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The previous thread had become sluggish, so I’m opening up a new one, jump-starting it with several excellent recent video interviews with Col. Douglas Macgregor:

Finally, in order to minimize the load on this thread, please continue to restrict your Tweets or place them under a MORE tag.

— Ron Unz

 
• Category: Foreign Policy • Tags: Open Thread, Russia, Ukraine 
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  1. Unlike Ritter and Sachs, Macgregor offers well constructed analysis. I will have to listen to those pieces as time allows.

    In tribute to Not-The-President Biden’s 80th birthday and the upcoming Thanksgiving holiday. I offer this:

     

     

    I suspect that bird regrets accepting the pardon at this point.

    🦃 Happy Thanksgiving 🦃

    • Replies: @songbird
    @A123

    What if we got ahead of Erdogan and changed the name of the bird to "Türkiye?"

    , @follyofwar
    @A123

    I don't see a whole lot of difference between the analyses of Ritter and Macgregor.

  2. Good timing, thanks!

    • Agree: A123
  3. https://zoom.earth/maps/temperature/

    It’s balmy in Crimea and Donetsk, frozen solid in Kiev, Sumy and Cherniev.

    Meteorological report.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Wokechoke


    It’s balmy in Crimea and Donetsk, frozen solid in Kiev, Sumy and Cherniev.
     
    Did Western media accuse Putin of that already?

    One of many Russian jokes (it rhymes in Russian, does not rhyme in English): “If the cat abandons kittens, Putin is to blame”.

    Replies: @A123

  4. @Wokechoke
    https://zoom.earth/maps/temperature/

    It's balmy in Crimea and Donetsk, frozen solid in Kiev, Sumy and Cherniev.

    Meteorological report.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    It’s balmy in Crimea and Donetsk, frozen solid in Kiev, Sumy and Cherniev.

    Did Western media accuse Putin of that already?

    One of many Russian jokes (it rhymes in Russian, does not rhyme in English): “If the cat abandons kittens, Putin is to blame”.

    • Replies: @A123
    @AnonfromTN

    Apparently they are accusing Russians of shelling their own nuclear power plant. (1)


    Ukrainian troops subjected the Zaporozhye nuclear power plant (NPP) to massive artillery shelling, damaging strategic facilities, an adviser to the head of Rosenergoatom, a subsidiary of Russian state nuclear energy corporation Rosatom, told Sputnik on Sunday.

    "The Ukrainian military launched a massive strike directly at the station. Twelve rockets were fired. It is known that six of them hit the cooling system of reactors, two — hit the dry cask storage [of radioactive waste]. The consequences of the shelling cannot be determined yet since the risk of repeated attacks remains," Renat Karchaa said.

    None of the Zaporozhye NPP personnel were injured, according to Karchaa.
     
    Why would Russians shell their own infrastructure? It's pretty daft accusation.

    Only unhinged Ukie Maximalists could find sense in such madness.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://sputniknews.com/20221120/ukrainian-troops-shell-zaporizhzhia-npp-damaging-strategic-facilities-rosenergoatom-1104465715.html

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Mr. Hack, @Sean

  5. @AnonfromTN
    @Wokechoke


    It’s balmy in Crimea and Donetsk, frozen solid in Kiev, Sumy and Cherniev.
     
    Did Western media accuse Putin of that already?

    One of many Russian jokes (it rhymes in Russian, does not rhyme in English): “If the cat abandons kittens, Putin is to blame”.

    Replies: @A123

    Apparently they are accusing Russians of shelling their own nuclear power plant. (1)

    Ukrainian troops subjected the Zaporozhye nuclear power plant (NPP) to massive artillery shelling, damaging strategic facilities, an adviser to the head of Rosenergoatom, a subsidiary of Russian state nuclear energy corporation Rosatom, told Sputnik on Sunday.

    “The Ukrainian military launched a massive strike directly at the station. Twelve rockets were fired. It is known that six of them hit the cooling system of reactors, two — hit the dry cask storage [of radioactive waste]. The consequences of the shelling cannot be determined yet since the risk of repeated attacks remains,” Renat Karchaa said.

    None of the Zaporozhye NPP personnel were injured, according to Karchaa.

    Why would Russians shell their own infrastructure? It’s pretty daft accusation.

    Only unhinged Ukie Maximalists could find sense in such madness.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://sputniknews.com/20221120/ukrainian-troops-shell-zaporizhzhia-npp-damaging-strategic-facilities-rosenergoatom-1104465715.html

    • Agree: showmethereal
    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @A123


    Apparently they are accusing Russians of shelling their own nuclear power plant.
     
    In Western lugenpresse it’s all par for the course. Western and Ukie media accused Russia of shelling Donetsk (it was never occupied by Ukies, and that makes them seethe), shelling civilians fleeing from Ukie-controlled areas to Russian-controlled ones in Eastern Ukraine, and of blowing up its own pipelines. IMO the highest achievement on these lines was BBC report from Crimea in 2015 headlined “celebration of the anniversary of Russian occupation”. IMO the funniest thing was that BBC actually showed genuine celebration, with numerous dressed-up Crimean families with children in the streets, yet libtard term “occupation” was in the headline.
    , @Mr. Hack
    @A123


    Why would Russians shell their own infrastructure? It’s pretty daft accusation.
     
    Why do you continue to make such stupid statements? Zaporizhya is a part of Ukraine. The famous Ukrainian Zaporizhian Hoste was located on the Khortytsia island in Zaporizhya: They've recreated the fort and have a Ukrainian museum there. I've been there, trust me it's a Ukrainian area.

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/6b/%D0%A1%D1%96%D1%87_%D0%B7_%D0%B2%D0%B8%D1%81%D0%BE%D1%82%D0%B8_%D0%BF%D0%BE%D0%BB%D1%8C%D0%BE%D1%82%D1%83.jpg/1024px-%D0%A1%D1%96%D1%87_%D0%B7_%D0%B2%D0%B8%D1%81%D0%BE%D1%82%D0%B8_%D0%BF%D0%BE%D0%BB%D1%8C%D0%BE%D1%82%D1%83.jpg

    How dumb can you get kremlinstoogeA123?

    , @Sean
    @A123

    It is an attempt by Ukraine to get a Western peacekeeping force sent to Zaporozhye. Kiev is scheming to bring America into conflict with Russia. It is a high risk strategy, but Ukraine thinks now the ground is frozen a Russian steamroller of bombardment allied to sufficient infantry will run over Ukrainian armies.

  6. @A123
    @AnonfromTN

    Apparently they are accusing Russians of shelling their own nuclear power plant. (1)


    Ukrainian troops subjected the Zaporozhye nuclear power plant (NPP) to massive artillery shelling, damaging strategic facilities, an adviser to the head of Rosenergoatom, a subsidiary of Russian state nuclear energy corporation Rosatom, told Sputnik on Sunday.

    "The Ukrainian military launched a massive strike directly at the station. Twelve rockets were fired. It is known that six of them hit the cooling system of reactors, two — hit the dry cask storage [of radioactive waste]. The consequences of the shelling cannot be determined yet since the risk of repeated attacks remains," Renat Karchaa said.

    None of the Zaporozhye NPP personnel were injured, according to Karchaa.
     
    Why would Russians shell their own infrastructure? It's pretty daft accusation.

    Only unhinged Ukie Maximalists could find sense in such madness.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://sputniknews.com/20221120/ukrainian-troops-shell-zaporizhzhia-npp-damaging-strategic-facilities-rosenergoatom-1104465715.html

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Mr. Hack, @Sean

    Apparently they are accusing Russians of shelling their own nuclear power plant.

    In Western lugenpresse it’s all par for the course. Western and Ukie media accused Russia of shelling Donetsk (it was never occupied by Ukies, and that makes them seethe), shelling civilians fleeing from Ukie-controlled areas to Russian-controlled ones in Eastern Ukraine, and of blowing up its own pipelines. IMO the highest achievement on these lines was BBC report from Crimea in 2015 headlined “celebration of the anniversary of Russian occupation”. IMO the funniest thing was that BBC actually showed genuine celebration, with numerous dressed-up Crimean families with children in the streets, yet libtard term “occupation” was in the headline.

  7. Wish FIFA president Gianni Infantino would elaborate on his remarks that “Europeans must apologize for 3000 years.”

    Am hoping he has found a Linear B tablet with an older, firsthand account of battle than Xenophon. Perhaps, a failed expedition to conquer the New World, or a kind of Bronze Age Stanley traveling into darkest Africa.

    Don’t think he could have been speaking of Troy, at least in the mythic tradition, both because of Trojan provocations and because of Aeneas’ brutal subjugation of the innocent Latins and Etruscans.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @songbird

    There seems to be quite a lot of criticism from human rights types though, this weaponizing of white man's guilt narratives in service of a rather reactionary (and homophobic!) regime is too blatantly cynical.
    Of course still indicative of the direction things are going, and as Meloni's remarks (even if they were not recent, but apparently from 2019) show even most right-wingers accept that framing or at least don't manage to explicitly reject it.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @songbird, @Coconuts, @silviosilver

  8. German_reader says:
    @songbird
    Wish FIFA president Gianni Infantino would elaborate on his remarks that "Europeans must apologize for 3000 years."

    Am hoping he has found a Linear B tablet with an older, firsthand account of battle than Xenophon. Perhaps, a failed expedition to conquer the New World, or a kind of Bronze Age Stanley traveling into darkest Africa.

    Don't think he could have been speaking of Troy, at least in the mythic tradition, both because of Trojan provocations and because of Aeneas' brutal subjugation of the innocent Latins and Etruscans.

    Replies: @German_reader

    There seems to be quite a lot of criticism from human rights types though, this weaponizing of white man’s guilt narratives in service of a rather reactionary (and homophobic!) regime is too blatantly cynical.
    Of course still indicative of the direction things are going, and as Meloni’s remarks (even if they were not recent, but apparently from 2019) show even most right-wingers accept that framing or at least don’t manage to explicitly reject it.

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @German_reader

    No, this is the correct usage of white guilt - to limit liberalism.

    , @songbird
    @German_reader

    It is kind of funny because Qatar is arguably a fake and gay state that would not exist except for the fact it is strategically advantageous for certain Western groups, if it is not amalgamated into some greater Arab state.

    , @Coconuts
    @German_reader


    There seems to be quite a lot of criticism from human rights types though, this weaponizing of white man’s guilt narratives in service of a rather reactionary (and homophobic!) regime is too blatantly cynical.
     
    I think these terms like white supremacy, white guilt, colonialism etc. for the most part come out of the post-modern, post-colonial far left, which is a mash up of ethnic particularism and liberationism from the European radical tradition, it means that mostly they can't be used effectively against progressives.

    It does sort of highlight how much this sort of thought is in appearance heavily indebted to white European males. One way I have seen blacks address this point is by claiming that due to their oppression blacks understood the relevant content of Marx, Hegel, Herder, Rousseau etc. before these authors wrote their works, or arrived at it independently of them.

    Replies: @showmethereal

    , @silviosilver
    @German_reader


    There seems to be quite a lot of criticism from human rights types though, this weaponizing of white man’s guilt narratives in service of a rather reactionary (and homophobic!) regime is too blatantly cynical.
     
    I don't doubt that it's cynical (I hope it's merely cynical, at least). But too blatantly cynical for what exactly? Certainly it's not too blatantly cynical to be called out. Who, apart from the "far right", will call it out? Which mainstream figure would have the balls to even correct the ludicrous notion that the white man has been injuring the rest of the world for three freakin thousand years? Totally overlooking the fact that he only gained dominion over it in the last couple of hundred, only made it contact with it 500 years ago, and had spent the previous thousand more or less getting his butt kicked by it. Normiefags would rather lose an arm than point any of this out, even though not a single bit of it can be termed 'racist' - not even by absurdly biased contemporary definitions of that term. (Then again, I guess it spoils the fun to focus too intently on the letter of the law, totally neglecting its spirit.)

    As for having to apologize for the next three thousand, there's even less chance that would be challenged. If anything, people are more likely to claim that three thousand isn't enough. Whites need to apologize for the next ten thousand, hundred thousand, or as long the sun continues to shine. (Shades of christcuck "reasoning" here, in which it's considered perfectly possible to do something that is so horrific during your three score and ten that God is perfectly justified in torturing you for the rest of eternity for it. Eternity - 500 trillion years and you're just getting warmed up. Perfectly just.)

    Replies: @Coconuts

  9. @German_reader
    @songbird

    There seems to be quite a lot of criticism from human rights types though, this weaponizing of white man's guilt narratives in service of a rather reactionary (and homophobic!) regime is too blatantly cynical.
    Of course still indicative of the direction things are going, and as Meloni's remarks (even if they were not recent, but apparently from 2019) show even most right-wingers accept that framing or at least don't manage to explicitly reject it.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @songbird, @Coconuts, @silviosilver

    No, this is the correct usage of white guilt – to limit liberalism.

  10. @German_reader
    @songbird

    There seems to be quite a lot of criticism from human rights types though, this weaponizing of white man's guilt narratives in service of a rather reactionary (and homophobic!) regime is too blatantly cynical.
    Of course still indicative of the direction things are going, and as Meloni's remarks (even if they were not recent, but apparently from 2019) show even most right-wingers accept that framing or at least don't manage to explicitly reject it.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @songbird, @Coconuts, @silviosilver

    It is kind of funny because Qatar is arguably a fake and gay state that would not exist except for the fact it is strategically advantageous for certain Western groups, if it is not amalgamated into some greater Arab state.

  11. A certain well known election denier and #NeverTrump conspiracy theorist has been declaring that Trump endorsed Lauren Boebert was going to lose. Guess what: (1)

    Democrat Adam Frisch concedes to Lauren Boebert in close Colorado House race

    Donald Trump-backed Republican Lauren Boebert will likely serve a second term in the House after her Democratic challenger Adam Frisch conceded to the incumbent Friday despite the race triggering Colorado’s recount laws

    Trump’s 90%+ endorsement success rate scores yet another win.

    When will Leftoids end their “Bigly Lie”? His personal favorite for House rule, Nancy Pelosi, is done for.

    The impending impeachment investigations into Not-The-President Biden’s corruption will be an expression of TRUTH & Justice in action: (2)

    Rep. James Comer announces the Republican House Oversight Committee is launching an investigation into Joe Biden’s dealings with his son Hunter to determine whether the president “is compromised or swayed by foreign dollars.”

    Video under [MORE]

    if you are a Dem who doesn’t like that, perhaps you should tell your own team that they started this crazy train. The Republicans have every right to shout their own grievances from the rooftops and hold as many investigations as they’d like after the last 6 years of insanity from the Left.

    Let’s not forget that Donald Trump was subjected to years of congressional investigation

    If you supported those measures against Trump, you cannot complain about this without being a massive hypocrite.

    • Joe Biden got the Ukrainian special prosecutor fired who was investigating his son’s involvement on the board of a corrupt Ukrainian energy firm.

    • Hunter Biden’s laptop is a treasure trove that implicates the president (“The Big Guy”) in numerous financial transactions with shady foreign entities that have benefited the Biden family over decades.

    • Whistleblower Tony Bobulinski, who helped set up the shell companies the Biden family used, has publicly detailed his conversations with Joe Biden and his brother Jim Biden, as well as Hunter Biden.

    • Joe Biden claimed he had no involvement with any of these family dealings, but voicemails and messages counter that claim.

    And that’s just the tip of the iceberg!

    MAGA WINS! Delusional #NeverTrump extremism loses.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/democrat-adam-frisch-concedes-to-lauren-boebert-in-close-colorado-house-race/ar-AA14h3SP

    (2) https://notthebee.com/article/house-gop-announces-investigation-of-the-president-this-committee-will-evaluate-whether-this-president-is-compromised-or-swayed-by-foreign-dollars-

    [MORE]

  12. Iraqi Information Minister reviews

    Closer Encounters
    Jason Reza Jorjani
    Arktos 2021

    454 pages on UFO’s and what this means for the future of earth humans.

    To begin with, Jorjani is an extremely bright guy and this book was worth reading. For me anyway. He identifies correctly many of the important issues on this topic. Near to zero false negatives. But he has a bias towards accepting many hypothetical physics fantasies and Silicon Valley futurist glossy brochure claims with a minimum of critical thought. False positives way out the wazoo. This leads him into la la land but he only has one awful style point so I am not going to be too hard on him. It must be almost impossible to go as far down the road to Dogmatic Materialism as he has traveled and realize far too late that one has a whole lot of back tracking to do.

    A partial list of his claims. Hopefully I have most of the biggies.

    The technological singularity advertised by Kurzweil et al is inevitable and getting here and now very soon.

    Profoundly significant alternative physics has been extant and concealed by rich powerful people since well before 1945.

    Multiple alien races are active geopolitical players. The signature of this is obvious to anybody with a sufficiently high IQ since 1945.

    (This is not a biggie but it is a small point which is at least worth mentioning. Psychometry tech guys seem to have never appreciated the fact, well known to many parents and most students, that a large fraction of the people who take tests are motivated only to get the odious chore over with and do not recognize much value in performing as well as you possibly can on the test. The usefulness of most tests is diminished by this basic fact. There are few practical applications to IQ test scores.)

    He fancies the nordics and the grays as significant alien races. He doesn’t do much with the mantids which are my personal favorite. : (

    His solar system contains alien spaceship bases on Mars, the Moon, and in the vast uncharted under waters of Earth.

    They don’t just do interplanetary -> interstellar -> intergalactic transport. They go through wormholes and forwards/backwards through time.

    The Akashic record is a thing. Quantum computers are a thing. The Breakaway Civilization is a thing. There are a lot of things going on in his presentation. I could go on and on about his casual treatment for what happens to be actual and factual, but I am going to stop here. I read the book two times and made 31 separate notations of stuff that is not going to hold together if somebody just takes a minute to stop reading and examine the logic of what the man has written here. I read it twice because there are a few bits worth pursuing and a few references that deserve more study. For an example of things that he does have correct, his claim that we are never going to get an honest disclosure regarding extant UFO data from the CIA is very very highly probably true. P ( that one ) > .999.

    It doesn’t take a rocket scientist to get this.

    He suffers from a flaw that you see in academic training with obsessive footnoting. When you have a source (this is only one example–John Brandenberg Death on Mars; he does this at least ten times) and you have 3 or 4 footnotes per page from the same source for eight pages running, you are being rude to the reader. None of your readers care that you are being so careful. Most of them think you are being an ass.

    Enough. I kind of liked the book. I cannot recommend anybody else to read it.

    • Replies: @Barbarossa
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    Near to zero false negatives. But he has a bias towards accepting many hypothetical physics fantasies and Silicon Valley futurist glossy brochure claims with a minimum of critical thought. False positives way out the wazoo.
     
    But at least that makes for an entertaining read. In the best case I suppose it reads as entertainingly as fiction while you also have the chance to stumble across something genuinely useful. Sometimes it's handy to have guys thinking way out in left field even if the failure rate is high.

    Enough. I kind of liked the book. I cannot recommend anybody else to read it.
     
    LOL. I guarantee that I will not read the book, but your synopsis was quite worth the read. Thanks for taking the time.
    , @S
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    His solar system contains alien spaceship bases on Mars, the Moon, and in the vast uncharted under waters of Earth.
     
    The premise is remindful of the old Gerry Anderson UFO TV series circa 1970, a somewhat entertaining show. :-)


    https://youtu.be/90kSw-BSCq4



    https://youtu.be/EpF6o2-nx4I

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

  13. @Emil Nikola Richard
    Iraqi Information Minister reviews

    Closer Encounters
    Jason Reza Jorjani
    Arktos 2021

    454 pages on UFO's and what this means for the future of earth humans.

    To begin with, Jorjani is an extremely bright guy and this book was worth reading. For me anyway. He identifies correctly many of the important issues on this topic. Near to zero false negatives. But he has a bias towards accepting many hypothetical physics fantasies and Silicon Valley futurist glossy brochure claims with a minimum of critical thought. False positives way out the wazoo. This leads him into la la land but he only has one awful style point so I am not going to be too hard on him. It must be almost impossible to go as far down the road to Dogmatic Materialism as he has traveled and realize far too late that one has a whole lot of back tracking to do.

    A partial list of his claims. Hopefully I have most of the biggies.

    The technological singularity advertised by Kurzweil et al is inevitable and getting here and now very soon.

    Profoundly significant alternative physics has been extant and concealed by rich powerful people since well before 1945.

    Multiple alien races are active geopolitical players. The signature of this is obvious to anybody with a sufficiently high IQ since 1945.

    (This is not a biggie but it is a small point which is at least worth mentioning. Psychometry tech guys seem to have never appreciated the fact, well known to many parents and most students, that a large fraction of the people who take tests are motivated only to get the odious chore over with and do not recognize much value in performing as well as you possibly can on the test. The usefulness of most tests is diminished by this basic fact. There are few practical applications to IQ test scores.)

    He fancies the nordics and the grays as significant alien races. He doesn't do much with the mantids which are my personal favorite. : (

    His solar system contains alien spaceship bases on Mars, the Moon, and in the vast uncharted under waters of Earth.

    They don't just do interplanetary -> interstellar -> intergalactic transport. They go through wormholes and forwards/backwards through time.

    The Akashic record is a thing. Quantum computers are a thing. The Breakaway Civilization is a thing. There are a lot of things going on in his presentation. I could go on and on about his casual treatment for what happens to be actual and factual, but I am going to stop here. I read the book two times and made 31 separate notations of stuff that is not going to hold together if somebody just takes a minute to stop reading and examine the logic of what the man has written here. I read it twice because there are a few bits worth pursuing and a few references that deserve more study. For an example of things that he does have correct, his claim that we are never going to get an honest disclosure regarding extant UFO data from the CIA is very very highly probably true. P ( that one ) > .999.

    It doesn't take a rocket scientist to get this.

    He suffers from a flaw that you see in academic training with obsessive footnoting. When you have a source (this is only one example--John Brandenberg Death on Mars; he does this at least ten times) and you have 3 or 4 footnotes per page from the same source for eight pages running, you are being rude to the reader. None of your readers care that you are being so careful. Most of them think you are being an ass.

    Enough. I kind of liked the book. I cannot recommend anybody else to read it.

    Replies: @Barbarossa, @S

    Near to zero false negatives. But he has a bias towards accepting many hypothetical physics fantasies and Silicon Valley futurist glossy brochure claims with a minimum of critical thought. False positives way out the wazoo.

    But at least that makes for an entertaining read. In the best case I suppose it reads as entertainingly as fiction while you also have the chance to stumble across something genuinely useful. Sometimes it’s handy to have guys thinking way out in left field even if the failure rate is high.

    Enough. I kind of liked the book. I cannot recommend anybody else to read it.

    LOL. I guarantee that I will not read the book, but your synopsis was quite worth the read. Thanks for taking the time.

  14. @A123
    Unlike Ritter and Sachs, Macgregor offers well constructed analysis. I will have to listen to those pieces as time allows.

     

    In tribute to Not-The-President Biden's 80th birthday and the upcoming Thanksgiving holiday. I offer this:

     
    https://i0.wp.com/dailysoak.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/11/JoeBidenTurkey1-min.jpg
     

    I suspect that bird regrets accepting the pardon at this point.

    🦃 Happy Thanksgiving 🦃

    Replies: @songbird, @follyofwar

    What if we got ahead of Erdogan and changed the name of the bird to “Türkiye?”

    • LOL: A123, Barbarossa
  15. https://julianmacfarlane.substack.com/p/putins-winnin-weakness The Western Media use any excuse to portray Russia as weak and losing. Kherson was one. Then the S300 missile that landed in Poland. That story was as defective as the missile but spun as “Russia is responsible for EVERYTHING…” Oh, and it’s weak and losing.
    Sadly, that’s not happening. And as MacGregor says, there will be a major offensive. First degrade Western Ukraine’s infrastructure. Galician/ Ruthenian nationalists will flee to Poland and Germany where they will not be welcome. Western Ukraine will be depopulated. Then cut off supply routes to Poland and by air. Then destroy the UAF giving special attention to mercenary forces. Think Japan: 1945. Which suddenly became pro-American. Ukraine will suddenly become pro-Russian

    https://julianmacfarlane.substack.com/p/putins-winnin-weakness

  16. @A123
    @AnonfromTN

    Apparently they are accusing Russians of shelling their own nuclear power plant. (1)


    Ukrainian troops subjected the Zaporozhye nuclear power plant (NPP) to massive artillery shelling, damaging strategic facilities, an adviser to the head of Rosenergoatom, a subsidiary of Russian state nuclear energy corporation Rosatom, told Sputnik on Sunday.

    "The Ukrainian military launched a massive strike directly at the station. Twelve rockets were fired. It is known that six of them hit the cooling system of reactors, two — hit the dry cask storage [of radioactive waste]. The consequences of the shelling cannot be determined yet since the risk of repeated attacks remains," Renat Karchaa said.

    None of the Zaporozhye NPP personnel were injured, according to Karchaa.
     
    Why would Russians shell their own infrastructure? It's pretty daft accusation.

    Only unhinged Ukie Maximalists could find sense in such madness.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://sputniknews.com/20221120/ukrainian-troops-shell-zaporizhzhia-npp-damaging-strategic-facilities-rosenergoatom-1104465715.html

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Mr. Hack, @Sean

    Why would Russians shell their own infrastructure? It’s pretty daft accusation.

    Why do you continue to make such stupid statements? Zaporizhya is a part of Ukraine. The famous Ukrainian Zaporizhian Hoste was located on the Khortytsia island in Zaporizhya: They’ve recreated the fort and have a Ukrainian museum there. I’ve been there, trust me it’s a Ukrainian area.

    How dumb can you get kremlinstoogeA123?

    • Troll: QCIC, YetAnotherAnon
  17. @Emil Nikola Richard
    Iraqi Information Minister reviews

    Closer Encounters
    Jason Reza Jorjani
    Arktos 2021

    454 pages on UFO's and what this means for the future of earth humans.

    To begin with, Jorjani is an extremely bright guy and this book was worth reading. For me anyway. He identifies correctly many of the important issues on this topic. Near to zero false negatives. But he has a bias towards accepting many hypothetical physics fantasies and Silicon Valley futurist glossy brochure claims with a minimum of critical thought. False positives way out the wazoo. This leads him into la la land but he only has one awful style point so I am not going to be too hard on him. It must be almost impossible to go as far down the road to Dogmatic Materialism as he has traveled and realize far too late that one has a whole lot of back tracking to do.

    A partial list of his claims. Hopefully I have most of the biggies.

    The technological singularity advertised by Kurzweil et al is inevitable and getting here and now very soon.

    Profoundly significant alternative physics has been extant and concealed by rich powerful people since well before 1945.

    Multiple alien races are active geopolitical players. The signature of this is obvious to anybody with a sufficiently high IQ since 1945.

    (This is not a biggie but it is a small point which is at least worth mentioning. Psychometry tech guys seem to have never appreciated the fact, well known to many parents and most students, that a large fraction of the people who take tests are motivated only to get the odious chore over with and do not recognize much value in performing as well as you possibly can on the test. The usefulness of most tests is diminished by this basic fact. There are few practical applications to IQ test scores.)

    He fancies the nordics and the grays as significant alien races. He doesn't do much with the mantids which are my personal favorite. : (

    His solar system contains alien spaceship bases on Mars, the Moon, and in the vast uncharted under waters of Earth.

    They don't just do interplanetary -> interstellar -> intergalactic transport. They go through wormholes and forwards/backwards through time.

    The Akashic record is a thing. Quantum computers are a thing. The Breakaway Civilization is a thing. There are a lot of things going on in his presentation. I could go on and on about his casual treatment for what happens to be actual and factual, but I am going to stop here. I read the book two times and made 31 separate notations of stuff that is not going to hold together if somebody just takes a minute to stop reading and examine the logic of what the man has written here. I read it twice because there are a few bits worth pursuing and a few references that deserve more study. For an example of things that he does have correct, his claim that we are never going to get an honest disclosure regarding extant UFO data from the CIA is very very highly probably true. P ( that one ) > .999.

    It doesn't take a rocket scientist to get this.

    He suffers from a flaw that you see in academic training with obsessive footnoting. When you have a source (this is only one example--John Brandenberg Death on Mars; he does this at least ten times) and you have 3 or 4 footnotes per page from the same source for eight pages running, you are being rude to the reader. None of your readers care that you are being so careful. Most of them think you are being an ass.

    Enough. I kind of liked the book. I cannot recommend anybody else to read it.

    Replies: @Barbarossa, @S

    His solar system contains alien spaceship bases on Mars, the Moon, and in the vast uncharted under waters of Earth.

    The premise is remindful of the old Gerry Anderson UFO TV series circa 1970, a somewhat entertaining show. 🙂

    [MORE]

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @S

    Those are fiction. Jorjani purports to be representing fact.

    He is not alone. If you like video check out Frank Tipler, professor of mathematics at Tulane U. from 58:00 -> 59:30 in Age of Deceit 2.

    When this came out in 2012 or whenever (I don't remember what year I first saw it) I thought it was way overkill but I watched again a few weeks ago and it has held up OK. Three hours is far too long but it's filled with more repetition than it it's filled with stuffing.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WQcyQMZmmkM&ab_channel=TimothyCastleberry

  18. Meloni “Round 2” versus Macron: (1)

    VIDEO below [MORE]

    Italy 2 – 0 France: Meloni Crushes Macron Amid Migrant Crisis

    ITALY – Well their new PM Giorgia Meloni certainly doesn’t hold back does she?

    Here’s her take on Macron, after he called the Italians disgusting.

    She’s informed, she’s furious, and she’s laying it out to everyone, basically out-Martha Vineyard-ing even Ron DeSantis as she forced that ship to France.

    For the smug Eurochickens out there, starting with Emmanuel Macron of France, she’s gotten word out now that Italy’s not one to mess with these days, they’ve had it with being Europe’s punching bag on migrants. Expect the Europeans to adjust their expectations accordingly.

    As a major power in the EuroZone she has EPIC leverage. The EU can be deliver what was promised, A Union of Sovereign Equals. Or, the already fragile € common currency can be blown up by the Globalists as they flail against Christian Populism.

    Make Italy Great Again [MIGA]

    Trump’s style, punching back at the Open Borders Elites, works.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/italy-2-0-france-meloni-crushes-macron-amid-migrant-crisis

    [MORE]

  19. @German_reader
    @songbird

    There seems to be quite a lot of criticism from human rights types though, this weaponizing of white man's guilt narratives in service of a rather reactionary (and homophobic!) regime is too blatantly cynical.
    Of course still indicative of the direction things are going, and as Meloni's remarks (even if they were not recent, but apparently from 2019) show even most right-wingers accept that framing or at least don't manage to explicitly reject it.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @songbird, @Coconuts, @silviosilver

    There seems to be quite a lot of criticism from human rights types though, this weaponizing of white man’s guilt narratives in service of a rather reactionary (and homophobic!) regime is too blatantly cynical.

    I think these terms like white supremacy, white guilt, colonialism etc. for the most part come out of the post-modern, post-colonial far left, which is a mash up of ethnic particularism and liberationism from the European radical tradition, it means that mostly they can’t be used effectively against progressives.

    It does sort of highlight how much this sort of thought is in appearance heavily indebted to white European males. One way I have seen blacks address this point is by claiming that due to their oppression blacks understood the relevant content of Marx, Hegel, Herder, Rousseau etc. before these authors wrote their works, or arrived at it independently of them.

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @Coconuts

    Cecil Rhodes didn’t think all white men were created equal. Yeah the same guy Rhodesia and Rhodes scholarships were named after. He firmly stated and believed Anglo Saxons were above all other white men. Northern Europeans looked down on Southern. Western Europeans looked down on Eastern. So when did all this white solidarity happen???

    Replies: @Coconuts

  20. Near perfect correlation between Whiteness and endorsing the glorification of Nazism, hehe.

    AK seems to be back on Twitter. Wasn’t he advocating Russia national regeneration through armed struggle and authoritarian leadership a while back?

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @Coconuts

    He's promoted that "Russians are poc and part of an anticolonial movement" stuff for a while. I don't think one can expect any intellectual coherence, at its core it's just resentment that Russia doesn't get the respect it supposedly deserves and isn't a superpower anymore.

    Replies: @Beckow

  21. After all, the anniversary

  22. @Coconuts

    Near perfect correlation between Whiteness and endorsing the glorification of Nazism, hehe.
     
    AK seems to be back on Twitter. Wasn't he advocating Russia national regeneration through armed struggle and authoritarian leadership a while back?

    Replies: @German_reader

    He’s promoted that “Russians are poc and part of an anticolonial movement” stuff for a while. I don’t think one can expect any intellectual coherence, at its core it’s just resentment that Russia doesn’t get the respect it supposedly deserves and isn’t a superpower anymore.

    • Agree: Barbarossa
    • Replies: @Beckow
    @German_reader


    ...one can't expect any intellectual coherence, at its core it’s just resentment that Russia doesn’t get the respect...
     
    For Russia you can substitute Poland, France, UK, China, any Third World country, even US, definitely Canada, and make exactly the same claim...nations' self perceptions are complicated and prickly. One's respect has an ever expanding definition. Look inward about how you feel about Germany.

    What matters more is the mistaken notion that Russia 'is not a superpower'. By any historical or strategic standard it is - that's the fundamental problem for the aspiring global rulers in Washington-London. The West has tried to defeat Russia (many times), trick it, buy it, even simply declare 'you are no superpower!'...none of it has worked.

    The reality staring at us today is that Russia has invaded a foreign country - a major, strategic Western ally and asset, took territory, destroyed infrastructure - there has not been any serious thing the West has done. Only a superpower could do that, e.g. US has done it previously. The silly notion that Russia is 'not a superpower' doesn't mesh with what has happened. If you raise the bar high enough and focus on minutia, losses, setbacks, you can deny the superpower status to any country: US failed in all its recent imperial ventures, UK and Spain also during their heydays, as did Rome in Germany, Persia. It is the fact that they can do it that makes them a superpower, not the details.

    Replies: @German_reader, @A123, @AnonfromTN

  23. @German_reader
    @Coconuts

    He's promoted that "Russians are poc and part of an anticolonial movement" stuff for a while. I don't think one can expect any intellectual coherence, at its core it's just resentment that Russia doesn't get the respect it supposedly deserves and isn't a superpower anymore.

    Replies: @Beckow

    …one can’t expect any intellectual coherence, at its core it’s just resentment that Russia doesn’t get the respect…

    For Russia you can substitute Poland, France, UK, China, any Third World country, even US, definitely Canada, and make exactly the same claim…nations’ self perceptions are complicated and prickly. One’s respect has an ever expanding definition. Look inward about how you feel about Germany.

    What matters more is the mistaken notion that Russia ‘is not a superpower‘. By any historical or strategic standard it is – that’s the fundamental problem for the aspiring global rulers in Washington-London. The West has tried to defeat Russia (many times), trick it, buy it, even simply declare ‘you are no superpower!’…none of it has worked.

    The reality staring at us today is that Russia has invaded a foreign country – a major, strategic Western ally and asset, took territory, destroyed infrastructure – there has not been any serious thing the West has done. Only a superpower could do that, e.g. US has done it previously. The silly notion that Russia is ‘not a superpower’ doesn’t mesh with what has happened. If you raise the bar high enough and focus on minutia, losses, setbacks, you can deny the superpower status to any country: US failed in all its recent imperial ventures, UK and Spain also during their heydays, as did Rome in Germany, Persia. It is the fact that they can do it that makes them a superpower, not the details.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @Beckow


    What matters more is the mistaken notion that Russia ‘is not a superpower‘.
     
    It clearly isn't and it will never be again. It could of course still be an important country with a lot of potential, no doubt about that. But it can't be the sort of imperial hegemon dominating a large part of Eurasia that Karlin and his ilk fantasize about.

    US failed in all its recent imperial ventures
     
    And Americans have mostly already forgotten about them, because in the end they didn't really matter to them, and the US is still the most powerful country in the world. Whereas Russia's prestige, economic prospects and military power have been much reduced by the Ukraine war, and if it continues to go as badly as it has done so far, it might even become an existential threat at least for Putin's regime.

    Replies: @A123, @Beckow

    , @A123
    @Beckow


    the fundamental problem for the aspiring global rulers in Washington-London.
     
    Not-The-President Biden? BoJo/Truss/Sunak/Who's Next? Rulers? Surely you jest.

    The aspiring global rulers seeking a European SJW Empire are Scholz and Macron (Paris-Berlin). However, their dominance over other European countries is slipping badly.

    • Italy is openly defying French liberal authoritarianism. (1)
    • Poland is also challenging the European SJW Empire. (2)

    Meet Europe’s coming military superpower: Poland

    Warsaw is turning to major arms deals with South Korea to establish supremacy in Continental Europe.

    “The Polish army must be so powerful that it does not have to fight due to its strength alone,” Prime Minister Mateusz Morawiecki said on the eve of Poland’s independence day.

    It’s a shift that has resonated with Poland’s indispensable ally.

    “Poland has become our most important partner in continental Europe,” a senior U.S. Army official in Europe said, citing the crucial role Poland has played in supporting Ukraine and in shoring up NATO defenses in the Baltics.
    ...
    Poland signed a 23 billion złoty (€4.9 billion) deal for 250 Abrams tanks from the U.S. this spring — a quick replacement for the 240 Soviet-era tanks sent to Ukraine. Its air force is equipped with U.S. F-16s and in 2020 Warsaw signed a $4.6 billion deal for 32 F-35 fighters. But the focus of its recent military spend has been Korea, where it has signed a flurry of deals to buy tanks, aircraft and other arms.

    So far, Poland has ordered between $10 billion-$12 billion worth of weaponry from Korea, said Mariusz Cielma, editor and analyst at Nowa Technika Wojskowa, a military technology news and analysis website.
     
    Scholz and Macron personally own the mess in Ukraine, as well as other EU fiascos. Does humiliating those two make Putin head of a "Super Power"? That seems like a bit of an overstatement.

    Really though, the label does not matter much. What does are facts on the ground. Russia has gained vast swaths of territory. Kiev has no viable plan to assault Mariupol. Capturing Crimea is even more implausible.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-202/#comment-5669011

    (2) https://www.politico.eu/article/europe-military-superpower-poland-army/

    Replies: @showmethereal

    , @AnonfromTN
    @Beckow


    It is the fact that they can do it that makes them a superpower
     
    The fear that Russia inspires in the elites of the empire and its sidekicks is a clear indication that they see Russia as a superpower. Raging inflation throughout the West and severe energy crisis in Europe, both produced by silly attempts to isolate Russia, suggest the same thing.

    But there is a huge difference. Russia and China are different kind of superpowers. They do not do US-style “shock and awe” indiscriminately murdering countless civilians. This makes military gains slow. But this also makes them long lasting. The US failed to control Afghanistan and Iraq for the same reason that made its military victory fast: mass murder produced widespread hatred among the locals, so in the end occupiers had to withdraw. A wise superpower makes an effort to avoid near-universal hatred generated by mass murder of the locals.

    It appears that the people are ingrates, and their good treatment does not pay. In the long run it’s a mistake. Russia is now capitalizing on positive perception the USSR gained in Africa. Only because of that it is successfully squeezing France out of Africa: Central African Republic, then Mali, now Burkina Faso. This is unlikely to be the end.

    One of the things that causes the rage and fear of the elites in the US and among its puppets is that Russia and China are a new kind of superpowers. They are not murderous thugs, who only go for quick victory and loot. They build relationships that can last. The world is changing. Open banditry becomes less and less profitable. Naturally, the bandits resent that.

    Replies: @German_reader

  24. German_reader says:
    @Beckow
    @German_reader


    ...one can't expect any intellectual coherence, at its core it’s just resentment that Russia doesn’t get the respect...
     
    For Russia you can substitute Poland, France, UK, China, any Third World country, even US, definitely Canada, and make exactly the same claim...nations' self perceptions are complicated and prickly. One's respect has an ever expanding definition. Look inward about how you feel about Germany.

    What matters more is the mistaken notion that Russia 'is not a superpower'. By any historical or strategic standard it is - that's the fundamental problem for the aspiring global rulers in Washington-London. The West has tried to defeat Russia (many times), trick it, buy it, even simply declare 'you are no superpower!'...none of it has worked.

    The reality staring at us today is that Russia has invaded a foreign country - a major, strategic Western ally and asset, took territory, destroyed infrastructure - there has not been any serious thing the West has done. Only a superpower could do that, e.g. US has done it previously. The silly notion that Russia is 'not a superpower' doesn't mesh with what has happened. If you raise the bar high enough and focus on minutia, losses, setbacks, you can deny the superpower status to any country: US failed in all its recent imperial ventures, UK and Spain also during their heydays, as did Rome in Germany, Persia. It is the fact that they can do it that makes them a superpower, not the details.

    Replies: @German_reader, @A123, @AnonfromTN

    What matters more is the mistaken notion that Russia ‘is not a superpower‘.

    It clearly isn’t and it will never be again. It could of course still be an important country with a lot of potential, no doubt about that. But it can’t be the sort of imperial hegemon dominating a large part of Eurasia that Karlin and his ilk fantasize about.

    US failed in all its recent imperial ventures

    And Americans have mostly already forgotten about them, because in the end they didn’t really matter to them, and the US is still the most powerful country in the world. Whereas Russia’s prestige, economic prospects and military power have been much reduced by the Ukraine war, and if it continues to go as badly as it has done so far, it might even become an existential threat at least for Putin’s regime.

    • Agree: Mr. Hack
    • Replies: @A123
    @German_reader



    US failed in all its recent imperial ventures
     
    And Americans have mostly already forgotten about them, because in the end they didn’t really matter to them
     
    What recent misadventures were truly imperial?

    • Afghanistan and Syria were police actions against specific threats, not an attempt to install imperial rule.

    • Iraq would probably have been better off as an American colonial protectorate. The fact that it was not added to an empire resulted in defective governance. Disarray and factionalism is so built up at this point that a partition seems necessary.

    The screwups have been epic in scope, scale, and other measures. However, they do not seem imperial.

    PEACE 😇

    , @Beckow
    @German_reader

    Arguing by assertion - "It clearly isn’t and it will never be again" - has limits, and you kind of reached them. I outlined to you what is in general a superpower, how you can recognize one in its behavior and how others react to it - or not react because they can't.

    What Russia did to Ukraine is a prima facie superpower behavior, including the lame and slightly hysterical Western reaction. You focus too much on day-to-day minutia and miss the big strategic shift. I also think - others may disagree - that Russia is completely dominating both the battlefield and the coming escalations. It is their own region, they have the stuff to throw at it, unless they fail internally and choose to go for a compromise it is theirs to manage in almost any way they want.

    By the way, the Western strategists (the smarter ones) know it - that's why they are trying to go for a save-the-face quick 'victory' and a settlement that would give Russia almost all they said they actually want: no Nato in Ukraine and separation-autonomy for the Russians who live in Ukraine.

    But let's see how it evolves.

  25. @Beckow
    @German_reader


    ...one can't expect any intellectual coherence, at its core it’s just resentment that Russia doesn’t get the respect...
     
    For Russia you can substitute Poland, France, UK, China, any Third World country, even US, definitely Canada, and make exactly the same claim...nations' self perceptions are complicated and prickly. One's respect has an ever expanding definition. Look inward about how you feel about Germany.

    What matters more is the mistaken notion that Russia 'is not a superpower'. By any historical or strategic standard it is - that's the fundamental problem for the aspiring global rulers in Washington-London. The West has tried to defeat Russia (many times), trick it, buy it, even simply declare 'you are no superpower!'...none of it has worked.

    The reality staring at us today is that Russia has invaded a foreign country - a major, strategic Western ally and asset, took territory, destroyed infrastructure - there has not been any serious thing the West has done. Only a superpower could do that, e.g. US has done it previously. The silly notion that Russia is 'not a superpower' doesn't mesh with what has happened. If you raise the bar high enough and focus on minutia, losses, setbacks, you can deny the superpower status to any country: US failed in all its recent imperial ventures, UK and Spain also during their heydays, as did Rome in Germany, Persia. It is the fact that they can do it that makes them a superpower, not the details.

    Replies: @German_reader, @A123, @AnonfromTN

    the fundamental problem for the aspiring global rulers in Washington-London.

    Not-The-President Biden? BoJo/Truss/Sunak/Who’s Next? Rulers? Surely you jest.

    The aspiring global rulers seeking a European SJW Empire are Scholz and Macron (Paris-Berlin). However, their dominance over other European countries is slipping badly.

    • Italy is openly defying French liberal authoritarianism. (1)
    • Poland is also challenging the European SJW Empire. (2)

    Meet Europe’s coming military superpower: Poland

    Warsaw is turning to major arms deals with South Korea to establish supremacy in Continental Europe.

    “The Polish army must be so powerful that it does not have to fight due to its strength alone,” Prime Minister Mateusz Morawiecki said on the eve of Poland’s independence day.

    It’s a shift that has resonated with Poland’s indispensable ally.

    “Poland has become our most important partner in continental Europe,” a senior U.S. Army official in Europe said, citing the crucial role Poland has played in supporting Ukraine and in shoring up NATO defenses in the Baltics.

    Poland signed a 23 billion złoty (€4.9 billion) deal for 250 Abrams tanks from the U.S. this spring — a quick replacement for the 240 Soviet-era tanks sent to Ukraine. Its air force is equipped with U.S. F-16s and in 2020 Warsaw signed a $4.6 billion deal for 32 F-35 fighters. But the focus of its recent military spend has been Korea, where it has signed a flurry of deals to buy tanks, aircraft and other arms.

    So far, Poland has ordered between $10 billion-$12 billion worth of weaponry from Korea, said Mariusz Cielma, editor and analyst at Nowa Technika Wojskowa, a military technology news and analysis website.

    Scholz and Macron personally own the mess in Ukraine, as well as other EU fiascos. Does humiliating those two make Putin head of a “Super Power”? That seems like a bit of an overstatement.

    Really though, the label does not matter much. What does are facts on the ground. Russia has gained vast swaths of territory. Kiev has no viable plan to assault Mariupol. Capturing Crimea is even more implausible.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-202/#comment-5669011

    (2) https://www.politico.eu/article/europe-military-superpower-poland-army/

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @A123

    Even more ironic is the items Poland is buying from South Korea is because those systems are better and cheaper than the comparable US equipment. People don’t even see the reality of the global shift. Yes South Korea is a U.S. ally - but it’s not the US. 30 years ago Poland wouldn’t have been buying from South Korea. Meanwhile their brothers across the border - North Koreans - just openly displayed missiles that can now hit every part of the U.S. Only a handful of nations had such missiles of such range. Its a changed world.

    Replies: @A123

  26. @Beckow
    @German_reader


    ...one can't expect any intellectual coherence, at its core it’s just resentment that Russia doesn’t get the respect...
     
    For Russia you can substitute Poland, France, UK, China, any Third World country, even US, definitely Canada, and make exactly the same claim...nations' self perceptions are complicated and prickly. One's respect has an ever expanding definition. Look inward about how you feel about Germany.

    What matters more is the mistaken notion that Russia 'is not a superpower'. By any historical or strategic standard it is - that's the fundamental problem for the aspiring global rulers in Washington-London. The West has tried to defeat Russia (many times), trick it, buy it, even simply declare 'you are no superpower!'...none of it has worked.

    The reality staring at us today is that Russia has invaded a foreign country - a major, strategic Western ally and asset, took territory, destroyed infrastructure - there has not been any serious thing the West has done. Only a superpower could do that, e.g. US has done it previously. The silly notion that Russia is 'not a superpower' doesn't mesh with what has happened. If you raise the bar high enough and focus on minutia, losses, setbacks, you can deny the superpower status to any country: US failed in all its recent imperial ventures, UK and Spain also during their heydays, as did Rome in Germany, Persia. It is the fact that they can do it that makes them a superpower, not the details.

    Replies: @German_reader, @A123, @AnonfromTN

    It is the fact that they can do it that makes them a superpower

    The fear that Russia inspires in the elites of the empire and its sidekicks is a clear indication that they see Russia as a superpower. Raging inflation throughout the West and severe energy crisis in Europe, both produced by silly attempts to isolate Russia, suggest the same thing.

    But there is a huge difference. Russia and China are different kind of superpowers. They do not do US-style “shock and awe” indiscriminately murdering countless civilians. This makes military gains slow. But this also makes them long lasting. The US failed to control Afghanistan and Iraq for the same reason that made its military victory fast: mass murder produced widespread hatred among the locals, so in the end occupiers had to withdraw. A wise superpower makes an effort to avoid near-universal hatred generated by mass murder of the locals.

    It appears that the people are ingrates, and their good treatment does not pay. In the long run it’s a mistake. Russia is now capitalizing on positive perception the USSR gained in Africa. Only because of that it is successfully squeezing France out of Africa: Central African Republic, then Mali, now Burkina Faso. This is unlikely to be the end.

    One of the things that causes the rage and fear of the elites in the US and among its puppets is that Russia and China are a new kind of superpowers. They are not murderous thugs, who only go for quick victory and loot. They build relationships that can last. The world is changing. Open banditry becomes less and less profitable. Naturally, the bandits resent that.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @AnonfromTN


    Russia is now capitalizing on positive perception the USSR gained in Africa. Only because of that it is successfully squeezing France out of Africa: Central African Republic, then Mali, now Burkina Faso.
     
    Ok. Let's hope Africans from those countries will immigrate to Russia then instead of France.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @showmethereal

  27. @German_reader
    @Beckow


    What matters more is the mistaken notion that Russia ‘is not a superpower‘.
     
    It clearly isn't and it will never be again. It could of course still be an important country with a lot of potential, no doubt about that. But it can't be the sort of imperial hegemon dominating a large part of Eurasia that Karlin and his ilk fantasize about.

    US failed in all its recent imperial ventures
     
    And Americans have mostly already forgotten about them, because in the end they didn't really matter to them, and the US is still the most powerful country in the world. Whereas Russia's prestige, economic prospects and military power have been much reduced by the Ukraine war, and if it continues to go as badly as it has done so far, it might even become an existential threat at least for Putin's regime.

    Replies: @A123, @Beckow

    US failed in all its recent imperial ventures

    And Americans have mostly already forgotten about them, because in the end they didn’t really matter to them

    What recent misadventures were truly imperial?

    • Afghanistan and Syria were police actions against specific threats, not an attempt to install imperial rule.

    • Iraq would probably have been better off as an American colonial protectorate. The fact that it was not added to an empire resulted in defective governance. Disarray and factionalism is so built up at this point that a partition seems necessary.

    The screwups have been epic in scope, scale, and other measures. However, they do not seem imperial.

    PEACE 😇

  28. @German_reader
    @Beckow


    What matters more is the mistaken notion that Russia ‘is not a superpower‘.
     
    It clearly isn't and it will never be again. It could of course still be an important country with a lot of potential, no doubt about that. But it can't be the sort of imperial hegemon dominating a large part of Eurasia that Karlin and his ilk fantasize about.

    US failed in all its recent imperial ventures
     
    And Americans have mostly already forgotten about them, because in the end they didn't really matter to them, and the US is still the most powerful country in the world. Whereas Russia's prestige, economic prospects and military power have been much reduced by the Ukraine war, and if it continues to go as badly as it has done so far, it might even become an existential threat at least for Putin's regime.

    Replies: @A123, @Beckow

    Arguing by assertion – “It clearly isn’t and it will never be again” – has limits, and you kind of reached them. I outlined to you what is in general a superpower, how you can recognize one in its behavior and how others react to it – or not react because they can’t.

    What Russia did to Ukraine is a prima facie superpower behavior, including the lame and slightly hysterical Western reaction. You focus too much on day-to-day minutia and miss the big strategic shift. I also think – others may disagree – that Russia is completely dominating both the battlefield and the coming escalations. It is their own region, they have the stuff to throw at it, unless they fail internally and choose to go for a compromise it is theirs to manage in almost any way they want.

    By the way, the Western strategists (the smarter ones) know it – that’s why they are trying to go for a save-the-face quick ‘victory’ and a settlement that would give Russia almost all they said they actually want: no Nato in Ukraine and separation-autonomy for the Russians who live in Ukraine.

    But let’s see how it evolves.

    • Agree: dogbumbreath
    • LOL: Mr. Hack
  29. @AnonfromTN
    @Beckow


    It is the fact that they can do it that makes them a superpower
     
    The fear that Russia inspires in the elites of the empire and its sidekicks is a clear indication that they see Russia as a superpower. Raging inflation throughout the West and severe energy crisis in Europe, both produced by silly attempts to isolate Russia, suggest the same thing.

    But there is a huge difference. Russia and China are different kind of superpowers. They do not do US-style “shock and awe” indiscriminately murdering countless civilians. This makes military gains slow. But this also makes them long lasting. The US failed to control Afghanistan and Iraq for the same reason that made its military victory fast: mass murder produced widespread hatred among the locals, so in the end occupiers had to withdraw. A wise superpower makes an effort to avoid near-universal hatred generated by mass murder of the locals.

    It appears that the people are ingrates, and their good treatment does not pay. In the long run it’s a mistake. Russia is now capitalizing on positive perception the USSR gained in Africa. Only because of that it is successfully squeezing France out of Africa: Central African Republic, then Mali, now Burkina Faso. This is unlikely to be the end.

    One of the things that causes the rage and fear of the elites in the US and among its puppets is that Russia and China are a new kind of superpowers. They are not murderous thugs, who only go for quick victory and loot. They build relationships that can last. The world is changing. Open banditry becomes less and less profitable. Naturally, the bandits resent that.

    Replies: @German_reader

    Russia is now capitalizing on positive perception the USSR gained in Africa. Only because of that it is successfully squeezing France out of Africa: Central African Republic, then Mali, now Burkina Faso.

    Ok. Let’s hope Africans from those countries will immigrate to Russia then instead of France.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader


    Let’s hope Africans from those countries will immigrate to Russia then instead of France.
     
    Russia is protected from immigrants coming out of warm countries by climate: it gets very cold there. There are Russian jokes about everything, including the cold. Question: what do Russians do while waiting for a bus at -40oC. Answer: men drink beer, kids eat ice cream.

    But take heart: as soon as Gulfstream stops, Europe will be protected by climate, as well. Not that the Europeans will be happy with the cold. But the Earth won’t ask them, like the empire doesn’t.

    Replies: @German_reader, @A123

    , @showmethereal
    @German_reader

    Well here is the problem with your thinking. With Russia and China actually helping those countries to develop they have less need to migrate. The most African students in the world study in China - not the west. But the overwhelming majority go back to their home nations. Again like the previous writer noted “different types of superpowers”.

    Replies: @Beckow, @Coconuts

  30. @German_reader
    @AnonfromTN


    Russia is now capitalizing on positive perception the USSR gained in Africa. Only because of that it is successfully squeezing France out of Africa: Central African Republic, then Mali, now Burkina Faso.
     
    Ok. Let's hope Africans from those countries will immigrate to Russia then instead of France.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @showmethereal

    Let’s hope Africans from those countries will immigrate to Russia then instead of France.

    Russia is protected from immigrants coming out of warm countries by climate: it gets very cold there. There are Russian jokes about everything, including the cold. Question: what do Russians do while waiting for a bus at -40oC. Answer: men drink beer, kids eat ice cream.

    But take heart: as soon as Gulfstream stops, Europe will be protected by climate, as well. Not that the Europeans will be happy with the cold. But the Earth won’t ask them, like the empire doesn’t.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @AnonfromTN


    Russia is protected from immigrants coming out of warm countries by climate: it gets very cold there.
     
    There are Somalis in Finland.
    Russia has got lots of space, it needs to share it with its African brethren who are Russia's friends in the struggle against Western imperialism. France is too racist, just think of the horrible things they did in Algeria. And Germany, well, only a question of time until it goes Nazi again. No, Russia needs to take in the migrants from Africa, in fact Russia should send ships to the Mediterranean and pick them up (and then maybe settle them in Crimea). It will be proof of Russia's solidarity and magnaminity and win her many friends around the world, and with those assets the victory over the empire can't be far off.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @dogbumbreath

    , @A123
    @AnonfromTN

    GR and TN,

    Why not follow Meloni's suggestion -- Africans Staying In Africa!

    What is wrong with that concept? It seems perfectly sound to me.

    No migrants = No country accepting migrants.

       Workers win!
          Russian Christians win!
              European Christians win!
                Everybody wins!


    Except for Elite Globalists and SJW Multicultists. SADZ for them. Boo hoo.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  31. German_reader says:
    @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader


    Let’s hope Africans from those countries will immigrate to Russia then instead of France.
     
    Russia is protected from immigrants coming out of warm countries by climate: it gets very cold there. There are Russian jokes about everything, including the cold. Question: what do Russians do while waiting for a bus at -40oC. Answer: men drink beer, kids eat ice cream.

    But take heart: as soon as Gulfstream stops, Europe will be protected by climate, as well. Not that the Europeans will be happy with the cold. But the Earth won’t ask them, like the empire doesn’t.

    Replies: @German_reader, @A123

    Russia is protected from immigrants coming out of warm countries by climate: it gets very cold there.

    There are Somalis in Finland.
    Russia has got lots of space, it needs to share it with its African brethren who are Russia’s friends in the struggle against Western imperialism. France is too racist, just think of the horrible things they did in Algeria. And Germany, well, only a question of time until it goes Nazi again. No, Russia needs to take in the migrants from Africa, in fact Russia should send ships to the Mediterranean and pick them up (and then maybe settle them in Crimea). It will be proof of Russia’s solidarity and magnaminity and win her many friends around the world, and with those assets the victory over the empire can’t be far off.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader

    Sarcasm is a good sign, it requires a sense of humor. I hope Germans still have it when the Gulfstream stops.


    There are Somalis in Finland.
     
    FYI, the parts of Finland, Sweden, and Norway where the people (locals and Somalis) live are a lot warmer than North Russia, not to mention Siberia or the Far East. Cold is the main reason why Chinese don’t want Siberia: they prefer to avoid extreme cold and just buy stuff that the Russians and other locals mine and log there.

    BTW, in the North of Russia grocery stores sell drinking-grade pure (96%) ethanol: when it’s -20 or -40oC outside, you don’t even get drunk, your body uses all ethanol to produce heat. When you come from the outside frozen to the bones, a glass (200 ml) of ethanol is the only thing that prevents catching cold.

    Replies: @German_reader, @Beckow, @S, @Mikel, @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    , @dogbumbreath
    @German_reader


    There are Somalis in Finland.
     
    Unless the rules have changed in the last few years, Finland has a "free" University Education to ALL (native or foreign) if you can speak Finnish. Naturally, many people from less fortunate places learn Finnish and go to Finland to get a free education.

    As for your rambling on about immigration.....in general, emigration occurs because the home country has no opportunities. China and Russia are working to fix this problem in Africa unlike the West which just loots.

  32. @German_reader
    @AnonfromTN


    Russia is protected from immigrants coming out of warm countries by climate: it gets very cold there.
     
    There are Somalis in Finland.
    Russia has got lots of space, it needs to share it with its African brethren who are Russia's friends in the struggle against Western imperialism. France is too racist, just think of the horrible things they did in Algeria. And Germany, well, only a question of time until it goes Nazi again. No, Russia needs to take in the migrants from Africa, in fact Russia should send ships to the Mediterranean and pick them up (and then maybe settle them in Crimea). It will be proof of Russia's solidarity and magnaminity and win her many friends around the world, and with those assets the victory over the empire can't be far off.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @dogbumbreath

    Sarcasm is a good sign, it requires a sense of humor. I hope Germans still have it when the Gulfstream stops.

    There are Somalis in Finland.

    FYI, the parts of Finland, Sweden, and Norway where the people (locals and Somalis) live are a lot warmer than North Russia, not to mention Siberia or the Far East. Cold is the main reason why Chinese don’t want Siberia: they prefer to avoid extreme cold and just buy stuff that the Russians and other locals mine and log there.

    BTW, in the North of Russia grocery stores sell drinking-grade pure (96%) ethanol: when it’s -20 or -40oC outside, you don’t even get drunk, your body uses all ethanol to produce heat. When you come from the outside frozen to the bones, a glass (200 ml) of ethanol is the only thing that prevents catching cold.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @AnonfromTN


    I hope Germans still have it when the Gulfstream stops.
     
    Why are you now going on about the Gulfstream? Even if it happens, it's not like one could do much about it.

    Replies: @LatW

    , @Beckow
    @AnonfromTN

    There are parts of Russia where Afros could survive and not just the south or Crimea. Big cities shield people from the cold and St. Petersburg is not that different from Helsinki. The migrant tsunami starts when the culture collapses and the idiot yearning of liberal-business-feminist crowd reaches certain size - it can happen in Russia too.

    The German_reader is fooling himself, almost all Afros who make it to Russia-Ukraine would end up in Western Europe, just like the water flows downstream. They are lazy food-and-goodies craving young men, they will go where the society is the softest and handouts available.

    The Gulfstream stop may happen too late, if ever. This is a culture meltdown, the way to fix it is by having one's own culture and not be apologetic - Meloni is a good sign, but the collapse goes on. At not so distant future it will be too late. Simple numbers.

    Replies: @German_reader

    , @S
    @AnonfromTN


    BTW, in the North of Russia grocery stores sell drinking-grade pure (96%) ethanol: when it’s -20 or -40oC outside, you don’t even get drunk, your body uses all ethanol to produce heat.
     
    That's funny. It's believed that's the very thing that saved the life of the Titanic's chief baker, Charles Joughin.

    Just prior to going into the water (which was -2C (28F)) when the Titanic sank, Joughin had drank half a glass of liqueur. He stayed afloat treading water in the frigid open ocean for two to three hours, by which time most others in the water had long since died, before finally being picked up by a life boat.

    Joughin said he felt colder in the open boat than he had while almost entirely submerged in the water.

    No frost bite, just some swollen feet afterwards.

    The Incredible Story Of The Titanic’s Baker, Who Survived In The Frigid Water For Hours

    Thanks to a strong constitution and some liquid courage, Charles Joughin survived nearly three hours in the frigid North Atlantic.
     

    Although he [Joughin] was assigned as captain of Lifeboat 10, he did not board; it was already being crewed by two sailors and a steward. He went below after Lifeboat 10 had gone, and "had a drop of liqueur" (a tumbler half-full of liqueur, as he went on to specify) in his quarters.
     
    https://allthatsinteresting.com/charles-joughin

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Joughin

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    , @Mikel
    @AnonfromTN


    when the Gulfstream stops
    ...
    when it’s -20 or -40oC outside, you don’t even get drunk, your body uses all ethanol to produce heat
     
    There you go again.

    For a scientist, you're very prone to making outlandish statements.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulf_Stream#Gulf_Stream_Collapse
    https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/497899/

    I'm not a scientist but I've been a weather nut all my life and, as a mountaineer, I know quite a few things about combating extreme cold. Unfortunately, alcoholic beverages (let alone 96% ethanol) only make matters worse, regardless of the initial euphoria.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    , @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @AnonfromTN

    That's not the main reason, vast swath of northern China is about the same climate

    https://i.postimg.cc/vZn5jSDK/Ko-ppen-Geiger-Climate-Classification-Map-1.png
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Köppen_climate_classification

    The main reason is the three Manchurian provinces, Heilongjiang, Jilin, Liaoning are all relatively underdeveloped. They can't really absorb further territory,

    https://i.postimg.cc/0NDRzxjC/Gdp-per-capita-of-the-administrative-division-in-China.png
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Chinese_administrative_divisions_by_GDP_per_capita

    Some PRC nationalists keep a long list of Qing territories annexed by Russia/Soviets, but that's neither here nor there, those "Chinese" territory belonged to the Manchu-Mongol elites not Han,
    https://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/沙俄和苏联割占中国领土列表

    Awesome travelogue by the way.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  33. @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader

    Sarcasm is a good sign, it requires a sense of humor. I hope Germans still have it when the Gulfstream stops.


    There are Somalis in Finland.
     
    FYI, the parts of Finland, Sweden, and Norway where the people (locals and Somalis) live are a lot warmer than North Russia, not to mention Siberia or the Far East. Cold is the main reason why Chinese don’t want Siberia: they prefer to avoid extreme cold and just buy stuff that the Russians and other locals mine and log there.

    BTW, in the North of Russia grocery stores sell drinking-grade pure (96%) ethanol: when it’s -20 or -40oC outside, you don’t even get drunk, your body uses all ethanol to produce heat. When you come from the outside frozen to the bones, a glass (200 ml) of ethanol is the only thing that prevents catching cold.

    Replies: @German_reader, @Beckow, @S, @Mikel, @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    I hope Germans still have it when the Gulfstream stops.

    Why are you now going on about the Gulfstream? Even if it happens, it’s not like one could do much about it.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @German_reader


    Why are you now going on about the Gulfstream?
     
    Because the Europeans haven't yet frozen without the Russian gas. Surely they will when this Gulfstream thing happens. It's just like the Yellowstone earthquake. It's coming.

    Replies: @Beckow

  34. @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader


    Let’s hope Africans from those countries will immigrate to Russia then instead of France.
     
    Russia is protected from immigrants coming out of warm countries by climate: it gets very cold there. There are Russian jokes about everything, including the cold. Question: what do Russians do while waiting for a bus at -40oC. Answer: men drink beer, kids eat ice cream.

    But take heart: as soon as Gulfstream stops, Europe will be protected by climate, as well. Not that the Europeans will be happy with the cold. But the Earth won’t ask them, like the empire doesn’t.

    Replies: @German_reader, @A123

    GR and TN,

    Why not follow Meloni’s suggestion — Africans Staying In Africa!

    What is wrong with that concept? It seems perfectly sound to me.

    No migrants = No country accepting migrants.

       Workers win!
          Russian Christians win!
              European Christians win!
                Everybody wins!

    Except for Elite Globalists and SJW Multicultists. SADZ for them. Boo hoo.

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @A123


    Africans Staying In Africa!
     
    That’s Russian strategy: make life acceptable where people live, and they won’t risk a journey elsewhere.

    Besides, nobody in Russia gets freebies. If Europe did not give freebies to immigrants, nobody would go there. Europe is actively committing suicide in many ways. Current wave of “refugees” is the result of one of those ways. As one of Russian TV personalities said, “too bad for Europe, we’ll miss it”.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @LatW

  35. @A123
    Unlike Ritter and Sachs, Macgregor offers well constructed analysis. I will have to listen to those pieces as time allows.

     

    In tribute to Not-The-President Biden's 80th birthday and the upcoming Thanksgiving holiday. I offer this:

     
    https://i0.wp.com/dailysoak.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/11/JoeBidenTurkey1-min.jpg
     

    I suspect that bird regrets accepting the pardon at this point.

    🦃 Happy Thanksgiving 🦃

    Replies: @songbird, @follyofwar

    I don’t see a whole lot of difference between the analyses of Ritter and Macgregor.

  36. @A123
    @AnonfromTN

    Apparently they are accusing Russians of shelling their own nuclear power plant. (1)


    Ukrainian troops subjected the Zaporozhye nuclear power plant (NPP) to massive artillery shelling, damaging strategic facilities, an adviser to the head of Rosenergoatom, a subsidiary of Russian state nuclear energy corporation Rosatom, told Sputnik on Sunday.

    "The Ukrainian military launched a massive strike directly at the station. Twelve rockets were fired. It is known that six of them hit the cooling system of reactors, two — hit the dry cask storage [of radioactive waste]. The consequences of the shelling cannot be determined yet since the risk of repeated attacks remains," Renat Karchaa said.

    None of the Zaporozhye NPP personnel were injured, according to Karchaa.
     
    Why would Russians shell their own infrastructure? It's pretty daft accusation.

    Only unhinged Ukie Maximalists could find sense in such madness.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://sputniknews.com/20221120/ukrainian-troops-shell-zaporizhzhia-npp-damaging-strategic-facilities-rosenergoatom-1104465715.html

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Mr. Hack, @Sean

    It is an attempt by Ukraine to get a Western peacekeeping force sent to Zaporozhye. Kiev is scheming to bring America into conflict with Russia. It is a high risk strategy, but Ukraine thinks now the ground is frozen a Russian steamroller of bombardment allied to sufficient infantry will run over Ukrainian armies.

  37. Don’t mean to be macabre, but is there really such a thing as a LGBT club? Since the place was called “Club Q” (whatever that means), I am going to suppose not.

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @songbird

    According to the literature there's a million gay male sodomy clubs.

    Every city has one posh and a small handful (<<10) of lesbian bars.

    Lesbians and gays socialize if and only if they have butt loads of money strictly for networking purposes--lesbians do not like men, not even gay men. The only females who like gay men are spinsters and dowagers and spinsters-to-be.

    I have never read about a QWERTY bar. Maybe that's why they are all so pissed off all the time.

    Replies: @Mikel

  38. What if we went back in time, and ran the decline of Western Civ experiment again? Changed nothing, except enforced Jucheism’s 15 approved haircuts for men, with an iron fist?

  39. @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader

    Sarcasm is a good sign, it requires a sense of humor. I hope Germans still have it when the Gulfstream stops.


    There are Somalis in Finland.
     
    FYI, the parts of Finland, Sweden, and Norway where the people (locals and Somalis) live are a lot warmer than North Russia, not to mention Siberia or the Far East. Cold is the main reason why Chinese don’t want Siberia: they prefer to avoid extreme cold and just buy stuff that the Russians and other locals mine and log there.

    BTW, in the North of Russia grocery stores sell drinking-grade pure (96%) ethanol: when it’s -20 or -40oC outside, you don’t even get drunk, your body uses all ethanol to produce heat. When you come from the outside frozen to the bones, a glass (200 ml) of ethanol is the only thing that prevents catching cold.

    Replies: @German_reader, @Beckow, @S, @Mikel, @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    There are parts of Russia where Afros could survive and not just the south or Crimea. Big cities shield people from the cold and St. Petersburg is not that different from Helsinki. The migrant tsunami starts when the culture collapses and the idiot yearning of liberal-business-feminist crowd reaches certain size – it can happen in Russia too.

    The German_reader is fooling himself, almost all Afros who make it to Russia-Ukraine would end up in Western Europe, just like the water flows downstream. They are lazy food-and-goodies craving young men, they will go where the society is the softest and handouts available.

    The Gulfstream stop may happen too late, if ever. This is a culture meltdown, the way to fix it is by having one’s own culture and not be apologetic – Meloni is a good sign, but the collapse goes on. At not so distant future it will be too late. Simple numbers.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @Beckow


    The German_reader is fooling himself
     
    It was meant as a joke, to mock AnonfromTN's Soviet boomer-like belief that it's somehow a big success for Russia if resentful Africans make pro-Russian noises. And while my immigration scenario may seem far-fetched now, I don't think it's completely impossible that Russia will feel herself forced to accept increasing numbers of African "students" and the like in an attempt to court influence with their countries (also send money down the African drain, like in the 1970s/1980s).
    There'll be two billion Africans in 30 years, more than enough to flood both Western Europe and Russia.

    Replies: @Beckow, @Matra

  40. @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader

    Sarcasm is a good sign, it requires a sense of humor. I hope Germans still have it when the Gulfstream stops.


    There are Somalis in Finland.
     
    FYI, the parts of Finland, Sweden, and Norway where the people (locals and Somalis) live are a lot warmer than North Russia, not to mention Siberia or the Far East. Cold is the main reason why Chinese don’t want Siberia: they prefer to avoid extreme cold and just buy stuff that the Russians and other locals mine and log there.

    BTW, in the North of Russia grocery stores sell drinking-grade pure (96%) ethanol: when it’s -20 or -40oC outside, you don’t even get drunk, your body uses all ethanol to produce heat. When you come from the outside frozen to the bones, a glass (200 ml) of ethanol is the only thing that prevents catching cold.

    Replies: @German_reader, @Beckow, @S, @Mikel, @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    BTW, in the North of Russia grocery stores sell drinking-grade pure (96%) ethanol: when it’s -20 or -40oC outside, you don’t even get drunk, your body uses all ethanol to produce heat.

    That’s funny. It’s believed that’s the very thing that saved the life of the Titanic’s chief baker, Charles Joughin.

    Just prior to going into the water (which was -2C (28F)) when the Titanic sank, Joughin had drank half a glass of liqueur. He stayed afloat treading water in the frigid open ocean for two to three hours, by which time most others in the water had long since died, before finally being picked up by a life boat.

    Joughin said he felt colder in the open boat than he had while almost entirely submerged in the water.

    No frost bite, just some swollen feet afterwards.

    The Incredible Story Of The Titanic’s Baker, Who Survived In The Frigid Water For Hours

    Thanks to a strong constitution and some liquid courage, Charles Joughin survived nearly three hours in the frigid North Atlantic.

    Although he [Joughin] was assigned as captain of Lifeboat 10, he did not board; it was already being crewed by two sailors and a steward. He went below after Lifeboat 10 had gone, and “had a drop of liqueur” (a tumbler half-full of liqueur, as he went on to specify) in his quarters.

    https://allthatsinteresting.com/charles-joughin

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Joughin

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @S


    No frost bite, just some swollen feet afterwards.
     
    Yep, it works. Thousands of people living in very cold areas can attest to it.
  41. German_reader says:
    @Beckow
    @AnonfromTN

    There are parts of Russia where Afros could survive and not just the south or Crimea. Big cities shield people from the cold and St. Petersburg is not that different from Helsinki. The migrant tsunami starts when the culture collapses and the idiot yearning of liberal-business-feminist crowd reaches certain size - it can happen in Russia too.

    The German_reader is fooling himself, almost all Afros who make it to Russia-Ukraine would end up in Western Europe, just like the water flows downstream. They are lazy food-and-goodies craving young men, they will go where the society is the softest and handouts available.

    The Gulfstream stop may happen too late, if ever. This is a culture meltdown, the way to fix it is by having one's own culture and not be apologetic - Meloni is a good sign, but the collapse goes on. At not so distant future it will be too late. Simple numbers.

    Replies: @German_reader

    The German_reader is fooling himself

    It was meant as a joke, to mock AnonfromTN’s Soviet boomer-like belief that it’s somehow a big success for Russia if resentful Africans make pro-Russian noises. And while my immigration scenario may seem far-fetched now, I don’t think it’s completely impossible that Russia will feel herself forced to accept increasing numbers of African “students” and the like in an attempt to court influence with their countries (also send money down the African drain, like in the 1970s/1980s).
    There’ll be two billion Africans in 30 years, more than enough to flood both Western Europe and Russia.

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @German_reader

    There are certainly enough Africans for all of us :)...It is a half-joke - I take as such too most of the time - but it has a very serious side: the coming end of us.

    One counter-force to the pro-Russian noises in the Third World is that the insane anti-Russian propaganda demonizing them as racists and haters may keep some from going there - the migrating demographic is heavily skewed toward the woke-rainbow-liberal types in the Third World (they have the minimal means).

    They are coming anyway, hundreds of millions, next time there is a breach in the minimal border controls or any excuse. We will need to rebuild the castles :)...curry and rap, women yearning for alphas, wimpy game playing Euro guys, cheap business owners hating workers, self-doubt and greedy boomers: Europe has had a perfect storm.

    Replies: @German_reader

    , @Matra
    @German_reader


    It was meant as a joke, to mock AnonfromTN’s Soviet boomer-like belief that it’s somehow a big success for Russia if resentful Africans make pro-Russian noises
     
    In the last two months I've noticed lots of young pro-Russians (mostly Russian, Serbian, and few outspoken Slovaks) engaging in all-out boomer-bashing of the kind we normally see in the Anglo Dissident Rightosphere. Unlike pro-Russia Anglos who think the war's going great (!) these Slavs are frustrated and bitter towards Putin and the people around him not just for the way the war has gone but for the Kremlin's PR which they think is stuck in Soviet times. We seem to have a worldwide boomer problem.

    Replies: @silviosilver

  42. @German_reader
    @AnonfromTN


    I hope Germans still have it when the Gulfstream stops.
     
    Why are you now going on about the Gulfstream? Even if it happens, it's not like one could do much about it.

    Replies: @LatW

    Why are you now going on about the Gulfstream?

    Because the Europeans haven’t yet frozen without the Russian gas. Surely they will when this Gulfstream thing happens. It’s just like the Yellowstone earthquake. It’s coming.

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @LatW

    You don't actually freeze, everyone just gets colder. Some are sick, others just very uncomfortable. Businesses close, factories limit production...that's the way it works, no apocalypse, only a slow end with a whimper...do you think that's a good thing? a victory?

    Replies: @LatW

  43. @German_reader
    @Beckow


    The German_reader is fooling himself
     
    It was meant as a joke, to mock AnonfromTN's Soviet boomer-like belief that it's somehow a big success for Russia if resentful Africans make pro-Russian noises. And while my immigration scenario may seem far-fetched now, I don't think it's completely impossible that Russia will feel herself forced to accept increasing numbers of African "students" and the like in an attempt to court influence with their countries (also send money down the African drain, like in the 1970s/1980s).
    There'll be two billion Africans in 30 years, more than enough to flood both Western Europe and Russia.

    Replies: @Beckow, @Matra

    There are certainly enough Africans for all of us :)…It is a half-joke – I take as such too most of the time – but it has a very serious side: the coming end of us.

    One counter-force to the pro-Russian noises in the Third World is that the insane anti-Russian propaganda demonizing them as racists and haters may keep some from going there – the migrating demographic is heavily skewed toward the woke-rainbow-liberal types in the Third World (they have the minimal means).

    They are coming anyway, hundreds of millions, next time there is a breach in the minimal border controls or any excuse. We will need to rebuild the castles :)…curry and rap, women yearning for alphas, wimpy game playing Euro guys, cheap business owners hating workers, self-doubt and greedy boomers: Europe has had a perfect storm.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @Beckow


    One counter-force to the pro-Russian noises in the Third World is that the insane anti-Russian propaganda demonizing them as racists and haters may keep some from going there
     
    Germany is supposedly full of Nazis who are constantly brutalizing and murdering peaceful poc immigrants, and who have infiltrated the police (which is also shooting innocent immigrants just for fun, like in America) and the army where they're creating death lists, and have their own Nazi party in parliament with AfD...and yet hundreds of thousands of immigrants from outside of Europe are still coming every year.

    the coming end of us.
     
    Yeah, for once I'm fully in agreement with you.

    Replies: @Beckow

  44. @LatW
    @German_reader


    Why are you now going on about the Gulfstream?
     
    Because the Europeans haven't yet frozen without the Russian gas. Surely they will when this Gulfstream thing happens. It's just like the Yellowstone earthquake. It's coming.

    Replies: @Beckow

    You don’t actually freeze, everyone just gets colder. Some are sick, others just very uncomfortable. Businesses close, factories limit production…that’s the way it works, no apocalypse, only a slow end with a whimper…do you think that’s a good thing? a victory?

    • Replies: @LatW
    @Beckow


    do you think that’s a good thing?
     
    Of course, it is not a good thing at all! Yes, these are hardships that shouldn't have been there (although you know very well that the inflation part is not as simple as it looks, it was long in the making, inflation would've risen even without the Russian invasion, that it's been made worse is, of course, a huge negative). My point was that the Russian media thought that the Euros will literally freeze. Physically. And quickly. They even made fun of the Finns who were gathering logs, even though this is something that people have always done in this region.

    It's hilarious how they're now invoking this Gulfstream meme. It reminded me of their constant talk about the plate tectonics in Yellowstone that will eventually destroy the US.

    And, as to Russia and Africans, yes, they will absolutely go there, regardless of the cold weather (big parts of Russia are livable, especially the European parts), and regardless of their image as intolerant or whatever. They will appear once a certain level of GDP per capita is achieved and as soon as the legislation is adopted to facilitate this (allowing foreign students to work due to labor shortage, etc).

    It is also possible that the Chinese who are renting plots in Siberia (40-50 year long leases) will import Asian labor.

    Replies: @German_reader, @LatW

  45. German_reader says:
    @Beckow
    @German_reader

    There are certainly enough Africans for all of us :)...It is a half-joke - I take as such too most of the time - but it has a very serious side: the coming end of us.

    One counter-force to the pro-Russian noises in the Third World is that the insane anti-Russian propaganda demonizing them as racists and haters may keep some from going there - the migrating demographic is heavily skewed toward the woke-rainbow-liberal types in the Third World (they have the minimal means).

    They are coming anyway, hundreds of millions, next time there is a breach in the minimal border controls or any excuse. We will need to rebuild the castles :)...curry and rap, women yearning for alphas, wimpy game playing Euro guys, cheap business owners hating workers, self-doubt and greedy boomers: Europe has had a perfect storm.

    Replies: @German_reader

    One counter-force to the pro-Russian noises in the Third World is that the insane anti-Russian propaganda demonizing them as racists and haters may keep some from going there

    Germany is supposedly full of Nazis who are constantly brutalizing and murdering peaceful poc immigrants, and who have infiltrated the police (which is also shooting innocent immigrants just for fun, like in America) and the army where they’re creating death lists, and have their own Nazi party in parliament with AfD…and yet hundreds of thousands of immigrants from outside of Europe are still coming every year.

    the coming end of us.

    Yeah, for once I’m fully in agreement with you.

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @German_reader

    Sure, but the Afros don't believe it about Germany...it is easier to believe that stuff about a remote slightly obscure Russia. The preparation by movies with scary narratives has been ongoing for generations. It may actually stick with many of them.

  46. @Beckow
    @LatW

    You don't actually freeze, everyone just gets colder. Some are sick, others just very uncomfortable. Businesses close, factories limit production...that's the way it works, no apocalypse, only a slow end with a whimper...do you think that's a good thing? a victory?

    Replies: @LatW

    do you think that’s a good thing?

    Of course, it is not a good thing at all! Yes, these are hardships that shouldn’t have been there (although you know very well that the inflation part is not as simple as it looks, it was long in the making, inflation would’ve risen even without the Russian invasion, that it’s been made worse is, of course, a huge negative). My point was that the Russian media thought that the Euros will literally freeze. Physically. And quickly. They even made fun of the Finns who were gathering logs, even though this is something that people have always done in this region.

    It’s hilarious how they’re now invoking this Gulfstream meme. It reminded me of their constant talk about the plate tectonics in Yellowstone that will eventually destroy the US.

    And, as to Russia and Africans, yes, they will absolutely go there, regardless of the cold weather (big parts of Russia are livable, especially the European parts), and regardless of their image as intolerant or whatever. They will appear once a certain level of GDP per capita is achieved and as soon as the legislation is adopted to facilitate this (allowing foreign students to work due to labor shortage, etc).

    It is also possible that the Chinese who are renting plots in Siberia (40-50 year long leases) will import Asian labor.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @LatW


    My point was that the Russian media thought that the Euros will literally freeze.
     
    That's certainly pretty dumb, and I think in the long run Russians won't feel like laughing and gloating anymore, but the energy crisis is real enough. Got informed about price rises by my energy supplier a few days ago...will jump from 26 cent/kwh to 44 cent/kwh. And of course lots of reports already that companies are closing down or re-locating. This will also affect the "Marshall plan" for Ukraine btw you were writing about in the last thread (bad analogy anyway, Marshall plan wasn't totally insignificant, but its importance can be exaggerated), when the EU core is in recession and subject to de-industrialization, good luck with that.

    Replies: @Wokechoke

    , @LatW
    @LatW


    My point was that the Russian media thought that the Euros will literally freeze. Physically. And quickly.
     
    To be fair to them, it's not entirely irrational or stupid. Maybe they have memories about how Reagan crushed the USSR - it wasn't done with armed forces, but by manipulating the oil price. The Russians might be trying to replicate that maneuver in their own way.
  47. @A123
    @AnonfromTN

    GR and TN,

    Why not follow Meloni's suggestion -- Africans Staying In Africa!

    What is wrong with that concept? It seems perfectly sound to me.

    No migrants = No country accepting migrants.

       Workers win!
          Russian Christians win!
              European Christians win!
                Everybody wins!


    Except for Elite Globalists and SJW Multicultists. SADZ for them. Boo hoo.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    Africans Staying In Africa!

    That’s Russian strategy: make life acceptable where people live, and they won’t risk a journey elsewhere.

    Besides, nobody in Russia gets freebies. If Europe did not give freebies to immigrants, nobody would go there. Europe is actively committing suicide in many ways. Current wave of “refugees” is the result of one of those ways. As one of Russian TV personalities said, “too bad for Europe, we’ll miss it”.

    • Agree: A123
    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @AnonfromTN


    That’s Russian strategy: make life acceptable where people live, and they won’t risk a journey elsewhere.
     
    It doesn't appear that this strategy worked for you. You traded it all in for science ($$) and a dull life somewhere in Tennessee. :-)

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    , @LatW
    @AnonfromTN


    That’s Russian strategy: make life acceptable where people live, and they won’t risk a journey elsewhere.
     
    That's what Meloni was just arguing, although not fully sure about her motivation there. Africa is developing, there are some decent businesses there now. The issue is that there are so many of them and that the countries are so diverse, is that enough of them can make their way to Europe or Russia.

    Besides, nobody in Russia gets freebies.
     
    This will not save you. Yes, there are tons of freeloaders, but there are also those who do work. Or the father works and then has several more children. The Somalis, for instance, will favor their group and give each other jobs, in the West Somali men work as cab drivers (and some of their younger women are hookers). They can live off of a cash economy. Granted, Russia will probably receive more migrants from Asia and they are very different than the low level Africans that the Euros keep getting. But not all Russians like that either.
  48. @S
    @AnonfromTN


    BTW, in the North of Russia grocery stores sell drinking-grade pure (96%) ethanol: when it’s -20 or -40oC outside, you don’t even get drunk, your body uses all ethanol to produce heat.
     
    That's funny. It's believed that's the very thing that saved the life of the Titanic's chief baker, Charles Joughin.

    Just prior to going into the water (which was -2C (28F)) when the Titanic sank, Joughin had drank half a glass of liqueur. He stayed afloat treading water in the frigid open ocean for two to three hours, by which time most others in the water had long since died, before finally being picked up by a life boat.

    Joughin said he felt colder in the open boat than he had while almost entirely submerged in the water.

    No frost bite, just some swollen feet afterwards.

    The Incredible Story Of The Titanic’s Baker, Who Survived In The Frigid Water For Hours

    Thanks to a strong constitution and some liquid courage, Charles Joughin survived nearly three hours in the frigid North Atlantic.
     

    Although he [Joughin] was assigned as captain of Lifeboat 10, he did not board; it was already being crewed by two sailors and a steward. He went below after Lifeboat 10 had gone, and "had a drop of liqueur" (a tumbler half-full of liqueur, as he went on to specify) in his quarters.
     
    https://allthatsinteresting.com/charles-joughin

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Joughin

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    No frost bite, just some swollen feet afterwards.

    Yep, it works. Thousands of people living in very cold areas can attest to it.

  49. German_reader says:
    @LatW
    @Beckow


    do you think that’s a good thing?
     
    Of course, it is not a good thing at all! Yes, these are hardships that shouldn't have been there (although you know very well that the inflation part is not as simple as it looks, it was long in the making, inflation would've risen even without the Russian invasion, that it's been made worse is, of course, a huge negative). My point was that the Russian media thought that the Euros will literally freeze. Physically. And quickly. They even made fun of the Finns who were gathering logs, even though this is something that people have always done in this region.

    It's hilarious how they're now invoking this Gulfstream meme. It reminded me of their constant talk about the plate tectonics in Yellowstone that will eventually destroy the US.

    And, as to Russia and Africans, yes, they will absolutely go there, regardless of the cold weather (big parts of Russia are livable, especially the European parts), and regardless of their image as intolerant or whatever. They will appear once a certain level of GDP per capita is achieved and as soon as the legislation is adopted to facilitate this (allowing foreign students to work due to labor shortage, etc).

    It is also possible that the Chinese who are renting plots in Siberia (40-50 year long leases) will import Asian labor.

    Replies: @German_reader, @LatW

    My point was that the Russian media thought that the Euros will literally freeze.

    That’s certainly pretty dumb, and I think in the long run Russians won’t feel like laughing and gloating anymore, but the energy crisis is real enough. Got informed about price rises by my energy supplier a few days ago…will jump from 26 cent/kwh to 44 cent/kwh. And of course lots of reports already that companies are closing down or re-locating. This will also affect the “Marshall plan” for Ukraine btw you were writing about in the last thread (bad analogy anyway, Marshall plan wasn’t totally insignificant, but its importance can be exaggerated), when the EU core is in recession and subject to de-industrialization, good luck with that.

    • Replies: @Wokechoke
    @German_reader

    The Balts are objectively pro-Mongol.

  50. @LatW
    @Beckow


    do you think that’s a good thing?
     
    Of course, it is not a good thing at all! Yes, these are hardships that shouldn't have been there (although you know very well that the inflation part is not as simple as it looks, it was long in the making, inflation would've risen even without the Russian invasion, that it's been made worse is, of course, a huge negative). My point was that the Russian media thought that the Euros will literally freeze. Physically. And quickly. They even made fun of the Finns who were gathering logs, even though this is something that people have always done in this region.

    It's hilarious how they're now invoking this Gulfstream meme. It reminded me of their constant talk about the plate tectonics in Yellowstone that will eventually destroy the US.

    And, as to Russia and Africans, yes, they will absolutely go there, regardless of the cold weather (big parts of Russia are livable, especially the European parts), and regardless of their image as intolerant or whatever. They will appear once a certain level of GDP per capita is achieved and as soon as the legislation is adopted to facilitate this (allowing foreign students to work due to labor shortage, etc).

    It is also possible that the Chinese who are renting plots in Siberia (40-50 year long leases) will import Asian labor.

    Replies: @German_reader, @LatW

    My point was that the Russian media thought that the Euros will literally freeze. Physically. And quickly.

    To be fair to them, it’s not entirely irrational or stupid. Maybe they have memories about how Reagan crushed the USSR – it wasn’t done with armed forces, but by manipulating the oil price. The Russians might be trying to replicate that maneuver in their own way.

  51. @songbird
    Don't mean to be macabre, but is there really such a thing as a LGBT club? Since the place was called "Club Q" (whatever that means), I am going to suppose not.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    According to the literature there’s a million gay male sodomy clubs.

    Every city has one posh and a small handful (<<10) of lesbian bars.

    Lesbians and gays socialize if and only if they have butt loads of money strictly for networking purposes–lesbians do not like men, not even gay men. The only females who like gay men are spinsters and dowagers and spinsters-to-be.

    I have never read about a QWERTY bar. Maybe that's why they are all so pissed off all the time.

    • Thanks: songbird
    • Replies: @Mikel
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    The only females who like gay men are spinsters and dowagers and spinsters-to-be.
     
    Totally wrong in my experience. I've met lots of women in different parts of the world who liked gay men in their own way. As one of them once told me 'they talk to you about clothes and kiss you in the lips, what's not to like?' My wife also finds effeminate gays funny and relatable, inoffensive men that behave like women and have female interests like her own.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

  52. @German_reader
    @Beckow


    One counter-force to the pro-Russian noises in the Third World is that the insane anti-Russian propaganda demonizing them as racists and haters may keep some from going there
     
    Germany is supposedly full of Nazis who are constantly brutalizing and murdering peaceful poc immigrants, and who have infiltrated the police (which is also shooting innocent immigrants just for fun, like in America) and the army where they're creating death lists, and have their own Nazi party in parliament with AfD...and yet hundreds of thousands of immigrants from outside of Europe are still coming every year.

    the coming end of us.
     
    Yeah, for once I'm fully in agreement with you.

    Replies: @Beckow

    Sure, but the Afros don’t believe it about Germany…it is easier to believe that stuff about a remote slightly obscure Russia. The preparation by movies with scary narratives has been ongoing for generations. It may actually stick with many of them.

  53. @AnonfromTN
    @A123


    Africans Staying In Africa!
     
    That’s Russian strategy: make life acceptable where people live, and they won’t risk a journey elsewhere.

    Besides, nobody in Russia gets freebies. If Europe did not give freebies to immigrants, nobody would go there. Europe is actively committing suicide in many ways. Current wave of “refugees” is the result of one of those ways. As one of Russian TV personalities said, “too bad for Europe, we’ll miss it”.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @LatW

    That’s Russian strategy: make life acceptable where people live, and they won’t risk a journey elsewhere.

    It doesn’t appear that this strategy worked for you. You traded it all in for science ($$) and a dull life somewhere in Tennessee. 🙂

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Mr. Hack


    It doesn’t appear that this strategy worked for you.
     
    FYI, my requirements apply to maybe 0.1% of the population. Besides, I left dying USSR in 1991, the RF did not exist at the time. Although the science in my field in the RF is still not top-notch, the US science is going down, too. Unfortunately, at accelerating rate. If I had to make a choice today, I’d either stay put or move to Singapore.
  54. @Mr. Hack
    @AnonfromTN


    That’s Russian strategy: make life acceptable where people live, and they won’t risk a journey elsewhere.
     
    It doesn't appear that this strategy worked for you. You traded it all in for science ($$) and a dull life somewhere in Tennessee. :-)

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    It doesn’t appear that this strategy worked for you.

    FYI, my requirements apply to maybe 0.1% of the population. Besides, I left dying USSR in 1991, the RF did not exist at the time. Although the science in my field in the RF is still not top-notch, the US science is going down, too. Unfortunately, at accelerating rate. If I had to make a choice today, I’d either stay put or move to Singapore.

  55. That’s certainly pretty dumb, and I think in the long run Russians won’t feel like laughing and gloating anymore, but the energy crisis is real enough.

    They are sometimes isolated from the European information space (many don’t read English or even French or German) and some of them travel very little, so they can have those kinds of assumptions. It is a bit similar to Americans who are similarly isolated and not that informed or indifferent about other societies (no judgement there for either of those nations, it’s just a fact that it determined by their vast geography, these nations could perfectly exist without anyone else, if they wanted to).

    [MORE]

    Got informed about price rises by my energy supplier a few days ago…

    I know, it’s very serious (many of us have seen shocking bills). I hope the elderly and the children are ok. This could be treated as a war like situation, unfortunately.

    My point was more that they thought there wouldn’t be any resilience at all. They have made these sweeping statements about many things (“Ukrainians are all ruled by the hunta and will come to our side as soon as they are liberated”, etc). The Gulfstream meme most likely is coming from that same type of thinking.

    It’s a weakness actually. They’re lucky that not all of their weaknesses are being exploited, because not enough global players care or care enough.

    “Marshall plan” for Ukraine

    This is still quite hypothetical, and, of course, these economic hardships do not help. But I think it is too early to say there is no money. There is money out there, I think a bigger issue is where to invest the money wisely long term. We saw how quickly for instance the tech bubble burst this year, if it wasn’t for the war, Ukraine would actually be a somewhat decent place for money to go to. Also, this hypothetical Marshall Plan would come not just from Europe, but possibly other global players, too. Who knows, maybe even China.

    Btw, in the above video, this McGregor guy is saying that Germany will de-industrialize by 20-30%. That’s a little exaggerated, imo. It’s crazy to throw such numbers around. Granted, imo, Germany de-industrializing even by 1% or 0.1% is a negative.

    In that same video, he’s also saying that Ukrainian troops are not firing the HIMARS but only Americans who have arrived on the frontlines are doing that, that sounds like some major BS to me. There are most likely instructors there, but that kind of a statement just sounds dubious.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @LatW


    Btw, in the above video, this McGregor guy is saying that Germany will de-industrialize by 20-30%.
     
    I don't watch or read anything by McGregor, he doesn't seem to be a credible source. Very strange, I wonder what's his motivation.

    Replies: @A123

    , @A123
    @LatW


    Americans who are similarly isolated and not that informed or indifferent about other societies (no judgement there for either of those nations, it’s just a fact that it determined by their vast geography
     
    Historically, U.S. Passports have only been held by 25-30% of citizens. Recently, that surged to over 40% due to Canada and Mexico transit requiring the document. 30 years ago you could easily cross into Windsor with only a driver's license.

    Trump's first act should be disbanding the entire Homeland Security fiasco...

    PEACE 😇
  56. @AnonfromTN
    @A123


    Africans Staying In Africa!
     
    That’s Russian strategy: make life acceptable where people live, and they won’t risk a journey elsewhere.

    Besides, nobody in Russia gets freebies. If Europe did not give freebies to immigrants, nobody would go there. Europe is actively committing suicide in many ways. Current wave of “refugees” is the result of one of those ways. As one of Russian TV personalities said, “too bad for Europe, we’ll miss it”.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @LatW

    That’s Russian strategy: make life acceptable where people live, and they won’t risk a journey elsewhere.

    That’s what Meloni was just arguing, although not fully sure about her motivation there. Africa is developing, there are some decent businesses there now. The issue is that there are so many of them and that the countries are so diverse, is that enough of them can make their way to Europe or Russia.

    Besides, nobody in Russia gets freebies.

    This will not save you. Yes, there are tons of freeloaders, but there are also those who do work. Or the father works and then has several more children. The Somalis, for instance, will favor their group and give each other jobs, in the West Somali men work as cab drivers (and some of their younger women are hookers). They can live off of a cash economy. Granted, Russia will probably receive more migrants from Asia and they are very different than the low level Africans that the Euros keep getting. But not all Russians like that either.

  57. Has anyone been to one of these dual language tube stations in London?

    Whitechapel has Bengali. Southall has Punjabi.

  58. @LatW

    That’s certainly pretty dumb, and I think in the long run Russians won’t feel like laughing and gloating anymore, but the energy crisis is real enough.
     
    They are sometimes isolated from the European information space (many don't read English or even French or German) and some of them travel very little, so they can have those kinds of assumptions. It is a bit similar to Americans who are similarly isolated and not that informed or indifferent about other societies (no judgement there for either of those nations, it's just a fact that it determined by their vast geography, these nations could perfectly exist without anyone else, if they wanted to).


    Got informed about price rises by my energy supplier a few days ago…

     

    I know, it's very serious (many of us have seen shocking bills). I hope the elderly and the children are ok. This could be treated as a war like situation, unfortunately.

    My point was more that they thought there wouldn't be any resilience at all. They have made these sweeping statements about many things ("Ukrainians are all ruled by the hunta and will come to our side as soon as they are liberated", etc). The Gulfstream meme most likely is coming from that same type of thinking.

    It's a weakness actually. They're lucky that not all of their weaknesses are being exploited, because not enough global players care or care enough.

    “Marshall plan” for Ukraine
     
    This is still quite hypothetical, and, of course, these economic hardships do not help. But I think it is too early to say there is no money. There is money out there, I think a bigger issue is where to invest the money wisely long term. We saw how quickly for instance the tech bubble burst this year, if it wasn't for the war, Ukraine would actually be a somewhat decent place for money to go to. Also, this hypothetical Marshall Plan would come not just from Europe, but possibly other global players, too. Who knows, maybe even China.

    Btw, in the above video, this McGregor guy is saying that Germany will de-industrialize by 20-30%. That's a little exaggerated, imo. It's crazy to throw such numbers around. Granted, imo, Germany de-industrializing even by 1% or 0.1% is a negative.

    In that same video, he's also saying that Ukrainian troops are not firing the HIMARS but only Americans who have arrived on the frontlines are doing that, that sounds like some major BS to me. There are most likely instructors there, but that kind of a statement just sounds dubious.

    Replies: @German_reader, @A123

    Btw, in the above video, this McGregor guy is saying that Germany will de-industrialize by 20-30%.

    I don’t watch or read anything by McGregor, he doesn’t seem to be a credible source. Very strange, I wonder what’s his motivation.

    • Replies: @A123
    @German_reader


    Btw, in the above video, this McGregor guy is saying that Germany will de-industrialize by 20-30%.
     
    Does anyone have the specific time within which video where that came from?

    It might make sense in context. As a one liner it is a bit eyebrow raising.

    I don’t watch or read anything by McGregor, he doesn’t seem to be a credible source. Very strange, I wonder what’s his motivation.
     
    When he talking within his expertise, military strategy and tactics, his analysis is sound. That does not mean it is 100% perfect future view. He does out perform others.

    Industrial, country scale, economics is not Macgregor's expertise. Germany is taking big shots with energy intensive industry shutting down. Heavy industry needed for military production is a limited slice of "industry" generally.

    PEACE 😇
  59. @LatW

    That’s certainly pretty dumb, and I think in the long run Russians won’t feel like laughing and gloating anymore, but the energy crisis is real enough.
     
    They are sometimes isolated from the European information space (many don't read English or even French or German) and some of them travel very little, so they can have those kinds of assumptions. It is a bit similar to Americans who are similarly isolated and not that informed or indifferent about other societies (no judgement there for either of those nations, it's just a fact that it determined by their vast geography, these nations could perfectly exist without anyone else, if they wanted to).


    Got informed about price rises by my energy supplier a few days ago…

     

    I know, it's very serious (many of us have seen shocking bills). I hope the elderly and the children are ok. This could be treated as a war like situation, unfortunately.

    My point was more that they thought there wouldn't be any resilience at all. They have made these sweeping statements about many things ("Ukrainians are all ruled by the hunta and will come to our side as soon as they are liberated", etc). The Gulfstream meme most likely is coming from that same type of thinking.

    It's a weakness actually. They're lucky that not all of their weaknesses are being exploited, because not enough global players care or care enough.

    “Marshall plan” for Ukraine
     
    This is still quite hypothetical, and, of course, these economic hardships do not help. But I think it is too early to say there is no money. There is money out there, I think a bigger issue is where to invest the money wisely long term. We saw how quickly for instance the tech bubble burst this year, if it wasn't for the war, Ukraine would actually be a somewhat decent place for money to go to. Also, this hypothetical Marshall Plan would come not just from Europe, but possibly other global players, too. Who knows, maybe even China.

    Btw, in the above video, this McGregor guy is saying that Germany will de-industrialize by 20-30%. That's a little exaggerated, imo. It's crazy to throw such numbers around. Granted, imo, Germany de-industrializing even by 1% or 0.1% is a negative.

    In that same video, he's also saying that Ukrainian troops are not firing the HIMARS but only Americans who have arrived on the frontlines are doing that, that sounds like some major BS to me. There are most likely instructors there, but that kind of a statement just sounds dubious.

    Replies: @German_reader, @A123

    Americans who are similarly isolated and not that informed or indifferent about other societies (no judgement there for either of those nations, it’s just a fact that it determined by their vast geography

    Historically, U.S. Passports have only been held by 25-30% of citizens. Recently, that surged to over 40% due to Canada and Mexico transit requiring the document. 30 years ago you could easily cross into Windsor with only a driver’s license.

    Trump’s first act should be disbanding the entire Homeland Security fiasco…

    PEACE 😇

  60. @German_reader
    @LatW


    My point was that the Russian media thought that the Euros will literally freeze.
     
    That's certainly pretty dumb, and I think in the long run Russians won't feel like laughing and gloating anymore, but the energy crisis is real enough. Got informed about price rises by my energy supplier a few days ago...will jump from 26 cent/kwh to 44 cent/kwh. And of course lots of reports already that companies are closing down or re-locating. This will also affect the "Marshall plan" for Ukraine btw you were writing about in the last thread (bad analogy anyway, Marshall plan wasn't totally insignificant, but its importance can be exaggerated), when the EU core is in recession and subject to de-industrialization, good luck with that.

    Replies: @Wokechoke

    The Balts are objectively pro-Mongol.

  61. https://zoom.earth/maps/temperature/

    Very Balmy Crimea, Rostov and Donetsk. Kiev, Sumy, Vinnitssia, Zhitomir and Cherniev frozen solid.

  62. The sky is falling in Russia :)…

    Media mostly writes nonsense, I would not take it too seriously. They all high-light improbable bad things about the enemy, Europeans do it, Finns do it, and Russians do it too. Russia will do fine, maybe that’s what really bothers you and some others here.

    Schadenfreude is an ugly thing. But it is so tempting, isn’t it?

  63. @German_reader
    @LatW


    Btw, in the above video, this McGregor guy is saying that Germany will de-industrialize by 20-30%.
     
    I don't watch or read anything by McGregor, he doesn't seem to be a credible source. Very strange, I wonder what's his motivation.

    Replies: @A123

    Btw, in the above video, this McGregor guy is saying that Germany will de-industrialize by 20-30%.

    Does anyone have the specific time within which video where that came from?

    It might make sense in context. As a one liner it is a bit eyebrow raising.

    I don’t watch or read anything by McGregor, he doesn’t seem to be a credible source. Very strange, I wonder what’s his motivation.

    When he talking within his expertise, military strategy and tactics, his analysis is sound. That does not mean it is 100% perfect future view. He does out perform others.

    Industrial, country scale, economics is not Macgregor’s expertise. Germany is taking big shots with energy intensive industry shutting down. Heavy industry needed for military production is a limited slice of “industry” generally.

    PEACE 😇

  64. Does anyone have the specific time within which video where that came from?

    In the first video, starting at 18:00, after he is asked about the European unity when it comes to supporting Ukraine, he starts talking about Germany, and says: “Germany’s economy is expected to contract 20-30% as a result of the sanctions that have been imposed and the lack of access to natural gas and oil from Russia.” (Actually, I misquoted him (apologies for that), it turns out he said something even crazier than what I misheard him say.)

    Then there is more nonsense about how it might seem for other Europeans that the deindustrialization of Germany might be a “good thing, but it’s not”, which is not how most Europeans think. Which Europeans think this? Certainly not Northern Europeans and not Visegrad, who rely on trade with Germany.

    When it comes to some of the Ukrainian casualty numbers he’s mentioning, first, the casualty numbers will not be given out right now, so I wonder about his sources. Second, his casualty ratios do not match what some of the men on the ground mention occasionally in their interviews on the Ukrainian TV as well as what is occasionally seen on social networks. There are no accurate numbers for this available so it’s puzzling how he can mention these with such confidence. So not sure I’d dedicate too much time listening to this guy.

    I also would like to have things clarified about the HIMARS. Many of the Ukrainian troops are highly competent (they have a serious school of artillery) and it is offensive to hear that they are unable to operate the HIMARS.

    • Replies: @A123
    @LatW


    I also would like to have things clarified about the HIMARS. Many of the Ukrainian troops are highly competent (they have a serious school of artillery) and it is offensive to hear that they are unable to operate the HIMARS.
     
    The issue is that HIMARS is badly mislabeled. Artillery = tubes & shells. Mortars are a very effective form of short range artillery.

    HIMARS is (at best) "Tomahawk Lite". It is a highly technical long range missile system. In terms of operator complexity, the Russian S400 would be a good parallel. Many months are required. It is doubtful that the Syrians can run their S300 half regiment after 9-12 months of training.

    France's contribution of Ceasar Self Propelled units is a handover over artillery. Fundamentally is is still tube & shell. That is a training cycle in weeks.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @LatW

    , @Yevardian
    @LatW


    In the first video, starting at 18:00, after he is asked about the European unity when it comes to supporting Ukraine, he starts talking about Germany, and says: “Germany’s economy is expected to contract 20-30% as a result of the sanctions that have been imposed and the lack of access to natural gas and oil from Russia.” (Actually, I misquoted him (apologies for that), it turns out he said something even crazier than what I misheard him say.)
     
    Well, admittedly I didn't bother watching the video, it just looks totally non-credible to me that an American general would be far more positive on Russia's war performance than you know, actual Russians or Ukrainians on the side of the SMO like Podolyaka, Strelkov or even Karlin. Did this guy claim the Kiev offensive was a 'feint' as well? "Desert Storm 2.0!"

    Considering the US either commited itself, or sanctioned a third party to blow up the Nordstream pipeline, I don't see why the contraction of the German economy should be of any concern to either Ukrainians or the Americans. I'd consider anybody attempting to argue the Russians blew up their own pipelines in the same ballpark as those arguing Kiev was a feint, too hopelessly partisan in their biases to take seriously.
    The vast majority of military aid to Ukraine has come from the United States at negligible cost to itself, whilst the Europeans get to pay the economic cost.


    Then there is more nonsense about how it might seem for other Europeans that the deindustrialization of Germany might be a “good thing, but it’s not”, which is not how most Europeans think. Which Europeans think this? Certainly not Northern Europeans and not Visegrad, who rely on trade with Germany.
     
    No, but there has already been talk of company or skilled labour relocation to the US.

    Replies: @Matra, @Wokechoke

  65. @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader

    Sarcasm is a good sign, it requires a sense of humor. I hope Germans still have it when the Gulfstream stops.


    There are Somalis in Finland.
     
    FYI, the parts of Finland, Sweden, and Norway where the people (locals and Somalis) live are a lot warmer than North Russia, not to mention Siberia or the Far East. Cold is the main reason why Chinese don’t want Siberia: they prefer to avoid extreme cold and just buy stuff that the Russians and other locals mine and log there.

    BTW, in the North of Russia grocery stores sell drinking-grade pure (96%) ethanol: when it’s -20 or -40oC outside, you don’t even get drunk, your body uses all ethanol to produce heat. When you come from the outside frozen to the bones, a glass (200 ml) of ethanol is the only thing that prevents catching cold.

    Replies: @German_reader, @Beckow, @S, @Mikel, @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    when the Gulfstream stops

    when it’s -20 or -40oC outside, you don’t even get drunk, your body uses all ethanol to produce heat

    There you go again.

    For a scientist, you’re very prone to making outlandish statements.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulf_Stream#Gulf_Stream_Collapse
    https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/497899/

    I’m not a scientist but I’ve been a weather nut all my life and, as a mountaineer, I know quite a few things about combating extreme cold. Unfortunately, alcoholic beverages (let alone 96% ethanol) only make matters worse, regardless of the initial euphoria.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Mikel

    I don’t know about mountaineers, but I know people who live in the Far North, where winter temperatures plunge to -30oC to -40oC. They consider -20oC a warm weather. I’ve got already spoiled by the life in the US, consider anything below -10oC very cold.

    People drink 96% ethanol AFTER being outdoors, when they feel freezing. This may or may not be important: they drink it after returning to the warmth of their home. In this case it does not cause any euphoria at all. They report no feeling of drunkenness, only the feeling of warmth spreading through the body. They do not catch cold, even though they often get chilled. Those who lived through that kind of winter say that they think they won’t survive w/o ethanol.

    BTW, everything you find in wiki is suspect, could be a deliberate or inadvertent lie. The same goes for published papers you find in PubMed (I don’t admit that lightly, as my papers are also in PubMed). As I tell my students, not everything published is true and not everything true is published.

    Replies: @Mikel

  66. @LatW

    Does anyone have the specific time within which video where that came from?
     
    In the first video, starting at 18:00, after he is asked about the European unity when it comes to supporting Ukraine, he starts talking about Germany, and says: "Germany's economy is expected to contract 20-30% as a result of the sanctions that have been imposed and the lack of access to natural gas and oil from Russia." (Actually, I misquoted him (apologies for that), it turns out he said something even crazier than what I misheard him say.)

    Then there is more nonsense about how it might seem for other Europeans that the deindustrialization of Germany might be a "good thing, but it's not", which is not how most Europeans think. Which Europeans think this? Certainly not Northern Europeans and not Visegrad, who rely on trade with Germany.

    When it comes to some of the Ukrainian casualty numbers he's mentioning, first, the casualty numbers will not be given out right now, so I wonder about his sources. Second, his casualty ratios do not match what some of the men on the ground mention occasionally in their interviews on the Ukrainian TV as well as what is occasionally seen on social networks. There are no accurate numbers for this available so it's puzzling how he can mention these with such confidence. So not sure I'd dedicate too much time listening to this guy.

    I also would like to have things clarified about the HIMARS. Many of the Ukrainian troops are highly competent (they have a serious school of artillery) and it is offensive to hear that they are unable to operate the HIMARS.

    Replies: @A123, @Yevardian

    I also would like to have things clarified about the HIMARS. Many of the Ukrainian troops are highly competent (they have a serious school of artillery) and it is offensive to hear that they are unable to operate the HIMARS.

    The issue is that HIMARS is badly mislabeled. Artillery = tubes & shells. Mortars are a very effective form of short range artillery.

    HIMARS is (at best) “Tomahawk Lite”. It is a highly technical long range missile system. In terms of operator complexity, the Russian S400 would be a good parallel. Many months are required. It is doubtful that the Syrians can run their S300 half regiment after 9-12 months of training.

    France’s contribution of Ceasar Self Propelled units is a handover over artillery. Fundamentally is is still tube & shell. That is a training cycle in weeks.

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @LatW
    @A123


    HIMARS is (at best) “Tomahawk Lite”. It is a highly technical long range missile system. In terms of operator complexity, the Russian S400 would be a good parallel. Many months are required. It is doubtful that the Syrians can run their S300 half regiment after 9-12 months of training.
     
    Ok, thanks for those details, but I'm pretty sure the Ukrainians are operating this system themselves. They had already been in training for a while in the summer. No offense to Syrians, but Ukrainians are more technically savvy than Syrians. This isn't going to be advertised much (for obvious reasons), but I did find a couple of videos where one can see Ukrainians operating HIMARS. They are out there by themselves.



    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yV2ZoapcEKk

    Starts at 0:20

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kkLMBSDEYFY

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @A123

  67. @Mikel
    @AnonfromTN


    when the Gulfstream stops
    ...
    when it’s -20 or -40oC outside, you don’t even get drunk, your body uses all ethanol to produce heat
     
    There you go again.

    For a scientist, you're very prone to making outlandish statements.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulf_Stream#Gulf_Stream_Collapse
    https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/497899/

    I'm not a scientist but I've been a weather nut all my life and, as a mountaineer, I know quite a few things about combating extreme cold. Unfortunately, alcoholic beverages (let alone 96% ethanol) only make matters worse, regardless of the initial euphoria.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    I don’t know about mountaineers, but I know people who live in the Far North, where winter temperatures plunge to -30oC to -40oC. They consider -20oC a warm weather. I’ve got already spoiled by the life in the US, consider anything below -10oC very cold.

    People drink 96% ethanol AFTER being outdoors, when they feel freezing. This may or may not be important: they drink it after returning to the warmth of their home. In this case it does not cause any euphoria at all. They report no feeling of drunkenness, only the feeling of warmth spreading through the body. They do not catch cold, even though they often get chilled. Those who lived through that kind of winter say that they think they won’t survive w/o ethanol.

    BTW, everything you find in wiki is suspect, could be a deliberate or inadvertent lie. The same goes for published papers you find in PubMed (I don’t admit that lightly, as my papers are also in PubMed). As I tell my students, not everything published is true and not everything true is published.

    • Disagree: Mikel
    • Replies: @Mikel
    @AnonfromTN


    I know people who live in the Far North, where winter temperatures plunge to -30oC to -40oC
     
    The temperature outside matters very little. What matters is your body temperature and fighting hypothermia is not exactly a secret science. Hospitals around the world (including Russia) have well established protocols and none of them include making patients ingest pure ethanol. Those people you talk about trying to poison themselves after being in the cold must obviously be conscious so they should rather try the old method of a good warm bath instead.

    On the other hand, if you really need some sort of high after exposure to the elements what I would recommend is a CBD bath bomb, available on the internet. It's becoming increasingly popular among outdoor sports people. Makes you sweat, relax and calm any pains.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @Emil Nikola Richard, @AnonfromTN

  68. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @songbird

    According to the literature there's a million gay male sodomy clubs.

    Every city has one posh and a small handful (<<10) of lesbian bars.

    Lesbians and gays socialize if and only if they have butt loads of money strictly for networking purposes--lesbians do not like men, not even gay men. The only females who like gay men are spinsters and dowagers and spinsters-to-be.

    I have never read about a QWERTY bar. Maybe that's why they are all so pissed off all the time.

    Replies: @Mikel

    The only females who like gay men are spinsters and dowagers and spinsters-to-be.

    Totally wrong in my experience. I’ve met lots of women in different parts of the world who liked gay men in their own way. As one of them once told me ‘they talk to you about clothes and kiss you in the lips, what’s not to like?’ My wife also finds effeminate gays funny and relatable, inoffensive men that behave like women and have female interests like her own.

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Mikel


    As one of them once told me ‘they talk to you about clothes and kiss you in the lips, what’s not to like?’

     

    I could make a very long list. But this would take time AND probably nobody would be interested in reading it. The closet is not going away any time soon. All sodomites in the NFL, NBA, and MLB are securely barricaded in there for the foreseeable future.

    Are there any uncloseted male soccer pros? There are closeted figure skaters for crying out loud.

    By the way there is a missing "working-class" in my first comment up there that I failed to proof read and find.

    Replies: @silviosilver

  69. @LatW

    Does anyone have the specific time within which video where that came from?
     
    In the first video, starting at 18:00, after he is asked about the European unity when it comes to supporting Ukraine, he starts talking about Germany, and says: "Germany's economy is expected to contract 20-30% as a result of the sanctions that have been imposed and the lack of access to natural gas and oil from Russia." (Actually, I misquoted him (apologies for that), it turns out he said something even crazier than what I misheard him say.)

    Then there is more nonsense about how it might seem for other Europeans that the deindustrialization of Germany might be a "good thing, but it's not", which is not how most Europeans think. Which Europeans think this? Certainly not Northern Europeans and not Visegrad, who rely on trade with Germany.

    When it comes to some of the Ukrainian casualty numbers he's mentioning, first, the casualty numbers will not be given out right now, so I wonder about his sources. Second, his casualty ratios do not match what some of the men on the ground mention occasionally in their interviews on the Ukrainian TV as well as what is occasionally seen on social networks. There are no accurate numbers for this available so it's puzzling how he can mention these with such confidence. So not sure I'd dedicate too much time listening to this guy.

    I also would like to have things clarified about the HIMARS. Many of the Ukrainian troops are highly competent (they have a serious school of artillery) and it is offensive to hear that they are unable to operate the HIMARS.

    Replies: @A123, @Yevardian

    In the first video, starting at 18:00, after he is asked about the European unity when it comes to supporting Ukraine, he starts talking about Germany, and says: “Germany’s economy is expected to contract 20-30% as a result of the sanctions that have been imposed and the lack of access to natural gas and oil from Russia.” (Actually, I misquoted him (apologies for that), it turns out he said something even crazier than what I misheard him say.)

    Well, admittedly I didn’t bother watching the video, it just looks totally non-credible to me that an American general would be far more positive on Russia’s war performance than you know, actual Russians or Ukrainians on the side of the SMO like Podolyaka, Strelkov or even Karlin. Did this guy claim the Kiev offensive was a ‘feint’ as well? “Desert Storm 2.0!”

    Considering the US either commited itself, or sanctioned a third party to blow up the Nordstream pipeline, I don’t see why the contraction of the German economy should be of any concern to either Ukrainians or the Americans. I’d consider anybody attempting to argue the Russians blew up their own pipelines in the same ballpark as those arguing Kiev was a feint, too hopelessly partisan in their biases to take seriously.
    The vast majority of military aid to Ukraine has come from the United States at negligible cost to itself, whilst the Europeans get to pay the economic cost.

    Then there is more nonsense about how it might seem for other Europeans that the deindustrialization of Germany might be a “good thing, but it’s not”, which is not how most Europeans think. Which Europeans think this? Certainly not Northern Europeans and not Visegrad, who rely on trade with Germany.

    No, but there has already been talk of company or skilled labour relocation to the US.

    • Replies: @Matra
    @Yevardian


    Did this guy claim the Kiev offensive was a ‘feint’ as well? “Desert Storm 2.0!”
     
    I remember McGregor saying back around April that the Kiev operation was to tie down Ukrainian troops near the capital so they wouldn't be available in the Donbass and that it may also have a reconnaissance mission to see how far they could get. Before then, maybe two or three weeks into the war, he said the war is all but over as the Ukrainian forces had been mostly obliterated, or words to that effect. Those who support the Russian narrative quote him as often as pro-Ukrainians quote Ben Hodges and Peter Zeihan, and like them he's way too confident in his assertions and predictions.
    , @Wokechoke
    @Yevardian

    The thing is, all military operations do contain feints of one sort or another. There's always some bluff.

    The issue on Kiev was that there was an attempted Coup de Main on the Kiev Regime, which failed followed by that weird column of 40 miles with trucks that simply vanished. That was certainly some kind of distraction.

    What does it matter now that Russia mobilized?

    Replies: @LondonBob

  70. @Mikel
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    The only females who like gay men are spinsters and dowagers and spinsters-to-be.
     
    Totally wrong in my experience. I've met lots of women in different parts of the world who liked gay men in their own way. As one of them once told me 'they talk to you about clothes and kiss you in the lips, what's not to like?' My wife also finds effeminate gays funny and relatable, inoffensive men that behave like women and have female interests like her own.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    As one of them once told me ‘they talk to you about clothes and kiss you in the lips, what’s not to like?’

    I could make a very long list. But this would take time AND probably nobody would be interested in reading it. The closet is not going away any time soon. All sodomites in the NFL, NBA, and MLB are securely barricaded in there for the foreseeable future.

    Are there any uncloseted male soccer pros? There are closeted figure skaters for crying out loud.

    By the way there is a missing “working-class” in my first comment up there that I failed to proof read and find.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    Dude, you must surely hold the record on this site for totally missing the point, the amount of bizarre non sequiturs you post.

    Anyone who has been out and about at any point over the last, oh, fifty years knows it's as obvious as the sun that plenty of women besides spinsters and "dowagers" enjoy the company of fags. I don't know what in the world would possess someone to pretend otherwise.


    By the way there is a missing “working-class” in my first comment up there that I failed to proof read and find.
     
    So why not go ahead and insert it now? (I'm supremely doubtful it'll save your "argument," but let's see.)
  71. @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader

    Sarcasm is a good sign, it requires a sense of humor. I hope Germans still have it when the Gulfstream stops.


    There are Somalis in Finland.
     
    FYI, the parts of Finland, Sweden, and Norway where the people (locals and Somalis) live are a lot warmer than North Russia, not to mention Siberia or the Far East. Cold is the main reason why Chinese don’t want Siberia: they prefer to avoid extreme cold and just buy stuff that the Russians and other locals mine and log there.

    BTW, in the North of Russia grocery stores sell drinking-grade pure (96%) ethanol: when it’s -20 or -40oC outside, you don’t even get drunk, your body uses all ethanol to produce heat. When you come from the outside frozen to the bones, a glass (200 ml) of ethanol is the only thing that prevents catching cold.

    Replies: @German_reader, @Beckow, @S, @Mikel, @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    That’s not the main reason, vast swath of northern China is about the same climate
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Köppen_climate_classification

    The main reason is the three Manchurian provinces, Heilongjiang, Jilin, Liaoning are all relatively underdeveloped. They can’t really absorb further territory,
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Chinese_administrative_divisions_by_GDP_per_capita

    Some PRC nationalists keep a long list of Qing territories annexed by Russia/Soviets, but that’s neither here nor there, those “Chinese” territory belonged to the Manchu-Mongol elites not Han,
    https://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/沙俄和苏联割占中国领土列表

    Awesome travelogue by the way.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    You may be right. In my experience (two faculty, four post-docs, two graduate students, and one undergrad; hardly a representative sample), the majority of Han Chinese lives in warmer climates. They consider Inner Mongolia and Manchuria very cold.

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

  72. @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @AnonfromTN

    That's not the main reason, vast swath of northern China is about the same climate

    https://i.postimg.cc/vZn5jSDK/Ko-ppen-Geiger-Climate-Classification-Map-1.png
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Köppen_climate_classification

    The main reason is the three Manchurian provinces, Heilongjiang, Jilin, Liaoning are all relatively underdeveloped. They can't really absorb further territory,

    https://i.postimg.cc/0NDRzxjC/Gdp-per-capita-of-the-administrative-division-in-China.png
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Chinese_administrative_divisions_by_GDP_per_capita

    Some PRC nationalists keep a long list of Qing territories annexed by Russia/Soviets, but that's neither here nor there, those "Chinese" territory belonged to the Manchu-Mongol elites not Han,
    https://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/沙俄和苏联割占中国领土列表

    Awesome travelogue by the way.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    You may be right. In my experience (two faculty, four post-docs, two graduate students, and one undergrad; hardly a representative sample), the majority of Han Chinese lives in warmer climates. They consider Inner Mongolia and Manchuria very cold.

    • Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @AnonfromTN

    There's a selection bias, most STEM Chinese in US are from the coastal south, 江南 Jiangnan, which entered into Chinese history later.

    Unfortunately, the Cradle of Chinese Civilization, 中原 Zhongyuan, in modern times, is about as underdeveloped as the Cradle of Western Civilization, Greece.

    https://i.postimg.cc/FHpvYHqV/Zhongyuan-map.png
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zhongyuan

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  73. @Yevardian
    @LatW


    In the first video, starting at 18:00, after he is asked about the European unity when it comes to supporting Ukraine, he starts talking about Germany, and says: “Germany’s economy is expected to contract 20-30% as a result of the sanctions that have been imposed and the lack of access to natural gas and oil from Russia.” (Actually, I misquoted him (apologies for that), it turns out he said something even crazier than what I misheard him say.)
     
    Well, admittedly I didn't bother watching the video, it just looks totally non-credible to me that an American general would be far more positive on Russia's war performance than you know, actual Russians or Ukrainians on the side of the SMO like Podolyaka, Strelkov or even Karlin. Did this guy claim the Kiev offensive was a 'feint' as well? "Desert Storm 2.0!"

    Considering the US either commited itself, or sanctioned a third party to blow up the Nordstream pipeline, I don't see why the contraction of the German economy should be of any concern to either Ukrainians or the Americans. I'd consider anybody attempting to argue the Russians blew up their own pipelines in the same ballpark as those arguing Kiev was a feint, too hopelessly partisan in their biases to take seriously.
    The vast majority of military aid to Ukraine has come from the United States at negligible cost to itself, whilst the Europeans get to pay the economic cost.


    Then there is more nonsense about how it might seem for other Europeans that the deindustrialization of Germany might be a “good thing, but it’s not”, which is not how most Europeans think. Which Europeans think this? Certainly not Northern Europeans and not Visegrad, who rely on trade with Germany.
     
    No, but there has already been talk of company or skilled labour relocation to the US.

    Replies: @Matra, @Wokechoke

    Did this guy claim the Kiev offensive was a ‘feint’ as well? “Desert Storm 2.0!”

    I remember McGregor saying back around April that the Kiev operation was to tie down Ukrainian troops near the capital so they wouldn’t be available in the Donbass and that it may also have a reconnaissance mission to see how far they could get. Before then, maybe two or three weeks into the war, he said the war is all but over as the Ukrainian forces had been mostly obliterated, or words to that effect. Those who support the Russian narrative quote him as often as pro-Ukrainians quote Ben Hodges and Peter Zeihan, and like them he’s way too confident in his assertions and predictions.

  74. @German_reader
    @Beckow


    The German_reader is fooling himself
     
    It was meant as a joke, to mock AnonfromTN's Soviet boomer-like belief that it's somehow a big success for Russia if resentful Africans make pro-Russian noises. And while my immigration scenario may seem far-fetched now, I don't think it's completely impossible that Russia will feel herself forced to accept increasing numbers of African "students" and the like in an attempt to court influence with their countries (also send money down the African drain, like in the 1970s/1980s).
    There'll be two billion Africans in 30 years, more than enough to flood both Western Europe and Russia.

    Replies: @Beckow, @Matra

    It was meant as a joke, to mock AnonfromTN’s Soviet boomer-like belief that it’s somehow a big success for Russia if resentful Africans make pro-Russian noises

    In the last two months I’ve noticed lots of young pro-Russians (mostly Russian, Serbian, and few outspoken Slovaks) engaging in all-out boomer-bashing of the kind we normally see in the Anglo Dissident Rightosphere. Unlike pro-Russia Anglos who think the war’s going great (!) these Slavs are frustrated and bitter towards Putin and the people around him not just for the way the war has gone but for the Kremlin’s PR which they think is stuck in Soviet times. We seem to have a worldwide boomer problem.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Matra

    Where have you noticed this, on twitter?

    As for AK, he's not dooming that badly yet. He's still assigning a greater than 50% subjective probability to a positive outcome.

    Anyone watching the World Cup? Useless Argies, going down to a pack of sandnigs (Yahya beaming). Disgraceful. O tempora o mores.

    Replies: @Yahya, @Matra, @LondonBob

  75. Did the Taiwanese president really tweet to mourn Biden’s dog?

  76. @Yevardian
    @LatW


    In the first video, starting at 18:00, after he is asked about the European unity when it comes to supporting Ukraine, he starts talking about Germany, and says: “Germany’s economy is expected to contract 20-30% as a result of the sanctions that have been imposed and the lack of access to natural gas and oil from Russia.” (Actually, I misquoted him (apologies for that), it turns out he said something even crazier than what I misheard him say.)
     
    Well, admittedly I didn't bother watching the video, it just looks totally non-credible to me that an American general would be far more positive on Russia's war performance than you know, actual Russians or Ukrainians on the side of the SMO like Podolyaka, Strelkov or even Karlin. Did this guy claim the Kiev offensive was a 'feint' as well? "Desert Storm 2.0!"

    Considering the US either commited itself, or sanctioned a third party to blow up the Nordstream pipeline, I don't see why the contraction of the German economy should be of any concern to either Ukrainians or the Americans. I'd consider anybody attempting to argue the Russians blew up their own pipelines in the same ballpark as those arguing Kiev was a feint, too hopelessly partisan in their biases to take seriously.
    The vast majority of military aid to Ukraine has come from the United States at negligible cost to itself, whilst the Europeans get to pay the economic cost.


    Then there is more nonsense about how it might seem for other Europeans that the deindustrialization of Germany might be a “good thing, but it’s not”, which is not how most Europeans think. Which Europeans think this? Certainly not Northern Europeans and not Visegrad, who rely on trade with Germany.
     
    No, but there has already been talk of company or skilled labour relocation to the US.

    Replies: @Matra, @Wokechoke

    The thing is, all military operations do contain feints of one sort or another. There’s always some bluff.

    The issue on Kiev was that there was an attempted Coup de Main on the Kiev Regime, which failed followed by that weird column of 40 miles with trucks that simply vanished. That was certainly some kind of distraction.

    What does it matter now that Russia mobilized?

    • LOL: Mr. Hack
    • Replies: @LondonBob
    @Wokechoke

    That forty mile truck convoy is one of the classic distractions of all time, can't believe how much that hypnotised the media, and NATO, as the Russian's secured the Crimea land bridge and surrounded Mariupol.

    Replies: @showmethereal

  77. @AnonfromTN
    @Mikel

    I don’t know about mountaineers, but I know people who live in the Far North, where winter temperatures plunge to -30oC to -40oC. They consider -20oC a warm weather. I’ve got already spoiled by the life in the US, consider anything below -10oC very cold.

    People drink 96% ethanol AFTER being outdoors, when they feel freezing. This may or may not be important: they drink it after returning to the warmth of their home. In this case it does not cause any euphoria at all. They report no feeling of drunkenness, only the feeling of warmth spreading through the body. They do not catch cold, even though they often get chilled. Those who lived through that kind of winter say that they think they won’t survive w/o ethanol.

    BTW, everything you find in wiki is suspect, could be a deliberate or inadvertent lie. The same goes for published papers you find in PubMed (I don’t admit that lightly, as my papers are also in PubMed). As I tell my students, not everything published is true and not everything true is published.

    Replies: @Mikel

    I know people who live in the Far North, where winter temperatures plunge to -30oC to -40oC

    The temperature outside matters very little. What matters is your body temperature and fighting hypothermia is not exactly a secret science. Hospitals around the world (including Russia) have well established protocols and none of them include making patients ingest pure ethanol. Those people you talk about trying to poison themselves after being in the cold must obviously be conscious so they should rather try the old method of a good warm bath instead.

    On the other hand, if you really need some sort of high after exposure to the elements what I would recommend is a CBD bath bomb, available on the internet. It’s becoming increasingly popular among outdoor sports people. Makes you sweat, relax and calm any pains.

    • Agree: Mr. Hack
    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @Mikel

    Years of alcohol abuse seem to have critically damaged the good Professor's ameliorative powers:

    https://youtu.be/B-EmeQg40wE

    Effects of alcohol and ethanol on the brain. :-)

    , @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Mikel


    On the other hand, if you really need some sort of high after exposure to the elements what I would recommend is a CBD bath bomb, available on the internet. It’s becoming increasingly popular among outdoor sports people. Makes you sweat, relax and calm any pains.
     
    Now this is why the comments section is the best part of the internet.

    I have a friend with 3 cats and 2 dogs and their hack for chills is sleeping with the animals on the bed. Yikes. Dogs are great but they eat shit.

    Replies: @Barbarossa, @dogbumbreath

    , @AnonfromTN
    @Mikel

    I described what people used since times immemorial, ages before Internet. They don’t look for highs, they only want to get warm and experience no adverse consequences of exposure to the cold. If you don’t believe it, talk to someone who lived in the Far North (as a resident, not as a tourist).

  78. @A123
    @LatW


    I also would like to have things clarified about the HIMARS. Many of the Ukrainian troops are highly competent (they have a serious school of artillery) and it is offensive to hear that they are unable to operate the HIMARS.
     
    The issue is that HIMARS is badly mislabeled. Artillery = tubes & shells. Mortars are a very effective form of short range artillery.

    HIMARS is (at best) "Tomahawk Lite". It is a highly technical long range missile system. In terms of operator complexity, the Russian S400 would be a good parallel. Many months are required. It is doubtful that the Syrians can run their S300 half regiment after 9-12 months of training.

    France's contribution of Ceasar Self Propelled units is a handover over artillery. Fundamentally is is still tube & shell. That is a training cycle in weeks.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @LatW

    HIMARS is (at best) “Tomahawk Lite”. It is a highly technical long range missile system. In terms of operator complexity, the Russian S400 would be a good parallel. Many months are required. It is doubtful that the Syrians can run their S300 half regiment after 9-12 months of training.

    Ok, thanks for those details, but I’m pretty sure the Ukrainians are operating this system themselves. They had already been in training for a while in the summer. No offense to Syrians, but Ukrainians are more technically savvy than Syrians. This isn’t going to be advertised much (for obvious reasons), but I did find a couple of videos where one can see Ukrainians operating HIMARS. They are out there by themselves.

    [MORE]

    Starts at 0:20

    • Thanks: Mr. Hack
    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @LatW

    Don't worry too much about kremlintoogeA123's most recent military information. He's been unable to see the forest for the trees for a long time now. He's too busy building bridges between the MAGA movement and the kremlin to see things straight anymore!

    https://s3-eu-central-1.amazonaws.com/cartoons-s3/styles/product_detail_image/s3/Crimean%20bridge%20mov%20.jpg?itok=TNpm8NWn

    , @A123
    @LatW


    Ok, thanks for those details, but I’m pretty sure the Ukrainians are operating this system themselves. They had already been in training for a while in the summer
     
    No doubt that Ukrainians are maintaining the vehicle, loading missile boxes, etc. These are not trivial jobs. If the solid fuel starts and the missile does not depart the launcher... Very bad.

    The question I was getting at is, "Who is setting up the actual missile flight/target plan?"

    This does not even have to be done on site. The mission planning is likely created elsewhere and then sent electronically to the launcher.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @LatW

  79. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Mikel


    As one of them once told me ‘they talk to you about clothes and kiss you in the lips, what’s not to like?’

     

    I could make a very long list. But this would take time AND probably nobody would be interested in reading it. The closet is not going away any time soon. All sodomites in the NFL, NBA, and MLB are securely barricaded in there for the foreseeable future.

    Are there any uncloseted male soccer pros? There are closeted figure skaters for crying out loud.

    By the way there is a missing "working-class" in my first comment up there that I failed to proof read and find.

    Replies: @silviosilver

    Dude, you must surely hold the record on this site for totally missing the point, the amount of bizarre non sequiturs you post.

    Anyone who has been out and about at any point over the last, oh, fifty years knows it’s as obvious as the sun that plenty of women besides spinsters and “dowagers” enjoy the company of fags. I don’t know what in the world would possess someone to pretend otherwise.

    By the way there is a missing “working-class” in my first comment up there that I failed to proof read and find.

    So why not go ahead and insert it now? (I’m supremely doubtful it’ll save your “argument,” but let’s see.)

    • Agree: Barbarossa
  80. @Matra
    @German_reader


    It was meant as a joke, to mock AnonfromTN’s Soviet boomer-like belief that it’s somehow a big success for Russia if resentful Africans make pro-Russian noises
     
    In the last two months I've noticed lots of young pro-Russians (mostly Russian, Serbian, and few outspoken Slovaks) engaging in all-out boomer-bashing of the kind we normally see in the Anglo Dissident Rightosphere. Unlike pro-Russia Anglos who think the war's going great (!) these Slavs are frustrated and bitter towards Putin and the people around him not just for the way the war has gone but for the Kremlin's PR which they think is stuck in Soviet times. We seem to have a worldwide boomer problem.

    Replies: @silviosilver

    Where have you noticed this, on twitter?

    As for AK, he’s not dooming that badly yet. He’s still assigning a greater than 50% subjective probability to a positive outcome.

    Anyone watching the World Cup? Useless Argies, going down to a pack of sandnigs (Yahya beaming). Disgraceful. O tempora o mores.

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @silviosilver


    Useless Argies, going down to a pack of sandnigs (Yahya beaming).
     
    Yahya is not beaming. He could care less about his people kicking a ball around better than some other people. That stopped at about the time he started reading books at age 17-18.

    Yahya would prefer if Arabians spent more time on worthier cultural activities such as music, cinema, and literature; such that they produce their own version of Jorge Luis Borges or Astor Piazolla. As it stands Arabians have no significant cultural achievements of their own, outside Islam, if that even counts as an achievement. All this oil money gone to waste; Allah should have given it to Maghrebis, Egyptians or Levantines.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @silviosilver, @showmethereal, @KidDynamite

    , @Matra
    @silviosilver

    Mostly Twitter, but also a couple of forums. Not this one though as it has thinned out since AK left. Maybe if Russia were performing better the Russians and few Serbs who used to comment here would come back to brag.

    The supposedly temporary Covid rule at last year's European championships allowing more substitutes has been made permanent. Allowing five subs represents the kind of Americanisation that Steve Sailer has long advocated. How can it be a team effort if half the players that finish didn't start the match? It also fundamentally changes the game. The England v Iran match yesterday had 14 minutes of time added at the end of the first half. There were 8 minutes added to the end of another match. Trying to get a more exact 'time clock' may also indicate creeping Americanisation. Maybe those drink breaks they had during hot days will turn into time-outs in the future.

    , @LondonBob
    @silviosilver

    Argentina have been rubbish for years now, wasn't aware Di Maria was still playing.

    Replies: @showmethereal

  81. @Coconuts
    @German_reader


    There seems to be quite a lot of criticism from human rights types though, this weaponizing of white man’s guilt narratives in service of a rather reactionary (and homophobic!) regime is too blatantly cynical.
     
    I think these terms like white supremacy, white guilt, colonialism etc. for the most part come out of the post-modern, post-colonial far left, which is a mash up of ethnic particularism and liberationism from the European radical tradition, it means that mostly they can't be used effectively against progressives.

    It does sort of highlight how much this sort of thought is in appearance heavily indebted to white European males. One way I have seen blacks address this point is by claiming that due to their oppression blacks understood the relevant content of Marx, Hegel, Herder, Rousseau etc. before these authors wrote their works, or arrived at it independently of them.

    Replies: @showmethereal

    Cecil Rhodes didn’t think all white men were created equal. Yeah the same guy Rhodesia and Rhodes scholarships were named after. He firmly stated and believed Anglo Saxons were above all other white men. Northern Europeans looked down on Southern. Western Europeans looked down on Eastern. So when did all this white solidarity happen???

    • Replies: @Coconuts
    @showmethereal


    So when did all this white solidarity happen???
     
    Afaik it comes from the US mainly where there was a legal category of 'white' which came to include all Europeans (and some latinos, people from the Middle East etc.)

    Progressives have done a lot to propagate it and spread it outside the US. Speaking of Rhodes, there might have been something similar in South Africa.

    Replies: @songbird

  82. @LatW
    @A123


    HIMARS is (at best) “Tomahawk Lite”. It is a highly technical long range missile system. In terms of operator complexity, the Russian S400 would be a good parallel. Many months are required. It is doubtful that the Syrians can run their S300 half regiment after 9-12 months of training.
     
    Ok, thanks for those details, but I'm pretty sure the Ukrainians are operating this system themselves. They had already been in training for a while in the summer. No offense to Syrians, but Ukrainians are more technically savvy than Syrians. This isn't going to be advertised much (for obvious reasons), but I did find a couple of videos where one can see Ukrainians operating HIMARS. They are out there by themselves.



    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yV2ZoapcEKk

    Starts at 0:20

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kkLMBSDEYFY

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @A123

    Don’t worry too much about kremlintoogeA123’s most recent military information. He’s been unable to see the forest for the trees for a long time now. He’s too busy building bridges between the MAGA movement and the kremlin to see things straight anymore!

  83. @A123
    @Beckow


    the fundamental problem for the aspiring global rulers in Washington-London.
     
    Not-The-President Biden? BoJo/Truss/Sunak/Who's Next? Rulers? Surely you jest.

    The aspiring global rulers seeking a European SJW Empire are Scholz and Macron (Paris-Berlin). However, their dominance over other European countries is slipping badly.

    • Italy is openly defying French liberal authoritarianism. (1)
    • Poland is also challenging the European SJW Empire. (2)

    Meet Europe’s coming military superpower: Poland

    Warsaw is turning to major arms deals with South Korea to establish supremacy in Continental Europe.

    “The Polish army must be so powerful that it does not have to fight due to its strength alone,” Prime Minister Mateusz Morawiecki said on the eve of Poland’s independence day.

    It’s a shift that has resonated with Poland’s indispensable ally.

    “Poland has become our most important partner in continental Europe,” a senior U.S. Army official in Europe said, citing the crucial role Poland has played in supporting Ukraine and in shoring up NATO defenses in the Baltics.
    ...
    Poland signed a 23 billion złoty (€4.9 billion) deal for 250 Abrams tanks from the U.S. this spring — a quick replacement for the 240 Soviet-era tanks sent to Ukraine. Its air force is equipped with U.S. F-16s and in 2020 Warsaw signed a $4.6 billion deal for 32 F-35 fighters. But the focus of its recent military spend has been Korea, where it has signed a flurry of deals to buy tanks, aircraft and other arms.

    So far, Poland has ordered between $10 billion-$12 billion worth of weaponry from Korea, said Mariusz Cielma, editor and analyst at Nowa Technika Wojskowa, a military technology news and analysis website.
     
    Scholz and Macron personally own the mess in Ukraine, as well as other EU fiascos. Does humiliating those two make Putin head of a "Super Power"? That seems like a bit of an overstatement.

    Really though, the label does not matter much. What does are facts on the ground. Russia has gained vast swaths of territory. Kiev has no viable plan to assault Mariupol. Capturing Crimea is even more implausible.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-202/#comment-5669011

    (2) https://www.politico.eu/article/europe-military-superpower-poland-army/

    Replies: @showmethereal

    Even more ironic is the items Poland is buying from South Korea is because those systems are better and cheaper than the comparable US equipment. People don’t even see the reality of the global shift. Yes South Korea is a U.S. ally – but it’s not the US. 30 years ago Poland wouldn’t have been buying from South Korea. Meanwhile their brothers across the border – North Koreans – just openly displayed missiles that can now hit every part of the U.S. Only a handful of nations had such missiles of such range. Its a changed world.

    • Replies: @A123
    @showmethereal


    Even more ironic is the items Poland is buying from South Korea is because those systems are better and cheaper than the comparable US equipment. People don’t even see the reality of the global shift
     
    Certainly the U.S. MIC produces overpriced goods based on what they can extract from the Pentagon. Cheaper SK gear is certainly reasonable. That being said they are also buying systems from the U.S. in addition to SK.

    The suppliers intentionally omitted are France and Germany. The Poles believe that supply lines via SJW European countries are a liability. While they have similar concerns about Not-The-President Biden, the Poles are hoping for more MAGA victories.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @showmethereal

  84. @Mikel
    @AnonfromTN


    I know people who live in the Far North, where winter temperatures plunge to -30oC to -40oC
     
    The temperature outside matters very little. What matters is your body temperature and fighting hypothermia is not exactly a secret science. Hospitals around the world (including Russia) have well established protocols and none of them include making patients ingest pure ethanol. Those people you talk about trying to poison themselves after being in the cold must obviously be conscious so they should rather try the old method of a good warm bath instead.

    On the other hand, if you really need some sort of high after exposure to the elements what I would recommend is a CBD bath bomb, available on the internet. It's becoming increasingly popular among outdoor sports people. Makes you sweat, relax and calm any pains.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @Emil Nikola Richard, @AnonfromTN

    Years of alcohol abuse seem to have critically damaged the good Professor’s ameliorative powers:

    Effects of alcohol and ethanol on the brain. 🙂

  85. @German_reader
    @AnonfromTN


    Russia is now capitalizing on positive perception the USSR gained in Africa. Only because of that it is successfully squeezing France out of Africa: Central African Republic, then Mali, now Burkina Faso.
     
    Ok. Let's hope Africans from those countries will immigrate to Russia then instead of France.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @showmethereal

    Well here is the problem with your thinking. With Russia and China actually helping those countries to develop they have less need to migrate. The most African students in the world study in China – not the west. But the overwhelming majority go back to their home nations. Again like the previous writer noted “different types of superpowers”.

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @showmethereal

    Each instance of a super-power is different, but the migration urge is always the same. The Third Worlders migrating to Europe-US, or possibly Russia (I doubt it), are not settlers. They are seeking the easiest way to live better - an instinct based on self-interest, laziness and a calculation that moving to where the stuff is beats trying to create it at home.

