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以色列大厅的力量
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上周三中午在阿灵顿国家公墓,我参加了一年一度的 纪念聚会 幸存者和朋友 自由号. 移动服务包括为 XNUMX 名美国水手、海军陆战队员和平民中的每一个敲响船钟,这些水手、海军陆战队员和平民在以色列蓄意的袭击中丧生,试图击沉情报收集船并杀死其所有船员。 在场的是一些幸存的船员以及像我和其他美国人一样的退伍军人,他们致力于确保故事的发生 自由 不会死,希望有一天美国政府有勇气承认在那个决定性的一天实际发生的事情。

那是袭击发生 XNUMX 周年。 事实上,攻击 自由号 8 年 1967 月 XNUMX 日被以色列战机和鱼雷艇袭击的事件几乎从记忆中消失,年轻一代完全不知道一艘美国海军舰艇曾经被美国“最好的朋友和盟友”以色列蓄意袭击并差点被击沉。 袭击之后是掩盖事件,这清楚地表明,至少有一位美国总统在近五十年前甚至将他与以色列国的关系置于对自己国家的忠诚之上。

事实上,这是和平时期对美国海军舰艇进行的最严重的袭击。 除了死亡人数外,还有 171 名船员在两小时的袭击中受伤,这显然是为了摧毁在国际水域作业的情报收集船,收集有关以色列与其阿拉伯邻国之间正在进行的六日战争的信息。 以色列人的飞机上有大卫之星的标记,因此可以指责埃及,他们从空中和海上用炮艇反复攻击这艘船。

幸存船员难以置信的勇气和决心是唯一让 自由 从下沉。 该舰的指挥官威廉·麦格纳格尔上尉因其在保持舰只漂浮方面的英勇作用而被授予国会荣誉勋章,尽管林登·贝恩斯·约翰逊总统打破传统,拒绝在白宫举行颁奖仪式,也拒绝亲自授予它,在华盛顿海军造船厂进行的不公开的公开演讲中,将该任务委派给海军部长。 袭击发生后给予其他船员的额外奖章使 自由号 在美国海军历史上与敌对势力的一次交战中装饰最华丽的舰艇。

对袭击的掩盖立即开始。 这 自由 船员们发誓对这一事件保密,马耳他的海军造船厂工人甚至是 戴维斯号航空母舰,这帮助了严重受损的 自由 到港口。 由海军上将约翰·麦凯恩 (John McCain) 领导的一个匆忙召集和进行的调查法庭根据华盛顿的命令采取行动,宣布这次袭击是身份错误的案件。 调查的高级法律顾问沃德·波士顿船长,随后 宣布攻击为 “故意击沉一艘美国船只并谋杀其全体船员”,还描述了“林登·约翰逊总统和国防部长罗伯特·麦克纳马拉命令他得出结论,尽管有大量相反的证据,但这次袭击是“身份错误”的案例。” 法院的调查结果被改写,与以色列战争罪行有关的部分,包括用机枪射击救生筏,被删除。 追随父亲的脚步,亚利桑那州参议员约翰麦凯恩利用他在参议院军事委员会的职位有效地阻止了重新召集调查委员会以重新审查证据。 大部分有关文件 自由 尽管自袭击发生以来已经过去了 49 年,但这一事件从未向公众公布过。

新的 人造 调查法庭和秘密授予的奖章只是掩盖的第一步,这种掩盖一直持续到今天,由政治家和媒体精心策划,似乎将以色列的利益置于美国利益之上。 自由 幸存者发现甚至很难将他们的案子公之于众。 XNUMX 月初,一个广告牌上写着“帮助 自由号 幸存者——被以色列袭击” 被拆除 在马萨诸塞州新贝德福德。 该广告牌由 Honor Liberty Vets Organization 放置,按照惯例,通过合同安排支付费用,该安排要求广告牌公司在固定时间长度内张贴图片。 它是放置在不同州的众多广告牌之一。 不可避免地,以色列人脉广泛的朋友开始抱怨。 一位犹太商人威胁要在别处开展业务,因此广告公司提前两周将广告牌移走。

XNUMX 年后,幸存者的数量逐渐减少 自由 不是在寻求惩罚或报复。 当被问到时,他们会告诉你,他们只要求追究责任,对袭击进行公正的调查,并最终向公众披露所发生事件的真实故事。

国会对国会的请求充耳不闻 自由 正如帕特·布坎南 (Pat Buchanan) 曾经说过的,“以色列占领了领土”,该国立法机构多年来一直如此,工作人员应该不会感到惊讶。 游说团体迫使国会甚至总统服从其意志的能力已被评论家详细阐述,首先是保罗·芬德利 (Paul Findley) 在 他们敢说出来,后来由约翰·米尔斯海默和斯蒂芬·沃尔特在 以色列大厅,在艾莉森威尔的 反对我们更好的判断,最近在柯克·比蒂 (Kirk Beattie) 出色的 国会与中东的塑造.

即使以色列杀害美国人,国会也愿意保护以色列,这是值得注意的,但这是立法机构愿意本能地支持以色列的症状,即使这损害了美国的利益和美国公民应享有的权利. 我特别注意 立法 目前正在通过国会的方式使任何联邦资金流向任何支持抵制、撤资和制裁运动的实体(更为人所知的是 BDS)都是非法的。 BDS 是一种向以色列政府施加压力的方式,它既非暴力又可能有效。 由于联邦政府在经济和教育的各个层面以及州和地方政府都有其挂钩,因此它威胁强制 BDS 合法化的威胁远非空洞的。

现行法律 在二十多个州,包括最近的纽约,惩罚支持和平 BDS 运动的实体,将 BDS 标记为反犹太主义,并使其成为非法或受制裁的支持它是对言论自由的直接攻击。 纽约州州长安德鲁·库莫说:“我们希望以色列知道我们站在它一边。” 它并不止于 BDS。 最近与欧洲签署的贸易协定被起草为 有条件 欧洲接受以色列占领巴勒斯坦西岸,同时以色列也在推动 审查互联网 禁止构成“煽动”的材料。 当然,煽动包括任何以反犹太主义为由批评以色列或其政府的行为。

民主党候选人推定希拉里克林顿 明确承诺 竭尽全力反对 BDS,她在 XNUMX 月份告诉一位崇拜美国以色列公共事务委员会的观众,“今天这里的许多年轻人都站在战斗的前线,反对令人震惊的抵制、撤资和制裁运动,即所谓的抵制、撤资和制裁运动。北斗系统。 特别是在反犹太主义在世界各地、尤其是欧洲兴起的时候,我们必须拒绝一切诋毁、孤立和破坏以色列和犹太人民的努力。 我已经拉响警报有一段时间了。 正如我去年在给美国主要犹太组织负责人的一封信中所写的那样,我们必须团结一致反击 BDS。”

所以治疗 自由号 在一个统治阶级几十年来一直在为一个小附庸国的强大游说团体竞标的国家里,没有人应该感到惊讶,这对美利坚合众国来说只是麻烦和费用。 它会结束吗? 由于以色列游说团目前控制着联邦政府的相关部门,而且很多媒体的变化不太可能在一夜之间发生,但有一些积极的迹象。 如果在伯尼·桑德斯 (Bernie Sanders) 影响下的民主党纲领委员会成功地淡化了对以色列的惯常夸赞——有人可能会补充说,这违背了希拉里的意愿——这将表明改变是困难的,但不一定是不可能的。 如果唐纳德特朗普获胜并坚持他在谈判中在以色列和巴勒斯坦之间保持中立的承诺,那也将是对冲突看法的显着转变。 如果美国人民最终醒来并意识到他们厌倦了整个闹剧并决定在中东洗手,那将改变一切。 试想一下,拿起早报,而不是阅读头版报道,该报道是关于伟大的世界领袖本杰明·内塔尼亚胡发出的警告和威胁。 那将是非常了不起的。

 
• 类别: 对外政策, 发展史 •标签: BDS运动, 自由号 
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  1. Anonymous • 免责声明 说:

    Once again Phil you’ve proven that you don’t have much to say anymore.
    Nothing to say about the US’s adventures in Afghanistan given the events in Orlando?
    This event happened closer to WWII in time than it did to today. Maybe we can hear some of your insights into why America is german occupied territory for giving them aid and protecting them with military bases so soon after killing our boys.
    Quite frankly I doubt anyone actually gives a shit about a one off event 50 years ago.
    Israel (and/or Jew) haters will latch on to this because it gives them ammo, the Israel first crowd will be mildly annoyed at you for bringing up something inconvenient to their narrative but otherwise laugh at how pathetic you are, but most of the world will continue not giving a shit about you Phil.

  2. Sanders is Jewish and Trump’s got Jewish in-laws. That should tell us that not all influential Jewish folk in America, particularly, are onboard with the wealthy donorist Likudnik class that strongarms policy with money. Nor are all those in Israel who are Jewish universally for the destructive policies under Netanyahu and his far-right coalition allies.

    Another interesting aspect of coverup with documents suppressed after 49 years, is that Israel is refusing to release millions of documents supposed to be public after 15 years, but is reclassifying them, not only dating to 1967 but to 1948. Nevertheless, Jewish investigative journalists and Israeli historians have found from the one per cent they had access to, they involve numerous false flag operations, intentionally deceptive propaganda and more seriously, actual genocide as policy from the earliest days of the formation of the modern nation.

  3. Tom Welsh 说:

    ‘“President Lyndon Johnson and Secretary of Defense Robert McNamara ordered him to conclude that the attack was a case of ‘mistaken identity’ despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary.” The court’s findings were rewritten and sections relating to Israeli war crimes, to include the machine gunning of life rafts, were excised’.

    And how was this was different from the Soviet political and judicial system? This single case provides clear and sufficient proof that there was no impartial justice in the USA in the 1960s, since when matters have got steadily worse.

    • 回复: @annamaria
  4. Tom Welsh 说:

    ” Inevitably, Israel’s well connected friends began to complain”.

    I would like to have heard how, exactly, they worded their complaints. “We insist that you stop publicizing the murderous terrorism of the Israeli government and the US government’s complicity with it”?

    • 回复: @El Dato
    , @anon
  5. Rehmat 说:

    Dear Giraldi, I think the Americans as good Christian smartens should forgive the incident as another ‘Christian blood sacrifice’ as the American Jewish Lobby admitted Israeli crimes in 2013.

    Leaders of several major American Jewish organizations met Barack Obama and members of his national security team on January 23, 2013 offering abject apologies for the Israeli covert attack on USS Liberty. According to Karl Reich, BNN senior producer, the Jewish groups included ADL, AIPAC and the Conference of Major American Jewish Organizations. However, the Israeli ambassador in Washington could not attend the meeting due to sickness.

    It took American Jewish leaders 46 year to admit that Israel did intentionally attack electronic intelligence-gathering ship, USS Liberty, on June 8, 1967, which resulted the death of 34 young Americans and wounding another 171. The Zionist regime blamed Egypt for the attack. The Israeli-poodle president Lyndon Johnson (his mother Rebekah Baines had Jewish family roots) covered Israeli foot-prints under the influence of his advisor, Mathilde Krim, a former operative of Jewish terrorist group Irgun. Her husband Arthur Krim, then chaired the finance committee for the Democratic National Committee.

    参谋长联席会议主席托马斯·穆勒海军上将和国务卿迪安·鲁斯克都驳斥了以色列的故事(“悲剧性事件”),并称该事件是以色列蓄意发动袭击,以吸引以色列方面的美国军队对抗阿拉伯人。

    Lt. Com. James Ennes was one of the survivors on USS Liberty. His story can be read here. James was hounded by the Jewish Lobby groups for years. They called him “antisemite”, “Nazi bastard” and “drop dead”.

    Alan Hart, veteran British war correspondent and author who covered the war from Sinai – has claimed that Israel was not attacked by Arab armies but it was deliberate attack by Israeli defense minister Gen. Moshe Dayan to destroy Egypt’s Soviet supplied military equipment – planes, missiles, artillery, tanks, the lot. Both Zionist prime minister Eshkol and Dayan took the military adventure as result of US president Lyndon Johnson’s “conditional green light”. The invasion and occupation of Jordanian and Syrian territories were not part of President’s green light.

    https://rehmat1.com/2013/01/27/jewish-groups-apologize-for-israeli-attack-on-uss-liberty/

    • 回复: @Che Guava
    , @Wizard of Oz
  6. Lot 说:

    The additional medals given to other crew members in the aftermath of the attack made the U.S.S. Liberty the most decorated ship based on a single engagement

    That’s quite a cover-up method, giving out a bunch of medals!

    The Liberty crew was sworn to secrecy over the incident

    Really? Did they break their oaths then talking to you about it? Have they been penalized for breaking their “vow of secrecy?” Seems they haven’t given all those medals they were awarded.

    The Israelis, whose planes had their Star of David markings covered up so Egypt could be blamed, attacked the ship repeatedly from the air and with gunboats from the sea.

    How is it remotely plausible that Egypt would intentionally attack an American ship? Why would Egypt ever, in the midst of a war it was losing against Israel, provoke a war with the USA?

    The USS Liberty was friendly fire in the fog of war, and quite a war it was for Israel, fighting enemies with many times its population on multiple land and sea fronts.

    I suggest having a perusal of this article:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_friendly_fire_incidents

    Note that it is extremely LONG.

    From that same broad era:

    3 July 1950 – Eight p-51s of No. 77 Squadron RAAF strafed and destroyed a train carrying thousands of American and South Korean soldiers who were mistaken for a North Korean convoy in the main highway between Suwon and P’yongtaek, resulting more than 700 casualties.

    Cyprus Emergency
    December 12, 1955: On the Troodos mountains near the village of Spilia during the Battle of Spilia, British units from the north and ones from the south, unable to see the fog and in the belief that they were surrounded by EOKA fighters, engaged each other in an eight-hour firefight involving airstrikes, artillery bombardments, and heavy weapons. This firefight caused 250 casualties, including 127 deaths, 102 injuries, and 21 missing, making it the deadliest friendly fire incident of the war.

    On October 15, 1958, 23 British soldiers of 1st Battalion, Royal Ulster Rifles, were killed and 35 others injured while walking near the Kyrenia Mountains when two British machine gunners mistook them for EOKA fighters and opened fire on them for at least 15 minutes. Some British soldiers yelled multiple times at the machine gunners that they were friendlies and the group they belonged to, but the gunners kept on firing.

    越南战争
    It has been estimated that there may have been as many as 8,000 friendly fire incidents in the Vietnam War

    19 November 1967, a U.S. Marine Corps. F4 Phantom aircraft dropped a 500 lb (230 kg) bomb on the command post of the 2nd Battalion (Airborne) 503d Infantry, 173d Airborne Brigade while they were in heavy contact with a numerically superior NVA force. At least 45 paratroopers were killed and another 45 wounded.

    1974 Turkish Invasion of Cyprus

    The Turkish destroyer D-354 Kocatepe was sunk by Turkish warplanes after being mistaken for an enemy ship.

    A flight of Greek Nord Noratlas aircraft transports carrying reinforcements from Greece was mistaken for a flight of Turkish aircraft by the defenders of Nicosia International Airport, who opened fire. Heavy Greek casualties were sustained.

    1982 Falklands War

    A Dassault Mirage III was shot down by Argentine Anti-Aircraft and small arms fire at Port Stanley while an A-4 Skyhawk was downed by a 35 mm antiaircraft battery near Goose Green. Both aircraft belonged to the Argentine Air Force.

    Companies A and C of the 3rd Battalion, Parachute Regiment, British Army engaged each other in an hour-long firefight in the Falkland Islands involving heavy weapons and artillery strikes, resulting in eight casualties, including five deaths and three injuries.

    1991年海湾战争

    During the Battle of Khafji, 11 American Marines were killed in two major incidents when their light armored vehicles (LAV’s) were hit by missiles fired by a USAF A-10.

    Two soldiers of the U.S. Army were killed and a further six wounded when an American Boeing AH-64 Apache attack helicopter fired upon and destroyed a U.S. Army Bradley Fighting Vehicle and an M113 Armoured Personnel Carrier (in the same incident) during night operations.

    An American A-10 during Operation Desert Storm attacked British Warrior MICVs, resulting in nine British dead and numerous casualties.

    In the 1994 Black Hawk shootdown incident, two U.S. Air Force F-15Cs involved with Operation Provide Comfort shot down two U.S. Army UH-60 Black Hawk helicopters over northern Iraq, killing 26 Coalition military and civilian personnel.

    • 同意: Jeff77450
  7. geokat62 说:

    And if the American people finally wake up and realize that they are tired of the entire farce and decide to wash their hands of the Middle East that would change everything.

    I recently made this comment on another thread. I believe it merits reposting here… adieu:

    这将是我对 Unz 的最后评论。 我喜欢与一些经常光顾这个网站的评论者进行辩论……我只希望他们一切顺利。

    问候,

    geokat62

    一项测试,以确定美国公民对 ME 政治的了解程度(我怀疑绝大多数人很难达到及格分数):

    1. 哪对夫妻被认为是“特殊关系”?

    a) 米奇和米妮
    b) 金·卡戴珊和坎耶·韦斯特
    c) 蝙蝠侠和罗宾
    d) 以色列和美国

    2. 是谁推动美国入侵伊拉克的?

    a) 俄罗斯人
    b) 以色列人
    c) 中国人
    d) 意大利人

    3. AIPAC 代表什么?

    a) 美国以色列公共事务委员会
    b) 美国人走向权力和腐败
    c) 美洲印第安人争取和平与合作
    d) 非洲爱尔兰伙伴关系与合作

    4. 谁拥有纽约时报?

    a) 卡洛斯·斯利姆
    b) 霍华德·休斯
    c) 唐纳德·特朗普
    d) 小亚瑟·奥克斯·苏兹伯格 (Arthur Ochs Sulzberger Jr.)

    5. 美国代表以色列否决了多少项联合国决议?

    一)1
    二)7处
    C)39
    四)53处

    6. 自 1980 年以来,美国轰炸或占领的穆斯林国家有多少?

    一)3
    二)14处
    C)6
    四)21处

    7. 自 1949 年以来,美国向以色列进贡了多少财宝?

    a) $120 B
    b) $5 B
    c) $18 B
    d) $63 B

    8.维多利亚纽兰嫁给了谁?

    a) 奥巴马
    b) 开膛手杰克
    c) 芭芭拉史翠珊
    d) 罗伯特·卡根

    9. PNAC 的联合创始人是谁?

    a) 巴纳姆和贝利
    b) 雅培和科斯特洛
    c) 克里斯托尔和卡根
    d) 布奇卡西迪和圣丹斯小子

    10. 以色列人通常如何称呼美国国会?

    a) 西议会
    b) 立法部门
    c) 梭伦室
    d) 山

    • 同意: Che Guava
    • 回复: @iffen
    , @Sam Shama
    , @Wizard of Oz
  8. Che Guava 说:
    @Anonymous

    Remembering such an event on its anniversary seems quite fitting.

    I see that you have a grand total of one post on this, at least with your silly and insulting user name.

    One may suspect that you were directed here by the Internet Megaphone, or whatever is used for the same purpose now.

    Mr. Giraldi’s articles are appreciated by many, he makes many valid points.

    Your post is just a witless attempt at personal invective.

    • 回复: @ISmellBagels
  9. @Anonymous

    “Quite frankly I doubt anyone actually gives a shit about a one off event 50 years ago.”

    So how does that explain the 24/7 indoctrination regarding “The” holocaust that none of us are supposed to ever forget? How long ago was that supposed to have occured?

