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Question 1: Hitler
In the West, we’re taught that Hitler is the embodiment of all evil, but it’s more complicated than that, isn’t it? The more I read about Hitler, the more convinced I am that his views about the Versailles Treaty were fairly commonplace among Germans living at the time. It seems to me that if Hitler hadn’t emerged as the leader who promised to restore Germany (to its original borders), someone else would have taken his place. The real problem was the injustice of the treaty itself which exacted reparations that could not be repaid along with the partitioning of the German state. It was the onerous settlement of Versailles that ensured there would be Second World War not Hitler.
Am I wrong about this? And would you agree that our over-simplified “cartoonish” portrayal of Hitler prevents people from understanding the events that led to WW2?
Ron Unz—You’re correct on all those points, but the true history is even worse than that.
Germany had been very successful during the early years of the First World War, repeatedly defeating the Russians while occupying portions of northern France, but nevertheless its leaders then sought to end the horrible mutual slaughter in 1916 by proposing a peace without winners or losers. However, most of the Allied leadership harshly rejected any peace negotiations and were instead determined to continue the war until Germany was defeated and permanently crippled. I discussed that important forgotten history in a long article last year.
- American Pravda: Lost Histories of the Great War
Ron Unz • The Unz Review • November 28, 2022 • 8,100 Words
A couple of years later, after America had entered the war, Germany agreed to an armistice—an end to the fighting—on the basis of President Woodrow Wilson’s Fourteen Points, which seemed to offer a fair peace without a victory for either side. But this turned out to be a bait-and-switch operation, since once Germany had withdrawn its army from French territory and given up its powerful naval forces, the Allies then imposed a brutal starvation blockade upon the weakened country, inflicting many hundreds of thousands of civilian deaths until the new German government finally accepted very harsh peace terms. These included the dismemberment and occupation of portions of their country, permanent military weakness, and acceptance of the entire guilt of the war, as well as paying gigantic future financial reparations to the victorious Allies.
The outrageous terms imposed at Versailles deeply rankled all Germans, and the memory of the starvation imposed upon Germany during the war and even afterward was one of the reasons Hitler believed it was so important to somehow gain access to additional agricultural territory.
As for the German leader himself, several years ago I pointed out that his contemporaneous assessment by many leading figures was very different than one might imagine based upon his demonic portrayal in the historical propaganda-narrative later created after war broke out.
By resurrecting a prosperous Germany while nearly all other countries remained mired in the worldwide Great Depression, Hitler drew glowing accolades from individuals all across the ideological spectrum. After an extended 1936 visit, David Lloyd George, Britain’s former wartime prime minister, fulsomely praised the chancellor as “the George Washington of Germany,” a national hero of the greatest stature. Over the years, I’ve seen plausible claims here and there that during the 1930s Hitler was widely acknowledged as the world’s most popular and successful national leader, and the fact that he was selected as Time Magazine’s Man of the Year for 1938 tends to support this belief.
I discovered a particular example of such missing perspectives earlier this year when I decided to read The Prize, Daniel Yergin’s magisterial and Pulitzer Prize-winning 1991 history of the world oil industry, and came across a few surprising paragraphs buried deep within the 900 pages of dense text. Yergin explained that during the mid-1930s the imperious chairman of Royal Dutch Shell, who had spent decades at the absolute summit of the British business world, became greatly enamored of Hitler and his Nazi government. He believed that an Anglo-German alliance was the best means of maintaining European peace and protecting the continent from the Soviet menace, and even retired to Germany in accordance with his new sympathies.
Since the actual history of this era has been so thoroughly replaced by extreme propaganda, academic specialists who closely investigate particular topics sometimes encounter puzzling anomalies. For example, a bit of very casual Googling brought to my attention an interesting article by a leading biographer of famed Jewish modernist writer Gertrude Stein, who seemed totally mystified why her feminist icon seemed to have been a major admirer of Hitler and an enthusiastic supporter of the pro-German Vichy government of France. The author also notes that Stein was hardly alone in her sentiments, which were generally shared by so many of the leading writers and philosophers of that period.
There is also the very interesting but far less well documented case of Lawrence of Arabia, one of the greatest British military heroes to come out of the First World War and who may have been moving in a rather similar direction just before his 1935 death in a possibly suspicious motorcycle accident. An alleged account of his evolving political views seems extremely detailed and perhaps worth investigating, with the original having been scrubbed from the Internet but still available at Archive.org.
A couple of years ago, the 1945 diary of a 28-year-old John F. Kennedy travelling in post-war Europe was sold at auction, and the contents revealed his rather favorable fascination with Hitler. The youthful JFK predicted that “Hitler will emerge from the hatred that surrounds him now as one of the most significant figures who ever lived” and felt that “He had in him the stuff of which legends are made.” These sentiments are particularly notable for having been expressed just after the end of a brutal war against Germany and despite the tremendous volume of hostile propaganda that had accompanied it.
The political enthusiasms of literary intellectuals, young writers, or even elderly businessmen are hardly the most reliable sources by which to evaluate a particular regime. But earlier this year, I pointed to a fairly comprehensive appraisal of the origins and policies of National Socialist Germany by one of Britain’s most prominent historians:
Not long ago, I came across a very interesting book written by Sir Arthur Bryant, an influential historian whose Wikipedia page describes him as the personal favorite of Winston Churchill and two other British prime ministers. He had worked on Unfinished Victory during the late 1930s, then somewhat modified it for publication in early 1940, a few months after the outbreak of World War II had considerably altered the political landscape. But not long afterward, the war became much more bitter and there was a harsh crackdown on discordant voices in British society, so Bryant became alarmed over what he had written and attempted to remove all existing copies from circulation. Therefore the only ones available for sale on Amazon are exorbitantly priced, but fortunately the work is also freely available at Archive.org.
Writing before the “official version” of historical events had been rigidly determined, Bryant describes Germany’s very difficult domestic situation between the two world wars, its problematic relationship with its tiny Jewish minority, and the circumstances behind the rise of Hitler, providing a very different perspective on these important events than what we usually read in our standard textbooks.
Among other surprising facts, he notes that although Jews were just 1% of the total population, even five years after Hitler had come to power and implemented various anti-Semitic policies, they still apparently owned “something like a third of the real property” in that country, with the great bulk of these vast holdings having been acquired from desperate, starving Germans in the terrible years of the early 1920s. Thus, much of Germany’s 99% German population had recently been dispossessed of the assets they had built up over generations…
Bryant also candidly notes the enormous Jewish presence in the leadership of the Communist movements that had temporarily seized power after World War I, both in major portions of Germany and in nearby Hungary. This was an ominous parallel to the overwhelmingly Jewish Bolsheviks who had gained control of Russia and then butchered or expelled that country’s traditional Russian and German ruling elites, and therefore a major source of Nazi fears.
Unlike so many of the other historians previously discussed, after the political climate changed Bryant assiduously worked to expunge his suddenly unfashionable views from the written record, and as a consequence went on to enjoy a long and successful career, topped by the accolades of a grateful British establishment. But I suspect that his long-suppressed 1940 volume, presenting a reasonably favorable view of Hitler and Nazi Germany, is probably more accurate and realistic than the many thousands of propaganda-drenched works by others that soon followed. I have now incorporated it into my HTML Books system, so those so interested can read it and decide for themselves.
- Unfinished Victory
Arthur Bryant • 1940 • 79,000 Words
Question 2: Munich
Help me understand Munich. We’ve all been taught that Britain’s Neville Chamberlain caved in to Hitler’s demands on the annexation of Czechoslovakia’s Sudetenland which, in turn, fueled Hitler’s lust for global conquest. But was that really what happened? And was “appeasement” really such a bad idea or should the European leaders have accepted that Versailles was a disaster from the get-go and agreed to Hitler’s demands to restore Germany’s original borders?
Ron Unz—The First World War had led to the collapse of the multi-ethnic Austro-Hungarian, Czarist, and Ottoman empires, each of which had been politically dominated by one ethnic group at the expense of all the others. President Woodrow Wilson’s Fourteen Points and the Versailles Peace Conference had elevated the principle that nationalities should be given freedom and ruled by their own leaders, and this had served as the logical basis for most of the successor states thus created.
However, there was a blatant double standard in the political application of this policy, with the creation of the new country of Czechoslovakia being one of the most obvious examples. Like the much larger Austro-Hungarian Empire, Czechoslovakia was stitched together from several entirely different nationalities, with roughly half the population being the ruling Czechs and the other half being Germans, Slovaks, and Ukrainians, who had little political power and deeply resented the domination of the Czechs, who completely controlled the government and its administration.
Czechoslovakia had been established as an important strategic ally for France to use against Germany, geographically serving as an ideal staging area for bombing attacks, almost amounting to an unsinkable aircraft carrier directly jutting into the heart of its German neighbor. Since the country was intentionally designed to threaten Germany, the overwhelmingly German Sudetenland region had been included so as to strengthen its geographical border defenses. The Germans were actually the second largest nationality within Czechoslovakia, so the very name amounted to dishonest propaganda, and something like Czecho-Germania might have been a little more accurate.
One of Hitler’s main goals was to free the suppressed German populations of Central Europe and reunite them with their German homeland and this included the more than 3 million Sudeten Germans. The Czech government was also quite friendly with Stalin’s Soviet Union, and therefore seemed a particularly menacing potential military threat, a possible future base for Soviet attacks against Germany.
Hitler gradually rebuilt Germany’s strength and by March 1938 managed to reunite his country with the Germans of Austria, accomplished with the overwhelmingly enthusiastic support of the latter. He then demanded that the Sudeten Germans be freed by the Czechs and allowed to unify with Germany as well, being willing to potentially risk a wider European war with the British, French, and Soviets on that issue. To avoid this, the leaders of Germany, Britain, France, and Italy together negotiated an agreement at Munich, allowing the Sudeten Germans to secede and join Germany. This peace agreement was wildly popular across nearly all of Europe.
However, once the Germans had been allowed to secede from Czechoslovakia, the Slovaks soon also did the same, establishing their own independent state of Slovakia (just as happened once again in 1993), and the entire country fell apart. At that point, Poland also grabbed a piece of disputed territory and the Hungarians threatened to do the same, so according to most accounts that I’ve read, the desperate Czech president turned to Hitler for support, and what was left of the country became a German protectorate.
Although anti-German propaganda soon portrayed the loss of Czech independence as a flagrant violation of the Munich Agreement, proof that Hitler couldn’t be trusted to keep his promises, the situation was really not so clear-cut since Czechoslovakia had already fallen apart and no longer existed. Furthermore, the Czechs had only been fully independent for twenty years after having previously spent nearly 700 years under German suzerainty, so in many respects, this merely restored the the traditional geopolitical arrangements in that part of Europe, doing so far more peacefully than when the Soviets invaded and occupied the Baltic States the following year.
Ironically enough, the Munich agreement signed by Chamberlain was reportedly so tremendously popular in Britain that if he’d called elections soon afterward, he probably would have won an overwhelming majority in Parliament, strongly consolidating his political hold over the British government for the next few years.
For those interested in a much more detailed discussion of this important history, I’d recommend the 1961 classic The Origins of the Second World War by renowned Oxford historian A.J.P. Taylor as well as David Irving’s outstanding 1991 volume Hitler’s War, available in HTML format on this website:
- Hitler’s War
David Irving • 1991 • 397,000 Words
Another excellent book covering this complex history is 1939: The War Had Many Fathers, published in 2011 by Gerd Schultze-Rhonof, a fully mainstream German professional military man, who rose to the rank of major-general in the German army before retiring. I’d also recommend David L. Hoggan’s extremely detailed narrative history in The Forced War, whose English version was originally published in 1989 and was long unavailable.
- The Forced War
When Peaceful Revisionism Failed
David L. Hoggan • 1989 • 320,000 Words
I should mention that both Schultze-Rhonof and Hoggan view these events somewhat differently than I have presented, with the former sharply condemning Hitler’s move into Czechia as a serious violation of the Munich Agreement and the latter arguing that the British government under Lord Halifax’s influence had always intended to orchestrate a war against Germany and was merely using the Munich Agreement as ruse to gain additional time for full rearmament before attacking.
Question 3: Churchill “The Drunken Poltroon”
I can’t make any sense of Churchill’s behavior prior to the war. Why was he so eager to declare war on Germany over a German territorial dispute with Poland many hundreds of miles away from his own country? Why did he think that should involve England? Besides, Churchill clearly had no way to transport British troops to Poland to defend the country nor would the battered British army have fared well against the better-trained and equipped Wehrmacht. In your book, Understanding World War II, you suggest that Churchill had benefactors who may have been pulling his strings and persuading him to do things that were clearly not in his country’s best interests. Is that what was going on, was Churchill just following a script that was written by others?
Ron Unz—Actually, Churchill only became a member of the British government on the day that war was declared against Germany, but he had indeed been strongly pressing from the outside for an anti-German policy by Chamberlain’s government, so the issue remains.
When I first encountered David Irving’s important historical work a few years ago, my biggest surprise was not the new information he provided about Hitler but the astonishing facts he revealed about Churchill. As I explained in my 2019 article on World War II:
I recently decided to tackle one of Irving’s much longer works, the first volume of Churchill’s War, a classic text that runs some 300,000 words and covers the story of the legendary British prime minister to the eve of Barbarossa, and I found it just as outstanding as I had expected.
As one small indicator of Irving’s candor and knowledge, he repeatedly if briefly refers to the 1940 Allied plans to suddenly attack the USSR and destroy its Baku oilfields, an utterly disastrous proposal that surely would have lost the war if actually carried out. By contrast, the exceptionally embarrassing facts of Operation Pike have been totally excluded from virtually all later Western accounts of the conflict, leaving one to wonder which of our numerous professional historians are merely ignorant and which are guilty of lying by omission.
Until recently, my familiarity with Churchill had been rather cursory, and Irving’s revelations were absolutely eye-opening. Perhaps the most striking single discovery was the remarkable venality and corruption of the man, with Churchill being a huge spendthrift who lived lavishly and often far beyond his financial means, employing an army of dozens of personal servants at his large country estate despite frequently lacking any regular and assured sources of income to maintain them. This predicament naturally put him at the mercy of those individuals willing to support his sumptuous lifestyle in exchange for determining his political activities. And somewhat similar pecuniary means were used to secure the backing of a network of other political figures from across all the British parties, who became Churchill’s close political allies.
To put things in plain language, during the years leading up to the Second World War, both Churchill and numerous other fellow British MPs were regularly receiving sizable financial stipends—cash bribes—from Jewish and Czech sources in exchange for promoting a policy of extreme hostility toward the German government and actually advocating war. The sums involved were quite considerable, with the Czech government alone probably making payments that amounted to tens of millions of dollars in present-day money to British elected officials, publishers, and journalists working to overturn the official peace policy of their existing government. A particularly notable instance occurred in early 1938 when Churchill suddenly lost all his accumulated wealth in a foolish gamble on the American stock-market, and was soon forced to put his beloved country estate up for sale to avoid personal bankruptcy, only to quickly be bailed out by a foreign Jewish millionaire intent upon promoting a war against Germany. Indeed, the early stages of Churchill’s involvement in this sordid behavior are recounted in an Irving chapter aptly entitled “The Hired Help.”
Ironically enough, German Intelligence learned of this massive bribery of British parliamentarians, and passed the information along to Prime Minister Neville Chamberlain, who was horrified to discover the corrupt motives of his fierce political opponents, but apparently remained too much of a gentlemen to have them arrested and prosecuted. I’m no expert in the British laws of that era, but for elected officials to do the bidding of foreigners on matters of war and peace in exchange for huge secret payments seems almost a textbook example of treason to me, and I think that Churchill’s timely execution would surely have saved tens of millions of lives.
My impression is that individuals of low personal character are those most likely to sell out the interests of their own country in exchange for large sums of foreign money, and as such usually constitute the natural targets of nefarious plotters and foreign spies. Churchill certainly seems to fall into this category, with rumors of massive personal corruption swirling around him from early in his political career. Later, he supplemented his income by engaging in widespread art-forgery, a fact that Roosevelt eventually discovered and probably used as a point of personal leverage against him. Also quite serious was Churchill’s constant state of drunkenness, with his inebriation being so widespread as to constitute clinical alcoholism. Indeed, Irving notes that in his private conversations FDR routinely referred to Churchill as “a drunken bum.”
During the late 1930s, Churchill and his clique of similarly bought-and-paid-for political allies had endlessly attacked and denounced Chamberlain’s government for its peace policy, and he regularly made the wildest sort of unsubstantiated accusations, claiming the Germans were undertaking a huge military build-up aimed against Britain. Such roiling charges were often widely echoed by a media heavily influenced by Jewish interests and did much to poison the state of German-British relations. Eventually, these accumulated pressures forced Chamberlain into the extremely unwise act of providing an unconditional guarantee of military backing to Poland’s irresponsible dictatorship. As a result, the Poles then rather arrogantly refused any border negotiations with Germany, thereby lighting the fuse which eventually led to the German invasion six months later and the subsequent British declaration of war. The British media had widely promoted Churchill as the leading pro-war political figure, and once Chamberlain was forced to create a wartime government of national unity, his leading critic was brought into it and given the naval affairs portfolio.
Following his lightening six-week defeat of Poland, Hitler unsuccessfully sought to make peace with the Allies, and the war went into abeyance. Then in early 1940, Churchill persuaded his government to try strategically outflanking the Germans by preparing a large sea-borne invasion of neutral Norway; but Hitler discovered the plan and preempted the attack, with Churchill’s severe operational mistakes leading to a surprising defeat for the vastly superior British forces. During World War I, Churchill’s Gallipoli disaster had forced his resignation from the British Cabinet, but this time the friendly media helped ensure that all the blame for the somewhat similar debacle at Narvik was foisted upon Chamberlain, so it was the latter who was forced to resign, with Churchill then replacing him as prime minister. British naval officers were appalled that the primary architect of their humiliation had become its leading political beneficiary, but reality is what the media reports, and the British public never discovered this great irony.
This incident was merely the first of the long series of Churchill’s major military failures and outright betrayals that are persuasively recounted by Irving, nearly all of which were subsequently airbrushed out of our hagiographic histories of the conflict. We should recognize that wartime leaders who spend much of their time in a state of drunken stupor are far less likely to make optimal decisions, especially if they are extremely prone to military micro-management as was the case with Churchill.
In the spring of 1940, the Germans launched their sudden armored thrust into France via Belgium, and as the attack began to succeed, Churchill ordered the commanding British general to immediately flee with his forces to the coast and to do so without informing his French or Belgium counterparts of the huge gap he was thereby opening in the Allied front-lines, thus ensuring the encirclement and destruction of their armies. Following France’s resulting defeat and occupation, the British prime minister then ordered a sudden, surprise attack on the disarmed French fleet, completely destroying it and killing some 2,000 of his erstwhile allies; the immediate cause was his mistranslation of a single French word, but this “Pearl Harbor-type” incident continued to rankle French leaders for decades.
Hitler had always wanted friendly relations with Britain and certainly had sought to avoid the war that had been forced upon him. With France now defeated and British forces driven from the Continent, he therefore offered very magnanimous peace terms and a new German alliance to Britain. The British government had been pressured into entering the war for no logical reason and against its own national interests, so Chamberlain and half the Cabinet naturally supported commencing peace negotiations, and the German proposal probably would have received overwhelming approval both from the British public and political elites if they had ever been informed of its terms.
But despite some occasional wavering, Churchill remained absolutely adamant that the war must continue, and Irving plausibly argues that his motive was an intensely personal one. Across his long career, Churchill had had a remarkable record of repeated failure, and for him to have finally achieved his lifelong ambition of becoming prime minister only to lose a major war just weeks after reaching Number 10 Downing Street would have ensured that his permanent place in history was an extremely humiliating one. On the other hand, if he managed to continue the war, perhaps the situation might somehow later improve, especially if the Americans could be persuaded to eventually enter the conflict on the British side.
Since ending the war with Germany was in his nation’s interest but not his own, Churchill undertook ruthless means to prevent peace sentiments from growing so strong that they overwhelmed his opposition. Along with most other major countries, Britain and Germany had signed international conventions prohibiting the aerial bombardment of civilian urban targets, and although the British leader had very much hoped the Germans would attack his cities, Hitler scrupulously followed these provisions. In desperation, Churchill therefore ordered a series of large-scale bombing raids against the German capital of Berlin, doing considerable damage, and after numerous severe warnings, Hitler finally began to retaliate with similar attacks against British cities. The population saw the heavy destruction inflicted by these German bombing raids and was never informed of the British attacks that had preceded and provoked them, so public sentiment greatly hardened against making peace with the seemingly diabolical German adversary.
In his memoirs published a half-century later, Prof. Revilo P. Oliver, who had held a senior wartime role in American Military Intelligence, described this sequence of events in very bitter terms:
Great Britain, in violation of all the ethics of civilized warfare that had theretofore been respected by our race, and in treacherous violation of solemnly assumed diplomatic covenants about “open cities”, had secretly carried out intensive bombing of such open cities in Germany for the express purpose of killing enough unarmed and defenceless men and women to force the German government reluctantly to retaliate and bomb British cities and thus kill enough helpless British men, women, and children to generate among Englishmen enthusiasm for the insane war to which their government had committed them.
It is impossible to imagine a governmental act more vile and more depraved than contriving death and suffering for its own people — for the very citizens whom it was exhorting to “loyalty” — and I suspect that an act of such infamous and savage treason would have nauseated even Genghis Khan or Hulagu or Tamerlane, Oriental barbarians universally reprobated for their insane blood-lust. History, so far as I recall, does not record that they ever butchered their own women and children to facilitate lying propaganda….In 1944 members of British Military Intelligence took it for granted that after the war Marshal Sir Arthur Harris would be hanged or shot for high treason against the British people…
Churchill’s ruthless violation of the laws of war regarding urban aerial bombardment directly led to the destruction of many of Europe’s finest and most ancient cities. But perhaps influenced by his chronic drunkenness, he later sought to carry out even more horrifying war crimes and was only prevented from doing so by the dogged opposition of all his military and political subordinates.
Along with the laws prohibiting the bombing of cities, all nations had similarly agreed to ban the first use of poison gas, while stockpiling quantities for necessary retaliation. Since Germany was the world-leader in chemistry, the Nazis had produced the most lethal forms of new nerve gases, such as Tabun and Sarin, whose use might have easily resulted in major military victories on both the Eastern and Western fronts, but Hitler had scrupulously obeyed the international protocols that his nation had signed. However, late in the war during 1944 the relentless Allied bombardment of German cities led to the devastating retaliatory attacks of the V-1 flying bombs against London, and an outraged Churchill became adamant that German cities should be attacked with poison gas in counter-retaliation. If Churchill had gotten his way, many millions of British might soon have perished from German nerve gas counter-strikes. Around the same time, Churchill was also blocked in his proposal to bombard Germany with hundreds of thousands of deadly anthrax bombs, an operation that might have rendered much of Central and Western Europe uninhabitable for generations.
I found Irving’s revelations on all these matters absolutely astonishing, and was deeply grateful that Deborah Lipstadt and her army of diligent researchers had carefully investigated and seemingly confirmed the accuracy of virtually every single item.
The two existing volumes of Irving’s Churchill masterwork total well over 700,000 words, and reading them would obviously consume weeks of dedicated effort. Fortunately, Irving is also a riveting speaker and several of his extended lectures on the topic are available for viewing on BitChute after having been recently purged from YouTube:
- American Pravda: Understanding World War II
Ron Unz • The Unz Review • September 23, 2019 • 20,500 Words
Irving’s 1987 Churchill book had laid bare his subject’s extremely lavish lifestyle as well as his lack of any solid income, together with the dramatic political consequences of that dangerous combination. This shocking historical picture was fully confirmed in 2015 by a noted financial expert whose book focused entirely on Churchill’s tangled finances, and did so with full cooperative access to his subject’s family archives. The story told by David Lough in No More Champagne is actually far more extreme than what had been described by Irving almost three decades earlier, with the author even suggesting that Churchill’s financial risk-taking was almost unprecedented for anyone in public or private life.
For example, at the very beginning of his book, Lough explains that Churchill became Prime Minister on May 10, 1940, the same day that German forces began their invasion of the Low Countries and France. But aside from those huge military and political challenges, Britain’s new wartime leader also faced an entirely different crisis as well, being unable to cover his personal bills, debt interest, or tax payments, all of which were due at the end of the month, thereby forcing him to desperately obtain a huge secret payment from the same Austrian Jewish businessman who had previously rescued him financially. Stories like this may reveal the hidden side of larger geopolitical developments, which sometimes only come to light many decades later.
The unacknowledged influence of secret payments to our own national leaders may be similar. George Washington law professor Jonathan Turley, a very prominent mainstream legal expert, recently published a column in The Hill expressing his total outrage that the American media was completely ignoring the massive corruption scandal involving Biden family members, who had received at least $10 million in secret financial payments from overseas interests. And just a few days ago, we learned that those payments to the Bidens had been made by a Ukrainian billionaire, perhaps helping to explain our current military confrontation with Russia over that country. Over the last year, Joseph Biden has sometimes been praised as another Winston Churchill, and that characterization may indeed be correct but not in the way intended.
Question 4: FDR
Why was FDR so eager to drag the United States into a war that posed no threat to US national security? It seems to me, that FDR’s decision may have been shaped—not by principle—but by the expectation that if the industrial centers of Europe were left in ruins, the US would unavoidably emerge as the lone global superpower. That, of course, turned out to be exactly what happened. But keep in mind, the “tipping-point” Battle of Stalingrad ended in February 1943, whereas, D-Day took place in June, 1944. What that means, is that the United States did not enter the conflict for a whole 16 months after it was certain that Germany would lose the war. In other words, the US invasion was basically a mop-up operation aimed at ensuring US hegemony over western Europe while preventing the Soviet Union from spreading communism across the continent. (Perhaps, you disagree with my analysis??)
What can you tell us about FDR and his motivation to enter the war? Was it entirely his decision or were there other factors involved?
Ron Unz—It’s possible that FDR envisioned that a European war would lead to the destruction of industrialized Europe as an competitor and the establishment of American global hegemony. But I think his motivation for American involvement in a war was actually much simpler than that.
America had been hit especially hard by the Great Depression and although FDR had reached the White House based upon his promise to end it, after five years in office, his policies had largely failed.
The American economy had also been weak in 1914, but once the First World War broke out, the huge needs of the Allied countries boosted our industrial production to new heights, resulting in American prosperity. Similarly, many mainstream history books admit that it was only the outbreak of World War II in 1939 that finally pulled the American economy out of the Great Depression, but they never consider the possibility that FDR might have deliberately provoked the war for that purpose. However, as I wrote in 2018, there seems strong contemporaneous evidence to that effect:
During the 1930s, John T. Flynn was one of America’s most influential progressive journalists, and although he had begun as a strong supporter of Roosevelt and his New Deal, he gradually became a sharp critic, concluding that FDR’s various governmental schemes had failed to revive the American economy. Then in 1937 a new economic collapse spiked unemployment back to the same levels as when the president had first entered office, confirming Flynn in his harsh verdict. And as I wrote last year:
Indeed, Flynn alleges that by late 1937, FDR had turned towards an aggressive foreign policy aimed at involving the country in a major foreign war, primarily because he believed that this was the only route out of his desperate economic and political box, a stratagem not unknown among national leaders throughout history. In his January 5, 1938 New Republic column, he alerted his disbelieving readers to the looming prospect of a large naval military build-up and warfare on the horizon after a top Roosevelt adviser had privately boasted to him that a large bout of “military Keynesianism” and a major war would cure the country’s seemingly insurmountable economic problems. At that time, war with Japan, possibly over Latin American interests, seemed the intended goal, but developing events in Europe soon persuaded FDR that fomenting a general war against Germany was the best course of action. Memoirs and other historical documents obtained by later researchers seem to generally support Flynn’s accusations by indicating that Roosevelt ordered his diplomats to exert enormous pressure upon both the British and Polish governments to avoid any negotiated settlement with Germany, thereby leading to the outbreak of World War II in 1939.
The last point is an important one since the confidential opinions of those closest to important historical events should be accorded considerable evidentiary weight. In a recent article John Wear mustered the numerous contemporaneous assessments that implicated FDR as a pivotal figure in orchestrating the world war by his constant pressure upon the British political leadership, a policy that he privately even admitted could mean his impeachment if revealed. Among other testimony, we have the statements of the Polish and British ambassadors to Washington and the American ambassador to London, who also passed along the concurring opinion of Prime Minister Chamberlain himself. Indeed, the German capture and publication of secret Polish diplomatic documents in 1939 had already revealed much of this information, and William Henry Chamberlin confirmed their authenticity in his 1950 book. But since the mainstream media never reported any of this information, these facts remain little known even today.
So according to Flynn’s January 1938 account, FDR and his advisors had originally viewed a possible war with Japan as the key to America’s economic revival, but they subsequently shifted their focus to a European war against Germany instead, and I think a turning point may have been the widespread Kristallnacht riots against German Jews in November 1938, following the assassination of a German diplomat by a Jewish activist. These attacks outraged the very influential Jewish communities of America and Europe, completely undoing any positive consequences of the Munich Agreement a couple of months earlier and focused intense international hostility against Hitler’s Germany, which had previously worked out reasonably amicable relations with its small Jewish population while establishing an important economic partnership with the rising Zionist movement.
Ironically enough, according to Irving’s very detailed reconstruction, Hitler had nothing to do with the anti-Jewish riots and urgently sought to suppress them once they began. Instead, the attacks seem to have been orchestrated by Joseph Goebbels, his powerful Propaganda Minister, who had recently fallen from favor because of his high-profile love affair with a Czech actress, leading to the bitter complaints of his wife, a close friend of Hitler. Goebbels apparently hoped he could use the anti-Jewish riots to restore his influence in the Nazi hierarchy, but they instead had disastrous consequences, thus raising the remarkable possibility that the political fallout from an extra-marital affair may have played a crucial role in the outbreak of World War II.
Question 5: The Holocaust
Recently, I’ve watched a number of David Irving videos on Rumble all of which are extremely persuasive. I really have a hard time understanding why powerful Jewish groups characterize Irving as an antisemite. What’s that all about? It seems to me that he’s just providing evidence from “primary source” material that he’s acquired from personal interviews or historical archives. In other words, he’s just doing what you would expect any credible historian to do, presenting the facts without ‘fear or favor’. Can you help me understand why these Jewish groups are so hostile to Irving?
Ron Unz—Irving’s research methodology has always relied heavily upon the use of documentary material and as he spent years working on his landmark Hitler biography, he gradually realized that there seemed to be no such evidence that the German dictator had approved or even been aware of any Jewish extermination project, strongly suggesting that he had had nothing to do with it. Jewish activist groups had come to regard Hitler as a demonic figure, so they bitterly resented those unorthodox conclusions from such a world-famous historian, and as I explained in 2018, their attacks enormously escalated after he later agreed to testify as an expert witness in a Canadian trial:
Fred Leuchter was widely regarded as one of America’s leading expert specialists on the technology of executions, and a long article in The Atlantic treated him as such. During the 1980s, Ernst Zundel, a prominent Canadian Holocaust Denier, was facing trial for his disbelief in the Auschwitz gas chambers, and one of his expert witnesses was an American prison warden with some experience in such systems, who recommended involving Leuchter, one of the foremost figures in the field. Leuchter soon took a trip to Poland and closely inspected the purported Auschwitz gas chambers, then published the Leuchter Report, concluding that they were obviously a fraud and could not possibly have worked in the manner Holocaust scholars had always claimed. The ferocious attacks which followed soon cost him his entire business career and destroyed his marriage.
David Irving had ranked as the world’s most successful World War II historian, with his books selling in the millions amid glowing coverage in the top British newspapers when he agreed to appear as an expert witness at the Zundel trial. He had always previously accepted the conventional Holocaust narrative, but reading the Leuchter Report changed his mind, and he concluded that the Auschwitz gas chambers were just a myth. He was quickly subjected to unrelenting media attacks, which first severely damaged and then ultimately destroyed his very illustrious publishing career, and he later even served time in an Austrian prison for his unacceptable views.
Although Irving has never been directly focused on Holocaust issues, in some of his presentations he has emphasized the total lack of any documentary evidence to support the standard narrative, an extremely suspicious fact given the massive scale of the alleged extermination project and the notorious German tendency for meticulous record-keeping.
In my previous interview, I’d already discussed many of the reasons I’m so extremely skeptical of the reality of the Holocaust, so there’s no need for me to repeat those arguments here.
- Why Everything You Know About World War II Is Wrong
Question 7: The Holocaust
However, I’d like to add the important point that once I read the books of leading mainstream Holocaust scholars such as Lucy S. Dawidowicz, Deborah Lipstadt, and Peter Novick, I found that their contents actually provided some considerable evidence against the historical reality of their central topic. As I explained in 2018:
These days, my morning newspapers seem to carry Holocaust-related stories with astonishing frequency, and probably no event of the twentieth century looms so large in our public consciousness. According to survey data, even as far back as 1995, some 97% of Americans knew of the Holocaust, far more than were aware of the Pearl Harbor attack or America’s use of the atomic bombs against Japan, while less than half our citizenry were aware that the Soviet Union had been our wartime ally. But I’d suspect that anyone who drew his knowledge from the mainstream newspapers and history books during the first couple of decades after the end of the Second World War might never have even been aware that any Holocaust had actually occurred.
ORDER IT NOWIn 1999 Peter Novick published a book on this general theme entitled The Holocaust in American Life, citing that survey, and his introduction began by noting the very strange pattern the Holocaust exhibited in its cultural influence, which seems quite unique among all major historical events. In the case of almost all other searing historical occurrences such as the massive bloodshed of the Somme or the bitter Vietnam War, their greatest impact upon popular consciousness and media came soon afterward, with the major books and films often appearing within the first five or ten years when memories were fresh, and the influence peaking within a couple of decades, after which they were gradually forgotten.
Yet in the case of the Holocaust, this pattern was completely reversed. Hardly anyone discussed it for the first twenty years after the end of the World War II, while it gradually moved to the center of American life in the 1970s, just as wartime memories were fading and many of the most prominent and knowledgeable figures from that era had departed the scene. Novick cites numerous studies and surveys demonstrating that this lack of interest and visibility certainly included the Jewish community itself, which had seemingly suffered so greatly under those events, yet apparently had almost completely forgotten about them during the 1950s and much of the 1960s.
I can certainly confirm that impression from my personal experience. Prior to the mid- or late-1970s, I had had only the vaguest impression that virtually all the Jews and Gypsies of Europe had been exterminated during the Second World War, and although the term “Holocaust” was in widespread use, it invariably referred to a “Nuclear Holocaust,” a term long-since supplanted and scarcely used today. Then, after the Berlin Wall fell, I was quite surprised to discover that Eastern Europe was still filled with vast numbers of unexterminated Gypsies, who quickly flooded into the West and provoked all sorts of political controversies.
I found even more striking material in a widely-praised research study by Prof. Joseph Bendersky, Book Review Editor of the Journal of Holocaust Studies. Descriptively subtitled “Anti-Semitic Politics of the U.S. Army,” his volume ran more than 500 pages with 1350 endnotes and was based upon ten years of archival research, but when I read it in 2019, I discovered an extremely strange omission:
ORDER IT NOWOliver’s peremptory dismissal of the standard Holocaust narrative led me to take a closer look at the treatment of the same topic in Bendersky’s book, and I noticed something quite odd. As discussed above, his exhaustive research in official files and personal archives conclusively established that during World War II a very considerable fraction of all our Military Intelligence officers and top generals were vehemently hostile to Jewish organizations and also held beliefs that today would be regarded as utterly delusional. The author’s academic specialty is Holocaust studies, so it is hardly surprising that his longest chapter focused on that particular subject, bearing the title “Officers and the Holocaust, 1940-1945.” But a close examination of the contents raises some troubling questions.
Across more than sixty pages, Bendersky provides hundreds of direct quotes, mostly from the same officers who are the subject of the rest of his book. But after carefully reading the chapter twice, I was unable to find a single one of those statements referring to the massive slaughter of Jews that constitutes what we commonly call the Holocaust, nor to any of its central elements, such as the existence of death camps or gas chambers.
The forty page chapter that follows focuses on the plight of the Jewish “survivors” in post-war Europe, and the same utter silence applies. Bendersky is disgusted by the cruel sentiments expressed by these American military men towards the Jewish former camp inmates, and he frequently quotes them characterizing the latter as thieves, liars, and criminals; but the officers seem strangely unaware that those unfortunate souls had only just barely escaped an organized mass extermination campaign that had so recently claimed the lives of the vast majority of their fellows. Numerous statements and quotes regarding Jewish extermination are provided, but all of these come from various Jewish activists and organizations, while there is nothing but silence from all of the military officers themselves.
Bendersky’s ten years of archival research brought to light personal letters and memoirs of military officers written decades after the end of the war, and in both those chapters he freely quotes from these invaluable materials, sometimes including private remarks from the late 1970s, long after the Holocaust had become a major topic in American public life. Yet not a single statement of sadness, regret, or horror is provided. Thus, a prominent Holocaust historian spends a decade researching a book about the private views of our military officers towards Jews and Jewish topics, but the one hundred pages he devotes to the Holocaust and its immediate aftermath contains not a single directly-relevant quote from those individuals, which is simply astonishing. A yawning chasm seems to exist at the center of his lengthy historical volume, or put another way, a particular barking dog is quite deafening in its silence.
I am not an archival researcher and have no interest in reviewing the many tens of thousands of pages of source material located at dozens of repositories across the country that Bendersky so diligently examined while producing his important book. Perhaps during their entire wartime activity and also the decades of their later lives, not a single one of the hundred-odd important military officers who were the focus of his investigation ever once broached the subject of the Holocaust or the slaughter of Jews during World War II. But I think there is another distinct possibility.
As mentioned earlier, Beaty spent his war years carefully reviewing the sum-total of all incoming intelligence information each day and then producing an official digest for distribution to the White House and our other top leaders. And in his 1951 book, published just a few years after the end of fighting, he dismissed the supposed Holocaust as a ridiculous wartime concoction by dishonest Jewish and Communist propagandists that had no basis in reality. Soon afterward, Beaty’s book was fully endorsed and promoted by many of our leading World War II generals, including those who were subjects of Bendersky’s archival research. And although the ADL and various other Jewish organizations fiercely denounced Beaty, there is no sign that they ever challenged his absolutely explicit “Holocaust denial.”
I suspect that Bendersky gradually discovered that such “Holocaust denial” was remarkably common in the private papers of many of his Military Intelligence officers and top generals, which presented him with a serious dilemma. If only one or two of those individuals had expressed such sentiments, their shocking statements could be cited as further evidence of their delusional anti-Semitism. But what if a substantial majority of those officers—who certainly had possessed the best knowledge of the reality of World War II—held private beliefs that were very similar to those publicly expressed by their former colleagues Beaty and Oliver? In such a situation, Bendersky may have decided that certain closed doors should remain in that state, and entirely skirted the topic.
- American Pravda: Holocaust Denial
Ron Unz • The Unz Review • August 27, 2018 • 17,600 Words - American Pravda: Secrets of Military Intelligence
Ron Unz • The Unz Review • June 10, 2019 • 12,500 Words
Question 6: WWII and Ukraine, Connecting the Dots
In our last interview, you challenged two of the most widely-accepted claims about World War 2, that:
- Hitler started WW2
- Hitler’s invasion of Poland was the first step in a broader campaign aimed at world domination
You showed that both of these are not true. Even so, they are still accepted as fact by the vast majority of people in the West. My concern, is that this same pattern is repeating itself in Ukraine where we’ve been told repeatedly that the war was an “unprovoked aggression” by an imperialist Putin who sees Ukraine as merely the first step in restoring the Soviet Empire. This is the prevailing narrative we read in the media about Ukraine, but is it true?
In your opinion, who started the war in Ukraine and why is it important that our record of events be based on historical facts and not on the fabrications of political partisans?
Ron Unz—When Russia invaded Ukraine in late February 2022, I’d almost immediately noticed the remarkable parallels to Germany’s invasion of Poland, which caused the outbreak of World War II. In each case, influential Western interests had heavily orchestrated the war by encouraging powerful provocations while blocking any reasonable negotiations, so I quickly published an article emphasizing this historical analogy and pointing out that America had clearly been responsible for the Ukraine war.
Although FoxNews has become one of the outlets most rabidly hostile to Russia, a recent interview with one of their regular guests provided a very different perspective. Col. Douglas Macgregor had been a former top Pentagon advisor and he forcefully explained that America had spent nearly fifteen years ignoring Putin’s endless warnings that he would not tolerate NATO membership for Ukraine, nor the deployment of strategic missiles on his border. Our government had paid no heed to his explicit red-lines, so Putin was finally compelled to act, resulting in the current calamity:
Prof. John Mearsheimer of the University of Chicago, one of our most distinguished political scientists, had spent many years making exactly these same points and blaming America and NATO for the simmering Ukraine crisis, but his warnings had been totally ignored by our political leadership and media. His hour-long lecture explaining these unpleasant realities had quietly sat on Youtube for six years, attracting relatively little attention, but then suddenly exploded in popularity over the last few weeks as the conflict unfolded, and has now reached a worldwide audience of over 17 million. His other Youtube lectures, some quite recent, have been watched by additional millions.
Such massive global attention finally forced our media to take notice, and the New Yorker solicited an interview with Mearsheimer, allowing him to explain to his disbelieving questioner that American actions had clearly provoked the conflict. A couple of years earlier, that same interviewer had ridiculed Prof. Cohen for doubting the reality of Russiagate, but this time he seemed much more respectful, perhaps because the balance of media power was now reversed; his magazine’s 1.2 million subscriber-base was dwarfed by the global audience listening to the views of his subject.
- Why John Mearsheimer Blames the U.S. for the Crisis in Ukraine
Isaac Chotiner • The New Yorker • March 1, 2022 • 3,900 WordsDuring his long and distinguished career at the CIA, former analyst Ray McGovern had run the Soviet Policy Branch and also served as the Presidential Briefer, so under different circumstances he or someone like him would currently be advising President Joe Biden. Instead, a few days ago he joined Mearsheimer in presenting his views in a video discussion hosted by the Committee for the Republic. Both leading experts agreed that Putin had been pushed beyond all reasonable limits, provoking the invasion.
Prior to 2014 our relations with Putin had been reasonably good. Ukraine served as a neutral buffer state between Russia and the NATO countries, with the population evenly divided between Russian-leaning and West-leaning elements, and its elected government oscillating between the two camps.
But while Putin’s attention was focused on the 2014 Sochi Olympic Games, a pro-NATO coup overthrew the democratically-elected pro-Russian government, with clear evidence that Victoria Nuland and the other Neocons grouped around Secretary of State Hillary Clinton had orchestrated it. Ukraine’s Crimea peninsula contains Russia’s crucial Sevastopol naval base, and only Putin’s swift action allowed it to remain under Russian control, while he also provided support for break-away pro-Russian enclaves in the Donbass region. The Minsk agreement later signed by the Ukrainian government granted autonomy to those latter areas, but Kiev refused to honor its commitments, and instead continued to shell the area, inflicting serious casualties upon the inhabitants, many of whom held Russian passports. Diana Johnstone has aptly characterized our policy as years of Russian bear-baiting.
As Mearsheimer, McGovern, and other observers have persuasively argued, Russia invaded Ukraine only after such endless provocations and warnings were always ignored or dismissed by our American leadership. Perhaps the final straw had been the recent public statement by Ukraine President Volodymyr Zelenskyy that he intended to acquire nuclear weapons. How would America react if a democratically-elected pro-American government in Mexico had been overthrown in a coup backed by China, with the fiercely hostile new Mexican government spending years killing American citizens in its country and then finally announcing plans to acquire a nuclear arsenal?
Moreover, some analysts such as economist Michael Hudson have strongly suspected that American elements deliberately provoked the Russian invasion for geostrategic reasons, and Mike Whitney advanced similar arguments in a column that went super-viral, accumulating over 800,000 pageviews. The Nord Stream 2 pipeline carrying Russian natural gas to Germany had finally been completed last year and was about to go into operation, which would have greatly increased Eurasian economic integration and Russian influence in Europe, while eliminating the potential market for more expensive American natural gas. The Russian attack and the massive resulting media hysteria have now foreclosed that possibility.
So although it was Russian troops who crossed the Ukrainian border, a strong case can be made that they did so only after the most extreme provocations, and these may have been deliberately intended to produce exactly that result. Sometimes the parties responsible for starting a war are not necessarily those that eventually fire the first shot.
Just days after the war began, I pointed out that the total demonization of Russia and Vladimir Putin by our media and government seemed exactly similar to how they had treated Germany and Adolf Hitler three generations earlier.
Such international retaliation against Russia and individual Russians seems extremely disproportionate. As yet the fighting in Ukraine has inflicted minimal death or destruction, while the various other major wars of the last two decades, many of them American in origin, had killed millions and completely destroyed several countries, including Iraq, Libya, and Syria. But the global dominance of American media propaganda has orchestrated a very different popular response, producing this remarkable crescendo of hatred.
Indeed, the closest parallel that comes to mind would be the American hostility directed against Adolf Hitler and Nazi Germany after the outbreak of World War II, as indicated by the widespread comparisons between Putin’s invasion of Ukraine and Hitler’s 1939 attack on Poland. A simple Google search for “Putin and Hitler” returns tens of millions of webpages, with the top results ranging from the headline of a Washington Post article to the Tweets of pop music star Stevie Nicks. As far back as 2014, Andrew Anglin of the Daily Stormer had documented the emerging meme “Putin is the new Hitler.”
Ironically enough, the arguments of Mearsheimer and others that Putin was greatly provoked or possibly even manipulated into attacking Ukraine raise certain intriguing historical parallels. The legions of ignorant Westerners who mindlessly rely upon our disingenuous media may be denouncing Putin as “another Hitler” but I think they may have inadvertently backed themselves into the truth.
- American Pravda: Putin as Hitler?
Ron Unz • The Unz Review • March 7, 2022 • 7,900 Words - American Pravda: World War III and World War II?
Ron Unz • The Unz Review • October 24, 2022 • 4,700 Words
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“Our entry into World War II was the crucial act in foisting a permanent militarization upon the economy and society, in bringing to the country a permanent garrison state, an overweening military-industrial complex, a permanent system of conscription. It was the crucial act in creating a mixed economy run by Big Government, a system of state-monopoly capitalism run by the central government in collaboration with Big Business and Big Unionism.
It was the crucial act in elevating presidential power, particularly in foreign affairs, to the role of single most despotic person in the history of the world. And, finally, World War II is the last war myth left, the myth that the Old Left clings to in pure desperation: the myth that here, at least, was a good war, here was a war in which America was in the right.
World War II is the war thrown into our faces by the war-making establishment, as it tries, in each war that we face, to wrap itself in the mantle of good and righteous World War II. It is because of its enthusiasm for World War II and its leader, Franklin D. Roosevelt, that the Old Left has never been able to understand the straight and true line that leads from the New Deal and Franklin D. Roosevelt which they adore, to the Great Society and Lyndon Johnson which they despise.”
-Murray Rothbard
https://mises.org/library/harry-elmer-barnes-rip
And weird how the Brits are once again such rabid dogs of war and saboteurs. Just today they were behind the attack on the civilian Crimean Bridge possibly killing civilians.
The sooner the English become extinct the more peaceful this world will be.
More little known war details :
The war over the German-Austrian customs Union:
https://armedwithknowledge.blogspot.com/2012/10/1931-banks-german-unity-austria-and.html
Holocaust narrative problems:
https://armedwithknowledge.blogspot.com/2019/08/holocaust-chapter-unexplained.html
The Jewish hoax that is sound of music (few reasons to suspect the referendums for the Anschluss were not legit) :
https://armedwithknowledge.blogspot.com/2018/03/the-sound-of-americana-austrian.html
The German-Polish alliance that could have been:
https://armedwithknowledge.blogspot.com/2012/10/no-second-world-war.html
The situation in Danzig, boycotts, Port for port negotiations, British interest in Polish mining:
https://armedwithknowledge.blogspot.com/2013/05/deconstructing-danzig-reevaluation-of.html
UK started the air war with Germany:
https://armedwithknowledge.blogspot.com/2017/02/mythbusting-truth-about-winston.html
What the rise of the “far right” really was in connection with:
https://armedwithknowledge.blogspot.com/2007/07/the-reichstag-fire-and-threat-of.html
Happy reading all
Seems like Harry Elmer Barnes— who was inclined toward pacifism— is the source of some common quotes on war, e.g., “endless war for endless peace”, “truth is the first casualty of war”, et al.
OMG, this is so awesome!
Ron, please keep us updated daily on the view count!
This is an outstanding overview that destroys officials myths of World War II.
Let me add some points:
Hitler’s National-Socialism was very similar to America’s Bernie Sanders’ socialist political movement as they promoted the same things. Take note “Bernie Bros”.
Churchill was far more evil that Hitler. He was as bad as Stalin, yet more corrupt.
Here is a short video about this topic since few are aware:
Mearsheimer later explained that the Germans invaded Poland with 1.5 million men in 1939. Russia invaded Ukraine with 190,000 men in 2022. He stated there is no way a force that small was expected to conquer and occupy a huge nation like Ukraine with 40 million people.
Adolf Hitler ist he most lied about man In history.Man In History
One of his first changes by Adolf Hitler upon taking power was to repeal the Jewish-controlled Weimar government’s continuance of 1928 restrictions on citizens carrying weapons except by known enemies of the people such as criminals and Jews plotting with enemies abroad. Jews always disarm populations. Adolf Hitler believed that an armed citizenry was the best insurance against such an opressive and evil state as Weimar ever again inflicting itself on the German people, as well as to protect the Reich from becoming corrupted in the future. Sadly this restriction was not only re-imposed after the war by the current Occupation government in Germany as it was across all the ZOG regimes of Europe with the very partial exception of Switzerland, but extended to include all self-defence weapons such as knives or pepperspray for women, leaving the people of Europe defenceless against criminals, hostile immigrants and the growing tyranny of the coming Jew World Order with it’s increasingly brutal and lawless, anti free-speech, heavily armed police and internal security forces.
“The authority of the State can never be an end in itself; for, if that were so, any kind of tyranny would be inviolable and sacred. If a government uses the instruments of power in it’s hands for the purpose of leading a people to ruin, then rebellion is not only the right but also the duty of every individual citizen.”
~Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf.
ADOLF HITLER IS THE MOST LIED ABOUT MAN IN HISTORY BECAUSE HE TOOK ON THE GREATEST LIARS IN HISTORY AND LOST. HIS OWN WHITE BROTHERS IN BRITAIN AND AMERICA FOOLED INTO DEFEATING HIM ON BEHALF OF THE JEWS WHO ARE NOW DEGRADING, MORALLY CORRUPTING AND GENOCIDING THE WHITE RACE WITH MASS THIRD-WORLD IMMIGRATION, CULTURAL MARXISM AND ZIONCORP PROMOTED MISCEGENATION ADVERTISING. SPREADING IMMORALITY AND PAEDOPHILIA AS THEY DID IN WEIMAR GERMANY, WHILE DELIBERATLY DESTROYING OUR ECONOMIES TO CREATE A JEW WORLD ORDER. ALL OF WHICH WAS PREDICTED BY ADOLF HITLER.
No one person in the 20th century has had such a profound effect as “the German Führer”. He raised a robbed, starving, broken, and defeated people into a well fed, motivated, happy, prosperous, industriously advanced and highly successful nation. This was all achieved in peace-time in an unbelievable six years.
Hitler amazed the world in everything he accomplished. To the great majority of the German people he was a redeemer. He gave them real leadership and motivated them to the greatest heights of achievement in every field of endeavour. Germany was a pulsating hive of industry. Every section of the country responded to his ideas and encouragement. He gave the German people joy of being alive and a pride in simply being a German, instead of the humiliated broken people he had inherited.) There was an infectious feeling of excitement and expectancy in the land, as day by day and week by week, Hitler raised his people from the gutter and freed Germans from humiliation in other lands.To his admirers, he was a real patriot and a war hero, having suffered in the horrors of trenches during the First World War. The people sensed that at last they had found standing before them a man, in whom they could trust and who believed in himself and in the talents and abilities of his own people.
And David Lloyd George (Ex-Prime Minister, UK), who stated in the Daily Express (Sep. 17, 1936): “It is not the Germany of the first decade that followed the war- broken, dejected and bowed down with a sense of apprehension and impotence. It is now full of hope and confidence, and of a renewed sense of determination to lead its own life without interference from any influence outside its own frontiers. One man has accomplished this miracle. He is a born leader of men. A magnetic and dynamic personality with a single-minded purpose, a resolute will and a dauntless heart.”
He created a Germany that influenced people from far beyond its borders. During the Second World War, a million foreigners joined the German Armed Forces (Waffen SS) simply because they believed in what he was trying to achieve, and willingly sacrificed themselves, for no reward except a profound belief in what they were fighting for.
Hitler created visual images of National Socialism and the Third Reich that are so outstanding, that to this day no person or country, has ever surpassed its artistic and spiritual influence. These powerful images of the Third Reich have been so effective that even today Hollywood film studios have made billions of dollars since the end of World War 11, and still continue to fill theatre seats just on the power of Hitler’s name.
Endless books have been published on the Third Reich mostly vilifying Hitler and his supporters. Even today, debates take place at every level continuing to try to understand or demean this phenomenon.
Some years ago the German historian Rainer Zitelmann, in a scholarly study established that Hitler’s outlook was “rational, self-consistent, and modern” and as early as 1953, the respected British historian Hugh R. Trevor Roper, evoked the image of Hitler as a kind of “synthesis of Napoleon and Spengler, noting that of all the world conquerors Hitler had been the most “philosophical.”
Hitler had a mixed attitude towards the United States. He praised its pre-1940s pro-white racial policies and restrictions on non-white immigration and its pioneering adoption of eugenics measures.
Whilst the American Apartheid System lasted until 1963, Hitler was dismayed by the spectacular growth of Jewish power which attempted to introduce the KaufmanPlan (“Germany must Perish”) by using the American democratic system for their own agenda. Kaufman’s Plan, he called it “The Final Solution”, sought to exterminate out the entire German nation through sterilization and was cheered by American politicians and the mass media: “A Sensational Idea” (Time Magazine)
Many people in position of authority, who continue to praise him today, have to do so clandestinely, or they face the wrath and retribution of the Jewish World Congress. Less well-known figures must watch their words, or they will be dubbed a Nazi and can face discrimination and dismissal from their place of work. In some countries they can be fined and imprisoned.
Governments (especially in ” Democratic Germany”) are terrified of any movement that has similarities to the style or ideas of the German Führer, and arrest, punish or fine, any individual who dares to show his support for or express serious interest in his ideals. In most democratic countries (especially Germany), his books are banished and publishers face arrest and are heavily fined for publishing National Socialist material. According to the Annual Report of the ‘German Federal Office for the Protection of the Constitution’ (George Orwell could not have invented a more sinister title) the German persecution machinery prosecuted between 1994 and 2002 a total of 80.703 citizens for expressing politically incorrect opinions in Germany.
In Britain, the United States and in Israel his book Mein Kampf can be easily obtained. The universities of Israel have many copies of “Mein Kampf” which are used for political studies by the students.
Not a day goes by without television stations around the world broadcasting programmes on Hitler and his policies. The Holocaust is the most discussed subject now in the world of politics. The modern day liberal intellectuals, who to one man, have been forced to accept the new multicultural experiment on mankind, (promoted by a race, who themselves do not practise what they preach), mostly condemn his ideas.
While magazines and newspapers constantly mention Hitler’s name usually accompanied by a dramatic photo of him for their readers to gloat over. “Nazism always sells. Hitler is functioning almost as good as Jesus Christ,” Amercian publishers told their German colleague Suhrkamp when he complained that they only wish to buy from him Hitler literature (Der Spiegel 28/1999, p. 178)
Intellectuals, mostly Jewish, still continue trying to unfathom the mystery, of where and how this immense power came about. Nervous rabbis, deranged by centuries of Cabalistic indoctrination, have uneasy notions that Hitler was sent by the enemy of their God Yahweh, to do battle with them in preparation of the final battle yet to come.
Hitler’s hostile attitude to Jews was neither irrational nor aberrant. He simply saw the Jews as Jesus Christ did before him. Jesus said to the Jews: “You belong to your father, the devil and you want to carry out your father’s desire. He was a murderer from the beginning, not holding to the truth, for there is no truth in him.” (John 8:44)
Hitler saw the Jews as “the personification of a great lie” while they pretended to be a religious community he openly exposed the fact, that they were a fully constituted, a national ethnic and self-selected group, with international ambitions.
Hitler has become the most famous marketing tool in the history of man, and there is little likelihood of his memory fading into oblivion, because “too many people still need him”. Whilst his memory is continuing to flourish, his war-time opponents, Winston Churchill, Josef Stalin and F.D. Roosevelt are obviously unusable as marketing tools.
Churchill, the famed cigar smoker, wasn’t even used to promote ‘Havanas’. Josef Stalin, the greatest mass murderer in the history of man (along with his Jewish commissars) does not even warrant a single second of advertising, i.e. gas pistols and toy weapons as well as funeral parlours. Finally, Roosevelt, the exemplar of economic globalisation is not worthy of even a mention in modern economic forums. If these three individuals had not chosen Adolf Hitler as their number one enemy, their destinies would have been total oblivion. Their fame still depends on Adolf Hitler. Without him, they are non-entities.
In discourses and speeches, every political party or politically orientated group will at some time in their existence, bring forth the name of Hitler. It is always safe for them to use his name. He never goes away.
His philosophy is like a siren song, calling out to his admirers and to the millions of confused people who sense that his views of “natural laws” are correct, and are the only laws that can be understood and trusted in our multi-cultural, in harmonious and devious New World Order. The allure of Hitlerism is contagious for young and old alike.
Thanks Ron Unz and Mike Whitney. So and one more time, circular history. We can get out of it?
Roosevelt had many objectives during World War II, but the primary was to continue President Wilson’s plan for a world government run by Wall Street. FDR worked on Wall Street for many years and supported disastrous World War I while an assistant Secretary of the Navy.
The Khazarian mafia just can’t leave the White man alone.
Checking out the January 2, 1939 issue of Time Magazine to see what it really “tends to support” would cost me $135 on eBay – because Time Magazine has most of its archives locked down. Ain’t gonna happen!
A casual couple of searches of my own turned up several possibilities for Stein’s Nazi Love.
According to this account Stein was a heroic Jewish Female Person who was actually spitting in Hitler’s eye.
Another is that she had believed her Astrology book (which predicted a quick defeat for Germany in the Battle of France) and had stayed in France despite being urged to leave on account of her being Jewish. Naturally the quick-witted Stein adopted a successful survival strategy of pretending to be a world-class Nazi suck-up.
Of course another very real possibility is that Gertrude Stein was an Honest-To-God Fascist. In 2023 it’s well known that a “Jewish” state can be chock full of Nasty Nazis.
There wasn’t much point of going any further in this piece, for a quick scan showed that it was mostly more of the same old ****. In other words, Repetition of Past Stuff – something Joseph Goebbels also used to great effect.
https://www.azquotes.com/author/5626-Joseph_Goebbels
But to avoid imitating Oddball of Kelly’s Heroes fame (Always with the negative waves Moriarty, always with the negative waves) I’ll now try to make a Positive Contribution with this post.
Consider the photograph of Winston Churchill at the top of the page. His “If Looks Could Kill” pose was actually showing his anger at the photographer – a fellow who had just snatched a cigar out of his mouth.
https://petapixel.com/2013/03/08/in-his-iconic-portrait-winston-churchill-is-scowling-over-a-lost-cigar/
Like the way that the planet Pluto was discovered not by direct observation, but rather by noticing certain irregularities in the gravitational paths of the surrounding planets, which caused the mathematical deduction that there just had to be some other planetary body hiding out in that orbital space…..
Unless and until one is willing to admit that there was and is in the history of Europe an extra-legal Jewish international empire which had been, all along, operating under its own auspices, but without the cover of national sovereignty… you can’t discuss European history accurately, or the course of its tedious wars, because you’re not accounting for Pluto.
If I told you that the Jewish Empire was the actual cause and start of the Second World War, you’d look at me like I’m crazy. Okay. I’m crazy.
It sounds like Kristallnacht was massively important in shaping media coverage of Hitler’s Germany, if before that event, American media was mostly favorable in its commentary on Nazi Germany, but afterwards was fiercely hostile, as described by that Polish ambassador in Washington. The extremely bad blood that Kristallnacht engendered between the American media and Nazi Germany explains why the media portrayed the German annexation of Czechia as bad, when it was actually good.
Wow, Churchill was corrupt. Thanks for the new details. The fact that Biden has been bribed by a wealthy foreigner just like Churchill was, for very similar reasons, is incredible. But while Jewish and Czech bribes of Churchill paid off for the Jews as a whole, the Ukrainian bribe that contributed to U.S. hostility towards Russia has obviously had bad consequences for Ukraine and presumably the only Ukrainians who’ve benefited from the current war are the very wealthy and well-connected. And while destroying Germany and much of Europe in a huge war was at least broadly beneficial for Americans, the current war in Ukraine doesn’t benefit us.
The recently published unexpurgated diaries of Chips Channon sent a bit of a shock wave through the British establishment. Volume II gives more insight into the way Winston Churchill was viewed by others in the Tory party during WWII.
Ron Unz’s latest project – Rehabilitating Hitler. Too funny.
> Germany had been very successful during the early years of the First World War, repeatedly defeating the Russians while occupying portions of northern France, but nevertheless its leaders then sought to end the horrible mutual slaughter in 1916 by proposing a peace without winners or losers.
This is a blatant falsehood. In his history of England for 1914-45, A.J.P. Taylor correctly noted that it was never Ludendorff’s intention to accept a peace without annexations. Instead, Bethmann-Hollweg had found himself being pushed out of power in 1916 in favor of Ludendorff. at a time when it was obvious that the US was likely to enter the war. Bethmann-Hollweg made some gestures in an attempt to avert US entry and possibly recover his position. But he was pushed out by Ludendorff who never endorsed any peace terms without major annexations.
The “good war” was always a myth. There are no good wars. All wars are bankers wars.
Curve Ball for Unz.
General De Gaulle had a handicapped daughter. Down Syndrome if I recall. Churchill’s informer from the Foreign Office who fed him figures about German rearmament as early as 1935 had a child with extreme handicaps. Ralph Wigram. Ralph was I suppose a sort of whistleblower feeding the Anti Appeasement faction of the Tory party the hard data it needed to attack Baldwin and Chamberlain in parliament. Ralph was also forwarding stories of Nazi antisemitism.
Parents of such children may have been motivated by stories about National Socialist Eugenics. This would have lent credence to later tales of Death Camps for Jews.
A truly eye-opening piece. How else can the criminalization of holocaust denial and support for BDS be satisfactorily explained other than via the ascendancy of Jewish power and its stranglehold on American politics?
Then comes the criminalization of support for BDS and arguably the most overused card in history – antisemitism, to silence critics of Israeli atrocities against Palestinians and pushing America to fight their wars in the ME?
It comes as no surprise that all this is paralleled by Jewish over representation of key positions in successive US administrations, despite Jews comprising a minuscule 2.4% of the population.
Wait. So Germany was doing well in WWI but because of the good heart of German leaders they sought peace to stop the killings and then they proceeded to accept outrageous terms imposed on them. Those German leaders of 1916 were really nice people.
Fascinating, but extremely depressing, reading
Missing is Guido Preparata’s book “Conjuring Hitler: How Britain and America made the Third Reich.” It was first published as an article which could be accessed for free but it seems to have disappeared.
I would be very interested to read your and Mr Unz’s take on this important book.
Seminal, timely, and above all, very, very helpful!
Thank you Ron and Mike. May this exceptional interview also go “super-viral” and be translated into every European language, as well as Russian.
The world owes you both, but especially you Ron Unz, a great debt of thanks.
With love,
Kali.
Thank u for this article mr Unz, ive wrote on other websites like urs just recently veternstoday .com between watching the 10 part doc Europa the last battle, an article by Kendra carter back in 2017 on jewworldorder.org and listneing to old audio speeches from Georg lincon rockwell from the 60’s we as a public have been lied too about Hitler and Nazi all for the sake of boeing down to the jew elites and jew serpremists unfortunately alot of people still rather believe the lies that we been told…
Wonderful stuff, well done you two. Just one point: you describe A.H. as “the leader who promised to restore Germany (to its original borders)” pre-Versailles. The problem here is, that he achieved the union with Austria as well as the achieving of those earlier borders. That union had always been denied to Germany as it would have made it too powerful. Austria had always been a part of Germany for centuries prior to the establishing of the modern nation-state in 1871. So including it as well as the pre-Versailles Germany would very soon make Germany the most powerful nation on Earth. Which the Empire could not permit.
“My impression is that individuals of low personal character are those most likely to sell out the interests of their own country in exchange for large sums of foreign money, and as such usually constitute the natural targets of nefarious plotters and foreign spies. Churchill certainly seems to fall into this category, with rumors of massive personal corruption swirling around him from early in his political career. Later, he supplemented his income by engaging in widespread art-forgery, a fact that Roosevelt eventually discovered and probably used as a point of personal leverage against him.”
This is the part that most Libertarians cannot fathom, because of ideology: The simple fact is that any people which is defined rightly as being greedy and acquisitive is also prone to being bribed. If your group mortality is based on any form of ‘might makes right,’ your group morality is based on amoral gain at the expense of others. If you see acquisition and wealth taking as inherently your right, then your morality always is essentially imperialistic and violent, barbarous. And you will be more than open to both making and receiving bribes.
Jews can buy WASPs easily because WASP culture is wide open to being bribed. Jews knew the while archetypal WASP Oliver Cromwell was strutting around having great fun slaughtering people inbthe names of ending tyranny and freezing people.
There are two groups of people who will fight to the dating not to see any of that: Jews who know that there prt off the Anglo-Zionist game works best7m by farm if they take all the blame (because they then can just when about anti-Semitism and keep going) and romantic Anglo-Saxon Protestant identifiers who can only imagine that women totally alien bunch Jews snuck in and forced a few WASPs to do bad things they otherwise would not have done and therefore the problem is 100% about Jews.
Anglo-Zionist Empire requires both ‘Oliver Cromwell’ and ‘Rothschild’ banking. And it guarantees drunken, avaricious, murderous poltroons like Churchill. WASP Empire is Orwell’s Oceania, is Huxley’s Brave New World. It is our American run ‘rules based order.’ It is Anglo-Zionism. It is evil at its core.
And effective resistance of it requires rejection of the entire cultural edifice with something rooted in historic Christendom.
The “anti-Jewish” riots were the result of the assassination of the Ernst vom Rath at the German embassy in Paris by a communist Jew. As with the vast majority of “anti-semitic” “Pogroms”, it was not only instigated by communist Jews, but the entire Pogrom was orchestrated by them too. Communist Jews were murdering people all over Europe. Gustlof had been murdered in Davos in 1936 by a communist Jew. Communist Jews had also just completed the Holodomr.
The entire post war Holocaust religion is just like an opera with a recurring underlying theme of “projection”. But this projection is backfiring because the more they demonize the NSDAP, the more more people compare them the Jewish IDF, Mossad, ADL and SPLC and their treatment of Palestinians.
This is, to put it bluntly, BS. Ukraine was not in line for NATO membership and still is not. No country with unsettled borders will be admitted to NATO, and NATO has been consistent on that throughout its history. In short, the statement by Mr. Unz is simply rubbish.
A goal of Russia, even as Soviet Russia, has been the destruction of NATO. Instead, because of the invasion, NATO has been expanded and Putin has put the fear of god into some of the members that have not been living up to their obligations under the treaty.
Mearsheimer has most of the same problems as the other Russian apologists. Anything said by MacGregor, Ritter, Johnson, and Mearsheimer has been a waste of time. They have been consistently wrong. It is a shame that Mr. Unz has been taken in by their rubbish.
The closing comments in this article explain how I viewed the start of the conflict in Ukraine from day one while sitting in my Moscow dormitory. I was mad at Putin, as I thought he fell into America’s trap for him. We’ll see if the Kremlin can pull off a victory, which would be arguably better for those of us on the dissident right. Great article as always!
The Jews are always attempting Purim. Exterminate the goyim.
Whenever the goyim manage to fight back, it’s self defense.
We are living through another Purim right now. Read the Book of (((Esther))).
One percent of the population but owned 33% of the land. That’s the thing right there.
Sounds like the “west” today. Same as it ever was.
Jews are supposedly 2% of the US (Weimerica) population. Is there any way to get a figure on how much real property they own? I’d put it at about 33%, at least, and 60% in major cities.
The owners of the real property have all the power.
The Jew is always the landlord, never the tenant.
“By resurrecting a prosperous Germany while nearly all other countries remained mired in the worldwide Great Depression, Hitler drew glowing accolades from individuals all across the ideological spectrum”
Is that the real reason for Hitler’s popularity at the time?
What’s left out here is that Hitler was the main world leader advocating Eugenics. He was the new man leading the way in murdering the disabled, and or course the Jews. He would have steadily worked his way around to darker skinned people and Catholics for sure. No future for them in their racial utopia.
Much of his support was in England, where the whole issue of Eugenics originated with the followers of Malthus like Francis Galton.
This issue of Eugenics is consistently downplayed in any discussion of World War II, and the fact that it was slowly spreading throughout the western democracies with strong support in the intellectual and progressive classes. The idea of culling the races has its roots in the English intellectual aristocracy and was popularized by H.G.Wells, Bertrand Russell and Aldous Huxley.
Hitler was the world leader who had the courage or madness to put the English intellectuals eugenic ideas into practise.
I think it was God or Providence(same thing) who ended Hitler working through people like Churchill, who was no doubt flawed, but was still a towering figure far above the average man. (Anyone who doubts that should read some of his writings in his 5 volumes on the first world war, his 5 five volume on the second world war and his 4 volumes on the History of the English speaking peoples- he was a genius in his use of language)
God destroyed the Germans to stop Eugenics for a period of time. A time of peace, the cold war and the time recently after the fall of the Soviet Union.
If Hitler had not been stopped imagine the carnage that would follow. H.G Wells had written openly about eliminating the darker skinned people because of the superiority of the white races.
We’ve confined ourselves to murdering millions of unborn defence babies. The bloodbath the Eugenicists had in mind was vast and evil.
The defeat of Hitler ended those murderous dreams of the Ecumenists and Malthusians.
Unfortunately it was never going to last, and the same evil is now returning, this time with the power of modern science and genetics to back it up.
Fuck Putin and fuck Stalin and Hitler. The fucking terrorist USEUNATO conglomerate couldn’t have found more compentent partners to advance their global Judaification than fucks like Hitler and Putin.
When Göring took the stand at the IMT, he was questioned by his defense attorney, Otto Stahmer — after Göring describes his upbringing and participation in WWI, Stahmer asks him about the circumstances of his first contact with Hitler — Göring said the first time he heard Hitler speak it was about Versailles — he was so impressed that he wanted to offer Hitler his help, so he went to meet him — Hitler immediately agreed to speak with him — Göring said at that meeting he had a ‘Schicksalsgefühl’, a feeling of destiny — people who understand German can listen here:
Nuremberg Day 80 (1946) Hermann Goering Direct Dr. Otto Stahmer — 3m30s
Göring also says that because of the way the war ended and his opposition to Weimar, he refused an invitation to be part of the Reichswehr.
The sooner the English become extinct the more peaceful this world will be.
I’m inclined to believe that way of thinking would eventually find excuses to have everyone end up extinct.
Perhaps rather than peoples could it be that sociopathic leaders are the ones that might need to become extinct from positions of power in the responsibilities of nations and humanity in general from obtaining public office.
“Wars are not the desires nor results of peoples……..but of individuals” – Sir Patrick Hastings
Germany agreed to an end to the fighting—on the basis of President Woodrow Wilson’s Fourteen Points, which seemed to offer a fair peace without a victory for either side. But this turned out to be a bait-and-switch operation
I am shocked ! In dealing with the US many nations and leaders understand that you are loved until you are not and that agreements are more worthless than used toilet paper. Those who chose to ignore the Judas, like Noreiga and Quadaffi, pay with their lives !
We see the same thing over and over again. Its no wonder that North Vietnam was nonchalant to US peace initiatives and gave the US a taste of its own medicine. Scoot along on the historical timeline and we have the Berlin Wall bait and switch and now the Ukraine/ Minsk betrayal. The same game 100 years later.
Its no wonder no one trusts the US to keep its word. That is why the next major conflict is going to be a fight to the end. When an animal is unpredictable it is wise to put it down for good.
We went through that last year and you’re completely wrong, having formed your entire view of the history based upon a paragraph or two in some extremely biased history published decades ago.
The Zelikow book that came out a couple of years ago was based upon years of archival research and is the first study on the subject written in the English language. It totally supports my analysis of the history. Anyone interested should read my article or the subsequent comment-threads in which we debated the point.
https://www.unz.com/runz/american-pravda-lost-histories-of-the-great-war/
Sure, they were sensible people. I think something like a million Germans had already died in the pointless slaughter and continuing the war was stupid for everyone. Lots of the leaders in Britain, Russia, and the other countries felt the same way, but only in Germany were they in the majority.
Just read my article from last year:
https://www.unz.com/runz/american-pravda-lost-histories-of-the-great-war/
I read the Preparata book several years ago and here’s what I said about it in a comment:
https://www.unz.com/runz/american-pravda-understanding-world-war-ii/?showcomments#comment-3488251
So, when all the prominent jews (and not so prominent, fr that matter) insist that the hoax is real, are we to still believe they are brilliant with higher IQ’s or are they (as I suspect) blatantly lying for white genocidal reasons?
The myth of the smart jew dissolves. Yet the truth of the evil jew is evident.
Absolutely great interview.
The way American academia teaches WWII, including the causes and results, are a complete travesty. Combine that with Hollywood presentations, which are just caricatures and you have a massive 80 year propaganda effort. The only thing we did by destroying Hitler was make the world safe for Jew communism which is now destroying us from within.
There was a mini series called the Exodus shown in the seventies when mini series were a thing. Anyway that was the start of the Holocaust. It was a term no one heard until then. Odd.
Also Pat Buchanan wrote a book Churchill, Hitler, and ‘The Unnecessary War’: How Britain Lost Its Empire and the West Lost the World. It discussed Churchill’ s twin lusts of bloodshed and lavish lifestyle. Horrible little man.
During the 1960s, I was married to a woman whose parents were Jews who left Germany in 1935, and who owned a large men’s wear department store in Germany. The man had died in the 1950s, but his wife survived and was my mother-in-law. She was an outspoken, caustic woman, who had unrelenting criticism of Nazi Germany. She blamed the Nazis for her economic problems (her and husband tried to sell their store without luck). Her brother-in-law had sold his share to her husband and had left Germany earlier and owned a fortune in orange groves.
She complained that when they came to New York City, she had to hire herself out as a housecleaner for several weeks (her main complaint was that she had to clean others’ toilets – a nasty fate to be avoided more than death, by any Jewish matron).
But, remarkably, she had little bad to say of Adolf Hitler (her complaint was that he let the “roughnecks” take over). She never mentioned “camps”, or gas chambers, or genocide. In the late 50s and early 60s, there were many Jews who came out of hiding from WWII, and there were many re-unions going on in her house. I didn’t speak Yiddish or German, so I understood little except that many Jews survived WWII.
The Holocaust (notoriety) didn’t come out until the 1970s, which, by my experiences was a sham.
As an untermensch, I find it disgusting that in an attempt to “clear history”, one of the most despicable beings in human history is getting the benefit of the doubt by these revisionists. Really – why? You can question the holocaust, point to the obvious that UK was, as always, the real catalyst of the war, that Churchill and FDR were as evil as Duche if not more, that the US was the final benefactor of the war, etc., but to question the motives of Adolf Schiklgruber, a a sick monster who only in Germany of that time could have been supported by all the population, is either plain demented or smbd. with an agenda.
The western collective karma for WW2 is playing out now in the complete destruction of its civilization with LGBt…., wokeism, covid religion and general degeneration. It all started then in the 1930s, even though, some countries may have lost more population to “covid” than to the nazis… Hmmmm, maybe spend some time figuring this one out instead of beating a dead horse in mental masturbation.
Bros
You live in Moscow “will see if the Kremlin can pull off a victory ?”
One German veteran of Russia lived next door to me and after I had known him for several years told me Russia was a dreadful place. His wife said that even in his 90’s he would wake up screaming and crying from nightmares.
If Russia back then could defeat the cream of the Wehrmacht after a near disaster losing Moscow, how will it fare against the fruitcakes in NATO. Maybe NATO trannies wearing pink dresses, high heels and matching bags will rout the Wagner Group, the Russian Army and take Moscow. We will see !?
Have a little faith Bros !
Thanks. Something about Hitlerjugend?
Talking about “German leaders” in this generic way means nothing on something like this. A.J.P. Taylor describes how Bethmann-Hollweg, as he became isolated and at risk of losing power to Ludendorff, attempting to make some gestures to the Allies. But Ludendorff never supported any of this.
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Bethmann, last remnant of Bismarck’s system, was left in nominal control, impotent to influence events, but striving still to hit on a programme which would both end the war and satisfy the demands of the political forces inside Germany — with the exception, of course, of the Spartacists and the Independents. To tempt the Allies he made offers to withdraw from Belgium and northern France; to satisfy the industrialists he made these offers spurious. To satisfy the Social Democrats he held out hopes of the liberation of Poland; to satisfy the Junkers and to keep the door open for a separate peace with Russia he made these hopes spurious also. To satisfy the Greater Germans he encouraged the re-establishment of German supremacy in Bohemia; to remain faithful to the principles of Bismarck’s policy he continued to treat Austria-Hungary as an independent and non-German power. Similarly, in home affairs, he promised a reform of the Prussian franchise; and took care never to put his promise into action. This was not government, nor even tactics; it was the helpless lurching of a machine utterly out of control. The government of the Reich had become as shadowy and meaningless as the movement of constitutional liberalism which it had ordered out of existence fifty years before; it would vanish at a word. This word was spoken on August 29th, 1916, when — as the result of the failures on the western front — Wiiliam II dismissed Falkenhayn and appointed in his place Hindenburg, hitherto commander in the east, with Ludendorff as his Quartermaster-General. On that day the supremacy of the military leaders, which Bismarck and even his successors had resisted, was established; the Chancellor, and for that matter the Emperor, ceased to exist as a separate force; and there began a dictatorship of the High Command, which ended only after the defeated German armies had marched home and dispersed. …
The industrialists’ demand for north-eastern France and Belgium, a Little German demand, would strengthen the German armament industry; Ludendorff espoused it. The unrestricted submarine campaign, anti-English and therefore also Little German, would defeat England; Ludendorff forced it through. The Junker demand for Livonia and Courland, which would give the Prussian landowners a new lease of political life in Germany, would strengthen Ludendorff ‘s left flank in the next war: he
added it to his programme. But at the same time, he added elements from the Greater German creed of democratic tradition, elements which would ruin the last fragments of Junker power. Ever since the beginning of the war, German policy had fumbled with the problem of Poland — anxious on the one hand to fool the Social Democrats by a pro-Polish policy; anxious on the other not to raise an insuperable barrier to a separate peace with Russia; anxious, above all, not to establish in Russian Poland a genuine Polish movement which would demand the return of Prussia’s Polish territories as well. In the autumn of 1916 Bethmann thought that he was at last within sight of peace with decaying Tsardom. Ludendorff, concerned only to bring out a Polish army on the German side, overrode Bethmann and insisted on the proclamation of an independent Kingdom of Poland in November 1916. So, too, with the affairs of the Habsburg monarchy, Ludendorff thought only of how to subordinate Austria-Hungary completely to the German High Command. The answer: German supremacy in Austria, the dream of the radicals of 1848 and of the extreme German nationalists of the eighteen-eighties; the “Austrian mission,” that high-sounding will-o’-the-wisp, became nothing more than an organization for compelling the Slav peoples to fight for German domination …
—–
— A.J.P. Taylor, The Course of German History, pp. 170, 172.
There was no peace offer approved by Ludendorff until late 1918, when the war was clearly lost.
It is laughable to observe the number of commenters spout the old propaganda canard: Nazi=bad-Communist=good.
The “American History Channel” in the USA should be renamed the “American Hitler Channel” for all the falsehoods and propaganda that it portrays and disseminates about WW2, Germany and Adolf Hitler.
According to programs on the “American History Channel”, Hitler was a drug addict, impotent, riddled with syphilis and other STDs, yet possessed highly technical “superweapons”, possessed “alien technology”, advanced flight and anti-gravity technologies, and still could not “win” WW2.
Anyone with an open mind who watches the Hitler lies and fabrications on that channel can easily see that it is all BS, especially when the so-called “holocaust™” is inserted into just about all of these programming “gems”. The same old photos of emaciated typhus victim bodies are constantly being paraded around to remind “us” how evil Hitler truly was. (Yeah, right).
Germany was much more advanced than even the USA of the time, hence “Operation Paperclip” commenced in which the USA snatched up Germany’s greatest scientific minds after the summation of WW2.
Looking at the big picture (which is usually ignored), the “German state” was attacked by the rest of the world, and held on to its principles for far longer than expected.
Hitler’s greatest “sin” was the monetization of labor (giving labor true “value”) and going against the Rothschild banks. Going against the jew-run banks made him “enemy #1”.
He also KNEW that there was a subset of Bolshevik jews who were fomenting communist revolution within Germany. Most people are unaware of the secret agreements that he had with the zionists to “encourage” jewish emigration to what was then known as Palestine. These agreements were celebrated by both the German government and the zionists at the time. A commemorative coin was even issued to celebrate the agreement. THAT aspect of history is never mentioned on the “American Hitler Channel”.
When it comes to WW2, Germany, and even the Allies, the “American History Channel” is 99% propaganda and 1% truth.
If those of “the greatest generation” could see the world of today and what it has become, being jew-controlled, they would have thrown off their American uniforms and fought on the side of the Germans…
Stuff Unz doesn’t bring up:
Britain blew up Nord Stream (the Russians said so)
Britain blew up peace talks in March 2022
The Skripal poisonings (the anti-Russian hoax that the Brits have used to push WW3)
But in the Unz precincts, Britain always gets a pass from the hall monitor. According to this worldview, Britain is comprised of lovely people who just want peace and goodwill among nations, but are being led astray by Jewish bankers and American warmongers.
And yet–polls show that the American public is much more amenable to a ceasefire in Ukraine than the British public are. If “the global dominance of American media propaganda” is factual, how do you account for this? Why did Jeffrey Sachs (a favorite of Ron Unz) recently say “the British are the most irresponsible, they have nothing to add but they love war, because they still think they’re the British empire.”
How can Unz write such an absurdity? Is he unaware of the Nuremberg trials where the details of the hoax were thoroughly documented, and even cast in stone (see below)? Then there was the little matter of the creation of the state of Israel, which was largely predicated on the hoax, is he unaware of that too?
Unz is saying, ‘OK, the Holocaust is suspect and might not have happened the way ‘holocaust scholars’, Unz’s phrase, tell it. But, it was of no consequence and only came to the awareness of the public in the 1970s, when even the Jews had forgotten it. No big deal. We’re seeing a new strategy, minimization of the hoax.
[Wars are not the desires nor results of peoples……..but of individuals” – Sir Patrick Hastings]
“ “Why of course the people don’t want war. Why should some poor slob on a farm want to risk his life in a war when the best he can get out of it is to come back to his farm in one piece? Naturally the common people don’t want war…after all it is the leaders of the country who determine the policy and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along…the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them that you will be attacked, and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.”
Field Marshal Hermann Goering quote.
Yet in any country that claims to be a democracy, a dubious claim at best, the people bear responsibility for not opposing or sabotaging the war moves of their psychopathic leaders. That the people allow themselves to be manipulated and coerced into sending their most precious sons, and waste their hard earned tax contributions, for the bidding of war profiteers is the given that should make the study of history a most important matter, not through the mindless programming of impressionable students, but by including in history lessons the perspective of the opposing party along with active debates at the classroom floor without any restrictions or intimidations.
The same way that the public was exposed to Holocaust survivor’s books and lectures, survivors from the carpet bombing of German cities should have been allowed to tell their side of the story. That would teach students to think for themselves. But what we are getting is a totally subdued Germany putting octogenarians in prison for challenging the Jewish/Allied narrative.
In this article, Ron Unz is doing what should have been done generations ago. Lew Rockwell called him the Great Ron Unz. I could not agree more.
Your comment makes no sense. I have no idea what you are saying.
Anyway, Hitler wasn’t that bad, at all, he even liked squirrels. Like Bernhard Goetz. Someone who likes dogs and squirrels cannot be a completely bad person. But Hitler liked also women and children. And bears and eagles.
American presidents and Churchill killed many more people than Hitler did. Many, many more. Only Stalin was on their league.
Untenable. The fact that they accepted “outrageous terms imposed at Versailles” as you write means that they were simply defeated and sought peace to save their skins, they had no other option.
This turn to the neocon Zelikow is particularly funny, especially in light of other things which get spouted here. Zelikow’s aims are simply to encourage a Russo-German conflict. Hence, a willingness to praise German imperialism in 1916 in order to better motivate more German workers to go on with the conflict.
When you brought him up last year, I specifically requested any information which allegedly shows that Ludendorff wanted a peace. All of your general comments have been about a vague “Germany” without any real description of the political actors. There isn’t anything about the fact that Bethmann-Hollweg made some gestures. But it has always been recognized by historians that he did this as he was losing influence, in a bid to retain some relevance. Now if someone could produce detailed documents showing that Hindenburg and Ludendorff were actually sending offers to the Allies for a a peace without annexations then that really might change the judgment of history. But no 0ne has been able to describe anything produced by Zelikow which would support this.
https://historynewsnetwork.org/article/180608
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German Chancellor Bethmann Hollweg, in private correspondence with Colonel House, hinted that his country was ready to return Belgium to independence and withdraw from parts (but not all) of Alsace-Lorraine in France. Whether he could have gotten the belligerent Kaiser Wilhelm II and his military chieftains, Hindenburg and Ludendorff, to agree to such concessions is another question altogether, one that Zelikow leaves unanswered.
—–
“The population saw the heavy destruction inflicted by these German bombing raids and was never informed of the British attacks that had preceded and provoked them, so public sentiment greatly hardened against making peace with the seemingly diabolical German adversary.”
If the Ukraine situation escalates into WW3 and the US is nuked by Russia, I can see the majority of surviving Americans feeling the same way due to the propaganda- that Russia nuked us entirely unprovoked. So instead of overthrowing whatever remains of our leadership at that point, the survivors will willingly agree to march over and invade Russia.
Drop the ad hominem, just deal with the facts:
-NATO expanded against Russian wishes and against Western promises.
–The US dropped out of the ABM treaty. Russia said they would have to resond and they have done so.
—The West has meddled in many Russian border countries including Ukraine. Russia stepped in to stop this.
Combined these look like the West is trying to destroy Russia.
Good rule of thumb. Whoever is demonized by the Jew aka American media is really the “good guy.”
The Huns aka Germans of WWI spearing babies with bayonets = lie
Hitler
Gaddafi
Ahmadinejad
Assad “gassing children” = lie
The Founding Fathers
Robert E. Lee
Stonewall Jackson
David Duke
William Pierce
Putin
Mel Gibson
Bobby Fischer
etc. etc. etc
And the scumbags are lionized.
Churchill = bumbling drunkard, lackey for the Jew. Probably compromised or blackmailed, he was well aware of what the Jew was doing in the Soviet Union even drunk.
FDR= scum. Adulterer. Sleazy. Huey Long was a threat to possibly give FDR a run for POTUS but was assassinated by some Jew. Cabinet was Jew friendly to say the least. Considered by some to have had Jewish ancestry.
Eisenhower= pencil pusher who miraculously rose to a 5 star General despite never seeing any combat as a soldier. How is this possible. Talk about affirmative action. Forced integration on Whites at gunpoint in Arkansas. Nickname: ” The Dutch Jew.”
MLK= Speeches were written mostly by some Jew, who plagiarized A bit here and there. Beat prostitutes, mostly White prostitutes, engaged in drunken orgies. Was nothing more than the original “reverend”, on par with scum like Jackson and Sharpton. Another lackey for the Jew.
Baby Nut&Yahoo = nuff said.
Einstein = plagiarism, pervert, and God only knows what else.
The Kennedy’s = Marilyn, Mary Joe, Forced integration at gunpoint in Alabama, skirt chasers, rapists and murderers in the family tree, bootlegging, etc., Teddy the drunk, wow, what a family.
Cue: Abraham, Martin and John by Dion. haha.
etc., etc….
Compare each list. Who looks like the good guys to you?
In terms of Hitler’s and the Nazis’ background and thinking, I would like to recommend the following ground-breaking book (no, I didn’t write it) which I have read:
The Pink Swastika:
https://scottlively.store/product/the-pink-swastika-homosexuality-in-the-nazi-party-4th-edition/
It’s about the role of homosexuality just before and during the Third Reich.
It is well-documented.
Nov 22, 2013 Thomas DiLorenzo – The Revolution Of 1913
From the Tom Woods show (podcast on iTunes),Loyola economics professor Thomas DiLorenzo discusses three events from 1913 that greatly escalated the transmogrification of America from the founder’s vision (limited government) to its current state (unlimited government).
Jun 21, 2023 NATO’s secret TERROR armies exposed in newly declassified documents
Newly declassified documents obtained by investigative journalist Kit Klarenberg of The Grayzone sheds light on previously undisclosed information about the existence of secret terror armies operated by the British government and NATO.
I have warmed up to the idea that the Russian advance on Kiev was a feint designed to preempt or dilute a Ukrainian attack on Crimea. It seems Russia may have been seriously unprepared for a full onslaught and had to make the bold yet strange moves up North with the modest forces they had assembled by that time.
I wonder if the notion that the advance was intended to promote negotiations is a palliative for Russian parents since having sons die hopelessly outgunned in a feint is not something to be discussed in polite company. Even though the feint was crucial and those may be heroic deaths, facing the reality of disposable heroes is not for the faint-hearted (no pun intended).
When I think about General Ben Hodges’ bloodthirsty talks, I now wonder if he is describing the actual original Ukrainian battle plan which he probably helped create. He uses phrases like “Sweep down and take Crimea” with a LOT of commitment.
I agree with you that nobody in 1916 wanted any kind of “peace” which didn’t include a settlement where they substantially won the war.
After you review the link provided by Mr. Unz, here is another one with my early thoughts on the same topic for you to consider.
https://www.unz.com/runz/american-pravda-lost-histories-of-the-great-war/?showcomments#comment-5681509
I personally don’t have the time–nor the desire–to read every book on the holocaust, because there must be literally thousands.
Many, if not a majority, of those books were written by non-jews, including plenty of germans.
Are they all in on the conspiracy?
I think the dismantling of the Warsaw Pact is a good analogy. The reason the Soviets agreed to withdraw their troops from East Germany was that the West promised NATO wouldn’t then advance into Eastern Europe. But after the Soviets withdrew and lost their bargaining leverage, the West reneged on the agreement and eventually expanded NATO to Russia’s borders.
Similarly, the Germans agreed to withdraw their troops from occupied French territory and scuttle their fleet because they were led to believe that the resulting peace agreement would be fair and based upon Wilson’s Fourteen Points. But after they lost their bargaining leverage, the Allies changed their mind and imposed an extremely harsh peace.
you are obviously jewish
Perhaps my language was a little loose in those quoted paragraphs from 2018, but my meaning was clear. Obviously, many major elements of the Holocaust narrative were promoted during the Nuremberg trials in 1946 and around the same time President Truman mentioned the six million figure in one of his speeches.
But as far as I can tell, there then was virtually no mainstream media discussion of the Holocaust story in the years that followed, with strong indications that it had quietly been understood to have probably just been wartime propaganda, and Beaty explicitly claimed this in his very high-profile 1951 book, which no one seems to have ever challenged.
Prof. Peter Novick focused on exactly this lack of attention in his widely-discussed book that I cited.
If you can find any substantial mainstream discussion of the Holocaust or its major elements during roughly the period 1947-1960, I’d be very interested.
Kristallnacht itself is grossly exagerated and may well have been a psyop by international Zionist forces or the intel agencies of foriegn governments hostile to Germany (the former seems most likely as the provocateurs seemed strangely ignorant of the basic Nazi command structure–e.g., someone dressed as an SS officer tried to order SA officers to lead attacks on Jews). See Ingrid Weckert’s The Bizarre Story of Kristallnacht. Download it for free here:
https://christiansfortruth.com/books/
> But after they lost their bargaining leverage, the Allies changed their mind and imposed an extremely harsh peace.
Ludendorff had absolutely no bargaining leverage, and he knew that very well. The failure of the German spring offensive to force France to submit to German terms before US forces arrived guaranteed Germany’s defeat. If the war had gone on into 1919 then the US plans were to begin dumping poison gas onto Berlin.
—–
In July 1918, General William L. Sibert, the head of America’s chemical warfare program, ordered that 3,000 tons of the methyl in shell and drums must be ready on March 1, 1919. The army’s secret plan for the spring 1919 offensive called for a massive use of poison gas that would have turned the fighting into largely a chemical war.
—–
— Scott Christianson, Fatal Airs, p. 40.
It would have been a disaster for Germany if the war had been carried on. The plans were to wipe out the Berlin population with wholesale attacks. Ludendorff simply played a dirty trick on the politicians whom he despised. He knew that he was defeated, so resigned and turned the government over to the Social Democrats and Catholic Centrists. They took over the government and signed the peace since they had no choice. Once that was done, Ludendorff accused them of a stab in the back even though he never had any realistic alternative.
Perhaps they whored themselves out for money. (((Publishing companies))) promising “their” books would be on ((( The New York Times Bestseller List))), whine, dine, and pocket line…. Kind of like John Grisham and his fairy tale, “A Time To Kill” which reversed the races of the victim and perpetrators but still hyped up the anti White movie/novel as ” based on a true life incident.” lolol, yeah right.
Jews were POW, SO WHAT. Jews were responsible for the genocide of 3-7 million in Ukraine in 1932-1933. Even IF the holocaust Jew narrative were 100% accurate, karma is a bitch. The Jew attempted the same shit in Spain but was unsuccessful, now we see that WWII never ended for the Jew. IF the holocaust were real it surely did not teach the Jew the error of his ways.
with the greatest respect —
@ 1:41: “Churchill and FDR had secretly agreed to dismantle the French empire”
What is the source for knowledge of this “secret” agreement?
—
btw: at the risk of too-much ‘reading between the lines’ —
Andrew Buchanan’s discussion of U.S. Engagement in Italy during WWII suggests that dismantlement of the Italian empire — or at least subversion of Italian interests, economy, and politics — was also on FDR’s agenda; in the case of Italy, prompted by Bernard Baruch.
Hey, Ron, have you ever read The Bizarre Story of Kristallnacht by Ingrid Weckert (downloadable for free here: https://christiansfortruth.com/books/ )? From what I’ve read in many sources, it seems the traditional account is grossly exaggerated; but from the evidence presented in that book, it appears that it may have been partly the work of Zionist or foriegn intel provocateurs (the former being more likely as the latter would have understond the Nazi command structure enough to know that a man dressed as an SS officer can’t be expected to get an SA officer to obey his orders). You should take a look at the book, even if you end up finding Irving’s semi-traditional account more persuasive. Great interview, by the way.
You need to understand the evil influence of Wall Street. They had loaned Britain and France massive sums and worried they could not be repaid if peace occurred in 1916. Germany began its unrestricted submarine warfare (only in British waters) in 1916 to pressure Britain to join peace talks. (It says so in the Zimmerman telegram). But Wall Street told the Brits to hang on, their boy Wilson would would send Yanks into the war as soon as he was reelected by promising not to enter the war.
The war went on for two more years until the Americans arrived to save the day and the Germans accepted Wilson’s just peace, only to be screwed by the Brits who stole big chunks of German land and allowed Wall Street to loot Germany via reparations to collect all war loans, plus interest.
I also think the dismantling of the Warsaw Pact is a good analogy. The reason the Soviets agreed to withdraw their troops from East Germany was that they were weak after decades of decadence due to Marxist ideology, they could not sustain their empire in Eastern Europe, so they withdrew, they had no choice.
The Russians today complain they believed in the promises of the West not to expand NATO to the East and Russophiles cry out loud about the lying West. I call BS. Everybody and the Russians knew they were weak and Eastern Europeans will line up to join NATO. Then the Russians started to do things right and here we are.
If you believe the Germans believed those promises, perhaps you don’t know much about heads of states, being an honest person all your life. Heads of states don’t trust each other at all. They don’t trust their mothers ffs! They act out of necessity to keep as much of their power as they can and they pretend they had righteous reasons. It’s in their job description.
The Germans of WWI were weak as were the Russians in the 90s so they pretended to be peaceful to hide their WEAKNESS. Weakness is the worst sin of the head of state.
Well, if this outrageous article does not merit a scathing attack in NYT,. LAtimes and WaPo, complete with copious links to this site, then the editors don’t know a Holocaust denier and an anti-semite from any hole anywhere! And please, don’t let it be just another ineffectual Guardian piece of trash again…
I read the one on the Sound of Music. Too earnest, and who wrote, directed, or produced it? I recall my mother taking me to see it as a small child, the nat-soc. elements seemed like the ‘good ones’ to me at the time.
Slovenian band Laibach performed it in D.P.R.K. abt. seven years ago, but D.P.R.K. appears to have had a strict contract with the band, so only the title song can be shown.
The record or CD is available, a few other videos are online (a couple very strange, not in a good way), but AFAIK, the above is the only one from the Sound of Music tour in D.P.R.K.
This is so ignorant I must assume that it comes from a paid troll:
1. If Soviet Russia wanted to destroy NATO, it wouldn’t have withdrawn its forces from Eastern Europe, allowed East Germany to join NATO, and disbanded the Warsaw Pact.
2. NATO had expanded all the way to Russia’s borders long before the Ukraine conflict, even after promising not to expand to the east in 1991. The USA built missile launch bases in Romania and Poland in blatant violation of the INF treaty with Russia, built ten new military bases in Poland, and deployed an armored brigade there. NATO also formed armored battle groups (with British and German soldiers) and deployed them right up to Russia’s borders.
3. Then our CIA couped Ukraine’s democratic government in 2014 when it lost interest in joining NATO or the EU after Russia said that would cross a red line. Then NATO built a huge training base in Ukraine and sent billions of dollars to build up a massive Ukrainian army.
All the happened long before Russian troops moved across the border in 2022, mostly to prevent genocide.
Here are some basics for those minds ruined by CNN.
I don’t know how old you are, but if you were old enough to be aware of current events and life in the USA in the 1960s and 1970s, you might be aware of the lack of discussion of the “Holocaust,” a word with a meaning that had nothing to do with Jews until the 1970s. I grew up in those years, and I recall the radical change in the American view of World War II. In the early 1970s, an avalanche of movies, “documentaries,” and media coverage began laying out the claims of the so-called “Holocaust.” Prior to that, the treatment of Jews in World War II had no more importance than many other facets of the war and was rarely discussed. If it had been, there probably would not have been a popular WW II comedy called “Hogan’s Heroes” on American television that ran from 1965 to 1971.
I graduated from high school in the mid-1970s, and it was only then that the Jews and their supposed experiences during World War II became so widely discussed in the media. I can honestly say I don’t recall any discussion of Jews and World War II in the 1960s, but I was also very young then, so that might account for that. But, in the early 1970s, an avalanche of anti-German hatred in the media began, and the “Holocaust” was at the center of it. I remember it like it was yesterday. My German parents came to the US after World War II, and they noticed the change. Despite coming from Germany and never abandoning their love for Germany, they were proud Americans. But when I brought home the discussion we were introduced to about gas chambers and Jews in the mid-1970s, along with it being discussed in the media, my mother commented, “This country has changed.” My parents were very bothered by their country being denigrated daily. And when you consider that the mammoth-length memoirs of Churchill, de Gaulle, and Eisenhower don’t mention gas chambers, that makes sense. It did not become the central feature of World War II in the American media or in American minds until the 1970s.
Outstanding analysis and commentary by Ron Unz.
The Haavara Agreement (Hebrew: הסכם העברה Translated: “transfer agreement”) was signed on 25 August 1933 after three months of talks by the Zionist Federation of Germany, the Anglo-Palestine Bank (under the directive of the Jewish Agency) and the economic authorities of Nazi Germany. The agreement was designed to help facilitate the emigration of German Jews to Palestine. While it helped Jews emigrate, it forced them to give up most of their possessions to Germany before departing. Those assets could later be obtained by transferring them to Palestine as German export goods.[1][2]
So your in-laws could have transferred some assets this way.
And whose fault is it that you could not have questined the motives of Schicklgruber so far?
It’s a silly book. The most likely explanation behind Crystal Night is that was planned by Hitler and Himmler, using Goebbels as an unwitting dupe, to discredit the SA and allow authority to be concentrated into the hands of the SS. In 1934, the Night of the Long Knives had been carried out as a concession to the army, which hated the SA. In 1938, Hitler moved against the army brass to shake things up and get his own chosen people into positions. This led to an apparent revival of the SA, who now joined on political attacks against the army. But the SS had been growing since 1934, and that was a new rivalry which the SA were not prepared for.
It all came to a head with the Night of Broken Glass. Goebbels put out calls to SA men, bypassing the normal chain of command. He whipped them up into a riotous state, and he was probably expecting that this would help his own promotion. But instead, Hitler suddenly expressed a disapproving view of the whole incident, and it was the SS which was promoted to the head of the class.
That would not have happened if Weckert’s thesis had been correct. If it had really happened the way that Weckert asserts, this would mean that Himmler was laying down on the job while Zionist agents set themselves up all over Germany. If Hitler had remotely suspected this, then Himmler would not have been given the promotion which he got. The only good explanation is that Hitler was fully satisfied that no such security lapse had taken place and that Himmler had not failed to catch anyone, the way that Weckert implies.
If the Versailles Treaty was bad, what to think of the situation post-1945?
Just look at Germany today. A mess. A completely defeated nation. Its young men are turned into queers, its young women are turned ino whores. The population is being replaced by Arabs, now the governments wants to bring even more immigrants from Africa and India. Meanwhile young people complain about… “climate change”. Their pipeline was destroyed, their future jeopardized, their economy being dismantled, but not a peep of complaint. A demoralized nation.
Still, weirdly enough, lots of Germans remain arrogant and keep pushing for “climate change” legislation in Europe or sending pro-migrant NGO ships to bring Africans to Italy, sending tanks to Ukraine to be destroyed in a week, etc etc.
Congratulations and thanks again Ron Unz, Mike Whitney and others.
“Truth Will Out ”
When I first began looking seriously into WW2 (later to expand to first half of 20th century), there was the hope but not the expectation.
They’ll never allow it ; they are too strong, media control etc
That was only around 16 or 17 years ago. Ì recall an interview of Dennis Wise re the total media blank out of his Greatest Story Never Told DVD series which had sold massively around the world …
But it is happening, despite trolls, Hysteria Channel, The Simpsons etc.
It is your responsibility, dear Reader, to educate yourself.
A stupid population is tax cattle/cannon fodder for the Bank.
Mr Unz has a good library on this site. You have no excuse.
It was noticed about Churchill in 1914 that he seemed to love war, but he was distrusted by the Tory right after his involvement in the abdication crisis. It must never ever be forgotten that Churchill did not declare war on Germany, Neville Chamberlain did that on September 1, 1939. And this may come as a surprise but Churchill did not become prime minister until May 1940, and he was far from popular with Conservative MPs in the House, which was noticed by American journalists and led to instructions to cheer him.
I do not think the US is happy about the invasion of Ukraine because it is an unmitigated catastrophe for the long term geopolitical position of America in relation to China, which is a genuine threat to US primacy.
It was the vindictive nature of the French after WWI that led, inevitably, to WWII. Why countries suck up to French diplomacy/”hosting” peace talks again and again only to learn their lesson (as the US should have done with the Vietnam “peace talks”) about French prevarication and glory seeking, I’ve never been able to understand. God help us if Putin, Biden and ZelenskY end up in Paris…..
Good eye on comparing Churchill and Bidens vulnerability to financial scandal and potential blackmail. A willing intel-agency-penetrated media could make him not only impeachable, but criminally liable for crimes performed while he was vice president from 2008-2016. I doubt Trump in particular would pardon him.
In fact, if Joe could get NATO in a war with Russia, the Establishment might actually try to arrange a Republican Presidential victory because we’d already be at war, and a Republican could be used to gin up patriotic fervor and increase the desperately needed recruitment of young white men, who are not enlisting currently at anywhere near their historical rates. I wouldn’t be surprised if our CIA had some real doozy false flags planned here if we ever get the necessary excuse to declare war on Russia to rile up our own natives. I’m sure we have simultaneous color revolutions probably planned to “start” in every nation on Russia’s borders right at the beginning of our hoped-for involvement.
Thank you for that video and all the others that are very informative. Your work is very much appreciated.
How is that FDR was such a supporter of Stalin when it was well known that the Soviets were mass murders and brutal dictators. FDR’s administration was calling Stalin “Uncle Joe” and providing financial and military support and eventually giving away Eastern Europe to dictatorial communist rule.
Reading the history, within minutes of the end of the war and establishing “new borders”, the Soviet Union became the most dangerous threat. Even Gen. Patton said we fought the wrong enemy and died in an “accident”. It seems that Operation Gladio was create to leave secret cells in countries in case of Soviet takeover of the European states. That may just have been a lie and justification but it shows the concern of Soviet aggression.
It is also well known that FDR was told that he had Soviet spies in senior positions in his administration which he flippantly dismissed. People like Alger Hiss and Harry Dexter White (Weiss) were just a few of the many in various agencies like the State Dept. and Treasury.
None of FDR’s policies regarding the Soviets or spies in his administration makes sense. Any thoughts or books that shed some light on this?
Sound familiar, goy?
Indeed, one would not be accounting for Plutocrats. The orbits of venal Anglo leaders like Churchill and Biden, and their countries’, are very malleable.
“…the Nuremberg trials where the details of the hoax were thoroughly documented…”
See statutes 19 and 21 among those the Jews created by which to conduct these so-called trials. They state explicitly that no evidence shall be required to support testimony given on behalf of the prosecution and that no evidence may be provided on behalf of the defendants to counter such testimony.
Result: an endless river of psychopathic horror fantasies created by vengeful Jews, and COMPLETELY lacking any supporting evidence.
Mr. Unz is not a stupid man – the excellent software of this site is proof-positive of that.
But he appears determined to avert his eyes away from any and all evidence which contradicts his current beliefs about WW1 and WW2 history.
It’s true that people who make a search for the term “Holocaust” during the 1947-1960 time frame aren’t going to find much information. That’s because the original descriptive terms for the Nazi horrors were ones like “mass murder” and most especially “Final Solution“.
The New Nazis – AKA Zionists – found it desirable to do a switcheroo of the names. Holocaust© is damned near a brand name these days – a person can get into some serious legal trouble if he messes with this Holy Intellectual Property in any way.
So why the change? Well, it would be a wee bit embarrassing for Final Solution to still be in common use when that is the precise program the shithole state has in progress for the subhuman Palestinian pests littering the stolen land of former Palestine.
Go to Google Scholar and put in the proper search terms. Limit the time frame to something like 1930 to 1960, and you’ll find plenty of information about what happened both before and during WW2.
One search result I particularly liked was a 1950 letter to the editor of the military journal ORDNANCE. Bern Dibner, a Lt. Colonel in the USAF Reserve, was writing about a 1949 article by the near-Nazi British General J.C.F. Fuller – a fellow who had been whining about the very immoral bombing campaign against poor Germany.
Dibner pointed out that 1) the Germans had done plenty of bombing themselves before it was their turn in the barrel, and 2) “The Germans, operating on a tribal superstition, destroyed six million Russians, Poles, and Jews as “lower races. It would be interesting to see General Fuller’s record of moral indignation at the time those wanton acts were committed or exposed.”
Dibner also remarked that “It has long been felt among military men that a basic reason for Germany’s military arrogance has been the fact that in the greater part of a century of military operations that it was her neighbors, and not Germany herself, that suffered physical destruction.”
What goes around, comes around. But in 2023 German memory of the WW2 era destruction has faded and they’re getting feisty again. Rearm! Get Russia!! This isn’t going to end well for them.
Fanciful.
Peter Moreira based his The Jew who Defeated Hitler: Henry Morgenthau, Jr., FDR, and How We Won the War on the million pages that preserved Morgenthau’s diaries, recordings, notes, etc.
In the book’s Prologue Moreira observes that “{Morgenthau] was the early architect of the U. S. airplane program,” and fleshes out this claim in the first chapter, Battling the Aggressors:
According to a timeline from Irving’s Hitler’s War, Warsaw set in motion events that culminated in Grynszpan’s Nov. 7 assassination of vomRath and Kristallnacht: On that date, a fortnight after Morgenthau had obtained FDR’s acquiescence to prepare for war, Warsaw ruled that “after October 31 no expatriate Poles would be allowed back into their country without a special entry visa.”
Germany had been home to many such expatriate Polish Jews, and responded by “quietly shunting trains loaded with Jews across the line into Poland,” among them, Grynszpan’s family, as he learned by a postcard from his sister on November 3.
In other words, FDR’s administration, prodded by figures such as Morgenthau, White, and Baruch, had been planning for war and implementing actions to finance and execute air war well before Hershel Grynszpan shot vom Rath.
Curiously, you leave out more relevant Goebbels quotes.
“The English follow the principle that when one lies, it should be a big lie, and one should stick to it.”
“The war we are fighting until victory or the bitter end is in its deepest sense a war between Christ and Marx. Christ: the principle of love. Marx: the principle of hate.”
“As socialists, we are opponents of the Jews, because we see in the Hebrews the incarnation of capitalism, of the misuse of the nation’s goods.”
“Good propaganda does not need to lie, indeed it may not lie. It has no reason to fear the truth. It is a mistake to believe that people cannot take the truth. They can. It is only a matter of presenting the truth to people in a way that they will be able to understand. A propaganda that lies proves that it has a bad cause. It cannot be successful in the long run.”
and prophetically,
“We shall go down in history as the greatest statesmen of all time,or as the greatest criminals”
Sorry, mistaken. Einstein is the source of all quotable quotes.
wsb/5ds
What you omit, is that there was a large public outcry when the programme began, so the euthanasia bit was cancelled. Some sterilization continued, just as it did in some areas of Canada and the US, for the “mentally deficient”.
Why didn’t anybody in America write a single book or even an article in the 1950s about the killing of millions of innocent Jews during WWII? Were all the historians and journalists in America in on a conspiracy of silence? I guess they didn’t want to tarnish the good reputation of the defeated Nazis. Later, American scholars were finally able to tell the truth about the evil Nazis.
But seriously, the Holocaust story is the culmination of the dishonest official history of the Jews in Europe. The reality is that European Jews were generally materially better off than their Gentile neighbors and wished to be separate from them so that they wouldn’t assimilate and thus “disappear” as Jews. The issue of assimilation came up a lot once Jews were emancipated in the 1800s. See Esau’s Tears by Albert Lindemann.
Are you Trolling, as Caroline Yeager noted; are you flexing your first-time muscle as a spiteful mutant, or was it Ron Unz’s mention of noted lesbian Gertrude Stein that motivated you to recommend this “ground-breaking book?”
Are you referring to this Pink Swastika:
or this one:
Both are listed listed on WorldCat.
Of the second item, SPLC wrote:
Same garbage.
Different day.
Up to now the Brits were having it all their way.
They reconquered US, they are still ‘under the radar’ major global players in most illegal activities either for money or for power.
But not so sure that this time they will get it clean as a nation.
Of course the grand names that are mostly either fully unknown to the public or semi obscure will not take the slightest punch just as the important Jews in WW2
Obviously, there were both pro- and anti-peace factions in Germany as in Britain, but Zelikow’s book provides overwhelming evidence that the former group had greater power in Germany during 1916 and into 1917, until the failure of their peace proposals undercut them. A few offhand paragraphs from Taylor’s book published decades ago certainly can’t match this overwhelming evidence, especially since Taylor essentially ignored the very high-profile 1916 peace effort in his brief account.
But all of this WWI material is really off-topic here since I’d merely included a couple of paragraphs about WWI at the beginning of my long article, only about 2% of the total. The comment-thread on my WWI article is still open, so you should use it for your views:
https://www.unz.com/runz/american-pravda-lost-histories-of-the-great-war/
No, I’m obviously not referring to the term “Holocaust,” which only came into use in the late 1970s or so. I’m referring to the major factual elements, such as gas chambers, extermination camps, or many millions of Jewish deaths.
That would be a fine example except that it’s merely a 1950 letter to the editor. Since you’ve been doing searches, perhaps you can locate a few similar examples in actual articles published in mainstream media outlets or by reputable historians.
As I’ve already emphasized, those official claims had been made at the Nuremberg trials and in one of Truman’s speeches, and they were never officially repudiated, so it’s hardly surprising that someone—possibly Jewish by his name—might have still mentioned them in a 1950 letter. But I think by that time, most knowledgeable people had quietly understood it had just been wartime propaganda-nonsense. Hence nobody challenged Beaty’s 1951 bestseller that explicitly said that.
Note that Dibner even gets his story a little confused, since he seems to believe that the six million figure includes all the Russians, Poles, and Jews killed by the Nazis, rather than merely the Jews alone.
You forgot to mention current Israel, The Land of Bilk & Money.
Where would we be without AIPAC, ADL, SPLC and Holocaust Studies at public universities? Of course, we can always choose those courses in “Fandom Rhetoric” to understand the analysis and impact of Harry Potter and Buffy, the Vampire Slayer.
Study the classics, i.e., Ancient Greece or Rome? Who needs that anymore?
These Unz emissions are like the part in Hellraiser where little Amy Greenblatt is hiding in the closet from her dead uncle, who’s running around wearing her dead Dad’s face like a mask, and the female Cenobite sneaks up on her and barfs squirmy maggots on her and she’s got to not scream or she’ll get caught. (The female Cenobite is scariest because I’d totally do her.)
Today’s particular moments of sublime joy:
“unexterminated Gypsies”
citing prominent public intellectual “Andrew Anglin of the Daily Stormer”
I can only guess that everyone on FDR’s team knew communism didn’t work and Slavs are stupid so the Soviet Union would be in deep trouble once his Lend Lease aid ended.
He also expected to have his powerful ally China on the Soviet’s border as a threat. FDR had armed the Soviets to destroy the German empire, and had armed the Chinese to destroy the Japanese empire. If he could spark a war between the Soviets and Chinese, they would destroy each other, leaving his United Nations based in New York to rule the world.
I’m just speculating, but surely these ideas were discussed.
In the end it turned out that Hitler was a criminal but he had a limit, Churchill was also a criminal but he had no limit and he proposed to continue killing until he ensured white supremacy forever.
A racist degenerate who wished to use nuclear supremacy to subjugate the world forever.
I didn’t know you made a video:
The holohoax has turned our world upside down, so that now we are governed by Jews who have allegiance only to Israel, who have forgotten the MAD doctrine, and have us on the verge of WW III.
Not to mention the endless death destruction and chaos that has existed in the middle east ever since the advent of Israel, all a consequence of the hoax.
But that’s of no concern to you? The only thing of interest is the academics’ take on the subject, and mainstream academics at that? What you are saying has no relation to the hoax or its consequences, beyond that the Jews were somehow able to totally corrupt not only governments and the press, but also academia, which is, admittedly, amazing.
You’re acting as a hoax minimizer or apologist, maybe unconsciously, maybe consciously. After all, when the Jews have to admit the thing was a preposterous prima facie hoax from the very start, which occurred before 1906 when an article appeared in the NYT accusing Russia of an ongoing systematic and murderous extermination 6 million Jews, what do the Jews say then? Why … it’s no big deal, of course, no one really paid any attention to it, why even the academics didn’t notice, i.e. exactly what you are saying right now.
Ron,
I respectfully disagree with your “assessment” of Antony Sutton, Ph.D. (now deceased). I stand by every comment that I made about him. I have read many of his books and many other authors agree with his writings concerning the transfer of technology to Russia and the U.S. corporations’ and financial industry’s help in Hitler attaining power and giving (selling) him the means with which to conduct World War II.
In regard to Mr. Sutton’s books on the transfer of American technology to Russia, he used the U.S. government’s own documents as a source for his writings. I cannot believe for one minute that a person with the education that Mr. Sutton possessed would use “dubious sources” for his writings concerning Germany both before World War II and during the war. His writings on this subject have been confirmed by many others.
I would much more believe Mr. Sutton’s writings than I would believe ANYTHING from the mainstream media or anything that I would see on television.
Thank you.
“The legions of ignorant Westerners who mindlessly rely upon our disingenuous media may be denouncing Putin as “another Hitler” but I think they may have inadvertently backed themselves into the truth.”
Maybe, but Pres.Putin himself would
not appreciate the comparison whether meant advertently or inadvertently. Hitler is even more reviled in Russia them in the West. Discussions like the above would meet with even less reception there. The ‘Great PatrioticWar’ is still relevant to them & Hitler is about as popular as Stepan Bandera. Although claims about Hitler’s better side would probably find a wide audience in Ukraine itself. For Hitler fans though, Ukraine could also be viewed as pivotal. If Hitler had halted his invasion of the USSR after scoring an easy victory in Ukraine instead of pressing on immediately to Moscow in the winter of 1941/’42, he might have won the war, at least in the short run. In any case, Russia didn’t want Hitler in Ukraine anymore than it wants Biden in Ukraine, whatever his relative (alleged) merits in other regards. It’s just not up for discussion for them.
Creation of the Golem.
Hi Ron,
Trained in philosophy this commenter is more prone to look at this issue with dis-compassion [Reason is me being an old Aramaic Orthodox Christian(who has his Sunday liturgy from the Jakobus (St.James’s) liturgy of the First Jerusalem Christian Community, today celebrated in Syriac (modified Estrangelo Aramaic) in the 8th revised version. St Thomas, an Apostle of Christ brought it to us on the Indian West Coast, Kerala around 52 A.D. traveling with a Jewish merchant (Rabban or Habban? Pl. refer to Thomas Acts in British Museum)]
Theologically, one may say, the problem began with the Garden of Eden. The Greed and Bondage to material and sensual charm and glory had bedeviled the Jews of all variants down millennia along with the perpetrator/originator of the tradition, the Egyptian and Sumerian sorcery culture that subjugated them till Moses liberated them.
How many Jews want to hear today, “Thou shall not kill” (implying Lacto-Vegan culture and all wars deliberately created last 500 yrs. for money grab alone), “Thou shall not steal” (Big Banks plus), “Thou shall not take another man’s wife” (Epstein & accused Hollywood film director stories) and amassing wealth by default and infinite lies ad nauseam? The entire marketing world controlled by the Jews is replete with and rinsed in superbly cooked lies and structured deceit. Prof. Thomas Dalton’s columns in UNZ Review corroborate these. Such criminal or non-criminal factualities go unpunished to cause murderous destitution in a world where millions starve to please sub-fractional, multi-billionaire neocon Zionist Zealots! Where is the Jewish Conscience towards humanity Yahweh has planted in the Human as He Blew Life into their nostrils. I am glad there are conscientious Jewish priests like Rabbi Dovid Weiss who categorically stated years ago that Judaism is not Zionism and does not require a land or state of their own to possess for their existence.
Greedy, unprincipled immoral people are not among Jews alone in this rapacious mortal sin accumulation. A good lot of Christians, Hindus, Japanese, etc., are all culpable, who are accountable for the same horrendous sins. That in no way exonerates the collective evil or individual guilt modern business/political Jews have committed individually or in sync with conglomerates. They are answerable to ABBA, their Creator. Hindus call it collective Karma. All are equal before Law. No escape, entitlement or exceptionalism for anyone anywhere. The next Holocaust will not see any concentration camps, only ashes with a nuclear extinction. No, enlightened world Jews wielding huge economic and political power have a dead serious responsibility to proactively fight for human evolution and not its devolution and extinction. That’s the Jewish Challenge. Can you rise up to that?
George Chakko, former U.N. correspondent at the Vienna International Center (U.N.), is now retired in Vienna, Austria. 17 July 2023 22:57 CEST
Levtraro wrote:
“The Russians today complain they believed in the promises of the West not to expand NATO to the East and Russophiles cry out loud about the lying West. I call BS. Everybody and the Russians knew they were weak and Eastern Europeans will line up to join NATO. Then the Russians started to do things right and here we are.”
Sort of. The world of geopolitics was different after Hiroshima August 6, 1945. I think the Russias had a glimmer of hope that the West would behave since Russia inherited a potent nuclear arsenal from USSR.
I think the Russian view would be more like: The USA should not press us with NATO and in other ways because we are still dangerous. Once the West pressured anyway, Russia thought, well these fools are doing what we expected. We will deal with them at a time and place of our choosing. My impression is that Russia was not really ready in early 2022 but had no choice to send in the troops before Russia was overcome by events. I assume they are very concerned that the leaders in the West seem too stupid to be trusted with nuclear weapons.
yeah, maybe.
I’m a big believer in Occam’s razor. I’m willing to entertain the idea that good-faith historians can go back, examine evidence, and potentially revise either the narrative or the numbers.
One of the ironies you immediately notice when you read comments on sites like this, which allow jew-haters to run wild, is that to a man, they all say the nazis didn’t harm one little hair on a single yid’s head, but they should have killed them all.
They also unrelentingly call, either overtly or not, for the extermination of the jews.
If given complete impunity, these jew-haters would kill as many jews as they have rounds of ammo.
So you’re asking us to believe, in contrast to the absolute mountain of evidence and literally thousands of witnesses, that a European population which had been told for thousands of years that jews had killed their savior, and a German population that had been anti-jew to begin with, and made more so by relentless propaganda…you’re asking us to believe that when given the opportunity and absolute impunity, that no jews were harmed?
it’s just not adding up.
again, I’m not opposed to revising figures and examining new evidence that comes to light. but to say it’s just a giant hoax and conspiracy is ridiculous.
It could certainly be true that uncle Adolf never gave the direct order. but his lieutenants knew exactly what he wanted, particularly Himmler.
Oftentimes, it’s the underlings who are more gung-ho than the actual leader.
You probably think those triple parentheses are clever, but they’re really just jewy as hell.
your screen name sounds christian, but I’m pretty sure you’re a jew.
jew.
“why didn’t anybody….write a single book or even an article in the 1950’s”….etc.
actually, Leon Poliakov’s Harvest of Hate: The Nazi Program for the Destruction of the Jews of Europe was Published in America by U. of Syracuse Press in 1954, having been originally published in France as Breviare de la Haine in 1951.
and Gerald Reitlinger’s 668 pp. The Final Solution came out in 1953.
but U.S. Zionist Organizations and their Jewish mass constituencies paid little atention to muh Holocaust during the 1950’s because Israel was still parasiting off German “Holocaust Reparations”.
only when the German lucre began to run out in the late 1950’s did the Zionists begin casting about for some new source of funds….and that meant putting the bite on “American” Jews and America in general, which in turn meant pushing the Holocaust narrative much, much harder.
Gosh, I’ve been away for awhile and must have missed all the calls for “extermination of the jews.”
In the spirit of keeping UnzForum on the up-and-up, please provide about
half-a-dozen examples of Unz forum participants “saying nazis didn’t harm one little hair on a single yid’s head;”
another half-dozen specific examples of the “unrelenting call for the extermination of the jews;”
and to completely, irrefutably validate your claims, provide Six examples of statements you have read on UnzForum that cause you to conclude that “these jew-haters would kill as many jews as they have rounds of ammo.”
No cheating now!!
No fair getting Jonathan Greenblatt to do your homework!!
An excellent article. I would just correct one thing:
WWII did not “pull America out of the Depression.” The Depression lasted throughout the war and only ended in 1946 when Harry Truman abolished Roosevelt’s socialist commands that had frozen the economy and prevented any adjustments from taking place.
And simple common sense shows that the Keynesian fantasies are false: While Keynes saw the pyramids as “thousands of people getting jobs,” he ignored the fact that the money spent doesn’t add anything to the economy. Likewise the war looks like “people getting jobs in war industries,” but what they produce is sent away to be destroyed. So the money from actual productive jobs is spent paying for other jobs that add no new productivity. Nothing the country can use.
Money itself isn’t wealth – only new productive additions are wealth. What you are doing when paying people to be unproductive, is simply stretch out the already existing wealth over more people.
You see “people getting jobs,” but you don’t see what the money could have been used for instead. It could have been used to pay for jobs that actually add to the economy.
Or to put it simpler: Do people really believe, like a Keynesian, that the country is enriched by paying a guy to dig a hole every day and fill it up again? How about instead paying him to do something that others can use?
Ronald Unz’s “Hitler, Churchill, the Holocaust, and the War in Ukraine” is extremely important and goes against everything we were taught in the public schools and have heard in the media.
I urge you all to pass along the link to this piece to everyone you know.
British influence is easy enough to quantify.
Jewish influence is slippery and you could miss it easily by labeling Blinken an American instead of a Jew. Or Edward Spiers as an Englishman.
Ben Wallace as far as I know is a pantomime British type. So is Boris Johnson. The type is well attested to in history and often condemned. Johnson has a Circassian and a Jew in the woodpile though. Sarkozy was French with Romanian roots amirite?
We could say that the Fictional Sir Harry Paget Flashman is the avatar of this Britishness. Waugh captured it well with his Basil Seal character as well.
Such characters are widely loathed for fucking up like Anthony Eden or Lord Halifax or glorified like Churchill or Lawrence for Fucking up in a different way.
No one discusses Jews up to their eyeballs in these scams at least in public.
They missed too many. One story that makes me laugh is that guy who escaped from a camp trekked across Poland and ended up living off the kindness of various peasants who housed and fed him.
Yeah right, Eastern European farmers and villagers took pity on this Czech-Yid so that he could get to inform the British about the camps.
Lol.
Try doing anything remotely similar on foot today asking for a meal bed clothing water and not have the first homeowner call the police on you.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siegfried_Lederer%27s_escape_from_Auschwitz
Hmmm… That’s interesting evidence from the Morgenthau diaries, suggesting that FDR was already focusing on Germany a couple of weeks before the Kristallnacht riots, so perhaps they weren’t as crucial as I’d speculated. It would be interesting if the diaries provided a timeline of when FDR began redirecting his plans for a war against Japan to one against Germany. But if if the anti-Jewish riots weren’t the trigger, I do think they were probably a very important supplementary factor.
Afraid of what you’d find?
1) 1960: Selected Translations of the Eichmann Case from German Magazine
https://apps.dtic.mil/sti/pdfs/ADA358887.pdf
2) 1955: The Final Solution Kurt R. Grossmann
https://www.jstor.org/stable/4609769
1) 1949 Operation murder
https://stars.library.ucf.edu/prism/183/
The Gas Vans were something I hadn’t known about – put a bunch of people into a comfortable camper vehicle and en route kill them with carbon monoxide from the engine.
There are a great many more of these document – maybe it’s time for Mr. Unz to make some searches of his own – ones where he hasn’t put on his blinkers.
I don’t know if you could quite say “empire” but Jews seem to be the only extremely influential non-territorial nation in world history. The gypsies, for example, were never influential. Mainstream political thinkers and historians haven’t come to terms with the phenomenon. It doesn’t help that they are terrified of broaching the subject. Do you know of other similar groups?
If we view the Jewish nation as having occupied a particular economic niche, how come we don’t see similar groups in other regions, e.g. China? Other groups like Lebanese and Overseas Chinese don’t exhibit the same features. They haven’t lasted unassimilated for centuries in a region, like Europe, and formed cohesive international influential networks.
…..hmmm, seems like something along those lines happened recently ……does history repeat ?sorta.
That’s right, the letter writer used a figure which is not currently Politically Correct. He might even be sent to prison if he lived in 2023 Canada, US, or Germany.
Fact is, nobody in 2023 knows how many people the Nazis murdered. And they sure didn’t know back in 1950 either.
Only that the number was a very large one.
The choice of the word “holocaust” is interesting. The literal definition is something like: a great destruction by fire. So basically, what the allies inflicted on the Japan & Germany. Were the atrocities committed against Jews used in an ironic sense? Or maybe it’s because the word “holocaust” had become a popular war to refer to the potential of nuclear war so it already invoked vivid images in people’s minds.
“My Name Is Nobody.”
The demonization has been nowhere near as successful, though. I attribute this to a variety of factors, among them previous demonizations of similar public enemies du jour, general war weariness, infinitely more sources for information, and first and foremost widespread distrust of both mainstream media and government. A new factor is the public has soured on the military, which happened to some extent with Vietnam but not to this degree.
This is not to discount there is a great deal of acceptance of the official narrative, but most minimize it and many outright reject the demonization. Rejection of the Putin as Hitler narrative likely has boosted Trump and wounded his primary rivals, and the same to a lesser extent is in evidence with the RFKJr. boomlet. Public opinion never deters the United States to abandon a planned war, of course, but it is hard to recall a time when there was this much public opposition so early after the train has semi-left the station.
It makes one wonder what would have happened if instantaneous information has been available in 1939.
Ok, so there was one book written by a French author and one by a German author. So, still it appears there was nothing originially written in America about the Holocaust during this period.
Does either of these two books explicitly note the murder of millions of Jewish civilians by the Nazis? I’d think if they did make that claim, and this was taken seriously by American scholars, there would’ve been an outpouring of writing on the subject.
The lesson learned is that empires die hard. How long did the Roman empire chugg along after its peak? And the families at the top never believe it is ever gone you only have to look at England, Poland and Turkie to see a belief in their continued influence beyond what actually is, Mussolini was the epitome of this delusion.
What you have to understand is because of the pyramid shape of power this cycle will continue because those at the top can burn through as many lives and resources at their disposal to keep the party going before it touches them, they haven’t nothing to lose, everything to keep.
After this Ukraine war is settled it will take everything for the U.S to keep Poland and Germany apart, there are far swathes of land Germany considers its and Russia occupies some of it, I wondered why Germany went so easy with the war.
I agree, and would add the following.
The article hints that the push for war in Ukraine resembles the possible engineering of WWII, and that there may have been Jewish involvement in the latter. The cautious hinting at these possibilities is understandable for a public figure. Because the very real Talmudic Mafia who engineered WWII (and WWI, Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, and Syria) and is now engineering WWIII between Russia and the Collective West, is a ruthless bunch.
As John Hobson explained in Imperialism: A Study, imperialist policies are driven by a tiny group of top financiers. See especially the section The Parasites of Empire. Key quotes are in the link below.
By their control of the financial system, they also control the major corporations, including media companies, and almost all the politicians. Thus, they deploy a nation’s military to wage war on other countries so they can loot their resources. Currently they are aiming to loot Russia’s vast natural resources.
The so-called “Anglo-American” empire is controlled by Talmudic Jewish financiers.
https://warprofiteerstory.blogspot.com/p/war-profiteers-and-israels-bank.html
They have no interest in the well-being of Britons or Americans. Instead, they rob and slaughter them in manufactured economic crises and wars for profit. The talking heads in the corporate media and most of Congress parrot their criminal cover stories. Both George W. Bush and Joe Biden are their agents.
Their pet project is Israel, so they can fulfill their “sacred” goal of ruling the world from Jerusalem. All the non-Jews are to be their slaves and cannon fodder, as per the teaching in the Talmud. They are not concerned about the vast destruction of a WWIII, as they were not about WWII or WWI.
They and their Talmudic doctrine are deeply evil. They and their doctrine must be unmasked and discredited for all time.
The normal way for Jews to deflect evidence and facts is to flatly reject it as silliness or racism and then revert back to the true and trodden propaganda line.
Weckert’s book is loaded with facts, evidence and dissection of myths. So the Jews must attack it, pretend it is of no import.
The idea that the Chancellor, the chief of Propaganda and the chief of internal Reich Security would conspire to destroy their international reputation with a violent, out of control demonstration does not make sense on any level except in the projections of a mad Jewish mind.
The facts are this:
Goebbels, Hitler, Heydrich, Himmler et. al had no idea what was going on. When they found out they all actively tried to stop it.
The riot was largely spurred on by the deliberate murder of a German diplomat by a Jew, who likely committed the murder for this specific purpose.
SA groups were given false orders over telephone by anonymous individuals, and street agitators got the party started by smashing up windows in Jewish shops. Once the impression was on that this was a state sanctioned event, a limited riot by the baser elements occurred which damaged some 20% of the synagoges in Germany. A free expression of public indignation to Jew connivance, but obviously not a good look for the country.
It is a mean-spirited idiocy to defend Hitler (by Mike Whitney) on this issue. Hitler demanded to “free” a fraction of his nationals but he violently suppressed the whole Czech nation. It is all right to suppress Czechs because they have been suppressed for 700 years. Historically, the Sudeten Mountains are a natural borders for the Czech-land. The Sudeten Germans settlements across the mountain in Czech land have evolved over the years similar to Jewish settlements on the Palestinian West Bank.
Holocaust is Greek for Burned Sacrifice.
It’s a highly suspicious term when you have the incantation of 6 million used in the same sentence.
“6 million died in the burned offering…to Yahweh…so that we could get Palestine. Amen.” Deny it and you lose your job goys.
Add some Jewish Lightning for insurance claims and you get Kristalnacht.
Agree.
But who was driving the agenda?
Contrary to Patrick McNally’s opinion, the details Ingrid Weckert adds to information about the events of Nov 7 – 10 seem evidence-based, ingenuous, and persuasive.
Coupled with the knowledge that Louis Brandeis, arguably highly influential in international zionist affairs, did want German Jews to leave Germany and more-or-less delegated Rabbi Stephen Wise to get it done –(by May 1933 Wise’s son, James, had published Swastika: The Nazi Terror, as slur that has stuck to the ancient symbol to this day); aware that Wise was highly energetic in the task (later on, to further prod Morgenthau, Wise told the Secretary that “Germans were making soap and lampshades of Jewish flesh;”) and aware, as Francis Nicosia describes, that zionists in Palestine had already formed Mossad elAliyeh Bet to persuade/assist German Jews in leaving Germany and crashing the British barriers to entry to Palestine, I think it’s reasonable to speculate that at least part of the destructive action against Jews was manufactured by zionists as the last tactic to induce them to leave — similar to the way zionists fell upon Iraqi Jews to drive them from Iraq to Palestine.
“… while still other theories suggested Hitler was the illegitimate grandchild of a Rothschild. But, according to Rabbi Antelman, these theories are incorrect. Rather, he claims, Hitler was the deliberate creation of a ritual participated in by his mother, Klara Polzl, and a Sabbatean Frankist. The ritual was held on the 9th of Av, known as Tisha B’av, which is observed by Jews as a fast day commemorating the destruction of the First and Second Temples, but commemorated by Frankists as Sabbatai Zevi’s birthday, on which they celebrate with their sex rites.”
Not just the Germans, but the COMINTERN led by the ‘Russians’ too:
Read on @ https://www.marxists.org/history/international/comintern/4th-congress/versailles.htm
The Fourth Congress of the Far Left socialist parties from all over the planet affiliated to the Communist International was held in November 1922. Its internationalist character is well expressed in its objective position on the injustice of the Versailles Treaty and the motivations behind that.
After this, subsequent congresses turned inwards toward the “defence of the Soviet state” and the Marxist objective analysis of Versailles passed into the background, replaced by a pragmatic search for “Imperialist” allies to “defend the Soviet State”.
It is the latter, along with its associated history, to which the Russian people today are the heir to.
The former Christian West IS the golem, the monster conjured via Kabbalist Satanism.
In addition to being “Fanciful,” it speaks poorly of Ron Unz’s scholarship to take so much of David Irving at face value. It’s pretty ridiculous to still believe, after all this time, the rumor that Goebbels was behind the attacks on Jews when we know it was anti-German interests already put in place that were behind them. (See Ingrid Weckert’s book on Kristallnacht https://carolynyeager.net/damage-kristallnacht-greatly-overstated-world-press) It’s also known that David Irving did not and does not like Joseph Goebbels and wrote a very biased book about him! My own speculation is that Irving is jealous of Goebbels’ chummy relationship with Hitler right up to the end.
Unz’s reliance on just a few sources–sometimes only one!–for his articles makes him a poor historian. And yet folks here are convinced he’s a genius who can never be wrong.
Didn’t Eichmann also testify that the Germans captured a Russian submarine, extracted its engine, then dragged it over 300 miles to Auschwitz and hooked it up to a wooden cow shed to kill people with monoxide fumes? Ludicrous nonsense, of course, but who can blame the guy for wanting to have some fun by pulling on a few Jewish dicks? Anyway the Russians have no record of that supposedly captured submarine. And, somehow, Israel also claims they inadvertently destroyed some 500 hours of interrogation tapes of Eichmann. How convenient.
Let’s cut the bullshit already. In the 1930s Germany received more Nobel prizes in physics and chemistry than any other country. They invented rocket/missile technology and nuclear bombs (on which, oh the irony, Jews heavily rely to this day to protect illegitimate Israel). If they had actually planned to exterminate the entire Jewish population I am sure they would have created more efficient means than were dreamed up by half-assed neurotic Jews.
Even fantasy spinner Raul Hilberg had to admit under oath that there was no scientific evidence of gas chambers. None, nada, zip.
Good summary. Even here their arrogance shows and they are probably the dumbest group collectively. They are all panzer brigadiers who don’t even know the meaning of their own name.
I gather that Unz views a certain discourse as shaping opinion in a certain direction, whereas Zelikow, as per your analysis, allegedly would view the same discourse as shaping opinion in an opposite direction. In Unz’s case he wants primarily to change the dominant view about World War Two, because that’s the one with the most points in common with present-day Ukraine; the inclusion of World War One is merely an accessory for enhancing Germany’s image, and further trashing the West’s. In the case of Zelikow, assuming you are correct, World War One was a much better instrument for his hypothetical purpose than World War Two, because the former was Jew-neutral.
Unz may have been aware of Zelikow’s possible intentions, and simply assessed that in order to score that (very small) point on one flank Zelikow necessarily opened his other flank to an attack.
Czech president Hache travelled to Berlin to ask the German government to protect his country against Soviet invasion.
Germany complied with Hache’s wishes. See newsreels to find out the warm reception German troops received from the citizenry.
The Germans are Asians who for centuries stole the land from the Serbian-speaking tribes (from which the separate nations of Czechs, Poles, Slovaks, etc. later arose). The Rhine River has long been the border between Germans and Serbs who founded all the old cities, as evidenced by the original toponyms (Brandenburg, Leipzig, Dresden, etc.). For example, Berlin was founded and named by Serbs, who lived there for 600 years before the Germans came.
After 1000 years of German penetration into the East, we now have the hypothesis that the ‘good’ Germans, led by their benevolent leader, pre-emptively attacked the USSR because the Russians were planning to conquer Europe. No one asks why the Russians would conquer Europe when there are no resources and raw materials there. At one time, a border between Germans and Serbs was even established by Charlemagne – Limes Sorabicus (Serbian border).
“inclined toward Pacifism”
If there is one question that has bothered me to no end for some 40 years now given my families background from the Balkins and a war that my family and I are still victims of to this very day, is the question of Christians murdering Christians? Read this piece here and it surely must provoke some serious questions if not soul searching?
https://www.theoccidentalobserver.net/2021/12/24/joyeux-no%d1%91l-the-beginnings-of-wwi-and-the-christmas-truce-of-1914/
Does anyone think that if a St. Paul were around to see the killing would not his words be practically the same as what is found in Hebrews 6:4-9
It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age and who have fallen[c] away, to be brought back to repentance. To their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace. Land that drinks in the rain often falling on it and that produces a crop useful to those for whom it is farmed receives the blessing of God. But land that produces thorns and thistles is worthless and is in danger of being cursed. In the end it will be burned.
Even though we speak like this, dear friends, we are convinced of better things in your case—the THINGS THAT HAVE TO DO WITH SALVATION!!!
The 1930’s the decade that everything went to hell. When I studied the Dust Bowl that hit America and the weather storms that like a pattern came in waves well does anyone think that was just a coincidence? I certainly don’t given it is what God warned would happen!
“Only dead men can tell the truth in this world” Mark Twain
The Führer used the greengrocer’s apostrophe?
Founding Sodom-on-the-Spree isn’t something a healthy person would want to brag about. The Prussians are like the English– they didn’t replace anybody, they became them. Just with a Germanic language rather than an indigenous one.
PBS has a new film out extolling the glories of the Weimar culture and its effect on Germany.
The promo has two gay men, sort of side cuddling – in public – and then a woke voice brags that the Weimar Republic was everything Hitler hated!
Like he was a demon for discouraging men to frolic sexually in the streets!🤯
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henri_Deterding
was the person of interest. If you google image search (henri deterding gravesite) you can find a great photo. The one I found was getty image property and I couldn’t post a working link to it. He was not a collaborator. He was a main guy.
Yeah, when you consider Darwin, Bacon, Locke, Smith, Hobbes, Mill, Bentham, Newton, Cromwell, MI6, Russell, the House of Windsor, Balfour, Rhodes, Crowley, and so on, there’s a case to be made that the British impact on the world has been equally deleterious to that of the Jews (their allies). Of course, the Jews are far more nefarious if measured by demographic proportion.
ahh, yes, ye ole “this only happened because these other people wanted it” trope. like the “Wilson founded Czechoslovakia” trope, ignoring the basic desires of the main group(s) involved. consider that just because a group, or person, may support something, for whatever reason, doesn’t mean that this is why that thing actually happened.
the Holy Roman Empire did not own the Czech lands, Czechs were fully independent within the HRE (as the saying goes: neither holy, nor Roman, nor an empire) and actually were the most independent of its constituents. the Czechs were not ruled by Germans until the Thirty Years’ War, which was a barbaric period that started with an attempt to suppress the Czechs, and a genocide of Czechs occurred leading to the majority German population of so-called Sudetenland.
Bohemia was a united kingdom for over a millennium – just by the official history, nevermind the hidden. there was no reason to divide it because one group had majority in one part, especially since large populations of other people lived in those parts (yes, Czechs did live in the so-called Sudetenland, even deep within it). Germans had no interest surrendering land where they were a minority, so why support hypocrisy?
is that why Benes refused Stalin’s support?
This is the part that most Libertarians cannot fathom, because of ideology: The simple fact is that any people which is defined rightly as being greedy and acquisitive is also prone to being bribed. If your group mortality is based on any form of ‘might makes right,’ your group morality is based on amoral gain at the expense of others. If you see acquisition and wealth taking as inherently your right, then your morality always is essentially imperialistic and violent, barbarous. And you will be more than open to both making and receiving bribes.
Libertarian ideology is a Jewish thought construct.
The “Austrians” when they came to America were even housed and given succor by usury recycled through finance capital (private banks), especially Rockefeller.
Plato talked about greed and acquisitive behavior as “Pleonexia.” Libertarians euphemize the every-man as some sort of hero, when the population actually consists of all kinds of rubes, sociopaths, psychopaths, etc.
Only government can be evil, and this then gives our (((friends))) room to maneuver and ply their usury game.
My opinion, for what it’s worth, is that Stalin was a “missionary Communist”. Another possible reason is that extending Russia to the Atlantic shores of Europe would safeguard that flank of Russia forever.
Whatever his motives, he had certainly turned Russia into an armed camp.
Bear with me if I shift from national policy, to the level of individuals. 16 million Americans served during WWII. (3/4 of them overseas). Virtually every one of those 16 million (who survived) had his life horribly upended, totally unnecessarily. (Including my father, and two uncles.) If you have never seen “The Best Years of Our Lives,” you should view it. Many critics consider it the best film ever produced.
Yes. It’s particularly frightful that holocaust denial is jailable in Germany. And can Germans name baby boys Adolf? And can Jews name baby boys Joshua? The latter really genocidal so the Jews boast about him, even sing about him, and “Josh” seems a common name among them, but Hitler definitely not genocidal.
It’s not just bullshit, it’s blood libel.
You cannot accuse a people of mass murder and get away with it. There are three necessary things for a murder:
1) A motive
2) A murder weapon
3) A body
1)The Jews were only 1% of the population, but they did conspire along with their cousins in the finance center to buy up 1/3 of Germany. In addition the Jews were instrumental in WW1, which the Germans called a “stabbing in the back.” Jews were also instrumental in the hyperinflation, which then caused mass starvation. The hyperinflation was a ‘bear raid” shorting attack similar to how George Soros operates today. The Reichsbank had been privatized under the Dawes plan (an American).
So, we can say there was motive, to kill the Jews. Any rational population would be pissed off at being dispossessed from the lands of their fathers.
2) A murder weapon. So far there is masturbating machines, and now the “gas trucks” but the big one is the holocaust murdering gas chambers.
I always challenge any Jew to come up with a single picture of an industrial scale murdering gas chamber. I would also like to see some sort of engineering plans. Some diary entries would be nice, since people of that era kept diaries.
But, Zip Nada Zilch. There are no photos. Silence -Crickets. Or, no evidence since it was bombed.
3) The bodies? Well they were buried alive, or cremated, so no evidence. Quick lets publish some pictures of starved bodies due to American bombing.
The greatest generation burned Germans alive in firebombing campaigns. At end of war they flew around in their P51 mustangs strafing everything that moved. The rail roads were bombed to smithereens. The German skies blackened with bombers, as American industrial capacity output bombers faster than they could train pilots to fly them.
I have an uncle who walked across Germany (he is still alive) and helped liberate the camps. It is all I can do to get him to talk about the subject, he mostly just gets mad when I bring up the Jews. There is a lot of guilt in their head, which is why they won’t talk about it. I don’t need to go into all of it here, lets just say that I know things from first hand witness who has to be pushed to talk to a relative (me), who means him no harm.
We Americans killed a lot of the Jews, and the Jews themselves are pushing blood libel accusations against the Germans.
The Jews are pretty disgusting in this regard; it is not honorable to push guilt narratives and blood libel accusations.
Where are the damn pictures? Prove your case Jews, or shut up. I happen to know almost firsthand that you are liars.
Yes, Germany’s acquiescence is quite a mystery. Some would point to US bases and say they are occupied. But at this time, if Germany refused to renew leases, would America really be able to garner the political support to use military force to keep the bases?
Is it as simple as German politicians and political parties simply bribed or blackmailed?
Do they really see Russia in its weakend state a threat to Europe?
Are they so ideologically aligned with America, liberalism, rules-based democracy that they sacrifice their own interests?
What about trade incentives? If so, can’t China pry them away by offering a better deal?
This came (if it came) 1400 years after the founding of the place that was first a fishing village and 800 years after the beginning of the arrival of the Germans. Spandau, Kopenick and other parts of the city are Serbian names. Prussians spoke Serbian until almost 200 or so years ago when it was forbidden by law. For hundreds of years, the genocide of indigenous Serbs took place in today’s Germany, forced assimilation, prohibition of using the language, even wearing shoes, and marriages, etc.
Nevertheless, the significant Serbian population somehow survived until WW2 when it was decimated so that there are now about 60 thousand of them. Even the House of Hohenzollern (and Mecklenburg as well) is of Serbian origin (just like Empress Catherine, Martin Luther and Leibniz); Queen Victoria officially declared the name of the English royal house by taking Albert’s surname, but since it was ‘bizarre’ (i.e., Serbian) it was never used and instead became the House of Windsor.
Btw, about Churchill…
Tavistock was working even before it was officially founded. Churchill attended their training. His mother’s father was the director of Rothschild’s daughter company who had a luxurious house on Fifth Avenue where there was a cologne fountain in the lobby. He sent his two daughters to England to marry as best they could. Churchill’s mother fell in love with King Edward and was married to Randolph Churchill.
She cheated on him with the king Edward while her husband also chased whores and got infected. The king sent him to be a governor in Ireland. Churchill’s mother boasted that she had slept with 260 men. The future Serbian king Milan, who studied in Paris, slept with both, her and her sister. He sent letters to her sister inviting her to marry him.
Churchill was a correspondent from Africa on the Boer Wars, but he was never there and reported from Rhodesia where he was with his lover because he was homosexual. Made up that he was kidnapped by the Boers and escaped from captivity and returned to England a great hero. Churchill proposed to establish the first concentration camps in South Africa where English committed a genocide because gold was found on the territory of the Boers.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3101024/Was-Winston-Churchill-lovechild-King-Serbia-Book-makes-extraordinary-claims-British-hero-s-mother-secret-relationship-Balkan-prince.html
The great irony about Churchill was that he wanted to preserve the British empire and keep Britain a white country. Yet he zealously supported two needless wars with Germany that prevented both of his goals from being realized.
Why do you believe that?
Just reading links on UR I am left with little doubt that the not novice g East was entirely related to Gorbache’s fear of a revived German threat and nothing to do with anything beyond East Germany East of which the Warsaw Pact still existed.
The similarity of the circumstances of both those conflicts have uncanny parallels. That is what Mr. Unz is referring to in his article.
There’s always that moment, in every Ron Unz article or interview, when Ron hilariously jumps the shark, after a long and steady buildup. This one was a real howler: “rather arrogantly refused any border negotiations…”
All of Ron’s articles are very funny, if you read them right.
Sure, I’m aware of those two books. But Poliakov was a longtime Jewish activist and Reitlinger, who I think was also Jewish, was an art historian, so neither of them were the sort of mainstream figures I’m describing.
Just before that, Paul Rassinier, a French socialist who served in various concentration camps, published the first major Holocaust Denial books, though it was some years before they were available in English. I think a Jewish activist named Berg published several Holocaust Denial works also around the same time, based upon his interviews with many Jews around Europe.
But I don’t think that any of these works on either side got almost any mainstream media coverage during this period.
That’s exactly the sort of total nonsense for which you’ve become notorious on this website.
Zelikow’s book seemed very solid and was based upon years of archival research. The story he told was reasonably positive to Imperial Germany and extremely negative to Britain and the US, and I just can’t see why making the British and American governments of 100 years ago look bad would be part of some sinister plot to promote our present-day conflict with Putin’s Russia.
The bottom line is that Zelikow’s work is the first and only book in the English language covering this topic, he’s a reputable academic figure, his text seems quite solid, and it received favorable reviews. So any reasonable person would treat it as authoritative unless there’s some strong argument on the other side. And only a dishonest propagandist such as yourself would consider a couple of paragraphs buried from some anti-German history book published decades ago as falling into that category and refuting such a solidly-researched book.
Furthermore, as I mentioned in my own article, Zelikow’s excellent research merely confirmed what I already knew from reading the contemporaneous 1916 media coverage and Lothrop Stoddard’s excellent 1917 volume.
Something different would’ve happened in 1939. The American people won’t fight for the American Zionist empire as we get no benefit from it. Young men are constantly berated, belittled and looked down upon. There is no motive for them to fight for a system that does nothing for them. As a US citizen I’d rather fight for Russia in that conflict. But I’m biased and spent roughly 8+ years living in Russia. If American troops go against Russia they’ll get spanked so fast it’ll be effing hilarious. With a real historical context comparing Putin to Hitler seems more and more like a compliment surprisingly. Hopefully the cabal gets their asses handed to them this time. Putin is leading the charge. That dude is fighting one big fight. I wish him the best of luck.
Anybody who says the Russians would have agreed to any of the things they agreed to if they would have known the US would turn Ukraine into a Banderist state and start a proxy war with Russia by means of terrorizing the Russian speaking population along old WWII battle grounds is a liar. There would have been no pull back from the Iron Curtain or dissolution of the Soviet Union. We’d still have Leftist kikes in this country carrying water for the Soviet Union like they did over four decades of the Cold War!
If BS were snowflakes, the ‘Holocaust’ would be a blizzard.
As I mentioned upthread, those two books were known to me, but neither really fell into what I was calling “mainstream coverage.” And since the US government had publicly promoted the Holocaust in 1946 and never officially retracted those claims, I think the issue fell into half-way zone for the next 15 years, with some people still believing it but many not.
Raul Hilberg is the academic father of Holocaust Studies and I think the story of what inspired him to focus on the topic probably gives a flavor of this situation:
https://www.unz.com/runz/american-pravda-holocaust-denial/#the-rediscovery-of-the-holocaust
So Hilberg’s post-WWII German-Jewish professor didn’t explicitly deny the Holocaust, but it seems clear that he was very skeptical of its reality. My strong suspicion is that Rosenberg’s views were very similar to those of most mainstream American historians and journalists during this period, explaining why the ADL and other Jewish activist groups never challenged Beaty’s 1951 bestseller for ridiculing the Holocaust as debunked wartime propaganda.
Look, David Irving is probably the best WWII historian, extremely careful in his use of source material, and his analysis of the circumstances of the Kristallnacht riots in his Hitler and Goebbels books seemed very solid and persuasive to me. Perhaps he’s wrong in that particular case, but I’d certainly go with his account over that of some random German writer, about whom I know nothing.
While I suppose it’s possible that Jewish groups somehow orchestrated the anti-Jewish attacks across all of Nazi Germany, that seems exactly like the sort of thing that agitated conspiracy-activists would tend to believe without a shred of solid evidence.
The schematic for the Auschwitz gas chambers was published by prominent hoax historians, R Van Pelt and A Dwork in “Auschwitz, 1270 to the present’ ….
More on these real ‘gas chambers’, aka fumigation rooms, here …
https://web.archive.org/web/20221101074132/https://www.holohoax101.org/
There not only the info that we don’t have, there is the info that we do have, like death certificates for the prisoners that died at Auschwitz and monthly summaries known as Death Books, captured by the Soviets but hidden for 50 years.
I.e., we know exactly what when on in the camps, yet the hoax is not affected, in govt, press, or academia. It would be unbelievable if it were not happening.
Of course none of that is important to Unz, he only wants to know what the academics were saying in 1950-60 …. that’s the real pressing issue, but, who the hell cares besides Unz.
The Good War….by Studs Terkel…..a great read….also Hard Times….. about the depression
A rigged poll in the UK recently declared that the warmongering villain Churchill was the Greatest British Man To Ever Live.
Wow. That’s quite some assertion.
The West never can face itself in the mirror regarding ” World War 2 “.
I’ll just add one more personal observation about SIR Winston Churchill, if you please.
He just looks like a total creep.
Ron Unz is the perfect illustration of the principle that reading a lot does not buy either knowledge or brains. Consider this, right at the beginning:
It may be breaking news to Unz, but
1. Germany was not “doing very well” until it made its peace proposals in 1916: it had lost the Battle Of The Marne and with it the chance of knocking France out of the war. It had only won the Battle Of Tannenberg owing to the incompetence of Tsarist Court favourite generals Rennenkampf and Samsonov [German officer Hoffmann, who was a deputy to Ludendorff, made the point that Rennenkampf need only have “closed with (the Germans) and he would have won”]. It had had to rush forces to Austria and the Ottoman Empire to stop them from being knocked out by Russia and the Western Allies/ANZAC respectively. All its overseas colonies were gone, with only Paul von Lettow-Vorbeck holding out in German East Africa. It had lost the months long Battle Of Verdun and was on the defensive everywhere along the Western Front. It made its peace proposals because it was stuck fast with no way to win.
2. Germany was militarily in collapse by mid 1918 after Ludendorff’s Spring Offensive petered out. Ludendorff himself told the Kaiser that the war was lost, just as von Moltke the Younger had told the Kaiser that the war was lost after the Marne in 1914. By late 1918 mobile warfare was fully restored, masses of French light tanks had taken the initiative, the Germans were falling back in the West, the Ottomans were crumbling before Allenby’s Offensive, the Italians had crushed the Austro-Hungarian Empire and it was disintegrating in real time, Bulgaria was suing for peace, and the German navy was in mutiny.
3. Why on earth would Germany have given up its “powerful” navy (which had been confined to port some 1917, except for U Boats, and was in mutiny) if it had thought it would secure a just and equitable peace?
4. The blockade against Germany began in 1914 and continued through the war. Anyone who knows a thing about the history of WWI knows the average German lost 15-20% body weight during the war years from reduced nutrition. Blockade runners trying to break the blockade were regularly intercepted by British “blockade squadron” cruisers in the North Sea, and included one civilian crewed submarine that made multiple trade voyages to America before Woodrow Wilson manufactured consent to enter the war. The blockade merely continued until the Weimar Republic signed Versailles. It did not begin after the war.
With so much utter drivel merely at the start of the article, before even getting to Hitler, there’s no point in reading further.
I’m not disagreeing with you, but high-I.Q. people can also be crazy and delusional. I hear in-breeding contributes to that.
The dismissal of A.J.P. Taylor from his Oxford Lecturer position in 1964 was one of the low points
in British academic history, a purely political decision to punish him for asserting that Germany and Hitler were not solely responsible for causing WW II. The British elites, particularly the Jews, were deeply offended that their preeminent historian had failed to conform to the official propaganda line
when he authored “The Origins Of WW II.”
The irony was that Taylor was anything but an admirer of Hitler or Germany, and considered Hitler
to be a rank opportunist. Taylor had been sharply critical of efforts to “appease” Hitler prior to the War, but as he delved into the archives he realized that Germany’s adversaries were also culpable
and the Jewish victim narrative was questionable, as later confirmed in more detail by David Irving and David Hoggan.
If there wasn’t so much cellphone footage of January 6th proving otherwise, we would be led to believe the Capitol Police put down a real planned insurrection and attack on congress instead of a farcial provocateur-provoked crossing of waist-high metal bike-rack-barriers and the walking-through opened-from-the-inside magnetic doors. Cellphones captured the masked-up bullhorn-yelling “scaffold commander” (almost certainly lefty political commentator John Nichols according to J D Rucker, who has a nice article about that), we have plenty of cellphone footage of Ray Epps on the ground exhorting others to enter the capital building the night before and the day of. Neither of these 2 men were arrested. The guy who rolled up the temporary fencing in front of the capital lawn was never arrested either. We have him on cellphone video.
Can you imagine how aggressive the media narrative would be if they didn’t have to worry about pesky cellphone videos? When the Ferguson, Missouri trial of police officer Darrel Wilson was due, the Justice Department of Attorney General Eric Holder had the FDA declare a no-fly zone over Ferguson and declared drones illegal to fly over the suburban city. They didn’t want the arsonists caught on camera. Lefties now claim police body cams somehow infringe on down market communities’ rights. They want to hide truths so they can lie about police brutality, obviously.
It’s too bad there weren’t cellphone cameras in the 1940s. We would be harder to lie to about that decade if there had been.
Germany’s original borders were those pre-1938. Look on any map in last 1000 years. The borders of Bohemia and Moravia almost never changed.
The Serbs also created Wakanda! The Negroes then stole it from Serbia too. For thousands of years every country and ethnic group has been waging war on Serbians for no reason. Oy vey. Anti-Semitism is nothing compared to Anti-Serbianism.
It will take me a long time to read through all of this, but one thing caught my attention. That was the implication that the US only started taking part in the war at DDay. The writer surely did not intend to imply that. The US joined in in December 1941. US land forces started operations (with impressive incompetence) against Germany in December 1942. This was long before DDay.
Great essay, Ron.
Upon reading your reply, and checking Zelikow’s background, I had second thoughts about my previous comment. It seems McNally was overstating Zelikow’s machiavellianism. It appears that Zelikow might be categorized as neocon-light at most, and the following passage in Wikipedia especially drew my attention:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philip_D._Zelikow
Come on now, Irving is not even close to the best WW2 historian out there.
He has done invaluable research for the field, but that is not the same thing. He is biased, pre conceived and uncritical in the use of sources. His thesis that the holohoax happened but Hitler didn’t know about it is childish, contradictory and has brought him a lot of grief in his professional life. Listening to Irving talk about WW2 is like a guy in the interrogation booth trying to craft a story that does not line up with the evidence. He thought he could have his cake and eat it too. The Jews were not impressed and they made him pay for it.
It’s the same thing with the Kristallnacht. Irving can’t have Hitler being responsible, so he tries to put all the blame on Goebbels. This idea might work on an unsuspecting public which have been conditioned to view the leadership of Germany as a cadre of unhinged madmen, but to a real historian it should be absolutely untenable.
Goebbels was an extremely intelligent and talented man. He prided himself on the Prussian order he imposed on his Gau in Berlin. He was acutely aware of the importance of propaganda when it came to public perception. To suggest that he organized such a riot, even going against the wishes of Adolf Hitler, is a mad thesis in the face of all the evidence to the contrary. The only thing supporting it is the false perception of Goebbels as a madman, and some questionable diary entries coming from a Soviet Archive (ie. likely faked).
Ingrid Weckert’s conclusions are far more cogent and in line with the available facts. Anyone who has read both books would not be in any doubt as to which is more trustworthy.
The Jew supremacists shut down the fake Irish sockpuppets because the goyim know. Now they have six million fake Greek sockpuppets like Alexandros to Jewsplain us how WWII is all about them.
yeah, I don’t think so. Do your own homework.
either way, think it’s incredibly disingenuous and intellectually dishonest to suggest that if, for example, there were a one-day moratorium on any consequences for killing jews, like a one-day open hunting season where you could kill as many jews as you wanted with zero repercussions, that a good percentage of posters on TUR wouldn’t pack their pickup trucks full of guns and ammo and have themselves a good-ol’ day of jew-hunting.
ironically enough, the jews they would most likely target would be the ones easiest to identify–the hasids.
the irony is that the hasids are anti-trans, anti-LGBT, anti-abortion, extremely conservative–both culturally and politically–and as far as I can tell, don’t like black people.
which, aside from the funny clothing and customs, makes their values perfectly aligned with the white nationalists.
“…While I suppose it’s possible that Jewish groups somehow orchestrated the anti-Jewish attacks across all of Nazi Germany, that seems exactly like the sort of thing that agitated conspiracy-activists would tend to believe without a shred of solid evidence…”
Indeed, the idea that “the Jews orchestrated Kristallnacht” has been debunked here:
https://www.hdot.org/debunking-denial/
Chapters : Introduction: Kristallnacht, Kristallnacht: Hitler’s Authorization, Kristallnacht: Hitler Did Not Try to Stop it, Kristallnacht: No Jewish Conspiracy, Kristallnacht: the Fate of Perpetrators, Kristallnacht: Damages and Death.
A pity for Carolyn Yeager e tutti quanti.
I agree, You said all the essentials in a nutshell
It’s great that we can freely discuss these things here and try to get the world on a better track.
jewish PsyOp Reichskristallnacht By Ingrid Weckert
Perfidious England and her Jewish Pals orchestrated Kristalnacht, just like they did Gleiwitz. It fits the same 2000 year old biblical pattern in every way. The Jew cries out in pain as he strikes you.
Stalin was a nationalist. Of course he had to deal with the circumstances as he found them. He most certainly understood that the West wanted to transfer their entire bag of methodologies into the USSR. He was and is still demonized. But more because he was far more clever than he was made to appear. He anticipated that the West would move on Russia. …Which of course meant Jews in whatever guise they wore.
He well understood the overall situation. Or else why did he remove the entire manufacturing capacity east of the Urals anticipating the capacity would be vulnerable to any incursions from the west no matter how that might happen. That manufacturing capacity was able to operate without threat. And of course it operated day and night churning out tanks, guns, and munitions.
Russians have no interest in being conquered by the west. Their methods are essentially defensive. Of course after WW II Stalin kept the west at bay by extending Russian territorial control — the perimeter holdings comprised a protective curtain against the Jewish controlled West.
The Jews run a system constantly in need of further expansion. As Putin pointed out the Russian people have had plenty of evidence of Russia being a prize the Jews cannot resist. The Russians resisted and broke Napoleon. They resisted the Bolsheviks and purged them in the late 1930s. They resisted the Germans in the 1940s. They purged the oligarchs in the 1990s and now in 2023 Putin is again armouring Russia against yet another attempt to bring Russia into the Western orbit of the Rules Based Order. The Rules Based Order is based on a never resting vision of Global domination.
The “world” in the Jewish conception is one where they would control the entire ball of wax. But thankfully the Russians, Chinese, and no doubt most thinking people prefer the emerging characterization of the “world” being multi polar instead.
Nationalism is not in the Globalists’ interest — nationalism having been intentionally denigrated as the cause of WW II. When in fact it was, even in those years, the Globalist impulse which was the cause of that global conflagration. Wherever the Jews get hold of the levers of power they subvert the national interest of its citizens — while using the force of the arms they hijack from those citizens — to project their banking oligarchy outward — manifesting as Globalism.
At the time of the early Cold War, the emphasis would have been on bringing West Germany into the fold of NATO. Any historian of modern Germany with a prominent place at Harvard or wherever would have been more concerned with writing things that promote the sense of Germans as good allies, not harping on atrocity stories from the recent war. Even major Jewish leaders such as Rabbi Stephen Wise or Chaim Weizmann would have realized after 1945 that shifting emphasis in the coming years was a smart idea.
Even so, Gerald Reitlinger and Leon Poliakov did produce books at that time. Whether or not one finds their claims convincing, the point is that there is no reason to expect that Cold War academia should have wanted to push the matter any further at the time. What was more the rage at the time was studying how Germany and Japan could be made into useful allies, not arguing about atrocities from the last war. By the 1970s the ‘economic miracle’ of postwar West Germany was so well known that these considerations no longer applied.
fun exercise — (in intellectual honesty 🤪 )
Match up States with largest pickup truck ownership
with
States with most Jews.
(Lucky thing Arabs invented Zero so the number of pick ups in NYC where most Hasids live *aside from Kryas Joes –can be tabulated)
The facts, as David Irving describes, is that Goebbels egged on the SA in a way which bypassed their traditional command structure. Then the whole incident was used to discredit the SA and grant enhanced authority to Himmler. Weckert’s really silly claim is that supposedly a significant underground SPECOP was carried out by hidden Jewish organization all across Germany, and Hitler responded by promoting Himmler. That makes no sense at all. If such a failure of internal security had occurred, then Himmler would have been replaced (and possibly sent to Dachau) while the whole SS and Gestapo would have been shaken up. It was obvious that Hitler was not perturbed by any purported security failure, so we can discount the whole idea that undercover Zionist agents played any role in Crystal Night. What it did accomplish was to discredit the SA at a time when they seemed to be coming back, and instead strengthened the SS. That’s the logical place to look for an explanation.
Ron Unz is doing everything he can to bring the truth, as closely as it can be ascertained, to as wide an audience as possible, using as many credible (and incredible) historical sources as he has examined (which is more than most of us) in order to do so.
And you have a problem with him asking for evidence that the alleged extermination of European jews was considered anything other than wartime propaganda in those early years following the war, why?
Right now, it appears that the amorphous “masses” are being lied into yet another disastrous war by the leaders of the west and their mockingbird media. If by Ron and others sounding the alarm, maybe, just maybe, enough people will hear the truth before it’s too late, and war will be averted as outraged people demand answers.
So rather than nit-picking and fault finding, how about you express a little gratitude instead. – The same goes for the Yeager woman.
Regards,
Kali.
> the details Ingrid Weckert adds to information about the events of Nov 7 – 10 seem evidence-based, ingenuous, and persuasive.
The only persuasive argument Weckert is able to make is that there was likely an unstated political motive behind the events of Crystal Night, rather than just the matter of general riots. As I’ve said, the most logical political motive, based on cui bono, is that Goebbels was being manipulated by Hitler and Himmler to discredit the SA, who were trying to revive their influence since Hitler had moved against the army. Weckert does not at all seriously address the implications of the kind of security failure which her thesis implies, a failure which would have been the fault of Himmler if her thesis were true. The fact that Himmler so greatly rewarded by Hitler after Crystal Night is a clear sign that no security failure was suspected to have occurred.
You make an excellent point.
Fast forward to the 2020 “summer of love” riots.
The perpetrators were the same people who had an agenda and controlled the situation (the powers that be).
These “riots” are a parallel to the Kristallnacht jewish-engineered “riots” in Germany.
Regards,
It’s hard to visualize such a thing when about 75% of the Germans (or whoever is living in Germany these days) are aggressively anti-patriotic to the point of advocating for the disappearance of the Germans. It says something strange when the Greens are the most pro-war party in Germany. What is the role of Germany in all this when Germany is militarily toothless and is in the process of deindustrializing?
> Czech president Hache travelled to Berlin to ask the German government to protect his country against Soviet invasion.
What a ridiculous hoax.
—–
At noon on 14 March, Keitel reported to Hitler that the Wehrmacht was poised on the Czech frontier, and could invade – as ordered – at 6 A.M. Hundreds of Luftwaffe bombers were standing by. To throttle, if not entirely silence, foreign criticism Hitler informed Prague that it would be to their “great advantage” if Dr. Hacha, despite age and infirmity, would travel to Berlin that very day to meet him. At 2:15 P.M. the German legation in Prague reported that Hacha would come to Berlin by train that evening – his heart would not stand the strain of flying. Hitler confidently instructed Keitel to issue orders to the army to invade at 6 A.M., whatever the outcome of the talk with Hacha. Keitel was to return to the Chancellery building at 9 P.M.
—–
— David Irving, The War Path, p. 187, 2013 edition.
There was nothing about fears of an alleged Soviet invasion involved in this.
Source: https://www.hdot.org/debunking-denial/kn2-hitlers-authorization/
But of course, now you will claim that the Jews wrote Goebbels’ diary…
Look, you’re just a dishonest shill…
You haven’t explained the huge national 1951 bestseller by Prof. John Beaty, who’d been a senior figure in wartime Military Intelligence, and denounced the Holocaust as a debunked wartime propaganda-hoax in his book, which was publicly endorsed by a long list of top American generals.
Since Beaty was a rightwinger, very critical of Jewish groups, he was ferociously attacked by the ADL and other Jewish activist organizations, which denounced him as deranged, but they never challenged his explicit Holocaust Denial. How does that make any sense?
Once his book became so enormously popular, it drew a couple of harshly negative academic reviews that strongly focused all his alleged factual errors, some of which were indeed errors. But those reviews also never challenged his Holocaust Denial.
https://www.jstor.org/action/doBasicSearch?Query=ti%3A%22The%20Iron%20Curtain%20Over%20America%22
What possible explanation is there, other than that few mainstream people believed in the reality of the Holocaust during the early 1950s?
Thanks Ron, very interesting.
I hope that we all note that many of the courageous truth researchers/tellers today are, like Mr Unz, themselves Jewish. Mr Unz, do you personally fear that, when the shit hits the fan, the masses will generalize and not distinguish good from evil Jews?
Separately, isn’t it interesting that, if the research RFK cited is correct, Covid tended to spare east Asians, Jews, and Finns. Finns have the highest IQ in Europe and, as we know, Asians and Ashkenazi Jews have high average IQ. Could IQ be a marker for a targeted virus?
If anything, your comment just highlights why Zelikow would wish to encourage a kinder, gentler image of Ludendorff, Hindenburg and Kaiser Wilhelm II. As you say, it’s a problem when the Greens are the most pro-war party out there.
Thanks Saggy. This is a real problem that we have that well-meaning but basically cowardly and/or under-educated ‘revisionist’ types who comment here do not want to acknowledge. Don’t turn our people’s salvation or our truth over to the care of Jews! And just say no to bullshit. Don’t talk nicey-nice to it, or try to persuade. Facts are facts, aren’t they? Evidence is evidence, although Jews and other lefties have been able to persuade many of us that that is not always so.
These people don’t want to be on the wrong side of what is a fun activity for them. Entertainment trumps everything else! Entertainment or bust! Isn’t that the secret Jewish weapon? “Let us entertain you.”
There isn’t anything substantive about Beaty’s book. It’s no surprise that Arthur Butz made a brief mention of it and then went to focus more on Reitlinger and Hilberg as authors of importance. Beaty goes off about the Khazar hypothesis. Whatever one’s opinion on that issue of Khazars and Jews, it has no real pertinence to the issue of what actually happened in camps located in the east of Europe during 1942-4. No serious academic would have taken Beaty seriously one way or another. Saying that it was a best-seller is meaningless. Lots of stupid books have been best-sellers, and that will remain true in the future. From the point of view of establishment academia at that time, the important issue would simply have been that of promoting West Germany as a dependable Cold War ally and leaving other issues for a later time. This would also have been fully accepted by Jewish organizations of the time.
“Look, you’re just a dishonest shill…”
What an asshole
Or rewind back to the Russian or even the French Revolution.
One fascinating extract from that Weckert essay concerns Moro Giafferi, a Jewish Lawyer:
After Hitler shut down the Weimar bar mitzvah, Jew and Jewish lawyers working for a Jewish organization called LICA started paying for fancy Jewish lawyers to represent Jewish Assassins. This could come right out of Kinosha where Rittenhaus shot the Jew Grossman who consequently came after him with Jewish Lawyers and Jewish Lawfare.
But it gets better when this power Jew laywer Giafferi (think of Alan Dershowitz) happens to be up to his neck in not only the vom Rath assassination, but the assassination of Gustloff and even the Reichstag fire! Clearly, LICA is the 1938 French equivalent to the ADL or the SPLC. Their sole purpose is to project Jewish power and to protect depraved Jews from meeting Christian Justice. Finally, Both Frankfurter and Grynszpan appear to have survived the “Holocaust” despite being notorious Jews who had assassinated NSDAP officials.
About those Auschwitz Death Books:
Source: https://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.com/2013/08/open-letter-to-nick-kollerstrom-on.html#more
The formula for world peace is to allow large nations to have adequate amounts of weaponry, and to not allow hostile neighbors of those large nations to have too many weapons. Versailles and recent NATO expansion plans violated this.
Linking to Deborah Lipstadt’s page of holocaust hysteria without even a word of actual argument from your own lips (let alone brain) just shows what a empty bag of tepid air you are.
After all these years you’ve been pushing “the Holocaust happened” refrain as an Internet ‘commenter’ on other people’s sites and you don’t even have a single page of your own making. What does that say for your knowledge of the actual happenings? You have none. All you have is unstinting hatred of German National Socialists, for whatever Freudian reason it is.
Poor Franklin is reduced to teaming up with Jews, and the U.S. Special Envoy for Combating Antisemitism, no less. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deborah_Lipstadt Aren’t you a little confused, my boy?
If you want to play white knight you could certainly find someone more worthy of a rescue operation than Patrick McNally.
Here are just a few of the more poignant comments by Ron Unz concerting the troll known as “Patrick McNally” who constantly spams UR threads :
https://www.unz.com/runz/more-falsehoods-of-world-war-ii
https://www.unz.com/runz/why-everything-you-know-about-world-war-ii-is-wrong
I whole heartedly agree with Mr. Unz.
The prime mover for the Jeuropeon Junion was The Coudenhove-Kalergi Plan – The Genocide of the Peoples of Europe
https://expose-news.com/2022/03/19/the-genocide-of-the-peoples-of-europe/
[continued]. Funded by Rothchild and the extended Globalist Jewish Oligarchies. Even back then, the lines between big money fortunes, government intelligence agencies, national leaders was very blurred, making it difficult to discern where one ended and the other began.
Of particular interest is the open announcement of intentions and goals of the constitution of the new pan-Euroism. This reminiscence of the the Jacob Schiff and financiers of the Russian Bolshevik Revolution, initiating an American publicity program to sell “communism” to the American Pimples.
Jews, and their affiliates, associaties, etc., usually (like Barbara Spectre) announce that they are going to take away everything, erase West Civ, and leave the Gentile bare assed naked in the bitter cold, and bent over with their hands tied. And the Goyim does effectively nothing.
As Emslander said on here recently, the real problem is not the Jews el al. Inc, but the Christian White Western European. I have much more to say, but I choke on my disgust of The West and its inflated sense of self importance, virtue, and noble qualities. Bend over West Poorer, and let Hymie and Schlomo take over.
.
I don’t remember Beaty mentioning the Khazar hypothesis in his book. I believe you are lying here.
1. I re-read the pages in Hitler’s War where Kristallnacht is discussed; found no reference to Goebbel’s romantic entanglements nor any indication that he had fallen precipitously from Hitler’s good graces.
I assume that material is from Irving’s Goebbels book, which, astonishing as it is, is on the shelves of none of the 50+ libraries in my area.
2. USHMM’s version of Kristallnacht events emphasizes that the events of Nov. 7 – 10, 1933 had a direct impact on migration of Jews to USA.
https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/kristallnacht
McNally noted in #195 that Weckert’s version claimed “there was likely an unstated political motive behind the events of Crystal Night, rather than just the matter of general riots.”
I agree.
I made no effort to trace the “Hitler liked Himmler better than Goebbels” plot — had enough of that with kindergarteners. Furthermore, In Breitbart & Lichtman’s FDR and the Jews, pointed mention is made that “NSDAP “quelled physical violence against Jews until Kristallnacht”, so it makes little sense that NSDAP leadership would tolerate “just a riot.”
There had to be a political agenda.
USHMM’s mention of the impact on immigration suggests to me that BOTH SIDES — German leadership and zionist leadership and Europe-based Jewish activists — saw in the simmering turmoil an opportunity for a final push for greater migration of German Jews out of Germany and into Palestine; and to force FDR to admit more German Jews to USA.
The two “adversaries,” NSDAP and zionists, had been working toward the same goal — removing German Jews from Germany — for four or five years, as Black’s Transfer Agreement revealed. These goals were consistent with Louis Brandeis’s Feb. 14, 1933, directive to Rabbi Stephen Wise that “all 587,000 German Jews must leave Germany. No Jew should remain in Germany. Let Germany share the fate of Spain.”
As well, Francis Nicosia’s Zionism and Anti-Semitism in Nazi Germany devotes several pages (137- ) to detailed discussion of the ways zionists operated “under the noses” of Gestapo and in collaboration with German SD [Security Services]; that emigration had been extended to Austrian Jews:
In the same time period, Nicosia noted,
Nor were the British or any other country welcoming European Jews into England.