    No amount of development will stop it and more integration only speeds it up. It mainly affects young males and usually the ones with some resources - the pathetic equivalent of middle and lower middle classes in the Third World. The only way to stop it is to simply stop it - no rules, no excuses, no back doors, no discussion. Or it will overwhelm what is left of the West. A simple choice that the people are unwilling to make, or often even see. There is really nothing scarier for what's left of our culture than the 'African students', whatever that term encompasses.

    Replies: @showmethereal

    , @Coconuts
    @showmethereal


    With Russia and China actually helping those countries to develop they have less need to migrate.
     
    There may be a kind of pattern developing related to political regime, so a hypothesis can be formed.

    Russia is a presidential republic with a managed democracy, China is a one-party organic democracy.
    Western countries are liberal parliamentary democracies. Liberal parliamentary regimes are probably most likely to invite permanent immigration from overseas and least able to prevent it happening, by their nature.

    The longer and stronger the liberal parliamentary tradition is, the more immigration and the more diverse it should be.

    Replies: @showmethereal

  86. @silviosilver
    @Matra

    Where have you noticed this, on twitter?

    As for AK, he's not dooming that badly yet. He's still assigning a greater than 50% subjective probability to a positive outcome.

    Anyone watching the World Cup? Useless Argies, going down to a pack of sandnigs (Yahya beaming). Disgraceful. O tempora o mores.

    Replies: @Yahya, @Matra, @LondonBob

    Useless Argies, going down to a pack of sandnigs (Yahya beaming).

    Yahya is not beaming. He could care less about his people kicking a ball around better than some other people. That stopped at about the time he started reading books at age 17-18.

    Yahya would prefer if Arabians spent more time on worthier cultural activities such as music, cinema, and literature; such that they produce their own version of Jorge Luis Borges or Astor Piazolla. As it stands Arabians have no significant cultural achievements of their own, outside Islam, if that even counts as an achievement. All this oil money gone to waste; Allah should have given it to Maghrebis, Egyptians or Levantines.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Yahya


    That stopped at about the time he started reading books at age 17-18.
     
    You really weren't much of a reader before that?

    I used to be a huge soccer fan, but I find it intolerably boring nowadays. I'll probably watch a game or two, or maybe just the last 20 minutes of a couple. The results don't really interest me either, but I would definitely consider it a massive disappointment if an African team won it (well, that's already happened, in a sense, but I mean a 100% Afro team from an African country).

    Sport is more than mere frivolity though. Sport is a mark of civilization - of the kind of civilization I prefer, anyway. It teaches participants the value of a long-term outlook and helps ingrain habits of preparation, training, coping with and overcoming adversity, self-improvement, ultimately enabling them to enjoy the fruits of their efforts. I would rather have youth devoting its time to mastering the art of "kicking a ball around" than loitering on street corners, harassing civilians, consuming drugs and porn, worshiping trashy celebrities and wasting their lives in a myriad other short-term pursuits. They can't all be scholars and artists, after all.

    Replies: @Yahya, @showmethereal, @Barbarossa

    , @silviosilver
    @Yahya


    such that they produce their own version of Jorge Luis Borges or Astor Piazolla.
     
    Are you actually a tango fan? I got into it for a while. Of the 'big names', I think preferred that Carlos Gardel dude's songs to Piazzolla's. Much of a muchness though. Nowadays, it's like Arab music to me: I think it's good, but I can only take so much before it starts sounding samey and wears me out. (I can take tango for a lot longer than Arab music though.) The dance itself is sexy as hell. It's hard to believe they generate those moves spontaneously, I'm half convinced the stuff I see in videos is all choreographed.

    Have you seen the 1998 movie Tango by Carlos Saura? I would be interested to hear your thoughts, if you have. I greatly enjoyed it, even though I have a hard time saying why exactly. It could just be that Argentina has always been my favorite Latin American country. Not for reasons that you might think ("it's so European"), but because that's where most of my extended family lives. I have never met them or even seen photographs, but relying on my mother's memory (and her sister's, before she died), I have been able to construct something of a family tree. There are a lot of them there and I have thought about contacting some "immigrant heritage" organization in Argentina to see if I can't establish contact.

    One thing I always envied (to a degree, still do) about my Arab friends was the strength of their extended family ties. That is far from unknown among balkanoids, of course, but in my own family we have tended to be distant from each other. I have first cousins who grew up in Detroit while I was growing up in Australia, and we'd heard about each other and spoken on the phone, but when I arrived in America, we had one meeting (one!) and that was that. Partly my fault for never following up, but when a guest arrives from overseas, if the host shows lackluster enthusiasm (almost frosty, actually), I think they deserve the lion's share of the blame. My cousins in Australia have mostly married into Anglo (or Irish, whatever) families, which I experienced as a massive loss and, frankly, viewed them as 'traitors', in the sense that it totally killed the vibe of family get-togethers I was used to as a kid, to the point that today we take no interest in each other's lives at all, and years go by between seeing each other (the "weddings and funerals" pattern). I have no qualms at all saying I wish they had married Arabs instead. (So, yeah, I may be a 'racist,' but not the kind or to the degree you think.)

    Replies: @Yahya

    , @showmethereal
    @Yahya

    Actually you have to have fairly high intelligence to be good at football. In a fluid game with constant changes - it requires not just intelligence - but also patience and concentration. Our athleticism does not win a football match. Beating Argentina is actually a huge accomplishment

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Yahya

    , @KidDynamite
    @Yahya

    Islam is the greatest achievement of the Arabs and is no joke - despite its detractors, it may well go down as the religion with the widest and most universal appeal. And that is no small feat, only Christianity even holds a candle in that respect.

    I don’t know much about soccer, but Arabs (as well as other people) should always keep athletically fit, especially in terms of martial fitness. Anything in the culture that encourages this is generally a good thing. Otherwise you build up a bookish nerd civilization that gets its ass rolled over by people like the Mongols who laugh as they burn down your libraries.

  87. @showmethereal
    @Coconuts

    Cecil Rhodes didn’t think all white men were created equal. Yeah the same guy Rhodesia and Rhodes scholarships were named after. He firmly stated and believed Anglo Saxons were above all other white men. Northern Europeans looked down on Southern. Western Europeans looked down on Eastern. So when did all this white solidarity happen???

    Replies: @Coconuts

    So when did all this white solidarity happen???

    Afaik it comes from the US mainly where there was a legal category of ‘white’ which came to include all Europeans (and some latinos, people from the Middle East etc.)

    Progressives have done a lot to propagate it and spread it outside the US. Speaking of Rhodes, there might have been something similar in South Africa.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Coconuts


    Afaik it comes from the US mainly where there was a legal category of ‘white’ which came to include all Europeans (and some latinos, people from the Middle East etc.)
     
    Don't know if it is really correct, but I heard that the term "white" was basically a technology invented in order to organize and take on the Injun. If so, I think it could probably be considered to be dangerously obsolete.

    This is one reason that I am a critic of the term and believe "Euro" or "European" is far superior.

    Indians had:
    1.) small numbers (and no ability to draw on huge reserves)
    2.) high disease susceptibility
    3.) no potential for crypsis
    4.) not very high verbal IQ
    5.) the horse as their greatest mode of mobility and communication
    6.) not much possibility of forming alliances with other non-white ethnic groups.
    7.) tribal organization only, no nation-states promoting their genetic interests.
    8) many were essentially hunter gatherers, only sowing snatch crops. Not urban dwellers. Cities probably were kind of deadly to them.

    Am sure one could come up with additional points, but, in short, with all due respect to Injuns, they were greatly outmatched.
  88. @German_reader
    @songbird

    There seems to be quite a lot of criticism from human rights types though, this weaponizing of white man's guilt narratives in service of a rather reactionary (and homophobic!) regime is too blatantly cynical.
    Of course still indicative of the direction things are going, and as Meloni's remarks (even if they were not recent, but apparently from 2019) show even most right-wingers accept that framing or at least don't manage to explicitly reject it.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @songbird, @Coconuts, @silviosilver

    There seems to be quite a lot of criticism from human rights types though, this weaponizing of white man’s guilt narratives in service of a rather reactionary (and homophobic!) regime is too blatantly cynical.

    I don’t doubt that it’s cynical (I hope it’s merely cynical, at least). But too blatantly cynical for what exactly? Certainly it’s not too blatantly cynical to be called out. Who, apart from the “far right”, will call it out? Which mainstream figure would have the balls to even correct the ludicrous notion that the white man has been injuring the rest of the world for three freakin thousand years? Totally overlooking the fact that he only gained dominion over it in the last couple of hundred, only made it contact with it 500 years ago, and had spent the previous thousand more or less getting his butt kicked by it. Normiefags would rather lose an arm than point any of this out, even though not a single bit of it can be termed ‘racist’ – not even by absurdly biased contemporary definitions of that term. (Then again, I guess it spoils the fun to focus too intently on the letter of the law, totally neglecting its spirit.)

    As for having to apologize for the next three thousand, there’s even less chance that would be challenged. If anything, people are more likely to claim that three thousand isn’t enough. Whites need to apologize for the next ten thousand, hundred thousand, or as long the sun continues to shine. (Shades of christcuck “reasoning” here, in which it’s considered perfectly possible to do something that is so horrific during your three score and ten that God is perfectly justified in torturing you for the rest of eternity for it. Eternity – 500 trillion years and you’re just getting warmed up. Perfectly just.)

    • Replies: @Coconuts
    @silviosilver


    Shades of christcuck “reasoning” here, in which it’s considered perfectly possible to do something that is so horrific during your three score and ten that God is perfectly justified in torturing you for the rest of eternity for it. Eternity – 500 trillion years and you’re just getting warmed up. Perfectly just.
     
    The original Christian version had a tendency to see the gap between God and humans as so vast that justice could not govern the relations between God and man. Statements about God's justice relate to God keeping his word and doing things he previously promised. From this perspective humans would have no right to demand that God allows them to enter heaven or fails to exile them away from his presence if he wants.

    Later people started to think that giving God this level of unaccountable sovereignty and absolute power was harmful to human dignity, so God had to be seen more as a kind of auxiliary to human moral reasoning. Guys like Feuerbach and Fichte decided God was a sort of projection of human needs and desires that were destined to be satisfied by human society.

    Imo it is the secularised humanist tradition the grievances against whites are part of, not the older God as transcendent absolute monarch one.

    I think it's possible these sensationalist grievances will just start to die out in a couple of decades, as whites are weakened and reduced in numbers enough for them to cease generating as much usable political capital.

    Replies: @Beckow, @silviosilver

  89. @Mikel
    @AnonfromTN


    I know people who live in the Far North, where winter temperatures plunge to -30oC to -40oC
     
    The temperature outside matters very little. What matters is your body temperature and fighting hypothermia is not exactly a secret science. Hospitals around the world (including Russia) have well established protocols and none of them include making patients ingest pure ethanol. Those people you talk about trying to poison themselves after being in the cold must obviously be conscious so they should rather try the old method of a good warm bath instead.

    On the other hand, if you really need some sort of high after exposure to the elements what I would recommend is a CBD bath bomb, available on the internet. It's becoming increasingly popular among outdoor sports people. Makes you sweat, relax and calm any pains.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @Emil Nikola Richard, @AnonfromTN

    On the other hand, if you really need some sort of high after exposure to the elements what I would recommend is a CBD bath bomb, available on the internet. It’s becoming increasingly popular among outdoor sports people. Makes you sweat, relax and calm any pains.

    Now this is why the comments section is the best part of the internet.

    I have a friend with 3 cats and 2 dogs and their hack for chills is sleeping with the animals on the bed. Yikes. Dogs are great but they eat shit.

    • Replies: @Barbarossa
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    sleeping with the animals on the bed
     
    I have a decent number of animals around but my rule is no way in hell are dogs in my bedroom, especially not in my bed. Gross and it ruins the ambiance.
    Cats are sometimes unavoidable on the bed it seems, as they creep in like a water leak, and as long as they stay by the foot of the bed we can keep a truce.
    However, and this only generally happens once, a cat will think it's a good idea to sleep near or on my head and purr at 1AM. I'm a heavy sleeper and I get pretty grumpy if I'm awakened, so the cat ends up taking an unceremonious flight across the room. Like I said, it's generally not repeated, which is best for all parties involved.
    , @dogbumbreath
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    Dogs are great but they eat shit.
     
    There is a simple reason dogs eat shit. Shit contains beneficial bacteria for the gut. In ancient times, humans who destroyed their gut bacteria and fell ill because their gut was not absorbing nutrients were given shit from a person with a healthy gut. Today we eat yogurt.

    Processed dog food is not the natural diet dogs should be eating. This can destroy their useful bacteria. Humans don't do well eating only processed food.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Unintended Consequence

  90. @Yahya
    @silviosilver


    Useless Argies, going down to a pack of sandnigs (Yahya beaming).
     
    Yahya is not beaming. He could care less about his people kicking a ball around better than some other people. That stopped at about the time he started reading books at age 17-18.

    Yahya would prefer if Arabians spent more time on worthier cultural activities such as music, cinema, and literature; such that they produce their own version of Jorge Luis Borges or Astor Piazolla. As it stands Arabians have no significant cultural achievements of their own, outside Islam, if that even counts as an achievement. All this oil money gone to waste; Allah should have given it to Maghrebis, Egyptians or Levantines.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @silviosilver, @showmethereal, @KidDynamite

    That stopped at about the time he started reading books at age 17-18.

    You really weren’t much of a reader before that?

    I used to be a huge soccer fan, but I find it intolerably boring nowadays. I’ll probably watch a game or two, or maybe just the last 20 minutes of a couple. The results don’t really interest me either, but I would definitely consider it a massive disappointment if an African team won it (well, that’s already happened, in a sense, but I mean a 100% Afro team from an African country).

    Sport is more than mere frivolity though. Sport is a mark of civilization – of the kind of civilization I prefer, anyway. It teaches participants the value of a long-term outlook and helps ingrain habits of preparation, training, coping with and overcoming adversity, self-improvement, ultimately enabling them to enjoy the fruits of their efforts. I would rather have youth devoting its time to mastering the art of “kicking a ball around” than loitering on street corners, harassing civilians, consuming drugs and porn, worshiping trashy celebrities and wasting their lives in a myriad other short-term pursuits. They can’t all be scholars and artists, after all.

    • Agree: LatW
    • Replies: @Yahya
    @silviosilver


    You really weren’t much of a reader before that?
     
    No. Hardly anyone, not least my family and friends, around me read any books growing up (this remains true today, sadly). My intellectual exertion at a young age was limited to figuring out how to master video games. Also, by some happenstance, I happened to fall in with the "cool" crowd from an early age (who are still my close friends; one of the positive aspects of Arab culture is that people move around rarely so friends stay for life) instead of the nerdy bookish types. In retrospect the latter probably would have been a better fit for my introverted personality, but i'm happy with the course I took. Sometimes the nerds can be too nerdy even for me (I had zero interest in comic books or the like). Also, some of the "cool" kids can be thoughtful interesting people, even if they don't read much or engage in intellectual activities.

    Totally overlooking the fact that he only gained dominion over it in the last couple of hundred, only made it contact with it 500 years ago, and had spent the previous thousand more or less getting his butt kicked by it.
     
    I think the FIFA president had the Roman and Greek conquests of MENA in mind when he made that statement. To me it's ridiculous to retrospectively attach the label "European" to Romans and Greeks, and pretend their conquests were of the same lineage as France's or Great Britain's. But there's certainly plenty of modern Westerners on both the left and right (including the ahistorical moron who brought this topic up) who like to pretend as if Greeks and Romans belonged to the same group as present-day Celts or Anglo-Saxons.

    Replies: @Coconuts

    , @showmethereal
    @silviosilver

    Yeah the joke indeed is that the French team who won is indeed and African team. Much to the chagrin of older French. But hey if they don’t like it they can always donate the trophy and prize money to their former French colonies

    , @Barbarossa
    @silviosilver


    Sport is more than mere frivolity though.

     

    I'd say that there is a big difference between playing sports and watching sports. The latter has little redeeming value while the former has a number of good attributes.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @songbird

  91. @LatW
    @A123


    HIMARS is (at best) “Tomahawk Lite”. It is a highly technical long range missile system. In terms of operator complexity, the Russian S400 would be a good parallel. Many months are required. It is doubtful that the Syrians can run their S300 half regiment after 9-12 months of training.
     
    Ok, thanks for those details, but I'm pretty sure the Ukrainians are operating this system themselves. They had already been in training for a while in the summer. No offense to Syrians, but Ukrainians are more technically savvy than Syrians. This isn't going to be advertised much (for obvious reasons), but I did find a couple of videos where one can see Ukrainians operating HIMARS. They are out there by themselves.



    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yV2ZoapcEKk

    Starts at 0:20

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kkLMBSDEYFY

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @A123

    Ok, thanks for those details, but I’m pretty sure the Ukrainians are operating this system themselves. They had already been in training for a while in the summer

    No doubt that Ukrainians are maintaining the vehicle, loading missile boxes, etc. These are not trivial jobs. If the solid fuel starts and the missile does not depart the launcher… Very bad.

    The question I was getting at is, “Who is setting up the actual missile flight/target plan?”

    This does not even have to be done on site. The mission planning is likely created elsewhere and then sent electronically to the launcher.

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @LatW
    @A123


    The question I was getting at is, “Who is setting up the actual missile flight/target plan?”
     
    What proof do you have that it is not the Ukrainians themselves? Where is this assumption coming from?

    Replies: @A123

  92. @showmethereal
    @A123

    Even more ironic is the items Poland is buying from South Korea is because those systems are better and cheaper than the comparable US equipment. People don’t even see the reality of the global shift. Yes South Korea is a U.S. ally - but it’s not the US. 30 years ago Poland wouldn’t have been buying from South Korea. Meanwhile their brothers across the border - North Koreans - just openly displayed missiles that can now hit every part of the U.S. Only a handful of nations had such missiles of such range. Its a changed world.

    Replies: @A123

    Even more ironic is the items Poland is buying from South Korea is because those systems are better and cheaper than the comparable US equipment. People don’t even see the reality of the global shift

    Certainly the U.S. MIC produces overpriced goods based on what they can extract from the Pentagon. Cheaper SK gear is certainly reasonable. That being said they are also buying systems from the U.S. in addition to SK.

    The suppliers intentionally omitted are France and Germany. The Poles believe that supply lines via SJW European countries are a liability. While they have similar concerns about Not-The-President Biden, the Poles are hoping for more MAGA victories.

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @A123

    From everything I have read the South Korean tanks are more capable than US M1A1 Abrams

    Replies: @A123

  93. @A123
    @showmethereal


    Even more ironic is the items Poland is buying from South Korea is because those systems are better and cheaper than the comparable US equipment. People don’t even see the reality of the global shift
     
    Certainly the U.S. MIC produces overpriced goods based on what they can extract from the Pentagon. Cheaper SK gear is certainly reasonable. That being said they are also buying systems from the U.S. in addition to SK.

    The suppliers intentionally omitted are France and Germany. The Poles believe that supply lines via SJW European countries are a liability. While they have similar concerns about Not-The-President Biden, the Poles are hoping for more MAGA victories.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @showmethereal

    From everything I have read the South Korean tanks are more capable than US M1A1 Abrams

    • Replies: @A123
    @showmethereal


    From everything I have read the South Korean tanks are more capable than US M1A1 Abrams
     
    A better comparison would be U.S. M1A2 SEPv3 ($6.5MM) versus SK K2 ($8.5MM). Poland is buying both. The K2 needs 3 crew rather than 4. And, the K2 main gun package is a full auto loader which is faster.

    Is it $2MM/each better? Only time will tell.

    PEACE 😇
  94. @S
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    His solar system contains alien spaceship bases on Mars, the Moon, and in the vast uncharted under waters of Earth.
     
    The premise is remindful of the old Gerry Anderson UFO TV series circa 1970, a somewhat entertaining show. :-)


    https://youtu.be/90kSw-BSCq4



    https://youtu.be/EpF6o2-nx4I

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    Those are fiction. Jorjani purports to be representing fact.

    He is not alone. If you like video check out Frank Tipler, professor of mathematics at Tulane U. from 58:00 -> 59:30 in Age of Deceit 2.

    When this came out in 2012 or whenever (I don’t remember what year I first saw it) I thought it was way overkill but I watched again a few weeks ago and it has held up OK. Three hours is far too long but it’s filled with more repetition than it it’s filled with stuffing.

    • Thanks: S
  95. @silviosilver
    @Yahya


    That stopped at about the time he started reading books at age 17-18.
     
    You really weren't much of a reader before that?

    I used to be a huge soccer fan, but I find it intolerably boring nowadays. I'll probably watch a game or two, or maybe just the last 20 minutes of a couple. The results don't really interest me either, but I would definitely consider it a massive disappointment if an African team won it (well, that's already happened, in a sense, but I mean a 100% Afro team from an African country).

    Sport is more than mere frivolity though. Sport is a mark of civilization - of the kind of civilization I prefer, anyway. It teaches participants the value of a long-term outlook and helps ingrain habits of preparation, training, coping with and overcoming adversity, self-improvement, ultimately enabling them to enjoy the fruits of their efforts. I would rather have youth devoting its time to mastering the art of "kicking a ball around" than loitering on street corners, harassing civilians, consuming drugs and porn, worshiping trashy celebrities and wasting their lives in a myriad other short-term pursuits. They can't all be scholars and artists, after all.

    Replies: @Yahya, @showmethereal, @Barbarossa

    You really weren’t much of a reader before that?

    No. Hardly anyone, not least my family and friends, around me read any books growing up (this remains true today, sadly). My intellectual exertion at a young age was limited to figuring out how to master video games. Also, by some happenstance, I happened to fall in with the “cool” crowd from an early age (who are still my close friends; one of the positive aspects of Arab culture is that people move around rarely so friends stay for life) instead of the nerdy bookish types. In retrospect the latter probably would have been a better fit for my introverted personality, but i’m happy with the course I took. Sometimes the nerds can be too nerdy even for me (I had zero interest in comic books or the like). Also, some of the “cool” kids can be thoughtful interesting people, even if they don’t read much or engage in intellectual activities.

    Totally overlooking the fact that he only gained dominion over it in the last couple of hundred, only made it contact with it 500 years ago, and had spent the previous thousand more or less getting his butt kicked by it.

    I think the FIFA president had the Roman and Greek conquests of MENA in mind when he made that statement. To me it’s ridiculous to retrospectively attach the label “European” to Romans and Greeks, and pretend their conquests were of the same lineage as France’s or Great Britain’s. But there’s certainly plenty of modern Westerners on both the left and right (including the ahistorical moron who brought this topic up) who like to pretend as if Greeks and Romans belonged to the same group as present-day Celts or Anglo-Saxons.

    • Replies: @Coconuts
    @Yahya


    To me it’s ridiculous to retrospectively attach the label “European” to Romans and Greeks, and pretend their conquests were of the same lineage as France’s or Great Britain’s.
     
    Is that because the conquests of France and Britain mostly happened under liberalism? The lineage of the political ideas that underpinned the conquests by Spain and Portugal does appear to go back to the Roman Empire, even if it is the later Christian version.

    The French speak a romance language and were heavily settled by Latin colonists (and Greek colonists in parts of the south) and some of them still learn Latin and Greek. I guess this is one reason some of them continue to identify with Greece and Rome.

    Greeks and Romans belonged to the same group as present-day Celts
     
    Iirc the Celtic groups and the Italic group the original Romans were part of were branches of the same Indo-European group. Bashibuzuk who used to post would probably know more about this.
  96. @Yahya
    @silviosilver


    Useless Argies, going down to a pack of sandnigs (Yahya beaming).
     
    Yahya is not beaming. He could care less about his people kicking a ball around better than some other people. That stopped at about the time he started reading books at age 17-18.

    Yahya would prefer if Arabians spent more time on worthier cultural activities such as music, cinema, and literature; such that they produce their own version of Jorge Luis Borges or Astor Piazolla. As it stands Arabians have no significant cultural achievements of their own, outside Islam, if that even counts as an achievement. All this oil money gone to waste; Allah should have given it to Maghrebis, Egyptians or Levantines.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @silviosilver, @showmethereal, @KidDynamite

    such that they produce their own version of Jorge Luis Borges or Astor Piazolla.

    Are you actually a tango fan? I got into it for a while. Of the ‘big names’, I think preferred that Carlos Gardel dude’s songs to Piazzolla’s. Much of a muchness though. Nowadays, it’s like Arab music to me: I think it’s good, but I can only take so much before it starts sounding samey and wears me out. (I can take tango for a lot longer than Arab music though.) The dance itself is sexy as hell. It’s hard to believe they generate those moves spontaneously, I’m half convinced the stuff I see in videos is all choreographed.

    Have you seen the 1998 movie Tango by Carlos Saura? I would be interested to hear your thoughts, if you have. I greatly enjoyed it, even though I have a hard time saying why exactly. It could just be that Argentina has always been my favorite Latin American country. Not for reasons that you might think (“it’s so European”), but because that’s where most of my extended family lives. I have never met them or even seen photographs, but relying on my mother’s memory (and her sister’s, before she died), I have been able to construct something of a family tree. There are a lot of them there and I have thought about contacting some “immigrant heritage” organization in Argentina to see if I can’t establish contact.

    One thing I always envied (to a degree, still do) about my Arab friends was the strength of their extended family ties. That is far from unknown among balkanoids, of course, but in my own family we have tended to be distant from each other. I have first cousins who grew up in Detroit while I was growing up in Australia, and we’d heard about each other and spoken on the phone, but when I arrived in America, we had one meeting (one!) and that was that. Partly my fault for never following up, but when a guest arrives from overseas, if the host shows lackluster enthusiasm (almost frosty, actually), I think they deserve the lion’s share of the blame. My cousins in Australia have mostly married into Anglo (or Irish, whatever) families, which I experienced as a massive loss and, frankly, viewed them as ‘traitors’, in the sense that it totally killed the vibe of family get-togethers I was used to as a kid, to the point that today we take no interest in each other’s lives at all, and years go by between seeing each other (the “weddings and funerals” pattern). I have no qualms at all saying I wish they had married Arabs instead. (So, yeah, I may be a ‘racist,’ but not the kind or to the degree you think.)

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @silviosilver


    Are you actually a tango fan?
     
    Not really tbh. I only mentioned Piazolla because he's the first thing that came to mind. In Latin America I only listen to classical music, which is mostly produced by Brazil. Even then I much prefer European classical music, which is obviously deeper and more sophisticated. Still, this piece by an obscure mestiza Brazilian composer is sublime, I find myself listening to it often:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GDfyFrtI7mM&ab_channel=sonhosesons


    Have you seen the 1998 movie Tango by Carlos Saura?
     
    No. I will watch it though and possibly write an opinion in my next round of film reviews if it is interesting.

    Have you watched the 2001 Bosnian comedy No Man's Land? I watched it twice; loved it the first time, but downgraded to an 8/10 the second time due to poor acting and some corny dialogue. But if you haven't seen it yet I'd recommend it. It's fairly even-handed so you need not worry about Serb-bashing or petty nationalism, movie seems to satirize all sides including the UN.


    It could just be that Argentina has always been my favorite Latin American country
     
    Brazil would be mine, I like how chaotic and crazy the country is. Also the relatively large number of Arabs is a plus too :). Though I will always respect Argentina for producing such an interesting writer as Borges (whose non-fiction I much prefer to his fiction; much like Orwell). Latin America in general is an interesting region, though tbh almost every major geographic sphere interests me, except perhaps sub-Saharan Africa due to a lack of high culture, and to a lesser extent Southeast Asia.

    Interesting that you have family in Argentina. Wasn't aware of Balkan migration to that country, or in Latin America more generally. I think only Ukrainians in Brazil are a prominent Slavic group.


    Nowadays, it’s like Arab music to me: I think it’s good, but I can only take so much before it starts sounding samey and wears me out.
     
    I can see where you're coming from, I like and appreciate the artistic skill of some Japanese Koto or Indian Raja practitioners; but I can only listen to so much for a period of time. I'd say though my ability to listen to exotic music has improved considerably over time. Previously I couldn't stand to venture out of my comfort zone; that is Arabic and Western music (the former I felt comfortable with because it's my native tradition, the other because of its ubiquity and consequent familiarity). The key turning point was when I realized that skill in music is universal, and not every piece of music required a piano or violin to be sophisticated. Even if I still struggle to listen to certain musical categories, I appreciate the artistic value of any classical tradition, and rejoice in any composition that doesn't fall under the mechanical, artificial, synthesizer-based "music" category which seems to have taken over every corner of the globe.

    With regards to Arabic music, I bet you've only listened to mainstream Arabic singers and musicians, though i'm curios to know which artists you were referring to. There's a whole world of obscure Arabic singers, orchestras, ensembles and composers who are ten times more skilled than known quantities like Abdel-Halim Hafez, Fairouz, and god forbid Nancy Ajram etc. but you have to search for them hard. One of the key strengths of the Western music ecosystem is that there's a certain level of organization which allows classical composers to remain (semi)prominent long after they die. In the Arab world, no such system exists so talented composers get lost in a deep void, though some pieces in the repertoire do live on.

    Anyway, recommending music is a fool's errand since musical tastes differ so much. But I can't help but make just a few (if you are interested in a more comprehensive list, see my reply to Dmitry here: https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-194/#comment-5497541)

    1) Ask El-Atash (اسق العطاش)

    This is a Sufi Muwashshah (a multi-lined strophic verse poem written in classical Arabic) called “Ask El-Atash” (اسق العطاش) or alternatively “Hayamatni” (هيمتني), which originated in Aleppo, Syria in the year 1190 in the Islamic calendar, or 1776 AD in the Gregorian calendar. In that year the rain was scarce and the people of Aleppo started praying for Allah (صلاة ودعاء الإستسقاء) to bring them rain.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A-M09-6hcvs&t=132s&ab_channel=OrninaSyrianOrchestra%D8%A3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%83%D8%B3%D8%AA%D8%B1%D8%A7%D8%A3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%86%D9%8A%D9%86%D8%A7%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%B3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%8A%D8%A9

    The above link is my favorite rendition of that song by Rasha Rizk and the Ornina Syrian Orchestra. But there's 5-6 more renditions on YouTube, though usually abridged. Two good ones include:

    Sabah Fakhry (Syrian): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eI0Gs2l21D0&t=1065s&ab_channel=AliAdiga%F0%9F%87%B8%F0%9F%87%BE%F0%9F%87%B8%F0%9F%87%BE

    Lubna Al-Quntar (Syrian): (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JWjYXYYIZ24&ab_channel=OrninaSyrianOrchestra%D8%A3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%83%D8%B3%D8%AA%D8%B1%D8%A7%D8%A3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%86%D9%8A%D9%86%D8%A7%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%B3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%8A%D8%A9)

    I gave the others in this post here: https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-194/#comment-5500139

    2) Ya Msafer Wahdak (يا مسافر وحدك)

    This is an Egyptian classical song, composed by the prolific Muhammad Abdel-Wahab, and arranged here by a talented Palestinian from Nazareth (a surprisingly artistic town), Nizar Al-Khater (highly recommend checking out his other works).

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QdOcTFX6vm0&list=RDQdOcTFX6vm0&start_radio=1&ab_channel=TheGaryBertiniIsraeliChoir%7C%D7%9E%D7%A7%D7%94%D7%9C%D7%AA%D7%91%D7%A8%D7%AA%D7%99%D7%A0%D7%99

    The choir is Israeli, looks to be primarily Ashkenazim, and the lead vocalist is a Lebanese Christian, Marie Jubran. So here you have a song composed by a Muslim, performed by Jews, and sung by a Christian. Whoever said the sons of Abraham can't get along with each other?

    3) Ahla Wa Sahla (أهلا وسهلا)

    Arabic music typically has an accurate reputation for sounding strange, depressing and melancholic. But that's because most people only listen to Arabic music from the Middle Eastern portion of the Arab world. In the Maghreb where people are more jovial, the music is much more upbeat (major scale in musicspeak). This is my favorite song from the bonhomie Algerian Jewish maestro Maurice El-Medioni:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lb2EyWjImXw&ab_channel=OLAMALE1

    On a technical level, he's probably not the best Maghrebi composer, but I love his melodies, they rarely fail to captivate me. If you like his style I recommend listening to the other Big 3 of Algerian Classical Music: Mustapha Skandarani, Mohamed Iguerbouchen, Mohammed Weld El Kourd. Anouar Brahem from Tunisia is also top-notch, though his style is different from the former composers.

    4) En Rah Minak Ya Ein (ان راح منك يا عين)

    This is a song from the Golden Age of Egyptian Cinema, originally composed for Shadia. Sounds similar to a Tango, but the Arabic elements predominate. There's a piano in there which is quite rare for a classical Egyptian songs.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iSgvZ4GhB40&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=6&ab_channel=%D9%86%D9%88%D8%A7%D8%AF%D8%B1%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%88%D8%A7%D8%A6%D8%B9%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%B1%D8%A7%D8%A6%D8%B9%D8%A9%D8%B4%D8%A7%D8%AF%D9%8A%D8%A9

    There's some nice modernized renditions by a couple of Levantine singer:

    Lara Elayyan (Jordanian): (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vVgtSgwYx80&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=146&ab_channel=%D9%84%D8%A7%D8%B1%D8%A7%D8%B9%D9%84%D9%8A%D8%A7%D9%86LaraElayyan)

    Nano Reis (Syrian): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o09k-jihU_E&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=145&ab_channel=mathfun2002

    The instrumentalists in the background of the last video are top-quality composers in their own right: Bassem Saba (Lebanese) and Simon Shaheen (Palestinian Christian). Recommend checking out their work too if you like this style.

    5) Palestinian Folklore

    A compilation of folklore by Nazerene folk singer Dalal Abu Amneh, who could very well have Balkan ancestry as indicated by her blonde hair and blue eyes. She utilizes a melismatic singing style common to traditional Arabic music (and also Celtic music); which can often times feel kitschy if done wrong but here is well executed:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jKACz8iX2mk&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=184&ab_channel=DalalAbuAmneh-%D8%AF%D9%84%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%A3%D8%A8%D9%88%D8%A2%D9%85%D9%86%D8%A9

    Let me know if you like any of these.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @silviosilver

  97. @Yahya
    @silviosilver


    Useless Argies, going down to a pack of sandnigs (Yahya beaming).
     
    Yahya is not beaming. He could care less about his people kicking a ball around better than some other people. That stopped at about the time he started reading books at age 17-18.

    Yahya would prefer if Arabians spent more time on worthier cultural activities such as music, cinema, and literature; such that they produce their own version of Jorge Luis Borges or Astor Piazolla. As it stands Arabians have no significant cultural achievements of their own, outside Islam, if that even counts as an achievement. All this oil money gone to waste; Allah should have given it to Maghrebis, Egyptians or Levantines.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @silviosilver, @showmethereal, @KidDynamite

    Actually you have to have fairly high intelligence to be good at football. In a fluid game with constant changes – it requires not just intelligence – but also patience and concentration. Our athleticism does not win a football match. Beating Argentina is actually a huge accomplishment

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @showmethereal

    Flopping with conviction requires major street smarts.

    People totally misunderestimate Kobe Bryant and James Harden.

    , @Yahya
    @showmethereal


    Actually you have to have fairly high intelligence to be good at football.
     
    If that were true, then East Asians would dominate the World Cup (which they don’t, quite the opposite), and blacks would not be over represented in European teams.

    Football players don’t seem that bright to me. Being a manager seems to be g-loaded though.

    Replies: @Mikel, @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms, @showmethereal

  98. @silviosilver
    @Yahya


    That stopped at about the time he started reading books at age 17-18.
     
    You really weren't much of a reader before that?

    I used to be a huge soccer fan, but I find it intolerably boring nowadays. I'll probably watch a game or two, or maybe just the last 20 minutes of a couple. The results don't really interest me either, but I would definitely consider it a massive disappointment if an African team won it (well, that's already happened, in a sense, but I mean a 100% Afro team from an African country).

    Sport is more than mere frivolity though. Sport is a mark of civilization - of the kind of civilization I prefer, anyway. It teaches participants the value of a long-term outlook and helps ingrain habits of preparation, training, coping with and overcoming adversity, self-improvement, ultimately enabling them to enjoy the fruits of their efforts. I would rather have youth devoting its time to mastering the art of "kicking a ball around" than loitering on street corners, harassing civilians, consuming drugs and porn, worshiping trashy celebrities and wasting their lives in a myriad other short-term pursuits. They can't all be scholars and artists, after all.

    Replies: @Yahya, @showmethereal, @Barbarossa

    Yeah the joke indeed is that the French team who won is indeed and African team. Much to the chagrin of older French. But hey if they don’t like it they can always donate the trophy and prize money to their former French colonies

  99. @Mikel
    @AnonfromTN


    I know people who live in the Far North, where winter temperatures plunge to -30oC to -40oC
     
    The temperature outside matters very little. What matters is your body temperature and fighting hypothermia is not exactly a secret science. Hospitals around the world (including Russia) have well established protocols and none of them include making patients ingest pure ethanol. Those people you talk about trying to poison themselves after being in the cold must obviously be conscious so they should rather try the old method of a good warm bath instead.

    On the other hand, if you really need some sort of high after exposure to the elements what I would recommend is a CBD bath bomb, available on the internet. It's becoming increasingly popular among outdoor sports people. Makes you sweat, relax and calm any pains.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @Emil Nikola Richard, @AnonfromTN

    I described what people used since times immemorial, ages before Internet. They don’t look for highs, they only want to get warm and experience no adverse consequences of exposure to the cold. If you don’t believe it, talk to someone who lived in the Far North (as a resident, not as a tourist).

  100. @silviosilver
    @Matra

    Where have you noticed this, on twitter?

    As for AK, he's not dooming that badly yet. He's still assigning a greater than 50% subjective probability to a positive outcome.

    Anyone watching the World Cup? Useless Argies, going down to a pack of sandnigs (Yahya beaming). Disgraceful. O tempora o mores.

    Replies: @Yahya, @Matra, @LondonBob

    Mostly Twitter, but also a couple of forums. Not this one though as it has thinned out since AK left. Maybe if Russia were performing better the Russians and few Serbs who used to comment here would come back to brag.

    The supposedly temporary Covid rule at last year’s European championships allowing more substitutes has been made permanent. Allowing five subs represents the kind of Americanisation that Steve Sailer has long advocated. How can it be a team effort if half the players that finish didn’t start the match? It also fundamentally changes the game. The England v Iran match yesterday had 14 minutes of time added at the end of the first half. There were 8 minutes added to the end of another match. Trying to get a more exact ‘time clock’ may also indicate creeping Americanisation. Maybe those drink breaks they had during hot days will turn into time-outs in the future.

  101. @showmethereal
    @Yahya

    Actually you have to have fairly high intelligence to be good at football. In a fluid game with constant changes - it requires not just intelligence - but also patience and concentration. Our athleticism does not win a football match. Beating Argentina is actually a huge accomplishment

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Yahya

    Flopping with conviction requires major street smarts.

    People totally misunderestimate Kobe Bryant and James Harden.

  102. This is not a bad bit of trolling from the Russians.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Matra

    That was not the first “request” from Ukraine to join NATO. Ukies downed Romanian fighter jet. The pilot was killed. Then they downed Romanian helicopter that searched for that missing jet. The crew was killed. Then Ukrainian drone (ancient, USSR-made) flew over several NATO countries and fell out of the sky in Zagreb, Croatia. So, hitting a tractor and killing two Poles is only the cherry on the cake.

    Replies: @Beckow

  103. @showmethereal
    @German_reader

    Well here is the problem with your thinking. With Russia and China actually helping those countries to develop they have less need to migrate. The most African students in the world study in China - not the west. But the overwhelming majority go back to their home nations. Again like the previous writer noted “different types of superpowers”.

    Replies: @Beckow, @Coconuts

    Each instance of a super-power is different, but the migration urge is always the same. The Third Worlders migrating to Europe-US, or possibly Russia (I doubt it), are not settlers. They are seeking the easiest way to live better – an instinct based on self-interest, laziness and a calculation that moving to where the stuff is beats trying to create it at home.

    No amount of development will stop it and more integration only speeds it up. It mainly affects young males and usually the ones with some resources – the pathetic equivalent of middle and lower middle classes in the Third World. The only way to stop it is to simply stop it – no rules, no excuses, no back doors, no discussion. Or it will overwhelm what is left of the West. A simple choice that the people are unwilling to make, or often even see. There is really nothing scarier for what’s left of our culture than the ‘African students‘, whatever that term encompasses.

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @Beckow

    So all the millions and millions and millions of Europeans that fled Europe for other continents - why did they stop? They stopped because the reasons they fled Europe for 3 centuries were remedied for the most part. It’s laughable people forget Europeans had a mass migration out for centuries.

    In any event it is a fact across the board that the more a country prospers - migration rates slow.

    Replies: @Beckow

  104. @Matra
    This is not a bad bit of trolling from the Russians.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    That was not the first “request” from Ukraine to join NATO. Ukies downed Romanian fighter jet. The pilot was killed. Then they downed Romanian helicopter that searched for that missing jet. The crew was killed. Then Ukrainian drone (ancient, USSR-made) flew over several NATO countries and fell out of the sky in Zagreb, Croatia. So, hitting a tractor and killing two Poles is only the cherry on the cake.

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @AnonfromTN


    ...hitting a tractor and killing two Poles...
     
    When you hit a tractor you often kill some Poles, that's the way it works in Eastern Europe, an anadiplosis. Another repeating pattern is the uncontrolled fury of resentful Galicians as they realize that the gig is up, that they lost again. That one is still coming.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  105. @Yahya
    @silviosilver


    You really weren’t much of a reader before that?
     
    No. Hardly anyone, not least my family and friends, around me read any books growing up (this remains true today, sadly). My intellectual exertion at a young age was limited to figuring out how to master video games. Also, by some happenstance, I happened to fall in with the "cool" crowd from an early age (who are still my close friends; one of the positive aspects of Arab culture is that people move around rarely so friends stay for life) instead of the nerdy bookish types. In retrospect the latter probably would have been a better fit for my introverted personality, but i'm happy with the course I took. Sometimes the nerds can be too nerdy even for me (I had zero interest in comic books or the like). Also, some of the "cool" kids can be thoughtful interesting people, even if they don't read much or engage in intellectual activities.

    Totally overlooking the fact that he only gained dominion over it in the last couple of hundred, only made it contact with it 500 years ago, and had spent the previous thousand more or less getting his butt kicked by it.
     
    I think the FIFA president had the Roman and Greek conquests of MENA in mind when he made that statement. To me it's ridiculous to retrospectively attach the label "European" to Romans and Greeks, and pretend their conquests were of the same lineage as France's or Great Britain's. But there's certainly plenty of modern Westerners on both the left and right (including the ahistorical moron who brought this topic up) who like to pretend as if Greeks and Romans belonged to the same group as present-day Celts or Anglo-Saxons.

    Replies: @Coconuts

    To me it’s ridiculous to retrospectively attach the label “European” to Romans and Greeks, and pretend their conquests were of the same lineage as France’s or Great Britain’s.

    Is that because the conquests of France and Britain mostly happened under liberalism? The lineage of the political ideas that underpinned the conquests by Spain and Portugal does appear to go back to the Roman Empire, even if it is the later Christian version.

    The French speak a romance language and were heavily settled by Latin colonists (and Greek colonists in parts of the south) and some of them still learn Latin and Greek. I guess this is one reason some of them continue to identify with Greece and Rome.

    Greeks and Romans belonged to the same group as present-day Celts

    Iirc the Celtic groups and the Italic group the original Romans were part of were branches of the same Indo-European group. Bashibuzuk who used to post would probably know more about this.

  106. @showmethereal
    @A123

    From everything I have read the South Korean tanks are more capable than US M1A1 Abrams

    Replies: @A123

    From everything I have read the South Korean tanks are more capable than US M1A1 Abrams

    A better comparison would be U.S. M1A2 SEPv3 ($6.5MM) versus SK K2 ($8.5MM). Poland is buying both. The K2 needs 3 crew rather than 4. And, the K2 main gun package is a full auto loader which is faster.

    Is it $2MM/each better? Only time will tell.

    PEACE 😇

  107. @silviosilver
    @German_reader


    There seems to be quite a lot of criticism from human rights types though, this weaponizing of white man’s guilt narratives in service of a rather reactionary (and homophobic!) regime is too blatantly cynical.
     
    I don't doubt that it's cynical (I hope it's merely cynical, at least). But too blatantly cynical for what exactly? Certainly it's not too blatantly cynical to be called out. Who, apart from the "far right", will call it out? Which mainstream figure would have the balls to even correct the ludicrous notion that the white man has been injuring the rest of the world for three freakin thousand years? Totally overlooking the fact that he only gained dominion over it in the last couple of hundred, only made it contact with it 500 years ago, and had spent the previous thousand more or less getting his butt kicked by it. Normiefags would rather lose an arm than point any of this out, even though not a single bit of it can be termed 'racist' - not even by absurdly biased contemporary definitions of that term. (Then again, I guess it spoils the fun to focus too intently on the letter of the law, totally neglecting its spirit.)

    As for having to apologize for the next three thousand, there's even less chance that would be challenged. If anything, people are more likely to claim that three thousand isn't enough. Whites need to apologize for the next ten thousand, hundred thousand, or as long the sun continues to shine. (Shades of christcuck "reasoning" here, in which it's considered perfectly possible to do something that is so horrific during your three score and ten that God is perfectly justified in torturing you for the rest of eternity for it. Eternity - 500 trillion years and you're just getting warmed up. Perfectly just.)

    Replies: @Coconuts

    Shades of christcuck “reasoning” here, in which it’s considered perfectly possible to do something that is so horrific during your three score and ten that God is perfectly justified in torturing you for the rest of eternity for it. Eternity – 500 trillion years and you’re just getting warmed up. Perfectly just.

    The original Christian version had a tendency to see the gap between God and humans as so vast that justice could not govern the relations between God and man. Statements about God’s justice relate to God keeping his word and doing things he previously promised. From this perspective humans would have no right to demand that God allows them to enter heaven or fails to exile them away from his presence if he wants.

    Later people started to think that giving God this level of unaccountable sovereignty and absolute power was harmful to human dignity, so God had to be seen more as a kind of auxiliary to human moral reasoning. Guys like Feuerbach and Fichte decided God was a sort of projection of human needs and desires that were destined to be satisfied by human society.

    Imo it is the secularised humanist tradition the grievances against whites are part of, not the older God as transcendent absolute monarch one.

    I think it’s possible these sensationalist grievances will just start to die out in a couple of decades, as whites are weakened and reduced in numbers enough for them to cease generating as much usable political capital.

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @Coconuts


    ...grievances will just start to die out in a couple of decades, as whites are weakened and reduced in numbers enough
     
    It never works that way. It will more likely be to the last scrap of whiteness that can be located, it must be exterminated because it reminds the others how inadequate they are. And most of the really nasty stuff will be done by the whites to themselves - that one I can't explain, and no God could explain it.

    As you weaken the whites they will simply be more vulnerable. I watched Georgina scream against Macron, a beautiful performance. But it struck me that it was basically an extreme defensiveness with a hint of hysteria, you don't win that way. Offering explanations, thinking that a better argument actually changes something, the pleading female voice - that is a road to nowhere.

    There is no justice in the universe or nature, buying into the silly concept of who is more just, more deserving, means that you have already lost. More power to Georgina Meloni, but she could be a latter-day distraction. There is a pathological self-destructive gene that the whites seem to carry and it has exploded in numbers as they ceased to propagate.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @Coconuts

    , @silviosilver
    @Coconuts

    I know the routine, God's love is not the same thing as man's love, and God's justice is not the same thing as man's justice - so much so that it's hard to see how they amount to 'love' or 'justice' at all. When you get past all the smoke and mirrors, some of version of this is what it always comes down to. (Of course, if that is true, it is true, and besides, what does a creator really owe his creation anyway? If it's all true, I'm shit out of luck, plain and simple.)

    But anyway, I'm really not here to dissuade anyone from being Christian. Hard it as it may be to believe, I would be thrilled if more people became Christian (especially more Europeans), even if I personally cannot take Christian theology seriously. My hard atheist days are far behind me, and Christianity is my spiritual 'mother tongue,' and I cannot depart too far from it for too long, so every now and then I am reminded of some aspect of Christianity that rubs me the wrong way and I blurt out something scornful.

  108. I very much wish that I could find a map of the countries that add improbable sound effects to their comedies and those that don’t. (Such as to accompany people making different motions)

    My conceptions of such areas are only the vaguest. But I get the idea that both China and SK add improbable sound effects, at least in certain cases, which I find surprising.

  109. @AnonfromTN
    @Matra

    That was not the first “request” from Ukraine to join NATO. Ukies downed Romanian fighter jet. The pilot was killed. Then they downed Romanian helicopter that searched for that missing jet. The crew was killed. Then Ukrainian drone (ancient, USSR-made) flew over several NATO countries and fell out of the sky in Zagreb, Croatia. So, hitting a tractor and killing two Poles is only the cherry on the cake.

    Replies: @Beckow

    …hitting a tractor and killing two Poles…

    When you hit a tractor you often kill some Poles, that’s the way it works in Eastern Europe, an anadiplosis. Another repeating pattern is the uncontrolled fury of resentful Galicians as they realize that the gig is up, that they lost again. That one is still coming.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Beckow


    uncontrolled fury of resentful Galicians as they realize that the gig is up, that they lost again.
     
    The imperial puppets did not say anything explicitly, but they act according to the reality, not according to politically motivated BS. Poland is placing its anti-missile defenses at the Ukrainian border, while Lithuania decided against handing its anti-missile defense system to Ukies, but to strengthen its anti-missile defenses ASAP instead.

    It’s like with MH17 in 2014: no airline said anything politically incorrect, but they all stopped flying over Ukraine and continued flying over Russia. Sapienty sat.
  110. @Coconuts
    @silviosilver


    Shades of christcuck “reasoning” here, in which it’s considered perfectly possible to do something that is so horrific during your three score and ten that God is perfectly justified in torturing you for the rest of eternity for it. Eternity – 500 trillion years and you’re just getting warmed up. Perfectly just.
     
    The original Christian version had a tendency to see the gap between God and humans as so vast that justice could not govern the relations between God and man. Statements about God's justice relate to God keeping his word and doing things he previously promised. From this perspective humans would have no right to demand that God allows them to enter heaven or fails to exile them away from his presence if he wants.

    Later people started to think that giving God this level of unaccountable sovereignty and absolute power was harmful to human dignity, so God had to be seen more as a kind of auxiliary to human moral reasoning. Guys like Feuerbach and Fichte decided God was a sort of projection of human needs and desires that were destined to be satisfied by human society.

    Imo it is the secularised humanist tradition the grievances against whites are part of, not the older God as transcendent absolute monarch one.

    I think it's possible these sensationalist grievances will just start to die out in a couple of decades, as whites are weakened and reduced in numbers enough for them to cease generating as much usable political capital.

    Replies: @Beckow, @silviosilver

    …grievances will just start to die out in a couple of decades, as whites are weakened and reduced in numbers enough

    It never works that way. It will more likely be to the last scrap of whiteness that can be located, it must be exterminated because it reminds the others how inadequate they are. And most of the really nasty stuff will be done by the whites to themselves – that one I can’t explain, and no God could explain it.

    As you weaken the whites they will simply be more vulnerable. I watched Georgina scream against Macron, a beautiful performance. But it struck me that it was basically an extreme defensiveness with a hint of hysteria, you don’t win that way. Offering explanations, thinking that a better argument actually changes something, the pleading female voice – that is a road to nowhere.

    There is no justice in the universe or nature, buying into the silly concept of who is more just, more deserving, means that you have already lost. More power to Georgina Meloni, but she could be a latter-day distraction. There is a pathological self-destructive gene that the whites seem to carry and it has exploded in numbers as they ceased to propagate.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Beckow


    It will more likely be to the last scrap of whiteness that can be located, it must be exterminated because it reminds the others how inadequate they are.
     
    Call it "The End of History and the Last White Man" thesis.
    , @Coconuts
    @Beckow


    It never works that way. It will more likely be to the last scrap of whiteness that can be located, it must be exterminated because it reminds the others how inadequate they are. And most of the really nasty stuff will be done by the whites to themselves – that one I can’t explain, and no God could explain it.
     
    Well, this is the less optimistic possibility. I am hoping these tendencies abate, but there is the possibility that they won't, or that they won't in time. If something like this happens the best explanation may be the 'mouse utopia' one, where some sort of mismatch between living conditions and evolutionary norms produces lots of people with serious psychological flaws.

    There is no justice in the universe or nature, buying into the silly concept of who is more just, more deserving, means that you have already lost.
     
    I think it used to be better understood, one side of justice is about reciprocal duty and obligation, but the other side of justice is power and authority used to pursue excellence or the good. To be just a certain level of power and ability is needed, and to recognise it people need to share some understanding of what a good life is. Imo this is why appeals to justice that are too abstract have this empty quality.

    Replies: @Beckow

  111. @A123
    @LatW


    Ok, thanks for those details, but I’m pretty sure the Ukrainians are operating this system themselves. They had already been in training for a while in the summer
     
    No doubt that Ukrainians are maintaining the vehicle, loading missile boxes, etc. These are not trivial jobs. If the solid fuel starts and the missile does not depart the launcher... Very bad.

    The question I was getting at is, "Who is setting up the actual missile flight/target plan?"

    This does not even have to be done on site. The mission planning is likely created elsewhere and then sent electronically to the launcher.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @LatW

    The question I was getting at is, “Who is setting up the actual missile flight/target plan?”

    What proof do you have that it is not the Ukrainians themselves? Where is this assumption coming from?

    • Replies: @A123
    @LatW



    The question I was getting at is, “Who is setting up the actual missile flight/target plan?”
     
    What proof do you have that it is not the Ukrainians themselves? Where is this assumption coming from?
     
    It is quite believable that Ukraine is running 100% independent units with 6 pack MLRS (~35km range). That is not dissimilar to conventional artillery in plan and use.

    The more exotic and expensive ammunition packages (ATACMS or PrSM) are much more complex. The longer range attacks seem to have very good intelligence on where things are, both targets and missile defense systems, well behind enemy limes.

    • Do you have any proof that Ukraine has the ability to perform such reconnaissance?
    • Can you think of several intelligence agency's associated Europe that do?
    • How about the European Empire's coup regime across the Atlantic?

    Chances of proving this either way are quite slim. The European Empire, for obvious reasons of deniability, is caught between maximum aggression and minimum disclosure. However, it would be unsurprising to learn that the Paris-Berlin axis is running a good portion of Zelensky's long range strike packages.

    Do you have any evidence that I am wrong?

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @LatW

  112. @Coconuts
    @silviosilver


    Shades of christcuck “reasoning” here, in which it’s considered perfectly possible to do something that is so horrific during your three score and ten that God is perfectly justified in torturing you for the rest of eternity for it. Eternity – 500 trillion years and you’re just getting warmed up. Perfectly just.
     
    The original Christian version had a tendency to see the gap between God and humans as so vast that justice could not govern the relations between God and man. Statements about God's justice relate to God keeping his word and doing things he previously promised. From this perspective humans would have no right to demand that God allows them to enter heaven or fails to exile them away from his presence if he wants.

    Later people started to think that giving God this level of unaccountable sovereignty and absolute power was harmful to human dignity, so God had to be seen more as a kind of auxiliary to human moral reasoning. Guys like Feuerbach and Fichte decided God was a sort of projection of human needs and desires that were destined to be satisfied by human society.

    Imo it is the secularised humanist tradition the grievances against whites are part of, not the older God as transcendent absolute monarch one.

    I think it's possible these sensationalist grievances will just start to die out in a couple of decades, as whites are weakened and reduced in numbers enough for them to cease generating as much usable political capital.

    Replies: @Beckow, @silviosilver

    I know the routine, God’s love is not the same thing as man’s love, and God’s justice is not the same thing as man’s justice – so much so that it’s hard to see how they amount to ‘love’ or ‘justice’ at all. When you get past all the smoke and mirrors, some of version of this is what it always comes down to. (Of course, if that is true, it is true, and besides, what does a creator really owe his creation anyway? If it’s all true, I’m shit out of luck, plain and simple.)

    But anyway, I’m really not here to dissuade anyone from being Christian. Hard it as it may be to believe, I would be thrilled if more people became Christian (especially more Europeans), even if I personally cannot take Christian theology seriously. My hard atheist days are far behind me, and Christianity is my spiritual ‘mother tongue,’ and I cannot depart too far from it for too long, so every now and then I am reminded of some aspect of Christianity that rubs me the wrong way and I blurt out something scornful.

  113. @Beckow
    @Coconuts


    ...grievances will just start to die out in a couple of decades, as whites are weakened and reduced in numbers enough
     
    It never works that way. It will more likely be to the last scrap of whiteness that can be located, it must be exterminated because it reminds the others how inadequate they are. And most of the really nasty stuff will be done by the whites to themselves - that one I can't explain, and no God could explain it.

    As you weaken the whites they will simply be more vulnerable. I watched Georgina scream against Macron, a beautiful performance. But it struck me that it was basically an extreme defensiveness with a hint of hysteria, you don't win that way. Offering explanations, thinking that a better argument actually changes something, the pleading female voice - that is a road to nowhere.

    There is no justice in the universe or nature, buying into the silly concept of who is more just, more deserving, means that you have already lost. More power to Georgina Meloni, but she could be a latter-day distraction. There is a pathological self-destructive gene that the whites seem to carry and it has exploded in numbers as they ceased to propagate.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @Coconuts

    It will more likely be to the last scrap of whiteness that can be located, it must be exterminated because it reminds the others how inadequate they are.

    Call it “The End of History and the Last White Man” thesis.

  114. @Beckow
    @AnonfromTN


    ...hitting a tractor and killing two Poles...
     
    When you hit a tractor you often kill some Poles, that's the way it works in Eastern Europe, an anadiplosis. Another repeating pattern is the uncontrolled fury of resentful Galicians as they realize that the gig is up, that they lost again. That one is still coming.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    uncontrolled fury of resentful Galicians as they realize that the gig is up, that they lost again.

    The imperial puppets did not say anything explicitly, but they act according to the reality, not according to politically motivated BS. Poland is placing its anti-missile defenses at the Ukrainian border, while Lithuania decided against handing its anti-missile defense system to Ukies, but to strengthen its anti-missile defenses ASAP instead.

    It’s like with MH17 in 2014: no airline said anything politically incorrect, but they all stopped flying over Ukraine and continued flying over Russia. Sapienty sat.

  115. @silviosilver
    @Yahya


    such that they produce their own version of Jorge Luis Borges or Astor Piazolla.
     
    Are you actually a tango fan? I got into it for a while. Of the 'big names', I think preferred that Carlos Gardel dude's songs to Piazzolla's. Much of a muchness though. Nowadays, it's like Arab music to me: I think it's good, but I can only take so much before it starts sounding samey and wears me out. (I can take tango for a lot longer than Arab music though.) The dance itself is sexy as hell. It's hard to believe they generate those moves spontaneously, I'm half convinced the stuff I see in videos is all choreographed.

    Have you seen the 1998 movie Tango by Carlos Saura? I would be interested to hear your thoughts, if you have. I greatly enjoyed it, even though I have a hard time saying why exactly. It could just be that Argentina has always been my favorite Latin American country. Not for reasons that you might think ("it's so European"), but because that's where most of my extended family lives. I have never met them or even seen photographs, but relying on my mother's memory (and her sister's, before she died), I have been able to construct something of a family tree. There are a lot of them there and I have thought about contacting some "immigrant heritage" organization in Argentina to see if I can't establish contact.

    One thing I always envied (to a degree, still do) about my Arab friends was the strength of their extended family ties. That is far from unknown among balkanoids, of course, but in my own family we have tended to be distant from each other. I have first cousins who grew up in Detroit while I was growing up in Australia, and we'd heard about each other and spoken on the phone, but when I arrived in America, we had one meeting (one!) and that was that. Partly my fault for never following up, but when a guest arrives from overseas, if the host shows lackluster enthusiasm (almost frosty, actually), I think they deserve the lion's share of the blame. My cousins in Australia have mostly married into Anglo (or Irish, whatever) families, which I experienced as a massive loss and, frankly, viewed them as 'traitors', in the sense that it totally killed the vibe of family get-togethers I was used to as a kid, to the point that today we take no interest in each other's lives at all, and years go by between seeing each other (the "weddings and funerals" pattern). I have no qualms at all saying I wish they had married Arabs instead. (So, yeah, I may be a 'racist,' but not the kind or to the degree you think.)

    Replies: @Yahya

    Are you actually a tango fan?

    Not really tbh. I only mentioned Piazolla because he’s the first thing that came to mind. In Latin America I only listen to classical music, which is mostly produced by Brazil. Even then I much prefer European classical music, which is obviously deeper and more sophisticated. Still, this piece by an obscure mestiza Brazilian composer is sublime, I find myself listening to it often:

    Have you seen the 1998 movie Tango by Carlos Saura?

    No. I will watch it though and possibly write an opinion in my next round of film reviews if it is interesting.

    Have you watched the 2001 Bosnian comedy No Man’s Land? I watched it twice; loved it the first time, but downgraded to an 8/10 the second time due to poor acting and some corny dialogue. But if you haven’t seen it yet I’d recommend it. It’s fairly even-handed so you need not worry about Serb-bashing or petty nationalism, movie seems to satirize all sides including the UN.

    It could just be that Argentina has always been my favorite Latin American country

    Brazil would be mine, I like how chaotic and crazy the country is. Also the relatively large number of Arabs is a plus too :). Though I will always respect Argentina for producing such an interesting writer as Borges (whose non-fiction I much prefer to his fiction; much like Orwell). Latin America in general is an interesting region, though tbh almost every major geographic sphere interests me, except perhaps sub-Saharan Africa due to a lack of high culture, and to a lesser extent Southeast Asia.

    Interesting that you have family in Argentina. Wasn’t aware of Balkan migration to that country, or in Latin America more generally. I think only Ukrainians in Brazil are a prominent Slavic group.

    Nowadays, it’s like Arab music to me: I think it’s good, but I can only take so much before it starts sounding samey and wears me out.

    I can see where you’re coming from, I like and appreciate the artistic skill of some Japanese Koto or Indian Raja practitioners; but I can only listen to so much for a period of time. I’d say though my ability to listen to exotic music has improved considerably over time. Previously I couldn’t stand to venture out of my comfort zone; that is Arabic and Western music (the former I felt comfortable with because it’s my native tradition, the other because of its ubiquity and consequent familiarity). The key turning point was when I realized that skill in music is universal, and not every piece of music required a piano or violin to be sophisticated. Even if I still struggle to listen to certain musical categories, I appreciate the artistic value of any classical tradition, and rejoice in any composition that doesn’t fall under the mechanical, artificial, synthesizer-based “music” category which seems to have taken over every corner of the globe.

    With regards to Arabic music, I bet you’ve only listened to mainstream Arabic singers and musicians, though i’m curios to know which artists you were referring to. There’s a whole world of obscure Arabic singers, orchestras, ensembles and composers who are ten times more skilled than known quantities like Abdel-Halim Hafez, Fairouz, and god forbid Nancy Ajram etc. but you have to search for them hard. One of the key strengths of the Western music ecosystem is that there’s a certain level of organization which allows classical composers to remain (semi)prominent long after they die. In the Arab world, no such system exists so talented composers get lost in a deep void, though some pieces in the repertoire do live on.

    Anyway, recommending music is a fool’s errand since musical tastes differ so much. But I can’t help but make just a few (if you are interested in a more comprehensive list, see my reply to Dmitry here: https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-194/#comment-5497541)

    [MORE]

    1) Ask El-Atash (اسق العطاش)

    This is a Sufi Muwashshah (a multi-lined strophic verse poem written in classical Arabic) called “Ask El-Atash” (اسق العطاش) or alternatively “Hayamatni” (هيمتني), which originated in Aleppo, Syria in the year 1190 in the Islamic calendar, or 1776 AD in the Gregorian calendar. In that year the rain was scarce and the people of Aleppo started praying for Allah (صلاة ودعاء الإستسقاء) to bring them rain.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A-M09-6hcvs&t=132s&ab_channel=OrninaSyrianOrchestra%D8%A3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%83%D8%B3%D8%AA%D8%B1%D8%A7%D8%A3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%86%D9%8A%D9%86%D8%A7%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%B3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%8A%D8%A9

    The above link is my favorite rendition of that song by Rasha Rizk and the Ornina Syrian Orchestra. But there’s 5-6 more renditions on YouTube, though usually abridged. Two good ones include:

    Sabah Fakhry (Syrian): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eI0Gs2l21D0&t=1065s&ab_channel=AliAdiga%F0%9F%87%B8%F0%9F%87%BE%F0%9F%87%B8%F0%9F%87%BE

    Lubna Al-Quntar (Syrian): (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JWjYXYYIZ24&ab_channel=OrninaSyrianOrchestra%D8%A3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%83%D8%B3%D8%AA%D8%B1%D8%A7%D8%A3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%86%D9%8A%D9%86%D8%A7%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%B3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%8A%D8%A9)

    I gave the others in this post here: https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-194/#comment-5500139

    2) Ya Msafer Wahdak (يا مسافر وحدك)

    This is an Egyptian classical song, composed by the prolific Muhammad Abdel-Wahab, and arranged here by a talented Palestinian from Nazareth (a surprisingly artistic town), Nizar Al-Khater (highly recommend checking out his other works).

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QdOcTFX6vm0&list=RDQdOcTFX6vm0&start_radio=1&ab_channel=TheGaryBertiniIsraeliChoir%7C%D7%9E%D7%A7%D7%94%D7%9C%D7%AA%D7%91%D7%A8%D7%AA%D7%99%D7%A0%D7%99

    The choir is Israeli, looks to be primarily Ashkenazim, and the lead vocalist is a Lebanese Christian, Marie Jubran. So here you have a song composed by a Muslim, performed by Jews, and sung by a Christian. Whoever said the sons of Abraham can’t get along with each other?

    3) Ahla Wa Sahla (أهلا وسهلا)

    Arabic music typically has an accurate reputation for sounding strange, depressing and melancholic. But that’s because most people only listen to Arabic music from the Middle Eastern portion of the Arab world. In the Maghreb where people are more jovial, the music is much more upbeat (major scale in musicspeak). This is my favorite song from the bonhomie Algerian Jewish maestro Maurice El-Medioni:

    On a technical level, he’s probably not the best Maghrebi composer, but I love his melodies, they rarely fail to captivate me. If you like his style I recommend listening to the other Big 3 of Algerian Classical Music: Mustapha Skandarani, Mohamed Iguerbouchen, Mohammed Weld El Kourd. Anouar Brahem from Tunisia is also top-notch, though his style is different from the former composers.

    4) En Rah Minak Ya Ein (ان راح منك يا عين)

    This is a song from the Golden Age of Egyptian Cinema, originally composed for Shadia. Sounds similar to a Tango, but the Arabic elements predominate. There’s a piano in there which is quite rare for a classical Egyptian songs.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iSgvZ4GhB40&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=6&ab_channel=%D9%86%D9%88%D8%A7%D8%AF%D8%B1%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%88%D8%A7%D8%A6%D8%B9%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%B1%D8%A7%D8%A6%D8%B9%D8%A9%D8%B4%D8%A7%D8%AF%D9%8A%D8%A9

    There’s some nice modernized renditions by a couple of Levantine singer:

    Lara Elayyan (Jordanian): (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vVgtSgwYx80&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=146&ab_channel=%D9%84%D8%A7%D8%B1%D8%A7%D8%B9%D9%84%D9%8A%D8%A7%D9%86LaraElayyan)

    Nano Reis (Syrian):

    The instrumentalists in the background of the last video are top-quality composers in their own right: Bassem Saba (Lebanese) and Simon Shaheen (Palestinian Christian). Recommend checking out their work too if you like this style.

    5) Palestinian Folklore

    A compilation of folklore by Nazerene folk singer Dalal Abu Amneh, who could very well have Balkan ancestry as indicated by her blonde hair and blue eyes. She utilizes a melismatic singing style common to traditional Arabic music (and also Celtic music); which can often times feel kitschy if done wrong but here is well executed:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jKACz8iX2mk&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=184&ab_channel=DalalAbuAmneh-%D8%AF%D9%84%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%A3%D8%A8%D9%88%D8%A2%D9%85%D9%86%D8%A9

    Let me know if you like any of these.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Yahya


    It’s fairly even-handed so you need not worry about Serb-bashing or petty nationalism
     
    I'll reply to the rest of your post later, but just quickly on this, lol, I am the last person who'd ever get offended by that. In the war years, there was this Croatian song "Oj Srbine, jebem ti tri prsta", best rendered in English as "Oi Serbo, fuck you and your three fingers" (3 fingers referring to the three fingers orthodox worshipers use to cross themselves, but also sometimes flashed as an orthodox "gang sign" lol, well, more like WWII's "v for victory" salute, made famous by Churchill). The lyrics are intended to taunt and maximally insult, but I can listen to something like that and laugh no problem. (This song is far from the only one and far from the worst; I remember it because I thought it was actually quite well done, the way it mimics a Serbian peasant musical style from the region. War taunt music was something of an entire genre.) I am mentioning this so you better understand where I'm coming from when I loose insults - I forget that not everybody takes that sort of thing as lightly as I do.

    Replies: @Yevardian

    , @silviosilver
    @Yahya


    Have you watched the 2001 Bosnian comedy No Man’s Land?
     
    To answer this question: I thought I had because the name sounded familiar, but it turns out, no, I haven't. I'll give it a go.

    Wasn’t aware of Balkan migration to that country, or in Latin America more generally. I think only Ukrainians in Brazil are a prominent Slavic group.
     
    I wasn't aware either until about a decade ago. From the balkans, most of it is Croatian. There's apparently more Croats in Chile than in Australia, and there's certainly more than a few here.

    Quite a few Levantines in Argentina too, known locally as "turcos", because they arrived when it was still the Ottoman empire. One of them, Carlos Menem, became president.

    There's about as many Poles in Brazil as Ukrainians btw. If you search for "igreja ortodoxa" in southern Brazilians cities and then click on the pics on the ones that come up, then judging by the congregations, they're not going to remain recognizably Ukrainian for much longer.

    I’d say though my ability to listen to exotic music has improved considerably over time.
     
    Bossa nova used to sound exotic and weird - or just plain crap - to me when I first heard it. For one reason or another I went back it a few times and eventually developed a liking for it. I think it's great now. I've listened to all the classics and know the lyrics of about half a dozen by heart. (I can read Portuguese decently [non-fiction, anyway], but only understand maybe 5%-10% of some songs from listening, depending on the singer's diction. If I like a song, my habit is to look up the lyrics and use that as a way to increase my vocabulary.)

    With regards to Arabic music, I bet you’ve only listened to mainstream Arabic singers and musicians, though i’m curios to know which artists you were referring to.
     
    I don't know how mainstream they are, though I recognized the name Nancy Ajram that you mentioned. I just did some youtube searching for arabic music, from which I learned there was a talent show called Arab Idol, so I mainly listened to the selections with the most views, figuring they were probably the best (or at least best known) songs. The titles were in Arabic so I don't know the songs' names.

    Let me know if you like any of these.
     
    I couldn't really get into them, tbh. Some of them took like three minutes for the vocals to begin. I just don't have that kind of patience, lol. I prefer the ones I heard in the Arab Idol list, of which I probably max out at three songs in a row. Something like flamenco, which is another style I'm impressed by, but which also quickly exhausts me, I could probably take, say, 5 songs in a row max. And not a chance I could listen to any of those on repeat. In comparison, pop music in English, Serbo-Cro, Spanish or Portuguese, I can listen to for two or three hours straight, and if I like a song, I can easily listen to it ten or twenty times in a row.

    Replies: @YetAnotherAnon

  116. It was Iran that caused Israel to talk about supplying weapons to Ukraine. In its article, Military Monitoring writes about a meeting held between the Israeli ambassador in Moscow – Mr. Alexander Ben Zvi, and the deputy head of the Russian diplomatic service, Mr. Mikhail Bogdanov.

    Israel has issued an ultimatum to Russia: if Moscow does not stop buying Iranian weapons, be it drones or missiles, Jerusalem will seriously consider supplying Kyiv with high-precision ballistic missiles. The Israeli media also wrote about this ultimatum, and in an extended material, the topic was touched on by the Israeli TV channel Kan-11.

    A source from the Israeli Ministry of Foreign Affairs also spoke about the same. According to him, says Military Monitoring, the head of Israel’s Security Council, Mr. Eyal Hulata, issued the same warning to his Russian counterparts.

    https://bulgarianmilitary.com/2022/11/22/israel-to-russia-well-supply-ballistic-missiles-to-ukraine-if/

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @sudden death


    Israel has issued an ultimatum to Russia: if Moscow does not stop buying Iranian weapons, be it drones or missiles, Jerusalem will seriously consider supplying Kyiv with high-precision ballistic missiles.
     
    That would be useful for Russia and bad for Israel. So far, the RF studiously avoided hitting Israeli targets in Syrian war. This would mean the end of this inconvenient restraint. Emboldened Syria might even fulfill the UN resolution and take back the Golan Heights.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Beckow, @silviosilver

    , @A123
    @sudden death


    the Israeli ambassador in Moscow – Mr. Alexander Ben Zvi
     
    The ambassador is regurgitating last second, non-policy, pronunciations promulgated by lame duck Lapid. He may be a career type that has no choice but to do so.

    head of Israel’s Security Council, Mr. Eyal Hulata
     
    Do you mean FORMER head? He has already jumped ship: (1)

    Israeli National Security Adviser Eyal Hulata has resigned from his post, according to a report Friday by Israel’s KAN 11 News public broadcaster.

    Hulata informed caretaker Prime Minister Yair Lapid that his resignation will take effect upon the formation of the new government to be headed by Likud chair Benjamin Netanyahu.
     
    There is no chance of any major change in Israel-Ukraine policy before Netanyahu's administration gets fully up to speed.

    Bottom line is that Netanyahu values good relations with Putin. The errors of the Bennett & Lapid past are going to be jettisoned. Hopefully within weeks, though Israel has its own deep state issues.

    • Netanyahu's defense against sociopath Khamenei's aggression is greatly aided by keeping Russia neutral/friendly.
    • Putin & Assad have a huge problem with Erdogan: (1)

    Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan is again threatening to imminently launch a major ground operation in northern Syria to root out Kurdish "terrorist" groups, following the November 13 bombing in central Istanbul which killed six people. The Turkish government quickly blamed the outlawed PKK and affiliate groups operating across the border in Syria.

    The weekend saw Turkish warplanes conduct dozens of 'retaliatory' strikes across Kurdish regions of northern Syria and Iraq. Ankara declared that 89 targets with alleged links to the PKK and Syrian YPG were destroyed.
    ...
    Russia has meanwhile warned against a new Turkish incursion into Syria. "We understand and respect Turkey’s concerns about ensuring its own security. We believe this is Turkey’s legitimate right," a fresh statement from Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov said. "At the same time, we call on all parties to refrain from steps that could lead to the destabilization of the overall situation," he added.
     
    Both Putin and Netanyahu have realpolitik motivations to improve relations.

    The idea that Netanyahu will betray Israel's national interests to support the highly offensive Zelensky is ludicrous.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.jewishpress.com/news/israel/government-israel/eyal-hulata-resigns-as-national-security-council-adviser/2022/11/05/

    (2) https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/erdogan-threatens-large-syria-ground-operation-soon-possible
  117. @sudden death

    It was Iran that caused Israel to talk about supplying weapons to Ukraine. In its article, Military Monitoring writes about a meeting held between the Israeli ambassador in Moscow – Mr. Alexander Ben Zvi, and the deputy head of the Russian diplomatic service, Mr. Mikhail Bogdanov.

    Israel has issued an ultimatum to Russia: if Moscow does not stop buying Iranian weapons, be it drones or missiles, Jerusalem will seriously consider supplying Kyiv with high-precision ballistic missiles. The Israeli media also wrote about this ultimatum, and in an extended material, the topic was touched on by the Israeli TV channel Kan-11.

    A source from the Israeli Ministry of Foreign Affairs also spoke about the same. According to him, says Military Monitoring, the head of Israel’s Security Council, Mr. Eyal Hulata, issued the same warning to his Russian counterparts.
     
    https://bulgarianmilitary.com/2022/11/22/israel-to-russia-well-supply-ballistic-missiles-to-ukraine-if/

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @A123

    Israel has issued an ultimatum to Russia: if Moscow does not stop buying Iranian weapons, be it drones or missiles, Jerusalem will seriously consider supplying Kyiv with high-precision ballistic missiles.

    That would be useful for Russia and bad for Israel. So far, the RF studiously avoided hitting Israeli targets in Syrian war. This would mean the end of this inconvenient restraint. Emboldened Syria might even fulfill the UN resolution and take back the Golan Heights.

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @AnonfromTN

    The thing about fighting Israel is those mother fu**ers will use their nukes with minimal provocation.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @LatW

    , @Beckow
    @AnonfromTN

    It would lead to combining of the different fronts and a more real world war. Countries are being pressured to choose sides. That will make a compromised half-way solution much harder.

    If we end up with a war to the bloody end, Ukraine will simply be destroyed. It will loose too much of its population and could become uninhabitable. Eastern Europe will return to its historical place as a fought-over borderlands with wealth escaping and nobody investing. Western Europe will tremble in its boots, permanently scared of what can come from the east and of its across-the-Atlantic masters. Migrants will pour in because the southern regions will economically collapse.

    There was a simple compromise: no Nato and normal rights for Russians in Ukraine. Can someone explain why was that such a hard thing to agree for Kiev-Washington? And they talk about Russia's guilt, confusing causes and consequences, the simpletons here eat it up. Because "war" is such a strong, scary word.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    , @silviosilver
    @AnonfromTN


    Emboldened Syria might even fulfill the UN resolution and take back the Golan Heights.
     
    Given your record in prophesying military outcomes, this comment has to be the kiss of death for Arab hopes in the region.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  118. @AnonfromTN
    @sudden death


    Israel has issued an ultimatum to Russia: if Moscow does not stop buying Iranian weapons, be it drones or missiles, Jerusalem will seriously consider supplying Kyiv with high-precision ballistic missiles.
     
    That would be useful for Russia and bad for Israel. So far, the RF studiously avoided hitting Israeli targets in Syrian war. This would mean the end of this inconvenient restraint. Emboldened Syria might even fulfill the UN resolution and take back the Golan Heights.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Beckow, @silviosilver

    The thing about fighting Israel is those mother fu**ers will use their nukes with minimal provocation.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    The thing about fighting Israel is those mother fu**ers will use their nukes with minimal provocation.
     
    You grossly underestimate their cowardice. They talk tough but run for cover with their tail between their legs even when no one attacks them. The times of Israeli military superiority are over, and deep down they know that.

    Replies: @Matra

    , @LatW
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    with minimal provocation
     
    If Russia helps Iran with their nuclear program, then Israel will consider this a major provocation.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  119. @AnonfromTN
    @sudden death


    Israel has issued an ultimatum to Russia: if Moscow does not stop buying Iranian weapons, be it drones or missiles, Jerusalem will seriously consider supplying Kyiv with high-precision ballistic missiles.
     
    That would be useful for Russia and bad for Israel. So far, the RF studiously avoided hitting Israeli targets in Syrian war. This would mean the end of this inconvenient restraint. Emboldened Syria might even fulfill the UN resolution and take back the Golan Heights.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Beckow, @silviosilver

    It would lead to combining of the different fronts and a more real world war. Countries are being pressured to choose sides. That will make a compromised half-way solution much harder.

    If we end up with a war to the bloody end, Ukraine will simply be destroyed. It will loose too much of its population and could become uninhabitable. Eastern Europe will return to its historical place as a fought-over borderlands with wealth escaping and nobody investing. Western Europe will tremble in its boots, permanently scared of what can come from the east and of its across-the-Atlantic masters. Migrants will pour in because the southern regions will economically collapse.

    There was a simple compromise: no Nato and normal rights for Russians in Ukraine. Can someone explain why was that such a hard thing to agree for Kiev-Washington? And they talk about Russia’s guilt, confusing causes and consequences, the simpletons here eat it up. Because “war” is such a strong, scary word.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Beckow


    There was a simple compromise: no Nato and normal rights for Russians in Ukraine.
     
    That was possible early this year. This would have prevented the war. But once started, the war brings its own dynamic. I don’t think it can be ended now without kicking the puppets out of Kiev and kicking the empire and its sidekicks out of Ukraine (this is essentially the same thing). I strongly suspect that an attempt to end this war on conditions that were acceptable before it started would cost Putin and his coterie power. He is smart enough to understand that. Official statements by the Kremlin that the war is not about regime change are pure subterfuge: they are confident that as the empire does not give a hoot about how many Ukrainians die, it won’t allow its puppets seek compromise.

    Replies: @Beckow

  120. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @AnonfromTN

    The thing about fighting Israel is those mother fu**ers will use their nukes with minimal provocation.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @LatW

    The thing about fighting Israel is those mother fu**ers will use their nukes with minimal provocation.

    You grossly underestimate their cowardice. They talk tough but run for cover with their tail between their legs even when no one attacks them. The times of Israeli military superiority are over, and deep down they know that.

    • Replies: @Matra
    @AnonfromTN

    Israel shot down a Russian surveillance plane killing 15 servicemen over Syria whilst attacking Russia's ally. Russia did nothing.

    Replies: @A123

  121. @Beckow
    @AnonfromTN

    It would lead to combining of the different fronts and a more real world war. Countries are being pressured to choose sides. That will make a compromised half-way solution much harder.

    If we end up with a war to the bloody end, Ukraine will simply be destroyed. It will loose too much of its population and could become uninhabitable. Eastern Europe will return to its historical place as a fought-over borderlands with wealth escaping and nobody investing. Western Europe will tremble in its boots, permanently scared of what can come from the east and of its across-the-Atlantic masters. Migrants will pour in because the southern regions will economically collapse.

    There was a simple compromise: no Nato and normal rights for Russians in Ukraine. Can someone explain why was that such a hard thing to agree for Kiev-Washington? And they talk about Russia's guilt, confusing causes and consequences, the simpletons here eat it up. Because "war" is such a strong, scary word.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    There was a simple compromise: no Nato and normal rights for Russians in Ukraine.

    That was possible early this year. This would have prevented the war. But once started, the war brings its own dynamic. I don’t think it can be ended now without kicking the puppets out of Kiev and kicking the empire and its sidekicks out of Ukraine (this is essentially the same thing). I strongly suspect that an attempt to end this war on conditions that were acceptable before it started would cost Putin and his coterie power. He is smart enough to understand that. Official statements by the Kremlin that the war is not about regime change are pure subterfuge: they are confident that as the empire does not give a hoot about how many Ukrainians die, it won’t allow its puppets seek compromise.

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @AnonfromTN


    ...I strongly suspect that an attempt to end this war on conditions that were acceptable before it started would cost Putin and his coterie power. He is smart enough to understand that.
     
    Probably true, the West fatally misread Putin and his coterie - they are the moderates, they were the ones to make a deal with. The desire to dramatize and demonize Putin, to create a Hitlerian emotional enemy has backfired.

    The only way Kiev-West can still get something like the pre-February deal is by over-performing in the war. That means they have to mindlessly escalate until they hit the wall. Again a catastrophic miscalculation: when a hurricane is offshore you don't go and pee into it and celebrate how brave and successful you are, you get out of there.

    But these are simple minds driven by petty emotions and immediate rewards. A key component of high intelligence is to be able to anticipate - the simpletons in charge of the West seem to have no ability to think two-three steps ahead. They may take all of us down with them.
  122. @LatW
    @A123


    The question I was getting at is, “Who is setting up the actual missile flight/target plan?”
     
    What proof do you have that it is not the Ukrainians themselves? Where is this assumption coming from?

    Replies: @A123

    The question I was getting at is, “Who is setting up the actual missile flight/target plan?”

    What proof do you have that it is not the Ukrainians themselves? Where is this assumption coming from?

    It is quite believable that Ukraine is running 100% independent units with 6 pack MLRS (~35km range). That is not dissimilar to conventional artillery in plan and use.

    The more exotic and expensive ammunition packages (ATACMS or PrSM) are much more complex. The longer range attacks seem to have very good intelligence on where things are, both targets and missile defense systems, well behind enemy limes.

    • Do you have any proof that Ukraine has the ability to perform such reconnaissance?
    • Can you think of several intelligence agency’s associated Europe that do?
    • How about the European Empire’s coup regime across the Atlantic?

    Chances of proving this either way are quite slim. The European Empire, for obvious reasons of deniability, is caught between maximum aggression and minimum disclosure. However, it would be unsurprising to learn that the Paris-Berlin axis is running a good portion of Zelensky’s long range strike packages.

    Do you have any evidence that I am wrong?

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @LatW
    @A123


    Do you have any evidence that I am wrong?
     
    I'm just trying to figure it out. This info will not be publicly available (in order to protect the troops). It is no secret that some reconnaissance assistance is provided. But the targeting is managed from the UA Headquarters with Ukrainians in charge.

    Replies: @A123

  123. @AnonfromTN
    @sudden death


    Israel has issued an ultimatum to Russia: if Moscow does not stop buying Iranian weapons, be it drones or missiles, Jerusalem will seriously consider supplying Kyiv with high-precision ballistic missiles.
     
    That would be useful for Russia and bad for Israel. So far, the RF studiously avoided hitting Israeli targets in Syrian war. This would mean the end of this inconvenient restraint. Emboldened Syria might even fulfill the UN resolution and take back the Golan Heights.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Beckow, @silviosilver

    Emboldened Syria might even fulfill the UN resolution and take back the Golan Heights.

    Given your record in prophesying military outcomes, this comment has to be the kiss of death for Arab hopes in the region.

    • LOL: A123
    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @silviosilver


    Given your record in prophesying military outcomes
     
    Let me remind you that military outcomes are only clear after the wars stop. Don’t count your chickens before they hatch.

    Replies: @silviosilver

  124. @silviosilver
    @AnonfromTN


    Emboldened Syria might even fulfill the UN resolution and take back the Golan Heights.
     
    Given your record in prophesying military outcomes, this comment has to be the kiss of death for Arab hopes in the region.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    Given your record in prophesying military outcomes

    Let me remind you that military outcomes are only clear after the wars stop. Don’t count your chickens before they hatch.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @AnonfromTN

    In that case, why not take your own advice?

  125. @AnonfromTN
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    The thing about fighting Israel is those mother fu**ers will use their nukes with minimal provocation.
     
    You grossly underestimate their cowardice. They talk tough but run for cover with their tail between their legs even when no one attacks them. The times of Israeli military superiority are over, and deep down they know that.

    Replies: @Matra

    Israel shot down a Russian surveillance plane killing 15 servicemen over Syria whilst attacking Russia’s ally. Russia did nothing.

    • Replies: @A123
    @Matra


    Israel shot down a Russian surveillance plane killing 15 servicemen over Syria whilst attacking Russia’s ally. Russia did nothing.
     
    Syria shot down a plane killing 15 Russians. The PR operation failed to reassign blame. Israel did nothing. Add it to the long list of things that have gone wrong with anti-air systems.

    What goes up, must come down!

    If you are within 200 air miles of an anti-air launcher there is an (admittedly small) chance your ticket could be punched on any day. Mistakes and bad luck are part of combat operations. Sometimes civilians pay the price with absolutely no warning.

    PEACE 😇
  126. @AnonfromTN
    @silviosilver


    Given your record in prophesying military outcomes
     
    Let me remind you that military outcomes are only clear after the wars stop. Don’t count your chickens before they hatch.

    Replies: @silviosilver

    In that case, why not take your own advice?

    • Agree: Mikel
  127. @sudden death

    It was Iran that caused Israel to talk about supplying weapons to Ukraine. In its article, Military Monitoring writes about a meeting held between the Israeli ambassador in Moscow – Mr. Alexander Ben Zvi, and the deputy head of the Russian diplomatic service, Mr. Mikhail Bogdanov.

    Israel has issued an ultimatum to Russia: if Moscow does not stop buying Iranian weapons, be it drones or missiles, Jerusalem will seriously consider supplying Kyiv with high-precision ballistic missiles. The Israeli media also wrote about this ultimatum, and in an extended material, the topic was touched on by the Israeli TV channel Kan-11.

    A source from the Israeli Ministry of Foreign Affairs also spoke about the same. According to him, says Military Monitoring, the head of Israel’s Security Council, Mr. Eyal Hulata, issued the same warning to his Russian counterparts.
     
    https://bulgarianmilitary.com/2022/11/22/israel-to-russia-well-supply-ballistic-missiles-to-ukraine-if/

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @A123

    the Israeli ambassador in Moscow – Mr. Alexander Ben Zvi

    The ambassador is regurgitating last second, non-policy, pronunciations promulgated by lame duck Lapid. He may be a career type that has no choice but to do so.

    head of Israel’s Security Council, Mr. Eyal Hulata

    Do you mean FORMER head? He has already jumped ship: (1)

    Israeli National Security Adviser Eyal Hulata has resigned from his post, according to a report Friday by Israel’s KAN 11 News public broadcaster.

    Hulata informed caretaker Prime Minister Yair Lapid that his resignation will take effect upon the formation of the new government to be headed by Likud chair Benjamin Netanyahu.

    There is no chance of any major change in Israel-Ukraine policy before Netanyahu’s administration gets fully up to speed.

    Bottom line is that Netanyahu values good relations with Putin. The errors of the Bennett & Lapid past are going to be jettisoned. Hopefully within weeks, though Israel has its own deep state issues.

    • Netanyahu’s defense against sociopath Khamenei’s aggression is greatly aided by keeping Russia neutral/friendly.
    • Putin & Assad have a huge problem with Erdogan: (1)

    Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan is again threatening to imminently launch a major ground operation in northern Syria to root out Kurdish “terrorist” groups, following the November 13 bombing in central Istanbul which killed six people. The Turkish government quickly blamed the outlawed PKK and affiliate groups operating across the border in Syria.

    The weekend saw Turkish warplanes conduct dozens of ‘retaliatory’ strikes across Kurdish regions of northern Syria and Iraq. Ankara declared that 89 targets with alleged links to the PKK and Syrian YPG were destroyed.

    Russia has meanwhile warned against a new Turkish incursion into Syria. “We understand and respect Turkey’s concerns about ensuring its own security. We believe this is Turkey’s legitimate right,” a fresh statement from Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov said. “At the same time, we call on all parties to refrain from steps that could lead to the destabilization of the overall situation,” he added.

    Both Putin and Netanyahu have realpolitik motivations to improve relations.

    The idea that Netanyahu will betray Israel’s national interests to support the highly offensive Zelensky is ludicrous.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.jewishpress.com/news/israel/government-israel/eyal-hulata-resigns-as-national-security-council-adviser/2022/11/05/

    (2) https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/erdogan-threatens-large-syria-ground-operation-soon-possible

  128. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @AnonfromTN

    The thing about fighting Israel is those mother fu**ers will use their nukes with minimal provocation.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @LatW

    with minimal provocation

    If Russia helps Iran with their nuclear program, then Israel will consider this a major provocation.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @LatW


    If Russia helps Iran with their nuclear program, then Israel will consider this a major provocation.
     
    In fact, Iran is unlikely to need any help with that. They are progressing despite numerous acts of sabotage by the usual suspects.

    Now that only jungle rules remain in international relations Iran will likely heed the example of NK: having nukes is the only guarantee that some bandits do not attack you (to promote democracy, no doubt).

    Replies: @sudden death

  129. @showmethereal
    @Yahya

    Actually you have to have fairly high intelligence to be good at football. In a fluid game with constant changes - it requires not just intelligence - but also patience and concentration. Our athleticism does not win a football match. Beating Argentina is actually a huge accomplishment

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Yahya

    Actually you have to have fairly high intelligence to be good at football.

    If that were true, then East Asians would dominate the World Cup (which they don’t, quite the opposite), and blacks would not be over represented in European teams.

    Football players don’t seem that bright to me. Being a manager seems to be g-loaded though.

    • Replies: @Mikel
    @Yahya


    Football players don’t seem that bright to me.
     
    I would even argue that a negative correlation exists between excellence at soccer and general IQ. But soccer does require good visual and spatial-temporal skills, which may explain showmethereal's observation.

    I've only watched the US match so far and they're definitely getting better, btw, in spite of the disappointing score. With all the money and potential talent available, the US should eventually become one of the big teams.

    Replies: @Yevardian, @showmethereal

    , @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @Yahya

    Japan and SK are ok, about the same level as Middle Eastern teams. The fact that PRC is so bad points to a certain defect. Both the other two superpowers, US and Russia, don't really care about soccer, but put together respectable teams. And unlike India, China produces world class weightlifters and sprinters.

    Soccer requires creativity and flair which EAs lack. I think that's the main reason.

    Replies: @showmethereal, @Yahya

    , @showmethereal
    @Yahya

    East Asians lack the overall athleticism. So that’s not a good analysis. The best black players tend to be the smarter ones also. And teams require all sorts. You need a combination of things.

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

  130. @Matra
    @AnonfromTN

    Israel shot down a Russian surveillance plane killing 15 servicemen over Syria whilst attacking Russia's ally. Russia did nothing.

    Replies: @A123

    Israel shot down a Russian surveillance plane killing 15 servicemen over Syria whilst attacking Russia’s ally. Russia did nothing.

    Syria shot down a plane killing 15 Russians. The PR operation failed to reassign blame. Israel did nothing. Add it to the long list of things that have gone wrong with anti-air systems.

    What goes up, must come down!

    If you are within 200 air miles of an anti-air launcher there is an (admittedly small) chance your ticket could be punched on any day. Mistakes and bad luck are part of combat operations. Sometimes civilians pay the price with absolutely no warning.

    PEACE 😇

  131. @Yahya
    @silviosilver


    Are you actually a tango fan?
     
    Not really tbh. I only mentioned Piazolla because he's the first thing that came to mind. In Latin America I only listen to classical music, which is mostly produced by Brazil. Even then I much prefer European classical music, which is obviously deeper and more sophisticated. Still, this piece by an obscure mestiza Brazilian composer is sublime, I find myself listening to it often:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GDfyFrtI7mM&ab_channel=sonhosesons


    Have you seen the 1998 movie Tango by Carlos Saura?
     
    No. I will watch it though and possibly write an opinion in my next round of film reviews if it is interesting.

    Have you watched the 2001 Bosnian comedy No Man's Land? I watched it twice; loved it the first time, but downgraded to an 8/10 the second time due to poor acting and some corny dialogue. But if you haven't seen it yet I'd recommend it. It's fairly even-handed so you need not worry about Serb-bashing or petty nationalism, movie seems to satirize all sides including the UN.


    It could just be that Argentina has always been my favorite Latin American country
     
    Brazil would be mine, I like how chaotic and crazy the country is. Also the relatively large number of Arabs is a plus too :). Though I will always respect Argentina for producing such an interesting writer as Borges (whose non-fiction I much prefer to his fiction; much like Orwell). Latin America in general is an interesting region, though tbh almost every major geographic sphere interests me, except perhaps sub-Saharan Africa due to a lack of high culture, and to a lesser extent Southeast Asia.

    Interesting that you have family in Argentina. Wasn't aware of Balkan migration to that country, or in Latin America more generally. I think only Ukrainians in Brazil are a prominent Slavic group.


    Nowadays, it’s like Arab music to me: I think it’s good, but I can only take so much before it starts sounding samey and wears me out.
     
    I can see where you're coming from, I like and appreciate the artistic skill of some Japanese Koto or Indian Raja practitioners; but I can only listen to so much for a period of time. I'd say though my ability to listen to exotic music has improved considerably over time. Previously I couldn't stand to venture out of my comfort zone; that is Arabic and Western music (the former I felt comfortable with because it's my native tradition, the other because of its ubiquity and consequent familiarity). The key turning point was when I realized that skill in music is universal, and not every piece of music required a piano or violin to be sophisticated. Even if I still struggle to listen to certain musical categories, I appreciate the artistic value of any classical tradition, and rejoice in any composition that doesn't fall under the mechanical, artificial, synthesizer-based "music" category which seems to have taken over every corner of the globe.

    With regards to Arabic music, I bet you've only listened to mainstream Arabic singers and musicians, though i'm curios to know which artists you were referring to. There's a whole world of obscure Arabic singers, orchestras, ensembles and composers who are ten times more skilled than known quantities like Abdel-Halim Hafez, Fairouz, and god forbid Nancy Ajram etc. but you have to search for them hard. One of the key strengths of the Western music ecosystem is that there's a certain level of organization which allows classical composers to remain (semi)prominent long after they die. In the Arab world, no such system exists so talented composers get lost in a deep void, though some pieces in the repertoire do live on.

    Anyway, recommending music is a fool's errand since musical tastes differ so much. But I can't help but make just a few (if you are interested in a more comprehensive list, see my reply to Dmitry here: https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-194/#comment-5497541)

    1) Ask El-Atash (اسق العطاش)

    This is a Sufi Muwashshah (a multi-lined strophic verse poem written in classical Arabic) called “Ask El-Atash” (اسق العطاش) or alternatively “Hayamatni” (هيمتني), which originated in Aleppo, Syria in the year 1190 in the Islamic calendar, or 1776 AD in the Gregorian calendar. In that year the rain was scarce and the people of Aleppo started praying for Allah (صلاة ودعاء الإستسقاء) to bring them rain.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A-M09-6hcvs&t=132s&ab_channel=OrninaSyrianOrchestra%D8%A3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%83%D8%B3%D8%AA%D8%B1%D8%A7%D8%A3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%86%D9%8A%D9%86%D8%A7%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%B3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%8A%D8%A9

    The above link is my favorite rendition of that song by Rasha Rizk and the Ornina Syrian Orchestra. But there's 5-6 more renditions on YouTube, though usually abridged. Two good ones include:

    Sabah Fakhry (Syrian): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eI0Gs2l21D0&t=1065s&ab_channel=AliAdiga%F0%9F%87%B8%F0%9F%87%BE%F0%9F%87%B8%F0%9F%87%BE

    Lubna Al-Quntar (Syrian): (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JWjYXYYIZ24&ab_channel=OrninaSyrianOrchestra%D8%A3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%83%D8%B3%D8%AA%D8%B1%D8%A7%D8%A3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%86%D9%8A%D9%86%D8%A7%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%B3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%8A%D8%A9)

    I gave the others in this post here: https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-194/#comment-5500139

    2) Ya Msafer Wahdak (يا مسافر وحدك)

    This is an Egyptian classical song, composed by the prolific Muhammad Abdel-Wahab, and arranged here by a talented Palestinian from Nazareth (a surprisingly artistic town), Nizar Al-Khater (highly recommend checking out his other works).

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QdOcTFX6vm0&list=RDQdOcTFX6vm0&start_radio=1&ab_channel=TheGaryBertiniIsraeliChoir%7C%D7%9E%D7%A7%D7%94%D7%9C%D7%AA%D7%91%D7%A8%D7%AA%D7%99%D7%A0%D7%99

    The choir is Israeli, looks to be primarily Ashkenazim, and the lead vocalist is a Lebanese Christian, Marie Jubran. So here you have a song composed by a Muslim, performed by Jews, and sung by a Christian. Whoever said the sons of Abraham can't get along with each other?

    3) Ahla Wa Sahla (أهلا وسهلا)

    Arabic music typically has an accurate reputation for sounding strange, depressing and melancholic. But that's because most people only listen to Arabic music from the Middle Eastern portion of the Arab world. In the Maghreb where people are more jovial, the music is much more upbeat (major scale in musicspeak). This is my favorite song from the bonhomie Algerian Jewish maestro Maurice El-Medioni:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lb2EyWjImXw&ab_channel=OLAMALE1

    On a technical level, he's probably not the best Maghrebi composer, but I love his melodies, they rarely fail to captivate me. If you like his style I recommend listening to the other Big 3 of Algerian Classical Music: Mustapha Skandarani, Mohamed Iguerbouchen, Mohammed Weld El Kourd. Anouar Brahem from Tunisia is also top-notch, though his style is different from the former composers.

    4) En Rah Minak Ya Ein (ان راح منك يا عين)

    This is a song from the Golden Age of Egyptian Cinema, originally composed for Shadia. Sounds similar to a Tango, but the Arabic elements predominate. There's a piano in there which is quite rare for a classical Egyptian songs.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iSgvZ4GhB40&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=6&ab_channel=%D9%86%D9%88%D8%A7%D8%AF%D8%B1%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%88%D8%A7%D8%A6%D8%B9%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%B1%D8%A7%D8%A6%D8%B9%D8%A9%D8%B4%D8%A7%D8%AF%D9%8A%D8%A9

    There's some nice modernized renditions by a couple of Levantine singer:

    Lara Elayyan (Jordanian): (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vVgtSgwYx80&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=146&ab_channel=%D9%84%D8%A7%D8%B1%D8%A7%D8%B9%D9%84%D9%8A%D8%A7%D9%86LaraElayyan)

    Nano Reis (Syrian): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o09k-jihU_E&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=145&ab_channel=mathfun2002

    The instrumentalists in the background of the last video are top-quality composers in their own right: Bassem Saba (Lebanese) and Simon Shaheen (Palestinian Christian). Recommend checking out their work too if you like this style.

    5) Palestinian Folklore

    A compilation of folklore by Nazerene folk singer Dalal Abu Amneh, who could very well have Balkan ancestry as indicated by her blonde hair and blue eyes. She utilizes a melismatic singing style common to traditional Arabic music (and also Celtic music); which can often times feel kitschy if done wrong but here is well executed:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jKACz8iX2mk&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=184&ab_channel=DalalAbuAmneh-%D8%AF%D9%84%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%A3%D8%A8%D9%88%D8%A2%D9%85%D9%86%D8%A9

    Let me know if you like any of these.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @silviosilver

    It’s fairly even-handed so you need not worry about Serb-bashing or petty nationalism

    I’ll reply to the rest of your post later, but just quickly on this, lol, I am the last person who’d ever get offended by that. In the war years, there was this Croatian song “Oj Srbine, jebem ti tri prsta”, best rendered in English as “Oi Serbo, fuck you and your three fingers” (3 fingers referring to the three fingers orthodox worshipers use to cross themselves, but also sometimes flashed as an orthodox “gang sign” lol, well, more like WWII’s “v for victory” salute, made famous by Churchill). The lyrics are intended to taunt and maximally insult, but I can listen to something like that and laugh no problem. (This song is far from the only one and far from the worst; I remember it because I thought it was actually quite well done, the way it mimics a Serbian peasant musical style from the region. War taunt music was something of an entire genre.) I am mentioning this so you better understand where I’m coming from when I loose insults – I forget that not everybody takes that sort of thing as lightly as I do.

    • Replies: @Yevardian
    @silviosilver

    I remember going through a phase of listening to Serbian 'turbofolk, some extremely 'powerful' lyrics and musicvideos, though my impression was that only Roki Vulavic had genuine talent as singer.
    Probably you've heard of these already, but others might be interested in them as a curio.
    I wonder what the Croatian side of that genre looks like.



    Pretty poor musically, but nice visuals:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q0I-XGTzfhg

    Attacking Bosnian Muslims, quite catchy in trashy way:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tFDpo62eqwU

    Generic cheesy 80's pop, except for the lyrics:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KifJ6J3KmWg

    Vulavic, instrumentation is midi-tier quality, but you can hear unlike the others he can actually sing:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qeAEdU4p5Cg

    Roki Again:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jKyWihLG2-8

    I like how when walking around a forest Vulavic wears a suit, whilst in the city he wears camoflage:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hxPaxFD0ar8

    Serbian military superiority over the Americans:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=333OVHhpK5c

    Backing track sounds like it belongs to 90s RTS videogame:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mY0MzNK6KqA

    On Serbian music in general, I quite like this sort of stuff too. I noticed that this particular 'operatic' (though totally unlike classical Italian-derived opera singing, I don't know what else to call it?) vocal styling is very characteristic of Greek music too, though you don't hear it much in Romanian traditional music, and I've never heard this style in non-Balkan Slavic countries.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WcE8Rrzfeio

    Replies: @Yevardian, @silviosilver

  132. @LatW
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    with minimal provocation
     
    If Russia helps Iran with their nuclear program, then Israel will consider this a major provocation.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    If Russia helps Iran with their nuclear program, then Israel will consider this a major provocation.

    In fact, Iran is unlikely to need any help with that. They are progressing despite numerous acts of sabotage by the usual suspects.

    Now that only jungle rules remain in international relations Iran will likely heed the example of NK: having nukes is the only guarantee that some bandits do not attack you (to promote democracy, no doubt).

    • Replies: @sudden death
    @AnonfromTN


    having nukes is the only guarantee that some bandits do not attack you
     
    Ukraine wholeheartedly agrees with this take;)
  133. @AnonfromTN
    @LatW


    If Russia helps Iran with their nuclear program, then Israel will consider this a major provocation.
     
    In fact, Iran is unlikely to need any help with that. They are progressing despite numerous acts of sabotage by the usual suspects.

    Now that only jungle rules remain in international relations Iran will likely heed the example of NK: having nukes is the only guarantee that some bandits do not attack you (to promote democracy, no doubt).

    Replies: @sudden death

    having nukes is the only guarantee that some bandits do not attack you

    Ukraine wholeheartedly agrees with this take;)

  134. @A123
    @LatW



    The question I was getting at is, “Who is setting up the actual missile flight/target plan?”
     
    What proof do you have that it is not the Ukrainians themselves? Where is this assumption coming from?
     
    It is quite believable that Ukraine is running 100% independent units with 6 pack MLRS (~35km range). That is not dissimilar to conventional artillery in plan and use.

    The more exotic and expensive ammunition packages (ATACMS or PrSM) are much more complex. The longer range attacks seem to have very good intelligence on where things are, both targets and missile defense systems, well behind enemy limes.

    • Do you have any proof that Ukraine has the ability to perform such reconnaissance?
    • Can you think of several intelligence agency's associated Europe that do?
    • How about the European Empire's coup regime across the Atlantic?

    Chances of proving this either way are quite slim. The European Empire, for obvious reasons of deniability, is caught between maximum aggression and minimum disclosure. However, it would be unsurprising to learn that the Paris-Berlin axis is running a good portion of Zelensky's long range strike packages.

    Do you have any evidence that I am wrong?

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @LatW

    Do you have any evidence that I am wrong?

    I’m just trying to figure it out. This info will not be publicly available (in order to protect the troops). It is no secret that some reconnaissance assistance is provided. But the targeting is managed from the UA Headquarters with Ukrainians in charge.

    • Replies: @A123
    @LatW


    no secret that some reconnaissance assistance is provided. But the targeting is managed from the UA Headquarters with Ukrainians in charge.
     
    Is the Paris based organization providing "some reconnaissance assistance" giving over everything? Or, could they be selectively offering up details that lead to their desired outcome?

    It is a life-or-death version of Magician's Choice. The party that controls the information strongly influences the mission selection.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @LatW

  135. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Mikel


    On the other hand, if you really need some sort of high after exposure to the elements what I would recommend is a CBD bath bomb, available on the internet. It’s becoming increasingly popular among outdoor sports people. Makes you sweat, relax and calm any pains.
     
    Now this is why the comments section is the best part of the internet.

    I have a friend with 3 cats and 2 dogs and their hack for chills is sleeping with the animals on the bed. Yikes. Dogs are great but they eat shit.

    Replies: @Barbarossa, @dogbumbreath

    sleeping with the animals on the bed

    I have a decent number of animals around but my rule is no way in hell are dogs in my bedroom, especially not in my bed. Gross and it ruins the ambiance.
    Cats are sometimes unavoidable on the bed it seems, as they creep in like a water leak, and as long as they stay by the foot of the bed we can keep a truce.
    However, and this only generally happens once, a cat will think it’s a good idea to sleep near or on my head and purr at 1AM. I’m a heavy sleeper and I get pretty grumpy if I’m awakened, so the cat ends up taking an unceremonious flight across the room. Like I said, it’s generally not repeated, which is best for all parties involved.

  136. @silviosilver
    @Yahya


    That stopped at about the time he started reading books at age 17-18.
     
    You really weren't much of a reader before that?

    I used to be a huge soccer fan, but I find it intolerably boring nowadays. I'll probably watch a game or two, or maybe just the last 20 minutes of a couple. The results don't really interest me either, but I would definitely consider it a massive disappointment if an African team won it (well, that's already happened, in a sense, but I mean a 100% Afro team from an African country).

    Sport is more than mere frivolity though. Sport is a mark of civilization - of the kind of civilization I prefer, anyway. It teaches participants the value of a long-term outlook and helps ingrain habits of preparation, training, coping with and overcoming adversity, self-improvement, ultimately enabling them to enjoy the fruits of their efforts. I would rather have youth devoting its time to mastering the art of "kicking a ball around" than loitering on street corners, harassing civilians, consuming drugs and porn, worshiping trashy celebrities and wasting their lives in a myriad other short-term pursuits. They can't all be scholars and artists, after all.

    Replies: @Yahya, @showmethereal, @Barbarossa

    Sport is more than mere frivolity though.

    I’d say that there is a big difference between playing sports and watching sports. The latter has little redeeming value while the former has a number of good attributes.

    • Agree: showmethereal
    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Barbarossa


    I’d say that there is a big difference between playing sports and watching sports.
     
    Pretty much the same difference as between having sex and watching porn.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    , @songbird
    @Barbarossa

    It is remarkable how woke the NHL has become.

    Has to be the most blue-collar professional league in America in terms of fans. The core demographic of players, though shifted, is still fairly Euro, so one would think that there is not much sensitivity, for tranny stuff to latch onto.

    IMO, it serves as an interesting example, about the woke dynamic. Somewhat ignorantly and tentatively, I would suggest that perhaps, it has something to do with the owners, and/or perhaps the regime. (And one can extrapolate to other organizations.)

    https://twitter.com/NHL/status/1595070878127034369?s=20&t=842CYNjs6QV3ZDjvyPPwFA

    Of course, there was this story out of Ukraine a while back, which, IMO, seems to hint more specifically at the regime than anything else:
    https://www.cbssports.com/nhl/news/andrei-deniskin-suspended-for-racist-gesture-towards-black-american-hockey-player/

  137. @Barbarossa
    @silviosilver


    Sport is more than mere frivolity though.

     

    I'd say that there is a big difference between playing sports and watching sports. The latter has little redeeming value while the former has a number of good attributes.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @songbird

    I’d say that there is a big difference between playing sports and watching sports.

    Pretty much the same difference as between having sex and watching porn.

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @AnonfromTN

    You guys didn't have any fun watching Conner McGregor's leg go snap?

    My favorite spectator sports moment of the last ten years I didn't even see. It was at the very end of the Chiefs-49er's Super Bowl and the 49er's had the ball 1st and ten on their own 20, behind by 4, 2 minutes left.

    I was listening on 49er's radio and Grep Popa had the greatest jinx commentary ever.

    "This is the exact situation Joe Montana was in the night he played himself into the Hall of Fame."

    By chain of accidents Garopalo is still the 49er's quarterback and he is having a great season. I still wonder if he ever heard about the Popa commenary.

  138. @LatW
    @A123


    Do you have any evidence that I am wrong?
     
    I'm just trying to figure it out. This info will not be publicly available (in order to protect the troops). It is no secret that some reconnaissance assistance is provided. But the targeting is managed from the UA Headquarters with Ukrainians in charge.

    Replies: @A123

    no secret that some reconnaissance assistance is provided. But the targeting is managed from the UA Headquarters with Ukrainians in charge.

    Is the Paris based organization providing “some reconnaissance assistance” giving over everything? Or, could they be selectively offering up details that lead to their desired outcome?

    It is a life-or-death version of Magician’s Choice. The party that controls the information strongly influences the mission selection.

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @LatW
    @A123

    Look, they're in their own country which they know the best. The targets that were hit made military sense.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @A123

  139. @A123
    @LatW


    no secret that some reconnaissance assistance is provided. But the targeting is managed from the UA Headquarters with Ukrainians in charge.
     
    Is the Paris based organization providing "some reconnaissance assistance" giving over everything? Or, could they be selectively offering up details that lead to their desired outcome?

    It is a life-or-death version of Magician's Choice. The party that controls the information strongly influences the mission selection.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @LatW

    Look, they’re in their own country which they know the best. The targets that were hit made military sense.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @LatW


    The targets that were hit made military sense.
     
    Do you mean such targets as Polish tractor, Romanian jet and helo, and some place in Zagreb?
    , @A123
    @LatW


    Look, they’re in their own country which they know the best. The targets that were hit made military sense.
     
    I kindly refer the gentleman to the explanation I provided some moments ago.

    It is quite believable that Ukraine is running 100% independent units with 6 pack MLRS (~35km range). That is not dissimilar to conventional artillery in plan and use.
     
    They probably are independently targeting strikes in "their own country which they know" at short range over their offensive lines. I have already made this point. Why do you need me to make it again?
    ___

    Now that we have disposed of that once and for all, let us return to the actual issue at hand.

    The more exotic and expensive ammunition packages (ATACMS or PrSM) are much more complex. The longer range attacks seem to have very good intelligence on where things are, both targets and missile defense systems, well behind enemy lines.
     
    The European Empire is required as a participant in making long range strikes successful. For example, those into Russia itself. I am not sure why why you are dodging this relatively straight forward relationship between EU Intelligence Agencies and the Kiev regime.

    Is it hard to believe that French intelligence is shaping Ukrainian strikes by selectively sharing details that support their desired outcome?

    If you assert this relationship does not & cannot exist, the burden of proof is yours.

    PEACE 😇
  140. @LatW
    @A123

    Look, they're in their own country which they know the best. The targets that were hit made military sense.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @A123

    The targets that were hit made military sense.

    Do you mean such targets as Polish tractor, Romanian jet and helo, and some place in Zagreb?

  141. @Coconuts
    @showmethereal


    So when did all this white solidarity happen???
     
    Afaik it comes from the US mainly where there was a legal category of 'white' which came to include all Europeans (and some latinos, people from the Middle East etc.)

    Progressives have done a lot to propagate it and spread it outside the US. Speaking of Rhodes, there might have been something similar in South Africa.

    Replies: @songbird

    Afaik it comes from the US mainly where there was a legal category of ‘white’ which came to include all Europeans (and some latinos, people from the Middle East etc.)

    Don’t know if it is really correct, but I heard that the term “white” was basically a technology invented in order to organize and take on the Injun. If so, I think it could probably be considered to be dangerously obsolete.

    [MORE]

    This is one reason that I am a critic of the term and believe “Euro” or “European” is far superior.

    Indians had:
    1.) small numbers (and no ability to draw on huge reserves)
    2.) high disease susceptibility
    3.) no potential for crypsis
    4.) not very high verbal IQ
    5.) the horse as their greatest mode of mobility and communication
    6.) not much possibility of forming alliances with other non-white ethnic groups.
    7.) tribal organization only, no nation-states promoting their genetic interests.
    8) many were essentially hunter gatherers, only sowing snatch crops. Not urban dwellers. Cities probably were kind of deadly to them.

    Am sure one could come up with additional points, but, in short, with all due respect to Injuns, they were greatly outmatched.

  142. @LatW
    @A123

    Look, they're in their own country which they know the best. The targets that were hit made military sense.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @A123

    Look, they’re in their own country which they know the best. The targets that were hit made military sense.

    I kindly refer the gentleman to the explanation I provided some moments ago.

    It is quite believable that Ukraine is running 100% independent units with 6 pack MLRS (~35km range). That is not dissimilar to conventional artillery in plan and use.

    They probably are independently targeting strikes in “their own country which they know” at short range over their offensive lines. I have already made this point. Why do you need me to make it again?
    ___

    Now that we have disposed of that once and for all, let us return to the actual issue at hand.

    The more exotic and expensive ammunition packages (ATACMS or PrSM) are much more complex. The longer range attacks seem to have very good intelligence on where things are, both targets and missile defense systems, well behind enemy lines.

    The European Empire is required as a participant in making long range strikes successful. For example, those into Russia itself. I am not sure why why you are dodging this relatively straight forward relationship between EU Intelligence Agencies and the Kiev regime.

    Is it hard to believe that French intelligence is shaping Ukrainian strikes by selectively sharing details that support their desired outcome?

    If you assert this relationship does not & cannot exist, the burden of proof is yours.

    PEACE 😇

  143. @Yahya
    @showmethereal


    Actually you have to have fairly high intelligence to be good at football.
     
    If that were true, then East Asians would dominate the World Cup (which they don’t, quite the opposite), and blacks would not be over represented in European teams.

    Football players don’t seem that bright to me. Being a manager seems to be g-loaded though.

    Replies: @Mikel, @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms, @showmethereal

    Football players don’t seem that bright to me.

    I would even argue that a negative correlation exists between excellence at soccer and general IQ. But soccer does require good visual and spatial-temporal skills, which may explain showmethereal’s observation.

    I’ve only watched the US match so far and they’re definitely getting better, btw, in spite of the disappointing score. With all the money and potential talent available, the US should eventually become one of the big teams.

    • Replies: @Yevardian
    @Mikel

    Just quickly surveying, I noticed there's a Basque football team that draws from both France and Spain, which could be considered quite provocative in itself, though of course I notice that isn't in FIFA. Actually, aside from the UK, are there any other sub-national teams competing in the WC? It feels funny that Scotland gets it's own representation, whilst enormous and far more distinct nations like Telugu or Tamils don't get teams.. though I'd guess Indians are terrible at soccer anyway (rather play cricket too).
    I see at the 'club' there's 'Bilboko Athletic Kluba' as well, though I guess its nothing special as I've never heard of it compared to famous Madrid and Barcelona teams which even I've heard of before.

    You might have seen this, I saw recently on El País that some curious historical fragment has recently been unearthed, now the earliest known written record of a Vasconic language.

    https://elpais.com/cultura/2022-11-14/un-equipo-de-investigadores-afirma-haber-descubierto-en-navarra-la-primera-inscripcion-en-vasco-de-hace-2100-anos.html

    Replies: @Mikel, @silviosilver

    , @showmethereal
    @Mikel

    US kids don’t grow up with the ball at their feet. Playing a sport using your feet to manipulate objects is counter-intuitive. And American crowds have low attention spans. Both are essential keys.

  144. The first major poll results since Trump announced his candidacy are in: (1)

    Former President Donald J. Trump holds a towering 30-point lead over the rest of the potential 2024 Republican primary field, according to a poll.

    In an Emerson College Polling survey released Tuesday, 55.1 percent of registered voters said they would vote for Trump in the 2024 GOP primary,

    NATIONAL POLL [MORE]

    2024 GOP Primary

    @realDonaldTrump 55%
    @RonDeSantisFL 25%
    @Mike_Pence 8%
    @Liz_Cheney 4%
    @tedcruz 3%
    @NikkiHaley 3%

    There is also an age divide in the Republican primary: younger voters under 50 break for Trump over DeSantis 67% to 14%, voters between 50 and 64 break for Trump 54% to 32%, while Republicans over 65 are more split: 39% support Trump and 32% DeSantis.

    This is a devastating gut punch to the #NeverTrump establishment followers of Mitch McConnell. Their attempts to blow up the MAGA movement from within have just taken a catastrophic blow.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2022/11/22/poll-donald-trump-holds-30-point-lead-over-2024-gop-primary-field/

    [MORE]

    • Replies: @sudden death
    @A123

    From this poll alone it seems there are at least 8% of Republicans (Cheney voters and at least half of Pence) who will not go to vote for Trump in 2024 or will vote for Biden, but ofc it will be easier to scream about election fraud when missing those votes while losing again, lol

    , @Mikel
    @A123

    From the same poll:


    When asked who they would vote for in a possible general election rematch between Trump and Biden, 40.9 percent said they would back Trump, while 45.1 percent said they would vote for the Democrat.
     
    After 3 consecutive Republican election losses with Trump as a leader, there is little doubt he would lose even against Kamala. If these numbers hold, we are doomed. But fortunately the result of this small poll of only ~600 respondents contradicts the previous ones where DeSantis was well ahead of him among Republicans.

    Replies: @A123

    , @Barbarossa
    @A123

    I'll point out that Trump is the only person who has even declared in the race, so it's hardly surprising that he has a commanding lead at this point. Polling like this is extremely meaningless at this point in the game. Once other candidates have declared and had a chance to get their message out in front of the electorate it will possible to draw some conclusions.

    Replies: @A123

    , @keypusher
    @A123

    Pretty early in his presidency it was clear that Trump was strictly for suckers. You're still banging his drum. Did you go into mourning when Michael Jackson kicked the bucket? Do you believe that real communism has never been tried?

    Replies: @A123

  145. @A123
    The first major poll results since Trump announced his candidacy are in: (1)

    Former President Donald J. Trump holds a towering 30-point lead over the rest of the potential 2024 Republican primary field, according to a poll.

    In an Emerson College Polling survey released Tuesday, 55.1 percent of registered voters said they would vote for Trump in the 2024 GOP primary,

    NATIONAL POLL [MORE]

    2024 GOP Primary

    @realDonaldTrump 55%
    @RonDeSantisFL 25%
    @Mike_Pence 8%
    @Liz_Cheney 4%
    @tedcruz 3%
    @NikkiHaley 3%
     

    There is also an age divide in the Republican primary: younger voters under 50 break for Trump over DeSantis 67% to 14%, voters between 50 and 64 break for Trump 54% to 32%, while Republicans over 65 are more split: 39% support Trump and 32% DeSantis.
     

     
    This is a devastating gut punch to the #NeverTrump establishment followers of Mitch McConnell. Their attempts to blow up the MAGA movement from within have just taken a catastrophic blow.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2022/11/22/poll-donald-trump-holds-30-point-lead-over-2024-gop-primary-field/



    https://twitter.com/EmersonPolling/status/1595013075026976770?s=20

    Replies: @sudden death, @Mikel, @Barbarossa, @keypusher

    From this poll alone it seems there are at least 8% of Republicans (Cheney voters and at least half of Pence) who will not go to vote for Trump in 2024 or will vote for Biden, but ofc it will be easier to scream about election fraud when missing those votes while losing again, lol

  146. @AnonfromTN
    @Barbarossa


    I’d say that there is a big difference between playing sports and watching sports.
     
    Pretty much the same difference as between having sex and watching porn.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    You guys didn’t have any fun watching Conner McGregor’s leg go snap?

    My favorite spectator sports moment of the last ten years I didn’t even see. It was at the very end of the Chiefs-49er’s Super Bowl and the 49er’s had the ball 1st and ten on their own 20, behind by 4, 2 minutes left.

    I was listening on 49er’s radio and Grep Popa had the greatest jinx commentary ever.

    “This is the exact situation Joe Montana was in the night he played himself into the Hall of Fame.”

    By chain of accidents Garopalo is still the 49er’s quarterback and he is having a great season. I still wonder if he ever heard about the Popa commenary.

  147. @A123
    The first major poll results since Trump announced his candidacy are in: (1)

    Former President Donald J. Trump holds a towering 30-point lead over the rest of the potential 2024 Republican primary field, according to a poll.

    In an Emerson College Polling survey released Tuesday, 55.1 percent of registered voters said they would vote for Trump in the 2024 GOP primary,

    NATIONAL POLL [MORE]

    2024 GOP Primary

    @realDonaldTrump 55%
    @RonDeSantisFL 25%
    @Mike_Pence 8%
    @Liz_Cheney 4%
    @tedcruz 3%
    @NikkiHaley 3%
     

    There is also an age divide in the Republican primary: younger voters under 50 break for Trump over DeSantis 67% to 14%, voters between 50 and 64 break for Trump 54% to 32%, while Republicans over 65 are more split: 39% support Trump and 32% DeSantis.
     

     
    This is a devastating gut punch to the #NeverTrump establishment followers of Mitch McConnell. Their attempts to blow up the MAGA movement from within have just taken a catastrophic blow.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2022/11/22/poll-donald-trump-holds-30-point-lead-over-2024-gop-primary-field/



    https://twitter.com/EmersonPolling/status/1595013075026976770?s=20

    Replies: @sudden death, @Mikel, @Barbarossa, @keypusher

    From the same poll:

    When asked who they would vote for in a possible general election rematch between Trump and Biden, 40.9 percent said they would back Trump, while 45.1 percent said they would vote for the Democrat.

    After 3 consecutive Republican election losses with Trump as a leader, there is little doubt he would lose even against Kamala. If these numbers hold, we are doomed. But fortunately the result of this small poll of only ~600 respondents contradicts the previous ones where DeSantis was well ahead of him among Republicans.

    • Replies: @A123
    @Mikel

    From the same poll:


    Similarly, Biden led DeSantis by a margin of 42.5 percent to 38.8 percent, with 11.2 percent stating they would vote for someone else
     
    Your attempt to undermine workers with a DeSantis "RINO" betrayal is also in OMGFAIL territory in terms of a establishment anti-MAGA win.

    As you want Not-The-President Biden to have a second term, this must make you very happy.

    PEACE 😇

  148. @Mikel
    @A123

    From the same poll:


    When asked who they would vote for in a possible general election rematch between Trump and Biden, 40.9 percent said they would back Trump, while 45.1 percent said they would vote for the Democrat.
     
    After 3 consecutive Republican election losses with Trump as a leader, there is little doubt he would lose even against Kamala. If these numbers hold, we are doomed. But fortunately the result of this small poll of only ~600 respondents contradicts the previous ones where DeSantis was well ahead of him among Republicans.

    Replies: @A123

    From the same poll:

    Similarly, Biden led DeSantis by a margin of 42.5 percent to 38.8 percent, with 11.2 percent stating they would vote for someone else

    Your attempt to undermine workers with a DeSantis “RINO” betrayal is also in OMGFAIL territory in terms of a establishment anti-MAGA win.

    As you want Not-The-President Biden to have a second term, this must make you very happy.

    PEACE 😇

  149. @Yahya
    @showmethereal


    Actually you have to have fairly high intelligence to be good at football.
     
    If that were true, then East Asians would dominate the World Cup (which they don’t, quite the opposite), and blacks would not be over represented in European teams.

    Football players don’t seem that bright to me. Being a manager seems to be g-loaded though.

    Replies: @Mikel, @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms, @showmethereal

    Japan and SK are ok, about the same level as Middle Eastern teams. The fact that PRC is so bad points to a certain defect. Both the other two superpowers, US and Russia, don’t really care about soccer, but put together respectable teams. And unlike India, China produces world class weightlifters and sprinters.

    Soccer requires creativity and flair which EAs lack. I think that’s the main reason.

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    What do you mean Russians don’t care about football (soccer)???? Who told you that??? They love the sport. Did you not see the passion involved when Russia hosted the World Cup? It was not just a commercial endeavor like when the US hosted. Russians were really really passionate. And plenty of Russian players have played in European leagues.

    , @Yahya
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms


    Japan and SK are ok, about the same level as Middle Eastern teams.
     
    Doesn't really say much, Middle Eastern teams are fairly mediocre. Theoretically, the MENA region and East Asia should be winning at least a few world cups, but literally all of them have gone to European and Latin American teams (the game is rigged!) But the point is that success in football doesn’t seem to be correlated with intelligence, Brazil and Argentina are hardly the highest IQ nations; but they put a solid showing in every tournament. African nations seem to be debilitated by their extreme poverty and lack of resources for training facilities or the like. But MENA and East Asian countries don't have that excuse really.

    You'd think China and India, with 2.5 billion people among them, would at least be able to find 11 world-class players who can take them all the way to victory in the finals. There are tiny nations like Uruguay and Netherlands, with but a percentage of China and India's populations, who have won the world cup.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tXqlbKwXpZI&t=14s&ab_channel=ComedyAddiction


    The fact that PRC is so bad points to a certain defect.
     
    Japan and South Korea oddly seem to outgun China on almost every cultural endeavor, even though the latter is 10x larger in population. The people who tend to narrowly focus on East Asian lack of cultural productivity compared to the West are missing the significant intra-East Asian differences in output as well. I haven't seen many good explanations for this. Lee Kuan Yew posited that China is hindered by a culture that does not permit a free exchange of ideas; a language that shapes thinking through epigrams; and 4,000 years of texts that suggest everything worth saying has already been said, and said better by earlier writers. He once advised the Chinese leadership make English the first language, though much as I respect Lee, strikes me as a materialistic and self-abasing idea.

    I would be interested to hear your explanation as to China's underperformance vis-a-vis Japan and Korea.


    Soccer requires creativity and flair which EAs lack. I think that’s the main reason.

     

    I think there's some truth in the age-old stereotype of East Asian lack of creativity, but as usual HBDists tend to overdo it. I wrote a post on this topic here: https://www.unz.com/isteve/math-vs-reading-test-score-tilts-internationally/#comment-5332386

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms, @showmethereal

  150. Ever spend 10 minutes speaking to Bethlehem Christian over the abuses they suffer at Muslim hands? (1)

    The Palestinian Authority has been forced to call off a press conference that was supposed to take place in Ramallah later this week regarding the upcoming Christmas festivities after protests by the Bethlehem Municipality and Christian leaders.

    Several Christian residents of Bethlehem accused the PA of attempting to “hijack” their holidays and marginalize the city’s role in organizing and overseeing the celebrations. Announcements about Christmas festivities have always been made from Bethlehem, they said.

    The dispute between Bethlehem and Ramallah over Christian holidays is unprecedented.

    Several Christians took to social media to express outrage over the PA’s attempt to shift attention from Bethlehem to Ramallah ahead of Christmas.

    The need to return Bethlehem to exclusive Christian control is self evidently necessary. End the Muslim occupation! Now!

    🎄 MERRY CHRISTMAS 🎄
    ___________________________

    (1) https://www.jpost.com/middle-east/article-723051

  151. @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @Yahya

    Japan and SK are ok, about the same level as Middle Eastern teams. The fact that PRC is so bad points to a certain defect. Both the other two superpowers, US and Russia, don't really care about soccer, but put together respectable teams. And unlike India, China produces world class weightlifters and sprinters.

    Soccer requires creativity and flair which EAs lack. I think that's the main reason.

    Replies: @showmethereal, @Yahya

    What do you mean Russians don’t care about football (soccer)???? Who told you that??? They love the sport. Did you not see the passion involved when Russia hosted the World Cup? It was not just a commercial endeavor like when the US hosted. Russians were really really passionate. And plenty of Russian players have played in European leagues.

  152. @Mikel
    @Yahya


    Football players don’t seem that bright to me.
     
    I would even argue that a negative correlation exists between excellence at soccer and general IQ. But soccer does require good visual and spatial-temporal skills, which may explain showmethereal's observation.

    I've only watched the US match so far and they're definitely getting better, btw, in spite of the disappointing score. With all the money and potential talent available, the US should eventually become one of the big teams.

    Replies: @Yevardian, @showmethereal

    Just quickly surveying, I noticed there’s a Basque football team that draws from both France and Spain, which could be considered quite provocative in itself, though of course I notice that isn’t in FIFA. Actually, aside from the UK, are there any other sub-national teams competing in the WC? It feels funny that Scotland gets it’s own representation, whilst enormous and far more distinct nations like Telugu or Tamils don’t get teams.. though I’d guess Indians are terrible at soccer anyway (rather play cricket too).
    I see at the ‘club’ there’s ‘Bilboko Athletic Kluba’ as well, though I guess its nothing special as I’ve never heard of it compared to famous Madrid and Barcelona teams which even I’ve heard of before.

    You might have seen this, I saw recently on El País that some curious historical fragment has recently been unearthed, now the earliest known written record of a Vasconic language.

    https://elpais.com/cultura/2022-11-14/un-equipo-de-investigadores-afirma-haber-descubierto-en-navarra-la-primera-inscripcion-en-vasco-de-hace-2100-anos.html

    • Replies: @Mikel
    @Yevardian


    You might have seen this, I saw recently on El País that some curious historical fragment has recently been unearthed, now the earliest known written record of a Vasconic language.
     
    Thanks. I didn't know about that finding. That should put to rest the theories about the Basque language coming from Aquitaine after the Roman conquest and replacing Celtic languages in the current Basque Country. That never made sense to me, although there do seem to be some Celtic toponyms interspersed here and there in a sea of Basque ancient toponyms. But considering that those theories are usually espoused by people with clear Spanish nationalist tendencies, they'll more likely try to question this finding or its significance. If the transliteration I see in the article is correct those words certainly look Vasconic.
    , @silviosilver
    @Yevardian


    I see at the ‘club’ there’s ‘Bilboko Athletic Kluba’ as well, though I guess its nothing special as I’ve never heard of it compared to famous Madrid and Barcelona teams which even I’ve heard of before.
     
    Not sure if you're being sarcastic here. : ) If you've honestly never heard of Athletico Bilbao though, they're actually one of the most successful teams in Spanish club soccer, and they've managed that feat despite (or maybe because of?) their policy of using only Basque players. Even a non-sportsball fan could be impressed by that.

    @Mikel

    although there do seem to be some Celtic toponyms interspersed here and there in a sea of Basque ancient toponyms. But considering that those theories are usually espoused by people with clear Spanish nationalist tendencies
     
    Years ago on some race/ethnicity forum (might have been Stirpes, now long defunct but once very good), I noticed a strain of Spanish nationalism that seemed to really go out of its way to play up "Celtic roots" - the sort of fathers who would force their kids to learn the bagpipes, lol. Have you ever had much personal experience with these types?

    @Matra

    Allowing five subs represents the kind of Americanisation that Steve Sailer has long advocated. How can it be a team effort if half the players that finish didn’t start the match?
     
    Well, I think you could just as well argue that the rule makes it more of a team effort, since it involves more people who are part of the (larger) team. But I can understand why 'purist' fans - which soccer is chock full of - would be put off by the changes. I really don't care anymore. Soccer has gone from my favorite sport when I was a teen, to something I can barely muster the energy to google the results of. The reason is mostly racial - who cares what a half nigged (soon to be 100%) "France" or "England" does - but not solely. In hindsight, the Bosman ruling totally wrecked European soccer. As early as the late 90s Chelsea could field a team without a single actual Englishman on it. I was still a huge fan, but I thought that was seriously messed up.

    @Barbie

    I’d say that there is a big difference between playing sports and watching sports. The latter has little redeeming value while the former has a number of good attributes.
     
    Yes, the sad little sporstball fan is a sitting duck for absolutist judgments like this. However, if you compare sporstball fandom to alternative uses of leisure time, there are obviously far worse things that the average fan - of decidedly average human 'quality' - could be doing. At a very basic level, reading sports journalism is likely the only reading some fans would ever do, and if not for that, then nothing. So that counts as a plus. Fandom also imparts some lessons in patience and coping with disappointment, and even restraint and hope (it's not over till it's over). Of course, there are more effective ways to imbibe those same lessons, but again you have to weigh that against the likelihood that the average fan would ever do so.

    Replies: @Mikel, @Matra, @Barbarossa

  153. @Beckow
    @showmethereal

    Each instance of a super-power is different, but the migration urge is always the same. The Third Worlders migrating to Europe-US, or possibly Russia (I doubt it), are not settlers. They are seeking the easiest way to live better - an instinct based on self-interest, laziness and a calculation that moving to where the stuff is beats trying to create it at home.

    No amount of development will stop it and more integration only speeds it up. It mainly affects young males and usually the ones with some resources - the pathetic equivalent of middle and lower middle classes in the Third World. The only way to stop it is to simply stop it - no rules, no excuses, no back doors, no discussion. Or it will overwhelm what is left of the West. A simple choice that the people are unwilling to make, or often even see. There is really nothing scarier for what's left of our culture than the 'African students', whatever that term encompasses.

    Replies: @showmethereal

    So all the millions and millions and millions of Europeans that fled Europe for other continents – why did they stop? They stopped because the reasons they fled Europe for 3 centuries were remedied for the most part. It’s laughable people forget Europeans had a mass migration out for centuries.

    In any event it is a fact across the board that the more a country prospers – migration rates slow.

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @showmethereal

    Europeans who left for three centuries were settlers. Or most of them were. Settlers are people who move to start farms, mines, trading settlements, and to plunder the natives.

    That is very different from the current Third World migrants: they come to short-cut to better life, they are not starting farms, bringing herds of cows, digging for metals. They plunder but differently: goodies from the clueless over-bred locals and petty theft. No amount of prosperity at home can change that. They are doing it out of laziness, and are the exact opposite of the Euro settlers in the past.

    Replies: @showmethereal

  154. @Yahya
    @showmethereal


    Actually you have to have fairly high intelligence to be good at football.
     
    If that were true, then East Asians would dominate the World Cup (which they don’t, quite the opposite), and blacks would not be over represented in European teams.

    Football players don’t seem that bright to me. Being a manager seems to be g-loaded though.

    Replies: @Mikel, @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms, @showmethereal

    East Asians lack the overall athleticism. So that’s not a good analysis. The best black players tend to be the smarter ones also. And teams require all sorts. You need a combination of things.

    • Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @showmethereal


    East Asians lack the overall athleticism.
     
    Speak for yourself, fucking loser.

    Don't drag down other East Asians with you, China hasn't beaten Japan and SK in twenty years--

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/China-Japan_football_rivalry
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/China-South_Korea_football_rivalry

    Organic sports organisation is anathema to the CCP, that's the reason why,

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_football_league_system
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dai_Nippon_Butoku_Kai

    Replies: @showmethereal

  155. @silviosilver
    @Yahya


    It’s fairly even-handed so you need not worry about Serb-bashing or petty nationalism
     
    I'll reply to the rest of your post later, but just quickly on this, lol, I am the last person who'd ever get offended by that. In the war years, there was this Croatian song "Oj Srbine, jebem ti tri prsta", best rendered in English as "Oi Serbo, fuck you and your three fingers" (3 fingers referring to the three fingers orthodox worshipers use to cross themselves, but also sometimes flashed as an orthodox "gang sign" lol, well, more like WWII's "v for victory" salute, made famous by Churchill). The lyrics are intended to taunt and maximally insult, but I can listen to something like that and laugh no problem. (This song is far from the only one and far from the worst; I remember it because I thought it was actually quite well done, the way it mimics a Serbian peasant musical style from the region. War taunt music was something of an entire genre.) I am mentioning this so you better understand where I'm coming from when I loose insults - I forget that not everybody takes that sort of thing as lightly as I do.

    Replies: @Yevardian

    I remember going through a phase of listening to Serbian ‘turbofolk, some extremely ‘powerful’ lyrics and musicvideos, though my impression was that only Roki Vulavic had genuine talent as singer.
    Probably you’ve heard of these already, but others might be interested in them as a curio.
    I wonder what the Croatian side of that genre looks like.

    [MORE]

    Pretty poor musically, but nice visuals:

    Attacking Bosnian Muslims, quite catchy in trashy way:

    Generic cheesy 80’s pop, except for the lyrics:

    Vulavic, instrumentation is midi-tier quality, but you can hear unlike the others he can actually sing:

    Roki Again:

    I like how when walking around a forest Vulavic wears a suit, whilst in the city he wears camoflage:

    Serbian military superiority over the Americans:

    Backing track sounds like it belongs to 90s RTS videogame:

    On Serbian music in general, I quite like this sort of stuff too. I noticed that this particular ‘operatic’ (though totally unlike classical Italian-derived opera singing, I don’t know what else to call it?) vocal styling is very characteristic of Greek music too, though you don’t hear it much in Romanian traditional music, and I’ve never heard this style in non-Balkan Slavic countries.

    • Replies: @Yevardian
    @Yevardian

    Reminds me, I might post some Turkish music I like from the classic 'Anatolian Rock' era, mostly from the 70s-80s. Perhaps Yahya could comment if any of this stuff is popular in the Arab world, definitely Turkish music remains very popular in Iran and in the Caucasus. Though my impression is that it isn't, I think something non-MENA people don't appreciate is how deep the cultural divide is between the Semitic world and the Turko-Iranian one in the region, its at least on the level of that between Northern and Southern Europe. I say 'Semitic' because I think its quite underestimated how influenced Israeli popular culture is by the Arab world.. although Turkish and Iranian influence there is virtually nil.

    'Psychadelic rock' with local flavour from Erkin Koray:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U0gjwpMb-k8

    Very 60's bubblegum, change the language and you can easily see this being an British invasion hit:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cUoJ9SUxwd0

    One of Baris Manco's many hits:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BI6Nk1cXBvk

    Mellow number from Esmeray:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpaobkArtFk

    60s tropic lounge-style:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cjx4CIVdWec

    Typical Anatolian Rock of the era from Altay:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OiTWl20BghY

    One Manco's better English-language attempts, I suspect he memorised the lyrics without understanding much, some of his live performances of this are totally unintelligible imao:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bGu7-xwcxYE

    Baris Manco again:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fa2L-A2sS-4

    Erkin Koray:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysekxL-cPQ0

    Manco:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZWHbfr9iBs

    One of Manco's most covered songs:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GUKIEjmQ1Bc

    A lesser known 70s Turkish group I remembered at random:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ln6ya0xahG0

    Incidentally I know this from my mother's side, my father can't stand any of this stuff, which goes for almost anything except Western Classical Music really. I tried introducing him to Jazz when I was first getting into the genre. Although he didn't actually hate it, after the novelty wore off he quickly lost interest.

    Replies: @Yahya

    , @silviosilver
    @Yevardian


    I remember going through a phase of listening to Serbian ‘turbofolk
     
    Shit, seriously? You really enjoyed listening to that stuff? I actually hadn't heard of any of the songs or performers you linked to. Maybe that Mauzer song I've heard before, but I think from someone posting a link here, not in its own day. I suppose it comes under the category of 'turbfolk' but it's not what I think of as most representative of the genre. Or maybe it is, and I just don't know what I'm talking about. I am not a fan of turbofolk but I got into it for a while in the early 2000s, and I think most of it is quite a lot better than the selections you posted. (Man, that "Srbian supermen" thing, rofl - you sure you're not trying to embarrass me here, hmm?) There isn't any bright dividing line between what is turbofolk and what is just Serbian pop music, and perhaps the kind that I liked (and most people liked, judging by what was listened to when I was there) is heavier on the pop (or "turbo") than on the folk.

    On Serbian music in general, I quite like this sort of stuff too.
     
    I immediately recognized the singer in that clip, but it surprised me that I couldn't remember his name - which I took as a sign of how out of touch I am with this music. If you like him, my two fave songs of his were "Rano je za tugu" and "Ostaricu necu znati" (let's see if I have good taste lol).

    I know what you mean by the vocal style, but I have no idea about the correct musical terminology for it. You're quite right that it's very common. One song that immediately comes to mind that features it strongly (takes it to excess even) is Mitar Miric - Ne diraj coveka za stolom.

    This to Yahya as well, who has expressed some interest in balkans music, a rather distinctive style is Sevdah/Sevdanlinka, which is mostly Bosnian but is thought quite highly of across ex-YU. Generally melancholy themes with oriental-tinged, often rather haunting, melodies. Couple of good examples by Safet Isovic - Moj Dilbere and Sehidski rastanak.

    My own personal preference, and the only stuff I can really enjoy without getting tired of it, is ex-YU pop from the 80s. Couple of good examples, the groups "Zana" and "Magazin."

    Replies: @Yahya

  156. @showmethereal
    @Yahya

    East Asians lack the overall athleticism. So that’s not a good analysis. The best black players tend to be the smarter ones also. And teams require all sorts. You need a combination of things.

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    East Asians lack the overall athleticism.

    Speak for yourself, fucking loser.

    Don’t drag down other East Asians with you, China hasn’t beaten Japan and SK in twenty years–

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/China-Japan_football_rivalry
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/China-South_Korea_football_rivalry

    Organic sports organisation is anathema to the CCP, that’s the reason why,

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_football_league_system
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dai_Nippon_Butoku_Kai

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    How many Japanese or Korean players are in t he top leagues compared to their size? And since you claim it’s a CPC problem then what about the Chinese in Taiwan and Hong Kong and even in the UK and Australia? Face facts instead of being an idiot trying to insult others. East Asian - especially Chinese women - do better than the men in those types of sports. Stop lying to yourself. Only idiots who believe in a master race believe that their race is great at everything

  157. @Yevardian
    @silviosilver

    I remember going through a phase of listening to Serbian 'turbofolk, some extremely 'powerful' lyrics and musicvideos, though my impression was that only Roki Vulavic had genuine talent as singer.
    Probably you've heard of these already, but others might be interested in them as a curio.
    I wonder what the Croatian side of that genre looks like.



    Pretty poor musically, but nice visuals:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q0I-XGTzfhg

    Attacking Bosnian Muslims, quite catchy in trashy way:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tFDpo62eqwU

    Generic cheesy 80's pop, except for the lyrics:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KifJ6J3KmWg

    Vulavic, instrumentation is midi-tier quality, but you can hear unlike the others he can actually sing:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qeAEdU4p5Cg

    Roki Again:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jKyWihLG2-8

    I like how when walking around a forest Vulavic wears a suit, whilst in the city he wears camoflage:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hxPaxFD0ar8

    Serbian military superiority over the Americans:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=333OVHhpK5c

    Backing track sounds like it belongs to 90s RTS videogame:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mY0MzNK6KqA

    On Serbian music in general, I quite like this sort of stuff too. I noticed that this particular 'operatic' (though totally unlike classical Italian-derived opera singing, I don't know what else to call it?) vocal styling is very characteristic of Greek music too, though you don't hear it much in Romanian traditional music, and I've never heard this style in non-Balkan Slavic countries.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WcE8Rrzfeio

    Replies: @Yevardian, @silviosilver

    Reminds me, I might post some Turkish music I like from the classic ‘Anatolian Rock’ era, mostly from the 70s-80s. Perhaps Yahya could comment if any of this stuff is popular in the Arab world, definitely Turkish music remains very popular in Iran and in the Caucasus. Though my impression is that it isn’t, I think something non-MENA people don’t appreciate is how deep the cultural divide is between the Semitic world and the Turko-Iranian one in the region, its at least on the level of that between Northern and Southern Europe. I say ‘Semitic’ because I think its quite underestimated how influenced Israeli popular culture is by the Arab world.. although Turkish and Iranian influence there is virtually nil.