    • 同意: Che Guava
    • 回复: @Neverforget
    , @Ace
  10. @Anonymous

    ISIS训练600名恐怖分子攻击欧洲(和美国)因为以色列:

  11. @AmericaFirstNow

    Hatred of Israel as San Bernardino terrorism motivation downplayed by Israel 1st US media:

    http://mondoweiss.net/2015/12/reported-politely-ignores/

    CIA’s Mike Scheuer on terrorism motivation also ignored by Israel 1st US media:

    Even Petraeus & CENTCOM warned of Israel threat to US troops:

    http://www.newstatesman.com/blogs/mehdi-hasan/2010/07/general-petraeus-israel-emails

    • 同意: Orville H. Larson
  12. 叛逆者约翰·麦凯恩(John McCain)面对自由号(USS Liberty)的掩盖和媒体帮凶:

    Cindy McCain also OK with USS Liberty cover-up:

    http://america-hijacked.com/2011/10/04/cindy-mccain-on-the-uss-liberty-coverup-i-dont-care-about-this-issue/

  13. El Dato 说:
    @Tom Welsh

    Either “No more money for your elections” or “I have a tape here of your latest private conversations … shame if it should get into the hands of the press”

    Like with what really went dowm with the Sabra and Shatila massacre, this is a story that needs to be told and retold. Isreal is not founded on enlightened leaders playing violin at sunset.

  14. Che Guava 说:
    @Lot

    What an excruciatingly long post in the worst of bad faith, entirely drawn from one irrelevant Wiki entry.

    If it had in fact been

    friendly fire in the fog of war

    as you ludicrously claim, the markings on the planes would not have been covered.

    If I recall the accounts correctly, the Liberty was flying the U.S. flag.

    I don’t recall whether the Israeli gunboats were said to be showing their flags in the accounts, I would guess not.

    So your long post is total diversionary bullshit.

  15. Che Guava 说:
    @Rehmat

    雷赫玛特

    The correct forms of address are ‘Dear Phil’, ‘Dear Phillip’, or ‘Dear Mr. Giraldi’.

    … or as I do here, just the first name.

    Still, as is sometimes the case, your post has much that is relevant this time.

    • 回复: @Rehmat
  16. @Anonymous

    It is you yids and your whining and stale lies who are the broken record, Moishe.

  17. @Che Guava

    It’s just Moishe and his “our boys” bullshit, pretending to be a lover of America. They reveal themselves every time.

    • 回复: @Che Guava
  18. @Lot

    Recordings of both the pilots and ground control discussing that the Liberty was an American ship have been released. That sinks your “friendly fire” theory like the terrorists of Tel Aviv were attempting to sink the Liberty.

    • 回复: @Marcus
  19. iffen 说:

    I doubt that you or most of your commenters can see it, but a problem in gaining support for an “impartial investigation” into the Liberty incident is lost in a sea of anti-Semitic touchstones like support for BDS, railing against the influence of the Lobby(?)/lobby, Alison Weir types, “faux” inquiries, etc. It is just one more bead on a string for you; just one more piece of the Jewspiracy puzzle. If a person, such as myself, was inclined to make a serious effort to gain further understanding of the incident, they would have to overcome the obstacles placed in the way by all the 88s who use this incident the same way that they use their “concern” for the Palestinians.

    • 回复: @Sam Shama
    , @Sam Shama
  20. Marcus 说:
    @Chris Mallory

    Not to mention it was a clear day with unlimited visibility

  21. Sam Shama 说:
    @geokat62

    Your comments and contributions are going to be missed. Hopefully, you will change your mind.

  22. Sam Shama 说:
    @iffen

    You spoke of 88s once before. I can’t google anything that makes much sense [including urban dictionary]

    https://www.google.com/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=88s

    • 回复: @Jus' Sayin'...
    , @iffen
  23. annamaria 说:
    @Anonymous

    “Nothing to say about the US’s adventures in Afghanistan given the events in Orlando?”

    Thank you for the perfect demonstration of hasbara technique.
    Here is the crux of the matter of this article that alarmed you so much, “That Congress is deaf to the pleas of the Liberty crew should surprise no one as the nation’s legislative body has been for years, as Pat Buchanan once put it, “Israeli occupied territory.”

  24. @Anonymous

    Hasbara troll. The Israeli’s must be paying by the word now.

    And the new Israeli argument seems to be, “This happened so long ago; let’s just forget about it,” I’ll make a deal with you: I’ll forget about the Liberty when I never hear another peep from any Jew about the Holocaust.

    • 同意: anarchyst
    • 回复: @Morris Bernstein
  25. annamaria 说:
    @Fran Macadam

    It is amazing how effectively Israel gives, but her own actions, the rationalization to all the wrongs that were done towards Jews in those countries where Jews decided to reside during last two millennia.

  26. @Lot

    Another Hasbara troll. This probably comes direct from some anal cavity in Tel Aviv.

  27. biz 说:
    @Anonymous

    Exactly. The day after yet another Jihadist massacre and the largest mass shooting in American history is a strange day to focus on an event from 50 years ago.

    It is the same thing that the liberals are trying to do at Daily Kos and Salon – change the conversation. In their case they are trying to fixate on Timothy McVeigh and abortion clinic bombings to distract from the Islamist atrocity. At least they are 20 years out of date – Giraldi is 2.5 times as out of date as they are.

    • 回复: @Art
  28. Che Guava 说:
    @ISmellBagels

    说得好。

    As for bagels, there is a scene in the NHK (state broadaster’s) great Silk Road series where bagels are being made at a bakery in one of the post-USSR ‘stans’, I cannot recall if it was Tajik or Uzbek.

    They were clearly making and selling bagels in the scene in the show.

    Not that I object to the bagel as something to eat, with a good filling, but it seems to originate in sth. west Asia.

  29. @Sam Shama

    The Hasbara agent, iffen, is making a reference to a code supposedly used by neo-Nazi groups. 8 is a reference to H, the eighth letter of the alphabet. 88 is a stand in for HH, which is an abbreviation of Heil Hitler. I’ve seen this displayed by unsavory elements in, e.g., the Aryan Brotherhood.

    Otherwise iffen seems upset by perfectly legitimate responses to Israeli war crimes and violations of international law.

    The saddest thing of all is that world Jewry will end up being the ultimate victim of Zionism. This ideology is based on the following false premises:

    (1) That Ashkenaz Jews are not Europeans but direct descendants of Old Testament Jewry. [Genetic research has demonstrated the falsity of this premise.]

    (2) That therefore Ashkenaz Jews and all other Jews should relocate to Palestine even though that meant and means driving out the original inhabitants by any means necessary.

    (3) That concentrating all world Jewry in a spot surrounded on all sides by those embittered to the nth degree by this brutal piece of colonialism is a good idea.

    (4) That continually increasing this bitterness by contempt and brutally inhumane subjugation is also a good idea.

    怎么可能出问题?

    The similarly situated Frankish Kingdom of Jerusalem endured for almost three centuries. Israel’s far briefer life span has evidently convinced the Israelis that they are immune to demography and the tides of history. If I were one of them, I’d make sure to have a second passport and a boogie bag.

    • 回复: @iffen
    , @biz
  30. Sherman 说:
    @Anonymous

    您是100%正确的。

    Geraldi is a Holocaust denier who makes his living peddling hatred and conspiracy theories.

    At no point in his article does he mention a motive as to why Israel attacked the USS Liberty. At no point does he mention that Israeli pilots and ground control were stressed and exhausted from fighting a ferocious war. At no point does he mention that the USS Liberty was – by all accounts – in dangerous waters or that Israel warned foreign ships to stay out of this zone.

    Giraldi only cares about the victims of this tragedy only so far as he can exploit them to further his hate-filled agenda.

    • 回复: @iffen
    , @ISmellBagels
  31. iffen 说:
    @Sam Shama

    I doubt commenter 5371 will tell you, so:

    Hate on Display™ Hate Symbols Database
    88
    88 is a white supremacist numerical code for “Heil Hitler.” H is the eighth letter of the alphabet, so 88 = HH = Heil Hitler. One of the most common white supremacist symbols, 88 is used throughout the entire white supremacist movement, not just neo-Nazis. One can find it as a tattoo or graphic symbol; as part of the name of a group, publication or website; or as part of a screenname or e-mail address. It is even sometimes used as a greeting or sign-off (particularly in messages on social networking websites).

    The number is frequently combined with another white supremacist numeric code, 14 (shorthand for the so-called “14 Words” slogan: “We must secure the existence of our people and a future for white children”) in the form of 1488, 14/88, 14-88, or 8814…

    It should be noted that 88 can be found in non-extremist contexts. The number is used by ham radio operators to mean “hugs” or “hugs and kisses.” Also, a number of NASCAR drivers, including several very well-known ones, have used the number 88, resulting in various automobile stickers and other forms of merchandise sporting that number.

    This is from the ADL website. Go have a look, they have interesting photos of tattoos.

    Are you sure you are Jewish?

    I can understand some of the confusion because a lot of these that comment here don’t qualify as 88s, most barely make it to 44, maybe even a 22 now and then.

  32. iffen 说:
    @Sherman

    Geraldi is a Holocaust denier

    I haven’t read all of his writing, so can you direct me to a passage that indicates this?

    From his articles that I have read, it seems to me that he is more anti-Israeli undue influence than anti-Semitic; there is a difference.

    • 回复: @Chris Mallory
  33. Tom Welsh 说:

    “Congressional willingness to protect Israel even when it is killing Americans is remarkable, but it is symptom of the legislative body’s willingness to go to bat for Israel reflexively, even when it is damaging to U.S. interests and to the rights that American citizens are supposed to enjoy”.

    Mark Twain nailed it in the 19th century:

    “有可能通过事实和数据表明,除了国会之外,没有别的美国本土的犯罪分子”。

  34. @iffen

    Don’t you know that being opposed to Israeli control of Western governments means you want to fire up the Panzers and relight the ovens?

    • 回复: @iffen
  35. iffen 说:
    @Jus' Sayin'...

    Otherwise iffen seems upset by perfectly legitimate responses to Israeli war crimes and violations of international law.

    Sam the Lion: I’ve been around that trashy behavior all my life, I’m gettin’ tired of puttin’ up with it. Now you can stay out of this pool hall, out of my cafe, and my picture show too – I don’t want no more of your business.

    Sophistry in action. Anti-Semitism masquerading as innocent inquiry, and not very cleverly.

    Why, oh why, did we have to take sides against Germany?

    Because we can see into the fucking future! We know how WWII turned out!

    • 回复: @Wizard of Oz
    , @Sam Shama
  36. biz 说:
    @Jus' Sayin'...

    (1) That Ashkenaz Jews are not Europeans but direct descendants of Old Testament Jewry. [Genetic research has demonstrated the falsity of this premise.]

    Actually genetic research has shown exactly the opposite. I don’t know if you are actually ignorant of that or lying out of your ass, but either way this is representative of the quality of discourse on the anti-Israel left.

  37. iffen 说:
    @Chris Mallory

    Don’t you know that the ones who want to fire up the Panzers and relight the ovens are opposed to Israeli control of Western governments.

  38. @geokat62

    YourQ 6. Let’s see, Libya, Somalia, Sudan, Yemen, Kosovo, Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Lebanon, Syria, Kuwait… do you count Bosnia and Saudi Arabia? S the answer is presumably 14 but which are they?

  39. @biz

    I think it was Ron Unz who quoted a figure of 30 per cent fhe
    European genes in Askenazim.. Given the blue eyes, red side burns etc. that seems about right.

    • 回复: @Anonymous
  40. @iffen

    The “innocent enquiry” point seems a bit paranoid. I am a certified philo-Semite but could easily ask a question about something one’s Jewish acquaintances would most likely know more about in an emollient form. E.g. How can one explain why the attack on the Liberty was kept up for so long? And surely it is known who gave the orders???

    • 回复: @iffen
  41. @iffen

    I have two friends who used to work in Hong Kong who include 88 in their email addresses. For good luck I think.

    • 回复: @Sam Shama
  42. gwynedd1 说:
    @Anonymous

    Its not like anyone else is milking the past for political gain now are they?

  43. Canute 说:

    多年来,我阅读了几本关于 USS Liberty 事件的书籍和文章。 可用信息的两个方面给我留下了深刻的印象——a)大量证据表明袭击是蓄意的,b)以色列采用极端手段诋毁或以其他方式诋毁任何提出关于 a)问题的人。 这让我回过头来开始阅读关于犹太复国主义事业几十年来的历史,现在,一个多世纪以来。 当以色列开始回应时,受害者牌总是在牌堆的顶部,而攻击很少解决提出的问题或所涉及的问题,而是严重依赖于仇恨和反犹太主义的声明。 经过几年的学习和研究,我只有一个问题。 为什么 19 个西方国家迅速而突然地通过法律,将质疑甚至批判性研究“大屠杀”定为刑事犯罪? 没有其他历史事件需要这种法律保护——我在历史上的任何地方、任何时候都找不到另一个例子。

    • 同意: Orville H. Larson
    • 回复: @Wally
  44. Anonymous • 免责声明 说:
    @Wizard of Oz

    At least 48% European, more probably somewhere in the 50-60% range.

    • 回复: @Wizard of Oz
  45. Art 说:
    @biz

    The day after yet another Jihadist massacre and the largest mass shooting in American history is a strange day to focus on an event from 50 years ago.

    I wondered how long it would take some low life Jew to make hay from the death of those Americans.

    Just like 9/11 – it is Jews who brought this death to America – our shores are vulnerable because of resident US Jews.

    Muslims are not our fight – Muslims are Israel’s fight.

    We want to trade with Muslims not fight them.

    If the Jews were to leave our shores, there would be NO fight between America and Muslims – PERIOD.

    Go away – biz

    • 回复: @biz
  46. iffen 说:
    @Wizard of Oz

    I am self-certified as neutral on the Israel problem. 88s can fuck off.

    There is a distinction to be made between “innocent inquiry” as to ascertaining “the Truth” and inquiry intended as sophistry. You may not care about the difference, I do.

    It is not anti-Semitic to question and inquire about the Liberty incident; the anti-Semitism derives from the motivation to question and inquire.

    On a related note, there is an extremely narrow window of inquiry into the “reality” of the Holocaust that does not derive from anti-Semitism. IOW, Holocaust deniers are anti-Semitic unless proven otherwise.

    • 回复: @Art
    , @schmenz
    , @Wizard of Oz
    , @Ace
  47. Rehmat 说:
    @Che Guava

    Thanks for lecture on English language Dr. Daniel Pipes – but I’m an engineer and that’s how we address people who are younger than me.

  48. Rehmat 说:

    This is a story of a slave nation which has constructed Holocaust Museums and Memorials in almost every major city in the country in the memory of Jews who died in far-away European countries during the early 1940s – but is allergic to the idea of building even a single Museum in the memory of mass-killing of tens of millions of American Natives or African slaves by the European settlers.

    1989 年 60 月,自由号航空母舰的前指挥官威廉·麦格纳格上尉在为船员举行的追悼会上慷慨地向礼品基金捐款。他的捐款和由安德鲁·梅隆基金会和威斯康星州人文委员会共同资助的赠款使图书馆向美国图书馆提供 XNUMX 卷美国主要作家的著作。

    关于中东的书籍也可以从各个角度获得,这与约瑟夫·朱伯特 (Joseph Joubert) 的评论一致:“辩论一个问题而不解决它比解决一个问题而不辩论它要好。”

    图书馆正在建设中,双方就该项目的两个主要捐助者提出的将图书馆命名为“自由号”号航空母舰的建议引发了激烈的争论。 该提案引发了主要由附近密尔沃基的居民试图诱使居民更改名称的尝试。 其中包括无情的批评性媒体报道、动土仪式期间的纠察、学校董事会拒绝允许高中乐队参加,以及一些地区神职人员和许多受邀的军方和联邦政府官员拒绝参加村庄的追悼会为船员。

    The project trustees wanted to name the library after Theodore and Benjamin Grob, two Swiss-born Jewish industrialists who donated $250,000 towards the project. But they rejected the offer saying: “Name it the USS Liberty Memorial Library in honor of the 34 Americans who died when Israel attacked the USS Liberty in 1967.”

    The powerful Jewish lobby Anti-Defamation League in Chicago describes the Liberty Lobby-whose name has no connection to the ship or the USS Liberty Veterans Association – as “the best-financed, most active anti-Semitic organization in America.”

    Howard Schoenfeld, president of Milwaukee`s Jewish Council, said the Liberty Lobby’s aim in keeping the issue before the public is “to be divisive and damaging to the US-Israeli relationship.” He denounced the effort as a “particularly pernicious attempt to take a tragic event and wrap anti-Semitism in the American flag.”

    A $83,000 federal donation was withdrawn, an invitation to the White House to send a representative was ignored (as was a personal invitation to GHW Bush), the local high school refused to provide a band for the opening ceremony, denouncing the organisers as Nazis, while the Commander of a nearby Naval Training Centre was ordered not to attend by Naval brass.

    https://rehmat1.com/2015/02/03/jews-against-uss-liberty-memorial-library/

  49. Art 说:
    @biz

    Actually genetic research has shown exactly the opposite. … yada … yada.

    What is it about Ashkenazi Jew genetics, that makes them such inveterate liars?

    This is a clear degenerate situation – it makes them impossible to live with – good people have to push them away.

    Not to love and abide by the truth is anti-Western – anti-Christian.

    These poor inferior Ashkenazi Jews start out life with a great defect. One must feel sorry for them and their children. Their backwards Luddite culture does nothing to correct the situation.

    • 同意: edNels
    • 回复: @biz
  50. Sam Shama 说:
    @iffen

    嗨,艾芬
    Got it. Thank you for the explanation. I haven’t spent much time wandering around the ADL website. [Frankly, I find these sites a bit contrived as most Jews in this country can hardly recount any anti-semitic experiences these days, and on the contrary, in these parts, being Jewish is no more remarkable than being Episcopalian; am I wrong?]

    I am not particularly religious in common meaning, [but keep options open to the idea that we are an output of a simulation underway, and religious thoughts from its primitive beginnings as written in our early texts to our present condition, represent attempts to understand, as code upgrades and modifications are made.

    Also increasingly some these Jew hatred filled comments on UR, I find truly boring]

  51. biz 说:
    @Art

    If the Jews were to leave our shores, there would be NO fight between America and Muslims – PERIOD.

    Lol, what is this, Salon.com?

    Whether you want it or not, Muslims have decided that you are their fight.

    • 回复: @Art
    , @Clyde
  52. @biz

    Ashkenaz mDNA is entirely European. Ashkenaz nuclear DNA has a contribution from male Jews who left Palestine well over two thousand years ago. I’d say most reasonable people would agree that Ashkenaz Jews are primarily of European descent. They differ significantly from all other Jews genotypically and phenotypically. For example, only Ashkenaz Jews show an average group intelligence higher than average and the genetic load that goes along with this, e.g. Tay-Sachs. Sephardic and other Jews have average or below average group IQ.

    Ashkenaz Jews are descended from male Jews in the diaspora of classical times who settled in Italy and married local Italian women around 2000 years ago. Descendants of this group migrated into more northern parts of Europe a bit over a thousand years ago. There was a major bottleneck around this time and modern Ashkenaz Jews appear to trace their ancestry back to a group of about 300-500 of these individuals. Apparently these males still intermarried with local women for some period. This is now accepted science that can be confirmed easily by an unbiased internet search or more fully by an examination of the relevant scientific literature.

    If you think this entitles Ashkenaz Jews to the Holy Land feel free.

    • 回复: @biz
    , @Wizard of Oz
  53. Sam Shama 说:
    @iffen

    I just asked 9 of my friends [all of them Jewish] on a common communication platform if they knew what 88 meant. None knew.

    btw, you reckon 5371 is 88? [I actually thought the choice had to do with a certain year in the Jewish calendar 🙂 ]

    • 回复: @iffen
  54. Art 说:
    @iffen

    It is not anti-Semitic to question and inquire about the Liberty incident; the anti-Semitism derives from the motivation to question and inquire.

    Hmm – Jews are only hated because they are Jews – NOT because of what they do. The fact of their cultural habits of lying and greed are to be ignored. Their ancient historical celebrations of death to others are to be ignored. Their degenerative proclivities must be ignored. Their history is inconsequential.

    For a Gentile to know and act on Jew history is anti-Semitic. To even question, to inquire is anti-Semitic.