The Truth About FDR and the Jews, Rafael Medoff quotes FDR’s repeated statements that “a Jews should be scattered thinly among many locations;” and lists the numerous times and ways that FDR resisted, frustrated, and was downright antisemitic in has attitude toward to increasing Jewish migration into USA.
Nevertheless, USHMM reports:
Yet he stuck to the quota system, although
and
In short, the pattern of events suggests to me that Kristallnacht was not a planned event, but that both sides “did not let a crisis go to waste” and, while simultaneously seeking to minimize damage and outrage and and deflect culpability, exploited the events to further their disparate aims.
Don’t forget that Kaiser Wilhelm was Queen Victoria’s grandson.
And that the English royal family as actually German.
There was no intrinsic reason for the English to hate the Germans.
Which didn’t stop Edward VII from scheming to start the war against Germany and beat her down. Under the influence of a group of plotters. Germany, just recently unified, in 1871, was advancing economically and socially (such as Bismarck’s programs to the living standards and public health of all Germans, especially urban workers) of and posing a competitive threat to the British Empire.
This is the view of Docherty and Macgregor (and other historians) as they set forth in great detail in Hidden History: The Secret Origins of the First World War.
Eric Hoffer is essential reading. “The True Believer”, a study of mass movements. His other books are illuminating. His life mirrors mine in some ways.
edit:
This statement is more even-handed than what, on second thought, I think is warranted.
The duplicity surrounding Hershel Grynszpan fits a pattern of provocation that would have predictable results, especially as those “results” were nudged along by activists-on-the-ground. Those provocations were, obviously, planned and carried out by- and for- Jewish interests.
Jews persons-groups set in motion the events that culminated in Kristallnacht.
Isn’t it possible that American officers might have had little to say about crematoria in, say, Auschwitz,
because
(1) it was the Russians who liberated Auschwitz and saw the conditions there firsthand, and
(2) there might have been a motivation to discredit anything the Russians said about the war, or about the Germans, since they—the Russians—were already the new adversary, and
(3) American officers might not have been able to communicate directly with German, Polish, Russian, Gypsy, French, and other prisoners and so might have remained in the dark?
I am curious as to Ron Unz’s take on the information presented in Danuta Czech’s Auschwitz Kalendarium. I know that Unz does not himself speak German, so his ability to check up on source material is limited. However, the Auschwitz Kalendarium, and its documentation, have been translated into English, as Auschwitz Chronicle.
It seems to me highly possible that Jewish factions wildly exaggerated the numbers of Jews burned in the crematoria. IMO delving into this history and trying to figure out just how many died, and how, in KZs located in Germany, France, Poland, Austria, and elsewhere is an absolutely legitimate project for historians. Evidence of the invoices etc. from the Topf company that built the crematoria and evidence from the Chronicle is clear on the existence of selections and crematoria. This evidence needs to be answered. I haven’t read Irving’s books, so I don’t know how he deals with this. I have, however, read the complete Auschwitz Kalendarium.
The narrative of the monster Hitler as being the sole cause of WW2 is ridiculous.
Certainly, Hitler and Germany had national security interests just as Putin and Russia have valid national security interests. However, I also consider somewhat ridiculous Mr. Unz’s statement that Hitler was getting along pretty well with the Jewish German community before 1938. Yes, this was pre-ovens, but not pre-reeducation camps, and other totalitarian policies that especially targeted Jews. A shocking era for assimilated Jewish Germans who realized that they had better flee for their lives, or go underground, while they still could do so.
I didn’t know that that website was of Deborah Lipstadt, who is indeed of somewhat dubious reputation. I found that website on the blogroll of Holocaust Controversies and quoted from it without having read its “about” information.
Yes indeed I believe that essentially the holocaust did happen, no matter how much “embellished” with Jewish exaggerations or even outright lies, no matter how much misused in what Norman Finkelstein calls “the Holocaust Industry” and no matter how much its belief enforced by “anti-Holocaust denial” laws (after all Jews will be Jews).
And I do condemn Hitler for his crimes against the Jews and his even more sinister plans with the Slavic peoples of eastern Europe, no matter how much success he had in the beginning with restoring Germany, and no matter how much guilty the Allies themselves were.
But such an opinion requires a “both-and” way of thinking instead of black-and-white thinking to which you have wedded yourself.
I will conclude with a little task for you to read and then revise (or rather revoke) your Auschwitz: the Undergroud Guided Tour:
https://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.com/2017/05/rebutting-twitter-denial-most-popular.html#auschwitzswimmingpool
If you are honest, you will follow my advice.
You’ve obviously never looked at it. Chapter II: Russia and the Khazars. Chapter III: The Khazars Join the Democratic Party.
> I made no effort to trace the “Hitler liked Himmler better than Goebbels” plot — had enough of that with kindergarteners.
It’s rather that Hitler liked the SS better than the SA. Goebbels was sort of embarrassed by the Crystal Night, but his career did not suffer. However, the SA basically received a 2nd Night of the Long Knives from this. They had attempted to regain influence in 1938 when Hitler moved against the army officers. But they lost out to the SS as a result of the Night of Broken Glass. That was the likely motive for the incident.
> Hitler and Germany had national security interests just as Putin and Russia have valid national security interests.
So did Poland after watching Hitler occupy Czechia. The Poles would have been stupid to place any trust in Hitler with any deal over Danzig after March 15, 1939.
When the suspicious coincidences pile that high and deep, it becomes safew to say your dealing not with coincidences but with one major Cohencidence.
Anyone with a modicum of intelligence would differentiate between the international globalist class who rule Britain, and the British themselves.
Many British are low !Q unthinking yobs, due to the dysgenic effects of the globalists’ wars, and social policy. Many are not, and there is a vibrant and well-informed truth movement.
Ron is downplaying the significance of the hoax, as does every author on Unz.com. For Unz and the rest it’s a historical curiosity, so he focuses on what the mainstream academics were saying in the 1950s. Why not focus on what the mainstream academics are saying now ??? They’re saying the same thing! As we said in the country ‘crooked as a dog’s hind leg’.
Unz is the last stage of Jewish gatekeeping on the hoax. He implies that it could be, and probably is, a hoax, and then goes o to focus on what the mainstream academics had to say about it in the 50s. That is the limit of his interest. Beyond that, it’s no big deal.
Chomsky played the same role vis a vis US militarism. The fiercest critic, but never a peep about the Jews running the show. Chomsky was the frontline defense on the hoax, he said that even discussing it would cause one to lose their humanity.
Unz says, well, it looks like it was a hoax, let’s see what the mainstream academicians have to say. It’s an academic exercise, no big deal. Many people actually believe this. This is the last line of defense.
Unz labels anyone who thinks otherwise a ‘holocaust troll’.
The hoax has turned our world upside down. US society is being wrecked just as Weimar Germany was wrecked. Jeff Sachs accurately says that the neocons now have us on the verge of WW III. And Unz is quibbling about what the ‘mainstream historians’, his would be peers, have to say, that’s all that is of interest to him.
Well, you are honest at least. I’ll give you that. Blast facts and debunked lies, Holocaust is your faith. Nothing can take the Holocaust away from you. Even if all that’s left is just the name…
If you never read anything else, or even if you only read Deborah Lipstadt, a plagiarist and shameless liar, once you had the opportunity to access Ron Unz’ opus on WWII and the Holocaust (and its accompanying bibliography) you might have paused and thought… No, not you. Proud not to see things “in black and white,” says the man tightening the knot of his blindfold… “Follow your advice”?! Pathetic.
How can there have been “Holocaust denial” in the 1950s, a period before there was a “Holocaust,” or the phrase “Holocaust denial” or the use of the word “denail” to negate ideas without meeting the challenge of discussing ?
Such anachronistic language and thinking doesn’t advance the discussion at all but just adds a layer obscurity.
BTW, Beaty isn’t really discussed in this essay. No idea who he was. The name just suddenly pops up out of nowhere.
“What possible explanation is there, other than that few mainstream people believed in the reality of the Holocaust during the early 1950s”
This is also kind of a dumb statement. How many mainstream people “believe in” a thing says nothing much. Most people in the “mainstream public” “believe in” AGW although they know nothing about it. Most people “believe in ” Covid-19 and went and had themselves jabbed with untested synthetic mRNA although they knew nothing about it.
“Believing in” is faith, not knowledge and understanding.
“Unthinking yob” is harsh in my experience.
My guess is that if the UK upper class were to vanish overnight, working class Brits would quite handily build their nation back to the envy of the world in no time.
Or the French. Or American. Working class people in ALL the old Western nations have been classed as deplorables long before the scummy Hillary designated them.
Keep treating them like dogs and they will become wolves. We’re almost there.
What it also achieved was to get the populations of allied nations on board with the anti-Hitler meme, and more accommodating to the idea of yet another bloody war.
So there’s that.
Kali.
There would have been no war if Hitler had simply adhered to the Munich Pact. It probably is true that Czechoslovakia would have dissolved a few years later without Hitler’s intervention. But what he did was press the Hungarians to place demands on the Slovaks, and then press the Slovaks to seek a German protectorate, while he demanded that Hacha submit to occupation. With that, he negated the prospects of any agreement over Danzig that was similar to Munich. The Crystal Night was not what changed Chamberlain’s approach from appeasement to guaranteeing Poland. It was the occupation of Czechia which did that.
All you’re showing is that Unz can never admit he’s wrong and that my assessment of him above is correct.
“–Ron Unz is doing everything he can to bring the truth, as closely as it can be ascertained, to as wide an audience as possible, using as many credible (and incredible) historical sources as he has examined (which is more than most of us) in order to do so.–”
I agree… he’s a real truth seeker and deserves the respect of all of us.
Holocaust is not my “faith”, it is an inescapable fact. Jews were killed by Einsatzgruppen behind the front in Russia. First only partisans, or those suspected of being partisans, then also Jewish women and children, whole Jewish neighborhoods, culminating in the massacre of Babi Yar near Kiev. Jews driven into ghettos died of hunger. Jews forced to labor (“Arbeit Macht Frei”) in work camps died of malnutrition (average survival term two to three months) and Jews unfit for work were gassed on arrival after “selection “. Holocaust “revisionists” maintain that the gassing and cremation of so many bodies was impossible, but they fail to explain what happened to those millions of Jews who disappeared without any trace. If they were kept alive in the camps, why nobody saw them again? There was not even space enough to house them. If they were transferred to “camps in the East¨, nobody has found any trace of those mythical camps.
In a recorded interview with Dutch former SS-man Van Sassen Eichmann himself bragged about his extermination of the Jews:
Source: https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/the-eichmann-tapes
I wonder whether David Irving was acquainted with Oscar Wilde’s doom and the facts that preceded it. Those that do not take Santayana’s famous saying seriously are doomed to be proven wrong, I guess.
This is how Hacha “voluntarily” requested occupation of his country by the Nazis:
Source: Wikipedia, Emil Hacha
So you subscribe to the state religion, “holocaustianity” as an immutable article of faith.
I feel sorry for you, being closed-minded as you are, unable or unwilling to seek and know the “truth” about this non-event in history.
It’s your loss.
For answers to the quetions you pose,
I suggest you read Douglas Reed’s The Controversy of Zion.
It is archived at this website.
Not all Jews have a drive to control the rest of mankind, and think they have literally been Chosen by God to do so. Only certain Jews claim believe the “Chosen” idea to be literally true. This latter group has, over a few thousand years, managed to form “governments” that were able to exert control ver their own ethnic members, in order to keep this idea alive.
It is the poor slob regular Jews who, historically, have had to bear the burden of their rabbis’ ambition and social control. It is they whose lives have been ruled by terror of breaking “God’s laws,’ actually make by tyrannical Jewish men.
It is crucial to understand, also, the difference between the history and belief systems of Sephardic jews and the “Ashkenazim” communities that appeared more or less out of “nowhere” to create populations of Jews in Poland/Lithuania/Russia and later in the Pale of Settlement.
Anyhow, enough said. I think you will find Reed’s book very thought-provoking. Even a red pill!
I am very surprised that Ron Unz has dismissed The Controversy of Zion as the ramblings of someone who was only 14 when WW1 occurred. First of all, this is outright wrong. C’mon, Ron. Reed enlisted in the British army at the outbreak of the Great War. So he experienced the war from the inside.
However, the book is not a memoir; it is a magisterial work of history, buttressed by an enormous volume of reading and research. However, after the war Reed worked his way to become one of the world’s foremost reporters, a kind of British Edward R. Murrow, on the spot in Europe as the head of the Central Europe desk of the Times, in Vienna, during the run-up to WW2 in Europe. So he can add some actual “memoir” aspects to his account of this period. At about this time he published a work, Insanity Fair, about what he was witnessing in various locales in Europe. It was an instant best-seller, on everyone’s lips (but now is really hard to find). His other books were very well received. I think he had left the Time because he thought they were distorting the reporting of actual events in Europe. After the war Reed worked on The Controversy for three years, but it wasn’t published until decades later. He probably feared the backlash for telling it like he saw it, regarding the reality of a secret organization that had lasted for a few thousand years, one based on the most primitive “tribal” laws, yet with a peculiar talent for deceit and psychological manipulation.
I do wish Reed’s other books were available at this website.
Thank you for this correction. I think you were wrong in your previous comment #213 by quoting all those disparate sources and coming to the conclusion you did. These riots were definitely planned in advance by pro-Jewish interests. Germans were the victims, not in any way perpetrators. From my 7-part review of Ingrid Weckert’s book – this is from the last chapter “Cui Bono?”:
Too many. Britain is full of stupider people than most around the world think. I don’t know the reason but I do know it’s true. Just give them a Royal Family to watch and imagine belongs to them, and they’re content.
Thank you Saggy! for coming out with it! The gate-keeper part.
I would add that Unz in all his holocaust articles (in which he keeps repeating the same stuff), never mentions the revisionist classics (the Holocaust Handbook series), and especially stays away from Germar Rudolf and any scientific proofs, or any of the 1970’s heroic German revisionist giants who questioned the gas chambers and paid a large price for it — except for American Arthur Butz or Jewish authors who didn’t. It’s very strange IF one assumes that Unz has a genuine interest in how the Hoax was revealed to the world.
He does like to stick with his own personal experience of “discovery” so that might explain it. Just trying to be fair. But it also fits the pattern of a gate-keeper.
I would like to add that Germar Rudolf is being hunted down again and had to leave his family and go on the run, not expecting to ever return to a private OR public life. THIS is what the Jewish mafia is currently still able to do! Please consider.
Your paranoia and insulting characterization knows no bounds. Clown.
Thanks, I may check it out but I’m not so interested in deconstructing a people. I find it more interesting to view them as a whole. The idea is more of a sociological & economic study on non-territorial peoples. Yuri Slezkine contributed some very interesting ideas but he didn’t focus much on other peoples and compare them. It seems to me that there should be counterpart peoples in other regions such as China, India, and the Middle East. If not, what were the conditions in Europe, that allowed a non-territorial people to thrive? How come a niche existed there and not elsewhere? Should we expect the rise of new non-territorial peoples?
Mr. Mattis is one of the top guns for the Holocaust defense industry. His specialty is aggressive rhetorical attacks and character defamation when his evidence is found lacking.
If he has emerged from the Zionist hyena den, that’s a sure sign that Ron Unz has moved to the top of their concerns. Ron should be VERY vigilant because Mathis specializes in destroying people’s reputations and even their lives. See this dialogue for a good example of his dangerous MO:
https://www.angelfire.com/fl4/fci/andysjew.html
Mr Mathis also enjoys anonymity. Let’s pull back the curtain on him somewhat. He has penetrated a once esteemed Catholic institution to provide cover for his hasbara:
He also claims an affiliation with U Penn as a “medical administrator”:
https://live-sas-www-history.pantheon.sas.upenn.edu/node/13762
[email protected]
https://about.me/aemathisphd
https://www.linkedin.com/in/andrew-e-mathis-3311302
Here are two images of him, one flattering and the other not:
https://media.licdn.com/dms/image/C5603AQGTvIxn4T_rWA/profile-displayphoto-shrink_400_400/0/1516247860472?e=1690416000&v=beta&t=Hb7CJX4y4ac2baFpQvm3jIOA2brVnHOPIKgT9lhljT4
We all should pray for Ron Unz, because Mathis is a dangerous opponent. Ron will need all of his wits to fend off this malevolent detractor.
Libertarianism is just extreme liberalism, which can be more clearly named “individualism.”
In The Republic, Plato describes liberalism extremely well. It fits exactly what we see in the West nowadays. For example, he observes how eventually even children stop respecting their parents and dogs become masters of people. Liberalism and supposed democratic government go together.
In the 1800s, Europe was already transitioning from oligarchic to democratic liberal systems. Fascist movements were not only responses to Communism but also to this transition to Liberalism. Once the fascist movements were destroyed, liberalism was amped up, largely by Jews (e.g. Popper) who saw fascism as a threat.
So Jews didn’t invent liberalism, they’ve just been at the forefront in promotion its most recent incarnation.
” Germans destroyed six million Russians, Poles and Jews…”
There’s that magic number, six million, again… 😀
Hard evidence, please. Not allied or ziofascist agitprop. Fact is, the Germans didn’t genocide anybody. War is war. If a Russian got in the way of a Wehrmacht bullet, so be it. Russkies murdered plenty of Germans. But then, no one ever said that mongol-slavonic race was civilized.
Sounds like Eichmann could have made a good living as a stand up comic.
He’s certainly funnier than Adam Sandler. 😃
I read your essay to this point — then stopped.
Lloyd George had served as legal counsel to Chaim Weizmann and his fellows who targeted British government officials in their determination to find a nation-state to support their zionist project. (Zionist leaders including Herzl had “shopped” the zionist project to the Ottomans, to the Kaiser, and finally to the British.)
For that and other reasons I do not share your conviction that Zelikow’s research on this topic was exhaustive. He had to have known of Weizmann’s involvement in the British war effort, and that his work and influence were significant. In 2010 Simon Winchester’s appearance at the Miami Bookfair was broadcast on C-Span. https://www.c-span.org/video/?296688-6/atlantic
Winchester recounted one version of the tale of how Chaim Weizmann exchanged his “discovery” of how to mass-produce acetone for cordite to advance the British war effort, for the Balfour Declaration and for entry of American forces in the war in Europe.
Here’s what Weizmann wrote in his autobiography, about his activities in 1916. It might explain why Lloyd George “suddenly switched sides:”
The following chapter in Weizmann’s Autobiography, Chapter 15, explores his zionist philosophy and ambitions.
Later chapters in the book report on his contact with Baron Rothschild, and also a situation that Weizmann viewed as comical in which, having been alerted by Louis Brandeis, Weizmann frustrated an attempt by Henry Morgenthau, SR, delegated by Woodrow Wilson, to arrange a “separate peace” with Turkey.
Maybe it’s a California thing, Ron: you appear star-struck by Zelikow.
I chose not to bother going to a library to borrow the book; I think Zelikow’s work (like Edwin Black’s) is a “limited hangout,” an attempt to tilt or even obscure the historical reality.
What more do you want from Ron Unz? He’s written that he thinks most if not all of the claims about the Holocaust are lies. He’s written that Justice was on the side of Hitler and the Germans in world war ii. He’s denounced the corruption of the Allies particularly Winston Churchill. Is that all not a major blow for truth?
The United States was the leader of the Eugenics movement, since the later 1800s. Throughout the 1930s Delegations of Nazis visited the University of Virginia, the intellectual center of that movement. The Germans unfortunately put to death people who were physically or mentally handicapped. All told about 90,000 were given a needle in Germany. Pressure from the Catholic and Lutheran churches in Germany ended the practice in 1941. The Americans were a little more civilized. They just wanted to sterilize Negroes, Jews and Callicacks.
I don’t think Russia had much choice. I’m sure some people were worried about this Ukraine mess from the beginning.
In the US, we still have the same creeps promoting communism, socialism and world government!
Bro, don’t be nervous. I know you can do much better even though you are a panzer brigadier. You forgot to comment on any of my claims, to find what is untrue and to destroy my credibility. Everything I said is the truth that everyone knows or can verify. You did not deny that the Serbs are the natives of modern Germany and that the Germans have been stealing their land for centuries and carrying out genocides. We need to know that in order to know what is happening today. Maybe you can tell us something about German Asian origins and when they became Europeans. At least tell us the meaning of the German name.
Instead, you found an American doctor for whom it is very likely that he, himself, has become a moron because of his stay among the Yanks (or panzers, anyway), although it does not necessarily mean that. Is it true that Serbophobia has existed since the time when the Germans still lived in their Asian homeland and why? Perhaps because they are the natives of Europe and the direct heirs of the oldest European civilization, culture and language. They have been subject to genocides since the arrival of the primitive Yamnaya nomads from Asian steppes 4,800 years ago.
Their language is the basis of Sanskrit and many Euro-Asian languages. As for the Judeans, they found refuge among the Serbs after the Exodus, as evidenced by many Sinai toponyms. The old name of Sinai is Serbal, just like the mountain where Moses allegedly received the 10 commandments from God and Mount Nebo (sky, in Serbian) from where he looked at the promised land and where he died. (at that time, the future Greeks also found refuge with the Serbs, coming to today’s Greece). The Philistines were immigrants from the Balkans at a time when only Serbs lived there (e.g., Goliath and Delilah), which was established a few years ago when King David’s palace was found, which his enemies, the Philistines, gave him as a refuge.
The Serbs helped the Judean returnees from the Babylonian captivity when they were not accepted in Jerusalem (due to alleged overcrowding) but were accepted by the Serbs in Asia Minor. That’s what Netanyahu is talking about bellow. Therefore, the series of genocides (the Germans gave more than their fair share) continues to this day and right now is mostly reflected in the theft and falsification of history, which includes the notorious falsification that the Goths (Dacians) were Germans and not Serbs, and as it is kept silent that they were also Diocletian, Constantine, Justinian.
Next time you can show the book that the first Serbs were aliens, I’m sure there is one. If you have nothing to say, then it is better to cover yourself with your ears and keep quiet for a while.
(first minute only)
The wiki page suggests Zelikow is a true swamp creature and is apparently intelligent. I don’t think I can take anything he writes at face value. The risk of being conned is simply too high.
Zelikow’s comparison of the official US government sanction of torture to internment is very strange. Torture crosses a line of bestiality which is extreme and vastly worse than the internment which occurred in WW2, as bad as that may have been. Torture always happens in war and in my view is a major reason war is to be avoided. Giving official cover for it, especially in a war of empire, is one of the worst things to happen in the USA in the last 30 years. I’m glad that he spoke out against it, but am skeptical that his moral compass is pointing in a good direction.
“Yes indeed I believe that essentially the holocaust did happen, no matter how much “embellished” with Jewish exaggerations or even outright lies, no matter how much misused in what Norman Finkelstein calls “the Holocaust Industry” and no matter how much its belief enforced by “anti-Holocaust denial” laws (after all Jews will be Jews).
And I do condemn Hitler for his crimes against the Jews and his even more sinister plans with the Slavic peoples of eastern Europe, no matter how much success he had in the beginning with restoring Germany, and no matter how much guilty the Allies themselves were.
But such an opinion requires a “both-and” way of thinking ”
++++++++++++++++++++++++++
These are reasonable positions that I agree with.
Labeling the Nazi genocide a Jewish Holocaust was wrong to begin with.
But now, calling the “Holocaust” a hoax is also gedeppert.
Wilful distortions of the events and aftermath of WW2 fuel more distortions of current history, specifically in the Ukraine and Germany.
For these and other reasons we need a fearless, honest ongoing historiographical examination and discussion of the background and actual events of World War 2.
“Stalin was a nationalist.”
https://youtube.com/shorts/GOZ8qiHFA_E?feature=share
Hache’s daughter, who accompanied her father to Berlin, wrote about her experience.
And the Czech citizens appeared happy to see German soldiers in their city. That’s what the newsreel show.
I guess you are interested in the theoretical treatise.
But Reed’s thrust is to show why THIS people/tribe was driven to do what basically no other has been: To ensure that the members of The Chosen did NOT mingle with the other people among or alongside whom they lived, so as eventually return this planet to a state where they are in control. it’s as simple as that. Along the way they (their rabbis and “lawgivers”) have had numerous successes at complicating the lives and destinies of their host states and have maintained their monomaniacal focus through ages. I believe I have written elsewhere at this blog that one could justifiably refer to the First/Second/Third/Fourth/and Fifth Reichs of this project.
So, I think Reed might say: “Look, the reason I wrote this book is because the case of the Jews is sui generis, and now we are seeing the catastrophic results of their multi-thousand-year drive to dissolve other nations while themselves taking the reins of world government.”
That was back in 1956. As he writes in his “Epilogue”:
“In our time, I judge, a barbaric superstition born in antiquity and nurtured through the ages by a semi-secret priesthood, has returned to plague us in the form of a political movement supported by great wealth and power in all great capitals of the world. Through the two methods used, revolution from below and the corruption of governments from above, it has come far towards success in a fantastic ambition of achieving world dominion, using these two instruments to incite nations against each other. . . .
“I have felt, during the labour of preparing this book, that I lived with evil. The forces which have been projected into the 20th Century, as from some dinosauric cavern, are superstitious ones. I have had a constant sense of contact with the minds of men like Ezekiel, who in barbarous times had barbarous thoughts. I had a distinct feeling of re-encounter with such minds in our present time,”
We are much farther along this road now. That is a principal reason for reading this book. And, it is actually well written and a good read. If you like to read history books. It would be a long read on=screen (I prefer to read hard-copy books), but Ron Unz has made the individual chapters available at this site. So, you could easily choose a few of the later chapters to read. Actually, the first chapters are very illuminating in explaining where this madness actually came from.
Here is the link:
https://www.unz.com/book/douglas_reed__the-controversy-of-zion/
Churchill’s successors – Bozo, Truss and Maharishi Snake – seem equally determined to turn Europe into a wasteland uninhabitable for centuries by supplying weapons, men and materiel to a Ukraine waging war on a nuclear armed Russia.
Many thanks again to Mr Unz for his diligence in revealing the truth behind the matrix fantasy.
Deserved.
Apologies.
During 1955-1965, I lived in a very Jewish part of the US. Being of German descent, I was very much interested in the Holocaust (not so then named). I was practically alone (among all my friends, most of whom were Jewish – I was not Jewish) in this interest, but got labeled a Nazi for my most-unseemly interest.
My Jewish friends didn’t buy my Nazi label – it came from my Gentile friends.
Good thing those benevolent Jews and their Allied cohorts had mastered the art of ehanced persuasion (i.e., kidnapping and testicle crushing) or the truth might NEVER have come out.
I mostly agree. I would like to add that it does need to be emphasized that the very limited trashy elements of the German cities deserve immense scorn. If they hadn’t let the provocateurs lead them to needlessly disregard the officially stated government politcy of dealing with the Jewish issue in a LEGAL manner, the sabateurs would have been left isolated and caught.
You obviously haven’t read any of the my articles on the Holocaust, including the ones linked and cited above, since all of them heavily discuss Prof. John Beaty’s extremely important 1951 book and the crucial evidence it provides.
https://www.unz.com/runz/why-everything-you-know-about-world-war-ii-is-wrong/#question-7-the-holocaust
That’s not surprising since you’re obviously just an anti-vaxxer conspiracy-crackpot.
You contribute nothing of value to the discussions on this website and maybe I should just get rid of people like you.
We are very fortunate to have Ron Unz provide us all with free access to now such almost impossible to find writings by such great writers like Arthur Bryant. Writings which now are taboo and smeared. Chapters 3, 4, and 5 of “Unfinished Victory” are quite eye-opening. All should read these chapters while it is still possible. Thanks Ron Unz!
https://www.unz.com/book/arthur_bryant__unfinished-victory/
One long quote from Ch 4:
“For the Marxist reviled the man of faith and ideals as bitterly as he did the financial exploiter. It was his creed that nothing existed in the world but matter and that no motive could animate man but immediate self-interest. The great organised institutions and societies, based on faith and love and maintained by self-sacrifice through which man had raised himself from the primeval slime, were to be ruthlessly destroyed and their adherents liquidated. First they were to be undermined by “criticism repeated again and again until the corrosive ate into the old State so thoroughly that it finally crumbled to pieces Mob violence was to finish the process. The world would then be ready for an international order that admitted of neither separate race nor tradition nor religion, and in which all men would be subordinated as unthinking automatons to a single ruling clique of Marxist intellectuals and bureaucrats.
“For Hitler was acute enough to realise that the Marxists did not stand for the freedom they pretended but for a despotic uniformity, enforced by terror and the annihilation of all who opposed them. In this they differed only in their superior violence from the international financiers and exploiters they professed to supplant. Like Belloc and other earlier modern social philosophers, Hitler perceived the twin roads down which mankind was being herded toward the servile state. First came the economic development which transformed the social structure of the nation and substituted for its old feudal rulers, who at least had a certain sense of responsibility and noblesse oblige, the financier and the middleman who had none. Under the jointstock company system, the search for profits became the sole guiding principle of social life. “The small artisan class slowly disappeared and the factory worker, who took his place, had scarcely any chance to establish an independent existence of his own but soon sank to the proletariat level.” His present and future passed into the sole power of the man of figures who, calling himself his employer or master, acknowledged no responsibility for his moral or physical well-being. The hungry sheep looked up and were not fed.”
Chapter 3 and 4 should be read by all.
Of course there’s absolutely nothing substantive about the Holocaust in Beaty’s 1951 book. All Beaty did was spend a couple of paragraphs ridiculing the Holocaust as dishonest wartime propaganda by Jews and Communists that almost no one still believed. Since almost no one still believed in the Holocaust in 1951, why would he waste any more space on it?
The crucial thing is that Beaty’s book was a huge bestseller, strongly endorsed by many top American generals, and neither the ADL nor any of the many other Jewish activists who attacked him ever challenged his dismissal of the Holocaust.
Exactly. It’s heavily discussed in Irving’s Goebbels book.
As I’ve said before, you’re just an obsessive, elderly crank, so extremely stubborn as to be delusional.
Just a few weeks ago, you attacked me for never discussing Germar Rudolf in my writings so I quoted the paragraphs from my big Holocaust Denial article in which I’d done exactly that. You defended yourself by saying you’d never read my article.
Similarly, you’ve claimed that Butz never used the word “Nazi” in his book when he actually used it a couple of hundred times. You’re simply delusional.
The obvious reason you’re now spending so much time on our website is that almost nobody ever visits yours. Our website certainly isn’t large, but it still gets roughly 200x your traffic.
Maybe you should form an alliance with that “Andrew Mathis” fellow. Almost nobody visits his website either.
At some point, I’m going to get fed up and get rid of people like you.
Thank you, Zachary, for that reminder of the ubiquity of the term “final solution.”
A college boyfriend of mine was actually enamoured of the idea of knowing the German term “die
Endloesung.”
I lived in Germany from ca. 1969 to 1974. I don’t recall hearing much discussion at all of what had happened during WW2. It was not questioned (among young people I hung out with) that the German state was a criminal enterprise at that time and that the Germans were completely responsible for the war, and for what happened to their country afterwards. Others (slightly older people) just didnt talk about it in my presence, at least. I don’t recall anyone talking about “the Holocaust,” even though Dachau and other KZs were well-known sites and even tourist sites of die Endloesung (der Judenfrage).
In fact, I am not sure that “holocaust” is even a German word. One would have to look in an older German-English dictionary. A German site (https://www.dwds.de/wb/Holocaust) says that it is a borrowed word from English and gives a date of 1942. If that date is correct, I doubt this borrowing was in the the war context. Because as of 1942 the Endloesung (Final Solution of the Jewish Question) was just barely getting going. This site also elaborates that the meaning of the original Greek word meant Brandopfer, or burnt offering, of an animal: the WHOLE animal, not just a part of it. This site also offers as German translations Austilgung (extermination); Judenvernichtung (destruction of Jews), Massenvernichtung (mass extermination/destruction), Voelkermord (German for genocide or ethnocide), etc.
The Enclyclopoedia Britannica has this:
“The word Holocaust is derived from the Greek holokauston, a translation of the Hebrew word ʿolah, meaning a burnt sacrifice offered whole to God. This word was chosen, and gained wide usage, because, in the ultimate manifestation of the Nazi killing program—the extermination camps—the bodies of the victims were consumed whole in crematoria or open fires.”
The American Heritage dictionary Usage note:
“it first appeared in Middle English in the 1300s, used in reference to the biblical sacrifice in which a male animal was wholly burnt on the altar in worship of God. ”
I haven’t found a source with a usage note indicating the FIRST usage of Holocaust in the Endloesung context. My personal recollection is that the term first appeared, or became current, in the 1970s, in connection with a TV series. This is confirmed in this Wiki entry:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust_(miniseries)
“The series has been widely credited with bringing the term “Holocaust” into popular usage to describe the extermination of the European Jews.[2][3][4]”
Oddly, most of the cast appear to have been Gentiles. I believe this was a first big role for Meryl Streep. A rundown one the plot shows that it is conceived of as an epic a la War and Peace or Dr. Zhivago, that checks all the boxes for the “mainstream jewish narrative” POV. It is almost funny, actually.
It is quite possible that mainstream American learned its history lesson on “the Holocaust” from this series.
(WW2 and fictionalized Nazism has also been good to Meryl Streep. Her first big role was in Julia (based on a “true” story, with lots of embroidery); her second in Holocaust. Another landmark role for her was that of the distraught Polish woman, Sophie, in Sophie’s Choice. )
As the website grows with larger readership and more commentators, at some point you will probably have to ban some people who contribute nothing but divisiveness and friction and yes. If I had to choose who to ban right now, it would be Patrick McNally and not the old lady. She has an ego built around her long-existing holocaust-denial website and she is pretty fearless for doing that for all these years. Don’t expect her to be a demure feminine lady-like figure at this point. Patrick otoh seems like a real troll or “hasbara”. Just my 2 cents.
Thanks for that feedback. I hope it’s useful. I’m hopeful that the truth will set us free, and the 1st Amendment will continue setting the truth free. We all need to pitch in and do what we can. We have a WWIII to prevent.
Wrong. The first post-war educated Soviet leader Gorbachev changed the Soviet system and let all the satellite countries fall one after another. Another Brezhnev would have ruled the Soviets until now. Soviet were stronger and their power respected more than weaken Russia today. One must remember that Thatcher and Mitterrand opposed Gorbachev/Kohl German unification.
Keep at it, Ron, and don’t be dragged down by the free-riding, backseat writers! You’re one of the best embodyments of the Christian virtue of meekness: contrary to the popular (mis)understanding of it, it is NOTHING like weakness (and those who confuse the two do so at the two do so at their perril); rather it means someone with great strength or in a position of power who has the self-restraint to not abuse it, whether for self-aggrandizement or revenge. A puny, yipping chihuahua is not meek; a large mastiff that sits there calmly amid as pack of yipping chihuahuas that bark and fake lunges at it is. I don’t agree with alot of what you write (I think you dead wrong on Hispanics in the US), but I’ve almost never been more impressed by someone’s combo of great scholarship and humility. Just tune out the madder voices and someday when you finally retire from this you can have the satisfaction of knowing you kept the light of real intellectual inquiry burning and were better than the petty voices that couldn’t resist taking a stab at those who burn it brighter than they could ever hope to.
Based on a Heads Up by “Anon” I delved into your commenting history here at UR.
I found this little love gem by Mathis to McNally:
It is clear why Mathis called Mr. Unz “what an Asshole” when Mr. Unz correctly called McNally “a dishonest shill”. Mr Mathis later says this to a polite commenter: “Because fuck civility”.
Browsing though the comments from Andrew Mathis I also noticed this challenge to Ron Unz:
Okay Mr. Mathis, why don’t you recommend some neutral blog or forum where both you and Mr. Unz are guaranteed freedom of speech without any censorship or moderation. Hell, you can even recommend one that would allow you to use your typical vulgar Jewish vernacular.
My recommendation:
https://dailystormer.in/
Andrew Anglin knows first hand about the malignant effect of Jewish censorship. He would guarantee you and Mr. Unz freedom of speech.
If you don’t find dailystormer acceptable, then please provide us with a list of blogs/forums where there is freedom of speech. Certainly 4chan and Reddit don’t apply since they are so heavily moderated, and their commenting engines don’t compare to UR anyway.
In comments from Mathis there is also a long debate he had with Mr. Weir, who managed to give Mathis a good throbbing. Mathis was snotty, arrogant and condescending throughout the entire discussion. He cannot claim that he was debating Mr. Wear on his own blog.
“was not what changed Chamberlain’s approach from appeasement to guaranteeing Poland…”. That is utter and total rubbish. Chamberlain never changed his approach to appeasement. The Poland guarantee was just a facade. I have been through this several times with you already. Why you still keep on pushing this drivel and British fake history and propaganda? It seems to me that you are unable to change your views even when credible facts are presented to you.This is very disappointing and raises questions to your other replies on this forum. You are just repeating garbage British propaganda.This is shameless. Do you even care for the truth or not?
Apparently you don’t have the time (or knowledge) to list them, either.
Yes. And many high IQ people are simply liars.
The problem is not ‘the English people.’ The problem is WASP culture. It is the great replacement for Christendom, which makes it the primary anti-Christendom. WASP culture murdered the vibrant, joyous, culture that was Catholic Merrie Olde England. Merrie Olde England was flavored mightily at its top by things French, while Wealthy Anglo-Saxon Protestant culture is based on a Judaizing heresy and almost immediately allied with Jewish financiers to be able to wage wars incessantly against non-WASP white Christians. WASP culture is all about building a worldwide empire that is Anglo-Zionism.
Anglo-Zionist Empire requires WASPs as much as it requires Jewish money. WE need, the world needs, the English to reconvert, to go back to the right path: Traditional Latin Mass Catholicism.
Stalin was a Georgian. So if Stalin were a nationalist, he would have been a Georgian nationalist who then wished to lead an empire with a dozen ‘major’ ethnic and linguistic groups, with his ethnicity, Georgian, being rather small and undistinguished.
I wouldn’t be surprised if a few of the fires were insurance frauds, but there may have been a mixed bag of local initiative and some quiet instruction from high cabinet officers.
It does seem that Hitler, apart from creating an atmosphere, didn’t want it to happen.
Ron Unz responded to Patrick McNally* with these words:
“Look, you’re just a dishonest shill…”
To which you quite rightly added ‘What an asshole’, because ‘McNally’ is indeed that also.
(*McNally’s real name is Shlomo Baruch Shlongstein – but he uses an Anglicised handle in UR to deflect attention away from the fact that he has a Talmudic dog in the race).
Mathis, I’ve been following your comments in the UR Holohoax threads, and as you’re likely well aware, you get a hell of a lot wrong (in fact, your output is bordering on diarrhoea).
You do say some reeeeally dumb stuff.
Anyway, it’s good to see you’ve partially redeemed yourself by calling out Shlomo McNally here.
Well done.
Hmm,
Well, the Poles seized a piece of Czechia with alacrity!
While playing the victim.
What is your view of the status if ethnic Germans in Poland?
Were Hitler’s concerns in that department valid?
Ha ha,
I have, actually, read I think all or most of your articles on the Holocaust.
However, many of them appeared years ago, and I didn’t commit them to memory (!).
“That’s not surprising since you’re obviously just an anti-vaxxer conspiracy-crackpot.”
Ha ha. It’s fun to push buttons.
Look, no one who’s done the objective research disputes that the REAL Holocaust occurred.
ie: the Anglo-Zionist empire incendiary bombing of German and Japanese civilians and the dropping of the A-bombs.
But somehow, in this day and age, it may surprise you that there are actually some claiming that there was a systematically planned mass genocide of Jews by the Germans, that there were ‘gas chambers’ that killed Jews with Zyklon B (even though not a smidgen of proof exists of the blueprints for the construction of said gas chambers, nor photos, not a single autopsy of the countless number conducted that proved anyone died from gassing).
I mean, we even KNOW the following:
John Wear’s book is available in HTML format to read for free here in the UR.
I suggest you read it and pass it on to those that have been propagandised into believing that more than a few hundreds thousand Jews died in these work camps**.
(**NOTE: That’s not to imply that the Germans killed these few hundred thousand Jews.
The fact is, the overwhelming bulk of Jews died during the 1942/43 Typhus epidemics and in the last 6 months of the war as the German Logistics/Food transportation network was decimated by Allied bombing/strafing.
As is well documented, German civilians in the cities were themselves starving in the concluding months of the war as food supplies weren’t getting through).
Watch the actual combat footage in this 2 min video (taken from Allied fighter planes that roamed the skies virtually unmolested in the concluding months of the war as they had TOTAL Air Superiority), that depicts strafing of trains, truck convoys and anything that moved in Germany during WWII:
Towards the end of the war, many Allied fighters were coming back to base with most or all of their ammunition not expended, claiming that there were no targets remaining to strafe. ie: every train/every car and truck had already been blown up.
They were then instructed to target farmers on horse drawn transport. (They justified that by saying that horse drawn supplies of food were still getting through to German soldiers).
Don’t believe me ? If so, watch this 46 sec video below:
The depravity of the Anglo Zionist empire knew no bounds. They committed, BY FAR, the most egregious war crimes of WWII.
It was blue sky to second place as far as war crimes were concerned.
*Wear
*thrubbing
Daily Stormer, lol
For those unaware, I’m assuming it’s the same Andrew Mathis associated with the hardcore ‘exterminationists’ at Holocaust Controversies — they’ve engaged in a running battle with CODOH adherents and other revisionists for many years now.
Unz has not at all said he thinks “most if not all” claims about Holocaust are lies. Unz basically says the same thing about the Holo” as David Irving says. Irving bows to the Jews by stating again & again that up to 2.5 million mostly Jews were gassed to death in rooms equipped with carbon monoxide exhaust at three ‘transit camps’ Belzec, Sorbibor and Treblinka. With no evidence!! Or, the 2.5 million was a combination of gas chambers and Einsatzgruppen killings, he’s not particularly clear about it at all. Neither is Ron Unz.
Further, he somewhat exonerates Hitler and blames Himmler and Heydrich instead. So what has changed? It’s all part of portraying “Nazis” (a fictional term) as a special breed of human being. And pointing out the corruption and sins of Churchill, or Roosevelt for that matter, does not change the slimmed reputation of Germany/Germans.
Ron Unz has really done very little except create attention for himself and a blind following of certain sheeple. What does Ron Unz stand for? He’s a classic libertarian, as are many Jews (they say). Do they bring Jews to account for all their crimes throughout the ages? Do they denounce Judaism and end their own affiliation with Jewry? Do they condemn by name any other Jews? No. They continue to benefit from being a Jew due to Jewish money power. While more and more Gentiles fall into place supporting them.
This is what is called “Gatekeeping.” Do you deny it?
Brilliant, Holmes! (And I mean that with sincerity, not sarcasm.)
Methinks that troll doth protest (and curse) too much. He and his kind act like the ex-high priests of a wierd pagan cult which some righteous king finally stopped giving massive, no-questions-asked subsidies to since they couldn’t prove the reality of their god (a la the priests of Bel in the Book of Daniel: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bel_and_the_Dragon ): they’ve gone without serious opposition for so many years that they have no idea what serious and civil deaate even looks like or what its purpose is (why pursuade when you could prosecute?).
How nice of the Jews to help Hitler in his scheme by assassinating a German official, not once, but twice. After all, those murders are key to get this thing to go off.
Also how clever of Hitler to deal with a minor issue of internal politics by dragging the name of the entire nation in the mud and upsetting all his foreign policy plans in the process. That sounds exactly what a highly intelligent national leader would do. As leader of the SA and dictator of Germany, it’s not like he can solve this some other way. Hitler’s hands were obviously so tied that he had to resort to surreptitious means of an international character to get his will.
The whole scheme is akin to shooting up an elementary school so you can divert attention from a gas station robbery. In Jewish propaganda this type of logic is common and acceptable, but in the analysis of historical truth it should rightly be denounced as utter nonsense.
It’s funny you say qui bono. Who did benefit the most from this event? Clearly the Jews. In second place it has to be the allied nations who could relish in this public relations disaster of their enemy. In a distant third you could perhaps place the German government because they did gain some very negligible positives out of the whole affair, but of course nothing that could make up for the negative ones. So clearly a net loss for Germany.
Perhaps qui stupido would be a better question?
Still no reply to this from RKU? Has he just not noticed it?
So you admit that you cannot name a single neutral blog/comment platform that could be used as a debate venue. Of course I am not at all surprised, your tribe will never enter into a game or gamble unless they have rigged it or have a secret advantage.
I will also note that I have dealt with Jewish shysters like yourself before. Lawyers in general love to nit pick and deliberately avoid the salient points in an argument. Jews are experts at this style of non-debate because they are the worlds experts at the even more warped and perverted talmudic law too. A married couple of Jewish lawyers is hell on earth.
We can see this perfectly in the way that Jewish shysters in Hollywood and Nuremburg managed to turn their own war crimes like Katyn and a war of starvation into capital crimes against Germans and Germany. We can also see it clearly today in the way that Jewish shysters and neocons have hijact the US and turned it into a weapon of Zionist terrorism in Ukraine, Syria, Iraq and all across the middle east and even south America.
“…Look, no one who’s done the objective research disputes that the REAL Holocaust occurred.
ie: the Anglo-Zionist empire incendiary bombing of German and Japanese civilians and the dropping of the A-bombs…”
A classical example of whataboutism: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism
The Allied war crimes were indeed substantial, but that doesn’t “prove” that the Holocaust didn’t happen.
Inmates of the concentration camps did indeed die of hunger and diseases at the end of the war due to the fact that the supply lines to the camps were bombed by the Allies, but that accounts only for a small number of all those who were transported to the camps and “disappeared”.
Austrians in 1938 had been happy to join Germany. The most one can say about Czechs in 1939 is that they were demoralized. The original defense plans had been made with the Sudetenland in mind. The Munich Pact nullified these plans, so it seemed kind of hopeless to try fighting a war in March 1939.
—–
On the occasion of Independence Day, October 28, large-scale demonstrations occurred throughout the country, most notably in Prague. Not expecting it, the occupants did not respond by brute force to the Czech defiance immediately, but they took drastic steps against participants in the funeral procession of a university student, Jan Opletal, a victim of the October demonstrations, held on November 15. The funeral turned into a massive student demonstration to which the Nazis responded with terror tactics. On November 17, student dormitories were raided by the Gestapo, students were dragged out, arrested, some were executed and others deported to concentration camps. On the same day all Czech schools of higher education were closed down and were not reopened for the duration of the war. Most of the executed student leaders were National Democrats and none of them was a Communist.
—–
— Josef Kalvoda, Czechoslovakia’s Role in Soviet Strategy, p. 92.
For more on Jan Opletal:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jan_Opletal
—–
On 28 October 1939, on the anniversary of the Czechoslovak independence, Jan Opletal and other medical students called for Resistance against the German occupation, and distributed flyers. Throughout the Protectorate of Bohemia and Moravia, the Czech population took part in strikes and demonstrations.
—–
You cannot blame Mr. Unz for the behavior of other Jews. As for condemning historical Jewish behavior and Judaism, his own articles and those of others on this website, do that all the time. No “gatekeeping” at all.
The mob exists in every country and it can be very fickle to control. By comparison a Czech mob once instigated a murderous pogrom after a Jew had merely thrown sand at a Priest.
Thankfully the Germans are not as quick to anger as the Czechs. The Jews were certainly hoping for more destruction than they got that night.
Hitler partly blamed Goebbels. Not because of any belief that he planned the event, but because his agitating propaganda had riled up the German people to the point something like this could become a reality. This type of base antisemitism can be very useful when securing votes, but after the NSDAP came into power a more subtle line was required. David Irving has used this apparent about face to suggest that Adolf Hitler was not really an antisemite, but that is putting the cart before the horse. Hitler was undoubtedly planning to solve the Jewish problem in a more direct way at some point. Probably under the cover of war, which is what happened in reality, but open agitation and a riotous atmosphere was not conducive to a 1930s Germany trying to present a good face to the world.
Deep down Hitler knew that his own politics and rhetoric were also to blame for what happened, which probably explains why he did not punish Goebbels et. al. Trying to convince the world that a Jewish conspiracy had tricked the German population into a national riot would do more harm than good, so the matter was simply dropped.
I recall the “most if not all” is a direct quote from one of his essays. Although he seems to deeply admire Irving, there’s no reason to assume he accepts Irving’s recent pivot to 2.5 million deaths. I would assume he leans more toward Wear’s 300,000.
I don’t think he “slimes” the reputation of Germans at all. He writes with open admiration of Hitler and sympathy for German strategic objectives. I would assume had he lived in Germany in those days he would have proudly served the Reich, as apparently many Jews of mixed breeding did.
I think you need to take the good with gratitude. No one is perfect and no one sees things exactly the same as his fellow human being.
I do agree with you that his narcissistic preening is shocking, but perhaps that’s inevitable for anyone with an IQ over 200, as I have read about him. I’m quite appalled by his cruel comments towards you in particular. You’ve been at this game far longer than he has and even if he has surpassed your understanding he owes you some gratitude. He doesn’t seem to have any competence in human relationships courtesy or even simple decency. In that regard he behaves like somebody with a spectrum disorder.
I recently asked a friend to do a Mormon baptism for the dead for him because he strikes me as someone with an enormous intellect but a puny heart and no soul. I think he’s greatly in need of salvation.
The flak I receive from Ron Unz shows I’m over the target. For one thing, he cannot take criticisms that he feels vulnerable to. He’s reacting more and more like Joe Biden every day. Angry. Joe Biden also presides over a populace purporting to enjoy Free Speech, which Joe has to allow while at the same time tries to suppress. Ron is in the same position.
What’s with this constantly calling me ‘obsessive, elderly crank’; stubborn; delusional. Is it a fault to live a long life? Should I be silenced at a certain age, when I am capable of living independently without any help from anyone? I’m not even signed up for Medicare! What I know, I am zealous about, yes, and that only means “enthusiastic.” That’s why I end up coming here, for the opportunity to exchange views on subjects I consider important. I don’t bother with what I don’t consider important or pay that much attention to. That means I am not a troll. The only people you should ban is trolls, NOT whoever you disagree with or who disagrees with you or even questions your sincerity. That should not bother you.
But I bother you.
“never discussing Germar Rudolf in my writings so I quoted the paragraphs from my big Holocaust Denial article”
Not accurate. You included a paragraph (or two?) mentioning G.R.s arrest and trial in Germany for his revisionist writing, but not a presentation of his revisionist writing itself. Not important to you?. What is important? From what I can see, it is to tie together “Nazis” (a fictional name) and Zionist Jews. For that, you utitlize and recommend entire books by Jewish authors like Lenni Brenner and Edwin Black — not Germar Rudolf. [You also only read David Irving on Kristallnacht, but not Ingrid Weckert, a much better authority.]
I also never said I hadn’t read your article in question. I said I DID read it but didn’t recall the paragraph or two about Germar Rudolf. I took responsibility for that even though the subject under discussion was “holocaust revisionism,” not criminal sanctions against it. The same goes with what I said about Butz; no matter how many times I correct your statements regarding “what I said,” you just keep repeating your original statement. You ignore continuing conversation & corrections, and insist on only the very first things said. What does that tell us about you? Your cultivated image as a reasonable non-partisan is flagging.
Please allow me to paraphrase for you:
Jews get a sadistic thrill out of blaming and punishing their victims. Today some might call it a dopamine rush. Judeo-sadism and lust for vengeance swept all across Russia in 1917, then Hungary in 1919, then Spain in 1936, then back to the Baltics in 1940. Then came the genocide of Germany by various power Jews and secret plans, later to be weaponized, like Hooten and Morgentau. This was followed by the casting of fake blame back onto the very victims of Jewish hate so that they would still be forced to pay billions every year, even after 80 years had passed, to hundreds of thousands of “death camp” “survivors”. In reality these were just Jewish carpet-baggers of course, Jews who had migrated to Palestine at Hitlers invitation. Meanwhile Ursula Haverbeck rots in jail for speaking the truth about Jewish Power.
> The crucial thing is that Beaty’s book was a huge bestseller, strongly endorsed by many top American generals, and neither the ADL nor any of the many other Jewish activists who attacked him ever challenged his dismissal of the Holocaust.
As I already said, that has to be understood in the context of the early Cold War. It would have been totally counter-productive from the standpoint of Israeli interests for the ADL or any other such Jewish organization to do what you imply they should have done. At this time, the Truman administration was leading the US in the recently begun Cold War. Truman had displayed an obviously friendly attitude towards the new state of Israel, but his administration was also forced to launch investigations into intelligence reports of Soviet moles who had infiltrated the Roosevelt administration.
Note that all of the serious investigations began at a time when Joseph McCarthy was nowhere on the scene. McCarthy later made a name for himself by charging that Dean Acheson and George Marshall, leading figures in the Truman administrations Cold War efforts, were allegedly Soviet agents who had “lost China” as part of their service to Moscow. Nothing in Venona or anywhere else supports these insane charges.
The Truman administration had to walk carefully through these political weeds and the last thing they would have needed would be to get dragged into a protracted public argument about Beaty’s trivial book. The book did not make any serious arguments which guaranteed it a place in any future scholarly debates. It was simply embraced by a sector of the Right on purely political grounds. The obvious sensible policy for the ADL to follow would have been simply to support Truman in his brand of Cold War politics while encouraging a friendly stance towards Israel, while ignoring Beaty and any followers he had.
Isn’t it strange that for Ron Unz it’s all about how many visitors you have at your website? Not about who they are and why they’re visiting?
Ursula Haverbeck is not in jail. She was. Please stop saying she is.
Let me be clear that I don’t care what you think.
I see I have been doxed here as well. It’s not the first time and probably won’t be the last.
You people don’t scare me. I’ve been dealing with you for thirty years.
Fuck off and die.
I imagine those were German citizens of Czechoslovakia.
Adolf Hitler wanted Czechoslovakia neutralized as a military springboard for enemy powers, of that there can be no doubt. This was his main and overriding motivation.
But why did Hacha come? Was it because he feared rabid dog Hitler, or was it because the Slovaks and the Ruthenians had just ripped his country apart by seceding? Because Poland, Hungary and the Soviets were watching on like hungry wolves for the chance at gaining territory from the fallout? In lieu of these attractive prospects he decided to put himself in the arms of Hitler.
Why didn’t he go to his so called ally, Stalin? Who had promised so much help to Czechoslovakia? Or the Western powers? Evidently Hacha thought Adolf Hitler was the more reasonable option. And who can blame him? No Czech had to serve in WW2, their lands were not bombed and the Germans provided order, jobs and food for them. When Benes returned from exile after the war, he looked out over Prague and said “thanks to me this city stands unharmed”. But the credit should really go to Hacha, the man who made the deal.
I know how much you love splitting nose hairs, but your statement
“Please stop saying she is.”
Implies that I have repeatedly made this infraction of the Yeager code of true and pure “Nazi”. Please tell me when the other time(s) were?
The Polish government greedily latched onto the opportunity to grab some of Czechoslovakia themselves, and Churchill was quite rightly critical of this.
“The Poles had gained Teschen by their shameful attitude towards the liquidation of the Czechoslovak State. They were soon to pay their own forfeits. On March 21, when Ribbentrop saw M. Lipski, the Polish Ambassador in Berlin, he adopted a sharper tone than in previous discussions. The occupation of Bohemia and the creation of satellite Slovakia brought the German Army to the southern frontiers of Poland.”
— Winston Churchill, The Gathering Storm, pp. 312-3.
Putin has apparently made some similar comments.
But Germany’s march across Czechia on March 15, 1939, destroyed any possibility of reaching a similar agreement over Danzig. If Hitler had stayed back from this and allowed the Czechoslovak state to simmer for a few years, there probably would have been an eventual separation of Slovakia around 1941 or so. Meanwhile, Chamberlain would have fully supported his claims for a settlement over Danzig and Poland would have been required to yield by international opinion. But the events of March 15 left the Polish government with no choice but to draw the line over Danzig.
Hitler wanted his effort to rid Germany of its Jews to be “legal.”
That is why he was really pissed off when, I think in 1934, a bunch of local Brown shirt rednecks started a mini-pogrom against a Jewish clan that ran a Gasthaus and brewery in a smallish German town whose name escapes me but I think it started with G. At least one family member was killed, and others were very badly beaten up. OK, I think this is it: Gunzenhausen Palm Sunday Pogrom. You can find more info if you do a search for “Gunzenhausen pogrom.”
Hitler came down hard on the SS jerks because it was open thuggery, not covered by any racial law then on the books. Up until 1939 Hitler was still looking for “legal” ways to get rid of Germany’s Jews—-get them out of German economic and public life, get them to leave on their own but of course leave their assets behind.
> How nice of the Jews to help Hitler in his scheme by assassinating a German official,
Whoever said anything about Hitler scheming to assassinate a German official at that time? Hitler had a long-running record, going back to the Reichstag fire of February 27, 1933, of simply latching onto events as they occurred and using them to promote a predetermined agenda. Himmler’s rivalry with the SA had been slowly burning in the background for quite a while. Hitler almost certainly would have encouraged Himmler in advance to do whatever he needed to secure his hold. When Ernst vom Rath died, Goebbels was probably encouraged to think that he now had a chance to seize the limelight for himself. Then Himmler criticized the whole thing and took over the power from the SA. But as I said, if there had been a real security failure on that night then Himmler would not have been promoted the way he was.
> Adolf Hitler wanted Czechoslovakia neutralized as a military springboard for enemy powers
Rubbish. It was the exact opposite. Hitler had a neutral Czechoslovakia and Poland in 1938. What he sought was a roadway for a drive to the east that would open the way for the expansion of living space. That was why he destroyed the neutrality that was right in front of him.
> But why did Hacha come?
—–
Hitler informed Prague that it would be to their “great advantage” if Dr. Hacha, despite age and infirmity, would travel to Berlin that very day to meet him.
—–
— David Irving, The War Path, p. 187, 2013 edition.
Given the way that Hitler had initiated things, there was really no choice for Hacha. He could have given Hitler a middle-finger, but otherwise he had to come.
> Why didn’t he go to his so called ally, Stalin?
What a bizarre statement. Hacha never had any alliance with Stalin at all.
Excellent. Whatever one may think of Ron Unz’s personal views on a host of subjects, he is to be commended for the many dissident articles that are published on this rare but extremely insightful website.
Mr. Unz also allows those who snipe at him, who are cranks, and who are intellectually dishonest to express their opinions which I find quite commendable in terms of patience and being charitable to others.
Personally, I’m not bothered in the least by Mr. Unz’s positions on the Covid vaccines and Hispanic crimes (none of which I agree with), or whatever because there is so much that he writes that I find perfectly reasonable and truthful. Like yourself, I don’t ask nor expect Mr. Unz to agree with my views, especially when on most important issues we already agree.
Also, the level of intellectual integrity and rigorous objectivity that Mr. Unz has displayed in his writings is quite mind-blowing when one stops to think about it. Mr. Unz is Jewish, and yet he exposes the Holocaust ‘narrative’ for all the lies it’s based on, including the received ‘narrative’ about WW2 and Adolf Hitler! For the sake of Truth, he has exposed himself to such reputation-destroying and lawfare groups as the ADL and the $PlC. This alone should make us grateful for his efforts.
Some people, of course, will never be happy even when there is mostly agreement on many subjects. We ought to be happy, instead, with what we can get in terms of shared opinions with others.
> Hitler came down hard on the SS jerks
False. It was the SA who were involved with the Gunzenhausen pogrom. Hitler was not so much concerned about legality as he was over the fact that the army regarded the SA as uncouth primitives, and in 1934 he needed the support of the army. Bu 1938 he had begun moving against the army, and the SS was coming into its own. But for a while in 1938 it looked like the SA was making a comeback and the expense of the army. Then the Night of Broken Glass came, and the SA was shunted to the side by the SS.
“… but that accounts only for a small number of all those who were transported to the camps and ‘disappeared’.”
Typhus can make you “disappear”. Recently, a friend of mine almost “disappeared” from pneumonia. The Black Plague made whole cities and towns “disappear”.
The truth is stubborn. As it is surrounded by lies, it just sits there, biding its time. The lies end up bringing themselves down. Shame, a fall from grace, “victimhood” lost. She’s come undone.
Where are all the 6,000,000 bodies? Occam’s razor indeed!
Many people have told that there’s no other website in the world that allows such a wide range of discussion on so many different extremely controversial topics. I can’t say whether that’s true, but that’s what lots of people have said.
The comments on this website are also very lightly moderated compared with those on almost any other website. In particular, I’ve been told it’s almost unprecedented for someone to be so willing to allow comments denouncing or attacking him on his own website. In the interests of free speech, I’ve tried to allow a great deal of this.
Unfortunately, the ultra-controversial nature of our topics and this extremely light moderation has naturally attracted a considerable number of extremely quarrelsome individuals as well as a few who clearly have a degree of mental illness. It also seems very likely that this website has drawn a certain number of “trolls” from hostile organizations, who are behaving in this way for obvious, disruptive reasons.
Normally, I don’t pay too much attention to the flow of comments on this website because I’m busy with other things, but I’ve recently gotten fed up with the volume of insults directed against me. I’ve therefore decided to get more involved in moderating comments and cracking down on this.
Henceforth, insults against me are likely to get trashed, perhaps with several substantive, innocuous comments by the same individual also trashed as a penalty. Heavily off-topic comments may also get trashed.
Producing a lengthy, substantive comment probably requires a considerable amount of time and effort, so if you don’t want to have your comments trashed, avoid insulting me. I’m hoping that individuals who’ve had enough of their lengthy, time-consuming comments trashed may decide to permanently depart this website.
If you don’t like this new policy, just move to a different website.
Fascinating. But take a look at this book from ’33, by the World Committee for the Victims of German Fascism, which seems pretty well documented except for the speculations about the Reichstag fire. Wouldn’t the Allies have been much influenced by this and other inside reporting — and rightly so?
https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.284972/mode/2up
I think you’re overreacting …… but in a good way ….. 🙂
Here’s the thing – in this thread a very nasty fellow has appeared, A. Mattis. I haven’t heard of this fellow since he kicked me off his site years ago after 2 or 3 posts. He was everywhere then. My impression then, as now, is that he is a truly vile person, and it is my impression that he is not Jewish, which makes it even worse!
So, he led off with the “you’re an asshole” remark, and then a few posts later “fuck off and die” …. This kind of idiocy has no place in any forum.
Also, he wants to debate you but not on a site you control, which is ironic as he wouldn’t debate me on a site he controlled.
I think the solution is to ban this idiot, he deserves it, and then resume your heretofore lax oversight.
Only you did, in an attempt to rephrase my statement dishonestly.
In your mind Hitler’s scheme is to have a big riot (for no good reason) and that can’t happen without the murders. The central part of this, brilliant, plan is something he can not control, nor Himmler. And as usual it is all based on (((conjecture))) with no real evidence to back it up.
The foreign provocateur plan actually does have evidence. In fact all the evidence point toward it. Anonymous phone calls, phony orders, strange window smashers, shadows disappearing into the night. This was the talk on the ground. What you hear nothing about is specific orders from named individuals, written orders from anyone in government, any documented orders at all. No organization. No planning. Nor any real motive. And crucially, the main benefactor of this event is not the German Government, it is foreign Jews and enemies of Germany.
How easily such a riot is engineered could be seen recently in the foreign backed protests against Netanyahu’s legal reforms, in the holy land itself, which came out of nowhere on the orders of foreign Jews.
A month before Churchill murdered 2,000 French sailors in a Pearl Harbor style act of war, he ordered the British naval fleet to flee west from the Channel NorthSea and Atlantic. To shelter in the Irish Sea. While the British army was stuck at Dunkirk.
The French army east of the beach at Dunkirk fought off the German army. Until British civilians fishermen merchant vessels cross channel ferries yachts and boats of every kind sailed to Dunkirk To Rescue theBritush expeditionary Force caught at Dunkirk.
Spring of 1940, as the German army was at the French German border Churchill went over to France To purpose a united nation of France and Britain. Something similar to early medieval times. When England ruled about 45 percent of France. The French said no.
Churchill completely disapproved of De Gaulle and the French military men who escaped to England and set up a French government military operation in exile. There’s allegations that Churchill attempted to assassinate De Gaulle and some of his key men. Who knows? But if he could murder 2,000 allied French sailors in an act of war he certainly hesitate to
Murder a few more French military men.
Churchill’s financial problems weren’t just caused by living in a grandiose aristocratic style far far beyond his income. They were caused by his gambling. A disease that affects so many people every race ethnicity religion occupation income.
And his debts were paid by jews who wanted Palestine and WW2 the defeat of Western Europe and the triumph of Russian communism all over Europe China and then to the rest of the world.
The British hagiography of WWs 1+2 is morbid and disgusting. The royal family and the cathedral services honoring the slaughterhouses. And OMG all the streaming services endless new WWs movies and series.
There’s even yet another series about one of the British triumphs of WW2. Searched for a fresh and healthy fit young man’s corpse in a morgue somewhere. Dressed him up in a navy officer uniform. Put false information about the coming invasion of France on him. Dumped him in the Mediterranean. The German’s found the corpse and the false information.
There’s been dozens of books and movies about the one British contribution to the Normandy landings. Thousands of American young men killed trying to climb cliffs under German fire.,More French people were killed by -American bombs than the Germans killed in 6 years. And the Americans killed civilians not soldiers.
Then there’s 70 years of the British weeping and wailing about the bombings and dreadful
deprivations the British suffered during WWs especially WW2. The civilians under German or Russian occupation suffered far far more. French people born between 1928 and 1942 were grew up to be 20 pounds less and 2 inches shorter because of food deprivation.
The Poles under German occupation were restricted to 800 calories a day. The Poles in the Russian sector had even less food. Supposedly there was true famine in the Netherlands. But the English pretend they had it worse with their rationing.
Actually, because of the rationing and factory cafeterias the ordinary working class English ate better than they had for 300 years. That’s a big reasons the socialists labor party won in 1945.
The majority of the voters; badly paid working people had it so much better under wartime socialism with better food and clothing banks etc that the labor socialists won the 1945 election. And institutioned socialism national health child benefit for everyone no matter how rich I or poor what we call child welfare payments government old age pensions.
Like the American Kennedy’s, Churchill was a master of public relations and propagandizing himself.,
The first work cited is from 1960, which is consistent with Deniers’ claims that the Holocaust story was stitched together beginning in the 1960s.
The second one is a pretty incredible account by a German Jew writing in a small Ohio college’s literary magazine. If this is the most significant account of what we today call the Holocaust written during the 1950s in America, then that’s not really a good sign for believers in the Holocaust.
The third one, from a Jewish publication, appears to be based on the Nuremberg Trials. Everyone agrees the Nuremberg Trial proceedings contained the central elements of the modern Holocaust narrative, and undoubtedly some Jews still took those claims seriously in 1949. But they were a tiny minority.
JFYI
Exclusive from Dima.
Biden and Erdoğan discuss ending of grain deal by Russia.
https://t.me/militarysummary/2516
[It’s extremely bad behavior to publish a 10,000 word article as a comment. That’s what links are for. Next time you’ll get trashed.]
I support your efforts, and I agree with what you say about David Irving. I haven’t read his book on Joseph Goebbels, and I’m not sure what he says about him, but I think what Ingrid Weckert has to say about Kristallnacht and other things not necessarily related to that are very informative and interesting. Ingrid Weckert researched and wrote a book on Kristallnacht and apparently presented the following report at an Institute for Historical Review meeting.
‘Crystal Night’ 1938: The great Anti-German spectacle
Ingrid Weckert
https://www.ihr.org/jhr/v06/v06p183_Weckert.html
Czechoslovakia was expressly created at Versailles to serve as a military buffer to Germany. By French politicians in the 30s the country was described as “an aircraft carrier” for operations into the heart of Germany. It had military agreements with France and the USSR at the time of Munich. The UK was still officially pledged to support them in 1939. Their treatment of the German population was clumsy and oppressive. They were clearly not a neutral country, much less friendly.
Hitler saw a shot to end this threat and he duly took it. Later he was willing to consider any deal with the Western powers that did not designate Czechia as a potential hostile to German interests, so it was not about Czech territory per se, or the fabulous lebensraum which played no role in the actual politics of the late 30s. The Czechs got to keep their land and their laws and their culture under the condition they surrender their foreign policy to Germany. A classic protectorate.
Hacha was backed into a corner without any help from Germany. The Slovaks, basically half the country, were rebelling. And the Ruthenians too. Poland was a declared enemy and had already grabbed territory by brute force. Hungary was itching for Ruthenia to return to their kingdom. Stalin was eyeing any opportunities to gain a foothold. The West had withdrawn their support, effectively acquiescing in the partition of their own short lived Versailles creature. So in effect the Czechoslovakian state was no more. And Hacha went to Hitler. He could have gone to Stalin, or the Poles or the Western Powers but he didn’t.
Ja, seriously, from 20th July all/any ships in black sea will be considered as potentially carrying arms for Kiev.
Russian attacks destroy Odessa port.
Fwd information from Brian Berletic.
USA again doubles down.
What can possibly go wrong ?
⚔️🇷🇺🇺🇦🇺🇸 US Announces New Military Assistance Package for Ukraine
It is not being drawn from existing stockpiles, but instead to be procured through yet-to-be concluded contracts with “industry & partners.”
In other words, Ukraine will not be getting any of this equipment for months or even years…
▪️Four NASAMS & munitions;
▪️152mm artillery rounds;
▪️Mine clearing equipment;
▪️anti-tank TOW missiles;
▪️Phoenix Ghost/Switchblade drones;
▪️Precision aerial munitions;
▪️Counter-UAS and electronic warfare detection equipment;
▪️150 fuel trucks;
▪️115 tactical vehicles to tow and haul equipment;
▪️50 tactical vehicles to recover equipment;
▪️Port & harbor security equipment;
▪️Tactical secure communications systems;
▪️Support for training, maintenance, & sustainment activities.
Source: https://www.defense.gov/News/Releases/Release/Article/3463890/biden-administration-announces-additional-security-assistance-for-ukraine/
People are liars. (Fixed it for you. LOL)
I just hope you’re not too upset with some posts, so that you over-react. The back and forth on this site makes the comment’s section the best, most informative one I know of, although I sometimes find the “Jew this”, “Jew that” seeming obsession of some posters hard to take.
The lady is pretty harsh and blunt on his findings and methods. I don’t know any other website hosts who would put up with that with less hostility and defensiveness than he’s shown.
I don’t know who would think that objecting to a commenter stating incorrectly that an ELDERLY and greatly beloved German female revisionist was currently “rotting in jail” when said revisionist has been out of prison since November 2020, almost 3 years, is “splitting nose hairs.”
Being up to date is worth something, and chronically misstating the facts is a bad look. One would think “our” people would care. It’s my experience they don’t care much, as a couple years back I would see that error often, and correct it, which is why I added “Please stop saying it.” My apologies if that offended you … but you should know better.
You should also know that I have nothing to do with “Nazis”. You’ve got me confused with someone else. 🙂
1. Visigoths joined the Catholic Church.
2. Conflicts arise between Jews and Visigoths.
3. Jews welcomed the MuslimArab and mainly-Berber conquerors in the 8th century. The Muslim conquest of Spain.
4. Golden age of Jewish culture in Spain.
1. The Bolsheviks become Stalinists.(1922-1937)
2. Conflicts arise between Jews-Mensheviks(Trotsky, Kamenev, Zinoviev, etc.) and Stalinists.
1. The 1932 elections established the Nazi Party as the largest parliamentary faction of the Weimar Republic government.
2. Conflicts arise between Jews and Nazi.
3.WW2 1939 – 1945
4.Golden age of Jewish culture in USA.
1.The Neocons are seizing power in the US.
2.NATO(Wesley Clark) bombing of Yugoslavia. ; United States invasion of Afghanistan ; The Iraq War ;
The Syrian Conflict ; the Ukraine conflict.
3. the Taiwan conflict ; The Iran War; WW3
4. Greater Israel.
Very interesting. It seems our entire 20th century history is full of lies and propaganda.
Reuniting the German peoples may have been well and good, but how is invading France and Russia a sane foreign policy? That is where I start to have trouble with the rehabilitation of Hitler. I’m trying to keep an open mind. Thoughts?
Yes, it was the SA. It occurred at the end of March (the Night of the Long Knives occurred in late June).
There are different interpretations of why Hitler and others were displeased with this particular incident. The SA was supposed to be deployed against Communists in the streets. Not randomly against Jews in small towns by individual SA louts. The Gunzenhausen Palm Sunday pogrom was part of this problem of the SA getting out of line. One writer states, “Unsystematic antisemitism in the countryside often took a very crude form” (Die Juden im Nazionalsozialismus), with local SA acting on their own initiative and often out of personal grudges. This lack of discipline and taking law into own hands was symptomatic of the bigger problem with the SA being undisciplined. And, there was no legal framework for these random attacks on Jewish businesses, often in towns where the locals were OK with the local Jews and were dependent on them, e.g., as cattle dealers. I.e., adequate political and legal work had not yet been done to mobilize locals against local Jews. “Only systematic action from above could finally eliminate the Jews from the local scene” (117).
Per Snyder, The Encyclopedia of the Third Reich, “SA,” the biggest problem was that Roehm wanted to take the SA to the left and start a “second revolution” (which seems to be an inherent disconnect with the SA’s main task, which was to beat up Communists in the streets), whereas Hitler now needed to stick with the “nationalism” part of the program and ditch the “socialist” part.
Very well said, Rockaboatus. And I enjoy your articles, please do more.
I am now slightly leaning towards believing Ron Unz’ take on Hispanic crime as not being all that big of a deal. Yes, statistically they do more crime than white people in CA and most other places, but it is mostly internal to their tribes (gang stuff). Not even close to the societal chaos engendered by black crime (and the media fomentation of black crime). I worked in rural areas in Mexico for years and felt mostly safe. I think Ron’s point about Hispanics driving black gangs out of LA and making it better is important. Hispanics don’t want to ruin everything.
I would also add that the media and commercial adverisements on TeeVee seem to ignore Hispanics (and Asians) and only really promote blacks beyond all demographic and economic contributions. It’s insane. Black black blackety blackety black, always black male with a white woman. Almost never Hispanics in any TeeVee ads or shows. Why always so much blackness in our faces?
I looked it back up, and you are right here. Those were indeed the chapter titles. Back when Ron published his, “The Secrets of Military Intelligence”, the Beaty book was linked and made available. I read quite a bit of it, but not all of it. Beaty wrote about other things in the book besides WW2 if memory serves. It’s been a while.
The thing is Pat, if Beaty was tasked with compiling field reports from commanders, spies, local European newspapers, and interviewed-local citizens for a year or two, it seems hard to believe not one witness that man considered credible said to Beaty, “Mr. Beaty, the Germans are executing the prisoners in the work camps for no reason man! Even if they are doing a good job, their rations are starvation-level and the Germans are killing hundreds per day for no reason!” “Is there any negotiation possible whereby we could give the Germans food to free these unfortunate people Mr. Beaty? You talk to the brass sir, can we do anything?”
Beaty seemed like an honest enough guy, although he was kind of a dry writer if memory serves, that he would have said something if the above scenario happened but he didn’t. He just claimed the story was absurd.
I personally don’t know. I grew up with the standard textbook narrative. I watched “The Winds of War” as narrated by Lawrence Olivier on PBS as a kid with my parents which had footage of camps and emaciated victims and assumed it was 100% true. If I had to guess…….I’d lean toward Himmler and Mengele being behind some killings (those two just felt like real creeps to me), but perhaps only about half as many deaths as claimed. However I’ve not made any real effort to go into depth about this event. What I do know is that the intensity of the event had made criticizing one group of people practically off limits, and we ought all be beholden to some objective critique if we are in the wrong about something. We will have uneven dialogue until we can.
Thanks for your further comment. Some clarifications: In your blockquote from me, you put two sentences together that were not together when I wrote them. I was not speaking about Unz when I referred to “the slime-d reputation of Germany/Germans.
And John Wear did not come up with the number 300,000 — he took it from someone else. It’s kind of standard among German revisionists; I’m thinking Juergen Graf. Unz has never given an estimate, he would have no idea.
Why do you believe he has an IQ over 200? It was he who said so, gee, such a modest fellow. Let me say to the rest of your comment, for which I thank you, that Unz always initiated the insults, while I just gave back as I got.
Patterns just random; stop noticing.
Not really. Just last month I published my big WWII interview, which has gotten more readership than anything else on this website in the last year or two, and there was a big section on the Holocaust, that heavily emphasized the evidence of the Beaty book:
https://www.unz.com/runz/why-everything-you-know-about-world-war-ii-is-wrong/#question-7-the-holocaust
You obviously didn’t read it if you’d never heard of Beaty. I also heavily emphasized his book in my Holocaust interviews on Iranian broadcast TV a few months ago.
Well, to start with Britain, France, and the USA defacto, declared war on Germany. And France invaded parts of Germany before Germany did anything. In fact France had invaded German territory twice between the wars.
The Soviet Union had planned to invade Germany and Western Europe when Germany struck a preemptive strike about 1 month prior.
You can read Germany’s War by John Wear, and The Chief Culprit by Viktor Suvorov for further information. There are numerous books out there that cover the topics of who attacked whom and who started it all.
Those interviews were outstanding!
Hey, Ron, a quick question. I had a suggestion for how you might deal with the problem, recently come to a head, of acrimony, insults, trolls etc., without compromising the free speech integrity of this amazing site. It’s somewhat long–not because it’s complicated but because I want to show the reasoning behind each of its few parts–but I think you’ll really find it worth considering at least. Would you like me to type it up as a reply to one of your comments or send it as an email with my username in the subject line?
Hispanics are just as bad as blacks, if not even worse in many ways. I am getting really sick and tired of so-called pro-white/white nationalists being soft of them like this.
Do you have a head injury?
The Hasbara presence is strong today. Tel Aviv never sleeps!
Can’t have the people know the truth about the Holohoax.
The Greatest Lie Ever Told! Jews don’t eat Whoppers, they tell Whoppers. Whopping Big Lies that would make Goebbels blush bright crimson. Ain’t that right, Schlomo?
Maybe France and Russia were about to attack Germany. Why was the British Expeditionary Force of 350,000 eager soldiers sent to France? What expedition was Churchill planning in collusion with Joey Stalin? One wonders. Hitler magnanimously allowed these Brits to be rescued at Dunkirk after the German army blitzed through Belgium and France. He was a man with a soft spot for merry old England, was Adolfus. Pity the Brits didn’t show any reciprocal mercy later in the game.
>Why always so much blackness in our faces?
link — ‘… it’s designed to accustom Whites to seeing lots of Blacks literally everywhere‘
Czechoslovakia. Was an artificial country created after WW1 by the victors, the usual inbred Anglo-Zionist bankster illuminati. It would be like joining China and Japan together and calling it Chipan. Sounds reasonable. Or let’s combine America and Canada and call it Canerica. Or Amerinada. Hoowee! I’m on a roll today. Watch out Adam Sandler!
So those Sudentenland Germans were in “Czechoslovakia” well before there was such an animal.
They were ethnic Germans who were being oppressed by the gleeful Czechs. They welcomed some assistance from Onkel Adolf.
We saw exactly what happened to Czechoslovakia after the Berlin wall came down. It split in two. By then the Sudenten Germans had long gone, emigrating to West Germany where wages and social welfare benefits were far higher than in the eastern bloc.
Money talks. It always has.
Could it be that the Russophobia now in the West is worse than Germanophobia before WWII? There is all this cancellation of Russian culture. Were they cancelling German philosophy and music then?
All I remember of Laibach is that they became famous with a lousy version of a great song by a far better German band. I saw Laibach once in 80’s Manchester and they were crap. The place was full of skinheads who thought they were watching a Nazi band. Maybe they got better at playing their instruments with time, as most other crappy bands seem to.
BTW I also saw New Order when they were starting up and virtually unknown in the basement of some Leeds hotel. That also attracted young idiots who thought they were Nazis, probably because of the name of the band. But New Order really got good and huge with time.
France invaded Germany first in World War 2.
https://forum.codoh.com/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=11241
Hitler invaded the Soviet Union to prevent Stalin’s attack on Germany (Operatsia Groza)
It would have been suicide to allow Stalin to attack first.
https://forum.codoh.com/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=7999
All signatories to the Versailles Treaty were supposed to disarm but Germany was the only country to do so. Hitler rearmed Germany after the other countries failed to disarm and he found his country surrounded by states that had a larger military than his own nation. In other words it was an act of self defence.
http://www.wintersonnenwende.com/scriptorium/english/archives/articles/fichteEwhobroke.html
#279 Skeptikal
My I express my opinion?
“What is your view of the status if ethnic Germans in Poland?”
There was only 0,7 milion of Germans in Poland (2,3% of population in 1931).
Germans were concentrated in western and northern part of Poland.
If Hitler really wanted only to secure German minority in Poland he should took over only western parts of Poland, not half of Poland with 15 milions of non-Germans, including very German cities like Warsaw and Krakow (sarcasmus).
(Google “minorities in Poland before war” or take a look at German minority in pre-war Poland in this map https://zpe.gov.pl/a/mniejszosci-narodowe-ii-rp-i-konflikty-na-tle-narodowosciowym/DRP76tecq (scroll down a little to find the map). Germans are marked in blue colour described as “niemieckiego” ).
“While playing the victim.”
Germans are playing the victims. Germans desperately try to blame others for war crimes they did.
For example, Germans prepared proscription lists 1-2 years before war to kill Poles when they conquer Poland.
Can you provide examples of such proscription lists made by Poles?
“The shootings [of Poles] were conducted with the use of a proscription list (Sonderfahndungsbuch Polen), compiled by the Gestapo in the span of two years before the 1939 invasion.[1] The top secret lists identified more than 61,000 members of the Polish elite: activists, intelligentsia, scholars, clergy, actors, former officers and others, who were to be interned or shot. “
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Tannenberg
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1931_Polish_census
JFYI
Related. In Baghdad.
Will somebody say that Sweden did not deserve this ?
🇮🇶🇸🇪 Hundreds of protesters against the burning of a copy of the Qur’an, carried out recently with the consent of the Stockholm authorities, seized and set fire to the Swedish embassy in Baghdad. The embassy staff were not injured.
To extrapolate from this.
Russia continues to deliver direct payback for the (latest) Kerch Bridge attack in which a young couple were killed and their daughter injured/orphaned.
It is widely believed that the orcs of SBU carried it/others similar out, but the planning etc was done by western, probably UK, agencies.
There are large numbers of western mercenaries fighting Russia. Just one example was RFJ Jr’s son that he recently bragged about. Killing Russians for the sanhedrin and their Heavenly Kingdom. Fighting a losing battle.
The same principle applies as with Baghdadi Muslims.
Similar outcome, just different time scale/methods.
A great presentation by Jürgen Graf titled “The Fate of Unregistered Auschwitz Inmates (2000)”
Video Link
Mr. Graf goes into some detailed analysis of the 438,000 mostly communist Jews who were forced to leave Hungary as their allies in the Red Rapist Army approached eastern Europe. Basically Mr. Graf contends that these Jews were desperately needed for labor and were sent all over to work in labor camps and even in agricultural labor divisions.
Mr. Graf is still living in exile in Russia from the Swiss authorities who want to lock him up for 15 months for racism and holocaust denial. That Jewish power is so omnipresent and overwhelming that Swiss researchers cannot even publish the truth is just one small indication of how warped and unhinged the hatred and lust for vengeance emanating from organized Jewry is.
Of course we see this same inverted Judaic worldview all around us. From Wokeism to Environmentalism to Ukrainian war mongering to corrupted judicial systems even in Switzerland. Then in a pique of Jewish projection, they dare to call it all “Judeo-Christianity”.
Thanks.
“Channel Restricted.
Contains Incitement to Hared.”
Bitch Yute has taken 30 shekels.
Material like yours is not shown throughout Europe.
Please use another platform.
Thanks.
Incitement to Hatred
Or Revelation of Truth. Forbidden on Bitch Yute.
Found it elsewhere .
Thanks again.
https://altcensored.com/watch?v=_li-8u0hMOA
As an engineer with an extensive scientific background as well as an intense interest in geopolitical affairs, I can easily prove that the so-called “holocaust™” is a massive historical fraud imposed upon the world.
From engineering and logistical standpoints, NONE of the claims made by so-called “holocaust™ survivors” is plausible or even possible.
The same could be said about the “Nuremberg Trials” which were based on “law” in which “rules of evidence” were not only thrown out but prohibited, while hearsay and the promotion of the “commonly accepted (false) narrative” were not only promoted but used as a basis for the convictions of those in the dock. Let’s not forget that ALL Nuremberg defendants were tortured into signing confessions and gave (false) testimony that was prepared by the victors, truth be damned.
From a moral point-of-view, countries and institutions that have made any opposition to the “commonly accepted narrative” of the so-called “holocaust™” into crimes punishable by threats of prosecution and incarceration are but more proof that the whole so-called “holocaust™” story is untenable and based on lies and fabrications, NOT truth.
“Holocaustianity™” has become the current “state religion” in many countries and even in some of the United States as well.
Censorship is PROOF itself that the so-called “holocaust™” is indeed the fraud of the twentieth and twenty-first centuries.
Thank you. You made some good points. I’ll have to do more reading especially on FDR allowing Eastern Europe to be taken over by Stalin. As a Slav, I spend a number of years in a DP camp in Germany so that is a point of interest. Also, I went through The Basic School in “72. Thanks for the informative videos.
Personal verbal attacks in general should not be tolerated. But the next escalation step is threats of violence or of doxxing and eventual “cancelation”.
This is essentially what Mathis is threatening me with in this comment:
Many Jews actually loved Germany because it was so “civilized”, and those that stayed did right so right until the Judeo-wokeist-Communist take over of the last 15 years.
But mixed among those many Jews there are always evil nasty Jews that hate goyim and want to exploit their culture. Jews like Howard Stern, Sarah Silverman or Lenny Bruce are always vulgar and crude and continually debase those Christians that they live among, and who in reality they are the guests of. They also spread this crudeness and incivility around in the UR comments section.
This Andrew Mathis character wrote in an earlier comment “fuck civility”. He is a typical greasy, vulgar Jew of the kind that any other Jew claiming to be “good” should reject and boycott. Instead good Jews project blame back onto the goyim themselves for what vulgar Jews have done to European culture and even the comments sections at UR.
This entire argument rests on interpretation of turning the remainders of former Kingdom of Bohemia into Protektorat Böhmen und Mähren in 1939. If and only if Czechs asked for it, Hitler can be viewed as benign leader intending merely to unify German nation. On the other hand, if Reich swallowed Czechs against their will then other nations were justified in their opposition to further Hitler’s claims.
From what I have been told by my grandfather, old photographs, and from what can still be seen:
1. Czechs didn’t invite Germans
2. for sure we didn’t like being turned into Protektorat, effectively becoming second class citizens; bilingual inscriptions, German subtitles for movies, German as mandatory language taught in schools, plans to demolish important buildings in Prague related to Czech national identity
3. certain institutions like Gestapo were rather too active, and many people were jailed and executed; after Heydrich’s death terror ensued and entire villages were put to death
4. Heydrich himself had promised the nation partial assimilation and partial removal to Siberia
5. there are sufficient documents of how Soviet soldiers were greeted when they finally arrived, that alone should remove any doubts about the feelings of the nation
6. that and the treatment of Boehmers, now Germans remaining in Sudentenland, after the war
Put briefly, Hitler was more or less what his modern portrayal shows, dictator, demagogue, and destroyer of his own nation. He definitely intended to dominate Europe, especially eastern Europe, and obtain more “Lebensraum” for Germans by assimilation and removal of Slavic nations. There can be no doubt about that. That of course doesn’t mean Churchill, Roosevelt, or Stalin were nice guys.
> Only you did, in an attempt to rephrase my statement dishonestly.
You’re discounting the capacity of a smart politician to latch onto circumstances as they develop. Before Marinus van der Lubbe had set the Reichstag on fire, Hitler had already been on the lookout for some rationale to justify passing the Enabling Act. It had always been his intent to pass dictatorial powers for himself once he gained the Chancellorship. He just didn’t know in advance how or when he would do it. When van der Lubbe set the building on fire, Hitler reacted in such a well-calculated way that many people presumed that the whole must have been a premeditated plan on Hitler’s part. But it seems to have just been a case of latching onto circumstances as they developed.
Conversely, even if one wanted to give consideration to the possibility of Jewish groups having planned something around this in advance, one would still be forced to recognize that a lot of what they did just improvisation after the event. In particular, Grynszpan was enraged over the fact that his lawyer presented the whole thing as motivated by an alleged homosexual come-on from Ernst vom Rath. Gryspan had wanted it to be presented as a political act, The defense made was done against his wishes. These are the kinds of improvisations which happen when something has not been fully planned in advance.
But again, if a network of Jewish agents had been able to infiltrate their way across such a vast stretch of the Third Reich as Weckert implies, then Himmler would never have been promoted in the way that he was. The consolidation of power in Himmler’s hands which occurred after November 10, 1938, is only explicable under the assumption that Hitler himself saw no reason to believe Weckert’s thesis. Hitler was obviously satisfied with Himmler’s performance.
Of course Czechs didn’t invite the Germans, their president Hache did it on their behalf.
You can whine and moan about the bad Germans all you want but ask yourself this: Why did Mr Hache NOT go to Stalin, Poland, etc. and ask for help???
I use a VPN and often switch between servers all over the place, but for many videos I have to use a US server. Jews forcing censorship and mind control and generally doing their dastardly deeds all over the planet, its as old as the bible. I used the bitchute URL because Mr. Unz can scrape it and provide a preview image and that’s where I found it.
Video streamer services are a mixed bag, like search engines. Youtube sucks not only for the censorship, but also for all the advertising. I avoid Youtube and Google as much as possible. Boycott the Jew.
> Czechoslovakia was expressly created at Versailles to serve as a military buffer to Germany.
For that matter, so was Poland. Buffers are not an inherently hostile phenomenon. They very often help to keep peace. To the extent that there was anything to be criticized about the way that this particular buffer had been formed out of Versailles, the entire purpose of the Munich Pact was to rectify those critiques. Chamberlain made it clear that he did not think it worth going to war over the Sudetenland, and the French government supported him in this. The Munich Pact compromised all of the traditional defensive plans of the Czechoslovak state and left the remaining state open to being overrun by Germany at any time. This was no “dagger pointed at the heart of Germany” by any stretch.
As for Soviet aims, the USSR was always hindered by the fact that Soviet troops could do nothing to enter Czechoslovakia without the cooperation of Poland and/or Romania. Any statements out of Moscow about aligning with France against Germany over Czechoslovakia were just made with the hope of encouraging a Franco-German conflict. But there was really nothing much Stalin could have done, since any attempt by Soviet troops to cross Polish territory would have been resisted by the Poles.
Hitler’s aims were not defensive at all. It was the central part of his program to launch a drive for living space in which the Russian territory was seen as the main reward. Any willingness to deal with Poles or Czechs hinged on their own readiness to act as subordinates in Germany’s drive to the east.
Never saw Laibach live. They did play in Tokyo once, but I didn’t notice the publicity until some time after.
They are odd, I have an old videotape and a DVD, a few CDs, so have some idea of their original form.
They were agents provocateur in former Yugoslavia. I suspect money from DBR.
Early recordings, very industrial, somewhat militaristic. Not bad, if, as I do, one likes that sort of thing.
The original vox died, as did F.R.Y., then they began to be as now, sometimes a rougher take on Kraftwerk, sometimes amusing cover versions.
The German song you think of is by Opus, sub-Police-style reggae, covered by Laibach. You may really try listening to the original now, title Life is Life. Very Eurovision B-grade.
The cover by Laibach was pretty brilliant, the original, only amusing by contrast.
As for New Order, as with their parent band Joy Division, do you really want to imagine that the Third Reich’n’Roll allusions were accidental?
Also, how could you say they were unknown when the were based on Swingin’ Ian Curtis & the Joy Division?
I did see New Order live once, and never saw a poncier and more obnoxious bunch of posers in my life. Still, liked (past tense) a few of the singles.
Live, far too irritating.
Hácha only did what he had to. With German troops at the frontier (not behind mountains, but the new frontier established after 1938) there was no alternative. It’s the fact that he had to make such a choice which invalidates the main argument of the article, that Hitler wished merely to reunite Germans. His intentions was to dominate Europe and take large chunks of its eastern part. The only things in the article that are right: Churchill was a bum, Britons would have been better not to meddle in matters of the continent.
Quite contrary to what you think as a Czech I don’t whine and moan about WW2 at all. For a rather low costs – the payment was made mostly by Americans in dollars and in lives by Soviets – a huge German minority was removed from the territory. Though that’s not something the current Russo-phobia permits to perceive to most of the blokes here, that alone was a huge success. Especially since Germany seems to be on self-destruct course once again.
The SS was built up as the more sophisticated replacement for the SA. It was Crystal Night which completed that.
Actually, the article is also available on this website along with all the other IHR archives, which I added several years ago:
https://www.unz.com/pub/jhr__crystal-night-1938-the-great-anti-german-spectacle/
https://www.unz.com/publication/jhr/issues/
I try to bend over backwards to be fair, so I read it, but wasn’t very impressed.
Only a fraction of the article deals with who was actually responsible for the Kristallnacht riots, and most of the authors’s claims on other matters seem reasonably plausible. But the Kristallnacht evidence appears extremely thin, basically undocumented claims of “suspicious” or “strange” events. The suggestion seems to be that Jewish activists had so much secret power in 1938 Nazi Germany that they were able to manipulate portions of the SA into staging the riots without official orders. This seems extremely unlikely to me, basically the sort of “conspiracy theory” that only appeals to totally biased partisans.
As for a more plausible explanation, here’s an interesting sentence I found about half-way down:
I’d guess that Hitler probably had access to better information about what had really happened than than Ingrid Weckert, writing many decades later. And he believed that Goebbels had orchestrated the attacks, which was exactly what David Irving had concluded in his Goebbels book.
So on one side, we have Hitler and David Irving and on the other we have Ingrid Weckert. I think I’d go with the former.
> Beaty seemed like an honest enough guy
Military and government forces of all types have often adopted stances on issues that are determined strategically. In the 1980s, the Reagan administration supported an alliance of forces fighting the Vietnamese in which the Khmer Rouge were the leading element, despite their having US forces in the early 1970s. Since Beaty doesn’t actually make any real argument from historical data one way or another, his book is simply a political diatribe. Now sometimes such books may contain accurate assertions, even if one disagrees with the author on other things. But there’s no reason to think that the ADL would have somehow regarded Beaty’s book as something which needed a rebuttal from historians.
The ADL in 1951, when Beaty’s book appeared, would rather have been interested in helping the Truman administration accomplish its aims. Truman had shown himself to be very friendly towards the new Israeli state. In 1951, the main problem for Truman was to encourage the “economic miracle” in West Germany. Without that economic success story, the Cold War would have gone very differently. There also would have been no West German reparations paid to Israel if the economy hadn’t succeeded.
> Hitler magnanimously allowed these Brits to be rescued at Dunkirk
Wrong. He simply did not realize that Britain had chosen to make a retreat and was expecting a further fight. See David Irving, Hitler’s War, for more detail.
Sorry Che, my bad, bad memory. The band I saw in the central Leeds hotel basement was Depeche Mode not New Order. I never saw New Order live but vaguely knew them as they were associated with the Manchester Hacienda I used to frequent. They once came with Nico to my local pub and I had a few words with her without realising who she was. Only later I found out she was hanging out with New Order in town before she died in Ibiza.
OK Brosi, and thanks.
Mine was just a heads up to advise that anything “controversial ” posted on Bitch Yute will be censored in Europe.
Maybe I should get a VPN also.
What about the assassination of vom Rath? Is that so completely irrelevant? Are you saying that Goebbels had “instigated” or planned the both the event and the reaction? Or are you saying that Goebbels had the anti-Jewish pogrom cannon primed and loaded so that it could go off at any instant provided some random event happened at the right point in time?
It is clear to me that the actual terrorist assassination was timed and orchestrated like so many Judeo-Masonic assassinations across the 20th century. McKinley, Arch Duke Ferdinand, Gustloff, and even Lincoln, Ghadaffy, Hussein, Assad, Kennedy, and even Floyd, Traavon and King. We are now far wiser than we were 20 years ago. We know about projects like Gladio and MKUltra. We have seen all these gladio style fake psyop terror attacks spread like waves across the US. So now we know that was Judea just as capable of assassinating vom Rath in order to instigate the Kristallnacht “pogrom” as they were to have the Archduke assassinated in order to instigate WWI for Israel. Jews are famous for defacing Jewish graves and calling it anti-semitism. In this case they instigated the riots and once again called it anti-semitism.
So if we have to take a holistic view on the entire “pogrom” and the events leading up to it instead of just one night of typical Antifa/BLM violence in todays US of Wokeistan, it is clear that this is part of a far bigger plan than just “riots” and other chum for the US and other Judeo-Zionist newspapers to spread anti-German lies and portray once again the eternal Jewish victim.
So please explain why Goebbels had vom Rath assassinated. While you are at it you can also explain why Goebbels started the Reichstag fire and assassinated Gustloff. I am all ears.
Right.
Autobahn (full).
Vom Rath died a couple of days after having been shot, giving Goebbels plenty of time to prepare the attacks. He probably just took advantage of the opportunity as Irving argues, hoping that he could use the attacks to regain some of his influence in the Nazi leadership.
If Hitler thought Goebbels was guilty, why do you think you’re in a better position to say otherwise?
Some of the details of the Vom Rath shooting do seem quite suspicious, and Weckert might very well be correct that it was organized by Jewish activists rather than the action of a single angry individual. But there’s really no solid evidence one way or the other.
Conspiracy-activists endlessly focus on all sorts of complex conspiracies and severely damage their own credibility by doing so.
According to Francis Nicosia, “Raul Hilberg Distinguished Professor of Holocaust Studies at the University of Vermont,” (according to the endorsement on back of Nicosia’s Zionism and Anti-Semitism in Nazi Germany (2008), there were, not only, “Jewish activists . . . in 1938 Nazi Germany . . .,” there was active communication and collaboration between named German (i.e. Eichmann) and zionist (i.e. Feivel Polkes of Haganah) figures with a shared agenda: cause German Jews to leave Germany, preferably for Palestine.
On p. 116, Nicosia wrote:
{snip}
{snip}
Against the “formidable obstacle to Jewish emigration” of the “deeply-rooted, assimilationist character of the Jewish community and its attachment to Germany,” Germans monitored German-Jewish meetings and events, paying special attention to “non-zionist or anti-zionist Jewish organizations.”
By means of communications and meetings in Berlin (Feb. – Mar. 1937 & others) and in Haifa (October 1937 and others) between Eichmann and Polkes, who “claimed to hold an important position in the Haganah . . .the clandestine Jewish self-defense organization,” German security services [SD] hoped to gain insight into zionist plans, including identities of key figures behind the Jewish boycott of Germany;
For his part, Polkes hoped to use the Haganah- SD collaboration to drive a wedge between any possible German-Arab relationship; to so promote Jewish migration to Palestine as to achieve a Jewish majority; and other goals, to which end Polkes offered assistance “in securing petroleum resources for Germany in the region.”
As mentioned earlier, Nicosia’s book is source for knowledge that Haganah created Mossad le aliyeh bet — Committee for Illegal Immigration — Jewish activists throughout Europe whose function was to encourage and aid European (German) Jews to leave their German homes and, especially, to smuggle them across British barriers to migration into Palestine.
I cannot speak directly to other elements in your assertion: “that they had secret power;” “that they were able to manipulate portions of the SA into staging riots”, and to do that “without official orders,” but the exercise of pattern recognition might moderate some of these claims.
Many here agree, as I do, that David Irving is an extraordinarily valuable source for granular information on these controversial issues. But no single researcher or historian can cover all of the sources, witnesses, documents and data, one more reason that this “alternative media selection” and its sometimes rambunctious commentariat is critically important.
That is just more equivocation from you. Hitler knew how to exploit events to his benefit, so that means he was complicit in a riot which was extremely harmful to his government? This is your main thrust to prove he or the NSDAP was involved with this thing?
Grynzpan gave six versions. None of them truthful. His counsel from LICA (the French ADL), the same character involved after the murder of Wilhelm Gustloff, showed up at the police station before news of the shooting became public. His office is also likely where the destitute beggar Grynszpan got 250 francs to buy a gun. And they did a hell of a job for him too, these top of the line lawyers. They influenced the Germans to treat him well, and after 7 comfortable years in captivity, this cold blooded murderer was released with the privilege of early retirement to Israel on a generous BRD pension.
Hitler blamed the SA and Goebbels. To him, the guy who helped put things back into order was Heinrich Himmler. The SA was duly reprimanded and would soon become incorporated into the army. Goebbels was out of favor for years. Hitler may be mad at Goebbels, but he is not going to cashier a skilled propagandist when at the same time Julius Streicher is on the NSDAP payroll, lampooning Jews to comical extremes with his Andrew Anglin style periodical.
Most of the facts about this event only came out after the war, when the West German Government attempted to prosecute persons in connection to it. The testimony from those trials remove some of the veil. The aforementioned clandestine telephone orders and mysterious agent provocateurs. Also The Gauleiters, present with Goebbels when the latter supposedly held his fiery speech calling them to action against the Jews, all testify that their first order of business was to call their locales and put a stop to the disturbances. Witnesses close to Goebbels say his immediate reaction was embarrassment on behalf of some of his party comrades. True to his elitist, doctoral self. Yet the Goebbels “diary” presents a completely different impression. Here Goebbels is a Hollywood cartoon character, relishing in the chaos, ordering Jews to be beaten up and synagogues burned down. Raving on as if in an apparent state of unhinged ecstasy. And all of this comes from a Soviet archival copy without originals, the contents of which has yet to be released to the public in full.
Considering the mountain of fakery and hoaxing that constitutes WW2 documents and testimony, I think we can safely and prudently throw this particular argument on the dustbin of history. Particularly when literally all the other evidence and motivation point in a completely different direction.
I would assert that the planning and implementation of this simultaneous and spontaneous uprising across Germany within 24 hours would be beyond even Goebbels. There is also proof in a centuries old MO, or pattern of how this syndicate operates. What the Jews were doing to the NSDAP and Hitler was little different from what the Jews did to the Tsar and his court from 1905-1917.
These “riots” have a strange habit of occurring at the most inopportune, or opportune, points in time. The recent days of protest in France saw thousands of cars get torched and hundreds of small businesses destroyed for basically nothing more than a nudge. Color revolutions sprout up all over the planet, and we all know that the same parties have been instigating them long before Allende or the Shah. Smedley Butler told us what the US military had been up to since the US Civil War. We can even see how CIA and other foreign agents can create scandals in the US today, just take the Trump “dossier” as an example.
One thing is certain: the German people were furious with Judeo-Communism, they knew precisely what the communists were up to in Spain and what they had done to Russia and what they had tried to pull off in Germany in 1919. So why is it that so often critical goyim leader get assassinated by Jews or their co-conspirators at critical junctions in history? How is it that they so often get away with it?
It is easier for me to believe that the vom Rath assassination and the Riots were a planned operation (psyop) rather than 2 nearly random but highly dependent events that everyone admits was such a blow to the NSDAP.
what about Germany-Austria? hyperbole does not an argument make, nor are irrelevant and extreme examples… Germany-Austria makes sense for the analogy.
they were in Bohemia, an ancient territory. Czechs were living in so-called Sudetenland, why weren’t they given the Right to secede in their towns/houses? how microscopic do we allow secession? my own grandfather was studying architecture at University in so-called Sudetenland, a school which closed upon its takeover by Germany – he was forced to study in German, or leave. so much for those minority Rights the Germans cried about. no German school ever closed by Czech authorities, and the first German school closed on Czech territory was closed by the Poles after taking Zaolzie allied with the Germans (how ironic).
they weren’t oppressed. they weren’t allowed to secede, but that is not oppression. would Germany today allow the Turks to secede? so-called Sudetenland was a place where Czechs and Germans both lived for centuries, and the Czechs allowed that to continue. the Germans, after the takeover, were the ones to cease this, so they were the oppressors.
a divorce opposed by the majority of the populations, a decision made by politicians. something like 2/3 of each nation opposed it. the 1/3 on either side usually have opposing arguments why it was good: the Czechs “we gave them too much” and the Slovaks “they took too much.”
Addendum
Weckert wrote this about a talk she had with David Irving in 1992:
A good example that Irving writes what he wants to believe.
Online the only diaries you can get from Goebbels begin in 1939. Here are some excerpts where he uses the word Jew:
October 14, 1939
October 17, 1939
October 24, 1939
November 3, 1939
November 19, 1939
January 7, 1940
Contrast these to the relevant Soviet derived entry on November 10, 1938
Apart from the crudeness of language so common when the allied forging team try to mimick high IQ individuals in the Nazi Government, there are obvious problems with this entry.
The first paper trail leading to Hitler is the order he issued at about 1pm on the night of the riots, demanding that all disturbances be quelled immediately. That is in direct contrast to what this diary entry purports.
Goebbels as Propaganda Minister and Gauleiter of Berlin does not have the authority to order the SA, the SS, the Gestapo or other Gauleiters around. They would certainly take offense at any attempts to abrogate their authority in this way. It makes no sense for Hitler to give such an order to Goebbels.
After Goebbels made his speech, the other party leaders testify that they made calls to quell the riots. The recipients of these calls confirm the story. If Goebbels was attempting to rile them up to violent action he evidently failed spectacularly.
Another problem is the supposed timing of this. Goebbels alleged fiery speech was held on the 9th, but the first reports about disturbances were already coming in on the 8th.
Stosstropp Hitler is an odd term. The official unit going by that name last saw action in 1924, becoming defunct when Hitler reconstituted the party in the aftermath of the failed Putsch.
Julius Streicher left the party early because he was feeling ill and retired to Nuremberg. He could not have had any talks with Goebbels that evening.
Why does Goebbels claim to try and save a synagogue from burning?
That he was shot ONE DAY before the critical decision on Palestine (whether to, in light of the Arab revolt against increasing Jewish immigration and the prospects of a permanent Jewish state along side an Arab one, curtail further Jewish settlement and moves toward that state) is not proof that it was done by Zionist elements, but it makes the case more likely.
Another false comparison. At Versailles Germany was denied all forms of effective national defense. Only allowed a skeleton Reichswehr force of 100,000 men, with light weapons only. Czechoslovakia was created as a gun to Germany’s head. Spearheading far into their heartland, with a large army and willing partners, completely opening them to invasion and aerial bombardment. A purpose that was spoken about quite openly in official circles.
Hitler managed to force a peaceful compromise to this situation at Munich, but this only created further problems. The four powers all agreed to guarantee borders when the situation became normalized. What transpired instead is that Poland grabbed Teschen, and in an attempt to keep rebellious Slovaks and Ruthenians under control, the Czech government cracked down hard, inviting bitter ire. Stalin was as usual offering “to help”, but everybody knew what that meant. Poland and Hungary were looking on like vultures. The artificial Czechoslovakian rump state was disintegrating. Slovakia declared independence and aligned themselves with Hitler. Ruthenia would also appeal to Germany for aid, but Hitler declined this free springboard into the Ukraine and left them to be gobbled up by Hungary. The Poles were somewhat perturbed to be denied further territory, but in general happy to see an enemy state succumb.
When the Wehrmacht entered into Czechia it had nothing to do with any plans for lebensraum to the East. It had everything to do with the geopolitical situation as it was on the ground and the failure of Versailles and the Western powers who had created the situation in the first place. Without any allies or any support the natural choice for the Czechs was to align themselves to somebody. This Hitler took advantage of and got rid of the dreaded “aircraft carrier” that could at any moment be put into use by either France, Stalin or Britain, and the Czechs were mostly content not to be left to an even worse fate.
The treatment of Czechia during the protectorate belie any lebensraumish intent on part of the Germans, nor does the voluntary relinquishment of Ruthenian territory. In contrast it speaks of a defensive intent, abstaining from excessive or opportunistic moves.
This should not be surprising. Nearly all the murders of Jews took place on territory later occupied by the Soviet Union. More than half the killings took place in the Aktion Reinhardt death camps, far behind what became the Iron Curtain. The mass shootings by the Einsatzgruppen also took place on Polish or Soviet territory. Jews from Western Europe were transported to Auschwitz, itself in Poland, either as workers or for extermination. When America and its Western allies conquered Western Germany and the occupied countries to its West, they did not find death camps, although they found and liberated several concentration camps on German territory. There is no reason why American officers, focused on winning the war, would have become aware of events that had taken place hundreds of miles to the East, and as much as two years before they themselves were fighting the Germans.
Austria was never part of Germany until March 1938. It was separated from Germany in 1945 The earlier customs union was just that, a customs union.
Germany was a linguistic ethnic conglomeration of as many as 300 kingdoms dukedoms baronies independent cities monastic territories all under the sovereign Holy Roman Emperor of Austria. At the time of unification, 1871 Prussia imposed unification or Prussian rule on 39 linguistic ethnic German entities.
From 800 AD to 1866 AD the separate countries that unified to become Germany were under the rule of Austria the Holy Roman Empire. Austria ruled the hundreds of Germanic entities.
Look, the whole thing happened 85 years ago and there’s no way a present-day analyst can be sure of the cause. But according to Weckert, the attacks were carried out by SA groups often operating outside the normal chain of command. I’m extremely skeptical that any network of Jewish activists had widespread control over SA groups all across 1938 Nazi Germany.
Personally, I thought David Irving’s analysis implicating Goebbels seemed quite persuasive when I read it a year or so ago, but let’s leave that aside. Hitler had absolute authority over all the security and investigative services in Nazi Germany and given the disastrous consequences of the riots, it’s difficult to believe that he made no effort to figure out what had really happened. And according to Weckert, Hitler believed that Goebbels had instigated the riots.
I think it’s rather presumptuous for any of us living in 2023 America to believe he can come up with a better understanding of what had really happened in 1938 Germany Hitler had done at the time.
It’s really a matter of definition, but I tend to disagree.
Austria and the rest of Germany had spent about a thousand years together as parts of the Holy Roman Empire. Admittedly, the Empire was politically decentralized and somewhat loosely run, but during nearly all of that time, all the inhabitants owed ultimate allegiance to the same ruler. So I think all the Austrians and Germans during those centuries would have regarded themselves as common citizens of the Empire.
In fact, during many of those centuries, that German unity might have been tighter than that in France, since some of the French provinces owed allegiance to the English king or were otherwise hostile enemies of the French king.
The Soviet Union was our ally – wouldn’t they have informed the U.S., and the world, of all mass murders of Jews committed by the Germans in Eastern Europe? The Soviet people weren’t aware of the Holocaust at the time the Iron Curtain fell in the 1990s, which is odd if the events constituting the Holocaust took place in Soviet territory.
Also, the Holocaust story was widely accepted in the 1970s in America, and the intelligence officers continued to not believe in it through that period. What good evidence did Holocaust scholars have that these officers didn’t have?
this is getting better and better, Ron Unz is a treasure. As I’m getting into the urgency of the situation I’m reminded of the subtitle of Hannah Arendt’s book on Eichmann: THE BANALITY OF EVIL. What apt words for the situation in the Ukrayne.
did you not read the article. America was MIRED in economic troubles prior to her Heroic entry in WW2. Argentina did not participate in the war and subsequent rebuilding of Europe effort and it’s paying the price to this day. in fact the one company/family of Argentina that did participate in the Marshall Plan by selling portland cement to tastelessly rebuild the incinerated historic towns is now very wealthy and a patron of the arts. Argentina would ve a rich country if more than a single conpaby had had the chance to participate in the industrial-economic project of the century.
No, you should read my remarks a little more carefully. Nearly half the text in question focuses on the early post-war years, and I think after the 1946 Nuremberg Trials, American Intelligence officers could hardly have failed to be aware of what we now call the “Holocaust.” Indeed, we know that very soon after the fighting ended, OSS agents were constructing fake gas chambers in Dachau and other concentration camps in Germany.
Moreover, I emphasized that Bendersky’s book heavily mined the personal archives of those officers, providing quotes from their letters and diaries written as late as the 1970s, long after the Holocaust had attained considerable visibility.
Yet Bendersky includes not a single mention of the Holocaust from any of his 100 generals and Military Intelligence officers anywhere in his book although he focuses entirely upon their views on Jewish issues.
I think it’s absolutely certain that they did occasionally refer to the Holocaust during all those decades, but Bendersky deliberately excluded all their statements. The very likely reason he did so was that they all ridiculed the Holocaust as a ridiculous hoax, just as their former colleagues Beaty and Oliver had written in their books.
What is not said and is regularly hidden is that it was the land of the native Serbs, which the Germans were capturing for hundreds of years, and they themselves were expelled and Germanized. The Limes Sorabicus established by Charlemagne shows that the Vandals (Wends), the Prussians, the Pomeranians, Polabians, the Kashubs, most of Austria and all of Eastern Germany were Serbian.
It can be seen that there was also Berlin, which was founded and named by the Serbs in the 6th century and where the Germans came only in the 12th century. Even the dynastic houses of Mecklenburg and Hohenzollern are of Serbian origin. Pictured is Niklot (at Schwerin Castle), the progenitor of the House of Mecklenburg, the longest ruling dynasty in Europe from 1167-1918 in their region (2nd map).
The ethnic Germans were being oppressed. Learn some facts instead of displaying your own biases.
” Jews were transported to Auschwitz for extermination… ”
Why waste the price of a train ticket on them? Why not shoot them on the spot? Your thesis is full of bull. Jews of all ages were fed and housed and kept alive at Auschwitz. Those who could work worked. Mostly in the adjacent rubber factory. Auschwitz was a labour camp, not a death camp or extermination camp. Take your Hasbara nonsense to Finkelstein’s pawn shop in Schlep St Tel Aviv. You might get a shekel for it.
The same Talmudic tribe who always divides the populace in a manner that prevents them from uniting together against the parasitic take over also uses this same technique in manipulating both the news and history. I wonder whether Ilya Ehrenburg was involved in the creation of this “diary”?
#340 Zane
“Czechoslovakia. Was an artificial country created after WW1 by the victors (…)”
Why you did’t mention that Germany was artificial country created by Prussians just 40 years earlier – in 1871 year?
Before that date, territory of modern Germany was divided in over 300 separated counties, duchies, cities etc. usually hostile each other.*
Not to mention, that in 1866 (just 5 years before unification of Germany with “Blood and Iron”)** German-speaking Prussia attacked German-speaking Austria.
Since 1871 it took only 70 years when patchwork Austria dissipated into many independent nations and Germany lost half of it’s territory due to TWO WORLD WARS which they provoked.
Well done, Germans.
Germans have no talent to build healthy nation.
——
* “Estimates of the total number of German states at any given time during the 18th century vary, ranging from 294 to 348[2] or more. “
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kleinstaaterei
** https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blood_and_Iron_(speech)
They did — the Red Army captured Majdanek in July 1944, well before Auschwitz (January 1945) — they exploited some of the unpleasant scenes they found (of course there were some), including in the camp crematoria — they put on a propaganda show for the media to accuse the Germans of atrocities, including mass murder — some believe this is why the Germans decided to destroy the crematoria at Birkenau before the Red Army arrived — so as not to give the Soviets another chance to put on a similar show.
The Soviets held a brief trial starting in late Nov 1944 — six Germans were convicted, and executed the day after the verdict — the whole business took only about one week.
Later at the IMT the Soviet prosecution claimed the Germans murdered 1.5m people at Majdanek — today it is generally conceded that well under 100k people died there during the entire history of the camp, and Majdanek was not a ‘death camp’ where the Germans committed mass murder — albeit today it still says in Wikpedia that when captured Majdanek was ‘the best preserved example of a Holocaust death camp’, and had ‘intact gas chambers’.
I guess you could call this the case of the dog that didn’t bark while alive . . . but then started barking like mad once it was dead and buried–at the command of Hilberg, Lipstadt and the ADL.
The information about FDR, Churchill, and pre-war politics is more persuasive.
N.B. in Europe Bitchute blocks the first of the David Irving lectures linked in the article (whether embedded in this page or viewed directly in Bitchute). It tells us:
OK, so this article is more or less a no-brainer ref the Jewish bloodbath in Ukraine (yes, yet another Jewish bloodbath) for the growing numbers who gain awareness of the “hidden” forces controlling world events in the west.
It’s useful for the $ amounts, as westerners queue at food banks for a handout, or live in the street in USA, also for where the $billions go, and for the sadly still high, though declining, numbers still supporting this ongoing disaster.
You might think abt sending it to any such that you know.
https://www.rt.com/russia/579897-europes-black-hole-ukraine/
I had several comments posted in a Steve Sailer thread a little while ago – all hard hitting comments* that pretty much eviscerated the Holohoax fraud.
(*Said comments contained no abuse, no slurs against Sailer or anyone else. There was no vulgarity or profanity contained therein etc).
But ADL affiliated Sailer, after I inquired as to whether my comments were likely to come out of moderation before the 2024 election, then responded by deleting them completely.
Ron, how is it that you allow this bought-and-paid-for minion [Steve Sailer] of the Holohoax industry, to do what he does ?
It’s not just me that he’s been doing this to. Several other individuals, that I am aware of, have likewise been treated this way by this enemy of free speech.
Ernst Zündel gets into the Haavara agreement:
Video Link
Germany was already making great strides in incentivizing the Jewish departure from Germany. They were trying to establish themselves as the Herrenvolk, better than the other Europeans in all ways, including matters of honor and morality.
It was the Judeo-Communists and Zionists who wanted a “pogrom” to create panic among European Jews.
I think you might be confusing Neville Chamberlain with Stalin.
I liked your comment and excellent appraisal of the treacherous British, coupled with the traitorous Winston ‘Spendthrift’ Churchill.
But I have to correct you on this one thing you mentioned:
In fact, this deceit was not in relation to the D-Day landing at Normandy, but in relation to the upcoming landing in Sicily from those Allied forces that had just wrapped up the North African campaign.
The plan entailed releasing a corpse with a fictional identity off the coast of Spain, where strong currents will carry it ashore near where a known German agent operates. The non-existent Royal Marine courier, Major William Martin, would appear to be a plane crash victim carrying documents about an upcoming Allied invasion of German-occupied Greece, rather than Sicily, the more obvious target.
The name of the film appears in the poster below:
Hitler, in many exchanges with his advisers, never wavered from his opinion that the Allied invasion in the west would land at NORMANDY.
But his advisers (not least of whom was the head of the Abwehr, the traitorous Admiral Wilhelm Canaris), insisted that the invasion would come through Calais.
So, against his better judgement, Hitler reinforced his forces and defences in that region.
Well you would – seeing as you’re an apologist for the crimes of Malevolent International Jewry.
It’s fair enough that you’d say that if Jews are being blamed for egregious crimes they did NOT perpetrate – and you have PROOF that Jews weren’t the masterminds.
If you do, then by all means please show it to us.
But if, for example, the absolute DELUGE of evidence suggests that the Zionist Usury Banking Cartel (aka ZOG), orchestrated the JFK coup d’etat, the 9/11 False Flag, the Anthropogenic Global Warming Fraud, invented the Holohoax fable, perpetrated the Covid Psyop and much more besides (and the forensic evidence emphatically DOES indeed suggest that), then we should call a spade a spade.
Of course, said crimes were committed by a small sliver of obscenely rich and depraved Zionist Jews, so this is no reflection on rank and file Jews like yourself.
Ron Unz can see that for what it is and calls it out as such, because he’s a righteous Jew.
I mean, if I say Michael Chertoff, Larry Silverstein, Dov Zakheim and Philip Zelikow were implicated in the 9/11 False Flag (if not in its actual perpetration, then at least in the cover up that followed), then why should you be offended by that statement ?
FFS, it’s not as though I’m calling your mother a whore.
No more than other goys are offended if I were to say that Dick Cheney was front and centre involved in this heinous crime. Everyone agrees that Cheney was deeply implicated and should swing from a lamp post as a result.
So Little Jonny, quit moaning and start encouraging your fellow small hats in your social circle to join the crusade with the other righteous Jews, and expose those that are bringing death and despair to the world – irrespective of what tribe the criminals belong to.
What you have raised is worthy of a pair of week long conferences. All the pros and cons deserve attention and checking we beyond what is to be found on or associated with UR . There is of course a possibility that Hoess’s memoir was fakedor designed to protect his family. But nothing on UR settles that.
A relatively new point for me is the building of fake gas chambers at Dachau etc. Not a problem for the Holocaust believers because the crypto Coms throughout the US government and services would happily have done it to help poison US-German relations. It occurs to me that the silence of those you suggest would have been heard on the subject may well have been explained by their being well aware of the fakery and been unwilling to risk playing into games they didn’t fully understand got up by people they weren’t predisposed to trust – like Jewiish Communists.
On the faking of gas chambers you refer to OSS agents doing it which seems to add a detail to be investigated because it would be interesting to know how corrupted that predecessor to the CIA was, and by whom, in whose interests. Anything known about the OSS And its personnel and activit⁹ies at the time?
Allow me to take the opportunity to post a link to a couple of essays by the distinguished highly Anglophile Chilean historian, one of the world’s great networkers and a vigorous and productive 93 years old tomorrow.
The first one I discovered with pleasure on the Quadrant online website a piece about Wellington and the “croakers” that I remember taking issue with at the time for being far too indulgent towards George W. Bush and his misadventures but I see now might also raise your hacklesover his conventionally heroic view of the much slandered Churchill. I also link, unread his recent detour into Ukraine where I suspect he may concentrate his attention on nationalism in contrast to the targeted anti Russian views of his and my friend, also an ex professor whom I normally identify as the only Westerner to have given and MBA course in the Soviet Union (in Kyiv in 1990 or 91).
https://quadrant.org.au/magazine/2009/04/george-bush-and-history-s-croakers/
and
I’m having to sort out logins and will return. Please let me know if you cannot read the auricle linked above.
Actually what was at the time colloquially known as the War Refugee Board Report, today often called Vrba-Wetzler Report (its authors were unknown or anonymous back then) circulated in American government circles in 1944 — it contained the gist of the extermination allegations about Auschwitz, i.e. that Jews were being deliberately murdered in gas chambers — but there was considerable skepticism about it — Butz covers this in The Hoax of the Twentieth Century.
But it was introduced as evidence at the IMT (‘document Number L-22, Exhibit USA-294’) — however I don’t think it played a very prominent role in establishing the planned mass murder of Jews as one of the ‘crimes against humanity’.
There I think the Höss Affidavit was much more important — curiously, and what most people don’t know, is that Höss was not called as a witness by the prosecution — they just submitted his affidavit — he did testify, but only because one of the defense counsel, I think for Kaltenbrunner, requested it — I assume this was to deflect blame from Kaltenbrunner, although I haven’t read the transcript or listened to the testimony of Höss.
Vrba eventually settled in Canada — he appeared as a witness during the first Zündel trial.
I don’t think Sailer has much interest in the ‘Holocaust’, so you ought to think twice about trying to post comments about it there (especially since articles specifically about the ‘Holocaust’ are not exactly rare here on the UR) — and I have no problem with Unz publishing him — but yeah, spread the word about Steve Sailer.
i gave you facts, and you responded with nothing but waaa and projection. pathetic.
Well, all I did was provide a few short extracts from the long articles I’d published back in 2018 and 2019, which you obviously never bothered reading at the time, although they’re attracted enormous traffic and nearly 600,000 words of comments:
https://www.unz.com/runz/american-pravda-holocaust-denial/
https://www.unz.com/runz/american-pravda-secrets-of-military-intelligence/
You’d be wrong to think that. Sailer interjected OFTEN in the commentary – invariably to defend the official B.S narrative of ‘gas chambers/6 million dead’.
I mean, he was defending it like he had a dog in that race.
Sailer doesn’t generally post articles that relate to the Holohoax.
But when he titles an article ‘Could the U.S. Have Stopped the Holocaust?’, then we can safely assume it has something to do with the Holohoax.
This is the actual article if you’d like to peruse it:
https://www.unz.com/isteve/could-the-u-s-have-stopped-the-holocaust-no-because-it-was-mostly-over-by-the-end-of-1942/
Needless to say, said article attracted a a swarm of commentary (approaching 1000 comments – ten times more than his average article attracts).
Most of the commentary was from Zio apologists and rabid Zionists, or at least it seemed that way as many comments from people with objective data on this fraud were likely muzzled.
That said, most of my comments were eventually released from moderation (often after several days – a trick Steve Sailer employs, which entails that most readers have moved on after I seemingly did not respond to their false statements, and the comment count had moved on by another 150-200 or so, and thus no one scrolled back several days to see what I wrote).
You see, if I post a comment on a Monday, if Sailer ends the moderation period three or four days later, it does not appear as a fresh comment on Thurs or Fri.
It is BACK DATED to the Monday when I posted it.
So UR readers, be aware that Steve Sailer is bought-and-paid-for by the Zio lobby.
This is the depths to which he has stooped to appease his yarmulke wearing benefactors.
I wrote on this at some length here:
“Notre Dame des Fascistes: Gertrude Stein, Bernard Faÿ, & the Joy of Collaboration”
https://counter-currents.com/2020/08/notre-dame-des-fascistes-1/
“Germany” did not exist until 1871.
The Austrian Empire ruled many entities of Germanic peoples. And Slavic French Italian and Spanish and S American people’s (Carlos 6). Austria was always a nation separate from the other German Italian Slavic and Spanish entities it ruled as part of its Empire.
Thanks There’s a new film on Netflix operation mincemeat dozens of books British movies and TV shows and now a new movie. Endless celebrations of the slaughterhouse.
>You’d be wrong to think that.
No, I don’t think so — Sailer himself has little interest in the ‘Holocaust’, as you can see from a search for the word sorted by date — the word appears maybe half a dozen times a year (if that) in what he writes — I don’t care about the comments under his posts — anyway, my objection to Sailer has nothing to do with whether he writes about the ‘Holocaust’, or what his opinions about it are — nor how he handles comments (you’re not the first I’ve seen complain about that).
>This is the actual article if you’d like to peruse it:
No thanks — Sailer is a faggot and I pay zero attention to him — not even to mock him, which I used to do occasionally when he put up yet another hand-wringing post about black ghetto homicide.
But Germany after 1871 also contained large numbers of Polish Slavs and other non-Germanic peoples, just as France contained a certain number of Germans and Italians.
Meanwhile, the formal name of the Holy Roman Empire, which contained Austria and all the German states, had been “the Holy Roman Empire of the German Nation.”
So it’s obviously a matter of definition, but I think it’s perfectly reasonable to say that all the German states and Austria had been united for about a thousand years in a single political entity.
Yes, Bitchute complies with all censorship requests from European governments, Germany and France being the most aggressive (despite that, they are still harassed) — as you see in your example, typically if a channel posts any content at all that’s deemed to ‘incite racial hatred’, the entire channel is blocked, i.e. regardless of how harmless the content of other videos on that channel is (I’ve never seen an exception to this, anyway) — but there are websites you can use to download Bitchute videos — just put in the Bitchute URL there, and afterward you can watch the video on your device.
See this 2017 article by yours truly, please — https://jan27.org/the-two-fake-documents-upon-which-the-auschwitz-gas-chamber-myth-rests/
What needed to be understood was understood from the beginning. “The Holocaust” is a hoax from 1944 till now; there is not any truth to it to be salvaged, in spite of the efforts to transfer it from Auschwitz to the very small transit camps further east. End of discussion.
The only positive steps from this point is to call it out, not drag it out with endless “discussion.”
Caution, imbecile at work.
Wow. You met Nico? If you didn’t realise who she was, she must have been less of a junky than I had thought. Sure, I like many of her songs.
As for Depeche Mode (naming themselves for a French fashion mag., ugh), I can’t see how you could mistake them for N.O., but I never saw a D.M. show either. Like some of the electropop, suppose when they started pretending to have a deep political message (one good song), the confusion is understandable.
Closest I’ve ever been to Manchester and the Hacienda was seeing 24-Hour Party People once, N.O. was near the centre of the film at times, I can’t recall, but think N.O. members played themselves.
The best part, and doubtless cut now, was two or three from the Stone Roses feeding rat poison to pigeons on a rooftop, I like pigeons too much to approve, but it was a funny scene!
Thank you. I love Kraftwerk, but it is good that you post it, educational for others.
If you are curious about Laibach, their closest approach to Kraftwerk style in sound was in much of their recording Kapital, much (not all) is influenced by Kraftwerk style.
Kraftwerk, AFAIK, has not dared to release a new song since the not much good bicycle-race anthem Tour de France, videos, sure, Laibach adapted a cut-rate version of that video style too, for a little time.
Just a “kissing cousin” comment which is parallel to this discussion:
I guess June 20th isn’t the day the 2nd seal opens, I guess no world war III is around the corner, and I guess our Snare Drummer ZelenskY isn’t the antichrist after all.
Yes, thanks Che.
Remember Kraftwerk back in the day, others also you/Mike mention, interesting and talented but for me a passing fancy. Cocteau Twins etc. Now have a sort of sympathy for Anja Huwe and Xmal Deutschland re all that weird incubus succubus etc stuff, thinking the damage done to Germans with holofraud false guilt … Maybe misplaced sympathy. Dunno.
Soon after this, left for Asia and it was all left far behind.
In Tokyo I reunited with my first musical love, Baroque, when walking through a large building in Shinjuku and hearing Antonio Vivaldi “Four Seasons” for the first time in years, piped through the public system. Magic. Beauty. Logic. Joy.
Occasionally tune in to other, and your post was a welcome reminder.
Thanks.
We all know Jews were the biggest per capita mass murderers of the 20th century. They must be in the lead for the 21st century title, because of their extremely high representation among American neocons, who set in motion the war in Ukraine and the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq before that.
Jews in traditional media and on social media are very bloodthirsty regarding the current Ukraine war. They and Zelensky really want the war to continue until there’s no Ukrainian nation left to put up a fight.
I just noticed that my recent Holocaust writings had prompted a mainstream Substacker named Brian Mowrey to publish a massive six-part discussion of the Holocaust that runs nearly 20,000 words.
https://unglossed.substack.com/p/transed-and-nationless-the-post-hitler
https://unglossed.substack.com/p/introduction-to-the-post-60s-holocaust
https://unglossed.substack.com/p/the-forgetting-of-the-holocaust
https://unglossed.substack.com/p/american-awakening-recalling-the
https://unglossed.substack.com/p/reflections-on-a-gilded-age
https://unglossed.substack.com/p/the-new-improved-sacrifice-society
Although he’s cautious about taking any explicit positions, he certainly seems to view the standard narrative with a rather skeptical eye, and includes quite a number of additional issues new to me.
Ron Unz:
“I think it’s perfectly reasonable to say that all the German states and Austria had been united for about a thousand years in a single political entity. ”
The Germans themselves certainly didn’t think so.
Napoleon certainly didn’t think so.
The attendees of the Congress of Vienna didn’t think so.
Citizens who were banned in one state and had to seek refuge in another German state certainly didn’t think so.
The prosecutors and victims of the Thirty Years’ War certainly didn’t think so.
This statement is absurd on its face.
Perhaps you meant to say “cultural entity” (united by German language).
They were not united.
By posting this, RU is clearly on the side of “dragging the holohoax out with endless discussion.” See my comment #411.
That explains why the Holocaust story could be imprinted on a credulous American public. In the 60s, there wasn’t a coherent narrative of U.S. entry into the European theater of World War II. We allied with the Soviets, who were clearly bad. We fought against the Nazis, who were attempting to repel the Soviets from Europe. As a result of Allied victory, the Soviets ended up bringing half of Europe into their sphere of influence.
But the story of Nazi extermination of millions of innocent Jews makes the U.S.’s siding with the Soviets and not the Nazis make sense. And the updated World War II narrative with the Holocaust story included places the white American people in the hero’s role, at a time when they were playing the role of villain in the domestic black civil rights saga as portrayed in the media.
This is in the IHR talk (what you call the article) which you read, but not in the English-language version of the book, which I have and reviewed in 7 parts early last year at cy.net. I don’t find anything like that in her book, maybe someone else can. It was published in 1991, after the IHR talk in 1985, and now out of print or unavailable. Why the discrepancy in saying what Hitler thought? Was she throwing that sentence out there for the benefit of David Irving, who was likely in attendance at the conference?
Methinks you put too much weight on that single sentence.
Weckert writes on page 142 of Flashpoint:
AAMOF I haven’t yet read the June 10 article.
So what? There are only 24 hours in a day.
However, in this article, your first mention of Beaty is actually in a long excerpt from your previous article, “As mentioned earlier, Beaty . . . ” A good editor would have saved you from this editorial slip and silly assumption that readers plowing through 9,700 words of text should plow through additional thousands of words to search for info on who Beaty was.
Molehill >> Mountain.
Of far greater interest to me is the idea that Hitler never gave any instructions for the destruction of the Jews. To me the answer seems quite clear, and is contained in the Wannsee Protocol. I had never actually read this document. Here it is in both English and German:
https://avalon.law.yale.edu/imt/wannsee.asp
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/37/Wannsee_Protokoll_januar_1942.pdf
It clearly mandates the destruction of all Jews, “restlos” — completely, totally, without exception.
Hitler did not personally attend the Wannsee Conference, where the plan for the final solution to the Jewish problem was presented. However, the preparation of the plan was ordered by Reichsmarschall Goering. I very much doubt that Goering ordered such a sweeping plan, a final solution to the persistent stil-festering problem of the Jews, which earlier measures had not completely solved (even though hundreds of thousands of Jews had been induced to leave Germany), without discussing this with Hitler. In particular because military aspects were involved.
One interesting point in the document concerns the connection between military results in the east and the execution of the plan, which was to cleanse Germany and all conquered and associated territories of Jews. “Restlos.”
The basic plan that was outlined in the Protocol was followed (although the “Evakuierungen” were by train, not on foot).
Another interesting point is the tension already evident in the statements various ministers made in this document between the German economy’s need for labor and the completion of the final solution. This tension became sharper as the war progressed and explains the dual purpose of Auschwitz. As a source of labor for IG Farben at Monowitz (Auschwitz II) and as a site of the final solution. Snyder, in The Encyclopedia of the Third Reich, has an good entry on IG Farben and its centrality to the German and Reich economy, in which he mentions the Auschwitz plant. (This encyclopedia is a great desk resource and endlessly interesting to browse. Snyder was a scholar who had studied and written his doctorate in Germany, was not (AFAIK) Jewish, was not affiliated with any Jewish or government orgs that have a definite “Holocaust” slant (like the online Holocaust Museum resources). He provides a hell of a lot of information, tables, photos, sources, etc. Some of his books may be candidates for being made available at TUR.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louis_Leo_Snyder)
Another interesting point that arises from a reading of the actual Wannsee Protocal is the frequent mentions of Endloesgung der Judenfrage,the “final solution of the Jewish Question” —not just “Endloesung” alone. There are references to “other solutions” tried out since 1933, and 1939, that have not worked—there are still a few Jews left in Germany. Hence the need for a “final solution”—die Endloesung, introduced as “another possible solution.” Furthermore, the occupation of Poland and the establishment of the General Gouvernment there has expanded the scope of “the problem,” and the local Polish authorities want quick action. Unfortunately, other governments appear to be dragging their feet, specifically Hungary. The final solution plan may have to be forcibly imposed on them (aufoktroyieren, a very forceful word).
The Protocol is replete with euphemistic terms. Such euphemisms should not be taken to mean that no orders for the destruction of the Jews were given from the very summit of the Nazi hierarchy. Nazi rhetoric is full of such coded formulations, often starting with “Sonder,” “special.” The real meanings are obvious. The need for caution is also obvious. These fellows were well aware that they had to proceed carefully. After all it was a state conspiracy, mainly under the leadership of the SS (check out the perfectly typed German document—no typos!!–with the special SS typewriter key). The document is labeled “Geheime Reichssache!” (“Secret Reich Matter”). At the end the planners state:
Despite all of the euphemistic, oblique language, when push comes to shove, the planners cut to the chase. If defining who is a Jew and thus must be eliminated gets too complicated, the gordian knot can be cut with a stroke of the pen to nullify Mischling marriages , and time-wasting (for the bureaucrats of the Race Ministry) Mischling births can be preempted entirely via forced sterilizations.
There are also oblique references to “the problem,” “the problem” being the Jews.
I can well imagine that Zionists and others would have a strong interest in replacing “the final solution [to what?]” with another more emotional term because “final solution” leads to the question, “solution” to what? Answer: “the Jewish Question” or “the Jewish Problem.” Inquiring minds would want to know: What is the problem to be solved? That question is not exactly answerable with “antisemitism.”
IMO one of the most interesting sections of the Protocal is the following one, which again touches on the labor vs elimination issue:
So on these planned “evacuation” marches the weak will fall by the wayside anyhow, whereas the strongest, left alive because of natural selection, are the ones who will have to be “treated accordingly.” One way or another, all the Jews are to die. The Nazi hierarchy seems to have hoped that they could work most of the Jews to death and then pick off the remainder to make sure there was no remnant to pop up again somewhere to cause more political trouble, as had been the historical problem. This is why the solution did indeed have to be “final.”
You seem unaware that Napoleon caused the dissolution of the Holy Roman Empire, which was not restored by the Congress of Vienna. Since the Empire no longer existed at that point, it obviously didn’t include all the Germans.
In fact, I’d go so far as to say that the Empire had effectively disappeared as a real political entity a couple of centuries earlier during the Thirty Years War. I had emphasized that the Empire varied considerably over time, but it did exist in substantial political form for the better part of a thousand years, and during that time it included Austria and all the other Germans.
> Hitler knew how to exploit events to his benefit, so that means he was complicit in a riot which was extremely harmful to his government?
In your imagination it may have been. In reality, Hitler did not suffer any serious consequences until he overran Czechia and imposed the protectorate on Slovakia during March 14-6, 1939. Until that time, Chamberlain showed no tendency to want to take a stand against Hitler. The Night of Broken Glass did not affect this. Similarly, the Polish ambassador to Washington, Jerzy Potocki, continued making statements critical of Roosevelt in communications right up until at least March 7, 1939.
—–
On 10 March 1939 Sir Samuel Hoare took up the optimistic line, having consulted Chamberlain. In a speech at Chelsea he stressed the potential economic benefits to be derived from European cooperation.
“Suppose that political confidence could be restored in Europe …”
He looked to “the three dictators” of Europe and the Prime Ministers of Britain and France to work together to “transform the whole history of the world”.
—–
— Simon Newman, March 1939: The British Guarantee to Poland, p. 86.
There was no sign of the Crystal Night having turned anyone important against the Third Reich who had not already been decidedly in that direction. It was the occupation of Czechia which did it,
Thanks for making it clear that in a 1935 meeting memorandum from Heydrich, the message was “All of those present agreed on . . .clear, strict, and effective anti-Jewish legislation that separated Jews from Aryans, coupled with an orderly and rapid emigration process.”
It can’t be emphasized enough – that the solution to the Jewish Question in the Third Reich was SEPARATION, always, not extermination. Separation might mean removal. This is the very same problem and solution that needs to be brought to bear on invading Negroes and Arab Muslims and Asians. There is always a minority who can fit in, but never the whole. Further, the responsibility for how the invader fares after removal is not on the one doing the removing. “Out you go.”
> At Versailles Germany was denied all forms of effective national defense.
Which was precisely why Neville Chamberlain advocated the policy of appeasement. Like many British politicians, he had been critical of the Versailles Treaty for a long time.
> Hitler managed to force a peaceful compromise to this situation at Munich,
Hitler did not want a peaceful compromise at Munich. It was Chamberlain who forced that temporarily on Hitler. What Hitler wanted was to overrun Czechoslovakia right then and there, with Britain and France stuck sitting on the sidelines. He was confident that the campaign in Czechoslovakia would give him an easy victory and the Allies would sit around befuddled.
Instead, it was Chamberlain who pointed things back at Hitler. Chamberlain expressed a willingness that Germany should receive the Sudetenland. But he drew the line at that and made it clear that if Hitler went further then he would be getting himself in a general war. The Gestapo’s reports made it clear that the German public was not looking forward to this prospect. So, Hitler reluctantly settled for the Munich Agreement. But it was always his intent to tear it apart and move across Czechia.
Soviet officials made some statements directed at Western audiences about Jews being victimized. For some of this one can look up the old booklet Soviet War Documents, published in 1943. But official Soviet propaganda generally did not talk about Jews. The Soviet state was more interested in getting Russians and Ukrainians (from the east Ukraine, the region which had been part of the USSR before 1939) to fight the Germans. There simply was no obvious payoff in harping about Joo-dis-Joo-dat for Soviet propaganda, and they generally did not do so.
The Austrian Holy Roman Empire won the 30 years war. As Sweden, Bohemia and N eastern German countries destroyed themselves over Calvinism vs Lutheranism. The Austrian Empire emerged stronger than ever.
The Germanic languages spoken in the 300 Germanic states were similar to the Latin languages Romanian Italian French Spanish and Portuguese. Different languages that couldn’t be understood by people of other states.
It really wasn’t until the rise of Prussia, universal schooling and the radio that German became one language instead of a conglomeration of local versions of Germanic languages. Prussia began its program of unification of Germany under Prussian control in the 1700s. Prussia eventually succeeded only to lose Prussian control of Germany after a mere 58 years.
The Prussian controlled unification of Germany in 1871 was vastly unpopular in Germany. Only the Prussians liked it. It led to a cultural civil war; the Kulturcampf. And another massive surge in immigration to America. Only Prussians liked the harsh imposition of Prussian language, culture religion customs rules and laws etc on the formerly independent German countries.
For instance the state public school system. All the German countries had compulsory free state schools up to age 12. One thing that was greatly resented was the sudden appearance of affirmative action Prussian administrators and school heads all over Germany. It meant no administrative jobs for the local people. And Prussian customs imposed on teachers and students. Something we Americans are very familiar with. Hostiles parachuted in to turn schools into propaganda operations totally opposed to community standards.
Same thing happened in post office tax department sewers and water roads and bridges administrators of town and cities. Affirmative action civil service Prussians parachuted in to change local customs and laws to foreign Prussian customs and laws.
The resentment led to a southwestern German non violent resistance the kulturcampf and a surge in immigration to America
The prevailing mood at Nuremberg was to consider any denial of genocide an admission of guilt. The position generally taken by the defense was to deny or attempt to minimize involvement in this “great crime”. If you were in the navy or had been in Hitlers disfavor, such a defense might succeed. But if you were high up in the security hierarchy or by chance could be connected to a designated “killing center”, it became difficult to create credible counter-fictions. You might notice particularly the SS spinning stories designed to shift blame away from their organization and pinning it on some non affiliated individual, in a feeble attempt to preserve themselves as upright and honorable.
Same seems to have applied to loyalists like Hess and Streicher, who could hardly be accused of any capital crimes. Their dedication to Hitler and National Socialism was itself tantamount to transgression of the gravest kind.
Kaltenbrunner indeed called Höss as a witness to illustrate how the main man at Auschwitz had no incriminating relationship to the defendant. For some reason he must have felt assured the former commandant would back him up on that score.
This however was immaterial. The prosecution had about 20 “witnesses” (signed affidavits) painting a picture of Kaltenbrunner as a man executing death warrants with vigorous enthusiasm. In a story where Adolf Hitler calls in Himmler and tells him “Heini, I want you to kill me some 6 million Jews”, unfortunate characters like Kaltenbrunner are essential to fill the part as comic book villains.
Carolyn Yeager brings up a good point when she asks “why are we still discussing this?”. Anyone familiar with the relevant literature about “the Holocaust” knows it to be a complete hoax. There are few unanswered questions. It’s time we moved on from endless discussions about details.
6 million dead = hoax
4 million dead at Auschwitz = hoax
Gas chambers = hoax
Gas “ovens” = hoax
Electrical conveyor belts = hoax
Shrunken human skulls = hoax
Human soap = hoax
Masturbation machines = hoax
Gas vans = hoax (though, the Jews in the Soviet Cheka experimented with such innovations)
Anne Frank diary = hoax
Simon Wiesenthal = liar
Hossbach Memorandum = hoax
Hermann Rauschning = hoax
Einsatzgruppen reports = hoax
Holocaust survivor escapes 8 gas chambers with a diamond fortune hidden in his rectum= hoax (except for maybe the last part)
Swimming pool at Auschwitz = real
Friendly football matches between starving “death camp” inmates and SS guards = real
Musical stage performances by jewish artists in Aushwitz = real
Bordello at Auschwitz = real
Movie theater at Auschwitz = real
Shop selling beer and cigarettes in Auschwitz = real
Inmates being paid in camp currency to spend on these services (they could also freely receive mailed in packets) = real
Anne Frank given life saving treatment at camp hospitals by top German doctors = real
Bribing SS guards to have a large scale, traditional Jewish wedding in Auschwitz = real
Civilian contractors in the thousands from nearby towns coming and leaving to work every day in the “death camp” = real
Babies being born and cared for in Auschwitz = real
Typhus epidemic in 1942 = real
Starvation in 1945 = real
Now you would think if the fantastical Jewish protestations about German behavior toward them during the war had any resemblance at all to reality, then there wouldn’t be the need for all these hoaxes to support their narrative. The actual reality of Auschwitz stand in glaring contrast to the schizophrenic imagination that has been selected out of the witness testimony.
The Nuremberg trials were “show trials” and “kangaroo courts” in which normal court procedures were all ignored. Even some American jurists criticized this “court” for its actions.
That being said…
Normal “rules of evidence” were not only ignored but not allowed. Hearsay was not only allowed, but taken as TRUTH.
This is where the holohoax (oops, I mean “holocaust™”) got its start as being the hoax of the 20th century.
Even in present-day kangaroo courts that prosecute those who utter “holocaust™” heresy, normal “rules of evidence” are thrown out and not allowed to be exercised.
You see, the fraudulent “commonly accepted narrative” is accepted as FACT while real FACTS are not allowed to be entered into the court record.
Look up Monika Schaefer, Ursula Haverbeck, Sylvia Stolz, Ernst Zundel, and many other martyrs who have been prosecuted and convicted on the altar of “holocaustianity™”. In all of their cases, they were not allowed to introduce evidence into the court record proving that “holocaust™” claims were false and could easily been proven to be false.
” Prussia began its program of unification of Germany under Prussian control in the 1700s. ”
Thanks.
The Holy Roman Empire was not a German political entity.
Germany was not unified prior to the unification under Bismarck.
The only reason I mentioned language was as a possible explanation for Ron Unz’s opinion.
The history of German is not my Fach, but I think Martin Luther was important for the development of the standardized German language.
As for hatred of Prussia, I don’t see the relevance here. A lot of people hate Prussia because of its military culture.
For better or for worse, Prussia under Bismarck managed to unify the North and South German states—Protestant and Catholic.
You said:
“The Prussian controlled unification of Germany in 1871 was vastly unpopular in Germany. ”
Possibly, but Prussia wasn’t the only entity desiring unification of the hundreds of statelets.
The Bavarians related far more strongly to Catholic Austria, directly to the east and south.
Sissi was a Bavarian princess.
The Bavarians still joke about “die Preiss.” A typical Bavarian with a typical Bavarian name, Alois Permaneder, is a character in Buddenbrooks.
Actually, my experience when I lived in Bavaria was that most people enjoyed taking the piss out of “die Preiss,” but actually revered or at least respected Bismarck and thought that Wilhelm II screwed up by “firing” him. My friend’s mother was very proud that Bismarck was a regular visitor to Bad Kissingen.
That’s really a very interesting explanation that I’d never previously considered.
I really was very pleased to see that my recent pieces on the Holocaust provoked Mowbrey’s work, which cites and quotes me. I have the impression he’s a pretty mainstream writer, so his multi-part series raising all sorts of serious doubts about the reality of the Holocaust seems almost unprecedented, or at least I can’t think of the last time anything like that has happened anywhere on the Internet. I wonder if my recent pieces on that subject will provoke any other mainstream writers to start saying similar things.
He also did quite a lot of good research, finding all sorts of interesting tidbits. The one that really jumped out at me was that in April 1945, our newspapers
https://unglossed.substack.com/p/the-forgetting-of-the-holocaust
That hardly fits too well with the standard narrative.
Okay, so now you’re claiming that Ingrid Weckert flat-out lied about Hitler. Maybe, maybe not.
I think you may be confusing Serbs and Sorbs.
Serbs were a South Slavic people.’
Sorbs were a West Slavic people.
They may well have been a single ethnic group before the 6th C.
The first historical mention of Berlin is in the 13th C.
But of course the settlements were much earlier.
Some Sorbs were probably living there at the time because they inhabited the Brandenburg region.
By then the Sorbs and Serbs were long separated.
Per Wiki:
“A genetic study of Sorbs showed that they share greatest affinity with Poles, while results were compared to Serbia and Montenegro due to historical hypotheses, showing that “The Sorbs were most different to Serbia and Montenegro, likely reflecting the considerable geographical distance between the two populations.”
That’s really not correct. The Thirty Years War was fought almost entirely on the territory of the Empire, and totally devastated most of it, with something like one-third of the entire population dying, two-thirds in some regions, relative losses greater than in any other European conflict, before or after.
Most of the participants suffered enormously and the Habsburg’s Empire was severely damaged, certainly not coming out stronger than before. The only semi-winner was probably France, which replaced the Habsburgs as the leading power in Europe. I guess you could say that Brandenburg also gained a little politically, even though its territory was severely ravaged.
You are right – the Holy Roman Empire – was not a German entity. I think that the forgery that the Germans were Goths served the purpose to present the Germans as inheritors of the Western Roman Empire. It seems difficult to mentally free oneself from historical falsifications.
I have already noticed that it is a great surprise for the Germans that they wrested the present German territory from the natives. Also, they do not know where their ancestral home is in Asia, nor do they know the meaning of their name received from those natives. The aforementioned Martin Luther was a Serb (just like the founder of the German Academy of Sciences, Leibniz) from the Ljutići tribe (from ljut=hot, angry) and was a big Slavophobe who hated not only Serbs but also Poles and Czechs.
Perhaps someone has noticed a change in German rhetoric that East Germany is now called Central Germany. It was logical to expect that the Germans would one day raise the question of their territories that were given to Poland, although they do not raise it openly yet. It would be naive to expect that Germany’s 1000-year-old trend of eastward penetration would disappear overnight, and also that they would acknowledge the destruction of the natives and the seizure of their land. All this makes the thesis of ‘Barbarossa’ as a pre-emptive attack on the Soviets to prevent their attack less likely.
It should be fair and admit that they still to some extent renounced the forgeries of their Vienna-Berlin historical school and that they even published German maps with original Serbian toponyms. Btw, a little education won’t hurt them – Leipzig’s name comes from ‘Little Linden’, Schwerin comes from Zverin (beast), Ratzburg (can be seen on the map in #385) is a ‘Serbian town’, (Cardinal) Ratzinger (=someone who comes from a town where Serbs live).
Nevertheless, the forgery, on which the whole industry was built, that the Germans were Goths is still waiting, as well as to say decisively who the real Aryans were.
As you probably know, a major point of discussion among those who wanted to create a unified Germany was the different visions that different parties aspired to: Grossdeutschland or Kleindeutschland. In the end Bismarck went the Kleindeutschland route.
There is a fairly good discussion of this at the Wiki article linked below, which also provides enough background to show why the idea that there was a 1000-year old German political entity cannot be considered valid:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_question
With the Anschluss of Austria in 1938, it could be said that Hitler finally achieved the Grossdeutschland model of unifying the German-speaking rump state of the defunct Austro-Hungarian Empire with Germany. I believe there is evidence that Hitler, from western Austria, had always wanted to be German in the sense that he thought Austria should have been part of a Grossdeutschland state.
I’ve really never heard that anywhere. Are you really saying that the Bavarian or Rhineland dialect of German was as different from the Prussian dialect as Italian is from French? I’m extremely skeptical about that.
My very strong impression is that the differences were more like regional accents, as in Texas English versus New York English. For example, for centuries, all the different German states always used the same German books. Prominent figures freely moved from one city or university to another in a different state without serious language problems.
There was certainly some regional friction after 1871, but I think is was more due to cultural or religious differences, much like there was friction between Southerners and New Englanders.
Perhaps someone on this thread who is knowledgeable in German history can resolve this issue.
At long last a sensible remark. Keep in mind also that Himmler himself in his notorious Posen speech paraphrases the term Evakuierung (“evacuation”) with Ausrottung (“extermination”).
The only resort holocaust “revisionists” have is to declare both the Wannsee Protocol and the recording of Himmler’s Posen speech as forgeries.
Also keep in mind that those Jews unable to work are simply not mentioned in the Wannsee Protocol. Of course not. Their “problem” was already solved in the deathcamps. If the Aktion Reinhardt camps really were “transit”camps, then the Wannsee conference should have mentioned the establishment of “camps in the East” where the Jews unable to work would have to be settled. But they were not mentioned at all.
Thus the plan was: kill all Jews unable to work in the deathcamps (happened), send those Jews able to work to the East and work them to death. Kill the strongest among them who still survive in order to prevent revenge from future generations. Well, that is a Holocaust which cannot be denied.
I am not confusing anything. You yourself said that they were the same ethnic group. The term ‘Slavs’ originates from the 6th c. and all Slavs also have a common origin. How is it that all the others (Germans, Greeks, French, etc.) have the same origin, language and name wherever they are, and Serbs and Sorbs were the same until the 6th c. and after that they were not.
In addition, they also have the names Wends, i.e., Vandals and many other. Serbs are the natives of Europe, and the Serbian language was spoken from the Baltic to the Peloponnese (Sanskrit evolved from it). The situation changed a little with the arrival of the Hungarians who “sneak” between the northern and southern Serbs, although even in today’s Hungary, the Serbs were the majority until 1848.
Berlin was founded by the Serbs and given its name in the 6th c., and the Germans came in the 12th century, and that’s when history seems to “begin”. Most of Berlin’s toponyms (Spandau, Kopenick, Pankow, etc.) are Serbian names. You yourself say that there was a settlement on the site of Berlin before the 13th c (when Germans came), but obviously you don’t know anything about it, and apparently neither does anyone else. Dresden, Brandenburg (Branibor) were also Serbian cities so as Zerbst (i.e., Serbst) where Catherine II, who was also a Serb, originated.
Have a look at the map given in this Wikipedia link.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sorbs
You can see that at the time the map was made in 1861 the Germans themselves referred to them as Serbs and not Sorbs. Serbia itself was at the time referred to as Servia in the West.
There could be something to your assertion that the Germans came from Asia as there are some Asiatic elements in the German character, although like the Hungarians they changed considerably by mixing with Europeans. However, when did this invasion happen and how did they manage to penetrate through the Serbs/Slavs to occupy those territories? There is little evidence of any such invasion or battles in history. They probably also displaced many Saxons and forced them to move to England.
It’s not that complicated — (non-lethal) Nazi persecution of the Jews was well-known — the Nürnberg Gesetze, Kristallnacht, etc, all received wide media coverage — Jewish organizations (AJC, later the WJC) and prominent Jews like Stephen Wise worked to spread sympathy for Jews and provoke condemnation of Germany — after the US entered the war, Germans were demonized in the media — with the end of the war came newsreels and fotos — bulldozers pushing piles of emaciated corpses into mass graves at Bergen-Belsen, bodies strewn all over the ground at Nordhausen (Mittelbau-Dora) — soap from the fat of Jews, lampshades from the skin of Jews — people were primed to believe the absolute worst about the Germans, so they did.
William Luther Pierce used to talk a lot about the pernicious influence of the media, which is a lot more pervasive and powerful today than it was back then — you saw this during BLM, when many Whites were persuaded to believe a totally fictitious narrative about young black males, more or less a useless predator class in America, being unfairly victimized by police.
LOL, you are quoting the lying Netanyahu as a historical authority. This is a Khazar who steals Palestinian land by falsely claiming to be an original Hebrew. So were those Sebs during the Roman Republic he is referring to neighbours of Khazaria or Palestine? Why he is saying this is purely for propagandistic purposes of today to soften up the Serbs for whatever plans Israel may have for them and to help distance Serbs from their traditional Palestinian friends.
I used to go to a lot of music venues
I did see Nico play “Sunday Morning” at a festival in Hyde Park in mid-70’s but she was just a tiny figure on the stage in the distance.
We’re off topic here diverting the discussion. Your Laibach comment, and my subsequent ones, would have been more appropriate on Anglin’s thread about the US army defector to North Korea.
A folk that is 80% Nordic did obviously not “come from Asia”. They have admixture like all Europeans. The only people with less are probably Scandinavians and Dutch.
Swarthy Greeks, Balkans and Slavs have quite the delusion if they consider Germans to be Asians. Their own blood can often be as much as 50% Asian. The corruption and lack of morals in these countries is apple proof of this.
Yours is really a void formula. I could just spout the other side’s litany that the real threat to world peace is paranoid dictatorships who invade other countries, and it would be equally void.
Get used to war. We’ll have plenty of them.
Snyder was Jewish.
https://pt.findagrave.com/memorial/199432727/louis-leo-snyder
Well, this great piece will set David Cole’s teeth on edge
I look forward to his Taki based response riddled with enmity and envy
Kudos Messers Whitney and Unz
Thanks (I expect to be “restlos” attacked for citing the Wannsee Protocol).
Re “Also keep in mind that those Jews unable to work are simply not mentioned in the Wannsee Protocol.” Not sure what this means, since ability to work is mentioned a number of times in the Protocol. See below.
Also, keep in mind that the Wannsee-ers didn’t mention the T4 Programm, which provided a philosophical and also practical basis for the final solution.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aktion_T4#
See the photos: In particular this one shows how the existence of Aktion T4 also ended up serving the needs of policial and racial cleansing:
Not explained in English Wiki but explained at https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aktion_T4#:
This is just a small example of the difference in the type of info available on de.wikipedia compared to en.wikipedia—and Wiki is obviously just a secondary or even “tertiary” source. (Many revisionists charge that no information from any German sources can be trusted. That may be true in some respects and to some degree, but not, I believe, concerning the details. This is also a convenient way (1) to discount inconvenient info available in German but not in English, and (2) to discount the need know German in the context of revisionist German history.)
The purpose of that program was to cleanse (sauebern) German society of “unworthy of life” German citizens, including many Jewish Germans. The bodies of those who were killed in that program were incinerated in ovens, not given burials (these people are usually disappeared” a second time in the Jewish Holocaust narrative). Often the families had no idea what had happened to family members who were taken away to “hospitals.” Knowledge of this program circulated enough within German society, despite efforts to keep it secret, that it had to be discontinued.
See “Opposition”; “Exposure”; and “Technoology and Personnel Tranfer to Death Camps” at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aktion_T4#
In particular:
This surely influenced the Wannsee-ers to try to keep their plans away from the view of German civilians and the populations in conquered territories.
The conflation of biological, racial, and political cleansing is hinted at here:
“Epidemic carrier” seems to refer to possessing and spreading unwanted political views or even organizing and fomenting resistance. It applies a biological idea to political convictions. As a metaphor (or is that a simile?) it also conveys the idea of an invisible germ that can be located only via the telltale trait of Jewishness.
There is no explanation of why 2.5 million Jewish Poles are unfit for work, nor is it obvious why this word is underlined. Perhaps the latter is a “dog whistle” conveying that they have zero worth to anyone’s economy and hence plans should be made to transport them somewhere where they can be “put down” ASAP.
This dog whistle may have been legal hair-splitting by Dr. Buehler.
His legal background is detailed in German Wiki:
Regarding earlier “Loesungen,” the Protocol states:
I alluded in an earlier comment to this emphasis on “legality” via the passage of the needed laws to (appear to) justify measures taken to cleanse Germany of its Jews (and dissidents, including those who refused to swear allegiance to the Nazi regime, such as Jehovah’s Witnesses. But Aktion T4 was outside any legal framework).
The statement’s appearance in this position in the Protocol kind of implies that the wink-wink here is that at this point, given the new situation in the East, there is no time to waste passing “laws.” Aktion T4 provides an extralegal precedent. The “problem” has become way to big for the legal system to play much of a role. Even the Nuernberg Race Laws will be thrown overboard because there just isn’t time, nor the needed bureaucratic and legal manpower, to apply them as they had been applied to Jewish Germans. Besides, there was no point in wasting time applying legalistic racial minutiae to Polish Mischlinge, since the Poles, as Slavs, were already Untermenschen anyhow.
The Endloesung der Judenfrage was a question of logistics and human resources.
Anglin’s take on the defector wasn’t up at the time.
Since he was already a criminal in RoK, only reason he wasn’t already in gaol there is the ‘Status of Forces’ ‘agreement’ forced on every occupied place by the U.S.A.
I still go to many shows, but mainly local, went to see Primal Scream with a friend on request eight or so years ago, it was fun.
‘more’ tags were added to your, my, and McBrides comments by mods, that is new and amusing.
Really, since now is around the anniversary of the worst of the U.S.A.A.F. firebombing raids, the movie Oppenheimer, about a dull bureaucrat, is being released just before the anniversaries of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, most of the above seems a little irrelevant.
I have no need to review your articles to see which I read at the time because I only need to ask whether you think those “600,000” words of comment really qualify as meeting the standards you would set for what should emerge from an intellectually respectable attempt to meet the requirements I suggested in the passage you quoted from my comment, viz
More congenitally, I find that I omitted reference to one of the points that I would nominate as well worth following up with meticulous research and analysis. That is the explanation of Hitler’s recurring obsession with Lebensraum in terms of his dismay at the starvation of Germans in 1919 because they lacked their own breadbasket. That seems to go beyond Hitler being obsessed with what America had got from its wide open space which I had long been conscious of.
Why do you think a sudden response by Mr. Cole likely? I greatly doubt it.
I don’t deny that the military power of the Soviets was larger relative to today’s Russia vis-a-vis the West. But a nation cannot run on military power alone. It needs to provide goods and services to its population. The Soviets failed on that front and that was their worst weakness, as much as the US$ being demanded for trade and reserve around the world is USA’s worst weakness today.
Oppenheimer is being touted as the greatest film of the 21’st Century. I’m not going to watch it. Yes the more tag is often added by the moderator if comment is too long or not relevant.
It was lack of resources that was the main reason for Germany’s defeat, both in men, materials and fuel.
In an equal fight they would have defeated any one maybe two of their opponents but could not cope with all of them. Probably “pound for pound” the best fighting force the world has ever seen.
The addition of ‘more’ by mods is new to me, assume that it is to aid a self-publicity piece by Mr. Unz with collaboration from Whitney.
I certainly will be avoiding that film.
The movie was made to celebrate the contribution of communist Jew Ellis Islanders to the destruction of America. Consider David Greenglass, the foreman of the machine shop who had the plans and physically, with his own hands made the prototypes of the atom bombs and bombsights etc.
There were about 100 K machinists in America in the 1940s. And by incredible coincidence Oppenheimer the communist managed to find the one machinist in America who wasn’t just another communist Ellis Island Jew dedicatee yo the destruction of America but had a sister and brother in-law in NYC able to smuggle the plans and extra protypes to the Soviet Union. Were any of the scientists at Los Alamos goyim Americans? Or was every single one a foreign communist subversive insurrectionist Jew?
I read there’s a lot of unnecessary sex scenes in the movie. Cillian Murphy is still in decent shape. But I’d hate to see a real middle aged naked Oppenheimer and his middle aged ugly communist wife.
Kind regards for your reply.
___
One of the more pernicious aspects of holocaustianity is how it sucks all the oxygen out of the larger historical environment.
For example, the term “fascism” is tossed about with reckless abandon. One suspects that many use it after a semester-course in political science where they learned a definition adequate to regurgitate in a pop quiz.
My parents were taken from Italy as young people to avoid the evil Duce. That means that my grandparents grew up in the turmoil of the attempts at unifying Italy, with all of the complexities that entailed.
As much as I appreciate and have learned from Unz forum as well as your own efforts at a cause I endorse — Justice4Germans — I’m more interested in learning about my forebears lives, and my own heritage.
(To that end — pleased to have been alerted to the Lothrop Stoddard text, that devotes a chapter to Italy in the era of the wars https://www.unz.com/book/lothrop_stoddard__present-day-europe/ )
I’m not claiming Ingrid Weckert “lied.” I don’t know why that line showed up there or what it means. I do notice it’s somewhat awkwardly(?) added at the end of a paragraph.
I will go so far as to speculate that it might or could have something to do with the firebombing of the IHR/JHR office/warehouse in 1984-85. In my 2013 article “The Unforgivable Sins of Mark Weber” (https://carolynyeager.net/unforgivable-sins-mark-weber), I trace the following:
So issues appeared, but no editor to ask about them. Mark Weber didn’t become editor until 1992; the following year (’93) the journal went bi-monthly, and other changes occurred that proved to be the “beginning of the end” for the previously successful revisionist magazine.
I’m just pointing out the coincidence. I suppose lots of things can go wrong when there is no editor.
The use of buses was notorious in the Aktion T4 euthanasia program, although that program AFAIK the gassing was not done in the buses themselves.
But, the populace saw these fleets of gray buses going back and forth, and they had a pretty strong suspicion of what was going on.
For instance, Klaus Schwab, born in 1938 in Ravensburg, certainly saw the buses.
If he was too young to know what they were for, his parents did (his father owned an engineering business that was a special Reich medal for businesses that facilitated the economic and scientific aims of the Reich).
https://www.tracesofwar.com/sights/5070/Memorial-of-the-Grey-Buses.htm
If Ron Unz and others wish to do their own searches one useful term is “Die Grauen Busse.”
Here, for the lazy, are some hits—you’ll even learn a bit of German.
Tod = death. Denkmal = Memorial
Denkmal der Grauen Busse – https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denkmal_der_Grauen_Busse
Denkmal der grauen Busse/Mahnmal Weissenau | https://www.bpb.de/themen/holocaust/erinnerungsorte/503264/denkmal-der-grauen-busse-mahnmal-weissenau/
NS Euthanasie im 3. Reich – Die Grauen Busse – http://www.ns-euthanasie.de/index.php/die-grauen-busse (with photos of victims)
Graue Busse in den Tod – https://www.evangelisch.de/inhalte/122715/30-08-2019/evangelischer-pfarrer-deckte-vor-75-jahren-den-nazi-massenmord-behinderten-auf
Das Denkmal der grauen Busse – WOHIN BRINGT IHR [Where are you taking us?”…
Das Denkmal von den Grauen Bussen – AmkA.de
https://amka.de/das-denkmal-von-den-grauen-bussen
Here is an “images” search—plenty of vintage photos and links .
https://www.google.com/search?q=Die+Grauen+Busse&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwj5idq37qKAAxUskIkEHYOjDkwQ0pQJegQIDxAB&biw=993&bih=498&dpr=1.2
Here is one.
https://www.evangelisch.de/inhalte/122715/30-08-2019/evangelischer-pfarrer-deckte-vor-75-jahren-den-nazi-massenmord-behinderten-auf
(Google Translate):
“Protective custody” was another Nazi euphemism.
The point of posting this? The Nazi planners knew perfectly well that the euthanasia killings, and the Endloesung, were crimes of the highest order. Naturally, they tried to hide their crimes, and the evidence. That is one reason why, when the Red Army was getting close to Auschwitz and Stutthof (and later, to other KZs), orders were given to march all inmates to the interior of the Reich and to destroy as much evidence as possible.
https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/death-marches
At some time you might find the necessity of a American Pravda series on LaRouche whose circles demonstrated the epistemological basis of the British Empire as basically the new HQ for the Venetians and their methods.
Here is a short with reference to Parvus
https://larouchepub.com/lar/2023/5025-dr_karl_marx_refuted-lar.html
Here is a short on the Venetians who traced themselves back to the Canaanites
It is strange that the holocaust revisionists have taken all trouble to “prove” that the gassing of Jews could not have happened and thus that there was no holocaust, but never bothered to prove that the euthanasia program did not exist, which was practiced with those same gassings. So the gassing of the Jews was technically impossible, but the gassing of the handicapped was not?
With so many false syllogisms in one paragraph I can’t help to wonder if shills come in graded packages. You have the McNally 950 pro, “high rate of subversion”, and then there’s the Franklin 250 classic, “low effort, high volume”.
The T-4 Aktion was an actual killing operation with ample documentation, and a signed order by Hitler himself. The absence of all these things when it comes to the fairy tales about the holohoax only serve to demonstrate the lack of logic in your argument. The Germans used monoxide poisoning. Cheap, painless, deadly at high concentrations but harmless at low. A near optimal choice when you want an operation to run safely and efficiently.
In the Holohoax, which was cooked up by Jewish minds, the German efficiency is substituted for a type of logic commonly encountered in paranoid delusions. Gas chambers with wooden doors, German conscripts right out of high school smashing the brains of jewish infants and laughing about it, geysirs of blood gushing from the earth with Jews who are still alive wailing underground. This is something that belongs in a mental institution, not history books.
The euthanasia “program” story is riddled with lies. Calling those who were involved in it “handicapped” is one of the first lies. And all you know about it is what you read on Wikipedia posted by the Holohoax Lobby. Since you’ve been proven to be an ignoramus on the subject, one wonders why you keep embarrassing yourself. (I think it’s because you’re scared to death the whole story might soon be blown right out of the water. But you’re not helping any.)
“And all you know about it is what you read on Wikipedia posted by the Holohoax Lobby. ”
Ha ha. What I said. Nice try.
AAMOF I have read many German primary sources on Aktion T4 and other topics.
They are fairly readily available. I have cited some of these sources in earlier UR articles on the subject of the Holocaust.
Go and read them yourself and then come back here and report.
As for “Justice for Germans,” I think that is the name of your website or group, I am totally for that. Germans are the most gaslighted people of the modern era.
The current oppressive situation in Germany with the clampdown on open discussion and free speech and the Ukraine/energy/economy situation is I speculate (from what I can see from here) only possible because of the psychological abuse Germans have been subjected to for a number of generations now.
But the road to justice is not through denying or distorting what was done first to Germans, then to others. Neither minimize nor maximize to further political agendas. Just the truth, warts and all.
That also includes the truth of the Judenfrage.
What’s being described, killing the handicapped, looks to have a different technical solution. A plausible one.
It’s quite well known that De Gaulle had a die syndrome child and this was key to his comparative liberal outlook.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anne_de_Gaulle
Also Ralph Wigram, a key source in HM Gov for Churchill during the wilderness years, was motivated as an anti National Socialist because he had a congenitally disabled son with downs. Wigram also committed suicide before the war.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ralph_Wigram
All speculation but many people with cripples in the family might have heard about Nat Soc Euthanasia and quietly decided to oppose the regime at all opportunities.
There is a lot of ignorance in that area. Sometimes simple peasant logic is enough to determine whether something is true or not. Genetic science has determined that only haplogroup ‘I’ originated in Europe. If someone claims otherwise, let them come forward and say it.
What does that mean next? That the Germans came to Europe. Just like the Greeks. From where?There are many testimonies about the arrival of (future) Germans. This ‘Alexandros’ talks arbitrarily and without any knowledge. And the Germans often try to smuggle themselves in like the ‘Nordics’. But Scandinavians and Serbs who have a half of ‘I’ DNA are natives, Germans not. Alexandros naively talks about external physiognomy.
What is a ‘typical’ German physiognomy? For example, the Prussians. They are not Germans. There are descriptions of Germans at the time of their arrival in Europe. They got their physiognomy from the indigenous Serbs, we should see the East Germans who are almost indistinguishable from the Poles. The ‘Skeptical’ guy opened my eyes even though I already knew. He knows about the history of Berlin since the 13th century because it was written in his school textbooks.
Therefore, he does not know the first half of history of Berlin (6-13), but he knows the second half (13-20 century) when Germans came there. So, it’s not (just) that panzers are dumb, it’s that they’ve never even heard of it, and by their blinkered nature they just listen to authorities and don’t try to use their own brains. In one discussion, I wanted to tell them the meaning of their name because none of them knew, but they were so arrogant (in addition to stupidity, that is another typical characteristic of them) that I gave up. Tacitus’s Germania has nothing to do with Germans (anyone knows the meaning of Germania? I doubt because none so far answered the meaning of ‘Europe’).
Perhaps ‘Alexandros’, who confirmed that the Greeks also came to Europe, could finally answer where they came from and when (and whether they brought the Olympian mythology from there).
The story about the Germany policy of cripple euthanasia is public record and even had the Pope weigh in to have it stopped.
Here’s the thing though. We do abort deformed children in the womb as a matter of course today. Down syndrome children are routinely flushed out the cervix. Among other missshapes. It’s awkward for all concerned.
Look, the sentence isn’t “awkwardly” added to the end of a paragraph—it fits perfectly. Because you personally happen to strongly disagree with it, you’re suggesting some sort of bizarre conspiracy at the JHR to add one rather innocuous sentence to one article that one year.
I’m sure you’re vastly more familiar with the details of the JHR than I am, but unless you can find various other examples of sentences or paragraphs being inserted in their articles without approval of the authors, you’re being totally irrational. There were lots of bitter quarrels swirling around the JHR and if editors had been adding sentences to the articles without the permission of the authors, surely there would have been lots of angry complaints.
If a writer published an article in the JHR, we should assume the words were his unless that’s strong evidence to the contrary.
This reminds me exactly of what happened a few months ago when you loudly claimed that Arthur Butz had never used the word “Nazi” in his big Holocaust book. I pointed out that he’d used the word at least a couple of hundred times, including in his chapter headings, but you still refused to admit you were mistaken.
As I said before, you’re such an exceptionally stubborn person, you’re essentially delusional.
“…The T-4 Aktion was an actual killing operation with ample documentation, and a signed order by Hitler himself. The absence of all these things when it comes to the fairy tales about the holohoax only serve to demonstrate the lack of logic in your argument…”
It is exactly because of the resistance of the public and the clergy against the euthanasia program that Hitler decided to implement the holocaust of the Jews in a different way. Thus no written document of his order and the use of covering terms where necessary, such as Umsiedlung (“resettlement”) for deportation to death camps and Sonderbehandlung (“special treatment”) for gassing. BTW, after the protests against the euthanasia program it was not stopped at all but continued in secret. Talk about Hitler’s “honesty”.
“… Gas chambers with wooden doors, German conscripts right out of high school smashing the brains of jewish infants and laughing about it, geysirs of blood gushing from the earth with Jews who are still alive wailing underground. This is something that belongs in a mental institution, not history books…”
Some absurd stories that are spread during a war about certain actions do not deny the existence of those actions, for which there is ample real proof.
Don’t touch my Bibi 😊. It’s true that he’s a liar and all, but he was instructed by his rabbi to say what he said (I don’t think he could come publicly with some arbitrary statement of that kind). The fact is that they were the original Judeans and that was 1000 years before the appearance of the Khazars.
Their tribesmen did not gladly welcome them after leaving the Babylonian slavery in Jerusalem, but the Serbs from Asia Minor received them. Relations between Serbs and Judeans date back to ancient times (I already wrote about Sinai and that Moses allegedly received 10 commandments on Mt Serbal).
Even today, the relations between the Israelis and Serbia are correct and solidary (they state that Serbia is one of rare countries in the world where does not exist anti-Semitism), but the big problem is the American Jews who consider the Serbs a symbol of resistance to their intentions to achieve their goals. In this sense, look at their unprecedented media campaign against the Serbs in the 90s, which the whole world had to follow, as a preparation for the bombing.
The Khazars came much later than that. If you are interested, you can read Milorad Pavić’s book – ‘Khazarian dictionary’ – about the alleged debate when the Khazars would collectively convert to one of mainstream religions (Christianity, Islam or Judaism), in which representatives of three religions participated who competed to interpret the dream of the Khazarian khagan more convincingly. The book consists of three parts where the special perspectives and documents of all three religions on that controversy are presented.
In the book, the Christians were represented by Cyril the brother of Methodius, whom the writer says was a Greek. The skeleton of the book, which was written in the form of a dictionary, were known historical facts, but there is probably some imagination in their interpretation. In the late 80s it was one of the most read in the world (perhaps Ron will also be interested as it has something to do with his background).
By the way, I did not forget that David tricked and killed Goliath, who was a Philistine of Balkan origin (he has a Serbian name), even though the Philistine Delilah was friends with the Judean Samson and cut his hair with scissors 🙂 .
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictionary_of_the_Khazars
Well, if “the holocaust never happened” you will have to explain why the Wannsee Protocol talks about the hope that most Jews will be worked to death and that those who still survived need to be killed because otherwise their descendants would try to take revenge. Also, if the Reinhardt camps were only “transit” camps for the Jews to be resettled in “camps in the East¨, then the Wannsee conference that was exactly about the logistics of the operation would have mentioned the organization of those mythical camps. There is absolutely no proof of such camps and no Nazi convicted ever mentioned them in his defense.
Finally, here is Himmler’s Posen speech that says it all (with German text and English translation).
https://phdn.org/archives/holocaust-history.org/himmler-poznan/
There must be a psychological reason why some people against all proofs still stubbornly keep on defending moral monsters.
They did refer to the Germans as “Huns” during WWI so there could be more truth in that than those who invented it imagined. Anyway, much of what is claimed to have happened, like the southern migration of the Slavs, supposedly happened through that period of the Dark Ages, which maybe never existed, according to the First Millennium Revisionist.
The Khazarian Empire may not have existed at the time of the Roman Republic, and I was using the term as a geographic descriptor, so they could have been neighbours of the people inhabiting that region who later adopted the Jewish religion. Just like the Serbian people did not appear with the Orthodox religion.
What Weckert describes (citizens seeing “strangers” in towns) is exactly what I remember reading about a town in Syria. People reported seeing strangers, and then – voila – an uprising mysteriously occurred.