    [MORE]

    ‘Psychadelic rock’ with local flavour from Erkin Koray:

    Very 60’s bubblegum, change the language and you can easily see this being an British invasion hit:

    One of Baris Manco’s many hits:

    Mellow number from Esmeray:

    60s tropic lounge-style:

    Typical Anatolian Rock of the era from Altay:

    One Manco’s better English-language attempts, I suspect he memorised the lyrics without understanding much, some of his live performances of this are totally unintelligible imao:

    Baris Manco again:

    Erkin Koray:

    Manco:

    One of Manco’s most covered songs:

    A lesser known 70s Turkish group I remembered at random:

    Incidentally I know this from my mother’s side, my father can’t stand any of this stuff, which goes for almost anything except Western Classical Music really. I tried introducing him to Jazz when I was first getting into the genre. Although he didn’t actually hate it, after the novelty wore off he quickly lost interest.

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @Yevardian


    Incidentally I know this from my mother’s side, my father can’t stand any of this stuff, which goes for almost anything except Western Classical Music really. I tried introducing him to Jazz when I was first getting into the genre. Although he didn’t actually hate it, after the novelty wore off he quickly lost interest.
     
    Your father and I are kindred souls; I couldn't listen to any of the stuff you posted. I was actually impressed by the beginning instrumentation of the first Erkin Koray tune; until he started singing in that psychedelic style which I can't stand. I told the Dragon Man before that my musical tastes tends towards the orderly and mundane; never got into jazz, electronic, hip-hop, dance, rock or psychedelic music. My reaction to jazz was pretty much identical to your father's. Perhaps you can recommend the Arabic pieces I posted above, I think he might like some of them.

    From Turkey I am a fan of their classical tradition. I wrote a lengthy post on it to Bashibuzuk here: https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-198/#comment-5581415

    It's fairly similar to Arabic music, as it is based on the Maqam/Makam/Mugham system utilized by the Arab world, Turkey, and Azerbaijan; though surprisingly it took me a while to get accustomed to it. I cannot comment on the popularity or lack thereof of Anatolian Rock in the Arab world; since i've never listened to any till today, though I was vaguely familiar with the genre. All I know is that i've never heard a Turkish tune being played on TV, radio or in outdoor settings; though Turkish TV shows are ubiquitous on MBC (a pan-Arab TV network watched all over the Arab World). My friends mostly listen to the basest forms of Western music, stuff that make my ears bleed.

    Iran - zero. The cultural separation between Iran and the Arab world is several times greater than with Turkey, perhaps owing to the residual Ottoman influence of the latter. I do not have experiences like you of watching The Lizard or listening to Banan with family; I had to explore Iranian cinema and music by myself. I largely agree with your take on the division between the Semitic and Turco-Persian worlds. I've seen several Israeli renditions of classical Arabic songs, unsurprisingly from the Mizrahim of that country. Though Arabic cultures popularity with Mizrahi seems strange considering the hatred they have for us. I should point out though that some Turks like listening to Arabic music as well; I see them in the comment sections of many Arabic songs. And occasionally I come across Turkish renditions of Arabic songs, such as this tasteful adaptation of Lena Chamamyan's Baali Maak by Selva Erdener:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R18262T-REA&ab_channel=SelvaErdener

    Regarding Turkey and Iran's influence; obviously both of them try to gain favor with the prestige Arab world in their quest to lead the Islamic Ummah. Iran has been more successful, even though it faces a steeper battle given its cultural distance and more importantly, Shia disposition, which puts it at odds with Sunni Arabs in the region. Turkey should have done better considering many Arab elites in places like Egypt and Algeria have recent Turkish ancestry. But Erdogan really played his cards wrong, supporting the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt, opposing Assad in Syria, and picking fights with the Gulf Arab monarchies. Virtually the only "nation" he has any influence over is tiny Qatar. Iran has done well given the poor cards they were dealt, but they too are treated with suspicion and hostility by most of the Arab World, as I demonstrated in my reply to you some months ago.


    I remember going through a phase of listening to Serbian ‘turbofolk, some extremely ‘powerful’ lyrics and musicvideos, though my impression was that only Roki Vulavic had genuine talent as singer.

     

    Lol, these videos seem like self-parodies.

    I'm a huge fan of Balkan folk music. This piece of Bulgarian polyphonic music is exquisite:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UsDtmdWFBxU&ab_channel=CosmicVoicesfromBulgaria

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @Barbarossa

  158. Would we be better off if there was some sort of Logan’s Run for politicians, when they reached the age of 60?

    • Replies: @Barbarossa
    @songbird

    Yes, but I would be generous and raise the age to 70. While they are at it American political races should be settled via cage match. I feel it would improve the dignity of the political system over what we have today. Plus it would save a lot of time and provide greater entertainment value to boot!

    Replies: @songbird, @Mr. Hack, @A123

  159. @Yevardian
    @Mikel

    Just quickly surveying, I noticed there's a Basque football team that draws from both France and Spain, which could be considered quite provocative in itself, though of course I notice that isn't in FIFA. Actually, aside from the UK, are there any other sub-national teams competing in the WC? It feels funny that Scotland gets it's own representation, whilst enormous and far more distinct nations like Telugu or Tamils don't get teams.. though I'd guess Indians are terrible at soccer anyway (rather play cricket too).
    I see at the 'club' there's 'Bilboko Athletic Kluba' as well, though I guess its nothing special as I've never heard of it compared to famous Madrid and Barcelona teams which even I've heard of before.

    You might have seen this, I saw recently on El País that some curious historical fragment has recently been unearthed, now the earliest known written record of a Vasconic language.

    https://elpais.com/cultura/2022-11-14/un-equipo-de-investigadores-afirma-haber-descubierto-en-navarra-la-primera-inscripcion-en-vasco-de-hace-2100-anos.html

    Replies: @Mikel, @silviosilver

    You might have seen this, I saw recently on El País that some curious historical fragment has recently been unearthed, now the earliest known written record of a Vasconic language.

    Thanks. I didn’t know about that finding. That should put to rest the theories about the Basque language coming from Aquitaine after the Roman conquest and replacing Celtic languages in the current Basque Country. That never made sense to me, although there do seem to be some Celtic toponyms interspersed here and there in a sea of Basque ancient toponyms. But considering that those theories are usually espoused by people with clear Spanish nationalist tendencies, they’ll more likely try to question this finding or its significance. If the transliteration I see in the article is correct those words certainly look Vasconic.

  160. @A123
    The first major poll results since Trump announced his candidacy are in: (1)

    Former President Donald J. Trump holds a towering 30-point lead over the rest of the potential 2024 Republican primary field, according to a poll.

    In an Emerson College Polling survey released Tuesday, 55.1 percent of registered voters said they would vote for Trump in the 2024 GOP primary,

    NATIONAL POLL [MORE]

    2024 GOP Primary

    @realDonaldTrump 55%
    @RonDeSantisFL 25%
    @Mike_Pence 8%
    @Liz_Cheney 4%
    @tedcruz 3%
    @NikkiHaley 3%
     

    There is also an age divide in the Republican primary: younger voters under 50 break for Trump over DeSantis 67% to 14%, voters between 50 and 64 break for Trump 54% to 32%, while Republicans over 65 are more split: 39% support Trump and 32% DeSantis.
     

     
    This is a devastating gut punch to the #NeverTrump establishment followers of Mitch McConnell. Their attempts to blow up the MAGA movement from within have just taken a catastrophic blow.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2022/11/22/poll-donald-trump-holds-30-point-lead-over-2024-gop-primary-field/



    https://twitter.com/EmersonPolling/status/1595013075026976770?s=20

    Replies: @sudden death, @Mikel, @Barbarossa, @keypusher

    I’ll point out that Trump is the only person who has even declared in the race, so it’s hardly surprising that he has a commanding lead at this point. Polling like this is extremely meaningless at this point in the game. Once other candidates have declared and had a chance to get their message out in front of the electorate it will possible to draw some conclusions.

    • Replies: @A123
    @Barbarossa


    Polling like this is extremely meaningless at this point in the game. Once other candidates have declared and had a chance to get their message out in front of the electorate it will possible to draw some conclusions.
     
    Trump is getting his MAGA message out now. And, he has developed a great deal of "soft power" via endorsements, rallies, and fund raising.

    If DeSantis joins the race. What will he deliver as anti-MAGA messaging? And, how will he get that anti-MAGA message out?

    If DeSantis offends the MAGA base, he is pretty much doomed as a candidate. Many people believe that getting him to run now is actually a set-up for destruction. (1)

    DeSantis is now the favorite among many Republican voters and almost all conservative commentators for the Party presidential nomination. Such passionate advocates seem to have missed two essential points:

    • In a rigged electoral system, no Republican candidate, not even DeSantis, can be expected to win a national election. DeSantis cruised to victory in Florida because, as governor of the state, he had the means and the authority to ensure a clean election. But he would be helpless against a massive crime organization, aka the Democrat Party, which effectively controls the electoral infrastructure, the physical apparatus, the paid loyalty of election workers, and the federal agencies that oversee the process. If the system is not repaired and made answerable to the people, there will never be a Republican president again.

    • Should DeSantis run in 2024 and lose — which is increasingly likely in the current adulterated circumstances — the sequel would be devastating. Florida would be at the mercy of the next gubernatorial race since DeSantis is a unique political figure and could not be readily replaced. Additionally, DeSantis himself would have become a kind of displaced person, neither an American president nor a state governor. An invaluable political talent would have been sacrificed to the untutored enthusiasm of his supporters. If the American republican experiment is now in dire straits, it would then be expeditiously destroyed. A slim hope will have become an utter disaster.
     
    The best, really only, option for MAGA is to settle on Trump quickly. That leaves many months to decide to handle 2024 balloting (which may or may not be voting).

    ♦ Can it be cleaned up?
    ♦ Or, is the only choice going 100% all in on balloting for the MAGA side?

    I would prefer the former. However, I suspect that is not possible. The GOP will need its own Fultoning operation to win.
    ___

    Trump will continue to run until he obtains the result he won in 2020. If he gets that fairness, he will use up his second and last term when he leaves office in 2028.

    If the 2024 election is stolen again... Brace yourself for Trump 2028, Trump 2032, Trump, 2036, etc. The only way to achieve post-Trump MAGA is term limits. And, that means belatedly delivering a win to the man who already earned it.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://pjmedia.com/columns/david-solway-2/2022/11/11/desantis-2024-think-again-n1645202

    Replies: @sudden death

  161. @songbird
    Would we be better off if there was some sort of Logan's Run for politicians, when they reached the age of 60?

    Replies: @Barbarossa

    Yes, but I would be generous and raise the age to 70. While they are at it American political races should be settled via cage match. I feel it would improve the dignity of the political system over what we have today. Plus it would save a lot of time and provide greater entertainment value to boot!

    • LOL: songbird
    • Replies: @songbird
    @Barbarossa

    A123 would be in a bind because he loves Trump, but Merkel turned 60 in 2014.

    Mr. Hack would be in a bind because he hates ageism, but Putin is 70.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    , @Mr. Hack
    @Barbarossa

    Political cage match?

    https://mediacloud.theweek.com/image/private/s--vyk3xCoM--/f_auto,t_single-media-image-mobile@1/v1608624392/13_55.jpg

    International cage matches anyone?

    https://www.cleveland.com/resizer/KfkQjsuGtJUY7qFV5QykDvx055s=/800x0/smart/arc-anglerfish-arc2-prod-advancelocal.s3.amazonaws.com/public/ZCFUMKON6BC4BFWKORY4TWRUH4.jpg

    , @A123
    @Barbarossa


    While they are at it American political races should be settled via cage match. I feel it would improve the dignity of the political system over what we have today. Plus it would save a lot of time and provide greater entertainment value to boot!
     
    Celebrity Deathmatch did Lincoln versus Washington.
     

    https://i.ytimg.com/vi/stg2M4My2Yo/hqdefault.jpg

    I would happily take Trump versus Droolin Joe.

    PEACE 😇

  162. I’ll answer the comments in the previous thread.

    comment https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-201/#comment-5668686

    Criterion Dmitry has not reacted mostly arthous

    I became a movie fan after 2020, because of the coronavirus pandemic and lockdowns. Before 2020, I didn’t see so many classic movies.

    Film is the main art of the 20th century. For 20th century film, is the equivalent of painting, music, opera and theater in the previous centuries. I don’t know why I was added in connection to Criterion films. But if you look at their films they sell in the USA, they are selling a lot of the best films of the 20th century.. They have a quite significant collection there.

    https://www.criterion.com/shop/browse/list

    It doesn’t imply they don’t also sell many bad films. But the pluses is they had a wide group of films. Another plus is they have contributed to some restoration of films projections. They also begin to release the native 4k discs this month.

    In terms of the negatives, I know people complained about some of their encodings. Also some of their discs can be selling for $30.

    $30 is enough for two people, to go to the cinema and also perhaps add a glass of wine. But then when you go to the cinema in a randomized weekend, what kind of films can you see.

    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-201/#comment-5668533

    One of the worst movies I ever saw, at least in part was Heathers.

    I didn’t know this film, but it looks like the same epoch as the worst film I saw in 2020, was recommended by you to me (as well as IMDB). It was “Ferris Bueller’s Day Off”.

    With the coronavirus lockdown in 2020, I was suddenly becoming a movie fan, seeing two films in the evening. A rule I remember from this experience of seeing a lot of films, in a short time, are that 1980s films are often not a good idea. You won’t necessarily have a good mood after.

    Seeing a lot of films in a rapid way, I would say generally 1980s and 1990s films were less likely to be something with an interesting point of view or a humanist or moral teaching.

    1980s films often become like superficial advertising, or kind of sudden music videos. You can enjoy a kind of injection of the optimism and euphoria of the 1980s culture from this. But surely “Ferris Bueller’s Day Off” could be a textbook of nihilist kitsch, even more than compared to Soviet equivalent.


    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-201/#comment-5668807

    Letterbox feels like a site for the Tiktok generation

    Letterboxd is perhaps not bad because of the quantity of people writing reviews is so high. There is some wisdom of crowds.

    A problem is if many people are seeing the films on their phone or notebook, from streaming sites. But film is mostly visual (where narrative or “characterization” is often not so much more realistic than in your ordinary dream). So, if someone sees a film on their phone or notebook, it can be a much more narrow criteria for judging than in a cinema or OLED, where you are sometimes hypnotized by also visual things.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Dmitry


    But surely “Ferris Bueller’s Day Off” could be a textbook of nihilist kitsch, even more than compared to Soviet equivalent.
     
    LMAO. Is it not like Tom Sawyer? And does not it hit a bit against materialism with the scenes in Cameron's (rich) home? I will shamelessly repeat myself, when I say that I think it is the quintessential film for American schoolkids.

    But one scene that I remember being a little weirded out by was the scene where Ferris lip syncs Danke Schoen. It really sounds like a woman is singing it, but I did not realize this was Wayne Newton, which if anything weirds me out more.

    The guy who plays the principal was unfortunately some Hollywood pederast, which makes it hard to see the movies he was in, the quite good Amadeus, and the terrible Howard the Duck (both '80s movies), the TV cut of which I enjoyed as a kid, but which is really quite a powerfully strange movie.

    IIRC, you liked The Breakfast Club, which I have always disdained as being too artificial and too much like a play. Have you seen any other John Hughes movies, or is that it? Many in the catalog. Swedish Family used to be a big fan, as I recall.

    You should watch Planes, Trains, and Automobiles. It is what I would call another rare quintessentially American film. In part, because it is about Thanksgiving, but also the massive size of America.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

  163. @Barbarossa
    @songbird

    Yes, but I would be generous and raise the age to 70. While they are at it American political races should be settled via cage match. I feel it would improve the dignity of the political system over what we have today. Plus it would save a lot of time and provide greater entertainment value to boot!

    Replies: @songbird, @Mr. Hack, @A123

    A123 would be in a bind because he loves Trump, but Merkel turned 60 in 2014.

    Mr. Hack would be in a bind because he hates ageism, but Putin is 70.

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @songbird

    Ageism? I've been against Beckov style auschwitz solutions for individuals nearing retirement age. 70 actually seems too old for a presidential candidate, not to mention 80 as both Biden and Trump represent.

    https://a57.foxnews.com/static.foxnews.com/foxnews.com/content/uploads/2022/09/918/516/cartoon-0930223-copy.jpg?ve=1&tl=1

    Replies: @songbird

  164. @Dmitry
    I'll answer the comments in the previous thread.

    @Yahya comment https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-201/#comment-5668686


    Criterion Dmitry has not reacted mostly arthous
     
    I became a movie fan after 2020, because of the coronavirus pandemic and lockdowns. Before 2020, I didn't see so many classic movies.

    Film is the main art of the 20th century. For 20th century film, is the equivalent of painting, music, opera and theater in the previous centuries. I don't know why I was added in connection to Criterion films. But if you look at their films they sell in the USA, they are selling a lot of the best films of the 20th century.. They have a quite significant collection there.

    https://www.criterion.com/shop/browse/list

    It doesn't imply they don't also sell many bad films. But the pluses is they had a wide group of films. Another plus is they have contributed to some restoration of films projections. They also begin to release the native 4k discs this month.

    In terms of the negatives, I know people complained about some of their encodings. Also some of their discs can be selling for $30.

    $30 is enough for two people, to go to the cinema and also perhaps add a glass of wine. But then when you go to the cinema in a randomized weekend, what kind of films can you see.

    @songbird

    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-201/#comment-5668533


    One of the worst movies I ever saw, at least in part was Heathers.

     

    I didn't know this film, but it looks like the same epoch as the worst film I saw in 2020, was recommended by you to me (as well as IMDB). It was "Ferris Bueller's Day Off".

    With the coronavirus lockdown in 2020, I was suddenly becoming a movie fan, seeing two films in the evening. A rule I remember from this experience of seeing a lot of films, in a short time, are that 1980s films are often not a good idea. You won't necessarily have a good mood after.

    Seeing a lot of films in a rapid way, I would say generally 1980s and 1990s films were less likely to be something with an interesting point of view or a humanist or moral teaching.

    1980s films often become like superficial advertising, or kind of sudden music videos. You can enjoy a kind of injection of the optimism and euphoria of the 1980s culture from this. But surely "Ferris Bueller’s Day Off" could be a textbook of nihilist kitsch, even more than compared to Soviet equivalent.

    @Yevardian
    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-201/#comment-5668807


    Letterbox feels like a site for the Tiktok generation

     

    Letterboxd is perhaps not bad because of the quantity of people writing reviews is so high. There is some wisdom of crowds.

    A problem is if many people are seeing the films on their phone or notebook, from streaming sites. But film is mostly visual (where narrative or "characterization" is often not so much more realistic than in your ordinary dream). So, if someone sees a film on their phone or notebook, it can be a much more narrow criteria for judging than in a cinema or OLED, where you are sometimes hypnotized by also visual things.

    Replies: @songbird

    But surely “Ferris Bueller’s Day Off” could be a textbook of nihilist kitsch, even more than compared to Soviet equivalent.

    LMAO. Is it not like Tom Sawyer? And does not it hit a bit against materialism with the scenes in Cameron’s (rich) home? I will shamelessly repeat myself, when I say that I think it is the quintessential film for American schoolkids.

    [MORE]

    But one scene that I remember being a little weirded out by was the scene where Ferris lip syncs Danke Schoen. It really sounds like a woman is singing it, but I did not realize this was Wayne Newton, which if anything weirds me out more.

    The guy who plays the principal was unfortunately some Hollywood pederast, which makes it hard to see the movies he was in, the quite good Amadeus, and the terrible Howard the Duck (both ’80s movies), the TV cut of which I enjoyed as a kid, but which is really quite a powerfully strange movie.

    IIRC, you liked The Breakfast Club, which I have always disdained as being too artificial and too much like a play. Have you seen any other John Hughes movies, or is that it? Many in the catalog. Swedish Family used to be a big fan, as I recall.

    You should watch Planes, Trains, and Automobiles. It is what I would call another rare quintessentially American film. In part, because it is about Thanksgiving, but also the massive size of America.

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @songbird


    It really sounds like a woman is singing it, but I did not realize this was Wayne Newton, which if anything weirds me out more.
     
    Wayne Newton might be the weirdest man in public life in the world. He set off the gaydar of a large fraction of the world. Some weird genetics but he is not a homo. Apparently he proved this to everybody in the city of Las Vegas by shagging women there at unbreakable record rates. Like 3 a day for thirty years or something that makes your weiner sore just to ponder.

    Then when he got old he got about fifty plastic surgeries on his face.

    Truly a Las Vegas icon.
  165. @Mikel
    @Yahya


    Football players don’t seem that bright to me.
     
    I would even argue that a negative correlation exists between excellence at soccer and general IQ. But soccer does require good visual and spatial-temporal skills, which may explain showmethereal's observation.

    I've only watched the US match so far and they're definitely getting better, btw, in spite of the disappointing score. With all the money and potential talent available, the US should eventually become one of the big teams.

    Replies: @Yevardian, @showmethereal

    US kids don’t grow up with the ball at their feet. Playing a sport using your feet to manipulate objects is counter-intuitive. And American crowds have low attention spans. Both are essential keys.

  166. @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @showmethereal


    East Asians lack the overall athleticism.
     
    Speak for yourself, fucking loser.

    Don't drag down other East Asians with you, China hasn't beaten Japan and SK in twenty years--

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/China-Japan_football_rivalry
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/China-South_Korea_football_rivalry

    Organic sports organisation is anathema to the CCP, that's the reason why,

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_football_league_system
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dai_Nippon_Butoku_Kai

    Replies: @showmethereal

    How many Japanese or Korean players are in t he top leagues compared to their size? And since you claim it’s a CPC problem then what about the Chinese in Taiwan and Hong Kong and even in the UK and Australia? Face facts instead of being an idiot trying to insult others. East Asian – especially Chinese women – do better than the men in those types of sports. Stop lying to yourself. Only idiots who believe in a master race believe that their race is great at everything


  167. https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-201/#comment-5669733

    folks on the right who argue against “depopulation” do this for their own people, not the global population

    If you remember most of our history, our population has been between 10,000 people to 100,000 people. Latvia today has maybe 20-200 times more people than would have been seeming natural for the population of all humans in this planet for most our time here. World population of humans was less than in a football stadium today.

    Sometimes people don’t think about numbers, to avoid how strange and unnatural our situation is. If you understand the numbers are so large, it is impossible they are not devaluing the individual’s life. (If there were 1000 people, just your ordinary biological reality could be 800 million times more unique than it is.)

    If you want to not generalize about a nationality and know them directly in our modern high population world. For example, to meet the citizens of the Russian Federation to know their views about war, if you would meet one person every ten minutes for 12 hours per day, for 7 days each week, it will be 6000 years before you meet the now living population of the country.

    But if you want to ask the Ukrainians about their opinion, it would be more than 1700 years of your 12 hour working days without weekends.

    [MORE]

    So, of course, these are not very natural, abstract desires, based in projecting of the size of the population of vastly inconceivable size of tribes and their even larger competitor tribes, which are not really tribes anymore (because a tribe would have just some 80-100 people).

    We live in the post-agriculture, post-industrialization times, with vast numbers we cannot understand, which our ancestors could not imagine about, but then we have considered this life normal, and sometimes in dysfunctional ways. For example, the celebrity worship is because we are designed for groups of not more than around 100, so there is part of our thoughts which is identifying celebrities we see regularly with a warm feeling like they are people of our family or team.

    We have no connection to these celebrities and politicians, but the politicians especially can exploit our lack of adaptation to modern world, by projecting their role as a father or tribal leader.

    symbolizes not so much “depopulation” or lack of people per se, but that it is romantic for a couple to be alone, the idea is almost that the rest of the world doesn’t exist, but only two people exist who are special to each other,

    But it’s not only for the couple enjoyable, but also for a family, or group of friends. Anytime when you are the only people, but which is also controlled nature, is like this. For example, when your group go to the cinema or the museum, and there is no other customer than yourselves.

    These are the standard part of luxury vacation, but also of the medieval monastery, of the royal palace, of the rich people’s country mansion. On one side it has all the benefits of civilization, on the other side, without the people. I.e. “Garden of Eden”.

    By comparison, the anti-romantic, is when you see other people who can substitute for yourself. For example, you go to a restaurant as a couple, and there too many other couples there.

    Cult “Moonie wedding” is the really the anti-wedding, because it is designed to devalue the idea of the wedding. People are dissolved to become a group which is not exactly human anymore, but far more powerful than any human, and open to exploitation by the human who is able to direct it. Of course, a lot of our culture and programming of a last few hundred years has been like a Moonie wedding.

    that’s where it begins and the next step is an environment that is good for family formation. That’s why I mentioned that these Guardian articles may have an agenda or at least they are not hitting the mark in understanding these developments. They’re focusing on depopulating areas, while at the same time there are pockets that are growing, with relatively decent TFR

    But I mean what do you actually want in your life? What makes you happy in real life, not in political abstractions. I don’t think increasing our already vast quantity is a desire commonly people feel, even if it is sensible to say in political talks. It’s necessary for the comfort of our modern civilization.

    Without our vast quantity, our economy would not be going, we would not have this wealth, we would not have comfort, we would not have army, we would not have sports teams to “represent us”, we would not possibility for millionaires and billionaires. Without replacement fertility rates and aging population, our financial system could collapse. Without replacement fertility rates, our politicians will use immigration instead. So, it’s a common view of the political people to desire it. But when they looked in their soul, it’s not like anyone really enjoys being diluted with even more than our vast numbers. At best, maybe there is some “sublime” sense about our vast quantities.

    you’re right but wouldn’t the situation be worse without the maternity capital? These payments should be made, but I don’t think they’re the key.

    Maternity capital reduces the poverty rate, but doesn’t seem to effect on the fertility rate, according to the demographers, and now the government seems to be accepting this more openly. January 2023, they go to the unified allowance for families with any children, not above replacement fertility. (https://www.interfax.ru/russia/871568)

    This doesn’t imply maternity capital is necessarily bad policy, as one of the extremes in Russia is inequality.

    So, officials have said maternity capital was successful to reduce the poverty rate, but not effect the fertility rate. In terms of population replacement, one of the effects of maternity capital is likely to move forward the timing of births, instead of increasing their number. To small extent, this could reduce the future population by slightly reducing the time space between generations. If you are below replacement fertility, then reducing the time space between generations will increase the rate of natural population decline (although this increase in rate of fall would only begin in around 2050s).

    That’s kind of scary, I wonder what is the way out of that, if that’s the case.

    Maybe there could be at least still potential reduction of the accounting problems, increasing pension age and improving the health of the population.

    But you can’t improve the health so much without reducing peoples’ liberty for choice. And a lot of people wouldn’t want to continue working even if they were healthy.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Dmitry


    But it’s not only for the couple enjoyable, but also for a family, or group of friends. Anytime when you are the only people, but which is also controlled nature, is like this. For example, when your group go to the cinema or the museum, and there is no other customer than yourselves.
     
    They're not at all comparable. A couple in love truly doesn't care if there is nobody else around. But a family or group of friends going to the movies or a museum or a restaurant would react very poorly if there were nobody else around. The presence of other people is an important ingredient in making the outing enjoyable. And the presence of too many of the 'wrong sort of people' - use your imagination - can completely spoil the outing. When you go somewhere, even if you're the biggest libtard on the planet, you have a mental picture of the sort of people you expect to find there, so if one day you show up and the place turns out to be, say, three quarters pajeets and you've never seen that before, it'll be a very different experience to the one you were expecting (leaving you scratching your head wondering if it's not Indian independence day or something that caused you to have such an unfortunate experience).

    Replies: @Dmitry

    , @Dmitry
    @Dmitry


    (If there were 1000 people, just your ordinary biological reality could be 800 million times more unique than it is.
     
    Typo -" (If there were 1000 people, just your ordinary biological reality could be 8 million times more unique than it is."
  168. @Dmitry
    @LatW
    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-201/#comment-5669733

    folks on the right who argue against “depopulation” do this for their own people, not the global population
     
    If you remember most of our history, our population has been between 10,000 people to 100,000 people. Latvia today has maybe 20-200 times more people than would have been seeming natural for the population of all humans in this planet for most our time here. World population of humans was less than in a football stadium today.

    Sometimes people don't think about numbers, to avoid how strange and unnatural our situation is. If you understand the numbers are so large, it is impossible they are not devaluing the individual's life. (If there were 1000 people, just your ordinary biological reality could be 800 million times more unique than it is.)

    If you want to not generalize about a nationality and know them directly in our modern high population world. For example, to meet the citizens of the Russian Federation to know their views about war, if you would meet one person every ten minutes for 12 hours per day, for 7 days each week, it will be 6000 years before you meet the now living population of the country.

    But if you want to ask the Ukrainians about their opinion, it would be more than 1700 years of your 12 hour working days without weekends.

    So, of course, these are not very natural, abstract desires, based in projecting of the size of the population of vastly inconceivable size of tribes and their even larger competitor tribes, which are not really tribes anymore (because a tribe would have just some 80-100 people).

    We live in the post-agriculture, post-industrialization times, with vast numbers we cannot understand, which our ancestors could not imagine about, but then we have considered this life normal, and sometimes in dysfunctional ways. For example, the celebrity worship is because we are designed for groups of not more than around 100, so there is part of our thoughts which is identifying celebrities we see regularly with a warm feeling like they are people of our family or team.

    We have no connection to these celebrities and politicians, but the politicians especially can exploit our lack of adaptation to modern world, by projecting their role as a father or tribal leader.


    symbolizes not so much “depopulation” or lack of people per se, but that it is romantic for a couple to be alone, the idea is almost that the rest of the world doesn’t exist, but only two people exist who are special to each other,

     

    But it's not only for the couple enjoyable, but also for a family, or group of friends. Anytime when you are the only people, but which is also controlled nature, is like this. For example, when your group go to the cinema or the museum, and there is no other customer than yourselves.

    These are the standard part of luxury vacation, but also of the medieval monastery, of the royal palace, of the rich people's country mansion. On one side it has all the benefits of civilization, on the other side, without the people. I.e. "Garden of Eden".

    By comparison, the anti-romantic, is when you see other people who can substitute for yourself. For example, you go to a restaurant as a couple, and there too many other couples there.

    Cult "Moonie wedding" is the really the anti-wedding, because it is designed to devalue the idea of the wedding. People are dissolved to become a group which is not exactly human anymore, but far more powerful than any human, and open to exploitation by the human who is able to direct it. Of course, a lot of our culture and programming of a last few hundred years has been like a Moonie wedding.


    that’s where it begins and the next step is an environment that is good for family formation. That’s why I mentioned that these Guardian articles may have an agenda or at least they are not hitting the mark in understanding these developments. They’re focusing on depopulating areas, while at the same time there are pockets that are growing, with relatively decent TFR
     

    But I mean what do you actually want in your life? What makes you happy in real life, not in political abstractions. I don't think increasing our already vast quantity is a desire commonly people feel, even if it is sensible to say in political talks. It's necessary for the comfort of our modern civilization.

    Without our vast quantity, our economy would not be going, we would not have this wealth, we would not have comfort, we would not have army, we would not have sports teams to "represent us", we would not possibility for millionaires and billionaires. Without replacement fertility rates and aging population, our financial system could collapse. Without replacement fertility rates, our politicians will use immigration instead. So, it's a common view of the political people to desire it. But when they looked in their soul, it's not like anyone really enjoys being diluted with even more than our vast numbers. At best, maybe there is some "sublime" sense about our vast quantities.


    you’re right but wouldn’t the situation be worse without the maternity capital? These payments should be made, but I don’t think they’re the key.
     
    Maternity capital reduces the poverty rate, but doesn't seem to effect on the fertility rate, according to the demographers, and now the government seems to be accepting this more openly. January 2023, they go to the unified allowance for families with any children, not above replacement fertility. (https://www.interfax.ru/russia/871568)

    This doesn't imply maternity capital is necessarily bad policy, as one of the extremes in Russia is inequality.

    So, officials have said maternity capital was successful to reduce the poverty rate, but not effect the fertility rate. In terms of population replacement, one of the effects of maternity capital is likely to move forward the timing of births, instead of increasing their number. To small extent, this could reduce the future population by slightly reducing the time space between generations. If you are below replacement fertility, then reducing the time space between generations will increase the rate of natural population decline (although this increase in rate of fall would only begin in around 2050s).


    That’s kind of scary, I wonder what is the way out of that, if that’s the case.
     
    Maybe there could be at least still potential reduction of the accounting problems, increasing pension age and improving the health of the population.

    But you can't improve the health so much without reducing peoples' liberty for choice. And a lot of people wouldn't want to continue working even if they were healthy.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @Dmitry

    But it’s not only for the couple enjoyable, but also for a family, or group of friends. Anytime when you are the only people, but which is also controlled nature, is like this. For example, when your group go to the cinema or the museum, and there is no other customer than yourselves.

    They’re not at all comparable. A couple in love truly doesn’t care if there is nobody else around. But a family or group of friends going to the movies or a museum or a restaurant would react very poorly if there were nobody else around. The presence of other people is an important ingredient in making the outing enjoyable. And the presence of too many of the ‘wrong sort of people’ – use your imagination – can completely spoil the outing. When you go somewhere, even if you’re the biggest libtard on the planet, you have a mental picture of the sort of people you expect to find there, so if one day you show up and the place turns out to be, say, three quarters pajeets and you’ve never seen that before, it’ll be a very different experience to the one you were expecting (leaving you scratching your head wondering if it’s not Indian independence day or something that caused you to have such an unfortunate experience).

    • Replies: @Dmitry
    @silviosilver


    a family or group of friends going to the movies or a museum or a restaurant
     
    The best vacation as a child, was when our family has our own beach, without anyone else. The best time with friends in youth, when we go home late enough, we have a center of a city like it is our property. The most enjoyable recent times in the cinema, when we are the only people in the cinema. And the best time in the museum, when there was no-one in the museum,

    A few weeks ago, we were the only people in the cafe, and it was great, like the feeling of being at home, but in the city.


    would react very poorly if there were nobody else around
     
    If you are alone, then you might like there to be other people. But if you are in a group, no other people is often perfect. Just look at your own experiences.
    .

    A couple in love truly doesn’t care if there is nobody else around
     
    Most couples are not in love at lot of the time and it's still of course better when you have the place as much as possible.

    Replies: @silviosilver

  169. @Dmitry
    @LatW
    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-201/#comment-5669733

    folks on the right who argue against “depopulation” do this for their own people, not the global population
     
    If you remember most of our history, our population has been between 10,000 people to 100,000 people. Latvia today has maybe 20-200 times more people than would have been seeming natural for the population of all humans in this planet for most our time here. World population of humans was less than in a football stadium today.

    Sometimes people don't think about numbers, to avoid how strange and unnatural our situation is. If you understand the numbers are so large, it is impossible they are not devaluing the individual's life. (If there were 1000 people, just your ordinary biological reality could be 800 million times more unique than it is.)

    If you want to not generalize about a nationality and know them directly in our modern high population world. For example, to meet the citizens of the Russian Federation to know their views about war, if you would meet one person every ten minutes for 12 hours per day, for 7 days each week, it will be 6000 years before you meet the now living population of the country.

    But if you want to ask the Ukrainians about their opinion, it would be more than 1700 years of your 12 hour working days without weekends.

    So, of course, these are not very natural, abstract desires, based in projecting of the size of the population of vastly inconceivable size of tribes and their even larger competitor tribes, which are not really tribes anymore (because a tribe would have just some 80-100 people).

    We live in the post-agriculture, post-industrialization times, with vast numbers we cannot understand, which our ancestors could not imagine about, but then we have considered this life normal, and sometimes in dysfunctional ways. For example, the celebrity worship is because we are designed for groups of not more than around 100, so there is part of our thoughts which is identifying celebrities we see regularly with a warm feeling like they are people of our family or team.

    We have no connection to these celebrities and politicians, but the politicians especially can exploit our lack of adaptation to modern world, by projecting their role as a father or tribal leader.


    symbolizes not so much “depopulation” or lack of people per se, but that it is romantic for a couple to be alone, the idea is almost that the rest of the world doesn’t exist, but only two people exist who are special to each other,

     

    But it's not only for the couple enjoyable, but also for a family, or group of friends. Anytime when you are the only people, but which is also controlled nature, is like this. For example, when your group go to the cinema or the museum, and there is no other customer than yourselves.

    These are the standard part of luxury vacation, but also of the medieval monastery, of the royal palace, of the rich people's country mansion. On one side it has all the benefits of civilization, on the other side, without the people. I.e. "Garden of Eden".

    By comparison, the anti-romantic, is when you see other people who can substitute for yourself. For example, you go to a restaurant as a couple, and there too many other couples there.

    Cult "Moonie wedding" is the really the anti-wedding, because it is designed to devalue the idea of the wedding. People are dissolved to become a group which is not exactly human anymore, but far more powerful than any human, and open to exploitation by the human who is able to direct it. Of course, a lot of our culture and programming of a last few hundred years has been like a Moonie wedding.


    that’s where it begins and the next step is an environment that is good for family formation. That’s why I mentioned that these Guardian articles may have an agenda or at least they are not hitting the mark in understanding these developments. They’re focusing on depopulating areas, while at the same time there are pockets that are growing, with relatively decent TFR
     

    But I mean what do you actually want in your life? What makes you happy in real life, not in political abstractions. I don't think increasing our already vast quantity is a desire commonly people feel, even if it is sensible to say in political talks. It's necessary for the comfort of our modern civilization.

    Without our vast quantity, our economy would not be going, we would not have this wealth, we would not have comfort, we would not have army, we would not have sports teams to "represent us", we would not possibility for millionaires and billionaires. Without replacement fertility rates and aging population, our financial system could collapse. Without replacement fertility rates, our politicians will use immigration instead. So, it's a common view of the political people to desire it. But when they looked in their soul, it's not like anyone really enjoys being diluted with even more than our vast numbers. At best, maybe there is some "sublime" sense about our vast quantities.


    you’re right but wouldn’t the situation be worse without the maternity capital? These payments should be made, but I don’t think they’re the key.
     
    Maternity capital reduces the poverty rate, but doesn't seem to effect on the fertility rate, according to the demographers, and now the government seems to be accepting this more openly. January 2023, they go to the unified allowance for families with any children, not above replacement fertility. (https://www.interfax.ru/russia/871568)

    This doesn't imply maternity capital is necessarily bad policy, as one of the extremes in Russia is inequality.

    So, officials have said maternity capital was successful to reduce the poverty rate, but not effect the fertility rate. In terms of population replacement, one of the effects of maternity capital is likely to move forward the timing of births, instead of increasing their number. To small extent, this could reduce the future population by slightly reducing the time space between generations. If you are below replacement fertility, then reducing the time space between generations will increase the rate of natural population decline (although this increase in rate of fall would only begin in around 2050s).


    That’s kind of scary, I wonder what is the way out of that, if that’s the case.
     
    Maybe there could be at least still potential reduction of the accounting problems, increasing pension age and improving the health of the population.

    But you can't improve the health so much without reducing peoples' liberty for choice. And a lot of people wouldn't want to continue working even if they were healthy.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @Dmitry

    (If there were 1000 people, just your ordinary biological reality could be 800 million times more unique than it is.

    Typo -” (If there were 1000 people, just your ordinary biological reality could be 8 million times more unique than it is.”

  170. @silviosilver
    @Dmitry


    But it’s not only for the couple enjoyable, but also for a family, or group of friends. Anytime when you are the only people, but which is also controlled nature, is like this. For example, when your group go to the cinema or the museum, and there is no other customer than yourselves.
     
    They're not at all comparable. A couple in love truly doesn't care if there is nobody else around. But a family or group of friends going to the movies or a museum or a restaurant would react very poorly if there were nobody else around. The presence of other people is an important ingredient in making the outing enjoyable. And the presence of too many of the 'wrong sort of people' - use your imagination - can completely spoil the outing. When you go somewhere, even if you're the biggest libtard on the planet, you have a mental picture of the sort of people you expect to find there, so if one day you show up and the place turns out to be, say, three quarters pajeets and you've never seen that before, it'll be a very different experience to the one you were expecting (leaving you scratching your head wondering if it's not Indian independence day or something that caused you to have such an unfortunate experience).

    Replies: @Dmitry

    a family or group of friends going to the movies or a museum or a restaurant

    The best vacation as a child, was when our family has our own beach, without anyone else. The best time with friends in youth, when we go home late enough, we have a center of a city like it is our property. The most enjoyable recent times in the cinema, when we are the only people in the cinema. And the best time in the museum, when there was no-one in the museum,

    A few weeks ago, we were the only people in the cafe, and it was great, like the feeling of being at home, but in the city.

    would react very poorly if there were nobody else around

    If you are alone, then you might like there to be other people. But if you are in a group, no other people is often perfect. Just look at your own experiences.
    .

    A couple in love truly doesn’t care if there is nobody else around

    Most couples are not in love at lot of the time and it’s still of course better when you have the place as much as possible.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Dmitry


    Just look at your own experiences.
     
    Of course I consulted my own experiences (who else's would I?), but perhaps I erred in extrapolating too far from them. You and I may just be very different people. But probably more similar than you think, since I also strongly feel that western liberal societies are the best that have ever existed and nothing else really comes close. I just wish it could all take place in a racially and culturally reasonable context - a thought you're apparently completely unwilling to entertain. (The world's big enough for all of us, so why not?)

    To address your point again, there are places we go to get away from people and places we go in order to be around them. Some places lend themselves to both purpose, like the beach. If you feel like being alone, an empty beach can be perfect. If you want to have some fun in the sun, a crowded beach can be just the ticket. Other places, it strikes me as bizarre that a group of friends would prefer to be there alone. "We went to the nightclub bro and we were the only ones there, it was so cool!!" I can't imagine anyone ever saying that. To me, some of the examples you use fall into (or closer to) this category.

    Alone in a museum? Not sure about that. I wouldn't want it so packed I had to wait forever to see any of the exhibits, but it would definitely feel 'warmer' if there were other people there besides my own group. (Unless we were kids and the objective was to run wild, lol.) Generally, I think the rule is if a place is obviously built to hold a large number of people but there are only a few there, it feels kinda sad. Individual mileage would vary quite considerably here.

    Most couples are not in love at lot of the time
     
    Yeah I know, that's why I specified a couple in love, hoping to imply that they are feeling pretty in love in that moment. Anyway, I'll stop nitpicking you if you stop nitpicking me. I'm starting to feel like AP responding to every little detail lol.

    Replies: @Dmitry

  171. @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @Yahya

    Japan and SK are ok, about the same level as Middle Eastern teams. The fact that PRC is so bad points to a certain defect. Both the other two superpowers, US and Russia, don't really care about soccer, but put together respectable teams. And unlike India, China produces world class weightlifters and sprinters.

    Soccer requires creativity and flair which EAs lack. I think that's the main reason.

    Replies: @showmethereal, @Yahya

    Japan and SK are ok, about the same level as Middle Eastern teams.

    Doesn’t really say much, Middle Eastern teams are fairly mediocre. Theoretically, the MENA region and East Asia should be winning at least a few world cups, but literally all of them have gone to European and Latin American teams (the game is rigged!) But the point is that success in football doesn’t seem to be correlated with intelligence, Brazil and Argentina are hardly the highest IQ nations; but they put a solid showing in every tournament. African nations seem to be debilitated by their extreme poverty and lack of resources for training facilities or the like. But MENA and East Asian countries don’t have that excuse really.

    You’d think China and India, with 2.5 billion people among them, would at least be able to find 11 world-class players who can take them all the way to victory in the finals. There are tiny nations like Uruguay and Netherlands, with but a percentage of China and India’s populations, who have won the world cup.

    The fact that PRC is so bad points to a certain defect.

    Japan and South Korea oddly seem to outgun China on almost every cultural endeavor, even though the latter is 10x larger in population. The people who tend to narrowly focus on East Asian lack of cultural productivity compared to the West are missing the significant intra-East Asian differences in output as well. I haven’t seen many good explanations for this. Lee Kuan Yew posited that China is hindered by a culture that does not permit a free exchange of ideas; a language that shapes thinking through epigrams; and 4,000 years of texts that suggest everything worth saying has already been said, and said better by earlier writers. He once advised the Chinese leadership make English the first language, though much as I respect Lee, strikes me as a materialistic and self-abasing idea.

    I would be interested to hear your explanation as to China’s underperformance vis-a-vis Japan and Korea.

    Soccer requires creativity and flair which EAs lack. I think that’s the main reason.

    I think there’s some truth in the age-old stereotype of East Asian lack of creativity, but as usual HBDists tend to overdo it. I wrote a post on this topic here: https://www.unz.com/isteve/math-vs-reading-test-score-tilts-internationally/#comment-5332386

    • Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @Yahya

    Soccer is similar to chasing girls, you need to fit some basic level of requirements, beyond that it depends more on confidence, je ne sais quoi. Latin guys usually fit the stereotype, hence the term "Romance". This is also true in basketball where Spain/Argentina routinely beat black teams.

    Two of the top ten current players are MENA, but historically e.g. Zidane, Özil, play for European national teams.

    https://www.theguardian.com/football/ng-interactive/2021/dec/21/the-100-best-male-footballers-in-the-world-2021

    East Asians are historically the least confident. Japs and Koreans are better. PRC Chinese are not only bottom feeders, they drag down the reputation of everyone else.

    But unlike India, China is a powerhouse in wide range of Olympic sports, so there is an incongruence.

    *Indians probably have some genetic limitation, but an Indian guy won gold in javelin which is a well-rounded sport, so who knows.

    Some simple reasons is EA is much more dense than everywhere else, so less soccer fields. EAs have a much more demanding education system so less time.


    Japan and South Korea oddly seem to outgun China on almost every cultural endeavor
     

    strikes me as a materialistic and self-abasing

     

    Self-abasing is the main reason. The Chinese term is 茶毒 chá dú meaning "spiritually poison/maim". It's very typically in education and parenting to brainwash kids they are only fit to do such and such.

    This was a big deal in sports history. The reaction of many Chinese was actually self-abasing and negative, not only do they lack confidence they want to drag down and discredit those who succeed,

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/the-streak-is-broken-chinas-su-bingtian-is-fastest-qualifier-in-race-to-be-the-worlds-fastest-man/


    a language that shapes thinking through epigrams; and 4,000 years of texts that suggest everything worth saying has already been said, and said better by earlier writers.

     

    This isn't the problem, the best testimony for hanzi is that the Japanese uses it.

    PRC is strong in top-down organisation thus its very capable in Olympic sports, so I'm still very bullish on China's industrial development, but I'm much less bullish on PRC's soft power, charisma and team sports performance.

    Enjoy your perspective btw.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    , @showmethereal
    @Yahya

    Comparing China to South Korea and Japan in football is easy. China started playing the game on a grass roots level much much later. Once China started to focus on summer Olympic sports it passed Japan in medals. Now it passed everyone except the US and almost beat the US. Now that if focuses on Winter Olympic sports it beat Japan and South Korea. That’s with about 8 years of work. Football the Chinese women beat other Asians. Why the men don’t is another matter. As to culture - don’t go by what westerners tell you. They boost Korea and Japan because they are western Allies.

    But back to football - in 20 years China will do much better. But will it win? I have doubts. Same with basketball- China is getting better (it’s the second most popular sport) but there are certain physical attributes that just aren’t in the gene pool as readily. China will produce more Jeremy Lins than they will Yao Ming. Meaning Jeremy Lin was pretty good but not an “all star”. Yao Ming was a Hall of Famer. Same will happen with football in my mind. A could of Chinese have made it to top European leagues…. Like Koreans and Japanese before. But I doubt they become too 10. Top 20 is more realistic.

    Ironically Japan beat Germany 2-1. Completely shocking. But don’t expect Japan to win the tournament. And don’t expect them to repeatedly beat Germany either in the future.

    And Germany has been one of the best in the world for 100 years. They are NOT known for flair players though. Football is a multi faceted sport. Brazil and Germany have won the most World Cups between them and yet play completely differently! Italy has won the 3rd most and again plays completely differently. They were always thought of as a more defensive side with rarely having flair players either. Germany was always thought of for their machine like efficiency. It is Brazil that is know for flair and creativity. Only the Dutch and Argentines have been though of to have as much flair and creativity. Argentina has won more than the Dutch though. Again - very complex

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms, @songbird

  172. @Yevardian
    @Mikel

    Just quickly surveying, I noticed there's a Basque football team that draws from both France and Spain, which could be considered quite provocative in itself, though of course I notice that isn't in FIFA. Actually, aside from the UK, are there any other sub-national teams competing in the WC? It feels funny that Scotland gets it's own representation, whilst enormous and far more distinct nations like Telugu or Tamils don't get teams.. though I'd guess Indians are terrible at soccer anyway (rather play cricket too).
    I see at the 'club' there's 'Bilboko Athletic Kluba' as well, though I guess its nothing special as I've never heard of it compared to famous Madrid and Barcelona teams which even I've heard of before.

    You might have seen this, I saw recently on El País that some curious historical fragment has recently been unearthed, now the earliest known written record of a Vasconic language.

    https://elpais.com/cultura/2022-11-14/un-equipo-de-investigadores-afirma-haber-descubierto-en-navarra-la-primera-inscripcion-en-vasco-de-hace-2100-anos.html

    Replies: @Mikel, @silviosilver

    I see at the ‘club’ there’s ‘Bilboko Athletic Kluba’ as well, though I guess its nothing special as I’ve never heard of it compared to famous Madrid and Barcelona teams which even I’ve heard of before.

    Not sure if you’re being sarcastic here. : ) If you’ve honestly never heard of Athletico Bilbao though, they’re actually one of the most successful teams in Spanish club soccer, and they’ve managed that feat despite (or maybe because of?) their policy of using only Basque players. Even a non-sportsball fan could be impressed by that.

    although there do seem to be some Celtic toponyms interspersed here and there in a sea of Basque ancient toponyms. But considering that those theories are usually espoused by people with clear Spanish nationalist tendencies

    Years ago on some race/ethnicity forum (might have been Stirpes, now long defunct but once very good), I noticed a strain of Spanish nationalism that seemed to really go out of its way to play up “Celtic roots” – the sort of fathers who would force their kids to learn the bagpipes, lol. Have you ever had much personal experience with these types?

    Allowing five subs represents the kind of Americanisation that Steve Sailer has long advocated. How can it be a team effort if half the players that finish didn’t start the match?

    Well, I think you could just as well argue that the rule makes it more of a team effort, since it involves more people who are part of the (larger) team. But I can understand why ‘purist’ fans – which soccer is chock full of – would be put off by the changes. I really don’t care anymore. Soccer has gone from my favorite sport when I was a teen, to something I can barely muster the energy to google the results of. The reason is mostly racial – who cares what a half nigged (soon to be 100%) “France” or “England” does – but not solely. In hindsight, the Bosman ruling totally wrecked European soccer. As early as the late 90s Chelsea could field a team without a single actual Englishman on it. I was still a huge fan, but I thought that was seriously messed up.

    @Barbie

    I’d say that there is a big difference between playing sports and watching sports. The latter has little redeeming value while the former has a number of good attributes.

    Yes, the sad little sporstball fan is a sitting duck for absolutist judgments like this. However, if you compare sporstball fandom to alternative uses of leisure time, there are obviously far worse things that the average fan – of decidedly average human ‘quality’ – could be doing. At a very basic level, reading sports journalism is likely the only reading some fans would ever do, and if not for that, then nothing. So that counts as a plus. Fandom also imparts some lessons in patience and coping with disappointment, and even restraint and hope (it’s not over till it’s over). Of course, there are more effective ways to imbibe those same lessons, but again you have to weigh that against the likelihood that the average fan would ever do so.

    • Replies: @Mikel
    @silviosilver


    Have you ever had much personal experience with these types?
     
    Fortunately no. It's very difficult to find such types IRL. But every mention of our being genetically different from them irritates Spaniards no end. You see pundits and even some politicians losing their cool at the idea. This is in part understandable after so many years of my separatists countrymen committing atrocities. That obviously generates lots of resentment (but strangely very little desire to let us go). However, this sentiment has deeper roots.

    An idea quite popular among Spanish patriots in the times before genetic studies was that "Basques were the real, original Spaniards". To a certain extent, the current genetic understanding has proven them right. The genetic distinction between us and neighboring populations is that after the IE invasions of the Iron Age we received very little admixture from other sources so I guess we are quite representative of the population that existed in the Atlantic/Southwestern area of Europe in the early Iron Age. The mystery though is that we have the highest percentage of the R1b IE haplogroup in Europe, along with the Welsh, but we managed to keep a non-IE language.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    , @Matra
    @silviosilver


    If you’ve honestly never heard of Athletico Bilbao though, they’re actually one of the most successful teams in Spanish club soccer, and they’ve managed that feat despite (or maybe because of?) their policy of using only Basque players.
     
    Just to be clear it means the players must come from the Basque country, and they might be flexible about what that means. I don't know if you even have to be born there or can join a club as kid straight from Africa and be classified as Basque. Last time I saw them play they had one black player. Tracing his DNA would tell not solve any puzzles about Basque origins.

    But I can understand why ‘purist’ fans – which soccer is chock full of – would be put off by the changes.
     
    I'm anything but a purist but the Americanisation of sports is mostly a bad thing. (Though I noticed you Aussies were quicker to embrace that in rugby league and other sports than the Brits, maybe 'colonials' are more open to change). Even in Canada many older hockey people prefer watching IIHF sanctioned games that can have ties (unless they've changed that) and end in two hours because they don't have TV timeouts like the wretched NHL. Everything in post-1960s America is a big bloated production full of hype, overwrought sentimentality, not to mention the worshipping of black people.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @A123, @Mikel

    , @Barbarossa
    @silviosilver


    the sad little sporstball fan is a sitting duck for absolutist judgments like this.
     
    I don't know if it's meant to be exactly absolutist, but in my mind it has to do with having a sense of civilizational ideals or aspirations. It doesn't mean that sportsball fans have to be castigated, but at the same time if it's all that someone has for interests going in their lives it's rather sad and their should be no issue with being clear as a society that we prize other aspiration more highly. Having no sense of relative standards also means that it's that much more unlikely that most will ever shoot for higher since they may remain ignorant of higher ideals.

    We get stuck in an endless degenerative loop of, "Thank God that junior's in here playing Call of Duty! He could be out there axe murdering people, you now!"

    Sports fandom seems like something which is okay in small doses, but when it becomes one's major interest in life it just seems rather unhinged to me. I knew a guy at a job many years ago who was a Yankees fanatic and bragged about how he watched all of every single Yankees game every year. I thought he was nuts, but then again he thought I was some sort of degenerate for not owning a TV so maybe we were even!
  173. @Dmitry
    @silviosilver


    a family or group of friends going to the movies or a museum or a restaurant
     
    The best vacation as a child, was when our family has our own beach, without anyone else. The best time with friends in youth, when we go home late enough, we have a center of a city like it is our property. The most enjoyable recent times in the cinema, when we are the only people in the cinema. And the best time in the museum, when there was no-one in the museum,

    A few weeks ago, we were the only people in the cafe, and it was great, like the feeling of being at home, but in the city.


    would react very poorly if there were nobody else around
     
    If you are alone, then you might like there to be other people. But if you are in a group, no other people is often perfect. Just look at your own experiences.
    .

    A couple in love truly doesn’t care if there is nobody else around
     
    Most couples are not in love at lot of the time and it's still of course better when you have the place as much as possible.

    Replies: @silviosilver

    Just look at your own experiences.

    Of course I consulted my own experiences (who else’s would I?), but perhaps I erred in extrapolating too far from them. You and I may just be very different people. But probably more similar than you think, since I also strongly feel that western liberal societies are the best that have ever existed and nothing else really comes close. I just wish it could all take place in a racially and culturally reasonable context – a thought you’re apparently completely unwilling to entertain. (The world’s big enough for all of us, so why not?)

    To address your point again, there are places we go to get away from people and places we go in order to be around them. Some places lend themselves to both purpose, like the beach. If you feel like being alone, an empty beach can be perfect. If you want to have some fun in the sun, a crowded beach can be just the ticket. Other places, it strikes me as bizarre that a group of friends would prefer to be there alone. “We went to the nightclub bro and we were the only ones there, it was so cool!!” I can’t imagine anyone ever saying that. To me, some of the examples you use fall into (or closer to) this category.

    Alone in a museum? Not sure about that. I wouldn’t want it so packed I had to wait forever to see any of the exhibits, but it would definitely feel ‘warmer’ if there were other people there besides my own group. (Unless we were kids and the objective was to run wild, lol.) Generally, I think the rule is if a place is obviously built to hold a large number of people but there are only a few there, it feels kinda sad. Individual mileage would vary quite considerably here.

    Most couples are not in love at lot of the time

    Yeah I know, that’s why I specified a couple in love, hoping to imply that they are feeling pretty in love in that moment. Anyway, I’ll stop nitpicking you if you stop nitpicking me. I’m starting to feel like AP responding to every little detail lol.

    • Replies: @Dmitry
    @silviosilver


    bizarre that a group of friends would prefer to be there alone. “We went to the nightclub
     
    Maybe not if you go to the nightclub to meet women, but if you are with friends or colleagues, even then it is often more pleasant when it is mostly empty except your group. This is also the theme for "VIP" spaces in that industry.

    By the way, think about the experiences which are expensive. Why do wealthy people buy a yacht, instead of going with the Carnival Cruises?

    Yacht goes to the same places as Carnival Cruises, with less luxury, less options for food, less entertainment. Carnival Cruise ship has 50 difference restaurants, but it is full of other people. Yacht is less luxurious than any cruise ship, but it is without the other people.

    Yacht is a private space, which can go to an empty beach, which only has family and staff. Billionaire's yatcht carries the comfortable level of a middle class suburban house to non-human natural spaces.

    It combines the comfortable world of civilization, with the empty world of our ancestors. For most of our history, except a very recent time, our world population was some thousands and our society was around 100 people. The problem in our ancestor's time was the difficulty of nature, as Marx has written.

    But when the difficulty of nature is resolved (e.g. billionaire's yacht), then of course the soul feels more comfortable to go to the empty spaces, than in the Carnival Cruise. It is without this recent, unnatural experience of large numbers of people.

    Most of our ancestors have never experienced a large number of people before around 80 generations in the past. But in tens of thousands of generations our ancestors were living with mostly empty and depopulated planet, seeing less people in all life, than modern people see every day.


    it would definitely feel ‘warmer’ if there were other people there besides my own group. (Unless we were kids and the objective was to run wild,
     
    I've been often in the museums when they are empty or almost empty. It's definitely better if it is a museum with interesting objects, as you are alone with the objects, like they were in your house.

    If it was a bad museum, then you might not want it to be empty, but I'm not sure you enjoy it even with people, unless you are visiting an interesting country. It's true when you are in vacation, even just people watching can become interesting.


    why I specified a couple in love, hoping to imply that they are feeling pretty in love in that moment
     
    Sure, but even a couple not in love, will be feeling a better mood in empty Venice, than Venice full of tourists.

    I'm not talking about "abandoned" in the sense that it is like post-apocalypse. Or "vacation to Vorkuta". But I mean, when it is the same as normal civilization, but without all the people. This is just luxury.

    Replies: @silviosilver

  174. I guess the Russian reaction has dwindled to the point Unz can shut down the blog. It’s amazing how we can be on the verge of WWIII with a country yet pretend it doesn’t exist. Spain, world music, movies, DIE indoctrination along with the Republican capitulation to mass uncontrolled immigration but not much about Russia around here.

    You people are pretty feckless, aren’t you.

    • LOL: Yahya, A123
    • Replies: @A123
    @Unintended Consequence


    It’s amazing how we can be on the verge of WWIII with a country yet pretend it doesn’t exist. ... not much about Russia around here.
     
    What should be said that has not be said multiple times before?

    There is no WW III coming, even if Putin uses multiple strategic nukes in the Ukraine. American SJW's have a very thin surface preference for 🇺🇦 as virtue signalling in tweets. How many Leftoids would actually sign up and risk death for them. What % of Americans could find Ukraine on a globe?

    The Ukie Maximalists posting here cannot be engaged on the topic. They lie repeatedly, shamelessly misrepresent facts, are willingly blind to Kiev's war crimes, and at least one of them is dangerously mentally ill. Those extremists have pushed most of those who started in the middle, including myself, firmly into Putin's camp.

    What is to be gained by screaming at each other?
    ___

    In may ways talking about America is discussion of the fiasco in Ukraine.

    There will be less money for Kiev aggression starting next year, and the previous flows will be audited for misuse. What will the Paris-Berlin axis do when their U.S. puppet becomes less effective at delivering the cash?

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

  175. @Yevardian
    @Yevardian

    Reminds me, I might post some Turkish music I like from the classic 'Anatolian Rock' era, mostly from the 70s-80s. Perhaps Yahya could comment if any of this stuff is popular in the Arab world, definitely Turkish music remains very popular in Iran and in the Caucasus. Though my impression is that it isn't, I think something non-MENA people don't appreciate is how deep the cultural divide is between the Semitic world and the Turko-Iranian one in the region, its at least on the level of that between Northern and Southern Europe. I say 'Semitic' because I think its quite underestimated how influenced Israeli popular culture is by the Arab world.. although Turkish and Iranian influence there is virtually nil.

    'Psychadelic rock' with local flavour from Erkin Koray:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U0gjwpMb-k8

    Very 60's bubblegum, change the language and you can easily see this being an British invasion hit:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cUoJ9SUxwd0

    One of Baris Manco's many hits:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BI6Nk1cXBvk

    Mellow number from Esmeray:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpaobkArtFk

    60s tropic lounge-style:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cjx4CIVdWec

    Typical Anatolian Rock of the era from Altay:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OiTWl20BghY

    One Manco's better English-language attempts, I suspect he memorised the lyrics without understanding much, some of his live performances of this are totally unintelligible imao:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bGu7-xwcxYE

    Baris Manco again:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fa2L-A2sS-4

    Erkin Koray:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysekxL-cPQ0

    Manco:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZWHbfr9iBs

    One of Manco's most covered songs:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GUKIEjmQ1Bc

    A lesser known 70s Turkish group I remembered at random:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ln6ya0xahG0

    Incidentally I know this from my mother's side, my father can't stand any of this stuff, which goes for almost anything except Western Classical Music really. I tried introducing him to Jazz when I was first getting into the genre. Although he didn't actually hate it, after the novelty wore off he quickly lost interest.

    Replies: @Yahya

    Incidentally I know this from my mother’s side, my father can’t stand any of this stuff, which goes for almost anything except Western Classical Music really. I tried introducing him to Jazz when I was first getting into the genre. Although he didn’t actually hate it, after the novelty wore off he quickly lost interest.

    Your father and I are kindred souls; I couldn’t listen to any of the stuff you posted. I was actually impressed by the beginning instrumentation of the first Erkin Koray tune; until he started singing in that psychedelic style which I can’t stand. I told the Dragon Man before that my musical tastes tends towards the orderly and mundane; never got into jazz, electronic, hip-hop, dance, rock or psychedelic music. My reaction to jazz was pretty much identical to your father’s. Perhaps you can recommend the Arabic pieces I posted above, I think he might like some of them.

    From Turkey I am a fan of their classical tradition. I wrote a lengthy post on it to Bashibuzuk here: https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-198/#comment-5581415

    It’s fairly similar to Arabic music, as it is based on the Maqam/Makam/Mugham system utilized by the Arab world, Turkey, and Azerbaijan; though surprisingly it took me a while to get accustomed to it. I cannot comment on the popularity or lack thereof of Anatolian Rock in the Arab world; since i’ve never listened to any till today, though I was vaguely familiar with the genre. All I know is that i’ve never heard a Turkish tune being played on TV, radio or in outdoor settings; though Turkish TV shows are ubiquitous on MBC (a pan-Arab TV network watched all over the Arab World). My friends mostly listen to the basest forms of Western music, stuff that make my ears bleed.

    Iran – zero. The cultural separation between Iran and the Arab world is several times greater than with Turkey, perhaps owing to the residual Ottoman influence of the latter. I do not have experiences like you of watching The Lizard or listening to Banan with family; I had to explore Iranian cinema and music by myself. I largely agree with your take on the division between the Semitic and Turco-Persian worlds. I’ve seen several Israeli renditions of classical Arabic songs, unsurprisingly from the Mizrahim of that country. Though Arabic cultures popularity with Mizrahi seems strange considering the hatred they have for us. I should point out though that some Turks like listening to Arabic music as well; I see them in the comment sections of many Arabic songs. And occasionally I come across Turkish renditions of Arabic songs, such as this tasteful adaptation of Lena Chamamyan’s Baali Maak by Selva Erdener:

    Regarding Turkey and Iran’s influence; obviously both of them try to gain favor with the prestige Arab world in their quest to lead the Islamic Ummah. Iran has been more successful, even though it faces a steeper battle given its cultural distance and more importantly, Shia disposition, which puts it at odds with Sunni Arabs in the region. Turkey should have done better considering many Arab elites in places like Egypt and Algeria have recent Turkish ancestry. But Erdogan really played his cards wrong, supporting the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt, opposing Assad in Syria, and picking fights with the Gulf Arab monarchies. Virtually the only “nation” he has any influence over is tiny Qatar. Iran has done well given the poor cards they were dealt, but they too are treated with suspicion and hostility by most of the Arab World, as I demonstrated in my reply to you some months ago.

    I remember going through a phase of listening to Serbian ‘turbofolk, some extremely ‘powerful’ lyrics and musicvideos, though my impression was that only Roki Vulavic had genuine talent as singer.

    Lol, these videos seem like self-parodies.

    I’m a huge fan of Balkan folk music. This piece of Bulgarian polyphonic music is exquisite:

    • Thanks: Mr. Hack
    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @Yahya

    It's even more difficult for somebody who's not a native or a real connoisseur of Middle Eastern music to discern regional differences. Ardeshir Farah is a native of Iran and Jorge Strunz of Cota Rica. For many years now, they've been playing together and putting together albums of pure exotic joy, including a blend of "highly virtuosic, rhythmic, and improvisation-rich original instrumental compositions, against a backdrop of native sounds, including Spanish, Iranian, Arabic and South American influences. This album is a collection of their Middle Eastern influenced music. Obviously, they surround themselves with top-notch studio musicians too (I particularly like the two violin players that are highlighted within this album). I'd be interested in hearing your opinion of this album, and what regional influences that you detect - enjoy!

    https://open.spotify.com/album/7CKP7tNlbSvmNkaZ0NHb7E?si=sxk00KNnSHqrstAA_ZAKtA

    Replies: @Yahya

    , @Barbarossa
    @Yahya

    I've been going through your music suggestions from throughout the thread and have been enjoying everything quite a bit, so thanks for sharing those. I have a pretty broad appreciation for any high quality music regardless of extraction, but I tend to not listen to it for a extended periods of time. I'll be likely to binge on a bunch or your suggestions and connected music for a week or so and perhaps not return to anything like it for many months. I'm not sure why that is, but I suppose that even if I have a great deal of appreciation for something it still doesn't feel like my "thing".

    Even if I don't stick with it I'm enjoying it quite a bit and find it quite obvious that you have discriminating taste.

    At the Melkite church that we often go to their are quite a number of Lebanese and one man in particular who sings in Arabic. It's quite incredible. In general I find the Middle Eastern music/ singing to be incredibly emotive and rich. It just feels ancient.

    Replies: @Yahya

  176. @showmethereal
    @German_reader

    Well here is the problem with your thinking. With Russia and China actually helping those countries to develop they have less need to migrate. The most African students in the world study in China - not the west. But the overwhelming majority go back to their home nations. Again like the previous writer noted “different types of superpowers”.

    Replies: @Beckow, @Coconuts

    With Russia and China actually helping those countries to develop they have less need to migrate.

    There may be a kind of pattern developing related to political regime, so a hypothesis can be formed.

    Russia is a presidential republic with a managed democracy, China is a one-party organic democracy.
    Western countries are liberal parliamentary democracies. Liberal parliamentary regimes are probably most likely to invite permanent immigration from overseas and least able to prevent it happening, by their nature.

    The longer and stronger the liberal parliamentary tradition is, the more immigration and the more diverse it should be.

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @Coconuts

    You have a good point. And that is another good reason as to why Russia would not be open to mass migration. There is no reason to migrate somewhere if you can’t eventually “get the vote”. But those guys are being facetious. They see the flaws in the system for those who are proponents of western nationalism. On the flip side Russia - nor China - are the ones who colonized African nations. So they don’t speak Russian nor Chinese. They speak French and Belgian and English etc.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Coconuts

  177. @Unintended Consequence
    I guess the Russian reaction has dwindled to the point Unz can shut down the blog. It's amazing how we can be on the verge of WWIII with a country yet pretend it doesn't exist. Spain, world music, movies, DIE indoctrination along with the Republican capitulation to mass uncontrolled immigration but not much about Russia around here.

    You people are pretty feckless, aren't you.

    Replies: @A123

    It’s amazing how we can be on the verge of WWIII with a country yet pretend it doesn’t exist. … not much about Russia around here.

    What should be said that has not be said multiple times before?

    There is no WW III coming, even if Putin uses multiple strategic nukes in the Ukraine. American SJW’s have a very thin surface preference for 🇺🇦 as virtue signalling in tweets. How many Leftoids would actually sign up and risk death for them. What % of Americans could find Ukraine on a globe?

    The Ukie Maximalists posting here cannot be engaged on the topic. They lie repeatedly, shamelessly misrepresent facts, are willingly blind to Kiev’s war crimes, and at least one of them is dangerously mentally ill. Those extremists have pushed most of those who started in the middle, including myself, firmly into Putin’s camp.

    What is to be gained by screaming at each other?
    ___

    In may ways talking about America is discussion of the fiasco in Ukraine.

    There will be less money for Kiev aggression starting next year, and the previous flows will be audited for misuse. What will the Paris-Berlin axis do when their U.S. puppet becomes less effective at delivering the cash?

    PEACE 😇

    • Troll: Mr. Hack
    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @A123


    The Ukie Maximalists posting here cannot be engaged on the topic. They lie repeatedly, shamelessly misrepresent facts, are willingly blind to Kiev’s war crimes, and at least one of them is dangerously mentally ill.
     
    There you go again, kremlinstoogeA123, trying to malign those that simply disagree with your pro-kremlin views. It's you that's long overdo for a nap on the shrink's couch.

    https://s3.amazonaws.com/lowres.cartoonstock.com/miscellaneous-judge-morals-pot-kettle-black-mfln130_low.jpg
  178. @Barbarossa
    @silviosilver


    Sport is more than mere frivolity though.

     

    I'd say that there is a big difference between playing sports and watching sports. The latter has little redeeming value while the former has a number of good attributes.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @songbird

    It is remarkable how woke the NHL has become.

    Has to be the most blue-collar professional league in America in terms of fans. The core demographic of players, though shifted, is still fairly Euro, so one would think that there is not much sensitivity, for tranny stuff to latch onto.

    IMO, it serves as an interesting example, about the woke dynamic. Somewhat ignorantly and tentatively, I would suggest that perhaps, it has something to do with the owners, and/or perhaps the regime. (And one can extrapolate to other organizations.)

    [MORE]

    Of course, there was this story out of Ukraine a while back, which, IMO, seems to hint more specifically at the regime than anything else:
    https://www.cbssports.com/nhl/news/andrei-deniskin-suspended-for-racist-gesture-towards-black-american-hockey-player/

  179. @Barbarossa
    @songbird

    Yes, but I would be generous and raise the age to 70. While they are at it American political races should be settled via cage match. I feel it would improve the dignity of the political system over what we have today. Plus it would save a lot of time and provide greater entertainment value to boot!

    Replies: @songbird, @Mr. Hack, @A123

    Political cage match?

    International cage matches anyone?

  180. @songbird
    @Barbarossa

    A123 would be in a bind because he loves Trump, but Merkel turned 60 in 2014.

    Mr. Hack would be in a bind because he hates ageism, but Putin is 70.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    Ageism? I’ve been against Beckov style auschwitz solutions for individuals nearing retirement age. 70 actually seems too old for a presidential candidate, not to mention 80 as both Biden and Trump represent.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Mr. Hack

    Ideally, the best way to remove Biden from politics would have been some ethical test, such as when he plagiarized the speech of some UK politician, in his earliest presidential campaign, back in the '80s. Saving that, I think he should have been forcefully removed from politics, after having two aneurysms, before he was 50.

    IMO, Trump has lost a lot of his energy, I'm not sure anyone can think of something he said that was entertaining or bucking the status quo, in years. It was funny when he tweeted to Cher that her plastic surgery didn't work, but that was like ten years ago, and it is kind of pathetic that people are still living in old moments like that. (BTW, doesn't sound like he will come back to twitter).

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

  181. @Barbarossa
    @A123

    I'll point out that Trump is the only person who has even declared in the race, so it's hardly surprising that he has a commanding lead at this point. Polling like this is extremely meaningless at this point in the game. Once other candidates have declared and had a chance to get their message out in front of the electorate it will possible to draw some conclusions.

    Replies: @A123

    Polling like this is extremely meaningless at this point in the game. Once other candidates have declared and had a chance to get their message out in front of the electorate it will possible to draw some conclusions.

    Trump is getting his MAGA message out now. And, he has developed a great deal of “soft power” via endorsements, rallies, and fund raising.

    If DeSantis joins the race. What will he deliver as anti-MAGA messaging? And, how will he get that anti-MAGA message out?

    If DeSantis offends the MAGA base, he is pretty much doomed as a candidate. Many people believe that getting him to run now is actually a set-up for destruction. (1)

    DeSantis is now the favorite among many Republican voters and almost all conservative commentators for the Party presidential nomination. Such passionate advocates seem to have missed two essential points:

    • In a rigged electoral system, no Republican candidate, not even DeSantis, can be expected to win a national election. DeSantis cruised to victory in Florida because, as governor of the state, he had the means and the authority to ensure a clean election. But he would be helpless against a massive crime organization, aka the Democrat Party, which effectively controls the electoral infrastructure, the physical apparatus, the paid loyalty of election workers, and the federal agencies that oversee the process. If the system is not repaired and made answerable to the people, there will never be a Republican president again.

    • Should DeSantis run in 2024 and lose — which is increasingly likely in the current adulterated circumstances — the sequel would be devastating. Florida would be at the mercy of the next gubernatorial race since DeSantis is a unique political figure and could not be readily replaced. Additionally, DeSantis himself would have become a kind of displaced person, neither an American president nor a state governor. An invaluable political talent would have been sacrificed to the untutored enthusiasm of his supporters. If the American republican experiment is now in dire straits, it would then be expeditiously destroyed. A slim hope will have become an utter disaster.

    The best, really only, option for MAGA is to settle on Trump quickly. That leaves many months to decide to handle 2024 balloting (which may or may not be voting).

    ♦ Can it be cleaned up?
    ♦ Or, is the only choice going 100% all in on balloting for the MAGA side?

    I would prefer the former. However, I suspect that is not possible. The GOP will need its own Fultoning operation to win.
    ___

    Trump will continue to run until he obtains the result he won in 2020. If he gets that fairness, he will use up his second and last term when he leaves office in 2028.

    If the 2024 election is stolen again… Brace yourself for Trump 2028, Trump 2032, Trump, 2036, etc. The only way to achieve post-Trump MAGA is term limits. And, that means belatedly delivering a win to the man who already earned it.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://pjmedia.com/columns/david-solway-2/2022/11/11/desantis-2024-think-again-n1645202

    • Replies: @sudden death
    @A123


    Trump 2028, Trump 2032, Trump, 2036
     
    Somehow managed to miss the moment when he stopped aging and became immortal runner up;)

    Replies: @A123

  182. @A123
    @Unintended Consequence


    It’s amazing how we can be on the verge of WWIII with a country yet pretend it doesn’t exist. ... not much about Russia around here.
     
    What should be said that has not be said multiple times before?

    There is no WW III coming, even if Putin uses multiple strategic nukes in the Ukraine. American SJW's have a very thin surface preference for 🇺🇦 as virtue signalling in tweets. How many Leftoids would actually sign up and risk death for them. What % of Americans could find Ukraine on a globe?

    The Ukie Maximalists posting here cannot be engaged on the topic. They lie repeatedly, shamelessly misrepresent facts, are willingly blind to Kiev's war crimes, and at least one of them is dangerously mentally ill. Those extremists have pushed most of those who started in the middle, including myself, firmly into Putin's camp.

    What is to be gained by screaming at each other?
    ___

    In may ways talking about America is discussion of the fiasco in Ukraine.

    There will be less money for Kiev aggression starting next year, and the previous flows will be audited for misuse. What will the Paris-Berlin axis do when their U.S. puppet becomes less effective at delivering the cash?

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    The Ukie Maximalists posting here cannot be engaged on the topic. They lie repeatedly, shamelessly misrepresent facts, are willingly blind to Kiev’s war crimes, and at least one of them is dangerously mentally ill.

    There you go again, kremlinstoogeA123, trying to malign those that simply disagree with your pro-kremlin views. It’s you that’s long overdo for a nap on the shrink’s couch.

  183. @Barbarossa
    @songbird

    Yes, but I would be generous and raise the age to 70. While they are at it American political races should be settled via cage match. I feel it would improve the dignity of the political system over what we have today. Plus it would save a lot of time and provide greater entertainment value to boot!

    Replies: @songbird, @Mr. Hack, @A123

    While they are at it American political races should be settled via cage match. I feel it would improve the dignity of the political system over what we have today. Plus it would save a lot of time and provide greater entertainment value to boot!

    Celebrity Deathmatch did Lincoln versus Washington.
     

    I would happily take Trump versus Droolin Joe.

    PEACE 😇

    • Agree: Barbarossa
  184. @songbird
    @Dmitry


    But surely “Ferris Bueller’s Day Off” could be a textbook of nihilist kitsch, even more than compared to Soviet equivalent.
     
    LMAO. Is it not like Tom Sawyer? And does not it hit a bit against materialism with the scenes in Cameron's (rich) home? I will shamelessly repeat myself, when I say that I think it is the quintessential film for American schoolkids.

    But one scene that I remember being a little weirded out by was the scene where Ferris lip syncs Danke Schoen. It really sounds like a woman is singing it, but I did not realize this was Wayne Newton, which if anything weirds me out more.

    The guy who plays the principal was unfortunately some Hollywood pederast, which makes it hard to see the movies he was in, the quite good Amadeus, and the terrible Howard the Duck (both '80s movies), the TV cut of which I enjoyed as a kid, but which is really quite a powerfully strange movie.

    IIRC, you liked The Breakfast Club, which I have always disdained as being too artificial and too much like a play. Have you seen any other John Hughes movies, or is that it? Many in the catalog. Swedish Family used to be a big fan, as I recall.

    You should watch Planes, Trains, and Automobiles. It is what I would call another rare quintessentially American film. In part, because it is about Thanksgiving, but also the massive size of America.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    It really sounds like a woman is singing it, but I did not realize this was Wayne Newton, which if anything weirds me out more.

    Wayne Newton might be the weirdest man in public life in the world. He set off the gaydar of a large fraction of the world. Some weird genetics but he is not a homo. Apparently he proved this to everybody in the city of Las Vegas by shagging women there at unbreakable record rates. Like 3 a day for thirty years or something that makes your weiner sore just to ponder.

    Then when he got old he got about fifty plastic surgeries on his face.

    Truly a Las Vegas icon.

    • Thanks: songbird
  185. @Mr. Hack
    @songbird

    Ageism? I've been against Beckov style auschwitz solutions for individuals nearing retirement age. 70 actually seems too old for a presidential candidate, not to mention 80 as both Biden and Trump represent.

    https://a57.foxnews.com/static.foxnews.com/foxnews.com/content/uploads/2022/09/918/516/cartoon-0930223-copy.jpg?ve=1&tl=1

    Replies: @songbird

    Ideally, the best way to remove Biden from politics would have been some ethical test, such as when he plagiarized the speech of some UK politician, in his earliest presidential campaign, back in the ’80s. Saving that, I think he should have been forcefully removed from politics, after having two aneurysms, before he was 50.

    IMO, Trump has lost a lot of his energy, I’m not sure anyone can think of something he said that was entertaining or bucking the status quo, in years. It was funny when he tweeted to Cher that her plastic surgery didn’t work, but that was like ten years ago, and it is kind of pathetic that people are still living in old moments like that. (BTW, doesn’t sound like he will come back to twitter).

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @songbird


    (BTW, doesn’t sound like he will come back to twitter).
     
    He is now a direct business competition to twitter. He thinks he going to make maga bucks with truth social.

    https://www.politico.com/news/2022/11/22/trump-sec-truth-social-public-company-00070444

    I forgot this other trivia point on the Wayne Newton case. He is pro level on twenty or so different instruments. When he was selling out his casino show every night for years running he used to do numbers on the guitar, sax, piano, trumpet, accordion, + a couple others.
  186. @Wokechoke
    @Yevardian

    The thing is, all military operations do contain feints of one sort or another. There's always some bluff.

    The issue on Kiev was that there was an attempted Coup de Main on the Kiev Regime, which failed followed by that weird column of 40 miles with trucks that simply vanished. That was certainly some kind of distraction.

    What does it matter now that Russia mobilized?

    Replies: @LondonBob

    That forty mile truck convoy is one of the classic distractions of all time, can’t believe how much that hypnotised the media, and NATO, as the Russian’s secured the Crimea land bridge and surrounded Mariupol.

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @LondonBob

    The crazy thing is they thought Russia was that stupid as to have a long convoy of trucks to take Kiev with no protection.

  187. @silviosilver
    @Matra

    Where have you noticed this, on twitter?

    As for AK, he's not dooming that badly yet. He's still assigning a greater than 50% subjective probability to a positive outcome.

    Anyone watching the World Cup? Useless Argies, going down to a pack of sandnigs (Yahya beaming). Disgraceful. O tempora o mores.

    Replies: @Yahya, @Matra, @LondonBob

    Argentina have been rubbish for years now, wasn’t aware Di Maria was still playing.

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @LondonBob

    Huh? Argentina just won the Copa America and made the WC final as recently as 2014…. Had Higuan been remotely clinical they would have beaten Germany soundly

    Replies: @LondonBob

  188. So the rest of the Ukrainian electrical grid has now been taken out, surely a big Russian offensive coming shortly. The nightmare scenario has now unfolded for Europe, and the West. Plenty of chances to strike a deal, now the Russians aren’t interested, wave of refugees, economic collapse accelerating, blackouts and a decisive NATO defeat incoming. At least let us see the current ruling elite gone, rainbow flags and all.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @LondonBob


    At least let us see the current ruling elite gone, rainbow flags and all.
     
    You are overly optimistic. Considering mass stupidity, ignorance, and cuckedness of European and American population, Western ruling elites will keep rotting in power quite a few years yet. Remember, every nation has the government it deserves. No number of Russian strikes on hapless Ukraine can make Western nations suddenly deserve something better than the clowns they have. I know, it’s disappointing, but that’s how it is.
    , @A123
    @LondonBob


    So the rest of the Ukrainian electrical grid has now been taken out, surely a big Russian offensive coming shortly.
     
    Russia is treating the residents Kiev and other cities in the same way Ukrainian regimes treated the farmers in Crimea. It is an exact parallel. Hypocritical Ukie Maximalists are upset. However, their past outrages mean they cannot obtain traction beyond their true believers.

    Why "shortly"? Let the Kiev regime run itself ragged over the winter months. Their failures providing basic goods & services will diminish support among average Ukrainian civilians. They penalty for being too late is pretty clear in Gaddafi's tale. Zelensky is likely to bolt early. That will allow him bask in the praise and remuneration of his European Elite operators.

    If Ukraine can obtain sane leaders capable of negotiation, the bloodshed can end.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    , @sudden death
    @LondonBob


    surely a big Russian offensive coming shortly
     
    now they will try to take Siversk or something little bit less monumental?;)

    the most funny thing atm though is they took out the lights from those Nazis in Transnistria too, lol

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  189. @LondonBob
    So the rest of the Ukrainian electrical grid has now been taken out, surely a big Russian offensive coming shortly. The nightmare scenario has now unfolded for Europe, and the West. Plenty of chances to strike a deal, now the Russians aren't interested, wave of refugees, economic collapse accelerating, blackouts and a decisive NATO defeat incoming. At least let us see the current ruling elite gone, rainbow flags and all.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @A123, @sudden death

    At least let us see the current ruling elite gone, rainbow flags and all.

    You are overly optimistic. Considering mass stupidity, ignorance, and cuckedness of European and American population, Western ruling elites will keep rotting in power quite a few years yet. Remember, every nation has the government it deserves. No number of Russian strikes on hapless Ukraine can make Western nations suddenly deserve something better than the clowns they have. I know, it’s disappointing, but that’s how it is.

  190. @LondonBob
    So the rest of the Ukrainian electrical grid has now been taken out, surely a big Russian offensive coming shortly. The nightmare scenario has now unfolded for Europe, and the West. Plenty of chances to strike a deal, now the Russians aren't interested, wave of refugees, economic collapse accelerating, blackouts and a decisive NATO defeat incoming. At least let us see the current ruling elite gone, rainbow flags and all.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @A123, @sudden death

    So the rest of the Ukrainian electrical grid has now been taken out, surely a big Russian offensive coming shortly.

    Russia is treating the residents Kiev and other cities in the same way Ukrainian regimes treated the farmers in Crimea. It is an exact parallel. Hypocritical Ukie Maximalists are upset. However, their past outrages mean they cannot obtain traction beyond their true believers.

    Why “shortly”? Let the Kiev regime run itself ragged over the winter months. Their failures providing basic goods & services will diminish support among average Ukrainian civilians. They penalty for being too late is pretty clear in Gaddafi’s tale. Zelensky is likely to bolt early. That will allow him bask in the praise and remuneration of his European Elite operators.

    If Ukraine can obtain sane leaders capable of negotiation, the bloodshed can end.

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @A123


    Russia is treating the residents Kiev and other cities in the same way Ukrainian regimes treated the farmers in Crimea.
     
    BTW, it is the 7th anniversary of the beginning of Ukrainian energy blockade of Crimea. During the short period of November 20-23, 2015, Ukie terrorists blew up power lines going to Crimea. That resulted in virtually total blackout. Quite a few teams doing emergency surgery in Crimean hospitals were suddenly plunged into darkness. Thanks to Russian efforts, now Crimea has a lot of its own electricity generating capability (more than it can consume), plus two high-voltage underwater cables from Krasnodar region as a backup. Hearing pathetic squeals of Ukraine residents about the loss of power, Crimeans gleefully chuckle. As the saying goes, he who laughs last, laughs best.

    If Ukraine can obtain sane leaders capable of negotiation, the bloodshed can end.
     
    For that Ukraine should get real leaders, not someone else’s puppets. Every nation has the government it deserves. Any reason to believe that Ukraine residents will deserve much better than they have any time soon?

    Replies: @showmethereal

  191. @Yevardian
    @silviosilver

    I remember going through a phase of listening to Serbian 'turbofolk, some extremely 'powerful' lyrics and musicvideos, though my impression was that only Roki Vulavic had genuine talent as singer.
    Probably you've heard of these already, but others might be interested in them as a curio.
    I wonder what the Croatian side of that genre looks like.



    Pretty poor musically, but nice visuals:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q0I-XGTzfhg

    Attacking Bosnian Muslims, quite catchy in trashy way:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tFDpo62eqwU

    Generic cheesy 80's pop, except for the lyrics:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KifJ6J3KmWg

    Vulavic, instrumentation is midi-tier quality, but you can hear unlike the others he can actually sing:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qeAEdU4p5Cg

    Roki Again:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jKyWihLG2-8

    I like how when walking around a forest Vulavic wears a suit, whilst in the city he wears camoflage:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hxPaxFD0ar8

    Serbian military superiority over the Americans:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=333OVHhpK5c

    Backing track sounds like it belongs to 90s RTS videogame:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mY0MzNK6KqA

    On Serbian music in general, I quite like this sort of stuff too. I noticed that this particular 'operatic' (though totally unlike classical Italian-derived opera singing, I don't know what else to call it?) vocal styling is very characteristic of Greek music too, though you don't hear it much in Romanian traditional music, and I've never heard this style in non-Balkan Slavic countries.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WcE8Rrzfeio

    Replies: @Yevardian, @silviosilver

    I remember going through a phase of listening to Serbian ‘turbofolk

    Shit, seriously? You really enjoyed listening to that stuff? I actually hadn’t heard of any of the songs or performers you linked to. Maybe that Mauzer song I’ve heard before, but I think from someone posting a link here, not in its own day. I suppose it comes under the category of ‘turbfolk’ but it’s not what I think of as most representative of the genre. Or maybe it is, and I just don’t know what I’m talking about. I am not a fan of turbofolk but I got into it for a while in the early 2000s, and I think most of it is quite a lot better than the selections you posted. (Man, that “Srbian supermen” thing, rofl – you sure you’re not trying to embarrass me here, hmm?) There isn’t any bright dividing line between what is turbofolk and what is just Serbian pop music, and perhaps the kind that I liked (and most people liked, judging by what was listened to when I was there) is heavier on the pop (or “turbo”) than on the folk.

    On Serbian music in general, I quite like this sort of stuff too.

    I immediately recognized the singer in that clip, but it surprised me that I couldn’t remember his name – which I took as a sign of how out of touch I am with this music. If you like him, my two fave songs of his were “Rano je za tugu” and “Ostaricu necu znati” (let’s see if I have good taste lol).

    I know what you mean by the vocal style, but I have no idea about the correct musical terminology for it. You’re quite right that it’s very common. One song that immediately comes to mind that features it strongly (takes it to excess even) is Mitar Miric – Ne diraj coveka za stolom.

    This to Yahya as well, who has expressed some interest in balkans music, a rather distinctive style is Sevdah/Sevdanlinka, which is mostly Bosnian but is thought quite highly of across ex-YU. Generally melancholy themes with oriental-tinged, often rather haunting, melodies. Couple of good examples by Safet Isovic – Moj Dilbere and Sehidski rastanak.

    My own personal preference, and the only stuff I can really enjoy without getting tired of it, is ex-YU pop from the 80s. Couple of good examples, the groups “Zana” and “Magazin.”

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @silviosilver


    , a rather distinctive style is Sevdah/Sevdanlinka, which is mostly Bosnian but is thought quite highly of across ex-YU. Generally melancholy themes with oriental-tinged, often rather haunting, melodies. Couple of good examples by Safet Isovic – Moj Dilbere and Sehidski rastanak.
     
    Yes Isovic was one of my first introductions to the treasure trove that is Balkan folk music. More specifically this song:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eMb3jWURFd0&ab_channel=SafetIsovi%C4%87

    I remember how impressed I was with the instrumentation, and more saliently, the distinctive, booming Bosnian vocal technique which I had never heard of before. But unfortunately Isovic's music is highly variable, some are very schlocky and others are excellent.

    Didn't like any of the pop tunes or artists you mentioned tbh. I've written to Philip Owen before that i'm only interested in higher forms of musical expression from other cultures. But within my own culture, the genre that has most stirred my soul is the trashy ethnic music. The trashier it was, the more deeper the feelings it elicited. I've unfortunately lost my taste for that peculiar genre of music, but I will always fondly remember the days of ethnic warmth (now mostly gone) that type of music generated within me.

    PS: I'm still waiting for a reply to the rest of my initial post. What did you think of the Arabic songs?

    Replies: @silviosilver

  192. @silviosilver
    @Yevardian


    I see at the ‘club’ there’s ‘Bilboko Athletic Kluba’ as well, though I guess its nothing special as I’ve never heard of it compared to famous Madrid and Barcelona teams which even I’ve heard of before.
     
    Not sure if you're being sarcastic here. : ) If you've honestly never heard of Athletico Bilbao though, they're actually one of the most successful teams in Spanish club soccer, and they've managed that feat despite (or maybe because of?) their policy of using only Basque players. Even a non-sportsball fan could be impressed by that.

    @Mikel

    although there do seem to be some Celtic toponyms interspersed here and there in a sea of Basque ancient toponyms. But considering that those theories are usually espoused by people with clear Spanish nationalist tendencies
     
    Years ago on some race/ethnicity forum (might have been Stirpes, now long defunct but once very good), I noticed a strain of Spanish nationalism that seemed to really go out of its way to play up "Celtic roots" - the sort of fathers who would force their kids to learn the bagpipes, lol. Have you ever had much personal experience with these types?

    @Matra

    Allowing five subs represents the kind of Americanisation that Steve Sailer has long advocated. How can it be a team effort if half the players that finish didn’t start the match?
     
    Well, I think you could just as well argue that the rule makes it more of a team effort, since it involves more people who are part of the (larger) team. But I can understand why 'purist' fans - which soccer is chock full of - would be put off by the changes. I really don't care anymore. Soccer has gone from my favorite sport when I was a teen, to something I can barely muster the energy to google the results of. The reason is mostly racial - who cares what a half nigged (soon to be 100%) "France" or "England" does - but not solely. In hindsight, the Bosman ruling totally wrecked European soccer. As early as the late 90s Chelsea could field a team without a single actual Englishman on it. I was still a huge fan, but I thought that was seriously messed up.

    @Barbie

    I’d say that there is a big difference between playing sports and watching sports. The latter has little redeeming value while the former has a number of good attributes.
     
    Yes, the sad little sporstball fan is a sitting duck for absolutist judgments like this. However, if you compare sporstball fandom to alternative uses of leisure time, there are obviously far worse things that the average fan - of decidedly average human 'quality' - could be doing. At a very basic level, reading sports journalism is likely the only reading some fans would ever do, and if not for that, then nothing. So that counts as a plus. Fandom also imparts some lessons in patience and coping with disappointment, and even restraint and hope (it's not over till it's over). Of course, there are more effective ways to imbibe those same lessons, but again you have to weigh that against the likelihood that the average fan would ever do so.

    Replies: @Mikel, @Matra, @Barbarossa

    Have you ever had much personal experience with these types?

    Fortunately no. It’s very difficult to find such types IRL. But every mention of our being genetically different from them irritates Spaniards no end. You see pundits and even some politicians losing their cool at the idea. This is in part understandable after so many years of my separatists countrymen committing atrocities. That obviously generates lots of resentment (but strangely very little desire to let us go). However, this sentiment has deeper roots.

    An idea quite popular among Spanish patriots in the times before genetic studies was that “Basques were the real, original Spaniards”. To a certain extent, the current genetic understanding has proven them right. The genetic distinction between us and neighboring populations is that after the IE invasions of the Iron Age we received very little admixture from other sources so I guess we are quite representative of the population that existed in the Atlantic/Southwestern area of Europe in the early Iron Age. The mystery though is that we have the highest percentage of the R1b IE haplogroup in Europe, along with the Welsh, but we managed to keep a non-IE language.

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Mikel

    Youz guys were the refugees from lost Atlantis is my favorite explanation.

    The last I saw the linguistics was inexplicable. And the genetics is captured by the empire of lies and should be ignored for the next forty years or so.

  193. @A123
    @LondonBob


    So the rest of the Ukrainian electrical grid has now been taken out, surely a big Russian offensive coming shortly.
     
    Russia is treating the residents Kiev and other cities in the same way Ukrainian regimes treated the farmers in Crimea. It is an exact parallel. Hypocritical Ukie Maximalists are upset. However, their past outrages mean they cannot obtain traction beyond their true believers.

    Why "shortly"? Let the Kiev regime run itself ragged over the winter months. Their failures providing basic goods & services will diminish support among average Ukrainian civilians. They penalty for being too late is pretty clear in Gaddafi's tale. Zelensky is likely to bolt early. That will allow him bask in the praise and remuneration of his European Elite operators.

    If Ukraine can obtain sane leaders capable of negotiation, the bloodshed can end.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    Russia is treating the residents Kiev and other cities in the same way Ukrainian regimes treated the farmers in Crimea.

    BTW, it is the 7th anniversary of the beginning of Ukrainian energy blockade of Crimea. During the short period of November 20-23, 2015, Ukie terrorists blew up power lines going to Crimea. That resulted in virtually total blackout. Quite a few teams doing emergency surgery in Crimean hospitals were suddenly plunged into darkness. Thanks to Russian efforts, now Crimea has a lot of its own electricity generating capability (more than it can consume), plus two high-voltage underwater cables from Krasnodar region as a backup. Hearing pathetic squeals of Ukraine residents about the loss of power, Crimeans gleefully chuckle. As the saying goes, he who laughs last, laughs best.

    If Ukraine can obtain sane leaders capable of negotiation, the bloodshed can end.

    For that Ukraine should get real leaders, not someone else’s puppets. Every nation has the government it deserves. Any reason to believe that Ukraine residents will deserve much better than they have any time soon?

    • Thanks: showmethereal
    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @AnonfromTN

    It is impressive what they were able to do in Crimea. Also impressive that even through 8 years of shelling I’ve watched videos of lots of normal life in cities and town of the Donbass. Also impressive is how quickly Mariupol is being rebuilt. I admit - Russia has more civil industry resources than I thought previously.

    Replies: @Beckow, @AnonfromTN

  194. @showmethereal
    @Beckow

    So all the millions and millions and millions of Europeans that fled Europe for other continents - why did they stop? They stopped because the reasons they fled Europe for 3 centuries were remedied for the most part. It’s laughable people forget Europeans had a mass migration out for centuries.

    In any event it is a fact across the board that the more a country prospers - migration rates slow.

    Replies: @Beckow

    Europeans who left for three centuries were settlers. Or most of them were. Settlers are people who move to start farms, mines, trading settlements, and to plunder the natives.

    That is very different from the current Third World migrants: they come to short-cut to better life, they are not starting farms, bringing herds of cows, digging for metals. They plunder but differently: goodies from the clueless over-bred locals and petty theft. No amount of prosperity at home can change that. They are doing it out of laziness, and are the exact opposite of the Euro settlers in the past.

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @Beckow

    They became “settlers” (a pretty word for invaders) because they thought they could find a better life outside of Europe. Same thing. Strange though you call it laziness. I don’t see whites doing any of the menial jobs. And i recall from first hand accounts and reading literature - the same descriptions you use of these third world ppl are the same things Irish and Italians were greeted with when they arrived on the shores of the USA. They were called thieves and lazy and dumb and with evil catholic beliefs. But now they are all part of white solidarity. Strange how that works. As to what’s happening in Europe- all that mass migration is a result of former colonialism as well as active destabilizing actions taken by NATO in the last 30 years. In fact Ghaddaffi warned Europe. NATO chose to aid his murderers anyway.

  195. @A123
    @Barbarossa


    Polling like this is extremely meaningless at this point in the game. Once other candidates have declared and had a chance to get their message out in front of the electorate it will possible to draw some conclusions.
     
    Trump is getting his MAGA message out now. And, he has developed a great deal of "soft power" via endorsements, rallies, and fund raising.

    If DeSantis joins the race. What will he deliver as anti-MAGA messaging? And, how will he get that anti-MAGA message out?

    If DeSantis offends the MAGA base, he is pretty much doomed as a candidate. Many people believe that getting him to run now is actually a set-up for destruction. (1)

    DeSantis is now the favorite among many Republican voters and almost all conservative commentators for the Party presidential nomination. Such passionate advocates seem to have missed two essential points:

    • In a rigged electoral system, no Republican candidate, not even DeSantis, can be expected to win a national election. DeSantis cruised to victory in Florida because, as governor of the state, he had the means and the authority to ensure a clean election. But he would be helpless against a massive crime organization, aka the Democrat Party, which effectively controls the electoral infrastructure, the physical apparatus, the paid loyalty of election workers, and the federal agencies that oversee the process. If the system is not repaired and made answerable to the people, there will never be a Republican president again.

    • Should DeSantis run in 2024 and lose — which is increasingly likely in the current adulterated circumstances — the sequel would be devastating. Florida would be at the mercy of the next gubernatorial race since DeSantis is a unique political figure and could not be readily replaced. Additionally, DeSantis himself would have become a kind of displaced person, neither an American president nor a state governor. An invaluable political talent would have been sacrificed to the untutored enthusiasm of his supporters. If the American republican experiment is now in dire straits, it would then be expeditiously destroyed. A slim hope will have become an utter disaster.
     
    The best, really only, option for MAGA is to settle on Trump quickly. That leaves many months to decide to handle 2024 balloting (which may or may not be voting).

    ♦ Can it be cleaned up?
    ♦ Or, is the only choice going 100% all in on balloting for the MAGA side?

    I would prefer the former. However, I suspect that is not possible. The GOP will need its own Fultoning operation to win.
    ___

    Trump will continue to run until he obtains the result he won in 2020. If he gets that fairness, he will use up his second and last term when he leaves office in 2028.

    If the 2024 election is stolen again... Brace yourself for Trump 2028, Trump 2032, Trump, 2036, etc. The only way to achieve post-Trump MAGA is term limits. And, that means belatedly delivering a win to the man who already earned it.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://pjmedia.com/columns/david-solway-2/2022/11/11/desantis-2024-think-again-n1645202

    Replies: @sudden death

    Trump 2028, Trump 2032, Trump, 2036

    Somehow managed to miss the moment when he stopped aging and became immortal runner up;)

    • Replies: @A123
    @sudden death

    Some how you managed to miss the point I was making;). Again;)


    The only way to achieve post-Trump MAGA is term limits. And, that means belatedly delivering a win to the man who already earned it.
     
    Read;). And, attempt to absorb these facts;)

    PEACE 😇
  196. @LondonBob
    So the rest of the Ukrainian electrical grid has now been taken out, surely a big Russian offensive coming shortly. The nightmare scenario has now unfolded for Europe, and the West. Plenty of chances to strike a deal, now the Russians aren't interested, wave of refugees, economic collapse accelerating, blackouts and a decisive NATO defeat incoming. At least let us see the current ruling elite gone, rainbow flags and all.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @A123, @sudden death

    surely a big Russian offensive coming shortly

    now they will try to take Siversk or something little bit less monumental?;)

    the most funny thing atm though is they took out the lights from those Nazis in Transnistria too, lol

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @sudden death


    the most funny thing atm though is they took out the lights from those Nazis in Transnistria too, lol
     
    That was because parts of the unified electric grid made by the USSR on its European territory still remain. Neither Ukraine, nor Moldova added much after the collapse of the USSR. They still live on the legacy of those “damn commies”, lol.

    Replies: @sudden death

  197. @AnonfromTN
    @Beckow


    There was a simple compromise: no Nato and normal rights for Russians in Ukraine.
     
    That was possible early this year. This would have prevented the war. But once started, the war brings its own dynamic. I don’t think it can be ended now without kicking the puppets out of Kiev and kicking the empire and its sidekicks out of Ukraine (this is essentially the same thing). I strongly suspect that an attempt to end this war on conditions that were acceptable before it started would cost Putin and his coterie power. He is smart enough to understand that. Official statements by the Kremlin that the war is not about regime change are pure subterfuge: they are confident that as the empire does not give a hoot about how many Ukrainians die, it won’t allow its puppets seek compromise.

    Replies: @Beckow

    …I strongly suspect that an attempt to end this war on conditions that were acceptable before it started would cost Putin and his coterie power. He is smart enough to understand that.

    Probably true, the West fatally misread Putin and his coterie – they are the moderates, they were the ones to make a deal with. The desire to dramatize and demonize Putin, to create a Hitlerian emotional enemy has backfired.

    The only way Kiev-West can still get something like the pre-February deal is by over-performing in the war. That means they have to mindlessly escalate until they hit the wall. Again a catastrophic miscalculation: when a hurricane is offshore you don’t go and pee into it and celebrate how brave and successful you are, you get out of there.

    But these are simple minds driven by petty emotions and immediate rewards. A key component of high intelligence is to be able to anticipate – the simpletons in charge of the West seem to have no ability to think two-three steps ahead. They may take all of us down with them.

    • Agree: A123
  198. @Mikel
    @silviosilver


    Have you ever had much personal experience with these types?
     
    Fortunately no. It's very difficult to find such types IRL. But every mention of our being genetically different from them irritates Spaniards no end. You see pundits and even some politicians losing their cool at the idea. This is in part understandable after so many years of my separatists countrymen committing atrocities. That obviously generates lots of resentment (but strangely very little desire to let us go). However, this sentiment has deeper roots.

    An idea quite popular among Spanish patriots in the times before genetic studies was that "Basques were the real, original Spaniards". To a certain extent, the current genetic understanding has proven them right. The genetic distinction between us and neighboring populations is that after the IE invasions of the Iron Age we received very little admixture from other sources so I guess we are quite representative of the population that existed in the Atlantic/Southwestern area of Europe in the early Iron Age. The mystery though is that we have the highest percentage of the R1b IE haplogroup in Europe, along with the Welsh, but we managed to keep a non-IE language.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    Youz guys were the refugees from lost Atlantis is my favorite explanation.

    The last I saw the linguistics was inexplicable. And the genetics is captured by the empire of lies and should be ignored for the next forty years or so.

  199. @sudden death
    @A123


    Trump 2028, Trump 2032, Trump, 2036
     
    Somehow managed to miss the moment when he stopped aging and became immortal runner up;)

    Replies: @A123

    Some how you managed to miss the point I was making;). Again;)

    The only way to achieve post-Trump MAGA is term limits. And, that means belatedly delivering a win to the man who already earned it.

    Read;). And, attempt to absorb these facts;)

    PEACE 😇

  200. @songbird
    @Mr. Hack

    Ideally, the best way to remove Biden from politics would have been some ethical test, such as when he plagiarized the speech of some UK politician, in his earliest presidential campaign, back in the '80s. Saving that, I think he should have been forcefully removed from politics, after having two aneurysms, before he was 50.

    IMO, Trump has lost a lot of his energy, I'm not sure anyone can think of something he said that was entertaining or bucking the status quo, in years. It was funny when he tweeted to Cher that her plastic surgery didn't work, but that was like ten years ago, and it is kind of pathetic that people are still living in old moments like that. (BTW, doesn't sound like he will come back to twitter).

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    (BTW, doesn’t sound like he will come back to twitter).

    He is now a direct business competition to twitter. He thinks he going to make maga bucks with truth social.

    https://www.politico.com/news/2022/11/22/trump-sec-truth-social-public-company-00070444

    I forgot this other trivia point on the Wayne Newton case. He is pro level on twenty or so different instruments. When he was selling out his casino show every night for years running he used to do numbers on the guitar, sax, piano, trumpet, accordion, + a couple others.

  201. Last night Ukrainian rockets of anti-missile defense systems (some supplied by NATO) hit two multi-apartment residential buildings, one in Kiev, another in Vyshgorod (Kiev region). Six Ukrainians were killed, many wounded. By comparison, recent killing of two Poles by Ukrainian anti-missile rocket was not so bad, after all.

    • Replies: @LondonBob
    @AnonfromTN

    NATO air defense systems have never been found to work, given the importance of missiles this is a massive flaw.

  202. @sudden death
    @LondonBob


    surely a big Russian offensive coming shortly
     
    now they will try to take Siversk or something little bit less monumental?;)

    the most funny thing atm though is they took out the lights from those Nazis in Transnistria too, lol

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    the most funny thing atm though is they took out the lights from those Nazis in Transnistria too, lol

    That was because parts of the unified electric grid made by the USSR on its European territory still remain. Neither Ukraine, nor Moldova added much after the collapse of the USSR. They still live on the legacy of those “damn commies”, lol.

    • Replies: @sudden death
    @AnonfromTN

    Should better try explain this to rocketry experts in Kremlin, cause they seem to not know those basic facts about intergrid connections in those places, not me;)

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  203. @Beckow
    @Coconuts


    ...grievances will just start to die out in a couple of decades, as whites are weakened and reduced in numbers enough
     
    It never works that way. It will more likely be to the last scrap of whiteness that can be located, it must be exterminated because it reminds the others how inadequate they are. And most of the really nasty stuff will be done by the whites to themselves - that one I can't explain, and no God could explain it.

    As you weaken the whites they will simply be more vulnerable. I watched Georgina scream against Macron, a beautiful performance. But it struck me that it was basically an extreme defensiveness with a hint of hysteria, you don't win that way. Offering explanations, thinking that a better argument actually changes something, the pleading female voice - that is a road to nowhere.

    There is no justice in the universe or nature, buying into the silly concept of who is more just, more deserving, means that you have already lost. More power to Georgina Meloni, but she could be a latter-day distraction. There is a pathological self-destructive gene that the whites seem to carry and it has exploded in numbers as they ceased to propagate.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @Coconuts

    It never works that way. It will more likely be to the last scrap of whiteness that can be located, it must be exterminated because it reminds the others how inadequate they are. And most of the really nasty stuff will be done by the whites to themselves – that one I can’t explain, and no God could explain it.

    Well, this is the less optimistic possibility. I am hoping these tendencies abate, but there is the possibility that they won’t, or that they won’t in time. If something like this happens the best explanation may be the ‘mouse utopia’ one, where some sort of mismatch between living conditions and evolutionary norms produces lots of people with serious psychological flaws.

    There is no justice in the universe or nature, buying into the silly concept of who is more just, more deserving, means that you have already lost.

    I think it used to be better understood, one side of justice is about reciprocal duty and obligation, but the other side of justice is power and authority used to pursue excellence or the good. To be just a certain level of power and ability is needed, and to recognise it people need to share some understanding of what a good life is. Imo this is why appeals to justice that are too abstract have this empty quality.

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @Coconuts


    mouse utopia:’ mismatch between living conditions and evolutionary norms produces lots of people with serious psychological flaws.
     
    That is the core problem. It is hard to be optimistic about it abating because the change in living conditions would have to be very disruptive. With massive numbers of people involved it would be very unpredictable.

    ...the other side of justice is power and authority used to pursue excellence or the good.
     
    There is a conscious effort to undermine anything excellent or extraordinary. There is a hint of the Marxist egalitarianism in it, but without any concern with the material life. The single-minded focus on material life is what made the original Marxism appealing and successful. What we get now is a race to the egalitarian cultural bottom with low-quality material goods to make it palatable. When the goods run out it will get ugly.
  204. @AnonfromTN
    @sudden death


    the most funny thing atm though is they took out the lights from those Nazis in Transnistria too, lol
     
    That was because parts of the unified electric grid made by the USSR on its European territory still remain. Neither Ukraine, nor Moldova added much after the collapse of the USSR. They still live on the legacy of those “damn commies”, lol.

    Replies: @sudden death

    Should better try explain this to rocketry experts in Kremlin, cause they seem to not know those basic facts about intergrid connections in those places, not me;)

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @sudden death


    Should better try explain this to rocketry experts in Kremlin, cause they seem to not know those basic facts about intergrid connections in those places
     
    I am sure they know, but decided that it cannot be helped. It appears that their objective it to damage power and transport infrastructure in Ukraine enough to prevent it moving its troops and Western weapons and ammo. The war is more than nine months old, but Russia did not target Ukrainian power and transport infrastructure until NATO started sending large amounts of military materiel to Ukraine. Actions have consequences.

    Replies: @sudden death, @Jazman

  205. @sudden death
    @AnonfromTN

    Should better try explain this to rocketry experts in Kremlin, cause they seem to not know those basic facts about intergrid connections in those places, not me;)

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    Should better try explain this to rocketry experts in Kremlin, cause they seem to not know those basic facts about intergrid connections in those places

    I am sure they know, but decided that it cannot be helped. It appears that their objective it to damage power and transport infrastructure in Ukraine enough to prevent it moving its troops and Western weapons and ammo. The war is more than nine months old, but Russia did not target Ukrainian power and transport infrastructure until NATO started sending large amounts of military materiel to Ukraine. Actions have consequences.

    • Agree: showmethereal
    • Replies: @sudden death
    @AnonfromTN

    too much lazy atm to be searching old posts but it seems 8-6 months ago both you and Beckow were posting frequently how RF is certainly succesful at merciless/precise/lightning/constant/relentless destruction of all the incoming foreign mercennaries, weapons and ammo straight at the grounds near the western UA borders and elsewhere inside;)

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    , @Jazman
    @AnonfromTN

    Kiev regime literally lost more than entire inventory of US Army by this point.
    Russia targets substations and power lines,something that can be easily repaired in peacetime.
    And for people in affected areas there are two choices.
    First is to run. Run like hell while there is still a possibility to run.
    Second is to attempt a regime change.This is next to impossible because a)Kiev regime is a terrorist one and will simply murder anybody opposing it and b)locals in Kiev especially are pretty brainwashed...which is why most of them didn't run yet.
    Latter is also the reason why Russia sending a diversionary force to Kiev in February was a diversionary force and not a real one.
    Nobody needs several million un-loyal, ungrateful neobarbarian freeloaders.
    Mexicans at least can and will work!

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  206. Sher Singh says:

    Catholics were cucked by love marriage & executing criminals.
    https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/147470491501300114

    A belief in the Rule of Law, rather than the Gods doesn’t help.
    A distant authority bringing order to the world, rather than a personal chaos shaping reality.

    https://www.academia.edu/1549528/2_The_Christian_origins_of_secularism_and_the_rule_of_law

    Won’t really say much more, not my problem tbh.

    [MORE]

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Sher Singh

    Sikhism would seem to prescribe that Justin Trudeau grow his hair even longer and look even more like a tranny. IMO, the only solution to the Justin Trudeaus of the world is to give them buzzcuts.

    Replies: @Sher Singh

  207. @AnonfromTN
    @sudden death


    Should better try explain this to rocketry experts in Kremlin, cause they seem to not know those basic facts about intergrid connections in those places
     
    I am sure they know, but decided that it cannot be helped. It appears that their objective it to damage power and transport infrastructure in Ukraine enough to prevent it moving its troops and Western weapons and ammo. The war is more than nine months old, but Russia did not target Ukrainian power and transport infrastructure until NATO started sending large amounts of military materiel to Ukraine. Actions have consequences.

    Replies: @sudden death, @Jazman

    too much lazy atm to be searching old posts but it seems 8-6 months ago both you and Beckow were posting frequently how RF is certainly succesful at merciless/precise/lightning/constant/relentless destruction of all the incoming foreign mercennaries, weapons and ammo straight at the grounds near the western UA borders and elsewhere inside;)

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @sudden death


    it seems 8-6 months ago both you and Beckow were posting frequently how RF is certainly succesful at merciless/precise/lightning/constant/relentless destruction of all the incoming foreign mercennaries, weapons and ammo straight at the grounds near the western UA borders and elsewhere inside
     
    I am not sure, but it does not matter. Active war is going on. The situation often changes in 6-8 days, let alone 6-8 months. My personal (uninformed) opinion is that early on Putin overestimated the common sense of NATO planners. He did not expect NATO to get involved to the extent that it is now. The situation on the ground changed, so did the strategy.

    BTW, do you remember Western propaganda saying back in March that Russia is running out of cruise missiles? One Russian commenter recently wrote about current strikes, “it’s good that we ran out of cruise missiles back in March, otherwise we’d be blamed for those strikes”. Good trolling, no?
  208. @silviosilver
    @Yevardian


    I see at the ‘club’ there’s ‘Bilboko Athletic Kluba’ as well, though I guess its nothing special as I’ve never heard of it compared to famous Madrid and Barcelona teams which even I’ve heard of before.
     
    Not sure if you're being sarcastic here. : ) If you've honestly never heard of Athletico Bilbao though, they're actually one of the most successful teams in Spanish club soccer, and they've managed that feat despite (or maybe because of?) their policy of using only Basque players. Even a non-sportsball fan could be impressed by that.

    @Mikel

    although there do seem to be some Celtic toponyms interspersed here and there in a sea of Basque ancient toponyms. But considering that those theories are usually espoused by people with clear Spanish nationalist tendencies
     
    Years ago on some race/ethnicity forum (might have been Stirpes, now long defunct but once very good), I noticed a strain of Spanish nationalism that seemed to really go out of its way to play up "Celtic roots" - the sort of fathers who would force their kids to learn the bagpipes, lol. Have you ever had much personal experience with these types?

    @Matra

    Allowing five subs represents the kind of Americanisation that Steve Sailer has long advocated. How can it be a team effort if half the players that finish didn’t start the match?
     
    Well, I think you could just as well argue that the rule makes it more of a team effort, since it involves more people who are part of the (larger) team. But I can understand why 'purist' fans - which soccer is chock full of - would be put off by the changes. I really don't care anymore. Soccer has gone from my favorite sport when I was a teen, to something I can barely muster the energy to google the results of. The reason is mostly racial - who cares what a half nigged (soon to be 100%) "France" or "England" does - but not solely. In hindsight, the Bosman ruling totally wrecked European soccer. As early as the late 90s Chelsea could field a team without a single actual Englishman on it. I was still a huge fan, but I thought that was seriously messed up.

    @Barbie

    I’d say that there is a big difference between playing sports and watching sports. The latter has little redeeming value while the former has a number of good attributes.
     
    Yes, the sad little sporstball fan is a sitting duck for absolutist judgments like this. However, if you compare sporstball fandom to alternative uses of leisure time, there are obviously far worse things that the average fan - of decidedly average human 'quality' - could be doing. At a very basic level, reading sports journalism is likely the only reading some fans would ever do, and if not for that, then nothing. So that counts as a plus. Fandom also imparts some lessons in patience and coping with disappointment, and even restraint and hope (it's not over till it's over). Of course, there are more effective ways to imbibe those same lessons, but again you have to weigh that against the likelihood that the average fan would ever do so.

    Replies: @Mikel, @Matra, @Barbarossa

    If you’ve honestly never heard of Athletico Bilbao though, they’re actually one of the most successful teams in Spanish club soccer, and they’ve managed that feat despite (or maybe because of?) their policy of using only Basque players.

    Just to be clear it means the players must come from the Basque country, and they might be flexible about what that means. I don’t know if you even have to be born there or can join a club as kid straight from Africa and be classified as Basque. Last time I saw them play they had one black player. Tracing his DNA would tell not solve any puzzles about Basque origins.

    But I can understand why ‘purist’ fans – which soccer is chock full of – would be put off by the changes.

    I’m anything but a purist but the Americanisation of sports is mostly a bad thing. (Though I noticed you Aussies were quicker to embrace that in rugby league and other sports than the Brits, maybe ‘colonials’ are more open to change). Even in Canada many older hockey people prefer watching IIHF sanctioned games that can have ties (unless they’ve changed that) and end in two hours because they don’t have TV timeouts like the wretched NHL. Everything in post-1960s America is a big bloated production full of hype, overwrought sentimentality, not to mention the worshipping of black people.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Matra


    Tracing his DNA would tell not solve any puzzles about Basque origins.
     
    Hehe, nicely put. Of course, it would hardly come as a shock if it turns out they have cucked on the original rule. My point about their impressive record still stands though, since most of it was amassed prior to the age of diversity and woke fuckery.

    Neither version of rugby is popular where I live and I never got into it, so I can't comment about any rule changes. Actually, I'm pretty sure I don't even know any of the rules. On the few brief occasions I have seen it on TV, I have no idea what is going on. Come to think of it, I doubt I've ever met more than three or four people my entire life who claim to be fans of it. I am pretty sociable and I like making chitchat about sportsball with strangers, so that's a bit of anecdotal evidence of how unpopular it is here. It's huge in other parts of the country though.

    The rule changes in Australian rules football have been subtle but have mainly helped the game flow more smoothly, but also softened it up a bit so there are fewer serious injuries, which originally displeased some of the old timers but even they have probably gotten over it by now. The only innovation I dislike is the score review, which is painfully slow and boring and a huge buzzkill. As if the drama of the game depends in any way on the umpires making precisely the correct call every time. If anything, the opposite is true - a dramatic wrong call will give fans something to talk about for years after the match.

    Oh, and female football commentators. Geezus. Ideology over reality yet again. As if listening to a chick babble on with her worthless opinion doesn't wreck the atmosphere of a bunch of boys getting together to watch a game. I doubt even female footy fans (of which there are plenty) really enjoy listening to a woman announcer. If anti-sportsballers really wants to hurt professional sporstball, they should be pushing for much, much more of this.

    Say, you remember that poster "Fred Scrooby" from the MR days? A real sourpuss, he was. He certainly had it in for me. I bet even he'd admit I've come a long, long way since then though. You ever come across him anywhere since then? I remember he had an account here, under a different name, around the time of this site's inception. I forget the username he had, but he had made his posts private anyway. If you know of his online whereabouts, do let me know, thanks. If nothing else, I at least owe him an apology.

    Replies: @Matra

    , @A123
    @Matra


    Americanisation of sports is mostly a bad thing

     

    Europization is also pretty bad. Germany had this as a pregame team photo.

     
    https://media.breitbart.com/media/2022/11/AP-Photo_Ebrahim-Naroozi-640x480.jpg
     

    Then they promptly lost 2-1 to Japan. I do not know how they made themselves sick, but some Euro SJW ritual was likely to blame. Were they sucking on Tide pods?
    ___

    Advertising on uniforms is also much more dramatic in Europe.

     
    https://i.eurosport.com/2017/08/06/2140756-44772537-1600-900.jpg
     

    How long has Fly Emirates FC been a team? Oh. Wait. That is supposed to be Arsenal FC. Sorry for the confusion.

    When will Tampax sponsor a team?

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @Matra, @Emil Nikola Richard, @LondonBob

    , @Mikel
    @Matra


    Just to be clear it means the players must come from the Basque country, and they might be flexible about what that means.
     
    Quite true. Right now there is a French guy, Aymeric Laporte, playing for Spain in the World Cup. He was born somewhere in Aquitaine but the Athletic de Bilbao detectives found that 2 of his grandparents were from the French Basque Country so they recruited him as a teenager. Then he decided to get a Spanish passport and now may end up playing against his country of origin. Athletic's rule of only using local players used to be much more serious in the past.
  209. @sudden death
    @AnonfromTN

    too much lazy atm to be searching old posts but it seems 8-6 months ago both you and Beckow were posting frequently how RF is certainly succesful at merciless/precise/lightning/constant/relentless destruction of all the incoming foreign mercennaries, weapons and ammo straight at the grounds near the western UA borders and elsewhere inside;)

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    it seems 8-6 months ago both you and Beckow were posting frequently how RF is certainly succesful at merciless/precise/lightning/constant/relentless destruction of all the incoming foreign mercennaries, weapons and ammo straight at the grounds near the western UA borders and elsewhere inside

    I am not sure, but it does not matter. Active war is going on. The situation often changes in 6-8 days, let alone 6-8 months. My personal (uninformed) opinion is that early on Putin overestimated the common sense of NATO planners. He did not expect NATO to get involved to the extent that it is now. The situation on the ground changed, so did the strategy.

    BTW, do you remember Western propaganda saying back in March that Russia is running out of cruise missiles? One Russian commenter recently wrote about current strikes, “it’s good that we ran out of cruise missiles back in March, otherwise we’d be blamed for those strikes”. Good trolling, no?

  210. Gotras also break off with population expansion or re-combine at times.

    Jatts overall are 40% Steppe which tracks closely with the R1A percentage.
    So make your own estimates of Guru ka Malwa.

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਿਹ

  211. @Matra
    @silviosilver


    If you’ve honestly never heard of Athletico Bilbao though, they’re actually one of the most successful teams in Spanish club soccer, and they’ve managed that feat despite (or maybe because of?) their policy of using only Basque players.
     
    Just to be clear it means the players must come from the Basque country, and they might be flexible about what that means. I don't know if you even have to be born there or can join a club as kid straight from Africa and be classified as Basque. Last time I saw them play they had one black player. Tracing his DNA would tell not solve any puzzles about Basque origins.

    But I can understand why ‘purist’ fans – which soccer is chock full of – would be put off by the changes.
     
    I'm anything but a purist but the Americanisation of sports is mostly a bad thing. (Though I noticed you Aussies were quicker to embrace that in rugby league and other sports than the Brits, maybe 'colonials' are more open to change). Even in Canada many older hockey people prefer watching IIHF sanctioned games that can have ties (unless they've changed that) and end in two hours because they don't have TV timeouts like the wretched NHL. Everything in post-1960s America is a big bloated production full of hype, overwrought sentimentality, not to mention the worshipping of black people.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @A123, @Mikel

    Tracing his DNA would tell not solve any puzzles about Basque origins.

    Hehe, nicely put. Of course, it would hardly come as a shock if it turns out they have cucked on the original rule. My point about their impressive record still stands though, since most of it was amassed prior to the age of diversity and woke fuckery.

    Neither version of rugby is popular where I live and I never got into it, so I can’t comment about any rule changes. Actually, I’m pretty sure I don’t even know any of the rules. On the few brief occasions I have seen it on TV, I have no idea what is going on. Come to think of it, I doubt I’ve ever met more than three or four people my entire life who claim to be fans of it. I am pretty sociable and I like making chitchat about sportsball with strangers, so that’s a bit of anecdotal evidence of how unpopular it is here. It’s huge in other parts of the country though.

    The rule changes in Australian rules football have been subtle but have mainly helped the game flow more smoothly, but also softened it up a bit so there are fewer serious injuries, which originally displeased some of the old timers but even they have probably gotten over it by now. The only innovation I dislike is the score review, which is painfully slow and boring and a huge buzzkill. As if the drama of the game depends in any way on the umpires making precisely the correct call every time. If anything, the opposite is true – a dramatic wrong call will give fans something to talk about for years after the match.

    Oh, and female football commentators. Geezus. Ideology over reality yet again. As if listening to a chick babble on with her worthless opinion doesn’t wreck the atmosphere of a bunch of boys getting together to watch a game. I doubt even female footy fans (of which there are plenty) really enjoy listening to a woman announcer. If anti-sportsballers really wants to hurt professional sporstball, they should be pushing for much, much more of this.

    Say, you remember that poster “Fred Scrooby” from the MR days? A real sourpuss, he was. He certainly had it in for me. I bet even he’d admit I’ve come a long, long way since then though. You ever come across him anywhere since then? I remember he had an account here, under a different name, around the time of this site’s inception. I forget the username he had, but he had made his posts private anyway. If you know of his online whereabouts, do let me know, thanks. If nothing else, I at least owe him an apology.

    • Replies: @Matra
    @silviosilver

    Fred Scrooby from Vermont. No, I haven't come across him anywhere since MR days. Guessedworker suggested once or twice that he may have died. GW said Scrooby came up with the term 'race replacement', not to be confused with 'the great replacement' which a Frenchman came up with.

    Replies: @silviosilver

  212. @Matra
    @silviosilver


    If you’ve honestly never heard of Athletico Bilbao though, they’re actually one of the most successful teams in Spanish club soccer, and they’ve managed that feat despite (or maybe because of?) their policy of using only Basque players.
     
    Just to be clear it means the players must come from the Basque country, and they might be flexible about what that means. I don't know if you even have to be born there or can join a club as kid straight from Africa and be classified as Basque. Last time I saw them play they had one black player. Tracing his DNA would tell not solve any puzzles about Basque origins.

    But I can understand why ‘purist’ fans – which soccer is chock full of – would be put off by the changes.
     
    I'm anything but a purist but the Americanisation of sports is mostly a bad thing. (Though I noticed you Aussies were quicker to embrace that in rugby league and other sports than the Brits, maybe 'colonials' are more open to change). Even in Canada many older hockey people prefer watching IIHF sanctioned games that can have ties (unless they've changed that) and end in two hours because they don't have TV timeouts like the wretched NHL. Everything in post-1960s America is a big bloated production full of hype, overwrought sentimentality, not to mention the worshipping of black people.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @A123, @Mikel

    Americanisation of sports is mostly a bad thing

    Europization is also pretty bad. Germany had this as a pregame team photo.

     

     

    Then they promptly lost 2-1 to Japan. I do not know how they made themselves sick, but some Euro SJW ritual was likely to blame. Were they sucking on Tide pods?
    ___

    Advertising on uniforms is also much more dramatic in Europe.

     

     

    How long has Fly Emirates FC been a team? Oh. Wait. That is supposed to be Arsenal FC. Sorry for the confusion.

    When will Tampax sponsor a team?

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @Matra
    @A123

    The LGBT flag is as American as the Stars & Stripes. Everywhere you see it you know you are in the American Empire.

    Replies: @A123

    , @Emil Nikola Richard
    @A123

    The German team seems to be aping the


    Speak no Evil
     
    pose. This is purportedly a protest to the Qatar hosts prohibiting rainbow arm bands.

    There isn't anything in the See/Hear/Speak no evil triad which precisely maps to Wear No Evil Advertising on the Upper Arm.

    Sailer asks how gay is soccer and nobody in the comments had an answer to the question of how many current professional soccer players are out of the closet. They are men. 1-3% are homos. How many of them are out and how many of them are in the closet?

    Nobody is actually proud to be a homo. It is utterly bizarre that multi millions have been sucked into an empire of lies propaganda scam.

    Related toy problem: what is the correlation between people who think homos are fine and people who think the corona virus is worth taking the stupid experimental RNA treatment to fight?
    , @LondonBob
    @A123

    Strange to put their hands over their mouths, in most countries in the West you can't criticise the sodomists, unlike in Qatar.

  213. @Coconuts
    @Beckow


    It never works that way. It will more likely be to the last scrap of whiteness that can be located, it must be exterminated because it reminds the others how inadequate they are. And most of the really nasty stuff will be done by the whites to themselves – that one I can’t explain, and no God could explain it.
     
    Well, this is the less optimistic possibility. I am hoping these tendencies abate, but there is the possibility that they won't, or that they won't in time. If something like this happens the best explanation may be the 'mouse utopia' one, where some sort of mismatch between living conditions and evolutionary norms produces lots of people with serious psychological flaws.

    There is no justice in the universe or nature, buying into the silly concept of who is more just, more deserving, means that you have already lost.
     
    I think it used to be better understood, one side of justice is about reciprocal duty and obligation, but the other side of justice is power and authority used to pursue excellence or the good. To be just a certain level of power and ability is needed, and to recognise it people need to share some understanding of what a good life is. Imo this is why appeals to justice that are too abstract have this empty quality.

    Replies: @Beckow

    mouse utopia:’ mismatch between living conditions and evolutionary norms produces lots of people with serious psychological flaws.

    That is the core problem. It is hard to be optimistic about it abating because the change in living conditions would have to be very disruptive. With massive numbers of people involved it would be very unpredictable.

    …the other side of justice is power and authority used to pursue excellence or the good.

    There is a conscious effort to undermine anything excellent or extraordinary. There is a hint of the Marxist egalitarianism in it, but without any concern with the material life. The single-minded focus on material life is what made the original Marxism appealing and successful. What we get now is a race to the egalitarian cultural bottom with low-quality material goods to make it palatable. When the goods run out it will get ugly.

  214. @Yahya
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms


    Japan and SK are ok, about the same level as Middle Eastern teams.
     
    Doesn't really say much, Middle Eastern teams are fairly mediocre. Theoretically, the MENA region and East Asia should be winning at least a few world cups, but literally all of them have gone to European and Latin American teams (the game is rigged!) But the point is that success in football doesn’t seem to be correlated with intelligence, Brazil and Argentina are hardly the highest IQ nations; but they put a solid showing in every tournament. African nations seem to be debilitated by their extreme poverty and lack of resources for training facilities or the like. But MENA and East Asian countries don't have that excuse really.

    You'd think China and India, with 2.5 billion people among them, would at least be able to find 11 world-class players who can take them all the way to victory in the finals. There are tiny nations like Uruguay and Netherlands, with but a percentage of China and India's populations, who have won the world cup.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tXqlbKwXpZI&t=14s&ab_channel=ComedyAddiction


    The fact that PRC is so bad points to a certain defect.
     
    Japan and South Korea oddly seem to outgun China on almost every cultural endeavor, even though the latter is 10x larger in population. The people who tend to narrowly focus on East Asian lack of cultural productivity compared to the West are missing the significant intra-East Asian differences in output as well. I haven't seen many good explanations for this. Lee Kuan Yew posited that China is hindered by a culture that does not permit a free exchange of ideas; a language that shapes thinking through epigrams; and 4,000 years of texts that suggest everything worth saying has already been said, and said better by earlier writers. He once advised the Chinese leadership make English the first language, though much as I respect Lee, strikes me as a materialistic and self-abasing idea.

    I would be interested to hear your explanation as to China's underperformance vis-a-vis Japan and Korea.


    Soccer requires creativity and flair which EAs lack. I think that’s the main reason.

     

    I think there's some truth in the age-old stereotype of East Asian lack of creativity, but as usual HBDists tend to overdo it. I wrote a post on this topic here: https://www.unz.com/isteve/math-vs-reading-test-score-tilts-internationally/#comment-5332386

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms, @showmethereal

    Soccer is similar to chasing girls, you need to fit some basic level of requirements, beyond that it depends more on confidence, je ne sais quoi. Latin guys usually fit the stereotype, hence the term “Romance”. This is also true in basketball where Spain/Argentina routinely beat black teams.

    Two of the top ten current players are MENA, but historically e.g. Zidane, Özil, play for European national teams.

    https://www.theguardian.com/football/ng-interactive/2021/dec/21/the-100-best-male-footballers-in-the-world-2021

    East Asians are historically the least confident. Japs and Koreans are better. PRC Chinese are not only bottom feeders, they drag down the reputation of everyone else.

    But unlike India, China is a powerhouse in wide range of Olympic sports, so there is an incongruence.

    *Indians probably have some genetic limitation, but an Indian guy won gold in javelin which is a well-rounded sport, so who knows.

    Some simple reasons is EA is much more dense than everywhere else, so less soccer fields. EAs have a much more demanding education system so less time.

    Japan and South Korea oddly seem to outgun China on almost every cultural endeavor

    strikes me as a materialistic and self-abasing

    Self-abasing is the main reason. The Chinese term is 茶毒 chá dú meaning “spiritually poison/maim”. It’s very typically in education and parenting to brainwash kids they are only fit to do such and such.

    This was a big deal in sports history. The reaction of many Chinese was actually self-abasing and negative, not only do they lack confidence they want to drag down and discredit those who succeed,

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/the-streak-is-broken-chinas-su-bingtian-is-fastest-qualifier-in-race-to-be-the-worlds-fastest-man/

    a language that shapes thinking through epigrams; and 4,000 years of texts that suggest everything worth saying has already been said, and said better by earlier writers.

    This isn’t the problem, the best testimony for hanzi is that the Japanese uses it.

    PRC is strong in top-down organisation thus its very capable in Olympic sports, so I’m still very bullish on China’s industrial development, but I’m much less bullish on PRC’s soft power, charisma and team sports performance.

    Enjoy your perspective btw.

    • Thanks: Yahya
    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms


    Soccer is similar to chasing girls
     
    Have to disagree. Chasing girls is natural (we are mammals, after all), whereas soccer is not. Besides, British word “football” describes it better, whereas American football is a misnomer: as the name implies, you are supposed to manage the ball with your feet, not hands.

    The only similarity is that self-confidence helps in both, but it helps in pretty much everything people do.

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

  215. @A123
    @Matra


    Americanisation of sports is mostly a bad thing

     

    Europization is also pretty bad. Germany had this as a pregame team photo.

     
    https://media.breitbart.com/media/2022/11/AP-Photo_Ebrahim-Naroozi-640x480.jpg
     

    Then they promptly lost 2-1 to Japan. I do not know how they made themselves sick, but some Euro SJW ritual was likely to blame. Were they sucking on Tide pods?
    ___

    Advertising on uniforms is also much more dramatic in Europe.

     
    https://i.eurosport.com/2017/08/06/2140756-44772537-1600-900.jpg
     

    How long has Fly Emirates FC been a team? Oh. Wait. That is supposed to be Arsenal FC. Sorry for the confusion.

    When will Tampax sponsor a team?

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @Matra, @Emil Nikola Richard, @LondonBob

    The LGBT flag is as American as the Stars & Stripes. Everywhere you see it you know you are in the American Empire.

    • Replies: @A123
    @Matra


    The LGBT flag is as American as the Stars & Stripes. Everywhere you see it you know you are in the American Empire.
     
    Whaaat??? Let me Fix That For You

    The LGBT flag is as Muslim as the Crescent & Star. Everywhere you see it you know you are in the Islamophile European Empire. Or, European Caliphate if you prefer.

    Look at this Jihadist troop transport carrying Muslim invaders to Europe.

     
    https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-_iZ-C7cdJ98/YHGaUpvkHRI/AAAAAAAAGLo/clpVoF7uSx8hUxYpkOsauif6Ps-LMyFfwCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/Evangelic%2BChurch%2BGermany%2BAntifa%2Bpeople%2Bsmugglers.jpg
     

    The Bacha Bāzī LGBT flag is prominent. Also, the flag of the Fascist Stormtroopers of Antifa, which was founded in Europe.

    You need to blame Europe and sexually deviant Islam for the rainbow flag.

    PEACE 😇
  216. @Yahya
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms


    Japan and SK are ok, about the same level as Middle Eastern teams.
     
    Doesn't really say much, Middle Eastern teams are fairly mediocre. Theoretically, the MENA region and East Asia should be winning at least a few world cups, but literally all of them have gone to European and Latin American teams (the game is rigged!) But the point is that success in football doesn’t seem to be correlated with intelligence, Brazil and Argentina are hardly the highest IQ nations; but they put a solid showing in every tournament. African nations seem to be debilitated by their extreme poverty and lack of resources for training facilities or the like. But MENA and East Asian countries don't have that excuse really.

    You'd think China and India, with 2.5 billion people among them, would at least be able to find 11 world-class players who can take them all the way to victory in the finals. There are tiny nations like Uruguay and Netherlands, with but a percentage of China and India's populations, who have won the world cup.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tXqlbKwXpZI&t=14s&ab_channel=ComedyAddiction


    The fact that PRC is so bad points to a certain defect.
     
    Japan and South Korea oddly seem to outgun China on almost every cultural endeavor, even though the latter is 10x larger in population. The people who tend to narrowly focus on East Asian lack of cultural productivity compared to the West are missing the significant intra-East Asian differences in output as well. I haven't seen many good explanations for this. Lee Kuan Yew posited that China is hindered by a culture that does not permit a free exchange of ideas; a language that shapes thinking through epigrams; and 4,000 years of texts that suggest everything worth saying has already been said, and said better by earlier writers. He once advised the Chinese leadership make English the first language, though much as I respect Lee, strikes me as a materialistic and self-abasing idea.

    I would be interested to hear your explanation as to China's underperformance vis-a-vis Japan and Korea.


    Soccer requires creativity and flair which EAs lack. I think that’s the main reason.

     

    I think there's some truth in the age-old stereotype of East Asian lack of creativity, but as usual HBDists tend to overdo it. I wrote a post on this topic here: https://www.unz.com/isteve/math-vs-reading-test-score-tilts-internationally/#comment-5332386

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms, @showmethereal

    Comparing China to South Korea and Japan in football is easy. China started playing the game on a grass roots level much much later. Once China started to focus on summer Olympic sports it passed Japan in medals. Now it passed everyone except the US and almost beat the US. Now that if focuses on Winter Olympic sports it beat Japan and South Korea. That’s with about 8 years of work. Football the Chinese women beat other Asians. Why the men don’t is another matter. As to culture – don’t go by what westerners tell you. They boost Korea and Japan because they are western Allies.

    But back to football – in 20 years China will do much better. But will it win? I have doubts. Same with basketball- China is getting better (it’s the second most popular sport) but there are certain physical attributes that just aren’t in the gene pool as readily. China will produce more Jeremy Lins than they will Yao Ming. Meaning Jeremy Lin was pretty good but not an “all star”. Yao Ming was a Hall of Famer. Same will happen with football in my mind. A could of Chinese have made it to top European leagues…. Like Koreans and Japanese before. But I doubt they become too 10. Top 20 is more realistic.

    Ironically Japan beat Germany 2-1. Completely shocking. But don’t expect Japan to win the tournament. And don’t expect them to repeatedly beat Germany either in the future.

    And Germany has been one of the best in the world for 100 years. They are NOT known for flair players though. Football is a multi faceted sport. Brazil and Germany have won the most World Cups between them and yet play completely differently! Italy has won the 3rd most and again plays completely differently. They were always thought of as a more defensive side with rarely having flair players either. Germany was always thought of for their machine like efficiency. It is Brazil that is know for flair and creativity. Only the Dutch and Argentines have been though of to have as much flair and creativity. Argentina has won more than the Dutch though. Again – very complex

    • Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @showmethereal

    You obviously don't know jack squat about sports so should STFU:

    - China can produce another Yao or Lin, but China cannot to produce a Steve Nash or Manu Ginobili, a moderately athletic guy who's not even that tall but has high basketball IQ

    - Japan almost made it in 2018 to the quarterfinals and just barely lost to Belgium. Today wasn't a major surprise

    - Japan is already top 10 in another major team sport, rugby

    - The Japanese team had a major size disadvantage vs. Germany, but made up for it in speed and tenacity

    - The Chinese team has no size disadvantage, yet they still suck because they a bunch of overpaid egotistical pansies

    https://i.postimg.cc/Gh9ZqcTD/China-PR-national-football-team-training-in-Tehran-01.jpg

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @AnonfromTN, @Matra, @showmethereal

    , @songbird
    @showmethereal


    Same with basketball- China is getting better (it’s the second most popular sport)
     
    After that commercial where LeBron Jones played one-on-one against a dragon (the symbol of China) and won, they should have arrested everyone involved in promoting basketball in China and shot them in the back of the head.

    (I must specify that this is a joke.)

  217. @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @Yahya

    Soccer is similar to chasing girls, you need to fit some basic level of requirements, beyond that it depends more on confidence, je ne sais quoi. Latin guys usually fit the stereotype, hence the term "Romance". This is also true in basketball where Spain/Argentina routinely beat black teams.

    Two of the top ten current players are MENA, but historically e.g. Zidane, Özil, play for European national teams.

    https://www.theguardian.com/football/ng-interactive/2021/dec/21/the-100-best-male-footballers-in-the-world-2021

    East Asians are historically the least confident. Japs and Koreans are better. PRC Chinese are not only bottom feeders, they drag down the reputation of everyone else.

    But unlike India, China is a powerhouse in wide range of Olympic sports, so there is an incongruence.

    *Indians probably have some genetic limitation, but an Indian guy won gold in javelin which is a well-rounded sport, so who knows.

    Some simple reasons is EA is much more dense than everywhere else, so less soccer fields. EAs have a much more demanding education system so less time.


    Japan and South Korea oddly seem to outgun China on almost every cultural endeavor
     

    strikes me as a materialistic and self-abasing

     

    Self-abasing is the main reason. The Chinese term is 茶毒 chá dú meaning "spiritually poison/maim". It's very typically in education and parenting to brainwash kids they are only fit to do such and such.

    This was a big deal in sports history. The reaction of many Chinese was actually self-abasing and negative, not only do they lack confidence they want to drag down and discredit those who succeed,

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/the-streak-is-broken-chinas-su-bingtian-is-fastest-qualifier-in-race-to-be-the-worlds-fastest-man/


    a language that shapes thinking through epigrams; and 4,000 years of texts that suggest everything worth saying has already been said, and said better by earlier writers.

     

    This isn't the problem, the best testimony for hanzi is that the Japanese uses it.

    PRC is strong in top-down organisation thus its very capable in Olympic sports, so I'm still very bullish on China's industrial development, but I'm much less bullish on PRC's soft power, charisma and team sports performance.

    Enjoy your perspective btw.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    Soccer is similar to chasing girls

    Have to disagree. Chasing girls is natural (we are mammals, after all), whereas soccer is not. Besides, British word “football” describes it better, whereas American football is a misnomer: as the name implies, you are supposed to manage the ball with your feet, not hands.

    The only similarity is that self-confidence helps in both, but it helps in pretty much everything people do.

    • Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @AnonfromTN

    But American football vs. soccer illustrates my point, the former is very planned set-piece that requires knowledge of a much more complex playbook. There's much less flair and spontaneity.

    The quarterback is the most complex and difficult position in all of sports, and it's dominated by northern Euros.

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/nfl-draft-physiognomy-clemson-ice-age-caveman-1-vs-byu-anglo-nice-guy-2/

    So it happens Slavs are overrepresented in QB, coaches as well as positions that require size, speed and physicality: tight end and defensive end

    https://kafkadesk.org/2021/01/23/nfl-the-slavic-connection-in-american-football/

    Replies: @showmethereal, @LatW

  218. @silviosilver
    @Matra


    Tracing his DNA would tell not solve any puzzles about Basque origins.
     
    Hehe, nicely put. Of course, it would hardly come as a shock if it turns out they have cucked on the original rule. My point about their impressive record still stands though, since most of it was amassed prior to the age of diversity and woke fuckery.

    Neither version of rugby is popular where I live and I never got into it, so I can't comment about any rule changes. Actually, I'm pretty sure I don't even know any of the rules. On the few brief occasions I have seen it on TV, I have no idea what is going on. Come to think of it, I doubt I've ever met more than three or four people my entire life who claim to be fans of it. I am pretty sociable and I like making chitchat about sportsball with strangers, so that's a bit of anecdotal evidence of how unpopular it is here. It's huge in other parts of the country though.

    The rule changes in Australian rules football have been subtle but have mainly helped the game flow more smoothly, but also softened it up a bit so there are fewer serious injuries, which originally displeased some of the old timers but even they have probably gotten over it by now. The only innovation I dislike is the score review, which is painfully slow and boring and a huge buzzkill. As if the drama of the game depends in any way on the umpires making precisely the correct call every time. If anything, the opposite is true - a dramatic wrong call will give fans something to talk about for years after the match.