    If you do you will be called an anti-Semitic 88 Nazi by iffen and his anti-Western, anti-Gentile tribal coercive gang.

    Why do we put up with iffen and his gang?

    Go away iffen!

  55. @Jacques Sheete

    Indeed, Philip and his tribe managed to abscond with the entirety of WWII.

    I recently had a conversation with a lady who was working for the Memory Project (Canadian initiative to catalog veterans stories) – she was lobbing me to contribute more money to the project. I responded that I felt nothing had been learned from these wars and my fathers contribution (WWII Sailor) was being dishonored by the slavish devotion to veterans without any understanding of war and it’s consequences. She replied,

    “We went to war to save the Jews”

    I told her that Canada, at that time in history was indifferent to Jewish suffering. (In fact we sent Jewish refugees back to Europe in 1939.)

    Of the 80 to 90 million deaths (as a result of the second world war) only the jewish lives matter. Now that is the power of the Jewish Lobby, the theft of history.

    • 回复: @Jacques Sheete
    , @Rehmat
  56. biz 说:
    @Jus' Sayin'...

    Actually, that was remarkably cogent and not too far removed from the truth. Congrats.

    Studies have shown Ashkenazim to have around 85% male levantine ancestry according to Y-chromosome analysis, and around 40% female levantine ancestry according to Mt-DNA analysis. This averages out to something like 62% levantine.

    In any case, none of this has anything to do with who is ‘entitled’ to Israel. Jews are entitled to Israel because they bought land there, developed the land and industries, declared independence, and defeated several military attempts to annihilate them. Also they absorbed so many Jews that were ethnically cleansed out of Muslim countries that those Mizrahi Jews now comprise a majority of Israelis, so your bleating about the Ashkenazim is irrelevant now anyway.

  57. biz 说:
    @Art

    Quite a feat for a small group of ‘Luddites’ to have won around 30% of the science Nobel Prizes, no?

  58. Art 说:
    @biz

    Whether you want it or not, Muslims have decided that you are their fight.

    This makes you Jews very happy doesn’t it.

    Christians and Muslims killing each other gets you off.

    You Zionist Jews are without redeeming value – worthless degenerates.

    Go away – biz

    p.s. America must break off – stop the fight, come home and look out for our people.

    • 回复: @biz
  59. biz 说:
    @Art

    I wish that Jihadism had never come to our shores, but it is here. This is not something you can withdraw from.

    Blaming Jews for what Muslims are doing to you only makes you look incredibly weak and pathetic. Man up and fight the fight that has been brought to your door.

  60. iffen 说:
    @Sam Shama

    My first visit to the ADL site was today. I just thought it odd that you (1) didn’t know what 88 meant, and (2) couldn’t find out. It is similar to being a black American and not knowing what KKK stands for and not being able to find out.

    No, being Jewish is not anywhere close to being like an Episcopalian. Not even apples and oranges, more like apples and rocks. They don’t really care whether you go to synagogue or not.

    Personal experience is just one avenue on the trip to knowledge.

    I just asked 9 of my friends [all of them Jewish]

    So, it’s true, y’all do stick together.

    There is a lot of misdirection on these comment threads. That really doesn’t bother me. Several of the commenters insist that I am Jewish or hasbara. I had to look up hasbara about two years ago when I first saw it. If hasbara exists then I am reasonably sure that some of the 88 traffic is generated by them; Abbot and Costello.

    Are the 88s a threat to Jews? That’s not really the main focus of my interests, so if they are, you and your friends are on your own.

  61. gcochran 说:
    @biz

    A better, more detailed analysis shows that Ashkenazi mtDNA is ~90% European, perhaps more. Mostly Italian.

    • 回复: @Wizard of Oz
  62. schmenz 说:
    @iffen

    “Holocaust deniers are anti-Semitic unless proven otherwise.”

    Thank you for that ruling, Chief Justice Iffen.

    • 回复: @iffen
    , @AmericaFirstNow
  63. @Anonymous

    Maybe we can hear some of your insights into why America is german occupied territory for giving them aid and protecting them with military bases so soon after killing our boys.

    __

    You are really dumb, sir. America is German occupied territory? OUR BOYS were killed in WWII because America was drawn into that war for the greater glory of Israel.

    Understand that today Israel is utterly dependent on the United States for money, arms and diplomatic support. One or two states share common enemies with Israel; a handful of countries buy its weapons; a few others are its de facto accomplices in ignoring international treaties and secretly manufacturing nuclear weapons. But outside Washington, Israel has no friends — at the United Nations it cannot even count on the support of America’s staunchest allies. Despite the political and diplomatic incompetence of the PLO [Palestine Liberation Organization]… ; despite the manifest shortcomings of the Arab world at large… ; despite Israel’s own sophisticated efforts to publicize its case, the Jewish state today is widely regarded as a — the — leading threat to world peace.

    What is emerging is a new bi-polar world, with the United States and Israel on one side, and the rest of the world on the other. This new alignment of forces, this shift in power relationships in the world, is strikingly reflected in the United Nations, where, time and time again, votes on issues in both the General Assembly and the Security Council pit the United States and Israel on one side, and virtually the entire rest of the world on the other.

    So go ahead, keep on with your backwards thinking… “german occupied territory” …such a fool.

  64. Sam Shama 说:
    @Wizard of Oz

    Interestingly, a Jewish custom when gifting money for a Bar Mitzvah or a wedding, the number 8 features prominently. It could be a multiple of 18, or a repetition of it, or written in reverse order. So $18, $180, $1818 or even $1881 would work.

    Just another example of Jewish appropriation, some might say.

    • 回复: @Buzz Mohawk
    , @Wizard of Oz
  65. Sam Shama 说:
    @iffen

    If a person, such as myself, was inclined to make a serious effort to gain further understanding of the incident, they would have to overcome the obstacles placed in the way by all the 88s

    I fail to understand how any of their “efforts” could possibly pose a hurdle for you to research into the proceedings of the U.S.S. Liberty ignominy.

    So, it’s true, y’all do stick together.

    purposely chosen, and therefore it seems in my sample, Jews are not overly tuned into the threats from white supremacists.

    • 回复: @iffen
  66. iffen 说:
    @schmenz

    No problem, remember that I did state that there was a narrow window to inquiry.

    Any other questions that I can clear up for you?

  67. Clyde 说:
    @biz

    Art is way way way out there. So much so that if anyone is getting paid by Tel Aviv Steve (Hasbara paymaster) it is him

  68. Sam Shama 说:
    @iffen

    Are you thinking that I am @Jus’ Sayin’ ? Not by a long shot. Ok now I understand what you mean’t by misdirection. Well blimey, I have been accused of the very same. Of course there are a few characters here who seem obsessively engaged in subterfuge [Art, e.g now thankfully in the rubbish bin]. I am just bored with the lack of interesting issues/puzzles.

    • 回复: @iffen
    , @iffen
  69. @Sam Shama

    希伯来语的意思是 生活 is numerically equivalent to 18.

  70. @Fran Macadam

    “Another interesting aspect of coverup with documents suppressed after 49 years, is that Israel is refusing to release millions of documents supposed to be public after 15 years, but is reclassifying them, not only dating to 1967 but to 1948. Nevertheless, Jewish investigative journalists and Israeli historians have found from the one per cent they had access to, they involve numerous false flag operations, intentionally deceptive propaganda and more seriously, actual genocide as policy from the earliest days of the formation of the modern nation.”

    Of course. The documents reveal the foundation of lies, perfidy, and degeneracy on which the Zionist entity is based.

  71. iffen 说:
    @Sam Shama

    I fail to understand how any of their “efforts” could possibly pose a hurdle for you to research into the proceedings of the U.S.S. Liberty ignominy.

    True, bad construction on my part. I should have said obstacles, diversions and obfuscations rather than hurdles.

  72. iffen 说:
    @Sam Shama

    now I understand what you mean’t by misdirection

    I just mean that I keep that in mind when exchanging comments.

    Look, I don’t have a settled opinion on whether 88s are a threat to you and your friends. Just forget about them if you want. I am pretty sure that they are not going to forget about you.

    • 回复: @Sam Shama
  73. @biz

    This averages out to something like 62% levantine.

    Studies I’ve seen put the figure the other way around; about 40% middle eastern.

    Your argument seems to be that European and Asian Jewish colonizers have stolen the land fair and square from its original inhabitants. It’s the standard colonialist argument. For consistency’s sake will you hold to it when the land gets taken back. The demographics make that inevitable. The poor showing of the entire IDF against one Hezbolla brigade about ten years ago make it likely sooner rather than later.

    The result will be a catastrophe for world Jewry. A catastrophe brought on by equating Judaism with Zionism. It will be comparable to earlier catastrophes brought on by earlier false Jewish prophets, e.g., Simon bar Kokhbar, Sabati Xevi.

    • 回复: @biz
    , @Jimi Shmendrix
  74. DaveE 说:
    @Anonymous

    “…..most of the world will continue not giving a shit about you Phil.”

    Maybe that’s true in YOUR world. But here in the real world, it’s all over but the shooting (and shouting) for the Israelites and it ain’t Mr. Giraldi who’s the loser.

    • 回复: @AmericaFirstNow
  75. @DaveE

    伊农的“中东犹太复国主义计划”的展开:伊拉克的危机和以色列的国家利益中心:

    http://america-hijacked.com/2014/07/13/the-unfolding-of-yinons-zionist-plan-for-the-middle-east-the-crisis-in-iraq-and-the-centrality-of-the-national-interest-of-israel/

    克林顿电子邮件显示美国为以色列寻求叙利亚政权更迭:

    Insisted Russia Wouldn’t Dare Interfere:

    http://america-hijacked.com/2016/03/22/clinton-email-shows-us-sought-syria-regime-change-for-israels-sake/

    Also fits with what James Morris mentioned on Russia Today as can be seen via scrolling to youtube at following URL:

    Israel Lobby Pushes for US Action Against the Syrian Government: James
    Morris Dares to Mention the Taboo History

    http://america-hijacked.com/2012/02/12/israel-lobby-pushes-for-us-action-against-the-syrian-government/

  76. @schmenz

    Former Israeli minister on anti-Semitic trick:

    “Anti-semitic, its a trick we always use it”:

  77. Phil has been speaking truth to power about the valiant little David State for so long that he must be inured to the standard smears of anti-Semitism. There is no doubt that Israel deliberately bombed the American spy ship Liberty, perhaps out of fear that it was monitoring the execution of Egyptian p.o.w.s in the Sinai. Also that Israel and its accomplices in the diaspora engineered a coverup that continues to this day. No surprise that John McCain, the “war hero” who was bombing Vietnamese villages and then enjoyed a remarkably lenient captivity, is part of the coverup in Zionist-controlled Washington. Canute makes a good point. The Nazi massacre of the European Jews was a terrible crime, one of the very worst things that ever happened in the horror-filled history of Europe. Yet it is even more “ancient history” than the attack on the Liberty. I keep up with the news and political commentary, and I hear about the Holocaust literally every day of my life. “Never forget!”? I’m more likely to forget my own name than the saga of Jewish tribulation endlessly regurgitated by Hollywood and the other mass media.

    • 同意: Jacques Sheete
  78. US media won’t convey truth because of following:

    犹太人在美国媒体中占主导地位吗? 那么,如果我们怎么办呢?
    :

    http://america-hijacked.com/2013/04/26/do-jews-dominate-in-american-media-and-so-what-if-we-do/

  79. biz 说:
    @Jus' Sayin'...

    Nope, wrong. Jews did not steal the land and so-called ‘Palestinian’ Arabs are not its original inhabitants.

    The latter are descended in part from conquerors from the Arabian Peninsula who arrived with the Islamic conquest and in part from immigrants who arrived in the late 19th and early 20th centuries. Nothing about their presence is original.

    The former are mostly descended from people who either
    a) purchased land from Ottomans fairly
    b) arrived as refugees after being ethnically cleansed by Arabs

    Also contrary to what you have asserted demographics do not make a re-conquest of the land by its former Palestinian Arab conquerors inevitable. On the contrary, the Arab fraction of Israel has stabilized at around 18%, and some of these are loyal Druze, Christians, and Bedouin. Muslim Arabs are around 13% and holding steady.

    • 回复: @Wizard of Oz
  80. @Ralph Raico

    More on traitor John McCain:

    约翰·麦凯恩(John McCain):《战争英雄》还是少一些?:

    http://america-hijacked.com/2013/05/30/john-mccain-war-hero-or-something-less-by-philip-giraldi/

    McCain serves his AIPAC/Neocon masters shown in following youtube:

    以色列大厅 (AIPAC which Hillary Clinton panders to as well):

    Corrupt McCain takes Saudi money too:

    John McCain’s charity at Arizona State University accepted 1 million from Saudi Arabia government:

    http://america-hijacked.com/2016/04/05/john-mccains-charity-at-arizona-state-university-accepted-1-million-from-saudi-government/

    • 回复: @AmericaFirstNow
  81. 5371 说:
    @biz

    Y-chromosome analysis can show no such thing. The best designed whole-genome analyses have failed to suggest any ancestral connection with Palestine.

    • 回复: @biz
    , @Wizard of Oz
  82. @Sherman

    Another Moishe Yidturd earning a few shekels today. Save it turd.

    • 回复: @Sherman
  83. Jew running Federal Reserve and Wall Street responsible for following:

    Financial crash coming this year (by August?)

    • 回复: @AmericaFirstNow
    , @Sam Shama
  84. biz 说:
    @5371

    你不对

    Of the many studies, here are two:

    1) https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC18733/
    从摘要:
    “Despite their long-term residence in different countries and isolation from one another, most Jewish populations were not significantly different from one another at the genetic level. Admixture estimates suggested low levels of European Y-chromosome gene flow into Ashkenazi and Roman Jewish communities. A multidimensional scaling plot placed six of the seven Jewish populations in a relatively tight cluster that was interspersed with Middle Eastern non-Jewish populations, including Palestinians and Syrians. Pairwise differentiation tests further indicated that these Jewish and Middle Eastern non-Jewish populations were not statistically different. The results support the hypothesis that the paternal gene pools of Jewish communities from Europe, North Africa, and the Middle East descended from a common Middle Eastern ancestral population”

    2) http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1274378/
    从摘要:
    “A sample of 526 Y chromosomes representing six Middle Eastern populations (Ashkenazi, Sephardic, and Kurdish Jews from Israel; Muslim Kurds; Muslim Arabs from Israel and the Palestinian Authority Area; and Bedouin from the Negev) was analyzed for 13 binary polymorphisms and six microsatellite loci. The investigation of the genetic relationship among three Jewish communities revealed that Kurdish and Sephardic Jews were indistinguishable from one another, whereas both differed slightly from Ashkenazi Jews.”

    There are many more. Google is your friend.

    • 回复: @5371
  85. Eric Margolis on C-SPAN about USS Liberty cover-up:

    Remember what Israel did to the USS Liberty and what our government did to us.

  86. Rule #1–America is a sovereign nation with the right to conduct its affairs in such a way so that it accords with the interests of AMERICA, not those of a foreign nation.

    Rule#2–Israel is a foreign nation who presumably acts in such a way so that THEIR interests will be served, not those of America or any other country.

    Rule #3–The interests of Israel and those of America are not necessarily identical. If they happen to coincide at times, so much the better.

    Rule #4–If the interests of Israel and those of America clash————-see Rule #1.

    Would that more Jews in America took note of the above.

  87. @5371

    He said “Levantine” so why do you pretend to be contradicting by reference to “Palestine”? According to the Bible and more credible evidence the Hebrews were all over the Middle East from Abraham onewrds.

  88. @biz

    I think you are out of date on the “loyal” Bedouin. The Israeli government has pissed them off (probably leaving attention to them to low level lazy bureaucrats and dudding them over land) and now they are just breeding and living off welfare.

    • 回复: @biz
  89. @Sam Shama

    A bit of appropriation is OK by those who provided the material for the KJV and the Cranmer (and 1662) C of E Book of Common Prayer.

  90. Sherman 说:
    @ISmellBagels

    I’m glad I earned my shekels. It proves I’m not on food stamps like you.

    • 回复: @iffen
  91. It was good of Giraldi to attend the LIBERTY commemoration event in Arlington National Cemetery. Naturally, there was no U.S. Government acknowledgment of, or attendance at, the event. Also, no news coverage. Hell, we can’t remind anyone that the Zionist darlings in Tel Aviv attacked a commissioned vessel of the United States Navy, now, can we?

    With “friends” like Israel, we sure as hell don’t need any enemies.

    • 回复: @annamaria
  92. iffen 说:
    @biz

    In any case, none of this has anything to do with who is ‘entitled’ to Israel. Jews are entitled to Israel because they bought land there, developed the land and industries, declared independence, and defeated several military attempts to annihilate them.

    You might as well have written this in Linear A for all the understanding that it will get.

    Israel is a special nation state in more ways than one. In the instances here, the same rules that are applied to every nation state that exists, has existed or is coming into existence do not apply to only one nation, and that is Israel.

    但是你知道的。

  93. @Neverforget

    You are correct. The idea that FDR, Churchill or Stalin gave a (bleep) about ordinary Jews and went into WW2 to save the Jews is a most preposterous notion.

    It would be most interesting to ask the lady to provide evidence to support her beliefs.

    In fact, some Zionists collaborated with Nazis and I suspect that the Nazi-Zionist program to resettle Jews in Palestine added fuel to Churchill’s furor over Germany in general and Hitler in particular.

  94. @Fran Macadam

    Bernie Sanders still referred to the Mearsheimer/Walt ‘The Israel Lobby and US Foreign Policy’ book as ‘conspiracy theory (more than likely because he is a Jew too) and Trump took 100 million from Sheldon Adelson and wants to kill the Iran Deal for Israel as well! So don’t get your hopes up about Trump being much different!

  95. Art 说:

    The site resident Jews are all hopped up today.

    Muslims killing Americans is manna to them.

    This is like 9/11 II.

    p.s. In Israel, 9/11 is a new national holiday.

  96. Rehmat 说:
    @Neverforget

    In case you didn’t notice – Canada has long become a Zionist Jewish colony like the US, UK, France, Australia and Germany.

    https://rehmat1.com/2016/06/14/canada-iran-to-pay-13-million-to-victims-of-israeli-terrorism/

    • 回复: @Neverforget
  97. @Anonymous

    Hi

    Is that Greg Cochran there missing the “o” with thumb on smartphone?

    I shall have to resume my skirmish of 10 years ago wherein I insisted on the theoretical possiblity and likely reality of Ashkenazi IQ having risen partly because of dumb Jewish males not breeding (or at least not ss Jews) – at which you scoffed.

    Anyway I can go on calling my rabbi friend who told me that there were Jews in the Rhineland before there were Germans “cousin”.

  98. iffen 说:
    @Sherman

    How about earning those shekels by providing the evidence that Giraldi is a Holocaust denier.

  99. @iffen

    The problem is you give no help in determining the all important underlying motivation so one’s personality – paranoid or the opposite – is likely to dominate.

    • 回复: @Art
    , @iffen
  100. iffen 说:
    @Sam Shama

    Since you use terms like ignominy and you say that there are no more puzzles, is it accurate to say that you accept the official explanation that the Liberty incident was a case of mistaken identification?

    • 回复: @Art
  101. Art 说:
    @Wizard of Oz

    The problem is you give no help in determining the all important underlying motivation so one’s personality – paranoid or the opposite – is likely to dominate.

    致相关人士,

    Hmm – do iffen and Wiz say extra stupid things (like the above) in order to maintain the façade that they are not Jews?

    Just asking —- Art

  102. iffen 说:
    @Wizard of Oz

    你想要什么?

    I gave you a good rule of thumb.

    Holocaust deniers are anti-Semites.