David Irving reports that Hitler blamed Goebbels, and that might be exactly how it went down (publicly), but privately Hitler might have thought otherwise. Maybe they both realized what they were up against (a Jewish boycott, an assassination in Paris and one in Switzerland, Crystal Night), and decided to lick their wounds, be more vigilant in the future, run a tighter ship, and get on with their plans. When you are up against people like this, whose agenda is to create chaos, to divide and separate, who want you to get all defensive, sometimes it’s better to not give them the satisfaction, blame your own guy (if he’s man enough to take it for the cause) and move on. So I think Irving and Weckert can both be right (the former stating what was actually said; the latter stating what actually happened).
There are some truly evil sons of bitches out there. If you try to play fair, compromise, take the moral high ground, you will get eaten alive by these types of people. You must know your enemy inside and out, know what they are capable of, and then stay two steps ahead of them. Hitler tried to win by playing fair. With people like this, that’s impossible.
How the US deals with mental illness today:
Becoming a brainless zombie is just another form of euthanasia and it is even Judeo-Communist approved.
“Racial Hygiene” would certainly have a role if a tribe was under acute threat. Jews did it during the Haavara transfers. Eugenics was and is a valid and admirable ideal, but the devil is in the details. What is happening to Europe and the US is deliberate dysgenics. If Eugenics is a crime against humanity, then certainly dysgenics would have to be one too.
It is also important to note that during the Covid hysteria it was the authoritarian ultra-left across the leadership of every western country who were perfectly willing to lock down millions of people and then to try to coerce them into accepting an experimental mRNA injection.
So if we put German Racial Hygienity on the line up with Judeo-Leftist dysgenics and Judeo-leftist pandemic panic and Judeo-leftist climate panic, I’ll go with the NSDAP Racial Hygiene any day of the week.
> Hitler might have thought otherwise. Maybe they both realized what they were up against (a Jewish boycott, an assassination in Paris and one in Switzerland, Crystal Night), and decided to lick their wounds
If Hitler had had any cause for suspecting such, then at a minimum he would have replaced Himmler as leader of the SS and Gestapo. If this Weckert-thesis had any truth to it, it would mean that a vast network of Jewish agents managed to outsmart the whole security apparatus of the Reich, and Hitler rewarded with a promotion for it. That makes no sense. Crystal Night was used to discredit the SA and install the SS into the driver’s seat. That is likely what it was meant to do.
When you look at Krystallnacht from the viewpoint of “Cui Bono” and how it benefitted the Jews/Antifa in so many ways, and on how all the blame was so perfectly projected back onto Germany, it seems clear to me.
At some point Jews lose the presumption of innocence and even the benefit of the doubt. Judea had declared war on Hitler and were waging a civil war against Franco in Spain and waves of chattel Russian slavery were being sent by Communist Jews to the Gulag year after year.
Many of the “Nazis”, like Hitler, were one time communists. It is likely that there were many contacts and channels of communication between Antifa and the SA, even in 1938. I remember watching the umbrella man instigating the looting during the Floyd riots of 2020, the same thing could have happened in 1938 on Krystallnacht. Hitler had banned the Masonic Lodges in 1935, but they were likely still meeting in secret.
NSDAP guilt for Krystallnacht is the cornerstone of the entire holofraud religion. This is supposedly where the NSDAP finally really proved that they hated all Jews and wanted all Jews dead more than anything else.
The reality is that this was just another escalation by Judea of the same type we have witnessed in Ukraine in the last 2 years. Judea needed WWII to complete their Zion project.
The Holohoaxers will distract and deflect with anything to avoid the essential truth here.
The definition of Holocaust denial also includes this key element (number 3):
I doubt that any holohoaxer writing in this UR comment section wants to try to claim that “approximately 6 million Jews were murdered“.
Since everyone agrees that “6 million” is a typical Jewish exaggeration, the only logical conclusion is that the “holocaust” never occurred the way Jews want to believe it did. The “holocaust” is Jewish masochism porn forced on the goyim by raw, overwhelming Jewish Power.
There are two main currents, I think, of holocaust denial. Perhaps there are others, but I will not get into them.
The first one is the utilitarian one. For example, Iran has a tradition in Holocaust denial because it is an enemy of Israel. One could think of other similar cases, but I think that suffices as an example.
The second current is ideological. One of the key tenets of Nazi ideology is biological determinism allied with racialism. A significant percentage of modern-day biological determinist racialists is comprised of whites. If it is established that the Nazis were moral monsters, there is a plausible argument from biological determinist / racialist ideas to assert that whites are constrained by their genetic makeup to be moral monsters.
“The T-4 Aktion was an actual killing operation with ample documentation, and a signed order by Hitler himself. ”
Why, yes!
Thanks for that clarification.
Hitler was on board with the T4 program.
This is supposed to be an argument that he was not on board with the Endloesung.
What a joke.
NB: A a signed order is not a law.
Hitler and his managers knew perfectly well that such a law would never get passed and that the actions they planned were criminal and would be seen as such by Germans. It is a horrible irony that the Party that celebrated KINDER, KIRCHE, KUECHE hatched a plan to murder children (and others) who had been born imperfect or had become imperfect. The double irony is that the food embargo had probably led to many illnesses and physical conditions that were then labeled “Erbkrankheiten.” Hitler had, actually, zero compassion for the German people.
With all of the legal brainpower at the service of the Third Reich—who had used their legal craft to craft the crafty laws that had already been passed to rid Germany of Jews and political undesirables—do you really think the Party could not have crafted a law to cover Aktion T4?
The answer is obvious: They would not be able to put this one across—quite possibly in part because it targeted all Germans, not just Jewish Germans, and of course the brutality would have been out in the open. There would not have been any way to pull of “We’re sending your behinderte daughter to the east.”
Thanks Alden, an article I saw on Daily Mail about an English physicist named IIRC Clarkson, and his connection with the U.S. Army officer who was truly in charge, really made me see how the parasites of Ellis Island always exaggerate their roles, in this case, too.
Clarkson, like Tibbetts, was human, and, like Tibbetts, felt bad throughout his later life.
Recommend finding the article.
Apparently, in one line in the film, the script has the Oppenheimer clown (and Communist) say that antisemitism would make Germany lose the race for the bomb, just nonsense.
The German team under Heisenberg would have been quite capable of making it, British sabotage of resources made it impossible to do it in time.
Heisenberg also had some idea of what it would do, and didn’t like the idea, but I’m sure he worked conscientiously as project manager.
Also, Hitler would likely have vetoed its use, Germany had the world’s only big stockpiles of the most advanced nerve gases until the U,S.A. and U.S.S.R. got hold of the formulae post-war, judicious use at Stalingrad would have been decisive, but Hitler specifically forbade it as inhumane.
If they had an A-bomb, I suspect that Hitler would have made a similar decision.
Germany tried to send materials to continue development to Japan, but IIRC, that shipment was identified and seized near the Cape of Good Hope. Too late anyway, late spring of 1945.
“I found Irving’s revelations on all these matters absolutely astonishing, and was deeply grateful that Deborah Lipstadt and her army of diligent researchers had carefully investigated and seemingly confirmed the accuracy of virtually every single item”.
Gee, the same Deborah Lipstadt that is now ratcheting up charges of antisemitism against anyone who might have the temerity to challenge the “accepted narrative” of the Holocaust?
How ironic can you get, Mr. Unz? The same Lipstadt that threatens historians possessing Irving-like courage who ask the wrong questions while providing very inconvenient facts on the Holocaust, with prison time?
I agree.
Those of you still defending these immoral Judaic monsters that conjured up the Holohoax fable, kindly cease and desist.
The following video emphatically demonstrates that the alleged Auschwitz extermination centre could not possibly have worked. It was so impractical a design for mass killing, there is NO WAY the ultra efficient Germans would have designed it this way.
(Skip the first 7 mins of the video below, because it just summarises what the alleged official narrative for the Holohoax is, for the benefit of anyone not familiar with it):
Video Link
I tried to post the video above in a Steve Sailer thread, but Sailer’s Talmudic benefactors told him to purge the comment*.
(*Steve Sailer is known to be controlled by the ADL and/or some other rabid Talmudic entity.
He regularly refuses to post anything that exposes the official narrative on the Holohoax for what it is. ie: a total fabrication that only a simpleton would believe).
Your statement:
…is correct.
The “six-million” exaggeration…is still being used to demonize ALL “goyim” who “did not do enough” to stem the supposed deaths. The jews still use the “six-million” figure to evoke sympathy for themselves and have been doing so since the 1800s. There are far too many people who believe the “six-million” figure.
This is a common tactic used by the jews to deflect criticism of their actions and the evoke sympathy for the “poor oppressed jews”.
The actual number of ALL camp deaths is approximately 271,000, NOT “six-million”.
The “holocaust™” is being dismantled piece-by piece.
I look forward to AI (Artificial Intelligence) coming on the scene. If AI is honest, the holocaust™ fable will be ripped to shreds for all to see.
THEN, what will the jews do?
Regards,
Then kindly explain why the mass media still proclaims the holy 6 million as fact at every opportunity.
I invite you to do a quick review of this to prove it to yourself.
Do you know of YMO?
I’ll throw a ‘more’ tag in myself, after stating that Mr. Unz re-citing himself in the guise of an ‘interview’ or ”hey, do you remember when …’ like in a TV show when they run out of material is a little tiresome. I don’t really understand why Whitney sometimes collaborates in these efforts.
Here is another Laibach video from their
D.P.R.K. tour. It is a recent upload. The reactions of the (I presume mainly)
Worker’s (or Labour) Party members in this one are interesting. The lyrics, as you will see, are in a ticker-tape display in hangul above the stage. Watch it, even if you don’t like the song (I do), the audience reactions are very interesting.
The man in the front row sticking his fingers in his ears may not be Korean.
In old photos of party meetings (twenty and a little more yrs ago), older European men in senior military uniforms would appear, all old, guess dead or decrepit now, but interesting, they were Stalinist refugees from Warsaw Pact countries.
The man hiding his face and fingers in his ears may be a descendant.
Do you know YMO or the Yellow Magic Orchestra? In Japan, they ended up as a kind of cross between Sex Pistols (as a cultural craze, though not at first) and Kraftwerk (much of the music).
Sadly, last year two members (Sakamoto and Takahashi) died, both at 71. Not a tragically young age, but unusual for Japan, and almost beyond coincidence for two. I suspect vaccine responsibility.
Actually it is the jews that practice “racialism” to the nth degree. If you are not jewish, you are not considered to be fully human.
The jews make German “racial awareness” look like a Sunday school sermon, nothing more.
Read Stephen Bloom’s book Postville for a good look at jewish behavior in action.
As to “holocaust™ denial” it is merely a needed correction to the lies, fabrications and propaganda that was instituted by the jews themselves, along with “help” from the victors, which solidly established “holocaustianity™” as a new “state religion”, at least in western societies. Observe the many European countries (and even Canada) that have criminalized and censored the TRUTH about this non-event in history.
Regards,
> Germany had the world’s only big stockpiles of the most advanced nerve gases
Churchill had anthrax weapons which he was ready to use if needed for retaliation:
“I mean that we have no intention of indulging in this form of warfare except as a retaliation for its institution by the enemy.”
— Julian Lewis, Changing Direction, 2nd edition, p. xxiv.
It wasn’t some special morality which caused either side to refrain from using nerve gas or anthrax. It was the awareness of the enemy’s retaliatory capacity which did it.
The argument of this video is: “if the design was not perfect it didn’t happen”, but why should a crime be perfect in order to be credible?
The website holocaust denial on trial has 12 chapters on Auschwitz-Birkenau: https://www.hdot.org/debunking-denial/
The author of this video is nicknamed “Ugly Voice” and he is refuted on the website holocaust controversies under “Ugly Voice”: https://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.com/search?q=ugly+voice
Still, all the “technical” arguments that the holocaust didn’t happen do not refute the fact that Himmler himself in his Posen speech openly talks about the extermination of the Jews. Why would he do that?
It turns out that the the video of the D.P.R.K. performance was not approved and has vanished.
Link I placed is now only to the (I think not bad) commercial video.
At least I still have the video file from D.P.R.K. show, download everything I think I may like to watch a few times.
Really, it’s like something out of the Master and Margarita, 1984, etc.
Though, I like the main vid. too, but sudden vanishing is so odd.
when even “Alternative Media” joins the proclamation, what chance do merely rational people have?
brought to UnzForum by A.J. Smuskiewicz
https://www.unz.com/article/group-think-the-root-of-racism/#comment-6037257
This is dishonest, as I only added pertinent information about the Journal of Historical Review (JHR) that you did not know and that could have impacted the articles published in 1985. You have no idea what other articles were published in 1985, and don’t intend to find out, so the whole situation makes you very angry. But facts are facts.
You keep having to admit that I know more than you about the subject, but still you label me “unreasonable” if I disagree with you. You deep-sixed three of my comments in a previous thread because you considered they insulted you (my conclusion). But it is you who keeps insulting me, and for years now!
How many times are you going to repeat this same false anecdote about me? What you’re speaking of occurred over a year ago and I did NOT refuse to admit that Butz used the term Nazi in “Hoax …” I did admit it, just a little further down in that very thread. That you keep repeating this even after being corrected makes it into a lie, not just a mistaken memory on your part. This seems extremely stubborn to me.
But to our current point, whether the sentence is awkwardly placed is a subjective decision/impression for each of us. Nothing can be proven from it. Nor did I attempt to prove anything. I said I was only speculating. I have no favored outcome in this matter, except that I would put more weight on an author’s book on a particular subject than on one article/talk.
In more detail, young Adolph spent some time in hospital as a result of phosgene and mustard gas.
Aldous Huxley used ‘anthrax bombs’ as a narrative device in his description of the past takeover by the world-state.
I looked it up, that purely by Reddeditioters, so, I would guess. Same as subhumans like you.
I’m the only person on this thread knowledgeable about German history.
Here’s a very well known example of mutually incomprehensible Germanic language as recent as 100 years ago. In 1920 in Berlin a young woman was fished out of the river in a suicide attempt. She was homeless distraught distressed she was kept in a charity hospital and then placed in one of the women’s shelters. Not just line up every afternoon and kicked out at 7/am but dormitory style permanent style living.
1920 Berlin civil war between communists and numerous other factions starvation total collapse of government Yet 1920 Berlin, bad as it was still had a functioning system for homeless mentally ill poor people. In contrast to America’s Capitol DC and all our major cities. Packed full of homeless since 1975.
Soon the young woman attracted a group who claimed she was the 4 th child youngest daughter of the Czar and Czarina of Russia, Anastasia. She was dressed up, taught some aristocratic manners and behavior and paraded about
The Czar’s wife, the mother of Anastasia Romanov was from the principality of Hesse Germany. South central Germany Frankfurt au Maine is in Hesse.
The Hessian Czarina her siblings cousins and the rest of the royal family of Hesse grew up speaking Hessian High German. High German was the term for the standard educated German taught in the high schools but not in the K-6 local German language schools. The upper classes and the princes dukes grafs barons and upper middle classes spoke high German. The ordinary people spoke their local languages.,
The 5 children of the Russian Czar and Czarina were quadringual especially the girls. As was the custom for upper class girls in Europe in those days. They learned Russian from father and the Russians Hessian high German from mother and English and French from live in teachers. Every summer until WW1 the Czar’s children including Anastasia spent a month in their mother’s home, Hesse. It was a total immersion month in Hessian high German. For the first 12 years of Anastasia Romanove’s life she spent a month in Hesse speaking and learning Hessian German.
The handlers of the young woman they claimed was Anastasia Romanov convinced some of the Hessian Czarina’s siblings cousins and other relatives to meet with the woman they claimed was Anastasia Romanov.
As soon as she spoke every Hessian who met with her knew she wasn’t Anastasia. Because the only Germanic language she spoke was an east Prussian uneducated farm worker language. Not a dialect but different enough to be considered a different language from Hessian German.
Here’s a couple tests for all these commenters who think Germany existed before 1871 and that the non existent Germany not a nation ruled the Austrian Hapsburg Holy Roman Empire for a thousand or 1,500 years.
What were the years that a Hapsburg Holy Roman Emperor ruled S and Central America Mexico part of the s Western United States and the Philippines.
What European nations and territories did this this Hapsburg Emperor not rule during the years he ruled S and Central America some parts of the southern western United States and the Philippines
Who was the King of Bohemia? Hint it wasn’t Elizabeth and Frederick Palsgrave
What nation found some obscure E German baron and made his descendants first Grafs then Marquesses then Kings then Emperor of the United nation of Germany?
If commenters can’t answer those questions without their favorite Wikipedia superficial googling then it’s obvious they know nothing about German history Except for 19th century romantic period nonsense and Lothrop Stoddard nonsense.
Revisionism of the standard British Jewish false history of WWs 1 and 2 is great. But wandering ofc into Nordic Germanic supremacy based on 19th century romantic movement and ethnic religious bigotry is ridiculous. FYI Germans aren’t Nordics and Nordics aren’t Germans. As proven by DNA. FYI Poles,Czechs Slovaks and Ukrainians not Germans and Scandinavians are the bluest and blondest people in the world.
> In more detail, young Adolph spent some time in hospital as a result of phosgene and mustard gas.
Which doesn’t change the fact that the Allied capacity for retaliation would have influenced his decision of whether or not to use a nerve gas. Anthrax and nerve gas were the pre-atomic age form of WMDs. Both sides had something, neither side used it.
Mass Media distortions are partial proof that this constant change in narrative is due to some kind of Bernaisian predictive programming. We see it over and over, just take all the bald face lies told about “Covid” and things like “lockdown”.
One related term is called “Revelation of the Method”
By incessantly demanding that we accept 6 million murdered as a “fact” and prosecuting people for denial of this number, while at different points in time saying that there was only 4 million, or 2 million, or even 11 million, they force us to accept that the number is irrelevant, only obeisance matters. This is part of the revelation of the method.
You forgot the part about “the Men of Unz”…
A lot of Jewish landlords may have been going for the insurance claims by torching their own property.
It would not be the first time. Not the last either.
There’s another element of Krastalnacht though. If one of your people is assassinated by a committed activist for another people, why not pogrom the rest of the scum?
Good point about Umbrella Man and do not
Forget the FBI building pipebomber. Will we ever ID them? I doubt it.
I’ve thought that the OKc bombing could have easily been organized by a Merrick Garland type as well. A highly favored Jewish lawyer in the Justice Department who took over the investigation that found Tim McVeigh.
On the contrary, Ms Yeager (and Saggy). Far from being a gate-keeper, Ron has opened the doors to the subject of “holocaust” revision for many (including myself) who otherwise may not have discovered the controversy, or the extensive references/bibliographies he offers to support his work, much of which hosts on this website, gratis.
It was Ron’s essay “Holocaust Denial” which first brought me to this site and was my first introduction to this subject. That, in turn, led me to the work of the very gracious John Wear, another honourable man whose work you go to some lengths to belittle and rubbish, though apparently you are on the same side as in the “holocaust” debate.
Ron Unz provides, freely, masses of literature, and extensive bibliographies along with his own, very careful, analysis on many, many controversial topics, which is one of the reasons the [A]DL, et al, won’t touch him. – Because he makes sure he can support everything he writes!
Your constant (in thread, after thread, after thread) nit-picking and belittling the work of others simply because they do not write as you write, or reach the conclusions you reach, is testament to your bitter character and jealous nature, and is liable to put new-comers off the subject all together – be that intentional on your part or not. So, in effect, it is you, Carolyn Yeager, who serves as a “gate-keeper”, discouraging others from digging deeper into this crucial topic.
You may not see yourself as a troll, Ms Yeager, but the fact is that you present as one. Other’s, who’ve obviously never read your comments here, rush to your defence because of your age, finding attacks on you unseemly. Not only do you not (and I’m sure you’ll be the first to agree with this) need their support, you do not deserve it.
And for any who doubt me in that, I’ll be happy to reproduce the comment I wrote in another thread, proving you to be a troll when you asked/challenged me to do so.
That comment shut you up for a while. Hopefully this will have a similar effect.
Regards,
Kali.
> A lot of Jewish landlords may have been going for the insurance claims by torching their own property.
No German Jew in 1938 would seriously have expected to receive any significant insurance payments.
People who think Germany is an ancient unified nation and that Austria was always part of the thousand or more year old unified German state shouldn’t be blathering ignorant early 19th century European romanticism and claiming it’s true. Come on, who was the king of Bohemia? When did a Hapsburg HRE rule S America and the Philippines?
If you ignoramuses know so much about Germany you should know the answers. But you ignoramuses don’t know the answers because you know nothing about Germany except some modern religious bigotry and fairy tale romanticism
The thread quickly deteriorated into nonsense. From WW2 Jewish claims justifying the takeover of Palestine to The Song of the Nieblings and Barbarossa hiding in his cave to save the Burgundians.
You’re confused.
Well, what conclusions have you reached? Has Unz ever said that the ‘holocaust’ is a preposterous prima facie hoax? What is closest he has come to saying that?
I recall in his first article he said … something to the effect … hell … let’s look it up … the whole paragraph …..
Did Unz notice something that previous scholars missed? Like the whole thing is a preposterous hoax? I think Unz’s article is great, and I’d recommend it to anyone new to the subject, or anyone wanting more info, but the conclusion, i.e. the above paragraph, seems very strange indeed.
And, there is the text, he only spent a few weeks studying it, and the subtext, it’s not important enough to spend more time on.
Couple that with the many articles that refer to the hoax, i.e. the ‘holocaust’, that appear on Unz without noting it is a hoax, in effect, promoting it.
Yes? No?
Of course I see the hoax as the lynchpin of the creation of the state of Israel, the complete domination of the US media and govt, and the current abandonment of the MAD doctrine and the march toward nuclear destruction. Am I overstating the case? I don’t think so.
Video Link
McVeigh didn’t do it…
He was a “patsy” who was peripherally involved, being contracted to drive a truck and park it. The whole OKC investigation is full of holes and was tainted from the start. The intent was for McVeigh to be stopped and arrested. His missing license plate was removed by those involved and was part of the “plan” to pin the whole affair on him. Notice how quickly McVeigh was tried and executed, “witnesses” being the families who lost loved ones in that “operation”, being paraded through the trial, normally emotional anecdotal “evidence” is not admissible or permitted the be introduced as “evidence” but was allowed and was rampant throughout the McVeigh trial.
A “death sentence” normally takes approximately 20 years to completion. Not so for McVeigh. Who knows?…if he was a government “asset” he might still be alive.
There were critical ATF, FBI, DEA and other Justice Department records that needed to disappear in order to keep the “shadow government” from being discovered. In a normal investigation, evidence is preserved for weeks, months, and even years. Not so with OKC, as the debris from the Murrah building was carted off almost immediately under armed guard.
There were explosives planted within the building. “Utility and maintenance workers” were observed going in and out of the building for weeks, wiring up the building for charges, being observed dealing with “blue barrels” that (presumably) held explosive charges. There is NO WAY a truck bomb could do so much damage as the building across the street was unscathed.
FBI and ATF agents were also advised to “stay home” that day. It is clear that the destruction of the Murrah building was a government “operation”.
The OKC “bombing” was implemented for a multitude of reasons, one being the destruction of critical government records as well an attempt to defuse the growing “militia movement” which was gaining strength in “flyover country”.
The OKC bombing rates right up there with WTC 9-11 as being a successful government “false-flag operation”.
all the charm of Wasserman Shultz but wit hairy armpits.
+
the attack on Yeager was harsh.
Where are the Ageism police?
As I said, the starting point is the fact that only the ‘I’ haplogroup (there were some insignificant ones) is indigenous to Europe. Why is there a great resistance to state that, for example, Germans and Greeks came to Europe (from Asia and Africa), while Hungarians and Turks do not hide it and are proud of it? It is obvious that a new history of the world of the first millennium must be written.
Everyone is already aware of the forgery that the Germans were Aryans (they deformed that concept by declaring them superhuman and created a negative perception). There are still few who know that the Germans were not even Goths, which is a falsification on an industrial scale. Only one word is enough to reveal that forgery, which is how the Romans called the Goths -> Dacians. Btw, I feel a little sorry for the old lady (otherwise fake Aryan and fake Goth) despite her arrogance because she lived her whole life without even learning the meaning of the name Germans.
Re: Khazars…
I don’t know if there is any information about the Khazars at the time Bibi talks about. They may have lived in the area of Pakistan/Afghanistan then, as there are now still tribes of that name before they came to Ukraine. By the way, the Serbs who received the old Judean returnees from the Babylonian captivity are probably the same ones from Laurent’s text (#439) who carved the text into the obelisk. There are testimonies about the cultural legacy of those Judeans who found refuge with Serbian-speaking tribes in Asia Minor.
Re: New rhetoric…
… I have already mentioned that in Germany it started to be called East Germany – Central Germany. And Putin said a few days ago that the Poles should at least be aware, if not grateful, to Stalin for the current borders that included parts of the former Germany. Are the Polish brothers smart enough to understand in time what the winds are blowing or has Catholicism already metastasized in their brains?
Second… I already said that Bibi fired one of his important MPs because he told the protesters in Israel that it was good that 6 million of them were destroyed in the Holocaust and that more should have been done. A rift is clearly emerging between the Khazars (Ashkenazis) who have no connection to Palestine and the ancient native Judeans. Bibi is Khazar, and prominent Sephardim were Shimon Peres and Ariel Sharon.
I think Ron is more right about this than Alden.
Alden wanders off into a lot of byways of German history, bringing in Anastasia etc. to prove his point that some Germans could not understand the language of others. He also seems to be trying to make other points—namely, that Germany didn’t exist as a political entity before 1871, and ergo, it also was not a linguistic entity. The political unification in 1871 does not mean that before unification, German was not spoken throughout the entities that were unified (unlike the situation in prerevolutionary France and well into the late 19th C, where unrelated different languages were spoken and most people did not speak French).
Regarding regional dialects, Germans are far more comfortable with the idea of the coexistence of a local language and standardized “Hochdeutsch” than are English speakers. In many rural areas, people didn’t speak Hochdeutsch, but the language they spoke was a dialect of German, not a different language
Regional dialects are mainly a matter of pronunciation (which can make it very hard to understand), and some special vocabulary (for instance, between Austrian German and Hochdeutsch), which is a lexical issue. The grammar is the same, aside from maybe one region using more dative instead of genitive, and that kind of thing. IMO a comparison would be a person with a thick Scottish accent—my parents had a Scottish friend whose English was practically impossible to understand, plus the Scottish historically at least used a lot of special vocabulary.
The basics of the history of the German language are not rocket science.
Wiki has a perfectly serviceable entry:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_language
In my own ancient Penguin Book of German Verse, in which the poems are arranged basically chronologically, the first poem in the collection is the Hildebrandslied (c. 800), described as “the only relic, in German, of early alliterative heroic poetry.” The ms. was found in Fulda, Hesse.
No. 2. Muspilli (ninth century), Old High German, a Bavarian ms.. or perhaps it originated in Salzburg.
No. 3. Weingartner Reisesegen, 10th C, a ms. found in the monastery of Weingarten, in Wuerttemberg, southwest Germany
No. 4. Der von Kuerenberg, 1150-70, probably Bavarian or Austrian
No. 5. A group of love poems from the 12th C. By this time the German comprehensible to one who knows modern German.
Further entries are from named poets who are Swiss, Alsatian, South German, Thuringian, etc.
All “German.” One of them is the poet who composed “Parcival.”
https://archive.org/details/penguinbookofger00fors/page/n7/mode/2up?view=theater
https://archive.org/details/penguinbookofger00fors/page/n9/mode/2up?view=theater
There may have been pockets of people speaking some other languages in the territory that makes up modern “Germany,” but I believe the evidence is that the basic outlines of German (with many regional differences and pronunciations) were established everywhere on that territory by the early Middle Ages. Martin Luther had a huge effect on the German language with his translation of the Bible into German. So, anyone who read Luther’s Bible was reading the same language.
Here is a brief explanation of Luther’s influence on the German language:
https://theworld.org/stories/2015-04-02/martin-luther-didnt-just-reform-church-he-reformed-german-language
“Before Luther, there was no single German language — just a series of dialects. Two in particular were dominant: Upper German and Low German. As a child, Luther lived on the linguistic borderlands that divide the two, and his family moved back and forth across the boundary several times.”
If it is possible to credibly speculate about the KGB doing apartment bombings in Moscow in the tail end of Yeltsin’s rule, there’s not reason to exclude the idea in the context of the mid-to-late 1990s USA either. Merrick Garland looks like a perfect candidate for organizing such a dastardly plan.
You wrote:
“The Germanic languages spoken in the 300 Germanic states were similar to the Latin languages Romanian Italian French Spanish and Portuguese. Different languages that couldn’t be understood by people of other states.
It really wasn’t until the rise of Prussia, universal schooling and the radio that German became one language instead of a conglomeration of local versions of Germanic languages.”
These two ideas do not compute. “Latin languages Romanian Italian French Spanish and Portuguese” =/ “local versions of Germanic languages.”
Perhaps Alden is German.
His/her first language does not seem to be English.
Alden derides any info coming from Wikipedia.
Wikipedia articles on historical subjects generally are fairly well supported by various types of documentation.
Alden doesn’t supply any evidence or documentation (such as in journal articles or books or even encyclopedia entries or webpages from specialized websites) for a single one of his/her many jumbled-up assertions.
It is necessary to start from the beginning and not from the middle. I have already said that the history of European civilization and culture begins after the Ice Age (about 12000 BC) and not 9000 years later (i.e., 4500-4800 years ago) when nomads from the Russian steppes came to Europe, committed genocide against the natives and allegedly brought their Yamnaya (aka ‘Indo-European’) language, which they allegedly spread throughout Europe (how?) and a large part of Asia.
It is very easy to determine that this is not true. First, it is not known where and in what period the so-called ‘Indo-European’ (Yamnaya) language was created, and it takes about 4-5000 years for that.
If we even ignore this then the question arises whether Sanskrit (and the languages derived from it, e.g. Hindu, Punjabi, etc) is an ‘Indo-European’ language. The answer is – Sanskrit is an ‘Indo-European language’ what is clearly seen from its similarity to European languages.
But genetics says that the Aryans who brought the language (and mythology) that became Sanskrit were not Yamnaya (aka ‘Indo-Europeans) nomads. How then can Sanskrit be an ‘Indo-European’ language?
Let’s even ignore that.
This would mean that the Yamnaya nomads came to Europe 2800-2500 BC, imposed their language so much that the natives of Europe totally forgot their original language, developed a sophisticated mythology and Rg Veda, went to SE Asia (it took them for that about 500 years) and as Aryans took the ‘Indo-European’ language obtained from the Yamnaya and the mythology developed on it (translated their own or adopted Yamnaya mythology?) in 2000 BC to India. Who can believe in all that?
That in just a couple hundred of years the ‘Indo-European’ language spread to every corner of swampy, wooded Europe, without bridges on rivers, and that in that period Vedic mythology developed, what should take thousands of years?
In short… the German language was formed in the 15th century (and later) in the environment of the indigenous languages, i.e., Serbian language that originated in Vinca and developed there organically for over 10,000 years (according to Alinei, it has continuity from the Paleolithic). Latin is also a provincial (Lazio) Apennine dialect, which was later taken over by the Catholic Church, which also originated in the Serbian language environment (from which borrowed many words) and neither Spanish, nor French, and especially not the artificial Romanian language (and nation) formed in the 19th century, did not originate from Latin.
‘Not perfect’ ? What the eff are you talking about ?
The video demonstrates in no uncertain terms, that if this was an extermination centre, that only a CHILD would have designed it this way.
Everything about the design is inefficient, impractical, and downright juvenile.
On the other hand, if it had been designed as a facility to minimise the spread of disease, and thereafter as quickly as possible cremate those that died in the typhus epidemics of 1943/43, then the design is indeed efficient.
This facility only had five blocks of three ovens, they could only cremate a few score of bodies per day (remember, these utilised the technology of 80 years ago and took MUCH longer to cremate than the modern high tech cremation ovens which need 1 hour to cremate a 45kg/100 pound body).
So, factoring in the possibility that an another epidemic could occur, and that a situation could exist where far more individuals could die from typhus/natural causes than the capacity of the few ovens could handle, the Germans designed a cool room (or cool cellar) to store bodies underground, until such time as oven capacity was available to cremate them.
Importantly, the actual blueprints clearly identify these ‘cool rooms’ as a Liechenkeller.
(Leiche = corpse, cadaver. Leichenkeller literally translates to corpse cellar. ie: cool room mortuary where bodies could be stored).
Of course the peddlers of the Holohoax myth claim that this Leichenkeller was the actual killing room, because it is the only thing in the blueprints that could remotely have substituted (in their minds at least), as a gas chamber.
I don’t like to be called dishonest so I wasted a few minutes digging up some of the old comments by Yeager:
https://www.unz.com/article/the-holocaust-of-six-million-jews-in-world-war-i/?showcomments#comment-5137036
https://www.unz.com/article/the-holocaust-of-six-million-jews-in-world-war-i/?showcomments#comment-5137841
Anyone can check the thread and confirm that she kept on arguing that Butz didn’t use the word “Nazi” in his book even after I showed he used it a couple of hundred times, on almost every other page. I finally left this closing comment:
https://www.unz.com/article/the-holocaust-of-six-million-jews-in-world-war-i/?showcomments#comment-5138709
Anyone can check the discussion and see how fanatically stubborn/delusional she tends to be.
I’m no expert on the history of the German language, but I’m extremely skeptical regarding your claim that the various local German dialects were as different from each other as French, Italian, and Spanish, essentially being different languages.
As far as I know, for hundreds of years all the books published in Germany came out in a single, German language edition and could be read by everyone in all the different regions. If written German was the same to Hessians, Prussians, and Bavarians, they obviously all used the same language.
Meanwhile, Italian, Spanish, and French obviously require entirely different books to be readable.
Yes they used a facility originally designed for another purpose for extermination, thus being not perfectly efficient, instead of building an entirely new one. That is still the same argument “if it was not perfect it didn’t happen”. Were the Nazis really always rational and efficient? What about their insane death marches to save the lives of the inmates in order to use them for labor, but during which most died?
I’ve seen all the arguments pertaining to Carolyn Yeager. Briefed myself on all of them, albeit inadequately.
Without offence to anyone, certainly not to Dr Unz, I have to say that Ms. Yeager remains a beacon for OUR people. Her tenacity, warts and all, has a quality within it that is essential if there is to be any rescue of what remains for us in an extremely dire situation. I believe her polemics are done with the highest of motives and that when she applies the verbal greenhide goad, it is always with that in mind, albeit sometimes, lost in the polemics.
Having said that, I try to stay clear of her because I can’t handle the – justified – scrutiny.
I suspect Ron your marital state reflects the insight, possibly of yourself and every attractive woman you might have wooed that arguments would end up like that😎
What matters is the quality of the references and documentation.
The first part of the video One Third of the Holocaust is spent examining the references used in Raul Hilberg’s standard work The Destruction of the European Jews, and showing what poor quality they are — full of nonsense no reasonable person could believe — Hilberg was asked by the prosecution to appear as a witness during the first Zündel trial, but under cross-examination was so badly humiliated by Zündel’s attorney Doug Christie that he refused to appear at the second Zündel trial a few years later — among other things, he was forced to admit that he’d never actually visited any of the camps (to e.g. utilize their docmentation).
>thinking Holohoax peddlers care about the truth
Babby’s eternal mistake
Read again Article 19 and 21 of the Nürnberger Kangaroo court and remember what we are dealing with.
The Holohoax has been scientifically myth-busted for a million time. The peddlers dont care. They are pieces of shit who want to cling to the decaying jewish-west. They should be treated as such.
Unironically, the Holohoax never happened, it should have happened, and it will happen for real, globally.
PUTIN: “If Polish units enter, for example, Lviv or other territories of Ukraine, they will remain there. And they will stay there forever. This, by the way, will be nothing new. Let me remind you that after the defeat of Germany and its allies at the end of World War I, Polish units occupied Lviv and the adjacent lands that belonged to Austria-Hungary at that time.
Poland, instigated by the West, took advantage of the tragedy of the Russian Civil War and annexed some historical Russian provinces. Our country, which was in a dire situation at that time, was forced to conclude the Treaty of Riga in 1921 and actually recognized the annexation of its territories.
And even earlier, in 1920, Poland seized a part of Lithuania – Vilna region, the territory around modern Vilnius. It seems that together with Lithuanians they fought against the so-called “Russian imperialism”, and as soon as an opportunity arose, they immediately grabbed a piece of land from their neighbors.
Poland, as it is known, took part in the division of Czechoslovakia as a result of the Munich agreement with Hitler in 1938. It completely occupied Teshinska Silesia.
In the 20s and 30s of the last century in the so-called Eastern Kresy of Poland – and this is the territory of Western Ukraine, Western Belarus and part of Lithuania – there was a rigid polonization and assimilation of local inhabitants, suppression of national cultures and Orthodoxy.
I would also like to remind you of how such an aggressive policy ended for Poland. It ended with the national tragedy of 1939, when Poland was thrown by the Western allies to the German war machine and actually lost its independence and statehood, which was restored to a great extent thanks to the Soviet Union. And it was thanks to the Soviet Union, thanks to Stalin’s position, that Poland gained significant lands in the West, lands of Germany. That’s exactly right: the western territories of present-day Poland are Stalin’s gift to the Poles.” ?
Fisch…what kind of name is that, anyway?
JFYI
Ukraine slaughterhouse continues.
A glimpse of yet another AFU failure
Attempt to cross Dnipr (from tg channel)
There are many reports similar btw.
🇷🇺🇺🇦 When trying to cross to the left bank of the Dnieper during July, Ukrainian formations lost about 900 people. Such data are provided by the acting governor of the Kherson region Volodymyr Saldo.
The fighters of the RF Armed Forces successfully repelled all enemy attacks, destroying more than 30 motor boats, 2 tanks, 28 howitzers, 2 MLRS installations and 2 EW stations of the Ukrainian army in three weeks.
Also, according to Saldo, 7 ammunition depots and 2 command posts were destroyed.
The enemy suffered most of the losses when trying to force the Dnieper in the area of the Kinburn Spit and the Antonovsky Bridge.
How did you build a Strawman without straw, Moishe?
“Of course I see the hoax as the lynchpin of the creation of the state of Israel, the complete domination of the US media and govt,”
No, the Endloesung is not the lynchpin.
It was a step along the way, but the road had already been well prepared.
(Also, following this after-the-fact logic, if the Holocaust was necessary to the creation of the Jewish state in Palestine, then the Zionists would have welcomed it, and it was a stroke of luck that it occurred.)
The drive to create the state of Israel —the international Zionist movement—goes much further back.
It seems to me that the (IMO) criminal enterprise of the creation of the state of Israel—the gradual and then outright theft of Arab land, which continues as we speak/write, and the creation of a constant source of unrest and capital of international intrigue—is the tale wagging the dog when it comes to assessing the Endloesung.
The Zionists are the world’s most effective opportunists, that is true.
They didn’t “create” the Holocaust but they certainly have used it for their own purposes.
In particular, they have been able to shut down any discussion, via the “antisemitism” meme, of the actual sources of and machinations behind the Zionist movement.
“Holocaust deniers” actually work to support this long-term effort to suppress more and more forcefully to attain total control of the narrative of Zionism. “The Holocaust” is a good red herring from the long-term goal of “retaking” Palestine for “the Jews” and destroying the local Arab population in a “biblical” fashion. The deniers are useful idiots in this project.
If the “deniers” would just shut up, it might be possible to have a much more thoroughgoing discussion (and actual historical investigations) of Zionism and the actual Judenfrage. It would eliminate a sideshow that derails serious discussion and uses up a lot of oxygen and provides further justifications for total narrative control by Zionists and their puppets and mouthpieces.
I highly recommend Douglas Reed’s The Controversy of Zion. It is available in chapter-size chunks at TUR. This is not the first reading that I have done on the subject of the Zionist project, but it is the most interesting and it pulls together more threads than anything else that I know of so far, and also explains a lot of the tensions within Judaism.
This discussion of the German language is a twig connected to the question of the “age” of a political German entity.
The existence of an identifiable German language is separate from the political features of “Germany.”
I’ll leave you there in the weeds with your fascinating conflation of prehistory and history.
I kind of knew when I wrote that that people like you would jump on it.
Although I was referring to the history of the German language.
But since you insist, you obviously are ignorant of the primary sources that document the Endloesung.
Well upthread in comment #524 you have it:
“…Unironically, the Holohoax never happened, it should have happened, and it will happen for real, globally…”
Thank you, but what is “the greenhide goad?” Never heard that before.
While I’m here, I’ll add that what you refer to as “the polemics” is essential for all of “OUR people” to engage in, but it’s also what you mean when you refer to “warts.” What warts? Seeing warts reveals a fear of controversy, ie. scrutiny. Being seen as we actually are is humans’ big fear. Putting one’s self out there in a hostile environment is the bravest act humans can do. It’s why Adolf Hitler is among the bravest of men, what he did out of love and concern for his people, not out of personal ambition. Has anyone in the world been more scrutinized than he?
It was a
That’s for sure.
They created the holohoax out of whole cloth. That is they put the Jews in camps, but killed none. Just like the US put the Japs in camps, but didn’t kill any. There was no holocaust in the US camps. There was no holocaust in the Nazi camps.
The first holohoax was in 1905 as announced in the NYT, the ongoing systematic murderous extermination of six million Jews.
https://ibb.co/sKtqBSz You have to click on the link to see the article.
A book was written about their efforts to create a hoax in WW One by Don Heddesheimer “The First Holocaust, Jewish Fundraising Campaigns with Holocauste Claim in WW One”
Also, I see the hoax as the Jews’ only vulnerability, that is, if one prominent person would expose this hoax it would permeate the brains of the brain-dead American population, and the Jews’ game would be up. I believe that.
I don’t see anything else as having any effect whatsoever.
Wait until AI (Artificial Intelligence) takes hold and analyzes the so-called jewish “holocaust™”. IF AI is honest and impartial, letting the chips fall where they may, it will destroy the “holocaust™” myth and blow the “commonly accepted narrative” of the so-called “holocaust™” to smithereens.
The sooner the better…
IIRC, Ron has stated, more than once, in recent articles that no more than a couple of hundred thousand jews died in the camps. (Maybe his figure was closer to 300,000?) Either way, he is “prima facie” denying the alleged jewish holocaust.
I could be wrong about this, but Ron Unz may have been the first, or amongst the first, to describe holocaust dogma as forming the basis for the “Holocaustian” religion. Certainly, it was Ron who introduced me to the concept of “Holocaustianity” even if others had coined that term before him. There are other instances too, in which Ron has brought fresh (from my perspective) insight to the discussion, but I’m not going to comb through his articles to find them for you. Go ahead and read them for yourself.
In the meantime, I cannot fathom why on earth you would have a problem with him stating that he’s not an expert on the subject. The whole reason for the existence of his American Pravda series is to alert readers to the dishonesty of the establishment media, and to do what he can (which is quite a lot, as it goes) to set certain records straight to the best of his ability.
No, saggy, the “subtext” is to invite the reader to dig deeper! And he even provides these comment threads so that we may do so with the support and input of the wider UR community.
And yet you have the audacity to describe him as a “gate-keeper”.
No.
He gives freedom to individual contributers to write what they choose, and freedom to us readers to challenge what they write. That’s not Ron “promoting the hoax”, that’s Ron promoting free speech and free exchange of ideas.
No, you are not. I fully agree with you on this.
Why you have daggers drawn for Ron, who provides this platform for us, is beyond me! Certainly I don’t agree with him on everything (his take on the pandemic psyop, for example, continues to perplex me), but his overall contribution to the pursuit of truth and honesty in reporting/academia is second to none!
Whilst I’m here, I have another observation to make regarding the input of the Yeager woman:
On the one hand she accuses Ron of being a gatekeeper when it comes to holocaust revision, yet on the other hand she declares all discussion on the subject pointless. This strikes me as somewhat of a contradiction.
Apparently, according to Ms Yeager, we should all declare the hoax for what it is, and leave it there, regardless of the fact that millions upon millions of ordinary people have never in there lives known there was even a debate on the matter.
And in the meantime, she would have us believe that Ron Unz is some kind of gatekeeper, preventing the truth from getting out.
Ron describes her as stubborn and delusional. I think he’s far too kind.
On yet another note, I’ve very much enjoyed reading this discussion. Thanks to Ron, and to the wealth of reading material he provides, plus his wider references, and thanks also to John Wear, amongst one or two others, my own knowlage on the subject of the second world war, and of the evidence which disproves the “holocaust”, I’ve been able to follow the debate with enough background knowledge to know what people are actually talking about.
I don’t yet know enough, with enough confidence to join in. But I’m learning!
Thank you all.
Kali.
“…And it was thanks to the Soviet Union, thanks to Stalin’s position, that Poland gained significant lands in the West, lands of Germany…”.
That would make Poland a receiver of stolen goods. Furthermore, Poland knowingly accepted these stolen goods.
By western standards that makes Poland a criminal entity. Now Poland has the temerity to ask for “reparations” payments from Germany. The German reply sought to be: “Return our stolen lands, compensate all the families whose lands and properties you stole, etc. and we can talk about it.”
Of course Germany already is pouring billions of Euros into Poland via EU payments. As most of us know, for those receiving free stuff it is never enough.
“…It’s why Adolf Hitler is among the bravest of men, what he did out of love and concern for his people, not out of personal ambition…”
Well, what about his infamous Nero Decree to destroy all Germany’s infrastructure, which Speer wisely sabotaged? In his Darwinian thinking the German people didn’t deserve to survive anyway. Not exactly an example of his “love” for the German people.
See video:
Yeager: “what he did out of love and concern for his people, not out of personal ambition”
Du spinnst.
Hitler didn’t give a s— about the German people.
Not even his oldest friends and earliest supporters.
You should not make out that your experience is the typical one. “Holocaust” as a religion (Holocaustianity) was described extensively by Robert Faurisson in 2008, although his revisionist work began in the 1970s. He wrote “The Secular Religion of ‘the Holocaust’ – a tainted product of consumer society.”
You admit that
Ron’s article was published here in 2018 !! Your first introduction to holocaust revisionism! You show an incredible level of ignorance. Yet now you think you should instruct Carolyn Yeager (carolynyeager.net) on whom to believe about this subject. Classic example of the arrogance of ignorance.
Absolute crap. British ‘anthrax bombs’ were from a work of fiction, Brave New World by Aldous Huxley.
The intense bombing of German civilian populations by the Bomber Command under bomber Harris was far worse than your mythical ‘counterweapon’.
Stalingrad or Volgograd is nowhere near Britain, if Hitler had allowed the use of the nerve poisons, it would have worked.
As you likely know, a very strange Buddhist cult in Japan made a plant to make the the least potent of those chemicals. Very unhappy for those exposed.
Your ideas are nonsense.
I’d just like to pay tribute to David McCalden of Belfast in N. Ireland.
His “Holocaust Revisionism for Beginners” was the first major analysis of the holofraud I watched after a few short articles, abt 15 years ago.
As a fellow Celt, I wish to post Respect for David who was a cofounder of IHR, that used to be better than it is today, and wrote some other materials. Those interested may check his name at CODOH. He and Bradley Smith were friends.
Often controversial and at loggerheads needlessly with others, I’m nevertheless sorry you died so young, David. Thanks for your contribution to Truth.
Here’s a link to his “Beginners” vdo.
It was a landmark for me back then.
https://altcensored.com/watch?v=cWTaXa7aR_E
Dagnabbit.
I’ve got work to do, Propaganda Tool Franklin, and beyond that, I promised myself to “fast and abstain” from the endless school-yard fights on this topic.
But the video you posted must not be permitted to pass uncritically.
My primary school education (such as it was) was mostly memorization of Catechism Q&A.
In that context, I was drilled to understand that “When someone tells a lie, it’s like shaking a feather pillow into the wind.”
As is sometimes the case with young children, I resolve then and there to be a “gatherer of feathers.”
Impossible, I know now, but just as Kevin Barrett conveyed recently that an infant whose genitals have been mutilated never overcomes that betrayal, so I find myself unable to set aside the compulsion to confront liars, to “gather feathers.”
Perhaps you can explain these “feathers” from the Nero Decree video:
1. Regarding Albert Speer: Is it not the case that an adversary will frequently preserve and nurture one (or more) of their Opponents, preferably one who was close to the decision center, in order to exploit him for their future purposes? Has it ever crossed your mind that Speer might have been such a “patsy;” that, in exchange for providing useful information (i.e. ratting on his friends), he would be allowed to live to a ripe old age?
2. Regarding the video’s creator:
a. Who is “Dark Docs?”
b. What is his agenda?
c. What are the sources used for the doc?
d. Has he tested the validity of the information he used?
e. Has he provided broader context for the scenes and narration presented?
f. Where does he get the financial & other resources to pursue this agenda?
g. What does he/she hope to accomplish by creating these video “docs?”
3. Regarding the video itself: I viewed it twice, the second time with the sound OFF and took quick notes on the number & duration of scenes in which destruction, usually in fire and smoke, was on-screen. In the 10.38 minute video, slightly over 2 minutes of the presentation featured such destruction.
4. If Albert Speer contrived to NOT carry out the Decree Hitler ordered in mid-March 1945, how did all that destruction come about?
4a. This cycles back to Item 2.e., “broader context:”
By March, 1945, when (according to Wikipedia–>Hugh Trevor Roper) Hitler issued a “Nero Decree,” British and American Air Force had dropped so many tonnes of bombs on Germany (and Italy and France) that they were running out of targets. By one account, Allied bombers returned to their base with the full complement of bombs because they could not find a German city that had not already been reduced to rubble (some of them, multiple times).
Jörg Friedrich discusses this at length in The Fire: The Bombing of Germany, 1940 – 1945.
4b. The Wiki entry includes this quote of part of the Decree:
Isn’t this rather SOP for military units in combat — to destroy their own armaments, etc., rather than allow the Adversary to take and use them (Afghanistan notwithstanding)?
4c. On the other hand, as Friedrich details and as documents of the US Department of Interior detail, beginning early in 1942, under orders from Franklin D. Roosevelt, “German Village” and “Japanese Village” were created at Dugway in the Utah desert.
At Dugway, the US AirForce; Standard Oil Company; Erich Mendelsohn “the Jewish architect” and fellow Jewish architects then at Harvard; and set designers from Hollywood studios, collaborated to build and furnish exact replicas of civilian housing in Germany. They researched and developed maximal means of creating firestorms that would consume the civilian housing and their civilian occupants, and practiced and perfected their techniques on the structures they had created.
Civilian.
Even babies in their cribs:
NOT military-transport-industrial or other elements that might be of value “for the prosecution of the war.”
The Allies planned, perfected, and carried out air raids to produce firestorms on civilian housing and their civilian occupants.
These are war crimes.
5. So explain to us, SFB Franklin Ryckaert, what did you hope to accomplish by posting DarkDoc’s film?
> Stalingrad or Volgograd is nowhere near Britain
Using a new type of weapon in any of the theaters of war would have been treated as an escalation across the entire war. Bombings had already been used by both sides, though the Allies gained the advantage from 1942 onward.
“But the Allies committed warcrimes by bombing civilian targets”. I acknowledge that, but that is another subject. To introduce it here is whataboutism. Hitler ordered his Nero Decree without any consideration for the future of the German people, because in his Darwinian worldview by losing the war they deserved no future. And that my friend is not exactly “love for the German people”. If that hurts your admiration for the Austrian painter, so be it.
Infamous in what sense? Like the Holohoax or the human lampshades?
Speer said many things after the war in an attempt to distance himself from the “Nazi stigma”. He claimed to have been in opposition to Hitler, that he tried to assassinate him. It was all lies of course, but his performance at Nuremberg and his willingness to smear Germany met with approval from his captors. His deputy Sauckel was hung, Speer was allowed to live. He was miffed at receiving as much as 20 years for his cooperation. Heinz Jost for example, the commanding officer of Einsatzgruppe A and supposedly responsible for the murder of hundreds of thousands of Jews, only got 10 years, commuted to 5!
Clearly “cooperation” was going on there as well.
The Führer Directives when viewed with sober eyes instead of through the “infamous version” given by Albert Speer, reveal sensible orders dealing with pressing military matters, and as seen in Directive 70, the rescue of civilian lives is at this desperate point in the war still given priority.
The moniker “Nero Decree” is somewhat apt in this connection. Because the Roman Senators lied about Nero in an attempt to smear him in the eyes of posterity. They tried to claim he had set the city of Rome on fire. In reality the culprits appear to have been Chrestians (Judeans…) whom Nero persecuted ruthlessly. For this he has gone down in history as the devil incarnate. It all sounds so familiar.
That is an interesting hypothesis. He had no offspring or extended family, so he certainly was not trying to create some kind of dynasty like Napoleon or Charlemagne. Hitler eschewed wealth and owned little, in fact he did not even have title to his chateaux in Bavaria.
What good does it do to create a thousand year reich when it just collapses anyway because you “don’t give a shit about the people”?
Either Hitler cared devoutly about Germany and its future, or he was a stooge for some other party.
Ignoring for the moment the faultless logic saying the Holohoax happened because of Heebhunter, I shall rather come up with some recent Jewish comments of my own:
Hitler deliberately did not marry or have children for a variety of reasons which he mentioned in private conversations with friends, his secretaries etc.
a. Present the image of a man that was unconditionally dedicated to his nation.
b. No time to raise a family.
c. Avoid saddling Germany with an incompetent heir.
Bombing civilian targets is NOT “whataboutism,” it is a war crime, a crime against humanity, crimes for which the perpetrators have not yet been held to account but, even worse, crimes that are celebrated. That you participate in that celebration makes you complicit in those crimes.
Destroying one’s own military war-fighting materials to deprive the enemy of their use is rational military practice, not criminal.*
That, my friend, is mind-reading through a warped brain. not by a cool assessment of what was happening and what the so-called Nero Decree actually said.
Wikipedia quotes Hitler’s Decree thus:
which expresses precisely the opposite of your projected interpretation:
“The enemy will leave . . .”
“will leave” indicates the FUTURE tense:
The statement indicates a calculation of what might/”will” happen, not exactly the work of genius inasmuch as major cities in Germany were already “scorched earth.”
SFB Franklin wrote: “without any consideration for the future of the German people
Exactly the opposite of what the words say: if Hitler and German leaders had been unconcerned with “the future of the German people,” they would have been the first to flee, leaving “the German people” to fend for themselves.
Obviously, that did not happen: Speer is, seemingly, the only one who sought and gained protection from the Allies and, thereby, survived.
Furthermore, they would have been unconcerned that an enemy that was already raping their female children and old women would find and utilize the armaments of the German people.
SFB Franklin wrote:
What do you mean by- and where do you find explication of – “Hitler’s Darwinian worldview?”
Nothing in the quoted Decree hints at anything that would remotely support your interpretation.
Nor do I think I have mentioned Hitler’s “love of the German people” nor my own “admiration for the Austrian painter.”
Do you find yourself compelled to resort to jousting with Straw Men inasmuch as you have no argument to otherwise support your assertions?
You quoted me as saying at the time:
I thereby acknowledged the word is in the book.
There were never any”death marches.” Moving prisoners from here to there, partially on foot, was not done in order to kill them. Nor were they shot at random along the way. Do you buy the whole schtick? If so, you really are SFB. (I had to look that up to find out what it meant. Hint: check the Urban Dictionary.)
Plus, I don’t know about “Nazis” but yes, the Wehrmacht and SS were always rational and efficient. Many committed suicide when the end came, along with their Leader. That was rational too.
You have not responded to a central, critical conundrum of DarkDoc’s video:
If Albert Speer contrived to NOT carry out the Decree Hitler ordered in mid-March 1945, how did all the destruction [depicted in the video] come about?
That’s first.
Second, on the military rationality of destroying military materiel, (and in the spirit of whataboutism) this is what the Allies did:
(based on a conversation from 12 or 13 years ago when Amazon used to host interactive forums —
“Son of Yehudi Menuhin Questions Holocaust”
https://www.amazon.com/forum/history?cdForum=Fx33HXI3XVZDC8G&cdMessage=Mx3QLSFNSHIX4KO&cdPage=4&cdSort=oldest&cdThread=Tx3PBR3O4LKZWOS (link no longer exists)
validated by disclosures in the film, Ritchie Boys.
The photo of Parloff is from the film — former Ritchie Boys took a sentimental journey to Fort Ritchie and ruminated on their activities while working as spies, saboteurs, interrogators and subversives in the German battlefield.
https://ritchieboys.com/EN/boys_parloff.html
They claim responsibility for having acquired the unprecedentedly large cache of German documents that were the source of William Shirer’s Rise & Fall of the Third Reich.)
Years ago someone posted a video of the testimony of a Jewish doctor who was at Nordhausen when the camp was bombed by Allied Air Force. I have not been able to find that video. The doctor told of how he and others survived the bombing-raid then carried patients into the woods and hid for several days.
Thanks so much Arthur. David McCalden was a real professional (for an amateur!). I was not able to watch that one; is there another way to see it?
I’ve managed to embed this one with the help of Bill Finck – https://jan27.org/select_videos/ Third video down on the page. In 1984 with Bradley Smith. I’m very interested in all these “old” ones. Vintage!!
Sorry Arthur, I CAN watch the McCalden video after all. Guess I did something wrong the first time. Thanks for all you do.
Again you start with your ‘not quite efficient’ as an extermination centre B.S definition of what were clearly WORK camps.
These work camps were COMPLETELY INEFFICIENT as extermination centres. Even Blind Freddie can see that.
You also write:
As the Soviet hordes were advancing, looting/raping/murdering along the way, camp inmates were given the choice of staying put or walking the west.
German civilians were given the same choice – and they also chose to WALK.
And the reason BOTH camp inmates and German civilians WALKED is because there was NEXT TO NO RAIL AND ROAD TRANSPORT REMAINING.
In the final months of the war, the Allied air forces roamed the skies virtually unchallenged, and they bombed/strafed the German transport network into rubble*.
The winter of 1944/45 was a particularly brutal one and German civilian and camp inmates BOTH froze to death in the process. ie: the German authorities never intended that this be a death march.
Nevertheless, MOST did not die on this death march – the vast majority survived it.
(*Scroll up to comment # 281 and watch the brief videos showing strafing of EVERYTHING THAT MOVED in Germany in the final months of the war – the same videos YOU ALREADY SAW in a previous comment, but somehow got a sudden attack of amnesia and forgot about).
Not the way it was. The only inmates who could choose were patients in the hospital/infirmaries. All the rest were REQUIRED to go. This is a point of great confusion for many people, mainly because they like the idea that camp inmates & Jews CHOSE to go with the “NAZIS” rather than stay and wait for the Soviets. So false narratives like this get started, because somebody thinks it will benefit them.
Truth must be without fear or favor. Would a U.S. prison warden and guards abandon their prison and leave behind all those who wanted to stay? No, because the prisoners would be a danger to society if set free. The Geneva Convention, et al, required that all authorities keep track of those in their captivity and remain responsible for them — account for them. They could not just be set loose.
So all camp inmates, unless they were in hospital under a doctor’s care, had to leave the camp under guard and travel/march to the new location, where they would remain under guard. Carelessly saying they “had a choice” is unfortunately all too common.
This is all the land where the old native Serbs lived (the Poles and other Slavs are the offspring of the ancient Vinca Serbian speaking Aryans) and which the Germans seized during their penetration to the east over the course of 1000 years. The washed-up German history full of falsifications says nothing about it. That’s why one panzer here is surprised that there are 600 years of Berlin’s history before the arrival of the Germans in the 13th century, where the Serbs founded and gave their name to that city and many others. So the Germans should not forget that they live on a stolen territory (just like their Asian compatriots, the Turks) where they almost destroyed and assimilated the natives.
You mean the type of Jews that made old Blood and Guts General George S. Patton puke his guts out thinking about hours after smelling them en masse?
And you forgot one important anti…anti-Christ. The type of Jews that say Jesus existed, was stoned by the Sanhedrin and boils in excrement for eternity. As bad as they are, I wouldn’t bother hurrying them towards the Lake of Fire.
It feels like mr. forkyou is engaging in classic projection.
Speaking of Kyras Joel, if Jews were really White, Rockland County would look like Ruby Ridge and Waco.
No, you kept stubbornly insisting that he only used it when quoting the statements or documents of anti-Nazi sources like the U.S. government. But anyone who looks at his book can see he used the word 238 times, in every possible way, just like normal people do.
However, if you’re now finally willing to admit that 1+1=2 rather than 1+1=27, that’s fine with me. It only took you a couple of years.
Sure. Over the last couple of generations, American society and its media has probably demonized Adolf Hitler and Nazi Germany more than just about anything else. As I’ve pointed out, a great deal of demonization was probably based upon nonsense, but it obviously still has a tremendous amount of social force.
So naturally the sort of people willing to totally ignore that demonization would tend to be exceptionally fanatic and stubborn individuals.
In fact, exactly the same was true of Lenni Brenner, the fanatic Jewish Trotskyite who was the key figure in revealing the Nazi-Zionist economic partnership of the 1930s. As I explained in my article:
https://www.unz.com/runz/american-pravda-jews-and-nazis/#zionism-in-the-age-of-the-dictators
You are correct to be focusing on the ACTUAL Holocaust deniers. ie: those yarmulke wearing rabid Zionists that deny the REAL Holocaust of WWII and it’s genocidal immediate aftermath. ie:
1) The murder through incendiary bombing of German and Japanese civilians during the war, coupled to the dropping of the A-bombs.
2) The murder/starvation of millions of ethnic Germans in bordering nations (eg: Sudetenland, Prussia etc), that were driven out/dispossessed of homes where their forebears had been living for centuries.
3) The murder/starvation of German civilians (within its own borders) and up to a million German POW’s, from the deliberate starvation level calorie allotment of food.
These things collectively are AT LEAST an order of magnitude worse than the sum total of the few hundred thousand Jews that died during WWII (mostly from the 1942/43 typhus epidemic, from natural causes, and from malnutrition in the concluding months of the war as the German logistics/food transport network had been decimated from Allied bombing/strafing that entailed that German civilians were themselves starving in the concluding months of the war).
You also write:
Once again, I’m in full agreement that the malevolent Jews that are peddling the phone Holohoax narrative should STFU, so that the revisionists can get there message out to the dumbed down masses.
Thereafter, we can once and for all expose the Holohoax myth for the crude lie that it is.
How any thinking person that had done even a scintilla of objective research (Hint: most didn’t) could have believed this for even one second, is beyond me.
As for the ‘useful idiots’ definition you’ve applied to rank and file Jewry in peddling the Holohoax myth, I think you’re being too generous here.
Yes, some of them were indoctrinated from birth with this nonsense and, although they’re well meaning people with a conscience, they haven’t tried terribly hard to search for the objective truth.
Meanwhile, MANY of them, know full well what they’re doing. They know it’s a hoax but continue propagating this nonsense because they (and world Jewry) stand to gain financially from it (because they can keep milking the German taxpayers for billions each year in reparations).
Very importantly also, whilst the Holohoax myth is still believed by many around the world, these small hat misfits can use the ‘alleged tragedy’ as an excuse for why they deserve to dispossess the Palestinians of their land.
In other words, at least to their twisted way of thinking, they’ve been through so much [alleged] trauma and hardship, we (the citizens of the world) owe them a homeland of their own.
As we all know, the minute the Holohoax myth is emphatically exposed in the minds of most of the world’s citizenry, there will be an IMMEDIATE demand by the nations of the world for the Khazarians* (individuals that have NO bloodline relation to those that lived there in biblical times), to depart and go back to whence they came.
(*unlike the Palestinians whose DNA proves they’ve resided there for millennia).
“…There were never any”death marches.” Moving prisoners from here to there, partially on foot, was not done in order to kill them…”
But that is not what the term is intended to mean. It means that many died because of the bad conditions which the Nazis didn’t care about. Not that the marches were especially organized to kill them.
“…Many committed suicide when the end came, along with their Leader. That was rational too…”
There are people who wish that they were that way “rational” already in 1933…
0Thank you, Carolyn.
Glad you were able to access it after all, hoping others will do so.
It’s a bit scratchy for those used to slick presentations, but was immensely valuable to me at the time. I had only read short more or less opinion pieces and David’s vdo opened the way for more serious reading like Holocaust Handbooks at CODOH. Ernst Zündel and wife Ingrid Rimland. R.I.P.
Link below for anybody interested.
Best Wishes.
https://ernstzundel.wordpress.com/.
I couldn’t disagree more, Skeptikal. Though certainly the zionist Palestine project predates the alleged extermination of European Jewry, it is the alleged “holocaust” which today puts (or attempts to) the jewish state occupying Palestine beyond criticism… because “never again”, because “special, unique suffering”….
It is only by citing their fantastical Holocaustian myth that jews, and “israel” are somehow, magically placed beyond scrutiny, their crimes against humanity to be overlooked.
Yet, on your recommendation of Douglas Reed, I couldn’t agree more.
Funny old world.
Kali.
Netanyahu fired one of his important MPs because he told the protesters in Israel that it was good that 6 million of them were destroyed in the Holocaust and that more should have been done. A rift is clearly emerging between the Khazars (Ashkenazis) who have no connection to Palestine and the ancient native Judeans. It was the first public conflict of its kind that I had ever seen. Netanyahu is Khazar, and prominent Sephardim were Shimon Peres and Ariel Sharon.
Thank you for link to Jan27, Carolyn.
Anthony Lawson “stickler for truth” was another early (for me) voice.
Recommend to you, dear Reader. Also main page of jan27, where you may see the reactions of the Beast called “democracy” to those questioning its murderous racketeering under the guise of so-called history, “War on terror” etc.
They are in fact the terrorists.
I had somehow missed Dean Irebold. Thanks.
https://jan27.org/
So, I first came to the subject around 2018. According to you then, I should simply have been told “the holocaust is a hoax”, and no further discussion is required. In itself that’s a very silly and ignorant possition to take.
Also note, I have never once told you “whom to believe” on the subject, and actually have frequently agreed with you and been persuaded by you on various aspects of these discussions. For example, I agree/d that any discussion of the holocaust should use the official, definition (6 million, gas chambers, etc) as a baseline. I also was persuaded by you that Hitler knew nothing of Hess’s unauthorised trip to Scotland. – So, on the actual subject in question, I take no issue with your expertise.
It’s your shitty attitude, belittling the work of others, whilst trolling the comment threads that I take exception to, as I have made clear in the past.
Ron is here, opening up this subject to a wider audience, whilst you nit-pick and criticise. Yet it’s through Ron, John Wear and others, that regular people like myself, may come to discover your work. Try developing a little grace and showing a little gratitude.
Kali.
I just saw this video on Stormfront: https://www.stormfront.org/forum/t1389392/
Putin is showing a bunch of killings during WWII. Of course, I really don’t know what is really going on here since I didn’t witness any of it with my own eyes. There are extremely poor quality video footage of what may be real or staged dead people, or people who were killed by someone, maybe the Israeli Russian Bolsheviks themselves, but then blamed by Putin on the Ukrainian nationalists. And Putin then writes a narrative about what is going on, in which he claims that it was Ukrainian White nationalists who killed all those people because they were not racially pure Ukrainians, but were other White races like Polish, and Putin says a lot of those killed people were Israeli people that Ukraine wanted to get rid of. Then Putin says a lot of those dead bodies were killed in the most horrific ways by the Ukrainian nationalists. He says babies had their eyes pulled out while they were still alive, and then the babies body parts were nailed to a picture frame to hang up for decoration. He says women’s stomachs were cut open while they were still alive, and salt was poured in the wound. Putin seems to be enjoying himself when describing actions that many people today falsely believe happened during the Spanish Inquisition – all those stories about sadistic tortures of Israeli people – as if Putin joyfully felt that he scored big in tricking Russian citizens into continuing the war in Ukraine.
Putin then says all these atrocities only stopped after Russia came in, and out of love for humanity, stopped the killings by the Ukrainian nationalists. Putin then says that these same Ukrainian nationalists run Ukraine today, and it is these same nationalists that Russia is at war with right now, and Russia must continue on in the war so that Ukrainian nationalists won’t once again start torturously killing Israeli people and Polish people and women and children and babies.
So, how many lies here is Putin saying? First, whatever torturous killings Ukrainian nationalists may or may not have done, it is a matter of record that Bolshevik Russia under the rule of the Israeli people killed dozens of millions of Conservative Right-Wing Nationalist Russian Slavs. Putin pretends this major event did not even exist, an event well documented by Kevin MacDonald and Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn. The Red Army was the Israeli Bolshevik Army, and the only reason they invaded Eastern Europe was to protect Israeli people and incorporate all of Europe into the Israeli Russian Bolshevik Empire, with the intention that Israeli people will rule over all the White people, and eventually all the Gentiles of the world. Putin has personally erased all of this history from Russia. Putin’s entire narrative is built upon lies, which he is using to convince Russians to agree to continue the war in Ukraine.
Putin says that this same torturous Ukrainian nationalists who did all those killings in the past are now in charge of Ukraine. If Putin was Pinocchio, how long would his nose be now? Putin is well aware that Ukrainian nationalists don’t run the Ukrainian government, but that Israeli people do. Zelensky himself is not even in charge, but rather the international Israeli community collectively run the Ukrainian government. Putin knows this. But, he must lie to get Russian citizens to continue the war.
Regarding Putin’s beloved Red Army, he omits the fact that they mass raped German females as they moved Westward through Europe. So, I suppose one could be shocked at just how much Putin lies. One can ask how it can be possible for one single leader to be such an extreme criminal towards his own citizens. But then, Pretty much all the White politicians of White nations also lie just as much as Putin just for the sake of getting wealth and power. It’s a common phenomenon.
On a final note, one knows that a politician is being deceptive when he uses the word “Nazi” instead of the actual phrase National Socialism. “Nazi” was created as a derogatory term by Israeli people. It would be like a politician trying to get the public to not care about the well-being of Blacks by always referring to them as the N word, as opposed to just Blacks, or African-Americans.
#409 #425 Ron Unz
“So it’s obviously a matter of definition, but I think it’s perfectly reasonable to say that all the German states and Austria had been united for about a thousand years in a single political entity. “
” I had emphasized that the Empire varied considerably over time, but it did exist in substantial political form for the better part of a thousand years, and during that time it included Austria and all the other Germans. “
193 states are gathered in powerful political organization ONZ. Can I claim that they are one nation?
USA, Canada, Ireland, England have the same language and similar culture but nobody claims they are one country or one nation.
We see that Germany and Austria are different countries althought they share similar culture and language.
But many people don’t see that 200 years ago in Germany were many such “Austria”s.
Germans divided themselves into many independend entities.
Separatism of Germans was enormous. Much bigger than in other parts of Europe (maybe except Italian separatism).
The question is, why Germans were so deeply divided from X c. till XIX c. while the most of European countries were (more or less) united.
And when Germans finally were “united” into one nation, they unleash two world wars just in next 70 years.*
I repeat my opinion, it is because Germans don’t have talent to build healthy nation.
—-
* – I know that it is debatable who is responsible for unleashing two world wars but I suppose, that we can at least agree that Germans willingly and enthusiastically took part in those “enterprises”.
I’m sorry, should be UN (United Nations) not ONZ. Please replace “ONZ” with “UN” in my comment if possible. Thank you in advance.
America could pass a Constitutional Amendment to rescind every Jew’s citizenship, seize their property and deport them to Israel.
LEGALLY!
Apologies and LOL. It seems that you have a great crystal ball.
Am abt. half-way through Mr. Cole’s latest weekly column, and so far, it is entirely an attack on mainly Mr. Unz, but also Anglin, and commentors on this site in general.
Wow. He begins by saying the Ukrainians are responsible for the Babi Yar massacre, which never happened! I say it never happened because the accounts range from 30,000 to 300,000 killed, yet there hasn’t been a single body excavated, no bodies, no bullets, no investigation. Plus, the Allies coerced a preposterous confession out of Paul Blobel, the confession has been scrubbed from the internet … but not the wayback machine …
https://web.archive.org/web/20190513100145/https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/obliterating-the-traces-of-bodies-of-jews-killed-by-the-einsatzgruppen-june-1947
He confessed that the Nazis uncovered the graves, poured on some gasoline, and burned the bodies in place. Read more at https://web.archive.org/web/20230224053344/http://www.holohoax101.org/201/
Putin is in bed with Chabad big time … it is frightening … https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2013/06/16/disputed-jewish-collection-exhibited-a24959
573 (“reply” function is, as per usual, not working).
@Skeptikal
Hitler wanted his effort to rid Germany of its Jews to be “legal.”
America could pass a Constitutional Amendment to rescind every Jew’s citizenship, seize their property and deport them to Israel.
LEGALLY!
+++++++++++++++++++
It sure helped Hitler and the Nazis pass those “laws” by ridding the Reichstag of all opposition parties first.
Just declare them illegal and send the politicos to Dachau for “reeducation” or, if they happen to be Jews, make them an offer they can’t refuse to leave Germany forever!
First, take their real passports and replace them with ones that are valid for a few months only, for the purpose of exiting Germany only (cross a border and enter a neighboring country). No reentry. Maybe make a deal with some Jewish authority somewhere that they will be trundled off to the desert in Palestine.
I wonder whether we could do the same thing! To rid the USA of the Israel Lobby.
See my comment #551, which was intended as a reply to this one from Unz. Thanks.
Kali,
You seem to be agreeing with me on every point.
NB: There is a difference between “Holocaust” revisionism (I hate to use the H- word, as it has become—or, probably, was conceived as—an intellectual, emotional, and political bludgeon) and “HoloHoax” shrieking.
Do you speak German or Russian or Polish?
Are you familiar with any primary sources?
Do you have any family members who were actually affected by the events under discussion?
Israeli people = Jews, and it is true that it was created by them. Most leftist-communist leaders in Germany were Jews — not all, but the majority. That, with only 1% of the German population being Jewish. It was they who took the simple shortcuts of ‘nazi’ (nationalists) and ‘soci’ (socialists — at that time signifying communist or international labor movement, ie. Workers of the World Unite) and began calling the NSDAP “Nazis”. Since they were so dominant in the media even then, all over the world, they could do it.
We must remember the mainstream media is Jewish, and is the enemy. Why can’t Ron Unz understand this about the term Nazi? Why does he insist it is harmless and was widely used by Goebbels, et al, but the only thing he produces is one newspaper promotional series “A Nazi Goes to Palestine” and the cheap advertising tokens that were produced along with it? How about an example of Adolf Hitler using it? Where is that?
Where are all the instances of using the term Nazi by actual upper echelon members of Adolf Hitler’s government? Or even by Wehrmacht military commanders. Or how about the SA and SS? I’m asking Ron Unz to reply to this with the same alacrity he replies to what he thinks is his solid case about Arthur Butz.
“Bolshevik Russia under the rule of the Israeli people killed dozens of millions of Conservative Right-Wing Nationalist Russian Slavs. Putin pretends this major event did not even exist, an event well documented by Kevin MacDonald and Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn.”
No one has ever documented such insane claims. Solzhenitsyn was a blowhard who recalled his life in 1937, at the height of the purges, as a time when “the brightest of futures lay ahead.” Yet he also casually repeated Kurganov’s hoax of “66 million” without even bothering to ask himself why he had never noticed this happening during the events themselves. Actual research from the archives since 1991 supports Getty’s conclusions:
“The new documentation has confirmed other aspects of the terror that I have suspected for some time. For one thing, the archival evidence from the secret police rejects the astronomically high estimates often given for the number of terror victims. Certainly, the numbers are still terribly large, and even the more modest figures from the archives do not make the terror any more palatable or easy to understand. We should not need to artificially run up the score to tens of millions of victims to realize the horror of Stalinism.”
— Archibald Getty & Oleg Naumov, The Road to Terror: Stalin and the Self-Destruction of the Bolsheviks 1932-1939, p. xiv, Yale University Press, 1999.
Here is a correct link to that part of the Laibach’s DPRK performance. Audience reactions are very interesting (as I think is the song).
This reply seems to be dumped here, but this is the Laibach performance of the song Whistleblowers in DPRK, audience reactions are mixed, and interesting.
Watch for yourself, any human can see.
> Most leftist-communist leaders in Germany were Jews — not all, but the majority.
That was definitely not true of the Communist Party. The Social Democrats had many Jews in their leadership, but not the KPD.
—–
In 1930, however, the communists tried to shout down their nazi competitors in the fairground of nationalism … by making concessions to anti-semitism. It was pointed out that there was not a single Jew on the central committee, and only one in the parliamentary party.
—–
— Arthur Spencer, “National Bolshevism,” Survey: A Journal of Soviet and East European Studies, October 1962, p. 145.
—–
While German Jews constituted a disproportionate percentage of the Weimar-era left and also of the anti-Nazi underground scene, the KPD’s Jewish membership was never very large. By some estimates there were approximately one thousand Jewish Communists in 1927 in a party of 140,000. … This would be roughly proportionate to the Jewish population of Germany at the time.
—–
— John M. Cox, Circles of Resistance: Jewish, Leftist, and Youth Dissidence in Nazi Germany, pp. 74, 80.
The Social Democrats had been regarded by Lenin as the main obstacle to the growth of a new revolutionary party. The piece “The Proletarian Revolution and the Renegade Kautsky” was his formal denunciation of the Social Democrats as the main force blocking the proletarian revolution in Germany. He saw more of a temporary common interest with the German army officers such as Hindenburg than with Karl Kautsky.
“Nazi’ was mostly used in quoted sources, not by Butz personally. To prove your case you need to distinguish between the two and give the number (much lower than 238) that were used by Butz conversationally. I say that Butz was seldom “conversational” in this book; that is not the way he writes. It was pretty much research, research, research. I just randomly looked at a very short section in Chapt. 7 under the heading “Conclusions” that I thought would be more ‘conversational’ than most. I copy it here:
Note that Butz uses the word “German” to indicate the Germans, when many others would substitute the word “Nazi” in those instances. You yourself tend to say Nazi when you could very well say German. But they were always “Germans” to Arthur Butz, as they are to me which is why I say what I do about him. Psychologically, Nazi separates them from Germans. Nazi has come to signify a special breed of inhumanity, as I pointed out in a recent comment somewhere.
I’m sure I could find many other passages in the book that would illustrate the same thing. It’s what I mean by saying “a careful reading” will tell us more than a “text search” will do.
All these various opinions don’t make an argument.
Agree, and under b. he said that his children would suffer for that reason (lack of an involved father), especially sons who would be held to too high of a standard to live up to (would have to grow up in his shadow). He thought it unfair.
Adolf Hitler was a very thorough thinker & planner. He seldom left any stone unturned.
I see. My apologies if I misread/misunderstood initially. I do agree that and end to ‘”Holohoax” shrieking’ would be helpful. Also, I also dislike using the H-word. I find Holocaustian/Holocaustianity much more helpful/fitting. I also dislike the term “Holohoax”.
I speak English (well) and some Portuguese (poorly), that is all, so I’m not familiar with any primary source material besides snippets I’ve read in secondary sources.
Naturally my family was affected by the war, my great grandmother having lost 4 of her 7 children in a single air raid, and of course my great grandfather and two grandfathers (plus various uncles) all fought with the Royal Navy, though, I believe exclusively in the Pacific theater. I doubt any of that was the point of your question though.
I do wonder what the point actually was. What are you trying to get at?
Curious regards,
Kali.
“…I suppose, that we can at least agree that Germans willingly and enthusiastically took part in those “enterprises”. ..”.
In your wet dreams!
Germany was and remains the most peaceful country in Europe*. The Kaiser’s and Hitler’s peace offerings certainly put to lie your assertions.
Agreed though, when attacked Germans fought back tooth and nail, hammer and tongs, etc.
Moral of the story: Leave Germany alone!
*After WWI and the continuous propaganda about the war mongering Germans, I wrote an essay regarding this that was published in Chronicles, a Magazine of American Culture. I found 4 studies to support my assertion above. Two were written by British authors and two by American authors. All four put to lie that assertion, giving numbers to support their conclusions.
I’m English and, sadly, I have to say that you are right about the English (English or British, but there’s no time for that topic now) being rabid dogs of war and saboteurs. They are war mongers, but so is the US and NATO.
However the British fall into three categories – the rulers who actually plot the wars, the majority of the public who fall for the propaganda and want war, and the very, very few like myself who can see through the propaganda. It is only since the internet came along that I learned the true history of WW2, so for most of my life I was one of the brainwashed masses. They are living in a Hall Of Mirrors. What they see is a distortion. They never see behind the mirrors. The media keep them in the Hall Of Mirrors.
Hopefully more and more will have the revelation, as I did, but it won’t happen quickly as most are bigotted. Try to tell them and they get angry, they don’t want to know. Mark Twain was right about it being easier to fool people than to convince them they’ve been fooled.
Yes, it is. You’re just talking through your hat. They intend to convey that the “Nazis” expected many to die on the way of the so-called march bc, as you say, ‘they didn’t care’ and didn’t provide food, water. But this is a lie, both about caring and about the food, water. More lies have been told about conditions on the so-called “death marches” than possibly any other aspect of this hoax.
There were not even very many actual walking marches by inmates. Most of the time they moved by train. Often it was a mixture of both bc there weren’t train lines everywhere. The whole subject is full of invention and whole-cloth lies, and you act like it’s settled history. You are playing stupid when it comes to holohoax and 3rd Reich … how do you justify such irrationality to yourself?
Well then, let us see what LORD WIKIPEDIA says about the matter. Here are some quotes from the article ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_marches_during_the_Holocaust )
This shows once again what great humanitarians the Nazis, sorry…the Natioinal Socialists really were. Fortunately we have revisionists like you to set the record straight.
Actually, I was citing pretty factual data, not opinions. The Central Committee of the KPD did not have any Jews in 1930; the KPD in 1927 had about 1000 Jewish members out of 140,000 total members; Lenin had always treated Social Democrats such as Karl Kautsky as the primary opponents of any attempt to build a Communist Party in Germany. It’s also a fact that the KPD and NSDAP collaborated together against the Social Democrats, as in the Prussian Landtag referendum.
Do you just do what you’re told? You’ve announced you’re satisfied with Ron Unz’s presentation as 100% reliable, with the addition of John Wear, to the extent that you can tell Carolyn Yeager what to think and where to go. That’s Kali.
You have never agreed with me openly, nor acknowledged my recent Hess article (that I announced here, and nor has anyone else), while you secretly learn from me what no one else can teach you. Certainly not John Wear, who you call a perfect person and gentleman. You need to figure out whether you value knowledge & truth over niceness & politeness of manner, and if the latter stay away from this site, or from certain posters such as myself. I never invited you into my conversations; as I recall you came in on your own accord thinking you needed to scold me. You’re still doing it, as in “It’s your shitty attitude, belittling the work of others, whilst trolling the comment threads” , while you copy my style and vocabulary shamefully, as best you can.
is belied by your adamant (stubborn) defense of Ron and John, as though they are all that anyone needs and beyond reproach). You would like to think they’re all that you need, but alas, the truth is much bigger than that and I do believe you’re too small and too far behind. Stop hoping you can graduate by cheating. It takes time to learn and you’re a slow learner.
Hitler in his own words and elite Jewish leadership in their own words.
Video Link
Patrick McNacnally is full of something like antfa Big Sister, as Winston is full of Big Brother after his cure.
I checked, the British did have a small stock of anthrax bombs, one would assume to drop on cattle, that was in WWI days, and a little after.
Japan, in the thirties, also played with anthrax bombs. I would assume with possible aim of livestock.
So, pure rubbish except for Mustopha Monde’s precis of history in Brave New World.
A work of fiction.
Hitler would have been able to deliver nerve gas to Britain, via normal aircraft, then VI and VII, but never chose to. Certainly would have been very effective!
Look, “Alden” claimed upthread that Bavarian German and Prussian German are entirely different languages. That seems totally ridiculous to me, but I’m not an expert on German, so I suppose it’s remotely possible that she might be correct.
However, your claim that Butz never uses the word “Nazi” in conversational terms can be disproven by anyone who merely looks at his book. I feel ridiculous wasting any time on this, but I’ll start with Chapter 1, which uses the word “Nazi” 37 times(!!) almost all of them “conversationally.” Here are the first ten examples of this:
(1) “Chapter 1 • Trials, Jews and Nazis”
(2) “In the middle of the heated election campaign of 1946, just before the major Nazis Göring, Ribbentrop et al. were to be hanged…”
(3) “…the killing, mainly in “gas chambers,” of several (usual figure, six) million Jews of all ages and conditions by the Nazis during the war…”
(4) “…was deported during the war to occupied eastern territory by the Nazis and the Romanians.”
(5) “…While he believes that many Jews perished as a result of the combined effects of Nazi policies and wartime conditions…”
(6) “The Nazis, on the other hand, thought that there were 865,000, and I see no motivation for deliberate inflation of this figure; other figures used by the Nazis were not wildly inflated compared to the figures of other sources.”
(7) “…both of whom infer from their data five to six million Jewish victims of the Nazis.”
(8) “Rassinier accepts the reality of about a million Jewish victims of Nazi policies…”
(9) “This was the trial of the top Nazis Göring, Hess, Ribbentrop…”
(10) “…constitute major source material for writing any history of Nazi Germany…”
Anyone can click the link and see for themselves.
https://www.unz.com/book/arthur_r_butz__the-hoax-of-the-twentieth-century/#chapter-1-trials-jews-and-nazis
I really feel like I’m arguing with someone on LSD who’s claiming that 1+1=27.
Mearsheimer’s dissidence on Ukraine policy comes with the proviso that the US has the sacred duty to run the world and set it in order. Watch his early talks on the matter. His opposition is rooted in the realistic assessment that global governance plans and a century of social engineering could go up in smoke if a war between Russia and the US were to go badly for the Anglo-Americans. It’s a tactical difference.
Late to the conversation but what we had in the eve of WW2
FDR: Anti-Hitler, especially his revolutionary economic policies of National Socialism, anti-Japan (pro China), anti-British Empire (a threat to American export Capitalism, Imperial Preference), anti-all European Empires, pro-Stalin, pro-Communist
Churchill: Pro-Semitic, anti-German, pro-British Empire but hatred for Hitler blinds him. Anti-Communist but ready to support Soviet if it means destroying Hitler, believes in special Anglo-American relationship, ends up destroying his beloved British Empire.
Stalin: The main mastermind. Smart enough to know that (Western and Central) Europe was the pace worth having, unlike the shitty Third World, wished to eventually Bolshevise all of Europe, played the Western powers against each other at best he could and the Japanese vs the Chinese to keep Japan busy in the East.
Hitler: Wanted to unite all Germans into the Reich under a revolutionary economic as well as civilizational system.
Japan/ Tojo: Wanted to stop the spread of Communism in East Asia.
Simple As.
Oh, Carolyn, you had to go and spoil it didn’t you. You were doing so well too, providing argument, insight, perspective and analysis, all of which were valuable and helpful. – To the extent that I’d pretty much decided to make a comment to that effect, thanking you for your contributions.
I think I can safely say that when your not busy trolling an belittling the work of others, you are an asset to these discussions. Such a shame you’re an unrepentant troll with a most off-putting personality.
With lame straw-men like this you really do let yourself down, Ms Yeager. Tsk! Where, when have I EVER said such a thing? lol
When? Where? I may tell you you’re jealous and bitter, but I do not tell you what to think or where to go. As for you referring to yourself in the third-person, are you sure you’re feeling ok? Maybe a lie-down would help?
Yes I did openly agree with you on at least two points within that same discussion that you decided to write, and later announced your Hess article.
I didn’t read the article you wrote. – I didn’t need to, because you’d already persuaded me within the discussion, that Hitler new nothing of Hess’s trip. By that time in the discussion, however, you’d already behaved in such an arrogant and obnoxious way toward several other commenters, including John Wear, that I had no intention of giving you any support whatsoever. Yet I began my participation in that thread agreeing with you on other points.
IIRC, that was the same conversation in which you challenged me to prove you were a troll according to definitions you provided. And so, after a little goading from you, I did exactly that. That’s when you suddenly fell quiet. Remember?
He is a gentleman, and a very gracious man. But perfect?? When? Where? You and your silly straw-men! lol
No figuring needed. The former is wasted without the latter. (Case in point, nobody from here bothered to read or acknowledge your Hess article).
The latter is empty and largely pointless without the former, but at least good human relation may be maintained with a little common curtacy and politeness.
I didn’t answer your initial question asking if I always do as I’m told. But go ahead and see if you can guess the answer to it now!
Oh dear. Your ego seems to be getting the better of you, Ms Yeager. Try to calm down. A nice cup of camomile tea may help.
Not at all, dear. But Ron’s work provides very helpful introductions to the broader topic, whilst John takes the student a little deeper. Of course, the references they provide may be used to go deeper still.
Did I inadvertantly enroll on history course? Goodness me! And here I was simply hoping to fill some of the gaps in my knowledge base. I guess Ron publishing his cheat-sheets on this website without warning or disclaimer had me fooled.
Or is it that you are just so jealous of the attention Ron gets for his work, and the traffic he attracts to his website, that you must scrape the barrel for insults to make yourself feel “BIG” and “FAST” and that your life’s work hasn’t been over-shadowed by a man who freely uses the word “Nazi” without caring how it offends you. God, that must really stick in your craw.
I’m reminded now that, along with a couple of other things, it was on the use of the word Nazi that I openly agreed with you it that other thread.
Easy now,
Kali.
I don not understand why you have so much anger for Ron Unz ???? Without him and his tireless work, we would not have this platform. And we would not have all of these wonderful articles to awaken us.
Perhaps you should read a little more closely https://www.unz.com/runz/american-pravda-holocaust-denial/ :
I do not see him as Controlled Opposition. Or a Gatekeeper. Your statement makes no sense to me.
I do not think we can expect any Jew to destroy every Jewish relationship he/she has and convert to Christianity in order to prove their worth to an angry goyim mob.
His net effect is most certainly POSITIVE. If every American would read his entire American Pravda series, https://www.unz.com/page/american-pravda-series/ there would be no more wars.
All of America would be AWAKENED. How many days, weeks, months or years of his life did it take him to write these articles??????Has he not put in the work for the betterment of mankind???
Why do you seek to destroy him? Besmirch his work? What is your end goal with these comments?
On a scale of 1 to 10, 10 being the most virulent Anti-Semitic Self hating Jew who converted to Christianity:
I see Brother Nathaniel as a 10. I love this guy. He is blunt, angry and committed. But is his strategy sound?
I see Norman Finklestein as 4 —for he knows the truth but dare not announce it. He is a coward.
I see Noam Chomsky as Controlled Opposition and probably an agent of Israel. He is a 2 for sure.
I see Israel Shahik as a 8 because he loved his Jewish culture, heritage and history but also loved even more the TRUTH and ALL fellow human beings.
I see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benjamin_H._Freedman as a solid 10.
Using this same scale, I see Mr. Ron Unz as a solid 8. I do not know is religious beliefs….but he seems very dedicated to Scholarly Truth. He takes great effort in putting in the time to thoroughly research before publishing anything. His tone is measured and erudite, never inflammatory or emotional. As a neutral historian should be.
If I were a chess player…and realized we live in the APEX of Jewish power and control ….would I kick that hornet nest? Would I raise my middle finger to the ADL and shout from the rooftop….”Bring it on Bitches”??? If I looked at the landscape of Jewish Control….would I excommunicate myself from my tribe or try to remain friends and quietly publish well researched articles? Would I be a foaming at the mouth rabid Anti-Semite or would I take a higher more scholarly road???
What is the best method for educating the masses? Info Wars.com or Dr. Jordan Peterson????? Joe Rogan or Victor David Hanson???
What method has the highest chance of success in todays highly polarized society?
The voice of calm reason soothes an agitated and bewildered soul.
Unfortunate that Carolyn Yeager is forced to take so much flak.
I appreciate the information she curates so carefully; it’s a lesson to me to be very careful when trying to undo a century of vilification and false information.
Also appreciate the work John Wear does (and many others on this forum).
Their motivations differ — all are valuable.
Thank you for posting this. It shows how little Butz used the word ‘Nazi’ even in this introductory-style Chapt. 1 titled “Trials, Jews and Nazis.” It comprises 30 full & dense pages in the book, so that averages only once every 3 pages. When reading it, it’s experienced as far and few between. If this was written by an anti-revisionist, the word ‘Nazi’ in some form would be peppered all over the pages. I’m not exaggerating. For example, close to the end of this chapter, there’s a paragraph wherein Butz uses “German” when he could have used “Nazi,” and many other authors would have, including Ron Unz.
Just looking at Chapt. 2, I see this paragraph, similar to the above:
It seems to me that Arthur Butz went out of his way to avoid using the term Nazi, while not refusing to do so where he thought it necessary or appropriate. So while I don’t claim to have “won” this argument, Mr. Unz didn’t either. It’s a matter of framing, as I said before. As he wants to frame it, technically he could say he did (and probably will), but I still hold that his “framing” is dishonest: I did not insist the word Nazi did not appear at all in his book, by his hand, but that it was how and how often it was used. My position was that Arthur Butz did not use the word liberally, and would have preferred not to use it at all. Of course that’s my opinion; I never asked him and do not want to bother him with it now.
Really, my dear, I do not care. Nor does anyone else. Please spare me your attentions.
I read Cole’s article attacking Ron UNZ this AM. He was right about some of the comments. It’s one thing to discuss WW2 and expose the standard history lies. It’s quite another to go off into……the nicest word is eccentric tangents.
Thank you. It’s very unfortunate that only 2 people on this thread know the basics of German and Austrian history.
I think your problem is not only a big Ego but also an exaggerated sense of having the only right opinion which makes you quarrel with those who are nearest to you. If you lived in Nazi Germany you would run a concentration camp, not for Jews but for Nazis who in your opinion were not anti-Semitic enough.
Hitler was an intelligence officer in ww1 He was blinded for two weeks by English gas.
That was inception for for his determination.
If you are one of those two, can you tell us when the Germans came to Europe, whether the Goths were Germans and whether the Germans took the land (the largest part of modern Germany) from the natives?
Ms Yeager is a beacon for Germans as defined by the people who lived in the section of Europe that became Germany in 1871 and ended in 1918. Nothing to do with other Whites and Whites of the European diaspora all over the world.
Said it yourself, you’re no expert on Germany. There’s also High German and Low German.
In fact, the DDP (Deutsche Demokratischpartei), a dead center liberal party that disappeared with the stock market crash, was the common home of a plurality of German Jews. This was so well known that the DDP was often called the “Jewish party.”
Ha, ha, ha.
First you claimed that Butz never used the word “Nazi.” But I pointed out he’d used the word 238(!!!) times, roughly once every two pages.
Then you claimed almost none of his usage was “conversational.” But I showed that nearly all of it was.
Now you point to the fact that he also sometimes used the word “German.” But I never denied that.
Instead of just admitting that you’ve been mistaken, you come up with the most utterly bizarre arguments. You’re such an exceptionally stubborn person, you’re basically delusional.
Your problem is that by never admitting you’re wrong even when you obviously are, you severely damage your credibility on all other matters. If people can easily see that you’re wrong—even delusional—on something so obvious, why should they trust your claims on more complex issues that they can’t easily check?
Add to that your extremely quarrelsome personality, and you’re the sort of individual who does severe damage to your own ideological side.
I very much doubt that the ADL is paying to support your efforts, but they probably should.
You’ve been claiming that the so called Germans are actually Serbians or Serbs. You claim that every Europeans from Sicily to Sweden and the Urals to Ireland are actually Serbs. You’re off in your fantasy world of the Serbian Empire.
Since the 17th c or so, written German has been standardized based on the Saxon dialect, which is the dialect Luther spoke and into which he translated the Bible.
Many, perhaps most, languages have prestige written forms and varying oral forms. This is far from unique and not limited to German. In fact, standard French is not the language a plurality of French people speak at home, particularly in the southwest, where the so-called langues d’oc are spoken. Standard Spanish is based on Castilian, in which Cervantes wrote, spoken again by only a minority. Ditto with Italian, based on Tuscan (written by Dante).
So it is absolutely true that spoken German dialects can be mutually unintelligible. Vorarlberg, in far western Austria, where my grandfather’s parents came from, has a very rarified dialect that is so difficult for “standard” German speakers to understand that it has to be subtitled on German TV. Someone else pointed out that Low German dialects, spoken in northern Germany, are similarly difficult to understand.
A journalist from Dortmund once told me that, when two Germans from, e.g., Schleswig-Holstein and Bavaria meet, they’ll typically use English rather than one of their dialects or the prestige dialect they might have learned at school. I tend to believe him.
Same goes for Italian. My grandmother and one of her sisters in law were both first language Italian speakers. Her sister in law spoke Neopolitan; my grandmother spoke Sicilian. They could barely understand one another and so used English.
Anyone who would care what David Cole thinks about anything is not worth listening to. David Cole is a truly awful person. If he came on this comment thread he’d be destroyed, and I guess he knows it.
The entire Taki’s Mag lineup is pretty awful; it’s more interesting to read Unz comments than to read Taki’s featured writers. Alden seems to be pretty easily influenced.
So tell me oh ignorant one, who was the King of Bohemia? And what were the years the Holy Roman Austrian Emperor ruled S and Central America Mexico and the Philippines?
All these experts on German history who think Austria was part of Germany and that a real country or nation called Germany existed before 1871.
None of you know the answers. I’m sure you can find them in your only source of information, wikipedia.
Can someone give a link to this Cole article?
Of course, you’re just putting your own spin on all of this, and on everything I say. Maybe there are people here who are not smart enough to see this, but I always have.
The bolded part is meaningless because of all the documents, charts and quotations that make up this book. But numbers mean everything to you. One ‘Anon’ fellow here speculated that you were on the autism spectrum.
Now the bolded part is indicating an outright lie. You ‘showed’ no such thing. So you’re becoming dishonest again.
I’ll wager you’ll find the word ‘German’ many multiple times more than the word ‘Nazi’, when used as an adjective, which is often.
This just shows that you suppress information that doesn’t conform to your wishes, and that you put more emphasis than is warranted on whatever you want to make into a major influence or identifying factor. An example of this is your saying that I never admit that I’m wrong. How would you know? The fact is that I admit when I’m wrong very easily — when I realize I’m wrong! But if I don’t think I’m wrong, why would I admit it?! I have learned over the years not be be intimidated into accepting that I’m wrong by bullies like you. Because intimidation is what it is. Ninety-five percent of the people posting here are intimidated by you, and by practically anyone, anywhere.
You can’t write anything to me without throwing in a couple of insults along with it. Do you notice that?
And you have the audacity to call Ron dishonest!
Your position was that Butz didn’t use the word “conversationally”. Ron went to the trouble, after being trolled by you in thread after thread one this one petty issue, of demonstrating that he clearly did. Now you attempt to dishonestly reframe your position!
What a pity, Carolyn, that you choose to waste your considerable talents and knowledge, and your years of research and writing, in egoistic trolling of others. You have so much to offer, and a great legacy of work to leave for posterity when you exist this plain of existence. It would be a tremendous loss if your work were to be disregarded simply because you failed, in your lifetime, to overcome your massive ego.
Think on,
Kali.
Germany is to European civilization what the US is to Jew Power.
Every white man should support the former and fight against the later, because it is in his self interest to do so. People who think Germany is just another nation have completely missed the point.
https://www.takimag.com/article/the-rights-ideological-dysgenics/
The article says that Chamberlain got evidence from German intelligence that Churchill was being paid by the Czech government and various Jewish people.
“Ironically enough, German Intelligence learned of this massive bribery of British parliamentarians, and passed the information along to Prime Minister Neville Chamberlain”
Has anyone seen this evidence? Did it come out in a freedom of information request?
You’re really such a silly person I can’t resist one more comment on this very foolish matter…
The formal name for Hitler’s regime was “National Socialist” or “NSDAP” but almost everyone in the world calls it “Nazi” for short and that term was even used in Goebbels’ own leading Nazi newspaper. You, however, are an extreme eccentric who detests that term and instead says that only the formal name should be used. Since you greatly admire Butz, you incorrectly cited his book as an example of such proper usage.
As I’ve pointed out, Butz uses the term “Nazi” 238 times, almost always in “conversational” terms.
But I just now checked and he only uses the term “National Socialist” once and “NSDAP” just six times, with almost all of those uses being when he’s quoting from other documents. So he almost never uses your preferred term and almost always uses mine. But you refuse to admit you were mistaken, and still stubbornly insist that 1+1=27.
This is exactly why I described you as an obsessive crank…
But this ‘missing the point’ is due to a failure of discernment, which is due to a failure of IQ (general intelligence) in many if not most individuals. They are thus subject to their lower emotions rather than to a higher vision. So the usual methods of improvement that are offered (more money, etc.) are not going to work. I am now convinced that Eugenics programs for intelligence as well as health is the only solution. Those who present it as immoral are the enemies of civilization, not the protectors of humanity.
This is the discussion we should be having — not just here on UR but on the larger world stage. It should not be left up to the shifty, dishonest technocrats.
I am very fond of Serbs. I’ve been invited to a wedding near Novi Sad and about a year later to a babtism. Both times the church ceremony lasted endlessly, the festivities several days and the mood was incredible, the food abundant and delicious (the booze, too). I felt like part of a very big family and those events have become part of my fondest memories. I wouldn’t mind to be mistaken for a Serb.
Vorarlberg is a dialect so special that even the neighbouring counties in Austria, Bavaria and Lichtenstein are baffled.
This site of Ron Unz helped me to leave the hall of mirrors and that was not so long ago
This article about Judeo-Communist genocidal murders during the “Great Purge” from 1936-38 is quite interesting considering that this is what Stalin was doing to ethnic minorities including the Volga Deutsche at the same time that the Germans got fed up with Jews constantly assassinating ethnic German officials and smashed a few windows
.
Vinnitsa, Ukraine: Where Jewish-Led NKVD Terrorists Murdered 10,000 Christians And Blamed It On The ‘Nazis’
So we have a proven MO (method of operation) where Judeo-Communists would commit mass murder and genocide, and then when caught would trump up the evidence and blame the very people that were trying to make them stop for the very crimes that the Jews had committed. Katyn Forest, Vinnhitsa. Just two examples of a repeating pattern that leads back to Stalin’s torchmen orders and “soviet” “partisan” war crimes.
Soviet Judeo-Communists had no great love for Eastern European Bourgeoius Jews or even Orthodox Stetl Jews. Operation Reinhard didn’t kill gorillions of Jews, the ((Partisans)) and ((Kommissars)) did.
Thanks for the intriguing article link.
One could say the specific template for ‘the H’ accusations of WWII, ie, ‘the camps’, the ‘cattle cars’, the planned systematic mass murder of prisoners, health measures (vaccination against disease) being turned upside down into diabolical instruments of death (‘poisonous injections’), manufacturing leather goods from the human skin of the ‘murdered’ prisoners, camp commandant(s) shooting prisoners down for sport, death camps (ie ‘slaughter-pens’), etc, can be traced back even further to the conclusion of the US Civil War in 1865.
That is the year when these fraudulent accusations were formally leveled against the defeated South in regards to it’s treatment of Union POW’s it held at Andersonville and other of it’s POW camps, and the apparent (ultimately failed) intention to first try by show trial, and then execute by hanging, the entirety of the upper echelons of the defeated South’s military and political leadership on that false basis.
These were largely Anglo-Saxon’s making the false accusations and they are ultimately responsible for their actions. However, to add context, there was (and is) an unfortunate ideology called British Israelism which has historically been believed in by powerful elements of the Anglo-Saxon elites and their hangers on, where they believe themselves also (somehow) to be Jewish, which may (or may not have) had some influence upon them here. [See link below regarding British Israelism.]
http://www.revneal.org/Writings/Writings/british.htm
The post war October, 1870 article linked and excerpted below, which appeared in the then hugely influential Atlantic Monthly, and which makes specific note of Andersonville, may be referencing British Israelism in it’s title, ie ‘Our Israelitish Brethren.
In more modern English the title would read ‘Our Jewish Brothers’.
https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/1870/10/our-israelitish-brethren/306257/
The execution of Henry Wirz, the commanding officer of Andersonville, on November 10, 1865.
‘Of the giant wrongs to which they [the Jewish people] have been subjected for the last ten centuries,—the huge Andersonville outrages,—few readers need to be reminded.’
Well, thanks again for adding this last comment; it helps me to bring out the most important points that might be getting missed in all the detail.
First, you are very determined to discredit me (which you’ve continued for about 4 years now) with your name-calling — a favorite tactic of yours. You don’t do it to everybody, only those you argue with.
Does this go along with your lack of interest in the Holocaust Handbook series and all the great early German revisionists such as Wilhelm Staeglich, Thies Christophersen, Juergen Graf, Udo Walendy, Ernst Zundel, Ingrid Weckert who really broke down the wall erected by the Nuremberg Tribunals, at considerable cost to themselves? They are the real heroes in historical revisionism, to whom we owe everything, But you actually try to brush that all away in favor of David Irving. How to explain it? Is it because you would like to be the current go-to expert on Holocaust Denial/Revisionism? Or is it because you don’t want to bring the Jewish Lobby holo-police on your head?
Second,
Interesting. WHY is the first bolded part true? Bc it was a Jewish project from the 1920’s on to call the NSDAP ‘Nazis.’ I wrote right here about the Nazi-Soci thing just the other day. Maybe someone can find it. This term was not popularized by the NS members themselves. It’s CLEAR history that Adolf History discouraged (even forbade) its use by his government and everyone in the party. Thus they did not use it.
Why is the second bolded part not true? Because I am right that the term Nazi was popularly used by enemies of the NSDAP to discredit them in the eyes of the population. I have answered for the “Nazi Goes to Palestine” example, that it was a one-off and why, many times both at my website and here. The only people who used it then were the newspapers and the opposing political parties. There is/was a reason for that! Ron Unz ignores this, won’t answer it. So I’m asking him now to respond to this one question – fully – to engage with it in good faith.
“On what do you base your stated belief that ‘Nazi’ is a perfectly harmless word “used by everyone” simply as a substitute for ‘National Socialist?’
You might answer, ‘On my own experience.’ In that case I would say that your experience is limited, and superficial. You need to look further and deeper into the issue. I would be happy to guide you, just as I’ve already, finally, enlightened you that the Der Angriff newspaper was not the flagship newspaper of the NSDAP, which you insisted on for over a year without ever even looking on Wikipedia to find out. If you do not wish to look further/deeper, then that is on you, not on me.
But the word Nazi is the cruz of the issue here and is not an eccentric one. Calling it eccentric is part of the agenda for further popularizing its use.
FYI, I do not have a ‘massive ego.’ My ego is in proportion to my abilities. In fact, I had to work on it to bring it up to where it is (what I mean by not being intimidated).
You, otoh, have an ego too large for your abilities, so that would be called a disproportionate ego. Maybe you are projecting.
In 1938 the Butovo firing range the Soviet ritual sacrifices reached a frenzy:
Those Judeo-Communists certainly had a lot to hide all across Ukraine. After they vanquished the Germans their retribution was sadistic and genocidal, especially against the local population. This is the Jewish legacy that Jews don’t want to own.
When a speaker of a German dialect wants to write a letter to another speaker of that dialect, does he translate it to the prestige dialect when he writes it down?
This is a phenomenon I have noticed in other languages, and am interested to know if it happens in Germany too?
Funny.
@610, Alden
I guess you didn’t realize that Hochdeutsch means “high German.”
Funny.
“All these experts on German history who think Austria was part of Germany and that a real country or nation called Germany existed before 1871. ”
My dear, you are mixing me up with someone else.
You are funny, and so are your absurd pretensions.
Well, that’s certainly possible. I emphasized that I don’t really know anything about the German language.
But if we leave aside especially unusual rural dialects, I’d still be shocked if the spoken dialects of different regions were actually as different from each other as Spanish, Italian, and French. For hundreds of years, students from all the different parts of Germany attended the same universities, and how would that have been possible if their German dialects had been so different that they couldn’t understand each other or what the professors were saying?
Was it really true that in (say) 1830 a Prussian from Berlin couldn’t understand the German of a Saxon from Leipzig or a Bavarian from Munich? I just find that very difficult to believe.
I read through it. This is what Cole wrote:
So he wants Unz to be useful to/for whom? I suppose he means useful to the respectable official right that achieves what? Getting some politician into office to make some infinitesimal change?
“What are you trying to get at?”
The same as with my question concerning knowledge of German/Polish and primary sources.
I often wonder how many people who comment here and go on and on about the HoloHoax have any direct experience of the complex sequence of events that ended in the Endloesung der Judenfrage.
What idog do they have in this fight?
If they were really serious about history(and not just debunking well documented facts and making a misunderstood martyr and humanitarian out of Hitler) they would acquire the requisite tools, the most basic of which is a knowledge of German (as did David Irving) and/or Polish.
David Cole is like an escapee from a lunatic asylum who is trolling everybody and getting away with it. Why does he get away with it? I say bc he became so famous via his participation in the H. Revisionist movement, pal-ling around with the likes of Ernst Zundel and Bradley Smith. There’s no other reason than the great interest in holohoax revisionism. Because he’s a jew, the controlling Lobby lets him be heard, but the honest-to-God, serious revisionists are prevented from being heard. Cole spouts nonsense, never really saying anything. The Lobby likes that. It keeps people scratching their head but not learning anything.
He should be shunned.
Someone might have taken HITLER’S place but I think it is unlikely to have been able to beat back the Communists during the 20’s when it took so much effort to wake up the German public who had been tricked into believing other not so pro German explanations as to why the Versaille Treaty was appropriate or not
Hitler was “the genius” the Protocols referred to as to an enemy who could possibly undo all the work already done by elite Jews that had given them internationally such a huge vice grip over the leavers of power
The Protocols said that the Genius was unlikely to succeed because of Jews secret cultural dominance
In the case of the German language, I’m with Ron Unz and have been from the beginning. I don’t think Alden knows what she’s talking about much of the time. I thought there was a more intelligent Alden here during my first year or two, but either it’s now a different Alden or Alden has deteriorated quite a bit. I think it’s most likely that the spoken dialect would be more difficult to grasp easily than the written. That’s even true from different regions in the USA. It’s probably more like that. Maybe a little more pronounced.
The book The Iron Curtain Over America by John Beaty mentioned in the OP, an interesting read, can be had for free as a PDF download if you do a search of the phrase below:
‘The Iron Curtain Over America – WHALE’
Mr. Unz. As a physicist, do you have an opinion on this? Thanks.
It was the Social Democrats who acted as the barrier to the Communist Party of Germany, not the NSDAP. The KPD was instructed by the Comintern to take the stance of “After Hitler, our turn!” This was the position of the Comintern that the only way the KPD could triumph was if Hitler first came to power and crushed the SPD. Then the eventual crisis of Hitler’s government would now enable the KPD to come to power, with the SPD no longer able to divert the working class. Although events followed a much more roundabout route than had been anticipated in 1928 when the “Third Period” of the Comintern was formulated, that was sort of how things went.
It is to be expected that dialects in hard-to-reach mountainous regions will deviate more from the standardized norm than (historically) more accessible areas.
I just did a search for “Vorarlberg dialect.” Apparently it is an Alemannic dialect.
Alemannic means a dialect of High German (new word for me). There are a whole lot of these.
Here is a Youtube film about the Vorarlberg dialect—called “the most difficult of all Austrian dialects.” For outsiders to understand, that is.
It’s a very charming little film and gives a good idea of the types of diversion from standard German. Many of these are also present in Bavarian, but less extreme. Also in the Schwaebischer dialect/accent.
Eons ago I went for a ski holiday to Lech, with the German student travel organization. I could understand the instructor. Obviously, as a ski instructor he was used to communicating with outlanders.
Yes, there’s plenty of responsibility to share.
Roger Casement’s brilliant 1915 book The Crime Against Europe traces British hostility to Germany back to 1870.
https://www.gutenberg.org/files/14728/14728-h/14728-h.htm
‘It might truly be said of the British Empire to-day that where two or three are gathered together, there hatred of Germany shall be in the midst of them.’
The then widely distributed and reviewed 1853 US book The New Rome offers a blueprint for future US/UK global conquest. After the US and UK form a practically unbeatable united front, they first move to conquer and gain control of continental Europe’s center of power, identified as Germany, thereby unleashing a ‘world’s war’ upon the Earth.
https://archive.org/details/newrome00poes/page/105/mode/1up
‘That great uprising of all peoples, that world’s war which is for ever seen to hang, like the sword of Damocles, over the passing joys and troubles of the hour, will fall when the Anglo-Saxon empire shall lay its slow but unyielding grasp upon the countries of the Germanic confederation. Then will the mastery of Europe be the prize of the death-struggle between the Union [the US] and the Czar [Russia].’
Thanks S.
Iron Curtain Over America by Beaty has been in the “Featured Book / HTML Book” box in the right-hand column for several months.
https://www.unz.com/book/john_beaty__the-iron-curtain-over-america/
After having read Cole’s latest scribbles I agree with you.
Thanks for the video. My ancestry line is Schwaebischer, that I know for sure.
“…If they were really serious about history(and not just debunking well documented facts and making a misunderstood martyr and humanitarian out of Hitler) they would acquire the requisite tools, the most basic of which is a knowledge of German (as did David Irving) and/or Polish…”.
I still read and speak German quite well. Ditto for the spoken German if it is not too complex.
About your “…debunking well documented facts…” And “…making a … humanitarian out of Hitler…”
Hmmm, we all heard about Hitlers orders to gas every Jew the Germans could lay their hands on, and that 6 million were gassed in Auschwitz and sent up the smoke stack where, judging by the colour of the smoke, it was possible to tell which people were being cremated. A little tongue in cheek but the latter is from an eye witness’ testimony.
So, my dear Skeptikal, I ask you to provide authenticated forensic evidence to substantiate your allegations that Hitler was not a humanitarian?
Recall that Hitler had been described as the greatest statesman had he not begun the holocost or WWII or whatever.
Mathis, why are you bothering posting a comment ? No one gives a rat’s arse what you have to say.
UR readers, this is the individual that responds with comments like this one to me (after I presented irrefutable evidence of the Holohoax fraud):
https://www.unz.com/announcement/the-holocaust-debate/#comment-6066410
I’m not the only one he’s responded to this way – he’s made quite a habit of it.
For those not familiar with Mathis, he is a known minion of ZOG/the ADL, who is paid to propagate the official narrative of the Holohoax. ie: gas chambers/6 million dead etc.
However, when challenged, he quickly gets flustered and starts throwing expletives around.
On another occasion, the response from the Mathis Midget was so vile, that Ron Unz had to interject and write this:
https://www.unz.com/announcement/the-holocaust-debate/#comment-6068427
I read the column and it struck me as little odd…
He’s supposedly very hostile to this website, denouncing and insulting me and several of our other writers. But most of his insults and attacks were fairly generic, basically saying I’m a bad, bad person and everyone should avoid us.
The problem with that approach is that anyone reading his column who hadn’t been aware of my work might become curious and decide to take a look. If they did, they’d probably discover that my articles come across very differently than he had implied, and some of them might become fascinated by the material. So perhaps I’d gain some new readers while Cole would lose a great deal of his credibility. For that reason, his attacks didn’t make any logical sense.
Put another way, if the New York Times or CNN ran a huge high-profile feature attacking this website exactly as Cole did, I’d be absolutely thrilled, and it would give us a gigantic boost. That’s exactly why they’d never be stupid enough to do anything like that.
Cole’s behavior is so strangely counter-productive that one might almost wonder if he quietly agrees with the ultra-controversial material we publish and decided to give us a boost, but did so in a safe, plausibly-deniable manner. After all, how can he get into trouble for ferociously attacking, insulting, and denouncing us?
Well, the discovery of a room temperature superconductor would be an absolutely gigantic achievement. But I’m not on Twitter and I’ve never heard of Alex Kaplan, so I can’t judge the credibility of the claim.
When I checked the NYT website, they had a big story about the retraction of a previous room-temperature superconductor paper, which apparently was fraudulent:
https://www.nytimes.com/2023/07/26/science/ranga-dias-retraction-physics.html
A story in the New Scientist seemed very skeptical of the latest claim:
https://www.newscientist.com/article/2384782-room-temperature-superconductor-breakthrough-met-with-scepticism/
So, WW2 was a farce, the history we’ve been taught is as well, the movies and shows – it is the most referenced event in everyday life still. The Germans were starved afterwards. We still occupy. JFK murdered by an insidious conspiracy, RFK, who vowed to reopen the case gets whacked. The most famous coroner says point blank shot to the head. Iraq 1, 911, Iraq 2. Time marches on, Russiagate, Hunter laptop, Epstein island, weird paintings referencing Clinton & Lewinsky, Bush the dunce and 911 found in his house. Nothing to see. Jan. 6th. Voting machines. Covid, shots, shutdown, riots.
We are on an endless loop with a downward trajectory. Thank you raising these issues Mr. Unz. But the voters keep voting as they do – you wonder why they want “democracy” to spread.
Satanic inversion
Many thanks for your references and quotes. The British mindset
against Germany was malicious and unfathomable, turning out to
be a disaster for both nations, and for the world balance of power.
If you had more enemies like David Cole you would not need friends.
He seems totally unhinged.
People are sheep. England is not governed for the benefit of the English, which is why you see browns and blacks flooding the country. More than a thousand years ago people understood that writing, then other media, is like a remote control for most of the population. So these parasites take the choke points of information and then use the population for their own purposes. Control of money is another way to control a country. These parasites sit behind banks and other great financial institutions.
Even when people rebel, as with Brexit, there is enough control in the system to defy what people want. Really we all need a complete collapse.
JFYI
Brief updates from Ukraine.
AFU make small localised gains for v high cost.
1. Dima. Overview. 15 mins.
https://rumble.com/v32n7fu-bradley-square-complete-destruction-of-ukrainian-armored-fist.-military-sum.html
2. Rabotino. tg.
🇷🇺🇺🇦 During today’s offensive in the Rabotino area, the enemy brought 10AK units into battle, indirectly confirming the complete loss of 9AK combat capability.
In the course of the so-called “counter-grunt”, the Armed Forces of Ukraine threw into battle at least two assault detachments from the 116th and 118th Ombre, reinforced by the BTG 47th Ombre. To support the offensive, two tank companies (33 ombr and 14 brng) were involved – up to 80 armored vehicles in total. As a result of well-built defense 58A, 21 tanks and 14 infantry fighting vehicles (various modifications) were destroyed.
Enemy losses in manpower, (according to rough estimates only) over 220 dead.
++++
You’ve got some things wrong. You wrote:
The retracted paper of 2020 by Dias was not about room-temperature superconductivity. Another paper by him which deals with room-temperature superconductivity is of 2023, and is in the process of evaluation by the scientific community. From the New York Times piece you cited:
This June 2023 NYT picece is about the superconductivity paper by Dias:
‘New Study Bolsters Room-Temperature Superconductor Claim’
https://archive.is/guhbH
From the latter NYT piece:
Dear Skeptikal,
Are you actually suggesting that anyone who takes an interest in the Holocaustian religion and its foundational myths must learn to speak and read German in order to debunk those myths using primary source data to do so?
Would you expect people to re-invent the wheel in order to ride a bike of drive a car?
The alleged extermination of European Jewry by NS Germany has already been conclusively debunked, the remaining dogma kept alive by repetition of outlandish myths obtained through tortured “confessions” and ridiculous “eye witness” accounts that don’t stand up to reason or scrutiny.
For my own part, I’m currently interested in learning about Hitler himself, in order to discover how much of the current dogma surrounding him is pure Allied propaganda, and how much is factual. Should I go to the trouble of leaning German first in order to read Mien Kampf in its original language, or simply read an English translation? I’m also interested in National Socialist ideology, and in National Socialism as it unfolded in Germany. I have several tabs open to (heaven forfend!) ENGLISH LANGUAGE books and articles on those subjects. Should I go ahead and close them? Would that be your recommendation?
One of the books I have open is Irving’s Hitler’s War, and just from reading the introduction alone I have my doubts about his acceptance of the Holocautstian Myth. But I reason that he knows much more than I about the subject at hand and so will read on, reserving a pinch of salt for sprinkling where I feel it’s needed. Is this an unwise position to take, do you think?
I also have John Wear’s Germany’s war open, along with several of his articles, yet John himself does not speak German. Should I close them, do you think?
How about I stop reading Mr Unz”s articles too, because he doesn’t speak German?
Maybe John and Ron should cease their writings on this subject all together. Yes? No?
And here am I using rhetoric to make a point, yet I was never educated in the trivium. How very cavalier of me!
Unapologetically yours,
Kali.
Dear Carolyn,
It appears you have confused ego with self-confidence.
It is your ego which causes you to attempt to undermine my self-confidence. That’s unfortunate.
It is my self-confidence that causes me to attempt to make you aware of your antagonistic and unwarranted ego, NOT in order to undermine you, but in order to help you to see the difference.
Kind regards,
Kali.
Well, Mr. Unz, since you replied to Che Guava on David Cole and to Johnny Walker, why don’t you reply to my latest question from what has been an ongoing dispute between us. Do you not have an answer to my question re “Nazi vs National Socialism” from comment #630:
I’ll reword it slightly to try to make it as clear as possible:
“Since you claim that “Nazi” was in common use, give some examples of it’s common use by high-ranking National Socialists during the 3rd Reich and afterward, or in any official literature produced by and for the Third Reich, of which there was a huge amount.” How about any use after the war by loyalists to the regime (we must realize most of them were killed), including people like Sylvia Stolz, Horst Mahler, Leon Degrelle, Ernst Zundel, etc.
Newspapers, other than the Beobachter, were not official Reich literature. Thanks.
Douglas Reed, The Controversy of Zion:
The Controversy of Zion is available at TUR! Please read the relevant chapters! Is is an absorbing read—Reed is also a great stylist with a sardonic sense of humor.
For his pretty well documented (in primary sources) account** of the sorry tale of the capture of British foreign policy by Zionists, and the ruinous outcome you could start with chapters 28, 31, and 32.
To access the book, go to the UR home page and find on the top menu line “HTML Books.”
Click that, then enter “Douglas Reed” in the find box. Click on his name and it opens to a page for the book. “Read more” opens to a list of the separate chapters.
**Reed quotes from many primary sources such as memoirs etc. but unfortunately he did not provide notes to facilitate finding the exact sources/page numbers, etc. in both published and unpublished/archival material An annotated version of the book would be great, if some scholar has time to do it.
Dear Kali,
“Are you actually suggesting that anyone who takes an interest in the Holocaustian religion and its foundational myths must learn to speak and read German in order to debunk those myths using primary source data to do so?”
You are a nice and fair person who always makes a point of being polite and mature.
I have read many of your comments on other threads.
Your use of “actually” signals that this is your own interpretation of what I wrote.
I think my point is clear, no “actually.”
Your “should I close X book” rhetoric is indeed silly.
I am not going to get into a long, wordy go-round to rehash the obvious.
Funny how everything I said about the Negro-Saxon Sub-Human race is true.
THANK GOD ALMIGHTY that this insect slave race of the yids will be exterminated under the brown and black Hindu, Paki and Arab tides
Payback for 1919.
Payback for 1945.
Payback for all your crimes against humanity.
The Great Shitstain will finally go down the septic tank of history.
Death and Hellfire to the anglo Nation of Sub-Humans.
So now you are asking Mr. Unz to waste even more of his precious time on your request by searching not only the entire NS leadership for their possible use of the term “Nazi”, but even their post-war admirers. Don’t you think Mr. Unz has more important things to do, or is your Ego (your main problem) too big to understand that?
Finally, I propose, if the term “Nazi” is too irreverent for your taste, to use the term NASTY instead. At least that would characterize people like you adequately.
Actually, it might be easier to just use the Filter field of the Author Cloud box. Just start typing in the author’s name “Ree” and you’ll get the link. The Filter fields of Cloud boxes are very handy ways to locate material.
You’re just obsessively stubborn on this “Nazi” issue and I’ve already wasted too much time on this nonsense.
Consider the term “Black” as applied to American Negroes. During some periods of American history, it was considered a vicious slur, during other periods the complementary term, and during others, the widely used neutral description. Exactly the same is true for the term “Negro,” which has gone in and out of favor.
I don’t know or care how commonly “Nazi” was used by the Nazis themselves. It may have varied over time and circumstances. But since Propaganda Minister Joseph Goebbels’ own Nazi newspaper in Berlin seemed to use the word, it can’t have been all that pejorative.
As far as I know, the only other words for describing Hitler’s regime would be the more formal terms “National Socialist” or “NSDAP,” and you yourself strongly prefer those. But you also like and greatly admire Arthur Butz, and I’ve pointed out that in his own book, he almost never used the terms you prefer but instead almost exclusively used “Nazi.” So the whole thing just probably seems a matter of personal preference.
I think the real problem is that you’ve spent decades obsessively focused on Nazi Germany and long ago made a simple mistake on this matter. Then I came along, someone lacking 99% of your knowledge but who pointed out your mistake, and you’re unwilling to admit it.
You should ask yourself who should decide whether a person is “worthy of reproduction” or not. On the basis of what criteria is a human being allowed to decide the fate of another? Only when this question has been clarified can I follow your argument.
Dear Skeptikal,
Thank you for your kind words [here, for the amusement of Ms Yeager, I “imitate” our gracious, and sometimes quite funny host, Mr Unz]. – Those that were kind anyway. 🙂
So, reinvent the wheel it is then. Oh my! When will I ever find the time?!
Sometimes, my love, humour helps.
I will continue with my reading, and hope and pray that, by some fluke, I manage to pass whatever test, or trap, it is that you may set for me.
With love,
Kali.
I’m not following this ….
What does that mean? The Jews were victims at Andersonville ????
https://web.archive.org/web/20230224053356/http://www.holohoax101.org/wirz/
How can anyone not greatly admire Arthur Butz. A EE prof, in the 1970s, sitting in a library somewhen in Illinois, figured out the whole damn hoax and wrote what is still the best book on the subject. This is what genius looks like!
One reason his book is still the best is that he looks at both aspects of the hoax, #1 – what really happened, and #2 – the endless propaganda campaign to turn phantasmagoria into reality. Of course much has been learned about what really happened, but that’s just the starting point for the hoax. The real subject of interest now is how in hell did the Jews convince the world that this over-the-top phantasmagoria really happened. The holocaust did not happen, the holohoax did, but most of the ‘research’ is on the holocaust that didn’t happen, not the holohoaqx that did.
Just came across this quote from Goebbels –
Little did he know.
https://www.gingersoftware.com/english-online/spelling-book/confusing-words/complementary-complimentary
That might have been better written as:
‘the huge Andersonville like outrages’
However, if the accusations of ‘the H’ of WWII are questionable, and the paralleling accusations about Andersonville as well, this begs the question of just how true other past ‘atrocity’ accounts are, such as what Catholics refer to as the Black Legend.
Not saying bad things didn’t happen at all, but perhaps an article on the personality type known within the field of psychology as ‘the wound collector’ can offer us some insight into what is going on.
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/spycatcher/201509/wound-collectors
That’s revealing. Ron Unz got into the habit of using the word “Nazi” as though it’s the proper name for National Socialism (in no small part because of the type/quality of the books he reads ), and is TOO STUBBORN to consider changing it. He’s proud of remaining ignorant!
As an example, he read about the newspaper promotion “A Nazi Goes to Palestine” in a book by the Jewish author Lenny Brenner, and it was such a lucky find for him that he didn’t look any deeper into the affair, and now refuses to consider that Lenni Brenner was wrong about that newspaper campaign. It wasn’t as he portrayed it. So lies are built upon lies, and Ron Unz is just fine with that.
If the reader thinks this is making a mountain out of a molehill, you would be wrong, and would know it if you gave it any thought. If you have sufficient subtlety of mind, it will reveal itself as crucial to understanding & correcting the dilemma the European race finds itself in today. Which is that lies, when not corrected and eradicated, invite more lies. It’s similar to an organism when invaded by a foreign substance; if not expelled, it fosters a more welcoming environment for further foreign invaders. Pretty soon, the organism is overrun.
This sounds suspiciously like projection. What is my mistake? I think you mean by that: My view that Nazi’ is a word used with bad intentions. But if the “Nazis” themselves thought that and didn’t use it, how can it be a mistake??
Answer: It’s not a mistake.
And the same with all the National Socialist sympathizers after the war, even up to today. Are any of them comfortable with the term ‘Nazi?’ Only those who dislike the “Nazis” fall into the habit of calling the National Socialists “Nazis.”
But it didn’t, and you can’t demonstrate that it did or you would. You use the word “may,” which indicates it’s just empty verbiage to fill space, including trying to distract with talking about Black/Negro. So who is it who won’t admit when he’s wrong?
This was my last attempt to get an answer from you, but it wasn’t in vain. The importance of this “question” has clarified and solidified in my mind, so that my assurance that it’s right, and I’m right, is on even firmer ground. The firmer the ground one’s position stands on, the better. You can’t say that about your position which is on very shaky ground.
The psychology of Judaism is that of the wound collector. As a people they are only united when facing common enemies and common sufferings. By designating all non-Jews as the other, they secure perpetual victimhood for themselves. The only way for Jews to remain a cohesive and separate group is to nurture an intense fear and hatred for their host. By interpreting every perceived slight as a potential shoah, a permanent psychological state is maintained.
In WW2, this standard neurosis of Jews became married in purpose to the propaganda of the goyim nations. Both looking for any means to accuse Germany of war crimes. After the war the same lies would become useful as scenic material in the Allied Show Trials, but the Holohoax played a secondary role in those proceedings. Rudolf Höss’ statement about killing millions of Jews would never have been if not for Kaltenbrunner’s lawyer calling him as a witness for the defense.
The real birth of the Holohoax can be traced back to Paul Rassinier and the other revisionists who started questioning the narrative. Until then the Jews appear to have been largely content with defeating Germany and securing Palestine for themselves. But once threatened, they became as one mind again, assiduously nurturing the gollem back to life. Since then they have not let their foot off the gas. Tireless work has been poured into an ever growing phantasmagoria which by now has morphed into a genuine religious hysteria.
“Recall that Hitler had been described as the greatest statesman had he not begun the holocost or WWII or whatever. ”
There is no doubt that Hitler was very shrewd.
It was stupid for him to start the Hitlercaust.
The Wandsee Protokol sets out clearly the Party’s aims. No holds barred.
Obviously Hitler thought that this new “final” solution to the problem of the Jews could in fact be finalized and lead to long-term benefits for Germany. Dumb dumb dumb. It destroyed Germany as a sovereign state. At the very least it provided a pretext for the Allies to occupy and gaslight the Germans for the foreseeable future.
Your “6 million up the smokestack” sounds like snark, so I’m not going to touch it!!!
Well, I will say that the historical reality of the Endloesung is not dependent on the reality or veracity of the number 6. The reification by both sides of the number 6—both the Holocaustians and the HoloHoaxers—well, again, I am not going to go there.
Look, you’re the big expert on Nazi Germany and I’m not.
Brenner’s book claimed that Goebbels’ Nazi newspaper in Berlin had run a huge, 12-part series entitled “A Nazi Goes to Palestine” and also produced a commemorative medal in conjunction with the series, bearing those same words. The image of that medal is easily available on the Internet and I used it to illustrate my article:
https://www.unz.com/runz/american-pravda-jews-and-nazis/#the-nazi-zionist-economic-partnership-of-the-1930s
Brenner was a fanatic Jewish Trotskyite, fiercely hostile to Zionism, and for obvious reasons, his claim was considered ultra-controversial. So surely if he had been lying, the legions of Zionists who hated his book would have denounced him for it. That’s why I feel pretty confident that what he was saying was correct.
But maybe I’m wrong. Just find some solid evidence that Goebbels’ Nazi newspaper hadn’t run a 12-part series with that shocking title and I’ll gladly consider it. In fact, I’m sure all the fanatic Zionists would be very grateful to you if you manage to debunk Brenner’s claims after all these years.
Kali, aka “My love,” (?)
I am not setting traps. I am suggesting that auto didacts (like me, but I do speak German and I am not going to reveal more here of my personal history) be aware of the pitfalls of believing people who debunk (with the all-purpose “it’s fake”) original sources such as official communiques, invoices, orders, etc. that can be read in the original language when they (the debunkers) cannot actually read those sources for themselves, or understand what is being said in, say, a documentary about the Firma Topf, or invoices from various vendors, and other materials. (Your comparison with reinventing the wheel to ride a bicycle is, with all due respect, absurd. Which I think you know.)
“Topf und Soehne, Erfurt” –
Trailer: https://www.topfundsoehne.de/ts/de/service/mediathek/videos/2020/135819.html
I see no evidence that this film is available with English captions. Just one small example.
Furthermore, the reason for my mention of having a family member who experienced the events of the Third Reich could be called “experiential learning.” Many people here simply do not understand enough of the history of the Third Reich to avoid making some very silly statements. Such as Ron Unz’s, that the Reich was getting along pretty well with its Jews in the 1930s. It looks like Ron’s picture of the history of the Third Reich starts with the Endloesung. A cursory read of the Wannsee Protocol would puncture Ron’s picture, even though that document doesn’t go into detail as to the draconian “laws” passed to induce Germany’s few hundred thousand Jews to leave the country. However, a knowledge of the raft of laws that were passed (referenced in the Protocol) would make more sense of the actual situation. Which the descendants of those who managed to flee for their lives know more about. Such lists (of laws) available through an English=language online search tend to be compiled by pro=Jewish-victims groups, which ignore the persecution of others besides Jews—which I find annoying (but does not mean that Jews were not persecuted and “evakuiert”); if interested you can find them via a search for “Third Reich anti-Jewish laws” or something similar. (Or, you could read a whole book on the subject.) And of course they don’t provide any historical perspective on the “Judenfrage” itself. However, as I point out in an earlier comment, the Endloesung, targeting the Jews and Slavs (and others) of Eastern Europe, occurred completely outside any legal framework such as the laws that were passed in an earlier phase of the Third Reich that was focusing on cleansing Germany of Jewish Germans.
“Just find some solid evidence that Goebbels’ Nazi newspaper hadn’t run a 12-part series with that shocking title and I’ll gladly consider it.”
Well, it is impossible to prove a negative.
I don’t know anything about this series (I have heard of Brenner but I don’t think I have read anything by him, at least not recently).
But I did a search for “Ein Nazi Faehrt nach Palaestina” and got this hit:
https://www.bpb.de/themen/nationalsozialismus-zweiter-weltkrieg/die-wohnung/195248/die-artikelserie-ein-nazi-faehrt-nach-palaestina/#footnote-target-2
First two grafs
(Google Translate:)
The web article is about the series; it does not reproduce the series itself, but shows some interesting vintage photos. But the footnotes mention various issues of Der Angriff. Presumably these are the issues that published “Ein Nazi faehrt nach Palaestina.”
A search for “Der Angriff 9. Oktober 1934” gave me this hit for the 12 articles,
https://archives.cjh.org/repositories/5/archival_objects/1180467 ,
but, “The record you’ve tried to access does not exist or may have been removed.”
Back to my Suchergebnisse, “search results,” one of them leads back to Brenner.
Here is something interesting:
https://etd.ohiolink.edu/apexprod/rws_etd/send_file/send?accession=case1365174634&disposition=inline
The abstract:
Leopold von Mildenstein and the Jewish Question
I tried to get rid of some of the hard returns before the time ran out.
Thanks for your response. I just saw your comment.
The Germany/Polish/Czechia situation is complicated.
I didn’t assume that Hitler “only” wanted to secure the safety of ethnic Germans in Danzig.
Why do you think Hitler grabbed half of Poland?
For Lebensraum?
The Wannsee Conference was still in the future . . .
As a student I also used to come there for skiing (Zurs, St Anton) and maybe somewhere on the ski resort I met and heard Skep and his yodeling on Hoch German. The Limes Sorabicus runs through there somewhere and I’m not sure if the ski resorts are on the German side or the Serbian side.
It’s really interesting (to me) that we have a Schwaebischer commentator. She/her is very likely of Serbian origin since the name of the province comes from the Serbian Suebi tribe. First of all, stubbornness and some other traits are indicative. Even today in Serbia, Germans are colloquially called Schwab(s) (another Serbian name for them – Germani – is more commonly used by Russians).
After all, maybe the qualification ‘fake Gothic, fake Arian lady’ is not correct, we may have a real McCoy case. Maybe I owe you a big apology, Big Sis.
My grandfather was born in the US but didn’t speak English until he went to school and knew German (or Vorarlbergisch) his whole life. Oddly, his first job out of school was as a jeweler, and knowing German made it easier to understand the Yiddish of the stonecutters.
Probably Germans write to one another in Lutherdeutsch since it’s the standard. There are written versions of most German dialects, but few use them regularly except in rare instances. They’re much more spoken than written. I doubt my grandfather could ever write in Lutherdeutsch or Vorarlbergisch — unfortunately I never asked him.
You mad bro? You seem mad
Here’s the thing you’re missing. Until the 19th century, instruction at many top European universities, particularly in German and Austria, was in Latin, not German. The use of vernacular in universities came with the advent of nationalism.
My area of expertise is Austria, so I can comment most coherently about that. German was phased in for instruction at many universities following 1848, but almost as quickly, major universities began to press for their own national languages (e.g., Czech at the universities in Prague, Polish at the University of Lemberg). The Franz Joseph University at Czernowitz (now Chernivtsi, Ukraine) was actually founded as a German-language university because German-language instruction was becoming less available in the eastern marches of Austria, and German-speakers, many, many Jews among them, insisted that German instruction be available. This was done despite the majority of the population in Czernowitz speaking Romanian or Ukrainian, so as a concession, departments in those languages were established, as well as an Orthodox Christian seminary — the first (I believe) state-run one in the empire.
So is it possible that a Saxon and a Bavarian wouldn’t understand one another in 1830? Yes, but the dialects aren’t *that* far apart. Try getting a person from Innsbruck and one from Kiel to understand one another, and it’ll be much more difficult.
“Yes they used a facility originally designed for another purpose for extermination, thus being not perfectly efficient, instead of building an entirely new one. ”
Not sure what you are talking about here. Auschwitz started out as an old army barracks but as it expanded new facilities were built.
You might want to watch the documentary about Topf und Soehne, the company whose engineers designed and custom-built and maintained the crematoria for the concentration camps that needed them. Even for non-German-speakers, the gist of the film is clear. The company already held a number of patents for burning bodies in crematoria (the legal business; although this was just 2% of its business, which was mainly building brewery facilities, the source of most of their patents) and applied for new patents for their new inventions for reducing thousands of corpses to ash per day. These were not standard crematoria for the normal trade (although in that context Topf had a number of patents already for super-high-heat disposal that combusted both the coffin and the corpse with no need to add extra fuel).
A lot of engineering know-how and ambition went into designing bespoke two-, three-, and eight-muffle ovens, the last for Auschwitz, along with new ventilation technology.
I wouldn’t ask you sweat over this but where would you fit into the picture the fact that amazing levels of ignorance about almost everything that at least quite a lot of intelligent people think important is shown by many surveys?
What leaps to mind is answers to questions like “When did the first/second world war begin/end?” or “Who was Harry Truman? Obviously that is only roughly connected.
Noted for reference
You are misrepresenting everything. And, you change the story a little every time you tell it because (I think) you’re only giving it part of your attention and that’s not good enough.
Let’s be very clear. I’m not saying the series didn’t appear in the newspaper with the title “A Nazi goes to Palestine” or that the coins were not produced and passed out to people as an advertising promotion. I am saying it was a commercial enterprise and had no connection with the Reich program to encourage Germany’s Jews to emigrate to Palestine. It just coincided with it. The ‘Nazi’ who went to Palestine was a journalist at the time and an NSDAP party member named Baron Leopold Itz von Mildenstein.
Joseph Goebbels was publisher of Der Angriff, but not editor and didn’t write for the paper after early 1933. This series was published in 1934. Goebbels was not “behind” this promotion, or involved in it, afaik. Nowhere do I see it said that he was; he’s never mentioned except as it being “his” newspaper. He likely approved of it. For Der Angriff, it was a promotional activity to increase readership and awareness, nothing more. Giving away medals (tokens) as an advertising ploy was a common practice at that time.
In your major Pravda article “Jews & Nazis,” you wrote this:
That’s all you wrote, but there were a couple errors which I have bolded. The “important SS official” was currently a journalist; it was a month, not six months; and Der Angriff was not the “flagship media organ” of the Party. A pretty good account I just found online is here: https://www.invaluable.com/auction-lot/nazi-medal-nazi-going-to-palestine-with-swastika--28-c-04d4e2d97c
I might have more to add tomorrow, but the very important point I want to make now is how the use of the term “Nazi” contributes to endless confusion about the facts of the National Socialist Program and regime of Adolf Hitler, called the Third Reich. We know what that was. But we don’t know what “Nazis” are. It’s a fiction. It describes nothing. One can’t even say for sure who was a Nazi and who was not. What did the Nazis do? What do they stand for? How does a Nazi compare to a German? Calling National Socialist Germans “Nazis” takes away all ability to define and comprehend them as purposeful men and women, with hopes and goals. Think about that for a bit.
Here’s a gratuitous tip, Carolyn: Never let your opponents know what offends you.
A few years ago I was driving through southern Louisiana and noticed a bumper
sticker, “Proud To Be A COONASS! ”
Cajun Pride ?
As your Woke pals phrase it, “Be self affirming, not defensive.”
Yes indeed, in light of the typhus epidemics of 1942/43, where thousands were dying per week at times, the Germans contracted Topf und Söhne to install the multiple muffle ovens so that said typhus infested corpses could be disposed of post haste, rather than risk further disease spread.
After all, these workers in these WORK CAMPS were much needed in the German war effort, and the loss of tens of thousands due to typhus was severely affecting output of desperately needed war materiel.
And, the existence of blueprints and orders for these cremation ovens is well documented.
Now, let’s turn our attention to the alleged ‘Gas Chambers.
WHERE are the blueprints for their construction ?
WHERE are the signed orders asking that they be constructed ?
WHAT German company was granted the contract for their construction ?
WHERE are the photos that show these gas chambers as they were during WWII ?
Until you can furnish some or all of those answers, you have NOTHING.
All you have is a Zionist conjured fairy-tale about some mythical extermination centre.
Get back to us when you’ve undertaken some objective research into the matter.
#684 Odyssey
“Even today in Serbia, Germans are colloquially called Schwab(s) (…)”
Really?
In Poland, pejorative name for Germans is also “Schwab” (polish: Szwab).
From word “Szwab” was created a verb “oszwabiać” (“o-Szwab-iać”) which means “to cheat”.
Germans from Swabia must really piss off our ancestors that their name has became synonym of trickery and dishonesty.
I knew that Germans (Prussians, Austrians) deserved this bad name for germanization of Poland in 1795-1918 but I didn’t realize that this has happend also in Serbia.
Man learns whole life.
Dear Skeptikal,
“My love” is how I tend to affectionately address people, young and old (as well as my animals). You may take it personally, or not, as you wish. Of course its significance is more weighted towards the intimate when I call my husband “My Love”, but the sharing and expression of the underlying feeling and intent are not depreciated by lack of intimacy. Love (with a capital “L”) is what makes my world go round, and what motivates my words and actions most of the time.
I think you and I may have our wires crossed somewhat when it comes to debunking the “holocaust of 6,000,000 jews” by NS Germany: I, personally, am not here to debunk anything as I’m simply not qualified to do so. That said, I’m satisfied from my reading of secondary source literature (which, as you pointed out earlier, sometimes contains snippets of primary source support) has satisfied me that the “holocaust of 6,000,000 jews” is a myth which continues to be propagated, despite lack of solid evidence for it – by, for example, The Holocaust Encyclopedia, which continues to present that outlandish figure as undeniable fact. I’m also satisfied that there were no “death camps” or “homicidal gas chambers”. – If you have information that may disabuse me on these points, I’d be happy to take a look (English language, of course).
I am also aware that NS Germany did have an agenda and ambition to rid itself of its jewish population, by fair means and foul. – My current area of research (“research” to inform myself, nothing more) is National Socialism as a political philosophy, and its operation inside, and impact on “Hitler’s Germany”. To that end, I will do that search you suggest, and I thank you for the tip.
I’m also aware that Germany at the time had a significant internal “jewish problem”, and was also fearful of the advancing, jewish inspired, and largely jewish led, Comintern. And I’m aware that it banned all other political parties, besides the Zionist party, and imprisoned political opponents, though my knowledge on these points is decidedly sketchy, hence my current “research” and mulitple open tabs.
Additionally, I also know that nothing happens in a vacuum, and that the events that unfolded in “Hitlers Germany” were preceded by other significant historic events (WW1 and Versailles), and that they unfolded amid an increasingly hostile geopolitical environment, with Jewish/Zionist activists fuleing that hostility.
I’m here to learn, Mr Skeptikal, my love. If you can help me on that journey, so much the better. If you can’t, I will not hold it against you.
Fond regards,
Kali.
I apologize for my late reply.
I have Lenni Brenner’s book and read much of it, hoping at the time of purchase for illumination. The same goes for Edwin Black’s book.
Both have provided a service in writing these books, which, I would add, have received widespread, unhindered dissemination. That’s what comes of being Jewish. It provides a kind of right to a licence. But why? There are contingent Tribal benefits: i) the Holocaust story is interspersed in the texts without question as it is ad nauseum in their public utterances from the time of the books’ launchings to the present day. Undoubtedly in such a context, this adds false gravitas to the latter; ii) the narrative, as with the writings where the holocaust is featured as with historians Martin Gilbert and the countless other Jewish historians of the same, is in possession of the Tribe, a sine qua non to isolating and demonizing alternative views from gentile writers seeking to, inter alia, redress what they consider to be a defamation of their people; in the case of Hanna Arendt and the much later Lenni Brenner, what is presented is a kind of outrage, Far Leftist in his case, less so in hers, that “these kapos made deals, collaborated in the terrible crime of the Holocaust against European Jewry”.
With this narrative, less than a half truth, the real basis behind the collaboration is obscured and other sides of the picture omitted. This can only be imagined if it is accepted that the holocaust narrative is fundamentally false and that the Zionist leaders of the Jewish communities neither expected nor got such a thing, sans the goings on on the Eastern Front, where Jewish and Polish partisan activity was punished extra-judicially with sub-machine guns and long trenches, without the protection of the Geneva Conventions. Then the obviously highly coordinated Zionist, collaboration makes total sense in terms, firstly, of the long stated aims of Zionism and its long practiced highly pragmatic and conspiratorial methodology, but also of the fascist character of a large proportion of the desperate and frenzied petty bourgeois Eastern Jewry, a major constituency of European Zionism and a Marxist’s text-book base for fascism. On the latter I recently posted on your site a contemporary report by a Jewish leftist, thrown out of the World Zionist Congress for exposing the existence of a brownshirt (not blackshirt as that wasn’t potent enough!) wearing mass Jewish Polish fascist party of 50.000 members. This incidentally was the forerunner of the “Revisionist” Likud, now in office in Israel.
The bottom line as I see it with all these Jewish writings is a nasty sting in the tail, the reader paying far more than he gets.
I’m returning your gratuitous tip unused bc I have no idea what your message to me is. My Woke pals??
I don’t like to make fun of people, but you’re such a remarkably quarrelsome, obsessive crank…
You sharply criticize what you regard as the serious inaccuracy of one key sentence in my long article:
You claim that von Mildenstein wasn’t “an important SS official” but according to the preferred account that you quote, he was the head of the Jewish Department of the SD/Nazi SS, which seems reasonably important to me.
You say that I was wrong in claiming that Der Angriff was “the flagship media organ of the Nazi party,” but you agree that its founder and publisher was Propaganda Minister Joseph Goebbels and it was the largest local Nazi paper in the capital city of Berlin.
So we both agree that in 1934 the big Berlin Nazi newspaper published by Joseph Goebbels ran a huge 12-part series entitled “A Nazi Goes to Palestine.” I’d say that conclusively proves that usage of the term “Nazi” was perfectly acceptable in Nazi Germany.
I’m sure you still disagree. In fact, I’m sure if Adolf Hitler and Joseph Goebbels were brought back to life, you’d energetically harangue both of them about how they totally misunderstood Nazi ideology.
In all my years on the Internet, I’m not sure I’ve ever encountered an individual more stubborn than yourself.
This morning I came across what I had been looking for last night: https://www.unz.com/runz/american-pravda-jews-and-nazis/#zionism-in-the-age-of-the-dictators You wrote:
It was NOT struck by “Nazi Germany,” was it. A small or sloppy error like that makes all the difference in the world as to the meaning. This only illustrates again that “Nazi Germany” has no frigging meaning, thus does not inform us at all but it’s only purpose is to DIS-inform us and confuse us.
Now you have to answer for whether you engage in this by error (which I tend to believe) or on purpose.
Hi Kali
In your embarking on a study of National Socialism, the superlative system for all people, I know you will be aware that whole libraries have been written and not all the material is helpful or even honest. My own suggestion for a simply-written factual introduction is by the American academic, Richard Tedor, titled “Hitler’s Revolution”.
I’m also suggesting that you get your own hard copies of books as you will wish to refer back and cross reference etc. This may be difficult but worth pursuing.
This is a link to the Archive online copy, better than nothing anyway.
https://archive.org/details/hitlers-revolution-by-richard-tedor_202107
I also know that you realise that access to honest researchers of repute is virtually indispensible in a study of this magnitude. Carolyn Yeager is one of those people.
There is also a huge library on the person and life of Adolf Hitler, which is allied to studying NS. Massive amounts of malignant bullshit from the Usual Suspects but also some very accurate and responsible material. You might start with Dennis Wise “The Greatest Story Never Told” vdo series which is easily available afaik on Gab etc.
Best wishes for your studies.
“am Ende steht der Sieg.”
Sir, it is ridiculous for you to address me as “my love.”
1. “After all, these workers in these WORK CAMPS were much needed in the German war effort, and the loss of tens of thousands due to typhus was severely affecting output of desperately needed war materiel.”
A lot of energy is expended to remain ignorant of the complex interplay of the Third Reich’s need for labor and the drive to “finalize” the “solution.” This tension is alluded to already in the Wannsee Protocol. Read it. In the original, Then “get back to us.”
2. “WHERE are the blueprints for their construction ?
WHERE are the signed orders asking that they be constructed ?
WHAT German company was granted the contract for their construction ?
WHERE are the photos that show these gas chambers as they were during WWII ?”
In the Topf und Soehne company archives in Erfurt, Germany, which include the designs for two of the crematoria buildings that had basement gas chambers.
You can also check out the invoices for special unbreakable glass for small windows used to monitor the progress.
Funny, before the sticking point was the capacity of the crematoria. Now, it’s “High -capacity crematoria, of course!! But show me the gas chambers.”
Next stop for Vigilante: All of that evidence is faked by the Jews!!
Parents ought to caution their children, that while many a Euro people might well indeed have something of a creative streak about themselves, with it seems to come a too ready susceptibility to believe any snake oil salesman that comes along.
A belief in the fabled (and impossible) ‘Indian rope trick’ which took Europe by storm in the late 19th and early 20th century comes to mind here…
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_rope_trick
‘..only the amazing credulity of the Occident nurtures the rumor.’
And, regarding work camp vs. Vernichtungslager,
Auschwitz I, Auschwitz II (Birkenau), Auschwitz III (Monowitz — IG Farben plant)
Do some basic reading, and “get back to us.”
This is not a “preferred account” (I haven’t yet searched for what I myself have written previously for any links that might have been available then), but as I said “this was something pretty good’ I found last night past my bedtime to give you something to think about. There is confusion about Mildenstein’s position, it elsewhere being stated that this (or some other) SS position came later, after he wrote about his trip to Palestine. That’s the reason for the question marks I added. I have to have time to see if I can clarify that, but it is not something that changes the key argument between us.
Now this is meaningless trickery (ie hoaxery) on your part. JOSEPH GOEBBELS PLAYED NO ROLE IN THIS SS PROJECT. If he did, you (and your sources) could certainly find some evidence of it, and he certainly would have written something about it himself. He did not. Nor did AH. So that’s another job you won’t do – find out if JG said anything about it. He didn’t because it was a private undertaking, no doubt financed by the Jews of the Union of German Zionists. And maybe Palestinian groups. Not “Nazi Germany.”
That’s a stupid conclusion. “Nazi” was not outlawed in Germany. So people could use it if they wished. As I’ve said, those in the government were forbidden to use it and Party members were strongly discouraged from using it (disincentivized). As I’ve said also, the Jews loved it, just as you do. So all you’ve conclusively proven is that it was/is Jews who cling to the use of the word Nazi, which is one reason I so stubbornly oppose it.
One thing you’re not doing is being open-minded about this, though you’re pretending to be. You are actually a person who develops his beliefs from sound bites. What you are citing as the basis of your knowledge is the equivalent of sound-bites from TV & videos. You have no depth. You admit you have no depth of understanding on this, but yet turn around and repeat again what you said before, relying on sound-bites. I keep asking you to take a look at this but you don’t, or can’t.
Well, I’ll have more coming, as I endeavor to find more factual information. But my job entails having to prove a negative, as JM suggested. As usual, a Jew is in the position of doing without evidence with the support of the Zionist Media, so my job is more difficult.
LOL. The truth finally outs, Skeptikal is a crypto-bimbo. This helps explain why European women seem to be much more vulnerable to sweet talking Jews then European men: Women, like Jews, are far more sophisticated then their men when it comes to crypsis.
Just start with the make up. Women often have to “put on their face” before they go out. Crypsis. Plastic surgery anyone, which gender has more? Hypergamy? RBF? 80% of the gender dysphoria cases in CA are girls who are considering turning into men. Could the fact that far more women want to be a completely different gender than they were born be proof of this embracement of crypsis?
Or how about this: on the comments sections at UR there are 5 times more women than men who use handles that might, or likely will, cause their misgendering.
Why is this? Because these women themselves consider women to be less intelligent and less well read and therefore don’t want to be prejudged because of their possession of a uterus.
How many camp guards died of typhus and were cremated in those ovens compared to the camp inmates? Just asking.
LOL.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suebi
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alemanni
Most Schwabians are Alemanni which were Suebi. They mostly ended up across Würtemberg and Northern Switzerland. Their credo is “Schafe, schafe, hüsli baue” which means “Work, Work build a house”. This dialect would be understandable to an Alsacian, Swiss or a Schwabian because they are all originally Alemmani/Subi. In High German it would be “Arbeiten, Arbeiten, Haus bauen”.
Agreed that in one sense, it is our fault bc we so easily believe things. But to not believe in anything is not a good solution. That’s why it’s a dilemma that has beset mankind from the beginning. Once again, I recommend improving General Intelligence so that individuals can reason these things out for themselves. And natural evolution goes in that direction, unwaveringly, but we are now interfering with it in the most serious ways. That needs to stop. Our race can’t afford it.
My ancestors (both sides) were in Baden, generally around the Stuttgart area, and to the north of there. For sure the credo “Work, Work build a house” fits them, and our larger community. I also recognize the Schwabian cuisine from my grandmothers — or is it Schwaebian, as Sceptical spelled it? I like the sound of the umlaut “A”. I just checked and yes, it is pronounced Sway-bian, with an umlaut. But the umlaut is never used anymore, so I’ve always pronounced it wrong, as Swah-bian.
One of your most famous Swabian compatriots, Carolyn, is the universally admired Field Marshall Erwin J E Rommel.
https://en.metapedia.org/wiki/Erwin_Rommel
Sure you already know that your name Yeager is an anglicised form of Jäger, meaning Hunter, very appropriate for a researcher.
Without the Umlaut, it can be spelled Jaeger, so you see the a-e has been inverted when your parents moved to USA.
Thank you for the link to text of the Wannsee Protocol, complete with list of participants and also demographic statistics.
Have you read the document, Herrin Doktor Skeptical and Herr Doktor Franklin Ryckaert?
I found it shocking. Just shocking.
However, where did you find validation for this statement —
How does that comport with these passages from the text:
Several paragraphs treating exemptions for the various forms of intermarriage, with-children/without children, etc., follow. Most are to be “exempt” and “to be evacuated to “an old-age ghetto, as well as —
** Were there gas chambers at Theresienstadt? Crematory? When camps were “liberated” and, i.e. Eisenhower engaged Hollywood film directors to photograph the camps so that “no one will have room for cynical doubt,” https://remember.org/facts-aft-lib-eis.html , was Theresienstadt treated the same way?
It was an obviously failed attempt at sarcasm, and nothing more.
I doubt that you have “woke pals”, but then again you never know.
I have friends who bragged about marching in a George Floyd
parade, and I struggled to suppress my contemptuous laughter.
Dear Uncle Arthur,
Thank you!
Recommended reading from knowledgeable friends/colleagues is exactly what I need given, as you point out, the unimaginable wealth of unreliable pulp written on the subject.
Having dipped in and out of various books and articles, and having read a gorillion or so comments here, I started reading Hitlers War in ernest today (though the intro almost put me off). I’m finding it fascinating, and very accessable, though naturally, as all good reading does, it provokes as many questions as it answers.
Hard-copies of important books would be a boon, but as you know, even getting them delivered here is almost impossible. On a more positive note, I have a brand new phone with acres of internal storage, plus a large memory card, so I can download to my heart content.
I recall you also recommended the video “The Greatest Story Never Told” which I’ve still not watched. But I will.
Of course I’d never really be so churlish or self-limiting as to avoid Carolyn Yeager’s work simply because I find her… off-putting. I will make the most of all the good resources available to me.
Thank you again for your recommendations and for the link.
Much love,
Kali.
Another interesting feature of Camps was lagergeld, currency issued for use of inmates. This scrip was usable in the Kantine, Shop and Post Office, some Camps had a Bordello also. The scrip has become collector items.
I bought a copy of the Barnes Review featuring this interesting phenomenon. Afaik it may still be available with colour plates of notes etc.
This website has copied the BR article, but just in b/w.
Letter from an inmate of Block 28 Dachau KIII, Sept 8, 1940.
https://www.wintersonnenwende.com/scriptorium/english/archives/articles/ccmoney.html
.
“Sir”? – Even if my name doesn’t give it away, despite that it’s also the name of a hindu goddess, my mention of my husband ought to have. I’m not a “sir”!
But seeing as it obviously makes you nervous, I promise I will never call you “my love” again.
Kali.
Theresienstadt was perhaps the most artistic.
Some examples for sale.
Many online philatelists sell them. Search “lagergeld”
https://www.tyrol-phila.at/theresienstadt-lagergeld-51027.html
My grandfather, Arthur, who came alone as still a teenager but with a boatload of fellow Swabians sponsored by a big railroad company in 1906 (which one I’ve forgotten). GM&O? It was he who changed the spelling or allowed it to be changed (more likely). He made good and passed on a thriving business and an outstanding reputation to my father. Well, guess what? He liked Hitler too but after Pearl Harbor he stayed quiet about it. He was a truly wonderful grandfather, and my sister and I, and younger brother, got to know him very well and spend quality time with him before he died when I was in the 4th grade.
Another famous, or infamous Swaebian was Col. Claus von Stauffenberg, a most upstanding man anyway, in the eyes of many. Thanks for letting me talk about my grandfather, who always lit up every occasion. He had the knack.
Most welcome, Kali.
That’s an interesting book by David Irving.
I know I don’t need to tell you — take notes when reading, write questions for things not clear. If you are interested in military (which I was to start) Stackpole of Mechanicsburg USA is an excellent source … keep your notes for later reference.
Dedicated folder. It’s crucial to do this.
Best wishes.
“am Ende steht der Sieg.”
Hi. I’ve used up my limit of ‘buttons’ but I want to say thanks. I’m glad my answer didn’t turn you off. That speaks well of you by itself.
I’m too outspoken to have “woke pals”; they would all have deserted me by now. Luckily most people where I live are conservative … and a lot of Christians, who don’t like ‘woke.’
Well according to Odyssey, that would mean that you are Serbian (Suebi). Of course Serbians would tell us that the NSDAP wanted to exterminate Slavs/Serbs like roaches, or Jews anyway. But basically Odyssey tells us that most of Germany was/is Serbian. So in reality the SS hated their own Aryan race and never even figured it out.
What baloney from Skeptikal. ‘She'(?) seems to think we are all imbeciles here who will fall for her line that by reading German in the original, she is privy to information (like “primary sources”) we do not have. That’s nonsense.
The Wannsee minutes are fraudulent and doctored, and even if they weren’t they don’t outline a genocidal program at all. We’re supposed to believe that those attending the meeting didn’t mean what they said, but spoke in a code language in order to cover their real meaning! Does knowing German help Skeptikal to understand the code language? LOL.
Everyone should read the article “Anatomy of a Fabrication” at CODOH, https://codoh.com/library/document/the-wannsee-conference-protocol/en/, and if you haven’t read it recently & have forgotten details, read it again! Written in 1993, it’s still unequaled. And never refuted. Can Skeptikal show us what’s wrong about it? I’m all ears, Skep.
As I read Odyssey (not very often), he thinks the whole world is Serbian, or was originally Serbian. It strikes me as unhinged.
Personally I would apply “infamous” to von Stauffenberg, Carolyn.
As you no doubt know, FM Rommel got caught up in that business, also.
Bad business all round.
Back in the day, I was interested in the debate Who lost the war, Hitler or the Generals ? many arguments, valid also, in a debate that’s still going on but more subdued now perhaps … If any main cause can be applied, my view is that AH treated the snakes in London with a respect that they did not at all merit. Too honourable, even naive.
Repeatedly he did this, multiple peace offers, Dunkirk etc.
There was a big NS movement in Great Britain at the time also.
A real possibility to end the war by 1940/41 by defeat of GB, then isolate/destroy bolshevism. Plenty of allies for this, even in Russia.
Alas.
What’s the difference between a Sceptic and a Cynic?
Based on this definition:
I would quarrel with associating “cynicism” with “belief-disbelief.” When, in advanced old age I learned about testing Truth value through the syllogism; and the importance of the First Premise in composing a logical argument, the world took on a whole new hue — simplistic, I’m sure, but it works.
Today, Mark Green posted this link in the Newslinks feature:
Germany 1930s in color, Pre-War
I thought it would be relaxing, refreshing, a welcome respite from the propaganda wars.
And so it is; Thanks, Mark Green.
BUT — the sceptic reared its head:
The video is composed from several in the holdings of USHMM.
The film series USHMM holds are in the Herbert David Vogel collection. Vogel was one of the participants in the tour organized by Vereinigung Carl Schurz that brought professors and students from 26 American universities (and similar professionals) to Germany in 1934 “With the object of furthering the friendly relations between America and Germany on the basis of mutual understanding and goodwill.”
The threshold question raised by the USHMM provenance of the video was, Why would USHMM hold records showing a peaceful, prosperous Germany? As it happens, on my desk is a book by Michael Benson, Gangsters vs. Nazis: How Jewish Mobsters Battled Nazis in Wartime America. Benson celebrates the numerous beatings, dirty tricks, and other gangsterish brutalities that Meyer Lansky, Bugsy Siegel, Arnold Rothstein and their gangs and compatriots heaped upon any and every effort by Germans in USA to hold a rally, a talk, or even keep their own families and businesses together — “to further friendly relations between America and Germany on the basis of mutual understanding and goodwill.”
Carl Schurz, born in Prussia in 1829; an active “1848er” who like so many of the 1848 revolutionaries (among them the family of Louis Brandeis) migrated to the USA. Schurz, who studied law, pursued political and reform interests in USA; was a Union general serving at the Battle of Gettysburg; active in Liberal Republican Party; served as editor on several national newspapers/magazines; represented Missouri in the US Senate; and was appointed to Secretary of Interior by Rutherford B. Hayes. Just imagine: if Germany had won the War, the US would be polluted with more ne’er do-wells such as Schurz. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carl_Schurz
Herbert David Vogel was, technically, neither professor nor student but a hydraulics engineer, a graduate of West Point assigned to the Corps of Engineers. Vogel was known to the Schurz organization based on a year he spent as a student in Berlin.
In his retirement, Vogel wrote a long letter — Recollections, to his then-45-year old son. Vogel described his visit to Germany that sounded like a source-book for Erik Larson’s In the Garden of Beasts: Love, Terror, and an American Family in Hitler’s Berlin, a work that USHMM referenced to spotlight “Nazi terror” in the very early days of Hitler’s rise to power.
That sounds more like USHMM.
But wading deeper into the weeds of Vogel’s Recollections EMJ’s truism about “the cunning of history” came to light:
Vogel had almost nothing negative to tell his son about the many postings he and his wife and young family were assigned; the numerous bosses and co-workers he had over the various important water-control projects he worked on or supervised.
That is, not until mention of “one Carl Bendetsen:”
The plot thickens:
Who was this Bendetsen dude?
Wikipedia tells us:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karl_Bendetsen
What’s that — 1000 words, just to demonstrate the “cunning of history” by which, in its efforts to vilify Germans, USHMM leaves clues to the ugly behavior of one of the chosen.
I’m trollin’ ya, Honey.
Thanks for not calling me “my love” in the future.
Save it for your caro sposo.
With western war depts scraping the bottom of the barrel with old Abrams tanks (not to forget “fighting vehicles” LOL) for Ukraine, looks like Ministry of Silly Walks is doing its bit for victory for the rules based Gay Parade.
https://www.rt.com/news/580481-uk-mail-mali-mishap/
What did I write to elicit this Niagara Falls of prose ?
Cutting to the chase, I think the point of the Niagara has to do with this:
“clues to the ugly behavior of one of the chosen.”
This phrase has no relevance to my own points of view.
I think, like Alden, you are mixing me up with someone else.
Hm. No comments from the A team.
nothing.
It’s too hot to pour concrete.
—
but — thinking skeptically:
The wikipedia article was outspoken about Karl Bendetsen.
Who gets to get away with that?
Chances are it was written by someone who is Japanese?
The American People paid reparations to Japanese who were interned, and the American People bear the shame of having interned them.
But a Jewish person pushed the issue.
Gonna have to skim the Bendersky book, see if any of the “antisemitic” military people he complained about spoke up against Japanese internment.
all the other stuff was just bread-crumbs that led to Benedtsen. Who tried to pass as a non-Jew.
Mlle Brosi,
You have a lot of problems.
Starting with projection.
I suggest you find yourself a nice boyfriend and stop wasting your pretty little head on the HoloHoax. .
I answered that and said that it was unclear and I was seeking more information. Well, I have more information on Mildenstein now and it come from Wikipedia! Yes, as it so often turns out, Wiki has a lot more to choose from, and what’s more, is always correct when it comes to dates and the like, while Lenni Brenner is not.
It turns out that Mildenstein was NOT the head of the Jewish Desk at the Sicherheitsdienst (SD) in April 1933 when he and Kurt Tuchler (with their wives) spent a month in Palestine. He didn’t have that job with the SD until August 1934!
So much for what an important personage he was.
A second big error you committed is in placing the trip to Palestine in 1934 instead of 1933. You wrote:
A few paragraphs later, you wrote:
But no, I didn’t agree.The trip to Palestine was in 1933, as written here:
Proof enough? Doesn’t it seem like this is more of a pact between two friends – a Jew and a German – to help advance Zionism since they both believed in it so much. I don’t think they even needed Joseph Goebbels.
I’m going to copy here my edited version of what I found at Wikipedia bc there are other interesting tidbits to be had:
Yep, Bro, even Adolf admitted it (though he used the word ‘Slavs’). This is very easy to establish because Serbs have European and Germans have Asian genetics. It is easy to establish that the Goths were not Germans, and it is known that the Wends (Vandals) were Serbs.
The House of Hohenzollern (and House of Mecklenburg) are also of Serbian origin (just like Martin Luther, Leibniz and Empress Katharina II). It should not be surprising, like all converts, Luther was a great Serbophobe (and Slavophobe). The biggest Serbian enemies are converted Serbs – Bosnian Muslims (Islamic converts), most of the Croats (Catholic converts), Bulgarians are 95% ethnic Serbs, like most Hungarians and a large part of Greeks (in Greek Macedonia there were 85% Serbs 100 or so years ago). Romanians (former Dacians i.e. Goths) are also former Serbs. Prussians are not Germans, either.
It’s never too late to learn the truth. Just as Madeleine Albright found out very late that she was a converted Jew, so perhaps Carolyn found out that she is of Serbian origin.
Bro, I am glad that our Big Sis regularly follows my comments, but she is so shy to admit it which is a bit strange for her mature age.
The issue of the woefully inadequate capacity (for mass extermination), of the cremation ovens NEVER changed.
You apologists for the Holohoax have still not addressed this issue – nor of the logistical impossibilities of supplying sufficient coking coal for the cremation of those millions of alleged victims.
ie: NO documentation that said coking coal was ever shipped to Auschwitz, NO evidence of huge (or even small) mounds of coking coal VISIBLE from the numerous aerial reconnaissance photos of this work camp that were taken throughout the war.
Yes, the cremation ovens had sufficient capacity to handle the hundreds and hundreds of deaths that were occurring during the typhus epidemics of 1942/42 and those from natural causes.
But NO, they had nowhere near the capacity sufficient to handle even the smallest fraction of those claimed to have been killed by the peddlers of this myth.
You are claiming:
Can you furnish these designs/blueprints that show the ‘gas chambers ?
ie: depicting sturdily constructed and air tight doors, ventilation systems, the Zyklon B delivery system, the heating* systems employed etc.
(*The Zyklon B pellets would release their pesticidal gas at temperatures above around 25 degrees Celsius/c. 78 deg F. Below that temp they were INERT.
Of course the small chambers used for delousing the clothes and bedding of the inmates, DID indeed have equipment that heated the chamber prior to the placement of the Zyklon B pellets, but no such heating paraphernalia was shown to exist elsewhere else in these work camps).
If the blueprints for these alleged gas chambers existed, of course the Holohoax lobby would have made them widely available.
So then, since you’re claiming that such blueprints exist, get to it. We’d all like to scrutinise them.
BTW, seeing as Topf und Söhne specialised in making cremation ovens, don’t you think it strange that they’d also be commissioned to build something of which they have no expertise ? (ie: a chamber for using toxic gas).
Surely, a company like Degesch (of which IG Farben had a controlling interest), would have been better suited as a contractor to build an extermination chamber.
After all, Degesch manufactured the Zyklon B pesticide which was so successful in greatly reducing mortality during the 1942/43 typhus epidemic, where it was employed in delousing the clothes and bedding of the camp inmates.
It thus played a key role in saving the lives of much needed workers that contributed to the German war effort.
I don’t have statistics for how many camp guards died of typhus. No doubt many did.
Of course, seeing as epidemic typhus (as opposed to scrub or murine typhus), is spread by body lice, and bearing in mind that inmates lived/worked/slept in close proximity to one another, they would have been far more susceptible to it.
Said lice would cluster in the hair on your head/armpits etc, your clothes, bedding etc.
For certain the guards would be regularly inspected, bath more frequently and have their clothes and bedding fumigated more regularly, thus minimising the likelihood of disease amongst themselves.
Not so with the inmates, who’d be more likely to wear the same clothes for extended periods, use the same bed sheets/blankets for weeks on end, and practise lower standards of hygiene.
As for you suggestion about prison guards being cremated in the camp ovens, why would they ?
Even if their corpses were riddled with lice, said corpse could still be placed in the smallish delousing chambers where the clothes and bedding of inmates was fumigated with Zyklon B, and given the treatment.
Then, their lice-free body could be transported to the next of kin where it could be buried in the family plot in their little town/place of origin.
What sparked my interest, Uncle A, was reading an article by John Wear which, at least in part, described the determination of certain British “operatives” (Lord Halifax, et al) to provoke a war with Germany, despite the praise they’d previously heaped on Hitler and the NSDAP.
So the question I’m exploring (my own anarchist principles aside, for the moment at least) is, is/could National Socialism be the key to freeing mankind from the grip of elite/tribal psychopathy? Is that why the psychopaths did (and do) everything in thier power to oppose it?
With love,
Kali.
So for those who are not paying full attention to this, but only glancing through it, I will point out the important facts and what they mean.
1) Leopold von Mildenstein was a regular member of the SS when he made the trip to Palestine with the Jew Tuchler, without any special position. He was a competent writer/journalist.
2) He had an affinity with Zionism and was an opponent of the “Julius Streicher”style of anti-semitism (this is stated in several places).
3) The trip to Palestine was sponsored and probably financed by the Juedische Rundschau bi-weekly newspaper of the Zionist movement and by the Zionist Federation of Germany — all Jewish, need I add. No approval or commitment from the Hitler regime or Goebbels’ Gau office in Berlin was necessary, nor can I find any mention of such, although there probably was an informal or preliminary intention to publish from the editors at Der Angriff.
4) Tuchler approached Mildenstein because they were already acquainted. He knew M. was a writer and a friend of Zionism, and also an SS member. What more could he want?
5) Tuchler just asked Mildenstein to write something ‘positive’ about the Jews in Palestine, but M. wanted to visit the place for himself before he did. So it was arranged.
6) M. was impressed and wrote a long article that was divided into 12 parts for serialization in the Angriff newspaper, along with the promotional campaign using the (cheap at that time) medals w/ the Swastika & and Star of David.
7) Serialization is a popular way of getting new readers used to reading a particular newspaper, bc at that time there were a lot of newspapers competing for readers. The longer the series runs, the better for that purpose. (Ron Unz glibly calls the series “massive” in his article without knowing the length of each installment.)
8) By 1936, the attitude of the Hitler government to Jews in Palestine changed to one of caution, bc of the Arab world, and Mildenstein was let go from his position in the SD. Because of his journalistic skills, he was transferred to the Press Dept. of the Foreign Ministry.
9) He survived the war and also the post-war and lived without too much incident until his death in 1964.
So what does it mean? When all is said and done, this newspaper series has been blown out of proportion by those on either side who think it can work to their advantage. This is the nature of politics. In itself, it didn’t change anything. It was a phenomenon of it’s time & place. But the evidence shows it was a Jewish-Zionist project, not a Third Reich project, not even a joint project. That is the error indulged in by Ron Unz & Lenni Brenner for their own interests, not historically factual. A false interpretation.
I think I am due an apology from Mr. Unz for ridiculing my German trait of Thoroughness by repeatedly calling it “crankism.” I do indeed have a need/desire to ‘get to the bottom of things’ and hate leaving ‘loose ends’ flying around, especially when it works against my beliefs and/or concerns. It’s this very quality that has led to my uncovering several prevailing falsehoods which no one else was interested in looking into any more deeply. I am actually surprised (and of course disappointed) in how un-curious most people are; how easily they accept insufficient answers. 🙂
The snake-like attitude of Lord Halifax, Kali, typifies why the English govt has earned the nickname “Perfidious Albion”. This is not recent and imho is well deserved.
The Anglo-Norman-Jewish ruling class in England is able to recruit certain types of amoral boneheads, perverts and the like because of belonging to a perceived “English superiority” that is entitled to show the rest of the world how to behave.
This attitude is not uncommon still, even among the lower orders who are themselves victims of the ruling echelon. Private schools (called “public schools” by the English), the homo culture, BBC, “newspapers”, Masonic orders etc all play a part in this.
It extends to 5Eyes ex-colonies also.
The entire idea is laughable, or it would be if it did not cause so much distress.
Halifax et al. saw a very real threat to their Square Mile ruling class in National Socialism, and they were 100% correct in their estimation.
Hence the snake-like pretence when weak, and the not just military defeat but total obliteration of Germany when strong. Gross war crimes even after Germany’s surrender plus the farce of Nuremberg, followed by the holohoax.
Those people are still in power today.
From my own studies, I conclude and believe that National Socialism is the natural system of government for all strata in any society, though its actual form might differ from place to place. It has been proven to be so as you will see when reading of what happened after Adolf Hitler, the greatest leader in modern memory, was elected to power in 1933 when he inherited the Jewish “liberal” Weimar mess.
Best Wishes.
PS. There is no substitute for study. You need to satisfy yourself of these matters which are vital to understanding the world we live in. People’s opinions, including mine, might or might not be correct or true or valid.
There are plenty of liars around, as these columns show.
The filthy habits of the jews contributed greatly to the typhus epidemics rampant in the camps.
General George Patton wrote about the filthy habits of the jews who refused to use provided sanitary facilities, instead preferring to use the corners of rooms as latrines. They had to be threatened with rifle butts to get them to use the sanitary facilities.
Along with supply chain issues, the camp inmates themselves contributed greatly to their own demise by their refusal to abide by human sanitary norms.
Those adults who can read for themselves and who are interested in this episode can read about it for themselves and make up their own minds here:
“LEOPOLD VON MILDENSTEIN AND THE JEWISH QUESTION”
https://etd.ohiolink.edu/apexprod/rws_etd/send_file/send?accession=case1365174634&disposition=inline
No need for Ms. Yeager to “explain it all to you” or hold your hand.
Actually , I am quite sure Ms. Yeager herself has not read this the thesis.
So, Ms. Yeager might herself profit from reading Mr. JOSEPH VERBOVSZKY’s thesis.
The footnotes are quite interesting, providing context and of pointing to further sources..
From Van Pelt’s book “Auschwitz 1270 to the present”,
Degesch also made heaters/fans for vaporiizing/distributing the Zyklon:
All this in an ‘extermination center’ ….. the lies are preposterous
What is this, Herrin Skeptical!
You, who have plumbed Niagara Falls but have yet to dabble a dainty digit in the anomalies of the Wannsee creek-bed,
https://www.unz.com/runz/hitler-churchill-the-holocaust-and-the-war-in-ukraine/#comment-6080342
make bold to instruct Professor Doktor Yeager as to what she might “profitably” read?
nb. Among those statements directly refuting Skeptical’s declaration that Wannsee “mandated” execution of every Jew without exception, is this:
that speaks directly to the matter of Mr. Mildenstein.
Was he Jewish?
The eastern ghetto Jews (most, not all, I’m sure) did NOT want to take showers! They wanted to keep their same clothes on for weeks on end. Now that most have become more ‘modern-thinking’, they want to blame the “Nazis” for keeping them that way. No, the Germans did them a favor by bringing them into the clean, modern German world.