    Oh, and female football commentators. Geezus. Ideology over reality yet again. As if listening to a chick babble on with her worthless opinion doesn't wreck the atmosphere of a bunch of boys getting together to watch a game. I doubt even female footy fans (of which there are plenty) really enjoy listening to a woman announcer. If anti-sportsballers really wants to hurt professional sporstball, they should be pushing for much, much more of this.

    Say, you remember that poster "Fred Scrooby" from the MR days? A real sourpuss, he was. He certainly had it in for me. I bet even he'd admit I've come a long, long way since then though. You ever come across him anywhere since then? I remember he had an account here, under a different name, around the time of this site's inception. I forget the username he had, but he had made his posts private anyway. If you know of his online whereabouts, do let me know, thanks. If nothing else, I at least owe him an apology.

    Replies: @Matra

    Fred Scrooby from Vermont. No, I haven’t come across him anywhere since MR days. Guessedworker suggested once or twice that he may have died. GW said Scrooby came up with the term ‘race replacement’, not to be confused with ‘the great replacement’ which a Frenchman came up with.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Matra

    I just remembered after I posted that I first came across him at Takimag, back when they still had a comments section. He was using the same username which he later made an account with here at Unz, but I could tell by the posting style and post content that it was him. Not sure if you care, but if you don't already know, Leon Haller posts at counter currents as "Lord Shang." He usually had something useful and interesting to say, although he had a surprisingly large number of detractors (who I felt were idiots). I sometimes get the feeling he's at the end of his tether. Not sure why he never migrated over here.

    Yes 'race replacement' is on the money, forces the issue like nothing else I've known, leaving little to no room for misdirection. Sad to say, it's about the only thing of lasting significance that emerged from all those lengthy discussions over there. Unfortunately, it's a bit too good for its own good. Unable to rebut it, people play dumb, clam up or attempt to cancel you. That still makes for a useful litmus test though. Anybody who freaks out over it, it's as reliable a sign as any that they're not really on board. 'Great replacement' is more useful for being vaguer, but it enables the bullshit artists to swarm, and if they gain sway it comes to mean anything and everything but race.

  219. @Coconuts
    @showmethereal


    With Russia and China actually helping those countries to develop they have less need to migrate.
     
    There may be a kind of pattern developing related to political regime, so a hypothesis can be formed.

    Russia is a presidential republic with a managed democracy, China is a one-party organic democracy.
    Western countries are liberal parliamentary democracies. Liberal parliamentary regimes are probably most likely to invite permanent immigration from overseas and least able to prevent it happening, by their nature.

    The longer and stronger the liberal parliamentary tradition is, the more immigration and the more diverse it should be.

    Replies: @showmethereal

    You have a good point. And that is another good reason as to why Russia would not be open to mass migration. There is no reason to migrate somewhere if you can’t eventually “get the vote”. But those guys are being facetious. They see the flaws in the system for those who are proponents of western nationalism. On the flip side Russia – nor China – are the ones who colonized African nations. So they don’t speak Russian nor Chinese. They speak French and Belgian and English etc.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @showmethereal


    They speak French and Belgian and English
     
    There is no such thing as Belgian language. Three languages are spoken in Belgium: French, Dutch (Flemish), and German. Most of the population speaks the first two. However, Belgians are smart enough to make all three spoken languages official (unlike some morons we all know).

    Replies: @Beckow, @showmethereal

    , @Coconuts
    @showmethereal


    On the flip side Russia – nor China – are the ones who colonized African nations. So they don’t speak Russian nor Chinese. They speak French and Belgian and English etc.
     
    Very few in Africa and the Middle East must speak German or Italian as legacies of colonialism (maybe there are a few who speak Italian in Eritrea), and more or less no one Dutch, Irish, Danish, Swedish or Norwegian. But all these countries have similar patterns of immigration from Africa and MENA.

    Appeals to colonialism, as if this immigration was somehow retribution or reparations for colonialism and imperialism seems more like a rationalisation of something with other causes. If it was about reparations Belgium would take only Congolese, Netherlands only Indonesians and a few from the Carribean, Germany from Tanganyika, Italy from Eritrea, Somalia etc. But this is not what is seen in Europe.

    Even the countries that take a large number of immigrants from their former colonies like Spain, France, Britain also take a lot of people not from their former empires.

    I guess the point Beckow was making about settlers was about the relative productivity and level of development of North America and Australia when the British started to occupy them, and the level of productivity and development of Europe when Africans and others arrive now.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @showmethereal

  220. @LondonBob
    @Wokechoke

    That forty mile truck convoy is one of the classic distractions of all time, can't believe how much that hypnotised the media, and NATO, as the Russian's secured the Crimea land bridge and surrounded Mariupol.

    Replies: @showmethereal

    The crazy thing is they thought Russia was that stupid as to have a long convoy of trucks to take Kiev with no protection.

  221. @showmethereal
    @Coconuts

    You have a good point. And that is another good reason as to why Russia would not be open to mass migration. There is no reason to migrate somewhere if you can’t eventually “get the vote”. But those guys are being facetious. They see the flaws in the system for those who are proponents of western nationalism. On the flip side Russia - nor China - are the ones who colonized African nations. So they don’t speak Russian nor Chinese. They speak French and Belgian and English etc.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Coconuts

    They speak French and Belgian and English

    There is no such thing as Belgian language. Three languages are spoken in Belgium: French, Dutch (Flemish), and German. Most of the population speaks the first two. However, Belgians are smart enough to make all three spoken languages official (unlike some morons we all know).

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @AnonfromTN


    ...Belgians are smart enough to make all three spoken languages official (unlike some morons we all know).
     
    But not smart enough to even acknowledge it in Ukraine with Russians. Why is that? Is there a hierarchy of smarts and killing Russians is the ultimate value? AP has argued incoherently a few times about Bretons and the quasi-fascist Balts, but at least he has some awareness - the Belgians like that flat-footed pedo Michel simply deny the nose between their eyes.

    By the way, there are fewer than 50k Germans in Belgium with full cultural and linguistic rights - the things Germany did to Belgium in two wars are incomparably worse than anything Ukies accuse the "Imperium" of doing...

    , @showmethereal
    @AnonfromTN

    I receive your correction. I was eating and drinking and watching multi cultural Belgium beat multi cultural Canada as I typed the comment - LOL. Should have read “the languages of their colonizers such as the French - Belgians - English etc”

  222. @AnonfromTN
    @showmethereal


    They speak French and Belgian and English
     
    There is no such thing as Belgian language. Three languages are spoken in Belgium: French, Dutch (Flemish), and German. Most of the population speaks the first two. However, Belgians are smart enough to make all three spoken languages official (unlike some morons we all know).

    Replies: @Beckow, @showmethereal

    …Belgians are smart enough to make all three spoken languages official (unlike some morons we all know).

    But not smart enough to even acknowledge it in Ukraine with Russians. Why is that? Is there a hierarchy of smarts and killing Russians is the ultimate value? AP has argued incoherently a few times about Bretons and the quasi-fascist Balts, but at least he has some awareness – the Belgians like that flat-footed pedo Michel simply deny the nose between their eyes.

    By the way, there are fewer than 50k Germans in Belgium with full cultural and linguistic rights – the things Germany did to Belgium in two wars are incomparably worse than anything Ukies accuse the “Imperium” of doing…

  223. @A123
    @Matra


    Americanisation of sports is mostly a bad thing

     

    Europization is also pretty bad. Germany had this as a pregame team photo.

     
    https://media.breitbart.com/media/2022/11/AP-Photo_Ebrahim-Naroozi-640x480.jpg
     

    Then they promptly lost 2-1 to Japan. I do not know how they made themselves sick, but some Euro SJW ritual was likely to blame. Were they sucking on Tide pods?
    ___

    Advertising on uniforms is also much more dramatic in Europe.

     
    https://i.eurosport.com/2017/08/06/2140756-44772537-1600-900.jpg
     

    How long has Fly Emirates FC been a team? Oh. Wait. That is supposed to be Arsenal FC. Sorry for the confusion.

    When will Tampax sponsor a team?

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @Matra, @Emil Nikola Richard, @LondonBob

    The German team seems to be aping the

    Speak no Evil

    pose. This is purportedly a protest to the Qatar hosts prohibiting rainbow arm bands.

    There isn’t anything in the See/Hear/Speak no evil triad which precisely maps to Wear No Evil Advertising on the Upper Arm.

    Sailer asks how gay is soccer and nobody in the comments had an answer to the question of how many current professional soccer players are out of the closet. They are men. 1-3% are homos. How many of them are out and how many of them are in the closet?

    Nobody is actually proud to be a homo. It is utterly bizarre that multi millions have been sucked into an empire of lies propaganda scam.

    Related toy problem: what is the correlation between people who think homos are fine and people who think the corona virus is worth taking the stupid experimental RNA treatment to fight?

  224. @Matra
    @silviosilver

    Fred Scrooby from Vermont. No, I haven't come across him anywhere since MR days. Guessedworker suggested once or twice that he may have died. GW said Scrooby came up with the term 'race replacement', not to be confused with 'the great replacement' which a Frenchman came up with.

    Replies: @silviosilver

    I just remembered after I posted that I first came across him at Takimag, back when they still had a comments section. He was using the same username which he later made an account with here at Unz, but I could tell by the posting style and post content that it was him. Not sure if you care, but if you don’t already know, Leon Haller posts at counter currents as “Lord Shang.” He usually had something useful and interesting to say, although he had a surprisingly large number of detractors (who I felt were idiots). I sometimes get the feeling he’s at the end of his tether. Not sure why he never migrated over here.

    Yes ‘race replacement’ is on the money, forces the issue like nothing else I’ve known, leaving little to no room for misdirection. Sad to say, it’s about the only thing of lasting significance that emerged from all those lengthy discussions over there. Unfortunately, it’s a bit too good for its own good. Unable to rebut it, people play dumb, clam up or attempt to cancel you. That still makes for a useful litmus test though. Anybody who freaks out over it, it’s as reliable a sign as any that they’re not really on board. ‘Great replacement’ is more useful for being vaguer, but it enables the bullshit artists to swarm, and if they gain sway it comes to mean anything and everything but race.

  225. @A123
    The first major poll results since Trump announced his candidacy are in: (1)

    Former President Donald J. Trump holds a towering 30-point lead over the rest of the potential 2024 Republican primary field, according to a poll.

    In an Emerson College Polling survey released Tuesday, 55.1 percent of registered voters said they would vote for Trump in the 2024 GOP primary,

    NATIONAL POLL [MORE]

    2024 GOP Primary

    @realDonaldTrump 55%
    @RonDeSantisFL 25%
    @Mike_Pence 8%
    @Liz_Cheney 4%
    @tedcruz 3%
    @NikkiHaley 3%
     

    There is also an age divide in the Republican primary: younger voters under 50 break for Trump over DeSantis 67% to 14%, voters between 50 and 64 break for Trump 54% to 32%, while Republicans over 65 are more split: 39% support Trump and 32% DeSantis.
     

     
    This is a devastating gut punch to the #NeverTrump establishment followers of Mitch McConnell. Their attempts to blow up the MAGA movement from within have just taken a catastrophic blow.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2022/11/22/poll-donald-trump-holds-30-point-lead-over-2024-gop-primary-field/



    https://twitter.com/EmersonPolling/status/1595013075026976770?s=20

    Replies: @sudden death, @Mikel, @Barbarossa, @keypusher

    Pretty early in his presidency it was clear that Trump was strictly for suckers. You’re still banging his drum. Did you go into mourning when Michael Jackson kicked the bucket? Do you believe that real communism has never been tried?

    • LOL: A123
    • Replies: @A123
    @keypusher

    Your strawmanning and lies are quite pathetic.

    You really should stop unless you want to be viewed as comic relief.

    ==============================
       We are not laughing with you!
          We are all laughing at you!
    ==============================


    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @Mikel

  226. @Matra
    @A123

    The LGBT flag is as American as the Stars & Stripes. Everywhere you see it you know you are in the American Empire.

    Replies: @A123

    The LGBT flag is as American as the Stars & Stripes. Everywhere you see it you know you are in the American Empire.

    Whaaat??? Let me Fix That For You

    The LGBT flag is as Muslim as the Crescent & Star. Everywhere you see it you know you are in the Islamophile European Empire. Or, European Caliphate if you prefer.

    Look at this Jihadist troop transport carrying Muslim invaders to Europe.

     

     

    The Bacha Bāzī LGBT flag is prominent. Also, the flag of the Fascist Stormtroopers of Antifa, which was founded in Europe.

    You need to blame Europe and sexually deviant Islam for the rainbow flag.

    PEACE 😇

    • LOL: Barbarossa
  227. @keypusher
    @A123

    Pretty early in his presidency it was clear that Trump was strictly for suckers. You're still banging his drum. Did you go into mourning when Michael Jackson kicked the bucket? Do you believe that real communism has never been tried?

    Replies: @A123

    Your strawmanning and lies are quite pathetic.

    You really should stop unless you want to be viewed as comic relief.

    ==============================
       We are not laughing with you!
          We are all laughing at you!
    ==============================

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @Mikel
    @A123

    Speaking of laughs, yesterday I read this piece at Takimag and I thought of you:

    https://www.takimag.com/article/midterm-for-the-worse-part-ii-these-firsts-shall-be-our-last/

    I don't think you're going to like it and I don't agree with every single point myself but Cole is always sharp and funny and you definitely need to read different points of view outside of the informational bubble you seem to be in.

    Replies: @A123

  228. @AnonfromTN
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms


    Soccer is similar to chasing girls
     
    Have to disagree. Chasing girls is natural (we are mammals, after all), whereas soccer is not. Besides, British word “football” describes it better, whereas American football is a misnomer: as the name implies, you are supposed to manage the ball with your feet, not hands.

    The only similarity is that self-confidence helps in both, but it helps in pretty much everything people do.

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    But American football vs. soccer illustrates my point, the former is very planned set-piece that requires knowledge of a much more complex playbook. There’s much less flair and spontaneity.

    The quarterback is the most complex and difficult position in all of sports, and it’s dominated by northern Euros.

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/nfl-draft-physiognomy-clemson-ice-age-caveman-1-vs-byu-anglo-nice-guy-2/

    So it happens Slavs are overrepresented in QB, coaches as well as positions that require size, speed and physicality: tight end and defensive end

    https://kafkadesk.org/2021/01/23/nfl-the-slavic-connection-in-american-football/

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    American football quarterbacks require the most intelligence in American football - not in all sports. That is nonsense. A central midfielder in real football requires more intelligence than someone who memorizes pre-set plays and can get told every 30 seconds what next to do from the sidelines. A central midfielder is required to play defense and offense and constantly “read the game” in order to make decisions. It’s like the difference between human trained domestic dogs and wild canines. Even the smartest domestic dogs get outwitted by their wild canine counterparts unless they get human help.

    , @LatW
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms


    So it happens Slavs are overrepresented in QB, coaches as well as positions that require size, speed and physicality: tight end and defensive end
     
    Not just any Slavs, but a very particular, narrow type, mostly Balto-Slav from the north - from Poland and Lithuania, this type is more robust than the average Slav (which is a very big and rather diverse population). Defensive end in particular requires a very robust, strong physique and tall stature (you cannot be dainty and small boned). When one thinks of how is this type different from similar robust Nordic or Scottish types, it seems that they have just a tiny bit more plasticity.

    It looks like these types made it into the NFL because their parents were first generation immigrants and had to struggle a bit so they were more represented in working and middle class (where these players typically come from). The third generation of these immigrants are already more affluent and may have chosen other, more white collar professions rather than an extremely competitive and tough sport. Also, if they keep having petite or very thin spouses this type will dissolve (nothing against petite women, of course, it's just that they won't be producing that type of a physique).

    Replies: @silviosilver, @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

  229. @showmethereal
    @Yahya

    Comparing China to South Korea and Japan in football is easy. China started playing the game on a grass roots level much much later. Once China started to focus on summer Olympic sports it passed Japan in medals. Now it passed everyone except the US and almost beat the US. Now that if focuses on Winter Olympic sports it beat Japan and South Korea. That’s with about 8 years of work. Football the Chinese women beat other Asians. Why the men don’t is another matter. As to culture - don’t go by what westerners tell you. They boost Korea and Japan because they are western Allies.

    But back to football - in 20 years China will do much better. But will it win? I have doubts. Same with basketball- China is getting better (it’s the second most popular sport) but there are certain physical attributes that just aren’t in the gene pool as readily. China will produce more Jeremy Lins than they will Yao Ming. Meaning Jeremy Lin was pretty good but not an “all star”. Yao Ming was a Hall of Famer. Same will happen with football in my mind. A could of Chinese have made it to top European leagues…. Like Koreans and Japanese before. But I doubt they become too 10. Top 20 is more realistic.

    Ironically Japan beat Germany 2-1. Completely shocking. But don’t expect Japan to win the tournament. And don’t expect them to repeatedly beat Germany either in the future.

    And Germany has been one of the best in the world for 100 years. They are NOT known for flair players though. Football is a multi faceted sport. Brazil and Germany have won the most World Cups between them and yet play completely differently! Italy has won the 3rd most and again plays completely differently. They were always thought of as a more defensive side with rarely having flair players either. Germany was always thought of for their machine like efficiency. It is Brazil that is know for flair and creativity. Only the Dutch and Argentines have been though of to have as much flair and creativity. Argentina has won more than the Dutch though. Again - very complex

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms, @songbird

    You obviously don’t know jack squat about sports so should STFU:

    – China can produce another Yao or Lin, but China cannot to produce a Steve Nash or Manu Ginobili, a moderately athletic guy who’s not even that tall but has high basketball IQ

    – Japan almost made it in 2018 to the quarterfinals and just barely lost to Belgium. Today wasn’t a major surprise

    – Japan is already top 10 in another major team sport, rugby

    – The Japanese team had a major size disadvantage vs. Germany, but made up for it in speed and tenacity

    – The Chinese team has no size disadvantage, yet they still suck because they a bunch of overpaid egotistical pansies

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    The Chinese are unsurpassed in producing martial arts movie stars.

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    , @AnonfromTN
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    Your comments show clear anti-Chinese bias, most common among Japanese. FYI, that feeling is mutual: most Chinese hate Japanese (although Chinese in the US usually buy Japanese cars).

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    , @Matra
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms


    Japan is already top 10 in another major team sport, rugby
     
    Many their players are barely or not even Japanese. If you watched the last World Cup you know that.

    Also, everyone on earth who follows rugby knows that the sport has always been dominated by the three main Southern Hempishere countries plus England and France, and being very generous based on their performances over the last 40 years I'll include Ireland, Wales, and Argentina. After them all you have is Scotland (population 6 million), Italy (never very good) and a few minuscule Pacific islands like Tonga and Fiji. Getting into the top ten with such competitors is hardly a major accomplishment for a country of way over 120 million people, though I'll grant you that they have got better over the decades.

    From what I can tell the best sport for East Asians is baseball with Japan and S. Korea always doing well at the World Baseball Classic, exporting players to MLB, and having strong domestic leagues. They're not likely to get much better at soccer.

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms, @silviosilver

    , @showmethereal
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    I notice it is usually the people with the least actual knowledge who are quickest to resort to insults. Are Steve Nash and Manu Ginobli East Asian??? Stick to the topic. The original question was the difference between Chinese and Koreans and Japanese in international football. Simple answer is China was isolated and started much later. But just like the Olympics once China gets experience it will surpass both Koreans and Japanese.
    Basketball indeed is the perfect example. How many ethnic Koreans and Japanese made it in the NBA?? They make it in baseball because as US vassals they have long experience at baseball. East Asians do not have the physical attributes to dominate in basketball. That is a simple reality. BUT China has indeed produced a hall of famer in Yao Ming. To compare Steve Nash and Manu Ginobili has zero context. However Canada and Argentina have played basketball much longer than China on a grass roots. So there is no way you can say a Jeremy Lin can’t become on their level. In fact when Jeremy Lin did go play in China he didn’t dominate the way Stephon Marbury did - which means other Chinese (born) could indeed play in the NBA. But I still don’t expect China to become as good as the US or Spain simply because of gene pool. The women on the hand may one day beat the US women as they have come close more than once. But as I see others noted - you aren’t actually thinking with rational sense but have a grudge against Chinese.

    And no Japan is not a team anyone fears to play. Neither is the US and the US made the knockout rounds before. Use real sense.

    I see others addressed rugby so no need to waste my time.

    The only thing you did say correct is that Chinese footballers are indeed overpaid. Korean and Japanese league players make less money which makes them more hungry to strive overseas and get better. Indeed the Chinese Super League salaries are over inflated.

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms, @Emil Nikola Richard

  230. @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @showmethereal

    You obviously don't know jack squat about sports so should STFU:

    - China can produce another Yao or Lin, but China cannot to produce a Steve Nash or Manu Ginobili, a moderately athletic guy who's not even that tall but has high basketball IQ

    - Japan almost made it in 2018 to the quarterfinals and just barely lost to Belgium. Today wasn't a major surprise

    - Japan is already top 10 in another major team sport, rugby

    - The Japanese team had a major size disadvantage vs. Germany, but made up for it in speed and tenacity

    - The Chinese team has no size disadvantage, yet they still suck because they a bunch of overpaid egotistical pansies

    https://i.postimg.cc/Gh9ZqcTD/China-PR-national-football-team-training-in-Tehran-01.jpg

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @AnonfromTN, @Matra, @showmethereal

    The Chinese are unsurpassed in producing martial arts movie stars.

    • Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    It's all fake. Real Chinese martial arts is sanda, Tatar wrestling plus kickboxing. Not native to China.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanda_(sport)

  231. @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @showmethereal

    You obviously don't know jack squat about sports so should STFU:

    - China can produce another Yao or Lin, but China cannot to produce a Steve Nash or Manu Ginobili, a moderately athletic guy who's not even that tall but has high basketball IQ

    - Japan almost made it in 2018 to the quarterfinals and just barely lost to Belgium. Today wasn't a major surprise

    - Japan is already top 10 in another major team sport, rugby

    - The Japanese team had a major size disadvantage vs. Germany, but made up for it in speed and tenacity

    - The Chinese team has no size disadvantage, yet they still suck because they a bunch of overpaid egotistical pansies

    https://i.postimg.cc/Gh9ZqcTD/China-PR-national-football-team-training-in-Tehran-01.jpg

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @AnonfromTN, @Matra, @showmethereal

    Your comments show clear anti-Chinese bias, most common among Japanese. FYI, that feeling is mutual: most Chinese hate Japanese (although Chinese in the US usually buy Japanese cars).

    • Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @AnonfromTN

    Chinese are now the populous minority group in Japan. Whereas Russians on surface are friendly but are actually contemptuous towards Chinese, I saw that after Pelosi's landing.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_people_in_Japan

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  232. @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @showmethereal

    You obviously don't know jack squat about sports so should STFU:

    - China can produce another Yao or Lin, but China cannot to produce a Steve Nash or Manu Ginobili, a moderately athletic guy who's not even that tall but has high basketball IQ

    - Japan almost made it in 2018 to the quarterfinals and just barely lost to Belgium. Today wasn't a major surprise

    - Japan is already top 10 in another major team sport, rugby

    - The Japanese team had a major size disadvantage vs. Germany, but made up for it in speed and tenacity

    - The Chinese team has no size disadvantage, yet they still suck because they a bunch of overpaid egotistical pansies

    https://i.postimg.cc/Gh9ZqcTD/China-PR-national-football-team-training-in-Tehran-01.jpg

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @AnonfromTN, @Matra, @showmethereal

    Japan is already top 10 in another major team sport, rugby

    Many their players are barely or not even Japanese. If you watched the last World Cup you know that.

    Also, everyone on earth who follows rugby knows that the sport has always been dominated by the three main Southern Hempishere countries plus England and France, and being very generous based on their performances over the last 40 years I’ll include Ireland, Wales, and Argentina. After them all you have is Scotland (population 6 million), Italy (never very good) and a few minuscule Pacific islands like Tonga and Fiji. Getting into the top ten with such competitors is hardly a major accomplishment for a country of way over 120 million people, though I’ll grant you that they have got better over the decades.

    From what I can tell the best sport for East Asians is baseball with Japan and S. Korea always doing well at the World Baseball Classic, exporting players to MLB, and having strong domestic leagues. They’re not likely to get much better at soccer.

    • Thanks: showmethereal
    • Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @Matra

    What percent of English rugby team is native English?

    There's untapped talent if Chinese (or better yet Mongols) get into rugby

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weightlifting_at_the_Summer_Olympics

    , @silviosilver
    @Matra


    They’re not likely to get much better at soccer.
     
    Why not though? Surely it's partly a function of how popular the sport is. So if today it's starting from a low base (I have no idea if it is), then it's not unreasonable to expect substantial improvement. Even in a worst case scenario of demographic decline in coming decades, say a 50% drop, it's still a sizeable population. (And nowhere else besides Africa is going to grow much, to the extreme detriment of all of us, of course...)

    Regarding race and sport, there's obviously a relationship, but it's difficult to tease out the various causal factors behind various countries' success. Not saying this to brag (maybe a little, hehe), but has any country dominated any sport as thoroughly as Serbia dominates water polo? (Argentina maybe with polo polo?) They, like Croats, also punch above their weight in more popular sports, like soccer, basketball, handball and volleyball. But are Serbs and Croats really physically that different to, say, Hungarians or Austrians or, a bit further afield, Poles, who are notable mostly for their lack of sporting success? Maybe the answer is: they have better things to do with their time, such as build prosperous economies. Then again, Australia has long kicked ass in sport (just not the ones I tend to care about) and this doesn't seem to have been an obstacle to achieving enviable prosperity.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Matra

  233. @showmethereal
    @Yahya

    Comparing China to South Korea and Japan in football is easy. China started playing the game on a grass roots level much much later. Once China started to focus on summer Olympic sports it passed Japan in medals. Now it passed everyone except the US and almost beat the US. Now that if focuses on Winter Olympic sports it beat Japan and South Korea. That’s with about 8 years of work. Football the Chinese women beat other Asians. Why the men don’t is another matter. As to culture - don’t go by what westerners tell you. They boost Korea and Japan because they are western Allies.

    But back to football - in 20 years China will do much better. But will it win? I have doubts. Same with basketball- China is getting better (it’s the second most popular sport) but there are certain physical attributes that just aren’t in the gene pool as readily. China will produce more Jeremy Lins than they will Yao Ming. Meaning Jeremy Lin was pretty good but not an “all star”. Yao Ming was a Hall of Famer. Same will happen with football in my mind. A could of Chinese have made it to top European leagues…. Like Koreans and Japanese before. But I doubt they become too 10. Top 20 is more realistic.

    Ironically Japan beat Germany 2-1. Completely shocking. But don’t expect Japan to win the tournament. And don’t expect them to repeatedly beat Germany either in the future.

    And Germany has been one of the best in the world for 100 years. They are NOT known for flair players though. Football is a multi faceted sport. Brazil and Germany have won the most World Cups between them and yet play completely differently! Italy has won the 3rd most and again plays completely differently. They were always thought of as a more defensive side with rarely having flair players either. Germany was always thought of for their machine like efficiency. It is Brazil that is know for flair and creativity. Only the Dutch and Argentines have been though of to have as much flair and creativity. Argentina has won more than the Dutch though. Again - very complex

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms, @songbird

    Same with basketball- China is getting better (it’s the second most popular sport)

    After that commercial where LeBron Jones played one-on-one against a dragon (the symbol of China) and won, they should have arrested everyone involved in promoting basketball in China and shot them in the back of the head.

    (I must specify that this is a joke.)

  234. @Matra
    @silviosilver


    If you’ve honestly never heard of Athletico Bilbao though, they’re actually one of the most successful teams in Spanish club soccer, and they’ve managed that feat despite (or maybe because of?) their policy of using only Basque players.
     
    Just to be clear it means the players must come from the Basque country, and they might be flexible about what that means. I don't know if you even have to be born there or can join a club as kid straight from Africa and be classified as Basque. Last time I saw them play they had one black player. Tracing his DNA would tell not solve any puzzles about Basque origins.

    But I can understand why ‘purist’ fans – which soccer is chock full of – would be put off by the changes.
     
    I'm anything but a purist but the Americanisation of sports is mostly a bad thing. (Though I noticed you Aussies were quicker to embrace that in rugby league and other sports than the Brits, maybe 'colonials' are more open to change). Even in Canada many older hockey people prefer watching IIHF sanctioned games that can have ties (unless they've changed that) and end in two hours because they don't have TV timeouts like the wretched NHL. Everything in post-1960s America is a big bloated production full of hype, overwrought sentimentality, not to mention the worshipping of black people.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @A123, @Mikel

    Just to be clear it means the players must come from the Basque country, and they might be flexible about what that means.

    Quite true. Right now there is a French guy, Aymeric Laporte, playing for Spain in the World Cup. He was born somewhere in Aquitaine but the Athletic de Bilbao detectives found that 2 of his grandparents were from the French Basque Country so they recruited him as a teenager. Then he decided to get a Spanish passport and now may end up playing against his country of origin. Athletic’s rule of only using local players used to be much more serious in the past.

  235. @Sher Singh
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GURv4guxIcE

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6TwioIc6a_8

    @songbird Catholics were cucked by love marriage & executing criminals.
    https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/147470491501300114

    A belief in the Rule of Law, rather than the Gods doesn't help.
    A distant authority bringing order to the world, rather than a personal chaos shaping reality.

    https://www.academia.edu/1549528/2_The_Christian_origins_of_secularism_and_the_rule_of_law

    Won't really say much more, not my problem tbh.


    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/777363024196796426/852791619115417620/unknown.png

    Replies: @songbird

    Sikhism would seem to prescribe that Justin Trudeau grow his hair even longer and look even more like a tranny. IMO, the only solution to the Justin Trudeaus of the world is to give them buzzcuts.

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @songbird

    Why should I hate trudeau?

    Classical liberalism is about internalizing public opinion & reducing harm.
    He does that admirably, and is a good representation of White culture.

    As a White Nationalist, I can bear no ill will against justeen Trudeau.

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਿਹ

    Replies: @Jatt Aryaa

  236. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    The Chinese are unsurpassed in producing martial arts movie stars.

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    It’s all fake. Real Chinese martial arts is sanda, Tatar wrestling plus kickboxing. Not native to China.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanda_(sport)

  237. Kherson City

    See new Tweets
    Conversation
    Nina 🐙 Byzantina
    @NinaByzantina
    If the western media echo chamber is acknowledging “sympathies for Russia,” multiply it by 1,000.

    https://washingtonpost.com/world/2022/11/&#8230;

    [MORE]

  238. @AnonfromTN
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    Your comments show clear anti-Chinese bias, most common among Japanese. FYI, that feeling is mutual: most Chinese hate Japanese (although Chinese in the US usually buy Japanese cars).

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    Chinese are now the populous minority group in Japan. Whereas Russians on surface are friendly but are actually contemptuous towards Chinese, I saw that after Pelosi’s landing.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_people_in_Japan

    • Troll: showmethereal
    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms


    Whereas Russians on surface are friendly but are actually contemptuous towards Chinese
     
    A lot of things I know contradict this strange assertion. In fact, my smartest post-doc (out of >10) was Chinese, as was one of the two of my smartest graduate students. Both now hold faculty positions in the US universities. Chinese undergrad I have right now in the lab is among the three best (out of >50) undergrads I ever had. But I am sure I am not a representative example of Russians.

    What about more representative Russians? In the RF Far East, where Chinese live alongside Russians, Chinese say that Russians are the only white people who treat them as equals. There is a fair number of intermarriages there. More often than not both parties feel good about those marriages years later.

    I observed contemptuous attitude towards Chinese only in Indonesia and Malaysia. This was directed towards Chinese and Japanese tourists. My impression was that locals felt that white tourists are within their rights, whereas Chinese and Japanese are impostors, behaving like tourists while having no right to.

    BTW, if you believe what you read in wiki, I have a bridge to sell you.

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms, @Mikel

  239. @Matra
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms


    Japan is already top 10 in another major team sport, rugby
     
    Many their players are barely or not even Japanese. If you watched the last World Cup you know that.

    Also, everyone on earth who follows rugby knows that the sport has always been dominated by the three main Southern Hempishere countries plus England and France, and being very generous based on their performances over the last 40 years I'll include Ireland, Wales, and Argentina. After them all you have is Scotland (population 6 million), Italy (never very good) and a few minuscule Pacific islands like Tonga and Fiji. Getting into the top ten with such competitors is hardly a major accomplishment for a country of way over 120 million people, though I'll grant you that they have got better over the decades.

    From what I can tell the best sport for East Asians is baseball with Japan and S. Korea always doing well at the World Baseball Classic, exporting players to MLB, and having strong domestic leagues. They're not likely to get much better at soccer.

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms, @silviosilver

    What percent of English rugby team is native English?

    There’s untapped talent if Chinese (or better yet Mongols) get into rugby

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weightlifting_at_the_Summer_Olympics

  240. If Russians are enthusiastic enough about a raccoon* to make it a mascot for paratroopers (rumor is they took one from the Kherson zoo), think of how much more enthusiastic they would be about a wooly, giant sloth, or giant beaver.

    *considered a pest animal in America. It raids the garbage, attacks cats, and can carry rabies.
    _____
    I feel that all these games where an animal (octopus, otter, parrot…) prophesies who will win the world cup by selecting the flag of certain teams is meant to be a subtle critique on democracy.

  241. @A123
    @keypusher

    Your strawmanning and lies are quite pathetic.

    You really should stop unless you want to be viewed as comic relief.

    ==============================
       We are not laughing with you!
          We are all laughing at you!
    ==============================


    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @Mikel

    Speaking of laughs, yesterday I read this piece at Takimag and I thought of you:

    https://www.takimag.com/article/midterm-for-the-worse-part-ii-these-firsts-shall-be-our-last/

    I don’t think you’re going to like it and I don’t agree with every single point myself but Cole is always sharp and funny and you definitely need to read different points of view outside of the informational bubble you seem to be in.

    • Replies: @A123
    @Mikel

    Speaking of laughs, yesterday I read this piece at PJ Media and I thought of you:

    https://pjmedia.com/columns/david-solway-2/2022/11/11/desantis-2024-think-again-n1645202

    I don’t think you’re going to like it and I don’t agree with every single point myself but Solway is sharp. You definitely need to read different points of view outside of the #NeverTrump bubble you seem to be in.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @Mikel

  242. @Mikel
    @A123

    Speaking of laughs, yesterday I read this piece at Takimag and I thought of you:

    https://www.takimag.com/article/midterm-for-the-worse-part-ii-these-firsts-shall-be-our-last/

    I don't think you're going to like it and I don't agree with every single point myself but Cole is always sharp and funny and you definitely need to read different points of view outside of the informational bubble you seem to be in.

    Replies: @A123

    Speaking of laughs, yesterday I read this piece at PJ Media and I thought of you:

    https://pjmedia.com/columns/david-solway-2/2022/11/11/desantis-2024-think-again-n1645202

    I don’t think you’re going to like it and I don’t agree with every single point myself but Solway is sharp. You definitely need to read different points of view outside of the #NeverTrump bubble you seem to be in.

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @Mikel
    @A123

    As it happens, I had already read that piece somewhere else. That's the difference between the two of us and what I referred to when I mentioned your bubble. Don't you have any better argument for everything that has happened and will happen than the allegedly rigged elections that nonetheless no Republican candidate has contested? Why support the Trump candidacy or any other if the elections are going to be rigged and the Republicans that have a majority of state governors are unable to do anything about it? Why is Trump even trying to be elected again if you guys are right and the Democrats have the power to win the next elections through fraud?

    Replies: @A123, @silviosilver

  243. @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @AnonfromTN

    Chinese are now the populous minority group in Japan. Whereas Russians on surface are friendly but are actually contemptuous towards Chinese, I saw that after Pelosi's landing.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_people_in_Japan

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    Whereas Russians on surface are friendly but are actually contemptuous towards Chinese

    A lot of things I know contradict this strange assertion. In fact, my smartest post-doc (out of >10) was Chinese, as was one of the two of my smartest graduate students. Both now hold faculty positions in the US universities. Chinese undergrad I have right now in the lab is among the three best (out of >50) undergrads I ever had. But I am sure I am not a representative example of Russians.

    What about more representative Russians? In the RF Far East, where Chinese live alongside Russians, Chinese say that Russians are the only white people who treat them as equals. There is a fair number of intermarriages there. More often than not both parties feel good about those marriages years later.

    I observed contemptuous attitude towards Chinese only in Indonesia and Malaysia. This was directed towards Chinese and Japanese tourists. My impression was that locals felt that white tourists are within their rights, whereas Chinese and Japanese are impostors, behaving like tourists while having no right to.

    BTW, if you believe what you read in wiki, I have a bridge to sell you.

    • Agree: Mikhail, showmethereal
    • Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @AnonfromTN

    Thanks. Chinese of course excel academically, but continue to be narrowly focused. I see this in my area where Chinese hit a ceiling easily but don't have the soft skills to move higher, on top of that some indeed have integrity issues.

    In PRC, Chinese put up little resistance to horrific Zero Covid measures. In the US these "anti-Asian" attacks are almost entirely against Chinese who are perceived as easy marks. Then the StopAsianHate scam is entirely a Chinese American thing. To me all this is related to Chinese being generally effeminate and unathletic. On top of that they attribute this to genetics so don't even try.


    most Chinese hate Japanese
     
    There's a material minority of independent thinking Chinese who feel the opposite.

    anti-Chinese bias, most common among Japanese
     
    This is misunderstood. Jackie Chan made a movie Shinjuku Incident where he’s an illegal immigrant to Japan. He joins the criminal underclass, where all the Chinese pretended to be brothers but in the end all backstabbed each other. The only protagonist was the Japanese detective.

    The most memorable line was:


    日本人不偷東西,就以為別人也不偷,真傻

    The Japanese don't steal, and therefore think no one else would, so gullible

     

    Replies: @songbird

    , @Mikel
    @AnonfromTN


    BTW, if you believe what you read in wiki, I have a bridge to sell you.
     
    Saying "if you believe what you read in wiki" is like saying "if you believe what you read in magazines". Which magazines? The ones that talk about food recipes or the ones that talk about politics? And which sections in those magazines? The opinion pieces or the column about upcoming events? Discarding all of Wikipedia because there is bias in certain entries is like discarding the contents of a whole dictionary because it includes woke words and definitions.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  244. @AnonfromTN
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms


    Whereas Russians on surface are friendly but are actually contemptuous towards Chinese
     
    A lot of things I know contradict this strange assertion. In fact, my smartest post-doc (out of >10) was Chinese, as was one of the two of my smartest graduate students. Both now hold faculty positions in the US universities. Chinese undergrad I have right now in the lab is among the three best (out of >50) undergrads I ever had. But I am sure I am not a representative example of Russians.

    What about more representative Russians? In the RF Far East, where Chinese live alongside Russians, Chinese say that Russians are the only white people who treat them as equals. There is a fair number of intermarriages there. More often than not both parties feel good about those marriages years later.

    I observed contemptuous attitude towards Chinese only in Indonesia and Malaysia. This was directed towards Chinese and Japanese tourists. My impression was that locals felt that white tourists are within their rights, whereas Chinese and Japanese are impostors, behaving like tourists while having no right to.

    BTW, if you believe what you read in wiki, I have a bridge to sell you.

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms, @Mikel

    Thanks. Chinese of course excel academically, but continue to be narrowly focused. I see this in my area where Chinese hit a ceiling easily but don’t have the soft skills to move higher, on top of that some indeed have integrity issues.

    In PRC, Chinese put up little resistance to horrific Zero Covid measures. In the US these “anti-Asian” attacks are almost entirely against Chinese who are perceived as easy marks. Then the StopAsianHate scam is entirely a Chinese American thing. To me all this is related to Chinese being generally effeminate and unathletic. On top of that they attribute this to genetics so don’t even try.

    most Chinese hate Japanese

    There’s a material minority of independent thinking Chinese who feel the opposite.

    anti-Chinese bias, most common among Japanese

    This is misunderstood. Jackie Chan made a movie Shinjuku Incident where he’s an illegal immigrant to Japan. He joins the criminal underclass, where all the Chinese pretended to be brothers but in the end all backstabbed each other. The only protagonist was the Japanese detective.

    The most memorable line was:

    日本人不偷東西,就以為別人也不偷,真傻

    The Japanese don’t steal, and therefore think no one else would, so gullible

    • Replies: @songbird
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    Couple days ago, I spoke to a Chinese doctor, who had all these woke badges on him. BLM, he/him, a rainbow lanyard, and I forget what else. It is only now just occurring to me that he was probably from HK. I didn't think of it at first because his name was very Chinese.

  245. @AnonfromTN
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    You may be right. In my experience (two faculty, four post-docs, two graduate students, and one undergrad; hardly a representative sample), the majority of Han Chinese lives in warmer climates. They consider Inner Mongolia and Manchuria very cold.

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    There’s a selection bias, most STEM Chinese in US are from the coastal south, 江南 Jiangnan, which entered into Chinese history later.

    Unfortunately, the Cradle of Chinese Civilization, 中原 Zhongyuan, in modern times, is about as underdeveloped as the Cradle of Western Civilization, Greece.


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zhongyuan

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms


    most STEM Chinese in US are from the coastal south
     
    Come to think of it, most are. But I had one pretty good and productive post-doc from Xinjiang (she is Han Chinese). However, she got her PhD from Fudan university in Shanghai. The smartest one was from the South, but not the coast. Grad student was from a smallish (by Chinese standards) city near Shanghai, close to Suzhou. Did not ask the undergrad where she is from.

    The thing about wiki stands.
  246. @A123
    @Mikel

    Speaking of laughs, yesterday I read this piece at PJ Media and I thought of you:

    https://pjmedia.com/columns/david-solway-2/2022/11/11/desantis-2024-think-again-n1645202

    I don’t think you’re going to like it and I don’t agree with every single point myself but Solway is sharp. You definitely need to read different points of view outside of the #NeverTrump bubble you seem to be in.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @Mikel

    As it happens, I had already read that piece somewhere else. That’s the difference between the two of us and what I referred to when I mentioned your bubble. Don’t you have any better argument for everything that has happened and will happen than the allegedly rigged elections that nonetheless no Republican candidate has contested? Why support the Trump candidacy or any other if the elections are going to be rigged and the Republicans that have a majority of state governors are unable to do anything about it? Why is Trump even trying to be elected again if you guys are right and the Democrats have the power to win the next elections through fraud?

    • Replies: @A123
    @Mikel

    Why are you desperately trying to sweep under the rug the election fraud that is being contested?

    How could you miss it?

    https://www.zerohedge.com/political/top-arizona-election-official-moved-undisclosed-location

    Did you also miss these?

    https://theconservativetreehouse.com/blog/2022/11/23/kari-lake-provides-update-on-status-of-arizona-botched-election-lawsuits/

     
    https://rumble.com/embed/v1u3wae/
     

    The difference between you and I is simple. I follow facts. I call the objective truth that vote fraud is real.

    Your closed mind is centered on #NeverTrump histrionics, fiction, and blind faith in the Fake Stream Media. Believing Rachel Maddow is a terrible mental dysfunction on your part.

     
    https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEjVfh-oqB8hD5WLet0WHfeRZYBA2hveWmqeGunLIGfu5GOvpLZzPSUVgkckB0ljIu3dr9fvSqER_6VMAntSYmrSQDA3W56Bw7gfteNxEPTF5cC-4UkdKFFTkVm4n-ZuQBmqbp61ijflSuYgs1KgKykyd0Wte5TzZJmEGT_BxgsepPBu8PSOl1Y2OnHvuA/s540/90mimb_bcf7f1299855c6eca6ebe3475e0e9120_b60e1116_540.jpg
     

    Why do you insist on submission to Not-The-President Biden? Is he really worth of 4 more years? Trying to create a insurrection guaranteed to fail is giving Chuck Schumer exactly what he wants.

    Can you not see this blindingly obvious reality?

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Mikel

    , @silviosilver
    @Mikel

    Do you find it completely implausible that there may have been decisive election shenanigans? If you find it implausible, consider the kind of people who would be engaged in the shenanigans: antifa-supporting leftards, 1000% in favor open borders, who have no qualms about (and list of justifications as long as your arm for) blatant anti-white discrimination, etc. For these people, America as it has thus far existed is nothing but an obstacle to their "progressive" program (ie transforming the country into "Los Esclavos Unidos"), which they are impatient as hell to implement. Do they strike as you the kind of people who would give the flyingest of fucks about staid "white supremacist" notions of election integrity? Personally, I think all this is perfectly plausible, but I'm not yet prepared to say it's definitely happening.

    Replies: @LondonBob, @Mikel

  247. @AnonfromTN
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms


    Whereas Russians on surface are friendly but are actually contemptuous towards Chinese
     
    A lot of things I know contradict this strange assertion. In fact, my smartest post-doc (out of >10) was Chinese, as was one of the two of my smartest graduate students. Both now hold faculty positions in the US universities. Chinese undergrad I have right now in the lab is among the three best (out of >50) undergrads I ever had. But I am sure I am not a representative example of Russians.

    What about more representative Russians? In the RF Far East, where Chinese live alongside Russians, Chinese say that Russians are the only white people who treat them as equals. There is a fair number of intermarriages there. More often than not both parties feel good about those marriages years later.

    I observed contemptuous attitude towards Chinese only in Indonesia and Malaysia. This was directed towards Chinese and Japanese tourists. My impression was that locals felt that white tourists are within their rights, whereas Chinese and Japanese are impostors, behaving like tourists while having no right to.

    BTW, if you believe what you read in wiki, I have a bridge to sell you.

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms, @Mikel

    BTW, if you believe what you read in wiki, I have a bridge to sell you.

    Saying “if you believe what you read in wiki” is like saying “if you believe what you read in magazines”. Which magazines? The ones that talk about food recipes or the ones that talk about politics? And which sections in those magazines? The opinion pieces or the column about upcoming events? Discarding all of Wikipedia because there is bias in certain entries is like discarding the contents of a whole dictionary because it includes woke words and definitions.

    • Agree: silviosilver
    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Mikel

    Everything that concerns politics, political geography, economics, and history in wiki ranges from lies to blatant lies. Usually heavily censored. What you read about chemical compounds, nucleic acids, and proteins tends to be true. Likely other non-political items, too (did not check them out).

  248. @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @AnonfromTN

    There's a selection bias, most STEM Chinese in US are from the coastal south, 江南 Jiangnan, which entered into Chinese history later.

    Unfortunately, the Cradle of Chinese Civilization, 中原 Zhongyuan, in modern times, is about as underdeveloped as the Cradle of Western Civilization, Greece.

    https://i.postimg.cc/FHpvYHqV/Zhongyuan-map.png
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zhongyuan

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    most STEM Chinese in US are from the coastal south

    Come to think of it, most are. But I had one pretty good and productive post-doc from Xinjiang (she is Han Chinese). However, she got her PhD from Fudan university in Shanghai. The smartest one was from the South, but not the coast. Grad student was from a smallish (by Chinese standards) city near Shanghai, close to Suzhou. Did not ask the undergrad where she is from.

    The thing about wiki stands.

  249. @Mikel
    @AnonfromTN


    BTW, if you believe what you read in wiki, I have a bridge to sell you.
     
    Saying "if you believe what you read in wiki" is like saying "if you believe what you read in magazines". Which magazines? The ones that talk about food recipes or the ones that talk about politics? And which sections in those magazines? The opinion pieces or the column about upcoming events? Discarding all of Wikipedia because there is bias in certain entries is like discarding the contents of a whole dictionary because it includes woke words and definitions.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    Everything that concerns politics, political geography, economics, and history in wiki ranges from lies to blatant lies. Usually heavily censored. What you read about chemical compounds, nucleic acids, and proteins tends to be true. Likely other non-political items, too (did not check them out).

    • Agree: showmethereal
  250. @Mikel
    @A123

    As it happens, I had already read that piece somewhere else. That's the difference between the two of us and what I referred to when I mentioned your bubble. Don't you have any better argument for everything that has happened and will happen than the allegedly rigged elections that nonetheless no Republican candidate has contested? Why support the Trump candidacy or any other if the elections are going to be rigged and the Republicans that have a majority of state governors are unable to do anything about it? Why is Trump even trying to be elected again if you guys are right and the Democrats have the power to win the next elections through fraud?

    Replies: @A123, @silviosilver

    Why are you desperately trying to sweep under the rug the election fraud that is being contested?

    How could you miss it?

    https://www.zerohedge.com/political/top-arizona-election-official-moved-undisclosed-location

    Did you also miss these?

    https://theconservativetreehouse.com/blog/2022/11/23/kari-lake-provides-update-on-status-of-arizona-botched-election-lawsuits/

     



    Video Link
     

    The difference between you and I is simple. I follow facts. I call the objective truth that vote fraud is real.

    Your closed mind is centered on #NeverTrump histrionics, fiction, and blind faith in the Fake Stream Media. Believing Rachel Maddow is a terrible mental dysfunction on your part.

     

     

    Why do you insist on submission to Not-The-President Biden? Is he really worth of 4 more years? Trying to create a insurrection guaranteed to fail is giving Chuck Schumer exactly what he wants.

    Can you not see this blindingly obvious reality?

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @A123


    Why are you desperately trying to sweep under the rug the election fraud
     
    I like posting jokes. Here are two American ones.

    When the guy learned that his in-laws voted for Biden, he got so pissed that stopped visiting their graves.

    My father was a lifelong Republican supporter. But after he died, he started voting for Democrats.

    Replies: @A123

    , @Mikel
    @A123

    So you have managed to find one (1) Republican candidate out of hundreds that is going for a recount but, as expected, no answer to my very simple questions.

    If you think that Takimag is MSM or somehow equivalent to the Maddow show you must have started too early with the bourbon this long weekend. Take it easy, there's plenty of time ahead. Happy thanksgiving anyway. Stay well.

  251. @A123
    @Mikel

    Why are you desperately trying to sweep under the rug the election fraud that is being contested?

    How could you miss it?

    https://www.zerohedge.com/political/top-arizona-election-official-moved-undisclosed-location

    Did you also miss these?

    https://theconservativetreehouse.com/blog/2022/11/23/kari-lake-provides-update-on-status-of-arizona-botched-election-lawsuits/

     
    https://rumble.com/embed/v1u3wae/
     

    The difference between you and I is simple. I follow facts. I call the objective truth that vote fraud is real.

    Your closed mind is centered on #NeverTrump histrionics, fiction, and blind faith in the Fake Stream Media. Believing Rachel Maddow is a terrible mental dysfunction on your part.

     
    https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEjVfh-oqB8hD5WLet0WHfeRZYBA2hveWmqeGunLIGfu5GOvpLZzPSUVgkckB0ljIu3dr9fvSqER_6VMAntSYmrSQDA3W56Bw7gfteNxEPTF5cC-4UkdKFFTkVm4n-ZuQBmqbp61ijflSuYgs1KgKykyd0Wte5TzZJmEGT_BxgsepPBu8PSOl1Y2OnHvuA/s540/90mimb_bcf7f1299855c6eca6ebe3475e0e9120_b60e1116_540.jpg
     

    Why do you insist on submission to Not-The-President Biden? Is he really worth of 4 more years? Trying to create a insurrection guaranteed to fail is giving Chuck Schumer exactly what he wants.

    Can you not see this blindingly obvious reality?

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Mikel

    Why are you desperately trying to sweep under the rug the election fraud

    I like posting jokes. Here are two American ones.

    When the guy learned that his in-laws voted for Biden, he got so pissed that stopped visiting their graves.

    My father was a lifelong Republican supporter. But after he died, he started voting for Democrats.

    • Replies: @A123
    @AnonfromTN


    I like posting jokes. Here are two American ones.

    When the guy learned that his in-laws voted for Biden, he got so pissed that stopped visiting their graves.

    My father was a lifelong Republican supporter. But after he died, he started voting for Democrats.
     

    Sadly, your "jokes" are 100% accurate:

     
    https://media-cldnry.s-nbcnews.com/image/upload/t_fit-1120w,f_auto,q_auto:best/rockcms/2022-10/221027-inline-tweet-ac-435p-7be986.jpg
     

    The fraud Mikel embraces is undeniably obvious. That leaves two options:

    -1- Fix the issue.
    -2- Replicate the issue on unprecedented scale.

    If you or Mikel have a credible path to #1 please share it.

    Failing that, the 2020 precedent of Fultoning will apply to 2024. Counting & Balloting will be more important than voting.

    PEACE 😇

  252. @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @AnonfromTN

    Thanks. Chinese of course excel academically, but continue to be narrowly focused. I see this in my area where Chinese hit a ceiling easily but don't have the soft skills to move higher, on top of that some indeed have integrity issues.

    In PRC, Chinese put up little resistance to horrific Zero Covid measures. In the US these "anti-Asian" attacks are almost entirely against Chinese who are perceived as easy marks. Then the StopAsianHate scam is entirely a Chinese American thing. To me all this is related to Chinese being generally effeminate and unathletic. On top of that they attribute this to genetics so don't even try.


    most Chinese hate Japanese
     
    There's a material minority of independent thinking Chinese who feel the opposite.

    anti-Chinese bias, most common among Japanese
     
    This is misunderstood. Jackie Chan made a movie Shinjuku Incident where he’s an illegal immigrant to Japan. He joins the criminal underclass, where all the Chinese pretended to be brothers but in the end all backstabbed each other. The only protagonist was the Japanese detective.

    The most memorable line was:


    日本人不偷東西,就以為別人也不偷,真傻

    The Japanese don't steal, and therefore think no one else would, so gullible

     

    Replies: @songbird

    Couple days ago, I spoke to a Chinese doctor, who had all these woke badges on him. BLM, he/him, a rainbow lanyard, and I forget what else. It is only now just occurring to me that he was probably from HK. I didn’t think of it at first because his name was very Chinese.

  253. @A123
    @Mikel

    Why are you desperately trying to sweep under the rug the election fraud that is being contested?

    How could you miss it?

    https://www.zerohedge.com/political/top-arizona-election-official-moved-undisclosed-location

    Did you also miss these?

    https://theconservativetreehouse.com/blog/2022/11/23/kari-lake-provides-update-on-status-of-arizona-botched-election-lawsuits/

     
    https://rumble.com/embed/v1u3wae/
     

    The difference between you and I is simple. I follow facts. I call the objective truth that vote fraud is real.

    Your closed mind is centered on #NeverTrump histrionics, fiction, and blind faith in the Fake Stream Media. Believing Rachel Maddow is a terrible mental dysfunction on your part.

     
    https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEjVfh-oqB8hD5WLet0WHfeRZYBA2hveWmqeGunLIGfu5GOvpLZzPSUVgkckB0ljIu3dr9fvSqER_6VMAntSYmrSQDA3W56Bw7gfteNxEPTF5cC-4UkdKFFTkVm4n-ZuQBmqbp61ijflSuYgs1KgKykyd0Wte5TzZJmEGT_BxgsepPBu8PSOl1Y2OnHvuA/s540/90mimb_bcf7f1299855c6eca6ebe3475e0e9120_b60e1116_540.jpg
     

    Why do you insist on submission to Not-The-President Biden? Is he really worth of 4 more years? Trying to create a insurrection guaranteed to fail is giving Chuck Schumer exactly what he wants.

    Can you not see this blindingly obvious reality?

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Mikel

    So you have managed to find one (1) Republican candidate out of hundreds that is going for a recount but, as expected, no answer to my very simple questions.

    If you think that Takimag is MSM or somehow equivalent to the Maddow show you must have started too early with the bourbon this long weekend. Take it easy, there’s plenty of time ahead. Happy thanksgiving anyway. Stay well.

    • LOL: A123
  254. @AnonfromTN
    @A123


    Why are you desperately trying to sweep under the rug the election fraud
     
    I like posting jokes. Here are two American ones.

    When the guy learned that his in-laws voted for Biden, he got so pissed that stopped visiting their graves.

    My father was a lifelong Republican supporter. But after he died, he started voting for Democrats.

    Replies: @A123

    I like posting jokes. Here are two American ones.

    When the guy learned that his in-laws voted for Biden, he got so pissed that stopped visiting their graves.

    My father was a lifelong Republican supporter. But after he died, he started voting for Democrats.

    Sadly, your “jokes” are 100% accurate:

      

    The fraud Mikel embraces is undeniably obvious. That leaves two options:

    -1- Fix the issue.
    -2- Replicate the issue on unprecedented scale.

    If you or Mikel have a credible path to #1 please share it.

    Failing that, the 2020 precedent of Fultoning will apply to 2024. Counting & Balloting will be more important than voting.

    PEACE 😇

  255. @songbird
    @Sher Singh

    Sikhism would seem to prescribe that Justin Trudeau grow his hair even longer and look even more like a tranny. IMO, the only solution to the Justin Trudeaus of the world is to give them buzzcuts.

    Replies: @Sher Singh

    Why should I hate trudeau?

    Classical liberalism is about internalizing public opinion & reducing harm.
    He does that admirably, and is a good representation of White culture.

    As a White Nationalist, I can bear no ill will against justeen Trudeau.

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਿਹ

    • Replies: @Jatt Aryaa
    @Sher Singh

    Welp.

    https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/bill-c-21-ban-hunting-rifles

    Replies: @Barbarossa

  256. @Matra
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms


    Japan is already top 10 in another major team sport, rugby
     
    Many their players are barely or not even Japanese. If you watched the last World Cup you know that.

    Also, everyone on earth who follows rugby knows that the sport has always been dominated by the three main Southern Hempishere countries plus England and France, and being very generous based on their performances over the last 40 years I'll include Ireland, Wales, and Argentina. After them all you have is Scotland (population 6 million), Italy (never very good) and a few minuscule Pacific islands like Tonga and Fiji. Getting into the top ten with such competitors is hardly a major accomplishment for a country of way over 120 million people, though I'll grant you that they have got better over the decades.

    From what I can tell the best sport for East Asians is baseball with Japan and S. Korea always doing well at the World Baseball Classic, exporting players to MLB, and having strong domestic leagues. They're not likely to get much better at soccer.

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms, @silviosilver

    They’re not likely to get much better at soccer.

    Why not though? Surely it’s partly a function of how popular the sport is. So if today it’s starting from a low base (I have no idea if it is), then it’s not unreasonable to expect substantial improvement. Even in a worst case scenario of demographic decline in coming decades, say a 50% drop, it’s still a sizeable population. (And nowhere else besides Africa is going to grow much, to the extreme detriment of all of us, of course…)

    Regarding race and sport, there’s obviously a relationship, but it’s difficult to tease out the various causal factors behind various countries’ success. Not saying this to brag (maybe a little, hehe), but has any country dominated any sport as thoroughly as Serbia dominates water polo? (Argentina maybe with polo polo?) They, like Croats, also punch above their weight in more popular sports, like soccer, basketball, handball and volleyball. But are Serbs and Croats really physically that different to, say, Hungarians or Austrians or, a bit further afield, Poles, who are notable mostly for their lack of sporting success? Maybe the answer is: they have better things to do with their time, such as build prosperous economies. Then again, Australia has long kicked ass in sport (just not the ones I tend to care about) and this doesn’t seem to have been an obstacle to achieving enviable prosperity.

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @silviosilver

    The probability of making a good living playing sports is extremely low. Almost as bad as playing the lottery. When a class of people is exceptionally good at a sport it invariably is a signal of desperation.

    Classic example is negroes and basketball.

    Replies: @silviosilver

    , @Matra
    @silviosilver

    I haven't thought this through but one reason the Chinese may never get good at soccer is that it is not structured enough for them. Too much of what goes on on the pitch requires independent thought and initiative. S Korea playing today reminds me that they made to the semi-finals in 2002 - with the help of some dodgy home field advantage refereeing - but have done little since then. Anyway, East Asians are probably right not to attach so much national prestige and importance on sports.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

  257. @Mikel
    @A123

    As it happens, I had already read that piece somewhere else. That's the difference between the two of us and what I referred to when I mentioned your bubble. Don't you have any better argument for everything that has happened and will happen than the allegedly rigged elections that nonetheless no Republican candidate has contested? Why support the Trump candidacy or any other if the elections are going to be rigged and the Republicans that have a majority of state governors are unable to do anything about it? Why is Trump even trying to be elected again if you guys are right and the Democrats have the power to win the next elections through fraud?

    Replies: @A123, @silviosilver

    Do you find it completely implausible that there may have been decisive election shenanigans? If you find it implausible, consider the kind of people who would be engaged in the shenanigans: antifa-supporting leftards, 1000% in favor open borders, who have no qualms about (and list of justifications as long as your arm for) blatant anti-white discrimination, etc. For these people, America as it has thus far existed is nothing but an obstacle to their “progressive” program (ie transforming the country into “Los Esclavos Unidos”), which they are impatient as hell to implement. Do they strike as you the kind of people who would give the flyingest of fucks about staid “white supremacist” notions of election integrity? Personally, I think all this is perfectly plausible, but I’m not yet prepared to say it’s definitely happening.

    • Replies: @LondonBob
    @silviosilver

    Plenty of evidence of voter fraud has been found, long dead people in Michigan requesting and returning ballots, counting stopping, implausible one hundred percent to Biden vote dumps, ballot stuffing, election security measures gutted, expansion of mail voting, election results deviating from opinion polling, long established correlations in vote patterns breaking down in some places but not in others, voting machines breaking in Republican areas, people who didn't vote being told they voted etc.

    , @Mikel
    @silviosilver


    Do you find it completely implausible that there may have been decisive election shenanigans?
     
    The key words there are completely and decisive.

    I know for a fact that there must be some fraud because I see with my eyes every election that things like voter authentication are a joke. But regarding the 2020 elections, the likelihood of fraud of various kinds having a decisive impact in the results is very unlikely, to say the least. At the beginning, the fraud cases brought forward by the Trumpists looked quite plausible to me but in retrospect, I think that I spent too much time reading and hearing about them and too little time paying attention to opposing views. It didn't help that the Democrat, RINO and MSM response was "there's nothing to see here", "it's all a big lie" and massive censorship. But we now know many things that we didn't then, like Trump lawyers (including in some cases Giuliani) making clownish claims that didn't stand close scrutiny and some incontrovertible facts, like the recount done in Arizona by the election doubters themselves showing the expected results: many irregularities but the same results (with actually marginally worse results for Trump in the recount).

    But my questions to A123 that he couldn't answer stand: why is practically no Republican contesting the results of the new election? Why are Republicans unable to prevent the Democrats from committing fraud when they control the electoral mechanisms in most states, including some key ones like Nevada or Georgia? Why would Trumpists want his candidate to run again if they know that the elections are going to be rigged? I could add some more but the debate about electoral fraud has gotten tiresome.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @A123, @LondonBob

  258. @AnonfromTN
    Last night Ukrainian rockets of anti-missile defense systems (some supplied by NATO) hit two multi-apartment residential buildings, one in Kiev, another in Vyshgorod (Kiev region). Six Ukrainians were killed, many wounded. By comparison, recent killing of two Poles by Ukrainian anti-missile rocket was not so bad, after all.

    Replies: @LondonBob

    NATO air defense systems have never been found to work, given the importance of missiles this is a massive flaw.

  259. @silviosilver
    @Mikel

    Do you find it completely implausible that there may have been decisive election shenanigans? If you find it implausible, consider the kind of people who would be engaged in the shenanigans: antifa-supporting leftards, 1000% in favor open borders, who have no qualms about (and list of justifications as long as your arm for) blatant anti-white discrimination, etc. For these people, America as it has thus far existed is nothing but an obstacle to their "progressive" program (ie transforming the country into "Los Esclavos Unidos"), which they are impatient as hell to implement. Do they strike as you the kind of people who would give the flyingest of fucks about staid "white supremacist" notions of election integrity? Personally, I think all this is perfectly plausible, but I'm not yet prepared to say it's definitely happening.

    Replies: @LondonBob, @Mikel

    Plenty of evidence of voter fraud has been found, long dead people in Michigan requesting and returning ballots, counting stopping, implausible one hundred percent to Biden vote dumps, ballot stuffing, election security measures gutted, expansion of mail voting, election results deviating from opinion polling, long established correlations in vote patterns breaking down in some places but not in others, voting machines breaking in Republican areas, people who didn’t vote being told they voted etc.

  260. @A123
    @Matra


    Americanisation of sports is mostly a bad thing

     

    Europization is also pretty bad. Germany had this as a pregame team photo.

     
    https://media.breitbart.com/media/2022/11/AP-Photo_Ebrahim-Naroozi-640x480.jpg
     

    Then they promptly lost 2-1 to Japan. I do not know how they made themselves sick, but some Euro SJW ritual was likely to blame. Were they sucking on Tide pods?
    ___

    Advertising on uniforms is also much more dramatic in Europe.

     
    https://i.eurosport.com/2017/08/06/2140756-44772537-1600-900.jpg
     

    How long has Fly Emirates FC been a team? Oh. Wait. That is supposed to be Arsenal FC. Sorry for the confusion.

    When will Tampax sponsor a team?

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @Matra, @Emil Nikola Richard, @LondonBob

    Strange to put their hands over their mouths, in most countries in the West you can’t criticise the sodomists, unlike in Qatar.

  261. @German_reader
    @AnonfromTN


    Russia is protected from immigrants coming out of warm countries by climate: it gets very cold there.
     
    There are Somalis in Finland.
    Russia has got lots of space, it needs to share it with its African brethren who are Russia's friends in the struggle against Western imperialism. France is too racist, just think of the horrible things they did in Algeria. And Germany, well, only a question of time until it goes Nazi again. No, Russia needs to take in the migrants from Africa, in fact Russia should send ships to the Mediterranean and pick them up (and then maybe settle them in Crimea). It will be proof of Russia's solidarity and magnaminity and win her many friends around the world, and with those assets the victory over the empire can't be far off.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @dogbumbreath

    There are Somalis in Finland.

    Unless the rules have changed in the last few years, Finland has a “free” University Education to ALL (native or foreign) if you can speak Finnish. Naturally, many people from less fortunate places learn Finnish and go to Finland to get a free education.

    As for your rambling on about immigration…..in general, emigration occurs because the home country has no opportunities. China and Russia are working to fix this problem in Africa unlike the West which just loots.

  262. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Mikel


    On the other hand, if you really need some sort of high after exposure to the elements what I would recommend is a CBD bath bomb, available on the internet. It’s becoming increasingly popular among outdoor sports people. Makes you sweat, relax and calm any pains.
     
    Now this is why the comments section is the best part of the internet.

    I have a friend with 3 cats and 2 dogs and their hack for chills is sleeping with the animals on the bed. Yikes. Dogs are great but they eat shit.

    Replies: @Barbarossa, @dogbumbreath

    Dogs are great but they eat shit.

    There is a simple reason dogs eat shit. Shit contains beneficial bacteria for the gut. In ancient times, humans who destroyed their gut bacteria and fell ill because their gut was not absorbing nutrients were given shit from a person with a healthy gut. Today we eat yogurt.

    Processed dog food is not the natural diet dogs should be eating. This can destroy their useful bacteria. Humans don’t do well eating only processed food.

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @dogbumbreath

    I totally agree that healthy dogs ought to eat shit.

    My point is that it is disgusting to snuggle with a dog. If the house is that chilly you need to turn up the thermostat.

    (Obviously if you are an eskimo you get an excuse.)

    , @Unintended Consequence
    @dogbumbreath

    "Processed dog food is not the natural diet dogs should be eating. This can destroy their useful bacteria."

    Hello, fellow friend of dog. Don't forget to remind the dog skeptics that not all dogs eat poop. And they take to frequent baths more readily than cats. Also, no one expects a person to kiss a dog. The dog will forgive a human for this slight because that is the dog's nature.

    Replies: @showmethereal

  263. @AnonfromTN
    @showmethereal


    They speak French and Belgian and English
     
    There is no such thing as Belgian language. Three languages are spoken in Belgium: French, Dutch (Flemish), and German. Most of the population speaks the first two. However, Belgians are smart enough to make all three spoken languages official (unlike some morons we all know).

    Replies: @Beckow, @showmethereal

    I receive your correction. I was eating and drinking and watching multi cultural Belgium beat multi cultural Canada as I typed the comment – LOL. Should have read “the languages of their colonizers such as the French – Belgians – English etc”

  264. They, like Croats, also punch above their weight in more popular sports, like football, basketball, handball and volleyball. But are Serbs and Croats really physically that different to, say, Hungarians or Austrians

    Yes. The most underreported story in sports of the 21st century is extreme Balkan overperformance, particularly once you adjust for per capita. I suspect part of it is height advantage.

    How height helps in basketball, volleyball or handball is all self-explanatory. Football is a more interesting case. The cope used to be that tall players aren’t as technically proficient as short ones but Zlatan demolished that myth.

    Nordic countries are bad at football because we don’t have the climate for it, even Denmark is a bit too cold. But it can’t be the only explanation. Zlatan grew up in Sweden yet still became a world-class player. So there must be something different apart from height that affects these things.

    What’s incomprehensible to me is the bizarre obsession with football in Sweden given this fact. The Norwegians have correctly adapted their sporting bets after their climate constraints. As a result, they dominate the Winter Olympics because they understand which sports they should focus on to maximise results. Sweden has the climate of Scandinavia but the pretensions of Iberia.

    [MORE]

    One could of course have added tennis to your list. One of the world’s best players is Djokovic, who is obviously from the Balkans and tall at 188 cm.

    If we look at the four guys ranking above him, they are all above 183 cm, with the Greek guy being 193 cm(!) . The two Spainards are both significantly taller than the Spanish national average.

    https://www.atptour.com/en/rankings/singles

    The apparent height advantage in many sports is underdiscussed and underexplored. It cannot be the single explanation – things like climate, pro-sports culture etc all matter – but it must be a part of the whole answer. I suspect Balkans outperform because they do well on all three factors in combination.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Thulean Friend


    things like climate, pro-sports culture etc all matter – but it must be a part of the whole answer.
     
    Did something change in Spain this respect? If we date the adoption of mass participation in sports to after WWII, Spain was nowhere to be seen for the longest time. Then all of a sudden they started wining everything.

    Replies: @Thulean Friend, @LondonBob

  265. @silviosilver
    @Matra


    They’re not likely to get much better at soccer.
     
    Why not though? Surely it's partly a function of how popular the sport is. So if today it's starting from a low base (I have no idea if it is), then it's not unreasonable to expect substantial improvement. Even in a worst case scenario of demographic decline in coming decades, say a 50% drop, it's still a sizeable population. (And nowhere else besides Africa is going to grow much, to the extreme detriment of all of us, of course...)

    Regarding race and sport, there's obviously a relationship, but it's difficult to tease out the various causal factors behind various countries' success. Not saying this to brag (maybe a little, hehe), but has any country dominated any sport as thoroughly as Serbia dominates water polo? (Argentina maybe with polo polo?) They, like Croats, also punch above their weight in more popular sports, like soccer, basketball, handball and volleyball. But are Serbs and Croats really physically that different to, say, Hungarians or Austrians or, a bit further afield, Poles, who are notable mostly for their lack of sporting success? Maybe the answer is: they have better things to do with their time, such as build prosperous economies. Then again, Australia has long kicked ass in sport (just not the ones I tend to care about) and this doesn't seem to have been an obstacle to achieving enviable prosperity.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Matra

    The probability of making a good living playing sports is extremely low. Almost as bad as playing the lottery. When a class of people is exceptionally good at a sport it invariably is a signal of desperation.

    Classic example is negroes and basketball.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    When a class of people is exceptionally good at a sport it invariably is a signal of desperation.
     
    Are you suggesting that Serbs go into water polo for the money? Lol.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

  266. @dogbumbreath
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    Dogs are great but they eat shit.
     
    There is a simple reason dogs eat shit. Shit contains beneficial bacteria for the gut. In ancient times, humans who destroyed their gut bacteria and fell ill because their gut was not absorbing nutrients were given shit from a person with a healthy gut. Today we eat yogurt.

    Processed dog food is not the natural diet dogs should be eating. This can destroy their useful bacteria. Humans don't do well eating only processed food.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Unintended Consequence

    I totally agree that healthy dogs ought to eat shit.

    My point is that it is disgusting to snuggle with a dog. If the house is that chilly you need to turn up the thermostat.

    (Obviously if you are an eskimo you get an excuse.)

  267. This Thanksgiving I will be making many Erdogan-themed jokes. I figure politics is safe, once you cross the Bosporus.

    • Replies: @Thulean Friend
    @songbird

    I think Erdogan is going to get crushed in the next elections but I must say I've come to like him as time has gone on. He has shown remarkable resilience and geopolitical independence despite Turkey being in such a precarious position. Much stronger European countries show far less spine.

    Replies: @songbird

  268. @dogbumbreath
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    Dogs are great but they eat shit.
     
    There is a simple reason dogs eat shit. Shit contains beneficial bacteria for the gut. In ancient times, humans who destroyed their gut bacteria and fell ill because their gut was not absorbing nutrients were given shit from a person with a healthy gut. Today we eat yogurt.

    Processed dog food is not the natural diet dogs should be eating. This can destroy their useful bacteria. Humans don't do well eating only processed food.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Unintended Consequence

    “Processed dog food is not the natural diet dogs should be eating. This can destroy their useful bacteria.”

    Hello, fellow friend of dog. Don’t forget to remind the dog skeptics that not all dogs eat poop. And they take to frequent baths more readily than cats. Also, no one expects a person to kiss a dog. The dog will forgive a human for this slight because that is the dog’s nature.

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @Unintended Consequence

    All dogs if allowed to revert to normal behavior - will eat it. If you don’t feed them and they turn feral they will kill and eat animals. They won’t just catch the squirrel or the rabbit or the duck. They will eat them… in their entirety. They will eat the intestines and all. And if they can’t catch - they will scavenge a dead carcass. They are domesticated from wild canine. Human selection hasn’t bred out all of their natural instincts. And actually “kissing” is natural for them. Wolves and African wild dogs lick each other in the mouth as a form of communication

  269. @LondonBob
    @silviosilver

    Argentina have been rubbish for years now, wasn't aware Di Maria was still playing.

    Replies: @showmethereal

    Huh? Argentina just won the Copa America and made the WC final as recently as 2014…. Had Higuan been remotely clinical they would have beaten Germany soundly

    • Replies: @LondonBob
    @showmethereal

    Copa America is basically Brazil and Argentina, sure lousy teams can get a lucky run to the final, like Argentina did in 2014, like Germany did in Japan. They have had a very lopsided team for a while now, very good strikers who all play very similar, and then not much else, maybe a decent midfielder or two.

  270. @AnonfromTN
    @A123


    Russia is treating the residents Kiev and other cities in the same way Ukrainian regimes treated the farmers in Crimea.
     
    BTW, it is the 7th anniversary of the beginning of Ukrainian energy blockade of Crimea. During the short period of November 20-23, 2015, Ukie terrorists blew up power lines going to Crimea. That resulted in virtually total blackout. Quite a few teams doing emergency surgery in Crimean hospitals were suddenly plunged into darkness. Thanks to Russian efforts, now Crimea has a lot of its own electricity generating capability (more than it can consume), plus two high-voltage underwater cables from Krasnodar region as a backup. Hearing pathetic squeals of Ukraine residents about the loss of power, Crimeans gleefully chuckle. As the saying goes, he who laughs last, laughs best.

    If Ukraine can obtain sane leaders capable of negotiation, the bloodshed can end.
     
    For that Ukraine should get real leaders, not someone else’s puppets. Every nation has the government it deserves. Any reason to believe that Ukraine residents will deserve much better than they have any time soon?

    Replies: @showmethereal

    It is impressive what they were able to do in Crimea. Also impressive that even through 8 years of shelling I’ve watched videos of lots of normal life in cities and town of the Donbass. Also impressive is how quickly Mariupol is being rebuilt. I admit – Russia has more civil industry resources than I thought previously.

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @showmethereal


    ...how quickly Mariupol is being rebuilt
     
    The active rebuilding says it all: Russia plans to win and stay. They wouldn't do it if they were tentative. US never invested in rebuilding Iraq - they knew the score, they knew it was not winnable. Or later in Libya and Syrian regions it controlled...

    A nuclear super-power has signaled in every possible way that it is in the war to win. Nato decided to make it as painful and bloody as possible hoping for an internal collapse in Russia. You don't have to be a genius to figure out how this will play out: after lots of blood Russia will get what it wants. Kiev will become a defeated backwater with most of the population gone or about to leave.

    West will forever claim that they prevented Russia from reaching their maximum goals: if Russia takes Odessa, they will say 'but look, they don't have Kiev or Lviv'. If Russia takes Galicia, they will say "but we kept them from getting Poland!"...etc...who is the winner? The country that won on the ground or people who can't think straight and live in silly self-delusions and by lying?

    Replies: @showmethereal

    , @AnonfromTN
    @showmethereal


    It is impressive what they were able to do in Crimea.
     

    Russia has more civil industry resources than I thought previously.
     
    Yes, but there is downside: Russia spent a lot of resources in Crimea, and now is and will be spending even more rebuilding Donbass. I saw a lot of construction going on in and near Lugansk with my own eyes in October. Crimea left the madhouse and joined Russia w/o a single shot fired. While the industry there, like in the rest of Ukraine, was obsolete (mostly Soviet-built before 1991 and exploited into the ground by greedy oligarchs) and needed massive investment to bring it to the current Russian level, at least residential housing remained serviceable. A lot of housing in Donbass, not only in Mariupol, was heavily damaged, and needs to be rebuilt. Plus, there are almost twice as many residents in Donbass as in Crimea.

    Watching Putin’s actions (while having no inside info), I suspect that one of the problems he and his team are trying to solve is how to reformat Ukraine w/o taking on 25 million freeloaders. After all, huge numbers of parasites broke the economic back of the USSR. He does not want this to happen to the RF. I cannot think of a viable solution, but I hope they can.

    Replies: @showmethereal

  271. @Beckow
    @showmethereal

    Europeans who left for three centuries were settlers. Or most of them were. Settlers are people who move to start farms, mines, trading settlements, and to plunder the natives.

    That is very different from the current Third World migrants: they come to short-cut to better life, they are not starting farms, bringing herds of cows, digging for metals. They plunder but differently: goodies from the clueless over-bred locals and petty theft. No amount of prosperity at home can change that. They are doing it out of laziness, and are the exact opposite of the Euro settlers in the past.

    Replies: @showmethereal

    They became “settlers” (a pretty word for invaders) because they thought they could find a better life outside of Europe. Same thing. Strange though you call it laziness. I don’t see whites doing any of the menial jobs. And i recall from first hand accounts and reading literature – the same descriptions you use of these third world ppl are the same things Irish and Italians were greeted with when they arrived on the shores of the USA. They were called thieves and lazy and dumb and with evil catholic beliefs. But now they are all part of white solidarity. Strange how that works. As to what’s happening in Europe- all that mass migration is a result of former colonialism as well as active destabilizing actions taken by NATO in the last 30 years. In fact Ghaddaffi warned Europe. NATO chose to aid his murderers anyway.

  272. @showmethereal
    @AnonfromTN

    It is impressive what they were able to do in Crimea. Also impressive that even through 8 years of shelling I’ve watched videos of lots of normal life in cities and town of the Donbass. Also impressive is how quickly Mariupol is being rebuilt. I admit - Russia has more civil industry resources than I thought previously.

    Replies: @Beckow, @AnonfromTN

    …how quickly Mariupol is being rebuilt

    The active rebuilding says it all: Russia plans to win and stay. They wouldn’t do it if they were tentative. US never invested in rebuilding Iraq – they knew the score, they knew it was not winnable. Or later in Libya and Syrian regions it controlled…

    A nuclear super-power has signaled in every possible way that it is in the war to win. Nato decided to make it as painful and bloody as possible hoping for an internal collapse in Russia. You don’t have to be a genius to figure out how this will play out: after lots of blood Russia will get what it wants. Kiev will become a defeated backwater with most of the population gone or about to leave.

    West will forever claim that they prevented Russia from reaching their maximum goals: if Russia takes Odessa, they will say ‘but look, they don’t have Kiev or Lviv’. If Russia takes Galicia, they will say “but we kept them from getting Poland!“…etc…who is the winner? The country that won on the ground or people who can’t think straight and live in silly self-delusions and by lying?

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @Beckow

    Correct. Though Iraq and Libya and Syria couldn’t be rebuilt by Americans because they weren’t wanted. Contrary to what the western media was saying - the vast majority of Mariupol people WANT Russia. I can remember seeing video way back in 2014 where the people were marching with Russian flags (some even with Soviet ones) and how Ukraine sent armored cars in there.

  273. @showmethereal
    @AnonfromTN

    It is impressive what they were able to do in Crimea. Also impressive that even through 8 years of shelling I’ve watched videos of lots of normal life in cities and town of the Donbass. Also impressive is how quickly Mariupol is being rebuilt. I admit - Russia has more civil industry resources than I thought previously.

    Replies: @Beckow, @AnonfromTN

    It is impressive what they were able to do in Crimea.

    Russia has more civil industry resources than I thought previously.

    Yes, but there is downside: Russia spent a lot of resources in Crimea, and now is and will be spending even more rebuilding Donbass. I saw a lot of construction going on in and near Lugansk with my own eyes in October. Crimea left the madhouse and joined Russia w/o a single shot fired. While the industry there, like in the rest of Ukraine, was obsolete (mostly Soviet-built before 1991 and exploited into the ground by greedy oligarchs) and needed massive investment to bring it to the current Russian level, at least residential housing remained serviceable. A lot of housing in Donbass, not only in Mariupol, was heavily damaged, and needs to be rebuilt. Plus, there are almost twice as many residents in Donbass as in Crimea.

    Watching Putin’s actions (while having no inside info), I suspect that one of the problems he and his team are trying to solve is how to reformat Ukraine w/o taking on 25 million freeloaders. After all, huge numbers of parasites broke the economic back of the USSR. He does not want this to happen to the RF. I cannot think of a viable solution, but I hope they can.

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @AnonfromTN

    That was actually going to be my question… who is financing the reconstruction? Is it local or from “Moscow”? I was also under the impression that the Sea of Azov was very important from an industrial point of view.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  274. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @silviosilver

    The probability of making a good living playing sports is extremely low. Almost as bad as playing the lottery. When a class of people is exceptionally good at a sport it invariably is a signal of desperation.

    Classic example is negroes and basketball.

    Replies: @silviosilver

    When a class of people is exceptionally good at a sport it invariably is a signal of desperation.

    Are you suggesting that Serbs go into water polo for the money? Lol.

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @silviosilver

    I did not write that. I did not imply that.

    You are an amateur.

    This is what you probably would like to study. Do you know what study entails?

    https://www.wendelberger.com/downloads/Schopenhauer_EN.pdf

  275. @Thulean Friend

    They, like Croats, also punch above their weight in more popular sports, like football, basketball, handball and volleyball. But are Serbs and Croats really physically that different to, say, Hungarians or Austrians
     
    Yes. The most underreported story in sports of the 21st century is extreme Balkan overperformance, particularly once you adjust for per capita. I suspect part of it is height advantage.

    https://i.imgur.com/5XIMkjM.jpg

    How height helps in basketball, volleyball or handball is all self-explanatory. Football is a more interesting case. The cope used to be that tall players aren't as technically proficient as short ones but Zlatan demolished that myth.

    Nordic countries are bad at football because we don't have the climate for it, even Denmark is a bit too cold. But it can't be the only explanation. Zlatan grew up in Sweden yet still became a world-class player. So there must be something different apart from height that affects these things.

    What's incomprehensible to me is the bizarre obsession with football in Sweden given this fact. The Norwegians have correctly adapted their sporting bets after their climate constraints. As a result, they dominate the Winter Olympics because they understand which sports they should focus on to maximise results. Sweden has the climate of Scandinavia but the pretensions of Iberia.


    One could of course have added tennis to your list. One of the world's best players is Djokovic, who is obviously from the Balkans and tall at 188 cm.

    If we look at the four guys ranking above him, they are all above 183 cm, with the Greek guy being 193 cm(!) . The two Spainards are both significantly taller than the Spanish national average.

    https://www.atptour.com/en/rankings/singles

    The apparent height advantage in many sports is underdiscussed and underexplored. It cannot be the single explanation - things like climate, pro-sports culture etc all matter - but it must be a part of the whole answer. I suspect Balkans outperform because they do well on all three factors in combination.

    Replies: @silviosilver

    things like climate, pro-sports culture etc all matter – but it must be a part of the whole answer.

    Did something change in Spain this respect? If we date the adoption of mass participation in sports to after WWII, Spain was nowhere to be seen for the longest time. Then all of a sudden they started wining everything.

    • Replies: @Thulean Friend
    @silviosilver

    Spain has only won a single WC. They've fallen off the radar a bit in recent years, maybe they got lucky by having insanely good players in the late 2000s. That said, in tennis they've been doing well.

    The same question can be turned towards the Balkans. Has the region always been this good at sports? I mean Partisan Red Belgrade was already pretty damn impressive by the late 1970s. In 1991, they won against Marseilles (which was a fantastic team back then).

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1991_European_Cup_Final

    One wonders how things might have panned out if the disaster of the 1990s didn't unfold. Maybe the Balkan superstar period was always fated to begin and it just skipped a decade due to the wars.

    Replies: @Matra, @silviosilver

    , @LondonBob
    @silviosilver

    The doping scandal coincides with the period of Spanish sporting prowess.

  276. @silviosilver
    @Mikel

    Do you find it completely implausible that there may have been decisive election shenanigans? If you find it implausible, consider the kind of people who would be engaged in the shenanigans: antifa-supporting leftards, 1000% in favor open borders, who have no qualms about (and list of justifications as long as your arm for) blatant anti-white discrimination, etc. For these people, America as it has thus far existed is nothing but an obstacle to their "progressive" program (ie transforming the country into "Los Esclavos Unidos"), which they are impatient as hell to implement. Do they strike as you the kind of people who would give the flyingest of fucks about staid "white supremacist" notions of election integrity? Personally, I think all this is perfectly plausible, but I'm not yet prepared to say it's definitely happening.

    Replies: @LondonBob, @Mikel

    Do you find it completely implausible that there may have been decisive election shenanigans?

    The key words there are completely and decisive.

    I know for a fact that there must be some fraud because I see with my eyes every election that things like voter authentication are a joke. But regarding the 2020 elections, the likelihood of fraud of various kinds having a decisive impact in the results is very unlikely, to say the least. At the beginning, the fraud cases brought forward by the Trumpists looked quite plausible to me but in retrospect, I think that I spent too much time reading and hearing about them and too little time paying attention to opposing views. It didn’t help that the Democrat, RINO and MSM response was “there’s nothing to see here”, “it’s all a big lie” and massive censorship. But we now know many things that we didn’t then, like Trump lawyers (including in some cases Giuliani) making clownish claims that didn’t stand close scrutiny and some incontrovertible facts, like the recount done in Arizona by the election doubters themselves showing the expected results: many irregularities but the same results (with actually marginally worse results for Trump in the recount).

    But my questions to A123 that he couldn’t answer stand: why is practically no Republican contesting the results of the new election? Why are Republicans unable to prevent the Democrats from committing fraud when they control the electoral mechanisms in most states, including some key ones like Nevada or Georgia? Why would Trumpists want his candidate to run again if they know that the elections are going to be rigged? I could add some more but the debate about electoral fraud has gotten tiresome.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Mikel


    why is practically no Republican contesting the results of the new election?
     
    The answer to this and your following questions is: because this “two-party electoral democracy” is a ruse for the gullible. Both parties are controlled by essentially the same cabal (usually referred to as “the elite”). This cabal wants sheeple to believe that they live in a democracy and that their vote matters. Sheeple are more likely to remain docile that way.

    Replies: @Mikel, @A123

    , @A123
    @Mikel

    I already answered these questions, but will briefly reply before I head out for the day.

    Point #1 -- There is a huge difference between MAGA and Republican. Case in point, Mitch McConnell.

    Point #2 -- There is no such thing as a Trumpist. I presume you intended MAGA, but became very confused.

    Let me rephrase your questions to match reality and respond. The square brackets indicate [corrected terms].


    Why is [MAGA] unable to prevent the Democrats from committing fraud when they control the electoral mechanisms in most states, including some key ones like Nevada or Georgia?
     
    Kemp in Georgia is not MAGA. Thus MAGA has no control in Georgia. This was made painfully obvious to everyone in 2020 and the same anti-MAGA team is still in charge.

    I lack deep insight on Nevada one way or the other. It seems like a mixed bag.


    why is practically no [MAGA Candidate] contesting the results of the new election?
     
    The judiciary is largely uninterested or incapable of handling such matters in a timely manner. The fraudulent "loser" has huge opportunities to run out the clock, thus obtaining the office illegitimately. This was also made painfully obvious to everyone in 2020.

    Mounting legal challenges is very expensive. Anti-MAGA types like Ronna McDaniel control the RNC purse. There may be challenges that could work but do not have sufficient resources. I suspect that Nevada is in this situation.

    MAGA needs to build up giant piles of money so they can fight every fraud, everywhere. However, that does not exist yet. At this point, funding must be selectively deployed.


    Why would [MAGA Candidates] want to run again if they know that the elections are going to be rigged?
     
    It varies by candidate:

        -A- Doing the right thing is its own reward.
        -B- Winning beyond the margin that can be stolen is possible.
        -C- Willingness to adopt the tactics of the opposition.

    Consider some of Saul Alinsky's concepts:

        RULE 4: “Make the enemy live up to its own book of rules.”
        RULE 6: “A good tactic is one your people enjoy.”
        RULE 8: “Keep the pressure on. Never let up.”

    Option -C- is the potential gold mine. Those supporting MAGA candidates need to use the other side's rules. Balloting, Counting Until You Win, and Fultoning to ensure the candidate who actually won gets the office.

    The SJW ability to complain is greatly limited by their prior, shrill "every ballot must be counted" rhetoric (RULE 4). And, serving up justice for past misdeeds is a powerful motivator (RULE 6).
    _____

    Where you personally fail is RULE 8. Despite the overwhelming and irrefutable evidence that elections outcomes are being criminally manipulated, you refuse to keep the pressure up.

    You insist on going flaccid, exhibiting sheeple like acceptance of the Fake Stream Media narrative. Your submission provides bounty unto Not-The-President Biden.

     
    https://www.americanthinker.com/images/bucket/2022-11/242176_5_.jpg
     

    I do not know which is worse:
        • Do you lack the insight to see your capitulation serves Elite rule?
        • Or, are you willingly complicit with SJW Globalist subversion?

     

    ==================================
    🦃🍗🥧 HAPPY THANKSGIVING 🦃🍗🥧
    ==================================

    There will be an attempt at deep fried turkey in a few hours. I am bringing two extra fire extinguishers. Last weekend I won on planning. We cleared an old, overgrown concrete pad (former shed base?) down slope and away from their house.

    I hope those cooking are doing it right.

     
    https://i0.wp.com/www.powerlineblog.com/ed-assets/2022/11/Cook-a-turkey.png
     

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    , @LondonBob
    @Mikel

    Trump was winning comfortably before the voting stopped and voter dumps started, even the NYT election predictor forecast him winning by a comfortable margin, ballot harvesting and mail in fraud aren't obvious, unless you analyse forensically, however dumping a bunch of votes all to one candidate is hardly sophisticated, about as blatant as it gets.

    Replies: @sudden death

  277. @silviosilver
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    When a class of people is exceptionally good at a sport it invariably is a signal of desperation.
     
    Are you suggesting that Serbs go into water polo for the money? Lol.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    I did not write that. I did not imply that.

    You are an amateur.

    This is what you probably would like to study. Do you know what study entails?

    https://www.wendelberger.com/downloads/Schopenhauer_EN.pdf

  278. @Mikel
    @silviosilver


    Do you find it completely implausible that there may have been decisive election shenanigans?
     
    The key words there are completely and decisive.

    I know for a fact that there must be some fraud because I see with my eyes every election that things like voter authentication are a joke. But regarding the 2020 elections, the likelihood of fraud of various kinds having a decisive impact in the results is very unlikely, to say the least. At the beginning, the fraud cases brought forward by the Trumpists looked quite plausible to me but in retrospect, I think that I spent too much time reading and hearing about them and too little time paying attention to opposing views. It didn't help that the Democrat, RINO and MSM response was "there's nothing to see here", "it's all a big lie" and massive censorship. But we now know many things that we didn't then, like Trump lawyers (including in some cases Giuliani) making clownish claims that didn't stand close scrutiny and some incontrovertible facts, like the recount done in Arizona by the election doubters themselves showing the expected results: many irregularities but the same results (with actually marginally worse results for Trump in the recount).

    But my questions to A123 that he couldn't answer stand: why is practically no Republican contesting the results of the new election? Why are Republicans unable to prevent the Democrats from committing fraud when they control the electoral mechanisms in most states, including some key ones like Nevada or Georgia? Why would Trumpists want his candidate to run again if they know that the elections are going to be rigged? I could add some more but the debate about electoral fraud has gotten tiresome.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @A123, @LondonBob

    why is practically no Republican contesting the results of the new election?

    The answer to this and your following questions is: because this “two-party electoral democracy” is a ruse for the gullible. Both parties are controlled by essentially the same cabal (usually referred to as “the elite”). This cabal wants sheeple to believe that they live in a democracy and that their vote matters. Sheeple are more likely to remain docile that way.

    • Agree: Matra
    • Replies: @Mikel
    @AnonfromTN

    There is some truth in what you say but, as usual, you take things to the extreme. Living in Oregon or California is not the same as living in Texas or Wyoming. Electoral choices do still have practical consequences. Let's see how A123 reacts to your calling him sheeple for believing that voting for Trump is going to make any difference.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    , @A123
    @AnonfromTN


    The answer to this and your following questions is: because this “two-party electoral democracy” is a ruse for the gullible. Both parties are controlled by essentially the same cabal (usually referred to as “the elite”).
     
    You provide a solid description of 2014 and earlier. The Uniparty prevented Christian Workers from having a voice by running two parties, neither of which had traditional American values.

    That *began* changing in 2016 with the appearance of MAGA. In some races, there are now real differences. In others, establishment swamp rats are still nominated. Change is not instant. It took 40+ years to dig this hole. Filling it in will take multiple MAGA administrations. Trump's 2nd Term will be only a few step in the journey.

    If surrender monkeys like Mikel concede everything with out fighting, the Uniparty will return. This is a once in a century chance to save the country.


    This cabal wants sheeple to believe that they live in a democracy and that their vote matters. Sheeple are more likely to remain docile that way.
     
    I used the term Sheeple to describe Mikel's insistence on capitulation before I saw this post. We will have to see how he responds to this accurate characterization of his stance. Those like Mikel are indeed exactly what the cabal wants.

    ==================================
    🦃🍗🥧 HAPPY THANKSGIVING 🦃🍗🥧
    ==================================

  279. @silviosilver
    @Matra


    They’re not likely to get much better at soccer.
     
    Why not though? Surely it's partly a function of how popular the sport is. So if today it's starting from a low base (I have no idea if it is), then it's not unreasonable to expect substantial improvement. Even in a worst case scenario of demographic decline in coming decades, say a 50% drop, it's still a sizeable population. (And nowhere else besides Africa is going to grow much, to the extreme detriment of all of us, of course...)

    Regarding race and sport, there's obviously a relationship, but it's difficult to tease out the various causal factors behind various countries' success. Not saying this to brag (maybe a little, hehe), but has any country dominated any sport as thoroughly as Serbia dominates water polo? (Argentina maybe with polo polo?) They, like Croats, also punch above their weight in more popular sports, like soccer, basketball, handball and volleyball. But are Serbs and Croats really physically that different to, say, Hungarians or Austrians or, a bit further afield, Poles, who are notable mostly for their lack of sporting success? Maybe the answer is: they have better things to do with their time, such as build prosperous economies. Then again, Australia has long kicked ass in sport (just not the ones I tend to care about) and this doesn't seem to have been an obstacle to achieving enviable prosperity.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Matra

    I haven’t thought this through but one reason the Chinese may never get good at soccer is that it is not structured enough for them. Too much of what goes on on the pitch requires independent thought and initiative. S Korea playing today reminds me that they made to the semi-finals in 2002 – with the help of some dodgy home field advantage refereeing – but have done little since then. Anyway, East Asians are probably right not to attach so much national prestige and importance on sports.

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Matra

    Ping pong

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_World_Table_Tennis_Championships_medalists#Men's_singles

    , @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @Matra


    I haven’t thought this through but one reason the Chinese may never get good at soccer is that it is not structured enough for them. Too much of what goes on on the pitch requires independent thought and initiative.

     

    Agree with this actually. Another factor is the Japanese team mostly play in the top European leagues,

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japan_national_football_team#Current_squad

    For Koreans its about half. The Chinese play entirely in the Chinese Super League, which is actually the sixth highest paid league

    https://www.olbg.com/insights/global-football-league

    They get pampered and don't go out to challenge themselves.
  280. @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @AnonfromTN

    But American football vs. soccer illustrates my point, the former is very planned set-piece that requires knowledge of a much more complex playbook. There's much less flair and spontaneity.

    The quarterback is the most complex and difficult position in all of sports, and it's dominated by northern Euros.

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/nfl-draft-physiognomy-clemson-ice-age-caveman-1-vs-byu-anglo-nice-guy-2/

    So it happens Slavs are overrepresented in QB, coaches as well as positions that require size, speed and physicality: tight end and defensive end

    https://kafkadesk.org/2021/01/23/nfl-the-slavic-connection-in-american-football/

    Replies: @showmethereal, @LatW

    American football quarterbacks require the most intelligence in American football – not in all sports. That is nonsense. A central midfielder in real football requires more intelligence than someone who memorizes pre-set plays and can get told every 30 seconds what next to do from the sidelines. A central midfielder is required to play defense and offense and constantly “read the game” in order to make decisions. It’s like the difference between human trained domestic dogs and wild canines. Even the smartest domestic dogs get outwitted by their wild canine counterparts unless they get human help.

  281. @AnonfromTN
    @Mikel


    why is practically no Republican contesting the results of the new election?
     
    The answer to this and your following questions is: because this “two-party electoral democracy” is a ruse for the gullible. Both parties are controlled by essentially the same cabal (usually referred to as “the elite”). This cabal wants sheeple to believe that they live in a democracy and that their vote matters. Sheeple are more likely to remain docile that way.

    Replies: @Mikel, @A123

    There is some truth in what you say but, as usual, you take things to the extreme. Living in Oregon or California is not the same as living in Texas or Wyoming. Electoral choices do still have practical consequences. Let’s see how A123 reacts to your calling him sheeple for believing that voting for Trump is going to make any difference.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Mikel


    Electoral choices do still have practical consequences.
     
    Local electoral choices, yes. Likely because the cabal does not want to get swamped by the nitty-gritty of local issues. As to national elections…

    Have you noticed that the key things in the foreign policy remain essentially the same regardless which “party” is technically in power? These invariably include military bases all over the world, coups in various countries, naked aggression against the countries where a coup cannot be arranged, and various sanctions against anyone who does not toe the imperial line.

    That MIC funding keeps growing under either “party”? It has already reached obscene proportions, it exceeds the military spending of the rest of the world put together. Yet the increases of the amounts of money thrown into insatiable maw of greedy US MIC show no signs of abating, and it does not matter one bit which “party” is technically in power.

    These and many other things show that real power is wielded by the forces behind the scenes, not by elected figureheads, who are becoming more and more pathetic (severe Alzheimer’s is a new low).

    Replies: @Mikel, @Barbarossa

  282. @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @showmethereal

    You obviously don't know jack squat about sports so should STFU:

    - China can produce another Yao or Lin, but China cannot to produce a Steve Nash or Manu Ginobili, a moderately athletic guy who's not even that tall but has high basketball IQ

    - Japan almost made it in 2018 to the quarterfinals and just barely lost to Belgium. Today wasn't a major surprise

    - Japan is already top 10 in another major team sport, rugby

    - The Japanese team had a major size disadvantage vs. Germany, but made up for it in speed and tenacity

    - The Chinese team has no size disadvantage, yet they still suck because they a bunch of overpaid egotistical pansies

    https://i.postimg.cc/Gh9ZqcTD/China-PR-national-football-team-training-in-Tehran-01.jpg

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @AnonfromTN, @Matra, @showmethereal

    I notice it is usually the people with the least actual knowledge who are quickest to resort to insults. Are Steve Nash and Manu Ginobli East Asian??? Stick to the topic. The original question was the difference between Chinese and Koreans and Japanese in international football. Simple answer is China was isolated and started much later. But just like the Olympics once China gets experience it will surpass both Koreans and Japanese.
    Basketball indeed is the perfect example. How many ethnic Koreans and Japanese made it in the NBA?? They make it in baseball because as US vassals they have long experience at baseball. East Asians do not have the physical attributes to dominate in basketball. That is a simple reality. BUT China has indeed produced a hall of famer in Yao Ming. To compare Steve Nash and Manu Ginobili has zero context. However Canada and Argentina have played basketball much longer than China on a grass roots. So there is no way you can say a Jeremy Lin can’t become on their level. In fact when Jeremy Lin did go play in China he didn’t dominate the way Stephon Marbury did – which means other Chinese (born) could indeed play in the NBA. But I still don’t expect China to become as good as the US or Spain simply because of gene pool. The women on the hand may one day beat the US women as they have come close more than once. But as I see others noted – you aren’t actually thinking with rational sense but have a grudge against Chinese.

    And no Japan is not a team anyone fears to play. Neither is the US and the US made the knockout rounds before. Use real sense.

    I see others addressed rugby so no need to waste my time.

    The only thing you did say correct is that Chinese footballers are indeed overpaid. Korean and Japanese league players make less money which makes them more hungry to strive overseas and get better. Indeed the Chinese Super League salaries are over inflated.

    • Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @showmethereal

    Baseball was introduced in Japan in 1872. During WWII the Japanese war cry was "to hell with Babe Ruth"

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baseball_in_Japan#History

    Russian contempt for the Chinese is real:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_deportations_of_Chinese_people

    Does the CCP ever bring this up? No, because PRC was originally a Soviet vassal.

    And because it was the Chinese whom acted like unruly goons


    The Chinese entertained joint management until mid-1929. The change from Soviet control to Chinese control started when the Chinese authorities made a radical move to try to remove Soviet management. Chinese authorities stormed the Soviet Consulate in Harbin. They arrested the General Manager of the CER, his assistant and other Soviet citizens and removed them from power in the CER.
     
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sino-Soviet_conflict_(1929)

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @showmethereal

    , @Emil Nikola Richard
    @showmethereal


    So there is no way you can say a Jeremy Lin can’t become on their level. In fact when Jeremy Lin did go play in China he didn’t dominate the way Stephon Marbury did – which means other Chinese (born) could indeed play in the NBA.
     
    Lin was a freak whose case does not allow for such a generalization. He was a stranger to the NBA because he played at a non-basketball U. He burned through the league for 3 weeks to a month because he had some great skills. He also had a fatal flaw in his game which they quickly learned to exploit after which he was never more than Just Another Guy.

    Replies: @showmethereal

  283. @Mikel
    @silviosilver


    Do you find it completely implausible that there may have been decisive election shenanigans?
     
    The key words there are completely and decisive.

    I know for a fact that there must be some fraud because I see with my eyes every election that things like voter authentication are a joke. But regarding the 2020 elections, the likelihood of fraud of various kinds having a decisive impact in the results is very unlikely, to say the least. At the beginning, the fraud cases brought forward by the Trumpists looked quite plausible to me but in retrospect, I think that I spent too much time reading and hearing about them and too little time paying attention to opposing views. It didn't help that the Democrat, RINO and MSM response was "there's nothing to see here", "it's all a big lie" and massive censorship. But we now know many things that we didn't then, like Trump lawyers (including in some cases Giuliani) making clownish claims that didn't stand close scrutiny and some incontrovertible facts, like the recount done in Arizona by the election doubters themselves showing the expected results: many irregularities but the same results (with actually marginally worse results for Trump in the recount).

    But my questions to A123 that he couldn't answer stand: why is practically no Republican contesting the results of the new election? Why are Republicans unable to prevent the Democrats from committing fraud when they control the electoral mechanisms in most states, including some key ones like Nevada or Georgia? Why would Trumpists want his candidate to run again if they know that the elections are going to be rigged? I could add some more but the debate about electoral fraud has gotten tiresome.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @A123, @LondonBob

    I already answered these questions, but will briefly reply before I head out for the day.

    Point #1 — There is a huge difference between MAGA and Republican. Case in point, Mitch McConnell.

    Point #2 — There is no such thing as a Trumpist. I presume you intended MAGA, but became very confused.

    Let me rephrase your questions to match reality and respond. The square brackets indicate [corrected terms].

    Why is [MAGA] unable to prevent the Democrats from committing fraud when they control the electoral mechanisms in most states, including some key ones like Nevada or Georgia?

    Kemp in Georgia is not MAGA. Thus MAGA has no control in Georgia. This was made painfully obvious to everyone in 2020 and the same anti-MAGA team is still in charge.

    I lack deep insight on Nevada one way or the other. It seems like a mixed bag.

    why is practically no [MAGA Candidate] contesting the results of the new election?

    The judiciary is largely uninterested or incapable of handling such matters in a timely manner. The fraudulent “loser” has huge opportunities to run out the clock, thus obtaining the office illegitimately. This was also made painfully obvious to everyone in 2020.

    Mounting legal challenges is very expensive. Anti-MAGA types like Ronna McDaniel control the RNC purse. There may be challenges that could work but do not have sufficient resources. I suspect that Nevada is in this situation.

    MAGA needs to build up giant piles of money so they can fight every fraud, everywhere. However, that does not exist yet. At this point, funding must be selectively deployed.

    Why would [MAGA Candidates] want to run again if they know that the elections are going to be rigged?

    It varies by candidate:

        -A- Doing the right thing is its own reward.
        -B- Winning beyond the margin that can be stolen is possible.
        -C- Willingness to adopt the tactics of the opposition.

    Consider some of Saul Alinsky’s concepts:

        RULE 4: “Make the enemy live up to its own book of rules.”
        RULE 6: “A good tactic is one your people enjoy.”
        RULE 8: “Keep the pressure on. Never let up.”

    Option -C- is the potential gold mine. Those supporting MAGA candidates need to use the other side’s rules. Balloting, Counting Until You Win, and Fultoning to ensure the candidate who actually won gets the office.

    The SJW ability to complain is greatly limited by their prior, shrill “every ballot must be counted” rhetoric (RULE 4). And, serving up justice for past misdeeds is a powerful motivator (RULE 6).
    _____

    Where you personally fail is RULE 8. Despite the overwhelming and irrefutable evidence that elections outcomes are being criminally manipulated, you refuse to keep the pressure up.

    You insist on going flaccid, exhibiting sheeple like acceptance of the Fake Stream Media narrative. Your submission provides bounty unto Not-The-President Biden.

      

    I do not know which is worse:
        • Do you lack the insight to see your capitulation serves Elite rule?
        • Or, are you willingly complicit with SJW Globalist subversion?

    ==================================
    🦃🍗🥧 HAPPY THANKSGIVING 🦃🍗🥧
    ==================================

    There will be an attempt at deep fried turkey in a few hours. I am bringing two extra fire extinguishers. Last weekend I won on planning. We cleared an old, overgrown concrete pad (former shed base?) down slope and away from their house.

    I hope those cooking are doing it right.

      

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @A123

    The thing to do with Thanksgiving dinners is make sure you eat some good food before you go. If you are hungry when you get there you will be miserable.

    Replies: @Barbarossa

  284. @Matra
    @silviosilver

    I haven't thought this through but one reason the Chinese may never get good at soccer is that it is not structured enough for them. Too much of what goes on on the pitch requires independent thought and initiative. S Korea playing today reminds me that they made to the semi-finals in 2002 - with the help of some dodgy home field advantage refereeing - but have done little since then. Anyway, East Asians are probably right not to attach so much national prestige and importance on sports.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

  285. @AnonfromTN
    @Mikel


    why is practically no Republican contesting the results of the new election?
     
    The answer to this and your following questions is: because this “two-party electoral democracy” is a ruse for the gullible. Both parties are controlled by essentially the same cabal (usually referred to as “the elite”). This cabal wants sheeple to believe that they live in a democracy and that their vote matters. Sheeple are more likely to remain docile that way.

    Replies: @Mikel, @A123

    The answer to this and your following questions is: because this “two-party electoral democracy” is a ruse for the gullible. Both parties are controlled by essentially the same cabal (usually referred to as “the elite”).

    You provide a solid description of 2014 and earlier. The Uniparty prevented Christian Workers from having a voice by running two parties, neither of which had traditional American values.

    That *began* changing in 2016 with the appearance of MAGA. In some races, there are now real differences. In others, establishment swamp rats are still nominated. Change is not instant. It took 40+ years to dig this hole. Filling it in will take multiple MAGA administrations. Trump’s 2nd Term will be only a few step in the journey.

    If surrender monkeys like Mikel concede everything with out fighting, the Uniparty will return. This is a once in a century chance to save the country.

    This cabal wants sheeple to believe that they live in a democracy and that their vote matters. Sheeple are more likely to remain docile that way.

    I used the term Sheeple to describe Mikel’s insistence on capitulation before I saw this post. We will have to see how he responds to this accurate characterization of his stance. Those like Mikel are indeed exactly what the cabal wants.

    ==================================
    🦃🍗🥧 HAPPY THANKSGIVING 🦃🍗🥧
    ==================================

  286. @Unintended Consequence
    @dogbumbreath

    "Processed dog food is not the natural diet dogs should be eating. This can destroy their useful bacteria."

    Hello, fellow friend of dog. Don't forget to remind the dog skeptics that not all dogs eat poop. And they take to frequent baths more readily than cats. Also, no one expects a person to kiss a dog. The dog will forgive a human for this slight because that is the dog's nature.

    Replies: @showmethereal

    All dogs if allowed to revert to normal behavior – will eat it. If you don’t feed them and they turn feral they will kill and eat animals. They won’t just catch the squirrel or the rabbit or the duck. They will eat them… in their entirety. They will eat the intestines and all. And if they can’t catch – they will scavenge a dead carcass. They are domesticated from wild canine. Human selection hasn’t bred out all of their natural instincts. And actually “kissing” is natural for them. Wolves and African wild dogs lick each other in the mouth as a form of communication

  287. @silviosilver
    @Thulean Friend


    things like climate, pro-sports culture etc all matter – but it must be a part of the whole answer.
     
    Did something change in Spain this respect? If we date the adoption of mass participation in sports to after WWII, Spain was nowhere to be seen for the longest time. Then all of a sudden they started wining everything.

    Replies: @Thulean Friend, @LondonBob

    Spain has only won a single WC. They’ve fallen off the radar a bit in recent years, maybe they got lucky by having insanely good players in the late 2000s. That said, in tennis they’ve been doing well.

    The same question can be turned towards the Balkans. Has the region always been this good at sports? I mean Partisan Red Belgrade was already pretty damn impressive by the late 1970s. In 1991, they won against Marseilles (which was a fantastic team back then).

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1991_European_Cup_Final

    One wonders how things might have panned out if the disaster of the 1990s didn’t unfold. Maybe the Balkan superstar period was always fated to begin and it just skipped a decade due to the wars.

    • Replies: @Matra
    @Thulean Friend

    Spain also won two European championships in 2008 & 2012 - they also won one in the 60s. In the same period they were the top European country in basketball, which is big outside of Northern Europe, and probably the dominant country in motorsports, tennis, and a couple of other widely played international sports. I remember at the time David Goldman aka Spengler, who was bitter at Spain over their Israel policy, mocked them as an unambitious loser country pointing to their lack of accomplishment in sports as an example. Being a typical American rube his evidence of Spanish lack of sporting prowess was their poor performances at the Olympics (which few care about) and was completely ignorant of the country's towering position in world sport at the time.

    Replies: @Thulean Friend

    , @silviosilver
    @Thulean Friend


    I mean Partisan Red Belgrade was already pretty damn impressive by the late 1970s. In 1991, they won against Marseilles (which was a fantastic team back then).
     
    Not sure if that's supposed to be a joke, but Partizan and Red Star Belgrade are two different teams.

    I saw that game. Marseilles dominated but couldn't score. I think their best chance was when former Red Star player ("traitor") Dragan Stojkovic - now manager of the Serbian national team - came on as a substitute late in the game. That game was one of the most elated victory feelings I've ever experienced. The other was when Partizan won the Euro League basketball final against Badalona the following year, with a 3-pointer at the buzzer.

    Funny, I can remember a ton of individual games and some of their details from the 90s, but draw a complete blank on anything in the last fifteen years. Well, part of the reason is I hardly care about the results anymore, whereas I used to be a passionate little sporstball fan.


    One wonders how things might have panned out if the disaster of the 1990s didn’t unfold. Maybe the Balkan superstar period was always fated to begin and it just skipped a decade due to the wars.
     
    Hey? In the 90s, Serbia won the Eurobasket tournament in 1995 and 1997 and the FIBA world championship in 1998. And a still intact Yugolsavia won the world championship in 1990 and the Euro championship in 1991. At the club level, in addition to the aforementioned Partizan victory, Jugoplastika Split won it in 1989, 1990, and 1991.

    Replies: @Thulean Friend

  288. @songbird
    This Thanksgiving I will be making many Erdogan-themed jokes. I figure politics is safe, once you cross the Bosporus.

    Replies: @Thulean Friend

    I think Erdogan is going to get crushed in the next elections but I must say I’ve come to like him as time has gone on. He has shown remarkable resilience and geopolitical independence despite Turkey being in such a precarious position. Much stronger European countries show far less spine.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Thulean Friend

    I would say I am somewhat neutral on Erdogan. I really don't care about him turning the Hagia Sophia back into a mosque (not like there are many Christians in Turkey). I may be opposed to military adventurism, using migrants as weapons, and inflation, but those seen like common sins. My main disagreement with him is that he seems to be trying to take away the joy of English-speaking schoolkids regarding the bird/country pun.

    Don't know how legit this map of Chinese search terms is, but I think it is interesting how Turkey is seen as "opposes China", while Poland is perceived as "hates China."https://twitter.com/whyvert/status/1595933987838758912?s=20&t=ILMDjqMEicY37_pMevfLEw


    Certain other parts of it puzzle me, such as Belgians being called "red devils" (does this have to do with promoting an anti-Euro narrative in Africa?) and Bulgarians having "milk-induced longevity" (thought they were fairly lactose-intolerant?)

    Replies: @German_reader, @silviosilver, @AnonfromTN

  289. The clownshow at the Qatar World Cup just keeps giving. Now the Belgian foreign minister confronts the FIFA president, outraged over them banning the pro-LGBT armbands.

    Meanwhile the German team got thrashed by the Japanese(!) after making a huge performative political stink before the game. Karma.

    • LOL: Barbarossa
    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Thulean Friend

    Good thing she didn't confront the Qataris. They would have escorted her directly to the airline terminal gate and told her to not ever come back.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    , @Yahya
    @Thulean Friend

    I thought I spotted some familiar facial features on that Belgian foreign minister, and sure enough she’s from an Algerian background.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hadja_Lahbib

    Incidentally some of the Turkish-origin players were also protesting Qatar’s LGBT arm-band decision along with their German teammates. A sign of assimilation perhaps.

    Are MENA people in Europe generally becoming more socially liberal, or are these unrepresentative samples?

    Interesting that an Algerian-Belgian minister is attempting to impose European values on an Arab nation. The beginnings of a new era.

    Replies: @Matra, @Thulean Friend

    , @showmethereal
    @Thulean Friend

    Honestly though - if the western media didn’t focus on such folly nobody would care. In non western nations nobody cares about that garbage… they just want to watch the games. Qatar absolutely doesn’t care either - lol

  290. @Mikel
    @AnonfromTN

    There is some truth in what you say but, as usual, you take things to the extreme. Living in Oregon or California is not the same as living in Texas or Wyoming. Electoral choices do still have practical consequences. Let's see how A123 reacts to your calling him sheeple for believing that voting for Trump is going to make any difference.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    Electoral choices do still have practical consequences.

    Local electoral choices, yes. Likely because the cabal does not want to get swamped by the nitty-gritty of local issues. As to national elections…

    Have you noticed that the key things in the foreign policy remain essentially the same regardless which “party” is technically in power? These invariably include military bases all over the world, coups in various countries, naked aggression against the countries where a coup cannot be arranged, and various sanctions against anyone who does not toe the imperial line.

    That MIC funding keeps growing under either “party”? It has already reached obscene proportions, it exceeds the military spending of the rest of the world put together. Yet the increases of the amounts of money thrown into insatiable maw of greedy US MIC show no signs of abating, and it does not matter one bit which “party” is technically in power.

    These and many other things show that real power is wielded by the forces behind the scenes, not by elected figureheads, who are becoming more and more pathetic (severe Alzheimer’s is a new low).

    • Replies: @Mikel
    @AnonfromTN


    Have you noticed that the key things in the foreign policy remain essentially the same regardless which “party” is technically in power?
     
    Yes but that's no big news. Everybody has noticed that the MIC/neocon lobby is very powerful in DC and Congressmen of both parties are loyal to it. However, we now know that a candidate that explicitly promises to change some of those key things in foreign policy can become President (or at least could 6 years ago, demographic changes are happening so fast that I'm not sure that would be possible again).

    The fact that Trump didn't change anything on foreign policy and actually doubled down on everything you mentioned when he became President doesn't necessarily mean that it is impossible to do. Let's not forget that he failed to keep his promises on everything he ran on (except for the Israel Embassy) so at least to a very big extent it was just a personal problem of incompetence and inconsistency. He could have perfectly surrounded himself with anti-interventionist people who shared his campaign message like Buchanan, Rand Paul, Gosar, Tulsi,... and, as Commander in Chief, he had ample power to order troop retreats and abstain from attacking foreign countries. Instead, he filled his Administration with rabid interventionists like Pompeo, Haley, McMaster, Matis, Esper, Bolton... With such choices it's little wonder that he failed to keep campaign promises that he had simply forgotten about.

    There are very strong inertias in American politics, especially when it comes to military and foreign policy matters, and shady cabals do exist but it would be a mistake to conclude that they are all powerful just because because such an idiosyncratic personage as Trump was unable to stand up to them.

    Btw, knowing all the things that he failed to do, are you going to vote for Trump again if he is the nominee? And would you rather have him run instead of someone who has at least been able to take concrete actions on immigration and the woke insanity like DeSantis?

    Replies: @A123, @AnonfromTN

    , @Barbarossa
    @AnonfromTN

    Yep. Voting in local elections is usually far more effective than any national races. Of course everyone thinks it's the opposite case, which is a shame.

    Replies: @silviosilver

  291. @showmethereal
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    I notice it is usually the people with the least actual knowledge who are quickest to resort to insults. Are Steve Nash and Manu Ginobli East Asian??? Stick to the topic. The original question was the difference between Chinese and Koreans and Japanese in international football. Simple answer is China was isolated and started much later. But just like the Olympics once China gets experience it will surpass both Koreans and Japanese.
    Basketball indeed is the perfect example. How many ethnic Koreans and Japanese made it in the NBA?? They make it in baseball because as US vassals they have long experience at baseball. East Asians do not have the physical attributes to dominate in basketball. That is a simple reality. BUT China has indeed produced a hall of famer in Yao Ming. To compare Steve Nash and Manu Ginobili has zero context. However Canada and Argentina have played basketball much longer than China on a grass roots. So there is no way you can say a Jeremy Lin can’t become on their level. In fact when Jeremy Lin did go play in China he didn’t dominate the way Stephon Marbury did - which means other Chinese (born) could indeed play in the NBA. But I still don’t expect China to become as good as the US or Spain simply because of gene pool. The women on the hand may one day beat the US women as they have come close more than once. But as I see others noted - you aren’t actually thinking with rational sense but have a grudge against Chinese.

    And no Japan is not a team anyone fears to play. Neither is the US and the US made the knockout rounds before. Use real sense.

    I see others addressed rugby so no need to waste my time.

    The only thing you did say correct is that Chinese footballers are indeed overpaid. Korean and Japanese league players make less money which makes them more hungry to strive overseas and get better. Indeed the Chinese Super League salaries are over inflated.

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms, @Emil Nikola Richard

    Baseball was introduced in Japan in 1872. During WWII the Japanese war cry was “to hell with Babe Ruth”

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baseball_in_Japan#History

    Russian contempt for the Chinese is real:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_deportations_of_Chinese_people

    Does the CCP ever bring this up? No, because PRC was originally a Soviet vassal.

    And because it was the Chinese whom acted like unruly goons

    The Chinese entertained joint management until mid-1929. The change from Soviet control to Chinese control started when the Chinese authorities made a radical move to try to remove Soviet management. Chinese authorities stormed the Soviet Consulate in Harbin. They arrested the General Manager of the CER, his assistant and other Soviet citizens and removed them from power in the CER.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sino-Soviet_conflict_(1929)

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    More wiki cites. Hardly anything related to politics, economics, and history in wiki is credible. If any truth remains in these entries, it’s there because the censors are sloppy or overworked (or simply dumb).

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    , @showmethereal
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    Since the industrial revolution Japan has had an affinity for western things. Teddy Roosevelt was a big fan of Japan westernizing Asia. Japanese were placating the west even back then. But once Japan was occupied by the US after WW2 baseball became more prominent. I’m not even sure how you can possibly even try to debate that…. Anyway…

    Ahhh so you realize you are on shaky ground and so bring up the Sino Soviet conflict. What in earth does that have to do with anything we were discussing???? Stop wasting time.

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

  292. @Thulean Friend
    @silviosilver

    Spain has only won a single WC. They've fallen off the radar a bit in recent years, maybe they got lucky by having insanely good players in the late 2000s. That said, in tennis they've been doing well.

    The same question can be turned towards the Balkans. Has the region always been this good at sports? I mean Partisan Red Belgrade was already pretty damn impressive by the late 1970s. In 1991, they won against Marseilles (which was a fantastic team back then).

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1991_European_Cup_Final

    One wonders how things might have panned out if the disaster of the 1990s didn't unfold. Maybe the Balkan superstar period was always fated to begin and it just skipped a decade due to the wars.

    Replies: @Matra, @silviosilver

    Spain also won two European championships in 2008 & 2012 – they also won one in the 60s. In the same period they were the top European country in basketball, which is big outside of Northern Europe, and probably the dominant country in motorsports, tennis, and a couple of other widely played international sports. I remember at the time David Goldman aka Spengler, who was bitter at Spain over their Israel policy, mocked them as an unambitious loser country pointing to their lack of accomplishment in sports as an example. Being a typical American rube his evidence of Spanish lack of sporting prowess was their poor performances at the Olympics (which few care about) and was completely ignorant of the country’s towering position in world sport at the time.

    • Agree: showmethereal
    • Replies: @Thulean Friend
    @Matra


    Spain also won two European championships in 2008 & 2012
     
    Yeah, the Spanish team from 2008-2012 basically crushed everything but their trophy count outside of this golden four year period is meager indeed. I do hope they do well in this tournament. Of all the teams playing, I enjoy watching them the most.

    There were some here who questioned the utility of even watching sports. My answer is simple. Never in a million years could I play as beautifully as the Spanish team when they are in form no matter how hard I try. I've heard people really into tennis say the same thing when Federer was at his best. It transcends sports, it almost becomes meditative watching a true master at his craft.


    I remember at the time David Goldman aka Spengler, who was bitter at Spain over their Israel policy
     
    I still come across quite a few snide remarks against the Irish by various Jewish twitter types. It took me some time to figure it out before it became clear that it's for Ireland's historically pro-Palestine stance.
  293. @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @showmethereal

    Baseball was introduced in Japan in 1872. During WWII the Japanese war cry was "to hell with Babe Ruth"

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baseball_in_Japan#History

    Russian contempt for the Chinese is real:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_deportations_of_Chinese_people

    Does the CCP ever bring this up? No, because PRC was originally a Soviet vassal.

    And because it was the Chinese whom acted like unruly goons


    The Chinese entertained joint management until mid-1929. The change from Soviet control to Chinese control started when the Chinese authorities made a radical move to try to remove Soviet management. Chinese authorities stormed the Soviet Consulate in Harbin. They arrested the General Manager of the CER, his assistant and other Soviet citizens and removed them from power in the CER.
     
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sino-Soviet_conflict_(1929)

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @showmethereal

    More wiki cites. Hardly anything related to politics, economics, and history in wiki is credible. If any truth remains in these entries, it’s there because the censors are sloppy or overworked (or simply dumb).

    • Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @AnonfromTN

    What's your epistemic standard? I only cite wiki excerpts that are well sourced. I was calling out an obvious lie by showmethereal that Japan played baseball only as a US vassal.

    Would a picture be better?
    https://i.postimg.cc/Y9MFB7js/dd62409b-p.jpg
    One of the most prominent pitchers in the history of Japanese baseball was Victor Starffin “the blue-eyed Japanese” (青い目の日本人, aoi-me no Nihonjin). A white émigré who arrived in Japan after the Russian Revolution by way of Manchuria

  294. @showmethereal
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    I notice it is usually the people with the least actual knowledge who are quickest to resort to insults. Are Steve Nash and Manu Ginobli East Asian??? Stick to the topic. The original question was the difference between Chinese and Koreans and Japanese in international football. Simple answer is China was isolated and started much later. But just like the Olympics once China gets experience it will surpass both Koreans and Japanese.
    Basketball indeed is the perfect example. How many ethnic Koreans and Japanese made it in the NBA?? They make it in baseball because as US vassals they have long experience at baseball. East Asians do not have the physical attributes to dominate in basketball. That is a simple reality. BUT China has indeed produced a hall of famer in Yao Ming. To compare Steve Nash and Manu Ginobili has zero context. However Canada and Argentina have played basketball much longer than China on a grass roots. So there is no way you can say a Jeremy Lin can’t become on their level. In fact when Jeremy Lin did go play in China he didn’t dominate the way Stephon Marbury did - which means other Chinese (born) could indeed play in the NBA. But I still don’t expect China to become as good as the US or Spain simply because of gene pool. The women on the hand may one day beat the US women as they have come close more than once. But as I see others noted - you aren’t actually thinking with rational sense but have a grudge against Chinese.

    And no Japan is not a team anyone fears to play. Neither is the US and the US made the knockout rounds before. Use real sense.

    I see others addressed rugby so no need to waste my time.

    The only thing you did say correct is that Chinese footballers are indeed overpaid. Korean and Japanese league players make less money which makes them more hungry to strive overseas and get better. Indeed the Chinese Super League salaries are over inflated.

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms, @Emil Nikola Richard

    So there is no way you can say a Jeremy Lin can’t become on their level. In fact when Jeremy Lin did go play in China he didn’t dominate the way Stephon Marbury did – which means other Chinese (born) could indeed play in the NBA.

    Lin was a freak whose case does not allow for such a generalization. He was a stranger to the NBA because he played at a non-basketball U. He burned through the league for 3 weeks to a month because he had some great skills. He also had a fatal flaw in his game which they quickly learned to exploit after which he was never more than Just Another Guy.

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    No Yao Ming was more of a “freak” chance. You can directly compare Jeremy Lin playing in the NBA and China vs the many other NBA players who went to play in China as well. Jeremy Lin never dominated the Chinese league. Good but not dominant. Same can be said of other former NBA players. Stephon Marbury did dominate though. He’s still there coaching and owning a team too.

  295. @A123
    @Mikel

    I already answered these questions, but will briefly reply before I head out for the day.

    Point #1 -- There is a huge difference between MAGA and Republican. Case in point, Mitch McConnell.

    Point #2 -- There is no such thing as a Trumpist. I presume you intended MAGA, but became very confused.

    Let me rephrase your questions to match reality and respond. The square brackets indicate [corrected terms].


    Why is [MAGA] unable to prevent the Democrats from committing fraud when they control the electoral mechanisms in most states, including some key ones like Nevada or Georgia?
     
    Kemp in Georgia is not MAGA. Thus MAGA has no control in Georgia. This was made painfully obvious to everyone in 2020 and the same anti-MAGA team is still in charge.

    I lack deep insight on Nevada one way or the other. It seems like a mixed bag.


    why is practically no [MAGA Candidate] contesting the results of the new election?
     
    The judiciary is largely uninterested or incapable of handling such matters in a timely manner. The fraudulent "loser" has huge opportunities to run out the clock, thus obtaining the office illegitimately. This was also made painfully obvious to everyone in 2020.

    Mounting legal challenges is very expensive. Anti-MAGA types like Ronna McDaniel control the RNC purse. There may be challenges that could work but do not have sufficient resources. I suspect that Nevada is in this situation.

    MAGA needs to build up giant piles of money so they can fight every fraud, everywhere. However, that does not exist yet. At this point, funding must be selectively deployed.


    Why would [MAGA Candidates] want to run again if they know that the elections are going to be rigged?
     
    It varies by candidate:

        -A- Doing the right thing is its own reward.
        -B- Winning beyond the margin that can be stolen is possible.
        -C- Willingness to adopt the tactics of the opposition.

    Consider some of Saul Alinsky's concepts:

        RULE 4: “Make the enemy live up to its own book of rules.”
        RULE 6: “A good tactic is one your people enjoy.”
        RULE 8: “Keep the pressure on. Never let up.”

    Option -C- is the potential gold mine. Those supporting MAGA candidates need to use the other side's rules. Balloting, Counting Until You Win, and Fultoning to ensure the candidate who actually won gets the office.

    The SJW ability to complain is greatly limited by their prior, shrill "every ballot must be counted" rhetoric (RULE 4). And, serving up justice for past misdeeds is a powerful motivator (RULE 6).
    _____

    Where you personally fail is RULE 8. Despite the overwhelming and irrefutable evidence that elections outcomes are being criminally manipulated, you refuse to keep the pressure up.

    You insist on going flaccid, exhibiting sheeple like acceptance of the Fake Stream Media narrative. Your submission provides bounty unto Not-The-President Biden.

     
    https://www.americanthinker.com/images/bucket/2022-11/242176_5_.jpg
     

    I do not know which is worse:
        • Do you lack the insight to see your capitulation serves Elite rule?
        • Or, are you willingly complicit with SJW Globalist subversion?

     

    ==================================
    🦃🍗🥧 HAPPY THANKSGIVING 🦃🍗🥧
    ==================================

    There will be an attempt at deep fried turkey in a few hours. I am bringing two extra fire extinguishers. Last weekend I won on planning. We cleared an old, overgrown concrete pad (former shed base?) down slope and away from their house.

    I hope those cooking are doing it right.

     
    https://i0.wp.com/www.powerlineblog.com/ed-assets/2022/11/Cook-a-turkey.png
     

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    The thing to do with Thanksgiving dinners is make sure you eat some good food before you go. If you are hungry when you get there you will be miserable.

    • Replies: @Barbarossa
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    Are you serious? You must have been subjected to some astoundingly bad cooking! I love good Thanksgiving food. Of course every dish in the roster can be cooked badly, but when it's good it's really good!

    Replies: @A123, @Emil Nikola Richard

  296. @Thulean Friend
    The clownshow at the Qatar World Cup just keeps giving. Now the Belgian foreign minister confronts the FIFA president, outraged over them banning the pro-LGBT armbands.

    https://i.imgur.com/pdPg7Fc.png

    Meanwhile the German team got thrashed by the Japanese(!) after making a huge performative political stink before the game. Karma.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Yahya, @showmethereal

    Good thing she didn’t confront the Qataris. They would have escorted her directly to the airline terminal gate and told her to not ever come back.

    • LOL: Yahya
    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    Good thing she didn’t confront the Qataris. They would have escorted her directly to the airline terminal gate and told her to not ever come back.
     
    Would have served her right. Europeans do not understand how annoying is their habit of teaching everyone how to run their countries. Especially now, when these sermons come from the people who got their countries in a hole and keep digging.

    Replies: @Yahya

  297. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Thulean Friend

    Good thing she didn't confront the Qataris. They would have escorted her directly to the airline terminal gate and told her to not ever come back.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    Good thing she didn’t confront the Qataris. They would have escorted her directly to the airline terminal gate and told her to not ever come back.

    Would have served her right. Europeans do not understand how annoying is their habit of teaching everyone how to run their countries. Especially now, when these sermons come from the people who got their countries in a hole and keep digging.

    • Agree: Sher Singh, showmethereal
    • Replies: @Yahya
    @AnonfromTN

    Lol if the Belgian minister thinks the Muslim Brotherhood in Qatar will give in to the gay lobby. The Western obsession with promoting LGBT rights is sort of a parody at this point.

    Replies: @Coconuts

  298. @AnonfromTN
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    Good thing she didn’t confront the Qataris. They would have escorted her directly to the airline terminal gate and told her to not ever come back.
     
    Would have served her right. Europeans do not understand how annoying is their habit of teaching everyone how to run their countries. Especially now, when these sermons come from the people who got their countries in a hole and keep digging.

    Replies: @Yahya

    Lol if the Belgian minister thinks the Muslim Brotherhood in Qatar will give in to the gay lobby. The Western obsession with promoting LGBT rights is sort of a parody at this point.

    • Replies: @Coconuts
    @Yahya

    In the West Feminism-Muslim-LGBTQIA+ is a kind of natural alliance. Don't know how far Intersectionality has spread in Belgium but it's not 100% surprising to see ethnic minority women promoting these beliefs.

  299. @Thulean Friend
    @silviosilver

    Spain has only won a single WC. They've fallen off the radar a bit in recent years, maybe they got lucky by having insanely good players in the late 2000s. That said, in tennis they've been doing well.

    The same question can be turned towards the Balkans. Has the region always been this good at sports? I mean Partisan Red Belgrade was already pretty damn impressive by the late 1970s. In 1991, they won against Marseilles (which was a fantastic team back then).

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1991_European_Cup_Final

    One wonders how things might have panned out if the disaster of the 1990s didn't unfold. Maybe the Balkan superstar period was always fated to begin and it just skipped a decade due to the wars.

    Replies: @Matra, @silviosilver

    I mean Partisan Red Belgrade was already pretty damn impressive by the late 1970s. In 1991, they won against Marseilles (which was a fantastic team back then).

    Not sure if that’s supposed to be a joke, but Partizan and Red Star Belgrade are two different teams.

    I saw that game. Marseilles dominated but couldn’t score. I think their best chance was when former Red Star player (“traitor”) Dragan Stojkovic – now manager of the Serbian national team – came on as a substitute late in the game. That game was one of the most elated victory feelings I’ve ever experienced. The other was when Partizan won the Euro League basketball final against Badalona the following year, with a 3-pointer at the buzzer.

    Funny, I can remember a ton of individual games and some of their details from the 90s, but draw a complete blank on anything in the last fifteen years. Well, part of the reason is I hardly care about the results anymore, whereas I used to be a passionate little sporstball fan.

    One wonders how things might have panned out if the disaster of the 1990s didn’t unfold. Maybe the Balkan superstar period was always fated to begin and it just skipped a decade due to the wars.

    Hey? In the 90s, Serbia won the Eurobasket tournament in 1995 and 1997 and the FIBA world championship in 1998. And a still intact Yugolsavia won the world championship in 1990 and the Euro championship in 1991. At the club level, in addition to the aforementioned Partizan victory, Jugoplastika Split won it in 1989, 1990, and 1991.

    • Replies: @Thulean Friend
    @silviosilver


    Funny, I can remember a ton of individual games and some of their details from the 90s, but draw a complete blank on anything in the last fifteen years. Well, part of the reason is I hardly care about the results anymore, whereas I used to be a passionate little sporstball fan
     
    Though I did not personally grow up with the game in the late 1980s and early 1990s, my dad did. He also spent a lot of time watching games all over Europe with his friends in his youth. So through him I got to learn of now long-lost names like Batistuta and can recall a time when Parma was actually a serious team. He has a similar attitude to yours.

    Teams weren't all bought up by some rich oil sheikh. The owners were genuine fans in a manner which is rare today. The Agnelli family's relationship with Juventus was perhaps iconic, but not unique. It nearly is now.

    The player squads were more local, so they actually cared for the clubs to a greater extent. Or if not local, at least from the same nation. This made Champions League games more exciting. Watching old recordings of Man Utd's 1999 Champions League win is still something I remember fondly from my childhood and their Bayern Munich opponents was almost an entirely German team. Most non-English players were either from the British Isles or Scandinavians.

    Additionally, and perhaps this is subjective, but my sense is that there were greater personalities. Who is the Eric Cantona of today? I can't think of anyone. Messi is a crybaby and Ronaldo seems like an idiot. Lewandowski is probably a perfectly polite guy but also feels boring and empty.

    Everything wasn't hyper-optimised in terms of diet or fitness. There were more things left to chance, both on the pitch and off it. Referees had greater tolerance for fights. Players could occasionally get away with going to the pub before a game. They were famous, but not mega-celebrities in the way that they are today.

    In short, the game didn't feel as mercenary as it does today. At least that's the impression I got growing up with old recorded games. I later read a lot about this period and it was probably the golden mean between some amount of necessary globalisation with the right amount of local flavour.

    Replies: @songbird

  300. Condolences to silviosilver who, pretending not to be a sportsball fan, is crying right now after Brazil took his boys to the woodshed. They should do better against Cameroon. Not too sure though about Switzerland. Do the so-called Swiss still have all those Albanians who helped slay their Chetnik enemies four years ago?

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Matra


    Condolences to silviosilver who, pretending not to be a sportsball fan, is crying right now after Brazil took his boys to the woodshed.
     
    Haha. Not a great start for the balkanoids this world cup. Croatia could do no better than draw against the sandniggaz and Serbia was convincingly beaten by the sambaniggaz. Could easily have been much worse too.

    Is it just me or is Brazil is getting less white with each world cup, but maybe kinda less black too?

    I think Switzerland - aka the Albanian B team - has even more Albo players this time around.

    An interesting detail I heard during the commentary of the Croatia-Morocco game was that Morocco has 14 players who were not even born in Morocco. Nice of them to do the decent thing and play for their real country rather impose themselves on Belgian and Dutch national teams lol.

    , @silviosilver
    @Matra

    Who's crying now, eh? :)

    I learned during the game that Canada's goalkeeper was born a Krajina Serb, giving the contest something of a grudge match flavor.

    @German_reader


    and writing them down here doesn’t cause much harm, but as a tactic in a political debate they’re a huge own goal. It would horrify even a lot of people who might be otherwise persuaded by anti-immigration arguments.
     
    Well of course. In a mainstream debate, I wouldn't dream of mentioning anything like that. I wouldn't even post that at Sailer's. But people who've made their way to a site like this - to the Open Threads, in particular - probably have a strong sense that something is deeply wrong with the picture of reality they have been presented, and with them I think it's worth pushing the envelope a little. Anyway, showmethereal is not some honest debater; he's simply an anti-white pest.

    Replies: @Matra, @A123

  301. @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @AnonfromTN

    But American football vs. soccer illustrates my point, the former is very planned set-piece that requires knowledge of a much more complex playbook. There's much less flair and spontaneity.

    The quarterback is the most complex and difficult position in all of sports, and it's dominated by northern Euros.

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/nfl-draft-physiognomy-clemson-ice-age-caveman-1-vs-byu-anglo-nice-guy-2/

    So it happens Slavs are overrepresented in QB, coaches as well as positions that require size, speed and physicality: tight end and defensive end

    https://kafkadesk.org/2021/01/23/nfl-the-slavic-connection-in-american-football/

    Replies: @showmethereal, @LatW

    So it happens Slavs are overrepresented in QB, coaches as well as positions that require size, speed and physicality: tight end and defensive end

    Not just any Slavs, but a very particular, narrow type, mostly Balto-Slav from the north – from Poland and Lithuania, this type is more robust than the average Slav (which is a very big and rather diverse population). Defensive end in particular requires a very robust, strong physique and tall stature (you cannot be dainty and small boned). When one thinks of how is this type different from similar robust Nordic or Scottish types, it seems that they have just a tiny bit more plasticity.

    It looks like these types made it into the NFL because their parents were first generation immigrants and had to struggle a bit so they were more represented in working and middle class (where these players typically come from). The third generation of these immigrants are already more affluent and may have chosen other, more white collar professions rather than an extremely competitive and tough sport. Also, if they keep having petite or very thin spouses this type will dissolve (nothing against petite women, of course, it’s just that they won’t be producing that type of a physique).

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @LatW

    Who are you talking about? Name some names. Defensive end is hardly known as a common white position, although Nick Bosa ranks among the best today.

    Replies: @LatW, @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    , @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @LatW


    similar robust Nordic or Scottish types

     

    A more common type is NFL centers guards and rugby players, 6'1 to 6'4, shorter arms but benchpresses more.

    https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-2022-offensive-guard-rankings-tiers

    Defensive end in particular requires a very robust, strong physique and tall stature

     

    6'5+ as well as long arms. More common in blacks but some whites actually dominate the position, e.g. JJ Watt

    Big and fast white guys are actually not that rare. If you watch Gronk outrunning and shoving around black DBs he looks like man amongst boys. There was a German dominated the NFL combines but didn't make it because he lacked skills,

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moritz_Böhringer

    Smaller and fast white guys the equivalent of Deion Sanders are rarer.

    I'm saying a lot of HBD preconceptions who can do or who's better at what sport is premature.

    Replies: @LatW

  302. @Thulean Friend
    The clownshow at the Qatar World Cup just keeps giving. Now the Belgian foreign minister confronts the FIFA president, outraged over them banning the pro-LGBT armbands.

    https://i.imgur.com/pdPg7Fc.png

    Meanwhile the German team got thrashed by the Japanese(!) after making a huge performative political stink before the game. Karma.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Yahya, @showmethereal

    I thought I spotted some familiar facial features on that Belgian foreign minister, and sure enough she’s from an Algerian background.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hadja_Lahbib

    Incidentally some of the Turkish-origin players were also protesting Qatar’s LGBT arm-band decision along with their German teammates. A sign of assimilation perhaps.

    Are MENA people in Europe generally becoming more socially liberal, or are these unrepresentative samples?

    Interesting that an Algerian-Belgian minister is attempting to impose European values on an Arab nation. The beginnings of a new era.

    • Replies: @Matra
    @Yahya


    Interesting that an Algerian-Belgian minister is attempting to impose European values on an Arab nation.
     
    Maybe she's Kabyle. They are often the most anti-Arab, anti-Muslim people in Francophone politics.

    Replies: @Yahya

    , @Thulean Friend
    @Yahya


    Are MENA people in Europe generally becoming more socially liberal, or are these unrepresentative samples?
     
    Can only speak for Sweden and I would say generally yes, there is significant liberalisation but it also depends widely. The moslem community is exceptionally diverse both in terms of ethnicity (and thus cultural practices) as well as how long they've been here.

    One puzzle has been Sweden's very slow crawl upwards in terms of our moslem population in official surveys. Immigration has been very rapid, yet the percentage has moved up far more slowly over the last twenty years. This has led to accusations from the far-right that our demographers are "covering up our replacement".

    But there's a more simple way to square this circle; we now have many more "cultural moslems". By some estimates, as many as 14% of the population could be classified as moslems by including this more liberal definition. The way people are asked in some of these surveys can be quite strict (wrt to regular observances, mosque attendance etc) so that's why this number is closer to 8-9% in surveys. A significant percentage are basically liberal secularists who conveniently become moslem during ramadam (or even just during Eid).

    Anecdotally, it does gel with my personal experience. I saw lots of assimiliated moslem girls at my university. Befriended some and many had Swedish boyfriends. Though I still noticed a greater cultural aversion to casual sex, which is postive in my book. Swedish culture is a bit degenerative at times. As an aside, a Pakistani family moved in across the building from me. We met them at the bus-stop a few days ago, and didn't know they lived close to us before they told us their adress (very direct and un-Swedish!). The woman wore a hijab but her teenage daughter dressed completely Swedish. (And I'm not one who cares much about hijabs anyway. Niqab/Burka is a different story).

    Still, there's a bit of a backlash due to perceived excessive assimilation. A controversy which is brewing around so-called "virginity operations" where young girls who have lost their virginity will try to "restore" their hymen so as to raise their status in the marriage market. The current government is moving to criminalise these operations, but some leftist activists are saying that if it is forced underground then these girls will still attempt it but at considerably greater physical risk to themselves and their health. It's a tough issue, IMO. I agree in principle with our government but the leftists do have a point.

    It's a bit like the issue of "woman going home alone at 3 AM dressed in a miniskirt gets raped". Of course, any decent moral stance wouldn't blame the woman. Yet, pragmatically we must accept that the world isn't perfect and she should've exercised better personal judgement. How to pull that off without sounding like an apologist for rapists isn't easy. Similar balance here.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @silviosilver, @Wrights

  303. @Matra
    Condolences to silviosilver who, pretending not to be a sportsball fan, is crying right now after Brazil took his boys to the woodshed. They should do better against Cameroon. Not too sure though about Switzerland. Do the so-called Swiss still have all those Albanians who helped slay their Chetnik enemies four years ago?

    Replies: @silviosilver, @silviosilver

    Condolences to silviosilver who, pretending not to be a sportsball fan, is crying right now after Brazil took his boys to the woodshed.

    Haha. Not a great start for the balkanoids this world cup. Croatia could do no better than draw against the sandniggaz and Serbia was convincingly beaten by the sambaniggaz. Could easily have been much worse too.

    Is it just me or is Brazil is getting less white with each world cup, but maybe kinda less black too?

    I think Switzerland – aka the Albanian B team – has even more Albo players this time around.

    An interesting detail I heard during the commentary of the Croatia-Morocco game was that Morocco has 14 players who were not even born in Morocco. Nice of them to do the decent thing and play for their real country rather impose themselves on Belgian and Dutch national teams lol.

  304. @Yahya
    @Thulean Friend

    I thought I spotted some familiar facial features on that Belgian foreign minister, and sure enough she’s from an Algerian background.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hadja_Lahbib

    Incidentally some of the Turkish-origin players were also protesting Qatar’s LGBT arm-band decision along with their German teammates. A sign of assimilation perhaps.