    • 回复: @Jacques Sheete
  103. annamaria 说:
    @Orville H. Larson

    meanwhile, Mr. Cuomo, a man of ‘easy virtue’ in service of the Lobby gives the US Constitution a black eye: http://www.democracynow.org/2016/6/9/debate_is_cuomos_crackdown_on_bds
    “New York Governor Andrew Cuomo has issued the first-ever executive order forcing state agencies to divest from any organizations aligned with the Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions movement… Legal groups have declared the order unconstitutional and a form of “21st century McCarthyism.”

    ROBERT FREEDMAN: “Well, I think the governor did the right thing. I would have preferred it to go through the Legislature, if possible. But because of the goals of BDS, which are particularly ugly, I think it was something that had to be done.”
    In other words, when the US Constitution becomes an obstacle for the Lobby, than “something has to be done.”

    “Flanked by AIPAC and Israeli consul, Cuomo signs anti-BDS order:” http://mondoweiss.net/2016/06/flanked-israeli-consul/

    • 回复: @Orville H. Larson
  104. biz 说:
    @Wizard of Oz

    That’s the Negev Bedouin. The Northern Bedouin are doing better. But yes, the Negev Bedouin are a problem now.

    • 回复: @Art
  105. iffen 说:
    @Ralph Raico

    inured to the standard smears of anti-Semitism

    Which of the comments are smears of anti-Semitism, numbers please? Don’t use # 1 because I am not sure of what he is trying to say.

    There is no doubt that Israel deliberately bombed the American spy ship Liberty

    So that is the way it is done, you just declare that there is no doubt.

    the diaspora engineered a coverup

    Where is the cover-up? They admitted that they did it. The question is whether they did it intentionally.

    • 回复: @Art
    , @annamaria
    , @annamaria
  106. Art 说:
    @iffen

    BREAKING!!!!!

    Fox Jews has convicted the wife of the killer terrorist.

    Megyn Kelly is demanding hanging before midnight!

    Jews say 6:00 AM.

    Sorry Megyn.

  107. @iffen

    “Holocaust deniers are anti-Semites.”

    Does that include Jewish and Palestinians and their supporters who question aspects of the thing?

    说明。

    I’ve criticized and questioned plenty of goyim. Am I anti-Goy? Why or why not? If so, are anti-Goyim to be condemned or not?

    说明。

    • 回复: @Fran Macadam
    , @iffen
  108. @Fran Macadam

    Not that we’re not as capable and culpable. I read that some of the Clinton email server evidence is to be suppressed for 75 years. Someone who doesn’t want to be tried before they’re ninety? 🙂

  109. @Jacques Sheete

    I’ve found that neither people who have genuine grievances, will acknowledge that of the other, for fear it diminishes their own.

    • 回复: @Jacques Sheete
  110. iffen 说:
    @Jacques Sheete

    aspects of the thing?

    Not sure what the “thing” is.

    Am I anti-Goy?

    Not sure anti-goy is a thing.

    Simple and straight-forward; if you are a Holocaust denier, then you are an anti-Semite.

  111. anonymous • 免责声明 说:

    Serious question Phil . Do you think about jews 24/7 . I mean is there even a few moments in your day when jews do not occupy your mind ? Even when you sleep are your dreams ( nightmares ) 100% jew dreams every night. 99.87% of the time ??

    • 回复: @5371
    , @annamaria
  112. Art 说:
    @iffen

    inured to the standard smears of anti-Semitism

    Which of the comments are smears of anti-Semitism, numbers please? Don’t use # 1 because I am not sure of what he is trying to say.

    致相关人士,

    iffen now uses the derogatory term “88’s”. This means Nazis. He calls use Nazis these days – what a guy – a non-Jew to boot (lol).

    “Anti-Semitic” is no longer getting the desired reaction from the folks. Who cares?

    Poor iffen boy.

    艺术

    p.s. Crying wolf only lasts so long.

  113. Sam Shama 说:
    @iffen

    Noted and I am not forgetting anything, just happen to think that most of these blokes are frustrated and are simply venting on this forum [Peter Frost’s imagery of Joe Webb, e.g. standing in front of a full length mirror in cowboy boots and hat (?) nudi in flagrante delicto, breathing fire!]

    • 回复: @iffen
  114. Art 说:
    @biz

    That’s the Negev Bedouin. The Northern Bedouin are doing better. But yes, the Negev Bedouin are a problem now.

    biz Mordecai the Jew says “not a good time to be a Negev Bedouin.”

    What does this mean for them?

    • 回复: @Wizard of Oz
  115. An Israeli patrol plane spotted and identified the Liberty the morning of the attack. An intelligence officer did the identification. An American spy ship. The IDF has never revealed how far up the chain of command that identification was reported. That is important because hours later, when the attack took place, the IDF command said it had no knowledge of the American ship.

    American spy ships go where the Russians are. It would have been very important for IDF commanders to be told the Russians were in the vicinity of the Sinai while Israel was fighting its ally Egypt.

    • 回复: @Ace
  116. Sam Shama 说:
    @AmericaFirstNow

    If you are so sure about this imminent crash, it does present an opportunity for you, does it not?

  117. I think you have to understand the six day war to understand the attack on the Liberty. The war was a pretext designed to enable Israel to take the West Bank from Jordan. Security wise Israel had a very good setup where Jordan controlled the West Bank. Jordan kept the peace. And it was integrating Palestinians into Jordan. Palestinians had half the seat in the Jordanian parliament at the time. There were very few attacks by Palestinians on Israelis in the years leading up to the war.

    But Israel wanted/needed the land. I think it was planning the war years in advance. It needed as much secrecy as possible to attack the West Bank and blame it on Jordan. They had to attack the Liberty to get it out of the area.

    • 回复: @Wizard of Oz
    , @Anonymous
  118. iffen 说:
    @Sam Shama

    Well, I missed that Peter Frost imagery. I had Joe Webb on CTI for a while, but took him off and have learned a thing or two from considering his comments. I think he must have smoked or dropped way too much of the God’s nectars. Please respond to my #104.

    • 回复: @Sam Shama
  119. Not sure what the “thing” is.

    Use your imagination. Or read the sentence of yours I was referring to. (Hint: The subject was “The” holocaust, as in, “Holocaust deniers are anti-Semites.”

    “Simple and straight-forward; if you are a Holocaust denier, then you are an anti-Semite.”

    Meh. Simple minded at best.

    • 回复: @iffen
  120. I note particularly legislation currently working its way through Congress that will make it illegal for any federal funding to go to any entity that supports the Boycott, Divest and Sanction movement, better known as BDS.

    It’d be amusing to get Planned Parenthood on board with BDS and watch the gyrations on the Left.

  121. @Jus' Sayin'...

    So what if somebody makes a buck? I fully believe in everything I say. However, this is time of my life, so I do need to be compensated. It’s not much, and it doesn’t come from Israel. $2,000 a month for 5 hours per week, but it’s from the comfort of home. Nobody going to get rich off doing it or quit their day job, so it’s not like we would lie for chump change.

    • 回复: @iffen
  122. Max Payne 说:

    I don’t usually believe in false flags, but when I read up on the USS Liberty I can’t help but pause for a minute.

    If only the Star of David wasn’t covered up. Then the whole thing would have blown away as a mistake of war.

    What bothers me is that the Americans were about to strike Cairo (some even say with tactical nuclear weapons) as retaliation until they found out Israel did it. Of course…. no retaliation was ever planned against Israel once the TRUTH was found out.

  123. @annamaria

    Piss on Andrew Cuomo, that two-bit-assed political hack. And piss on AIPAC.

  124. Art 说:

    AmericaFirstNow:
    Jew running Federal Reserve and Wall Street responsible for following:

    Financial crash coming this year (by August?)

    山姆:
    If you are so sure about this imminent crash, it does present an opportunity for you, does it not?

    致相关人士,

    Here we see the Jew mind at work.

    The Gentile is concerned about 300 million people — the Jew is concerned about himself.

    艺术

  125. anon • 免责声明 说:

    有了像以色列这样的“朋友”,美国不需要任何敌人。

  126. 5371 说:
    @biz

    I said well designed whole-genome studies, not Y-chromosome refuse you just dredged up by googling.

    • 回复: @Wizard of Oz
    , @biz
  127. 5371 说:
    @anonymous

    How large a portion do “anti-semites” occupy of your own mind and dreams?

  128. @iffen

    Not a bad rule of thumb if you have to decided on the spot whether he/she is an anti-Semite. But I would be inclined to put them in other classes with equal probability (non-exclusive I suppose). E.g. the away with the pixies type who obsesses about aliens, flying saucers etc. and/or the type who in his innocence doesn’t really see anything so he understands how it could be really important to others or objectively. So, if you found your 15 year old nephew who knows no Jews having got excited by someone’s big brother adding the Holocaust to the list of good hoaxes he had come across….. so… yes, a good starting point in most cases but…..

  129. @5371

    I’ve never heard a geneticist suggest you need more than the Y chromosome and the mitochondrial DNA to know where a person’s ancestors originated. What more will you get out of a whole genome study that is relevant. BTW, if it was Greg Cochran giving the 48 per cent figure for Ashkenazi European ancestry then I would regard him as authoritative even if it conflates the male and female lines in a single figure.

    • 回复: @5371
  130. @Art

    One of the problems seems to date back to the pre WW1 Ottoman rule under which only a very small fraction of the land was owned privately. So the formerly nomadic Bedouin found themselves squatting on land which they hadn’t either bought or leased from the Israeli government as successor to the Ottoman government. Eventually the government got round to planning its use and that meant evictions….

    • 回复: @Art
  131. @Ralph Raico

    On the one hand weight should be put on the failure of Israel and the US to come clean on the Liberty if, nearly 50 years after the event, it would appear that knowledge of the Liberty’s identity was only at a low level and didn’t involve the Israeli government. It is hard not to conclude that it was an act of utter ruthlessness at a high level though I haven’t heard a plausible explanation for why it would make sense for Israel to do it.

    Ah yes false flag theory does make sense…. Just note it..

    On the other hand I don’t accept it as remotely reasonable to compare the Holocaust with the attack on the Liberty as you have. Test question: which would you prefer to be lodged in people’s brains as something never to happen again but made possible by human nature so needing to be guarded against?

    • 回复: @Wizard of Oz
    , @iffen
  132. @Wizard of Oz

    I mean i just noteD it – from another comment.

  133. @Steve Richter

    At what point after the first hostilities of the war was the Liberty attacked? Consistently with your account it would have had to be almost immediately. Was it? Or don’t you know that vital detail?

    • 回复: @Steve Richter
  134. @Jus' Sayin'...

    I question your emphasis on “Italian” women. Presumably only urban populations were significant though some might have been in small trading posts on frontiers. So the picture is one of merchants (mostly) not waiting till a bride from Palestine or elsewhere in the ME could be recruited. In that context I invoke my rabbi friend’s “there were Jews in the Rhineland before there were Germans” and the blue eyes and red facial hair of many Ashkenazim and suggest a big female Celtic input. As the Gauls had sacked Rome it would be wrong to deny that the “Italian” women were Celts but I raise the question.

  135. @gcochran

    So that’s where you got the 48 per cent and/or 50 to 60 per cent European ancestry from? I.e averaging predominantly ME male and predominantly European female?

    What proportion Celtic? And….

    What can you tell us about the many smart Jews of Spain and their descendants as to genes and IQs? Were they originally just like the Ashkenazi forebears? And/or was there at some and what time a split? How far did the expelled Sephardis join up with Ashkenazi?

    • 回复: @gcochran
  136. Anonymous • 免责声明 说:

    The tittle is about Liberty. Dont hide focus. Dont underestimate impact. Dear nice noble audiences.

  137. @iffen

    Hey Iffen, you said,”Not sure anti-goy is a thing.” Well, sorry, but it turns out there is such a thing and Saker mentions why in an article just this AM. Cool, eh?

    “同样,反犹太主义是一个普遍接受的概念,但仇恨不是。 这只是许多其他“单向精神障碍”中的两个……朋友们,这不是巧合。 这是一个 *系统* 旨在让我们都变得愚蠢和容易上当。”

    https://www.unz.com/tsaker/the-orlando-massacre-the-lies-the-exploitation-and-unasked-questions/

    With some of us the system failed, while with others….! 😉

    • 回复: @iffen
  138. 5371 说:
    @Wizard of Oz

    How many great-grandparents did you have, Wiz? Two, or eight? I’ll leave the rest of what was to be my comment as an exercise for the reader.

    • 回复: @iffen
    , @Wizard of Oz
    , @biz
  139. alexander 说:

    亲爱的菲尔,

    There are some extremely important lessons we all need to learn about this attempted but flubbed Israeli “false-flag” Terror attack against our Liberty.

    The first is that Israel is willing to murder Americans in large numbers to suit their agenda.

    The second is that Israel commits acts of terrorism on very large scales, usually disguising them as false-flag events.

    The third is understanding the near total level of impunity for conducting such acts of terrorism, against the US, even when they are caught red handed.

    What sort of precedent does this set ?

    Doesn’t it make clear that ANY terrorist attack since that time, if it were an Israeli false-flag event, would be covered up completely ……in EXACTLY the same manner as was the Liberty incident ?

    And if this is the case,what does this say about our ENTIRE war on terror, if a leading perpetrator of “false flag” events against us , has absolute impunity for engaging in such conduct ?

    Isn’t it saying to all Americans that no matter what we do or how hard we try ,and even how many TRILLIONS we spend in fighting terrorism, Israels complete impunity guarantees this war will go on for exactly as long as they want it to ?

    And if it does, why is that Okay ?

    Why should our nations liberty from terrorism be determined by those who suffer no accountability when committing it ?

  140. biz 说:
    @5371

    You’re grasping at straws now and it shows. When speaking of a population, Y-chromosome analysis is sufficient to establish the founding male population, and Mt-DNA analysis is sufficient to establish the founding female population.

  141. iffen 说:
    @Jacques Sheete

    Meh. Simple minded at best.

    Au contraire, not all Holocaust deniers are simple minded.

  142. iffen 说:
    @Wizard of Oz

    it would appear that knowledge of the Liberty’s identity was only at a low level and didn’t involve the Israeli government… though I haven’t heard a plausible explanation for why it would make sense for Israel to do it.

    Concealing troop movements by the IDF is a plausible explanation.

    The Liberty would report troop movements, the Soviets would intercept those reports and pass them on to Egypt and Syria.

    • 回复: @Wizard of Oz
  143. iffen 说:
    @Jacques Sheete

    but it turns out there is such a thing and Saker mentions why

    In that case, if both you and the Saker agree then by all means let me revise my world view.

    • 回复: @Jacques Sheete
  144. iffen 说:
    @5371

    你好5371。

    Sam S. and I exchanged views on your handle. I said that I thought it might be long hand for 88 and he thought it was a year in the Jewish calendar.

    I found a converter online, and if it is correct, the year 5371 would be 1611, and I couldn’t find any notable event for the year 1611.

    Care to give us a hint?

    • 回复: @5371
  145. Sam Shama 说:
    @iffen

    On this matter, I am rather inclined to agree with Ron Unz [read the now fully disclosed transcripts from the pilots [even with many lines redacted] ]

    https://www.unz.com/article/the-uss-liberty-must-not-be-forgotten/#comment-972614

    • 回复: @iffen
  146. iffen 说:
    @Morris Bernstein

    $2,000 a month for 5 hours per week

    WTF, I asked for $2,000 and they Jewed me down to $1,500.

    Just for that, have at it Art!

  147. @iffen

    That strikes me as an implausible explanation because it presumes that the US didn’t have adequate encryption to pass on intelligence secretly, that Israel knew that, that the US didn’t and that Israel didn’t tell the US that the Soviet union was listening in on US secret comunications.

    I think i prefer the false flag explanation assuming that one is needed.

    • 回复: @iffen
  148. @5371

    At first sight a good point: the most intelligent perhaps that i have read from you.

    So one of my great grandfathers’ Y chromosome that i have inherited came from the Congo and one of the great-grandmothers whose mitochondrial DNA I share was Ainu but all the rest were pure bred Scandinavians. Interesting to speculate about what i would look like – but irrelevant of course.

    My instant provisional answer is that i am not a population and if you took 500 people who belonged to the same community as me it would be the averages that counted.

    How much you would be helped by dealing with the whole genome i don’t know. Possibly you could infer how many Scandinavians contributed to my genome but it wouldn’t help displace the conclusions already reached sbout the population.

    • 回复: @5371
  149. iffen 说:
    @Sam Shama

    Unz – “the motivation behind the 商榷 Israeli attack is a major historical puzzle”

    Sam S. – “There are no rational answers. It was a tragic 错误 pure and simple, but those who believe otherwise”

    Which is it? Do you agree with Unz or with Sam S.?

    • 回复: @Sam Shama
  150. iffen 说:
    @Wizard of Oz

    the US didn’t have adequate encryption to pass on intelligence secretly

    The US Navy wasn’t competent enough to communicate adequately with the Liberty. If they had been, then the Liberty would have been 100 n. miles away from the coast, out of the war zone, and the incident would never have occurred.

    • 回复: @Wizard of Oz
  151. @iffen

    “In that case, if both you and the Saker agree then by all means let me revise my world view.”

    To be more in line with this or what? I guess in its own way the dude is expressing praise for the goyim…

    “Goyim were born only to serve us.” Explaining why God allowed non-Jews long lives, [Shmuel Eliyahu, the chief rabbi of Safed] added: “Imagine that your donkey would die, you’d lose your income. [The donkey] is your servant. … That’s why he [the gentile] gets a long life, to work well for the Jew.”

    Mr Yosef’s remarks against “gentiles” were greeted with respectful silence by Israeli officials and most of the media. It was left to the United States government and the New York-based Anti-Defamation League (ADL) to issue rebukes. Abraham Foxman, the ADL’s head, accused the rabbi of advancing “hateful and divisive ideas”.

    So, in criticizing the good rabbi, is the esteemed Mr Foxman anti-Semitic or what? I’d also be interested in your views about the Zionists who supported Nazis. Where do they fall on the anti-Semite scale?

    http://www.counterpunch.org/2010/12/10/israel-s-racist-rabbis/print

  152. annamaria 说:
    @iffen

    You really do not know how and “where is the cover-up?

    This is how the Lobby does it:
    1. “Flanked by AIPAC and Israeli consul, Cuomo signs anti-BDS order:” http://mondoweiss.net/2016/06/flanked-israeli-consul/

    2. “Professor’s Angry Tweets on Gaza Cost Him a Job:” http://www.nytimes.com/2014/09/13/world/middleeast/professors-angry-tweets-on-gaza-cost-him-a-job.html?_r=0

    3. “On the Death of Helen Thomas:” https://consortiumnews.com/2013/07/22/on-the-death-of-helen-thomas/

    4. “Why is Norman Finkelstein Not Allowed to Teach?” http://www.csun.edu/~vcmth00m/finkelstein.html

    和更多…。

    • 同意: Orville H. Larson
  153. @Rehmat

    That’s sensationally interesting if true – and renders much of the discussion on this thread idle ignorance. But what are your sources for the admission and apology to President Obama?

  154. annamaria 说:
    @iffen

    Here is also an example of how the Lobby operates against “undesirables” in the US government: “Freeman hits ‘Israel lobby’ on way out:” http://www.politico.com/story/2009/03/freeman-hits-israel-lobby-on-way-out-019856

  155. annamaria 说:
    @anonymous

    You mean, the US should close the eyes and “think of England” while the US resources are burnt in the Middle East and the US Constitution is under attack from the “chosen?” Could you tell Krystols and Kagans to close their dirty mouths and stop inciting for more wars, day after day? Enough already. It is not for nothing that the Lobby and its supporters are called “Israel-firsters.” Their loyalty is not to the US and American people but to their “promised land” and “chosen people.” Giraldy is a patriot of the USA. Whats is your grievance about? – that Giraldy cares about his country that has been abused by the unprincipled tribe?

