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为什么德国攻击苏联
希特勒向苏联宣战-两份历史文献
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外交部长约阿希姆·冯·里本特洛普宣布德国对苏联宣战。 在一个挤满外国记者和代表德国新闻界的记者的会议室里,他阅读了给苏联政府的冗长外交照会的文本,其中详细解释了决定进攻苏联的原因。 22年1941月XNUMX日星期日,他对声明的阅读在德国广播电台播出。

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22 年 1941 月 XNUMX 日星期天早上黎明破晓时,德国、芬兰和罗马尼亚的军队突然沿着一条从极北北极圈到南部黑海数百英里的宽阔战线对苏联发动了进攻。 . 意大利、匈牙利、斯洛伐克和克罗地亚迅速加入了这场有史以来规模最大的军事攻势。 来自这些国家的士兵很快就加入了来自其他欧洲国家的志愿者,包括法国、荷兰、丹麦、挪威、西班牙和比利时。

约瑟夫·戈培尔向全世界宣布了德国、芬兰和罗马尼亚军队对苏联发动进攻的惊人消息。 22 年 1941 月 XNUMX 日星期日清晨,德国部长在柏林广播中宣读了希特勒的公告,解释了这次袭击的背景和原因——这是历史上最大规模的军事行动。
约瑟夫·戈培尔向全世界宣布了德国、芬兰和罗马尼亚军队对苏联发动进攻的惊人消息。 22 年 1941 月 XNUMX 日星期日清晨,德国部长在柏林广播中宣读了希特勒的公告,解释了这次袭击的背景和原因——这是历史上最大规模的军事行动。

星期天早上 5 点 30 分,德国广播电台向全世界宣布了这次袭击的惊人消息,当时帝国部长约瑟夫·戈培尔向德国人民广播了阿道夫·希特勒的公告,其中阐述了他发动历史性进攻的原因。

随后是德国对苏联宣战的广播。 这是一份给苏联政府的外交照会,外交部长约阿希姆·冯·里宾特洛甫 (Joachim von Ribbentrop) 在匆忙组织的代表德国媒体以及欧洲和海外报纸的记者招待会上宣读了这份外交照会。

外交部的这份声明详细解释了德国政府做出进攻苏联的重大决定的原因。 大约两个小时前,里宾特洛甫将文本交给了苏联驻柏林大使,与此同时,德国驻莫斯科大使正在向苏联外交部长提交一份较短的文本。

里宾特洛甫声明的内容很快由德国的DNB通讯社发布,第二天出现在德国和国外的报纸上。 一份英文文本,其中包含一些错误,也许是由于准备的匆忙,出现在 纽约时报.

尽管德国 22 月 1941 日的两份声明描绘了一个严重且迫在眉睫的苏联威胁,但它们实际上低估了危险的规模。 虽然希特勒和他的将军们知道红军庞大而强大,但他们严重低估了它的规模和力量。 事实证明,这种误判是导致苏联军队未能按计划在 42-XNUMX 年冬天开始粉碎苏联军队的一个重要且可能是决定性的因素——这使得红军在长达四年的巨大冲突中取得最终胜利成为可能。

到 1941 年 XNUMX 月,苏联空军不仅是世界上最大的空军,而且比所有其他国家的空军总和还要多。 同样,苏联的空降突击部队——只能用于进攻行动——不仅比德国大,而且比世界其他地区的伞兵联合部队还要大。 苏联红军的坦克部队不仅是世界上最大的,而且比世界其他地区的坦克部队加起来还要大。

德国领导人不知道苏联已经在生产 T-34、KV-1 和 KV-2 坦克,这是世界上最重、最致命的坦克,比任何德国型号都更强大。 他们也不知道苏联军队拥有 4,000 多辆两栖坦克——这些坦克仅用于进攻行动——而德国人却没有。

德国人也不知道苏联人是如何为他们的军事指挥官准备战争的。 例如,就在几周前,苏联领导人约瑟夫·斯大林在 1941 年 XNUMX 月对军事学院毕业生的秘密演讲中说:“在保卫我们的国家时,我们不得不采取侵略性的行动。 我们必须从防御转向军事进攻政策。 我们必须将我们的训练、我们的宣传、我们的媒体改革成一种进攻的心态。 红军是现代军队,现代军队是进攻军队。”

没过多久,德国领导人就意识到他们严重误判了苏联军事集结的范围。 11 年 1941 月 200 日——也就是“巴巴罗萨行动”开始八周后——德国陆军最高司令部司令弗朗茨·哈尔德将军在他的日记中写道:“从整体上看,我们越来越清楚我们低估了俄罗斯巨人,它有意识地为战争做好了准备,这是极权主义国家特有的绝对缺乏克制……在战争开始时,我们估计有大​​约 360 个敌方师。 现在我们已经在数 XNUMX。”

一周后,也就是 19 月 XNUMX 日,见多识广的帝国宣传部长约瑟夫·戈培尔 (Joseph Goebbels) 在日记中同样写道:“我们显然低估了苏联的冲击力,尤其是苏联军队的装备。 我们对布尔什维克有什么可用的东西一无所知。 这导致了错误的决策……”

希特勒本人公开和私下都承认,他误判了苏联威胁的程度和规模。 3 年 1941 月 XNUMX 日,这位德国领导人在柏林对一大群听众说:“当然,我们弄错了一件事。我们不知道这个敌人对德国和欧洲的准备是多么巨大,而且是多么伟大。是危险; 我们是如何勉强逃过毁灭的,不仅是德国,还有欧洲。”

美国政府以副国务卿萨姆纳威尔斯发表的官方声明回应了德国领导的攻势的消息。 它完全无视柏林领导人的观点,声称德国的“背信弃义”袭击是希特勒“残忍和野蛮地奴役所有人民并最终摧毁剩余的自由民主国家”计划的一部分。 实际上,正是苏联——当时世界上最具压迫性的政权——致力于消灭“自由民主”和“无产阶级专政”在所有国家的最终胜利。 在 1939 年至 1940 年的“冬季战争”中,红军试图将布尔什维克政权强加于芬兰时,斯大林明确表示了他对“自由民主”的基本敌意。 事实上,芬兰的士兵——议会民主制——现在正在作为希特勒德国的盟友与苏联作战。

美国公众在很大程度上对欧洲事务一无所知,并受到多年媒体宣传和富兰克林罗斯福总统危言耸听的言论的制约,普遍接受了他们政府对冲突的看法。 “当然,”罗斯福在 24 月 XNUMX 日对记者说,“我们将尽可能向俄罗斯提供所有可能的援助。” 美国违反其宣布的中立国地位,无视国际法,很快向苏俄提供军事援助。

多年来,有影响力的美国历史学家一直接受美国官方对德苏冲突的看法。 他们将德国领导的攻势描绘成对一个和平国家的一次危险且无缘无故的突然袭击,其动机首先是帝国的宏伟愿景。 典型的是詹姆斯·麦格雷戈·伯恩斯(James MacGregor Burns)的观点,他是著名的美国历史学家和 XNUMX 世纪美国历史专家。 在他广受好评的书中 罗斯福:自由战士 他驳斥了德国外交部 22 年 1941 月 XNUMX 日的声明,称其为“一堆纳粹谎言”。

然而,近年来,越来越多的历史学家收集了大量证据,证实了希特勒和德国政府提出的要点,并表明苏联正在准备大规模进攻。 这些历史学家中最有影响力的可能是前苏联 GRU 军事情报官员弗拉基米尔·雷祖 (Vladimir Rezun)。 在以维克多·苏沃洛夫 (Viktor Suvorov) 笔名撰写的一系列书籍中,他提供了令人印象深刻的证据,表明苏联政权正在准备对德国和欧洲进行大规模进攻,而德国领导的进攻阻止了即将到来的苏联罢工。 他说,应该将斯大林而不是希特勒视为二战的“罪魁祸首”。

近几十年来,大量文件和其他历史证据被曝光,这些证据证实了 22 年 1941 月 XNUMX 日德国声明中的要点。这些证据也彻底否定了对德苏冲突的简单描述,实际上是对第二次世界大战的描述本身,美国官员和著名的历史学家在战争期间和之后的几年里向美国公众展示过。

即使德国、芬兰和其他欧洲国家的领导人错误地认为苏联的进攻迫在眉睫,但他们当然有充分的理由将斯大林政权视为危险的威胁,并得出结论认为苏联正在部署庞大的军事力量为未来某个时刻的进攻做准备。 希特勒及其政府为德国领导的袭击辩护的理由不是谎言或借口。

事实上,德国、芬兰和罗马尼亚领导人在 1941 年 1845 月对苏联发动袭击,比美国领导人发动了一系列战争——包括 1898 年对墨西哥、2003 年对西班牙和伊拉克发动战争——的理由更充分、更实质性。 XNUMX 年。在这些案例中,美国军队袭击的国家都没有对美国构成明显和现实的威胁,也没有对美国重要的国家利益构成威胁。

由于希特勒 22 年 1941 月 XNUMX 日的公告和同一天德国外交部的声明详细解释了对苏联发动致命决定的原因和动机,因此这些文件具有历史意义。 这两个声明的特制翻译文本全文如下。

希特勒对德国人民的宣言

德国人! 国家社会主义者!

经过沉重的照顾,被谴责了数月之久的沉默,现在终于到了我终于可以坦率说话的时候了。

3年1939月1914日,德意志帝国收到英军宣战的消息,英国再次尝试通过与欧洲大陆上任何实力最强的力量作斗争来挫败欧洲巩固并由此崛起的一切开端。时间。 过去,这就是英国在多次战争中摧毁西班牙的方式。 这就是她对荷兰进行战争的方式。 这就是后来她在整个欧洲的帮助下与法国作战的方式,也是世纪之交的时候,她开始包围当时的德国帝国,并在1918年发起了第一次世界大战。 仅仅由于其内部缺乏团结,德国才在XNUMX年被击败。后果是可怕的。

在虚伪地宣称战斗仅是针对皇帝及其政权之后,德军放下武器之后,德意志帝国的an灭按计划开始了。

一位法国政治家 [乔治·克莱蒙梭] 的预言,即有 XNUMX 万德国人太多了——换言之,这个数字将不得不因饥饿、疾病或移民而被消除——显然正在应验,国家社会主义者运动开始了统一德国人民的工作,从而启动了帝国的复兴。 我们的人民从痛苦、苦难和可耻的无视中崛起,是一种纯粹内部复兴的形式。 这丝毫没有影响英国,更不用说威胁了。

然而,立即开始了一项新的,充满仇恨的对德国包围政策。 犹太人与民主主义者,布尔什维克与反动派之间形成了我们所有人都熟悉的内外情节,其唯一目的是禁止建立新的德国人民国家,并使帝国重新陷入无能和痛苦。 。

除了我们之外,对这个国际世界阴谋的仇恨是针对那些像我们自己一样被财富所忽视并被迫在最艰苦的生存斗争中谋生的国家的。

最重要的是,意大利和日本,与德国一样,拥有分享这个世界商品的权利,这是有争议的,实际上是被正式剥夺了。 因此,面对威胁到它们的财富和权力的利己主义全球组合,这三个国家的联盟纯粹是一种自我保护的行为。 根据美国通用伍德在美国众议院委员会面前的声明,早在1936年[温斯顿]丘吉尔就宣布德国再次变得太强大了,因此必须将其摧毁。

在1939年夏天,英国似乎开始了通过重复执行全面的包围德国政策来实现其计划歼灭的时机。 为此目的举行的谎言运动​​的计划包括宣布其他人受到威胁,用英国的保证和援助承诺欺骗他们,并像在[第一]之前发生的那样,使他们与德国抗衡。世界大战。

因此,从1939年XNUMX月至XNUMX月,英国成功地向世界广播了立陶宛,爱沙尼亚,拉脱维亚,芬兰和比萨拉比亚。 以及乌克兰,都受到德国的直接威胁。 这些州中的一些州被误导为接受这些主张所赋予的保证承诺,从而加入了针对德国的新的包围圈阵线。 在这种情况下,我认为自己有权在我自己的良心和德国人民的历史之前承担责任,不仅是要向这些国家或其政府保证这些英国主张的虚假性,而且还要使最强大的权力处于静息状态。在东部[苏联],通过关于我们的利益范围的特别庄严的宣言。

国家社会主义者! 那时,您可能都觉得这一步对我来说是艰巨而艰难的一步。 德国人民从未对俄罗斯人民怀有敌意。 但是,二十多年来,莫斯科的犹太布尔什维克统治者一直在努力点燃不仅德国,而且点燃整个欧洲。 德国从来没有尝试过将其国家社会主义世界观带入俄罗斯,但是相反,莫斯科的犹太布尔什维克统治者坚定地努力,不仅通过意识形态手段,而且首先是通过军事力量,将自己的统治权强加给我们和其他欧洲国家。 这个政权的活动所造成的后果,仅仅是所有国家的混乱,苦难和饥饿。

另一方面,我已经努力了二十年,以最少的干预和不破坏我们的生产,在德国建立一个新的社会主义秩序,不仅消除失业,而且允许生产工人获得越来越多地分享他的劳动成果。 这项国民经济和社会重建政策的成就——通过克服等级和阶级划分而争取真正的民族共同体——在当今世界上是独一无二的。

因此,我在 1939 年 XNUMX 月艰难地将我的 [外交部长] [冯·里宾特洛甫] 派往莫斯科,以抗击英国对德国的包围政策。 我这样做只是出于对德国人民的责任感,但最重要的是,无论如何,最终希望能够持久缓和紧张局势,并能够减少原本可能要求我们做出的牺牲。

德国在莫斯科郑重申明,指定的领土和国家——除立陶宛外——不在德国的任何政治利益之列,但缔结了一项特别[补充]协议,以防英国成功煽动波兰对德国开战. 在这种情况下,德国的主张也受到与德国军队成就完全不成比例的限制。

国家社会主义者! 我本人希望并为德国民族的利益而缔结的这项条约的后果非常严重,特别是对生活在有关国家中的德国人而言。 为了摆脱新的[苏维埃]政权,该起义最初以无限的苦难威胁着他们,远远超过半百万[在种族上]德国的男人和女人,所有的小农,工匠和工人,几乎被迫离开故土过夜。迟早要彻底灭绝。

然而,成千上万的德国人消失了! 永远不可能确定他们的命运,更不用说他们的下落了。 其中有不少于 160 名德意志帝国公民。 对于这一切,我保持沉默——因为我不得不这样做! 毕竟,我的一个愿望是最终缓和紧张局势,并在可能的情况下与这个 [苏联] 国家永久和解。

但是,在我们进军波兰的过程中,苏联统治者突然违反条约,也宣称立陶宛。 德意志帝国从来没有打算占领立陶宛的意图,不仅没有向立陶宛政府提出任何此类要求,而且相反地拒绝了当时的立陶宛政府以这种精神将德国军队派往立陶宛的请求,与德国的政策宗旨不符。

尽管如此,我还是顺应了这一新的俄罗斯需求。 但是,这仅仅是不断更新勒索的开始,此后不断重复。

波兰的胜利仅由德国军队赢得,这促使我向西方大国[英国和法国]提出另一项和平提议。 由于国际和犹太士兵的努力,它被拒绝了。 当时已经遭到拒绝的原因在于,英国仍然有希望动员欧洲联盟反对德国,其中包括巴尔干和苏联俄罗斯。 因此,在伦敦决定派克里普斯先生为莫斯科大使。 在任何情况下,他都得到了明确的指示,以恢复英苏之间的关系,并朝亲英方向发展它们。 英国媒体报道了这次任务的进展情况,但战术原因并未强加沉默。

在1939年秋天和1940年春天,最初的结果实际上使他们感到自己。 俄罗斯承诺不仅要服从军队而且要服从芬兰,也要服从波罗的海国家,所以,她突然提出了这样的主张,即必须保护这些国家免受外部威胁或阻止它,这是错误的,从而激发了这一行动。 这只能适用于德国,因为没有其他国家甚至可以干预波罗的海地区,更不用说在那里开战了。 我还是必须保持沉默。 但是,克里姆林宫的政权立即走得更远。

而在 1940 年春天,德国根据所谓的[与苏维埃俄罗斯于 28 年 1939 月 XNUMX 日签订的]友好条约,从东部边境撤出了她的军队,事实上,大部分地区都完全清除了这些地区德国军队,当时俄罗斯军队的部署已经开始,到了只能被视为对德国的蓄意威胁的程度。

根据[苏联外交部长]莫洛托夫当时的个人声明,仅在22年春天,波罗的海国家就有1940个俄罗斯师。俄罗斯政府一直声称它是由当地人召集的。人口,他们的存在的目的只能是对德国的示威游行。

从10年1940月1940日起,我们的士兵在西部破坏法英势力的同时,俄罗斯在我们东部边境的军事部署仍在以前所未有的危险程度发展。 因此,从XNUMX年XNUMX月起,我认为,不再允许我们的东部省份(在以前如此频频被浪费的东部省份)面对如此庞大的布尔什维克师的部署而不受保护,这符合帝国的利益。

因此,正像英苏俄合作的意图那样,东方的这种强大的[德国]部队被束缚了下来,以致西方战争特别是飞机战争的彻底结束不再可能了。由德国领导层担保。 但是,这不仅符合英国的目标,也符合苏联的俄罗斯政策目标,因为英,苏两国都打算让这场战争尽可能长时间地进行下去,以削弱整个欧洲并使之更加强大。无能为力。

在最后的分析中,俄罗斯威胁要袭击罗马尼亚的意图同样是要拥有或什至销毁德国乃至整个欧洲经济生活的重要基础。 自1933年以来,德国帝国就以无限的耐心寻求赢得东南欧国家作为贸易伙伴的资格。 因此,我们对他们的内部合并和秩序也有最大的兴趣。 俄罗斯进入罗马尼亚,希腊与英国结盟,威胁着迅速将这些地区也变成一般的战区。

与我们的原则和习俗相反,应当时负责该事态发展的罗马尼亚政府的紧急要求,我建议该国默认为和平而放弃苏维埃俄罗斯的要求,并割让[该省]比萨拉比亚。 然而,罗马尼亚政府认为,只有在获得赔偿的德国和意大利至少能够保证罗马尼亚仍然存在的完整性的前提下,罗马尼亚政府才能在自己的人民面前作出回应。 我这样做的心胸很开阔,最重要的是因为当德国帝国给予保证时,这意味着它也遵守了。 我们既不是英国人也不是犹太人。

我仍然相信,尽管已经承担了我们自己的严重义务,但在这很晚的时候仍为该地区的和平事业服务。 但是,为了最终解决这些问题并明确表达俄罗斯对德国的态度,以及在不断增加对我们东部边境的动员压力下,我请莫洛托夫先生来到柏林。

苏联外交部长[在他们的会议上,12 年 13 月 1940 日至 XNUMX 日]然后要求德国澄清或同意以下四个问题:

莫洛托夫的第一个问题:如果苏联对罗马尼亚发动进攻,德国对罗马尼亚的保证是否也针对苏联?

我的回答:德国的担保是一般性担保,对我们无条件约束。 但是,俄罗斯从未向我们宣布,除了比萨拉比亚以外,她在罗马尼亚还有其他利益。 [苏联]对布科维纳北部的占领已经违反了这一保证。 因此,我不认为俄罗斯现在可以突然对罗马尼亚实施更深远的意图。

莫洛托夫的第二个问题:俄罗斯再次感到自己受到芬兰的威胁,俄罗斯决心不容忍这一点。 德国是否准备好不向芬兰提供任何援助,最重要的是立即撤出向基尔肯内斯行进的德国救援部队?

我的回答:与以往一样,德国在芬兰绝对没有任何政治利益。 但是,德国政府再也不能认为俄罗斯对芬兰小国发动的新战争是可以容忍的,更是如此,因为我们再也无法相信芬兰会威胁俄罗斯。 在任何情况下,我们都不希望在波罗的海出现另一场战争。

莫洛托夫的第三个问题:德国是否准备同意苏俄向保加利亚提供保证,并在这方面向保加利亚派遣苏联军队,就此而言,他 - 莫洛托夫 - 准备声明苏联不打算为此例如,废黜国王?

我的回答是:保加利亚是一个主权国家,我不知道保加利亚曾经要求苏联向苏联提供任何保证,例如罗马尼亚要求德国提供的保证。 而且,我将不得不与我的盟友讨论此事。

莫洛托夫的第四个问题:苏俄绝对要求自由通过达达尼尔海峡,为了保护她,还要求占领[在土耳其]达达尼尔海峡和博斯普鲁斯海峡上的一些重要基地。 德国是否同意这一点?

我的回答:德国随时准备同意修改《蒙特勒条约》[1936] 以支持黑海国家。 德国不准备同意俄罗斯占领[土耳其]海峡的基地。

国家社会主义者! 在这里,我采取了唯一的态度,即我可以担任德国帝国的负责任领导人,同时也是欧洲文化和文明的认真负责的代表。 其结果是增加了苏俄针对帝国的活动,但最重要的是,立即开始从内部破坏新的罗马尼亚国家,并试图通过宣传罢免保加利亚政府。

在罗马尼亚[铁卫军]军团的迷茫和不成熟领导人的帮助下,罗马尼亚发动了一场政变,目的是推翻国家元首安东内斯库将军,在国内制造混乱,以消除法律权威,从而取消实施德国担保的先决条件。 尽管如此,我仍然认为最好保持沉默。

这一行动失败后,俄罗斯军队立即重新集结在德国东部边境。 越来越多的坦克部队和降落伞部队被转移到危险的德国边境附近。 德国武装部队和德国本土都知道,直到几周前,我们的东部边境还没有一个德国坦克或摩托化师驻扎。

如果需要任何最终证明英国和苏维埃俄罗斯之间形成的联盟,尽管进行了所有转移和伪装,南斯拉夫冲突提供了它。 当我尽一切努力进行最后的平定巴尔干地区的尝试,并在与公爵[墨索里尼]的同情合作下,邀请南斯拉夫加入三方条约时,英国和苏维埃俄罗斯联合组织了这场政变,在一次[27 年 1941 月 XNUMX 日]晚上,撤掉了准备达成协议的政府。

今天,我们可以告诉德国民族,塞尔维亚反对德国的政变不仅仅发生在英国人的领导下,而且主要是在苏俄的主持下发生的。 虽然我们也对此事保持沉默,但苏联领导人现在更进了一步。 他们不仅组织了政变,而且在几天后 [5 年 1941 月 XNUMX 日] 与那些顺从的生物缔结了著名的友好条约,旨在加强塞尔维亚人抵抗巴尔干和平的意志,并煽动他们反对德国。 这不是柏拉图式的意图:莫斯科要求动员塞尔维亚军队。

因为,即使到那时,我仍然相信最好不要说出来,克里姆林宫的执政者走得更远:今天德国帝国的政府掌握了书面证据,证明俄罗斯为了最终使塞尔维亚参战而付出了代价。她承诺通过萨洛尼卡(Salonika)向她提供武器,飞机,弹药和其他针对德国的战争物资。 这几乎是在我建议日本外交大臣松冈(Matsuoka)缓解与俄罗斯的紧张关系的那一刻发生的,但仍然希望以此为和平事业服务。

只有我们无与伦比的师迅速发展到斯科普里[Skopje],以及占领萨洛尼卡本身,才挫败了这一苏俄-英军阴谋的目标。 但是,塞尔维亚空军军官逃往俄罗斯,并立即被派为盟友。

只是轴心国在巴尔干地区的胜利挫败了今年夏天在东南欧作战数月内束缚德国的计划,同时稳​​步完成了苏俄军队的部署并加强了他们的战斗准备,最后,与英国一道,并在预期的美国供应的支持下,绑架并击败了德国帝国和意大利。

因此,莫斯科不仅违反了我们的友好条约的规定,而且还不幸地背叛了我们。 所有这些都是在克里姆林宫的统治者如芬兰和罗马尼亚的情况下完成的,直到最后一刻都假装和平与友谊,并发出了看似无害的否认。

虽然我一次又一次地被迫保持沉默,但现在是时候继续作为一个单纯的观察者不仅是一种疏忽的罪行,而且是对德国人民的犯罪——是的,甚至是对整个欧洲.

今天,大约有160个俄罗斯师站在我们的前沿。 几个星期以来,对这一边界的侵犯不断,不仅影响我们,而且影响最远的北部(与芬兰相对)以及罗马尼亚。 俄罗斯飞行员认为,忽视这些疆界是一种狂热的运动,大概是向我们证明他们已经感到自己是这些领土的主人。 在17月18日至XNUMX日晚上,俄罗斯巡逻队再次渗透到帝国领土,只有长时间交火后才能撤退。

这把我们带到了一个时刻,我们有必要对付这一阴谋的犹太-英军士兵和莫斯科布尔什维克中心的犹太统治者。

德国人! 此刻正在部署部队,就其规模和范围而言,这是迄今为止世界上最大规模的部署。 纳尔维克胜利的战士们与他们的芬兰战友团结在一起,站在北极北部。 由挪威征服者 [迪特尔将军] 指挥的德国师,以及他们元帅 [曼纳海姆] 领导下的芬兰自由英雄们,正在保护芬兰的土地。 德国东部战线的编队从东普鲁士一直延伸到喀尔巴阡山脉。 德国和罗马尼亚士兵在国家元首安东内斯库的领导下从多瑙河下游的普鲁特 [河] 岸边到黑海沿岸联合起来。

因此,这方面的任务不仅是保护单个国家,而且是维护欧洲,从而拯救所有人。

因此,我今天决定再次将德意志帝国和我们人民的命运和未来置于我们的士兵手中。

愿主上帝在这场战斗中特别帮助我们!

德国对苏联宣战

德国外交部给苏联政府的说明

I

1939 年夏天,德意志帝国政府出于达成德苏利益解决的愿望,与苏联政府接洽时,很清楚要与一个国家达成谅解并非易事。一方面声称属于一个民族国家共同体,由此产生了权利和义务,但另一方面又被一个政党统治,该政党作为共产国际[共产主义国际]的一部分,正在努力实现世界革命——在换句话说,这些民族国家的解体。

德意志帝国政府作出了努力,搁置了严重的疑虑,这些忧虑是基于德国和苏维埃政治目标的根本差异,以及基于完全对立的国家社会主义和布尔什维克主义的世界观之间的鲜明对比。 它的指导思想是,消除因德国和俄罗斯之间的谅解而产生的战争可能性,以及维护两国之间一直存在友好关系的两国真正的迫切需要,这将为我们提供解决方案。这是防止国际犹太主义共产主义理论进一步传播到欧洲的最好保证。 俄罗斯本身的某些事件和俄罗斯政府采取的某些国际范围的措施使人们认为,至少有可能背离这些学说和颠覆其他国家的方法,这一事实进一步加强了这种信念。 在莫斯科举行的招待会符合德国的这一倡议,苏俄政府准备与德国缔结友好条约似乎证明了这种态度的改变。

因此,23年1939月28日缔结了《不侵略条约》,两国于1939年XNUMX月XNUMX日签署了《边界和友谊协定》。这些协定的实质包括:

1.两国相互承诺不相互攻击,不要和睦相处,

2.划定利益领域,德意志帝国宣布放弃在芬兰,拉脱维亚,爱沙尼亚,立陶宛和比萨拉比亚的所有影响力,而前波兰国的领土直到纳鲁,布格和圣[河流]所划定的界线根据苏联的意愿纳入俄罗斯。

在与俄罗斯签订互不侵犯条约之后,德意志帝国政府实际上对苏联的政策进行了根本性的转变,从此对苏联采取了友好的态度。 德国政府在文字和精神上都忠实地遵守与苏联缔结的条约。 此外,它通过击败波兰,也就是让德国流血,帮助苏联在外交政策上取得了建国以来最大的成功。 只有德国对俄罗斯的善意政策和德国武装部队的压倒性胜利才有可能做到这一点。

因此,帝国政府不无道理地期望苏联对德国帝国采取类似的态度,特别是考虑到在帝国外交大臣冯·里本伯特罗普在莫斯科进行的谈判中,以及在其他情况下,苏联政府曾对苏联采取过类似的态度。一再表示认为,这些条约将是持久解决德国苏俄利益的基础,两国都尊重对方的政权,并准备放弃对对方内政的任何干涉。伙伴,将实现持久的睦邻关系。 不幸的是,很快就变得很明显,德国政府在这个假设中犯了错误。

II

事实上,在德俄条约缔结之后,共产国际很快就恢复了它在各个领域的活动。 这不仅适用于德国,而且适用于对德国友好的国家、中立国家和被德国军队占领的欧洲地区。 为了避免公然违反条约,改变了方法,更小心地和更狡猾地应用伪装。 莫斯科显然认为有必要通过不断谴责德国所谓的“帝国主义战争”来抵消与国家社会主义德国缔结协定的影响。 强有力和有效的预防性警察措施迫使共产国际试图以其他方式在德国开展颠覆活动和情报工作,利用为此目的在邻国建立的中心。

为此,前德国共产党官员被派去煽动颠覆活动并在德国安排破坏活动。 GPU [NKVD] 政委 Krylov 负责为此目的组织的系统培训课程。 此外,在德国占领的领土上,特别是在保护国[波西米亚-摩拉维亚]和被占领的法国,以及挪威、荷兰、比利时等地,进行了密集的颠覆活动。

苏俄外交职位,特别是布拉格总领事馆在这方面提供了宝贵的帮助。 包括无线电发射器和接收器在内的主动情报服务绝对是共产国际针对德国帝国的工作的证明。 还有大量的文献证据,包括证人的证词和有关共产国际其他颠覆和侦察工作的全部范围的书面材料。 此外,还组织了破坏活动小组,这些小组保留了自己的实验室,以制造用于燃烧活动的燃烧性和高爆炸弹。 此类袭击是对例如不少于16艘德国船只进行的。

除了这种颠覆和破坏活动外,还进行了间谍活动。 因此,为了获得这些德国人为GPU的服务,德国以最应受谴责的方式利用从苏联俄国遣返的[民族]德国人。 不仅男人而且女人也是无耻勒索的受害者,被迫进入GPU服务。 甚至苏联驻柏林大使馆在由大使馆顾问阿布拉克·科布洛夫(Amayak)Kobulov领导的行动中,也没有因间谍目的无故滥用域外权利而退缩。 俄罗斯驻莫斯科莫霍夫市领事馆的一名工作人员[L. 米哈伊洛夫(Mikhailov)领导的另一个俄罗斯间谍网络遍布整个保护区[波希米亚-摩拉维亚]。 警方能够及时采取行动的进一步实例清楚地表明了这些苏联苏维埃广泛的阴谋。 总体而言,无可辩驳的证据表明,苏俄在政治,军事和经济领域对德国进行了非法的大规模颠覆活动,破坏和恐怖行为以及为战争做准备的间谍活动。

至于苏俄在德国以外的欧洲国家的颠覆活动,几乎遍及欧洲所有与德国友好或被德国占领的国家。 例如,在罗马尼亚,以俄罗斯传单形式的共产主义宣传将德国描述为对所有当地麻烦负责,以培养反德公众情绪。 自 1940 年夏天以来,南斯拉夫的情况也很明显。那里的传单煽动人民抗议 [Dragiša] Cvetković 政府,该政府与柏林和罗马的“帝国主义”政府结盟。 在萨格勒布共产党工作人员的一次会议上,从斯洛伐克到保加利亚的整个东南欧被描述为俄罗斯的保护国,在德国希望军事衰落之后将成立。 在苏联驻贝尔格莱德大使馆,德国军队发现了这种宣传起源于苏联俄罗斯的文件证据。 南斯拉夫的共产主义宣传试图使用民族主义口号,而在匈牙利,它主要在鲁塞尼亚人中有效,它对苏俄即将解放的希望寄予厚望。 斯洛伐克的反德宣传尤为活跃,它公开鼓动苏俄吞并该国。

在芬兰,臭名昭著的“苏联和平友好协会”积极与[苏联经营的] Petroskoi 广播电台合作,推动颠覆国家,从而以完全反德的方式运作。

在法国、比利时和荷兰的鼓动是针对德国占领当局的。 在总政府[波兰]进行了类似的宣传运动,但具有民族主义和泛斯拉夫特征。 当苏俄在那里开始宣传时,希腊几乎没有被德国和意大利军队占领。 所有这一切都证明了苏联在每个国家都有系统地开展了一场反对德国在欧洲建立稳定秩序的努力的运动。

与此同时,宣传直接旨在反击德国的政策措施,谴责这些措施是反俄的,并试图为苏俄和德国争取这些不同的国家。 在保加利亚,有人反对该国加入三方协定,并赞成与俄罗斯签订保证协定。 在罗马尼亚,有人试图渗透 [民族主义] 铁卫队 [运动] 并收买其领导人,其中包括发起 23 年 1941 月 XNUMX 日未遂政变的罗马尼亚人格罗扎,莫斯科布尔什维克特工站在他身后充当拉线者. 帝国政府对此有无可争辩的证据。

关于南斯拉夫,德意志帝国政府掌握的文件表明,南斯拉夫特使 [米洛拉德]乔治维奇 [Djordjevich] 在 1940 年 1940 月与 [苏联外长] 莫洛托夫谈话的基础上确信德国被视为那里作为“明天的强敌”。 苏俄对塞尔维亚军界提出的军备要求的回应,更加表明了苏俄的态度。 27 年 XNUMX 月,苏俄总参谋长向南斯拉夫武官宣布:“我们将立即满足您的要求。” 支付的价格和支付方式由贝尔格莱德政府决定,只有一个条件:对德国保密。 当 Cvetković 政府随后与轴心国接洽时,莫斯科开始推迟武器交付,苏俄战争部将此消息简短地传达给南斯拉夫武官。 今年 XNUMX 月 XNUMX 日贝尔格莱德政变的上演是塞尔维亚阴谋者和英俄特工针对帝国的阴谋活动的高潮。 这场政变的塞尔维亚领导人和“黑手”的首领 [Božin] Simić 先生仍在莫斯科,在那里他与苏俄宣传中心密切合作,积极反对帝国。

上述各点只是苏联在整个欧洲进行的极其全面的对德宣传活动的一小部分。 为了向外界提供自德俄缔结条约以来苏俄机构的这些活动的概况,并使公众能够做出自己的判断,德意志帝国政府将公布其掌握的大量材料。 . 总之,帝国政府指出以下几点:

在与德国缔结条约时,苏联政府多次明确表示无意直接或间接干涉德国事务。 友好条约缔结时,庄严表示将与德国共同努力,按照各国的真正利益,结束一方面是德国,另一方面是英法之间的战争,并尽快实现这一目标。 鉴于上述事实在战争的进一步过程中逐渐变得更加明显,这些苏俄协议和声明已被证明是故意误导和欺骗的。 德国的友好态度所带来的好处也没有使苏联政府对德国采取忠诚的态度。 相反,帝国政府被迫意识到,1939 年缔结的条约是应用列宁论点的又一个例子,正如 1939 年 XNUMX 月《斯洛伐克共产党指南》中明确重申的那样,指出: “如果可以促进苏联政府的利益并帮助使对手无害,可以与某些其他国家缔结条约。” 因此,这些友好条约的签署对苏维埃政府来说只是一种战术策略。 真正的目标是达成对俄罗斯有利的协议,同时为苏联未来的强有力行动做好准备。 指导思想仍然是削弱非布尔什维克国家,以便能够更容易地颠覆它们,并在时机成熟时粉碎它们。 在贝尔格莱德被苏联使馆俘虏后发现的一份俄罗斯文件中,这一目的用以下措辞粗暴地表达了出来:“苏联只会在适当的时候做出反应。 轴心国进一步分散了他们的力量,苏联将因此对德国进行突然的打击。” 苏联政府没有听从俄罗斯人民的声音,他们真诚地希望与德国人民和平友好地生活在一起。 相反,它延续了旧的布尔什维克两面派政策,并因此承担了沉重的责任。

III

如果说苏联在德国和欧洲其他国家进行的颠覆性宣传对其对德态度毫无疑问,那么苏联政府在军事领域和对外政策领域的对德政策,甚至自从德国和俄罗斯签订协议以来,事情就变得更加清楚了。 在划定利益范围之际,苏联政府在莫斯科向帝国外交部长宣布,它不打算占领、布尔什维化或吞并位于其利益范围内的任何国家,但前者的领土除外。波兰国家,当时处于解体状态。 然而,事实上,正如事态发展所表明的那样,苏联在这一时期的政策完全是为了一个目标——即在北冰洋和北冰洋之间的任何可能出现的地方扩大莫斯科的军事力量。黑海,并进一步在欧洲传播布尔什维克主义。

该政策的制定分以下几个阶段进行:

1. 它始于 1939 年 XNUMX 月和 XNUMX 月与爱沙尼亚、拉脱维亚和立陶宛缔结所谓的援助条约,并在这些国家建立军事基地。

2. 苏俄接下来的行动是针对芬兰。 当芬兰政府拒绝了苏俄的要求,接受了就意味着芬兰独立国家主权的终结,于是苏维埃政府成立了库西宁共产主义伪政府。 当芬兰人民拒绝与该政府有任何联系时,向芬兰提交了最后通牒,然后在 1939 年 1940 月下旬,红军发动了进攻。 芬兰与俄罗斯于 XNUMX 年 XNUMX 月缔结的和平协议迫使芬兰放弃其东南部省份的一部分,这些省份立即被布尔什维克统治。

3. 几个月后——也就是 1940 年 15 月——苏联对波罗的海国家采取了行动。 根据第一个莫斯科条约的条款,立陶宛在德国的利益范围内。 在第二个条约中,在苏联的愿望下,德国政府为了和平放弃了其在该国大部分地区的利益,尽管它是怀着沉重的心情这样做的。 这片领土的一小部分仍然在德国的利益范围内。 在 XNUMX 月 XNUMX 日发出最后通牒之后,整个立陶宛,包括留在德国利益范围内的部分,在没有通知德国政府的情况下被苏联占领,因此苏联现在扩展到东普鲁士[德国]的整个东部边境。 当随后就此事与德国接洽时,德国政府经过艰难的谈判,为进一步努力达成友好解决方案,将立陶宛的那部分地区也割让给了苏联。

不久之后,拉脱维亚和爱沙尼亚同样被军队占领,这一行动违反了与这些国家达成的援助协定。 与莫斯科的明确保证相反,所有波罗的海国家随后都被布尔什维克化,占领后几周被苏联政府即刻吞并。 在兼并的同时,红军第一次在苏俄领土的整个北部地区以强大的力量反对欧洲。

顺便说一句,苏联政府因此单方面取消了德国与那些[波罗的海]国家之间达成的经济协议,根据莫斯科协议,这些协议不会受到影响。

4. 在莫斯科条约中,就前波兰国家领土内的利益划定明确同意,不得在标记这些利益区的边界以外发生任何政治骚动。 相反,双方占领当局的活动仅限于这些领土的和平发展。 德国政府拥有无可辩驳的证据表明,尽管有这些协议,苏联在占领该领土后不久不仅允许反德宣传在 [德国控制的] 波兰总政府中消费,而且事实上一直支持它与布尔什维克在同一地区的宣传。 强大的俄罗斯驻军也在占领后立即转移到这些领土。

5.当德军仍在西部与法国和英国作战时,苏联向巴尔干半岛挺进。 尽管苏联政府在莫斯科谈判中曾宣布永远不会向解决比萨拉比亚问题迈出第一步,但 24 年 1940 月 XNUMX 日,苏联政府通知德国政府,现在决定以下列方式解决比萨拉比亚问题:力量。 同时,有人说,苏联对布科维纳的要求也扩展到了布科维纳,即曾经是古代奥地利王室的领土,从未属于俄罗斯,而且在莫斯科时代从未被提及。谈判。

德国驻莫斯科大使向苏联政府宣布,其决定完全出乎德国政府的意料,将对德国在罗马尼亚的经济利益产生严重的不利影响,也将导致罗马尼亚的生活中断。那里的大型 [民族] 德国人定居点,以及 [民族] 德国人在布科维纳的存在。 莫洛托夫回答说,此事极为紧急,苏联希望在24小时内获悉德国政府对这一问题的态度。 尽管对罗马尼亚采取了这种粗暴的行动,但德国政府为了维护和平并维持与该国的友谊,再次出手干预苏联。 它建议曾向德国寻求帮助的罗马尼亚政府让步,并建议将比萨拉比亚和北布科维纳交给苏维埃俄罗斯。 德国已将罗马尼亚政府的肯定答复转达给苏联政府,同时罗马尼亚政府要求给予足够时间撤离这些大片地区并保护那里居民的生命财产安全。
然而,苏联政府再次向罗马尼亚发出最后通牒,并在到期前于 28 月 XNUMX 日开始占领布科维纳的部分地区,随后立即占领整个比萨拉比亚直至多瑙河。 这些领土也立即被苏联吞并,布尔什维克化,因此实际上沦为废墟。

苏维埃政府在莫斯科谈判中占领和布尔什维克帝国政府在东欧和巴尔干地区给予苏联的整个利益范围,显然是违背莫斯科协定的。 尽管如此,帝国政府仍然对苏联保持绝对忠诚的态度。 它完全避免干预芬兰战争和波罗的海问题。 它支持苏维埃政府在比萨拉比亚问题上反对罗马尼亚政府的立场,对苏维埃政府造成的局面,虽然心情沉重,但也心甘情愿。

此外,为了从一开始就尽可能消除两国之间的任何分歧,[德国]进行了大规模的重新安置行动,将苏联占领区的所有[民族]德国人都带回了德国。 帝国政府坚持认为,几乎无法提供更令人信服的证据来证明其希望与苏联达成持久和平的愿望。

IV

由于俄罗斯向巴尔干半岛推进,该地区的领土问题成为讨论的焦点。 1940年夏天,罗马尼亚和匈牙利在英国特工挑起的分歧导致30月底发生严重危机后,呼吁德国帮助安排解决领土争端。 罗马尼亚和匈牙利之间的战争迫在眉睫。 德国一再要求匈牙利和罗马尼亚调解争端,希望维护巴尔干地区的和平,并与意大利一起邀请两国在维也纳举行会谈,并应他们的要求,在那里宣布了维也纳仲裁1940 年 XNUMX 月 XNUMX 日的奖项。这确立了匈牙利和罗马尼亚之间的新边界。 为了帮助罗马尼亚政府在其人民面前证明他们所做的领土牺牲是正当的,并为未来消除该地区的任何争端,德国和意大利承诺保证剩余的罗马尼亚国家。 鉴于俄罗斯在这方面的愿望已经得到满足,这一保证无论如何不能被视为针对俄罗斯。 然而,苏联提出申诉并表示,与早先的声明相反,根据其在巴尔干地区的愿望通过占领比萨拉比亚和北布科维纳而得到满足,它对巴尔干问题有进一步的兴趣,尽管目前这些问题是没有进一步定义。

从那时起,苏俄的反德政策越来越明显。 帝国政府继续收到越来越具体的报告,根据这些报告,英国大使[斯塔福德爵士]克里普斯在莫斯科进行了一段时间的谈判进展顺利。 与此同时,帝国政府掌握了苏联在各个领​​域进行密集军事准备的证据。 17 年 1940 月 1941 日,南斯拉夫驻莫斯科武官最近在贝尔格莱德发现的一份报告证实了这一证据,其中写道:“根据从苏联来源获得的信息,空军的武装,根据本次战争的经验,坦克军和炮兵正在全面推进,到 XNUMX 年 XNUMX 月将基本完成。这可能也构成了在此之前苏联外交政策不会发生明显变化的[时间]限制。”

尽管苏联在巴尔干问题上态度不友好,但德国为与苏联达成谅解做出了新的努力:帝国外交部长在给斯大林的信中全面审视了帝国的政策自莫斯科谈判以来。 信中特别提到以下几点:

当德国、意大利和日本缔结三方条约时 [27 月1940 年 XNUMX 月 XNUMX 日]一致同意,该协议在任何意义上都不是针对苏联的,而是三个大国的友好关系及其与苏联的条约应完全不受该协议的影响。 这也被记录在柏林三方条约中。 同时,这封信表达了愿望和希望,如三方条约签署国所希望的那样,共同澄清与苏联的进一步友好关系,并赋予这种关系具体形式。 为了更充分地讨论这些问题,帝国外长邀请莫洛托夫先生访问柏林。

在莫洛托夫访问柏林期间 [12 月13 年 1940 月至 XNUMX 日] 德意志帝国政府被迫得出结论,苏联只倾向于与三方条约国家,特别是与德国进行真正的友好合作,前提是他们准备支付苏联要求的代价。 这个价格包括苏联进一步渗透到北欧和东南欧。 莫洛托夫在柏林以及随后与德国驻莫斯科大使的外交对话中提出了以下要求:

1. 苏联希望向保加利亚提供保证,除此之外,还希望与她签订一项与波罗的海国家签订的援助协议,即提供 [苏联] 军事基地。 与此同时,莫洛托夫宣布他不想干涉保加利亚的内部政权。 俄罗斯政委[阿尔卡季]索博列夫当时访问索非亚也是为了实现这一意图。

2. 苏联要求与土耳其签订条约形式的协议,以便在长期租约的基础上为苏联陆海军在博斯普鲁斯海峡和达达尼尔海峡提供一个基地。 如果土耳其不同意这一提议,德国和意大利将与俄罗斯合作采取外交措施,以强制遵守这一要求。 这些要求旨在苏联对巴尔干地区的统治。

3. 苏联再次声明,它感到自己受到芬兰的威胁,因此要求德国完全放弃芬兰,这实际上意味着对该国的占领和对芬兰人民的灭绝。

德国自然无法接受俄罗斯的这些要求,苏联政府将其描述为与三方协约国合作的先决条件。 因此,三方条约权力与苏联达成谅解的努力失败了。 德国这种态度的结果是,俄罗斯现在加强了其已经越来越明显的反德政策,与英国日益密切的合作变得更加明确。 1941 年 XNUMX 月,俄罗斯的这种不赞成态度首先表现在外交领域。 当月德国在保加利亚采取某些措施反对英国军队登陆希腊时,俄罗斯驻柏林大使在一份官方声明中指出,苏联将保加利亚领土和两海峡视为苏联的安全区,并它不能继续被动地旁观这些地区发生的威胁这些安全利益的事件。 出于这个原因,苏联政府警告德军不要出现在保加利亚领土或两个海峡中的任何一个。

作为回应,帝国政府向苏联政府提供了关于其在巴尔干地区采取军事措施的原因和目的的详尽信息。 这清楚地表明,德国将竭尽全力阻止英国在希腊站稳脚跟的任何企图,但它无意占领该海峡,并将尊重土耳其的主权和领土。 德国军队通过保加利亚不能被视为对苏联安全利益的侵犯; 相反,帝国政府认为这些行动符合苏联的利益。 在完成在巴尔干地区的行动后,德国从那里撤军。

尽管德国政府发表了这一声明,但苏联政府在德国军队进入保加利亚后直接向保加利亚发表了一份声明,该声明表现出明显对德意志帝国的敌意,并实际上表示德国军队的存在保加利亚不利于巴尔干地区的和平,反而利于战争。 帝国政府在收到的信息中找到了对这种态度的解释,这些信息的规模稳步增加,关于苏俄和英国之间越来越密切的合作。 即使面对这些事实,德国仍然保持沉默。

同样,苏联政府在 1941 年 XNUMX 月作出保证,如果土耳其加入巴尔干战争,俄罗斯不会攻击土耳其。 根据帝国政府掌握的信息,这是英国外交大臣[安东尼·伊登]访问安卡拉期间英俄谈判的结果,其目的是拉近俄罗斯与英国阵营的距离。

V

苏联政府对德意志帝国的侵略政策从那时起就越来越明显,而苏联和英国之间迄今为止有些谨慎的政治合作却在疫情爆发时为全世界所见。今年 14 月初的巴尔干危机。 今天已经完全确定,南斯拉夫加入三方条约后,英国在贝尔格莱德煽动的政变是在苏俄的纵容下煽动的。 在此之前的一段时间里,实际上自 1940 年 XNUMX 月 XNUMX 日以来,俄罗斯一直在秘密协助南斯拉夫武装对抗轴心国。 占领贝尔格莱德后,帝国政府掌握的文件最终证明了这一点,这些文件揭示了俄罗斯向南斯拉夫运送武器的每个阶段。