    Are MENA people in Europe generally becoming more socially liberal, or are these unrepresentative samples?

    Interesting that an Algerian-Belgian minister is attempting to impose European values on an Arab nation. The beginnings of a new era.

    Replies: @Matra, @Thulean Friend

    Interesting that an Algerian-Belgian minister is attempting to impose European values on an Arab nation.

    Maybe she’s Kabyle. They are often the most anti-Arab, anti-Muslim people in Francophone politics.

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @Matra

    I think you're right. She's fairly light too, which is common among Kabyles:


    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/dc/Hadja_Lahbib_2022_%28sq_cropped%29.jpg


    Reminds me of Zinedine Zidane's phenotype.

    Kabyle Berbers tend to be more intelligent on average than Arabs so that would explain her high-ranking position. She also dresses and carries herself fairly well, indicates an upper class background. I think Berbers in Europe generally come from a higher class background. That's just going off anecdata though, can't be bothered to check the statistics. There's this Berber soprano on Youtube I like called Amel Brahim who performs Amazigh folk and Western classical songs:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qfsnGeeLlPA&list=OLAK5uy_lJgHIeE5HqYacbKZT03mI51pnV89F1ns0&index=2&ab_channel=AnneLeBozec-Topic

  305. @LatW
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms


    So it happens Slavs are overrepresented in QB, coaches as well as positions that require size, speed and physicality: tight end and defensive end
     
    Not just any Slavs, but a very particular, narrow type, mostly Balto-Slav from the north - from Poland and Lithuania, this type is more robust than the average Slav (which is a very big and rather diverse population). Defensive end in particular requires a very robust, strong physique and tall stature (you cannot be dainty and small boned). When one thinks of how is this type different from similar robust Nordic or Scottish types, it seems that they have just a tiny bit more plasticity.

    It looks like these types made it into the NFL because their parents were first generation immigrants and had to struggle a bit so they were more represented in working and middle class (where these players typically come from). The third generation of these immigrants are already more affluent and may have chosen other, more white collar professions rather than an extremely competitive and tough sport. Also, if they keep having petite or very thin spouses this type will dissolve (nothing against petite women, of course, it's just that they won't be producing that type of a physique).

    Replies: @silviosilver, @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    Who are you talking about? Name some names. Defensive end is hardly known as a common white position, although Nick Bosa ranks among the best today.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @silviosilver

    Sorry, they're not in defensive end, but QBs mostly. I had players from the old era like Johnny Unitas in mind, QBs are, of course, thinner (but still robust) than defensive end. Estonian Margus Hunt is defensive end (he was in Cincinnati Bengals & Chicago Bears), and he is a little more filled in (although even he is very lean, just seems more muscular and "fuller" figured).

    , @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @silviosilver

    Kevin Greene, Jared Allen. Currently there's TJ Watt.

    Lyle Alzado, Brian Bosworth were pretty hyped.

    There was an Estonian with freakish athleticism but never made it,

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margus_Hunt

    Replies: @LatW

  306. @Matra
    @Yahya


    Interesting that an Algerian-Belgian minister is attempting to impose European values on an Arab nation.
     
    Maybe she's Kabyle. They are often the most anti-Arab, anti-Muslim people in Francophone politics.

    Replies: @Yahya

    I think you’re right. She’s fairly light too, which is common among Kabyles:

    Reminds me of Zinedine Zidane’s phenotype.

    Kabyle Berbers tend to be more intelligent on average than Arabs so that would explain her high-ranking position. She also dresses and carries herself fairly well, indicates an upper class background. I think Berbers in Europe generally come from a higher class background. That’s just going off anecdata though, can’t be bothered to check the statistics. There’s this Berber soprano on Youtube I like called Amel Brahim who performs Amazigh folk and Western classical songs:

  307. @silviosilver
    @LatW

    Who are you talking about? Name some names. Defensive end is hardly known as a common white position, although Nick Bosa ranks among the best today.

    Replies: @LatW, @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    Sorry, they’re not in defensive end, but QBs mostly. I had players from the old era like Johnny Unitas in mind, QBs are, of course, thinner (but still robust) than defensive end. Estonian Margus Hunt is defensive end (he was in Cincinnati Bengals & Chicago Bears), and he is a little more filled in (although even he is very lean, just seems more muscular and “fuller” figured).

  308. @silviosilver
    @Thulean Friend


    things like climate, pro-sports culture etc all matter – but it must be a part of the whole answer.
     
    Did something change in Spain this respect? If we date the adoption of mass participation in sports to after WWII, Spain was nowhere to be seen for the longest time. Then all of a sudden they started wining everything.

    Replies: @Thulean Friend, @LondonBob

    The doping scandal coincides with the period of Spanish sporting prowess.

  309. @Mikel
    @silviosilver


    Do you find it completely implausible that there may have been decisive election shenanigans?
     
    The key words there are completely and decisive.

    I know for a fact that there must be some fraud because I see with my eyes every election that things like voter authentication are a joke. But regarding the 2020 elections, the likelihood of fraud of various kinds having a decisive impact in the results is very unlikely, to say the least. At the beginning, the fraud cases brought forward by the Trumpists looked quite plausible to me but in retrospect, I think that I spent too much time reading and hearing about them and too little time paying attention to opposing views. It didn't help that the Democrat, RINO and MSM response was "there's nothing to see here", "it's all a big lie" and massive censorship. But we now know many things that we didn't then, like Trump lawyers (including in some cases Giuliani) making clownish claims that didn't stand close scrutiny and some incontrovertible facts, like the recount done in Arizona by the election doubters themselves showing the expected results: many irregularities but the same results (with actually marginally worse results for Trump in the recount).

    But my questions to A123 that he couldn't answer stand: why is practically no Republican contesting the results of the new election? Why are Republicans unable to prevent the Democrats from committing fraud when they control the electoral mechanisms in most states, including some key ones like Nevada or Georgia? Why would Trumpists want his candidate to run again if they know that the elections are going to be rigged? I could add some more but the debate about electoral fraud has gotten tiresome.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @A123, @LondonBob

    Trump was winning comfortably before the voting stopped and voter dumps started, even the NYT election predictor forecast him winning by a comfortable margin, ballot harvesting and mail in fraud aren’t obvious, unless you analyse forensically, however dumping a bunch of votes all to one candidate is hardly sophisticated, about as blatant as it gets.

    • Agree: AnonfromTN, S
    • Replies: @sudden death
    @LondonBob

    Trump was whining and propagandizing against the mail voting during entire election year, so why is it so surprising that his voters were participating mainly on election day, therefore naturally were absent from mail votes which consequently were absolutely dominantly for Biden then?

    Not even to mention that many Republican voters got quite sick with Covid or even died prior election day due all the trumper floomer propaganda too.

    Replies: @LondonBob

  310. @showmethereal
    @LondonBob

    Huh? Argentina just won the Copa America and made the WC final as recently as 2014…. Had Higuan been remotely clinical they would have beaten Germany soundly

    Replies: @LondonBob

    Copa America is basically Brazil and Argentina, sure lousy teams can get a lucky run to the final, like Argentina did in 2014, like Germany did in Japan. They have had a very lopsided team for a while now, very good strikers who all play very similar, and then not much else, maybe a decent midfielder or two.

  311. @silviosilver
    @Yevardian


    I remember going through a phase of listening to Serbian ‘turbofolk
     
    Shit, seriously? You really enjoyed listening to that stuff? I actually hadn't heard of any of the songs or performers you linked to. Maybe that Mauzer song I've heard before, but I think from someone posting a link here, not in its own day. I suppose it comes under the category of 'turbfolk' but it's not what I think of as most representative of the genre. Or maybe it is, and I just don't know what I'm talking about. I am not a fan of turbofolk but I got into it for a while in the early 2000s, and I think most of it is quite a lot better than the selections you posted. (Man, that "Srbian supermen" thing, rofl - you sure you're not trying to embarrass me here, hmm?) There isn't any bright dividing line between what is turbofolk and what is just Serbian pop music, and perhaps the kind that I liked (and most people liked, judging by what was listened to when I was there) is heavier on the pop (or "turbo") than on the folk.

    On Serbian music in general, I quite like this sort of stuff too.
     
    I immediately recognized the singer in that clip, but it surprised me that I couldn't remember his name - which I took as a sign of how out of touch I am with this music. If you like him, my two fave songs of his were "Rano je za tugu" and "Ostaricu necu znati" (let's see if I have good taste lol).

    I know what you mean by the vocal style, but I have no idea about the correct musical terminology for it. You're quite right that it's very common. One song that immediately comes to mind that features it strongly (takes it to excess even) is Mitar Miric - Ne diraj coveka za stolom.

    This to Yahya as well, who has expressed some interest in balkans music, a rather distinctive style is Sevdah/Sevdanlinka, which is mostly Bosnian but is thought quite highly of across ex-YU. Generally melancholy themes with oriental-tinged, often rather haunting, melodies. Couple of good examples by Safet Isovic - Moj Dilbere and Sehidski rastanak.

    My own personal preference, and the only stuff I can really enjoy without getting tired of it, is ex-YU pop from the 80s. Couple of good examples, the groups "Zana" and "Magazin."

    Replies: @Yahya

    , a rather distinctive style is Sevdah/Sevdanlinka, which is mostly Bosnian but is thought quite highly of across ex-YU. Generally melancholy themes with oriental-tinged, often rather haunting, melodies. Couple of good examples by Safet Isovic – Moj Dilbere and Sehidski rastanak.

    Yes Isovic was one of my first introductions to the treasure trove that is Balkan folk music. More specifically this song:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eMb3jWURFd0&ab_channel=SafetIsovi%C4%87

    I remember how impressed I was with the instrumentation, and more saliently, the distinctive, booming Bosnian vocal technique which I had never heard of before. But unfortunately Isovic’s music is highly variable, some are very schlocky and others are excellent.

    Didn’t like any of the pop tunes or artists you mentioned tbh. I’ve written to Philip Owen before that i’m only interested in higher forms of musical expression from other cultures. But within my own culture, the genre that has most stirred my soul is the trashy ethnic music. The trashier it was, the more deeper the feelings it elicited. I’ve unfortunately lost my taste for that peculiar genre of music, but I will always fondly remember the days of ethnic warmth (now mostly gone) that type of music generated within me.

    PS: I’m still waiting for a reply to the rest of my initial post. What did you think of the Arabic songs?

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Yahya


    I’ve written to Philip Owen before that i’m only interested in higher forms of musical expression from other cultures.
     
    Yeah, I suspected as much. The thing is, they seem to me to be so closely associated with that culture (or with a particular people/nation) that it creates a barrier for me to completely enjoy it. I don't mean because I find it too alien, I mean it makes me feel like something of an "imposter," like I'm illicitly encroaching on them. With pop music, the themes are universal, and even if the performer is an avowed 'racist,' it's like so what, they can't stop me enjoying it since the music has no obvious connection with anything culturally particular.

    Btw, talking about pop music in the other post, how could I forget to mention 80s Italian pop? That's probably my favorite, or co-favorite with English-language 80s, and just as good. I'll nominate three songs that best capture it for me, Giuni Russo - Un'estate al mare, Stadio -Acqua e sapone, Franco Battiato - Centro di gravita permanente. Trashy? Yeah, okay. I never claimed to be a musical sophisticate. (That last one is kinda profound though. Supposedly inspired by Gurdjieff themes. The chorus means something like "I'm looking for a permanent center of gravity that never changes my mind about things and people", ie some stable standpoint from which to make sense of the phantasmagorical stimulation that postmodern culture assaults our senses with. That song could be the anthem of a lot of people on this blog - and in wider society - besides me.)

    I'll use the example of a scene in the Spanish movie "Vengo" (because I wanted to ask you something else about it too). The film is about some rivalry between Spanish gypsies ("gitanos") and features a lot of flamenco music and dance. If you go to the scene at the 19 minute mark /watch?v=ViCVxYO8r0A&t=1140s [I trust you're able to append that to after the .com after youtube ] you'll see that's some pretty powerful performance by the singer at the table (no idea what she's singing about). The 'soldiers' (or maybe guardia civils) at the next are getting into the music, and eventually they get up and crowd around the singer's table and get into it even more. Now, if I had happened to be at that restaurant, even if it's unlikely I'd be eyed as a racial outsider, and even if I could do that rhythmic hand-clapping, I still wouldn't attempt to join in, because that seems like it's something very culturally particular and it would feel very inauthentic for me to attempt to join in. You follow?

    Of course, a lot depends on the context in which a piece of music is performed. When they were composed, Wagner's works were pointedly Germanic, and if the current year were 1922 instead of 2022, there isn't a chance could I enjoy them the way, say, a Hitler could. But western culture has been promoting itself as universal culture for so long now, that Wagner becomes accessible in a way he previously wasn't. On the other hand, a piece like "Concierto de Aranjuez," which was composed (at least ostensibly) to celebrate the Nationalist victory in the Spanish Civil War (but I which prefer as the vocal arrangement in French, "Mon Amour"), by the time it achieved international acclaim, WWII was over, so it slotted fairly neatly into the "universalist" category. Similarly, James Last's "The Lonely Shepherd" (made famous by pan-flutist Gheorghe Zamfir) was "universalist" from the outset, but if it had been composed in a context in which the Nazis had won WWII, reactions to it may well have been very different.

    The other thing I wanted to ask you about that movie is, if you go to the beginning, there seems to be a diverse crowd of Spaniards and Arabs making their way to a little "castle," where a flamenco performance is taking place, but which then morphs into some Arabic number. (Normally, when I hear "fusion," I think "run," because it's going to be something godawful but this wasn't so bad, lol.) My question is: is that an Arabic style you recognize, and if so, what is it and what is its origin?

    Replies: @Yahya

  312. @LatW
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms


    So it happens Slavs are overrepresented in QB, coaches as well as positions that require size, speed and physicality: tight end and defensive end
     
    Not just any Slavs, but a very particular, narrow type, mostly Balto-Slav from the north - from Poland and Lithuania, this type is more robust than the average Slav (which is a very big and rather diverse population). Defensive end in particular requires a very robust, strong physique and tall stature (you cannot be dainty and small boned). When one thinks of how is this type different from similar robust Nordic or Scottish types, it seems that they have just a tiny bit more plasticity.

    It looks like these types made it into the NFL because their parents were first generation immigrants and had to struggle a bit so they were more represented in working and middle class (where these players typically come from). The third generation of these immigrants are already more affluent and may have chosen other, more white collar professions rather than an extremely competitive and tough sport. Also, if they keep having petite or very thin spouses this type will dissolve (nothing against petite women, of course, it's just that they won't be producing that type of a physique).

    Replies: @silviosilver, @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    similar robust Nordic or Scottish types

    A more common type is NFL centers guards and rugby players, 6’1 to 6’4, shorter arms but benchpresses more.

    https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-2022-offensive-guard-rankings-tiers

    Defensive end in particular requires a very robust, strong physique and tall stature

    6’5+ as well as long arms. More common in blacks but some whites actually dominate the position, e.g. JJ Watt

    Big and fast white guys are actually not that rare. If you watch Gronk outrunning and shoving around black DBs he looks like man amongst boys. There was a German dominated the NFL combines but didn’t make it because he lacked skills,

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moritz_Böhringer

    Smaller and fast white guys the equivalent of Deion Sanders are rarer.

    I’m saying a lot of HBD preconceptions who can do or who’s better at what sport is premature.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms


    I’m saying a lot of HBD preconceptions who can do or who’s better at what sport is premature.
     
    Of course. And even within one population, there are several types. My point regarding those QBs who have a Slavic background is that they are not just any Slavs, but a very particular type of Northern Slav or Balto-Slav, some call them Wends. 😉 Gronk is a Wend.

    Replies: @silviosilver

  313. @silviosilver
    @LatW

    Who are you talking about? Name some names. Defensive end is hardly known as a common white position, although Nick Bosa ranks among the best today.

    Replies: @LatW, @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    Kevin Greene, Jared Allen. Currently there’s TJ Watt.

    Lyle Alzado, Brian Bosworth were pretty hyped.

    There was an Estonian with freakish athleticism but never made it,

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margus_Hunt

    • Replies: @LatW
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms


    There was an Estonian with freakish athleticism but never made it,

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margus_Hunt
     

    Yea, he was in the NFL. He is 6'8, 277lbs. He started out as a discus thrower (he did well in the junior championships).

    Big and fast white guys are actually not that rare
     
    You're right, not that rare. There are some in ice hockey who are around 190cms and fast.

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

  314. @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @silviosilver

    Kevin Greene, Jared Allen. Currently there's TJ Watt.

    Lyle Alzado, Brian Bosworth were pretty hyped.

    There was an Estonian with freakish athleticism but never made it,

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margus_Hunt

    Replies: @LatW

    There was an Estonian with freakish athleticism but never made it,

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margus_Hunt

    Yea, he was in the NFL. He is 6’8, 277lbs. He started out as a discus thrower (he did well in the junior championships).

    Big and fast white guys are actually not that rare

    You’re right, not that rare. There are some in ice hockey who are around 190cms and fast.

    • Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @LatW

    The biggest ever MMA fighter was actually a Korean, Hong-man Choi, 7'2, 351lbs. But he was lazy and thought can just overpower people.

    Here he is against a normal size Slav who's infinitely more skilled, Fedor, who got him easily with a 十字固め jūji-gatame "cross arm bar", judo technique.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CbIRj2DDK1A

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

  315. Yes, the election was stolen.

    https://roloslavskiy.substack.com/p/voting-doesnt-win-you-elections

    Shouldn’t wignats who scream about dominating the globe have a better answer?

    They seem to hate anyone else doing something about it even more..

  316. @LondonBob
    @Mikel

    Trump was winning comfortably before the voting stopped and voter dumps started, even the NYT election predictor forecast him winning by a comfortable margin, ballot harvesting and mail in fraud aren't obvious, unless you analyse forensically, however dumping a bunch of votes all to one candidate is hardly sophisticated, about as blatant as it gets.

    Replies: @sudden death

    Trump was whining and propagandizing against the mail voting during entire election year, so why is it so surprising that his voters were participating mainly on election day, therefore naturally were absent from mail votes which consequently were absolutely dominantly for Biden then?

    Not even to mention that many Republican voters got quite sick with Covid or even died prior election day due all the trumper floomer propaganda too.

    • Replies: @LondonBob
    @sudden death

    No, prior to the vote dumps mail in votes were relatively evenly split, albeit with a clear margin to Biden.

  317. @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @LatW


    similar robust Nordic or Scottish types

     

    A more common type is NFL centers guards and rugby players, 6'1 to 6'4, shorter arms but benchpresses more.

    https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-2022-offensive-guard-rankings-tiers

    Defensive end in particular requires a very robust, strong physique and tall stature

     

    6'5+ as well as long arms. More common in blacks but some whites actually dominate the position, e.g. JJ Watt

    Big and fast white guys are actually not that rare. If you watch Gronk outrunning and shoving around black DBs he looks like man amongst boys. There was a German dominated the NFL combines but didn't make it because he lacked skills,

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moritz_Böhringer

    Smaller and fast white guys the equivalent of Deion Sanders are rarer.

    I'm saying a lot of HBD preconceptions who can do or who's better at what sport is premature.

    Replies: @LatW

    I’m saying a lot of HBD preconceptions who can do or who’s better at what sport is premature.

    Of course. And even within one population, there are several types. My point regarding those QBs who have a Slavic background is that they are not just any Slavs, but a very particular type of Northern Slav or Balto-Slav, some call them Wends. 😉 Gronk is a Wend.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @LatW


    Gronk is a Wend.
     
    Gronk was a tight end. Tight end has become a very white position in recent years, and all the best tight ends are white. I'm pretty sure most of them aren't slavic.

    @songbird


    Not sure how realistic the prospects of Turkey joining the EU ever were, but I suppose I should thank Erdogan for helping to sabotage the idea.
     
    I'm not sure either, but the very fact the idea was ever floated and that they achieved candidate status is disturbing enough.

    Replies: @songbird

  318. Bipolar world in action:

    The threat of US sanctions on their global operations caused many leading Chinese banks such as ICBC, the New Development Bank and the Asian Infrastructure Investment Bank to withdraw credit and financing from Russia. Chinese energy giants such as Sinochem also suspended all Russian investments and joint ventures. In August, UnionPay – the Chinese equivalent of Visa and Mastercard – also ceased its cooperation with Russian banks, citing sanctions. The material motivation for Beijing’s corporations to pull out of Russia was clear: before the war China did $100 billion in trade with Russia (rising by a projected $30 billion this year thanks to increased oil imports) but more than $1.5 trillion with the US and EU.

    With Biden and Xi’s joint condemnation of the threat of nukes at Bali earlier this month, the so-called ‘track two’ understandings of March have become a ‘track one’ public policy. Thanks to Wang’s shuttle diplomacy, Nato and China have effectively aligned on not escalating the Ukraine-Russia conflict, according to the Chinese source. Over a series of meetings with Nato leadership since early September, Wang pledged to use China’s considerable leverage in Moscow to dissuade Putin from using nukes, while in return Nato has affirmed that they would not provide strategic weapons to Ukraine.

    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-red-line-biden-and-xis-secret-ukraine-talks-revealed/

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @sudden death


    Nato and China have effectively aligned on not escalating the Ukraine-Russia conflict
     
    Indeed, following Chinese demands the US pressured Poland into not supplying Mig-29 to Ukraine.

    Here is an excerpt from cited Spectator article:
    a Nato country providing fighter jets of any kind to Kyiv represented an important symbolic, if not necessarily operationally significant, step towards direct Nato involvement in the conflict. Initially, Washington was positive. But a day later, on 8 March, the Pentagon abruptly reversed its position, pronouncing Poland’s proposal ‘not tenable’.

    Replies: @LondonBob

  319. @sudden death
    Bipolar world in action:

    https://www.spectator.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2022/11/Red-LIne_SE_FORF1.jpg


    The threat of US sanctions on their global operations caused many leading Chinese banks such as ICBC, the New Development Bank and the Asian Infrastructure Investment Bank to withdraw credit and financing from Russia. Chinese energy giants such as Sinochem also suspended all Russian investments and joint ventures. In August, UnionPay – the Chinese equivalent of Visa and Mastercard – also ceased its cooperation with Russian banks, citing sanctions. The material motivation for Beijing’s corporations to pull out of Russia was clear: before the war China did $100 billion in trade with Russia (rising by a projected $30 billion this year thanks to increased oil imports) but more than $1.5 trillion with the US and EU.

    With Biden and Xi’s joint condemnation of the threat of nukes at Bali earlier this month, the so-called ‘track two’ understandings of March have become a ‘track one’ public policy. Thanks to Wang’s shuttle diplomacy, Nato and China have effectively aligned on not escalating the Ukraine-Russia conflict, according to the Chinese source. Over a series of meetings with Nato leadership since early September, Wang pledged to use China’s considerable leverage in Moscow to dissuade Putin from using nukes, while in return Nato has affirmed that they would not provide strategic weapons to Ukraine.
     

    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-red-line-biden-and-xis-secret-ukraine-talks-revealed/

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    Nato and China have effectively aligned on not escalating the Ukraine-Russia conflict

    Indeed, following Chinese demands the US pressured Poland into not supplying Mig-29 to Ukraine.

    Here is an excerpt from cited Spectator article:
    a Nato country providing fighter jets of any kind to Kyiv represented an important symbolic, if not necessarily operationally significant, step towards direct Nato involvement in the conflict. Initially, Washington was positive. But a day later, on 8 March, the Pentagon abruptly reversed its position, pronouncing Poland’s proposal ‘not tenable’.

    • Replies: @LondonBob
    @AnonfromTN

    Why would you believe anything in the Spectator? The nukes disinformation talk should immediately discredit the author.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  320. @Yahya
    @silviosilver


    Are you actually a tango fan?
     
    Not really tbh. I only mentioned Piazolla because he's the first thing that came to mind. In Latin America I only listen to classical music, which is mostly produced by Brazil. Even then I much prefer European classical music, which is obviously deeper and more sophisticated. Still, this piece by an obscure mestiza Brazilian composer is sublime, I find myself listening to it often:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GDfyFrtI7mM&ab_channel=sonhosesons


    Have you seen the 1998 movie Tango by Carlos Saura?
     
    No. I will watch it though and possibly write an opinion in my next round of film reviews if it is interesting.

    Have you watched the 2001 Bosnian comedy No Man's Land? I watched it twice; loved it the first time, but downgraded to an 8/10 the second time due to poor acting and some corny dialogue. But if you haven't seen it yet I'd recommend it. It's fairly even-handed so you need not worry about Serb-bashing or petty nationalism, movie seems to satirize all sides including the UN.


    It could just be that Argentina has always been my favorite Latin American country
     
    Brazil would be mine, I like how chaotic and crazy the country is. Also the relatively large number of Arabs is a plus too :). Though I will always respect Argentina for producing such an interesting writer as Borges (whose non-fiction I much prefer to his fiction; much like Orwell). Latin America in general is an interesting region, though tbh almost every major geographic sphere interests me, except perhaps sub-Saharan Africa due to a lack of high culture, and to a lesser extent Southeast Asia.

    Interesting that you have family in Argentina. Wasn't aware of Balkan migration to that country, or in Latin America more generally. I think only Ukrainians in Brazil are a prominent Slavic group.


    Nowadays, it’s like Arab music to me: I think it’s good, but I can only take so much before it starts sounding samey and wears me out.
     
    I can see where you're coming from, I like and appreciate the artistic skill of some Japanese Koto or Indian Raja practitioners; but I can only listen to so much for a period of time. I'd say though my ability to listen to exotic music has improved considerably over time. Previously I couldn't stand to venture out of my comfort zone; that is Arabic and Western music (the former I felt comfortable with because it's my native tradition, the other because of its ubiquity and consequent familiarity). The key turning point was when I realized that skill in music is universal, and not every piece of music required a piano or violin to be sophisticated. Even if I still struggle to listen to certain musical categories, I appreciate the artistic value of any classical tradition, and rejoice in any composition that doesn't fall under the mechanical, artificial, synthesizer-based "music" category which seems to have taken over every corner of the globe.

    With regards to Arabic music, I bet you've only listened to mainstream Arabic singers and musicians, though i'm curios to know which artists you were referring to. There's a whole world of obscure Arabic singers, orchestras, ensembles and composers who are ten times more skilled than known quantities like Abdel-Halim Hafez, Fairouz, and god forbid Nancy Ajram etc. but you have to search for them hard. One of the key strengths of the Western music ecosystem is that there's a certain level of organization which allows classical composers to remain (semi)prominent long after they die. In the Arab world, no such system exists so talented composers get lost in a deep void, though some pieces in the repertoire do live on.

    Anyway, recommending music is a fool's errand since musical tastes differ so much. But I can't help but make just a few (if you are interested in a more comprehensive list, see my reply to Dmitry here: https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-194/#comment-5497541)

    1) Ask El-Atash (اسق العطاش)

    This is a Sufi Muwashshah (a multi-lined strophic verse poem written in classical Arabic) called “Ask El-Atash” (اسق العطاش) or alternatively “Hayamatni” (هيمتني), which originated in Aleppo, Syria in the year 1190 in the Islamic calendar, or 1776 AD in the Gregorian calendar. In that year the rain was scarce and the people of Aleppo started praying for Allah (صلاة ودعاء الإستسقاء) to bring them rain.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A-M09-6hcvs&t=132s&ab_channel=OrninaSyrianOrchestra%D8%A3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%83%D8%B3%D8%AA%D8%B1%D8%A7%D8%A3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%86%D9%8A%D9%86%D8%A7%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%B3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%8A%D8%A9

    The above link is my favorite rendition of that song by Rasha Rizk and the Ornina Syrian Orchestra. But there's 5-6 more renditions on YouTube, though usually abridged. Two good ones include:

    Sabah Fakhry (Syrian): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eI0Gs2l21D0&t=1065s&ab_channel=AliAdiga%F0%9F%87%B8%F0%9F%87%BE%F0%9F%87%B8%F0%9F%87%BE

    Lubna Al-Quntar (Syrian): (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JWjYXYYIZ24&ab_channel=OrninaSyrianOrchestra%D8%A3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%83%D8%B3%D8%AA%D8%B1%D8%A7%D8%A3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%86%D9%8A%D9%86%D8%A7%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%B3%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%8A%D8%A9)

    I gave the others in this post here: https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-194/#comment-5500139

    2) Ya Msafer Wahdak (يا مسافر وحدك)

    This is an Egyptian classical song, composed by the prolific Muhammad Abdel-Wahab, and arranged here by a talented Palestinian from Nazareth (a surprisingly artistic town), Nizar Al-Khater (highly recommend checking out his other works).

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QdOcTFX6vm0&list=RDQdOcTFX6vm0&start_radio=1&ab_channel=TheGaryBertiniIsraeliChoir%7C%D7%9E%D7%A7%D7%94%D7%9C%D7%AA%D7%91%D7%A8%D7%AA%D7%99%D7%A0%D7%99

    The choir is Israeli, looks to be primarily Ashkenazim, and the lead vocalist is a Lebanese Christian, Marie Jubran. So here you have a song composed by a Muslim, performed by Jews, and sung by a Christian. Whoever said the sons of Abraham can't get along with each other?

    3) Ahla Wa Sahla (أهلا وسهلا)

    Arabic music typically has an accurate reputation for sounding strange, depressing and melancholic. But that's because most people only listen to Arabic music from the Middle Eastern portion of the Arab world. In the Maghreb where people are more jovial, the music is much more upbeat (major scale in musicspeak). This is my favorite song from the bonhomie Algerian Jewish maestro Maurice El-Medioni:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lb2EyWjImXw&ab_channel=OLAMALE1

    On a technical level, he's probably not the best Maghrebi composer, but I love his melodies, they rarely fail to captivate me. If you like his style I recommend listening to the other Big 3 of Algerian Classical Music: Mustapha Skandarani, Mohamed Iguerbouchen, Mohammed Weld El Kourd. Anouar Brahem from Tunisia is also top-notch, though his style is different from the former composers.

    4) En Rah Minak Ya Ein (ان راح منك يا عين)

    This is a song from the Golden Age of Egyptian Cinema, originally composed for Shadia. Sounds similar to a Tango, but the Arabic elements predominate. There's a piano in there which is quite rare for a classical Egyptian songs.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iSgvZ4GhB40&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=6&ab_channel=%D9%86%D9%88%D8%A7%D8%AF%D8%B1%D9%88%D8%B1%D9%88%D8%A7%D8%A6%D8%B9%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%B1%D8%A7%D8%A6%D8%B9%D8%A9%D8%B4%D8%A7%D8%AF%D9%8A%D8%A9

    There's some nice modernized renditions by a couple of Levantine singer:

    Lara Elayyan (Jordanian): (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vVgtSgwYx80&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=146&ab_channel=%D9%84%D8%A7%D8%B1%D8%A7%D8%B9%D9%84%D9%8A%D8%A7%D9%86LaraElayyan)

    Nano Reis (Syrian): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o09k-jihU_E&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=145&ab_channel=mathfun2002

    The instrumentalists in the background of the last video are top-quality composers in their own right: Bassem Saba (Lebanese) and Simon Shaheen (Palestinian Christian). Recommend checking out their work too if you like this style.

    5) Palestinian Folklore

    A compilation of folklore by Nazerene folk singer Dalal Abu Amneh, who could very well have Balkan ancestry as indicated by her blonde hair and blue eyes. She utilizes a melismatic singing style common to traditional Arabic music (and also Celtic music); which can often times feel kitschy if done wrong but here is well executed:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jKACz8iX2mk&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=184&ab_channel=DalalAbuAmneh-%D8%AF%D9%84%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%A3%D8%A8%D9%88%D8%A2%D9%85%D9%86%D8%A9

    Let me know if you like any of these.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @silviosilver

    Have you watched the 2001 Bosnian comedy No Man’s Land?

    To answer this question: I thought I had because the name sounded familiar, but it turns out, no, I haven’t. I’ll give it a go.

    Wasn’t aware of Balkan migration to that country, or in Latin America more generally. I think only Ukrainians in Brazil are a prominent Slavic group.

    I wasn’t aware either until about a decade ago. From the balkans, most of it is Croatian. There’s apparently more Croats in Chile than in Australia, and there’s certainly more than a few here.

    Quite a few Levantines in Argentina too, known locally as “turcos”, because they arrived when it was still the Ottoman empire. One of them, Carlos Menem, became president.

    There’s about as many Poles in Brazil as Ukrainians btw. If you search for “igreja ortodoxa” in southern Brazilians cities and then click on the pics on the ones that come up, then judging by the congregations, they’re not going to remain recognizably Ukrainian for much longer.

    I’d say though my ability to listen to exotic music has improved considerably over time.

    Bossa nova used to sound exotic and weird – or just plain crap – to me when I first heard it. For one reason or another I went back it a few times and eventually developed a liking for it. I think it’s great now. I’ve listened to all the classics and know the lyrics of about half a dozen by heart. (I can read Portuguese decently [non-fiction, anyway], but only understand maybe 5%-10% of some songs from listening, depending on the singer’s diction. If I like a song, my habit is to look up the lyrics and use that as a way to increase my vocabulary.)

    With regards to Arabic music, I bet you’ve only listened to mainstream Arabic singers and musicians, though i’m curios to know which artists you were referring to.

    I don’t know how mainstream they are, though I recognized the name Nancy Ajram that you mentioned. I just did some youtube searching for arabic music, from which I learned there was a talent show called Arab Idol, so I mainly listened to the selections with the most views, figuring they were probably the best (or at least best known) songs. The titles were in Arabic so I don’t know the songs’ names.

    Let me know if you like any of these.

    I couldn’t really get into them, tbh. Some of them took like three minutes for the vocals to begin. I just don’t have that kind of patience, lol. I prefer the ones I heard in the Arab Idol list, of which I probably max out at three songs in a row. Something like flamenco, which is another style I’m impressed by, but which also quickly exhausts me, I could probably take, say, 5 songs in a row max. And not a chance I could listen to any of those on repeat. In comparison, pop music in English, Serbo-Cro, Spanish or Portuguese, I can listen to for two or three hours straight, and if I like a song, I can easily listen to it ten or twenty times in a row.

    • Replies: @YetAnotherAnon
    @silviosilver

    I really like old Colombian music. This selection is from the very late 50s/early 60s.

    https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_lA2nCRtVeIPxKCnaND9fa_pwISgBu7o-Y

    Replies: @silviosilver

  321. @Beckow
    @showmethereal


    ...how quickly Mariupol is being rebuilt
     
    The active rebuilding says it all: Russia plans to win and stay. They wouldn't do it if they were tentative. US never invested in rebuilding Iraq - they knew the score, they knew it was not winnable. Or later in Libya and Syrian regions it controlled...

    A nuclear super-power has signaled in every possible way that it is in the war to win. Nato decided to make it as painful and bloody as possible hoping for an internal collapse in Russia. You don't have to be a genius to figure out how this will play out: after lots of blood Russia will get what it wants. Kiev will become a defeated backwater with most of the population gone or about to leave.

    West will forever claim that they prevented Russia from reaching their maximum goals: if Russia takes Odessa, they will say 'but look, they don't have Kiev or Lviv'. If Russia takes Galicia, they will say "but we kept them from getting Poland!"...etc...who is the winner? The country that won on the ground or people who can't think straight and live in silly self-delusions and by lying?

    Replies: @showmethereal

    Correct. Though Iraq and Libya and Syria couldn’t be rebuilt by Americans because they weren’t wanted. Contrary to what the western media was saying – the vast majority of Mariupol people WANT Russia. I can remember seeing video way back in 2014 where the people were marching with Russian flags (some even with Soviet ones) and how Ukraine sent armored cars in there.

  322. @AnonfromTN
    @showmethereal


    It is impressive what they were able to do in Crimea.
     

    Russia has more civil industry resources than I thought previously.
     
    Yes, but there is downside: Russia spent a lot of resources in Crimea, and now is and will be spending even more rebuilding Donbass. I saw a lot of construction going on in and near Lugansk with my own eyes in October. Crimea left the madhouse and joined Russia w/o a single shot fired. While the industry there, like in the rest of Ukraine, was obsolete (mostly Soviet-built before 1991 and exploited into the ground by greedy oligarchs) and needed massive investment to bring it to the current Russian level, at least residential housing remained serviceable. A lot of housing in Donbass, not only in Mariupol, was heavily damaged, and needs to be rebuilt. Plus, there are almost twice as many residents in Donbass as in Crimea.

    Watching Putin’s actions (while having no inside info), I suspect that one of the problems he and his team are trying to solve is how to reformat Ukraine w/o taking on 25 million freeloaders. After all, huge numbers of parasites broke the economic back of the USSR. He does not want this to happen to the RF. I cannot think of a viable solution, but I hope they can.

    Replies: @showmethereal

    That was actually going to be my question… who is financing the reconstruction? Is it local or from “Moscow”? I was also under the impression that the Sea of Azov was very important from an industrial point of view.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @showmethereal


    That was actually going to be my question… who is financing the reconstruction? Is it local or from “Moscow”? I was also under the impression that the Sea of Azov was very important from an industrial point of view.
     
    To the best of my knowledge (which is not comprehensive), Russia is paying for almost everything. Considering the ravages of Ukie occupation since 2014-15 and further destruction in the current war, Donbass might break even in maybe 10 years and become profitable after that. Economic potential of the sea of Azov will come into play when local production picks up. For many years Donbass will need massive investment from the outside, not just of money, but of construction materials and numerous other products.

    That is not to say that they don’t produce anything. E.g., in Lugansk they make local dry sausage (not salami, Russian/German style dry sausage) that quality-wise can compete with the best produced anywhere in the world. The same is true for equivalent of prosciutto crudo made in Lugansk. It was like that even in Soviet times. Lugansk sausage and high-end meat products were and still are among the best (I say it having tried high quality meats in >20 countries). They make quite a few other things in Donbass that are competitive, but overall production is much lower than needed to finance required massive reconstruction.

    I think Donbass will succeed because most people there have the right attitude. In contrast to many people in Ukraine, who for some inexplicable reason think that everybody owes them, the people I talked to in Lugansk believe that Russia does not owe them anything. They are grateful for the liberation, but see additional help as good will, rather than something due. People solve their problems only when they are ready to do it themselves. Habitual freeloaders are doomed to have shithole for a country.

    Replies: @Beckow, @showmethereal

  323. @Thulean Friend
    The clownshow at the Qatar World Cup just keeps giving. Now the Belgian foreign minister confronts the FIFA president, outraged over them banning the pro-LGBT armbands.

    https://i.imgur.com/pdPg7Fc.png

    Meanwhile the German team got thrashed by the Japanese(!) after making a huge performative political stink before the game. Karma.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @Yahya, @showmethereal

    Honestly though – if the western media didn’t focus on such folly nobody would care. In non western nations nobody cares about that garbage… they just want to watch the games. Qatar absolutely doesn’t care either – lol

  324. @showmethereal
    @AnonfromTN

    That was actually going to be my question… who is financing the reconstruction? Is it local or from “Moscow”? I was also under the impression that the Sea of Azov was very important from an industrial point of view.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    That was actually going to be my question… who is financing the reconstruction? Is it local or from “Moscow”? I was also under the impression that the Sea of Azov was very important from an industrial point of view.

    To the best of my knowledge (which is not comprehensive), Russia is paying for almost everything. Considering the ravages of Ukie occupation since 2014-15 and further destruction in the current war, Donbass might break even in maybe 10 years and become profitable after that. Economic potential of the sea of Azov will come into play when local production picks up. For many years Donbass will need massive investment from the outside, not just of money, but of construction materials and numerous other products.

    That is not to say that they don’t produce anything. E.g., in Lugansk they make local dry sausage (not salami, Russian/German style dry sausage) that quality-wise can compete with the best produced anywhere in the world. The same is true for equivalent of prosciutto crudo made in Lugansk. It was like that even in Soviet times. Lugansk sausage and high-end meat products were and still are among the best (I say it having tried high quality meats in >20 countries). They make quite a few other things in Donbass that are competitive, but overall production is much lower than needed to finance required massive reconstruction.

    I think Donbass will succeed because most people there have the right attitude. In contrast to many people in Ukraine, who for some inexplicable reason think that everybody owes them, the people I talked to in Lugansk believe that Russia does not owe them anything. They are grateful for the liberation, but see additional help as good will, rather than something due. People solve their problems only when they are ready to do it themselves. Habitual freeloaders are doomed to have shithole for a country.

    • Thanks: showmethereal
    • Replies: @Beckow
    @AnonfromTN

    This is a civilizational war, flags and dry sausages are of no importance. The war is to decide who lives and who goes, what stories are told. It started much smaller, but the gradual escalation (by both sides) got us to the point of no return. Whoever gets Donbas or the Black Sea coast - and other lands - will take it as-is, even as desert with nothing standing. The calculations and who pays for what have been thrown out between February and October.

    Kiev and West are more committed to the total existential struggle because they are weaker on the ground. Russia is still acting tentative, counting marbles, implicitly offering compromises; Russia hasn't saddled up yet. West has still not processed a very simple strategic reality: Russia cannot afford to lose and is in a position to win. So they are poking the bear and giggling like idiots thinking that it is all about the poking - it is not going to end well.

    Replies: @German_reader, @AnonfromTN

    , @showmethereal
    @AnonfromTN

    Thanks. Interesting note about the attitude of the people. From what I have seen of Crimea the people don’t even consider it liberation …. They seem to be more like “we were always Russia anyway”

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  325. @Sher Singh
    @songbird

    Why should I hate trudeau?

    Classical liberalism is about internalizing public opinion & reducing harm.
    He does that admirably, and is a good representation of White culture.

    As a White Nationalist, I can bear no ill will against justeen Trudeau.

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਿਹ

    Replies: @Jatt Aryaa

    • Replies: @Barbarossa
    @Jatt Aryaa

    I'm not surprised. Hopefully it gets some hard pushback, but it doesn't seem like Canada has much gumption that way.

    As an aside from the article. I didn't know the SKS was so popular with Canadian sportsman. I've always liked mine and thought it is an underrated gun. Cheap to buy and cheap to shoot, though I recently saw that non-reloadable Russian made ammo is now double what it was several years ago when I bought a bunch.

  326. @sudden death
    @LondonBob

    Trump was whining and propagandizing against the mail voting during entire election year, so why is it so surprising that his voters were participating mainly on election day, therefore naturally were absent from mail votes which consequently were absolutely dominantly for Biden then?

    Not even to mention that many Republican voters got quite sick with Covid or even died prior election day due all the trumper floomer propaganda too.

    Replies: @LondonBob

    No, prior to the vote dumps mail in votes were relatively evenly split, albeit with a clear margin to Biden.

  327. @AnonfromTN
    @sudden death


    Nato and China have effectively aligned on not escalating the Ukraine-Russia conflict
     
    Indeed, following Chinese demands the US pressured Poland into not supplying Mig-29 to Ukraine.

    Here is an excerpt from cited Spectator article:
    a Nato country providing fighter jets of any kind to Kyiv represented an important symbolic, if not necessarily operationally significant, step towards direct Nato involvement in the conflict. Initially, Washington was positive. But a day later, on 8 March, the Pentagon abruptly reversed its position, pronouncing Poland’s proposal ‘not tenable’.

    Replies: @LondonBob

    Why would you believe anything in the Spectator? The nukes disinformation talk should immediately discredit the author.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @LondonBob


    Why would you believe anything in the Spectator? The nukes disinformation talk should immediately discredit the author.
     
    I don’t. Frankly, I do not blindly believe anything from any source. I use the method I learned back in the USSR: compare what you get from different sources and dismiss everything that serves the source’s purposes. Things reported reluctantly (which are against the narrative the source promotes) have a good chance of being true. Glib tales supporting the promoted narrative are virtually certain to be lies. I look at it as a biologist: nature gave us two eyes because you cannot adequately see the reality from just one point of view.

    As to discrediting that particular author, it’s just a small detail. For years Western media discredited itself totally, spreading obvious lies and blatant lies (e.g., a zillion hospitals in Aleppo, all of which disappeared the day Islamist bandits were kicked out; scary tales about covid, which immediately disappeared when Putin started the operation in Ukraine; glorious victories of Ukie army, even though the war keeps going on the territory Ukraine considers its own; etc.). Orwell was prescient, most “reports” by Western media are comrade Ogilvy-style stories. Discrediting a single liar in the source that is devoted to lying does not matter much.

    Replies: @LatW

  328. @silviosilver
    @Yahya


    Have you watched the 2001 Bosnian comedy No Man’s Land?
     
    To answer this question: I thought I had because the name sounded familiar, but it turns out, no, I haven't. I'll give it a go.

    Wasn’t aware of Balkan migration to that country, or in Latin America more generally. I think only Ukrainians in Brazil are a prominent Slavic group.
     
    I wasn't aware either until about a decade ago. From the balkans, most of it is Croatian. There's apparently more Croats in Chile than in Australia, and there's certainly more than a few here.

    Quite a few Levantines in Argentina too, known locally as "turcos", because they arrived when it was still the Ottoman empire. One of them, Carlos Menem, became president.

    There's about as many Poles in Brazil as Ukrainians btw. If you search for "igreja ortodoxa" in southern Brazilians cities and then click on the pics on the ones that come up, then judging by the congregations, they're not going to remain recognizably Ukrainian for much longer.

    I’d say though my ability to listen to exotic music has improved considerably over time.
     
    Bossa nova used to sound exotic and weird - or just plain crap - to me when I first heard it. For one reason or another I went back it a few times and eventually developed a liking for it. I think it's great now. I've listened to all the classics and know the lyrics of about half a dozen by heart. (I can read Portuguese decently [non-fiction, anyway], but only understand maybe 5%-10% of some songs from listening, depending on the singer's diction. If I like a song, my habit is to look up the lyrics and use that as a way to increase my vocabulary.)

    With regards to Arabic music, I bet you’ve only listened to mainstream Arabic singers and musicians, though i’m curios to know which artists you were referring to.
     
    I don't know how mainstream they are, though I recognized the name Nancy Ajram that you mentioned. I just did some youtube searching for arabic music, from which I learned there was a talent show called Arab Idol, so I mainly listened to the selections with the most views, figuring they were probably the best (or at least best known) songs. The titles were in Arabic so I don't know the songs' names.

    Let me know if you like any of these.
     
    I couldn't really get into them, tbh. Some of them took like three minutes for the vocals to begin. I just don't have that kind of patience, lol. I prefer the ones I heard in the Arab Idol list, of which I probably max out at three songs in a row. Something like flamenco, which is another style I'm impressed by, but which also quickly exhausts me, I could probably take, say, 5 songs in a row max. And not a chance I could listen to any of those on repeat. In comparison, pop music in English, Serbo-Cro, Spanish or Portuguese, I can listen to for two or three hours straight, and if I like a song, I can easily listen to it ten or twenty times in a row.

    Replies: @YetAnotherAnon

    I really like old Colombian music. This selection is from the very late 50s/early 60s.

    https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_lA2nCRtVeIPxKCnaND9fa_pwISgBu7o-Y

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @YetAnotherAnon

    Thanks. Some of those are quite catchy, but probably not something I would return to again. I like a lot of 50s stuff from Cuba and Puerto Rico, as popularized by the "Buena Vista Social Club" album that came out about 20 years ago. Before that, my introduction to latino music was a televised concert "Canciones de mi padre" by Linda Rondstat, in which she sang a number of classic mariachi songs. I thought it was fantastic from the first listening.

  329. So it appears that Turkey is now following the Egyptian strategy of knocking on Gulf Arab states with a tin cup in hand every time a currency-induced economic crisis hits them.

    Turkey and Qatar are in the final stages of talks for Doha to provide up to $10 billion in funding for Ankara, including up to $3 billion by the end of this year, two senior Turkish officials and one other source told Reuters.

    With Western countries balking at investments in Turkey, Ankara has turned to “friendly” countries for foreign resources to backstop its policy of supporting the lira currency by balancing the economy’s supply and demand for forex.

    Turkey is also in the final stage of talks with Saudi Arabia on Riyadh placing a $5 billion deposit at the Turkish Central Bank, a Saudi finance ministry spokesman said on Tuesday. Turkey’s central bank has declined to comment on the matter.

    https://english.alarabiya.net/News/gulf/2022/11/25/Turkey-in-final-stage-talks-for-up-to-10-billion-funding-from-Qatar-Report

    Gulf Arab states have been fairly generous with Egypt in the past, though much of it out of ethnic solidarity. Apart from Qatar, i’m surprised to see them lending a hand to Turkey, which ever since Erdogan took over has had acrimonious relations with the Gulf monarchies. Erdogan though has been mending fences with the Arab rulers over the past few years, including with Egypt’s Sisi just a few days ago. His strategy appears to be paying off.

  330. @Yahya
    @AnonfromTN

    Lol if the Belgian minister thinks the Muslim Brotherhood in Qatar will give in to the gay lobby. The Western obsession with promoting LGBT rights is sort of a parody at this point.

    Replies: @Coconuts

    In the West Feminism-Muslim-LGBTQIA+ is a kind of natural alliance. Don’t know how far Intersectionality has spread in Belgium but it’s not 100% surprising to see ethnic minority women promoting these beliefs.

  331. @showmethereal
    @Coconuts

    You have a good point. And that is another good reason as to why Russia would not be open to mass migration. There is no reason to migrate somewhere if you can’t eventually “get the vote”. But those guys are being facetious. They see the flaws in the system for those who are proponents of western nationalism. On the flip side Russia - nor China - are the ones who colonized African nations. So they don’t speak Russian nor Chinese. They speak French and Belgian and English etc.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Coconuts

    On the flip side Russia – nor China – are the ones who colonized African nations. So they don’t speak Russian nor Chinese. They speak French and Belgian and English etc.

    Very few in Africa and the Middle East must speak German or Italian as legacies of colonialism (maybe there are a few who speak Italian in Eritrea), and more or less no one Dutch, Irish, Danish, Swedish or Norwegian. But all these countries have similar patterns of immigration from Africa and MENA.

    Appeals to colonialism, as if this immigration was somehow retribution or reparations for colonialism and imperialism seems more like a rationalisation of something with other causes. If it was about reparations Belgium would take only Congolese, Netherlands only Indonesians and a few from the Carribean, Germany from Tanganyika, Italy from Eritrea, Somalia etc. But this is not what is seen in Europe.

    Even the countries that take a large number of immigrants from their former colonies like Spain, France, Britain also take a lot of people not from their former empires.

    I guess the point Beckow was making about settlers was about the relative productivity and level of development of North America and Australia when the British started to occupy them, and the level of productivity and development of Europe when Africans and others arrive now.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Coconuts

    The more pertinent point is that settlers founded those countries. If it hadn't been for British founders, then America, Canada, Australia would never have happened. Or if someone else had settled there - and someone else eventually certainly would have, given the natives' low developmental level and thus inability to resist - they would have founded very, very different countries. Nowadays, of course, it's all the rage to refer to the aboriginals as "First Nations," as if the average abo had the slightest conception of living "in Australia." (So wtf were they really "first" at?)

    If we remember that the native tribes were happily slaughtering each other and "stealing" each others lands since time imemorial, the great irony is that one actually has to be a racist to claim slaughtering and stealing was only illegitimate when a white tribe (the Brits) joined the fray. The best thing for the Brits to have told prospective non-British entrants is: sorry - founders, keepers.

    "B-b-b-but silvio don't you get it, your own grandparents would have been barred by your rules!!" Yeah, they would have, so what? The important thing right now is to draw the correct the lesson from their mistakes - mistakes which I obviously admit have benefited from - not to repeat them or compound them with self-serving stories about how, since we were allowed in, so must the rest of the world be, ad infinitum.


    Don’t know how far Intersectionality has spread in Belgium but it’s not 100% surprising to see ethnic minority women promoting these beliefs.
     
    It's not remotely surprising. Promoting those causes help keep the "nativists" at bay. It's all of a piece with "anti-racism" (aka white demotion and dispossession).

    Replies: @Sher Singh

    , @showmethereal
    @Coconuts

    Yeah productivity is true. But the natives looked at the white invaders the same way. They didn’t care about productivity. Aside from the fact Australia was literally a place for the Brits to get rid of undesirables. In North America - what is left of the native tribes still protest and wish whites would leave their ancestral lands. They don’t care about productivity.

    As to Europe - again most don’t feel sorry. They collectively competed in imperialism- so they collectively absorb. Italy and Spain are the closest across the Med. The destruction of Libya is what unleashed the latest torrent. That was a NATO operation. Well if they share “defense” well hey they all have to share in the fruits of their destabilization. Why Germany chose to accept so many after the Syrian and Iraqi destabilizing I don’t know. But again they are a NATO country. NATO countries follow the U.S. so hey - that’s what happens. For every action there is a reaction. All the Arab Spring psyop is all part of it. NATO has blood on its hands and dirt on its clothes. All those actions hastened the migrant crisis

    Replies: @German_reader, @Coconuts

  332. @YetAnotherAnon
    @silviosilver

    I really like old Colombian music. This selection is from the very late 50s/early 60s.

    https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_lA2nCRtVeIPxKCnaND9fa_pwISgBu7o-Y

    Replies: @silviosilver

    Thanks. Some of those are quite catchy, but probably not something I would return to again. I like a lot of 50s stuff from Cuba and Puerto Rico, as popularized by the “Buena Vista Social Club” album that came out about 20 years ago. Before that, my introduction to latino music was a televised concert “Canciones de mi padre” by Linda Rondstat, in which she sang a number of classic mariachi songs. I thought it was fantastic from the first listening.

  333. @Coconuts
    @showmethereal


    On the flip side Russia – nor China – are the ones who colonized African nations. So they don’t speak Russian nor Chinese. They speak French and Belgian and English etc.
     
    Very few in Africa and the Middle East must speak German or Italian as legacies of colonialism (maybe there are a few who speak Italian in Eritrea), and more or less no one Dutch, Irish, Danish, Swedish or Norwegian. But all these countries have similar patterns of immigration from Africa and MENA.

    Appeals to colonialism, as if this immigration was somehow retribution or reparations for colonialism and imperialism seems more like a rationalisation of something with other causes. If it was about reparations Belgium would take only Congolese, Netherlands only Indonesians and a few from the Carribean, Germany from Tanganyika, Italy from Eritrea, Somalia etc. But this is not what is seen in Europe.

    Even the countries that take a large number of immigrants from their former colonies like Spain, France, Britain also take a lot of people not from their former empires.

    I guess the point Beckow was making about settlers was about the relative productivity and level of development of North America and Australia when the British started to occupy them, and the level of productivity and development of Europe when Africans and others arrive now.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @showmethereal

    The more pertinent point is that settlers founded those countries. If it hadn’t been for British founders, then America, Canada, Australia would never have happened. Or if someone else had settled there – and someone else eventually certainly would have, given the natives’ low developmental level and thus inability to resist – they would have founded very, very different countries. Nowadays, of course, it’s all the rage to refer to the aboriginals as “First Nations,” as if the average abo had the slightest conception of living “in Australia.” (So wtf were they really “first” at?)

    If we remember that the native tribes were happily slaughtering each other and “stealing” each others lands since time imemorial, the great irony is that one actually has to be a racist to claim slaughtering and stealing was only illegitimate when a white tribe (the Brits) joined the fray. The best thing for the Brits to have told prospective non-British entrants is: sorry – founders, keepers.

    “B-b-b-but silvio don’t you get it, your own grandparents would have been barred by your rules!!” Yeah, they would have, so what? The important thing right now is to draw the correct the lesson from their mistakes – mistakes which I obviously admit have benefited from – not to repeat them or compound them with self-serving stories about how, since we were allowed in, so must the rest of the world be, ad infinitum.

    Don’t know how far Intersectionality has spread in Belgium but it’s not 100% surprising to see ethnic minority women promoting these beliefs.

    It’s not remotely surprising. Promoting those causes help keep the “nativists” at bay. It’s all of a piece with “anti-racism” (aka white demotion and dispossession).

    • Thanks: S
    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @silviosilver

    Ultimately, people care about what they have an interest in.
    I care about White Christian survival due to concubines.

    Euro Pagans due to their being cousins. Why does a Slav care for Turks or Anglos?
    If it's just crass consumerism & a respect for modern amenities - that's a dead end.

    Replies: @Coconuts, @silviosilver

  334. The deep fried turkeys were successful. It turned out that getting two smaller birds was much easier than obtaining one that was just the right size. This also eliminated the overflow risk as much less oil was required. One was a bit over done, but not bad for a first effort.

    Open Thread Humor

    Open [MORE] for the rest.

    ==================================
    🦃🍗🥧 HAPPY THANKSGIVING 🦃🍗🥧
    ==================================

    Dining table picture

     

     

    First world problems… FOOD COMA

     

     

    [MORE]

    For Barbarossa

     

    ______________

     

     

     

     

     
    –And– Thanksgiving is not complete without the WKRP Turkey Drop.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @A123

    In high school, used to know a football player who hit someone with big frozen turkey at the turkey toss.

    During the Great Depression, they used to throw a live bird from the top of a building. People would fight over it, sometimes ripping parts off.

  335. @Thulean Friend
    @songbird

    I think Erdogan is going to get crushed in the next elections but I must say I've come to like him as time has gone on. He has shown remarkable resilience and geopolitical independence despite Turkey being in such a precarious position. Much stronger European countries show far less spine.

    Replies: @songbird

    I would say I am somewhat neutral on Erdogan. I really don’t care about him turning the Hagia Sophia back into a mosque (not like there are many Christians in Turkey). I may be opposed to military adventurism, using migrants as weapons, and inflation, but those seen like common sins. My main disagreement with him is that he seems to be trying to take away the joy of English-speaking schoolkids regarding the bird/country pun.

    Don’t know how legit this map of Chinese search terms is, but I think it is interesting how Turkey is seen as “opposes China”, while Poland is perceived as “hates China.”

    [MORE]
    https://twitter.com/whyvert/status/1595933987838758912?s=20&t=ILMDjqMEicY37_pMevfLEw

    Certain other parts of it puzzle me, such as Belgians being called “red devils” (does this have to do with promoting an anti-Euro narrative in Africa?) and Bulgarians having “milk-induced longevity” (thought they were fairly lactose-intolerant?)

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @songbird


    Certain other parts of it puzzle me, such as Belgians being called “red devils”

     

    It's the name of the Belgian national football team:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belgium_national_football_team
    , @silviosilver
    @songbird


    I really don’t care about him turning the Hagia Sophia back into a mosque (not like there are many Christians in Turkey).
     
    I don't care either, but you should still use it against him to highlight how culturally antagonistic, how uninterested in pluralism, how "unwestern" he is. Even elite eurocucks seem to have come to their senses about Turkey, but it doesn't hurt to keep the pressure on in case they get any big ideas about EU membership anew. Warding off cuckery requires eternal vigilance.

    Replies: @songbird

    , @AnonfromTN
    @songbird


    I would say I am somewhat neutral on Erdogan. I really don’t care about him turning the Hagia Sophia back into a mosque
     
    Turning Sophia into a mosque is not important in and of itself. It is only important as a clear sign of sultan’s stupidity: there is huge Blue Mosque across the square, so they did not need another one in this location.

    Other signs of his stupidity and megalomania are plentiful. Let me just point out new Istanbul airport. Clearly oodles of money were spent, it is huge. Yet it is extremely uncomfortable: gates are very far from each other, so you walk for miles to get to your gate; huge spaces are empty, essentially wasted, but there are very few chairs (people sitting on the floor are an indication); there are very few places where you can eat, which are all crowded as the result, but there is a profusion of duty-free shops without customers, etc.

    His military adventures show the same combination of stupidity and megalomania. Turkey does not have resources to make even half of these successful.

    Yet everything depends who you compare him to. If you compare him to today’s European and US “leaders”, he looks remarkably sane and smart.
  336. @A123
    The deep fried turkeys were successful. It turned out that getting two smaller birds was much easier than obtaining one that was just the right size. This also eliminated the overflow risk as much less oil was required. One was a bit over done, but not bad for a first effort.

     

    Open Thread Humor

    Open [MORE] for the rest.

    ==================================
    🦃🍗🥧 HAPPY THANKSGIVING 🦃🍗🥧
    ==================================


    Dining table picture

     
    https://ace.mu.nu/archives/Pepe%20Thanksgiving.jpg
     

    First world problems... FOOD COMA

     
    https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEggTI51DkmkO9qVZyctpnLtXLRkou7nEh8s1fkng15vYNIbhJllsOcTyU3L3iJEfdoEJdVLToLoHX5Nmewfeb1p2XiDtseEkPm9rJiKI6uc-RghofzIIjEUp0oQv84Tx80LBZqTTiladcoi0Q4vtG1WnnaUDYcC3WpYx0Tofe__RB3dIf-TeczO472t/s384/daily_gifdump_4212_13.gif
     



    For Barbarossa

     
    https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEhZAXduqgx8Fc01Jaa-Urm_NIigNqhLHes8hsWa2tUfNgT4ENdGuonEDpxVSvmUJz_Tmm-SesA88vnhcmZKjdoxFaW5G3JFLUF3JGeIg-wSfMi_MNQCYSrwfZ47ufmAXSeVXJM7El_tHBZvTNzzSNGySb_ngbFzrSkWZmi4AxpW2-p2fgFGJ7hpuOmT/s469/daily_gifdump_4209_34.gif

    ______________


     
    https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEhzbrIx4479ex_kml0f63DbijI06Xvy5JGGjAmIApZgWqYC0LCvSbjF7S6EuQ21wOAOv4rtzyC3b9zmKq_rfswsF5byD5EaQu1XrvirMBU2frK_QIV-_-k9Xa4aPlRkAU-TK0b4C2hepv8nkC2n5lPCg_z4qwhFZewhETA0gKLg1jlkg2LgGiPySGd22Q/s720/611.jpeg

     
    https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEjXO5NfgHEsbonhPP2Nx1I21olxt8_qSpurC_Gh_FQ1_ngILNdg14PaZ_JXw-w0tCUcc04W9uaJ9dsVD5Ch3BVAkJfu8g5XqQY-7HvCk1U-xQEFGQTuNwwb8nLFD7soEZhLXJ307hEZQ869fJwFtB95aFLJ4sqYO-2tYo-4xO1BensmQj_whfW6PjWg/s440/daily_gifdump_4199_46.gif

     
    https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEj5K1XTifI7FtXIU-owPIv5RZEq8S_ajG8AOXUqL3v47y6SnIZNBgytrvRn1qubdcb6jNefTuZvx9bZpYwNUlezmhNzo25p8GqE8LcdJDJdB23mf_fkCA9lJYGBwna10yyAXq8PUVqoykJNEH-TaKti4dHTFZ0jLtguEYLtzxTfNJQTg-eQ9gfYR4xe/s526/1.png

     
    https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEgPnOE0LeC-bVIEMQpdcnV8ndB5ABrtJsGvRSh5nhyHxgcYYxNoyM_vJ0mGHn1PMKTAOzxBWQWYHQhAo_frP2m3gcSci95qZ6GiOMeo1msDe_h7-jprxZaiDPvP0miVRbFEpiY1rapOGsQsjE6S-9LUdaAg80sLl2MNxZ52LgIADeSnh-lJ0kaKfqpikw/s675/90milesed938e61b88b345aa3d79d16b0886a20_ff993053_540.jpg

     
    --And-- Thanksgiving is not complete without the WKRP Turkey Drop.

    https://youtu.be/APGe2l_6utI

    Replies: @songbird

    In high school, used to know a football player who hit someone with big frozen turkey at the turkey toss.

    During the Great Depression, they used to throw a live bird from the top of a building. People would fight over it, sometimes ripping parts off.

  337. @songbird
    @Thulean Friend

    I would say I am somewhat neutral on Erdogan. I really don't care about him turning the Hagia Sophia back into a mosque (not like there are many Christians in Turkey). I may be opposed to military adventurism, using migrants as weapons, and inflation, but those seen like common sins. My main disagreement with him is that he seems to be trying to take away the joy of English-speaking schoolkids regarding the bird/country pun.

    Don't know how legit this map of Chinese search terms is, but I think it is interesting how Turkey is seen as "opposes China", while Poland is perceived as "hates China."https://twitter.com/whyvert/status/1595933987838758912?s=20&t=ILMDjqMEicY37_pMevfLEw


    Certain other parts of it puzzle me, such as Belgians being called "red devils" (does this have to do with promoting an anti-Euro narrative in Africa?) and Bulgarians having "milk-induced longevity" (thought they were fairly lactose-intolerant?)

    Replies: @German_reader, @silviosilver, @AnonfromTN

    Certain other parts of it puzzle me, such as Belgians being called “red devils”

    It’s the name of the Belgian national football team:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belgium_national_football_team

    • Thanks: songbird
  338. @Yahya
    @silviosilver


    , a rather distinctive style is Sevdah/Sevdanlinka, which is mostly Bosnian but is thought quite highly of across ex-YU. Generally melancholy themes with oriental-tinged, often rather haunting, melodies. Couple of good examples by Safet Isovic – Moj Dilbere and Sehidski rastanak.
     
    Yes Isovic was one of my first introductions to the treasure trove that is Balkan folk music. More specifically this song:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eMb3jWURFd0&ab_channel=SafetIsovi%C4%87

    I remember how impressed I was with the instrumentation, and more saliently, the distinctive, booming Bosnian vocal technique which I had never heard of before. But unfortunately Isovic's music is highly variable, some are very schlocky and others are excellent.

    Didn't like any of the pop tunes or artists you mentioned tbh. I've written to Philip Owen before that i'm only interested in higher forms of musical expression from other cultures. But within my own culture, the genre that has most stirred my soul is the trashy ethnic music. The trashier it was, the more deeper the feelings it elicited. I've unfortunately lost my taste for that peculiar genre of music, but I will always fondly remember the days of ethnic warmth (now mostly gone) that type of music generated within me.

    PS: I'm still waiting for a reply to the rest of my initial post. What did you think of the Arabic songs?

    Replies: @silviosilver

    I’ve written to Philip Owen before that i’m only interested in higher forms of musical expression from other cultures.

    Yeah, I suspected as much. The thing is, they seem to me to be so closely associated with that culture (or with a particular people/nation) that it creates a barrier for me to completely enjoy it. I don’t mean because I find it too alien, I mean it makes me feel like something of an “imposter,” like I’m illicitly encroaching on them. With pop music, the themes are universal, and even if the performer is an avowed ‘racist,’ it’s like so what, they can’t stop me enjoying it since the music has no obvious connection with anything culturally particular.

    Btw, talking about pop music in the other post, how could I forget to mention 80s Italian pop? That’s probably my favorite, or co-favorite with English-language 80s, and just as good. I’ll nominate three songs that best capture it for me, Giuni Russo – Un’estate al mare, Stadio -Acqua e sapone, Franco Battiato – Centro di gravita permanente. Trashy? Yeah, okay. I never claimed to be a musical sophisticate. (That last one is kinda profound though. Supposedly inspired by Gurdjieff themes. The chorus means something like “I’m looking for a permanent center of gravity that never changes my mind about things and people”, ie some stable standpoint from which to make sense of the phantasmagorical stimulation that postmodern culture assaults our senses with. That song could be the anthem of a lot of people on this blog – and in wider society – besides me.)

    I’ll use the example of a scene in the Spanish movie “Vengo” (because I wanted to ask you something else about it too). The film is about some rivalry between Spanish gypsies (“gitanos”) and features a lot of flamenco music and dance. If you go to the scene at the 19 minute mark /watch?v=ViCVxYO8r0A&t=1140s [I trust you’re able to append that to after the .com after youtube ] you’ll see that’s some pretty powerful performance by the singer at the table (no idea what she’s singing about). The ‘soldiers’ (or maybe guardia civils) at the next are getting into the music, and eventually they get up and crowd around the singer’s table and get into it even more. Now, if I had happened to be at that restaurant, even if it’s unlikely I’d be eyed as a racial outsider, and even if I could do that rhythmic hand-clapping, I still wouldn’t attempt to join in, because that seems like it’s something very culturally particular and it would feel very inauthentic for me to attempt to join in. You follow?

    Of course, a lot depends on the context in which a piece of music is performed. When they were composed, Wagner’s works were pointedly Germanic, and if the current year were 1922 instead of 2022, there isn’t a chance could I enjoy them the way, say, a Hitler could. But western culture has been promoting itself as universal culture for so long now, that Wagner becomes accessible in a way he previously wasn’t. On the other hand, a piece like “Concierto de Aranjuez,” which was composed (at least ostensibly) to celebrate the Nationalist victory in the Spanish Civil War (but I which prefer as the vocal arrangement in French, “Mon Amour”), by the time it achieved international acclaim, WWII was over, so it slotted fairly neatly into the “universalist” category. Similarly, James Last’s “The Lonely Shepherd” (made famous by pan-flutist Gheorghe Zamfir) was “universalist” from the outset, but if it had been composed in a context in which the Nazis had won WWII, reactions to it may well have been very different.

    The other thing I wanted to ask you about that movie is, if you go to the beginning, there seems to be a diverse crowd of Spaniards and Arabs making their way to a little “castle,” where a flamenco performance is taking place, but which then morphs into some Arabic number. (Normally, when I hear “fusion,” I think “run,” because it’s going to be something godawful but this wasn’t so bad, lol.) My question is: is that an Arabic style you recognize, and if so, what is it and what is its origin?

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @silviosilver


    The thing is, they seem to me to be so closely associated with that culture (or with a particular people/nation) that it creates a barrier for me to completely enjoy it.
     
    I can see where you're coming from with the "cultural barrier" thing. Though I ultimately I don’t agree; for me the barrier is no impediment to enjoying an artistic piece of music. In fact, I find that the intellectual component of "high-art" music makes it easier for me to identify with the piece, because I feel like it is operating on the same wavelength, as opposed to some pop tune designed to appeal to the lowest common denominator. The composer of a classical piece is targeting a tiny subset of the population, whereas a pop musician is aiming too broadly for it to "speak to me", if you get what I mean. Also, a classical piece isn't really designed to get you to identify with it or "join in" the same way a pop song would.

    As you can probably tell, I listen to a lot of folk music from around the world. Folk music is nothing if not ethnically particular, but it doesn't stop me from enjoying it. Now, I do acknowledge that getting into Arabic folk music is a lot easier, and elicits a greater emotional reaction, than listening to foreign folk music. But i've also enjoyed listening to non-Arabic folk music, even from cultures that are immensely distant from my own. Japanese people are as alien to me as they come; yet I have been moved greatly by this tune:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JGbsvxMLkgg&ab_channel=bahpaw

    It's one of my favorite songs of all-time and the first I learned to play on the piano.


    But western culture has been promoting itself as universal culture for so long now, that Wagner becomes accessible in a way he previously wasn’t.
     
    Yes I've heard of the refrain before that Western music is "universal" and belongs to everyone etc. including oddly by Edward Said. I have to disagree completely with that notion; to me it is clear that that genre was developed in a very peculiar place and context which makes it uniquely Western. I also disagree, and to some extent am annoyed, with the premise that Western music is "universal" while everyone else's is just "ethnic" music or lumped into a generic and overly broad "world music" category. Why should East Asian music, which utilizes 5-tone pentatonic scales and simple time divisions, be put in the same category as Middle Eastern music, which uses 7-tone scales and a wide variety of modes and complex time divisions? The two are clearly as different to each other as Western music is to them.

    Much as I enjoy Beethoven or Mozart or Rachmaninov or Szymanowski etc. they aren't really universal musicians, but were forged out of a specific milieu in Europe. Had they born in Indonesia or Egypt or Peru, they would not have composed the music they did. Now it's true that some people from non-Western countries have taken to composing European classical music. But they remain obscure to the vast majority of people in their home countries, practically no-one listens to them (except me!). I don't think European classical music has reached enough of an audience in non-Western nations to truly be classified as universal.


    My question is: is that an Arabic style you recognize, and if so, what is it and what is its origin?
     
    I immediately recognized the outfits and the people - they are Upper Egyptian ("Saidi") peasants. The people who have been tilling the fertile plains of Egypt since the dawn of civilization. They have a unique culture which is quite separate from the urbanized townfolk; which you can immediately tell by their peculiar manner of dress. The music they were playing was Saidi Egyptian folklore. I'm not surprised it fuses well with gypsy music; the clue is in the name.

    I couldn’t really get into them, tbh. Some of them took like three minutes for the vocals to begin. I just don’t have that kind of patience, lol.
     
    Well this whole thread on music just reinforced my notions that musical tastes are too different; it's impossible to guess which songs will resonate with another person. I don't think any of us liked each other's recommendations. My response to the Colombian playlist was roughly similar to yours; the rhythms are neat, nice to listen to, but ultimately I probably won't be going back to listen to them frequently. Perhaps if I force myself I could get into Colombian music the same way I did Indian or Turkish or Japanese music.

    But dammit, I would've been content had you liked at least one of the songs I recommended. But now I'm compelled to give some more suggestions. This time I will try to tailor it to your tastes, given the new information you've presented to me.

    1) Ehzar and Ya Ossas

    Starting off on the pop side, my favorite all-time singer Julia Boutros, whom I hesitated to mention again in my previous comment for fear of beating on a dead horse. But I love her music (at least some of it), have to put in a word. She has two types of songs: 1) nationalistic/patriotic Lebanese or pan-Arab songs and 2) romantic love songs. The former is what I listen to; can't stand the romantic mumbo-jumbo (true of any singer really). But I suppose the "particularism" of her nationalistic songs will put you off, so I'm going to attach two songs of hers, one from each category.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0aGjeb5GpHM&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=22&ab_channel=JuliaBoutros

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xcJqArTAFjE&ab_channel=WATARY

    You'll probably be able to guess which one is which just by quickly listening to the instrumentals.

    2) Ya Zahratan Fi Khayali

    This one is an "Arab tango" originally composed by Syrian Druze émigré Farid Al-Atrash in the 20th century; but performed here by an Armenian singer born in Lebanon:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0kh9xmnxk-E&ab_channel=AzizAllaf

    I like the instrumentation of this rendition much better than the original. There are a surprisingly large number of excellent renditions of this famous song, some of which include:

    Mirna Kassis (Assyrian): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o5R0yIczEBc&ab_channel=MirnaKassis

    Faia Younan (Assyrian): (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WV0IOOinRXk&ab_channel=rihabchahba)

    Aseel Massoud (Syrian): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LqlRNnW2GTs&ab_channel=ATHRODEELAhmad%26Aseel

    Serouj Kradjian (Armenian): (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FfZAYGYKpj8)

    Valdimir Troshin (Russian): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44pqhknYvMI&ab_channel=FaridHQ%D9%81%D8%B1%D9%8A%D8%AF

    3) Ya Rayah

    Over to the Maghreb, a jovial tune by the excellent El Gusto Orchestra; this one I'm sure you will like. Hard not to feel upbeat after listening to this track.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r84MWStOChE&ab_channel=bristol324

    This music belongs to the category of Algerian Chaabi music. The orchestra is comprised of veteran Algerian Muslim and Jewish musicians who were reunited after 50 years of separation owing to the creation of Israel and subsequent flight of Algeria's Jewish population. The creation of the orchestra has led to a rediscovery of their music, a mix of Andalusian and Berber sounds and religious chants which incorporates strong, guttural singing with an accompanying piano, flute, strings and percussion. The resulting sound is remarkably textured and harmonious. The NYT wrote an article on this orchestra here if you're interested: https://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/13/arts/music/algerian-chaabi-musicians-reunite-in-the-band-el-gusto.html

    4) Mabrouk

    Another pop tune, this time by Yemeni singer Balqees:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aa28dxptaR4&ab_channel=Rotana

    Here i'm hoping the percussion will appeal to you as it is roughly similar to Saidi Egyptian folklore. Balqees' music is a cut below Julia's in terms of both the quality of instrumentation and vocal ability. This is evident in their live concerts; the Lebanese singer sounds much better whereas the Yemeni singer requires the aid of a studio sound engineering. Both though are vastly superior to 99% of pop artists around the globe.

    Replies: @silviosilver

  339. German_reader says:

    Satellite observed two ships which had switched off their transponders just a few days before the Nordstream pipelines blew up:
    https://www.wired.com/story/nord-stream-pipeline-explosion-dark-ships/?utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=onsite-share&utm_brand=wired&utm_social-type=earned

    Must be possible to identify those ships. Of course not a big story (as it should be) in the retard country I’m living in, instead everyone’s talking about how they’re not nice enough to sodomites in Qatar and how one shouldn’t watch the world cup because of that.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader


    Must be possible to identify those ships.
     
    Who is supposed to identify those ships? When the fox investigates a break-in into the chicken coup, the conclusions are predictable 100%.

    Replies: @German_reader

    , @Emil Nikola Richard
    @German_reader

    All the intelligence agencies know exactly who blew up the pipeline.

    They ain't talking to us useless eaters about it. We get the Jews versus Kanye West and Elon Musk laying off all the good people at twitter.

    , @A123
    @German_reader

    At 95-130m that is right in the blank spot that the U.S. Navy does not have.

    • Patrol boats top out at about 60m.
    • The next step are Destroyers all of which exceed 150m.
    • Yes... Littoral Combat Vessels are in this size range. However, they suck at everything and are incredibly easy to visually identify. Are any of these festering piles of worthlessness operating in Baltic waters?

    There are a vast number of civilian vessels in that size range. Even if the dark ships can be identified, that may not lead to a culprit. Simple smuggling (not geopolitical sabotage) could be in play. Or, illicit fishing with out the proper licenses.

    What happens if the transports are found and linked to an attack? Between cash hire and back stopped ID's, good luck tracking the source back. Much of "counter terrorism" is based on leaks or patterns. With a one off incident, there is unlikely to be a pattern.

    There is not even conclusive proof of an attack rather than an industrial accident. The Swedes claim they have evidence, yet they have not shared it.

    Everybody has a theory. Mine is that the Poles did it. However, chances of obtaining sufficient proof to go public are virtually nil.

    PEACE 😇

  340. @songbird
    @Thulean Friend

    I would say I am somewhat neutral on Erdogan. I really don't care about him turning the Hagia Sophia back into a mosque (not like there are many Christians in Turkey). I may be opposed to military adventurism, using migrants as weapons, and inflation, but those seen like common sins. My main disagreement with him is that he seems to be trying to take away the joy of English-speaking schoolkids regarding the bird/country pun.

    Don't know how legit this map of Chinese search terms is, but I think it is interesting how Turkey is seen as "opposes China", while Poland is perceived as "hates China."https://twitter.com/whyvert/status/1595933987838758912?s=20&t=ILMDjqMEicY37_pMevfLEw


    Certain other parts of it puzzle me, such as Belgians being called "red devils" (does this have to do with promoting an anti-Euro narrative in Africa?) and Bulgarians having "milk-induced longevity" (thought they were fairly lactose-intolerant?)

    Replies: @German_reader, @silviosilver, @AnonfromTN

    I really don’t care about him turning the Hagia Sophia back into a mosque (not like there are many Christians in Turkey).

    I don’t care either, but you should still use it against him to highlight how culturally antagonistic, how uninterested in pluralism, how “unwestern” he is. Even elite eurocucks seem to have come to their senses about Turkey, but it doesn’t hurt to keep the pressure on in case they get any big ideas about EU membership anew. Warding off cuckery requires eternal vigilance.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @silviosilver

    Not sure how realistic the prospects of Turkey joining the EU ever were, but I suppose I should thank Erdogan for helping to sabotage the idea.

  341. @LondonBob
    @AnonfromTN

    Why would you believe anything in the Spectator? The nukes disinformation talk should immediately discredit the author.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    Why would you believe anything in the Spectator? The nukes disinformation talk should immediately discredit the author.

    I don’t. Frankly, I do not blindly believe anything from any source. I use the method I learned back in the USSR: compare what you get from different sources and dismiss everything that serves the source’s purposes. Things reported reluctantly (which are against the narrative the source promotes) have a good chance of being true. Glib tales supporting the promoted narrative are virtually certain to be lies. I look at it as a biologist: nature gave us two eyes because you cannot adequately see the reality from just one point of view.

    As to discrediting that particular author, it’s just a small detail. For years Western media discredited itself totally, spreading obvious lies and blatant lies (e.g., a zillion hospitals in Aleppo, all of which disappeared the day Islamist bandits were kicked out; scary tales about covid, which immediately disappeared when Putin started the operation in Ukraine; glorious victories of Ukie army, even though the war keeps going on the territory Ukraine considers its own; etc.). Orwell was prescient, most “reports” by Western media are comrade Ogilvy-style stories. Discrediting a single liar in the source that is devoted to lying does not matter much.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @AnonfromTN

    Re: The Spectator article.


    I do not blindly believe anything from any source. I use the method I learned back in the USSR: compare what you get from different sources and dismiss everything that serves the source’s purposes. Things reported reluctantly (which are against the narrative the source promotes) have a good chance of being true.
     
    Right. But you know what the issue is in this case? There may not be enough sources (especially with clearly attributed reports) in this case to begin with. If there really was an agreement between the US and China, as noted in these recent reports after Bali, then in fact it is a really big deal - this could be a 21st century equivalent of Yalta (insert the more appropriate geographic location).

    If this is true, there are big implications for Russia's neighbors. But as to sources, there probably will not be many open ones. Eventually the US would have to come open about these things, but China doesn't even have to report any of this - so there may not be any Chinese sources at all, except for maybe some state approved political commentary, which may not even be that explicit. Would be interesting to see if anything was mentioned about this in the Chinese media.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  342. @silviosilver
    @songbird


    I really don’t care about him turning the Hagia Sophia back into a mosque (not like there are many Christians in Turkey).
     
    I don't care either, but you should still use it against him to highlight how culturally antagonistic, how uninterested in pluralism, how "unwestern" he is. Even elite eurocucks seem to have come to their senses about Turkey, but it doesn't hurt to keep the pressure on in case they get any big ideas about EU membership anew. Warding off cuckery requires eternal vigilance.

    Replies: @songbird

    Not sure how realistic the prospects of Turkey joining the EU ever were, but I suppose I should thank Erdogan for helping to sabotage the idea.

    • Agree: showmethereal
  343. @LatW
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms


    I’m saying a lot of HBD preconceptions who can do or who’s better at what sport is premature.
     
    Of course. And even within one population, there are several types. My point regarding those QBs who have a Slavic background is that they are not just any Slavs, but a very particular type of Northern Slav or Balto-Slav, some call them Wends. 😉 Gronk is a Wend.

    Replies: @silviosilver

    Gronk is a Wend.

    Gronk was a tight end. Tight end has become a very white position in recent years, and all the best tight ends are white. I’m pretty sure most of them aren’t slavic.

    Not sure how realistic the prospects of Turkey joining the EU ever were, but I suppose I should thank Erdogan for helping to sabotage the idea.

    I’m not sure either, but the very fact the idea was ever floated and that they achieved candidate status is disturbing enough.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @silviosilver


    >Not sure how realistic the prospects of Turkey joining the EU ever were, but I suppose I should thank Erdogan for helping to sabotage the idea.

    I’m not sure either, but the very fact the idea was ever floated and that they achieved candidate status is disturbing enough.
     
    Agreed. I think it helps take the blinders off about the nature of the regime and about how mass migration into the EU is being promoted by the regime, rather than being something accidental, or not sought after.

    @AnonfromTN

    It is only important as a clear sign of sultan’s stupidity
     
    I know a lot of people predict some Ottoman Empire 2.0 in the coming decades. Personally, I'm kind of skeptical. (If pan-Arabism didn't work out, rule by Turks seems like quite a stretch) Granted they probably have the least bad demographic base in the area (still pretty bad), and control the source of a lot of the water in the Middle East. I still don't see it. More likely Pakistan would move into the Middle East, IMO.

    Replies: @A123

  344. @songbird
    @Thulean Friend

    I would say I am somewhat neutral on Erdogan. I really don't care about him turning the Hagia Sophia back into a mosque (not like there are many Christians in Turkey). I may be opposed to military adventurism, using migrants as weapons, and inflation, but those seen like common sins. My main disagreement with him is that he seems to be trying to take away the joy of English-speaking schoolkids regarding the bird/country pun.

    Don't know how legit this map of Chinese search terms is, but I think it is interesting how Turkey is seen as "opposes China", while Poland is perceived as "hates China."https://twitter.com/whyvert/status/1595933987838758912?s=20&t=ILMDjqMEicY37_pMevfLEw


    Certain other parts of it puzzle me, such as Belgians being called "red devils" (does this have to do with promoting an anti-Euro narrative in Africa?) and Bulgarians having "milk-induced longevity" (thought they were fairly lactose-intolerant?)

    Replies: @German_reader, @silviosilver, @AnonfromTN

    I would say I am somewhat neutral on Erdogan. I really don’t care about him turning the Hagia Sophia back into a mosque

    Turning Sophia into a mosque is not important in and of itself. It is only important as a clear sign of sultan’s stupidity: there is huge Blue Mosque across the square, so they did not need another one in this location.

    Other signs of his stupidity and megalomania are plentiful. Let me just point out new Istanbul airport. Clearly oodles of money were spent, it is huge. Yet it is extremely uncomfortable: gates are very far from each other, so you walk for miles to get to your gate; huge spaces are empty, essentially wasted, but there are very few chairs (people sitting on the floor are an indication); there are very few places where you can eat, which are all crowded as the result, but there is a profusion of duty-free shops without customers, etc.

    His military adventures show the same combination of stupidity and megalomania. Turkey does not have resources to make even half of these successful.

    Yet everything depends who you compare him to. If you compare him to today’s European and US “leaders”, he looks remarkably sane and smart.

  345. @German_reader
    Satellite observed two ships which had switched off their transponders just a few days before the Nordstream pipelines blew up:
    https://www.wired.com/story/nord-stream-pipeline-explosion-dark-ships/?utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=onsite-share&utm_brand=wired&utm_social-type=earned

    Must be possible to identify those ships. Of course not a big story (as it should be) in the retard country I'm living in, instead everyone's talking about how they're not nice enough to sodomites in Qatar and how one shouldn't watch the world cup because of that.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Emil Nikola Richard, @A123

    Must be possible to identify those ships.

    Who is supposed to identify those ships? When the fox investigates a break-in into the chicken coup, the conclusions are predictable 100%.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @AnonfromTN

    Sure. I expect the story to be buried. No big deal apparently.

  346. @German_reader
    Satellite observed two ships which had switched off their transponders just a few days before the Nordstream pipelines blew up:
    https://www.wired.com/story/nord-stream-pipeline-explosion-dark-ships/?utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=onsite-share&utm_brand=wired&utm_social-type=earned

    Must be possible to identify those ships. Of course not a big story (as it should be) in the retard country I'm living in, instead everyone's talking about how they're not nice enough to sodomites in Qatar and how one shouldn't watch the world cup because of that.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Emil Nikola Richard, @A123

    All the intelligence agencies know exactly who blew up the pipeline.

    They ain’t talking to us useless eaters about it. We get the Jews versus Kanye West and Elon Musk laying off all the good people at twitter.

  347. The money shot from Avi Loeb Garry Nolan Brian Keating.

    It’s in the chapter starting at 41:15 What would be the impact of discovery of extraterrestrials?

    Garry Nolan says “I was raised Catholic but brought up Jewish.”

    Gack.

    Anyhow here is the best evidence.

    https://arxiv.org/pdf/1304.3381.pdf
    https://arxiv.org/pdf/1303.6739.pdf

    If you ask me this isn’t evidence of much more than Garry Nolan’s stubbornness but it’s there in peer reviewed research papers for all you interested geniuses out there.

    [MORE]

  348. @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader


    Must be possible to identify those ships.
     
    Who is supposed to identify those ships? When the fox investigates a break-in into the chicken coup, the conclusions are predictable 100%.

    Replies: @German_reader

    Sure. I expect the story to be buried. No big deal apparently.

  349. @Yahya
    @Yevardian


    Incidentally I know this from my mother’s side, my father can’t stand any of this stuff, which goes for almost anything except Western Classical Music really. I tried introducing him to Jazz when I was first getting into the genre. Although he didn’t actually hate it, after the novelty wore off he quickly lost interest.
     
    Your father and I are kindred souls; I couldn't listen to any of the stuff you posted. I was actually impressed by the beginning instrumentation of the first Erkin Koray tune; until he started singing in that psychedelic style which I can't stand. I told the Dragon Man before that my musical tastes tends towards the orderly and mundane; never got into jazz, electronic, hip-hop, dance, rock or psychedelic music. My reaction to jazz was pretty much identical to your father's. Perhaps you can recommend the Arabic pieces I posted above, I think he might like some of them.

    From Turkey I am a fan of their classical tradition. I wrote a lengthy post on it to Bashibuzuk here: https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-198/#comment-5581415

    It's fairly similar to Arabic music, as it is based on the Maqam/Makam/Mugham system utilized by the Arab world, Turkey, and Azerbaijan; though surprisingly it took me a while to get accustomed to it. I cannot comment on the popularity or lack thereof of Anatolian Rock in the Arab world; since i've never listened to any till today, though I was vaguely familiar with the genre. All I know is that i've never heard a Turkish tune being played on TV, radio or in outdoor settings; though Turkish TV shows are ubiquitous on MBC (a pan-Arab TV network watched all over the Arab World). My friends mostly listen to the basest forms of Western music, stuff that make my ears bleed.

    Iran - zero. The cultural separation between Iran and the Arab world is several times greater than with Turkey, perhaps owing to the residual Ottoman influence of the latter. I do not have experiences like you of watching The Lizard or listening to Banan with family; I had to explore Iranian cinema and music by myself. I largely agree with your take on the division between the Semitic and Turco-Persian worlds. I've seen several Israeli renditions of classical Arabic songs, unsurprisingly from the Mizrahim of that country. Though Arabic cultures popularity with Mizrahi seems strange considering the hatred they have for us. I should point out though that some Turks like listening to Arabic music as well; I see them in the comment sections of many Arabic songs. And occasionally I come across Turkish renditions of Arabic songs, such as this tasteful adaptation of Lena Chamamyan's Baali Maak by Selva Erdener:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R18262T-REA&ab_channel=SelvaErdener

    Regarding Turkey and Iran's influence; obviously both of them try to gain favor with the prestige Arab world in their quest to lead the Islamic Ummah. Iran has been more successful, even though it faces a steeper battle given its cultural distance and more importantly, Shia disposition, which puts it at odds with Sunni Arabs in the region. Turkey should have done better considering many Arab elites in places like Egypt and Algeria have recent Turkish ancestry. But Erdogan really played his cards wrong, supporting the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt, opposing Assad in Syria, and picking fights with the Gulf Arab monarchies. Virtually the only "nation" he has any influence over is tiny Qatar. Iran has done well given the poor cards they were dealt, but they too are treated with suspicion and hostility by most of the Arab World, as I demonstrated in my reply to you some months ago.


    I remember going through a phase of listening to Serbian ‘turbofolk, some extremely ‘powerful’ lyrics and musicvideos, though my impression was that only Roki Vulavic had genuine talent as singer.

     

    Lol, these videos seem like self-parodies.

    I'm a huge fan of Balkan folk music. This piece of Bulgarian polyphonic music is exquisite:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UsDtmdWFBxU&ab_channel=CosmicVoicesfromBulgaria

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @Barbarossa

    It’s even more difficult for somebody who’s not a native or a real connoisseur of Middle Eastern music to discern regional differences. Ardeshir Farah is a native of Iran and Jorge Strunz of Cota Rica. For many years now, they’ve been playing together and putting together albums of pure exotic joy, including a blend of “highly virtuosic, rhythmic, and improvisation-rich original instrumental compositions, against a backdrop of native sounds, including Spanish, Iranian, Arabic and South American influences. This album is a collection of their Middle Eastern influenced music. Obviously, they surround themselves with top-notch studio musicians too (I particularly like the two violin players that are highlighted within this album). I’d be interested in hearing your opinion of this album, and what regional influences that you detect – enjoy!

    • Thanks: Yahya
    • Replies: @Yahya
    @Mr. Hack


    I’d be interested in hearing your opinion of this album, and what regional influences that you detect – enjoy!
     
    I've actually come across their work before, I think it was you actually who posted them?

    Their music tilts more towards Spanish/Andalusian than Middle Eastern.

    Actually I don't hear much Middle Eastern elements at all.

    Where is the Qanun, the Oud, the Sitar or the Tambur?

    This is Persian classical music:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6QF6e-Ac8Nw&t=165s

    Key differences: slower tempo, more melancholy, different tone color.

    Spanish Andalusian music:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j9AxhfJ8xuI&ab_channel=%D7%AA%D7%96%D7%9E%D7%95%D7%A8%D7%AA%D7%99%D7%A8%D7%95%D7%A9%D7%9C%D7%99%D7%9D%D7%9E%D7%96%D7%A8%D7%97%D7%95%D7%9E%D7%A2%D7%A8%D7%91JerusalemOrchestraE%26W

    Musical idea is much closer to Strunz and Farah.

    I have written posts on Arabic, Turkish and Persian classical music here:

    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-198/#comment-5581415

    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-193/#comment-5474079

    Thanks for the recommendation. Since you are interested in Middle Eastern fusion, I would also recommend checking out the talented Jordanian violinist Layth Sidiq. He has done collaborations with with Greek, Indian and Western musicians.

    Indian-Middle Eastern:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FKS-w38SQ2w&list=OLAK5uy_ln90hl6sjqcpkVe4awxJ3amSsOsu68J18&index=3&ab_channel=LaythSidiq-Topic

    Greek-Middle Eastern:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4lrgUUh1PtU&ab_channel=BerkleeCollegeofMusic

    Western-Middle Eastern:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o0UgRMFe3oo&ab_channel=JafraProductions%D8%AC%D9%81%D8%B1%D8%A7%D9%84%D9%84%D8%A5%D9%86%D8%AA%D8%A7%D8%AC

  350. @AnonfromTN
    @showmethereal


    That was actually going to be my question… who is financing the reconstruction? Is it local or from “Moscow”? I was also under the impression that the Sea of Azov was very important from an industrial point of view.
     
    To the best of my knowledge (which is not comprehensive), Russia is paying for almost everything. Considering the ravages of Ukie occupation since 2014-15 and further destruction in the current war, Donbass might break even in maybe 10 years and become profitable after that. Economic potential of the sea of Azov will come into play when local production picks up. For many years Donbass will need massive investment from the outside, not just of money, but of construction materials and numerous other products.

    That is not to say that they don’t produce anything. E.g., in Lugansk they make local dry sausage (not salami, Russian/German style dry sausage) that quality-wise can compete with the best produced anywhere in the world. The same is true for equivalent of prosciutto crudo made in Lugansk. It was like that even in Soviet times. Lugansk sausage and high-end meat products were and still are among the best (I say it having tried high quality meats in >20 countries). They make quite a few other things in Donbass that are competitive, but overall production is much lower than needed to finance required massive reconstruction.

    I think Donbass will succeed because most people there have the right attitude. In contrast to many people in Ukraine, who for some inexplicable reason think that everybody owes them, the people I talked to in Lugansk believe that Russia does not owe them anything. They are grateful for the liberation, but see additional help as good will, rather than something due. People solve their problems only when they are ready to do it themselves. Habitual freeloaders are doomed to have shithole for a country.

    Replies: @Beckow, @showmethereal

    This is a civilizational war, flags and dry sausages are of no importance. The war is to decide who lives and who goes, what stories are told. It started much smaller, but the gradual escalation (by both sides) got us to the point of no return. Whoever gets Donbas or the Black Sea coast – and other lands – will take it as-is, even as desert with nothing standing. The calculations and who pays for what have been thrown out between February and October.

    Kiev and West are more committed to the total existential struggle because they are weaker on the ground. Russia is still acting tentative, counting marbles, implicitly offering compromises; Russia hasn’t saddled up yet. West has still not processed a very simple strategic reality: Russia cannot afford to lose and is in a position to win. So they are poking the bear and giggling like idiots thinking that it is all about the poking – it is not going to end well.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @Beckow


    So they are poking the bear and giggling like idiots thinking that it is all about the poking – it is not going to end well.
     
    West isn't monolithic, just recently General Milley said that the Ukrainians have taken back as much territory as they realistically can for now and should take the opportunity for negotiations.
    You are right however that there are powerful factions in Western countries who are pushing this line that one can't negotiate with Russia, Putin must be overthrown, only total victory is acceptable etc. EU parliament with its recent foolishness of declaring Russia a terrorist state was an egregious example of this mindset (also lots of similar nonsense...apparently German Bundestag now wants to officially recognize Holodomor as genocide, lol). In Germany it's strongly promoted by certain Greens (ironically some were active Maoists back in the 1970s, their basic mentality apparently hasn't changed much). I agree that it's not going to end well if that kind of thinking wins out.

    Replies: @Beckow

    , @AnonfromTN
    @Beckow


    This is a civilizational war
     
    My impression is that Putin was planning for a local skirmish, just beating back imperial advance into Ukraine to encircle Russia. However, by getting into it to the hilt the West made it an existential geopolitical struggle. Bankrupt empire wants to retain its dominance, other forces, including Russia, want to put an end to its dominance and reformat the world, making it multi-polar. In a way, the empire was right to start this struggle as early as possible: with every passing year its power wanes. Naturally, the empire does not give a hoot about Ukies, they are disposable cannon fodder in this geopolitical struggle.

    So they are poking the bear and giggling like idiots thinking that it is all about the poking – it is not going to end well.
     
    Bismarck (who was no friend or admirer of Russia) rightly said more than a century ago about potential war with Russia that he knows many ways of making the bear leave his lair, but not a single way of making it go back.

    Replies: @Beckow

  351. German_reader says:
    @Beckow
    @AnonfromTN

    This is a civilizational war, flags and dry sausages are of no importance. The war is to decide who lives and who goes, what stories are told. It started much smaller, but the gradual escalation (by both sides) got us to the point of no return. Whoever gets Donbas or the Black Sea coast - and other lands - will take it as-is, even as desert with nothing standing. The calculations and who pays for what have been thrown out between February and October.

    Kiev and West are more committed to the total existential struggle because they are weaker on the ground. Russia is still acting tentative, counting marbles, implicitly offering compromises; Russia hasn't saddled up yet. West has still not processed a very simple strategic reality: Russia cannot afford to lose and is in a position to win. So they are poking the bear and giggling like idiots thinking that it is all about the poking - it is not going to end well.

    Replies: @German_reader, @AnonfromTN

    So they are poking the bear and giggling like idiots thinking that it is all about the poking – it is not going to end well.

    West isn’t monolithic, just recently General Milley said that the Ukrainians have taken back as much territory as they realistically can for now and should take the opportunity for negotiations.
    You are right however that there are powerful factions in Western countries who are pushing this line that one can’t negotiate with Russia, Putin must be overthrown, only total victory is acceptable etc. EU parliament with its recent foolishness of declaring Russia a terrorist state was an egregious example of this mindset (also lots of similar nonsense…apparently German Bundestag now wants to officially recognize Holodomor as genocide, lol). In Germany it’s strongly promoted by certain Greens (ironically some were active Maoists back in the 1970s, their basic mentality apparently hasn’t changed much). I agree that it’s not going to end well if that kind of thinking wins out.

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @German_reader

    Sure, West isn't monolithic but the dominant faction wants an all out war, or to push it to the absolute limit. The Greens - whether today, Maoist, or genderless freaks - are simply stupid people with initiative. The kind of people who in the past joined massive revolutionary movements or religious revivals. Their libido is in the wrong place.

    The EU freak-show is just the beginning: everything and everyone will be demonized, the language categories will be stretched, the most egregious nonsense will be tried - and applauded. It will also happen in Russia, more slowly, but possibly more deadly. The worst thing that could happen is Putin leaving, replaced with hot-heads who match Poland and the English media in determination and irresponsibility.

    It is almost amusing, seeing the inevitable steps, the loss of the common sense, the rush to create mayhem, all the time forgetting that the underlying issues - at least officially - are actually very minor. So minor that they can't be openly discussed in the West. It would be embarrassing to admit that we are rushing toward a catastrophe, or toward a lot worse lives, in order to dictate what language is used in the Ukie schools and to place effectively useless Nato armies on the Russian border. The people in charge are either desperate or complete idiots.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Unintended Consequence

  352. @Beckow
    @AnonfromTN

    This is a civilizational war, flags and dry sausages are of no importance. The war is to decide who lives and who goes, what stories are told. It started much smaller, but the gradual escalation (by both sides) got us to the point of no return. Whoever gets Donbas or the Black Sea coast - and other lands - will take it as-is, even as desert with nothing standing. The calculations and who pays for what have been thrown out between February and October.

    Kiev and West are more committed to the total existential struggle because they are weaker on the ground. Russia is still acting tentative, counting marbles, implicitly offering compromises; Russia hasn't saddled up yet. West has still not processed a very simple strategic reality: Russia cannot afford to lose and is in a position to win. So they are poking the bear and giggling like idiots thinking that it is all about the poking - it is not going to end well.

    Replies: @German_reader, @AnonfromTN

    This is a civilizational war

    My impression is that Putin was planning for a local skirmish, just beating back imperial advance into Ukraine to encircle Russia. However, by getting into it to the hilt the West made it an existential geopolitical struggle. Bankrupt empire wants to retain its dominance, other forces, including Russia, want to put an end to its dominance and reformat the world, making it multi-polar. In a way, the empire was right to start this struggle as early as possible: with every passing year its power wanes. Naturally, the empire does not give a hoot about Ukies, they are disposable cannon fodder in this geopolitical struggle.

    So they are poking the bear and giggling like idiots thinking that it is all about the poking – it is not going to end well.

    Bismarck (who was no friend or admirer of Russia) rightly said more than a century ago about potential war with Russia that he knows many ways of making the bear leave his lair, but not a single way of making it go back.

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @AnonfromTN


    ...Putin was planning for a local skirmish, just beating back imperial advance into Ukraine to encircle Russia.
     
    If he really was, he was deluding himself. The idea that the West would back down - after decades of investments, planning, endless seminars and weapons - was not realistic. It wasn't the West he misread but the Ukies - for some reason Putin&Co. thought that Ukies would back down, would act rationally, refuse to be martyrs.

    As we have seen in the modern world almost anything can be manipulated and people lack basic survival and reasoning skills - the ones with money, brains are resources are allowed to leave, hysteria is stirred up, a bit of outright suppression, and the remaining masses of Ukie men left with few choices are marched into muddy fields to die. The bizarre show goes on with the leader in green sweat-pants, visiting dignitaries, new narratives invented daily and dutifully repeated in the Western media. That's the world we live in. I am increasingly skeptical if it is really that important to save it from a big boom :)


    Bismarck...rightly said he knows many ways of making the bear leave his lair, but not a single way of making it go back.
     
    These guys decided to slay the bear so they need him to come out. They suffer from what is called paradoxical thinking - trying to prove that what is accepted as truth is not true at all, that it can be changed.

    They think they can kill the bear - the way they think that Normandy invasion defeated Hitler, or that a woman is not defined by biology. Paradoxical thinking appeals to people who are reasonably smart but lack life experience. It is not only reality that they miss and the inevitable propaganda self-delusions, they also seek drama - the way their lives have been shaped by cheesy Hollywood narratives.

    (It is not particularly new, read Shakespeare to see the phenomenon of over-dramatizing everything - it is good entertainment, but deadly when allowed to rule our lives.)

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  353. @German_reader
    @Beckow


    So they are poking the bear and giggling like idiots thinking that it is all about the poking – it is not going to end well.
     
    West isn't monolithic, just recently General Milley said that the Ukrainians have taken back as much territory as they realistically can for now and should take the opportunity for negotiations.
    You are right however that there are powerful factions in Western countries who are pushing this line that one can't negotiate with Russia, Putin must be overthrown, only total victory is acceptable etc. EU parliament with its recent foolishness of declaring Russia a terrorist state was an egregious example of this mindset (also lots of similar nonsense...apparently German Bundestag now wants to officially recognize Holodomor as genocide, lol). In Germany it's strongly promoted by certain Greens (ironically some were active Maoists back in the 1970s, their basic mentality apparently hasn't changed much). I agree that it's not going to end well if that kind of thinking wins out.

    Replies: @Beckow

    Sure, West isn’t monolithic but the dominant faction wants an all out war, or to push it to the absolute limit. The Greens – whether today, Maoist, or genderless freaks – are simply stupid people with initiative. The kind of people who in the past joined massive revolutionary movements or religious revivals. Their libido is in the wrong place.

    The EU freak-show is just the beginning: everything and everyone will be demonized, the language categories will be stretched, the most egregious nonsense will be tried – and applauded. It will also happen in Russia, more slowly, but possibly more deadly. The worst thing that could happen is Putin leaving, replaced with hot-heads who match Poland and the English media in determination and irresponsibility.

    It is almost amusing, seeing the inevitable steps, the loss of the common sense, the rush to create mayhem, all the time forgetting that the underlying issues – at least officially – are actually very minor. So minor that they can’t be openly discussed in the West. It would be embarrassing to admit that we are rushing toward a catastrophe, or toward a lot worse lives, in order to dictate what language is used in the Ukie schools and to place effectively useless Nato armies on the Russian border. The people in charge are either desperate or complete idiots.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Beckow


    are simply stupid people with initiative
     
    There is Russian joke:
    - What’s more dangerous than a nuclear war?
    - An idiot with initiative.

    Do similar jokes exist in other countries?
    , @Unintended Consequence
    @Beckow

    "The Greens – whether today, Maoist, or genderless freaks – are simply stupid people with initiative. The kind of people who in the past joined massive revolutionary movements or religious revivals."

    I am certainly no fan of Greens with their ideas based in fanaticism more than science. However, the Greens in Belgium made a strong statement on war as it is linked to the environment by refusing to send Britain some components related to their nuclear arsenal today. Seems the Green party won an election there and will be in committee soon to make similar decisions so were allowed to anticipate the formal proceedings.

    Replies: @Beckow

  354. @German_reader
    Satellite observed two ships which had switched off their transponders just a few days before the Nordstream pipelines blew up:
    https://www.wired.com/story/nord-stream-pipeline-explosion-dark-ships/?utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=onsite-share&utm_brand=wired&utm_social-type=earned

    Must be possible to identify those ships. Of course not a big story (as it should be) in the retard country I'm living in, instead everyone's talking about how they're not nice enough to sodomites in Qatar and how one shouldn't watch the world cup because of that.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Emil Nikola Richard, @A123

    At 95-130m that is right in the blank spot that the U.S. Navy does not have.

    • Patrol boats top out at about 60m.
    • The next step are Destroyers all of which exceed 150m.
    • Yes… Littoral Combat Vessels are in this size range. However, they suck at everything and are incredibly easy to visually identify. Are any of these festering piles of worthlessness operating in Baltic waters?

    There are a vast number of civilian vessels in that size range. Even if the dark ships can be identified, that may not lead to a culprit. Simple smuggling (not geopolitical sabotage) could be in play. Or, illicit fishing with out the proper licenses.

    What happens if the transports are found and linked to an attack? Between cash hire and back stopped ID’s, good luck tracking the source back. Much of “counter terrorism” is based on leaks or patterns. With a one off incident, there is unlikely to be a pattern.

    There is not even conclusive proof of an attack rather than an industrial accident. The Swedes claim they have evidence, yet they have not shared it.

    Everybody has a theory. Mine is that the Poles did it. However, chances of obtaining sufficient proof to go public are virtually nil.

    PEACE 😇

  355. @AnonfromTN
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    More wiki cites. Hardly anything related to politics, economics, and history in wiki is credible. If any truth remains in these entries, it’s there because the censors are sloppy or overworked (or simply dumb).

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    What’s your epistemic standard? I only cite wiki excerpts that are well sourced. I was calling out an obvious lie by showmethereal that Japan played baseball only as a US vassal.

    Would a picture be better?

    One of the most prominent pitchers in the history of Japanese baseball was Victor Starffin “the blue-eyed Japanese” (青い目の日本人, aoi-me no Nihonjin). A white émigré who arrived in Japan after the Russian Revolution by way of Manchuria

  356. @AnonfromTN
    @Mikel


    Electoral choices do still have practical consequences.
     
    Local electoral choices, yes. Likely because the cabal does not want to get swamped by the nitty-gritty of local issues. As to national elections…

    Have you noticed that the key things in the foreign policy remain essentially the same regardless which “party” is technically in power? These invariably include military bases all over the world, coups in various countries, naked aggression against the countries where a coup cannot be arranged, and various sanctions against anyone who does not toe the imperial line.

    That MIC funding keeps growing under either “party”? It has already reached obscene proportions, it exceeds the military spending of the rest of the world put together. Yet the increases of the amounts of money thrown into insatiable maw of greedy US MIC show no signs of abating, and it does not matter one bit which “party” is technically in power.

    These and many other things show that real power is wielded by the forces behind the scenes, not by elected figureheads, who are becoming more and more pathetic (severe Alzheimer’s is a new low).

    Replies: @Mikel, @Barbarossa

    Have you noticed that the key things in the foreign policy remain essentially the same regardless which “party” is technically in power?

    Yes but that’s no big news. Everybody has noticed that the MIC/neocon lobby is very powerful in DC and Congressmen of both parties are loyal to it. However, we now know that a candidate that explicitly promises to change some of those key things in foreign policy can become President (or at least could 6 years ago, demographic changes are happening so fast that I’m not sure that would be possible again).

    The fact that Trump didn’t change anything on foreign policy and actually doubled down on everything you mentioned when he became President doesn’t necessarily mean that it is impossible to do. Let’s not forget that he failed to keep his promises on everything he ran on (except for the Israel Embassy) so at least to a very big extent it was just a personal problem of incompetence and inconsistency. He could have perfectly surrounded himself with anti-interventionist people who shared his campaign message like Buchanan, Rand Paul, Gosar, Tulsi,… and, as Commander in Chief, he had ample power to order troop retreats and abstain from attacking foreign countries. Instead, he filled his Administration with rabid interventionists like Pompeo, Haley, McMaster, Matis, Esper, Bolton… With such choices it’s little wonder that he failed to keep campaign promises that he had simply forgotten about.

    There are very strong inertias in American politics, especially when it comes to military and foreign policy matters, and shady cabals do exist but it would be a mistake to conclude that they are all powerful just because because such an idiosyncratic personage as Trump was unable to stand up to them.

    Btw, knowing all the things that he failed to do, are you going to vote for Trump again if he is the nominee? And would you rather have him run instead of someone who has at least been able to take concrete actions on immigration and the woke insanity like DeSantis?

    • Replies: @A123
    @Mikel

    Trump delivered the MAGA “Anti-War” platform he won on. Everyone understands this objective TRUTH.

    Notable achievements included:

    1. Trump is the first President in modern history to start ZERO new wars. This is a massive achievement that should be celebrated by all Americans.

    It is especially momentous, as Trump had to contend with sociopath Khamenei who was openly trying to provoke a war.

     
    https://joannenova.com.au/wp-content/presidents-wars.jpg
     


    2. Trump pulled U.S. troops out of the kill sack between Turkish and Syrian/Russian lines. “Protecting Oil” was a fig leaf believed by no one. Functionally, the U.S. efforts now provide intelligence on Iranian terrorists operating in Syria and Western Iraq, and little else.

    Trump also made it clear that the U.S. would not support Erdogan’s aggression. The NATO defensive alliance would not back a Turkish offensive operation.

    3. Trump effectively ended the Afghan War.

     
    https://i.dawn.com/primary/2020/10/5f7f8869c725d.jpg
     

    Gen. SJW Milley’s treachery was avoided. We will never know if that was Trump personally not trusting the traitor. Or, if senior staff headed off the trap. Probably both. If Trump received the 2nd term that he won at the ballot box, there would have been a deal & orderly pull out centered on Bagram.
    ___

    MAGA (under Donald Trump) ratcheted down SJW Globalist Forever Wars across the globe.

    What more could anyone want that is “actually achievable”?

    Did Trump score 100% of absolutely, totally, everything, across the entire globe? Of course not, that simply was not available. No President can possibly deliver 100% of absolutely, totally, everything. The American system does NOT work that way.
    ___

    Knowing all the things that Trump succeeded at in limiting the MIC, why would anyone not vote for him?

    Would you rather have DeSantis, a candidate with minimal national experience & track record? How do you know this retired military officer is not 100%+ MIC compliant?

    For everyone rational who wants to reduce foreign entanglements, the choice is undeniably clear & obvious. TRUMP 2024

    A primary vote for DeSantis is a vote for Brandon, Mikel's true choice for President.

    #LetsGoBrandon 😇

     
    https://i.ebayimg.com/thumbs/images/g/6NMAAOSwfA5gro69/s-l1600.jpg

    Replies: @Mikel

    , @AnonfromTN
    @Mikel


    we now know that a candidate that explicitly promises to change some of those key things in foreign policy can become President (or at least could 6 years ago,
     
    We also know that even though he utterly failed to change the suicidal course, the cabal hates his guts and is prepared to break any law and completely destroy the legal system to hurt him and his supporters. If he were smarter, more competent, and actually started doing what he promised, the cabal would do to him what they did to Kennedy.

    Btw, knowing all the things that he failed to do, are you going to vote for Trump again if he is the nominee? And would you rather have him run instead of someone who has at least been able to take concrete actions on immigration and the woke insanity like DeSantis?
     
    If I vote in 2024 (I did not make up my mind yet), I am going to vote against every Democrat on the ballot. IMO, Democrats are guilty of too many things. They nominated an evil bitch in 2016 (remember her mad witch chuckle when she talked about brutal murder of Ghaddafi), and then in 2020 they nominated a person who is corrupt to the core, was always dumb, and now has severe Alzheimer’s. They resorted to unprecedented in the US history election fraud to get this half-corpse “elected”. They are guilty of blatantly lying about covid and forcing useless “vaccinations” on the population (BTW, one of the decisions of Nuremberg tribunal was that performing a medical procedure on a person against his/her will is a crime). They are guilty of bringing the world to the brink of nuclear war. They are guilty of many other things, but these alone would suffice to lock them up for life under the rule of law (some in jail, others in madhouse inside jail).

    So, if Trump ends up being the nominee, I would vote for him. But I would like Republicans to nominate someone more competent and mature than that narcissistic 70-year old teenager.

    Replies: @A123, @Mikel

  357. @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @showmethereal

    Baseball was introduced in Japan in 1872. During WWII the Japanese war cry was "to hell with Babe Ruth"

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baseball_in_Japan#History

    Russian contempt for the Chinese is real:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_deportations_of_Chinese_people

    Does the CCP ever bring this up? No, because PRC was originally a Soviet vassal.

    And because it was the Chinese whom acted like unruly goons


    The Chinese entertained joint management until mid-1929. The change from Soviet control to Chinese control started when the Chinese authorities made a radical move to try to remove Soviet management. Chinese authorities stormed the Soviet Consulate in Harbin. They arrested the General Manager of the CER, his assistant and other Soviet citizens and removed them from power in the CER.
     
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sino-Soviet_conflict_(1929)

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @showmethereal

    Since the industrial revolution Japan has had an affinity for western things. Teddy Roosevelt was a big fan of Japan westernizing Asia. Japanese were placating the west even back then. But once Japan was occupied by the US after WW2 baseball became more prominent. I’m not even sure how you can possibly even try to debate that…. Anyway…

    Ahhh so you realize you are on shaky ground and so bring up the Sino Soviet conflict. What in earth does that have to do with anything we were discussing???? Stop wasting time.

    • Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @showmethereal

    More lies from you. China attempted to modernize in the Western model as the Japanese had during Meiji but simply failed,

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-Strengthening_Movement

    In the First Sino-Japanese War, no one assumed Japan would win. The Japanese successfully adopted the Jeune École naval concept of smaller ships against bigger Chinese battleships.

    Amongst many Chinese fails, the sailors had to wear queues that their Manchu masters forced on them, this was a huge operational risk because getting queues caught in machinery meant probable death.

    Teddy Roosevelt declined reparations from China and set a scholarship to educate Chinese,

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boxer_Indemnity_Scholarship

    The 1929 conflict was a case of Chinese picking a fight with the Soviets and getting a well-deserved ass-whupping. That's why wumao like you mouth off about the Japanese but never dares saying jack shit offensive to your Russian grandfather 俄爹.

    So in fact, the best all time Japanese baseball player is half Chinese 王貞治 おう さだはる Wáng Zhēnzhì

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sadaharu_Oh

    Replies: @showmethereal

  358. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @showmethereal


    So there is no way you can say a Jeremy Lin can’t become on their level. In fact when Jeremy Lin did go play in China he didn’t dominate the way Stephon Marbury did – which means other Chinese (born) could indeed play in the NBA.
     
    Lin was a freak whose case does not allow for such a generalization. He was a stranger to the NBA because he played at a non-basketball U. He burned through the league for 3 weeks to a month because he had some great skills. He also had a fatal flaw in his game which they quickly learned to exploit after which he was never more than Just Another Guy.

    Replies: @showmethereal

    No Yao Ming was more of a “freak” chance. You can directly compare Jeremy Lin playing in the NBA and China vs the many other NBA players who went to play in China as well. Jeremy Lin never dominated the Chinese league. Good but not dominant. Same can be said of other former NBA players. Stephon Marbury did dominate though. He’s still there coaching and owning a team too.

  359. @Matra
    @silviosilver

    I haven't thought this through but one reason the Chinese may never get good at soccer is that it is not structured enough for them. Too much of what goes on on the pitch requires independent thought and initiative. S Korea playing today reminds me that they made to the semi-finals in 2002 - with the help of some dodgy home field advantage refereeing - but have done little since then. Anyway, East Asians are probably right not to attach so much national prestige and importance on sports.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    I haven’t thought this through but one reason the Chinese may never get good at soccer is that it is not structured enough for them. Too much of what goes on on the pitch requires independent thought and initiative.

    Agree with this actually. Another factor is the Japanese team mostly play in the top European leagues,

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japan_national_football_team#Current_squad

    For Koreans its about half. The Chinese play entirely in the Chinese Super League, which is actually the sixth highest paid league

    https://www.olbg.com/insights/global-football-league

    They get pampered and don’t go out to challenge themselves.

  360. @Beckow
    @German_reader

    Sure, West isn't monolithic but the dominant faction wants an all out war, or to push it to the absolute limit. The Greens - whether today, Maoist, or genderless freaks - are simply stupid people with initiative. The kind of people who in the past joined massive revolutionary movements or religious revivals. Their libido is in the wrong place.

    The EU freak-show is just the beginning: everything and everyone will be demonized, the language categories will be stretched, the most egregious nonsense will be tried - and applauded. It will also happen in Russia, more slowly, but possibly more deadly. The worst thing that could happen is Putin leaving, replaced with hot-heads who match Poland and the English media in determination and irresponsibility.

    It is almost amusing, seeing the inevitable steps, the loss of the common sense, the rush to create mayhem, all the time forgetting that the underlying issues - at least officially - are actually very minor. So minor that they can't be openly discussed in the West. It would be embarrassing to admit that we are rushing toward a catastrophe, or toward a lot worse lives, in order to dictate what language is used in the Ukie schools and to place effectively useless Nato armies on the Russian border. The people in charge are either desperate or complete idiots.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Unintended Consequence

    are simply stupid people with initiative

    There is Russian joke:
    – What’s more dangerous than a nuclear war?
    – An idiot with initiative.

    Do similar jokes exist in other countries?

  361. @AnonfromTN
    @showmethereal


    That was actually going to be my question… who is financing the reconstruction? Is it local or from “Moscow”? I was also under the impression that the Sea of Azov was very important from an industrial point of view.
     
    To the best of my knowledge (which is not comprehensive), Russia is paying for almost everything. Considering the ravages of Ukie occupation since 2014-15 and further destruction in the current war, Donbass might break even in maybe 10 years and become profitable after that. Economic potential of the sea of Azov will come into play when local production picks up. For many years Donbass will need massive investment from the outside, not just of money, but of construction materials and numerous other products.

    That is not to say that they don’t produce anything. E.g., in Lugansk they make local dry sausage (not salami, Russian/German style dry sausage) that quality-wise can compete with the best produced anywhere in the world. The same is true for equivalent of prosciutto crudo made in Lugansk. It was like that even in Soviet times. Lugansk sausage and high-end meat products were and still are among the best (I say it having tried high quality meats in >20 countries). They make quite a few other things in Donbass that are competitive, but overall production is much lower than needed to finance required massive reconstruction.

    I think Donbass will succeed because most people there have the right attitude. In contrast to many people in Ukraine, who for some inexplicable reason think that everybody owes them, the people I talked to in Lugansk believe that Russia does not owe them anything. They are grateful for the liberation, but see additional help as good will, rather than something due. People solve their problems only when they are ready to do it themselves. Habitual freeloaders are doomed to have shithole for a country.

    Replies: @Beckow, @showmethereal

    Thanks. Interesting note about the attitude of the people. From what I have seen of Crimea the people don’t even consider it liberation …. They seem to be more like “we were always Russia anyway”

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @showmethereal


    From what I have seen of Crimea the people don’t even consider it liberation …. They seem to be more like “we were always Russia anyway”
     
    I guess that’s how they feel. Partly because Crimea left the madhouse without any violence. In contrast, because of exactly the same feelings Donbass experienced eight years of brutal war and occupation, with thousands killed and wounded (e.g., since 2014 Ukies murdered and maimed more than 500 children in Donbass). So, for them it is liberation.

    Replies: @showmethereal

  362. @Mikel
    @AnonfromTN


    Have you noticed that the key things in the foreign policy remain essentially the same regardless which “party” is technically in power?
     
    Yes but that's no big news. Everybody has noticed that the MIC/neocon lobby is very powerful in DC and Congressmen of both parties are loyal to it. However, we now know that a candidate that explicitly promises to change some of those key things in foreign policy can become President (or at least could 6 years ago, demographic changes are happening so fast that I'm not sure that would be possible again).

    The fact that Trump didn't change anything on foreign policy and actually doubled down on everything you mentioned when he became President doesn't necessarily mean that it is impossible to do. Let's not forget that he failed to keep his promises on everything he ran on (except for the Israel Embassy) so at least to a very big extent it was just a personal problem of incompetence and inconsistency. He could have perfectly surrounded himself with anti-interventionist people who shared his campaign message like Buchanan, Rand Paul, Gosar, Tulsi,... and, as Commander in Chief, he had ample power to order troop retreats and abstain from attacking foreign countries. Instead, he filled his Administration with rabid interventionists like Pompeo, Haley, McMaster, Matis, Esper, Bolton... With such choices it's little wonder that he failed to keep campaign promises that he had simply forgotten about.

    There are very strong inertias in American politics, especially when it comes to military and foreign policy matters, and shady cabals do exist but it would be a mistake to conclude that they are all powerful just because because such an idiosyncratic personage as Trump was unable to stand up to them.

    Btw, knowing all the things that he failed to do, are you going to vote for Trump again if he is the nominee? And would you rather have him run instead of someone who has at least been able to take concrete actions on immigration and the woke insanity like DeSantis?

    Replies: @A123, @AnonfromTN

    Trump delivered the MAGA “Anti-War” platform he won on. Everyone understands this objective TRUTH.

    Notable achievements included:

    1. Trump is the first President in modern history to start ZERO new wars. This is a massive achievement that should be celebrated by all Americans.

    It is especially momentous, as Trump had to contend with sociopath Khamenei who was openly trying to provoke a war.

      

    2. Trump pulled U.S. troops out of the kill sack between Turkish and Syrian/Russian lines. “Protecting Oil” was a fig leaf believed by no one. Functionally, the U.S. efforts now provide intelligence on Iranian terrorists operating in Syria and Western Iraq, and little else.

    Trump also made it clear that the U.S. would not support Erdogan’s aggression. The NATO defensive alliance would not back a Turkish offensive operation.

    3. Trump effectively ended the Afghan War.

      

    Gen. SJW Milley’s treachery was avoided. We will never know if that was Trump personally not trusting the traitor. Or, if senior staff headed off the trap. Probably both. If Trump received the 2nd term that he won at the ballot box, there would have been a deal & orderly pull out centered on Bagram.
    ___

    MAGA (under Donald Trump) ratcheted down SJW Globalist Forever Wars across the globe.

    What more could anyone want that is “actually achievable”?

    Did Trump score 100% of absolutely, totally, everything, across the entire globe? Of course not, that simply was not available. No President can possibly deliver 100% of absolutely, totally, everything. The American system does NOT work that way.
    ___

    Knowing all the things that Trump succeeded at in limiting the MIC, why would anyone not vote for him?

    Would you rather have DeSantis, a candidate with minimal national experience & track record? How do you know this retired military officer is not 100%+ MIC compliant?

    For everyone rational who wants to reduce foreign entanglements, the choice is undeniably clear & obvious. TRUMP 2024

    A primary vote for DeSantis is a vote for Brandon, Mikel’s true choice for President.

    #LetsGoBrandon 😇

     

    • Replies: @Mikel
    @A123

    Sorry to be blunt but I wasn't talking to you. Your comments on this topic (whether you believe what you say or not, that's never been very clear to me) are extremely predictable, repetitive and spammy.

    You may not be able to understand this but, unlike you, I'm not a fanboy of anybody and my expectations with any Republican are low. In fact, I'm not sure I'll vote for DeSantis, we'll see. Blindly backing any candidate like you do is for losers. I only care about policies and the main ones for me are end to wars and foreign interventions; closing the border and making sure the US retains something resembling its historical demographic composition; combating wokeness; promoting economic prosperity. Candidates are secondary and you usually have to choose the lesser evil that will hopefully advance at least part of what you believe in.

    Replies: @A123

  363. @AnonfromTN
    @Beckow


    This is a civilizational war
     
    My impression is that Putin was planning for a local skirmish, just beating back imperial advance into Ukraine to encircle Russia. However, by getting into it to the hilt the West made it an existential geopolitical struggle. Bankrupt empire wants to retain its dominance, other forces, including Russia, want to put an end to its dominance and reformat the world, making it multi-polar. In a way, the empire was right to start this struggle as early as possible: with every passing year its power wanes. Naturally, the empire does not give a hoot about Ukies, they are disposable cannon fodder in this geopolitical struggle.

    So they are poking the bear and giggling like idiots thinking that it is all about the poking – it is not going to end well.
     
    Bismarck (who was no friend or admirer of Russia) rightly said more than a century ago about potential war with Russia that he knows many ways of making the bear leave his lair, but not a single way of making it go back.

    Replies: @Beckow

    …Putin was planning for a local skirmish, just beating back imperial advance into Ukraine to encircle Russia.

    If he really was, he was deluding himself. The idea that the West would back down – after decades of investments, planning, endless seminars and weapons – was not realistic. It wasn’t the West he misread but the Ukies – for some reason Putin&Co. thought that Ukies would back down, would act rationally, refuse to be martyrs.

    As we have seen in the modern world almost anything can be manipulated and people lack basic survival and reasoning skills – the ones with money, brains are resources are allowed to leave, hysteria is stirred up, a bit of outright suppression, and the remaining masses of Ukie men left with few choices are marched into muddy fields to die. The bizarre show goes on with the leader in green sweat-pants, visiting dignitaries, new narratives invented daily and dutifully repeated in the Western media. That’s the world we live in. I am increasingly skeptical if it is really that important to save it from a big boom 🙂

    Bismarck…rightly said he knows many ways of making the bear leave his lair, but not a single way of making it go back.

    These guys decided to slay the bear so they need him to come out. They suffer from what is called paradoxical thinking – trying to prove that what is accepted as truth is not true at all, that it can be changed.

    They think they can kill the bear – the way they think that Normandy invasion defeated Hitler, or that a woman is not defined by biology. Paradoxical thinking appeals to people who are reasonably smart but lack life experience. It is not only reality that they miss and the inevitable propaganda self-delusions, they also seek drama – the way their lives have been shaped by cheesy Hollywood narratives.

    (It is not particularly new, read Shakespeare to see the phenomenon of over-dramatizing everything – it is good entertainment, but deadly when allowed to rule our lives.)

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Beckow


    If he really was, he was deluding himself.
     
    IMO, that’s the mistake Putin often makes: he overestimates the sanity and intelligence of his adversaries. It is common in Russia to make fun of his manner of calling Western scum “partners”. Judging by what Russia is doing now, he learned his lesson.
  364. @AnonfromTN
    @sudden death


    Should better try explain this to rocketry experts in Kremlin, cause they seem to not know those basic facts about intergrid connections in those places
     
    I am sure they know, but decided that it cannot be helped. It appears that their objective it to damage power and transport infrastructure in Ukraine enough to prevent it moving its troops and Western weapons and ammo. The war is more than nine months old, but Russia did not target Ukrainian power and transport infrastructure until NATO started sending large amounts of military materiel to Ukraine. Actions have consequences.

    Replies: @sudden death, @Jazman

    Kiev regime literally lost more than entire inventory of US Army by this point.
    Russia targets substations and power lines,something that can be easily repaired in peacetime.
    And for people in affected areas there are two choices.
    First is to run. Run like hell while there is still a possibility to run.
    Second is to attempt a regime change.This is next to impossible because a)Kiev regime is a terrorist one and will simply murder anybody opposing it and b)locals in Kiev especially are pretty brainwashed…which is why most of them didn’t run yet.
    Latter is also the reason why Russia sending a diversionary force to Kiev in February was a diversionary force and not a real one.
    Nobody needs several million un-loyal, ungrateful neobarbarian freeloaders.
    Mexicans at least can and will work!

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Jazman


    Russia targets substations and power lines
     
    The domino effect started in Ukrainian electric grid: due to overload quite a few transformers in the remaining substations self-destructed (blew up and caught fire or just caught fire).

    Nobody needs several million un-loyal, ungrateful neobarbarian freeloaders.
     
    IMO, that’s the greatest problem Putin and his team are trying to solve: to reformat Ukraine while avoiding saddling Russian economy with millions of freeloaders. Regardless of their loyalty: a pig is loyal to the trough where the food is, but that loyalty is worthless.
  365. @Mikel
    @AnonfromTN


    Have you noticed that the key things in the foreign policy remain essentially the same regardless which “party” is technically in power?
     
    Yes but that's no big news. Everybody has noticed that the MIC/neocon lobby is very powerful in DC and Congressmen of both parties are loyal to it. However, we now know that a candidate that explicitly promises to change some of those key things in foreign policy can become President (or at least could 6 years ago, demographic changes are happening so fast that I'm not sure that would be possible again).

    The fact that Trump didn't change anything on foreign policy and actually doubled down on everything you mentioned when he became President doesn't necessarily mean that it is impossible to do. Let's not forget that he failed to keep his promises on everything he ran on (except for the Israel Embassy) so at least to a very big extent it was just a personal problem of incompetence and inconsistency. He could have perfectly surrounded himself with anti-interventionist people who shared his campaign message like Buchanan, Rand Paul, Gosar, Tulsi,... and, as Commander in Chief, he had ample power to order troop retreats and abstain from attacking foreign countries. Instead, he filled his Administration with rabid interventionists like Pompeo, Haley, McMaster, Matis, Esper, Bolton... With such choices it's little wonder that he failed to keep campaign promises that he had simply forgotten about.

    There are very strong inertias in American politics, especially when it comes to military and foreign policy matters, and shady cabals do exist but it would be a mistake to conclude that they are all powerful just because because such an idiosyncratic personage as Trump was unable to stand up to them.

    Btw, knowing all the things that he failed to do, are you going to vote for Trump again if he is the nominee? And would you rather have him run instead of someone who has at least been able to take concrete actions on immigration and the woke insanity like DeSantis?

    Replies: @A123, @AnonfromTN

    we now know that a candidate that explicitly promises to change some of those key things in foreign policy can become President (or at least could 6 years ago,

    We also know that even though he utterly failed to change the suicidal course, the cabal hates his guts and is prepared to break any law and completely destroy the legal system to hurt him and his supporters. If he were smarter, more competent, and actually started doing what he promised, the cabal would do to him what they did to Kennedy.

    Btw, knowing all the things that he failed to do, are you going to vote for Trump again if he is the nominee? And would you rather have him run instead of someone who has at least been able to take concrete actions on immigration and the woke insanity like DeSantis?

    If I vote in 2024 (I did not make up my mind yet), I am going to vote against every Democrat on the ballot. IMO, Democrats are guilty of too many things. They nominated an evil bitch in 2016 (remember her mad witch chuckle when she talked about brutal murder of Ghaddafi), and then in 2020 they nominated a person who is corrupt to the core, was always dumb, and now has severe Alzheimer’s. They resorted to unprecedented in the US history election fraud to get this half-corpse “elected”. They are guilty of blatantly lying about covid and forcing useless “vaccinations” on the population (BTW, one of the decisions of Nuremberg tribunal was that performing a medical procedure on a person against his/her will is a crime). They are guilty of bringing the world to the brink of nuclear war. They are guilty of many other things, but these alone would suffice to lock them up for life under the rule of law (some in jail, others in madhouse inside jail).

    So, if Trump ends up being the nominee, I would vote for him. But I would like Republicans to nominate someone more competent and mature than that narcissistic 70-year old teenager.

    • Thanks: S
    • Replies: @A123
    @AnonfromTN


    They resorted to unprecedented in the US history election fraud to get this half-corpse “elected”.
    ...
    So, if Trump ends up being the nominee, I would vote for him. But I would like Republicans to nominate someone more competent
     
    The problem is not competence. Trump's 1st Term was sabotaged.
        • Mitch McConnell hates MAGA
        • Mitch McConnell controlled Senate confirmations (Judicial and Cabinet)

    Trump had to horse trade for every nomination and thus got, at most, 50% of who he wanted. Does anyone believe Trump voluntarily chose:
        ∞ Mrs. Mitch McConnell, Elaine Chao?
        ∞ John Bolton
    The way that Trump abused & humiliated Bolton with media Bad Cop/Good Cop was both entertaining and effective. He sent Boston out to state something NeoCon (Bad Cop) so Trump could overrule him (Good Cop).

    20/20 hindsight, selecting Jeff Sessions was the worst mistake of Trump's 1st term. "Judas" Sessions empowered the Russia, Russia, Russia myth, which derailed any relations reset with Putin. However, it is hard to blame this on lack of competence. The selection was highly competent. Sessions's betrayal was a complete shock that happened with no warning.
    ____

    After winning in 2020, why would Trump step aside (other than medical condition)?

    There is one-and-only-one practical, guaranteed way to prevent future runs for President. Term Limits. Once Trump uses up his 2nd Term, that is it, forever.

    If somehow 2024 is also stolen. That simply sets up TRUMP 2028. If you want to see a new MAGA leader in 2028, your best (and only) choice is helping Trump in 2024.

    #LetsGoBrandon 😇

    , @Mikel
    @AnonfromTN


    So, if Trump ends up being the nominee, I would vote for him. But I would like Republicans to nominate someone more competent and mature than that narcissistic 70-year old teenager.
     
    Fair enough. But, unlike in finance, in politics past performance is quite a reliable predictor of future performance, especially with an 80-year old narcissist, so if by any miracle he won in 2024, we may end up getting all you want to avoid from the Democrats and then some more.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  366. @Beckow
    @German_reader

    Sure, West isn't monolithic but the dominant faction wants an all out war, or to push it to the absolute limit. The Greens - whether today, Maoist, or genderless freaks - are simply stupid people with initiative. The kind of people who in the past joined massive revolutionary movements or religious revivals. Their libido is in the wrong place.

    The EU freak-show is just the beginning: everything and everyone will be demonized, the language categories will be stretched, the most egregious nonsense will be tried - and applauded. It will also happen in Russia, more slowly, but possibly more deadly. The worst thing that could happen is Putin leaving, replaced with hot-heads who match Poland and the English media in determination and irresponsibility.

    It is almost amusing, seeing the inevitable steps, the loss of the common sense, the rush to create mayhem, all the time forgetting that the underlying issues - at least officially - are actually very minor. So minor that they can't be openly discussed in the West. It would be embarrassing to admit that we are rushing toward a catastrophe, or toward a lot worse lives, in order to dictate what language is used in the Ukie schools and to place effectively useless Nato armies on the Russian border. The people in charge are either desperate or complete idiots.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Unintended Consequence

    “The Greens – whether today, Maoist, or genderless freaks – are simply stupid people with initiative. The kind of people who in the past joined massive revolutionary movements or religious revivals.”

    I am certainly no fan of Greens with their ideas based in fanaticism more than science. However, the Greens in Belgium made a strong statement on war as it is linked to the environment by refusing to send Britain some components related to their nuclear arsenal today. Seems the Green party won an election there and will be in committee soon to make similar decisions so were allowed to anticipate the formal proceedings.

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @Unintended Consequence

    The Belgian Greens come through, wow :)...well, it could be real or a faint, but I will wait for more sustained and substantial Green actions before I would even start listening to them. Maybe it is a simple controlled opposition trick...

  367. @showmethereal
    @AnonfromTN

    Thanks. Interesting note about the attitude of the people. From what I have seen of Crimea the people don’t even consider it liberation …. They seem to be more like “we were always Russia anyway”

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    From what I have seen of Crimea the people don’t even consider it liberation …. They seem to be more like “we were always Russia anyway”

    I guess that’s how they feel. Partly because Crimea left the madhouse without any violence. In contrast, because of exactly the same feelings Donbass experienced eight years of brutal war and occupation, with thousands killed and wounded (e.g., since 2014 Ukies murdered and maimed more than 500 children in Donbass). So, for them it is liberation.

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @AnonfromTN

    I saw where people in Kherson region were glad at the integration of the healthcare system to Russian standards…. I saw many young people in the Donbass region saying it would make it was for them to go to university in Russia. But of course I would assume Russia would want them to return to help develop the region. Correct?

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  368. @silviosilver
    @Yahya


    I’ve written to Philip Owen before that i’m only interested in higher forms of musical expression from other cultures.
     
    Yeah, I suspected as much. The thing is, they seem to me to be so closely associated with that culture (or with a particular people/nation) that it creates a barrier for me to completely enjoy it. I don't mean because I find it too alien, I mean it makes me feel like something of an "imposter," like I'm illicitly encroaching on them. With pop music, the themes are universal, and even if the performer is an avowed 'racist,' it's like so what, they can't stop me enjoying it since the music has no obvious connection with anything culturally particular.

    Btw, talking about pop music in the other post, how could I forget to mention 80s Italian pop? That's probably my favorite, or co-favorite with English-language 80s, and just as good. I'll nominate three songs that best capture it for me, Giuni Russo - Un'estate al mare, Stadio -Acqua e sapone, Franco Battiato - Centro di gravita permanente. Trashy? Yeah, okay. I never claimed to be a musical sophisticate. (That last one is kinda profound though. Supposedly inspired by Gurdjieff themes. The chorus means something like "I'm looking for a permanent center of gravity that never changes my mind about things and people", ie some stable standpoint from which to make sense of the phantasmagorical stimulation that postmodern culture assaults our senses with. That song could be the anthem of a lot of people on this blog - and in wider society - besides me.)

    I'll use the example of a scene in the Spanish movie "Vengo" (because I wanted to ask you something else about it too). The film is about some rivalry between Spanish gypsies ("gitanos") and features a lot of flamenco music and dance. If you go to the scene at the 19 minute mark /watch?v=ViCVxYO8r0A&t=1140s [I trust you're able to append that to after the .com after youtube ] you'll see that's some pretty powerful performance by the singer at the table (no idea what she's singing about). The 'soldiers' (or maybe guardia civils) at the next are getting into the music, and eventually they get up and crowd around the singer's table and get into it even more. Now, if I had happened to be at that restaurant, even if it's unlikely I'd be eyed as a racial outsider, and even if I could do that rhythmic hand-clapping, I still wouldn't attempt to join in, because that seems like it's something very culturally particular and it would feel very inauthentic for me to attempt to join in. You follow?

    Of course, a lot depends on the context in which a piece of music is performed. When they were composed, Wagner's works were pointedly Germanic, and if the current year were 1922 instead of 2022, there isn't a chance could I enjoy them the way, say, a Hitler could. But western culture has been promoting itself as universal culture for so long now, that Wagner becomes accessible in a way he previously wasn't. On the other hand, a piece like "Concierto de Aranjuez," which was composed (at least ostensibly) to celebrate the Nationalist victory in the Spanish Civil War (but I which prefer as the vocal arrangement in French, "Mon Amour"), by the time it achieved international acclaim, WWII was over, so it slotted fairly neatly into the "universalist" category. Similarly, James Last's "The Lonely Shepherd" (made famous by pan-flutist Gheorghe Zamfir) was "universalist" from the outset, but if it had been composed in a context in which the Nazis had won WWII, reactions to it may well have been very different.

    The other thing I wanted to ask you about that movie is, if you go to the beginning, there seems to be a diverse crowd of Spaniards and Arabs making their way to a little "castle," where a flamenco performance is taking place, but which then morphs into some Arabic number. (Normally, when I hear "fusion," I think "run," because it's going to be something godawful but this wasn't so bad, lol.) My question is: is that an Arabic style you recognize, and if so, what is it and what is its origin?

    Replies: @Yahya

    The thing is, they seem to me to be so closely associated with that culture (or with a particular people/nation) that it creates a barrier for me to completely enjoy it.

    I can see where you’re coming from with the “cultural barrier” thing. Though I ultimately I don’t agree; for me the barrier is no impediment to enjoying an artistic piece of music. In fact, I find that the intellectual component of “high-art” music makes it easier for me to identify with the piece, because I feel like it is operating on the same wavelength, as opposed to some pop tune designed to appeal to the lowest common denominator. The composer of a classical piece is targeting a tiny subset of the population, whereas a pop musician is aiming too broadly for it to “speak to me”, if you get what I mean. Also, a classical piece isn’t really designed to get you to identify with it or “join in” the same way a pop song would.

    As you can probably tell, I listen to a lot of folk music from around the world. Folk music is nothing if not ethnically particular, but it doesn’t stop me from enjoying it. Now, I do acknowledge that getting into Arabic folk music is a lot easier, and elicits a greater emotional reaction, than listening to foreign folk music. But i’ve also enjoyed listening to non-Arabic folk music, even from cultures that are immensely distant from my own. Japanese people are as alien to me as they come; yet I have been moved greatly by this tune:

    It’s one of my favorite songs of all-time and the first I learned to play on the piano.

    But western culture has been promoting itself as universal culture for so long now, that Wagner becomes accessible in a way he previously wasn’t.

    Yes I’ve heard of the refrain before that Western music is “universal” and belongs to everyone etc. including oddly by Edward Said. I have to disagree completely with that notion; to me it is clear that that genre was developed in a very peculiar place and context which makes it uniquely Western. I also disagree, and to some extent am annoyed, with the premise that Western music is “universal” while everyone else’s is just “ethnic” music or lumped into a generic and overly broad “world music” category. Why should East Asian music, which utilizes 5-tone pentatonic scales and simple time divisions, be put in the same category as Middle Eastern music, which uses 7-tone scales and a wide variety of modes and complex time divisions? The two are clearly as different to each other as Western music is to them.

    Much as I enjoy Beethoven or Mozart or Rachmaninov or Szymanowski etc. they aren’t really universal musicians, but were forged out of a specific milieu in Europe. Had they born in Indonesia or Egypt or Peru, they would not have composed the music they did. Now it’s true that some people from non-Western countries have taken to composing European classical music. But they remain obscure to the vast majority of people in their home countries, practically no-one listens to them (except me!). I don’t think European classical music has reached enough of an audience in non-Western nations to truly be classified as universal.

    My question is: is that an Arabic style you recognize, and if so, what is it and what is its origin?

    I immediately recognized the outfits and the people – they are Upper Egyptian (“Saidi”) peasants. The people who have been tilling the fertile plains of Egypt since the dawn of civilization. They have a unique culture which is quite separate from the urbanized townfolk; which you can immediately tell by their peculiar manner of dress. The music they were playing was Saidi Egyptian folklore. I’m not surprised it fuses well with gypsy music; the clue is in the name.

    I couldn’t really get into them, tbh. Some of them took like three minutes for the vocals to begin. I just don’t have that kind of patience, lol.

    Well this whole thread on music just reinforced my notions that musical tastes are too different; it’s impossible to guess which songs will resonate with another person. I don’t think any of us liked each other’s recommendations. My response to the Colombian playlist was roughly similar to yours; the rhythms are neat, nice to listen to, but ultimately I probably won’t be going back to listen to them frequently. Perhaps if I force myself I could get into Colombian music the same way I did Indian or Turkish or Japanese music.

    But dammit, I would’ve been content had you liked at least one of the songs I recommended. But now I’m compelled to give some more suggestions. This time I will try to tailor it to your tastes, given the new information you’ve presented to me.

    [MORE]

    1) Ehzar and Ya Ossas

    Starting off on the pop side, my favorite all-time singer Julia Boutros, whom I hesitated to mention again in my previous comment for fear of beating on a dead horse. But I love her music (at least some of it), have to put in a word. She has two types of songs: 1) nationalistic/patriotic Lebanese or pan-Arab songs and 2) romantic love songs. The former is what I listen to; can’t stand the romantic mumbo-jumbo (true of any singer really). But I suppose the “particularism” of her nationalistic songs will put you off, so I’m going to attach two songs of hers, one from each category.

    You’ll probably be able to guess which one is which just by quickly listening to the instrumentals.