Exactly as the black negroes today want to blame and collect reparations bc of American ‘slavery’ when in actual fact, today’s blacks should be grateful for it!! One black person recently admitted that and was roundly condemned.
Life moves forward (evolution) in uneven ways.
“nb. Among those statements directly refuting Skeptical’s declaration that Wannsee “mandated” execution of every Jew without exception, is this:”
Oh, stop the silly blah-blah.
I guess you assume that commenters here don’t bother to read earlier comments that you are commenting on.
I am not going to waste TUR real estate by repeating what I already said.
Until 1933 there were two recognized ways to organize a nation and its economy: Capitalism and Communism. Today we may observe the results of each system. Who can honestly say that they like what they see?
I happen to believe that the National Socialist way to organize a nation and its economy was a third way to do so. This was a way that allowed the working man who, after all is the creator of the national wealth, to fully benefit from his labours. The Autobahn type highway and Volkswagen, plus many other NSDAP innovations still exist today. Bankers were relegated to service positions, and not permitted the power they have in capitalist countries to skim the cream off the work of others.
Both Communism and Capitalism are methodologies to shear the sheep on the tax farm. At least with Capitalism there was an effort not to kill the goose that laid the golden egg. Communism killed whoever was perceived as a threat, no matter how remote.
My parents became adults and were married during the NSDAP regime in Germany. Their experiences were generally positive, as even during the war they were able to travel all over Germany for their honeymoon, which was in 1942.
With the NSDAP nation organization international bankers were shut out from profiting off Germany’s international trade. The Germany introduced government to government trade such that bankers were not necessary. Eg. Germany would ship machinery and fertilizer to Argentina, who in turn would ship meat and grain to Germany, all in agreed upon quantities.
It was Churchill that railed against this and opined that a war would be necessary to stop this loss to his banker friends. This was in the mid 1930’s already.
I’m over the target and experiencing incoming flak. Does Skeptical have any disagreement with the account of Herr Mildenstein I provided? If so, s/he doesn’t say what it is but simply offers another one by a graduate student. Why waste everyone’s time? I wrote out in simple language information on Mildenstein & his trip to Palestine for exactly those who don’t have the time to spend. Just as a service, and because I want them to “get it.”
Now you respond by expecting us to take a lot of time to read a 40-page graduate student’s thesis! I may take a look at it when I have time, but I wouldn’t expect more than a couple others to do so.
If I had never picked up a single book; or read a single essay that attempted to falsify the holocaust narrative, a comment such as yours, together with its antecedents, would have convinced me beyond a shadow of a doubt that the narrative was bogus, and was perpetuated by persons of less-than-mediocre capacity to confront a set of facts rationally and honestly.
There are still “stinky jews” out there…
Not too long ago, stinky jews were kicked off a flight from Detroit to Miami after other passengers complained about their stench.
Of course, these jews protested at not being allowed to “fly while stinky”.
The airline graciously provided these stinky jews with a free hotel room so that they could “freshen up”. They were put on a flight to their destination the next day.
These “stinky jews” are now suing the airline for refusing to allow them to “fly while stinky”.
Chutzpah, indeed…
The idea was the monetization of productive physical labor.
Germany did not have any appreciable amount of precious metals or reserve currency, and few natural resources other than water and abundant coal reserves.
Physical labor is the primary source of all economic value, not what some talmudic gnome sitting on his pile of gold and silver claims it to be.
A true national economy must exist to serve the people, not the other way around.
No truly sovereign nation would let its citizens starve or suffer degradation and debt slavery simply to appease the lurking market worshiping demons.
The German people was under no imperative whatsoever to starve or turn back to those supposedly idyllic days when Berlin was the cheap sex capital of Europe and women were often forced to prostitute themselves for a cup of sugar or a piece of bread.
Hitler’s great crime (other than having lost the war) was that the National Socialist economic policies worked so well. This no doubt horrified the usurious overlords of Wall St. and the City of London, and enraged FDR , whose so called “New Deal” had been totally ineffective at dealing with the depression in the USA.
Re the “bad business” with Stauffenberg and Rommel, yes very bad indeed. The book Wilhelm Kriessmann and I translated from Hermann Giesler (last part of his memoir) — it doesn’t seem that you’ve read it. It has 4 whole chapters covering that ‘business’ that are very interesting. I noticed that someone put it on Archive.org if you should have the time to look at it.
I think the crux of the problem was that Hitler admired the British and their accomplishments too much to want to go to war with them. He wanted to partner with them. He saw this as the only way to make the Aryan world work and retain dominance. But the British elite didn’t want to share that dominance with the Germans. It’s still that way with Anglo-America. They don’t see the Germans as “in their club,” maybe not good enough (yet too good for them to compete with).
Hitler believed he could win people over. So I guess his great fault was to believe in Reason, that Reason could prevail among reasonable people. I don’t think it should be called naivite. He realized there was no other solution that would work, at the time. There doesn’t seem to have been a functioning Peace Movement in GB. They were pretty good at throwing all those types into prison.
I think your idea that Germany could defeat GB militarily is over-idealistic. Germany was too small and its allies too unstable. It really comes down to the Jews as a wealthy, connected world organization that prevents our progress in unifying racially, which would require the acceptance of dominant & subordinate nations. They say it’s distrust of “the other” but that’s not true – it’s them!
I was wondering what Ron Unz thought of Cole’s article.
I’m afraid that none of those very minor possible errors, which I may have taken from Brenner’s book, have anything to do with the issue at hand, which was the acceptable use of the term “Nazi” in Nazi Germany.
The only reason I’d quoted that sentence from my 2018 article was that Berlin’s big Nazi newspaper, published by Joseph Goebbels, had run a huge 12-part series entitled “A Nazi Goes to Palestine” and distributed an associated commemorative medal bearing the same inscription.
I merely pointed out that if Goebbels’ own big Nazi newspaper in Berlin used the word “Nazi” in its headlines that conclusively proved that the term “Nazi” was perfectly acceptable in Nazi Germany.
None of it had anything to do with whether Mildenstein was an important SS official before he published the series or only became one the following year, or your other minor complaints.
Similarly, Arthur Butz clearly preferred using the term “Nazi” to “NSDAP” or “National Socialist” or anything else in describing Hitler’s regime.
So my verdict on you stands. However, you’ve certainly exhausted me on this absurdly trivial issue, and I doubt I’ll bother replying to your further complaints.
Actually, I found it a little puzzling, as I’d already mentioned upthread:
https://www.unz.com/runz/hitler-churchill-the-holocaust-and-the-war-in-ukraine/#comment-6077796
You came late and want me to repeat everything for you that I already wrote.
Don’t waste my time.
You sound like a pompous ass, TBH.
Are you the same person who wrote:
AAMOF I haven’t yet read the June 10 article.
So what? There are only 24 hours in a day. ?
AAMOF I did not ask you to “repeat everything you already wrote.”
Ron Unz’s essay is the driving topic of this thread. I read it carefully. I read Beaty several weeks ago. At the risk of appearing a “pompous ass,” I must admit I did not-do not pay much attention to your writing. Shall we soon see your work in weekly installments?
I asked you to reconcile your assertion that Wannsee protocol
with numerous “exemptions” — exceptions and exclusions specifically cited in the Wannsee document that you linked.
Most pertinent were the numerous exceptions for, i.e. persons over 65, who were to be housed at Theresteinstadt.
If there is evidence that one Jew was sent to Theresteinstadt and returned from that place after the war, then your assertion that Wannsee “clearly mandates the destruction of all Jews . . . completely, totally, without exception,” is logically false.
But whether or not Thereseinstadt existed; whether or not Wannsee planned to exempt certain categories of Jews to a “ghetto” — Thereseinstadt; whether or not Thereseinstadt was a place where Jews were to be “destroyed;” whether or not Thereseinstadt had “gas chambers” and crematories to “destroy Jews” are Yes-Or-No questions.
You did not respond to those questions.
You made a very bold claim: that Wannsee “clearly mandates the destruction of all Jews, “restlos” — completely, totally, without exception.”
Extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence: The text of the document you relied upon not only fails to provide that evidence, it offers countervailing evidence.
It may be quite true that I am a pompous ass. If you actually knew me, no telling what you would think.
Most of Ms. Yeager’s points re Mildenstein seem trivial, or are incorrect or irrelevant.
I have read through the whole thesis LEOPOLD VON MILDENSTEIN AND THE JEWISH QUESTION, written by Joseph Verbovszky.
It presents a very interesting discussion of the ongoing efforts, including Mildenstein’s, to find a magic wand to solve the Jewish Question—and thereby to win huge Brownie points with Hitler, quite apart from the pursuit of his own beliefs. It highlights the tensions between the Zionists and the assimilationists within the German Jewish community and the ways the Nazis exploited them. Mildenstein makes some interesting observations on the different types of Jewish Germans in Palestine, such a on the one hadn the Betar “pioneers” and OTOH the rich Jewish Germans who decamped to Palestine pre-1933— with their assets. (Obviously, in light of current events, the Jewish Question is still the Question, but we are not allowed to mention it, are we. )
Here’s the thesis’s Conclusion (I don’t expect any of the Hoaxers here to actually read the document and broaden their viewpoints—they prefer their well-worn hobby horses!):
I don’t seem to be able to fix the hard returns.
Cf. Joseph Goebbels, “Die Nazis-Sozis.”
“then your assertion that Wannsee “clearly mandates the destruction of all Jews . . . completely, totally, without exception,” is logically false.”
It is not “my assertion.” It is what is in the document.
I provided a translation for the word “restlos.”
I also pointed out that the document gives evidence of the tensions between the need for labor and the drive to complete the Final Solution.
A major point that many of you all, including you and Vigilante, for some reason still do not seem to be able to “get,” although it is not that complicated.
That’s all now.
Of course. Since you’re being exposed as a sloppy writer who accepts material from book sources that “sound good to you” without checking the authenticity. In this case, you played up the importance of these two items [the year 1934, and how that affected the actual “important SS position held by Mildenstein” at the time he traveled to Palestine] that you now label “absurdly trivial.” How quickly you go from important to trivial when the truth comes out against you.
Now again you’re calling Der Angriff “Berlin’s big Nazi newspaper” and “Goebbels’ own big Nazi newspaper in Berlin.” It was not a big newspaper but a small one. You don’t bother to find out, but just make it up to fit your narrative. Fact: It only became a daily newspaper in 1931, and it’s highest circulation was only 110,600, in a city of over four million, on the eve of the July 1932 Reichstag election. (Wiki) After 1933, the importance of the newspaper decreased. So you just don’t know what you’re talking about and will say anything that sounds good to you. People should know this.
This truth about Der Angriff and Mildenstein’s position with the SS bears heavily on your claim that the term “Nazi” was in common use in the Third Reich (1933-1945). Correcting these two mistakes undoes your silly idea that the “use of the word ‘Nazi’ in one headline in “Goebbels own big newspaper in Berlin” conclusively proves that the term ‘Nazi’ was perfectly acceptable in Nazi Germany.” !! No, it does not. That is not proof, even if you were not at the same time wrong about the size of the newspaper.
You were also mistaken in your article when it comes to Adolf Eichmann. You wrote:
Not true. That was part of his job as the SS agent for Jewish Affairs. In 1939, he was made chief of the Jewish Department Referat IV B4 of the RSHA, similar to Mildenstein’s job.
Then you wrote this nonsense:
Wow. Don’t know what to say. You’re trying so very hard to connect National Socialists (Nazis to you) with Jews. Why? If you’re exhausted, that’s the reason. I’m glad if you don’t reply, and it won’t stop me from pointing out mistakes and untruths when I see them. It’s called revisionism. Revisionism means “the establishment of historical truth by revealing earlier errors in interpretation of causes & merits of a conflict” … Harry Elmer Barnes, one of my heroes.
NOWHERE does the Wannsee document state that the “destruction” of ALL Jews is mandated, with no exceptions.
Thank you for the translation of “restlose.” College German was a long time ago. Happily, other methods of translating are now readily available.
Here’s a machine translation of the passage that includes the one time the adjective “restlose” is used:
“Complete” modifies “cleaning up the problem”, where “the problem” is the presence of Jews in the German nation.
It is quite true that a major goal of NSDAP was to remove all Jews from Germany.
That is what the Wannsee conference of January 1942 purports to discuss.
Ironically, according to comments written in plain English by Rabbi Stephen Wise in his autobiography, The Challenging Years, (p. 242 iirc), nearly a decade earlier, in mid-February 1933, Louis Brandeis issued the directive to Rabbi Wise that “all Jews must leave Germany . . . all 587,000 German Jews must leave . . . No Jew should remain in Germany.”
Was Brandeis’s directive a euphemism for “All 587,000 German Jews must be destroyed?”
Many of us “don’t get” what you seem to “get” because you infer the use of euphemisms, which is illogical in context and based upon the overall context of the rest of the document.
Here are German words meaning “destruction” and/or “annihilation”, and the numbers of times these words appear in the Wannsee document:
https://www.ghwk.de/fileadmin/Redaktion/PDF/Konferenz/protokoll-januar1942_barrierefrei.pdf
Zerstörung, ZERO
Vernichtung, ZERO
Untergang, ZERO
Zertrümmerung, ZERO
Vertilgung, ZERO
Zerrüttung ZERO
—–
In a Question and Answer format, Germar Rudolf discusses the Wannsee protocols in Holocaust Handbooks Volume 15, Lectures on the Holocaust: Controversial Issues Cross-Examined, Third Expanded Edition, 2017.
At the outset, Rudolf concedes that the conference took place and the document is real.
On the other hand, Caroline Yeager questions the legitimacy of the document.
I think Ms. Yeager makes a good point: the document was “discovered” at Wannsee in 1946. Coincidentally, at that time the Wannsee mansion was being used to house Jewish “survivors” of the holocaust. Robert Kempner used the document in his prosecutions at Nuremberg. Kempner is said to have used illegitimate means to extract “confessions” and in other ways was far from meeting the criterion for an objective member of the legal team.
Furthermore, several months before the Trials began, Rabbi Stephen Wise wrote to his children that he had already colluded with Judge Robert Jackson to conduct the “trial” in a way unlike any other western judicial process.
No you didn’t. You are relying on a false interpretation of what the word means in English due to its similarity to “restless”. This is a false interpretation.
“Restlos” in this context means the remaining or residual Jews.
NSDAP policy was that the Jews in Germany were not German and were not welcome in Germany. England and the US had disallowed the emigration of Jews to Israel and were blockading Germany and all of Europe. Madagascar as a possible destination for the Eastern European Jews was no longer a possibility. At Wannsee in 1942 the issue was what were they going to do with the “remaining” Jews.
As usual for so many similar historical events surrounding the NSDAP, the evidence has been tampered with by Jews, and the Jews have perjured themselves incessantly. The entire Nuremberg process has to be thrown out as a mistrial, and all the Jewish claims against Germany during the Third Reich have to be re-evaluated in the light that Judea declared war against Germany in 1933 and waged a war of genocide against Germany throughout the period of the Third Reich using its proxies the US, UK and the USSR.
Thank you for your suggestion, Carolyn. I will look up that reading.
My main source for Rommel was buying the D. Irving biography. UR readers may not know that he makes all his material available as free downloads. Unsurprisingly, the false accusation against Rommel came from Gen. Speidel who played a treacherous role during the D-Day landings.
Speidel was Rommel’s Chief of Staff as you probably know.
He was rewarded by the Allies after end of hostilities.
https://www.fpp.co.uk/books/Rommel/index.html
I can agree that the probable cause of Hitler’s wish for peace with GB was his Logic and Reason. He didn’t realise the true nature of Perfidious Albion and expected to be dealing with people of honesty and integrity. Very reasonable expectation when dealing with diplomats at the highest level of government.
“Agreement incapable” as described recently.
Those people do not change, apparently.
I cannot agree that Germany could not have subdued GB after the capture of the BEF, if that had been carried out. Being an island is a two-edged sword — not easily invaded but otoh easily isolated. Submarines could have cut off GB’s shipping supplies.
There were considerable sympathetic forces like BUF.
Then again, the timing might not have been possible with the need to face the imminent attack by bolshevism. Maybe difficult to call, but I think possible to at least neutralise.
As Paula Hitler memorably commented just after end of hostilities.
Dear Ron,
I mentioned earlier on in this thread that I agree with Ms Yeager in regard to use of the term “Nazi”.
When I was growing up through the 70’s and 80’s I had no idea that the term stood for National Socialism, I only knew that it was a derogatory epithet used against German’s and Hitler.
The moment, remarkably recently – probably within the last 20 years – I learned the “the Nazi’s” were in actuality a political organisation called National Socialists my whole perspective changed: from one of blind/ignorant acceptance of a propagandised caricature, to one of realising I’d been, at least somewhat, hoodwinked.
The extent of the hoodwink continues to unfold.
That’s why it’s not quite the trivial matter you imagine it to be. Arthur Butz made a mistake in his liberal use of the term. Ms Yeager was mistaken in having not fully appreciated his liberal use of the term.
I hope that you, easily as stubborn as Ms Yeager as you are, take a less cavalier attitude toward propaganda terms in the future. Because they tend to skew important issues – by design.
Best regards,
Kali.
Carolyn, it’s interesting that you call Harry Elmer Barnes one of your heroes, yet simultaneously critcise the Libertarian movement and suggest (as I recall) that it was predominantly influenced by Jews.
Another misguided individual made the same allegation in another UR thread, to which I responded with a list of all the individuals that both influenced and laid the foundations for Libertarianism – and all but two were gentiles.
Of course, the two that were Jewish (Ludwig von Mises and Murray Rothbard), were righteous Jews that constantly pointed out the malfeasance of the ZOG owned and operated Federal Reserve and advocated for the dissolution of the latter.
On the matter of Murray Rothbard, it is well documented that he and Harry Elmer Barnes had a great friendship.
The following is from Wikipedia (which is no friend of Rothbard but, to their credit for once, it speaks the truth on this issue):
Got that Carolyn ? No other political ideology embraces revisionism like the Libertarians.
In light of that, it’s strange that you’ve endorsed the Orange Man (aka Donald J Chump) – a known sock puppet of ZOG.
Moral of the Story: Before you criticise other political ideologies, make sure you know exactly what they represent and simultaneously get your own house in order.
Because Donald Chump is no friend of the goyim.
EDIT
Should be
Carolyn Yeager.
Apologies for the error.
In their documents the Nazis never used explicit terms, always code-words such as Evakuierung, Umsiedlung or Sonderbehandlung. Following passage from the Wannsee Protocol is however clear enough:
Meaning the majority will be worked to death, and those who still survive will be killed, because being strong they or their progeny will try to take revenge.
That is clearly the meaning. Those Nazi sympathisers who deny that need themselves a Sonderbehandlung.
I did some research and was referred to an old lady who lives in the neighbourhood and has just turned 91. She explained indignantly that until the collapse in May 1945, no one in the German population went hungry because everything was perfectly organised, with food stamps and neighbourly help. After her family had to flee the Eastern territories, she heard the word “Nazi” for the first time after the end of the war. It had not been used before, at least in her environment.
The term “ausrotten” (Himmler, Wannsee) originally meant “to uproot”. When the meaning shifted to “exterminate”, I don’t know, nevertheless I hope to have made a constructive contribution.
Nowhere do you say that Barnes was a Libertarian, only that he was a friend of a Libertarian. You spend a lot of words to do nothing, to not accomplish your aim. And even if Barnes was a Libertarian, it wouldn’t matter to me bc it’s Barnes himself, HIS work, not his political affiliation, that I admire. So, as so often, you’re barking up the wrong tree.
You are really intrusive, do you know that?
I agree with you that the term ‘Nazi!’TM, as with ‘racist’, ‘anti-semite’, ‘fascist’, etc, is a ‘loaded’ term, and steer clear from using it. I just say ‘NS Germany’ instead.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loaded_language
Mr. Unz
I’m hoping to appropriate this comment to turn into a blog post:
https://www.unz.com/estriker/the-rampant-black-violence-on-american-military-bases/#comment-6080262
But I need to clear it with you first. (The commenter, bobbyg68, has kindly given his assent already)
Thanks!
Sonder means Special and behandlung means Treatment, plain and simple. The combined word was used for several purposes, none of which was Death. Carlo Mattogno wrote an entire book, The Origin of “Special Treatment” in Auschwitz, about it. I’m sure you’d never dream of reading it when you can follow the ignorant “survivor’s” tales instead.
But FYI Mattogno wrote:
This is all I’ll copy here, hoping it is sufficient to get the point across. Another reliable source is Juergen Graf, the Swiss-German revisionist. In his booklet “Raphael Ben Nescher und sein Buch ‘Holocaust-Revisionismus: Ideologie oder Wissenschaft?,” he demonstrates the obvious absurdity of the Auschwitz “Sonderkommando” lore:
Thanks for sharing this, Kali. Especially for saying that it’s not a trivial matter. Exactly the point. It’s a huge (massive?) mistake for any truth seeker to allow that it is “not worth fighting over.” It is, and imo of course, it should be.
So glad we can agree on this. 🙂
My parents also told me that the real starvation did not occur until 1947, ie. 2 years after the cease fire.
Knowing what I do now, I conclude that is how long it took for the Morgenthau Plan and Germany Must Perish initiatives to take effect.
My parents and I were very fortunate to have been in an area of western Germany that was a mixed economy of farming and light industry. My father, who was a very gifted metalworker, produced pots and pans to order for local farmers. My mother would trade these manufactured goods with the farmers for fresh fruits and vegetables.
As late as 1984 when I visited an aunt in that area she told me that many of the large pots my father had made were still in use. These large pots were made-to-measure for cooking preserves in Mason Jars or the German equivalent.
Another memorable item my father made was a large scale replica of a Greek wine jug. The owner of the firm of my father’s employment, this was 6 or 7 years after the war, was a member on the board of directors of the local museum. It its display was a Greek ceramic jug perhaps 100 mm high. The owner asked my father if he could make a replica in brass about 750 mm tall. This was the kind of work my father loved and, in due course fabricated one. I have a photo of it and it looked beautiful.
I wish I could trace the ownership now and perhaps purchase it.
So as you cite him, Skeptikal declares makes
And yet you note he claims that the documents includes:
What an extermination plan that is – kill them all, but make sure you lodge everyone older than 65 at Theresienstadt where they must then assume the burden of feeding, clothing housing them for what purpose?
Now its clear why the Germans lost the war. They definitely exterminated without exceptions those who were able bodied and capable of working to support the war effort, while keeping alive useless mouths who would presumably be the first to be exterminated if they were determined to eradicate without exception the embers of that group.
That fully captures length and breadth of the lunacy that holocaust purveyors embrace.
How ingenious.
Where can I get a Secret Decoder Ring?
Were the folks at Bletchley Park able to de-code German documents so that they could know with a metaphysical certainty that Germans were planning to Evakuierung all the Jews?
If so, when did they know? What did they do to stop it?
In the first weeks of June 1942, BenGurion was head of the Jewish Agency in TelAviv. He headed a group that debated whether to request that the Allies bomb Auschwitz.
At that time, according to a document that BenGurion signed, the decision was NOT to ask Allies to bomb Auschwitz because the Jewish Agency believed Auschwitz was a work camp, and the Jewish Agency did not wish to be responsible for harming “a single Jew.”
If Nazis “never used explicit terms,” how is it that the passage you quoted is “clear enough?”
(I was not able to find “eliminieren” in the original German text of the doc. ???)
In the Holocaust Handbook previously referenced, German Rudolf acknowledges that the passage that you quoted is a problem.
Why do you suppose Germans did not cloak that passage in code-words?
Similarly, the Wannsee Protocol is forthright in prescribing “sterilization” for any Jew who “wishes to remain in Germany.” No code-words; bold language. IIRC one participant said, Just sterilize the lot of them, (or words to that effect).
This forces recognition of the fact that the Wannsee Protocols did NOT “clearly mandate the destruction of all Jews, “restlos” — completely, totally, without exception,” contrary to Skeptikal’s repeated and irrational assertion.
Truth is truth. It matters!
And the truth is, I’m finding you to be an excellent and insightful scholar, Carolyn. Thank you for sharing some very helpful comments.
Sincerely.
Kali.
This thread has become a silly self-licking ice-cream cone.
Ha-ha! People on this thread are coming together, in the opposite direction of what you would like. In your comment #757 above, you begin:
Yet you don’t point out anything specific that is incorrect, and all you offer in its place is the empty verbiage of a graduate thesis by a Joseph Verbovszky (comment #757) that you happened upon through an internet search.
The part you copied, Chapt V – Conclusions, is a word salad of generalities that explains nothing, solves nothing. You can’t tell us why we should read it, or what it contains that is worthwhile except “a different viewpoint.” Do you know that you are bankrupt, trying to sell an empty carcass to people who are well-fed and not hungry enough to even consider your empty carcass. Maybe you should switch sides; you’d have more success.
That’s right Big Sis. Screw that Skep’s ears.
Reveals what it feels like to be skewered on the cross.
On the matter of intrusion, I noticed that you completely bypassed responding to what I said about you being a previous supporter of the KNOWN ZOG sock puppet Donald J Chump.
I’m sure many of the UR commentariat would be curious to know the answer to this question:
Are you endorsing the Orang-u-tan (aka Donald J Chump) for the 2024 election ?
Or will you be siding with the most honest, most intelligent, most likely to bring about the demise of ZOG candidate. ie: RFK Jr ?
For your consideration, Arthur. From p. 72 in “The Artist Within the Warlord’, Chapt 4: Why Operation Sea Lion was never launched. Hitler was explaining to Hermann Giesler in Aug. 1942, over tea & cookies, his reasoning about Op. Sea Lion:
From this we can see that Hitler was neither naive or too idealistic/honorable. He was a realist and looked at every angle. When he took that great “leap” into Soviet Russia in June ’41, it must have taken everything he had. He sensed how dangerous the Russians were. He really was depending on Providence, imo, because it was very dangerous either way–doing it or not doing it. Germany was between a rock and a hard place. Existential.
Hitler referred to fate often. Germans use the word ‘fateful’ a lot. It is a reality to them. I think being in the middle of a continent, hemmed in, contributes to that.
I had seen this photograph before, but I hadn’t noticed the date, May 1, 1945 or that these were “Hungarian Jewish” women. Budapest fell in February, 1945, and these women are at Dachau, not Auschwitz. They certainly were no use as labor, and they almost certainly had been evacuated from Budapest during the siege since these Yentas had been impregnated in late 1944.
Now this is what I call “Restlos” “Ausrotten”.
Yeah, the survival of children and babies born in the concentration camps refute the Holocaust!
This belongs to the stock in trade of cheap ideas raised by the revisionist geniuses. Here is the reality:
Source: https://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.com/2017/05/rebutting-twitter-denial-most-popular.html#unfit
It is the same old trick of the revisionists: mention an exceptional case, then suggest that it was the rule.
At the risk of sounding like #MeToo, I endorse Kali’s comment @765: the creation, use, and abuse of “Nazi” is important and must no go unchallenged.
Similarly regarding the Swastika: Rabbi Stephen Wise’s son turned it into an epithet by May 1933.
If that ancient symbol could be turned into a universal symbol of villainy, than it would not be long until other symbols that various cultures hold dear can be similarly subverted, and so it has come to pass.
In the same vein, I bristle when I see “Machiavelli” used as a synonym for devious (the professor who included “Machiavellian” in the Dark Triad should be reduced to janitor without tenure).
Machiavelli was a profound observer, scholar, and critic of Roman/European history. I cannot cite direct evidence, but I believe Hitler must have been acquainted with Machiavelli’s thought and works.
Your mention of the German concern for “fate” brings Machiavelli to mind: Niccolò understood that Fate held cards, but that the prudent leader — The Prince — developed skills and plans to manage whatever challenge Fate dealt, part of the constellation of qualities Machiavelli referred to as virtu.
—
@ Franklin Ryckaert, #786:
Makes perfect sense: tattoo the infant then kill it.
German precision at work.
Never understood that phrase.
Discovered this explanation:
a process, department, institution, or other thing that offers few benefits and exists primarily to justify or perpetuate its own existence.
That being the case, I disagree that this thread “offers few benefits . . .”
Several commenters have offered up abundant evidence of the complete absence of critical thinking and logic; and the utter bankruptcy of holocaustianity.
There is still that problem of the ice cream melting to the bottom of the cone where it gets soggy and drips onto your hand and down your sleeve. Yuck.
The Nazis were not always rational. In fact the whole Third Reich was based on irrationality, but tattooing a (Jewish) child might have been practical for those who had to know which child to kill and which not.
LOL. 6 million Jews died in the holofraud, and we know it was exactly 6 million because that is what the Rabbi’s are demanding. But there were only about 5 million Jews in all of the areas Hitler occupied, and ever since the war millions of Jews demand reparations based on their claim to be “death camp survivors”.
So you claim that it is irrelevant that there are hundreds of photographs of fat and happy Yentas who made it through childbirth in death camps while their families were fed and cared for as millions of German women were being raped, and millions of German men murdered, by the Red Rapist Army.
It is also important to mention that while these spoiled Yentas were being pampered and cared for by the SS, the US marched in and committed war crimes and mass murder against the very SS that had fed those plump Yentas.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dachau_liberation_reprisals
Who I will vote for in the presidential election has no connection to this comment thread at all. You bring it up bc of your obsession with the Libertarian political philosophy. If it were a private matter for me I would ignore your intrusive question, but I’ve already voiced my view on that in many places, including on this site. If you look in the right places, you will find it.
I sure will not be voting for RFK Jr. First, I don’t vote in the Dem primary, and that’s as far as he will go. The only way I would vote for RFK is if it were a Joe Biden vs. RFK election, which it won’t be in Nov. 2024.
Why do many Ashkenazi Jews have blue eyes?
Next time, Franklin, try to fact-check the information you copy-paste from a website created by an unaccomplished malcontent-suicide like Tim Mason.
Do you try to blame the stupidity of the Nazis on me?
Thanks, Carolyn.
How ironic for me to inform you that I bought your book on 5. Oct. 2018 (just looked on amzn) and have not read it. Soon after purchase, it was “borrowed” by an interested person … after which I moved house and lost track of it …
I’ll get another copy, and this time read it …
That’s a good quote w sound reasons for not carrying out Op Sealion.
Perhaps my view derives from wishful thinking about taking down the dreadful Churchill govt and its supporters. I’ve read fairly extensively in BUF (Sir Oswald Mosley) and others similar. They were all patriots though deeply opposed to “The Bank” and its minions.
Many were imprisoned (without charges) in WW2. “Regulation 18b”
Maybe you have heard of Arnold Leese ?
Here’s a pdf link to his “Out of Step” for your maybe interest.
(Readily available from National Library of Israel btw …)
http://ia800709.us.archive.org/25/items/ArnoldLeeseOutOfStep/Out%20of%20Step%20by%20Arnold%20Leese.pdf
Franklin exposes the boundless irrationality that makes up the holocaust narrative its purveyors propound as exmplified by:
Bu didn’t skeptical just say the Wannesse protocols called for wiping out the Jews without exception except for all the exceptions that must have been made because so many survived.
But if the plan was to wipe them out without exceptions, why in the world would the Germans sustain babies that clearly did not qualify for exceptions for twins since none of the babies pictured having survived the camps were twins?
Oh, and by what criteria did they determine which babies were to be exceptions and which were simply to be chucked into gas chambers before they were shoveled into furnaces? Were there written protocols that identified just which babies were to be exempt?
It is, however, the photos of the perfectly healthy, well nourished and obviously happy mothers that completely belies the claim that just days earlier they were steps away from gas chambers and the ovens or whatever ghastly business was otherwise supposedly in store for them.
Thanks for your endorsement, SC, that the use & abuse of the term “Nazi” should not go unchallenged. So will anything be done about it? It would take objecting to it whenever one sees it used as the ONLY term for National Socialist or ism. We also need to research how/why it was or wasn’t used during the Third Reich, by whom, and get those facts established. That’s something I never did, and truthfully, there was a time that I argued that it was an OK word bc I myself rather liked it, so I didn’t really feel it’s harm. Since then I’ve seen the light on how it’s another attempt (pushed hard mainly by Jews) to destroy anything to do with Adolf Hitler.
FYI, my position is that ‘Hitlerism’ is an appropriate name for the ideology that we know as National Socialism, NSDAP and the German Third Reich. ‘Nazism’ is not bc it there is no such thing and never was, except in the minds of the enemies of all things ‘Hitler.’ The word Nazi signifies nothing in terms of the actual people and programs that are associated with Hitler’s 12-year regime, who were GERMANS first and foremost, and who were trying to save their country from Bolshevism (first) and Jewry (second), not attack other countries! I think it important that this understanding ‘sinks in’ bc it’s not just that it’s a slur, but that it’s meaningless and does not describe any reality.
It is really comic book or animated cartoonish villian type of stuff. For immature kids. That’s one thing that could be emphasized.
“…Oh, and by what criteria did they determine which babies were to be exceptions and which were simply to be chucked into gas chambers before they were shoveled into furnaces? Were there written protocols that identified just which babies were to be exempt..?”
You should have asked the Nazi leaders of those concentration camps. Rules were sometimes different in time, space and circumstances, and need not always have been in writing. Exceptions did exist, but do not refute the main policy.
If the belief in the innocence of the Nazis is your religion (“Nazianity”?) then be free to have that. I’d rather believe in the pursuit of reality, no matter where that leads to.
“…Since then I’ve seen the light…”
“…my position is that ‘Hitlerism’ is an appropriate name for the ideology that we know as National Socialism,..”
“Hitlerism” sounds too close to the term “Esoteric Hitlerism” of cranks like Savitri Devi and Miguel Serrano. I just happened to coin the term “Nazianity”, which I herewith propose.
No, it is you who claim there was a criterion the must have used because they obviously didn’t do the same thing to all the babies which, were it true, would mean they saved them all because the phto proves the pictured babies survived. Since it is you who claim such criteria existed, you specify what it is bc in the absence of such criteria, the pictured babies are evidence they all must have survived since there is no basis for establishing they met any criteria that saved them.
I don’t believe anyone’s guilt or innocence. I accept and reach conclusions about events from what physical evidence establishes occurred. You can believe whatever holocaust purveyor hallucinations please you, but don’t expect me to subscribe to them without physical evidence as substantiating proof. And you obviously have none that substantiates the claimed criterion the Germans allegedly used to determine which babies would be saved and which would not bc you have refused to provide them despite having alleged they existed.
Another piece of holocaust purveyor evidence fit only for the garbage dump.
Was a Polish midwife in Auschwitz, Stanislawa Leszczynska,”
NaziGerman?It’s the “stupid” statement of Stanislawa Leszczynska that is contradicted by what medical science (and thousands of mothers) know about the changing nature of a neonate’s eye color and hair color.
Most likely, the foolishness about “blue eyes and blonde hair” was put into Midwife Stanislawa Leszczynska’s mouth by anti-German propagandists.
Like Ritchie Boy Hans Spear, a Chicago house-painter (perhaps inspired by Hitler), who sniffed out an orphanage where German infants were cared for.
A nasty little man, Spear nearly spits as he tells the tale of his derring-do in taking down an orphanage in Germany:
—
Constraining reproduction of The Other was, apparently, one of the war aims of both Allies and Axis powers: Kaufmann urged the sterilization of all Germans, and at Wannsee (supposedly) Jews who wished to remain in Germany should voluntarily submit to sterilization.
The Battle of the Babies!
Well, the Nazis did have a policy of kidnapping Polish children with blue eyes and blond hair.
See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kidnapping_of_children_by_Nazi_Germany
So it is very well possible that they also stole Polish babies with those characteristics. Whether they knew that eye color of babies can change I don’t know. They were quite stupid when it came to matters of race. They thought that Polish children with blue eyes and blond hair must be of Germanic origin, incapable of imagining that such characteristics are also possible among Slavic peoples. Himmler sent even an expedition to Tibet because he thought that “the Aryans” originally came from there. Clumsy idiocy as official policy.
The possible criterion was already mentioned in the quote I provided. To repeat:
Source: https://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.com/2017/05/rebutting-twitter-denial-most-popular.html#unfit
What are you about, Franklin?
Are you trying to learn something — about how forces understood or misunderstood other forces, and reacted or didn’t react to protect what they thought was important, so that we, today, can learn how better to conduct our affairs; or are you just trying to score points in some mindless game you’re playing in your head?
Re SC, “What it feels like to be skewered on the cross.”
What a blasphemous image, and stupid statement.
Have fun at the treacly Kali-Yeager love fest!
Dear Septic Al,
In an earlier comment to me you said:
I wish I could say the same for you.
I’ve not read many of your comments on this forum, those I have read I’ve found generally uninspiring.
But glancing through your contributions to this conversation I see that you started well, making strong points, which you generally supported.
Then, for some reason you lost your way and became silly, trollish and … pointless.
Some of us live and learn, because that is the mature thing to do, Septic.
That you prefer to devolve into pointlessness and jealousy is your choice and your problem. That choice renders you someone of no consequence and not to be taken seriously in this, or future discussions.
So sad.
Kali.
Why didn’t the Germans keep proper records to tell us whatever happened to every single Jew they kidnapped, and then we wouldn’t have to endlessly argue about the bloody Holocaust? After all they did tattoo a number on every Jew so there must have been followups in their records. Like this, of course anyone can throw around any number they want.
pay attention.
that was not the statement of SC.
Understandable that Skeptikal would make such a mistake.
Skeptikal is in the “Don’t bother me with the facts, my mind is made up” camp.
“…After all they did tattoo a number on every Jew so there must have been followups in their records…”
They didn’t. Here is the proper information:
https://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.com/2017/05/rebutting-twitter-denial-most-popular.html#tattoo
Jews who were gassed on arrival were neither tattooed nor registered. We can estimate their numbers only from the train records.
The question why the Nazis didn’t act differently is as useless as the question why history didn’t happen differently. We can only work with what happened.
Another good hearted practice which has been spun and twisted in the most evil way by your ilk.
The Germans cared for orphaned children. Even Jew children as evidenced by some of the photos posted in this thread. Those who were considered racially compatible would also be naturalized as Germans. Only a sick and perverted mind would have the temerity to twist these acts of the heart into evil fantasies of murder and depravity. Quite natural to you, I’m sure, but abhorrent to the rest of us.
Poles and Germans share many genes. As to be expected when living next to each other for a thousand years. The instinct for the nature of race that we find in the prewar era has mostly been proven correct by modern science. Blue eyes and blonde hair do share a common origin. Every blue eyed man today comes from the same ancestor. Whether this origin is “Germanic” is quite irrelevant to this concept of sameness.
Even if that is the case, they would have kept records when they were rounding them up. No?
I did reference detailed studies based on train records quite some time ago.
To Commenter Mike: “They” refers to “Germans” in your previous comment. But not “every Jew” was tattooed; that practice was only in place at the Auschwitz location. Thus you’re confusing yourself and your readers due to your superficial, ie. hearsay, knowledge of the vast subject of “Holocaust.” There are many like you who join the conversation on the believer side and all you contribute is confusion. If you have a question, please ask it without incl your false assumptions in it.
Now Franklin R. purports to straighten you out, but he too relies on little knowledge and a lot of prejudice. He says:
Aha. “We,” he says. There is no proof, aka evidence, that any Jews were gassed on arrival. That is a fiction created by survivors–for example Elie Wiesel (who I think that you, at one time, recognized as a fraud), and many, many others. But all equally as fraudulent. As backup, I offer my own articles gathered together here: https://carolynyeager.net/holoquacks. There are exactly 20 articles to choose from (choose any one you like). I 100% stand behind my careful research in each one of them, thus if you have any questions or disagreements, you can ask me directly and I’ll answer. You never do this, for the same reason you only offer links, specifically to Holocaust Controversies, to Wikipedia, or to HDOT (Deborah Lipstadt’s site), avoiding putting anything in your own words. It’s because you are ignorant as hell about the whole hodge-podge of claimed happenings, and would soon be in deep trouble, factually, if you tried to speak/write from your own knowledge.
You don’t know what happened, and you’ve been making that quite clear in this thread, becoming increasingly belligerent as you are doubted by more and more readers. You don’t like being on the defensive, do you? You can only operate from an offensive position. I think that’s very revealing in itself. It means you cannot defend your position, or any specific claim that you make in your own words.
It’s true that Sceptikal makes a lot of sloppy mis-attributions. S/he is striking me more and more as an “elderly” person (lots of us here are) who, while having the advantage of reading German, is not that well versed in the subject. So s/he’s kind of winging it. I have suspected that s/he’s working for someone, but that’s a difficult call, so I won’t make it.
That’s been my question over the years. This guy doesn’t add up. While presenting himself as a White Nationalist, he at the same time has such a dislike for Adolf Hitler that can only be understood as that prevalent Dutch hatred of the Germans. The Dutch seemingly don’t want to be ethnically related to the Germans, which they ARE. They prefer to side with the British. Maybe it’s the large number of Jews in their country, for several centuries already, that has influenced them in this direction?
Franklin confirmed his father was in the Jewish Resistance after Germany, out of necessity, occupied The Netherlands. He calls it the Dutch Resistance, but it was a Jewish organization just like the French Resistance that was propagandized as a spontaneous action of the indigenous people. These groups were financed and armed by Great Britain, in large part. Of course, GB was being financed by the U.S. It’s true the Dutch hated and resented the occupation. But it could also be that Franklin is part or fully Jewish — many Jews, as in Germany, think of themselves as White and want to be European. This could be the conundrum F.R. is in.
Speaking of eating humble-pie, whatever went before, Carolyn Yeager, your recent and current contributions have been scholarly, measured, relevant, generous… and full of light!
Your Eminence.
It would be a boon to this site, and a benefit to all if Mr Unz were prevailed upon to serialise your work.
Thank you,
Kali.
(I can’t wait to see what commenter septic-Al makes of this comment! – This goes way beyond “treacle”. lol)
Thanks Kali. I’m very glad you’re getting something out of my contributions. I think your dear “Uncle Arthur” had a lot to do with your changing viewpoint/receptivity. He is a man of pure good will. I credit the particular mix of commenters in this thread as the reason it’s ended so well and so positively.
I mentioned many months ago (a year or more?) that I am a student & follower of the Indian philosophy of Advaita Vedanta, as you appear to be. I don’t know if you prefer Advaita (Monism) or not, but any form is good and leads to the same goal. Maybe we’ll be able to share a little more about that one day. For sure, appreciation, likes and dislikes, are in the eye of the beholder more than in that which we’re beholding. A shift in viewpoint can change the whole picture, as with an optical illusion. I love to use the example of the optical illusion because, for me, it explains it all.
In the meantime, I wouldn’t expect Mr Unz to publish my work, and am not sure I would want it here. See, I’m still a very fussy person! We are not perfectible in the physical world and should not expect to be. What a relief. 🙂
Thanks for interesting dots to connect regarding the Dutch.
Did the Jews come to interact with the British via the Dutch East India company?
It’s been a while since I read Sven Beckert’s The Empire of Cotton, but I recall its main point was that the British dramatically shifted the cotton industry from its Eastern center to one dominated by England through the force of military power (Beckert calls it “war capitalism”). India (& Egypt) had been highly prosperous centers for cotton production and trade, but British militarism partnered with merchant chicanery changed all that, plunging those nations into poverty.
Dutch East India company emerged at about the same time; and while Beckert does not make a point of it, it is a fact that the Rothschilds, already heavily involved in Dutch East India company, gained a prominent place in the British cotton trade just as the British were coming to dominate that trade.
My comments on this issue originated when I responded to you by citing skepitcal’s claim that the protocols propounded at the Wannsee conference laid the foundation for implementing a program of killing all Jews “without exception.” That protocol certainly made it clear enough that the Germans ad indeed crafted and then implemented a plan that was deliberately aimed at exterminating without exception every Jew in Europe they could lay their hands on.
That thus, as he out it, was without a doubt the plan without exceptions.
But then, as I noted, a strange twist to this definite plan appeared in the form of “exceptions” that excluded certain Jews from being exterminated without exception as part of the protocol that proved the German intentions was to kill all Jews.
That’ of course, is the purpose of the protocol – it proved German intention to murder without exception all Jews.
But then a doubt intrudes. If the plan was to do them all in as the protocol appeared to prove, how come there are so many survivors. Indeed, the last comment I saw in the press was the Germans today are still be extorted to pay for maintaining more then 200,000 survivors of the holocaust when the youngest of them necessarily is 78 years old if born on the day Jewish survivors were liberated from the camps.
Thus some doubt begins to creep into the reverie that the Wannsee protocol proves the GErmans had in fact adopted and were implementing a plan they haD DRAWN UP to eliminate “WITHOUT EXCEPTION” all Jews.
So I do you your problem. The holocaust purveyors appeared to have found the magic proof the Germans really had this evil plan that they indeed implemented that establishes they indeed killed at least six million, but then there are all these pesky exception to the rule that they were to be done in “without exception.”
So how can there be exceptions to a plant that is to be implemented “without exceptions.
And what we really find after adding up all the “exceptions” like babies at exterminations camps, or sending 65 years olds and above to rest camps at Theresienstadt, and etc., etc., etc. IS THAT that all the exception completely swallow up the rule that the Germans had in fact adopted and were implementing a protocol calling for the extermination of Jews “without exception”, and the exceptions you bring up to account for ALL THE SURVIVORS Show it wasn’t implemented AND instead fully refute it EVER EXISTED.
I do not see why solving a problem completely could not include some exceptions to a general action. The exceptions are simply part of the plan.
As for too many Jews claiming to be “Holocaust survivors”, those are probably freeloaders who take the definition of that too broadly: any Jew who lived in Europe during WW2 is a “Holocaust survivor”.
Well, what do you know. I just began and right away I come up with this, which is quite good. I’ll copy it here (with my boldface added) for anyone who may want to comment on it:
I can agree with this, especially since it points out that the word was “avoided by the NSDAP” and was used by their opponents. Exactly what I said to Ron Unz, who insisted I was wrong! Based on one newspaper article series! In a minor newspaper at that.
I could say that, just like “Holocaust,” the word was made popular after the fact, not during, by the usual suspects.
Your articles about Jewish swindlers do not prove that gaschambers never existed. They only prove that Jewish swindlers exist, but we knew that already. Irene Zisblatt is also debunked in an article on holocaustcontroversies nota bene in a letter addressed to you, here: https://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.com/2010/02/response-to-c-yeager.html#more So you can’t claim that holocaustcontroversies defends all Jewish storytellers.
As for your claim that the Dutch resistance was “Jewish and Communist” I have checked this Wikipedia article ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_resistance ) and found that from the 53 main figures in the resistance 6 were Jews and 3 were Communists. That is indeed disproportional but no justification to call the whole resistance “Jewish and Communist”. Still you cannot appreciate Dutch nationalism. You think we should have hailed the invading Germans and readily have given up our independence to be annexed by Germany. Since that didn’t happen, there must be an “explanation” for that anomaly: it is the Jews and the Communists!
As for the “conundrum” of me being a WN but not a NS, NS was German supremacism, notoriously anti-Slavic, while the Slavs are not only the biggest part of the white race, but also inhabiting the biggest part of the world. If mass non-white immigration into the western world continues, the Slavs may very well be the only white people left.
How you can combine interest in Vedanta with admiration for Hitler is for me a conundrum.
Looks like the Etymology page was taken from this page at War history online, which in turn is probably from an earlier source which I may track down! However, please look at https://www.warhistoryonline.com/instant-articles/the-origin-of-the-term-nazi.html with the title: “Everyone knows the word “Nazi” but how did the term come into being?”
It carries the same information as the first item I posted, but with a little more. I will quote what I consider the best of it:
The book was first published in Germany in 1963 as Fazit: Kein Rechtfertigungsversuch or “Account Rendered: No attempt at justification.” https://www.amazon.com/Account-Rendered-Dossier-Former-Self-ebook/dp/B00CC2P2O8
Melita Maschmann had been successfully de-nazified.
Not when the plan per se calls for eliminating them “without exception” and when the protocol that prescribes the plan to be implemented without exception does not specifically provide and specify any exceptions.
The exception you allege are all made up post hoc to account for the fact that a plan without exception was neither conceived nor implemented, but made up from whole cloth by holocaust purveyors.
Merely the claim that there are still 200,000 “survivors” of the holocaust whom the Germans must succor refutes that claim that 6 million of the total population of Jews who came under German control perished when 78 years later so many are still around.
Actuarial tables prove it, which is why it’s illegal in Germany even to mention this fact.
I offered my articles as a refutation of your statement that
I said there was “no proof of anyone being gassed on arrival,” that that was only tales of fake survivors, and I offered a lot of evidence of fake survivor tales. You then changed it into whether gas chambers existed, which you should know is shifty, lying Jewish avoidance tactics on your part.
You still haven’t shown any evidence that Jews were sent to a gas chamber and killed ON ARRIVAL at Auschwitz, or anywhere else. Neither you nor anyone can prove a single homicidal gas chamber existed, but you still claim people were killed in them. See? Then you try to lie yourself out of your irrational claims.
From the Wikipedia page you link to, there is no way you know the proportion of Jews or Communists in the Resistance Groups, of which there were many different types. That info is not given. Please quote directly from the page and give the section heading, that gives that information.
Finally, NS was not “notoriously anti-Slavic” but the Slavs were notoriously anti-German. That’s where the problems between the countries stemmed from. There was a Pan-Slavic movement, you know. Your concern for Slavs seems to be only a cover for more ‘wrongdoing’ that you can blame on Germans. I’m sure your lack of knowledge about Vedanta is equal to your lack of knowledge about Hitler and his National Socialism. Vedanta is not moralism, and you are only about moralism.
Actually, a couple of years ago you did ask me republish one of your old articles and it accumulated 1,450 comments:
https://www.unz.com/article/the-search-for-wwii-mass-graves/
However, you’re an extremely quarrelsome person and exceptionally stubborn, since you still refuse to admit you were wrong. You cite an “Instant Article” from some random website to support your position and treat it as authoritative, which is totally ridiculous:
You have fully admitted that the leading local Nazi paper in the German capital city of Berlin, published by Propaganda Minister Joseph Goebbels and having a circulation of something like 100,000, ran a big 12-part series in 1934 having the title “A Nazi Goes to Palestine.”
Since the statement you cite by that random writer claimed that anyone using the term “Nazi” in Nazi Germany “might face serious consequences” I suppose that means Goebbels had himself arrested.
Your problem is that by fighting so ferociously on issues where you’ve long since been proven wrong, you severely damage your own credibility on everything else.
You’re also sometimes rather unrealistic in your views. For example, upthread you argued that since the term “Nazi” had been so heavily demonized by the Western media, it’s important to use a different name to describe the political regime of the Third Reich. Okay. But your suggestion is instead to call it “Hitlerism.” While “Hitlerism” would certainly be descriptive and accurate, I doubt that the connotations to modern-day Westerners would be all that much more favorable.
Dear Carolyn,
Certainly this place is a mixed bag, including the commentariat. But the UR archive is such a vast and useful resource. And, of course, if your work (or parts of it) were uploaded here, you could arrange to have moderation privileges for the comments, or turn commenting off. – Maybe somethings to concider.
Uncle Arthur (adopted) was upset with me for my less than kind comments toward you. He was right. Much as I tried to convince myself otherwise, I was letting my own ego dictate my indignant and immoderate words. Silly me!
I think the only philosophy I really try to follow is Lao Tzu’s Daoism, though I incorporate a lot of eastern teachings into my every-day practices, particularly Yoga/living in awareness. (I did say “practice”! 😉) I asked hubby, my own personal encyclopedia, what is Advaita Vedanta. Based on his description I can see why you imagined I was a follower of that philosophy. – But now I have even more reading to do! lol
I’m glad we’re friends.
With love,
Kali.
#1 I already acknowledged that Jewish swindlers exist. Their tales do neither confirm nor deny the existence of gaschambers.
#2 The evidence of mass killings of Jews (by whatever means) is the fact that those deemed “unfit for labor” were never seen again, nor can any revisionist explain where they went if their lives were spared. German reports of deportations by train mention the Reinhard camps as their final destination and not as “transit” to mythical “camps in the East”.
#3 The section heading is Main Figures in the Dutch Resistance. You can find it if you scroll deep down in the article: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_resistance
“Jewish” or “Communist” is written behind the names. I counted “Jewish Communist”as Jewish. Belinfante is a well known Sephardic name. The other names are typically Dutch.
#4 Gosh those evil Slaves were “notoriously anti-German”! So why trying to settle in their countries then? O right they would “disappear “eventually according to plan. I just finished reading an on-line book about this matter: Secret Nazi Plans for Eastern Europe which explains such attitude of the Slavs:https://diasporiana.org.ua/wp-content/uploads/books/22007/file.pdf
#5 Vedanta is not moralism, but all Indian spiritual schools assume morality as a first step on the spiritual path. First requirement in the Yoga of Patanjali for example is ahimsa, non-violence.
Dear Ron,
I knew I’d read a very good essay about the search for mass graves somewhere! Unsurprisingly, it was here. And how good it is to know it was written by Carolyn Yeager!
You’re both stubborn. And all this arguing back and forth isn’t really helping (except in furthering Carolyn’s research into the matter).
The fact is that, today the word “Nazi” is used almost universally as an epithet and a slur, as yourself and Carolyn seem to agree.
So, given the “unfavorable [and unfair] connotations” of the word Nazi, surely it would be more helpful for readers, many of whom are here to learn, if contemporary writers and publishers substituted the fairer and more accurate/meaningful term “National Socialism”, in the spirit of honesty and truth in reporting? – I agree with you regarding the term “Hitlerism”.
Kind regards,
Kali.
My, what a big hearted response. You have earned my highest esteem and compliments.
With love,
LRD
The problem here is that if, as thousands of Rabbi’s and Jonathan Greenblatt insist, 6 million Jews were Holocausted out of a native population of about 5 million, then there can only be -1,000,000 Jews after the end of the war.
So if you told a whopper about 6 million and you are are 1 million Jews in the hole, in general you don’t go around fabricating classes and groups of survivors that would increase your deficit. But Jews with all their Chutzpah simply cannot resist the chance to dance on the Goyim graves by continually inflating the number of survivors while simultaneously ignoring the growing more than 1 million dead Jew deficit.
Take this as an example:
‘An Eye for an Eye’: The Jews Who Sought to Poison Six Million Germans to Avenge the Holocaust
So on top of thousands of pregnant and young mother Yenta’s released from the “death camps”, we have Jewish terrorist groups rampaging around Germany and Europe looking for ways to ritually slaughter at least 6 million more Germans than had already died at Rhine Meadows Camps or in Dresden or Pforzheim or on the evacuations of East Prussia, Sudetenland and Silesia.
At this same point in time Patton was writing home to his wife about having to throw “good Germans” out of their house so that Jewish DP’s could move in.
Instead of us playing whack-a-mole with 6 million mission dead Jew corpses, why don’t the Jewish braniacs like Skeptikal come out and list the exact number of Jews who died in which location at the precise point in time with a link to supporting documentation. This certainly must be in an excel .xls or .pdf somewhere.
Here is the official International Red Cross Report that states less that 300,000 total deaths of ALL races of “death camp” internees, Christians, Homo’s, Communists and Jews. Why cannot the Holocaustians come up with a break down like this Red Cross Report?
With out an unbiased [by Jews] official break down with drill down analysis, we must simply go back to the last audit, which would put the total number of Jews dead at about 150,000, the same number as for all other groups of criminals and malcontents added combined. This would leave plenty of living Jews to explain for the communist take overs of Eastern Europe, all the fat Yenta death camp survivors, the DP’s, the Maquis, the “Polish” partisans, and of course the ‘An Eye for an Eye’ group, and finally, the millions of Jewish emigrants desperate to get away from deliberately blighted eastern Europe to Palestine or the US.
I’m going to take one numbered item at a time bc otherwise you skip or don’t fully answer my objections. It’s usually not productive to put too many issues in one comment. So I’m beginning with #3: I looked at that section fairly closely the first time around, and most names don’t include race or religious identities. You are assuming that the compiler of the list even knew the racial/religious/political identity of all the listed persons. Most important … THERE IS NO SOURCE FOR THE LIST. None. The only reason Wikipedia can be useful is bc sources, also called references, are given for most factual statements. But nothing at all for this list. Where does it come from? Lack of a source really makes it null and void.
Plus, under the heading “Resistance Organization” the first sentence is: “As early as 15 May 1940, the day after the Dutch capitulation, the Communist Party of the Netherlands (CPN) held a meeting to organize their underground existence and resistance against the German occupiers.” It goes on to stress that there were numerous resistance organizations, the most radical being CS 6, which specialized in assassinations. The NSF specialized in financial support. These groups were operated by professionals, not average citizens.
Therefore, your statement that:
is false, or if you prefer it, not said in good faith. It was worded so as to cover up the truth, or to give a false impression. You did not find out such information from this page. You have stretched credulity a long way, apparently on the chance that it won’t be critically checked out.
So afaic we’re back to step one concerning just how Jewish or Communist the “Dutch” Resistance was. Since the various resistance groups ran the gamut from “helping & hiding Jews” to far more violent actions, it turns out that there was not such a thing as “The Dutch Resistance” but a scattered array of anti-occupation efforts. I imagine the majority of Jews & Communists were in the more radical groups.
I’m not saying there was not a serious dislike/resistance to the German occupation, only how ‘grass-roots’ any organized activity was beyond the milder activities like helping & hiding Jews.
I’m aware how important Textile manufacturing and trade were to Britain in the 18th and 19th centuries, and what a big deal it was worldwide, but I’ve never had reason to look into the Dutch East India company. I can believe that the Jews had a part in it.
When the Jews were banished from England in the 15th century, most moved to The Netherlands, especially Amsterdam, so what good did it do, beyond relieving England for awhile. It was the same with Germany moving Jews elsewhere. Without having the will to take away what makes them the pestilence they are–their religion & it’s fake story-line/history–they just continue on somewhere else, and eventually even return from where they were banished, even stronger.
Instead of just indulging in ad hominems, there needs to be a real discussion of the realities. The perception of “Morality,” as F. Ryckaert always insists on, is what prevents that from happening. I think that’s where we need to go; what do you think?
Just a week ago, Philip Giraldi posted an article “It’s Past Time to be Honest About Israel”. But was he honest about it? Not entirely. Too bad it wasn’t titled “It’s Past Time to be Honest About the Jews.” Would Ron Unz accept such a title? I think he probably would.
Well, thanks again for this reply. It surpasses what I thought I could expect to receive from you, and it gives me a lot that I can “set straight.”
Yes, of course I have not forgotten that you published an article that I submitted to you, and it was very popular. I appreciate that you linked to it.
As to my 2 posts on the use of the word “Nazi,” they are just the beginning–as I said–of my investigation, and I didn’t expect to find anything that good right away. YOU, otoh, have nothing to back up your position but the one serialized article titled “A N. G. to P.” which I’ve already commented on extensively. It was not written or sponsored by Goebbels, as you want us to believe, and you’ve not provided evidence of that, only supposition.
Do you deny what the article said about “Herman Goering also avoided including the term in any of his speeches. The same could be said of over 550 members of the NSDAP who were interviewed by Professor Theodore Abel of Columbia University in 1933.” If so, where are your examples of such use?
The article was not written by Joseph Goebbels, was it? So who is being stubborn by acting as though it was! At that time, he had ceased even writing for Der Angriff, since he was now Propaganda Minister for all Germany. If you want to say otherwise, please do, but don’t keep inferring things that aren’t true.
In addition, you keep repeating that Der Angriff was “the leading local Nazi paper in the German capital city of Berlin” when that really means nothing in the actual big picture. It was I who informed you way back in comment#760 that the circulation was 110,000 at it’s height–a drop in the bucket in a city of 4 million. In those days, most people bought & read newspapers.
Your habit of repeating untruths reminds me of Joe Biden continuing to say he had no knowledge of any of son Hunter’s foreign business dealings, only to change the wording to “he was never in business with son Hunter.” You’ve been doing the same thing with this “Joseph Goebbels used the word Nazi freely” theme you started
You miss the point altogether. It’s not only more favorable but, most important, more accurate. That has always been included in my argument. You yourself admit that “Hitlerism” would be accurate. If this has no appeal, it’s bc the majority don’t care about accuracy, they like the ‘tough-guy” sound of Nazi, or the sensationalized sound of it, the ‘cool’ look of the word, the “Z” in it — all that superficial stuff that is NOT accurate history. Remember, revisionism exists to bring history into accord with the truth (or something like that). Not into accord with Joe Biden types.
So I’ll continue with my search into the origins of Nazi, and I expect it will be productive. In the meantime, I invite you and anyone else to produce the evidence you need to support your original idea that the National Socialists were just fine with the word Nazi and how it described themselves and their organization. So far, there’s been nothing on that front.
Darn, I added that sentence “I looked up Abel and his book …. ” and stuck in in the wrong place at the very last minute. Should never do that. I have to write this additional comment anyway. But that sentence is not from Ron Unz – my apologies.
I’m hoping to get the book, but it will take a week just for delivery, if I’m able to.
https://www.betterworldbooks.com/product/detail/why-hitler-came-into-power-9780674952003?shipto=US&curcode=USD
Caroline-
I have a copy of Abel’s book — on my desk right now.
Is there something I could research for you?
Thank you for your offer. I did just order it so I should have my own copy within a week. And there is some of it available online, but the software for reading it is not very cooperative.
I would like you to say what you think of it. How useful is it? How truthful? I know Abel was an American professor who was essentially snooping around Germany hoping to learn something. The Germans cooperated in the hope of reaching the foreign public in a positive way. What can you tell us?
BTW, I also had the Amazon link to the Abel book, but it kept disappearing and reappearing. It’s not there now. From the large white space, it’s obvious something went wrong when that comment was submitted.
It would make a refreshing change to discuss the realities, the facts and the fictions, without descending into ad hominems, emotionality and moralising, and without calls for and actual “holocaust”!
I’m just not sure that that’s even possible on this forum… Unless…
Unless the discussion was actually, and fairly moderated. – Maybe if we could agree on a moderation strategy and a small contingent of level-headed, fair-minded moderators, then we’d be able to move the conversation forward. – Seems like a tall order to me though.
With love,
Kali.
Their countries? The Poles and Czechs long ago settled in German territory, and after WWI were granted German territory filled with German citizens who had to accept suddenly being ruled by non-Germans who were hostile. The Polish and Czech plan being carried out on these ethnic Germans was to disenfranchise them from their land, farms and industries, eventually their homes, and hand it all over to Poles & Czechs. WWII was begun over this very issue (although it was only a ruse). For the Germans, they were simply taking back what had been taken from them. More of the undoing of the Versailles Treaty. If Poland had shown reasonableness regarding Danzig and the Corridor, Germany would never have invaded. But the Polish ruling class WANTED the Germans to attack at that time. Don’t forget that.
Are you ignorant of history, or just dishonest about it?
Getting back what Versailles had taken from Germany was only a ruse of Hitler. He wanted far more: all of eastern Europe up to the Urals (with a 200 km “security zone” beyond it). By refusing education and medical care to the local Slavic people, he hoped their number would decrease to less than the Germans who would settle the land. The Slavic minority would then act as slaves for the German Herrenvolk. That was his main “ideal” (besides of course making Europe Judenrein).
As I said before, one must have a special mentality to admire this German Genghis Khan.
Yes, and this was IN Germany proper, already shrunk and crowded with the millions of Germans returning from the East where they had been forcefully expelled. Housing all these people was a nightmare.
Into this scene of Germans trying to help Germans (who no one else would), we see all these DPs who were almost entirely Eastern European Jews being given space in the homes of Germans who had survived the war. Some Germans were entirely removed from their homes. It is egregious. No other people had this done to them. I read all about it in Alfred de Zayas books: A Terrible Revenge and Nemesis at Potsdam.
Sounds to me like you’re just spouting rubbish. Spiteful rubbish at that.
In other words, I remain unconvinced by your contributions.
Best regards,
Kali.
Your abysmal ignorance about things you continually rely on is astounding. Joachim Neander was a guest visitor at HC.blogspot.com, not one of the 5 Jewish regulars there. They are never as polite as he is and was. Still, Neander is a holohoax promoter. Your touting him as an example of how the HolocaustControversies crowd behaves and writes is just another false claim from you.
Neander was still way too soft on Zisblatt; made every kind of excuse for her, to the point of being WRONG. He was really engaged in damage control. If one wants the facts about that sick little 5 ft. tall liar, read my long article under “Holo Frauds & Quacks.”
Ron Unz, Jul 17, 2023: 9700 words. ‘There was something hinky about the way USA was conned into WWII, and the pattern is repeated in the way Russia was conned into war with Ukraine.’ [paraphrase]
Ron Unz, Coffee and a Mike, (Conversation with Mike Farris) +- Aug 1, 2023
~41 min. Farris refers to Unz’s Jul 17, 2023 article:
35 words:
Unz says:
https://rumble.com/v3409yo-coffee-and-a-mike-episode-651-with-ron-unz-rfk-jr.-vs.-i.f.-stone-on-the-ke.html
Chalk Unz’s 35 words on the sidewalk.
Make a bumper sticker for your car.
Make a flier and leave a dozen in your church on Sunday.
Neander said: “…I think I made it clear enough in my analysis that Mrs. Zisblatt’s book is not only fiction as such, but what is more, that it is bad fiction and should be withdrawn from circulation…”
For me that is clear enough, but obviously not for you. You want Neander to deny the Holocaust altogether and join your Hitler-did-nothing-wrong-sect. For people like you the world must seem a very cruel place.
As I’ve pointed out several times before, I’m very skeptical of those claims:
https://www.unz.com/runz/more-falsehoods-of-world-war-ii/?showcomments#comment-6027945
I like this blurb from your “Secret Nazi Plans” book:
So there was obviously a considerable Volksdeutsche population all over Crimea, as there was along the Volga and Danube.
Based on the persecution of Germans by Stalin and the Judeo-Bolschevics, today we would have to say that under the UN doctrine of R2P, Barbarossa was even more necessary than the invasions of Syria in 2012 and Libya in 2011.(Genocide)
That’s funny because during the war the German Government would send whole teams of highly trained doctors to help the population in Russian villages. A typical modern Western “win hearts and minds” operation when you think about it.
Unfortunately the effort would soon prove to be in vain. As one story goes, a team went missing, so they sent in some soldiers to ascertain what had happened. When the doctors arrived they found the village abandoned, followed by machine gun fire from the woods, wiping them out to a man.
Who did the shooting? The women of the village.
That’s the kind of war the Germans had to fight in the East. And it’s a war they lost. Because in reality, Germans are not the crude beasts some people would like to imagine that they are.
This fascinating document goes into some detail about the secret treaty between England and Stalin in October 1939.
The Secret Dossier of Finnish Marshal C.G.E. Mannerheim: On the Diplomatic Prelude of World War II
This finally clarifies why the west never objected to Stalin swallowing up all of Eastern Europe from 1939-41. The document also perfectly explains the entire Winter War with Finland and why Stalin suddenly accepted a peace offer from Finland after the Finnish lines had collapsed. The document clarifies how Stalin had granted England and France the right to invade Norway and Denmark, and then how Hitler was forced to invade Norway and Denmark when he found out about the secret treaty.
Most importantly, this also proves why Hitler was forced to invade the USSR: he knew about this secret treaty and he knew the USSR was going to invade Germany before Hitler could come to terms with England.
The author Toomas VARRAK (Estonian) concludes with:
England had secret treaties with the USSR, yet simultaneously was supposedly plotting Operation Pike with France to bomb Baku oilfields up until May 1940, when England tried to grab Norway and Denmark in agreement with Stalin. It just doesn’t add up.
As usual, you carefully pick a sentence or two out of an entire article, and then say it represents the whole. This is purposeful, in order to deceive. The sentence you chose re Zisblatt is a very weak criticism. I already said that Neander was engaged in damage control. The Zisblatt book is an embarrassment to the Holocausters, especially bc she & her story is also featured in Stephen Spielberg’s “award winning” documentary film, “The Last Days.”
Being an embarrassment, they’d like to get rid of her; make her book go away. Thus Neander recommended it be “withdrawn from circulation.” “Don’t read it,” he recommends. “WE” don’t support her.” She came to the attention of our (denialist) circles bc Eric Hunt put the spotlight on her. I picked it up and brought out even more of her lies & contradictions, quite detailed. My critique was published by the Inconvenient History Blog, which was popular at the time. It was thought damaging enough for Joachim Neander, who was associated with the Auschwitz-Birkenau Memorial former camp in Poland, to write what he did in response. That’s what Franklin is referring to. Neander’s entire “response” has to be read, plus my answer to it (which is on my site under “Holo Frauds & Quacks”, in order to understand what Neander is all about. Franklin wants you to accept his spin on it.
So Franklin concludes that Hitler and myself have a cruel view of the world. That’s spin too, nothing more. He offers nothing to back it up. His only goal is to support the Hoax in whatever way possible, truth be damned (which is the goal of Holocaust Controversies website). He finds common ground with them.
#837 Carolyn Yeager
“If Poland had shown reasonableness regarding Danzig and the Corridor, Germany would never have invaded.”
So, when Hitler seized area with German minorities in Czechs (Sudetenland) and Poland (western part of Poland and Pomeranian Corridor) then the rest of Czechs and Poland area remainded free? Germans had never conquered Prague and Warsaw and the September War 1939 is a fabrication of polish propaganda, right?
Your lies are so primitive that schoolboy from elementary school will not believe in it.
You are really dishonest person Miss @Carolyn Yeager.
That “village” was most likely a shtetl.
I’m impressed with your willingness to state your ideals, Kali, and to be practical about them at the same time. It may be something women can do better than men.
My thoughts this morning came down to this: The “holocaust” or “genocide of the Jews” is a fiction. Why are we continuing to argue about it when there is no finality in it–no end to it. Some basic truths, ie. realities, must be agreed upon eventually. It’s not that hard. The measure for this, the standard or rule, must be what is rational, and the irrational rejected. Thus, the early revisionist books were commonly titled with the subheading
Fact or Fiction
Myth or Reality
These researchers/enquirers sifted the known facts to separate ‘fact’ from ‘fiction.’ They were very responsible in their approach & conclusions. They believed reason would prevail. However, a Holocaust Lobby formed to resist reason and reality, and it had the support of governments (our governments!!!) and elite institutions. WHY this support exists is part of what needs to be examined and agreed upon. This could actually happen EXCEPT FOR the power centers that oppose it. They provide the disrupters. They’re all over this site, and everywhere these discussion go on, many paid to be here. Do we call them out?
In any case, our attention must remain focused on the main goal: separating fact from fiction, myth from reality. One way to assure that is to require proof/evidence in every posted comment, not simply opinion or self-standing quotes from this or that text w/o the posters’ commentary that sincerely & fully explains its purpose. Yes, a very tall order, not possible on a free-speech forum like this, but it is what “truth” requires.
#846 Alexandros
“Who did the shooting? The women of the village. ”
You are absolutely right. Each Slavic bride brings a dowry consisting of machine gun and a few hand grenades.
Slavic girls are like Amazons. Even today, area around Warsaw is called Mazovia* which comes from “Amazovia” – land of Amazons.
Ok, now seriously.
Who told you that BS ? I want to know that guy, he must be a very good science-fiction writer.
“(…)Germans are not the crude beasts some people would like to imagine that they are. “
Yes, they were and still are beasts because of German “culture”.
German culture is like Jewish culture – invasion and extermination of host inhabitants is a deeply rooted in their national character.
—-
* I’m not joking, Mazovia really exists 🙂
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mazovia
The Judeo-Bolshevic and their Jewish Kommissars were quite proud of all the female snipers in the red rapist army. In fact, the way the Jews were able to completely mind control the Soviet Russian women was their greatest accomplishment.
It is one major difference between the USSR and Germany during the war. The Soviets didn’t care how many million goy women died fighting for Judeo-Communism or how many families were destroyed. The NSDAP were interested in strong families and protected the women.
As I said above, likely the village was a shtetl and likely the women were Shiksas.
Dear Carolyn,
I read your piece on “the Zisblatt woman/dwarf” (🙃) and appreciate your comments here regarding “damage control”, and the Holocaustian need to keep her out of the view of histographers.
I’ve kept your “holoquacks” series open for future ‘light” reading .
Continued thanks,
Kali.
Psychiatrists have a description for the affliction that befell you: Projection and Transference.
Suspect it is too late for you to seek help.
Yes indeed!
“Our” governments and state institutions support the lie. Uncovering WHY that is is crucial. – I don’t doubt that sexual and other blackmail will be part of that answer. But the ideology which drives the blackmailers must inevitably be darker and deeper.
And here we have the beginning (and possibly the middle and end) of a workable moderation strategy. Just needs a little twerking and broadening.
But maybe the format of a comment thread discussion is the wrong way to go… It might be more helpful if it were some kind of textual (via email exchange, for eg) panel discussion between yourself and other experts, and champions if the Holocaustian faith, or advocates for it, which would be uploaded as an article, with a (somewhat) less strictly moderated discussion thread bellow. (Or none at all .?)
So, the heavy-weights slog it out, for the benefit of all Mankind, out in the open, using rationality, reason and evidence to make their cases.
Or am I going too far?!
I’m not sure it’s even necessary. Though sometimes it can be entertaining.
With love,
Kali.
Well, I now have read your articles on the Zisblatt case on your own website and I must say you did a good job exposing the inconsistencies and absurdities of that lady’s story. She is a typical pathological liar of whom there are so many among the Jews.
But when all has been said and done about such Jewish swindlers, does that really deny the Holocaust? With “Holocaust” I mean the combined efforts by the Nazi regime to exterminate the Jews by: 1) hunger in ghettos, 2) killing by Einsatzgruppen culminating in Babi Yar, 3) killing in gasvans, 4) death by undernourishment and overwork in concentration camps, 5) gassing in Auschwitz and in the Reinhard camps.
You mentioned Eric Hunt in this respect. You are aware of the fact that he has revoked his Holocaust revisionism, and for exactly the same reason as I do? Here are his words:
Source: https://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.com/2017/02/eric-hunt-is-no-longer-holocaust-denier.html#more
Neither you nor CODOH nor any other revisionist can answer that question, and I believe if they are honest they will go the same way as Eric Hunt.
Thus as you claim the lack of an answer to the following key question is what changed your view of the holocaust:
Well, I guess you don’t realize that after the war, there were walls all over Germany (and I am sure every other country touched by the war) with posters asking “have you seen – and listing the name of the missing person.”
And the answer, in most cases was also “I don’t know,” because there were no travel agencies making up itineraries for where people scattered to the four winds ended up. Thus the fact that families who were separated during their displacement failed ort were unable to reconnect is not proof that they were murdered. Just think about it – if an extended family of twelve people were separated when the Germans displaced entire communities and they never reconnected, because none of them knew what happened to the other, each would claim the other 11 were murdered by the Nazis when they all might well be alive while none could say what happened to the others.
It is this phenomenon that results in relatives or friends accidentally reconnecting years later when each thought the other had been killed in the holocaust that merely resulted in two resurrections.
So your failure to get a satisfactory answer to that question merely proves you are cluel3ess about where to look for answers because the one certainty is their is no evidence that any were gassed anywhere.
#855 HdC
“Psychiatrists have a description for the affliction that befell you: Projection and Transference.”
Thank you for the diagnosis, my dear friend.
I will pay you $100 for the diagnosis as soon as Germans start to pay $1.3 trillion reparation for Poland for crimes they made during WWII.
“ABRIDGED VERSION THE REPORT ON THE LOSSES SUSTAINED BY POLAND AS A RESULT OF GERMAN AGGRESSION AND OCCUPATION DURING THE SECOND WORLD WAR, 1939-1945”
https://instytutstratwojennych.pl/en/abridged-war-report
Have a nice reading.
Thank you, dear Kali.
I’ve just looked up this page after a couple days absence.
Glad to see both you esteemed Ladies are friends.
With kindest wishes and respect to both you and Carolyn.
#853 Brosi
” The NSDAP were interested in strong families and protected the women.”
NSDAP was interested in strong German families. Germans had no scruples to exterminate whole families of other nationalities.
Germans treated German women like cows or like incubators (Lebensborn)*.
Germans didn’t hesitate to steal 50-200,000 children from Poland (and 40-50,000 children from Belarussia and Ukraine, 1000 children from Czech, 300 children from Norway)** and put them into German families.
If that means for you strong family support…
—-
* “Lebensborn was established by Heinrich Himmler, and provided welfare to its mostly unmarried mothers, encouraged anonymous births by unmarried women at their maternity homes, and mediated adoption of children by likewise “racially pure” and “healthy” parents, particularly SS members and their families.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lebensborn
** “Robbed childrens. “I was fit for germanization” “(“Zrabowane dzieci. “Nadawałem się do zniemczenia”)
https://www.dw.com/pl/zrabowane-dzieci-mia%C5%82em-niebieskie-oczy-nadawa%C5%82em-si%C4%99-do-zniemczenia/a-40387693
Well, let’s begin with returning all the stolen territory that the Poles were “given” to them after WWI and WWII. Yes I heard the tale that the territory was really stolen by the Soviets, and then handed to Poland.
That would make Poland a receiver of stolen goods, which must be returned.
Then I want to see Polish compensation for all the personal property stolen or destroyed that was owned by German expatriates, and compensation to the families of the murdered Germans. You know, the way Jews are getting reparations from Germany.
You do all that, and then maybe we can talk of reparations to Poland.
Mind you, I would subtract all the German billions of Euros that Poland receives via payments from the EU. What’s that you say, it’s not German but EU money?
There is some rumbling about Germany withdrawing from the EU. The who would pour money into Poland? France? Italy? don’t make me laugh.
I recall from my childhood a song, Dondi, Little Dondi, about an Italian orphan.
Cute song. Dondi the Orphan was so adorable: “All the world’s sunny joys packed in one little boy . . ”
You see, Dondi was not Jewish. And only Jewish children suffer. Little Italian orphans are “packed with sunny joy.”
Thousands of Italian children were orphaned in/by the world war. Not a few of them — like children from my Mother’s village who lost their parents, their grandmas and grandpas, their aunties and uncles, and their homes and their farms –became orphans when their village in Italy was bombed by U S Air Force.
What happened to all those children, I wondered?
I googled, Italian orphans.
The only substantive return was a link to a home for Jewish children.
Because no other child who was victimized by a war that was provoked by FDR of USA and Churchill of UK, with enormously influential zionists sitting at their right hands, matters; only Jews.
Of course the NSDAP government concerned itself with the well being of German women and families.
The Poles were fortunate that the Germans took on all those orphaned children in Poland, unlike those “humane” Danes that let 10,000 German children starve to death after the war.
The well being of Polish women and families was/is the job of the Polish government and not any other government.
Thank you, Carolyn, for elucidating the full picture ref Irene “Diamonds” Zisblatt.
People need to be aware of the deceitful trick that you so ably expose of posters like Franklin Ryckaert, whom I’m beginning to see as no more than a troll.
The object of this excellent website is Truth. And it is coming out, despite the John Johnsons, Franklin Ryckaerts, Patrick McNallys etc.
Excuse my taking the liberty of providing a link to your article on Neander. It provides, as does Ryckaert, yet more evidence of the weasel nature of the promotors of a gross lie.
https://carolynyeager.net/holocaust-scholar-finds-%E2%80%9Cdiamond-girl%E2%80%9D-be-work-fiction
You mention Inconvenient History.
Well worth your attention, dear Reader.
Ref Hygiene Station at Auschwitz.
Inscription in the undressing room of a hygiene barrack in Auschwitz-Birkenau: “One louse, your death.” An exhortation to the prisoners to cleanliness. Typhus, the main cause of death in Auschwitz, is transmitted by the louse.
https://inconvenienthistory.com/
No, of course not. No one says so. What it denies are the things that person claims they experienced at the hands of Germans, but didn’t. These lies are not innocent. They corrupt children and slander and libel an entire nation that has produced many geniuses and is responsible for some of mankind’s greatest achievements. They’ve resulted in the distortion and corruption of the justice system of all European peoples, taking away our freedoms of speech and association. They’ve turned European against European. It’s monstrous.
You, as a promoter and supporter of this Big Lie, share responsibility for all that. Your ‘explanation’ that certain documents show a certain number of people transported to several named locations known as the Reinhardt camps (with a ‘t’), and now cannot be accounted for, is PROOF that those people were killed at those named locations, and their bodies burned, is not the only explanation possible. For one thing, there is no physical evidence that that number of people were ever there, and no evidence of mass burnings leaving remains and traces. So maybe the documents were wrong, or tampered with; or maybe after the people got to those locations, they then went somewhere else. Because actual people, human bodies, always leave behind remains, they don’t just disappear into the air.
So this is not the slam-dunk you want to make it into. And many answers have been given to your question; they are just not accepted by those who are invested in the gross lies of the Jewish swindlers. This “mystery” will eventually be resolved. Revisionist work is hampered by the legal restrictions in place and by harassment from the authorities. They’ve clamped down hard, which discourages progress. Many of our best have been silenced. But the tide always turns.
Pathological liars always get nasty when they are caught in a lie. Always. You can see it here in this comments section by the behavour of commenters like Ryckaert and fufu.
Liars have two main vulnerabilities:
1. They assume everyone lies the same way they do
2. They simply cannot understand why people who stick to the truth no longer trust or believe people who repeatedly get caught telling lies.
In the case of “Auschwitz-Birkenau, Treblinka, Belzec, Sobibor, Chelmno” we have to consider what happened to the initial claims that there were gas chambers at Dachau, Buchenwald, etc in the west. These claims were debunked and the Jewish lies exposed.
So now Holofraudians demand that revisionists account for 6 million gassed and missing Jews from a native population of 5 million across the areas occupied by Germany, even after they have been caught repeatedly lying about what happened at the labor camps, as is even admitted by Ryckaert above.
So publish a similar official document refuting the existence of gaschambers in Auschwiz-Birkenau, Treblinka, Belzec, and Sobibor and be done with those “pathological liars” for good.
And when you are at it, publish also an official document describing where those elusive “camps in the East” were, whereto some 1,400,000 Jews (not 6 million) were deported after having gone through the above mentioned camps, that allegedly were only “transit camps” after all. You would render revisionism a great service in doing that, because up to now none of the revisionists has succeeded in that.
Success!
First, you need to prove that 1,400,000 physical human beings (not just numbers on a piece of paper) were sent to those “transit camps” in the first place. There is plenty of reason to doubt that.
The revision of the so-called Aktion Reinhardt camps is not a finished product. For one thing, information on this period (currently based almost entirely on hearsay) is still hard to come by. The reason may be bc what we’re supposed to be looking for doesn’t exist, never happened in the first place.
It’s also hampered by the secretiveness and disinformation of what was the Soviet Union at the time, the incompleteness & fakery of the documents that have so far been released, and the structure of the present Russian govt as 100% anti-“Nazi” and pro-“Holocaust.”
On top of that, the anti-nazi, pro-holocaust fixed perspective pervades every govt in Europe and Western Asia, and is trumpeted by it’s media. It’s clear that Revisionist-minded researchers are at a great disadvantage, even constantly threatened with imprisonment. Right now, Germar Rudolf is in hiding or on the run, completely out of the picture!! Does anyone write about that? Will Ryckaert talk about that?
P.S. Documents refuting the existence of gaschambers in Auschwiz-Birkenau, Treblinka, Belzec, and Sobibor have already been published–many times, in the way of books & research papers. What do you mean by “official?” Governmental, or legal documents stamped by a government? Get real. How would that be possible?
Ah. Franklip rejoices in having unearthed the key fact to be demanded to prove the holocaust happening by demanding those questioning it produce evidence there were no gas chambers at various camps.
That’s obviously an impossible task because anyone seeking the truth about the holocaust knows there indeed were gas chambers at the camps, but their sole purpose was to kill lice and other death dealing pests who would otherwise have have posed a deadly threat to the inmates. Thus these gas chambers that were admittedly present were a life saving measure that is very odd that those bent on killing without exceptions all Jews as the SS protocols cited as proof of it all would have it was the whole plan.
But then he thunders you’re all still wrong because you can’;t give me tangil;e evidence that there were indeed tangible gas chambers at any of the camps.
You gat me there, Franklip. I admit I can’t present to you tangible gas chambers (I mean real one) to prove none were at the camps because I would then first have to produce one and whisk it away to prove that they were never there.
Oh, but wait. There is a better method. It’s called the dog that didn’t bark. It’s the old story of the dog not barking when it should have that proves something ewas amiss about the situation or the dog would have barked, and the absence of the barking proves it.
It’s the clue Arthur Conan Doyle included in his story “Silver Blade” that proved the mastrer was the killer because the dog would have barked had the killer been the stranger that the master claimed it to be that then fingered him as the perpetrator.
But Doyle actually stole this from Homer’s Odyssey, I believe.
So now let’s turn this around and put the demand for evidence on a real factual basis. And that is, it is the holocaust purveyors claiming the real existence of gas chambers who need to present tangible evidence that any were in fact present at the camps and that they were constructed to accomplish the gassing of the numbers required to prove the actual occurrence of the holocaust as the purveyors claim it occurred.
So Franklip, where is the tangible, material evidence of the presence of such gas chambers in the camps where you allege they were?
See, Franklip, I neither affirm nor deny the presence of those gas chambers. I only put the advocate to his proofs of real, tangible, material evidence that establishes beyond a reasonable doubt they were there.
First you break down the 6 million dead Jews who died between June 1941- May 1945 by cause of death, location, date, citizenship and a URL/link to proof.
LMAO.
“…First, you need to prove that 1,400,000 physical human beings (not just numbers on a piece of paper) were sent to those “transit camps” in the first place. There is plenty of reason to doubt that…”
So first you say that the Reinhard camps were only “transit camps” to “camps in the East¨, but when I ask for evidence of the existence of those mythical camps in the East, you suddenly say it is not certain that Jews were sent through those Reinhard camps at all. So which is it: transit camps or not transit camps? And if not, what were those camps for or did they not exist at all?
Besides, I acknowledge that asking for a negative proof (“gaschambers did not exist”) is illogical, but “there existed camps in the East” is a positive statement and for that evidence can be demanded. Thus far not a shred of such evidence has been found.
I know the world is a cruel place, Holocaust denial is difficult!
WWII was planned out already in 1936 when England and the USSR singed a secret treaty seceding all of Eastern Europe and Finland to Stalin’s blood thirsty Jews.
In October 1939, after the UK had not objected to Stalin swallowing Poland to the Curzon line, Churchill signed another secret treaty with Stalin where once again, all of Eastern Europe including the Baltics were seceded to Stalin. In exchange, the UK and France were given the green light to grab Scandanavia.
AFAIK I’ve never said anything about “camps in the East,” east of Sobibor. You may think that is the ‘mainstream’ revisionist position, but do not assume you know what I think. ASK!
I used to accept the Carlo Mattogno “preliminary” revisionist position on the ACTION REINHARDT camps, but I have thought differently since a couple of years ago. Why? Bc it’s unlikely that over a million “prisoners” were processed in those small places in so short a time … leaving so little imprint or evidence behind. To say they were all murdered in homicidal gas chambers and their bodies burned with firewood is not conceivable. Still more, supposedly the Germans were able to leave the sites pristine, as if nothing had ever taken place there (like at Babi Yar). And this was accomplished when the Red Army was hard on their heels, rushing into the occupied territories. Have you ever tried to draw that picture, or show how it was done?
Yes, you are illogical. But then you just parrot the “Holocaust Controversies” clowns.
#862 HdC
“Well, let’s begin with returning all the stolen territory that the Poles were “given” to them after WWI and WWII. “
Germany accepted new borders with Poland in 1970 year (and confirmed it in 1990).*
“You do all that, and then maybe we can talk of reparations to Poland.”
Sure. Just give me a numbers. How big reparations from Poland want Germany?
We can take it off from $1.3 trillion reparation for Poland and then we will check balance.
“Mind you, I would subtract all the German billions of Euros that Poland receives via payments from the EU.”
From each 1 euro send to Poland, 0.8 euro returns to Germany so bringing Poland into EU was a good deal for Germany.
I’m curious when Canadians will pay reparations to Natives for stealing their land and decades of discrimination, do you know something about it?
—–
* ” In 1970 West Germany signed treaties with the Soviet Union (Treaty of Moscow) and Poland (Treaty of Warsaw) recognizing Poland’s Western border at the Oder–Neisse line as current reality, and not to be changed by force.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oder%E2%80%93Neisse_line
“The German–Polish Border Treaty of 1990[a] finally settled the issue of the Polish–German border, which in terms of international law had been pending since 1945.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German%E2%80%93Polish_Border_Treaty
#864 HdC
“The Poles were fortunate that the Germans took on all those orphaned children in Poland, (…) “
Children were orphaned because “cultural and educated” Germans killed their parents.
For more examples of German “mercy”, read this:
“Robbed childrens. “I was fit for germanization” “(“Zrabowane dzieci. “Nadawałem się do zniemczenia”)
https://www.dw.com/pl/zrabowane-dzieci-mia%C5%82em-niebieskie-oczy-nadawa%C5%82em-si%C4%99-do-zniemczenia/a-40387693
The reason we don’t know where they went is because the outgoing records have “vanished”. Probably it wasn’t Germany that decided to keep only the “incriminating” half of the evidence.
But there have been studies. Walter Sanning calculated about 300 thousand missing Jews after the war. The rest went to the USSR, to Palestine, to USA and to South America. For example we have 200 thousand European Jews immigrating to Israel from Morocco, Tunisia and Iran after 1948. Presumably they came to those countries somehow. There were literally thousands of concentration camps of varying sizes scattered all over Europe.
German logistics managed to ship a bunch of Russian POWs over a thousand miles to my small home town, so they could starve there instead of in Russia. Knowing where all the Jews went is impossible when all the records have mysteriously disappeared in Allied custody. The US, the UK and the USSR are keeping vital documents from the war sealed to this very day. Obviously the time to protect Stalin’s rule and Clement Attlee’s cabinet have long since passed, so we may only guess why evidence that could explain what actually happened in WW2 is still kept from us.
You quoted: “…Children were orphaned because “cultural and educated” Germans killed their parents…”.
Transference, much?
I point out the book Polish Atrocities Against the German Minority in Poland. This plus incessant border excursions by the Poles, chauvinistic headlines of invading Germany and moving the border to Berlin, finally caused Germany to begin its police action to stop the murder of German civilians who never wanted to live in Poland. Add Polish threats to the German city of Danzig to that mix.
It seems to me that the agreement you cite, between Germany and Poland, would include a quid pro quo: No claims in the future by Germany and no claims by Poland. However, if Poland wishes to open up that agreement for further adjustment, it may begin by returning stolen German territory.
It may please you to know that I live on a beautiful property that I purchased legally. Furthermore, the original tract of land, all 60,000 acres of it (ca 24,000 Ha), was legally purchased from the original owners, the natives of this area, in about 1798 or so. The original purchase agreement may be viewed in the local museum. Trust that puts your mind at ease.
They mostly left for Poland. And it was done in the 13th century by Edward I. The Polish king invited them in.
You know, I have no idea why I wrote 15th Century. I know it couldn’t have been then. I must have been having a mental lapse – senior moment. But it’s good to know people are reading this! Thanks for the correction; I will look up the Polish king inviting them.
Mr. E Exposes Barbie
Video Link
You make a very valid point Solonto, one that I think is worth emphasising frequently, and that is the primacy (exclusivity, really) that is granted to Jewish suffering – real and fabricated.
The suffering of all other people’s is either ignored completely, or vaguely alluded to in passing, as a sop.
Including the contemporary attempt by “the Jewish state” to exterminate the people of Palestine!
Viva Palestine!
Kali
I posted a link to that document in a reply to “fufu” a couple years ago, HdC.
He is just a troll that repeats “Hyena of Europe” propaganda despite evidence.
Smigly-Ridz reincarnated, perhaps.
But since there are perhaps readers who have not yet seen it, here is (again) the link.
Maybe also search Bromberg Massacre/”Bromberger Blutsonntag”.
https://archive.org/details/GermanForeignOfficeThePolishAtrocitiesAgainstTheGermanMinorityInPolandEN1940299S.Text
Interestingly enough I had the fortuitous opportunity to walk alongside one our esteemed US senators in a parade this last year. He took the standard historical tack when I challenged him and his senior colleague about their abominable position on the UKR war funding. He said that it was exactly like WWII, and was able to argue well. I didn’t have a good answer to why Germany (didn’t want world conquest) by invading France. But I did argue that Hitler (Heidler, the origin of the name as pointed out by D. Irving) simply wanted to reunite the German people. I pointed out Danzig, the true name of the once proud 98% German Prussian city. (I forget the current name.) I didn’t mention that German boys were being castrated by the sick Polish overlords; something that they in turn accused the other of. The slick US Senator (and one time Governor too) scoffed call, calling the city insignificant ; we agreed to disagree. I wonder if he would call city where he got his monumental political career started unimportant as well
#879 HdC
So, you don’t know how much money want Germans from Poles? Give me numbers, please.
“Transference, much?”
My dear friend, I gave you a link* to article how in reality German treated children of other nationalities.
If you read this article you would know that:
1. Germans stole 50-200,000 children from Poland, 40-50,000 children from Belarussia and Ukraine, 1000 children from Czechia, 300 children from Norway) and put them into German families.
2. Before Germans stole kids, they had separated men from women and from children because Polish fathers and mothers had fought when German wanted to take their kids.
3. In Łódź was created koncentration lager for children called ‘Little Auschwitz’. (what kind of beast had to be Germans ???)
4. Zita Suse alias Zyta Sos as a 8 year old child was beaten by SS-man till loss of consciousness. Then she was tranfsered to Lebensborn in Germany. She said “I died alive (Umarłam za życia)”
5. Children from Sokolniki were treated as blood-donors for German airmen. Only 56 out of 1682 kids survived.
and many other German crimes.
“It may please you to know that I live on a beautiful property that I purchased legally. “
I belive you. I’m curious what happend next to these native owners? Did your grand-grand-grandparents sent them blankets infected with pox?
Or maybe they sent children of Natives to schools in Canada where they were brainwashed, abused ,raped and in many cases killed.**
You must be proud of your ancestors.
Canadians seems to be like Germans – abusing and killing children of local people is a bright mark of their national character.
—-
* “Robbed childrens. “I was fit for germanization” “(“Zrabowane dzieci. “Nadawałem się do zniemczenia”)
https://www.dw.com/pl/zrabowane-dzieci-mia%C5%82em-niebieskie-oczy-nadawa%C5%82em-si%C4%99-do-zniemczenia/a-40387693
** “Catholic Bishops in Canada have apologised “unequivocally” to Canada’s Indigenous peoples for a century of child abuse at church-run residential schools that was part of a government programme to “assimilate” them into Canadian society, (…)”
“The system, which operated between 1831 and 1996, removed about 150,000 Indigenous children from their families and brought them to Christian residential schools run on behalf of the federal government.”
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2021/9/25/catholic-church-apologises-to-canadas-indigenous-over-abuses
BTW, these small, temporary installations came to be called Aktion Reinhardt camps bc they were involved in the program administered by Fritz Reinhardt, a State Secretary in the German Finance Ministry, that collected excess goods of Jews who were being transported out of Germany proper to parts East. Reinhardt was responsible (as I understand it) for the collection and storage of these goods. He himself did not give it this name, but came to be called by his name, popularly.
It was NOT called after Reinhard Heydrich, head of the SD, which would be silly as first names were not used to identify people in National Socialist Germany. And no program would be named with the head person’s first name. So the liars are just doing what they do–lie. They want to associate the entire project they portray as an extermination plan with Reinhard Heydrich, since no one knows who Fritz Reinhardt was, nor can he be associated with any Police or Gestapo. It’s all so transparent, and to my mind, childish to try to pass this off. We see that Franklin Ryckaert just falls in line with whatever the Holohoax promoters are doing and saying, while he wants us to believe that he’s using his own critical abilities in coming to his conclusions.
Is he bought and paid for? A fair question. Maybe he’s just a ‘quarrelsome’ person, according to Ron Unz’s thinking.
“…BTW, these small, temporary installations came to be called Aktion Reinhardt camps bc they were involved in the program administered by Fritz Reinhardt, a State Secretary in the German Finance Ministry, that collected excess goods of Jews who were being transported out of Germany proper to parts East…”
To “collect excess goods of Jews”. You mean of course to rob them. Shall I send some Blacks to your house to collect your “excess goods”?
“who were being transported out of Germany proper to parts East¨, so you still espouse the “camps in the East” myth.
“Is he bought and paid for?”. Indeed a “fair” question for those who cannot imagine such a thing as conscience. Typical Nazi.
Same question was asked about Eric Hunt (by people of the same mentality).
Eric Hunts article about his conversion is linked here: https://archive.is/DoGTn
The Bromberg massacre happened on 3 September 1939, two days after the German invasion on 1 September 1939.
About the actions of the Noble Nazis in Poland, see:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_crimes_against_the_Polish_nation
Many so-called Volksdeutche (local ethnic Germans) enthusiastically participated in the looting of Poles.
“…the contemporary attempt by “the Jewish state” to exterminate the people of Palestine..!”
Yeah the evil Israelis are genociding the Palestinians!
Only thing is they are not very good at it. When Israel was created in 1948 there were 1,3 million Palestinians, now there are 14,3 million*). Half of them in historical Palestine, half in the rest of the world. In 1948 some 100,000 Palestinians were allowed to stay in Israel. They have now grown to 2 million, nearly 21% of the population. Some genocide!
*) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinians
https://historyheist.com/bromberg-bloody-sunday-polish-jews-massacre-5500-germans-in-one-day-followed-by-thousands-more-in-the-next-few-days/#main
Ryckaert says —
“The Bromberg massacre happened on 3 September 1939, two days after the German invasion on 1 September 1939.”
And posts a Wiki link.
Are you saying, Ryckaerts, this atrocity is justified ?
Do you believe that raping women and nailing children to barns is sort of excusable ?
The Report attached to my reply to HdC indicates that this appalling slaughter by your fellow jews and Poles is but one of many similar.
Perhaps you regard it as a mitzvah ?
Did your rabbi tell you to post this shit ?
You, Ricketts, are a disgusting weasel.
Atrocities are never justified, but Bromberg obviously happened as a reaction to the German invasion.
Local ethnic Germans were organized in Selbstschutz (“selfdefense”) units and participated in the warcrimes of te invading Germans. Some example:
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selbstschutz
Now what does your rabbi say about that?
This reply from you illustrates how you never answer my statements or questions of FACT, but evade evade it every time by bringing up your “moral” objections. What’s MORAL is one question to ask and answer, what is FACTUAL is another. Whether the original non-official term for this program was Reinhardt (yes) or Reinhard (no) is the issue that I brought up. You are EVADING it bc you can’t give the answer that you want to give honestly. Yet you will continue to spell it Reinhard in spite of the facts pointing elsewhere bc you don’t care about facts. IMO, ignoring facts is immoral.
No, I don’t. I said East of Germany proper, which meant in the General Government, meaning Belzec, Treblinka and Sobibor. Again I say, you do not discuss in good faith, but depend on ‘tricks’ like this.
Typical pulling out the “I’m more moral than you” card. But I’m interested in FACTS & Reality. I knew Eric Hunt well, from the time he admitted online that he was the one who had accosted Elie Wiesel. (He was in the manic phase of his disorder: Bipolar disorder.) You know nothing about him but what you read by the holohoax pushers. He wanted out of the situation he had created for himself (not new), and most likely, either consciously or unconsciously, decided to burn his bridges so so wouldn’t go back. I know that he couldn’t possibly have believed what he was saying then, & using those dumb photos as “proof.” That’s why when he sent that stuff to me, I didn’t believe he was serious. I told him so. I was like, “Cut it out, Eric.” Then he cut the tie completely, and that was that.
Eric Hunt may have been paid money, I don’t know. I hope he was so that he got something out of it.
Addendum (from the same source):
Now that comes as a surprise!
“…Whether the original non-official term for this program was Reinhardt (yes) or Reinhard (no) is the issue that I brought up. You are EVADING it bc you can’t give the answer that you want to give honestly. Yet you will continue to spell it Reinhard in spite of the facts pointing elsewhere bc you don’t care about facts. IMO, ignoring facts is immoral…”
On the Internet both spellings occur (try: Aktion Reinhard). Originally I was used to write Reinhardt, but then I saw it spelled as Reinhard and then “corrected” my spelling. So my bad.Yes I wrongly thought it was called after Heydrich, but now I see that in the Wikipedia article about him his first name is also splelled as Reinhard.
“…No, I don’t. I said East of Germany proper, which meant in the General Government, meaning Belzec, Treblinka and Sobibor…”
You will mean other camps in the GG of Poland. Those 3 camps were too small to house big populations.
Talking about morality (your favored evasion), do you think the German Ministry of Finance was justified to “collect excess wealth” from Jews or do you consider that as a form of robbery?
#891 Arthur MacBride
(…) nailing children to barns (…)
Sure. Bydgoszcz (Bromberg) in 1939 has a population of 143,000 but they keep some barns only to nail German children.
” Groups of Bolsheviks attacked from Ponz, Lotz and Warsaw”
What is Ponz, what is Lotz? Why there were Bolsheviks which Poles repelled in 1920 ?
You must be really poor man if you decided to be a slave of Nazi-propagandists. Go back to your camper van, boomer.
Good! So now I expect you never to spell it Aktion Reinhard or Operation Reinhard again. I’ll be paying attention.
No, I don’t mean other camps, bc I’m not referring to housing big populations, you are. We don’t know how many but there were newspaper reports of Jews arriving by train from the west, with cars filled with their goods, including furniture. Thomas Kues also uncovered at least one Soviet news article that Stalin had ordered foreign Jews to be sent to gulags in the north, for the reason that he didn’t trust them. The only Jews he wanted were Russian Jews. [This was in the book on Aktion Reinhardt camps written by Mattogno, Grag & Kues, refuting the Holo Controversies guys]
After that, Thomas Kues (a Swede, I believe) quit doing revisionist work, no explanation given. Another very promising bright light lost.
It was really excess baggage that wealthy Jews wanted to take with them, but was not useful for their immediate or intermediate needs, and the Germans didn’t have the number of railroad cars available to haul it all for them. So it was identified and stored in barracks “warehouses” and it was the property of the Reich government until final disposal in the future. It’s true the future was uncertain, but that was the situation. There was dire punishment for any German who tried to take any of it for him/herself; it was very strictly handled. Not considered either as appropriation of “excess wealth” or “stolen goods.” So no, I don’t consider it robbery.
I’ll address the Canadian issue a little, because it irks me too. But not for the reason you think.
At that time residential schools were the norm in Britain, and those with money sent their children to same to be educated.
So, this system was imported to Canada in an effort to educate native children such that they would be able to earn a living in the white man’s world. A substantial number of these children did become lawyers, doctors, members of parliament, etc. Note that education for natives is free to them in Canada.
I will grant you that there were/are bad schools with bad administrators, and that some mistreated the children. I’ll leave it at that.
However, much is made in the mass media about hundreds of unidentified graves surrounding these schools. To which I say: “So what?” These schools had been in operation for over 100 years, and if 2 or 3 children died every year the school was in operation, you get hundreds of graves.
Aside: No msm ever gave the statistics of how many white children died during the same time period. I wonder why? Methinks that the mortality rate of European children was much higher due to their dispersal to remote areas without medical care or decent food in the winter.
Much caterwauling about unmarked graves. Again: So what? It is the families’ responsibility to maintain graves and the grave markers, NOT the governments’ or the tax payers’.
Billions upon billions of dollars are spent on the natives in Canada every year with very little to show for it. The Canadian government gives lump sum payments to the various tribe’s governing councils, without any accountability to the Canadian government or tax payer! This is not a typographical error, but unvarnished truth. A previous government introduced legislation to make the tribe administrators’ accountable but, what with the hue and cry from these worthies, the new liberal government axed that worthwhile piece of legislation.
The current method of schooling native children is an absolute disaster. Naturally the natives insist that their children be schooled on their reserves. But who does teaching? I’m sure there are some native teachers but, a significant number are white or, perhaps now, other non native teachers that accept the teaching position for a one year period in the northern reaches of Ontario, Manitoba, etc.
After one year these teachers leave their position and will NEVER go back! Why? Because there is no money to purchase school supplies, books, paper, pencils, computers, etc. The teachers salary is guaranteed, but everything else is at the “pleasure” of the band council.
Then there is the parental lack of support for the need of education. Drunkenness is a problem among natives, thus rending to children is often of secondary concern.
If you have questions I’d be pleased to answer them to the best of my ability.
Quillette just released an essay on this topic
Not a Genocide
Terrible things happened at many of Canada’s Residential Schools. But describing these institutions as instruments of mass murder is inaccurate.
Ian Gentles
https://quillette.com/2023/08/02/not-a-genocide/?ref=quillette-weekly-newsletter
How magnanimous of the Khazarians to allow 100,000 to remain in their (the Palestinians) own country, after their murderous orgies in that 1948 campaign that killed scores of thousands of unarmed villagers.
And yet Franklin, you have no qualms about being an apologist for these thieving mother-f*ckers.
As for this remark of yours:
In fact they’re very good at it.
However, as you and I well know, the ONLY reason the Zionist misfits don’t murder all the Palestinians, is because that would cause a tsunami of international outrage against the Khazarian illegal occupiers, that would have severe trade/diplomatic/BDS repercussions for them – leading to the collapse of this monstrosity of a state.
Just a final word to you, fufu, before again putting you on Ignore.
You have appeared in these columns in the past, repeating this judeo-masonic bullshit and multiple posters have rebutted it multiple times.
Yet here you are yet again, repeating the same old bullshit.
Your country, dubbed “The Hyena of Europe” even by your so-called allies, was used by them to ignite a World War against NS Germany. Approx. 6 million people died. Today you are again doing it, this time in Ukraine which you hope to annex part of.
You are going to get a hard wake-up. There are multiple voices giving opinions on what should happen with warmongering Poland.
It’s really touching that you still trust Perfidious and Uncle Shlomo.
A sterling tribute to your apparently permanent stupidity.
Perhaps you believe that UR commentariat are sort of babes-in-the wood and naive simpletons that will believe Wikipedia ?
Can you be serious repeatedly posting that propaganda ?
In perhaps expectation that people here will believe it ?
Even the founder of Wiki himself admits it.
Are you a moron, Ryckaerts ?
That might be the most charitable interpretation, but most likely you are a weasel.
Your posts do tend toward judgment in the latter category.
https://joannenova.com.au/2023/08/founder-says-cia-fbi-control-wikipedia-and-made-it-the-most-biased-encyclopedia/
“It-is-in-Wikipedia-therefore-it-is-not-true” is the last subterfuge of those who see their arguments fail. If that doesn’t work they resort to “Wikipedia-is-controled-by-Jews-you-quote-Wikipedia-therefore-you-must-be-yourself-a-Jew-or-you-work-for-the-Jews”.
If I would quote other sources then you would equally try to discredit those other sources. Carolyn Yeager does that all the time, only to defend her Führer as spotlessly innocent.
If you belong to that same sect that hysterically tries to convince the world that Hitler did nothing wrong, that the Holocaust did not happen, that no crimes against Slavic peoples were ever committed by the Nazis and that Hitler had no plans to conquer eastern Europe, then further debate with you is useless.
The sectarian mind is the irrational mind par excellence.
Irrespective of your reliance on Wikipedia for anything other than non-controversial info, it’s as clear as day that you’re a Jew.
Which wouldn’t be a problem if you were a righteous Jew. ie: someone that didn’t post their disinfo with malice aforethought.
Anyone who wasn’t born yesterday is aware that Wikipedia will never tell the truth on matters related to ZOG orchestrated crimes/Psyops/assassinations/wars/False Flags etc.
For example:
1) The Ukraine proxy war
2) The murders of JFK, RFK, JFK Jr, James Forrestal, MLK Jr etc
3) The Anthropogenic Global Warming hoax
4) The Holohoax
5) 9/11, the attempted murder of the entirety of the crew of the USS Liberty by the Apartheid Israeli state.
6) The Covid Psyop and…. much more.
But the problem is that you’re a malevolent Jew, the sort that cares not for the truth.
Your only purpose here is to peddle lies on behalf of your Talmudic/B’nai B’rith benefactors.
Pulling out all the tricks now. An unbroken stream of ad hominems and false syllogisms. He must have flustered you.
As to actual arguments to support the idea millions were baked in gas ovens there is nothing.
Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy?
Caught in a Duschraum. No escape from reality.
The Jews like to say Europeans resent the fact a Judaic religon was foisted upon them. I say Jews equally resent our forcing them to take showers in WW2.
You only confirm: “…If that doesn’t work they resort to “Wikipedia-is-controled-by-Jews-you-quote-Wikipedia-therefore-you-must-be-yourself-a-Jew-or-you-work-for-the-Jews”…”
So tell me genius which source do you recommend to describe the actions of the Noble Nazis on orders of their Saintly Leader in the lands of the Slavic Untermenschen?
Here is a short video about the Nazi Intelligenzaktion, the action to murder 60,000 of the Polish intelligentsia in order to better rule the population as their slaves. The author is himself a Pole and therefore of course lying, because Slavic Untermenschen always lie:
PS, Wouldn’t it be far more easy to deny WW2 altogether rather than to have to work day and night to deny every crime of the Holy Innocent Nazis? Talk about efficiency!
Are you a pacifist? Are you against going to war under any circumstances? The German Ernst Zundel was, you know.
The National Socialist party declared war on Jewry in Germany, and Jewry declared war on Germany with a big announcement in a leading London newspaper in early 1933 demanding boycotts. If you say ‘not all Jews went along with the declaration of war’, it is also true that not all Germans went along with the NSDAP’s intentions either. Germans were living all over the world then who had an interest in the dispute, just as Jews were living all over the world. All things considered, they were pretty equal in strength at that time, except in Germany.
So is your moral code that ‘war is wrong’ and that invading another country is a crime? In the 19th Century Jews were invading Germany, not as a military force but as a tightly connected racial-religious kin force that was competing for resources and political-financial power. It may have been slow at first, but did build up strength by taking advantage of any and all difficulties and hardships that befell Germany and it’s people, especially of a financial nature. Jews know how to be of assistance to the ruling classes, and Germany had a sharp division between it’s “aristocratic” landed class and it’s “lower class” of workers & peasants. The latter were looked down upon and not even seen as “fellow countrymen” to the upper class, thus making it easier for the Jew to be of service.
A main goal of Adolf Hitler’s National Socialist government was to end this divide between rich and poor Germans through a nationalist political program. The Jews were opposed to this bc it’s what they depended on for their own flourishing in a country not their own. Thus the National Socialists and the Jewish community were opposed to each other. You want to portray the mentality of the National Socialists as hatred — “the Holocaust really happened bc they did not value Jewish life; the ‘Nazis’ committed crimes (and atrocities) against Slavic peoples for the same reason; and Hitler had plans to conquer eastern Europe also for the same reason” — but no hatred from the Jews & Slavs. They are only victims.
You used to say that the solution was for all Jews in Europe to move to their own country Israel, which they now have and didn’t have before, but you don’t say that anymore bc it’s all too obvious THEY WON’T. What you really think is a mystery. But it’s increasingly seeming that underneath it all, what makes you ‘tick’ is that you’re at least part Jewish. Nothing else explains it. You have strangely never denied that but simply remained silent on it, which crypto Jews almost always do!! If so, that means you’ve been a dishonest plant within the White Nationalist community all along.
The link to archive.is doesn’t work — is some kind of scam, or else has some type of super-duper security that doesn’t allow the computer that I’m coming from to access it. I wonder if others had the same experience.
What is very clear at this point, for me, is that the #1 goal of the Holocaust Lobby & the Jewish Lobby & the Israel Lobby (if there is any distinction between them) is to :
Say Nazi. Keep the word “Nazi” in use, and minimize to the point of non-use the words Nationalist Socialist/N.S.D.A.P./Hitler supporters, etc. (More coming on this …)
Also in the top tier:
Holocaust education in the schools. Reach all children at a young age before they are capable of reasoning or critical thinking.
Keep atrocity propaganda in the forefront. Images of torture, repeating the “stories” of inhuman atrocities on all Jews, many Poles, Gypsies, homosexuals, Catholic priests, children & infant to frighten people.
Pass more laws. Legalize the prohibition against “hate speech” which only amounts to hurting the feelings of selected “victim” groups, with appropriate punishments serious enough to deter such speech.
Build more holocaust museums and Jewish centers. Make the Jews’ version of their history the one we learn. Keep the focus on Jews, not on White history and culture; make it seem that White history/culture is not important — we are a dying race.
Put Jews in leadership roles over European Whites. Find or allow acceptable Jews to be in charge of popular websites. Make out that they are more effectively doing for Europeans what Europeans can’t do for themselves. At the same time, sabotage pro-white websites with incompetent or disloyal whites.
“…So is your moral code that ‘war is wrong’ and that invading another country is a crime..?”
Yes, definitely so, therefore I condemn Hitler’s plan he had to colonize eastern Europe.
As for your assertion that the Jews themselves had so to speak “colonized” Germany by their control of finance, politics and media, that is indeed true (it is presently true also of your own country, the US) and I understand Hitler’s wish to end that situation, however that should not have been done by genocide but by peaceful emigration (the same way I wish to end the presence of large non-white populations in Europe).
Whether Jews will emigrate to Israel depends on the situation in their diaspora countries. If they feel unsafe they will go. This is already happening in France. Presently 43% of the world’s Jews already live in Israel.
“Encouraging” all Jews to leave will be as difficult as “encouraging” non-Whites to leave Europe. Presently it is a pious wish, but we don’t know if public opinion will change.
What I really think is no mystery. The world is diverse in terms of race, ethnicity, culture, language, and religion but mixed societies simply don’t work. Thus ethnic groups should have their own countries. If problematic mixed societies already exist, then they should be “unmixed” but in an orderly and humane manner, which may take some decades to accomplish (this is also what Greg Johnson proposes).
Presently for white countries the false dilemma is either “Nazism” or “multiculturalism” (and that to such a degree that Whites will become a minority). A Third Way should be adopted, but espousing Nazism will certainly not do the trick.
I found it this way: Eric Hunt Metapedia. Then choose: External links: Codoh forum: Eric Hunt rolls over? On that page choose the first link, which is: http://archive.is/DoGTn
Success.
Murder of 60,000 innocent Poles would leave over 1,500,000 teeth.
Please present 1% of these as authenticated evidence.
#901 Arthur MacBride
“You have appeared in these columns in the past, repeating this judeo-masonic bullshit and multiple posters have rebutted it multiple times.
Yet here you are yet again, repeating the same old bullshit.”
Nothing was rebutted.
” Approx. 6 million people died.”
70 milions.* In war unleashed by Germans.
” Ukraine which you hope to annex part of.”
Nobody wants to annex part of Ukraine. What for? It is urban legend.
—
* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II_casualties
Just about EVERY jew on the planet today claims to be a “holohoax™” (oops, I mean “holocaust™”) “survivor”.
EVERY last one of them will claim that their relatives who lived in the WW2 time frame qualify, thereby qualifying them as “holocaust™ survivors”, even if they never left the USA.
The latest scam is a claim by jewish psychiatrists that “holocaust™ transference syndrome” is a malady suffered by descendants of so-called “holocaust™survivors” and should be on the dole for shekels…
You didn’t answer my question, but sneak around it. I repeat:
“Are you a pacifist? Are you against going to war under any circumstances?”
Please don’t edit my question.
Great answer, if you had ended it at “situation.” You are assuming genocide when that is the main dispute of Revisionism since 1948, and which the National Socialists denied during and immediately after the war … that is, until they were murdered or imprisoned by kangaroo military courts in order to silence them. While you’re involved in this thread, you cannot assume such a thing in your answer to a related question. (Are you a swindler, since you won’t stop with your tricks?) Until this is decided using legitimate, fair-minded EVIDENCE, it’s improper to interject such an unproven claim as a fact into your answer.
It IS a fact that PEACEFUL EMIGRATION is exactly what Hitler’s Reich was attempting to do by cooperating with the Zionist Jewish Councils to facilitate emigration to Palestine and other nations. The trouble started when the newly arrived Jews failed to adhere to their agreements not to mistreat the Arab inhabitants of the region, to live peacefully among and with them. Since as you admit:
this effort soon became unworkable. Hitler’s government came up with other places to which “their” Jews could emigrate, but the “other places,” ie the rest of the world, didn’t cooperate. Either they didn’t want the Jews or the Jews refused to go there.
This was not the fault of Germany or the National Socialists. As you said yourself, they had every right to remove Jews from their country as enemy aliens, but the Jews are such troublemakers wherever they go that no one wanted them!
So it’s back to my original question: “Are you a pacifist? Are you against going to war under any circumstances?”
There are numerous revisionist books/websites you could utilise. I recommend this one from John Wear:
http://www.wearswar.com/
As for reading real history about WWII, there is none better than David Irving.
Also from John Wear, you could read his book that’s available right here in UR:
https://www.unz.com/book/john_wear__germanys-war/
Yet more projection on your part when you write:
You and the other Holohoaxers are working day and night to deny the reality of what actually occurred during WWII.
In war both sides commit atrocities. But, any objective analysis will CLEARLY demonstrate that, by far the most heinous crimes (both quantitatively and qualitatively), were committed by the Anglo Zionist empire.
It is YOU Fake-lin Rycketts that is the DENIER. The Revisionists freely acknowledge the criminality of Malevolent International Jewry.
“…Are you a pacifist? Are you against going to war under any circumstances..?”
I think violence in case of selfdefense is acceptable.
#912 HdC
“Murder of 60,000 innocent Poles would leave over 1,500,000 teeth.
Please present 1% of these as authenticated evidence. “
Palmiry forest (near Warsaw) where Poles were executed by “cultural” Germans, over 2000 graves.
“The core exhibition is devoted to mass executions in Palmiry and in the Kampinos Forest in the years 1939-1943 and other events which took place in the area during World War II.”
https://palmiry.muzeumwarszawy.pl/en/permanent-exhibition/
” During the German occupation of Poland between 1939 and 1943, the Gestapo and SS units carried out secret mass shootings of the Polish civilian population here.[1] The memorial is located near the former mass graves. “
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memorial_in_Palmiry
Canada – beautiful country in hands of extremely stupid people.
What is remarkable is that in August 1941, which is before the USA joins the war officially which is later in December 1941, in during the Atlantic Conference in New Foundland, Roosevelt is already deciding American participation in the World in that conference!! Mind boggling! The US Congress did not want war, but Roosevelt wanted war but he had no excuse to go to war at Germany yet. The Germans were horrified at how Roosevelt could sidestep “American Neutrality” and work against Germany on the sly.
But what is even more remarkable is that in the Atlantic Conference in 1941, before the USA has even joined the war officially, Roosevelt is already deciding (with Churchill going along) the post WW2 World, they are planning the United Nations and the permanent members including the USSR. That is there is a special place for a brutal genocidal Communist regime USSR in the post WW2 War in the minds of the American elites but no place for the German Third Reich and the Japanese Empire!!! This is so mind boggling!!! Crazy!!
Not only that but Land Lease was passed by Congress to help countries who are potential victims of totalitarian regimes but it was up to the President which countries are those fighting totalitarian regimes. And Roosevelt decides that the USSR is a victim of totalitarian regimes while the USSR was the most brutal, totalitarian regime on Earth!!!!
Great Britain was sending most of it’s most modern tanks and most of it’s modern airplanes to the Soviet Union rather than to its own forces!! That too in dangerous convoys in the North/ Baltic Sea leading to the sinking of many British ships and the death of many British seamen. Britain along with the USSR even invaded the neutral power of Iran so as to get more goods and tech to the USSR. Very hypocritical for Britain to invade a neutral country, it was the anti-thesis of everything the free West was fighting for, for Britain declared war on Germany for supposedly the same fault!! Weird.
https://api.parliament.uk/historic-hansard/commons/1946/apr/16/russia-british-empire-war-assistance#:~:text=In%20the%20period%20from%201st,the%20United%20States%20of%20America.
British PM Clement Atlee was asked in the floor of the British parliament on the 16th of April 1946, by Colonel Crosthwaite-Eyre if he could publish a comprehensive statement giving a list of weapons and materials, together with their costs, that were supplied in aid to the U.S.S.R. by the British Empire, between 1st October, 1941, and the termination of hostilities in Europe.
British PM Atlee replied, “Yes, Sir. I am circulating a full statement in the OFFICIAL REPORT. The House may like to have the following summary of this. In the period from 1st October, 1941, to 31st March, 1946, we supplied to the Soviet Union 5,218 tanks, of which 1,388 were from Canada. We supplied 7,411 aircraft, including 3,129 aircraft sent from the United States of America. As previously explained on the 10th May, 1944, the aircraft from the United States of America were sent on United States Lend Lease to the Soviet Union as part of the British commitment to the U.S.S.R. in exchange for the supply of British aircraft to United States Forces in the European Theatre. The total value of military supplies despatched amounts to approximately £308 million. We have also sent about £120 million of raw materials, foodstuffs, machinery, industrial plant, medical supplies and hospital equipment.”
That is a lot of stuff and remember 308 million pounds is a lot of money as it is 1940s pounds, thanks to inflation would be huge amount today.
Stick to your own logic.
But I think you can’t do that, because this is only a vicarious argument. You don’t care for logic or self defense, you care about Jewish imposed morality. In that universe any right of retribution becomes null and void if “evil” is committed in the act of that retribution. Germany, being in rebellion to this dogma is, a priori, guilty.
This is a very common Western mindset. On display every time some heinous criminal is served popular justice. Murder, we can accept. But revenge, now that is wrong!
And so, in fear of committing it himself, man allows evil to march on.
This more than anything is why Adolf Hitler is the ultimate enemy. He represents a threat to the entire established psychological order of our world.
“Violence” can be many things other than arming & training troops and declaring war against a (perceived) enemy. So you still refuse to answer my question about pacifism and declaring war.
Were the National-Socialist Germans not acting in self-defense against the Poles, and also the Jews?
You are equating “atrocities” with “crimes,” which are defined by a state–the same mistake John Wear makes in his book and articles that you recommend. I believe you’ve adopted your position that “both sides commit atrocities” from him. He also makes the mistake of equating “atrocities” with what he judges to be “moral failures” and argues that “most people would agree that such & such is wrong.” So now an immoral act against another becomes an atrocity. This is no way to resolve differences.
It’s my considered opinion that NS Germany did not commit atrocities during WWII (nor during WWI), and I have asked that evidence of real atrocities be given to me. What I received was always in the nature of a crime (seldom) or an act/decision considered immoral in the eyes of the recipient (most of the time). Can you improve on that record?
Dictionary definition of ATROCITY, from Wordnik, goes way beyond crimes:
“Judea declares war on Germany” meant in practice a boycott of German goods by American Jews. German Jews and Jews from other parts of Europe were not guilty of that boycott. So why should NS Germany putting German and other European Jews in concentration camps be seen as an “act of self-defense”?
One could argue (according to the Suvorov thesis) that Russia was preparing an invasion of Germany, and that Germany’s attack on Russia was a preemptive strike. But Hitler was only too happy to invade Russia because of his Lebensraum plans. In that sense it was more than an “act of self-defense”, it was a war of conquest.
As for Poland, it depends how you explain the Gleiwitz incident: false flag by Germany or false false flag by Poland? Anyway Poland too became part of the Lebensraum plan.
You could not provide any evidence, could you? Graves alone only show that someone was buried there. Foe all we know those graves contain the bodies of murdered Germans.
As to your concluding sentence, I would agree that all western countries are run by traitors OR extremely stupid people. That goes in spades for your Poland.
The Iranian Famine
The Great Famine & Genocide in Iran: 1917-1919
by Mohammad Gholi Majd
too many idiocies
not worth expenditure of my precious neuronal fluids
–
Franklin Ryckaert is so thoroughly illogical and irrational — desperately so — that he/she/it should be encouraged to POST POST POST, because every squirt of digital ink from Ryckaert’s keyboard is one more manifestation of the bankruptcy of holocaustianity.
Good then spend your “precious neuronal fluids” looking at this map of Hitler’s Lebensraum plan, all for the sake of “self-defense” of course. Good luck with your religion of Nazianity.
Unfortunately, Sanning is far from honest in the way he references sources.
—–
… a report by the Canadian-Jewish journalist Raymond Arthur Davies … mentioned a plenary session of the Jewish Anti-Fascist Committee in … which its secretary Shachne Epstein reported the evacuation of 3.5 million Jews from the territories occupied by Germany…
Davies, Raymond Arthur, Odyssey Through Hell, New York, 1946, p. 142.
—–
— Walter Sanning, The Dissolution of Eastern European Jewry, pp. 103, 221, 1983 IHR edition.
Turning to the actual Davies book, we find:
—–
With great pride, Epstein reported on the role of Jews in all Allied armies… He greeted the Jews of Poland. He revealed that the Germans had killed about five million Jews and that the Soviet Union had succeeded in saving three-and-a-half milion.
—–
— Davies, Odyssey Through Hell, p. 142.
Notice that Epstein as referenced by Davies does not say anything about the Soviets having evacuated anyone. He simply claims that the Germans killed 5 million, but that another 3.5 million was kept from falling into German hands by the Soviet army fighting back against the Germans. There is nothing recited by Davies which in any way suggests that the Soviets did any evacuations. That is a spin which Sanning puts on it through a misleading citation.
Franklin logic, holocaustianity sacrament: When you’re in a hole, Keep digging
The quality of a man’s initial assertion is important, because it says something about the validity of his argument as a whole.
You are attempting to discredit Walter Sanning, and the best example you can find is a mere supporting argument of his:
In chapter 4 we can read what his own computations are based on:
As to your example, your big “gottcha” moment is that Sanning has taken “saved” to mean the same thing as “evacuated”. Unless Jews were hiding out the war in their spawn caves, I struggle to see any other interpretation of the word. Your main argument is not even really an argument. Sanning and Epstein are essentially saying the same thing.
It’s a well known fact that Jews are bad athletes because they spend all their time on mental gymnastics. I remember a fairly generic documentary where a typical Jewish family was interviewed.
“Do you ever go to the gym?”
No, never. Why would we? It would just be a waste of time.
Time better served subverting the goyim I reckon.
Let it be on the record that Franklin Ryckaert still has not answered the question of “whether he is a pacifist and if he’s against going to war under any circumstances.” He tries to reframe or reword the question so he doesn’t have to say ‘yes’ or ‘no.’ He wants to play the Jewish swindler.
What the swindler wants to talk about is “Hitler’s Lebensraum plans”. But there was no plan, just various discussions & statements at different times. It’s only FR’s opinion that “Hitler was only too happy to invade Russia because of his Lebensraum plans.” But he doesn’t add “imo”. He states it as a fact. It therefore cannot be the basis for his further statement that: “It was more than an act of self-defense, it was a war of conquest.”
The Gleiwitz incident was not a false flag at all. It was a lie by Poland to cover up all their aggressive acts against ethnic German citizens by making it look as if it were the Germans being the aggressive ones. https://carolynyeager.net/gleiwitz-%E2%80%9Cfalse-flag%E2%80%9D-incident-pure-fiction
I like this. Some very important concepts here. Revenge is payback. I like the word “payback” better. It’s what our justice systems are based on — you have to pay, you can’t get away scot-free.
We sure need a lot more of that in our American justice system right now. Our country is being overtaken by crime in the cities. The biggest contributor to it is growing racial-cultural diversity and mixing, and probably overcrowding.
You seem not to understand conditionality. Besides, you ask my opinion and when I give that you say that is only your opinion.
So am I against war under any circumstances? I say no, under the circumstance of self-defense war is allowed. Was Germany’s war against Poland and Russia a war of self-defense? It depends (conditionality!) on the question whether Poland attacked Germany or not or whether Russia threatened to do so. If so, (conditionality!) was Germany’s war purely a war of self-defense? No that war was a war of conquest according to Hitler’s Lebensraum concept. He would have attacked Poland and Russia anyway. The murder of 60,000 of Poland’s elite, to secure that the Poles would never rebel against German rule, and all the talk in Hitler’s Table Talk about conquering Russia and settling it with Germans clearly indicate that. But that you deny.
What you say is fair enough Carolyn, and my using the word ‘atrocities’ was inappropriate.
What I’m getting at is, in war their will be instances where one side does the most despicable things. eg: the incendiary fire bombing of women and children in Dresden.
And, assuming that a German soldier was on leave to visit his family in Dresden, only to find that when he returned he only found the charred stumps remaining of his family members at the morgue, it would be understandable why that soldier, after returning to the front, would become a crazed animal and engage in war crimes against a soldiers of the Anglo-Zionist empire. (eg: butchering unarmed belligerents that had surrendered – like this bloke that Donald J Chump pardoned when he was POTUS):
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/dec/27/eddie-gallagher-trump-navy-seal-iraq
From the article above:
A bit of background on the story about Navy Seal Gallagher (who had the nickname ‘Blade’ – because he liked to thrust it into unarmed civilians).
An ISIS fighter had been captured and was being interrogated, when Gallagher thrust a knife into his throat.
After stabbing the captive to death for no reason, [Gallagher – who was the platoon leader] then forced his troops to pose for a photograph with the corpse.
That ‘ISIS fighter’ was a TEENAGE BOY, he had long since been disarmed, he was a shivering/frightened child whilst being questioned.
Also from the article:
This is not an isolated incident in the U.S military, from what I’m told.
For you Americans reading this, think twice before your salute the next soldier you encounter.
The ‘services they’ve rendered’ for their country may not be what you envisaged.
Of course, the example above is not analogous to what any German soldier may or may not have done during WWII.
The Navy Seal Gallagher was not getting revenge for what Afghani’s had done to him personally – no Afghan had ever done him/his family/his nation any harm.
Meanwhile, as proof of the sort of depraved bloke that Donald J Chump is, the following excerpt is also from that same article in the link:
Yep, Trump is one hell of a good judge of character (witness the ZOG operatives he appointed to his administration during his tenure – likely to be seeing that again if he gets elected in 2024).
Then again, maybe I’m being too tough on the Orang-u-tan (aka the Orange Man),.
After all, you can’t judge a book by its cover (Eddie Gallagher pictured below):
https://avatars.mds.yandex.net/i?id=723a34fb6ba4e7b0bcf2d495199d3d9c60baa648-8400759-images-thumbs&n=13
Yes, yes, he looks like a pleasant, timid little fellow, I guess.
> Sanning and Epstein are essentially saying the same thing.
No, they definitely are not. The statement which comes from Raymond Arthur Davies, as a description of what Epstein is purported to have said, is simply:
“He revealed that the Germans had killed about five million Jews and that the Soviet Union had succeeded in saving three-and-a-half million.”
“Saving” in this context means mainly that the German advances were stopped from going further. Of course, there will have been some routine evacuations which were motivated by a concern about Jews, but simply a general evacuation of industrial infrastructure. Although propaganda from the Third Reich always grossly overexaggerated the percentage of Soviet officials who were of Jewish background, there were enough Jews with positions in the Soviet state so that an evacuation of factories back to the Urals will have taken some Jews with it. But nowhere remotely close to 3.5 million would have been evacuated in this way. A few hundred thousand at most.
That fact that Davies attributes both the 5 million and the 3.5 number to Epstein shows us what he actually means. Regardless of whether you believe that this alleged 5 million was actually killed by the Germans, or if you wish to maintain that they were simply deported deeper into Russia with some unknown mortality rate affecting them, these numbers obviously are consistent with the fabled six million. The alleged 5 million which Epstein is quoted as having given is obviously not the entirety of Jews who were eventually under German occupation. I doubt that it includes Hungary, though it likely includes Jews who remained in eastern Poland on June 22, 1941. It would also include some proportion of Jews who lived in the 1939 territories of the USSR, while the 3.5 million in question is simply those who were in the 1939 borders but did not end up under German occupation.
Sanning tries to portray the Epstein reference by Davies as if it were evidence that the German-occupied territories had 3.5 million fewer Jews in them than is maintained by, say. Raul Hilberg or Gerald Reitlinger. It is obvious that Epstein does not imply anything of the sort. Simply by taking the 5 million number which Epstein gives, and adding on some other Jewish populations is places like Hungary, we are well within the range that is needed by such writers as Hilberg and Reitlinger. Whatever revisionist argument may be made against these authors, there are no grounds for deducting 3.5 million from their assessments of likely Jewish casualties based on the Epstein statement.
You seem not to understand the difference between asking for a yes-no answer and asking for an opinion. I ask for the former and you give me the latter, and then fault me!!
So now you finally admit you’re not against war under any circumstances. You’re only against it when it does damage to your side. Bc you can’t admit this, you try to cloak your partisanship in favor of the Jews & Poles with something you call “conditionality” –which turns everything into an opinion. No final conclusion can be reached bc of conditionality. Thus the argument continues–until the Jews can succeed in taking everything over, control the courts/justice system entirely, and imprison every dissenter.
Your bottom line: Since the facts speak against you, all you have is opinion and that’s what you stick with. But we’re not here to waste our time with your cloak of “conditionality” being used to hide what is a simple proposition: You are either a pacifist or you are not.
What you are is an imposter, in more ways than one.
Yuk. You and Franklin Ryckaert are two sides of the same coin.
You’re from that sick little, jew-infested ‘down-under’ British colony named Australia, which cannot get it’s own house in order. Will it be a part of China soon? Even though your country has dire problems with its politicians, you expend your energy tearing down the USA and our politicians, giving us advice on how to vote, instead of doing anything to change your system. Was the Australian role in WWII anything to be proud of? Not as I see it.
To get away from identifying with Australia, you spout Libertarian philosophy day and night, avidly following the American Ron Paul. You care nothing for your own country, I gather. You must see yourself as a citizen of the world!
At least you admitted:
I thank you and credit you with that. Cheers.
“…But we’re not here to waste our time with your cloak of “conditionality” being used to hide what is a simple proposition: You are either a pacifist or you are not…”
This proves that you can only think in black-and-white terms. We have had this conversation before, then you declared to be even proud of being a black-and-white person.
Life is not that simple.
https://codoh.com/library/document/real-lessons-evian-conference-part-one/en/
By Hadding Scott. It’s timely to this thread.
Sometimes it is, like in this case. I don’t remember having this particular conversation before, either. Can you supply an example?
We’re not writing about “life.” We’re discussing very particular statements made by you, whether they be true or false.
Lucky I just posted the link to Scott’s latest article right before your comment appeared. You need to read it, and maybe even respond to it. It’s pointing out the very same Jewish spin & evasion on the Evian Conference that I’m getting from you.
“Look, David Irving is probably the best WWII historian, extremely careful in his use of source material….”
OMG, no. When I was a wee tyke I was inspired by David Irving’s posturing as the intellectual hero unafraid to tell the truth, but I have since learned that this is really not who he is. He is no more to be trusted than the average mainstream historian, and possibly less.
I got my first clue about this when I visited Robert Faurisson at his home in 2000 and he spent some time complaining about the casual recklessness of David Irving’s historiography. Irving writes what amount to historical novels.
He is a very interesting speaker, but if he utters a fact that you would like to use, you had better find the source and check it yourself, because it may not prove what he says it proves. I found a few examples like that.
https://codoh.com/library/document/talking-frankly-about-david-irving/en/
Yes. Operation Barbarossa was pre-Emptive strike.
Oh dear, it seems I’ve struck a nerve by criticising your hero, the ZOG sock puppet Donald J Chump.
You also state:
Jews represent around 2% of the U.S population.
Meanwhile, here in Oz, they’re only 0.5% of the population.
So, to the extent that Australia has an infestation, your country has epidemic proportions of them (especially the most malevolent and depraved subset of them on the planet).
I suggest you clean up your own backyard before you start pointing fingers at others.
Yes, I’m a helpful individual, and want to enlighten the dumbed down masses (like yourself), to the magnificence of the Libertarian philosophy of Dr Ron Paul, based on the Non-Aggression principle and the sound economics of the Austrian School.
Had Dr Paul’s remedies been applied around the world, we’d have an infinitely safer, peaceful and economically stable/viable existence than what we’re experiencing now.
But you Carolyn, are too set in your ways in your blind adherence to partisan politics to understand that. Pity for you.
As for your assertion that I’m on par with that ignorant fiction peddler Ryckaert, that’s a low blow.
As quarrelsome as you are, I’d never descend to those depths of calling you that.
The Ron Unz comment Hadding is replying to also contains this gem:
He’s referring to Ingrid Weckert as some “random German writer,” revealing the large gaps in his knowledge and understanding of the Revisionist movement, yet Ron wants to be seen as an authoritative voice. He “knows nothing of her”–but did soon rectify that by learning of her reputation.
We’re all learning. Even David Irving can still learn–if he wants to.
I thought you’d say just that. But here’s how it works, see. Though Jews are only .5% of Australia’s population, Jews still exercise full control over the decisions made in that country, which means Australians are even less able to stand up to the Jew than are Americans. It takes 2% for our country.
As to Ron Paul, you know that I supported RP when he ran for president, to the tune of donating $100 three times (!) and then a little more. However, he let us down, dropped out and kept much of that money to fund his foundation or whatever it is he’s operating from now. That’s not what we gave it to him for! Paul is not a fighter. Donald Trump is a fighter, which is what we need.
Now I suggest you let the U.S. tackle its own problems and elections, and you take care of Australia. You never show any interest in what’s going on there. Guess you only sleep there.
I have news for you. Ron Paul NEVER dropped out in the 2012 GOP primaries.
He stayed in the 2012 primary race until the very end, and NEVER endorsed Mitt Romney at the completion of the process (as is customary for those don’t win the nomination to do).
Similarly, Ron Paul never endorsed Trump in the 2016 election – because he saw through Trump’s thin veneer and recognised him for the fraud that he was.
Most importantly, Ron Paul was CHEATED out of the victory in many of the primaries that we now know he actually won – especially the early primaries which, if he’d been announced as the winner at the time, would have enabled him to build momentum, raise more campaign contributions etc, that would’ve helped him win more primaries still.
For example, the first of the primaries was in Iowa, and despite consistently polling as the frontrunner in the lead up to that primary, Ron Paul was announced to have come in THIRD place on the night.
Well, it has since been announced that Ron Paul did in fact handily win that primary race, that there was an error in the ‘tabulation’ or some nonsense like that.
To the extent that there now exists the Ron Paul Institute for Peace and Prosperity, this is funded by donors who recognise the great work Ron Paul does – and it is very GREAT work indeed.
That you’re not aware of this Carolyn, is testament to how ignorant you are.
Lastly, you wrote:
Oh pleeeeeease !! Trump talks a big game but has NOTHING to show for it at the end of the day.
He bankrupted the country, delivered everything that ZOG asked for (with compound interest), and ensured that the U.S would descend into a banana republic hell-hole.
You got what you wished for – you can now stew in it.
Look, you’re a “Hitlerist” and I think Hadding is some sort of Neo-Nazi, so you hang out together and in your circles, a pro-Hitler German writer like Weckert is probably a very big deal. But you don’t represent too large a segment of the world.
I’d read that long Weckert article and as you know, I wasn’t very impressed with its quality.
According to the article, she graduated high school and then “studied theology,” later developing an interest in history. She’s only published that one book, summarized in the article.
So she’s basically an untrained amateur pro-Hitler historian whose work only seemed so-so to me and who has only written one book.
You just can’t imagine how ridiculous you seem by assuming that every amateur pro-Hitler historian should be known to everyone in the world.
Perhaps you should consider that the obvious reason you spend so much time on this website is because so few people ever visit yours.
I didn’t ask you to take my word about anything. I generally do not expect anyone to take my word, because I know that what I say is surprising. I informed you that David Irving really is not a careful historian, and I gave you a link where some examples are presented.
Since the link goes to quite a long article, here is a digest of two noteworthy instances.
Irving asserts that gassings happened in Auschwitz’s (no longer extant) “white house” and “red house” based on the confession of a former deputy-commandant of Auschwitz, Hans Aumeier.
Irving also likes to refer to an allegation of mass-shooting somewhere near Riga in late 1941. Irving’s main evidence for this is a confession by Generalmajor Walter Bruns.
I discovered that the confessions of Hans Aumeier and Walter Bruns were extracted by torture. Irving omits to tell his audiences that Walter Bruns’ and Hans Aumeier’s confessions were extracted while they were prisoners in the notorious London Cage. (The book Cruel Britannia is about this prison.) About Aumeier’s confession, Irving wrote to Mark Weber in 1992:
“He was held in a most brutal British prison camp, the London Cave [Cage](the notorious Lieutenant Colonel A Scotland)… It becomes more lurid with each subsequent version. At first no gassings, then 50, then 15,000 total. Brute force by interrogators perhaps.” (quoted in transcript of Irving-Lipstadt trial, 2 February 2000}
Irving also omits to mention that Bruns’ confession has Jews queuing up for more than a kilometer (anderthalb kilometer) passively awaiting their turn to be shot. This is not credible.
Furthermore, while the written confession attributed to Bruns makes him an eyewitness to the massacre, at Nuremberg his testimony was that he had only heard about it (G. Fleming, Hitler and the Final Solution, 1987, p.83). The origin and the content of these confessions indicate that they are not credible, and Irving knows it.
So, you see, checking David Irving’s sources in these instances leads to the discovery that he is giving credence to old war-propaganda that deserves no credence.
Malla wassup buddy.
I’ve made you really famous on Twitter. Post screenshot of your posts and they lap it up. I wish you corresponded more often on email. Hehe. You have a great mind.
P.S- you’re also closing in on 10,000 comments here on unz. Just looked on your profile. The reply you make to this might be the exact 10,000th one. Wow.
David Irving has always come across as far too much of a “know-it-all” for my tastes. As you write, he is an entertaining writer and speaker and he has lots of entertaining tidbits and stories.
I don’t give any more credibility to anything he says after he was arrested and likely tortured than I do to statements by any German officer during the IMT trials at Nuremberg. When a confession has been extracted through torture, first the torturer has to be prosecuted and sentenced before we can even start to try to deconstruct any evidence provided by the tortured witness.
Here is what wiki says about Irvings arrest:
Notice the “The Nazis did murder millions of Jews.”. I don’t blame Irving for lying under Jewish coercion. I blame Judea, Zionism and their progeny Israel.
Okay, I glanced at your stupid link attacking Irving:
https://codoh.com/library/document/talking-frankly-about-david-irving/en/
You criticize him for some remarks he made in 2009 that you strongly dispute.
I assume that you’re aware that in 2005 Irving had been arrested in Austria for some of his public remarks made decades earlier and thrown into prison for a year in his late 60s, very narrowly avoiding spending the rest of his life behind bars:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Irving#Life_after_the_libel_suit
While he was imprisoned in Europe, the British government seized the historical archives he’d accumulated over his lifetime of research and his family also lost their home. Perhaps that helps explain why his public remarks made several years later on various controversial historical matters weren’t quite up to your own standards.
My impression is that you’re some sort of Neo-Nazi and also that Neo-Nazis are eccentric dimwits. The nature of your attack on Irving tends to support both these impressions.
Perhaps you should consider getting some new talking points against Carolyn Yeager bc the same old ones you’ve been using for so long are not very effective. Maybe stick to the historical facts being argued instead of personal put-downs?
I shouldn’t need to say that Ingrid Weckert has long been known as a respected researcher and writer in Germany, and also among revisionist circles in Europe and America. She has published two books that I know of, and possibly others of a “travel guide” type (don’t know). She’s considered an expert on Israel. She definitely compares very favorably in reputation with Lenni Brenner, who you put enormous faith in.
Again, just bc someone is unknown to you doesn’t mean they are ‘generally unknown.’ That’s why I said regarding David Irving, “We’re all learning.” Try being a little more humble about what you think you know.
The book Irving wrote about the Nurenberg War Crimes trials best reflects his “on the one hand” and then “on the other hand” approach to addressing controversial historical events.
He best expresses this attitude in that book by “on the one hand” denouncing the trials as travesties, but then “on the other hand” almost delights in the punishment justly meted to the condemned.
It’s like he is trying to gain the approval and applause of people on both sides of the issue at the same time.
He thus exemplifies those Dante condemned to the hottest part of hell – the ones who, in the time of a moral crisis, preserve their neutrality who end up satisfying neither..
Your idea that David Irving was tortured by the Austrian police in order to extract his “change of mind” sounds like a conspiracy theory to me. Neither German nor Austrian police engage in torture (Nuremberg IMT style). Irving thought he would be released with a slap on the wrist if he didn’t contest the charges (which were true). He was shocked when he was sentenced so harshly. After sitting in prison for awhile, he decided to change his tactics. When you know David Irving, you know he’s very capable of doing that. The statement you blockquoted was his new strategy. And he’s been stuck with it ever since.
It’s important that he never wrote book #2 on Himmler, wherein he promised he would detail how Himmler put to death 2.5 million Jews in the three small, far eastern transit camps. For me, it was always an empty promise since I knew it couldn’t be done. But he made that empty promise to keep his fans sticking with him and coming to his talks. He was already used up and had nothing more to give.
To not blame Irving “for lying under Jewish coercion” is a dangerous precedent. Jews weren’t “coercing” Irving while he was in prison. He just realized then that they had the upper hand, and he was no equal. So he changed his tactics. It’s dangerous for a movement to make a hero out of such a weak individual. This whole affair needs closer scrutiny than it’s getting, not to harm or minimize Irving’s importance but to secure a more truthful historical narrative.
It was Hiram Johnson (1866-1945) – a Progressive Republican from California. He said: “The first casualty, when war comes, is truth.”
Johnson was Governor of California from 1911 to 1917 and a U.S. senator from 1917 to 1945. He was a senator when he uttered the famous statement.
He happened to die on the day when the A-bomb was dropped on Hiroshima.
First off, the USSR did not attempt to save Jews out of the goodness of their hearts. Apart from being seen as politically unreliable, they were human resources to be spent in Stalin’s war machine. On much the same token the Germans were keen to preserve their labor. In the Red Army that also meant fighting, and over a million of them perished in that role. Today these Jews are labeled victims of “the Holocaust”, and their movement from West to East are used to inflate the numbers through double counting.
Sanning provides rich and varied evidence for the movement of millions of Jews in the USSR. Sometimes a hundred thousand Jews from a single city. The evacuations were usually started weeks in advance, so plenty of time to carry them out. Your assertion that this number is false is based on nothing but air.
Instead you try to spin a fairly clear statement into its opposite. “Saved” denotes some action taken and the number 3,5 million specify the number of people affected by this action. If Epstein meant all the Jews in the USSR, the number should be higher by a few million at least. It is therefore perfectly natural for Sanning to assume that they are speaking about the same thing. They might not, but since the conclusion of the book is supported by a lot of other evidence, this possible ambiguity is of minor importance.
With respect, Ron, for the open debate on this your website.
I think that you will readily agree that one’s view of events in WW2 will change as more evidence becomes available. It is no secret that Great Britain has fought tooth and nail to prevent any view save that of the doughty heroic W S Churchill confronting those evil Nazi’s from coming out. But such details have been and still are coming out.
Your correspondent Hadding makes some good points that are worthy of consideration.
Otoh your casual dismissal of Hadding is not worthy of you.
I have just ordered “Cruel Brittania”, not having known about the London Cage.
I had previously known about the disgraceful Lt Col Robin “Tin Eye” Stephens and other British torture centres in England and in Germany used to extract quite spurious confessions used in the Nuremburg kangeroo Court.
I appeal to the spirit of your own website that you give Hadding and Carolyn Yeager a little more respect. Just writing people off as “Hitlerists” doesn’t cut it, Ron.
Ah okay, so going ad hominem against me with a generalization about “neo-Nazis” negates the need to consider whether what I am saying is accurate. Brilliant.
I never wanted to attack David Irving. Since he had been an inspiration for me I really wanted him to be what I initially thought he was, but he is not.
The stuff about Bruns is in Hitler’s War, first published in 1977. In the long article on CODOH I dispute some other interpretations of evidence that he uses to support allegation of a mass-shooting near Riga (the so-called Rumbula Massacre). For example, he invokes as evidence a set of Himmler’s notes from a telephone conversation that are so vague and skeletal that imagination could make anything of them.
David Irving was saying largely the same things in 2009 that he had written in 1977. So, the excuse that his archives had been taken away doesn’t really help.
By the way, Faurisson went through much worse without ever caving in the way Irving did. Faurisson was a more serious man who was not just trying to write books that would sell, which seems to have been Irving’s chief motivation.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torture
I suspect that we both would agree that Irving was coerced while Austrian “officials” were “extracting a confession, interrogation for information“.
The only question here is what is the definition of “severe pain or suffering”.
You claim that “Neither German nor Austrian police engage in torture (Nuremberg IMT style)”. I actually doubt that while the prisoners were physically located in Nuremberg for the “trial”, that “torture” was still being used to extract “confessions”. Besides, further abuse might even have led to exposure of the kangaroo trial for what it was. Even bloodthirsty Jews dead set on revenge against Titus, Jesus and all of European Christianity aren’t stupid to send defendents into the courtroom limping, or on a stretcher, all bruised and beaten up like Höss..
Those of us following the Gonzalo Lira saga are aware of his statements that Ukrainian prison guards didn’t “torture” him, but that other prisoners did. The same could have easily happened to David Irving. Obviously many other prisoners can be easily bribed or coerced into performing physical or mental abuse on some unlucky yet resistant fellow inmate, and often pedophiles end up getting murdered in prison. In fact, that is the claim made about Jeffery Epstein.
Most readers would likely agree that after his internment in the Austrian prison, Irving suddenly changed his tune concerning the Holohoax, and even Ron Unz points this out in a comment above, and in fact his sudden “confession” while in prison that the “Holohoax” did occur is proof enough for me that he was coerced into changing his story.
Would it have been “torture” if he had been ass raped in the shower or beaten up in the washroom? I would contend that it was.
I had read about “the London Cage” years ago in an article by the dailymail. Here are a few articles below:
REVEALED: The two Nazi officers suspected of being tortured to death by the British in a Kensington mansion after 70 year battle to keep their names secret – and how one was given a false identity on his death certificate
LOL. Lieutenants like Tanzmann order the “deaths of thousands” all the time, and they always have.
How Britain tortured Nazi PoWs: The horrifying interrogation methods that belie our proud boast that we fought a clean war
LFMAO. “Prisoner of War Interrogation Section (PWIS)”. The Anglo-Zionists were the real “Nazis”, not the NSDAP or the SS.
Was Britain guilty of torture too? New book reveals how a UK Colonel drew a confession from a Nazi soldier in a basement in Kensington
The Theodore Abel book arrived the other day & I have read 4 of the 6 “life histories” which are so greatly enjoyed by a Hitlerist like me. I hate to come to the end of them, lol. Although the end of each one is beautiful–a happy ending! Until ten or twelve years later when the bad ending comes. Oh, those halcyon days after 1933 for Germany!
Unfortunately, the author of the 4th essay has kind of ruined it for me, bc he’s used the word “Nazi” 4 times! Up until this, I had seen the word “Nazi” only once, used by Abel himself. Lots and lots of variations on the word National Socialism in use, and one time, so far, in the intro to the Six Life Histories, “the Hitler movement” which I’m good with. If fact, I like it. I continue to think it’s the best substitute for “Nazi.”
So I’m finding this project to be more rewarding that expected. I’ll continue until I think I’ve uncovered everything I can. I’m not satisfied that I’ve found everything there is to know yet, but I may have. There may not be anything more to it than what’s in that War History Online article. https://www.warhistoryonline.com/instant-articles/the-origin-of-the-term-nazi.html Anyway, it’s from that article that I discovered the Abel book “Why Hitler came into power,” for which I’m grateful. Cheers.
Actually, Hiram Johnson’s reported utterance of that saying occurred in 1929, and there were several previous instances of it being said by others. You can read all about it in the page I give below.
‘Truth Is the First Casualty in War’
https://quoteinvestigator.com/2020/04/11/casualty/
Thanks.
For some strange reason I hadn’t known about the “London Cage”, which apparently was only one of many similar interrogation centres in England.
I did know about the infamous Lt Col Robin “Tin Eye” Stephens (he wore a monocle) who ran Camp 020 (1940 – 1945) in London and Bad Nennsdorf (1945 – 1947) in Germany, though had never read extensively of the brutalities that went on.
This is the current MI5 entry on Stephens.
https://www.mi5.gov.uk/bad-nenndorf
Here are some accounts of recipients’ of treatment by this “energetic character” and his staff in the German Health resort of Bad Nenndorf.
Unlikely they share MI5’s rather neutral or even positive view of Tin-Eye.
https://inconvenienthistory.com/10/3/5924
#943 Malla
“Yes. Operation Barbarossa was pre-Emptive strike. “
Attack on Poland, Denmark, Norway, Belgium, Holland, France, Great Britain, Greece, Yugoslavia were also German pre-emptive strikes?
Or maybe just cleaning Europe for future German Totalitarian Reich?
@Brás Cubas
I had seen that “quote investigator” page. I did not notice that it directly contradicted the abundant claims that Senator Hiram Johnson had uttered the famous dictum at the time of the First World War, when he happened to be attracting a lot of attention as a critic. Some of the quotes, like the attribution to Aeschylus, are really not the same statement.
But it is possible that Johnson did not say it until 1929, and that he got it from Arthur Ponsonby’s Falsehood in War-Time (1928). A newspaper of 5 February 1929 said that Johnson had made the statement “recently,” and mentions Ponsonby.
https://books.google.com/books?id=RsdcAAAAIBAJ&pg=PA8&dq=%22Hiram+Johnson%22+war+truth+%22first+casualty%22&article_id=1323,4534215&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiIqI7XotCAAxUQlIkEHU4NAWYQ6AF6BAgDEAI#v=onepage&q=%22Hiram%20Johnson%22%20war%20truth%20%22first%20casualty%22&f=false
The deployment of German troops to Norway via Denmark was unquestionably preemptive. There was a British invasion of Norway in progress.
According to Adolf Hitler’s statement at the time, the invasion of Poland followed Polish border provocations. I tend to believe Uncle Adi, because that kind of stupidly outrageous behavior was not unusual for the Poles.
But, even apart from the direct Polish provocations, the partition of Poland with the Soviet Union was a strategically preemptive move. There was saber-rattling against Germany, and Poland was aligned with France and Britain against Germany. There were also efforts to bring the USSR into that alliance, which would have been a total disaster for Germany. Therefore Adolf Hitler awkwardly reversed his longstanding anti-Sovietism and made the non-aggression pact with the USSR which had the dual purpose of eliminating Poland and keeping the USSR out of hostilities for the time being. This was the only clear way to save Germany from crushed in the very near future.
France and Britain declared war on Germany then rejected Hitler’s offers to negotiate peace.
Belgium was carved out of France in 1830 as a so-called buffer state. In other words, Belgium exists to be invaded.
The Netherlands’ neutrality was already not being respected by the UK (with aircraft flying over) before the German troops rolled in. Probably the Netherlands would have been subjected to a British invasion like Norway if German troops had not occupied it. Trusting the British not to do that would have been to ignore a lesson from experience.
Yugoslavia had signed a pact to be Germany’s ally. Then the government was overthrown by a British-sponsored coup and replaced with one hostile to Germany. This happened when concerns about the Soviet trustworthiness had already developed. Leaving this hostile state in the Balkans to fill up with British troops was a bad idea.
Greece was invaded gratuitously. It was Mussolini’s stupid idea and the Germans had to bail him out.
You imply that there was an intention to make every occupied country into Germany. That’s absurd. Nothing that extreme was intended. If you look at a map of Großdeutschland from 1942 you see that in central Europe only traditionally German lands were annexed. What was going to happen in the east was more open to question. People talk about “Generalplan Ost” but this was six different proposals, none of which was ever adopted. But, one way or another Hitler wanted to make Ukraine into a reliable food-source for Germany, and I believe at the very least that he intended to settle German farmers in Crimea, because this place had been inhabited by Germanic peoples in the past.
It is quite amazing how many different nations/peoples have wanted to claim Crimea over the last thousand years. Cossacks, Tatars, Russian, Ukrainians, Germans, but most of all JEWS. The Crimean war of 1856 was fought by England and France to prevent Russia from taking control of Crimea. There were numerous German named cities on the peninsula, one of which was named “Zürichtal”. It was German farmers all along the Volga who actually taught the Russian serfs how to farm.
Later, Stalin had promised Crimea to Judea in exchange for Ultra-rich New York Banking Jews providing capital and expertise to build up the Judeo-Soviet war industries. The Ford tractor/truck plant was financed by New York Jews in the understanding that Crimea would eventually be a New Zion in exchange. Thousands of US workers went to JewSSR in the 1930’s, and many ended up in the gulags for decades.
It was when Stalin double crossed the Jews when he did not allow their return to claim Crimea after the war when the Doctors Plot and other Jewish schemes to eliminate Stalin were hatched.
In fact, the Heavenly Jerusalem project is the root of the Ukrainian Jewish war going on today.
Don’t stop there, fufu; you’re on a roll.
According to Franklin Delano Roosevelt hisself, in a speech to the (largely anti-war) American people on October 27, 1941,
Hitler had South America in his sites!
Thence, through the “soft belly” of the USA straight to Washington, DC!!
What you’ve put together here is nothing but opinion, speculation, “would have–could have–might haves,” but no specific evidence of torture or abuse experienced by David Irving. I’ve seen you do this before and it leaves me baffled.
Irving wrote a book about his experience of arrest and imprisonment in Austria in 2005-2006, titled Banged Up. I have a copy of that book, sent to me by none other than Eric Hunt. I’ve never read it! Eric sent it to me as a kind of thank you gift, unsolicited. Now, since I’m disputing your ideas about Irving, I guess I’ll have to read it. A very fast read, just to see if anything you’re saying can be found in it.
I doubt it, or you would be able to quote it, and so could others. The center of the book has 7 heavyweight, glossy pages of color photos, mostly of David Irving. Among them is a charming close-up of young Bente Hogh, “with whom he started a new family” in 1992. The descriptive words above her photo include “My imprisonment is a worse ordeal for her than me.” Well, if that is the case, he’s saying he didn’t experience rape, torture, beatings or extraction of a confession through intimidating interrogations … all the things you imagine and even suggest he experienced at the hands of the Austrian authorities or other prisoners. In fact, in leafing through it, on one page he mentioned how well he got along with other prisoners, and knew how to talk their language.
It therefore mystifies me as to why you write some of the things you write in the way of comments. Not all. But this one for sure.
Give it a rest Carolyn. Torture need not just imply physical abuse.
It can be administered psychologically.
So picture this. Irving is incarcerated in Austria and some depraved Talmudic entities approach him whilst there and say:
‘My, my what a lovely wife and five daughters you have. We sure wouldn’t want anything to happen to them while you’re in prison’.
‘Oh, pardon me. I meant to say four daughters – seeing as Josephine committed suicide not so long ago. So sad, so sad**’.
(**The Talmudic degenerates had a bit of a chuckle about Josephine’s demise.
One of the wreaths sent to her funeral by them contained a card which stated:
“Truly a merciful death, Philipp Bouhler and friends”.
The reference to Bouhler was a reference to the Nazi who was in charge of Hitler’s euthanasia programme. Irving described it as a “very cruel taunt”.
The agents sent by ZOG may well have also said:
‘And what about your daughter in Melbourne* Australia ? What a lovely little family she has and a blissful life she leads there (all the while showing photos of Irving’s daughter obviously taken from a moving vehicle that had been surveilling her and her family, tracking her movements)’.
(*In a brief email exchange I had with David Irving many years ago, he told me one of his daughters was living in Melbourne and how he was not allowed entry into Australia to visit her because our corrupt politicians were instructed by ZOG to deny Irving an entry visa into the country – a restriction that continues up to the present day).
So please Carolyn, just quit it with your incessant abuse of David Irving.
Before you spew more venom his way, I suggest you walk a mile in his shoes.
You know NOTHING of the behind the scenes threats/intimidation that Irving had been subjected to over the years.
Whaaatttt ???? This 5 minute vid should disabuse you of that notion. I’ll thow in a second vid, lagniappe.
Trump before and after the 2016 election …
Video Link
Trump pledges more arms to Zelesky, more than they ever got.
Video Link
Trump is a Zionist wrecking ball, directed right at the center of the democratic farce, the elections. They think the will destroy the country, they may be right.
Spare me your vids. I never watch them. Vids can show anything the vid maker wants.
I don’t bring up Trump unless someone brings it up to me. So STOP with the political electioneering on forums like this. Go out and march with a placard, or give a speech. I’m not interested in hearing guys tell me how awful Trump is. I can make up my own mind, thank you. Got that?
I finished reading through DI’s book “Banged Up.” It’s a misleading title, from what’s in it. The problems he gets into are always his own mistakes, which he even admits about a number of things. None of the scenarios you invent in this idiotic comment are contained in the book, or even come close. Plus he’s very friendly toward Jews in several places.
But you are a genuine ass, and want to believe whatever you choose to believe. Just please don’t bother me with it.
Well, I don’t recall that he ever claimed being tortured. But it seems to me that being arrested in a foreign country at age 67 for something he’d said 16 years earlier would be a pretty unpleasant experience. Even more unpleasant would be the very real possibility—even likelihood—of spending the rest of his life in prison.
Even though he managed to escape that fate, spending only a year behind bars, his family in England had no idea what had happened to him for weeks, and naturally assumed he was dead and “disappeared.” Meanwhile, the British government seized the historical archives he’d spent a lifetime accumulating and with his absence, his family lost their home.
It hardly seems a very appropriate fate for someone who was quite possibly the most internationally successful British historian of the last 100 years.
The whole thing sounds pretty similar to what the old Warsaw Pact countries had been doing to their own troublemakers during the last 30-odd years of their existence. So I suppose you must have always had a lot of sympathy for Markus Wolf and his Stasi.
Thanks TV. I think the real point here is that if Jewish Power had Irving locked up for “holocaust denial” and if Jewish Power had Irving mentally or physically abused in order to extract a retraction concerning Germany’s behavior during WWII, then Jewish Power would certainly also be able to extract promises from Irving that he would not disclose his abuse. Hell, they might even have promised to allow and even promote his book concerning his incarceration as long as he behaved in the manner expected from a cowed goyim. Locking up Irving, coercing a retraction, and then getting it smeared across all the newspapers would serve to “encourager les autres”.
Yes of course, what was I thinking.
Naturally, one would’ve expected Irving to disclose all specifics about the intimidation he and his family were being subjected to.
If the small hats were threatening his family, the obvious thing is to write about those threats in his book ‘Banged Up’, thus putting himself in the good books of the Talmudic ones – seeing as any publicity is good publicity as far as the latter are concerned.
After all, we have a precedent on matters like this. Michael Collins Piper and Christopher Bollyn exposed ZOG orchestration in their writings on the JFK coup d’etat and 9/11 respectively, and from then on the small hats made sure life was a bed of roses for both individuals.
Good stuff Saggy.
Trump’s not just a hypocrite, he’s a traitor through and through.
“Banged up” is simply UK slang for locked up. It confused me too.
The title must have made a very strange impression in Australia, where banged up is equivalent to American knocked up.
And to T-V, Brosi, and anyone else on this subject:
EVERYONE knows being arrested and dragged to jail & kept there is and would be “unpleasant” and even worse for ANYONE, anywhere, at any age. Why even say such things when that was never the point of contention? It began as a rejoinder to Brosi’s inventions and conspiracy theories about (conventional) torture and rape, then T-V had to get into it with his own inventions. I’m saying none of that comes from David Irving himself although he wrote an entire book about the experience. It’s very simple, but you are all people with an agenda you want to push.
Wow. Facts are now irrelevant? None of the things you mentioned have I condoned. What I have said (previously) is that DI knew he was sneaking into a country that had an outstanding arrest warrant in place for him, and that it was dangerous. And for what? Was he so hard up for publicity? He didn’t tell his partner where he was going or consider the consequences in advance. He was totally reckless! Which is in his personality, as is known. He also made mistakes after he was incarcerated by selecting a poor attorney to represent him over a competent one (Schaller), because of the poor one’s MEDIA connections. That’s David Irving’s chronic poor judgment based on his own desire for fame. When he realized the inability of the one he chose, he berated himself and eventually changed attorneys. This extended his time of imprisonment.
I’m not attacking DI, but my sympathy is limited by the realities that played a part in his whole situation. He made himself a victim, and then made the most of it, even though he didn’t choose it. Although looked at from another or higher point of view, he did. We all choose our life experiences. In this case, of course, the laws outlawing speech denying the holyhoax are at fault, but they’re put in place because of and by JEWS! Ron Unz’s objection to that is still very subdued, and of a “putting his foot in the water” nature. We need an all out assault on the whole WWII narrative, but where is it? I do a more thorough job than any of you three I mentioned, and certainly better than David Irving is doing. He is catering to and excusing the Jews as we speak. He is not even a holocaust denier, and you people say you don’t blame him! Unbelievable.
If Trump actually imagines that his telling Z he’s got to make a deal and then Telling P that unless he makes a deal he will give Z everyt4hing he wants (given the current state of affairs of the Russian counter-offensive crumbling the Ukie front around Kharkov) will settle it all, then he is a deranged lunatic.
The Russian army today is actually poised at the jump-off position their counteroffensive reached after they first stopped the German Kursk offensive and pushed them back passed their start lines before the Red Army launched its next phase that pushed the Germans back to Kiev.
The Ukies are done. Toast. Finito.
You are now either watching the beginning of the collapse of the Ukie army and the disintegration of NATO, or the run up to NATO’s direct involvement against Russia and the start up to WWIII.
Those are the options left to the US Empire.
The problem is: You are inventing this all, w/o any direct evidence. How can that be responsible?
And what Germans who were imprisoned followed that pattern/example? Or Frenchmen? Anyone?
In regards to ‘the H’ of WWII the memory of the dead has been besmirched by being cynically weaponized against the simple right of Euro peoples (and not ‘just’ Germans) to simply have the right to collectively exist at any time and at any place on planet Earth. [See the ‘Stolperstein’ link below as an example.]
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stolperstein
So I will not add to nor affirm something that has been cynically, shamelessly, and soulessly turned into a weapon against myself and others natural collective right to simply exist. [How many times has a Euro innocently spoken out against ‘mass immigration’ and some fanatic nut starts screaming about ‘cattle cars’ and ‘camps’? For the record, myself and many others are perfectly okay with a republic as a form of government.]
Those non-Jewish Euros who sado-masochistically embrace ‘the H’ as it is currently presented are like the crazy Peter O’Toole Irishman character Murphy in the 1972 movie Murphy’s War who at war’s end in his unbridled hatred of all things German (which he is unable to let go of) ultimately and needlessly winds up destroying himself.
If the memory of African slaves and slavery (which the Jewish people, amongst others, had been quite involved in) was similarly being cynically weaponized against the Jewish people’s simple right to collectively exist anywhere on Earth via the placement of tens of thousands of ‘Stolperstein’ (ie literally ‘stumbling blocks’) on Israeli streets, I would have no expectation of any healthy minded Jewish person adding to or affirming that either.
That should rather read ‘Stolperstein’ (ie literally ‘stumbling stone’).
Interesting point about banged up meaning knocked up to Aussies because it brought to mind how TV and CY seem to be about half-right and half-wrong in their assessment of Irving by failing to note that Irving’s real flaw is trying to be just a little bit pregnant when it comes to holocaust narrative.
Thus if I recall correctly, he is the first to have declared after extensively going over German documents that he found not a single one in which Hitler directed the launching of the holocaust and thereby raising the issue of whether the Germans had ever planned the event as it was being portrayed. Irving, however, did not also say that therefore it’s impossible the holocaust happened as claimed, even though it’s impossible to imagine how it could simply have occurred without explicit directions from the top that were essential for organizing and implementing the operation necessary to accomplish it.
There is no doubt that Irving’s announcement sent shock waves through the holocaust purveyor community.
But by the sake token, Irving didn’t deny that the Germans murdered the Jews. It’s just that Hitler didn’t order it.
So he approached the issue by trying to be only a little bit pregnant – the Germans did it, but Hitler didn’t order it.
That’s how Irving approaches controversial issues – he tries to have it both ways.
It didn’t work with the holocaust, because the only stand you can honorably take is to wholeheartedly join the holocaust purveyors or the historical revisionist ( “deniers”). There is no middle ground. You are either pregnant or you are not. Those are the options that Irving has discovered that have haunted him by trying to embrace both possibilities at the same time.
Contrast his position on the issue with Speer, who wholehearted embraced the holocaust purveyor narrative at Nuremberg and his book after he was released from prison rather than being hanged for his obvious complicity in the holocaust that his position as armaments czar placed him.
For as Butz, I believe, pointed out, if anyone in Germany was fully aware of the resources that necessarily had to be placed at the disposal of those implementing the holocaust that required moving through Europe of millions of people, it was Speer who, for example, had to authorize the diversion of hundred of locos and thousands of freight cars, and tens of thousands of tons of coal to run the operation. The necessary resources could not have been made available for the project without his knowledge.
Had Speer, however, told the truth, he would have been hanged. He knew that. So he wholehearted embraced and acknowledged the Germans indeed planned and implemented the murdering of millions of Jews that in one fell swoop entirely validated the narrative of the holocaust purveyors by someone whose word for it was as good as gold. They needed no further proof to validate the tale. Thus was he spared at Nuremberg for the service he performed for the purveyors.
Speer thereby fully embraced the “I am pregnant” version of the story.
It is by trying to be both pregnant and not pregnant that Irving’s half-hearted position came to be accepted by neither side and ended up being denounced by both.
And TV and CY are arguing over and lauding Irving for embracing the part of the story they like and denouncing him for also embracing the part they don’t like when his real flaw is he simultaneously embraced two parts that form irreconcilable contradictions.
As Dante said, the hottest part of hell is reserved for those who in the time of a moral crisis preserved their neutrality by trying to be just a little bit pregnant.
Well said.
> “Saved” denotes some action taken and the number 3,5 million specify the number of people affected by this action. If Epstein meant all the Jews in the USSR, the number should be higher by a few million at least.
Epstein made the claim that 5 million had been killed, and 3.5 million landed in a region unoccupied by German forces. This totally compatible with Raul Hilberg’s version of events. If Epstein had really been talking about 3.6 million having been evacuated from territory which the Germans occupied, then his split would have been 1.5/7 instead of 5/3.5.
That’s an unfair comment, Ron.
I’m reading through this thread closely after a few days absence, and see that all Carolyn is doing is refuting spurious notions/speculations that DI may have been tortured, psychologically or physically, into supporting Holocaustian mythology whilst in prison.
And she’s using DI’s own book on his experiences in prison to do so.
She didn’t suggest that imprisonment in Austria was a a holiday camp, only that making stuff up about possible torture is not honest.
And she’s right. No matter how wrong the reader may want her to be.
The quality of this comment thread has improved greatly, with emotionality and ad hominems reduced to a minimum, as more sober analysis is brought to bare on these contentious issues.
But now, personal animosity threatens to disrupt the flow and lower the standard. I hope I’m wrong, because, so far, I’m finding the last few dozen comments to be very helpful, and the tone to be very pleasing.
Best regards,
Kali
It is possible to claim that I “made stuff up” about “torture”, but to claim that I “made stuff up” about POSSIBLE “torture” is tantamount to claiming that “torture” was IMPOSSIBLE.
Kali, are you asserting that it was impossible that Irving was “tortured”?
Here are the essential facts:
– Irving, an admitted “holocaust” denier travels to Austria in 2005.
– Irving is arrested, “tried”, and sentenced to 3 years in prison
– Irving is released after one year, whereupon he reverses his claims of “no holocaust” and no gas chambers and starts claiming millions of Jews were killed in the Reinhard camps and that Jews were gassed.
– Irving writes a book about his incarceration and never mentions “torture”
Hadding has provided a link to a great 2016 CODOH article where he goes into detail about several of Irving’s questionable assertions and his constant grandstanding. I have long had my doubts about Irving, and Hadding’s article really hit the bullseye as far as I am concerned.
So armed with the evidence from Hadding that Irving has never been above choosing narratives that would promote his career and his book sales, and armed with the knowledge that Irving was released from prison 2 years prematurely and that afterwards Irving dropped his most incendiary claims, it would seem to be a safe bet to me that Irving made a bargain with some branch of Jewish Power. Does a sentence reduction from 3 years to 1 year in exchange for retractions alone represent coercion or “torture”? That I will let you and Yeager decide for yourselves. In my book, using the wiki definition of “torture” that I provided in a comment above, it is my opinion that there was not only the possibility, but also the likelihood, that Irving was “tortured”.
What irks me here is the typical Yeager obsession with minor details that really have little bearing on the discussion or the topic of the thread, which is not about Irving. Instead we end up with a virtual pissing match over dozens of comments about whether Irving’s assertion that Himmler caused Kristalnacht without Hitler’s support, or whether it was a subversive operation by Judea. By natural law we are all allowed our own opinions about the veracity of the Krystalnacht and the holofraud, so logically we are we also allowed our own opinions about the accuracy of the changing assertions made by Irving. Threads like this are made for hashing out these opinions to see which if any can hold water.
Yeager has aggressively attacked Ron Unz, Truth Vigilante, Rurik, and myself for having opinions that differ from hers on what are often minor and unimportant historical areas of dispute. Were it not for Yeager’s obsessive commenting on this thread, I would bet that Rurik and others would be providing their opinions and insight to these discussions, and I would assert that their input would be more valuable. I avoid making any response to her comments because I can never be certain that I won’t face a tirade of insults. Instead we get another thread where Yeager annoys virtually every other contributor with her attitude of superiority and cantankerousness. Carolyn Yeager is a shameless Besserwisser, almost on the same scale as David Irving.
Irving famously said …
That’s good enough for me.
Even Raul HIlberg has admitted there is no evidence linking Hitler to the hoax ….
Video Link
Brosi and Saggy: Must see, especially the 5 or 6 photos in the new article (not the top one). https://www.foxnews.com/politics/top-house-republican-rips-damning-picture-biden-hunter-linked-adviser-2015-ukraine-trip
I commented in my long article about David Irving that the seed of a possible retreat was evident already in 1988, because he tried to minimize controversy by blaming the Holocaust narrative on the British PWE when he knew perfectly well that it was of Jewish origin. He also greatly underestimated how long the controversy would last when he said that thought that the debunking of the gas-chamber story would become mainstream in 5 to 10 years. He was in for a big letdown.
The retreat was evident already with David Irving’s Goebbels in 1996, because it is very derogatory of its subject. It looks like approval-seeking. Ernst Zündel commented (privately) at the time that Irving had been accustomed to living the high life as a famous historian who drove a Rolls Royce, and had embraced Holocaust Revisionism with the expectation that it would be the next big thing in modern historiography, and that he would benefit from having gotten into it early. So now he was trying to show that he was a good boy after all by slamming Hitler’s propaganda-minister.
In other words, David Irving in 1988 saw Holocaust Revisionism as a career-opportunity. He thought that it would end up making him even more famous and respected (and no doubt rich too, ultimately). His motivation was not idealistic.
So, that is why he retreated. It was already happening before the affair in Austria.
Certainly, that seems a safe bet, Brosi, but to assume torture, rather than blackmail, threats, financial reward, fame and fortune, early release, or something else, can only be guesswork underpinned by nothing but speculation, and nothing more than that.
Ron’s comment to Carolyn was unfair and, I think, provocative. Possibly deliberately so.
We all know that “the Yeager woman”, as I used to call here before discovering the extent of her work, investigations and explanations regarding, I believe, all aspects of National Socialist Germany and “Hitlerism”, and a corresponding degree of admiration and respect for her, is finicky about accuracy, and even seemingly (to the layman) “minor” details may induce a “school ma’am” lecture from her.
That said, I also note that she has been much less critical of perceived failings or shortcomings of others in this thread, and it seems to me, is making a real effort to patiently explain her position.
But because she has a reputation for aggressive, and even unfair comments directed at others in past threads, she’s being demonised now. Unfairly.
I’m still exploring her work, and find that it is her “finicky” attention to detail that sets it apart, and makes it an incredibly valuable resource. I only hope others here manage to lay their misgivings (or hurt feelings) aside, as I have, and avail themselves of the great body of work that informs her attitude/finicky attention to detail.
Best regards,
Kali
Interesting. Thank you
I’m currently reading Hitler’s War, and finding it all rather prosaic, and even somewhat non-serious in places Still, Irving knows more about the subject than I do, so I continue reading, albeit with added salt.
I’ll read your piece on him shortly.
With thanks,
Kali
“Thus if I recall correctly, he is the first to have declared after extensively going over German documents that he found not a single one in which Hitler directed the launching of the holocaust….”
Irving attracted attention in 1977 by offering US$1000 to anybody who could produce such a document but he was not the first to notice this absence. Arthur Butz mentioned in The Hoax of the Twentieth Century (1976) that some Israeli researcher had noted it.
JFYI ref Ukraine.
Uncle Shlomo continues to double down.
Alzheimers Patient asks more for the failing Jewish Ukraine bloodbath.
But resistance growing.
https://sputnikglobe.com/20230810/biden-asks-congress-for-13-billion-in-new-ukraine-military-aid-as-opposition-grows-1112520195.html
Meanwhile multiple reports of AFU fails.
Also Heavenly Kingdom made a further decision on Pechersky Lavra.
Follows a recognised Judeo-bolshevik pattern in USSR.
https://www.rt.com/russia/581124-kiev-pechersk-lavra-court/
I thank you for this. Especially
Yes, that is “me”, alright. I was just born that way. Horoscope-wise, I do have very strong planetary influences in Virgo. Hadding has his sun in Virgo; he’s quite particular too. 🙂 Glad you’re back. I did notice your absence.