贝尔格莱德政变成功后,俄罗斯于 5 月 6 日与 [Dušan] Simović 将军的非法塞尔维亚政府缔结了一项友谊协定,该协定将为政变分子提供道义上的支持,并以其影响力协助日益壮大的英南希腊阵线. 1941 年 XNUMX 月 XNUMX 日,美国副国务卿萨姆纳·威尔斯在与苏联驻华盛顿大使多次交谈后表示,当时美国副国务卿萨姆纳·威尔斯显然对此表示满意:在某些情况下,俄南条约可能是最伟大的条约。重要性。 它在许多方面都引起了人们的兴趣,并且有理由假设它不仅仅是一个友好和互不侵犯的协议。

因此,在德国军队集中在罗马尼亚和保加利亚领土上以对抗英国军队在希腊大规模登陆的同时,现在显然与英国合作的苏联正试图通过以下方式刺杀德国:

1. 给予南斯拉夫公开的政治和秘密军事支持。

2. 试图通过承诺不攻击保加利亚和德国并将土耳其军队部署在色雷斯非常不利的战略位置,使土耳其对保加利亚和德国采取侵略态度。

3. 将强大的军事力量集中在比萨拉比亚和摩尔达维亚的罗马尼亚边境,以及

4. XNUMX月初,外交部副人民委员[安德烈]维辛斯基在与罗马尼亚驻莫斯科大使[格里高利]加芬库的谈话中突然试图启动与罗马尼亚的快速和解政策,以说服该国脱离德国。 英国外交,通过美国人的中介,在布加勒斯特朝着同样的方向努力。

按照英俄计划,集中在罗马尼亚和保加利亚的德军将受到三个方面的攻击,即比萨拉比亚、色雷斯和塞希腊边境。 仅仅由于 [罗马尼亚领导人] [Ion] Antonescu 将军的忠诚、土耳其政府的现实态度,尤其是由于德国的迅速主动和德国军队的决定性胜利,这个英俄计划才得以实施。沮丧的。

根据帝国政府掌握的信息,近 200 架载有苏联和英国特工以及西莫维奇和其他塞尔维亚政变分子的南斯拉夫飞机起飞——其中一些飞往俄罗斯,这些军官今天在那里为俄罗斯军队服务,还有一些到埃及。 仅这一事实就为英国、俄罗斯和南斯拉夫之间的密切合作提供了一个特别的特征。

苏联政府曾多次试图隐瞒其政策背后的真实意图,但徒劳无功。 除了在最后一个时期保持与德国的经贸关系外,它还采取了一系列具体措施来欺骗世界,以为它在与德国保持正常甚至友好的关系。 例如,几周前驱逐挪威、比利时、希腊和南斯拉夫的外交代表,英国媒体对德俄关系保持沉默,这是通过英国大使克里普斯与俄罗斯政府合作安排的。 ,最后是 [苏联] 塔斯社 [13 月 XNUMX 日] 发布的 dementi [声明],该声明试图将德国与苏维埃俄罗斯之间的关系描绘成完全正确的。 这些伪装的企图,与苏联政府的实际政策形成了如此粗暴的对比,自然无法欺骗帝国政府。

VI

伴随着苏联政府的反德政策,在军事领域,所有可用的俄罗斯武装力量稳步增加,沿着从波罗的海延伸到黑海的广阔战线。 早在德国深入参与西部的法国战役,只有极少数德国分遣队驻扎在东部的时候,俄罗斯最高统帅部就开始有系统地向帝国东部边境转移大量部队,包括特别是在与东普鲁士和政府将军 [波兰] 的边界以及罗马尼亚对面的布科维纳和比萨拉比亚的边界上进行了大规模部署。

面向芬兰的俄罗斯驻军也在稳步加强。 将更多新的俄罗斯师从远东和高加索转移到俄罗斯西部是这方面的额外措施。 例如,苏联政府宣布波罗的海地区将只被极少数军队占领后,开始集中在该地区,占领完成后,军队人数不断增加,今天的人数为估计有 22 个师。 很明显,俄罗斯军队正在越来越靠近德国边境,尽管德国方面没有采取任何军事措施来证明俄罗斯的这种行动是合理的。 正是俄罗斯的这种行为,首先迫使德军采取了反制措施。 此外,俄罗斯陆军和空军的各个单位也开始行动,强大的空军分遣队被部署在德国边境沿线的机场。 自 XNUMX 月初以来,俄罗斯飞机越过边境的次数越来越多,越过德意志帝国领土的次数也不断增加。 罗马尼亚政府报告了罗马尼亚边境地区布科维纳、摩尔达维亚和多瑙河的类似发展。

自今年年初以来,德国武装部队最高司令部一再通知 [德国] 外交政策领导人俄罗斯军队对帝国领土构成的威胁不断增加,并在这方面强调只有侵略性意图才能解释这些部署。 这些武装部队最高指挥部的报告将与所有细节一起公开。

如果对俄罗斯这次部署的侵略性质有丝毫怀疑,他们已经被最近几天传到德国最高司令部的消息完全打消了。 现在俄罗斯总动员已经完成,不少于160个师被部署到德国。 最近几天进行的侦察结果表明,俄罗斯军队,特别是摩托化和装甲部队的部署是这样进行的,俄罗斯最高统帅部随时准备在各种情况下采取积极行动。指向德国边境。 有关侦察和巡逻活动增加的报告以及每天发生在两军边境和前哨的小规模冲突的报告构成了极其紧张的军事局势,这种局势随时可能爆发。 今天从英国收到的消息是,英国大使克里普斯进行谈判,以在英国和苏维埃俄罗斯的政治和军事领导人之间建立更密切的合作,同时[英国的] 比弗布鲁克勋爵曾经是反苏的,他呼吁支持俄罗斯在即将到来的冲突中竭尽全力,以及他呼吁美国也这样做,明确表明德意志民族正在准备什么样的命运。

总而言之,德意志帝国政府作出以下声明:

与它所承担的所有义务相反,并粗暴违反其庄严声明,苏联政府转而反对德国。 它有:

1. 不仅继续,而且自战争爆发以来,加强了对德国和欧洲的颠覆活动。 它有

2. 以越来越敌对的方式逐步发展其对德外交政策。 它有

3. 在德国边境部署全部军队准备进攻。

苏联政府因此违反和破坏了与德国的条约和协定。 布尔什维克莫斯科对国家社会主义的仇恨比其政治智慧更强烈。 布尔什维克主义以致命的敌意反对国家社会主义。 布尔什维克莫斯科准备在国家社会主义德国为自己的生存而斗争时在背后捅她一刀。

面对对其东部边境的严重威胁,德国无意保持不作为。 因此,元首已下令德国武装部队竭尽全力反对这一威胁。 在即将到来的斗争中,德国人民完全明白,他们不仅要保卫祖国,而且要从布尔什维克主义的致命危险中拯救整个文明世界,为欧洲真正的社会进步扫清道路。

补充阅读

约瑟夫·毕晓普,“俄罗斯专家揭露斯大林征服欧洲的计划”
历史评论杂志, 十一月至十二月1997年
( http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v16/v16n6p22_Bishop.html )
( https://www.unz.com/pub/jhr__russian-specialist-lays-bare-stalins-plan-to-conquer-europe/ )

J. Bishop,罪魁祸首,”评论。
不便的历史,2009 年 XNUMX 月
( https://inconvenienthistory.com/1/2/1906 )

约瑟夫·毕晓普,“对德苏冲突的深思熟虑:希特勒能赢吗?”
历史评论杂志, 十一月至十二月1995年
( http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v15/v15n6p38_Bishop.html )

阿道夫·希特勒。 11年1941月XNUMX日,德国国会演讲。(对美国宣战)
( http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v08/v08p389_Hitler.html )

约阿希姆·霍夫曼(Joachim Hoffmann), 斯大林Vernichtungskrieg,1941-1945年:Planung,Ausführung和Dokumentation。 慕尼黑:Herbig,1999年。

乔治·肯南(George F. Kennan) 列宁和斯大林统治下的俄罗斯和西方. 波士顿:大西洋/小布朗公司,1961

海因茨·马根海默 希特勒的战争:德国的关键战略决策,1940-1945. 巴恩斯与诺布尔,2003

Eric Margolis,“是时候面对二战的真相了”,2009 年和 2011 年
( http://www.huffingtonpost.com/eric-margolis/time-to-face-the-truth-ab_b_282379.html )

Daniel W. Michaels,“考察斯大林 1941 年进攻德国的计划”。
历史评论杂志, 十一月至十二月2000年
( http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v19/v19n6p40_Michaels.html )

丹尼尔·迈克尔斯(Daniel W. Michaels),“揭露斯大林征服欧洲的计划:苏联如何“丢掉”了第二次世界大战”, 历史评论杂志,1998年XNUMX月至XNUMX月。
( http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v17/v17n4p30_Michaels.html )

Daniel Michaels,“关于‘巴巴罗萨’的新证据:希特勒为何袭击苏俄”。
历史评论杂志,2001月-XNUMX月。 XNUMX
( http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v18/v18n3p40_Michaels.html )

Daniel Michaels,“俄罗斯和德国历史学家辩论‘巴巴罗萨’”
历史评论杂志,2001月-XNUMX月。 XNUMX
( http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v20/v20n6p59_Michaels.html )

约翰·莫西尔。 死亡之旅:希特勒与斯大林——东线,1941-1945 。 西蒙与舒斯特(Simon&Schuster),2010年。

汤姆·塞格夫,“二战是斯大林的罪魁祸首吗?”
“国土报” (以色列),31 年 2007 月 XNUMX 日
( http://www.haaretz.com/weekend/magazine/was-stalin-to-blame-1.228553 )
[ http://www.fpp.co.uk/online/07/08/Stalins_warguilt.html ])

约翰·L·斯内尔 幻觉与必然性:全球战争的外交,1939-1945. 波士顿:霍顿米夫林,1963

维克多·苏沃洛夫(V. Rezun), 罪魁祸首:斯大林开始第二次世界大战的宏伟设计 . 海军学院出版社,2008

维克多·苏沃洛夫(V. Rezun), 破冰船:第二次世界大战是谁发动的?。 伦敦:1990年。

Viktor Suvorov (V. Rezun),“斯大林:二战的‘罪魁祸首’。”
讲座,C-跨度。 视频
( http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/283856-1 )

Viktor Suvorov (V. Rezun),“谁发动了第二次世界大战?”
演讲。 视频

Ron Unz,“当斯大林几乎征服欧洲时”,2018 年 XNUMX 月。
( https://www.unz.com/runz/american-pravda-when-stalin-almost-conquered-europe/ )

马克·韦伯(Mark Weber),“罗斯福的“秘密地图”演说”
历史评论杂志春季1985
( http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v06/v06p125_Weber.html )

Mark Weber,“第二次世界大战的‘好战’神话”,2008 年 XNUMX 月。
( http://www.ihr.org/news/weber_ww2_may08.html )

(从重新发布 历史回顾研究所 经作者或代表的许可)
 
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  1. Sunday morning, June 22, 1941, military forces of Germany, Finland and Romania suddenly struck against the Soviet Union

    Technically, at least on the German front, on that day, they struck against the Soviet occupation forces in Poland. They wouldn’t get to the borders of the Soviet Union* until a little later.

    *Or, if one prefers, Bolshevik controlled territory in the Russian Empire. But hey, Communists are people too, they deserve to have their rights of sovereignty respected just like everyone else. If we just leave them alone and let them liquidate the class enemies in peace, they will be no bother to their neighbors.

    • 同意: jacques sheete
  2. Why attack the Soviet Union?

    Why not attack the Soviet Union?

    Ronald Reagan – We Begin Bombing In 5 Minutes

    My fellow Americans. I’m pleased to announce that I’ve signed legislation outlawing the Soviet Union. We begin bombing in five minutes.

    • 回复: @Beckow
  3. anon[318]• 免责声明 说:

    The Nazi Reich invaded the USSR because it was an impeary status, bellicose and genocidal; the Nazis did not aim for any security reasons, no matter what they said. Its objectives were to annex lands, to exploit natural resources and to enslave and annihilate the inhabitants of the Soviet Union. Any minimally serious reading of the history of the Nazi occupation of the Soviet territories confirms this.

  4. Anonymous [AKA "Rex Germanicus"] 说:

    “Any minimally serious reading of the history of the Nazi occupation of the Soviet territories confirms this.”
    “Any minimally serious reading of the history… confirms this.”

    Ah yes, where have we heard these formulations before. Unquestionable, official truths without alternatives. I wonder. Maybe we should outlaw questioning the motives and actions of the “vile war of aggression on the innocent Soviet Union”, too. Us Germans are all too familiar with narratives like these after all.

    To this day the war over history does not stop, because powerful people today need its narrative to justify their power and status of ‘victim’ and ‘criminal’. If only the tyrants of old could finally rot and we could burry the tyrants of today with them. Sad!

    • 回复: @EugeneGur
    , @Matteo
  5. What about all other European countries invaded , by Germany at that time ?

  6. Mikel 说:
    @european born

    They were also conspiring to attack Germany under the influence of Jewish plotters. Besides, Hitler had clearly stated in Mein Kampf that he had no expansionist designs whatsoever and held Germany’s eastern neighbors in his highest regards.

    • 哈哈: Plato's Dream
    • 回复: @RI
  7. Next we need Neville Chamberlain on the same subject.

    • 回复: @Wally
    , @jacques sheete
  8. Mulegino1 说:

    The position of the vast bulk of the Soviet forces deployed along the western borders of the USSR says it all. There is 地狱里没有办法 these deployments were defensive in nature. Had the Germans not struck when they did, and the Soviets had seized the Romanian oil fields (the 9th Rifle Army was within easy striking distance) Germany and all of Europe would have been rendered helpless and immobile within a few weeks.

    To put it quite simply, Hitler’s actions gave Europe a few years breathing space, before it was overwhelmed by Soviet-Anglo-American invaders to subsequently become the contested ground of the Cold War. Operation Barbarossa was an act of Divine Providence, and the only way that the Europe of Nations retained even a glimmer of hope of survival. A Soviet tsunami would have drowned it in 1941; the tension between NATO and the Soviet bloc allowed the core of European Christian identity to survive- ironically- in the East.

  9. Hillbob 说:

    War was forced on the peace loving Fuhrer.

    Though many Soviet army personnel was on “summer” leave……
    The attack took the soviets by complete surprise with extraordinary losses in men and material in the first few days of the invasion. In fact , some units were ordered not to fire on the invaders , thinking that it was a mistake.

    Stalin went awol at the shock. The supply of produce to Germany went unhindered up to the day of the invasion.

    Stalin did not believe the warnings of the German spy Richard Sorge who proved invaluable to him in the battle of Moscow who gave him the ‘exact’ details of the attack(as well the British code breakers of Ultra)

    He even dismissed the warning of at least one German soldier who went over to the soviets to warn them the day before the actual invasion.

    In fact Stalin believed Hitler more than he did his own Generals and spies at the time.

    Sounds like a country preparing to attack Germany

    • 同意: Miggle
    • 回复: @j2
    , @Pandos
    , @KenH
  10. Hillbob 说:
    @european born

    Great point. Reason finds no place in either the murderous Nazis or their present day adherents and apologists

    • 回复: @anonomy
    , @Wally
    , @Sin City Milla
  11. Mikel 说:
    @Mulegino1

    Oh yes. Just because they had just been unable to defeat the mighty Finns it doesn’t mean that the Soviets were not about to overrun Nazi Germany (and all the rest of European nations). It was a matter of weeks before they would have been occupying Lisbon and the Straits of Gibraltar.

  12. Priss Factor [又名“ Asagirian”] 说: • 您的网站

    The position of the vast bulk of the Soviet forces deployed along the western borders of the USSR says it all. There is no way in hell these deployments were defensive in nature.

    Maybe USSR was trying to push Germany into a defensive position so that it wouldn’t go on the offensive.

    Stalin simply wan’t a gambler on that scale.

    • 回复: @Sin City Milla
  13. obwandiyag 说:

    This is disingenuous in the extreme. Of course the Russians were preparing like crazy for a German invasion. Look what happened. Sheesh.

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  14. j2 说:
    @Hillbob

    “Sounds like a country preparing to attack Germany.”

    The issues you mention do not prove your point. Consider the chronology. I do not know how fast Germany mobilized, but Finland mobilized as a war exercise in 18. June 1941. Finland joined the attack 25. June 1941 and the goal of the war was regaining areas lost in the Soviet attack 1939-1940. Sorge warned Stalin 20. May 1941. Probably at that time there were no clear signs of Germany mobilizing in the Eastern Front. Stalin had attack troops taking offensive positions with the planned attack in August 1941, many officers would take summer vacations in the end of June, it was summer and not yet the attack. It is possible that Stalin did not believe in the ability of Germans to start an attack. Germany was in war in the West and had so far yielded in everything. It seems true that Soviet troops were planning an attack in Central Europe. Maybe Germany mobilized faster than they thought possible.

    In the beginning of the talk Hitler gave to Mannerheim when he visited Finland Hitler explains why he attacked to the SU so late: that he wanted to attack to France much earlier but it was raining all the time, and if the Soviets had taken Romanian oil fields in 1940, Germany could not have stopped it. Possibly in 1939 Hitler was hoping to have a bit longer peace arrangement with the Soviet Union, but after the summer of 1940 (when the SU occupied the Baltic states) it must have been clear that an eastern war was coming very soon. Hitler started it two months too late considering the short summer, and because of this it may have been a preventive war, but to Mannerheim he explained the late start with the Greece expedition. As for Hitler’s general plans for gaining areas in the east, istn’t that in Mein Kampf explained well enough.=, and Germany did attack to Poland (regardless of what caused it.)

    • 回复: @Wally
    , @Beefcake the Mighty
  15. Indeed, it’s a good question. Why would Germans decide at that point to declare war against the Soviet Union? Germans knew what had happened during WWI, that the war would go until the the end and only end with the defeat and unconditional capitulation of Germany. In 1941 it was clear that Germany could not defeat the UK, it was clear that there was no hope of a peace agreement. And it was clear that the USA would at some point take the side of the UK and win the war. So, why would Hitler decide at this point to attack the Soviet Union? For some reason he must have felt compelled to attack.

    • 回复: @j2
  16. @european born

    What about all other European countries invaded , by Germany at that time ?

    Possibly as a necessity of war. This is not a theme I know very much about, but as far as I know Germany could have occupayed Denmark as a necessity of war. But Germany didn’t want to conquer Denmark. The Danish government remained more or less in power, the Germans even didn’t care about the Jews in Denmark. The only thing that they wanted was to control it militarily in order that the British don’t use Denmark as a starting point to attack Germany.

    Have you tried to answer the question why France declared war against Germany on the 3 of September, 1939? And what about the British invasion of Iceland, for instance? From Wikipedia:

    “The invasion of Iceland occurred on 10 May 1940 during World War II. Iceland was occupied by troops of the United Kingdom. The United Kingdom military operation, codenamed Operation Fork, was conducted by the Royal Navy and Royal Marines. The invasion was performed because the British government feared that the island would be used by the Germans, who had recently overrun Denmark, Iceland’s possessing country. The Government of Iceland issued a protest, charging that its neutrality had been “flagrantly violated” and “its independence infringed”.”

    • 回复: @James Forrestal
  17. Sparkon 说:

    All of the pre-war maneuvering becomes easier to understand if one accepts my argument that Stalin was trying to goad, intimidate, or even frighten the Germans into attacking, in much the same way that Roosevelt was backing the Japanese into a corner so that the hotheads and militants in Japan saw few options other than to attack Pearl Harbor and eliminate the immediate American threat to their remaining sources of raw materials, or so they thought.

    No one was happier than Iosef Stalin when the Germans launched Barbarossa, unless it was Franklin D. Roosevelt or Winston Churchill. Churchill simply wanted Germany crushed again, while FDR and Stalin were motivated by their shared Communist ideology. The German attack also allowed Stalin to consolidate power as nothing else could have.

    It was all part of the plan from the beginning going back at least to 1929, when Stalin had initiated his cruel and merciless twin programs of forced collectivization and rapid industrialization that resulted in the deaths of millions of peasants, Kulaks, and Nepmen among the various nationalities of the Soviet Union, but which allowed the Red Army to build up what was probably the most powerful military in the world by the eve of Barbarossa, as Mark Weber notes in his fine article here.

    The conspiracy between FDR and Iosef Stalin was predicated on the desire and intention to let the enemy strike the first blow so that the Allies would be able to claim the moral high ground, which they did throughout the war, and during the post-war psychological beat down of Germany, which continues to this day.

    If Stalin had attacked Germany, FDR would not have been able to sell to the American public the entirely absurd idea of benevolent “Uncle Joe,” and it would have been much harder, if not virtually impossible to demonize Germany and especially Adolf Hitler.

    Hitler’s failure to bag the BEF when it was trapped at Dunkirk, along with other fatal strategic mistakes leading to Germany’s defeat, naturally leads to my conjecture that the guy with the little moustache was in fact an agent with a cryptic agenda.

    In his speech above, Hitler singles out England as the source of the conspiracy against Germany, not once but twice. Yet, when Hitler had the chance to knock England out of the war, he failed to capitalize on the golden opportunity, forgetting apparently how the Allied expeditionary force had landed and formed up in England in WWI before crossing the channel and throwing its weight against the Kaiser’s army, thereby changing the outcome of the war, and all of it based on a deal between Zionists and the British to bring the United States into the war in exchange for a Jewish homeland in Palestine, the notorious “stab in the back.”

    The German war effort was also compromised, perhaps fatally, by the presence of a powerful spy within the 3rd Reich’s hierarchy in the person of Abwehr head Admiral Canaris, who supposedly turned against Hitler after the so-called Night of the Long Knives in 1934 when the German dictator liquidated the SA.

    The Allies can be grateful that Canaris apparently never learned about Stalin’s Red Army purges in 1937, or especially his murderous collectivization, dekulakization, and rapid industrialization campaigns beginning in 1929 where millions of Russians, Ukrainians, and Kazakhs (among others) perished as a result of Stalin’s ruthless policies, rather than a few hundred thugs who were killed in Hitler’s take down of Röhm and his SA.

    • 回复: @Grahamsno(G64)
  18. j2 说:
    @Mikel

    “Oh yes. Just because they had just been unable to defeat the mighty Finns it doesn’t mean that the Soviets were not about to overrun Nazi Germany (and all the rest of European nations). It was a matter of weeks before they would have been occupying Lisbon and the Straits of Gibraltar.”

    You ridicule something you do not quite understand. It is the nature conditions that count here.
    Finns stopped the Soviet main attack second time in the Summer of 1944 (with important help from German airforces), but just after that the Soviets did overrun Nazi Germany and all of East Europe fell under their power. Germans could not stop a Soviet main attack. Nature conditions in Central Europe unfortunately suit very well to mass use of tanks, unlike (fortunately) in Finland. If the Western Allied had not pushed east from the west, Soviets very possibly would have proceeded further and taken the whole Continent.

    • 同意: Mulegino1
    • 回复: @Mikel
  19. j2 说:
    @UncommonGround

    Why Hitler attacked the Soviet Union in 1941? Maybe he was forced to attack at that time. Possible.
    But it is a wrong question.

    The correct question is why Hitler attacked Poland? Hitler had some problems with Poles, but it did not require a war and occupation of the country. Attacking to Poland started the world war. It was known that it would bring in France, most probably also the Great Britain, and the Soviet Union was a threat, the USA would fight in Europe after some time. If Hitler tried to avoid a world war, the only decision needed was not to attack to Poland but to find some other solution, even taking Germans in Poland to main Germany.

    But Mein Kampf mentions Jews on almost every page, so that was something essential to Hitler. If the real reason of the war was forcing Jews out Europe into the homeland that Zionist bankers had got through the previous bloody world war, then occupying Poland was unavoidable as that is where most of them were. Areas in the east, stopping Communism, they were secondary goals and the final result, Germany’s defeat, could be seen, but this single goal was what Hitler wanted to achieve, and achieved: Israel.

  20. PeterMX 说:
    @european born

    Which countries are you referring to? France and Great Britain that declared war on Germany in early September 1939, Holland which allied itself with Britain and France and said nothing to Britain as their bombers flew over Dutch territory (prior to the German attack on French and British troops in May 1940) to drop bombs on Germany, or the German invasion of Norway to only get their days before the British planned to invade to cut Germany off from vital natural resources it needed?

    http://www.fpp.co.uk/books/Hitler/1977/html_chapter/06.html

    “Churchill broadcast on the BBC a warning to Norway that Britain would no longer tolerate a pro-German interpretation of neutrality ; the Allies would continue the fight “wherever it might lead them.” (Churchill’s designs on Norway were known to German Intelligence from a series of incautious hints he dropped in a secret press conference with neutral press attaches in London on February 2.) Small wonder that Hitler later referred more than once to the indiscretions committed by Reynaud and Churchill as providing the final urgent stimulus for his own adventure.(1)”

    https://www.counter-currents.com/2013/12/battle-for-norway/

    The German invasion of Poland to free mistreated Germans and their territory from Polish occupation only occurred after extensive efforts to come to a peaceful solution. Something the British deliberately sabotaged by encouraging the Poles to keep the German territory when they promised to make war on Germany in early 1939 in the event Germany attacked Poland.

    The German city Memel is another example of allied behavior. The allies declared it a “Free City”, like Danzig, after WW I but in 1923 Lithuania attacked and took over the German city. The allies immediately recognized Memel as Lithuanian. Germany took it back, freeing the German population, in 1938.

    • 同意: Byrresheim
  21. @j2

    I would say that the situations in 1939 and in 1941 were quite different. I don’t think that Hitler ever wanted a war against the UK or against France. At the end his drive to reverse Versailles was too strong and led to a war. I’m not sure, but it seems that Hitler wanted to make peace with the English as soon as the war started, but it was too late (I read once a book about peace initiatives during the war where the author says that there were about 100 such peace proposals which the English ignored or rejected, the book itself talks about 50 peace proposals, I don’t remember anymore the name of the author). At that time things were very different than they are today or they had been a few years earlier). Large parts of East Europe had been a part of Austria, Hitler was Austrian and maybe it was natural for him to think that he could change things easily. Poland was a country that changed its form, location and owner quite often. Is it likely that Hitler and his generals wanted still to conquest anything at all in 1941 for the pure sake of conquest? I think that the only thing that mattered at that time was not to loose the war. They were the managers of a desaster. In 1939 Hitler could still think that he could take the initiative and determine outcomes, even if he was wrong. In 1941 it was too late for that.

    • 回复: @j2
  22. Mikel 说:
    @j2

    Yes, how thoughtless of me to suggest that the Nazi invasion of the Soviet Union had anything to do with Hitler’s idea of acquiring Lebensraum for Germany in the East and was not of a purely defensive nature.

    • 回复: @j2
    , @Wally
  23. j2 说:
    @Mikel

    Do not be so hard on yourself, you are partially correct. In Mein Kampf there is the clear idea of gaining Lebensraum from the east, if is from Karl Haushofer. The goal of destroying Communism and pushing Russia to the east was also real. Clearly the Barbarossa Operation did not have a purely defensive nature, even if the offensive attack in 1941 was made in a situation when the Soviet Union was forming troops to an attack formation.

    Your mistake is not there, it is in misunderstanding the plan Hitler had concerning the Jews. A simple calculation of the Jewish death toll shows incorrect the common view that the goal was the destruction of the whole people and confirms that the goal followed in a more literal sense the way the final solution was described in the Wannsee conference.

    Starting from this fact that can be shown in simple arithmetics, you should investigate what it implies to the attack to Poland. There was the problem of the Free City of Danzig. That problem could have been solved, but Nazis wanted to push Poland to a war. (They were much helped by Polish attitude not to allow Germany to annex Danzig), but an agreement could have been found. Such issues as that Nazis considered Poles as untermenchen are not an explanation to the war. Hitler wanted a war with Poland that he knew he would win, not any solution to the Danzig problem.

    Thus, Hitler either wanted a war with France and England, or he just had to occupy Poland. Then you ask why Poland? The Lebensraum was supposed to be in the Baltic area, a bit higher up. I connect it to the final solution and to the homeland in Palestine, which is largely why the First World War was started by Freemasons and bankers.

    • 回复: @Wally
    , @Franklin Ryckaert
  24. j2 说:
    @UncommonGround

    Annexing Austria, then Czechoslovakia, which was a part of Austria before the WWI. And then the war with Poland.

    The rest is what follows: because of a war with Poland Germany ended up in a war with France and had to go through Belgium, so England joined to the war. England planned to occupy Norway, so Germany occupied Norway. Germany occupied Denmark for a similar reason. And so it goes on.

    Your explanation then is that Hitler wanted a war with Poland (it was not the question of Danzig, which could have been solved in some way) because as he wrote in Mein Kampf, he did not see the possibility of Poles having an independent state. Poland had been divided in the end of the 18th century and beginning of the 19th century among Prussia, Austria and Russia. That would mean that the idea was to restore Germany and Austria to what they were before the WWI. It is possible that it was the idea, but it is not at all clear that this was the idea. What then about the Lebenstraum, the Jewish question, the untermenchen, Communism. I think the idea of restoring something was only a justification that was used in the beginning. The alternatives I would consider are: was is to stop Communists? Was it to gain Lebensraum? Was it to exterminate untermenchen (=Slavs)? Was it to solve the Jewish problem? I think it was the last. The main goal was the last because that is the only goal that is a logical continuation for the First World War. It is the only solution what explains why no countries including the USA wanted to take the Jews. Wars and especially world wars do not start just like that, because somebody shot an archduke or because an Austrian ex-soldier got to power in Germany. I think it is a myth that the world drifted to the WWII because of a dictator and that democracies did not stop him in time. It was not at all like that, there had to be interests and goals on the winning side to have this war.

    • 不同意: Zumbuddi, Wally
    • 回复: @Germanicus
    , @Wally
    , @Johann
  25. Anon[999]• 免责声明 说:

    Mein Kamph not withstanding.

    It was Trotsky who wanted to wage a global revolution and his accolites today are The NeoCon scum that infest our government. Stalin was merely a thug, but he always sought compromise and accommodation with the west. Churchill played him for a fool.

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  26. @UncommonGround

    And what about the British invasion of Iceland, for instance?

    Or the joint British/ Soviet invasion of Iran

    As far as Norway goes — the Brits also planned to invade, and had already landed troops in the north when the Germans took control.

  27. Wally 说:
    @anon

    Proof of their ‘genocidal’ actions is where exactly?

    It’s a basic question that those who make such a claim must produce.

    二战欧洲/大西洋剧院修正主义论坛
    https://forum.codoh.com/viewforum.php?f=20

    • 回复: @Plato's Dream
  28. Wally 说:
    @european born

    You are woefully indoctrinated.
    事实:
    –苏联入侵了芬兰,拉脱维亚,爱沙尼亚,立陶宛,波兰,入侵并吞并了罗马尼亚的部分地区,入侵了伊朗,入侵了挪威北部和丹麦的博恩霍尔姆岛,但“盟国”没有采取任何行动。
    –波兰入侵并吞并了捷克领土的大部分地区,捷克斯洛伐克占领了德国的大部分地区,对德国平民实施暴行。 然而,“盟国”什么也没做。
    –在德国对美国宣战之前很久,“中立”的美国一直在攻击德国的U型船和航运,同时向英国和苏联提供物资。
    –在德国到达并制止它之前,英国人入侵并在纳尔维克(Narvik)开采挪威。
    –法国在比利时边境安置了2万士兵,而BEF又有近XNUMX万。
    –法国和英国已经通过在低地上空飞行飞机而违反了比利时和荷兰的“中立性”,而不受惩罚。
    –重要的是要记住,法国已经在1939年入侵德国萨尔,在整个时期中,希特勒一直在乞求丘吉尔谈判恢复原状。

    “希特勒不会有战争,但他将被迫参加,不是今年,而是以后……”(《犹太人的埃米尔·路德维希》,《年鉴》,1934 年 XNUMX 月)

    http://www.codoh.com

    • 回复: @Anon
  29. Wally 说:
    @Philip Owen

    Who made a fair & reasonable deal.

    想谈谈吗?

    谢谢。

  30. Wally 说:
    @j2

    LOL
    I guess Polish occupation of a large part Germany had noting to do with it.
    I guess Polish atrocities on Germans had nothing to do with.
    Poland even invaded and annexed parts of Czechoslovakia.

    为什么德国入侵波兰,作者:约翰·威尔(John Wear): http://inconvenienthistory.com/11/1/6391
    1年1939月XNUMX日之前的波兰针对德国人的暴行: https://forum.codoh.com/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=7525

    在波兰的压力下,南部和东部地区的德国人受到压迫性待遇。 19年1920月1921日,波兰人的力量确实足够强大,试图用武力占领该国。 在波兰的各个方面,主要是从波兰国会招募的人,都在篡夺权威。 许多德国人被强行带过边境进入波兰,许多人被杀。 经过数周的时间,才有可能平息这一上升和恢复秩序……协约国曾建议,德意志帝国的非居民上西里西亚人应在科隆西里西亚之外投票。 德国对此表示抗议,协约国承认她的抗议是有效的。 20年1921月,全民公决的日期定为XNUMX年XNUMX月XNUMX日。
    波兰人利用恐怖主义立即复兴,特别是在里布尼克,普莱斯,卡托维兹和贝登地区。 在全民投票之前的几天,它达到了高潮。 来自德国帝国其他地区的选民经常被拒绝参加民意调查。 有时他们受到虐待,甚至在某些情况下被谋杀; 选民们住的房屋被烧毁……在全民公决后的第二天,波兰的暴行重新开始,从那以后一直持续不间断……实际上,所有城镇都投票支持德国……XNUMX月初见证了新的波兰起义。比前一个比例要大得多。 Korfanty秘密地筹集了一支井井有条的波兰部队,该部队从边境提供武器和弹药,并得到来自波兰的大批士兵的加固。
    到20月XNUMX日,英军再次占领了较大的城镇,而波兰人则在农村地区占了上风。 由于难以支付他的士兵和向他们提供食物,科凡蒂现在失去了对他的追随者的控制。 成立了独立的乐队,掠夺了村庄,虐待了德国人,并杀死了其中许多人。”

    – 1922年《大不列颠百科全书》,“ SILESIA,UPPER”

    这篇文章出现在 1930 年 XNUMX 月的波兰报纸 Die Liga der Grossmacht 上:

    波兰和德国之间的斗争是不可避免的。 我们必须系统地为此做好准备。 我们的目标是新的坦能堡战役。 但是,这次是柏林郊区的坦嫩伯格(Tannenberg)。 普鲁士必须重新征服波兰,而普鲁士的确应征服至施普雷河。 在与德国的战争中,将不会有囚犯……

    Tannenberg” refers to the Battle of Tannenberg in 1410 when a Polish army defeated the German Teutonic Knights. The article is full of many more anti-German remarks.

    此外,冯·里本贝特罗普(Von Ribbentrop)为波兰的进攻辩护说,在1919年至1939年之间,有XNUMX万德国人被波兰暴行驱逐出境,并伴随着多次暴行,向海牙世界法院和日内瓦国际联盟的投诉一直在忽略了。
    IOW, the World Court did not find the accusations of Polish atrocities to be bogus.
    推荐的: “Dokumente polnischer Grausamkeiten. Verbrechen an Deutschen 1919-1939 nach amtlichen Quellen” (Documentations of Polish Cruelties. Crimes Against Germans 1919-1939 According to Official Sources).: https://www.amazon.com/Dokumente-Polnischer-Grausamkeiten-Verbrechen-Deutschen/dp/3887411781

    • 回复: @j2
  31. Wally 说:
    @Mikel

    的确。
    Germany’s preemptive attack on the USSR had nothing to do with ‘lebensraum”.
    Please actually read the article above and try again.

    Barbarossa行动是预防性袭击: https://forum.codoh.com/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=7999
    和:
    The Remarkable Historiography of David Irving,,由Ron Unz撰写: https://www.unz.com/announcement/the-remarkable-historiography-of-david-irving/

    http://www.codoh.com

  32. The thesis is interesting, but not convincing. There is a difference between planning and preparing, and acting. Responsible defense requires planning and preparing. The moral response to a perceived threat is to ready one’s defenses. A competent defense makes the cost of attack impermissibly high. It keeps alive the possibility that both sides will forego violence. It gives the benefit of doubt to peace, not war.

    Preventive war pre-empts the possibility for peace and gives the benefit of doubt to war.

    In the event, Soviet defenses were not excessive, they were barely adequate. The defense planners calculations were vindicated.

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
    , @JP
  33. renfro 说:

    If you were around and reading the news back then you would know that in addition to expanding territory, the threat of Bolshevism coming to Germany was a major factor for Hitler.

    This edited interview of Adolf Hitler by George Sylvester Viereck took place in 1923. It was republished in Liberty magazine in July 1932

    ”When I take charge of Germany, I shall end tribute abroad and Bolshevism at home.”

    Adolf Hitler drained his cup as if it contained not tea, but the lifeblood of Bolshevism.

    “Bolshevism,” the chief of the Brown Shirts, the Fascists of Germany, continued, gazing at me balefully, “is our greatest menace. Kill Bolshevism in Germany and you restore 70 million people to power. France owes her strength not to her armies but to the forces of Bolshevism and dissension in our midst.

    “The Treaty of Versailles and the Treaty of St Germain are kept alive by Bolshevism in Germany. The Peace Treaty and Bolshevism are two heads of one monster. We must decapitate both.”

    继续…..https://www.theguardian.com/theguardian/2007/sep/17/greatinterviews1

    Hitler attributed Bolshevism to the Jews, but then so did most other world leaders as in Churchills “Zionism and Bolshevism”:

    ”International Jews.
    In violent opposition to all this sphere of Jewish effort rise the schemes of the International Jews. The adherents of this sinister confederacy are mostly men reared up among the unhappy populations of countries where Jews are persecuted on account of their race. Most, if not all, of them have forsaken the faith of their forefathers, and divorced from their minds all spiritual hopes of the next world. This movement among the Jews is not new. From the days of Spartacus-Weishaupt to those of Karl Marx, and down to Trotsky (Russia), Bela Kun (Hungary), Rosa Luxembourg (Germany), and Emma Goldman (United States), this world-wide conspiracy for the overthrow of civilisation and for the reconstitution of society on the basis of arrested development, of envious malevolence, and impossible equality, has been steadily growing. It played, as a modern writer, Mrs. Webster, has so ably shown, a definitely recognisable part in the tragedy of the French Revolution. It has been the mainspring of every subversive movement during the Nineteenth Century; and now at last this band of extraordinary personalities from the underworld of the great cities of Europe and America have gripped the Russian people by the hair of their heads and have become practically the undisputed masters of that enormous empire.
    There is no need to exaggerate the part played in the creation of Bolshevism and in the actual bringing about of the Russian Revolution by these international and for the most part atheistical Jews. It is certainly a very great one; it probably outweighs all others. With the notable exception of Lenin, the majority of the leading figures are Jews. Moreover, the principal inspiration and driving power comes from the Jewish leaders. Thus Tchitcherin, a pure Russian, is eclipsed by his nominal subordinate Litvinoff, and the influence of Russians like Bukharin or Lunacharski cannot be compared with the power of Trotsky, or of Zinovieff, the Dictator of the Red Citadel (Petrograd), or of Krassin or Radek – all Jews. In the Soviet institutions the predominance of Jews is even more astonishing. And the prominent, if not indeed the principal, part in the system of terrorism applied by the Extraordinary Commissions for Combating Counter-Revolution has been taken by Jews, and in some notable cases by Jewesses. The same evil prominence was obtained by Jews in the brief period of terror during which Bela Kun ruled in Hungary. The same phenomenon has been presented in Germany (especially in Bavaria), so far as this madness has been allowed to prey upon the temporary prostration of the German people. Although in all these countries there are many non-Jews every whit as bad as the worst of the Jewish revolutionaries, the part played by the latter in proportion to their numbers in the population is astonishing. ”

  34. Anon[424]• 免责声明 说:

    The bellicose germans are always attacking neighbours , the poor germans think they are racially superior . Now they attacking economically and psychologically other countries of the European Union , they will be defeated as usual , the EU will not last .

  35. refl 说:

    I have recommended it here before: “Who set Hitler against Stalin” by Nikolai Starikov. The author concludes that the whole war on Hitlers part was a giant improvisation.

    It is devastating to see that a Russian nationalist Duma member gives more thought to what really happened back than then legions of western internet commentators, not even to speak of historical accademia. Think of Hitler as an intelligence asset installed to engage Germans, Russians and all of central Europe in a self-defeating fight to the death, leaving communism and bankerism as the lords of what once was the European world.

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  36. Anon[424]• 免责声明 说:

    Great european monsters : Napoleon , Hitler , Churchill .

  37. Anonymous [AKA "Danilko"] 说:

    Wonderful piece of crap…may be we can see here some analogy with the situation existing today between the « free » world and Russia/China to justify a First Strike…

    • 同意: RobinG
  38. Anon[424]• 免责声明 说:

    The miserable finns , hungarians , romanians , slovaks …. hoped to get some bones from the ubermenschen , serving them to exterminate russians , miserable countries , miserable Europe

    • 回复: @ariadna
  39. Parfois1 说:

    Why does anyone take the author of this article seriously? My first reaction was to ignore it as a futile attempt to re-write history to whitewash Nazism; on the other hand, it might have had some new useful insight into the workings of Hitler’s brain, so I read the first paragraphs. But, alas, it was a waste of time for it is nothing more than rehashing the old platitudes of Nazi propaganda.

    A few years ago I heard the same platitudes – but this time coming from the new fascist state in Washington – before unleashing attacks on the Middle East and elsewhere in the world under the guise that they are a “threat to America’s interests”; in fact the same excuses used by the murderous fascist state of Israel when it attacks unarmed civilians.

    This article is cheap Nazi propaganda – and one wonders why it was allowed to appear in this respectable UNZ Review. Lack of suitable material for publication? Or just plain old-fashioned crass anti-sovietism?

    • 回复: @RobinG
    , @CK
    , @Sin City Milla
  40. George 说:

    Did the Soviet Union consciously lure the British and French Empires into a war with Germany by supporting Germany during the Polish conquest? Or was it just dumb luck?

  41. Gustav 说:

    谎言的终结

    In 2015, a small German publisher publishes a book by Dr. Ing. rer. mil. Bernd Schwipper, Major General a. D of the East German Army (NVA): “Germany in the sights of Stalin”.

    Schwipper 博士曾在东德和苏联的军事学院学习,最近担任防空师指挥官。

    他的研究基于苏联总参谋部的行为,这些行为在耶尔津总统时代暂时可用。

    行动、动员、基础设施计划等证明,斯大林用19年1940月18日(!)、1940年11月1941日、15年1941月XNUMX日和XNUMX年XNUMX月XNUMX日的行动计划策划了对德国的进攻。所有计划都纯粹是进攻性的。 在此之前,苏联对波兰、芬兰、波罗的海国家和罗马尼亚进行了战争。

    Because of the strong border fortification in the east of Germany and the rapid German victory over France, the plans from August 1940 were not implemented.

    21 年 1941 月 10 日,德国国防军的预防性进攻发生在苏联进攻前几天。 苏联最迟将在 1941 年 XNUMX 月 XNUMX 日左右袭击德国。

    由于采取了史无前例的防御措施,红军在初期的损失是巨大的。

    从今天的观点和公开文件的知识来看,必须说,是的,德国军队的攻击是预防性的。

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
    , @David In TN
  42. In 我的奋斗 Hitler clearly stated that he wanted 栖息地 in Russia, and in his 表谈话 he waxed lyrical about how he would settle Germans in the East, use all its resources for Germany and reduce its Slavic population to serfdom. Nowhere in his 表谈话 did he complain about Stalins “betrayal” of their mutual non-aggression pact. This renders the idea that Hitler’s attack on Russia was only preventive in intent doubtful. Stalin may have had aggressive intentions toward Germany, but Hitler did have those too toward Russia, and for different (“racial”) reasons. There were no “good guys” in WW II, everybody betrayed everybody.

  43. @j2

    “…The Lebensraum was supposed to be in the Baltic area, a bit higher up…”

    没有 栖息地 was supposed to be in all of Eastern Europe up to the Urals.

    阅读 总体规划 .

  44. @Sparkon

    No one was happier than Iosef Stalin when the Germans launched Barbarossa

    Yes he was so happy that he had a nervous breakdown you idiot. When the war started his politburo was so terrified to wake him up and tell him the ‘good news’ that they spent hours arguing as to who would break the news to him.

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
    , @Sparkon
  45. @anon

    You made some claims, now attempt to substantiate them. Try reading the article while yer at it and remember that trolling isn’t well tolerated here.

    • 回复: @RobinG
  46. @european born

    Now tell us how the USSR was formed, and explain it while yer at it. Did you read the article? How many times was the word.”encirclement” used? Do you understand what it meant?

    Did you know that some New York Jews declared war on Germany in 1933, complete with boycotts and financing of international communism and that Marxists had been preaching about, advocating, and acting on the concept of violent worldwide revolution for many decades?

  47. @Philip Owen

    Next we need Neville Chamberlain on the same subject.

    And Roosevelt and Churchill who appeased Stalin in every way possible. And Churchill appeased the deranged Roosevelt as well.

  48. @Grahamsno(G64)

    No one was happier than Iosef Stalin when the Germans launched Barbarossa

    Yes he was so happy that he had a nervous breakdown you idiot. When the war started his politburo was so terrified to wake him up and tell him the ‘good news’ that they spent hours arguing as to who would break the news to him.

    Yeah,yeah, we all know the old canard about the tender hearted Stalin’s “noyvuss bweakdown.” What I’d like to know are your sources. Credible ones only, please.

    Before you waste yours and everyone else’s time, go back and read the article above, and ‘splain this.

    Influential American historians have for years accepted the official US view of the German-Soviet clash.

    和这个。:

    This evidence also thoroughly discredits the 简单化 portrayal of the German-Soviet clash, and indeed of the Second World War itself, that US officials and prominent historians presented to the American public during the war, and for years afterwards.

    We’ve had nearly a century now to understand that we’ve been lied to; what’s taking you so long to get a clue?

    “… this entire 神话, so prevalent then and even now about Hitler, and about the Japanese, is a tissue of fallacies from beginning to end. Every plank in this nightmare evidence is either completely untrue or not entirely the truth.

    如果人们应该学习有关希特勒德国的这种知识欺诈,那么他们将开始提出问题,并寻找问题……”

    -默里·罗斯巴德(Murray Rothbard), 时代的修正主义

    PS: Mr. Rothbard was an 美国犹太人 and an historian of the very highest caliber. Read him and wake up.Take his advice and start asking questions. Don’t be a dupe.

  49. @Franklin Ryckaert

    Yes, just ask General Vlasov

    I came to you the Germans to fight. This is my profession, I have been doing this for more than 25 years. I believe that I am still quite a skilled and experienced general and military leader. I was also the Deputy Commissar of Defense. … And here in Germany, I [am not needed]. My application was rejected. They didn’t even talk to me. I managed to win the sympathy of only one person with whom I communicate a lot and to whom I express my opinion. But he is just a captain. And gentlemen above the title does not seem interested in me. Oh yes, I am Untermensch.

    But from a purely professional point of view, I can not understand you. I know Stalin personally, I know his habits, I can predict his actions in certain situations. I also know all the top military leaders of the Soviet Union, I can say exactly what each of them is capable of. But you Germans seem to know everything much better. My opinion is not interesting to anyone. As a result, I sit in my house in Dalem, sunbathe in the garden and play cards, while there are battles on all fronts.

    From an interview Vlasov gave to an SS captain

    Regardless of why the war started, the German arrogance towards ethnic Slavs is one of the worst mistakes in history.

  50. Here’s another perspective for the gulls, dupes, and other forms of true believers… especially the fool who posted “Drang nach Osten” as if it validates the standard tripe.