    2) Ya Zahratan Fi Khayali

    This one is an “Arab tango” originally composed by Syrian Druze émigré Farid Al-Atrash in the 20th century; but performed here by an Armenian singer born in Lebanon:

    I like the instrumentation of this rendition much better than the original. There are a surprisingly large number of excellent renditions of this famous song, some of which include:

    Mirna Kassis (Assyrian):

    Faia Younan (Assyrian): (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WV0IOOinRXk&ab_channel=rihabchahba)

    Aseel Massoud (Syrian): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LqlRNnW2GTs&ab_channel=ATHRODEELAhmad%26Aseel

    Serouj Kradjian (Armenian): (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FfZAYGYKpj8)

    Valdimir Troshin (Russian): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44pqhknYvMI&ab_channel=FaridHQ%D9%81%D8%B1%D9%8A%D8%AF

    3) Ya Rayah

    Over to the Maghreb, a jovial tune by the excellent El Gusto Orchestra; this one I’m sure you will like. Hard not to feel upbeat after listening to this track.

    This music belongs to the category of Algerian Chaabi music. The orchestra is comprised of veteran Algerian Muslim and Jewish musicians who were reunited after 50 years of separation owing to the creation of Israel and subsequent flight of Algeria’s Jewish population. The creation of the orchestra has led to a rediscovery of their music, a mix of Andalusian and Berber sounds and religious chants which incorporates strong, guttural singing with an accompanying piano, flute, strings and percussion. The resulting sound is remarkably textured and harmonious. The NYT wrote an article on this orchestra here if you’re interested: https://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/13/arts/music/algerian-chaabi-musicians-reunite-in-the-band-el-gusto.html

    4) Mabrouk

    Another pop tune, this time by Yemeni singer Balqees:

    Here i’m hoping the percussion will appeal to you as it is roughly similar to Saidi Egyptian folklore. Balqees’ music is a cut below Julia’s in terms of both the quality of instrumentation and vocal ability. This is evident in their live concerts; the Lebanese singer sounds much better whereas the Yemeni singer requires the aid of a studio sound engineering. Both though are vastly superior to 99% of pop artists around the globe.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Yahya


    The music they were playing was Saidi Egyptian folklore. I’m not surprised it fuses well with gypsy music; the clue is in the name.
     
    Have you heard of the "Egyptians" ethnic group in the balkans? I am pretty sure they are just gypsies, but they claim descent from Egyptians (a local variation on the we wuz kangz theme).

    But dammit, I would’ve been content had you liked at least one of the songs I recommended. But now I’m compelled to give some more suggestions.
     
    I am very moody when it comes to what music and what movies I enjoy. For weeks, sometimes months, at a time I will get into a certain kind of music or certain genre of film and listen/watch almost exclusively that, and then abruptly tire of it and move onto something else, but I always find myself circling back around eventually. I really wouldn't do justice to your selections to listen to them now, as I'm just not in that kind of mood. Sorry.

    Replies: @Yahya

  369. @Beckow
    @AnonfromTN


    ...Putin was planning for a local skirmish, just beating back imperial advance into Ukraine to encircle Russia.
     
    If he really was, he was deluding himself. The idea that the West would back down - after decades of investments, planning, endless seminars and weapons - was not realistic. It wasn't the West he misread but the Ukies - for some reason Putin&Co. thought that Ukies would back down, would act rationally, refuse to be martyrs.

    As we have seen in the modern world almost anything can be manipulated and people lack basic survival and reasoning skills - the ones with money, brains are resources are allowed to leave, hysteria is stirred up, a bit of outright suppression, and the remaining masses of Ukie men left with few choices are marched into muddy fields to die. The bizarre show goes on with the leader in green sweat-pants, visiting dignitaries, new narratives invented daily and dutifully repeated in the Western media. That's the world we live in. I am increasingly skeptical if it is really that important to save it from a big boom :)


    Bismarck...rightly said he knows many ways of making the bear leave his lair, but not a single way of making it go back.
     
    These guys decided to slay the bear so they need him to come out. They suffer from what is called paradoxical thinking - trying to prove that what is accepted as truth is not true at all, that it can be changed.

    They think they can kill the bear - the way they think that Normandy invasion defeated Hitler, or that a woman is not defined by biology. Paradoxical thinking appeals to people who are reasonably smart but lack life experience. It is not only reality that they miss and the inevitable propaganda self-delusions, they also seek drama - the way their lives have been shaped by cheesy Hollywood narratives.

    (It is not particularly new, read Shakespeare to see the phenomenon of over-dramatizing everything - it is good entertainment, but deadly when allowed to rule our lives.)

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    If he really was, he was deluding himself.

    IMO, that’s the mistake Putin often makes: he overestimates the sanity and intelligence of his adversaries. It is common in Russia to make fun of his manner of calling Western scum “partners”. Judging by what Russia is doing now, he learned his lesson.

  370. @AnonfromTN
    @Mikel


    we now know that a candidate that explicitly promises to change some of those key things in foreign policy can become President (or at least could 6 years ago,
     
    We also know that even though he utterly failed to change the suicidal course, the cabal hates his guts and is prepared to break any law and completely destroy the legal system to hurt him and his supporters. If he were smarter, more competent, and actually started doing what he promised, the cabal would do to him what they did to Kennedy.

    Btw, knowing all the things that he failed to do, are you going to vote for Trump again if he is the nominee? And would you rather have him run instead of someone who has at least been able to take concrete actions on immigration and the woke insanity like DeSantis?
     
    If I vote in 2024 (I did not make up my mind yet), I am going to vote against every Democrat on the ballot. IMO, Democrats are guilty of too many things. They nominated an evil bitch in 2016 (remember her mad witch chuckle when she talked about brutal murder of Ghaddafi), and then in 2020 they nominated a person who is corrupt to the core, was always dumb, and now has severe Alzheimer’s. They resorted to unprecedented in the US history election fraud to get this half-corpse “elected”. They are guilty of blatantly lying about covid and forcing useless “vaccinations” on the population (BTW, one of the decisions of Nuremberg tribunal was that performing a medical procedure on a person against his/her will is a crime). They are guilty of bringing the world to the brink of nuclear war. They are guilty of many other things, but these alone would suffice to lock them up for life under the rule of law (some in jail, others in madhouse inside jail).

    So, if Trump ends up being the nominee, I would vote for him. But I would like Republicans to nominate someone more competent and mature than that narcissistic 70-year old teenager.

    Replies: @A123, @Mikel

    They resorted to unprecedented in the US history election fraud to get this half-corpse “elected”.

    So, if Trump ends up being the nominee, I would vote for him. But I would like Republicans to nominate someone more competent

    The problem is not competence. Trump’s 1st Term was sabotaged.
        • Mitch McConnell hates MAGA
        • Mitch McConnell controlled Senate confirmations (Judicial and Cabinet)

    Trump had to horse trade for every nomination and thus got, at most, 50% of who he wanted. Does anyone believe Trump voluntarily chose:
        ∞ Mrs. Mitch McConnell, Elaine Chao?
        ∞ John Bolton
    The way that Trump abused & humiliated Bolton with media Bad Cop/Good Cop was both entertaining and effective. He sent Boston out to state something NeoCon (Bad Cop) so Trump could overrule him (Good Cop).

    20/20 hindsight, selecting Jeff Sessions was the worst mistake of Trump’s 1st term. “Judas” Sessions empowered the Russia, Russia, Russia myth, which derailed any relations reset with Putin. However, it is hard to blame this on lack of competence. The selection was highly competent. Sessions’s betrayal was a complete shock that happened with no warning.
    ____

    After winning in 2020, why would Trump step aside (other than medical condition)?

    There is one-and-only-one practical, guaranteed way to prevent future runs for President. Term Limits. Once Trump uses up his 2nd Term, that is it, forever.

    If somehow 2024 is also stolen. That simply sets up TRUMP 2028. If you want to see a new MAGA leader in 2028, your best (and only) choice is helping Trump in 2024.

    #LetsGoBrandon 😇

  371. @A123
    @Mikel

    Trump delivered the MAGA “Anti-War” platform he won on. Everyone understands this objective TRUTH.

    Notable achievements included:

    1. Trump is the first President in modern history to start ZERO new wars. This is a massive achievement that should be celebrated by all Americans.

    It is especially momentous, as Trump had to contend with sociopath Khamenei who was openly trying to provoke a war.

     
    https://joannenova.com.au/wp-content/presidents-wars.jpg
     


    2. Trump pulled U.S. troops out of the kill sack between Turkish and Syrian/Russian lines. “Protecting Oil” was a fig leaf believed by no one. Functionally, the U.S. efforts now provide intelligence on Iranian terrorists operating in Syria and Western Iraq, and little else.

    Trump also made it clear that the U.S. would not support Erdogan’s aggression. The NATO defensive alliance would not back a Turkish offensive operation.

    3. Trump effectively ended the Afghan War.

     
    https://i.dawn.com/primary/2020/10/5f7f8869c725d.jpg
     

    Gen. SJW Milley’s treachery was avoided. We will never know if that was Trump personally not trusting the traitor. Or, if senior staff headed off the trap. Probably both. If Trump received the 2nd term that he won at the ballot box, there would have been a deal & orderly pull out centered on Bagram.
    ___

    MAGA (under Donald Trump) ratcheted down SJW Globalist Forever Wars across the globe.

    What more could anyone want that is “actually achievable”?

    Did Trump score 100% of absolutely, totally, everything, across the entire globe? Of course not, that simply was not available. No President can possibly deliver 100% of absolutely, totally, everything. The American system does NOT work that way.
    ___

    Knowing all the things that Trump succeeded at in limiting the MIC, why would anyone not vote for him?

    Would you rather have DeSantis, a candidate with minimal national experience & track record? How do you know this retired military officer is not 100%+ MIC compliant?

    For everyone rational who wants to reduce foreign entanglements, the choice is undeniably clear & obvious. TRUMP 2024

    A primary vote for DeSantis is a vote for Brandon, Mikel's true choice for President.

    #LetsGoBrandon 😇

     
    https://i.ebayimg.com/thumbs/images/g/6NMAAOSwfA5gro69/s-l1600.jpg

    Replies: @Mikel

    Sorry to be blunt but I wasn’t talking to you. Your comments on this topic (whether you believe what you say or not, that’s never been very clear to me) are extremely predictable, repetitive and spammy.

    You may not be able to understand this but, unlike you, I’m not a fanboy of anybody and my expectations with any Republican are low. In fact, I’m not sure I’ll vote for DeSantis, we’ll see. Blindly backing any candidate like you do is for losers. I only care about policies and the main ones for me are end to wars and foreign interventions; closing the border and making sure the US retains something resembling its historical demographic composition; combating wokeness; promoting economic prosperity. Candidates are secondary and you usually have to choose the lesser evil that will hopefully advance at least part of what you believe in.

    • Replies: @A123
    @Mikel

    Sorry to be blunt but your persistent lies have to be countered with the TRUTH.

    Your deception on this topic is extremely predictable, repetitive, and serves the SJW Globalist agenda. I strongly suspect you do not believe what you post as it sounds like mindless regurgitation of debunked DNC talking points.


    I only care about policies and the main ones for me are end to wars and foreign interventions; closing the border and making sure the US retains something resembling its historical demographic composition; combating wokeness; promoting economic prosperity.
     
    So you want what Trump successfully delivered to the maximum extent possible given non-MAGA opposition within both parties (e.g. Mitch McConnell). Especially, "end to wars and foreign interventions".

    While every conflict, everywhere, was not 100% concluded within 4 years. -- As a matter of objective fact:
        • Active wars were reduced
        • No new wars were started
    This is an amazing achievement considering the war provocation delivered by Khamenei. Why do you refuse to give credit where it is due? It seems like you are hyper focused on Trump as a candidate, incapable of seeing the larger potential of MAGA.

    Everyone notices you were unable to counter a single FACT I presented above and are now attempting, unsuccessfully, to shift the focus. If you want what you say, why are you not backing Trump's proven successes? One has to believe you are being untruthful. Or, I concede, possibly self delusional.

    All of things on your list can be delivered by supporting MAGA over the long haul. And, there is any easy path for that.
        -- Trump in 2024.
        -- Followed by likely DeSantis in 2028 and 2032.

    Trying to blowup MAGA by having DeSantis make an anti-MAGA run against Trump in 2024 simply makes no sense. Especially, as you have no proof he will be better. Signs are good, but he should wait to take over the MAGA reins gracefully in 2028. And, I suspect that is what will happen. DeSantis has no pressing need to go head to head with Trump.


    Candidates are secondary
     
    If candidates are secondary. Why do you have this total commitment against Trump as a candidate? Something does not add up.

    If you genuinely believe what you say. You have an easy choice. Treat candidates as secondary, as you say you believe. Stop lying about candidate Trump's record. After all that record is to you, secondary. Right?

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @Mikel

  372. @Jazman
    @AnonfromTN

    Kiev regime literally lost more than entire inventory of US Army by this point.
    Russia targets substations and power lines,something that can be easily repaired in peacetime.
    And for people in affected areas there are two choices.
    First is to run. Run like hell while there is still a possibility to run.
    Second is to attempt a regime change.This is next to impossible because a)Kiev regime is a terrorist one and will simply murder anybody opposing it and b)locals in Kiev especially are pretty brainwashed...which is why most of them didn't run yet.
    Latter is also the reason why Russia sending a diversionary force to Kiev in February was a diversionary force and not a real one.
    Nobody needs several million un-loyal, ungrateful neobarbarian freeloaders.
    Mexicans at least can and will work!

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    Russia targets substations and power lines

    The domino effect started in Ukrainian electric grid: due to overload quite a few transformers in the remaining substations self-destructed (blew up and caught fire or just caught fire).

    Nobody needs several million un-loyal, ungrateful neobarbarian freeloaders.

    IMO, that’s the greatest problem Putin and his team are trying to solve: to reformat Ukraine while avoiding saddling Russian economy with millions of freeloaders. Regardless of their loyalty: a pig is loyal to the trough where the food is, but that loyalty is worthless.

  373. @AnonfromTN
    @Mikel


    we now know that a candidate that explicitly promises to change some of those key things in foreign policy can become President (or at least could 6 years ago,
     
    We also know that even though he utterly failed to change the suicidal course, the cabal hates his guts and is prepared to break any law and completely destroy the legal system to hurt him and his supporters. If he were smarter, more competent, and actually started doing what he promised, the cabal would do to him what they did to Kennedy.

    Btw, knowing all the things that he failed to do, are you going to vote for Trump again if he is the nominee? And would you rather have him run instead of someone who has at least been able to take concrete actions on immigration and the woke insanity like DeSantis?
     
    If I vote in 2024 (I did not make up my mind yet), I am going to vote against every Democrat on the ballot. IMO, Democrats are guilty of too many things. They nominated an evil bitch in 2016 (remember her mad witch chuckle when she talked about brutal murder of Ghaddafi), and then in 2020 they nominated a person who is corrupt to the core, was always dumb, and now has severe Alzheimer’s. They resorted to unprecedented in the US history election fraud to get this half-corpse “elected”. They are guilty of blatantly lying about covid and forcing useless “vaccinations” on the population (BTW, one of the decisions of Nuremberg tribunal was that performing a medical procedure on a person against his/her will is a crime). They are guilty of bringing the world to the brink of nuclear war. They are guilty of many other things, but these alone would suffice to lock them up for life under the rule of law (some in jail, others in madhouse inside jail).

    So, if Trump ends up being the nominee, I would vote for him. But I would like Republicans to nominate someone more competent and mature than that narcissistic 70-year old teenager.

    Replies: @A123, @Mikel

    So, if Trump ends up being the nominee, I would vote for him. But I would like Republicans to nominate someone more competent and mature than that narcissistic 70-year old teenager.

    Fair enough. But, unlike in finance, in politics past performance is quite a reliable predictor of future performance, especially with an 80-year old narcissist, so if by any miracle he won in 2024, we may end up getting all you want to avoid from the Democrats and then some more.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Mikel


    if by any miracle he won in 2024, we may end up getting all you want to avoid from the Democrats and then some more.
     
    If he puts a stop to woke insanity, uncontrolled immigration, and forced “vaccination”, it would be an improvement. His con-man approach to contacts with foreign leaders is also a lot more reasonable than what we have now. But you are right, there is little reason to believe that anything else would improve.

    Replies: @A123

  374. @Mikel
    @AnonfromTN


    So, if Trump ends up being the nominee, I would vote for him. But I would like Republicans to nominate someone more competent and mature than that narcissistic 70-year old teenager.
     
    Fair enough. But, unlike in finance, in politics past performance is quite a reliable predictor of future performance, especially with an 80-year old narcissist, so if by any miracle he won in 2024, we may end up getting all you want to avoid from the Democrats and then some more.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    if by any miracle he won in 2024, we may end up getting all you want to avoid from the Democrats and then some more.

    If he puts a stop to woke insanity, uncontrolled immigration, and forced “vaccination”, it would be an improvement. His con-man approach to contacts with foreign leaders is also a lot more reasonable than what we have now. But you are right, there is little reason to believe that anything else would improve.

    • Replies: @A123
    @AnonfromTN


    If [Trump] puts a stop to woke insanity, uncontrolled immigration, and forced “vaccination”, it would be an improvement. His con-man approach to contacts with foreign leaders is also a lot more reasonable than what we have now.
     
    In a single 4 year term how much is actually achievable?

    Baring some unprecedented shift, MAGA will not have 60 votes in the Senate to end filibusters. That means some compromise will still be required.

    The big 3 in my book are about jobs:

    • Setting up the framework to gradually decouple from Asia (not just China)
    • Beginning MAGA Reindustrialization
    • Limiting migration both legal & illegal

    I am not sure why you describe toughness as "con man". He did a pretty good job in foreign policy standing up (while sitting down) to unreasonable Euro SJW dribble.

     
    https://api.time.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/donald-trump-angela-merkel-g7-summit.jpg
     

    In your opinion, Who is the last President to do better than Trump on foreign policy? The pickings are quite slim. Reagan perhaps?

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  375. @Mikel
    @A123

    Sorry to be blunt but I wasn't talking to you. Your comments on this topic (whether you believe what you say or not, that's never been very clear to me) are extremely predictable, repetitive and spammy.

    You may not be able to understand this but, unlike you, I'm not a fanboy of anybody and my expectations with any Republican are low. In fact, I'm not sure I'll vote for DeSantis, we'll see. Blindly backing any candidate like you do is for losers. I only care about policies and the main ones for me are end to wars and foreign interventions; closing the border and making sure the US retains something resembling its historical demographic composition; combating wokeness; promoting economic prosperity. Candidates are secondary and you usually have to choose the lesser evil that will hopefully advance at least part of what you believe in.

    Replies: @A123

    Sorry to be blunt but your persistent lies have to be countered with the TRUTH.

    Your deception on this topic is extremely predictable, repetitive, and serves the SJW Globalist agenda. I strongly suspect you do not believe what you post as it sounds like mindless regurgitation of debunked DNC talking points.

    I only care about policies and the main ones for me are end to wars and foreign interventions; closing the border and making sure the US retains something resembling its historical demographic composition; combating wokeness; promoting economic prosperity.

    So you want what Trump successfully delivered to the maximum extent possible given non-MAGA opposition within both parties (e.g. Mitch McConnell). Especially, “end to wars and foreign interventions”.

    While every conflict, everywhere, was not 100% concluded within 4 years. — As a matter of objective fact:
        • Active wars were reduced
        • No new wars were started
    This is an amazing achievement considering the war provocation delivered by Khamenei. Why do you refuse to give credit where it is due? It seems like you are hyper focused on Trump as a candidate, incapable of seeing the larger potential of MAGA.

    Everyone notices you were unable to counter a single FACT I presented above and are now attempting, unsuccessfully, to shift the focus. If you want what you say, why are you not backing Trump’s proven successes? One has to believe you are being untruthful. Or, I concede, possibly self delusional.

    All of things on your list can be delivered by supporting MAGA over the long haul. And, there is any easy path for that.
        — Trump in 2024.
        — Followed by likely DeSantis in 2028 and 2032.

    Trying to blowup MAGA by having DeSantis make an anti-MAGA run against Trump in 2024 simply makes no sense. Especially, as you have no proof he will be better. Signs are good, but he should wait to take over the MAGA reins gracefully in 2028. And, I suspect that is what will happen. DeSantis has no pressing need to go head to head with Trump.

    Candidates are secondary

    If candidates are secondary. Why do you have this total commitment against Trump as a candidate? Something does not add up.

    If you genuinely believe what you say. You have an easy choice. Treat candidates as secondary, as you say you believe. Stop lying about candidate Trump’s record. After all that record is to you, secondary. Right?

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @Mikel
    @A123


    Everyone notices you were unable to counter a single FACT I presented above
     
    Sorry if I hurt your feelings by not debating your points. I always have plenty of activities programmed for the weekends and they take precedence over online debates, especially of the kind you like to engage in. To be totally fair, you did manage to come up with a couple of decent excuses of why one would take part in an election knowing that it was rigged but the whole idea of Democrats being able to steal the elections with the help of traitor Republicans and Trumpists still wanting to take part in those elections is nutty.

    Btw, you also hurt my feelings when I saw that you didn't include accusations of being a covert Muslim in your tirade against me. I found it unfair that only some commenters get the Islamist treatment from you. What do I have to do to join that club?

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @A123

  376. @AnonfromTN
    @Mikel


    if by any miracle he won in 2024, we may end up getting all you want to avoid from the Democrats and then some more.
     
    If he puts a stop to woke insanity, uncontrolled immigration, and forced “vaccination”, it would be an improvement. His con-man approach to contacts with foreign leaders is also a lot more reasonable than what we have now. But you are right, there is little reason to believe that anything else would improve.

    Replies: @A123

    If [Trump] puts a stop to woke insanity, uncontrolled immigration, and forced “vaccination”, it would be an improvement. His con-man approach to contacts with foreign leaders is also a lot more reasonable than what we have now.

    In a single 4 year term how much is actually achievable?

    Baring some unprecedented shift, MAGA will not have 60 votes in the Senate to end filibusters. That means some compromise will still be required.

    The big 3 in my book are about jobs:

    • Setting up the framework to gradually decouple from Asia (not just China)
    • Beginning MAGA Reindustrialization
    • Limiting migration both legal & illegal

    I am not sure why you describe toughness as “con man”. He did a pretty good job in foreign policy standing up (while sitting down) to unreasonable Euro SJW dribble.

      

    In your opinion, Who is the last President to do better than Trump on foreign policy? The pickings are quite slim. Reagan perhaps?

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @A123


    Who is the last President to do better than Trump on foreign policy? The pickings are quite slim.
     
    The pickings are indeed slim: not much to choose from. If forced, I’d pick Nixon.

    Your pic is a good illustration of what Russians used to say jokingly: among European politicians only Merkel has balls.

    BTW, a shortage of eggs has recently developed in the UK. As in Russian the same word is used for eggs and balls (like in Spanish – huevos), there are now jokes about Brits not having them.

    Replies: @A123

  377. @A123
    @AnonfromTN


    If [Trump] puts a stop to woke insanity, uncontrolled immigration, and forced “vaccination”, it would be an improvement. His con-man approach to contacts with foreign leaders is also a lot more reasonable than what we have now.
     
    In a single 4 year term how much is actually achievable?

    Baring some unprecedented shift, MAGA will not have 60 votes in the Senate to end filibusters. That means some compromise will still be required.

    The big 3 in my book are about jobs:

    • Setting up the framework to gradually decouple from Asia (not just China)
    • Beginning MAGA Reindustrialization
    • Limiting migration both legal & illegal

    I am not sure why you describe toughness as "con man". He did a pretty good job in foreign policy standing up (while sitting down) to unreasonable Euro SJW dribble.

     
    https://api.time.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/donald-trump-angela-merkel-g7-summit.jpg
     

    In your opinion, Who is the last President to do better than Trump on foreign policy? The pickings are quite slim. Reagan perhaps?

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    Who is the last President to do better than Trump on foreign policy? The pickings are quite slim.

    The pickings are indeed slim: not much to choose from. If forced, I’d pick Nixon.

    Your pic is a good illustration of what Russians used to say jokingly: among European politicians only Merkel has balls.

    BTW, a shortage of eggs has recently developed in the UK. As in Russian the same word is used for eggs and balls (like in Spanish – huevos), there are now jokes about Brits not having them.

    • Agree: A123
    • Replies: @A123
    @AnonfromTN



    Who is the last President to do better than Trump on foreign policy? The pickings are quite slim.
     
    The pickings are indeed slim: not much to choose from. If forced, I’d pick Nixon.

     

    The big three after WW II were serious Ike, JFK, Nixon. However, saying nice things about Nixon could get you in a lot of trouble.


    Your pic is a good illustration of what Russians used to say jokingly: among European politicians only Merkel has balls.
     
    Rumor has it that medication was involved.

     
    https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEjPkjYpzh51VREBpVeYKhkE9s_fLZW_qR-HhTvjmczHOwehYrU0aEir5Ox7JBX-qvGE-sZ1agFTaFZucjgt2Nyw-NirVvSMi5lTqHbyhtbfVCR3LYKh9geR72Vuq655LxCQ6npSIuf9zLF6kOM6s06DVcpN8g4CjW4skf2JFiTrSLh0YMugc2UU247AFQ/s480/90mimb_e12ca10912e5801730b6e3c74f54f3db_15ac78bd_500.jpg
     

    This was also tried on Macron and Trudeau. Alas, the epic Estrogen count on those two prevented the medication from working. Even Big Pharma could not help them.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @silviosilver, @Emil Nikola Richard

  378. @Mr. Hack
    @Yahya

    It's even more difficult for somebody who's not a native or a real connoisseur of Middle Eastern music to discern regional differences. Ardeshir Farah is a native of Iran and Jorge Strunz of Cota Rica. For many years now, they've been playing together and putting together albums of pure exotic joy, including a blend of "highly virtuosic, rhythmic, and improvisation-rich original instrumental compositions, against a backdrop of native sounds, including Spanish, Iranian, Arabic and South American influences. This album is a collection of their Middle Eastern influenced music. Obviously, they surround themselves with top-notch studio musicians too (I particularly like the two violin players that are highlighted within this album). I'd be interested in hearing your opinion of this album, and what regional influences that you detect - enjoy!

    https://open.spotify.com/album/7CKP7tNlbSvmNkaZ0NHb7E?si=sxk00KNnSHqrstAA_ZAKtA

    Replies: @Yahya

    I’d be interested in hearing your opinion of this album, and what regional influences that you detect – enjoy!

    I’ve actually come across their work before, I think it was you actually who posted them?

    Their music tilts more towards Spanish/Andalusian than Middle Eastern.

    Actually I don’t hear much Middle Eastern elements at all.

    Where is the Qanun, the Oud, the Sitar or the Tambur?

    This is Persian classical music:

    Key differences: slower tempo, more melancholy, different tone color.

    Spanish Andalusian music:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j9AxhfJ8xuI&ab_channel=%D7%AA%D7%96%D7%9E%D7%95%D7%A8%D7%AA%D7%99%D7%A8%D7%95%D7%A9%D7%9C%D7%99%D7%9D%D7%9E%D7%96%D7%A8%D7%97%D7%95%D7%9E%D7%A2%D7%A8%D7%91JerusalemOrchestraE%26W

    Musical idea is much closer to Strunz and Farah.

    I have written posts on Arabic, Turkish and Persian classical music here:

    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-198/#comment-5581415

    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-193/#comment-5474079

    [MORE]

    Thanks for the recommendation. Since you are interested in Middle Eastern fusion, I would also recommend checking out the talented Jordanian violinist Layth Sidiq. He has done collaborations with with Greek, Indian and Western musicians.

    Indian-Middle Eastern:

    Greek-Middle Eastern:

    Western-Middle Eastern:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o0UgRMFe3oo&ab_channel=JafraProductions%D8%AC%D9%81%D8%B1%D8%A7%D9%84%D9%84%D8%A5%D9%86%D8%AA%D8%A7%D8%AC

  379. @AnonfromTN
    @LondonBob


    Why would you believe anything in the Spectator? The nukes disinformation talk should immediately discredit the author.
     
    I don’t. Frankly, I do not blindly believe anything from any source. I use the method I learned back in the USSR: compare what you get from different sources and dismiss everything that serves the source’s purposes. Things reported reluctantly (which are against the narrative the source promotes) have a good chance of being true. Glib tales supporting the promoted narrative are virtually certain to be lies. I look at it as a biologist: nature gave us two eyes because you cannot adequately see the reality from just one point of view.

    As to discrediting that particular author, it’s just a small detail. For years Western media discredited itself totally, spreading obvious lies and blatant lies (e.g., a zillion hospitals in Aleppo, all of which disappeared the day Islamist bandits were kicked out; scary tales about covid, which immediately disappeared when Putin started the operation in Ukraine; glorious victories of Ukie army, even though the war keeps going on the territory Ukraine considers its own; etc.). Orwell was prescient, most “reports” by Western media are comrade Ogilvy-style stories. Discrediting a single liar in the source that is devoted to lying does not matter much.

    Replies: @LatW

    Re: The Spectator article.

    I do not blindly believe anything from any source. I use the method I learned back in the USSR: compare what you get from different sources and dismiss everything that serves the source’s purposes. Things reported reluctantly (which are against the narrative the source promotes) have a good chance of being true.

    Right. But you know what the issue is in this case? There may not be enough sources (especially with clearly attributed reports) in this case to begin with. If there really was an agreement between the US and China, as noted in these recent reports after Bali, then in fact it is a really big deal – this could be a 21st century equivalent of Yalta (insert the more appropriate geographic location).

    If this is true, there are big implications for Russia’s neighbors. But as to sources, there probably will not be many open ones. Eventually the US would have to come open about these things, but China doesn’t even have to report any of this – so there may not be any Chinese sources at all, except for maybe some state approved political commentary, which may not even be that explicit. Would be interesting to see if anything was mentioned about this in the Chinese media.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @LatW


    If there really was an agreement between the US and China
     
    As to rumors about US-China agreement reached on Bali, I have my doubts. Primarily I doubt that very pragmatic Xi would discuss with demented Biden anything of importance, let alone depend on an agreement with a person who will forget about it within minutes. Xi does not strike me as Gorby-type naïve fool.

    Would be interesting to see if anything was mentioned about this in the Chinese media.
     
    Well, I can’t read Chinese, so their media is closed to me.

    Replies: @LatW

  380. Great offset to the likes of Ben Hodges, David Petraeus, Jack Keane, Mark Hertling, Cedric Leighton, Jim Stavridis and Barry McCaffrey –

  381. @LatW
    @AnonfromTN

    Re: The Spectator article.


    I do not blindly believe anything from any source. I use the method I learned back in the USSR: compare what you get from different sources and dismiss everything that serves the source’s purposes. Things reported reluctantly (which are against the narrative the source promotes) have a good chance of being true.
     
    Right. But you know what the issue is in this case? There may not be enough sources (especially with clearly attributed reports) in this case to begin with. If there really was an agreement between the US and China, as noted in these recent reports after Bali, then in fact it is a really big deal - this could be a 21st century equivalent of Yalta (insert the more appropriate geographic location).

    If this is true, there are big implications for Russia's neighbors. But as to sources, there probably will not be many open ones. Eventually the US would have to come open about these things, but China doesn't even have to report any of this - so there may not be any Chinese sources at all, except for maybe some state approved political commentary, which may not even be that explicit. Would be interesting to see if anything was mentioned about this in the Chinese media.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    If there really was an agreement between the US and China

    As to rumors about US-China agreement reached on Bali, I have my doubts. Primarily I doubt that very pragmatic Xi would discuss with demented Biden anything of importance, let alone depend on an agreement with a person who will forget about it within minutes. Xi does not strike me as Gorby-type naïve fool.

    Would be interesting to see if anything was mentioned about this in the Chinese media.

    Well, I can’t read Chinese, so their media is closed to me.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @AnonfromTN


    Primarily I doubt that very pragmatic Xi would discuss with demented Biden anything of importance, let alone depend on an agreement with a person who will forget about it within minutes
     
    Personalities are important, but what is more important is the spirit of openness (if it's real). It seems that some warming of the relationship definitely has taken place. But, of course, if such a huge agreement was made, the question is how it sticks in case someone like Trump comes back or anti-China hawks come in the forefront. It would be a lot of work for the State Department then to tame someone like Trump.

    Xi does not strike me as Gorby-type naïve fool.
     
    Well, not only that, but China is also not in the same position as the USSR was during Gorby's time, quite the opposite, in fact. (To be fair to Gorby, he probably couldn't do all that much more in his position, use of force was a gamble since the masses had been woken up first and foremost within the Russian nation).

    But even if such an agreement was made (that the US will not provide long range missiles (and pressure Ukraine to not take Crimea?) but China will try to deter Russia from the use of nukes), the question is still how this can be enforced (neither of those two countries, no matter how large, have full control over the other countries involved).

    Replies: @German_reader, @showmethereal

  382. @AnonfromTN
    @A123


    Who is the last President to do better than Trump on foreign policy? The pickings are quite slim.
     
    The pickings are indeed slim: not much to choose from. If forced, I’d pick Nixon.

    Your pic is a good illustration of what Russians used to say jokingly: among European politicians only Merkel has balls.

    BTW, a shortage of eggs has recently developed in the UK. As in Russian the same word is used for eggs and balls (like in Spanish – huevos), there are now jokes about Brits not having them.

    Replies: @A123

    Who is the last President to do better than Trump on foreign policy? The pickings are quite slim.

    The pickings are indeed slim: not much to choose from. If forced, I’d pick Nixon.

    The big three after WW II were serious Ike, JFK, Nixon. However, saying nice things about Nixon could get you in a lot of trouble.

    Your pic is a good illustration of what Russians used to say jokingly: among European politicians only Merkel has balls.

    Rumor has it that medication was involved.

     

     

    This was also tried on Macron and Trudeau. Alas, the epic Estrogen count on those two prevented the medication from working. Even Big Pharma could not help them.

    PEACE 😇

    • LOL: silviosilver
    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @A123


    This was also tried on Macron and Trudeau. Alas, the epic Estrogen count on those two prevented the medication from working. Even Big Pharma could not help them.
     
    Sad. Their only hope now is to be put on a course of Soybigone treatment. Unfortunately, it will be some time before the treatment takes effect.
    , @Emil Nikola Richard
    @A123

    Bold risk taking is an effect of Emsam, Sam Bankman Fried's chemical of choice.

    https://astralcodexten.substack.com/p/the-psychopharmacology-of-the-ftx

  383. @Coconuts
    @showmethereal


    On the flip side Russia – nor China – are the ones who colonized African nations. So they don’t speak Russian nor Chinese. They speak French and Belgian and English etc.
     
    Very few in Africa and the Middle East must speak German or Italian as legacies of colonialism (maybe there are a few who speak Italian in Eritrea), and more or less no one Dutch, Irish, Danish, Swedish or Norwegian. But all these countries have similar patterns of immigration from Africa and MENA.

    Appeals to colonialism, as if this immigration was somehow retribution or reparations for colonialism and imperialism seems more like a rationalisation of something with other causes. If it was about reparations Belgium would take only Congolese, Netherlands only Indonesians and a few from the Carribean, Germany from Tanganyika, Italy from Eritrea, Somalia etc. But this is not what is seen in Europe.

    Even the countries that take a large number of immigrants from their former colonies like Spain, France, Britain also take a lot of people not from their former empires.

    I guess the point Beckow was making about settlers was about the relative productivity and level of development of North America and Australia when the British started to occupy them, and the level of productivity and development of Europe when Africans and others arrive now.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @showmethereal

    Yeah productivity is true. But the natives looked at the white invaders the same way. They didn’t care about productivity. Aside from the fact Australia was literally a place for the Brits to get rid of undesirables. In North America – what is left of the native tribes still protest and wish whites would leave their ancestral lands. They don’t care about productivity.

    As to Europe – again most don’t feel sorry. They collectively competed in imperialism- so they collectively absorb. Italy and Spain are the closest across the Med. The destruction of Libya is what unleashed the latest torrent. That was a NATO operation. Well if they share “defense” well hey they all have to share in the fruits of their destabilization. Why Germany chose to accept so many after the Syrian and Iraqi destabilizing I don’t know. But again they are a NATO country. NATO countries follow the U.S. so hey – that’s what happens. For every action there is a reaction. All the Arab Spring psyop is all part of it. NATO has blood on its hands and dirt on its clothes. All those actions hastened the migrant crisis

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @showmethereal


    The destruction of Libya is what unleashed the latest torrent.
     
    That's only a partial truth (and I was never in favour of Western intervention in Libya) in the sense that the state collapse in Libya means there's no authority one can make a deal with to keep the migrants from subsaharan Africa away. But the real driver of that migration is the immense population growth in Africa. And paradoxically improvement in living standards in Africa would probably lead to an increase in migration, since more people would have the necessary funds for financing their emigration. Any analysis that ignores these realities is dishonest or simply stupid.
    Similar considerations apply to other migration issues as well. You mention Syria, it's a common refrain by quite a few commnters here on UR that Western countries have to take in Syrians because of their role in the destabilization of Syria (and as you do, this is then extended to even a country like Germany, whose involvement in Syria has been negligible, because of NATO or some common white man's guilt or whatever). And sure, there is an awful lot to criticize about the role of the US and some other Western states in that civil war (as there is about the role of the Gulf states and of Turkey...though Turkey at least has paid a heavy price for its meddling). But this is only part of the truth. One has to wonder, why exactly could Syria be destabilized to such an extreme degree? Could it be, because the country experienced totally absurd population growth (from 4,5 million in 1960 to 21 million in 2011), encouraged by a state that wanted cannon fodder, because its nepotistic and corrupt dictatorship then proved unable to provide decent prospects to all the frustrated young men this created, and because rather too many Syrians decided to seek a solution to their problems in an orgy of sectarian killing? And similar processes apply in a lot of those essentially failed societies in the Global South.
    As for your fairy tale about Russia supposedly being different, providing a better model etc., lol, gimme a break, this is all just re-hashed Soviet bs. Russia is just supporting various military thugs who want Wagner mercenaries to crush their internal enemies. People who think differently are just as much suffering from delusions as Americans who believe their country is nothing but a force for good in the world.

    Replies: @showmethereal

    , @Coconuts
    @showmethereal


    But the natives looked at the white invaders the same way. They didn’t care about productivity. Aside from the fact Australia was literally a place for the Brits to get rid of undesirables. In North America – what is left of the native tribes still protest and wish whites would leave their ancestral lands. They don’t care about productivity.
     
    Iirc the point was originally more about the difference between European settlers and Africans migrants coming to Europe. Africans, MENA and others coming to Europe are definitely motivated by the level of economic development there, they do not appear to be drawn by a desire for uncultivated land or Europe's raw natural resources. Nor by a selfless Kantian moral imperative to seek pure justice or to save Euros from their moral backwardness.

    Generally, this idea that the difference in value between the level of development of modern Australia or the US and Native American tribes is completely subjective, and in theory one is just as valuable or good as another is also very popular among white progressives at the moment and has a lot of political significance for them. It might be cynical, but I think the reason these claims are taken seriously is because it suits the broader political interests of powers like the US and China to do so, at least superficially.

    As to Europe – again most don’t feel sorry. They collectively competed in imperialism- so they collectively absorb.
     

    European countries are organising this themselves (in various cases it has been organised by the colonialists who used to run the empires). I was saying that reparations for colonialism is not a significant or relevant factor. Afaik Libya was a Franco-British operation, not a NATO one, but these immigration trends pre-date by 20 years, even decades more. The actual cause is highlighted by German_reader, major growth in populations outside Europe, better communications, easier travel, plus declining indigenous populations in Europe. The present European economic and political systems currently depend on growth, diversity and expanding populations, so they have a natural openness and attractive pull.

    Ironically, the Nordic countries with the most idealistic immigration policies are the ones with the least participation in colonialism.

    Replies: @showmethereal

  384. @A123
    @AnonfromTN



    Who is the last President to do better than Trump on foreign policy? The pickings are quite slim.
     
    The pickings are indeed slim: not much to choose from. If forced, I’d pick Nixon.

     

    The big three after WW II were serious Ike, JFK, Nixon. However, saying nice things about Nixon could get you in a lot of trouble.


    Your pic is a good illustration of what Russians used to say jokingly: among European politicians only Merkel has balls.
     
    Rumor has it that medication was involved.

     
    https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEjPkjYpzh51VREBpVeYKhkE9s_fLZW_qR-HhTvjmczHOwehYrU0aEir5Ox7JBX-qvGE-sZ1agFTaFZucjgt2Nyw-NirVvSMi5lTqHbyhtbfVCR3LYKh9geR72Vuq655LxCQ6npSIuf9zLF6kOM6s06DVcpN8g4CjW4skf2JFiTrSLh0YMugc2UU247AFQ/s480/90mimb_e12ca10912e5801730b6e3c74f54f3db_15ac78bd_500.jpg
     

    This was also tried on Macron and Trudeau. Alas, the epic Estrogen count on those two prevented the medication from working. Even Big Pharma could not help them.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @silviosilver, @Emil Nikola Richard

    This was also tried on Macron and Trudeau. Alas, the epic Estrogen count on those two prevented the medication from working. Even Big Pharma could not help them.

    Sad. Their only hope now is to be put on a course of Soybigone treatment. Unfortunately, it will be some time before the treatment takes effect.

  385. German_reader says:
    @showmethereal
    @Coconuts

    Yeah productivity is true. But the natives looked at the white invaders the same way. They didn’t care about productivity. Aside from the fact Australia was literally a place for the Brits to get rid of undesirables. In North America - what is left of the native tribes still protest and wish whites would leave their ancestral lands. They don’t care about productivity.

    As to Europe - again most don’t feel sorry. They collectively competed in imperialism- so they collectively absorb. Italy and Spain are the closest across the Med. The destruction of Libya is what unleashed the latest torrent. That was a NATO operation. Well if they share “defense” well hey they all have to share in the fruits of their destabilization. Why Germany chose to accept so many after the Syrian and Iraqi destabilizing I don’t know. But again they are a NATO country. NATO countries follow the U.S. so hey - that’s what happens. For every action there is a reaction. All the Arab Spring psyop is all part of it. NATO has blood on its hands and dirt on its clothes. All those actions hastened the migrant crisis

    Replies: @German_reader, @Coconuts

    The destruction of Libya is what unleashed the latest torrent.

    That’s only a partial truth (and I was never in favour of Western intervention in Libya) in the sense that the state collapse in Libya means there’s no authority one can make a deal with to keep the migrants from subsaharan Africa away. But the real driver of that migration is the immense population growth in Africa. And paradoxically improvement in living standards in Africa would probably lead to an increase in migration, since more people would have the necessary funds for financing their emigration. Any analysis that ignores these realities is dishonest or simply stupid.
    Similar considerations apply to other migration issues as well. You mention Syria, it’s a common refrain by quite a few commnters here on UR that Western countries have to take in Syrians because of their role in the destabilization of Syria (and as you do, this is then extended to even a country like Germany, whose involvement in Syria has been negligible, because of NATO or some common white man’s guilt or whatever). And sure, there is an awful lot to criticize about the role of the US and some other Western states in that civil war (as there is about the role of the Gulf states and of Turkey…though Turkey at least has paid a heavy price for its meddling). But this is only part of the truth. One has to wonder, why exactly could Syria be destabilized to such an extreme degree? Could it be, because the country experienced totally absurd population growth (from 4,5 million in 1960 to 21 million in 2011), encouraged by a state that wanted cannon fodder, because its nepotistic and corrupt dictatorship then proved unable to provide decent prospects to all the frustrated young men this created, and because rather too many Syrians decided to seek a solution to their problems in an orgy of sectarian killing? And similar processes apply in a lot of those essentially failed societies in the Global South.
    As for your fairy tale about Russia supposedly being different, providing a better model etc., lol, gimme a break, this is all just re-hashed Soviet bs. Russia is just supporting various military thugs who want Wagner mercenaries to crush their internal enemies. People who think differently are just as much suffering from delusions as Americans who believe their country is nothing but a force for good in the world.

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @German_reader

    I’m not saying the west “has to” take them in. I firmly believe in the God given principle of of reaping and sowing. Causing problems in others homes will bring problems in your home.

    As to Syria… Syria had a fairly high human development. Same with Libya.

    Replies: @silviosilver

  386. @AnonfromTN
    @LatW


    If there really was an agreement between the US and China
     
    As to rumors about US-China agreement reached on Bali, I have my doubts. Primarily I doubt that very pragmatic Xi would discuss with demented Biden anything of importance, let alone depend on an agreement with a person who will forget about it within minutes. Xi does not strike me as Gorby-type naïve fool.

    Would be interesting to see if anything was mentioned about this in the Chinese media.
     
    Well, I can’t read Chinese, so their media is closed to me.

    Replies: @LatW

    Primarily I doubt that very pragmatic Xi would discuss with demented Biden anything of importance, let alone depend on an agreement with a person who will forget about it within minutes

    Personalities are important, but what is more important is the spirit of openness (if it’s real). It seems that some warming of the relationship definitely has taken place. But, of course, if such a huge agreement was made, the question is how it sticks in case someone like Trump comes back or anti-China hawks come in the forefront. It would be a lot of work for the State Department then to tame someone like Trump.

    Xi does not strike me as Gorby-type naïve fool.

    Well, not only that, but China is also not in the same position as the USSR was during Gorby’s time, quite the opposite, in fact. (To be fair to Gorby, he probably couldn’t do all that much more in his position, use of force was a gamble since the masses had been woken up first and foremost within the Russian nation).

    But even if such an agreement was made (that the US will not provide long range missiles (and pressure Ukraine to not take Crimea?) but China will try to deter Russia from the use of nukes), the question is still how this can be enforced (neither of those two countries, no matter how large, have full control over the other countries involved).

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @LatW


    It seems that some warming of the relationship definitely has taken place.
     
    The US has just enacted wide-ranging sanctions against China's semiconductor industry, in a blatant attempt to strangle China's further economic progress, so that seems rather unlikely. China probably just isn't keen on the war in Ukraine leading to a world conflagration.

    Replies: @LatW

    , @showmethereal
    @LatW

    China doesn’t trust the US. Nor does it get involved in trying to tell other countries what to do in 3rd party squabbles.

    Replies: @LatW

  387. @A123
    @AnonfromTN



    Who is the last President to do better than Trump on foreign policy? The pickings are quite slim.
     
    The pickings are indeed slim: not much to choose from. If forced, I’d pick Nixon.

     

    The big three after WW II were serious Ike, JFK, Nixon. However, saying nice things about Nixon could get you in a lot of trouble.


    Your pic is a good illustration of what Russians used to say jokingly: among European politicians only Merkel has balls.
     
    Rumor has it that medication was involved.

     
    https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEjPkjYpzh51VREBpVeYKhkE9s_fLZW_qR-HhTvjmczHOwehYrU0aEir5Ox7JBX-qvGE-sZ1agFTaFZucjgt2Nyw-NirVvSMi5lTqHbyhtbfVCR3LYKh9geR72Vuq655LxCQ6npSIuf9zLF6kOM6s06DVcpN8g4CjW4skf2JFiTrSLh0YMugc2UU247AFQ/s480/90mimb_e12ca10912e5801730b6e3c74f54f3db_15ac78bd_500.jpg
     

    This was also tried on Macron and Trudeau. Alas, the epic Estrogen count on those two prevented the medication from working. Even Big Pharma could not help them.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @silviosilver, @Emil Nikola Richard

    Bold risk taking is an effect of Emsam, Sam Bankman Fried’s chemical of choice.

    https://astralcodexten.substack.com/p/the-psychopharmacology-of-the-ftx

  388. German_reader says:
    @LatW
    @AnonfromTN


    Primarily I doubt that very pragmatic Xi would discuss with demented Biden anything of importance, let alone depend on an agreement with a person who will forget about it within minutes
     
    Personalities are important, but what is more important is the spirit of openness (if it's real). It seems that some warming of the relationship definitely has taken place. But, of course, if such a huge agreement was made, the question is how it sticks in case someone like Trump comes back or anti-China hawks come in the forefront. It would be a lot of work for the State Department then to tame someone like Trump.

    Xi does not strike me as Gorby-type naïve fool.
     
    Well, not only that, but China is also not in the same position as the USSR was during Gorby's time, quite the opposite, in fact. (To be fair to Gorby, he probably couldn't do all that much more in his position, use of force was a gamble since the masses had been woken up first and foremost within the Russian nation).

    But even if such an agreement was made (that the US will not provide long range missiles (and pressure Ukraine to not take Crimea?) but China will try to deter Russia from the use of nukes), the question is still how this can be enforced (neither of those two countries, no matter how large, have full control over the other countries involved).

    Replies: @German_reader, @showmethereal

    It seems that some warming of the relationship definitely has taken place.

    The US has just enacted wide-ranging sanctions against China’s semiconductor industry, in a blatant attempt to strangle China’s further economic progress, so that seems rather unlikely. China probably just isn’t keen on the war in Ukraine leading to a world conflagration.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @German_reader


    to strangle China’s further economic progress
     
    The US doesn't have to facilitate China's economic progress and the US has already done a lot for China's economic progress, historically (at the detriment of their own people, as some on this very website would argue). None of this cancels out what happened in Bali - apparently an attempt to be less confrontational overall. They seemed to agree on two things - that there shouldn't be war among them and that nuclear threats should not be made by anybody on this planet.

    Replies: @German_reader

  389. Sher Singh says:
    @silviosilver
    @Coconuts

    The more pertinent point is that settlers founded those countries. If it hadn't been for British founders, then America, Canada, Australia would never have happened. Or if someone else had settled there - and someone else eventually certainly would have, given the natives' low developmental level and thus inability to resist - they would have founded very, very different countries. Nowadays, of course, it's all the rage to refer to the aboriginals as "First Nations," as if the average abo had the slightest conception of living "in Australia." (So wtf were they really "first" at?)

    If we remember that the native tribes were happily slaughtering each other and "stealing" each others lands since time imemorial, the great irony is that one actually has to be a racist to claim slaughtering and stealing was only illegitimate when a white tribe (the Brits) joined the fray. The best thing for the Brits to have told prospective non-British entrants is: sorry - founders, keepers.

    "B-b-b-but silvio don't you get it, your own grandparents would have been barred by your rules!!" Yeah, they would have, so what? The important thing right now is to draw the correct the lesson from their mistakes - mistakes which I obviously admit have benefited from - not to repeat them or compound them with self-serving stories about how, since we were allowed in, so must the rest of the world be, ad infinitum.


    Don’t know how far Intersectionality has spread in Belgium but it’s not 100% surprising to see ethnic minority women promoting these beliefs.
     
    It's not remotely surprising. Promoting those causes help keep the "nativists" at bay. It's all of a piece with "anti-racism" (aka white demotion and dispossession).

    Replies: @Sher Singh

    Ultimately, people care about what they have an interest in.
    I care about White Christian survival due to concubines.

    Euro Pagans due to their being cousins. Why does a Slav care for Turks or Anglos?
    If it’s just crass consumerism & a respect for modern amenities – that’s a dead end.

    • Replies: @Coconuts
    @Sher Singh


    Why does a Slav care for Turks or Anglos?
    If it’s just crass consumerism & a respect for modern amenities – that’s a dead end.
     
    From my irl experience of Belarusians, apart from the ties to local Slavic culture and Russia or Poland, plenty of the more educated ones seem to be 'Northern Euro' orientated, looking to Scandanavia, Netherlands, Switzerland, WASPs in the US for political and cultural inspiration, Germany for technology.

    I found this noticeable because the educated liberal people in the UK had a different orientation, similar to what SilvioSliver was talking about in Australia, where they value a mixture of aborigine, Native American and tribal cultures generally, blacks etc.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @Dmitry

    , @silviosilver
    @Sher Singh


    I care about White Christian survival due to concubines.
     
    If you keep carrying on like that, you're going to larp your way to an early grave, son.

    A belated reply to your post, because your nonsense ticks me off, but I was just watching the Canada v Croatia match, and goddam, the number of nigs on that team, it reminded me of my "silver rule" [silviosilver, geddit?]: if someone is a nighater, or gives me reliable indications that he may become a nighater, I shall do my best to mend fences, because this world of ours will require all the nighaters it can get its hands on if we are to survive the coming deluge. (We can kill each other later.)

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @Wokechoke

  390. @Unintended Consequence
    @Beckow

    "The Greens – whether today, Maoist, or genderless freaks – are simply stupid people with initiative. The kind of people who in the past joined massive revolutionary movements or religious revivals."

    I am certainly no fan of Greens with their ideas based in fanaticism more than science. However, the Greens in Belgium made a strong statement on war as it is linked to the environment by refusing to send Britain some components related to their nuclear arsenal today. Seems the Green party won an election there and will be in committee soon to make similar decisions so were allowed to anticipate the formal proceedings.

    Replies: @Beckow

    The Belgian Greens come through, wow :)…well, it could be real or a faint, but I will wait for more sustained and substantial Green actions before I would even start listening to them. Maybe it is a simple controlled opposition trick…

  391. @German_reader
    @LatW


    It seems that some warming of the relationship definitely has taken place.
     
    The US has just enacted wide-ranging sanctions against China's semiconductor industry, in a blatant attempt to strangle China's further economic progress, so that seems rather unlikely. China probably just isn't keen on the war in Ukraine leading to a world conflagration.

    Replies: @LatW

    to strangle China’s further economic progress

    The US doesn’t have to facilitate China’s economic progress and the US has already done a lot for China’s economic progress, historically (at the detriment of their own people, as some on this very website would argue). None of this cancels out what happened in Bali – apparently an attempt to be less confrontational overall. They seemed to agree on two things – that there shouldn’t be war among them and that nuclear threats should not be made by anybody on this planet.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @LatW


    The US doesn’t have to facilitate China’s economic progress and the US has already done a lot for China’s economic progress, historically (at the detriment of their own people, as some on this very website would argue). None of this cancels out what happened in Bali – apparently an attempt to be less confrontational overall.
     
    Are you now a spokesperson for Biden's administration? You wrote there has been a warming of relations, which is just absurd given the semiconductor sanctions and the change in the US position on Taiwan (still not complete, but definitely less ambiguous now than before).
    I don't know either why you're going on and on about nuclear threats. Russia wasn't going to use nuclear weapons in Ukraine anyway unless they're losing really badly (e. g. risk of losing Crimea) or NATO intervenes directly, and nothing about that has changed.

    Replies: @German_reader, @AnonfromTN, @LatW

  392. to strangle China’s further economic progress

    The US doesn’t have to facilitate China’s economic progress and the US has already done a lot for China’s economic progress, historically (at the detriment of their own people, as some on this very website would argue).

    There is no U.S. desire or intent to strangle bourgeoisie CCP Elite rule over their victims, China’s proletariat workers. Such interference in the name of “Manifest Destiny” would be counter productive. If the Han people voluntarily choose bourgeoisie CCP oppression as their desired form of government the U.S. has no cause to interfere.

    This is essential to the philosophy of gradual decoupling and MAGA Reindustrialization. It is simply the straightforward application of the fact that Christian Populist Americans no longer wish to be exploited by CCP Elite aggression.

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @A123


    There is no U.S. desire or intent to strangle bourgeoisie CCP Elite rule over their victims, China’s proletariat workers.
     
    Did you really need this gush of pseudo-Marxist terminology to completely misrepresent the case?

    Replies: @A123

  393. @A123


    to strangle China’s further economic progress
     
    The US doesn’t have to facilitate China’s economic progress and the US has already done a lot for China’s economic progress, historically (at the detriment of their own people, as some on this very website would argue).
     
    There is no U.S. desire or intent to strangle bourgeoisie CCP Elite rule over their victims, China's proletariat workers. Such interference in the name of "Manifest Destiny" would be counter productive. If the Han people voluntarily choose bourgeoisie CCP oppression as their desired form of government the U.S. has no cause to interfere.

    This is essential to the philosophy of gradual decoupling and MAGA Reindustrialization. It is simply the straightforward application of the fact that Christian Populist Americans no longer wish to be exploited by CCP Elite aggression.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    There is no U.S. desire or intent to strangle bourgeoisie CCP Elite rule over their victims, China’s proletariat workers.

    Did you really need this gush of pseudo-Marxist terminology to completely misrepresent the case?

    • Replies: @A123
    @AnonfromTN


    Did you really need this gush of pseudo-Marxist terminology
     
    The Chinese Communist Party [CCP] leads a pseudo-Marxist nation. Thus, accurate use of the terminology is highly appropriate.

    It is also an sincere representation of MAGA intent. If the bourgeois CCP intentionally seeks violent conflict over essential resources, it will be reciprocated. If the CCP focuses on territory in their domain, so be it. I look forwards to the CCP Elite's attempt to colonize and assimilate Afghanistan into the Greater "Silk Road" Han Dynasty.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  394. German_reader says:
    @LatW
    @German_reader


    to strangle China’s further economic progress
     
    The US doesn't have to facilitate China's economic progress and the US has already done a lot for China's economic progress, historically (at the detriment of their own people, as some on this very website would argue). None of this cancels out what happened in Bali - apparently an attempt to be less confrontational overall. They seemed to agree on two things - that there shouldn't be war among them and that nuclear threats should not be made by anybody on this planet.

    Replies: @German_reader

    The US doesn’t have to facilitate China’s economic progress and the US has already done a lot for China’s economic progress, historically (at the detriment of their own people, as some on this very website would argue). None of this cancels out what happened in Bali – apparently an attempt to be less confrontational overall.

    Are you now a spokesperson for Biden’s administration? You wrote there has been a warming of relations, which is just absurd given the semiconductor sanctions and the change in the US position on Taiwan (still not complete, but definitely less ambiguous now than before).
    I don’t know either why you’re going on and on about nuclear threats. Russia wasn’t going to use nuclear weapons in Ukraine anyway unless they’re losing really badly (e. g. risk of losing Crimea) or NATO intervenes directly, and nothing about that has changed.

    • Agree: showmethereal
    • Replies: @German_reader
    @German_reader

    https://asiatimes.com/2022/11/harvard-guru-gives-biden-a-d-for-china-policy/


    Now, how about China policy more narrowly? This restriction on semiconductors is a declaration of economic war. It’s completely disproportionate to any of the problems we have with China. This is going 30, 40% of the way toward what we did with Japan, cutting off their oil before Pearl Harbor. Semiconductors are the key to the modern world.

    This validates every crazy nationalistic Chinese professor who’s been arguing that our goal all along has been to keep China down, to prevent them from growing. In terms of the relationship, it’s just awful. It’s an escalation. People don’t realize this is a declaration of war.

    [...]

    Now, back to the bigger picture. In China policy, Biden has done two important things.

    One is, he has completely reneged on the 1979 agreement that’s been the basis for peace in Taiwan. What did we say in that agreement? That we will not have official relations, we will not have an alliance.

    Now Biden has said four times he will defend Taiwan. That’s called an alliance.

    When Nancy Pelosi went to Taiwan, she was very careful to label it an official visit. And then immediately after a meeting with Taiwan’s President, Tsai Ing-wen’s spokeswoman went on their national TV and said Taiwan is a sovereign and independent country.

    That was the culmination of Pelosi’s visit—a complete breach of the US promises that have kept Taiwan safe for over four decades.
     

    Replies: @S, @showmethereal

    , @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader


    Russia wasn’t going to use nuclear weapons in Ukraine
     
    The likelihood of Russia using nukes in Ukraine is the same or lower that the probability of Yellowstone volcano erupting tomorrow morning. But it’s a boogieman very useful for the greedy US MIC, so everyone in its pay keeps repeating it.
    , @LatW
    @German_reader


    I don’t know either why you’re going on and on about nuclear threats.
     
    I'm just recounting the points that they agreed on during the G20 meeting. You, AnonT and a few others are the ones who have been constantly bringing up the "nuclear threat" for months now, over and over. Of course, Russia will not use nukes, not even when they have to exit Crimea (there are some news that they are already preparing an evacuation, just in case, and Ukraine hit Dzhankoi which is quite deep inside Crimea). These statements by China are just an extra confirmation of that.

    Replies: @German_reader, @AnonfromTN

  395. @AnonfromTN
    @A123


    There is no U.S. desire or intent to strangle bourgeoisie CCP Elite rule over their victims, China’s proletariat workers.
     
    Did you really need this gush of pseudo-Marxist terminology to completely misrepresent the case?

    Replies: @A123

    Did you really need this gush of pseudo-Marxist terminology

    The Chinese Communist Party [CCP] leads a pseudo-Marxist nation. Thus, accurate use of the terminology is highly appropriate.

    It is also an sincere representation of MAGA intent. If the bourgeois CCP intentionally seeks violent conflict over essential resources, it will be reciprocated. If the CCP focuses on territory in their domain, so be it. I look forwards to the CCP Elite’s attempt to colonize and assimilate Afghanistan into the Greater “Silk Road” Han Dynasty.

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @A123


    Thus, accurate use of the terminology is highly appropriate.
     
    Then use it accurately. Greedy US bourgeoisie (corporations) shifted production to China because Chinese proletarians are a lot cheaper than American proletarians. Reduced labor costs boosted their profits. For the same reason this greedy bourgeoisie shifted production to other locales with cheaper proletarians: Mexico, Indonesia, Malaysia, Philippines, Vietnam, Bangladesh, etc. The upside for the US is that it is getting real goods (admittedly, mostly of poor quality) while paying with colored paper it can print in unlimited quantities.

    There are several downsides, though. One, lots of industrial jobs in the US are lost. Two, the US stopped being self-sufficient, as almost everything, from socks to computers, is now made in China or similar locales. Even the US weapons industry would grind to a standstill without components made in countries with cheap proletarians. Some of the filthy rich among the US bourgeoisie got worried: the Ponzi scheme of the US dollar is enforced by the US military capabilities. If this Ponzi scheme collapses, that would be the end of the US domination and their personal riches. End of story.

    Replies: @A123

  396. German_reader says:
    @German_reader
    @LatW


    The US doesn’t have to facilitate China’s economic progress and the US has already done a lot for China’s economic progress, historically (at the detriment of their own people, as some on this very website would argue). None of this cancels out what happened in Bali – apparently an attempt to be less confrontational overall.
     
    Are you now a spokesperson for Biden's administration? You wrote there has been a warming of relations, which is just absurd given the semiconductor sanctions and the change in the US position on Taiwan (still not complete, but definitely less ambiguous now than before).
    I don't know either why you're going on and on about nuclear threats. Russia wasn't going to use nuclear weapons in Ukraine anyway unless they're losing really badly (e. g. risk of losing Crimea) or NATO intervenes directly, and nothing about that has changed.

    Replies: @German_reader, @AnonfromTN, @LatW

    https://asiatimes.com/2022/11/harvard-guru-gives-biden-a-d-for-china-policy/

    Now, how about China policy more narrowly? This restriction on semiconductors is a declaration of economic war. It’s completely disproportionate to any of the problems we have with China. This is going 30, 40% of the way toward what we did with Japan, cutting off their oil before Pearl Harbor. Semiconductors are the key to the modern world.

    This validates every crazy nationalistic Chinese professor who’s been arguing that our goal all along has been to keep China down, to prevent them from growing. In terms of the relationship, it’s just awful. It’s an escalation. People don’t realize this is a declaration of war.

    […]

    Now, back to the bigger picture. In China policy, Biden has done two important things.

    One is, he has completely reneged on the 1979 agreement that’s been the basis for peace in Taiwan. What did we say in that agreement? That we will not have official relations, we will not have an alliance.

    Now Biden has said four times he will defend Taiwan. That’s called an alliance.

    When Nancy Pelosi went to Taiwan, she was very careful to label it an official visit. And then immediately after a meeting with Taiwan’s President, Tsai Ing-wen’s spokeswoman went on their national TV and said Taiwan is a sovereign and independent country.

    That was the culmination of Pelosi’s visit—a complete breach of the US promises that have kept Taiwan safe for over four decades.

    • Thanks: S
    • Replies: @S
    @German_reader


    This is going 30, 40% of the way toward what we did with Japan, cutting off their oil before Pearl Harbor. Semiconductors are the key to the modern world...

    ..This validates every crazy nationalistic Chinese professor who’s been arguiing that our goal all along has been to keep China down, to prevent them from growing. In terms of the relationship, it’s just awful. It’s an escalation. People don’t realize this is a declaration of war.
     
    Thanks. This is a very insightful and important analysis.

    For some reason, the two quoted can't simply say this is all quite deliberate on the part of the United States. The power of the 'Big Lie', I suppose, the hard truth being simply too impalatable, too horrible, for them to even think about, let alone speak of.

    That truth being, the US/UK, point by point, is using WWII as it's template in it's present course of actions in regards to Russia.

    In WWIII, from the US/UK perspective, Russia is the new Germany, Putin the 'new Hitler'. As a microcosm, Putin, after failing to take Kiev, is bogged down in Ukraine, the same as Hitler, after failing to take Moscow, was bogged down in Russia, each leader, despite the fact that the United States is already in effect at war with them, refusing thus far to take the bait and simply declare war on the US.

    The United States, therefore, needs a 'backdoor' to enter more forcibly and directly into war, with Germany then, and with Russia today.

    In WWII, this was accomplished via the backdoor of Japan and the accompanying embargoes of oil and scrap metal. In WWIII, the backdoor for US war with Russia is China and an accompanying embargo in regards to Chinese semiconductor production.

    In response, Japan obliged the United States with it's Dec 7, 1941 attack upon Pearl Harbor. Germany, honoring it's treaty obligations with Japan, then declared war upon the United States, just as the US had desired.

    Will China, in response to this embargo upon it, attack the United States? Will this then bring Russia to declare war upon the United States, in solidarity with China, just as the US desires?

    We shall see.

    [I'm not for what I'm describing here, ie what it appears they are attempting to do. I think the historically slavery corrupted elites and hangers on of the US/UK should of been overthrown long ago.]

    Speaking of backdoor attacks, the below excerpt is from pg 109 of the 1853 book The New Rome.

    'Russia has expended all her forces in making a formidable display on her Western border. The United States are already digging the trenches for an attack in the rear.'

    https://archive.org/details/newrome00poes/page/108/mode/2up
    , @showmethereal
    @German_reader

    Correct. He and Jeffrey Sachs are some of the few US guys who get how China thinks. Ironic they are both Harvard guys

  397. @German_reader
    @LatW


    The US doesn’t have to facilitate China’s economic progress and the US has already done a lot for China’s economic progress, historically (at the detriment of their own people, as some on this very website would argue). None of this cancels out what happened in Bali – apparently an attempt to be less confrontational overall.
     
    Are you now a spokesperson for Biden's administration? You wrote there has been a warming of relations, which is just absurd given the semiconductor sanctions and the change in the US position on Taiwan (still not complete, but definitely less ambiguous now than before).
    I don't know either why you're going on and on about nuclear threats. Russia wasn't going to use nuclear weapons in Ukraine anyway unless they're losing really badly (e. g. risk of losing Crimea) or NATO intervenes directly, and nothing about that has changed.

    Replies: @German_reader, @AnonfromTN, @LatW

    Russia wasn’t going to use nuclear weapons in Ukraine

    The likelihood of Russia using nukes in Ukraine is the same or lower that the probability of Yellowstone volcano erupting tomorrow morning. But it’s a boogieman very useful for the greedy US MIC, so everyone in its pay keeps repeating it.

  398. @A123
    @AnonfromTN


    Did you really need this gush of pseudo-Marxist terminology
     
    The Chinese Communist Party [CCP] leads a pseudo-Marxist nation. Thus, accurate use of the terminology is highly appropriate.

    It is also an sincere representation of MAGA intent. If the bourgeois CCP intentionally seeks violent conflict over essential resources, it will be reciprocated. If the CCP focuses on territory in their domain, so be it. I look forwards to the CCP Elite's attempt to colonize and assimilate Afghanistan into the Greater "Silk Road" Han Dynasty.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    Thus, accurate use of the terminology is highly appropriate.

    Then use it accurately. Greedy US bourgeoisie (corporations) shifted production to China because Chinese proletarians are a lot cheaper than American proletarians. Reduced labor costs boosted their profits. For the same reason this greedy bourgeoisie shifted production to other locales with cheaper proletarians: Mexico, Indonesia, Malaysia, Philippines, Vietnam, Bangladesh, etc. The upside for the US is that it is getting real goods (admittedly, mostly of poor quality) while paying with colored paper it can print in unlimited quantities.

    There are several downsides, though. One, lots of industrial jobs in the US are lost. Two, the US stopped being self-sufficient, as almost everything, from socks to computers, is now made in China or similar locales. Even the US weapons industry would grind to a standstill without components made in countries with cheap proletarians. Some of the filthy rich among the US bourgeoisie got worried: the Ponzi scheme of the US dollar is enforced by the US military capabilities. If this Ponzi scheme collapses, that would be the end of the US domination and their personal riches. End of story.

    • Replies: @A123
    @AnonfromTN

    I am using it properly. Why are you intentionally misrepresenting your case?

    Greedy CCP bourgeoisie exploited an unequal system. They used CCP subsidies and foreign lobbying to transfer jobs and economic activity from the U.S. to China. Yes. Multinational MegaCorporations were evil co-collaborators.

    =============================================
                A state without industrial policy has
    Neither economic security, Nor national security.
    =============================================


    MAGA-nomics is about establishing a highly competitive industrial policy. Reshoring everything that the CCP, MegaCorporations, and other bourgeoisie pillaged is the minimum essential task to regain American jobs for American citizens. This is how the U.S. re-establishes both economic and national security.

    If ending CCP bourgeoisie exploitation includes sending executives of multinational MegaCorporations to... Ahem... Reeducation... So mote it be.

    This simple economic reality about jobs and economic activity should not be hard for anyone to grasp.
    ___

    Let me put it this way... It might be easier to grasp for some readers with a certain cinematic bent.

    CCP Elite bourgeoisie and MegaCorporations executives are in the car together. They get to go off the cliff together like Thelma & Louise. If you are spending intellectual cycles trying to decide which is "Thelma" and which is "Louise" you are wasting your time. Both receive the same outcome, driver & passenger alike.

    All must meet their fate.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @LatW

  399. @AnonfromTN
    @Mikel


    Electoral choices do still have practical consequences.
     
    Local electoral choices, yes. Likely because the cabal does not want to get swamped by the nitty-gritty of local issues. As to national elections…

    Have you noticed that the key things in the foreign policy remain essentially the same regardless which “party” is technically in power? These invariably include military bases all over the world, coups in various countries, naked aggression against the countries where a coup cannot be arranged, and various sanctions against anyone who does not toe the imperial line.

    That MIC funding keeps growing under either “party”? It has already reached obscene proportions, it exceeds the military spending of the rest of the world put together. Yet the increases of the amounts of money thrown into insatiable maw of greedy US MIC show no signs of abating, and it does not matter one bit which “party” is technically in power.

    These and many other things show that real power is wielded by the forces behind the scenes, not by elected figureheads, who are becoming more and more pathetic (severe Alzheimer’s is a new low).

    Replies: @Mikel, @Barbarossa

    Yep. Voting in local elections is usually far more effective than any national races. Of course everyone thinks it’s the opposite case, which is a shame.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Barbarossa


    Voting in local elections is usually far more effective than any national races.
     
    Assuming "local" means municipal rather than state, describe some of its successes.

    Replies: @Barbarossa, @Barbarossa

  400. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @A123

    The thing to do with Thanksgiving dinners is make sure you eat some good food before you go. If you are hungry when you get there you will be miserable.

    Replies: @Barbarossa

    Are you serious? You must have been subjected to some astoundingly bad cooking! I love good Thanksgiving food. Of course every dish in the roster can be cooked badly, but when it’s good it’s really good!

    • Replies: @A123
    @Barbarossa

    Thanksgiving is a "butter" holiday. The baking goodness of dressing (Northerners may call it stuffing) is a joy. Then let the rivers of gravies flow.

    Are separate tureens of turkey gravy and pork/bacon gravy common to every Thanksgiving table? Or, is it unique to certain parts of the South? You need one for the ham and one for the bird.

    PEACE 😇

     
    https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-AO-9u1uFoXI/UVjcgdrp0cI/AAAAAAAAFYo/ZmAI9m7B8qg/s1600/DSC09741.JPG

    Replies: @Barbarossa

    , @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Barbarossa

    Turkey, mash potatoes, dressing, gravy in combination makes me want to puke to think about it. (I exaggerate here a tiny little bit.)

    Replies: @A123, @Barbarossa, @Mikhail, @AnonfromTN

  401. @Jatt Aryaa
    @Sher Singh

    Welp.

    https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/bill-c-21-ban-hunting-rifles

    Replies: @Barbarossa

    I’m not surprised. Hopefully it gets some hard pushback, but it doesn’t seem like Canada has much gumption that way.

    As an aside from the article. I didn’t know the SKS was so popular with Canadian sportsman. I’ve always liked mine and thought it is an underrated gun. Cheap to buy and cheap to shoot, though I recently saw that non-reloadable Russian made ammo is now double what it was several years ago when I bought a bunch.

    • Agree: Sher Singh
  402. @AnonfromTN
    @A123


    Thus, accurate use of the terminology is highly appropriate.
     
    Then use it accurately. Greedy US bourgeoisie (corporations) shifted production to China because Chinese proletarians are a lot cheaper than American proletarians. Reduced labor costs boosted their profits. For the same reason this greedy bourgeoisie shifted production to other locales with cheaper proletarians: Mexico, Indonesia, Malaysia, Philippines, Vietnam, Bangladesh, etc. The upside for the US is that it is getting real goods (admittedly, mostly of poor quality) while paying with colored paper it can print in unlimited quantities.

    There are several downsides, though. One, lots of industrial jobs in the US are lost. Two, the US stopped being self-sufficient, as almost everything, from socks to computers, is now made in China or similar locales. Even the US weapons industry would grind to a standstill without components made in countries with cheap proletarians. Some of the filthy rich among the US bourgeoisie got worried: the Ponzi scheme of the US dollar is enforced by the US military capabilities. If this Ponzi scheme collapses, that would be the end of the US domination and their personal riches. End of story.

    Replies: @A123

    I am using it properly. Why are you intentionally misrepresenting your case?

    Greedy CCP bourgeoisie exploited an unequal system. They used CCP subsidies and foreign lobbying to transfer jobs and economic activity from the U.S. to China. Yes. Multinational MegaCorporations were evil co-collaborators.

    =============================================
                A state without industrial policy has
    Neither economic security, Nor national security.
    =============================================

    MAGA-nomics is about establishing a highly competitive industrial policy. Reshoring everything that the CCP, MegaCorporations, and other bourgeoisie pillaged is the minimum essential task to regain American jobs for American citizens. This is how the U.S. re-establishes both economic and national security.

    If ending CCP bourgeoisie exploitation includes sending executives of multinational MegaCorporations to… Ahem… Reeducation… So mote it be.

    This simple economic reality about jobs and economic activity should not be hard for anyone to grasp.
    ___

    Let me put it this way… It might be easier to grasp for some readers with a certain cinematic bent.

    CCP Elite bourgeoisie and MegaCorporations executives are in the car together. They get to go off the cliff together like Thelma & Louise. If you are spending intellectual cycles trying to decide which is “Thelma” and which is “Louise” you are wasting your time. Both receive the same outcome, driver & passenger alike.

    All must meet their fate.

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @LatW
    @A123


    They get to go off the cliff together like Thelma & Louise. If you are spending intellectual cycles trying to decide which is “Thelma” and which is “Louise” you are wasting your time. Both receive the same outcome, driver & passenger alike.
     
    Oh, and the American worker is like the Brad Pitt character who leaves with the cash, right? LOL. Except he wouldn't be stealing.
  403. @Barbarossa
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    Are you serious? You must have been subjected to some astoundingly bad cooking! I love good Thanksgiving food. Of course every dish in the roster can be cooked badly, but when it's good it's really good!

    Replies: @A123, @Emil Nikola Richard

    Thanksgiving is a “butter” holiday. The baking goodness of dressing (Northerners may call it stuffing) is a joy. Then let the rivers of gravies flow.

    Are separate tureens of turkey gravy and pork/bacon gravy common to every Thanksgiving table? Or, is it unique to certain parts of the South? You need one for the ham and one for the bird.

    PEACE 😇

     

    • Replies: @Barbarossa
    @A123

    Ham doesn't seem to be a Thanksgiving thing around here, but it seems like the South does two meats for everything. We usually do ham for Christmas, and my timing should be good since I'll have my two pigs back by then!

    I agree on the butter though. We went up to my parents for Thanksgiving which is nice, but my Mom is a somewhat indifferent cook, so I spent some time adjusting things, a process which involved a lot of butter. I basted 1/2 a lb of herbed butter on the turkey which makes for a good gravy base and a moist bird, not to mention the mashed potatoes which ate up another 2 sticks.

    We're on the same page with Thanksgiving food, but I really worry about Emil Nikola Richard though. What kind of Cormac McCarthyesqe dystopian hellscape of Thanksgiving did he have to endure as a youth? Or does he just prefer PBJs? The questions make one's mind reel!

    Replies: @A123

  404. @Barbarossa
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    Are you serious? You must have been subjected to some astoundingly bad cooking! I love good Thanksgiving food. Of course every dish in the roster can be cooked badly, but when it's good it's really good!

    Replies: @A123, @Emil Nikola Richard

    Turkey, mash potatoes, dressing, gravy in combination makes me want to puke to think about it. (I exaggerate here a tiny little bit.)

    • Replies: @A123
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    Turkey, mash potatoes, dressing, gravy in combination makes me want to puke to think about it. (I exaggerate here a tiny little bit.)
     
    Hmmm..... The problem is insufficient gravy.

    Turkey & gravy, mashed potatoes & gravy, dressing & gravy, ham & gravy, biscuits & gravy, gravy & gravy in combination

    That is much butter... Err... Better.

    PEACE 😇
    , @Barbarossa
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    So, this raises the pertinent question? What food do you really like? We know that you don't like Indian food or Thanksgiving fare. I feel like these indirectly encompass and rule out a substantial amount of culinary ground.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    , @Mikhail
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    - Sweet potatoes sliced and in the final minutes of baking, sliced with marsh mellow and pineapple cubes

    - dark turkey meat with cranberry sauce

    - white turkey meat with gravy

    - apple cider

    - white turkey meat with gravy

    - vegetable stuffing, cooked with and independent of turkey

    - pecan, pumpkin and coconut pies.

    In addition, I make a vegetarian chili with rice using red kidney beans, along with V8 low sodium vegetable juice and the McCormick low sodium chili powder.

    Leftovers make for great turkey sandwiches and soup, using the bones and the jellied gravy, along with the low sodium V8.

    , @AnonfromTN
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    Turkey, mash potatoes, dressing, gravy in combination makes me want to puke to think about it.
     
    I do not feel so strongly about it, but…

    Maybe because I am a red meat fan, I only value birds with flavor. Say, duck has a special flavor, and I like it. Turkey, on the other hand, IMO is just an overgrown poor quality chicken. Tried roasted traditional Thanksgiving way turkey some years ago and was underwhelmed. Tried smoked turkey later. IMO chicken is much better that way, too.

    Ham is a separate story. I like pork, including roasted pork. I like Italian prosciutto crudo, and other Italian cold-smoked parts of a pig, particularly neck. I like French jambon, or Spanish jamon Serrano. But what is called ham in the US is hopelessly spoiled by additives and artificial coloring.

    Have to admit, though, that I like mashed potatoes. I mean real ones, not the crap sold under this name in supermarkets (all varieties, not only Hungry Jack).

    I know three American-invented foods I really like: spare ribs, cheesecake, and barbeque. Have to admit, though, that I like pizza in the US much more than Italian pizza. If you order two toppings in Italy, you get a pizza with one half having one topping, and the other half the second one. I like American multi-topping pizza much better, particularly meat lovers’ variety.

    Replies: @Beckow, @Mikel

  405. @German_reader
    @LatW


    The US doesn’t have to facilitate China’s economic progress and the US has already done a lot for China’s economic progress, historically (at the detriment of their own people, as some on this very website would argue). None of this cancels out what happened in Bali – apparently an attempt to be less confrontational overall.
     
    Are you now a spokesperson for Biden's administration? You wrote there has been a warming of relations, which is just absurd given the semiconductor sanctions and the change in the US position on Taiwan (still not complete, but definitely less ambiguous now than before).
    I don't know either why you're going on and on about nuclear threats. Russia wasn't going to use nuclear weapons in Ukraine anyway unless they're losing really badly (e. g. risk of losing Crimea) or NATO intervenes directly, and nothing about that has changed.

    Replies: @German_reader, @AnonfromTN, @LatW

    I don’t know either why you’re going on and on about nuclear threats.

    I’m just recounting the points that they agreed on during the G20 meeting. You, AnonT and a few others are the ones who have been constantly bringing up the “nuclear threat” for months now, over and over. Of course, Russia will not use nukes, not even when they have to exit Crimea (there are some news that they are already preparing an evacuation, just in case, and Ukraine hit Dzhankoi which is quite deep inside Crimea). These statements by China are just an extra confirmation of that.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @LatW


    there are some news that they are already preparing an evacuation, just in case
     
    There are hundreds of thousands of Russians in Crimea who don't want to live under Ukrainian rule, maybe you should face up to that fact. If there were a real risk of Russia losing Crimea, it's not clear at all that Russia wouldn't use nukes. If I were Putin, I certainly would use them in such a scenario.
    But that's the problem with you, you identify 100% with every single Ukrainian demand, even the ones that are completely unreasonable, there is never any limit or any thought how badly this could all end. It's not enough if Ukraine is preserved as a sovereign state that controls the territories where people actually are and feel Ukrainian, no, victory has to be total and 30-year old borders in ethnically muddled border regions have to be sacrosanct. Absolute lunacy.

    Replies: @LatW

    , @AnonfromTN
    @LatW


    Of course, Russia will not use nukes, not even when they have to exit Crimea (there are some news that they are already preparing an evacuation, just in case, and Ukraine hit Dzhankoi which is quite deep inside Crimea).
     
    More figments of sick (or cocaine-induced) imagination of Ukie propagandists. All of this is as fake as the story told by Ukie talking head Danilov about Ukraine killing in Crimea Iranians who were teaching Russians to operate their drones.

    Considering how things are going, there will be many more self-consoling lies spread by desperate Ukies and/or their puppeteers. Funny thing is, w/o electricity much fewer people hear these lies on Ukie TV. Also, to the delight of moderators of many websites, with Internet down in much of Ukraine, the number of Ukie trolls dropped precipitously.
  406. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Barbarossa

    Turkey, mash potatoes, dressing, gravy in combination makes me want to puke to think about it. (I exaggerate here a tiny little bit.)

    Replies: @A123, @Barbarossa, @Mikhail, @AnonfromTN

    Turkey, mash potatoes, dressing, gravy in combination makes me want to puke to think about it. (I exaggerate here a tiny little bit.)

    Hmmm….. The problem is insufficient gravy.

    Turkey & gravy, mashed potatoes & gravy, dressing & gravy, ham & gravy, biscuits & gravy, gravy & gravy in combination

    That is much butter… Err… Better.

    PEACE 😇

  407. @A123
    @AnonfromTN

    I am using it properly. Why are you intentionally misrepresenting your case?

    Greedy CCP bourgeoisie exploited an unequal system. They used CCP subsidies and foreign lobbying to transfer jobs and economic activity from the U.S. to China. Yes. Multinational MegaCorporations were evil co-collaborators.

    =============================================
                A state without industrial policy has
    Neither economic security, Nor national security.
    =============================================


    MAGA-nomics is about establishing a highly competitive industrial policy. Reshoring everything that the CCP, MegaCorporations, and other bourgeoisie pillaged is the minimum essential task to regain American jobs for American citizens. This is how the U.S. re-establishes both economic and national security.

    If ending CCP bourgeoisie exploitation includes sending executives of multinational MegaCorporations to... Ahem... Reeducation... So mote it be.

    This simple economic reality about jobs and economic activity should not be hard for anyone to grasp.
    ___

    Let me put it this way... It might be easier to grasp for some readers with a certain cinematic bent.

    CCP Elite bourgeoisie and MegaCorporations executives are in the car together. They get to go off the cliff together like Thelma & Louise. If you are spending intellectual cycles trying to decide which is "Thelma" and which is "Louise" you are wasting your time. Both receive the same outcome, driver & passenger alike.

    All must meet their fate.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @LatW

    They get to go off the cliff together like Thelma & Louise. If you are spending intellectual cycles trying to decide which is “Thelma” and which is “Louise” you are wasting your time. Both receive the same outcome, driver & passenger alike.

    Oh, and the American worker is like the Brad Pitt character who leaves with the cash, right? LOL. Except he wouldn’t be stealing.

    • Agree: A123
  408. @A123
    @Barbarossa

    Thanksgiving is a "butter" holiday. The baking goodness of dressing (Northerners may call it stuffing) is a joy. Then let the rivers of gravies flow.

    Are separate tureens of turkey gravy and pork/bacon gravy common to every Thanksgiving table? Or, is it unique to certain parts of the South? You need one for the ham and one for the bird.

    PEACE 😇

     
    https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-AO-9u1uFoXI/UVjcgdrp0cI/AAAAAAAAFYo/ZmAI9m7B8qg/s1600/DSC09741.JPG

    Replies: @Barbarossa

    Ham doesn’t seem to be a Thanksgiving thing around here, but it seems like the South does two meats for everything. We usually do ham for Christmas, and my timing should be good since I’ll have my two pigs back by then!

    I agree on the butter though. We went up to my parents for Thanksgiving which is nice, but my Mom is a somewhat indifferent cook, so I spent some time adjusting things, a process which involved a lot of butter. I basted 1/2 a lb of herbed butter on the turkey which makes for a good gravy base and a moist bird, not to mention the mashed potatoes which ate up another 2 sticks.

    We’re on the same page with Thanksgiving food, but I really worry about Emil Nikola Richard though. What kind of Cormac McCarthyesqe dystopian hellscape of Thanksgiving did he have to endure as a youth? Or does he just prefer PBJs? The questions make one’s mind reel!

    • Replies: @A123
    @Barbarossa


    Ham doesn’t seem to be a Thanksgiving thing around here, but it seems like the South does two meats for everything. We usually do ham for Christmas, and my timing should be good since I’ll have my two pigs back by then!
     
    Ham is precooked, preserved, and lasts for weeks as a leftover. I suspect it is a combination of tradition and practicality. Particularly huge Thanksgiving ham may make it all the way to Christmas if it is an enthusiastic, salty cure.

    The Christmas centerpiece will be beef. However, ham availability is guaranteed. It usually appears as dinner one or two days prior so the fatty ham sections can appear in other dishes, green been casserole. Ham bone and less savory bits become soup/stew base.

    Butter and other fats + flour = ROUX. If you have good drippings the gravy always works. I suspect my usual Thanksgiving hosts are slipping some bacon grease into the turkey gravy... As the result is outstanding, I am not even going to ask the question.

    PEACE 😇
    ___________

    P.S. The first humor GIF under MORE was intended for you.

    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-202/#comment-5676131

    Replies: @Barbarossa

  409. German_reader says:
    @LatW
    @German_reader


    I don’t know either why you’re going on and on about nuclear threats.
     
    I'm just recounting the points that they agreed on during the G20 meeting. You, AnonT and a few others are the ones who have been constantly bringing up the "nuclear threat" for months now, over and over. Of course, Russia will not use nukes, not even when they have to exit Crimea (there are some news that they are already preparing an evacuation, just in case, and Ukraine hit Dzhankoi which is quite deep inside Crimea). These statements by China are just an extra confirmation of that.

    Replies: @German_reader, @AnonfromTN

    there are some news that they are already preparing an evacuation, just in case

    There are hundreds of thousands of Russians in Crimea who don’t want to live under Ukrainian rule, maybe you should face up to that fact. If there were a real risk of Russia losing Crimea, it’s not clear at all that Russia wouldn’t use nukes. If I were Putin, I certainly would use them in such a scenario.
    But that’s the problem with you, you identify 100% with every single Ukrainian demand, even the ones that are completely unreasonable, there is never any limit or any thought how badly this could all end. It’s not enough if Ukraine is preserved as a sovereign state that controls the territories where people actually are and feel Ukrainian, no, victory has to be total and 30-year old borders in ethnically muddled border regions have to be sacrosanct. Absolute lunacy.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @German_reader

    Just calm down. I didn't say that this is good or bad. I have absolutely no desire to discuss it with you.

    I was merely stating the facts about what had recently happened - there is work going on to clear out the corridor to Crimea and that Crimea has already been hit. That's all.

    In your case I'd be more worried about what could happen in Europe if Putin continues his terroristic attacks on the peaceful infrastructure. There could be more waves of refugees.

    Replies: @German_reader

  410. @German_reader
    @LatW


    there are some news that they are already preparing an evacuation, just in case
     
    There are hundreds of thousands of Russians in Crimea who don't want to live under Ukrainian rule, maybe you should face up to that fact. If there were a real risk of Russia losing Crimea, it's not clear at all that Russia wouldn't use nukes. If I were Putin, I certainly would use them in such a scenario.
    But that's the problem with you, you identify 100% with every single Ukrainian demand, even the ones that are completely unreasonable, there is never any limit or any thought how badly this could all end. It's not enough if Ukraine is preserved as a sovereign state that controls the territories where people actually are and feel Ukrainian, no, victory has to be total and 30-year old borders in ethnically muddled border regions have to be sacrosanct. Absolute lunacy.

    Replies: @LatW

    Just calm down. I didn’t say that this is good or bad. I have absolutely no desire to discuss it with you.

    I was merely stating the facts about what had recently happened – there is work going on to clear out the corridor to Crimea and that Crimea has already been hit. That’s all.

    In your case I’d be more worried about what could happen in Europe if Putin continues his terroristic attacks on the peaceful infrastructure. There could be more waves of refugees.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @LatW


    In your case I’d be more worried about what could happen in Europe if Putin continues his terroristic attacks on the peaceful infrastructure. There could be more waves of refugees.
     
    This might actually not be that bad from a German perspective, the more Ukrainian men are killed in the war and the more women and children leave the country, the higher the chances for German men of getting a Ukrainian girlfriend.
    Seriously, what do you expect me to say? Obviously not great that Ukrainians are without energy and heating as winter approaches, it's not something I'm happy about. But apart from sending Ukraine anti-air defense systems and evacuating Ukrainian civilians to the EU, it's not like all that much can be done. And I don't think you can claim any moral high ground either, since it's people like you who are in favour of victory at any cost.

    Replies: @LatW

  411. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Barbarossa

    Turkey, mash potatoes, dressing, gravy in combination makes me want to puke to think about it. (I exaggerate here a tiny little bit.)

    Replies: @A123, @Barbarossa, @Mikhail, @AnonfromTN

    So, this raises the pertinent question? What food do you really like? We know that you don’t like Indian food or Thanksgiving fare. I feel like these indirectly encompass and rule out a substantial amount of culinary ground.

    • Agree: A123
    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Barbarossa

    For protein I eat a lot of eggs and dairy. For the rest I eat vegetables, fruits, nuts. Very little meat, around a pound a month. For dinner I had 2 hard boiled eggs and red kidney beans that I boiled for three hours after soaking them in salt-saturated water for two hours. The last twenty minutes there was a half onion chopped and three tablespoons of granulated garlic tossed in there. And some yogurt (the real stuff--I cannot stand low fat yogurt) and some grapes.

    You probably think I am a barbarian but I have spent 0 dollars 0 cents in the last year at McDonald's Taco Bell Kentucky Fried Chicken Subway Starbucks.

    Pumpkin pie and cranberries + fsck-ton granulated sugar are also not items that I consider to be food. If that stuff is so great how come everybody eats it only once a year?

    Mexicans and Italians and Chinks know how to cook. Indians do not.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @Barbarossa

  412. German_reader says:
    @LatW
    @German_reader

    Just calm down. I didn't say that this is good or bad. I have absolutely no desire to discuss it with you.

    I was merely stating the facts about what had recently happened - there is work going on to clear out the corridor to Crimea and that Crimea has already been hit. That's all.

    In your case I'd be more worried about what could happen in Europe if Putin continues his terroristic attacks on the peaceful infrastructure. There could be more waves of refugees.

    Replies: @German_reader

    In your case I’d be more worried about what could happen in Europe if Putin continues his terroristic attacks on the peaceful infrastructure. There could be more waves of refugees.

    This might actually not be that bad from a German perspective, the more Ukrainian men are killed in the war and the more women and children leave the country, the higher the chances for German men of getting a Ukrainian girlfriend.
    Seriously, what do you expect me to say? Obviously not great that Ukrainians are without energy and heating as winter approaches, it’s not something I’m happy about. But apart from sending Ukraine anti-air defense systems and evacuating Ukrainian civilians to the EU, it’s not like all that much can be done. And I don’t think you can claim any moral high ground either, since it’s people like you who are in favour of victory at any cost.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @German_reader


    the higher the chances for German men of getting a Ukrainian girlfriend.
     
    You should have German girlfriends.

    And I don’t think you can claim any moral high ground either, since it’s people like you who are in favour of victory at any cost.

     

    At least I support those who are not cowards in the face of mass murderers.

    Replies: @German_reader

  413. @Barbarossa
    @A123

    Ham doesn't seem to be a Thanksgiving thing around here, but it seems like the South does two meats for everything. We usually do ham for Christmas, and my timing should be good since I'll have my two pigs back by then!

    I agree on the butter though. We went up to my parents for Thanksgiving which is nice, but my Mom is a somewhat indifferent cook, so I spent some time adjusting things, a process which involved a lot of butter. I basted 1/2 a lb of herbed butter on the turkey which makes for a good gravy base and a moist bird, not to mention the mashed potatoes which ate up another 2 sticks.

    We're on the same page with Thanksgiving food, but I really worry about Emil Nikola Richard though. What kind of Cormac McCarthyesqe dystopian hellscape of Thanksgiving did he have to endure as a youth? Or does he just prefer PBJs? The questions make one's mind reel!

    Replies: @A123

    Ham doesn’t seem to be a Thanksgiving thing around here, but it seems like the South does two meats for everything. We usually do ham for Christmas, and my timing should be good since I’ll have my two pigs back by then!

    Ham is precooked, preserved, and lasts for weeks as a leftover. I suspect it is a combination of tradition and practicality. Particularly huge Thanksgiving ham may make it all the way to Christmas if it is an enthusiastic, salty cure.

    The Christmas centerpiece will be beef. However, ham availability is guaranteed. It usually appears as dinner one or two days prior so the fatty ham sections can appear in other dishes, green been casserole. Ham bone and less savory bits become soup/stew base.

    Butter and other fats + flour = ROUX. If you have good drippings the gravy always works. I suspect my usual Thanksgiving hosts are slipping some bacon grease into the turkey gravy… As the result is outstanding, I am not even going to ask the question.

    PEACE 😇
    ___________

    P.S. The first humor GIF under MORE was intended for you.

    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-202/#comment-5676131

    • Replies: @Barbarossa
    @A123


    P.S. The first humor GIF under MORE was intended for you.
     
    Thanks, I saw that. That is one way to get a fat pig! Pigs are smart, there is no doubt about that.

    I suspect my usual Thanksgiving hosts are slipping some bacon grease into the turkey gravy
     
    I would say that would be an excellent use of bacon grease. One of my pet peeves are people that get rid of their bacon grease. I'm not sure you can trust someone like that. They are probably queers or commies or both!

    I would say that Turkey usually needs some help to remain moist and make a decent gravy base. All the herbed butter I used for basting fit the bill in my case. My wife made a good roux gravy with those drippings. It's such a different thing than store bought gravy.

    Replies: @A123

  414. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Barbarossa

    Turkey, mash potatoes, dressing, gravy in combination makes me want to puke to think about it. (I exaggerate here a tiny little bit.)

    Replies: @A123, @Barbarossa, @Mikhail, @AnonfromTN

    – Sweet potatoes sliced and in the final minutes of baking, sliced with marsh mellow and pineapple cubes

    – dark turkey meat with cranberry sauce

    – white turkey meat with gravy

    – apple cider

    – white turkey meat with gravy

    – vegetable stuffing, cooked with and independent of turkey

    – pecan, pumpkin and coconut pies.

    In addition, I make a vegetarian chili with rice using red kidney beans, along with V8 low sodium vegetable juice and the McCormick low sodium chili powder.

    Leftovers make for great turkey sandwiches and soup, using the bones and the jellied gravy, along with the low sodium V8.

  415. @Barbarossa
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    So, this raises the pertinent question? What food do you really like? We know that you don't like Indian food or Thanksgiving fare. I feel like these indirectly encompass and rule out a substantial amount of culinary ground.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    For protein I eat a lot of eggs and dairy. For the rest I eat vegetables, fruits, nuts. Very little meat, around a pound a month. For dinner I had 2 hard boiled eggs and red kidney beans that I boiled for three hours after soaking them in salt-saturated water for two hours. The last twenty minutes there was a half onion chopped and three tablespoons of granulated garlic tossed in there. And some yogurt (the real stuff–I cannot stand low fat yogurt) and some grapes.

    You probably think I am a barbarian but I have spent 0 dollars 0 cents in the last year at McDonald’s Taco Bell Kentucky Fried Chicken Subway Starbucks.

    Pumpkin pie and cranberries + fsck-ton granulated sugar are also not items that I consider to be food. If that stuff is so great how come everybody eats it only once a year?

    Mexicans and Italians and Chinks know how to cook. Indians do not.

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    Milk count as Indian food.

    @a123 https://twitter.com/SinghDahiya1/status/1287738547089182720?s=20

    , @Barbarossa
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    You probably think I am a barbarian but I have spent 0 dollars 0 cents in the last year at McDonald’s Taco Bell Kentucky Fried Chicken Subway Starbucks.
     
    That pretty much describes me too, so you'll get no complaint from this quarter. I did get something from a Wendy's once in the last year since I was on the road at 10PM and needed something for dinner. The choices were either a bag of chips at the gas station or a hot "burger" at the adjoining Wendy's. I choose the latter, but cripes the meal package was like $9 and was crappy. I can't believe that people eat that as a matter of routine.

    It sounds like you like a pretty simple food routine. Personally I like things jam packed, so Thanksgiving is right up my alley. This morning I made scrambled eggs with sauteed onions, spinach, bacon, and extra sharp chedder cheese, topped with some paprika and finished in the broiler till crisp and bubbly on top. Paired with a couple slices of sourdough bread and coffee that is average breakfast at my house. My wife would happily eat the same scrambled egg every day, but I like going all out.

    We actually don't do that much sugar around here, and mostly sweeten with maple syrup and honey. Even then things are quite lightly sweetened compared to most people. I can get honey from a local guy by the 5 gallon pail and this spring I'm getting a 55 gallon drum bulk drum of syrup that I'm splitting with some other families. The syrup is less than $20 a gallon in bulk like that. So some lightly sweetened pumpkin pie topped with some similarly lightly sweetened whipped cream is not gross at all and very flavorful. I agree with you though that most deserts are way too sweet and can be gross.

    In modern processed cooking sugar+sodium are substitutes for actual flavor, but when you start with actual good tasting ingredients, rich food can be really good.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Mr. Hack

  416. @German_reader
    @LatW


    In your case I’d be more worried about what could happen in Europe if Putin continues his terroristic attacks on the peaceful infrastructure. There could be more waves of refugees.
     
    This might actually not be that bad from a German perspective, the more Ukrainian men are killed in the war and the more women and children leave the country, the higher the chances for German men of getting a Ukrainian girlfriend.
    Seriously, what do you expect me to say? Obviously not great that Ukrainians are without energy and heating as winter approaches, it's not something I'm happy about. But apart from sending Ukraine anti-air defense systems and evacuating Ukrainian civilians to the EU, it's not like all that much can be done. And I don't think you can claim any moral high ground either, since it's people like you who are in favour of victory at any cost.

    Replies: @LatW

    the higher the chances for German men of getting a Ukrainian girlfriend.

    You should have German girlfriends.

    And I don’t think you can claim any moral high ground either, since it’s people like you who are in favour of victory at any cost.

    At least I support those who are not cowards in the face of mass murderers.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @LatW


    At least I support those who are not cowards in the face of mass murderers.
     
    No, you just use the war in Ukraine as a vehicle to live out your braindead romantic fantasies, because your own nation in its complete and utter insignificance will of course never be able to wage the kind of heroic struggle you fantasize about and will always be limited to unhinged verbal extremism. But sure, for now Ukrainians will regard people like you who egg them on to completely exclude any compromise (because you can't talk with "mass murderers" after all) as their best friends. Maybe they will have second thoughts when Ukraine has been completely wrecked and de-populated.

    Replies: @LatW

  417. @German_reader
    @German_reader

    https://asiatimes.com/2022/11/harvard-guru-gives-biden-a-d-for-china-policy/


    Now, how about China policy more narrowly? This restriction on semiconductors is a declaration of economic war. It’s completely disproportionate to any of the problems we have with China. This is going 30, 40% of the way toward what we did with Japan, cutting off their oil before Pearl Harbor. Semiconductors are the key to the modern world.

    This validates every crazy nationalistic Chinese professor who’s been arguing that our goal all along has been to keep China down, to prevent them from growing. In terms of the relationship, it’s just awful. It’s an escalation. People don’t realize this is a declaration of war.

    [...]

    Now, back to the bigger picture. In China policy, Biden has done two important things.

    One is, he has completely reneged on the 1979 agreement that’s been the basis for peace in Taiwan. What did we say in that agreement? That we will not have official relations, we will not have an alliance.

    Now Biden has said four times he will defend Taiwan. That’s called an alliance.

    When Nancy Pelosi went to Taiwan, she was very careful to label it an official visit. And then immediately after a meeting with Taiwan’s President, Tsai Ing-wen’s spokeswoman went on their national TV and said Taiwan is a sovereign and independent country.

    That was the culmination of Pelosi’s visit—a complete breach of the US promises that have kept Taiwan safe for over four decades.
     

    Replies: @S, @showmethereal

    This is going 30, 40% of the way toward what we did with Japan, cutting off their oil before Pearl Harbor. Semiconductors are the key to the modern world…

    ..This validates every crazy nationalistic Chinese professor who’s been arguiing that our goal all along has been to keep China down, to prevent them from growing. In terms of the relationship, it’s just awful. It’s an escalation. People don’t realize this is a declaration of war.

    Thanks. This is a very insightful and important analysis.

    For some reason, the two quoted can’t simply say this is all quite deliberate on the part of the United States. The power of the ‘Big Lie’, I suppose, the hard truth being simply too impalatable, too horrible, for them to even think about, let alone speak of.

    That truth being, the US/UK, point by point, is using WWII as it’s template in it’s present course of actions in regards to Russia.

    In WWIII, from the US/UK perspective, Russia is the new Germany, Putin the ‘new Hitler’. As a microcosm, Putin, after failing to take Kiev, is bogged down in Ukraine, the same as Hitler, after failing to take Moscow, was bogged down in Russia, each leader, despite the fact that the United States is already in effect at war with them, refusing thus far to take the bait and simply declare war on the US.

    The United States, therefore, needs a ‘backdoor’ to enter more forcibly and directly into war, with Germany then, and with Russia today.

    In WWII, this was accomplished via the backdoor of Japan and the accompanying embargoes of oil and scrap metal. In WWIII, the backdoor for US war with Russia is China and an accompanying embargo in regards to Chinese semiconductor production.

    In response, Japan obliged the United States with it’s Dec 7, 1941 attack upon Pearl Harbor. Germany, honoring it’s treaty obligations with Japan, then declared war upon the United States, just as the US had desired.

    Will China, in response to this embargo upon it, attack the United States? Will this then bring Russia to declare war upon the United States, in solidarity with China, just as the US desires?

    We shall see.

    [I’m not for what I’m describing here, ie what it appears they are attempting to do. I think the historically slavery corrupted elites and hangers on of the US/UK should of been overthrown long ago.]

    Speaking of backdoor attacks, the below excerpt is from pg 109 of the 1853 book The New Rome.

    ‘Russia has expended all her forces in making a formidable display on her Western border. The United States are already digging the trenches for an attack in the rear.’

    https://archive.org/details/newrome00poes/page/108/mode/2up

  418. German_reader says:
    @LatW
    @German_reader


    the higher the chances for German men of getting a Ukrainian girlfriend.
     
    You should have German girlfriends.

    And I don’t think you can claim any moral high ground either, since it’s people like you who are in favour of victory at any cost.

     

    At least I support those who are not cowards in the face of mass murderers.

    Replies: @German_reader

    At least I support those who are not cowards in the face of mass murderers.

    No, you just use the war in Ukraine as a vehicle to live out your braindead romantic fantasies, because your own nation in its complete and utter insignificance will of course never be able to wage the kind of heroic struggle you fantasize about and will always be limited to unhinged verbal extremism. But sure, for now Ukrainians will regard people like you who egg them on to completely exclude any compromise (because you can’t talk with “mass murderers” after all) as their best friends. Maybe they will have second thoughts when Ukraine has been completely wrecked and de-populated.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @German_reader


    who egg them on
     
    They don't need to be egged on.

    Replies: @German_reader

  419. @German_reader
    @LatW


    At least I support those who are not cowards in the face of mass murderers.
     
    No, you just use the war in Ukraine as a vehicle to live out your braindead romantic fantasies, because your own nation in its complete and utter insignificance will of course never be able to wage the kind of heroic struggle you fantasize about and will always be limited to unhinged verbal extremism. But sure, for now Ukrainians will regard people like you who egg them on to completely exclude any compromise (because you can't talk with "mass murderers" after all) as their best friends. Maybe they will have second thoughts when Ukraine has been completely wrecked and de-populated.

    Replies: @LatW

    who egg them on

    They don’t need to be egged on.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @LatW

    imo it's still irresponsible to do so. And before you start with any nonsense about "cowards" etc. (yes, yes, I get it, German men are degenerates, unlike the Ukrainian heroes, to some extent that may unfortunately even be true), I have never suggested Ukraine should just surrender. This is a question about war aims, at what point the benefits of continuing the fight outweigh the negatives and under which conditions the war can be ended. As it now looks, Russia can't conquer Ukraine, but still do substantial damage. And the behaviour of Zelensky's government (trying to bring about direct NATO intervention, going on about the "liberation" of Crimea) is simply appalling. They need to be told to aim at realistic core goals and stop this nonsense.

    Replies: @LatW

  420. German_reader says:
    @LatW
    @German_reader


    who egg them on
     
    They don't need to be egged on.

    Replies: @German_reader

    imo it’s still irresponsible to do so. And before you start with any nonsense about “cowards” etc. (yes, yes, I get it, German men are degenerates, unlike the Ukrainian heroes, to some extent that may unfortunately even be true), I have never suggested Ukraine should just surrender. This is a question about war aims, at what point the benefits of continuing the fight outweigh the negatives and under which conditions the war can be ended. As it now looks, Russia can’t conquer Ukraine, but still do substantial damage. And the behaviour of Zelensky’s government (trying to bring about direct NATO intervention, going on about the “liberation” of Crimea) is simply appalling. They need to be told to aim at realistic core goals and stop this nonsense.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @German_reader


    German men are degenerates, unlike the Ukrainian heroes, to some extent that may unfortunately even be true
     
    Look, I never said anything bad about German men specifically (or didn't mean to imply). But if you want to dish out, then learn to take it back.

    As it now looks, Russia can’t conquer Ukraine, but still do substantial damage.

     

    They will continue doing damage as long as they are allowed to, most likely even during any potential negotiations, you don't see it that way but their goal is to destroy that nation, not simply impose their will. I already told you that if they had just tried to take the Donbas, like their generals suggested, it would be one thing, and, while not great, it probably wouldn't merit an all out existential fight. But they overplayed their hand and went too far. If they are allowed to keep their gains, then it is just a matter of time when the war will restart - the Ukrainians have said over and over that they do not want to leave this to their children. This is not even my subjective outlook (personally I feel that those who don't want to live together shouldn't be forced to, ideally), I'm just explaining how they think. Trust me, they don't need to be egged on, after what was done to them, they don't.

    Replies: @German_reader, @Mikel

  421. @German_reader
    @LatW

    imo it's still irresponsible to do so. And before you start with any nonsense about "cowards" etc. (yes, yes, I get it, German men are degenerates, unlike the Ukrainian heroes, to some extent that may unfortunately even be true), I have never suggested Ukraine should just surrender. This is a question about war aims, at what point the benefits of continuing the fight outweigh the negatives and under which conditions the war can be ended. As it now looks, Russia can't conquer Ukraine, but still do substantial damage. And the behaviour of Zelensky's government (trying to bring about direct NATO intervention, going on about the "liberation" of Crimea) is simply appalling. They need to be told to aim at realistic core goals and stop this nonsense.

    Replies: @LatW

    German men are degenerates, unlike the Ukrainian heroes, to some extent that may unfortunately even be true

    Look, I never said anything bad about German men specifically (or didn’t mean to imply). But if you want to dish out, then learn to take it back.

    As it now looks, Russia can’t conquer Ukraine, but still do substantial damage.

    They will continue doing damage as long as they are allowed to, most likely even during any potential negotiations, you don’t see it that way but their goal is to destroy that nation, not simply impose their will. I already told you that if they had just tried to take the Donbas, like their generals suggested, it would be one thing, and, while not great, it probably wouldn’t merit an all out existential fight. But they overplayed their hand and went too far. If they are allowed to keep their gains, then it is just a matter of time when the war will restart – the Ukrainians have said over and over that they do not want to leave this to their children. This is not even my subjective outlook (personally I feel that those who don’t want to live together shouldn’t be forced to, ideally), I’m just explaining how they think. Trust me, they don’t need to be egged on, after what was done to them, they don’t.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @LatW


    the Ukrainians have said over and over that they do not want to leave this to their children.
     
    If this goes on for years, there won't be all that many Ukrainian children in Ukraine to leave anything to. There are about 200 000 Ukrainian children in German schools now, I suppose more in Poland. The country is being de-populated at a rapid pace. SPIEGEL recently had a story about Ukrainian teenagers in Hamburg, and the tenor already was "We have much better chances here, we don't want to go back". Comments like by Zelensky's wife along the lines "If necessary, we can tolerate being without power for 2-3 years" are just crazy, who's going to live under such conditions when people can go to the EU instead.
    I don't think Ukraine should just give up territories where the majority of the population before the war was clearly Ukrainian in sentiment, obviously there are limits to what could be conceded. But I don't see how aiming at some kind of total victory over Russia (whose original goals in this war have already failed btw) is going to lead to anything but disaster.

    Replies: @LatW

    , @Mikel
    @LatW


    the Ukrainians have said over and over that they do not want to leave this to their children
     
    Do you think that if Ukraine takes back Crimea the Russians will never come back again? The contrary looks much more likely. Short of marching to Moscow and dismembering the Russian state, I don't know how Ukrainians can prevent their children from having to fight Russia in the future.

    personally I feel that those who don’t want to live together shouldn’t be forced to, ideally),
     
    That would be the best alternative really. Ukraine deserves to be independent from Moscow, now more than ever. But just apply the same principle to Crimea and Donbass (I doubt thre is a pro-Russian majority anywhere else now in Ukraine) and there you have a basis for a possible future peace. When Musk proposed this he was met with abuse in Kiev though.

    Replies: @Sean, @LatW

  422. Springprincess #IStandWithRussia🇷🇺
    @TamrikoT
    When Russians find bodies of the dead Ukraine soldiers, they commit them to the ground and make a mark for Ukrainians to find them and identify.
    Ukraine Nazis never have any respect for neither fallen nor alive Russian soldiers.

    [MORE]

  423. German_reader says:
    @LatW
    @German_reader


    German men are degenerates, unlike the Ukrainian heroes, to some extent that may unfortunately even be true
     
    Look, I never said anything bad about German men specifically (or didn't mean to imply). But if you want to dish out, then learn to take it back.

    As it now looks, Russia can’t conquer Ukraine, but still do substantial damage.

     

    They will continue doing damage as long as they are allowed to, most likely even during any potential negotiations, you don't see it that way but their goal is to destroy that nation, not simply impose their will. I already told you that if they had just tried to take the Donbas, like their generals suggested, it would be one thing, and, while not great, it probably wouldn't merit an all out existential fight. But they overplayed their hand and went too far. If they are allowed to keep their gains, then it is just a matter of time when the war will restart - the Ukrainians have said over and over that they do not want to leave this to their children. This is not even my subjective outlook (personally I feel that those who don't want to live together shouldn't be forced to, ideally), I'm just explaining how they think. Trust me, they don't need to be egged on, after what was done to them, they don't.

    Replies: @German_reader, @Mikel

    the Ukrainians have said over and over that they do not want to leave this to their children.

    If this goes on for years, there won’t be all that many Ukrainian children in Ukraine to leave anything to. There are about 200 000 Ukrainian children in German schools now, I suppose more in Poland. The country is being de-populated at a rapid pace. SPIEGEL recently had a story about Ukrainian teenagers in Hamburg, and the tenor already was “We have much better chances here, we don’t want to go back”. Comments like by Zelensky’s wife along the lines “If necessary, we can tolerate being without power for 2-3 years” are just crazy, who’s going to live under such conditions when people can go to the EU instead.
    I don’t think Ukraine should just give up territories where the majority of the population before the war was clearly Ukrainian in sentiment, obviously there are limits to what could be conceded. But I don’t see how aiming at some kind of total victory over Russia (whose original goals in this war have already failed btw) is going to lead to anything but disaster.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @German_reader


    If this goes on for years, there won’t be all that many Ukrainian children in Ukraine to leave anything to.
     
    The current horrific, hot phase will not go on for years, I trust Kyrylo Budanov (the head of the Ukrainian intelligence) and General Zaluzhnyi here above all. Kyrylo Budanov says that the hot phase of the war will be over some time next year (from what I understand from his words, somewhere closer to summer).

    After that there will be permanent cold war between Russia and her neighbors (I don't harbor much hope in the Russian population that they could somehow change and become friendly in considerable numbers). Ukraine will have to become Israel.

    There are about 200 000 Ukrainian children in German schools now, I suppose more in Poland. The country is being de-populated at a rapid pace.
     
    I never said that this is not catastrophic. This needs to be penned down as involuntary displacement by a foreign aggressor, and should be treated as one of the many crimes of this aggression. In fact, a displacement on such a scale could be treated as borderline genocide. I know you don't like it when people state it openly like that but that's what it is (or ethnocide at the very least). So those who will just quietly accept that it is ok to commit something like that, should just think about how they will be perceived.

    And, btw, I'm not worried about the Ukrainians in Poland (or in the Baltic States, in smaller, but still significant numbers). They are at home there. The ones in Western countries should be encouraged to repatriate in due time, hopefully, next year. The families will need to be reunited with their men.

    obviously there are limits to what could be conceded
     
    It is very unseemly when a foreigner talks about "conceding" someone else's land. Talk that way about your own land.

    Another thing that you fail to understand is the life in occupied territory. It is torment. Imagine if part of one German state was occupied by a power that hates you and the people there were tormented, would you just leave them there? The electricity will come back, so will some of the refugees, but why willfully give up territory and leave your kin under a savage occupation? Especially when the military are willing to fight.

    But I don’t see how aiming at some kind of total victory over Russia (whose original goals in this war have already failed btw) is going to lead to anything but disaster.
     
    A "total victory" over Russia can only be completed with the direct participation of the Russian people.
    The baton will be passed on to them and then it will be up to them to decide what they can achieve.

    Russia's original goals failed in this instance but that doesn't mean they won't try again. The Russian society is ill and they cannot help but keep reverting back to their crazy imperial impulses. They do not have a strong enough core. Unless the Russian people themselves change this, this will go on forever. For Ukraine it is a question how this can be mitigated and what security guarantees Ukraine can build long term. Best will be a strong military and good friends.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @German_reader, @Beckow

  424. @Barbarossa
    @AnonfromTN

    Yep. Voting in local elections is usually far more effective than any national races. Of course everyone thinks it's the opposite case, which is a shame.

    Replies: @silviosilver

    Voting in local elections is usually far more effective than any national races.

    Assuming “local” means municipal rather than state, describe some of its successes.

    • Replies: @Barbarossa
    @silviosilver

    If you have sensible people on the county and local level they can be judicious in the application of state or federal laws regardless of how unhinged those laws are. County sheriffs, being elected are often an important check on nonsense.

    For example, we have lots of gun laws in NY but the local sheriffs are typically forthright that they do not plan on enforcing them, since they know quite well that there are lots of violations and it will only cause trouble to enforce.

    It was the same during Covid madness. The State could make all sorts of strictures but if you had county officials who respected local norms and behavior it was often kept very minimal.

    When I first built on my land I had little money but I built a little 20x20 cabin with no septic, electric, or water for less than 10k on my off grid back-road. Since then, it's been expanded several times and outfitted like a real house with hot running water and all! The veritable lap of luxury!
    But, at the time I was starting out and had virtually nothing except for the desire to make a start. Naturally what I was doing by living in my hunting camp was not especially legal, especially with a wife and baby, and I had some anxiety that I would be found out.
    Being a small town people figured it out pretty quickly and the reaction was generally encouraging that I was making a go of things rather than disapproving that I didn't have everything done from the get go. At one point after the fact I remember the building inspector saying, "Well, I don't think there is a law that says you can't live in your hunting cabin year round."

    So, long story short if you have good and sane local officials they will make your life much more reasonable in practice while the opposite may make your life a living hell. My building inspector or town board has had more good impact on my ability to live my life than any number of Trumps or Bidens. You want local officials who treat you like a neighbor and a fellow human being and who will do right by you regardless of the letter of the law. The way things are going, I think that will become more important, not less, going forward.

    , @Barbarossa
    @silviosilver

    Out of curiosity, I described some examples of the relative importance of local governments in my other reply. Any feedback on that?

    Replies: @silviosilver

  425. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Barbarossa

    For protein I eat a lot of eggs and dairy. For the rest I eat vegetables, fruits, nuts. Very little meat, around a pound a month. For dinner I had 2 hard boiled eggs and red kidney beans that I boiled for three hours after soaking them in salt-saturated water for two hours. The last twenty minutes there was a half onion chopped and three tablespoons of granulated garlic tossed in there. And some yogurt (the real stuff--I cannot stand low fat yogurt) and some grapes.

    You probably think I am a barbarian but I have spent 0 dollars 0 cents in the last year at McDonald's Taco Bell Kentucky Fried Chicken Subway Starbucks.

    Pumpkin pie and cranberries + fsck-ton granulated sugar are also not items that I consider to be food. If that stuff is so great how come everybody eats it only once a year?

    Mexicans and Italians and Chinks know how to cook. Indians do not.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @Barbarossa

  426. German_reader says:

    Trump apparently had dinner with Kanye West and Nick Fuentes:
    https://www.axios.com/2022/11/25/trump-nick-fuentes-ye-kanye

    [MORE]

    A source familiar with the conversation told Axios Trump took a phone call during the dinner, and his demeanor toward Ye seemed to change when he got off the call. Trump made some nasty comments about Ye’s ex-wife, Kim Kardashian, and told the rapper to pass them on.
    Ye, who has lost major sponsorships over his anti-Semitism and recent far-right associations, has said he wants to run for president in 2024. The rapper claims Trump started “screaming” at him at the dinner and told him he would lose — “most perturbed” by Ye asking Trump to be his running mate.

    What they’re saying: “Kanye West very much wanted to visit Mar-a-Lago. Our dinner meeting was intended to be Kanye and me only, but he arrived with a guest whom I had never met and knew nothing about,” Trump said in a statement.
    A Trump spokesman did not provide comment on additional reporting about the dinner. Fuentes did not immediately respond to requests for comment.
    Behind the scenes: A source familiar with the dinner conversation told Axios that Trump “seemed very taken” with Fuentes, impressed that the 24-year-old was able to rattle off statistics and recall speeches dating back to his 2016 campaign.
    Paraphrasing the conversation, the source said Fuentes told the president he preferred him to be “authentic,” and that Trump seemed scripted and unlike himself during his recent 2024 campaign announcement speech.
    Trump responded, “You like it better when I just speak off the cuff,” the source said. Fuentes replied that he did, calling Trump an “amazing” president when he was unrestrained. “There was a lot of fawning back and forth,” the source added.
    Fuentes told Trump that he represented a side of Trump’s base that was disappointed with his newly cautious approach, especially with what some far-right activists view as a lack of support for those charged in the Jan. 6 Capitol attack.
    Trump didn’t disagree with Fuentes, but said he has advisers who want him to read off teleprompters and be more “presidential.” Notably, Trump referred to himself as a politician, which he has been loathe to do in the past.
    Fuentes also told Trump that he would crush potential 2024 Republican rivals in a primary, including Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis. Trump asked for Fuentes’ opinion on other candidates as well.
    Trump at one point turned to Ye and said, “I really like this guy. He gets me,” according to the source.

    Since Jared failed so badly in 2020, maybe Andrew Anglin can become Trump’s campaign manager for 2024.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @German_reader

    You probably wouldn't expect Trump to know who Fuentes was, but it's kinda astonishing that no one among Trump's handlers knew who he was either - or were there these people simply not around? Or were they around, knew who Fuentes was, but didn't think that was anything to be alarmed by? If so, I'm not honestly not sure if that is good or bad. Obviously bad in terms of PR, but maybe not so bad in terms of how far up "far right" ideas have infiltrated?

    Replies: @German_reader, @A123

    , @S
    @German_reader


    Trump apparently had dinner with Kanye West and Nick Fuentes:
     
    Trump, much like his counterpart Putin, does not in reality believe in the identity of peoples, ie peoplehood, or, nationalism. It is simply empty symbolism of empty symbolism with these two.

    Never the less, for those self proclaimed 'progressives' which may be a bit slow on the uptake, things like this purported dinner with Fuentes that Trump has had, the same as Trump having said years back that there were good and decent people on 'both sides' at Charlottesville, is quite deliberate and designed to ensure that the prog's psychological conditioning is 'triggered, ie that Trump (like Putin) is 'literally a new Hitler'.

    For today's delusional US progressive, fighting Putin in Ukraine is fighting Trump by proxy, which in turn for them is fighting Hitler by proxy, the latter being the designated evil poster boy for any and all expressions of peoplehood since 1933-45, irrespective of what the actual reality might truly be.



    As for the war in Ukraine, Ukraine being to WWIII what Poland was to WWII, ie it's flashpoint, the war thus far is going swimmingly for it's anti-identity promoters. Their air forces effectively being grounded, both Russia and Ukraine have been reduced to fighting high casualty WWI style trench warfare, ensuring that their best, brightest, and bravest men are being killed or maimed in large numbers at the front.

    Relatedly, Ukraine is bleeding huge numbers of it's people as refugees, many, if not most, to never return. This in turn is further destabilizing what remains of the identity of those European peoples which have taken them in. [Russia, too, has lost some of it's people as refugees, but not in the high numbers percentage wise as Ukraine has.]

    Last, but certainly not least, the war between Ukraine and Russia is generating vast amounts of hatred between the two, which the war's promoters stoke, and in turn feed off of, making them stronger.

    For any not liking this and where it is headed, first and foremost, the people of the Anglosphere countries (where much of this is emanating from) should stand down and refuse to support the war in any way, shape, or form, even if this is entirely unilateral. Though I realize it may seem counter intuitive where things are a bit hotter, I would suggest something similar for Ukraine and Russia, ie to stand down.

    Fight, if one must, but, on one's own terms, not as here, where everyone involved has been manipulated into fighting against their own interests.

    Get right with God, all this not necessarily being in the order I have suggested.
    , @songbird
    @German_reader

    It is a pity that we will never know what Trump said about Kim Kardashian.

  427. @Sher Singh
    @silviosilver

    Ultimately, people care about what they have an interest in.
    I care about White Christian survival due to concubines.

    Euro Pagans due to their being cousins. Why does a Slav care for Turks or Anglos?
    If it's just crass consumerism & a respect for modern amenities - that's a dead end.

    Replies: @Coconuts, @silviosilver

    Why does a Slav care for Turks or Anglos?
    If it’s just crass consumerism & a respect for modern amenities – that’s a dead end.

    From my irl experience of Belarusians, apart from the ties to local Slavic culture and Russia or Poland, plenty of the more educated ones seem to be ‘Northern Euro’ orientated, looking to Scandanavia, Netherlands, Switzerland, WASPs in the US for political and cultural inspiration, Germany for technology.

    I found this noticeable because the educated liberal people in the UK had a different orientation, similar to what SilvioSliver was talking about in Australia, where they value a mixture of aborigine, Native American and tribal cultures generally, blacks etc.

    • Thanks: Sher Singh
    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @Coconuts

    https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x33eua2

    He's a Serb though, 50-50 whether he's darker than me..
    E. Euros tilting to the North is like a black white supremacist.
    E. Euros are natural serfs - they love whoever beats/rapes them.

    A Belarussian shows up to a Whites Only meeting - expects the clan, gets BLM.

    , @Dmitry
    @Coconuts


    looking to Scandanavia, Netherlands
     
    It's not specific for Belarus. Everyone outside Europe, is looking (with dreams) to Western Europe. Western Europe is the center for our cargo-cult.

    I guess a lot is in relation to consumer products. My parents always wanted every consumer product "made in Germany", whether car or washing machine. It's like having a German automobile, means you now have been able to give your family the quality of life of Germany.

    In Russia, if you rent an apartment which is slightly clean or modern, you can advertise saying it has "Scandinavian style" and add to the price. "Scandinavian style" doesn't just mean you go to IKEA, but maybe it is the perfect euphemism to describe middle class, clean apartment where "real white people" (i.e. Western Europeans) can live.

    I believe there is the same cargo-cult in Latin America, in the Middle East. In India, it's infamous, that the driver of the taxis will start to talk about their admiration for Nazi Germany.


    educated liberal people in the UK had a different orientation,
     
    Educated people in the UK are probably the world's most elite nationality, with space a little below for France, Germany, Netherlands etc. They have been the creators of the modern world for more than a couple centuries. If you are cargo-cult for everyone, then who will be cargo cult for you?

    This probably part of the fashion for "primitivism" in the latter 19th century. There is also the dream of the "secret knowledge" of ancient peoples, which is especially in relation for India, which is not exactly "primitivism" (as the ancient Indians were the most advanced in certain topics in their time). Many of the English creators of topics like computer science were obsessed with ancient India.

    I think North-West European countries like UK also cargo-cults in the epicurean topics (e.g. food) for the Latin cultures like France, which is correct as the countries with Mediterranean have always better food, and have continued more traditional culture in those areas like food and the traditional industry.

    Replies: @songbird

  428. @German_reader
    Trump apparently had dinner with Kanye West and Nick Fuentes:
    https://www.axios.com/2022/11/25/trump-nick-fuentes-ye-kanye

    A source familiar with the conversation told Axios Trump took a phone call during the dinner, and his demeanor toward Ye seemed to change when he got off the call. Trump made some nasty comments about Ye's ex-wife, Kim Kardashian, and told the rapper to pass them on.
    Ye, who has lost major sponsorships over his anti-Semitism and recent far-right associations, has said he wants to run for president in 2024. The rapper claims Trump started "screaming" at him at the dinner and told him he would lose — "most perturbed" by Ye asking Trump to be his running mate.
     

    What they're saying: "Kanye West very much wanted to visit Mar-a-Lago. Our dinner meeting was intended to be Kanye and me only, but he arrived with a guest whom I had never met and knew nothing about," Trump said in a statement.
    A Trump spokesman did not provide comment on additional reporting about the dinner. Fuentes did not immediately respond to requests for comment.
    Behind the scenes: A source familiar with the dinner conversation told Axios that Trump "seemed very taken" with Fuentes, impressed that the 24-year-old was able to rattle off statistics and recall speeches dating back to his 2016 campaign.
    Paraphrasing the conversation, the source said Fuentes told the president he preferred him to be "authentic," and that Trump seemed scripted and unlike himself during his recent 2024 campaign announcement speech.
    Trump responded, “You like it better when I just speak off the cuff," the source said. Fuentes replied that he did, calling Trump an "amazing" president when he was unrestrained. "There was a lot of fawning back and forth," the source added.
    Fuentes told Trump that he represented a side of Trump's base that was disappointed with his newly cautious approach, especially with what some far-right activists view as a lack of support for those charged in the Jan. 6 Capitol attack.
    Trump didn't disagree with Fuentes, but said he has advisers who want him to read off teleprompters and be more "presidential." Notably, Trump referred to himself as a politician, which he has been loathe to do in the past.
    Fuentes also told Trump that he would crush potential 2024 Republican rivals in a primary, including Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis. Trump asked for Fuentes' opinion on other candidates as well.
    Trump at one point turned to Ye and said, "I really like this guy. He gets me," according to the source.
     
    Since Jared failed so badly in 2020, maybe Andrew Anglin can become Trump's campaign manager for 2024.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @S, @songbird

    You probably wouldn’t expect Trump to know who Fuentes was, but it’s kinda astonishing that no one among Trump’s handlers knew who he was either – or were there these people simply not around? Or were they around, knew who Fuentes was, but didn’t think that was anything to be alarmed by? If so, I’m not honestly not sure if that is good or bad. Obviously bad in terms of PR, but maybe not so bad in terms of how far up “far right” ideas have infiltrated?

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @silviosilver

    I'm more amazed that Trump met Kanye after all the recent controversy, his handlers can't have missed all of that after all. Maybe A123 should start to be concerned, could it be that Trump will really be like Hitler in his 2nd term and start to persecute Judeo-Christians?

    Replies: @sudden death, @silviosilver, @A123

    , @A123
    @silviosilver


    You probably wouldn’t expect Trump to know who Fuentes was, but it’s kinda astonishing that no one among Trump’s handlers knew who he was either – or were there these people simply not around?
     
    Fuentes was unexpectedly part of Kanye's entourage. (1)

    Trump’s campaign provided Breitbart News with this statement from President Trump: “Kanye West very much wanted to visit Mar-a-Lago. Our dinner meeting was intended to be Kanye and me only, but he arrived with a guest whom I had never met and knew nothing about.”
     
    Going to the house of a private citizen does not have the same sort of security pre-clearance as a White House visit. How should the unknown, but non threatening, guest be handled? Odds are there were no staff who could sight recognize Fuentes.

    If everyone who ever had a single dinner with someone they do not know is eliminated from Presidential eligibility... Who remains? Spending more than a few minutes on this part of the story is desperation given form and substance.

     
    https://i0.wp.com/www.powerlineblog.com/ed-assets/2022/11/Fh4mP8fXwAAHWe6.jpg
     

    Intentionally meeting with Kanye is much more problematic. There is plenty of staff with lead time to head off "Ye Mistake". By itself, this goes in the category of unforced error. Unlikely to inflict long term damage, but certainly less than prudent. Expect future private meetings to have more strict preparation & invitation control.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2022/11/25/trump-dined-at-mar-a-lago-with-white-nationalist-holocaust-denier-nick-fuentes-alongside-kanye-west/
  429. @silviosilver
    @German_reader

    You probably wouldn't expect Trump to know who Fuentes was, but it's kinda astonishing that no one among Trump's handlers knew who he was either - or were there these people simply not around? Or were they around, knew who Fuentes was, but didn't think that was anything to be alarmed by? If so, I'm not honestly not sure if that is good or bad. Obviously bad in terms of PR, but maybe not so bad in terms of how far up "far right" ideas have infiltrated?

    Replies: @German_reader, @A123

    I’m more amazed that Trump met Kanye after all the recent controversy, his handlers can’t have missed all of that after all. Maybe A123 should start to be concerned, could it be that Trump will really be like Hitler in his 2nd term and start to persecute Judeo-Christians?

    • LOL: A123
    • Replies: @sudden death
    @German_reader

    Negroes r da real Joos now, can't be antisemetic if you're persecuting just fake ones;)

    , @silviosilver
    @German_reader

    You're quite right. That alone is astonishing, but perhaps excusable based on their prior dealings, and also comports with Trump's renegade maverick approach to politics. It's hard to see what actual good could possibly come of it though. (Or have I completely misread Trump, and the "literally Hitler" accusations had some merit after all, and he really is planning on forming a "death con 3" alliance with Ye?)

    I too await A123's update.

    @sudden death


    Negroes r da real Joos now, can’t be antisemetic if you’re persecuting just fake ones;)
     
    Have you followed the flap on twitter? Credit where it's due, those real Jew groids are doing a knockdown troll job on the 'fake' Jews. Well, they're not really trolling, they're actually sincere. It's just funny seeing the usual "that's nazi!" accusations falling flat and being nimbly sidestepped.
    , @A123
    @German_reader

    When did Yeezy join the wignat movement?

    Isn't he a trifle too pigmented too fit in?

    PEACE 😇

  430. @showmethereal
    @Coconuts

    Yeah productivity is true. But the natives looked at the white invaders the same way. They didn’t care about productivity. Aside from the fact Australia was literally a place for the Brits to get rid of undesirables. In North America - what is left of the native tribes still protest and wish whites would leave their ancestral lands. They don’t care about productivity.

    As to Europe - again most don’t feel sorry. They collectively competed in imperialism- so they collectively absorb. Italy and Spain are the closest across the Med. The destruction of Libya is what unleashed the latest torrent. That was a NATO operation. Well if they share “defense” well hey they all have to share in the fruits of their destabilization. Why Germany chose to accept so many after the Syrian and Iraqi destabilizing I don’t know. But again they are a NATO country. NATO countries follow the U.S. so hey - that’s what happens. For every action there is a reaction. All the Arab Spring psyop is all part of it. NATO has blood on its hands and dirt on its clothes. All those actions hastened the migrant crisis

    Replies: @German_reader, @Coconuts

    But the natives looked at the white invaders the same way. They didn’t care about productivity. Aside from the fact Australia was literally a place for the Brits to get rid of undesirables. In North America – what is left of the native tribes still protest and wish whites would leave their ancestral lands. They don’t care about productivity.

    Iirc the point was originally more about the difference between European settlers and Africans migrants coming to Europe. Africans, MENA and others coming to Europe are definitely motivated by the level of economic development there, they do not appear to be drawn by a desire for uncultivated land or Europe’s raw natural resources. Nor by a selfless Kantian moral imperative to seek pure justice or to save Euros from their moral backwardness.

    Generally, this idea that the difference in value between the level of development of modern Australia or the US and Native American tribes is completely subjective, and in theory one is just as valuable or good as another is also very popular among white progressives at the moment and has a lot of political significance for them. It might be cynical, but I think the reason these claims are taken seriously is because it suits the broader political interests of powers like the US and China to do so, at least superficially.

    As to Europe – again most don’t feel sorry. They collectively competed in imperialism- so they collectively absorb.

    European countries are organising this themselves (in various cases it has been organised by the colonialists who used to run the empires). I was saying that reparations for colonialism is not a significant or relevant factor. Afaik Libya was a Franco-British operation, not a NATO one, but these immigration trends pre-date by 20 years, even decades more. The actual cause is highlighted by German_reader, major growth in populations outside Europe, better communications, easier travel, plus declining indigenous populations in Europe. The present European economic and political systems currently depend on growth, diversity and expanding populations, so they have a natural openness and attractive pull.

    Ironically, the Nordic countries with the most idealistic immigration policies are the ones with the least participation in colonialism.

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @Coconuts

    But Franco British does equal NATO. That’s how gangs work (so called mutual defense treaty). But the US absolutely was a major force behind it. Why do you think Hilary Clinton laughed after saying “we came we saw he died”. It was literal.

  431. @German_reader
    @silviosilver

    I'm more amazed that Trump met Kanye after all the recent controversy, his handlers can't have missed all of that after all. Maybe A123 should start to be concerned, could it be that Trump will really be like Hitler in his 2nd term and start to persecute Judeo-Christians?

    Replies: @sudden death, @silviosilver, @A123

    Negroes r da real Joos now, can’t be antisemetic if you’re persecuting just fake ones;)

  432. @German_reader
    @silviosilver

    I'm more amazed that Trump met Kanye after all the recent controversy, his handlers can't have missed all of that after all. Maybe A123 should start to be concerned, could it be that Trump will really be like Hitler in his 2nd term and start to persecute Judeo-Christians?

    Replies: @sudden death, @silviosilver, @A123

    You’re quite right. That alone is astonishing, but perhaps excusable based on their prior dealings, and also comports with Trump’s renegade maverick approach to politics. It’s hard to see what actual good could possibly come of it though. (Or have I completely misread Trump, and the “literally Hitler” accusations had some merit after all, and he really is planning on forming a “death con 3” alliance with Ye?)

    I too await A123’s update.

    Negroes r da real Joos now, can’t be antisemetic if you’re persecuting just fake ones;)

    Have you followed the flap on twitter? Credit where it’s due, those real Jew groids are doing a knockdown troll job on the ‘fake’ Jews. Well, they’re not really trolling, they’re actually sincere. It’s just funny seeing the usual “that’s nazi!” accusations falling flat and being nimbly sidestepped.

  433. @silviosilver
    @German_reader

    You probably wouldn't expect Trump to know who Fuentes was, but it's kinda astonishing that no one among Trump's handlers knew who he was either - or were there these people simply not around? Or were they around, knew who Fuentes was, but didn't think that was anything to be alarmed by? If so, I'm not honestly not sure if that is good or bad. Obviously bad in terms of PR, but maybe not so bad in terms of how far up "far right" ideas have infiltrated?

    Replies: @German_reader, @A123

    You probably wouldn’t expect Trump to know who Fuentes was, but it’s kinda astonishing that no one among Trump’s handlers knew who he was either – or were there these people simply not around?

    Fuentes was unexpectedly part of Kanye’s entourage. (1)

    Trump’s campaign provided Breitbart News with this statement from President Trump: “Kanye West very much wanted to visit Mar-a-Lago. Our dinner meeting was intended to be Kanye and me only, but he arrived with a guest whom I had never met and knew nothing about.”

    Going to the house of a private citizen does not have the same sort of security pre-clearance as a White House visit. How should the unknown, but non threatening, guest be handled? Odds are there were no staff who could sight recognize Fuentes.

    If everyone who ever had a single dinner with someone they do not know is eliminated from Presidential eligibility… Who remains? Spending more than a few minutes on this part of the story is desperation given form and substance.

     

     

    Intentionally meeting with Kanye is much more problematic. There is plenty of staff with lead time to head off “Ye Mistake”. By itself, this goes in the category of unforced error. Unlikely to inflict long term damage, but certainly less than prudent. Expect future private meetings to have more strict preparation & invitation control.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2022/11/25/trump-dined-at-mar-a-lago-with-white-nationalist-holocaust-denier-nick-fuentes-alongside-kanye-west/

  434. @German_reader
    Trump apparently had dinner with Kanye West and Nick Fuentes:
    https://www.axios.com/2022/11/25/trump-nick-fuentes-ye-kanye

    A source familiar with the conversation told Axios Trump took a phone call during the dinner, and his demeanor toward Ye seemed to change when he got off the call. Trump made some nasty comments about Ye's ex-wife, Kim Kardashian, and told the rapper to pass them on.
    Ye, who has lost major sponsorships over his anti-Semitism and recent far-right associations, has said he wants to run for president in 2024. The rapper claims Trump started "screaming" at him at the dinner and told him he would lose — "most perturbed" by Ye asking Trump to be his running mate.
     

    What they're saying: "Kanye West very much wanted to visit Mar-a-Lago. Our dinner meeting was intended to be Kanye and me only, but he arrived with a guest whom I had never met and knew nothing about," Trump said in a statement.
    A Trump spokesman did not provide comment on additional reporting about the dinner. Fuentes did not immediately respond to requests for comment.
    Behind the scenes: A source familiar with the dinner conversation told Axios that Trump "seemed very taken" with Fuentes, impressed that the 24-year-old was able to rattle off statistics and recall speeches dating back to his 2016 campaign.
    Paraphrasing the conversation, the source said Fuentes told the president he preferred him to be "authentic," and that Trump seemed scripted and unlike himself during his recent 2024 campaign announcement speech.
    Trump responded, “You like it better when I just speak off the cuff," the source said. Fuentes replied that he did, calling Trump an "amazing" president when he was unrestrained. "There was a lot of fawning back and forth," the source added.
    Fuentes told Trump that he represented a side of Trump's base that was disappointed with his newly cautious approach, especially with what some far-right activists view as a lack of support for those charged in the Jan. 6 Capitol attack.
    Trump didn't disagree with Fuentes, but said he has advisers who want him to read off teleprompters and be more "presidential." Notably, Trump referred to himself as a politician, which he has been loathe to do in the past.
    Fuentes also told Trump that he would crush potential 2024 Republican rivals in a primary, including Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis. Trump asked for Fuentes' opinion on other candidates as well.
    Trump at one point turned to Ye and said, "I really like this guy. He gets me," according to the source.
     
    Since Jared failed so badly in 2020, maybe Andrew Anglin can become Trump's campaign manager for 2024.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @S, @songbird

    Trump apparently had dinner with Kanye West and Nick Fuentes:

    Trump, much like his counterpart Putin, does not in reality believe in the identity of peoples, ie peoplehood, or, nationalism. It is simply empty symbolism of empty symbolism with these two.

    Never the less, for those self proclaimed ‘progressives’ which may be a bit slow on the uptake, things like this purported dinner with Fuentes that Trump has had, the same as Trump having said years back that there were good and decent people on ‘both sides’ at Charlottesville, is quite deliberate and designed to ensure that the prog’s psychological conditioning is ‘triggered, ie that Trump (like Putin) is ‘literally a new Hitler’.

    For today’s delusional US progressive, fighting Putin in Ukraine is fighting Trump by proxy, which in turn for them is fighting Hitler by proxy, the latter being the designated evil poster boy for any and all expressions of peoplehood since 1933-45, irrespective of what the actual reality might truly be.

    [MORE]

    As for the war in Ukraine, Ukraine being to WWIII what Poland was to WWII, ie it’s flashpoint, the war thus far is going swimmingly for it’s anti-identity promoters. Their air forces effectively being grounded, both Russia and Ukraine have been reduced to fighting high casualty WWI style trench warfare, ensuring that their best, brightest, and bravest men are being killed or maimed in large numbers at the front.

    Relatedly, Ukraine is bleeding huge numbers of it’s people as refugees, many, if not most, to never return. This in turn is further destabilizing what remains of the identity of those European peoples which have taken them in. [Russia, too, has lost some of it’s people as refugees, but not in the high numbers percentage wise as Ukraine has.]

    Last, but certainly not least, the war between Ukraine and Russia is generating vast amounts of hatred between the two, which the war’s promoters stoke, and in turn feed off of, making them stronger.

    For any not liking this and where it is headed, first and foremost, the people of the Anglosphere countries (where much of this is emanating from) should stand down and refuse to support the war in any way, shape, or form, even if this is entirely unilateral. Though I realize it may seem counter intuitive where things are a bit hotter, I would suggest something similar for Ukraine and Russia, ie to stand down.

    Fight, if one must, but, on one’s own terms, not as here, where everyone involved has been manipulated into fighting against their own interests.

    Get right with God, all this not necessarily being in the order I have suggested.

  435. Anybody who has any interest in football , should be praying for a Saudi Arabian victory against Poland – the most boring, negative worthless scumbag international team on the planet. The match against Mexico by them was a disgrace – typical polish faggot loser mentality – the same story in the last few international tournaments they have qualified for, despite having at least 3 very high class players.

    Encapsulates much of the failure nation’s mentality the style of play

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @Gerard1234

    Poland lacked flair against Mexico, but were quite competent. Saudis looked good, but they are not really 'Saudis'. Iran beating Wales was nice, the setup with US is great... The thing about Poland is that Poles are generally gifted people with a touch of normalcy that is refreshing - but on a state level they collapse into obsessive genuflecting towards selected betters. They usually pick a dreamed off far-away Western power, they did it with France and Vatican, moved on to England, today US. It undermines everything about them, as if they were only real up to a point and then enthusiastic servitude.

    Poles lack flair and that can be fatal. Others who lack flair often have grace, but Poles don't have grace either - they are flat and obedient, always going through predetermined compulsory steps. JP II was typical - public obedience but no depth, he never did anything unexpected. I hope 'Saudis' clobber them. My bet is on Brazil-Croatia at some point, could be fun...The Belgian pedos also look promising. And after the embarrassing German hand-over-mouth circus, I hope they go home soon to celebrate their rainbow overlords.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @Gerard1234

  436. @German_reader
    @silviosilver

    I'm more amazed that Trump met Kanye after all the recent controversy, his handlers can't have missed all of that after all. Maybe A123 should start to be concerned, could it be that Trump will really be like Hitler in his 2nd term and start to persecute Judeo-Christians?

    Replies: @sudden death, @silviosilver, @A123

    When did Yeezy join the wignat movement?

    Isn’t he a trifle too pigmented too fit in?

    PEACE 😇

  437. Ukraine taking aid from the US/UK is like the proverbial thirsty castaway afloat on the ocean giving into temptation and drinking seawater.

    In each instance, unless they stop doing so soon, they won’t be long for this world.

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @S

    That analogy only goes so far. In one case there is a single brain / spirit / will.

    There are plenty of Ukrainians who aren't stupid but they have to keep mum until the poop show passes.

  438. @S
    Ukraine taking aid from the US/UK is like the proverbial thirsty castaway afloat on the ocean giving into temptation and drinking seawater.

    In each instance, unless they stop doing so soon, they won't be long for this world.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    That analogy only goes so far. In one case there is a single brain / spirit / will.

    There are plenty of Ukrainians who aren’t stupid but they have to keep mum until the poop show passes.

    • Agree: S
  439. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Barbarossa

    Turkey, mash potatoes, dressing, gravy in combination makes me want to puke to think about it. (I exaggerate here a tiny little bit.)

    Replies: @A123, @Barbarossa, @Mikhail, @AnonfromTN

    Turkey, mash potatoes, dressing, gravy in combination makes me want to puke to think about it.

    I do not feel so strongly about it, but…

    Maybe because I am a red meat fan, I only value birds with flavor. Say, duck has a special flavor, and I like it. Turkey, on the other hand, IMO is just an overgrown poor quality chicken. Tried roasted traditional Thanksgiving way turkey some years ago and was underwhelmed. Tried smoked turkey later. IMO chicken is much better that way, too.