Perhaps you’ve already done this, I don’t know, but have you by chance compared the Southern Confederacy’s 1861-65 war with the Capitalist United States with Germany’s 1941-45 war with the Communist Soviet Union?
Point by detailed point, from start to finish, the parallels between the two wars are uncanny, including the finale in each war where fraudulent accusations were falsely made against the defeated prostrate foe that planned mass murder of prisoners had taken place involving ‘cattle cars’ and ‘camps’, with the apparent intention in each instance to execute by hanging the top leadership of both countries after show trials had taken place, in the latter case succeeding.
Andersonville (with it’s rail depot) and Auschwitz are the big parallels here, and this within living memory of leaders such as FDR, Churchill, and Stalin.
I’ve posted before the 1870 Atlantic Monthly article linked below, which specifically references ‘Andersonville’ in reference to past alleged ‘atrocities’ against the Jewish people and the possible connection with the unfortunate Anglosphere ideology of British Israelism.
The 1870 article is entitled ‘Our Israelitish Brethren’, which in more modern English would translate as ‘Our Jewish Brothers’.
https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/1870/10/our-israelitish-brethren/306257/
‘Of the giant wrongs to which they [the Jewish people] have been subjected for the last ten centuries,—the huge Andersonville outrages,—few readers need to be reminded.’
You exposed you are suffering from a terminal cognitive deficit disorder by declaring that Irving claiming that more people died in Kennedy’s car than were murdered in gas chambers at Auschwitz does not in the slightest mean Irving was denying the Germans killed any Jews, just that they didn’t use gas chambers to do it.
OP, what you’ve written would be valid IF David Irving said he was a Holohoax revisionist or was working towards that goal.
Irving never hinted he was a revisionist for even one second.
Irving never did the forensics at the alleged gas chambers like a Fred Leuchter (he’d never even visited Auschwitz, Treblinka or any of the other alleged sites that were claimed to be extermination centres, to the best of my knowledge).
Irving had never analysed the logistics of conducting mass extermination or looked into the actuarial studies that extrapolate, based on the hundreds of thousands of ‘Holohoax survivors’ still alive in recent years, that the vast bulk of European Jewry that was interned during the war were obviously not exterminated as claimed by the small hats.
Irving was, first and foremost, a historian.
But he was no ordinary historian. He was the greatest WWII historian that ever lived – and likely will ever live.
I can safely make such a sweeping statement because, unlike the rest, who (for the most part) just read each others history books and then regurgitated secondary and tertiary material, Irving put in the hard yards and spent countless hours scouring the PRIMARY SOURCE documents through the National military archives and related archival storage facilities.
In ADDITION to that, David Irving had access to documents and writings that NO OTHER ENTITY ON THE PLANET had access to, other than the immediate family of the relevant individuals.
Irving was given access to the diaries, private letters and writings of key individuals in the Third Reich by the widows and families of said prominent individual (and indeed of the prominent individuals themselves who survived the war and weren’t executed at Nuremberg).
After Irving’s book ‘The Destruction of Dresden’, the Germans saw for the first time, a truly objective historian that told the whole truth on an important WWII historical event, without embellishment.
They trusted Irving, and no doubt his cause was aided by the fact that he spoke German fluently.
The widows and families thus entrusted the private diaries, letters and such of their husbands to David Irving because they knew he wouldn’t do what the ZOG affiliated ‘historians’ did.
ie: take selective bits out of context and then smear these individuals and the regime with a predetermined narrative.
Now, as you’ve all seen, Carolyn Yeager is bitching and moaning about how David Irving isn’t worthy of being a revisionist, and thus smears him relentlessly.
The fact is, the only reason Irving got dragged into the revisionist space, is because his historical research unearthed evidence that OVERLAPPED with the work of the revisionists.
In other words, after scouring the primary source documents, like the intercepts of German wireless communications that had been decoded with the Enigma machine, Irving noted that there was NO MENTION of extermination camps for the Jews or other undesirables, NOT a SINGLE MENTION in any document that Hitler ordered any liquidation of Jews etc.
The fact of the matter is, it was the revisionists that dragged Irving into this argument.
Obviously Ernst Zündel thought highly enough of Irving to request his appearance at the former’s second trial in 1988.
Lastly, people will say that what I wrote about Irving is just my opinion, and is not shared by others.
Well, I have news for you. Malevolent International Jewry also were well aware that David Irving’s enormous prestige, if associated with the Revisionist movement, could unravel the Holohoax myth.
That’s why they went to extreme lengths in allocating $13 million to the Lipstadt trial, to make sure they could bury and discredit Irving.
I mean, just think about that for one moment. The U.S government allocated a comparable amount ($15 million) towards setting up the 9/11 Commission – the investigation into the greatest act of terrorism on human history.
Make no mistake, ZOG knew full well the importance of David Irving, so they allocated all the resources necessary to destroy him.
So OP, in terms of being able to unravel the Holohoax myth, there has NEVER been any single entity in history that has been ‘more pregnant’ than David Irving, and thus you are not correct to be alleging he has a ‘real flaw’.
As far as I’m concerned, and factoring in all the threats and intimidation he’s no doubt been subjected to over the last four decades (not to mention bankrupting him – Irving lost his prestigious London home in Mayfair), David Irving’s performance has been near flawless.
Yes, and so what. No one produced such a document which was his point. And the real point is that without such a HIGH LEVEL ORDER DOCUMENTING THE IMPLMENTATION FO THE PLAN, IT IS RIDICULOUS TO ASSUME THAT SUCH a plan could have been implemented and the resource for doing it have become available to accomplish.
That was also Butz’s point that it is inconceivable that Speer would have been ignorant of the plan when he was in charge of the entire German armaments program from about 1943 on that would have required him to sign off on all the resources that necessarily would have had to have been diverted from the war effort to accomplish it. Thus he saved his neck by embracing the claim the Germans did it, and just tried to atone for and distance himself from it.
And you are correct that Butz noted that “. . . Dr. Kubovy of the Center of Jewish Documentation in Tel Avid admitted in 1960: ‘there is no document signed by Hitler, or Hydrich speaking of exterminating the Jews the Jews and [. . . ] the word ‘extermination ‘ does not appear in the letter from Goering to Heydrich concerning the final solution of the Jewish question” [i.o.] Arthur R. Butz, The Hoax of the Twentieth Century (Uckfield, UK: Castle Hill Pub;oishers, 2015), p. 41. That some Israeli from a Center in Tel-Avid mentioned this in 1960 that Butz picked up and referenced in his book originally published in 1976 was, of course a well know fact known by all worldwide. The fact is that it was indeed Irving who with his wager brought world wide attention to this issue that fully confirms the point I made that
So all I can say is that with your comment you are trying to pick gnat shit out of pepper that does not do justice to your prior comment in this thread.
Whoever goes through David Irving’s work and cuts out the unsupportable parts will be the greater historian, because the role of imagination and deliberate plot-shaping is significant and does not belong in “real history.”
However, I wrote about David Irving in 2016:
Although I included some criticism of Irving in that article, he liked it enough to post the link on his Radical’s Diary blog.
https://codoh.com/library/document/david-irving-is-not-the-embodiment-of-holocaust/en/
Huh? What a cranky reaction.
Maybe you always knew that persons other than David Irving discovered the lack of documentation for what is now called “the Holocaust,” but for a long time I didn’t know it.
So far as I know David Irving never mentioned Kubovy when he was offering US$1000 for anyone who could find such a document. The stunt would have seemed much less audacious if he had said that the non-existence of such a document had already been established by others.
In fact, Irving strongly implied in his 1977 interview with David Frost that it was his own discovery:
It seems to be another example of David Irving’s false posturing (which it must be if the fact was as “well known” as you say), and if it is that, it implies that he had read Arthur Butz’s The Hoax of the Twentieth Century (published the previous year), which is interesting to know, for assessing his relationship to Holocaust Skepticism.
As TV eloquently pointed out above, and as is described in the wiki definition of torture I linked to above, “blackmail, threats” do constitute a form of “torture”.
Besides, I did not “assume torture”. Here is what I wrote:
Unlike know-it-alls like Yeager and Irving, I don’t think in absolutes. I always think in terms of odds. The odds that Irving was either physically “tortured”, or through “blackmail, threats“, I estimated as being “likely“. In my book “likely” means more than a 50% chance. Again, I stand by that assessment.
Does this mean that “I assume” he was “tortured”? No, because I don’t have to. As I laid out in my comment above, the facts speak for themselves: Irving changed his story after his incarceration.
It was Yeager who originally attacked me via her “torture” strawman. Now you have joined her in trampling this strawman. You go girls. This is the problem with Yeager and this is why I don’t engage with her comments.
Finally, you never addressed my question: “Kali, are you asserting that it was impossible that Irving was “tortured”?”
As you cited what your wrote about Irving in 2016:
In case you missed it, that was my very point by noting Irving was trying to be only a little bit b pregnant with how he addressed the holocaust.
So what did his comment that more people died in Kennedy’s car than were murdered in gas chambers at Auschwitz mean except that he thereby apparently fully subscribes to Butz’s analysis that there were no gas chambers at Auschwitz that were used to murder any Jews. And given that by his Kennedy statement he subscribed fully to that position, how could he be anything but a “holocaust denier” or a full blown “revisionists” that Jews immediately recognized as such and began their campaign to vilify and destroy him as they clearly foresaw that a historian of his stature taking that position fatally threatened their narrative.
So having dipped his toes in the water with his elliptic remark, Irving was astounded by how they began hounding him and then tried to beat a retreat without fully retracting what his research obviously pointed to with respect to the historicity of the holocaust.
That was my point about his trying to be just a little bit pregnant which the holocaust purveyors will not abide. You are either entire with them, or they are entirely against you if you are not.
Thus does CY attack him for failing to be a full blown revisionist that his apparently half-hearted position makes him appear to be. As I see it, her point really is that if you’re in, you might aS WELL BE ALL IN BECAUSE jEWS WON’T LET YOU GET AWAY WITH JUST BEEING A LITTLE BIT PREGNANT.
So if you’re gonna take flak by just flying near the target, you might as well aim for the bull’s eye.
As you cited what your wrote about Irving in 2016:
In case you missed it, that was my very point by noting Irving was trying to be only a little bit b pregnant with how he addressed the holocaust.
So what did his comment that more people died in Kennedy’s car than were murdered in gas chambers at Auschwitz mean except that he thereby apparently fully subscribes to Butz’s analysis that there were no gas chambers at Auschwitz that were used to murder any Jews. And given that by his Kennedy statement he subscribed fully to that position, how could he be anything but a “holocaust denier” or a full blown “revisionists” that Jews immediately recognized as such and began their campaign to vilify and destroy him as they clearly foresaw that a historian of his stature taking that position fatally threatened their narrative.
So having dipped his toes in the water with his elliptic remark, Irving was astounded by how they began hounding him and then tried to beat a retreat without fully retracting what his research obviously pointed to with respect to the historicity of the holocaust.
That was my point about his trying to be just a little bit pregnant which the holocaust purveyors will not abide. You are either entire with them, or they are entirely against you if you are not.
Thus does CY attack him for failing to be a full blown revisionist that his apparently half-hearted position makes him appear to be. As I see it, her point really is that if you’re in, you might aS WELL BE ALL IN BECAUSE jEWS WON’T LET YOU GET AWAY WITH JUST BEEING A LITTLE BIT PREGNANT. sO IF Y
Just for the record, I disagree with what you wrote about me in this comment (#985), mainly bc you link me together with T-V, whom I actually dislike very much bc I judge him to be a slippery character.
In the first sentence, it is your opinion that both we two do not see the flaw in Irving that you do, or in the way you do. There is therefore no reason to bring either of us into your argument at all.
In the second sentence, I am not “lauding” or “denouncing Irving for the vague reasons you give. Again, you may read it that way, that is all. The next time you addressed this same issue, you left me out of it–showing you didn’t need to include me from the beginning.
Thanks.
So, now you’re pretending that you didn’t say this on 10 August:
Then you had the chutzpah to say this the very next day:
Is there more than one person posting as “The Old Philosopher”?
Just stop fussing at me, okay? I corrected you on a fairly obscure point. You don’t have to try to save your reputation by pretending that you already knew or that I am somehow doing you wrong.
Dear Hadding,
I finished reading your essay about Irving this morning, and want to thank you for bringing my attention to it.
I suggest that Mr Unz would also benefit from reading it (hopefully he reads this comment).
I began reading Hitler’s War on Unz’s recommendation, and because it seems a reasonable place for me to begin pulling together so many loose and disparate pieces of information I’ve gathered from my somewhat loose and disparate readings around this subject so far. – As I said yesterday, I’ll continue with the book, though with added (non-kosher) salt.
But I’m pleased to have read your analysis of Irving’s questionable methods, interpretations and motives. Again, thank you
Best regards,
Kali
Hi Carolyn,
I hope to spend more time on this thread tomorrow. For some reason I couldn’t access UR this morning, so now I’m back to playing catch-up, and it’s already way past my bed time!
My dad was a Virgo… with a very warm chuckle for a laugh. When I picture him now he’s always chuckling.
Good night my friend. “See” you tomorrow.
With love,
Kali
Interesting, I had difficulty logging onto unz.com this morning, too.
Tried again at about 2 PM and there was no difficulty then.
The site was down. It had to be down for everyone. It appeared the Cloud “protection team” was on the job. Most websites have that Cloud service since around 10 years ago to protect against such interruptions of service. I do. About $22-23 a month cost. Although it might depend on the size and the kind of attacks, I’m not sure. That’s what I pay, but it takes care of 3 websites.
Responds:
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I guess I either failed at my effort at sarcasms or you failed to grasp the obvious that by referring to “some” center in Tel-Avid disclosing it in 1960 that I also noted must have been “well known” world wide made the contradiction so obvious no one could miss it.
Congratulations. You proved me wrong.
LaRouche does not make the connection between the Phoenicians and Carthage.
LaRouche says “Venice adopted the Roman system,” but Rome rather famously destroyed Carthage.
LaRouche says “a great man, Alexander, destroyed Tyre (the center of the ‘evil’ of Phoenician/Canaanite).
This appears to be so.
LaRouche says the Venetians “imposed evil cults . . .it spread the cult of Aristotle throughout the Mediterranean.”
Aristotle was the teacher of Alexander the Great.
What is this “evil cult of Aristotle” that LaRouche mentions?
LaRouche praises Dante for his efforts against the evil of Venice, (which spread the “evil cult of Aristotle throughout the Mediterranean,” but Dante appears to have held Aristotle in some good regard; it is to Aristotle that Dante refers in Canto IV:
Aristotle’s works, together with those of Plato and Socrates, form the philosophical base of Christianity.
LaRouche may have some interesting things to say about the influence of the Venetians, but his hermeneutic is overtaken by an emotional animus as well as a scattershot presentation.
With all respect, Carolyn, the contention over Irving has de-railed this thread from its core argument; namely, that a parallel exists between the way that FDR & Churchill provoked a war against Germany, and the way that Russia was provoked to war.
The essay linked in comment #969
http://archive.wilsonquarterly.com/sites/default/files/articles/WQ_VOL9_NY_1985_Article_06.pdf
offers extraordinary, but unintended, insight into the perfidy of FDR in “provoking” war against Germany.
The essay quotes FDR:
My understanding of the matter of the “Secret Map” is that FDR used the “threat” that Germany would invade the USA.
Until Pearl Harbor (also engineered by FDR), this was FDR’s first gambit to maneuver the US populace to acquiesce to war.
The essayists wrote:
But Hitler did NOT “pose a threat to the security of the United States;” FDR lied to make the people think that.
With regard to Germany, no casus belli existed; the claim was as phony as “babies being thrown from incubators” or WMD in Iraq.
Your comment merits a complete reply, so let me respond in the order you make your points:
I grnt you he was extraordinary in many respects, foremost being that he actually delved deeply into the records that document what what prompted political figures to act and for what purpose rather than writing history from what amounts to newspaper accounts.
But the holocaust was history and an important part of WWII history that anyone writing about it as he did, particular his two volume Hitler’s War he could hardly ignore if he was going to address the point and purpose of Hitler’s policies and objectives and plans for conducting the war.
Of course he could, like Churchill, Eisenhower, DeGaulle, Montgomery and many other key historical figures have simply ignored the issue.
And Irving certainly did largely ignore it in his writing about WWII. And he never went into a detailed examination of the mechanich of how it was claimed to have been carried out as the revisionist did to refute the credibility of the holocaust narrative.
Except by explicitly declaring that his extensive delving into the archives established there never was a Hitler order for implementing the holocaust, and then offering the prize to anyone who could prove otherwise.
That, as I pointed out, not only put him square into the middle of the debate about it, but was a direct challenge to the credibility of the narrative for the holocaust. And by declaring that more people died in Kennedy’s car that were ever gassed at Auschwitz, he seconded Butz’s point that no Jews were gassed at that camp without his having to bother going over the details of why that was so as Butz did.
* * *
The fact is, the only reason Irving got dragged into the revisionist space, is because his historical research unearthed evidence that OVERLAPPED with the work of the revisionists.
* * *
It’s correct he never went into a detailed examination to challenge the holocaust narrative by refuting that the physical evidence required to prove it waas missing that therefore refuted the entire narrative as Butz did.
But his comment about more people having died in Kennedy’s car than were ever gassed at Auschwitz was in fact a generalized denial of the entire enterprise that was as complete a denial of the narrative as any evidence the revisionists ever compiled to refute it.
That’s why the holocaust purveyors went after as vehemently as did did against any other revisionist.
* * *
That’s precisely why they went after him full force.
* * *
Yes, but then he also backtracked by seeming to confirm the Germans were engaged in an extensive program of killing Jews, especially after he was imprisoned in Austria. That’s what CY holds against him without acknowledging how much his weighing in with his comment on Auschwitz advanced the revisionist argument.
I won’t go that far. There are many flaws in his work.
His biography of Milch is certainly an example. Col. Gen. Theo Osterkamp who commanded JG51 up to the battle of Britain certainly contests vehemently Irving’s almost heroic treatment of Milch that Osterkampf reveals is hardly merited (Milch Irving: Traodie der Luftwaffe? Kritische Bewegungen mit dem Gleichnamigen Werk (Neckargemund, Germ.: Kurt Vorwinkel Verlag, 1971).
AS they put it on the flyleaf of the book, “Irving/Milch see the tragedy above all in the failure of the aircrews, thus the men who on the outside led, fought and fell.”
The best example of this is Irving citing Milch that “‘if one sees how the first He177 flew on 20 November 1939, and that the aircraft are still not in service, one can only weep’ said Milch at the end of 1942.. . .The principal delay to the He 177 had been caused by the basic requirement that it should be able to dive-bomb. It was tempting to blame Udet for this . . . Milch refused to blame a dead man now” (p. 170)
But a more lunatic idea than requiring that a four-engined bomber to be able to dive-bomb could hardly be imagine. Udet was indeed not the person to be blamed because he was subordinated to Milch in the air ministry. It was Milch who was in a position to stop the madness of turning of four-engined plane into a dive bomber, but he didn’t and instead avoided his responsibility to stop Udet’s madness of turning four engined planes into dive-bombers and by thereby failing to equip air crews with the appropriate weapons they needed to fight the war effectively.
Milch was evading his own responsibility for his failure by ducking behind purporting to stand up for subordinates in a totally false sense of loyalty to incompetence that redounded against Milch that Irving ignores.
It’s when I read stuff like that the Irving’s star wanes in my sight.
Versailles was the symptom, not the problem. The problem is essentially Tikkun Olam, a Talmudic principle that allows Jews to lie, cheat, steal, and manipulate in order to subvert and conquer the countries that their hosts built.
((Yuri Slezkine)) indirectly describes some of this in his book The Jewish Century
I am reading it now, but this section from pg. 53-54 really illustrates why Hitler would want to eliminate the presence of malignant Jews throughout Germany:
Hitler did not want war. Roosevelt, Churchill and Stalin did, and they mostly wanted war because that is what their secret ((benefactors)) wanted. Judea had already declared war on Germany in 1933 anyway.
Hitler wanted Germany united and he wanted to eliminate the malign Jewish control. He didn’t want any Germans to die to achieve that. He wanted the Jews to leave Germany so badly he was even willing to let them take their stolen loot with them.
Even if the Jews controlling the drafting and signing of the Versailles treaty had allowed a fair and just settlement that fulfilled Wilsons 14 promises, Judea would have kept trying to incite WWII, even for centuries, until they achieved their Tikkun Olam goals. Using the modern Jewish vernacular, the Jews would have kept creating division and animosity between the European countries and peoples “for as long as it takes” using “whatever it takes”.
Well, Brosi, if my original comment, addressed to Ron, had been a critique of your or anyone elses specific input, then you may have a point.
But my comment was to highlight the unfairness of Ron’s attack on Carolyn.
Carolyn had objected to the speculative assumptions of torture (in whatever form) because she prefers that we stick to what is actually known, and what can be reasonably infected from that. That is her nature, her right and central to her own work.
What you wrote wasn’t the point of my comment. What Ron wrote was. I wasn’t debating the cause of Irving’s change of position, I was trying to articulate what I saw as Carolyn’s perspective.
That’s all.
Go back and read what I wrote. The answer to your question is there.
Best regards,
Kali
Here’s what I wrote, Brosi:
As you can see, I make no such assertion, (that torture was impossible) and leave the question open. Because none of us know what actually happened.
Kali.
Brosi writes:
And he adds:
Brosi is not distinguishing between the past and the future when he speaks of “odds”. Or “thinking in terms of odds.”
The past has already happened and is a fact. It is not open to speculation, is not still a gamble. It can be discovered by the evidence it left behind. Every honest, educated person knows what evidence is. This is what Revisionism is based on.
The future, otoh, can be speculated upon, since it has not yet happened. Figuring the odds of ‘this’ vs ‘that’ is possible, based on what is known, including previous similar experiences & events.
Brosi seems unaware of this distinction, bc it runs through all his comments on this site. What I have been calling “conspiracy theorizing” based on assumptions, he calls “thinking in terms of the odds” based on knowledge of past events.” Can he grasp that a different approach is necessary when dealing with the past than with the future? Or is he too stubborn?
At this point, Irving was either tortured or he wasn’t. Find out. Don’t speculate.
#967 Hadding
Hamlet the Braveheart:
“Be affraid of scared Germans. When Germans are scared they can start to kill everybody in neighbourhood in preemptive attack.” *
“Belgium exists to be invaded. “
Germany exists only to be destroyed.
” France and Britain declared war on Germany (…)”
… 3 days after Germany attacked their ally – Poland. What a surprise!
“If you look at a map of Großdeutschland from 1942 you see that in central Europe only traditionally German lands were annexed. “
I didn’t know that Poznan, Warsaw or Cracow were ancient German lands. Do you suggest that people who speak only Polish are Germans?
” But, one way or another Hitler wanted to make Ukraine into a reliable food-source for Germany, (…)”
So, you accept that if someone bigger than Germany want Germany tranform into multi-culti sh*t country this is according to the rule that “stronger can do whatever wants”.
—
* Achtung! Nur für Deutsche Readers – that was a joke.
Agree.
We know this to be absolutely True because Judea is still “trying to achieve their Tikkun Olam goals” “for as long as it takes,” using “whatever it takes.”
(I>(It started with Rome, if not with Egypt and Persia)
Iraq
Iran
Syria
Lebanon
Libya
Ukraine
— the near-total subversion of US federal administration
Yes yes, it is true that many, many non-Jews spearheaded and benefited from the above wars.
Years ago I heard a lecturer on Assyrian history describe how an Assyrian general maneuvered the leader of an enemy state into conquering another state, that conquered state being an enemy that the Assyrians dearly wished to be vanquished.
The lecturer quipped, “A smart general lets someone else do his fighting for him.”
Judea was conquered by Assyria; not at all implausible that some of the same strategies would have been adopted. (Also not at all unlikely that Judeans and Assyrians intermarried. Add that to the Khazar thesis.)
USA (and UK) have been Judea’s willing b***h for decades.
Judea used Russia to destroy Germany (see Benjamin Ginsberg, How Jews Defeated Hitler)
Germany chose not to be Judea’s b***h..
Read: “Polish Atrocities Against the German Minority in Poland”.
Germany marched into Poland to stop that. What business was this to the Brits, French, and Yanks?
Unless, of course, the latter three wanted war at any price.
Okay CY, you are the expert, I don’t pretend that I am one. Prove that Irving wasn’t tortured.
My best ‘proof’ is that Irving never uttered even a hint that such a thing occurred or played a role in his decisions. You can say (as T-V did or it might have been you, or both) that the deal made for his freedom was that he had to remain totally mum about such a thing, but that is NOT convincing. If you think you can convince anyone of that, then describe/explain the process in more detail, rather than just making an empty claim or suggestion.
Hadding has discussed in comment #992 to Kali how Irving was showing signs of retreat from a firm revisionist position well before his adventure in Austria, and especially in his book Goebbels (1996). He didn’t have to be forced or bribed away from the facts assembled by the Revisionists up to that time. Irving’s #1 concern, as I see it, was always the sale of his books and his reputation as a major British historian, and that required the cooperation of Big Jewry.
So there was simply no need for your unfounded theory of torture, whether mental or physical, to be the cause of Irving’s new positions, especially on the gassing/murder [by Himmler] at the Action Reinhardt camps, which Revisionism denies and for which there is no supporting evidence.
Yes, compared to you I am “the expert.” You resent it, don’t like it, but you can’t change it.
LOL. Höss also signed a confession that he gassed 4 million Jews at Auschwitz and “never uttered even a hint” that he was tortured.
Dear Every-One,
I come in peace. 📿
You all know that I’m quite ignorant of the main subjects of this discussion. – Which is not to say that I don’t have my own opinions and perspectives, which I’ll continue to share at my discretion, and my own risk, as I hope all will continue to do
Here I want to make a serious point about the importance of responding to another’s comments (as opposed to reacting to them) in an adult manner.
Of course we all “react” to certain comments, but as adults we have the capacity to pause and reflect, and to get our egos out of the way, in order to deepen understanding.
I can see, so clearly, that Carolyn Yeager is doing that. She is not attacking anyone gratuitiously, and is only responding, with reason, fussy as some may find her, and she finds herself, to assertions made by others … and whatnot (inserted for the pendants amongst us).
Earlier in the thread, Carolyn suggested what amounted to a “Moderation Policy”, (as I subsequently referred to it). I’m afraid I don’t recall the specific words she used, but nonetheless I see that ever since she made that comment, the spirit of which is, I hope, us contained in this one, she has made all effort to adhered to its principles.
Because, I think, she is adult enough to recognise the importance of our dialogues. – Not to get bogged down in personality cults, popularity contests, vitriol (except deliberately 😆), and other such empty, ego-gratifying… noise. – Valid observations of others possible motives … and whatnot, notwithstanding. 🧐
Also, I think she understands that there are things unknowable to us at this moment, so rather that hang around speculating (chewing gum?) we can move the conversation forward, whilst leaving a given thread open.
SELF MODERATION, (because we are adults -or aspire to be?) is what we have available to us in this free, open space.
[Thank you for it Ron Unz!! – Inevitable data harvesting ops notwithstanding. This place is a treasured gift to many.]
Self Moderation: also known as adulthood.
I didn’t intend this comment to be about Carolyn, but it seems to me that her contribution over the last couple of hundred comments or so, exemplify what I want to say.
Anyone baring a grudge against her for past conversations, I hope will look closer (inside and outside) to see what’s happening Now, and respond to that rather than drag such baggage along with them, ready to react to something that is already past.
Maybe we can all (who are not trolls) improve our commenting standards.****
With love,
Kali
**Plus, imagine having her on your side in a fight! 🔥😅
****unless we’re having fun trolling trolls, or cracking our skulls in attempting (the impossible*) to influence Influencer$.
(*Whilst taking advantage of the opportunity to raise awareness and increase understanding.)
**** or risk leaving Slave-World as our legacy.
P.S. Spotty internet is a hazard of off-grid living, and means I can’t always comment immediately… Like now. 😶🌫️ For that and other reasons, please forgive my sporadic involvement here.
#1023 HdC
“Read: “Polish Atrocities Against the German Minority in Poland”.”
I don’t like hf (historical-fiction).
What about well documented German atrocities?
What about well documented Canadian atrocities against Natives?
I know that August is a harvest time and you are busy, but did you find a little time to read
“ABRIDGED VERSION THE REPORT ON THE LOSSES SUSTAINED BY POLAND AS A RESULT OF GERMAN AGGRESSION AND OCCUPATION DURING THE SECOND WORLD WAR, 1939-1945”
https://instytutstratwojennych.pl/en/abridged-war-report
$1.3 trillion reparation for Poland from germany is still pending.
Speaking of torture committed by the Anglo-Zionists (which was the main reason I ever brought up the possibility that Irving was tortured)
Since CY, as usual, insists on beating her straw man, I will repeat what I wrote in my original comment:
Does the mere threat of having your testicles crushed, which Irving well knew was what the English had inflicted on hundreds of German officers, constitute “torture”. Does other lesser threats, such as a lifetime in prison, or anal rape, constitute “torture”. What is the exact line between coercion and torture? This reminds me of the recent statement made before the Australian Parliament by the Covid experts that “no one in Australia was forced to get vaccinated”.
I will let the “expert” Carolyn Yeager explain, based on her experience while serving in the military and facing these kinds of threats, what exactly is the difference between coercion and torture.
During a trip to the Bavarian royal castles, many years ago, we stayed in a small guesthouse on Lake Starnberg where King Ludwig drowned. Our landlady was from Munich and had experienced the bombing as a child. We talked about that terrible time and she told us that her father had been a bricklayer and had to build the ovens in the Dachau concentration camp. That was in 1949, on the orders of the American occupation.
> Read: “Polish Atrocities Against the German Minority in Poland”.
Mostly just propaganda from the Third Reich.
“A … Central Office … was set up under Kurt Lueck and Karl Berger … Their files … contain 5,437 names… Hitler soon seized upon exaggerated estimates of the number of dead (13,000) and missing (45,000); he combined them and then made everyone adhere to the total of 58,000. The Lueck-Berger file was found in Poznan in 1945 and used by Pospieszalski to discredit the 58,000 figure. He reckoned that even 5,437 was an exaggerated count, since it included some who were missing only temporarily as well as about a thousand Polish German soldiers, who were listed whether deaths were due to Poles or to the Wehrmacht… Peter Aurich … studying the same evidence a decade later … contends that between 4,000 and 5,000 members of the German minority … died as a result of popular violence in September 1939.”
–Richard Blanke, Orphans of Versailles, pp. 235-6.
A good rule to follow whenever considering any Third Reich propaganda made against Poland in 1939 is to always chop down the alleged charges to at most 10% of whatever is alleged. So, if Hitler makes a claim of 58,000 then you can right away start by reducing this to something closer to 5,000.
There is no equivalence whatsoever between Rudolf Hoess in 1945-6 and David Irving in 2005-6, 50 years later. That is a ludicrous comparison and you should truly be ashamed of it, but apparently you’re incapable of shame.
It was not the Austrians who crushed testicles. They are a lot more civilized than the American conquerors in the immediate postwar period.
Yes, well, there were no “ovens” (cremation furnaces) in Treblinka, Belzec or Sobibor. There were in Auschwitz-Birkenau, of course.
I visited the Dachau memorial camp in 2009. It was a beautiful sunny day and a peaceful rural setting. It felt spacious and benign. Walking back from seeing the crematorium alongside a couple of younger men, I exclaimed what a lovely place it was. They were scandalized, but nice about it.
Then you have NO PROOF at all. What you have Carolyn is LESS than speculation – seeing as a lot of speculative guesses are extrapolated from solid evidence.
No one gives a rat’s arse if you find it convincing or not.
What we DO KNOW is that Malevolent International Jewry went out of their way to take Irving down (eg: allocating $13 million towards the Lipstadt trail), like they have done to NO ONE BEFORE OR SINCE amongst revisionists or historians, with perhaps Ernst Zündel being a close second.
And to that end, it is not credible that ZOG would not initiate threats/intimidation against David Irving (amounting to psychological torture that caused him extreme anxiety and anguish), to achieve their desired outcome.
Hey old friend. Sorry for my late reply, am too busy nowadays. The Indian economy is heating up for some strange reason and that means loads and loads of work lately.
Wow thanks, bud. What is the Twitter A/c? Anyways thank you very much in helping spread truth.
I promise, I will.
Yeah, thanks.
The Mau Mau, was not a simple case “of wanting Brits out”, it was terrorism by members of a few tribes (primarily the Kikuyu) who committed brutal acts of violence on other black African tribesmen too. Britain actually backstabbed the White settlers on the highlands of Kenya and left the place. Most of the African colonies were too expensive to maintain and after losing India, the Empire made less sense. Also, the USA and the USSR both wanted the end of the British Empire and also the traitors back home in London. Militarily the British could have easily kept their Empire in Africa. So could the other European powers but all were backstabbed by traitors back home. The British elites would later backstab the Rhodesians and give the nation to Communist thug Mugape who ruined the place up. The French elites pulled the rug under the pied noirs in Algeria even after the French military had defeated the FLN.
There have been very few cases of people driving an European / Japanese Imperial power out of Empire using military/ terror means. Few examples are the American Revolution (got loads of help from France and Spain without which success would be difficult), the revolution in South America against the Spanish Empire like that of Simon Bolivar (where British mercenaries did most of the heavy fighting against the Imperial Spanish forces) and the Vietnamese defeat of the French in Dien Bien Phu.
But worth remembering is that British (plus Indian) forces along with released French POWs (plus French 5th Colonial Infantry Regiment (RIC) commandos) and surrendered Japanese soldiers of the Southern Expeditionary Army Group, under an interim British administration of Major General Douglas Gracey, commander of the 20th Indian Infantry Division, had brought order to Vietnam right after WW2, forcing the Viet Mihn to scale down attacks after taking heavy casualties, thus gaining control over Vietnam to an extent, both the French and Americans failed to do later.
Austria, part of Germany during WWII, has lately shown a large degree of intestinal fortitude by resisting ZOG’s demands that all the western fiefdom’s provide munitions, sanctions, aid and credit guarantees for the latest war by Judea for their Heavenly Jerusalem project, but Austria is still just another cog in ZOG’s genocidal Coudenhove-Kalergy project. However, after the Zündel trial, ZOG was clearly gunning for Irving. That Jewish Power was able to coerce Austria to issuing an arrest warrant for Irving already shows the they were in a thrall to ZOG.
As I wrote in a comment above, it don’t think that it would have been prison guards who would have “tortured” or coerced Irving, rather it would have been the fellow inmates who physically harmed him, if the “torture” had been physical. These inmates could quite easily also have passed threats, either written or verbal, on to Irving. ((Visitors)) could have provided even more motivation for Irving’s retractions.
If Irving hadn’t been “tortured”, or coerced by threats, why would he have recanted about gas chambers? Once he was out of Austrian prison and outside of the country, he could easily have just recanted his recantation. But instead he stuck to his gas chambers flip flop and alienated the readers that had made him rich. It seems to me that a taste of Jewish Power had finally instilled the fear of Yahweh in him.
Austria is an interesting case here. In 1938 we have Anschluss of Austria in March, liberation of the Sudetan Germans from Czech persecution in September, and then Krystallnacht in 1938. It was the Austrian’s overwhelming embracement of Hitlers movement to free Greater Germany from Jewish depravity and corruption that made them a target for specially harsh Jewish treatment at the end of the war, which would explain why Stalin his Red Rapist Army was allowed to take over Vienna.
So my question to you, Hadding, is do you believe what Irving wrote about Krystallnacht? Do you think Hitler coordinated it? Or do you think this was Jewish retribution for Anschluss and the Munich Agreement?
So, according to you the Germans always lied and everybody else always told the unvarnished truth. Got it.
Not even Churchill believed this when he wrote about the truthfulness of propaganda in Germany and the democratic countries.
Because he wanted to sell books again, duh. That’s the basic motivation for Irving. If you read his book “Banged-Up” you would see he refers to that all the time — his books, his ability to produce books. He said he became content in prison because his writing (on the Himmler book) was going well and, you know, the wife & child could take care of themselves.
He did recant some of it. He was giving a somewhat confused version of things for awhile, but then settled on the Aktion Reinhardt gassings narrative. He thought he could pin it on Himmler–this is Irving the author back in charge now. He foresaw another big victory, and big sales to recoup his losses.
Bc you’re hung up on ZOG you see everything through that lens. But Irving wasn’t hung up on ZOG. I already understand him far better than you do, after reading only one book by him. I have watched, in the past, a lot of his video presentations however.
See my comment #1040.
If that were the case, TV, surely he’d recant, under duress of torture/threats/intimidation…, and then exist public life, rather than consciously lying, against his own will, on such an important topic, to a worldwide audience for years to come?
What would you do in similar circumstances if you were an honest historian? (Rhetorical question: food for thought.)
Best regards,
Kali
Once Irving said more people died in Kennedy’s car than were gassed at Auschwitz, the Zionist put him in a zugzwang from which there was no escape.
I don’t believe anyone can really judge how Irving responded without standing in his shoes, and no one comment about it in this thread has ever been within miles of where he stood in them
Hadding has already made a very strong case that Irving’s “honesty” is for sale at the right price.
Jewish Power is a formidable opponent. They caused 17 million deaths in WWI in order to destroy the Ottoman, German, Austrian and Russian Empires and to form their Zionist Empire starting with the conquest of Palestine. Then they started WWII and caused probably 100 million deaths in order to get the UN formed and Israel recognized.
The real problem here is that no goyim knows for sure who is at the top of the Talmudic pyramid, and the Christian hating monster has many, many tentacles. Take this article from the horses mouth as an example:
B’nai Brith Advocacy Leads to Criminal Convictions for Holocaust Deniers
Talmudic vengeance seeks out victims across the globe to make examples of. It is funny how Yeager hasn’t been silenced or put behind bars, despite having travelled to Germany….
Official list of Revisionist scholars persecuted / imprisoned for questioning the “Holocaust”
LOL. The Holocaust “expert” Carolyn Yeager isn’t on this list…
1985 (Germany) Thies Christophersen – served one year of a one and a half year prison sentence
Sep. 1987 (France) Jean-Marie Le Pen – fine of €183,000
Nov. 1991 (United Kingdom) Fred Leuchter – arrested and deported
Oct. 1992 (Germany) Otto Ernst Remer – 22 month imprisonment, which he avoided by fleeing to Spain in February 1994
Oct. 28, 1993 (Germany) Fred Leuchter – arrested, but released on bail. He left Germany before being put on trial
Feb. 27, 1998 (France) Roger Garaudy – 6 months imprisonment (suspended), ₣240,000 (€37,500) – fine
Dec. 12, 1996 (Germany) Udo Walendy – sentenced twice: 15 months, and 14 months prison – without parole
Jul. 21, 1998 (Switzerland) Jürgen Graf – 15 months’ imprisonment (fled Switzerland to avoid sentence)
Jul. 21, 1998 (Switzerland) Gerhard Förster – 12 months’ imprisonment, disgorgement
Apr. 8, 1999 (Australia) Fredrick Töben – 7 months’ imprisonment Mannheim, Germany – retrial – 2011 indefinitely stayed by judge Dr Meinerzhagen
May 27, 1999 (France) Jean Plantin – 6 months’ imprisonment (suspended), fine, damages
Jun. 1999 (Germany) Jean-Marie Le Pen – Fine of €6,000
Dec. 7, 1999 (Poland) Dariusz Ratajczak – One year probation, dismissed from university teaching position, banned from all Polish universities for 3 years
Apr. 11, 2000 (Switzerland) Gaston-Armand Amaudruz – 1 year imprisonment, damages
Jun. 9, 2004 (France) Vincent Reynouard – 24 months’ imprisonment, of which 18 months were suspended, plus €3,000
Feb. 20, 2006 (Austria) David Irving – 3 years’ imprisonment. Released and deported after serving 13 months
Mar. 15, 2006 (Germany) Germar Rudolf – 2½ years’ imprisonment
Oct. 3, 2006 (France) Robert Faurisson – €7,500 fine, 3 months’ probation
Feb. 15, 2007 (Germany) Ernst Zündel – 5 years’ imprisonment
Nov. 8, 2007 (France) Vincent Reynouard – 1 year imprisonment and a €10,000 fine
Jan. 14, 2008 (Austria) Wolfgang Fröhlich – 6 years’ imprisonment (third offence)
Jan. 15, 2008 (Germany) Sylvia Stolz – 3½ years’ imprisonment
Jun. 19, 2008 (Belgium) Vincent Reynouard – 1 year imprisonment and €25,000 fine
Oct. 1 – Nov. 19, 2008 (Germany) Fredrick Töben – London extradition to Mannheim, Germany, on European Arrest Warrant issued by Germany, failed
Mar. 11, 2009 (Germany) Horst Mahler – 5 years’ imprisonment
Apr. 27, 2009 (Austria) Gerd Honsik – 5 years’ imprisonment, later reduced to four years
Aug. 15 – Nov. 12, 2009 (Australia) Fredrick Töben – 3 months’ imprisonment for contempt of court
Oct. 23, 2009 (Germany) Dirk Zimmerman – 9 months’ imprisonment
Oct. 27, 2009 (Germany) Richard Williamson – €12,000 fine [later overturned]
Feb. 6, 2011 (Germany) Günter Deckert – 5 month imprisonment for translating Carlo Mattogno’s ‘Auschwitz – The First Gassings’ into German
Jan. 31, 2013 (Hungary) Gyorgy Nagy – 18-month suspended jail sentence
Feb. 11, 2015 (France) Vincent Reynouard – 2 years imprisonment and €4,500 fine
May 7, 2015 (France) Vincent Reynouard – 2 months imprisonment
Nov. 12, 2015 (Germany) Ursula Haverbeck – 10 months’ imprisonment
Nov. 4, 2016 (France) Vincent Reynouard – 5 month imprisonment, €4,000 fine
May 5, 2018 (Germany) Alfred Schaefer – €5,000 fine
May 8, 2018 (Germany) Ursula Haverbeck – 2 years’ imprisonment
Oct. 26, 2018 (Germany) Monika Schaefer – 10 months’ imprisonment
May 23, 2019 (Germany) Sylvia Stolz – 18 months’ imprisonment
Sept. 18, 2020 (France) Hervé Ryssen – 17 months’ imprisonment
Nov. 25, 2020 (France) Vincent Reynouard – 4 months’ imprisonment
Dec. 4, 2020 (Germany) Ursula Haverbeck – 1 years’ imprisonment
#1039 HdC
You have no evidences my dear Heavily dumb Canadian (HdC).
Your grandparents must be a member of Einsatzgrouppen who killed children to make Lebensraum for Germans and then escaped to Canada to avoid prison.
Soon, your dream will become true, you will live in nazi-land …
Canada – such beautiful country in hands of morons.
Of course Hitler did not coordinate Kristallnacht. Who suggests that? Irving blames Goebbels. Blaming “the evil men around Hitler” is Irving’s usual story-line.
From a German perspective it made no sense at all, because Hitler had shown willingness to work with other governments to solve the Jewish problem.
Weckert suggests that that Kristallnacht was a false-flag operation done to create sympathy for Zionism. This makes a lot of sense, because of the timing.
Jewish migration to Palestine had been sharply restricted since late 1937 and in October 1938 the British government began floating the idea of giving Palestine to the Arabs. The very day before Kristallnacht, on 8 November 1938, it was reported that an Arab negotiator in London declared that Arab resistance would cease if Jewish immigration were ended.
https://tinyurl.com/2fy4wb2t
Mossad already existed, basically for the purpose of smuggling Jews. It seems that the Zionists even had operatives or friends in the German foreign ministry in 1939 who tried to sabotage negotiations that would enable Jews to go elsewhere than Palestine. The Zionists had capabilities. So, Weckert’s theory is not so far-fetched as one might suppose.
Your ability to misconstrue is remarkable.
Germany is an organic nation-state. Belgium is not. There is no Belgian identity. I know about Belgium because I used to have a Belgian girlfriend. Everybody in that country knows that it is artificial. It was created as a buffer-state — and allied with Britain so that Britain would have pretexts for military intervention on the Continent. This is why I say: Belgium was made to be invaded.
After many provocations and refusal to negotiate.
Warsaw and Cracow were in the General Government, which was not annexed to Germany. It was a protectorate, and Hitler tried to make the General Government into a new Polish state. This was part of his peace-proposal to Britain and France in early 1940. He offered the premiership to a former Polish prime minister, Wincenty Witos, who refused.
Posen (“Poznan”) was an important city of Imperial Germany prior to the First World War. In general, only lands that had previously been part of Germany were annexed under Hitler. This reality contrasts very sharply with the stupid assumption that all occupied zones were intended for annexation.
I think that the brutal reality of a struggle for survival among nations was a lesson that the Entente imparted to Germany from 1914 to 1919, and Adolf Hitler learned that lesson. Mein Kampf is full of lessons that Hitler learned by observing the enemy’s methods in the First World War. Hitler therefore was less naive than Kaiser Wilhelm II had been — although, I have to say, still much more of a gentleman than the enemy leaders that he ultimately faced.
Well, I think we’re just going around in circles, but I suppose I should respond to your comment, repeating something I’d already said far upthread.
The Weckert article had come up early in this discussion and I’d read it, not being very impressed with the quality of her research or her analysis. Without providing any solid evidence, she suggested that in 1938 a secret network of Jewish Zionist agents had gained control over numerous SA units all across Nazi Germany and launched the Kristallnacht attacks as a false-flag operation for the reasons you say. That seems extremely implausible to me, the sort of wild speculation that gives “conspiracy theories” a bad name.
https://www.ihr.org/jhr/v06/v06p183_Weckert.html
However, interestingly enough, she included this important sentence in the middle of her very long article:
So unlike you and Weckert, Hitler himself believed that Goebbels had orchestrated the attacks, just as Irving later argued. Since Hitler had total control over the investigative resources of Nazi Germany and a strong incentive to get the bottom of what had happened, wouldn’t you agree that he probably had the best idea of who was actually responsible?
As to who instigated the whole thing, there is the following reference by by the Polish ambassador of Poland to France of a report dated December 17, 1938 included in the German white papers on Poland that had been reached on December 6th for improving relations between France and Germans:
“When he left at the end of October for Warsaw, Minister Bonnet informed me that the signature and publication of the accord were imminent. But this assumption was not realized for two reasons: one was the difficulty in reaching an accord on the text; and the other reason was the assassination of an attache in the German embassy in Paris, causing a suspension for two weeks. ”
That the assassination that triggered Krystallnacht apparently at least delayed the signing of the according suggest ulterior hidden motives were at work for staging a false flag operation for triggering the pogrom that followed.
The accord was actually signed on December 6. The assassination certainty set the stage for triggering the pogrom that smeared Germany just after the Munich accords were signed..
Do you have any evidence that ‘Hitler believed that Goebbels had orchestrated the attacks’ other than David Irving and the woman you think so poorly of (Weckert) saying so?
You forgot to say that Weckert’s book, Flashpoint (in English), which is her major work on the subject of Kristallnacht, which she put a lot of time & effort into, does not say a word about who Hitler believed orchestrated the attacks. Hadding might not be aware of that.
And I still suggest the possibility that that sentence in her TALK to the IHR conference was a loose remark, which was then published by the IHR as an article (during the time when the magazine had no editor).
Sure, there are some very suspicious aspects of the assassination and it seems quite likely to me that Jewish activist groups could have organized it for exactly the reasons you suggest. They would have hoped that the assassination of an important German diplomat in Paris, perhaps provoking German retaliation of some sort, would disrupt German-French relations. There’s nothing implausible about that theory.
But that’s very different than the wild speculation that Jewish activists had secretly gained control of numerous SA units all across Nazi Germany and manipulated them as part of some plot.
This is a strawman argument. Weckert does not claim that they were “Jewish Zionist agents [who] had gained control over numerous SA units“.
The various assassination attempts on Hitler also prove that there were forces that were so set on killing Hitler that they would risk facing the wrath of the Gestapo. Zionists were still cooperating with the NSDAP through the Havaara agreements, and did not totally abandon the NSDAP until after Stalingrad in 1943.
Many Prussian Burgers (aristocracy) wanted to see Hitler fail, and there were also all those hundreds of highly secretive Masonic lodges, protected by oaths and threats of horrible deaths, that Hitler had started closing in 1935 who could well have been trying to defame the NSDAP and foment a confrontation between the Zionists and the NSDAP.
Weckert also describes how the Krystallnacht narrative is based on the IMT testimony of SA Chief of Staff Viktor Lutze who was very LIKELY tortured (that’s for you, Kali):
Once again I will assert that the Talmudic Nuremberg Tribunals were a complete sham and a mistrial. Not only were they centered around torture, but also forged documents and doctored photographs provided by Judeo-Bolshevics focused on projection onto Germany and the covering up their own war crimes and crimes against humanity. Every single verdict that came out of the IMT are far, far less reliable than what Weckert writes.
#1047 Hadding
“Germany is an organic nation-state. “
Germany was invented by Bismarck in 1871.
Before that date there were over 300 independend German-speaking entities (Kleinestaaterei).
I don’t know how many times I must repeat this simple fact.
“After many provocations and refusal to negotiate.”
Earlier Hitler violated international pacts by militarization of Germany, taking Saar Region and conquest of Czechoslovakia.
“Warsaw and Cracow were in the General Government, which was not annexed to Germany.”
+1 point for you. I specially mixed cities from area directly incorporated into Germany after 1939 called Warthegau* with cities from General Government** (Warsaw, Cracow).
Now, explain me, why Germans occupied Warsaw and Cracow when there were no German minority?
“Posen (“Poznan”) was an important city of Imperial Germany prior to the First World War.”
The city was founded in X century by Slavs and have been pure Polish city until German occupation in XIX century.
Poznań is a Polish city.
Do you know that Berlin, Dresden, Leipzig are cities founded by Slavs?
Berlin – is from Slavic “bralin” (swamp)***
Dresden – is from Slavic “derewo/drzewo” (tree)****
Leipzig – is from Slavic “lipa” (lime tree) *****
Here you have a map of Slavic settlements in Germany from VIII century stretching to Elbe river.
It is even called “Germania Slavica”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germania_Slavica
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sorbian_March
So, where are your ancient German territories?
Most of Eastern Germans are germanized Slavs.
—
* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reichsgau_Wartheland
** https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Government
*** “Typical Germanized place name suffixes of Slavic origin are -ow, -itz, -vitz, -witz, -itzsch and -in, prefixes are Windisch and Wendisch. The name Berlin has its roots in the language of West Slavic inhabitants of the area of today’s Berlin, and may be related to the Old Polabian stem berl-/birl- (“swamp”).”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berlin
**** “Although Dresden is a relatively recent city that grew from a Slavic village (…)”
***** “The name Leipzig is ultimately derived from the Slavic designation for basswood (AE) or lime trees (BE) (German: Linden).”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germania_Slavica
Good morning Brosi.
True. Though quite how the Talmudists manage to force someone to remain in the public eye, and apparently cheerfully so, eludes me.
As you know, I’m currently reading Hitler’s War, and I have to say, though of course it contains facts derived from primary source data which are of significant value and importance, I’m finding Irving’s writing style unhelpful, and even silly in places. Not to mention he tends to jump around the timeline in places.
When it comes to historiography, I much prefer John Wear’s “matter of fact” style, even though his work is founded in secondary sources. It’s much easier on the noggin! (THANKS JOHN, if you’re reading.)
Given her body of work on the matter, including books, translations, blogs, podcasts, collaborations, etc, the obvious implication of your remark seems misplaced.
Could it be that, as with Ron, Carolyn also induces the “Voldemort effect”, in that the Talmudists would rather not draw attention to her?
Irving was already world famous before travelling to Austria, where there was an arrest warrant issued for him, so it’s unsurprising that he was made an example of.
————-
Unrelated: I found a link on https://carolynyeager.net/ to a sweet little archive site: https://wintersonnenwende.com/scriptorium/english/archives/caseforgermany/cfg02.html (This link opens to another book I’m currently reading, coming from exactly the perspective I was searching for. Published just months before the outbreak of war, it offers an unbiased perspective on Hitler and the Reich, from a a Scotsman who travelled to Germany to find out for himself what was really happening there.). THANK YOU CAROLYN!!
Best regards,
Kali
Thank you, Ron, for the link to Ingrid Weckert’s IHR article.
It is hugely interesting for many details around Herschel Grynszpan, who assassinated Ernst vom Rath, and the six different accounts he gave to authorities.
I only knew the bare bones that Grynszpan/Gruenspan shot vom Rath.
And this (apparently spontaneously) ignited Kristallnacht. Hmm …
This paper is immensely interesting. Thank you.
“Truth Will Out”.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viktor_Lutze
Lutze died in a car crash in 1943. He didn’t make it to Nuremberg. Tortured or not.
Kristallnacht did damage Germany’s reputation, with people like Charles Lindbergh wondering what the German authorities were playing at. However, virtually every building in Germany and Austria connected with Jews went up in smoke, and officially, 91 Jews were killed. Somebody did it. Maybe the Jews did this to themselves. Or maybe it was a government that operated under the slogan “The Jews are our misfortune”?
No speculation is necessary that the event was carefully planned because it was widespread and initiated practically immediately after the assassination which is impossible unless the plan to do so had been carefully planned long before the event that launched it that the planners must have known would occur because they also planned the assassination.
It’s like the assassination of the Archduke that was planned long before the event and implemented when the British had everything ready to go to launch WWI.
This is a strawman if I ever saw one. Now you’re sounding like the “conspiracy theorists” and “crackpots” that you are so critical of in these comment threads.
You took a quick read of I. W.’s published talk at a conference, and you feel qualified to dismiss her work on that basis. Incredible. We’re seeing that you are poorly, or only partially informed on most things. As soon as you read a little bit, you feel qualified to write an article about it. Well, Ingrid Weckert was over-qualified to write about Kristallnacht. To get the full flavor of her book, Flashpoint, w/o reading it all (and it’s out of print), you can read my 7-part review/summary beginning here: https://carolynyeager.net/closer-look-kristallnacht-1938-just-another-jewish-hoax
If you’re going to keep repeating your same original impressions, you really should.
Where does this ” IMT testimony of SA Chief of Staff Viktor Lutze” that you pasted in here come from? You don’t identify it.
Installment #1, https://carolynyeager.net/closer-look-kristallnacht-1938-just-another-jewish-hoax, focuses on the Foreword which deals with the Goebbels question:
Dear Kali,
On your unrelated item, I really appreciate the time you’re spending at my website, even to going to Wintersonnenwende.com. It is the best (!) and the woman who runs it (after her father who began it passed away) is a bright, talented German-Canadian who is even more devoted than I am to this work. For her, it is without doubt a labor of love. This site deserves all the support it can get. And probably more readers!
One of the more recent translations on the site is probably my favorite true story of all time! I know your plate is full at the moment, but please put it on your “to read” list. I think you’ll be glad you did. https://wintersonnenwende.com/scriptorium/english/archives/longnightsjourney/lnjid00.html It conveyed to me an accurate picture of the German(s) I know and as I know them. These Polish Nationals were also Volksdeutsch, as the previous 5 or 6 generations of my family were. It was one of those pieces that, while reading it, I didn’t want it to end bc I was enjoying it so much.
Thanks for all your recent comments too. Carolyn
Ms. Yeager,
I toggled over here after reading a post from Kali on the Holocaust Debate thread, and the link to wintersonnenwende; I have read only one chapter, but I look forward to reading the rest; Kali attributed the source to you, and I thank you, as well.
My maternal relatives were from Germany, and ethnic Germans in Poland, Bohemia and that territory. My grandmother spoke a bit of Polish, and I make kolaches and perogies from recipes handed down from her, as did my mother.
It is a beautiful and terrible history; I appreciate those who are courageous enough to combat the official narrative.
I’ve now got that link open in another tab for reading later… I’ve spied a few other titles on that site I’d like to read as well, so it looks like I’ll be spending a lot of time there. I’ll share the link around my contacts too.
I hope I didn’t go too far with my unasked for “appraisal” of you the other day, Carolyn… And especially, I hope you didn’t feel patronised in any way! – Confession: I was a tiny bit stoned, LoL – (hence all the smilies). I don’t smoke much, but when I do you never know what I might come out with!
Naughty Kali!!
With love (to Tiptoethrutulips as well),
Kali
Yes, there’s a lot there that is very tempting. Sharing the link would be great.
So that’s your secret for being especially perceptive, lol. I’ll keep that in mind. And yes, I DO appreciate the value of what we accomplish here, that’s why I continue. You’re a good and sensitive (intuitive) comrade.
Germany is more of an organic state than even Russia or France.
Tacitus wrote Germania ca. 98 A.D.
You Poles have your own fake history that deserves zero respect. Most arrogant nation-state in Europe.
If you argue that Poland properly extends to the Elbe, it just tends to confirm what Germans were saying in 1939, that the Poles started the war with border-provocations because they were motivated by ambitions of conquest.
True enough,. It was, however, the English who instigated it by making their com itment to Poland’s territorial integrity (whatever that included) that served as a pretext for them declaring war to honor their commitment exactly the same way as they used the purported violation of Belgium’s neutrality as a pretext for launching WWI in their quest to destroy their German rivals,
Same plan, different venue.
Polish newspaper headlines between the wars make really interesting reading.
I think that a website sweetliberty.org had copies of these.
The key fact pointed out by Ingrid Weckert is that Kristallnacht happened on the 15th anniversary of the Beerhall Putsch, so that all the regular leaders of SA units, and all high officials of the NSDAP, were away in Munich. The units thus were in the hands of inexperienced deputy-commanders.
Weckert says that SA units received mysterious instructions by telephone. Only 3 out of 28 SA units obeyed the instructions and participated in the violence.
I discussed it with Chris Cantwell in 2018. https://national-socialist-worldview.com/2018/11/10/kristallnacht-as-a-jewish-false-flag-operation/
#1066 Hadding
Herr Schweinefuhrer Hadding
“If you argue that Poland properly extends to the Elbe (…)”
Can you read?
SLAVS lived to Elbe river. Slavs who lived close to Elbe river were called (in German) Oboditie, Leutizen, Sorben. Not Poles.
Look again at map of Eastern Germany from 1869 “Germanische und slavische Volksstämme zwischen Elbe und Weichsel”:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sorbian_March
These Slavic tribes were later brutally exterminated and remnants of Slavs were germanized (except Leutizen).
“(…)Poles started the war with border-provocations because they were motivated by ambitions of conquest. “
Why Poles wish to conquer land of morons called Germany? “Let Germans rule themselves and they quickly destroy `themselves”.
Of course you agree that cities in Eastern Germany like Berlin, Dresden, Lepizig are Slavic founded cities (as I proved in my comment #1053).
#1068 HdC
“Polish newspaper headlines between the wars make really interesting reading.
I think that a website sweetliberty.org had copies of these. ”
My dear peasant from Canada, how do you know this when you can’t even read properly English sources, not to mention documents in other languages?
I am not arguing with a Polish bigot. Enjoy your fake history.
A bit off topic from your Germans vs. Poles debate, but this statement is unequivocally false, and history bears quite the opposite regarding ethnic German expansion and society.
Catherine The Great invited Germans into Russia/Ukraine to farm and industrialize certain territories, and their use of three-fields-and-fallow was more successful than native methods (I’m not suggesting Germans developed this method, but they used it, and it’s often associated with their successful harvests). I know Catherine was German/Prussian, but she was devoted to Russia and would not work to cause trouble within.
Czech nobility invited Germans into Bohemia in the 11th century to farm, mine, etc. They were expelled once they out-produced and out-worked the Czech natives, to local Czech consternation, but Germans were invited back in again by Matthias for the very same reasons. All of the prosperity of the Sudetenland in mining, textiles, glass works, etc., was due to German industriousness.
Germany-proper was virtually destroyed twice in the 20th century, but she somehow recovers and rises above many other societies, particularly the Slavic countries. Having said that, I personally believe Slavs suffered tremendously in their “progress” due to unrelenting pressure, conflict and capture from Asia, Turks and Arabs.
The defeat of Germany in 1945 may have dealt the final death blow, but they seemed to have recovered well enough until someone (?) reached down into the depths of Hades and flung all manner of lovely “diverse” beings into lily-white, Europe. At some point, I hope the Slavs and the North/Western (all) Europeans realize that they are more compatible with each other than the filth swept into their countries by the Broom of Israel.
What does this mean, “Be like ____”
I surmise from the comments that replies are, “I am like ____”
What does that mean?
______
This over-long thread has left me feeling very cranky.
Why do we pay so much attention to Jews and the lies they told to ‘enshrine’ themselves as the world’s pre-eminent victims?
Why does the USA have XXX holofraud museums (plus at least 2 museums to the crimes that Allies and Americans committed against Europe and Japan), but no museums to the many and manifest treacheries, lies, and war crimes of prominent Jews?
Why do we give a flying f&&& about Jews?
Why do we dumb taxpayers pay for them?
Why do we allow our children to be forced to learn about this religion-of-deception and graft?
How about a museum — in every state, at least — to the distinct and various ethnic groups that migrated to USA, that put their “lives, their fortunes, their sacred honor”, in addition to their life’s blood and sweat and dreams, to the project of creating American cities and towns?
I am SICK TO DEATH of reading about/learning about JEWS. They SUCK!
Jews lie and get other people to kill for them, then demand that we, who try not to lie, try not to harm another, are demeaned by them and forced to pay for their “preferences.”
We desperately need museums to the American people, and also, major museums, in the middle of Washington, DC and every major cities, to the many and manifest crimes of Jews, crimes for which they have NEVER been called to account.
If we remain complacent as Jews dominate our landscape and our history with THEIR version of history, then OUR version may be forever lost.
We MUST create permanent monuments and museums to record the “ALTERNATIVE,” “Revisionist” history of the activities of our own US government, subverted these past decades by Jews to serve the preferences of Jews and to the benefit of Jews.
Where is the USMuseum to the Murderous Lies of Jewish Leaders?
Sometimes you just have to be lucky…
Some years ago my wife and I wound up at the southern end of the big bridge that joins Upper Peninsula Michigan to the Lower Peninsula in Makinaw City.
At the edge of the park was a small commemorative marker, much like a grave marker, proclaiming the name of the first Jew to soil that beautiful spot. (It’s on Google Maps).
A day later we toured the military fort nearby and perused the descriptions posted at various locations therein.
Low and behold, at the quartermasters stores was such a description that also noted some corruption with the fort’s supplies and stores. The individual charged with the malfeasance in said stores? None other than the first Jew in the commemorative plaque!
Quite a record that the first of his tribe would abuse his authority with the state. And things have only gotten worse since then.
My “dear” Ignoramus, you think it possible that the website owner provided translations for said headlines???
Better yet, assuming you can read and comprehend Polish, dig out the offending newspapers and read them yourself. I’m sure the Poles have them in a museum somewhere. Or the Germans took them for safe keeping. Do some work yourself.
I made this argument a long time ago, and every so often I repeat that I don’t care about Jews at all. I’ve never read any of those big tomes about the Talmud, and the Shulcan whatever it is, and the History of the Jews. Why would I want to know?? I know they hate us, hate me, that’s enough to know. Because I’d rather read about my own people, first and foremost the Germans.
But saying this seems to go over people’s heads. They’re quick to join in with talk about and against Jews with vigor and enthusiasm. This is part of our sickness right there.
My advice is to stop being interested in Jews! When the plight of Jews is brought up, express that it’s not your problem. Don’t listen to the argument that we have to show concern for all people. Get over that. I know that the concept of Humanity is a fraud. I’m not responsible for humanity. I’m responsible for a much smaller amount, like only what I can see and hear. If we all took care of our own self, a few friends & family, it would be a better world. The nation is the ultimate size of what we can belong to and have some measure of love for. It’s enough. Let others, of other nations, do the same. Jews have their own families & nation, but they want to live in, and off, others.
It all starts with education. In National Socialist Germany, the schools taught students along that line, and it was excellent. Their instruction showed great respect for every German, and emphasized Germany’s role in history and in the affairs of the nations, It was so exceedingly civilized.
If we as a people didn’t feel or take any responsibility for Jews, they would soon go elsewhere. Jews use ‘shock & awe’ to force us to feel for them. We must learn not to fall for that. Learn to ignore them, and of course don’t do business with them.
That’s just what I was saying. Weckert’s wildly speculative scenario is that a network of Jewish Zionist agents had so much influence in 1938 Nazi Germany that they were able to manipulate SA units across the country into staging anti-Jewish riots as a false-flag operation. That seems extremely implausible to me.
Let’s assume that Weckert is telling the truth and correctly passing along those stories of mysterious phone calls ordering SA units to attack Jews throughout the Germany. Since the result was such a huge political disaster and so strongly condemned by Hitler and the top Nazi leadership, isn’t it very plausible that the SA leaders would have later invented those stories as an excuse? Was the SA such a poorly run organization that any random outsider could just call them up and order them to do something violent and dramatic without any of them bothering to check whether the orders were coming from a legitimate authority? You’re the expert on Nazi Germany and I’m not, so you tell me, but it sounds totally ridiculous.
That sort of bizarre scenario is very different than Irving’s argument that Goebbels—one of the most powerful and influential figures in Germany—inappropriately ordered those SA units to take those actions, either directly or via some close allies of his in the SA or Nazi hierarchy
And I’d once again emphasize that Weckert herself states that Hitler strongly believed that Goebbels had been responsible. Personally, I’d take Hitler’s opinion on what actually happened in 1938 over yours or Weckert’s so many decades later.
Here is some other information on this matter:
Source: https://www.hdot.org/debunking-denial/kn2-hitlers-authorization/#_edn2
Some did check. As I told you, 25 out of 28 units ignored the instruction.
I doubt that Hitler “strongly believed” that Goebbels was responsible. If so then it is hard to understand why Goebbels was not sacked, because by all accounts everybody, including Goebbels, understood that Kristallnacht was a disaster for Germany. Goebbels said: they killed a dozen Jews and for this we may have to pay sometime with a million soldiers.
I will review the details when I get the chance.
This makes no sense. What is bizarre is what Ron Unz is reading into Ingrid Weckert’s clear statement that the SA units telephoned by “mysterious strangers” DID NOT participate in the violence. DID NOT. Only 3 out of 28 were fooled by it. So where does RU come off in saying that Weckert is claiming overwhelming Jewish-Zionist influence in Germany, and even going so far as to make a statement like this:
This in the face of the fact that only 3 out of 28 units even temporarily followed this order. His position is completely irrational.
There are other explanations for how the damage took place than to believe it could only have been done by SA members. It seems most posters here are not particularly knowledgeable about Kristallnacht, so aren’t able to wage a credible rebuttal. That’s one result of spending too much time pursuing Zionist conspiracy theories instead of real history.
LOL. You’re back on Deborah Lipstadt’s website! You can no longer say you didn’t know it was hers. You are 100% in with the Jews.
Fact: Adolf Hitler was not told of the burnings, etc. until after midnight, after he had gone to bed.
Fact: The “intense discussion together at dinner that night” between Hitler & Goebbels was NOT about the disturbances and was not particularly intense, either. Goebbels said he didn’t receive the reports until after Hitler had left, and he immediately took action. Not realizing how extensive the rioting would become, it was not thought necessary to disturb the Fuehrer.
What you quote from the diary (long in the Soviet archives) cannot be something that Goebbels wrote. It doesn’t fit the facts otherwise known.
Fact: Richard Evans is the worst of the British ‘Third Reich-Hitler” historians. But he is the one who participated in D. Lipstadt’s trial brought by Irving. He is a partisan.
An important part of the deception is the exaggeration of the scale of Kristallnacht. If you accept that every synagogue was destroyed, that every window of every Jewish shop was smashed, as that — as one postwar professional historian put it — “blood flowed everywhere,” then you have to believe that this was directed and approved from the top.
The actual scale of the vandalism and violence was much less than that.
Such actions could not have been approved from the top because they were so damaging to Germany, in several ways. The vandalism didn’t cost Jews. It cost German insurance companies.
“…What you quote from the diary (long in the Soviet archives) cannot be something that Goebbels wrote. It doesn’t fit the facts otherwise known…”
So are you now resorting to the last “argument” people like you use, which is: “the document has been forged”?
If Kristallnacht really did disturb the Nazi authorities because it would show to the world how badly they treated the Jews, you’ll have to explain why they behaved towards the victims and the perpetrators this way:
Source: https://www.hdot.org/debunking-denial/kn1-intro/
Punishing the victims, not punishing the perpetrators, would not really show to the world their “righteousness”, but obviously they didn’t care. They had “greater plans” already.
The notion that within hours after the German official died pogrom against Jews were initiated on the spur of the moment by the SA throughout Germany is utter nonsense.
That might seem credible to dumbbells today given their awareness of the near instantaneous world-wide communication networks of today when the whole world within minutes learsn of an important event.
But we are talking 1938. Long-distance phone service was barely available to a miniscule proportion of the population of any country. Even local phone service was barely available to most people.
And there are commentators who actually have the gall that within hours the the death of the foreign service officer in another country, untold hundred if not thousands of Germans were spontaneously moved to engage in a program against Jews in Germany?
,
That on its face is ridiculous to anyone who as ever participated in any kind of widespread demonstration about anything (anti-war, civil rights, abortions, you name it). Such events happen and can be carried off only after careful advance planning and organization. unless some cataclysmic event happens that prople are already predisposed to act upon when the even occurs.
As someone pointed out in a prior comment, there was nothing in Germany that had happened before that predisposed the Germans to engage in organized violence against Jews on a moments notice.
Since in my view there is no question that the plan and organization to launched a progrom on a moments notice could be accomplished only if the plans for doing so had been been worked out and the organization for carrying it out was in place when the triggering event occurred.
Now, since it was a Jew who assasssinated the German official, Jews were the only members of a group who could have known about and been prepared and ready in advance to launch the response to it that occurred. Members of no other organized group could have known about the intended assassination in advance of i to be prepared to act on it on a moment’s notice..
It is also necessary to keep in mind that news of the death that did not occur until the evening hours so news about it could have reached Germany only in the late evening when crowds would not have gathered who could be instantly incited to engage in mob action. Thus the participants had to be individually rounded up to participate in the action.
That goes to who had the means and opportunity to pull it off as effectively as it happened.
And then we get to who had the motive to pull it off.
The just consider that Hitler hand Germany were riding high diplomatically when just weeks earlier Hitler had pulled of the Munich Accord that prompted Europe to exhale a huge sigh of relief that war had been averted by Hitler’s diplomacy.
Why then would members of any group in German have even imagined to engage in a country-wide pogrom against Jews that could only besmirch Germany’s reputation aND REDOUND TO THE ADVANTAGE OF ITS ENEMies the Jews by generating world wide sympathy for their plight?
Thus only Jews had the clear-cut motive for launching such a false flag operation that was calculated to besmirch Germany’s reputation and world standing.
Thus means, opportunity and motive, the age old trinity that identifies a perpetrator, points directly and solely straight at the real culprits.
I read somewhere upthread that “91 Jews were killed” in Kristallnacht, but in the final German reports it was far less than that. I can’t find the lesser number right at the moment but it was more like under twenty. I also read here that “no synagogue was left standing” the next day, but a final German report pointed out that “in 1938 there were still some 1,420 synagogues standing unharmed in Germany.” A given number of one hundred seventy-seven (177) destroyed is neither “all”, nor “most, nor even a large fraction, but only 12% of the total. and then they count shuls (schools) as synagoges too. Huge exaggerations are a Jewish specialty.
Your source is s–t. Why can’t you ever find a non-Jewish source? The reason must be because you’re a Jew who only wants to spread a Jewish narrative.
According to wikipedia, Goebbels’s affair with the Czech actress was not a secret; was known to Magda who retaliated by engaging an affair of her own; was being dealt with among ‘official’ sources.
If this was Goebbels’s MOTIVE to “instigate” an attack on Jews, it made little sense. Moreover, as implied in SCENARIO 5, the riot did little to alay Hitler’s suspicions, nor does it seem that Goebbels’s position in Hitler’s hierarchy was substantially threatened.
IMPLAUSIBILITY INDEX: Goebbels was not a stupid man. Implausible that he think that stirring up a wide-spread attack on Jews would enhance his stature in the Reich hierarchy.
IMPLAUSIBILITY INDEX: Regarding key terms, “gained control,” “numerous SS units” — it was not necessary to “gain control of numerous SS units“. It was sufficient infiltrate or manipulate a relative few low-level personnel in official-sounding organizations.
a. As Francis Nicosia recorded, zionists from Israel did, indeed, operate throughout Germany and directly under the noses of, and not infrequently, in cooperation with, Gestapo.
b. Based on statements by Louis Brandeis in February, 1933, zionists were motivated to ‘drive’ German Jews out of Germany, by frightening them, if necessary. It had been done before, and after.
Israeli zionists had the MEANS to instigate a riot, and the MOTIVE to do so.
IMPLAUSIBILITY INDEX: See Scenario 2.
As well: Consider present-day “Color revolution” scenarios: After the critical event, i.e. the riots at Maidan, there is always a Follow-up plan. Fast-forward to SCENARIO 4.
IMPLAUSIBILITY INDEX: With the assassination Jewish zionists created the OPPORTUNITY to foment a riot.
IMPLAUSIBILITY INDEX: The critical sentence occurs at the end of an explanatory paragraph:
or.
In other words, NSDAP Party leaders were not able to conceptualize that the Mossad el aliyeh Bet that Gestapo had been cooperating with, would compromise, exploit and subvert the Germans.
Weckert’s explanation may not be the most articulate, but it seems to account for all the facts now known; it seems to be more plausible than that “Goebbels set off an attack on Jews in order to overcome the disgrace of his romantic affair.”
I don’t mean to change the subject, but I have concluded (for now) my investigation into the origin and use of the term “Nazi” among members of the NSDAP and leadership of the Third Reich. Below is a brief overview for the interested reader, which I will follow up with a longer essay on my website carolynyeager.net.
Rather than repeat both sides of the disagreement, please refer to comments 670, 677 & especially 680 btw Ron Unz and myself in this thread and follow the replies from there. What I’ve found is that there is complete agreement among the few sources that concern themselves with this question, and that the use of this word as a political term began in 1921.
My references are
Prior to 1921, when Adolf Hitler became the leader of the German Worker’s Party, and changed it’s name to the National Socialist German Workers Party (Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei), the only way the word “nazi” was known was as a nickname for “Ignaz” which was itself a nickname for Ignatius, a boy’s name found mostly in Bavavia. For some reason Ignaz and Nazi came to signify a foolish, awkward and not very bright person.
Contrarily, the nickname “sozi” for Socialist (Sozialist) had been in use for many years. The Social Democratic Party was founded back in 1875 in Germany (Sozialdemokratische Partei Deutschlands),and had become a leading political party, even #1. It was one of the earliest Marxist-oriented parties in the world, and appealed to the common laboring man and woman, of whom there were many. It was a big advocate for labor unions. Adolf Hitler was, of course, aiming at the working man by adding Socialist to the party name, but it was also the political philosophy, combined with Nationalism, he strongly believed was the best for the German people as a whole.
Miffed, the Social Democrats came up with the term ‘nazi’ for their new competition, from the name Nationalsozialistische or National Sozialist which also, all the better, was the nickname for a clumsy fool in Bavaria, the home region of the new party. However, none of this made much difference until the NSDAP began to gain electoral muscle after 1928, and especially by 1930.
During the ’30s Party members referred to themselves as Nationalsozialisten (National Socialists), and only very rarely used the colloquial Nazi, usually in conjunction with Sozi or when indicating how the opposition referred to them. The main example of it’s use that is pointed to is Leopold von Mildenstein’s article series “A Nazi goes to Palestine” (Ein Nazi fährt nach Palästina) published in Der Angriff in 1934. But it’s never suggested that that is more than a singular example, in the spirit of “nazi-sozi”, nor that Goebbels played a role. Instead, the term Parteigenosse (party member) was encouraged as a way of addressing one another, with its corresponding feminine form Parteigenossin. This was mentioned approvingly by Adolf Hitler in a 1936 Party Day speech. [Hitler, Adolf (1936). Die Reden (Talk) des Führers am Parteitag der Ehre, Munich: Zentralverlag der NSDAP.]
After the NSDAP’s victory in 1933, the use of the term ‘Nazi’ by itself or in terms such as “Nazi Germany,” “Nazi regime,” and so on was popularized by German exiles outside the country, but not in Germany. From them, the term spread into other languages and it was eventually brought back into Germany after World War II. [Rabinbach, Anson; Gilman, Sander, eds. (2013). The Third Reich Sourcebook. Berkeley: University of California Press. p. 4.]
Because of the derogatory intentions behind the use of ‘Nazi’, Adolf Hitler disapproved of it’s use, never used it himself, and even banned it’s use in all official government and party writings and correspondence. Hitler was the undisputed leader of the Party, so such an order was respectfully obeyed. For Ron Unz to say that it was widely used in Germany by party members themselves, such as Joseph Goebbels, is simply wrong and unfounded. Unz is relying on one book he read by the Jewish anti-zionist Lenni Brenner, without doing any further investigation of the matter. Ron Unz also uses “Nazi” almost solely when referring to National Socialist/ism and apparently doesn’t want to change.
A few items of evidence showing that Nazi was not used by party members, or government employees at all levels, are the following:
* A collection of Hitler’s dinner conversations from 1941 through 1944 titled Hitler’s Table Talk does not contain the word “Nazi.”
* In his speeches, Hermann Göring never uses the term “Nazi”.
* Hitler Youth leader Melita Maschmann wrote a book about her experience entitled Account Rendered. In it, she did not refer to herself as a “Nazi”, even though she was writing well after World War II.
* In 1933, the 581 members of the National Socialist Party who answered interview questions put to them by Professor Theodore Abel from Columbia University\, did not refer to themselves as “Nazis.”
* In his book, Why Hitler Came Into Power (1938), academic Theodore Abel published six life histories of pre-1933 active party members, and only one, “The Story of a Middle-Class Youth,” had the word Nazi in it. It was used only four times; twice he was quoting someone else, once as ‘Nazi Party,’ and once he was describing how excited he felt as a sixteen year old wearing brown trousers (which strangely were forbidden at the time!).
I challenge anyone who wants to convince us of a wide acceptance of the word Nazi among the National Socialists between 1920 and 1945 to come forth with the evidence. I didn’t find any. I hope this goes some way in putting this matter to rest.
This would explain why I don’t remember seeing it.
You may have read it here. https://national-socialist-worldview.com/2018/11/10/kristallnacht-as-a-jewish-false-flag-operation/
I had seen somewhere that the canonical death-toll was 91 but Heinrich Haertle in a chapter of Freispruch für Deutschland (1965) wrote that it was 35.
Holocaust Controversies has no article on Kristallnacht, only this brief remark on Weckert:
I admit that Lipstadt’s website sometimes makes a rather superficial impression, making too easy “conclusions”, but this was the only quick reference I could find.
You will reject any source that contradicts your “Hitlerism” anyway, whether Jewish or not.
Whether Kristallnacht was instigated by the Nazi regime or was a Jewish false flag, ultimately does not deny the criminal attitude and behavior of the regime towards the Jews and the Slavs.
To illustrate this, here is a quote from Erich Koch, Reichskommissar of Ukraine, that I found the other day:
And with this attitude this creature committed his appalling crimes against the Slavic Untermenschen.
But this information is from Wikipedia, which is “controled by Jews” and thus….
Why were Germans invited into the Bohemian territory in the first place? Why were Germans invited into Ukraine/Russia?
Who was primarily responsible for the industrial and agricultural success/enrichment in the Sudetenland territory?
Other than Jews, which ethnic group primarily supported the Bolsheviks/communists/Soviets prior to and after WW1? Was it Slavs?
Who was butchering Germans in Danzig prior to WW2? Was it the Poles? Are they Slavs?
What happened to the ethnic Germans in “Czechoslovakia” after the Treaty of Versailles, signed under duress\coercion by Germany? What happened to the industry/farms formerly maintained by said Germans? Did the Czechs do a stupendous job replacing the lazy, incompetent Germans? Are Czechs Slavs?
How many Czechs were massacred when Germany reclaimed the Sudetenland?
How many Russians/Ukrainians/Poles/Germans/Czechs/Hungarians, and all manner of Eastern Europeans were massacred when Lenin/Trotsky/Stalin brought their version of equality and peace to the masses?
Who was Edvard Benes? Was he Slavic? Did he throw in with the Soviets? How did that work out for him? The useful Slavs soon wear out their usefulness, don’t they?
Is Deborah Lipstadt controlled/funded/supported/promoted by Jews? I’m sure she is not biased at all; David Irving, neither Slavic, Jewish, nor German, but a rather fine Englishman, unlike Churchill, was not biased, and he made every effort to reveal the truth. He was hounded mercilessly and imprisoned, which is odd, considering obvious truths need no protection from the law.
Let’s not pretend we have no clue about which “sources” of information are readily accessible, and which people make ready use of “false flags” to further their bequeathed promise of world domination. How many Slavs were aboard the USS Liberty? How many Jews? How many Slavs were in the Towers? How many Jews? Ol’ Lucky Larry Silvertongue was out that day, getting the pox removed from his rat-face; his rat-faced kids just so happened to be out too.
I think you have your criminal regimes sorely confused. You are confused about the ‘creatures,” as well.
All the Poles I dealt with were very decent, polite people. However, as a whole they seem to have a syndrome. According to Polish opinion, Poland stretches from the Rhine to the Dnieper, from the Baltic Sea to the Black Sea. Unfortunately, this Polish territory has been occupied by hostile states, sometimes by the Swedes, for almost a thousand years by the Germans, for centuries by the Russians, occasionally by Austria, etc.
TU QUOQUE
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tu_quoque
Please spare me the reference to Wikipedia; I don’t need to search therein to form an opinion or an analysis of historical facts. Nor do I need it to translate Latin phrases.
Why don’t you just answer the questions?
Why don’t you hop on Wikipedia to find the definition of retribution? Or, retaliation? Or, poetic justice?
On the suggestion that my argument is hypocritical, kindly explain to me how Jews are/were justified in their Acquisition/Return to the land from which they were expelled thousands of years hitherto; said acquisition by the efforts of Gentiles obtained through bribery, deception, media control, political upheavals, terror, etc., yet Germans are brutish creatures for attempting same, for territory into which they were invited centuries before, to the benefit of the Slavs living therein, only the Germans currently residing in said territory are/were much abused by the ungrateful, resentful Slavs, unlike the Jews still residing in Palestine before the onset of WW1? And, also unlike the Jews, the Germans attempted their Reclamation by negotiations – no lying, no manipulating, no use of others to fight their battles, no violence before declarations of war.
Here’s some information from Al Jazeera:
“ The Balfour Declaration is widely seen as the precursor to the 1948 Palestinian Nakba when Zionist armed groups, who were trained by the British, forcibly expelled more than 750,000 Palestinians from their homeland.”
CAVE MENDACES
Now you do it again: whataboutism (a variant of tu quoque) about Zionists in Palestine. That was not the subject. We were talking about Nazi crimes against Slavic peoples during WW2. You suggest that because some small minorities of Germans lived for centuries productive lives among Slavic peoples therefore Nazi Germany had the right to invade their countries, murder their elites, expell masses of them and enslave the rest. And that was not only a crime of the Nazi state, many members of said German minorities in those Slavic lands actively took part in those crimes. They formed paramilitary Selbstschutz (“selfprotection”) groups that actively took part in the mass murder of the very people among whom they had lived for centuries. See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selbstschutz
Quote:
What a surprise!
If genuine, that use of “master race” (Herrenrasse) by Erich Koch would be the only instance of it by an official of Hitler’s government or the NSDAP that I have seen.
They really did not use that term, although Anglo-American propaganda accused them of it constantly.
No, I said/implied that “whataboutism” is not relevant to my argument. I’m not going to consider information pulled from Wikipedia, unless we’re arguing over a date of birth, the year of an event, etc., or anything not generally subject to interpretation or controversy. High school teachers disallow Wikipedia as an accurate source for essays, and thus……
What is right or wrong, unjust or justified, must be considered within context, which can often extend beyond the immediate act(s) in question. The “Zionists in Palestine” activities /atrocities can not be excluded from the justifications, as much of what occurred in Europe from the late 1800’s until the conclusion of WW2 (and afterwards) is inextricably entwined within that movement, for which Jews, as a group, absolutely claim complete and utter justification.
Are you an American? Here is an extreme example, and a proposed argument about what’s right, wrong or justified:
In 2007, a young couple were carjacked at gun point and taken to a rental property in a remote area of Knoxville, Tennessee. The young man was tortured in a field behind the house, raped, killed and set on fire. It was determined he was set alight after death; how very thoughtful of those creatures who had captured him. The young girl was tied to a barbell in a bedroom, gang raped for over 24 hours, eventually doused with bleach and stuffed in a trash bag in a garbage pail, wherein she suffocated to death. The coroner said her mouth and genital area were shredded.
I forced myself to watch much of the trial footage, and I noted the father of the young girl, who, hour after hour, sat with arms crossed, constantly rocking back and forth, glaring at the black monsters on the witness stand, describing what they did to his daughter. Now, ordinarily, I’m not a proponent of mob rule or vigilantism, but if I were in charge of that case, I would allow the fathers of those victims a few minutes alone with those creatures, with a weapon of their choice, and permission to do what they felt appropriate. And, that would be illegal, but would it be wrong or unjustified? I say, no.
Here’s a bit of information for you taken from a source other than Wikipedia:
“ Centuries later, in 1438, Bartolomeo de Giano, an Italian Franciscan who was holed up in Constantinople as the Turks laid siege to it, described their slave raids throughout the Balkans. From Hungary, 300,000 were enslaved and “carried off in just a few days,” he wrote; from Serbia and Transylvania, 100,000 were “led away in iron fetters tied to the backs of horses … [and] women and children were herded by dogs without any mercy or piety. If one of them slowed down, unable to walk further because of thirst or pain, O Good Jesus! she immediately ended her life there in torment, cut in half.”
As one historian observes, “[t]he massive enslavement of slavic populations during this period gave rise, in fact, to our word ‘slave’: in Bartolomeo’s time, to be a slave was to be a Slav.”
The slave markets of the Ottoman sultanate were for centuries so inundated with European flesh that children sold for pennies, “a very beautiful slave woman was exchanged for a pair of boots, and four Serbian slaves were traded for a horse.”
It was the same elsewhere. In Crimea — where many millions of Slavs were enslaved by the Ottomans’ Muslim allies, the Tatars (Mongols turned Muslim) — an eyewitness described how Christian men were castrated and savagely tortured (including by gouging out their eyes), whereas “[t]he youngest women are kept for wanton pleasures.”
Do you have any thoughts on the current vilification of Europeans for our past slave raiding? Is that vilification justified? Or, does “whataboutism” apply in the context of slave raiding history?
The noun Untermensch is a German rendering of Lothrop Stoddard’s term Under-Man, from his book The Revolt Against Civilization: the Menace of the Under-Man (1922).
Stoddard was extremely influential in Germany, but this book was not about race per se. It was an attempt to explain why Bolshevism was able to take over in some countries. Stoddard blamed it on the combination of civilization’s increasing complexity and the dysgenic increase of humans incapable of succeeding in such a society. It was an argument for eugenic sterilization.
Hitler and the NSDAP certainly recognized that dysgenic breeding was an ailment that had affected Germany as well as other nations, and therefore had several hundred thousands of their own people sterilized on eugenic grounds in the 1930s.
So, the Untermensch is essentially not a matter of classifying races or peoples. This is a distortion conveyed by American war-propaganda.
The supposed suffering of Slavs was a big deal in the American propaganda of 1945. George Stevens’ concentration-camp movie portrays mainly Poles and Russians as victims, and barely mentions Jews.
That proportion is more or less reversed today. At Auschwitz since 1990 the alleged Jewish death-toll has been several times the alleged non-Jewish death-toll, and Deborah Lipstadt tells us that the only actual genocide was against Jews. https://codoh.com/library/document/anti-gentiles-deny-the-5-million/en/\
In fact, several Slavic nation-states were allied with Germany. Poland was offered an alliance with Germany and Italy against the USSR as late as March 1939. Yugoslavia was very briefly allied with Germany but then the government was overthrown.
Poles still claim that three million of their people who were not Jews were murdered, but that figure has been orphaned with the adjustment of the death-tolls in the camps. Poles had a hard time under German occupation mainly because they continued to fight Germany while occupied, instead of accepting peace-terms and collaborating like France.
Have you figured out yet that Ryckaert is a Jew, so will never agree to, or acknowledge, ANY argument of yours, no matter how good? The only thing to do with him is to ignore him, which is what we should be doing with every Jew! This is the hardest thing to do, but it is the best strategy (I’ve decided).
I actually decided that some time ago but, as I said, it’s hard to do. And I only recently became convinced that Ryckaert is a Jew. I’m slow, but once I get it, I’ve got it. I have a total attitude shift.
I think that the title of Mildenstein’s article Ein Nazi fährt nach Palästina uses the term with some irony. The use of that derogatory word conveys that the action of visiting Palestine was contrary to the expectation of the people who would use that word.
100% whataboutism. Congretulations!
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_crimes_against_the_Polish_nation
But of course: “Wikipedia is controled by Jews, therefore it is not true”.
I don’t care if you think that I’m a Jew. That is clearly your way to cope with moral matters. Deep down you know about the crimes of NS Germany. What you “gain” by living a lie is anyone’s guess.
Since I started commenting and debating on the Internet I learned a lot about human psychology, and boy there are very strange characters among them!
Good luck in Walhalla with your “artist within the warlord”.
But you never, never say that you are NOT a Jew, do you? That tells the tale.
“Since I started commenting and debating on the Internet I’ve learned a lot” about Jewish psychology and they never deny outright that they are Jews. I think there’s some kind of taboo against it.
Also, if you were not a jew it would not be okay with you that you were thought to be one. You would try to clear you name.
And I notice how much you hate my book bc it shows the real Hitler — the artist within the warlord. That really galls you. Good.
Whom did you think you would convince by copying and pasting Wikipedia? Anybody with an ounce of sense knows that you get on Wikipedia is an echo of mainstream propaganda.
On this subject, as I have already indicated, there are two contradictory mainstream narratives. There was the US government’s narrative of 1945, which represented Slavs as the main victims of genocide, and there is Zionist narrative that has gradually become more emphatic since 1978, whereby Jews are the only victims of genocide. Slavs have been essentially written out of the “genocide” narrative, at least as presented in the USA.
So, you are quoting old propaganda that does not fit what is now the mainstream narrative.
You have Reinhard Heydrich supposedly proposing to kill all the Polish cognitive elite — which resembles what the USSR actually did. The Germans didn’t do anything like that, and it is absurd to suggest. Hitler greatly admired the Polish leader Marshal Pilsudski, attending a memorial service for him upon his death. I have already mentioned that after trying to win Poland as an ally in March 1939, Hitler tried to make the General Government into a new Polish state with former Polish PM Wincenty Witos at the head.
You are regurgitating old propaganda that doesn’t fit either the new propaganda or old known facts.
You cannot prove a negative. and I am not interested in doing that. Besides, not all Jews are evil, though their ideology is and those who follow it are, but there are always exceptions. Same with the ideology of Nazism, but not the German people since they are not wedded to that ideology, like the Jews are to theirs.
As for your “artist within the warlord”, there have been more people in history who thought to be able to combine idealism with crime on a mass scale. Those who only look at their idealism while denying their crime are deluded. Lying to oneself is perhaps worse than lying to others, and often incurable.
Regards.
They will sometimes say, I’m not Jewish, and then you find out that this means only that they don’t attend synagogue.
You should check Wikipedia on the notion of “the pot calling the kettle black.”
You must be one of those bleeding-hearts, who say, those poor, black boys (and one black GIRL) can’t be blamed for their savagery, as their history is rife with slavery, oppression, Jim Crow, ad nauseam….And, that rather German-looking girl just had to suffer for the sins of her ancestors. So, when is “social justice” appropriate, and when is it not? Jews and blacks do align in their mania, idiocy (mostly blacks) and hypocrisy (Jews and blacks), until the Jews are mangled and robbed in their diamond shops (those very diamonds wrested from the soil in Africa; who primarily profits from that industry?), in which case, no consideration is made for those poor, black fiends.
Germans arrived to Slavic territory by invitation, not conquest – FACT.
Germans were expelled by Slavs through violence/intimidation – FACT.
Germans returned once more by invitation, not conquest – FACT.
Savage, overly bellicose people are not routinely invited into territories by the native people – FACT.
The Versailles Treaty was drawn up without German representation – FACT.
The signing of said treaty was obtained by coercion/threat of continued economic blockades – FACT.
Hitler recovered Sudetenland by negotiation, not violence – FACT.
Hitler offered peace agreements and concessions repeatedly to avoid war – FACT.
Before WW2 and after, ethnic Germans were horrifically abused by Czechs and Poles – FACT.
Many Jews and Slavs allied with Bolsheviks/Soviets against Germans – FACT.
Jewish perfidy and Slavic supported communism damaged more Europeans and more of Europe (and America) than anything done by Hitler and Germany. The Holocaust narrative is utterly false and scientifically impossible. Get off of Wikipedia and listen to “survivor” interviews for the Shoah Foundation, but get yourself a note pad to record the outlandish, and often contradictory, testimony and details for comparison. If you have a reasonably functioning brain, you will be aghast at the lies, exaggerations and ridiculous accusations.
I don’t think you understand TU QUOQUE or CAVE MENDACES or INSANIA TURBARUM.
Frank! Dude! What gives?
Nobody serious about anything relies on wiki for unbiased, factual information, Frank. That’s why God invented books! – (And other serious literature.)
The fact you do rely on wiki, and even trust it, tells us several things about you:
•You are not a serious participant in this discussion, and only wish to propagate establishment lies.
•You are mentally, and probably emotionally immature. (How old are you? – I’m guessing 12.)
•You are probably of jewish ethnicity, given the nature of the propaganda you promote.
One other thing, your “whataboutism” argument is juvenile, and doesn’t make you appear nearly as grown-up and clever as you think it does.
If I’m wrong, and you are serious and are an adult, interested in discovering the truth about the world we inhabit, then allow me to point you in the direction of a serious website, an absolute treasure trove of information, which I myself am very pleased to have discovered via a link on Carolyn Yeager’s website.
https://wintersonnenwende.com/scriptorium/english/archivesindex.html
Just take a look at the titles on that page, and read the blurbs! – I don’t know about you Frank, but I’m going to be spending rather a lot of time reading my way through that material over the coming year or so. I do hope you choose to join me, and break your childish dependence on Wikipedia!
Best wishes,
Kali
I wonder why Ron Unz doesn’t see that as a possibility, as smart as he is? I’d say it’s bc he doesn’t want to admit that it’s a propaganda term. It’s meant to distract from an understanding of National Socialism as a political program, and convey instead an impression of an aggressive and lawless gang of discontents.
I have noticed that the biggest push for “Nazi” has come from U.S. Jews/media. It’s like a full court press! I’ll bet it’s dominant even in the majority of school textbooks today (where it shouldn’t even be). It’s treated as if National Socialism is an archaic form of the proper name Nazi. That’s the completely misleading impression I get.
I hadn’t really considered it, as unfortunately, many gentiles have the same “Hitler = monster, Jews = innocent victims because someone said they killed Jesus” affliction.
While I would never suggest or imply I am as knowledgeable or scholarly on the Hitler/Germany subject as you, I suspect I have not been slinging mud (or just honest facts) with all manner of nincompoops, apologists or outright liars for nearly as long, therefore I have not yet reached my frazzled/frustration threshold.
Unlike Franklin Cryptic-Poser-of-Ethnic-Germanic-Person, I actually view multiple sources, including yours, for information and argue accordingly, rather than dish out Latin terms for, “Oh Yeah? You’re a big, fat liar!”
I had a good bit of friction with the professor of the last German course that I took, because the textbook and the professor referred to the period of Hitler’s rule as die Nazizeit.
That is exactly like referring to the Soviet Union as the Commie Period of Russian history, or the GDR as the Commie Period of German history. They don’t do it.
Yes, there could be some difference in meaning between Jewish and Jew. “I’m not Jewish” in that I don’t attend synagogue or observe the dietary or other laws. “Jewish” is behavior while “Jew” is being. Splitting hairs like that is very Jewish, or Talmudic. Not considered dishonest.
This is why I don’t want to learn more about Jews. It’s a foreign universe, and not anything desirable.
Well, it’s nice to see that unlike your preternaturally stubborn friend Yeager, you’re at least willing to recognize the historical fact under discussion, namely that Joseph Goebbels’ own big Nazi newspaper in Berlin published a long twelve-part series using the supposedly prohibited word “Nazi” in the title.
However, I’m quite skeptical of your interpretation. There’s really no indication that the series or the title was meant to be ironic in any way. Perhaps you can locate the articles themselves somewhere and see what they say, but since this occurred during the height of the Nazi-Zionist economic partnership and Zionist organizations were then preferentially favored in Nazi Germany, I’d assume that the series was quite positive, just as suggested.
Words change their implications over time. For example, “Negro” once carried friendly and favorable implications, but more recently insulting ones. Similarly, “Black” was once insulting and then became favorable or neutral. “Quaker” was an insult, which was eventually accepted and became a neutral descriptive term.
It’s very possible that “Nazi” was originally an insulting term, but I think by this date it had probably become an “edgy” or informal description for NSDAP members, much like “Yank” was used for Americans of that period. It may have been very rare for top American officials to use “Yank” in their official documents or speeches and the powerful Southern committee chairman who controlled Congress must have hated that term, but lots of American informally called themselves “Yanks.”
Maybe I’m right or maybe I’m not, but if the Goebbels’ own big Berlin Nazi newspaper used “Nazi” in its headlines, then the term obviously wasn’t confined to hostile propaganda at that point.
How many examples do you have? This is the only example of Nazi by itself in a National-Socialist publication that I have seen.
That is the crucial question, because if you know, as I know from reading a few of the party’s publications, that Nazi is not a term that members of the NSDAP normally used, then when you do see the word you have to wonder if there is a special reason for it.
The special reason is evident enough. A representative of the NSDAP is visiting a place where, very likely, some people use that word. It’s also a good way to catch attention, because people will be shocked initially upon seeing that word.
It’s like saying, A Gringo visits Mexico City, or, A Christkiller visits the Vatican. Titles like that would make people want to read.
Goebbels had a flair for stirring interest.
With all due respect, I am puzzled by this admission.
I am not arguing that it is perfectly fine for one group of people to punish/terrorize another group for the past actions of their ancestors, or for issues otherwise resolved or put to rest. I am suggesting a flagrant double standard regarding the views/opinions of German actions and Jewish/Bolshevik/Soviet actions. Self-determination and self-defense is a universally accepted proposition, yes?
It is a fact that nearly every conciliatory or peaceful offer from Hitler to all opponents is absent from mainstream sources; I know this to be true as I began reading the history in high school, and I never knew of it until I picked up a used copy of Hitler’s War on a whim. We know what happened to Irving, don’t we?
If we acknowledge that Jews, not all, but certainly the powerful/influential/monied, are wedded to an evil (the world is your cattle) ideology, how do we judge a man, who recognized this evil, as well as the evil/destructive element within communism/Marxism, as evil in his opposition to same? To what lengths can he go to combat or defeat it? How does he verify the innocent from the subversives, when they are intermingled?
Most people believe Hitler came to power and immediately began gassing, killing, slashing, hacking, shooting, torturing his way around Europe; you know this is not true, and you know it is the public perception, you know who promotes/teaches this perception, you know who rakes in millions in reparations/donations, you know who makes the Hollywood movies full of outright falsehoods, you know you supports legislation to outlaw oppositional research/publishing, you must SEE the consequences now, as Whites/Europeans can not offer any defense of their societies/cultures from alien invasion, lest they be called “Nazis!” “Never Again!” Everyone, every color is welcome in European countries (but NOT Israel)….we destroy the Middle East over lies on behalf of Israel….the ADL, SPLC, etc. undermine/sue whites everywhere……yet, you defend Israel and vilify Hitler. His predictions about Jewish domination have come to pass.
I am honestly and sincerely asking, why/how you believe my position or the “revisionist” position is wrong?
That actually means nothing more than not letting the kettle get away with calling the pot black. while claiming to be lily-white.
I must object because you are stating a falsehood, which you often do. I, of course, have never failed to recognize (even confirm) that the series of articles ran in that small (not big) Berlin newspaper. Have I? HAVE I?
You’re not right, but someone as preternaturally stubborn as yourself refuses to recognize when you’re wrong. You just double down. And it’s not like you haven’t been told, you have. So much for the famous Unz brain.
You people with your illusions of WW2 and WW3. It is simple math that WW1 was started by the Bolshevik Jews when they assassinated the Russian Royals, and WW1 has never come to an end, we are in chapter 25 of it.
Frankly, I’d never given any thought to the subject and had casually accepted the widespread claims on the Internet that “Nazi” was regarded as a hostile slur. But after I stumbled across such a telling counter-example, I concluded that belief was mistaken.
It would be interesting if you or someone else can find and read some of the actual articles in question. I suppose it’s possible that the editor was using that word in the title as a means of drawing attention so it would be useful to know whether “Nazi” was also heavily found in the body of the text as well, perhaps used in neutral fashion.
Sure, that seems like a fine analogy to me. But although “Gringo” is a mild anti-American slur invented by Mexicans, lots of white Americans use it jokingly or ironically all the time. In fact, it sounds exactly like the sort of thing Trump might say with some of his friends.
I must say you seem like a much more rational person in analyzing some of these issues than your friend Yeager.
Another blatant example of your sheer hapless stances on most issues. You are a Holocaust denier. Holocaust denial comes with an exclusive directive. That directive is that all of it, I mean all of it (the entire Holocaust) is a made up conspiracy by the Jews to “trick” using magical powers, like being able to revise extemporaneously history before it unfolded. Like magic.
Starting with Kristallnacht. Kristallnacht was a Jewish false flag, Like 9/11 etc. You either get on the train or off the train. But you cannot say that the Holocaust was fake and Kristallnacht was executed by the NS. It makes them look mean and vindictive. We all know they were wonderful people who were terrible mischaracterized by the evil communist Jews (along with the evil capitalist banker Jews), falsely as being evil. The Holocaust is a false story that the Jews perpetrated and the world somehow believes, and the revisionist are being arrested for get this hate speech. Oy vey!!!
What else to expect from a guy who thinks Covid was a US bio weapon. You are a lost cause an enigma wrapped into a Vulcan like exterior of math and science.
You have never answered my repeated question of how do you reconcile your Holocaust denial when two of your favorite figures Israel Shahak and Norman Finkelstien, one a direct Holocaust survivor and the latter Norman Finkelstein’s entire paternal and maternal families were wiped out in the Holocaust at famous killing spots like Auschwitz?
How is that possible to know two prominent Jew haters who were Holocaust survivors and not believe in the Holocaust? If it was not true, don’t you think they would be the first to come forward. Shahak wrote about his Holocaust experience in memoirs. Was he lying ? The same man that wrote about Judaism as being a weight of 3000 years of BS. Shahak.
You Ron point out mercilessly similar hypocrisy in others when they express irrational non sensical facts. Now that you have crossed the rubicon of H denial, and covid as a US bioweapon you will never be taken seriously outside UR ever, ever again. Like a laughing stock.
You might want to tell Phil Girladi the comments on his articles drop precipitously
when the word “Jew ” or “Israel” is not in the tittle. Poor guy, gotta have the Jew in the Jew on Unz Review. Good rhyme no LOL?
An example would be:
What Is Happening In Syria? only 142 comments
Some New Developments in the Spy Business 192 comments
As opposed to:
It’s Past Time to be Honest About Israel 347 comments
Does Israel Seek a “Final Solution for Palestinians? can you guess a whopping 421 comments
You win the most boring commentator on UR. Worst than anyone to date, even Han. Worse than Han. Impossible to get past three sentences on your post. You do realize that nothing I mean nothing you write is original? It has all been repeated like thousands of times over and over. Yet you write like gosh you think you are original and forthright. OMFG you are boring. Do not fear. I will never respond to anything your write.
My favorite today’s special from Tippi Toes. I had no fucking clue until I saw this. Thanks for sharing. I just do not have any idea how we verify the innocent Jew from the subversive Jew when…. when…. they are so intermingled. Perhaps you can come up with some blood test that will determine the subversive from the innocent…… Or a lesser test or a DNA something. God we need something to differentiate!!!! And what if one family has both???
It is a fact that nearly every conciliatory or peaceful offer from Hitler to all opponents is absent from mainstream sources; I know this to be true as I began reading the history in high school, and I never knew of it until I picked up a used copy of Hitler’s War on a whim. We know what happened to Irving, don’t we?
If we acknowledge that Jews, not all, but certainly the powerful/influential/monied, are wedded to an evil (the world is your cattle) ideology, how do we judge a man, who recognized this evil, as well as the evil/destructive element within communism/Marxism, as evil in his opposition to same? To what lengths can he go to combat or defeat it? How does he verify the innocent from the subversives, when they are intermingled?
I do not “defend” Israel in its crimes, but since it already exists and will not go away, it is better to function as a refuge for all Jews, provided of course that they behave properly.
The Holocaust as an argument against keeping white countries white need not worry us. Don’t use the word “race”, don’t talk about “superior or inferior races” and above all don’t talk in praising terms about the Third Reich. Talk about “ethnicity”, “identity” and the right of all peoples to maintain their identity (and thus stop all immigration of people of another identity). This is called “identarianism” and has nothing to do with “Nazism”.
Many European countries already have growing anti-immigration parties. Germany has the Alternative für Deutschland party which is now the second largest in the country. Calling them “Nazis” is not working.
I believe in the Holocaust in the (moderate) functionalist not intentionalist sense. See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Functionalism%E2%80%93intentionalism_debate
I also believe in the Nazi plan to colonize eastern Europe (mentioned in several places of Hitler’s Table Talk) and the crimes committed to achieve that.
I hope this clarifies things.
I don’t like being insulted or accused of dishonesty, especially when I’m probably correct. Wikipedia obviously isn’t reliable on controversial topics, but I think its simple factual information can usually be trusted.
The big national Nazi newspaper in Nazi Germany was apparently Völkischer Beobachter, which supposedly had a circulation of 1.2 million by 1941:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/V%C3%B6lkischer_Beobachter
Meanwhile, the local Nazi newspaper in Berlin, founded and published by Goebbels was Der Angriff, supposedly had a circulation of 110,600 in July 1932, though it gradually declined afterwards.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Der_Angriff
The total population of Nazi Germany in the late 1930s was around 90 million, while the population of Berlin was around 4.3 million, or less than 5% of the total.
So on a pro-rata basis, we’d expect fewer than 60,000 copies of the national Nazi newspaper to be distributed in Berlin. But as the political capital city, the actual rate would probably have been far higher. Still, it seems a very open question whether more copies of Goebbels’ paper were distributed in Berlin than copies of the national Nazi newspaper. Maybe some expert on Nazi Germany knows the answer to that.
But if distribution in Germany’s capital city were at least roughly comparable between the two newspapers, it’s ridiculous of you to describe Goebbels’ own Berlin newspaper as a “small” or insignificant one.
Early on in this ridiculous dispute, you’d pointed to Arthur Butz, a man you greatly admire, as someone who would never use the word “Nazi” in his book. When I checked and pointed out he’d used it almost exclusively, something like 250 times, you refused to admit you’d been mistaken.
Here’s another example that just came to mind. I assume that you regard Ernst Zundel as a great personal hero of yours. I remember a few years ago I saw an interview of him by some journalist in which he was accused of being a Neo-Nazi. His reply was “I’m not a Neo-Nazi, I’m a Nazi!” So unless my memory is faulty, he publicly embraced that term just as much as you prefer being called a “Hitlerist.”
I think the reason you’ve being so stubborn is mostly embarrassment. You’ve apparently spent decades very intensely focused on all aspects of Hitler and Nazi Germany, while I paid very little attention to the subject. Then I suddenly come along and just casually notice that you were probably mistaken in one of your conclusions. It’s very difficult for you to admit that likelihood.
That is so weak Carolyn. Just reverse your quote and you will find you. All of you extreme Jew haters on this site should be on Meds. It is just psychotic the way you write and think. Every bit of evidence and information supporting the Holocaust and the deliberate mass murder of the Jews is fake, a lie, the witnesses are unreliable, texts are forged. Okay
Yet everything supporting Holocaust denial from the most obscure of resources and dubious origins, is spot on a fact a non questionable fact. Just read John Wear, never mind read any of you. Who in their right mind is going to believe you? Finding a Jew under every bed, in every corner of every conversation is the sign of a mentally ill person. It just is. No one believes that the NS were good people no one. And blaming the Jews for YOUR troubles is fruitless pointless, because your evidence is your evidence. No matter how disreputable the source or how many times it is proven wrong. You just say the Jew, the Jew the Jew.
Why did Eichmann transport 475,00 Jews to Auschwitz in the summer of 1945 when the war was about to end. Old people, sick people, women with babies, Jews who were better off in their ghettoes in Budapest. Jews that could not in any way help Germany. Jews that could not feed or care for themselves?????
No answer is rational or possible none other than to murder them. Game, set and match.
Carolyn and I did a series together called The International Jew Study Hour. Somebody commented that it was a good show because of the difference between me and her. She likes to take a forceful position whereas I am more cautious.
In particular we disagreed about the Protocols. I find the Protocols to be of no value. Henry Ford’s articles generally did not depend on the Protocols and would have been perfectly good (stronger, in fact) if the Protocols had never been mentioned.
I feel that I have been a little unfair here. The value that Carolyn saw in the Protocols was that it explained what are essentially weaknesses of a liberal society that Jews exploit.
That kind of summary is worth something, but I was not as impressed with it because I had read criticisms of democracy from Plato to Henry Sumner Maine. To me, the Protocols was not revealing secret Jewish knowledge. It was revealing well known weaknesses of the system, of which Jews have become the preeminent exploiters in our era.
What does this mean Fran?
What is the “Holocaust”? Without a clear definition your whole point is meaningless.
I know we’ve discussed this before, and you’ve asserted that placing Jews in ghettos is what you personally think of as “the holocaust”, as it pertains to your own family.
But that’s not how the term is defined by your Jewish community leaders, is it? They claim the holocaust was a plan, systematically implemented by Germany, to exterminate, by gassing+cremating+grinding, or mas shootings, or bayoneting babies, etc, all Jews under the control of the National Socialists, to the extent that fully Six Million individual Jews were killed.
Upon examination it turns out that the official definition of “Holocaust” is false.
There were certainly ghettos, and some Jews certainly were killed. But that’s not what the Holocaustian religion claims as it’s foundational sacrifice is it? -Holocaustianity insists the number killed is six million, and the means for their death was mostly gas-chambers. These are articles of faith, with no grounding in reality.
Best wishes,
Kali
That’s called a walk-off grand slam in baseball.
Well done.
This is not what Ernst Zündel said. You are also not the first to misquote him in precisely this manner. I remember correcting a radio personality about this back in 1996. Evidently this misrepresentation was widely disseminated.
In a 1994 interview, Mike Wallace accused Ernst Zündel of publishing “radical right and neo-nazi propaganda material.” Zündel said: “Totally untrue. I do not publish neo-nazi literature.” Wallace came back at him by listing items that he was selling, and Zündel explained: “Mr. Wallace, that’s not neo-nazi stuff. That’s Nazi stuff. It’s a big difference.” (8:02 to 8:41)
In other words: he was publishing materials of historical interest, not materials advocating a political program for today.
Zündel never said, “Call me a Nazi,” as some hostile person somewhere has alleged. That would have been a foolish statement given his position and legal troubles in Canada, and also in relation to the Federal Republic of Germany.
Why did he not correct Mike Wallace’s use of the word Nazi as applied to the books etc? I think that he probably sensed that this would not have gone over well with the public, who are so used to hearing and saying Nazi that it would have been regarded as pointless nitpicking. He had more important arguments to present.
https://odysee.com/@magiclamps:6/Mike-Wallace-60-edited-the-interview-and-made-it-inaccurate:5
There is also a video of Ernst Zündel complaining about how the interview was redacted. https://altcensored.com/watch?v=dh97EXToQOk
This consists of deception after deception, ruse after ruse, and slippery “reasoning” with the intention to deceive. What is not hard to see is that you are trying to provoke me, hoping I will get angry enough to INSULT you. It’s an old game, like FDR with AH, hoping to bring on WWII. You want me gone from this site altogether, but your reputation as a “free speech” site argues against banning me.
You are putting an awful lot of time and effort into this argument if I’m just a ridiculous & stubborn old woman. (You notice that I have convinced people while you have not.) So your actions belie your words; thus, my pointing it out is not an “insult.”
You have changed your entire story on this around to where now the only thing you can fault me with is saying that Der Angriff was not a “big newspaper” but a small one. As usual, you start throwing numbers around, which are only estimates at that. And your language: ” we’d expect …”; “would probably have been …”; “it seems …”; “But if …”; and best of all, “Maybe some expert on Nazi Germany knows the answer to that.” This is buffoonish.
Well, here again, I said “small” but never said “insignificant.” Is this not a purposeful misdirection on your part ? I used small bc you were emphasizing that it was big, “a big Berlin newspaper.” I even gave the circulation numbers before you ever did, and from Wiki, which now you quote, but selectively. You’re also now trying to equate it with the Völkischer Beobachter which, in the beginning, you didn’t even know about. It took you two years to look it up, bc you were so cocky about your Lenni Brenner info.
Your last paragraph is completely baseless. Your fantasy. Your self-serving picture of yourself as “I suddenly come along and just casually notice that you were probably mistaken in one of your conclusions. It’s very difficult for you to admit that likelihood.” LOL. WHO cannot admit he’s mistaken? WHAT am I mistaken about? WHICH conclusion?
Isn’t it time to stop tap dancing?
Of course they were good people. They were dutiful people who upheld ideals and opposed decay. Adolf Hitler was an ascetic.
The demonization of “the Nazis” ultimately becomes a demonization of the entire Western World, and it even has some highly unflattering ramifications for Jews — which I can elaborate, if you want to know. (If you’ve watched Ari Libsker’s documentary Stalags, then you already know.)
;… and the Jews received far less justice than was their due! http://judaism.is/holocaust.html
They were rounded up and interned (or otherwise relocated, since some Hungarian Jews were taken to Austria) because the war-zone was getting close to them. Experiences of the First World War caused the concern that Jews would become active as guerrillas and saboteurs, trying to help enemy forces as the fighting approached.
To me the more striking question is, if it was so important to save Jewish lives, why did Franklin Roosevelt insist on “unconditional surrender”? That demand ensures that the war will stretch on as long as possible with as many deaths as possible. Yet I have never heard or seen any criticism of this. Negotiate a peace and whatever is happening can be ended — but Germany will still exist as a power, possibly with Hitler’s government still intact.
FDR’s position seems to have reflected the prevalent Jewish attitude.
Jews outside of Europe really did not care what might happen to the Jews still in Europe. I have two videos where Jews make this point.
Uri Avnery talked about the indifference of Jews in Palestine toward “the Holocaust.”
Video Link
Edwin Black talked about the indifference of most American Jews toward their co-ethnics in Germany before the war. They were much more hellbent on harming Hitler than on protecting Jews. They were willing to sacrifice Jews for their anti-Hitler vendetta.
Video Link
And, yet, you seem to have done just that.
Jews do seem to have a knack for doing the impossible, don’t they? Lucky Larry Silvertongue made such an enormous profit after sinking a few million dollars into asbestos-filled towers and doubling his insurance coverage with a terrorism indemnity rider; luckily, he had a doctor’s appointment for his pox-filled rat-face on that fateful day when explosions were heard in the basements, just like Netanyahu predicted years ago; then Ol’ Silvertongue spouts off about, “Let’s just pull it,” as if the NY Fire chief would actually ask him for advice on fire control. It’s surprising how many people are unaware of Tower 7, and it’s lucky for Pox-Filled Rat-Face the media blackout is nearly absolute.
Indeed.
“The Jews welcome this revolution in the Christian world, and the Jews should show an example. It is not an accident that Judaism gave birth to Marxism, and it is not an accident that the Jews readily took up Marxism: all this was in perfect accord with the progress of Judaism and the Jews.” (A Program for the Jews and Humanity, by Rabbi Harry Waton, p. 148).
“In death as in life, I defy the Jews who caused this last war [WW II], and I defy the powers of darkness which they represent. I am proud to die for my ideals, and I am sorry for the sons of Britain who have died without knowing why.” (William Joyce’s [Lord Ha Ha] last words just before Britain executed him for anti-war activism in WW II).
“I was reluctant, in fact unwilling, to be party to the destruction of Germany under the pretense of denazification . . . I believe Germany should not be destroyed, but rather rebuilt as a buffer against the real danger which is Bolshevism from Russia… I have been at Frankfurt for a civil government conference. If what we are doing [to the Germans] is”‘Liberty, then give me death”. I can’t see how Americans can sink so low. It is Semitic, and I am sure of it………There is a very apparent Semitic influence in the press. They are trying to do two things: first, implement communism, and second, see that all businessmen of German ancestry and non-Jewish antecedents are thrown out of their jobs.” (General George S. Patton)
“We have the Israelis coming to us for equipment. We can say we can’t possibly get the Congress to support a program like this. And they say don’t worry about the Congress. We will take care of the Congress. This is somebody from another country, but they can do it. They own, you know, the banks in this country. The newspapers. Just look at where the Jewish money is.” (General George S. Brown)
David Horowitz has repeatedly said, publicly, that his Jewish parents housed communist Jews from Russia in their basement; there is plenty of evidence gleaned from Jews themselves about what they have been up to and how they are intent on destroying gentile society.
You say/write this repeatedly, yet you continue to respond.
Listen here, DoDo, I was not suggesting Hitler should have conducted DNA tests, as I’m fairly certain that technology was not available at that time. I was referring to identifying the partisans, who often nestle amongst civilians, and of course, the myriad of Jews within the community who offered support through money, information, etc., in alliance with subversive forces. The Japanese were sent to concentration camps in the US too…it happens in multicultural societies during war.
Speaking of the community, Jews and their Rabbis kept to Jewish enclaves by choice and/or rabbinical dictates, not because they were banished to ghettos. I also find countless descriptions of “a good life” in Germany prior to the war. Their subsequent banishment, after all of the machinations, assassinations, and constant meddling/incitement/lies, they wrought upon themselves.
I’m sorry to bore you, but I don’t fear you, Franny. Nor do I worry about being smote by your quick wit and impressive literary skills. I do find it a bit funny that you chastise me for “unoriginal” text, then you copy & paste half of your correspondence directly from my original digital tome on “Why Are Jews A Pox On The Ass Of The Whole Wide World?”
in Reply to Tiptoethrutulips:
lol
____
I thought Tiptoe’s comment was well-crafted; far more moderate and “politically correct” than my rant, “Jews SUCK.”
When one thinks of Jews, or Blacks or Irish or Germans or any other categorical designation, I suppose that most people contemplate one or two or several or a dozen representative individuals from that category; no one can know the entire population of that category.
Encountering Fran Taubman on this Forum is not tipping the scales in favor of a kindly apprehension of Jews-as-a-group.
Some years ago, Taubman posted numerous comments asserting that the holocaust story had to be true because so many Jews were missing.
Then Taubman waxed wroth when it was disclosed that his/her grandparents were prosperous members of a Baltimore synagogue. One would have thought that to be a happy situation: grandparents are alive and thriving.
Yet Taubman presumes to hector Ron Unz!! In my homespun process of assessing groups, Ron Unz stands out; he tips the scale.
So which “Jew” should we take as representative of Jews-as-a-group?
What matters, Franklin, is not so much “what you believe” as what biased information has led you to “believe” those things, and the impact that biased information has had on subsequent activities to this day.
The absolute totality of information about the world wars and alleged holocaust can never be known: as diligent as he was, even estimable David Irving could not interview every participant or read every memoir.
But the rational person must include and consider and balance all of the readily available information.
The crime of this era is that the “other side of the story” has not been permitted to be told and debated forthrightly.
That, in itself, is evidence against the Truth value of the holocaust story as alleged.
Sorry, I disagree with you here. The Protocols are as important as the Talmud and the crucifixion of Christ in making the case that the Hebrews have been waging a secret war against Europeans (descendants of Rome) for over 2000 years. The Protocols illustrate the depravity, lust for vengeance, and two faced nature of “the international Jew”.
Jews have been expelled from at least 109 European countries for their incessant swindling, perversion and corruption. Jews also opened the gates for Moslem hordes at Granada and Constantinople. They are at a minimum accessories for starting both WWI and WWII. And despite all the incessant braindead blather from Rychaert, the destruction of Palestine and the ongoing holocaust of Palestinians complete the picture.
The secret Jewish war against Gentiles and Germans did not start in 1939, or even 1933. It started thousands of years earlier. This war did not end in 1945, it is still ongoing today.
It is clear that Jews would love to exclude all their centuries of malfeasance, corruption and satanic behavior and how they projected their own crimes against humanity onto Germany from the discussion. But character is very relevant when judging the honesty and validity of witness testimony. We now have literally hundreds of dishonest testimony concerning German behavior at the Labor camps during the war made by Jews or by gentiles that they have tortured. We now know far more about Jewish extortion, coercion and blackmail of Western political, military leaders going back centuries than ever before.
Finally, centuries of Jewish control of media and their constant warping of history and narrative have become so crass and undeniable that Jewish kvetching has become synonymous with chutzpah.
Anti-semitism today is the only path to the truth. For a goyim not be called an anti-semite is proof of someone who is living in an artificial world of Jewish lies.
That is a rather unflattering portrait of Jonathan Greenblatt.
The Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion clearly is a forgery. We could make the excuse that Holocaustians make for Holohoaxers, that it conveys an “essential truth,” but it is not a document. It does not prove anything.
We don’t need the Protocols at this point. We have good research like Kevin MacDonald’s work. Even Henry Ford’s The International Jew is perfectly good if you ignore the scattered references to the Protocols.
I see @Brosi commenting farther down.
I understand that for people who are completely uneducated in anti-democratic political philosophy, the Protocols look like an important document, but it is not a document. Protocols is not a proof of anything.
If you hype Protocols as a proof of what Jews are doing, you just make yourself look like a dishonest fool.
Even if there were some possibility that Protocols was genuine — which is not the case — we don’t need it. We have scholarship that makes the case.
Now I have alienated a new batch of fools who want to believe in that thing.
My growing knowledge of the subject indicates that you are correct, Hadding, and the western world has been bamboozled; not only regarding the alleged “holocaust”, but also regarding National Socialism itself.
No wonder the word “nazi” is bandied around so freely, to invoke the cartoonish image the (undeniably evil) victors of the war wish to present of the sadly defeated National Socialists.
As an ideology and political philosophy, National Socialism seems to have a great deal to commend it. “Nazism”, on the other hand, has nothing boot jack-booted megalomania and sadism as it’s predominant characteristics. The latter bares no relation to the former.
That’s why correct terminology is so important!
Best regards,
Kali
No author of that essay about Asher Ginsberg is named. Not one specific citation is given. It’s crap.
Why do you think that is, Fran Taubman?
By May of 1933 James Waterman Wise, son of Rabbi Stephen Wise, had already published Swastika: The Nazi Terror, re-creating of that ancient symbol the perception that it is an icon for evil.
A few months before Waterman Wise turned the Swastika into a symbol of opprobrium, on March 24, 1933, “Judea Declared War on Germany,”
.https://www.wintersonnenwende.com/scriptorium/english/archives/articles/jdecwar.html
I have on my desk Michael Benson’s Gangsters vs. Nazis: How Jewish Mobsters Battled Nazis in Wartime America (c 2022).
Benson names other heads of Jewish gangs and writes extensively of how they organized
.
Tablet reviewed Benson’s book here. The reviewer named several of “100 anti-semitic” groups and that they
I wanted to know How and How Often “anti-semites” (aka Germans) “openly flaunted their hatred for Jews” and found this item on the YadVashem website: The Nazi Party and its Violence Against the Jews, 1933-1939: Violence as a Historiographical Concept, by Armin Nolzen
Nolzen opens by discussing Franz Neumann’s 1942 “masterpiece, Behemoth,” which argued that “violence n his masterpiece, Behemoth, first published in 1942, Franz Neumann referred to violence as “not just one unimportant phenomenon in the structure of National Socialist society.” Violence, Neumann argued, “is the very basis upon which the [Nazi] society rests.”
In the first two paragraphs of the essay, Essayist Nolzen uses the word “violent” twelve times, writing that
But in the third paragraph, the YadVashem essayist writes:
Benson informed his readers in Gangsters vs Nazis that Germans “wore brown shirts” and ” displayed swastika banners next to the Stars and Stripes” and said “Sieg Heil” and “goose-stepped” “ended up with busted lips and in hospitals,” their meetings broken up by Jewish gangsters, yet YadVashem informs us, “As far as the persecution of the Jews between 1933 and 1939 is concerned, little is known about the anti-Jewish violence of the Nazi party.”
On the opening page of FDR and the Jews, Breitman and Lichtman wrote:
The information before me shows that it was not Germans — “Nazis” — who were violent, but Jews.
Germans did not turn the swastika into a symbol synonymous with Hate; the son of Jewish rabbi Steven Wise did.
In the civilization I was raised in, it is a sin to speak evil of another, and to incite others to think evil of another, especially when the words and ideas thus spread are not true.
In the Roman Catholic tradition, one is called to repent and to make amends for sins committed against others.
Does the same exist in the Jewish tradition?
Do you think that the people who disseminated so much mal-information that
have an obligation to repent and to make reparations for the harm done?
Can we try to remain accurate here? In the context of the word “Nazi,” I said I would prefer the terminology Hitlerism over Nazism. The correct terminology is National Socialism, but specifically Hitler’s German National Socialism … bc it’s a national political program, duh. So thinking you can apply it across the board is not German National Socialism. That’s why Hitlerism is acceptable, and even a desireable term.
What I wrote in comment 1078 above is relevant here, and is my sincere belief. The only thing really necessary is to get rid of the Jews, who are the instigators and perpetuators of the word Nazi. They have good reason to like it, namely that Nazi is a counterfeit word, in accord with Jews as a counterfeit people. Their false identity that they have succeeded in foisting upon the ‘Nations of the world’ is counterfeit, ie. not genuine.
Chapter 14:
Did the Jews Foresee the World War?
“Before proceeding to a more detailed study of the connection between the written program of the documents which are called “The Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion,” and the actual program as it can be traced in real life, we shall now view those plans which were future when the Protocols were uttered. It must be borne in mind, however, that what was future in 1896 and 1905, may be past today, that what was plan then may be fulfillment now. To bear this in mind will be in exact accord with the expression of Protocol 22—”I have endeavored to indicate carefully the secrets of past and future events, and of those momentous occurrences of the near future toward which we are rushing in a stream of great crises.” Some of those “momentous occurrences” have come to pass, and with them a brighter light on the Question which we are studying.” (From The International Jew)
I have often wondered about The Protocols; whence did it appear? Who discovered it? If it’s not a “document,” what is it?
If it’s not authentic, it certainly seems to have been “reverse-engineered” based on confirmed historical behavior/precedent. And, Jews certainly seem to be blessed with the gift of clairvoyance regarding future wars, basement bombs, etc.
Really? Here is paragraph number 2, on the top left:
Here is a link to the entire book:
https://archive.org/details/waters-flowing-eastward-the-war-against-the-kingship-of-christ
In chapter 4 I think that Fry makes a convincing case for the Protocols being authentic.
I had assumed that an “expert” like yourself was familiar with the work. Leider nicht.
#1095 Mosafer Hastam
“According to Polish opinion, Poland stretches from the Rhine to the Dnieper, from the Baltic Sea to the Black Sea.”
If you don’t understand basic difference between Poles and Slavs then you should focuse on reading history before you compromise yourself writing stupid commments.
SLAVS lived close to Elbe river. Slavs who lived close to Elbe river were called (in German) Obodritie, Leutizen, Sorben. Not Poles.
Look at map of Eastern Germany in VIII century (map was made in 1869) “Germanische und slavische Volksstämme zwischen Elbe und Weichsel”:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sorbian_March
Maybe a picture will enlight you if you have problems with reading, my dear Kara Mustafa.
#1073 #1094 Tiptoethrutulips
Jesus, King of Jews! You are really talented in touching plenty of topics in one comment.
“Who was primarily responsible for the industrial and agricultural success/enrichment in the Sudetenland territory? “
Who was responsible for extermination of Polabian Slavs between X and XII century? [1]
Who was responsible for extermination of Old Prussians between XII and XV century? [2]
Who was responsible for Germanization of Poles during XIX century? [3]
Who was responsible for mass extermination of Slavs during 1939-1945?
(Answer: Germany).
“Who was butchering Germans in Danzig prior to WW2? “
Nobody butchered Germans in Gdańsk (Danzig). It is a German myth. Provide names of Germans allegedly murdered.
Fact is, that Slavs were butchered in Gdańsk by Germans in 1308. Gdańsk was founded by Slavs in X century and to XIV century it was a Slavic city. [4]
“How many Czechs were massacred when Germany reclaimed the Sudetenland?”
None.
How many Czechs were killed by Germans during war? Answer: 340,000.
How many Polish educated men and women were specially murdered by Germans during war? (Answer: 100,000- 150,000). [6]
—
[1] “Polabian Slavs, also known as Elbe Slavs,[a] is a collective term applied to a number of Lechitic (West Slavic) tribes who lived scattered along the Elbe river in what is today eastern Germany.
(…)
The Polabian Slavs were largely conquered by Saxons and Danes since the 9th century and were subsequently included and gradually assimilated within the Holy Roman Empire. “
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polabian_Slavs
[2] “Not until the 13th century were the Old Prussians subjugated and their lands conquered by the Teutonic Order. The remaining Old Prussians were assimilated during the following two centuries. “
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Prussians
[3] Germanisation of Poles during XIX and XX centuries.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germanisation_in_Poland_(1939%E2%80%931945) 1939-1945
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germanisation_of_Poles_during_the_Partitions 1772-1918
[4] “The city of Danzig (Gdańsk) was captured by the State of the Teutonic Order on 13 November 1308, resulting in a massacre of its inhabitants and marking the beginning of tensions between Poland and the Teutonic Order. “
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teutonic_takeover_of_Danzig_(Gda%C5%84sk)
“In 1308, the town was taken by Brandenburg and the Teutonic Knights restored order. Subsequently, the Knights took over control of the town. Primary sources record a massacre carried out by the Teutonic Knights against the local population,[40] of 10,000 people, but the exact number killed is subject of dispute in modern scholarship.[41]”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gda%C5%84sk
[5] Murdering Polish educated people by Germans.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intelligenzaktion
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generalplan_Ost
At the risk of boring Franny Taubman of the Baltimore Taubmans (I wonder why she left the idyllic city of Baltimore?), and forcing her to respond, although she often claims she never will/never does, I am still perplexed by your position in light of your admissions.
I certainly understand a hesitance to proclaim, “Let’s rid ourselves of all Jews!” and I am not suggesting support for same, but there is no dearth of confirmed sources and video/audio recordings of Jews/Rabbis proclaiming (and welcoming) the pending downfall of gentile nations. Of course, we can convince ourselves those are the words of a few Mad Hatters, but look around – evidence of the disintegration of European nations is everywhere, as is evidence of Jewish encouragement/promotion of same. (Soros, ADL, SPLC, AIPAC, Required oaths by Congress, Traficant “falling” off his tractor).
I do worry about the consequences of denying the reality of racial differences; if the Knoxville couple I previously mentioned had my mindset, they would have been on high alert anytime they were within the vicinity of a high black population, and they would have fought like wildcats to prevent their kidnapping. They were in a moving vehicle – pull out the bear spray kept stashed in your vehicle, risk the gunfire, as in most endeavors requiring a bit of skill/practice, like accurate shooting, the majority of blacks fail miserably. With criminal blacks, do not expect any mercy or an option for survival, as they devolve into unbelievable savagery on a whim. The total media blackout on the frequency and nature of their crimes in America is criminal; who controls our media, Mr. Ryckaert?
It is a picture of utter hypocrisy for Jewish organizations, like the NAACP, to pretend their true interests are for freedom and prosperity for all mankind, considering their strict codes of conduct for their societies, and the fact that there is no possible way they do not see the detrimental consequences of what they have wrought. Regarding those who claim no adherence to rabbinical laws, they are vastly over represented in perversions, banking/financial fraud, radical ideology, etc., and they donate to and protect their brethren who do so adhere. The grift springs eternal – who pays to recoup the fees associated with a kosher rating for your laundry detergent? Whomever buys the detergent, that’s who.
Based on what’s happening NOW, I fully understand the necessity of barring certain people from positions of authority/influence. How to go about it without hurting those who mean no harm, I have no idea.
I don’t agree with you on Hitler’s savagery or utter animosity for Slavs or Eastern Europeans, unless they were Bolsheviks. I have translated many of his speeches, and what he actually said never aligned with mainstream sources. But, I’ll focus on the Table Talks at some point.
I live in Texas, an obvious border state. Unlike the accepted reputation, southerners are not bigots, who terrorize black/brown people for fun. Or for any reason besides defense, but many southerners knew/know from experience what would happen after integration and the elevation of a people so disparate to Europeans, in general. They were correct on every point. Unlike years past, we now have security guards in parking lots at night since the arrival of Haitians across the borders. Do you listen to that Goblin Mayorkas swear in Congress the borders are secure? Is he a Jew? Yes, he is, so he’s a liar. And, he is indeed lying, because I can see it happening with my own eyes.
I take the Protocols to be an effort, on the one hand, to hide the truth in plain sight, and then, on the other hand, declare the truth to be a forgery and thereby banish it from view.
Just remember that in Soviet Russia, it was illegal even to have a copy.
The document is not much more than an outline for how a minority can manipulate and control the masses through the mass media in an age where popular democracy has taken root and undermined the class structure that cemented the ruler of the aristocracy thro8gh the divine right of kings doctrine that was sold to the masses.
It’s really the equivalent of Machiavelli’s Prince wherein he tells him how to manipulate things behind a facade of morality that justifies using any means to acquire and maintain his power.
Yes, whoever composed Protocols obviously knew something about Jews, but more generally this person knew the weaknesses of a liberal society. The fact that public opinion can be controlled by a few media-controlling “wire-pullers” was discussed by Henry Sumner Maine in 1886. “In a pure democracy, the ruling men will be the Wire-pullers and their friends.” https://books.google.com/books?id=S7fzKzTc3ckC&printsec=frontcover&dq=%22Henry+Sumner+Maine%22+%22wire-pullers%22&hl=en&newbks=1&newbks_redir=0&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjuzqijm-eAAxUMVTABHTzuDBEQ6AF6BAgEEAI#v=onepage&q=%22wire-pullers%22&f=false
Extrapolating existing trends to forecast future events, including wars, is something that many people do.
The International Congress of Women referred to “the coming ‘great war’” in 1900.
https://books.google.com/books?id=JTkEAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA229&dq=%22the+coming+great+war%22&hl=en&newbks=1&newbks_redir=0&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwijvIrkmOeAAxVNTjABHWCnC5cQ6AF6BAgCEAI#v=onepage&q=%22the%20coming%20great%20war%22&f=false
Daniel Louis Hanson wrote “The Coming European War” in 1911.
https://books.google.com/books?id=ed45AQAAMAAJ&pg=PA536&dq=%22coming+european+war%22&hl=en&newbks=1&newbks_redir=0&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwj7ponhl-eAAxXOSzABHbG7A48Q6AF6BAgMEAI#v=onepage&q&f=false
I don’t read a lot of Christian propaganda. The fact that this book has “Kingship of Christ” in the title doesn’t really scream credibility.
The Protocols are the McDonalds of WWII/holocaustianity revision.
To dine at Michelin tables, I suggest
Arthur Ruppin and the Production of the Modern Hebrew Culture, PhD dissertation for TelAviv University/book by Etan Bloom.
https://books.google.com/books?id=0kDGomVkrJgC&printsec=copyright#v=onepage&q&f=false
It’s quite long and packed with ideas that will make your head spin and turn on its head much of ADL’s own protocols. (Mental image: Egghead Greenblat as HumptyDumpty: Greensplat!)
For example: “Real Jews” are not Semites:
Yes, I ramble; you’re not the first to remark on it. I need to edit myself.
Based on your responses, I will assume we can agree – there is no group of people in history completely innocent of conquering/terrorizing/sometimes enslaving members of other groups, as well as members of their own group, yes?
A brief Germanic history:
“They first got the name of Germans in Roman times. North of the Rhine dwelt the Teutons, south of the Rhine dwelt the Gauls. But there came a time when a wild horde of Teutons crossed the Rhine, and drove the Gauls out. The Gauls then gave to the wild tribe the name of Germans or neighbours, and by degrees the name was given to the whole race. We still call them Germans, but they call themselves die Deutschen. That is a much newer name, and they did not receive until the end of the ninth century.”
Regarding Germany of yore, we have Romans invading from the south; Danes and Goths (not Slavs) invading from the north; Huns (Slavs?) invading from the east, all at various times in ancient history. Who’s the most guilty?
Who was responsible for extermination of Polabian Slavs between X and XII century? [1]
Were they exterminated or assimilated into the germanized territory known as Pomerania? Didn’t the Danes grab of few polish cookies from the Polabian cookie jar?
Who was responsible for extermination of Old Prussians between XII and XV century? [2]
I’m not too sure. The Old Prussians were once part of the Baltic Tribes, yes? And, weren’t they amongst those considered the “Baltic Vikings” for their habits of pillaging and plundering? Goths and Danes were mucking about in the Baltics hunting amber, so maybe they can bear some blame, but eventually, yes, the territory was germanized and converted to the Teutonic Order, but we can blame Jesus for that, not the Germans, as pagans were in the crosshairs of newly converted Christians.
Who was responsible for mass extermination of Slavs during 1939-1945?
There was no official program of extermination, and there was a declared war occurring during this time frame, yes? Patrick McNally asserts that the Czechs were fiercely fighting against the Bolsheviks/Reds earlier, and we know how those Reds were about slaughtering everyone in sight and getting their pounds of flesh.
Nobody butchered Germans in Gdańsk (Danzig). It is a German myth. Provide names of Germans allegedly murdered.
I’m not sure I believe you; I have seen photographs and read many accounts of Polish violence against ethnic Germans in Danzig. I don’t doubt Danzig had a Slavic origin, or perhaps a Goth or Dane founding, as well; Dublin, Ireland was settled by Vikings. I don’t know enough of its history to speak on it, but I doubt Hitler would invade for no good reason; he spent YEARS trying to find diplomatic solutions to the territorial conflicts, which were all inhabited by ethnic Germans, as far as I know. But, see my answer below to your assertion that Germans killed those Polish intellectuals.
[5] Murdering Polish educated people by Germans.
Are you suggesting these murders were committed by Germans, not Russians? I don’t bother to read any links to Wikipedia for any controversial or disputed events.
From John Wear/Inconvenient History:
American historian David Hoggan wrote that German-Polish relationships became strained by the increasing harshness with which the Polish authorities handled its German minority. More than 1 million ethnic Germans resided in Poland, and these Germans were the principal victims of the German-Polish crisis in the coming weeks. The Germans in Poland were subjected to increasing doses of violence from the dominant Poles. Ultimately, many thousands of Germans in Poland paid for this crisis with their lives. They were among the first victims of Britain’s war policy against Germany.[6]
On August 14, 1939, the Polish authorities in East Upper Silesia launched a campaign of mass arrests against the German minority. The Poles then proceeded to close and confiscate the remaining German businesses, clubs and welfare installations. The arrested Germans were forced to march toward the interior of Poland in prisoner columns. The various German groups in Poland were frantic by this time, and they feared that the Poles would attempt the total extermination of the German minority in the event of war. Thousands of Germans were seeking to escape arrest by crossing the border into Germany. Some of the worst recent Polish atrocities included the mutilation of several Germans. The Poles were warned not to regard their German minority as helpless hostages who could be butchered with impunity.[7]
From MICHIGAN STATE UNIVERSITY, DEPARTMENT OF HUMANITIES:
On April 13, 1943, German radio announced the discovery of a mass grave in Katyn forest near Smolensk, where, it was alleged, Soviet security forces had carried out executions of thousands of Polish officers. The claim was denounced by Stalin as a “monstrous invention by the German-fascist scoundrels” designed to sow discord among the war-time allies. The Polish government-in-exile, then in London, appealed to the International Red Cross to conduct an investigation, which provoked the Soviet government to sever relations with the London Poles. The Soviet government continued to deny any responsibility until, under Gorbachev, it admitted that the executions had been ordered by Stalin and carried out by the NKVD. Official documents turned over to the Polish government in 1992 revealed that 4,443 Polish officers had been executed at Katyn and another 16,000 at other sites.
VAE VICTIS
What now?
The NSDAP’s teaching about the physical anthropology of Jews was consistent with this. The NSDAP did not use semitisch as a racial term, although they did proclaim themselves Antisemiten, I suppose based on the kind of cultural distinction that H.S. Chamberlain made. (Chamberlain’s book Aryan Worldview said that the concept of an Aryan race was problematic.)
According to the NSDAP’s doctrine, Jews were a people (not a race) heavily mixed with other populations, with the two distinguishing racial components of European Jewry being forderasiatisch (Near-Eastern) and orientalisch (Arabid), with the Near-Eastern component being stronger.
Lothrop Stoddard in Racial Realities in Europe (1925) said that European Jews were of Alpine race. This is an oversimplification but there is a lot of truth in it, since, we now know, the maternal line of Ashkenazi Jews traces preponderantly to Italy and thereabouts.
You’re a psycho Solonto always was always will be. Like trying to pawn off the idea that the pilots of the Enola Gay were Jewish. You are literally two inches from the loony bin. If Jews bother you so much get off this site. You will not have to rant and rave, go to yoga work it out. High Jew hatred is a mental condition. I am sure your family can help you.
The Germans relocated the Jews from Hungary? To where.? They had no fuel no trains. They could not feed their war fronts or supply armaments. Germany was on its last legs. Hitler lost his mind and could not coalesce a withdraw and settlement. He ran Germany into the ground for vanity purposes. And you are telling me that in 1944, they relocated the Jews ? That they would become guerrilla fighters.
You H deniers can kiss my ass. You are out of your mind. The Germans invaded Hungary in 1944 to insure that Hungary would not make a separate agreement with the Allies. So Eichmann knowing that the war was lost, decided his last mission would be to murder as many Jews as possible, in a short amount of time. It lightening speed he rounded up and ghettoized 800,000 Hungarians. They were locked in ghettoes there was no way they could act as fighters. Every Jew was rounded up or shot.
Eichmann re tools his system and orders 8 muffled ovens from Topf and Sons, created a larger rail ramp for longer trains, and with obsessive intensity started a precise transfer to Auschwitz. Butz claimed the Germans transported workers to procure armaments under Speer. Every transport was tagged, every Jew identified, every train marked, with precision. No questions about any of this. None.
With the discovery of the transport and train documentation and the discover and verification of the Auschwitz Album, it became obvious that Eichmann was transferring mothers and babies to stop the next generation of Jews from being born. He transported the old and the sick, for no reason on earth but to murder them. It was Eichmanns raison d’être. Nothing I mean nothing you can do can countermand these facts.
Word of the transports, murder and cremation of the Jews hit Europe. The pope protested the transports, along with the Swedish set up an embassy to hide Jews. Switzerland and other countries threaten war crimes against the Hungarians if they did not stop the transports. Finally they did but no before 350,000 Jews were murdered the day they entered Auschwitz and were rejected for registration at the camp and were murdered.
There are photographs. The line forms at Auschwitz for the selection process, who would live and be registered at the camp and who would not and be cremated.
Non registered Jews being taken to the crematorium. Gosh they look like guerrillas to me.
Jews off to the crematorium.
It is a fact that some Hungarian Jews were taken to Austria. Relocation was the point.
The way that you are using photographs here is absurd. None of those people in those pictures are being harmed in any way.
That’s called a rumor. Pope Pius XII btw did not believe this rumor.
Goyim waiting to be gassed in Jewish showers:
Goyim in line to be genocided by Jews
Hungarian goyim who never made it our of Jewish death camps
What a clumsy bullshitter you are, Fran. “Torah” encourages you to lie: https://judaism.is/torah-encourages-lies.html Chabad encourages you to lie: https://judaism.is/chabad.html …and you are just a clumsy bullshitter.
Sehr entäuschend, sehr schade. Clearly you didn’t even bother to open this remarkable and well footnoted work. I would submit that this attitude and behavior shows a degree of arrogance and egotism exceeding that of David Irving, who you so disparage.
Waters Flowing Eastward is also very readable.
On top of exposing the Jewish lies and fraud concerning their obsession with discrediting and hiding the Protocols (even resorting to the death penalty for entire families for mere possession), Fry gets into the infamous Russian “pogroms” of the late 19th century. The explanation of the real causes of the “pogroms” below is an important piece of evidence in the Krystallnacht discussion earlier in this thread. It establishes a long and repeating pattern of Jewish treachery and treason, and illustrates that these secret Jewish Organizations (Fry calls it the Kahal) have repeatedly created false flags through assassinations, and as in the case of Dreyfuss leaked “secret” information.
Just as with Krystallnacht, the Holofraud, and Vinnitsa, a few Jewish casualties are massively inflated into hundreds, thousands, and even millions of deaths through the incessant Jewish kvetching and their monopoly on the media and the narrative.
Citation?
The entire Nuremberg racial superiority laws were nothing more then a country under mass psychosis.
You cannot defend any of it. The Slavs were a notch up from the Gypsies and the Jews and Hitler did his first gassing on his own people. He gassed (all documented because he did not hide it ) the physically and mentally disabled. Like 80,000 German citizens gassed with CO2 until the church and families screamed bloody murder especially the church. Then he stopped. When it came time for the Jews and political prisoners, mum was the word. The first gassing were on Russian POW’s in Auschwitz, an experiment.
You want to split hairs about Semites, language and the meaning of race vs religion? Knock yourselves out. Hitler was a psychotic, narcissistic megalomaniac who somehow enthralled a nation to erotic sadism. Germany and the SS were sadistic murderers dressed for swagger and effect in leather and colored lightening bolts on the SS uniforms.
Jew haters could not argue their way out of a papperbag. It will never be a numbers game re: the Jews. It was the first time in the history of the world a group of people were hunted down in foreign countries deliberately for eradication never before in the history of the world was that done to a non combatant citizenry. Never.!
ROFL. Jews: Histories biggest liars and hypocrites. And Fran Taubman is the hyprocrite Empress of the empire of hypocrites.
New Documentary Sheds Light On Israel’s Strict Prohibitions On Interracial Marriage
In Israel, intermarriage viewed as treason
Meanwhile, as I write this comment, Fat Franny and her Jewish psyhopath pals are busy holocausting all of Palestine. What a cunt.
Are those hideous goy-girls from Texas? It sure looks like it! What a nightmare……….
Very funny, Al, but you are wrong, and I hate to tell you…….BUT, it is a known fact, according to a fake-Jew eyewitness (affectionately called Pookie, by me), that those Hungarian Jews were NOT lined up and sorted, oh no….they were unceremoniously dumped straight from the tram, straight down the stairwell, straight to the gas chamber, then, “we cut the hair”………we all know The Thing….
If you’re going to argue with Skedaddled-From-Baltimore-After-We-Riled-Up-The-Blacks Taubman, you better get your facts straight.
Speaking of getting facts straight: Baltimore Fran didn’t say anything about GAS CHAMBERS.
Here’s what BFT Wrote, with perfect clarity and logic:
— A genius, that Eichmann; ran “longer trains” with no fuel; got approval for new furry ear muffs for the Gestapo when “[Germany] could not feed their war fronts or supply armaments.”
BFT: Nothing I mean nothing you can do can countermand these facts.
best I can figure is the people in the picture carried the train cars to whatever train station that was still intact (Allied firebombers made a special effort to firebomb “marshaling yards” — train stops, where many, many German & other civilians gathered to seek refuge from Allied firebombing of German civilian housing: ”
RoW: Nothing I mean nothing you can do can countermand these facts.
US Department of Interior documented the personnel and process by which US Air Force perfected created the maximal firestorm to cremate German and Japanese civilians Dugway Proving Ground..
Fun Fact: FDR ordered the acquisition of the grounds at Dugway early in 1938.
Very confusing statement.
Is BFT saying that all those people are dead-on-their-feet but that Nazis are going to re-vivify some of them — sorting out “those who live . . .and those who would not and be cremated” [sic]
But then BFT says,
and
But a crematory is for “disposing of dead bodies,” and they don’t look dead.
Anyway, who took those pictures?
What were they doing in those “foreign counties” in the first place, Fran? I mean besides tax farming, capitalising on Christian good will, exploiting peasants and formenting revolutions.
They could have assimilated and become people like any other. But supremacism and chauvinism prevented them.
Pernicious Jewish influence within their Host Nations, since emancipation, was undermining religious and cultural norms, whilst traditional Jewish exploitation of their Hosts, which had always been a feature of Jewish Supremacism (hence all the expulsions) continued apace, particularly in Germany during the Weimar years.
As today, Fran, Jews knew no scruples and grew more powerful from the debauchery they inflicted upon their Hosts, as Christian generosity and trust led to the undoing of Christian values, through the encroachment of Jewish subversive movements. To the extent that now the whole western world can be considered a Weimar Republic.
Yes. For eradication from the Host Society by expulsion. That much we know for certain.
Anything other than those known facts require hard evidence. Evidence which you lack.
Of course not Fran, because the other people’s of the world had countries of their own, and did not live as aliens, separated by choice and chauvinism, from those whom they lived amongst.
Because they were not enlisted in any overt military force does not, except in the most pedantic sense, mean that they were not combatants in the war. – A war which their co-ethnics had first declared, and then agitated for amongst the allies, with unrelenting will, employing bribery, blackmail and propaganda, to force unwilling nations into the bloodiest war in history.
And even though you now have a country of your own, albeit stolen by force of Jewish Terror, here you are, promoting a twisted weimaresque “woke” culture upon your Host Nations throughout the west, subverting our various cultures, undermining our traditional values, exploiting the good will of the useful idiot, whilst raking in the “reparations” AND helping to forment yet another bloody war! – And though that description certainly does not go for every Jew, it does go for your Community Leaders and powerful Jews thought the lands, whilst the good Jews, with notable exceptions such as Ron Unz, say and do nothing to end the madness.
You wanted Palestine for yourselves, and you took it. But you refuse to live there, insisting on remaining in our lands, whilst simultaneously flooding us with immigrants, whilst preaching about your very special and unique victimhood and crying “Never again”, despite that you obviously love it!
The moment Jews stop being Jews (which is a matter of choice, no genetics) the whole world will become a better place for all of us, including those formerly identified as Jews. That’s the solution to the Jewish question!
Best wishes,
Kali
Appears that assertion of mine was wrong. Apologies.
Proof that I was wrong, that it was NOT Jews who piloted the Enola Gay, is that there is no holiday or memorial to celebrate the accomplishments of the pilots of Enola Gay, in contrast to the accolades given to:
Louis Brandeis, who, among other war-inciting offenses, abused his position of trust to subvert Wilson’s effort to negotiate a “separate peace” with Turkey (see Henry Morgenthau, Sr. autobiography, All in A Lifetime https://archive.org/stream/bub_gb_P-UEAAAAYAAJ/bub_gb_P-UEAAAAYAAJ_djvu.txt ) Brandeis University https://www.brandeis.edu
Erich Mendelsohn, “the Jewish architect,” who collaborated on design for the perfection of firebombing of civilian housing in Germany (synagogue in Cleveland, OH https://clevelandhistorical.org/items/show/491)
Rabbi Steven Wise, Brandeis’s acolyte and tireless busybody who spread numerous lies about Germans, including that “Germans were making soap and lampshades of Jewish flesh” (See Moreira, https://www.amazon.com/Jew-Who-Defeated-Hitler-Morgenthau/dp/1616149582.) and co-opted the legal process by which Nuremberg trials were conducted (SEE i.e. The Challenging Years, Wise’s autobiography). (synagogue in NYCity https://swfs.org)
There, Fran; you have my apology.
Now, rather than rant on my psychological status (fragile as it might be), how about your responses to the questions posed in Comment #1147?
#1158 Tiptoethrutulips
“Based on your responses, I will assume we can agree – there is no group of people in history completely innocent of conquering/terrorizing/sometimes enslaving members of other groups, as well as members of their own group, yes?”
It’s all about proportions.
Every nation has bad and good events in history.
Good nation is nation which has more good events in history than bad ones.
For example, Germany has much more bad events in history than good.
Good events: they helped economic development in some regions of Slavic countries and many Germans became Slavs, Germans are also good in technology and science.
Bad events: systematic physical and cultural eradication of Slavs Drang nach Osten (‘Drive to the East’) [1] i.e. extermination of Slavs in Eastern Germany (Crusades against Slavs) [2], religious wars, Germanisation of Slavs in XVIII-XX centuries by Prussia and Austria, two world wars with over 60 milions casualities, love to technology which is effect causes that Germany destroys environment (every of 80 milion of Germans produce at average, over 600 kg of waste each year).
German’s history: 80% of bad things, 20% of good things.
“Regarding Germany of yore, we have Romans invading from the south; Danes and Goths (not Slavs) invading from the north; Huns (Slavs?) invading from the east, all at various times in ancient history. Who’s the most guilty?”
My theory is that in Roman times (c.a. I AD) Germania (area between Rhine and Vistula rivers) was inhabitated by Celtic, Scandinavian/Nordicic, Slavic and probably other tribes.
Germania was a border land just like Ukraine was a border land in XVI-XVIII centuries between Russia, Tatars and Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth.
That mix of Celts, Nords and Slavs evolved into this “thing” what we call today “Germany”.
Germania in I AD – Celts, Scandinavians/Nords, Slavs and other tribes.
Germania in XXI AD:
From Rhine to Oder river it has German-speaking inhabitants, from Oder river eastward it has Polish-speaking inhabitants.
“Are you suggesting these murders were committed by Germans, not Russians?”
Both Germans and Soviets murdered Poles, escpecially educated Poles (intelligentsia) [3].
This topic is about Germany so I mentioned only German atrocities against Polish elites.
For that reason I didn’t mention Ukrainians who murdered 100,000-150,000 Poles in Wolyn Massacre in 1943 year [4].
And I didn’t mention Jewish cooperation with Soviets (after 17 September 1939) in harrassment of Poles because it is also not related to the topic [5].
“From John Wear/Inconvenient History”
John Wear is dishonest person because he is agile Nazi-manipulator under disguise of objective and cultural historian.
He never provide proofs, he only cites pro-Nazi-presstitution opinions.
Even if he writes about German atrocities against other nations he puts it into context that those nations deserved the fate from Germans.
“(…) many thousands of Germans in Poland paid for this crisis with their lives. (…) The arrested Germans were forced to march toward the interior of Poland in prisoner columns. (…)Thousands of Germans were seeking to escape arrest by crossing the border into Germany. “
Show me proofs it has happend. Places. Names. Of course John Wear shoud provide proves, not you.
—-
[1] “Drang nach Osten (German: [‘Drive to the East’,[1][2] or ‘push eastward’,[3] ‘desire to push east'[4]) was the name for a 19th-century German nationalist intent to expand Germany into Slavic territories of Central and Eastern Europe.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drang_nach_Osten
[2] “Wendish Crusade
The Wendish Crusade (German: Wendenkreuzzug) was a military campaign in 1147, one of the Northern Crusades and a part of the Second Crusade, led primarily by the Kingdom of Germany within the Holy Roman Empire and directed against the Polabian Slavs (or “Wends”). The Wends were made up of the Slavic tribes of Abrotrites, Rani, Liutizians, Wagarians, and Pomeranians who lived east of the River Elbe in present-day northeast Germany and Poland.[1]”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wendish_Crusade
[3] “Intelligentsia”
“The intelligentsia is a status class composed of the university-educated people of a society who engage in the complex mental labours by which they critique, shape, and lead in the politics, policies, and culture of their society;[1] as such, the intelligentsia consists of scholars, academics, teachers, journalists, and literary writers.[2][3]
Conceptually, the intelligentsia status class arose in the late 18th century, during the Partitions of Poland (1772–1795). Etymologically, the 19th-century Polish intellectual Bronisław Trentowski coined the term inteligencja (intellectuals) to identify and describe the university-educated and professionally active social stratum of the patriotic bourgeoisie; men and women whose intellectualism would provide moral and political leadership to Poland in opposing the cultural hegemony of the Russian Empire.[4] “
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intelligentsia
[4] “Massacres of Poles in Volhynia and Eastern Galicia”
“The massacres of Poles in Volhynia and Eastern Galicia (…) were carried out in German-occupied Poland by the Ukrainian Insurgent Army (UPA) with the support of parts of the local Ukrainian population against the Polish minority in Volhynia, Eastern Galicia, parts of Polesia and Lublin region from 1943 to 1945.[3] The peak of the massacres took place in July and August 1943. The massacres were exceptionally brutal and affected primarily women and children.[4][1] The UPA’s actions resulted in about 50,000 to 100,000 deaths”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Massacres_of_Poles_in_Volhynia_and_Eastern_Galicia
[5]
Very “objective” article from Wikipedia, anyway…still a source of basic knowledge about Polish-Jewish relationships in 20-thies of XX century, Reader should make further research.
“Judeo-Communism”
“Żydokomuna (…), Polish for “Judeo-Communism” [1] is an anti-communist[2] and antisemitic canard,[3][4] or a pejorative stereotype,[5][6] suggesting that most Jews collaborated with the Soviet Union in importing communism into Poland, or that there was an exclusively Jewish conspiracy to do so.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C5%BBydokomuna
Thanks, Hadding.
I’ve read only half of Etan Bloom’s amazing dissertation; it’s complex and rich (and well written).
One dominant theme is Arthur Ruppin’s profound commitment to eugenics and the eugenic theories of the age, including adoption (with some refinements) of the ideas of Chamberlain; of Haeckel; of “one of his teachers, Felix von Luschan,” and the like.
Ruppin was born, educated, and developed a career/s in Germany, a culture he dearly loved and was keen to be considered part-of and contributing-to (although he lived and worked predominantly in the new zionist Palestine, Ruppin never learned to speak or write Hebrew).
Bloom credits Ruppin with having developed the first “scientific” “statistical analysis” of the Jewish population. He applied his (award-winning) eugenic and racial theories to those anthropological and demographic data in developing policies for creating the “Hebrew” state.
Forgive another cut-and-paste attempt to encapsulate what Bloom calls “Ruppin’s transvaluation rhetoric” and some of the ideas that “fueled” Ruppin’s weltanschauung:
I selected this passage, concerning Ruppin winning the Krupp Prize for his eugenics essay, mostly because it includes Ruppin’s declaration that the State should replace God.
In another dissertation, of lesser quality and importance, concerning the reaction of German evangelical churches to De-Nazification in the American zone , that author cites Karl Jasper’s series of lectures and
This shorter dissertation mentions Joint Chiefs of Staff [JCS] Directive 1067 as the operating plan for “de-nazification.” According to wikipedia, 1067 was a slightly modified form of the Morgenthau plan,
which at least in its initial days, was executed by “Morgenthau Boys from US Treasury Dept.”
Based on a reading of Cora Sol Goldstein’s Capturing the German Eye, it appears Ruppin’s godless State + perpetual guilt won out over Jasper’s hope for a “confession of German guilt to the world, and restructuring society with God at the centre.”
There is no good reason to believe that anybody was gassed.
The Euthanasia Decree was issued to the medical profession at the very beginning of the war. It was a permission for physicians to do mercy-killing of hopeless cases. The purpose was to stop wasting on hopeless cases medical resources and personnel that could be devoted to war-wounded.
During the two years that the Euthanasia Decree was in effect, the number euthanized was not great: 71,000, which was about 1 in 1000 Germans. It means that only persons in an extremely bad condition might be euthanized.
The physician’s tool for euthanasia is the hypodermic needle. With an hypodermic needle, the euthanasia could be done quietly.
The suggestion that injections would not have sufficed due to the imagined large number of victims, so that it would have been necessary to build gas-chambers to which those victims would then have to be transported for euthanasia, is absurd. Gassing would have been messier (because gassed persons tend to make messes), more expensive, more difficult, and harder to do quietly. It was also unjustified by the numbers. I have never seen good evidence that this happened.
It was not “the church” but Bishop Galen alone who preached against euthanasia when he heard about it. He gave a sermon in 1941 insinuating that soldiers wounded on the Eastern Front might be euthanized, which was then quoted in leaflets dropped by Anglo-American propaganda. This forced a ceremonious revocation of the Euthanasia Decree.
There is no good evidence that anybody else was gassed either.
Bishop Galen himself, by the way, seemed to be a skeptic of the gassing accusation (as was Bishop Faulhaber, and apparently many in the hierarchies of both major churches). He gave a speech in Rome in 1946 shortly before his death (at his residence in the British zone of occupation) in which he compared unfavorably the behavior of the postwar occupiers of Germany to the behavior of Hitler’s government:
Deborah Lipstadt even says in effect that there was no genocide of Gypsies. She points out that Gypsies served in the German armed forces.
The whole Slavic thing was already discussed and has become totally absurd even to bring up at this point.
https://codoh.com/library/document/anti-gentiles-deny-the-5-million/en/
It is plain enough that a large part of Protocols was copied from Maurice Joly’s Dialogue in Hell. You should know that this is the main strike against it.
The anonymous hack who wrote that essay from TBR that you posted should have specifically addressed that point. The failure to do so, while vaguely pointing to an entire book about “the Kingship of Christ” as the supposed proof of the Protocols‘ genuineness, will surely leave most thoughtful people unimpressed. Anybody who thumps a book instead of quoting chapter and verse obviously doesn’t want his claim to be checked.
What a pity that “revisionism” has not yet reached the Encyclopaedia Britannica:
Source: https://www.britannica.com/event/T4-Program
Of course, I totally agree. Did you think that you were making a point?
Whew! I guess I had this coming. It’s so much easier to argue with Skedaddled-From-Baltimore Taubman.
Yes, sometimes this is true, but only if an accurate determination of degree is possible, and within what context/perimeters? Regarding ancient history, there are too many unknowns, translation issues, etc., I’m not saying it’s irrelevant, but we can only go back so far. And, on that note:
In recently recorded history, Mongolians ravaged and enslaved Eastern Europeans, as did Arabs and Turks, to a much greater degree and for a much greater length of time than did Germans. Furthermore, Europeans, in general, did much less slave raiding/trading than Africans, Turks and Arabs; Jewish merchants were heavily involved in the trade, particularly into South America. Europeans, who came late and left first, ended the trade, did they not? Yet, WHO is in the crosshairs for slave blame/reparations? Nary an Arab, African, Turk or Mongolian. If proportions apply to Germany, ancient and modern, then don’t they apply to everyone else for everything else? This is the problem with the historical blame game, and to a certain degree, good/bad, right/wrong, just/unjust is relative, as in my “father delivering illegal justice to daughter’s rapists/torturers/murderers” analogy. We don’t always know the whole story. Sometimes, wrongs can not be made right. Channon Christian’s father can seek retribution, but he will never again see his daughter in this world, whether he has his vengeance or not.
And, Germany was NOT responsible for both world wars, so I disagree with your analysis.
I am a German (Dutch/Irish too), so am I a thing? What’s interesting about this ethnic mixture you describe is that, for the most part, Scandinavians and Europeans from the north, north west, and north eastern territories are very similar. I was born in a central Texas town comprised of Germans, Poles, Czechs and Hungarians, and if you say, in Europe, these groups are “the same,” they all get their knickers in a twist. But, the town was lovely, peaceful and everyone looked out for each other; from an “outsiders” perspective, they all have much in common, and are a very similar people.
I do not believe this, and this is a serious allegation. Please provide me an instance of his dishonesty. I don’t know Mr. Wear personally, but I was reading at Inconvenient History long before I argued with anyone over the Holocaust or details on the Wars, and I do check for affirmative sources from other scholars; I never found an instance of inaccuracy.
You casually dismiss the allegations about Germans massacring Polish intellectuals, which was indeed a proven falsehood, as “no harm, no foul,” well, what about proportionality regarding lies against Germany? Were six million Jews killed? Plus, what, 1-2 million more Slavs/Russians, whomever? Do you also believe the stories of ripping babies, limb by limb, and tossing them into open fire pits? How is it, fufu, that NO ONE in America, now or then, hears about what the Bolsheviks and Red Russians were doing to their people, the Polish people, and everyone else in Eastern Europe? I have taken great pains over the years to discover who is lying to western people about nearly everything – it sounds crazy, but western media was captured many years ago, in publishing too, and now there is a near total blackout on truth about yesterday and today. And, Hitler is perhaps lied about more than any known figure.
I’m not anti-Polish, but I am anti-Wikipedia, so I can’t really consider your cited sources, but I’ll see if I can find a “Polish violence against Germans” source more acceptable to you.
And another thing, since I frequently search official “Jewish” sites for information/sources, I receive “relative” feeds to my cell phone in the form of “you tube shorts” videos. I recently received a blip from a young English boy, he looked about 19-20, at the ruins of Auschwitz-Birkenau, and he said, he was involved in a program to inform people about the horrors of the Holocaust, and the need to ensure Germany continues to make the necessary restitution to the Jewish people. In 2023? When will it end? Did the Soviet Union pay reparations to the families of the Katyn Massacre victims? I know the answer to that question……
Some times people feel so strongly about a given subject, and want something to be true so bad, that they let their emotions get the best of themselves. They engage in self deception, and they concoct their own ‘evidence’ to support it, ie they manufacture it.
They hurt their own cause, though, whatever that cause might be, when they do that. [And no doubt sometimes the erroneous ‘evidence’ may have originated from a hostile source, an agent provocateur, whose intention was to discredit the cause.]
Dead giveaways are anachronistic language or concepts, or, it’s stated too plainly, as if to order, or, it’s the only obscure source.
Albert Pike’s ‘three world wars’ with it’s talk of ‘Fascism’ when the term hadn’t even been invented at the time is an example. Another example would be the infamous Legions of Satan book purportedly written in the 1780’s describing a supposed speech of Lord Cornwallis at his surrender about how the US would some day return to Britain, though no one can seem to find even a single copy of the said book.
Then there was the supposed vast plot to kill Lincoln discovered outlined in the leaves of a British cavalry training manual decades after the events. Too many other examples besides those to go into, here.
If the truth is uncertain on a subject, leave it at that, and only go by what you know as fact. Though it’s almost something of a cliché, it still holds true:
‘Honesty really is the best policy.’
Interesting character, Bishop/Cardinal Clemens vonGalen:
Vatican News Service informs us:
https://www.vatican.va/news_services/liturgy/saints/ns_lit_doc_20051009_von-galen_en.html
His family had been nobility for two centuries when Galen was born in 1878.
He became bishop of Münster in 1933, “the first diocesan Bishop to be consecrated under Hitler’s regime.” And he was outspoken from the get-go, writing letters, delivering sermons critical of NSDAP to the extent that Pope Pius XI called him to Rome to consult on what became the 1937 encyclical, “To the Bishops of Germany,” “notwithstanding Nazi opposition.”
Galen, dubbed “The Lion of Münster” spoke out against “State confiscation of Church property and the programmatic euthanasia carried out by the regime.”
The Vatican News Service noted cryptically (and in my opinion, tendentiously),
.
I say “tendentiously” because the report gives the impression that NSDAP bombed the bishop’s residence, but Jörg Friedrich reports otherwise:
In addition to citing Galen’s leadership in reversing the euthanasia program, Friedrich devotes several pages to the attacks churches in Münster had suffered over the centuries; and more pages to the Oct. 10, 1943 attack itself, when The Lion of Münster personally worked to save the many people in the cathedral when it was firebombed; worked for several days attempting to save first this, then another part of the extraordinary structure, all to no avail.
Friedrich quotes the navigator who was ordered to fly the mission: Ellis B. Scripture is quoted saying that he “was very reluctant to fly this mission . . . it turned me off completely.” But his commander told him, “Look Captain, this is W-A-R . . .We’re here to beat the hell out of the Germans and we’re going to do it . . .”
Scripture flew the mission, targeting the front steps of the church of the man who stood up to Hitler and reversed the euthanasia program.
Curiously, in an extensive oral interview, Ellis Scripture makes no mention of his stance in opposition to bombing churches. https://95thbg.com/cms/2020/9/1/ellis-b-scripture
Scumbag.
The point I wanted to make is that you need to believe that “the Jews” don’t control some institutions of information, but all, even the Encyclopaedia Britannica. Thus people like you must believe in a total conspiracy, similar to flat earth believers. Your microscopic Hitler-did-no-wrong sect has a similar prospect of success as the sect of the flat earthers.
Very clever! That was entertaining and informative.
I will never forgive FDR or Churchill for what they did….
The Princess Bride is one of the best movies ever. The Jews are funny; it’s too bad they don’t focus mainly on comedy instead of Destroying Amalek!
thanks
especially liked “check the pockets for loose change”
“Absurd” I guess you do not understand the context of the photographs. You may want to look at the entire album.
https://mchekc.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/01/AuschwitzAlbum-1.pdf
or this YouTube video:
Or let one of the biggest H deniers of our times Carlos Mattogno put the photos I posted in context. You say that the photos are absurd because nothing is happening to these people? Maybe nothing is happening to them in the photograph but they are on their way to Crematorium #4 at Auschwitz identified by Mattogno and their journey from the train platform. The last place
these Jews were ever seen on this earth. 475,000 Jews were transported to Auschwitz in the summer of 1944, 80,000 were registered for labour in the camp. And you are correct some 20,000 were transported elsewhere for armaments labor under Speer. Some to Austria. The remainder of the Jews were never registered in the camp, 350,000 Jews died the day they arrived after the selection process. They were murdered and cremated in one of the 5 crematoriums and 75 ovens at Auschwitz.
You cannot argue these facts. They are facts. If the Germans had transported the Jews elsewhere they are not recorded, and they surely would have published them in print as it would have left them off the hook for exterminating the Jews. So the Jews arrived at the Auschwitz and a mother and daughter would disappear and the son and the father would enter the camp and never see their family members again. Last seen at one of the 5 crematorium and over 75 ovens at Auschwitz.
To the Jew obsessed these photos of the arrival of the Hungarian Jews at Auschwitz in the Auschwitz Album along with the detailed train documents, naming and counting of every Jew are like Kryptonite, it makes Jew haters like Carolyn flee the post. There is nothing to discuss. A while ago H denial had a flash, but since the 1970’s main stream historians have been busy refuting the Pseudoscience of H denial, and it is now a dead field, left only to the those mentally unhealthy people obsessed with Jews. It is a frightful group. Many here on UR.
H denial is dead as a historical field. Like the judge in the Irving case said. It is impossible to separate Jew hatred from H denial. H denial is not an objective history, it is perpetrated by Jew haters promoting a conspiracy that the Jews faked the Holocaust. Because it is a non objective field of study like main stream historians, the Judge ruled that everything Irving wrote was biased and distorted based on his partiality to Germany. And mainstream historians and most rational people agreed putting the field of H denial in the rear view mirror as a distorted Jew hatred field perpetrated by Jew haters, not objective historians.
What you have left is Jew obsessed people who are so frightened by their on irrational hatred they are no longer just people with a story, they are obsessed, irrational and mentally unable to handle reason and facts. Much like Carolyn Yeager who riles against Jews who present history as being tainted because they are Jews. Like she wants the history as she sees it and screams when it is not. Like the total nut job she is, or obsesses over minor details like was Kristallnacht was a false flag.
Not one H denier has ever found the missing 350,000 documented Jews that disappeared at Auschwitz. Not a one. That is because they were murdered and cremated the day they arrived. That is what the facts show.
Hear the photos and captions by Carlos Mattogno. on a tour thru Auschwitz from Crematorium #2 to Crematorium #4. Here is a book that will help you with the facts. The Holocaust in Hungary: Evolution of a Genocide …
You are an obsessed Jew hater, with a sadistic tendency like your German heroes. The worst of the worst Jew haters who takes pleasure out of doxing me and publishing my mothers obituary on the UR. How delightful…. A little sadistic. Or pursing my interest and family…. you love to do that. I guess you recognize another sadistic Jew obsessed hater in Al Ligouri who takes pleasure in trying to humiliate me and Jews with childish memes. Posting photos of me.
You complain about the evil Jews and look at your own evilness and vile disposition towards a Jew on these postings.
Your posting show a mentally frightened obsessed man who does not even understand what you are so freighted about so you throw every fear that you have to the wall like spaghetti to see what you can stick on the Jews. Look Jew obsession is just not a good place to be, it is not. It is stupid and hateful. Most of the time you do not even know what you are talking about. You claim that my post on the Hungarian Jews seemed confusing. There is more documentation on the Hungarian Jews than almost any other event during the war. It is one of the most factual events documented, by Hungarians, by the Germans, by the Jews and by the world because it happened inexplicably at the end of the war with the world watching. Even Himmler told Eichmann to stop waisting resources and time on transporting Jews to their death.
READ about it.
The Holocaust in Hungary: Evolution of a Genocide (Documenting Life and Destruction: Holocaust Sources in Context) First Edition
by Zoltán Vági (Author), László Csősz (Author), Gábor Kádár (Author)
The “context” that you are adding is what is absurd.
There were about 5 million Jews in Axis Europe at its maximum expanse and it is clear that most of them survived the war, because The Economist reported the number of “survivors” still alive 75 years later as 400,000.
https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/2020/01/25/archivists-are-racing-to-identify-every-jewish-holocaust-victim
It is also not hard specifically to find Hungarian Jews who survived.
https://observers.france24.com/en/europe/20220128-98-year-old-holocaust-survivor-shares-her-story-on-tiktok
The huge numbers of survivors should deflate your presumption that any crowd of Hungarian Jews or other people shown in a photograph taken at Auschwitz will all be killed.
On top of that, it is conclusively proven in various ways that the Kremas, which you allege as the means by which that huge crowd will be dispatched, were not and could not be used for that.
You are in Jewish Propaganda Lala-Land.
Check your language.
According to Doktah Rachell Levine,
https://www.nationalreview.com/news/mothers-or-egg-producers-top-hhs-official-rachel-levine-praises-clinic-for-gender-affirming-language/
hmm
Does Rachell still have testicles?
PS Are these “egg producers” Jewish?
https://www.unz.com/runz/hitler-churchill-the-holocaust-and-the-war-in-ukraine/?showcomments#comment-6112380
How do it know?
Are they about to be cremated?
If you would get off of your Christian hating high horse and read the book, you would see that Fry devotes more than a chapter to these typical Jewish attempt at obfuscation.
Here is one of the paragraphs from the chapter “MORE ATTEMPTS AT REFUTATION ” where he addresses Joly’s book.
Rather than claiming that the Protocols were plagiarized from Joly, it was Joly who was the plagiarist. There are numerous versions of the Protocols, it was a “living document”, further refined with each iteration. Jacob Schiff and Henry Morgentau Jr. both and different versions of the Protocols.
What becomes clear to those with an open mind willing to read a book that dares to use the word “Christian” in its title, is the degree to which the Kahal went and still goes to today, to suppress the Protocols. There was a multi-generational coordinated effort to discredit it and to suppress its dissemination. This alone can be considered significant. It mirrors Volataire’s quip about “discovering those who rule over you”.
Jews like to claim that the Protocols are libelous, so libelous in fact that Jews supported the death penalty for mere possession in many countries. However, a document is not libelous if it is true. Here is what Henry Ford said about the Protocols over 100 years ago, long before all the evidence of what Jews are up to came out during WWII and the Judaic holocaust of Palestine.
Unfortunately, Ford did not know what we know now. The Protocols had already been released by Herzl at the International Zionist Conference in 1897 in Basle.
LOL. Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.
The Kahal and its secret society tentacles have many means of censorship, the strongest is self-censorship. “The Jews” don’t have to “control” Britannica to “nudge” it into framing contentious issues in a manner that befits them. Your Judaic dissembling is more proof that you are a Jew.
Dear Fran,
Because I enjoy looking at old photo’s I downloaded that Auschwitz album and took a close look to see if I could gleen some “context”.
What I saw was photo’s of large numbers of predominantly healthy, well-fed (certainly not “starving” as you have claimed in earlier comments, whilst none appear to wearing soiled clothing, as you have also claimed elsewhere) people at a transport hub/railway station (with one or two taken in woodland).
Some pics show people in their underwear, obviously awaiting their turn to freshen up in the showers, whilst others show groups in clean uniforms, presumably after their showers.
I see no plumes of smoke anywhere, which in itself suggests that no crematoriums were operational in the location, as you also claim.
You insist that the majority of these people were murdered, for no other reason than their whereabouts after the war was unknown. Though it is known that the plan was to transport them eastward, where they would have ended up in what became Soviet territory, and so simply got lost behind the Iron Curtain. This seems the most rational explanation to me.
You have no evidence of murder – unless doubtful and contradictory eye witness testimony and tortured “confessions”, that don’t fit the known facts, count as evidence of anything other than an agenda to vilify a defeated enemy and fund the creation of a “Jewish state” on the land of a terrorised people.
All evidence and physical proof that the claims of mass murder are unfounded you dismiss out if hand, whilst insisting that those of us who accept those proofs do so only because of some irrational hatred of Jews.
So it strikes me that the irrational hatred is that expressed by the Jewish people, including yourself, toward anyone who refuses to accept their religiously held, unsupported, beliefs.
You, Fran, tend to rant about “Jew hate”, rave about the Holocaustian mythos, and repeat your mantra of unique and special Jewish suffering, over and over again, whilst determinedly ignoring the deaths of 60 million Gentiles (also called “goyim” by your Jewish brethren), as if their very real suffering counts for nothing at all!