    战争 宣传 has obscured the true facts of history, otherwise Americans might realize that the German record is no more aggressive, if as aggressive, as that of the French, British, and Dutch who conquered huge empires in Asia and Africa while the Germans stayed at home composing music, studying philosophy, and listening to their poets. Not so long ago the Germans were, in fact, among the most “peace-loving” peoples of the world and might become so again, given a world in which it is possible to live in peace.

    -- FREDA UTLEY, The High Cost of Vengeance. Chapter 5 • German Democracy between Scylla and Charybdis

    • 同意: Iris, Zumbuddi, apollonian
    • 回复: @Franklin Ryckaert
  51. @The scalpel

    The thesis is interesting, but not convincing.

    Just like your comment.

    There is a difference between planning and preparing, and acting.

    Duh. FYI, you may want to state that as a plural for the sake of improved accuracy.

    Responsible defense requires planning and preparing.

    Profound, yup.

    The moral response to a perceived threat is to ready one’s defenses.

    Especially when preparing defenses to Marxist “world revolution” agitation acting in concert with moneyed imperialists’ ambitions. Are you trying to virtue signal or is this just simple minded smugness, or what? Do you and the rest of the gulls have a clue about what had been taking place in the USSR under Lenin and Stalin?

    A competent defense makes the cost of attack impermissibly high.

    But this takes time and resources. I’d guess that it would be much more difficult with a Versailles-like rope around one’s neck.

    Next time you may want to consider honing yer scalpel, doc.

    • 回复: @The scalpel
  52. @Gustav

    由于采取了史无前例的防御措施,红军在初期的损失是巨大的。

    I think you meant to write,” The losses of the Red Army in the early days were enormous because of unprecedented 缺乏 defensive measures on Stalin’s part.

    • 回复: @Beefcake the Mighty
  53. I think someone previously noted this.

    Pre-emptive warfare is not new and rife with speculative reasons why someone is attacking someone else.

    Botton line Germany did not have much of a case for war. The Allied powers had largely given up their attempts to exact revenge on Germany as evidenced by their failure to respond to Germany’s violations.

    Chancellor Hitler’s gambit was neither justified nor well thought out.

  54. @refl

    …leaving communism and bankerism as the lords of what once was the European world.

    That should be crystal clear to anyone able to breathe on his own given what’s been going vis a vis US military gangsterism even to this day. They don’t even try to hide it any longer.

    Major General Butler and many others were correct.

    “……(在海军陆战队工作的33年中,我大部分时间都在为大型企业,华尔街和银行家担任高级肌肉先生。)

    In short, I was a racketeer, a gangster for [crony] capitalism*.”

    - 巴特勒少将美国海军陆战队,战争是一场球拍,1935

    * Marxism was a capitalist funded program from the start.

  55. Jake 说:

    “I did so with heavy heart, above all because when the German Reich gives a guarantee, that means it also abides by it. We are neither Englishmen nor Jews.”

    Anglo-Zionist Empire, baby! Not marked by truth telling but by perpetual dissembling and chicanery to be the One Ring That Rules Them All. WASPs and Jews both defined by lying, together, allied in their lying which serves the purpose of amassing ever more wealth and power at the expense of the vast majority of white Gentiles, especially those who are historic Christian.

    Like a stopped clock, even a Christ hating Nazi can be correct a couple of times per day.

    Which is how Stalin realized what a Satanically blood-lusting freak Trotsky was compared to even himself.

    WASP帝国是盎格鲁-犹太复国主义帝国。

  56. Moi 说:

    Could be, despite what we are told, Adolf was the least evil of the leaders of the time. I hear the crap that comes out of the mouths of our leaders–and Bibi–and I know lying is their default speech.

  57. Germanicus 说:
    @j2

    Annexing Austria, then Czechoslovakia, which was a part of Austria before the WWI. And then the war with Poland.

    So many lies and ridiculousness in just one sentence.

    Austria was not annexed, they rejoined the Reich after 98% referendum. Austrians are German people, for a very long time, the Reich had two capitals, Berlin and Vienna. What belongs together goes together, hence German troops paraded in Vienna, and Austrian mountain troopers paraded in Berlin.

    You refer to the Sudetenland? I would refer to the Munich agreement the signatory allies broke. Soviet forward airfields also played a role.

    德国,联合王国,法国和意大利考虑到该协定,原则上已就将苏德登德国领土割让给德国达成了协议,并就管辖该割让的以下条款和条件以及随后采取的措施达成了协议。并根据此协议,他们各自对确保其实现所必需的步骤负责:

    (1)疏散将从1月XNUMX日开始。

    (2)联合王国,法国和意大利同意,撤离领土应在10月XNUMX日之前完成,而没有任何现有设施被摧毁,并且捷克斯洛伐克政府将负责进行撤离而不会造成任何损害。所说的装置。

    (3)由德国,英国,法国,意大利和捷克斯洛伐克的代表组成的国际委员会将详细规定疏散条件。

    (4)1月XNUMX日开始分阶段占领德国军队占领的主要德国领土。 所附地图上标出的四个领土将按以下顺序被德军占领:

    该地区在1月2日和2日标记为第一。 3月3日至4日标记为第二号的领土; 5月6日,7日和10日标为III号的领土; 该地区在XNUMX月XNUMX日和XNUMX日标记为IV号。 其余具有德国特色的领土将由上述国际委员会立即确定,并于XNUMX月XNUMX日之前由德国军队占领。

    (5)第3款所指的国际委员会将确定举行全民投票的领土。 这些领土将由国际机构占领,直到全民投票结束为止。 该委员会将以举行萨尔公民投票的条件为基础,确定举行公民投票的条件。 该委员会还将确定不迟于XNUMX月底举行全民投票的日期。

    (6)边界的最终确定将由国际委员会进行。 在某些特殊情况下,该委员会还将有权向四个大国推荐德国,英国,法国和意大利,对在没有公民投票的情况下将要移交的区域进行严格的人种志确定方面应作一些细微的修改。

    (7)享有进出转让领土的选择权,该选择权自本协议签订之日起六个月内行使。 德国捷克斯洛伐克委员会应确定备选方案的细节,考虑便利人口转移的方式,并解决上述转移产生的原则性问题。

    (8)捷克斯洛伐克政府将在本协定签署之日起的四个星期内,从其军事和警察部队中释放任何可能希望被释放的Sudeten德国人,而捷克斯洛伐克政府将在同一时期内释放Sudeten德国囚犯。正在因政治犯罪被判入狱。

    http://avalon.law.yale.edu/imt/munich1.asp

    The Czechs have to this day the anti-German, kind of raycist Benes decrees in place, even the EUSSR complained.

    Massacres on German population, discrimination, prohibition of German language in stolen German territory after Versailles is nothing any German true chancellor can ignore due to his oath he swears to protect the German peoples.

    The situation is comparable with Ukraine, Donbass and Crimea. Yes, Putin studied closely these things, he speaks a good German, knows the truth, but keeps repeating the nonsensical Soviet narrative in public.

    You people are hopelessly trapped in your on web of lies, deceit, and you have no clue how to get out of it.

    • 同意: jacques sheete, Wally
    • 回复: @Pandos
  58. @jacques sheete

    “…the German record is no more aggressive, if as aggressive, as that of the French, British, and Dutch who conquered huge empires in Asia and Africa while the Germans stayed at home composing music, studying philosophy, and listening to their poets…”

    Admitted the Germans didn’t start to colonize as early as the French, the British and the Dutch. After all, they became a united nation only in 1871. But since 1884 they stopped “listening to their poets” and started to colonize : Togo, Cameroon, Kenya, South West Africa, Papua and Micronesia. And in spite of their previous “composing music, studying philosophy and listening to their poets”, they committed crimes to their colonial populations too. See : Wikipedia, German Colonial Empire, Rebellions and Genocide.

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
    , @Wally
  59. @jacques sheete

    Was Hitler’s 丹·纳赫·奥斯滕 really less bad than Stalin’s Drang nach Westen ?

  60. Wally 说:
    @j2

    说过:
    “As for Hitler’s general plans for gaining areas in the east, istn’t that in Mein Kampf explained well enough.=, and Germany did attack to Poland (regardless of what caused it.)”

    Your comments above debunk your own position that Hitler attacked to gain land in the east.
    All that you describe would have made such a plan next to impossible.

    Hitler simply HAD to attack the USSR when he did or else, it was a risk he had to take.
    Whereas any desire for land could easily have been put off until conditions were more favorable.

    Yes, Germany attacked Poland after much Polish aggression and land seizures. Poland was asking for and deserved it.

  61. Wally 说:
    @j2

    Yet you dodge my comment #29 & 31 while you just make up what serves your Zionist agenda.

    http://www.codoh.com

  62. Wally 说:
    @j2

    说”
    “But Mein Kampf mentions Jews on almost every page, so that was something essential to Hitler. ”

    不,不是。

    Yes he talks about Jews, like this site talks about the sleazy Usual Enemies of Free Speech as it should, but so what?
    And when was Mein Kampf even written? The conditions of 1939 were certainly different.

    USSR’s Kruschev said “We will bury you, Iran’s Ayatollah Khomeini called the US the “Great Satan”, so what? Neither attacked the US.

    Once again, you tellingly dodge the comments which refute your claims.

  63. anonymous[727]• 免责声明 说:

    1. The Red Army did not outnumber Germany and her allies in 1941.
    It was was close to even. The Russians did have an enormous RESERVE military of 10 to 15M. It is best to think of this as an express draft. This was a perfect organization for 防卫, not offensive operations. The Russians were able to call them up to create more defensive lines depriving Hitler of an early victory in 1941.

    2. Tanks.
    The Red Army did have a large number of tanks but 90% were the obsolete BT with thin armor and the undersized 45mm gun. The Russians were replacing that with the more modern T34 / KV85 but is this strictly an offensive weapon? No.

    Look at how the Germans used their tanks on the eastern front when they were on the retreat. They used them as fire fighting brigades to try to counter Red Army break throughs. The Russian landscape is vast. They just got experience fighting the Japanese in their vast eastern border. Why wouldn’t they plan on having mobile units to defend their territory. It is silly to say that tanks purely an offensive weapon. How would they fight defensively against an army that had tanks if didn’t have their own tank force.
    – Christian J. Chuba

    • 回复: @Sin City Milla
  64. Anonymous [AKA "Sergeant Glory"] 说:
    @Mulegino1

    “Soviet-Anglo-American invaders”? Hardy, har har… and sorry, pal — once USA entered the war, the Nazis were finished.

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
    , @Mike P
  65. Epigon 说:

    Quoting Soviet aircraft and tank inventory numbers immediately paints the author as an amateur.

    http://tankarchives.blogspot.com/2015/07/common-questions-red-army-afvs-in.html?_sm_au_=iVV2fMPRPRvTFknV

    Regarding aircraft inventory – Soviets were severely lacking in both modern monoplane fighters and pilots trained to fly them. The most numerous were I-153 biplane and I-16 monoplane of mid-1930s vintage. The organisation was flawed, VVS and PVO, aircraft regiments with a mix of fighters, CS and tactical bombers.

    Soviets caught up with German designs quality-wise only with the advent of Yak-3, Yak-9 and La-5/7 fighters (in different situations, vs. contemporary Bf-109 and FW-190 models).

    RKKA was in the middle of expansion and re-armament process. The famous T-34 was originally never planned to be full-scale production model – indeed, it was scheduled to be replaced by T-34M on production lines in July 1941, with complete replacement by November 1941, relegating it to training and second-line units; this tank design had a three-man turret, commander cupola, torsion bar suspension and was de facto a fusion of German delivered Panzer III and T-34, along with T-50, a similar scout/light tank that would have replaced the myriad of obsolete soviet light tanks of 1930s.

    • 回复: @Sin City Milla
  66. Wally 说:
    @Franklin Ryckaert

    You mean the Generalplan Ost which never existed

    Generalplan Ost is a laughable & fake Zionist creation. There was / is no such authentic Generalplan Ost German document. Simple as that. Show us if you can. You cannot.

    This supposed to be a believable title page? LOL

    Not a single signature anywhere on any page.
    Nothing to verify that it is authentic. Nothing whatsoever.
    Nothing whatsoever to show that the entire text is anything but manufactured text.

    Even the Zionist biased Wiki said about the bogus Generalplan Ost:”
    “Thus, no copies of the plan were found after the war among the documents in German archives. Apart from Ehlich’s testimony, there are several documents which refer to this plan or are supplements to it. Although no copies of the actual document have survived, most of the plan’s essential elements have been 重建 from related memos, abstracts and other ancillary documents.”

    http://www.codoh.com

    • 回复: @Mike P
  67. Wally 说:
    @j2

    I remind the readers here that this is the same j2 who claims that the Germans shot millions of Jews, for which the human remains cannot be shown even though Jews claim that those alleged immense remains actually exist in precisely know locations.

    See j2 attempt his dancing seal act in the comments here:

    美国真理报:大屠杀否认,由Ron Unz撰写: https://www.unz.com/runz/american-pravda-holocaust-denial/

    http://www.codoh.com

    • 回复: @j2
  68. @Anon

    It was Trotsky who wanted to wage a global revolution and his accolites today are The NeoCon scum that infest our government. Stalin was merely a thug, but he always sought compromise and accommodation with the west.

    True. But Stalin always sought to milk the West and did, spectacularly.

    Churchill played him for a fool.

    That’s backwards. Churchill hated Stalin and the Reds, but kissed the Red queen FDR’s arse as FDR was kissing Stalin’s. Maybe the old glamour queen sot was too drunk to notice, though.

    Read all about it here, ——托马斯·弗莱明, 新经销商战争:罗斯福和二战内的战争

    Note: A better title would have been The Raw Dealer’s and One Worlder’s War: The 20 the Century Wars for Domination of the World. FDR and Stalin were competing for Dictator of the World; Stalin won, along with his international banking buddies.

  69. “Po lil Germany dindu nuffin. ”

    • 回复: @Wally
    , @jacques sheete
  70. @obwandiyag

    This is disingenuous in the extreme. Of course the Russians were preparing like crazy for a German invasion. Look what happened. Sheesh.

    Your comment is superficial in the extreme. Pssst, look what happened to Germany, and why.

    Can you name the 4 largest empires of the time, and can you understand why Germany was motivated to avoid becoming 另一个 受害者 of their crimes and One World aspirations?

    • 回复: @EugeneGur
  71. Anon[424]• 免责声明 说:

    read the book :

    Soldaten , Protokolle von Kämpfen , Töten und Sterben

    Sönke Neitzel , Harald Weltzer

    S. Fischer Verlag GMBH , Franfurt am Main , 2011

  72. Pandos 说:
    @Hillbob

    jews got the knife before they gave the knife.

  73. Great article, genosse Goebbels himself would be proud.

  74. @Hippopotamusdrome

    Kieve and Minsk were bombed at dawn on 22 June. They had nothing to do with Poland.

    • 回复: @Anon
  75. RobinG 说:
    @Parfois1

    Are you new to the comments? The ranks of UR readers are laced with Nazi fan-boys…and girls, not to mention the regular dose of racist columnists and bloggers. They cheer each other on.

    • 回复: @Beefcake the Mighty
  76. @Wally

    Google “non-combatant soviet losses in WW2”

    • 回复: @Anon
  77. Epigon 说:

    Comments are pure gold.
    Attack on USSR was already agreed upon in 1940.
    Start date of May 15th was desired in Weissung 21, June 10th in Weissung 32 – due to late Spring rains making movement difficult and ponds and rivers difficult to cross.

    During Cold war, the myth of Operation Maritsa taking away German forces scheduled for Barbarossa appeared. Then it was fleshed out with nonsense on missing third Panzer group based in Romania, even though the double-envelopment from Iassi was discarded as impossible to pull off due to Dniester during that time of the year.

    Soviet Union was definitely not planning a war in 1941 – in fact – artillery, tank, aviation all had their modernization and re-equipment scheduled to end by Spring/Summer of 1942.

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  78. AnonFromTN 说:

    When political declarations are cited as proof, this tells us all we need to know about the author. Case closed.

  79. RobinG 说:
    @jacques sheete

    Oooh, we’re so scared! Everybody hide, incoming ad hominem!

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
    , @Anon
  80. Epigon 说:
    @jacques sheete

    Yes, it is a big deal.

    Not to you, but to those who don’t want to share the fate of Wends, Serby, Carinthians, Prussians, Rusyns, Serbs.

    Or see a repetition of 4th Crusade.

  81. Anon[424]• 免责声明 说:
    @Wally

    Good points , so nearly all europeans were a bunch of warmongering blood thirsty degenerates , they wanted a war , they got a war , 50 million dead , plus 25 million in the great war ,

    • 回复: @Hillbob
  82. @Franklin Ryckaert

    See : Wikipedia, German Colonial Empire, Rebellions and Genocide.

    I won’t bother; Wikipedia is 不能 a creditable source on the topic at hand. No serious historian, amateur or professional would offer that as a source.

  83. @jacques sheete

    Definitely not virtue signaling. I don’t have any virtues! You can check my references on that. Whatever the perceived costs and inadequacies of defense, the costs and inadequacies of attacking the same enemy are higher, all else equal. Military science 101. Proof: How did things work out with that operation Barbarrosa any way?

    My point was simply to say that peace is preferable to war. I base this on the assumptions that human life has value and that the troops doing the dying on each side have more in common than the politicians they foolishly fight for. I doubt the common man on either side cares much about, or even understands the political philosophy of their so-called leaders. I see all politicians in general as corrupt and amoral no matter what flag they wave.

    My advice is to learn a valuable skill, live a peaceful life, let other fools go off to war. Change or ignore what one can in terms of oppression to whatever extent one is fulfilled by doing so. Accept the rest, relying on one’s value to other human beings and one’s wits to survive. It is best to have a good amount of both. Humans being what they are, there is bound to be oppression of one political stripe or another. Recognize it like a grizzly bear in the woods, and learn to survive with it there.

    Feel free to correct any grammatical mistakes in the above reply 😉

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  84. CK 说:
    @Parfois1

    都。
    And a complete inability to remember any Russian history.
    The thesis relies on the imaginings of a man who tries to steal the name
    of the most successful general in western history.
    The last of the invaders of Russia following the Revolution and the Allied Invasions at Archangel and Vladivostok departed Siberia in 1925, and these same invaders were back and attacking Russian territory in 1939. At the battle of Khalkhin Gol then Col. Zhukov handed the Japanese such a defeat as to cause that nation to enter into a mutual non-aggression pact with the USSR.
    That Stalin did not trust the assertions of the USA and the UK is not surprising given how they had arrogated to themselves the right to reverse the outcome of the Russian revolution.
    Churchill hated Russia and disliked Hitler, it was his “brilliant” idea that the two of them should bleed themselves to death on the steppes of Russia. Unfortunately for Churchill, the Germans did all the bleeding after 1942. By the beginning of 1944 it was evident that Russia did not need the help of the USA and the UK to defeat the remains of the German military and that there was nothing between the Russian Armies and the English Channel and the Pyrenees mountains.
    So, suddenly, after 5 years of inability and unwillingness, D-Day is arranged. Without D-day, Paris would have been liberated by Russian troops. Maybe they would have remembered the treatment afforded Moscow when Napoleon “liberated”?

    • 回复: @Curmudgeon
  85. @Franklin Ryckaert

    Was Hitler’s Drang nach Osten really less bad than Stalin’s Drang nach Westen ?

    Why even ask such a question? Stalin’s and the bankster and other millionaire Reds’ Drang nach die ganze Welt was unquestionably worse.

    Pleas don’t tell me that you’e still advocating the policies of the Neo Crazies’ One World goals!

    • 回复: @Epigon
  86. Agent76 说:

    It Happened In Paris: WWII Nazi Occupation (1942 & 1944)

    Watch this stunning footage of Nazi occupied France captured surreptitiously by a brave Pathé cameraman, Gaston Madru, from 1942 to 1944. It gives a snapshot of everything from swastikas flying from French buildings to the German retreat from France in 1944.

  87. @Epigon

    Attack on USSR was already agreed upon in 1940.

    …in August 1939…the Soviets signed the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact with Nazi Germany after the British and French rejected Soviet offers to establish a military alliance 德国。

    https://history.state.gov/milestones/1921-1936/ussr

  88. @RobinG

    Everybody hide, incoming ad hominem!

    Too late…they were launched a few comments back.

    #78 RobinG says:Next New Comment
    21年2019月2日,格林尼治标准时间下午13:XNUMX
    @ Parfois1
    Are you new to the comments? The ranks of UR readers are laced with Nazi fan-boys…and girls, not to mention the regular dose of racist columnists and bloggers. They cheer each other on.

    • 回复: @RobinG
  89. Epigon 说:
    @jacques sheete

    You do realise Stalin abandoned Leninist and Trotskyst “permanent revolution” and “world revolution”, in favour of a centralised, “socialism-in-a-single-state” model?

  90. Agent76 说:

    German Invasion Of Russia – June 1941 (1941)

    Panning shot along road of advancing German troops passing retreating Russian prisoners. Various shots of German infantry advancing through smoke and rubble strewn town.

  91. @The scalpel

    Hey scalpel, your last comment was much better than your first one, and I, a fellow virtue free opinionator, agree with all except this which 恶魔strates a severe lack of context appreciation.:

    Whatever the perceived costs and inadequacies of defense, the costs and inadequacies of attacking the same enemy are higher, all else equal. Military science 101.

    I know nothing of military science, but I can imagine what it would be like to be faced with brutal imperialist and One World enemies on all sides.

    Proof: How did things work out with that operation Barbarrosa any way?

    How would they have likely worked out 经过反复的改良试验, Barbarossa? What would you have done? Please don’t tell me you’d do an FDR or a tRump and bend over.

    • 回复: @The scalpel
  92. @Anonymous

    “Soviet-Anglo-American invaders”? Hardy, har har… and sorry, pal — once USA entered the war, the Nazis were finished.

    Ever ask yourself why some New York Jews declared 另一个 war on Germany in 1933? Now, tell us when the USA entered the war.

    • 回复: @Wally
  93. Mulegino1 说:

    The deployment of the Soviet forces on June 21, 1941 is sufficient evidence that Operation Barbarossa was a preventative/preemptive attack.

    They were deployed in offensive positions along an east/west axis, in vulnerable salients.

    Why was the 9th Rifle Army on the Romanian border- within easy striking distance of the oil fields- if the Soviets were in defensive mode?

    Why was light infantry deployed in the Carpathians, when heavy infantry would have been more effective for defensive purposes?

    What- other than aggressive intent explains the forward Soviet air forces lying on their tarmacs in close proximity to the front lines? Virtually their entire front line air force was destroyed on the first day of Barbarossa.

    The idea that the Soviet forces were an incompetent, “staggering Colossus” is false. The Soviet forces under Zhukov had crushed the Japanese at the Battle of Khalkin Gol, and gave such an admirable account of themselves at the defense of Brest that Hitler himself ordered that the defenders be given full prisoner of war status-even though the Soviets were not signatories to the Geneva Convention and refused prisoner of war protections to Axis prisoners.

    Germany was clearly not ready for a long term war against the USSR- most of its artillery was still horse drawn, its tanks were inferior to their Soviet counterparts. It is clear that Hitler knew that Barbarossa was a desperate gamble, yet struck anyway because he knew that any hesitation in doing so would have resulted in an aggressive and overwhelming Soviet avalanche against Europe, silly stories about “lebensraum” and Slavophobia notwithstanding.

    • 同意: Mike P
  94. Mefobills 说:
    @anon

    Nazis did not aim for any security reasons, no matter what they said. Its objectives were to annex lands, to exploit natural resources and to enslave and annihilate the inhabitants of the Soviet Union

    All of history can be reduced to creditor vs debtor. The creditor class becomes a plutocracy, then it controls the polity, then it makes sure debtors remain indebted, to continue the plutocracy.

    To paraphrase Ezra Pound, democracy is just a code word for Jewish run society. This means that money controls the polity.

    The money power, really international banking credit, took root in England in 1694, and then proceeded to radiate outward from London.

    This money power to used to create a one world government, using one world money, with a corresponding animating religious ideology of Tikkun (repairing the world) for the special people to own/run said world.

    This theme cannot be overlooked, especially in the context of National Socialism. NS was a serious attempt to break down class lines, and have one volk all rowing in unison. This provided a flank that Jewish power could not easily penetrate.

    NS also did a pretty good job of eliminating Jewish plutocrats grip on money power within Germany, which is why they were so effective at countering the Jewish usury method.

    Bolshevism WAS funded into existence by Wall Street interests (Jewish), so Communism cannot be divorced from Jewish finance capitalism.. They are flip sides of the same thing, both of which are pyramid control mechanisms… to control sheeple goyim by extracting their wealth in various forms, most especially to extract through debt enslavement.

    To repeat: finance capitalist west and communist Russia were flip sides of the same coin. Both were being “string pulled” by Jewish plutocracy intent on becoming its own messiah, and murdering anybody who gets in their way of global domination.

    Stalin didn’t become a National Communist until later. Around time of operation Barbarossa
    it wasn’t clear if Stalin was an International Communist doing bidding of International Jews, or if he was a National Communist doing bidding of Slavs.

    By 1946 it was clear that Stalin had pivoted away from the international.

    This third way of National Socialism (and Italian Fascism) was a threat to the Jewish world order of international credit and no national borders (with Jews being in charge by pulling strings).

    • 回复: @Sin City Milla
  95. anonomy 说:
    @Hillbob

    So if Hitler was planning war against the Jewish Soviets, why wouldn’t he put the Jewish people in camps or ask them to leave? Is that any different than the US putting Japanese and Germans in camps? Were the communists antagonizing in other countries such as Germany? Now over to the Soviet Gulag, was that because of war plans?

    • 回复: @Mefobills
  96. @Epigon

    You do realise Stalin abandoned Leninist and Trotskyst “permanent revolution” and “world revolution”, in favour of a centralised, “socialism-in-a-single-state” model?

    Do you realize that if I were to take him at face value on that topic, that I would also realize that it was no doubt a 临时 expedient?

    You do realize that there are things politicians say that are for public consumption and things they say behind closed doors? Do you realize that sometimes their actions are not consistent with their claims and that all of the above can change in a flash, then back again, in a heartbeat?

  97. @Epigon

    还有一件事……

    You do realise Stalin abandoned Leninist and Trotskyst “permanent revolution” and “world revolution”, in favour of a centralised, “socialism-in-a-single-state” model?

    You do realize that was essentially what Hitler was aiming for, don’t you? Why was only one damned for it? Whose model was less brutal?

    • 回复: @RI
  98. Wally 说:
    @Franklin Ryckaert

    Yep, a Zionist citing Zionist controlled Wikipedia which guarantees that anything of interest to Jews is so manipulated.

    And that’s the best that Franklin, fake Generalplan Ost, Ryckaert con conjure.

    • 回复: @Franklin Ryckaert
  99. RH 说:

    This article is a complete waste of time, although it does have novelty value. I have never seen, or thought I would see, Ribbentrop quoted at face value. The author thinks either that his readers are credulous idiots, or is one himself. Does he actually think that his description of Soviet military capability reflects reality?

    • 回复: @David In TN
  100. Wally 说:
    @jacques sheete

    “Ever ask yourself why some New York Jews declared another war on Germany in 1933? Now, tell us when the USA entered the war.”

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  101. Mefobills 说:
    @Epigon

    You do realize that you cannot attach a specific date as to when Stalin rejected Trotsky International Jew method.

    The Jews in Russia had not been marginalized by time of Operation Barbarossa. They were slowly being tricked by Stalin, or Stalin hadn’t pivoted yet – nobody can tell.

    So, now we all have to believe that Hitler was Omniscient and had perfect 20/20 forward vision, when we cannot even agree in hindsight?

    Much of Russian military was offensive in nature – that is clear, and it was pointed at Germany, and indeed the West had maneuvered to be buddies with “Uncle Joe.”

    AND… most especially, the German economic model, the model for governing German state, was antithetical to Jewish International Plutocracy.

    • 同意: jacques sheete
    • 回复: @NoseytheDuke
  102. Wally 说:
    @Chris Mallory

    Well, Germany did fight back.

    这是你能做的最好的吗?

  103. Sean 说:

    WW2 was a continuation of WW1. And long before, Fredrick the Great (Hitler’s personal hero) had been attacked by a Russian led alliance. The German nation united was just too strong, and so as it progressively grew it had natural enemies of great size. Did Russia attack Prussia because Fredrick had said the Tsarina was into horses? Partly I suppose yes, but those two powers were never going to be friends for ever

  104. All of history can be reduced to creditor vs debtor.

    And if not all, then certainly a good portion of it can be.

    One of my favorite quotes.:

    甚至Aristophanes都知道分数。 从他对由妇女管理的共产主义政府的讽刺中:

    普拉萨戈拉(Praxagora):
    Where did the lender get the money from in the first place, if all the money belongs to everyone? Obviously, he’s a thief!

    Aristophanes, “Women in Parliament”(also known as “The Assembly Women” or “Women in Power”) κκλησιάζουσαι

    书面 390 BCE, Translated by G. THEODORIDIS

  105. Wally 说:
    @Hillbob

    You mean the “murderous Nazis” who gave Auschwitz inmates the choice to stay or leave with them when they pulled out.

    Most left with the “murderous Nazis” while thousands of others were allowed to stay just so thy could tell the world about the extermination of Jews that supposedly occurred there.

    Please give us proof that the ‘Nazis’ were particularly “murderous”.

    It’s a simple, reasonable request.

    http://www.codoh.com

    • 回复: @Hillbob
    , @Hillbob
  106. EugeneGur 说:
    @Anonymous

    Maybe we should outlaw questioning the motives and actions of the “vile war of aggression on the innocent Soviet Union”, too.

    Question by all means, just don’t lie and distort the facts. Psychologically, I understand the desire of the Germans to “question” the facts. However, it’s a dangerous path to take, and it’s already led Germany to support the Ukrainian Nazis, the same exact people the Nazi Germany supported and used 75 years ago. It seems to me like Germany never learns.

    The fact remains that it wasn’t the Soviet Union, with all its might, that initiated the attack, but Germany. And the behavior of the Germans – and not just the Germans, mind you, for almost the entire Europe joined in the fun – completely negates even the most remote claim that they were “defending” themselves.

    “Innocent” – I don’t know what that means, but a war of aggression it undoubtedly was, no matter how you try to spin it. You know, even when you attack a country you intensely dislike, it’s still a war of aggression.

    • 回复: @Anon
    , @Wally
    , @Sin City Milla
  107. Mefobills 说:

    Operation Barbarossa is number 6.

    https://archive.org/details/EUROPATheLastBattlePart6#

    Change url ending letters to Part1#, Part2#, Part3#….Part10# if you want to watch the series.

  108. AWM 说:

    Clearly both sides were preparing for offensive actions. It is inconceivable that the coming conflict was not apparent to all after Germany scuttled the invasion of Britain. This must have been a great concern to Stalin. When the great mass of Soviet war material was discovered in the weeks in June/July following the invasion, German generals must have realized that they had no better than one chance in three at absolute best of emerging victorious as scheduled if allowed full authority to prosecute the war without interference.

    While it is easy to claim delays hurt the Germans, and they certainly did, the fall of Moscow would not have ended the war, a much more potentially successful campaign after the initial attack would have been to wheel south toward the Baku oil fields. While there is almost no possibility seizure could be accomplished it might have been a big enough threat to get a negotiated settlement while maintaining the bulk of German forces with only minor damage.

    Why didn’t Stalin send strong forces toward Ploiesti when Hitler was occupied in Western Europe is the question I have always wondered. This would have left him in a position of strength that would have even allowed him to absorb all of Europe through political as well as military solutions.

    • 回复: @Sin City Milla
  109. EugeneGur 说:
    @jacques sheete

    Can you name the 4 largest empires of the time, and can you understand why Germany was motivated to avoid becoming another victim of their crimes

    If Germany was anyone’s victim, it was of its own stupidity and arrogance. Germany was crushed because it lost WWI it had a hand in initiating. It was crushed again in 1945, because it lost yet another war it started.

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
    , @Anon
  110. @Mikel

    The Winter War has been seriously misunderstood. The Finns were the second best soldiers of the war, defending their homes and fighting in a brutal environment that favored the defense. After initial missteps (and of course in typical Soviet manner they thoughtlessly fed men to the meat grinder), the Soviets recovered and imposed harsh terms on the Finns. (They acquired about 10% of Finnish economic output.). They were plainly unsphased by their experience, as they reimposed demands on the Finns later in 1940. The Winter War says absolutely nothing about Soviet preparedness and intents in the summer of 1941.

  111. Johann 说:
    @j2

    Read Peter Hitches ew book called The Phony Victory. He does a very good job of explaining how much we were taught about the beginning of WWII is so much bs. Apparently a big pusher of the war was Winston Churchill whose number one concern was maintaining the British Empire. Much of the myth of Chamberlain at Munich being a traitor and the Polish Question was stirred up by unresolved issue from the corrupt Treaty on Versailles which was cobbled together by Wilson and his cohorts in the One World Government movement. Apparently FDR had a lot of contact with Stalin and FDR’s wife was an operative for the American Communist Party. So many of our history books were concocted by the Anglo American Bolshevik empire and still is today.

  112. Germanicus 说:
    @Wally

    Well, Germany did fight back.

    It is really astonishing, how everything is spun and turned upside down.

    The corporate Weimar regime, the democratic tyranny and masonic incompetence installed in 1919, did not make any concessions in regard to the Westprussia, the Danzig issue.
    They did not concede even an inch of Westprussia. It was the NS government that made compromises, offered the corridor, joint run infrastructure such as railway and highway.

    It is for no country a viable option to have one part cut off from the rest by a hostile force. Alaska would be an issue, if Canada was hostile to the US.

    The puppet Poles rejected any solution and their radio aired crazy speeches by polish generals proclaiming the intention to take Berlin due to british and french support promises. That went well for the Poles, and they don’t learn, the US do the same with them in relation to Russia as the Brits and French did in relation to Germany.

    • 回复: @Iris
  113. @Wally

    Here is a comment on this subject that I made at Lasha Darkmoon’s website referring to her article “In Stalin’s Gulags”, March 6, 2019 :

    [更多]

    富兰克林·雷卡特(Franklin Ryckaert)
    九月13,2015 7时:下午42

    @ LUCA K

    Here is an example of one of my “projections” out of sheer ignorance of course :

    “The foundation of St. Petersburg by Peter the Great was a
    fatal event in the history of Europe; and St. Petersburg must therefore disappear utterly from the earth’s surface. Moscow, too. Then the Russians will retire into Siberia.
    It is not by taking over the miserable Russian hovels that we shall establish ourselves as masters in the East. The German colonies must be organised on an altogether higher plane.
    We have never before driven forward into empty spaces. The German people have absorbed both northern and southern Austria, and the original inhabitants are still there; but they were Sorb-Wends, members of basic European stock, with othing in common with the Slavs.
    As for the ridiculous hundred million Slavs, we will mould the best of them to the shape that suits us, and we will isolate the rest of them in their own pig-styes; and anyone who talks about cherishing the local inhabitant and civilising him, goes straight off into a concentration camp !”

    Source : Hitler’s Table Talk [PDF], p.617 (google that).

    So your “innocent” Hitler who “only wanted to defend Germany” clearly talks about :

    1) Destroying St. Petersburg and Moscow.
    2) Establishing the Germans as “masters” in the East.
    3) Organizing German colonies.
    4) The fact that Germans expanded in the past, but did not mix with Slavs, implying that they are “racially inferior” to them.
    5) He calls the hundred million Slavs in the East “ridiculous” and promises to mold the best of them to the shape that suits the Germans, and to isolate the rest in their pig-styes.
    6) He says : “Anyone who talks about cherishing the local inhabitant and civilise him, goes straight off into a concentration camp.”

    The only way you can wriggle out of that is by saying that Hitler’s Table Talk was “written by the Jews”.
    祝你好运!

    • 回复: @Wally
    , @Anon
  114. @european born

    Next Mr Weber will claim that Germany invaded Norway because Germany feared being invaded by the fearsome Vikings.

    • 回复: @Wally
  115. Hitler might have won, had he not been forced to delay the invasion of the USSR until June. The delay was caused by him having to bail out Mussolini in Greece. So Mussolini’s foolishness in invading Greece may have cost the Axis powers the war.

    • 回复: @Sean
  116. @jacques sheete

    First off, a good defense would deter an attack by making the costs impermissiby high. If the attackers are too ignorant to see this, then a vigorous defense will irreparably weaken the attacker and make them susceptible to a devestating counter attack.

    So far, so good. In the event that the defenses are severely overmatched such as the scenario you describe, attacking by such an overmatched force would be suicide. In that case, the best bet is to disband and deprive the attacker of targets, then reform in small groups to engage in irregular warfare. See Iraq, Afghanistan, etc.

    Regarding Barbarrosa, I think the Soviets would have been deterred by German defenses until such time that the Allies had fatally weakened Germany. That scenario would only have been possible because Germany ATTACKED first. Until then, the Allies were deterred by German defenses (peace in our time and all that)

    Finally, somewhat ironically, for now I am in favor of the proliferation of WMD’s and the means to deliver them anywhere. As is, non-nuclear countries are faced with irregular warfare as their only defense against superpowers. The ability to deliver a WMD is an adequate deterrent – see North Korea.

    Ideally, I would like to see the proliferation of effective defensive missiles. Any country with enough of those could deter an attack with a credible threat to wipe out all the attackers aircraft, ships, and armor, thus avoiding the need for WMD’s as a deterrent. I hope this day is not too far off.

    Again, in the big picture, I emphasize the individuals responsibility to choose peace as I described above. That course is the most moral and most logical for individuals with the intelligence and ability to do it. If practiced on a wide scale, it could hinder nation’s abilities to engage in aggressive war, especially in the age of WMD’s. You can get anything you want at Alice’s Restaurant….

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  117. @Wally

    When the last German dies of a heart attack after strangling the last Jew the world will be a better place.

    You German apologists are not any different than the Holohoax whiners.

    • 哈哈: Commentator Mike
    • 回复: @Wally
    , @Anon
  118. @anon

    Apparently you have delved more deeply into hysteria and the hysterical and done even less than minimally serious reading of the authentically documented history of the Third Reich and more importantly even less into the machinations of Britain’s Secret Society and FDR whose mendacity, hypocrisy, treachery and treason exceeds that of the sociopathic if not psychopathic Churchill as instigators of WW II!

  119. Sean 说:
    @Hapalong Cassidy

    https://ssi.armywarcollege.edu/pubs/parameters/articles/99spring/hooker.htm

    That is not what RD Hooker or RHS Stolfi said. According to Stolfi stopping in front of Smolensk for well over a month was a fatal error.

  120. That’s all we need, more wars in Europe ( in this case reasons why war was necessary ) so that more White people are killed. Itz not enough that about 37 million White people died in World War one and about 60 million died in World War two.

    At this rate there won’t be too many White people left in Europe. Add to this that White people no longer want to have babies and soon Europe will become de-populated. So send in the Africans and Asians who sure like to screw and have very few serious industrial scale wars.

    So many White people I know who have zero or only one child. There’s something wrong!

    Meanwhile the Africans didn’t get the memo about world overpopulation or don’t know how to read and the African and Asians populations are surging. African population expected to top two billion by 2050. India alone will have 1.6 billion. These numbers will swamp Europe, USA, Australia. It dosen’t look good for White people.

    And then we have this author giving us his reasons why Germany had to attack Russia. The author should really write an essay encouraging White people to have more babies.

  121. Wally 说:
    @Chris Mallory

    You just admitted again that you cannot back up anything you say.

    This is just too easy.

  122. Wally 说:
    @Franklin Ryckaert

    LOL, That’s your best shot? You are simply irrational.

    It’s noted that you dodged my information that savages your fake ‘Generalplan Ost’.
    And you cannot show the millions of human remains that are claimed to be in known locations.
    Then you blunder on and quote the known fraud of “Table Talk”. LOL

    Genoud、Heim 和 Picker 的希特勒的“餐桌谈话”:学术欺诈和丑闻研究:
    https://www.inconvenienthistory.com/9/3/4880
    和:
    http://carolynyeager.net/our-hitlers-table-talk-series-now-available-cds
    Our “Hitler’s Table Talk” series now available on CD’s
    A two-disc CD set containing all 56 of the newly-edited, discussing Hitler’s Table Talk, spanning 1941 to 1944.
    推荐的:
    https://carolynyeager.net/

    劳施宁揭穿:
    https://codoh.com/search/?sorting=relevance&q=Rauschning

    http://www.codoh.com

    • 回复: @Franklin Ryckaert
  123. Anonymous [AKA "justread"] 说:

    “Historical” documents?

    Maybe one from December 18th 1940 – would that be acceptable – even it was not written by Goebbels or von Ribbentrop, but bears the signature of Hitler himself?

    It’s called Fuhrer Directive #21 and orders preparation for the invasion of Russia. It even names the offensive – “Barbarossa”.

    It demanded that preparations be in place/guns ready to go off by mid-May of 1941, i.e. the following year.

    Unfortunately, that deadline appeared to suffer from Hitler’s military operations to secure the Balkans – especially Greece and Yugo.

    Debate rages as to whether this was necessary, but the simple fact is that Hitler’s offensive kicked off in late June (the 22nd) as opposed to Mid-May as originally conceived.

    p.s. How on earth could Hitler have moved up 3 mm men and their tanks and artillery without intending to invade Russia?

    • 回复: @Sin City Milla
  124. Beckow 说:
    @Hippopotamusdrome

    Bitter, very bitter losers. Next you will tell us that Mein Kampf was a fiction book and not a political program.

    A hint about how it works: you can’t go back and re-fight WWII. It is done, you lost.

    • 回复: @Cortes
    , @jacques sheete
  125. Wally 说:
    @europeasant

    Actually the British invaded Norway and were there when the Germans arrived.
    请注意。

  126. New Dealer 说:

    乌兹网! Proudly transitioning from neo-Nazi to Nazi.

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
    , @Anon
  127. Hillbob 说:
    @Wally

    Like taking blood from toddlers(for German officers) and discarding these babies to a slow and agonizing death(if not already dead) in the Ukraine. Watching the little things squirming in death agony, the eyes beseeching …..ah those brave peaceful Nazis. Oh by the way what were the plans for Moscow again after it was taken for the fuhrer? Just the small matter of razing it and putting a man made(or beast made) lake in place

  128. ariadna 说:
    @Anon

    Talking through your hat (whatever ethnic kind you sport). Not one of those countries wanted any “bones” from Germany, nor did they want to “exterminate Russians.” They wanted help in defending themselves from the imminent Bolshevik threat while internally they were also struggling to redress the judaic weimarization of their economies and culture. Oy, miserable Goyim, eh?

    • 回复: @Anon
  129. Anon[424]• 免责声明 说:

    In the I & II world wars , most of the european nations participated and many of them cheerfully .

    Most of the Governemts showed a very high degree of criminality sending waves of millions and millions of men to kill and to be killed , not caring for civilians

    And the people , the common people also showed a very high degree of criminality , they were full o hate towards their neighbours , fought against them , killed them in the name of a pathological nationalism , killing to the last day of war ( it is amazing why the german & allies did not surrender or made a truce after Moscow and Stalingrad )

    There will be a III , and last , atomic World War ??

    Satanic times

  130. Anonymous [AKA "archives"] 说:

    Now, consider this: If the Soviets had been sufficiently prepared/about to invade Germany back in 1941 when Hitler invaded, why were they routed in such spectacular fashion early on? A Great many of Stalin’s resources were still mid-country to the East. After the German invasion kicked off, these had to be moved West pronto.

    Compare and contrast this to the 1943 series of engagements that would become known as “The Battle of Kursk” (salient?). Then, sides were preparing for what was to be Hitler’s last major offensive on the Eastern front. It was a very different story in terms of progress/ground gained.

    Stalin’s intelligence was sufficiently effective that he actually shelled the Germans just before their 1943 offensive commenced – with the result that their campaign was really very heavy going for the Germans all the way.

    This was quite unlike late June of 1941 where 3 German army groups stretching from the Baltic all the way down to the South struck altogether and really had the Soviets on the run for some time. They came quite close to capturing Moscow (again there is considerable debate over whether capturing that objective would been the end of the story, but it would not have a been a positive for Stalin.)

  131. Hillbob 说:
    @Anon

    Ha Ha. So true. Unimaginable destruction in Europe. Thank god for the EUropeans who settled on other far-away peoples lands and brought such overwhelming virtue and Christianity to them. Nothing left to chance. Virtuous gems such as ‘slaves obey your masters’ and christian guarantees for a great after life (after) the body was ravaged….

  132. @jacques sheete

    Yes, has to be a typo, it was precisely the fact that Soviet forces were aligned in vulnerable offensive salients that they suffered such catastrophic losses in the initial stages when the Germans broke through.

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  133. Pandos 说:
    @Germanicus

    Benes was a soviet spy. His niece married Zbigniew Kazimierz Brzezinski.

  134. @Wally

    Looks like London Jews declared war on Germany in 1933 as well. 😉

    Bbbbbut dem Nazis!

    • 回复: @Thorfinnsson
  135. RobinG 说:
    @jacques sheete

    Bears repeating –

    The ranks of UR readers are laced with Nazi fan-boys…and girls, not to mention the regular dose of racist columnists and bloggers. They cheer each other on.

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  136. @EugeneGur

    It was crushed again in 1945, because it lost yet another war it started.

    既然你这么说,那好吧。

    打哈欠。

    PS: So what can you say about dem holocaust viktums? Some Jews openly declared war on Germany in 1933 (see above) if not sooner, so I guess they haven’t a leg to whine on regarding “de holocaust,” eh? You know, I’ve been told that “stuff happens” in war.

    I guess some people never learn.

    • 回复: @EugeneGur
  137. Anonymous [AKA "nobunkhere"] 说:

    No way the Soviets were in a position to go on the offensive against Germany in mid-1941 – total nonsense.

    All you have to do is to consult what the Soviets themselves said and did. They were playing for time, at least another year by their own reckoning, before they felt that they would be in a position to take on Germany. Yup, they had the greatest manpower and resources on paper, but they themselves didn’t feel that they were in a position to go to war with Germany. They were also still looking East towards Japan at the time.

    Stalin was at pains to be seen to yielding to the Germans, even continuing to demand that his forces cause no “provocations” against the Germans for hours after Barbarossa had begun.

  138. @Chris Mallory

    “Po lil “Chosen Ones” dindu nuffin. “

    So let’s build another holocaust memorial and by the way, where’s my “reparations?”

  139. @The scalpel

    First off, a good defense would deter an attack by making the costs impermissiby high. If the attackers are too ignorant to see this, then a vigorous defense will irreparably weaken the attacker and make them susceptible to a devestating counter attack.

    Etc., etc., etc. Thanks, general!

    PS: This stuff is fun, but I have a lot to do, and I’m not buying your theories.

    • 回复: @The Scalpel
  140. @europeasant

    The author should really write an essay encouraging White people to have more babies.

    Not needed. You just did.

    • 回复: @europeasant
  141. @Beckow

    A hint about how it works: you can’t go back and re-fight WWII. It is done, you lost.

    I hope you tell that to the “holocaust survivors.” Oh, wait, they won, and they still are. Well then, please tell ’em to quit whining about the one that didn’t survive.

    谢谢。

  142. @New Dealer

    New Dealer? Really?

    Even FDR gave up on that silliness after endless variations. For many people it was and still is, a Raw Deal. I have tons of evidence.

  143. @RobinG

    Bears repeating –

    OK, but please bare anything else. Deal?

    Now be nice and quit trolling, Dearie!

  144. j2 说:
    @Wally

    “I remind the readers here that this is the same j2 who claims that the Germans shot millions of Jews, for which the human remains cannot be shown even though Jews claim that those alleged immense remains actually exist in precisely know locations.”

    I am sure I do not need to remind any readers of this forum that this is the same Wally that we all know. My final calculation is in the link, it does not have Germans shooting millions of Jews, Wally made that up all by himself
    http://www.pienisalaliittotutkimus.com/2018/09/24/my-final-solution-of-the-final-solution/

    • 回复: @Wally
  145. Sparkon 说:
    @Grahamsno(G64)

    By some accounts, Stalin received no less than 87 separate messages, warnings, reports, dispatches from a variety of sources advising him of the impending German attack.