    Ham is a separate story. I like pork, including roasted pork. I like Italian prosciutto crudo, and other Italian cold-smoked parts of a pig, particularly neck. I like French jambon, or Spanish jamon Serrano. But what is called ham in the US is hopelessly spoiled by additives and artificial coloring.

    Have to admit, though, that I like mashed potatoes. I mean real ones, not the crap sold under this name in supermarkets (all varieties, not only Hungry Jack).

    I know three American-invented foods I really like: spare ribs, cheesecake, and barbeque. Have to admit, though, that I like pizza in the US much more than Italian pizza. If you order two toppings in Italy, you get a pizza with one half having one topping, and the other half the second one. I like American multi-topping pizza much better, particularly meat lovers’ variety.

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @AnonfromTN

    Meat on pizza is an aberration, it should have never been tried. Meat has to be eaten separately with respect it deserves. The bready stuff is suspicious anyway, at least in Italy they go light on bread and more on flavor. Good bio stock those Italians, I just wish they were taller.

    Birds are nervous animals, chickens most of all. When we eat too much poultry it seeps in. Chickens were domesticated in India and looking at the results it all makes sense - no beef, skinny chickens or a chick-pea yellowish mushy paste. The summary of Indians...

    I am with you on bbq. The best thing we could do is to drop the humans to around one billion and raise cattle on the freed land. Today Ukies are busy helping, the Black Sea steppes are ideal for beef...

    Replies: @Sher Singh

    , @Mikel
    @AnonfromTN


    Turkey, on the other hand, IMO is just an overgrown poor quality chicken.
     
    I've never tried one but I suspect that homegrown turkeys have nothing to do with the store bought variety. I know for a fact that homestead chickens and store chickens are totally different beasts.

    Replies: @songbird

  440. @Gerard1234
    Anybody who has any interest in football , should be praying for a Saudi Arabian victory against Poland - the most boring, negative worthless scumbag international team on the planet. The match against Mexico by them was a disgrace - typical polish faggot loser mentality - the same story in the last few international tournaments they have qualified for, despite having at least 3 very high class players.

    Encapsulates much of the failure nation's mentality the style of play

    Replies: @Beckow

    Poland lacked flair against Mexico, but were quite competent. Saudis looked good, but they are not really ‘Saudis’. Iran beating Wales was nice, the setup with US is great… The thing about Poland is that Poles are generally gifted people with a touch of normalcy that is refreshing – but on a state level they collapse into obsessive genuflecting towards selected betters. They usually pick a dreamed off far-away Western power, they did it with France and Vatican, moved on to England, today US. It undermines everything about them, as if they were only real up to a point and then enthusiastic servitude.

    Poles lack flair and that can be fatal. Others who lack flair often have grace, but Poles don’t have grace either – they are flat and obedient, always going through predetermined compulsory steps. JP II was typical – public obedience but no depth, he never did anything unexpected. I hope ‘Saudis‘ clobber them. My bet is on Brazil-Croatia at some point, could be fun…The Belgian pedos also look promising. And after the embarrassing German hand-over-mouth circus, I hope they go home soon to celebrate their rainbow overlords.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Beckow


    I hope ‘Saudis‘ clobber them.
     
    Too bad for you. And just to rub it in, one of the goalscorers was named Zielinski.

    Replies: @Beckow

    , @Gerard1234
    @Beckow

    Quite brilliant analysis, masterful!

    The Belgian paedos have a had their chances in previous tournaments and never truly been able to master their talent, so I don't expect them to do very well now.

    Saudi's played a great match any were very unlucky against the Polish negative swines. If Saudis had decided at the kickoff to stay still and not pass the ball at all, then the match would have finished 0-0- thats how negative the plan from the Poles for these matches are. I don't understand how with probably the best striker on the planet can decide to play in the same crap , loser style that failed them in 2018 in Russia, and in a way that Lewandowski touches the ball less than the ballboy. Can't begrudge a player like him a World Cup goal though.

    The German hand-over-mouth -gay-nazis is ridiculous . On one side, Germans obeying uncle Sams orders on this absurd rainbow nonsense should surprise nobody. However, its disturbing that a team with all these Turkish, Arab, African diaspora in the squad seem happy with the "protest" and very complicit in it. At least with the French team there would have been a divide on the issue between the white "Christians" and the Africans and Arabs in the squad.

  441. @LatW
    @German_reader


    I don’t know either why you’re going on and on about nuclear threats.
     
    I'm just recounting the points that they agreed on during the G20 meeting. You, AnonT and a few others are the ones who have been constantly bringing up the "nuclear threat" for months now, over and over. Of course, Russia will not use nukes, not even when they have to exit Crimea (there are some news that they are already preparing an evacuation, just in case, and Ukraine hit Dzhankoi which is quite deep inside Crimea). These statements by China are just an extra confirmation of that.

    Replies: @German_reader, @AnonfromTN

    Of course, Russia will not use nukes, not even when they have to exit Crimea (there are some news that they are already preparing an evacuation, just in case, and Ukraine hit Dzhankoi which is quite deep inside Crimea).

    More figments of sick (or cocaine-induced) imagination of Ukie propagandists. All of this is as fake as the story told by Ukie talking head Danilov about Ukraine killing in Crimea Iranians who were teaching Russians to operate their drones.

    Considering how things are going, there will be many more self-consoling lies spread by desperate Ukies and/or their puppeteers. Funny thing is, w/o electricity much fewer people hear these lies on Ukie TV. Also, to the delight of moderators of many websites, with Internet down in much of Ukraine, the number of Ukie trolls dropped precipitously.

  442. @AnonfromTN
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    Turkey, mash potatoes, dressing, gravy in combination makes me want to puke to think about it.
     
    I do not feel so strongly about it, but…

    Maybe because I am a red meat fan, I only value birds with flavor. Say, duck has a special flavor, and I like it. Turkey, on the other hand, IMO is just an overgrown poor quality chicken. Tried roasted traditional Thanksgiving way turkey some years ago and was underwhelmed. Tried smoked turkey later. IMO chicken is much better that way, too.

    Ham is a separate story. I like pork, including roasted pork. I like Italian prosciutto crudo, and other Italian cold-smoked parts of a pig, particularly neck. I like French jambon, or Spanish jamon Serrano. But what is called ham in the US is hopelessly spoiled by additives and artificial coloring.

    Have to admit, though, that I like mashed potatoes. I mean real ones, not the crap sold under this name in supermarkets (all varieties, not only Hungry Jack).

    I know three American-invented foods I really like: spare ribs, cheesecake, and barbeque. Have to admit, though, that I like pizza in the US much more than Italian pizza. If you order two toppings in Italy, you get a pizza with one half having one topping, and the other half the second one. I like American multi-topping pizza much better, particularly meat lovers’ variety.

    Replies: @Beckow, @Mikel

    Meat on pizza is an aberration, it should have never been tried. Meat has to be eaten separately with respect it deserves. The bready stuff is suspicious anyway, at least in Italy they go light on bread and more on flavor. Good bio stock those Italians, I just wish they were taller.

    Birds are nervous animals, chickens most of all. When we eat too much poultry it seeps in. Chickens were domesticated in India and looking at the results it all makes sense – no beef, skinny chickens or a chick-pea yellowish mushy paste. The summary of Indians…

    I am with you on bbq. The best thing we could do is to drop the humans to around one billion and raise cattle on the freed land. Today Ukies are busy helping, the Black Sea steppes are ideal for beef…

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @Beckow

    There's about 1 billion Hindus & Sikhs who don't eat beef.
    So yeah just kill everyone else, and let cattle roam free.

    Glad we could find common ground you Slavic cuck.
    You rotate between providing whores to India, Turks or W Euros.

    Replies: @Beckow

  443. @A123
    @Mikel

    Sorry to be blunt but your persistent lies have to be countered with the TRUTH.

    Your deception on this topic is extremely predictable, repetitive, and serves the SJW Globalist agenda. I strongly suspect you do not believe what you post as it sounds like mindless regurgitation of debunked DNC talking points.


    I only care about policies and the main ones for me are end to wars and foreign interventions; closing the border and making sure the US retains something resembling its historical demographic composition; combating wokeness; promoting economic prosperity.
     
    So you want what Trump successfully delivered to the maximum extent possible given non-MAGA opposition within both parties (e.g. Mitch McConnell). Especially, "end to wars and foreign interventions".

    While every conflict, everywhere, was not 100% concluded within 4 years. -- As a matter of objective fact:
        • Active wars were reduced
        • No new wars were started
    This is an amazing achievement considering the war provocation delivered by Khamenei. Why do you refuse to give credit where it is due? It seems like you are hyper focused on Trump as a candidate, incapable of seeing the larger potential of MAGA.

    Everyone notices you were unable to counter a single FACT I presented above and are now attempting, unsuccessfully, to shift the focus. If you want what you say, why are you not backing Trump's proven successes? One has to believe you are being untruthful. Or, I concede, possibly self delusional.

    All of things on your list can be delivered by supporting MAGA over the long haul. And, there is any easy path for that.
        -- Trump in 2024.
        -- Followed by likely DeSantis in 2028 and 2032.

    Trying to blowup MAGA by having DeSantis make an anti-MAGA run against Trump in 2024 simply makes no sense. Especially, as you have no proof he will be better. Signs are good, but he should wait to take over the MAGA reins gracefully in 2028. And, I suspect that is what will happen. DeSantis has no pressing need to go head to head with Trump.


    Candidates are secondary
     
    If candidates are secondary. Why do you have this total commitment against Trump as a candidate? Something does not add up.

    If you genuinely believe what you say. You have an easy choice. Treat candidates as secondary, as you say you believe. Stop lying about candidate Trump's record. After all that record is to you, secondary. Right?

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @Mikel

    Everyone notices you were unable to counter a single FACT I presented above

    Sorry if I hurt your feelings by not debating your points. I always have plenty of activities programmed for the weekends and they take precedence over online debates, especially of the kind you like to engage in. To be totally fair, you did manage to come up with a couple of decent excuses of why one would take part in an election knowing that it was rigged but the whole idea of Democrats being able to steal the elections with the help of traitor Republicans and Trumpists still wanting to take part in those elections is nutty.

    Btw, you also hurt my feelings when I saw that you didn’t include accusations of being a covert Muslim in your tirade against me. I found it unfair that only some commenters get the Islamist treatment from you. What do I have to do to join that club?

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Mikel


    Btw, you also hurt my feelings when I saw that you didn’t include accusations of being a covert Muslim in your tirade against me. I found it unfair that only some commenters get the Islamist treatment from you. What do I have to do to join that club?
     
    Excellent trolling!

    Replies: @A123, @Jazman

    , @A123
    @Mikel


    you did manage to come up with a couple of decent excuses of why one would take part in an election
     
    The key points that you intentionally ignored (again):

    -A- The rigging can be fixed
    -B- Or, the rigging can be magnified and used the other direction.

    Both of my suggestions are practical options.
    ___

    Your belief that nothing can be changed is more than just nutty. You reek of despair. You exist to capitulate before SJW values.

    Please explain -- How can your plan, total abject surrender, lead to victory?

    PEACE 😇

     
    https://www.trumparea.com/_pics/2211/we-will-fix-this.jpg
  444. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Barbarossa

    For protein I eat a lot of eggs and dairy. For the rest I eat vegetables, fruits, nuts. Very little meat, around a pound a month. For dinner I had 2 hard boiled eggs and red kidney beans that I boiled for three hours after soaking them in salt-saturated water for two hours. The last twenty minutes there was a half onion chopped and three tablespoons of granulated garlic tossed in there. And some yogurt (the real stuff--I cannot stand low fat yogurt) and some grapes.

    You probably think I am a barbarian but I have spent 0 dollars 0 cents in the last year at McDonald's Taco Bell Kentucky Fried Chicken Subway Starbucks.

    Pumpkin pie and cranberries + fsck-ton granulated sugar are also not items that I consider to be food. If that stuff is so great how come everybody eats it only once a year?

    Mexicans and Italians and Chinks know how to cook. Indians do not.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @Barbarossa

    You probably think I am a barbarian but I have spent 0 dollars 0 cents in the last year at McDonald’s Taco Bell Kentucky Fried Chicken Subway Starbucks.

    That pretty much describes me too, so you’ll get no complaint from this quarter. I did get something from a Wendy’s once in the last year since I was on the road at 10PM and needed something for dinner. The choices were either a bag of chips at the gas station or a hot “burger” at the adjoining Wendy’s. I choose the latter, but cripes the meal package was like $9 and was crappy. I can’t believe that people eat that as a matter of routine.

    It sounds like you like a pretty simple food routine. Personally I like things jam packed, so Thanksgiving is right up my alley. This morning I made scrambled eggs with sauteed onions, spinach, bacon, and extra sharp chedder cheese, topped with some paprika and finished in the broiler till crisp and bubbly on top. Paired with a couple slices of sourdough bread and coffee that is average breakfast at my house. My wife would happily eat the same scrambled egg every day, but I like going all out.

    We actually don’t do that much sugar around here, and mostly sweeten with maple syrup and honey. Even then things are quite lightly sweetened compared to most people. I can get honey from a local guy by the 5 gallon pail and this spring I’m getting a 55 gallon drum bulk drum of syrup that I’m splitting with some other families. The syrup is less than $20 a gallon in bulk like that. So some lightly sweetened pumpkin pie topped with some similarly lightly sweetened whipped cream is not gross at all and very flavorful. I agree with you though that most deserts are way too sweet and can be gross.

    In modern processed cooking sugar+sodium are substitutes for actual flavor, but when you start with actual good tasting ingredients, rich food can be really good.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Barbarossa


    I agree with you though that most deserts are way too sweet and can be gross.
     
    That’s a purely American failing. Deserts in most of the world are sweetened just right, not overly sugary.

    In modern processed cooking sugar+sodium are substitutes for actual flavor
     
    That, again, is an American thing. Europeans and Asians do not spoil their food that way. In fact, even Brits (about whom Poirot said correctly “you don’t have cuisine, you have food”) serve better food than you find in the US. I switched to buying exclusively “low sodium” or “no sodium” stuff, as I find regular stuff inedible.
    , @Mr. Hack
    @Barbarossa


    This morning I made scrambled eggs with sauteed onions, spinach, bacon, and extra sharp chedder cheese, topped with some paprika and finished in the broiler till crisp and bubbly on top.
     
    An easier way, possibly, to get the same "bubbly effect on top" and easier too, is to just add some water to your frying pan and baste the whole "omelette" once it starts to fry nicely, never having to move the pan to your oven. To get the whole creation "crispy" just let the process that I've described continue until most or all of the water evaporates.

    I always go "all out" too, just have a different array of all stars that serve as the base of this miniature feast: onions, bell peppers, hotter peppers, sausage and mushrooms (kind of like a "Denver omelet). Of course, this creation is not a classical omelette in an real sense (very good in its own right), but something a bit more primitive and down to earth. I do end the whole melange with a good sprinkling of shredded cheese, whatever cheese that I seem to have on hand at the time seems to do. And the cheese component helps in achieving the slightly "crispy" texture, if fried/basted long enough, that you appear to appreciate.

    Replies: @Barbarossa

  445. @Beckow
    @Gerard1234

    Poland lacked flair against Mexico, but were quite competent. Saudis looked good, but they are not really 'Saudis'. Iran beating Wales was nice, the setup with US is great... The thing about Poland is that Poles are generally gifted people with a touch of normalcy that is refreshing - but on a state level they collapse into obsessive genuflecting towards selected betters. They usually pick a dreamed off far-away Western power, they did it with France and Vatican, moved on to England, today US. It undermines everything about them, as if they were only real up to a point and then enthusiastic servitude.

    Poles lack flair and that can be fatal. Others who lack flair often have grace, but Poles don't have grace either - they are flat and obedient, always going through predetermined compulsory steps. JP II was typical - public obedience but no depth, he never did anything unexpected. I hope 'Saudis' clobber them. My bet is on Brazil-Croatia at some point, could be fun...The Belgian pedos also look promising. And after the embarrassing German hand-over-mouth circus, I hope they go home soon to celebrate their rainbow overlords.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @Gerard1234

    I hope ‘Saudis‘ clobber them.

    Too bad for you. And just to rub it in, one of the goalscorers was named Zielinski.

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @silviosilver

    ...Zielinski...?

    But was he wearing green sweatpants?

    It is what it is, I had no $ on it...next time :)...

  446. @Mikel
    @A123


    Everyone notices you were unable to counter a single FACT I presented above
     
    Sorry if I hurt your feelings by not debating your points. I always have plenty of activities programmed for the weekends and they take precedence over online debates, especially of the kind you like to engage in. To be totally fair, you did manage to come up with a couple of decent excuses of why one would take part in an election knowing that it was rigged but the whole idea of Democrats being able to steal the elections with the help of traitor Republicans and Trumpists still wanting to take part in those elections is nutty.

    Btw, you also hurt my feelings when I saw that you didn't include accusations of being a covert Muslim in your tirade against me. I found it unfair that only some commenters get the Islamist treatment from you. What do I have to do to join that club?

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @A123

    Btw, you also hurt my feelings when I saw that you didn’t include accusations of being a covert Muslim in your tirade against me. I found it unfair that only some commenters get the Islamist treatment from you. What do I have to do to join that club?

    Excellent trolling!

    • Replies: @A123
    @AnonfromTN

    It is pretty obvious that Mikel personally fears me. That he is incapable of engaging in constructive dialogue is quite sad actually.

    Given his pathological, anti-factual hatred for MAGA and Trump, he comes across as a pure breed #Bidenista. The avocado toast must be diminishing what little is left of his cognitive ability.

    (shrug) ... What can I do other than use TRUTH to debunk his lies?

    Any redundancy is entirely under Mikel's control. If he tells the same lie, I respond with the same TRUTH. That he expects a debunked lie to work based on using it multiple times is a bizarre mental dysfunction.

    PEACE 😇

    ==================================
    "Insanity is repeating the same mistakes
            and expecting different results."
    Sudden Death, Rita Mae Brown, 1983.
    ==================================

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    , @Jazman
    @AnonfromTN

    Here is one " Russian " guy on Quora he remind me of Navalny
    https://www.quora.com/profile/Misha-Firer?q=misha%20

  447. @A123
    @Barbarossa


    Ham doesn’t seem to be a Thanksgiving thing around here, but it seems like the South does two meats for everything. We usually do ham for Christmas, and my timing should be good since I’ll have my two pigs back by then!
     
    Ham is precooked, preserved, and lasts for weeks as a leftover. I suspect it is a combination of tradition and practicality. Particularly huge Thanksgiving ham may make it all the way to Christmas if it is an enthusiastic, salty cure.

    The Christmas centerpiece will be beef. However, ham availability is guaranteed. It usually appears as dinner one or two days prior so the fatty ham sections can appear in other dishes, green been casserole. Ham bone and less savory bits become soup/stew base.

    Butter and other fats + flour = ROUX. If you have good drippings the gravy always works. I suspect my usual Thanksgiving hosts are slipping some bacon grease into the turkey gravy... As the result is outstanding, I am not even going to ask the question.

    PEACE 😇
    ___________

    P.S. The first humor GIF under MORE was intended for you.

    https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-202/#comment-5676131

    Replies: @Barbarossa

    P.S. The first humor GIF under MORE was intended for you.

    Thanks, I saw that. That is one way to get a fat pig! Pigs are smart, there is no doubt about that.

    I suspect my usual Thanksgiving hosts are slipping some bacon grease into the turkey gravy

    I would say that would be an excellent use of bacon grease. One of my pet peeves are people that get rid of their bacon grease. I’m not sure you can trust someone like that. They are probably queers or commies or both!

    I would say that Turkey usually needs some help to remain moist and make a decent gravy base. All the herbed butter I used for basting fit the bill in my case. My wife made a good roux gravy with those drippings. It’s such a different thing than store bought gravy.

    • Agree: A123
    • Replies: @A123
    @Barbarossa


    I would say that Turkey usually needs some help to remain moist and make a decent gravy base.
     
    The best part on Thanksgiving Day are the browned skin pieces. Thighs are particularly moist for those who like dark vs light selection.

    While two small birds this year was not planned, it may go into the book for next year. There were no squabbles over who got which bits. There were two wish bones for the youngins. While turkey breast certainly works fresh, it is also an ideal leftover for sandwiches, turkey salad, etc.

    My wife made a good roux gravy with those drippings. It’s such a different thing than store bought gravy.
     
    Store bought is much better than it used to be, still inferior to authentic. It needs to be enhanced to work in an emergency:

    -- Brown some onions in a half stick of butter
    -- Stir that into the store bought
    -- Add pepper and/or spices to match the meal
    -- Let simmer until the flavours come together

    It is a good contingency item to have about if you do not get the anticipated amount of properly baked drippings. Or, in our case, deep fried birds that provided none.

    One can keep emergency unsalted stock (often frozen). However converting that to gravy is much more time consuming.

    PEACE 😇
  448. @Barbarossa
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    You probably think I am a barbarian but I have spent 0 dollars 0 cents in the last year at McDonald’s Taco Bell Kentucky Fried Chicken Subway Starbucks.
     
    That pretty much describes me too, so you'll get no complaint from this quarter. I did get something from a Wendy's once in the last year since I was on the road at 10PM and needed something for dinner. The choices were either a bag of chips at the gas station or a hot "burger" at the adjoining Wendy's. I choose the latter, but cripes the meal package was like $9 and was crappy. I can't believe that people eat that as a matter of routine.

    It sounds like you like a pretty simple food routine. Personally I like things jam packed, so Thanksgiving is right up my alley. This morning I made scrambled eggs with sauteed onions, spinach, bacon, and extra sharp chedder cheese, topped with some paprika and finished in the broiler till crisp and bubbly on top. Paired with a couple slices of sourdough bread and coffee that is average breakfast at my house. My wife would happily eat the same scrambled egg every day, but I like going all out.

    We actually don't do that much sugar around here, and mostly sweeten with maple syrup and honey. Even then things are quite lightly sweetened compared to most people. I can get honey from a local guy by the 5 gallon pail and this spring I'm getting a 55 gallon drum bulk drum of syrup that I'm splitting with some other families. The syrup is less than $20 a gallon in bulk like that. So some lightly sweetened pumpkin pie topped with some similarly lightly sweetened whipped cream is not gross at all and very flavorful. I agree with you though that most deserts are way too sweet and can be gross.

    In modern processed cooking sugar+sodium are substitutes for actual flavor, but when you start with actual good tasting ingredients, rich food can be really good.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Mr. Hack

    I agree with you though that most deserts are way too sweet and can be gross.

    That’s a purely American failing. Deserts in most of the world are sweetened just right, not overly sugary.

    In modern processed cooking sugar+sodium are substitutes for actual flavor

    That, again, is an American thing. Europeans and Asians do not spoil their food that way. In fact, even Brits (about whom Poirot said correctly “you don’t have cuisine, you have food”) serve better food than you find in the US. I switched to buying exclusively “low sodium” or “no sodium” stuff, as I find regular stuff inedible.

  449. @AnonfromTN
    @Mikel


    Btw, you also hurt my feelings when I saw that you didn’t include accusations of being a covert Muslim in your tirade against me. I found it unfair that only some commenters get the Islamist treatment from you. What do I have to do to join that club?
     
    Excellent trolling!

    Replies: @A123, @Jazman

    It is pretty obvious that Mikel personally fears me. That he is incapable of engaging in constructive dialogue is quite sad actually.

    Given his pathological, anti-factual hatred for MAGA and Trump, he comes across as a pure breed #Bidenista. The avocado toast must be diminishing what little is left of his cognitive ability.

    (shrug) … What can I do other than use TRUTH to debunk his lies?

    Any redundancy is entirely under Mikel’s control. If he tells the same lie, I respond with the same TRUTH. That he expects a debunked lie to work based on using it multiple times is a bizarre mental dysfunction.

    PEACE 😇

    ==================================
    “Insanity is repeating the same mistakes
            and expecting different results.”
    Sudden Death, Rita Mae Brown, 1983.
    ==================================

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @A123


    It is pretty obvious that Mikel personally fears me. That he is incapable of engaging in constructive dialogue is quite sad actually.
     
    This is exactly the same sort of rubbish that you used on me, before you "banished" me from your viewing list. If Mikel continues to shred your baseless commentary like I did, the "you're dangerously mentally retarded" and "you need to seek medical assistance" and "I feel sorry for you" crap will start to fly. You're so predictable and full of BS, kremlinstoogeA123. :-(

    https://www.liveabout.com/thmb/tUFffEM_-Rp_fvsxQzlNkGZqFlw=/1500x0/filters:no_upscale():max_bytes(150000):strip_icc():format(webp)/thanksgiving-funny-58b8d6cd5f9b58af5c8ee9cc.jpg
    No matter how hard he tries, A123 will not be able to camouflage the fact that he's really at heart just another garden variety kremlin stooge. Happy Thanksgiving kremlinstoogeA123!
  450. @Beckow
    @Gerard1234

    Poland lacked flair against Mexico, but were quite competent. Saudis looked good, but they are not really 'Saudis'. Iran beating Wales was nice, the setup with US is great... The thing about Poland is that Poles are generally gifted people with a touch of normalcy that is refreshing - but on a state level they collapse into obsessive genuflecting towards selected betters. They usually pick a dreamed off far-away Western power, they did it with France and Vatican, moved on to England, today US. It undermines everything about them, as if they were only real up to a point and then enthusiastic servitude.

    Poles lack flair and that can be fatal. Others who lack flair often have grace, but Poles don't have grace either - they are flat and obedient, always going through predetermined compulsory steps. JP II was typical - public obedience but no depth, he never did anything unexpected. I hope 'Saudis' clobber them. My bet is on Brazil-Croatia at some point, could be fun...The Belgian pedos also look promising. And after the embarrassing German hand-over-mouth circus, I hope they go home soon to celebrate their rainbow overlords.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @Gerard1234

    Quite brilliant analysis, masterful!

    The Belgian paedos have a had their chances in previous tournaments and never truly been able to master their talent, so I don’t expect them to do very well now.

    Saudi’s played a great match any were very unlucky against the Polish negative swines. If Saudis had decided at the kickoff to stay still and not pass the ball at all, then the match would have finished 0-0- thats how negative the plan from the Poles for these matches are. I don’t understand how with probably the best striker on the planet can decide to play in the same crap , loser style that failed them in 2018 in Russia, and in a way that Lewandowski touches the ball less than the ballboy. Can’t begrudge a player like him a World Cup goal though.

    The German hand-over-mouth -gay-nazis is ridiculous . On one side, Germans obeying uncle Sams orders on this absurd rainbow nonsense should surprise nobody. However, its disturbing that a team with all these Turkish, Arab, African diaspora in the squad seem happy with the “protest” and very complicit in it. At least with the French team there would have been a divide on the issue between the white “Christians” and the Africans and Arabs in the squad.

  451. @Barbarossa
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    You probably think I am a barbarian but I have spent 0 dollars 0 cents in the last year at McDonald’s Taco Bell Kentucky Fried Chicken Subway Starbucks.
     
    That pretty much describes me too, so you'll get no complaint from this quarter. I did get something from a Wendy's once in the last year since I was on the road at 10PM and needed something for dinner. The choices were either a bag of chips at the gas station or a hot "burger" at the adjoining Wendy's. I choose the latter, but cripes the meal package was like $9 and was crappy. I can't believe that people eat that as a matter of routine.

    It sounds like you like a pretty simple food routine. Personally I like things jam packed, so Thanksgiving is right up my alley. This morning I made scrambled eggs with sauteed onions, spinach, bacon, and extra sharp chedder cheese, topped with some paprika and finished in the broiler till crisp and bubbly on top. Paired with a couple slices of sourdough bread and coffee that is average breakfast at my house. My wife would happily eat the same scrambled egg every day, but I like going all out.

    We actually don't do that much sugar around here, and mostly sweeten with maple syrup and honey. Even then things are quite lightly sweetened compared to most people. I can get honey from a local guy by the 5 gallon pail and this spring I'm getting a 55 gallon drum bulk drum of syrup that I'm splitting with some other families. The syrup is less than $20 a gallon in bulk like that. So some lightly sweetened pumpkin pie topped with some similarly lightly sweetened whipped cream is not gross at all and very flavorful. I agree with you though that most deserts are way too sweet and can be gross.

    In modern processed cooking sugar+sodium are substitutes for actual flavor, but when you start with actual good tasting ingredients, rich food can be really good.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Mr. Hack

    This morning I made scrambled eggs with sauteed onions, spinach, bacon, and extra sharp chedder cheese, topped with some paprika and finished in the broiler till crisp and bubbly on top.

    An easier way, possibly, to get the same “bubbly effect on top” and easier too, is to just add some water to your frying pan and baste the whole “omelette” once it starts to fry nicely, never having to move the pan to your oven. To get the whole creation “crispy” just let the process that I’ve described continue until most or all of the water evaporates.

    I always go “all out” too, just have a different array of all stars that serve as the base of this miniature feast: onions, bell peppers, hotter peppers, sausage and mushrooms (kind of like a “Denver omelet). Of course, this creation is not a classical omelette in an real sense (very good in its own right), but something a bit more primitive and down to earth. I do end the whole melange with a good sprinkling of shredded cheese, whatever cheese that I seem to have on hand at the time seems to do. And the cheese component helps in achieving the slightly “crispy” texture, if fried/basted long enough, that you appear to appreciate.

    • Replies: @Barbarossa
    @Mr. Hack

    What I make is usually really more of a frittata. My ingredients constantly change as well based on what we have around.

    I wouldn't mind trying the water trick, but how do you keep the bottom from burning while waiting for the top to crisp?

    I really like using the broiler for the ability to cook the top of things while not overcooking the bottom. Similarly, if we are making pizza, if the bottom crust is done and the top isn't sufficiently crisped I'll throw the broiler on for a couple minutes.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

  452. @A123
    @AnonfromTN

    It is pretty obvious that Mikel personally fears me. That he is incapable of engaging in constructive dialogue is quite sad actually.

    Given his pathological, anti-factual hatred for MAGA and Trump, he comes across as a pure breed #Bidenista. The avocado toast must be diminishing what little is left of his cognitive ability.

    (shrug) ... What can I do other than use TRUTH to debunk his lies?

    Any redundancy is entirely under Mikel's control. If he tells the same lie, I respond with the same TRUTH. That he expects a debunked lie to work based on using it multiple times is a bizarre mental dysfunction.

    PEACE 😇

    ==================================
    "Insanity is repeating the same mistakes
            and expecting different results."
    Sudden Death, Rita Mae Brown, 1983.
    ==================================

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    It is pretty obvious that Mikel personally fears me. That he is incapable of engaging in constructive dialogue is quite sad actually.

    This is exactly the same sort of rubbish that you used on me, before you “banished” me from your viewing list. If Mikel continues to shred your baseless commentary like I did, the “you’re dangerously mentally retarded” and “you need to seek medical assistance” and “I feel sorry for you” crap will start to fly. You’re so predictable and full of BS, kremlinstoogeA123. 🙁


    No matter how hard he tries, A123 will not be able to camouflage the fact that he’s really at heart just another garden variety kremlin stooge. Happy Thanksgiving kremlinstoogeA123!

  453. @Yahya
    @silviosilver


    Useless Argies, going down to a pack of sandnigs (Yahya beaming).
     
    Yahya is not beaming. He could care less about his people kicking a ball around better than some other people. That stopped at about the time he started reading books at age 17-18.

    Yahya would prefer if Arabians spent more time on worthier cultural activities such as music, cinema, and literature; such that they produce their own version of Jorge Luis Borges or Astor Piazolla. As it stands Arabians have no significant cultural achievements of their own, outside Islam, if that even counts as an achievement. All this oil money gone to waste; Allah should have given it to Maghrebis, Egyptians or Levantines.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @silviosilver, @showmethereal, @KidDynamite

    Islam is the greatest achievement of the Arabs and is no joke – despite its detractors, it may well go down as the religion with the widest and most universal appeal. And that is no small feat, only Christianity even holds a candle in that respect.

    I don’t know much about soccer, but Arabs (as well as other people) should always keep athletically fit, especially in terms of martial fitness. Anything in the culture that encourages this is generally a good thing. Otherwise you build up a bookish nerd civilization that gets its ass rolled over by people like the Mongols who laugh as they burn down your libraries.

  454. @LatW
    @German_reader


    German men are degenerates, unlike the Ukrainian heroes, to some extent that may unfortunately even be true
     
    Look, I never said anything bad about German men specifically (or didn't mean to imply). But if you want to dish out, then learn to take it back.

    As it now looks, Russia can’t conquer Ukraine, but still do substantial damage.

     

    They will continue doing damage as long as they are allowed to, most likely even during any potential negotiations, you don't see it that way but their goal is to destroy that nation, not simply impose their will. I already told you that if they had just tried to take the Donbas, like their generals suggested, it would be one thing, and, while not great, it probably wouldn't merit an all out existential fight. But they overplayed their hand and went too far. If they are allowed to keep their gains, then it is just a matter of time when the war will restart - the Ukrainians have said over and over that they do not want to leave this to their children. This is not even my subjective outlook (personally I feel that those who don't want to live together shouldn't be forced to, ideally), I'm just explaining how they think. Trust me, they don't need to be egged on, after what was done to them, they don't.

    Replies: @German_reader, @Mikel

    the Ukrainians have said over and over that they do not want to leave this to their children

    Do you think that if Ukraine takes back Crimea the Russians will never come back again? The contrary looks much more likely. Short of marching to Moscow and dismembering the Russian state, I don’t know how Ukrainians can prevent their children from having to fight Russia in the future.

    personally I feel that those who don’t want to live together shouldn’t be forced to, ideally),

    That would be the best alternative really. Ukraine deserves to be independent from Moscow, now more than ever. But just apply the same principle to Crimea and Donbass (I doubt thre is a pro-Russian majority anywhere else now in Ukraine) and there you have a basis for a possible future peace. When Musk proposed this he was met with abuse in Kiev though.

    • Replies: @Sean
    @Mikel

    It is very difficult to see how Russia can avoid total mobilisation and commitment. Losses so far have not been sufficient on either side to make them weary of the war. All thoughts that a certain peace formula can resolve the situation are futile. What is needed is some good old fashioned reality therapy: a vile battle of attrition in the style of Verdun in which the objective is not to gain territory but to kill, kill, and kill again. I think America is begining to worry that too many Russians are being killed and the effect it might have on the Russian mindset. The US intel assassination campaign targeting the best Russian generals seems to have been halted out of worry the effect it might have on how far the Russian army leadership are prepared to go.

    , @LatW
    @Mikel


    Do you think that if Ukraine takes back Crimea the Russians will never come back again? The contrary looks much more likely.
     
    Please, see my post above. They always come back. It's been that way since the 5th century or so. Only one solution - Israel. Not Finland, not Switzerland. Israel.

    Short of marching to Moscow and dismembering the Russian state, I don’t know how Ukrainians can prevent their children from having to fight Russia in the future.
     
    As I said above, the Russians themselves have to march to Moscow. Ukraine will stop on its borders, then pass the baton on to the Russians. If they have enough strength (which I highly doubt).

    Alternatively, they can enjoy a "beautiful" life under Prigozhin's sledgehammer. (Look that up).

    Ukraine deserves to be independent from Moscow, now more than ever.
     
    That's not how this works. One doesn't "deserve" something out of the blue. One has to fight for it. As the Ukrainian people have done for hundreds of years now.

    When Musk proposed this he was met with abuse in Kiev though.
     
    It is way too late for those solutions now. Such a plan will also be rejected by the Russian side long term (although they are desperate for an agreement so that they can at least keep the current gains). No, it's too late. It is in the hands of the Ukrainian military now.

    Replies: @Yahya, @Mikel, @Dmitry

  455. @silviosilver
    @Yevardian


    I see at the ‘club’ there’s ‘Bilboko Athletic Kluba’ as well, though I guess its nothing special as I’ve never heard of it compared to famous Madrid and Barcelona teams which even I’ve heard of before.
     
    Not sure if you're being sarcastic here. : ) If you've honestly never heard of Athletico Bilbao though, they're actually one of the most successful teams in Spanish club soccer, and they've managed that feat despite (or maybe because of?) their policy of using only Basque players. Even a non-sportsball fan could be impressed by that.

    @Mikel

    although there do seem to be some Celtic toponyms interspersed here and there in a sea of Basque ancient toponyms. But considering that those theories are usually espoused by people with clear Spanish nationalist tendencies
     
    Years ago on some race/ethnicity forum (might have been Stirpes, now long defunct but once very good), I noticed a strain of Spanish nationalism that seemed to really go out of its way to play up "Celtic roots" - the sort of fathers who would force their kids to learn the bagpipes, lol. Have you ever had much personal experience with these types?

    @Matra

    Allowing five subs represents the kind of Americanisation that Steve Sailer has long advocated. How can it be a team effort if half the players that finish didn’t start the match?
     
    Well, I think you could just as well argue that the rule makes it more of a team effort, since it involves more people who are part of the (larger) team. But I can understand why 'purist' fans - which soccer is chock full of - would be put off by the changes. I really don't care anymore. Soccer has gone from my favorite sport when I was a teen, to something I can barely muster the energy to google the results of. The reason is mostly racial - who cares what a half nigged (soon to be 100%) "France" or "England" does - but not solely. In hindsight, the Bosman ruling totally wrecked European soccer. As early as the late 90s Chelsea could field a team without a single actual Englishman on it. I was still a huge fan, but I thought that was seriously messed up.

    @Barbie

    I’d say that there is a big difference between playing sports and watching sports. The latter has little redeeming value while the former has a number of good attributes.
     
    Yes, the sad little sporstball fan is a sitting duck for absolutist judgments like this. However, if you compare sporstball fandom to alternative uses of leisure time, there are obviously far worse things that the average fan - of decidedly average human 'quality' - could be doing. At a very basic level, reading sports journalism is likely the only reading some fans would ever do, and if not for that, then nothing. So that counts as a plus. Fandom also imparts some lessons in patience and coping with disappointment, and even restraint and hope (it's not over till it's over). Of course, there are more effective ways to imbibe those same lessons, but again you have to weigh that against the likelihood that the average fan would ever do so.

    Replies: @Mikel, @Matra, @Barbarossa

    the sad little sporstball fan is a sitting duck for absolutist judgments like this.

    I don’t know if it’s meant to be exactly absolutist, but in my mind it has to do with having a sense of civilizational ideals or aspirations. It doesn’t mean that sportsball fans have to be castigated, but at the same time if it’s all that someone has for interests going in their lives it’s rather sad and their should be no issue with being clear as a society that we prize other aspiration more highly. Having no sense of relative standards also means that it’s that much more unlikely that most will ever shoot for higher since they may remain ignorant of higher ideals.

    We get stuck in an endless degenerative loop of, “Thank God that junior’s in here playing Call of Duty! He could be out there axe murdering people, you now!”

    Sports fandom seems like something which is okay in small doses, but when it becomes one’s major interest in life it just seems rather unhinged to me. I knew a guy at a job many years ago who was a Yankees fanatic and bragged about how he watched all of every single Yankees game every year. I thought he was nuts, but then again he thought I was some sort of degenerate for not owning a TV so maybe we were even!

  456. @Beckow
    @AnonfromTN

    Meat on pizza is an aberration, it should have never been tried. Meat has to be eaten separately with respect it deserves. The bready stuff is suspicious anyway, at least in Italy they go light on bread and more on flavor. Good bio stock those Italians, I just wish they were taller.

    Birds are nervous animals, chickens most of all. When we eat too much poultry it seeps in. Chickens were domesticated in India and looking at the results it all makes sense - no beef, skinny chickens or a chick-pea yellowish mushy paste. The summary of Indians...

    I am with you on bbq. The best thing we could do is to drop the humans to around one billion and raise cattle on the freed land. Today Ukies are busy helping, the Black Sea steppes are ideal for beef...

    Replies: @Sher Singh

    There’s about 1 billion Hindus & Sikhs who don’t eat beef.
    So yeah just kill everyone else, and let cattle roam free.

    Glad we could find common ground you Slavic cuck.
    You rotate between providing whores to India, Turks or W Euros.

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @Sher Singh

    Ok, calm down...eat whatever you want.

    But come to think of it, would it even be theoretically possible to have Indian wh...s? Maybe a bit of beef would help the stock...

    Replies: @Sher Singh

  457. @showmethereal
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    Since the industrial revolution Japan has had an affinity for western things. Teddy Roosevelt was a big fan of Japan westernizing Asia. Japanese were placating the west even back then. But once Japan was occupied by the US after WW2 baseball became more prominent. I’m not even sure how you can possibly even try to debate that…. Anyway…

    Ahhh so you realize you are on shaky ground and so bring up the Sino Soviet conflict. What in earth does that have to do with anything we were discussing???? Stop wasting time.

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    More lies from you. China attempted to modernize in the Western model as the Japanese had during Meiji but simply failed,

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-Strengthening_Movement

    In the First Sino-Japanese War, no one assumed Japan would win. The Japanese successfully adopted the Jeune École naval concept of smaller ships against bigger Chinese battleships.

    Amongst many Chinese fails, the sailors had to wear queues that their Manchu masters forced on them, this was a huge operational risk because getting queues caught in machinery meant probable death.

    Teddy Roosevelt declined reparations from China and set a scholarship to educate Chinese,

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boxer_Indemnity_Scholarship

    The 1929 conflict was a case of Chinese picking a fight with the Soviets and getting a well-deserved ass-whupping. That’s why wumao like you mouth off about the Japanese but never dares saying jack shit offensive to your Russian grandfather 俄爹.

    So in fact, the best all time Japanese baseball player is half Chinese 王貞治 おう さだはる Wáng Zhēnzhì

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sadaharu_Oh

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    Change your fake name. As someone else outed you - you are nothing but a rabid anti Chinese. What does any of that have to do with football and sports overall. Sorry if it hurts your feelings but it is a fact Japan is an occupied country and so loves the past time of its captors.

    And China has never been scared of Russia. Even the Soviets would tell you that. To say so makes you look like an idiot. Fact is China and Russia solved their issues. They have no animosity. Only idiots like yourself who are upset that China passed Japan again - as was the case through the majority of human history. Chinese don’t want to play baseball - and neither does the vast majority of the world. Japan is still ahead in football…. For a little while. Will you cry if/when they pass Japan as they have in Olympic sports?

    Fact is East Asians do not have the genetics to dominate in football. Nor do they in basketball. That’s just reality. That was the original argument. Japan is a rich country with a huge population. Making it to the quarter finals is actually not a huge achievement- except the fact East Asians are not expected to be good. Kind of like Chinese NBA players. Put salt in your rabid anti China wounds. It hurts but it will heal you

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

  458. @AnonfromTN
    @Emil Nikola Richard


    Turkey, mash potatoes, dressing, gravy in combination makes me want to puke to think about it.
     
    I do not feel so strongly about it, but…

    Maybe because I am a red meat fan, I only value birds with flavor. Say, duck has a special flavor, and I like it. Turkey, on the other hand, IMO is just an overgrown poor quality chicken. Tried roasted traditional Thanksgiving way turkey some years ago and was underwhelmed. Tried smoked turkey later. IMO chicken is much better that way, too.

    Ham is a separate story. I like pork, including roasted pork. I like Italian prosciutto crudo, and other Italian cold-smoked parts of a pig, particularly neck. I like French jambon, or Spanish jamon Serrano. But what is called ham in the US is hopelessly spoiled by additives and artificial coloring.

    Have to admit, though, that I like mashed potatoes. I mean real ones, not the crap sold under this name in supermarkets (all varieties, not only Hungry Jack).

    I know three American-invented foods I really like: spare ribs, cheesecake, and barbeque. Have to admit, though, that I like pizza in the US much more than Italian pizza. If you order two toppings in Italy, you get a pizza with one half having one topping, and the other half the second one. I like American multi-topping pizza much better, particularly meat lovers’ variety.

    Replies: @Beckow, @Mikel

    Turkey, on the other hand, IMO is just an overgrown poor quality chicken.

    I’ve never tried one but I suspect that homegrown turkeys have nothing to do with the store bought variety. I know for a fact that homestead chickens and store chickens are totally different beasts.

    • Agree: Barbarossa, AnonfromTN
    • Replies: @songbird
    @Mikel

    The breed on most tables has changed dramatically since the '50s. Used to be a lot more like wild turkeys (much thinner, more dark meat).

    Replies: @Barbarossa

  459. @silviosilver
    @Beckow


    I hope ‘Saudis‘ clobber them.
     
    Too bad for you. And just to rub it in, one of the goalscorers was named Zielinski.

    Replies: @Beckow

    …Zielinski…?

    But was he wearing green sweatpants?

    It is what it is, I had no $ on it…next time :)…

  460. @Sher Singh
    @Beckow

    There's about 1 billion Hindus & Sikhs who don't eat beef.
    So yeah just kill everyone else, and let cattle roam free.

    Glad we could find common ground you Slavic cuck.
    You rotate between providing whores to India, Turks or W Euros.

    Replies: @Beckow

    Ok, calm down…eat whatever you want.

    But come to think of it, would it even be theoretically possible to have Indian wh…s? Maybe a bit of beef would help the stock…

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @Beckow


    ਪੁਨ ਕਰ ਜੋਰਿ ਬਤਾਇਸਿ ਬਾਤਿ । "ਨਿਕਟ ਦੁਸ਼ਟ ਗੋ ਕਰਤੇ ਘਾਤਿ । ਤਿਨ ਕੇ ਬਸ ਨਹਿ ਆਵਤਿ ਸੋਈ । ਕਤਰਿ ਓਜ ਕੋ ਮੈਂ ਤਹਿ ਜੋਈ" ।੩।⁣
    After [saluting Guru Hargobind] he clasped his hands and began to say, "There are vile people close to here butchering cows and they are trying to get hold of more cows with great effort.⁣

    ਸੁਨਿ ਸਤਿਗੁਰੁ ਸੋ ਆਗੇ ਕਰ੍ਯੋ । ਹਯ ਧਵਾਇ ਚਾਲੇ ਰਿਸਿ ਧਰ੍ਯੋ । ਹੁਤੇ ਨਿਕਟ ਹੀ ਜਾਇ ਨਿਹਾਰੇ । ਖੜਗ ਨਿਕਾਸ੍ਯੋ ਤਤਛਿਨ ਮਾਰੇ ।੪।⁣
    Listening to this Satiguru Hargobind mounted his horse and proceeded ahead with great anger, seeing where they were they closed the distance, taking out his sword he quickly slaughtered them. ⁣

    ਭਾਜ ਚਲੇ ਕੁਛ ਘੇਰਿ ਪ੍ਰਹਾਰੇ । ਖੰਡ ਖੰਡ ਕਰਿ ਧਰ ਪਰ ਡਾਰੈ ।⁣
    Some of them ran away, but they were flanked, surrounded and attacked, they were chopped down and then into pieces. ⁣
     

    Replies: @songbird

  461. @Barbarossa
    @A123


    P.S. The first humor GIF under MORE was intended for you.
     
    Thanks, I saw that. That is one way to get a fat pig! Pigs are smart, there is no doubt about that.

    I suspect my usual Thanksgiving hosts are slipping some bacon grease into the turkey gravy
     
    I would say that would be an excellent use of bacon grease. One of my pet peeves are people that get rid of their bacon grease. I'm not sure you can trust someone like that. They are probably queers or commies or both!

    I would say that Turkey usually needs some help to remain moist and make a decent gravy base. All the herbed butter I used for basting fit the bill in my case. My wife made a good roux gravy with those drippings. It's such a different thing than store bought gravy.

    Replies: @A123

    I would say that Turkey usually needs some help to remain moist and make a decent gravy base.

    The best part on Thanksgiving Day are the browned skin pieces. Thighs are particularly moist for those who like dark vs light selection.

    While two small birds this year was not planned, it may go into the book for next year. There were no squabbles over who got which bits. There were two wish bones for the youngins. While turkey breast certainly works fresh, it is also an ideal leftover for sandwiches, turkey salad, etc.

    My wife made a good roux gravy with those drippings. It’s such a different thing than store bought gravy.

    Store bought is much better than it used to be, still inferior to authentic. It needs to be enhanced to work in an emergency:

    — Brown some onions in a half stick of butter
    — Stir that into the store bought
    — Add pepper and/or spices to match the meal
    — Let simmer until the flavours come together

    It is a good contingency item to have about if you do not get the anticipated amount of properly baked drippings. Or, in our case, deep fried birds that provided none.

    One can keep emergency unsalted stock (often frozen). However converting that to gravy is much more time consuming.

    PEACE 😇

  462. Sher Singh says:
    @Beckow
    @Sher Singh

    Ok, calm down...eat whatever you want.

    But come to think of it, would it even be theoretically possible to have Indian wh...s? Maybe a bit of beef would help the stock...

    Replies: @Sher Singh

    ਪੁਨ ਕਰ ਜੋਰਿ ਬਤਾਇਸਿ ਬਾਤਿ । “ਨਿਕਟ ਦੁਸ਼ਟ ਗੋ ਕਰਤੇ ਘਾਤਿ । ਤਿਨ ਕੇ ਬਸ ਨਹਿ ਆਵਤਿ ਸੋਈ । ਕਤਰਿ ਓਜ ਕੋ ਮੈਂ ਤਹਿ ਜੋਈ” ।੩।⁣
    After [saluting Guru Hargobind] he clasped his hands and began to say, “There are vile people close to here butchering cows and they are trying to get hold of more cows with great effort.⁣

    ਸੁਨਿ ਸਤਿਗੁਰੁ ਸੋ ਆਗੇ ਕਰ੍ਯੋ । ਹਯ ਧਵਾਇ ਚਾਲੇ ਰਿਸਿ ਧਰ੍ਯੋ । ਹੁਤੇ ਨਿਕਟ ਹੀ ਜਾਇ ਨਿਹਾਰੇ । ਖੜਗ ਨਿਕਾਸ੍ਯੋ ਤਤਛਿਨ ਮਾਰੇ ।੪।⁣
    Listening to this Satiguru Hargobind mounted his horse and proceeded ahead with great anger, seeing where they were they closed the distance, taking out his sword he quickly slaughtered them. ⁣

    ਭਾਜ ਚਲੇ ਕੁਛ ਘੇਰਿ ਪ੍ਰਹਾਰੇ । ਖੰਡ ਖੰਡ ਕਰਿ ਧਰ ਪਰ ਡਾਰੈ ।⁣
    Some of them ran away, but they were flanked, surrounded and attacked, they were chopped down and then into pieces. ⁣

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Sher Singh


    When the men met then on the ford, and when they began to fight and to strike each other there, and when each of them began to strike the other, the eel threw three folds round Cuchulainn's feet, till he lay on his back athwart the ford. Loch attacked him with the sword, till the ford was blood-red with his blood.

    'Ill indeed,' said Fergus, 'is this deed before the enemy. Let each of you taunt the man, O men,' said he to his following, 'that he may not fall for nothing.'

    Bricriu Poison-tongue Mac Carbatha rose and began inciting
    Cuchulainn.
    'Your strength is gone,' said he, 'when it is a little salmon that overthrows you when the Ulstermen are at hand [coming] to you out of their sickness yonder. Grievous for you to undertake a hero's deed in the presence of the men of Ireland and to ward off a formidable warrior in arms thus!'

    Therewith Cuchulainn arises and strikes the eel so that its ribs broke in it, and the cattle were driven over the hosts eastwards by force, so that they took the tents on their horns, with the thunder-feat that the two heroes had made in the ford.

    The she-wolf attacked him, and drove the cattle on him westwards. He throws a stone from his sling, so that her eye broke in her head. She goes in the form of a hornless red heifer; she rushes before the cows upon the pools and fords. It is then he said: 'I cannot see the fords for water.' He throws a stone at the hornless red heifer, so that her leg breaks under her.
     

    When Cuchulainn was in this great weariness, the Morrigan met him in the form of an old hag, and she blind and lame, milking a cow with three teats, and he asked her for a drink. She gave him milk from a teat.

    'He will be whole who has brought it(?),' said Cuchulainn; 'the blessings of gods and non-gods on you,' said he. (Gods with them were the Mighty Folk [Note: i.e. the dwellers in the Sid. The words in brackets are a gloss incorporated in the text.]; non-gods the people of husbandry.)

    Then her head was healed so that it was whole.

    She gave the milk of the second teat, and her eye was whole; and gave the milk of the third teat, and her leg was whole. So that this was what he said about each thing of them, 'A doom of blessing on you,' said he.

    'You told me,' said the Morrigan, 'I should not have healing from you for ever.'

    'If I had known it was you,' said Cuchulainn, 'I would not have healed you ever.'
     
    https://www.gutenberg.org/cache/epub/14391/pg14391-images.html
  463. Sher Singh says:
    @Coconuts
    @Sher Singh


    Why does a Slav care for Turks or Anglos?
    If it’s just crass consumerism & a respect for modern amenities – that’s a dead end.
     
    From my irl experience of Belarusians, apart from the ties to local Slavic culture and Russia or Poland, plenty of the more educated ones seem to be 'Northern Euro' orientated, looking to Scandanavia, Netherlands, Switzerland, WASPs in the US for political and cultural inspiration, Germany for technology.

    I found this noticeable because the educated liberal people in the UK had a different orientation, similar to what SilvioSliver was talking about in Australia, where they value a mixture of aborigine, Native American and tribal cultures generally, blacks etc.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @Dmitry

    He’s a Serb though, 50-50 whether he’s darker than me..
    E. Euros tilting to the North is like a black white supremacist.
    E. Euros are natural serfs – they love whoever beats/rapes them.

    A Belarussian shows up to a Whites Only meeting – expects the clan, gets BLM.

  464. @Mikel
    @LatW


    the Ukrainians have said over and over that they do not want to leave this to their children
     
    Do you think that if Ukraine takes back Crimea the Russians will never come back again? The contrary looks much more likely. Short of marching to Moscow and dismembering the Russian state, I don't know how Ukrainians can prevent their children from having to fight Russia in the future.

    personally I feel that those who don’t want to live together shouldn’t be forced to, ideally),
     
    That would be the best alternative really. Ukraine deserves to be independent from Moscow, now more than ever. But just apply the same principle to Crimea and Donbass (I doubt thre is a pro-Russian majority anywhere else now in Ukraine) and there you have a basis for a possible future peace. When Musk proposed this he was met with abuse in Kiev though.

    Replies: @Sean, @LatW

    It is very difficult to see how Russia can avoid total mobilisation and commitment. Losses so far have not been sufficient on either side to make them weary of the war. All thoughts that a certain peace formula can resolve the situation are futile. What is needed is some good old fashioned reality therapy: a vile battle of attrition in the style of Verdun in which the objective is not to gain territory but to kill, kill, and kill again. I think America is begining to worry that too many Russians are being killed and the effect it might have on the Russian mindset. The US intel assassination campaign targeting the best Russian generals seems to have been halted out of worry the effect it might have on how far the Russian army leadership are prepared to go.

  465. @AnonfromTN
    @showmethereal


    From what I have seen of Crimea the people don’t even consider it liberation …. They seem to be more like “we were always Russia anyway”
     
    I guess that’s how they feel. Partly because Crimea left the madhouse without any violence. In contrast, because of exactly the same feelings Donbass experienced eight years of brutal war and occupation, with thousands killed and wounded (e.g., since 2014 Ukies murdered and maimed more than 500 children in Donbass). So, for them it is liberation.

    Replies: @showmethereal

    I saw where people in Kherson region were glad at the integration of the healthcare system to Russian standards…. I saw many young people in the Donbass region saying it would make it was for them to go to university in Russia. But of course I would assume Russia would want them to return to help develop the region. Correct?

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @showmethereal


    I saw where people in Kherson region were glad at the integration of the healthcare system to Russian standards….
     
    As far as I know (from relatives living in Ukraine), Ukrainian healthcare is now below the level of poor African countries. I have no personal experience with current RF healthcare system. A few years ago during her visit there my wife broke her hand. They set it for free at the local emergency room. When upon return she saw an American doctor, he said that everything was done right, there is nothing else that needs to be done. Considering how much they would charge for that in the US, her good quality free treatment was remarkable.

    I saw many young people in the Donbass region saying it would make it was for them to go to university in Russia. But of course I would assume Russia would want them to return to help develop the region. Correct?
     
    My knowledge in this area is spotty. I know that some years ago Donbass switched to Russian handbooks in schools and colleges and Russia recognized LPR and DPR school and college diplomas (could not do that when they used pathetic Ukrainian handbooks). Young people could go to Russian colleges after school even back then, but there might have been bureaucratic issues. In Russian colleges there are two tracks: tuition is free for those who get good scores on entrance exams, whereas those with poorer (but not failing) scores could get in for a fee (it is still peanuts compared to outrageous tuition costs in the US).

    I know that in the RF the mobilization of college students was prohibited, whereas LPR and DPR mobilized college students. Recently Putin issued a decree that college students in LPR and DPR should be demobilized and return to their studies.

    I think the RF government will provide some incentives for college graduates to return to LPR and DPR (as well as incentives for specialists from other Russian regions to go there), but I don’t think this will be mandatory. After all, now that these are Russian regions, local people have the same rights as all Russian citizens: they are free to go anywhere.

    Replies: @showmethereal, @LondonBob

  466. @Sher Singh
    @Beckow


    ਪੁਨ ਕਰ ਜੋਰਿ ਬਤਾਇਸਿ ਬਾਤਿ । "ਨਿਕਟ ਦੁਸ਼ਟ ਗੋ ਕਰਤੇ ਘਾਤਿ । ਤਿਨ ਕੇ ਬਸ ਨਹਿ ਆਵਤਿ ਸੋਈ । ਕਤਰਿ ਓਜ ਕੋ ਮੈਂ ਤਹਿ ਜੋਈ" ।੩।⁣
    After [saluting Guru Hargobind] he clasped his hands and began to say, "There are vile people close to here butchering cows and they are trying to get hold of more cows with great effort.⁣

    ਸੁਨਿ ਸਤਿਗੁਰੁ ਸੋ ਆਗੇ ਕਰ੍ਯੋ । ਹਯ ਧਵਾਇ ਚਾਲੇ ਰਿਸਿ ਧਰ੍ਯੋ । ਹੁਤੇ ਨਿਕਟ ਹੀ ਜਾਇ ਨਿਹਾਰੇ । ਖੜਗ ਨਿਕਾਸ੍ਯੋ ਤਤਛਿਨ ਮਾਰੇ ।੪।⁣
    Listening to this Satiguru Hargobind mounted his horse and proceeded ahead with great anger, seeing where they were they closed the distance, taking out his sword he quickly slaughtered them. ⁣

    ਭਾਜ ਚਲੇ ਕੁਛ ਘੇਰਿ ਪ੍ਰਹਾਰੇ । ਖੰਡ ਖੰਡ ਕਰਿ ਧਰ ਪਰ ਡਾਰੈ ।⁣
    Some of them ran away, but they were flanked, surrounded and attacked, they were chopped down and then into pieces. ⁣
     

    Replies: @songbird

    When the men met then on the ford, and when they began to fight and to strike each other there, and when each of them began to strike the other, the eel threw three folds round Cuchulainn’s feet, till he lay on his back athwart the ford. Loch attacked him with the sword, till the ford was blood-red with his blood.

    ‘Ill indeed,’ said Fergus, ‘is this deed before the enemy. Let each of you taunt the man, O men,’ said he to his following, ‘that he may not fall for nothing.’

    Bricriu Poison-tongue Mac Carbatha rose and began inciting
    Cuchulainn.
    ‘Your strength is gone,’ said he, ‘when it is a little salmon that overthrows you when the Ulstermen are at hand [coming] to you out of their sickness yonder. Grievous for you to undertake a hero’s deed in the presence of the men of Ireland and to ward off a formidable warrior in arms thus!’

    Therewith Cuchulainn arises and strikes the eel so that its ribs broke in it, and the cattle were driven over the hosts eastwards by force, so that they took the tents on their horns, with the thunder-feat that the two heroes had made in the ford.

    The she-wolf attacked him, and drove the cattle on him westwards. He throws a stone from his sling, so that her eye broke in her head. She goes in the form of a hornless red heifer; she rushes before the cows upon the pools and fords. It is then he said: ‘I cannot see the fords for water.’ He throws a stone at the hornless red heifer, so that her leg breaks under her.

    [MORE]

    When Cuchulainn was in this great weariness, the Morrigan met him in the form of an old hag, and she blind and lame, milking a cow with three teats, and he asked her for a drink. She gave him milk from a teat.

    ‘He will be whole who has brought it(?),’ said Cuchulainn; ‘the blessings of gods and non-gods on you,’ said he. (Gods with them were the Mighty Folk [Note: i.e. the dwellers in the Sid. The words in brackets are a gloss incorporated in the text.]; non-gods the people of husbandry.)

    Then her head was healed so that it was whole.

    She gave the milk of the second teat, and her eye was whole; and gave the milk of the third teat, and her leg was whole. So that this was what he said about each thing of them, ‘A doom of blessing on you,’ said he.

    ‘You told me,’ said the Morrigan, ‘I should not have healing from you for ever.’

    ‘If I had known it was you,’ said Cuchulainn, ‘I would not have healed you ever.’

    https://www.gutenberg.org/cache/epub/14391/pg14391-images.html

    • Thanks: Sher Singh
  467. @German_reader
    @showmethereal


    The destruction of Libya is what unleashed the latest torrent.
     
    That's only a partial truth (and I was never in favour of Western intervention in Libya) in the sense that the state collapse in Libya means there's no authority one can make a deal with to keep the migrants from subsaharan Africa away. But the real driver of that migration is the immense population growth in Africa. And paradoxically improvement in living standards in Africa would probably lead to an increase in migration, since more people would have the necessary funds for financing their emigration. Any analysis that ignores these realities is dishonest or simply stupid.
    Similar considerations apply to other migration issues as well. You mention Syria, it's a common refrain by quite a few commnters here on UR that Western countries have to take in Syrians because of their role in the destabilization of Syria (and as you do, this is then extended to even a country like Germany, whose involvement in Syria has been negligible, because of NATO or some common white man's guilt or whatever). And sure, there is an awful lot to criticize about the role of the US and some other Western states in that civil war (as there is about the role of the Gulf states and of Turkey...though Turkey at least has paid a heavy price for its meddling). But this is only part of the truth. One has to wonder, why exactly could Syria be destabilized to such an extreme degree? Could it be, because the country experienced totally absurd population growth (from 4,5 million in 1960 to 21 million in 2011), encouraged by a state that wanted cannon fodder, because its nepotistic and corrupt dictatorship then proved unable to provide decent prospects to all the frustrated young men this created, and because rather too many Syrians decided to seek a solution to their problems in an orgy of sectarian killing? And similar processes apply in a lot of those essentially failed societies in the Global South.
    As for your fairy tale about Russia supposedly being different, providing a better model etc., lol, gimme a break, this is all just re-hashed Soviet bs. Russia is just supporting various military thugs who want Wagner mercenaries to crush their internal enemies. People who think differently are just as much suffering from delusions as Americans who believe their country is nothing but a force for good in the world.

    Replies: @showmethereal

    I’m not saying the west “has to” take them in. I firmly believe in the God given principle of of reaping and sowing. Causing problems in others homes will bring problems in your home.

    As to Syria… Syria had a fairly high human development. Same with Libya.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @showmethereal


    I’m not saying the west “has to” take them in. I firmly believe in the God given principle of of reaping and sowing.
     
    Actually, you are saying that. Their entry into the country is the form that the "reaping" takes. No entry, no reaping. All there would be is their desire to entry the country, which would simply be their problem. There is no necessary causal link between their desire to enter and granting them permission to. None whatsoever.

    Replies: @showmethereal, @Coconuts

  468. @Mikel
    @A123


    Everyone notices you were unable to counter a single FACT I presented above
     
    Sorry if I hurt your feelings by not debating your points. I always have plenty of activities programmed for the weekends and they take precedence over online debates, especially of the kind you like to engage in. To be totally fair, you did manage to come up with a couple of decent excuses of why one would take part in an election knowing that it was rigged but the whole idea of Democrats being able to steal the elections with the help of traitor Republicans and Trumpists still wanting to take part in those elections is nutty.

    Btw, you also hurt my feelings when I saw that you didn't include accusations of being a covert Muslim in your tirade against me. I found it unfair that only some commenters get the Islamist treatment from you. What do I have to do to join that club?

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @A123

    you did manage to come up with a couple of decent excuses of why one would take part in an election

    The key points that you intentionally ignored (again):

    -A- The rigging can be fixed
    -B- Or, the rigging can be magnified and used the other direction.

    Both of my suggestions are practical options.
    ___

    Your belief that nothing can be changed is more than just nutty. You reek of despair. You exist to capitulate before SJW values.

    Please explain — How can your plan, total abject surrender, lead to victory?

    PEACE 😇

     

  469. @showmethereal
    @AnonfromTN

    I saw where people in Kherson region were glad at the integration of the healthcare system to Russian standards…. I saw many young people in the Donbass region saying it would make it was for them to go to university in Russia. But of course I would assume Russia would want them to return to help develop the region. Correct?

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    I saw where people in Kherson region were glad at the integration of the healthcare system to Russian standards….

    As far as I know (from relatives living in Ukraine), Ukrainian healthcare is now below the level of poor African countries. I have no personal experience with current RF healthcare system. A few years ago during her visit there my wife broke her hand. They set it for free at the local emergency room. When upon return she saw an American doctor, he said that everything was done right, there is nothing else that needs to be done. Considering how much they would charge for that in the US, her good quality free treatment was remarkable.

    I saw many young people in the Donbass region saying it would make it was for them to go to university in Russia. But of course I would assume Russia would want them to return to help develop the region. Correct?

    My knowledge in this area is spotty. I know that some years ago Donbass switched to Russian handbooks in schools and colleges and Russia recognized LPR and DPR school and college diplomas (could not do that when they used pathetic Ukrainian handbooks). Young people could go to Russian colleges after school even back then, but there might have been bureaucratic issues. In Russian colleges there are two tracks: tuition is free for those who get good scores on entrance exams, whereas those with poorer (but not failing) scores could get in for a fee (it is still peanuts compared to outrageous tuition costs in the US).

    I know that in the RF the mobilization of college students was prohibited, whereas LPR and DPR mobilized college students. Recently Putin issued a decree that college students in LPR and DPR should be demobilized and return to their studies.

    I think the RF government will provide some incentives for college graduates to return to LPR and DPR (as well as incentives for specialists from other Russian regions to go there), but I don’t think this will be mandatory. After all, now that these are Russian regions, local people have the same rights as all Russian citizens: they are free to go anywhere.

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @AnonfromTN

    Thanks for the insight. I understand geopolitics and I try to read and watch as many “independent” sources as possible. But I always like to know the actually local sources as possible. I know a couple of Russians and yes they both have family in “Ukraine”. Frankly they are more sad than anything because it has caused differences in their own families that live on the Ukrainian side. It’s just sad to me that western Ukraine would turn on their Slavic brethren like that. But yea I did hear healthcare was pretty poor in Ukraine. That’s something I couldn’t understand. Under Putin Russia seemed to re-tool its economy… I failed to understand why Ukraine couldn’t

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Mr. Hack

    , @LondonBob
    @AnonfromTN

    Rostov and Sochi are the fastest growing Russian cities, the infrastructure in Novorossiya will need upgrading, but I have no doubt these areas will attract the people who make these areas thrive.

  470. @LatW
    @AnonfromTN


    Primarily I doubt that very pragmatic Xi would discuss with demented Biden anything of importance, let alone depend on an agreement with a person who will forget about it within minutes
     
    Personalities are important, but what is more important is the spirit of openness (if it's real). It seems that some warming of the relationship definitely has taken place. But, of course, if such a huge agreement was made, the question is how it sticks in case someone like Trump comes back or anti-China hawks come in the forefront. It would be a lot of work for the State Department then to tame someone like Trump.

    Xi does not strike me as Gorby-type naïve fool.
     
    Well, not only that, but China is also not in the same position as the USSR was during Gorby's time, quite the opposite, in fact. (To be fair to Gorby, he probably couldn't do all that much more in his position, use of force was a gamble since the masses had been woken up first and foremost within the Russian nation).

    But even if such an agreement was made (that the US will not provide long range missiles (and pressure Ukraine to not take Crimea?) but China will try to deter Russia from the use of nukes), the question is still how this can be enforced (neither of those two countries, no matter how large, have full control over the other countries involved).

    Replies: @German_reader, @showmethereal

    China doesn’t trust the US. Nor does it get involved in trying to tell other countries what to do in 3rd party squabbles.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @showmethereal


    Nor does it get involved in trying to tell other countries what to do in 3rd party squabbles.
     
    Not sure if this is true. Try reading their party newspaper, Global Times. It is full of condescending lecturing towards some Europeans. It mostly makes one laugh (entertaining to read), but to say that they don't care or won't lecture, is not true.

    Replies: @showmethereal

  471. @German_reader
    @German_reader

    https://asiatimes.com/2022/11/harvard-guru-gives-biden-a-d-for-china-policy/


    Now, how about China policy more narrowly? This restriction on semiconductors is a declaration of economic war. It’s completely disproportionate to any of the problems we have with China. This is going 30, 40% of the way toward what we did with Japan, cutting off their oil before Pearl Harbor. Semiconductors are the key to the modern world.

    This validates every crazy nationalistic Chinese professor who’s been arguing that our goal all along has been to keep China down, to prevent them from growing. In terms of the relationship, it’s just awful. It’s an escalation. People don’t realize this is a declaration of war.

    [...]

    Now, back to the bigger picture. In China policy, Biden has done two important things.

    One is, he has completely reneged on the 1979 agreement that’s been the basis for peace in Taiwan. What did we say in that agreement? That we will not have official relations, we will not have an alliance.

    Now Biden has said four times he will defend Taiwan. That’s called an alliance.

    When Nancy Pelosi went to Taiwan, she was very careful to label it an official visit. And then immediately after a meeting with Taiwan’s President, Tsai Ing-wen’s spokeswoman went on their national TV and said Taiwan is a sovereign and independent country.

    That was the culmination of Pelosi’s visit—a complete breach of the US promises that have kept Taiwan safe for over four decades.
     

    Replies: @S, @showmethereal

    Correct. He and Jeffrey Sachs are some of the few US guys who get how China thinks. Ironic they are both Harvard guys

  472. @showmethereal
    @German_reader

    I’m not saying the west “has to” take them in. I firmly believe in the God given principle of of reaping and sowing. Causing problems in others homes will bring problems in your home.

    As to Syria… Syria had a fairly high human development. Same with Libya.

    Replies: @silviosilver

    I’m not saying the west “has to” take them in. I firmly believe in the God given principle of of reaping and sowing.

    Actually, you are saying that. Their entry into the country is the form that the “reaping” takes. No entry, no reaping. All there would be is their desire to entry the country, which would simply be their problem. There is no necessary causal link between their desire to enter and granting them permission to. None whatsoever.

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @silviosilver

    Crossing borders illegally has been going on since nations created borders. How do you suppose they could stop such a flood? This flood is a DIRECT result of things these countries did (well NATO collectively). Of course yea Turkiye has spitefully let some through - but I don’t even know why they are in NATO in the first place. But people will always sneak across through land or sea. Now letting them in via quota is a different story. But that’s their guilty conscience and frankly serves them right. The only countries I would feel sorry for are those who refuse to take part.
    Again reaping and sowing is not a Principle of “choice”. It’s part of the created order. You do corruption you reap corruption. Don’t blame me - take it up with the Creator

    Replies: @silviosilver

    , @Coconuts
    @silviosilver


    Actually, you are saying that. Their entry into the country is the form that the “reaping” takes. No entry, no reaping. All there would be is their desire to entry the country, which would simply be their problem. There is no necessary causal link between their desire to enter and granting them permission to. None whatsoever.
     
    Maybe there is a more 'value free' analysis available:

    If a country has a certain political system and a certain set of values and a particular situation arises (say the mass arrival of refugees), the effect will be to some extent predictable. This would mean the people responsible for planning actions which might give rise to large movements of refugees should also think about possible impacts further down the line. I would guess they understand this now much better than they did in the 2000s (but perhaps not).


    “Serves them right.” Thank you for making your anti-white hostility clear. In stark contrast to you, though I believe China has not always been an innocent little angel, nothing they have ever done would cause me to insist they must demographically obliterate themselves as an act of penitence
     
    From a Chinese point of view European nations taking in lots of refugees and immigrants from Africa and MENA could be beneficial in the long run. Major demographic change should make them less stable, less powerful, possibly more open to manipulation by outside great powers if the need arises (e.g. by stoking racial tensions).

    Adding cynicism about the motivation of Germany, Austria, Nordic countries around the refugee issue does seem pretty anti-white.

    I think relatively retarded attempts to explain racism and colonialism as having mainly cultural causes may encourage this. If it was all supposedly down to the influence of Aristotle, Plato, Christianity and 19th century positivist science combined with having a European phenotype, then all Europeans from Ireland to the Baltics, Portugal to Bulgaria and Ukraine are equally 'guilty' of whiteness, colonialism etc. by sharing broadly the same physical characteristics and a similar intellectual inheritance.

  473. @Coconuts
    @showmethereal


    But the natives looked at the white invaders the same way. They didn’t care about productivity. Aside from the fact Australia was literally a place for the Brits to get rid of undesirables. In North America – what is left of the native tribes still protest and wish whites would leave their ancestral lands. They don’t care about productivity.
     
    Iirc the point was originally more about the difference between European settlers and Africans migrants coming to Europe. Africans, MENA and others coming to Europe are definitely motivated by the level of economic development there, they do not appear to be drawn by a desire for uncultivated land or Europe's raw natural resources. Nor by a selfless Kantian moral imperative to seek pure justice or to save Euros from their moral backwardness.

    Generally, this idea that the difference in value between the level of development of modern Australia or the US and Native American tribes is completely subjective, and in theory one is just as valuable or good as another is also very popular among white progressives at the moment and has a lot of political significance for them. It might be cynical, but I think the reason these claims are taken seriously is because it suits the broader political interests of powers like the US and China to do so, at least superficially.

    As to Europe – again most don’t feel sorry. They collectively competed in imperialism- so they collectively absorb.
     

    European countries are organising this themselves (in various cases it has been organised by the colonialists who used to run the empires). I was saying that reparations for colonialism is not a significant or relevant factor. Afaik Libya was a Franco-British operation, not a NATO one, but these immigration trends pre-date by 20 years, even decades more. The actual cause is highlighted by German_reader, major growth in populations outside Europe, better communications, easier travel, plus declining indigenous populations in Europe. The present European economic and political systems currently depend on growth, diversity and expanding populations, so they have a natural openness and attractive pull.

    Ironically, the Nordic countries with the most idealistic immigration policies are the ones with the least participation in colonialism.

    Replies: @showmethereal

    But Franco British does equal NATO. That’s how gangs work (so called mutual defense treaty). But the US absolutely was a major force behind it. Why do you think Hilary Clinton laughed after saying “we came we saw he died”. It was literal.

  474. @German_reader
    @LatW


    the Ukrainians have said over and over that they do not want to leave this to their children.
     
    If this goes on for years, there won't be all that many Ukrainian children in Ukraine to leave anything to. There are about 200 000 Ukrainian children in German schools now, I suppose more in Poland. The country is being de-populated at a rapid pace. SPIEGEL recently had a story about Ukrainian teenagers in Hamburg, and the tenor already was "We have much better chances here, we don't want to go back". Comments like by Zelensky's wife along the lines "If necessary, we can tolerate being without power for 2-3 years" are just crazy, who's going to live under such conditions when people can go to the EU instead.
    I don't think Ukraine should just give up territories where the majority of the population before the war was clearly Ukrainian in sentiment, obviously there are limits to what could be conceded. But I don't see how aiming at some kind of total victory over Russia (whose original goals in this war have already failed btw) is going to lead to anything but disaster.

    Replies: @LatW

    If this goes on for years, there won’t be all that many Ukrainian children in Ukraine to leave anything to.

    The current horrific, hot phase will not go on for years, I trust Kyrylo Budanov (the head of the Ukrainian intelligence) and General Zaluzhnyi here above all. Kyrylo Budanov says that the hot phase of the war will be over some time next year (from what I understand from his words, somewhere closer to summer).

    After that there will be permanent cold war between Russia and her neighbors (I don’t harbor much hope in the Russian population that they could somehow change and become friendly in considerable numbers). Ukraine will have to become Israel.

    [MORE]

    There are about 200 000 Ukrainian children in German schools now, I suppose more in Poland. The country is being de-populated at a rapid pace.

    I never said that this is not catastrophic. This needs to be penned down as involuntary displacement by a foreign aggressor, and should be treated as one of the many crimes of this aggression. In fact, a displacement on such a scale could be treated as borderline genocide. I know you don’t like it when people state it openly like that but that’s what it is (or ethnocide at the very least). So those who will just quietly accept that it is ok to commit something like that, should just think about how they will be perceived.

    And, btw, I’m not worried about the Ukrainians in Poland (or in the Baltic States, in smaller, but still significant numbers). They are at home there. The ones in Western countries should be encouraged to repatriate in due time, hopefully, next year. The families will need to be reunited with their men.

    obviously there are limits to what could be conceded

    It is very unseemly when a foreigner talks about “conceding” someone else’s land. Talk that way about your own land.

    Another thing that you fail to understand is the life in occupied territory. It is torment. Imagine if part of one German state was occupied by a power that hates you and the people there were tormented, would you just leave them there? The electricity will come back, so will some of the refugees, but why willfully give up territory and leave your kin under a savage occupation? Especially when the military are willing to fight.

    But I don’t see how aiming at some kind of total victory over Russia (whose original goals in this war have already failed btw) is going to lead to anything but disaster.

    A “total victory” over Russia can only be completed with the direct participation of the Russian people.
    The baton will be passed on to them and then it will be up to them to decide what they can achieve.

    Russia’s original goals failed in this instance but that doesn’t mean they won’t try again. The Russian society is ill and they cannot help but keep reverting back to their crazy imperial impulses. They do not have a strong enough core. Unless the Russian people themselves change this, this will go on forever. For Ukraine it is a question how this can be mitigated and what security guarantees Ukraine can build long term. Best will be a strong military and good friends.

    • Agree: Mr. Hack
    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @LatW


    Another thing that you fail to understand is the life in occupied territory. It is torment.
     
    That’s exactly what the people in LPR and DPR say after being liberated from Ukies.

    Replies: @LatW

    , @German_reader
    @LatW


    In fact, a displacement on such a scale could be treated as borderline genocide. I know you don’t like it when people state it openly like that but that’s what it is (or ethnocide at the very least). So those who will just quietly accept that it is ok to commit something like that, should just think about how they will be perceived.
     
    It isn't genocide, stop using such propaganda terms. Nor did I imply it is "ok". The problem with your approach to these matters is that it's extremely normative and moralistic, always about how things ought to be if there were perfect justice, never about weighing potential costs and risks of various courses of action. Of course there can't be peace at any price, a ceasefire wouldn't make any sense if Russia just uses it to regroup and then attack again, but your dogmatic assertion that this war needs to be fought to the bitter end really comes across as rather fanatical (and I'm not convinced either by your claims "But Ukrainians think the same"...maybe in Lviv or among those living abroad, might be different in the regions where the fighting actually takes place).

    It is very unseemly when a foreigner talks about “conceding” someone else’s land. Talk that way about your own land.
     
    You've been told this multiple times before - Ukraine would have no chance at all without Western support, and all of Europe is making immensely painful economic sacrifices because of the war. If Ukrainians want to continue the war until the 2014 borders have been restored (which means taking the war to areas where only land, not people will be "liberated"), ok, their choice, in that event support should be scaled down or even ended.

    Another thing that you fail to understand is the life in occupied territory. It is torment.
     
    For some, and not in all of the occupied areas equally, there seem to be quite a few who are willing to accommodate themselves to Russian rule at least in the Donbass areas taken since February.

    Replies: @LatW, @AnonfromTN

    , @Beckow
    @LatW

    We have a real thing in LatW: a die-hard fanatic previously hiding behind more reasonable views. Spilling of blood tends to radicalize...

    On points LatW views are ridiculous: blatant double standards (so Russians in Ukraine were not tormented and murdered? is that ok now?), quoting Kiev propaganda ministry, over-the-top rhetoric, suggesting that "Russians themselves should destroy Russia"...are the Latvians too lazy now?

    To the false history and propaganda a new element is added: drama! The words become more loaded, it is all very existential, the other side is pure evil ("die Russian scum, just die already!!!!")...

    It is a reflection of what LatW knows and doesn't want to admit: Russia is playing with Ukies like a cat and mouse, they will clobber them, and the only tiny hope is to dramatize it to such an extent that Nato goes in and maybe we go nuclear. As all drama it is very irresponsible.

    How about just giving Russians normal rights in Ukraine, or follow the Kosovo example and let the malcontents separate. And keep Nato out of there, why do we have to risk everything for Nato to be able to have bases in Ukraine? How can you look at yourself and still pretend that you are normal if you choose more death instead of a very reasonable peaceful solution? Is losing better?

  475. @showmethereal
    @LatW

    China doesn’t trust the US. Nor does it get involved in trying to tell other countries what to do in 3rd party squabbles.

    Replies: @LatW

    Nor does it get involved in trying to tell other countries what to do in 3rd party squabbles.

    Not sure if this is true. Try reading their party newspaper, Global Times. It is full of condescending lecturing towards some Europeans. It mostly makes one laugh (entertaining to read), but to say that they don’t care or won’t lecture, is not true.

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @LatW

    Global Times does not set policy. Another western fallacy. And an editorial in a newspaper is not at all the same as making secret agreements behind the scenes. Not even remotely. I bet most westerners don’t know a recent editor in chief was a former Tiananmen Square protester. According to westerners they are all dead.
    But to prove my point to you. Go read what Global Times editorial said China “might” do to prevent Pelosi from visiting Taiwan. China didn’t do what’s the editorials said (send military escorts to stop her plane from landing). So no - Global Times does not speak directly for Xi nor the Poliburo. Again - lack of understanding from the west.

    Replies: @LatW

  476. @LatW
    @German_reader


    If this goes on for years, there won’t be all that many Ukrainian children in Ukraine to leave anything to.
     
    The current horrific, hot phase will not go on for years, I trust Kyrylo Budanov (the head of the Ukrainian intelligence) and General Zaluzhnyi here above all. Kyrylo Budanov says that the hot phase of the war will be over some time next year (from what I understand from his words, somewhere closer to summer).

    After that there will be permanent cold war between Russia and her neighbors (I don't harbor much hope in the Russian population that they could somehow change and become friendly in considerable numbers). Ukraine will have to become Israel.

    There are about 200 000 Ukrainian children in German schools now, I suppose more in Poland. The country is being de-populated at a rapid pace.
     
    I never said that this is not catastrophic. This needs to be penned down as involuntary displacement by a foreign aggressor, and should be treated as one of the many crimes of this aggression. In fact, a displacement on such a scale could be treated as borderline genocide. I know you don't like it when people state it openly like that but that's what it is (or ethnocide at the very least). So those who will just quietly accept that it is ok to commit something like that, should just think about how they will be perceived.

    And, btw, I'm not worried about the Ukrainians in Poland (or in the Baltic States, in smaller, but still significant numbers). They are at home there. The ones in Western countries should be encouraged to repatriate in due time, hopefully, next year. The families will need to be reunited with their men.

    obviously there are limits to what could be conceded
     
    It is very unseemly when a foreigner talks about "conceding" someone else's land. Talk that way about your own land.

    Another thing that you fail to understand is the life in occupied territory. It is torment. Imagine if part of one German state was occupied by a power that hates you and the people there were tormented, would you just leave them there? The electricity will come back, so will some of the refugees, but why willfully give up territory and leave your kin under a savage occupation? Especially when the military are willing to fight.

    But I don’t see how aiming at some kind of total victory over Russia (whose original goals in this war have already failed btw) is going to lead to anything but disaster.
     
    A "total victory" over Russia can only be completed with the direct participation of the Russian people.
    The baton will be passed on to them and then it will be up to them to decide what they can achieve.

    Russia's original goals failed in this instance but that doesn't mean they won't try again. The Russian society is ill and they cannot help but keep reverting back to their crazy imperial impulses. They do not have a strong enough core. Unless the Russian people themselves change this, this will go on forever. For Ukraine it is a question how this can be mitigated and what security guarantees Ukraine can build long term. Best will be a strong military and good friends.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @German_reader, @Beckow

    Another thing that you fail to understand is the life in occupied territory. It is torment.

    That’s exactly what the people in LPR and DPR say after being liberated from Ukies.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @AnonfromTN

    All I can say about those populations (purely subjectively without politics), is that their fate is very harsh. They seem to be located on the civilizational plate. Especially in places such as Gorlovka, on the purely human level, they have been dealt out way, way too much.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  477. @Mikel
    @LatW


    the Ukrainians have said over and over that they do not want to leave this to their children
     
    Do you think that if Ukraine takes back Crimea the Russians will never come back again? The contrary looks much more likely. Short of marching to Moscow and dismembering the Russian state, I don't know how Ukrainians can prevent their children from having to fight Russia in the future.

    personally I feel that those who don’t want to live together shouldn’t be forced to, ideally),
     
    That would be the best alternative really. Ukraine deserves to be independent from Moscow, now more than ever. But just apply the same principle to Crimea and Donbass (I doubt thre is a pro-Russian majority anywhere else now in Ukraine) and there you have a basis for a possible future peace. When Musk proposed this he was met with abuse in Kiev though.

    Replies: @Sean, @LatW

    Do you think that if Ukraine takes back Crimea the Russians will never come back again? The contrary looks much more likely.

    Please, see my post above. They always come back. It’s been that way since the 5th century or so. Only one solution – Israel. Not Finland, not Switzerland. Israel.

    [MORE]

    Short of marching to Moscow and dismembering the Russian state, I don’t know how Ukrainians can prevent their children from having to fight Russia in the future.

    As I said above, the Russians themselves have to march to Moscow. Ukraine will stop on its borders, then pass the baton on to the Russians. If they have enough strength (which I highly doubt).

    Alternatively, they can enjoy a “beautiful” life under Prigozhin’s sledgehammer. (Look that up).

    Ukraine deserves to be independent from Moscow, now more than ever.

    That’s not how this works. One doesn’t “deserve” something out of the blue. One has to fight for it. As the Ukrainian people have done for hundreds of years now.

    When Musk proposed this he was met with abuse in Kiev though.

    It is way too late for those solutions now. Such a plan will also be rejected by the Russian side long term (although they are desperate for an agreement so that they can at least keep the current gains). No, it’s too late. It is in the hands of the Ukrainian military now.

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @LatW


    Only one solution – Israel. Not Finland, not Switzerland. Israel.
     
    You mean that Ukraine should shamelessly attack each and every one of their neighbors; greedily grab more and more of their land; subject native minorities to an apartheid system; ruthlessly concoct plans to destroy their geopolitical opponents without having qualms about its impact on ordinary people of those countries; several of which have multiple times more people than a small nation like Israel; and then illegally build nuclear weapons, triggering an arms race in a region that was previously free of such destructive weapons? In short, become the douchiest, most assholic nation in the planet, hated by billions around the globe. Good idea, much better than Finland or Switzerland.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    , @Mikel
    @LatW


    Israel. Not Finland, not Switzerland. Israel.
     
    No. Switzerland is a far superior solution. It hasn't had a war in several centuries. Its combination of a credible military deterrence (which Ukraine now also has) and good relations with everybody spared them from being invaded even by the Nazis. Crucially, it is also a confederation. Every little canton belongs to the federation on a voluntary basis and has ample autonomy, including its own constitution, police and courts.

    Speaking of Nazis, if Ukraine tries to go for a Versailles humiliation, understandable as the desire might now be, it is not difficult to predict that it will sooner or later get a III Reich on its frontier. Even AK is now deriding Putin and the "Kremlins" in every second tweet. Large swaths of United Russia voters must be ready to support a hardliner challenge to the current order. It's time for statesmanship in order to avert a worse Russian threat for everybody in the future.

    Replies: @German_reader, @LatW, @AP

    , @Dmitry
    @LatW


    Only one solution – Israel
     
    For internal security policy, Israel is not exactly a successful example. They are killed every week in different terrorist attacks. There are politicians in Israel's parliament, who receive over $100,000 salary from taxpayers, who are supporting Hamas. There are female conscripts, working in prisons, who were raped by Palestinian security prisoners, sacrificed by their officers. There are religious cult groups who go to live in territory which could never be legally part of Israel.

    There is an example of the dystopian aspects of European internal law applied to unfinished civil war in the Middle East since 1948, which has fuel of nationalism and Middle East's very strong religions. There are more than 50 years without two-state solution, but even with two-state solution the civil war will continue within Israel.

    This is surely a dystopia.

    If you ignore the civil war, Israel has a mix of the 19th century European political software, which also has predictable positive results like in colonial states of Australia or New Zealand.

    There is English law, proportional representation, free-speech, private property, decentralized/uncensored media. There is some successful anti-corruption policies. There is investment in science* and quite bit of the artistic and academic production for the size of country. There is consumer protection, unionization and worker protection (although not in all industries e.g. construction industry is less like in a developed country).

    Israel is also a population of mostly third world multiracial immigrants (the majority of the Jewish population) who they can assimilate to create a new nationality in a couple generations. But then this "melting pot" is going to a society divided by religion instead. As the "melting pot" of Brazil, is not ending another type of division (in Brazil, class divisions instead of religious divisions).


    -
    *From the view of postsoviet countries, there should be a desire to copy the higher investment in R&D , which China could be attaining. But also places like Germany or Sweden have much higher investment for R&D.

    https://i.imgur.com/u4d5Nv9.jpg

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @LatW

  478. Pretty amusing to hear the ambassadors of places like Pakistan in China speak. Complete opposite of that Melnyk guy.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @songbird


    Complete opposite of that Melnyk guy.
     
    Melnyk is deputy foreign minister now. Surprised me, I would have thought his Bandera worship would have precluded such an appointment given the importance of relations with Poland.

    Replies: @Beckow

  479. @songbird
    Pretty amusing to hear the ambassadors of places like Pakistan in China speak. Complete opposite of that Melnyk guy.

    Replies: @German_reader

    Complete opposite of that Melnyk guy.

    Melnyk is deputy foreign minister now. Surprised me, I would have thought his Bandera worship would have precluded such an appointment given the importance of relations with Poland.

    • Thanks: songbird
    • Replies: @Beckow
    @German_reader

    When politicians speak outside the usual boundaries - like Melnik - they are either designated pariahs or the chosen. Melnik turned out to be one of the chosen. He knew he could do no wrong, he was privy to the script. Too many pretended that was not the script only aberration. I think we know now...

    Melnik was like a canary in a coal mine, his rise says it all: Poland is the designated team B, the staging ground, to be used again for much bigger things. It is about the lands, the incredible arable topsoils with plenty of water, it has always been about that, for at least 300-400 hundred years.

    Replies: @German_reader

  480. @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @showmethereal

    More lies from you. China attempted to modernize in the Western model as the Japanese had during Meiji but simply failed,

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-Strengthening_Movement

    In the First Sino-Japanese War, no one assumed Japan would win. The Japanese successfully adopted the Jeune École naval concept of smaller ships against bigger Chinese battleships.

    Amongst many Chinese fails, the sailors had to wear queues that their Manchu masters forced on them, this was a huge operational risk because getting queues caught in machinery meant probable death.

    Teddy Roosevelt declined reparations from China and set a scholarship to educate Chinese,

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boxer_Indemnity_Scholarship

    The 1929 conflict was a case of Chinese picking a fight with the Soviets and getting a well-deserved ass-whupping. That's why wumao like you mouth off about the Japanese but never dares saying jack shit offensive to your Russian grandfather 俄爹.

    So in fact, the best all time Japanese baseball player is half Chinese 王貞治 おう さだはる Wáng Zhēnzhì

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sadaharu_Oh

    Replies: @showmethereal

    Change your fake name. As someone else outed you – you are nothing but a rabid anti Chinese. What does any of that have to do with football and sports overall. Sorry if it hurts your feelings but it is a fact Japan is an occupied country and so loves the past time of its captors.

    And China has never been scared of Russia. Even the Soviets would tell you that. To say so makes you look like an idiot. Fact is China and Russia solved their issues. They have no animosity. Only idiots like yourself who are upset that China passed Japan again – as was the case through the majority of human history. Chinese don’t want to play baseball – and neither does the vast majority of the world. Japan is still ahead in football…. For a little while. Will you cry if/when they pass Japan as they have in Olympic sports?

    Fact is East Asians do not have the genetics to dominate in football. Nor do they in basketball. That’s just reality. That was the original argument. Japan is a rich country with a huge population. Making it to the quarter finals is actually not a huge achievement- except the fact East Asians are not expected to be good. Kind of like Chinese NBA players. Put salt in your rabid anti China wounds. It hurts but it will heal you

    • Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @showmethereal


    As someone else outed you
     
    Who are you referring to? Name his name and I'll address him directly.

    I'm anti-:

    - Death by a thousand cuts

    - Opium addiction

    - Eunuch bureaucracy

    - Female infanticide, footbinding

    - Massive civil wars and depopulation events

    - Massive famines and occurrence of cannibalism, euphemized as “two-legged goat” (https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/兩腳羊)

    - "When you conceal your will from others, that is Thick. When you impose your will on others, that is Black (Dark)." (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thick_Black_Theory)

    - "being anti-America is work, living in America is life" (反美是工作、留美是生活).[11] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sima_Nan)

    If that makes me anti-China then I'm anti-China.

    Fact is China and Russia solved their issues. They have no animosity.
     
    Good, I hope that relationship goes better than it did last time.

    Stalin and Kim started the Korean War that ended in nearly a million Chinese casualties. After Great Leap Forward, Cultural Revolution, Sino-Soviet Split, Deng had to come to Japan and give the saikeirei 最敬礼 “the most respectful gesture” to the Hinomaru 日の丸.

    https://i.postimg.cc/G3svHXhx/t9r7chbkh2o71.jpg

    Replies: @A123, @showmethereal

  481. @silviosilver
    @LatW


    Gronk is a Wend.
     
    Gronk was a tight end. Tight end has become a very white position in recent years, and all the best tight ends are white. I'm pretty sure most of them aren't slavic.

    @songbird


    Not sure how realistic the prospects of Turkey joining the EU ever were, but I suppose I should thank Erdogan for helping to sabotage the idea.
     
    I'm not sure either, but the very fact the idea was ever floated and that they achieved candidate status is disturbing enough.

    Replies: @songbird

    >Not sure how realistic the prospects of Turkey joining the EU ever were, but I suppose I should thank Erdogan for helping to sabotage the idea.

    I’m not sure either, but the very fact the idea was ever floated and that they achieved candidate status is disturbing enough.

    Agreed. I think it helps take the blinders off about the nature of the regime and about how mass migration into the EU is being promoted by the regime, rather than being something accidental, or not sought after.

    It is only important as a clear sign of sultan’s stupidity

    I know a lot of people predict some Ottoman Empire 2.0 in the coming decades. Personally, I’m kind of skeptical. (If pan-Arabism didn’t work out, rule by Turks seems like quite a stretch) Granted they probably have the least bad demographic base in the area (still pretty bad), and control the source of a lot of the water in the Middle East. I still don’t see it. More likely Pakistan would move into the Middle East, IMO.

    • Troll: Yahya
    • Replies: @A123
    @songbird

    New EU entry is 99%+ impossible. France, Hungary, Germany, and Poland have all said they will not approve new entrants without "reform". And, their concepts of reform are 180° diametrically opposed.

    • Populist countries, with European values, demand less Brussels and more VETO rights.

    • Authoritarian countries, with SJW Globalist dogma, want to gut national sovereignty and European values.
    ____

    Erdogan's intent is hard to fathom. His offensive in Syria creates problems for both Russia and the European Empire. Kurds are abandoning positions needed to counter Daesh to fortify against Turkish aggression.

    There is still a chance that Erdogan will spike Finland & Sweden joining NATO in retaliation for the EU dead end.

     

    If you want a good lark, PoliticoEU has opened their voting for Most Powerful European leader of 2022.

    https://www.politico.eu/article/poll-who-is-the-most-powerful-person-in-europe/

    I already nominated Viktor Mihály Orbán. Who else has done more to thwart the Berlin/Paris/Davos axis of evil?

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @songbird

  482. German_reader says:
    @LatW
    @German_reader


    If this goes on for years, there won’t be all that many Ukrainian children in Ukraine to leave anything to.
     
    The current horrific, hot phase will not go on for years, I trust Kyrylo Budanov (the head of the Ukrainian intelligence) and General Zaluzhnyi here above all. Kyrylo Budanov says that the hot phase of the war will be over some time next year (from what I understand from his words, somewhere closer to summer).

    After that there will be permanent cold war between Russia and her neighbors (I don't harbor much hope in the Russian population that they could somehow change and become friendly in considerable numbers). Ukraine will have to become Israel.

    There are about 200 000 Ukrainian children in German schools now, I suppose more in Poland. The country is being de-populated at a rapid pace.
     
    I never said that this is not catastrophic. This needs to be penned down as involuntary displacement by a foreign aggressor, and should be treated as one of the many crimes of this aggression. In fact, a displacement on such a scale could be treated as borderline genocide. I know you don't like it when people state it openly like that but that's what it is (or ethnocide at the very least). So those who will just quietly accept that it is ok to commit something like that, should just think about how they will be perceived.

    And, btw, I'm not worried about the Ukrainians in Poland (or in the Baltic States, in smaller, but still significant numbers). They are at home there. The ones in Western countries should be encouraged to repatriate in due time, hopefully, next year. The families will need to be reunited with their men.

    obviously there are limits to what could be conceded
     
    It is very unseemly when a foreigner talks about "conceding" someone else's land. Talk that way about your own land.

    Another thing that you fail to understand is the life in occupied territory. It is torment. Imagine if part of one German state was occupied by a power that hates you and the people there were tormented, would you just leave them there? The electricity will come back, so will some of the refugees, but why willfully give up territory and leave your kin under a savage occupation? Especially when the military are willing to fight.

    But I don’t see how aiming at some kind of total victory over Russia (whose original goals in this war have already failed btw) is going to lead to anything but disaster.
     
    A "total victory" over Russia can only be completed with the direct participation of the Russian people.
    The baton will be passed on to them and then it will be up to them to decide what they can achieve.

    Russia's original goals failed in this instance but that doesn't mean they won't try again. The Russian society is ill and they cannot help but keep reverting back to their crazy imperial impulses. They do not have a strong enough core. Unless the Russian people themselves change this, this will go on forever. For Ukraine it is a question how this can be mitigated and what security guarantees Ukraine can build long term. Best will be a strong military and good friends.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @German_reader, @Beckow

    In fact, a displacement on such a scale could be treated as borderline genocide. I know you don’t like it when people state it openly like that but that’s what it is (or ethnocide at the very least). So those who will just quietly accept that it is ok to commit something like that, should just think about how they will be perceived.

    It isn’t genocide, stop using such propaganda terms. Nor did I imply it is “ok”. The problem with your approach to these matters is that it’s extremely normative and moralistic, always about how things ought to be if there were perfect justice, never about weighing potential costs and risks of various courses of action. Of course there can’t be peace at any price, a ceasefire wouldn’t make any sense if Russia just uses it to regroup and then attack again, but your dogmatic assertion that this war needs to be fought to the bitter end really comes across as rather fanatical (and I’m not convinced either by your claims “But Ukrainians think the same”…maybe in Lviv or among those living abroad, might be different in the regions where the fighting actually takes place).

    It is very unseemly when a foreigner talks about “conceding” someone else’s land. Talk that way about your own land.

    You’ve been told this multiple times before – Ukraine would have no chance at all without Western support, and all of Europe is making immensely painful economic sacrifices because of the war. If Ukrainians want to continue the war until the 2014 borders have been restored (which means taking the war to areas where only land, not people will be “liberated”), ok, their choice, in that event support should be scaled down or even ended.

    Another thing that you fail to understand is the life in occupied territory. It is torment.

    For some, and not in all of the occupied areas equally, there seem to be quite a few who are willing to accommodate themselves to Russian rule at least in the Donbass areas taken since February.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @German_reader


    a ceasefire wouldn’t make any sense if Russia just uses it to regroup and then attack again
     
    Right, that's exactly what Russia would do - regroup and then try to attack again (even though the shitheads don't even have enough winter uniforms, something they should've thought about back in August). But for some reason the likes of yourself just keep screeching for this ceasefire - so you know full well what would happen and you still insist on it. Wow, that's transparent.

    and I’m not convinced either by your claims “But Ukrainians think the same”…maybe in Lviv or among those living abroad, might be different in the regions where the fighting actually takes place

     

    It's been what - 8 years of war now? - and you still come out with deeply uninformed statements like that? Don't embarrass yourself - you're not in the loop. Do me a favor before you text me again - open any Ukrainian channel and listen to it for a few hours. I have no time for someone who is that uninformed, it's just not serious.

    all of Europe is making immensely painful economic sacrifices because of the war
     
    Do not fucking blame the Ukrainians for this. The Ukrainians didn't attack anybody. The economic hardships are only partially due to the war. The inflation was going to come either way - it started way BEFORE the war. The inflation is the result of the "quantitative easing" that was performed by the Federal Reserve and the European Central Bank. For years. This is your own doing! Own it.

    Replies: @German_reader, @Wokechoke

    , @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader

    Your lugenpresse won’t tell you that, but at least 95% of people in Donbass hate Ukies guts. They were occupied by Ukies and liberated from Ukies.

    Replies: @LatW

  483. @Mikel
    @AnonfromTN


    Turkey, on the other hand, IMO is just an overgrown poor quality chicken.
     
    I've never tried one but I suspect that homegrown turkeys have nothing to do with the store bought variety. I know for a fact that homestead chickens and store chickens are totally different beasts.

    Replies: @songbird

    The breed on most tables has changed dramatically since the ’50s. Used to be a lot more like wild turkeys (much thinner, more dark meat).

    • Replies: @Barbarossa
    @songbird

    White meat turkiye is really only good for sandwiches or meat pies, in my opinion. I'll eat the dark meat every time. Same with chicken. For the life of me, I don't know why people are all on about white meat all the time.

    Replies: @A123, @songbird

  484. @LatW
    @German_reader


    If this goes on for years, there won’t be all that many Ukrainian children in Ukraine to leave anything to.
     
    The current horrific, hot phase will not go on for years, I trust Kyrylo Budanov (the head of the Ukrainian intelligence) and General Zaluzhnyi here above all. Kyrylo Budanov says that the hot phase of the war will be over some time next year (from what I understand from his words, somewhere closer to summer).

    After that there will be permanent cold war between Russia and her neighbors (I don't harbor much hope in the Russian population that they could somehow change and become friendly in considerable numbers). Ukraine will have to become Israel.

    There are about 200 000 Ukrainian children in German schools now, I suppose more in Poland. The country is being de-populated at a rapid pace.
     
    I never said that this is not catastrophic. This needs to be penned down as involuntary displacement by a foreign aggressor, and should be treated as one of the many crimes of this aggression. In fact, a displacement on such a scale could be treated as borderline genocide. I know you don't like it when people state it openly like that but that's what it is (or ethnocide at the very least). So those who will just quietly accept that it is ok to commit something like that, should just think about how they will be perceived.

    And, btw, I'm not worried about the Ukrainians in Poland (or in the Baltic States, in smaller, but still significant numbers). They are at home there. The ones in Western countries should be encouraged to repatriate in due time, hopefully, next year. The families will need to be reunited with their men.

    obviously there are limits to what could be conceded
     
    It is very unseemly when a foreigner talks about "conceding" someone else's land. Talk that way about your own land.

    Another thing that you fail to understand is the life in occupied territory. It is torment. Imagine if part of one German state was occupied by a power that hates you and the people there were tormented, would you just leave them there? The electricity will come back, so will some of the refugees, but why willfully give up territory and leave your kin under a savage occupation? Especially when the military are willing to fight.

    But I don’t see how aiming at some kind of total victory over Russia (whose original goals in this war have already failed btw) is going to lead to anything but disaster.
     
    A "total victory" over Russia can only be completed with the direct participation of the Russian people.
    The baton will be passed on to them and then it will be up to them to decide what they can achieve.

    Russia's original goals failed in this instance but that doesn't mean they won't try again. The Russian society is ill and they cannot help but keep reverting back to their crazy imperial impulses. They do not have a strong enough core. Unless the Russian people themselves change this, this will go on forever. For Ukraine it is a question how this can be mitigated and what security guarantees Ukraine can build long term. Best will be a strong military and good friends.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @German_reader, @Beckow

    We have a real thing in LatW: a die-hard fanatic previously hiding behind more reasonable views. Spilling of blood tends to radicalize…

    On points LatW views are ridiculous: blatant double standards (so Russians in Ukraine were not tormented and murdered? is that ok now?), quoting Kiev propaganda ministry, over-the-top rhetoric, suggesting that “Russians themselves should destroy Russia“…are the Latvians too lazy now?

    To the false history and propaganda a new element is added: drama! The words become more loaded, it is all very existential, the other side is pure evil (“die Russian scum, just die already!!!!“)…

    It is a reflection of what LatW knows and doesn’t want to admit: Russia is playing with Ukies like a cat and mouse, they will clobber them, and the only tiny hope is to dramatize it to such an extent that Nato goes in and maybe we go nuclear. As all drama it is very irresponsible.

    How about just giving Russians normal rights in Ukraine, or follow the Kosovo example and let the malcontents separate. And keep Nato out of there, why do we have to risk everything for Nato to be able to have bases in Ukraine? How can you look at yourself and still pretend that you are normal if you choose more death instead of a very reasonable peaceful solution? Is losing better?

  485. @songbird
    @silviosilver


    >Not sure how realistic the prospects of Turkey joining the EU ever were, but I suppose I should thank Erdogan for helping to sabotage the idea.

    I’m not sure either, but the very fact the idea was ever floated and that they achieved candidate status is disturbing enough.
     
    Agreed. I think it helps take the blinders off about the nature of the regime and about how mass migration into the EU is being promoted by the regime, rather than being something accidental, or not sought after.

    @AnonfromTN

    It is only important as a clear sign of sultan’s stupidity
     
    I know a lot of people predict some Ottoman Empire 2.0 in the coming decades. Personally, I'm kind of skeptical. (If pan-Arabism didn't work out, rule by Turks seems like quite a stretch) Granted they probably have the least bad demographic base in the area (still pretty bad), and control the source of a lot of the water in the Middle East. I still don't see it. More likely Pakistan would move into the Middle East, IMO.

    Replies: @A123

    New EU entry is 99%+ impossible. France, Hungary, Germany, and Poland have all said they will not approve new entrants without “reform”. And, their concepts of reform are 180° diametrically opposed.

    • Populist countries, with European values, demand less Brussels and more VETO rights.

    • Authoritarian countries, with SJW Globalist dogma, want to gut national sovereignty and European values.
    ____

    Erdogan’s intent is hard to fathom. His offensive in Syria creates problems for both Russia and the European Empire. Kurds are abandoning positions needed to counter Daesh to fortify against Turkish aggression.

    There is still a chance that Erdogan will spike Finland & Sweden joining NATO in retaliation for the EU dead end.

    If you want a good lark, PoliticoEU has opened their voting for Most Powerful European leader of 2022.

    https://www.politico.eu/article/poll-who-is-the-most-powerful-person-in-europe/

    I already nominated Viktor Mihály Orbán. Who else has done more to thwart the Berlin/Paris/Davos axis of evil?

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @A123


    Erdogan’s intent is hard to fathom. His offensive in Syria creates problems for both Russia and the European Empire
     
    In fact, sultan bombed Kurd positions (some say telling the US before bombing, so that the US removed its instructors from targeted areas). Putin’s thinking about Kurds is something like “serves them right”. However, sultan cancelled promised ground operation that could have affected Russian and Syrian forces on the ground, as soon as Putin told him to in no uncertain terms. As to Europeans, who asks them?
    , @songbird
    @A123

    At this point, the EU is more likely to contract or collapse than expand, which I suspect is necessary for any kind of reform.


    There is still a chance that Erdogan will spike Finland & Sweden joining NATO
     
    I wish he would. But I don't think he will.
  486. @German_reader
    @LatW


    In fact, a displacement on such a scale could be treated as borderline genocide. I know you don’t like it when people state it openly like that but that’s what it is (or ethnocide at the very least). So those who will just quietly accept that it is ok to commit something like that, should just think about how they will be perceived.
     
    It isn't genocide, stop using such propaganda terms. Nor did I imply it is "ok". The problem with your approach to these matters is that it's extremely normative and moralistic, always about how things ought to be if there were perfect justice, never about weighing potential costs and risks of various courses of action. Of course there can't be peace at any price, a ceasefire wouldn't make any sense if Russia just uses it to regroup and then attack again, but your dogmatic assertion that this war needs to be fought to the bitter end really comes across as rather fanatical (and I'm not convinced either by your claims "But Ukrainians think the same"...maybe in Lviv or among those living abroad, might be different in the regions where the fighting actually takes place).

    It is very unseemly when a foreigner talks about “conceding” someone else’s land. Talk that way about your own land.
     
    You've been told this multiple times before - Ukraine would have no chance at all without Western support, and all of Europe is making immensely painful economic sacrifices because of the war. If Ukrainians want to continue the war until the 2014 borders have been restored (which means taking the war to areas where only land, not people will be "liberated"), ok, their choice, in that event support should be scaled down or even ended.

    Another thing that you fail to understand is the life in occupied territory. It is torment.
     
    For some, and not in all of the occupied areas equally, there seem to be quite a few who are willing to accommodate themselves to Russian rule at least in the Donbass areas taken since February.

    Replies: @LatW, @AnonfromTN

    a ceasefire wouldn’t make any sense if Russia just uses it to regroup and then attack again

    Right, that’s exactly what Russia would do – regroup and then try to attack again (even though the shitheads don’t even have enough winter uniforms, something they should’ve thought about back in August). But for some reason the likes of yourself just keep screeching for this ceasefire – so you know full well what would happen and you still insist on it. Wow, that’s transparent.

    [MORE]

    and I’m not convinced either by your claims “But Ukrainians think the same”…maybe in Lviv or among those living abroad, might be different in the regions where the fighting actually takes place

    It’s been what – 8 years of war now? – and you still come out with deeply uninformed statements like that? Don’t embarrass yourself – you’re not in the loop. Do me a favor before you text me again – open any Ukrainian channel and listen to it for a few hours. I have no time for someone who is that uninformed, it’s just not serious.

    all of Europe is making immensely painful economic sacrifices because of the war

    Do not fucking blame the Ukrainians for this. The Ukrainians didn’t attack anybody. The economic hardships are only partially due to the war. The inflation was going to come either way – it started way BEFORE the war. The inflation is the result of the “quantitative easing” that was performed by the Federal Reserve and the European Central Bank. For years. This is your own doing! Own it.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @LatW


    But for some reason the likes of yourself just keep screeching for this ceasefire – so you know full well what would happen and you still insist on it. Wow, that’s transparent.

     

    Would you please not twist my words?

    The Ukrainians didn’t attack anybody.
     
    They didn't implement the Minsk agreements either, nor did they stop in their attempt at becoming at least a quasi-member of NATO. And at least some in the Ukrainian leadership knew that this would increase the risk of a full-scale war with Russia, as shown in a pretty revealing quote from your hero Arestovych which you posted just a few weeks ago.

    The inflation was going to come either way – it started way BEFORE the war.
     
    You seem to have missed the part where Russian gas shipments stopped (and where *someone* blew up the Nordstream pipelines, to ensure that they can't easily be taken up again).
    Anyway, I think your perception is rather skewed. You don't seem to understand that the support Ukraine has been given can be forfeited, if enough people in Western Europe and the US come to the conclusion that Ukrainian war aims are too extreme and in conflict with one's own core interests. Latvians of course will always have a different perspective, but fortunately you don't matter all that much.
    , @Wokechoke
    @LatW

    Harpie person.

  487. @German_reader
    @LatW


    In fact, a displacement on such a scale could be treated as borderline genocide. I know you don’t like it when people state it openly like that but that’s what it is (or ethnocide at the very least). So those who will just quietly accept that it is ok to commit something like that, should just think about how they will be perceived.
     
    It isn't genocide, stop using such propaganda terms. Nor did I imply it is "ok". The problem with your approach to these matters is that it's extremely normative and moralistic, always about how things ought to be if there were perfect justice, never about weighing potential costs and risks of various courses of action. Of course there can't be peace at any price, a ceasefire wouldn't make any sense if Russia just uses it to regroup and then attack again, but your dogmatic assertion that this war needs to be fought to the bitter end really comes across as rather fanatical (and I'm not convinced either by your claims "But Ukrainians think the same"...maybe in Lviv or among those living abroad, might be different in the regions where the fighting actually takes place).

    It is very unseemly when a foreigner talks about “conceding” someone else’s land. Talk that way about your own land.
     
    You've been told this multiple times before - Ukraine would have no chance at all without Western support, and all of Europe is making immensely painful economic sacrifices because of the war. If Ukrainians want to continue the war until the 2014 borders have been restored (which means taking the war to areas where only land, not people will be "liberated"), ok, their choice, in that event support should be scaled down or even ended.

    Another thing that you fail to understand is the life in occupied territory. It is torment.
     
    For some, and not in all of the occupied areas equally, there seem to be quite a few who are willing to accommodate themselves to Russian rule at least in the Donbass areas taken since February.

    Replies: @LatW, @AnonfromTN

    Your lugenpresse won’t tell you that, but at least 95% of people in Donbass hate Ukies guts. They were occupied by Ukies and liberated from Ukies.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @AnonfromTN

    Can't you see, the idiot believes only Lviv wants to fight. OMG. Deliberately obtuse. Must be so painful for this AfD voter to see Russia lose.

    Replies: @German_reader

  488. @AnonfromTN
    @LatW


    Another thing that you fail to understand is the life in occupied territory. It is torment.
     
    That’s exactly what the people in LPR and DPR say after being liberated from Ukies.

    Replies: @LatW

    All I can say about those populations (purely subjectively without politics), is that their fate is very harsh. They seem to be located on the civilizational plate. Especially in places such as Gorlovka, on the purely human level, they have been dealt out way, way too much.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @LatW

    Ukies shelled residential areas in Donetsk and cities in Donetsk agglomeration, including Gorlovka, since 2014. And keep shelling today using NATO-supplied systems. Your media would lie bout it, but the people on the ground are 100% sure who shells, kills, and maims them. They have no doubt who is their enemy and who is their friend.

  489. @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader

    Your lugenpresse won’t tell you that, but at least 95% of people in Donbass hate Ukies guts. They were occupied by Ukies and liberated from Ukies.

    Replies: @LatW

    Can’t you see, the idiot believes only Lviv wants to fight. OMG. Deliberately obtuse. Must be so painful for this AfD voter to see Russia lose.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @LatW

    I have consistently stated that I don't want Russia to win in Ukraine and that a sovereign Ukrainian state should be preserved. Don't twist my words or misrepresent my position or I will adopt a rather different tone towards you in future. This is my only warning.

  490. @A123
    @songbird

    New EU entry is 99%+ impossible. France, Hungary, Germany, and Poland have all said they will not approve new entrants without "reform". And, their concepts of reform are 180° diametrically opposed.

    • Populist countries, with European values, demand less Brussels and more VETO rights.

    • Authoritarian countries, with SJW Globalist dogma, want to gut national sovereignty and European values.
    ____

    Erdogan's intent is hard to fathom. His offensive in Syria creates problems for both Russia and the European Empire. Kurds are abandoning positions needed to counter Daesh to fortify against Turkish aggression.

    There is still a chance that Erdogan will spike Finland & Sweden joining NATO in retaliation for the EU dead end.

     

    If you want a good lark, PoliticoEU has opened their voting for Most Powerful European leader of 2022.

    https://www.politico.eu/article/poll-who-is-the-most-powerful-person-in-europe/

    I already nominated Viktor Mihály Orbán. Who else has done more to thwart the Berlin/Paris/Davos axis of evil?

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @songbird

    Erdogan’s intent is hard to fathom. His offensive in Syria creates problems for both Russia and the European Empire

    In fact, sultan bombed Kurd positions (some say telling the US before bombing, so that the US removed its instructors from targeted areas). Putin’s thinking about Kurds is something like “serves them right”. However, sultan cancelled promised ground operation that could have affected Russian and Syrian forces on the ground, as soon as Putin told him to in no uncertain terms. As to Europeans, who asks them?

  491. @LatW
    @AnonfromTN

    All I can say about those populations (purely subjectively without politics), is that their fate is very harsh. They seem to be located on the civilizational plate. Especially in places such as Gorlovka, on the purely human level, they have been dealt out way, way too much.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    Ukies shelled residential areas in Donetsk and cities in Donetsk agglomeration, including Gorlovka, since 2014. And keep shelling today using NATO-supplied systems. Your media would lie bout it, but the people on the ground are 100% sure who shells, kills, and maims them. They have no doubt who is their enemy and who is their friend.

  492. German_reader says:
    @LatW
    @German_reader


    a ceasefire wouldn’t make any sense if Russia just uses it to regroup and then attack again
     
    Right, that's exactly what Russia would do - regroup and then try to attack again (even though the shitheads don't even have enough winter uniforms, something they should've thought about back in August). But for some reason the likes of yourself just keep screeching for this ceasefire - so you know full well what would happen and you still insist on it. Wow, that's transparent.

    and I’m not convinced either by your claims “But Ukrainians think the same”…maybe in Lviv or among those living abroad, might be different in the regions where the fighting actually takes place

     

    It's been what - 8 years of war now? - and you still come out with deeply uninformed statements like that? Don't embarrass yourself - you're not in the loop. Do me a favor before you text me again - open any Ukrainian channel and listen to it for a few hours. I have no time for someone who is that uninformed, it's just not serious.

    all of Europe is making immensely painful economic sacrifices because of the war
     
    Do not fucking blame the Ukrainians for this. The Ukrainians didn't attack anybody. The economic hardships are only partially due to the war. The inflation was going to come either way - it started way BEFORE the war. The inflation is the result of the "quantitative easing" that was performed by the Federal Reserve and the European Central Bank. For years. This is your own doing! Own it.

    Replies: @German_reader, @Wokechoke

    But for some reason the likes of yourself just keep screeching for this ceasefire – so you know full well what would happen and you still insist on it. Wow, that’s transparent.

    Would you please not twist my words?

    The Ukrainians didn’t attack anybody.

    They didn’t implement the Minsk agreements either, nor did they stop in their attempt at becoming at least a quasi-member of NATO. And at least some in the Ukrainian leadership knew that this would increase the risk of a full-scale war with Russia, as shown in a pretty revealing quote from your hero Arestovych which you posted just a few weeks ago.

    The inflation was going to come either way – it started way BEFORE the war.

    You seem to have missed the part where Russian gas shipments stopped (and where *someone* blew up the Nordstream pipelines, to ensure that they can’t easily be taken up again).
    Anyway, I think your perception is rather skewed. You don’t seem to understand that the support Ukraine has been given can be forfeited, if enough people in Western Europe and the US come to the conclusion that Ukrainian war aims are too extreme and in conflict with one’s own core interests. Latvians of course will always have a different perspective, but fortunately you don’t matter all that much.

  493. @LatW
    @AnonfromTN

    Can't you see, the idiot believes only Lviv wants to fight. OMG. Deliberately obtuse. Must be so painful for this AfD voter to see Russia lose.

    Replies: @German_reader

    I have consistently stated that I don’t want Russia to win in Ukraine and that a sovereign Ukrainian state should be preserved. Don’t twist my words or misrepresent my position or I will adopt a rather different tone towards you in future. This is my only warning.

  494. @songbird
    @Mikel

    The breed on most tables has changed dramatically since the '50s. Used to be a lot more like wild turkeys (much thinner, more dark meat).

    Replies: @Barbarossa

    White meat turkiye is really only good for sandwiches or meat pies, in my opinion. I’ll eat the dark meat every time. Same with chicken. For the life of me, I don’t know why people are all on about white meat all the time.

    • Replies: @A123
    @Barbarossa


    White meat turkiye is really only good for sandwiches
     
    That is certainly a desired end state.

    However "turkiye"? Really? (groan)


    Same with chicken. For the life of me, I don’t know why people are all on about white meat all the time.
     
    The custom, rapid growth, KFC poultry-ish genetic organism generates tender and flavorful white bits. If the only bird like substance one has consumed is KFC, the preference for white bits is understandable.

    PEACE 😇

    https://youtu.be/i8eHWXooV8c

    Replies: @A123, @Barbarossa

    , @songbird
    @Barbarossa


    For the life of me, I don’t know why people are all on about white meat all the time.
     
    Not sure either. Would guess it is something to do with health nuts (but you need fat to digest protein). Or, maybe, the strange sensitization of the palate that seems to be especially bad among children (who are more sensitive in terms of their receptors. ) I think dark meat is especially good in sandwiches.

    It is kind of unfortunate how more and more people in Europe seem to be giving up goose and duck for turkey.

    White meat turkiye
     
    Been wondering if the umlauts in Turkish are somehow related to the special relationship that they had with Germany, around WWI.

    My technique for Thanksgiving dessert is to not waste caloric space by imbibing any sugar-based drinks. Cranberry sauce, IMO, is horrible on the same plate as the main meal, but is excellent when mixed with pumpkin pie or vanilla ice cream.

    Family tradition is turkey and ham. Never violated for Thanksgiving, but sometimes substituted for beef or other meats on other holidays.

    One thing I always observe is how it is hard to guess the heaviest eaters from their builds.
    ___
    Re: gun rights in Canada: I've heard it speculated that nullification is going to become a thing in Canada (historically hasn't been), and that the more central or rural provinces are rich in natural resources, so they are net contributors and consequently have some levers of power.

    Replies: @Barbarossa

  495. @Mr. Hack
    @Barbarossa


    This morning I made scrambled eggs with sauteed onions, spinach, bacon, and extra sharp chedder cheese, topped with some paprika and finished in the broiler till crisp and bubbly on top.
     
    An easier way, possibly, to get the same "bubbly effect on top" and easier too, is to just add some water to your frying pan and baste the whole "omelette" once it starts to fry nicely, never having to move the pan to your oven. To get the whole creation "crispy" just let the process that I've described continue until most or all of the water evaporates.

    I always go "all out" too, just have a different array of all stars that serve as the base of this miniature feast: onions, bell peppers, hotter peppers, sausage and mushrooms (kind of like a "Denver omelet). Of course, this creation is not a classical omelette in an real sense (very good in its own right), but something a bit more primitive and down to earth. I do end the whole melange with a good sprinkling of shredded cheese, whatever cheese that I seem to have on hand at the time seems to do. And the cheese component helps in achieving the slightly "crispy" texture, if fried/basted long enough, that you appear to appreciate.

    Replies: @Barbarossa

    What I make is usually really more of a frittata. My ingredients constantly change as well based on what we have around.

    I wouldn’t mind trying the water trick, but how do you keep the bottom from burning while waiting for the top to crisp?

    I really like using the broiler for the ability to cook the top of things while not overcooking the bottom. Similarly, if we are making pizza, if the bottom crust is done and the top isn’t sufficiently crisped I’ll throw the broiler on for a couple minutes.

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @Barbarossa

    It's rare that I ever burn the bottom, although it has happened on a couple of occasions. The "trick" is really, I think, just a manner of basting the eggs in the pan. I don't do it immediately, but about half way through the whole frying process. The water should ideally seep through to the bottom of the entire of the pan, but it seldom if ever does. You pour about 1.5 - 2/0 oz of water around the edges of the eggs, and it begins to steam up. Be sure to cover the pan with a cover so that the steam stays inside and does its job. Perhaps your method is better than mine? It's just the timing of getting the oven hot enough to broil the top part is a little confusing to me? And yes, of course, the stars of the feast should rotate depending on what you have available. I made some this morning right after we started this conversation. An onion bagel with some butter and a couple of campari tomatoes embellished the main show. And some good hot coffee to seal the deal.

    Replies: @Barbarossa

  496. @Barbarossa
    @songbird

    White meat turkiye is really only good for sandwiches or meat pies, in my opinion. I'll eat the dark meat every time. Same with chicken. For the life of me, I don't know why people are all on about white meat all the time.

    Replies: @A123, @songbird

    White meat turkiye is really only good for sandwiches

    That is certainly a desired end state.

    However “turkiye”? Really? (groan)

    Same with chicken. For the life of me, I don’t know why people are all on about white meat all the time.

    The custom, rapid growth, KFC poultry-ish genetic organism generates tender and flavorful white bits. If the only bird like substance one has consumed is KFC, the preference for white bits is understandable.

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @A123
    @A123

    ADDENDUM

     
    https://i.pinimg.com/originals/d2/70/3a/d2703a9aeab7188b875a9ba631cb59d4.jpg
     

    PEACE 😇

    , @Barbarossa
    @A123


    However “turkiye”? Really? (groan)
     
    LOL. You'll have to blame songbird for that one. I'm only following his groundbreaking example.
  497. @silviosilver
    @Barbarossa


    Voting in local elections is usually far more effective than any national races.
     
    Assuming "local" means municipal rather than state, describe some of its successes.

    Replies: @Barbarossa, @Barbarossa

    If you have sensible people on the county and local level they can be judicious in the application of state or federal laws regardless of how unhinged those laws are. County sheriffs, being elected are often an important check on nonsense.

    For example, we have lots of gun laws in NY but the local sheriffs are typically forthright that they do not plan on enforcing them, since they know quite well that there are lots of violations and it will only cause trouble to enforce.

    It was the same during Covid madness. The State could make all sorts of strictures but if you had county officials who respected local norms and behavior it was often kept very minimal.

    When I first built on my land I had little money but I built a little 20×20 cabin with no septic, electric, or water for less than 10k on my off grid back-road. Since then, it’s been expanded several times and outfitted like a real house with hot running water and all! The veritable lap of luxury!
    But, at the time I was starting out and had virtually nothing except for the desire to make a start. Naturally what I was doing by living in my hunting camp was not especially legal, especially with a wife and baby, and I had some anxiety that I would be found out.
    Being a small town people figured it out pretty quickly and the reaction was generally encouraging that I was making a go of things rather than disapproving that I didn’t have everything done from the get go. At one point after the fact I remember the building inspector saying, “Well, I don’t think there is a law that says you can’t live in your hunting cabin year round.”

    So, long story short if you have good and sane local officials they will make your life much more reasonable in practice while the opposite may make your life a living hell. My building inspector or town board has had more good impact on my ability to live my life than any number of Trumps or Bidens. You want local officials who treat you like a neighbor and a fellow human being and who will do right by you regardless of the letter of the law. The way things are going, I think that will become more important, not less, going forward.

    • Agree: Sher Singh
  498. @A123
    @Barbarossa


    White meat turkiye is really only good for sandwiches
     
    That is certainly a desired end state.

    However "turkiye"? Really? (groan)


    Same with chicken. For the life of me, I don’t know why people are all on about white meat all the time.
     
    The custom, rapid growth, KFC poultry-ish genetic organism generates tender and flavorful white bits. If the only bird like substance one has consumed is KFC, the preference for white bits is understandable.

    PEACE 😇

    https://youtu.be/i8eHWXooV8c

    Replies: @A123, @Barbarossa

    ADDENDUM

     

     

    PEACE 😇

  499. @AnonfromTN
    @Mikel


    Btw, you also hurt my feelings when I saw that you didn’t include accusations of being a covert Muslim in your tirade against me. I found it unfair that only some commenters get the Islamist treatment from you. What do I have to do to join that club?
     
    Excellent trolling!

    Replies: @A123, @Jazman

    Here is one ” Russian ” guy on Quora he remind me of Navalny
    https://www.quora.com/profile/Misha-Firer?q=misha%20

  500. @Barbarossa
    @songbird

    White meat turkiye is really only good for sandwiches or meat pies, in my opinion. I'll eat the dark meat every time. Same with chicken. For the life of me, I don't know why people are all on about white meat all the time.

    Replies: @A123, @songbird

    For the life of me, I don’t know why people are all on about white meat all the time.

    Not sure either. Would guess it is something to do with health nuts (but you need fat to digest protein). Or, maybe, the strange sensitization of the palate that seems to be especially bad among children (who are more sensitive in terms of their receptors. ) I think dark meat is especially good in sandwiches.

    [MORE]

    It is kind of unfortunate how more and more people in Europe seem to be giving up goose and duck for turkey.

    White meat turkiye

    Been wondering if the umlauts in Turkish are somehow related to the special relationship that they had with Germany, around WWI.

    My technique for Thanksgiving dessert is to not waste caloric space by imbibing any sugar-based drinks. Cranberry sauce, IMO, is horrible on the same plate as the main meal, but is excellent when mixed with pumpkin pie or vanilla ice cream.

    Family tradition is turkey and ham. Never violated for Thanksgiving, but sometimes substituted for beef or other meats on other holidays.

    One thing I always observe is how it is hard to guess the heaviest eaters from their builds.
    ___
    Re: gun rights in Canada: I’ve heard it speculated that nullification is going to become a thing in Canada (historically hasn’t been), and that the more central or rural provinces are rich in natural resources, so they are net contributors and consequently have some levers of power.

    • Replies: @Barbarossa
    @songbird


    sensitization of the palate that seems to be especially bad among children
     
    I have a couple kids that prefer dark meat, one that prefers white and a couple who will go either way. I would guess that the common kid's preference for white meat is more a result of what they are usually fed than anything innate.

    My wife really wants to get a goose for Christmas, but we never check around for one in time so haven't done it yet. I really like duck though, so I would guess I would like goose. The first time I ever had duck was while I was working in the Hudson Valley and a restaurant had a half smoked duck dinner. They raised and smoked the ducks themselves and it was really good!

    hard to guess the heaviest eaters from their builds.
     
    I'd fit in this category. Sometimes people think I don't eat enough, but that is not the case at all. I'm the guy who evaluates the donut selection to pick the one with the highest calorie count. Hopefully I never end up adrift on a lifeboat at sea since I wouldn't last long.

    I don't really ever drink sweet drinks other than apple cider this time of year. I prefer to eat my sugar any day rather than drink it.
  501. @A123
    @songbird

    New EU entry is 99%+ impossible. France, Hungary, Germany, and Poland have all said they will not approve new entrants without "reform". And, their concepts of reform are 180° diametrically opposed.

    • Populist countries, with European values, demand less Brussels and more VETO rights.

    • Authoritarian countries, with SJW Globalist dogma, want to gut national sovereignty and European values.
    ____

    Erdogan's intent is hard to fathom. His offensive in Syria creates problems for both Russia and the European Empire. Kurds are abandoning positions needed to counter Daesh to fortify against Turkish aggression.

    There is still a chance that Erdogan will spike Finland & Sweden joining NATO in retaliation for the EU dead end.

     

    If you want a good lark, PoliticoEU has opened their voting for Most Powerful European leader of 2022.

    https://www.politico.eu/article/poll-who-is-the-most-powerful-person-in-europe/

    I already nominated Viktor Mihály Orbán. Who else has done more to thwart the Berlin/Paris/Davos axis of evil?

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @songbird

    At this point, the EU is more likely to contract or collapse than expand, which I suspect is necessary for any kind of reform.

    There is still a chance that Erdogan will spike Finland & Sweden joining NATO

    I wish he would. But I don’t think he will.

  502. @AnonfromTN
    @showmethereal


    I saw where people in Kherson region were glad at the integration of the healthcare system to Russian standards….
     
    As far as I know (from relatives living in Ukraine), Ukrainian healthcare is now below the level of poor African countries. I have no personal experience with current RF healthcare system. A few years ago during her visit there my wife broke her hand. They set it for free at the local emergency room. When upon return she saw an American doctor, he said that everything was done right, there is nothing else that needs to be done. Considering how much they would charge for that in the US, her good quality free treatment was remarkable.

    I saw many young people in the Donbass region saying it would make it was for them to go to university in Russia. But of course I would assume Russia would want them to return to help develop the region. Correct?
     
    My knowledge in this area is spotty. I know that some years ago Donbass switched to Russian handbooks in schools and colleges and Russia recognized LPR and DPR school and college diplomas (could not do that when they used pathetic Ukrainian handbooks). Young people could go to Russian colleges after school even back then, but there might have been bureaucratic issues. In Russian colleges there are two tracks: tuition is free for those who get good scores on entrance exams, whereas those with poorer (but not failing) scores could get in for a fee (it is still peanuts compared to outrageous tuition costs in the US).

    I know that in the RF the mobilization of college students was prohibited, whereas LPR and DPR mobilized college students. Recently Putin issued a decree that college students in LPR and DPR should be demobilized and return to their studies.

    I think the RF government will provide some incentives for college graduates to return to LPR and DPR (as well as incentives for specialists from other Russian regions to go there), but I don’t think this will be mandatory. After all, now that these are Russian regions, local people have the same rights as all Russian citizens: they are free to go anywhere.

    Replies: @showmethereal, @LondonBob

    Thanks for the insight. I understand geopolitics and I try to read and watch as many “independent” sources as possible. But I always like to know the actually local sources as possible. I know a couple of Russians and yes they both have family in “Ukraine”. Frankly they are more sad than anything because it has caused differences in their own families that live on the Ukrainian side. It’s just sad to me that western Ukraine would turn on their Slavic brethren like that. But yea I did hear healthcare was pretty poor in Ukraine. That’s something I couldn’t understand. Under Putin Russia seemed to re-tool its economy… I failed to understand why Ukraine couldn’t

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @showmethereal


    Under Putin Russia seemed to re-tool its economy… I failed to understand why Ukraine couldn’t
     
    Retooling requires investments. Those whose business model is to steal and run away do not invest. Putin and his team limited what can be stolen. I’m pretty sure that even now maybe 10% of the RF budget ends up in the hands of various thieves. But in Ukraine corruption is on the totally different level: everything gets stolen one way or another. All Ukrainian “presidents” since 1991 were thieves. All of them used primeval nationalism as a fig leaf to cover their thievery. That’s why Ukraine does not have resources to do anything good for the ordinary people.

    In Russia the 1990s were the period of wanton thievery by local and foreign crooks. Then Putin gradually put a stop to it. That’s why foreign and Russian crooks hate him so much. Now the aggrieved Russian thieves and bandits are all in the West, like Khodorkovsky. In contrast to Russia, in Ukraine 1990s never ended.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    , @Mr. Hack
    @showmethereal


    It’s just sad to me that western Ukraine would turn on their Slavic brethren like that.
     
    This sounds like a very naïve characterization of what's going on in Ukraine, especiall for somebody to make who likes to garner his information from "many independent sources as possible" including "local sources' as well? Have you included any local Ukrainian sources to your viewing list (quite frankly, it doesn't sound like you do)?

    Western Ukraine? How do you come up with that? All of the main direction for the war comes from Kyiv in the center, the seat of the national government. Zelensky and the vast majority of his advisors are from all over Ukraine. You sound like you're stuck in some sort of a time warp harpening back to the 1980's?

    Replies: @showmethereal

  503. @silviosilver
    @showmethereal


    I’m not saying the west “has to” take them in. I firmly believe in the God given principle of of reaping and sowing.
     
    Actually, you are saying that. Their entry into the country is the form that the "reaping" takes. No entry, no reaping. All there would be is their desire to entry the country, which would simply be their problem. There is no necessary causal link between their desire to enter and granting them permission to. None whatsoever.

    Replies: @showmethereal, @Coconuts

    Crossing borders illegally has been going on since nations created borders. How do you suppose they could stop such a flood? This flood is a DIRECT result of things these countries did (well NATO collectively). Of course yea Turkiye has spitefully let some through – but I don’t even know why they are in NATO in the first place. But people will always sneak across through land or sea. Now letting them in via quota is a different story. But that’s their guilty conscience and frankly serves them right. The only countries I would feel sorry for are those who refuse to take part.
    Again reaping and sowing is not a Principle of “choice”. It’s part of the created order. You do corruption you reap corruption. Don’t blame me – take it up with the Creator

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @showmethereal


    Crossing borders illegally has been going on since nations created borders. How do you suppose they could stop such a flood?
     
    Shoot them. Evict any that have managed to settle. We shoot people who illegally enter our homes, and our countries are simply our collective homes. In the case of infiltrator arriving by sea, sink their boats and strafe any survivors with machine gun fire. You wouldn't have to shoot many before they got the message. It would quickly expose their lie that they are arriving out of a "life or death" choice. If they were that desperate, they'd take any port any in a storm.

    Perhaps shooting them won't work? Okay fine, it's still worth trying. After all, we have laws against homicide not because we think that will ensure no homicide ever takes place, but because we rightly want to discourage it and punish it when it does. When homicide occurs, we don't throw our hands up in despair and claim that since we're unable to prevent all homicide it's pointless to have laws against it at all.

    I wouldn't have a problem with any country acting this way. People around the world are rightly concerned about a revisionist China throwing its weight around, but if China were to adopt the kind of stance against illegal infiltrators that I outlined above, they would have my complete support.

    Now letting them in via quota is a different story. But that’s their guilty conscience and frankly serves them right.
     
    "Serves them right." Thank you for making your anti-white hostility clear. In stark contrast to you, though I believe China has not always been an innocent little angel, nothing they have ever done would cause me to insist they must demographically obliterate themselves as an act of penitence

    Replies: @Yahya, @Barbarossa, @showmethereal, @German_reader

  504. @LatW
    @showmethereal


    Nor does it get involved in trying to tell other countries what to do in 3rd party squabbles.
     
    Not sure if this is true. Try reading their party newspaper, Global Times. It is full of condescending lecturing towards some Europeans. It mostly makes one laugh (entertaining to read), but to say that they don't care or won't lecture, is not true.

    Replies: @showmethereal

    Global Times does not set policy. Another western fallacy. And an editorial in a newspaper is not at all the same as making secret agreements behind the scenes. Not even remotely. I bet most westerners don’t know a recent editor in chief was a former Tiananmen Square protester. According to westerners they are all dead.
    But to prove my point to you. Go read what Global Times editorial said China “might” do to prevent Pelosi from visiting Taiwan. China didn’t do what’s the editorials said (send military escorts to stop her plane from landing). So no – Global Times does not speak directly for Xi nor the Poliburo. Again – lack of understanding from the west.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @showmethereal


    Global Times does not set policy. Another western fallacy. And an editorial in a newspaper is not at all the same as making secret agreements behind the scenes.
     
    Of course, not, but an editorial in a big newspaper can be important (even though it's less "official" sounding than People's Daily). They definitely have a stance that is somewhat critical towards the West (and I also noticed a few strange assumptions about the European Parliament and a slightly didactic approach about what Europeans should or shouldn't do, what is good or what isn't good for them). But you may be right that it is not intended to be too forceful or far reaching.

    bet most westerners don’t know a recent editor in chief was a former Tiananmen Square protester.
     
    That fact alone doesn't necessarily mean that much, he doesn't appear to be a liberal. And it's not even all that uncommon for some former protesters / dissidents to become hardliners or supporters of the state. He appears to have been a strong propagandist, somewhat of a strong personality, similar to Solovyov in Russia who is a hardliner and strong government propagandist, but also a bit of a free styler (especially lately). But it doesn't mean they are fully independent. It looks like a mix of personal beliefs mixed with state propaganda.

    Replies: @showmethereal

  505. @A123
    @Barbarossa


    White meat turkiye is really only good for sandwiches
     
    That is certainly a desired end state.

    However "turkiye"? Really? (groan)


    Same with chicken. For the life of me, I don’t know why people are all on about white meat all the time.
     
    The custom, rapid growth, KFC poultry-ish genetic organism generates tender and flavorful white bits. If the only bird like substance one has consumed is KFC, the preference for white bits is understandable.

    PEACE 😇

    https://youtu.be/i8eHWXooV8c

    Replies: @A123, @Barbarossa

    However “turkiye”? Really? (groan)

    LOL. You’ll have to blame songbird for that one. I’m only following his groundbreaking example.

  506. @songbird
    @Barbarossa


    For the life of me, I don’t know why people are all on about white meat all the time.
     
    Not sure either. Would guess it is something to do with health nuts (but you need fat to digest protein). Or, maybe, the strange sensitization of the palate that seems to be especially bad among children (who are more sensitive in terms of their receptors. ) I think dark meat is especially good in sandwiches.

    It is kind of unfortunate how more and more people in Europe seem to be giving up goose and duck for turkey.

    White meat turkiye
     
    Been wondering if the umlauts in Turkish are somehow related to the special relationship that they had with Germany, around WWI.

    My technique for Thanksgiving dessert is to not waste caloric space by imbibing any sugar-based drinks. Cranberry sauce, IMO, is horrible on the same plate as the main meal, but is excellent when mixed with pumpkin pie or vanilla ice cream.

    Family tradition is turkey and ham. Never violated for Thanksgiving, but sometimes substituted for beef or other meats on other holidays.

    One thing I always observe is how it is hard to guess the heaviest eaters from their builds.
    ___
    Re: gun rights in Canada: I've heard it speculated that nullification is going to become a thing in Canada (historically hasn't been), and that the more central or rural provinces are rich in natural resources, so they are net contributors and consequently have some levers of power.

    Replies: @Barbarossa

    sensitization of the palate that seems to be especially bad among children

    I have a couple kids that prefer dark meat, one that prefers white and a couple who will go either way. I would guess that the common kid’s preference for white meat is more a result of what they are usually fed than anything innate.

    My wife really wants to get a goose for Christmas, but we never check around for one in time so haven’t done it yet. I really like duck though, so I would guess I would like goose. The first time I ever had duck was while I was working in the Hudson Valley and a restaurant had a half smoked duck dinner. They raised and smoked the ducks themselves and it was really good!

    hard to guess the heaviest eaters from their builds.

    I’d fit in this category. Sometimes people think I don’t eat enough, but that is not the case at all. I’m the guy who evaluates the donut selection to pick the one with the highest calorie count. Hopefully I never end up adrift on a lifeboat at sea since I wouldn’t last long.

    I don’t really ever drink sweet drinks other than apple cider this time of year. I prefer to eat my sugar any day rather than drink it.

    • Thanks: songbird
  507. @showmethereal
    @AnonfromTN

    Thanks for the insight. I understand geopolitics and I try to read and watch as many “independent” sources as possible. But I always like to know the actually local sources as possible. I know a couple of Russians and yes they both have family in “Ukraine”. Frankly they are more sad than anything because it has caused differences in their own families that live on the Ukrainian side. It’s just sad to me that western Ukraine would turn on their Slavic brethren like that. But yea I did hear healthcare was pretty poor in Ukraine. That’s something I couldn’t understand. Under Putin Russia seemed to re-tool its economy… I failed to understand why Ukraine couldn’t

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Mr. Hack

    Under Putin Russia seemed to re-tool its economy… I failed to understand why Ukraine couldn’t

    Retooling requires investments. Those whose business model is to steal and run away do not invest. Putin and his team limited what can be stolen. I’m pretty sure that even now maybe 10% of the RF budget ends up in the hands of various thieves. But in Ukraine corruption is on the totally different level: everything gets stolen one way or another. All Ukrainian “presidents” since 1991 were thieves. All of them used primeval nationalism as a fig leaf to cover their thievery. That’s why Ukraine does not have resources to do anything good for the ordinary people.

    In Russia the 1990s were the period of wanton thievery by local and foreign crooks. Then Putin gradually put a stop to it. That’s why foreign and Russian crooks hate him so much. Now the aggrieved Russian thieves and bandits are all in the West, like Khodorkovsky. In contrast to Russia, in Ukraine 1990s never ended.

    • Agree: dogbumbreath
    • Thanks: showmethereal
    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @AnonfromTN

    The big difference between organized crime in Russia and Ukraine is that Putin has been able to meticulously place all of the oligarchs that are involved in crimes under his direct thumb, whereas in Ukraine no such centralizing of the big oligarchs has ever taken place. In other words, Putler is the supreme godfather of organized crime in Russia. This has been good for Putler, as he undoubtedly shares in all of the profits of the ill gotten gains, and is able to force his underling oligarchs to make large contributions to national projects that he feels are ones worth supporting.

    https://image.cagle.com/248131/750/248131.png

    Putler has been able to put Yanukovych to shame (including gold plated toilets and ostrich farms) as a second tier inteloper, by building his own palace that is estimated to cost $956 million dollars, a super palace complex located on the Black Sea coast near Gelendzhik, Krasnodar Krai, Russia. I don't know how much time will be left for the godfather to enjoy his vision of heaven on earth?

    https://www.syracuse.com/resizer/3WwZCIx6YYLZFkNQ_4q9r-NibEE=/arc-anglerfish-arc2-prod-advancelocal/public/JI72A7PXSJHJFGWISUWV4YLKU4.jpg

    https://s3-eu-central-1.amazonaws.com/cartoons-s3/styles/large/s3/Serhii%20Fedko-4.jpg?itok=AyD9aVvT

    https://image.cagle.com/248395/750/248395.png

    Replies: @Mikhail

  508. @showmethereal
    @LatW

    Global Times does not set policy. Another western fallacy. And an editorial in a newspaper is not at all the same as making secret agreements behind the scenes. Not even remotely. I bet most westerners don’t know a recent editor in chief was a former Tiananmen Square protester. According to westerners they are all dead.
    But to prove my point to you. Go read what Global Times editorial said China “might” do to prevent Pelosi from visiting Taiwan. China didn’t do what’s the editorials said (send military escorts to stop her plane from landing). So no - Global Times does not speak directly for Xi nor the Poliburo. Again - lack of understanding from the west.

    Replies: @LatW

    Global Times does not set policy. Another western fallacy. And an editorial in a newspaper is not at all the same as making secret agreements behind the scenes.