I believe that your fixation on the special, unique (unproven) suffering of your people is pathological, and is a sign of a psychosis, which you obviously enjoy, and which profits your people in oh, so many ways.
As the world accelerates toward yet another unnecessary world war, interest in the causes of the previous two is growing amongst those of us intelligent enough to care to stop the next. And with that interest, so more and more become interested in historic revisionism, and alerted to the lies of “Jewish suffering”. So you are wrong to suggest that revisionism is dead, Fran. Actually, it’s on the threshold of becoming mainstream.
Many people are unsurprisingly angry about the enormity of the lies they have been taught to accept as truth all of their lives, and angry that the originators of those lies hold so much undeserved power within our societies.
I would suggest that, for your own sake, you Jews go ahead and find your own solution to the problems you continue to inflict upon your Host Nations (including Palestine), lest the aggrieved masses become a mob and find one for you.
Best wishes,
Kali.
“…It is also not hard specifically to find Hungarian Jews who survived…”
You give an example of one woman only, you need to account for some 400,000 Hungarian Jews who didn’t survive. Auschwitz was partly a workcamp and partly a deathcamp. Those unfit for work were “sent to the left”, never to be seen again by their family who were “sent to the right”. This woman typically has a tattooed number on her arm of those employed as workers.. From your link:
So if people “sent to the left” were not killed, why has nobody seen them again? And if they were “sent to camps in the East” why has nobody found any trace of such camps: no maps, no administration, no testimonies by Nazi personel, Jewish survivors or local bystanders. No Nazi ever captured denied the mass killing, they said they only followed orders, nobody talked about “camps in the East”. Eichmann didn’t mention them in his taped interview with van Sassen while he still was a free man and thus not tortured.
This challenge still stands for you deniers: https://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.com/2011/07/challenge-to-supporters-of-revisionist.html
Hypocrite. The entire TALMUDIC racial superiority laws are nothing more than a TRIBE under mass SATANIC psychosis. https://judaism.is/who-is-human.html
“The seed of the goyim is like an animal.” Sanhedrin 74b
“All Gentile children are animals.” Yebamoth 98a
“Gentile sperm leads to barbaric offspring”
https://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4006385,00.html
Israeli Soldier: “They are animals, we are humans!”
for·ger·y | ˈfôrjərē | noun (plural forgeries) • a perfect copy of an original document, signature, banknote, or work of art: The ADL admitted that the Protocols of the Elders of Zion are a forgery, a perfect copy of the original. https://judaism.is/antisemitism.html#lexicon
This is a previous correspondence with Mark Bahner about the Hungarian Jews:
As you insist there is not one single instance or record of Hungarian Jew survival, and as only the “fit to work” were permitted to live, every single Hungarian Jew survivor would therefore be amongst the 10% selected, which is approximately 40,000 persons, as those who perished would have no actual record of life beyond the camps, and the official survivor record lists 50,000 – 70,000 registered (not sure why the list is not enumerated), perhaps you start your search here:
REGISTRATION CARDS OF HOLOCAUST SURVIVORS RETURNING TO HUNGARY FROM GERMANY IN 1945 AND 1946. (ID: 31357)
Title or Main Description: Registration cards of Holocaust survivors returning to Hungary from Germany in 1945 and 1946. Survivors were registered by the Hungarian section of the World Jewish Congress. The c. 50000-70000 cards are arranged in alphabetical order. Acc. to 1996 USHMM fellow Tam s Stark, many survivors, both urban and rural, chose not to register with the WJC in 1945 out of fear of reprisal.
……………………………
The above is from the Holocaust Survivors and Victims Database. Note, many chose not to register.
George Soros is a Jew from Hungary; he survived, and managed to avoid the camps altogether.
Another:
This week on Those Who Were There: Voices from the Holocaust, we’re listening to the testimony of Esther Schwartzman. Born in Mukachevo between the world wars…… This was until March 1944, when Hitler installed a new, radical rightwing government in Hungary. Within days, Adolf Eichmann and special teams of SS arrived to plan the deportation of Hungarian Jewry. Between May 15 and July 7, almost 450,000 Hungarian Jews were sent to Auschwitz. About two-thirds were immediately sent to the gas chambers.
Another, who says no Germans were involved in the deportation:
Nearly 75 years ago, Hungarian police forced Rozsa Heisler onto a train, along with thousands of other Hungarian Jews.
“We were crammed together for five days without food or water,” she recalls. “We didn’t know where we were going. Then we reached Auschwitz.”
Heisler’s mother and grandfather were murdered at the concentration camp. She and her sister, sent on to a labor camp, survived on leftover potato peels.
Now 93, the bright-eyed great-grandmother lives in a cozy apartment in Budapest, a city she proudly calls home. But she has no illusions about the role her country played decades before. “We didn’t see any German soldiers until we reached Auschwitz,” she says. “It was Hungarians who deported us.”
Galling as it is to seem to encourage the arrogance of Franklin’s “challenge,” —
BFT posted a contrived narrative: no evidence, no proof, just suppositions and assertions.
If BFT can spin a narrative, so can anyone else.
1. There’s this:
That is, Jews in Hungary became Hungarians.
2. Maybe they transited to South America, or Russia, or anywhere else that zionists in Israel paid Eichmann to help them escape to, and they stopped being Jews.
(Certainly Germany needed the money, at that point, Germany needed money more than they needed labor, especially problem-laborers such as Jews had been in other work camps, where they deliberately brought typhus, etc.)
3. Eichmann had worked in Hungary since at least the late 1930s, working to get Jews OUT of Hungary and out of Europe, with special effort to get Hungarian Jews to Palestine.
3a. We know this from David Ben-Gurion himself. When BenGurion was captured, BenGurion told the Knesset:
What did the plan change TO?
4. As the above research/dissertation uncovered, Hungarian Jews resisted migrating to Palestine.
Moreover, as the research disclosed, once in Palestine, Hungarian Jews either took the first chance to leave Palestine, or hid/changed their identity.
5. What happened to all those Hungarian Jews, you ask?
They did not go from transit on trains that had no fuel straight to crematoria spewing colored smoke in fuzzy ear-muffs; they went from being Jews to being Hungarian. Or something else. They changed their identity.
6. If you want to know what happened to Hungarian Jews, Franklin, pose your challenge to George Soros. He bought and sold them.
7. If I recall correctly, some number of Hungarian Jews paid Eichmann to get out of Hungary.
Surely those Jews would be proud to respond to your BS challenge, Franklin. Find them — find those Hungarian Jews who bought their way out of Hungary and left their fellow Jews behind. They’ll be happy to tell their stories, no doubt.
8. Relating to #3a, above: Why was BenGurion so eager to capture, silence, and kill Eichmann, with whom he and the Jewish Joint had collaborated for almost a decade?
Is it plausible that the Jewish Agency paid Eichmann to get rid of Jews that the zionist project did not have the capacity to accommodate? And that above all, in 1960 when Eichmann was captured; and Jews in Israel were restive and wanted to leave, and Mizrahi were not getting along with Ashkenazi and Hungarian Jews were not getting along with anyone, (SEE #1. and #2, above), BenGurion had to keep OTHER Jews from knowing that Jews had PAID Eichmann/Germans to kill Jews, to transit Jews to places other than Israel, pick a scenario: anyone is as likely as anything that inhabits BFT’s fevered dreams. Eichmann KNEW, and he had to be silenced.
9. According to David Engel, “professor of holocaustianity at New York University (iirc) and “scholar” of holocaustianity at USHMM, holocaust became The Holocaust just after the Eichmann trial. https://www.amazon.com/Holocaust-Third-Reich-Seminar-Studies/dp/1408249944
Until that time — for over a decade immediately after the war(s) in Europe, nobody talked about an alleged holocaust, as many on UnzForum have noted.
Just a coincidence of course, that immediately post-Eichmann (when the last witness is suitably dispatched), PR agencies; Spielberg/Hollywood; sayanim worldwide rushed to the battle stations to produce a smokescreen against the possibility that some truthiness might emerge from the Eichmann affair.
Just a coincidence.
— Whadda Ya think?
Frannie is simply regurgitated nonsense that was annihilated in a previous thread on this issue.
So if Hungarians deported them under those conditions to terrible camp, why in the world did she return to live in Hungary among the people who allegedly traumatized her where she would be daily reminded of who did it to her?
Your posts are so mind boggling ignorant of any other significant history other than Douglas Reed and John Wear. It is suffocating to reading you, not worth answering, as there is nothing to answer, you lack a nuance or scope or wider birth of historical context. Like looking at the photo albums and seeing a bunch of people Those people disappeared several hours after they arrived. Do you understand disappear? No one on earth ever saw them again. You go with your family and take a train, you arrive, you mother and sister go one way you go another and you never ever see your mother and sister again. EVER and your sister is a baby. Understand? There was standing room only at Auschwitz. There is a name associated to every Jew that arrived via train They were never seen again. This is not a magic act.
But the assertion that I am in a host country, that being the US?? OMFG
Wait a second, I am a US Citizen. I am not in a host country. The US is made up of all national and ethnicities, all equal citizens. There is an Indian American running for the GOP to president of the United States. How fucking stupid can you be? My father and his brothers served in WW2 and my uncle lost his leg. So who do you think you are talking to with “host country”.
You can believe what you want that the Jews are a fake people and their history is also fake and made up, according to your mentor Douglas Reed (and your other sources), but for gods sake Kali read something else. At least listen to an opposing point of view, there are many. Why not read : The Antiquities of the Jews by Flavius Joseph, and entire history to 1st AD. We are not a scam people. We are a 3500 year old religion and people based on national rendezvous as a nation (not one or two people a nation) with a divine being on Mt. Sinai. Where we received the 10 commandments. How do I know it was a national revelation and not an individual one? Before the rendezvous there was a census taken. A shekel for an adult, half of a shekel for a child. Perhaps you recognize our national currency in Israel today is the Shekel yes from biblical times!!! The Shekel, from thousands of years ago till today. We are the indigenous people of Israel/ Palestine which was named by the Romans after the Philistines, Israel’s arch enemies. Before the Romans conquered Israel, it was called Israel. Palestine never represented a tribe or people.
There never has been a country called Palestine run by Palestinians, never. Never an Arab ruler. Jerusalem is the capitol of Israel, it always was, it was never the capitol of any Palestinian or Arab rule. It was a province of the Ottoman Empire. Learn your fucking history. Before 1967 there were no national people called the Palestinians, they were Arabs from Arabia. A territory never mentioned in the Koran once. Mohammed never set foot in Israel ever. It is all Jewish since biblical times. If you still think we are fake. Study the Dead Sea Scrolls, also a complete history of the bible circa 3rd century BCE. BCE Kali!!! Certainly more truthful are the Dead Sea Scrolls than Douglas Read LOL? If you not care for Jewish history told by Jews. Read: The History of the Jews by Paul Johnson a catholic.
Read: Ethics of our fathers: Our entire ethics in a book.
Chapter 1.
.
We throughout our 3500 year old history have had great sages and prophets, great thinkers and doers writers, scientists etc. The Jews are an integral part of the make up the world. I know that is difficult for you to hear but it is true. We have a national identity based on our teachings and ethics, and our devotion to a divine being that we pray to in our own unique way thru unique rituals. Our connection to the divine is unbreakable. Much of Western Jurisprudence and the rights of the individual is based on Jewish law, which since King Solomon was the first to stand for the rights of the individual and not the state. The US capitol has a fresco of Moses. The US founding fathers acknowledged the Jewish contribution to the freedom of the individual that the US constituion is based on. AND THE FOUNDING FATHERS WROTE ABOUT IT KALI!!! WE Jews have given the world much to the world. Pick a subject any subject. We hold a lot of knowledge and history, our sages like Hillel brilliant men. We spawned two other regions based on Abraham, out founder.
If you cannot follow what I am saying (possible you are to dense to be able to enter a competing ideology in your mind to form two opposing ideologies at the same time) stay with the mentally challenged Jew haters like Al and Solonto on UR go ahead. But know that these people in their own sense of self are deeply disturbed and represent nothing of any significance other than hate. Which is a road leading no where. LOOK at their post. Especially Al’s. Do you see a person worth knowing there. In his unmitigated depravity accuses the Jews of being depraved? How does that work for you? How does all of the vile Jew hatred spewed here work for you.
You once asked me, know you have on many occasions begged me to give up my uniqueness as a Jew which for whatever reason you describe as a victimology. You say if I would only join the human race, if only all the Jews will give up their uniqueness and join the rest of the world, everything will be safe once again. All the world will be well. Does that mean I get to join you Kali, and your merry band of good for nothing anarchist? Because I want no part of you or your ilk. I will never give up my uniqueness as a Jew, my relationship with G-d, AND my relationship with other Jews. Never. You are as dump as a doorpost for asking such a stupid thing. Why does everyone in the world need to be the same? I have a history, a family, and a community that I love.
I am a proud Jew. Now go away and do some reading. You are an embarrassment of ignorance.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Josephus
This guy wrote books on Jewish history don’t you think he knows a thing or two about the history of the Jews? Way better then Douglas Reed
source????
— Whadda Ya think?
You got any sources that site Eichmann trying to get the Jews out of Hungary from the 1930’s? Really because Germany never interfered or was in any way connected to Hungary until they INVADED IT , in 1944. This post is more stupid than the Enola Gay post. You are completely clueless. Care to site some reading material. I do not think so. The thing about you Solonto is not only are you vile, you are literally dumber then a door post.
Indeed.
Rather than wholly trust other sources, even those I believed to be truthful/reliable, I spent days watching/listening to Shoah interviews. I was stunned by the contradictions in their testimonies to the official narrative. Jewish families nearly all expressed prosperity in Europe, and particularly in Germany, under “Hitlerite” governance. Curiously, the polish Jews seem to have suffered more in Poland before Hitler’s arrival.
Any attempt to understand what Hitler was doing, especially if you find his actions reasonable/necessary considering circumstances, is renounced as utter callousness or maniacal hatred. I am a mother; I see those photos of displaced women/children/elderly, and naturally understand their fear and desperation. I was separated from my daughter, age 13, at an international airport, and I thought I would have a nervous breakdown.
It’s clear to me what eventually occurred was not the original intent, and no plan or effort of extermination was ever intended.
#1178 Tiptoethrutulips
“It’s all about proportions. (…)
Yes, sometimes this is true, but only if an accurate determination of degree is possible, and within what context/perimeters?”
It is difficult to assess if Sumer was a good or bad country because we have limited sources from 5,500 year ago.
But in this thread, we are talking about European countries with quite well described history of the last 1000 years.
“If proportions apply to Germany, ancient and modern, then don’t they apply to everyone else for everything else?”
“Rule of proportions” applies to other countries as well.
For example, Poland also has bad and good events in history but good events were more than bad ones.
“And, Germany was NOT responsible for both world wars, so I disagree with your analysis.”
I understand. It is debatable who were a real creators of these catastrophies.
I should wrote that Germany willingly took part in First and Second World Wars.
“I am a German (Dutch/Irish too), so am I a thing? “
I’m sorry, I got a bit carried away but the more I read about Germany the more I’m losing respect for this nation who thinks that it is better than others (it is quite opposite).
“That mix of Celts, Nords and Slavs evolved into this “thing” what we call today “Germany”. “
It is only my THEORY. Other theory proposed Odyssey who claims that Germans came from Asia.
“I do not believe this, and this is a serious allegation. Please provide me an instance of his dishonesty.”
I have got long disscussion with Mr John Wear about WWII.
At that time I thought that he is honest researcher but with a lack of knowledge from “Eastern” (Belarussian, Polish, Yugoslavian, Soviet) perspective.
So I tried to provide some questions and facts disillusing alleged German innocency and naivety before and during WWII.
You can check threads:
https://www.unz.com/ejones/why-its-easier-to-talk-to-a-robot-than-to-a-jew/#comment-5985487
https://www.unz.com/ejones/germania-delenda-est/
Finally, he refused to talk with me anymore.
“I’m not anti-Polish, but I am anti-Wikipedia, so I can’t really consider your cited sources, but I’ll see if I can find a “Polish violence against Germans” source more acceptable to you.”
English Wikipedia is biased in topics controversial for Anglosaxon zone. In topics related to other countries it is rather quite neutral.
I think that it is good practice to check other language versions of Wikipedia when it comes to controversial topic.
Anyway, non-Wikipedia sources I can offer
“The War Report – Abridged Version” about German atrocities in Poland during World War II. Report was made by Polish specialists.
https://instytutstratwojennych.pl/en/abridged-war-report
I can offer you also German’s bestialities in Belarussia:
https://khatyn.by/en/
Khatyn_massacre (Belarussia).
“At least 5,295 Belarusian settlements were burned and destroyed by the Nazis, and often all their inhabitants were killed (some amounting up to 1,500 victims) as a punishment for collaboration with partisans.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khatyn_massacre [not to be confused with Khatyn massacre of Polish POW in 1940]
National Memorial of the Republic of Belarus
” It commemorates particularly the more than 600 “burnt villages” which, together with their inhabitants, were destroyed in the National Socialist genocide and the Nazi policy of the “burnt earth” in Belarus since the beginning of the Second World War. “
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Memorial_of_the_Republic_of_Belarus
And I can offer you detailed article (in Polish) about 100,000 Poles expelled by Germans from Zamość area in 1942.
“Robbed childrens. “I was fit for germanization” “(“Zrabowane dzieci. “Nadawałem się do zniemczenia”)
https://www.dw.com/pl/zrabowane-dzieci-mia%C5%82em-niebieskie-oczy-nadawa%C5%82em-si%C4%99-do-zniemczenia/a-40387693
I meant to say, the Polish Jews suffered in Polish society more than elsewhere in Europe. According to the testimony I heard.
Don’t you think if they were lying they would have gotten their stories straight. Just go to YouTube and google arrival to Auschwitz. You will hear identical stories from people from many different countries and languages all saying the same thing. Human nature is not an automaton machine. You have 5 people watch a car crash and you will get 5 different stories. The gassing and cremation of the Jews is told during the war with diaries, the exact same statements that Hoss made in his Nuremberg confession. Now how did he know what an SS doctor wrote in his diaries to match statements to Hoss, who had never seen them. No one had seen them. Many extemporaneous diaries during the war all the same story as the Sonderkammandos and the Germans. No German officer’s children posthumously ever came forward to say that their parents were lying that the Holocaust and the gassing and cremation of the Jews never took place. No one other than the Revisionist. Imagine that. You have no proof other than yourselves. It is a proof positive story, from the victims from the perpetrators and from the by standers. Non Jewish Hungarians said it was like living in a horror movie everyday, watching the Jews being rounded up.
True, but why are you guys & girls dumb enough to keep regurgitating it with her??? You are no better than she is. She and fufu and Franklin should be ignored, not encouraged by replies. Dumb!
Fran, it is NOT possible to gas/shoot 350,000 people in 45-50 days, and incinerate and dispose of their remains in entirety, with no residual evidence of same. Beloved Wikipedia says, 80% of 434,000 were gassed upon arrival. So, approximately 6,944 people were gassed/incinerated/ashes dumped each day for 50 days? It can not be done. And, let’s not forget to add the thousands of gypsies, chased by the Hounds of Hell around their lunch table, who were also dispatched during this time frame.
Who says Jews are a fake people? Clearly, they are alive and well, thriving and accruing fortunes in societies they denounce and undermine constantly; they are sent packing for bad behavior, but always return. Always.
If “Israel” belongs to Jews by divine right, why didn’t Jews organize themselves and take it?
Who is Edom? Amalek? Did they also reside in Israel?
Our founding legal system was based more upon Greek/Roman civilization. The founders also specified the country was to be the home of white men (aka English/northern Europeans, maybe other Europeans). Once the pioneering/settling is primarily done, the Jews swarm in…..and you’re not the only one aware of the philosophies of the Ancients – the ancient opinions expressed about Jewish perfidy and habits in their organization mirror what is said today. Maybe it’s you.
Well, that’s quite some rant there, Fran. Either I triggered you or you’ve been reading Douglas Reed and he did.
But you and I both know that I won’t stop suggesting that those who identify as Jews let go of their egoistic “special unique suffering”, along with their archaic, blood spattered religion, and joint the rest of Mankind (those who survive the fall of Western Civilisation, at least) on our evolutionary journey back to God (with an “o”), or better to say “Godliness” (again, with an “o”) which lies at the heart of each of us, thereby to discover your True uniqueness.
Attempting to hold back time, to hold onto a 3,000 year old myth, and the “laws” which it foisted upon the Judaites, and subsequently / the system of law, as you rightly point out, that we in the west labour under today, is a fool’s errand. Learn to truly know yourself (as opposed to the ego idea you have if yourself) and you won’t need any law or laws to tell you how to behave. As a conscious, sentient woman, you will discover the Truth at your heart, and live according to that Truth.
Lots of love,
Kali
Well, that really does depend on ones approach, my dear Carolyn. Though I absolutely agree with you that regurgitating points over and over is not productive.
I agree about “fufu” too; a totally pointless commenter if ever their was one. The best thing about her(?) posts, I find, is not reading them.
As far as Fran (I don’t know about Franklin yet) goes, I like to remember that it’s through the cracks that the light gets in (and out).
Love,
Kali.
Fran,
In an earlier correspondence, I asked you to view the testimony of a particular witness, whom I believed was utterly unreliable and obviously lying, yet, you refused and explained you could not be bothered.
Ruth Grunwald describes her childhood in her Jewish enclave in Frankfurt, Germany as idyllic. Her family and neighbors prospered, she attended a Jewish school, they observed Jewish traditions and holidays, and she confirmed good relations with gentile Germans. She said, no one in her family was mistreated. She was born a few years before Hitler came to power, so she is describing “Hitlerite” Germany.
Ms. Grunwald further states, everything changed after Kristallnacht. Her father was sent to a camp, but WW1 veterans were given special consideration, so he returned soon afterwards and her family left Germany in March, 1939. She stayed in touch with relatives, by mail, who were sent to live in Theresienstadt during the war. She did NOT say they died therein; I assume therefore they survived.
This was not the story I was expecting to hear. She is not the only witness to describe Jewish life in Germany thusly.
Some say, Kristallnacht was specifically done (by subversives) to further agitate/implicate Hitler, and stir up the hornet’s nest, as the Munich Agreement, signed 09/30/38, was a step towards peace for Germany, but a ruination of a possible war. Rather conveniently, Kristallnacht occurred 11/09/38, just in time to ruin Hitler’s plan and Jewish/Gentile peaceful relations. Jewish Luck (and Coincidences) springs eternal, does it not? I tend to believe the conspiracy theorists about the big K are correct.
Speaking of conspiracies – 11/09 – 09/11……….The other day, I was watching the movie, Independence Day, released in 1996. I am fairly certain I noticed the countdown timer on Jeff Goldblum’s computer screen began at 9:11. It was just a flash; I refrained from rewinding as I feel I already know enough information to drive myself crazy.
You can run but you cannot hide, FROM THE FACTS of the Holocaust, and your infatuation with Adolph and the NS. Horrid. Choke on it.
bECAUSE SILENCE IS ASSENT.
Alleges as proof of the holocaust:
I’ve explained this to you the last time you spread your bull shit on this site about that every point you kept making. The ddin’;t come forward because following the Nuremberg trials, it was illegal for Germans to contraDICT THE FINDINGS OF THE TRIBUNAL and questioning the holocaust purveyor narrative is now illegal in Germany and other countries. You make it illegal to tell the truth, and then express wonderment that few people risk going to jail for something that does not really personally affect them except to the extent they are willing and determined to stand for the truth.
The holocaust purveyors, on the other hand, are incentivised to spread the most absurd lies because they will thereby demand entitlements for reparations without taking the slightest risk that people will incur the wrath of criminal laws to challenge them while it also allegedly validates their victim hood that then entitles them to subjugate other people and pursue whatever agenda serves their interest no matter how much harm it inflicts on others they dare not challenge because it is protected by their sanctifiedfalse narrative.
This is what the “permanent” Holocaust debate thread is for. You’ve been posting on that plenty, and so has Tulip and Franklin, Fran, etc. Guess it’s not getting enough attention so it’s been brought to this thread, which was dealing with some more specialized questions which are now derailed by this “regurgitation.”
I was glad The Old Philosopher used that word; it gave me the opportunity to say what I wanted to say. At the least, it’s bad strategy, Kali, to substitute for more insightful & engaging content what is regurgitated leftovers. Light through the cracks is a matter of opinion; it’s just not mine.
But hey, it’s a free country so have at it and enjoy yourselves.
No, it isn’t. Silence can speak volumes. Do you ever listen to silence?
We got it already!!!
Germans only tell lies; Poles, Jews, allies, communists tell nothing but the unvarnished truth. Sarc. off. Even your “hero” Churchill did not believe this when he compared the truthfulness of German propaganda with that of the allies’. He found German propaganda much more truthful than that of the allies’.
Ok ok you got a burr up your ass about Germany. It must really rankle you to see baaad Germany doing so well, as compared to your shithole country.
It’s been my experience over many years in heavy engineering with several employers, that good and capable people can work wonders with the bad or questionabl systems and tools. And bad people from a training and personal disposition perspective, can be given the best systems and tools but produce nothing but garbage. I’ll let you guess who is who.
Bear in mind that your disparaging of German reports does not help your position: Why should anyone give greater credence to Polish reports than German reports??? If both are equally bad then both are properly ignored.
However, if I read a report that is written in a neutral tone about certain findings that sound reasonable to an intelligent person that has been “around the block” so to speak, and without opinions or graphical embellishments that are scientifically impossible or non-verifiable, I’m inclined to give that report more credence than the stuff you and Franny dish out with your copy and paste skill which, no doubt, are excellent.
But, carry on! You do provide comic relief, as does Franny, with your shrill caterwauling.
I am combining two of your posts. The Holocaust and Holocaust denial are vast fields, that have been discussed and argued about for years. All of your questions have already been answered ad nauseam, all you need to do is look. I am not going to go tit for tat with you on specifics. The most comprehensive and thorough website on debunking Holocaust denial is Holocaust Controversies. If you look thru it, you will find all of the answers to your questions. The question about unreliable witnesses, as well as your claim that it was impossible to burn all of those bodies in the given time period. All of your questions have been answered and documented like crazy. Look at the website. In minute profound detail.
https://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.com
There is also a specific paper on the subject of body disposal called: Body Disposal at Auschwitz: The end of Holocaust denial. See link. In brief Topf and sons engineer Kurt Prufer was the design engineer of the ovens who worked closely with Bischoff the head of building design at Auschwitz, for the request for rapid burn time and greater body capacity. There are in depth reports using stop watches, Prufer gives a full accounting. In essence they stopped cremating individual bodies and started to incinerate many bodies at one time. Many of the bodies were small children. There is a dissertation on this. The incineration caused tremendous heat from the multi muffled ovens. So the process was self fueling. They only needed fuel to start the ovens. The ovens broke down after 24-7 use, so there were complication. But the body disposal has been fully documented There are other Holocaust denial websites. The one from the Jewish Virtual Library covers every denial question brought up and is pretty comprehensive. I will include those links.
The bottom line is that Holocaust denial is Jew hatred. Much like yourself. You are a perfect example of a H denier. You hate Jews. The irony is while denying the Holocaust, all you Jew haters think the Jews deserved it. Don’t you find that ironic? You cannot separate Jew hatred from Holocaust denial.
The reason Carolyn is so bugged by you all hailing me with questions is because she knows you all know that the Holocaust happened, and that millions of Jews were murdered, not only by gasing but by shooting when liquidating ghettoes, which is how my own family of survivors experienced. They were saved by Christians when they were away from the ghetto and it was being liquidated. Christian Poles saved them. These people are all witness. Do you think my cousins family were not shot? In one day my cousins lost 45 members of their family including elderly grandparents. A story especially in the Ukraine and points East where Jews were not sent to camps. A story told over and over again. A resistance movement was formed from the survivors of the ghettoes, in the forest. The head was the Belski Brothers. There is a film on it.
If you think it is impossible to burn bodies fast enough to make the count, think about how improbable it would be to make up the Holocaust from so many countries, involving so many people with different languages and experiences. It is simply impossible, not just improbable. People ask me questions like you to convince yourself that it did not happen. But everyone, every denier at THIS POINT IN TIME, knows that it is factual.
For instance with the walls closing in on the Germans in 1944, why transport all of those sick, elderly disabled Jews and babies to Auschwitz? They could not feed nor cloth them. The Jews were under lock and key in Ghettoes. It is hard to come up with a reason. They were not transporting them to be re transited. Absurd. Transited to wear. The war was about to end.
Eichmann transported the Hungarian Jews to Auschwitz in 1944 because he thought it was his sworn duty to execute the orders to eradicate the Jews. That is what he said in his testimony. Eichmann never denied the transport, gassing and cremation of the Jews, he spoke openly about it. He said he thought it was the right think to do as the war was ending. You can listen to his testimony on YouTube.
For more questions: Remember Holocaust deniers are Jew haters. Nothing more nothing less. Cosmic Jew haters. Do you think the world is stupid? No one believes Holocaust deniers, no one. Not even the deniers like Carolyn Yeager herself. She knows. She knows because she wants to ignore the evidence. She runs from it.
https://www.auschwitz.org/en/history/holocaust-denial/
https://www.againstholocaustdistortion.org/news/a-brief-history-of-holocaust-denial-and-distortion
https://antisemitism.adl.org/denial/
https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/background-and-overview-of-holocaust-denial
https://phdn.org/archives/holocaust-history.org/auschwitz/body-disposal/
It would indeed be refreshing to read some facts that you could provide. By that I mean verifiable forensic facts and not a photo essay with unsubstantiated opinions, and your shrill caterwauling.
If the Germans did not gas and cremate the Jews, or shoot them in ghettoes, if there was not orders for the eradication of the Jews, men, women and children, so there would be no future generation of Jews, you would have heard about it by family members. Fuck what you say about the tyranny of coming forward with the truth. The fear of not going along with the story. Fuck that a thousand times. If the Germans were innocent they would scream bloody murder, their families, their friends. No way anyone could concoct a fake story of mass murder and rope in the perpetrators with fear.
Get a fucking life. Germans would have written posthumously from now to kingdom come. What do you hear. Crickets. No one German child has come forward to say their parents did not do it. Not a one. As a matter of fact Eichmanns children have been arrested for terrorizing Jews in Argentina. They do not deny it. The glow in it.
What a sad excuse by deniers. “Oh everyone is afraid to speak the truth they will be arrested” Many parts about the Holocaust including the numbers have been questions and changed. No one fears the truth but deniers.
I do wish I had not read about The Holocaust Debate Thread. I’d never visited, but I could not resist — like a wreck on the highway.
—
Taubman frightens me. I think she is unhinged; I hope she is not representative of most Jews.
Taubman frightens me because she is so irrational; engages in abusive attacks; never responds directly to questions nor does she read and give thought to responses — often with sources cited and linked– to her claims.
She not so much a playground bully but a snarling junk-yard dog.
Taubman frightens me because when I go about my day and my life and may encounter Jewish people, I think, “Taubman.” “This person is unhinged. This person will be abusive and irrational.”
Taubman is beyond redemption, and
“I seek no victory. For the honor of my soul and character lies in deviating from the paths of fools, not in conquering them.”
Frankly, history from 1,000 years past is often fraught with errors/interpretations/omissions, etc. People argue incessantly about happenings 20 years ago, so….
At the risk of “schooling” you, I must say this about historical writing, journalism, so on:
I attended a city council meeting; Speaker made a comment, and an exchange with council members ensued; Speaker was reasonable, correct and prevailed in his points; the following day, Newspaper printed the exchange, correctly with regard to actual words spoken, however the order of comments was reversed, more than once, which then gave the appearance of Speaker as combative and incorrect. Newspaper, technically, told no lie, nor omitted a statement, but the deception was still achieved.
I make no claim of extraordinary intellect or superior knowledge regarding WW1/WW2/Holocaust/Hitler, but I have spent half my life reviewing evidence/testimony looking for inconsistencies, contradictions, obvious omissions, and statements that convey impossibilities; some are by error, some are by deception, and sometimes you just can not know.
I reviewed your comments with John Wear. It appears to me, you just don’t like what he has to say. Your hostility was apparent, and Mr. Wear, as usual, polite and measured. I thought you treated him terribly, and you essentially called him a liar. Now, squaring off with Fran, Al Liguori, myself, etc., is fine because we all sling a bit of mud, now and again, and we all have it coming, but I can’t say I blame Mr. Wear for discontinuing conversations with you. That said, we all say things we shouldn’t, so I hope you take no personal offense.
I think the “good country vs. bad country” is an argument premise that has no resolution. The age of consent for sex in Mexico is 12; is that good or bad? Mexicans say, Si, se puede! I say, you are all a bunch of child rapists. Muhammad says, Allah recommends 9 year old girls…….
I would like to continue the conversation about Germans in Poland, as I suspect you are in Poland (?), and I had German relatives in Poland, but I need to keep researching, and I’ll get back to you unless I’ve offended you, and you would rather not.
I concur, but rather than just pushing the “agree” button, I thought I’d chime in and say, I’m glad to see someone else make an entire paragraph from one loooong sentence.
Fran, I do not hate Jews, and I do not hate you. I am sorry for your family, and of course, I understand why you feel the way you do.
Having said that, the facts are the facts, and the exaggerations and falsehoods are obvious. Holocaust “denial” is not claiming, no Jews were killed, no Jews were separated and sent to camps, no war atrocities occurred, nor is it saying every Jewish person deserved their fate, particularly the young. I imagine if I had been living in Germany at that time, I would have helped Jews get out of Germany. And, that was the objective, not their extermination. And, I can’t help but agree with that goal, considering what Jews were doing/are doing to Gentile society. I’m not suggesting camps, but their positions of authority in government, academia, MEDIA, NGO’s, appears detrimental.
Jews have Israel and that’s where they should primarily live; no more subsidies from the US, no more dual citizenship, no more influence in America, and just in case Ms. Yeager’s reading, no more war in Ukraine so Jews can swoop in and buy up resources for agriculture, minerals, (is there oil in Ukraine?), etc., and no more wars for Israel anywhere. Fight your own battles.
Silence indeed is deafening in circumstances when a response is required but none is forthcoming – like when no applause great the words of a speaker.
Except that lies left unrefuted easily to into truths among those who lack the information to refute them.
Dear Carolyn,
Why allow what others choose to comment on affect your own input? Why not continue to present the broader picture just as you have been?
We’ve been having a very interesting and valuable discussion here regarding the whole WW2/NS Germany narrative, ubiquitous use of pejorative terms, lies and deceptions surrounding Kristallnacht, etc. And we still have a long way to go, particularlt if we wish to illuminate the determination of the allies, under pressure from certain Jewish quarters, to forment war against Hitler’s Germany.
I don’t see why such an important discussion need come to an end because others, significantly Fran Taubman, have joined the conversation and have brought the “Holocaust debate” along with them – mostly to refute Fran’s shrill accusations.
But we can just as easily widen the discussion once again, to include the broader topics, thereby to encourage others (the silent reader) to see the bigger picture and come closer to understanding the breadth and the depth of the lies we all grew up believing.
We really can do it all. And in the meantime, all those who wish to ignore Fran, Franklyn, fufu, et al, are free to do so.
Best regards,
Kali
I think that it was quite a long time after the war before Britannica even had anything about Jews being gassed. When I was growing up we had the edition of Britannica from 1961 and I don’t think that it had anything about that. If it was mentioned at all, it certainly was not emphasized. For a long time many educated people presumed that the gassed-Jews story was simply war-propaganda, like the similar stories from the First World War.
It is amazing how this disgusting Yenta shows up at the end of every the holofraud thread and then barfs all over the comment section with her typical yid lies. It would appear that she is getting paid to bury and commentary that contradicts her satanic beliefs.
In any case, I “ignored” that yenta bitch.
Protocols of Elders of Zion may “tickle the ears” as the good book says, but Heinrich Graetz’s History of the Jews, published in the middle 1800s (1853 – 1856) offers an important insight into how very many Jews were taught to think about their history and identity in the immediate era under discussion that laid a foundation that many — i.e. Taubman — have assiduously built upon.
Graetz was the “first to write a comprehensive history of the Jews from a Jewish perspective.” His personality and position, even in Jewish society of the time, was decidedly cranky and vituperative. Accordingly, his history was stridently anti-Christian and focused on what Jewish scholars call the “lachrymose” identity of the Jewish people — a people forever put-upon and suffering; the eternal victim.
Contrary popular perception, the majority of Jews were not at all conversant in “secular” topics until very late — Jacob Raisin’s The Haskalah Movement explains how Eastern Jews only began to teach —
https://www.gutenberg.org/cache/epub/15921/pg15921-images.html#chap2
their young secular subjects –rather, to send their young to “Christian” schools in Germany and Austria to learn secular subjects, in the Haskalah period, roughly coinciding with Graetz’s publication of History of the Jews.
In relatively short order, Graetz’s History became a fixture in many Jewish homes. It was a standard BarMitzvah gift. Sometime in the 1920s or early 1930s Rabbi Steven Wise wrote to his wife that he was deeply immersed in Graetz and hoped she and their children were also reading it.
Etan Bloom includes this extraordinary description of Arthur Ruppin’s encounter with Graetz and with zionism:
.
That Graetzverein seems to have been particularly involved with zionism as it meets to study Graetz’s History indicates that Graetz’s perspective was intricately entwined with zionist ideology.
Back to Bloom:
“A portrayal of a Jew from 2000 BC”
Hey Mr. Genius in 2000 BC “Jews” did not yet exist. Even if we take Abraham as the first “Jew” then 2000 BC is at least 300 years too early. But before Jews settled outside the Middle East and partly mixed with the local populations, either by intermarriage or by welcoming converts, the Jews of the Middle East were not racially different from the rest of the population, as is still the case with the Jews from Arab countries.
The picture you show BTW is from a (non-Semitic) Sumerian. Sumerian civilization (the oldest civilization of the world) lasted from ca. 4000 BC to 2350 BC in what is now Iraq, after which it was overtaken by the Semitic Akkadians. So that picture is not of a Semite, let alone of a Jew.
Next time you try to interpret historic pictures, first do your homework, otherwise I cannot call you “Mr. Genius” anymore!
The mention of the Holocaust in the Encyclopaedia Britannica is dealt with here:
https://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.com/2017/05/rebutting-twitter-denial-most-popular.html#britannica
Dear Sir, Please note that the refutation of these types of falsehoods has already been done again and again, and better than those now participating here can do. For someone like Fran, FuFu and Franklin, it would be good enough (better, in my mind) to offer a link to the revisionist writing (book or article) that covers that best. It’s doubtful they will read it bc they DO NOT WANT TO KNOW. They are here only to disrupt the intelligent discussion of this subject, NOT to actually debate it.
Understanding that, I see the point in doing as John Wear does, which is to give a link to that already published information and leave it at that. That is the equivalent of silence. Most efforts at ‘debate’ only lead to more disinformation and downright lying being put forth as rebuttal. All three of the above named holocaustians include plenty of links that supposedly support what they’re saying. Do I read them? Hell no. I don’t waste my time bc I’m already convinced of what is true … but so are they.
My point is that intelligent readers get bored with this rehashing (regurgitation?) and go elsewhere. And not-so-intelligent people are not going to read long comments or anything more difficult than 6th grade level prose and jokes/ridicule. That’s why I say it’s bad strategy — a waste of the free-speech opportunity here.
#1215 HdC
“Germans only tell lies;”
Usually. Germans have inferiority complex therefore they try to prove their supremacy by humiliating others. Just like Jews.
Lying is a part of their culture.
” It must really rankle you to see baaad Germany doing so well (…)”
Really? I didn’t notice that Germany is in good conditions.
“(…) as compared to your shithole country. “
At least my country is real country with 1000 year history, not like artificial 150 year old Canada full of Catholic, Nazi-German’s, Banderite’s bandits and their descendants.
” Why should anyone give greater credence to Polish reports than German reports???”
Because Polish reports are well documented.
” I’m inclined to give that report more credence than the stuff you and Franny dish out with your copy and paste skill which, no doubt, are excellent.”
So, what kind of proves you want from Poles? In Poland are physical evidences of German bestiality like cemetaries, mass graves, plenty of documents from different sources. What else you want?
Maybe you shoud make trip to Poland to see these sites of German barbarity.
This comment of Fran’s on Holocaust Debate bemoaned the fact that Jesus was a Jew.
She wrote:
In a much-delayed response, I posted several passages from Etan Bloom’s dissertation on Arthur Ruppin.
It explained that there are two branches of Jews, one of them, Ashkenazi, originated from Hittites and Persian; the other — Bedouins,– were Semitic.
https://www.unz.com/announcement/the-holocaust-debate/#comment-6115079
#1220 Tiptoethrutulips
“Frankly, history from 1,000 years past is often fraught with errors/interpretations/omissions, etc. People argue incessantly about happenings 20 years ago, so….”
I apply “rule of proportion” here: the last 1000 year of European history seems to be correctly described in 80% and faulty or fraudulent in 20%.
Sumer’s history seems to be correctly described in 40% and faulty or fraudulent in 60%.
etc.
Errors, frauds, exaggerations, omissions, misinterpretations have happend in history many times but it doesn’t mean that there is no truth in history.
It depends on topic but I think that last 1000 years in European history is more correct than faulty or fraudulent.
And when you take history of Germany in last 1000 years you will see that there is a lot of extermination of Slavs (‘Drang nach Osten’*), forceful Germanisation of Slavs and other nations, and two the biggest wars in history of world etc.
That is why reputation of this nation is bad.
“Your hostility was apparent, and Mr. John Wear, as usual, polite and measured.”
That is why I wrote that he is agile Nazi-propagandist in contrary to primitive Nazi-propagandists like @HdC or @Carolyn Yeager. He pretends to be cultural, “objective” researcher while in fact he avoided answering many simple questions.
For example, @John Wear claimed that Hitler invaded Poland and Czechoslovakia only to secure German minorities from “terrible” Polish and Czechoslovakian terror.
I asked him many times why Hitler conquered whole Czechoslovakia and whole Poland when German minorities in Poland and Czechoslovakia were tightly concentrated in western parts of these countries.
).
You can check this by “googling” distribution of German minorities before 1939 (i.e. “German Settlements in Eastern Europe”
He never asnwered this simple question.
The answer is that Hitler wanted Lebensraum for Germans and Gdańsk (Danzig) or Sudetenland were only a pretexts to conquer whole Polish and Czechoslovakian lands and then remove Slavs from these territories of future German colonization.
But “honest” Mr. John Wear never admitted that because in his eyes Germans are innocent victims of English, French, Polish, Czechoslovakian policies.
—-
* “Drang nach Osten (German: [‘Drive to the East’,[1][2] or ‘push eastward’,[3] ‘desire to push east'[4]) was the name for a 19th-century German nationalist intent to expand Germany into Slavic territories of Central and Eastern Europe.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drang_nach_Osten
Sumer is no longer known to be the oldest civilization in the world.
Check out Gobekli-Tepe. I believe it’s in Turkey, if I remember correctly. They have been excavating for years, and I don’t think they are even half way done.
It’s too bad we’ve been destroying the Middle East for decades on behalf of Israel, as many ancient ruins and artifacts have been destroyed. And, yes I know, some in the Middle East have been destructive, but if we had more scientists mucking about in that area instead of soldiers, perhaps they would have been more inclined at preservation for a world heritage site, which typically brings in jobs and tourists dollars for the local populations.
It seems to me our serious problems in the Middle East were nonexistent until the Balfour Deception arrived like Manna from Heaven.
I did read Antiquities, Fran, and I seem to remember there was a lot
I understand what you are saying, and you are not completely wrong.
However, I DO read on the links offered by the “opposition,” as it is very important to know exactly what they are claiming and from where/whom they obtain their sources. Knowing exactly what they claim enables one to find the contradictions in their stories. The pro-Jewish sources provide the best “ammunition,” as it’s impossible to keep thousands upon thousands of stories straight, such as the claim by one Jew of constructing barracks whilst standing waist-deep in water, followed by another Jew, claiming an enormous fire pit, raging in the exact area, used for throwing babies, alive, into said inferno.
The comment section is like a school; to a certain degree, we all offer perspectives and sources unknown to or previously not considered by others, and not everyone is a scholar. I found Unz from a comment on another site, and I read Unz for years, with nary a comment made. It was a comment made about Ukraine, which inspired me to engage, because I had no clue about what’s really going on over there, but a few commenters seemed to have a clue.
Wow. You really are a Hasbara Kike.
Ignored.
That’s why instead of trying to substantively refute their nonsense, I try demonstrate the absurdity of it.
Exactly what I’ve just been trying to say. – I can’t write well when I’m tired, so thank you for making this point that needed making.
Fond regards,
Kali
I rest my case.
Declares:
Frannie, so sorry I missed your oath-filled diatribe that fully reflects the truth has knocked the stuffing out of you and left you with nothing but rage and cuss words as evidence proving your claim.
But let’s put the validity of your allegations to a simple test. You claim the defeated Germans would all have simply come forward by the millions and denounced the blood libel being told against them that was exactly like the war guilt clause built into the Versailles Treaty when contesting it meant long prison terms if not execution at the hands of the allies immediately after the war for participating in the alleged holocaust and gain them nothing, and down to this very day an over eighty year old German women is jailed for contesting the narrative, yet despite the certainty of punishment for contesting those allegations with evidence proving its falsity, the Germans by the thousands would come forward to denounce the holocaust lies when the judicial system rigged against them by prevented them from even presenting evidence validating their claims?
But yet give these circumstances, you have the audacity to claim that the failure of Germans to come forward to denounce the holocaust purveyor narrative proves its truthfulness.
Thus let me put to you simply enough for even you to understand it.
Suppose telling the holocaust tale were declared a blood libel on German people and would subject any one who told it to long prison terms without having even a chance to present evidence that purported to substantiate their claims, how many Jews would then still come forward to tell their tales that had been declared a libel that subjected them to long prison terms rather than accolades for having survived their suffering and bundles of cash as compensation.
Go ahead, Frannie, tell us how many thousands of Jews would have rushed forward and still proclaim that blood libel on the German people.
You can make up whatever you want, but every sentient being understands the truth of the matter that the line of number of holocaust purveyors lining up to affirm their tales would be reduced to trifles.
Now mind you, I am not advocating that whatever claims holocaust purveyors make about the holocaust be declared a blood libel like is done by criminalizing anyone who questions the holocaust purveyor narrative.
What I am advocating is that anyone making proven false claims be ,in some manner held appropriate liable for doing so but only if the accused is entitled to raise all evidence in court that challenges the charge rather than be held liable for contesting any holocaust purveyor tales without being able to resent evidence that validates the challenges.
Moreover, I am also insisting that holocaust purveyors who made claims about the holocaust that have been proven false be held as strictly liable as anyone contest the holocaust purveyor claims.
Were that the case, there are numerous authors of holocaust purveyor tales that would have been convicted of purveying falsehoods.
And were purveyors held to that standard, to what extent would that shrink the scope of the holocaust purveyor industry?
Thus does Frannie prance and dance by claiming the failure of Germans to come forward to refute the holocaust tales proves their truthfulness when she full well knows she is playing with a stacked deck and a rigged roulette wheel that proclaims here the winner using marked cards and aa WEIGHTED BALL when by the same token it’s reversed against anyone who challenges her claims and then proclaims that she is the winner playing this rigged game.
Frannie, your laws criminalizing anyone challenging your holocaust narratives exposes how Jews have rigged the game that thereby indeed in one fell swoop destroys destroys the credibility and truthfulness of all your claims requiring us to no further than that to dismiss them in their entirety.
Your frantic oath laden response exposes that you actually realize the game is almost up.
Offer a link? Intelligent people, regurgitate.?? Carolyn. You have been left behind like yesterdays trash. You have not kept up with the latest refutation of revisionist dogma. All the original Revisionist history has been refuted irrefutably. The revisionist are treading water in their rebuttals. Where have you been? Wondering around asking commentators if they are Jewish, you want to hear the non Jewish side?
I have posted this many times. The best revisionist: Mattogno, Rudolf. Graf, have published papers regarding the original revisionist claim by Butz at only 100,000 employable Jews were transported to Auschwitz in the summer of 1944. After the discovery of the Auschwitz Album in 1988, which has been verified by H Revisionist, together with the verification of documents, that 435,000 Hungarian Jews were transported to Auschwitz from Budapest and included not only employable Jews, but the old, the sick, babies and mothers, directly contradicting Butz’s claim. Since the publication of the Auschwitz Album in 1988, Revisionist have been revising their original claim, to find out what happened to the 350,000 non employable Jews transported, not registered, and not transported elsewhere (20,000 were recorded as being transferred to another camp). Three papers have been written on the subject of the non registered Hungarian Jews BY TOP REVISIONIST. Unanswered question they admit are troubling? To say that Auschwitz was a transit camp in 1944 is absurd. Look at the people arriving from Budapest, these people were on their last legs and near death when they arrived. In addition family members tell the same story. When they arrived at their barracks they asked where their family members were, they were told by the German officers and the other prisoners that their family members were dead, gassed and cremated.
Insights on the 1944 Deportations of Hungarian Jews
What Happened to the Jews Who Were Deported to Auschwitz But Were Not Registered There?
Jürgen Graf
http://vho.org/GB/Journals/JHR/19/4/Graf4.html
This from Carlos Mattogno:
https://codoh.com/library/document/the-deportation-of-hungarian-jews-from-may-to/en/
So you see Carolyn, you Revisionist have a huge problem, not only where did the unregistered missing Jews go, whose family members never found. (certainly if they were transported elsewhere they would have gotten in touch after the war). Many of the unregistered Jews were children, and sick people, who could not fend for themselves.
You have the really nagging creepy question of WHY? Why did Eichmann spend precious supplies, trains, fuel and logistics to transport all of these Jews to Auschwitz which was standing room only?
There is no logical reason, no helpful to the Germans reason. No reason at all. There was no plan to transport them to after Auschwitz? Why not ask Eichmann himself? He will tell why the Jews were transported. Eichmann does not equivocate.
at 1:00:00
In addition to the recent books written regarding the extermination of the Jews: The following are direct rebuttals to the Revisionist:
The book published in 2011
Belzec, Sobibor, Treblinka : Holocaust denial and Operation Reinhard : a critique of the falsehoods of Mattogno, Graf and Kues
Authors:Jonathan Harrison, Roberto Muehlenkamp, Jason Myers, Sergey Romanov, Nicholas Terry
Or the 2013 book:
The Holocaust in Hungary: Evolution of a Genocide (Documenting Life and Destruction: Holocaust Sources in Context) First Edition
by Zoltán Vági (Author), László Csősz (Author), Gábor Kádár (Author)
You go around asking commentators “are you a Jew” well let me ask you Carolyn. As a supporter of Hitler and the NS are you a murderer? You have no answers to anything, Your information stopped in 1970.
I have also spent weeks of exhaustive research with John Wear on the restitution claims by Jews, that Wear claimed were 437,000 Jews were receiving money from the Germans n 1984. That his claim that Jews were fraudulently receiving payments by the German’s was a lie. His claim that millions of Jews were on pensions also a lie. I went over every document with him.
The restitution claims are public knowledge. Published yearly by the Claims Conference (look it up ) in coordination with the German BEG the German bureau in charge of restitution claims to the Jews. There were never more than 1,000,000 Jews ever receiving restitution from the Germans. The largest amount given was several billion dollars of farm equipment to Israel which used to pension 500,000 survivor refugees, the larges survivor population went to Israel.
In addition the documents show it was nearly impossible to get a claim approved. Until 1980 the claims were only for Jewish German citizens, you had to have proof of birth, proof of residency. If you were in a camp, you had to have a camp card. If you were at IG Farben or Krupps you had to have the labor card to prove it. In a Ghetto also a card to prove it. Most claims were rejected. No one in my family received a dime from Germany.
Not only did I spend countless hours researching this for John who I though was a sincere man trying to sincerely search for the truth, John turns around and publishes an article on his website that says “The claims conference cast doubts on the Holocaust”. A lie, A bold face lie. If anything the amount of documentation needed to receive money from German was proof positive that the Holocaust took place.
All of you, all the Revisionist and H deniers are liars. You are and will never be interested in the truth you take facts and mangle them into Jew hatred.
I also introduced and reviewed the Auschwitz Album (which shows specifically the arrival of Hungarian Jews to Auschwitz) with John, which he had never seen before, refuting Butz’s claim of only employable Jews being transported to Auschwitz, and the 350,000 missing Jew mystery: They were not transported and never seen again the day they arrived at Auschwitz, they were never registered in any camp. As I SAID in my last post, you best Revisionist would like to find the missing Jews.
What does John do with all of this information THAT I GAVE HIM. He turns around and writes a fucking incredulous article on the : Fate of the unregistered Hungarian Jews: The real truth. John actually puts that in the tittle: THE REAL TRUTH. Like he has found the missing Jews. What is his answer?????
THERE WERE NO HOMICIDAL GAS CHAMBERS AT AUSCHWTZ-BIRKENAU ???
This in his mind is worth an article. There are no homicidal gas chambers? How does he know that. Prussian Blue. a color. Where are the missing Jews. H denial is dead unless you have an answer for that.
Got a link to where the missing Jews went Carolyn. I am ready for it any time you want to give it. but until you figure it out the world says fuck you and you pseudo science denial. You have nothing. Holocaust denial no longer exist. It is the deluded subject of crazy people obsessed with Jews.
Fran, where was that album from 1945-1988?
I watched the blip on a video about it; the narrator made a big to-do about how THAT ALBUM CONTAINS THE ONLY PHOTOS IN THE WORLD on Auschwitz whilst in operation.
How can that claim be possible? Who took those photographs?
damn good question.
Are you lazy? You can find this information out by just googling it. There are many other photos of this of the SS and Hoss in the Album as well as the Hungarian Jews. Not one Revisionist denies the authenticity of the album. It was found by a woman named Lili Jacobs, who was a Hungarian survivor with her sister, her mother and her two brothers were murdered the day they arrived. She kept the album for herself and gave out photos to survivors. The original photos are very small, and it is not until they are blown up that they have impact. Lily in 1988 decided to donate the album to Yad Vashem. All of the Germans can be identified, the ones in the selection line. Mengele is in there. The photos were taken by two SS officers. Here is the blurb from Yad Vashem. Also I am including a colored photograph of people waiting outside of Crematorium 4, with a quotation from a survivor who knew them from their village. The Germans transported 475,000 Jews to Auschwitz-Birkenau from May to October of 1944 shortly before the war ended against the order of Himmler, expressly to murder and eradicate them, especially the women and children. They murdered 340,000 upon arrival. And you in no way can countermand that fact. It is impossible. Unless you can locate 350,000 missing Jews.
Below the German officers of Auschwitz including Hoss. Also from the album.
The Germans from May to October of 1944 transported 475,000 Hungarian Jews from Budapest to Auschwitz – Brikenau. They gassed and cremated 350,000 upon arrival. The war was about to end in a few short months. The Jews were shipped there for the express purpose of murdering them, especially the women and children. You have absolutely no proof to refute this. NONE.
Below is a colorized photo from the Auschwitz Album. Let me type the caption so you can understand the significance since you think everyone is silenced. Just take this in. You cannot prove they were not there, they were not at crematorium 4 and that they were gassed, cremated and gone in a few hours. Disprove IT. You have nothing.

Everyone knew the Jews that disappeared, they were family members or village friends. They were disappeared hours after this photo was taken.
“Dealt with” my ass. It concedes the point. It was only many years after the war that Encyclopaedia Britannica treated gassings of Jews as a real and important event.
Hi Ms Ranty,
You know Carolyn Yeager does make a valid point about you, Fran. She says you’re here only to highjack the conversation and to keep it going around in pointless circles. She’s right about that.
Your photographs prove nothing at all. They’re just photos of groups of people. That’s it. That’s all you’ve got.
That and spit freckled rants about 350,000 missing Hungarian Jews, whom the evidence (what little there is of it) indicates were transported east.
All to “prove” the “holocaust” of “6,000,000”.
It really doesn’t add up does it Fran?
Prove it! Go ahead and bring forth the actual, physical evidence.
Fact is you can’t, because there is none. In fact all actual evidence points in the opposite direction. And you know it.
And so you rant.
But the truth is getting out, whilst the prohibitions against speaking it are being more widely ignored by those of us who refuse to live on our knees. And so the more timid amongst us are encouraged to seek and to speak the truth also.
Which scares the b’Jesus out of you.
And so you rant.
Easy tiger!
Kali.
Well, Franny, I read the whole of Antiquities and from what I remember there was a lot of god telling the jews to do xyz and them doing the opposite, followed by god smiting the disobedient little feckers and the cycle repeating. Plus ca change … Anyway, Josephus defected to the Roman side, didn’t he? Doesn’t that make him a traitor to the Jews? Why’re you so proud of him?
Also, extemporaneous means ex (from or out of) tempor (time or the moment), so off the cuff, without relying on notes. I think the word you’re grasping for is ‘contemporaneous’. I know it’s your new favourite erudite-sounding word but it would be less hilariously malapropistic if you used it in the correct context; as goes for the even more amusing (from another of your comments) image of people writing stuff posthumously.
Furthermore, you state your tribal ethics include the admonition, “Be cautious in judgement” and then go on to judge incautiously Al, Solento and my dear wife. As well, I think your grasp of history is about as muddled as your writing.
[apologies for my earlier attempt to reply, my ancient smartphone wasn’t smart enough to handle a thread of this length.]
AND NOT A SINGLE WORD OF YOUR RESPONSE ADDRESSES THE POINT YOU CITE THAT YOUR NON-SEQUITOR PURPORTS TO ADDRESS.
In legalese, your comment is called an unresponsive answer.
It’s the answer a witness gives to mislead, misrepresent, deny, deceive when a truthful and honest answer to the question demolishes their case.
Congratulations. You’ve won the booby prize.
Going against my policy of not replying to you, I feel I must push back on this:
Where is your EVIDENCE for such a large figure of 475,000? Not hearsay. Real proof. That is an estimate in a very fuzzy area and I don’t believe it was possible to accomplish that feat in a few months in 1944! It’s all fictionalized, and the UNCONDITIONALLY SURRENDERED Germans were FORCED to acquiesce to it (they assumed it would be temporary like most war propaganda is). It has remained in place because it became the basis for a NEW WORLD ORDER of a disguised communism of global government. The nation-state and nationalism was and remains the enemy of this New World Order, secured by this very narrative that you push.
You have no proof FOR it. None. What you offer is not proof, it is not even evidence. It is invented, made-up photo captions. It is a Narrative, meaning a St0ry. Jewish storytelling. Fewer and fewer believe it, and eventually no one will believe it. But unfortunately, the nation-state may be a dim memory by then.
Because encyclopedias don’t do independent research, they collect already generally accepted information, hence they are never up to date a la minute.
The photos prove that there were large groups of Jews from the “unfit for work” category (women, children, eldery) who arrived in Auschwitz. Hungarian Jews who survived all belonged to the “fit for work” category. After selection nobody saw those Jews “unfit for work” again. If they were not gassed then those who abducted them are obliged to explain their disappearance. Up until now no “revisionist” has ever succeeded in explaining the disappearance of millions of abducted Jews who were “unfit for work”. The burden of the proof is on them to explain what happened to them. If they can’t, then we can safely assume that they were murdered. The more so because Hitler, Goebbels, Himmler and the Wannsee protocol openly talked about exterminating the Jews.
As for the so-called “technical impossibility” of gassing and cremating that many Jews, that has been dealt with already extensively in holocaustcontroversies, quod vide.
And here we have it, ladies and gents! The bottom line of the entire Holocaustian faith:
“WE…
ASSUME…
MURDER.”
Such dark arts you practice, you faithful followers and pushers of the lie.
Read those words back to yourself Franklin, Fran, fufu.
Read them again: “We assume murder”, then spare a though for your soul, and for the soul of Mankind!
Kali.
“…We can safely assume that those abducted Jews were not murdered, but were “resettled in the East” in camps of which never any trace has been found, but of which we can safely assume that they really existed. No survivor of those 2,3 million “resettled” Jews has ever been found, but we can safely assume that they did survive. Hitler, Goebbels, Himmler and the Wannsee protocol openly talk about the extermination of the Jews, but we can safely assume that they didn’t mean it…”
FIFY.
On the contrary, Frankie, I neither affirm nor deny they were murdered, but instead leave you to your proofs which by what you assume as proof establishes you have no evidence whatever that comes within light years of proving they were murdered in any manner whatsoever and , ergo, you’re toast.
The photos prove NOTHING that you claim they prove.
One clause at a time:
“Large groups” — yes.
“Jews” — what proves that they were Jews?
Show me, I’m from Missouri: how does the photo prove that the people in it were in a category “unfit to work”?
Because they’re wearing clothes?
Because they’re standing up?
.
Or maybe they were the people who got off the bus at a suburban hotel where they changed their clothes then took another bus to the carnival at the beach and posed for the photo in #1163.
The photos can prove one narrative as readily as another.
What you are doing, Franklin, is repeating and repeating a narrative. Perhaps there is proof for your narrative, but the photos ain’t that proof.
Exactly.
For the sake of clarity, I have never said a single word referring to “camps” in the east, and I’m not sure that any one else, besides you Holocaustians, has either.
And don’t even try to bring up the Wannsee protocol, which has already been thoroughly eviscerated in this thread.
Surprisingly, I’m taken aback by my own reaction to your admitting that you “assume murder“! I literally feel sick.
How utterly depraved one must be to assume, with literally zero credible evidence to offer, the cold-blooded murder of millions!
You Holocaustian faithful, coming here to preach your filth, should hang your heads in shame!
Kali.
How hot was it in May/June/July in Poland? They all appear to be dressed in cold weather clothing; hats, heavy coats, scarves, stockings…..
I did check the appropriate weather patterns, and they are overdressed, especially if they were packed like sardines in a railway tram for days.
No one is claiming Hungarian Jews were not removed from Hungary, but those photos prove nothing. And, there are just too many lies circulating to believe a witness claiming to report the identity of those pictured. The album was “buried” for over forty years. The “confessions” of Rudolf Hoess, were written in early 1947, in a Polish prison, under obvious duress, and the original manuscript was in Polish custody for over 4 years prior to publication. NOTHING contained within those “confessions” or images would be admissible in a proper court.
I have a vague recollection of a photograph claimed to be a depiction of concentration camp inmates, gathered or huddled together during an incident reported to have occurred in the summer, yet heavy snow was in the background.
No one on your side of What Really Happened ever speaks on the necessity or appropriateness of enacting criminal and civil laws to prevent thorough research, speech or publication of opposing views or evidence. Why is this necessary? Do you think David Irving deserved prosecution? Ernst Zundel? Have you bothered to read any of the trial transcripts?
Notes:
Super excellent observation and great point. You have completely and totally debunked that as evidence of the Hungarian Jews at Auschwitz during that period.
Congratulations.
I just love it when a plan comes together.
Jan, at historyreviewed, tells great stories about Jews and blacks in South Africa. He’s a bit “colorful,” but a good source of info.
Here’s a bit about a Hungarian survivor (about 2 minutes); the report says many Jewish people died AFTER the Soviets arrived. Interesting……
[Isn’t it sad? Hitler is DEAD … and these worthless scum live on and they get to tell their tall tales about their wondrous escapes. The GOOD are DEAD, and the GARBAGE and FILTH are ALIVE and they lie to everyone, including the next generation. It makes me sick. AND they celebrate ISRAEL but they DON’T LIVE THERE!!! Instead they live in AMERICA and they work for the DESTRUCTION of America! Jan]
Here’s the video: https://www.goyimtv.com/v/2675995504/Holocaust-survivor-Erika-Gold-shares-story-of-escape-at-Jewish-Community-Center-in-Youngstown
If you are interested, take note of the video in Fran’s post # 1184.
The narrator claims all photos are of Jews arriving to Auschwitz beginning in May through the summer. The photos presented at 1:07 through 1:28 (especially 1:28) depict people covered head to toe, in heavy coats and scarfs. The people in the groves, in summer, are heavily clothed, as well.
So, Franny & Franky, if you’re reading: the narrator says, those destined for death were sent to the groves to wait, with no idea what was to happen – they were told they were waiting for the showers. 6,944 per day. Don’t you think someone would have noticed after the first thousand or so failed to come back out, all shiny clean? Don’t you think they would remove their coats and scarves in spring/summer? What about the constant hauling away of ashes, that must occur if the corpses were zapped by high power thermal lasers, which is the only way to possibly do it in the manner and number claimed.
The best evidence of refutation is their evidence. If you want to see a text book case of lying and witness leading, watch the Shoah interview of Dario Gabbai. I still can’t believe they released it; it’s comical. For me, it was the lynchpin. As he is lying, they are all lying.
Gotta laugh at those random pictures of fat live happy people peppered with Chabad Fran’s ludicrous captions.
http://judaism.is/perpetrators.html
Thanks, Tiptoe.
A lot to think about in the anomalous situation described — the cold weather attire in May 1944.
The presence of a nun was also interesting.
It appears the crowd was NOT “all Jews.”
The presence of non-Jews in labor camps further validated by the extensive quote of Primo Levi, a rock-star among “holocaust survivors,” inasmuch as Levi “survived” through the ministrations of an Italian Catholic bricklayer who was employed?? forced-labor?? by the Germans.
Primo Levi returned to his home in Italy, had a wife, children, family and career writing about how much he suffered in the war. Then he is said to have committed suicide.
Meanwhile, that Italian Catholic whose efforts saved Primo Levi’s life — he died shortly after the war was over, most likely having been weakened by his experiences in the labor camp.
What’s his name? Somehow it does not come readily to mind; only PRIMO LEVI the holocaust survivor hero.
—
The Yad Vashem (YV) website offers useful background and context regarding Hungary’s alliance with Germany through most of the war; and the (changing) status of Jews in Hungary in that period:
https://www.yadvashem.org/articles/general/jews-of-hungary-during-the-holocaust.html
Form your own understandings.
My thinking is that Hungary was trying to make decisions that best served Hungary’s interests; that Jews in Hungary –very many of whom, the YV website notes — “converted to Christianity,” and as we learned elsewhere, many of whom were opposed to zionism and had no wish to migrate to zionist Palestine. Reasonable to surmise that there might have been a problem with partisan Jews committing rear-guard actions in Hungary that Hungarian officials had to deal with.
nb. YadVashem’s narrative regarding Eichmann & Sonderkommandos I read with a grain of salt.
Really a shame BenGurion & Jewish court sealed Eichmann in a glass box and did not allow his side of the story to be fully told: the rest of the world could have learned so much about what really happened. Shades of “Obama killed binLaden & tossed his body in the ocean.”
—
Additional background to the “May 1944 cremation of 475000 Hungarian Jews unfit for labor”
In the 6-months period before and after the (alleged) May 1944 deportation of Hungarian Jews (that is, February 1944 to July, 1944), Hamburg was attacked from the air by RAF and/or USAAF at least ten times. But Hamburg had already been subject to firebombing beginning in 1940 and not ending until mid-April 1945.
There’s more, much more of Allied bombing of Germany in the period May 1944, but this comment is already too long.
This data is pertinent under this particular topic, “Hitler, Churchill, the Holocaust, and the War in Ukraine,” because it provides insight into what may be the intentions of those who are prosecuting the war against Ukraine, Central Europe and Russia, insofar as major protagonists (and intended beneficiaries) of the ongoing warfare and destruction are closely identified with the major beneficiaries and protagonists of the war against Germany.
I have consistently throughout my time on UR with fighting Jew hatred and H denial have posted fact after fact after fact. This particular question of 475,000 Jews shipped from Budapest to Auschwitz in the summer of 1944. It has been documented train by train, Jew by Jew by YOUR OWN fellow REVISIONIST. I have posted these articles maybe 10 times. You should be ashamed that you are not clear on this information. Have not absorbed it the many times that I have posted it, and would waste my time for having to repost it, all the while accusing me of interrupting you “intelligent chatter” with nonsense.
Mattogno wrote extensively about this. So did Graff. I will post the articles again and you can read them and look at the data. Did you listen to the Eichmann testimony? Himmler ordered him to stop transports because the war was over. Eichmann stated that it was his final duty to rid the Reich of its enemies, and he would die knowing that the Reich had fewer Jews, especially killing women and children, so there would be no future generation of Jews for revenge.
Carlo Mattogno:
https://codoh.com/library/document/the-deportation-of-hungarian-jews-from-may-to/en/?page=3
Excerpt from document. He lists 437,000 Jews
From Jergen Graf:
http://vho.org/GB/Journals/JHR/19/4/Graf4.html
Excerpt from document:
Further down the document
Fat kike Franny claims that 450,000 Jews were gassed and cremated at Auschwitz as Germany was being genocided and crumbing under US/UK firebombing in the last few months of the war.
Yet at the same time, Jews love to brag about the great hero Raoul Wallenberg, “the Swedish diplomat who saved tens of thousands of central European Jews from the gas chambers of Auschwitz in 1944 and 1945.”.
The Guardian goes on to state:
This is the problem with lying kikes like fat Franny. They always demand that all their contradicting spiderwebs of lies be believed or else you are an “anti-semite”. What Jew cares if some goy cattle get holocausted for claiming that some number of Jews not equal to 6,000,000 died during WWII. But when interviewed by another lying kike, lying kikes like fat Franny have no problem admitting that 6,000,000 is just some figure that underestimates Jewish collective suffering, but likely overstates the number of Jews who got “gassed” using Zyklon-B.
So how can we be certain, even if all those supposed Jews in Fat Franny’s Holofraud Foto Album are Jewish, that they weren’t one of Wallenberg’s “Swedish Jews” like Dwight Eisenhower?
Answer: Don’t you dare question Hebrew narrative, goyim. If you do you are an anti-semite and you will be sent to the Amalek Gulag to die, like Raoul Wallenberg.
Well Franny, I have often given a clue as to where your beloved tribes people wound up: In the 60 countries where they were interviewed in preparation for the movie Swindler’s List.
Left you speechless with that, or cat got your tongue?
Dear Kali, somehow Jews and shame don’t go together. They have chutzpah for that.
No not speechless at all. In the summer of 1944 German trains were only going further into the Reich, certainly not East, and certainly not to other countries. The war was over. East was moving West. The entire Reich was collapsing. There were no countries to ship the Jews to, and why would you want to relocate Jews during the final days of the war, that was shining rapidly out of control? That would be your priority shipping Jews to other countries? The Germans were not able to ship food to the front or to feed their own people internally. They were transporting maybe 20,000 Jews to the Reich for armament labor.
Why not listen to the Eichmann trial. He was responsible for the transporting of all the Jews, that was his job. Regarding the Hungarian Jewish transports he was demonic and fanatical. Within 8 months of invading Hungary, all of the Jews in Hungary were hunted down and placed in ghettoes. As the liquidation began, various transport destinations were assigned to different Ghettoes. In other words you left when your ghetto was called. The various meeting points were Gymnasiums, or open air places, where people waited for days for trains to arrive. When the trains arrived, each Jew one by one was identified and marked for transport. It was precision because it was large and complicated. Eichmann could be spotted running around the transport spots in Budapest waiting for all the Jews especially the children boarded the train. He was also offering to sell Jews in exchange for trucks and armaments. Warning the Zionist that the longer they waited, more Jews would die.
In preparation of the Hungarian transports, Eichmann increased the ramps at Auschwitz to go to the outside of the gate, and increased the oven capacity. The stories of arriving to Auschwitz are repeated thousands of time, without benefit of the Auschwtiz which proves their stories.
Jews left the train and lines were formed. Inspections were made. If the Germans thought you could work they selected you and you went to the right and were registered as a prisoner of the camp. Those unable to work, old people, babies, and women, were sent to the left to the crematoriums.
The thing that amazes me about all of you is that this quandary of the missing Jews is reflected in papers by the top Holocaust Revisionist. Where did those missing Jews go? Bothers them because in 1944 none was really going anywhere outside of German occupied territory. The system was collapsing. But this information and time of the war does not bother you morons. Amazing. Or Solonto saying how to we know the photos are of Jews, they could be non Jews. Duh they are all wearing yellow Jewish star. The photos are of a Hungarian transport of Jews that arrived in Auschwitz on a certain date. As to why they were wearing so many clothes. They piled clothes on because they had no suitcases, or very few belongings. They wore everything they had.
There were no further transports out of Auschwitz expect for 20,000 Jews sent further into the Reich. There were no other recorded transports. The Jews who went to the crematoriums (which again for the umpteenth time is located and documented by Carlo Mattogno top Revisionist in a paper, where he copies and captions the photographs from the Auschwitz Album) were never seen again. The family members of these missing Jews were told that they were gassed and cremated, that is what usually goes on in crematoriums. No? They were told that information that night by the Germans and by the other prisoners.
Since there is no further information on these Jews, no transports, no other sitings of them after the war. It is reasonable to assume that they are dead. It is also reasonable to assume that they died that day.
Eichmann admits that he was following what he thought were orders to rid the Reich of its enemies.
It seems pretty clear to me. These Jews were were gassed and cremated when they arrived, that is why they were transported in the first place. There was no other reason. They could have stayed in their ghettoes in Hungary, the war was about to be over. Why transport the old and the sick and babies? They were of no use to the Germans, and they could not feed the prisoners they had in camps. It was not until the neutral countries threaten war crimes on the Hungarians that the transports stopped in October. There were less then 200,000 Jews left out of the original 800,000 Jews that were living there at the beginning of the war.
Why would transport the sick, the elderly small children old ladies to Auschwitz in the summer of 1944???? Why. They were not relocating these people anywhere.
You have to be rabidly obsessed not to take in this information regarding the specific time period, the documentation and the missing Jews, not to come to the conclusion that the Jews were scheduled for eradication.
Jew obsessions, like the people on this website never end well. Look at what happened to Hitler? To NS.Magda Goebbels murdered her 5 children and herself because she did not want to live in a world without the Fuhrer. Do you know how crazy obsessed you have to be to do something like that?
You Holocaustian faithful, coming here to preach your filth, should hang your heads in shame!
Why not listen to the Eichmann trial? Eichmann was responsible for all of the Jewish transports. He was the perpetrator. He is not denying it, nor hanging his head in shame. He claims that no matter how awful it was, he was doing his job. Eichmann. Listen to Eichmann if you think the story of the eradication of the Jews is made up.
You are a simpleton.
I knew you’d come up with something from Mattogno, bc he has published huge amounts of info on transfers of deported persons that were recorded on this or that document. I’m quite aware of Mattogno’s work on this subject (in general, not in detail) and it is considered ongoing research from whatever documents have lately come to light. This particular article from CODOH is old, is dated from 2001 and is subtitled “A preliminary account“.
The material from Graf is similarly from a 2002 issue of the Institute’s Journal. This is a long time ago in the holocaust revisionist world. You really need to look for the latest figures offered if you want to be relevant. So in spite of all the copy-paste you have have plastered here, most of which is unnecessary distraction, I continue to doubt the number 435,000 (attributed by Graf to Laszlo Ferenczy, Hungarian police chief for how many were transported out of Hungary, not necessarily to Auschwitz, and I also ask how reliable is Ferenczy? There are many reasons he would not be.). Again, Graf is just giving what he’s found.
Back to Mattogno, here is a paragraph of the Codoh article you pasted:
Who wants to try to make sense out of all that? Not I. Because it doesn’t prove anything.
Finally, I am seriously wondering why long copy-paste comments like this one are not given the “HIDE” treatment? They used to be. Is the editor in league with Franny when it comes to ‘holocaust’ threads? Unnecessarily long posts like this one make it harder to scroll through the comments. They are similar to experiencing pushy, overbearing, egotistic people in public places.
I thought of that, Franny. It does make sense if they were planning ahead for winter, but if they were packed like sardines in trams, with little food or WATER, those coats and scarves are coming off, otherwise they would perish from heat exhaustion. And, if they are standing around in the summer, waiting hours and hours for a shower, those coats, hats and scarves are still coming off; I don’t care what you say, they will hold their coats, they won’t keep them on in the heat.
Erika Gold said they were marched from Hungary, of course, she escaped straight away. She didn’t mention trains. She said her father was sent to a concentration camp, but he returned, as so many did by the accounts I have heard. So, the Jews were expelled and expected to march approximately 459 kilometers to then wait around and be gassed to death? Are you sure? That seems an extraordinary effort at a time when resources and manpower were dwindling. Why not exterminate them closer to home?
Some years ago Rafael Medoff of the Wyman Institute wrote this paper to ‘clear up’ a controversy over labeling at the holocaust museum in DC:
titled AMERICA’S FAILURE TO BOMB AUSCHWITZ:
A New Consensus Among Historians
http://www.WymanInstitute.org
Medoff includes several revealing sets of facts:
Then, one week later, Vrba and Wetzler smuggled themselves out of Auschwitz and wrote reports that caused BenGurion and the JAE to change their minds:
Having sniffed the wind from another direction, BenGurion and fellows are now all-in for bombing a place where rather more than “a single Jew” might be harmed.
GIVEN that there were over 20,000 US military intelligence agents, including over 2000 Jews trained at Fort Ritchie to scout out German activities, it’s hard to know how it came to be that JAE in Palestine was so totally out-of-the-loop on June 11 but totally informed one week later.
MOREOVER, Vrba and Wetzel have been fact-checked and de-bunked six-ways-to-Sunday (© Chuck Schumer).
But mirabile dictu and just in the nick of time to push Henry Morgenthau, JR’s scheme for US to fund ____, Vrba & Wetzel pop up.
To be sure, Jews all over the world had been sorta-kinda pressuring USA, Britain and Russia to “bomb the railroad tracks;” “bomb Auschwitz,” but the answer was always No, even from the British.
Medoff expresses exasperation at this reluctance:
Did Allied photo reconnaissance show smokestacks around Auschwitz?
Did Allied photo recon pilots report columns of smoke issuing from smokestacks around Auschwitz?
Nem.
нет
לֹא
EDIT:
“But mirabile dictu and just in the nick of time to push Henry Morgenthau, JR’s scheme for US to fund ____, Vrba & Wetzel pop up.”
Blank space should be, WRB, War Refugee Board.
On Jan 22 1944 Morgenthau persuaded FDR to sign act establishing War Refugee Board
Then, in June, 1944,
—
** Treasury Department employees were verrry busy back then.
Wikipedia reports:
Better a dumb Canadian than a stupid Pole.
Agreed that Canada, indeed all western countries, are run by morons (or perhaps traitors).
As to your guesses regarding my and my families background… Better not quit your day job, if indeed you have one.
Churchill’s opinion on the veracity of the propaganda in Germany vs “democratic countries”, it’s been a long time since I read about this; but I seem to recall that it was written in his memoirs of WWII.
I’d rather live under German orderliness and justice (pre-war!) than the zoo Canada and all other countries have become.
Why does the editor allow those ridiculous memes from Al that he repeats over and over again. I doubt the editor is in league with me. I agree with you about the length but you nor anyone else recognizes that I am posting from your side not my side. These are top Revisionist I am quoting about the validity of the photos, and the disappearance of the Jews.
I copied and paste because I have posted the text to those articles of Mattogno and Graf like forever, and you seem not to give a hoot. Like you do not like them and therefore not relevant. The latest information to come it is a book I also posted a gizelian times, published by non Jewish authors (I think)
The Holocaust in Hungary: Evolution of a Genocide (Documenting Life and Destruction: Holocaust Sources in Context) First Edition
by Zoltán Vági (Author), László Csősz (Author), Gábor Kádár (Author)
But you miss the most important point Carolyn, you always do. Butz claimed that only employable Jews were sent to Auschwitz in the summer of 1944 to serve the ammunitions departments of Speer who was desperate for help. Looking at the Auschwitz Album (Mattogno sites specifically as factual). All relevant Revisionist site the photo Album as being an actual documentation.
Who in their right mind is transporting, the sick, the elderly, babies with grandmothers, in 1944 to Auschwitz when there was no room and the war was about to end?? Come up with an answer. They were not transporting them anywhere. They were sent there specifically to be gassed and cremated. You to should listen about an hour into the Eichmann tape.
Eichmann was demonic in his insistence on eradicating all the Jews of the future generation. Himmler expressly told him to stop. He did not. People observing the liquidation of the Hungarian Jews were in shock at the insanity of what was taken place with the war about to end.
You got any good reasons why Eichmann would send the Jews shown in the Auschwitz Album to Auschwitz from Budapest in the summer of 1944. I bet you cannot think of one reason. It sure was not to resettle them, because there was no where to resettle them to.
Are you just fucking stupid Carolyn? The paragraph you posted is about the registered Jews. Both Graf and Mattogno’s articles are flat out debunking of Butz’s original estimate and rationale for the transports, as well as there uncertainty of “what happened to the missing Jews”, and there realization that the story does not add up. It does not add up at all. Your top Revisionist are in a quandary over the photos and why those very needy Jews were transported at that late a date. Why transport a baby to Auschwitz, when they were perfectly safe in Budapest in a ghetto. When you have a good answer, get back to me.
But I would listen carefully to what Eichmann said. He was pretty clear in his charge. He was also selling Jews at that late a date for trucks and equipment, specifically with a fast sell or die date.
And finally why are you saying that this information is not relevant? That I am posting nonsense. If this has the Revisionist scratching. Why is this not legitimate territory to tear down H denial. You have to answer these questions, and look at those photos, and see how it cooperates every witness description from th 1960’s of what it was like to arrive at Auschwitz and go thru the selection process and watch their family members disappear.
You’re a little bit uninformed on the Holocaust and all of you questions have been answered millions of times, and they are naive, and silly. Let me refer you to some sites that can help you out. All thought I think I posted them before.
Your question:
Why not exterminate them closer to home?
AS Hoss said the killing is easy, it is the body disposal that is hard. The Germans used to dig trenches out East in Belarus and other areas, and shoot all the Jews thousands at a time, The German shooters used to get sick, and the piles of bodies had movement, it was a mess, people would crawl out.
That is why they came up with gassing, it was bloodless and quick. But more importantly they had massive ovens for body disposal. That is why the Germans had killing camps. The Hungarian citizens were not going to stand around while the Germans shot 350,000 people and placed them into ditches. Not possible.
But it is really tiring explaining simple Holocaust stuff about trains and camps. You can google anything you want and get an answer. Why not google, why didn’t the Germans just shoot the Jews and not transport them to be gassed. and see what you come up with. All of the answers to your questions are at your fingertips. And I do not mean to be rude, but your questions are really silly.
Why not listen to the Eichmann trial. One hour in.
My favorite, favorite Solonto posting.
“Large groups” — yes.
“Jews” — what proves that they were Jews?
The ones wearing the really large yellow stars of David Solonto, your vileness is only trumped by your stupidity.
fufu does seem to have serious personal issues against Germans (and Canadians?); I’m studying on the Poles vs. Germans history; Germans migrated thereto beginning in the 1200’s, so it is deep-seated.
I love Canada/Canadians. I spent a week in Vancouver and Vancouver Island a few years ago; such extraordinary beauty. I am horrified by the rampant crime amongst the “new” Canadians; Castro, The Younger, should be deported.
I found this interesting comment by an English author written just a few years before WW2:
“What were the facts? Since the war of 1870, for which France and Germany were equally to blame, up to 1914 Germany had been at peace with all the world. We on the other hand had been constantly at war. We had invaded and conquered Egypt, we had made war on the Boers, we had fought in Africa and on the frontiers of India, and had annexed Burma. The gates of the temple of Janus had never been closed; yet we were firmly convinced that we were a peaceful non-aggressive people, and Germany an aggressive military nation……
Now that no serious student of the events leading up to 1914 [can still claim] that the German government was to blame any more than any other European government including our own, this legend about an aggressive Germany is obviously false; yet it is still believed by many people in this country, and we are told that Hitler is the successor of the Kaiser, and aims at the military conquest of Europe. The last war was psychological, it had no basis on realities, and if there is another war in Europe it will also be psychological. […] To-day, now that we have conscript armies, it is necessary for the government before it can declare war to rouse the peoples of two countries to such a hatred of each other, that decent Englishmen and decent Germans get out their rifles and try to kill each other. This is done by means of propaganda.”
In all the sordid European/American war history of the 20th century, it is a shame that Canada and Canadians are swept up in the aftermath and suffering for the displaced chickens arriving to roost, which the Jews swung overhead and then flung our way.
Any of you Jew obsessed mental nut jobs, Oh yeah Eisenhower had Jew blood. That explains everything, doesn’t it. Wow. Want to take a wild guess as to why the Jews in the below photo were transported from Budapest to Auschwitz -Birkenau in May of 1944. (that is the date for these photos),
1. There was no room at Auschwitz for any more prisoners. It was full.
2. There was no where to house, feed or cloth these people. The Germans were on their last legs. Germany was months away from total defeat and they new at the time of these transports that the war was lost.
3. No other train records exist except for 20,000 Jews being transferred into the Reich for armaments labor.
4. If these Jews were transported elsewhere why? Where? There was no place to transport them East at this time. East was moving West. There were no other countries to transport them to. These people could not fend for themselves or be resettled for work.
5. Why would you spend time, trains and fuel, in 1944 to resettle these Jews? It makes no sense.
None of these Jews were every located or found. One can assume they died in that camp. It is a more than reasonable determination given all the facts and eyewitness that they were gassed and cremated. Last seen at a crematorium. AS told by H Revisionist who recognize the crematorium the Jews are walking toward. Why not listen to the Eichmann trail and let him explain it to you. He does explain it. Why the children ?
If Germany had transported these Jews elsewhere they would have saved and published the trains and transports as it would have saved them from the explanation that these Jews were transported to Auschwitz in the May of 1944 to be gassed and cremated. There is no other answer to the “missing Jews”
These Jews could have waited out the war in their locked up Ghettoes in Hungary at no additional charge or expense to the Germans who were in dire need of fuel, food and armaments. Eichmann offered to sell the Jews for armaments, with a quick past due date. Wait to long and more will be killed.
To the very Jew obsessed. Seek medical help. Jew obsessions never end well. Although Brosi the dude that thinks Eisenhower has Jew blood in him is beyond help. Actually most of you are beyond help. Doomed to spend the rest of your lives searching for the Jew under the bed. BA HA HA!!!!
It is a sad commentary on Jews and Judaism how invested you are in wallowing in misery—even to the point of lying to yourself and others about how victimized you are: altered and “re-purposed” photos, phony captions, lying “eyewitnesses,” a “diary” written in ballpoint pen composed by a hired author (that Otto Frank tried to stiff, so that Frank had to be taken to court for the author to get paid), holographic “survivor” testimonies in any language the AI can synthesize. What a joke you people are!… a satanic joke. http://judaism.is/holocaust.html
If you left it at that, just wallowing in misery as your sole purpose in life, most people would not care about you. Unfortunately your genocidal and supremacist precepts of Judaism have prompted you to commit crimes against you throughout history http://judaism.is/perpetrators.html … and there is not one thing funny about that at all. May God grant you the justice you really deserve, not the justice you imagine you deserve.
Meanwhile… here is photo of a pile of corpses of Hungarian Jews killed by the Nazis… because my rabbi told me so:
Yeah… because you say so… [laughing at your Jewish fables—Titus 1:13-14].
Carolyn Yeager has no real answer to information the two most important revisionists themselves provide, so now suddenly that information is “too old” to be taken seriously. We should look at newer information, but she doesn’t say what that is. So she “continues to doubt”. The Hungarian police chief Ferenczy gives the same number of deportees, but “how reliable is Ferenczy?”, “there are many reasons he would not be”.
These are of course very weak arguments. You cannot win with these people, they have already made up their mind and no fact or reasoning is going to change that. It is as useless as debating with the member of a religious sect, and Hitler-worshippers are a kind of sect.
Still peeved about that gold star thing, eh Franny? MOVE ON! Life is short!
Re:
Count the gold stars.
Count the NOT gold stars.
—
Any comment on Allies making photo-reconnaissance flights over Auschwitz? Did they see smokestacks? Smoke?
No need to cut-and-paste a manuscript: YES or NO.
___
re “None of these Jews were every located or found. One can assume they died in that camp. ”
Nonsense.
One can as readily assume they made it to Italy like the Jews who arrived in Oswego.
Or South America or any of a dozen other places.
And gave up being Jews. It happened, esp. in Hungary.
It’s weird for sure, the pettiness of finding a scrap to hold up, like how do we know there are Jews in the phots, or what clothes were they wearing in May, anything to cast doubt about an event like the murder of 350,000 Jews.
-The commandant of Auschwitz Rudolf Hoss says the Jews were gassed and incinerated.
– Eichmann the man in charge of transporting the Jews to Auschwitz, says the Jews were gassed and cremated, especially the women and children to avoid another generation of vengeful Jews.
-The sonderkammandos who worded 24 /7 in the crematoriums describe the gassing and cremating the Jews.
-Kurt Prufer the German designer from Topf and Sons, who fabricated the new 8 multi muffle ovens, bears witness to the gassing and incineration of the Jews as specs were handed down from the Germans and Bischoff for faster burn times and more capacity, specifically to gas and murder Jews. He was the oven maker. I guess he would know…
– Then you have the witnesses, the Hungarians, the Jewish survivors, and the missing Jews. And inexplicably the photos of Jews in horrid conditions, babies and mothers, and grandmothers, old debilitated men getting off trains at Auschwitz on May 5, 1944. For what reason??
But Eisenhower had Jew blood in him which explains why he hates Germans. And the Jews made up the entire Holocaust, gassing and incineration. Without the photo Album you might not see it. But oddly enough and for whatever reason the toads on the UR do not understand that the biggest and best Revisionist, Rudolf, Mattogno, Graf, and Butz are vexed and cannot explain why those non employable Jews were being sent to Auschwitz. They wrote papers about it. The deniers know that H denial is dead, finished all of the new material out that historians have put together has finished their story. I am sure that all of the H deniers know the truth, even Carolyn knows by now that all of the Revisionist information has been ripped to shreds. https://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.com
And after the Irving trial, it was obvious that H denial is NOT a true historical field. H denial is Jew hatred and nothing more, it is an attempt to exchange the victims for the perpetrators. Revisionist are not looking for objective truth, the mangel the truth to fit a narrative with pseudo science and scholarly facades. They are Jew haters, and Holocaust denial is hate speech. And I am glad it is breathing its last breath on this stupid website. What does Revisionist idiot John Wear say. “There were no Homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz -Birkenau. Right John and Carolyn Yeager cannot add and subtract and questions the numbers, her own revisionist say are factual.
I say game set match, the Germans gassed and incinerated babies and mothers, in 1944 when the war was about to end, for no reason other than they were Jews. But Tiptoe wants to know why they are wearing so many clothes, in may. She thinks that is just so odd. Hey Tiptoe, it was cold in Poland on May 5, 1944. Why the fuck do you care what the Jews were wearing. They died minutes after the photos were taken.
How did they get to Italy in 1944? Did they call an Uber? You really crack me up.
I have heard/read this suggestion once or twice before – the German soldiers suffered to execute innocent people. That’s interesting. So, Germans, unlike the Bolsheviks, the Red Russians (were they just Bolsheviks sans Jews?), the Dresden bombers, the French fleet sinkers, the Czechs, and countless other ruthless, heathen warriors who suffered not to rape/torture/shoot civilians wherever they stood, or rounded up to a nearby clearing, were reluctant to behave like beasts? What does that say about Germans, in general? I’m sorry Franny, it’s not silly nor naive to conclude that enormous cost and precious manpower would be wasted to transport people meant to be killed.
The claim is 350,000 (it varies) were killed from May 15 to early/mid-July, in approximately 50 days.
It is not possible to gas approximately 7,000 people per day, in rooms not constructed nor properly outfitted for effective, precise delivery of gas nor decontamination, who are then incinerated to ash the very same day. Let’s pretend we can kill everyone in 4-5 minutes, as Gabbai claimed, and we can incinerate 1 body to ash in 1 hour.
So, in one 24 hour period, only 24 bodies, per muffle, can be incinerated.
At 52(?) muffles, that’s 1,248 bodies per day.
That leaves 5,752 corpses remaining, each day, when the new batch or the grove batch comes in.
At 1,248 per day, the cremation process would have to continue until long past mid-July, until the exit of the SS soldiers, but let’s pretend they kept on burning until January 27, 1945.
There are 258 days from May 15 to January 27, therefore upon liberation, there would still be 28,016 corpses lying about.
In the above described scenario, we are not taking into account the time required to corral the persons down the stairwell, the disrobing for the shower, the push into the gas chambers/shower room after they likely recognized there would be no showers, the removal after gassing, the hair cutting.………I do not understand why you can’t see this discrepancy.
Please provide me the link to the Soviet reports of these discovered corpses.
Before you suggest multiple corpses were stuffed in the muffles, please note the additional time required for the type of sorting claimed, i.e., proper ratio of males, females and children, thereby delays the process significantly and reduces the daily number.
From some Jewish site, I can’t remember:
To be sure, there are testimonies of living Jewish babies thrown on pyres in Auschwitz-Birkenau in the summer of 1944.3 There are also reports of some Jewish Sonderkommandos having been put alive in the ovens, but the setting on fire of live human beings was exceptional.
Is this true? The grove Jews and the standing-in-line-with-ski-gear jews did not notice this tossing of infants?
Teirgartenstrasse4
In other camps e.g. Birkenau in the summer of 1944 when gassing the Hungarian Jews, resort was made to mass open air cremation pits.
Is this true? The grove Jews and the standing-in-line-with-ski-gear jews did not notice this tossing of infants?
Auschwitz-Birkenau aerial photographs: https://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.com/search/label/aerial%20photos
None of those “revisionists¨ really believe their own lies. They not only hate Jews, they also love Nazism and their “hero” Adolf Hitler. They are fighting a lost battle. Because of its genocidal behavior towards Jews and Slavs a moral rehabilitation of Nazism is not possible.
BTW, Eisenhower being called a “terrible Swedish-Jew”, was a youthful prank of his fellow students at the military academy. That text in comment #1270 is obviously satire. Eisenhower was of German stock, not Swedish or Jewish, but try to tell that to the “revisionist geniuses” on this forum.
The same way 900 Jews got to Naples, then Oswego, NY, in Spring 1944
@ 1278: https://www.unz.com/runz/hitler-churchill-the-holocaust-and-the-war-in-ukraine/?showcomments#comment-
In WWI, Henry Morgenthau, SR. with Woodrow Wilson’s permission, took a delegation including Felix Frankfurter and a Jewish representative of zionists, to Egypt (or so it was intended). Morgenthau reports in his autobiography that the zionist representative was carrying a trunk-full of money and $400,000 in gold, for relief of Jews in Egypt.
Jews, specifically HIAS, performed similar service in Eastern Europe in WWI, transiting Polish & Russian Jews to Germany for safety.
Not unthinkable that Jews performed the same kind of activity throughout WWII. In fact, it’s unthinkable that they did not.
Ahhh. We suspected all along that you were cracked.
Fran Taubman killed helpers she employed at her compound on Shelter Island.
No bodies have been found but the workers have been missing for days and no one knows where they have gone.
It’s weird for sure, the pettiness of finding a scrap to hold up, like where are the bodies? Is there any forensic evidence of a murder — a weapon, blood? What ties Taubman to the murder?
Is there anything to cast doubt about an event like Fran Taubman’s murder of persons at her workshop?.
Wait a minute. Including the Packers even as just an example of this lunacy is going just a bit too far.
A photograph, in and of itself, is not necessarily definitive proof of a claim. If you show someone a photograph of your summer vacation in Maui, but the photo is a depiction of you in ski pants/jacket/goggles, your claim will be questioned.
What you are suggesting is that everything claimed by Jews, much of which was not revealed until many years after the fact, must be accepted without inquiry because…..?
He was beaten/tortured upon capture; his family threatened; the confessions/autobiography was extracted under duress, therefore inadmissible.
Weren’t they all killed after 2 months? Who was left? Dario Gabbai, the fake-Jewish sonderkommando, who said:
“I’m sure I had a bar mitzvah…I don’t remember, but I’m sure I did.”
“Our traditional Jewish food was chicken. Rice and beans.”
“I don’t remember our synagogue; I can’t really describe it; I was only 22 years old when the Nazis captured me.”
“The Hungarian Jews were dropped straight from the tram down the crematorium/chamber stairwell.”
“I pulled 3,500 black & blue corpses around everyday with the hook end of a cane; no protective gear required, but sometimes we screamed, Ahh! You know, from the gas.”
I’ll stop here. I won’t mention the darting eyes, glancing off camera, incessant throat clearing, inability to remember his brother’s age or identify his former “Nazi” ID papers…..
Yes, they can. That’s why the story appears to be false.
Hey, Franny, it is NOT cold in early May. Atypical weather does occur, but was it cold on May 15? June 15? July? It is so hot where I live, you can wear flip-flops year round; we are acclimated to this heat. Whilst vacationing at an island near the equator, me and my family were hiking around in shorts/halter tops, happy as clams, whilst the family from Washington state, decked out head to toe in mesh gear, were melting and proclaiming heat exhaustion. You claim the photos depict people, previously packed by the thousands in trams, given little water, transported over several days in spring/summer, yet nearly all are dressed in heavy, winter clothing. That is called a discrepancy; multiple discrepancies indicate deliberate falsifications. The entire official “Holocaust” narrative is nothing but discrepancies, exaggerations and outright lies.
You are comparing 350,000 apples with one orange, but even your comparison is not right.
If you don’t believe the captions on Chabad Fran’s photos of healthy well-fed people, you must be a jew-hating mentally-disturbed antisemite Nazi!
You and several others here are heroically and effectively exposing Chabad Fran’s rabid supremacist lies, but… taking her seriously plays into the Jews’ tactic of counting dead and “survivor” Yids on your fingers in order to avoid the central pertinent question: “If a tribe/nation declares a global war, should we be surprised or sad that some of them died in wars and revolutions that they started?” http://judaism.is/perpetrators.html
Not at all.
I am comparing 350,000 apples with one egg.
I’ve never known an orange to be cracked.
Oh dear.
Let’s talk again in 2063 after a PR has been hired to revise the narrative and we’ll look at some photos.
The same way 900 Jews got to Naples, then Oswego, NY, in Spring 1944
A lot of people would have liked to have gone to Italy in the summer of 1944, including the Germans and the Poles. Unfortunately the roads were a little overcrowded with tanks and bombs. No matter to even write such a line is proof that you have no idea what it was like to be a DP in 1944. No one in Europe could just walk into another country, you were not allowed to, in fact it was really impossible to immigrate any where, especially if you were stateless, homeless and poor. Your statement above discusses 900 people, not 1.1 million refugees, whose homes were gone, and were destitute. d\
My family sponsored 4 cousins from DP camps in Europe, it took 6 months and a lot of money, and even then it was a long drawn out process, where my family had to prove that they could support these family members for 2 years.
There were 1.1 million Jews who were in DP camps at the end of the war. Israel took 500,000 of them. The other survivors were annexed into Russia as they absorbed the Eastern Countries, approx 2.2 million. The remainder of those Jews trickled into South America, the US and other European Countries but they did not “walk into Italy”. And they certainly did not go anywhere from Auschwitz that was a march from hell to be liberated.
At least try and pretend you know what you are talking about. The Jews you see in the Auschwitz Album were gassed and cremated the day the photograph was taken. That is what the Germans say, the Commandant’s, and the survivors who searched for their family members.
My comment #1275 still stands; you have not even touched it. You are unable to read it with any desire to know what I am saying; it’s pure resistance on your part. And the same with Franklin R. I agree with you both on one thing: We have already made up our minds and nothing from the other side is going to change it, unless it be something huge and hitherto unknown.
But repeating selected passages from 20 year-old material that has been long known of and digested, will not change anything. What we Hoax-deniers here should be doing is directing our comments to our own side and those who may be not fully convinced yet, but not replying to dyed-in-the-wool Hoax-believers (usually Jews for whom is it political and existential) with repetitious and time-wasting, boring replies.
False. Of course I know what “side” it’s from. It’s ridiculous nonsense like this that you so carelessly throw around that makes it intolerable to talk with you.
I don’t think either said anything about the “photos.” More wild and un-hinged statements, not connected to what was originally “argued” by you, that you throw at me. You grab at Eichmann now and bring him into it w/o making any connection. You’re out of control and in the throes of insanity in your effort to defend a narrative created by other insane people whom you are related to.
No further comment from me until you properly deal with what I already wrote. Like it or not, that is my position.
https://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.com/2014/10/rebuttal-of-mattogno-on-auschwitz-part.html#docs
I guess it was my poor effort at sarcasm that didn’t come through.
Ref.: Post # 1216
Our very own font of all Jewish wisdom, Franny, has regaled us with the following pearls of wisdom: (sarcasm off)
Franny’s partial post: “…The incineration caused tremendous heat from the multi muffled ovens. So the process was self fueling. They only needed fuel to start the ovens. The ovens broke down after 24-7 use, so there were complication. But the body disposal has been fully documented…”
This is only a short excerpt; the whole paragraph is worth reading. Why? Because she made the same assertion in another thread on this blog some months ago.
As I am wont to do, I asked Franny for photographs of these super duper German crematoria as installed in Auschwitz.
And our Franny had to concede that no such crematoria had ever been built!!!
As to the rest of her shrill caterwauling, it surely demonstrates her intelligence to be equal to that of a door knob. The latter at least has definite usefulness.
That Franny definitely sounds unhinged to me. Methinks she is ready for the mental hospital.
What makes you think I give a flying frick ?
You have worn out your franchise and the world’s patience.
Grow the frick up.
Get over yourself.
Or just go away somewhere and kvetch to yourself in a mirror.
You’re too pathetic for decent company.
Who says ‘they are the two most important revisionists’? I didn’t. (Actually Juergen Graf is one of my favorite revisionists. So smart. I posted an old classic, 1994 video interview with Ernst Zundel here: https://jan27.org/select_videos/ It’s the second one down.) There are too many important revisionists to believe such a thing. M. and G. worked together on finding, translating and interpreting documents, and they wrote about these documents. Their accuracy is only as good as the accuracy of the documents.
In the case of the police chief Ferenczy, he didn’t get his numbers from Graf; Graf got the numbers from Ferenczy, and said so. So your statement quoted above is wrong. It’s the old trick of saying that the stories of two parties agree, when actually one party took it’s story from the other! I know you can follow that, though Fran would have difficulty. (And that’s the difficulty of trying to converse with her.)
Ha! Where do you find those images? I especially like #5; little assassin bugs, all in a row.
What else can we do? Words too defiant (aka too truthful) are twisted to make us appear maniacal or abominable.
Fran, FledFromBaltimoreAfterIncitingHatredForWhitesOrWhiteAppearing, calls me a malevolent Jew hater repeatedly, for asking simple questions, such as, “why do people wear heavy, winter clothing in spring/summer?” while I have never once proclaimed her a Gentile hater, though I doubt she is, on an individual basis, but she does proclaim, “Jews are the best of all people! We are the light of the world!” And, if you ask, “could that belief be part of the problem?” prepare yourself for accusations of white supremacy, racism, blood-libel, intolerance, cruelty, rage, envy, (just insert every known aspersion, applicable only to gentiles, of course).
Ref.: post #1302
Franny wrote: “…At least try and pretend you know what you are talking about. The Jews you see in the Auschwitz Album were gassed and cremated the day the photograph was taken. That is what the Germans say, the Commandant’s, and the survivors who searched for their family members…”.
Talk is cheap, and often obtained by torture.
Do you have any authenticated forensic evidence to support this assertion of gassings?
You know, 6,000,000 corpses would leave somewhere between 100 million to 200 million teeth; cremation does not destroy teeth.
1% of these would be nice as evidence and would negate the need for all your caterwauling and crocodile tears.
“…But repeating selected passages from 20 year-old material that has been long known of and digested, will not change anything…”
Something is not wrong by simply being “old”. If you know of new material that refutes those old passages, then why not provide a link to it? Perhaps because such “new material” doesn’t exist at all. An unsolved problem, no matter how old, still needs an answer.
Fran is right about the May weather in that part of Europe. You say you live in a semi-tropical climate and proceed to use your own experience to judge the weather elsewhere. It’s also true that ghetto jews traditionally wear very “cover-up” clothing, too many clothes from our pov. But it’s not a good argument and you should drop it. There are far more important issues. You should discover what they are instead of indulging your every passing thought process as it occurs to you.
Just calling it as I see it; nothing personal intended.
You also need to digest (read with comprehension) what I wrote in my original comment #1275.
Not all “problems” have answers. We’ve been around and around this “problem” and find that the number of Jews, and just as many non-Jews, transported around, especially after 1943, is unknown. Reliable information is missing. A lot of it fell into the hands of the Soviets. Because of that, you Zionists invented numbers that suited you, and then demanded revisionists prove them wrong. This is a game I won’t play.
ref: #1297
Franny copied and pasted:
“…I pulled 3,500 black & blue corpses around everyday with the hook end of a cane; no protective gear required, but sometimes we screamed…”
The description of the colour of the corpses alone puts to lie this entire narrative. People that died from Zyklon B poisoning, or from Carbon Monoxide for that matter, do not have black & blue colour, nor yellow or green for that matter. Any decent book on toxicology would prove this point.
Holocostians certainly prove to be from the shallow end of the gene pool. The ones that copy and paste this nonsense are no better.
The suggestion was that if those Jews were wearing heavy coats it could not have been in May, therefore those pictures could not pertain to the transport of the Hungarian Jews. But in those very same pictures the German soldiers are not wearing any coats at all, and they would be spending most of the time in open air. So that “coat-argument” is not valid. See picture: https://collections.ushmm.org/iiif-b/assets/738104
#1279 HdC
“Better a dumb Canadian than a stupid Pole.”
I know it is better to be Canadian than Pole.
At least nobody will come to your house in a middle of night screaming “Hände hoch!”*, shots your grandparents, uncle and aunt sends to koncentrazion lager, then he rapes your wife, steals your family souvenirs, sends your older sons for forced labour and your younger childs to Germany for Germanization, expels you from your own home because it is needed for German colonists, finally saying that it’s only your blame because you didn’t want to give back him your own house.
And when this guy goes away, new guy will appear immediately and will live in your house for years and you will be his servant.
USA is not perfect but it’s good neighbor compared to Germany and Russia.
“I’d rather live under German orderliness and justice (pre-war!) than the zoo Canada and all other countries have become. “
Blame yourself and your compatriots.
Canada, USA and other western countries have been democratic countries** and their citizens have been electing psychopaths (who now rule the world) voluntarily, decades after decades.
—
* -means of course in German language: “Hands up!”
** -I know, it’s debatable how much western countries are democratic but I think we can agree that citizens of western countries have have more tools to keep their governments under control than other countries in the world (Russia, China etc.).
ref.: @1283
15 years or so ago I got into a debate on ‘Chronicles, a Magazine of American Culture’ regarding Prussian/German aggressiveness as to war and general military proclivity.
I did a little research on this and found 4 authors, 2 British and 2 Americans, who wrote about these claims just after WWI. Note that I did not find any authors that tried to prove the above allegations.
These 4 worthies dug into these allegations and found that exactly the opposite was true. It turned out that the biggest war mongers in Europe, bar none, were the British followed closely by the French. The Spanish also made a good showing.
Germany/Prussia were at the very bottom of that list of war mongers.
One correction to the article you quoted. The Franco-Prussian was was started by the French.
Now we are getting where this needs to go.
As far as I know the numbers of Jews come from the German reports of train transports. They had to make those reports because the trains were owned by a private company that had to be paid for every passenger.
I appreciate your comments; I am aware of traditional head coverings, and modest clothing, worn by observant Eastern European women. My grandmother often wore a light scarf on her head to protect from sun; my mother, as well. People use umbrellas to deflect the sun’s rays and keep cool. And, by observation, it can be determined if the umbrellas are used for cooling or keeping dry. Heavy coats, heavy scarves, stockings, etc., denote cold weather, not moderately cool weather. Especially, during the day.
I am aware of temperatures in northern/eastern Europe in spring/summer. I have been there during that time, not specifically, but generally. Elevation, ocean currents, wind patterns, etc., affects temperature tolerance and variations; I have been quite comfortable in 4 degree Fahrenheit weather, in Colorado, in full, overhead sunshine, with moderate weather attire, and freezing in coastal, southern Texas when temperatures (rarely) hit 35 degrees Fahrenheit whilst wearing a heavy coat, gloves, etc. Coastal currents exacerbate chill, hence – wind chill factor. Or conversely, heat index increases caused by humidity. You know, the temperature is 90, but feels like 100. Today, it’s 95f, sunny, feels like 108.
I am keenly aware of the nature of climate acclimation, as many tourists to south Texas underestimate the strength/consequences of the sun/humidity, proper hydration, etc. Sun poisoning is common amongst those unfamiliar. Regardless, if humans are crammed together by the thousands, so tightly to be unable to sit, as claimed, the interior temperature will increase; if they are denied water, as claimed, they will remove their coats. The photographs are said to have been taken during the summer; that is the claim. The elderly and the young will not acclimate readily to heat/dehydration; they will seize up. Which of those persons photographed were standing/sitting around in June or July? If it is, in fact, June or July, the coats and scarves are coming off. I say, if it’s May, they’re coming off. I say, those photos were taken in winter.
I checked for weather anomalies during that time period; I found nothing. If you are aware of unseasonal cold fronts, throughout the summer of 1944, please advise accordingly. I will adjust my argument, accordingly.
And, if you believe the mumbo-jumbo about waiting for the first 2,ooo-3,000 people to process through the shower/gas/cremation ordeal, which I don’t, in order for the next group to filter through, they are then sitting around for days, weeks, etc., and those coats are coming off.
If I don’t use my own faculties of reasoning, based on personal experience, education, observations, reality or precedent, then upon whom do I depend? Should I accept what jews say? We all use what we know/understand to form an analysis. HdC is an engineer, so no one argues with him about those schematics – they fly away like those traditional Jewish chickens.
And, one further observation, if I may – the contradictions amongst the eyewitnesses, are so vast and numerous, it is impossible to submit a cohesive, defensive argument, as their tall tales all over the place; it’s like the game of Wack-A-Mole – you just smack them down as they arise.
Eyewitness, Dario Gabbai, said, the Hungarian Jews were dropped straight down the stairwell, sometimes 10,000 per day. Fran, not an eyewitness, and many others say, they were lined up, sorted, lined up again, sent to the grove to wait, they had no clue about what was happening, although babies were thrown alive, in fire pits, that no one noticed……
THEY DO NOT RETRACT THEIR LIES, OVERESTIMATIONS (6 million still everywhere on their pages/literature), OPPOSING ACCOUNTS, ETC., SO WE ARE ALL OVER THE PLACE, AS WELL.
They may have “had to make reports” but those reports didn’t have to be correct, did they. And you have to do better than “As far as I know” … Where is the famous “proof?”
I find it strange that NS Germany, in 1944, could afford to pay a private train company for every passenger, yet they were transporting people all around, sometimes seemingly pointlessly. We do know that many working Jews were transported from the Reinhardt camps back west to labor camps. The whole story of this period has NOT been told, and I suspect purposefully. Ask “by whom” and then think who’s been in control since the end of the war.
You know, folks, there’s this permanent narrative that “Nazis” at that time were frantically destroying evidence that would incriminate them, but that accusation is far more likely to be a projection of what (((they))) were doing. The plan for how they would blame the Germans was already in place. And a portion of the Slavs were in on it.
Mattogno and Graf, have documents listing every train, every passenger, time, where it left from. In meticulous detail, cooperated by the Hungarians.
WRITTEN IN top revisionist articles. Mattogno also takes the stroll thru Auschwitz showing the Jews passing thru the gate of Crematorium 2 and ending up in the groves of crematorium 4. He captions the photos.
And Carolyn is calling this information bogus. Every train, every Jew has been verified. All the photographs are of a transport of 12,000 Jews from Hungary on May 5, 1944, as told by Revisionist historians!!! And Carolyn is not accepting it, accusing the Revisionist of making up data?
How does that work Carolyn? You post a meaningless paragraph citing how confusing the information is. The paragraph was confusing but the data is iron clad. Did you read Mattogno’s paper????
ref #1318
fufu copied and pasted “…At least nobody will come to your house in a middle of night screaming “Hände hoch!”*, shots your grandparents, uncle and aunt sends to koncentrazion lager, then he rapes your wife, steals your family souvenirs, sends your older sons for forced labour and your younger childs to Germany for Germanization, expels you from your own home because it is needed for German colonists, finally saying that it’s only your blame because you didn’t want to give back him your own house.
And when this guy goes away, new guy will appear immediately and will live in your house for years and you will be his servant…”
For “Germanization” simply read “Polonization” which, indeed did occur in addition of the listed deeds.
Funny that, because that is exactly what the Poles did to the German expatriates that found themselves living in Poland after their German territory was stolen by Poland. Poles tend to disagree with this and claim that land was given to them by the kind and benevolent allies after the war. That would make Poles the receivers of stolen goods, which is not looked upon kindly by decent people.
Your observations regarding the governance of western democracies is much like my own observations. I have thought about so-called democracies for a long time and concluded that it is fiction.
The political party powers, the back room boys, decide who will stand as prime minister or president. The populace gets to choose among equally useless and unpleasant types.
What is needed are write-in ballots where the voter may write in a candidate of his choosing. This would require run-off elections to determine the final winner but so what?
Alternatively simply pick the requisite number of candidates off the street, the way it is done for jury selection in criminal trials. I’d be willing to bet that the resulting administration would be superior to what we have now.
I think it is you who are unhinged Carolyn. I have posted this information numerous times. Both Graf and Mattogno commented on the Auschwitz Album, that is what the articles were about.!!! They could see the unemployable Jews. Below again is the article by Mattogno, along with THE AUSCHWITZ PHOTOS, that Mattogno copied and pasted in his article, along with questions and captions. LOOK at the article, the photos are there. Copies of the Auschwitz Album photos.
https://codoh.com/library/document/the-deportation-of-hungarian-jews-from-may-to/en/
Captions by Carlo Mattogno on the Auschwitz Album photos. Look at how he points to the chimney stacks at crematorium number 2. “Look no smoke “he said.
I am really starting to fell like you have a crush on me Carolyn.
The above statement was taken from the link you provided. Do you know what this actually means?
It means:
“It is “proven” that several hundred thousands of people were killed, regardless of specific, forensic evidence or lack thereof, based on what witnesses said, and because we can’t account for every person who arrived to Auschwitz.”
It has been repeatedly asserted by Jewish sources, that 450, 000 undocumented Hungarian Jews were sent to Auschwitz. How do you count/locate undocumented people?
Are these the Topf ovens with high power thermal laser beams? Incineration to ash in 15 minutes?
I’m not sure it’s possible, and then we still must account for the gassing, hauling, prepping, maintenance, etc., but let’s pretend again…52 muffles, 1 corpse every 15 minutes is 4,992 per 24 hour day, so no need for those open air fire pits, then?
A lot of years ago the first website where I participated canceled me after someone wrote to me, “Why do you hate Jews?”
My initial reaction was, I don’t hate Jews.
For years that has troubled me. Why would someone say that?
But OK.
I give up.
Jews demand to be hated.
I’ll oblige.
I’ll tell ’em so 24 times a day if that makes them happy. And makes them stop yapping like a mongrel dog that just peed on the rug.
Just leave me alone and stop screwing up the nation where my grandkids are growing up.
Bingo!! That is what I have been talking about. The beginning middle and end of Holocaust denial. The Holocaust makes perfect logical and documented sense to non Jew haters. You are all stuck with each other. Outside of your world, is the real world, and no one wants anything to do with you. You are canned losers.
Or … they denote that these people had been deported and were not free agents; they wore their coats, scarves, etc. so no one would take them. If they carried a bag or bundle, they might have to put it down, or check it somewhere & not get it back. If it was ON their back, it was safe. Makes total sense to me.
Fran,
No one is saying, we certainly know these photos do not include images of Jews in concentration camps, nor Jews at Auschwitz. The images in the official album appeared in 1988, like Manna from Heaven. The camps were liberated/destroyed over 40 years prior; that’s a long time to be missing.
The video presentation of the official album is narrated and partly says:
It’s the only surviving visual evidence of the process of mass murder at Auschwitz-Birkenau.
@ :56, this transport of Hungarian Jews from the area of Ruthenia arrived in May, 1944.
The arrival of Jews occurred 24 hours a day, 7 days a week.
Most Jews arrived and were sent to the left, to their death.
@ 2:40, these Hungarian Jews arrived daily in the summer of 1944. Many were sent to the grove….they had no idea what was in store…….
All during the narration, various photos, unmarked for reference, scroll along. With a few exceptions, the people are heavily clothed, with heavy neck scarves, as well as head coverings, etc., and other than Elie Wiesel (Romanian) and Primo Levy (Italian), only Hungarian ethnicity is mentioned. Near the end of the video, we see shaved heads and what appears to be warm weather clothing (short sleeves, no neck scarfs).
All of the rail cars in the background, that I observed, were closed/boxed; no visible slats, no open cars. You don’t have to live in Hellfire flip-flop City, Texas, to know, you can’t stuff a closed rail car with thousands of people in coats, in spring/summer weather, no water, for days, without killing half of them before arrival……
Speaking of killing them all…..I noticed in the first set of images in your post, unemployable women and children are depicted with cooking pots and luggage, which they were allowed to keep and take to the following destination……I guess they were not sent “left/to immediate death,” as Fran Taubman, real Jew, swears happened to them ALL, nor as Dario Gabbai, fake jew, swears they were ALL dumped straight down the stairwell to the gas chamber.
That does make sense, if their journey is short, and in the early spring, therefore relatively cool.
Heavy coats, heavy neck scarves, stockings, etc., no water, stuffed into a closed car, day after day, in late spring and early summer, mid/late summer, can kill the young, elderly, infirm, and eventually, the healthier, if they are not acclimated to prolonged high heat.
The blips say the Hungarian Jews arrived during summer. I know northern Europe is not like south Texas, but they appear heavily bundled for spring weather. It’s just another discrepancy.
I sent Fran a more detailed observation, I think # 1332, about the album “discovered” by Lilly Jacob. I have no idea whence she found it.
“…The blips say the Hungarian Jews arrived during summer. I know northern Europe is not like south Texas, but they appear heavily bundled for spring weather. It’s just another discrepancy…”
Discrepancy or not, if the weather was cold at that time, you will have to explain why the German soldiers in those pictures all wear only their uniforms and no coats at all, and they would be working all day in open air.
See my comment above at #1317 with picture. Even Carolyn Yeager agrees with that.
#1326 HdC
“For “Germanization” simply read “Polonization” which, indeed did occur in addition of the listed deeds.”
Really? Poles stole German childs to “Polonize” them as Germans did to Polish kids during war when Germans stole over 200,000 Polish childrens* ?
“Funny that, because that is exactly what the Poles did to the German expatriates that found themselves living in Poland after their German territory was stolen by Poland.”
They always could emigrate to Germany. If they stayed in Poland that means that they preferred Polish culture over German “culture”.
Polish culture is much more attractive than German “culture” which is Byzantine culture.
” That would make Poles the receivers of stolen goods, which is not looked upon kindly by decent people.”
They aren’t stolen. Germany accepted these borders in 1971 and 1990 years.**
BTW:Canadians stole land from Natives and made forced “Canadization” of 150,000 Native childs. When do you pay reparations?
Better be hurry before invasion of multi-culti make you poor.
Anyway, let’s take your crazy and stupid theory that “Poles stole German land” as true.
How much $$$ Germany wants from Poland for this allegedly stolen land?
How much $$$ Germany wants for selling Eastern Germany which is old Slavic land*** brutally Germanized in VIII-XII centuries?
I think, that after these transactions Germany will still need to pay reparations to Poles because Germany owes Poland $1.3 trillion****.
“The political party powers, the back room boys, decide who will stand as prime minister or president. The populace gets to choose among equally useless and unpleasant types. “
Blame yourself and your compatriots who preferred making money than keep eye on public affairs.
Don’t worry, soon you will live in land of your dreams – Nazi land. You seems to be good kapo in KL Canada.
—
* – “Kidnapping of children by Nazi Germany”
“During World War II, around 200,000[4][5][6][7] ethnic Polish children as well as an unspecified number of children of other ethnicities were abducted from their homes and forcibly transported to Nazi Germany for purposes of forced labour, medical experimentation, or Germanization. “
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kidnapping_of_children_by_Nazi_Germany
** – ” In 1970 West Germany signed treaties with the Soviet Union (Treaty of Moscow) and Poland (Treaty of Warsaw) recognizing Poland’s Western border at the Oder–Neisse line as current reality, and not to be changed by force.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oder%E2%80%93Neisse_line
“The German–Polish Border Treaty of 1990[a] finally settled the issue of the Polish–German border, which in terms of international law had been pending since 1945.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German%E2%80%93Polish_Border_Treaty
*** – “Germania Slavica”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germania_Slavica
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sorbian_March
****-“The War Report – Abridged Version” about German atrocities in Poland during World War II. Report was made by Polish specialists.
https://instytutstratwojennych.pl/en/abridged-war-report
I looked at your picture; I have seen that particular image many times. Have you ever seen a German officer in short sleeves? How many in heavy coats, scarves, etc.? You don’t really see them dressed in anything other than what they were wearing in the image you posted. I am SURE they wore coats in some areas, and I have been looking – I’ll keep you posted.
My speculation? Heavy coats, scarves, etc., are a bit of an encumbrance. They restrict your movement, you have difficulty moving quickly; you can’t be nimble, you can’t be quick…..coats may need to be removed, held, they get lost, just as Ms. Yeager surmised……the solution is long underwear. If you ski or hike in winter, you always wear long underwear. It is very effective at insulation, in fact, I often remove my jacket, and ski in just the long-sleeved underwear, but I keep my ski pants on.
But, never fear, Mr. Ryckaert, I am back on the Shoah interviews; I am in the middle of one right now. So far, she reports: arrived to Auschwitz in August, 1944; cattle car was packed and they could not sit; she was still a kid (but they didn’t kill her, even though she was unemployable); the camp was overcrowded; she was on the platform for 24 hours (they knew about the gassing although the photo book narrator said the inmates had NO IDEA what was happening); they were SENT TO THE SHOWERS WERE THEY TOOK A……..SHOWER; off to Block 16. I paused at her reporting of the loss of electricity due to allied bombing, and her father and sister (another unemployable permitted to live for some reason) contracted typhus. She also mentioned inmates were transferred to a hospital somewhere.
Any thoughts on why the Allies would bomb an area known to house innocent, Jewish camp inmates? Do you think any Jews died due to this bombing? Do you think those deaths were included in the six million attributed to the “Nazis?”
About the Polonization of Germanic children, no, the Poles did not go that far.
The Poles simply nailed those children to barn doors… Problem solved.
Agreed that I and my family could have taken greater interest in Canadian political life. But our bent is not in that direction. My personal bent was in improving infrastructure for the improvement of the standard of living for all citizens.
We did, faithfully, cast our votes.
Technically, the English, French and a few Dutch did the displacing.
How about you contact the Comanche and get started on the reparations they owe to the Apaches, Pawnees, Arapahos, and Mexican tribes, for the slaughter, torture, displacement that occurred long before Europeans arrived; continued after the arrival of Europeans, and right or wrong, were eventually stopped by same, in their centuries long reign of terror on everyone who was not a Comanche. I would sling a few mentions of the northern native tribes, but then I’m rambling, yet again.
If you put down the book on, “Nazis and Germans Were the Only Evil, Most Evil, Only Savage, Most Savage, Group of People on the Planet,” you might find otherwise.
Pick up a copy of the book, “A Fate Worse than Death,” get back to me. It’s a compilation of accounts from prisoners/captives of Native American tribes.
The train journey from Hungary to southwestern Poland is two days: you leave one day and arrive the next. It’s part of the Jewish lie that it was somehow 5 days to a week. It’s the same with “no water.” Water was supplied in every car. The cars weren’t necessarily “closed” either, for I’ve read of windows (high up) or other openings left open a crack to allow air in. They were also not packed in tightly but had sufficient space between them.
You may know this, but you follow your first sentence with 3 more paragraphs of useless commentary that has no purpose that I can see. This is my problem with you. As you said yourself once, you need to edit your comments … bc you’re not hopeless.
Nazi military in coats:
Source: https://www.hdot.org/debunking-denial/or24-death-camps/
For the rest of your comment, I do not know what you are talking about. As far as I know the Allies didn’t bomb any camp.
Bombing of Nordhausen in World War II
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bombing_of_Nordhausen_in_World_War_II#:~:text=Mission%20748%3A%2010%20B%2D17s,the%20secondary%20target%20of%20Nordhausen.&text=The%20Combined%20Chiefs%20of%20Staff,and%20burned%20with%20intense%20heat.
This appears to be a white-wash.
A video exists/existed in which a Jewish doctor who was tending to tuberculosis patients in the hospital at Nordhausen camp told what he saw and experienced: Allied planes bombed the camp. Many persons in the camp were killed. The doctor spoke of dragging patients out of the hospital to hide in the woods until the thought it was safe to return.
Franny lied, 6 million Jews didn’t die.
And you can skip the details about how those 6 million were allegedly murdered. It’s all true. Take Fannie’s word for it.
Video Link
As other Ritchie Boys were relieved of war duties immediately after May, 1945, Morris Parloff hurriedly traveled to Nordhausen to secure German V-2 technology that had been promised to USSR.
I wrote, “an area known to house inmates,” not an actual camp, which, of course, they would not directly target, unless it’s a camp of German civilians. I should have been more specific. They seemed to have no qualms about Dresden, which as far as I know, had no military significance, no factories nor significant industry, but several mobile hospitals, etc.
Thank you for an image of German soldiers in coats, which I also said I was sure to exist. Anywho, Paula Lebovics, another Jew from a wealthy family in Poland, who thrived despite the never ending pogroms, arrived to Auschwitz in August of 1944. She specifically remarked on the German soldiers, impeccably dressed in proper uniforms, belts, boots and hats, in August, which aligns with my observation that they seem nearly always to be dressed in the same manner, regardless of the time of year. She did not describe hordes of people, sitting or standing around in groves, or dressed in winter clothing, but she also said she was mainly confined to a specific area in Birkenau.
She also said, in her on-camera interview, her family had made an assumption about the deaths of some extended family members at the hands of Germans, but they later learned those family members were killed by Polish people with an axe.
ADVERB
Nearly is used to indicate that something is not quite the case, or not completely the case.
#1337 Hdc
“About the Polonization of Germanic children, no, the Poles did not go that far.
The Poles simply nailed those children to barn doors… Problem solved.”
Sure, Poles took this methods from Canadians who nailed Native children to barn doors half century earlier.
“My personal bent was in improving infrastructure for the improvement of the standard of living for all citizens.”
Did your work was connected with an improvment of barn’s doors width to nail more Native children?
Every Canadian knows that less Natives means the better standard of living.
Canadians only didn’t predict that the more hostile Natives they kill the more hostile emigrants will come.
Even Ukrainians sent to Canada after Russian aggression in February 2022, have been escaping from Canada because they see there is no perspective for better life.
You are such a moron that I’m really happy you live in Canada, far far from more civilized Slavic countries. Stay there and never ever think about emigration to Central, Southern and Eastern Europe.
And expect gift – after WW III (which is comming) we will relocate to Canada more German criminals. KL Canada is really worth it.
Thank you for those encouraging words.
It has been suggested since high school, by more than one Red Pen, “Edit! Shorter sentences! Make your point! Do not begin a sentence with a conjugation!” I disagree on the last command, but I am an outlaw, in literary circles, and animal rescue circles, regarding laws about not stealing emaciated dogs tied on chains all year long……..rambling again, sorry.
I am aware of the myriad of contradictions about those train trips regarding length, water, air, Red Cross assistance, food, etc.
I argue/analyze on the specific allegation or discrepancy, as I come upon it, and regarding the “Holocaust,” I’m usually aware of its’ impossibility or exaggeration.
I find it difficult to explain or discuss complicated, complex issues with pithy comments.
Understating often leads to misconstructions. More detailed comments often lead to a better understanding or a point of personal relevance, which also leads to better analysis or understanding.
Overstating clearly annoys you, and I’m sure others, but please feel free to disregard as you so choose.
ADVERB – Usually
If something usually happens, it is the thing that most often happens in a particular situation.
Not to be confused with “always.” I won’t bother with the dictionary for “always.”
The question inquiring minds want answered is how many of those Hungarian Jews Franny claimed were gassed were actually masturbated to death?
Does death by masturbation really qualify as a “holocaust”? And who was keeping those Jews hard while they were approaching death? Frannies fat grandmother pole dancing in a gas chamber? If it takes over an hour to masturbate a Jew to death, how many days would it take to masturbate 450,000 Jews to death?
It just occurred to me that since Jews have no foreskin, they were more vulnerable to masturbation machines, so most of the Jews would have been executed that way. This is the only possible way that tiny cremation rooms and non-existent gas chambers could have eliminated all the communist slav and polish useful idiots.
As revenge for 3,000,000 Jewish men being masturbated to death, Jews have decided to inflict a tidal wave of porn on the goyim. That way they get to see the goyim commit death by masturbation just like they were. Judaic vengeance at its finest.
A few more encouraging words, Tulip — bc I’d like to think there is hope for you. But since you’ve been refusing good advice from English teachers all your life, and you’re now in your 50’s I believe, maybe not. But still, it is doable if you could see the benefit from it.
You say, “More detailed comments often lead to a better understanding …” The problem with this is that your tendency to “ramble” is never adding more detail, but distracting from what you’ve said that is worthwhile. Or, stated otherwise, diminishing any valid point(s) you may have already made. You see? That’s my own experience with all your posts. Yes, all.
For me, you are unreadable. And I agree with all those, including Fran, who say your comments are BORING, too boring to read. Why? You’re trying to be scintillating, and clever, clever, clever. But it doesn’t come off because … poor content, not well thought out. If you are well-informed, as you assure me you are, why should that be? Possibly bc you’re not focused on communicating information & truth to the other as the #1 goal, but on pleasing yourself, ie. living up to a certain self-image you have. Yet the fact is, you are not that interesting — in fact, you are boring. The TOPIC is interesting, and why we’re here. Learning about you (or me) is not why we’re here. For that, there is Facebook.
I know this comes off as terribly overbearing and mean on my part, but I hope you will give it some thought. Review what you’ve written lately and see if there isn’t some truth in it. I’ve had to do that myself, and it has benefited me greatly. 🙂
You’re not exactly wrong, and I don’t mind constructive criticism.
But, I am not a scholar, and this is an internet commentator platform; it’s not The Literary Review. That said, the subject matter is serious, and I am deeply concerned with what’s happening and what has happened in America and Europe. It seems every warning made by Adolf Hitler has come to pass. His “conspiracy theory” was correct.
I once believed his theory was without merit. I no longer do, and it was many interesting and thoughtful comments, made in various comment sections, that turned my mind.
There is a “personal” aspect, and a comedic aspect to my writing, as that is the sort of writing from others that appeals to me. Perhaps I’m not as clever nor as amusing as I would like to be in written text, however I am not an egomaniac, nor do I use Facebook or those sorts of social media platforms.
I regret to have been boring and/or unintentionally offending The World of Unz during the last few months; I will take your advice under consideration. But, you know the saying about Old Dogs and new tricks (I’m not that old, but very close); I will do my best.
These poor starving gentiles, even poor innocent children, are being forced by Hungarian Jews to dig their own graves with their hands:
These starved gentiles are being forced by Hungarian Jews to line up to be gassed in Israeli death camps:
This survivor of the Israeli death camps gives his testimony in any language you choose and the AI will make his mouth say he died from anything you want him to say. The internet will allow this survivor to survive forever:
Yes, indeed. Frannie, this is the nonsense that purports to prove the narrative told by holocaust fabricators to validate their tales.
I have to ask, as I’ve seen that image before – is it an original or a reconstruction, like the reconstruction snuck in at Auschwitz?
It’s the real thing. The original.
Why are these Jews dancing on the platform at the Budapest train station?
Because they just found out that the are going to be saved from the Judeo-Bolshevic Red Rapist Army…
and that they are going to be sent to the Euro-Disney at Auschwitz.
Are you insinuating that impeccably honest Jews like Fran Taubman would lie about something as sacred as the holy holofraud? How dare you, Hasbara Yentas simply never lie.
I can assure you that that masturbation machine was no reconstruction and that it was just as real as the diary of Ann Franke…
In fact, numerous Rabbis who have spent centuries studying how all goyim are Amaleks and must be eliminated have come out and told us that in order to accelerate the masturbation death procedure, that at the Wannsee Conference Hitler personally ordered that the mother of each victim be turned into KY jelly soap bars for use in this barbaric method of execution.
Dear Carolyn,
In an earlier comment to Tiptoe, you suggest that the transportees wore so many layers of heavy, winter clothing for fear of loosing their bundles. But surely, as any experienced traveller knows, those bundles would have provided good, makeshift seating. That was my first thought. But if they were packed into the cars, then bundles of clothes may have taken up precious space.
Now you say that, contrary to Fran’s suggestion that they were packed like sardines, there was adequate space in each car for each passenger. This makes Tiptoe’s clothing argument all the more valid. – Certainly their journey would have been made much more comfortable had they bundled their clothing for use as seating. Unless it was freezing cold.
Best regards,
Kali.
Dear Tiptoe,
It’s all a matter of personal taste. I don’t find you boring. But then, I don’t mind a bit of rambling here and there.
These are very serious topics we’re dealing with, so for the sake of our good mental health, I think it’s important to lighten up once in a while.
Thank you for your input and your perspective.
Best regards,
Kali.
Come to think of it, why tell lies if the whole story is absolutely true as Frannie keeps alleging.. And then you have all these examples of proven liars putting out their claims that instantly become proof of the holocaust that the purveyors peddle to keep buttressing their tale.
And then I am reminded of the jury instruction about assessing the testimony of a witness that tells the jury that if you catch a witnesses telling one material lie, the jury can dismiss as lies everything the witness testified to unless the probability that what the witness alleges is true is greater than that it is false.
Well then given all the proven lies that holocaust purveyors have told to buttress their claims, everything purveyors have claimed about it should likewise be dismissed as lies unless and until they present physical evidence that proves its truthfulness beyond a reasonable doubt as would be required in any murder case.
Aint seen Frannie produce any kind of evidence that comes remotely close to that standard.
I mean not a single photograph she has presented has been authenticated by anyone qualified to do so.
None of the documentary evidence she has presented passes the laugh test much less the evidentiary standards that qualify it as an exception to the hearsay rule that OTHERWISE BARS IT FROM BEING INTRODUCED IN A CRIMINAL trial, such as that for example for business records, that it was made in the regular course of a business; it was made at or near the time oif the event, act or condition it documents; the custodian or other qualified person testifies to its identity and the mode of its preparation and the source of the information and method and time of preparation were such as to indicate its trustworthiness.
Hey, Frannie, I have not seen that the documents your keep invoking as evidence of the holocaust comes within light year of proving it satisfies even one of the requirements necessary to qualify it as evidence. Not a single one.
So Frannie, unless you can produce evidence that any document you rely on to substantiate your claims satisfies all the requirements that quality it as evidence under the appropriate exception to the hearsay rule, it is dismissible as garbage until you present the qualifying evidence.
If I had spent years studying how to hate Goyim in the Talmud and the Protocols, or under the guidance of some goyim hating Rabbi, like Franny clearly has, then I could certain prove to you that these never ending circular logic psyops that the Jews keep playing on us are a centuries old method used for the destruction of any host stupid enough to allow Jews into their country.
We can see it all over, and the volume and mendacity has become so shrill that even the biggest useful idiots are having a difficult time pretending its not happening. Here is an example.
With the CV19 psyop, already with SARS in 2003 which was then amplified by various fake follow on “bird flu” and “swine flu” epidemics, we had Jews doing their predictive programming with things like event 209 or even Hariri presentations at Davos. Next some billionaire or some Jew controlled tax free “foundation” gets a group of bribed or extorted doctors to claim that some new “respiratory illness” is filling up some hospital ward. Then they get one of the talmudic MSM organs, like AP or Reuters, or even some small local paper, to publish and amplify the story. Then they get one or two health organs of one of the ZOG satrapies to make some announcements about risks to the nation. Then they use coercion to get a few more countries which are not under their total domination to announce similar findings. Then they get some UN organization, like WHO, to start beating the panic drum. Then they use their control of media and big tech to shut down any alternative sources of information from publishing the truth. Then they use all their slick lawyers and politicians to make laws and to prosecute any goyim who tries to resist their narrative.
This is what happened over a longer, more protracted period of time (Rabbis have been working to destroy European civilization for over 2000 years), with the Holofraud and Global Warming.
Franny’s role in all this is to obfuscate and to gas light the goyim. She is a provocateur. She is like those Jews smashing windows on Krystallnacht or during those infamous “pogrom” in Tsarist Russia.
O Gosh the swimmingpool argument again! https://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.com/2017/05/rebutting-twitter-denial-most-popular.html#auschwitzswimmingpool
Well, Franny, my dear, I do wonder about the efficacy of that contraption.
Ordinarily, I would suggest that, through personal experience in helping a man along in that endeavor, it seems to me it would be ineffective, but I have been cautioned in that regard.
I thought “death by masturbation,” like blindness, had been debunked.
ref.: #1346
Congratulations fufu, the fertile imagination of your sick brain produced a tour de force of Polish creativity. You would do very well in Hollywood. Just combine baaad Germans and the holy 6 million in your fairy tale, and an Oscar would be guaranteed.
Engineers are not needed for barn nailings of women and children; this was well proved by the Soviets and Poles.
Sorry to have to advise you that my professional endeavours were in the field of electric power plant construction.
In an earlier post on this thread I wrote about the natives in Canada. The issues are complex and Native culture is a large part of the problem here. Some years ago a newspaper I think it was, reported on the state of well being of a very small native band on the east coast of Canada. This native band was very small indeed with about 200 members and a woman as band chief. The report also stated that this chief drew a salary of 1 million dollars! Nice job if you can get it.
Immigrants and others are leaving Canada all the time for various reasons, and the current catastrophic increase in housing costs are a large part of the problem. I’ve lived in my own home, now my fourth, since 1976. There are ongoing debates as to what is cheaper accommodation, rental or purchase. I’d agree that renting is cheaper under certain circumstances; in the long run purchasing is the way to go because it isolates you from dramatic rent increases such as we see now. The rent for a tiny apartment, smaller than my living room, is more than twice of what I pay monthly for mortgage and property taxes. And who wants to raise a family in such surroundings?
Oh, and bring on those German immigrants to Canada! This would be a great improvement of what we get now by the hundreds of thousands. But Canada is a huge country and the impact of those free loaders has not yet reared its ugly head in my neighbourhood because the house prices here are now well over 1 million dollars. And yes, I live in a very nice home indeed, with vistas of meadow and forest, right in the middle of one of the fastest growing cities in Canada.
Finally, the tract of land I reside on was legally purchased from the legal owners, a native band, back in 1790 or thereabouts by the German Land Company, which then brought in German settlers and farmers. The bill of sale is displayed in a local museum.
Dear Kali,
Your comment shows zero awareness of that which you’re commenting on.
Best regards.
God Himself tells us to hate evil.
GOD HIMSELF has damned Chabad Fran’s wicked, lying “double tongue”!
So typical that Jews contradict God to “defeat” him. Bava Metzia 59b
I value Caroline Yeager’s steadfast insistence on precision and concision in pursuit of Truth (my working definition of Truth = “the mind’s assent to reality”).
I also value UnzForum for many things — Laurent Guyénot, Pepe Escobar, the collection of disappeared books, etc., as well as the opportunity to learn from and engage with commentators who frequently offer fresh information and fresh perspectives.
In terms of writing style in comments: Tiptoe is relatively new to UnzForum.
I’m a
relativelyabsolutely old person who has taken advantage of UnzForum for more years than Tiptoe and in that time I have, in my own estimation, anyhow, somewhat honed my own ability to write more concisely.But in my own estimation, UnzForum is also a pressure release valve as well as an opportunity to try out ideas; to make a fool of myself with little real-world impact; to look at myself in the words I have written and critique them for myself, assessing when I wish I had erased that 3″ box and when I am proud of its contents.
UnzForum is a school; the tuition is whatever I choose to contribute.
I’m glad it exists.
I’m glad Carolyn Yeager participates.
I’m glad Tiptoethrutulips, Kalli, even Skeptikal and many others are brave enough to share their thoughts. I wish Fran Taubman would go away, but I suppose you need the bitter to make the sweet that much more delectable.
I tend to write too much — “prolixity,” someone told me.
I also get so wrapped up in the last thing that popped into my mind that I forget the first thing.
In terms of the above comment, the motivation for writing it was Laurent Guyénot’s opening passage in How Yahweh Conquered Rome, the chapter entitled “The People of the Lie,” exemplified by a passage from Primo Levi in which the Jewish- Italian holohoax survivor instructs his son that the people he is metaphorically describing (“dentist” = “Jews”) maintain and expand their dominance by being more proficient than all others in “The Lie.”
Guyénot’s writing has been a phenomenal eye-opener and mind-expander. He has put the history of the last 2500 years (+-), dominated as they have been by the “mythology” of Judea-Christianity, through a cat-scan and discovered numerous malfunctions and disease mechanisms.
Pepe Escobar, for all that some criticize him for an excess of enthusiasm about the progress of the “Global South” or the “Global Globe,” has nevertheless served to keep the Unz commentariat informed that the R0W is moving on from the forms of global dominance imposed by Judeo-Christianity.
Consider Taubman’s taunt (@ #1330) that
Don’t think so, Fran: The emerging strength of the Global South, the Rest of the World (RoW), IS the real world.
There’s a new world a-borning and, to paraphrase George Carlin, Jews ain’t in it (fascinating that Ethiopia has joined BRICS11: in his blueprint for zionist Palestine, Arthur Ruppin specifically excluded “Black and brown people,” and in the present day, Israelis have expelled Ethiopian Jews. The emerging strength of the Global South, the Rest of the World (RoW), IS the real world.
About twenty years ago zionists in USA headed up an organization whose first act was to assess the feasibility of an Israel-China alliance, “in view of the expected demise of USA as a global power.”
In that 20-year period, as Jane Eisner informed young Jews, “Jews are the new Elite.”
At about the same time, in about 2012, Phil Weiss wrote in his blog, Mondoweiss, Jews had now displaced “WASPs” as the “American Elite.”
Way to go, Jews.
The USA has never been so fubar’d.
Perhaps your rabbi or cantor can compose “no one wants anything to do with us. . . . We are canned losers” to the tune of RoW RoW RoW your boat gently into the drink . . .
(And maybe some Hagee-ish “Christian zionist passsstor” can compose an evangelical version:
RoW RoW RoW your boat gently down the drain . . . )
I rather like Franny’s scribbles, or copy and paste efforts, now and again.
Franny’s caterwauling demonstrates for one and all the non existence of verifiable forensic evidence in support of any assertions of the holy holocost. One may argue numbers, railroads, weather, clothing, pictures etc. etc. until blue in the face. Without any forensic evidence to substantiate holocost happenings of gasings and cremations, it did not happen. Every human contact leaves evidence.
And it demonstrates the origins of the holohoaxers from the shallow end of the gene pool. They sure as hell do not grasp the meaning of verifiable forensic evidence.
Franny’s copy and paste just reinforces the holohoaxers’ lies.
The rural villages I have visited in western Germany all had a Loeschteich or dousing pond for the fire department to obtain large quantities of water quickly.
Not one of them was made of concrete or in any way shape or form resembled a swimming pool.
Granted that a swimming pool can, and will, be used by the fire department in an emergency. However, construction of concrete demonstrates that the primary intent is for use as a swimming pool.
Further, I have never seen a Loeschteich with diving stands as shown in the picture of other, earlier, posts.
Mislabelling of innocent photos appears to be a primary occupation of holohoaxers.
ref.: #1356
Beautiful, just beautiful!
I listened to Jane’s speech, all 15+ minutes of it. How skillfully she bashes European men, elevates African men, chides the English for recalcitrance in public, Jewish religious expression (Balfour Deception, anyone?), whilst still claiming a prolonged history of undeserved group victimization, who, Finally! have achieved “extraordinary wealth, social status and political power.” I envision a room full of goyim, clapping like seals, in response. Finally?
I say, they, themselves, reveal the truth of it; it being, what they have actually been up to over the years. In listening to the Shoah interviews, I have observed the following:
With only one exception, every “survivor” hailed from a prosperous, wealthy or well-to-do family, including in Poland and Germany, even after Hitler came to power.
Baruch Bergman professed poverty throughout, but would repeatedly say, “Although we were poor, we hired….someone to care for children, cook, clean, work here or there, bribe an official…” His interview was conducted from his 5th Avenue apartment. He also mentioned his father ran a business selling confiscated goods which had been confiscated by Germans and turned over to White Russians. But, Hey! Everyone’s gotta eat! Let’s sell Jewish property back to the Jews!
Paula Lebovics, who was in Auschwitz at liberation, said, “Although many people had issues with the Russians (no further inquiry on that subject), I did not.” She also said the Russians gathered all frozen corpses to arrange for a photo, and dressed all remaining inmates in those striped pajamas, also for those now famous photos.
Every interviewer led or prompted the interviewee to desist from any positive or insufficiently tragic statements about their experiences. I heard several statements of happiness and contentment in the early “ghetto” years (of course, some listeners are aware they self-segregated anyway), and the survivors immediately changed tack. I do understand the concept of finding happiness or a way to cope in a terrible circumstance, and I resent the deceptive manipulation. And, I suggest, it’s impossible to find joy in a Death Camp.
On Ukraine, I recently read there was much geo-political worry over Germany and German success in farming in that fertile area prior to WW1, and here we are, Ukraine with all that fertile soil, minerals, oil (?), ripe for exploitation.
Scratch a lie, find a jew.
(Sorry, Franny)
Agree.
So that explains why your comments so often seem like a series of vignettes, where any cohesion is hard to find. I’ve noticed that more lately than I had earlier. From your comment above this one:
Sure you do. If I were someone other than C. Y., I would find her one of the more interesting and informative. I would like her style too, abrasive though it seems to many.
So we all have our personalities, I’m certainly appreciative of that. Some of it can be hard-wired & almost impossible to change w/o destroying the personality, but much of it is not. That’s where we can improve ourselves, and who wouldn’t benefit from some improvement? Those who rush to interfere with that, and assure you that you don’t need to change a thing, like Kali does, are not your best friends. Kali did this with Rurik also. It’s kind of her trademark. Tulip is not Rurik, imo; she is tougher and capable of taking on her own defense rationally, if she thinks it’s necessary.
But beyond that, my question to you is: Why did you agree with Kali’s comment? From what you wrote here, I now suspect it was bc you sometimes do similar disconnected “excess” as Tulip indulges in, and so you don’t think critique is in order.
Is that the reason, or is it something else?
Correction: “as Tulip used to indulge in.” Maybe she’s already stopped that.. 🙂
This thread:
Carolyn Yeager: 162 comments. 36, 689 words
SolontoCroesus: 76 comments 23,868 words
I think that’s called “writer-based writing” — the writer assumes that the reader is ‘in the writer’s head’ and follows the connections being made; that is, that the reader must be a mind-reader because the writer has failed to provide context.
In an overall review, I noticed a few (but not “so often”) of such “series of vignettes” type comments, some that were really off the rails.
I read a lot and try to introduce others to information I have discovered. I try to include references, extensive quotes, and links so others can pursue the reference if it interests them.
I am far more interested in “Who set the wars/ destruction in motion” than in counting bodies.
The topic being as controversial as it is, I try to support claims I make with outside authorities. Favorite sources are autobiographies of some of the zionist leaders who were actively involved in starting or prolonging the wars.
Having read the material, I fail to recognize in writing about it to an unknown audience that they have no concept of the whole of the matter being discussed, and I frequently fail to provide that context because it becomes even more wordy.
I did not examine and tally CY vs StC comments for references to books, essays and the like, with accompanying links. My impression is that CY offers fewer.
Thank you, dear Kali.
She’s not wrong to say it, particularly if I come across as inserting “myself,” rather than my observations into the debate. I do appreciate a bit of personal writing, in general, to understand a writer’s perspective, but within appropriate context.
Jordan Peterson, whom I dearly love (although he’s spun out a bit since his capture by the Daily Wire; I knew they’d grab him….I’m meandering…) says, no matter what you do in life, effective communication skills are paramount. I tend to agree.
Cheerio! Fare thee well! Parting is such sweet sorrow! Whatever you Brits are saying these days….
“There were no homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau.” – John Wear
I checked out your typical Hebrew “fact checker” “rebuttal”.
First of all this statement uses typical Jewish circular logic to debunk: “Auschwitz was an extermination camp because among the sub-camps there were was an extermination camp“, QED. Of course they have never proved that any sub-camp was an “extermination camp”.
Then it drills down into the swimming pool:
In many lands, including Spain, firefighters have first use of water in a pool, so by twisted and warped Jewish logic every pool in Spain could be considered a “firefighting water reservoir” and a Jewish baby drowning pool to boot.
The author fails to mention that it Judea who declared war against Germany and forced all it minion states (US/UK/USSR/France) to wage war on Germany. Jews, unless proven otherwise, were de-facto soldiers at war with Germany, and morally could be considered POW’s. Jews should be relieved that Hitler didn’t just set up a set of Bug River Meadows Camps and left all Jews to perish to the elements in the same fashion that Eisenhower the “Swedish Jew” set up camps to exterminate German POW’s after the war was ended. Instead we have 80 years of kvetching, spittle flinging, fraud, lies and extortion.
Jews tell so many lies piled so deep that they cannot recognize the truth. You claim to be gods chosen people, but that is a lie. In reality you worship the prince of lies and you are his chosen people.
The vast majority of Jews and their sycophants are raised at birth on a steady diet of lies. For males it starts with the Rabbi chomping off their foreskin for “hygiene”, yet Jews are the most unhygienetic fair skinned people on the planet.
I can assert with near certainty that none of us “holocaust” “deniers” commenting on this thread hate Ron Unz despite the fact that he is a Jew. To the contrary, most, if not all, like myself respect him immensely for exposing Jewish lies that you propagate, like the holofraud that you obsess over.
It is not Jews that we “hate” [I put hate in quotations because none of us “hate” any Jews the way Jews hate goyim], rather it is Jewish lies. The entire Talmud is centered around lying. Kol Nidre is your holiday where you celebrate lying to what you claim is “god”, by torturing chickens. What a disgusting race of liars you are.
When a Jew tries to rise above the filthy religion that makes Matza Balls using blood from ritually sacrificed goy children, we honor and praise them. Like Ron Unz, or Henry Makow, Brother Nathanael.
Now I have never, ever, seen anything from a Rabbi that is not a pack of lies. If someone accused me of hating Rabbi’s I might even agree. But hating Jews? I plead not guilty.
So have you refuted the “swimmingpool-argument” yes or no?
“…When a Jew tries to rise above the filthy religion that makes Matza Balls using blood from ritually sacrificed goy children, we honor and praise them…”
You claim “not to hate Jews”, yet you believe in that ridiculous Medieval blood label?
Thrown out of 109 countries, Franklin. why? What a buffoon you are. Here is what our Jewish host Ron Unz had to say about Toaff’s exposure of your tribes depravity and sadism:
Whenever Jews react so violently goyim can be certain they have tapped into the truth, and this is doubly true with “blood libel” that gets Jews like you kvetching and flinging spit. Toaff was researching a case of Jewish ritual sacrifice from the late 19th century, long after your “mideaval” misdirection. And why do you think the Russian peasants kept getting so outraged by Jewish behavior that they would participate in a pogrom? When some child was found drained of blood in a well with puncture marks in the same pattern that was found on the cellar door where Jews ritually sacrificed the Tsar and his family, do you claim that is mere coincidence? Of course some Yenta like Franny was probably spreading some lies to the Russian peasants, but it was the ritial blood sacrifice that made them despise Jews like yourself.
Now, even more modern cases are coming to light with the exposure of Jewish elites addiction to adrenochome and the exposure of what ((Jeffrey Epstein)) was up to a Zorro Ranch and his pedo island.
So Franklin, please share with us your favorite type of Matzah balls. Do ones made with Aryan blood taste better than those made with Slavic blood? And which type of Adrenochrome gives you the biggest rush?
Below the more are a small taste of what Europeans have discovered about so many Jews and especially their Rabbis over the last few centuries:
You mean “libel”. Yes he has. And I appreciate the quotes from the HC page bc I simply can’t stand to read anything there anymore. It’s all the same, always dishonest.
What do you find is missing from his rebuttal?
This comment was meant for #1380, not 1381, about the HC page on the Auschwitz swimming pool.
You can’t stand reading the Holocaust Controversies rebuttal of what I call the “swimmingpool-argument” because you yourself have written Auschwitz: The Underground Guided Tour with the same ridiculous “argument”.
The HC rebuttal was already cited by Brosi himself and need no further elaboration from me. Brosi did not refute that in any way.
As for people who insist on still believing Medieval superstitions, everybody has the right to his own pace of evolution. If that means being stuck in the Middle Ages, so be it. For Brosi Medieval pictures of their superstitions are “the proof”.
Don’t straw man me Carolyn.
Offering support to a fellow commenter where I see fit is not the same thing as suggesting there’s no room for growth or change! By the same token, needlessly criticising others is not the same thing as constructively criticising them.
Think back to your unjustifiably shitty treatment of John Wear and of Rurik (others too) which occured before you decided to moderate yourself because the topic under discussion is too important to be bogged down in ad hominem comments.
I alternated between criticising you and slapping you down in a (failed) effort to get you to see the error of your ways. But my efforts are not why you changed your approach. You changed because it made sense to you to do so.
IF Tiptoe decides she needs to moderate her comments for any reason, that’s her choice and doubtless will have nothing at all to do with your pointless and personal criticism (because you find her “boring”) of her! Same goes for John, Rurik and any other participant in these discussions that you choose to attack for no good reason.
I will defend and support anyone I choose to, and neither require, nor seek your approval for that. I dislike unnecessary/unhelpful bitchiness and needlessly shitty attitudes, and remain free to pounce as I see fit.
Apparently, all it took for your sudden reversal of attitude toward me was my disagreeing, or not wholeheartedly agreeing, with you. That suggests an incredibly fragile ego to me. So fragile, in fact, that you would sidestep this most important debate in order to regress to your former position of charging me for no good reason.
You can do better than this Carolyn, as you have amply demonstrated in this thread. Your knowledge and insistence on accuracy (where the facts are known) are to your credit. Your needlessly unpleasant and unhelpful criticisms of others is not.
I reassured Tiptoe that she is not boring. I imagine that’s what others agree with. It’s beyond me why you feel the need to ask!
If you wish to clash with me, you know I will easily match you and probably outmatch you, and will enjoy doing so (I’m a fighter by nature, well practices by necessity). But if you wish to continue to present your case against the Holocaustian myth, I happily, and humbly, remain your student.
Obviously, I feel that the latter would be a better use of our time.
Best regards,
Kali
I agree with this!
I think we’ve well and truly exhausted the (no)body-count part of this discussion. (If I see one more comment about Hungarian “We… Assume… Murder” Jews I might actually weep with the boredom of pointless repetition.)
Getting to the WHO agitated for war, and by what methods/means will surely expose the truly guilty parties, responsible for the deaths of millions upon millions of gentiles, as well as a few hundred thousand Jews. – I’m interested to learn more about Lord Halifax if you happen to have any references to offer, Solonto.
But I disagree that anyone here owes Carolyn an explanation for their contributions, unless it’s within the context of debating the facts. If she finds someone too wordy, and has a problem with that, then let her examine herself to discover why.
For my part, I don’t think I’ve ever skipped a comment of yours when I’ve encountered them in all the years I’ve been using this forum. So, rest assured, you must be doing something right. 😇
Fond regards,
Kali.
Thanks for your nice reply! You didn’t answer my question but that’s alright; it no longer seems important. It’s always helpful to hear someone give a self-assessment; the person becomes “more” than just the words they present & a more rounded picture emerges. I understand everything you said and can relate.
No, I don’t quote from & link to the type of material that you do. I don’t read books by Jews bc I find them so offensive. But I like to read/know parts of them, and I’ve enjoyed your commentary on these sources over the few years I’ve been on UR. Rabbi Wise stands out in my mind. That’s what first really impressed me. It’s only recently that you’ve seemed to mix it up in a way that is less logical … for me. (Actually, I think it may be bc you didn’t like the way the thread was going and wanted to introduce something else?) All in all, though, solid information is always good. I get disturbed with opinion and hearsay. My pet peeve: “I remember reading somewhere that …” That’s why I use links to my own websites as much as I do — bc I remember them and they’re easy for me to find.
Yes, sometimes a little more context would be helpful. You say: “Favorite sources are autobiographies of some of the zionist leaders who were actively involved in starting or prolonging the wars.” Noted, and here is where I could often use just a little more connection with the how, when and where, even though it may seem obvious to you. I would like to hear from you how you connect it.
To copy you, I am very glad you’re here too! It would be a grievous loss if you were to depart.
I don’t think that you have Tiptoe, and I’ve appreciated your examination of the evidence (“survivor” videos, photo’s, etc) from a lawyerly perspective. I’ve also gained insight into where your coming from, from the personal anecdotes that you’ve shared.
I agree also, and this is why I like to write… to craft a piece of writing to say the most, as succinctly as possible is something I love to do. But, as you point out, the personal is also part of our discussions alongside the subject matter itself, and it helps us to form an image of one another.
In an earlier comment, Carolyn informed us that her star sign is Virgo (same as my dad).
Mine is Libra, so I try to find or introduce balance where I can. But I’m only half a degree inside Libra, approaching Scorpio, so I go rather deep and have a nasty sting in my tail. (Aquarius rising, moon in Capricorn… But I’m rambling! 😁)
My point being that we may all share personal details. Sometimes gratuitously. Including Carolyn.
Lots of love,
Kali.
Oh, these days I tend to say “ate ja”, because I live in Portugal, but “toodle-pip” is always fun to say. xx
Y’know, Kali, I frequently think I fail to observe decent blog manners in not thanking people when they write something kind or favorable about what I have written. I don’t want to seem to be playing for an audience . . .
(I have been thoroughly Catholicized– I had a principal, once, whose favorite statement was, “I am the least and the last and the lowest” (!).
(she’s now at the “lowest” point in her life — 6′ under)
BUT, it feels good, and I thank you for your vote of confidence.
I also believe that a blog such as this, which indeed does discuss important issues and should take full advantage of the opportunity Ron Unz offers to air them, can also be a source for development of writing skills, as well as a place to be funny or stupid or just rant, if that is what makes life a little better.
Very best —
#1364 HdC
“You would do very well in Hollywood. Just combine baaad Germans and the holy 6 million in your fairy tale, and an Oscar would be guaranteed.”
Don’t tempt me my litte Canadian devil 🙂 Do you want some percentage? I can offer you 20% as inventor of the idea.
“Engineers are not needed for barn nailings of women and children; this was well proved by the Soviets and Poles.”
As usually, you have no proves.
“In an earlier post on this thread I wrote about the natives in Canada. The issues are complex and Native culture is a large part of the problem here. “
AngloSaxon-origin people of Canada are a problem, not Natives.
“But Canada is a huge country(…)”
Canada isn’t country. Canada is a bunch of money-makers from all over the world. Next 200 year will show if Canada is a real country.
“Finally, the tract of land I reside on was legally purchased from the legal owners, a native band, back in 1790 or thereabouts by the German Land Company, which then brought in German settlers and farmers. The bill of sale is displayed in a local museum. “
As usually, you have no proves. The document is the most probably forgery. Probably your grand-grandparents forced Natives to give them back land and then they legalized it by that “document”.
BTW: do you know what was “Kanada” (“Canada” in Polish language) in Auschwitz?
If you don’t know, read short novels of Tadeusz Borowski “I invite you to the gas”. (the title it is my robust translation, I don’t know if his short novels were translated into English).
“Kanada” — group of long living prisoners in Auschwitz, taken to unloading incoming transports, seemed to be privilaged.
The Jew (the people on this thread ) these people hate no longer exists, it is an imaginary cosmic hatred that only exists in their minds, it is not based on reality. Their minds are completely formed into a time warp. The Medieval Jew no longer exists, the entire “Jew” these people refer to has morphed into a Judeo-Christian world. The two are inextricably bound. Most Christians have a Jew in their family, and a close one, like a grandmother, or uncle. Many Jews are intermarried with Christians. Many Jews no longer identify with being Jews. So these Jew haters would be pulling their hair out trying to find the “Jew”. Never mind ascribe unified behavioral traits. And when you point these facts out they scream loudly. Stephen Miler is Jewish and is the most virulently anti immigration policy maker that was once in the Trump administration. My point. No two Jews are alike.
I will repeat my earlier comment which Solonto thought was a taunt, which is not a taunt but is the truth. To the rational and sane world outside of theirs. Cosmic Jew hatred is viewed as a psychological or emotional problem, much like schizophrenics, or paranoia. Paranoia is behind many conpirracy theories. It was pointed out at the Irving trial that Revisionist historians are all Jew haters and therefore their history and data is so skewed and biased, that it cannot be relied on. And it has been proven false. Revisionist take threads and weave rugs, based on pseudo science.
So what you see on this thread is people where Jew hatred is a severe emotional problems, and as I once said, Cosmic Jew hating, obsessions with Jews never ends up well. Look at Germany. The Jew haters on this thread will always be in the dark, always be anonymous, and always hiding, even from their own family members, because most people do not have emotional problems with Jews.
People think that Revisionist are “crazy” people with a Jew problem. Look at Phil Giraldi he cannot go two articles without mentioning the word “Jew”. Sick. You can not deny the Holocaust and be normal. The evidence is overwhelming. It will be criminalized and defeated at whatever cost, that is how dangerous the Christian world views Jew hatred, and the people that promote it. Been there done that. The world will not tolerate it. Whenever Jew hatred appears, it is given a major wallop, no matter where in the world it occurs. It will not be tolerated.
Jew haters will always live in a form of purgatory hell, sort of what they wish for the Jews, but they are all so deranged they do not see the irony. They will be in the dark, hidden, anonymous and forever powerless. That is what they hate most is that the Jews have power and they have none, like Zero . So they post degrading memes and statements about Jews. Even Al, if his identity was revealed would be kicked out of the Catholic church.
Jew hatred is the beginning, middle and end of Holocaust denial.
Not one person on this website can explain why babies, mothers, handicapped, old, sick and other non employable Jews were transported on May 5, 1944, when the walls were closing in on the Germans, and the war was about to end. Other than a small group transported further inside the Reich for armaments labor, there was no place outside the Reich to transport them to. None. East was moving west. Not one reason can be found, other than the deliberate decision by Eichmann to finish what Germany started even at the end of the war, to eradicate the next generation of Jews.
Listen to the Eichmann trial, he is not tortured and he does not deny this fact.
Story after story verify the Auschwitz Album, which has been researched by Carlo Mattogno, Jurgen Graf, and Arthur Butz. These top Revisionist are surprised and set back by the photos of the Auschwitz Album, showing non only non employable Jews, but babies, and the severely handicapped and the elderly. These Revisionist do not deny the validity of these photographs. There is a date on the photos, the transport identified by date, the Germans are known, the Jews are known, the trains are known, and the buddings and the landscape of Auschwitz-Birkenau is known. Carlo Mattagno details exactly the location and walk of the Jews in the photograph from the train station to crematorium #4.
Story after story talk about the arrival, the line up, the selection process, the difference between being chosen to go to the right vs. the left, and the realization that family members that went left would never be seen again. With regards to forensics. The forensics of a Auschwitz is the same as Maui, when people are killed in a bloodless way, and incinerated, there is no forensics left. There is no forensics in Maui after a few weeks, they cannot identify people. After a few years after the Germans blew up the 5 crematoriums there was and is nothing left, but mountains of ash, which is there, ashes are there in abundance. Mountains of ashes were found.
Virulently Jew hatred like the kind on this thread by Brosi, Al, Solonto, is a mental condition.
https://youtu.be/Y9Xk8vFjP3E?si=-Ho4tXnlA2BDvHme
I asked you a simple question: “What do you find is missing from his rebuttal?”
You don’t answer — can’t answer — bc you have no idea what you could say. AS USUAL, you avoid answering by repeating “Brosi did not refute that in any way.” Others disagree with you, you know, but you will not respond to them/us.
FYI, Mr. Nobody Jew, I have been the target of Holocaust Controversies in the past. Bc of my booklet Auschwitz: The Underground Guided Tour, which you mention a lot. They hated it too. And they used every four-letter word against me that could think of!! They are scum. This was during the time of my rebuttals to Prof. Neander, which you know of. I was also written up in major profiles by the SPLC and the ADL both, bc of that little book. So it is you who is failing to come up with real arguments to support your position that the swimming pool at Auschwitz was not a swimming pool, just as all the other recreational facilities & opportunities were not for those purposes and had not taken place. The evidence is there that they did.
As for the blood-letting of Christian children, the evidence is there for that also. In Russia, Ukraine, and other Slav countries, there have been famous court cases (I have written about some, but I can’t remember was words I used in order to find them with my search function.) wherein the Jews were found guilty. Then World Jewry brought to bear large sums of money and top legal- eagles to “reverse” those decisions, and that was the beginning of “antisemitism.” Brosi’s images aren’t the proof, but testimony under oath at the time (which Christians respect) is the proof. And it exists.
I watched, “Swimming in Auschwitz.” All 56+ minutes of it; unfortunately, only one witness gave testimony about swimming in the “Nazi” swimming pool (the image of the pool we all see flashed on screen); she said she swam in August, when the weather was hot.
The documentary features the story of six female survivors. Again, with only one exception (an orphan), all hailed from wealthy Jewish families. I mention this only because I have yet to hear the personal story of those Jews subjected to the pogroms or outcast, etc., in the Shoah interviews.
I will forgo the many favorable or not-so-terrible details, which include flower gardens, music, etc., and relay what I feel are important counter points to the overall official narrative:
All six described tolerable conditions, in ghettos and camps, until the last few months (beginning about late 1944 or so) of the war, with dwindling supplies, food, medicine, etc.
A few of the six described the “live baby throwing in fire pits” that many other survivors failed to notice or speak on in their interviews, although they were in the same camp during the same time.
Rena Drexler, one of the six, from Poland, stated the Russian liberation of her camp was no liberation; the women were abused and raped; what little food that remained was confiscated.
I have watched many Shoah interviews over the years; not a single female inmate described a sexual assault or rape by a German soldier. Of course, I make no claim that such assaults did not occur, but so far, I have heard no testimony indicating it did.
Many years ago I read an account (I can’t name it) of a German officer who was sexually assaulting young girls in his camp; it was discovered, and he was executed by the Germans for his crimes. I have no idea if this story is true, but it fits the pattern of the overall attempt of German officers to hold to more honorable conduct with civilians during war and/or incarceration of displaced citizens.
The many accounts of the Bolshevik/Mongolian/Soviet Russian soldiers reveal a barbarity difficult to believe (and hear of); I heard the testimony of a Russian man, forced to serve in Russian forces at the age of about 17; he was distraught over their behavior, and he relayed the story of two young German girls, looking for their parents, caught and gang-raped to death. He said he tried to tell the girls to hide, but of course, they did not understand.
I await the Hollywood production of this relatively unknown aspect of WW2; maybe someone will adapt, “Hellstorm: The Death of Nazi Germany” for the big screen. Or, for the History Channel.
The camps were not like the country club; no one really says otherwise, but the lies and contradictions are so numerous and extraordinary, and the fact that much of the most egregious/outlandish testimony remains in the public sphere (if I represented Shoah, I would yank most of it) speaks to the level of control or influence in media/law, and the confidence of their ability to eliminate any powers that may bring their lies to the forefront. To my knowledge, America is the only remaining western country with no laws against “denying” the Holocaust. Do you have any thoughts on why such laws are necessary?
It is interesting that you think: the blood-letting of Christian children, the evidence is there for that also is true. Based on almost non existent proof. Really none. One outlier claim, from one outlier book. That is it. Questionable at best.
Yet you say the Holocaust and all the documentation and proof by survivors, Germans and civilians is false, is a lie. That it did not happen.
Do you have an eye witness to a Jew preforming blood-letting on a Christian child? Or even harming a Christian child?
With this type of bias, no one believes anything you say. There is mountains of evidence proving the Holocaust and almost Zero supporting the Jewish blood-letting of Christian children. Yet there you are swearing it is true. Do you see why people think you’re nuts, and no longer pay attention to you?
What proof of this do you have Carolyn? None because it is a lie. A bald face lie. The catholic church rescinded these claims on their own. The Catholic church admitted that these trials and claims were fake. Because they also were lies.
No, I did not. I said that Virgo was where Hadding’s natal sun was placed, and that I had a strong planetary influence in Virgo (to be exact – 2 planets in conjunction in an exact opposition with one in Aries; plus the south node). So you didn’t get that right. What else don’t you get right? You think SolontoCroesus’ first name is Solonto. You and Fran. You never thought to figure it out that it is “Solon to Croesus,” without spaces, or look the name up. All I’m saying is that there’s a great deal you don’t know, some of which other people do know.
You also said to me (#1386): Don’t straw man me, Carolyn. What did that refer to? What straw man did you find in what you quoted from me? You don’t know what a strawman is either. You have your own problems and limitations that you should be dealing with, and learning about, before you ‘take on the world.’ You are not up to it.
Finally, I’ll add that this: If you wish to clash with me, you know I will easily match you and probably outmatch you, is so out-of-proportion to my simple observation that your rush to assure people that they are “in the right” and need not change anything is not the advice of a true friend — that one has to ask “Who has the fragile ego?” I’ll leave my disputes with John Wear and Rurik for another time, and just say you don’t understand either of them and never did.
Best regards (as usual)
What about the French? Were they Angles or Saxons? No, they were not.
You seem to have a Canadian Bee in your bonnet. Regarding Canada:
1. The Kanada warehouses, also known as Effektenlager or simply Kanada, were storage facilities in the Auschwitz concentration camp in German-occupied Poland during the (fake) Holocaust. The buildings were used to store the stolen belongings of prisoners, mostly Jews who had been murdered in the (fake) gas chambers on arrival.[2] The property of prisoners registered in the camp and used as slave labour was kept on deposit.[3]
The warehouses became known as “Kanada” (or “Canada”) because the prisoners saw them as the land of plenty.
2. The name “Canada” likely comes from the Huron-Iroquois word “kanata,” meaning “village” or “settlement.” In 1535, two Aboriginal youths told French explorer Jacques Cartier about the route to kanata; they were actually referring to the village of Stadacona, the site of the present-day City of Québec.
You also seem woefully (or willfully) misinformed on the nature of Native American Cultures.
If you would like to explore the skinned-alive, scalped-alive, baby-dragged-behind-running-horse, heart-ripping-out, nose-chopping-off-gang-raping, child-sacrificing, enemy-enslaving habits of Native Americans, please let me know, and I will direct you to a few sources.
Start with: A Fate Worse Than Death: Indian Captivities in the West, 1830-1885 – , Gregory; Michno, Michno, Susan
Are you sure there are no confirmed accounts of Polish/Slavic conquest, exploration and violence?
What Carolyn is saying is that you and Tulips are minus in the intelligence department, at least in regard to the necessary chops for communicating and debating on this blog, which happens to have highly intelligent people, able to express themselves literally. Both you and Tulip sound like clueless children. Wondering what clothing people are wearing, and patting each other on the back, with little love taps.
Outside of this blog you may be very intelligent (doubt it) but not here. Did you ever listen to the Eichmann tape? Why not. It is so relevant and proof that what you are claiming is not true is true. Comments like: “Jews do not look starved in the photos” is just stupid. The Polish Jews in the Warsaw ghetto were starved because they did not have adequate food. They were in that Ghetto for for 2 years. Not true of the the Hungarian Jews. Germany had just invaded Hungary 8 months before those Jews were transported. Why would they be starved? They had just been rounded up.
You do not have a grasp of the physical geography, time, and space that events took place in, or even how to take individual situations to form an entire picture, that you need to understand and incorporate the entire history of the war, which spanned years and counties. Each country being different. You answer regarding a post about a war event like it happened last night in your back yard. Like the people in the Auschwitz photos look fine to you. When in fact they were pretty traumatized. Just from what had happened to them over the last 8 months.
Carolyn you are completely correct I never looked up SolontoCroesusI had no idea it was from Solonto to Croesul. Thanks. I still think that Solonto is not a bad short name.
Here is a little film of the leveling of Warsaw, after the Warsaw Ghetto uprising, the Germans evacuated all of the buildings of people in Warsaw and leveled it, with fire bombs. One of the most beautiful cities in Europe gone. The film is 20 minutes long. I do not know if you are capable of a 20 minute attention span. But take a look to get the feel of the land.
There are two videos. I find the arial plane views of the entire city, the best.
Franny, I think you are in dire need of a few love taps. Especially if you believe the masturbation contraption, as pictured, could possibly work as claimed.
Your lack of knowledge in this area denotes, it has been too long, Guurl!
Once, when I was banging my way through our high school football team………just kidding! No more personal stories….
“There were no homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz-Birkenau.” – John Wear
Thank you for your kind thoughts.
It’s not just good to work together, it’s essential.
We all have useful things to contribute.
Best regards
All that verbiage! You must get paid by the number of words you write.
Why not simply produce verified forensic evidence as per the example I outlined earlier.
1% of the 100,000,000 teeth of the holy 6 million ought to do it, Franny.
Did you ever listen to the Dario Gabbai tape?
You know, “I am sure I had a bar mitzvah. I really don’t remember, but I’m sure I did.” “Our traditional Jewish food was chicken. Rice and beans.” “I pulled 3,000 black & blue corpses around with the hook end of a cane everyday.” “Sometimes we screamed, Ahh! because of the gas!” “The Hungarian Jews were dropped straight down the stairwell.”
What does that have to do with anything? It’s Solon to Croesus, by the way. Solon, a wise man from Athens…..pull your nose out of the Babylonian Talmud and read a little Greek history/mythology. Learn a little math/algebra to calculate how long it would take to incinerate a few million people without high power thermal lasers.
My my my, all that verbiage with nothing substantial to say.
You do raise one interesting point about engineers in Poland. Perhaps in your land engineers were necessary for nailing women, children, and soldiers to barn doors.
If you think that bill of sale for the tract of land I live on is forged, better people than you have raised that issue. The Native tribes (6 of them) have claimed the land stolen, then they claimed it was sold at too low a price, etc etc. At that time the documents were tested for authenticity. I know I know white people in Canada are not to be trusted. You’re not native by any chance? Anyways, at this time the issue appears settled.
I’ve visited a number of countries during my professional endeavours for business reasons. It was always nice and comforting to come home to dull and peaceful Canada.
I’ll leave the exciting life style to the envious types who want something for nothing. Poland immediately springs to mind and, of course, that “shitty little country” so aptly described by a French diplomat after his visit there.
You have asked me this once before and I have answered it. There is a paper specifically on the teeth after incineration. Do you think there were any teeth left in the Maui fires, because there were none. They cannot identify many of the bodies. Why do you think that is HdC?
The bodies at Auschwitz were not cremated they were incinerated. The teeth melted. You are seriously a deranged individual, by the stupidity and repetitiveness about forensics, when incineration LEAVES NO FORENSIC EVIDENCE, other than ash. Not even bones. The forensics regarding Auschwitz have been asked and answered a million times.
https://www.hdot.org/debunking-denial/or21-remains-teeth/
Let me ask you. Why would the Germans transport 475,000 old, sick, babies, and elderly Jews to Auschwitz on may 5, 1944 to Auschwitz Birkenau, when the war was about to end, and the Germans knew they were going to lose.? When Auschwitz was full. Standing room only. The Germans had no shelter, food or clothes for these Jews. None. Why spend money, logistics, manpower and trains to transport them to no where?
Do not say these Jews were then transported to one of 60 countries. Europe was landlocked in 1944. No one was leaving a country. Jews were only transported inside the Reich for labor.
A one sentence answer will suffice. Similarly like the teeth melted by the high heat.
You will answer something stupid and inconsequential, because you are a deranged Jew hater. The facts lay before you. All of your stupid questions regarding forensics have been asked and answered.
The rebuttal of HC which Brosi himself copied is enough for me and should be for you with your Underground Guided Tour. I have nothing to add to that, but here it is again:
Source: https://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.com/2017/05/rebutting-twitter-denial-most-popular.html#auschwitzswimmingpool
And this is supposed to be Brosi’s “rebuttal”:
“…In many lands, including Spain, firefighters have first use of water in a pool, so by twisted and warped Jewish logic every pool in Spain could be considered a “firefighting water reservoir” and a Jewish baby drowning pool to boot…”
I fail to see its “logic”, but perhaps you do…
For modern people still believing in Medieval superstitions about Jews like fhe blood libel says a lot about their rationality. We could forgive illiterate European peasants to believe such but not modern people. “Proofs” of the blood libel were obtained by torture, as if not people would “confess” anything to stop the pain. Popes even during the Middle Ages ruled against the blood libel. As for the “proof” of Toaff, this is what he said:
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Passovers_of_Blood
But perhaps you like Der Stürmer with its scurrilous pictures:
1.1 million people were incinerated in Auschwitz over a period of several years, not several million. All told there were 2.2 million Jews that died of gassing and incineration in all the camps combined.The rest were shot.There are many papers on this subject. Like a lot.
https://phdn.org/archives/holocaust-history.org/auschwitz/body-disposal/
Body Disposal at Auschwitz
The End of Holocaust Denial.
by John Zimmerman
Frannie, those picture of devastation in Warsaw really impressed me that they fully proved how bestial the Germans were when it came to fighting in urban area.
So let me remind about what was really happened then. There was a little thing called WWII that was being fought and the so called holocaust was not even a minor.