    Gorodetsky’s argument dovetails nicely with the story told by David Murphy. Murphy massively documents the in-pouring of intelligence from all over Europe and even Japan, warning of the German military buildup for invasion. Insofar as this intelligence was used at all, it was to avoid any action that might be seen as a provocation. German aircraft were allowed to fly reconnaissance missions deep into Soviet territory; German troops were allowed to violate Soviet borders in search of intelligence. All this was intended to remind the Germans of the depth of Soviet resolve, while demonstrating that the Soviet Union was not about to attack.

    https://www.cia.gov/library/center-for-the-study-of-intelligence/csi-publications/csi-studies/studies/vol50no1/9_BK_What_Stalin_Knew.htm

    All of it supports my argument that Stalin and Roosevelt shared the same strategy, which was to provoke the enemy, but let him strike the first blow.

    Nothing rallies patriotism like blood spilled by the enemy in a surprise or sneak attack, and no other action could have united the various Soviet nationalities like the German invasion did within the Soviet Union. In like fashion, all isolationist opposition to American involvement in WWII pretty much faded away after the “surprise” Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor.

    Anastas Mikoyan, the ever-surviving Politburo member (1922-66), one of few of Stalin’s close milieu, recalls a unique case dating back to May 1941, when the German Ambassador, Friedrich-Werner Graf von der Schulenburg, shared lunch with Stalin and made it clear to him, with the interpreter present, that Germany was planning to invade the Soviet Union. A unique situation, indeed, considering that the German embassy’s counselor Gustav Hilger was also present.

    [...]

    And then it became clear that all those intrepid intelligence sources had been right and only one man was wrong. What happened next? Nothing. Back in the 19th century a political leader proven wrong on such a dramatically large scope would shoot himself, out of shame. Stalin never did, for he had been raised in a different manner. He simply told himself: shove it.

    https://day.kyiv.ua/en/article/history-and-i/stalin-vs-stirlitz

    After he recovered from his nervous breakdown, that is.

  146. @j2

    I have read parts of Mein Kampf over the years and I found very little said about the Jews except in the chapters devoted to that concern. And even there, Adolph Hitler’s supposed rabid antisemitism was fairly tame in my view. In fact, he was speaking more as a political scientist would instead of an ideologue…

    • 回复: @j2
  147. The hidden agenda of WWII was to make the world safe for socialism.

    • 回复: @Anon
  148. @Wally

    For your information, Hitler-admirer Carolyn Yeager does not (repeat : does NOT) deny the authenticity of Hitler’s TableTalk, neither does David Irving. Here is what David Irving says about Hitler’s Table Talk :

    “Hitler’s Table Talk is the product of his lunch- and supper-time conversations in his private circle from 1941 to 1944. The transcripts are genuine. (Ignore the 1945 “transcripts” published by Trevor-Roper in the 1950s as Hitler’s Last Testament — they are fake).

    The table talk notes were originally taken by Heinrich Heim, the adjutant of Martin Bormann, who attended these meals at an adjacent table and took notes. (Later Henry Picker took over the job). Afterwards Heim immediately typed up these records, which Bormann signed as accurate.”

    “The Table Talks’ content is more important in my view than Hitler’s Mein Kampf, and possibly even more than his Zweites Buch (1928). It is unadulterated Hitler. He expatiates on virtually every subject under the sun, while his generals and private staff sit patiently and listen, or pretend to listen, to the monologues.”

    Source : How good is Hitler’s Table Talk ? – David Irving
    http://www.fpp.co.uk/Letters/Hitler/Table Talk010104.html

    If you want to maintain your faith in Hitler’s innocence, you are free to do so, but it will be a faith based on wishes and not on facts.
    No matter how immoral the Allies themselves were, that does not clear Hitler from his own guilt.

    • 回复: @Anon
    , @Wally
    , @Steve Naidamast
  149. Anon[267]• 免责声明 说:
    @Plato's Dream

    But Kiev and Minks had everything to do with international communist imperialism and its outposts. War strategy against an existential threat is what it has to be.

  150. Anon[267]• 免责声明 说:
    @Franklin Ryckaert

    The only way you can wriggle out of that is by saying that Hitler’s Table Talk was “written by the Jews”.
    祝你好运!

    你在说什么?

    Its not controversial to question the authenticity of the printed table talks. Even in mainstream academia, their content is widely held under high suspicion of forgery due to how many hands and translations they passed through for any given printing.

    让我们休息一下。

  151. Anonymous [AKA "quotesandcontext"] 说:

    Sorry, but while it might have been obvious to every one that both the Soviets and Nazis were going to clash in the West and that the U.S. and Japan were destined for a fight in the East, the run-up to both was slightly different.

    FDR might have provoked the Japanese with his petroleum embargo/economic sanctions etc. etc. , but butter wouldn’t melt in Uncle Joe Stalin’s mouth when it came to the Germans.

    He was supplying them with wheat up until the bitter end and didn’t even raise a peep against Hitler’s further adventures in Europe which led up to Operation Barbarossa. He was blowing kisses at them to play for time.

    If it’s a choice between Stalin’s being naive and/or scheming versus worrying about the preparedness of his military and playing for time, I’ll choose the latter any day.

    Hitler had been secretly preparing to invade the Soviet Union for many months, whereas the Soviets were not yet in a position to mirror those affections.

  152. Anon[267]• 免责声明 说:
    @Franklin Ryckaert

    If you want to maintain your faith in Hitler’s innocence, you are free to do so, but it will be a faith based on wishes and not on facts.

    In light of the aims of international communism, which was and is world domination to include in Germany, you cannot judge Hitler based on his actions toward communist held territory. Stated propaganda or not, he was attempting to do the rest of the world a favor by destroying communism in a primary nest of its power at the time.

    • 同意: jacques sheete
    • 回复: @Franklin Ryckaert
  153. EugeneGur 说:
    @jacques sheete

    I guess some people never learn.

    Yes, some never do, and the Germans seem to be those people.

    Some Jews openly declared war on Germany in 1933

    I neither know nor care what “some” Jews declared war on Germany in 1933. If they had, Germany should’ve concentrated on fighting 他们.

    What I do know, however, that the Germans exterminated Jews, as well other categories they specifically disliked, on the captured Soviet territory in a systematic manner, and those Jews definitely did not declare any war on Germany or offend Germany in any way.

    You know, I’ve been told that “stuff happens” in war.

    Oh, “stuff happens” in war, doesn’t it? When why are you whining about the Red Army treating you Nazi scum not too kindly?

    • 回复: @Anon
    , @jacques sheete
    , @refl
  154. Anon[267]• 免责声明 说:
    @New Dealer

    乌兹网! Proudly transitioning from neo-Nazi to Nazi.

    Please, with your content free ad hominems. Anyone battling communism and the Jewish power behind it is fighting for the human race that the Jews plan to genocide (see many places in the Zohar).

    For one, here is the Jewish plan to destroy all other nations in a final War with Islam as well as to genocide all Muslims:

    https://www.chabad.org/kabbalah/article_cdo/aid/1391003/jewish/Daily-Zohar-Vaeira-Day-5.htm

    You can’t hold the moral water of the average National Socialist German in 1941.

  155. Anon[267]• 免责声明 说:
    @Monotonous Languor

    The hidden agenda of WWII was to make the world safe for socialism.

    There is little that is inherently wrong with a degree of Nationalist (economic) Socialism. Social (cultural) Marxism is a whole other animal.

    What WWII made the world safe for the the Jewish plan to escort it toward a final war that is meant to destroy it.

    See my above Chabad link.

  156. @jacques sheete

    I’m not buying your theories.

    You cannot buy my theories, they are given freely and worth every penny that you pay for them.

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  157. Anon[267]• 免责声明 说:
    @EugeneGur

    If Germany was anyone’s victim, it was of its own stupidity and arrogance. Germany was crushed because it lost WWI it had a hand in initiating. It was crushed again in 1945, because it lost yet another war it started.

    谢谢你的笑声。

  158. Anon[267]• 免责声明 说:
    @RobinG

    Don’t let the door hit you in the behind, hypocrite.

  159. Anon[267]• 免责声明 说:
    @Plato's Dream

    I prefer to google “Gulag genocide” for immensely larger numbers.

  160. j2 说:
    @Steve Naidamast

    “I have read parts of Mein Kampf over the years and I found very little said about the Jews except in the chapters devoted to that concern. And even there, Adolph Hitler’s supposed rabid antisemitism was fairly tame in my view. In fact, he was speaking more as a political scientist would instead of an ideologue…”

    I read it some twenty-thirty years ago and noticed that there were very many incidences of the word Jew. I checked it. In the English translation there are 445 incidences of the word Jew in 697 pages, that is one incidence in 1,56 pages. I said, in almost every page. That is in average, one in 1.56 pages is almost every page. That is a lot. There are 4 incidences of the word Pole (not pole or Napoleon) and 63 incidences of French, that gives you some comparison, both were neighboring countries to Germany. I said nothing of the character of these references to Jews, only that there was very many references to Jews in that book. Seems that my old memory is still better than your reading parts of Mein Kampf.

    • 回复: @Cowboy
    , @Rogue
  161. Anon[267]• 免责声明 说:
    @EugeneGur

    those Jews definitely did not declare any war on Germany or offend Germany in any way.

    “Those” Jews? Who are “those” Jews?

    Jewry explicitly categorizes itself as an international nation. Its one of the defining aspects of it. All Jews are therefore “those Jews”. They most certainly do not get to claim international individualism at the same time that they benefit from international unity when convenient.

    All Jewry holds the same beliefs and ultimate aims. See my above Chabad link.

    German Jews certainly did “offend” Germany. You only need to read the statements of the Germans in regard to them.

    You only need to read Jewish scripture to see just how they offend every sane nation and that they are a slow poison to every nation.

    • 回复: @EugeneGur
  162. Wally 说:
    @Franklin Ryckaert

    Oh my, you lose again.
    Of course there were conversations at dinners, but what has been added, mistranslated, invented within them is the issue.

    You incompetently missed:
    伪造希特勒的“最后遗嘱”: http://www.fpp.co.uk/Hitler/docs/Testament/byGenoud.html
    和:
    表谈,选择器: http://www.fpp.co.uk/Hitler/Table_Talk/Picker.html
    你当然躲过了:
    Genoud、Heim 和 Picker 的希特勒的“餐桌谈话”:学术欺诈和丑闻研究:
    https://www.inconvenienthistory.com/9/3/4880
    和:
    劳施宁揭穿: https://codoh.com/search/?sorting=relevance&q=Rauschning
    And then there’s the bogus Table Talk claims here:
    历史学家里斯如何伪造和发明 : https://codoh.com/library/document/4917/?lang=en
    和:
    – It’s noted that you dodged my information that savages your fake ‘Generalplan Ost’.
    – And you cannot show the millions of human remains that are claimed to be in known locations.

    http://www.codoh.com

    • 回复: @Franklin Ryckaert
  163. Anon[267]• 免责声明 说:
    @EugeneGur

    The fact remains that it wasn’t the Soviet Union, with all its might, that initiated the attack, but Germany.

    False. International communism was and is an existential threat to the world. A fact that you can derive from their texts that claim to wish to turn communist every nation in the world and to bring all of the national destruction that entails. Communism in Germany is what led to the rise of the National Socialists in self defense.

    Jewry is also an existential threat. A fact that you can derive from their texts that claim to want to genocide all non-Jews.

    And the behavior of the Germans – and not just the Germans, mind you, for almost the entire Europe joined in the fun – completely negates even the most remote claim that they were “defending” themselves.

    What a forceful conclusion after having said exactly nothing.

    • 同意: jacques sheete
    • 回复: @Commentator Mike
    , @EugeneGur
  164. @Franklin Ryckaert

    “Yawn” is no argument.

    Probably not meant to be, but rather a highly appropriate response to silliness. Get the hint?

    • 回复: @Beefcake the Mighty
  165. Logan 说:

    The Germans were also unaware of how the Soviets had been preparing their military commanders for war.

    The Soviets had prepared the great majority of their senior commanders for war by shooting them. And, of course, in the process terrorizing the rest.

    It’s difficult to imagine a more counter-productive approach.

  166. @The Scalpel

    You cannot buy my theories, they are given freely and worth every penny that you pay for them.

    Yeah, but I’m a big tipper.

    Now, don’t spend it all in one place! 😉

  167. @EugeneGur

    Oh, “stuff happens” in war, doesn’t it? When why are you whining about the Red Army treating you Nazi scum not too kindly?

    I already explained why. Are you a slow learner “er sumpin?

  168. Anon[352]• 免责声明 说:
    @Chris Mallory

    When the last German dies of a heart attack after strangling the last Jew the world will be a better place.

    You German apologists are not any different than the Holohoax whiners.

    That’s a pretty cucked opinion. No offense. You have to be utterly ignorant of history from WWI onward to hold it. Or merely have an irrational hatred of what are provably high quality Europeans that the Jewish poison in their midst had been gunning to kill for centuries.

    From the 17th century:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johann_Andreas_Eisenmenger

    在他的论战中,另一个即使次要的因素包括一个论点,即德国人是基督教中一个独特的民族,他们是迦南人的后裔,根据申命记 7:16,“犹太人”打算摧毁他们。

  169. j2 说:
    @Wally

    “LOL
    I guess Polish occupation of a large part Germany had noting to do with it.
    I guess Polish atrocities on Germans had nothing to do with.
    Poland even invaded and annexed parts of Czechoslovakia.”

    You do not understand the question. I asked why Hitler attacked Poland, because he had to guess that it would bring France and probably England to the war, that is, it would start a world war.

    This is not the same question as to ask, did Hitler have any reason for a war with Poland. There could have been reason for a localized war between Germany and Poland, but the attack to Poland did not start a localized war. It started a world war.

    So, let me ask you again in a more clear way: why did Hitler attack Poland? Was he an idiot who did not understand that it would start a world war, or did he have a very specific reason to attack Poland even if it started a world war (which Germany lost and from the beginning one would guess that they would lose). Is it clear now, or do you LOL?

    • 回复: @Iris
    , @jacques sheete
  170. @Anon

    If destroying communism was his only aim I would heartily endorse such a venture. But his real aim was colonizing Eastern Europe for his “superior” Germans at the cost of the “inferior” Slavs. He could have accepted the cooperation of Russian general Vlasov and his anti-communist troops, defeat Stalin and establish a German friendly nationalist regime in Russia, but that was never his aim. His aim was 栖息地.

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
    , @europeasant
  171. Wally 说:
    @j2

    LOL
    In your own link you stated:

    “I believe that six million Jews were killed by Nazis, 1-1.5 million in Auschwitz.
    If it appears that the calculation does not support this belief, it is only because addition of numbers uses the normal logic where 2+2=4, but beliefs do not need to follow any logic. The Holocaust was a miracle and miracles do not follow mathematical logic.”

    but beliefs do not need to follow any logic. The Holocaust was a miracle and miracles do not follow mathematical logic设立的区域办事处外,我们在美国也开设了办事处,以便我们为当地客户提供更多的支持。“
    Say what? IOW, you a laughable charlatan, a shyster, a deranged True Believer. LOL
    Trust me, I will follow you with that quote.
    推荐的:
    科学家发现使阿什肯纳兹犹太人易患精神分裂症的基因
    DNST3 基因的变异使德系犹太人患精神分裂症和类似疾病的可能性增加 40%
    .': https://www.haaretz.com/.premium-ashkenazi-gene-increases-schizophrenia-1.5294333

    犹太人对精神疾病的强烈倾向是否有助于他们的“大屠杀” : 幻想?:https://forum.codoh.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=12239

  172. Wally 说:
    @EugeneGur

    Yet you have been challenged repeatedly to present your prove of the “holocaust” narrative, heretofore you have not.

    Your discredited comments here are a reminder:

    Pravda: Holocaust Denial, by Ron Unz: https://www.unz.com/runz/american-pravda-holocaust-denial/

    http://www.codoh.com

  173. Cowboy 说:
    @j2

    Many people claim that Hitler was a Illuminist (Henry Makow), and many others that his entire government was financed by Prescott Bush.

    Seeing how Hitler banned Freemasonry in Germany, excepting an old Prussian Aristocratic lodge of which he was never associated, can we, in your opinion, now judge all of his actions as having been free of Masonic or any other (Theosophy, Blavatsky, etc) esoteric influence?

    • 回复: @j2
  174. Anon[424]• 免责声明 说:
    @ariadna

    Miserable finns ( helped even to the siege- genocide of Leningrad`s civilians ) , miserable rumanians , miserable hungarians , croats ( big genocides , Jasenovac ) ,slovaks , etc….etc … wanted that theirs master nazi germans give them some territories ,( some bones ) for being obedient like miserable dogs . The fight agains bolshevism , against judaization was pure bullshit to cover their greed and cruelty

    In the 2 world wars the europeans proved to be the most criminal , full of hate , aggresive , greedy, blood thisty , stupid , suicidal and miserable people or the world . You have to be stupid to fight two wars like that in 31 years , against bolshevism you say , hahahahaha , in WWI bolshevism did not exist , Putin is not a bolshevik ,and all the euroyanki nazis keep barking at Russia . Is Maduro a bolshevik ? or just the euroyankis want to steal the oil of Venezuela . Is Iran bolshevik ?

    The europeans , and their sons the yankees , pretend to teach moral lessons to mankind , but they do not have credibility any longer , their hands and souls are damaged by their endless criminal wars .

  175. Iris 说:
    @Germanicus

    “The puppet Poles rejected any solution and their radio aired crazy speeches by Polish generals proclaiming the intention to take Berlin due to British and French support promises”

    It is exactly the same scenario used to force Germany into WW1, with the “puppet” Serbs, backed by the White Russians funded by the French, doing the bidding for the British-French alliance (the Entente Cordiale).

    Germany was forced twice into a World War by the relentless conspiring of Britain. Britain had produced its geopolitical blueprint in the form of Mackinder’s Heartland theory as early as 1904, and set out to destroy Germany in order to stop her natural and inevitable rise as Europe’s main power.

    The criticism and focus on Stalin found in this article is somewhat naïve. What is a Machiavellian statesman, and I mean it in the positive way, supposed to do, knowing that a neighbouring nation-state is destined to be crushed by mightier powers, who’d already vanquished her a few years earlier?

    The core point is not who was responsible for Operation Barbarossa. It is that WW2 was started as a continuation of WW1, by the same actors, to finish off and quash Germany’s geopolitical prospects. Stalin knew that, and his duties being towards his country, he allied with the side most likely to win.

    • 同意: Byrresheim
  176. @Wally

    #The debunking of “Hitler’s Last Testament” is included in my quote from David Irving and thus implicitly endorsed by me. Still Irving acknowledges the authenticity of Hitler’s Table Talk.

    #I never endorsed Rauschning and acknowledge that he was a fraud.

    # General Plan Ost was not a specific document but a general plan for the Germanic colonization of Eastern Europe (up to the Urals), still in its initial stages and never worked out in details. Hence it had to be “reconstructed” from various sources, but the intention really existed. In my country, the Netherlands, the Germans tried to interest Dutchmen to settle in the East as part of this plan, but it never materialized.

    # I have tried to read Veronica Clark’s opinion on Hitler’s Table Talk, but it is too technical for me, and I lack the in-depth knowledge to be able to judge if authority David Irving had it wrong.

    # Nevertheless, it seems absurd to me that Hitler’s plan for the Germanic colonization of Eastern Europe, about which he talks in various places of his Table Talk, is entirely imaginary and a product of hostile propaganda. Hitler mentioned his wish for 栖息地 in Russia already in his 我的奋斗. But perhaps 我的奋斗 is also a falsification ?

    # I have no opinion about the number of victims of the German 别动队 or of the number of civilian victims of the German Wehmacht in the East. Fact is that the Germans treated their enemies in the East differently from their enemies in the West, and that had to do with their racial theories.

    • 回复: @Wally
  177. Iris 说:
    @j2

    ” Was he an idiot who did not understand that it would start a world war, or did he have a very specific reason to attack Poland even if it started a world war “

    He probably was tricked by the Hebraic banking plutocracy, who wanted the Jewish population to be scared and to move to Palestine. A bit like Saddam Hussein with Kuwait.

    Hannah Arendt reports about the collaboration between Jews and Nazis:
    “it is indisputable that during the first stages of their Jewish policy the National Socialists thought it proper to adopt a pro-Zionist attitude” (Hans Lamm),

    • 回复: @RobinG
  178. j2 说:
    @Cowboy

    “all of his actions as having been free of Masonic or any other (Theosophy, Blavatsky, etc) esoteric influence?”

    No, we cannot. Hitler was not a Mason, nor a Theosophist and he banned Freemasonry in Germany, though he correctly commented that German Freemasonry had not been subversive (it was French-Italian Freemasonry that had been subversive, Mizraim and Memphis lodges).

    However, by the WWII Freemasons did not any more work subversively, that is directly. The esoteric connection to Nazism is the Thule Society, that is Dietrich Eckart and Alfred Rosenberg. Nazi ideology is from these Thule people. They believed in the Judeo-Masonic conspiracy (which happened to exist) and that there was Judeo-Communistic conspiracy (which also happened to exist), so naturally they were anti-Masonic. But they were not anti-Theosophy as Theosophic teaching were very similar to those of Wagner’s circle (Houston Steward Chamberlain, racism) and they read the Secret Doctrine of Blavatsky. This doctrine, which developed to Nazi doctrine, includes restoring Jews to some place out of Europe, usually to Palestine, so it is Zionism of antisemitic type.

    In case you claim that Hitler was not in any way influenced by Nazi ideology, then you can claim that he was not in any way influenced by Theosophy, which is widely taken Masonic. However, if you think that Hitler was influenced by Nazi ideology, I cannot understand how you could come to your conclusion since Nazi ideology grew out of Thule Society that was created by a Freemason and Theosophist Sebottendorf and was a combination of national romantism (runes etc.) of the Germanic Order with Theosophic racial concepts and Theosophic fear of Jewish conspiracy expressed by the Protocols of the Elders of Zion.

    • 回复: @Seraphim
    , @Cowboy
  179. refl 说:
    @EugeneGur

    Myself, I parted from the brainwashed western narrative on 20th century only after the events in Ukraine in 2014 (some might find that quite late, but anyone has to take his time to wake up).
    After all, it was my own grandfather who invaded Crimea in 1941 and I have his letters and found his Iron cross between – handed to him for conquering the Dnjepr.

    The idea that Barbarossa might indeed have preempted a Soviet attack to me is the most difficult part in this story, and indeed, stupid and arrogant they were.

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  180. RobinG 说:
    @Iris

    A bit like Saddam Hussein with Kuwait.

    ???? How is this comparison the least relevant?

    • 回复: @NoseytheDuke
  181. @j2

    So, let me ask you again in a more clear way: why did Hitler attack Poland?

    Simple. The Poles were goading him and had been persecuting Germans put under their heel by the corrupt and disgusting Versailles diktat.

    Any more questions about the obvious?

    If so, read this:

    我们的德国国民开始殉难。 数以万计的人被以最卑鄙的方式拖走、虐待和谋杀。 残暴的野兽发泄了他们的反常本能,这个虔诚的民主世界眼睁睁地看着。

    Hitler’s Speech of September 19, 1939 at Danzig.

    Maybe talk to a Palestinian; I’m sure most of them have long had first hand experience with sadistic beasts venting their perverse instincts.

    • 回复: @j2
  182. @Iris

    It is that WW2 was started as a continuation of WW1, by the same actors, to finish off and quash Germany’s geopolitical prospects. Stalin knew that, and his duties being towards his country, he allied with the side most likely to win.

    全部同意。

  183. @Anon

    the german nazi soldiers were adicted to anfetamies ( Pervitin , trade name )

    The US military used the crap as well. Airplane pilots especially.

    • 回复: @Beefcake the Mighty
  184. @Franklin Ryckaert

    If destroying communism was his only aim I would heartily endorse such a venture.

    One other significant aim was to have peace with the US and Britain, but neither FDR nor Churchill would have any of it. One of their chief aims was to crush Germany and in that regard FDR even outdid Churchill. They even rebuffed German officials who were serious about assassinating Hitler, preferring, instead, to sadistically make the German people suffer gratuitously. Both were sickos.

    • 同意: Franklin Ryckaert
  185. @refl

    The idea that Barbarossa might indeed have preempted a Soviet attack to me is the most difficult part in this story, and indeed, stupid and arrogant they were.

    More likely desperate. The Japanese were too. Ever wonder why? Ask the Indians, for one.

  186. Seraphim 说:
    @j2

    Much too much was made out of the ‘Thule Society’. The pretensions that ‘Nazi ideology’ grew out of the fantasies of the ‘esoteric’ grupuscules spawned from the ‘Ariosophy’ of the Austrians Guido von List and Jörg Lanz von Liebenfels, was the boasting of Rudolf von Sebottendorff (formerly Rudolf Glauer), actually an adventurer, a Freemason and a practitioner of sufism and astrology, founder of the ‘Thule Society’ in 1916.
    If one care to read more attentively ‘Mein Kamf’ would realize that Hitler had a scathing contempt for those ‘wandering scholars who were peddling Germanic folk-lore and who never accomplished anything positive or practical, except to cultivate their own superabundant self-conceit…[who] rant about ancient Teutonic heroes of the dim and distant ages, stone axes, battle spears and shields, whereas in reality they themselves are the woefullest poltroons imaginable… people who brandish Teutonic tin swords that have been fashioned carefully according to ancient models and wear padded bear-skins, with the horns of oxen mounted over their bearded faces, proclaim that all contemporary conflicts must be decided by the weapons of the mind alone. And thus they skedaddle when the first communist cudgel appears. Posterity will have little occasion to write a new epic on these heroic gladiators…I have seen too much of that kind of people not to feel a profound contempt for their miserable play-acting. To the masses of the nation they are just an object of ridicule; but the Jew finds it to his own interest to treat these folk-lore comedians with respect and to prefer them to real men who are fighting to establish a German State”.

    In 1923, Sebottendorff was expelled from Germany as an undesirable alien; around 1925, the Thule Society disbanded. In 1933, Sebottendorff returned to Germany and published “Bevor Hitler kam: Urkundliches aus der Frühzeit der nationalsozialistischen Bewegung”. The book was banned by the Bavarian Political Police on March 1, 1934; Sebottendorff was arrested by the Gestapo, interned in a concentration camp, then expelled to Turkey yet again, where he committed suicide by drowning in the Bosphorus on May 9, 1945. There is a suspicion that he was a Comintern agent. It is not confirmed, but it is plausible, the Comintern and the Cheka/GPU/NKVD had indeed used esoteric organizations for espionage and covert operations.
    Anyhow, all these esoteric organizations have been banned by the anti-Masonic legislation of 1935.
    In any case they were not the origin of German anti-semitism.

  187. @jacques sheete

    Of course. All armies since antiquity give soldiers some kind of juice.

  188. The Red Army purges are another overstated narrative. (Suvorov in fact believes they strengthened the Red Army by imposing ideological discipline and getting rid of backsliders, not sure about that, but it’s at least plausible.) Simple fact is, whether you’re an unqualified lackey or not, you’d have to be simply insane to set your forces up like that, unless you were in fact preparing for offensive war.

    • 回复: @Sparkon
  189. AnonFromTN 说:

    Cool story, but incomplete. The author should have mentioned that before USSR innocent Hitler defended poor lil’ Germany from many other horrible threats: Czechoslovakia, Poland, Belgium, Netherlands, Luxembourg, Denmark, Norway, France, and a few other countries. Like a busy bee, Hitler kept defending Germany until May 1945.

  190. RI 说:
    @Hippopotamusdrome

    Technically, German forces attacked previously occupied by Poland territories of Belarus and Ukraine, which were already liberated by the Soviet union.

  191. RI 说:
    @Mikel

    So, when Hitler lied? In Mein Kampf or later?

  192. Mike P 说:
    @Anonymous

    “Soviet-Anglo-American invaders”? Hardy, har har… and sorry, pal — once USA entered the war, the Nazis were finished.

    Finally! The mellifluous voice of American jingoism. What took you so long?

    • 哈哈: Beefcake the Mighty
  193. Mike P 说:
    @Wally

    This looks like a memo that some enthusiastic SS-member and academic wrote in his spare time – almost doesn’t matter whether it is “authentic” or not.

    • 回复: @Wally
  194. @europeasant

    Just totally spot on. This is the sad reality we face today. And we all know it.

  195. Sparkon 说:
    @Beefcake the Mighty

    unless you were in fact preparing for offensive war.

    Perhaps, but consider this.

    Stalin’s rapid industrialization during the 1930s was almost entirely military in character. Few consumer goods were produced during this period, but rapidly evolving military gear of all types was produced to such degree that by the eve of Barbarossa, the Red Army had the world’s largest tank park, and the Red Air Force was similarly the largest in the world, as Mark Weber notes.

    The big catch was that Stalin’s almost frenzied military industrialization program during the 1930s spawned such rapid technological improvements in military hardware that by the 1940s, much of this equipment rolled out in the 1930s was largely obsolete already even not so long after it was produced.

    In his trap for Hitler and the Wehrmacht, Stalin simply positioned formations of these seemingly menacing but largely obsolete tanks, like the T-26 and BT series, close up to the border as bait. If the Wehrmacht destroyed them, so what? It saved the Soviets the trouble, and it cost the Germans time, bullets, men, and its own tanks, which could at least knock out these obsolete models, but not the newer T-34s and KVs

    BT-7, A-20, T-34 (’40), T-34 (’41)

    When the Germans attacked, the new T-34 comprised just 4% of the Red Army’s tanks, but the type remained under constant production and refinement throughout the war, and well over 50,000 were produced (Wikipedia says over 80,000), of which almost 45,000 were destroyed by the Germans.

    Any thought that the Soviet Union was really on the ropes against the German Wehrmacht even in high summer 1941 should be dispelled quickly by taking note of the Red Army’s participation with the British and Australians in the surprise attack and invasion of Iran on August 25, 1941 when the Red Army attacked with three armored spearheads disposing of over 1,000 T-26 tanks of the 44th, 47th and 53rd armies, and formations of heavy bombers. Against Iran in 1941, the nearly obsolete T-26 was good enough.

    Soviet tankmen of the 6th Armored Division drive through the streets of Tabriz

  196. Seraphim 说:

    Hitler made the same mistakes Bismarck warned against.
    Don’t get Germany bogged in the Balkans for the sake of Austria-Hungary. Bismarck would have happily let the Russians to take Constantinople.
    Don’t take head-on on Russia.
    But Hitler was Austrian. Prussian Germany was neither anti-Russian, nor anti-Slav.
    Austrian-Hungarians were both.

    • 回复: @Thorfinnsson
  197. anonymous[176]• 免责声明 说:

    Stalin knew war was coming so what’s so mysterious about him turning the country into a huge arms factory? He rushed industrialization because the showdown would come and they had to be prepared. Hitler wanted Lebensraum and that wasn’t exactly a secret. Stalin acted very rationally in building up his military capability. What else could be expected? The distinction between supposed offensive and defensive weapons and capabilities is a false one. War broke out between the western imperialist countries first which confirmed communist analysis of what would happen. Of course Stalin counted on them keeping each other busy while he built up and could later show up as the un-exhausted power. That didn’t quite work out as planned. There’s nothing hard to understand about why a country would build up its forces at maximum speed when it expects to be drawn into war in the near future.

    • 回复: @RobinG
    , @Wally
  198. RobinG 说:
    @anonymous

    The Hitler apologists here won’t let you get away with that kind of logical thinking.

    • 回复: @Franklin Ryckaert
    , @Cowboy
  199. @Anon

    Russia has at various times been a feudalist monarchy, a Jewish run communist dictatorship, and a capitalist democracy and it has always been the target of hostile westerners regardless. Trying to say that Hitler’s Nazis fought to defend Europe from communism is ridiculous. Wars are usually fought over natural resources and ideologies just create covers for these designs.

    Hitler screams he wants the west, the east, the whole world for their resources to feed his German supermen, and his Nazi fans shout no, he wants to defend freedom from the commie tyrants. It’s all about freedom. Hitler was so enamoured with freedom he had it written over the entrance to the concentration camp. Or I should say the annihilation or extermination camp. And Hitler wanted to solve the Jewish problem by the most expedient means possible, and the neo-Nazis scream no he was a humane, humanitarian do-gooder who just wanted to teach Jews the value of good, honest, hard work. No shit! And he was supposedly superintelligent and smart yet he was manipulated by Churchill, Stalin or whoever. And no he wasn’t a Zionist and had no plans to ship Jews to Israel, or he changed his mind as it was too expensive. And look, look, where are all the bones of the dead Jews? Went up in smoke. Or maybe he dressed them up in BOSS uniforms and sent them east as cannon fodder? Or maybe a bit of everything. It’s just a pity good old Adolf didn’t have the last laugh. Or wait, maybe he did, enjoying retirement with his Eva in Argentina laughing at all the idiots trying to solve all the mysteries he left in his wake. Who knows maybe he even took up having the odd glass of wine and a cigar on his porch enjoying the turmoil he created for others to solve. Cheers.

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  200. @Franklin Ryckaert

    ‘Was Hitler’s Drang nach Osten really less bad than Stalin’s Drang nach Westen ?’

    For the connoisseur of badness, that’s kind of an interesting question.

  201. Alfred 说:

    It is no great secret that the reason for the rapid advances of Germany and its allies at the beginning of this invasion was largely due to the posture of the Soviet Army – it was preparing to invade Europe. Their divisions were no longer placed in a defensive formation.

    “Operation Groza”

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Igor_Bunich

    Operation Barbarossa was a pre-emptive attack. I hate to say it, but Mr H was correct. Anyway, we all know who writes the history books in the West. As for Russia, they certainly don’t want to open their archives on that little episode – it would be used against them in a modern context.

  202. Wally 说:
    @anonymous

    Except that your peace loving Stalin invaded Finland, Latvia, Estonia, Lithuania, Poland, invaded & annexed parts of Romania, invaded Iran, invaded northern Norway and the Danish island of Bornholm.

    Good ole Uncle “rational” Joe, waas only worried about Germany. LOL

    And if Hitler wanted ‘lebensraum” then he already had it.
    Polish aggression assured that.

    You have zero prove that Germany attacked the USSR, then fought a two front war, just to get land.
    No doubt you’re going to trot out the impossible ‘gas chambers, and ‘soap made from Jews’. LOL

    I suggest you actually read the article under discussion.

    http://www.codoh.com

    • 回复: @anonymous
    , @Commentator Mike
  203. JP 说:
    @The scalpel

    Perhaps you are right, the only moral way to fight a war is defensively. So, when the Brits blockade all foodstuffs coming in to your country and you wait, defensively, while your people starve, at least you can assure the families too weak to bury their children that you were morally upright. And when the bombers come in and target housing districts with napalm you can wait, confident in the strength of a static position, and assure your now homeless neighbors that you’re doing the right thing by not retaliating. True, what used to take thousands of bombers can now be done by a single Minuteman, but wouldn’t it be just awful for the children of your enemies to have to suffer along with you?

    Perhaps you should re-examine your morals if they require you to lose and be at the mercy of those who don’t follow your “morals”. Is the lion less moral than the lamb?

    • 同意: Sin City Milla
    • 回复: @The Scalpel
  204. Wally 说:
    @Franklin Ryckaert

    – Yet you have no proof for Generalplan Ost, I showed you a fake document trying be “a specific document”, and I showed you that nothing in that fake occurred, but you just ‘feel’ it.
    – As I said, there certainly were notes from Hitler’s dinners, the point is that what is laughably alleged to have been said was not. Pay attention please.
    – If you cannot / will not read information which debunks the fake ‘Table Talk’ allegations then what the hell are you doing citing fake quotes from it? You must be just ‘feeling’ it again.
    – I also noted you dodged other devastating take downs of the nonsense that was supposedly part of ‘Table Talk”. What’s wrong with you anyway?
    – What Hitler “mentioned” in Mein Kampf is certainly not something that could have been done in the midst of an immense two front war. Your claim is beyond absurd.
    And if Hitler wanted ‘lebensraum” then he already had it. Polish aggression assured that.
    As I said,, Kruschev said “We will bury you.”, Ayatollah Khomeini called the US the “Great Satan”, yet they did not attack the US.
    – Show us how “the Germans treated their enemies in the East differently from their enemies in the West, and that had to do with their racial theories.” I await. Or are you just ‘feeling’ it again.
    – Your back tracking weasel words about the Einsatzgruppen are noted.
    But how about telling us generally what you think the Einsatzgruppen did and where.

    Your clearly over matched here, you need to embrace reality, not easily debunked Zionist propaganda
    But hey, ALL Revisionists are former Believers. Cheers.
    http://www.codoh.com

    • 回复: @Franklin Ryckaert
  205. Curmudgeon 说:
    @CK

    Marshall Pilsudski “invaded” the USSR to expand the Polish state. He detested the Bolsheviks. While he was certainly no supporter of Hitler, he understood the necessity of peace with Germany, and to that end signed a non-aggression pact with Germany in 1934, part of which was to sort out the fate of the former German territories, including Danzig. His chosen successor Smygly-Ryz, ignored his advice and mobilized the Polish Army a few weeks before Germany invaded Poland.

    Contrary to popular belief, WWII did not start when Germany invaded Poland. It started when France and Britain declared war on Germany.
    As for the “defensive nature” of the Soviets, Why would any country need offensive weaponry for defensive reasons? Germany gave up claim to Alsace and Lorraine, built the defensive Siegfried Line, and declared its border with France as being fixed. If the Soviets were really interested in defensive measures, they had two years to construct defensive positions, yet constructed none. If they were interested in defensive measures, why would they need 360 divisions within striking distance of the German border? If the Germans were really planning for an offensive measure, why were they still using horses? https://warfarehistorynetwork.com/daily/wwii/horses-of-the-blitz-german-cavalry-in-world-war-ii/
    Why would any leader of any country want a war on two fronts?

    Was Hitler completely innocent? Absolutely not. I urge people to stop swallowing the absolute bullshit narrative about the two world wars. There’s plenty of others to blame for both wars, most of it is inconvenient for the narrative.

    • 同意: Mike P
    • 回复: @jacques sheete
    , @CK
  206. j2 说:
    @jacques sheete

    “Simple. The Poles were goading him and had been persecuting Germans put under their heel by the corrupt and disgusting Versailles diktat.

    Any more questions about the obvious?”

    Yes, I will reformulate my question, and I do appreciate answers from you, Mighty and or course Iris.

    Too much is made of an esoteric and occult connections of Nazis, this naturally is so. I do not try to make this connection. Hitler was no esoteric or occult person, though Rudolf Hess maybe had such features. In Mein Kampf Hitler denounces the Vo”lkish thinking. It is the legacy of the Germanic Order in the Thule Society, those romantic dreams of the past. So, Nazi leaders were not Vo”lkish.

    But as commented by Iris, WWII was a continuation of WWI with the same actors and a similar outcome. If we look at the outcome, the first world war was a terrible war (a Masonic war to finish all wars, i.e., a war without a gain to teach the people not to do wars), destroyed three monarchies (Russia, Austria, Germany), gave Russia to Communists, raised the USA to a major power, and gave a homeland to Zionists. The second world war made the USA a major world power, gave more land to Communists and led to Israel, which would not have been born without moving the Jews.

    So, how did the WWI start? It was not a dramatic consequence of an assassination done by a terrorist group. There was plan to get the parties to a war. Masons had foreknowledge, so they had a role in the plan and the results of the war agree with Masonic goals: a war to finish all wars, destruction of monarchies, restoration of Jews.

    Now to the question. How did the WWII start? It started when Hitler attacked Poland. Hitler knew that France would join the war and his plan to attack France was through Belgium, so he could assume England will join the war. There is every reason to think that Hitler knew that there would be a war between Germany and the Soviet Union, everybody expected it. Thus, by attacking Poland Hitler knowingly started a new world war.

    I give you possible reasons why Hitler attacked Poland and I ask you to consider them carefully:

    1. Hitler wanted to start a new world war. The new war would have the same players as WWI and the same result. In Mein Kampf Hitler wants the world to be divided between England, the USA and Germany. That cannot be done through a war where England and the USA are against Germany. Hitler did indeed start a new world war, but he could not have wanted to start one. He must have had a better reason for doing so than a dream of Lebensraum in the east, greater Germany, enslavement of untermenchen, destruction of Communism. Hitler must have realized that none of these goals could be reached through a new world war because the coalition against Germany would again be too strong and Germany would lose. Thus, the result would be destruction of Germany through a war. The only goal Hitler could achieve was solving the Jewish question by moving Jews out of Europe so that they could be restored to Palestine.

    2. Hitler was so angered/irritated by Poles (the atrocities and so on) that he did not care if the attack leads to a world war. But Hitler praised himself as a thinker and a thinker would first think what the consequences are.

    3. Hitler was a player who thought that maybe France and England will not protect Poland. It cannot be this because France and England did not initially protect Poland, they declared a war and did nothing. Hitler attacked France and only that made the western war real. If it had been a gamble, Hitler would have taken Poland, not attacked France and the western powers would have forgotten the issue. But Hitler knew that they would not forget the issue and a world war would be the result.

    4. The main issue of this war was the solution of the Jewish question by Hitler pushing the Jews of Europe to Palestine. If so, Hitler had to attack Poland as there were most Jews, and start moving them to camps. Jews were moved East. It was not regular internation of unreliable people to camps during a war. You normally do not move internated people to any direction, just keep them in camps. It was a systematic uprooting of Jews and moving them to the east and later to some home country.

    For these reasons I think the only solution is number 4 of these alternatives. You propose that the reason was 2 and think it is obvious. If the explanation is 2 then Hitler must have been a stupid hothead. I doubt it. There is a logic in the two world wars. They were not started by stupidity of hotheads but by a careful plan. Hitler himself warns, if the international bankers again manage to push the world into a new world war, the result for Jews will be different (that is, they will be uprooted and moved to the east to be later moved to the homeland). So, Hitler says it was the bankers who again start a world war. Why do you not believe it?

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
    , @Wally
    , @Iris
  207. @RobinG

    The essential point is to prove that Russia’s military upbuilding was only for defensive purposes. The Hitler apologetes aver that it was done for offensive purposes and that that justified Hitler’s preventive war. But that argument could easily be made to defeat itself : Stalin 预期 an aggressive war from Germany, therefore he himself prepared for a preventive war, which then was wrongly interpreted by the Germans as the preparation for a war of conquest. So which is it ? The Germans had a 栖息地 ideology, the Russians under Stalin had a Socialism-in-one-country ideology. You choose !

    • 回复: @j2
    , @jacques sheete
  208. Cundalini 说:

    Quite possibly the most profoundly beautiful piece of Hitler ‘reputation laundering’ ever committed to the written word.

    • 回复: @Wally
  209. Fascinating article. It is all too clear that the United States was on the wrong side in the war in Europe. Thanks to Roosevelt.

  210. Cowboy 说:
    @RobinG

    The Stalin apologists here will throw a hissy fit and blame everything on Hitler. They call their own cognitive dissonance “logical thinking.”

    菲菲。

    Every European who died from 1939-1948 died because in Jew eyes they are Amalek. Hitler tried to save Europe from this jewish blood lust, and failed miserably. Stalin was a jew-stooge, just like Churchill and Roosevelt.

  211. Miggle 说:

    it was the Soviet Union the world’s most oppressive regime at the
    time that was dedicated to the eradication of “free democracies” and

    WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    This is not a quote. This is our author!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    So Nazi Germany, where not voting got you shot, where voting for the
    wrong party got you shot, where being a (German) Communist got you
    shot, where helping Jews to escape the country, or being suspected of
    it, got you shot, where escaping from a prisoner-of-war camp and being
    recaptured got you shot, was NOT the world’s most oppressive regime at
    the time? Was one of the “free democracies”?

    Look out Maduro, here the Nazis come. Because yours is the world’s
    most oppressive regime at this time. We will give Venezuela a free democracy!

    • 回复: @RobinG
    , @Wally
    , @jacques sheete
  212. @Beefcake the Mighty

    All armies since antiquity give soldiers some kind of juice.

    Churchill (himself a sot) is said to have quipped that the British naval tradition was nothing more than 甜酒, sodomy and the lash, and if he didn’t say it, I see no reason to doubt it.

    • 回复: @Miggle
  213. Rogue 说:
    @j2

    I also got hold of Mein Kampf about 25 years ago.

    I assumed (due to the regular painting of Adolf Hitler as the epitome of all evil) that it would be full of lurid, political porn.

    The reality? Before I was a quarter of the way through my eyes were glazing over with boredom.

    Took it back to the library.

  214. Cowboy 说:
    @j2

    “Nazi Ideology”

    Now that is a major trigger expression. The problem is that centuries of lies and misinformation has been spread by jews and communists to try to cover up their genocide of European peoples. Here are some typical jewish lies about “Nazi ideology”:

    “Lebensraum”
    最终的解决方案
    Nazi Hatred for Jews
    Nazi Hatred for Poles
    “The Holocaust”

    There are many, many more lies deliberately spread by both capitalist jews like Morgenthau and communist jews like Ehrenberg, as well as the mass murdering puppets like Stalin, Roosevelt and Churchill. Katyn forest is one minor example of how deep the lies go. With all these lies swimming around in this jewish ocean of deception, it is nearly impossible to be certain of anything that cannot be forensically proven.

    One thing that seems clear from the photographs and film footage from that era is the degree to which the German Volk identified with Hitler and his Nazi movement. I do not think that anyone would deny that there was a special pagan bond between the German people and Hitler, and they supported him with a fervency that had not been seen in centuries. This bond is illustrated by the extreme loyalty of his officers and his armies. In essence it was a mutual trust that only Europeans seem genetically capable of creating. In truth, many Europeans in the lands that he liberated from ZOG admired and trusted Hitler to such a degree that they 志愿 to go fight and die for him. Mark Weber explains it himself:

    “Soldiers from those nations were soon joined by volunteers from other European countries, including France, Netherlands, Denmark, Norway, Spain, and Belgium.”

    Just compare this to Stalin’s Kommisars machine gunning in the back any Communist soldier who failed to charge the MG34’s. Compare the behaviour of German troops in occupied France to the behaviour of the Soviets in occupied Poland, Hungary or Czechoslovakia. Or simply consider how jews working in German labor camps in Eastern Poland chose to retreat with their German “Death Camp” guards as the Soviets were raping and murdering their way across Eastern Europe in 1944 and 45.

    Regardless of all the lies and half truths dispensed by “scholars”, one salient fact shines through: Hitler had this special bond with the German Volk, and even the European people. Many people love to put Hitler’s decisions under the microscope of Kosher lies and half truths, but Hitler was acting emotionally and spiritually for the German people. Many of his early astute decisions were made over the objections of his officers and advisers, but he went ahead anyway, I think because he had a kind of spiritual guidance that comes from being a selfless leader. Calling it Paganism, Thuleism, Wotanism or anything else doesn’t change that fact.

    So when someone asks “Why did Germany attack the USSR”, I would reply:

    Germany had to strike to save Europe, and Hitler embodied the will of the German people. That volunteers from France, Netherlands, Denmark, Norway, Spain, and Belgium fought with Finland, Romania, Italy and Germany against the Jewish scourge proves that Hitler was no dictator.

    • 回复: @Anon
  215. The Hitler apologists here won’t let you get away with that kind of logical thinking.

    Robin, Sweetie, you forgot to insert the word, “twisted” as a modifier to “logical.” Are you a Red apologist? I hope not, since it’s a bit late, as in out of date, for Karl and the gang. Those well meaning useful idiots have long ago outlived their usefulness, just like the Zionist dupes of today.

    A small clique of big money boys finally have pretty much the whole world under their heels now.

  216. @AnonFromTN

    And while Germans were running amok in the rest of Europe, with plans to take more space in the east clearly stated in Mein Kampf, Soviet union obviously should not have taken any military steps to protect itself against most likely aggression. Germans crimes against Soviet POWs and civilian population that dwarf Holocaust make the whole point of this shitty article mute. It is always interesting how “partners” like to twist the truth. There is numerous examples of them invading Russia on massive scale with no similar scale invasion by Russia at all.