  156. Sam Shama 说:
    @iffen

    Iffen, permit me to be crystal clear. When I wrote my comments a year ago, I had paid only scant attention to the event and its details, believing as I did then, it was a tragic mistake committed by lower ranking officers. Upon examining/listening to the transcripts [in Hebrew] I was left with the clear conclusion that the captain of the flight formation ordered at least one ambivalent pilot to attack [the pilot kept repeating “Ze shelanu, ze shelanu” meaning “it’s one of ours! one of ours!” to which the captain replied something like, “ze lo taout, tasseh ma she ani omer”, meaning “Its not a mistake, do what I tell you to”] and another one, who refused, to turn back to Base and present himself to the chain of command. The captain then, was aware of the identity of the ship, yet continued on his mission to destroy an American ship and its crew. How far up did this duplicity go? I don’t know. Why did they do it? Its a puzzle.

    这是 练习 most ignominious incident in the history of the IDF .

    [I will tell you as a side-note, I don’t need to be lectured on the IDF by the 88s, as I am quite conversant with its operations today. It gets to perform a thankless job of policing the WB upon orders from the political class led by Netanyahu, and as a result of which, deservedly, but more often undeservedly, it is on the receiving end of misinformation wars [false videos]]

    Coming back to the U.S.S. Liberty, I am with Phil Giraldi. The survivors deserve recognition and much, much more. Should an independent investigation reveal Israeli and American collaborators and their nefarious reasons, they need to be hauled to the public square [even if octogenarians by now], then hung drawn and quartered.

    够清楚吗?

    • 回复: @iffen
    , @Rurik
  157. @Jus' Sayin'...

    So what would you do with Israelis like me (1/2 Ashkenazi 1/2 Syrian) or my kids (1/2 Yemenite)? Things aren’t so cut and dried after all this time.

  158. iffen 说:
    @Sam Shama

    够清楚吗?

    是的,谢谢。

    I have recently put myself in the deliberate attack camp. I remember reading about the incident years ago and putting it into my inconclusive box.

  159. @iffen

    A year ago Ron Unz described the Liberty as the US’s most advanced intelligence ship. It is hardly likely that its communications were open to the USSR.

  160. biz 说:
    @5371

    If the question was the proportions of your total ancestry as an individual then, yes, a full genome analysis would be relevant. If the question is the total founding ancestry proportion of a population then Y-chromosomes and Mt-DNA are sufficient. Think about it for a minute and you will probably get it. Or you may not get it, but it is still true.

    • 回复: @5371
  161. Art 说:
    @Wizard of Oz

    Eventually the government got round to planning its use (Bedouin land) and that meant evictions….

    z,

    Oh – I see – as the Israeli take the land, they are building new homes for the Bedouin – RIGHT!

    艺术

  162. Rurik 说:
    @Sam Shama

    Why did they do it? Its a puzzle.

    no it’s not Sam, everyone knows why they did it- As a false flag to get the US to destroy Egypt, so the cowards in the IDF wouldn’t have to fight them. Just like the way they did 911 to get the US to go to war with all their enemies in the Middle East. Duh

    This is the most ignominious incident in the history of the IDF .

    at least it was a military target against men in uniform, (even if they were Israel’s allies)

    Somehow for me it’s rather more shameful when one of the world’s more sophisticated militaries does something like target and slaughter dangerous terrorists like these…

    that I consider them at their most cowardly and ignominious

    it is on the receiving end of misinformation wars [false videos]]

    for a country whose motto is ‘by deception, we do war’, that’s quite the charge, and of course, as we’ve already discovered, the “false videos” you’re speaking of, isn’t this actual video of your poor put-upon IDF soldiers heroically taking on Goliath with their measly sling-shot (sniper rifle)

    • 回复: @alexander
    , @Sam Shama
  163. alexander 说:
    @Rurik

    I think Israels terrorist attack against our Liberty had multiple purposes,Rurik.

    The first was to sink our intelligence vessel, to prevent us from gaining hard intelligence on who ,in fact, was intent on initiated the war..

    The second was to disguise this attack as an Egyptian assault, so our enmity would point towards Egypt, and not Israel.

    These seem to be the most glaring rationales…….

    But check out my comment #147 on this thread…and see if you do not agree with its premise..

    It is the sheer level of Israels impunity, even when caught, which is perhaps our greatest worry, today.

    • 回复: @Rurik
  164. 5371 说:
    @Wizard of Oz

    The Y-chromosome and mitochondrial haplotypes by themselves usually afford precision no better than on a continental scale. That’s how we got such absurdities as the “Cohen haplotype” which turned out to be nothing of the kind. Whole-genome methods, on the contrary,themselves. provide the space within which to interpret them more securely.

  165. Hillchief 说:
    @Anonymous

    The main problem with Americans is you do not give a shit about stuff that happened 50 years ago.
    This is why you support the Taliban in the 80’s and lost the towers in the 2000’s. You did regime change in the 50’s in Iran, you got the revolution in 79.

    So grow up and never criticize anyone bringing up your past errors, as it shows you have no concept of “Blow Back”.

  166. 5371 说:
    @biz

    You are not tall enough to go on this ride.

    • 回复: @Wizard of Oz
  167. 5371 说:
    @iffen

    Both ingenious, but both wrong. It’s simply a number which happens to be a friend of mine.

    • 回复: @OLD JEW
  168. @AmericaFirstNow

    Zionist-owned Congress’ wars for Israel’s balkanizing Oded Yinon Plan get us attacked in RETALIATION. To end the wars and terrorist attacks on the west heed the words of ex-CIA bin Laden Unit Chief Michael Scheuer:

    This is the plan, complemented by the Jewish neocon’s A Clean Break Plan (google it) that is bankrupting the US on multi-trillion-dollar wars while US cities and infrastructure rot.

    http://www.globalresearch.ca/greater-israel-the-zionist-plan-for-the-middle-east/5324815

    • 回复: @taxonomy26
  169. Sam Shama 说:
    @Rurik

    False video, that is all I shall say of it right now. The IDF stopped publishing it’s analyses of doctored videos for a few years now (https://www.idfblog.com/blog/2012/05/19/5-anti-idf-lies-which-turned-viral/%5D and compiling a major report for presentation to relevant authorities.

    When Iffen writes of 88s, I now think of you as personifying the image. I don’t for a moment believe you care a whit for Palestinians. So you can throw any random pictures you want; I however, actually knew Shlomit. She was stabbed to death early in the year.

    I know the reactions this will elide from the 88 cognoscenti. Don’t bother.

    • 回复: @Rurik
    , @Max Payne
    , @Art
  170. That Israel got away with purposely attacking the US Navy is indicative of how deeply imbedded withing US government Zionist Jews are. This attack leaves no doubt that America is an Israeli-controlled bludgeon.

    请参阅以下链接:

    http://www.foreignpolicyjournal.com/2016/03/22/the-best-congress-aipac-can-buy/

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/billionaires-adelson-and-saban-at-odds-in-campaigns-unite-on-israel-and-hit-obama/2014/11/09/92a40f68-6835-11e4-b053-65cea7903f2e_story.html

    http://www.simpletoremember.com/articles/a/jews-in-the-media-hollywood/

    The destruction of Iraq, Libya and Syria cost the United States thousands of warrior’s lives and trillions of dollars. Iraq alone cost $6 Trillion, or 1/3 of the entire national debt. These states are among several targeted by this Israeli plan:

    http://www.globalresearch.ca/greater-israel-the-zionist-plan-for-the-middle-east/5324815

    Until Zionists are purged from the US political machine, the bankrupting wars for Israel will continue while America is bled dry.

    http://www.countercurrents.org/polya270813.htm

    • 同意: Rurik
  171. Anonymous • 免责声明 说:

    USS Liberty Remembrance – We Are Change Florida

  172. I know that Al Jazeerah broadcast a documentary on the USS Liberty attack but have any of our history-related channels ever done a story on it or have they flushed it down the memory hole like the crime-channels have flushed the Zebra Killings? “No good can come from revisiting these painful chapters, oy! Now, more slavery and holocaust documentaries!”

    • 回复: @Philip Giraldi
  173. @Malcolm X-Lax

    AS far as I know only the BBC and al-Jazeera have done documentaries on the Liberty.

  174. OLD JEW 说:
    @5371

    nevertheless:

    5 + 3 = 8
    7 +1 = 8

    Concatenate the 2 sums. —> 88

    • 回复: @iffen
  175. Rurik 说:
    @Sam Shama

    False video, that is all I shall say of it right now.

    and your evidence for that?

    do you have a link, 还是什么? Or are you just relying on your moral capital as a objective beacon of the truth in all things?

    这是 不能 a faked video, it’s very real indeed, and it goes a long way towards showing the level of contempt for Palestinian children’s lives that your ‘oh-so brave and humanitarian’ IDF actually practices.

    as for the young women tragically murdered, can you even comprehend that the fact her parents were raising her on land that belonged to others might have had something to do with her getting killed? I’ll tell you what, if I had a daughter like that in the 19the century America, and the whites were colonizing Amerindian land, I wouldn’t have used such a daughter as a weapon to steal other people’s land. It would be folly of the most callous kind, and the reason for her premature death.

    ~ may she rest in peace ..

  176. iffen 说:
    @OLD JEW

    Yes, but he said that was not it.

    I like to believe what people say until they prove themselves to be untrustworthy.

  177. Joe Stalin 说:

    To me, the fact that the USS Liberty’s communications frequencies were being deliberately jammed indicates that it was an intentional attack. I asked James Ennes about this decades ago but I have no recollection of his response (if any).

    As for US Navy communications, the whole point of the big parabolic dish on top of the vessel was to direct intelligence information to the moon, where it would bounce off and scatter enough to be received by earth receiving stations.

    Defense Electronics, October 1979, contains an article by James Ennes entitled:”Israeli Attack on U.S. Ship Reveals Failure of C3.”

    http://www.gtr5.com is the current USS Liberty site maintained by Ennes; it contains a link to his older site which is highly recommended.

    • 回复: @Ace
  178. Max Payne 说:
    @Sam Shama

    I love it. International media records Israeli war crimes on video. False video.

    A slew of evidence posing serious questions about certain aspects of the holocaust. Anti-semitism.

    You just can’t make this shit up….

    I guess when you’re identity is so intertwined with something so evil you can literally make yourself believe, against all evidence, the complete opposite of what’s happening in front of you.

    It must be some sort of mental disorder… or willful deception… or both feeding on each other.

    • 回复: @Sam Shama
  179. Sam Shama 说:
    @Max Payne

    You are well within your rights to practice the faith of your choice. In this case a childlike belief that all of these videos are genuine.

    A great many atrocities have been inflicted on the Pals, but I would suggest not swallowing every story as true.

    • 回复: @Carroll Price
  180. Art 说:
    @Sam Shama

    致相关人士,

    (Mr. Sam has chosen to not view my comments – his magnificent Jew intellect cannot handle my meager but truthful comments.) (Funny how a little truth trumps the best most intelligent misdirection of facts.)

    It is so cute how he has adopted his little Gentile pet’s (iffen) language.

    Iffen has come up with the new phony words that slay the truth talkers – 88’s (Nazis).

    It is true that “anti-Semite” has lost its edge – it is so ubiquitously used against any quibble that it has no meaning. Say a truth about a Jew and you will called an anti-Semite in a NY minute.

    What words are coming next “anti-holocaust.” Using the word “Semite” is a lie – 95% of Semites are Arabs. His problem is that holocaust is another lie that cannot be backed up by the truth – only intimidation.

    Mr. Sam’s problems are growing.

    艺术

  181. Wally 说: • 您的网站
    @Canute

    甚至犹太人也在跳槽。

    著名犹太小提琴家耶胡达·梅纽因的儿子杰拉德·梅纽因 (Gerard Menuhin) 所著的修正主义者犹太人的书中:

    讲真话,羞辱魔鬼
    由GERARD MENUHIN
    GERARD MENUHIN和THE BARNES REVIEW版权所有2015
    由...出版:
    《 Barnes评论》,邮政信箱15877,华盛顿特区20003
    可在: https://shop.codoh.com/book/406

    .pdf版本中的引号,分页可能略有不同:
    p.173
    “那些最终对这种绝望局势负责的人的阴谋成功了:他们在“大屠杀”专业人士和宣传的帮助下,创造了必要的内climate感,使永无止境的合法和非法移民不受挑战,社会破裂,内乱和社会资金不足。 因此,对所需的巨额债务进行了编程。 犹太人的影响实现了曾经凝聚力强的社区的瓦解。”

    p.305
    “只有一个事实,即人们可能不会质疑犹太人的“大屠杀”,而且犹太人的压力已在民主社会上施加法律以防止问题-同时不断提倡和灌输同一场无可争议的“大屠杀”,这使这场比赛无处可寻。 证明这一定是谎言。 为什么不容许有人质疑呢? 因为它可能冒犯了“幸存者”? 因为它“使死者感到耻辱”? 几乎没有充分的理由禁止讨论。 不会,因为暴露这种头号谎言可能引发对其他许多谎言的质疑,并使整个摇摇欲坠的捏造过程崩溃。”

    p.458
    “犹太人的行凶行为最明显地表现在对“大屠杀”神话的疯狂逼迫中,犹太人的暴行不仅会驳斥犹太人对巴勒斯坦的主张,而且会无休止的经济赔偿和赎罪以弥补对犹太人的伤害,这也将释放犹太人以及他们的奴隶们对世界的愤怒,他们的谎言和阴谋使他们受了数百年的欺骗和伤害。”

    第303页,平装版。
    “只有一个事实,即人们可能不会质疑犹太人的“大屠杀”,而且犹太人的压力已在民主社会上施加法律以防止问题-同时不断提拔和灌输同一场无可争议的“大屠杀”,这使这场比赛变得无处不在。 证明这一定是谎言。 为什么不容许有人质疑呢? 因为它可能冒犯了“幸存者”? 因为它“使死者感到耻辱”? 几乎没有充分的理由禁止讨论。 不可以,因为暴露在头上的谎言可能引发对其他许多谎言的质疑,并使整个摇摇欲坠的捏造过程崩溃。

  182. Rurik 说:
    @alexander

    The first was to sink our intelligence vessel, to prevent us from gaining hard intelligence on who ,in fact, was intent on initiated the war..

    I doubt that one Alexander, only because no matter what Israel did, the US government and media would have lied to protect them.

    The second was to disguise this attack as an Egyptian assault, so our enmity would point towards Egypt, and not Israel.

    that’s it alright !

    Doesn’t it make clear that ANY terrorist attack since that time, if it were an Israeli false-flag event, would be covered up completely ……in EXACTLY the same manner as was the Liberty incident ?

    I’m glad you brought that up, because when people claim that there’s just no way that if elements in our government and media were to have known that 911 was an inside job at the highest levels (perhaps excluding the chimp), that they could have ever managed for cover it all up and sell a vile lie that it was someone else, like Saddam who did it. But the attack on the USS Liberty is just such a case of an act of war (and unprecedented act of cowardly treachery) that, like 911 was perpetrated by Israel to the continuing cover-ups by our own government and media. When they got away completely with something like the attack on the USS Liberty, they knew they could get away with 任何东西。

    • 回复: @alexander
  183. @5371

    Back to being so cryptic that the nature of your offensiveness is obscure!

    But your little show of knowledge in detail did show that you were wrong I think. Or are you going to take on the formidable Greg Cochran and tell him that the figures he has quoted on this thread – initially as gcichran – are unknowable from the data/evidence available. I wouldn’t risk it if I were you. He hasn’t signed the Geneva Convention wrt POWs.

    • 回复: @5371
  184. Technomad 说:

    The reason the attack was suppressed in the press and elsewhere was simple. LBJ hadn’t decided not to run again, and even if he had already decided against another run, he had dedicated his life to the Democrats (Arabic: Hezb-i-Shaitan) and did not want to blow up the FDR coalition by alienating the “Jewish vote,” which was believed then to be heavily contingent on blind, mindless loyalty to Israel.

    If the Jewish vote had been a 共和政体 constituency, LBJ would have blared the Liberty assault from every pulpit he could find.

  185. U.S. Navy Court of Inquiry
    to inquire into the circumstances surrounding
    the armed attack on the USS Liberty (AGTR-5) on 8 June 1967
    […]

    FINDINGS OF FACT

    1. Available evidence combines to indicate the attack on LIBERTY on
    8 June was in fact a case of Mistaken identity.

    2. The Calm conditions and Slow ship speed may well have made the
    American Flag difficult to identify.

    3. The ship’s westerly heading at the time of attack – in the general
    direction of Egyptian ports may have reinforced elements of
    doubt in the minds of the several Israeli pilots who looked the
    ship over in the forenoon.

    4. The colors were shot down Early in the action and were replaced
    prior to the PT attack.

    5. The immediate confusion milling around astern followed by
    peaceful overtures by the attacking surface forces after launching
    only two torpedoes of the six presumed available (two
    on each PT boat), indicate these craft may well have identified
    the colors for the First time when they got in close enough to see clearly
    through the smoke and flames billowing, at times above the mast head.

    6. There are NO available indications that the attack was Intended
    against a U. S. Ship.

    7. LIBERTY’S position at the time of the attack has been previously
    ordered Changed farther to seaward by JCS; however, the messages
    relating to these changes were Not known to the ship before the attack took place.
    The reasons these messages were not known to the ship can be determined
    in all instances except for one. Since LIBERTY records and knowledgeable personnel
    were lost in the action, it is Impossible to determine the disposition of the message.

    8. The communication delays and mis-routing ERRORS which caused these several
    non-deliveries combined with delays in initiating follow-up actions on operational
    instructions received, all contributed to the Ship Itself being Unaware of plans and
    decisions made for her Repositioning. A detailed accounting of the five pertinent
    messages are attached as appendices one through five.
    […….]
    and 44 More.
    […….]

    [signatures]

    Isaac C Kidd
    Rear Admiral , U.S. Navy
    总裁

    Bernard J Lauff
    Captain, U.S. Navy
    会员

    Bert S Atkinson , Jr.
    Captain, U.S. Navy
    会员

    Ward Boston, Jr.
    Captain, U.S. Navy
    Counsel for the Court

  186. http://www.camera.org/index.asp?x_article=161&x_context=3

    [CAPTAIN] MCGONAGLE:
    […]
    “..I did not have an accurate ship’s position at this time, but I knew that to the left of the ship’s course at that time lie shoal waters and by turning to the left I would be approaching land closer than had been given me in directives which I held in that instant in time. I realized that if I attempted to turn to starboard, I would expose a larger target to the torpedo boats. I elected to maintain a heading of 283 at maximum speed. When the boats reached an approximate range of 2,000 yards, the center boat of the formation was Signalling to us.

    Also, at this range, it appeared that they were flying an Israli (sic) flag. This was later verified. It was not possible to read the signals from the center torpedo boat because of the intermittent blocking of view by smoke and flames.
    At this time, I yelled to machine gun 51 to tell him to Hold Fire.

    I realized that there was a Possibility of the aircraft having been Israeli and the attack had been Conducted in Error.
    I wanted to Hold Fire to see if we could read the Signal from the torpedo boat and perhaps avoid additional damage and personnel injuries.

    The man on machine gun 51 fired a short burst at the boats Before he was able to understand what I was attempting to have him do. Instantly, on machine gun 51 opening fire machine gun 53 began firing at the center boat.
    From the starboard wing of the bridge, 03 level,
    I observed that the fire from machine gun 53 was extremely Effective and Blanketed the area and the center torpedo boat.

    It was not possible to get to mount 53 from the starboard wing of the bridge. I sent Mr. LUCAS around the port-side of the bridge, around to the skylights, to see if he could tell QUINTERO, whom I believed to be the gunner on machine gun 53, to hold fire until we were able to clarify the situation. He reported back in a few minutes in effect that he saw no one at mount 53.

    As far as the torpedo boats were concerned, I am sure that they felt They were under fire from the USS LIBERTY. At THIS time They opened fire with their gun mounts and in a matter of seconds one torpedo was noted crossing astern of the ship at about 25 yards.”…..
    ------

    Liberty Lobby PORKED by CAPTAIN of Liberty
    - - -

  187. Anonymous • 免责声明 说: • 您的网站
    @Steve Richter

    Israel Beggged Jordan NOT to enter the War.
    Israel immediately offered back said territories in exchange for mere recognition.
    Arabs Refused in Aug ’67.
    See ‘Khartoum three nos’.