Let me also remind you that when the Polish resistance launched there resistance against the Germans in late 1944, the Russians were only a few miles east of Warsaw which was then a key transportation center for supplying German forces fighting the Russians to the east. The Polish resistance by starting an armed uprising that threatened the supply liners of the German armies fighting to the east triggered a forceful response to crush it so the Germans could regain complete control of those supply lines.
Under those circumstances, what did you expect the Germans to do to secure those critical supply lines? Throw marshmallows at the Polish resistance? I don’t think so. To get the job done quickly they would throw as much explosive as they could spare to crush the resistance as quickly as possible to secure their supply lines.
And that shows you what barbarians the Germans area.
Really. Then how about how the Israelis a few years ago demolished flattened Beirut when they invaded Lebanon when Israel was facing no threat even remotely comparable to what the Germans faced when fighting the Russian before Warsaw.
Then let’s bring it closer to home. What did the US do when they faced resistance in Fallujah in Iraq? They leveled the city. They did the same to Mosul. In neither case was the US facing nearly the threatening situation confronting the Germans before Warsaw.
So spare me the crocodile tears you want to shed for the poor people of Warsaw when the people you so admire did comparably far worse when facing much lesser threats than the Germans confronted at Warsaw.
But where is Franklin Ryckaert?? Has he run away from being expected to answer questions? I don’t want to hear from you Fran, bc you’re worse than Franklin.
I said I had written about the Jewish crimes of bloodletting, but it was a Heretics’ Hour podcast https://carolynyeager.net/heretics-hour-damascus-affair-protocols “From the Damascus Affair to the Protocols”. This really happened and it’s documented. For the program description, I wrote:
It never occurs to observant Jews to help non-Jews, does it. What interests me the most is how the Jews organize for their own protection and succeed at it.
https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Diaries_of_Sir_Moses_and_Lady_Montefiore
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alliance_Isra%C3%A9lite_Universelle
The Alliance Israélite Universelle (AIU; transl. ”Universal Israelite Alliance”) is a Paris-based international Jewish organization founded in 1860 with the purpose of safeguarding human rights for Jews around the world. Sort of an international Anti-Defamation League. Recall that the ADL was created in 1913 after Leo Frank was arrested for the murder of a 13 year old girl employee. He was guilty and found guilty, but was freed because of Jewish influence behind the scenes. The Damascus Affair is the same. Every time a Jew or Jews are found out & punished, rather than discipline their own people, Jewry forms new organizations to protect the guilty.
Today, both Leo Frank and the Jews of Damascus are considered victims of Christian antisemitism. And the Jewish version is the only one I can find online. There used to be much more so we’re going backwards.
You’re all over the place, on purpose. Plus you’re becoming very big on using ad hominems like your HC buddies do. Fact is, the HC paragraph you quoted says nothing about the swimming pool, does it? Your entire comment doesn’t mention the swimming pool, which was your starting place. So what is Brosi supposed to rebut?
The big news here is not the swimming pool at Auschwitz that no one doubts any longer, but your unmistakeable Jewish behavior, which you used to cover up so well. The discovery of the Jewish murder of Gentile children raises you Jews to a fever pitch. What do you say about the murder of 13 yr.old Mary Phagan by Jewish leader and upstanding Atlanta businessman Leo Frank? Now that one is a slam-dunk. And no Julius Streicher (who never killed anyone) involved.
As I recall, the Charles Lindbergh baby was killed by two Jews also. And how many more?
There used to be much more so we’re going backwards.
You are going backwards alright. The Damascus Blood Libel has nothing to do with the Medieval accusations by the Catholic Church, which they admit were fake, nor was there any Jewish agencies hired to pay the Catholics to change their story. You are a liar.
How many Christian children did the NS kill? So many no one can fathom, and you are worried about Leo Frank? Hitler murdered 70,000 disabled children and adults using gas. Proven. And you are worried about Leo Frank?
Your entire Holocaust denial, and pro Nazi life, has been ridiculed and proven false. All of it. So you are now reduced to printing about the Damascus Blood Libel, which was a fake. Not provable like the gassing of 70,000 German citizens.
You are an irrelevant, and so is your story. Meaningless. Your gun is filled with blanks and you are aiming at fake birds in the sky. You life and your stories run on the fumes of fantasies. Fantasies that can never be proven. Yet you state that with all certainty that with all the facts and documents that the Holocaust never happened,
https://www.jewishhistory.org/the-damascus-blood-libel/
You cannot answer why all of those non employable Jews were transported to an already full Auschwitz in 1944, as shown in the Auschwitz Album.
So you pedal false stories based on nothing but hearsay. You expect anyone to take you seriously?
How many extermination camp crematoriums were outfitted with the new, improved I.A. Topf & Sons models? How many with the C.H. Kori GmbH models?
From National Institutes of Health (Human teeth):
Behavior of teeth under extreme temperatures was studied, and researchers have attempted to explain the changes based on the structure and composition of teeth. The extent of damage to the teeth caused by thermal insult depends on the temperature range and duration of exposure.
At 400°C, no morphological changes were observed to teeth from any age group. At 700°C, the deciduous teeth showed minute dimensional changes. The young permanent teeth and elderly permanent teeth exhibited fragmentation. This observation is in contrast to the study of Karkhanis et al. and Palamara et al.[9,10] At 1000°C, the deciduous teeth also showed fragmentation but still retained most of their crown structure. The young permanent teeth show complete loss of enamel layer and fragmentation including the coronal dentin. Complete loss of crown was observed in a few specimens. At 1000°C, the teeth from Group C showed fragmentation of enamel layer. Most of the enamel is lost, but some amount of enamel can still be found attached to the crown. In contrast to the young permanent teeth, coronal dentin in elderly teeth was intact. It is observed that the coronal dentin of the elderly teeth is more resilient even at 1000°C as compared to the coronal dentin of young permanent teeth.
My thought is 15 minutes at the improved “zap” temperature, is not sufficient in length to dissolve all teeth.
From Erenow military history site:
Twenty or thirty minutes later when the huge mass of naked flesh had ceased to writhe, pumps drew out the poisonous air, the large door was opened and the men of the Sonderkommando took over. These were Jewish male inmates who were promised their lives and adequate food in return for performing the most ghastly job of all.* Protected with gas masks and rubber boots and wielding hoses they went to work. Reitlinger has described it.
Eyewitness Dario Gabbai, Sonderkommando in Crema II, said NO protective gear was worn.
In the end even the strenuous efforts of German free enterprise, using the best material and providing faultless workmanship, proved inadequate for burning the corpses. The well-constructed crematoria fell far behind at a number of camps but especially at Auschwitz in 1944 when as many as 6,000 bodies (Hoess put it at as many as 16,000) had to be burned daily. For instance, in forty-six days during the summer of 1944 between 250,000 and 300,000 Hungarian Jews alone were done to death at this camp. Even the gas chambers fell behind and resort was made to mass shootings in the Einsatzkommando style. The bodies were simply thrown into ditches and burned, many of them only partly, and then earth was bulldozed over them. The camp commanders complained toward the end that the crematoria had proved not only inadequate but “uneconomical.”
If those new ovens were zapping at 15 minutes per corpse, why was this open fire burning/partial burial necessary? Open fires most likely do not generate enough sustained heat to incinerate bone/teeth.
What’s the new total, Franny?
From the Jewish Virtual Library, 2023:
The total number of six million Jews murdered during the Holocaust, which emerged from the Nuremberg trials, is also an estimate. Numbers have ranged between five and seven million killed. The exact number will never be known because of the many people whose murders were not recorded and whose bodies have still not be found.
Yad Vashem, 2023:
In 1941, following the invasion of the Soviet Union, the Nazis and their collaborators launched the systematic mass murder of the Jews. By 1945 nearly six million Jews had been murdered.
United States Memorial Holocaust Museum, 2023:
The Holocaust was the systematic, state-sponsored persecution and murder of six million European Jews by the Nazi German regime and its allies and collaborators. The Holocaust was an evolving process that took place throughout Europe between 1933 and 1945.
“…Fact is, the HC paragraph you quoted says nothing about the swimming pool, does it? Your entire comment doesn’t mention the swimming pool…”
My comment was aimed at debunking the argument about all fascilities, and that includes the swimmingpool. Details could be read at the HC site, but here is their part on the swimmingpool:
Talking about Mary Phagan and the Lindbergh child in 20th century America is whataboutism and has nothing to do with the Medieval European blood libel.
Believing in that primitive superstition puts you in the same league as IQ 106 Julius Streicher.
#1403 HdC
“Perhaps in your land engineers were necessary for nailing women, children, and soldiers to barn doors.”
Again, you have no proves. Do you mind if I call you LIAR?
“If you think that bill of sale for the tract of land I live on is forged, better people than you have raised that issue.”
Sure. White lawers said that according to white people law everything is correct. The truth is that you are living on a stolen land.
“Poland immediately springs to mind and, of course, that “shitty little country” so aptly described by a French diplomat after his visit there. “
Are you sure it was a French diplomat? In fact Poland and France have had rather friendly relationships. The first elected king of Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth was a French.
Poles also beat Germans and Russians under Napoleon command in XIX century. France helped Poland to regain independency from German and Russian occupants in 1918.
You must be mistaken.
Europeans don’t hate Jews. They hate Jewish lies and Jewish liars like Franny and Franklin.
LOL. The average IQ in Israel is 85! All those inbred Ashkenazim, like you Franklin. And when it comes to superstition, no one else holds a candle to you Jews.
I am still waiting for your reply, Franklin [Notice how Jews love to wrap themselves with the flag of the people they are trying to destroy].
Why have Jews been thrown out of 109 European countries?
Tsk, tsk, Franklin. You lying Jews are all the same. I rebutted your kikey lies above, Toaff proved that Jews were still committing blood sacrifice on European Children into the 20th century. In fact, I think it was Benes who eventually became PM of Czechoslovakia because he defended some filthy lying Jew who had been caught committing the ritual sacrifice of a goy child.
Lying Jews like “Franklin” [ROFL] are always trying to corrupt and destroy the culture of the people who stupidly believe their lies and provide them “asylum” from the justice they richly deserve.
Good point, Tiptoe. Since the Jewish definition of “Holocaust denial” includes:
And according to Fran Taubman “Holocaust denial” means that you are Jew hating anti-Semite, then clearly Fran Taubman is a Jew hating anti-Semite.
In other words, that makes Fran Taubman not only a flaming hypocrite, but also a self-hating Jew.
Of course if I lied all the time to everybody, including myself, I would hate myself just like Franny does.
In fact, every nasty thing that Franny has written about anybody else on UR she is actually saying about herself.
This also explains why lying Jews hate goyim so much that they want to holocaust them. Since Goyim believe that the truth is honorable, and since the Jewish god is the prince of lies and Jews have to lie to stay close to their god, then Jews have goyim because they are a constant reminder of Jewish sadistic depravity.
What a nasty tribe of self-hating liars Jews are, and Franny Taubman is their poster Yenta.
Barefoot, a rope wrapped around his neck, hog-tied, and hanging from a tree
His execution witnessed by the people of the town where Mary Phagan spent her too-few years.
Justice delivered for the rape and murder of 13-year old Mary Phagan.
Her dead body was discovered by the night watchman, “a jute rope wrapped around her neck.”
The night watchman, a Black man, was accused of the murder but was found innocent
(let that sink in: in a Southern town, roiled with strife and poverty,
a Black man was found innocent and a Jew punished for the crime he committed).
Methinks that morality has sunk so low that telling the truth about anything is called antisemitism now.
In short: Truth = antisemitism.
And lying Jews like “Franklin” [LOL] and Franny are still lying about it today.
They were going to throw her body into the incinerator the next morning when the night watchman found her body. So the Jews were going to holocaust Mary just like ((Josh Green)) and his Jewish Kabal have holocausted Lahaina.
The issue is not, “what were they wearing?” The issue is the nature and credibility of the evidence.
You can’t claim “here are the Hungarian Jews, arriving in summer, 1944,” and present images, with no named copyright, of people standing/sitting in heavy coats, heavy neck scarves, stockings, and expect it to be accepted at face value.
Those photographs prove or indicate Jews and/or others arrived at various camps, at various locations/times, walked around with luggage, stood in line, etc. Most of that is not in dispute.
It is clear to me that the so-called Holocaust purveyors have cobbled together bits and pieces of truth, and inserted exaggerations and outright lies all within the story.
Quite the contrary, the son of the former Chief Rabbi of Rome, Israeli Prof. Ariel Toaff, was given unrestricted access to the Vatican Archives and he documented the Ashkenazi cult of ritual child murder: https://judaism.is/ritual-murder.html
Pasque di Sangue: Ebrei d’Europa e omicidi rituali
[Bloody Passover: European Jews and Ritual Homicide]
by Dr. Ariel Toaff. First edition (Bologna, Italy: Il Mulino, 2007)
http://www.vho.org/aaargh/fran/livres7/pasque.pdf
An English translation is available at
http://www.bloodpassover.com/
A very detailed review of the book:
http://traditioninaction.org/bkreviews/A_043_Pasque.htm
As you would expect, documentation of numerous ritual murders of Christian children by Jews, especially documentation provided by the son of the former Chief Rabbi of Rome, caused an enormous furor. Initially Dr. Toaff courageously stood tall promising to stand by his findings from medieval archives, but he suffered death threats and threats of prosecution by the Israeli Knesset. Within a week, publication of his first edition was stopped and the books were recalled from bookstores. Dr. Toaff promised—and provided—a heavily revised second edition, bleated that he had been misunderstood, and promised all the profits of his revised edition to the Anti-Defamation League.
Fortunately, enough copies of the first edition survived to be distributed in the original Italian and in translations that are readily available online. Of course, the revised second edition is readily available to anyone who would want it.
The risible premise in the revised edition is that Christian children died at the hands of Jews, but that the children were voluntary donors of blood and things just accidentally went wrong. The second edition is meticulously deconstructed with exact quotes here: http://www.cwporter.com/toaffdonor.htm Excerpt from the preamble to the deconstruction:
Though the Israeli press initially documented the duress to which Dr. Toaff was subjected, duress that forced him to recant, that press coverage has conveniently (for the perpetrators of the duress) been largely “disappeared.”
A salient example is the article ‘Blood Libel’ Author halts press by Matthew Wagner & AP, originally in the February 14, 2007 edition of The Jerusalem Post. The article was originally available at the Jerusalem Post and is even mentioned in the Wikipedia entry on Dr. Ariel Toaff (see footnote #12), but the article was subsequently “disappeared” from not only The Jerusalem Post, but was also “disappeared” from encyclopedia.com. The article remains archived at https://www.highbeam.com/doc/1P1-135137120.html, but requires a paid subscription for access. The content is quoted in several sites and can be found by searching for for ‘Blood Libel’ Author halts press.
Some reports have survived:
Historian angers Jews by probing medieval accusations of anti-Christian hatred
By Ariel David, USA Today, 2/10/2007 http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/2007-02-10-italy_x.htm
The Bloody Passovers of Dr Toaff
By Israel Shamir http://www.israelshamir.net/English/Eng11.htm
Bloody Passovers of Dr Toaff – follow up
By Israel Shamir http://www.israelshamir.net/English/Eng13.htm
Bloodcurdling Libel (a Summer Story)
By Israel Shamir http://www.israelshamir.net/English/blood.htm
And if it’s not good for the Jews?
By Lily Galili http://www.haaretz.com/print-edition/features/and-if-it-s-not-good-for-the-jews-1.213324
MKs seek to try Prof. Toaff over claims in blood libel book
Kadima MK Solodkin: There are grounds to indict Toaff and file civil suits for harm to the Jewish people. By Ofri Ilani http://www.haaretz.com/news/mks-seek-to-try-prof-toaff-over-claims-in-blood-libel-book-1.214186
The wayward son
The Jewish community in Italy is struggling to understand how the son of a legendary rabbi could give credence to the blood libels. The father of Prof. Ariel Toaff, Rabbi Elio Toaff, is equally bewildered.
By Adi Schwartz http://www.haaretz.com/magazine/week-s-end/the-wayward-son-1.213721
Author of blood libel book holds distribution to make changes
By Ofri Ilani http://www.haaretz.co.il/hasite/pages/ShArt.jhtml?itemNo=826066&contrassID=2&subContrassID=0&sbSubContrassID=0
While the Always Innocent Perpetual Victims wailed that the perpetrators of St. Simon’s ritual crucifixion and bloodletting murder had been tortured—as indeed they had been—they were at pains to explain what Toaff had adduced, that those who had been tortured revealed the as-yet-unknown location of St. Simon’s corpse. Had torture miraculously infused such knowledge?
Too, the “blood libel” claimants pass off the confessions as a tell-me-what-you-want-me-to-say phenomenon, but, not only did the perpetrators reveal the location of St. Simon’s mutilated little body, but Toaff documented that the perpetrators also revealed secret aspects of Judaic rituals that could not have been known to the torturers.
Denials, bribery, rent garments, death threats, etc.—the modus operandi is repeated throughout history whether it is the ritual murder of Fr. Thomas in Damascus, the trial of Leo Frank for the murder of little Mary Phagan (the event that spawned the Anti-Defamation League), or the recent Israeli “Defense” Force’s involvement with the rabbis’ murder-for-organ-harvesting crime syndicate.
One thing that is interesting because it was “missing in action” from all the furor was Toaff’s documentation of Judaic culture in the time of St. Simon of Trent. It is not just a ritual murder cult that Toaff documented, but a wicked Jewish culture pervaded by perversion and criminality, including prostitution, violent extortion, and murder-for-hire, especially by physician poisoners. Toaff freely stipulated such a hellish culture, but not a peep was ever mentioned about that in all the propaganda against him and his book.
Choose your favorite lying Franny Jew
Now you’re getting to it. And the “bits and pieces of truth” are not from the major elements of the story (important to always call it a story or narrative), but from the deportation element alone — and then we can start focusing on that, and on the why and wherefore of that. That’s the sum total of the mis-named “Holocaust.” The Jewish word for it, Shoah (the Catastrophe), is a more truthful choice. Here again, Jews will tell the truth to themselves but not to us, the Goyim.
One has to ask: How can we be (have been) so stupid as to fall for it? A very good question. Anti-Germanism, anyone? See my posts under Hostility Towards Germans. https://carolynyeager.net/hostility
http://www.cwporter.com/toaffdonor.htm Excerpt from the preamble to the
This link is bogus like you, and Toaff never said any of the below. Just all out lies. Blood is not Kosher for Humans to consume.
There is truth to what you write about the Polish resistance being warned, and Russians being a few miles away (although they never came thru). Many Polish citizens were agains the uprising and resistance.
You have to remember that Poland was under brutal occupation, people could be just arrested or shot on the street, there was no individual jurisprudence or laws protecting citizens of German occupation, this is true in France, Hungary, Poland, the Netherlands, anywhere where the Germans occupied was brutal. Horrible.
In addition the Warsaw Ghetto was centrally located in downtown Warsaw, where a Polish trolly car ran down the middle of the ghetto. People were lying dead in the street from starvation. It was horrifying for people to see such suffering for almost 2 years. The Polish resistance were the ones who smuggled the weapons thru sewers to the Jewish resistance. Can you blame them? What would you have done, watching that all go on.
I posted that film of the destruction of Warsaw to show Kali the scale, the vastness of the war, and the spatial context of what was going on and the amount of devastation that went on for years. Kali acts like this took place in a small county where there were really bad people.
The Warsaw Ghetto was run like a business, there was a Juddernat made of up of Jews to work with the Germans to help facilitate what they wanted, in the hopes of better outcomes. Adam Czeniakow the head of the Warsaw Ghetto Jewish Council, committed suicide when he could not save orphanage children from being transported to what everyone new at the time was death
My point being none of these events happened in a vacuum, and while the camps were hidden away, the Warsaw Ghetto was on display to Poland. The Poles use to try and sneak food in to the Jews.
I would have fought.
Feli from Germany: Five Major Inventions you didn’t know were German
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dqikFP7Uoy8
Not only “anti-Germanism . . .”
My working hypothesis is that the Jewish/zionist PTB work in overdrive to keep Jewish hoi polloi — like Fran — from realizing that zionist leaders “caused” the holocaust, either deliberately/planfully/with knowledge aforethought; or at very least, knowingly but not caring about what Jews would be killed* ** in the actions Jewish zionist PTB demanded, needed, intended.
(In other words, all of Jewry’s anti-holocaust denial laws are directed not least at other Jews.) Censorship: It’s not just for goyim anymore 😜
One can plausibly imagine that Fran’s rabbi regularly pumps his congregation full of the nonsense that Fran dumps on this forum.
* It is NOT unheard of- or unprecedented that- “Jews kill Jews.” Michael Ledeen made this point crystal-clear in a speech back when Jimmy Cayne from Bear-Stearns was Ledeen’s financier and bridge-partner.
** I think the specific groups of Jews who DID die in the war(s) that Jews provoked and benefited from, were pre-selected by the Jewish zionist PTB who engineered the wars. German Jews were to be saved — migrated to Palestine and USA; Polish & Russian Jews were disposable; likewise, Hungarian Jews were less fervently attached to the zionist project and more ready to assimilate, therefore less worthy of Jewish efforts to move them out of Europe.
ref. @1273
Several times now you have advocated to listen to the Eichmann trial in Israel.
What would that prove? Eichmann sat in a hermetically sealed glass box wearing thick headphones.
When he supposedly spoke, how do we know that it was, in fact, Eichmann who spoke?
We already know what the Israeli Supreme Court thought and believed of Jewish eyewitnesses: That they are a bunch of insufferable liars!
Why are Germans hated by all their neighbors? Good question! Perhaps ruthlessness, humorlessness, a robot-like discipline and an arrogant domineering spirit are the answer. Pictures are better than a thousand words. Here are a caricature and a real life picture, exactly matching the caricature:
Unwittingly honest concession, Franklin:
the book cover is for a book titled,
The MYTH of German Villainy;
the title you inserted is, as we all see,
This Is the Enemy.
So the signal you sent is, “The Enemy” created by propagandists is “A myth; a mythical villain.”
Well done.
By the way, who is the General?
Apparently the raft of “anti-Germanists” (h/t Carolyn Yeager) thinks there is something terribly threatening about a monocle.
There are half-a-dozen or so German generals-wearing-monocles dotting the internets. The one you chose is among those, but nowhere could I find his name.
Just why did you choose THAT monocle-wearing general?
The Devil’s in the details, Franklin, and the proud, modest, looking-you-straight-in-the-eye image you selected differs from the caricature in at least these ways:
1. No swastika on the hat
2. Monocle — to correct vision — not mirror glasses to enhance look of menace
3. Un-monocled eye is open, strikes me as having an inquisitive look like, “Tell me about yourself;” not shark-eyed menace as in caricature
4. Nose is in proportion to face, not outsized and pointed
5. Lips are straight in a pleasant-to-neutral closed position, not grotesquely turned into downward sneer
6. Ears are balanced and ‘normal,’ demonstrating no unusual indentations or whorls
7. Angle is face-forward, not sidewise
8. Demeanor impresses as open, pleasant, neutral, proud; not grotesque, angry, sinister.
So once again, congratulations for demonstrating in comparative images that the perpetuated image of Germans as “villainous” is —— a badly fabricated myth.
Jeez. Your bosses are going to bump you back to Propaganda-for-Dummies.
German monocle vs. Jewish Pince-nez.
The main difference is that Bronstein the lying Commie-Jew was directly responsible for the death of millions of innocent Russian peasants, while your dreaded German officer was an impeccably honorable soldier.
I am still waiting for your explanation as to why Jews were thrown out of 109 countries, Franklin [ROFL].
Ref.: #85
Fact is Churchill conspired with Roosevelt since the mid 1930’s to force a war on Germany.
Even Polish diplomatic dispatches commented on this.
Be sure to read the comments, as more have been added. Some are quite surprising.
ref.: 1426
Franny wrote: “I would have fought”.
Sure you would have, just as you did at Masada, right? Bunch of cowards those Jews were.
I mentioned to you in another post that the photographs were copyrighted and authenticated not only by Holocaust historians but by the top Revisionist scholars. Why do you continue to doubt the validity of these photographs? You can see famous people in them like Mengele. I also do not know why you are so confused by eyewitness testimony. It is very straightforward and easy to follow. Not every detail is the same but so what? They universally all say the same story.
What’s the new total, Franny?
My thought is 15 minutes at the improved “zap” temperature, is not sufficient in length to dissolve all teeth.
I do not understand your questions or posts. Are you trying to catch me in a game of “Gotcha”. If you think that the teeth did not melt, fine. Are you trying to prove me wrong or inaccurate?
The Holocaust and Holocaust Revisionism are vast fields of history. Most of the literature and back and forth on the numbers of everything has been researched and presented back and forth over and over again. The Revisionist have never recovered from the Auschwitz Album, or HC website, which takes on Revisionist claims and the Revisionist themselves have commented on that blog. Why not study it yourself?
Early Revisionism was at a hey day in the 1970 and 19800’s. Since then the field is pretty much dead. I have taken on John Wear for years on this site, I mean years with documentation, and I have pretty much run circles around him. He has taken my facts written articles that are flat our lies. I have called him on it. My research!!!
His comment that there were no homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz is based on a pseudo science report from Fred Leuchter that has been debunked. Furthermore, the Germans destroyed all of the crematoriums and Leuchters tests were of a partially decomposed wall of crematorium #2. Were claimed that there was no evidence of cyanide gas in on the crematorium walls, therefore there were no gas chambers. He only tested one wall of one crematorium. No other crematoriums were tested and no forensic analysis exist because the Germans blew up the other crematoriums to hide the evidence. So for John to say there were no homicidal gas chambers at Auschwitz is not based on facts for the other 4 crematoriums. Like the ones on May 5, 1944 where Mattogno placed the Hungarian Jews waiting outside crematorium #4. No tests were ever preformed on that crematorium of gassing room, because they were destroyed. We know from architectural blue prints from J Pressac, and documents between Bishoff the building supervisor at Auschwitz, and Topf engineers designing the gas rooms and ventilation system, that the blue prints are marked with the words “gassing cellar”. Where as some Revisionist try to twist this around to mean something else.
There is also detailed documents and correspondences between Topf engineers and Bischoff regarding the “Specs’ for the crematorium, ovens, oven capacity, ventilation systems etc. Some gas rooms did not have ventilation systems to change the air of the room that is why some sonderkammandos needed masks and gloves, while others did not.
I am 70 years old and from a religious Jewish family, I grew up in a culture and community made up of Holocaust survivors, and war veterans, like my fathers entire family, none of whom ever ever discussed the Holocaust, they would have rather been Nazi’s then victims. You were forbidden as child to discuss the Shoa as we called it. I never heard of Auschwitz until college, I thought there was only one concentration camp, for all the Jews. I never even knew it was a bad place. So I know a little bit about survivors and their testimonies. It was only before they died that they talked.
As I said the Holocaust is a big historical subject, much like the civil war or any other event in history. Books, facts and figures have already been established. How silly of you to sit here and try to debate the merits on an “empty brain”. Like you have figured out the burn rate and body count all by yourself, and want to challenge the facts
In addition to growing up with survivors and families, my cousin Alex Grobman has a PhD in Holocaust studies, he has written several books on the subject. In addition to that I have another cousin who is a famous “Nazi” hunter named Ephariam Zuroff. So I am steeped in Holocaust history and Nazism.
Do you or have you ever known any Holocaust survivors? or War veterans?
The one thing in common between Nazis’ including Nazis from different eras and Neo Nazis or Neo National Socialist is a great propensity for sadism, and suffering in general. Sadism to the point of thinking about pain and suffering as an “art form”. All Nazi’s have it. Comes with the clothes.
Now you tell me if this statement below from you Solonto rings the SADISM bell, and even rising to the level of the comment being a swish “art form”. Such a cool comment. Solonto’s comment below suggesting that the Jews commit their own genocide for gain is truly an example of “sadism as an art form” he is so mesmerized by other peoples suffering, and thrilled when it involves Jews. To state the below does not only show a propensity for sadism, it is hate speech, and one that if not spoken unanonymously would be criminal. Free speech is not hate speech. You cannot yell “fire” in a crowded auditorium.
.
So you should know Solonto that me and others working hard at eliminating hate speech about Jews, we will be vigilant to stop those who propose such ideas “like the Jews are okay with murdering other Jews in an effort to promote war” will be stopped. I am not threatening you in any way, I am making you aware of how many people are involved in prosecuting such talk. Bob Kraft was in my Shul this Shabbos discussing his foundation. I know other such prominent Jews and other religious Christian organizations fighting the very essence of YOU Solonto. Your evilness, your vileness and your sadism.
Fighting Jew hatred has never had bigger guns behind it.
https://apnews.com/article/new-england-patriots-owner-robert-kraft-antisemitism-campaign-5da8844493522237f7e3426b93307d9a
https://www.thekraftgroup.com/careers/fcas/
And know this Solonto I pray you choke the next time you utter such vileness about the Jews, referencing that they might commit their own genocide.
If a tree falls in the forest, and nobody hears it, does it make a sound?
If nobody gives a tinker’s dam if it falls, does it make a difference?
Hadding sent me a comment he wrote there, just like yesterday, I guess. Did you see it?
Interview with Rolf Mengele, son of the famous doctor.
I don’t doubt the photos are accurate as a depiction of occurrences happening somewhere in Germany/Poland or wherever the camps were located.
Per Yad Vashem:
Many scholars of the Holocaust have come to believe that when a Holocaust survivor tells a story that sounds too incredible to be true, it may be just that: the truth. Such is the story of Lilly Zelmanovic and her photo album.
18-year-old Lilly Jacob was deported with her family, and most of the Jews of Hungary, in the spring of 1944. […] Unlike all of the other survivors, she was granted a small miracle. On the day of her liberation, in the Dora concentration camp hundreds of miles from Auschwitz, she found in the deserted SS barracks a photo album. It contained, among others, pictures of her family and friends as they arrived on the ramp and unknowingly awaited their death.[…] It was also, as we now know, the only photographic evidence of Jews arriving in Auschwitz or any other death camp.
Who were the photographers who held the copyright? Who testified/verified where/when the photos were taken? Paula Lebovics, who was at Auschwitz-Birkenau when the Russians arrived, testified that the Russians put the remaining inmates in those striped pajamas, AND collected/exhumed frozen corpses to arrange for photographs. I am not hereby stating the “Hungarian Jews” photos were staged, but I am suggesting that manipulation of photographic evidence does occur. I think the “album” is cobbled.
I followed a link you provided about the ovens, teeth, etc., wherein you claimed the “surviving teeth” theory was debunked. I found no such refutation, so I did a little research and forwarded it along to you.
This is only somewhat true.
I have heard enough eyewitness testimony in Shoah Foundation interviews to determine what is likely true and what is not. If you take notes whilst listening to their testimonies, a pattern of deceptions becomes evident, to wit:
With only one exception, they all described well-to-do, prosperous, happy lives despite the mainstream claims of virulent anti-semitism, including in Germany after Hitler arrived to power. Rachel Gottstein said her Jewish grandfather was the mayor of a town in Poland.
Every interviewer “led” the witness; encouraged a terror-tale if the original description of an event was insufficiently horrific, “oh, let’s go back for a minute, didn’t something else happen? Why, yes, the Nazis shot everyone…”
It is not within the realm of possibility, for Henia, at Birkenau in summer of 1944, to describe daily hangings, fire pits into which living infants and toddlers are tossed, yet, Paula, at the same camp, same block, during the same time frame, fails to remember or describe those happenings. Such events could not be forgotten, nor would they go unreported to other inmates. If they didn’t see it, which would be unlikely if it were true, they would certainly mention it.
Every witness reported, “I heard this happened, or I later learned.” Several made references to, “just like Schindler’s List.”
Lucky Larry Silver-Tongue has got nothin’ on that Henia; on four occasions, she “guessed I just got lucky” as she managed to avoid the atrocities inflicted on everyone else around her; the last event, a round-up of young women to have their blood drained for transfusions to save German soldiers.
I am aware of different crematoriums/equipment. It is impossible to gas 3,500 people (sometimes up to 10,000) with poison tablets, and kill each person in 4-5 minutes, remove the corpses with the hook end of a cane, send all up an elevator shaft, stuff 3-4 into each muffle, incinerate to ash in 30-40 minutes….this is the testimony of an eyewitness at Crema II at A-B, who worked from March, 1944 until the Russians arrived. You know to whom I am referring; I follow your sources, yet you refuse to follow mine. This witness lied from top to bottom, he knew nothing about Jewish culture; WHY was his testimony necessary? He did claim he was the only surviving sonderkommando from A-B.
I am sorry for your family, and I understand your position, and despite what you suggest, I am not a hateful person. The Shoah interviews are at times difficult to hear. I do not doubt the horror of family separations and/or the magnitude of the losses suffered. Many of the witnesses, who were children or teenagers at the camps, marveled at “what did we do to deserve this?” If I had my family ripped from me, I believe I could be easily manipulated to tell a few stories, that I believed or was told may have happened to others, in order to “speak for those no longer here.”
In a nutshell, I believe the Big Jews sacrificed the Little Jews for their prophetic Return, from where they further their worldly habits of acquiring power, wealth and vengeance. I believe Hitler wanted the Jews moved out of Europe, certainly Germany. The evidence of Jewish machinations and meddling is everywhere. The duality is astonishing, i.e., heavily involved in African slave trade/heavily involved in NAACP, SPLC, and all manner of destroying western civilization (Amalek/Edom). One witness said, while accepting help in hiding from a labor round-up by a pastor in a church, she was told by her Rabbi, “do not cross yourself, do not look upon Christ, remember, you are a Jew!”
Yes and yes.
You are such a clown Brosi, even I think you are funny. This is C- Jew hatred and your memes are too funny to be taken seriously. A modern day Jew hater would be ashamed at the stupidly and clown like quality of your posts. You are an embarrassment to the Jew haters guild. I have reposted them to some of my friends, they are so hysterical! Baruch Hashem Bronzi!!
A real clown in a real clown car crash. Look Da Jooz made poopie all over my car!! Poor Bronsi. Bronzi the Jew hating clown.
Erwin Rommel
What was the point of that? I listened.
His son was not a material witness. His son apparently believed the allegations. Mengele denied the allegations.
Jonathan Pollard, convicted spy, denied he did anything wrong, as the USA had NOT done enough to help the Jews during WW2. I say, the death of nearly half a million American men/young boys was “enough.” He’s living large in Israel these days. Why is he a hero to Israel, Franny?
Wikipedia says, Mengele administered the gas. So, he dropped the tablets down the holes in the chamber roof? That is not what the Sonderkommandos say.
Thanks for the links. I read on a bit, and will read further.
Unfortunately, the entrenched demonization of all things German runs deep. A few years ago, I casually mentioned to a fellow animal rescuer that Germany had been early proponents of animal rights laws. She shot back about how “Germany had killed everyone!” Usually, I let those statements go, but not that time. She no longer speaks to me.
Apart from the English, Germans were definitely one of the founding groups in America. WW1 propaganda damaged much German-American culture.
I was shocked to learn how beneficial National Socialism is/was to society. Health, duty, honor, limits on vulture capitalism/banking, (no vultures)…..who needs that? At this point, I often feel tremendous sadness over what might have been.
I appreciate all your efforts in defending Germany/Germans.
Spare me your crocodile tears. Not interested.
You are also entirely conflating the 1942 Jewish ghetto incident that was quickly put down with the 1944 Polish resistance that was a serious military operation that required the Germans to use significant military forces to crush. The two were not in the same league as military operations.
But leave it to you to exaggerate the ghetto incident by almost equating it with the Polish 1944 resistance.
Your ability not to be able to follow along and listen ceases to amaze me. Listen closely. Rolpf says his father denied the medical experiments, and said to his son. How can you think I would do such a thing? His son asked, what about the selection process? And says to his father you admitted to the selection process, determining who will live and who will die.
The rest is for you to re listen and pay attention. All along we have been describing the selection process. The Jews chosen for work, and the ones chosen to be gassed and cremated. Mengele does not deny he took part in this process.
About Pollard, no whatabboutisms, just stupid. Besides I am not here to defend Jews, there are bad Jews, really bad Jews. There were Jews that sold other Jews out to be saved. There are bad Jews, good Jews and mostly in between Jews same as with all other people. Non Jewish people
Never heard that Mengele delivered the gas, SS doctors did do that but I never heard that he was one of them.
You’re kidding, right?
No that is not Rommel, that is Ernst-Eberhard Hell (hell, what’s in a name?), a Nazi general captured by the Russians as a war criminal. See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ernst-Eberhard_Hell
Here is another unpleasant German, general Walter Model (look at the eyes of that creature!):
At the end of the war he committed suicide. He was sought by the Russians for warcrimes:
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walter_Model
It is remarkable that all neighbors of Germany have negative epithets for Germans: The English: Kraut, the French: Boche, we Dutch have Mof. I think the Slavic peoples have their own.
This is consistent with Rabbi Steven Wise’s letter to his children in ~August 1944 that “Judge Robert Jackson has said the military trials will NOT conform to any of the customary legal precedents, and will retroactively criminalize making aggressive war . . .”
Freda Utley witnessed the “barbarity” of US war crimes against Germany. The opening pages of her work, The High Cost of Vengeance, expresses her outrage at witnessing first-hand the destruction of Germany carried out by Allied forces:
Utley also learned a great deal about the Nuremberg trials, prompting this writing:
A significant proportion of the “investigators” at Nuremberg were Jewish; many were Ritchie Boys — German Jews who had undergone training at Fort Ritchie, Md, to interrogate, subvert, spy upon, etc. Germans in the theater of war. At war’s end, they remained to investigate and prosecute Germans in the military tribunals.
Some of the techniques employed to obtain “confessions” are exactly as those described by former Ritchie Boys here.
The brutishness with which these Jewish Ritchie Boys/interrogators conducted themselves is consistent with the thuggish behavior described in Michael Benson’s Gangsters vs Nazis: How Jewish Mobsters Battled Nazis in [pre-] Wartime America.
In the linked video, Ritchie Boys laughed as they reminisced about carrying on tactics such as this during the war itself :
In short, Jewish thugs used barbaric tactics to coerce Americans to get into the war; Jewish thugs used barbaric tactics against Germans in the course of the war; Jewish thugs repeated those same barbaric tactics in the prosecution of Nazi war criminals.
Hilarious as funny as the frozen corpses lined up to take the Auschwitz photos. LOL. No vultures in the NS, just sadistic Nazi’s. Health, duty honor and limits? Another LOL. What about killing all of the physically and mentally handicap under the Nuremberg Racial Purity Laws, some 70,000 German Aryan citizens murdered by the NS. Prove ordered by Hitler. No, I doubt those poor souls felt any healthier under NS.
What a crock. What about Jurisprudence Tulip? Laws that protect individuals from being rounded up and thrown in Jail with out due process? How many people disappeared under NS and Hitler? . Most people that lived under German NS occupation, not just Jews, but Aryan individuals that would not go along with Hitler, lived under tremendous fear and anxiety, Frightened half out of their mine.
Would you call being afraid and anxious a healthy lifestyle. Having no protective laws against a tyrant? also not healthy.
For someone who claims the Jews are manipulated into thinking that their loved ones were killed when they disappeared and were never found. You seem like quite the patsy Tulips. No manipulation growing under your feet.
So if the survivors were manipulated into thinking that their loved ones were dead when they disappeared on the train platform, never to be seen again, where did the missing Jews go? If you lost your mother at a train station wouldn’t you spend the rest of your life looking for her? Would you think after a lifetime of searching never to be found, wouldn’t you think she was dead, or would you think you had been manipulated into thinking she was dead, by a frozen corpse photo?
There were 3 million Polish Jewish citizens in 1939, by 1945 there were 380,000 thousand Polish Jews still alive in Poland, the Soviet Union, or in the concentration camps in Germany, Austria and the Czech territories.
Where do you think those Jews are Tulip if not dead?
Could be wrong
Scroll down —
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_German_field_marshals
(sans monocle)
Do you have better information?
How about “LEAST FAVORITE”?
Judaism explained in pictures: https://judaism.is/memes.html
Well, I least I bother to listen, don’t I? I understood what was said. I know about the sorting, and I do not believe, “to the left,” was to the gas chamber. Besides, our very favorite Sonderkommando eyewitness said, “the Hungarian Jews were not sorted, they were dumped from the tram straight down the stairwell to the chamber.” So, there’s that.
It wasn’t meant to be whataboutism. People justify the things they do; some people agree and some do not. I suppose it’s all relative. If Mengele believed the Jews were destroying Germany, perhaps he felt justified in rounding them up and getting them out. In any case, I don’t believe the stories about him. On that note, I heard testimony from a few Shoah witnesses, who said they were surprised by the kindness he showed to them. So, there’s that.
Well, it’s on Wikipedia, so it must be true. “New” allegations crop up all the time. Have you heard of the blood draining to transfuse German soldiers?
I agree with you on good/bad Jews/gentiles. I love Dennis Prager. I hear him say, the US has been a blessing to the Jews. He gives wonderful advice on all things cultural/personal, but surely, he hears the maniacal Kill Amalek! proclamations. Does he push back? I know he reads the Talmud. I’m familiar with the accounts of how many Jews, who do push back, are ostracized/ruined, so there’s that.
No, not “bogus,” just another instance of evidence that typically stupid Jews have tried unsuccessfully to disappear. Archived and complete with verbatim excerpts from the ADL “2nd” edition: https://web.archive.org/web/20111221071617/http://www.cwporter.com/toaffdonor.htm As if murdering Jews care about “kosher”? Quoting Toaff on the Jew ritual murderer/butcher Philip Bader from Toaff’s “kosher” ADL edition:
The only reason for the Jew butcher of Christian children to puncture the carotid artery would be if he intended to suspend the child by his heels — again, to drain the blood downward – but with the obvious intention of killing him. This is the kosher slaughter position, a position commonly depicted in standard ritual murder literature. More on Jew ritual murder—ALL BLOOD, no “libel”! https://judaism.is/ritual-murder.html
Eugenic policies have been around forever. Plato remarked on it.
So, here’s this:
Rabbi Sidney Goldstein, Free Synagogue Pulpit, 1912
“We know from studies, the soundness and reliability of which are indisputable, that out of these defective groups and their offspring are recruited the greatest number of those unhappy creatures who fill our reformatories and prisons and asylums and our homes for the wayward and the vagrant…
…It is possible to prevent those who are defective from bringing forth abundantly and peopling the earth after their own kind…The birth-rate of the feeble-minded, the epileptic, many of the insane, and the criminal whose criminality is due to some deep-seated defect, should be controlled and cut off.”
Rabbi Max Reichler, Jewish Eugenics, 1915
“The very founder of the Jewish race, the patriarch Abraham, recognized the importance of certain inherited qualities, and insisted that the wife of his “only beloved son” should not come from “the daughters of the Canaanites,” but from the seed of a superior stock…
…This contention is eugenically correct. Davenport tells of a settlement worker of this city who made special inquiry concerning a certain unruly and criminally inclined section of his territory, and found that the offenders came from one village in Calabria, known as “the home of the brigands.” Just as there is a home of the brigands, so there may be a “home of the pure bloods.”
…Abraham’s servant, Eliezer, so the Midrash states, desired to offer his own daughter to Isaac, but his master sternly rebuked him, saying: “Thou art cursed, and my son is blessed, and it does not behoove the cursed to mate with the blessed, and thus deteriorate the quality of the race.”
There are such laws. There are also such laws to prevent “Holocaust Denial.” Any due process there? Did David Irving receive due process in Austria? What was his crime?
All countries go to war, and this is recognized internationally, hence the establishment of rules of engagement, treatment of POWS, outlines for war crimes, etc. Was the bombing of Dresden a war crime? Was the attack on the USS Liberty a crime? Was Egypt guilty of the attack? Countries also have the right to remove, restrict and/or regulate hostile groups within their borders.
Yes, I would look for her. If I searched for a lifetime and never found her, yes, I would assume she was dead. Her disappearance would not necessarily mean murder. She may have perished from illness, starvation, Allied bombing, Russian “liberation.” I don’t recall a single witness claiming to have located a relative from a frozen corpse photo.
It’s hard to say. I think many survivors registered with the Red Cross, which explains why Israel keeps trying to get their paws on those records. (For safekeeping.) Clearly, many Jews died. Many moved to Paris, London, the USA. Konstantin Kisin’s Jewish grandmother was born in a Soviet gulag. Note : In 1940, a year before the Nazis started deporting Jews to death camps, Joseph Stalin ordered the deportation of approximately 200,000 Polish Jews from Russian-occupied Eastern Poland to forced labor settlements in the Soviet interior. And,
This talk emerges from a book project examining the history and events leading up to the first deportation of Hungarian Jews in 1941. During the first weeks of the campaign against the Soviet Union, the wartime Hungarian government deported more than 20 thousand “foreign” Jews to occupied Soviet territories….. out of Hungary in recent months about large-scale deportations of “undesirables”—about 50 per cent of whom turn out to be Jewish—to the slave labor camps of the Soviet Union. Béla Fabian, former president of the Hungarian Independent Democratic party and for seventeen years a member of the Hungarian parliament, here summarizes and analyzes the reports, both published and unpublished, which add up to a picture of mass terror hardly surpassed by the record of the Nazis themselves, and in many respects frighteningly similar to their program of liquidation on racial lines.
So, there’s that.
More lying Jews telling lies about the “holocaust”….
Yet when Germany liberated Latvia, Lithuania and Estonia from their Judeo-Bolshevic hell, they all turned on the lying Jews like Ryckaert who had murdered blood sacrificed their children. Of course when the Jews marched back into the Baltics in 1944/45 all the best goyim were shipped off to the gulag and sadistically murdered by lying Jews.
Today, across the Baltics, it is not Germany that they hate, it is the Russians. Of course this hatred is misplaced, because it was lying Jews who had committed the holocaust of Latvia, Lithuania and Estonia.
I am not sure why “Franklin” [ROFL] is so obsessed and sexually aroused by monocles, but here is another Pince-Nez caricature of Trotsky…
How many remarkable, negative epithets for Jews?
What’s a shvartse? What’s a shabbos goy? Shiksa? Cattle?
It is remarkable that Jews have been expelled from many nations for the same reasons. It’s even more remarkable they are permitted to return, and then they do the same damn thing as before.
What about Mr. Peanut? Was he a Nazi?
#1449 Franklin Ryckaert
“It is remarkable that all neighbors of Germany have negative epithets for Germans: The English: Kraut, the French: Boche, we Dutch have Mof. I think the Slavic peoples have their own. “
“Szwab” in Polish. There is also verb based on this noun: “oszwabić” (o-Szwab-ić) which means “to cheat, deceive”.
It’s remarkable that in the US, Germans are called inventors, creators, scientists, city-builders, statesmen.
When I was in college, German was the necessary language for anyone wishing to pursue an advanced degree.
It’s remarkable that in the United States, there are numerous towns and cities named for Germans — Maryland, Tennessee, Kentucky, Ohio, Pennsylvania.
#1461 SolontoCroesus
“It’s remarkable that in the US, Germans are called inventors, creators, scientists, city-builders, statesmen. “
It’s remarkable that in many countries of Europe, Germans are called mass murderers, city-destroyers (like Warsaw in 1944), robbers and arrogant cheaters with superiority complex.
“When I was in college, German was the necessary language for anyone wishing to pursue an advanced degree.”
And all those people when they became educated in German way, then they quickly started to build NWO. Wow! I’m really impressed by German (anti)education!
If I would had built totalitarian state I would have choosen Germans.
A small tidbits.
German language was imposed on Slavs in XIX and XX centuries. Slave were forbidden by occupant Germans to use their own languages.
If Slav used his own language then was harrased (i.e. paid fine, was losing its job). Have you ever heard about “Września children strike”* ?
It was a strike of Polish children in 1901 in area occupied by Prussia who were forced by Germans to use their “advanced” language.
—-
* “Września children strike”
“In all of Greater Poland, which was annexed by Germany during the late-18th-century partitions of Poland, German was the language of instruction in schools from 1873 except in two subjects: religion and music.[2]”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wrze%C5%9Bnia_children_strike
Additionally:
“Germanisation of Poles during the Partitions”
“After partitioning Poland at the end of the 18th century, the Kingdom of Prussia and later the German Empire imposed a number of Germanisation policies and measures in the newly gained territories, aimed at limiting the Polish ethnic presence and culture in these areas.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germanisation_of_Poles_during_the_Partitions
The person in that photo is definitely not Rommel.
Dear Carolyn,
I deserve to be berated for my last comment to you, some of which was uncalled for. I hope that by the time you reach the end of this comment you’ll accept my apology.
That said, I really must speak up to address your response, because, once again you reveal a deeply unpleasant character trait: that of attempting to belittle another and/or undermine their (my) self confidence, not in any effort to help, as you pretend you were trying to do with Tiptoe, but out of a toxic egoic desire to elevate yourself at the expense of others.
This part is trivial, but it seems you missed the point of my bringing up that you’d earlier discussed yours (and Hadding’s) horoscopes. I mentioned it because you were castigating Tiptoe for “rambling” off in directions you thought she shouldn’t (despite that she at least managed to stay on topic). – Obviously you’re not averse to a bit of “rambling”… or meandering might be a better description, including meandering into person chit-chat, yourself. – It doesn’t and didn’t matter what yor natal sign is, or how many planets or other influences you have in what part of your chart. That wasn’t the point. Of course I didn’t commit what you’d shared to memory as it simply wasn’t important to do so. It still isn’t.
Well, I suppose you highlighting unimportant, inconsequential “wrongs” that you perceive me to have commited helps you to avoid noticing the broader points I made.
You have a problem with me having a problem with you repeatedly creating unnecessary, unwarranted problems with other highly respected commenters. Your MO, over and over, throughout so many conversations is to belittle, put-down and harangue those you feel yourself “superior” to.
That’s to say, you habitually bully others, whom you wish to belittle, presumably in order to elevate yourself. Yet you don’t need to do that! You have the intellect and the knowledge to make any point or case you wish to make without putting others down.
I hope you can see, if not blinded by your ego, the sense and the intended kindness in what I’m saying.
No, I don’t think Solonto’s name is “Solonto”. I think SolontoCroesus is a pseudonym that he has chosen for himself. That it has significance and meaning is obvious. That I have not gone to the trouble of looking it up, having only interacted with him, as far as I recall, in these very brief exchanges on this thread, is neither here nor there, and is certainly none of your concern!
Not having been exposed to any Greek history, mythology or philosophy throughout any of my educational experiences in school, collage or university IN NO WAY makes me your or anyone else’s inferior. Why you imagine it does tells us much more about you than you wish to imply about me.
I’m a working class woman from Liverpool, who spent her early years in all on a council housing estate, eating free school meals and wearing hand-me-down clothes.
My early education was designed to funnel me into a life of wage-slavery. I was (literally) taught how to iron and fold clothing, and how to type. I left school at 15 with no qualification. I have since remedied that through dedication and determination, so that by the time I was 42, not only was I several years sober*, I also had an (almost worthless) combined honours degree in Politics, Sociology and Geography. (Go me!)
In the meantime I became wise(r) to the extreme dishonesty and criminality of the establishment, and having the courage of my convictions plus the integrity not to compromise myself, I disentangled myself from the system, and set forth on a different path (which you can read about on my website, if you wish: tomboy-pink.co.uk) so that now, through courage, strength, integrity and innate intelligence, and by the Grace of the Divine, I find myself in this mountain paradise, on land that I do not own, but which I do manage and cultivate, off grid, solar-powered, free and independent of those corporate forces that govern the lives of everybody else I know.
*My need to get sober, or rather my imperative to self-medicate with alcohol in the first place, from the age of 14, was induced by extreme (in fact horrific) childhood traumas who’s details I will spare you. – The point of my mentioning it is that I found the courage to face those traumas, recognise and reverse their impact, heal myself and become, for the most part, though the work is still in progress, master of myself. It was not an easy journey, Carolyn, and every ounce of genuine self-confidence I have now I have fought for and earned. Certainly I still bare scars from my past which cause me to be overly sensitive to certain situations. But I am watchful and aware, and become less “wounded” every day.
However(!), had I encountered someone like you, who’s aim is to discourage, belittle and undermine others for their own ego gratification whenever they feel challenged, 20 years ago I may have never made it this far. – That is the danger you pose to others. Seeds, as they sprout to eventually flower, are at their most vulnerable. The kind thing to do, therefore, in all interactions with strangers, is to mind where you tread.
Your straw man, Carolyn, was in implying that my support of Tiptoe in any way suggested that she need not concern herself with personal growth or change.
You are absolutely right that my reaction was well out if proportion to the situation! I will spare you my excuses. I only hope you accept my apology for my intemporate words. They were childish and uncalled for.
However, your continued implication that I anywhere suggested or implied that Tiptoe, or anyone else, has no room to grow is an unfounded, straw man of your own creation.
Finally, for the sake of clarity, there is both reason and purpose in those salutations that I put at the end of my comments, and reason that I sign off almost every comment I make. I will not dream of insulting your intelligence simply because you do not know or recognise my reasons or purpose in this.
With kind regards,
Kali.
In the Rommel photo, notice the larger decoration under the Knight’s Cross is the Pour Les Merite Rommel was awarded in WWI that he would always be wearing in any photo like the one shown.
Zero sourcing or links to this information zero? Did you make it up? Who said all of the above that you write?
Let me make one thing absolutely clear to you, Fran:
I have read and witnessed, as have we all, your accelerating degeneracy, and rapidly accumulating toxicity to the extent that to pay you even an ounce of regard would be to my own detriment.
Your vitriolic outpourings of “Jew hate” reveal your true nature and the degeneracy of your Jewish identity and your Jewish cultural inheritance.
I have tried to be fair to you, to recognise your humanity, and to connect with you at the point of our common attributes as regular women. But you have abandoned any pretense of normal, rational, communication in favour of spewing forth toxic jewish bile in comment after comment.
From now on, therefore, I will respond to you as a poisonous troll ought to be responded to.
Kali.
You may be right.
Who is it?
The photo Franklin originally posted does not look like Hell: Hell’s posture is different — his right shoulder slouched; head tilted, not erect. Lips are wider, face is fatter, wrinkles at mouth more pronounced.
Several other photos of Hell online; in none does he wear a monocle, he does were ordinary eyeglasses.
The suggestion is monocles are an affectation of the wealthy or high-born. Perhaps Hell is neither?
. . . on the other hand, in USA there ARE towns called “Poland” — one, at least:
William McKinley grew up there
https://www.hmdb.org/m.asp?m=77091
I take it you have little regard for Germans.
Pity.
Some people just can’t seem to recognize quality and character when it stares them in the face.
Taubman and her lot admire, maybe even adore Germans: the zionist implantation on the lands of the Palestinians was built architecturally and sociologically on German models by German-born and German-educated men who implemented German ideas and social theories and systems.
The German man who is credited with “creating Hebrew culture in Palestine,” Arthur Ruppin, spoke only German (never learned Hebrew); made it his mission to turn East European Jews — i.e. Poles — from the “Degenerate” Jew that Nordau wrote about, into the “new Jew” that he thought was fit and necessary to create a colony that German/European Jews would be most comfortable in.
[Kali wrote to Taubman]:
ditto
don’t feed the trolls.
Nazi plans for the Baltic states:
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generalplan_Ost
V. V. Rozanov’s suppressed and extremely rare analysis of the 1911 Jewish ritual murder of 13 y/o Andrei Youshchinsky, Ekhad, אֶחָד , is available here: https://judaism.is/assets/ekhad.pdf
Jewish “justice” is witness tampering, bribery, media agitprop, then finally murder of the judges and witnesses
1911 A.D., The 13-year-old schoolboy, Andrei Youshchinsky was murdered in Kiev on March 12th. After eight days, his corpse was found in a brickyard completely slashed to pieces and bloodless. Suspicion fell on the Jewish manager of the brickyard, Mendel Beiliss. The case did not come to trial until two and a half years later (Sept. 29th to Oct. 28th, 1913). In the intervening period numerous attempts were made to lead the investigating officers on to the wrong track. Meanwhile a large number of incriminating witnesses suffered sudden and unnatural deaths; false accusations and confessions followed one after another due to huge money bribes. Behind the accused lurking in the shadows, was the figure of Faivel Schneerson of [FRAN’s !!!] Chabad Lubavitchers, leader of the ‘Zadiks’ (‘Saints’) of the Chassidim sect, who was the spiritual director of the murder. The trial ended with the release of Beiliss, but at the same time the court established that the murder had taken place inside the Jewish brickyard, which was the religious center of the Kiev Jews, for the purpose of obtaining blood. Almost all the prosecutors, witnesses, and authorities who had spoken out against Judaism, later fell victim to the [Jewish] Bolshevik Terror. (Ausfuhrliche Darstellungen des Prozeßes enthalten ‘Hammer’ Nr. 271, 273, 274, 275; Oktober bis Dezember 1913)
Andrei Youshchinsky’s right temple wounds were in the form of the Hebrew letter shin, ש, a letter of occult significance in the sephiroth of the Kabbalah. Here is an esoteric exposition by a Chabad rabbi regarding the letter shin, ש, a discussion that expectedly avoids the subject of ritual murder:
https://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/137093/jewish/Shin-Sin.htm
Besides faked and re-purposed photos and lying “eyewitnesses,” the “evidence for the HoloHoaxs includes imbecilic testimony: https://judaism.is/holocaust.html#imbecilictestimony
Oh but it is very much Taubman’s concern! Ever since BFT was denied a gold star, BFT has been itching to dox Solento (rhymes with Sorrento) and turn him over to the tender mercies of the rich dude who owns tall black men who run around and bounce a ball as a way for the rich Jewish dude to make money to induce people like BFT to harass people like Solento (or is it Sorrento?).
— but the Croesus thing. That IS the thing.
Croesus misinterpreted the message from the Oracle, because of which he lost his kingdom, Lydia.
(About a hundred years ago I read about it in a children’s book on Herodotus.)
I figure “misinterpreting the oracle” is a lot like getting the history wrong: bad things ensue.
It is remarkable that considering the history of constant invasions from Russians, Ukrainians, Mongols, Swedes, other ancient Baltic states, you focus such ire on Germany. I note religion was a major factor in many conflicts, and certainly in more recent times, the atheist Jews/Bolsheviks and Soviets seem to be an appropriate enemy and more deserving of your angst.
I studied a bit on your history:
I always thought Good King Wenceslaus was German. Wasn’t he a German?
The death of Wenceslaus resulted in renewed troubles in Prague and in almost all parts of Bohemia. Many Catholics, mostly Germans — mostly still faithful to the Pope — were expelled from the Bohemian cities.
The Hussites were aided at various times by Poland. Because of this, Jan Žižka arranged for the crown of Bohemia to be offered to King Władysław II Jagiełło of Poland, who, under pressure from his own advisors, refused it. The crown was then offered to Władysław’s cousin, Vytautas, the Grand Duke of Lithuania. Vytautas accepted it, with the condition that the Hussites reunite with the Catholic Church. In 1422, Žižka accepted Prince Sigismund Korybut of Lithuania (nephew of Władysław II) as regent of Bohemia for Vytautas.
The Poles supported the Czech Hussites in their efforts, except when Hussitism spread to Poland. (Whoops!) The polish Hussites were defeated in the battle of Grotniki in 1439.
I am bouncing around a bit, but this is an interesting tidbit about how it is/was that people move around:
As such, they were the target of religious-cum-ideological military raids carried out by the Teutonic Knights (a German military order), who had settled on a northern piece of Polish territory at the invitation of a Polish prince and had subjugated Old Baltic Prussians in the land that is today part of north-eastern Poland and makes up the whole of Russia’s Kaliningrad Region.
This is an observation from an Unz writer:
Till this day Russians consider Poles traitors to the Slavic world, and it was no less a person than Austrian Chancellor Metternich (one of the architects of European continental peace settlement forged at the 1815 Vienna Congress), who famously said: Poland is a wedge that the Western world has driven into the Slavic world. The statement is warranted to a great degree: because of Catholicism Poles have always felt to be a part of the Western world and have always felt opposed to eastern Orthodox Rus’.
When the Second World War erupted, Ukrainians would shoot at the back of Polish soldiers; during the years of German occupation, Ukrainians revelled in annihilating whole towns and villages inhabited by Poles — especially in Volhynia — with their cruelty shocking the battle-hardened, death-inflicting German SS-troopers.
In recent years:
In 1992, the Foundation for Polish-German Reconciliation was founded by the Polish and German governments, and as a result, Germany paid Polish sufferers approximately zl 4.7 billion (equivalent to zl 37.8 billion or US$7.97 billion in 2022).*
From NFP, May 21, 2023:
The chairman of the State Duma, the lower house of Russia’s parliament, has called for Poland to pay Moscow $750 billion for “liberating” it at the end of the Second World War and then helping it rebuild.
Vyacheslav Volodin, who is a leading figure in Vladimir Putin’s United Russia party, also said that “Poland must return” lands that it received as part of the postwar settlement and called for a ban on Polish trucks entering Russia.
Well, personally, I would tell the Russians to go pound sand on that last request for “a debt owed by the Poles.” Modern Russia, of course, bears no responsibility for the Soviets, but by my analysis, Red/Bolshevik Russia contributed to more tragedy in Eastern Europe than any other nation.
You do know that Hitler sought to protect Europe from communism, don’t you? What happened in Eastern Europe as a result of his defeat? Communism – think Marx, Trotsky, Bela Kun (actually Kohn), NOT GERMANS, ALL – jews, all.
There is an article in Forbes, April 28, 2022 titled, “Why Israel Became a Safe Haven for Russian Billionaires.” Basically, when criminal Jews in Ukraine start to worry about another pogrom, for no apparent reason, they luckily qualify for the Law of Return due to their Jewish ancestry. They can just skedaddle away, off to the Land of Bilk & Money, aka, Israel.
I also note that, as usual, Germany paid up. Has Poland received a dime from Russia?
Check into what General George Patton had to say about the “wrong enemy.” Take note of what happened to him for identifying the real enemies.
Oh, fuck off Frannie, you lying troll.
I am still waiting for you explanation as to why Jews were expelled from 109 countries. My patience is wearing thin, but then again you are lying Jew who shrinks from the truth.
That is a quote from Walter Scott, and it applies to wikipedia. Lying Jews like yourself have taken it over and in doing so they have made it worthless as a tool for devout holofraudians like yourself. You have been told this countless times by commenters who wield immense respect at UR, including Ron Unz, yet you refuse to desist from trying to use it “proof” supporting Jewish lies. Of course you are a lying Jew, so you refuse to accept this.
In any case, this is what your beloved wiki-book-of-jewish-lies has to say about your worthless and off target rebuttal:
Yet lying Jews like you and fat ugly lying Franny keep barfing this useless drivel all over the UR comments section, over and over and over again. If you want to know why Europeans hate lying Jews, just go look in the mirror.
That looks like the same picture. It’s highly possible, actually probably that the monocle was added to the one you showed. Or did you already assume that?
‘Mr. Peanut’ — good one.
It does seem to be the same face, but the portrait on wikipedia is not the same as the one Franklin posted: See differences in the white collar under the tunic; there is no oak-leaf (?) above the Iron Cross.
General Hell seems even more different, in his person, bearing, face, not just attire, from the portrait Franklin R. posted.
Makes little difference to me; Franklin’s comparison FAILED no matter who the German soldier is.
I’m just curious.
___
re: Brosi, #1477. That’s a new one. Some plausibility, but hard to find evidence that Otto Frank prostituted Anne Frank in the camp. Maybe in the attic as well.
I didn’t figure it out all by myself. However, if you have basic math skills and a bit of basic algebra, you can make the necessary calculations regarding burn/incineration rates, varying temperature requirements, etc. What I do, is step away from the “holocaust arena,” and find information from completely neutral sources, hence the dental heat-induced decomposition study results from The National Library of Medicine.
Would you like to know what I found interesting in searching for general information on cremation procedures in the first half of the 20th century? Well, I’ll tell you anyway – the search returns came back with pages and pages of literature from Jewish sites and Holocaust mumbo-jumbo reports. Deduce the meaning of those clearly compromised search results as you may.
I would agree; you are steeped in “Holocaust Studies.” My family, entirely German on my maternal side, just got on with life rather than traveling the world seeking retribution. (My dad always teased my mother – he called her a “bohunk” who cooked Polish goulash – she protested, as she was a German from Bohemia – her mother, was a German from Poland)
Regardless of which side you take on Germany and the Jews, some wrongs just can not be made right. I’m not suggesting justice for crimes should not be sought, but at some point, letting go must occur, especially if the crime has no specific perpetrator from whom justice can be sought, i.e., war, international slavery. The Jews don’t let go; not ever; nor do they accept blame. So, when the destruction of Amalek is complete, for which Jews seem hell-bent on accomplishing, not a single man, woman nor child, who lost their life in WW2, will return to feel the sun on their face or embrace their earthly relatives.
Thanks. I wanted to post a picture, but I can’t always get that feature to work.
Maybe Al Liguori can work his image-posting magic, and help me out.
Dear Kali,
Congratulations on your successful efforts to rise above past circumstances.
If I may, I offer a bit of advice, I heard from Dennis Prager and my father.
Mr. Prager: wisdom and knowledge are two separate things; if you acquire both, you will have a happy life.
Dear old Dad: there is no shame in “not knowing.” The only shame is in refusing to seek answers. His favorite advice to me, which he stole from Mick Jagger, which he would sing, “you can’t always get what you want!” He sang this at the top of his lungs whenever I complained about anything (not really applicable here, but I thought I’d share).
My advice: if a comment seems offensive, and you’re not sure, just go ahead and assume it was not intended so. If it was, you deny the offender the pleasure of getting under your skin; if it wasn’t, then you refrained from over-reacting.
Take care, toodle-oo, Adeus! Or whatever they say in Portugal these days…..but, you will always be an English Rose.
eeeew
Dennis Prager.
Isn’t there some other site where you can discuss that pompous purveyor of pornography?
#1469 SolontoCroesus
“(…) the zionist implantation on the lands of the Palestinians was built architecturally and sociologically on German models by German-born and German-educated men who implemented German ideas and social theories and systems.”
No wonder that Israel is falling country which would be quickly destroyed if not huge USA support, if Israel has been based on German “models”.
Germans have never been good in building healthy society. They don’t know how to do this. Jews in Israel copied this freaky German “solutions” so they are doomed, soon or later.
Thanks for your grasp of the tragedy of it all.
I feel that IN SPADES! And to make matters worse, a tragedy for Germans (“The Jews are our misfortune”) has been turned by those extremely cunning Jews into a win for themselves that Germans are paying for [and now Americans too]. One reason it doesn’t change is bc people like the great White “warrior” Kevin MacDonald thinks/says that it was Hitler’s fault that “whites” lost. Blame Adolf Hitler, not the Jews. And not him! In my book, that’s very similar to the Jew’s position.
Too many of our people are hung up on wanting to be a friend to the jews. You know, those good jews? SolontoCroesus writes:
“Not least at other Jews.” Gee, we better come to the aid of Jews again. Well, that sentiment is debatable. I wouldn’t mind getting into a debate about that. Without any ad hominems, memes & artwork used. Just good logic.
Thank you for that, Solonto. So, from Wise Man to … Mistaken One. I like it! 🙂
I take some very important guidance from the Dao, Solento (in Sorrento? Or is that ref. just to wind Franny up?), so I’m not sure we ever truly “lose” anything, even if we do find ourselves suddenly without a kingdom! Material existence can change many times during one lifetime, but it’s our essence, our being… that is the thing. The thing that truly “matter”s.
My comment was to Carolyn, but I appreciate your using it to get (somewhat cryptic) digs in at Toxic Troll, Baltimore Franny. Well done! 😁
Fond regards,
Kali.
Like Porn Hub? I tried that, but they weren’t interested in discussing WW2 over there.
Was he wrong, though?
I already took a few lumps for expressing admiration for Prager on the Holocaust trial thread; I don’t care what anyone says, I like what he has to say about culture, classical music, marriage, society, in general. I disagree with his views on Israel, Hitler, immigration, Judeo-Christian values, so I ignore accordingly.
#1475 Tiptoethrutulips
“It is remarkable that considering the history of constant invasions from Russians, Ukrainians, Mongols, Swedes, other ancient Baltic states, you focus such ire on Germany. “
I’m focused on Germans because this article is about Germany, not about complicated history of Poland or Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth and Russia, Sweden, Crimean Khanate, Ukraine etc.
“The chairman of the State Duma, the lower house of Russia’s parliament, has called for Poland to pay Moscow $750 billion for “liberating” it at the end of the Second World War and then helping it rebuild.”
I think it is propaganda trick.
Anyway.
Russians gave Poland bill for $750 billion to pay, then Poland should estimate reparations for 45 years of Soviet occupation. I think balance will be in Poland advantage.
“(…) Red/Bolshevik Russia contributed to more tragedy in Eastern Europe than any other nation. “
Germans wanted to exterminate 80% of Poles.
Comparing German and Soviet regimes – “better” for Poles was Soviet one. At least Soviets didn’t plan to kill as many Poles as possible (after 1945). Soviet regime allowed development of polish culture and
caused to rise Polish population from 24 milion to 38 milion (1945-1989) at a cost of harsh economic expoitation and total political dependency of Poland.
“Has Poland received a dime from Russia? “
If Poland asks for reparations then not only Germany but also Russia (former Soviet Union), England, France, Israel are in queue.
Do you imagine what would have happend to Poland with union of such powerful and angry debtors?
Very kind, and very wise advice, Tiptoe, which I do generally attempt to follow. Things aren’t going quite as smoothly in my wee mountain paradise of late though, and I let myself get caught up in some negative emotions. I am working on it though, so there’s that. 😉
I was going to settle for a simple “thanks” tag, but because I’ve used up my quota you get, and rightly so, something a little more personal.
With love,
Kali.
You can’t claim “here are the Hungarian Jews, arriving in summer, 1944,” and present images, with no named copyright, of people standing/sitting in heavy coats, heavy neck scarves, stockings, and expect it to be accepted at face value.
Those photographs prove or indicate Jews and/or others arrived at various camps, at various locations/times, walked around with luggage, stood in line, etc. Most of that is not in dispute.
It is clear to me that the so-called Holocaust purveyors have cobbled together bits and pieces of truth, and inserted exaggerations and outright lies all within the story.
I wanted to return back to the Auschwitz, you asked were it the copyright of the album, who did it. You doubt the validity of the photos, even though the biggest and best Holocaust Revisionist have authenticated them.
I wanted to point something out to you when you asked about the physical nature of the photographs. If you look on the album on the Yad Vashem website, on one side there is a photo of the album page itself, on the other side are the blown up photos, The album was typical photographic bound book whit sheets of mounting paper to mount photographs. The original photos were very small, like maybe 4 x 6. There are handwritten captions and notes written in the margins. The photos were taken by either by Ernst Hofmann or by Bernhard Walter, SS camp photographers who photographed prisoners. Of this there is no doubt in anyones mind. Lily never hid the album, she gave photos of away to relatives of the victims who identified some of the people you see. Since Lily was person and the photos small, to her it was no big deal. After she donated the photos to Yad Vashem, they were restored, and made much larger, you can see a lot of detail.
The idea that these were revitalized frozen corpses is more than preposterous, many of the Jews in the photographs are identified by family members. I took a screen shot of the photo album on the Yad Vashem website so you can see what I am saying.
I agree. So, how to get the Geniejews back in their bottle?
The “good” Jews, (yes, like Prager) support Israel, encourage US/English involvement in Middle Eastern wars, advocate for open borders, support Holocaust education, etc. It’s a serious problem.
I suspect Mr. MacDonald understands that Hitler realized their removal was the only option, so off to Israel, but most did not want to go. Why would they? They know about the Goose and the golden eggs. So, then what? Expulsion was easier when they had not yet infiltrated every major European power/corporation/media.
As in most things, hindsight is 20/20. I read somewhere that Hitler’s greatest mistake was underestimating the perfidy within the US government; as you know, German people were a large percentage of the American population, and perhaps he believed they would be unwilling to fight other Germans. I believe whomever made that observation was correct.
I think Solon is correct about the Big Jews sacrificing the little Jews, and we need to leave them to themselves, as far as I’m concerned. And that’s the irony – of all the actors from the late 19th through mid 20th century, only Adolf Hitler refrained from extraordinary personal gains and the betrayal of his own people.
Superb, Solon! Thank you (and I mean that to the amount off effort I have had to invest in wrestling technology to reply in this humungous thread.)
Yes, I understand that, and this article is about the War in Ukraine, Hitler, Churchill and the Holocaust. So, no matter what we discuss, we’re reaching back in history. The futility of going way, way back is a point I made earlier. Still, ancient ire dies hard.
I think you focus on Germany because you believe the lies and exaggerations about Germany and WW2. And, the fact that you focus on Germans as the ultimate enemy, when Russia has behaved demonstrably worse, is where my confusion lies. There were ethnic Germans in Poland; there were legitimate territorial claims by Germany. Hitler did try for a negotiated settlement. This is all true despite your unwillingness to consider these facts.
By my analysis, the Bolsheviks and the Soviets wrought the most tragedy to Poland/Eastern Europe. Didn’t the Polish people want Jews out as well? Why? Are you seriously suggesting communism was better for Poland? So, if you had an option, you would have moved to East Berlin rather than West Berlin?
If you choose East Berlin, then I assume you are out of your mind, or you are a communist from Africa, or a Jewish communist, or a Polish person with a generational beef against Germans.
It seems to me, Poland has faired better since the communists lost control. Am I wrong?
Hasn’t Germany paid reparations?
Pardon me, but are you suggesting that I am accusing someone of dressing up corpses to appear alive for a photograph? I am not.
Paula Lebovics, a Jewish inmate at Birkenau, said the following:
The allied bombing near the camp caused conditions to worsen; no electricity, no food/medicine supply arrivals.
The German patrol evacuated the inmates, by their own (inmate) choosing, and the infirm were sent to a hospital somewhere. Her mother, with whom she reunited, went to the hospital.
Paula said the remaining inmates, including herself, were alone in the camp for about ten days before the Russians arrived. Everyone headed off to the main campus, Auschwitz, and raided the kitchens and store rooms, wherein they found warm, comfortable clothing.
The Russians arrived, and they dressed everyone in those striped pajamas and they gathered/exhumed the corpses for photographs of dead bodies scattered everywhere. That is exactly what she said. Do you think she is telling lies?
I will review the album again. I am not saying the photos are forgeries; I am not objecting to enlargements, etc. I do not doubt people recognized themselves or their family members therein. I am saying, it’s suspicious that this evidence lay dormant for forty years; the person/persons who took the photos would be the first source to identify where/when taken. It is impossible to identify the exact location if there are no identifying markers in the background; some photos have markers, some do not. I do not believe arrivals in summer would remain covered head to toe in winter clothing, therefore we have yet another discrepancy amongst thousands of other discrepancies, so numerous and extraordinary to indicate overall deliberate deception.
I screwed up my last posting explaining the Auschwitz Album with incorrect blocking an quotations.
I went to fix it but it was too late. I hop you understand what I was pointing out to you about the bound album as a book, was how it was first presented.
I wanted to ask you about another item you wrote.
In a nutshell, I believe the Big Jews sacrificed the Little Jews for their prophetic Return, from where they further their worldly habits of acquiring power, wealth and vengeance.
Are you suggesting like Solon-to who wrote in one of the above posts, that the Jews committed genocide on other Jews for some sort of gain, to get Israel, for victimization status used to gain control and power? Is that what you mean about the big Jew sacrificing the little Jew? How exactly does this work, big Jew, little Jew? How did the Big Jew get the not guilty Germans to collaborate on this genocide plan? And if what you say is true, isn’t that proof that the Jews were in fact were deliberately murdered ? That the Holocaust is true. I mean you cannot have it both ways. If the Jews were behind it or not. You are saying there was in fact genocide going on? Perpetrated by Jews not Germans.
What directions did the Big Jews give to the Germans, that caused them to act so cruel sadistically towards civilians, men, women, old people etc.
Have you ever seen such a photo showing more cruel sadism, then the below photograph showing the Jews lined up for the selection process at Auschwitz? Because I have not. I cannot take my eye off this photograph. These Jews in these photos look filthy, unclean, humiliated, just standing there starring into space waiting to be examined by the SS Germans, such power figures, clearly enjoying their dominance over these pathetic looking Jews? Look at those Jews lined up like useless pieces of shit, their belongings, everything they own scattered like a mess around them, there family members and friends moving away and loosing site. You can smell the fear coming thru the photos. And the Germans? Standing there in their shiny uniforms and jackboots, gloved with whips in their hands. Such dominance, such power. Never showing an ounce of empathy for even mothers holding little babies. I have never come across the equally sadistic idea that Jews perpetrated this with the help of the Germans? Seriously who talks like that? Crazy people. That is some conspiracy. A Kali like conspiracy. She believes the entire universe is controlled by a cabal of Jews.
My question to you Tulip is how did the Big Jews get the Germans to murder the Little Jews? Do you have details on this? Carolyn talks and talks, yet never deals with the evidence, never shows what really happened, who made it up, and who made the Germans do all those bad things, against their wishes. Carolyn is evidence free. She can never deal with the facts, because the facts show that the Holocaust happened, with the exception of the few conspiratorial delusional people, that cannot prove anything because it is all wrapped in a conspiracy and controlled by the Jews. You hear nothing from Carolyn in the way of facts other than” how could we have fallen for it.” I dare say I am starting to believe that the people believing in a Jewish conspiracy of universal domination so bizarre and without facts, when you ask for any the shrug, there are no facts because the Jews make the facts hidden, are impossible to talk to.
I also wanted to ask you, about your claim all of the stories of survivors do not add up. That no two are alike. Yet I have pointed out to you many times, you can go to YouTube and punch in “arrival at Auschwitz” and you will see hundreds identical survivors testimonies describing what you are looking at in the Auschwitz album, in 5 different languages form different places all over Europe. The only thing these people have in common is they all arrived in Auschwitz. Getting off the train, the lineup the selection process, to the left, to the right, and watching loved ones disappear in another direction never to be seen again. Where did the people to the right end up ? If they were transported some where’s else surely the Germans would have punched those train tickets and published it. Screamed it. But there was literally no where to go accept further into Germany. Germany was collapsing. They were literally last seen standing outside a crematorium, there is a photograph of it. As described by Carlo Mattogno one of the biggest Revisionist. The only way out from of those Jews thru a chimney. Do you understand that they were never seen again? Babies, small children, old people who could not fend for themselves.
What part of the story is not true:? What part do you not understand? The Jews sitting outside crematorium 4 in the Auschwitz photo were not beamed aboard the Enterprise. They were based and incinerated.
I am posting a YouTube video of one of the survivors, he was 15, he might have gotten things wrong or exaggerated. How do you think you would respond if you were 15 and in that situation, with your entire family? Life or death? Listen to the Little Jew.
Well, this changes everything. Explains it too.
So you are not “British” but a gypsy, a “traveller,” whose family most likely hails from Romania, and before that, India. Therefore, Kali is not an affectation, but could very well be your real name. In any event, it’s you.
Thank you for giving your website url: tomboy-pink.co.uk. That’s the only honest thing I’ve seen you do.
So you were taking advantage of the good roads and lovely countryside of (somewhere in) Britain, which other people pay for, so you can live the free and easy life you want. Travellers never work. They steal. Of course, you can justify it bc you’re living in a “criminal” system to which you owe nothing.
You call your lifestyle Anarchy. And you blame “the Man” for everything, for teaching you to iron and fold clothes. That would be honest work, that many, many, many European women have done over the long term to earn a living. But not for gypsies. Hell no. You prefer to scam your way along, and you are quite good at it.
As for your childhood traumas, it’s not surprising in a gypsy family, from your male relatives, and in the type of environment in which you live. Don’t think your “ethic” of living for free would be welcome in a National Socialist society. Gypsies were definitely not killed, but many were put in Family Camps bc they would not work and were thieves instead, and now they con the state with their claims of 200,000 dead. A strong, united State is not a place that wants you.
Don’t write to me, please. I’m pretty much gone over the anonymity factor. That makes it a big waste of time.
Those changes between the two pics could be photo shop. Why believe images? Nowadays.
You should re read your post. Twice if necessary out loud. You cannot even take responsibility for your thoughts and actions. It is my fault you say what you said, because it was just a hypotheses, and I overreacted, like all bad Jews who call in the army after exposed Jew hatred. Look at us, we are to blame for what you said. Then you spend the rest of your post doubling down on your conspiracy. However it is not your conspiracy it is the Zionist conspiracy. And it is my fault for conflating the two. I am the one that is dangerous not you. Let me re-cap and see if I got the hypotheses (of course the Zionist )about Jews murdering other Jews correct.
Let me recap your conspiracy.
1. The Jews caused WW1 and WW2, they had such power they could control time and space and start, create and sustain wars, two WW
2. They started these wars to set up Germany as the bad guy and the Jews as victims so that the Jews could swindle the world with their fake holocaust, get Israel, gain power as the victims and have everyone eating out of our hands because to the holocaust, and ultimately dominate the world. Which is where we are now. The Jews dominate the world.
Do I have the conspiracy correct so far? Now here is where it gets tricky. I rattled a nerve, accusing you of saying that the Jews would murder other Jews for power and control.
You are upset because I am accusing you, and it is not your theory or hypothesis, it is the ZiONIST, theory, conspiracy or whatever. Not you propagating this ghastly genocide theory, it is a Jewish theory. So let me apologize Solon-too. You were just referring to a Jewish idea not your idea. My bad. And of course the vicious cycle of the Shul on Shabbos begins. I would like to point out that my shul is not subsidized by tax payers money, it is privately owned, and what we discuss is our business, just like your conspiracies are your business. We have our ideas, you have yours, but you are hysterical in thinking that our conspiracy, will ruin your world.
I cannot comment on who will win or lose this battle, the Jews or the Jew haters. My feeling is the Jews will win because the Christians are married to them. They are now one.
But I would still like to discuss the meaning, the true meaning of your conspiracy, involving the Zionist.
So you are saying that Brandeis, Wise, Franfuter, Morenthau and a group of very powerful Jews started WW2 knowing and not caring that millions of Jew would die. That these elite Jews did not care about the non elite Jews because they were willing to sacrifice them on their way to complete world domination which they have achieved after the war and the fake holocaust help them do it. So who cares if a few million Jews die?
Am I correct Solon-to? Do I have the above Zionist conspiracy (not your conspiracy) the Zionist correct? If I am correct aren’t we back to the same staring place? There were millions of Jews that were murdered. ( I do not understand that if the Jews were so powerful, how come they could not save the Jews from such a fate as what happened to them).
I do not get.
1. How were these Jews sacrificed by the Zionist Big Jews? They died in the camps of disease and starvation? The Germans did not kill them. I am confused on what part of the Holocaust is fake and what part is true.
2. If the Jews are conspiring to murder other Jews, isn’t this heinous? Just saying if you do not have specific facts to back up this conspiracy, you are in essence saying, YOU Solon-t0 are saying that the Jews murder other Jews to dominate the world. So see what I am saying Solon-to? The slippery slope you are on, a phrase there and a phrase there. a viola. You are pissing off a lot of Jews.
But you should calm down, I over reacted, as you said I was. No one is hunting you down. 90% of what is being discussed to decrease Jew hatred is positive, not criminal. Why not go to Robert Krafts website and read his initiative. I promise you will not be so frightened. But you should keep in mind that yo are not a clown show like Al, and Bronzi. where there literature and comments are throw aways, and laughable. No one takes their information seriously. Least of all the Jews. I mean their stuff is like from vampire movies. You in my opinion should be cautious about exposing conspiracy theories about the Jews murdering other Jews. It really does piss me off. I lost family members in that war, my dad fought in that war.
Travellers are not Gypsies but Irish people who have adopted a Gypsy-like life style (causing similar problems):
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irish_Travellers
Of course to save the reputation of your Saint Adolf you must also deny the Nazis did anything wrong to them too. However between 250,000 – 500,000 of them are estimated to have been killed by your noble Teutonic Knights: https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/genocide-of-european-roma-gypsies-1939-1945
But you do not that Carolyn. You do not know that she is a real blooded Gypsy, she may act like one, but that I do not think is her lineage. It is also not fair to the Gypsies, many of them work very hard. I think it unfair to label it a genetic lineage. It is her behavior not her lineage.
But you should read that website, it is shocking, they are arrested, and try to make a big deal of it, to accuse the police of brutality for taking their camper van for not paying their years of tickets for not registering their car. Then they camped out at the junk car lot, where the van was seized. It is all bat shit crazy stuff, EVEN for a true anarchist living off the land. They are not even true blue to that cause. They are just con artist wrapped up in conspiracy theories. There are many blogs where her husband talks to his family, who have pretty much disowned him.
Listen Carolyn I am glad she is on the Jew haters side and not my side. I will never respond to her again.
As we have come to expect of you, CHABAD Fran, you regurgitate a completely inverted lying version of “Jew hate.” Properly understood, Jew hate is hate _by_ Jews, precisely the kind of genocidal hatred that puts CHABAD rabbis like Faivel Schneerson at the center of the ritual murder of Christian children like Andrei Youshchinsky https://judaism.is/ritual-murder.html
More documentation of your CHABAD’s genocidal precepts here: http://judaism.is/chabad.html
Well Holocaust fans, after reading Kali’s blog, I have turned a corner. I have decided that everyone on this blog is bat shit crazy, and it is a total waste of my time to engage with any of you seriously. It just came to me suddenly, like I said after reading Kali’s blog. that I was actually communicating with this person for real, when in reality she is completely not real. I do not think any of you are…. real that is. Solon-to take care you will finally be at peace here on UR.
Hopefully this will be my last post ever on UR.
Well, yes, @SolontoCroesus is correct. Extensive credible evidence abounds of the role of Jews in instigating two world wars http://judaism.is/world-wars.html , deadly revolutions http://judaism.is/perpetrators.html , ginning up a third world war http://judaism.is/kabbalah.html , resulting in the death of ¼ BILLION Gentiles in the 20th century—orders of magnitude more evidence than your whiny lies about a handful of Hungarian Yids. Why are we to shed tears about Yi0ds who died in a war they were the first to declare??? Is it because “Jewish life is of infinite value” and “Only Jews are human”? Of course that is the case in your demonic Judaic creed. http://judaism.is/who-is-human.html
Estimated? ESTIMATED??? Let’s see some effn verifiable forensic evidence for all those baseless assertions.
Let’s see, take 200,000 gypsies, use 16 remaining teeth per corpse as the basis, would give 200,000 x 16 = 3,200,000 teeth. How about you provide 1% of them, or 32,000, as forensic evidence?
I suspect you are like Franny and skate around the most salient point of this whole debate: verifiable forensic evidence.
No evidence, no murder, no holocost. It is indeed that simple.
Yes, that could be the case.
But why would anyone bother?
Happily, that is not something that causes me to read until my eyes feel like sandpaper.
—
I’m audio-reading A Tale of Two Cities. Talk about wordy! Twenty minutes for Sidney Carton to tell Lucy Manette that he is a wretch, will always be a wretch. A miserable wretch. Not good enough for you. You are too good for me. I drink too much . . . . .
Many, many insights into how different was the world of 18th century France. Dickens manages to discuss “how hot it is” — at the wine shop, in England, wherever, and that the only remedy was to sit outside under the plane tree. While I spend the time worrying about the electric bill for AC.
But the spy craft was not all that different: a red rose in her hair and all the Jacqueses scatter.
Adieu.
Good riddance! (As if we believe you?)… Something for you to remember us by…
(I wish all my memes were this funny! http://judaism.is/memes.html )
I still have the research from a long time ago. Twenty thousand “gypsies” living in Germany died during those years — like a normal amount. But they saw what the Jews had done and got advisors to help them change it to 200,000 — the normal 10X increase. Now they have a big memorial in Berlin and reparations too. They’re smart enough when it comes to scamming money out of people.
Amazing that you think anyone accepts the ushmm.org info. You certainly deserve all the abuse you’re receiving.
Juvenile antics like #1508 make me realize that the audience that requires education is not Jews/Taubman — they are what they are; it’s people who think throwing spitballs or writing foul words on bathroom walls are the equivalent of argument or defense of one’s culture.
Such posts are an embarrassment and a shameful waste of an important resource.
Is that a promise?
I listened to Ben’s statement.
He says upon arrival, he had no idea about the place to which he arrived. (Auschwitz)
He lines up to be sorted. Considering he knew nothing, how was he able to determine the boy with a knee problem would be killed? He describes these thoughts as they occurred to him in line, not afterwards.
How could he possibly know the boy was killed?
Of course, a four minute blip can not accurately be evaluated without further context; people often weave in and out regarding what they thought would happen, what did happen, and thoughts occurring after an event get brought forward out of place/time, which is why I listen to the entire story before forming an opinion, but if you’re serious about leaving UR, then I won’t bother to respond further.
Abduction of an X number of people + survival of a far smaller number = genocide otf the missing number.
Your insistence on “forensic evidence” works both ways: do you have “forensic evidence” that General Eisenhower starved to death 1,5 million “disarmed enemy combatants” in his Rhine meadow camps, the death of millions of German citizens due to bombing of cities (including Dresden) and hunger and the expulsion of some 15 million of Germans from eastern Europe, many who have died underway? Show me their teeth!
Well, I for one believe the above mentioned did happen, but I don’t insist on impossibly to be proved “forensic evidence”.
The USHHM info was simply the first coming up. The second is from Wikipedia:
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romani_Holocaust
Your reaction is the by now well known “source denial”: if the source is Jewish it is a lie, because Jews always lie. Now: if the source is Gypsy it is a lie because Gypsies always lie, or they have been advised by lying Jews.
The only “right” sources are of course Neo-Nazi denial sources.
BTW, if I had to chose between an invasion of Gypsies or Nazis, I would chose Gypsies. Because Gypsies would be a nuisance of petty theft only, but Nazis would engage in wholesale genocide.
Obviously there is a time and place to be serious —AND— a time for ridicule.
Always debunked by facts, she displays the stereotypical modus operandi of Jews; she repeats her lies in the same or different threads. Not once have I ever seen Fran retract even a single lie. She is deserving of ridicule… and more, especially as a shaliach accomplice of Chabad.
Fran identified herself as a Chabadnik: https://www.unz.com/pgiraldi/israels-war-criminals-in-their-own-words/ That means she had assented to and assist Chabad’s agenda of Jewish supremacism, deceit, and global domination in the furtherance of her fucking “moshiach” (the damned ANTI-Christ) http://judaism.is/chabad.html As I pointed out, Chabad has been involved with ritual murder. http://judaism.is/ritual-murder.html
So, I will decide for myself when I will debunk her, chastise her, and/or ridicule her.
You are welcome to do as you choose. Carry on.
#1494 Tiptoethrutulips
“(…) when Russia has behaved demonstrably worse, is where my confusion lies. “
First thing: Not Russia but Soviet Union.
Second thing: Soviet’s occupation was far milder than German one. Germans wanted to murder 80% of Poles*. Soviets (after 1945) didn’t have such terrible plans.
“Hitler did try for a negotiated settlement.”
Show me a proofs that Hitler wanted to resettle German minority in Poland to Germany.
“There were ethnic Germans in Poland;”
You claim that Germans had right to expel Jews from Germany because Jews were unloyal and danger to German state.
But when Poles (allegedly) wanted to expel Germans because they were unloyal and danger to Polish State – it is crime.
You use double standards. You are hypocrite.
” Are you seriously suggesting communism was better for Poland?”
I repeat again.
“Communism” (Soviet’s occupation) was “better” than German occupation because Soviets didn’t have plans of total extermination of Poles.
Germans had ones.
“Hasn’t Germany paid reparations? “
No, they have haven’t paid $1.3 trillion of reparations for loss of 30% of population of Poland.**
—
* Generalplan Ost
“The Generalplan Ost (…), was Nazi Germany’s plan for large-scale ethnic cleansing, extermination and genocide of Slavs, Eastern European Jews and other ethnic groups categorised as “Untermensch” in Nazi ideology.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generalplan_Ost
** “The War Report – Abridged Version”- report German atrocities in Poland during World War II prepared by Polish specialists.
https://instytutstratwojennych.pl/en/abridged-war-report
WOW, Caroline, what an amazing display of bigotry and failure to comprehend what you read. I was somewhat aghast to see you, in an earlier comment, megalomaniacally and supremacistically presenting yourself as an arbitor for who should live and who should die based on their IQ (you give Nazi’s a bad name) but this particular abreaction takes the buscuit!
I am from old Swiss Roman (and tangentially, Gruyere nobility) and Cornish stock and Kali from Welsh, English (and probably a smattering of Irish) stock. Neither of us are gypsies nor Irish Travellers. I lived in my motorhome, untaxed, for a number of years as a form of protest against the corruption of the State and its theft of our freedoms. I did it for the sake of my children and all those who find themselves trapped by an abusive, coercive and dishonest system of control and exploitation. Just try living on the side of a dual carriageway road for three months in tents (until some gypsies compassionately brought us a caravan), facing the combined might of the police, local council, the masonic brotherhood, a hostile recovery company, the courts and the DVLA. See if you find that to be free and easy. Kali was completely drained by the end of that experience (when I was violently arrested, tortured and imprisoned and Kali watched helplessly as all of our worldly goods were smashed and confiscated.) It demands an extraordinary degree of courage, determination and fortitude to make a stand such as we did. If you think that is not taxing then you have a very limited understanding of what tax is; we have been taxed more than anyone who complies with the extortion regime you recognise as the State.
I have often pointed out to those who make the pig-ignorant claim that I freeloaded by not paying road tax that I am quite happy to spend a few days a year doing physical labour on road upkeep and improvement but I will not sully myself by contributing to the consolidated fund used to finance wars and oppression. Indeed, I do just that, pretty much singlehandedly, maintaining the dirt road that serves our land and that of our neighbours.
You may well have a creditable record of contribution in the field of holohoax revisionism and restoring the reputation of the much maligned German culture but, Caroline, if your writing comes from such a source as the bigotry and bias you display in the above comment then I doubt it is really creditable at all, rather it is likely to be disreputable. Fran may be toxic in her views and understanding of the world but that is easily explained by her obvious low intelligence and the years of anti-human indoctrination she has undergone. Where does your toxicity, bullying and offensive manner come from? I hope you don’t answer that it is part of your Teutonic heritage because then I would begin to doubt that the Germans really were as maligned as you suggest.
The source of information is all-important.
We’re now very familiar with “fake news.” And for the truth seekers out there, Wikipedia now doesn’t let you copy the references (numbered sources) on this page — maybe on all their pages!! Jews like F.R. would like to get rid of naming sources altogether. Yes, I have been pushing this feature at Wiki for a long time now. The saving feature on Wiki pages is that all info put on it by “readers” must have a source reference. Without those sources, it is truly worthless.
For the statement you block quoted above, the real source is: “The Historiography of the Holocaust”, by Ian Hancock, a book published by a textbook company in England. What do you bet that “Ian Hancock” is a pseudonym or a front man for the jewish creators of the book. But you don’t have to be a jew, racially, to spout the jew’s narrative (if there’s money, or even a living, to be made from it).
Yes, but there is physical evidence the the bombings took place, and that millions of corpses existed to be buried, and the millions of refugees from the east who were counted and integrated into society in the west.
So there is physical evidence of the murdering and displacing of the Germans.
It’s precisely that physical evidence that’s missing with respect to the murdering of Jews the holocaust purveyors merely claim happened while providing descriptions of how it happened that have often and repeatedly been debunked as lies or exaggerations.
And then they criminalize anyone who challenges their claims that ensures that only one side is free to enter into the debate. It’s ij fact of Jews seeking at all costs to criminalize speech that challenges their narrative that turned me against the tales of the purveyors. Once they resorted to relying on criminal laws to sustain their narrative, they completely debunked it because truth always stands on its own two feet, only lies and liars need the protection of criminal laws to sustain them
And that’s period, paragraph, end of story.
And I am unaware of any laws the Germans have enacted that criminalizes anyone disputing their narrative of what was done to them during WWII.
Thanks. I will respond, but I have a new kitten and I have to take him outside now for his morning outside time … maybe 2 hours? Getting him acclimated. Thanks for being patient.
I am British, of mostly Welsh ancestry. But also, yes, I AM Kali. – Kali Prajita, to be precise. Go ahead and look it up. You may learn something outside of your own, limited, self-centred, passions as a frustrated Germanic Fraulein.
My choice to become a traveller was entirely founded on my principles as an anti-establishment, anti-corruption, Anarchist. So, no, I’m not a gypsy.
Next time you are once again locked down in your home, confined, masked and jabbed, eating bugs and synthesized “meat”, receiving your programmable digital currency on condition of compliance, without hope of ever again knowing freedom unless delivered by death to the same, I do hope you think of me and my husband, a most extraordinary and exceptional man, Prajna Pranab (go ahead and look that up too; again, you may learn something) here on this outstandingly beautiful mountainside, with views of Spain upon which to rest our eyes, eating good, nutritious, chemical-free food, grown by the sweat of my own brow, cooked on my wood-fired range, by firewood cut and collected from my doorstep, eaten by the light of our solar system, surrounded by love, both earthly and heavenly.
Free. Always free. And always prepared to resist the tyranny that has already enslaved you, mentally, spiritually, emotionally and physically. Let that image adorn your dreams, as you prepare depart this earthly realm.
You are aware, because I have told you so before, that not only have I shared links to our website, I have shared all of the names under which I have participated in internet discussions, as well as my birth-name, my ideological positions, my activism, my past work in the care industry… my whole history. In fact, everything about me can easily be discovered simply by the HONESTY and openness with which I engage in these UR discussions. No?? You were not aware? What is wrong with you that you fail to pay attention to what has been offered to you on a plate?
I was taking my liberty upon roads built by my ancestors, and paid for by myself as a tax-payer. – I wanted to proudly insert the word “former” there (ie, “former tax-payer”), but the fact is, through every purchase I make, not on the free/”black” market, sadly I am still forced to pay taxes to the criminal and corrupt state, who’s criminality you share by your, apparently willing participation in it.
All involuntary tax is theft, Carolyn. And all tax, stolen from hard working people, MY PEOPLE, is used to pay the interest on usurious jew-debt, whilst the wealthy corporatist that engorged and enrich themselves at the expense of everyone else, and to the detriment of ecosystems, public commons, wildlife and peoples everywhere, do everything in their considerable, entirely illegitimate, power to avoid.
Whilst you pat yourself on the back for your stupid, self-defeating compliance with the creators of the Holocaustian, anti-German, anti-human, anti-life Death-Cult which you claim to stand against. Moron!
You imply that myself and my husband are thieves because we refuse to participate in the criminal enterprise that you willingly, proudly support. I say, look in the mirror next time you flap your gaping gob to disparage another.
Whilst we were travelling my ancestral roads on the British Ilse, Prajna and I had several encounters with Irish Travellers, and made friends with some. They loved us for the stand we made against a system which had oppressed, disparaged and criminalised them for generations, as well as for our knowledge of the legal system so often used against them wherever they went. And we loved them for their outrageous gall! I tell you, Ms Yeager, I would rather stand shoulder-to-shoulder with those guys, against your “neonazi” bigotry, and be thought a thief, than I would ever participate in your unconscionable Death-Cult. (You think you don’t support it, but you do. Stupidly, ignorantly and willingly. Moron!)
Oh, if you only knew the number of years I’ve lived without the luxury of a washing machine, scrubbing and wringing heavy work-clothes, towels, bedding and all, all by hand. Week in and week out, for years! The hours I’ve busted my back digging to create food gardens almost everywhere we’ve been, over and over, in order to leave something beautiful and worthwhile behind. You think the wage-slave work I did before, caring for elderly and disabled people, for peanuts, was “honest” because it involved having my earning stolen by the state?
Fact: YOU DON’T KNOW WHAT HONEST WORK IS, Ms Yeager. You think it means paying taxes to keep the system of debt-creation vital whilst your MASTERS build their next Holocaustian temple on your doorstep?? Give your head a wobble! You’re just one more high IQ moron on a hiding to nothing… Nothing but your own enslavement.
And what a disgusting moron you reveal yourself to be.
So, let me set you straight: The man, a relative from my father’s side of the family, who abused me was of part Irish, part English and part GERMAN stock. That man used jew-porn as his inspiration, and as an “instruction manual” for me.
I do hope you sleep soundly tonight. Let no images of a skinny 8 year old child being analy raped, amongst other, even more unspeakable things, by her blue-eyed, Germanic relative enter your dreams. Because that would be sad.
Prajna tells me I may have already got rid of Toxic Troll Franny from this forum. (Go me!)
One down. One to go!
Kali Prajita.
My bad, Al Ligouri.
Somehow, I failed to see how
effectively debunks
Why “hopefully”? Have you no integrity? Just go, Toxic Troll Taubman. And take the Yeager moron with you.
To everybody else: you’re welcome.
Love,
Kali.
@fufu:
Picture or map, this is a good idea. On the following map you can see that Germanic tribes settled the areas between the rivers Elbe, Oder and Vistula already in the 1st century. That was some centuries before the first Slavs came from the east and entered the center of Europe.
“The distribution of the primary Germanic dialect groups in Europe around AD 0-100:”
The following excerpt from an English wikipedia article about the Germanic tribe of the Vandals is also interesting:
(Source: wikipedia)
But Polish nationalists, starting in the 1920s, were obsessed with annexing (further) German territories because they would have been populated by Slavs at some point in history.
“Polish territorial claims 1934”
I have come to the conclusion that Poland was deliberately positioned against Germany from 1919 onwards by the Western Allies – i.e. by Germany’s enemies – and that Poland was encouraged and supported by the Western Allies in its anti-German attitude.
I was just checking my comment archive to make sure I’ve not left anyone waiting for a reply when I re-read this:
This is it, ladies and gents, the single comment that got the Yeager moron’s goat so much she resumed hostilities with me, despite my best efforts to nip it in the bud and remain peaceful, and despite my apologising for my hasty, intemperate words.
For the record.
Kali.
Hi. This is my response.
I like what you say about promoting the Italian culture and history. “I’m all for advocating for MY Team, for MY culture and heritage.”
But most of your long “argument” was about Jews! I wonder if you realize it. Point b thru e were all about Jews and Fran Taubman!
Finally, in point f you remember and say: “Trying to address Carolyn’s point more precisely: Are Jews my problem to solve? NO.” Righto. I appreciate and agree with what you wrote about me and my concern. You then do a short section on your own concerns. But this:
In other words, the Jews. No, wrong. The major point I want to make is that we MUST expose OUR role in the 20th century wars, both good and bad, both helpful and unhelpful, and THIS is what Europeans are unwilling to do.
It is complex enough to absorb a lot of time and space, with Jews being only a part of the story, not the major concern for WHITE PEOPLE. (sorry for the caps but I need to emphasize certain things that I don’t want you or readers to overlook.) Our major concern is ourselves, which many here are completely in denial about, and cannot look at. If one cannot/will not look & discuss their nation’s role, it’s bc that role was ignoble.
BTW, I’m not talking about including people like Fufu, or Fran Taubman for that matter. This is for Europeans about Europeans, including Americans, Canadians, Australians, etc. Strength comes from Unity, but genuine unity, not false platitudes. OTOH, it can’t be a free-for-all, so how about just you and I to start.
You may be right, but the allies’ military records prove the bombing runs. And bodies were recovered and incinerated to stop the spreading of disease. These were photographed with recognizable buildings or ruins in the back ground.
Further, it is forbidden to conduct excavations in the area of the former Rhine Meadows Camps. This from my cousin who lives nearby.
However, no German has ever approached any allied government for compensation. In fact the German government negotiated away the rights for Germans to pursue compensation from Poland.
Be that as it may.
But, almost 80 years after these ALLEGED occurrences, 4th generation Germans are still paying blackmail, with the stupid Americans having been sucked into the same scam with their $3 billion per year cash infusion into a country that did not even exist at the time in question.
That is the difference. If no money changed hands no one would give a chit what Jews or anyone else was caterwauling about.
What sick society absolutely gloats every time it is asserted, baselessly, that millions of its members were disappeared without one iota of physical evidence to prove that they were murdered? The reason is simple, MONEY! Gotta keep that Niagara Falls of cash flowing. Now the natives of Canada have caught onto this scam and try the same gambit. Why not? If it worked once…
As I keep advocating, talk or scribbles are cheap. I want to see verifiable forensic and physical evidence for all allegations. No such evidence = no such crime. Occam’s razor.
ref.: 1517
I will accept your rationale and explanation. Why? Because you do not go around asking for acknowledgement and compensation ahem blackmail, from all and sundry.
Over my long life so far I have learned that life is unfair; I also came to the conclusion that the best revenge is to live well or better, than your enemies. Happy to say that I managed this in spades.
It is pointless trying to directly fight governments and their pencil-necked collaborator civil servants, because they have more and bigger guns than the tax payer.
The key is to find a weak spot in the states’ machinery and attack there.
Case in point: I had a long running battle with the federal tax authorities. Quite by happenstance I read about the Tax Court and read up on some of their rulings. Surprise surprise but I found these rulings imminently fair and impartial.
Thus I applied for and was granted a hearing before this Tax Court. 4 weeks before this hearing, just as I was gathering all my evidence and making copies, I received a phone call from the government’s legal department. After a very lengthy and heated (on my part) phone call I was advised that the government and its robbers/tax department was dropping their claims against me. Further, my filing fee was returned by the Tax Court!
Find the chink in the armour and attack there.
That’s the point they keep missing – they have no physical evidence that forensically establishes and proves the Germans ever murdered 6 million Jews as and where they claim it happened. None. Nada. Zilch.
That’s why Frannie keeps parading photos of Jews walking around someplace, and then declaring them having been murdered by the Germans because no one knows where they went.
That’s what’s proof of nothing except that some people may have have been at the place they are depicted while they were still alive.
Yes. Many Russian citizens were brutalized by the Soviet Union. The USA is not yet as brutal, but the government certainly acts on behalf of citizens in ways which we object, and it is my country, therefore I’m an American, I am called an American. Are you suggesting the Soviet Union was an alien force in Russia, and elsewhere, yet it was still beneficial? I think you could argue the Bolsheviks were not generally of Russia. You could argue, the Jews were/are not of Russia, nor are they Russians, which they often proclaim themselves, as a matter of fact.
Who killed the Russian Tsar, fufu? Was he murdered by Russians? Was there a hostile element within Russia meddling in Russian affairs?
Does Wikipedia prove it herein?
Wikipedia:
The body responsible for the Generalplan Ost was the SS’s Reich Security Main Office (RSHA) under Heinrich Himmler, which commissioned the work. The document was revised several times between June 1941 and spring 1942 as the war in the east progressed successfully. It was a strictly confidential proposal whose content was known only to those at the top level of the Nazi hierarchy; [… ] Nearly all the wartime documentation on Generalplan Ost was deliberately destroyed shortly before Germany’s defeat in May 1945,[14][15] and the full proposal has never been found […] The extermination document for the Slavic people of Eastern Europe did survive the war and was quoted by Yale historian Timothy Snyder in 2010. It shows that ethnic Poles were the primary target of Generalplan OST.[20]
Where is this document quoted by Snyder? I looked for it unsuccessfully. Please forward accordingly.
From HREC:
The term Holodomor (death by hunger, in Ukrainian) refers to the starvation of millions of Ukrainians in 1932–33 as a result of Soviet policies. The Holodomor can be seen as the culmination of an assault by the Communist Party and Soviet state on the Ukrainian peasantry, who resisted Soviet policies. This assault occurred in the context of a campaign of intimidation and arrests of Ukrainian intellectuals, writers, artists, religious leaders, and political cadres, who were seen as a threat to Soviet ideological and state-building aspirations.
Between 1917 and 1921, Ukraine briefly became an independent country and fought to retain its independence before succumbing to the Red Army and being incorporated into the Soviet Union. […] By the end of the 1920s, Soviet leader Joseph Stalin decided to curtail Ukraine’s cultural autonomy, launching the intimidation, arrest, imprisonment and execution of thousands of Ukrainian intellectuals, church leaders, as well as Communist Party functionaries who had supported Ukraine’s distinctiveness.[…] The state confiscated the property of the independent farmers and forced them to work on government collective farms. The more prosperous farmers (owning a few head of livestock, for example) and those who resisted collectivization were branded kulaks (rich peasants) and declared enemies of the state who deserved to be eliminated as a class. Thousands were thrown out of their homes and deported.
In 1932, the Communist Party set impossibly high quotas for the amount of grain Ukrainian villages were required to contribute to the Soviet state. When the villages were not able to meet the quotas, authorities intensified the requisition campaign, confiscating even the seed set aside for planting and levying fines in meat and potatoes for failure to fulfill the quotas. Special teams were sent to search homes and even seized other foodstuffs. Starving farmers attempted to leave their villages in search of food, but Soviet authorities issued a decree forbidding Ukraine’s peasants from leaving the country. As a result, many thousands of farmers who had managed to leave their villages were apprehended and sent back, virtually a death sentence. A law was introduced that made the theft of even a few stalks of grain an act of sabotage punishable by execution. In some cases, soldiers were posted in watchtowers to prevent people from taking any of the harvest. […] Millions starved as the USSR sold crops from Ukraine abroad. The USSR vigorously denied that the Holodomor had occurred. Since the collapse of the Soviet Union, the Communist Party, secret police, and government archives that have become accessible to researchers support the conclusion that the famine was caused by Soviet state policies and was indeed intentionally intensified by Soviet authorities.
I seem to remember a similar Soviet slaughter of productive Polish citizens in a forest somewhere….Katyn?
That’s not what I claimed.
I have never claimed nations, upon determining a hostile element within, do not have the right to expel or restrict said element. I did claim the ethnic German element within the Danzig territory, as well as others, had been there for centuries, was once part of German territory, therefore Germany had a legitimate claim for possession. Why would Danzig be declared a “free city” if it clearly belonged to Poland? What was the ethnic composition of Danzig before WW2?
Who killed Polish intellectuals, professionals, officials in the Katyn Forest? Why were they killed?
So, the reparations payment I previously cited was insufficient? Was it less than or greater than the amount of $ 0.00 that was forked over by The Soviet Union?
What a coincidence! That’s exactly what Rurik said, over and over: “Despite my best efforts to nip it in the bud and remain peaceful (in spite of repeatedly calling me a “Sow” and posting pictures of sows), she (Yeager) wouldn’t stop her evil intentions toward me.”
Until YOUR “Uncle Arthur” appeared and enjoined him to cut it out with the “muh feelings” and get on with it. Rurik then attacked Arthur, promising never to consider him a friend again, and you sided with Rurik. Ah, deja vu.
Carolyn,
Thanks for your response.
Yes, I see your point about my concentration on “the Jewish problem,” and how that focus seems to contradict my assertion that my purpose is to highlight MY team and MY cultural heritage.
In fact, I am deeply involved in studying both — “the Jewish problem” and my own heritage and culture. This bifurcation gives rise to a third problem: I am afraid I will run out of years before I run out of ways to study, then effectively disseminate this information/passion.
The particular aspect of “the Jewish problem” that drives me is the overwhelming complicity of very many Jewish people in provocation of the wars and in war crimes in waging the wars and, equally vile and criminal, the involvement of Jews in criminal activities in Germany, Europe and elsewhere after the war. Those Jewish people have never been called to account; rather, they are celebrated in the Jewish community.
One outcome of this failure to understand the history (a “Croesus” situation) became manifest through a video that Arthur McBride posted HERE:
https://www.unz.com/aanglin/former-cia-analyst-says-zelensky-could-face-military-coup-soon/#comment-6130331
How Iraqis Got So Good At Smoking American Soldiers
Specifically, the video hinges on Paul. Bremer’s actions as “CPA” in Iraq when he undertook “de-Baathification” — firing as many 500,000 Iraqi soldiers, civil servants, and the like.
It seems obvious to me that Bremer’s de-Baathification program was modeled closely on the earlier de-Nazification program, with this significant difference: where Eisenhower effectively killed remaining German military, rendering Germany totally defenseless against the US occupying army’s “monopoly of violence,” Bremer fired Iraq’s military. This genius move allowed men who had been trained in military means of killing and destroying to use those skills to kill American occupiers in Iraq.
(In terms of learning from history: Bremer graduated from Yale; Dick Cheney was most influenced by his professor at Yale; Jake Sullivan, now running US policy in Ukraine, is a Yalie. Bad juju, Croesus-wise.)
All of that to say that, No, I can’t give up the necessity of calling to account those who committed war crimes — especially Jews — against Germany (and Italy) in the course of the world wars.
My interest in Germany is primarily from that perspective: the crimes committed against Germany in the world wars: making them known — telling Germany’s side of the story — and to the extent possible, bringing to justice those war criminals.
To my knowledge Unz Forum has not touched on matters concerning Italy — except to misuse the terms Fascist and Mafia, and to trace most knowledge of Italian culture to The Godfather movies.
Italy’s history is extraordinarily complex, but I hope to master it and, if the stars align, perhaps write a feature article tracing Italy’s history, especially Italy’s involvement in the world wars.
—
While I welcome your suggestion to debate these topics here and now, I’m afraid my old, cranky computer is overwhelmed with the bulk of this thread. I’m trying to think of another venue —
hmmm.
While typing this, listening to Larry Johnson being interviewed on Redacted
https://www.unz.com/aanglin/former-cia-analyst-says-zelensky-could-face-military-coup-soon/
Point that grabbed me is that Johnson was fired by CIA? when Cold War wound down.
There’s a pop culture novel about just that phenomenon: a lot of spooks, spies, agents, young people seeking adventure while in the pay of US government suddenly out of a job with an odd set of skills.
(Similar phenomenon in England in WWI era: flocks of young leaving farm & rural life for cities –> adventure of war. Thus, British necessity of WWII to absorb remainder)
In the interview, Larry Johnson summarized the various outlets where he’s sold his ‘talents.’
That is, “Where can I, Larry Johnson, ex-CIA, get a paycheck for what I was taught by US spook agency to do?”
Because Everybody gotta make a living.
Fran checks into Unz periodically: in May ’23, very few comments. Big increase in June ’23.
Huge flare-up on this topic, then seeming abrupt departure with a small bit of back-pedaling in her penultimate comment.
A few comments earlier, Fran did not sound like herself: comments had paragraphs! Not quite as much abusiveness; actual attempt at what looked like canned arguments. I speculated that either someone else was using Fran’s sign-in, or Fran was writing from a cheat-sheet, or someone was looking over her shoulder.
These disparate puzzle-pieces caused me to think that Fran’s comment string here was a job interview, a try-out.
Gotta make a living, and there are only so many outlets for glass-and-metal coffee tables.
And whatever agent she was trying to impress, Pulled her plug. FAIL.
(This is what comes of reading too many LeCarré novels)
If I may chime in, Solon:
Indeed.
In the American south, typically a patriotic community, the people of the Middle East (except Israel, of course), are believed to have always been savage, near-Neolithic, with only a few exceptions. This is what I believed – we are bringing Democracy! fighting terrorists, so on. I was stunned to see video footage of Iran/Iraq filmed in the 70’s, depicting no such thing. I don’t believe Islamic/Middle Eastern society is compatible with western society, but their culture is THEIRS, to continue or adjust as they see fit.
My grandfather, a non-conscripted pilot in Europe during WW2, who was orphaned in Ireland and adopted by a Scot, was duly warned by his father against participating in that war, as he had been in Europe during WW1, and revealed to my grandfather that things were not as they seemed nor as portrayed by the US government. My grandfather returned to admit his father was correct, but he was never forgiven, and the rift was permanent. My point is, the truth has been known by many for quite some time. The problem is the complexity of it; it’s hard to grasp the elements in entirety, although you know “something is just not right.”
That said, the trails do seem to lead to the same alien element; not to suggest European people are without responsibility, but the elimination of our strong, young men, through wars, does leave our societies lacking the sort best capable of leadership and/or defense. Coupled with control of media/academia, the conquest is just a matter of time.
I read the point of the war in Ukraine is to acquire resources, land suitable for agriculture, space, etc., for the benefit of Israel, as that country is sorely lacking natural resources and space. I believe this is true based on historical precedent.
Jim Traficant was an American congressman, who railed against Israel and its “stranglehold” on America. (Perhaps you are familiar; if not, you can still find his proclamations on line, for now anyway) He was sent to prison on federal charges; he always proclaimed his innocence, and he never ceased in his criticisms of Israel. Eventually, he “fell” off his tractor and died. Sometimes, I think American naïveté is deliberate, otherwise you and/or your family pay a heavy price for “knowing.” It happened to General Patton, as well.
SolontoCrazytown, I thought the EXACT same thing about a change in her tone and manner of expression.
Is it because we’re crazy, or we have an ability to recognize patterns? Both?
from AKA Crazytown —
Traficant had been a football star in high school.
A cousin of mine was in a hospital in Traficant’s hometown. Her husband had been on Traficant’s team.
I traveled to see my cousin in the hospital and her husband was there.
It was the same day, same hospital that Jim was taken to after the accident.
Ya, I think some of us have been around long enough to recognize “patterns.”
Thanks for being one of them, Tiptoe.
(Keep walking gently.)
#1524 Valjean72
“On the following map you can see that Germanic tribes settled the areas between the rivers Elbe, Oder and Vistula already in the 1st century.”
You have no proofs that people living between Elbe and Vistula river (“Germania”) in I AD, spoke only German language and were direct ancestors of modern Germans.
Area of “Germania” (Elbe to Vistula) in I AD was probably inhabitated by Celtic, Scandinavian/Nordic and Slavic people, and other tribes.
German-speaking people stole the name “Germania” and assigned it exclusively to German-speaking men.
Just like Germans stole name “Prussia” and assigned it to German-speaking people only (initially Prussians were non-German speaking, Baltic tribes*).
Summary:
“Germania” in I AD – Celts, Nords, Slavs (and other tribes).
“Germania” in XXI AD – German-speaking people (Elbe-Oder rivers), Polish-speaking people (Oder-Vistula rivers).
BTW: Do you know, how much money want Germans for selling East Germany to Poland? Poland is moderate rich country but we can make a good deal
—–
* “Old Prussians”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Prussians
#1531 Tiptoethrutulips
Are you drunk or something? Your comment has no sense.
Thanks HdC. I began my rebellion from the position that Gandhi said, “Civil disobedience becomes a sacred duty when the State is lawless and corrupt and anyone bargaining with such a State shares in that lawlessness and corruption.” He went on to say, “There is one sovereign remedy and that is non violent non cooperation.” And I made a stand by, in particular, refusing to cooperate with the Road Tax (and MOT vehicle inspection) scheme. My purpose was to provoke a response from their regime so that I would have an opportunity to highlight its corruption, oppression and sheer unreason.
I found many chinks in their illusionary armour. The first, and core failing is that the whole justice system purports to rest on the right of a defendant to present evidence in their defence but that right is also an illusion. Actually, it is worse than an illusion, it is a deception because: a court is not able to hear evidence unless the witness presenting the evidence swears (or affirms) to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. Do you know anyone who knows the whole truth about anything? It is simply not possible. To attempt to tell the whole truth about this one moment in this one place would require reams of paper and endless amounts of time. Given that both I and the judge know that it is not possible to tell the whole truth, if I were to swear an oath to do so then I will have committed the crime of perjury and the court is not permitted to hear evidence from a perjurer. Hence, to fail to swear that oath excludes any evidence from me and to swear that oath is perjury and thus the court is not required to entertain my evidence; the right to evidence in my defence, therefore, is a sham.
Lord Coke, one of the premier jurists in the English legal system, pointed out that law is reason and unless it is reasonable it has no force or effect. I am not bound by anything unreasonable or irrational and any intelligent and reasonable human being recognises the the whole system of law and government is unreasonable. That is quite some chink, don’t you think?
Camp Autolift (the protest camp we set up and maintained for three months when they confiscated our motorhome) was very challenging but was also very rewarding. We had many victories and struck some severe blows against the system and changed the thinking of a great number of people, setting them off on their own journeys of discovery and rebellion. Much of it is recounted on our blog (http://www.tomboy-pink.co.uk/blog/), in case you have time and inclination to read it. Our activism also pre and postdated Camp Autolift and there are a trove of other stories that are not recounted on the blog. Many chinks were discovered and exploited and our actions were generally met with success. Certainly there were a few occasions where we suffered violence and loss from their wicked system but they were far exceeded by the times where we transformed hearts and minds. Despite all of my activism I still have a spotless record. Although I was (briefly) imprisoned for contempt of court (I sent a message to the judge that I was not prepared to engage with his process having been tortured by his agents) there is no record of that conviction nor indeed for that period of imprisonment. We did discover, through the discovery process for a much later case, that we are both identified on the domestic extremists database but both of us have a clean criminal record.
I am delighted you wiped the floor with them too. Keep finding the chinks and keep exploiting them. Viva la revolution!
Sow or not, you are a moron and that is a fact.
Supporting your own enslavement, and the enslavement of your purported people, your beloved Germans, in your misguided, ideological zeal to uphold a system that will very soon, shut you down and shut you in, whilst raping you financially in order to build more temples to the Holocaustian religion in your own country. Moron!
You think you can dodge your culpability for your abusive comment by reference back to your unjustified attack on Rurik? Wrong. You think mentioning that conversation saves you from what you have coming in this one and all to come. Wrong.
The truth is you tried, for a remarkably short time, to conduct yourself with a modicum of self control/moderation. But you failed spectacularly because you are incapable of decency, honesty, self reflection or self control.
You are a nasty individual who apparently cannot help but show her true colours in thread after thread. – I recall in one conversation where you mentioned that even as a child you didn’t see why you should care about other people’s feelings. Possibly because, as Rurik said, you are a sow. Or more likely because your are a psychopath.
I also recall that towards the end of our first encounter on this forum you pleaded with me to “leave you alone” claiming feeble old age for your weakness. And so I did, out of pity for your fragility. – I wasn’t out to hurt you, only to help you to see the error of your ways.
Now though, thanks to your disgusting, abusive attempt to belittle me, even using my childhood experiences in an attempt to boost your own sense of psychopathic superiority, I will not leave you alone.
I have added you to my “commenters to follow” list, and I will watch you everywhere you go on this forum from now on.
Kali Prajita.
No, I’m not drunk or something.
Nothing I wrote made any sense? Fair enough.
Are you a communist or something? From Africa? From Eastern Europe?
Do YOU have any proofs that, a. The moon is made of solid rock? b. The moon is hollow and rings like a bell? c. The moon is made of cheese? d. There is a “man” in the moon, and that’s why we haven’t returned?
Let me help you; from (fake) Wikipedia:
Cheese is composed of water, fat, protein and lactose, and although water is its most volatile component, the other elements would also evaporate over time. The density of the moon is about three times that of cheese.
So, I say, the moon is not made of cheese. Does that make sense to you?
I think I’d rather have this discussion with you than with S-C. He seems to be mistaking what I’m saying, making it more difficult to communicate. It appears that you can see how the felt pressure to be civil and not step on anyone’s toes hampers what we say to the point of others not ‘getting it.’ It’s a constraint I feel all the time.
I’m going to call you Tiptoe from now on bc you “get” that we have to tiptoe around here, hoping not to offend the more sensitive among us. I like this from what you said:
The first is purposeful, by the Jews yes, and it’s our failure to simplify it and bring it down to it’s basics. I have been trying to do this, but I don’t get much cooperation. Someone like Franklin Ryckaert tries to complicate the issues, and this is why/how the “Holocaust” has grown from a fairly simple gas chamber story, to the Aktion Reinhardt camps that no longer exist and all the “killing in the Soviet Union” that has never been able to be investigated in any way. But this is just by way of example of how complexity is created to confound and block; a form of “look over here” when “over there” fails to deliver. Why are we unable to see through that and spend so much time trying to prove that something didn’t happen. It’s hard to fathom such foolish behavior on our part.
Secondly, the loss of our best men, and the offspring they would have produced in strong unions. Here, I am accused of being a feminist if I criticize men and/or hold them accountable for what they don’t do. Particularly, the cowardice and anonymity so prevalent in our times. For this reason, it may be time for women to take some, if not yet “the” reins. But honestly, I don’t see a single man who is up to it at all, so perhaps it will have to be “the reins.” I’m just speculating, not planning anything, but you show more intelligence than most who are commenting here. Just saying. I think you have tightened your writing approach (a great improvement!), and that in itself shows you are interested enough in this subject to listen to well-meant advice.
Thirdly, a very insightful comment. The people are in denial because they don’t have a leader to follow, who inspires them. And this country is completely sold out to Zionism and Israel. Any leader has to be willing to go against that, but at the same time not make it the primary thing. This is key. Americans pretend that Israel really is helping us in the mideast ??, I guess with intelligence gathering. It can’t be anything else. We pretend that the World Trade Towers really were brought down by planes hijacked by Saudi terrorists; we pretend that Lee Harvey Oswald killed President John F. Kennedy with a single rifle from behind; we pretend that the deadly attack on the USS Liberty never happened (by just forgetting about it) or was a ‘misunderstanding’. There are so many things we pretend to believe because we don’t want to put our comfortable lives in jeopardy.When we finally can’t pretend any longer it will be too late. Not that this is a place to do the sort of thing that is needed. But it could be a start, a beginning.
The important thing is to be concise and say exactly what and how, without making any excuses or getting personal. Scrupulously accurate. Fearless and direct. Political correctness was invented for a reason. Right? As to the Jews, there are lots and lots of people writing about the Jews. There’s no lack of writers/bloggers pointing out their sins. What good does it do? I’m NOT saying that it isn’t necessary, but that not everyone needs to be doing that; we also need to be talking about ourselves. Stories about grandparents are great! I always like them; they’re inspiring and touch the heart.
Have you read Mein Kampf? Hitler did it just right. The put-downs of his book are just the usual attack-porn, completely baseless. He spoke insightfully about the Jews in one section; the rest of Book One was only about Germans. That may be the way to best get across my idea.
Well, I just don’t know what I can say to this. With all due respect. The evil instigated by Jewish Power is beyond comprehension, but Americans and Europeans are ALL conditioned never to mention the word ‘Jew.” So this is not a way forward for our people. I guess I’m saying we need to try something else; as I said to Tiptoe, ‘exposing’ the Jewish responsibility for this is not working. I tried to suggest some reasons, but really that is neither here nor there either. We need to change our people’s focus of attention; something new is required. That is what Adolf Hitler did with/for Germans! Don’t you think we might learn from him?
This is a threat that you may be sorry you made. Be careful, girl.
While I sure don’t expect anyone here to hang on my every word, I wonder how you managed to miss the links to the evidence regarding the precise section you quoted:
[Emphasis added to the links]
Apparently too, you missed this:
[Emphasis added]
Debunking Chabad Fran:
https://www.unz.com/runz/hitler-churchill-the-holocaust-and-the-war-in-ukraine/?showcomments#comment-6129523
https://www.unz.com/runz/hitler-churchill-the-holocaust-and-the-war-in-ukraine/?showcomments#comment-6129501
https://www.unz.com/runz/hitler-churchill-the-holocaust-and-the-war-in-ukraine/?showcomments#comment-6128898
https://www.unz.com/runz/hitler-churchill-the-holocaust-and-the-war-in-ukraine/?showcomments#comment-6128857
https://www.unz.com/runz/hitler-churchill-the-holocaust-and-the-war-in-ukraine/?showcomments#comment-6128224
https://www.unz.com/runz/hitler-churchill-the-holocaust-and-the-war-in-ukraine/?showcomments#comment-6127357
Ridiculing Chabad Fran:
https://www.unz.com/runz/hitler-churchill-the-holocaust-and-the-war-in-ukraine/?showcomments#comment-6129588
https://www.unz.com/runz/hitler-churchill-the-holocaust-and-the-war-in-ukraine/?showcomments#comment-6128196
Your father recognized patterns.
Your grandfather recognized patterns.
Your grandfather’s father recognized.
Is it possible that many, many people recognize patterns but are constrained from acknowledging the importance and implications of these patterns, even to themselves?
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John%2020%3A19&version=NIV
Something E Michael Jones said: We have internalized the demands of our oppressors.
This website stimulates readers’s ‘pattern-recognition’ juices, and gives them the space to confront them.
Kindest regards.
Popeye said it best: I am what I am.
This is something I have pondered on as well; the myriad of allegations, some so bizarre or outlandish, you can hardly stop yourself from delving into it, as your first thought is, they wouldn’t possibly make something like this up? Well, as you know, yes, they would, and yes, they did. So, you delve in and find yourself all over the place, while in truth, the discovery of the first few falsehoods or impossibilities already turned your mind in the direction opposite the official story. I suppose we are all in different phases of the discovery process; I still argue, over and over, about the same details; right now, I just can’t stop myself.
I agree – so many good men wasted without issue, or children left fatherless. As you know, I am not a feminist, in the modern sense, but I do believe women are quite powerful, in their way, as nurturers and supporters of the men who must take ultimate responsibility for our societies. Some women can take leadership roles, of course, and some have no other choice but to do so; still, men are natural authority figures, whether today’s young women admit it or not. Boys/young men are being damaged by post-modernism mumbo-jumbo, as well as girls, and we all suffer for it. Lin Yutang has a rather poetic writing on the symbolic nature of man/woman: woman is water, man is clay, water permeates/molds clay, clay holds and gives substance to water. My experience is most good men do care for and instinctively protect women; if a woman is offended by a man holding a door open, she needs a bit of perspective.
This is true. I feel like we are at a point where potential leaders are sensing the danger? I don’t really know; Tucker Carlson recently said on a podcast, that he was completely oblivious to certain things happening in our government, culture, etc., but he still does not say what It is outright. He must know, but he does not say it. I watched Andrew Breitbart, single-handedly, clear an entire crowd of sign-holding whiners, by arguing with each of them over their silly slogans; they scurried off with their tails between their legs. It was magnificent. He was handsome, clever, self-deprecating, but more importantly, honest to a fault, politically incorrect, and a fearsome opponent in political debate. I jokingly remarked to a friend he would perish in a “plane crash.” He dies young; his coroner dies. What can I say?
Our education system is partly to blame for our “denials.” Critical thinking is neither taught nor encouraged. Gone are the days when teachers ask their students, “why do you think I am wrong?” or “why do you think you are correct?” I have always been an avid reader of history, mythology; I don’t think I’ve read a fictional novel in the last ten years, but this is my natural inclination, which I believe I inherited, so we’re back to the dearth of like offspring. It’s not nice to say, but we are being replaced by others not so generally inclined. In school, they can’t keep up, so standards are lowered, reading material is no longer “Homer/The Odyssey.” We may be doomed.
I have read some of Mein Kampf; I became concerned about the issue/translation, so I set it aside and it’s now in a box in the back of a storage room. I will return to it, but tying much of what he wrote to the success of Germany under his rule before the war did occur to me, eventually. The truth is, there must be some regulation to human societies; there must be a balance of freedom and obligation/duty. This can not be achieved with disparate populations living together. It can’t be achieved with a group eager to exploit freedoms meant for an “ethical” populace; I believe that has been the downfall of America. But, if we don’t know it, we can’t fix it. “They” have academia/media and the adulteration of our constitution. We may be doomed.
Thank you. I find myself asking, “Do I need to go here with this?” I will defy you, though, and put in a personal note: Tiptoe is fine; I chose that moniker because my grandmother used to dance and twirl around singing that song when I was little. She learned how to fly a prop plane because my grandfather teased her about women not being able to fly planes. She earned whatever the first provisional license is/was, but never flew again. She confided to me, she was terrified the entire time, and the boys could have it.
#1494 #1531 #1542 Tiptoethrutulips
“There were ethnic Germans in Poland; there were legitimate territorial claims by Germany. Hitler did try for a negotiated settlement. “
“I did claim the ethnic German element within the Danzig territory, as well as others, had been there for centuries, was once part of German territory, therefore Germany had a legitimate claim for possession.”
So why Germans conquered WHOLE POLAND if they wanted only Gdańsk (Danzig)?
And why Germans didn’t return to Poland territories with Polish minority living in Germany*?
Answer is, because Hitler wanted to make Lebensraum in Central and Eastern Europe. Gdańsk (Danzig) was only an excuse to start war.
For example, in 1942 over 100,000 Poles were expelled by Germans from Zamość area (240 km east south of Warsaw) and 300 Polish villages were partially or wholly destroyed by “cultural” Germans**.
—-
*
Polish minority in Germany in 1937 (dotted areas in East Prussia and Silesia)
** Ethnic cleansing of Zamojszczyzna by Nazi Germany”
“The ethnic cleansing of Zamojszczyzna by Nazi Germany (German: Aktion Zamosc,[4] also: Operation Himmlerstadt)[5] during World War II was carried out as part of a greater plan of forcible removal of the entire Polish populations from targeted regions of occupied Poland in preparation for the state-sponsored settlement of the ethnic German Volksdeutsche.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_cleansing_of_Zamojszczyzna_by_Nazi_Germany
With all due respect, however, it seems that you are a little confused
The term “Germanic” is not identical with the term “German”.
I wrote of Germanic tribes and not of German tribes who settled the areas between the rivers Elbe, Oder and Vistula already around the year 0. The first Slavs probably arrived in the 5th century at the earliest.
And regarding a “proof”, I had linked in my comment an interesting map from a Wikipedia article on East Germanic languages.
The following is a short excerpt from this English Wikipedia article
(Source:Wikipedia)
Concerning this statement of yours: …
…the following is my answer:
“Scandinavian” is mainly a geographical term and “Nordic” is again a code word to avoid the correct term “North Germanic”.
(Source: Wikipedia)
And as I mentioned earlier, the first Slavs did not penetrate Central Europe until several centuries later.
There is also an interesting map on Wikipedia on this matter:
And last but not least I find the following statement from you more than disconcerting: …
We Germans call our country Deutschland and our language deutsch, so what are we supposed to have stolen?
And of course German is a Germanic language, a West Germanic language to be more precise.
Not necessarily, Tiptoe, though really it depends what you mean by “we”.
Western Civilisation, as such, does appear to be doomed, as it is being demolished from within. But those who inhabit it have options available, to developed and grow new sociological, political and economic systems that, if we are wise and observant in our endeavours, can ensure our survival, as well as provide for our progeny a future in which they may flourish and reach their full potential as sentient, creative beings.
Not long ago I was reading John Wear’s “Germany’s War”, and it struck me that, with all of the effort and energy that went into formenting that war against National Socialism, that the NS system may well hold the key to the destruction of “the hegemon” (notwithstanding my own inclination toward Anarchism and freedom). Particularly because, over the years I’ve come to recognise that, at least under existing socio-economic systems, by and large, people “need” leadership as well as economic security.
But upon further reading and reflection, I realise that, even IF National Socialism could provide that “needed” leadership and security for sovereign nations, it would still be subject to the forces of globalisation and, of course, would only ever be as strong as any given leader. – Hitler appears to have been unique in his vision and exceptional his ability to lead, selflessly, for the greater good of his people. – Hence the caricature of the “evil Nazi dictator”.
So I have come to reject National Socialism as a solution, or even as a stepping-stone in the right direction. (Had Hitler succeeded, there would likely be no need for us to even have this conversation today. Sadly he, and his National Socialism, was crushed and cannot be revived in the current climate.)
And so, yes, Western Civ. is doomed. (I, for one, will not miss it.)
Anarchism, which has been propagandisticaly maligned at least as much as has N.Socialism, is a system characterised by cooperation, between individuals and groups, for mutual benefit. Therefore, as war approaches and western Civ is demolished, Anarchism becomes the mechanism by which we may retain our freedom and develop economic security, whilst ensuring our survival.
I’ve written on this forum several times about how that may be achieved: through cooperative enterprises from garden sharing, community “open space” gardens, seed sharing, and through the establishment of “community stores” (virtual or physical) within which members would give freely those resources (skills, time, produce, seeds, tools, materials, land, clothing, bedding, books, fuel, etc, etc, etc) that each individual is happy and comfortable giving (so that no-one feels exploited, or pressured into giving more than they are happy to give).
Such stores, operated on a “take only what you need, give only what you can” basis, would/could form the economic hub of the wider community, so that the economic needs of each member may be met locally. And as communities grow and become settled, so inter-communal, and eventually, inter-regional cooperation may be developed, so that through cooperative endeavours, not only can we survive, we may also come to thrive and to grow a whole new civilisation, without exploitation.
Of course an inherent feature of all such community initiatives is that one may choose with whom one wishes to associate, so that naturally, one would not enter into or develop a community with people one does not trust or feel an affinity with. (I call this the “birds of a feather” safeguard.) This seems to be of particular concern/importance within North America, thanks to the hatred and fear that has been ferociously instituted there.
Thankfully, for many years, intrepid folk have been developing off-grid, anti-establishment projects and communities all over the western world, because we recognised, early on, the need to do so. That means that there is masses of information and inspiration available to the huge numbers of people exiting (both physically and mentally/emotionally) the matrix since the first plandemic was unleashed.
Rather than “leadership” and in place if any kind of authoritarian hierarchy, we offer insight, guidance and the fruits of our experiences, to anyone seeking solutions.
Personally, I have searched for alternatives to slavery to a psychopathic regime, and alternatives to Anarchism (so that people may continue to be sheep if they wish), listened to and read the propositions of others, historic and contemporary… But given the shortness of time available now, even if a system such as N.Socialism could be instituted (which I don’t think it can), our societies are no longer “national” entities, but are multicultural messes that cannot be fixed by conventional thinking.
The globalised economic order IS set to destroy what little freedom is currently “enjoyed” by the people. But if pockets of free, sentient, self-reliant groups can survive outside of the control of globalised psychopathy, then “we” may not be doomed after are, and our children may live to free the children of the enslaved masses. Or better yet, if enough people come to their senses in time, then the globalised slave system may be avoided all together.
That’s why I do what I do. – And why I gave up my bricks and mortar home to do it.
With love,
Kali.
fufu, you have got to get off Wikipedia!
I’m not saying, nothing is accurate, but the information is clearly biased. Wikipedia is like the mainstream media.
A bit off our topic – English is a Germanic language, as well.
As I have repeatedly wondered (and written), Russia invaded Poland, as well, yet you seem perfectly fine with that invasion. To make you happy, I found this on Wikipedia:
*The roots of Polish history can be traced to ancient times, when the territory of present-day Poland was settled by various tribes including Celts, Scythians, Germanic clans, Sarmatians, Slavs and Balts.
*I have seen this information from various sources, so it appears to be accurate.
The German Empire, established in 1871 as an expanded version of the Prussian state, aimed at the assimilation of its eastern provinces inhabited by Poles. At the same time, St. Petersburg attempted to russify the former Congress Poland, joining Berlin in levying restrictions against use of the Polish language and cultural expression.
The Treaty of Versailles that emerged from the conference set up an independent Polish nation with an outlet to the sea, but left some of its boundaries to be decided by plebiscites. The largely German-inhabited Free City of Danzig was granted a separate status that guaranteed its use as a port by Poland.
Wikipedia says the city of Danzig was largely German-inhabited. Also from Wikipedia – In 1938, the Free City’s population of 410,000 was 98% German, 1% Polish and 1% other.
There is much information from neutral sources confirming attacks on Germans by Poles prior to WW2. There is also information about diplomatic efforts to resolve conflicts in that area. I submit, when diplomatic efforts fail and war is declared, then all bets are off and the chips fall where they may. If war is forced, the victors take what they want.
In reading on Polish history, there seems to be so much turmoil it’s nearly impossible to understand it with only a cursory review. The conflict with Germany is just a drop in the bucket, but it’s the most recent, and as usual, Germany/Germans are always The Most At Fault.
In America, there was a professor from Arizona, half German/half Comanche, who lectured Americans on their conquest guilt. He said, “You didn’t do anything to us we weren’t already doing to each other. The question is, what do we do now?” He also said we should vigorously protect our borders, otherwise, “Welcome to the reservation!” His name was David Yeagley.
Get off of Wikipedia, fufu.
Thank you for your observations. I have had a few conversations on Unz about “anarchy,” and chucking it all away in defiance of western authority, and said authority is somewhat out of control in some areas, but for me, I would not choose an anarchistic lifestyle.
For some reason, I thought you lived on a farm in the English countryside, like something from an Austen novel. But, I’ll remark briefly on the current situation in England/France. I’m sure you are aware of the grooming gangs, knife attacks, etc. That situation occurred due to the large influx of a disparate group, hostile to western civilization, and the retraction of law enforcement for political “correctness” and an effort to prevent stereotypes against certain people. That’s utter nonsense. Stereotypes exist because they are generally true.
France is constantly in flames; areas of Paris look like slums, Notre Dame was set alight. My daughter was there just last month; she said police sirens wailed all night, every night. Rape, gang rape is rampant. Welcome to America and multiculturalism.
In America, we see what is happening, and has been happening, when certain groups do not fear law enforcement nor consequences of their behavior. Cities and schools have been ruined by people unable to function in western societies. There are no-go zones all over America, and now Europe.
You can not have multiculturalism and peace. If we’re mixing Germans and Swedes, sure. Human nature is what it is. War is one thing; roving gangs of predators, preying on unsuspecting children/elderly, and just about everyone else, is quite another thing. There are too many disparate groups in America and Europe. Those groups WILL NOT abide by the notion of community peace and tranquility through shared cooperation. They will take what they want, and they do.
Look up the Knoxville Horror or Wichita Massacre; there are countless examples of these crimes in America, all of which are not reported in the national media. All people from all groups have criminal elements within, but there are measurable differences in percentages and degree of criminality, and specifically, savage violence.
In order to stay somewhat on the thread topic, I have certainly observed that Jewish groups are astronomically over represented in changes to immigration laws, open border proponents, minority elevation efforts to undermine white majorities – you name it, they’re doing it, so there’s that.
I am glad you are finding peace in your chosen lifestyle and you certainly deserve it. I hope you continue to thrive and avoid multicultural hellscapes. For all my rambling, I think anarchy would give too much more license to already dangerous and hostile people in America and Europe.
Indeed, we all are. And wouldn’t we all prefer to do “what we do” and “as we please,” without anyone pushing us to do more than we want. I’m certainly that way. I’m glad that I’m 82 and by my own reckoning I have only 10.5 more years in this physical life. I’m ready, I can tell you. Even though life is great now and I’m enjoying it, it’s largely bc I don’t feel responsible for fixing any of our perceived problems. You say you are quite old also, thus probably feel much the same.
But the majority of others are younger, still have skin in the game. Yet they mostly don’t even know of the danger, and, to an increasing degree believe they can live for themselves with no thought for the future, for anyone. The globalists will gladly help our race along in its death wish. In my heart of hearts, I agree with Tiptoe that we are doomed. Why? Because anyone who has the intelligence to “think” through a problem realizes the signs and the numbers show an inevitability. I don’t think the future will be kind, though. It won’t be the anarchist’s dream of cooperation among the colors of the rainbow and freedom & plenty for all. More like the “glorious’ revolution of the bolshevics in Russia. That’s where modern political correctness was born, under the Zionist flag. We ain’t seen nothin’ yet.
Do you know you’re talking to a machine? Or a programed robot who uses Wikipedia bc it has the false, pro-Poland pages, along with the false, pro-Jewish/Holocaust/Israel pages he wants? You write to him as if he is persuadable, or is seeking the truth of history. No! So why bother? Because you learn more as you’re doing it? That’s a possible reason.
I never said any such thing, I deny it, so you are required to quote and link to that “conversation.” I think I know what you’re referring to, and getting wrong.
You are surely mischaracterizing whatever that was about, so provide the exact quote and link to what you are “recalling” from our “first encounter.”
Without those two items, all you’ve done is to reveal more of your mental disorder for which you still need treatment/therapy. I know alcoholism, and I know getting sober is not the end of your problems. You admit you’re still medicating yourself with ‘weed’. You are also addicted to this website. Ever think of that?
In fact, I do learn as I go along.
We are in quite the quagmire, aren’t we? As European peoples, that is.
I hop on the China threads when I’m weary of sparring over Jews, and let me tell you, they are pissed at Americans and the English, in general. With only a very few exceptions, they are intelligent, well informed, and often exceedingly willing to concede points rather graciously; they rarely engage in the slugfests like the bellicose Europeans/Americans. I think our bellicosity was our benefit and our undoing, as this nature was exploited by infiltrators from within.
East Asians are preserving much of their culture whilst innovating and modernizing and maintaining beautiful public works, etc. (I don’t want any flack from anyone else about communism or the Chinese government…..(I’m not speaking to you, CY)…take it up with the Chinese commenters) I warn them repeatedly, keep your countries majority East Asian, by an enormous degree. They tell me I’m an insufferable racist.
Web commenters do inform those seeking information from neutral sources, i.e., people who don’t earn their living exclusively through providing news/information. Of course, there are scholars/historians still saying what’s true (when they’re not in jail) – I think you are in that category, and I have learned from you as well.
Regarding our “doom,” I was secretly hoping you would say, “Young(ish) lady! You are wrong!” I don’t think history is on our side, but you never know…..
Carolyn Yeager
2,888 Comments • 501,200 Words
Thanks for your reply. I thoroughly enjoyed it (inc. about your grandmother), didn’t fully agree with everything but with a substantial amount. I like the general drift of your thought and expression. This, I really want to comment on:
If we don’t say these things, we are doomed! It’s because we don’t say it, can’t say it, that we got into this doomed situation! We have got to stop with the Nice and go with the Truth at all cost. If the truth seems unkind, it’s bc we’ve been distorted by Social Consciousness: good manners and treat all with respect, etc. The South is especially known for that. And there’s nothing like being the recipient of the kind consideration of Southerns, I’ll give you that. I have enjoyed it for a good portion of my life. It’s not natural to me though. I naturally want to dig into things and expose what I find. I’m not satisfied with the surface appearance, esp when something is “not right.”
As to Mein Kampf, the translations don’t really vary enough to make a big difference, imo. I’ve only read the Murphy and the Dalton translations, both of which are okay but I much prefer the Dalton for Americans. Dalton introduced the side by side English-German versions so his translation can be checked by the reader. Many say the Stalag is the best, which could very well be but I have never had that one, so have no opinion. I have a summarized series of posts at my website of Vol. One and Two by Dalton that gives the main points, revealing at least what he did and didn’t say. https://carolynyeager.net/mkvoli and https://carolynyeager.net/mkvolii
Cordially …
> Kristallnacht was a disaster for Germany.
But it was a blessing for Himmler and the SS. That is why the most plausible explanation behind the event is that Hitler and Himmler jointly conspired to manipulate Goebbels into creating a riot which discredit the SA and allow the SS to take decisive control. Nor is it true that Crystal Night created any real disaster for Germany. That came when Hitler occupied Czechia and forced Slovakia to request a German protectorate, all in violation of the Munich Agreement. If Hitler had simply observed the Munich Agreement, then Chamberlain would have supported his claims on Danzig, and no one would have cared about the Night of Broken Glass.
Crystal Night very likely was a conspiracy. But it was a conspiracy within the top apparatus of the Third Reich. Not anything involving outsiders.
> Jews were the only members of a group who could have known about and been prepared and ready in advance to launch the response to it that occurred.
Ernst vom Rath was shot in the morning on November 7 and died more than 48 hours later on November 9. That allows plenty of time for different parties to make plans. If anything, to the extent that one is agreed on waiting until after vom Rath’s death before the riots begin, Goebbels would have better access to prompt information that any foreign Jews abroad.
Hi Tiptoe,
I intended to include something on “law” and “order” in my previous comment, but it grew quite long enough without.
What I’ve described so far is a simple approach to economics (putting food on the table, clothes on our backs and rooves over our heads). Of course there is more to life: education, questions of “order”, settlement of disputes, questions of autonomy, shared resources…
But first, what you say about Britian and Europe is absolutely true. I’ll be surprised if civil war, both here and there (the US) is avoided.
And this is the crux of the matter:
But Anarchism (I call it that because the word “anarchy” has been propagandised to the point that it’s meaning has been inverted) is a system without hierarchy, without “rulers”, but not without rules.
Of course the individual’s and the communities right to self-defence, to repel attacks and to guard against theft, etc, is paramount.
My own thinking on the matter is that each member of the community should receive and practice military or marshal training as part of their education, so that, as and when the need arises, we can defend ourselves. And as we developed our new cooperative systems, so we may join with other communities for broader, including regional, defence as needed too.
As I said, without rulers, not without rules, so community councils (counsels), with due respect for the acquired wisdom, knowledge and life experience of elders, knowledge gained in specific areas, etc, for the settlement of internal disputes, and to address external threats, would form the basic political body, to provide order and security. Each with a voice (in an ideal world, with the man of the house speaking for his family).
Ultimately, what I envision is communities of autonomous households, each with its own plot of land to cultivate, each with access to communal resources and commons, each contributing what they can for the good of the whole, including to the education of the children (with the full involvement of the parents/mother), training (including military/marshal) and skill-sharing, welfare in terms of food, home maintenance, and the like, for the less able-bodied (who also have plenty to contribute, regardless of physical strength/ability). With peace, harmony, security and necessary defence developed through cooperation and settlement of disputes through community councils. (And should a form of natural aristocracy arise through that process, as the dust of civil war settles, then so be it. – Doubtless in centuries to come a natural aristocracy would be replaced by an oligarchy, and future generations can start the same shit-show we face today all over again! 🙃)
All of that said, dear Tiptoe, because you are in Texas, I’m reminded of another commenter there, Mefobills (his commenting has slowed down over the last year or so, but he is still around), a brilliant economist, with a deep knowledge of, and admiration for N.Socialism and for the economic policies of the same. – Iirc, he is also in South Texas. – I hope that you encounter him, and that you find a way to communicate outside of UR (maybe through “burner” email accounts) because I think you have a great deal in common and may be of considerable help to each other and your respective local communities (in the traditional sense) as the shtf.
We each have to do what fits with our individual circumstances, local environments and perspectives.
I hope that I have given some food for thought in these breef outlines (one day I may write a whole manifesto) and that, as our respective societies and economies devolve, we may all find ways to develop new, non-coercive, political, economic and social systems, so that the next civilisation we create will be a joy and a benefit to ALL of it’s members.
Oh! Nearly forgot: on “multiculturalism”, all association within Anarchism is voluntary. – “Don’t hate, separate!”… And repel marauders. 😊 And never give an economic or “moral” foothold to the Talmudists or Holocaustians!
With love,
Kali
“Herrenvolk” was the term that was used. Strictly speaking, a raw translation would be more like “master folk.” However, the term “volk” as used in NSDAP-propaganda always had racial connotations so that translating it into English this way is misleading. “Master race” is the best English approximation to “Herrenvolk.”
As wrong as you conflating the description “traveller” with the Roma ethnicity?
As wrong as you going off, half cocked, in fit if anti-Roma prejudice?
As wrong as you conflating the notion of “honest work” with paying taxes to support your own oppression?
As wrong as you assuming that the children of Gypsy families deserve, or should expect abuse because of their ethnicity?
As wrong as you wishing to euthanize those you deem to be less intelligent than you, despite that you are a political moron who proudly funds her ideological enemies through tax extortion?
As wrong as you imagining that a high “g” factor measurement equates to superior intelligence?
As wrong as you refusing to submit your past work to Ron for publication here, where it would gain a much wider audience and could be of help in setting the historic record straight, so that National Socialism may be revived as a credible alternative to globalism/international-communism, because you are “fussy”?
As wrong as you trolling your intellectual)ideological comrades on this forum in order to feel yourself superior to them?
As wrong as you thinking voting for Trump will help achieve anything but accelerating the advance of tyranny?
Or as wrong as you getting for yourself a companion animal that will more than likely outlive you, and so be left alone once you depart this life, whilst there are so many older animals in need of loving homes?
Shall I go on?
Kali Prajita.
Addendum: On “law”:
The system of law currently practiced in the west is adversarial, coercive, often oppressive, hierarchical, top-heavy, dogmatic, prohibitively expensive (particularly for the redress of civil disputes), infantalises the general public, is punitive but not corrective, and “politically correct” to the extent that it does not protect against crime.
Sometimes bad people are sent to prison, sometimes good but misguided people are. Sometimes entirely innocent people are criminalised for questioning the authority of tyrants. And etc.
Police enforce policy, generate revenue, and feed the bureaucracy, but seldom protect the public from crime, including “white collar” crime, which is seldom policed.
In short, it is not fit for purpose, and we can do better.
Love,
Kali.
Where are the quotes and links to them? Failure to produce only shows that you are a fraud.
I understand your overall point, but…
Yes, law is adversarial; plaintiff vs. defendant, prosecution vs. defense. Life is often adversarial; burglar vs. homeowner, driver vs. carjacker, business vs. shoplifter, farmer vs. rabbits, Black Friday after Thanksgiving……
Hierarchies exist everywhere in life; in nature, a struggle for dominance, resources is an everyday battle. Though one may choose voluntary cooperation, what is to be done about those who voluntarily choose to take what does not belong to them? One will find himself/herself unable to focus on everyday matters for a constant need to mount a defense, and thusly, official law/rule enforcement is established and off we go to established hierarchies.
National Socialism is meant for a “like” people; not every population could manage it. The success achieved after its application in Germany attests to the possibilities of balancing freedom/duty. America, perhaps the most “free” nation on earth, moved along quite well when the entire population was alike. Certainly not without faults, as all people are somewhat flawed, the initial prohibitions of allowing certain groups within and international entanglements were thwarted, and here we are.
Again, I wish you much deserved happiness and success in your community. I hope you defy us “doubters” and forgive us when we sail over seeking refuge from Transformed America/Europe, as per that Ghoul Barbara Spectre said, The Transformation Must Take Place.
Well, isn’t it a shame, Carolyn, that you and I are back in the mud. It’s true that I am partly to blame this time, as you did manage to provoke more than one emotional response from me.
But I’m feeling back to my usual, cheerful objectivity, back to setting the world to rights, as is my want.
So I’m now giving you a choice. We can either go back to some form of peaceful coexistence on this forum, or I can go ahead and post the comment I’ve just composed, which I don’t think you’ll like. Or maybe I’ll compose another, equally destructive.
Personally, I would prefer peaceful coexistence, or at least a veneer of the same. But it’s up to you.
You have the choice to stop pushing. I recommend you take it, so that you/we/this forum can deal with more pertinent, less personal matters, and you and I can refrain from causing one another undue pain.
Kali.
Dear Kali,
Please accept this bit of personal, albeit unsolicited, advice.
Historians/scholars must always use very specific, very literal verbiage/diction in their writing, as they are subjected to intense scrutiny. Any personal or emotional-type references springs the door wide open for accusations of emotional, therefore non-objective, attachment to the subject matter. I imagine old habits die hard. I also imagine anyone who defends Hitler or National Socialism, in a public/official manner, is subjected to a wrath not experienced by scholars of any other historical subject, so maybe a little “prickly” countenance develops.
You have been through so much in your life; don’t bring any further conflict into your world, if possible. Does this “fight” have any real significance to your life? Sometimes “winning” is just not as important as it seems, especially if it really doesn’t matter in the long run. It stirs up old wounds, and I say this from personal experience. Let it go.
Best Regards.
#1551 Valjean72
“The first Slavs probably arrived in the 5th century at the earliest.”
“And as I mentioned earlier, the first Slavs did not penetrate Central Europe until several centuries later.”
This allochtonic theory (arrival of Slavs to Europe in Vth century), made up by German “scientists” has no sense.
Small tribe of Slavs couldn’t populate half of Europe.
Slavs must be numerous in V century to cover half of Europe.
To become huge tribe in V century, Slavs needed time. 700-1000 years I think.
Therefore Slav’s origin can be easily moved back to III BC or further.
It means that Slavs lived in Germania (area between Elbe and Vistula rivers) long before German ethnos (ancestors of modern day Germans) has been formed.
“East Germanic languages”
Explain, what East Germanic languages are?
In my opinion, East Germanic languages were mainly Slavic language in I AD.
““Scandinavian” is mainly a geographical term and “Nordic” is again a code word to avoid the correct term “North Germanic”.”
My theory (nobody needs to agree with it) is that Germans are descendants of Celts, Nordics and Slavs.
Scandinavians/Nordic people weren’t emigrants from Germany, Germans were descendants of Scandinavians (and Celts, and Slavs).
Therefore (in my opinion), more correct term should be that German language is a Scandinavian/Nordic language.
What a douchebag McNally is. “Strickly speaking”, Herrenvolk means “Gentlemen”. As in civilized, trustworthy and honorable. Instead he perverts this into meaning “Master Race”. He is an accessory to the genocide of Germany.
No wonder Ron Unz had this to say about ((McNally)):
I’m in full agreement, dear Tiptoe, though with a little added insight into the realm of WW2 revisionism and it’s inherent obstacles. Thank you.
Naturally I’ve been giving this a lot of thought, and concluded last night that the reasons I reached out to build bridges with Ms Yeager in the first place still stand. When she is on topic, and not being too “school ma’amish” then she has a great deal to offer and, ironically, to teach.
I dear say this thread is drawing to a natural end as generally, when threads become this long, they become very slow, laggy and, for some, almost impossible to comment on. Yet it has remained interesting, relevant and important (emotional spats notwithstanding).
I agree, it’s better to let go of personal animosity and vitriolic attrition. The subject itself is much more important than either myself or Carolyn. Plus, I think we’re both too old and (emotionality aside) too mature for flame wars.
So there’s that. 🙈🙉🙊
Many thanks, with love,
Kali.
#1553 Tiptoethrutulips
“As I have repeatedly wondered (and written), Russia invaded Poland, as well, yet you seem perfectly fine with that invasion. “
I’m not sure what Russification of Poland had to do with Germanization of Poland.
Tsardom Russia wanted to russify Poles so Germans are innocent?
“There is much information from neutral sources confirming attacks on Germans by Poles prior to WW2.”
Can you provide some examples of those alleged “attacsk on Germans by Poles”? Places, names etc.
“Wikipedia says the city of Danzig was largely German-inhabited. Also from Wikipedia – In 1938, the Free City’s population of 410,000 was 98% German, 1% Polish and 1% other. “
Then why Hitler conquered WHOLE POLAND and CZECHOSLOVAKIA instead ONLY territories with German minorities?
You avoid asnwering simple questions.
You acknowledged that the Soviet Union invaded Poland as well as Germany.
Then you claim that: “…Then why Hitler conquered WHOLE POLAND…”. (capitals by you).
Logic is obviously not your ability.
How many Poles were killed by the “humanitarian” Soviets?
For attacks on Germans by Poles read “Polish Atrocities Against the German Minority in Poland”. There is another book on this topic by a Hungarian author whose name I forgot.
The point you seem to be missing (or just ignoring) is that Poland was invaded by TWO countries, yet you decry one invader as monstrous and the other as beneficial. There is a legitimate argument to be made on behalf of Germany’s claim for the Danzig or Polish Corridor, as ethnic Germans were/had been residing therein for centuries. That Danzig was populated almost entirely by Germans is not in dispute. It is also true that throughout centuries past, Germans were invited in by nobility or royalty due to their industriousness and success in agriculture, therefore their presence therein was not entirely due to conquest.
From Inconvenient History:
British Ambassador Nevile Henderson in Berlin was concentrating on obtaining recognition from Halifax of the cruel fate of the German minority in Poland. Henderson emphatically warned Halifax on August 24, 1939, that German complaints about the treatment of the German minority in Poland were fully supported by the facts. […]
On August 25, 1939, Ambassador Henderson reported to Halifax the latest Polish atrocity at Bielitz, Upper Silesia. Henderson never relied on official German statements concerning these incidents, but instead based his reports on information he received from neutral sources. The Poles continued to forcibly deport the Germans of that area, and compelled them to march into the interior of Poland. Eight Germans were murdered and many more were injured during one of these actions.
Polish atrocities against ethnic Germans have been documented in the book Polish Acts of Atrocity against the German Minority in Poland. Most of the outside world dismissed this book as nothing more than propaganda used to justify Hitler’s invasion of Poland. However, skeptics failed to notice that forensic pathologists from the International Red Cross and medical and legal observers from the United States verified the findings of these investigations of Polish war crimes.[…]
The book Polish Acts of Atrocity against the German Minority in Poland stated:
When the first edition of this collection of documents went to press on November 17, 1939, 5,437 cases of murder committed by soldiers of the Polish army and by Polish civilians against men, women and children of the German minority had been definitely ascertained. It was known that the total when fully ascertained would be very much higher. Between that date and February 1, 1940, the number of identified victims mounted to 12,857. At the present stage investigations disclose that in addition to these 12,857, more than 45,000 persons are still missing. Since there is no trace of them, they must also be considered victims of the Polish terror. Even the figure 58,000 is not final. There can be no doubt that the inquiries now being carried out will result in the disclosure of additional thousands dead and missing.[54]
Medical examinations of the dead showed that Germans of all ages, from four months to 82 years of age, were murdered. The report concluded:
It was shown that the murders were committed with the greatest brutality and that in many cases they were purely sadistic acts—that gouging of eyes was established and that other forms of mutilation, as supported by the depositions of witnesses, may be considered as true.
The method by which the individual murders were committed in many cases reveals studied physical and mental torture; in this connection several cases of killing extended over many hours and of slow death due to neglect had to be mentioned.
Are you familiar with the Polish/German Non-Aggression Treaty of January 26, 1934?
The aforementioned publication, Polish Acts of Atrocities….is available on-line. Read it. Fact-check it.
Well, he didn’t conquer all of Poland in 1939. Didn’t the Russians, those angels of mercy, slip in through the back door? I’m no military strategist, but I imagine if you go to the extraordinary effort and expense of an invasion, particularly if you are provoked, and suffering the death of your soldiers, upon defeat of your enemy, you don’t just turn around and go home, nor do you offer the same terms of cooperation that were previously rejected.
Did the Germans kill those polish officers/officials/intellectuals in the forest? Who killed them, fufu? Why kill the “best and brightest” of a nation?
I don’t think that’s true.
Dear Carolyn, Tiptoe, and whomever it concerns,
Earlier in this thread I made a big deal about “self moderation”, and then proceeded to blow my own. Reasons and excuses are irrelevant. I blew my cool, and that is that. And so I apologise to each of you; especially to you, Carolyn.
Because I do find your (Carolyn’s) perspective and deep knowledge regarding National Socialism, Hitler’s Germany and the Third Reich important, I have decided that, from now on, I will make a conscious effort* to not interfere with your comments addressed to others.
I notice that there’s a new article on this website who’s subject is National Socialism in America, I believe (I’ve not done more than scan the headline in my way to write this comment). I want you to know that if you decide to participate in the comment thread below it, that you can do so without fear of interference from me.
Tangentially, I feel I may have distressed others with mental images of my own childhood that I sincerely hope don’t overly alarm you. I want you to know that those things happened many years ago and that, though of course they have had a huge impact on my life, they do not define who (or how) I am today. – I take my healing journey very seriously, and have faced those things I needed to face, in order to let go of, or undo, their impact on me. So, where that skinny eight year old once stood, now I stand; I remain the strongest woman I know. Therefore, please rest assured that healing, even from extreme trauma, is possible for those who consciously choose to do the inner work, and face the facts (snot and tears may alchemically fuse to make a balm for one’s soul). Of course, constant vigilance is necessary, watching for the self-indulgence of a wounded ego. The journey continues…
I think that’s all I wanted to say. – It has been a morning of constant interruptions here on the mountain, and now I must go and attend to other matters.
Love and best wishes to all,
Kali.
#1575 HdC
“Then you claim that: “…Then why Hitler conquered WHOLE POLAND…”. (capitals by you).
Logic is obviously not your ability.”
Germans took half of Poland in 1939 and second half in 1941 after starting war with Soviet Union.
Half and half means WHOLE POLAND.
Why you don’t know basic facts about World War II?
May I check your knowledge about WWII?
Did you know that Germans killed over 100,000 of educated Poles during war in planned action?
Did you know that Germans expelled 100,000 Poles from Zamość region in 1943?
Did you know that Germans deliberately destroyed Warsaw to the ground after 1944 Uprising?
Did you know that Germans robbed 500,000 artefacts of Polish culture?
#1576 Tiptoethrutulips
“The point you seem to be missing (or just ignoring) is that Poland was invaded by TWO countries, yet you decry one invader as monstrous and the other as beneficial.”
You constantly try to redirect Reader’s attention from bestiality of Germans during WWII by introducing off topics (Soviet’s crimes, Allie’s crimes).
Very silly tactics. Germans were beasts during WWII.
“There is a legitimate argument to be made on behalf of Germany’s claim for the Danzig or Polish Corridor, as ethnic Germans were/had been residing therein for centuries. “
Why Hitler conquered WHOLE POLAND, CZECHOSLOVAKIA if his only concern was German minorities in Gdańsk (Danzig) and part small part of Czechoslovakia?
Can you answer such simple question or you will play dumb again?
“Polish atrocities against ethnic Germans have been documented (…)”
Do you have real and original evidences other than words of pro-Nazi writers? Mass graves, documents from Polish authorities planning extermination of Germans, evidences that killed Germans were innocent civilians and not spies, saboteurs, criminals etc.?
No, you don’t have ones.
Why you repeat lies?
If we’re going to go into rigid descriptions of words, then “herr” was often translated as “lord.” Of course, a word like “gentlemen” was classically reserved for people who had some social status. The average German peasant was not a “gentleman” or a “herr” in any sense. The idea of the “Herrenvolk” was that the German race would actually claim a higher status for itself over the Slavic subhumans whose land would now go to the higher race.
The rest of your garbage is just an illustration of how a very crude rambling ideologue can rely on quotes from a slightly suave rambling ideologue to sound mildly coherent. That’s your dependency on such silly quotes.
That booklet of German propaganda is based on at least a 10-fold exaggeration of anything that really happened. For actual historical details see Orphans of Versailles by Richard Blanke for details. Moreover:
1) Although there had been economic pressures placed upon the German minority in Poland before the war broke out, there were no massacres occurring until the early days of September. The number of victims of such massacres as really happened was never remotely close to the 58,000 claimed in German propaganda. The only real issue is whether the number of German minority victims once the war began was closer to 2000 or 5800.
2) Beyond that, one should be clear that the major efforts to shut Germans out of parts of the Polish economy began after the occupation of Czechia on March 15. There had been earlier attempts to pressure what was seen in Poland as an economically privileged German minority, but this beyond what Mussolini had done with South Tyrol Germans in earlier years. Hitler was able to work things out with Mussolini because his aims of conquest were centered on the east, so he didn’t see any reason to fight over South Tyrol. If had not had his larger aims, then tensions over German minorities in Czechoslovakia and Poland could have been handled in the same way. But this was never Hitler’s aim.
I think I point out that ALL PEOPLE ARE BEASTS DURING WAR, IN GENERAL. And, yes, some are more beastly than others. Case in point – The Bolsheviks, the Soviets, and Ilya Ehrenburg. I just read a statement on Ehrenburg from a Jewish publication: “His incendiary writings certainly contributed in no small measure to the orgy of murder and rape by Soviet soldiers against German civilians.”
Are you seriously suggesting to me, that Poles/Poland neither committed beastly acts against nor provoked Germans/Germany before a declaration of war?
I have answered this question.
Alright, please reveal your direct, original, forensic evidence that supports your claims. Do not supply Polish sources. (although I did provide sources from Americans/Red Cross, no?)
Why you don’t answer questions regarding:
Who murdered polish people in Katyn Forest and why?
Why did Polish people want Jews out of Poland?
I do not doubt exaggerations occur, sometimes deliberately and/or sometimes mistakenly during estimations. Sometimes, I think journalists exaggerate to weave a more interesting tale, or because they are advocating for a particular side, which is why I seek multiple sources and eyewitness testimony, on camera, when possible, before arriving at a conclusion.
A perfect example of deliberate exaggeration for deceit would be: six million murdered; fire pits in swampland into which living children were ripped and tossed; gassing 3,000 people in 5 minutes with insecticide, soap made of human fat…..
I am unfamiliar with The Orphans of Versailles. Are you familiar with Hellstorm, The Death of Nazi Germany? I ask only to suggest innocent civilians/children suffer for what happens when their governments make war, whether for justifiable reasons or not.
Unlike most anti-Germany commenters appear or relate, I do peruse sources from the opposing side. I will read The Orphans of Versailles.
#1582 Tiptoethrutulips
“Are you seriously suggesting to me, that Poles/Poland neither committed beastly acts against nor provoked Germans/Germany before a declaration of war?”
So, you don’t have real proofs that Poles had been killing Germans before 1 September 1939 (places, names).
I expected that.
“I think I point out that ALL PEOPLE ARE BEASTS DURING WAR, IN GENERAL”
It’s all about proportions (you remember that we discussed “rule of proportions”?).
Germans murdered tens of milions of people. It can’t be compared to any atrocities committed by other nations to Germans.
“Why Hitler conquered WHOLE POLAND, CZECHOSLOVAKIA if his only concern was German minorities in Gdańsk (Danzig) and part small part of Czechoslovakia?
I have answered this question.”
No, you didn’t. You fled like a hare.
“Alright, please reveal your direct, original, forensic evidence that supports your claims. “
You are again fleeing like a hare. We are talking about alleged Polish crimes. You don’t have real evidences about alleged Polish crimes. You only cite some pro-Nazi writers.
” (although I did provide sources from Americans/Red Cross, no?)”
I asked about original documents. You didn’t provide them. Where are they placed? Who made them? Another pro-Nazi Americans?
“Do not supply Polish sources.”
“An eye for an eye”.
Prove alleged Polish crimes not using documents prepared by pro-Nazi men.
Why you repeat lies? Why you love Nazi-Germany which caused death over 60 mln of people?
Herrlich = Heavenly, Splendid
Lying Jews like yourself just love to warp and abuse language the same way you abuse the truth.
The rest of my “garbage” was direct quotes about you from Ron Unz. He has invited you to take your lying spam somewhere else on numerous occasions. Instead you keep coming back with your hasbara lies.
Once again, here are some direct quotes by Ron Unz concerning your cavalier attitude to the truth:
Is that 6 million Jews or 60 million people? Or, 60 million Jews?
This entire exchange has been an exercise in futility. So, ok Little Bunny fufu, you are correct. Hitler arrived to power and said, “The Jews are ruining it for everyone!” So, he kicked the Big Jews out, and then, as if by some miracle, Prosperity arrived to Germany! (like Manna from Heaven?) Who knew?
Everything was moving along just fine. No more sex clubs, no more pornographic literature, no more unemployment, no more starvation, no more excruciating debt, no more groveling, no more vulture capitalism (aka Jews favored business practices). Of course, during all this prosperity, Jews were rattling sabers, for fear the rest of the world might notice what happens when the big Jews get kicked to the curb. The economic boycott and the “holy war” was, in fact, declared by Judea before Hitler touched a single curly-cue Jewish hair on any jewish head, but who cares? The Jews ARE NOT TO BE THWARTED EVER.
So, after about 6 years of economic and social prosperity, which always seems to occur when “Jews run like hares from their central banking lairs,” Hitler decided, “Let’s start a war, for no good reason! Who really wants peace and prosperity when those Poles in Poland are such good boys and girls, yet every peace treaty or offer of reconciliation is denied, denied denied!” And, the rest is history.
I find your circular arguments frustrating and a waste of time.
I find your refusal to answer questions about the Katyn Forest massacre evidence of your hypocrisy.
I also wonder why you refuse to address the “Jewish Question” that vexed the Poles just as it did the Germans. Aren’t there laws in Poland now that prohibit inquiry in this area of history?
I love Nazi-Germany because I look around Europe/America/Middle East and see the fruits of Jewish perfidy everywhere, just as Hitler predicted. Assassinations, false flag/terror attacks (USS Liberty/911), never ending wars, relentless immigration…..I understand Poland has been desperately trying to avoid all the “diversity” inflicted upon other European countries and America. If you think Jewish organizations have no involvement in this, such as Soros/Spectre, you are mistaken. This level and source of immigration will ruin your society.
If you are an ethnic Pole, I say, fight the UN and keep the immigrants out. I also say, please get off Wikipedia and look for other sources of information. If you are a Jew, go pound sand, preferably in Israel, where you belong. Millions of gentiles died so you could have it. If I were in charge, I’d send every last one of you to your desert paradise and keep you there forever more.
fufu, I will also point out a striking contradiction to the Jewish oppression narrative – I have listened to many Shoah Foundation interviews. So far, with only one (1) exception, every Jewish witness describes a prosperous, happy life in POLAND AND GERMANY, before 1939. Does that make sense to you?
It’s not some hidden reality that the German population suffered vengeful retributions from enraged Slavs at the end of the war. What is at issue here is the claim that somehow Hitler’s invasion of Poland was motivated by humanitarian concerns over Danzig.
“It is not Danzig that is at stake. For us it is a matter of expanding our living space in the East…”
— May 23 protocol taken down by Schmundt from Hitler’s dictation.
It was in that context that a decision had been made to press Poland to the limit with the expectation that they would either submit to terms which allowed their country to be used as a base for a further drive to the east into Russia, or else provide a convenient excuse for a war in which half of Poland would be immediately conquered and the rest taken later. Nothing in Hitler recorded archives suggests that he was ever motivated by a concern over human rights of Danzigers.
> So, he kicked the Big Jews out, and then, as if by some miracle, Prosperity arrived to Germany!
Another falsehood. Germany’s economy began to recover in 1932, mainly as a consequence of the Allies agreeing to cancel the reparations owed over the Versailles Treaty. This allowed the German financial sector to begin recovery in 1932. It usually for such a recovery to translate over into a rise in jobs, but Kurt von Schleicher had signed into law an economic stimulus package (which Hitler had opposed as long as he was out of office). The German economic recovery began before Hitler took office, and there’s no evidence that any measures specially associated with him played any role in starting the recovery.
But by 1936, the German economy was coming under strain because of Hitler’s emphasis on rearmament. Hjalmar Schacht, who had previously supported rearmament, tried urging Hitler to develop more export industries. Instead, Hitler had Schacht removed and replaced by Goering. The strains in the German economy under Hitler were an important factor in leading to World War II. Hitler realized that either he needed to achieve some big success really soon as a result of all that rearmament, or else Schacht would prove correct that it was unsustainable.
Everyone knows and acknowledges the retribution inflicted upon Germans after WW2, don’t they?
Yet, everyone is just Horrified and Mystified by Hitler’s notion of retributive justice, whether by agreement or force, for actions against Germany in WW1 and the Treaty of Versailles, which is, in fact, acknowledged to have been unreasonably and criminally enforced.
Please provide the names of the German delegates present during the Versailles treaty negotiations.
Please confirm, whether or not, economic sanctions were enforced against Germany prior to the treaty in order to compel agreement.
A bit out of sequence, but really just rhetorical, as I already know the answer:
Please name the courts/jurisdictions, in any western nation, that operate within the procedural rules of process and evidentiary discovery, enacted at Nuremberg.
It is no secret that Hitler believed WW1 was unnecessary and was instigated for ulterior motives, primarily by Zionist Jews, and the “Balfour Deception,” which arrived “out of nowhere” bears the truth of his conclusions.
It is no secret that the Bolsheviks and the Soviets were savage in their methods of enforcement of communism, and their goal was to expand throughout Europe. Hitler opposed their plan. The ultimate fate of Eastern Europe, the gulags, the Holodomor, all bear the truth of Hitler’s conclusions.
My conclusion is, whatever blockade you or anyone else in your censorious field of obfuscation and lie-mongering, aka Holocaust Studies, place upon the actual history, it is undeniable that Adolf Hitler placed the welfare of his people above any other. It is also apparent that he believed war was so detrimental to people, all people, that it should be avoided. He did not want to sacrifice German lives unnecessarily. His peace offers and diplomatic efforts are either unknown to the general public or they are portrayed as “just a maneuver” for more time to plot the DESTRUCTION/DOMINION OF THE WHOLE WORLD, SOUTH AMERICA, INCLUDED. Any thoughts on the acquisition of the Secret Map by FDR?
What I find interesting about you is the manner in which you casually dismiss the outrageous fabrications made by Jews, i.e., the soap, the geysers of blood, gassing/killing thousands per day, dragging corpses with canes, ripping infants to pieces, lies about apples, lies about “I was never actually at Auschwitz, but I was there in spirit,” throwing children into muffles alive………and, yet you don’t remark on why these lies were submitted in the first place. Why were the bulk of these stories so late in coming? Why are laws necessary to prevent investigation into the claims?
Are you familiar with the parable about crying wolf? If you tell lies, eventually no one believes anything you say. That is most likely the actual reason for legislation to prevent investigation/speech contrary to Jewish Holocaust Doctrine. I won’t mention the millions of dollars brought in annually by the Holocaust Industrial Complex.
FDR, Churchill and Stalin sacrificed their own people; why? I don’t care about Stalin’s motives, but the other two, I can’t really say, but hopefully, they are being taken to task in the afterlife by the millions of young boys and men they led to untimely, brutal deaths to the detriment of European people everywhere.
#1586 Tiptoethrutulips
“I find your refusal to answer questions about the Katyn Forest massacre evidence of your hypocrisy.”
I find you to refuse to answer questions why Hitler conquered WHOLE POLAND, CZECHOSLOVAKIA if his only concern was German minorities in Gdańsk (Danzig) and small part of Czechoslovakia?
Simply explanation is that Hitler wanted to create Lebensraum for Germans on lands inhabitated by Slavs at a cost of extermination of Slavs.
“(…)Jews were rattling sabers (…)”
They can rattle payots but not sabers. Jews never had have sabers*.
Inspired by your comments I can recommend you reading “Ilustrowany Kuryer Codzienny” from 28 August 1939.
mbc.malopolska.pl/dlibra/publication?id=83385&tab=3
“Discovery of German weapons in apartaments of Germans living in brzezinski and rybnicki districts” (page 1).
“Military German provocation along whole Polish borders” (page 2)
“34 accidents of provocations made by German airplanes” (page 2).