    • 回复: @j2
  217. Bukowski 说:

    希特勒的行为是正确的。 让斯大林先进攻是错误的。 斯大林入侵德国的名字是Operatsia Groza(雷暴行动)。 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Igor_Bunich
    巴巴罗萨行动阻止了雷暴行动。
    斯大林于 1941 年 XNUMX 月发表讲话,称苏联正在准备进攻性战争。
    http://www.fpp.co.uk/online/03/04/Stalin_plans.html
    直接从马口。
    斯大林于 1940 年 1939 月将莫洛托夫送到柏林,并附上一份新的领土要求清单,这使 1941 年的条约过时了。 他想要更多的芬兰和罗马尼亚领土,整个保加利亚,在南斯拉夫的基地,控制达达尼尔海峡等等。 XNUMX 年 XNUMX 月,当南斯拉夫政府更迭时,斯大林向他们提供武器和弹药以对抗德国,同时是时候自称是那个国家的朋友了。 这位苏联独裁者已经证明自己是不可信的。

    http://www.inconvenienthistory.com/2/4/3133

    • 回复: @Seraphim
  218. @Sparkon

    Stalin wisdom was incomparable. No wonder Lenin was promoting that “wonderfully Georgian” as he called him. Before industrialization started USSR was third world country with no capacity to produce tanks and only few tractors. I won’t even mention planes. Considering international situation there was no wonder the onus was on producing weapons. Otherwise Russia would not have existed after 1941.

    • 回复: @Sparkon
  219. @AnonFromTN

    The author should have mentioned that before USSR innocent Hitler defended poor lil’ Germany from many other horrible threats: Czechoslovakia, Poland, Belgium, Netherlands, Luxembourg, Denmark, Norway, France, and a few other countries. Like a busy bee, Hitler kept defending Germany until May 1945.

    Before USSR Hitler did what?

    Hitler was in no position to do much before the USSR. The USSR came into being around 1922 and Hitler was not in power until a decade later.

    I think you mean that Hitler died trying to defend those other countries which were horribly threatened by international financiers and their One World Monopolists and their 周一grel attack dogs, the Marxists and Bolshies.

    If not, may I suggest you consider employing an editor?

  220. @Mefobills

    AND… most especially, the German economic model, the model for governing German state, was antithetical to Jewish International Plutocracy.

    That is profound indeed!

    • 同意: Iris
  221. Miggle 说:
    @jacques sheete

    Rum was the traditional drink in the English navy, but you were not supposed to drink it till the sun was above the yard-arm.

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  222. @Sparkon

    Interesting speculation, but even here, your account is radically different from the official propaganda served up by the liberals and the Russians (who haven’t quite broken free of being a Soviet successor state). It’s thus much more compatible with revisionism than not.

  223. @jacques sheete

    Yes. The fact that he appeals to the case of Norway (as an example of Nazi “aggression”) demonstrates how weak his position is.

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
    , @AnonFromTN
  224. Sparkon 说:
    @Sergey Kriger

    Mr. Stalin’s cruel industrialization started in 1929 with the first 5-year plan, while Mr. Hitler did not come into power until Jan. 1933, when he was appointed Chancellor by Pres. Paul von Hindenburg, a development that elicited a declaration of war on Germany by international Jewry.

    But that crafty and prescient Stalin had apparently anticipated this turn of events when he wrote his reply to a query from the Jewish News Agency in the United States:

    在苏联,反犹太主义应受到法律的最严厉惩处,因为这是对苏联制度的深恶痛绝的现象。 根据苏联法律,活跃的反犹太人将被判处死刑。

    斯大林
    January 12, 1931

    https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/stalin/works/1931/01/12.htm

    So the Soviets were allied with the Jews against Germany, which is not to suggest of course that the Jews ever taught the Soviets any lessons about playing the victim, but does anyone familiar with the facts really think that Stalin and his generals were planning on or even capable of invading Germany in 1941, when the Red Army’s tank forces were comprised mostly of obsolete types like the T-26?

    More likely in my view, all the prewar hot air about offensive operations from Stalin and his generals was a provocation meant to make the Germans nervous, and to entice them into attacking and destroying all the Red Army’s obsolete junk seemingly poised menacingly against Germany.

    It was irresistible bait for the Germans, and they took it all, hook, line, and sinker.

  225. @Curmudgeon

    Good comment, but allow me to refine this a bit.:

    Contrary to popular belief, WWII did not start when Germany invaded Poland. It started when France and Britain declared war on Germany.

    The first is true and the second was certainly a proximate cause.

    However it started when Karl Marx and the rest of the boobs started yapping about worldwide revolution on behalf of their rich sponsors under the pretext of serving and protecting the hoi polloi. Germany (like Japan) was in their sights after it got unified, industrialized, and became a true competitor for world markets and resources and began to exercise some colonial aspirations like the big boys before them though on a much smaller scale, perhaps not sufficiently aggressive enough for the international userers.

    WW2 can be realistically viewed as a continuation of WW1, which itself can be usefully seen as a highly industrialized variant on the war between the big boys on the one hand and the one between the masters and the slaves on the other. It flared up when “Jews” from New Yoik and London declared war on Germany as front page news in 1933.

    WW2 , (essentially a continuation up of WW1), got a big boost when a certain clique of userers with One World aspirations instituted the Federal Reserve in 1913 facilitating the financing of belligerents in Europe for glee and profit. American involvement was subsequently “needed,” 除其他外, to protect the loans and reap the profits.

    Of course it all really started when a vengeful and hideously sadistic “G-wd” created, in his image, ( does that tell ya something about who created whom?) the most disgusting species known to creation or existence, or whatever it is.

  226. @j2

    How did the WWII start? It started when Hitler attacked Poland…

    Hitler did indeed start a new world war, but he could not have wanted to start one.

    Stopped after the second sentence, above.

    I’ve learned to simply dismiss people who continuously repeat threadbare concepts like that, especially since I was brought up believing such trash and unlearned a lot of it through experience coupled with hard work. Once a person moves beyond such foolishness there is no looking back, so you’re just wasting your time trying to resell it to me.

    Bless you for trying, though.

  227. @RobinG

    The relevance is in the use of the double-cross as a “diplomatic” strategy. Kuwait was stealing Iraq’s oil. US Ambassador Gillespie assured Saddam that the US had no position on Iraq’s intention to put a stop to it by military means if necessary, but it was later used as a pretext for a US invasion.

    Iris would probably state it better than me but it’s hard to imagine that you didn’t already know this history.

    • 回复: @RobinG
    , @Iris
  228. j2 说:
    @Franklin Ryckaert

    It is not the buildup of military capabilities but the placement of the troops that indicates an attack intention. For defense purposes the Soviet troops would have been placed as defense in depth, as they had a large area and in that case you do defense in depth. It was not for a Soviet preventive attack because German forces were not concentrated for an attack when Soviets were forming attack positions. A preventive attack requires an immediate threat of an attack.

    A clear early proof that Soviet troops were in attack formation was the rapid advance of German forces and the large number of Soviet POWs. Today there is information of Soviet troop placements and they were in an offensive formation. This I would take as a proven fact.

    If by a preventive attack by Stalin you mean that Stalin guessed that sooner or later there will be a war with Germany and it is better to attack first, then it is true: both sides knew that there would be a war. It is a bit of an academic question to ask if Hitler made a preventive attack in June 1941. It may well be that in June 1941 he was forced to attack in order to prevent a Soviet attack in August 1941, but the war was certain to come and both sides were aware of it. Just as well one may think that Hitler waited until Soviets started preparing their attack and used that chance for an offensive.

    Finland was one of the three countries that attacked to the Soviet Union in June 1941. In April-May 1941 there were general staff officer war games in the Finnish army with offensive scenarios. Before that time Finnish plans were purely defensive. The offensive alternative came up stronger a month before the attack. Thus, Germany had not gathered any coalition to the attack earlier that about 2 months before the attack. Stalin had no reason to suspect a German attack still in April 1941. This agrees well with the warning he got from Sorge in 12. May 1941. That is just a bit after the time the attack plan is likely to have been made. No visible preparations for an offensive were made before 12. May, so Stalin took Sorge’s warning for planted false information to confuse Soviet plans. There is reason to believe that Stalin did plan an offensive in August 1941 and was preparing for it. Thus, in a certain sense the attack in June 1941 can be called preventive.

    • 回复: @Commentator Mike
  229. @Franklin Ryckaert

    Stalin expected an aggressive war from Germany

    Wrong preposition and proposition.

    This is better.: Stalin expected an aggressive war on 德国。

    Which is why he tried to form an alliance with Britain and France against Hitler. When he got rebuffed by them he had to reformulate his approach, thus he fell back on one step at a time, i.e., his form of national socialism which was clever in many ways.

    So which is it ? The Germans had a Lebensraum ideology, the Russians under Stalin had a Socialism-in-one-country ideology. You choose !

    That’s known as a false dichotomy. It’s neither logical nor reasonable to demand a choice between the two when there are other possibilities. Besides being a rabble rouser, terrorist, arsonist, bank robber, assassin and mass murderer, Stalin was a master politician and it’s easy to see how that policy served his interests well. It’s not hard to understand that it was a temporary expedient which bought him time and who knows what else as I explained above, so do yourself a favor and change horses.

  230. @Commentator Mike

    Trying to say that Hitler’s Nazis fought to defend Europe from communism is ridiculous. Wars are usually fought over natural resources and ideologies just create covers for these designs.

    来,试试这个。

    Hitler’s Nazis fought to defend Europe from Communist (i.e. Marxist, Bolshevist, Leninist, and Stalininst*)控制 of markets and natural resources, and ideologies just create covers for these designs.

    * All those cats as well as FDR and Churchill to name just the most prominent ones, were all useful idiots in the service of the international usurers (who profit from war) until proven otherwise. BTW, it’s pretty obvious that the State of Israel, as is its puppet the USA, serve that purpose today, and both are now at about the used toilet paper stage.

  231. j2 说:
    @Sergey Kriger

    “Soviet union obviously should not have taken any military steps to protect itself against most likely aggression.”

    If the Soviet Union wanted to defend itself against a German invasion, the Soviet troops would have been in defense in depth in June 1941 and Germany could not have advanced so fast and taken so many POWs, but Stalin was planning an attack and had set the troops for an attack and this is the reason why so many POWs were taken of whom so many of them later died.

    “It is always interesting how “partners” like to twist the truth.”
    The Soviet Union twisted the truth of the Winter War for all the time up to 1980s. Nobody in the Warsaw Pact countries heard the truth of that war before 1980s. Soviets twisted very many truths, and some Russians are still twisting the truth. You may be still uninformed.

    • 回复: @Sergey Kriger
  232. @Miggle

    Sometimes (most of the time) I’m denser than basalt, but now I see why the Brits had sugar plantations (and slaves) all over the Caribbean.

    George Washington, a former Brit officer, was the biggest distiller of whiskey in the colonies I believe*. Hmmmmm…

    *I need to research it to be sure. And now I remember that both he and Jefferson advocated the growing of hemp, and evidently not just for the fibers.

    FDR descended from a multimillionaire dope trafficker and profiteer, Warren Delano II, and the Japanese had been trying to control heroin addiction in the far East. To that end it also tried to develop its own sources of opium in Manchukuo…De plot do thicken, it seemeth, or maybe I’m just a wild eyed kunspirasee theerist?

  233. Seraphim 说:
    @Bukowski

    It is more improbable that Stalin would have taken the initiative of the attack against Germany in the conditions of the existence of the Anti-Comintern Pact. It would have attracted the intervention of Japan and for sure Stalin wouldn’t have liked to fight on two fronts.
    The document purported to prove the aggressive intentions: “Considerations of the Plan for the Strategic Deployment of the Armed forces of the Soviet Union in Case of War with Germany and its Allies” is not a proof that Stalin intended to start the war.

  234. anonymous[176]• 免责声明 说:
    @Wally

    your peace loving Stalin

    Nowhere in the comment was it claimed that Stalin was “peace loving”.

    No doubt you’re going to trot out the impossible ‘gas chambers

    Neither the article nor the comment dealt with that so why drag it in?

    Good ole Uncle “rational” Joe,

    If you don’t think he acted in a rational manner then show us where he acted irrationally.

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  235. @Wally

    1) I said there was no specific document but only a general plan which was no yet worked out in details. That the Allies faked such a document does not disprove that the intention to colonize the East did not exsist. Otherwise, why would the Germans try to crimp Dutchmen to settle in the newly conquered territories in the East ? Nothing in that fake document occured ? Well of course, that was prevented by the course of the war.

    2) So your criterion is: if something in Hitler’s Table Talk is ebarrassing to you (“laughable”), it must be untrue, if not then it must be true. Special pleading much ?

    3) I trust David Irving more than the eccentric Veronica Clark, and he has read the original German text.

    4) Again, your criterion for something being “nonsense” is if it contradicts your image of the “innocent” Hitler.

    5) Hitler’s plans were megalomaniac anyway. Same could be said about Mussolini and the Japanese. Poland alone was never big enough for Hitler’s grandiose plans. What politicians say in public is often different from what they say in private. Public pronouncements may be for propaganda purposes only, by private remarks reveal their real thoughts and Hitler’s Table Talk was private.

    6) “…It is estimated that at 3.3 million Soviet POWs died in Nazi custody, out of 5.7 million. This figure represents a total of 57% of all Soviet POWs and may be contrasted with 8,300 out of 231,000 British and U.S. prisoners, or 3.6%. About 5% of the Soviet prisoners who died were Jews.[5]The most deaths took place between June 1941 and January 1942, when the Germans killed an estimated 2.8 million Soviet POWs primarily through deliberate starvation,[6] exposure, and summary execution…”
    Wikipedia: German Mistreatment of Soviet Prisoners of War.

    As for the German treatment of the Russian civilian population, for them the noble Nazis had reserved their 饥饿计划 : take food from the population to feed the German army and if the population starves, the better : “…The plan resulted in the deaths of millions of people.[1] The plan as a means of mass murder was outlined in several documents, including one that became known as Göring’s Green Folder, which quoted a number of “20 to 30 million” expected Russian deaths from “military actions and crises of food supply…” Wikipedia: Hungerplan.

    7) The Einsatzgruppen were used to kill partisans behind the front. They were killed by shooting and were burried in graves that they themselves had to dig. Many of those partisans were Jews. It is alleged that the Einsatzgruppen also killed whole Jewish villages, but I am not sure of that.

    When all has been said and done about the crimes of the Allies and their propaganda, still that does not make Hitler and the Nazis innocent. The last thing we need is a Hitler-cult.

  236. Anon[403]• 免责声明 说:

    This article really brought the Jewish supremacists out of their rotten woodwork.

  237. It would have attracted the intervention of Japan and for sure Stalin wouldn’t have liked to fight on two fronts.

    Despite the fact that Japan beat Russia shortly before (with funds “generously ” supplied by the New York banker, Schiff), its hands were more than full in China. it wasn’t in much need of another “front” itself.

  238. @Wally

    I’ll concede to you that one about the soap. Which self respecting Nazi would want to wash himself with soap made from a “filthy” Jew? Unless of course it was given to soldiers without telling them the origin. Or maybe to those Jews still capable of work in the concentration camps before the final exit shower. I can just imagine the snigger of the SS in the know.

    • 回复: @Byrresheim
  239. RobinG 说:
    @Miggle

    The author is indeed an aberration, but what a bizarre comparison! You want to tell us about the Stolypin cars in Venezuela?

    • 回复: @Miggle
  240. @jacques sheete

    A private boycott isn’t a formal declaration of war or even a sanctions regime. It’s similar to the “Divestment” campaign against the Apartheid South Africa (though sanctions were later imposed) or the current BDS campaign against Israel.

    Unlike Italy the Entente didn’t even sanction Germany, probably because Germany the largest trading partner of Britain and France. Much of the nickel used in the German war effort was for instance imported from Canada before the war with full knowledge of the British.

    World Jewry was, to say the least, not approving of the Nazi regime. But the “war” against it wasn’t universal as demonstrated by the Haavara Agreement (which Ron Unz has written about on this site).

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
    , @Wally
  241. AnonFromTN 说:
    @jacques sheete

    It’s always amusing to watch Nazi fanboys twist and squirm, even play clinically dumb, when confronted with facts. Take heart: true believers never let the reality get in the way of their beliefs.

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
    , @Wally
    , @L.K
  242. @Beefcake the Mighty

    有时我想知道为什么我还要打扰。

    He’s a rabid Holodomor denier too.

  243. RobinG 说:
    @NoseytheDuke

    How is that what Iris wrote? She said, “He probably was tricked by the Hebraic banking plutocracy…..” From the Jew thing, you’re reading that French and British official diplomats told Hitler not to worry about the [recently made, for the purpose] agreement with Poland? Okaaay. Maybe some evidence of that?

  244. @Seraphim

    Hitler’s Balkan policy was relatively successful. All of the Balkan states other than Greece entered the German sphere of influence. Unfortunately for the Germans the Yugoslav government was overthrown by a British-inspired coup d’etat and the Italians invaded Greece.

    Still, having been dealt a bad hand, German forces rapidly overran Yugoslavia and Greece.

  245. CK 说:
    @Curmudgeon

    The Polish attack on the Ukraine and Belarus in 1919 was stopped and then reversed by Trotsky and the Bolshevik armies. The Poles were driven back to Warsaw and then turned the military tables on the Reds at the battle of Warsaw. A peace treaty ensued and the Poles gave up about 1/2 the lebensraum they had initially taken.
    Some folks put the start of WWII as you do with the Anglo French declaration against Germany, others put the beginning at 7/7/37 with the Japanese invasion of China; for myself, a case can be made that the century of war began 2/8/04 with the Japanese navy’s sneak attack on the Russian port Port Arthur. And even that arbitrary start date ignores the many European and Asian wars and scrimmages that fed like rivulets of lava into the larger conflagrations of 1914-1920, 1937 – 1975.
    Any weapon that can be used to defend can be used to attack. Artillery to armoured cars, bayonets to white phosphorus bombs, tanks to katyusha they can be used to lead an attack or to respond to an attack. Scythes and sticks and rocks for that manner can be offensive and defensive. The Germans made short shrift of the Fabulous Maginot Line … by going around it. Maybe the Russians couldn’t afford a border fence from the Lithuanian border to the black sea.
    As for your question re horses, the Germans, the Poles, the Russians all used horses for pulling things. The US Marines were still using horses in Korea. Animals are still used in wars today, although horses not so much ( however many mules and jackasses hold generals rank even today).
    It is convenient to theorize in terms of snapshots and snippets of time and to ignore the fluid flows of men and motives and scientific advances and moral transgressions over time. Arguing from statics in a dynamic world is what academics do; a snapshot of their navel lint does not explain the process by which their waist lines keep expanding, but it gets a publication somewhere.

  246. AnonFromTN 说:
    @Beefcake the Mighty

    Yea, right, Germany never occupied Norway, and operation Weserübung never happened.

    Sane people can find some info here:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_occupation_of_Norway

    • 巨魔: Beefcake the Mighty
    • 回复: @jacques sheete
    , @Wally
  247. @Thorfinnsson

    But the “war” against it wasn’t universal …

    Of course. That’s part of the reason I 指定 some of the instigators.

    Anyway, I’m happy to see that you understand that there was a war going on and that there were economic components to it.

    The goofy finger pointing at Germany, Hitler and the Nazis as the major causes of the wars is essentially what I’m trying to refute.

    For most of the Hitler bashers it’s as if the Brit, US, Russian (and 苏联), and French empires never existed, and if they did, they “dindoo nuffin.”

    Furthermore, it’s as if the financial wonder boys and other scam artists “dindoo nuffin” either.

    It’s always “dem Nazis…” I call BS.

    • 回复: @Wally
    , @Thorfinnsson
  248. AWM 说:

    Stalin was not “trustworthy”
    and Hitler became a “madman”

    Well I’m glad we cleared that up.

    Both were brilliant (Hitler less so) but criminally flawed leaders, and thank God that their conflict began in June 1941, as opposed to 1943 or even later.
    I think Richard Sorge was an even bigger player than we have thought, perhaps Joseph Stalin had intended his “Thunderstorm” to be roughly coordinated with the Japanese attack in the Pacific. But when the Barbarossa attack became obvious, he played it to maximum effect in America and in the “long game” which it always seems he excelled. His sacrifice of millions of Soviet forces was perhaps the biggest gamble a leader could ever take, but he knew this would solidify his relationship with FDR, and, as usual, he was right.
    The world, as it existed late in 1945, was almost entirely of Stalin’s creation. He had literally eliminated all of his old enemies and divided the planet into 2 parts, one of FDR and one of his.
    It was in this world, and not until this world, that his talents or perhaps spies, failed him.

  249. @AnonFromTN

    It’s always amusing to watch Nazi fanboys twist and squirm…

    Spoken like a true OGPU or NKVD sympathizer, many of whom were reportedly sadistic beyond comprehension, as exemplified by their criminality in the various Stalinist holocausts including the Holodomor, or slow death by starvation* of up to 10 million Ukrainians. No merciful “gas chambers” for them!

    Actually, however any twisting you perceive likely originates in what passes for your mind. Enjoy your fantasies, Toughie!

    * But never mind, the Brits were fond of starving people 集体 以及。

    • 回复: @AnonFromTN
  250. @RobinG

    “He probably was tricked by the Hebraic banking plutocracy…..”

    He probably was. It wouldn’t be the only time that ever happened, would it?

    • 巨魔: RobinG
  251. @anonymous

    If you don’t think he acted in a rational manner then show us where he acted irrationally.

    Why bother? We have some pretty good ideas how that would turn out.

    PS: If you are unable to answer your own question, then what makes you think anyone else could do it for you?

  252. Wally 说:
    @AnonFromTN

    That’s it? That’s all you have to say?

    Your problem is that you cannot rationally, factually counter what Revisionist here post.
    You then become terribly frustrated and project your problem on them. It’s a classic, albeit highly juvenile, tactic.

    And do let us know how the ‘Nazi’ gas chambers’ worked when you get a chance.

    干杯。

    http://www.codoh.com

    “No alleged human remains of millions in allegedly known locations to see, no ‘holocaust’.”

  253. @AnonFromTN

    Sane people can find some info here:

    Sane or not, smart people don’t bother quoting Wiki on such topics.

  254. Wally 说:
    @jacques sheete

    说过:
    “For most of the Hitler bashers it’s as if the Brit, US, Russian (and Soviet), and French empires never existed”

    的确。
    Whenever anyone says that ‘the Nazis wanted to take over the world’ just show them a map of the period to see who already ruled the world.

    http://www.codoh.com

    • 回复: @Germanicus
  255. Wally 说:
    @AnonFromTN

    Except that the British had already invaded Norway and were there when the Germans arrived.

    See my comment #29 for many examples of Allied aggression that your limited education has failed to inform you of.

    And as if Wikipedia is an unbiased source. LOL

    犹太复国主义维基百科编辑课程
    http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/139189

    以色列及其党派如何审查互联网
    https://www.unz.com/article/how-israel-and-its-partisans-work-to-censor-the-internet/?highlight=wikipedia

  256. Wally 说:
    @Thorfinnsson

    Except that the “neutral” US government was supplying vast amounts of arms and supplies of all types to Britain and the USSR.

    Not exactly a “private boycott”.

    http://www.codoh.com

    • 同意: jacques sheete
    • 回复: @Thorfinnsson
  257. AnonFromTN 说:
    @jacques sheete

    Wow! More obfuscation and so many changes in direction that you ravings resemble Brownian motion. To be expected.

    As the Russian phrase expresses it, “can I have cutlets separately and flies separately”?

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  258. Hillbob 说:
    @Wally

    You asked me for examples of the “murderous’ Nazis. I provided two(see post #131) . Not sure if you have seen them, or I did not notice your response. If I have, please forgive me and direct me to it. It may very well elucidate my ignorance on the matter. Then again, these extreme levels of brutality, may not be extreme to you at all, hence not worth your time. Alternatively, you , like the beloved fuhrer, may have chosen your own way out when the heat was turned up…

  259. Wally 说: • 您的网站
    @Miggle

    – Wrong. Communists in NS Germany were not shot.

    – Wrong. Not voting in NS Germany did not get you shot.

    – Like the US and it’s concentration camps for Japanese-Americans, Germany incarcerated those that they thought were a threat to the war effort. Like the US and all the Allies, assisting those deemed a threat would indeed beget strong punishment.
    In fact Germany would have been unusual if they did not punish those they considered to be traitors.

    – There are numerous examples of those being recaptured after attempting to escape a German facility who were in fact not shot.

    – The Allies routinely shot all recaptured escapees and attempted escapees.

    We also notice that you make no mention of the notorious Communist WWII behavior. Telling.

    • 回复: @Andrew E. Mathis
    , @Miggle
  260. j2 说:
    @Franklin Ryckaert

    “6) “…It is estimated that at 3.3 million Soviet POWs died in Nazi custody, out of 5.7 million. This figure represents a total of 57% of all Soviet POWs and may be contrasted with 8,300 out of 231,000 British and U.S. prisoners, or 3.6%. About 5% of the Soviet prisoners who died were Jews.[5]The most deaths took place between June 1941 and January 1942, when the Germans killed an estimated 2.8 million Soviet POWs primarily through deliberate starvation,[6] exposure, and summary execution…”
    Wikipedia: German Mistreatment of Soviet Prisoners of War.”

    I make some comments on this.
    Firstly, Germans shot Russian POWs for several reasons, not only politrucks. One reason was that Russian POWs did not understand what being a POW implies but tried to fare war with spreading lice. In Auschwitz they tried to keep lice hidden even in their mouths and to throw them on the guards. There is a book by a Russian POW in Auschwitz Andrei Pogozev, escape from Auschwitz where he tells this.
    Secondly, Nazis misunderstood what the metabolic minimum means and calculated food portions as average metabolic minimum. It is too little for the other half. In the book Naill Ferguson, the pity of war is told of German food portions during the WWI and how somebody tried to live on them and lost some 20 kg if I correctly remember. Finns applied the same portions, or a bit bigger, but had to increase those portions as they are too small.
    Thirdly, infectious diseases had 20% (typhus) and 15% (Febris typhoidea) death ratios.

    • 回复: @EugeneGur
  261. Germanicus 说:
    @Wally

    Didn’t you know, these allies had conquered the planet, did some very questionable things in the places they conquered, they then turned twice good guys, and after the War(I +II), they again turned imperial, now with the Americans and Soviets continuing what the Brits, French and Russians did.
    The brits starved millions to death in India, the Bolsheviks in Ukraine, but hey, these allies turned twice the good guys to safe the world.

    二战1
    “Should Germany merchandise (do business) again in the next 50 years we have led this war (WW1) in vain.”
    – Winston Churchill in The Times (1919)

    二战2
    “We will force this war upon Hitler, if he wants it or not.” – Winston Churchill (1936 broadcast)

    “Germany becomes too powerful. We have to crush it.” – Winston Churchill (November 1936 speaking to US – General Robert E. Wood)

    “This war is an English war and its goal is the destruction of Germany.”
    – Winston Churchill (- Autumn 1939 broadcast)

    战争不仅是消除法西斯主义,而且是征服销售市场。 如果我们打算这样做的话,我们本来可以避免这场战争不发一枪就爆发,但我们不想这么做。”
    – Winston Churchill to Truman (Fultun, USA March 1946)

    “Germany’s unforgivable crime before WW2 was its attempt to loosen its economy out of the world trade system and to build up an independent exchange system from which the world-finance couldn’t profit anymore. …We butchered the wrong pig.”
    -Winston Churchill (The Second World War – Bern, 1960)

    “我们用希特勒制造了一个怪物,一个魔鬼。 因此,我们在战后无法拒绝它。 毕竟,我们动员群众反对魔鬼本人。 因此,战后我们被迫在这种破坏生物的局势中发挥自己的作用。 我们绝对不能向我们的人民指出,战争只是一种经济预防措施。”
    – US foreign minister James Baker (1992, Der Spiegel)

    “没有希特勒的政治学说促使我们参加这场战争。 原因是他在建立新经济方面取得了成功。 战争的根源在于嫉妒,贪婪和恐惧。”
    – Major General J.F.C. Fuller, historian, England

    “We didn’t go to war in 1939 to save Germany from Hitler…or the continent from fascism. Like in 1914, we went to war for the not lesser noble cause that we couldn’t accept a German hegemony over Europe.”
    – Sunday Correspondent, London (17.9.1989)

    “The enemy is the German Reich and not Nazism, and those who still haven’t understood this, haven’t understood anything.” – Churchill’s chief counselor Robert Lord Vansittart (as said to foreign minister Lord Halifax, September 1940)

    The taboo truth, which is so simple, and these things have been repeating over and over again with the “war on terror”.

  262. Wally 说:
    @Cundalini

    Yep, a reputation not earned and claims about for which there is no proof.

    干杯。

  263. @jacques sheete

    The trouble with a lot of revisionist narratives is that they seek to completely exculpate the Germans and paint them as blameless victims acting defensively (e.g. this article’s uncritical endorsement of the dubious Icebreaker thesis, also endorsed by Ron Unz), rather than simply correcting the narrative and pointing out the culpability of the other powers.

    It’s a fact, for instance, that the Germans devoured the Czechoslovak rump state (in concert with Poland and Hungary) . If I recall correctly the diplomatic excuse given was that Czechoslovakia was falling apart. The same reason the USSR gave for taking their half of Poland.

    It’s true that the British guaranteed Poland’s frontiers and the American ambassador encouraged Polish intransigence, but that doesn’t change the fact that Germany declared war on Poland and invaded the country.

    I’m reminded of the Fawlty Towers episode “The Germans”:

    Basil Fawlty (John Cleese): You started it

    German hotel guest: N0

    Basil Fawlty: Yes you did you invaded Poland!

  264. Wally 说:
    @j2

    打哈欠。
    j2 just repeats what I and others have utterly demolished.
    But hey, he’s one of those ‘Don’t confuse us with facts, our minds are made up’, we believe.’

    J2 is the same hasbarist who said:

    “I believe that six million Jews were killed by Nazis, 1-1.5 million in Auschwitz.
    If it appears that the calculation does not support this belief, it is only because addition of numbers uses the normal logic where 2+2=4, but
    beliefs do not need to follow any logic. The Holocaust was a miracle and miracles do not follow mathematical logic.

    j2 is a faithful True Believer. Let’s all praise his religious “miracles”!

    http://www.codoh.com

    • 回复: @j2
  265. @Wally

    在1933年?

    FDR didn’t turn to foreign intrigue until 1937, and it wasn’t until 1939 that the USA could even legally export weapons to belligerents (Cash & Carry Act).

    Lend-Lease in turn wasn’t made law until March, 1941.

    The “private boycott” in question was not about the foreign policy of the second and third Roosevelt administrations (which was clearly directed against the Axis Powers), but the 1933 Jewish commercial boycott immortalized in The Daily Express’ Judea Declares War 故事。

    • 回复: @Wally
  266. @Franklin Ryckaert

    I agree and I feel sorry for all the European people who died or suffered because of the megalomaniac Hitler. Some Germans did try to stop him but at a certain point his organization was too big and powerful.

    Most people just want to have something to drink and eat and enjoy life. If another Hitler comes about it will be the final death of Europeans.

    Europeans should unite against the new hordes coming from Africa and Asia.

    Genghis Khan and his Mongol hordes and the Moslem Ottoman Turks invaded Europe many times but were eventually repelled.

    The new invasion strategy is to out reproduce the Europeans as they found out that they could not conquer Europe by war.

    • 回复: @Wally
  267. @AnonFromTN

    Wow! More obfuscation and so many changes in direction that you ravings resemble Brownian motion. To be expected.

    As the Russian phrase expresses it, “can I have cutlets separately and flies separately”?

    As expected, more sick glee from the sadists among us.

    And Robin (the Redbird), outdated as you feathered flatuses are, warned us about Hitler fan boys and ad hominems. But please, both of you Holodomor deniers and Stalin fan critters , do knock yourselves out.

    PS: I like Stalin for knocking off a bunch of old Bolshies, exterminating Trotsky and playing FDR and Churchill for the butt licking pimps that they were, so maybe I’m not all bad, eh? Hey, maybe I’m even a fan-boy of Stalin’s to a degree, eh? 😉

  268. @Thorfinnsson

    The trouble with a lot of revisionist narratives is that they seek to completely exculpate the Germans and paint them as blameless victims acting defensively …

    Probably a bit of hyperbole there, but who could blame them in any case? Most are so sick of hearing about “de” holocaust (as if no other one ever occurred), and the victimology of the “Chozen 青云ders, that anything else comes as a relief.

    The truth of the matter is that the Germans were, in the big picture, on the defensive against certain elements of the crackpot big money crowd. Period.

    PS: You don’t need to point any of that out to me, but if it makes you feel better, be my guest. And another thing: I feel it’s important to keep hammering away at the truth because a lot of people today are being screwed over by essentially the same clowns as the Germans were.

    End of discussion, and have a nice day.

    • 同意: L.K
    • 回复: @Byrresheim
  269. FDR didn’t turn to foreign intrigue until 1937,

    FDR recognized teh Soviet Union in 1933 against the better judgement of better people.

    and it wasn’t until 1939 that the USA could even legally export weapons to belligerents (Cash & Carry Act).

    Giumme a break. Your use of the word,”legal” is as meaningful as it is ridiculous. “Legal” or not, FDR was a de facto dictator who did whatever he could get away with.

    • 回复: @Thorfinnsson
  270. RobinG 说:
    @CK

    Reasonable post. So, what’s your evidence that the world’s getting “colder and colder” (or weren’t you talking about climate)?

    • 回复: @CK
  271. j2 说:
    @Wally

    “j2 is a faithful True Believer. Let’s all praise his religious “miracles”!”

    But Wally, Holocaustism is the official religion of the EU, you would not want the inquisition to knock your door in the night time. We are all Holocaustists now, thanks to you our friends Americans.

    • 回复: @PeterMX
  272. @jacques sheete

    Thanks. I try as much as I can. My only regret is having a Vasectomy after only four children. I encourage all European men to withhold having this procedure until at least three children are born.

    If your woman does not want children then let her have an operation.

  273. @Sparkon

    The threat was not just from Hitler. But from all of western partners. Stalin clearly stated that Soviet union was some 50-100 years behind other western countries and to avoid destruction USSR needed to close the gap within 10 years or be crashed. Well, the gap was closed. The rest does not worth to be discussed.

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  274. Wally 说:
    @Franklin Ryckaert

    [In 2 parts: this software won’t allow my full comment. ???]

    pt.1:
    1. IOW, you believe in a plan where a fake document is debunked by claiming that there was a plan anyway, inspite of he fact that nothing that claim actually occurred.
    That’s the very definition of irrational. You just keep believing with no such proof whatsoever.

    2. The absurd claims about Table Talk have been 证明 to be false, I gave you proof of that falsity, you dodged it.

    3. I showed you from Irving’s own website that Table Talk is filled nonsense, you dodged it, of course.
    Previously you said that you ‘didn’t understand” Veronica Clark, but now you say you don’t “trust” her without even saying why. You’re a faithful True Believer impervious to facts and rationality.

    4. I explain and prove my criteria, you just believe in yours.

    5. Like a robot you keep repeating what I have demonstrated to be false. But you religiously believe anyway. Get serious.

    • 回复: @Franklin Ryckaert
  275. @j2

    You must have served at general staff in some important role to make judgements about troops disposition.

    • 回复: @j2
    , @j2
  276. EugeneGur 说:
    @Anon

    All Jewry holds the same beliefs and ultimate aims. See my above Chabad link.

    What an idiotic thing to say! Like “all Germans are Nazis” or “all Americans are stupid”.

    You only need to read Jewish scripture to see just how they offend every sane nation and that they are a slow poison to every nation.

    I am sorry but you are the poison and you are anything but sane.

  277. @jacques sheete

    FDR recognized teh Soviet Union in 1933 against the better judgement of better people.

    Diplomatic recognition of a sovereign state doesn’t qualify as “foreign intrigue” even if permitting a Soviet embassy in your capital has certain negative consequences. It’s also worth pointing out that there were substantial American exports to the USSR in this period, and the resumption of dipl0matic relations furthered facilitated this commercial success through the provision of c0nsular services and government-guaranteed export credit (once the EXIM Bank was created in 1934).

    In the absence of diplomatic recognition, some fraction of these export orders would certainly have been won from rival firms from other countries (mainly Britain and Germany).

    Worth weighing against the negative consequences of the usual Soviet shenanigans conducted under diplomatic cover.

    Giumme a break. Your use of the word,”legal” is as meaningful as it is ridiculous. “Legal” or not, FDR was a de facto dictator who did whatever he could get away with.

    Which weapons did America export to Britain (let alone the USSR) prior to the passage of the Cash & Carry Act?

    And in any case unlike the Lend-Lease weapons provided after March, 1941 the arms exported before then were paid for in cold, hard cash. Good business.

  278. Wally 说:
    @Franklin Ryckaert

    [part 2, faulty software wont’ allow full post]

    6. Please present proof of your POW numbers claim, which I note is attempt by you to change the subject. Yes, there were POWs and many died. I suggest a look at Eisenhower’s POW death camps:

    https://forum.codoh.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=12370&p=91796&hilit=eisenhower#p91796

    And the Soviet gulags which your Wikipedia fails to discuss.

    Like your laughable Generalplan Ost, there is no such thing as the ‘Hunger Plan’, LOL< and you cannot show us this "plan".
    I see you cite Zionist Wikipedia, why? It's hardly reliable, it's highly fake when it comes to Jew interests,
    犹太复国主义维基百科编辑课程: http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/139189
    以色列及其党派如何审查互联网: https://www.unz.com/article/how-israel-and-its-partisans-work-to-censor-the-internet/?highlight=wikipedi

  279. EugeneGur 说:
    @Anon

    International communism was and is an existential threat to the world. Communism in Germany is what led to the rise of the National Socialists in self defense.

    You can engage in the mental equilibristics all you want but it can’t change the facts by a hair’s breadth. Germany attacked the Soviet Union and not the other way around, whatever you fantasies are about “existential threats”.

    On the other hand, perhaps, we should emulate you? We in Russia think you are an ‘existential threat” to us. Should we bomb you to oblivion, you think, preventive-like?

    What a forceful conclusion after having said exactly nothing.

    Well, don’t blame the text for your deep deficiencies in understanding.

  280. Wally 说:
    @Franklin Ryckaert

    [part 3, faulty software won’t allow full post ???]

    7. Once again, you’re backtracking, but it’s a start.
    There is no proof for the claimed ‘killing whole Jewish villages’.

    NS Germany simply did not do what is alleged of them, simple as that. Your “cult” accusation is juvenile.

    Remember, ALL Revisionists are former Believers.

  281. AnonFromTN 说:
    @jacques sheete

    Sorry to disappoint, I am not a fan of Stalin or your beloved führer. What’s more, I am not a fan of OGPU/NKVD/KGB or Gestapo, either. Killing off a lot of old-guard Bolsheviks was arguably one of only two good things Stalin did in his life, the other being beating Nazis to pulp.

    • 同意: RobinG
    • 回复: @Sergey Kriger
  282. Wally 说:
    @Thorfinnsson

    说过:
    “The trouble with a lot of revisionist narratives is that they seek to completely exculpate the Germans and paint them as blameless victims”

    So show us what you feel is wrong with ‘lots of revisionist narratives’, be specific.

    我们在等。

    http://www.codoh.com

    • 回复: @Thorfinnsson
  283. Wally 说:
    @europeasant

    Please explain what makes you think Hitler was a “megalomaniac”.

    Tell us what you think he did, with proof.

    Or, are you just “feelin it’?

    “我们常常幻想着对希特勒本人提出起诉。 并在该起诉书中加入主要指控:欧洲犹太人问题的最终解决方案,犹太人的人身an灭。 然后它突然降临在我们身上,我们该怎么办? 我们没有证据。”
    –所谓的“大屠杀历史学家”,劳尔·希尔伯格(Raul Hilberg)

    “No alleged human remains of millions in allegedly known locations to see, no ‘holocaust’.”

  284. Wally 说:
    @Thorfinnsson

    The date is irrelevant

    I pointed out US massive aid to Britain & USSR before the US was in the war which proves that the “private boycott” was not so “private” at all.
    Obviously Roosevelt’s Jews went to work for Jew interests.

    你不喜欢它,但那是你的问题。

    • 回复: @Thorfinnsson
  285. EugeneGur 说:
    @j2

    Firstly, Germans shot Russian POWs for several reasons, not only politrucks. One reason was that Russian POWs did not understand what being a POW implies

    I don’t believe you realize how obnoxious you sound. Naturally, the Russian POWs are only themselves to blame, for they didn’t stand still while being slowly murdered.

    Secondly, Nazis misunderstood what the metabolic minimum means and calculated food portions as average metabolic minimum. It is too little for the other half.

    Yes, poor little Nazis were just too dumb to understand that people need to be fed in order to live.

    Thirdly, infectious diseases had 20% (typhus) and 15% (Febris typhoidea) death ratios.

    Of course, how could the Nazis know that in crowded conditions with little food, hard labour, and no medical treatments infections are likely to spread? Such a complicated concept was clearly beyond them – those saviors of the humankind.

    • 回复: @Sergey Kriger
    , @j2
  286. Anon[424]• 免责声明 说:
    @Cowboy

    More than a cowboy you are a black hat gunslinger .

    Are you baving to invade Venezuela , Iran , Russia , Irak , Siria , Somalia , Lebanon , Serbia , Cuba , ….. ? get your occupation troops out of Europe , you gunslinger .

    • 回复: @Mefobills
  287. PeterMX 说:
    @j2

    And it’s heresy punishable by years long prison sentences if you’re a non-believer. In the USSR the Jews took a different tack. As 80 to 85% of the USSR’s gov’t they outlawed Christianity and outlawed anti-Semitism. Apparently, we’re all forced to be Jews now. If you’re a non-believer, you’re punished.

    Currently the 88 year old German activist Ursula Haverbeck is serving jail time for not submitting to their will. Lawyer Sylvia Stolz has served two sentences in recent years. Her client Ernst Zundel served jail time for years and had his house bombed in Canada by Jews many years ago.. Stolz and Zundel served jail time in Germany. Alfred Schafer is currently serving jail time in Germany for not being a believer. All across Europe people are in trouble with the law for not believing. Some people estimate several thousand people are serving jail time in Europe (mostly Germany) for thought crimes related to the holocaust.

    This is Monika Schafer, Alfred’s sister. She was thrown in jail for apologizing to her German mother. She no longer believes in Holocaust. See her video at the bottom of the article. That is what she was arrested for. I’m in eastern Europe right now and YouTube has blocked it from being viewed here.

    https://www.darkmoon.me/2018/holocaust-revisionist-monika-schaefer-arrested-in-germany-and-placed-in-solitary-confinement-for-thought-crime/

    So, I guess the democracies don’t believe in free speech after all, and they support censorship too.

  288. @Wally

    In my post that you responded to I brought up this:

    It’s a fact, for instance, that the Germans devoured the Czechoslovak rump state (in concert with Poland and Hungary) . If I recall correctly the diplomatic excuse given was that Czechoslovakia was falling apart. The same reason the USSR gave for taking their half of Poland.

    It’s true that the British guaranteed Poland’s frontiers and the American ambassador encouraged Polish intransigence, but that doesn’t change the fact that Germany declared war on Poland and invaded the country.

    In the first case Germany violated the Munich Agreement, and in the second case Germany invaded Poland unprovoked (unless Poland not agreeing to German demands constitutes a provocation?).

    You claimed of Poland in another post:

    Yes, Germany attacked Poland after much Polish aggression and land seizures. Poland was asking for and deserved it.

    There is definitely something wrong with this revisionist narrative of yours.

    I suppose the rump Czechoslovak state was also asking for it?

    With respect to Operation Barbarossa, while I am dismissive of the Icebreaker thesis, the actual reasons put forth by the Reich in its Declaration of War have a lot of merit. So here revisionists are on firmer ground.

    • 回复: @Wally
  289. “megalomaniac”

    A psychopathological condition characterized by delusional fantasies of wealth, power, or omnipotence.

    I never met Hitler as I was born in Germany a few years after the war ended. But I have read a few books about him.

    He was delusional in that he thought that Slavs were weak and sub human. But maybe he only thought that for propaganda purposes.

    Of course he found out how weak Slavic people were when they kicked his ass and his followers from Stalingrad to Berlin. Therefore Delusional.

    1. Adolf Hitler by John Toland two volume set
    2.Bloodlands by Tim Snyder
    3.The Wolf of the Kremlin by Stuart Kahan
    4.Flight in the Winter by Jurgen Thornwald
    5.Hitler by Joachim Fest
    6.The Rise and Fall of Adolf Hitler by William Shirer
    7.Inside the Third Reich by Albert Speer

    There are many many more on Hitler.

    Currently reading for the second time in order to gain more understanding of military conditions in the east.
    1. Lost Victories by Field Marshall Erich Von Manstein.

    “Manstein was born Fritz Erich Georg Eduard von Lewinski in Berlin, the tenth son of a Prussian aristocrat and artillery general, Eduard von Lewinski (1829–1906), and Helene von Sperling (1847–1910). His father’s family had Kashubian ancestry and was entitled to use the Brochwicz coat of arms (Brochwicz III).[3] Hedwig von Sperling (1852–1925), Helene’s younger sister, was married to Lieutenant General Georg von Manstein (1844–1913); the couple was unable to have children, so they adopted Erich. They had previously adopted Erich’s cousin Martha, the daughter of Helene’s and Hedwig’s deceased brother.”

    • 回复: @Wally
  290. @AnonFromTN

    I actually think he did a lot more good things. Those good things he built allow modern Russia to survive and Putin to have a lot more relaxed lifestyle than Stalin did. good education , science and industrialization would be another thing stalin did.

  291. @EugeneGur

    Somehow it all was working just fine with western POWs. Go figure. Must be different metabolism and immunity..

    • 回复: @EugeneGur
  292. @Wally

    The date is relevant because what was being discussed was the Jewish private commercial boycott of 1933.

    You are instead discussing the foreign policy of the second and third Roosevelt administrations, which is a separate issue.

    I don’t even know why you insist on belaboring the point after such an obvious misunderstanding. Given that you’re the one who posted the newspaper photograph in the first place it’s exceptionally odd.

    • 回复: @Wally
    , @Johnny Rico
  293. j2 说:
    @Sergey Kriger

    Just a lowly professor in the defense university. What is your background that you know better?

    • 回复: @Sergey Kriger
    , @Johnny Rico
  294. j2 说:
    @EugeneGur

    I so much like you sarcastic guys, you are really very, very bright and all knowledgeable.
    About there points I raised:
    1. Germans did shoot Russian POWs. They had some reasons, some were not acceptable reasons. Some reasons were acceptable. For instance, as a POW you are to allowed to try to infect the guards by typhus. In this war many POWs were shot, some for a reason, some for a poor reason, some without a reason.
    2. Germans made this miscalculation of the calories needed during the WWI concerning their own people, so this was a wrong misunderstanding of what the metabolic minimum means. I calculated the calories from a main stream information of flood rations in Auschwitz, that equaled the metabolic minimum. Finns used similar food portions in the beginning, the calorie content for a POW (a young man) was 1200 Cal/day. That is low. If the goal had been to starve the POWs, why to give them any food at all? Yet they got food, only incorrectly calculated. Let us add that the food portions were too small in general as there was rationing.
    3. Before antibiotics there was no way to treat several of the infectious diseases. The real solution for the Russian POW problem had been, do not become a POW, your officers should have the skill to withdraw and not to take millions as POWs. By the way, in Soviet POW camps died a higher portion of prisoners. And not only in POW camps, also Jews. some 200,000 West Polish Jews escaped to the east in 1939. They ended up to Soviet camps in Siberia. For a long time it was believed that 90% died there. Much later it was found that not all died, but well over 50%. I have information of POW camps in Finland, they were Russian POWs. Finns took most of the POWs, some 60,000. Of them died 28,5%, mainly of diseases, but in the war time there was an investigation of why so many died and they managed to decrease the death ratio quite much. In northern Finland there were these terrible Germans. They took a smaller number of Russian POWs. The death ration in German camps was 24%. That is about as low as you can go in wartime conditions with the infectious diseases, wounded POWs and so on. The Finnish camps were larger, as Finns took much more POWs. The death ratio goes up with the camp size because of infections and other problems. I currently estimate that a WWII camp, whether a POW camp or other camp, hardly could have a death ration below 25-30%. For very large camps it would be over 50%. This is just because of the time and the conditions, but you, a sarcastic very bright guy, naturally know all about everything and do not need to consider the time and the conditions in the eastern front.