    Only thus and incredibly slowly, ‘occupation’.

    • 回复: @Steve Richter
  188. @David Evans

    大声笑。
    Conspiracy website Globalresearch and boobtube.

  189. uslabor 说:
    @Anonymous

    Then shutup about the holocaust already.

  190. 5371 说:
    @Wizard of Oz

    So you’re the same as the mysterious hasbarite biz? I’m ashamed of you, Wiz.

    • 回复: @biz
    , @Wizard of Oz
  191. Anonymous • 免责声明 说: • 您的网站

    Do Something to Honor the USS LIBERTY and END USA Govt. COVERUP- sign and share:

    WHEREUPON, we, the undersigned, in order to fulfill our duty to the brave crew of the USS Liberty and to all Americans who are asked to serve in our Armed Forces, hereby call upon the Department of the Navy, the Congress of the United States and the American people to immediately take the following actions:

    FIRST: That a new Court of Inquiry be convened by the Department of the Navy, operating with Congressional oversight, to take public testimony from surviving crewmembers; and to thoroughly investigate the circumstances of the attack on the USS Liberty, with full cooperation from the National Security Agency, the Central Intelligence Agency and the military intelligence services, and to determine Israel’s possible motive in launching said attack on a U.S. naval vessel;

    第二:美国国会的每个适当委员会调查白宫和国防部阻止拯救自由号航空母舰的行为,然后威胁她幸存的官兵如果他们揭露真相,并掩盖真实情况来自美国人民的袭击情况; 和

    THIRD: That the eighth day of June of every year be proclaimed to be hereafter known as “USS LIBERTY REMEMBRANCE DAY, in order to commemorate the Liberty’s heroic crew and to educate the American people of the danger to our national security inherent in any passionate attachment of our elected officials for any foreign nation.”

    widely:http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/end-usa-govt-coverup-honor-uss-liberty

  192. iffen 说:

    Is anyone here aware of a resolution of the contradiction between reports that the attacking planes had no markings and the report that a Jewish officer on the ship was observed weeping after seeing the Star of David on the planes? It would seem that whether there was a Jewish officer on board or not could be determined.

    • 回复: @Art
    , @Ace
  193. alexander 说:
    @Rurik

    毫无疑问。

    As a matter of fact the terror attack on our Liberty, set the precedent.

    Zero accountability and total impunity.

    For Israel ,or rather, the ultra belligerent elements within it, false flag terror attacks have become a way of life, and from all the signs I have seen ,a Highly profitable one to boot.

    If one were to define Absolute Power in our age of terror, it is precisely this.

    And the impunity guarantees its perpetuation.

    …when one controls , fabricates, and stages not only all the “major” terror events that occur but even all our responses to it,….there is no doubt who runs the show.

    Soup to nuts…and tens of trillions too.

    Quite a business, Rurik……quite a business.

    • 回复: @Carroll Price
  194. biz 说:
    @5371

    All non-fantastical claims about genetics are now ‘Hasbara’ apparently. The bar ever lowers.

    • 回复: @5371
  195. Regardless of which political party is it power, as long as Jews remain in control of the US government, as well as every other government in the Western world, you can forget about any meaningful investigation of the USS Liberty, 9/11, Boston Bombing, Black Ops Mass Shootings, and numerous other false-flag operations to occur in the US and Western countries over the past 70+ years.

  196. @Sam Shama

    Sam, a person could exaggerate thousands of times the atrocities and lies committed and told by Jews over the past 5000 years, and still come-up far short of portraying reality. As a sort of refresher, start by reading or re-reading the Old Testament, where you will find thousands of atrocities committed and lies recorded by Jewish scribes. And when it comes to proving that bold face lying by the Chosen is still very much in vogue, read or re-read the holocau$t fable which withstands serious inquiry about as well as do Snow White And The Seven Dwarfs, or Alice In Wonderland.

    • 回复: @taxonomy26
  197. gcochran 说:
    @Wizard of Oz

    Shai Carmi did an autosomal analysis to get that 48%, but he used a peculiar model . For the European model population, he used Flemings, while if you wanted to find out the most accurate answer, you would have used a European population that was closer to the group that furnished most of the admixture – Italian. So the real fraction of European ancestry is somewhat higher than 48%. On the other hand he’s much more honest than Behar, who is a liar, or El-Haik, who is just plain crazy.

    In general averaging the mtDNA and Y-chromosome numbers does not necessarily give you the right fraction of autosomal ancestry, although it’s usually in the right ballpark. You can come up with artificial scenarios in which the mtDNA all comes from population A, all the Y chromosomes from population B, and all the autosomal DNA from population C.

    Today you could get a far more accurate number for the Y chromosome ancestry, by sequencing the entire Y chromosome, rather than just looking at STRs. I haven’t seen anyone do this yet.

    proportion Celtic? hardly any, probably.

    The Sephardic Jews of Spain have a somewhat similar ancestry admixture, but I think it’s like repeating a recipe, rather than a common origin: some middle eastern plus european, but not quite the same middle easterners and not the same Europeans. Just as mestizos in Mexico and Chile do not have a common origin.

    A few Sephardics moved to Poland upon expulsion, not many.

    • 回复: @Wizard of Oz
  198. 5371 说:
    @biz

    You don’t make many comments on this site other than to defend Israel, biz or whatever you want to be called. Why might that be?

    • 回复: @biz
  199. @Carroll Price

    It’s so rare to see knuckle-dragging Joo haters like you any more without going to Stormfront, etc.
    And you never back anything you say.
    You’re just a Tourettes Syndrome Jew Hater.

    I support anyone’s right to Make a Case for any opinion, but you just repeat the tritest old canards with NO backing whatsoever.
    It’s a shame they let trailer park trash like you post here.

    • 回复: @Art
  200. @alexander

    And let’s not forget about the hit (in broad daylight) of a sitting US president in the process of winding down a banker’s war in Southeast Asia. After pulling that one off, with nary a hitch, they knew anything would be possible, including 9/11.

    • 回复: @AmericaFirstNow
    , @alexander
  201. Art 说:
    @iffen

    iffen: It is not anti-Semitic to question and inquire about the Liberty incident; the anti-Semitism derives from the motivation to question and inquire.

    Is anyone here aware of a resolution of the contradiction between reports that the attacking planes had no markings and the report that a Jewish officer on the ship was observed weeping after seeing the Star of David on the planes?

    Your inquiry is totally “anti-Semitic!”

    Are you a closet Jew hater?

    • 回复: @iffen
  202. @Carroll Price

    What Motivated the 9/11 Hijackers? See Testimony Most Didn’t:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J1bm2GPoFfg&feature=PlayList&p=F81BB573C9C0C7B2&index=0&playnext=1

    Main Motive of 9/11 Denial:

    Al Qaeda's main motive for the 9/11 attacks was most certainly anger at U.S. support for Israel. Did you listen to the…

    发布者 代表出版社 on 周三,四月13,2016

  203. Art 说:
    @taxonomy26

    It’s a shame they let trailer park trash like you post here.

    Hey Little Jew – you have to do better then that these days. That hardly cutes it here.

    It is back to hasbara class for you little lemming.

    Come back when you can run with the big lemmings.

    (Be sure and tuck in your little brown shirt — good boy.)

    • 回复: @Taxonomy26
  204. alexander 说:
    @Carroll Price

    卡罗尔,

    I can say to a certainty the assassination of Yitzhak Rabin, was the work of Jewish terrorism.

    Certainly we are all aware a showdown was looming between JFK and Israel in regards to Israels nuclear capacity.

    No President was more crystal clear and more adamant that Israel should never have a nuclear weapon.

    It was even reported Kennedy once said that Israel would get the bomb over his “dead body”.

    But correct me if I am wrong, wasn’t it LBJ, Kennedy’s “successor”, who all but approved of the Israeli terror attack on the Liberty ? Didn’t he , in fact, allow it to continue uncontested by US warplanes in the vicinity…..or was that McNamara ?

    Wasn’t it also LBJ who went silent ,in total acquiescence ,while Israel succeeded in acquiring the bomb ?

    These things are the facts of history…are they not ?

  205. iffen 说:
    @Art

    艺术:

    It is true that “anti-Semite” has lost its edge – it is so ubiquitously used against any quibble that it has 没意思.

    艺术:

    Your inquiry is totally “anti-Semitic!”

    Art, I warned you about playing with words; it just highlights your imbecility.

    These statements by you were made only a few hours apart, most people take a few months or years or at least days to forget what they have said.

    I see that you finally accepted that idea that I am not Jewish.

    Let’s try some more, you can cut and paste them for further study:

    I am not a closet anti-Semite; I am not a philo-Semite; I am an anti anti-Semite when they are in my way.

    It is 88s, not 88’s.

    • 回复: @Art
  206. iffen 说:

    嘿,艺术,

    Thanks for slapping # 207’s hand, I thought I was going to have to attend to it.

    As usual your comment was not very useful, but sometimes it is the effort that matters.

    Who does he think he is? Coming in here insulting the Jew haters; like I am not doing a good enough job.

    Anyway, thanks; more like this and we can be BFF? Naw, never mind, we will just be like the USSR and the US and work together against the real evil.

    Art, the sad part for me is that no one responded to my question about the plane’s markings. It’s just like they don’t really care all that much about what really happened; the incident is just one more bead on a rosary of hate facts. It couldn’t be that could it, Art?

    • 回复: @Sam Shama
  207. @Rehmat

    Canada is a strange world, we have a narcissistic self appraisal of ourselves – our freedoms, our decency, our human rights, we are everything that America is not – but if one looks underneath the surface the reality is quite different – I recently crossed the boarder from America to my home in eastern Canada, without my passport – this created a situation for myself, wherein I actually feared for my personal safety. Canadian boarder guards were screaming at me, physically accosting me and for the most part taking away all agency over my life. I have crossed boarders in many different countries, I was always treated well and was never afraid for my personal safety, in my home country, a very different experience. I found out soon after, I have no rights and the guards can do as they please. Compliance to authority is of the utmost importance – according to our highest court.

    That said, you are correct, Canada is an occupied nation – Harper, our last leader, belongs to the Alliance Church – the church’s doctrinal statements hew to the line that through the destruction of Israel is their salvation.

    Harper was an advisor to Preston Manning in the nineteen eighties ( Preston Manning’s father was leader of the Social Credit Party in Alberta – An anti-semitic organization, until the end of WWII)

    Another notable character in Canadian politics is Stockwell Day, whose father was a friend to Jim Keegstra – a schoolteacher in a small backwater town of about 700 people. Jim Keegsta was demonized in the 1980s during Israel’s horrific invasion of Lebanon. Keegsta’s case was a cause célèbre and effectively distracted from Israel’s crimes in the Middle East and gave comfort to Israeli interests.

    Fast-forward to December 13, 2002, the Zionist owned media (Izzy Asper) did a hit peace on David Ahenakew, (First Nations Leader from Saskatchewan) accusing him of spreading hate speech, (the conversation was private, between himself and a reporter) The government revoked his Order of Canada Medal and the poor man died in disgrace. This incident, like the Keegsrta case, was a warning to those who would question Israeli motivations and crimes. Many Canadians did not support the second war in Iraq and knowledgeable commentators were accusing the Americans of going to war for Israeli interests. This and several other incidents chilled any conversation regarding the real motivation for Iraqi War II.

    However, our current prime Minister is promising – his brother Alexandre Trudeau is a reporter who has a decidedly more realistic perspective on Israel. The Zionist media is having a fit over this brotherly connection and are attacking Alexandre’s character. This is illustrated by an obvious hit piece in the Huffington Post in 2012.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/mike-fegelman/alexandre-trudeau_b_2018038.html

    This isn’t Trudeau’s first offense. In 2004, he produced The Fence a totally unbalanced view of life on the Israeli and Arab sides of Israel’s security barrier favouring the Palestinian narrative. In the same production he profiled Zakaria Zubeidi, then leader of the terrorist group Al Aqsa Martyrs Brigades portraying him as a Robin Hood-like “leader of the resistance.” He never once told viewers that Zubeidi’s organization had murdered Arabs, Israeli Jews and foreigners, including a Canadian citizen killed in a bus bombing. Trudeau is also known for his offering public praise for Fidel Castro and for his criticism of the Israeli naval blockade of the Hamas-held Gaza Strip. Zubeidi’s organization had murdered Arabs, Israeli Jews and foreigners, including a Canadian citizen killed in a bus bombing. Trudeau is also known for his offering public praise for Fidel Castro and for his criticism of the Israeli naval blockade of the Hamas-held Gaza Strip.

  208. Art 说:
    @iffen

    I see that you finally accepted that idea that I am not Jewish.

    伊芬

    Yes – it was your post saying that you were an evangelical on your way to becoming an atheist. No Jew would say that. A godless man protecting those claiming to be “god’s chosen.” How crazy.

    You truly are on a path backwards – abandoning your people for those who do them harm. You are an intelligent man who refuses to see the harm Jews do. Poor you.

    A lot of evangelicals are old testament types who pass over Jesus for ancient ways. They pass over modern philosophical idealism for ancient primordial tribalism. Christian idealism has produced what freedom and prosperity humankind enjoys. It is not perfect – just better.

    You must be busting with pride that your Little Jew mentor – Sam – is embracing you 88s attacks. Although, Little Sam may be getting in trouble with the Big Jews for going off script.

    Hmm – a godless Gentile and a “chosen” Jew – cuddling – who would have thought?

    艺术

    • 回复: @Wizard of Oz
  209. @Art

    I put up tons of Facts, incl the Naval Court of Inquiry Findings, and the Testimony of the Liberty’s CAPTAIN.
    NO ANSWER to either.
    Got no game Adolph?

    You put up Nothing but Inuendo and More trailer Park Trash.

    You Tourettes Twins with the Carroll Price/Eva Braun creature?

    You both post NO meaty facts, only garbage.

    It’s funny, you have to wait for mods to be posted, but what do they Not allow?

    This is the worst garabage I’ve see ANYWHERE, even Unmoderated.

    • 回复: @5371
  210. @5371

    Despite your ADHD, dyspraxia or whatever it is that dominates your commenting style you might care to attend to someone who knows what he’s talking about. Greg Cochran, as I said to your deaf ears, and you can now find more #204.

    • 回复: @5371
  211. @Art

    You really don’t know any Jews personally or know anything about them free from mad theories do you?

    I have had professional reasons for knowing lots of Jews and I can say with certainty that there are vast numbers of Jewish atheists including inside Israel though my certain knowledge is about non Israeli Jews. As an atheist of non intensive Anglican/Episcopalian background I continue to puzzle over the apparent belief of many intelligent educated people in an Abrahamic god….

    The puzzle over sticking to being Jewish as an atheist is a slightly different puzzle but still puzzling to me. But maybe Disraeli provided a pride in “race” [tribe] explanation???? I’ve detected it in the Welsh and Viking descendants too, and Australian part Aborigines even.

    • 回复: @Art
  212. @gcochran

    Many thanks Greg. Lots of potential links and questions for me to follow up.

    One immediate question. Where did the observably large amount of red facial hair (and blue eyes) come from in Ashkenazim if not from Celts?

    What about my speculation that there was lots of Celtic ancestry in those “Italians” you mention based on e.g. the not entirely mythical sack of Rome by Cisalpine Gauls variously dated between 410 and 387BC?

  213. chris 说:
    @Anonymous

    My dear, “broken record” (BTW we know you’re one of the regular commentator trolls to this site) this story is far from over until the facts are exposed and the guilty are punished.

    The reason we need to look into this, as described by “alexander” (comment 147), is to determine their methods and to expose the sheer gall which they shamelessly make use of, hiding under the accusation of “antisemitism” when they get caught.

    The Israeli premier during the 67 war, Eshkol had already worked to whitewash the Lavon Affair; the false-flag operation whose victims were to be British and Americans ! Whatever the real goals of the Liberty attack were, the false-flag aspect seems to have been then and seems to continue to be now, standard procedure for the Israeli government.

    Scott Horton says that the reason Reagan pulled all US troops out of Lebanon after the 246 marines were killed is because the US came to suspect that the Israelis had known the attack was going to take place but never passed the warning on to us. When then the story of the Israeli “art students,” shadowing the 911 hijackers, came out, a certain pattern beings to begins to emerge.

    What do you think would have happened if the US had destroyed an Israeli spy ship in an incident like the one which was done to the Liberty? Would they have really glossed over the facts of the matter ? Would everyone from the president on down (but especially the US tax payer) have been let of the hook ?

    What an apt metaphor this is, that they tried to destroy “Liberty” but that it survived in spite of the odds. And just like the ship itself, the story has not died and it’s slowly making a miraculous recovery !

  214. Art 说:
    @Wizard of Oz

    I have had professional reasons for knowing lots of Jews and I can say with certainty that there are vast numbers of Jewish atheists including inside Israel

    z,

    I am sure that any words that I may have on God, Jews, and Israel will be wasted on you.

    I guess there is something to being on the wining bandwagon – it must be fun.

    You chose yours – I chose mine.

    I am an idealist Christian – so the meek are my people.

    艺术

    • 回复: @Wizard of Oz
  215. 5371 说:
    @Wizard of Oz

    That you perceive the argument from authority not only as unanswerable but as the only one possible does not surprise me, Wiz.

    • 回复: @Wizard of Oz
  216. 5371 说:
    @Taxonomy26

    If biz is on the varsity squad of hasbarists, you, Lover of Random Capitalisation, are from the scrub team.

  217. @Art

    The meek are your people? How do you demonstrate that since you clearly are not yourself one of them? You totally lack the modesty – and the good gentle manners – to be classed as meek.

    • 回复: @Art
  218. @5371

    It is difficult to answer you properly when you so clearly don’t know anything about arguments from authority. But try dealing with this.

    Greg Cochran is indeed an acknowleged and published authority and expert on relevant matters of mathemics, and statistical data, pertaining to Ashkenazi ancestry and genetics. You evidently are not but you seem to hold some views which are at variance with Greg’s that are within his area of expertise. He has given us part of his reasoning ehich refutes you. If you wish to preserve even a shred of credibilty for any claim of truth for any of your contested views in future you need to show how you would dispute the Cochran dicta.

    Specifically if you don’t want to be dismissed as a bullshitting blowhard just tell us what is wrong with #205 and argue your case.

    • 回复: @5371
  219. @Wizard of Oz

    At what point after the first hostilities of the war was the Liberty attacked? Consistently with your account it would have had to be almost immediately. Was it? Or don’t you know that vital detail?

    I know the Liberty was attacked hours after it was spotted by the IDF. I am pretty sure it had arrived off the Sinai just recently. Was not there on June 5, when the war started.

    • 回复: @Wizard of Oz
  220. @Anonymous

    Compare the number of Israelis killed by Palestinians before the occupation and since. Obviously much more lethal violence since. Add on the increasing international isolation and hostility toward Israel and Jews. ( being driven out of France ).

    The decision to take the West Bank was not based on security. It is land. Which is not to be critical of that decision. Everyone should just state the facts. The Liberty had to be attacked because the pretext Israel needed to take the West Bank was only going to last for a day or so. Israel could not risk the world knowing what it was about to do by attacking the West Bank.

  221. 5371 说:
    @Wizard of Oz

    Since you send me to Cochran with such dogged determination, Wiz you dear bumbling chap, I will mention that his views seem much more divergent from those of my hasbarist adversary biz than from mine.

  222. @Steve Richter

    I thought you were suggesting that the Israelis feared that the Liberty would allow the US to learn for sure that the war was started by the Israelis and not the other way round. But that surely would require the detection to be done much earlier thsn the Liberty was ib a position to do it. Right???

    • 回复: @Steve Richter
  223. biz 说:
    @5371

    Actually I make comments on other topics, which you can see by clicking on my comment history.