“[German-my add.] Terror against Poles in Gdańsk (Danzig)” (page 2).
My favorite:
“Germans can choose peace or their own catastrophe!” (page 3).0
(we know from history that “smart” Germans chose their own pogrom).
etc.
—
* Achtung! I’m trolling you right now. Don’t be upset and cheer up 🙂
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Payot
In another sense, it does make sense. I read a decidedly Judeophilic book about Jews in Weimar Germany.
Even averaging in the destitute Jewish immigrants from Eastern Europe, the average German Jew had an income 3.2 times that of the average German.
If we convert that to modern American standards, well, the average American family income seems to be around $100,000 year (that’s average, not median).
Give me an income of $320,000 a year and I’ll feel pretty damned prosperous. Guaranteed.
I’m not actually upset, Little Bunny fufu.
In many cases, the truth is usually somewhere in the middle. But, not always, as neither six million nor three million Jews died in WW2.
That said, I think it’s logical that Poles wanted to control the port, and they resented the German majority in Danzig, and Germans wanted to be left alone and reunited with Germany. It was a recipe for disaster and ongoing conflict; some say that was the entire point of the treaty.
In reading on Polish history lately, it is clear that your little slice of European/Slavic territory has been fraught with conflict for centuries. It’s too bad a compromise was not reached in 1939.
Here’s a little trolling, by me, to you:
Little Bunny fufu,
Hopping through Katyn Forest
Scooping up the Polish goons
And bopping them on the head
Down came Good Heil Hitler!
And Good Heil Hitler! said,
“Little Bunny fufu, I don’t wanna see you,
Scooping up my deutsche frauleins
And bopping them on the head”
If you are interested in the text of the original masterpiece, Little Bunny Foo Foo, I believe it is available on Wikipedia.
This is also a crucial point, which is not known to most people. Danzig was a German city (almost exclusively inhabited by German people) and was torn out of Germany after WW1 at the instigation of Poland and declared a “Free City” and placed under the League of Nations, with some sovereign rights granted to the Polish state on Danzig’s territory.
In 1923, under the supervision of the League of Nations, a referendum was held in Danzig.
Result: 95% Germans and about 3% Poles
The data are taken from Wikipedia and with all justified criticism of Wikipedia, imho one can rely in such cases to certain extend (and even more) on Wikipedia, because there as a rule rather the official (speak: German-hostile) historical narrative is represented.
There is also a list of mayors of Danzig from 1342 to the present on Wikipedia. From 1342 to 1945 all mayors had German names (see: here).
One must imagine that a historical German city, which was almost exclusively inhabited by Germans, was – of course against the will of its citizens – torn out of the fatherland. And this only in order to weaken Germany even further, to do a favor to the Poles, who were demanding even more, and ultimately to create a permanent source of conflict between Germany and Poland, which could be further fueled from the outside if necessary.
Where was here the “right of self-determination of peoples” praised by the Western Allies (Anglo-Zionists)? It never applied to the Germans, it only applied (more or less) to thpse European peoples who could be brought into position against Germany.
For Germany’s enemies, it is more than convenient to maintain the official narrative of German aggression and German crimes. On the one hand, it elegantly distracts from their own monstrous crimes committed against Germany and the Germans, and on the other hand, Germany is kept small and internally broken by this “cult of guilt”.
This artificially generated moral capital is converted into political capital, which ultimately also pays off financially for these states. Israel and Poland are certainly to be mentioned here in the first place.
> Hitler’s notion of retributive justice, whether by agreement or force, for actions against Germany in WW1 and the Treaty of Versailles
Hitler’s ambition of conquering living space in eastern Europe had nothing to do with the Versailles Treaty. It was the French who had tried to enforce stern terms against Germany at Versailles. The US and UK favored more lenient terms, but Poincare and Clemenceau were hoping to prevent the reemergence of Germany as a world power by demanding a stiff peace treaty.
Yet Hitler was comparatively gentle with the French in 1940, more so than he ever would be with Poles, Serbs, Russians, Ukrainians and other Slavs. That is because his attitude towards eastern Europe was guided by ideology, rather than some kind of revenge for Versailles. The ideology stated the Slavic subhuman was at most a tool which could be used to advance the German or Jewish race, and in this contest, it was the need for expanded German living space which had to win out at the expense of the Slavs.
There was a big difference between Weimar Germany and Germany in 1939. The suggestion that Jews were prospering in Germany up t0 1939 is absurd. See Avraham Baraki, From Boycott to Annihilation: The Economic Struggle of German Jews, 1933-1943, for the details. Hitler exerted steadily mounting economic pressure on German Jews for the period 1933-9.
As for the Weimar, there were certainly fewer impoverished Jews versus Impoverished Germans during that time. But it’s not true that Jews made up an excessive of the ultra-rich.
“Jewish wealth and capital was well in line with the Jewish population share, perhaps below one percent of Germany’s real capital stock but certainly less than twice that.”
— Alnrecht Ritschl, “Fiscal Destruction,” in Kreutzmueller & Zatlin, (eds.), Dispossession: Plundering German Jewry.
The point was that stark divisions between rich and poor were much higher within the German Gentile population than was the case among either the German Jewish population or German Gentile versus German Jewish.
> Poles wanted to control the port, and they resented the German majority in Danzig, and Germans wanted to be left alone and reunited with Germany.
The point was rather that Hitler’s ambitions involved much more than simply having Danzig Germans be left alone. If that was all that Hitler had wanted, then there would never have been a German occupation of Czechia on March 15, 1939; Neville Chamberlain would never have issued a guarantee to Poland; and the Poles would have been pressured to come to terms with Germany in the same that the Czechs had been at Munich. But Hitler’s ambitions were much bigger than simply helping the Germans in Poland. That’s why there was a war.
In the early years when Hitler took office, it would have been easy to imagine a war breaking out Germany and Italy over South Tyrol. Mussolini had been much more forward about cracking down on South Tyrol Germans than either the Polish or Czechoslovak governments had been until that point. But Hitler was convinced that Germany and Italy should be natural allies, so he exerted all of his diplomacy to smooth things out with Mussolini. He had no intent of doing this Poland or Czechoslovakia.
Why is is it important to you to deny that German Jews were dramatically wealthier than German gentiles?
A multiple of 3.2 is markedly greater than any difference that exists between any one group and the US average for example. It strikes me as potentially part of any explanation for the Holocaust.
> It is no secret that Hitler believed WW1 was unnecessary
In your imaginary world, perhaps. In reality, Hitler is very frank about how much he welcomed the outbreak of the war in 1914. Rather than seeing it as something unnecessary, he saw it as an essential opportunity to shrug off the degenerate influence of the Hapsburg monarchy and rediscover a German purpose. There is nothing in Mein Kampf at all suggests that the war was viewed by Hitler as unnecessary. Like many apologists, you’re rewriting the record of Hitler’s own stated motives in order to substitute better-sounding rationales where it is convenient.
Like many Jewish apologists, you’re just spewing Jewish lies and propaganda.
Here is what Ron Unz has to say about the liar Patrick McNally:
Who do you think you’re fooling? Little Bunny fufu needs no convincing. fufu accepts The World According To Wikipedia. Have you seen the recent headlines about a former Wikipedia executive claiming infiltration by government officials?
The guarantee to Poland was sure to enable more conflict. The English and the French were worried sick over the Poles, were they? That certainly explains their allyship with the Soviets, yes?
Did Hitler conquer this area or did he arrive by agreement? So, Bohemia and Moravia were devoid of Germans? This territory was never once part of Germania?
There was a war because Germany was the bulwark against the English, infested with Jewish money and Zionist ideology, and the spineless French, and their joint hell-bent effort to accommodate the Bolsheviks/Soviets in their hell-bent efforts to “transform” Europe.
Did anyone bother to ask the Czechs or Hungarians if they prospered after Hitler was defeated? Was Stalin and Bela Kohn a hero to those people?
Many Shoah interviewees, who, of course exaggerate exceedingly, often report that the Poles and the Hungarians were more than happy to see the Jews bounced off and away from their gentile societies. So, maybe Hitler was the scapegoat for all the other “Jew realists.”
Wasn’t Chamberlain hung and burned in effigy in Moscow over any attempt to negotiate with Germany? Sure, McNally, the war was caused by Hitler and his refusals to tow the line for Zionism, vulture capitalism and Gentile Perfidy.
Are you tagging in for Taubman?
#1593 Valjean72
Why Hitler conquered WHOLE Poland and WHOLE Czechoslovakia with 32 mln of non-Germans in Poland in Czechoslovakia
if his only concern was 5 mln German minorities in those countries?
Your comment is very long but it has no logic.
“There is also a list of mayors of Danzig from 1342 to the present on Wikipedia.”
Why didn’t you mention that there is also information that Germans murdered Slavic population of Gdańsk before 1342*?
“One must imagine that a historical German city, which was almost exclusively inhabited by Germans, (…)”
That why Gdańsk strongly opposed German-speaking Prussia in years 1772-1785.
Explanation of this Paradox: before 1871 there was no Germany. Germans are known for their separatism, before XIX century there were plenty of independent and hostile-to-each-other states in Germany (althought they share common language and culture).
No wonder that German fought against German.
I see your lack of knowledge is equal to your lack of logic.
——–
* “Gdańsk massacre or Gdańsk slaughter (rzeź Gdańska)”
“The city of Danzig (Gdańsk) was captured by the State of the Teutonic Order on 13 November 1308, resulting in a massacre of its inhabitants and marking the beginning of tensions between Poland and the Teutonic Order. “
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teutonic_takeover_of_Danzig_(Gda%C5%84sk)
#1592 Tiptoethrutulips
You are a coward who don’t want to ask simple question why Hitler conquered whole Poland and Czechoslovakia if he only wanted to “defend” German minorities in those countries.
Don’t you think, that German armies should stop when they conquered western Poland (dominated by German minorities)?
“That said, I think it’s logical that Poles wanted to control the port, (…) “
Poles built their own port Gdynia which was bigger than Gdańsk (Danzig) in 30-thies of XX century.
In reality, there are many accounts of soldiers volunteering to serve in a war and returning with a perspective or analysis of the conflict at odds with the lies previously told by their government and the media. I have had personal conversations with a few such soldiers.
I am certainly not claiming Hitler was a pacifist. But, are you sure Hitler never expressed any revelations or changes to his views occurring during and/or after WW1?
I don’t consider myself an apologist, as I used to believe, more or less, the official narrative of misplaced and unearned angst against organized Jewry. After a bit of actual studying, a pattern of subversive and detrimental behaviors emerged, just as Hitler said. Have you read excerpts from the Talmud? Are we or are we not cattle? Who were the Babylonians? Were they Amalek? Were they Edom? Aryans? They STILL whinge on and on about their damn temple! How about you look around today? How do Gentiles benefit from “Jews in the Midst?”
Have a gander at some info pasted from news sites:
From Birmingham, Alabama, to Cheyenne, Wyoming, cantors and rabbis have signed on. And they are demanding action.
More than 1400 Jewish clergy members signed a petition calling on elected officials to protect the legal right to seek asylum in the U.S., and on July 18, a delegation of rabbis, attorneys, and advocates went to Capitol Hill to deliver it to key members of Congress. The petition, organized by HIAS, includes signers from 47 states and every movement of Judaism, who express concern over the United States’ treatment of asylum seekers, and call for urgent moral leadership from the U.S. government.
“The Jewish people know what it means to be turned away and to be denied protection,” the petition states. “As Jews we understand the heart of the refugee, and the current actions of our government echo some of the darkest moments of our own history. Our concern does not only apply to the Jewish past, but to our present.”
TEL AVIV, Israel — Israel’s Sephardi chief rabbi Yitzhak Yosef is the subject of sharp criticism today, following his last weekly sermon when he compared black people to monkeys as he explained the blessing of blooming trees during the Hebrew month of Nisan.
Footage of his sermon was posted by the Israeli news site Ynet. In the video, the rabbi talks about black people in the streets of America whose parents are white, then calls the black son of a white couple a monkey. He also uses the Hebrew word “kushi” to describe black people, which is widely considered a racial slur in Israel.
The office of the rabbi responded saying that Yosef was quoting from the Talmud, the book of Jewish laws and traditions.
Ha! I’ll bet the Talmud has a few interesting things to say about “Gorillas in the Mist.” Personally, I could care less, but I resent the hypocrisy. We all know Jews run the NAACP, as they should due to their over-representation in the African slave trade. I’m sorry, I drifted off of WW2 , didn’t I?
I await your expert analysis of FDR’s acquisition of Hitler’s Top Secret Plan for World Domination and that Map of South America indicating his planned military installations from which he would conquer the USA. I guess the American Cattle stopped him in the Nick of Time.
Little Bunny fufu,
I don’t think “coward” is the appropriate word for me. Perhaps you mean, “mystified?” Confused? I feel like I have answered. I hereby answer, yet again:
The Austro-Hungarian Empire = filled with Germans. Hitler was an Austrian. I’m a bit confused about the Hungarians, as I have read the term “Hun” used as a pejorative term for Germans; was Attila a German? I just do not know.
Bohemia = filled with Germans; Moravia= filled with Germans; Pomerania = filled with Germans; Prussia = filled with Germans; City of Danzig = filled with Germans.
Sudetenland = Bohemia/Moravia – yes?
Germans = of Germania, Germanic people – yes?
I hereby acknowledge there were other people, not Germans, in these territories, except for (Free) City of Danzig, which was established after WW1 and was actually filled (98%) with Germans.
The War to Wrest Palestine From the Turks, aka WW1, began due to a “random” assassination; Germany intervened; Germany was kicking everyone’s ass all over the place, as Germans do; English Jews went crying to American Jews saying, England will reward all Jews with Palestine if American Jews can get the American cattle to fight their battle – the rest is history.
Hitler was pissed that Germany was blamed for the war, and that much needed German territory had been taken from Germany unnecessarily and illegally, thereby hobbling the German people in any future attempt to thwart perpetual Jewish machinations for The Return, and the transformation of communism for the rest of Europe. Hitler said, we’re done with this illegitimate treaty, which was agreed upon under duress, and I’m taking Germany back to Germany; please consider my claims and let’s work it out peacefully. Jews, of course, had their knickers in a twist over all of this, especially since Germany had been clipping along just fine without their unethical/exploitative practices – they resorted to their usual methods of “stirring up the hornet’s nest,” i.e., assassination/mob violence – blame Germans…..Hitler said, I’m done with diplomacy – I’m done with Jewish perfidy – I’m done with English perfidy, so I’m gonna take you bastards out for what you’ve done to Germany and to Europe. Were it not for the American Cattle, he may have saved Europe. The End.
Curiously enough, much esteemed General George Patton came to the same conclusion towards the end of the war. Don’t take my word for it – check it out, but use something other than Wikipedia.
I tried to simplify it for you – does it make sense? Do you feel like I provided a sufficient answer?
Little Bunny fufu, are you suggesting CIVIL WARS are specific to Germans?
It is probably pointless to “discuss” further with you – nor with any other notorious Polish nationalist – but the following is what I want to list you here.
You wrote: before 1871 there was no Germany. What do you think Heinrich Heine had in mind when he wrote his “Night Thoughts” (Nacht-Gedanken) in Paris in 1846?
English translation:
Or have you ever heard of the German Confederation (1815 – 1866), which was presided over by Austria and Prussia?
Note that Bohemia & Moravia (“Czech lands”) were integral part of the “German Confederation”
And Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart wrote in a letter to his father in 1776 about Germany, his beloved fatherland
You wrote:
on wikipedia you can read the following about it (“History of “Gdansk”)
Napoleon once said the following about the nature of historiography:
And you Poles, as war profiteers, try to insert your version (distortion, manipulation) of German-Polish history into official history. You have largely succeeded so far, because it is Germany’s enemies who have been writing the history books since 1945. But now and then you exaggerate it so much that even the Western Allies are embarrassed.
But also through sites like unz.com, the great falsifications of the 20th century history are coming out more and more, slowly but steadily.
> German Jews were dramatically wealthier than German gentiles?
That’s an absurd statement. As I said, the most anyone can argue for is that Jews were much more likely to be either middle-class or above, whereas there were many German lower-class elements. For example:
—–
Almost three-quarters of them made their living from trade, commerce, banking, and the professions, especially medicine and law. At the same time only about one-quarter of the non-Jewish population of Germany was similarly employed. Although professed Jews made up at most 0.9 percent of the German population in the Weimar period, they held slightly more than 3.5 percent of all positions in these trades.
—–
— Donald Niewyk, The Jews in Weimar Germany, p. 13.
The passage from p. 16 which you’ve taken up here is: “the average income of Jews in Weimar Germany was 3.2 times that of the total population.” But it’s clear that this simply reflects a stark inequality among the Gentile population. If one looks at the better off Gentiles, then there is no outstanding Jewish dominance.
> It strikes me as potentially part of any explanation for the Holocaust.
That’s provably false simply on the basis of how working people voted when they had a choice. In the elections of November 1932, the NSDAP won 33.1% of the vote, the Social Democrats (SPD) 20.4%, and the Communists (KPD) got 16.9%. Although there’s a myth which claims that the KPD was allegedly heavily Jewish, it did not have any major Jewish membership. The SPD did, however, have quite a few Jews in its top ranks. This did not stop German workers from voting for either the SPD or KPD. With 37.3% of the vote behind them, an SPD-KPD coalition would clearly have outranked the NSDAP and won the labor vote wholesale. It was only political rivalries which broke the SPD and KPD apart made the NSDAP stand out. But the voting record shows that German workers were never persuaded by your logic. If they had been, the NSDAP would have won more like 70+% of the vote.
As it was the NSDAP managed to win a share of the middle-class vote, but never made much a dent in the working-class vote. If we compare to the elections of January 1919, when neither the KPD or NSDAP was on the ballot, the vote for the SPD then was 37.9%. So, if one compares this with the 37.3% which the SPD and KPD won cumulatively in November 1932, one can maybe say that 0.6% of the voters shifted possibly over to the NSDAP. The main loss to the SPD was simply the rise in the KPD, and the resulting split between 2 different labor parties. But there’s no sign that working-class voters changed lanes over the Jewish Question.
As I said before, you’re the perfect example of the incoherent rambling ideologue who comes to depend upon the more literate rambling ideologue. One ill-informed person simply repeating phrases from another ill-informed person.
> The guarantee to Poland was sure to enable more conflict.
It was Hitler’s occupation of Czechia which brought about conflict. If he had simply abided by the Munich Agreement, then Chamberlain would have supported him in an effort to negotiate a settlement over Danzig.
> The English and the French were worried sick over the Poles, were they?
Not at all. They were concerned about their future status as European powers under conditions where Hitler cavalierly tears up the Munich Agreement and marches across Czechia. Allowing that would have destroyed all of their future credibility.
> That certainly explains their allyship with the Soviets, yes?
No, Operation Barbarossa is what explains it. There was no alliance with the USSR until June 22, 1941. Hitler’s occupation of Norway halted to Allied plans to send troops to fight in Finland against the Soviets. Then his offensive in France put a stop to the plans for bombing the Baki oilfields. But the Allied strategy before the fall of France had been centered on treating the USSR as a weak link in the perceived chain of German alliances, with the idea that an attack on the USSR could allow them to isolate Germany. Only the fall of France put a stop to this strategy.
> Did Hitler conquer this area or did he arrive by agreement?
He set up his invasion forces, called in Hacha, and made it clear to Hacha that he was going to occupy the territory one way or another. From that, he extorted a signature out of Hacha.
Let’s just take his own words from Mein Kampf:
“To me these hours seemed like a release from the painful feelings of my youth. Even today I am not ashamed to say that, overpowered by stormy enthusiasm, I fell down on my knees and thanked Heaven from an overflowing heart for granting me the good fortune of being permitted to live at this time.”
— Mein Kampf, p. 161, Houghton Mifflin edition, 1971.
Yes, many soldiers have come back from wars with deep regrets about what they got drawn into. That was not Hitler’s view at all.
? It is your statement that is absurd. If I make 3.2 times as much money as you do, I’m dramatically wealthier than you are. You make $32,000 a year; I make $100,000 a year. Yes, I am dramatically wealthier than you are.
But more to the point, I see you as trying to preserve the snowy innocence of the future victims of the Holocaust; their behavior did nothing to contribute to their fate.
…I tend to see myself as between two fanatical extremes here; of course the Holocaust happened, and of course it was wrong. Those who say otherwise are living in a land of willful delusion, and it’s tedious.
On the other hand, most victims contribute to their fate in some way, and so did the Jews. The analogy I tend to revert to in this case is the attractive woman who persists in walking home alone through a black neighborhood at 2:00 am and eventually gets raped.
Is the rape her fault? The rapist exonerated? Of course not. At the same time, it has to be admitted that if the woman had behaved differently, she wouldn’t have gotten raped.
German Jews were disproportionately wealthy, and very conspicuously and disproportionately influential in much of German life, including such widely hated phenomena as Bolshevism and the ‘proto-Wokism’ of Weimar Germany (the Institute for Sexual Research, etc). They weren’t just innocent little rabbits, quietly nibbling the flowers, then the fierce bad Nazis inexplicably turned on them. They had made themselves emblematic of everything the Nazi Revolution opposed. If Jews composed eighty percent of the Berlin stock exchange, and if they had made up all of most of the leadership of the short-lived Bavarian Soviet Republic et al, and if they were prominent in every cultural innovation the Nazis despised, and if they were far wealthier than others in a suddenly economically insecure and impoverished country, who do you think was going to get singled out as ‘the bad man’?
History happens for a reason. Nazi anti-semitism wasn’t simply a meteor that came from outer space.
Oh, ok then. So, an extorted signature IS inappropriate? Does a signature obtained under duress nullify an agreement? Did Germany agree to disarm in WW1, only to then be threatened with invasion?
From The American Legion:
The German delegation, not present throughout any of the discussions, was presented with the draft of the treaty in May 1919. After trying and failing to negotiate some of the more severe terms and facing threats of resumed war should they not sign, the German delegates signed the Treaty of Versailles on June 28, 1919, in the Hall of Mirrors at the Palace of Versailles.
From Deutsche Welle:
The Treaty of Versailles was signed on June 28, 1919 — but not by Chancellor Philipp Scheidemann, who resigned rather than lend his signature to the accord. Germany only signed the treaty after the Allies threatened to invade the country. The Rhineland, incidentally, had remained occupied since the armistice of November 11, 1918.
From the National Museum of Australia:
The treaty was signed in the Hall of Mirrors at the Palace of Versailles on 28 June 1919. Hughes signed it on behalf of Australia as a member of the British Empire.
The treaty drastically reduced Germany’s armed forces, demilitarised the Rhineland, carved off large areas of German territory and imposed massive reparations. It also contained a ‘war guilt’ clause, effectively blaming Germany for starting the war.
The German delegation had no choice but to sign it. The alternative was to have their country invaded by the Allied armies.
From Britannica:
“The treaty gave some German territories to neighbouring countries and placed other German territories under international supervision. In addition, Germany was stripped of its overseas colonies, its military capabilities were severely restricted, and it was required to pay war reparations to the Allied countries.”
Here’s an interesting observation from Jimmy Atkinson:
Thus, while Britain saw Germany as a “barrier-fortress against the Russians” 10 and an economically strong nation with which to engage in international trade, the French viewed Germany as a threat to French security.
From the US Department of State:
According to French and British wishes, Germany was subjected to strict punitive measures under the terms of the Treaty of Versailles. The new German government was required to surrender approximately 10 percent of its prewar territory in Europe and all of its overseas possessions. The harbor city of Danzig (now Gdansk) and the coal-rich Saarland were placed under the administration of the League of Nations, and France was allowed to exploit the economic resources of the Saarland until 1935. The German Army and Navy were limited in size. Kaiser Wilhelm II and a number of other high-ranking German officials were to be tried as war criminals
From Johndclare:
Finally, the territorial terms of the Treaty of Versailles also made the Germans angry. Germany lost 10% of its land. The Saar was a valuable coalfield, and West Prussia and Upper Silesia were rich farming areas, so their loss further weakened Germany’s economy. The loss of the Polish corridor separated East Prussia from Germany, and further damaged the German economy. Germany lost 16% of its coalfields and half its iron and steel industry. The loss of all Germany’s colonies to be mandates was seen as just so much British empire-building. The loss of Malmedy to Belgium, Schleswig to Denmark, Memel to Lithuania – and most of all Alsace-Lorraine to France – was also a national humiliation. The Treaty of Versailles also forbade Anschluss with Austria. This seemed unfair to the Germans, because everywhere else in Europe, the Treaties of 1919–20 gave peoples self-determination, but they divided Germany, and put 12½% of its population into other countries.
**I’m still waiting for your explanation about how FDR got his paws on That Secret Map of German World Conquest Via South American Invasion.
Agree with the rest of your post; but I don’t think you can be sure of the above.
Absent the seizure of Bohemia and Moravia, would Britain have pressured Poland to cede territory to Germany? After all, Hitler had just promised Chamberlain that he had no further territorial ambitions in Europe.
Chamberlain has been much vilified — but he was a perfectly decent, intelligent, and even courageous man. I’m skeptical that he would have cooperated in any further German attempts at aggrandizement. After all…
(a) the Sudetenland really did have an overwhelming German majority. The same didn’t apply to the Polish corridor.
(b) Czechoslovakia had been a bit of a novelty. A Polish state had been a feature of the European landscape for a thousand years.
(c) Britain had found herself horribly unready in the Summer of 1938. Subsequently, she began rapidly rearming.
(d) Hitler had promised. Munich was supposed to be it.
It’s likely that absent Bohemia and Moravia, Hitler could have attacked Poland and Britain would have remained neutral — but I don’t think you can assert with any confidence that she would have actually exerted pressure on Poland to give way.
I don’t see how the text you referenced has anything to do with an analysis of the causes of a conflict and/or the obvious strategies often observed to prolong a war or permit a certain outcome, i.e., why was Patton prohibited from taking Berlin? And, don’t bother with any of your cockamamie rebuttals, Because Yalta…..I believe what Patton said about it; his assassination proves his observations true.
You cited a statement without context, and I don’t really want to look up the rest of the text, but I’ll say this: if a soldier/citizen believes himself or his country has been abused, threatened, damaged or is in peril, I assert a “feeling of stormy enthusiasm,” would be typical at the opportunity for defense or retaliation or retribution. I did not claim Hitler was a pacifist. I did claim he sought justice for his country, cared for his countrymen forthright, and betrayed no one. I can’t say the same for FDR or Churchill.
Hitler was not a war-monger. You can spin it anyway you want, but the heavy censorship and criminal legislation preventing any opposition to the official WW2/Holohoax narrative proves Hitler’s observations true.
#1606 Valjean72
“Or have you ever heard of the German Confederation (1815 – 1866), which was presided over by Austria and Prussia? ”
Wait a minute! Why they called themselves Confederation till 1866 when it was allegedly one country?
Show me Kingdom of Germany.
On your map I see:
I see kingdom of Poland although after 1815 it was part of tsardom Russia).
I see kingdom of Sardinen.
I see kingdom of France but I don’t see Kingdom of Germany? Accident? I don’t think so.
I don’t see kingdom of Germany. On your map I see kingdom of Prussia, Austria,Bayern, Sachsen etc.
Of course it wasn’t one country/one single state but the idea of German unity/togetherness existed long before the founding of the klein-deutsche Reich in 1871.
The following is an excerpt from a Wikipedia article on the medieval German kingdom:
(Source: en.wikipedia.org/Kingdom_of_Germany)
But this whole issue is probably too complex and irritating for anti-German Polish chauvinists.
Because those are the differences between salaried professionals versus wage workers. What you’ve done is misrepresent a statement made by Niewyk about “income” as if it were about “wealth,” while you ignore the facts about “capital” which I had cited from Ritschl. In simplistic terms, wealth = income + capital (one could get more nuanced than that, but it’s not important). When Ritschl states:
—–
Between them, the data shown in table 10 generate shares of Jewish wealth in privately owned stock in Germany that range from .96 percent to 1.57 percent. By comparison, the Jewish population was .77 percent.
—–
— Kreutzmiller & Zatlin, (eds.), Dispossession: Plundering German Jewry, p. 67.
This does not conflict with the statement by Niewyk that:
—–
The typical urban Jewish community was divided into four fairly clear strata. At the top were the wealthy old families… Just below them stood a far larger stratum… It was thanks to the prosperity of much of this group that the average income of Jews in Weimar Germany was 3.2 times that of the total population.
—–
— Niewyk, The Jews in Weimar Germany, p. 16.
You’re inventing a false contradiction by twisting Niewyk’s statement into something other than what it was. Niewyk is not speaking here about major banking families like the Warburgs or the Schiffs. His statement has no bearing on capital holdings, which is what Ritschl was dealing with. Niewyk is concerned with wages and salaries, not capital gains. He’s simply noting that the working class in Germany (especially those with low wages) was overwhelmingly Gentile. Jews tended to be either middle or upper class, even when they did not have any capital holdings. Those without capital assets still worked their way into the better paid careers. Hence, when one compares to the huge number of Germans who worked on the assembly lines, the typical Jew is a lot better paid. But none of this data conflicts with the account of capital ownership laid out by Ritschl.
> including such widely hated phenomena as Bolshevism and the ‘proto-Wokism’ of Weimar Germany
There’s no evidence that any of this had much to do with the rise of the NSDAP. As I noted already, the KPD (Communist Party of Germany) actually showed an increase in its share of the vote throughout 1932. There is no evidence of any rise in anti-Communism during that period. However, this gain for the KPD simply came at the expense of the SPD (Social Democrats) and did not correspond to any increase in the vote for labor parties as a whole.
As for the temporary rise in votes for the NSDAP (to a maximum of 37.4% in the July 1932 election, before falling to 33.1% in November) this was not the result of any anti-Communism or anti-Jewishness either. One can read through the record of Hitler’s public statements in 1932-3 in the first volume by Max Domarus. At a time when the Depression was affecting Germany, Hitler played down the anti-Jewishness and focused on the economy and the Versailles Treaty. This still did not allow him to win over the German working classes, who went on splitting their vote between the KPD and SPD. But it caused a share of traditionally conservative voters to vote for Hitler in July, the same way that many people voted for Trump in 2016.
By the time of the November election, the economy had already begun to recover and this led to the drop in the NSDAP vote to 33.1%. The votes for the KPD and SPF if combined would clearly have been greater. But it was the machinations of Papen against Schleicher in January which allowed Hitler to get the appointment by Hindenburg.
> If Jews composed eighty percent of the Berlin stock exchange
As noted already, Jews held between 0.96-1.57% of the capital stock in Germany.
Of course, the Versailles Treaty was forced on the German delegates. What does that have to do with Hitler forcing an occupation on Czechia in March 1939? Furthermore, the whole business at Versailles highlights the hypocrisy of scoundrels like Hitler and Ludendorff. They claimed that the Weimar representatives at Versailles were carrying out a “stab in the back” against the German state, as if there were some other practical alternatives to simply signing the immediate peace terms dictated by the Allies. There obviously wasn’t. Philipp Scheidemann of the Social Democrats (SPD) had resigned because he refused to sign the treaty. Gustav Bauer (also SPD) took over his position and told the Allies that they should cancel certain clauses. That was when a crossing of the Rhine was threatened, and Bauer caved. Neither Hitler nor Ludendorff ever offered any practical alternative that Bauer could have followed. They simply charged him with the stab-in-the-back for political purposes.
> he sought justice for his country,
Hitler’s ambitions of acquiring living space from Poland had nothing to do with justice for Germans.
—–
It must absolutely be taken into account that there must be no “Polish masters;” where such masters do exist, they should, as harsh as it may sound, be killed… Once more the Fuehrer underlined that there must be but one master for the Poles, and this is the German: two masters could not and must not exist next to each other, hence all representatives of the Polish intelligentsia are to be killed. This may sound harsh, but it is the law of life. The Government General is a reservation for the Poles, one vast labor camp.
—–
— Dictated by Hitler on October 2, 1940, to Bormann, Frank and Schirach. Republished in Volume 3 of Max Domarus, Hitler: Speeches and Proclamations, p. 2100.
You suggested Hacha agreed under duress, did you not? The implication clearly was that Hitler’s actions were unethical or criminal. Therefore, as the Versailles Treaty was agreed to upon threat of invasion and continuing economic sanctions, please explain to me the difference.
Please explain to me WHY any rational leader would abide by such a treaty? In light of the ramifications of this treaty and the unethical manner in which it was obtained, I suggest Hitler’s actions were retaliatory, at the least, and certainly justified. Keep on spinning, McNally, as you refuse to acknowledge sincere diplomatic efforts to resolve these territorial claims were sought before the use of force. And, even a cursory analysis of occurrences after Agreements indicate any conciliatory efforts were undermined by those determined to bring Hitler/Germany down. I submit, he was aware of these subversive efforts, so….
Let’s not pretend Hitler is somehow monstrous because his actions were detrimental to “innocent” civilians. Have you studied history on any other subject besides WW2?
Perhaps you have an opinion on the innocent victims of the USS Liberty? And, before you accuse me of whataboutism, please note, I mention that incident only to suggest that Hitler was correct in his accusations of perfidy and unethical conduct continually present within the Jewish community, for which he justified his actions. Considering their ongoing machinations, to this day, to drag American cattle into their Holy Wars, I submit he was Right.
As always, I await your insightful analysis on that World Domination Via South America Map, and while you’re at it, explain to me why USS Liberty (actual) survivors were issued gag orders after an OBVIOUS friendly-fire incident.
I recently watched a documentary about the atrocities committed by the Pakistanis against the Hindus and Sikhs in Bangladesh. Wikipedia says, 200,000 to 400,000 women/girls were victims of a genocidal rape campaign. Do I believe this? Yes, I do, particularly since I am aware of what Pakistanis have been doing to English girls for years. My point is, some people just can not peacefully co-exist. I think Hitler recognized this unfortunate reality.
Once more :
From the US Department of State:
According to French and British wishes, Germany was subjected to strict punitive measures under the terms of the Treaty of Versailles. The new German government was required to surrender approximately 10 percent of its prewar territory in Europe and all of its overseas possessions. The harbor city of Danzig (now Gdansk) and the coal-rich Saarland were placed under the administration of the League of Nations, and France was allowed to exploit the economic resources of the Saarland until 1935. The German Army and Navy were limited in size. Kaiser Wilhelm II and a number of other high-ranking German officials were to be tried as war criminals
From Johndclare:
Finally, the territorial terms of the Treaty of Versailles also made the Germans angry. Germany lost 10% of its land. The Saar was a valuable coalfield, and West Prussia and Upper Silesia were rich farming areas, so their loss further weakened Germany’s economy. The loss of the Polish corridor separated East Prussia from Germany, and further damaged the German economy. Germany lost 16% of its coalfields and half its iron and steel industry. The loss of all Germany’s colonies to be mandates was seen as just so much British empire-building. The loss of Malmedy to Belgium, Schleswig to Denmark, Memel to Lithuania – and most of all Alsace-Lorraine to France – was also a national humiliation. The Treaty of Versailles also forbade Anschluss with Austria. This seemed unfair to the Germans, because everywhere else in Europe, the Treaties of 1919–20 gave peoples self-determination, but they divided Germany, and put 12½% of its population into other countries.
From Tulip:
Now, if WW1 had not occurred, I would agree with what you are suggesting. I do not consider the reclamation of one’s own former territories, resources and populations to be unjust, exploitative or unethical. Only Adolf Hitler is vilified for what many other western nations would also do. I find it comical that England takes any position against territorial expansion, whether justified or not. I will refrain from expanding on Jewish involvement in all those “European” India exploration companies. On that note, and off topic, all western nations are judged for these behaviors against some mysterious ruler by which no other countries on this earth ever once acted in a similar fashion – I just had to say it, as the Jewish involvement in these endeavors is not judged accordingly.
Whilst you’re digging around for the source of That Map of American Conquest Via South America, please find information on the Katyn Forest Massacre. For some reason, I believed that particular massacre was handled by the Soviets, who received extraordinary support by those Defenders of Freedom For Everyone, the Government of the American Cattle Country. Apparently, everyone was pissed at the Poles, but naturally, only Germans are/were guilty.
Oh, and back to the Pakistanis, for a bit; why are there so many Arab/Muslim people swarming all over Europe these days? Might it have anything at all to do with Israel and conflicts in the Middle East and American and English Cattle mucking about over there for the sake of our Greatest Ally? Hitler clearly proclaimed what was going to happen if we didn’t heed his warnings, Ja Oder Nein?
#1617 Valjean72
“Of course it wasn’t one country/(…)”
Agree. Germany didn’t exist till 1871 when many independent German-speaking entities (Kleinestaaterei*) were united with “Blood and iron” by Bismarck **.
And youd didn’t asnwer my question why Hitler conquered WHOLE Poland and WHOLE Czechoslovakia with 32 mln of non-Germans in Poland in Czechoslovakia
if his only concern was 5 mln German minorities in those countries?
—-
* “The word Kleinstaaterei (“small-state-ery”) is a pejorative term coined in the early nineteenth century to denote the territorial fragmentation of Germany”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kleinstaaterei
** “Blood and Iron (German: Blut und Eisen) is the name given to a speech made by Otto von Bismarck given on 30 September 1862, at the time when he was Minister President of Prussia, about the unification of the German territories.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blood_and_Iron_(speech)
Not one point you made actually contradicted anything I said.
Neither what the mass of Germans wanted nor how the Nazis came to power is directly relevant to the discussion. The Nazis had a very definite ideological platform — and Jews had behaved in a way and had come to occupy a position in Germany that made them the personification of everything that platform was against.
By 1933, the Nazis could indeed say — and say with considerable validity — ‘we don’t like these things. If we get rid of the Jews, many of these things will also disappear.’
…and we go on and on with the Saint Hitler versus ‘Hitler was the antichrist’ debate.
The horrible, unpalatable truth, of course, is that the reality lay somewhere in the middle. Hitler was a rather interesting man with many ideas and qualities, some of which really had a lot to be said for them, and some of which were…unfortunate.
His secretaries liked him.
It’s worth pointing out that ‘Pakistanis’ — that is to say, Indian Muslims — did coexist with ‘Indians’ — that is to say, Hindu Muslims — for over a thousand years. Say what you will about that; it compares favorably with our record vis-a-vis Native Americans, or the record of Spanish Christians vis-a-vis Jews and Muslims, or the record of Jews vis-a-vis Palestinians.
I’m not sure I understand your point. Disparate groups get along until they don’t; often, the conflict begins when one group exceeds in numbers over the other. More people = more conflict. What say you about the recent activities of Pakistanis/Muslims in England? I am unaware of roving gangs of teenage girls terrorizing anyone; perhaps those young girls really didn’t have it coming.
Do you really want to bring Spaniards/Europeans and Native North/South Americans (and are whites the most evil?) into this debate? Alright – the Spaniards sailed across the ocean because they were advanced technologically and could easily do so at that point in time. (The Comanches, in Texas, took advantage of another European technology – horses – and immediately began raiding, scalping and terrorizing other tribes; the tribes, who never adopted horse-riding to flee or fight, just disappeared)
The Spaniards committed a theretofore unknown sin of expansion and conquest, unknown to any other human groups on earth, until the arrival of Adolf Hitler, of course. In any case, the Spaniards weren’t really all that warm & fuzzy with most of the natives, for sure; they were particularly horrified to discover the habits of Montezuma, which included, constant wars, expansion of territory, gathering of slaves, including children, who had their beating hearts ripped out of their chests on the Sacrificial Stone in their temple. There were mountains of skulls all over various temples; the surviving sacrificial stones are available for viewing in Mexican museums today, and since there were no Jews roaming around in Mexico or South America at that time, the official estimates of the numbers killed/enslaved/sacrificed are still available in surviving tablets and monuments and are generally accepted as accurate.
Unlike the Spaniards, who arrived openly, in all their splendor, Hitler accurately identified an enemy working from within, stirring up conflicts whilst profiting from funding opposing sides; using money, mob violence and assassination to further their objectives and deceptions, manipulations, etc. Personally, I find the actions of the Spaniards and certainly Hitler, more honorable.
On that note, I understand that Jews were rather instrumental in aiding the Moorish invasion of Spain. Go ahead and fact-check it. Perhaps the Spaniards were influenced by their moorish conquerors, which may explain why they set sail and why they expelled the six million Jews from Spain in 1492.
Are you related to Patrick McNally?
Nothing you said addressed my remarks. I didn’t say the goddamned Spaniards were bad — for that matter, I didn’t say Muslims were good. I merely observed that ‘Pakistanis’ — -i.e., Indian Muslims — have a relatively good record of getting along with others, historically.
I am not related to Patrick McNally. Did I lie, exaggerate or obfuscate?
Are you related to Little Bunny fufu?
I understand what you said/wrote. Why don’t you explain to me why you felt compelled to point out that people in India co-existed peacefully thousands of years ago; I’m not sure there is such a person as a Hindu Muslim? – and then compare Indians of yore to European/Christian conflicts of relatively modern history. My point to McNally was some people are best left separated, and forced assimilation is often disastrous.
You did say, say what you will….
Maybe you meant Hindus and Muslims? Peaceful no longer.
And Jewish organizations were without question the one group that had excellent international communication connections to transmit such information and instantly energize and implement the widespread destruction that occurred.
There is also not the slightest doubt that Jews were the only ones who actually benefitted enormously from the destruction that followed.
And to whom does the crime fighting principle – means, motive, and opportunity point directly as the organizer of the pogrom ?
Only Jews. The motive element eliminates the Nazis, who had absolutely no motive to engage in the violence against Jews that occurred. None, zero, zip.
The Jews, on the the other hand, reaped the full benefit of the chaos by demonizing Germany.
The plot worked perfectly, and not even brain dead imbeciles can believes based on the evidence that anyone else was responsible once all the relevant facts are properly weighed.
May I suggest, however, that the proper income distribution to be considered (that totally escapes Pat, is what is the income distribution showing what portion of the population is included within each income ranking among the non-German (Jews) and the Germans.
Now if that statistical comparison tells that a much greater portion of the non-German population were included in the higher income brackets than of the German population, and a much larger proportion of the German population was included among the lower income rankings, then that would fully account for and explain the resentment resistance that would generate among the German people against the non-Germans residing among them that you so nicely explain.
Agree. It would also be useful to parse out — if virtually impossible — the relative income of German Jews as opposed to Jewish immigrants from Eastern Europe. The latter were supposedly very poor, so our 3.2 multiple may well understate matters.
Finally, McNally attempts to somehow disprove my argument by asserting that most land and capital was still in gentile hands. That may well have been the case; but I submit that the local burghers probably found it perfectly right and proper that Baron von Blank still held his vast but not particularly lucrative ancestral estates outside of town; they’d probably have rather not seen the old boy dispossessed. The Jewish department store owner who has come to clear five times as everyone else in town and to boot is blamed for the bankruptcy of eighteen local tradesmen isn’t so universally tolerated; in fact, he makes a nice point of common agreement. Left or right, we can all hate him.
You make an absolutely vital point because land was no longer the primary source of wealth as it had been while the aristocracy held sway up to about the early 19th century when industrial assets and factory production became the increasingly greater source of consumer and capital goods and banking and other financial sectors like insurance and land ownership became the source of wealth the utility of which did not decline by someone amassing more of it that is the basis for the supply/demand model that purports to account for how their interactions regulates the supply and demand of the objects of market exchanges.
Under Weimar, a particularly notorious group of people were Schieber, a term my Collins German-English dictionary translates as “black-marketeer”. Although there were plenty of Gentile Schieber, Jewish ones, typically originating in Poland or further east, were notorious.
News item from January 26, 1923. It notes that police surrounded a large number of well-dressed people who were awaiting a train at Schlesischer Bahnhof, and took them away to police HQ for further investigation. The item is entitled “The Fall Of The Mark And Black-Marketeering In Berlin”. It would be interesting to know how many of the detainees were Jews. The train is not further specified but the implication is it was a goods train and the well-dressed people were aiming to divide up the goods on it for sale – because of the high inflation which would get much worse during the year, wholesale goods had special value because the money was near-worthless.
#1626 Colin Wright
You seems to be smart person, much smarter than @HdC or @Valjean72 so you know answer to my question: why Hitler conquered WHOLE Poland and WHOLE Czechoslovakia with 32 mln of non-Germans in Poland in Czechoslovakia
if his only concern was 5 mln German minorities in those countries?
Can you answer that simple question?
Thank you in advance.
Sure. The five million Germans weren’t his whole concern, of course.
I cannot refrain from pointing out that Hitler conquered neither the whole of Poland, nor the whole of Czechoslovakia — well, he got the remainder of Poland in 1941.
Ah the know nothing demands an explanation of
This blockhead us obviously entirely ignorant of the historical developments that occurred.
So let me see if I can enlighten this lost soul about a few points bearing on his question that exposes his demanding answers for impossible events..
First, Hitler did not conquer all of Poland in 1939 when he launched the invasion. It was actually the Soviets and the Red Army that captured the eastern half per the prearrangements under German-Soviet non-aggression pacts singed days before the Germans launched their invasion.
Second, Hitler under the Munich agreement of 1938 took control of only the Bohemian portions of Czechoslovakia that was inhabited primarily by Germans who had been living there for centuries that was illegally seized from Germany by the Versailles Treaty. Hitler by that moves was thus recovering German territory inhabited primary by Germans exactly as he proclaimed his intentions to be.
There is a complicated account about the circumstances under which Hitler entered the rest of Czechoslovakia. AJP Taylor in his book The Origins of the Second World War was invited to enter the Czechoslovakian Republic by one of the two factions (Czechs and Slovaks) who made up the population because the two groups were at each other’s throats, and one of the groups sought his help to protect them from the larger faction.
That these groups continue to be at each other’s throats is evidence by the fact the country was reconstituted as Czechoslovakia after WWII, but has since again been split apart on the same fault lines into the independent Czech and Slovak states because they still can’t stand each other.
Thus the real answer to your qyestion is that it premised on entirely false foundations.
It’s also remarkable how many decided to torch their own property on the same date. What organisation! From Berlin to Cologne to Vienna, all that arson for insurance purposes…
#1638 The Old Philosopher
“First, Hitler did not conquer all of Poland in 1939 when he launched the invasion. “
I copy my comment #1578 to @HdC:
“Germans took half of Poland in 1939 and second half in 1941 after starting war with Soviet Union.
Half and half means WHOLE POLAND.
Why you don’t know basic facts about World War II? ”
“There is a complicated account about the circumstances under which Hitler entered the rest of Czechoslovakia. “
Nope, it’s not complicated. Hitler wanted to conquer Czechoslovakia. He needed only a cause.
If he would have done as you said then he would have taken only Sudetenland (with German minority) and (maybe) Slovakia as protectorate (against Czechs) but not Czechia.
Hitler took all Czechoslovakia so I’m sorry, your theory is rebutted
“(…)and one of the groups sought his help to protect them from the larger faction.”
Why you omitted question of Poland?
Poland also sought help in Germany for the same reason?
Hitler conquered Poland and Czechoslovakia with 32-milion of non-Germans because he wanted to make Lebensraum for Germans. Simple and logical.
Little Bunny fufu! How could you? I thought I was your Oracle of Polish/Czech Invasions!
From Belgium News, 2009:
Gdansk — Polish President Lech Kaczynski termed Warsaw’s role in Germany’s annexation of the former Czechoslovakia as a “sin” at ceremonies marking 70 years of the start of World War II.
“Poland’s participation in the annexation of Czechoslovakia in 1938 was not only an error, but above all a sin,” Kaczynski told world leaders attending the ceremonies in the Baltic port city of Gdansk.
“This was and shall forever remain a wrong,” Kaczynski added. […]
Poland annexed the Polish-dominated Zaolzie region of Czechoslovakia in October 1938 following the Munich Agreement at the same time Nazi Germany annexed the Sudetenland region.
From some Polish Guy on the internet:
“Zaolzie nasze!” October 1, 1938, Poland takes part in the partition of Czechoslovakia. 30 September, Poland gave an ultimatum to the Czechoslovak government. It demanded the immediate evacuation of Czechoslovak troops and police and gave Prague time until noon the following day. At 11:45 a.m.
From Human Rights Watch Ukraine:
Russia calls Soviet invasion of Poland in 1939 a ‘march of liberation’
The video then asserts the following: “In the course of the operation, Western Belarus and Western Ukraine, which had been occupied by Poland since 1921-1922 were liberated. Attempts by scholars and the media to present this operation as an act of aggression by the USSR are thwarted by the real facts. On 1 September 1939, the Germans entered Poland. Berlin insistently called on Moscow to join in the military action. The Soviet leadership, however, ignored the calls and refused to join in the conflict until the last possible moment. When it transpired that part of the Wehrmacht were able to move on Minsk, the decision was taken to send in troops. The Soviet Union had on several occasions tried to persuade Poland to conclude an agreement on mutual assistance in countering German aggression. The Polish leadership, however, rejected mutual action with the Red Army in countering the Wehrmacht. Warsaw demonstrated support for the aggressive policy of the Nazis which was in line with its own expansionist plans.
………………………….
You continue to side-step any inquiries into Jewish/Polish relations within Poland. I suspect the Poles had been terrorized by that particular sort of Eastern European/Russian Jewish society proclaimed to have been quite foul and ill-mannered towards the Polish cattle. Unlike the average Wikipedia scholar, I don’t believe a single word they say about never-ending pogroms in Russia….six million Jews facing starvation…….I won’t even call Poles hypocrites for absolutely wanting the Jews out of Poland whilst decrying Nazis as evil heeb-hunters….
Things aren’t always as they seem, which you may discover if you get off Wikipedia.
Oh, Little Bunny,
I forgot to mention – he didn’t need a cause; he said from the beginning, he wanted German territory back, as the Versailles Treaty was illegitimate, which it was.
I was responding to your query about:
So the premise he poses by asking why Hitler conquered the WHOLE of Poland and the WHOLE of Czechoslovakia were he only interested in the German minorities in those countries is that by doing so he falsified the alleged limitation he placed on his own policies being limited to the German minorities and by instead eventually conquering all of both he thereby revealed his real intentions as the conquest of both the the protection of the German minorities being only an excuse.
This is a delusionally simplistic formulation of the dynamics involving the international scene that has as its foundational premise that the policy choices Hitler could pursue were entirely independent of and unaffected by the actions take by his actual and possible adversaries that he could ignore with respect to whatever choices he made.
AS for Hitler taking the whole of Poland but in two chunk that based on your premise proved that was Hitler’s intention all along that refutes his claim he was doing it only to protect German minorities.
Your claims entirely ignore the fact that Hitler offered one magnanimous peace proposal after another to resolve outstanding differences with Poland that involved two major issues which were: 1. the repression and murdering of German civilians in the Corridor that had been part of Germany for years and 2,was to allow custom free transit of German goods across the Corridor between the parts of Germany the corridor separated.
At England’s urging, Poland failed even to acknowledge the offers. And, of course, the repression of Germans living in the Corridor continued
unabated.
Now this scenario was entirely like when in the run up to the Kuwait War, Kuwait refused to discuss issues between it and Iraq about Kuwait slant drilling into Iraqi territory to steal their oil and undercutting the OPEC price that Iraq needed to rebuild its economy after its war with Iran. Diplomats were astounded about Kuwait’s refusal to discuss the issues with Iraq. At the time I noted that what the really interesting diplomatic dispatches to be looked at was not what the state Dept was telling the Ambassador to Iraq to communicate to Iraq, but what the US ambassador to Kuwait was telling him to tell Kuwait which no one ever learned.
The US of course set the whole thing about, on the hone hand telling Iraq that it ha d not interest in inter Arab disputes while telling Kuwait to stand fast and ignore Iraqi demands. The rest is history respect to both Iraq and Poland.
When the Poles refused erven to discuss the issue and let diplomacy resolve the issues, Hitler saw no alternative but to resort to force, the only other way to resolve disputed between countries.
That of course was the whole plan the US UK cabal plotting to implement to trigger off the invasion and a war for destroying Germany which had become a real threat` to both of them `with its economic recovery that dwarfed anything occurring in Britain or the US which were both mired in depression.
And thus did Britain and France declare war on Germany in response to the invasion.
It took Germans about 3 weeks to crush the Poles and respond to redress their insolence.
As for Germany first grabbing half of Poland in 1939 and the other half in 1941 that purports to substantiate your thesis that taking Poland was the plan all along, it is refuted by what actually occurred.
Hitler never incorporated any part of Poland in to Germany except for the Corridor areas that were German to begin with. Nor, by the same token, did he incorporate parts of Czechoslovakia that Germany occupied at the request of the Slovaks (there was in fact only one country, and it was all or nothing as far as the request from German intervention, And Hitler occupied the second half of Poland in the course of launching an attack on Russia after UK continued to refuse to discuss very generous peace terms Hitler had offered them.
Thus given that England insisted on continuing the war against German y, and the Soviets took aggressive actions against German interests by occupying the Baltic countries, forcing Romania to cede Bessarabia under military threat that Hitler urged them to go along with and otherwise indicating they were going to pressure concessions from Germany, having no choice but to surrender or continue the wear, he chose the military option that was forced on him and invaded Russia as any major power would and has done throughout history when faced withn that situation.
Thus given that Hitler had no choice but to continue the war, his having to keep control over territories he seized during the course of the war that was forced upon him by the UK-US cabal,
thus entirely refutes your claim that Hitler continuing yo retain control over territories he occupied in the course of those operation proves he had intended all along to seize them.
Indeed, had Poland failed to play along and join Britain to confront him with an intolerable situation relating to the murdering of Germans in the Corridor, Poland could have entirely avoided being occupied by Germany. So it was as much their choice as it was Hitler’s.
Indeed, the US has created for Russia in Ukraine the exactly the same conditions as the US-UK cabal imposed on Germany with respect to Poland. Putin had repeated sought to resolve the issues of the Donets region ands made clear that advancing NATO to the Russian border was stepping over a red line. Indeed to make sure Putin understood we had every intention to run over it, two weeks before Putin launched his operation, the Ukies vastly increased their shelling of the Russian popuplated areas by multiple factors reaching over 1,000 rounds per day as recorded by a European security organization.
That’s when Putin finally said I have had enough and began the special military operation to make clear to the West that its attacks on Russian speaking population the Ukies were seeking to subjugate was not going to be tolerated.
And here we are.
Putin’s actions are also not evidence that he is seeking to r3ecreate the Soviet empire that is like your claim that Hitler ending up seizing more than the territory inhabited by Germans proves that was his plan all along.
Indeed, had the Ukies been willing to discuss the security arrangements and promised not to be included in NATO, the current war would in all likelihood never have happened..
But hey, the US Empire wanted the war to crush Russia. And they got what they wanted.
And that”s exactly what the Brits wanted and used Poland to get it started, just like they used Belgium to start things rolling to WWI.
#1641 #1642 Tiptoethrutulips
“Poland annexed the Polish-dominated Zaolzie region of Czechoslovakia in October 1938 following the Munich Agreement at the same time Nazi Germany annexed the Sudetenland region.”
Poland annexed area with Polish minority.
Hungary annexed area with Hungarian minority.
Germany annexed area with German minority… and then all other area of Czechoslovakia with non-German inhabitants.
“The Polish leadership, however, rejected mutual action with the Red Army in countering the Wehrmacht.”
Maybe because Poles knew what Soviet “help” meant? In 1919-20 Soviets tried to make “march of liberation” through Poland to Germany but Poles (surprisingly to Lenin) didn’t want to be “liberated” by Red Army. You know, some people didn’t want to work whole life in Siberia for glory of Soviet Union.
But after 1945 Poland was finally “liberated” by Soviets. It took “only” 45 years to throw out the best system in the world (communism) from Central, Southern and Eastern Europe.
“You continue to side-step any inquiries into Jewish/Polish relations within Poland.”
Yes, in Poland was extremal antisemitism – that is why the biggest population of Jews in Europe lived in Poland.
“I forgot to mention – he didn’t need a cause; he said from the beginning, he wanted German territory back, as the Versailles Treaty was illegitimate, which it was. “
Explain me, since when Warsaw was a German territory?
I’ve just remembered, that Hitler wanted to conquere whole Poland in 1939 but due to international complications he had to share out Poland to Stalin.
#1643 The Old Philosopher
“As for Germany first grabbing half of Poland in 1939 and the other half in 1941 that purports to substantiate your thesis that taking Poland was the plan all along, it is refuted by what actually occurred. “
I wrote this to @Tiptoethrutulips but I repeat it for you Hitler wanted to conquer whole Poland in 1939 but due to international complications he had to share out Poland to Stalin.
“Hitler never incorporated any part of Poland in to Germany except for the Corridor areas that were German to begin with. “
Hitler incorporated directly into Germany also big part of western Poland (Reichsgau Wartheland* ) which was inhabitated by Poles.
The rest area of German occuppied Poland was know as General Government**.
“(…) relating to the murdering of Germans in the Corridor, (…)”
But you have any evidences of these alleged crimes? Not German of course and not from pro-Nazi men. Mass graves etc.
“Thus given that Hitler had no choice but to continue the war, (…)”
You claim that Hitler had right for preemptive attack.
France, Britain ,Poland or other countries didn’t have right for preemptive attack.
Cultural people call it “double-standards” also known as – hypocrisy.
——–
* Reichsgau Wartheland
“The Reichsgau Wartheland (initially Reichsgau Posen, also Warthegau) was a Nazi German Reichsgau formed from parts of Polish territory annexed in 1939 during World War II. It comprised the region of Greater Poland and adjacent areas.”
“During the Partitions of Poland from 1793, the bulk of the area had been annexed by the Kingdom of Prussia until 1807 as South Prussia. From 1815 to 1849, the territory was within the autonomous Grand Duchy of Posen, which was the Province of Posen until Poland was re-established in 1918–1919 following World War I. “
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reichsgau_Wartheland
** “General Government”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Government
For a good deal of European history Germany was as unified as anyone. In the Twelfth Century, for example? England was ahead of everyone else, but otherwise?
Thereafter, Germany certainly survived as a cultural and linguistic reality — and it’s noticeable that no in what was reasonably Germany minded incorporation into Bismarck’s Reich too much. No doubt they didn’t like Prussia being quite so dominant, but that there should be a Germany in some form wasn’t seriously disputed. Austria was out — but German Austrians had mixed feelings about that. Here again, see the Blumenkrieg of 1938. Germany was a reality — even if not politically realized.
To see Germany as somehow not real is to disregard everyone else. Not real compared to what? Spain? France? Hungary?
…not to speak of the rest of the map of Europe. The exceptions were such relatively compact states as England, Denmark, Sweden, and Portugal. All of your larger states had considerable difficulty becoming unified, stable entities. Germany was certainly slow about it — but not really unique. Where was Spain in the fourteenth century? France?
Indeed, at the present it is Spain and Great Britain that have serious seperatist movements; not Germany.
WHO said Warsaw was German territory? In my reading of Polish history, I have determined the Swedes and the Russians have terrorized poor Poland to a greater extent than Germans. Let’s give the Mongols an honorable mention in terrorizing – thanks for keeping them out of Central Europe, by the way. I also read the city was designed based on German architecture similar to Dresden….I don’t know, Little Bunny, I think you should give us poor Germans a break.
I’m not sure I understand your point here. I also read somewhere that the Jewish population was in excess of 25% in the late 1800’s – early 1900’s; no need to explain what enmity this level of Jewry caused amongst the natives. I recall the interesting testimony of Polish Jew, Baruch Bergman – “we were so poor, but we managed to hire live-in child care…a cook…a maid….a tutor….so very poor, we were, somehow we managed.” Mr. Bergman spoke on his Polish servants as if they were mere….cattle.
Exactly, Little Bunny fufu. The Soviets/Bolsheviks really weren’t much help, and that’s exactly what I’ve been saying. There were Germans in Danzig/Pomerania. The Corridor was vital to German industry and a connection to Germans in Prussia. Please take a minute and review the details of the negotiations/peace offers made to Poland by Germany.
If you bother to look up the data I suggest, ask yourself this question: Why would England, having lost so many citizens in a war less than a generation past, whilst suffering economic deprivations domestically, offer to go to war over Poland? For Pete’s sake, people have been fighting over that territory for centuries. There were no English citizens therein; there were no significant economic endeavors therein. And, why does/did England (and America) ally with Russia, and then immediately declare Russia, afterwards, an enemy of freedom and democracy? They did this twice. It makes no sense – something else was afoot. Germany was doing something Someone didn’t like.
Notes to challenge my point Hitler only incorporated into Reich former German territory:
That he also included Wartheland that I excluded only proves my point he only included in the Reich former German territory seized from it at Versailles. I admit I did not included Wartheland, but as your reference to it makes clear, what is Wartheland but former German territory since 1793. Thus his included it but not the rest of occupied Poland proves my point he only took back former German territory inhabited by Germans that proves his acquisitions stayed within his stated claims of protect4ing Germans.
The General Govt was merely an administrative structure to run the areas of Poland German had no choice but to continue to control given the war England insisted on coninuing to wage. It entirely refutes your claim that Hitler occupying it as a consequence of the operation against Russia alleged proved that taking it was his intention from the start. That he cont9inued to occupy it given the continuation of the war utterly destroys your thesis that it was his intention to take and make from the outset.
As for your claims about double standards, where have I denied England could use force to advance and protect its interests? Could you point that out.
I merely denounced England for underhanded provoking conflict and then claiming it was an entirely peace-loving country that was merely defending itself against aggression when it in fact conspired to bring on the conflict by green-lighting the Polish repression of Germans living in territories they had been awarded that had been seized from Germany.
Germany was damn well entitled to use force to protect the Germans being murdered by Poles on territory that had been German.
I mean just note how the US declares its right to use force to protect whatever it considers to be its interests anywhere in the world.
Why then is Germany evil for doing the same? That’s the real double standard the US uses to demonize those whom it wishes to attack.
It’s either everybody or nobody can do it but its a double standard to claim as the US does that it is entitled to use force anywhere to protect its worldwide interests, but no one else can do so anywhere in the world especially when doing so conflicts with US interests.
#1647 Colin Wright
“Thereafter, Germany certainly survived as a cultural and linguistic reality (…)”
Yes, they have have similar culture and language but it doesn’t mean they were one country.
USA, GB, Canada etc. also have similar culture and language but nobody claims that they are one country.
“All of your larger states had considerable difficulty becoming unified, stable entities.”
But they were quite well united till XV-XVI century. Germany (and Italy) united in XIX century, about 3 centuries later.
#1648 Tiptoethrutulips
“WHO said Warsaw was German territory? “
You wrote: ” [Hitler] he said from the beginning, he wanted German territory back, as the Versailles Treaty was illegitimate, which it was. ” (your comment #1642)
Premises: Hitler conquered Warsaw in 1939.
Conclusion: therefore you claim that Warsaw was a German city.
“I’m not sure I understand your point here.”
My sentence about Jews in Poland was ironic.
ASAIK there was “antisemitism” in pre-war Poland but it was based on econimic tensions than racial theories like in Germany. Poland (after rebirth in 1918) was a poor country because of 123 years of occupation by Germans and Russians (1795-1918) and after calamities of World War I.
Anyway, Jews in Poland still had better living conditions than in other parts of Europe (where antisemitism was much severer).
“I also read somewhere that the Jewish population was in excess of 25% in the late 1800’s – early 1900’s;”
Probably your statistics relate to Warsaw or other city with huge Jewish population i.e. Jewish population in Warsaw in 1897 was 27% *. In 1931 census about 10% of population of Poland (about 3 milion).
“Why would England, having lost so many citizens in a war less than a generation past, whilst suffering economic deprivations domestically, offer to go to war over Poland?”
Because British were stupid. I think that English and French policies after 1918 was a disaster for Europe.
Brits first united with France to weaken it’s main rival Germany.
After war Brits supported Germany to weaken it’s main rival France.
Before WWII Brits supported France, Poland and other countries to weaken it’s main rival Germany.
Finally (after WWII), Brits lost whole imperium.
I don’t know how to name such policy. Call it “stupid” is not enought.
“The Corridor was vital to German industry and a connection to Germans in Prussia. “
The Corridor was also vital to Polish export via Gdynia port. Why Poles should place German interest above Polish interest?
—-
* Population of Warsaw -> chapter: National composition in the past. (“Ludność Warszawy. Rozdział: Skład narodowościowy w przeszłości”)
(I’m sorry, it is in Polish, I didn’t found English version)
If you scroll down and you will see that Poles (“Polacy”) were 62% of inhabitants of Warsaw and Jews (Polish: “Żydzi”) 27% in 1897.
** https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1931_Polish_census
#1649 The Old Philosopher
“(…) what is Wartheland but former German territory since 1793.”
It means 125 years.
From 966 to 1793 it was a Polish territory inhabitated in 90% by Poles.
It means 827 years.
This area in Polish language has even meaningful name- Polonia Major (in Latin) or Greater Poland.
Still you claim that this area was a German territory?
“The General Govt was merely an administrative structure to run the areas of Poland German had no choice but to continue to control given the war England insisted on coninuing to wage.”
“Germany was damn well entitled to use force to protect the Germans being murdered by Poles on territory that had been German.”
You claim that Germans had right to torture, murder, use Poles as slaves because of war with Allies.
Using your logic, Poles had no choice than expel Germans from Poland to prevent next war with Germany in the future.
“I mean just note how the US declares its right to use force to protect whatever it considers to be its interests anywhere in the world.
Why then is Germany evil for doing the same? “
You confirmed that Germany is like Britain or USA – brutal, imperialistic country.
Why you think that Germany had right to expand but other countries had no right to self-defence?
Germans took the risk to became superpower. They lost. They paid the price. Why Germans are now kveching that they are victims?
—–
* “General Government”, chapter “German intentions regarding the region”
“The conversion of Warsaw into a “model city” was planned in 1940 and later, in similar ways like the conversion of Berlin was planned. In March 1941 Hans Frank informed his subordinates that Hitler had made the decision to “turn this region into a purely German area within 15–20 years”. He explained: “Where 12 million Poles now live, is to be populated by 4 to 5 million Germans. The Generalgouvernement must become as German as the Rhineland.” ”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Government
#1648 Tiptoethrutulips
Addition.
“Let’s give the Mongols an honorable mention in terrorizing – thanks for keeping them out of Central Europe, by the way.
Me, Little Bunny fufu start to think …that maybe it was a mistake.
If Mongols had wrecked Western Europe in XIV century (Mongols were partially stopped by Poles)…
if Turks had wrecked Western Europe in XVII century (Turks were stopped by Poles in 1683 in battle of Vienna)…
if Soviets had wrecked Western Europe in XX century (Soviets were stopped by Poles in 1920 in battle of Warsaw)…
…then maybe we would not have have today so many arrogant Westerners who want turn whole world into electronic-Koncentrazion Lager.
> You suggested Hacha agreed under duress, did you not? The implication clearly was that Hitler’s actions were unethical or criminal.
More than that, Hitler’s actions showed that he could never be trusted to adhere to any treaty that might be signed over Danzig. After March 15, 1939, the Polish government knew very well that if they signed any agreement over Danzig that was similar to Munich, then Hitler would likely just wait 5 months before imposing new demands on Poland. The occupation of Czechia made an agreement over Danzig impossible.
> Therefore, as the Versailles Treaty was agreed to upon threat of invasion and continuing economic sanctions, please explain to me the difference.
Well, one obvious difference is that the Versailles Treaty came after Germany had fought a war for 4 years on French territory in which its early declared aims included much harsher terms than the Versailles Treaty.
https://thehistoryfiles.com/september-programme/
But this is just a diversion. All of the Weimar politicians sought to evade the conditions of the Versailles Treaty. The Rapallo Treaty was intended to provide a route around Versailles, so that the German military could continue preparing even with the Versailles Treaty nominally in force. But Hitler’s ambitions for a drive to the east, to acquire living space for the Aryan Herrenvolk at the expense of the Slavic subhuman, were a different matter altogether.
Whatever may have occurred in Pakistan, the tensions over Danzig and Poland only began to escalate after Hitler had tossed aside the Munich Agreement (less than 6 months after signing it) and occupied Czechia. Without that, it is far more likely that agreement could have been reached between Germany and Poland as had been done between Germany and Italy.
—–
In the spring of 1923 Mussolini had adopted Italianization as the official policy of his government and made its instigator, Tolomei, a senator… The use of the name ‘Alto Adige’ became obligatory and that of ‘south Tyrol’ or ‘German Tyrol’ a penal offence. German towns were given Italian names and German street signs removed, the German press was harassed and the German language progressively suppressed in the law courts, administration and schools. These measures provoked a bitter anti-Italian press campaign in Germany, to which the Italian press replied with equal passion. Early in May 1925 the Italian government made an official protest in Berlin.
—–
— Christopher Seton-Watson, Italy from Liberalism to Fascism, p. 689.
The reason that these German-Italian tensions were subsequently settled during Hitler’s time in office was not that Mussolini was somehow more German-friendly than the Poles were. It was simply that Hitler’s ambitions were directed towards expansion into eastern Europe, while he hoped that Mussolini would create a distraction for Britain and France. Hence, he worked diplomatically to assure Mussolini that the South Tyrol question could be settled peacefully. But it was never his intent to settle conflicts with Czechoslovakia and Poland peacefully without a German expansion to the east. That was why war etupted.
babbles:
Except, of course, there was no Poland as a governmental entity in the modern sense that you are using the term.
And there were elected kings of Poland from only 1572 through 1795 (just over 200 years) that was when Poland was ended as such with the final partition of 1795 after it had been partitioned twice before in 1772 and 1793.
So anyone making your extravagantly ridiculous claims about historical developments that is the basis for your declarations deserves no further consideration as anyone having anything worthwhile to say on any subject.
But my final point to you about your babblings is that the intentions and aims of goverenments and leaders need to be based on the conditions they confront as events unfold.
The conditions Hitler and the Reich faced in 1939 when the issue was limited to German-Polish relations regarding the murdering of Germans in the Corridor, the position of Danzig that its population was seeking to return to the Reich that the Poles were seeking to undermine by sending armed police into its territory, and custom free passage across the Corridor between German territory it divided were absolute different that the conditions he faced and had to respond to after the British French declaration of war and the British continuing the war after the insolent Poles junta had been silenced by its defeat.
And the steps he took when faced with that condition prove nothing at all about his having at the outset wanting to take over all of Poland and was merely using the conditions in play before the invasion as merely as a ruse to implement hidden long term plans that included conquering all of Poland.
And to top off your nonsense, you ask:
To prove what a fraudulent challenge you pose that has no basis in fact, post any statement I have made that expressly asserted what you claim I said.
Unless you do, you are a proven fraudster and liar.
Himmler clearly benefited from it the most. The SA was discredited, and the SS moved clearly into a commanding position with Hitler’s endorsement. As for whether or not Jewish organizations abroad benefited, there was no support for opening up Palestine after Crystal Night. If anything, the possibility of a conflict with Germany only caused Britain to renew its assurances to the Arabs that the Balfour Declaration was dead in the water. Yet this didn’t cause Chamberlain to withdraw from the Munich Agreement. It was only the occupation of Czechia on March 15 which did that.
> explain the resentment resistance that would generate among the German people against the non-Germans
As I said already, there is no evidence that working-class Germans ever subscribed to any such resentment. The votes from the German workers continued to go to the Social Democrats and Communists, though split between the 2 parties, right up until the last open election in November 1932. That’s not surprising because even though the percentage of Jews (versus the Jewish population) with good-paying middle-to-upper class careers was certainly higher than the corresponding percentage of Germans, the proportions of capital wealth owned by Jewish stockholders was in no way out of line with Jews as a share of the population. From the point of view of German proletarians, the exploiting class of capital-owners was not distinctively Jewish at all. That, again, is the difference between “income” versus “capital.”
> Germany was damn well entitled to use force to protect the Germans being murdered by Poles on territory that had been German.
Except that there was no murder of Germans by Poles when Hitler started the war. Pogroms began 2 days later on September 3 at Bromberg and spread around. But if Hitler had not pressed things towards war, this would never have happened.
From what I read, German expatriates were harassed and murdered by Poles as far back as 1920.
That’s ridiculous. That’s a completely inaccurate interpretation. Was East Berlin a Russian city? Was Congress Poland a Russian country? You’re just being difficult.
I’m not sure that’s true. Roman Dmowski (from wiki):
Dmowski often communicated his belief in an “international Jewish conspiracy” aimed against Poland.[81] In his essay “Żydzi wobec wojny” (Jews on the War) written about World War I,[82] Dmowski claimed that Zionism was only a cloak to disguise the Jewish ambition to rule the world. Dmowski asserted that once a Jewish state was established in Palestine, it would form “the operational basis for action throughout the world”.
Dmowski also claimed his Polish nationalist efforts were hindered by the Jews. He said, the majority of Russian Jews lived in Poland, and they were colluding with German Jews during WW1 as German Jews controlled banking, commerce and industry in Germany. They wanted to keep Poland weak so they could gain more control therein. Personally, I believe Dmowski. I also believe most Jews do quite well, despite never-ending claims of poverty, blah, blah, blah….until they get kicked to the curb, and then they just fly off, like bats, to their new bat cave elsewhere and start making another mess, yet again.
They DO seem stupid. But, they weren’t stupid. Their efforts to secure freedom for Poles was rather selective, was it not? All countries seek to maintain outside interests and prosperity for their citizens, or at least they should, so if they were actually concerned about Poland, for the sake of Polish people, they would have interfered with Russia’s constant meddling. England was infested with Jewish capital and their global interests, which is why they acted in opposition to the interests of their citizens; Jews are NOT English, nor are they Polish. Currently, the USA has billions for Ukraine, but nothing for Maui? Every person I know objects to the nonsense in Ukraine, and no one wants to send them a dime, but we are powerless to stop it. Extrapolate what’s happening now to what was happening then – same story, same people. Current presidential cabinet members are disproportionately Jewish, as are many department heads. Have you seen that Goblin Mayorkas? The borders are secure! Same people – same problems – same accusations. There is an obvious pattern, Little Bunny. Woe to us all.
They wouldn’t necessarily. If you would just read the terms offered by Hitler, maybe we would make some sort of progress instead of circling around this issue. You may not think the terms were acceptable, but the point is, he tried repeatedly to negotiate rather than fight over it.
You may want to do a little research into the Mongol’s version of prosperity.
How Poles and Hungarians Turned Back the Mongol Horde and Saved Europe
While the victories of the Hungarians and Poles in the 13th century did not stop the growth of Mongol power in Eastern Europe, they did check Mongol expansion into Central Europe. Much like the later heroism of King John III Sobieski against the Ottomans at Vienna in 1683, the Poles and Hungarians proved their might as Christian warriors against a foreign force. They did the same many times, especially during the subsequent lengthy wars against the Ottoman Turks. We owe a special debt of gratitude to the brave knights and foot soldiers who defended Central Europe and the West from the Golden Horde.
Scarcely had Europe emerged from the Dark Age when it faced another Asiatic invasion. This was the onslaught of the Mongols who turned west in the 13th century after conquering large parts of Asia. They pillaged Russia and Eastern Europe, leaving behind devastation and slavery. This is an account written by Giovanni de Plano Carpini, the Pope’s envoy to the Mongol Great Khan, who traveled through Kiev in February 1246:
They [the Mongols] attacked Rus [Russia], where they made great havoc, destroying cities and fortresses and slaughtering men, and they lay siege to Kiev, the capital of Rus; after they had besieged the city for a long time, they took it and put the inhabitants to death. When we were journeying through the land we came across countless skulls and bones of dead men lying on the ground. Kiev had been a very large and thickly populated town, but now it has been reduced almost to nothing, for there are at the present time scarce two hundred houses there, and the inhabitants are kept in complete slavery.1
The Mongols wanted all of Europe, and might have gotten it if the death of the great Ogedei Khan in 1242 had not sent Batu Khan, the leader who was ravaging Europe, back to the Mongolian capital to ensure his succession. Batu Khan left Eastern Europe depopulated and in ruins, but his return to Ulan Bator saved Western Europe. Still, Mongols remained in southern and central Russia for centuries in the Crimean, Kazan, and Astrakhan Khanates, which became hubs for slave raiding and trading. Some historians estimate that they enslaved more than three million Ukranians, Russians, and Poles.2 The word “slave” is etymologically close to the word “Slav” because of the number of Slavs who were enslaved over the centuries.
The Mongols are also blamed for the plague. Who knows?
I keep trying to tell you, my Little Bunny fufu, “it ain’t us!”
A statement can be simultaneously true and false. I submit Jews are quite capable of this maneuver:
The Liar Paradox is an argument that arrives at a contradiction by reasoning about a Liar Sentence. The Classical Liar Sentence is the self-referential sentence:
This sentence is false.
It leads to the same difficulties as the sentence, I am lying. Experts in the field of philosophical logic have never agreed on the way out of the trouble despite 2,300 years of attention. Here is the trouble. It is a sketch of the Paradox, the argument that reveals the contradiction:
Let L be the Classical Liar Sentence. If L is true, then L is false. But the converse also can be established, as follows. Assume L is false. Because the Liar Sentence is just the sentence L is false, the Liar Sentence is therefore true, so L is true. What has now been shown is that L is true if, and only if, it is false. Since L must be one or the other, it is both……Now, I’m not suggesting my arguments below fit this dilemma, but I am suggesting that the frequency of weaving falsehoods into truths is apparent if you pay attention, and if you do a little research. Ergo, Jewish censorship is rampant and legislation is needed to protect their pogrom fairy tales.
Wilson’s 14 points BS:
“We entered this war because violations of right had occurred which touched us to the quick and made the life of our own people impossible unless they were corrected and the world secure once for all against their recurrence.”
Was this true? Was America really suffering and in peril?
“VIII. All French territory should be freed and the invaded portions restored, and the wrong done to France by Prussia in 1871 in the matter of Alsace-Lorraine, which has unsettled the peace of the world for nearly fifty years, should be righted, in order that peace may once more be made secure in the interest of all.”
Was this true? Was the World really suffering over Alsace-Lorraine?
“XII. The Turkish portion of the present Ottoman Empire should be assured a secure sovereignty, but the other nationalities which are now under Turkish rule should be assured an undoubted security of life and an absolutely unmolested opportunity of autonomous development, and the Dardanelles should be permanently opened as a free passage to the ships and commerce of all nations under international guarantees.”
How did this work out for the Arabs therein? Of course, I’m referring to those citizens in Palestine who were to remain unmolested and secure.
“XIII. An independent Polish state should be erected which should include the territories inhabited by indisputably Polish populations, which should be assured a free and secure access to the sea, and whose political and economic independence and territorial integrity should be guaranteed by international covenant.”
Was Danzig “indisputably inhabited by Polish populations?”
“XIV. A general association of nations must be formed under specific covenants for the purpose of affording mutual guarantees of political independence and territorial integrity to great and small states alike.
In regard to these essential rectifications of wrong and assertions of right we feel ourselves to be intimate partners of all the governments and peoples associated together against the Imperialists. We cannot be separated in interest or divided in purpose. We stand together until the end.
For such arrangements and covenants we are willing to fight and to continue to fight until they are achieved; but only because we wish the right to prevail and desire a just and stable peace such as can be secured only by removing the chief provocations to war, which this programme does remove. We have no jealousy of German greatness, and there is nothing in this programme that impairs it. We grudge her no achievement or distinction of learning or of pacific enterprise such as have made her record very bright and very enviable. We do not wish to injure her or to block in any way her legitimate influence or power. We do not wish to fight her either with arms or with hostile arrangements of trade if she is willing to associate herself with us and the other peace- loving nations of the world in covenants of justice and law and fair dealing. We wish her only to accept a place of equality among the peoples of the world, — the new world in which we now live, — instead of a place of mastery.”
So, that explains the economic boycotts and threats of military invasions prior to the signing of the Versailles Treaty. And, to which Imperialists was he referring? Surely not England? Did the Treaty of Versailles injure Germany? Did he mention the war guilt mumbo-jumbo in this rather conciliatory speech?
How about a little Hollywood drama?
Princess Isabelle: The king desires peace.
William Wallace: Longshanks desires peace?
Princess Isabelle: He declares it to me, I swear it. He proposes that you withdraw your attack. In return he grants you title, estates, and this chest of gold which I am to pay to you personally.
William Wallace: A lordship and titles. Gold. That I should become Judas?
Princess Isabelle: Peace is made in such ways.
William Wallace: Slaves are made in such ways. The last time Longshanks spoke of peace I was a boy. And many Scottish nobles, who would not be slaves, were lured by him under a flag of truce to a barn, where he had them hanged. I was very young, but I remember Longshank’s notion of peace.
Also from Braveheart:
Narrator : I shall tell you of William Wallace. Historians from England will say I am a liar, but history is written by those who have hanged heroes.
And, “An oath to a liar is no oath at all.”
Of course, I make no claims about the veracity of this dialogue as it pertains to William Wallace, but the principles are true. I also chose it because Mel Gibson’s father never told him a lie. Do you ever wonder why Judas or Judea is always associated with treachery and betrayals? This frequent “association” proves nothing, but fire is hot, water is wet, if it walks like a duck…..
That nicely sums up the lies, deceptions and misrepresentations he included in all three of his preceding comments.
From the US Department of State, Office of the Historian:
Section XI.—Free City of Danzig (Art. 100 to 108)
Notes to Part III, Section XI, Articles 100 to 108
Danzig
The surrender of this “purely German Hanseatic city” and “its equally purely German environs” was declared by the German delegation to be “in the sharpest opposition to all the assurances” given by President Wilson, and would “lead to violent resistance and to an enduring state of war in the East”. Germany therefore rejected “the proposed rape of Danzig” (Foreign Relations, The Paris Peace Conference, 1919, vi, 836). But it was prepared to make Memel, Königsberg, and Danzig free ports in order to assure Poland “a direct outlet to the great highways of the sea”, as promised by President Wilson, and to grant the Poles “far-reaching rights”, subject to an agreement concerning the reciprocal use of German and Polish railways and rivers. […] The Free City of Danzig and its relations to Poland became, with the question of German minorities in Poland (see article 91), the casus belli of Germany in September 1939. The “explosion on the part of the military forces which have taken up their position” was set off because of tension, according to the German message of August 31, 1939 to the British Government, owing to “(1) the impossible delineation of frontiers, as fixed by Versailles dictate; (2) the impossible treatment of the minority in the ceded territories” […]
On August 12, 1936 the German Chancellor assured the Polish Under Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs that “Polish rights in the Free City, which he knew and understood, could not suffer the least detriment” from the National Socialists.
After 1936 the High Commissioner played a minor and decreasing part with respect to Danzig and in Danzig-Polish relations. There was, on the other hand, an increase of German-Polish relations, in which Germany voiced claims on behalf of the Free City but entirely within the bounds of the established regime.
On November 5, 1937, when the German-Polish minorities declaration (see art. 91) was announced, the German Chancellor formulated his attitude to the Polish Ambassador in three points: There would be no changes in the legal and political position in Danzig; the rights of the Polish population in Danzig would be respected; the rights of Poland in Danzig would be respected. The Chancellor added, according to the Ambassador’s report, that “a surprise step was out [Page 244] of the question”, but he also remarked that “Poland is bound up with Danzig”. He reiterated that declaration to the Polish Minister for Foreign Affairs on January 14, 1938. […]
The German Minister for Foreign Affairs proposed to the Polish Ambassador on October 24, 1938 a general settlement which included the reunion of Danzig with the Reich, Poland being assured of an extraterritorial road, a railroad and a free port, and economic facilities there. Poland would agree to the building of an extraterritorial motor road and railroad line across Pomorze. In his instructions to the Ambassador the Polish Minister for Foreign Affairs on October 31 stated that he was “ready to have final conversations personally with the governing circles of the Reich”. […]
The German Chancellor made a speech to the Reichstag on April 28, 1939, in which he argued that the Treaty of Versailles intentionally “inflicted a most severe wound on Germany” by establishing the Corridor and Danzig in such a way as to prevent understanding between Poland and Germany. The speech was the public frame for a memorandum handed to the Polish Government in which it was asserted that Poland had rejected the German proposals on Danzig and the Corridor and, by assuming the obligations of April 6 with the United Kingdom, which were incompatible with the German-Polish declaration of January 26, 1934, had “arbitrarily and unilaterally rendered this declaration inoperative” […]
As to negotiations, the German Führer, in a letter of August 23 to the British Prime Minister, said “Germany was prepared to settle the problem of Danzig and of the Polish Corridor by a very generous proposal, made once only, and by means of negotiations”. This quotation is from the German-English version of the German Foreign Office (Official Documents, No. 456). The original German reads: “Deutschland war bereit, die Frage Danzig und die des Korridors durch einen wahrhaft einmalig grosszügigen Vorschlag auf dem Wege von Verhandlungen zu lösen”. The British translation reads: “negotiation on the basis of a proposal of truly unparalleled magnanimity”. Any inclination of Poland to negotiate was “effectually destroyed” by the United Kingdom’s guaranty to Poland. Referring to proposed British military mobilization, the Führer wrote: “I must, therefore, inform Your Excellency that in the event of such military measures being taken, I shall order the immediate mobilization of the German armed forces (Wehrmacht)”.
So, let me get this straight: The Poles were behaving splendidly and everything was moving along as NOT intended, which means the Poles and Germans were getting along just fine. Adolf Hitler, whilst taking a break from his planned invasion of the USA via South America, decided, what’s with all this peace in Danzig and the Corridor? Why is it that any attempt at negotiations, to circumvent force, by Hitler is “just a ruse,” yet everyone else in the western world is truthful and inordinately concerned with the freedom of people living in places far removed from their sphere of influence? Who is it that considers the Whole World their sphere of influence?
I would speculate Hitler was much more understanding of a nation’s national interests. As as matter of fact, no speculation is necessary, as he hammered, on and on, about a nation keeping their interests and resources within their borders first, and then seeking mutually beneficial relationships with other nations.
Is that so? Germania had been around, in one form or another, for centuries, therefore there were Germans, with German interests, all over Central and Eastern-ish Europe. Please tell me about those “ancient” Czechoslovakians. What say you about the Poles, sneaking in to Czechoslovakia, on Hitler’s coattails? How is Czechoslovakia today? You’re right, Hitler had no intention of being the whipping-boy for the English, the vulture-capitalists nor the communists.
Here’s a tid-bit about German character from the Greensboro News & Record in the USA:
Now picture this, same time, same war, half a world away. A farm truck stops at the stockade area of the Overseas Replacement Depot (ORD) in Greensboro. A dozen German POWs pile into the back. No guards with guns climb aboard. Off go the prisoners for a day of work on a farm.“Only in America,’ as the late journalist and philosopher Harry Golden of Charlotte would say.
The Germans, it must be said, did good work on Piedmont farms and more than earned the 80 cents a day Uncle Sam paid under the Geneva Convention.
William Coble’s barn stands as evidence of German craftsmanship. It’s so picturesque that artists have painted it through the years. […] From William Coble’s farm, the POWs crossed West Friendly Avenue and dismantled the top of a barn on the Lindley farm. They brought it across the road and up the hill to the Coble Farm, then called Sunnyhill Dairy, and rebuilt it on terra cotta walls.
Wasn’t she scared looking out the back door at enemy soldiers 100 yards away? Not a bit, says Ruth Coble, William Coble’s wife.
“They were as nice of people as you would ever want to see,’ she remembers.
Every account I read of German POWs in America is the same: they worked hard; they were well-mannered; they caused no trouble; they didn’t seem like enemies nor as they were portrayed by the Media.
I have compared numerous accounts from citizens within “Nazi” occupied areas and Bolshevik/Soviet occupied areas. My conclusion? Excuse my language, but you’re full of shit, McNally. Their national character is obvious. I’m not saying they were pacifists nor never overly aggressive, but the monsters were/are exactly who Hitler said they were/are.
You got that straight. Bless you (strong dose of sarcasm intended).
Which Pew Survey did you consult for this conclusion?
Everyone knows the difference between income vs. capital. That’s not exactly the issue. The issue is the official narratives of Jewish oppression, restrictions, exclusions, ad nauseam….yet, spectacular wealth accrual by the Rothschilds, Sassoons, Marks & Spencer, et al, and locally, by their own admission, they describe prosperous live, always kvetching about mistreatment, never a word of appreciation for Gentile nations.
From the Jewish Virtual Library:
“In Hungary
The Hungarian wool trade was conducted almost entirely by Jews, who were thus in a position to establish textile industries. Adolf and Heinrich Kohner, originally Moravian feather merchants, established Hungary’s first modern wool textile factories. Other notable textile manufacturers were Robert Szurday (originally Weiss, ennobled in 1899), Leo Buday (originally Goldberger), and Samuel Goldberger (ennobled in 1867).
Bohemia and Moravia
These areas, the most industrialized in the Hapsburg Empire, also produced most of its textiles, and Jews played a prominent role in this industry. From the 17th century Jews had been almost the sole dealers in raw wool, from the peasants together with furs, hides, livestock, and other agricultural produce.”
Far be it from me to criticize Jewish industriousness, but it’s the Jewish international capital that enables local Jews to corner markets by importing materials sourced overseas using foreign labor, using Jewish shipping magnates, who achieved prominence by the same methods – this happens in multiple industries, and since they care NOT for the gentile countries they inhabit, they make no attempt to share or include gentiles in this prosperity, And they use their international networks to thwart non-Jewish competition. So, the international tycoons make millions, and the local Jewish merchants draw tremendous income from their international-money bankrolled businesses.
It’s not just business where the treachery is observed. Jews flew in to South Africa once the Dutch had built a prosperous society, as their international capital was quite useful for gold/diamond mining; they used English battering rams against the Dutch, of course. Eventually, the Jews agitated for Equality! and human rights for Africans, but once Apartheid fell, they flew like bats out of hell (quite literally) so they wouldn’t have to endure the consequences of their meddling; they retain their mineral interests, of course. Anywho…if you’re Jewish in South Africa today, you can fly straight into the arms of Israel. If you’re Afrikaans or English, you’re mostly stuck.
Geez, it’s almost as if early on there were people who (just in case) were deliberately attempting to create political conditions which would ensure the outbreak of a devastating new world war.
H G Wells, the British establishment author of The Open Conspiracy (1928) and The New World Order (1940) amongst other notable works, apparently readily (and easily) saw this as well.
In his ‘prophetic’ 1933 novel, The Shape of Things to Come, it is no less than the city of Danzig which kicks WWII off.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Shape_of_Things_to_Come
Probably related, I’ve posted before about how there were at least three major Anglosphere produced movies ie High Treason (1929), Men Must Fight (1933), and Things to Come (1936), which told there audiences that a future world war would be taking place no later than the specific year of ‘1940’, with Germany (generally) being presented as a future primary ‘enemy’.
A fascinating article on the 1929 film High Treason. YouTube has a copy and it’s worth a look see.
https://andyoucallyourselfascientist.com/2020/10/10/high-treason-1929/
A production still and dialogue from the same film…
“Secret forces are driving the great continents into war as surely as they did in 1914…”
A contemporary movie poster:
There were disturbances in 1920, including pogroms against Jews. But none of this has much to do with the crisis of 1939. The Polish government was acutely aware in 1939 that any support from Britain and France which they might receive depended on not starting anything prematurely. It was only after that the German invasion had been launched on September 1 that the pogroms against Germanic Polish citizens started. Specifically:
—–
Most notoriously in Bromberg (Bydgoszcz), attacks on Germans on 3 September had the character of a local pogrom… The Germans claimed in November 1939 that 5,400 had been killed in the ‘September Murders’ (including what they dubbed the ‘Bromberg Bloody Sunday’). Then, in February 1940, on Hitler’s own instructions (it was later claimed) this was simply multiplied by around ten-fold and a figure of 58,000 German dead invented. The most reliable estimates put the total number of ethnic Germans killed in outrages, forced marches, bombing and shelling at around 4,000. Terrible though these atrocities were, they were more or less spontaneous outbursts of hatred that took place in the context of panic and fear following the German invasion.
—–
— Ian Kershaw, Hitler: 1936-1945, Nemesis, p. 242.
None of this would have come about if not for the German invasion of Poland. Furthermore, the invasion itself could likely have been avoided if the occupation of Czechia had never taken place, and if Hitler had simply raised the Danzig issue as a diplomatic matter in the way of the Sudetenland in 1938. It was the occupation of Czechia which made a Munich deal impossible over Danzig and led to a war which resulted in the Bromberg pogrom.
> In his instructions to the Ambassador the Polish Minister for Foreign Affairs on October 31 stated that he was “ready to have final conversations personally with the governing circles of the Reich”. […]
That is exactly how things could have ended, if Hitler had not occupied Czechia. You don’t seem to grasp the implications of the bits and pieces which you’ve randomly selected here. If Hitler had never carried out his push on Czechoslovakia in March 14-16, 1939, then there probably would have been a resolution achieved over Danzig between Germany and Poland. Once Hitler had violated the Munich Agreement, then it became obvious that no Polish government could ever trust a deal which Hitler pretended to sign over Danzig.
You might be interested in this observation by Dr. William Pierce. He made a few claims in his writing that seemed a bit far-fetched when I began reading his work; every time I went to “fact-check” him, he was proved correct. This essay excerpt includes observations on their habits within gentile society:
Lest I seem like a hypocrite, I should tell you that I am not denigrating the Jews because they value their own lives quite differently from the lives of non-Jews. I am not denigrating the Jews for not being the egalitarians they pretend to be. I am denigrating them for pretending to be what they are not. No one in his right mind is an egalitarian. The members of every tribe that will survive very long on this planet value the lives of their fellow tribesmen above the lives of those who are not members of the tribe. Judaism is a survival-oriented religion. Christianity is not. Perhaps a more meaningful and relevant difference between the two religions is that Judaism is a religion for survival in a multicultural society. It is a religion for governing the behavior of a Jewish minority in the presence of a non-Jewish majority. Christianity, on the other hand, is a religion for governing the behavior of Christians in a homogeneous Christian society. In a multicultural society it becomes suicidal. Judaism makes very clear distinctions between Jews and non-Jews, and the rules are different for the way a Jew should behave toward his fellow Jews and the way he should behave toward non-Jews: quite different. In Christianity the rules are the same for everybody. That’s an important distinction, and it’s important for us to understand it. It’s important for the minority of Christians who aren’t lemmings to understand it too.
So again, I don’t denigrate Jews because they don’t believe in treating everyone the same. They want to survive, and there’s nothing wrong with wanting to survive. What’s pathological about the Jews is that they are constituted for existing as a predatory minority in a non-Jewish society. Judaism is a religion for predators. Christianity is a religion for pacifists. Judaism encourages deception. Christianity insists on truthfulness. Each is suited to a specific sort of environment. The Jews, through their control of the mass media of news and entertainment, have deliberately changed the environment in America to suit themselves, to enhance their own survivability at the expense of the non-Jewish majority. That’s what they always do everywhere that they are allowed to get away with it. That is their nature. That is why they often are successful, and it also is the reason why they are so hated and always have been. It is for good reason that we have the very well-known and often-used terms “anti-Semite” and “anti-Semitic,” but don’t have equivalent terms for other ethnic groups. “Anti-Semite,” of course, is a bit of a misnomer. It doesn’t mean a person who doesn’t like Arabs or other Semites; it means only a person who doesn’t like Jews. There is no term “anti-Buddhist” or “anti-Hindu,” even though there are far more Buddhists and Hindus in the world than Jews. Believe me, the Jews are special. They are unique.
We may have conflicts with other groups — we may be threatened by other groups — but no other group has ever threatened our existence in the way we are threatened by the Jews. Being predatory by nature may give the Jews certain survival advantages, just as it tends to get them into trouble a lot more often than is the case for most other groups. It also makes it very difficult for them to have a “normal” mode of existence: that is, to live only among themselves, instead of as a minority among non-Jews.
> he hammered, on and on, about a nation keeping their interests and resources within their borders first, and then seeking mutually beneficial relationships with other nations.
No, he did not. Hitler’s goes on endlessly about the need for the Aryan race to expand its living space. He maintains that Slavic eastern Europe, especially Russia, is the logical place for the Aryan population to expand. There is nothing which he ever says about a “nation” keeping within some kind of borders. His view is that the construct of a “nation-state” only exists to facilitate racial interests, where the interests of the race require an outlet for steady territorial expansion. The function of the nation is to secure that expansion of the race.
All of this laid out multiple times in Mein Kampf, the Second Book, and multiple speeches, many of which are cited by Irving in The War Path and Hitler’s War. No honest reading of Hitler’s own words would support the description which you’ve given.
> Which Pew Survey did you consult for this conclusion?
The first simplest source to use is simply the record of votes in Weimar elections. You can either look them up on Wiki or else go to pages 982-3 of Alan Bullock, Hitler and Stalin: Parallel Lives. The most pertinent parties to consider here are the National Socialists (NSDAP), the Social Democrats (SPD) and the Communists (KPD). Focusing on the election of May 20, 1928; September 14, 1930; July 31, 1932; and November 6, 1932, gives the voting percentages of:
NSDAP: 2.6, 18.3, 37.4, 33.1.
SPD: 29.8, 24.5, 21.6, 20.4.
KPD: 10.6, 13.1, 14.6, 16.9.
The July 31 election is the only one where the percentage vote for the NSDAP managed to outstrip the combined votes for the SPD and KPD. Even here it should be emphasized that there was no falling off in the votes for the latter two parties. It was just that a sector of middle-class conservatives gave their vote to the NSDAP, allowing the latter to surge to 37.4% (still not a majority vote) before declining again to 33.1. The labor vote continued to go the SPD and KPD right up until the end. But the latter two parties were at each other’s throats in bitter rivalry, which played to the advantage of the NSDAP. In that respect, it was sort of similar to the way that Admiral Kolchak’s coup d’état against the government of Social Revolutionaries in Siberia in 1918 guaranteed the victory of the Bolsheviks in Siberia.
Bits and pieces? I read the entire applicable text; I randomly selected bits and pieces for convenience.
Czechoslovakia was not a “naturally” established country. Are you suggesting that the Czechoslovakian authorities were not perturbed over a foreigner, Chamberlain, deciding on territory annexation on their behalf? Hitler wanted former German territory, which was illegally taken via a dubiously obtained treaty, returned to Germany. I’m sure the Czechs caused no trouble, whatsoever, over an agreement, for which they felt no real need to conform, as they were not consulted. Didn’t Churchill say, about Chamberlain, “You chose dishonor and you will have war.” Yes, he did. Were the Soviets mucking about with the Czechs? Did the Soviets burn and hang Chamberlain in effigy over the Munich Agreement? How much Sabre rattling was Hitler meant to ignore?
In light of the rather lengthy “bits & pieces” highlighted below regarding Poland, and her often perfidious conduct during WW1, explain to me why Poland was entitled to the territory granted to her? And, by an illegally acquired treaty, no less. (Note how the Poles turned on the Austrians, who had been their benefactors.)
From US Department of State:
“The Allied reply stated that the German language showed “some want of appreciation of the true situation” (ibid., p. 950). The arrangements for Danzig, which had been framed “with the most scrupulous care”, were intended to restore the city to the position which it had occupied for so many centuries as the port of Poland. Poland justly claimed that “the control and development of the port which is her sole opening to the sea shall be in her hands and that the communications between it and Poland shall not be subjected to any foreign control”.”
(It is universally accepted that Danzig was entirely German in 1918. How far back in time do we go to rectify past actions? For Jews, it’s thousands of years, which is why they won’t stop until Amalek is utterly destroyed.)
From the International Encyclopedia of the First World War:
At the beginning of the 20th century, the political status of the territories inhabited by the Poles differed greatly. Due to the partition of Poland at the end of the 18th century, Poles lived in three different states under varying political, social, economic, and cultural conditions on the eve of the Great War. In Russian-Poland, also called Congress-Poland, authorities conducted a process of Russification. The Polish language was not allowed in the public sphere, including in contact with authorities.[3]
Many Poles who did not want to submit to these conditions moved to Galicia, also referred to as Austrian-Poland, where the political atmosphere was completely different. Poles living under Francis Joseph I, Emperor of Austria (1830-1916) were in a much better position than their compatriots in Russian-Poland, subjects of Nicholas II, Emperor of Russia (1868-1918). Since 1860, Galicia had enjoyed extensive political and cultural autonomy, with a local parliament in Lviv (Lwów), municipal corporations, and guaranteed citizens’ rights such as freedom of press, speech, and demonstration, and the right to establish political parties. Administrative, education, and judicial systems were polonized. Polish culture flourished and was able to develop without any political obstacles. Poles enjoyed a privileged status, both politically and economically dominating other ethnic and religious groups such as the Ruthenians/Ukrainians and the Jews, who together made up more than half the population of Galicia.[4]
The harshest restrictions placed upon Polish national life occurred in Prussian-Poland, where a ruthless process of Germanization was conducted. The Polish language was forbidden in the administration, in schools, and in the judiciary system. Germans were most hated by the Poles in the years leading up to the war.[5] […]
In June 1908, Polish radicals connected to the military branch of the Polish Socialist Party established the Union of Active Fight (Związek Walki Czynnej, ZWC). The Austrian government discreetly tolerated this secret military organization. Its main aim was to train military commanders for a new national Polish army, in preparation for the next anti-Russian uprising in Russian-Poland. […] Events in southeastern Europe generated strong impulses to intensify such activity. In October 1912, influenced by Balkan complications and on the eve of an anticipated war between Russia and Austria-Hungary, a delegation consisting of a handful of Polish political parties established an umbrella organization named The Provisional Commission of Parties Striving for Independence (Tymczasowa Komisja Skonfederowanych Stronnictw Niepodległościowych). Its aim was the coordination of activities to reestablish Polish statehood with support from Austria-Hungary.[8] […]
The war, which finally erupted in the summer of 1914, surprised Poles as well as other European societies. At this point, Poles displayed loyalty toward their own states – Russia, Austria-Hungary, and Germany – respectively. […]
However, in the first stage of the Great War the most active Polish political camp worked in Austria-Hungry. The Polish national activists summoned the First Company under the command of socialist activist Józef Piłsudski (1867-1935) in Cracow and, immediately after the outbreak of hostilities with Russia, crossed the Russian border with the aim of provoking a massive anti-Russian uprising.[…] (colluding with the enemies, were they? How will they be punished?)
This was, however, incomparable to the roughly 3.5 million Polish soldiers who were mobilized to serve in the regular forces of the Russian, Austro-Hungarian, and German armies. […] From the Polish perspective, the First War could be characterized as a Polish civil war.
Point thirteen from Woodrow Wilson’s (1856-1924) congressional speech on 8 January 1918 assumed that as a result of the war, an independent Poland, consisting of all ethnic Polish territories and having access to the sea, would be reestablished. This assumption was repeated on 3 June 1918 in the Versailles Declaration during one of the Allied conferences as well as in many unilateral statements of Western allies. In the final two years of the war, Polish sympathies had shifted in favor of the Entente, which promised better conditions to the Poles than the Central Powers.[26] […]
In Galicia, respect toward Austrian authorities steadily declined. In summer and early autumn of 1918, demoralized and helpless Austrian authorities in Galicia fell into a state of inertia, their decisions generally ignored by the Polish populace. In many parts of Galicia, inhabitants were terrorized by bands of deserters, hidden in forest complexes. Authorities did not have enough power or energy to fight them off and thus they were forced to tolerate them.[31]
In contrast to the situation in Galicia and in spite of losing the war, the political crisis, and revolutionary upheavals in Germany, German administration in Prussian-Poland stood firm, fulfilled its duties, and maintained formal control. German officials did not consider voluntarily resigning from these terrains in favor of a Polish state, especially because these territories were mixed in population. Germans troops, which came back from the former Russian Empire in November 1918, still regarded the 1914 border as valid. In December 1918, the provincial parliament of the Great Poland region was summoned to Poznań to decide the region’s political future. At the end of the month, as a result of Ignacy Paderewski’s arrival, an anti-German uprising erupted in Great Poland. Poles controlled the greatest part of the region until the ceasefire in February 1919.[35] […]
It must be emphasized that military operations did not end on Polish soil in November 1918, but rather were followed by a border struggle in the new state, which continued for the next three years. Fighting took place in many areas: Eastern Galicia (war with the Ukrainians, October 1918 to July 1919), Great Poland (anti-German uprising, December 1918 to February 1919), Upper Silesia (three anti-German uprisings, 1919-1921), the raid on the Vilnius region (October 1920), and the war with Soviet Russia (until March 1921). From the Polish perspective, the First World War should be treated together with the above mentioned border struggles, which did not end until the signing of the Polish-Soviet Peace Treaty in Riga on 18 March 1921.[38] In the following years Poland remained isolated in the region and relations with the majority of its neighbors, with the exception of Romania and Latvia, remained cool or absolutely frozen, full of either suspicion and distrust or only lightly concealed hostility.
As usual, you and your ilk take statements out of context, nor do you ascribe speech or actions, once perfectly acceptable in pro-English/pro-American leaders, aka pro-Jewish stooges, as perfectly reasonable for this particular German leader (although America’s ruination via Jewish influence is more recent – Mr. Franklin, who did call Germans “swarthy,” said, don’t let Jews in, for the love of God! – I’m sure he’s rolling in his grave, recanting his insults to Germans, as he rolls…)
Pro-Jewish = good. You are a Jew! Be proud, but do NOT look upon the image of Christ, as that Christian pastor hides your ungrateful, prideful self from Evil Nazis, who unfairly claim we Jews are destructive to western society! But, remember…don’t cross yourself, they are all cattle – even the best of them, Jesus is boiling in excrement, they destroyed our Temple! it’s ok to steal from a gentile, do NOT let them read the Talmud!….said every Rabbi, ever.
Pro-European = used to be good, ok to expand territory during eras of international expansion and exploration, ok to share technology, BUT then, Germany = bad. Rest of Europe = bad. Colonizers, slavers, bigots, racists, women are baby-making slaves to their men, let the “negrification” occur, and enjoy gang-rape, robbery, looting, rap music, burning cities, failing schools, over-vaccination containing diseased materials, dual Israeli citizens, wars for Israel, enormous subsidies to Israel, all courtesy of Jewish = good…..said Adolf Hitler, rather presciently.
Did I drift a bit off topic? Not really; it’s all related to Hitler’s defeat. I know you don’t like it, but it is possible to evaluate, analyze, and contrast offensive actions, defensive actions, and changes to objectives due to changing circumstances.
(From Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf (1924) – From Volume II, Section 14).
[…] State boundaries are made by man and changed by man.
The fact that a nation has succeeded in acquiring an undue amount of soil constitutes no higher obligation that it should be recognized eternally. At most it proves the strength of the conquerors and the weakness of the nations. And in this case, right lies in this strength alone. If the German nation today, penned into an impossible area, faces a lamentable future, this is no more a commandment of Fate than revolt against this state of affairs constitutes an affront to Fate. No more than any higher power has promised another nation more territory than the Gerrnan nation, or is offended by the fact of this unjust distribution of the soil. Just as our ancestors did not receive the soil on which we live today as a gift from Heaven, but had to fight for it at the risk of their lives, in the future no folkish grace will win soil for us and hence life for our people, but only the might of a victorious sword.
Much as all of us today recognize the necessity of a reckoning with France, it would remain ineffectual in the long run if it represented the whole of our aim in foreign policy. It can and will achieve meaning only if it offers the rear cover for an enlargement of our people’s living space in Europe. For it is not in colonial acquisitions that we must see the solution of this problem, but exclusively in the acquisition of a territory for settlement, which will enhance the area of the mother country, and hence not only keep the new settlers in the most intimate community with the land of their origin, but secure for the total area those advantages which lie in its unified magnitude.
The folkish movement must not be the champion of other peoples, but the vanguard fighter of its own. Otherwise it is superfluous and above all has no right to sulk about the past. For in that case it is behaving in exactly tbe same wav. The old German policy was wrongly determined by dynastic considerations, and the future policy must not be directed by cosmopolitan folkish drivel. In particular, we are not constables guarding the well-known ‘poor little nations,’ but soldiers of our own nation.
But we National Socialists must go further. The right to possess soil can become a duty if without extension of its soil a great nation seems doomed to destruction. And most especially when not some little negro nation or other is involved, but the Germanic mother of life, which has given the present-day world its cultural picture. Germany will either be a world power or there will be no Germany. And for world power she needs that magnitude which will give her the position she needs in the present period, and life to her citizens.
Indeed. That’s what many claim; when you read the 14 Point Facade, the Treaty, and then learn the conditions under which it was obtained, it’s clear peace was not the objective.
The use of the cinema was something I recently learned that occurred prior to WW2 as a primer for war. I used to think western nations were above that nonsense. It’s a shame, as art can be such a powerful source for good in society; I think “The Family Man” was such a powerful film with a thoughtful message and enough silliness to make it rather enjoyable to watch. The CD should be a mandatory wedding gift for new couples.
It is interesting how science fiction authors seem to predict the future rather accurately; I’m fairly certain Cowboys & Aliens was a documentary.
Thanks for posting, spot on analysis and explanation of what it takes for any group to survive in competition with others involving the existential question of acquiring and maintining the resources necessary for any group to survive.
His key point that accounts for an essential condition for survivial is:
The members of any group that doesn’t is consigned to extinction. Like the do-gooders in American wanting to provide resources and services for illegal immigrants they deny to their fellow American.
There is no recovering from this unless and until those in power who support such treason are placed where they belong with no way back.
#1656 The Old Philosopher
“Except, of course, there was no Poland as a governmental entity in the modern sense that you are using the term.
And there were elected kings of Poland from only 1572 through 1795 (just over 200 years) (…)”
You missed Piast dynasty in Poland – 966-1370 and Jagiellonian dynasty in Poland – 1385-1572 (personal union of Poland and Lithuania- it means the same king in both countries: Kingdom of Poland and Grand Duchy of Lithuania).
Elected kings in “Poland” (in fact in Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth or Republic of Both Nations)- 1572-1795 you cited correctly.
Major regional conflicts in Poland were settled till XIII century. As far as I know, the last big region of Poland- Mazovia* (area around Warsaw) was formally incorporated into Kingdom of Poland in 1526 (although in fact it was strongly connected to Poland much earlier).
Anyway, in XVI century Kingdom of Poland was quite well united. In contrary to Germany which were unable to unite untill XIX century.
“The conditions Hitler and the Reich faced in 1939 when the issue was limited to German-Polish relations regarding the murdering of Germans in the Corridor,(…)”
You have no proofs (mass graves etc.) that German innocent civilians (it means: not spies, not saboteurs, not common criminals) were deliberately killed in 1939 (or shortly before) by Poles (maybe except Bloody Sunday** in Bydgoszcz (Bromberg) on 3-4 September 1939 where 300 Germans were killed but remember that Germans killed over 1,000-3,000 Poles in retaliation).
” [Me]: Why you think that Germany had right to expand but other countries had no right to self-defence?
To prove what a fraudulent challenge you pose that has no basis in fact, post any statement I have made that expressly asserted what you claim I said.”
Straw man fallacy?
You agree that other countries have right to self-defence? Right?
Self-defence means also preemptive attack.
Just like Germans in (alleged ) self-defence made an preemptive attack on Poland.
Do you agree that other nations have right to self-defence including preemptive attack ?
Unless you don’t answer the simple question I will treat you like a manipulator.
“So anyone making your extravagantly ridiculous claims about historical developments that is the basis for your declarations deserves no further consideration as anyone having anything worthwhile to say on any subject.”
You didn’t answer simple question why Poznań (Posen) region possessed, governed and populated by Poles by over 800 years is an eternal German territory.
——
* “Mazovia”
” In the second half of 15th century western Mazovia and in 1526/1529 the main part (with its capital in Warsaw) was incorporated into the Polish state.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mazovia
** “Bloody Sunday”
“Bloody Sunday (German: Bromberger Blutsonntag; Polish: Krwawa niedziela) was a sequence of violent events that took place in Bydgoszcz (German: Bromberg), a Polish city with a sizable German minority, between 3 and 4 September 1939, during the German invasion of Poland.
“After German Selbstschutz snipers fired on retreating Polish troops, there was a Polish reaction against the German minority and then the retaliatory execution of Polish hostages by the Wehrmacht and Selbstschutz, after the fall of the city. All these events resulted in the deaths of both German and Polish civilians. The Polish Institute of National Remembrance found and confirmed 254 Lutheran victims, assumed to be German civilians, and 86 Catholic victims, assumed to be Polish civilians, as well as 20 Polish soldiers. Approximately 600–800 Polish hostages were shot in a mass execution in the aftermath of the fall of the city. “
“After the Germans took over the city, they killed 1,200–3,000 Polish civilians in retaliation, as part of Operation Tannenberg.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bloody_Sunday_(1939)
Anything which involves a jump from October 1938 to April 1939 can at best be described as “bits and pieces.” The full documentary record shows that Hitler never intended to adhere to the Munich Agreement, and this is totally independent of whether one considers the Czechoslovak state to be “natural.” If there had been no determined effort by Hitler to force his terms of occupation on Czechia, then it’s quite plausible that the Czechoslovak state might have dissolved itself in 1941 without any foreign military occupation. Something like what happened in 1993. But that was not Hitler’s agenda. His aim was to gain a hold over Czechoslovakia, from which he could impose terms on Poland, and launch the greater drive to the east. A leap from October 1938 (when the Munich Agreement was less than a month old) to April 1939 (when it was clearly dead) skips over the crucial intermediary events.
> As usual, you and your ilk take statements out of context
There’s nothing out of context about the fact that Hitler’s ambitions for living space meant that he was aiming to thrust aside any kind of national borders wherever it suited him. He avoided a conflict with Mussolini over South Tyrol, even though a strict classical reading of national frontiers could have been made to justify a conflict with Italy. Yet he had resolved that the place for an expanding Aryan race was in eastern Europe, and hence conflict with Italy was best avoided. Meanwhile, and Slavic governments, even if the Czarist had somehow managed to survive into the 1940s by a historical accident, would have had to come into conflict with Hitler’s lebensraum agenda.
You know what Fufu, how lands were divided up between what nobles and people even two hundred much less five hundred or a thousand years go doesn’t add up to a thimble-full of shit.
In any case, territorial boundaries are not sacrosanct and divinely ordained. They are made and unmade by humans based and the strength of the contending parties and their willing to reach settlements peacefully or by resorting to force.
And the key to resorting to force is that once you appeal your case to heaven ., there is no other court you can go go and the result is at least temporarily final until the parties are ready for the next go around.
And then at each juncture, the question is who precipitated the event for what purpose, and what alternatives there were for a peaceful resolution that accommodated the interest of all parties rather than someone creating conditions that left people only the choice of fighting or surrendering to the demands the conditions the party created imposed on them.
It all comes back to the principle the Spartan propounded when a city state pleaded with them to forebear with their demands in the name of justice, to which the Spartan responded: “The strong do as they will, and the weak duffer as they must,” at least until the worm turns.
That being so, the Carthaginian peace the Romans imposed on Carthage is the only option the strong have to prevent the weak from ever rising up against them.
The fact is that it was the UK-US conspiracy to crush Germany as an economic competitor that produce both WWI and WWII. They succeeded and were thereby able to make up the lies by which they could claim it was the Germans who were responsible for all of it, when it was they who set the stage for the play that followed in each case.
The worm is now turning, and the results are unlikely to be pretty. It is, however becoming crystal clear the world has had it with the phony rules based order the US empire is seeking to impose on the world.
As a result, a new rules based order is emerging that will put an end to the US Empire.
Is it “Bits & Pieces,’ or is it considering context and extenuating circumstances?
Woodrow Wilson, 14 Point Facade, partial quote: “ We have no jealousy of German greatness, and there is nothing in this programme that impairs it. We grudge her no achievement or distinction of learning or of pacific enterprise such as have made her record very bright and very enviable. We do not wish to injure her or to block in any way her legitimate influence or power. We do not wish to fight her either with arms or with hostile arrangements of trade if she is willing to associate herself with us and the other peace- loving nations of the world in covenants of justice and law and fair dealing”
McNally: If you’re not Adolf Hitler, you can say whatever you want. You can tell outright lies and deceive your adversaries into de-militarizing in order to obtain an illegal treaty, ergo: Germans can’t negotiate with us, and if Germany does not agree to our “treaty,” we will invade and continue to withhold/block trade, including food stuffs.
Winston Churchill, after Munich Pact: “You were given the choice between war and dishonour. You chose dishonour, and you will have war.” – To Neville Chamberlain’
McNally: So, what? If you’re not Adolf Hitler, you can make all sorts of threats of war, invasion, economic embargoes….you can say whatever you want. No one will call you on it when the shit hits the fan.
About Czechoslovakia….3 million Germans therein. Here’s a few bits and pieces usually left out of the accusations on Hitler’s lebensraum mania:
Following the Munich Agreement of 1938, Slovakia lost its southern territories to neighbouring Hungary but gained greater autonomy within Czechoslovakia.
From Kafkadesk:
The independence of Czechoslovakia was officially proclaimed in 1918, following the collapse of the German and Austro-Hungarian empires at the end of World War I. The ensuing treaties of Versailles and Saint-Germain-en-Laye officially defined the borders of the new state, which incorporated the German-speaking territories of Bohemia, Moravia and Silesia.
The Sudetenland
Due to the new country’s centralized political structure, nationalism soon arose in the non-Czech nationalities, and several parties and movements were formed with the aim of fighting for broader political autonomy, with ethnic Germans and Hungarians openly agitating against the territorial settlements.
By 1933, encouraged by the newly founded Sudeten German Party, led by Konrad Henlein and financed by Nazi Germany, the particularly large German minority living in the Sudetenland region, which ranges across western Bohemia and northern Moravia, started demanding autonomy from Czechoslovakia, claiming they were oppressed by the national government.
A deal was quickly reached and at about 1:30 a.m. on September 30, 1938, Adolf Hitler, Neville Chamberlain, Benito Mussolini, and Édouard Daladier signed the so-called Munich Agreement, which stipulated that the German army was to complete the occupation of the Sudetenland by October 10, and an international commission would decide the future of other disputed areas.
TttT: (So-called Munich Agreement? Like the so-called Versailles Treaty? Where were the other disputed areas?)
Known as the “Munich Betrayal” or the “Munich Diktat” among Czechs and Slovaks, the Munich Agreement was soon followed by the First Vienna Award, which awarded Hungary Czechoslovakia’s largely Magyar-populated territories in southern Slovakia and southern Carpathian Ruthenia.
Chamberlain’s appeasement policies were ultimately discredited the following year when, in March 1939, Slovakia declared its independence from Czechoslovakia to side with Nazi Germany and Adolf Hitler annexed the remainder of Czechoslovakia.
World War II broke out the following September and, although it did buy time for the Allies to increase their military preparedness, the Munich Agreement quickly became a byword for the futility of appeasing expansionist totalitarian states.
After World War II the Sudetenland was restored to Czechoslovakia, which expelled most of the German inhabitants and repopulated the area with Czechs.
McNally: If you’re not Adolf Hitler, you CAN expel troublemakers from your country, even if those troublemakers had an actual historical claim to the territory and were responsible for the successful industry therein, and even if the troublemaker’s territory had been previously lost via an illegitimate treaty.
Braveheart Narrator: “An oath to a liar is no oath at all.” Unless you’re Adolf Hitler…..you know the thing…
I read over the Munich Pact. I didn’t see the promise to refrain from the annexation of additional former German territories by plebiscite or otherwise, nor did I see an agreement to refrain from thwarting Soviet/Bolshevik expansion.
My Little Bunny fufu, please read this:
Wayne Lutton:
Pope Innocent XI called for a Holy Alliance of Christian princes to resist the Muslim horde. The author portrays Innocent as a true Defender of the West who “never slackened since the day of his election” (in 1676) to organize a Crusade against the Sultan. Innocent pledged the revenues of the church to help raise an army.
King John Sobieski III of Poland, a veteran of the wars against the Turks, was willing to lead a contingent in support of the Habsburgs. But he had to have the unanimous approval of the Polish Diet. Louis XIV’s agents tried to bribe key members into vetoing the proposal. The papal nuncio, Pallavicini, was ordered by Innocent XI to use his powers, including those of his purse, to outbid the French. This they managed, though just barely. King John then set about to raise an army of 40,000.
While Kara Mustafa’s savage Tartar allies pillaged the surrounding countryside, the Turkish engineers went about the business of constructing siege lines and undermining the city’s defenses. Mustafa’s great gamble nearly succeeded. Dysentery, considered by the author “the Turks’ strongest ally,” spread fast among the soldiers and remaining civilian population of Vienna. The Muslims were on the verge of breaching the last defensive works, when, on September 9, it was announced that the relief force was assembling nearby.
Commanded by King John Sobieski, and including valuable reinforcements from Bavaria, Franconia, Thuringia, and Saxony, the allies attacked the Turks on September 12, a Sunday. Writes Stoye “At last the hour was reached when the Christian army, to use the emphatic language of a contemporary Turkish writer, became a flood of black pitch coming down the mountain, consuming everything it touched.” The next day, Sobieski made his victorious entry into Vienna, in advance of Emperor Leopold, to the acclamation of the grateful Viennese public.
In what has been dubbed the Last of the Crusades (from 1683-1699), Poland, Hungary, Austria, the Papal States, and such Mediterranean powers as Savoy, continued to exercise military pressure against the Turks.
…………………………………………………………………..
My grandmother was an ethnic German from Poland. She spoke a bit of Polish; I was born in a town filled with people from Poland, Germany and Czech/Hungary. Everyone looked after each other. When you remove ancient ire, Europeans, in general, are more similar than different. Jews were instrumental in allowing Moors into Spain and today, they are contributing to and supporting the same sort of social upheavals. Europe won’t be Europe much longer. Please look into what’s happening in London, Rotherham, Paris, Malmo, Molenbeek……My once safe city in Texas now has security guards all over shopping areas, and a young girl was killed by a South American illegal migrant. No one is worried about roving bands of Poles or Germans. Just think about it, Little Bunny.
I’d not heard of The Family Man before. Sounds like an alright movie.
Yes, both Elmer Davis (chief of WWII era Office of War Imformation) and Edward Bernays (author of the 1928 book Propaganda) spoke similarly of the great value of movies in their work.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Office_of_War_Information
Elmer Davis, the head of the OWI, said that:
“The easiest way to inject a propaganda idea into most people’s minds is to let it go through the medium of an entertainment picture when they do not realize they’re being propagandized”.
#1682 The Old Philosopher
In my comments I asked you four simple question:
1) Do you agree that other (than German) nations have right to self-defence including preemptive attack ?
2) You didn’t answer simple question why Poznań (Posen) region possessed, governed and populated by Poles by over 800 years is an eternal German territory.
3) Do you have real proofs i.e. mass graves of Germans allegedly murdered by Poles in 1939?
4) You claim that Hitler “Hitler never incorporated any part of Poland in to Germany except for the Corridor areas that were German to begin with.” – I proved you are wrong.
You didn’t address any of these issues.
BTW, I don’t esteem philosophers – they live in their own worlds and are easily manipulated by real people.
Notice the lame response is all he can muster.
Who thrusted aside any kind of national borders to create Czechoslovakia, and include the Sudetenland and Bohemia/Moravia therein?
And the Kings of all Thrusters (have you seen them going “at it” at that old, crumbly wall?), who eventually thrusted their way into the Holy Land, did they thrust aside any borders in Palestine? Did they do it to suit themselves? Were Jews proclaiming the need for Jewish lebensraum?
Chamberlain and Churchill were English, were they not? Should I bother to suggest the English did quite a bit of border thrusting themselves?
Any border thrusting in the Rhineland? First the Franks…..back and forth…I can’t say for certain if it was occupied by France after WW1, but Germany had no authority therein, so maybe symbolic border thrusting is the appropriate term.
It is also a known fact that Hitler was planning on thrusting borders in South America, and I know this to be true because FDR said it was so:
32nd President of the United States: 1933 ‐ 1945
Radio Address Announcing an Unlimited National Emergency.
May 27, 1941
I AM SPEAKING tonight from the White House in the presence of the Governing Board of the Pan American Union, the Canadian Minister, and their families. […]
The first and fundamental fact is that what started as a European war has developed, as the Nazis always intended it should develop, into a world war for world domination.
Adolf Hitler never considered the domination of Europe as an end in itself. European conquest was but a step toward ultimate goals in all the other continents. It is unmistakably apparent to all of us that, unless the advance of Hitlerism is forcibly checked now, the Western Hemisphere will be within range of the Nazi weapons of destruction. […]
And in March, 1941, the Congress passed the Lend-Lease Bill and an appropriation of seven billion dollars to implement it. This law realistically provided for material aid “for the government of any country whose defense the President deems vital to the defense of the United States.”
(I must interrupt here; wasn’t this Lend-Lease for the primary benefit of the Soviets? Exactly when did Churchill realize we were funding an Iron Curtain? Any border thrusting by the Soviets?)
[…] They would fasten an economic stranglehold upon our several Nations. Quislings would be found to subvert the governments in our Republics; and the Nazis would back their fifth columns with invasion, if necessary.
No, I am not speculating about all this. I merely repeat what is already in the Nazi book of world conquest. They plan to treat the Latin American Nations as they are now treating the Balkans. They plan then to strangle the United States of America and the Dominion of Canada.
I’ll go ahead and stop here, McNally. You have some explaining to do. What about that Map, McNally?
Of course I did. You just ignored it as you have all my objection to whichyou respond by swit4ching the subject to plkay ring around the rosy.
of o
I already said so.
2) You didn’t answer simple question why Poznań (Posen) region possessed, governed and populated by Poles by over 800 years is an eternal German territory.
I deny your claim since the very fact it has a German name proves it was not under continuous Polish control as by your question you seek to claim. Plus, that area has been under control of numerous different ethnic groups over whatever time frame yoiu are talking about and certainly has been under German control since the last partition of Poland before the 20th century
.
3) Do you have real proofs i.e. mass graves of Germans allegedly murdered by Poles in 1939?
Do you have real poofs of the 6 million alleged killed by the Germans. I haver no idea what you mean by “mass graves” or how many thousands need to be buried in one to count. There are, however clear photos of thousands of German corpses murdered by Poles.
I accepted your correction about Warthegau, and with that correction, it proves my point and entirely refuted yours that Hitler sought only to take all of Poland for Germany from the beginning rather than only reclaim German territory taken at Versailles which counts only had he incorporated it into the Reich all Polish territory he seized which he clearly did not, nor intended to do, thereby entirely refuting your claims.
Now what he would have done had he not lost the war is an open question that would depend entirely on the circumstances that then prevailed rather than what his plans at the outset were since had the British been willing to reach a settlement, the Polish issue would have undoubtedly been resolved differntly. History however never reveasls its alternatrives.
#1689 The Old Philosopher
I repeat my question:
“1) Do you agree that other (than German) nations have right to self-defence including preemptive attack ?”
Yes or Not?
“I deny your claim since the very fact it has a German (…)”
You have no basic knowledge about history of the region. Explain how name Poznań is a German origin word?
” Plus, that area has been under control of numerous different ethnic groups (…) “
Please, list those “different ethnic groups” chronologically.
I repeat my question:
“3) Do you have real proofs i.e. mass graves of Germans allegedly murdered by Poles in 1939?”
Of course you don’t have evidences, because nothing such had ever happend in 1939.
“Do you have real poofs of the 6 million alleged killed by the Germans. “
I have. German crimes are well documented. Read for example this report: “The War Report – Abridged Version”*.
To be correct: Poland lost 12 milion citizens (30% of population) because of war unleashed by Germans and Anglosaxons.
I’m not sure these numbers but the split seems to be:
5-6 milion of Polish citizens were killed (Polish citizens mean: ethnic Poles but also minorities living in Poland before 1939: Belarussians, Gypsies, Jews, Ukrainians etc.).
5-6 milion of Polish citizens survived but remained outside new borders of post-war Poland.
After war, there was a big shift of borders of Poland. If you don’t know what I’m talking about check map in “CHANGES IN THE BORDERS” chapter, page 13 in report I mentioned above.
“There are, however clear photos of thousands of German corpses murdered by Poles.”
Please, provide references before I call you hypocrite and troll again.
—–
* “The War Report – Abridged Version” (report about German bestialities in Poland during war)
https://www.reparations-for-poland.com/abridged-war-report
“In the Second World War, Poland suffered the greatest human
and material losses of all the European countries in relation to
the total eligible population and national wealth” (page 13)
Full report you will find going to https://www.reparations-for-poland.com/ and clicking tab “WAR REPORT” – there are three volumes concerning German crimes in Poland.
Can I answer, Little Bunny fufu?
1. Yes.
2. It’s not an eternal German territory. But, Germans have historically resided therein:
In about 1249, Duke Przemysł I began constructing what would become the Royal Castle on a hill on the left bank of the Warta. Then in 1253, Przemysł issued a charter to Thomas of Guben (Gubin) for the founding of a town under Magdeburg law, between the castle and the river. Thomas brought a large number of German settlers to aid in the building and settlement of the city – this is an example of the German eastern migration (Ostsiedlung) characteristic of that period….. In the second half of the 17th century and most of the 18th, Poznań was severely affected by a series of wars, attendant military occupations, lootings and destruction …. During the Deluge, Poznań’s Jewish community was accused of collaborating with the invading Swedish enemy….. It was also hit by frequent outbreaks of plague, and by floods, particularly that of 1736, which destroyed most of the suburban buildings. The population of the conurbation declined from 20,000 around 1600 to 6,000 around 1730, and *Bambergian and Dutch settlers (Bambers and Olęders) were brought in to rebuild the devastated suburbs. In 1778, a “Committee of Good Order” (Komisja Dobrego Porządku) was established in the city, which oversaw rebuilding efforts and reorganized the city’s administration. However, in 1793, in the Second Partition of Poland, Poznań came under the control of the Kingdom of Prussia, becoming part of (and initially the seat of) the province of South Prussia….. It would become part of the German Empire with the unification of German states in 1871…… Poznań was captured by the Red Army, assisted by Polish volunteers, on 23 February 1945 following the Battle of Poznań, in which the German army conducted a last-ditch defense in line with Hitler’s designation of the city as a Festung. The Citadel was the last point to be taken, and the fighting left much of the city, particularly the Old Town, in ruins……..
*Germans.
Back to Danzig/Gdańsk: (from VisitGdansk)
Germans played a special role in the history of Gdansk. Starting from the second half of the 14th century and all the way to 1946, they constituted the majority of the city’s residents. A description from 1659 reads: “The number of Germans is greater than the remaining nations, followed by Poles, thus, the two languages, German and Polish, are in use here”….. Out of the 1000 years of its existence, the city belonged to the Teutonic Order for 146 years, to Prussia and the German Reich for 126, and was formally a free city for 26. In total, this adds up to 298 years. For the remaining 700, the city had close ties to Poland. Gdansk Germans were regular citizens of pre-partition Poland. Coming of age, they would swear an oath of loyalty to the Polish King – in German – and would keep their vows in times of danger – one could say they would do this the German way: diligently and fairly. Examples of this include Poland’s wars against Sweden and the year 1734, when they fought bravely to protect King Stanislaw Leszczynski from the Russian army laying siege to the city.
3. It is acknowledged, through multiple sources, that Germans were targeted by Polish citizens. You can find this information if you look for it. Poland did invade Czechoslovakia in 1938; so, they went after Czechs, but not Germans? Regarding mass graves, how could we find them? Jews claim hundreds of thousands of inmates were shot and buried in mass graves all over Poland. However, as far as I know, these graves have never been found, and much of the territory is under government use and/or was developed, and the polish government does not permit excavation. However, Russia has acknowledged the massacre at Katyn Forest. They blamed the Germans for years.
4. Germany invaded Poland; no one denies this. The Soviets invaded also. As I said before, Little Bunny, the Swedes and Russians seem to have been more destructive to Poland throughout history. To me, Poland looks similar to Germany, and like it or not, Germans and Poles are inextricably linked. Polish people are nearly indistinguishable from Germans, when you live amongst both in America. Good and bad conduct notwithstanding, European people have much in common. I would gladly take a horde of Poles over the hordes invading America and Europe today. Ask Paris, London or Malmo if they agree.
i HAVE ANSWERED YOUR QUESTIONS. tHE FACT YOU CAN’T COMPREHEND THE ANSWERS IS BEYOND MY ABIKLITY TO CORRECT.
bUZZ OFF WITH YOUR BULLSHIT.
And for you information, Posen is the German name for the city the poles misnamed as Poznan that completely proves it has not been under Polish control for the entire time you claim.
And just to make clear how absurd your historical land claims are, we ae not giving America back to the Indians. We took it from the fair and square.
#1691 Tiptoethrutulips
“Can I answer, Little Bunny fufu?”
Me, Little Bunny fufu happily grant you this privilage. 🙂
It’s where the normal discussion starts. Now we are talking.
“1. Yes.”
I’m happy that finally someone directly answered my simple question:
“1) Do you agree that other (than German) nations have right to self-defence including preemptive attack ?”
“2. It’s not an eternal German territory. But, Germans have historically resided therein:”
Germans were always a minority. 10% is probably overestimation. 90% were Poles.
“Germans played a special role in the history of Gdansk. Starting from the second half of the 14th century and all the way to 1946, they constituted the majority of the city’s residents.”
Correct.
I think, that nobody disagrees with fact that Gdańsk (Danzig) after slaughering Slavic population in 1308*, was a mainly German-speaking city.
But many people forgot that German speaking population of Gdańsk (Danzig) was very loyal to Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth in XV-XVIII centuries and Gdańsk (Danzig) fought against German-speaking Teutonic Order and Prussia.
I.e. Gdańsk (Danzig) started and financed war to join Poland.
“3. It is acknowledged, through multiple sources, that Germans were targeted by Polish citizens. You can find this information if you look for it. “
Please provide references.
In September 1939 area with German minority in Poland was conquered by Wehrmacht in 7 days so there was no time for alleged mass killing of Germans by Poles.
There were anit-German attitudes in pre-war Poland but the context is that:
Poland in 1918 was a poor country after 123 years of exploitation by Germans (Prussians and Austrians) and Russians.
Poland was also demolished by First World War.
It is no wonder that there were many economical and national tensions (Poles-Germans, Poles-Ruthenians/Ukrainians, Poles-Jews etc.).
“4. Germany invaded Poland; no one denies this. The Soviets invaded also. As I said before, Little Bunny, the Swedes and Russians seem to have been more destructive to Poland throughout history.”
It’s old times.
“To me, Poland looks similar to Germany, (…)”
No, definitely it’s not. Poles and Germans have different mentalities (just like Poles and modern Russians have different mentalities).
While Poles are obsessed with freedom, Germans are obsessed with obedience.
For example, some slogans from Polish culture: “we fight for our freedom and yours”**, “freemen with freeman, equal men with equal men”***, “Poland, firt to fight”,
“it’s better to be hungry but free, than live as a rich slave”****, “nothing about us without us”*****, “we don’t ask for freedom, we fight for it”.
Find equivalents in German language.
“Polish people are nearly indistinguishable from Germans, when you live amongst both in America.”
You will see difference between Poles and Germans in time of trouble. In peace time everybody looks the same.
—
* “Gdańsk massacre or Gdańsk slaughter (rzeź Gdańska)”
“The city of Danzig (Gdańsk) was captured by the State of the Teutonic Order on 13 November 1308, resulting in a massacre of its inhabitants and marking the beginning of tensions between Poland and the Teutonic Order. “
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teutonic_takeover_of_Danzig_(Gda%C5%84sk)
** For our freedom and yours” from 1831
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/For_our_freedom_and_yours
*** it’s my awkward translation of Polish “Wolni z wolnymi, równi z równymi” from 1658 Treaty of Hadiach.
“The Treaty of Hadiach (…) It was designed to elevate the Cossacks and Ruthenians to the position equal to that of Poland and Lithuania in the Polish–Lithuanian union and in fact transforming the Polish–Lithuanian Commonwealth into a Polish–Lithuanian–Ruthenian Commonwealth (Rzeczpospolita Trojga Narodów, “Commonwealth of Three Nations”). “
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Hadiach
**** it’s my awkward translation of Polish “Lepszy na wolności kąsek lada jaki niżli w niewoli przysmaki” from “Dog and wolf” poem for children written by Adam Mickiewicz (main Polish poet) somewhere in XIX century.
*****- “Nihil novi” bill from 1505
“Nihil novi effectively established “nobles’ democracy” in what came to be known as the Polish “Commonwealth [or Republic] of the Nobility”. It was a major component of the evolution and eventual dominant position of the Polish parliament (Sejm).”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nihil_novi
“Troll” is all he has left to say after he smashed himself into an immovable, steel reinforced concrete barrier.
My Little Bunny fufu,
I have learned quite a bit about Polish history since debating with you, and thanks again for fighting the Mongols. Having said that, I still think Poles should have bees in their bonnets over the Russians bringing Mongolian soldiers into Eastern Europe. I’m just saying…..
Weren’t the Teutonic Knights fighting paganism? I know they were Germanic, and I’m not saying they were correct to attack pagans, but religious wars never cease to occur. Nearly every group of people fight over it at some point. So, it was not necessarily a German vs. Pole ethnic battle.
I found this information the other day:
From ForeignPolicy.com:
MARCH 21, 2023, 11:16 AM
On a sweltering summer day, July 10, 1941, hundreds of Jews were murdered by their Polish neighbors in the village of Jedwabne, almost 100 miles northeast of Warsaw. Babies were killed. Men were tortured. Women were raped. A young girl was decapitated and her head used as a soccer ball.
Villagers whose lives had not been extinguished with axes, clubs, and knives were rounded up and taken first to the market square and then to the outskirts of town, where they were herded into a barn. The wooden structure was doused with kerosene and set alight. Women, children, and men were burned alive as the jeering crowd watched. Their cries of agony reverberated throughout the village. Looting of the victims’ homes followed as peasants from neighboring villages showed up to take part in the plunder.
A monument erected near the barn where the Jews were immolated blamed Poland’s Nazi occupiers for the pogrom. Townspeople walked by the plaque for decades, knowing that it was a lie. Sixty years later, Polish Jewish historian Jan Gross’s Neighbors: The Destruction of the Jewish Community in Jedwabne, Poland uncovered the truth, drawing on documents long buried in archives and interviews with survivors: The massacre was perpetrated by the local villagers rather than their German occupiers. Similar massacres were reported from nearby towns, including Radzilow, Szczuczyn and Wasocz.
…………………………………………………………………………….
I don’t bring this up to castigate Poland. But, things just are not always as they seem, and that’s often true on both sides of one issue. One thing is always consistent though; the Jews are eventually targeted for expulsion by nearly everyone in the communities in which they reside, regardless of nationality, and throughout history, with nearly the exact accusations of perfidy claimed all around. Did Jews assist a Swedish invasion of Poland? Did they assist the Moors into Spain? Did they support the Bolsheviks? Does George Soros fund immigration into America and Europe. Yes, yes, yes, and yes. It’s the same pattern, evident today.
Regarding mass graves, the skeletal remains can be approximately dated, but unless DNA tests are done, how can we know who is buried? With two world wars, and multiple conflicts before and after, I suspect there are mass graves everywhere. If you are interested, you can view Hellstorm: The Death of Nazi Germany on video on Odysee. I suspect there are mass German graves all over the place, courtesy of Bolshevik/Soviet soldiers, who also murdered Polish citizens, as well.
Little Bunny, I am telling you, Germans and Poles have more in common than not, especially these days. With centuries of immigration throughout your territory, there is just no way German ethnicity is not carried, to some extent, by many Poles. I don’t care what the anti-Hitlerites say, I think Hitler preferred cooperation with Slavic countries. I listened to many speeches and read his writings, and whilst singing the praises of Germans, he did disparage other peoples, but that doesn’t equate to wanting to eliminate other nations. He was ultimately backed into a corner, and came out swinging, to put it mildly. I don’t think he ever said Polish people, as a group, would ruin Europe. The Jews, however…..
Just think about it, Little bun bun. 🐰
#1695 Tiptoethrutulips
Me, Little Bunny fufu thought about your opinions a little.
“I have learned quite a bit about Polish history since debating with you, (…)”
I’ve noticed that and I have appreciated that because history of Central, Souther and Eastern Europe (except Russia) is almost unknown in mainstream of Western Europe.
“Weren’t the Teutonic Knights fighting paganism? I know they were Germanic, and I’m not saying they were correct to attack pagans, but religious wars never cease to occur.”
What you have against paganism? Do you know that Christianity (religion of slaves) invented religious wars, which were not known in pagan times?
Did you know that first defender of pagans was a Polish diplomat Paweł Włodkowic in XV century?
” So, it was not necessarily a German vs. Pole ethnic battle.”
That’s right, it was battle of mentatliies. It was battle between Byzantine culture (Germany) and egalitarian culture (Poland), it was a battle between slaves (Germans) and freemen (Poland).
Poles are freeman, Germans are a slaves
“Little Bunny, I am telling you, Germans and Poles have more in common than not, especially these days. “
No, definitely it’s not. Poles are freemen while Germans are slave mentality people.
You are terrible mistaken.
” I think Hitler preferred cooperation with Slavic countries. “
I think your thinking is wrong. Killing 50-80% of Slav (Generalplan Ost)* is not “cooperation” with Slavs.
You live in your WonderHitlerland but it doesn’t change facts that Germans were beasts during World War II.
Gremans murdered innocent children and women only because they were from “under rasa”.
“On a sweltering summer day, July 10, 1941, hundreds of Jews were murdered by their Polish neighbors in the village of Jedwabne, almost 100 miles northeast of Warsaw. “
Jedwabe is a part of Holcaust Industry and Jewish propaganda. It is exaggerated in order to blame Poles for antisemitism. It will make a groud to require reparations from Poles for alleged “antisemitism”.
Do you know that after 17 September (invasion of Poland by Soviet Union), many Jews voluntaritly joined to Soviets and they denounced many Polish patriots?
Again, you are escaping from answering simple questions like a hare.
—
* Generalplan Ost
“The Generalplan Ost (…), was Nazi Germany’s plan for large-scale ethnic cleansing, extermination and genocide of Slavs, Eastern European Jews and other ethnic groups categorised as “Untermensch” in Nazi ideology.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generalplan_Ost
Fufus
Really. Then I give you Schiller and Goethe who rise vastly above anything from the Poles.
Actually, I have nothing against paganism. I am very much aware of the pagan traditions and rituals that were “adopted” for Christian rituals, i.e., the Yule Tree, celebration of the winter solstice, aka Christmas, Santa Claus…..I have listened to talks by many Nordic scholars, who castigate Charlemagne for spreading Christianity. I see their point.
Of course, there are cultural differences, but from an outsider’s perspective, an American with German ancestry, whose grandmother was a German from Poland, we are more similar than different. This is what I observe, as I don’t have historical grievances impacting my thoughts.
From my understanding and observations, Hitler did not intend conflict with Poland from the outset. He wanted Danzig back in the German fold, and he wanted the corridor. He did offer complete, unencumbered access by Poland, and the construction of a highway, also accessible to Poland. These offers indicate a desire for cooperation. I understand that Poles didn’t want to go along, however there were a few who wanted to ally with Germany. I think other forces agitated within Poland, and from without, to refute his offers. If/when war is declared, atrocities often occur. I’m not saying, Oh, Well! But, that’s the sad reality, and everyone is guilty of it.
Little Bunny, I meant to comment previously on the official story about the young girl’s head used as a soccer ball, but I was concerned about rambling….I don’t really believe that aspect of the story. I understand the “pack mentality” of angry crowds, etc., but that story reeks of the myriad of other Jewish exaggerations, i.e., ripping babies to pieces, throwing living children into fire pits, electric floors….you don’t have to convince me Jews tell outrageous lies. I don’t believe average Polish people would behave in that manner.
Of course, many Jews joined the Soviets. Of course, they denounced Poland and Polish people, who, I have no doubt, were much more tolerant of Jews than what Jews proclaim. They behave the same everywhere. I just listened to the testimony of a Hungarian Jewish woman, who said – the Soviets arrived to Budapest and made life miserable (worse than during the war); she went to live with her father in the countryside, and he was living with Russian soldiers; eventually, she escaped Budapest to live at a ski resort in Austria, then on to her father’s house in Vienna (he also escaped Hungary) – they had a chauffeur in Vienna, they dined in restaurants daily. How was the average Polish person living in 1947- 1948?
bun bun, I don’t think I dodge your questions. Of course, I understand animosity towards Germans, considering the war, the occupation, etc., but I am suggesting that things weren’t as they seemed. I believe Hitler was right about the unjust war, WW1, and Germany was illegally punished and threatened into the Versailles treaty; I also believe he wanted peaceful solutions, but he did say, war was possible, if diplomacy failed. The primary difference between Hitler and every other western leader, i.e., Churchill, FDR, is Hitler told the truth, always, about what he believed and what he would do; everyone else lied, lied, lied, and betrayed their own people.
Look around, Little Bunny fufu. The world we live in now is exactly as Hitler described, and Israel is a haven for Jewish criminals. Jews control banks, hedge funds, media, publishing, national governments, etc. Have you seen that ghoul, Yuval Noah Harari, telling everyone how the world is going to be, and how we need changes in society to promote “equality.” Do you want equality with the migrants from Africa and the Middle East? How will that equilibrium be achieved? It can ONLY be achieved by lower standards for all. All, except a few “you-know-whos.”
Just think about it, my Little Bunny.
#1697 The Old Philosopher
“[I said-] No, definitely it’s not. Poles are freemen while Germans are slave mentality people.”
“Really.”
You can prove that I’m wrong about German slave mentailty by finding equivalents in German language some slogans from Polish culture: “we fight for our freedom and yours”, “freemen with freeman, equal men with equal men”, “Poland, firt to fight”,
“it’s better to be hungry but free, than live as a rich slave”, “nothing about us without us”, “we don’t ask for freedom, we fight for it”.
(see my comment #1693 for references).
“Then I give you Schiller and Goethe who rise vastly above anything from the Poles.”
Your opinion is usless because probably you don’t know Polish literature.
You can’t compare Polish and German poets because you probably don’t know any Polish poets, do you?
#1698 Tiptoethrutulips
“Of course, there are cultural differences, but from an outsider’s perspective, an American with German ancestry, whose grandmother was a German from Poland, we are more similar than different. “
Germans are like Jews – they have superiority complex, they have “master-slave” culture (“be master or be a slave”).
“[Hitler] He wanted Danzig back in the German fold, and he wanted the corridor. “
The Corridor was also vital to Polish export via Gdynia port. Why Poles should place German interest above Polish interest?
“I believe Hitler was right about the unjust war,(…)”
Sure. Killing 50-80% of Slavs to make Lebensraum for Germans is good.
declares:
Exactly my point that obviously whizzed right passed the the terminally cognitively impaired fufu.
German poets like Goethe and Schiller are world renowned. Polish poet, of which there may be some, are unknown except to Poles and a smidgeon of specialists.
And the slogans you cite are slogans in every culture.
Indeed the slogan above the gate at Auschwitz was “Arbeit macht frei,” literally meaning “works makes you free” but probably best captured in English as “work liberates”.
In fact, a Scottish document of a compact they made among themselves as a the foundation for a war expresses all those sentiment and that dated from hundreds of years ago.
Ok, fufu. You win.
I never said, Polish people had no right to defend their interests, or their country.
To my knowledge, it is only the Jewish and Islamic codes that have commandments to lie and/or treat others poorly, to the benefit of their own insular group. Regarding those two ancient groups, who evolved from the same region, I have read, Islam is the broom of Israel.
A young French woman, raped and tortured by an African man recently, is in a coma; she may die – she will probably be disabled for life and unable to bear children; young girls and boys are gang-raped in Germany; they are molested at their community swimming pools; there are gang-rape groups in England, acid and knife attacks are becoming routine; there are no-go zones all over Europe and America. It’s not Polish people, nor German people, terrorizing innocent citizens. These disparate, violent, people were brought in for a reason.
It is clear to me, in general, the citizens of every country on this earth, suffer for the perfidy of their leaders. If you go to war, often by conscription, you must “hate” your enemy. After witnessing your comrades die or maimed in battle, I imagine that hate comes easily. Still, many soldiers return and wonder why all the killing was necessary, as average citizens still suffer, and only elites reap the benefits or resulting profits. War profiteering is real; Jewish groups seem to always reap the benefits. Whatever you may think about Hitler, his entire nation benefited for his policies prior to WW2, and that was his crime. He did seek diplomatic solutions to territory disputes, whether you accept it or not.
Israel was the prize of WW1 and WW2. Americans, Germans and Poles died for it. Americans are dying still.
You keep Poland polish. That’s my advice.
#1701 The Old Philosopher
“German poets like Goethe and Schiller are world renowned.”
If something is world wide known it doesn’t necessary mean it is masterpiece or genius.
American pop-culture is known everywhere but it doesn’t mean it is high culture, it’s average culture.
In contrary to you, many years ago, I read some fragments of Shakespeare and a few German poems (in translation).
Maybe it was a fault of translation or limited set of works I’ve read but I must say that … I wasn’t impressed.
They seem to represent the same level of genius like Kochanowski, Mickiewicz, Słowacki.
“And the slogans you cite are slogans in every culture.”
Do Germans really have equivalent of Polish “we fight for freedom our and yours”? Can you cite it?
I will try to be more precise.
1. Every culture has slogans.
2. Different cultures have different slogans.
Slogans in Poland are very different than slogans in Germany. That’s why Poles and Germans are different people.
I repeat:
While Poles are obsessed with freedom, Germans are obsessed with obedience.
Compare Polish slogans with German slogans.
#1702 Tiptoethrutulips
“To my knowledge, it is only the Jewish and Islamic codes that have commandments to lie and/or treat others poorly, to the benefit of their own insular group.”
You forgot about Christianity.
“It is clear to me, in general, the citizens of every country on this earth, suffer for the perfidy of their leaders. “
Westerners democratically have elected psychopats for decades in exchange for comfort life.
Westerners also have no scruples to harshly exploit post-Soviet countries.
Westerners have done almost nothing to stop “Jewish march” to power in western countries in last decades.
Westerners are doing nothing to regain power from Jewish hands.
Blame Westerners. They got what they had deserved.
“Whatever you may think about Hitler, his entire nation benefited for his policies prior to WW2, and that was his crime. “
Yes, Germans benefited from his policie but you must remember that Hitler sustained German prosperity grabbing, using resources and people from other countries as slaves.
Otherwise Reich would have became bankrupt.
“He did seek diplomatic solutions to territory disputes, whether you accept it or not.”
Only as a pretext to subdue other countries economically and politically.
Christianity has no such commandments. The Talmud specifically says, Jews are to treat Jews equitably, but lies may be told to gentiles, property may be stolen, gentiles are cattle, etc.; the Hadith also proclaims infidels may be treated poorly, i.e. –
“But whoever refuses [to pay jizya] will see nothing from us but the edge of a spear. The men will be killed and the children will be enslaved, and their wealth will be taken as booty. This is the judgment of Allah and His Messenger.
When the Islamic State invaded ancient Christian regions around the Ninevah Plain last June, it again declared: “We offer them [Assyrian Christians] three choices: Islam; the dhimma contract—involving payment of jizya; if they refuse this they will have nothing but the sword.”
Aren’t polish people westerners? Are you ethnically polish? Maybe Slavs are different from westerners, after all.
Who exploited “Soviet countries” in the first place? The Soviets?
The Jewish March is obscured from many people. Laws are on the books in many places to prevent anyone thwarting the Jewish March. Hitler warned the world about it, but no one listened.
Little Black fufu, you go ahead and rub your hands together, as you await the fall of the western world. It won’t be paradise – it will be a hellscape, more similar to Rhodesia or South Africa, or maybe Malmo. Detroit. Baltimore.
The truth is, if Hitler had won, Europe would be heavily comprised of Germans, and therefore very few little black/brown jackrabbits would be hopping around, ruining the lives of everyone stupid enough to believe the things you believe, or foolish enough to fail to heed the warnings about Jewish perfidy, and the negrofication of society. It seems to me, Islam and negroes are the brooms of Israel.
I understand Poland is desperately trying to retain its status as Righteous Amongst Nations, but in order to hang on to this endorsement, you can’t refuse to accept blame for the “Holocaust,” and you gotta start using Israel’s broom. We’ll see what happens. If you Slavs are as dreadful as many claim, maybe you stand a chance, but do rid yourself of those jackrabbits.
Pure and unadulterated rubbish!
You tried to make a big deal about slogans in Germany and Poland.
Poles cry out about freedom because they were oppressed by their own rulers.
Germans cried out about order and obedience because of the disorder caused by communist infiltrators and saboteurs.
Yes, indeed, and as Janet Joplin pointed out, “freedom is just another word for nothing left to lose.”
#1705 Tiptoethrutulips
“Christianity has no such commandments. “
Christianity (like Islam and Judaism) says that its believers are above others and therefore they have right to abuse and subdue other people (I suppose you know history of Christianity).
All three abrahamic religions are very aggressive and expansive.
“Aren’t polish people westerners? “
Yes, but they are third-rate Westerners from point of view real Westerners (USA, GB, France, Germany etc).
It’s funny that (real) Westerners have no problems to exploit their (alleged) brothers from Central Europe.
“Little Black fufu, you go ahead and rub your hands together, as you await the fall of the western world.It won’t be paradise – it will be a hellscape, more similar to Rhodesia or South Africa, or maybe Malmo. Detroit. Baltimore. “
It’s not my problem. I don’t live there. It’s problem of Westerners. Fall of West is an opportunity to regain real independence just like fall of West in 1918 had allowed to free countries of Central and Southern Europe.
“The truth is, if Hitler had won, Europe would be heavily comprised of Germans,(…)
…because Germans would have killed 50-80% of Slavs. You see? Even for you German’s lives are more important than Slavic lives because subconsciously you treat Germans as REAL Westerners and Slavs are only a people somewhere in Europe.
Fortunately, in Slavic world uncritical worshiping of Western culture is slowly diminishing.
” We’ll see what happens.”
We will see.
#1706 HdC
“Poles cry out about freedom because they were oppressed by their own rulers.
Germans cried out about order and obedience because of the disorder caused by communist infiltrators and saboteurs. “
Poles were oppressed so they wanted more freedom.
Germans were oppressed so they wanted less freedom.
And you don’t see such obvious discrepacy in metalities between these nations?
Good day.
Well, let’s check how strongly Germans feel about certain rights. Summarizing these in the national anthem would show how important these are to the citizens.
I offer in evidence the third stanza of Das Lied der Deutschen, aka Deutschland Lied aka the German national anthem.
“Einigkeit und Recht und Freiheit fuer das Deutsche Vaterland…
In English: “Unity and Rights and Freedom for the German Father Land… Convincing for me what is important. It started out as a poem written in 1841 or so.
You were saying?
#1710 HdC
“I offer in evidence the third stanza of Das Lied der Deutschen, aka Deutschland Lied aka the German national anthem.
“Einigkeit und Recht und Freiheit fuer das Deutsche Vaterland…
In English: “Unity and Rights and Freedom for the German Father Land… Convincing for me what is important. It started out as a poem written in 1841 or so.
You were saying? “
Here you have a few examples of German love of freedom.
“Handeln auf Befehl”* “just following orders”– typical German excuse which means “accept orders without questioning”.
“Meine Ehre heißt Treue”** “My honor means loyalty” – slogan of SS, which means “accept orders without questioning”.
“Blut und Eisen”*** “Blood and Iron” – forced unification of German micro-states in 1871.
German culture can be described as “obey, don’t be affraid to be brutal because then you will flourish”.
You know, why Germans didn’t stand up to Hitler?
Because there was no such order 🙂
Now find in German language equivalent of Polish “we fight for our and yours freedom”.
—
* “Superior orders”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superior_orders
** “Meine Ehre heißt Treue”
“Meine Ehre heißt Treue (“My honor means loyalty”) was the motto of the Schutzstaffel (SS) under Adolf Hitler and the Nazi Party in Nazi Germany. “
*** https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blood_and_Iron_(speech)
Babbles about something allegedly unique to Germans:
“Handeln auf Befehl”* “just following orders”– typical
Gee, when I was in basic training in US army , we were clearly made to understand that you follow of superiors.
Now. it’s true that applies only to lawful orders.
The lawyer who explained this to us also made clear that you are on your own should you refuse to follow as order, and it will be up t4o you to prove it was unlawfull.
Of course, every soldier is also a lawyer who can easily discern what is legal and unlawful.
By the way, the US Army committed war crimes in Vietnam, Korea, WWII, Iraq and whatever war it fought.
Did any US soldier refuse to follow the myriad unlawful orders given that were war crimes?
I am not aware of any.
So they must have acted just like every German soldier when they were given orders that the victors deemed to be illegal.
And here is Fufi instructed the world about following orders based on the German example that is the same in every army.
— feelin’ near as faded as my genes.
___
@ 1704 fufu said:
For how many centuries was Poland the location of the largest number of Jews in the world?
For how many of those centuries did Jews oppress the native Poles?
How many Jews in Poland learned to speak the Polish language?
Hint: Yiddish is Jewishized German.
(Query Heinrich Graetz, who wrote History of Jews in German.)
It was not until those “obedience-loving” Germans took on the task of removing Jews from Poland — simultaneously giving cover to Poles to exercise the vengeance that must have been simmering in their “freedom-loving” hearts, but not their muscles — that Poland was “freed” of their Jewish oppressors.
Seems to me a Thank You, Hitler and Wehrmacht, is in order.
In Polish or in German, but not in Yiddish.
SolontoCrazytown!
I’ve heard a few Jewish witnesses admit Yiddish was “bastardized German.” The last admission I heard was from a woman describing how a German officer saved her family. She was proud that her mother spoke high-German; her father was a Yiddish speaker. My former neighbor was a Yiddish speaker; she was absolutely lovely, and she sent Christmas presents to my children every year. That’s the quandary – the Jews don’t care for the actual righteous amongst their people. My neighbor bore no hatred towards Germans, by the way.
The Eastern European Jews ravaged Eastern Europe. I’ve been reading the crap Ilya Ehrenburg “Never Forgets!” My eyeballs can’t roll any further into my skull. What a pack of lies.
fufu is a hard case. Having said that, Poland is telling Ukraine to pound sand, AND telling the Africans to pound sand back to Africa. Maybe there’s hope for Eastern Europe.
#1712 The Old Philosopher
“Babbles about something allegedly unique to Germans:”
I was talking about society’s mentality, not military. Anyway.
“By the way, the US Army committed war crimes in Vietnam, Korea, WWII, Iraq and whatever war it fought.”
It’s all about proportions.
Probably each army has committed a crimes because each army have has a some percentage of sadists and psychopaths.
The difference between US Army and Wehrmacht during World War II is that US Army tried to punish those crimes (as much as possible) while Wehrmacht (Germans generally) promoted such crimes as normal thing.
Unfortunatelly, modern US Army is very similar to Wehrmacht in contrary to US Army from 1945.
I mean, US Army today has mentality of Wehrmacht- every crime is accepted and covered if it serves their masters.
It’s only my opinion.
What does you babbling have to do with the price of tea in China, or the third stanza of the German national anthem???
#1713 SolontoCroesus
“For how many centuries was Poland the location of the largest number of Jews in the world?”
I’m sorry, but I don’t understand what have in common fact that Westerners allowed Jews to take total control over Western Europe in the last 200-150 years with poor Jews from Central and Eastern Europe?
“It was not until those “obedience-loving” Germans took on the task of removing Jews from Poland (…)”
Germans also wanted to remove Poles to make Lebensraum. You know, it made Poles a little angry.
“Seems to me a Thank You, Hitler and Wehrmacht, is in order.”
Sure. Poles should praise Hitler and Stalin that their “team-work” finally removed from Poland two main foes of Poles – Germans and Jews at a promotional cost of losing 30% of population of Poland and huge border change.
Babbles:
Really. And which generals were court martialed for the war crime of bombing Dresden that was a purely civilian target filled with refugees and wounded soldiers? And how about Hiroshima and Nagasaki? Any generals court martialed for those atrocities?
Your remarks about the difference between Germans and Americans is that American war criminals were punished only proves you are either a babbling idiot or a Munchhausen liar.
Your pick.
#1716 HdC
“What does you babbling have to do with the price of tea in China, or the third stanza of the German national anthem??? “
I think, that your innovative approach to describing nation’s character by analyzing its anthem deserves name “HdC Stanza Standard Analysis”.
You are really big scientist.
Each theory should be checked so now we check your theory.
You claim that Germans are freedom-loving-people because they have “Freedom” in 3rd stanza of their anthem (why not in first stanza?).
Ok. Let’s assume it is true. 🙂
The British don’t have word “Freedom” in their anthem so they aren’t freedom-loving-people. Well, it’s true, they love money more than freedom.
The Canadians don’t have word “Freedom” in their anthem so they aren’t freedom-loving-people. Well, it’s true taking into consideration how easily they were pacified during Covid plandemia or that they recently celebrated Nazi-Ukrainian in Canadian Parliament*.
So your method works 2 times already. Congratulations. Keep doing your reaserch Mr. @HdC.
—-
* “The moment Canadian lawmakers celebrate Ukrainian Nazi”
https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-us-canada-66919230
> If you’re not Adolf Hitler, you can make all sorts of threats of war, invasion, economic embargoes….you can say whatever you want.
Chamberlain never made any threat of war to Hitler, until Hitler had torn up the Munich Agreement. Chamberlain spoke of “peace in our time: because that was what he wanted. Hitler was resolved on overrunning Czechoslovakia from the first moment when he signed the Munich Agreement. That was what made the difference.
> create Czechoslovakia
Czechoslovakia was created out of the breakdown of the old Austro-Hungarian empire. The German Austrians had always loather the multi-ethnic Habsburg empire, so this should not have been any loss for them. But Hitler’s for a drive to the east to conquer the living space of the Slavs required the Czechoslovak region as a steppingstone. He never made a big deal about South Tyrol with Mussolini, because he did not regard this as relevant for his wider ambitions.
Talk is cheap. Chamberlain wanted to buy time to re-arm Britain for a war with Germany that had been planned by the Brits since at least the mid 1930’s.
As usual you spout nothing but rubbish.
You are being much too kind.
The entire comment was actually about the BS spouted by Wilson and his 14 Points Shenanigans, and then Churchill chiding Chamberlain, “You are dishonorable and we will have war!” – or some such slurred babble….
Patricio thinks the Sudetenland/Moravia/Bohemia were all once ancient Czechoslovakia, or maybe just ancient Czechco, since Slovakia was certainly free to decide where they wanted to belong.
It’s almost as if Patricio thinks Deniers can’t read. And, only Jews can reclaim the land they believe is theirs; Bolsheviks/Soviets can pillage/plunder, and use Gulags for those who attempt to stop them from taking what is not theirs, in the first place. How did the Soviets manage to kill so many people without a complex network of gas chambers? If they really wanted to kill everyone, the Nazis certainly showed them the best way to do it. I hear the Soviet’s reparations payments are still $0.00 per year in 2023.
Chamberlain certainly expected that Britain would have to rearm. But he would have been perfectly happy if Hitler had simply allowed the remaining Czechoslovak state to deal with its internal differences on its own. There quite probably would have been an eventual separation of Slovakia from Czechia in 1941 or thereabouts, without Hitler’s interference. But then the whole thing would have occurred without Germany occupying and imposing a protectorate on Slovakia. In the meantime, Hitler could have raised issues about the status of Danzig and gotten a sympathetic ear in Britain over that. But that was not his agenda. His aim was to swiftly overrun Czechia, force Poland to accept a subordinate status in Germany’s drive to the east, and then began taking over living space in Russia and Ukraine. Simply working diplomatically to iron out things in Czechoslovakia and Poland was never his principal goal.
Why didn’t England simply allow the German state to deal with its internal issues on its own? Why didn’t England/US allow Russia to fight its own battle with Germany? I’m sure 500,000 American men/boys would have been happy to watch from the sidelines.
Why didn’t England/France simply allow Poland to deal with its issues with Germany and Russia? Why didn’t they declare war on Russia for invading Poland? Why didn’t the Allies expose the Gulags to the world?
Are you sure it was an imposition? Just like the imposition on the Austrians?
When did Hitler get a sympathetic ear over Poland/Danzig? What are your sources? Shlomo’s History of Evil Germany? So, there were no proposals about a thoroughfare, at Germany’s expense, or any trade agreements beneficial to Poland? Do you think the Poles regretted thwarting Germany or Russia? Do you really believe Poland prospered under the Soviet occupation? Do you think you should get information on WW2 from somewhere other than the History Channel on the Shlomo Network? That’s a rhetorical question, obviously.
That’s right, Patricio – Germany was to Rule the Entire World. Tell us all about the South American Goal. Did Jewry have any goals/plans for Palestine? What is going on over there? Apparently, Jews can’t run a prosperous nation without killing non-Jews. Gentiles can’t run a prosperous nation with Jews. The Jews are the problem, Patricio.
Babbles:
Exposes the depth and breadth of his ignorance since it wasn’t Hitler who brought about the dissolution of Czechoslovakia. In point of fact, as John Ware makes clear, “Hitler merely promised Tiso [in March 13, 1939] that he would support Slovakian if she continued to demonstrate her will to independence. The Slovakian government proceeded to vote a declaration of independence from Czechoslovakia on March 14, 1939. Ruthenia also declared independence and became a part of Hungary, dissolving what was left of the Czech state (Germany’s War (American Free Press: Upper Marlboro, MD, 2014)).
Your claim is thus founded on ignorance or is an outright lie, your pick.
And so is everything else you have written about anything.
> Why didn’t England simply allow the German state to deal with its internal issues on its own?
That is exactly what he did indeed do. This was why he never raised any heckles over the Crystal Night, even though a lot of people in Britain regarded the event with distaste. But the confrontations over first Czechoslovakia/Sudetenland in 1938 and then Poland/Danzig in 1939 were not mere internal issues of Germany. They were matters of international relations, involving states which Britain had at various times entered into prior agreements. Chamberlain had pressed Benes in 1938 to agree to the Munich Pact, because he did not think that it was worthwhile for Britain to launch a war if Hitler agreed to the Munich terms. But after Hitler had discarded the Munich Agreement, there was no way for Chamberlain to plausibly tell the Poles that they should make a similar agreement over Danzig.
> The Slovakian government proceeded to vote a declaration of independence from Czechoslovakia on March 14, 1939.
Another misleading distortion. The Slovakian government did not get up and decide to declare independence. Hitler called the Slovak representatives into his office and threatened that if they did not promptly declare independence and request a protectorate from Germany, then he would back Horthy’s encroachments of Slovakia. Prior to this, when Horthy in 1938 had shown a willingness to come to agreement with Prague, the German government had pressured him away from this.
—–
That day, August 22, passed without incident until evening when the Forschungamt, routinely monitoring the Hungarians’ telephone conversations between Kiel and Budapest, reported that at a meeting of foreign ministers of the Little Entente in faraway Bled the Hungarian delegation had apparently formally renounced all use of force against Czechoslovakia; the wiretaps showed that Horthy, Kanya and his prime minister, Bela von Imredy, had retrospectively sanctioned this. This cast a cloud over the entire state visit.
The secret meetings which began the next day, during a sea trip to Heligoland, were stormy. In the morning Hitler conferred privately with Horthy, while Ribbentrop and Weizsaecker took on Imredy and Kanya. Ribbentrop accused Kanya of stabbing Germany in the back with the Bled agreement, and refused to accept Kanya’s explanations…
Over the next four weeks, the Nazi pressure on the Slovaks to declare independence increased. Keppler sent his closest associate Dr. Edmund Veesenmayer to Bratislav to tell them to hurry, as ‘otherwise Hungary will get our permission to occupy Slovakia at any time after March 15.’ And when Durcansky and his economics minister visited Goering on February 28, the field marshal sinisterly greeted them with: ‘Now, what’s it to be? When are you going to declare independence, so we don’t have to turn you over to the Hungarians?’ Ribbentrop also received them with a promise to guarantee Slovakia’s frontiers, provided she proclaimed her independence at a time that suited the Fuehrer.
—–
— David Irving, The War Path, pp. 125-6, 186, 2013 Focal Point edition.
The pattern was that first in 1938 Hitler pressured Horthy into dropping any agreements with Czechoslovakia in order to engineer a Hungarian/Slovak confrontation. Then in 1939 he threatened the Slovaks that he would back Hungary unless they declared independence and requested a German protectorate. On both occasions, first the Hungarians and then Slovaks gave in to Hitler’s pressures. But this was not some mere spontaneous declaration of Slovak independence that happened on its own. It was forced through by Hitler as a way of creating pretext for Germany to occupy Czechia and place protectorate status over Slovakia, in order to facilitate the drive to the east which was his central overriding aim.
responds after citing my comment below:
The only misleading distortion is your claim that rather than the Slovakian govt just deciding to declare independence on March 14, they actually did it apparently immediately after Hitler had called them into his office and he used his magical powers to force them to succumb to his demands.
That the decision was not arrived in such sudden haste and under such pressure is made obvious by the trail of dates even he recites that led up to it starting Horthy showing his willingness to reach an agreement with Prague when on August 22 interecepted phone conversations “that at a meeting of foreign ministers of the Little Entente in faraway Bled the Hungarian delegation had apparently formally renounced all use of force against Czechoslovakia; the wiretaps showed that Horthy, Kanya and his prime minister, Bela von Imredy, had retrospectively sanctioned this. This cast a cloud over the entire state visit; then during secret meetings beginning the next day “Ribbentrop accused Kanya of stabbing Germany in the back with the Bled agreement, and refused to accept Kanya’s explanations; and while “over the next four weeks, the Nazi pressure on the Slovaks to declare independence increased. Keppler sent his closest associate Dr. Edmund Veesenmayer to Bratislav to tell them to hurry, as ‘otherwise Hungary will get our permission to occupy Slovakia at any time after March 15’ that was at least seven months after those secret conversations, until ” Durcansky and his economics minister visited Goering on February 28, the field marshal sinisterly greeted them with: ‘Now, what’s it to be? When are you going to declare independence, so we don’t have to turn you over to the Hungarians?”
So this pressure cooker Hitler stoked up took at least eight months to do its work that Hitler completed by simply calling the Slovaks into his office.
A.J.P Taylor in Origins of the Second World War (Greenwich, CT: Fawcett Pubs. Inc.. 1961) instead describes as follows the conditions and circumstances leading to that decision:
“But, as both Benet and Hitler had foreseen, it was impossible to hold the state together once Czech prestige and power were shaken. In Western eyes, Czechoslovakiaa was a happy, democratic state, wantonly dismembered by Hitler. In fact, it was a state of nationalities, created by Czech initiative and maintained by Czech authority. Once this weas broken, disintegration followed, just as the collapse of the Hapsburg monarchy followed defeat in the first World War.
“The Slovaks in particular had never been accepted as equal partners. . . . The demand for Slovak autonomy provided a grumbling under-current throughout the twenty years of Czechoslovakian history; after Munich, it came to the surface. Hitler patronized the Slovakian autonomists in order to spite Hungary, to whom Slovakia had originally belonged. The movement was not created by him; he merely took advantage of it, as he had done of the German Austrians and the Sudeten Germans. He would have been satisfied with Slovak autonomy within a subservient Czechoslovakian state. The Slovaks were not. Freed from their old awe of Prague, they grew turbulent. By the end of February 1939 Czecho-Slovakia (hyphenated since the previous October0 was crumbling. The Prague government might have little independence left; they still felt strong enough to discipline the Slovaks– indeed had to do so if Czecho-Slovakia were to survive. On March 9, the autonomous Slovak government was dismissed; Czech troops prepared to move it. Once again Hitler was taken by surprise. . . He could not allow the Czechs to restore their damaged prestige. On the othr hand, if he insisted on Czech forces keeping out of Slovakia the Hungarians might well move in [and reclaim their older territory] as they had planned to do in the previous September. Now Hitler turned against the Hungarians; and since the Czech army could no longer enter Slovakia to deter them, he had to do it himself.
“Germany hastily recognized Slovak independence, and thus brought Czecho-Slovakia to an end (pp 195-196).”
Thus it wasn’t Hitler’s scheming and plotting that brought it all on. It was, instead the conditions that were created by establishing Czechoslovakia as a conglomeration of competing minorities who detested and schemed against each other to claim or reclaim lands each demanded for itself. Hitler at most merely took advantage of the situation that could have gone even further out of control had the competing minorities been left to their own devices to fight it out that could easily have resulted in a war involving Hungary, Poland, and the Czech and Slovak states that could easily have drawn in the Soviets
Taylor’s description of the state of affairs that produced the results the followed entirely debunks your ridiculously clownish version of what occurred..
> Thus it wasn’t Hitler’s scheming and plotting that brought it all on.
It was indeed Hitler’s scheming which accounted for the specific way and time that the Czechoslovak state broke apart. It’s true that without Hitler’s intervention, there probably would still have occurred an eventual break-up of the Czechoslovak state in, say, 1941 or thereabouts. Such a break-up could have easily been worked out on the international stage, with Britain and France participating along with Germany to establish a neutralized zone in eastern Europe. But that was not Hitler’s goal.
Hitler envisioned his demands on Czechoslovakia and Poland as part of the drive to the east to conquer living space in Russia and Ukraine. Sitting around for a few years while the Slovaks debated what they wanted to do was not compatible with Hitler’s timetable. He needed to swiftly establish his position on the Czech and Polish reasons in order to promptly move further east.
For this reason, German officials worked to provoke the crisis of March 9, 1939:
—–
Furthermore, Mr. Hencke, German Charge d’ Affaires in Prague, encouraged the Czechs to use a strong hand with respect to Slovakia. On March 9, 1939, he was formally requested by Berlin to “reveal” to the Czech governmental circles a conspiracy being formed in Bratislava which would aim at the proclamation of independence. The Prague government naturally nibbled at the bait… The evening of March 9, 1939, the President of the Republic, Mr. Hacha, proceeded to the dissolution of the Slovak government of Monsignor Tiso…
—–
— Joseph Mikus, Slovakia: A Political History 1918-1950, pp. 78-9.
Once Hacha had dismissed the Tiso government, Hitler proceeded to set down his own terms on Tiso:
—–
Now he had permitted Monsignor Tiso to come here in order to make his position clear in a very short time… He would stand by his word as long as Slovakia made it clear that she desired independence. If she hesitated or did not wish to dissolve her connection with Prague, he would leave the destiny of Slovakia to the mercy of events for which he was no longer responsible.
Hitler then asked Ribbentrop whether he had anything to add, and Ribbentrop repeated that a decision must be made within hours and not days. He showed the Fuehrer a message he had just received which reported Hungarian troop movements to the Slovak frontiers. The Fuehrer read the report, mentioned it to Tiso and expressed the hope that Slovakia would soon make her decision.
—–
Ibid, pp. 81-82.
In this way, Tiso was pressed into declaring independence right then and there. Taylor’s commentary suffers from the weakness of being a glittering generality. Although there is a broad-brush of truth to the idea that Czechoslovakia was likely to come apart in the relatively near future, the way that this occurred was definitely Hitler’s creation.
It’s a lot like the way that one can say that the Ukrainian territory of Poland in 1939 would likely have split from the country sooner or later, even without the intervention of Joseph Stalin. There was a lot that was contrived and artificial about the eastern borders of 1939 Poland. But obviously, the annexation of these territories into the USSR was not something predestined.
Hitler was not an officer and not in intelligence. He was a courier. Why are you wasting our time with misremebered rubbish from some comic book you read 30 yeaes ago?
It’s been such a lomg time since you wrote about Russia,’s war on Ukraine that I have had to choose the last article with Ukraine in its heading to communicate the following to you, which yeaterday I posted in reply to commenter John Johnson
Let me add to my reasons for doubting that you are up to date in your assessments of MSM honesty and accuracy compared to the motley crew you seem to prefer. I can’t readily locate the articles and podcasts that I was going to challenge you with but reading/listening to sober voices in the Economist, Fi acial Times, Times and Telegraph radio, and just a few hours ago ABC RN’s Between the Lines encourages me to ask you how you can prefer your Scott Ritters and Colonel MacGregors.
Boundless speculations tethered to sky hooks as evidence by:
It’s not broad-brushed but the exact truth as revealed by how it came apart after break-up of Soviet Union without the slightest nudge from Hitler that were the exact same forces that split it apart that would have happened in exactly the same way as it happened later.
Did Hitler use those tensions to his advantage? Of course he did. Who wouldn’t.
But he didn’t create the forces that were there for him to use.
That’s big power politics. The UK-IUS does it all the time as they engineer revolutions and mayhem to control their empire.
You laCK EVEN A CHILDISH COMPREHENSION OF POWER POLITICS.
I come back in desperation to the task of getting you to reflect on how you can be so naively (and stubbornly) wrong about matters you have taken up because you realised how naively wrong you had been for many years until the reading you did which lead to American Pravda changed your assumptions.
I daresay pop psych would explain you as “on the spectrum” when it comes to your evident lack of people skills which can’t be exercised by deliberate exercise of your high IQ intellect, if only to amaze and impress, and to your pigheadedness about admitting error (or even the likelihood of it: Cp. that ludicrous 99%). No doubt, but it is a shame that you deliver naive belief to crooks and shysters like your Ukrainian crew of hopeless experts.
I have now, in recent comments, shown you
the contrast if you read Prof Michael Lawriwsky or Prof Mark Edele (e.g) and I invite you to at least seek an excuse for the absurdities you must now renounce by claiming an understandable starting authority in John Mearsheimer. Heroically right in taking on the Zionist Jewish Lobby but, sadly, now diminished by Ukraine. Right?
Let’s be broadmunded. Is there any moral difference at base between Hitler, Putin, Mugabe, Netanyahu, Stalin ….. and Trump. Actually, unless you think Trump is already proven beyond the moral pale – or exempted by his dementia – should we wait to see if he vould yet surprise? (No, can’t risk it).