  295. Mefobills 说:
    @Anon

    Anon 424, makes ad-hominems of Cowboy at variance with reality.

    Invasion of Venezuala, Iran, Iraq, Syria… etc. Most of these invasions are due to the usury system of world banking wanting to make new loans.

    Every time there is a war, there is a burst of new loan activity, and M2 (the broad money supply) increases. This then allows old debtors to pay their loans, and new debtors are created to make new money. New Debt Cycles pay old debt cycles.

    With regards to Germany moving against the Soviet Union, that was not due to Germany wanting to feed international usury bankers (Yes —Jews) but to instead disenfranchise them.

    Forever wars of the West are an ingenuous attempt of scaring the public, so new loans can be taken out, to then pay the MIC, to then create war machines.

    The profit motive was what created “international communism” and financial capitalism. At root, it is usury based banking. Trotsky’s first act was to put in a Wall Street Bank, in the same way that rebels in Libya put in a wall street bank.

    The bankers wanted their interests in Russia to be paid, which is why they backed Stalin.

    Hitler and Germany was having none of this, especially as they were clawing their way back after being almost destroyed by Versaille debts and hyperinflation.

    Germany represented a third way economy, of industrial capitalism (not finance capital) and this true threat has been confirmed by later utterances of Churchill.

    People, What part of “unforgivable crime” do you not understand. This is the root truth that you need to affix your eyes on, everything else is just knock on effects.

    http://www.renegadetribune.com/winston-churchill-germanys-unforgivable-crime/

    Germany’s unwillingness to be looted by international bankers was the reason million and millions of Europeans had to perish? The world elite definitely didn’t want the “Goyim” to get any big ideas after seeing Germany’s remarkable recovery under National Socialism.

    OK? That’s it. The world is run by a few psychopaths who want to “own” the world, and “repair” the world. They do this with usury banking.

    Also, who among you thinks that once whitey is wiped out from the world, that this situation will change, especially when it is whitey who makes attempts at correcting it, only to have other dupe whites fight against them.

    Here is a good rule of thumb. If a Jew is for something you should be against it. Hitler was against the Jew, who typically is an agent of usury and anti-logos behavior. Ergo, you should be for Hitler.

    • 回复: @Anon
    , @jacques sheete
  296. EugeneGur 说:
    @Sergey Kriger

    And, undoubtedly, the Western ones understood better what it means to be POWs – ours, you see, never quite learned to relax and enjoy.

  297. Iris 说:
    @NoseytheDuke

    “The relevance is in the use of the double-cross as a “diplomatic” strategy.”

    Thank you, I could not have stated it better.

    • 回复: @RobinG
  298. @j2

    My background does not allow me to make this sort of comments, but neither is yours. But my dad did graduate from academy of general staff and occupied commanding positions. I did not hear him making this sort of comments regarding what you wrote.

    • 回复: @j2
    , @Johnny Rico
  299. j2 说:
    @Sergey Kriger

    “You must have served at general staff in some important role to make judgements about troops disposition.”

    Naturally you are quite correct, I am not a general staff officer, though I did teach many of them on my topic, but the reason I can make this judgement is that the former president of Finland, Mauno Koivisto, while on pension visited frequently the university where I worked and he, as a former president, got all the help of the experts of the tactics and other departments. His conclusion was that Victor Suhurov was correct. You of course believe everything written in the always as reliable Wikipedia, so looking at the following page and searching for Koivisto you can confirm that he supported the idea:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_offensive_plans_controversy
    What that means is that my professor colleagues in the defense university either agreed with this opinion or at minimum could not show any counterarguments to it. The professors in the operational art and tactics, strategic, and war history departments were colonels, some were later generals, not so uninformed of these things as me, just as you would like it. Satisfied?

    • 回复: @Cowboy
    , @EugeneGur
  300. Wally 说:
    @Thorfinnsson

    No they are not separate, as I have shown.

    Do I really need to tell of the Jew influence within the FDR admin.?

    Yes I posted the newspaper, so? That does not preclude the fact that the US government worked hand & hand with Zionists against Germany before 二战。

    • 回复: @Thorfinnsson
  301. Mefobills 说:
    @anonomy

    So if Hitler was planning war against the Jewish Soviets, why wouldn’t he put the Jewish people in camps or ask them to leave? Is that any different than the US putting Japanese and Germans in camps? Were the communists antagonizing in other countries such as Germany? Now over to the Soviet Gulag, was that because of war plan

    The concentration camps were modeled on the English camps used during the Boer war.
    The camps were considered a intermediate method short of jail. Germany was infested by communist ideology due to proselytizing by the Jew. Red Berlin was a manifestation of this, where social norms were breaking down as is what happens when the Jew moves in. Higher Civilization falls, and in the process many are brainwashed, and need to be un-brainwashed.

    The camps, where “work makes you free” was an attempt to reverse bolshevik programming, for the lazy to learn how to work, and also to reward those who improved. The camps had camp money, and some inmates were released on the own cognizance to return later… sort of like a bonus for good behavior.

    By contrast English Boer camps had starvation and were poorly planned. American Camps for Japanese, were to isolate Japs as Japanese were being made into boogey man using wartime propaganda, which meant Japanese American’s would be at risk from the general population.

    Soviet Gulag was to terminate people, as history tells us. Gulags were run by the Jewish Cheka and were murderous in the extreme.

    • 同意: jacques sheete
    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  302. @jacques sheete

    Same people, same arguments, over and over, even just on this thread, but all seen on other threads before. Yes I’d like to comment some more too but why bother? Nobody here is going to change anybody’s mind, all set in their opinions repeating and repeating.

    Wish more would heed Europeasant’s appeal at #280.

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  303. j2 说:
    @Sergey Kriger

    “My background does not allow me to make this sort of comments, but neither is yours. But my dad did graduate from academy of general staff and occupied commanding positions. I did not hear him making this sort of comments regarding what you wrote.”

    Please, do not try to make me laugh. Finns do not like to laugh, remember out ski jumpers, never even smile. Read the other comment where I explain why I expressed that particular position, it is not from my personal competence, it is from the opinion of competent people and quite justified. Maybe your old dad just was not familiar with this topic.

    • 回复: @Sergey Kriger
    , @Seraphim
  304. @Thorfinnsson

    Dude. You are having a conversation with Wally. I thought you were smart. Lol

    • 回复: @Wally
  305. Wally 说:
    @europeasant

    Yawn. You’re all talk with no proof.

    And I remind you what article you’re posting comments to. One that demonstrates that Hitler 民政事务总署 to attack the USSR , your ‘slavs’. Hitler knew the risks, he said so, but had no choice. That’s the point you cluelessly missed.

    Hitler’s awareness of the impending Communist invasion and his reaction to it are indicative of someone who dealt with facts & reality, hardly “delusional”.

    Of that list of books, please show us the proof within them of Hitler’s “megalomania”.
    Just a list of books proves nothing.
    There’s plenty of books on witchcraft & sorcery I can cite, they do not prove the reality of witchcraft & sorcery.
    You’re simply slavushly reciting what you are instructed to recite, aka: 灌输.

    Now, please tell us how the alleged ‘Hitler gas chambers’ supposedly worked.
    Please show us the alleged millions of human remains of those allegedly murdered by Hitler, after all, it’s claimed that those remains exist in precisely known locations.

    We await. Bye.
    http://www.codoh.com

    • 回复: @europeasant
  306. @Wally

    Communists in NS Germany were not shot.

    Oh no? Fascinating. Can we at least agree that they were 被捕?

    • 回复: @refl
    , @Wally
  307. @j2

    Defense University? What does that mean? Use some references. You both are just throwing random shit out there.

    • 回复: @j2
  308. @Sergey Kriger

    What staff academy? Which commanding positions? Which army? What units? What war(s)?

  309. @Wally

    The “Zionists”?

    I’m not an expert on Zionist history, but didn’t the Nazi government have more links to Zionism than the FDR government in the 1930s?

    As for Jewish influence in the Roosevelt administration, this is well known. As is of course Soviet influence (often but not always the same).

    None the less, the Roosevelt administration was not involved in intrigue against Germany until 1937. Some contemporary observers believed that FDR turned to foreign intrigue owing to the failure of the New Deal and the onset of the “Roosevelt Recession” caused by premature tight money policies.

    And actual 武器 weren’t furnished to Britain (for CASH) until 1939.

    • 回复: @Wally
  310. Wally 说:
    @Thorfinnsson

    Why have you ignored the specifics of what I posted about the attack on Poland? See comment #29.
    “Unprovoked”? laughable.

    You claim “there is definitely something wrong with this revisionist narrative of yours”, but you can not demonstrate what. Hardly convincing.

    I’m pleased you accept the merits of Mark Weber’s article, it is logical, supported by all kinds of proof. We have common ground on that, a start.

    The Czechs wanted, sought Germany’s assistance, hence the “protectorate of Bohemia, Moravia”.
    It’s curious that you did not mention Poland’s seizure of part of Czechoslovakia before German involvement.

    I note that you are changing the subject, hmm. You can always debate Czechoslovakia here: https://forum.codoh.com/viewforum.php?f=20
    No name calling, no dodging

    的问候。

    • 回复: @Thorfinnsson
  311. Cowboy 说:
    @j2

    Who put a halo around this comment?

    Anyone who has spent a career in academia is beyond redemption. Get a real job, get a real life. The taxes that you think that you have paid as your side of the social contract were in reality merely plunder, stolen from the people to support your elitist existence. A career as professor in a Finnish “Defense University” is the non-plus-ultra. And now Finland is joining Nato in trying to provoke the Third World War for Israel, just as Poland did the second and Serbia the first. You are nothing more than a paid agent of ZOG. It makes Hitler’s entire SS appear angelic in comparison.

    • 回复: @j2
  312. L.K 说:
    @AnonFromTN

    Take heart: true believers never let the reality get in the way of their beliefs.

    First truthful lines you have produced here, probably while looking at yourself in a mirror: YOU are a true believer of idiotic WW2 propaganda

    • 同意: Beefcake the Mighty
    • 回复: @AnonFromTN
    , @Iris
  313. j2 说:
    @Johnny Rico

    National Defence University of Finland.

    • 回复: @Johnny Rico
  314. RobinG 说:
    @Iris

    Apparently you couldn’t cite evidence, either. Who double-crossed Hitler? (Finland, lol?)

  315. @Gustav

    “…yes, the attack of the German army was preventive.”

    And just what did it “prevent?”

    • 回复: @Wally
  316. @Wally

    1) “…. IOW, you believe in a plan where a fake document is debunked by claiming that there was a plan anyway, inspite of he fact that nothing that claim actually occurred. That’s the very definition of irrational. You just keep believing with no such proof whatsoever…”

    If a plan cannot be implemented due to adverse circumstances, it that then a proof that the plan did not exist? We are talking here about intentions, not actions.

    2) + 3) Not by David Irving. I repeat his judgement about Hitler’s Table Talk :

    “…Hitler’s Table Talk is the product of his lunch- and supper-time conversations in his private circle from 1941 to 1944. The transcripts are genuine. (Ignore the 1945 “transcripts” published by Trevor-Roper in the 1950s as Hitler’s Last Testament — they are fake).

    The table talk notes were originally taken by Heinrich Heim, the adjutant of Martin Bormann, who attended these meals at an adjacent table and took notes. (Later Henry Picker took over the job). Afterwards Heim immediately typed up these records, which Bormann signed as accurate…”

    “……在我看来,The Table Talks 的内容比希特勒的我的奋斗更重要,甚至可能比他的 Zweites Buch (1928) 更重要。 这是纯粹的希特勒. 他几乎阐述了太阳底下的每一个主题,而他的将军和私人工作人员则耐心地坐着听,或假装听独白……”

    Source : How good is Hitler’s Table Talk ? – David Irving
    http://www.fpp.co.uk/Letters/Hitler/TableTalk010104.html

    If you are not an expert in some matter and have no time to do independent research, you will have to go by some authorities. I consider David Irving to be an authority. And BTW, Carolyn Yeager, who is a Hitler admirer and very critical, does also believe that Hitler’s Table Talk is genuine.

    6) I could equally demand proof from you for the number of Eisenhower’s starved POWs.

    7) Like any encyclopedia, Wikipedia does not create information, it collects it. Information mentioned in Wikipedia already existed before it was collected. If you claim that its information is false because Wikipedia is manipulated by Jews, you will have to prove that the original information was false. Israeli manipulation of Wikipedia is mainly interested in clearing Israel’s name from war crimes.

    8) In the Wikipedia article on the Hungerplan, there are documents mentioned as proof.

    9) Another fun fact about Nazi behavior, you will undoubtedly deny :

    Wikipedia: Kidnapping of Polish children by Nazi Germany.
    摘录:

    Kidnapping of foreign children by Nazi Germany (Polish: Rabunek dzieci), part of the Generalplan Ost (GPO), involved taking children regarded as “Aryan-looking” from the rest of Europe and moving them to Nazi Germany for the purpose of Germanization, or indoctrination into becoming culturally German.

    At more than 200,000 victims, occupied Poland had the largest proportion of children taken.[2][5] An estimated 400,000 children were abducted throughout Europe.[1]

    The aim of the project was to acquire and “Germanize” children with purportedly Aryan-Nordic traits, who were considered by Nazi officials to be descendants of German settlers that had emigrated to Poland. Those labeled “racially valuable” were forcibly Germanized in centers and then sent to German families and SS Home Schools.[6] In the case of older children used as forced labor in Germany, those determined to be racially “un-German” were sent to extermination camps and concentration camps, where they were either murdered or forced to serve as living test subjects in German medical experiments – and thus often tortured or killed in the process.[7] Foreign children abducted

    400,000 throughout Europe [1]
    200,000 from occupied Poland [2]
    28,000 from territory of today’s Belarus [3]
    20,000 from the Soviet Union [4]
    10,000 from Western and South Eastern Europe [4]

    Dead in transit, estimated at tens of thousands, and underage inmates used as source of labour supply, not listed.

    10) Another fun fact : German general’s diary reveals Hitler’s plan for Russia – History
    https://www.history.com/…/german-generals-diary-reveals-hitlers-&#8230;

    Quote : “…On this day in 1943, upon the German army’s invasion of Pskov, 180 miles from Leningrad, Russia, the chief of the German army general staff, General Franz Halder, records in his diary Hitler’s plans for Moscow and Leningrad: “To dispose fully of their population, which otherwise we shall have to feed during the winter.”

    • 回复: @Wally
  317. @RH

    Plenty of comments from those stupid enough to think it serious. Or pretend to.

    • 回复: @Franklin Ryckaert
  318. @Wally

    Is that the best a Nazi apologist can do?

    • 回复: @Wally
  319. j2 说:
    @Cowboy

    “Who put a halo around this comment?”

    Not me for sure.

    “The taxes that you think that you have paid as your side of the social contract were in reality merely plunder, stolen from the people to support your elitist existence.”

    I was professor there for ten years as they needed someone like me and was mainly teaching officers, both cadets and general staff officers, lots of them, supervising their thesis, working on research projects, making project proposals, doing byrocracy. It is not elitist existence today, it is quite hard work, try once. But to cheer you up, for the last nine years I have been writing as a freelancer, so not one bit elitist existence and not making any money either, but I am not money and success oriented so it is fine for me, so now I am not working as an agent of the university or ZOG, and besides, I did work in industry quite long also in several firms. Cowboy, I think you have a complex, throw away your cowboy boots, stetson hat and the guitar you do not know how to play and get a job.

    • 回复: @Byrresheim
    , @Cowboy
  320. @j2

    I am not laughing. It is tragicomedy. You mentioned Souvorov as source.

    • 回复: @j2
    , @AnonFromTN
  321. Iris 说:
    @j2

    ” The main issue of this war was the solution of the Jewish question by Hitler pushing the Jews of Europe to Palestine.”

    You are very correct, J2.

    By 1929, the Zionist movement was failing to move Jews to Palestine, principally because of a lack of funding exacerbated by the 1929 Crisis.

    When Adolf Hitler came to power in January 1933, Germany was threatened by an international boycott campaign. To try to thwart it, the new Nazi power signed an agreement with the Zionist movement, which survived until the outbreak of war in 1939. And Zionism remained the only Jewish political movement allowed in Germany during this period.

    The Nazi party seizing power in Germany from January 30 1933 came as a shock amplified by the global crisis. Germany was in a profoundly unstable political situation because of its economic woes. Further violence ensued and the first concentration camps were opened for opposition communists, not for Jews. A global trade boycott of Germany was nonetheless decreed by the organised Hebraic community.

    In this context, a daring businessman, Sam Cohen, proposed a transfer agreement in March 1933: Jews who would like to emigrate to Palestine could sequestrate their property in Germany and receive as compensation the counterpart in German goods. One would obtain so-called “capitalist” visas conditioned on the importation of a capital of at least 1000 pounds sterling. After a number of adventures, he was joined in this project by executives of the Jewish Agency. The agreement is finalized in August 1933. It was understood that the Zionist movement would put all its weight to end the boycott. This is what happened in the facts.

    The so-called “capitalist” immigration visas benefited mainly Polish Jews. The German government was transferring more Jews to Poland’s “concentration camps” to favour their emigration to Palestine, as a means to alleviate the economic boycott of Germany.

    The idea of ​​a rescue in extremis of a population in danger of death is a retrospective illusion. The deterioration of the situation in Palestine since the summer of 1936 led to a sharp reduction in emigration, but the Zionist movement strongly opposed the conclusion of an equivalent agreement to transfer Jews to other countries, thus trapping entire Jewish communities inside “concentration camps” in war-torn Europe. Best.

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  322. AnonFromTN 说:
    @L.K

    Spoken like a true believer. Please accept my condolences.

    • 回复: @L.K
  323. Wally 说:
    @Thorfinnsson

    – No, Germany only had Jew links that assisted in getting Jews out of Germany.

    The FDR Jews made sure the US government assisted countries against Germany when the US was legally declared to be “neutral”. Quite a difference.

    – Any dates before the US was officially, legally ‘at war’ prove my point.

    You’re spinning your wheels.

  324. @Wally

    Why have you ignored the specifics of what I posted about the attack on Poland? See comment #29.
    “Unprovoked”? laughable.

    It wasn’t part of the original discussion. I’ve now read it:

    –波兰入侵并吞并了捷克领土的大部分地区,捷克斯洛伐克占领了德国的大部分地区,对德国平民实施暴行。 然而,“盟国”什么也没做。

    It’s true that Poland participated in feasting on the carcass of Czechoslovakia, along with Hungary.

    It’s not true that Poland held large parts of German territory in the 法律 sense. There were territories that were part of Poland which contained ethnic Germans. It’s understandable that Germany was interested in revising the Versailles frontiers, but that’s not a casus belli in a legal sense. Note that the Third Reich never sought to take South Tyrol from Italy, even though this territory was solidly German as well.

    As for Polish atrocities against ethnic Germans, after the Silesian mess was settled they began in the late spring of 1939 in response to growing German-Polish tensions (other than 1927 in Rybik). I’m not going to justify any atrocities, but ethnic tensions are hardly unusual.

    Claiming that the Czechs sought occupation by Germany is patently absurd. Hacha was simply notified that the Germans were going to occupy the country and offered the option of a protectorate, which he accepted.

    I didn’t mention the Polish land grab for the same reason that I didn’t mention the Hungarian one–it’s quite obvious that the whole thing was set in motion by the Germans.

    I’m not going to visit your forum because this is the only place I still comment online. Additionally, while I do approve of your “no dodging” rule, I’m not interested in your “no name calling” rule. One of the best things about the internet is the insults.

    • 回复: @j2
  325. @David In TN

    Never trust “official statements” from countries at war.

    • 回复: @Bukowski
  326. Wally 说:
    @David In TN

    打哈欠。

    What is an “Nazi apologist”? There’s nothing to apologize for.

    Given the statement that I responded to, nothing more was necessary. Please pay attention.

    Still waiting for you to tell us how your impossible ‘Nazi’ gas chambers’ worked.

    Still waiting for you to show us the alleged millions upon millions of human remains that are claimed to be in precisely known locations.

    干杯。

    http://www.codoh.com

  327. Iris 说:
    @RobinG

    Hello Robin;

    It is common knowledge among us “Nazi apologists” that the Nazi regime was vastly funded by large American corporations, such as General Electric, ITT, Standard Oil, all acting on behalf of the Wall Street and London-based financial oligarchy controlling them. Best.

    • 回复: @RobinG
    , @L.K
  328. j2 说:
    @Sergey Kriger

    “I am not laughing. It is tragicomedy. You mentioned Souvorov as source.”

    No, I did not. You mix up a claim with the proof of a claim. Let’s say that you, Sergey, make some claim, which incidentally happens to be correct but your way of deriving it is totally incorrect. Then somebody smarter than you proves the claim. Then it is your claim but the proof of the claim is not based on your argument.

    • 回复: @Sergey Kriger
  329. refl 说:
    @Sparkon

    So Stalin placed those obsolete tanks as cannon fodder for the Gernans? But why would he sacrifice them together with some 3 million soldiers who simply vanished on the front in that desastrous first half year? Being sent there with one rifle for two soldiers and not even boots?
    I am inclined to believe that a Soviet attack might have been imminent – war was coming their way in any case. But seing how events turned out the Germans could indeed have outlasted an attack. The Red army of 1941 was in disarray and nothing like the Red army of 1944/5.

    • 回复: @Sparkon
  330. Anon[424]• 免责声明 说:
    @Mefobills

    Ergo , I will never be for Hitler , only stupid masochistic europeans , or ignorant american nazis , can be for Hitler , a pagan , a drug adict stuffed with cocaine and morphinics .

    Of course there are many good german people , and germans have many talents , but , ergo , I will never be for Germany , just recenty look how they helped desintegrate and bomb Yugoslavia , look how they sadistically destroyed Greece , look how they helped to cause the Ucranian disaster , look how they profit from the euro while they plunder and humiliate south europe and the eastern european countries . Germany is a very arrogant nation , racist , and as her recent past shows a dangerous nation , cruel , without morals .

  331. @Commentator Mike

    Nobody here is going to change anybody’s mind, all set in their opinions repeating and repeating.

    For sure. And they keep repeating old war time propaganda as if they know something. Meanwhile the international bankster sociopaths keep refining their enslavement methods. And ’round and ’round she goes.

    But, hey, Baby, Yahweh luvs us!!

    • 回复: @Commentator Mike
  332. Iris 说:
    @L.K

    “YOU are a true believer of idiotic WW2 propaganda”

    I don’t think so, L.K.
    I think that AnonFromTN is an ethnic Russian who have strong patriotic feelings for Russia, just like J2 is a Finn who have similar patriotic feelings for his beloved country Finland.

    Patriotism is a profoundly honourable ethical value that should be respected by you and me, despite we are neither Russians nor Finns. Best.

    • 回复: @L.K
  333. refl 说:
    @Andrew E. Mathis

    That is really cool. Communists were RUNNING the camps for the SS, as they were Germans and had a strong sense of discipline. They used their position to send dissenters to the death.

    Deadly it was indeed for Russians in the camps, communist or not.

    • 哈哈: Wally
  334. @j2

    Thank you. That’s pretty cool. And impressive.

  335. Wally 说:
    @Franklin Ryckaert

    1. If a plan exited we would have seen it. We do not.
    Yet you say there were actuals deeds based upon a plan that was not implemented.
    哈哈 !!
    2. Again, for your dense little head, as I said, yes there was ‘table talk’, some are genuine, but what you and your absurd Zionists allege about those talks are lies, contrivances completely unsupported by facts…. as I have demonstrated repeatedly and you dodge. Please review what I posted.
    6. I make no claims on the number of Eisenhower dead.
    But Jews like you DO make laughable, impossible claims for the alleged Einsatzgruppen shootings of Jews, ca. 2,000,000. Of course it depends upon which liar you talk to.
    7. I have already proven that Wiki information is filled with lies. Please pay attention.
    8. Please show us these “documents”. Go ahead. Been there, done that. I await.
    9. There is no proof for your laughable child kidnappings, abductions, otherwise you would have presented it. Wikipedia again, LOL
    And how were they supposedly murdered? In the scientfically impossible gas chambers’?LOL
    Anyone could and did write propaganda about he Germans in WWII.
    Oh, and please show some claimed ‘soap made from Jews’.
    How about the claimed human skin lampshades.
    How about the Treblinka ‘steam chambers’ or the ‘gassings that allowed Jews to walk themselves to the mass graves and jump in. It’s a long list.
    10. You ‘diary’ link does not work. But I do note that you cannot show us the actual diary, Oops! .No, not someone’s fake & supposed ‘translation. Please show us the actual diary & page / s which actually say what’s alleged. Silence.

    • 回复: @Franklin Ryckaert
  336. @Mefobills

    Absolutely key point.:

    Every time there is a war, there is a burst of new loan activity, and M2 (the broad money supply) increases.

    Wars, and even the threat of wars, invariably cause inflation, causing many people to lose their property while the money printers, and those with access to stronger foreign capital get to buy it for fire sale prices. This happened to the Germans who saw a certain set of greaseballs getting rich off of their losses and understandably resented it.

    I’ll try to add the insert more tag here, but neither that nor the edit functions work for me on this site. Let’s see

    [更多]

    Historian Sir Arthur Bryant summarizes Jewish power in pre-1933 Germany. I have edited this slightly for brevity, omitting the ellipses:

    It was the Jews with their international affiliations and their hereditary flair for finance who were best able to seize such opportunities. They did so with such effect that, even in November 1938, after five years of anti-Semitic legislation and persecution, they still owned, according to the Times correspondent in Berlin, something like A THIRD OF THE REAL PROPERTY OF THE REICH.

    Most of it came into their hands during the inflation.

    But to those who had lost their all, this bewildering transfer seemed a monstrous injustice. After prolonged sufferings they had now been deprived of their last possessions. They saw them pass into the hands of strangers, many of whom had not shared their sacrifices and who cared little or nothing for their national standards and traditions.

    The Jews obtained a wonderful ascendancy in politics, business and the learned professions, in spite of constituting LESS THAN ONE PERCENT OF THE POPULATION.

    The banks, including the Reichsbank and the big private banks, were practically controlled by them. So were the publishing trade, the cinema, the theatres and a large part of the press — all the normal means, in fact, by which public opinion in a civilized country is formed. The largest newspaper combine in the country with a daily circulation of four millions was a Jewish monopoly. Every year it became HARDER AND HARDER FOR A GENTILE TO GAIN OR KEEP A FOOTHOLD IN ANY PRIVILEGED OCCUPATION.

    At this time it was not the ‘Aryans’ who exercised racial discrimination. It was a discrimination that operated without violence. It was EXERCISED BY A MINORITY AGAINST A MAJORITY.
    There was no persecution, only elimination. It was the contrast between the wealth enjoyed — and lavishly displayed—by aliens of cosmopolitan tastes, and the poverty and misery of native Germans, that has made anti-Semitism so dangerous and ugly a force in the new Europe.

    Beggars on horseback are seldom popular, least of all with those whom they have just thrown out of the saddle.

    Sir Arthur Bryant, Unfinished Victory (1940), emphasis added. The above comment was not written by me but I cannot find the source. my apologies to the author.

  337. Wally 说:
    @David In TN

    “And just what did it “prevent?” ”

    The planned Soviet attack.

    尝试阅读文章。

    • 回复: @David In TN
  338. @Iris

    Sweet summary there, Iris! Douglas Reed would be proud and both of you are correct.

  339. AnonFromTN 说:
    @Sergey Kriger

    Some people would believe anything that agrees with their agenda, even things they’d have trouble believing in Salt Lake City. Naturally, Nazi apologists would believe that Suvorov character, or even the voices they here in a lunatic asylum.

  340. @Sergey Kriger

    Well, the gap was closed. The rest does not worth to be discussed.

    It’s worth discussing if only to illustrate what lying, thieving, murdering SOBs “Allied” politicians and banksters were, and the hypocrisy and mendacity of the standard mythology because the world today is still suffering because of what those psychopaths did, and it will never have a chance to be mitigated until people understand what those sleazeballs have been up to for decades if not millennia.

  341. Wally 说:
    @Andrew E. Mathis

    No, they were not shot for being communists.

    You have no proof they were.

    http://www.codoh.com

    • 回复: @Andrew E. Mathis
  342. @Mefobills

    The concentration camps were modeled on the English camps used during the Boer war.

    Brits even ran concentration camps in Kenya during the 1960s, the scum! The US attempted the same in Vietnam when they herded people into designated centers complete with curfews and called it “pacification. ”

  343. Seraphim 说:
    @j2

    You may notice that sooner or later the most unrestrained apologists of the USSR paradise disclose their ‘nomenklaturist’ background.

    • 同意: byrresheim
    • 回复: @Beefcake the Mighty
  344. RobinG 说:
    @Iris

    So what? Your best is no April Glaspie. The analogy with Saddam still poor (at best).

    • 回复: @Iris
  345. RI 说:
    @jacques sheete

    May be you both should realize that both Germany and Soviet Union during that time were a threat to the said international power, although in somewhat different manner. This would explain why they were pushed to fight each other.

    • 同意: Iris
    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  346. @j2

    Sophistry. You can twist it as much as you like. But relying on what souvorov wrote is a sign of poor defence studies level in Finland. No wonder you do not laugh.

  347. L.K 说:
    @AnonFromTN

    Spoken like the intellectual fraud, pathetic propagandist that you are.

    You should take your own advice, prick; those who live in glass houses should not throw stones…

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
    , @AnonFromTN
  348. L.K 说:
    @Iris

    Yes, he’s a Russian who immigrated to the ZUS or Canada or something. Since he is such a great patriot, perhaps he should live in Russia…

    Anyways, your logic is really BAD; The fact that he is Russian doesn’t make it okay for him to be a disgusting LIAR.

    Furthermore, my father’s family is German and i have close relatives, like my grandfather, who fought or otherwise suffered trough the war.

    I don’t like it one bit that I have been lied to and indoctrinated via WW2 propaganda. Actually even most WW1 history is the victor’s propaganda as well.

    The moment I finally figured it out, it really pissed me off.

    • 回复: @Iris
    , @jacques sheete
  349. L.K 说:
    @Iris

    It is common knowledge among us “Nazi apologists” that the Nazi regime was vastly funded by large American corporations, such as General Electric, ITT, Standard Oil, all acting on behalf of the Wall Street and London-based financial oligarchy controlling them

    Not true at all!

    The Myth of the Big Business-Nazi Axis by Kerry R. Bolton
    http://www.inconvenienthistory.com/7/3/3434

    一些根据在德国的商业关系而被认为是“亲纳粹”的华尔街名人也在鼓动对德开战的人中。 根据国际法,德国在整个战争期间以信托方式持有外国企业。 与国际资本有着令人信服的联系的人 Hjalmar Schacht 于 1939 年被解除了所有职位,并最终被关进了集中营。 那些确实向纳粹党提供资金的德国商人是在相对较晚的时间这样做的,并且在德国传统中具有民族主义情绪,与英国自由贸易学校的自身利益相异。 即使是那些本可以合理地预期基于意识形态理由为 NSDAP 提供资金的外国商人,主要是亨利福特,也没有这样做,而是不断提出相反的指控。

    第三帝国是一个命令经济,企业高管成为他们公司的“受托人”,受国家监督。 NSDAP 的前提是:“在个人利益之前的共同利益”在整个政权中得到维护。 股息和利润在很大程度上受到限制。 虽然人们普遍认为希特勒违背了 NSDAP 计划的“社会主义”原则,但该政权确实在双边贸易和非正统融资方式的使用方面进行了广泛的行动。 国际资本的阴谋,包括那些据称是亲德的,都是为了战争,特别是如果不能说服德国恢复正统的贸易和金融方式的话。 战争发生在沙赫特被免职的同一年。

    • 回复: @Iris
    , @j2
  350. The reason Operation Barbarossa was as successful as it was is because the USSR was in an offensive position in Eastern Europe and was vulnerable to an attack. If the USSR was in a defensive position in depth, they would have ground the Wehrmacht into dust. However, after achieving their initial successes, the Wehrmacht split up their forces to go to Leningrad and Caucasia (and Stalingrad). If they would have concentrated their forces directed at Moscow, they could have beaten the USSR back, because all of the USSR’s railways led to Moscow, and if they were cut off there, the USSR would not be able to transport their troops and armaments to the front, and the Wehrmacht would have had free reign to mop up Easter Europe.

  351. Iris 说:
    @RobinG

    “The analogy with Saddam still poor (at best)”.

    I will make it clearer. The Nazi party was funded by the corporate and financial elite of the Anglo-Saxon world.

    During his Nuremberg trial, the former Reichsbank President and Minister of the Economy Hjalmar Schacht proposed to put on the dock those who fed the 3rd Reich, such as companies American General Motors and General Electrics, as well as the manager of the Bank of England Montagu Norman himself. He was swiftly acquitted.

    Hitler was no fool: it must have been extremely emboldening to be supported by the heavyweights of Western industry, all backed by the all-powerful tribal banking oligarchy who had its own plan: a giant wealth grabbing military base in Palestine.

    In the real world, Robin, finance and large corporations control the politicians, not the other way round.

    • 回复: @L.K
  352. @Seraphim

    Yes. Team Russia is every bit as idiotic as Team America.

  353. L.K 说:

    The Saker, despite his obvious very pro-Russian feelings, worked out the basics of the problem( WW2 “history” )

    难道纳粹的真正罪行不是他们是种族灭绝的疯子,而是他们输掉了二战,他们的(同样是种族灭绝的)敌人必须写下那场战争的历史?

    No wonder hard core Stalinist fanatics, like the pest SerGay Kriger, hate the guy.

  354. L.K 说:
    @Iris

    The Nazi party was funded by the corporate and financial elite of the Anglo-Saxon world

    Why are you still repeating this nonsense?

  355. Iris 说:
    @L.K

    “The moment I finally figured it out, it really pissed me off.”

    Likewise. The constant bashing of the German people on the basis of deliberate fabrications which are beyond common sense, such the impossible gas chambers, all to extract filthy “reparation” money from the entire world and to have free rein to torture Palestinians, sickens me to death.

    But ethnic Russians are not the ones playing that game. They have lost between 22 to 24 million people in WW2; this tragedy has had a genuine and profound impact on their worldview.

    Germans have lost 8 to 9 million people, an utter devastation of innocent civilians gratuitously murdered in aerial bombings, which is not even recognised to the day.

    On the other hand, how many within the warmongering members of AIPAC, ADL, CRIF have really lost a family member in WW2?

  356. Iris 说:
    @L.K

    Anthony Sutton’s “Wall Street and the rise of Hitler” is packed with facts and figures, and backed with over 70 references. I’ll stick with Sutton.

  357. @Wally

    We can at least agree they were shot, can’t we?

    And if we can, perhaps you can say what exactly they were shot for?

    • 回复: @Wally
  358. Curmudgeon 说:
    @CK

    Paratroopers are offensive only. Setting up your military in offensive formations is not defensive. Breaching your own defensive fortifications is not defensive.
    Using horses for your supply line transport is hardly an efficient way to keep up with a rapidly advancing army, Given they need to rest and be fed and watered.
    Germany began re-arming because itwas the only country to have met its obligations of dis-armament under the Treaty of Versailles. None of the others were anywhere close to halfway dis-armed.
    Meanwhile in Britain, the development and increased manufacture of long range bombers since 1937 cannot be seen as defensive.
    All wars are economic wars. A prosperous Germany that had cut the bonds of the international banking cartel, had to be destroyed. Whether by the Eastern Communist Bolshevik Jews or the Western Communist Bankster Jews was irrelevant.

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  359. Sparkon 说:
    @refl

    So Stalin placed those obsolete tanks as cannon fodder for the Gernans? But why would he sacrifice them together with some 3 million soldiers who simply vanished on the front in that desastrous [sic] first half year?

    Because the spilled blood from an enemy attack, especially a surprise attack, is a primary ingredient and catalyst of patriotism. Even many if not most Ukrainians rallied behind Stalin after the Germans attacked, and they’d previously hated him with a passion because of the Holodomor.

    Millions of Russians, Ukrainians, Kazakhs and other Soviet nationalities were starved to death as a direct result of Stalin’s ruthless and brutal collectivization. I don’t recall and can’t find any instance where he registered any sympathy, remorse, or regret about all the dead peasants, Kulaks, and NEPmen, nor do I find it difficult to accept that he would sacrifice millions more Red Army soldiers if it suited his purpose.

    Modern tanks comprised a small but growing part of the Red Army’s armored force at the outset of Barbarossa.

    By 22 June 1941, the Red Army deployed almost 1,000 T-34 and over 500 KV tanks, concentrated in five of their twenty-nine mechanized corps. By the end of December 1941, they had lost 2,300 T-34 and over 900 KV tanks, accounting for 15% of the 20,500 tanks lost that year.

    There were 967 T-34s and 508 KVs deployed: Erickson 1962/2001, p. 567.

    —维基百科

    In 1941 the Red Army lost about 17,500 tanks that were not either T-34 or KV , and virtually all of these must have been obsolete types like the T-26, although that light tank remained in service for much of the war.

    On 1 June 1941, the Red Army had 10,268 T-26 light tanks of all models on their inventories, including armoured combat vehicles based on the T-26 chassis. T-26s composed the majority of the fighting vehicles in the Soviet mechanised corps of the border military districts.

    (我的粗体)

    In like fashion, Roosevelt baited the Japanese by stationing several obsolete battleships at Pearl Harbor, and failed also to provide any intelligence to the Pearl Harbor commanders Adm. Kimmel and Gen. Short, even though FDR knew about the approaching Imperial Japanese Navy carrier strike force. He was prepared to let the Japanese attack succeed in order to get the U.S. into the war.

    After the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor, Adolf Hitler announced Germany’s declaration of war on the United States in a speech to the Reichstag on Dec. 11, 1941. Among Hitler’s mistakes, this was a another big one, standing alongside his failure to destroy or capture the BEF the preceding year, knock England out of the war, and Barbarossa itself.

    Hitler announces the declaration of war against the United States to the Reichstag on 11 December 1941

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  360. @RobinG

    Germany was goaded into war because German industrialisation and expansion threatened to cut into the Anglo Zionist hegemony and taking control of Russia was essential to complete the heartland aspect of McKinder’s Great Game. The idea was that they would smash one another to pieces.

    I’m sure you’ve heard such expressions as “all wars are economic”, “all wars are banker’s wars” and “Give me control of a nation’s money and I care not who makes the laws” Right?

    • 同意: Iris
    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  361. @Thorfinnsson

    The genius of Mr and Mrs Cleese at it’s best. Perception is often said to be reality and never more so than in humour. If the real explanation of who started the war were used then the punchline would run to a couple of volumes and wouldn’t nearly be quite as punchy.

    That’s a really good example of how popular culture is used to reinforce propagandistic mythology.

  362. @RI

    May be you both should realize that both Germany and Soviet Union during that time were a threat to the said international power, although in somewhat different manner.

    毫无疑问!

    Nothing like setting two against each other and profiting immensely no matter the outcome. Let them beat one another silly to the point of exhaustion, then walk in and grab what you can. It’s apparent to me that the Brit empire, especially, was very adept at that game.* They pulled similar stunts in Algeria and Eastern Africa, which are great examples of their mastery of the game. Very clever, but also very dastardly. Sick stuff too.

    Did you see the Arthur Bryant quote I posted above?

    • 回复: @RI
  363. @L.K

    He’s nothing more than a hot headed, opinionated amateur. No doubt gets a big kick out of hearing himself braying senselessly.

    • 回复: @David In TN
  364. AnonFromTN 说:
    @L.K

    Wow! My words are being quoted, like classical literature. Sorry, I am neither Shakespeare nor Dickens. Wrong field.

  365. @L.K

    I don’t like it one bit that I have been lied to and indoctrinated via WW2 propaganda. Actually even most WW1 history is the victor’s propaganda as well.

    The moment I finally figured it out, it really pissed me off.

    I have no ties to Germany, but I share the same feelings. I loathe the fact that I was suckered for decades, and when I figured out how badly the Germans were made to suffer for no reason, I’m beyond appalled. I’m even beyond bitter.

    And when I see that the same type of crap goes on even today, I’m filled with unspeakable contempt for the perps.

    • 同意: Beefcake the Mighty
  366. @Curmudgeon

    A prosperous Germany that had cut the bonds of the international banking cartel, had to be destroyed.

    是的。

    Given the events taking place today, that should be completely obvious.

  367. I do agree,that there was no good guys in WWII . How ever Mr Weber states – ” WHY GERMANY ATTACKED THE SOVIET UNION !!!

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  368. @Sparkon

    He was prepared to let the Japanese attack succeed in order to get the U.S. into the war.

    He even attempted to get the Japanese to fire the first shot and to get the Philippines behind him by sending a US officer and a Filipino crew with a tiny ship as a decoy, on a suicide mission to the South China Sea (I believe). They were waiting to ship out from Manila Bay when the attack on PH occurred. The boat was called the Lanikai.

    In early December 1941 in the Philippines, a young Navy ensign named Kemp Tolley was given his first ship command, an old 76-foot schooner that had once served as a movie prop in John Ford’s “The Hurricane.” Crewed mostly by Filipinos who did not speak English and armed with a cannon that had last seen service in the Spanish-American War, the Lanikai was under top-secret presidential orders to sail south into waters where the Japanese fleet was thought to be. Ostensibly the crew was to spy on Japanese naval movements, but to Tolley it was clear that their mission was to create an incident that would provoke war.

    Cruise of the Lanikai: Incitement to War by Kemp Tolley.

  369. @Wally

    LOL. The German attack in 1941 sure “prevented” the Russians from taking Berlin in 1945.

    • 回复: @Wally
  370. @jacques sheete

    You obviously get a big kick out of hearing yourself braying senselessly.

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  371. Miggle 说:
    @Wally

    Read Bernt Engelmann, 在希特勒的德国。

    And read Paul Brickhill, 大逃亡。

    • 回复: @Wally
  372. Miggle 说:
    @RobinG

    I don’t understand. What’s bizarre? In what way? Wild, insane propaganda is being whipped up against Maduro. We will no doubt soon learn, or soon be told, that Maduro has WMDs.

    You want to tell us about the Stolypin cars in Venezuela?

  373. @Wally

    “The Nazis kidnapped some 250,000 children for Germanization purposes – some 220,000 from Poland, many of whom were sent to Austria.After the war only 25,000 Polish children kidnapped by the Nazis were able to return to their parents.

    During the mass deportation of Poles from Zamojszczyzna, Polish children were classified by Nazi experts from the Main Office for Race and Resettlements. A file was set up for of each child with three fotos and with an expert evaluation ether positive or negative, from the racial point of view for the procreation in Germany. The children who were not acceptable were poisoned and on their death certificates pneumonia was listed as the cause of death. The poisoning was administered by the Mediznische Kinderleilanstalt department “B” in Lubiniec.”

    Source : Polish News : Polish children kidnapped by Nazi government – Polish News.com

    Were those 25,000 Polish children who were able to return to their parents, all lying ?

    I have discussed this matter with Carolyn Yeager, and again she didn’t deny it, but even tried to justify it.

    As for absurd claims of the ways the Nazis killed Jews in the concentration camps, I never mentioned them and I don’t believe them. You are projecting.

    • 回复: @Wally
    , @Wally
  374. Crimson2 说:

    Fuck this Nazi apologist bullshit. You losers think this is gonna work?

    • 回复: @Byrresheim
  375. RobinG 说:

    Bizarre = comparing Maduro to Stalin, who really was a thug. You were making a joke, of course. Do you imagine that 80 years from now, Capitalist apologists will insist that Brazil attacked Venezuela because Maduro was massing troops on the border? Hahaha. (Is this proving the failure of analogies?)

    • 回复: @Miggle
  376. fnn 说:

    A good book on the period leading up to WW2 is The European Jungle , by Englishman F. Yeats-Bown:
    https://archive.org/details/BrownYeatsEuropeanJungle

  377. RI 说:
    @jacques sheete

    By the way, the article we are commenting on, can serve as one of the openings of another setting against each other. Again. Just like before. Germans were made to believe that Soviets are going to attack them and Soviets were made to believe that Germans are going to attack them. Germans blinked first and made their suicidal/homicidal move. Great effort was put to achieve this.
    Again white people of Europe and European descent will vanish. Can we/you/ they understand this and stop fighting each other?

    In which post is the quote?

    • 同意: Iris
    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  378. Wally 说:
    @Franklin Ryckaert

    你的意思是:
    https://www.polishnews.com/polish-children-kidnapped-by-nazi-government
    – LOL. That’s your proof? Something that has no substantiation whatsoever.
    – Who was put on trial for the alleged “kidnappings”? Where?
    – Show us what necessarily would have been a mountain of German documents. You cannot.
    – It’s one simple minded guy looking for acclaim and cash making by stuff up.
    – Mentioned in the hilarious article was shyster Richard Lukas, see him shot down at: https://codoh.com/search/?sorting=relevance&q=richard+lukas
    – You ask:
    “Were those 25,000 Polish children who were able to return to their parents, all lying ?”
    I haven’t seen the verbatim text of what they all claim. Please produce it.
    – you said: “As for absurd claims of the ways the Nazis killed Jews in the concentration camps, I never mentioned them and I don’t believe them. You are projecting.”
    Except what I told you is from “eyewitnesses & survivors” statements, Nuremberg, & Jew publications. LOL
    – So now you’re telling that Jews were not gassed, yet you believe in the ‘holocaust’ storyline? LOL
    – So now you’re telling that Nuremberg was a fraud? Yet you defend it.
    – You’re telling me that “eyewitnesses & survivors” are liars? But you belive in them.
    – And your misuse of the word ‘projection’ is hilarious. Did you graduate from high school?
    – I see you still dodge numerous points of information I posted here that shred your dumb ‘Table Talk claims in my comment #171. Of course Yeager doesn’t deny that there are table talk notes, neither do I. But what you and other propagandists claim was said was not said and you cannot prove they were.
    – Show us the alleged human remains of millions upon millions in allegedly known locations.
    – Tell us how the nazi gas chambers supposedly worked.

  379. Wally 说:
    @Franklin Ryckaert

    Here you go it’s in print and must be true.

    “德国人用原子弹杀死了20,000名犹太人”哈哈

    更多信息:
    “纳粹用神奇的原子弹杀死了犹太人……”
    https://forum.codoh.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1150

    • 回复: @Franklin Ryckaert
  380. Wally 说:
    @Miggle

    IOW, you did not read those and can’t even quote sources from them.

    Here you go, books on witchcraft, so witchcraft must be true.
    https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1-d&q=books+on+witchcraft

  381. Wally 说:
    @David In TN

    But as Hitler said, it was a risk they had to take.

    请阅读讨论中的文章。

    http://www.codoh.com

  382. Wally 说:
    @Andrew E. Mathis

    Communists were not shot.

    You have no proof they were.
    Just like you have no proof for your beloved ‘holocaust’.
    啊。

    http://www.codoh.com

    • 回复: @Andrew E. Mathis
  383. Byrresheim 说:
    @Crimson2

    Truth sometimes prevails.
    So why not give it a try?

  384. Miggle 说:
    @RobinG

    The Unspeakablyevil States of America are telling us that Maduro really is a thug. It’s official. He’s a thug.

    It’s your scheme is it, that Capitalist apologists will insist that it wasn’t the U.S.A., it was Brazil that attacked Venezuela?