    I see my mission as fundamentally pushing back against lies, disinformation, and incorrectness. I did it here in this thread with regard to your incorrectness (or possibly lies) about how to determine the ancestry proportions of a given population. I do it elsewhere on other topics, on this site and other places.

    As for a supposed focus on Israel, that is because a stunningly high proportion of the lies, disinformation, and incorrectness out there seems to be about Israel and Jews, so I do comment a lot – but not exclusively – about these topics. I leave it for now to the reader to speculate why these particular topics tend to draw so many misinformed and/or dishonest comments, such as yours in this thread.

    • 回复: @5371
    , @Art
  224. 5371 说:
    @biz

    我写的

    [You don’t make many comments on this site other than to defend Israel]

    你回答了

    [Actually I make comments on other topics]

    So tell us, why would you make such a misleading non-denial denial? Does it betray someone practised in the arts of deception?

  225. Art 说:
    @Wizard of Oz

    z,

    You and iffen are former Christians who became atheists. Atheists think of themselves as being intellectually superior. They look down on the universal outlook of Christians and their God. Christians say we are all equal in the eyes of God. Christian philosophy values all human life – it values truth – it values forgives – it says be hopeful – it says to love to your neighbor irrespective of tribal identity. Jesus says “that the truth will set you free.” These intellectual prescriptions are the base of the best part of Western culture. Who can argue with that?

    I find it curious, that as you abandon the Christian God and the Christian philosophy, you revert to supporting tribalness. You go intellectually backwards. You leave something intellectually uplifting, for something that is non-thinking, something that is primordial – something that is animalistic and biological. What is intellectually superior about supporting one tribe over another?

    How do you two intellectually support the old ways of tribalism, how do you intellectually support those who make land claims based on a tribal god, a god that you do not believe exists.

    I find it unbelievable that you two former Christians support the Jews and their tribal pseudo-superiority complex.

    Do you atheists also have the same pseudo-superiority complex – it that way you side with the Jews?

    艺术

    • 回复: @iffen
    , @Wizard of Oz
  226. Art 说:
    @biz

    As for a supposed focus on Israel (denial)

    Gee biz,

    Hmm – are you another godless atheist who supports the tribal Jews like Wiz and iffen do?

    What is with you guys? Why do you favor the powerful over the weak?

    艺术

  227. Sam Shama 说:
    @iffen

    […the sad part for me is that no one responded to my question about the plane’s markings]

    嗨,艾芬
    Just saw this. Reading the transcripts certainly gave me no clues as to whether the contingent was flying incognito. There was something I read in an Israeli blog which seemed to say that they most certainly were [it is a lefty blog, so take it with a grain – a large one] but I shall follow up.

    [btw you do have patience replying to this ‘Art’ avatar, deliberately created to not suppress raw anti-semitism cloaked in unctuous piety and crocodile tears. I listened to his emissions with all the equanimity I could muster for over a year, but decided recently to gaol him in the ‘Ignore’ button up on the left hand corner. Missing chromosomes……]

    • 回复: @iffen
    , @RobinG
  228. iffen 说:
    @Sam Shama

    …you do have patience replying to this ‘Art’…but decided recently to gaol him in the ‘Ignore’ button up on the left hand corner

    I blame you Sam. (smiley) I had Art and Rurik on Ignore, likely since reading their 1st post, but took them off to follow your conversations with them and others such as geo and Talha.

    • 同意: Wizard of Oz
    • 回复: @Wizard of Oz
  229. iffen 说:

    OT

    Does anyone besides me wonder how the SPLC would be in possession of copies of the invoices from The National Alliance detailing customer purchases including membership?

    Not that anyone here would know anything about that type of organization, but you might know someone who knows someone.

    I don’t think that I like the idea of private transaction data being published.

    Are there no protections in place for political membership information or private commercial transactions?

    • 回复: @Wizard of Oz
  230. iffen 说:
    @Art

    你好艺术,

    I know my way around the New Testament and I don’t think there is a “philosophical” Jesus mentioned.

    马修22:14

    14 因为被召的人多,被拣选的人少。

    • 回复: @Art
  231. RobinG 说:
    @Sam Shama

    You know, you can contact surviving members of the USS Liberty crew through their websites. There was at least one Jewish sailor. When or why he cried, you can ask.

    https://www.usslibertyveterans.org/

    http://honorlibertyvets.org/about.html#.V2R0fjPD9qo

    • 回复: @Sam Shama
  232. Sam Shama 说:
    @RobinG

    嗨罗宾,
    I’ll do so, thank you much.

    • 回复: @iffen
  233. Joe Stalin 说:

    “Former NSA Officials Agree

    大卫·C·沃尔什

    自由事件期间美国独特频率的干扰似乎建立了蓄意的意图。 在与作者的独家采访中,几位前国家安全局(NSA)的高级官员对此表示赞同。

    14 年 2003 月 XNUMX 日,美国国家安全局辅助通用技术研究项目的“教父”奥利弗·柯比指出,自由号是“我的宝贝”。 在灾难发生后的几周内,负责运营/生产的副主任柯比在美国国家安全局位于马里兰州米德堡的总部阅读了美国信号情报 (SigInt) 生成的记录和“工作人员报告”。 它们是以色列飞行员在袭击期间的谈话记录。 他说,拦截使他们“绝对确定”他们知道这是一艘美国船只。 Kirby's 是 NSA 高级高级官员基于对 SigInt 材料的个人分析故意公开披露的第一次公开信息。

    在 24 年 2003 月 3 日的一次采访中,空军退役少将约翰莫里森,该机构当时的二把手(也是柯比的继任者)说,他在柯比的调查结果时已被告知并认可了他们。 前美国国家安全局局长威廉·奥多姆退役陆军中将在 2003 年 5 月 2003 日表示,根据这些数据,这次袭击的蓄意在该机构内部“不是一个有争议的问题”。 1977 年 1981 月 XNUMX 日,XNUMX 年至 XNUMX 年担任国家安全局局长的退役海军上将鲍比·雷·英曼表示,他“断然拒绝”克里斯托尔/以色列的论点。 “很难相信[自由]没有被正确识别。” 他说,这是基于他当时与 NSA 高层的谈话,他有直接的了解。 这四个人当时或以后都不知道有任何机构官员反对“故意”的结论。

    Naval Institute Proceedings
    Friendless Fire by David C_ Walsh
    2003年 六月

    • 回复: @AmericaFirstNow
  234. @Art

    I have Christian friends of high intelligence, academic achievement and worldly success who only give me cute answers (quips and wit) to my fundamental question which is as follows.

    The Abrahamic God of Jews, Christians and Muslims is Creator of the universe and all mankind, Omnipotent, Omniscient, Eternal and cares about us and what we do enough to communicate with us from time to time. How can there be such a being when, if we know anything, we know that he gave the ancient Hebrews instructions to commit genocide, Jesus’s and Paul’s version was very different, Mahomet’s was different again without God stepping in to say he wasn’t the genuine article …. and beyond all that there were dozens of conflicting teachings from Early Fathers to Cathars to Calvinists and beyond? Add to that the known fact that the father of all mankind has not acted as such in relation to billions of Hindus, Buddhists and animists. At the very least your conception of a Creator God who is intetested in what we do has to be radically different from any of the Abrahamic versions. (Logically my version that He was lonely and bored so decided to set off billions of multiverses and entertain himself by merely watching how they turned out makes sense though my Cardinal friend said “I don’t think that is quite standard Christian doctrine” and I have yet to try it on my rabbi friend who would at least acknowledge that the Hebrew bible’s deity is sometimes more judgmental than loving).

    So why don’t you abandon your deity who, as “Saint” (Sir) Thomas More clearly saw needs promises and threats of life after death to keep the strong from oppressing the weak and think through the morality that we can derive by thought and observation starting with evolution of our hominid ancestors?

  235. @iffen

    The only protection i guess in the land of the First Amendment would be found in criminal law against theft and maybe Copyright law. But i doubt that Copyright law wluld stop you saying that A,B,and C are each members of XYZ and made donations of $PQ….

  236. @iffen

    I belong to a club where one of our averagely eccentric members was heard to say “What i like about this club is that it makes me feel normal”. Responding to all on UR doesn’t.

  237. @Wizard of Oz

    I thought you were suggesting that the Israelis feared that the Liberty would allow the US to learn for sure that the war was started by the Israelis and not the other way round. But that surely would require the detection to be done much earlier thsn the Liberty was ib a position to do it. Right???

    it was two separate wars. Sinai and then the West Bank and Golan. Sinai being tactical. West Bank and Golan strategic. Success in taking the West Bank was critical to Israel the nation, the people. On June 8 the IDF had to decide quickly what to do about the Liberty. The window for taking the West Bank would be open for only a day or two.

    • 回复: @alexander
    , @Wizard of Oz
  238. Anonymous • 免责声明 说:

    USS Liberty has nothing lost there, 7000 miles away from US coastal waters.
    Those indispensable Ubermenshen were spying there, hence an act of war. And tehy got a lesson which they deserve.
    However those fighter planes didn’t finsh them all off. Unfortunately.

  239. alexander 说:
    @Steve Richter

    It is interesting you suggest that taking the West Bank and the Golan were “critical ” to Israel as a nation and as a people.

    Can you explain how this is so ?

    Why was it crucial to do this ?

    • 回复: @steve richter
  240. Joe Stalin 说:

    “Those indispensable Ubermenshen were spying there, hence an act of war. ”

    That must mean when I fire up the old shortwave radio to look for mil comms, that must be an act of war. Or if I try to snoop for Inmarsat signals from satellites. In non-combatant areas.

    Pretty bad writing for a troll.

  241. WhatEvvs 说:
    @iffen

    Thanks – I did used to know a pianist whose online moniker was 88Keys, because that’s what a piano has. Great guy.

    I wonder if Giraldi will tell us what he thinks of this:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kunduz_hospital_airstrike

    As far as the “sworn to secrecy” thing goes….ROFL.

    • 回复: @iffen
  242. @alexander

    Can you explain how this is so ?

    Golan provides security from Syria. But I guess not critical in that they have not moved people onto that territory. The West Bank clearly is never to be returned. Jerusalem is the capital, many settlements have been built. And Israel needs the space. This all seems obvious,no?

    • 回复: @annamaria
  243. Art 说:
    @iffen

    I know my way around the New Testament and I don’t think there is a “philosophical” Jesus mentioned.

    iffen and Wiz,

    God gave us brains or rather God’s universe evolved us to have brains. Before we acquired brains, we had biological gonads (actually mammalian brain stems) that directed our actions. We each have to make decisions about how to live longer, about how to get to tomorrow. Some people us their brains more then they use their gonads. Those that use their brains to make decisions about how to get to tomorrow, use a set of learned intellectual viewpoints to direct their actions. Those viewpoints are learned from personal experiences and culture. Put altogether, these views are called a philosophy for living. Some philosophies work better at building tomorrows then others.

    As we humans have progressed, small tribes have evolved in great nations and great religions. All religions have two intellectual components to them. One component prescribes how we should connect and interact with god. The other component prescribes how should connect and interact with each other. Different religions have different prescriptions for living.

    No human has ever truly known god – all we have are ever progressing viewpoints. Jesus gave us God 2.0. He undated the previous viewpoint of god. His God 2.0 was merciful, loving, forgiving, and hopeful. God 1.0 was harsh and vengeful. Jesus’ viewpoint on human relations are idealistic. He prescribed hope, respect for life, love for one’s neighbor, seeking truth, forgiving, and extending grace to all. (Considering the nature of organized religion, how these ideals ever filtered down to us today is a miracle.)

    You godless atheists have thrown out the idealist Christian baby with the religious bathwater.

    You two have embraced the mean old gonad god 1.0 by supporting the Jew tribe.

    Is atheism really progress – or it just reverting to the gonad world of the strong over the week?

    艺术

    • 回复: @NoseytheDuke
    , @helena
  244. annamaria 说:
    @steve richter

    “Golan provides security from Syria. But I guess not critical in that they have not moved people onto that territory. The West Bank clearly is never to be returned. Jerusalem is the capital, many settlements have been built. And Israel needs the space. This all seems obvious,no?”

    yes, absolutely. That was a very good explanation of the rationale of the ongoing war in Syria (and for Israel’s tacit support for “freedom fighters” of ISIS and Al Qaida). http://www.globalresearch.ca/twenty-six-things-about-the-islamic-state-isil-that-obama-does-not-want-you-to-know-about/5414735
    http://www.globalresearch.ca/israeli-military-support-to-syria-al-qaeda-terrorists-operating-out-of-the-golan-hights/5369619
    Do you personally believe that Oded Yonon Plan has been a guiding blueprint for the US/UK Lobby?

  245. Anonymous • 免责声明 说:
    @Fran Macadam

    Once again, we are played for patsies.

    Ever since I could vote, I’ve had to choose
    between the “LESSER OF TWO WEASELS)!

    That way, the conclave of self-interest that runs this country stays in power, while playing to the competitive drive in a country seemingly unable to be able to count higher than two.

    It’s our patriotic duty to criticize any other country, including Israel, that steps over the line, and, to also criticize anyone in this country who won’t step up to insist that other governments be held accountable.

    Shut the hell up, both Billary and Frump!
    You may get elected, but you are both only involved in your self-interest as your primary motivation. It’s beyond nauseating.

  246. @Steve Richter

    That makes sense but how did Israel get up the Sinai conflict in the first instance?

  247. iffen 说:
    @WhatEvvs

    Yes, we can put 88keys into the last paragraph that I copied from ADL.

    The hospital strike is very unfortunate. I really hate to see people like the MSF group becoming victims of the war. I don’t know how we can delineate the sequence of events that led to this incident. Were they relying on Afgan intelligence or not? I know that the US has been abused and used over the years in the never ending wars. Hopefully we are getting better. I still wonder if there is not some unfortunate dipwad still stuck in Gitmo because he was owed money by some operative that was savy enough to catch the ear of some 2nd Lt on the make.

    Many opportunities for double and triple bank shots.

  248. Anonymous • 免责声明 说:

    The US was spying on Israel and giving the info to the Arabs.
    After the Holocaust Israel was not going to go down and be murdered en masse by genocidal Muslims.
    再也不。

    You guys say NOTHING about:
    A. RUSSIA —
    1) shot down Korean Air Lines Flight 902
    2.) Korean Air Lines Flight 007,

    These civilian airlines were spying for the US

    B.) AMERICA–
    1.) Iran Air Flight 655 shot down by US fighter jet
    2.)TWA 800 -shot down by “stray” US Navy missile–or was it an Iranian missile? ALL COVERED UP BY BILL CLINTON.

    C. CHINESE –
    1.) Hainan incident where a US spy plane collided with a Chinese plane and was brought down with the Chinese holding the crew and dismantling the plane and stealing US secrets

    D.) the recent incident where river patrol boats were spying on Iran and Iran captured the crew and humiliated them for the word to see. The truth of the whole incident has been embargoesd

    So you see the US has a LONG history of spying on and behaving aggressively towards some countries who never harmed them.

    You sow what you reap. Israel will defend itself to the ends of the earth.
    永远不会

    Blame the American Govt for the USS Liberty.
    You dont spy on friends and give intel to their enemy who ultimately is your enemy too

    So come come with this BS about how Israel attacked an innocent ship–it was no such thing It was SPYING.

    • 回复: @iffen
    , @annamaria
    , @annamaria
    , @Blake
  249. @Art

    艺术,

    What do you think of the writings of Bishop Spong?

    谢谢

  250. Joe Stalin 说:

    “Iran Air Flight 655 shot down by US fighter jet”

    I’m unaware of ANY IR655 flight being downed by a US fighter jet. What kind of jet? Piloted by who? Carrier or land based? Cannon or air-to-air? Inquiring minds want to know!

    “So come come with this BS about how Israel attacked an innocent ship–it was no such thing It was SPYING.”

    So, can I take it you approved of the taking of the USS Pueblo by North Korea? After all, it too was in INTERNATIONAL waters.

  251. Art 说:

    Thanks NosytheDuke,

    He is new to me.

    I am looking into him – this is very interesting.

    Again Thanks — Art

    • 回复: @NoseytheDuke
  252. helena 说:
    @Art

    I’ve said it before – I agree completely with your analysis of religion. Religion and Politics are no different in the sense that they are ideologies about how we live; how we treat each other, what we do when we get up in the morning. That’s the whole point of ‘culture’ – not having to start from scratch every time social interaction occurs because ‘the rules of engagement’ are understood and shared.

    I don’t know if it is deliberate but all discussions about religion in the political sphere (the realm of ‘current affairs’) go round and round discussing imponderables such as ‘does god exist’ or, irrelevant accessories such as what additional cloth to wear where, and how often to pray.

    I also agree that christianity has given us the only workable template for peaceful societies. And I say that because even though Buddhism has a lot of good points, it is not based on the concept of 社体的一部分. The key behavioural memes, as you point out are ‘neighbour’, ‘forgiveness’, ‘honesty’.

    Instead of ‘never again’ (war) we should be thinking more along the lines of ‘for evermore’ (peace).

    • 回复: @Art
  253. iffen 说:
    @Anonymous

    The US was spying on Israel and giving the info to the Arabs.

    Do you have any facts to back this opinion?

    The only plausible explanation for a deliberate attack that I can come up with is that the Israelis had no confidence in the ability of the USN to keep any information about troop movements out of the hands of the Soviets and therefore the Arabs. You have added the possibility that it would have been a willful act on the part of the US to manipulate the war to a conclusion that it considered desirable, very interesting.

  254. @Art

    I’ve read a couple of his books. The one I enjoyed the most was Jesus for the non-religious.

    • 回复: @Art
  255. annamaria 说:
    @Anonymous

    Firedup,

    Please detach from the USA already. The USSLiberty incident is a case in study for showing the pernicious influence of the Lobby on the US policies. Since the USSLiberty tragedy they ziocons have pushed the US towards the Middle East wars that both emptied the US treasury and “enhanced” the image of the US due to 3 million dead (the innocents of all ages) and 10 million refugees (don’t you like the pics of dead children washed out on the shores of Europe?) These wars have been following the Oded Yinon Plan for Eretz Israel. http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/pdf/The%20Zionist%20Plan%20for%20the%20Middle%20East.pdf
    Meanwhile, the “Never Again” has become a battle cry for the Israeli power-thirsty racists of uncertain ethnicity like you spectacular Avigdor Lieberman, a Moldovan felon. The “Never Again” does not stop Israelis (and Israel-firsters like Nuland and Kagans) from cooperating with “freedom fighters” of ISIS and neo-nazis of the regime-changed Ukraine. By the way, is Kolomojsky (the Ukrainian oligarch that financed the neo-nazi thugs of Azov battalion involved in burning alive some 40 civilians in Odessa) is still an Israeli citizen?
    Don’t even think of accusing me of anti-semitism: it was Hanna Arndt, the best among the news Jews, who predicted the danger of triumph of banality of evil in Israel. There is a difference between Bach and Hitler (both were Germans) and between Einstein and Netanyahu (Jews).

  256. Joe Stalin 说:

    “Korean Air Lines Flight 007”
    “These civilian airlines were spying for the US”

    “The US planned to find the black boxes of the passenger aircraft but was outstripped by the USSR who detected the boxes first. All the data deciphered by the USSR after the catastrophe was handed over to South Korea in 1992 by Russian President Boris Yeltsin.

    “The International Civil Aviation Organization conducted an investigation into the case and concluded that the ill-fated passenger plane had deviated from its initial course due to the Korean pilots’ mistake and then erroneously intruded into Soviet airspace.

    “Japan’s Foreign Ministry has declassified diplomatic documents proving that the shooting down of the Korean Air Boeing-747 by the USSR was an accident, not an act of intentional “barbarism” as Washington tried to convince the international community for decades.

    http://sputniknews.com/politics/20151227/1032377880/washington-lied-ussr-downed-ke007-by-accident.html

  257. Joe Stalin 说:

    “Korean Air Lines Flight 902”
    ““These civilian airlines were spying for the US”

    “Bosov incorrectly identified the plane as a United States Air Force reconnaissance RC-135. When reporting back to Tsarkov, Bosov said he could see a maple leaf on the plane’s tail, implying that it belonged to North Atlantic Treaty Organisation (NATO). After a few moments, he corrected himself, stating that he could see Chinese characters and the “maple leaf” was actually a red stork with wings spread.[5]

    “According to Kim’s account of the attack, the interceptor approached his aircraft from the right side rather than the left as required by International Civil Aviation Organization (ICAO) regulation.[5] Kim decreased his speed and turned on the navigation lights, indicating that he was ready to follow the Soviet fighter for landing.[5]

    “According to Soviet reports, the intruder repeatedly ignored commands to follow the interceptor, and Flight 902 began drifting toward Finland. However, tapes released by Rovaniemi Area Control Centre show that Kim transmitted a call signal three times immediately prior to being shot down and attempted to communicate with the intercepting pilot.

    “Bosov tried to convince his superiors that the plane was not a military threat, but after receiving orders to shoot it down[4][5] he fired a pair of R-60 missiles. The first missile flew past the target.[5] The second one hit the left wing, knocking off approximately four meters of its length. The missile also punctured the fuselage, causing rapid decompression and jamming one of the plane’s four turbines.[5]

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_Air_Lines_Flight_902

  258. Art 说:
    @helena

    Instead of ‘never again’ (war) we should be thinking more along the lines of ‘for evermore’ (peace).

    海伦娜,

    Very nice – well said. Good is not the absence of bad – good must be worked at. We all want to last longer and longer. The strength to overcome the vagaries of nature comes from making rational positive connections with each other. Christian idealism guides us in making the rational decisions, that make positive long-term connections with each other. It is those connections that buttress us from the whims of nature. Those connections are not static – they have to be continuously worked at.

    Loving is about the future. When you love someone, you want a better future for them. When “you love your neighbor as you love yourself“ - and they do the same – a better future is made for THEM and for YOU. The Christian ideals of hope, life, love, truth, forgiving, and grace – are NOT sweet nothings – they are not feel good platitudes – they are everyday practical measures to a better more lasting ongoing fruitful life.

    艺术

  259. Art 说:
    @NoseytheDuke

    NosytheDuke – Thanks again

    Here is another fine YouTube video of Bishop Spong.

    “What a New Christianity for a New World will Contain”

    This is different – very thoughtful.

    It is for everyone – but atheists (they already know everything – they even know what they can’t prove).

    艺术

  260. Priss Factor [又名“匿名者”] 说: • 您的网站

    http://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/cuomo-and-b-d-s-can-new-york-state-boycott-a-boycott

    Powerful Jews use their gentile puppets to ban a boycott of Zionist oppression of Palestinians. Jews say you must comply with Zionist imperialism and oppression, or you will be destroyed. Jews who made a big deal of their role in the boycott to end Southern Segregation and South African apartheid(even though Israel was then South Africa’s #1 ally) are now saying that if you boycott Israel for its human right violations and imperialism, YOU will be destroyed.

    That is how power works. So, powerful Jews can say and do anything. Truth and Justice are whatever Jews say it is. Jews can even fool morons into believing ‘gay marriage’ is real marriage and that those who boycott homo degeneracy will be destroyed.
    That is globalism in action. If you boycott homo decadence and Zionist oppression, YOU will be targeted and destroyed. You must comply with Homo Imperialism. You must comply with Zionist oppression and terror against Palestinians.

    Jewish-and-Homo imperialists destroyed Middle East and North Africa and set off a massive refugee crisis, but these a**holes say that EUROPE must take in all these ‘refugees’.

    If they don’t, they are labeled as ‘Nazis’ or the ‘far right’.

    So, surrender to the Jewish flag and the homo flag, the proxy flag of Jewish Globalist Imperialism. Jews fund the homo agenda all over the world.

    Incidentally, Cuomo’s collaborationist outfit will punish businesses with $250,000 if they refer to man-in-dress-and-wig as ‘he’ than ‘she’. That is America under Jewish and Homo power. A clown show.

    We need PALESTINIANS AS A METAPHOR.

    We are all Palestinians living under Zio-Globalist Occupation.

    EU, US, Australia, and Canada are NOT free nations. They are Occupied Territories just like ‘Israel'(once Palestine) and West Bank.

    Since Jews don’t have the numbers to demographically take over US, Canada, Australia, and EU nations(like they did with Palestine), Jews use masses of Third World hordes as proxy so that whites will lose the electoral power to potentially unite against Jewish power.
    Jews plan to use browns, blacks, yellows, and Muslims against whites. Of course, white cuck-collaborators like Merkel, Hillary, Blair, Cameron, Hollande, and Trudeau are handsomely rewarded materially, and so they betray their own people and serve the Jews and Homos. And plenty of white millennials have been raised from cradle to be SJW-types.

    WE ARE ALL PALESTINIANS-AS-METAPHOR.

    Democracy can be a form of Imperialism.
    为什么以及如何?
    Democracy is about rule of majority. So, if you change the majority, the nature of power in democracy changes.

    What would happen if Palestinians were to become the electoral majority in Israel? Say goodbye to Israel as a Jewish state(just like South Africa is no longer a Boer Republic but a Bongo Wasteland — but things are still so awful in other black African nations that blacks still mill into South Africa). For Israel to continue as a Jewish state even after Arabs constitute the majority, democracy would have to be ended, and there must be something like Apartheid(which is the case in West Bank). Democracy empowers and ensures Jews in Israel ONLY AS LONG AS Jews are the majority. With a Jewish majority, democracy is a great blessing to the Jews. With an Arab majority, democracy would be the worst enemy to the Jews.

    Of course, you don’t necessarily need majority power to have power if your people are smart enough to gain control of all media, most of academia, law, politicians, and etc. Jews are only 2% of the US, but they have elite control of key institutions and industries. Also, as Holocaust has been made the faith of the West, it is taboo to say anything negative about Jews. It’d be like anyone badmouthing God or Jesus in the Middle Ages. Jews made it so that Jews, Homos, and blacks are quasi-deified. They are godly. Any criticism of Jews is ‘antisemitism’. Any criticism of blacks is ‘racism’. Any criticism of homo is ‘homophobia’. Only those three groups have special words to denounce any criticism of them.

    Because Jews have special smarts and talents, they can gain tremendous power in a democracy without majority power. Since they control media, finance, academia, and politicians, they can sway, manipulate, and control the hearts, minds, eyes, and ears of the majority.

    In contrast, white people need demographic majority power to maintain dominance in Western nations. So, when even their majority status slips from them, they are Palestinianized and finished.

    Look what happened to Palestinians once they were made the minority in what became Israel. We like to think that democracy empowers a people, but it can disempower a people if they become the minority and are out-voted by the new majority.
    Look what happened to white conservatives in California. They once used to dominate the state. Today, they are nothing no matter how much they vote for conservative policies.
    Same democracy but different results because brown-yellow-black votes came to vastly outnumber the white vote. Also, Jewish power and money bought up all the cuck-collaborators among the remaining whites.

    So, the idea of spreading ‘freedom through democracy’ isn’t necessarily true if you change the demographic balance of a nation.

    Suppose there is a nation that is dictatorial and repressive.
    Suppose US invades and brings democracy to that nation. Sounds good, right?
    If the US doesn’t mess with the demographic balance of the nation, things might turn out good for the native people via democracy. Democracy did good for Japanese and Germans after WWII since their nations were all Japanese or all German.

    But suppose US not only brings democracy but demographic changes whereby the native majority soon becomes a minority to masses of new arrivals.
    In that case, democracy will not empower but enslave the natives since democracy will favor the majority of new arrivals.

    Whites not only conquered Hawaii but invited in tons of yellows. With whites and yellows vastly outnumbering native Hawaiians, democracy doesn’t do any good for the native Hawaiians. Whites and yellows will always out-vote them if the natives want national independence and want to take Hawaii back.

    So, democracy is two-edged sword. It will free and empower your people if they constitute the solid majority. But it will disadvantage and enslave your people if they become the minority who are outvoted by the new majority.

    Jews gained control of the West. As globo-imperialist rulers, they decided to bring in masses of non-whites, turn them against whites, and use them as the new majority against whites.
    When whites were the solid majority, democracy was on their side. It was their great weapon.
    But now as whites become minorities, democracy is becoming their mortal enemy, their gloom-and-doom oppressor. Look at London, the English capital, that is now run by some dotkin mayor.

    It’s not about Left vs Right. It is about whites under Jewish globo-imperialist rule. Jews seek to weaken white power by bringing in tons of non-whites.

    As whites increasingly become smaller in number, they can only win by voting as a unified bloc(like whites do in the American South), but white vote remains divided because Jews run media & academia and have poisoned so many white minds with ‘white guilt’, ‘diversity mania’, ‘jungle fever’, ‘bamboo fever’, ‘exotica’, and shallowness all around.

  261. Jeff Gates, author of
    on Abe Fortas and pre-planning of the 1967 war and the attack on the USS Liberty

    H / T https://vidrebel.wordpress.com/2013/07/10/the-jewish-strategy-of-occupying-the-middle-ground/

  262. iffen 说:
    @Sam Shama

    评论 #270 链接到 Friendless Fire? 大卫·C·沃尔什。

    我阅读了 Walsh 的文章,引用如下:

    “偏见的暗示尤其让犹太幸存者感到不安,例如高级工程官乔治·戈尔登……”

    根据他的在线讣告:

    George H. Golden, Jr., “was the engineering officer aboard the ill-fated USS Liberty” and was “a deacon at Pentecostal Free Will Baptist Church.”

  263. “The Occupation of the American Mind” with Pink Floyd’s Roger Waters – WATCH FULL INTERVIEW

  264. anon • 免责声明 说:
    @Lot

    <>

    People seem to forget that the 1967 war was started by Israel. The fact that Israel won so easily speaks volumes on the power disparity between Israel and its “enemies”.

    This was actually not the first attempt by Israel to worsen US-Egyptian relations. A previous effort was the Lavon Affair of 1954, in which spies from Israel planted bombs targeting US owned properties in Egypt.

    • 回复: @Momus
  265. Art 说:

    It is Hasbara 101 Rule #4 – never ever totally admit to anything.

    Even though Israel has admitted to some culpability in the USS Liberty attack – we see, the current crop of Little Jews are still fighting, attacking, and calling people names over it.

    p.s. They even have their little sycophantic atheist friends going bonkers.

  266. Blake 说:
    @Anonymous

    I guess your world is a world where only weepies about the so called Holocaust or fake history yarns like Ben Hur revolves around.

    If people did not care about Phil why are you here in the first place? Clearly you are envious.

  267. Blake 说:
    @Anonymous

    Now why would they do that? If it wasnt for the US there wouldnt be no poxy sh*t stirring parasite called ‘israel’ and the world would be a much much safer place – and the US would be much better off. Lets face it you are a sick people who were never capable of sane rational policies. Sociopaths who start wars then play the victims.

  268. Ace 说:
    @Lot

    What garbage. So the Israelis, while involved in a major war, confused the Liberty with an Egyptian horse transport.

    When a small nation is at war on many fronts, one of its top priorities would be to deny one of its enemies horse transportation! Unfortunately for the men of the Liberty, after Israeli reconnaisance aircraft closely examined the Liberty on that clear morning with the U.S. ensign prominently displayed, the Israelis, so help me God, confused a U.S. warship with an Egyptian horse transport and attacked it.

    Friendly fire. No doubt about it.

  269. Ace 说:
    @iffen

    No. IOW, the burden of proof that a “holocaust denier” is anti-Semitic is on the proponent of that point.

    Can one say that there is “an extremely narrow window of inquiry into the ‘reality’ of Jewish feelings of friendship for Christians” so that Jews are anti-Christian until proven otherwise?

    Who decides what is an extremely narrow window of inquiry on any issue?

    • 回复: @iffen
  270. Ace 说:
    @Steve Richter

    It’s been a while since I read Innes’s original book but I don’t remember any reconnaissance a/c encountering the Liberty after the first plane. If that’s true, the later attack took place only because of that identification. The identification went up the chain to the Israeli officers who ordered the strike on the Liberty. They knew it was a U.S. ship. If the later observation was not based on that original report but, say, from a radar contact, the later observation was made by Israeli pilots who had the same opportunity to ID the ship as the first plane. Ergo, their own observation was sufficient to ID the ship.

    Since the official Israeli version was that their pilots — 所有 of the attacking pilots — mistakenly identified the Liberty as an Egyptian horse transport. 不是一个 of the pilots, supposedly, noticed the American flag on the ship. Then you have to believe that the Israeli jets were so worried about a horse transport that they made a 持续 attack on the Liberty and that Israeli torpedo boats were also called in to destroy this high-value target and that it was necessary to machine gun the sailors trying to lower boats into the water. The diversion of such high-value Israeli assets and the launch of one very expensive torpedo at a time when Israel had much bigger fish to fry makes the “misidentification” nonsense hard to swallow.

    And we know that one of the Israeli pilots objected to firing on an American ship but was ordered to do so anyway, IIRC.

    Plus the markings on the Israeli fighters were covered up. Is that something nations do when their planes are engaged in routine combat operations?

  271. Ace 说:
    @Joe Stalin

    The issue of the frequencies that the Israelis jammed is telling. Warships, police, armies, citizen band, ham radio use assigned portions of the spectrum and within those allocations specific frequencies are used. I’m not a SIGINT analyst but I figure it was no accident that the precise freqs of the Liberty were jammed. The Israelis knew the freqs of that American warship.

    The idea that the Israelis used a blunderbuss approach seems ridiculous to me.

    On an unrelated point, I read one account that said that a U.S. sub was in the area but could not respond because, I presume, of having a higher-priority strategic mission.

  272. Ace 说:
    @iffen

    Were the type of fighters the Israelis had also possessed by others combatants in that war? If not, any man on the Liberty would have been able to determine the nationality of the pilots even if the planes’ markings were obscured.

  273. iffen 说:
    @Ace

    Who decides

    我做。

    If you think that the Nazis didn’t try to exterminate European Jews you are a major retard. If you know it and deny it that makes you a retarded 88.

    I have no interest in debating Holocaust details with you or anyone else. My interest is in identifying 88s and anti-Semitism.

  274. Art 说:

    The USS Liberty – Rachel Corrie – the Jews never admit anything – it is always attack attack attack.

    The Jew are a sick paranoid people with a sick culture. Poor them.

  275. taxonomy26 说:

    [CAPTAIN] MCGONAGLE:
    […]
    “”..I did not have an accurate ship’s position at this time, but I knew that to the left of the ship’s course at that time lie shoal waters and by turning to the left I would be approaching land closer than had been given me in directives which I held in that instant in time. I realized that if I attempted to turn to starboard, I would expose a larger target to the torpedo boats. I elected to maintain a heading of 283 at maximum speed.
    When the boats reached an approximate range of 2,000 yards, the center boat of the formation was Signalling to us.

    Also, at this range, it appeared that they were flying an Israli (sic) flag. This was later verified. It was not possible to read the signals from the center torpedo boat because of the intermittent blocking of view by smoke and flames.
    At this time, I yelled to machine gun 51 to tell him to Hold Fire.
    I realized that there was a Possibility of the aircraft having been Israeli and the attack had been Conducted in Error.
    I wanted to Hold Fire to see if we could read the Signal from the torpedo boat and perhaps avoid additional damage and personnel injuries.

    The man on machine gun 51 fired a short burst at the boats Before he was able to understand what I was attempting to have him do. Instantly, on machine gun 51 opening fire machine gun 53 began firing at the center boat.
    From the starboard wing of the bridge, 03 level,
    I observed that the fire from machine gun 53 was extremely Effective and Blanketed the area and the center torpedo boat.
    It was not possible to get to mount 53 from the starboard wing of the bridge. I sent Mr. LUCAS around the port-side of the bridge, around to the skylights, to see if he could tell QUINTERO, whom I believed to be the gunner on machine gun 53, to hold fire until we were able to clarify the situation. He reported back in a few minutes in effect that he saw no one at mount 53.

    As far as the torpedo boats were concerned, I am sure that they felt They were under fire from the USS LIBERTY. At THIS time They opened fire with their gun mounts and in a matter of seconds one torpedo was noted crossing astern of the ship at about 25 yards.”…”
    `

  276. llloyd 说: • 您的网站

    A new book is being published in U.S. concerning USS Liberty and being publicised in media. Title: Blood In The Water. The author is a Philadelphia professor of English and creative writing, Joan Mellen. Maybe somewhere in America a woman professor of English has an expertese in American military history. Her source is a David Lewis who was an officer on USS Liberty and says he in attack had his ear drums blown out. Lewis (note surname) despite his injuries was able to retire as a navy commander and report on a confidential conversation with Lyndon Johnston that Johnston personally ordered the fighter planes en route to defend Liberty to return to base. The new book claims that Johnston ordered the IDF to attack Liberty so as to bring about regime change to Egypt. Johnston was in 1967 at the height of the Vietnam war, involving half a million American service men. Why suddenly his desire to overthrow Egypt then not a threat to U S interests? What non Israeli leader has ever been able to order the IDF to do anything? Why would Johnston order the destruction of a ship indispensible for intelligence gathering? This book makes Johnson a mass murderer of American service men. This was a man who loved the US military and was dependant on them for winning the Vietnam war. All sounds fishy after at last wide publicity about the Liberty. As Gilradi says, Israel’s deception. Start a war and blame some one else

    • 回复: @bjondo
  277. Archie1954 说:
    @Anonymous

    Mr. Giraldi please don’t listen to Anonymous. It is beyond important for justice to be done and the American traitors including the phoney “hero” McLain be exposed for what they are. Many people still care that American sailors were slaughterd by Israelis and many more want them punished!

  278. Anonymous [AKA "Bill Silverthumb"] 说: • 您的网站
    @Anonymous

    I can see why you’re anonymous. Our brave navy men were needlessly killed by Israel and the powers that be want to hide it from the American people. I don’t care if it happened in 1867 or 1967, the people have a right to know what Israel is really about, killing Palestinians by the thousands and confining them to a ghetto. You’re comments are extremely biased and quite disgusting, and those words apply to you, you are an ignorant pig.

  279. bjondo 说:
    @llloyd

    Yeah, blame US (the Chomsky rule) not Israel.

  280. Momus 说:
    @anon

    Egypt’s bellicosity started the 6 day war and Israel won probably the most resounding military victory ever.

    After the war Egypt ditched the USSR and bought it’s weapons from the US and later, after they had their arses I handed to them again in 1973 had the US help broker a treaty which has reliably held.

    • 回复: @geokat62
  281. geokat62 说:
    @Momus

    Egypt’s bellicosity started the 6 day war…

    LOL

  282. faris Mee 说:

    “Tell the Sixth Fleet to get those aircraft back immediately,” McNamara barked at the chief of Naval Operations.
    Admiral David L. McDonald, the chief of Naval Operations: “You get those fucking airplanes back on deck, and you get them back down.”
    The planes turned around. And the attack on the Liberty continued.

    If you had half a brain you’d see Amerika was responsible for the attack on the USS LIBERTY.

  283. Jhawk 说:
    @Anonymous

    Mr. Anonymous is a troll from you know where…

  284. Pat Kittle 说:

    [1964]:
    — US FALSELY claimed an Asian country attacked a US Navy ship (Tonkin Gulf “incident”).
    [RESULT]:
    — This Big Lie was the pretense for a horrific war against the falsely accused country.

    [1967]:
    — An Asian country did in fact KNOWINGLY attack a US Navy ship, a blatant act of war against the US.
    [RESULT]:
    — The attacking country has been fantastically rewarded by the US ever since.

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Personal 古典文学
他们在与中东打交道时不应该退缩吗?
华盛顿启用的现代格尔尼卡
在提名候选人之前给候选人施加压力
但是它甚至是朋友吗?
今天的中央情报局是为承包商和官僚服务的,而不是为国家服务的。