  385. j2 说:
    @Thorfinnsson

    “I didn’t mention the Polish land grab”

    and that also was a disputed area. both Poland and Czechoslovakia were created after the WWI and both claimed that small piece of land. Czechoslovakia occupied it was it 1919 or 1920 when Poland was in a war with Ukraine. Creating nation of states after empires collapse usually results into land disputes.

  386. j2 说:
    @L.K

    “Some Wall Street luminaries who are supposed to have been “pro-Nazi” on the basis of business affiliations in Germany were among those agitating for war against Germany.”

    Nobody claims that Wall Street luminaries were pro-Nazi. That is a trick that the debunkers invariably use: first they change the claim to a false one, then they argue that the opponent supports the false version of the claim, and then they debunk the false claim.

    The correct claim is that some Wall Street luminaries funded the armament of Germany and helped Hitler to prepare for the war. That means that these luminaries were pro-war, being themselves far away. Assuming that the reason for international finance to want this war was to move European Jews to Palestine, then these luminaries were pro-Zionism.

    Your quote mentions Henry Ford, who published articles on the Jewish conspiracy. Ford was a Freemason and Freemasons are almost all pro-semites. Because of this apparent contradiction, I think that Ford created antisemitism in order to push Jews to Palestine as that was the goal of all this antisemitism by Theosophists and other Masonic circles. Hitler admired Ford and gave him a medal, but Ford was not pro-Nazi to my knowledge. There were some business relations, preparations for wars usually create business opportunities, but the main help Ford gave to the war was to spread antisemitism, assuming that the Masonic/Zionist goal of the war was the creation of Israel.

    You make a similar false debunking of a claim as when people argue that how could bankers be pro-Communists as Communists were the arch enemies of capitalists, yet bankers like Jacob Schiff funded the Communist revolution. There is no conflict here once you understand that they are not pro one system or another system as long as it is far away but there is money to be made on catastrophes, wars and revolutions, and they had their own project of creating a new country.

    • 回复: @Iris
  387. @jacques sheete

    But I wonder how the almighty military industrial complex and the bankers will make money from wars if the one world government of the JWorld Order the ZOGs are planning takes over.

    Anyway for a break from dwelling on the past, here’s some good news just in:

    https://www.counter-currents.com/2019/03/populism-triumphs-in-the-netherlands/

    This speech should cheer most up. Not all is lost yet, history marches on. Keep on debating this WWII, just don’t bloody repeat it!

    • 回复: @Beefcake the Mighty
  388. This German Documentary gives the viewer the German perspective and not the standard western propaganda regarding the events that lead to WWII. The Poles were not innocent according to this film. I have never believed the Western version of events.

  389. @沃利

    If you still believe that the Nazi plan to colonize Eastern Europe with Germans (whether that plan was called “Generalplan Ost” or not) is nothing but a “Wikipedia Lie”, then please go to : Generalplan Ost : Fact or Fiction – Stormfront.
    On page 2 of that article you will find many quotations from no other than Hitler himself to the effect that he wanted to colonize Poland, Russia, the Ukraine, the Baltic states and even Czecho-Slovakia. These quotes come from David Irving’s book 希特勒的战争, so unless Irving is “part of the plot to smear Hitler”, there you have the proof you demanded. You cannot get around this !

    • 回复: @Beefcake the Mighty
    , @Wally
  390. @David In TN

    You obviously get a big kick out of hearing yourself braying senselessly.

    Yes, I do! Hee haww!!! 🙂

    • 哈哈: Beefcake the Mighty
    • 回复: @David In TN
  391. @european born

    How ever Mr Weber states – ” WHY GERMANY ATTACKED THE SOVIET UNION !!!

    Ok. You read the headline.

    Now read the first paragraph. It lists other countries that joined in . If you read a bit further, you’ll discover why they all attacked.:

    Although the two German statements of June 22 portrayed a grave and looming Soviet threat…

    Threat, get it?

  392. @Wally

    It’s a good thing I’m aware of that. Your time is tick, tick, ticking away.

    • 回复: @Wally
  393. @Miggle

    where helping Jews to escape the country

    Who got shot for that? Please try to learn about Nazi-Zionist collaboration. In fact, how can there be much doubt that one of the reasons the Brits wanted to destroy Hitler is that he was supporting the Zionist program in Palestine while the Brits wanted to claim control of the area for themselves?

    They couldn’t have “dem Nazis” meddling on “their” turf, could they?

    • 回复: @Miggle
  394. Cowboy 说:
    @j2

    Perhaps you have paid much more honestly earned taxes into the Finnish socialist system than you and your family have taken out as benefits. I cannot say. I do doubt it though.

    Here is a wiki chart showing “Allophones, i.e. residens with another native language than Finnish, Swedish or Sami, in Finland, 1980-2011, according to Statistics Finland”

    The chart is 8 years out of date, but I would say that Finland was already undergoing an invasion in 2011, and apparently neither you nor any of your pals in the military saw a problem getting paid to “protect” the country while it was going on.

    Which gets to the real issue here: Holocaustianity. You have clearly committed yourself to this new religion in such a fashion that you cannot allow any doubt about the 6 gorillion. Of course you cannot contradict this Talmudic number because if you did you would likely loose all the loot that the socialist state is still shoveling your way.

    https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/7559/finland-migrant-crisis

    The Rape Problem
    With all of Finland’s talk of multiculturalism and immigration, new narratives about the corrosive effects of both multiculturalism and the wave of asylum seekers have surfaced in the media, shocking both the government and the public. News stories discuss the increase in unemployment, the mounting cost of social benefits during the decline of welfare state, problems in educating foreigners, and issues of assimilation with the majority culture, which respects Finnish values and a secular, liberal and open society — all different from traditional Muslim values.

    In Finland, more and more cases of Finnish girls and women being raped by asylum seekers are being widely publicized. Much of Finnish society seems shocked, embarrassed and angry because of the increase in rapes perpetrated by asylum seekers. These crimes have provoked many nationalists, and led to the establishment of a paramilitary movement known as the Soldiers of Odin. Members of the movement view themselves as Finnish patriots, roaming the streets of Finland, protecting against Muslim immigrant offenders.

    Good Job J2, make the Soldiers of Odin voluntarily perform the jobs that you were paid to do, but miserably failed at.

    • 回复: @Beefcake the Mighty
  395. @Commentator Mike

    There will still be wars, as in 1984, they’ll just be euphemistically called police actions or some such crap (which is kinda what they do now anyway).

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  396. @Franklin Ryckaert

    At the end of the day, whatever plans the Germans had to exploit Soviet territories after the war were mainly opportunistic and had nothing to do with the decision to attack.

    • 回复: @Franklin Ryckaert
  397. @Cowboy

    Hey, let us know when the Gatestone Institute has anything to say about things like the Gaysott Act instead of harping 100% on Muslims.

    • 回复: @Iris
  398. Iris 说:
    @j2

    Great comment, J2. Mathematical logics at work is lovely to watch. Best.

    • 回复: @j2
  399. Iris 说:
    @Beefcake the Mighty

    It is so comforting and uplifting to see free minds still exist. People like you make the world a more bearable place to live in.

    • 回复: @Beefcake the Mighty
  400. @Wally

    Strawman. You don’t know my opinion about the Holocaust and assume that I believe all the propaganda, nomatter how ridiculous. FYI, I have read CODOH and am convinced that : 1) There was no plan to exterminate all Jews. At least not in the beginning. The Nazis only wanted to expel the Jews. That’s why the Nazis allowed the Jews to emigrate, had the Madagascar plan and cooperated with the Zionists for Jewish emigration to Palestine (“Haavara agreement”). At the Wannsee conference only “resettlement in the East” was planned. 2) Stories about “gas chambers” were all false. 3) There were no more than 4 million Jews under German control, so 6 million of them could never have been killed, with 3 million “survivors”. However, it is uncontested that millions of Jews were abducted to concentration camps and that millions “did not return”. What happened to them still has never been explained by the revisionists. Carlo Mattogno admits as much. Untill this question is resolved I withhold judgement, but I am prepared to consider the possibility that many of them were “worked to death” *) toward the end of the war when it was clear to the Nazis that all was lost and they wanted to abreact their spite on them. From my country the Netherlands more than 100,000 Jews were abducted and 90% “did not return”. Near the end of the war 400,000 Hungarian Jews were abducted and “did not return” either. Revisionists have no explanation.

    *) For the Nazis being able to “work to death” their captives, see Himmler’s Posen speech.

    • 回复: @Wally
    , @jacques sheete
  401. @RI

    Can we/you/ they understand this and stop fighting each other?

    You are preaching to the choir, my fine friend, so why are you directing your antagonism at only moi?

    The quote in question is at comment #350 at least for now.

    • 回复: @RI
  402. @Beefcake the Mighty

    Right, but during the war Hitler in his Table Talk talked all the time of his plans for Germanic colonization of Slavic lands. If Stalin never had planned to attack Germany, Hitler would have attacked Russia anyway to implement his grandiose plans. To depict Hitler as wholly “innocent”, only bent on defending Germany is disingenuous.

    • 回复: @Wally
    , @Beefcake the Mighty
  403. @Wally

    So you don’t believe that the Kommissarbefehl was real?

    • 回复: @Wally
  404. Wally 说:
    @Andrew E. Mathis

    As usual when beat, you try to change the subject.

    The discussion was about German communists.

    请注意,

  405. Wally 说:
    @Franklin Ryckaert

    Yeah boy, in the midst of a brutal two front war Hitler was going undertake such an endeavor. Hilarious.

    And as I explained, there was now plenty of ‘lebensraum’ via the defeat of Poland had Hitler wanted to.

    Quit digging, you make no sense whatsoever.

    http://www.codoh.com

    • 回复: @Franklin Ryckaert
  406. Ok, you don’t think Ernst Thälmann was shot?

    • 回复: @Wally
  407. Wally 说:
    @Franklin Ryckaert

    1. Please show us the ‘later plan to exterminate the Jews’.
    2.. You’re waking up.
    3. It is uncontested the Japanese-Americans were abducted and put into US concentration camps.
    – Mattogno does not say that.
    – Prove that millions of Jews are missing. Jews say they all to enormous mass graves
    – So please show us the immense human remains that Jews like you say exist in known locations.
    – S. Spielberg admitted that he had to send his crews to SIXTY different countries to interview scamming “survivors”: https://robertfaurisson.blogspot.com/2009/03/alleged-holocaust-of-jews-is-proving.html
    – If you think they are missing then how were they killed?
    推荐的:
    于尔根·格拉夫(Juergen Graf):未登记奥斯威辛集中营的囚徒的命运:

    http://juergen-graf.vho.org/articles/hungarian-holocaust-debate.html
    The Deportation of Hungarian Jews from May to July 1944, by Carlo Mattogno: https://codoh.com/library/document/357/?lang=en
    他们中的大多数被转移出奥斯威辛集中营,从来没有被毒死过。
    J. Graf and the illogical canard: ‘Where did Jews go then?’ / & more’
    https://forum.codoh.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=8272
    WJC的斯蒂芬·怀斯(Stephen Wise)说,1,250,000 – 1,500,000波兰犹太人在欧洲之外的波兰无家可归,第二次世界大战后还活着: https://forum.codoh.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=10191
    战争期间犹太人撤离到苏联: https://archive.is/jA9iI
    More Jews evacuated to USSR during war: https://www.jta.org/1944/02/23/archive/german-lauds-russia-for-joining-intergovernmental-committee-for-refugees
    – Himmler’s Posen speech? You are way behind here.
    You the mean the top secret speech that allegedly recorded? LOL
    You ignored my comment #91 可以在: 美国真理报:大屠杀否认,由Ron Unz撰写: https://www.unz.com/runz/american-pravda-holocaust-denial/

  408. Wally 说:
    @Johnny Rico

    Oh I see. you’re now threatening me because you can’t refute me.

    http://www.codoh.com

    • 回复: @Johnny Rico
  409. @Franklin Ryckaert

    There’s enough dubiousness in Table Talk to warrant skepticism. If you’re referring to Lebensraum, Hitler’s discussion in Mein Kampf (before he was German leader) was not only in line with much German thought at the time, but much more important, took place in the context of the instability of the Russian Civil War and aftermath. Hitler believed that, owing to the Jewish domination of the early Bolshevik leadership, the Soviet Union would degenerate into chaos and offer opportunities for German expansion. Obviously, in 1941 there was no risk of the Soviet government collapsing, and Hitler’s decision to attack was driven by the contingencies he faced at that time, and not some grandiose plan of conquest.

  410. Wally 说:
    @Franklin Ryckaert

    It would have been impossible, there was a massive two front war going on

    If Hitler wanted to “colonize” then why didn’t he? Germany had control of a massive amount of eastern territory for years.

    Khrushchev said “We will bury you.”, did he do it?

    The point of the Weber article is to point out the fact The USSR was planning to invade Germany. Unable to refute that fact you are terribly frustrated.
    It would be easier if you simply showed some integrity by going with that fact rather desperately clinging to your Jews First propaganda.

    • 回复: @Andrew E. Mathis
  411. EugeneGur 说:
    @j2

    His conclusion was that Victor Suhurov was correct.

    A correction – he isn’t Suvorov but Resun. He is a scumbag and has no right to the name Suvorov whatsoever.

    I couldn’t care less what the former President of Finland thinks on the topic, because his opinion is rather predictable. As to supposed professional qualifications of the people you mentioned, well, I’ve noticed that if a person has an agenda, as most of you professor colleagues likely do, it can easily override his professional judgement. I’ve red enough of books written by the Western “general” to know that.

    Resun also has an agenda, so he manipulates facts, theories, rumors, anything to suit his agenda ignoring a mountain of facts that contradicts his “theory”. His number and assertions have been debunked point-by-point so many times, it’s boring.

    These argument against Resun haven’t been presented in the West, because the West isn’t interested in the truth. The West is interested in one thing only: to whitewash the horrendous crimes the Nazis committed on our soil. That effort has been ongoing for many years in Germany and elsewhere. That’s why the West cringes every time we have the Victory Parade or Immortal Regiment, because the scale of the event then becomes plain for everyone to see.

    You, Sir, are a part of that effort. You might sound scientific, count calories, present numbers, but it’s all bogus. Your numbers are bogus (1200 calories a day – a starvation level? don’t make me laugh) and you arguments are ridiculous. Chances are you even know that, for plenty of information is still available in the West in spite of all the efforts to cover it up.

    • 回复: @j2
    , @Beefcake the Mighty
  412. @Wally

    Hitler wanted far more for his 栖息地 than Poland alone.

    Here are some quotes from the article Generalplan Ost : Fact or Fiction – Stormfront :

    (bold and caps by me)

    “…State frontiers are established by human beings and may be changed by human beings…”
    (......)

    “…Therefore we National Socialists have purposely drawn a line through the line of conduct followed by pre-War Germany in foreign policy. We put an end to the perpetual Germanic march towards the South and West of Europe and turn our eyes towards the lands of the East. We finally put a stop to the colonial and trade policy of pre-War times and pass over to the territorial policy of the future.
    But when we speak of new territory in Europe to-day we must principally think of RUSSIA and the border States subject to her…”

    Source : Mein Kampf, Chapter 14 : Germany’s Policy in Eastern Europe.

    “… Turning to the Soviet Union, he addressed these remarkable words to his privileged little audience: ‘The present national [Bolshevik] government in Russia is a danger to us. As soon as the Russians can, they slit the throats of those who have helped them to attain power. That’s why it will be vital to splinter the RUSSIAN EMPIRE and to divide up her territories and soil, TO BE SETTLED BY GERMAN SETTLERS and tilled by the German plough. Then … if we were on good terms with Britain we could solve the French problem without interference from Britain…”

    Source : David Irving 希特勒的战争, Millennium Edition, page 5

    “… Hitler had briefed Heydrich fully on the future of his Protectorate. Heydrich reported this to his local governors in Prague on October 2. One day, he said, the Protectorate would be settled by Germans. ‘This does not mean,’ said Heydrich, ‘that we now have to try to Germanise all Czech rabble. . . For those of good race and good intentions the matter is simple; they will be Germanised. For the rest, those of inferior racial origin or with hostile intentions, I shall get rid of them – there is plenty of room in the east for them.’ Inferior but well-meaning Czechs would probably be sent to work in the Reich. The more difficult category – those of good racial characteristics but hostile intentions – would have to be liquidated.*

    * Hitler had used the same language to Neurath, State Secretary Karl-Hermann Frank, and the minister of justice in September 1940: ‘Czechs turned down on racial grounds or anti-Reich in attitude were not to be assimilated. This category was to be eliminated (sei auszumerzen).’ In conversation over lunch on October 6, 1941 Hitler announced that the Jews in the Protectorate were all to be deported eastward. ‘After this war the Führer proposes to transplant all the racially valueless elements from Bohemia to the east…’

    Source : ibidem, page 442.

    [更多]

    “…Some of Hitler’s quotes on Geralplan Ost

    16 July 1941, Hitler Comments, Conference in Führer Headquarters, in Czesław Madajczyk, ed., Generalny Plan Wschodni: Zbiór dokumentów (Warszawa: Glówna Komisja Badania Zbrodni Hitlerowskich w Polsce, 1990), pp. 61-64.

    On Hitler’s aims in the conquered east: “The CRIMEA must be cleared of all [racially] foreign peoples, as must the parts of 加利西亚 which formerly belonged to the Austrian Empire. …We must make a Garden of Eden out of the newly won eastern territories; this is important for our future existence; [overseas] colonies play a subordinate role. … ALL OF THE BALTIC LANDS MUST BE ANNEXED TO THE REICH. Similarly, the Crimea, with a significant adjoining region (the region north of the Crimea) must become Reich territory. The annexed territory must be as large as possible. … THE REICH MUST ALSO ANNEX THE VOLGA COLONY AND THE AREA AROUND BAKU设立的区域办事处外,我们在美国也开设了办事处,以便我们为当地客户提供更多的支持。“

    D. 17 年 1941 月 69 日,希特勒独白,元首总部,Generalny 的 Madajczyk,第 70-XNUMX 页。

    “The [eastern] region must lose the character of the Asiatic steppe, it must be Europeanized! It is for this purpose that we are building great highways to the southern tip of the Crime and to the Caucasus. German cities established along these roadways will stretch like a string of pearls, and around these will be German settlements. The two or three million people we need [for this program] can be found quicker than we think. We will take them from Germany, the Scandinavian lands, Western Europe, and America. Chances are that I will not live to see this, but in twenty years twenty million people will inhabit this territory. In three hundred years we will have a blossoming parkland of extraordinary beauty..!”

    As for the people indigenous to the area, we will be sure to select those [of importance]. We will remove the destructive Jews entirely. … WE WILL NOT ENTER RUSSIAN CITIES, THEY MUST DIE OUT COMPLETELY.

    There is only one task: GERMANIZATION THROUGH THE INTRODUCTION OF GERMANS [to the area] and to treat the original inhabitants like Indians. … I intend to stay this course with ice-cold determination. I feel myself to be the executor of the will of History. What people think of me at present is all of no consequence. Never have I heard a German who has bread to eat express concern that the ground where the grain was grown had to be conquered by the sword. We eat Canadian wheat and never think of the Indians.”

    Himmler’s comments on the issue

    24 October 1939, Heinrich Himmler: Geheimreden 1933 bis 1945 und andere Ansprachen. Edited by B.F. Smith and A.F. Peterson (Frankfurt/Main: Propyläen Verlag, 1974), pp. 124-125.

    “When we consider the issue [of eastern people], we first have to recognize that we have already long occupied ourselves with the Polish-Slavic problem … then we must clearly conclude, and thus have I received my tasks from the Führer, that in at least in the provinces which currently belong to Germany, the problem of the Polish minority must be solved, it must be eliminated in our lifetime. The problem must be eliminated.

    This is a small piece of Asia into which we have come, and we want to push the borders of Germany still farther to the east; and with that the frontiers of Europe.”

    But “innocent” Hitler only wanted to “defend Germany”, is it not ?

    • 回复: @Franklin Ryckaert
    , @Wally
  413. Matteo 说:
    @Anonymous

    Just read Mein kampf’s last two chapters.

    All had been announced as early as in 1924. Hitler wanted to conquer Germany’s lebensraum eastwards. And he wanted to get rid of most Slav peoples in order to settle millions of Germans and have the other Slavs turned into slaves.

    期间。

    This article is BS. Nazis complaining about totalitarianism is laughable.

    Both nazism and communism are totalitarian. But nazism was genocidal.

    • 回复: @Beefcake the Mighty
    , @Wally
  414. @Franklin Ryckaert

    And don’t tell me : “Hitler didn’t settle the East with Germans, therefore it never was his plan.” He would have to win the war first. Since he lost the war, his plans could not be implemented, but that it still was his plan, his own words prove, and that is all I want to say.

    • 同意: RobinG
    • 回复: @Wally
    , @Wally
  415. @Matteo

    “Period.”

    Wow, that really settles it, I guess.

  416. AnonFromTN 说:

    The title is all wrong. The author should have been consistent: he should have stated that it only appeared that Germany attacked the Soviet Union, and tell that the Soviet Union attacked Germany. In the 21st century we’d be told that Stalin had WMDs.

  417. @j2

    I tried to but can’t resist commenting. My take is different from most.

    Why should the Soviet army have taken defensive positions? After all Nazi Germany and Soviet Russia were allies and Stalin never expected that attack until Hitler stabbed him in the back. Stalin had reasons to fear that Britain and France may declare war on the Soviet Union once he also invaded Poland. Britain was on its own and France occupied by the time of Operation Barbarossa but why should Stalin have moved his troops into defensive positions? It makes sense that Soviet troops were in forward positions in case the allies declared war on them too as they did on Nazi Germany for invading Poland so that they could move in to assist German troops, and not to invade Europe on their own account. And there could have been other reasons why Soviets expected to receive a declaration of war from the allies (or just Britain at some point) instead of from Germany. They had been supplying Nazi Germany with resources for its war effort and most of German imports were from the Soviet Union after the Molotov- Ribbentrop Pact was signed. But even long before that, the Soviet Union was actively helping Germany to beat the limitations on its armaments imposed by the Versailles Treaty through joint military industries and training programmes. Sure Churchill was egging Stalin on to attack Hitler but then Stalin had a treaty with Hitler he was sticking to until the Nazis broke it with their surprise attack. And maybe it wasn’t much of a surprise to Stalin as plans were underway since the previous year but perhaps he still expected to partner up with Hitler in that war if he couldn’t stay out of it.

    https://warontherocks.com/2016/06/sowing-the-wind-the-first-soviet-german-military-pact-and-the-origins-of-world-war-ii/

    • 回复: @Beefcake the Mighty
    , @j2
  418. @Wally

    He did. What do you think Heim ins Reich was?

    • 回复: @Wally
  419. j2 说:
    @EugeneGur

    “Your numbers are bogus (1200 calories a day – a starvation level? don’t make me laugh) and you arguments are ridiculous”

    That is the number of calories that according to one source I found were given to POWs (Russian) in Finnish POW camps. It is low for a young man (conscript soldier) who has to work, POWs did work, while it is much above the metabolic limit.

    German captured very many Russian POWs and made great advance in the beginning of the war. That alone makes the claim almost obvious. Had the troops been in defense in depth, the war had looked different.

    I have no agenda and I do not defend Nazis. Instead of whitewashing Nazis, I think they in reality were ZioNazis with a mission of pushing Jews to Palestine and the millions of dead that were the result of it were a part of the plan, as was the war with all the dead and destruction.

    Finns do not try to whitewash Nazi deeds. Finland did not do major war crimes in that war and most probably it could not have stayed outside the war even if Finland had not joined Germany. Either Germany of the Soviet Union would have attacked to Finland in that case. The Soviet Union did quite enough crimes, which were whitewashed for a long time.

    Did my professor colleagues have an agenda? This topic is war history, not operational art and tactics. Yet, many war archives are kept secret and the full truth is often not told. During the time of the Soviet Union Finns tried to avoid mentioning anything that would cause a negative reaction from the Soviet Union. There were also issues that were not mentioned because they conflicted with what the politicians wanted to claim. One such thing I mentioned: there were offensive general staff war games in April-May 1941. Now this information is not secret, for a long time it was, as our politicians wanted to claim that Finland drifted to the war. Fortunately that time passed and it is more open today. I am not a historian and cannot know what is still hidden, though I am certain that not all archives e.g. in Russia are opened.

    I heard about this Koivisto’s study on this issue maybe 13-14 years ago from the head of research during a coffee break. I did not pay much attention to it at that time and maybe no name was mentioned, but it was a Russian claim that Soviet troops were in attack positions in June 1941. As for historical research, it is not taking somebody’s book and believing it. It is going to the war archives and finding documents and trying to interpret them correctly. Maybe your Resun is a poor researcher, but you can take for granted that nobody’s claim is accepted without checking and evaluating it from sources. Soviet data was so very often false and the initial assumption is never to believe anything without checking it.

    “You, Sir, are a part of that effort. You might sound scientific, count calories, present numbers, but it’s all bogus. Your numbers are bogus (1200 calories a day – a starvation level? don’t make me laugh) and you arguments are ridiculous.”

    Fine, next time I will use the Russian top research method and ask if Sergei’s officer dad has heard of some disputed topic and it not, then the topic does not exits. You know, the father knows everything. Nice that you still have such good sons who trust their fathers.

    • 回复: @EugeneGur
  420. @Commentator Mike

    Why should the Soviets have taken defensive positions? Is this a serious question? But LOL @ the standard “Stalin naively trusted Hitler” line. Maybe you are being serious.

    • 回复: @L.K
  421. Wally 说:
    @Andrew E. Mathis

    Of course treason / attempting to overthrow any government is usually considered grounds for execution.
    Yet Germany did wait 11 years.

    That’s it? A treasonous operative is all you have?

    No doubt you’ll try trotting out the homosexual nonsense and gas chambers next.

    http://www.codoh.com

    • 回复: @Andrew E. Mathis
  422. @EugeneGur

    You are right that it’s ridiculous how the Americans in particular ignore the SOVIET (not Russian) war effort, and grotesquely exaggerate their (American) role in defeating Nazi Germany. But the Russian cult of victory is just that: a cult. Truly pathetic. Yeah, your grandfathers were cannon fodder. Well done!

  423. canusee [AKA "whathavewehere"] 说:

    They “shoot communists don’t they?”

    Er – actually, they shot communists – absolutely the Germans did.

    Here’s the “Commissar Order” – originally issued verbally by Hitler in March 1941 to the German military staff (as noted by Halder), but which became a “top secret” order issued by the military command on June 6th 1941 (i.e. but a few days before the invasion of the Soviet Union – Barbarossa – kicked off):

    6年1941月XNUMX日

    Guidelines for the Treatment of Political Commissars

    In the battle against Bolshevism, the adherence of the enemy to the principles of humanity or international law is not to be counted on. In particular the treatment of those of us who are taken prisoner in a manner full of hatred, cruelty and inhumanity can be expected from the political commissars of every kind as the real pillars of opposition.

    The troops must be aware that:
    1. In this battle mercy or considerations of international law with regard to these elements is false. They are a danger to our own safety and to the rapid pacification of the conquered territories.

    2. The originators of barbaric, Asiatic methods of warfare are the political commissars. So immediate and unhesitatingly severe measures must be undertaken against them.

    They are therefore, when captured either in battle or offering resistance, as a matter of routine to be dispatched by firearms.
    ...

    2. …Political commissars as agents of the enemy troops are recognizable from their special badge—a red star with a golden woven hammer and sickle on the sleeves…. They are to be separated from the prisoners of war immediately, i.e. already on the battlefield. This is necessary, in order to remove from them any possibility of influencing the captured soldiers.

    These commissars are not to be recognized as soldiers; the protection due to prisoners of war under international law does not apply to them. When they have been separated, they are to be finished off.

    • 回复: @Wally
    , @Hippopotamusdrome
  424. Wally 说:
    @Andrew E. Mathis

    You mean Germans returning to their land that was lost after WWI and the already German regions like the Sudetenland.

    • 回复: @Andrew E. Mathis
  425. canusee 说:

    Historical documents sure are fun:

    Führer Headquarters,
    11th六月1941。
    9 draft copies

    Directive No. 32
    Preparations for the period after ‘Barbarossa’

    A. After the destruction of the Soviet Armed Forces, Germany and Italy will be military masters of the European Continent—with the temporary exception of the Iberian Peninsula. No serious threat to Europe by land will then remain. The defence of this area, and foreseeable future offensive action, will require considerably smaller military forces than have been needed hitherto.

    The main efforts of the armaments industry can be diverted to the Navy and Air Force.

    Closer co-operation between Germany and France should and will tie down additional English forces, will eliminate the threat from the rear in the North African theatre of war, will further restrict the movements of the British Fleet in the Western Mediterranean and will protect the south-western flank of the

    European theatre, including the Atlantic seaboard of North and West Africa, from Anglo-Saxon attack.

    In the near future Spain will have to face the question whether she is prepared to co-operate in driving the British from Gibraltar or not.

    The possibility of exerting strong pressure on Turkey and Iran improves the prospect of making direct or indirect use of these countries in the struggle against England.

    B. This situation, which will be created by the victorious conclusion of the campaign in the East, can confront the Armed Forces with the following strategic tasks for the late autumn of 1941 and the winter of 1941-42…….

  426. Wally 说:
    @Franklin Ryckaert

    Now you are changing your story yet again.

    First you said Hitler attacked for the purpose of seizing land and settling Germans on this new land.
    After getting shredded on that asinine nonsense you fall back to ‘Well, uh, he would’ve if he could’ve’.
    LOL
    Please show us actual implementation plans drawn up by the Germans.
    After all, such an undertaking would necessarily require major planning and resources.

    我们在等。

    • 回复: @Hippopotamusdrome
  427. j2 说:
    @Commentator Mike

    “Why should the Soviet army have taken defensive positions? After all Nazi Germany and Soviet Russia were allies and Stalin never expected that attack until Hitler stabbed him in the back. Stalin had reasons to fear that Britain and France may declare war on the Soviet Union once he also invaded Poland. Britain was on its own and France occupied by the time of Operation Barbarossa but why should Stalin have moved his troops into defensive positions? It makes sense that Soviet troops were in forward positions in case the allies declared war on them too as they did on Nazi Germany for invading Poland so that they could move in to assist German troops, and not to invade Europe on their own account.”

    OK, you have zero background on operational art and tactics. Great. I will explain the little I know of that topic concerning this your idea. This is very elementary and I write it as for a person who knows nothing of the topic, so do not be irritated in case you know something and just wrote a joke.
    1. Stalin was concentrating forces on the western border. As a rule forces are not concentrated on borders if no military action is the be expected. Any concentration of forces on borders is interpreted as a potential attack threat and if a country does so, it usually informs the neighbor country why it concentrates forces on the border. Thus, when Russia after 1990 increased its forces relatively close to Finland, they informed Finland what they are doing and that is it not for attack purposes. No such explanation was given to Germany, thus the assumption is that the troops are concentrated for an attack.
    2. If the reason for concentrating forces was that Stalin expected Germany to attack and the forces were put there in order to stop the attack, then a logical necessity demands that they were placed in a way that at least theoretically could stop or delay German attack. This was not done: Soviet forces were placed totally incorrectly if they were meant for defense, as was show by the fast German advance and large number of POWs. Instead, they were placed in a logical way if the intention was to attack.
    3. You invented that Stalin wanted to defend against an Allied attack from the West side of Germany, that France and England would overrun whole Germany and West Poland and then come to the division line in Poland with the intention of attacking the Soviet Union. Such a military operation by the Allied would have taken minimum weeks and Stalin would have had enough time to form the defense line. Also in this case Soviet troops should have been in defense in depth, as the Allied power would have been very strong as it overrun Germany so fast.
    4. But maybe you mean that Stalin, as a good friend, would come to Germany’s aid without being asked by Germany. To stop together the Allied attack. To make a friendship and peace agreement. Such unasked help is called an attack. Stalin did offer this kind of help to Finland in 1939.

    I hope this clarifies the problem you have. I was not teaching operational art and tactics and only know what you have to know being ten years reading often very tactical theses of officers. But my students there never asked me to explain such things like you propose. Maybe some of the Russian top military experts here could inform you more deeply on this topic.

  428. j2 说:
    @Iris

    Thanks Iris, but you are always too kind. And thanks for answering my comment why Hitler attacked Poland. As this discussion diverges to some unwanted direction due to deep Russian expertise, I will not comment your answer.

  429. Wally 说:
    @Matteo

    说过:
    “Both nazism and communism are totalitarian. But nazism was genocidal.”

    Please present your proof of Nazim being “genocidal”

    – How did all the alleged victims supposedly die.
    – Where are the claimed immense human remains?

    Also follow my replies to Franklin Ryckaert which debunk the absurd ‘lebensraun / Barbarossa’ claim.

    干杯。

  430. @Wally

    What proof do you have that Thälmann committed treason?

  431. @Wally

    No I mean Germans who had lived for generations in the Baltic states who were relocated to Warthegau and Silesia by agreement of their government with the USSR. Most had never even been to Germany. Don’t you know anything?

  432. Wally 说:
    @Franklin Ryckaert

    – You still talk of he ‘Generalplan Ost’ which I demonstrated did not exist (recall the fake doc.), you later admitted it did it not exist. You’re clearly confused now.
    – You cited: 16 July 1941, Hitler Comments, Conference in Führer Headquarters, in Czesław Madajczyk, ed., Generalny Plan Wschodni: Zbiór dokumentów (Warszawa: Glówna Komisja Badania Zbrodni Hitlerowskich w Polsce, 1990), pp. 61-64.
    For which there are no such German documents to review, only Polish agenda driven propaganda. Please show us the actual German original documents … which do not exist. Ouch!
    – you cited:
    24 October 1939, Heinrich Himmler: Geheimreden 1933 bis 1945 und andere Ansprachen. Edited by B.F. Smith and A.F. Peterson (Frankfurt/Main: Propyläen Verlag, 1974), pp. 124-125.
    Yet you do not show us the actual genuine German text of what Himmler really said.
    False ‘translations” are legion when it comes to NS Germany as CODOH has demonstrated over & over again. So indeed, give us the real, authentic text.
    Recall this fact of Nuremberg: English translations of Russian translations of Polish copies of an alleged German original which cannot be found are typical Nuremberg ‘documents.’
    Imagine trying such nonsense in a real court of law:

    ‘Well your honor we know there are documents which prove our case, but well, uh, we cannot produce them.’ Laughter ensues.

  433. canusee [AKA "historysnotallmakebelieve"] 说:

    [Comments with too much boldface may be trashed instead of published.]

    Hitler’s March 30th 1941 meeting with the German senior military (approx. 200 men).

    …He [Hitler] asserted that, despite Great Britain’s holdout, the war had been won in the West. But time was of the essence. Predicting that in four years America would be ascendant as a military power and threat, Hitler said Germany had to complete its conquest of Europe as quickly as possible. The invasion of the Soviet Union would commence on June 22.

    Then, he [Hitler] dropped his bombshell. Army Chief of the General Staff Gen. Franz Halder, who took notes during Hitler’s lecture, wrote what Hitler next said:

    “The war against Russia will be such that it cannot be conducted in a knightly fashion. This struggle is one of ideologies and racial differences and will have to be conducted with unprecedented, unmerciful, and unrelenting harshness. All officers will have to rid themselves of obsolete ideologies. I know that the necessity for such means of waging war is beyond the comprehension of you generals but . . . I insist absolutely that my orders be executed without contradiction. The commissars are the bearers of ideologies directly opposed to National Socialism. Therefore the commissars will be liquidated. German soldiers guilty of breaking international law . . . will be excused. Russia has not participated in the Hague Convention and therefore has no rights under it.”

    The Wehrmacht senior officers received the full text of Hitler’s Kommissarbefehl, or Commissar Order, the next day and began wrestling with the consequences of the Faustian remilitarization bargain they had made with the Nazis. Captured civilians such as the commissars were to be denied protection under the Geneva Convention and, if possible, executed on the spot…

    • 回复: @Beefcake the Mighty
    , @Wally
  434. Wally 说:
    @canusee

    Please catch up.

    The discussion is about the treatment of 德语 communists, not Soviet Kommisars

    No one questions the Kommisar order.

    Leave it to the desperate to use strawman arguments.

    • 回复: @Andrew E. Mathis
  435. Wally 说:
    @Franklin Ryckaert

    No one questions Hitler’s musings in Mein Kampf about finding living space for Germans.

    But let’s look at the actual date, period of Hitler’s expressions:

    – The British blockade during was still fresh in his mind, hundreds of thousands of Germans had died because of this blockade, a blockade left in place long after hostilities ceased.

    – The industrial Ruhr region was occupied by France.

    – Vast amounts of German land had been stolen via Versailles

    Germany did need living space at that time.

    多得多: https://codoh.com/search/?sorting=relevance&q=lebensraum

  436. @j2

    I understand what you write, but Stalin and Hitler did indeed have an agreement and after both invaded Poland, Stalin too could have expected a declaration of war by the allies in which case his troops would have indeed joined up with Germans, since in such an eventuality it would be ridiculous to expect that Hitler would have objected. Britain and France declared war only on Germany but according to their agreement with Poland they should have also declared war on the Soviet Union, which they didn’t do. But the Soviets continued supplying Germany, and as the reference I quoted states provided Germany with a base for its attack on Norway against the British there, and supplied German submarines. Of course there was mistrust on all sides but it is a fact that Hitler and Stalin had a pact and the Soviets contributed greatly to German rearmament and their war effort until the point that Germany attacked them. These are all facts but how you then interpret them that’s up to you. So they had ideological differences. If this is so important why didn’t the Soviets refuse any cooperation with Germany, military or otherwise, and refuse to supply and assist them in their war against France and Britain?

    If Stalin really wanted war with Hitler then why didn’t he attack as soon as Germans engaged the French and Brits on the western front, but instead wait until France was defeated and the British Expeditionary Force sent back to England, to launch this hypothetical nonsensical attack on Germany you and others here propagate? That would have been the ideal moment to crush Hitler and finish the war far sooner with far fewer casualties. So why wait until Hitler consolidated his rule over occupied Europe and had many more troops and equipment from the conquered nations he sent east in his own attack on Russia? Utterly preposterous and ridiculous thesis. And the answer is that Stalin did not want war with Germany, but if the allies declared war on the Soviet Union because of its own invasion of Poland or its assistance to the German war effort then he would have had to fight on Hitler’s side.

    • 回复: @Beefcake the Mighty
    , @j2
    , @L.K
  437. RI 说:
    @jacques sheete

    Thanks, I am in agreement with Sir Arthur.
    I think that Germans and Russians were (still are) victims of a horrible plot to exterminate each other. And I am preaching this everywhere . And pay the price. I am not a German nor Russian. We should not fall for a similar plot even disguised as a most humanistic and tolerant one.

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  438. @Wally

    Interesting that you admit Soviet commissars were targeted for summary execution. What’s your opinion of that? Was it justified?

  439. @Wally

    Interesting that you find the Generalplan Ost doc not believable but you accept the far less well substantiated Schelegelberger document. It’s almost like you dismiss every document that disproves your case but accept every document that you think does.

  440. Wally 说:
    @canusee

    Given the past horrific actions of the Soviet Army, Hitler knew that the risky but imperative preemptive attack on the USSR would be rough. So what?

    Yes, Soviet Kommisars were to be executed. So what?

  441. @Commentator Mike

    It’s irrelevant what Stalin didn’t do in 1940, which I presume is your scenario. He was doubtless surprised at how quickly France fell and at any rate during this time he was seizing the Baltics (including all of Lithuania, in contravention of the modified Nazi-Soviet pact), and grabbing a piece of Romania. At the end of 194o he sent Molotov to Berlin with further demands, including against the Finns. Presumably at this stage he felt he still had time to pressure the Germans. At any rate the question concerns the situation the Germans faced in the summer of 1941, when they were clearly in a use-it-or-lose-it situation, at a minimum.

  442. L.K 说:
    @Beefcake the Mighty

    Commentator Mike is just another clueless poster who should be doing some actual research instead of posting embarrassing nonsense on the internet.

    • 回复: @Commentator Mike
  443. j2 说:
    @Commentator Mike

    The size of the Soviet army increased from, if I correctly remember, from 2.4 million in 1939 to 5.7 million in 1941. After the war when Soviets unmobilized they had 2.8 million army, so this 2.4 million of 1939 was the peace time army size. Stalin did not have an army to go to the war in 1940, especially as the experiences from Poland and Finland in 1939 showed serious problems in the army. He could not start any attack before summer 1941.

    About this hypothesis that Stalin intended to attack, as said, I am not a historian. I have not checked the archives, and I know that many historians have rejected this theory. However, that does not say much since the main stream historians support the Holocaust story, which according to my calculations (that I did and checked) is impossible. Thus, the thesis of Stalin wanting to attack may very well be true even if the majority of historians reject it. The essential test is not if the majority reject it but are there respectable historians who do not reject it. This seems to be the case. Assuming that the thesis is easily shown wrong, I am quite sure that my professor colleagues would have explained it to president Koivisto, and as they did not, it means that the thesis is at least possible and may well be even probable.

    As this issue is now so much discussed here, I checked the size of Soviet troops in June 1941. They had 2.4 million in the area from the Polish western border to the Black Sea. It is quite irrelevant here that Hitler collected 3.3 million German soldiers to Barbarossa and had numerical superiority. This does not matter as we ask if before Hitler concentrated this force did Stalin have enough troops for an offensive. It depends on where these 2.4 million were, so I cannot answer it. Possibly that is enough, it means that Stalin had over twice the peace time army and very many tanks, though worse quality.

    In the first month Germans took 400,000 POWs from this 2.4 million. That is 12,4%. It does seem very high. Additionally comes 200,000 dead or wounded. I think it indicates that the formation of these troops was not suitable for defense. For a more precise comment on how these troops were placed I have no material. I can only say that apparently it is possible to state that the troops were in offensive positions, as this was the conclusion of Koivisto.

    To your further arguments: Soviets provided military supplies to Germany, why so if they intended to attack? I think both side knew that there would be a war sooner or later, but they made an agreement and to a certain extent followed it. In the German war declaration it is said that Soviets did not fill everything in the agreement, such as e.g. they took over the Baltic states. I do not see any special problem in fulfilling some part of a deal and cheating on some others. People do so, countries do so.

    You ask why Stalin was not a man of principle who never makes hazy deals and if he mistrusted Hitler then why did he at all make a deal with Hitler. It is because he was a smart man, old fox. Men of principle would not become dictators in the Soviet Union, you have to be ready to play.

    I already said why Stalin had to wait. You say that the ideal moment had been in 1940. But if you do not have army in fighting condition, you cannot use this ideal moment.

    I have not carefully looked at this claim of Stalin’s plan to attack. I find that there is enough evidence to consider it possible and maybe probable. I will give one argument why it is probable: Stalin did attack Finland to have, as Russians claimed, Finnish artillery further from Leningrad. I am sure Stalin did not think Finland would attack alone. It would have to be on the German side. Thus, Stalin expected a German attack. As he expected a German attack, it is likely that he did something to stop this attack? Yes, naturally he had to. He increased the army size from 2.4 million to 5.7 million, built lots of tanks, and improved the tactical concepts. It was a better army in 1941 as in 1939. Yet, this improved army lost so much ground in one week. Why? The only reason I can see is that Stalin expected a German attack and was prepared to it, but he was prepared to make the first strike, and that is why he was surprised by the fast German mobilization and that Germany made the first strike.

  444. @Wally

    Here is a passage from the German text of Himmler’s first Posen speech of October 4, 1943 :

    “…Ein Grundsatz muss für den SS-Mann absolut gelten: ehrlich, anständig, treu und kameradschaftlich haben wir zu Angehörigen unseres eigenen Blutes zu sein und sonst zu niemandem. Wie es den Russen geht, wie es den Tschechen geht, ist mir total gleichgültig. Das, was in den Völkern an gutem Blut unserer Art vorhanden ist, werden wir uns holen, indem wir ihnen, wenn notwendig, die Kinder rauben und sie bei uns großziehen......“

    The German verb 劳本 means literally “to rob”. The English text translates with “kidnapping”.

    And here is the English translation :

    “…One basic principle must be the absolute rule for the SS men: We must be honest, decent, loyal and comradely to members of our own blood and to nobody else. What happens to a Russian, to a Czech, does not interest me in the slightest. What other nations can offer in the way of good blood of our type, we will take, if necessary, by kidnapping their children and raising them here with us......“

    And you still maintain that a policy of kidnapping blond Polish children didn’t exist?

    • 回复: @Wally
  445. @Beefcake the Mighty

    Yep, they can always cook up some pretext, (prefereably “humanitarian”), even if they own/ control nearly everything significant.

  446. @Franklin Ryckaert

    There were no more than 4 million Jews under German control, so 6 million of them could never have been killed, with 3 million “survivors”.

    对。

    Note the source as well as the date.

    考虑到最多 100,000 人成功从欧洲移民,这将使纳粹德国直接统治下的犹太人总数达到约 3,200,000。
    664 AMERICAN JEWISH YEAR BOOK
    http://www.ajcarchives.org/AJC_DATA/Files/1941_1942_9_Statistics.pdf

    http://balder.org/judea/Six-Million-140-Occurrences-Of-The-Word-Holocaust-And-The-Number-6,000,000-Before-The-Nuremberg-Trials-Began.php

    I hope the links still work. I’ve posted this info so often that it’s all probably been “expurgated” by now.

    • 回复: @L.K
  447. @RI

    I think that Germans and Russians were (still are) victims of a horrible plot to exterminate each other.

    That is, without a shred of doubt, true.

    谢谢您的意见。

    • 同意: Byrresheim
  448. @Wally

    Which horrific actions of the Soviet Army are you talking about? And shooting military commissars without even a drumhead court martial is a war crime. To plan it ahead makes the whole high command culpable.

    • 同意: AnonFromTN
    • 哈哈: Wally
    • 回复: @Wally
  449. L.K 说:
    @Commentator Mike

    Beefcake has already taken care of your risible post.

    I’ll add that in the summer of 1940 the preparations for the Red Army to be able to attack Germany were still far from complete.
    The expectations were for the summer of the following year; 1941.

    Stalin’s goal from the beginning(Polish campaign) was to get Germany and the West to be at war, while he had a free hand to act in the background, which is exactly what he did.
    Cunning strategy except Hitler eventually realized what he was doing and manage to – barely – strike the first blow.

    Utterly preposterous and ridiculous thesis

    Well, Pyotr Grigorenko, Soviet Army Major General & highly decorated WWII veteran didn’t think so.
    Neither did many Russian historians in the post Soviet period who had access to the then open archives, now closed again.

    正如 DWMichaels 所写:
    […]he was the first leading Soviet figure to advance the revisionist arguments, which became well known during the 1980s and 1990s, on Stalin’s preparations for aggressive war against Germany. In an article submitted to a major Soviet journal (but rejected, and later published abroad), Grigorenko pointed out that Soviet military forces vastly outnumbered German forces in 1941. Just prior to the German attack on June 22, 1941, more than half of the Soviet forces were in the area near and west of Bialystok, that is, in an area deep in Polish occupied territory. “This deployment could only be justified” wrote Grigorenko, “if these troops were deploying for a surprise offensive. In the event of an enemy attack these troops would soon be encircled.”

    1990 年代以来,随着苏联档案的部分开放(再次关闭),许多俄罗斯历史学家完善了斯大林侵略目标的证据。
    Fanatic propagandists and quacks who peddle Soviet propaganda(now incorporated by the Russian Fed. ) hate Resun( Suvorow) and would like him to have been the only Russian to advance such a thesis. Far from it:

    Russian military historian Dr. Mikhail Meltiukhov of the Russian Institute of Documents and Historical Records Research, Russian historian M. Nikitin, V. A. Nevezhin, Colonel V. D. Danilov, Igor Bunich, Irina. V. Pavlova, V. L. Doroshenko, Boris Sokolov, B.N.Petrov, Vladimir Neveshin, M.Solonin, Constantine Pleshakov, Dr.Alexander Pronin, Prof. Dr. Maria Litowskaja, Colonel Kiselev, Dr. Dschangir Nadschafov, faculty director of the Institute of General History of the Russian Academy of Sciences, P. Bobylev, T. Bushueva, Y. Felshtinskiy, etc.

  450. I always admired the way Roman’s dealt with their enemies. Once enemy was defeated it was either finished off for good like Carthagen or absorbed like Gauls. This personage is talking about some horrific actions of the Soviet army which exist only in western collective inflamated brain with purpose to whitewash very real horrific crimes collective west brought upon Soviet union. The cause of all this exactly that soviet army and people happened to be extremely forgiving and merciful. Why? Because the payback for what germans and their henchmen did in Russia should have been far more serious than what happened. Germany should have been finished as independent state for good..otherwise we see how all this scum sleazes from all nooks and crannies. Letting Germany off the hook as easy as it had was really bad mistake and bad lesson.

    • 回复: @Iris
    , @Wally
  451. @Wally

    Funny how a Hitler-worshiper would think “horrific actions” were a bad thing.

    • 回复: @Wally
    , @jacques sheete
  452. Wally 说:

    说过:
    “Why? Because the payback for what germans and their henchmen did in Russia should have been far more serious than what happened.”

    What do you feel the “Germans and their henchmen” did in the communist USSR?

    And oh yes, please present proof with that. We await.

    So hows life in Tel Aviv?

  453. Iris 说:
    @Sergey Krieger

    You are an uneducated fool.

    And it was Carthago, not Carthagen, that the filthy Roman empire destroyed.

    • 回复: @Sergey Krieger
  454. L.K 说:
    @jacques sheete

    嘿,雅克,
    Don’t even bother with this Franklin Ryckaert, just another shill. In another thread he wrote:

    希特勒进攻俄罗斯的动机是以牺牲“劣等”斯拉夫人为代价为他的“优势”德国人创造生存空间

    These jokers have no shame.

    Yet even Brit historian Richard Overy, typical British Court historian and no friend of NS Germany, has been forced to admit in a recent work of his that:

    Few historians now accept that Hitler had any plan or blueprint for world conquest, in which Poland was a stepping stone to some distant German world empire. Indeed, recent research has suggested that there were almost no plans for what to do with a conquered Poland and that the vision of a new German empire in central and eastern Europe had to be improvised almost from scratch.

    Richard Overy, 1939: Countdown to War – 2009, p.124.

  455. Wally 说:
    @Franklin Ryckaert

    正如我所说和证明的,波森的演讲是假的,但你一直在犯错误。
    干得好:
    – 没有人类遗骸来支持毫无根据的主张。 从未挖掘过任何一个据称的巨大乱葬坑,也没有核实和展示过其中的内容。 不是一个。 故事情节说 6 万犹太人和 5 万其他人 = 11 万,现在想想看。
    多么奇怪,在没有证据支持的情况下声称发生了大规模谋杀。 毒气室正如所称的那样在科学上是不可能的,并且已被修正主义者揭穿令人作呕的事实,并且据称在声称的已知地点同时进行了 1,000,000 至 2,000,000 次大规模枪击事件,但在这些地点没有产生万人坑。 这是为什么?
    – 1993 年,国家档案馆中捕获的德国记录的监督档案管理员罗伯特·沃尔夫承认,更准确的“ausrottung”翻译将是根除或撕毁。 沃尔夫还指出,在希姆莱的演讲手写笔记中,希姆莱使用了术语“judenevakuierung”,即犹太人的撤离,而不是“灭绝”。
    – 有缺页,不同人重新打印的页面,甚至页面已重新编号。
    – 然后我们在数千人面前进行了所谓的“秘密”演讲。 坦率地说,关于它的断言是可笑的。
    – 纽约的 Yivo(意第绪语科学研究所)在 Rosenberg 部非常积极地处理提交给纽伦堡审判的文件。
    – 像 SS-OGruF Gottlob Berger 这样的观众完全否认希姆莱在谈论灭绝犹太人。 我建议阅读:NMT,第 13 卷。 457-487
    – 正如德国法官 Staeglich 巧妙地指出的那样,这个所谓的(录制的)演讲是一堆不合逻辑的、胡说八道和重新编写的文本,参见:
    “奥斯威辛:一位法官查看证据,威廉·斯塔格利希 (Wilhelm Stäglich)”: http://codoh.com/library/document/230
    – 录制包含此类涉嫌机密内容的演讲? 对。 党卫军伯杰将军在听录音时没有认出希姆莱的声音。
    – 完全缺乏对它做出的绝望假设的订单。[/quote]更多在这里:
    '姿势演讲': http://forum.codoh.com/viewtopic.php?t=372
    和这里:
    海因里希·希姆莱 (Heinrich Himmler) 于 04.10.1943 年 XNUMX 月 XNUMX 日发表的波森演讲,海因里希·希姆莱 (Heinrich Himmler)
    出版时间:1943-10-04,4 年 1943 月 1919 日在 Posen 发表,XNUMX-PS 号文件的翻译,纽伦堡审判,Carlos Porter: http://codoh.com/library/document/891/

    • 回复: @Andrew E. Mathis
  456. L.K 说:

    Justice Jackson, Nuremberg trial record

    I really think that this trial, if it should get into an argument over the political and economic causes of this war, could do infinite harm, both in Europe, which I don’t know well, and in America, which I know fairly well. If we should have a prolonged controversy over whether Germany invaded Norway a few jumps ahead of a British invasion of Norway, or whether France in declaring war was the real aggressor, this trial can do infinite harm for those countries with the people of the United States. And the same is true of our Russian relationships. The Germans will certainly accuse all three of our European allies of adopting policies which forced them to war.

    The reason I say that is that captured documents which we have always made that claim – that Germany would be forced into war. They admit they were planning war, but the captured documents of the Foreign Office that I have examined all come down to the claim, “We have no way out; we must fight; we are encircled; we are being strangled to death.”

  457. KenH 说:
    @Hillbob

    The attack took the soviets by complete surprise with extraordinary losses in men and material in the first few days of the invasion.

    That’s primarily because Stalin decreed that Soviet troops not yield once inch of ground to the “fascists”. As a result army after army got encircled and annihilated by the maneuver warfare of the Germans.

    Sounds like a country preparing to attack Germany

    Many German officers and soldiers observed that the Soviet army units they encountered were in 进攻 positions. If the Soviet Union was not preparing to attack Germany then they should have encountered a Soviet army in defensive positions with tank traps, land mines, trenches, etc. These were all the obstacles the Wehrmacht ran into at Kursk-Orel when the Red Orchestra spy ring tipped off the Soviets to the coming German offensive enabling them to make defensive preparations that checked the German advance.

  458. Wally 说:
    @Andrew E. Mathis

    Actually, they were political kommisars, aka: enforcers.

    Not even popular with Red Army soldiers.

    Not all were executed.

    The German High Command did not issue the ‘Kommisar order’.

    Ask Finland about Soviet atrocities.

    • 回复: @Andrew E. Mathis
  459. @Wally

    不要管那个。 你在巴巴罗萨之前指控苏联军队的暴行。 有证据吗?

    • 回复: @Marcali
  460. Wally 说:
    @David In TN

    打哈欠。

    You still have no proof for your fake ‘holocaust’, as I have demonstrated.

    But hey, you faithfully believe.

    如果您的头在沙滩上,那您的屁股就在空中。

    • 回复: @David In TN
  461. Wally 说:
    @Sergey Krieger

    说过:
    “Why? Because the payback for what germans and their henchmen did in Russia should have been far more serious than what happened.”

    见评论474

  462. @Wally

    That they were political commissars isn’t in dispute unless you think shooting civilians is better than shooting soldiers. Whoops! Do you?

    Whether they were popular or not and whether some weren’t shot also isn’t the point. Many were shot and none had trials. That’s a war crime, yes or no?

    The Kommissarbefehl was issued by the OKW. That’s Keitel, the high command.

    I asked you about Soviet atrocities, not Finland. But I note your dodging

    • 回复: @Wally
  463. @Wally

    Then we have a so called “secret” speech in front of thousands. Frankly the assertions about it are laughable.

    Fewer than 100 at each speech, first all SS officers and then Gauleiters and Reichsleiters.

    I have personally pointed this out to you before so when you repeat it now, you’re just lying.

    • 回复: @Beefcake the Mighty
    , @Wally
  464. @L.K

    Yes. In fact (according to General Halder, I believe), Hitler entertained ideas of a Polish rump state, but this was opposed by Stalin because of the implications for Ukrainian nationalism. Not to mention German offers to Britain and France regarding peace throughout late 1939 involving some restoration of Polish sovereignty (rebuffed, needless to say).

  465. @Andrew E. Mathis

    Still, in a rambling speech (assuming its authenticity) he says very little about Jews as such, and as far as killings he only refers to the mass shootings on the Eastern Front (which no revisionist denies happened, and he uses realistic numbers of 500-1000 at a time). Hardly proof of a “Final Solution”. If a top secret “extermination plan” really existed Himmler would have to be unbelievably stupid or foolish to allow himself to be recorded or transcripted talking about it. The Posen speech is no more than a pointless rally-the-troops effort as the war got increasingly worse for Germany.

  466. @Iris

    Thanks for correcting my dumb phone. You are a bit smarter.

  467. @Wally

    Take your pills. You and a lot of likeminded locals need a lot of those.

    • 回复: @Wally
  468. anon1 说:

    这一切都可以追溯到对波兰的疯狂承诺。 如果没有那场二战,那将只是一场俄德战争。 我仍然不知道谁更愚蠢。 英国人做出承诺或波兰人认真对待它。

    • 同意: Beefcake the Mighty
    • 回复: @AnonFromTN
    , @jacques sheete
  469. BTW, let’s be clear about something: I’d much rather be called a “Hitler fanboy” than a Bush or Clinton supporter, any day of the week. If that’s your idea of an insult, keep ‘em coming.

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  470. @L.K

    Don’t even bother with this Franklin Ryckaert, just another shill.

    是的。

    I have pretty much written that one off, but while scrolling past his comment, (which I didn’t read in its entirety, (yawn)), I happened to notice the claim and couldn’t resist responding, not to him per se, but for the benefit of anyone else who may happen to read it.

    I have posted that quite a bit over the years, and have yet to get any sort of response to it. I mean, if there were only 3.2 million Jews in German occupied territories, how could they have killed 6 million? Must’ve been a lot of births or conversions, or maybe some rose from the dead (it’s been done before, ya know!) or something. Maybe majik!

  471. AnonFromTN 说:
    @anon1

    是什么让你这么想的? 这一承诺只是让英国和法国在法律上与德国交战,尽管他们什么也没做。 希特勒首先拿起了所有低垂的果实(碰巧是整个欧洲,除了苏联和英国)。 你认为他对法律感兴趣吗? 大机会! 他占领了卢森堡、比利时、荷兰、丹麦和挪威,这些国家都没有在法律上与德国交战。 丝毫没有阻止他。 无论如何,德国都会占领所有可用的欧洲,波兰曾经(现在仍然)完全无关紧要。

    • 回复: @Wally
  472. BTW, if the Germans wanted to exterminate Slavs as well, why did the Bulgarians ally with them?

  473. @anon1

    这一切都可以追溯到对波兰的疯狂承诺。

    I’m quite sure that both Churchill and FDR (both “aristocrats” to a degree) loathed the commoner, Hitler, were 疯狂地 嫉妒,并且会不惜一切代价与德国开战。 事实上,早在 1916 年左右,罗斯福作为威尔逊手下的海军助理部长就曾鼓动与德国开战,甚至早在有人听说过受伤并获得勋章的下士希特勒之前。

    Churchill was playing the old Brit game of getting others to fight it out for their benefit. They pulled that stunt more than once and it’s obvious to me that they just used the rather rambunctious Polish militarists and gave not a damn about them.

    这很疯狂,但也是一致的。 波兰军国主义者是傻瓜,英国军国主义者是最高级的混蛋,其余的都是历史。

    • 同意: Iris
    • 回复: @Iris
  474. @L.K

    It’s worth pointing out that Glantz himself admits that he had nothing like unfettered access to Soviet archives (although he’s done little to dispel common impressions to the contrary).

  475. @Beefcake the Mighty

    I second that sentiment and would add that the more I learn, the more I’d rather be called a Stalin fan boy than a supporter of Wilson, Churchill or FDR, all of whom are much more despicable than anything else the world could possibly produce. Pompous, power hungry, self righteous, mendacious, vengeful and ignorant as Hell, every one of those sickos.

    I’d add to that Truman, the simple minded goof, and LBJ; what a filthy piece of work that perverted, bloodthirsty, monstrosity was!

    And to think there were Americans who voted for each of them (except the Big “C” of course).

    • 同意: Beefcake the Mighty
  476. @David In TN

    Funny how a Hitler-worshiper would think “horrific actions” were a bad thing.

    Hey, ever hear of omelettes and breaking eggs? What’s a guy s’posed to do, huh? Was Hitler or was he not entitled to make an omelette or two?

    说明。

    • 回复: @David In TN
  477. @Beefcake the Mighty

    In times of need (of troops) useful idiots are always welcome. Besides, Hitler was never interested in colonizing the Balkans.

    • 回复: @j2
  478. Wally 说:
    @Sergey Krieger

    IOW, you cannot provide proof or your silly rants.

    • 回复: @Sergey Krieger
  479. Wally 说:
    @AnonFromTN

    你说:
    “He occupied Luxembourg, Belgium, Netherlands, Denmark and Norway, none of which was legally at war with Germany. Did not stop him one bit. Germany would have occupied all.of available Europe regardless, Poland was (and still is) totally inconsequential.”

    Amazing ignorance.

    –法国在比利时边境安置了2万士兵,而BEF又有近XNUMX万。
    – France and England were allowed to fly war planes over “neutral” Belgium and Holland.
    – Norway was invaded by Britain, the Brits were there when the German arrived and cleared them out.
    – Denmark had seized German land at the end of WWI, Germany wanted it back.
    – Germany considered Luxembourg a German state under the domination of their adversary France.
    – If Germany wanted to occupy all of Europe it would have.
    –苏联入侵了芬兰,拉脱维亚,爱沙尼亚,立陶宛,波兰,入侵并吞并了罗马尼亚的部分地区,入侵了伊朗,入侵了挪威北部和丹麦的博恩霍尔姆岛,但“盟国”没有采取任何行动。
    –波兰入侵并吞并了捷克领土的大部分地区,捷克斯洛伐克占领了德国的大部分地区,对德国平民实施暴行。 然而,“盟国”什么也没做。

    干杯。

    • 回复: @Thorfinnsson
  480. Wally 说:
    @Andrew E. Mathis

    Again you dodge what I post, please review my comment #477.
    Try to pay attention for Christ sake.

    But then you’re just another run-of-the-mill dim & debunked redneck Zionist.

    BTW, tell us about those ‘gas chambers’ that you believe in. LOL

    http://www.codoh.com

  481. @Hippopotamusdrome

    Actually Romania n Finland delayed their attacks, waiting to see how the German attack progressed before committing themselves. Not that they could have done much, since they had to wait for the soviets to hastily transfer the massive numbers of troops arrayed against them away to confront the emergency posed by the German invasion.

    To speak of “borders of the Soviet Union” is to completely misunderstand the nature of that political entity. When Stalin occupied eastern Poland, Lithuania, Latvia, Estonia, Bukovina, n Bessarabia, he had no intention of ever allowing these territories to resume independence. These areas were well along the way of being absorbed into the global Soviet entity when the Germans invaded n halted the process.

  482. Wally 说:
    @Andrew E. Mathis

    Now you’re changing your story, again. Some things never change.

    Anyway, like the partisan terrorists , commissars were not recognized as legal combatants.

    Again, please research Soviet atrocities against Finns, shouldn’t be too difficult for you … I hope.

    Now if you want to talk about real war crimes, there’s the Red Army. Of course a Stalin apologist such as yourself tries to downplay those. Alas.

    http://www.codoh.com

    • 回复: @Andrew E. Mathis
  483. @Mefobills

    Isn’t it interesting that after Stalin turned against the Jews with his planned purge of Communist Jews in the “doctors’ plot” in 1953, having lost confidence in their loyalty due to their support of Israel, that he suddenly turned up dead? It was only then that Jews around the world turned against the Soviet Union n the media stop calling it the “workers’ paradise”.

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  484. Beef the Mighty.
    the Bulgarian King Boris was an Austrian . How about that ?

  485. j2 说:
    @Franklin Ryckaert

    “In times of need (of troops) useful idiots are always welcome. Besides, Hitler was never interested in colonizing the Balkans.”

    The smaller countries could choose between two sides but they did not have a realistic chance to stay outside the war. These countries knew what Communism represented.

    Nazis had the racial teaching of lower races, untermenchen. For them Slavs and Finns and all those other people were lower races. In practice in Finland it meant that SS men were advised not to marry lower race women. So SS men in Norway made much more children with Norwegian pure blooded Aryans than with Finnish mongrel women. Which was not a so bad outcome after Germany lost. As Germans did not occupy Finland they did not realize the untermenchen philosophy.

    In Poland this untermenchen concept was realized. as the country was occupied. There was some level of apartheid, like that Nazis put a sign on a children skating place: not for dogs or for Poles. Poles were captured from the streets and forced to work in farms run by Germans. It was a form of a work duty, but in the case of untermenchen to work for the master race, so a bit different as the work duty for Germans. University education was not allowed for Poles as the lower race was not to get higher education. Warsaw university worked as an underground educational institute during the war and some students did graduate. So, these stories I know to be true.

    I have heard the story of kidnapping Polish children long ago, but have not checked if such happened. What was certainly true was that Poles with German ancestry could become Germans and this may be the actual background meaning of the story, stealing the children by converting them into Germans. Yet, only those with some German ancestry could be converted to German.

    All this kind of racism there was, but I think there was no idea of killing all Slavs. The idea was stealing their land or a part of it, pushing most of the untermenchen out and using a small number of them for simple work for the master race. So, it is just like with Palestinians in Israel.

    This all is true and if is why I am no Hitler fun boy. I know many untermenchen and they are quite similar to Germans. Actually, Finns are more different in character.

    • 回复: @Cowboy
  486. @Wally

    By the way, have you (yet) figured out an explanation for Hitler’s failure to “prevent” the Soviet capture of Berlin in 1945?

    • 回复: @Wally
  487. @jacques sheete

    You just admitted you are too stupid to understand irony.

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  488. @L.K

    Uh, I’m sure you guys know far more details, but then I’m also sure that the Soviets, and their western allies too, scrubbed much information pertaining to that phase of Soviet -Nazi cooperation, as it must have been quite embarrassing later on. Just like you don’t see Jews talking much about the Haavara agreement.

  489. Cowboy 说:
    @Sparkon

    John Wear has written several articles about this:

    https://wearswar.wordpress.com/2017/12/21/stalin-wanted-to-mount-a-massive-air-offensive-followed-by-an-assault-of-nearly-2-million-airborne-troops/

    The ideal combat plane Stalin developed was a light bomber designed to operate free of enemy resistance. Record-breaking characteristics were not required; Stalin demanded only simplicity, durability, and firepower. Stalin planned to create a plane that could be produced in numbers exceeding all warplanes of all types of all countries in the world. Literally, Stalin planned to build as many light bombers as there were small but mobile horsemen in the hordes of Genghis Kahn.
    ...
    When Germany invaded the Soviet Union it could only send 2,510 airplanes, including many outdated planes and assorted aircraft used for transport, communications, and medical purposes. The Soviet Union had 2,769 of the newest models Il-2, Pe-2, MiG-3, Yak-1, and LaGG-3. The Soviet Union also had seven additional new types of planes: the Ar-2, Er-2, Su-2, Pe-8, Yak-2, Yak-4, and Il-4. Aside from the 12 newest models, the Soviet Union also had the “obsolete” TB-3 and SB bombers, and the I-16 and I-153 fighters.
    ...
    Why then in the first stage of the war did the Soviet air force lose air superiority from day one?

    答案是这样的 the majority of Soviet pilots, including fighter pilots, were not taught dogfighting. Soviet aviation was designed to conduct one grandiose, sudden, aggressive operation to crush the enemy’s air force on the ground in one raid and obtain air superiority. Hitler’s preemptive strike prevented Soviet aviation from accomplishing its planned aggressive operations of unheard-of dimensions.

    https://wearswar.wordpress.com/2018/03/03/soviet-tanks-were-to-be-the-spearhead-in-stalins-plan-to-attack-conquer-europe-he-built-mass-produced-the-best-tanks-in-the-world/

    The Germans started producing the Pz-IVA, the most powerful German tank of the first half of World War II, at the end of 1937. The T-28 tank was superior to the German tank in all respects except one: the T-28 fired shells with an initial speed of 381 m/s, while the German Pz-IVA tank fired shells with an initial speed of 385 m/s. In response, starting in 1938, the Soviet T-28 tanks were produced with a new L-10 gun that fired shells with an initial speed of 555 m/s. The L-10 Soviet tank gun was unrivaled in Germany or anywhere else in the world. Despite being outstanding in comparison with all foreign tanks, after the war Soviet historians and generals called the T-28 tank obsolete.
    ...
    Suvorov shows that the Soviet Union had 1,400 T-34s at the time of invasion. During the second half of 1941, Soviet industry produced another 1,789 T-34 tanks.
    ...
    The Soviet Union also built an entire family of BT tanks—the BT-2, BT-5, BT-7, BT-7A, and BT-7M. BT stands for bystrokhodnyi (high-speed) tank. At the beginning of World War II, the Red Army had 6,456 BT tanks, as many as all other operational tanks in the rest of the world. The BT tanks were well designed, heavily armed for their times, had standard bullet-proof armor, and used a diesel engine which made the tanks far less vulnerable to fires. The first BTs had a speed of 69 mph; today most tanks would still be envious of such high speeds. Nevertheless, Soviet historians categorized these tanks among the obsolete models, so obsolete that until 1991 they were not even included in statistics.
    ...
    The Soviet Union also built an outstanding family of amphibious tanks: the T-37A, T-38, and T-40. By June 22, 1941, the Soviet Union had over 4,000 amphibious tanks in its arsenal. By comparison, to this day Germany has never built any amphibious tanks.

    Wear also forgets to mention the British Lend Lease that started in the summer of 1941. Britain shipped hundreds of tanks and Hurricane fighters, so any gaps that Stalin had in his airforce or tank forces were immediately filled by jew owned armaments companies like Vickers.

    https://ww2-weapons.com/lend-lease-tanks-and-aircrafts/

    “The first deliveries of tanks took place already in 1941, namely 487 Matilda II tanks, Valentine and Tetrarch from UK as well as 182 M3A1 Stuart and medium tanks M3 Lee from the USA.
    ...
    The first foreign aeroplanes to arrive were two squadrons of Hawker Hurricane fighters, which were flown in combat by RAF pilots in the autumn of 1941 and then handed over to the Russians ”

    • 回复: @Thorfinnsson
  490. @Sin City Milla

    When Stalin occupied eastern Poland, Lithuania, Latvia, Estonia, Bukovina, n Bessarabia, he had no intention of ever allowing these territories to resume independence.

    Obviously true. All one has to do is examine his “post war” grabs, which sent his dumbass former “allies” scrambling to block. It’s fortunate that FDR croaked; had he lived, there’s no telling what more he would have given to the guy who “only wanted socialism on one country.”

  491. Cowboy 说:
    @j2

    For a “scholar”, you sure lack documentation for your outrageous kosher claims, not even a wiki. Take this:

    “Nazis had the racial teaching of lower races, untermenchen. For them Slavs and Finns and all those other people were lower races. In practice in Finland it meant that SS men were advised not to marry lower race women…. As Germans did not occupy Finland they did not realize the untermenchen philosophy.=

    First of all, you contradicted yourself. Second of all, this is cognitive dissonance. Third of all, care to document this for us?

    Or is this merely more lies that you spew for sheckels, like the 6 gorillian?

    • 回复: @Wally
    , @j2
  492. @european born

    How about what? Are you denying that the Bulgarians are Slavs?

    • 回复: @RI
    , @european born
  493. @Wally

    Anyway, like the partisan terrorists , commissars were not recognized as legal combatants.

    Garbage. They had rank and insignia and were embedded within regular army units. They were legal combatants. You just painted yourself into a corner because you have no problem with them being shot but you’re not man enough to just say so because then you’ll have to admit your beloved Nazis actually committed a war crime.

    • 回复: @Wally
    , @David In TN
  494. CK 说:
    @RobinG

    Unsure what your comment is referencing in either of my comments here.

    • 回复: @RobinG
  495. Iris 说:
    @jacques sheete

    “In fact, FDR as assistant secretary of the Navy under Wilson agitated for war with Germany as far back as 1916 or so, long before anyone even heard of the wounded and decorated corporal, Hitler.”

    In the gallery of rogues who planned and engineered WW1 and its continuation, WW2, Britain and the London-based financial oligarchy stand at the very top position.

    By his relentless and indefatigable efforts, King Edward VII of Great-Britain created the Triple Entente (Britain, France, Russia) against Germany as early as 1907. He also initiated the “Special Relationship” with the US, which dates back to his time. Churchill continued this policy which allowed quashing Britain’s main geopolitical rival and prolonged the British empire under renewed forms.

    http://tarpley.net/online-books/against-oligarchy/king-edward-vii-of-great-britain-evil-demiurge-of-the-triple-entente-and-world-war-1/

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  496. RI 说:
    @Beefcake the Mighty

    I think Bulgarians are Slavs, but Hitler declared them true Aryans at the time. Considering that Slavs actually belong to the Aryan group ( to which not all Germans are part off), it is strange that he declared some Slavs Untermenschen. I boils down to political convenience – those are Aryans, but those are not, so let’s take their lands.

    • 回复: @Beefcake the Mighty
  497. AnonFromTN 说:
    @european born

    What’s more, Bulgaria prudently never sent any troops to the Eastern front. Maybe even an Austrian understood that the result would have been the same as with the Slovak corps, which surrendered to the Soviet troops the first chance it got. Surrendered in an organized manner, with privates, officers, and commanders.

  498. @Wally

    The proof that Germans killed upward to 18 million Soviet civilians and around 3 million Soviet POWs? Take your pill.

    • 回复: @Wally
  499. @Wally

    –法国在比利时边境安置了2万士兵,而BEF又有近XNUMX万。

    Well yes…that was where the Germans invaded through in 1914 and had planned to invade through again (the plans of which fell into French hands) until the Manstein plan was adopted. Additionally, the Maginot Line did not cover the Belgian frontier.

    If you were the French commander where would you have deployed your army? Perhaps on the Swiss and Spanish frontiers in order to avoid provoking poor little Germany?

    – Denmark had seized German land at the end of WWI, Germany wanted it back.

    The return of the Danish areas of Schleswig-Holstein had been promised by Prussia, but Bismarck reneged. This led to the formation of the German Empire’s “Danish Party”, which was never without representation in the Reichstag.

    While Danish King Christian X was interested in recovering the entire Duchy of Schleswig-Holstein, his actions caused a constitutional crisis. He relented, and Denmark recovered only the territories where the majority voted to rejoin Denmark.

    Furthermore, Hitler made no effort to recover any of Danish Schleswig-Holstein even after the Danish government was dissolved in 1943.

    • 回复: @Wally
    , @Cowboy
    , @Colin Wright
  500. @RI

    Perhaps, but actual German policies were driven by contingencies, and not strict adherence to racial ideology.

  501. Miggle 说:
    @jacques sheete

    I didn’t say there was no Nazi-Zionist collaboration. Early on there was. But are you saying German Jews didn’t have to wear yellow stars, were allowed to travel by taxi, allowed to stay in hotels, not dispossessed of their real-estate, not loaded into freight trains and carted off to no-one knew where?

    I have been making two points: (1) the German people were not Judeophobic; (2) a criminal gang took over the failed, destroyed state that was Germany. Making Holocaust denial criminal discredits the Holocaust numbers claimed. The example of the Chmielnitski Cossack rebellion leading to claimed massacres of Jews, where the numbers of Jews killed, numbers claimed for centuries, have recently been shown to be 10 times the true number reinforces that.

    But that doesn’t touch my two points. (1) The German people did not hate the German Jews. It was nothing like the Stolen Land, where the overwhelming proportion of the Jewish population want to exterminate the indigenous people, the original Hebrews. The Israeli Jewish population, overwhelmingly, are Nazis. The German population were 不能 纳粹分子

    (2) There was a gang of murderous criminals who took over Germany, a mark of the turmoil of a failed, destroyed state. (Failed, destroyed, largely due to the efforts of Louis Brandeis and the Parushim.) It was them, the Nazis, who hated the German Jews. And having taken over the government they passed laws giving themselves impunity. Engelmann:

    The Third Reich was inaugurated with a wave of terror such as Germany had never before experienced. In the first weeks after Hitler came to power more than 100,000 persons — mostly Communist and Social Democratic functionaries, prominent union officials, leftist and liberal intellectuals, and other opponents of the regime — were arrested, hauled away, tortured, and in many cases killed.

    By such means the Nazi leadership precluded any attempts at resistance and intimidated the mass of the population. Over the next few years the leading Nazis set about legalizing and bureaucratizing the terror that was necessary for preserving their hold over Germany.

    Among the worse of the Nazi gangs were the Brownshirts (SA). They were the gang that brought Hitler to power by intimidation and worse, had concentration camps, were murderers, torturers, the lot.

    There were also the Blackshirts (SS), at least as bad, who had their own concentration camps, and who on Hitler’s orders exterminated the Brownshirts. It was later called the Röhm Putsch. Again quoting 在希特勒的德国 by Bernt Engelmann:

    It was on this day that Hitler had his old guard liquidated: Ernst Röhm, supreme commander of the SA, the only friend with whom he used the intimate du form of address, as well as at least 150 high-ranking members of the SA were dragged out of their beds in the middle of the night and driven to their place of execution, where they were put up against a wall without explanation and shot. The victims included the leader of Catholic Action, Erich Klausener, and Hitler’s predecessor as chancellor, General Kurt von Schleicher, and his wife, as well as many others who were killed either for revenge or because they knew too much about Hitler’s past and his private life. One of them was […]. Another was the priest Bernhard Stempfle, who had helped Hitler write 我的奋斗。 In all, many hundreds, perhaps more than a thousand, were murdered between 30 June and 1 July [1934].

    There’s heaps more, but it’s time to stop.

    • 回复: @jacques sheete
  502. Wally 说:
    @Thorfinnsson

    So IOW, Belgium was no innocent neutral bystander as was claimed. Thanks, that’s what I said.

    Denmark was occupied in whole, Schleswig-Holstein was therefore brought back into German administration.

    AFAIK, Hitler, knowing the complications, wanted the Schleswig-Holstein question completely settled after the war.
    But the fact is that Denmark had taken land from Germany after WWI. Plebiscites results indicated many wanted to be part of Germany.

    谢谢。

    • 回复: @Thorfinnsson
  503. @Cowboy

    John Wear is recycling content from “Suvorov”.

    Why then in the first stage of the war did the Soviet air force lose air superiority from day one?

    The answer is that the majority of Soviet pilots, including fighter pilots, were not taught dogfighting. Soviet aviation was designed to conduct one grandiose, sudden, aggressive operation to crush the enemy’s air force on the ground in one raid and obtain air superiority.

    Isn’t the simpler thesis that Soviet troops of all kinds, including fighter pilots, were very badly trained and led at that time?

    Vickers (by then Vickers-Armstrong) was a publicly listed company in 1941. I’m unsure who the largest stockholders were.

  504. Cowboy 说:
    @Thorfinnsson

    “Hitler made no effort to recover any of Danish Schleswig-Holstein even after the Danish government was dissolved in 1943.”

    Another case of Hitler’s Nazi dogs not barking. Just like Switzerland, who was allowed to remain neutral. Or Spain, who was allowed to stay neutral even though England occupied their territory (Gibraltar). Or Norway, who was allowed to remain neutral until they accepted Churchill’s troops on their soil and mines in their harbors. Or all the SS volunteers from across Europe, all willing to serve the Führer and fight judeo-communism until death.

    Yet another case of Hitler’s dogs not barking is of course the charges of “racial supremacist” which ignores the fact that there were Jews, Spaniards, Moslems, Blacks, Danes, Dutch and many other races and people in the SS, his personal body guards.

    The biggest case of Hitlers dogs not barking is the missing 6 million bodies, followed up by his refusal to develop nuclear weapons for his V2 rockets. The unused 50,000 VX war heads Hitler never put on the V2 or used at Normandy would be closely related. Of course there is Dunkirk too.

    80 years after the end of European civilization, we now can look back and recognize that every thing the Jews lied about and falsely accused the Germans of, they had in fact perpetrated themselves.

  505. @Thorfinnsson

    ‘…The return of the Danish areas of Schleswig-Holstein had been promised by Prussia, but Bismarck reneged. This led to the formation of the German Empire’s “Danish Party”, which was never without representation in the Reichstag.

    While Danish King Christian X was interested in recovering the entire Duchy of Schleswig-Holstein, his actions caused a constitutional crisis. He relented, and Denmark recovered only the territories where the majority voted to rejoin Denmark.

    Furthermore, Hitler made no effort to recover any of Danish Schleswig-Holstein even after the Danish government was dissolved in 1943.’

    I was just wondering about all that. Thanks for the information.

    电影 9年XNUMX月 contained an interesting little scene where a ‘Danish’ farm wife tells the soldiers she doesn’t actually care much about the fighting. Her farm was in ‘Germany’ twenty two years ago; now it’s in ‘Denmark.’ It all just doesn’t strike her as worth dying over.

  506. @Sparkon

    Stalin’s* cruel industrialization

    *Henry Ford’s industrialization

    • 回复: @Sparkon
  507. Wally 说: • 您的网站
    @Andrew E. Mathis

    It may not fit your Jews First Zionist agenda, but the facts are the facts.

    Whether you like it or not, commisars were in fact not recognized as legal combatants.
    They were not even liked by the Soviet troops.

    It’s rather humorous just how much information you actually dodge.
    Now you’re wetting your little panties because you’ve been embarrassed again. Your problem.

    “Beloved Nazis”? As is said:

    “There were the ‘Nazis’ with the impossible ‘6M Jews, 5M others, & gas chambers’ and there were the ‘Nazis’ without the impossible ’6M Jews, 5M others, & gas chambers’.”

    干杯。

    • 回复: @Andrew E. Mathis
  508. Wally 说:
    @Cowboy

    You’re not dealing with rational, sane person here.

    Lacking proof, j2 said this:

    “I believe that six million Jews were killed by Nazis, 1-1.5 million in Auschwitz.
    If it appears that the calculation does not support this belief, it is only because addition of numbers uses the normal logic where 2+2=4, but beliefs do not need to follow any logic. The Holocaust was a miracle and miracles do not follow mathematical logic.”

    http://www.codoh.com

  509. @Franklin Ryckaert

    It is estimated that at 3.3 million Soviet POWs died in Nazi custody, out of 5.7 million

    5.7 million? Can’t we just round that to the nearest even million?

  510. @Wally

    Belgium was not an innocent bystander because it was in between France and Germany? Belgium actually canceled its alliance with France in 1937 and declared neutrality. Of course military considerations and terrain meant that neither France nor Germany could realistically be expected to respect Belgian neutrality, something Belgium itself was aware of but as usual there was wishful thinking on the part of the politicians.

    Denmark was permitted to retain its civilian government (and even hold free elections) until the middle of 1943. The plebiscites taken in the areas after WWI were respected. Those with Danish majorities went to Denmark, those with German majorities stayed in Germany (against the wishes of King Christian X). Naturally there were minorities on both sides of the border and in fact there still are today.

    And if past conquest is always a justification for future military operations, then just about every war and every offensive operation is always justified. For instance, the Baltic states and Finland had belonged to the Russian Empire. Therefore the USSR was justified in attacking them. Greece had belonged to the Roman Empire, justifying the Italian invasion. And so on.

    • 回复: @Wally
  511. Wally 说:
    @David In TN

    The Soviets took Berlin, they also invaded Finland, Latvia, Estonia, Lithuania, Poland, invaded & annexed parts of Romania, invaded Iran, invaded northern Norway and the Danish island of Bornholm.

    That does not change the fact that Germany had to attack the Communists before they attacked Germany.
    请阅读讨论中的文章。

    Still waiting for your proof of the impossible “Nazi gas chambers” and the equally ridiculous claim of millions shot by the Einsatzgruppen.

    You’re just another dim hasbarist that’s in over his head.

    http://www.codoh.com

    • 回复: @David In TN
  512. @Wally

    You’re wrong and you know it.

    Even without the Holocaust, the Nazis were a totalitarian nightmare, and all you do is defend them.

    Fascinating how you imagine me in “little panties.”

    • 回复: @Wally
    , @jacques sheete
  513. Sparkon 说:
    @Hippopotamusdrome

    Ah so. Henry Ford came over and helped Stalin confiscate grain from starving peasants did he?

    亨利·福特 Lazar Kaganovich with Joseph Stalin

    • 回复: @Hippopotamusdrome
  514. @Beefcake the Mighty

    I was born in Bulgaria . My grandparents told me all about WII, and how the people were always with the russian people. We have the same religion,alphabet and culture. Now,if i was a Bg solder at that time,and send to fight russians – I would,ve been the first to surrender ! By the way I never liked any dictators ,or polititions ever!

  515. Wally 说:
    @Andrew E. Mathis

    Yeah boy, that explains your dodging.

    What “holocaust”? Please explain and prove. We await.

    No imagining, you are a little lying sissy, as I and then many others at CODOH have demonstrated repeatedly.

    http://www.codoh.com

    • 回复: @Andrew E. Mathis
  516. Wally 说:
    @Thorfinnsson

    Belgium allowed belligerents to use it’s territory, air space. Legally they were not neutral.

    Yes, I realize the Danish situation was more complicated, as I expressed; but they were not without culpability.

    谢谢。

  517. RobinG 说:
    @CK

    It’s not. Liking that comment, curiosity led to prior posts.

    • 回复: @CK
  518. j2 说:
    @Cowboy

    Sure, Cowboy.

    First you question about the relations of Finnish women with German soldiers during the WWII.
    There is a recent dissertation on the topic
    https://agricolaverkko.fi/tietosanomat/vaitos-saksaan-vuonna-1944-lahteneista-suomalaisista-naisista/
    but as you probably do not speak Finnish (but want to give your opinion on the topic anyway) I found especially for you a reference in English:
    https://www.arkisto.fi/uploads/Julkaisut/monografiat/Ulkomaalaisten_sotilaiden_lapset_nide2.pdf
    From that report you find the sentence:
    “During the war, the Lebensborn organization was also active outside Germany. The strongest foreign branch was in Norway, where the population was considered racially valuable.:
    I have read several of these type of reports but as you seem to have an attitude, I do not care to give you more pointers. The number of Finnish women you find e.g from
    https://yle.fi/uutiset/3-5896886
    assuming you cope with the language. The message is very clear in all these reports: about 1000 Finnish women went to relations with German soldiers. It is a much smaller number than in Norway because the Norwegian population was considered racially valuable. Nazis considered the Finnish population as mongrels with Europeans and Mongols. You can easily find a reference to that. So, what do you question here? The topic is well studied.

    Secondly you claim that you found some contradiction. There is no contradiction. The policy of untermenchen, that is, not Aryans, was not applied in Finland as it was applied in Poland. The likely reason is that Finland was not occupied by Germans. The only the part of this supremacy philosophy that was applied was suggesting to German soldiers that they preferably should not marry Finnish women. This is the content of the piece I copied of Norway having a racially valuable population. It implies that other populations were not so valuable racially. We can see the effect of this in the difference of the number of Finnish and Norwegian women in relations with German soldiers. What exactly you do not understand here?

    Finally, you write very ignorantly like this: Or is this merely more lies that you spew for sheckels, like the 6 gorillian?””
    Please read the calculation I made concerning the Jewish death toll. It is simple arithmetics, not any tensor calculus, so you are certainly able to follow it:
    http://www.pienisalaliittotutkimus.com/2018/09/24/my-final-solution-of-the-final-solution/

    You skip the Kol Nidre that I added for legal purposes considering the holocaust denial laws in the EU and what Wally always likes to show stating that all calculations made last year are void. But as nothing can invalidate arithmetical calculations my calculations are not invalidated but very valid and they do not support the 6M. Read the text in full before making more comments on me and let Wally be the only one who is too lazy to read calculations and check before writing comments.

    • 回复: @europeasant
    , @Cowboy
    , @Cowboy
  519. @j2

    Meanwhile the Africans and Asians continue to invade while the Europeans are busy discussing World War Two which happened 80 years ago.

    Demographics in a Democracy is a death sentence for our people.

  520. CK 说:
    @RobinG

    There is a recent body of scientific work re the diminishing of the insolation due to the decline in sunspots. And it was a nasty cold spell when I wrote that older comment.
    There is little to no evidence showing global warming, ice cap shrinkage or sea level rise. There is a lot of data fudging by tenured academics; omission of data that doesn’t fit the agenda and manipulation and massage of data sets to make them seem to say one thing while the raw data shows the opposite.
    There was supposed to be a huge amount of money to be made trading various “warming” credits between the merchant banks; that has not yet come to pass. Somewhat like the great amount of money to be made by agglomerating chunks of sub-par mortgages into tra(e)nches and then “helping”the even greedier folks toinvest in them.
    The more scientific/esoteric the palaver the more people there are who swallow it whole.
    Thank you for enjoying my comments, I am not as active as I had been, cancer and bouts of congestive heart failure over the last twelve months have been unpleasant.

    • 回复: @RobinG
  521. This and other Russia related threads should serve as another proof that Russophobia and desire to rewrite history is not limited to the very top of western society but is widespread in the west. Even those who on the outside try to be russpphile actually want something from Russia. Basically to spill blood and make some other efforts for them. The moment russia is not doing this they immediately show their true face. This thread is out of madhouse quite really. Demanding proof of German crimes committed in the Soviet union is a sign that if things continue on current path, within few decades everything will be described as USSR attacking Germany and murdering German civilians. Unz just like RI is becoming refuge for lunatics and even Unz article regarding Russia history and Jewish role in it are false and only serve this fringe. But the fact that the west is russophobic from top to bottom is quite obvious to me.

  522. Wally 说:
    @Sergey Krieger

    说过:
    “Demanding proof of German crimes committed in the Soviet union is a sign that if things continue on current path, within few decades everything will be described as USSR attacking Germany and murdering German civilians. Unz just like RI is becoming refuge for lunatics and even Unz article regarding Russia history and Jewish role in it are false and only serve this fringe.”

    LOL, Sergey Krieger is panicking.
    Only unstable Zionists like Sergey Krieger think that demanding proof for alleged crimes is unacceptable.
    Jews like him are so arrogant they think that what applies to everyone else does not apply to them.

    His curiously beloved “holocaust” is a bizarre, perverse Jew fantasy and effortlessly demonstrated a such.

    The ‘holocaust’ storyline is one of the most easily debunked narratives ever contrived. That is why those who question it are arrested and persecuted. That is why violent, racist, & privileged Jewish supremacists demand censorship. Only lies require censorship.

    Revisionists bring Jews good news, 6M Jews were not murdered, they should be elated.

    http://www.codoh.com

    • 回复: @Sergey Krieger
  523. Wally 说:
    @Andrew E. Mathis

    Your use of the word ‘projection’ indicates that you don’t understand it’s meaning. I’m not surprised.

    So tell us what you think the ‘Nazis” did that was so terribly wrong?

    Please present proof with your answer.

    我们在等。

    http://www.codoh.com

    • 回复: @Andrew E. Mathis
  524. Cowboy 说:
    @j2

    Your final calculation website is off line.

    Your reports in Finnish seem to be of extremely small samples and mostly concerned with Russians, not Germans. You merely link to some giant documents mostly in your strange tongue as proof that Germans considered Finns to be “Untermensch”. Where is the beef, Finnish cowboy? When did Hitler or Goebbels say that Finns were Untermensch and that SS soldiers should not breed with them? Link the document, provide the page number and quote the paragraph for everyone too lazy to check your lies out.

    Don’t just arrogantly link to some document created by people who are as dependent on the sheckel as yourself.

    • 回复: @j2
  525. Cowboy 说:
    @j2

    Okay, your web site is back up.

    Since you couldn’t tell us yourself, here is your “Final Solution”:

    “I add a note: I do not deny the Holocaust, no part of it. I believe that six million Jews were killed by Nazis, 1-1.5 million in Auschwitz. If it appears that the calculation does not support this belief, it is only because addition of numbers uses the normal logic where 2+2=4, but beliefs do not need to follow any logic. The Holocaust was a miracle and miracles do not follow mathematical logic.”

    All based on ridiculous calculations like this:

    What could have happened to the missing one million Jews that are in the 3.5 million death toll of Vad Vashem? This is only a guess, but the question is of 200,000 Hungarian Jews and 1.48-0.26=1.22 million Jews who were taken to Operation Reinhardt camps and who did not come to DP-camps after 1946. Together this is 1.42 million Jews.

    The document is hogwash from beginning to end because it is based on the assumption that any missing jews at the end of the war were killed by Germans. This is not only fantasy, it is reckless.

    Some people will say anything for a sheckel.

    http://www.pienisalaliittotutkimus.com/2018/09/24/my-final-solution-of-the-final-solution/

    • 回复: @Beefcake the Mighty
    , @j2
  526. @Sergey Krieger

    Don’t be such a fucking baby. The vast majority of commentators here are pro-Russian in the current context (at least highly supportive of Putin’s multilateralism against the US imperium) and many (including myself) regard Putin as a great leader (who saved the Syrians and is now saving Venezuela). There’s no “Russophobia” or any such psychobabble here.

    • 同意: Iris, jacques sheete
    • 回复: @european born
    , @Seraphim
  527. @Cowboy

    Please don’t be clown like Wally. j2 says that as cover because of the legal implications of dissent in Europe. I personally find his calculations reasonable and they absolutely refute the official storyline.

    • 回复: @Wally
    , @Cowboy
  528. Am I the only one who suspects that Wally and Andrew Mathis are the same person?

    • 哈哈: Mike P
    • 回复: @Iris
  529. RobinG 说:
    @CK

    Disputing anthropomorphic cause of change is common, but doubting evidence of planet-wide warming, not so much. Interesting. Not that I follow this closely! There’s an enormous cohort who make this their primary issue, and they don’t need me, so I remain minimally informed and fairly agnostic. But aren’t salinity and sea-level rise objective measurements? I’ve heard this is apparent on some islands, and I’ve never heard of “warming” credits.

    The way people are prone to huge hoaxes, nothing would surprise me. That’s a problem in itself, being adrift in uncertainty. Sorry to hear of your difficulties. Time and strength become ever more precious.

  530. @Andrew E. Mathis

    Wow, Wally. People think you are a Nazi. That’s kinda awkward. You feel it cramps your style at all?

    • 哈哈: Andrew E. Mathis, Wally
    • 回复: @Wally
  531. @Sergey Krieger

    … Russophobia …

    I don’t think you should let it bother you, if any of those westerners want to ride with you wherever into the future great, if not, so what? Russia’s best friend is its nuclear arsenal and that’s all those true or fake friends and enemies need to know.

    • 回复: @Sergey Krieger
  532. Iris 说:
    @Beefcake the Mighty

    Likewise. Lots of sophisticated role playing going on on this website. Best.

  533. @Wally

    You mean besides the banning of opposition parties, closing down newspapers, creating a secret police force, firing people from their jobs because of their ancestry and then deporting those people for the same reason, subverting their justice system, bringing fascism to the continent’s most enlightened and dignified culture, sowing racial hatred, and leaving the continent in ruins?

    All of which you apparently are cool with?

    You mean besides all that? Jesus Christ, man. What good do you think they actually did?

    • 回复: @Wally
    , @Wally
    , @jacques sheete
  534. @Wally

    I am talking about Soviet union sicko. You seem to miss your pills and see Jews everywhere. Do you need proof that earth is round too? Or that the sun is the center of the solar system. Ok. Enjoy you paranoia.