    Of course, not, but an editorial in a big newspaper can be important (even though it’s less “official” sounding than People’s Daily). They definitely have a stance that is somewhat critical towards the West (and I also noticed a few strange assumptions about the European Parliament and a slightly didactic approach about what Europeans should or shouldn’t do, what is good or what isn’t good for them). But you may be right that it is not intended to be too forceful or far reaching.

    [MORE]

    bet most westerners don’t know a recent editor in chief was a former Tiananmen Square protester.

    That fact alone doesn’t necessarily mean that much, he doesn’t appear to be a liberal. And it’s not even all that uncommon for some former protesters / dissidents to become hardliners or supporters of the state. He appears to have been a strong propagandist, somewhat of a strong personality, similar to Solovyov in Russia who is a hardliner and strong government propagandist, but also a bit of a free styler (especially lately). But it doesn’t mean they are fully independent. It looks like a mix of personal beliefs mixed with state propaganda.

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @LatW

    Again what does a newspaper article have to do with officials interfering? You know what an opinion piece bs policy means - right? And he specific… the only thing I read is them telling Europe to stop blindly following the U.S. in its anti China crusade. That is directly about Chinese and European relations- not a 3rd part conflict. It is the exact opposite. Telling Europe to keep a 3rd party out of their own relations

    Replies: @LatW

  509. @Barbarossa
    @Mr. Hack

    What I make is usually really more of a frittata. My ingredients constantly change as well based on what we have around.

    I wouldn't mind trying the water trick, but how do you keep the bottom from burning while waiting for the top to crisp?

    I really like using the broiler for the ability to cook the top of things while not overcooking the bottom. Similarly, if we are making pizza, if the bottom crust is done and the top isn't sufficiently crisped I'll throw the broiler on for a couple minutes.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    It’s rare that I ever burn the bottom, although it has happened on a couple of occasions. The “trick” is really, I think, just a manner of basting the eggs in the pan. I don’t do it immediately, but about half way through the whole frying process. The water should ideally seep through to the bottom of the entire of the pan, but it seldom if ever does. You pour about 1.5 – 2/0 oz of water around the edges of the eggs, and it begins to steam up. Be sure to cover the pan with a cover so that the steam stays inside and does its job. Perhaps your method is better than mine? It’s just the timing of getting the oven hot enough to broil the top part is a little confusing to me? And yes, of course, the stars of the feast should rotate depending on what you have available. I made some this morning right after we started this conversation. An onion bagel with some butter and a couple of campari tomatoes embellished the main show. And some good hot coffee to seal the deal.

    • Replies: @Barbarossa
    @Mr. Hack

    Thanks for the details, I'll have to try it to see which is better. Do you have an actual broiler in your oven? With a top broiler it's not a matter of waiting for the oven to heat up since the food is directly under the flame. If I didn't have a broiler it would take way too long to wait for an oven to heat up.

    I never used the broiler for years, but I've gotten to see it as a great tool.

  510. @showmethereal
    @silviosilver

    Crossing borders illegally has been going on since nations created borders. How do you suppose they could stop such a flood? This flood is a DIRECT result of things these countries did (well NATO collectively). Of course yea Turkiye has spitefully let some through - but I don’t even know why they are in NATO in the first place. But people will always sneak across through land or sea. Now letting them in via quota is a different story. But that’s their guilty conscience and frankly serves them right. The only countries I would feel sorry for are those who refuse to take part.
    Again reaping and sowing is not a Principle of “choice”. It’s part of the created order. You do corruption you reap corruption. Don’t blame me - take it up with the Creator

    Replies: @silviosilver

    Crossing borders illegally has been going on since nations created borders. How do you suppose they could stop such a flood?

    Shoot them. Evict any that have managed to settle. We shoot people who illegally enter our homes, and our countries are simply our collective homes. In the case of infiltrator arriving by sea, sink their boats and strafe any survivors with machine gun fire. You wouldn’t have to shoot many before they got the message. It would quickly expose their lie that they are arriving out of a “life or death” choice. If they were that desperate, they’d take any port any in a storm.

    Perhaps shooting them won’t work? Okay fine, it’s still worth trying. After all, we have laws against homicide not because we think that will ensure no homicide ever takes place, but because we rightly want to discourage it and punish it when it does. When homicide occurs, we don’t throw our hands up in despair and claim that since we’re unable to prevent all homicide it’s pointless to have laws against it at all.

    I wouldn’t have a problem with any country acting this way. People around the world are rightly concerned about a revisionist China throwing its weight around, but if China were to adopt the kind of stance against illegal infiltrators that I outlined above, they would have my complete support.

    Now letting them in via quota is a different story. But that’s their guilty conscience and frankly serves them right.

    “Serves them right.” Thank you for making your anti-white hostility clear. In stark contrast to you, though I believe China has not always been an innocent little angel, nothing they have ever done would cause me to insist they must demographically obliterate themselves as an act of penitence

    • Thanks: S
    • Replies: @Yahya
    @silviosilver


    but if China were to adopt the kind of stance against illegal infiltrators that I outlined above, they would have my complete support.
     
    They would not have mine (not that it matters anyway). Most illegal immigrants to China are North Korean refugees/defectors. China is in large part responsible for the creation and survival of the retarded North Korean regime that has brought famine and deprivation to its people. It used to be bad enough that the CCP supported NK out of a sense of ideological kinship, but now they are just cynically keeping the Kim regime afloat for fear of a reunified Korean peninsula under an American-aligned government. China imo has an obligation to take in defectors who are fleeing the deprivation the CCP is responsible for creating.

    Replies: @showmethereal

    , @Barbarossa
    @silviosilver


    they must demographically obliterate themselves as an act of penitence
     
    Even if one thought that the sins of past people did deserve such a punishment it wouldn't make any sense since all the supposed sinners are dead. It's unjust to punish the sons for the sins of the father.

    I wouldn't support shooting illegal migrants since that is an unnecessary level of violence, but there are plenty of ways to enforce an unequivocal and protectionist immigration policy. It's not as though it's hard to figure out how "refugees" game the system and those loopholes can be shut down. Of course, an equivocal immigration policy is the whole point currently.

    Replies: @A123

    , @showmethereal
    @silviosilver

    When did I claim China was an innocent angel? Stick to the facts. NATO countries caused the problems and so have to deal with it. Simple as that. Shoot all you want and show the world how bloodthirsty you are. Go right ahead.

    Replies: @silviosilver

    , @German_reader
    @silviosilver


    In the case of infiltrator arriving by sea, sink their boats and strafe any survivors with machine gun fire.
     
    Such fantasies are probably counter-productive. There are many other things that could be done, like simply not granting such migrants access to the welfare system. Shut down the NGOs who pick up migrants in the Mediterranean, confiscate their funds and scuttle their boats. If migrants are picked up the Mediterranean, transport them back to the North African coast and disembark them there with food and enough money for traveling back home. If North African countries don't cooperate or are in state collapse like Libya, seize an enclave on the coast with military means. Push back migrants at the EU's borders (and yes, if they're getting violent, then they can and should be shot as a measure of last resort).
    Of course none of this will be done, because the political establishment wants this migration to happen, but if the political will were there, much could be done.

    Replies: @Beckow, @Yahya, @silviosilver

  511. @silviosilver
    @showmethereal


    Crossing borders illegally has been going on since nations created borders. How do you suppose they could stop such a flood?
     
    Shoot them. Evict any that have managed to settle. We shoot people who illegally enter our homes, and our countries are simply our collective homes. In the case of infiltrator arriving by sea, sink their boats and strafe any survivors with machine gun fire. You wouldn't have to shoot many before they got the message. It would quickly expose their lie that they are arriving out of a "life or death" choice. If they were that desperate, they'd take any port any in a storm.

    Perhaps shooting them won't work? Okay fine, it's still worth trying. After all, we have laws against homicide not because we think that will ensure no homicide ever takes place, but because we rightly want to discourage it and punish it when it does. When homicide occurs, we don't throw our hands up in despair and claim that since we're unable to prevent all homicide it's pointless to have laws against it at all.

    I wouldn't have a problem with any country acting this way. People around the world are rightly concerned about a revisionist China throwing its weight around, but if China were to adopt the kind of stance against illegal infiltrators that I outlined above, they would have my complete support.

    Now letting them in via quota is a different story. But that’s their guilty conscience and frankly serves them right.
     
    "Serves them right." Thank you for making your anti-white hostility clear. In stark contrast to you, though I believe China has not always been an innocent little angel, nothing they have ever done would cause me to insist they must demographically obliterate themselves as an act of penitence

    Replies: @Yahya, @Barbarossa, @showmethereal, @German_reader

    but if China were to adopt the kind of stance against illegal infiltrators that I outlined above, they would have my complete support.

    They would not have mine (not that it matters anyway). Most illegal immigrants to China are North Korean refugees/defectors. China is in large part responsible for the creation and survival of the retarded North Korean regime that has brought famine and deprivation to its people. It used to be bad enough that the CCP supported NK out of a sense of ideological kinship, but now they are just cynically keeping the Kim regime afloat for fear of a reunified Korean peninsula under an American-aligned government. China imo has an obligation to take in defectors who are fleeing the deprivation the CCP is responsible for creating.

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @Yahya

    False history. The Kim’s were put in power by the Soviets. Korea was divided by the U.S. and Soviets. Where did you get your history??? Why do people on here just make things up? China saved the Kim’s only because it didn’t want the US at its border. North Korea remained a Soviet client state.

    Replies: @Yahya

  512. @LatW
    @Mikel


    Do you think that if Ukraine takes back Crimea the Russians will never come back again? The contrary looks much more likely.
     
    Please, see my post above. They always come back. It's been that way since the 5th century or so. Only one solution - Israel. Not Finland, not Switzerland. Israel.

    Short of marching to Moscow and dismembering the Russian state, I don’t know how Ukrainians can prevent their children from having to fight Russia in the future.
     
    As I said above, the Russians themselves have to march to Moscow. Ukraine will stop on its borders, then pass the baton on to the Russians. If they have enough strength (which I highly doubt).

    Alternatively, they can enjoy a "beautiful" life under Prigozhin's sledgehammer. (Look that up).

    Ukraine deserves to be independent from Moscow, now more than ever.
     
    That's not how this works. One doesn't "deserve" something out of the blue. One has to fight for it. As the Ukrainian people have done for hundreds of years now.

    When Musk proposed this he was met with abuse in Kiev though.
     
    It is way too late for those solutions now. Such a plan will also be rejected by the Russian side long term (although they are desperate for an agreement so that they can at least keep the current gains). No, it's too late. It is in the hands of the Ukrainian military now.

    Replies: @Yahya, @Mikel, @Dmitry

    Only one solution – Israel. Not Finland, not Switzerland. Israel.

    You mean that Ukraine should shamelessly attack each and every one of their neighbors; greedily grab more and more of their land; subject native minorities to an apartheid system; ruthlessly concoct plans to destroy their geopolitical opponents without having qualms about its impact on ordinary people of those countries; several of which have multiple times more people than a small nation like Israel; and then illegally build nuclear weapons, triggering an arms race in a region that was previously free of such destructive weapons? In short, become the douchiest, most assholic nation in the planet, hated by billions around the globe. Good idea, much better than Finland or Switzerland.

    • Agree: AnonfromTN
    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Yahya

    Concise!

  513. @Mr. Hack
    @Barbarossa

    It's rare that I ever burn the bottom, although it has happened on a couple of occasions. The "trick" is really, I think, just a manner of basting the eggs in the pan. I don't do it immediately, but about half way through the whole frying process. The water should ideally seep through to the bottom of the entire of the pan, but it seldom if ever does. You pour about 1.5 - 2/0 oz of water around the edges of the eggs, and it begins to steam up. Be sure to cover the pan with a cover so that the steam stays inside and does its job. Perhaps your method is better than mine? It's just the timing of getting the oven hot enough to broil the top part is a little confusing to me? And yes, of course, the stars of the feast should rotate depending on what you have available. I made some this morning right after we started this conversation. An onion bagel with some butter and a couple of campari tomatoes embellished the main show. And some good hot coffee to seal the deal.

    Replies: @Barbarossa

    Thanks for the details, I’ll have to try it to see which is better. Do you have an actual broiler in your oven? With a top broiler it’s not a matter of waiting for the oven to heat up since the food is directly under the flame. If I didn’t have a broiler it would take way too long to wait for an oven to heat up.

    I never used the broiler for years, but I’ve gotten to see it as a great tool.

    • Thanks: Mr. Hack
  514. @silviosilver
    @showmethereal


    Crossing borders illegally has been going on since nations created borders. How do you suppose they could stop such a flood?
     
    Shoot them. Evict any that have managed to settle. We shoot people who illegally enter our homes, and our countries are simply our collective homes. In the case of infiltrator arriving by sea, sink their boats and strafe any survivors with machine gun fire. You wouldn't have to shoot many before they got the message. It would quickly expose their lie that they are arriving out of a "life or death" choice. If they were that desperate, they'd take any port any in a storm.

    Perhaps shooting them won't work? Okay fine, it's still worth trying. After all, we have laws against homicide not because we think that will ensure no homicide ever takes place, but because we rightly want to discourage it and punish it when it does. When homicide occurs, we don't throw our hands up in despair and claim that since we're unable to prevent all homicide it's pointless to have laws against it at all.

    I wouldn't have a problem with any country acting this way. People around the world are rightly concerned about a revisionist China throwing its weight around, but if China were to adopt the kind of stance against illegal infiltrators that I outlined above, they would have my complete support.

    Now letting them in via quota is a different story. But that’s their guilty conscience and frankly serves them right.
     
    "Serves them right." Thank you for making your anti-white hostility clear. In stark contrast to you, though I believe China has not always been an innocent little angel, nothing they have ever done would cause me to insist they must demographically obliterate themselves as an act of penitence

    Replies: @Yahya, @Barbarossa, @showmethereal, @German_reader

    they must demographically obliterate themselves as an act of penitence

    Even if one thought that the sins of past people did deserve such a punishment it wouldn’t make any sense since all the supposed sinners are dead. It’s unjust to punish the sons for the sins of the father.

    I wouldn’t support shooting illegal migrants since that is an unnecessary level of violence, but there are plenty of ways to enforce an unequivocal and protectionist immigration policy. It’s not as though it’s hard to figure out how “refugees” game the system and those loopholes can be shut down. Of course, an equivocal immigration policy is the whole point currently.

    • Replies: @A123
    @Barbarossa


    I wouldn’t support shooting illegal migrants since that is an unnecessary level of violence, but there are plenty of ways to enforce an unequivocal and protectionist immigration policy. It’s not as though it’s hard to figure out how “refugees” game the system and those loopholes can be shut down.
     
    In the U.S. there are some changes that would provide immediate relief.

    • No social safety net programs. Get sick, medically stabilized & sent home.

    • No citizenship based on "drop location". The idea of birthright citizenship is *NOT* in the Constitution. It is an obvious SJW misinterpretation of protections only intended to apply to emancipated slaves.

    • Severe sanctions for hiring illegals even if the worker is a contractor. The illegal gets sent home, and the company enters "correction" with increasing penalties for future violations.
    ___

    People do not remember when seasonal workers were highly effective & not disruptive. They left their wife and kids in Mexico. Stayed for only 4-6 months. Moved with the work, usually harvesting of some kind. And, then returned home with earnings that provided good purchasing power. The goal was keeping their primary life where goods & services were much cheaper.

    Providing no effective migrant worker "visa" for this cycle accidentally motivated permanent illegals. Combating drug and other smuggling skyrocketed the cost to travel back and forth undocumented. Workers with seasonal employment could not afford to go home regularly, so they paid the one-time cost to bring their families across illegally. That created a new path to citizenship and heavily burdens social services off season in certain communities.


    Of course, an equivocal immigration policy is the whole point currently.
     
    And, it is not just illegals & refugees. The excessively large H1B/OPT visa boondoggle has decimated wages for entry level jobs in certain industries. As a result, qualified U.S. citizens pursue other degrees. Decontaminating K-12 schools and fixing university admissions would also help.

    A key part of MAGA Reindustrialization is greatly reducing these H1B/OPT programs along with aggressive reshoring efforts. Once there is a career path, Americans will fill those degree tracks again.

    The same logic applies in skilled labor jobs. Americans will work hard for good pay. However, there is little motivation when the competition is illegal day labourers collecting $5/hr.
    ___

    Anti-offshoring will need serious enforcement so those measures have teeth. Simply starting with a $1/hr fee for every offshore worker or contractor would be a good start. Ratcheting it up annually funds the U.S. Government and motivates paying U.S. citizens to avoid the surcharge. By the time it reaches $5/hr, huge amounts of work will be brought back.

    There can be finesse for work the U.S. does not want. There is little national security downside to socks being made in Bangladesh.

    PEACE 😇

  515. @showmethereal
    @AnonfromTN

    Thanks for the insight. I understand geopolitics and I try to read and watch as many “independent” sources as possible. But I always like to know the actually local sources as possible. I know a couple of Russians and yes they both have family in “Ukraine”. Frankly they are more sad than anything because it has caused differences in their own families that live on the Ukrainian side. It’s just sad to me that western Ukraine would turn on their Slavic brethren like that. But yea I did hear healthcare was pretty poor in Ukraine. That’s something I couldn’t understand. Under Putin Russia seemed to re-tool its economy… I failed to understand why Ukraine couldn’t

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Mr. Hack

    It’s just sad to me that western Ukraine would turn on their Slavic brethren like that.

    This sounds like a very naïve characterization of what’s going on in Ukraine, especiall for somebody to make who likes to garner his information from “many independent sources as possible” including “local sources’ as well? Have you included any local Ukrainian sources to your viewing list (quite frankly, it doesn’t sound like you do)?

    Western Ukraine? How do you come up with that? All of the main direction for the war comes from Kyiv in the center, the seat of the national government. Zelensky and the vast majority of his advisors are from all over Ukraine. You sound like you’re stuck in some sort of a time warp harpening back to the 1980’s?

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @Mr. Hack

    What is naive? Since you think you know so much explain…. Most the Ukrainian sources I see on the internet are junk.
    And what are questioning about the difference of western Ukraine? I’m pretty sure by now you have heard of groups like the Right Sector - let alone the Azov. I only became interested in Ukraine in 2014. 1) I knew it was going to turn into a disaster when I saw Nuland and gang playing puppet master 2) I wondered what type of psychopaths would attack gov buildings or would chase people into a building and set it on fire as happened in Odessa.

    And I experientially only know 1 Ukrainian. Nice woman. Except she is very arrogant toward Russians. Never made sense to me - especially since she lives in what you would call a third world country and says she preferred it to conditions in her native Ukraine - and this was before the conflagrations

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

  516. @showmethereal
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    Change your fake name. As someone else outed you - you are nothing but a rabid anti Chinese. What does any of that have to do with football and sports overall. Sorry if it hurts your feelings but it is a fact Japan is an occupied country and so loves the past time of its captors.

    And China has never been scared of Russia. Even the Soviets would tell you that. To say so makes you look like an idiot. Fact is China and Russia solved their issues. They have no animosity. Only idiots like yourself who are upset that China passed Japan again - as was the case through the majority of human history. Chinese don’t want to play baseball - and neither does the vast majority of the world. Japan is still ahead in football…. For a little while. Will you cry if/when they pass Japan as they have in Olympic sports?

    Fact is East Asians do not have the genetics to dominate in football. Nor do they in basketball. That’s just reality. That was the original argument. Japan is a rich country with a huge population. Making it to the quarter finals is actually not a huge achievement- except the fact East Asians are not expected to be good. Kind of like Chinese NBA players. Put salt in your rabid anti China wounds. It hurts but it will heal you

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    As someone else outed you

    Who are you referring to? Name his name and I’ll address him directly.

    I’m anti-:

    – Death by a thousand cuts

    – Opium addiction

    – Eunuch bureaucracy

    – Female infanticide, footbinding

    – Massive civil wars and depopulation events

    – Massive famines and occurrence of cannibalism, euphemized as “two-legged goat” (https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/兩腳羊)

    – “When you conceal your will from others, that is Thick. When you impose your will on others, that is Black (Dark).” (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thick_Black_Theory)

    – “being anti-America is work, living in America is life” (反美是工作、留美是生活).[11] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sima_Nan)

    If that makes me anti-China then I’m anti-China.

    Fact is China and Russia solved their issues. They have no animosity.

    Good, I hope that relationship goes better than it did last time.

    Stalin and Kim started the Korean War that ended in nearly a million Chinese casualties. After Great Leap Forward, Cultural Revolution, Sino-Soviet Split, Deng had to come to Japan and give the saikeirei 最敬礼 “the most respectful gesture” to the Hinomaru 日の丸.

    • Replies: @A123
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    Is Xi leading the country into a Great Leap Backwards with his ZERO COVID policies?

    They are failing around the entire country. (1)


    Protests have erupted in Beijing and the far western Xinjiang region over COVID-19 lockdowns and a deadly fire on Thursday in a high-rise building in Urumqi that killed 10 people (with some reports putting the number as high as 40).
     
    It is hard to blame problems in Xinjiang on mythical, unspecific Western interference. How many people commenting here knew that there was a city named Urumqi in China before this story broke?
    ___

    Production of goods is collapsing. For example: (2)

    Foxconn Riot Could Cut China iPhone Production By More Than 30%

    Apple's top manufacturing partner, Foxconn Technology Group, is set to see November iPhone shipments from a massive factory in Zhengzhou, China, known as iPhone City, plunge after a week of unrest, Reuters said, citing a source with direct knowledge of the matter.

    They said iPhone production would be slashed by more than 30% at Foxconn's Zhengzhou plant in November versus an earlier estimate of up to 30% when problems at the factory began in late October.
     
    Can anybody justify Xi's authoritarian lockdown (a.k.a. imprisonment) mandates as necessary in terms of science & evidence?
    ___

    The European WEF just embraced China as a model (3). That is akin to the Godfather administering The Kiss of Death. If core SJW European leaders want something, you know that it is a fiasco.

    What more is needed to show that Xi is personally taking China down the wrong path?

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.zerohedge.com/covid-19/covid-lockdown-protests-erupt-beijing-xinjiang-after-deadly-fire

    (2) https://www.zerohedge.com/technology/foxconn-riot-could-cut-china-iphone-production-more-30

    (3) https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/mask-wefs-klaus-schwab-declares-china-role-model
    , @showmethereal
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    You would see the comment clearly they said it to you if you weren’t rabid in your anti China nonsense.
    Mock at history all you want - history is going back to what it has normally been in Asia for much of history. You can’t hide under the US skirt forever. Just pray for yourself that man mg don’t want to settle any blood debt. (But you probably aren’t even Japanese but an American who got obsessed with Japan from watching anime).
    Pride always comes before a fall. You will look at smart as you did when Costa Rica just beat Japan at the World Cup. What’s that you were saying about idiots and not knowing sports???

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

  517. @silviosilver
    @showmethereal


    I’m not saying the west “has to” take them in. I firmly believe in the God given principle of of reaping and sowing.
     
    Actually, you are saying that. Their entry into the country is the form that the "reaping" takes. No entry, no reaping. All there would be is their desire to entry the country, which would simply be their problem. There is no necessary causal link between their desire to enter and granting them permission to. None whatsoever.

    Replies: @showmethereal, @Coconuts

    Actually, you are saying that. Their entry into the country is the form that the “reaping” takes. No entry, no reaping. All there would be is their desire to entry the country, which would simply be their problem. There is no necessary causal link between their desire to enter and granting them permission to. None whatsoever.

    Maybe there is a more ‘value free’ analysis available:

    If a country has a certain political system and a certain set of values and a particular situation arises (say the mass arrival of refugees), the effect will be to some extent predictable. This would mean the people responsible for planning actions which might give rise to large movements of refugees should also think about possible impacts further down the line. I would guess they understand this now much better than they did in the 2000s (but perhaps not).

    “Serves them right.” Thank you for making your anti-white hostility clear. In stark contrast to you, though I believe China has not always been an innocent little angel, nothing they have ever done would cause me to insist they must demographically obliterate themselves as an act of penitence

    From a Chinese point of view European nations taking in lots of refugees and immigrants from Africa and MENA could be beneficial in the long run. Major demographic change should make them less stable, less powerful, possibly more open to manipulation by outside great powers if the need arises (e.g. by stoking racial tensions).

    Adding cynicism about the motivation of Germany, Austria, Nordic countries around the refugee issue does seem pretty anti-white.

    I think relatively retarded attempts to explain racism and colonialism as having mainly cultural causes may encourage this. If it was all supposedly down to the influence of Aristotle, Plato, Christianity and 19th century positivist science combined with having a European phenotype, then all Europeans from Ireland to the Baltics, Portugal to Bulgaria and Ukraine are equally ‘guilty’ of whiteness, colonialism etc. by sharing broadly the same physical characteristics and a similar intellectual inheritance.

  518. @Yahya
    @LatW


    Only one solution – Israel. Not Finland, not Switzerland. Israel.
     
    You mean that Ukraine should shamelessly attack each and every one of their neighbors; greedily grab more and more of their land; subject native minorities to an apartheid system; ruthlessly concoct plans to destroy their geopolitical opponents without having qualms about its impact on ordinary people of those countries; several of which have multiple times more people than a small nation like Israel; and then illegally build nuclear weapons, triggering an arms race in a region that was previously free of such destructive weapons? In short, become the douchiest, most assholic nation in the planet, hated by billions around the globe. Good idea, much better than Finland or Switzerland.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    Concise!

  519. @German_reader
    Trump apparently had dinner with Kanye West and Nick Fuentes:
    https://www.axios.com/2022/11/25/trump-nick-fuentes-ye-kanye

    A source familiar with the conversation told Axios Trump took a phone call during the dinner, and his demeanor toward Ye seemed to change when he got off the call. Trump made some nasty comments about Ye's ex-wife, Kim Kardashian, and told the rapper to pass them on.
    Ye, who has lost major sponsorships over his anti-Semitism and recent far-right associations, has said he wants to run for president in 2024. The rapper claims Trump started "screaming" at him at the dinner and told him he would lose — "most perturbed" by Ye asking Trump to be his running mate.
     

    What they're saying: "Kanye West very much wanted to visit Mar-a-Lago. Our dinner meeting was intended to be Kanye and me only, but he arrived with a guest whom I had never met and knew nothing about," Trump said in a statement.
    A Trump spokesman did not provide comment on additional reporting about the dinner. Fuentes did not immediately respond to requests for comment.
    Behind the scenes: A source familiar with the dinner conversation told Axios that Trump "seemed very taken" with Fuentes, impressed that the 24-year-old was able to rattle off statistics and recall speeches dating back to his 2016 campaign.
    Paraphrasing the conversation, the source said Fuentes told the president he preferred him to be "authentic," and that Trump seemed scripted and unlike himself during his recent 2024 campaign announcement speech.
    Trump responded, “You like it better when I just speak off the cuff," the source said. Fuentes replied that he did, calling Trump an "amazing" president when he was unrestrained. "There was a lot of fawning back and forth," the source added.
    Fuentes told Trump that he represented a side of Trump's base that was disappointed with his newly cautious approach, especially with what some far-right activists view as a lack of support for those charged in the Jan. 6 Capitol attack.
    Trump didn't disagree with Fuentes, but said he has advisers who want him to read off teleprompters and be more "presidential." Notably, Trump referred to himself as a politician, which he has been loathe to do in the past.
    Fuentes also told Trump that he would crush potential 2024 Republican rivals in a primary, including Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis. Trump asked for Fuentes' opinion on other candidates as well.
    Trump at one point turned to Ye and said, "I really like this guy. He gets me," according to the source.
     
    Since Jared failed so badly in 2020, maybe Andrew Anglin can become Trump's campaign manager for 2024.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @S, @songbird

    It is a pity that we will never know what Trump said about Kim Kardashian.

  520. @AnonfromTN
    @showmethereal


    Under Putin Russia seemed to re-tool its economy… I failed to understand why Ukraine couldn’t
     
    Retooling requires investments. Those whose business model is to steal and run away do not invest. Putin and his team limited what can be stolen. I’m pretty sure that even now maybe 10% of the RF budget ends up in the hands of various thieves. But in Ukraine corruption is on the totally different level: everything gets stolen one way or another. All Ukrainian “presidents” since 1991 were thieves. All of them used primeval nationalism as a fig leaf to cover their thievery. That’s why Ukraine does not have resources to do anything good for the ordinary people.

    In Russia the 1990s were the period of wanton thievery by local and foreign crooks. Then Putin gradually put a stop to it. That’s why foreign and Russian crooks hate him so much. Now the aggrieved Russian thieves and bandits are all in the West, like Khodorkovsky. In contrast to Russia, in Ukraine 1990s never ended.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    The big difference between organized crime in Russia and Ukraine is that Putin has been able to meticulously place all of the oligarchs that are involved in crimes under his direct thumb, whereas in Ukraine no such centralizing of the big oligarchs has ever taken place. In other words, Putler is the supreme godfather of organized crime in Russia. This has been good for Putler, as he undoubtedly shares in all of the profits of the ill gotten gains, and is able to force his underling oligarchs to make large contributions to national projects that he feels are ones worth supporting.

    Putler has been able to put Yanukovych to shame (including gold plated toilets and ostrich farms) as a second tier inteloper, by building his own palace that is estimated to cost $956 million dollars, a super palace complex located on the Black Sea coast near Gelendzhik, Krasnodar Krai, Russia. I don’t know how much time will be left for the godfather to enjoy his vision of heaven on earth?

    [MORE]

    • Replies: @Mikhail
    @Mr. Hack

    All the talk of corruption on Russia is pure projection. The US outspends the next seven leading countries in defense combined. Five of the ten leading countries in that category are NATO members. Russia ranks behind the US, China, Saudi Arabia and if I'm not offhand mistaken India in defense spending. Yet, the US MIC is unable to produce the weapons the corrupt, undemocratic and neo-Nazi influenced Kiev regime needs to have a better chance at success.

    The US government assigns more of a role for IRS agents to monitor the money matters of individual Americans, while being comparatively lax on the announced aid going to the Kiev regime.

    Shifting gears a bit -

    https://www.rt.com/news/567271-ex-reagan-admin-staffer-ukraine-russia/


    Despite public statements to the contrary, the administration of US President Joe Biden is not at all concerned about the plight of Ukrainians and is prepared to sacrifice the nation on the altar of weakening Russia, an official who served under Ronald Reagan believes.

    Paul Craig Roberts, who was assistant secretary of the Treasury for Economic Policy in the 1980s, also alleged that the Russian military had until recently been refraining from unleashing all of its might on Ukraine.

    In a piece published on his website on Friday and titled ‘It Seems Russia Won’t Require a Winter Offensive to Win the War’, Roberts said that Moscow’s latest missile strikes targeting critical infrastructure across Ukraine are a sign that the Kremlin “finally realized that Russia is at war.”

    According to the former official, for eight months since the start of its military campaign, Russia had been “protecting Ukraine from attack, thus helping Ukraine to conduct war against the Russian forces.”

    Despite that alleged strategy now having been revised, Russia still does not want to “destroy everything unless the West and its puppet Ukraine government fail to come to their senses.”
    Power boss urges Ukrainians to leave the country READ MORE: Power boss urges Ukrainians to leave the country

    The reason Moscow decided to spare its neighbor, Roberts argued, is that “Ukraine and the population there have been a part of Russia for centuries.”

    Moreover, having a poverty-stricken, bombed-out country on its border is not in Russia’s own interest, the ex-Treasury official said.

    However, “from Washington’s standpoint, the more Ukraine is destroyed the better,” Roberts alleged, explaining that such an outcome would end up being an “economic and financial drain on Russia.” He also insisted that the US leadership does not care about the price the Ukrainians would have to pay in such a scenario.

    “It is unjust that it is Ukraine that is paying the cost of Western inhumanity and not Washington and the European capitals,” Roberts wrote.

    He went on to lay into the “Western whore media,” accusing them of failing to report the true situation on the front lines. Reports of Russia’s heavy losses and imminent defeat are all totally misleading, he insisted.

    He warned that “such absurd propaganda” and underestimation of Russia’s military capabilities could see the US and NATO becoming directly involved in the conflict, thus provoking World War III.

    Since the start of Russia’s military operation in Ukraine, the West has been providing Kiev with massive assistance both in terms of weapons and money. Moscow has repeatedly warned that arms shipments will only prolong the conflict and increase the risk of a direct confrontation between Russia and NATO. A number of top Russian officials, including Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov, have accused the bloc of waging war against Russia “by proxy,” while President Vladimir Putin has described his country as fighting “the entire Western military machine.”

     

  521. @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @showmethereal


    As someone else outed you
     
    Who are you referring to? Name his name and I'll address him directly.

    I'm anti-:

    - Death by a thousand cuts

    - Opium addiction

    - Eunuch bureaucracy

    - Female infanticide, footbinding

    - Massive civil wars and depopulation events

    - Massive famines and occurrence of cannibalism, euphemized as “two-legged goat” (https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/兩腳羊)

    - "When you conceal your will from others, that is Thick. When you impose your will on others, that is Black (Dark)." (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thick_Black_Theory)

    - "being anti-America is work, living in America is life" (反美是工作、留美是生活).[11] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sima_Nan)

    If that makes me anti-China then I'm anti-China.

    Fact is China and Russia solved their issues. They have no animosity.
     
    Good, I hope that relationship goes better than it did last time.

    Stalin and Kim started the Korean War that ended in nearly a million Chinese casualties. After Great Leap Forward, Cultural Revolution, Sino-Soviet Split, Deng had to come to Japan and give the saikeirei 最敬礼 “the most respectful gesture” to the Hinomaru 日の丸.

    https://i.postimg.cc/G3svHXhx/t9r7chbkh2o71.jpg

    Replies: @A123, @showmethereal

    Is Xi leading the country into a Great Leap Backwards with his ZERO COVID policies?

    They are failing around the entire country. (1)

    Protests have erupted in Beijing and the far western Xinjiang region over COVID-19 lockdowns and a deadly fire on Thursday in a high-rise building in Urumqi that killed 10 people (with some reports putting the number as high as 40).

    It is hard to blame problems in Xinjiang on mythical, unspecific Western interference. How many people commenting here knew that there was a city named Urumqi in China before this story broke?
    ___

    Production of goods is collapsing. For example: (2)

    Foxconn Riot Could Cut China iPhone Production By More Than 30%

    Apple’s top manufacturing partner, Foxconn Technology Group, is set to see November iPhone shipments from a massive factory in Zhengzhou, China, known as iPhone City, plunge after a week of unrest, Reuters said, citing a source with direct knowledge of the matter.

    They said iPhone production would be slashed by more than 30% at Foxconn’s Zhengzhou plant in November versus an earlier estimate of up to 30% when problems at the factory began in late October.

    Can anybody justify Xi’s authoritarian lockdown (a.k.a. imprisonment) mandates as necessary in terms of science & evidence?
    ___

    The European WEF just embraced China as a model (3). That is akin to the Godfather administering The Kiss of Death. If core SJW European leaders want something, you know that it is a fiasco.

    What more is needed to show that Xi is personally taking China down the wrong path?

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.zerohedge.com/covid-19/covid-lockdown-protests-erupt-beijing-xinjiang-after-deadly-fire

    (2) https://www.zerohedge.com/technology/foxconn-riot-could-cut-china-iphone-production-more-30

    (3) https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/mask-wefs-klaus-schwab-declares-china-role-model

  522. Trudeau is a tranny.

    [MORE]

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @songbird


    Trudeau is a tranny.
     
    Whether true or not, that’s irrelevant. What relevant is that he is a pathetic nonentity subservient to the empire.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @songbird, @Mr. Hack

    , @Barbarossa
    @songbird

    Ya know, just when I think it's already reached peak ClownWorld. I would like to think that this would destroy political capital, but that is probably overly optimistic.

    Right now I'm reading the recollections of Geronimo and it seems as though a couple quotes from that should counteract the baleful presence of Justin the Tranny.

    "If an Apache had allowed his aged parents to suffer for food or shelter if he had neglected or abused the sick, if he had profaned our religion, or had been unfaithful, he might be banished from the tribe."

    "The interpreter came alone and said that Geronimo was very sick with cold and fever. He had come to tell me that that we must appoint another date, as he feared that the old warrior had an attack of pneumonia...In a moment I realized the old chief riding furiously (evidently trying to to arrive as soon as the interpreter did), his horse flecked with foam and reeling from exhaustion. Dismounting he came in and said in a hoarse whisper , "I promised to come. I am here."

  523. @Mr. Hack
    @AnonfromTN

    The big difference between organized crime in Russia and Ukraine is that Putin has been able to meticulously place all of the oligarchs that are involved in crimes under his direct thumb, whereas in Ukraine no such centralizing of the big oligarchs has ever taken place. In other words, Putler is the supreme godfather of organized crime in Russia. This has been good for Putler, as he undoubtedly shares in all of the profits of the ill gotten gains, and is able to force his underling oligarchs to make large contributions to national projects that he feels are ones worth supporting.

    https://image.cagle.com/248131/750/248131.png

    Putler has been able to put Yanukovych to shame (including gold plated toilets and ostrich farms) as a second tier inteloper, by building his own palace that is estimated to cost $956 million dollars, a super palace complex located on the Black Sea coast near Gelendzhik, Krasnodar Krai, Russia. I don't know how much time will be left for the godfather to enjoy his vision of heaven on earth?

    https://www.syracuse.com/resizer/3WwZCIx6YYLZFkNQ_4q9r-NibEE=/arc-anglerfish-arc2-prod-advancelocal/public/JI72A7PXSJHJFGWISUWV4YLKU4.jpg

    https://s3-eu-central-1.amazonaws.com/cartoons-s3/styles/large/s3/Serhii%20Fedko-4.jpg?itok=AyD9aVvT

    https://image.cagle.com/248395/750/248395.png

    Replies: @Mikhail

    All the talk of corruption on Russia is pure projection. The US outspends the next seven leading countries in defense combined. Five of the ten leading countries in that category are NATO members. Russia ranks behind the US, China, Saudi Arabia and if I’m not offhand mistaken India in defense spending. Yet, the US MIC is unable to produce the weapons the corrupt, undemocratic and neo-Nazi influenced Kiev regime needs to have a better chance at success.

    The US government assigns more of a role for IRS agents to monitor the money matters of individual Americans, while being comparatively lax on the announced aid going to the Kiev regime.

    Shifting gears a bit –

    https://www.rt.com/news/567271-ex-reagan-admin-staffer-ukraine-russia/

    Despite public statements to the contrary, the administration of US President Joe Biden is not at all concerned about the plight of Ukrainians and is prepared to sacrifice the nation on the altar of weakening Russia, an official who served under Ronald Reagan believes.

    Paul Craig Roberts, who was assistant secretary of the Treasury for Economic Policy in the 1980s, also alleged that the Russian military had until recently been refraining from unleashing all of its might on Ukraine.

    In a piece published on his website on Friday and titled ‘It Seems Russia Won’t Require a Winter Offensive to Win the War’, Roberts said that Moscow’s latest missile strikes targeting critical infrastructure across Ukraine are a sign that the Kremlin “finally realized that Russia is at war.”

    According to the former official, for eight months since the start of its military campaign, Russia had been “protecting Ukraine from attack, thus helping Ukraine to conduct war against the Russian forces.”

    Despite that alleged strategy now having been revised, Russia still does not want to “destroy everything unless the West and its puppet Ukraine government fail to come to their senses.”
    Power boss urges Ukrainians to leave the country READ MORE: Power boss urges Ukrainians to leave the country

    The reason Moscow decided to spare its neighbor, Roberts argued, is that “Ukraine and the population there have been a part of Russia for centuries.”

    Moreover, having a poverty-stricken, bombed-out country on its border is not in Russia’s own interest, the ex-Treasury official said.

    However, “from Washington’s standpoint, the more Ukraine is destroyed the better,” Roberts alleged, explaining that such an outcome would end up being an “economic and financial drain on Russia.” He also insisted that the US leadership does not care about the price the Ukrainians would have to pay in such a scenario.

    “It is unjust that it is Ukraine that is paying the cost of Western inhumanity and not Washington and the European capitals,” Roberts wrote.

    He went on to lay into the “Western whore media,” accusing them of failing to report the true situation on the front lines. Reports of Russia’s heavy losses and imminent defeat are all totally misleading, he insisted.

    He warned that “such absurd propaganda” and underestimation of Russia’s military capabilities could see the US and NATO becoming directly involved in the conflict, thus provoking World War III.

    Since the start of Russia’s military operation in Ukraine, the West has been providing Kiev with massive assistance both in terms of weapons and money. Moscow has repeatedly warned that arms shipments will only prolong the conflict and increase the risk of a direct confrontation between Russia and NATO. A number of top Russian officials, including Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov, have accused the bloc of waging war against Russia “by proxy,” while President Vladimir Putin has described his country as fighting “the entire Western military machine.”

  524. Arthur Morgan
    @ArthurM40330824
    Mercenary is complaining that in #Donbass most of civilians are actually pro #Russian. How is that a surprise? Maybe that should be a hint, you are fighting a wrong war against the wishes of the people who live there. Get out!
    #Ukraine

    [MORE]

  525. Opens profile photo
    J. Malkova🇷🇺♥️
    @CanadianKitty1
    People really need to educate themselves. Things are not always as we are told.
    Pro BRICS/+🚫NATO, 🚫EU. Pro Russia. Bite me..DMs=BLOCKED

  526. reddit . com /r/Military has had some great photos from Donbas front lines last couple days.

    I could not get web addresses for the best ones with a .jpg ending but this one is similar:

    There aren’t going to be any shots of these places with Zelensky or Ano Tennessee!

  527. @LatW
    @showmethereal


    Global Times does not set policy. Another western fallacy. And an editorial in a newspaper is not at all the same as making secret agreements behind the scenes.
     
    Of course, not, but an editorial in a big newspaper can be important (even though it's less "official" sounding than People's Daily). They definitely have a stance that is somewhat critical towards the West (and I also noticed a few strange assumptions about the European Parliament and a slightly didactic approach about what Europeans should or shouldn't do, what is good or what isn't good for them). But you may be right that it is not intended to be too forceful or far reaching.

    bet most westerners don’t know a recent editor in chief was a former Tiananmen Square protester.
     
    That fact alone doesn't necessarily mean that much, he doesn't appear to be a liberal. And it's not even all that uncommon for some former protesters / dissidents to become hardliners or supporters of the state. He appears to have been a strong propagandist, somewhat of a strong personality, similar to Solovyov in Russia who is a hardliner and strong government propagandist, but also a bit of a free styler (especially lately). But it doesn't mean they are fully independent. It looks like a mix of personal beliefs mixed with state propaganda.

    Replies: @showmethereal

    Again what does a newspaper article have to do with officials interfering? You know what an opinion piece bs policy means – right? And he specific… the only thing I read is them telling Europe to stop blindly following the U.S. in its anti China crusade. That is directly about Chinese and European relations- not a 3rd part conflict. It is the exact opposite. Telling Europe to keep a 3rd party out of their own relations

    • Replies: @LatW
    @showmethereal

    I understand what you mean about 3rd parties, it's a problematic issue (even if inevitable in many cases). In that regard, I understand very well where Hu Xijin from Global Times is coming from (he is just being protective of his nation). Remember that other nations feel that way, too. It's partly the fault of E.Europeans that they did not provide enough information to China. Even if you are going to stay on Russia's side, you would still have better information.

    Replies: @showmethereal

  528. @silviosilver
    @showmethereal


    Crossing borders illegally has been going on since nations created borders. How do you suppose they could stop such a flood?
     
    Shoot them. Evict any that have managed to settle. We shoot people who illegally enter our homes, and our countries are simply our collective homes. In the case of infiltrator arriving by sea, sink their boats and strafe any survivors with machine gun fire. You wouldn't have to shoot many before they got the message. It would quickly expose their lie that they are arriving out of a "life or death" choice. If they were that desperate, they'd take any port any in a storm.

    Perhaps shooting them won't work? Okay fine, it's still worth trying. After all, we have laws against homicide not because we think that will ensure no homicide ever takes place, but because we rightly want to discourage it and punish it when it does. When homicide occurs, we don't throw our hands up in despair and claim that since we're unable to prevent all homicide it's pointless to have laws against it at all.

    I wouldn't have a problem with any country acting this way. People around the world are rightly concerned about a revisionist China throwing its weight around, but if China were to adopt the kind of stance against illegal infiltrators that I outlined above, they would have my complete support.

    Now letting them in via quota is a different story. But that’s their guilty conscience and frankly serves them right.
     
    "Serves them right." Thank you for making your anti-white hostility clear. In stark contrast to you, though I believe China has not always been an innocent little angel, nothing they have ever done would cause me to insist they must demographically obliterate themselves as an act of penitence

    Replies: @Yahya, @Barbarossa, @showmethereal, @German_reader

    When did I claim China was an innocent angel? Stick to the facts. NATO countries caused the problems and so have to deal with it. Simple as that. Shoot all you want and show the world how bloodthirsty you are. Go right ahead.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @showmethereal


    When did I claim China was an innocent angel?
     
    I didn't say you claimed it. I brought it up as a way to demonstrate my evenhandedness on the issue of illegal infiltration. (A gesture of congeniality you've evidently chosen to throw back in my face. Noted.)

    Shoot all you want and show the world how bloodthirsty you are.
     
    The "world" (ie those parts of it keenest to export their useless riffraff) might howl in impotent rage, but would it do? It protests but ultimately does nothing when NATO forces launch military operations - which, unlike defending yourself, actually can be described as "bloodthirsty" - so my guess is nothing would happen. I'm willing to try and find out anyway.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @showmethereal

  529. @Yahya
    @silviosilver


    but if China were to adopt the kind of stance against illegal infiltrators that I outlined above, they would have my complete support.
     
    They would not have mine (not that it matters anyway). Most illegal immigrants to China are North Korean refugees/defectors. China is in large part responsible for the creation and survival of the retarded North Korean regime that has brought famine and deprivation to its people. It used to be bad enough that the CCP supported NK out of a sense of ideological kinship, but now they are just cynically keeping the Kim regime afloat for fear of a reunified Korean peninsula under an American-aligned government. China imo has an obligation to take in defectors who are fleeing the deprivation the CCP is responsible for creating.

    Replies: @showmethereal

    False history. The Kim’s were put in power by the Soviets. Korea was divided by the U.S. and Soviets. Where did you get your history??? Why do people on here just make things up? China saved the Kim’s only because it didn’t want the US at its border. North Korea remained a Soviet client state.

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @showmethereal


    Korea was divided by the U.S. and Soviets.

     

    The Korean War was essentially fought by the Chinese on the communist side. North Korea only fielded a 1/5th of China's troops. The Soviets not even a percentage.

    No Chinese intervention = no North Korea.


    https://external-preview.redd.it/tZgO7-QCGzypUHWbkKYsKnJQaLt2qZV3L54Loe_nBdw.jpg?auto=webp&s=46fee86bc60a68b79484fb4324b2af649195657f


    China is responsible for keeping North Korea alive during its infancy.


    China saved the Kim’s only because it didn’t want the US at its border.

     

    China has enough nukes now to lay the entire planet to waste. You think this whole "we don't want the US on our border" is a good excuse for keeping 26M intelligent, capable North Koreans in a state of deprivation and tyranny, when they could've been living the high life like their ethno-racial brothers across the border?

    Replies: @showmethereal

  530. @songbird
    Trudeau is a tranny.

    https://twitter.com/Henrik_Palmgren/status/1596618716296671233?s=20&t=YjhsNKgaBmHjFcNCx9qB9Q

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Barbarossa

    Trudeau is a tranny.

    Whether true or not, that’s irrelevant. What relevant is that he is a pathetic nonentity subservient to the empire.

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @AnonfromTN

    True but maybe he can get a milligram of sympathy like Mark Zuckerberg for his PTSD from the three dozen or so anal rapes he endured when he was initiated into the society back in his teenage years.

    They might not even know there is a compliance-obedience compound contained in their meds. Presumably their children will consider some day that it was all worth it but that is so far from a sure thing it is closer to no way jose.

    Have you seen those tabloid photographs of Musk's tranny kid?

    , @songbird
    @AnonfromTN

    Is Canada really a vassal of GAE? I don't know... Canada doesn't really have much in the way of security concerns, so it would seem like there isn't much political leverage via military alliance. Maybe, that's not how the empire is organized? And it is financial? Or mind virus?

    But I think that Canada is always trying to show that it is more progressive than the US, so I just don't get subservient vibes.

    Replies: @A123

    , @Mr. Hack
    @AnonfromTN

    I assume that you pay income, property and other types of taxes to the US government? By doing so, you are also serving the interests of "the empire". You do have choices here, you may quit paying taxes and take a principled position showing that you don't go along with the policies and foreign entanglements of the empire. Or better yet, you can just pick up your bags and move to somewhere like Moscow and stand with your own people.

    https://s3.amazonaws.com/lowres.cartoonstock.com/politics-vladimir_putin-fifth_column-russia_politics-fifth_columnists-pied_piper-atan4949_low.jpg

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  531. @songbird
    Trudeau is a tranny.

    https://twitter.com/Henrik_Palmgren/status/1596618716296671233?s=20&t=YjhsNKgaBmHjFcNCx9qB9Q

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Barbarossa

    Ya know, just when I think it’s already reached peak ClownWorld. I would like to think that this would destroy political capital, but that is probably overly optimistic.

    Right now I’m reading the recollections of Geronimo and it seems as though a couple quotes from that should counteract the baleful presence of Justin the Tranny.

    “If an Apache had allowed his aged parents to suffer for food or shelter if he had neglected or abused the sick, if he had profaned our religion, or had been unfaithful, he might be banished from the tribe.”

    “The interpreter came alone and said that Geronimo was very sick with cold and fever. He had come to tell me that that we must appoint another date, as he feared that the old warrior had an attack of pneumonia…In a moment I realized the old chief riding furiously (evidently trying to to arrive as soon as the interpreter did), his horse flecked with foam and reeling from exhaustion. Dismounting he came in and said in a hoarse whisper , “I promised to come. I am here.”

    • Thanks: songbird
  532. German_reader says:
    @silviosilver
    @showmethereal


    Crossing borders illegally has been going on since nations created borders. How do you suppose they could stop such a flood?
     
    Shoot them. Evict any that have managed to settle. We shoot people who illegally enter our homes, and our countries are simply our collective homes. In the case of infiltrator arriving by sea, sink their boats and strafe any survivors with machine gun fire. You wouldn't have to shoot many before they got the message. It would quickly expose their lie that they are arriving out of a "life or death" choice. If they were that desperate, they'd take any port any in a storm.

    Perhaps shooting them won't work? Okay fine, it's still worth trying. After all, we have laws against homicide not because we think that will ensure no homicide ever takes place, but because we rightly want to discourage it and punish it when it does. When homicide occurs, we don't throw our hands up in despair and claim that since we're unable to prevent all homicide it's pointless to have laws against it at all.

    I wouldn't have a problem with any country acting this way. People around the world are rightly concerned about a revisionist China throwing its weight around, but if China were to adopt the kind of stance against illegal infiltrators that I outlined above, they would have my complete support.

    Now letting them in via quota is a different story. But that’s their guilty conscience and frankly serves them right.
     
    "Serves them right." Thank you for making your anti-white hostility clear. In stark contrast to you, though I believe China has not always been an innocent little angel, nothing they have ever done would cause me to insist they must demographically obliterate themselves as an act of penitence

    Replies: @Yahya, @Barbarossa, @showmethereal, @German_reader

    In the case of infiltrator arriving by sea, sink their boats and strafe any survivors with machine gun fire.

    Such fantasies are probably counter-productive. There are many other things that could be done, like simply not granting such migrants access to the welfare system. Shut down the NGOs who pick up migrants in the Mediterranean, confiscate their funds and scuttle their boats. If migrants are picked up the Mediterranean, transport them back to the North African coast and disembark them there with food and enough money for traveling back home. If North African countries don’t cooperate or are in state collapse like Libya, seize an enclave on the coast with military means. Push back migrants at the EU’s borders (and yes, if they’re getting violent, then they can and should be shot as a measure of last resort).
    Of course none of this will be done, because the political establishment wants this migration to happen, but if the political will were there, much could be done.

    • Agree: Barbarossa
    • Replies: @Beckow
    @German_reader

    The issues with what you suggest:

    NGOs can't be defined in an open society - they are everything and nothing. Shutting down 'NGOs' is like using a bucket to empty a river...target the money that comes directly from the governments. But the old women would cry, and homos would riot...

    Welfare is tricky: once the migrants are physically in a country, some kind of welfare will happen - it is built into the situation. We can change the details, generosity, but they are not going to sit on street corners hungry...

    The physical removal, enclaves, paying them to leave, etc...are half-measures that have been tried and are gamed by migrants and their accomplices. The visuals are almost as bad as what silviosilver described, and it only buys some time.

    What is needed is an uncompromising separation: guard the borders, abolish the back-doors (schools, family, visits...)...tell the source countries that they are not to connect now in any way with Europe, maybe later. Include diplomats, 'rich', etc...require that Euro parasites - French, English... stop selling their own countries for access to Third Word riches.

    Meloni told that to Macron, I wish she was serious, but that angle is always allowed to be suppressed. This is access to visas for access to the Third World wealth - a simple comprador transaction...the problem is at home...

    , @Yahya
    @German_reader


    If North African countries don’t cooperate or are in state collapse like Libya, seize an enclave on the coast with military means.
     
    Wtf, ever heard of the concept of national sovereignty?

    If you’re going to flagrantly violate other people’s sovereignty, what’s to stop others from calling out your hypocrisy when you pull the “sovereignty” card to argue for the enforcement of immigration laws in your country?

    A more just approach would be to offer North African states money in exchange for co-operation on migration issues. Given their general state of penuriousness, they’ll probably oblige for a small sum.

    No need to bring out your inner imperialist.

    Of course given the pathetic state for the German military (by some measures behind Egypt’s and Turkey’s), you are also in no position to make such threats anyway.

    Replies: @German_reader, @KidDynamite

    , @silviosilver
    @German_reader


    Such fantasies are probably counter-productive.
     
    I'm not exactly being interviewed for television here. I obviously agree less drastic measures should be attempted first. However, my experience debating immigration boosters is they'll contest every one of your suggestions with the hope of demonstrating that "nothing can be done." Well, if all that fails, you can always try shooting, so in my reply to him, I just cut straight to the chase.

    Shooting does work. In 2018, Gaza Palestinians, probably on the advice NGO leftards, attempted a "March of Return", to mark the 70th anniversary of their expulsion from Israel. If they thought Israelis would cuck, they had another thing coming. Israelis didn't cuck, they opened fire. Stopped them cold - and those people actually had roots in the country they were trying to infiltrate, unlike the fake "refugees" trying to infiltrate Europe. According to Amnesty - which can be relied upon to maximize the number of casualties - 150 marchers were killed, which hardly amounts to a holocaust.

    Replies: @German_reader

  533. @AnonfromTN
    @songbird


    Trudeau is a tranny.
     
    Whether true or not, that’s irrelevant. What relevant is that he is a pathetic nonentity subservient to the empire.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @songbird, @Mr. Hack

    True but maybe he can get a milligram of sympathy like Mark Zuckerberg for his PTSD from the three dozen or so anal rapes he endured when he was initiated into the society back in his teenage years.

    They might not even know there is a compliance-obedience compound contained in their meds. Presumably their children will consider some day that it was all worth it but that is so far from a sure thing it is closer to no way jose.

    Have you seen those tabloid photographs of Musk’s tranny kid?

  534. @German_reader
    @songbird


    Complete opposite of that Melnyk guy.
     
    Melnyk is deputy foreign minister now. Surprised me, I would have thought his Bandera worship would have precluded such an appointment given the importance of relations with Poland.

    Replies: @Beckow

    When politicians speak outside the usual boundaries – like Melnik – they are either designated pariahs or the chosen. Melnik turned out to be one of the chosen. He knew he could do no wrong, he was privy to the script. Too many pretended that was not the script only aberration. I think we know now…

    Melnik was like a canary in a coal mine, his rise says it all: Poland is the designated team B, the staging ground, to be used again for much bigger things. It is about the lands, the incredible arable topsoils with plenty of water, it has always been about that, for at least 300-400 hundred years.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @Beckow


    It is about the lands, the incredible arable topsoils with plenty of water, it has always been about that, for at least 300-400 hundred years.
     
    You could claim the same about Russia, they've grabbed some pretty valuable agricultural land in Eastern Ukraine after all. And I'm not convinced such motivations play that much of a role in NATO countries.
    Regarding Poland, I wonder if they'll ever get fed up with Ukraine. The recent missile incident with Zelensky's blatant attempt at manipulation (in Germany noticed even by a mainstream conservative newspaper like Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung btw) should have been a bright red warning sign for Poland that the Ukrainians may have goals that aren't in Poland's interests at all (and possibly use distinctly underhanded methods in pursuit of those goals). But I suppose Poles are too invested in the project and too big romantics to entertain such cynical thoughts. A pity.

    Replies: @A123, @Beckow, @AP

  535. German_reader says:
    @Beckow
    @German_reader

    When politicians speak outside the usual boundaries - like Melnik - they are either designated pariahs or the chosen. Melnik turned out to be one of the chosen. He knew he could do no wrong, he was privy to the script. Too many pretended that was not the script only aberration. I think we know now...

    Melnik was like a canary in a coal mine, his rise says it all: Poland is the designated team B, the staging ground, to be used again for much bigger things. It is about the lands, the incredible arable topsoils with plenty of water, it has always been about that, for at least 300-400 hundred years.

    Replies: @German_reader

    It is about the lands, the incredible arable topsoils with plenty of water, it has always been about that, for at least 300-400 hundred years.

    You could claim the same about Russia, they’ve grabbed some pretty valuable agricultural land in Eastern Ukraine after all. And I’m not convinced such motivations play that much of a role in NATO countries.
    Regarding Poland, I wonder if they’ll ever get fed up with Ukraine. The recent missile incident with Zelensky’s blatant attempt at manipulation (in Germany noticed even by a mainstream conservative newspaper like Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung btw) should have been a bright red warning sign for Poland that the Ukrainians may have goals that aren’t in Poland’s interests at all (and possibly use distinctly underhanded methods in pursuit of those goals). But I suppose Poles are too invested in the project and too big romantics to entertain such cynical thoughts. A pity.

    • Replies: @A123
    @German_reader


    Ukrainians may have goals that aren’t in Poland’s interests at all (and possibly use distinctly underhanded methods in pursuit of those goals). But I suppose Poles are too invested in the project and too big romantics to entertain such cynical thoughts. A pity.
     
    A similar romanticism for migration exists in Germany. The aggressively pro-migrant FDP is belatedly having its first twitches: (1)

    Although the Free Democrats (FDP) are a part of Germany’s governing traffic light coalition, the party is increasingly at odds with its own partners on issues such as illegal immigration, energy policy, and plans to distribute huge sums of money to citizens.

    Leading these critiques is the deputy leader of FDP, Wolfgang Kubicki, who has launched another attack against the other two parties, the Greens and the Social Democrats (SPD), that make up the coalition.

    The 70-year-old vice-president of the Bundestag described the migration policy as “an absolute piece from the madhouse.” The federal government is now financing “on behalf of the state a refugee ship in the Mediterranean for private sea rescue.” That is completely against the interests of “the southern EU countries and also against our own,” he said.

    As Germany grapples with over 1.2 million migrants in less than a year amid a raging inflation crisis, a majority of the public believes that the country is accepting too many. Despite the criticism from Kubicki, FDP itself has long promoted mass immigration, including proposals to increase the number of accepted migrants to 500,000 per year to satisfy the demands of big business. However, Germans’ souring mood on immigration may be contributing to FDP’s decision to criticize its own coalition government on the issue.
     

    • Is there hope for Christian Populism in Germany?
    • Or, has Germany too much invested in migration romanticism?

    Even though it is obviously not in the interests of German citizens, the latter seems likely. Sad really.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://rmx.news/germany/germanys-migration-policy-is-from-the-madhouse-says-fdp-deputy-leader-about-his-own-coalition-government/

    Replies: @German_reader

    , @Beckow
    @German_reader

    Sure, Russia and the 'West' are fighting over who will control the lands...in any war there are two sides. Russia has a slight local advantage, they have also historically prevailed in that region.


    Poles are too invested in the project and too big romantics to entertain such cynical thoughts.
     
    Poles are both, but there is more to it: Poland on a state level has always been the main source of instability in the region. Polish boundaries are badly defined, their ambition exceeds their capabilities, they are always star-struck by the others.

    From Napoleon to Churchill, (and now 'Biden' for god sake?), Poland cherishes the role of a loyal martyr - Poles weep like children with drama about their own sacrifices. Bandera massacred them but being liked by the English or Biden triumphs that. Fundamentally too many Poles dream of being somewhere to the far west, to be accepted.... It is incurable, they will trigger more mayhem. But Poles are still more coherent and disciplined than the Ukies.

    Replies: @German_reader

    , @AP
    @German_reader


    Regarding Poland, I wonder if they’ll ever get fed up with Ukraine.
     
    Russian loss is critical for Poland, so not in the context of this war.

    The recent missile incident with Zelensky’s blatant attempt at manipulation
     
    A Pole told me that the Russians have been deliberately sending their missiles in such as way that they would draw Ukrainian AA missiles into Poland, that they had been doing that before and that this is the first time it worked. I didn't pursue the discussion and don't know where he had heard that.

    Ukrainians may have goals that aren’t in Poland’s interests at al
     
    Survival of the Ukrainian state and its separation from the Russian world are very much in Poland's interests.

    Replies: @German_reader

  536. @Barbarossa
    @silviosilver


    they must demographically obliterate themselves as an act of penitence
     
    Even if one thought that the sins of past people did deserve such a punishment it wouldn't make any sense since all the supposed sinners are dead. It's unjust to punish the sons for the sins of the father.

    I wouldn't support shooting illegal migrants since that is an unnecessary level of violence, but there are plenty of ways to enforce an unequivocal and protectionist immigration policy. It's not as though it's hard to figure out how "refugees" game the system and those loopholes can be shut down. Of course, an equivocal immigration policy is the whole point currently.

    Replies: @A123

    I wouldn’t support shooting illegal migrants since that is an unnecessary level of violence, but there are plenty of ways to enforce an unequivocal and protectionist immigration policy. It’s not as though it’s hard to figure out how “refugees” game the system and those loopholes can be shut down.

    In the U.S. there are some changes that would provide immediate relief.

    • No social safety net programs. Get sick, medically stabilized & sent home.

    • No citizenship based on “drop location”. The idea of birthright citizenship is *NOT* in the Constitution. It is an obvious SJW misinterpretation of protections only intended to apply to emancipated slaves.

    • Severe sanctions for hiring illegals even if the worker is a contractor. The illegal gets sent home, and the company enters “correction” with increasing penalties for future violations.
    ___

    People do not remember when seasonal workers were highly effective & not disruptive. They left their wife and kids in Mexico. Stayed for only 4-6 months. Moved with the work, usually harvesting of some kind. And, then returned home with earnings that provided good purchasing power. The goal was keeping their primary life where goods & services were much cheaper.

    Providing no effective migrant worker “visa” for this cycle accidentally motivated permanent illegals. Combating drug and other smuggling skyrocketed the cost to travel back and forth undocumented. Workers with seasonal employment could not afford to go home regularly, so they paid the one-time cost to bring their families across illegally. That created a new path to citizenship and heavily burdens social services off season in certain communities.

    Of course, an equivocal immigration policy is the whole point currently.

    And, it is not just illegals & refugees. The excessively large H1B/OPT visa boondoggle has decimated wages for entry level jobs in certain industries. As a result, qualified U.S. citizens pursue other degrees. Decontaminating K-12 schools and fixing university admissions would also help.

    A key part of MAGA Reindustrialization is greatly reducing these H1B/OPT programs along with aggressive reshoring efforts. Once there is a career path, Americans will fill those degree tracks again.

    The same logic applies in skilled labor jobs. Americans will work hard for good pay. However, there is little motivation when the competition is illegal day labourers collecting $5/hr.
    ___

    Anti-offshoring will need serious enforcement so those measures have teeth. Simply starting with a $1/hr fee for every offshore worker or contractor would be a good start. Ratcheting it up annually funds the U.S. Government and motivates paying U.S. citizens to avoid the surcharge. By the time it reaches $5/hr, huge amounts of work will be brought back.

    There can be finesse for work the U.S. does not want. There is little national security downside to socks being made in Bangladesh.

    PEACE 😇

    • Agree: Barbarossa
  537. @German_reader
    @silviosilver


    In the case of infiltrator arriving by sea, sink their boats and strafe any survivors with machine gun fire.
     
    Such fantasies are probably counter-productive. There are many other things that could be done, like simply not granting such migrants access to the welfare system. Shut down the NGOs who pick up migrants in the Mediterranean, confiscate their funds and scuttle their boats. If migrants are picked up the Mediterranean, transport them back to the North African coast and disembark them there with food and enough money for traveling back home. If North African countries don't cooperate or are in state collapse like Libya, seize an enclave on the coast with military means. Push back migrants at the EU's borders (and yes, if they're getting violent, then they can and should be shot as a measure of last resort).
    Of course none of this will be done, because the political establishment wants this migration to happen, but if the political will were there, much could be done.

    Replies: @Beckow, @Yahya, @silviosilver

    The issues with what you suggest:

    NGOs can’t be defined in an open society – they are everything and nothing. Shutting down ‘NGOs’ is like using a bucket to empty a river…target the money that comes directly from the governments. But the old women would cry, and homos would riot…

    Welfare is tricky: once the migrants are physically in a country, some kind of welfare will happen – it is built into the situation. We can change the details, generosity, but they are not going to sit on street corners hungry…

    The physical removal, enclaves, paying them to leave, etc…are half-measures that have been tried and are gamed by migrants and their accomplices. The visuals are almost as bad as what silviosilver described, and it only buys some time.

    What is needed is an uncompromising separation: guard the borders, abolish the back-doors (schools, family, visits…)…tell the source countries that they are not to connect now in any way with Europe, maybe later. Include diplomats, ‘rich’, etc…require that Euro parasites – French, English… stop selling their own countries for access to Third Word riches.

    Meloni told that to Macron, I wish she was serious, but that angle is always allowed to be suppressed. This is access to visas for access to the Third World wealth – a simple comprador transaction…the problem is at home…

  538. @AnonfromTN
    @songbird


    Trudeau is a tranny.
     
    Whether true or not, that’s irrelevant. What relevant is that he is a pathetic nonentity subservient to the empire.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @songbird, @Mr. Hack

    Is Canada really a vassal of GAE? I don’t know… Canada doesn’t really have much in the way of security concerns, so it would seem like there isn’t much political leverage via military alliance. Maybe, that’s not how the empire is organized? And it is financial? Or mind virus?

    But I think that Canada is always trying to show that it is more progressive than the US, so I just don’t get subservient vibes.

    • Replies: @A123
    @songbird


    Is Canada really a vassal of GAE?
     
    There really is no such thing as the GAE. If you seek understanding, consider that both the U.S. and Canada are vassals of the Greater European Empire [GEE].

    I think that Canada is always trying to show that it is more progressive than the US, so I just don’t get subservient vibes
     
    Canada is willingly submissive to SJW European values. Christianity is functionally dead as institution in the most populous areas, so there is little resistance grounded in traditional values. To show their allegiance to the GEE, Canada genuflects to Europe at every opportunity.

    America has a strong Christian heartland and active resistance to SJW European values. While the Democrat Party willingly serves the GEE, the Republicans are starting to gain some backbone under MAGA. Will America be able to escape the GEE? Such a goal is desirable, but far from certain.

    PEACE 😇

  539. @showmethereal
    @Yahya

    False history. The Kim’s were put in power by the Soviets. Korea was divided by the U.S. and Soviets. Where did you get your history??? Why do people on here just make things up? China saved the Kim’s only because it didn’t want the US at its border. North Korea remained a Soviet client state.

    Replies: @Yahya

    Korea was divided by the U.S. and Soviets.

    The Korean War was essentially fought by the Chinese on the communist side. North Korea only fielded a 1/5th of China’s troops. The Soviets not even a percentage.

    No Chinese intervention = no North Korea.

    China is responsible for keeping North Korea alive during its infancy.

    China saved the Kim’s only because it didn’t want the US at its border.

    China has enough nukes now to lay the entire planet to waste. You think this whole “we don’t want the US on our border” is a good excuse for keeping 26M intelligent, capable North Koreans in a state of deprivation and tyranny, when they could’ve been living the high life like their ethno-racial brothers across the border?

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @Yahya

    You skip the FACTS. Soviets installed Kim. US and Soviets divided Korea. China has NEVER controlled the Kim’s. It fought in the war when the US got to the Yalu River. It was US arrogance that caused China to flood into Korea. Those are facts. China does not tell Kim how to run NK. In fact most of the consumer goods NK get is smuggled in by those who work in China. Most dissidents who escape North Korea to get to the South do so via China. They don’t cross the DMZ. All governments involved know this. So stop making up stuff. China “saved” North Vietnam too for the same reason it saved North Korea. It didn’t want the US at its border. Only difference is the North Vietnamese were able to flood the South while the Chinese soldiers stayed in North Vietnam. Vietnam on its own chose to reform its economy - like China did. So if you blame China for North Korea then you should give China credit for the next Asian economic miracle - which is Vietnam. But your bias is there. Or maybe you genuinely don’t know the history…. I can’t say

    Replies: @Yahya

  540. @German_reader
    @Beckow


    It is about the lands, the incredible arable topsoils with plenty of water, it has always been about that, for at least 300-400 hundred years.
     
    You could claim the same about Russia, they've grabbed some pretty valuable agricultural land in Eastern Ukraine after all. And I'm not convinced such motivations play that much of a role in NATO countries.
    Regarding Poland, I wonder if they'll ever get fed up with Ukraine. The recent missile incident with Zelensky's blatant attempt at manipulation (in Germany noticed even by a mainstream conservative newspaper like Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung btw) should have been a bright red warning sign for Poland that the Ukrainians may have goals that aren't in Poland's interests at all (and possibly use distinctly underhanded methods in pursuit of those goals). But I suppose Poles are too invested in the project and too big romantics to entertain such cynical thoughts. A pity.

    Replies: @A123, @Beckow, @AP

    Ukrainians may have goals that aren’t in Poland’s interests at all (and possibly use distinctly underhanded methods in pursuit of those goals). But I suppose Poles are too invested in the project and too big romantics to entertain such cynical thoughts. A pity.

    A similar romanticism for migration exists in Germany. The aggressively pro-migrant FDP is belatedly having its first twitches: (1)

    Although the Free Democrats (FDP) are a part of Germany’s governing traffic light coalition, the party is increasingly at odds with its own partners on issues such as illegal immigration, energy policy, and plans to distribute huge sums of money to citizens.

    Leading these critiques is the deputy leader of FDP, Wolfgang Kubicki, who has launched another attack against the other two parties, the Greens and the Social Democrats (SPD), that make up the coalition.

    The 70-year-old vice-president of the Bundestag described the migration policy as “an absolute piece from the madhouse.” The federal government is now financing “on behalf of the state a refugee ship in the Mediterranean for private sea rescue.” That is completely against the interests of “the southern EU countries and also against our own,” he said.

    As Germany grapples with over 1.2 million migrants in less than a year amid a raging inflation crisis, a majority of the public believes that the country is accepting too many. Despite the criticism from Kubicki, FDP itself has long promoted mass immigration, including proposals to increase the number of accepted migrants to 500,000 per year to satisfy the demands of big business. However, Germans’ souring mood on immigration may be contributing to FDP’s decision to criticize its own coalition government on the issue.

    • Is there hope for Christian Populism in Germany?
    • Or, has Germany too much invested in migration romanticism?

    Even though it is obviously not in the interests of German citizens, the latter seems likely. Sad really.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://rmx.news/germany/germanys-migration-policy-is-from-the-madhouse-says-fdp-deputy-leader-about-his-own-coalition-government/

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @A123

    SPD and Greens are intending to push through wide-ranging changes to citizenship and naturalization laws. Stuff like automatically giving all children born in Germany citizenship if their parents have had legal residency for five years. Making it possible to acquire citizenship after just three years if "special efforts at integration" have been made (judging by some especially egregious cases under the old laws, like a Syrian who was naturalized after five years, this could even mean something like joining SPD and agitating for more funds and easier family reunification for migrants...more commonly it probably means something like attending an integration course and getting some low-paid job). Dual citizenship as standard, no obstacle to naturalization. And so on. The intention is quite blatantly to hand out citizenship to as many as possible of those who have come as refugees (or "refugees") since 2014/15. Of course heavily supported by the usual ethnic activists and by migration "scholars". For the SPD the motivation is probably also acquiring new voters, since otherwise their voter basis consists mainly of retarded boomers who are voting for them out of habit, because they already did so 40 years ago.
    Anyway, as your linked article says quite correctly, FDP are also mass immigration enthusiasts, but presumably they'd rather get skilled workers instead of welfare cases. There are also lots of other points of friction in the coalition on economic matters, notably about whether to keep the remaining nuclear power stations running. FDP is declining in polls, apparently quite a few of their voters are disappointed, and that could eventually become dangerous for the party (they were out of the Bundestag not that long ago and already looked like they were on their last legs).
    But in general, the outlook is of course totally bleak from my pov (also a factor why I have no sympathy for LatW's hysterical bs...my own nation, like all others in Western Europe, is being dismantled in record time, but somehow we're all supposed to care about the sanctity of Ukraine's 30-year old borders, even in cases like Crimea where those borders never made any sense. Just ridiculous).

    Replies: @A123

  541. @songbird
    @AnonfromTN

    Is Canada really a vassal of GAE? I don't know... Canada doesn't really have much in the way of security concerns, so it would seem like there isn't much political leverage via military alliance. Maybe, that's not how the empire is organized? And it is financial? Or mind virus?

    But I think that Canada is always trying to show that it is more progressive than the US, so I just don't get subservient vibes.

    Replies: @A123

    Is Canada really a vassal of GAE?

    There really is no such thing as the GAE. If you seek understanding, consider that both the U.S. and Canada are vassals of the Greater European Empire [GEE].

    I think that Canada is always trying to show that it is more progressive than the US, so I just don’t get subservient vibes

    Canada is willingly submissive to SJW European values. Christianity is functionally dead as institution in the most populous areas, so there is little resistance grounded in traditional values. To show their allegiance to the GEE, Canada genuflects to Europe at every opportunity.

    America has a strong Christian heartland and active resistance to SJW European values. While the Democrat Party willingly serves the GEE, the Republicans are starting to gain some backbone under MAGA. Will America be able to escape the GEE? Such a goal is desirable, but far from certain.

    PEACE 😇

  542. @German_reader
    @Beckow


    It is about the lands, the incredible arable topsoils with plenty of water, it has always been about that, for at least 300-400 hundred years.
     
    You could claim the same about Russia, they've grabbed some pretty valuable agricultural land in Eastern Ukraine after all. And I'm not convinced such motivations play that much of a role in NATO countries.
    Regarding Poland, I wonder if they'll ever get fed up with Ukraine. The recent missile incident with Zelensky's blatant attempt at manipulation (in Germany noticed even by a mainstream conservative newspaper like Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung btw) should have been a bright red warning sign for Poland that the Ukrainians may have goals that aren't in Poland's interests at all (and possibly use distinctly underhanded methods in pursuit of those goals). But I suppose Poles are too invested in the project and too big romantics to entertain such cynical thoughts. A pity.

    Replies: @A123, @Beckow, @AP

    Sure, Russia and the ‘West’ are fighting over who will control the lands…in any war there are two sides. Russia has a slight local advantage, they have also historically prevailed in that region.

    Poles are too invested in the project and too big romantics to entertain such cynical thoughts.

    Poles are both, but there is more to it: Poland on a state level has always been the main source of instability in the region. Polish boundaries are badly defined, their ambition exceeds their capabilities, they are always star-struck by the others.

    From Napoleon to Churchill, (and now ‘Biden’ for god sake?), Poland cherishes the role of a loyal martyr – Poles weep like children with drama about their own sacrifices. Bandera massacred them but being liked by the English or Biden triumphs that. Fundamentally too many Poles dream of being somewhere to the far west, to be accepted.… It is incurable, they will trigger more mayhem. But Poles are still more coherent and disciplined than the Ukies.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @Beckow


    Polish boundaries are badly defined, their ambition exceeds their capabilities
     
    I don't think the boundaries are that badly defined today. Before the mass influx of Ukrainians, Poland was essentially a mono-ethnic state without any serious minority problems. They've won their struggle with Germany over territory (even if it doesn't seem to have registered with a lot of Poles). Agreed about the excessive ambitions though, all that talk about the powerful Intermarium bloc is a perfect example. imo it will end in tears.

    But Poles are still more coherent and disciplined than the Ukies.
     
    I can't say I like Poland all that much, but they're undoubtedly a part of "Europe", despite all the friction still intelligible to people further west. I'm far from convinced the same is true of Ukraine...what's one to think about a guy like Arestovych who supposedly once was an acolyte of Dugin and hung out in Moscow, doing who knows what? Big mistake for the Poles imo to get emotionally so invested in those Byzantine post-Soviet conflicts.

    Replies: @Beckow

  543. German_reader says:
    @A123
    @German_reader


    Ukrainians may have goals that aren’t in Poland’s interests at all (and possibly use distinctly underhanded methods in pursuit of those goals). But I suppose Poles are too invested in the project and too big romantics to entertain such cynical thoughts. A pity.
     
    A similar romanticism for migration exists in Germany. The aggressively pro-migrant FDP is belatedly having its first twitches: (1)

    Although the Free Democrats (FDP) are a part of Germany’s governing traffic light coalition, the party is increasingly at odds with its own partners on issues such as illegal immigration, energy policy, and plans to distribute huge sums of money to citizens.

    Leading these critiques is the deputy leader of FDP, Wolfgang Kubicki, who has launched another attack against the other two parties, the Greens and the Social Democrats (SPD), that make up the coalition.

    The 70-year-old vice-president of the Bundestag described the migration policy as “an absolute piece from the madhouse.” The federal government is now financing “on behalf of the state a refugee ship in the Mediterranean for private sea rescue.” That is completely against the interests of “the southern EU countries and also against our own,” he said.

    As Germany grapples with over 1.2 million migrants in less than a year amid a raging inflation crisis, a majority of the public believes that the country is accepting too many. Despite the criticism from Kubicki, FDP itself has long promoted mass immigration, including proposals to increase the number of accepted migrants to 500,000 per year to satisfy the demands of big business. However, Germans’ souring mood on immigration may be contributing to FDP’s decision to criticize its own coalition government on the issue.
     

    • Is there hope for Christian Populism in Germany?
    • Or, has Germany too much invested in migration romanticism?

    Even though it is obviously not in the interests of German citizens, the latter seems likely. Sad really.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://rmx.news/germany/germanys-migration-policy-is-from-the-madhouse-says-fdp-deputy-leader-about-his-own-coalition-government/

    Replies: @German_reader

    SPD and Greens are intending to push through wide-ranging changes to citizenship and naturalization laws. Stuff like automatically giving all children born in Germany citizenship if their parents have had legal residency for five years. Making it possible to acquire citizenship after just three years if “special efforts at integration” have been made (judging by some especially egregious cases under the old laws, like a Syrian who was naturalized after five years, this could even mean something like joining SPD and agitating for more funds and easier family reunification for migrants…more commonly it probably means something like attending an integration course and getting some low-paid job). Dual citizenship as standard, no obstacle to naturalization. And so on. The intention is quite blatantly to hand out citizenship to as many as possible of those who have come as refugees (or “refugees”) since 2014/15. Of course heavily supported by the usual ethnic activists and by migration “scholars”. For the SPD the motivation is probably also acquiring new voters, since otherwise their voter basis consists mainly of retarded boomers who are voting for them out of habit, because they already did so 40 years ago.
    Anyway, as your linked article says quite correctly, FDP are also mass immigration enthusiasts, but presumably they’d rather get skilled workers instead of welfare cases. There are also lots of other points of friction in the coalition on economic matters, notably about whether to keep the remaining nuclear power stations running. FDP is declining in polls, apparently quite a few of their voters are disappointed, and that could eventually become dangerous for the party (they were out of the Bundestag not that long ago and already looked like they were on their last legs).
    But in general, the outlook is of course totally bleak from my pov (also a factor why I have no sympathy for LatW’s hysterical bs…my own nation, like all others in Western Europe, is being dismantled in record time, but somehow we’re all supposed to care about the sanctity of Ukraine’s 30-year old borders, even in cases like Crimea where those borders never made any sense. Just ridiculous).

    • Thanks: A123
    • Replies: @A123
    @German_reader

    To give credit to Germans where credit is due. Local resistance is picking up.

    The environment crazies tried to protest in Hamburg and were promptly ushered off (1). Video below [MORE].


    Their error made it easy for venue security to escort the cultural vandals out of the premises, all to the applause of the show’s audience.

    A man who appeared to be the show’s conductor walked out on stage as the crowd celebrated the removal of the cultural vandals.

     

    A German auto museum also dealt with some of these nutters recently. (2)

    a group called Scientist Rebellion took the sticky route when nine members glued their hands to the floor of the Porsche pavilion at Volkswagen's Autostadt museum in Wolfsburg on Thursday.
    ...
    staff at the VW museum ignored the playbook. Instead of calling Wolfsburg police immediately, staff "recognized the right to protest," then closed the pavilion for the evening and left — turning off the light and heat as they walked out.

    https://davidicke.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/10/SCIENTISTS-ARE-PRATS-IMAGE-768x428.jpg

     

    If the German people would back serious parties, AfD or a new Populist group, problems could be fixed. I do not understand why individuals with legitimate grievances cannot aggregate against an out of control elite leadership class.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.westernjournal.com/climate-protesters-humiliated-moments-gluing-concert-hall-conductors-stand-never-realized/

    (2) https://www.autoblog.com/2022/10/21/climate-protesters-glue-themselves-to-porsche-museum-germany/



    https://twitter.com/IngridStangl1/status/1596144298877063168?s=20

    Replies: @German_reader, @songbird

  544. @German_reader
    @silviosilver


    In the case of infiltrator arriving by sea, sink their boats and strafe any survivors with machine gun fire.
     
    Such fantasies are probably counter-productive. There are many other things that could be done, like simply not granting such migrants access to the welfare system. Shut down the NGOs who pick up migrants in the Mediterranean, confiscate their funds and scuttle their boats. If migrants are picked up the Mediterranean, transport them back to the North African coast and disembark them there with food and enough money for traveling back home. If North African countries don't cooperate or are in state collapse like Libya, seize an enclave on the coast with military means. Push back migrants at the EU's borders (and yes, if they're getting violent, then they can and should be shot as a measure of last resort).
    Of course none of this will be done, because the political establishment wants this migration to happen, but if the political will were there, much could be done.

    Replies: @Beckow, @Yahya, @silviosilver

    If North African countries don’t cooperate or are in state collapse like Libya, seize an enclave on the coast with military means.

    Wtf, ever heard of the concept of national sovereignty?

    If you’re going to flagrantly violate other people’s sovereignty, what’s to stop others from calling out your hypocrisy when you pull the “sovereignty” card to argue for the enforcement of immigration laws in your country?

    A more just approach would be to offer North African states money in exchange for co-operation on migration issues. Given their general state of penuriousness, they’ll probably oblige for a small sum.

    No need to bring out your inner imperialist.

    Of course given the pathetic state for the German military (by some measures behind Egypt’s and Turkey’s), you are also in no position to make such threats anyway.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @Yahya


    Of course given the pathetic state for the German military (by some measures behind Egypt’s and Turkey’s), you are also in no position to make such threats anyway.
     
    It would presumably be a common EU project with France, Italy and maybe Spain, and the goal would be limited to seizing a small area on the coast.
    Anyway, something like this would of course be only a measure of last resort, when a state doesn't want to cooperate at all and tries to weaponize migration flows, or when a state has collapsed into anarchy like Libya and there's no one you can make a deal with. In general, it would of course be much preferable to conclude agreements with North African states and pay them for their help in managing migration flows. If possible, such military measures should of course be avoided because of the predictable backlash they would generate.
    And as I indicated in my previous comment, it's unlikely to happen anyway, since there is no political will in Europe to really stop migration.
    , @KidDynamite
    @Yahya


    Of course given the pathetic state for the German military (by some measures behind Egypt’s and Turkey’s), you are also in no position to make such threats anyway.
     
    Going back to my point about never losing a martial edge. High-falutin’ poetry and music will not keep people from assaulting your borders, only the explicit or implicit threat that - you send any young armed men here, we will send them back in plastic bags. It’s what those illiterate goat-herders did in Afghanistan until we finally got the message and tired of it and left.

    As it is, I see places like Egypt concentrate their Olympic medal efforts in things like wrestling, weightlifting and martial arts...I’m seeing Morocco produce very solid kick boxers...leave badminton and ping pong for the nerds.

    Replies: @Yahya

  545. @LatW
    @Mikel


    Do you think that if Ukraine takes back Crimea the Russians will never come back again? The contrary looks much more likely.
     
    Please, see my post above. They always come back. It's been that way since the 5th century or so. Only one solution - Israel. Not Finland, not Switzerland. Israel.

    Short of marching to Moscow and dismembering the Russian state, I don’t know how Ukrainians can prevent their children from having to fight Russia in the future.
     
    As I said above, the Russians themselves have to march to Moscow. Ukraine will stop on its borders, then pass the baton on to the Russians. If they have enough strength (which I highly doubt).

    Alternatively, they can enjoy a "beautiful" life under Prigozhin's sledgehammer. (Look that up).

    Ukraine deserves to be independent from Moscow, now more than ever.
     
    That's not how this works. One doesn't "deserve" something out of the blue. One has to fight for it. As the Ukrainian people have done for hundreds of years now.

    When Musk proposed this he was met with abuse in Kiev though.
     
    It is way too late for those solutions now. Such a plan will also be rejected by the Russian side long term (although they are desperate for an agreement so that they can at least keep the current gains). No, it's too late. It is in the hands of the Ukrainian military now.

    Replies: @Yahya, @Mikel, @Dmitry

    Israel. Not Finland, not Switzerland. Israel.

    No. Switzerland is a far superior solution. It hasn’t had a war in several centuries. Its combination of a credible military deterrence (which Ukraine now also has) and good relations with everybody spared them from being invaded even by the Nazis. Crucially, it is also a confederation. Every little canton belongs to the federation on a voluntary basis and has ample autonomy, including its own constitution, police and courts.

    Speaking of Nazis, if Ukraine tries to go for a Versailles humiliation, understandable as the desire might now be, it is not difficult to predict that it will sooner or later get a III Reich on its frontier. Even AK is now deriding Putin and the “Kremlins” in every second tweet. Large swaths of United Russia voters must be ready to support a hardliner challenge to the current order. It’s time for statesmanship in order to avert a worse Russian threat for everybody in the future.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @Mikel


    if Ukraine tries to go for a Versailles humiliation
     
    Versailles was discussed a few months ago on Twitter by some of those pro-Ukrainian hardliners (e. g. Paul Massaro iirc) who fantasize about breaking up Russia, according to them the only issue with it was that it wasn't harsh enough. And when one thinks about the implications of some statements from that corner (e. g. how Russian draft dodgers mustn't be received in the EU at all, because all of them, without exception, are undoubtedly in favour of Russia's war, they just don't want to fight it themselves), it's pretty clear that permanent enmity with Russia and Russians per se is taken for granted.
    Of course it's still very questionable though if Ukraine will even be able to inflict the kind of defeat on Russia people like LatW seem to regard as possible or inevitable. I hope it doesn't happen, but who knows, maybe there will be a Russian winter offensive, and all the people who are so sure now that talk about a ceasefire is their biggest problem, will be refuted by events.

    Replies: @sudden death

    , @LatW
    @Mikel


    Switzerland is a far superior solution. It hasn’t had a war in several centuries
     
    Switzerland is a good example and often touted as an example to follow by both Ukrainian and Baltic nationalists. However, we have a worse geographic positioning than Switzerland (I will not go into the reasons why the Nazis didn't manage to occupy Switzerland, the reasons go beyond "every man having a rifle", but just note that the dynamic between Germany and countries such as Switzerland, Denmark and Norway is a little different that the ethnic dynamic in the former Russian Empire).

    it is not difficult to predict that it will sooner or later get a III Reich on its frontier
     
    This pseudo Reich will never turn into a real Reich. They simply don't have what it takes for it. Above all organizational skills. The way that the USSR was built was based on both co-operation and coercion of all participants. Russia is trying to replicate that (for example, enlisting a lot of minorities to fight a war for Russian ethnic goals), but it's not working, because the main component, the Ukrainian, is no longer there. But of course they will pose a real threat in the future, if the Russians themselves do not change (not many hopes there), so Israelization would be good. As Arestovych said, there is a struggle over who own's the heritage of Kyiv (not a great situation, but it is reality and the historical fate). Of course, in the EE format, with EE customs, without some of those negatives that Israel is having to deal with. Ukraine won't lack arable land and will have more friends near by.

    Also, since you bring up Versailles. The Russian character is such that they always feel that they are owed something. That probably won't go away.... ever.

    , @AP
    @Mikel


    No. Switzerland is a far superior solution.
     
    Federation in Ukraine would not have resembled Switzerland but rather 18th century Poland. "Autonomous" eastern parts would be under de facto control of Russia, and therefore any Ukrainian policies would be vetoed by Russia. The state would be weak, dexentralized, paralyzed. It's why Minsk deal was pushed by Russia. You think Russia had Ukraine's best interests in mind when doing so?

    Russia invaded and partitioned Poland when Poland tried to reform its system in order to eliminate that state of affairs. It was aided by Poland's western neighbors. Russia would like the same - Orban is willing to play that role, but fortunately for Ukraine Poland is not.

    Speaking of Nazis, if Ukraine tries to go for a Versailles humiliation, understandable as the desire might now be, it is not difficult to predict that it will sooner or later get a III Reich on its frontier
     
    Are Russians as competent as the Germans were?

    It’s time for statesmanship in order to avert a worse Russian threat for everybody in the future.
     
    Allowing Russia to keep any territory seized in 2022 and for it not to pay for the damage it caused would reward its illegal and bloody aggression.

    Replies: @German_reader, @Mikel

  546. German_reader says:
    @Beckow
    @German_reader

    Sure, Russia and the 'West' are fighting over who will control the lands...in any war there are two sides. Russia has a slight local advantage, they have also historically prevailed in that region.


    Poles are too invested in the project and too big romantics to entertain such cynical thoughts.
     
    Poles are both, but there is more to it: Poland on a state level has always been the main source of instability in the region. Polish boundaries are badly defined, their ambition exceeds their capabilities, they are always star-struck by the others.

    From Napoleon to Churchill, (and now 'Biden' for god sake?), Poland cherishes the role of a loyal martyr - Poles weep like children with drama about their own sacrifices. Bandera massacred them but being liked by the English or Biden triumphs that. Fundamentally too many Poles dream of being somewhere to the far west, to be accepted.... It is incurable, they will trigger more mayhem. But Poles are still more coherent and disciplined than the Ukies.

    Replies: @German_reader

    Polish boundaries are badly defined, their ambition exceeds their capabilities

    I don’t think the boundaries are that badly defined today. Before the mass influx of Ukrainians, Poland was essentially a mono-ethnic state without any serious minority problems. They’ve won their struggle with Germany over territory (even if it doesn’t seem to have registered with a lot of Poles). Agreed about the excessive ambitions though, all that talk about the powerful Intermarium bloc is a perfect example. imo it will end in tears.

    But Poles are still more coherent and disciplined than the Ukies.

    I can’t say I like Poland all that much, but they’re undoubtedly a part of “Europe”, despite all the friction still intelligible to people further west. I’m far from convinced the same is true of Ukraine…what’s one to think about a guy like Arestovych who supposedly once was an acolyte of Dugin and hung out in Moscow, doing who knows what? Big mistake for the Poles imo to get emotionally so invested in those Byzantine post-Soviet conflicts.

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @German_reader


    ...the boundaries are that badly defined today
     
    Less than in the past, but the western, eastern and northern (Kaliningrad) borders are not fully settled - it is imaginable that it would change, esp. the cursed idea if Intermarium. Many Poles otherwise normal talk about their Intermarium dreams, usually when inebriated :)...

    Poles are European, maybe too much so... they consciously play up bad Euro habits like fake superiority, greed, mindless aggression. There is something atavistic about it, quite underdeveloped.

    Arestovych is a homo from a secret service and theatre background, bought and sold many times. In times of extreme strife weird characters making no sense pop up. Kiev is full of them, e.g. sweatpants Zelko. Historically the weirdos have no staying power, street clowns to distract. When things settle down they will be gone. If things settle down...

    Replies: @AP

  547. @showmethereal
    @silviosilver

    When did I claim China was an innocent angel? Stick to the facts. NATO countries caused the problems and so have to deal with it. Simple as that. Shoot all you want and show the world how bloodthirsty you are. Go right ahead.

    Replies: @silviosilver

    When did I claim China was an innocent angel?

    I didn’t say you claimed it. I brought it up as a way to demonstrate my evenhandedness on the issue of illegal infiltration. (A gesture of congeniality you’ve evidently chosen to throw back in my face. Noted.)

    Shoot all you want and show the world how bloodthirsty you are.

    The “world” (ie those parts of it keenest to export their useless riffraff) might howl in impotent rage, but would it do? It protests but ultimately does nothing when NATO forces launch military operations – which, unlike defending yourself, actually can be described as “bloodthirsty” – so my guess is nothing would happen. I’m willing to try and find out anyway.

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @silviosilver

    You're a refugee yourself, and one made so as a direct result of NATO intervention.
    You slyly try to change the narrative to 19th C colonies rather than 21st C wars.

    It's completely depraved & it's funny seeing white nationalist E. Euros.
    The West already moved on from racialism & they're left howling like retards - alone.

    , @showmethereal
    @silviosilver

    If China was the one responsible for the disruption in Myanmar and was flooded with migrants then I would say it’s China’s fault and China has to deal with it. But that’s not the case.

    And you claim I was anti white. Where did I blame all whites???? I don’t believe Serbians should have to suffer consequences of NATO actions. I didn’t think Finland should either - but since Finland wants to join NATO then I wouldn’t feel sorry for them if they have a migrant crisis. Same goes for the issues that come up regarding past imperialism and relationships with former colonies. If they weren’t a colonizer I don’t think a white country should have to suffer. Which was how this argument started. Why should Russia take in African migrants. France won the World Cup with descendants and immigrants from former colonies. Russia has not won a World Cup and Russia did not have them. See people aren’t stupid. Africans have said it themselves regarding both Russia and China. Why do you think in the recent riots in Haiti they were marching with Russian flags asking Russia for help to keep out “international UN troops” like happened last time (which was a U.S. and French operation in disguise).

    As to the consequences of what would happen to your suggestion …. Well personally I think it might ignite the jihadists again to attack western countries some more. But It will certainly cause Global South countries to further vote against western countries in the UN. If they think it’s “bad” the global south won’t economically sanction Russia right now - expect it to get “worse”.

    Make no mistake - I am against illegal migration. But I understand cause and effect. I also understand the God given principle that governs all of creation which is - sowing and reaping.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @Coconuts

  548. German_reader says:
    @Yahya
    @German_reader


    If North African countries don’t cooperate or are in state collapse like Libya, seize an enclave on the coast with military means.
     
    Wtf, ever heard of the concept of national sovereignty?

    If you’re going to flagrantly violate other people’s sovereignty, what’s to stop others from calling out your hypocrisy when you pull the “sovereignty” card to argue for the enforcement of immigration laws in your country?

    A more just approach would be to offer North African states money in exchange for co-operation on migration issues. Given their general state of penuriousness, they’ll probably oblige for a small sum.

    No need to bring out your inner imperialist.

    Of course given the pathetic state for the German military (by some measures behind Egypt’s and Turkey’s), you are also in no position to make such threats anyway.

    Replies: @German_reader, @KidDynamite

    Of course given the pathetic state for the German military (by some measures behind Egypt’s and Turkey’s), you are also in no position to make such threats anyway.

    It would presumably be a common EU project with France, Italy and maybe Spain, and the goal would be limited to seizing a small area on the coast.
    Anyway, something like this would of course be only a measure of last resort, when a state doesn’t want to cooperate at all and tries to weaponize migration flows, or when a state has collapsed into anarchy like Libya and there’s no one you can make a deal with. In general, it would of course be much preferable to conclude agreements with North African states and pay them for their help in managing migration flows. If possible, such military measures should of course be avoided because of the predictable backlash they would generate.
    And as I indicated in my previous comment, it’s unlikely to happen anyway, since there is no political will in Europe to really stop migration.

  549. @German_reader
    @silviosilver


    In the case of infiltrator arriving by sea, sink their boats and strafe any survivors with machine gun fire.
     
    Such fantasies are probably counter-productive. There are many other things that could be done, like simply not granting such migrants access to the welfare system. Shut down the NGOs who pick up migrants in the Mediterranean, confiscate their funds and scuttle their boats. If migrants are picked up the Mediterranean, transport them back to the North African coast and disembark them there with food and enough money for traveling back home. If North African countries don't cooperate or are in state collapse like Libya, seize an enclave on the coast with military means. Push back migrants at the EU's borders (and yes, if they're getting violent, then they can and should be shot as a measure of last resort).
    Of course none of this will be done, because the political establishment wants this migration to happen, but if the political will were there, much could be done.

    Replies: @Beckow, @Yahya, @silviosilver

    Such fantasies are probably counter-productive.

    I’m not exactly being interviewed for television here. I obviously agree less drastic measures should be attempted first. However, my experience debating immigration boosters is they’ll contest every one of your suggestions with the hope of demonstrating that “nothing can be done.” Well, if all that fails, you can always try shooting, so in my reply to him, I just cut straight to the chase.

    Shooting does work. In 2018, Gaza Palestinians, probably on the advice NGO leftards, attempted a “March of Return”, to mark the 70th anniversary of their expulsion from Israel. If they thought Israelis would cuck, they had another thing coming. Israelis didn’t cuck, they opened fire. Stopped them cold – and those people actually had roots in the country they were trying to infiltrate, unlike the fake “refugees” trying to infiltrate Europe. According to Amnesty – which can be relied upon to maximize the number of casualties – 150 marchers were killed, which hardly amounts to a holocaust.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @silviosilver


    However, my experience debating immigration boosters
     
    I see it differently, imo those fantasies about sinking boats and strafing any survivors play into the false dichotomies commonly used by mass immigration proponents, as if the only alternatives were taking the migrants to Europe (permanently, granting them full access to welfare services, and eventually citizenship with all its political rights) or letting them die, or even outright killing them. I mean, I get the emotional impulse behind such fantasies, indeed share it myself, and writing them down here doesn't cause much harm, but as a tactic in a political debate they're a huge own goal. It would horrify even a lot of people who might be otherwise persuaded by anti-immigration arguments.
    Israel as an analogy doesn't work that well, because essentially there's still a kind of real military conflict going on there (even if it's rather one-sided by now), and despite all the pr it isn't really a Western country anyway, but a Mideastern one.
  550. German_reader says:
    @silviosilver
    @German_reader


    Such fantasies are probably counter-productive.
     
    I'm not exactly being interviewed for television here. I obviously agree less drastic measures should be attempted first. However, my experience debating immigration boosters is they'll contest every one of your suggestions with the hope of demonstrating that "nothing can be done." Well, if all that fails, you can always try shooting, so in my reply to him, I just cut straight to the chase.

    Shooting does work. In 2018, Gaza Palestinians, probably on the advice NGO leftards, attempted a "March of Return", to mark the 70th anniversary of their expulsion from Israel. If they thought Israelis would cuck, they had another thing coming. Israelis didn't cuck, they opened fire. Stopped them cold - and those people actually had roots in the country they were trying to infiltrate, unlike the fake "refugees" trying to infiltrate Europe. According to Amnesty - which can be relied upon to maximize the number of casualties - 150 marchers were killed, which hardly amounts to a holocaust.

    Replies: @German_reader

    However, my experience debating immigration boosters

    I see it differently, imo those fantasies about sinking boats and strafing any survivors play into the false dichotomies commonly used by mass immigration proponents, as if the only alternatives were taking the migrants to Europe (permanently, granting them full access to welfare services, and eventually citizenship with all its political rights) or letting them die, or even outright killing them. I mean, I get the emotional impulse behind such fantasies, indeed share it myself, and writing them down here doesn’t cause much harm, but as a tactic in a political debate they’re a huge own goal. It would horrify even a lot of people who might be otherwise persuaded by anti-immigration arguments.
    Israel as an analogy doesn’t work that well, because essentially there’s still a kind of real military conflict going on there (even if it’s rather one-sided by now), and despite all the pr it isn’t really a Western country anyway, but a Mideastern one.

  551. @Sher Singh
    @silviosilver

    Ultimately, people care about what they have an interest in.
    I care about White Christian survival due to concubines.

    Euro Pagans due to their being cousins. Why does a Slav care for Turks or Anglos?
    If it's just crass consumerism & a respect for modern amenities - that's a dead end.

    Replies: @Coconuts, @silviosilver

    I care about White Christian survival due to concubines.

    If you keep carrying on like that, you’re going to larp your way to an early grave, son.

    A belated reply to your post, because your nonsense ticks me off, but I was just watching the Canada v Croatia match, and goddam, the number of nigs on that team, it reminded me of my “silver rule” [silviosilver, geddit?]: if someone is a nighater, or gives me reliable indications that he may become a nighater, I shall do my best to mend fences, because this world of ours will require all the nighaters it can get its hands on if we are to survive the coming deluge. (We can kill each other later.)

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @silviosilver

    I don't hate niggers or whites - 1 is a demographic threat & 2 is an enabler.
    End the west to save the rest. E. Europe can quit its white larp & join up, anytime.

    Indian courtesans have been imported from the Graeco-Roman world from before Alexander.
    There's no larp nor do we make graves - I'm just done caring about unserious people.

    , @Wokechoke
    @silviosilver

    Oh Canada, why did they do it? I was astonished by the large numbers too.

  552. @German_reader
    @A123

    SPD and Greens are intending to push through wide-ranging changes to citizenship and naturalization laws. Stuff like automatically giving all children born in Germany citizenship if their parents have had legal residency for five years. Making it possible to acquire citizenship after just three years if "special efforts at integration" have been made (judging by some especially egregious cases under the old laws, like a Syrian who was naturalized after five years, this could even mean something like joining SPD and agitating for more funds and easier family reunification for migrants...more commonly it probably means something like attending an integration course and getting some low-paid job). Dual citizenship as standard, no obstacle to naturalization. And so on. The intention is quite blatantly to hand out citizenship to as many as possible of those who have come as refugees (or "refugees") since 2014/15. Of course heavily supported by the usual ethnic activists and by migration "scholars". For the SPD the motivation is probably also acquiring new voters, since otherwise their voter basis consists mainly of retarded boomers who are voting for them out of habit, because they already did so 40 years ago.
    Anyway, as your linked article says quite correctly, FDP are also mass immigration enthusiasts, but presumably they'd rather get skilled workers instead of welfare cases. There are also lots of other points of friction in the coalition on economic matters, notably about whether to keep the remaining nuclear power stations running. FDP is declining in polls, apparently quite a few of their voters are disappointed, and that could eventually become dangerous for the party (they were out of the Bundestag not that long ago and already looked like they were on their last legs).
    But in general, the outlook is of course totally bleak from my pov (also a factor why I have no sympathy for LatW's hysterical bs...my own nation, like all others in Western Europe, is being dismantled in record time, but somehow we're all supposed to care about the sanctity of Ukraine's 30-year old borders, even in cases like Crimea where those borders never made any sense. Just ridiculous).

    Replies: @A123

    To give credit to Germans where credit is due. Local resistance is picking up.

    The environment crazies tried to protest in Hamburg and were promptly ushered off (1). Video below [MORE].

    Their error made it easy for venue security to escort the cultural vandals out of the premises, all to the applause of the show’s audience.

    A man who appeared to be the show’s conductor walked out on stage as the crowd celebrated the removal of the cultural vandals.

    A German auto museum also dealt with some of these nutters recently. (2)

    a group called Scientist Rebellion took the sticky route when nine members glued their hands to the floor of the Porsche pavilion at Volkswagen’s Autostadt museum in Wolfsburg on Thursday.

    staff at the VW museum ignored the playbook. Instead of calling Wolfsburg police immediately, staff “recognized the right to protest,” then closed the pavilion for the evening and left — turning off the light and heat as they walked out.

    If the German people would back serious parties, AfD or a new Populist group, problems could be fixed. I do not understand why individuals with legitimate grievances cannot aggregate against an out of control elite leadership class.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.westernjournal.com/climate-protesters-humiliated-moments-gluing-concert-hall-conductors-stand-never-realized/

    (2) https://www.autoblog.com/2022/10/21/climate-protesters-glue-themselves-to-porsche-museum-germany/

    [MORE]

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @A123

    Oh yes, those climate activists are also constantly in the news (of course portrayed in a generally sympathetic light). They're now regularly blocking traffic in Berlin and other cities, with predictable results (there was controversy recently, when a woman riding a bicycle had been pinned under a truck, and a special vehicle that is used in such situations couldn't reach the accident site because of a blockade by climate activists...the woman subsequently died in hospital). Some mainstream conservatives have even suggested they might morph into terrorists, like the Baader-Meinhof group did in the early 1970s. Don't really care that much myself, but those privileged brats are certainly annoying, even if one thinks climate change is a serious issue (as I'm inclined to do).

    , @songbird
    @A123

    The Green movement would collapse, if they were given special housing that environmentally limited the temperature of their living quarters to 10 degrees Celsius.

  553. German_reader says:
    @Mikel
    @LatW


    Israel. Not Finland, not Switzerland. Israel.
     
    No. Switzerland is a far superior solution. It hasn't had a war in several centuries. Its combination of a credible military deterrence (which Ukraine now also has) and good relations with everybody spared them from being invaded even by the Nazis. Crucially, it is also a confederation. Every little canton belongs to the federation on a voluntary basis and has ample autonomy, including its own constitution, police and courts.

    Speaking of Nazis, if Ukraine tries to go for a Versailles humiliation, understandable as the desire might now be, it is not difficult to predict that it will sooner or later get a III Reich on its frontier. Even AK is now deriding Putin and the "Kremlins" in every second tweet. Large swaths of United Russia voters must be ready to support a hardliner challenge to the current order. It's time for statesmanship in order to avert a worse Russian threat for everybody in the future.

    Replies: @German_reader, @LatW, @AP

    if Ukraine tries to go for a Versailles humiliation

    Versailles was discussed a few months ago on Twitter by some of those pro-Ukrainian hardliners (e. g. Paul Massaro iirc) who fantasize about breaking up Russia, according to them the only issue with it was that it wasn’t harsh enough. And when one thinks about the implications of some statements from that corner (e. g. how Russian draft dodgers mustn’t be received in the EU at all, because all of them, without exception, are undoubtedly in favour of Russia’s war, they just don’t want to fight it themselves), it’s pretty clear that permanent enmity with Russia and Russians per se is taken for granted.
    Of course it’s still very questionable though if Ukraine will even be able to inflict the kind of defeat on Russia people like LatW seem to regard as possible or inevitable. I hope it doesn’t happen, but who knows, maybe there will be a Russian winter offensive, and all the people who are so sure now that talk about a ceasefire is their biggest problem, will be refuted by events.

    • Replies: @sudden death
    @German_reader


    maybe there will be a Russian winter offensive
     
    imho RF certainly will try to do another "Debaltsevo" with those new mobiks, the only question is scope and place - finishing taking Bakhmut/Avdeevka types just for "patriotic" distraction/show off after Kherson retreat or something more ambitious like rumours about reattacking Sumy/Chernigov again.

    Replies: @German_reader

  554. German_reader says:
    @A123
    @German_reader

    To give credit to Germans where credit is due. Local resistance is picking up.

    The environment crazies tried to protest in Hamburg and were promptly ushered off (1). Video below [MORE].


    Their error made it easy for venue security to escort the cultural vandals out of the premises, all to the applause of the show’s audience.

    A man who appeared to be the show’s conductor walked out on stage as the crowd celebrated the removal of the cultural vandals.

     

    A German auto museum also dealt with some of these nutters recently. (2)

    a group called Scientist Rebellion took the sticky route when nine members glued their hands to the floor of the Porsche pavilion at Volkswagen's Autostadt museum in Wolfsburg on Thursday.
    ...
    staff at the VW museum ignored the playbook. Instead of calling Wolfsburg police immediately, staff "recognized the right to protest," then closed the pavilion for the evening and left — turning off the light and heat as they walked out.

    https://davidicke.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/10/SCIENTISTS-ARE-PRATS-IMAGE-768x428.jpg

     

    If the German people would back serious parties, AfD or a new Populist group, problems could be fixed. I do not understand why individuals with legitimate grievances cannot aggregate against an out of control elite leadership class.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.westernjournal.com/climate-protesters-humiliated-moments-gluing-concert-hall-conductors-stand-never-realized/

    (2) https://www.autoblog.com/2022/10/21/climate-protesters-glue-themselves-to-porsche-museum-germany/



    https://twitter.com/IngridStangl1/status/1596144298877063168?s=20

    Replies: @German_reader, @songbird

    Oh yes, those climate activists are also constantly in the news (of course portrayed in a generally sympathetic light). They’re now regularly blocking traffic in Berlin and other cities, with predictable results (there was controversy recently, when a woman riding a bicycle had been pinned under a truck, and a special vehicle that is used in such situations couldn’t reach the accident site because of a blockade by climate activists…the woman subsequently died in hospital). Some mainstream conservatives have even suggested they might morph into terrorists, like the Baader-Meinhof group did in the early 1970s. Don’t really care that much myself, but those privileged brats are certainly annoying, even if one thinks climate change is a serious issue (as I’m inclined to do).

  555. @Matra
    Condolences to silviosilver who, pretending not to be a sportsball fan, is crying right now after Brazil took his boys to the woodshed. They should do better against Cameroon. Not too sure though about Switzerland. Do the so-called Swiss still have all those Albanians who helped slay their Chetnik enemies four years ago?

    Replies: @silviosilver, @silviosilver

    Who’s crying now, eh? 🙂

    I learned during the game that Canada’s goalkeeper was born a Krajina Serb, giving the contest something of a grudge match flavor.

    and writing them down here doesn’t cause much harm, but as a tactic in a political debate they’re a huge own goal. It would horrify even a lot of people who might be otherwise persuaded by anti-immigration arguments.

    Well of course. In a mainstream debate, I wouldn’t dream of mentioning anything like that. I wouldn’t even post that at Sailer’s. But people who’ve made their way to a site like this – to the Open Threads, in particular – probably have a strong sense that something is deeply wrong with the picture of reality they have been presented, and with them I think it’s worth pushing the envelope a little. Anyway, showmethereal is not some honest debater; he’s simply an anti-white pest.

    • Troll: showmethereal
    • Replies: @Matra
    @silviosilver

    It goes without saying, but I'll say it anyway, I wanted Croatia to win. It doesn't matter anyway. At last year's Euros Gareth Southgate clearly wanted the winning penalty to be scored by a black player to be immortalized in a thousand highlight reels for the next few decades. The British Left didn't get that so they settled on a black players are victims of racist abuse fake story instead. Canadian MSM/ruling class/woketards got most of what they could reasonably have expected out of this World Cup. An African born in a refugee camp in Liberia goes down in history as the first Canadian to score at a World Cup, unlike the almost entirely white team that represented Canada in Mexico 1986 who, as the MSM always remind the public, "failed to score a goal". The headlines have been written and school textbooks of the future will no doubt inform future generations of this glorious moment in history.

    Btw did you see the Jurgen Klinsmann analysis of the Iranians? "This is their culture" - ie. cheating & gamesmanship. Not that the world champion diver Klinsmann is in a position to attack others on this score.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    , @A123
    @silviosilver



    and writing them down here doesn’t cause much harm, but as a tactic in a political debate they’re a huge own goal. It would horrify even a lot of people who might be otherwise persuaded by anti-immigration arguments.
     
    Well of course. In a mainstream debate, I wouldn’t dream of mentioning anything like that
     
    I concur. The more practical steps are:

    • Allowing the illegal transport to dock
    • Imprisoning its crew for human trafficking & kidnapping
    • Scuttling the vessel for legal violations

    Money only works when it outweighs the risk. Life imprisonment for crew and loss of ship after one batch of Jihadists... The risk vastly exceeds the potential rewards.

    For MENA origin arrivals via small boat, returning them home to Africa (e.g. Rwanda) pending their asylum claims is simply good management. It is known that 90%+ of the applicants will be rejected. This way, rejects can be put on a bus or a very short flight. They cannot vanish into the underworld.

    An alternate site for obvious non-MENA origin could be setup elsewhere outside of the EU. For example, Serbia and/or Belarus could use the money. Again, this would accelerate sending failed applicants home when they do not get in.

    America's "Stay in Mexico" MPP program is both humane and an excellent model.

    PEACE 😇

  556. @German_reader
    @Beckow


    Polish boundaries are badly defined, their ambition exceeds their capabilities
     
    I don't think the boundaries are that badly defined today. Before the mass influx of Ukrainians, Poland was essentially a mono-ethnic state without any serious minority problems. They've won their struggle with Germany over territory (even if it doesn't seem to have registered with a lot of Poles). Agreed about the excessive ambitions though, all that talk about the powerful Intermarium bloc is a perfect example. imo it will end in tears.

    But Poles are still more coherent and disciplined than the Ukies.
     
    I can't say I like Poland all that much, but they're undoubtedly a part of "Europe", despite all the friction still intelligible to people further west. I'm far from convinced the same is true of Ukraine...what's one to think about a guy like Arestovych who supposedly once was an acolyte of Dugin and hung out in Moscow, doing who knows what? Big mistake for the Poles imo to get emotionally so invested in those Byzantine post-Soviet conflicts.

    Replies: @Beckow

    …the boundaries are that badly defined today

    Less than in the past, but the western, eastern and northern (Kaliningrad) borders are not fully settled – it is imaginable that it would change, esp. the cursed idea if Intermarium. Many Poles otherwise normal talk about their Intermarium dreams, usually when inebriated :)…

    Poles are European, maybe too much so… they consciously play up bad Euro habits like fake superiority, greed, mindless aggression. There is something atavistic about it, quite underdeveloped.

    Arestovych is a homo from a secret service and theatre background, bought and sold many times. In times of extreme strife weird characters making no sense pop up. Kiev is full of them, e.g. sweatpants Zelko. Historically the weirdos have no staying power, street clowns to distract. When things settle down they will be gone. If things settle down…

    • Replies: @AP
    @Beckow


    Arestovych is a homo
     
    He's been married twice and has three children. You?

    Replies: @songbird

  557. @German_reader
    @Mikel


    if Ukraine tries to go for a Versailles humiliation
     
    Versailles was discussed a few months ago on Twitter by some of those pro-Ukrainian hardliners (e. g. Paul Massaro iirc) who fantasize about breaking up Russia, according to them the only issue with it was that it wasn't harsh enough. And when one thinks about the implications of some statements from that corner (e. g. how Russian draft dodgers mustn't be received in the EU at all, because all of them, without exception, are undoubtedly in favour of Russia's war, they just don't want to fight it themselves), it's pretty clear that permanent enmity with Russia and Russians per se is taken for granted.
    Of course it's still very questionable though if Ukraine will even be able to inflict the kind of defeat on Russia people like LatW seem to regard as possible or inevitable. I hope it doesn't happen, but who knows, maybe there will be a Russian winter offensive, and all the people who are so sure now that talk about a ceasefire is their biggest problem, will be refuted by events.

    Replies: @sudden death

    maybe there will be a Russian winter offensive

    imho RF certainly will try to do another “Debaltsevo” with those new mobiks, the only question is scope and place – finishing taking Bakhmut/Avdeevka types just for “patriotic” distraction/show off after Kherson retreat or something more ambitious like rumours about reattacking Sumy/Chernigov again.

    • Thanks: German_reader
    • Replies: @German_reader
    @sudden death

    Arestovych apparently claimed back in October there was a 50/50 chance Russia would attempt another offensive against Kyiv during winter. Seems rather unlikely to me that something like this could succeed, but I can't claim to have much understanding of the military situation.

  558. @sudden death
    @German_reader


    maybe there will be a Russian winter offensive
     
    imho RF certainly will try to do another "Debaltsevo" with those new mobiks, the only question is scope and place - finishing taking Bakhmut/Avdeevka types just for "patriotic" distraction/show off after Kherson retreat or something more ambitious like rumours about reattacking Sumy/Chernigov again.

    Replies: @German_reader

    Arestovych apparently claimed back in October there was a 50/50 chance Russia would attempt another offensive against Kyiv during winter. Seems rather unlikely to me that something like this could succeed, but I can’t claim to have much understanding of the military situation.

  559. @silviosilver
    @Matra

    Who's crying now, eh? :)

    I learned during the game that Canada's goalkeeper was born a Krajina Serb, giving the contest something of a grudge match flavor.

    @German_reader


    and writing them down here doesn’t cause much harm, but as a tactic in a political debate they’re a huge own goal. It would horrify even a lot of people who might be otherwise persuaded by anti-immigration arguments.
     
    Well of course. In a mainstream debate, I wouldn't dream of mentioning anything like that. I wouldn't even post that at Sailer's. But people who've made their way to a site like this - to the Open Threads, in particular - probably have a strong sense that something is deeply wrong with the picture of reality they have been presented, and with them I think it's worth pushing the envelope a little. Anyway, showmethereal is not some honest debater; he's simply an anti-white pest.

    Replies: @Matra, @A123

    It goes without saying, but I’ll say it anyway, I wanted Croatia to win. It doesn’t matter anyway. At last year’s Euros Gareth Southgate clearly wanted the winning penalty to be scored by a black player to be immortalized in a thousand highlight reels for the next few decades. The British Left didn’t get that so they settled on a black players are victims of racist abuse fake story instead. Canadian MSM/ruling class/woketards got most of what they could reasonably have expected out of this World Cup. An African born in a refugee camp in Liberia goes down in history as the first Canadian to score at a World Cup, unlike the almost entirely white team that represented Canada in Mexico 1986 who, as the MSM always remind the public, “failed to score a goal”. The headlines have been written and school textbooks of the future will no doubt inform future generations of this glorious moment in history.

    Btw did you see the Jurgen Klinsmann analysis of the Iranians? “This is their culture” – ie. cheating & gamesmanship. Not that the world champion diver Klinsmann is in a position to attack others on this score.

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Matra

    How can you have a Battle of the Nations where the generals are mercenaries?

    I like the ATP 10X more at least. At the 2022 final in Turin that was a real Serb who beat a real Norwegian.

    (Also Denmark got hosed. Their entry got all his points too late to qualify. He could have smashed that Serb.)

    Replies: @Matra

  560. @silviosilver
    @Matra

    Who's crying now, eh? :)

    I learned during the game that Canada's goalkeeper was born a Krajina Serb, giving the contest something of a grudge match flavor.

    @German_reader


    and writing them down here doesn’t cause much harm, but as a tactic in a political debate they’re a huge own goal. It would horrify even a lot of people who might be otherwise persuaded by anti-immigration arguments.
     
    Well of course. In a mainstream debate, I wouldn't dream of mentioning anything like that. I wouldn't even post that at Sailer's. But people who've made their way to a site like this - to the Open Threads, in particular - probably have a strong sense that something is deeply wrong with the picture of reality they have been presented, and with them I think it's worth pushing the envelope a little. Anyway, showmethereal is not some honest debater; he's simply an anti-white pest.

    Replies: @Matra, @A123

    and writing them down here doesn’t cause much harm, but as a tactic in a political debate they’re a huge own goal. It would horrify even a lot of people who might be otherwise persuaded by anti-immigration arguments.

    Well of course. In a mainstream debate, I wouldn’t dream of mentioning anything like that

    I concur. The more practical steps are:

    • Allowing the illegal transport to dock
    • Imprisoning its crew for human trafficking & kidnapping
    • Scuttling the vessel for legal violations

    Money only works when it outweighs the risk. Life imprisonment for crew and loss of ship after one batch of Jihadists… The risk vastly exceeds the potential rewards.

    For MENA origin arrivals via small boat, returning them home to Africa (e.g. Rwanda) pending their asylum claims is simply good management. It is known that 90%+ of the applicants will be rejected. This way, rejects can be put on a bus or a very short flight. They cannot vanish into the underworld.

    An alternate site for obvious non-MENA origin could be setup elsewhere outside of the EU. For example, Serbia and/or Belarus could use the money. Again, this would accelerate sending failed applicants home when they do not get in.

    America’s “Stay in Mexico” MPP program is both humane and an excellent model.

    PEACE 😇

  561. @Matra
    @silviosilver

    It goes without saying, but I'll say it anyway, I wanted Croatia to win. It doesn't matter anyway. At last year's Euros Gareth Southgate clearly wanted the winning penalty to be scored by a black player to be immortalized in a thousand highlight reels for the next few decades. The British Left didn't get that so they settled on a black players are victims of racist abuse fake story instead. Canadian MSM/ruling class/woketards got most of what they could reasonably have expected out of this World Cup. An African born in a refugee camp in Liberia goes down in history as the first Canadian to score at a World Cup, unlike the almost entirely white team that represented Canada in Mexico 1986 who, as the MSM always remind the public, "failed to score a goal". The headlines have been written and school textbooks of the future will no doubt inform future generations of this glorious moment in history.

    Btw did you see the Jurgen Klinsmann analysis of the Iranians? "This is their culture" - ie. cheating & gamesmanship. Not that the world champion diver Klinsmann is in a position to attack others on this score.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    How can you have a Battle of the Nations where the generals are mercenaries?

    I like the ATP 10X more at least. At the 2022 final in Turin that was a real Serb who beat a real Norwegian.

    (Also Denmark got hosed. Their entry got all his points too late to qualify. He could have smashed that Serb.)

    • Replies: @Matra
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    Djokovic got hosed all year. He didn't get his points for Wimbledon (Russians and Belarusians banned outright) and he couldn't play Australia or the US because of vaccine mandates. These days I only watch tennis majors and international football tournaments. Leaving aside the crass politicization of sports which has put me off all of them there's the problem of changing broadcast rights requiring either a cable/satellite TV package or different paid apps for each league. Watching sports is something we can all do a lot less of, sticking to more productive activities like arguing on Unz.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Emil Nikola Richard, @A123

  562. Sher Singh says:
    @silviosilver
    @showmethereal


    When did I claim China was an innocent angel?
     
    I didn't say you claimed it. I brought it up as a way to demonstrate my evenhandedness on the issue of illegal infiltration. (A gesture of congeniality you've evidently chosen to throw back in my face. Noted.)

    Shoot all you want and show the world how bloodthirsty you are.
     
    The "world" (ie those parts of it keenest to export their useless riffraff) might howl in impotent rage, but would it do? It protests but ultimately does nothing when NATO forces launch military operations - which, unlike defending yourself, actually can be described as "bloodthirsty" - so my guess is nothing would happen. I'm willing to try and find out anyway.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @showmethereal

    You’re a refugee yourself, and one made so as a direct result of NATO intervention.
    You slyly try to change the narrative to 19th C colonies rather than 21st C wars.

    It’s completely depraved & it’s funny seeing white nationalist E. Euros.
    The West already moved on from racialism & they’re left howling like retards – alone.

    • Agree: showmethereal
  563. Sher Singh says:
    @silviosilver
    @Sher Singh


    I care about White Christian survival due to concubines.
     
    If you keep carrying on like that, you're going to larp your way to an early grave, son.

    A belated reply to your post, because your nonsense ticks me off, but I was just watching the Canada v Croatia match, and goddam, the number of nigs on that team, it reminded me of my "silver rule" [silviosilver, geddit?]: if someone is a nighater, or gives me reliable indications that he may become a nighater, I shall do my best to mend fences, because this world of ours will require all the nighaters it can get its hands on if we are to survive the coming deluge. (We can kill each other later.)

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @Wokechoke

    I don’t hate niggers or whites – 1 is a demographic threat & 2 is an enabler.
    End the west to save the rest. E. Europe can quit its white larp & join up, anytime.

    Indian courtesans have been imported from the Graeco-Roman world from before Alexander.
    There’s no larp nor do we make graves – I’m just done caring about unserious people.

  564. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Matra

    How can you have a Battle of the Nations where the generals are mercenaries?

    I like the ATP 10X more at least. At the 2022 final in Turin that was a real Serb who beat a real Norwegian.

    (Also Denmark got hosed. Their entry got all his points too late to qualify. He could have smashed that Serb.)

    Replies: @Matra

    Djokovic got hosed all year. He didn’t get his points for Wimbledon (Russians and Belarusians banned outright) and he couldn’t play Australia or the US because of vaccine mandates. These days I only watch tennis majors and international football tournaments. Leaving aside the crass politicization of sports which has put me off all of them there’s the problem of changing broadcast rights requiring either a cable/satellite TV package or different paid apps for each league. Watching sports is something we can all do a lot less of, sticking to more productive activities like arguing on Unz.

    • LOL: Sher Singh
    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Matra


    sticking to more productive activities like arguing on Unz.
     
    It’s certainly a more entertaining activity, but hardly more productive.

    Replies: @Yahya

    , @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Matra


    problem of changing broadcast rights requiring either a cable/satellite TV package
     
    You tube highlight clips have almost all the important stuff.

    A couple years ago there was a game changing controversial call that they replayed five different angles so the paid subscribers at home could all make up their own mind and that wasn't in the highlights. I can't even remember which year it was. Tampa Bay Kansas City super bowl. OK let me think about this for twenty seconds. It was the one in Feb 2021. I have to think for a minute to come up with something important that wasn't there for free the same day!

    , @A123
    @Matra


    Leaving aside the crass politicization of sports which has put me off all of them there’s the problem of changing broadcast rights requiring either a cable/satellite TV package or different paid apps for each league.
     
    You can enjoy 100% of U.S. IMSA competition for free with no package -- Those in countries with no broadcast deal can find a live feed.

    https://www.imsa.com/tvlive/

    In the U.S., Canada, and other countries with live deals the replays are available here (usually only 3 days after the event):

    https://www.youtube.com/c/imsaofficial/videos

    Watching sports is something we can all do a lot less of, sticking to more productive activities like arguing on Unz.
     
    Watching the Rolex 24 Hours of Daytona can be done in parallel with posting on Unz. Its a twofer.

    Right now I am catching up on some European racing that I missed some months ago:

    https://www.youtube.com/user/gt1world

    PEACE 😇

     
    https://cdn.lsr-freun.de/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/magz225-768x266.jpg

    Replies: @showmethereal

  565. @Matra
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    Djokovic got hosed all year. He didn't get his points for Wimbledon (Russians and Belarusians banned outright) and he couldn't play Australia or the US because of vaccine mandates. These days I only watch tennis majors and international football tournaments. Leaving aside the crass politicization of sports which has put me off all of them there's the problem of changing broadcast rights requiring either a cable/satellite TV package or different paid apps for each league. Watching sports is something we can all do a lot less of, sticking to more productive activities like arguing on Unz.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Emil Nikola Richard, @A123

    sticking to more productive activities like arguing on Unz.

    It’s certainly a more entertaining activity, but hardly more productive.

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @AnonfromTN


    It’s certainly a more entertaining activity, but hardly more productive.

     

    It's more productive in that you learn a great deal from spending time on this website, if of course you use it properly (same is true of any intellectual website). Watching sports gives the entertainment aspect, but you don't come out any wiser.

    Evidently one of the great strengths of Unz is the free speech environment that allows people to advocate for shooting illegal migrants without getting the least amount of backlash. Almost impossible anywhere else. One of the downsides is that it attracts a lot of nutters. On the other hand some reasonably sane and intelligent people are also attracted by the freedom given here. I should point out that Unz review isn't completely "free" to any intellectual debate. There are certain topics or positions that will immediately attract scorn and derision from the majority of commentors; one of which is pro-migration attitudes; the other (though not pertinent to this blog) is philo-Semitic or philo-Zionist viewpoints. Inevitably an intellectual gathering place will attract like-minded people who will proceed to set-up their own "zone of comfort" where they refuse viewpoints which run counter to their cherished beliefs. Unz review is no exception. On the other hand, TUR allows a great deal of diverse opinions to be aired on certain topics like the Russia-Ukraine conflict; and this is where its unique strengths start to shine.

    I think for me and most commentors here the main attraction is the commenting system and users, as demonstrated by the fact that we comment here without needing a columnist or blogger to lead the discussion.

    Replies: @German_reader, @AnonfromTN, @Emil Nikola Richard

  566. Sher Singh says:

    https://www.reuters.com/world/americas/canada-launches-new-indo-pacific-strategy-focus-disruptive-china-2022-11-27/

    https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/canada-china-trudeau-xi-taiwan-1.6664854

    Focus on cybersecurity – means they’ll continue to poke India who’s buttmad at Sikhs.
    More people turn out for Sikh referendums than local elections lol.

    Hindus leak fluid even when they’re 80-90% it’s weird..

    [MORE]

    lol

    Hindus crying after 2 Jatts storm 100s of them.

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @Sher Singh

    What is the condition now? Do Sikhs want their own state. Is there potential for another “war”?

    Also how did so many get to Toronto? Is it for religious reasons they left India or just economic? I see loads of them when I go to Toronto. Especially in the Brampton area - there is a huge temple on a main road.

    Replies: @Sher Singh

  567. @Matra
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    Djokovic got hosed all year. He didn't get his points for Wimbledon (Russians and Belarusians banned outright) and he couldn't play Australia or the US because of vaccine mandates. These days I only watch tennis majors and international football tournaments. Leaving aside the crass politicization of sports which has put me off all of them there's the problem of changing broadcast rights requiring either a cable/satellite TV package or different paid apps for each league. Watching sports is something we can all do a lot less of, sticking to more productive activities like arguing on Unz.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Emil Nikola Richard, @A123

    problem of changing broadcast rights requiring either a cable/satellite TV package

    You tube highlight clips have almost all the important stuff.

    A couple years ago there was a game changing controversial call that they replayed five different angles so the paid subscribers at home could all make up their own mind and that wasn’t in the highlights. I can’t even remember which year it was. Tampa Bay Kansas City super bowl. OK let me think about this for twenty seconds. It was the one in Feb 2021. I have to think for a minute to come up with something important that wasn’t there for free the same day!

  568. @Matra
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    Djokovic got hosed all year. He didn't get his points for Wimbledon (Russians and Belarusians banned outright) and he couldn't play Australia or the US because of vaccine mandates. These days I only watch tennis majors and international football tournaments. Leaving aside the crass politicization of sports which has put me off all of them there's the problem of changing broadcast rights requiring either a cable/satellite TV package or different paid apps for each league. Watching sports is something we can all do a lot less of, sticking to more productive activities like arguing on Unz.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Emil Nikola Richard, @A123

    Leaving aside the crass politicization of sports which has put me off all of them there’s the problem of changing broadcast rights requiring either a cable/satellite TV package or different paid apps for each league.

    You can enjoy 100% of U.S. IMSA competition for free with no package — Those in countries with no broadcast deal can find a live feed.

    https://www.imsa.com/tvlive/

    In the U.S., Canada, and other countries with live deals the replays are available here (usually only 3 days after the event):

    https://www.youtube.com/c/imsaofficial/videos

    Watching sports is something we can all do a lot less of, sticking to more productive activities like arguing on Unz.

    Watching the Rolex 24 Hours of Daytona can be done in parallel with posting on Unz. Its a twofer.

    Right now I am catching up on some European racing that I missed some months ago:

    https://www.youtube.com/user/gt1world

    PEACE 😇

     

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @A123

    24 hour Nurburgring is the most exciting - lol. LeMans had been neutered in the name of environmentalism and cutting costs. But Le Mans used to be in the top 2 also

    Replies: @A123

  569. Some pretty insane numbers coming out of Ireland: (from beginning of Oct)

    -207,843 PPS numbers (similar to social security number) issued so far this year
    -only about 22.8% of those for births in Ireland (and one can wonder what percentage of these are actually Irish births)

    • Replies: @Coconuts
    @songbird

    I also watched Keith's video last night.

    It looks like they are trying to play accelerated catch up with some of the other North-West Euro countries in terms of demographic change. Hate speech laws only appeared in the UK about 50 years after migration started for example, and it took a while for them to really come into effect. They do seem to be a powerful and effective tool for controlling discussion of the topic though.

    Is this the influence of NGOs and corporate interests from Europe and other parts of the Anglo world? It's hard to understand what advantage Ireland gains from encouraging unfiltered immigration.

    Some interesting data points on what is going on in the UK at present:

    https://unherd.com/thepost/report-critical-race-theory-is-endemic-in-british-schools/

    https://www.spiked-online.com/2022/11/22/critical-race-theory-is-being-taught-as-fact/

    In the 2nd link there is a reference to the apparently quite widespread belief that the UK was a country founded on racism. The Museum of London apparently now has a display suggesting that a typical inhabitant of Roman London was a Sub-Saharan woman with mixed race children.

    This guy is one of the best mainstream or centre-left commentators on the issue, he is not as pessimistic:

    https://unherd.com/thepost/migration-numbers-are-not-as-bad-as-they-look/

    Things Ireland may have to look forward to in the future.

    Replies: @songbird

  570. @showmethereal
    @LatW

    Again what does a newspaper article have to do with officials interfering? You know what an opinion piece bs policy means - right? And he specific… the only thing I read is them telling Europe to stop blindly following the U.S. in its anti China crusade. That is directly about Chinese and European relations- not a 3rd part conflict. It is the exact opposite. Telling Europe to keep a 3rd party out of their own relations

    Replies: @LatW

    I understand what you mean about 3rd parties, it’s a problematic issue (even if inevitable in many cases). In that regard, I understand very well where Hu Xijin from Global Times is coming from (he is just being protective of his nation). Remember that other nations feel that way, too. It’s partly the fault of E.Europeans that they did not provide enough information to China. Even if you are going to stay on Russia’s side, you would still have better information.

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @LatW

    Well I can respect your comment then…. But please clarify the “better information” from Eastern Europe would be (I assume the context you mean is Ukraine/Russia)?

    Replies: @LatW

  571. @Yahya
    @German_reader


    If North African countries don’t cooperate or are in state collapse like Libya, seize an enclave on the coast with military means.
     
    Wtf, ever heard of the concept of national sovereignty?

    If you’re going to flagrantly violate other people’s sovereignty, what’s to stop others from calling out your hypocrisy when you pull the “sovereignty” card to argue for the enforcement of immigration laws in your country?

    A more just approach would be to offer North African states money in exchange for co-operation on migration issues. Given their general state of penuriousness, they’ll probably oblige for a small sum.

    No need to bring out your inner imperialist.

    Of course given the pathetic state for the German military (by some measures behind Egypt’s and Turkey’s), you are also in no position to make such threats anyway.

    Replies: @German_reader, @KidDynamite

    Of course given the pathetic state for the German military (by some measures behind Egypt’s and Turkey’s), you are also in no position to make such threats anyway.

    Going back to my point about never losing a martial edge. High-falutin’ poetry and music will not keep people from assaulting your borders, only the explicit or implicit threat that – you send any young armed men here, we will send them back in plastic bags. It’s what those illiterate goat-herders did in Afghanistan until we finally got the message and tired of it and left.

    As it is, I see places like Egypt concentrate their Olympic medal efforts in things like wrestling, weightlifting and martial arts…I’m seeing Morocco produce very solid kick boxers…leave badminton and ping pong for the nerds.

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @KidDynamite

    So are you going to return permanently under your old moniker, or is this temporary?

    How long have you been lurking here?

    Peace.

  572. @A123
    @German_reader

    To give credit to Germans where credit is due. Local resistance is picking up.

    The environment crazies tried to protest in Hamburg and were promptly ushered off (1). Video below [MORE].


    Their error made it easy for venue security to escort the cultural vandals out of the premises, all to the applause of the show’s audience.

    A man who appeared to be the show’s conductor walked out on stage as the crowd celebrated the removal of the cultural vandals.

     

    A German auto museum also dealt with some of these nutters recently. (2)

    a group called Scientist Rebellion took the sticky route when nine members glued their hands to the floor of the Porsche pavilion at Volkswagen's Autostadt museum in Wolfsburg on Thursday.
    ...
    staff at the VW museum ignored the playbook. Instead of calling Wolfsburg police immediately, staff "recognized the right to protest," then closed the pavilion for the evening and left — turning off the light and heat as they walked out.

    https://davidicke.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/10/SCIENTISTS-ARE-PRATS-IMAGE-768x428.jpg

     

    If the German people would back serious parties, AfD or a new Populist group, problems could be fixed. I do not understand why individuals with legitimate grievances cannot aggregate against an out of control elite leadership class.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.westernjournal.com/climate-protesters-humiliated-moments-gluing-concert-hall-conductors-stand-never-realized/

    (2) https://www.autoblog.com/2022/10/21/climate-protesters-glue-themselves-to-porsche-museum-germany/



    https://twitter.com/IngridStangl1/status/1596144298877063168?s=20

    Replies: @German_reader, @songbird

    The Green movement would collapse, if they were given special housing that environmentally limited the temperature of their living quarters to 10 degrees Celsius.

  573. @Mr. Hack
    @showmethereal


    It’s just sad to me that western Ukraine would turn on their Slavic brethren like that.
     
    This sounds like a very naïve characterization of what's going on in Ukraine, especiall for somebody to make who likes to garner his information from "many independent sources as possible" including "local sources' as well? Have you included any local Ukrainian sources to your viewing list (quite frankly, it doesn't sound like you do)?

    Western Ukraine? How do you come up with that? All of the main direction for the war comes from Kyiv in the center, the seat of the national government. Zelensky and the vast majority of his advisors are from all over Ukraine. You sound like you're stuck in some sort of a time warp harpening back to the 1980's?

    Replies: @showmethereal

    What is naive? Since you think you know so much explain…. Most the Ukrainian sources I see on the internet are junk.
    And what are questioning about the difference of western Ukraine? I’m pretty sure by now you have heard of groups like the Right Sector – let alone the Azov. I only became interested in Ukraine in 2014. 1) I knew it was going to turn into a disaster when I saw Nuland and gang playing puppet master 2) I wondered what type of psychopaths would attack gov buildings or would chase people into a building and set it on fire as happened in Odessa.

    And I experientially only know 1 Ukrainian. Nice woman. Except she is very arrogant toward Russians. Never made sense to me – especially since she lives in what you would call a third world country and says she preferred it to conditions in her native Ukraine – and this was before the conflagrations

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @showmethereal


    Most the Ukrainian sources I see on the internet are junk.
     
    Which ones might those be? I want to make sure that I avoid reading them.

    And what are questioning about the difference of western Ukraine? I’m pretty sure by now you have heard of groups like the Right Sector – let alone the Azov.
     
    You're the one that first made the insinuation that "It’s just sad to me that western Ukraine would turn on their Slavic brethren like that." So you chose to pinpoint Western Ukraine as somehow being the disloyal Slavic brethren, turning on Russia, when, as we all know that it was first Russia that decided to forgo peaceful means with Ukraine and invaded to "chase Nazis"and other such nonsense, killing tens of thousands of Ukrainian civilians in the process.

    Replies: @showmethereal

  574. @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @showmethereal


    As someone else outed you
     
    Who are you referring to? Name his name and I'll address him directly.

    I'm anti-:

    - Death by a thousand cuts

    - Opium addiction

    - Eunuch bureaucracy

    - Female infanticide, footbinding

    - Massive civil wars and depopulation events

    - Massive famines and occurrence of cannibalism, euphemized as “two-legged goat” (https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/兩腳羊)

    - "When you conceal your will from others, that is Thick. When you impose your will on others, that is Black (Dark)." (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thick_Black_Theory)

    - "being anti-America is work, living in America is life" (反美是工作、留美是生活).[11] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sima_Nan)

    If that makes me anti-China then I'm anti-China.

    Fact is China and Russia solved their issues. They have no animosity.
     
    Good, I hope that relationship goes better than it did last time.

    Stalin and Kim started the Korean War that ended in nearly a million Chinese casualties. After Great Leap Forward, Cultural Revolution, Sino-Soviet Split, Deng had to come to Japan and give the saikeirei 最敬礼 “the most respectful gesture” to the Hinomaru 日の丸.

    https://i.postimg.cc/G3svHXhx/t9r7chbkh2o71.jpg

    Replies: @A123, @showmethereal

    You would see the comment clearly they said it to you if you weren’t rabid in your anti China nonsense.
    Mock at history all you want – history is going back to what it has normally been in Asia for much of history. You can’t hide under the US skirt forever. Just pray for yourself that man mg don’t want to settle any blood debt. (But you probably aren’t even Japanese but an American who got obsessed with Japan from watching anime).
    Pride always comes before a fall. You will look at smart as you did when Costa Rica just beat Japan at the World Cup. What’s that you were saying about idiots and not knowing sports???

    • Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @showmethereal

    I left the conversation because I don't think you can actually read and write Chinese.

    If you are actually literate you should be able to easily identify the source and meaning of this passage--

    https://i.postimg.cc/DybxsJXy/ea852f1db8fdd385.jpg

    Replies: @showmethereal

  575. @Mikel
    @LatW


    Israel. Not Finland, not Switzerland. Israel.
     
    No. Switzerland is a far superior solution. It hasn't had a war in several centuries. Its combination of a credible military deterrence (which Ukraine now also has) and good relations with everybody spared them from being invaded even by the Nazis. Crucially, it is also a confederation. Every little canton belongs to the federation on a voluntary basis and has ample autonomy, including its own constitution, police and courts.

    Speaking of Nazis, if Ukraine tries to go for a Versailles humiliation, understandable as the desire might now be, it is not difficult to predict that it will sooner or later get a III Reich on its frontier. Even AK is now deriding Putin and the "Kremlins" in every second tweet. Large swaths of United Russia voters must be ready to support a hardliner challenge to the current order. It's time for statesmanship in order to avert a worse Russian threat for everybody in the future.

    Replies: @German_reader, @LatW, @AP

    Switzerland is a far superior solution. It hasn’t had a war in several centuries

    Switzerland is a good example and often touted as an example to follow by both Ukrainian and Baltic nationalists. However, we have a worse geographic positioning than Switzerland (I will not go into the reasons why the Nazis didn’t manage to occupy Switzerland, the reasons go beyond “every man having a rifle”, but just note that the dynamic between Germany and countries such as Switzerland, Denmark and Norway is a little different that the ethnic dynamic in the former Russian Empire).

    [MORE]

    it is not difficult to predict that it will sooner or later get a III Reich on its frontier

    This pseudo Reich will never turn into a real Reich. They simply don’t have what it takes for it. Above all organizational skills. The way that the USSR was built was based on both co-operation and coercion of all participants. Russia is trying to replicate that (for example, enlisting a lot of minorities to fight a war for Russian ethnic goals), but it’s not working, because the main component, the Ukrainian, is no longer there. But of course they will pose a real threat in the future, if the Russians themselves do not change (not many hopes there), so Israelization would be good. As Arestovych said, there is a struggle over who own’s the heritage of Kyiv (not a great situation, but it is reality and the historical fate). Of course, in the EE format, with EE customs, without some of those negatives that Israel is having to deal with. Ukraine won’t lack arable land and will have more friends near by.

    Also, since you bring up Versailles. The Russian character is such that they always feel that they are owed something. That probably won’t go away…. ever.

  576. @Yahya
    @showmethereal


    Korea was divided by the U.S. and Soviets.

     

    The Korean War was essentially fought by the Chinese on the communist side. North Korea only fielded a 1/5th of China's troops. The Soviets not even a percentage.

    No Chinese intervention = no North Korea.


    https://external-preview.redd.it/tZgO7-QCGzypUHWbkKYsKnJQaLt2qZV3L54Loe_nBdw.jpg?auto=webp&s=46fee86bc60a68b79484fb4324b2af649195657f


    China is responsible for keeping North Korea alive during its infancy.


    China saved the Kim’s only because it didn’t want the US at its border.

     

    China has enough nukes now to lay the entire planet to waste. You think this whole "we don't want the US on our border" is a good excuse for keeping 26M intelligent, capable North Koreans in a state of deprivation and tyranny, when they could've been living the high life like their ethno-racial brothers across the border?

    Replies: @showmethereal

    You skip the FACTS. Soviets installed Kim. US and Soviets divided Korea. China has NEVER controlled the Kim’s. It fought in the war when the US got to the Yalu River. It was US arrogance that caused China to flood into Korea. Those are facts. China does not tell Kim how to run NK. In fact most of the consumer goods NK get is smuggled in by those who work in China. Most dissidents who escape North Korea to get to the South do so via China. They don’t cross the DMZ. All governments involved know this. So stop making up stuff. China “saved” North Vietnam too for the same reason it saved North Korea. It didn’t want the US at its border. Only difference is the North Vietnamese were able to flood the South while the Chinese soldiers stayed in North Vietnam. Vietnam on its own chose to reform its economy – like China did. So if you blame China for North Korea then you should give China credit for the next Asian economic miracle – which is Vietnam. But your bias is there. Or maybe you genuinely don’t know the history…. I can’t say

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @showmethereal

    You are a CCP shill. No point in "debating" with you.

    Replies: @showmethereal

  577. @AnonfromTN
    @Matra


    sticking to more productive activities like arguing on Unz.
     
    It’s certainly a more entertaining activity, but hardly more productive.

    Replies: @Yahya

    It’s certainly a more entertaining activity, but hardly more productive.

    It’s more productive in that you learn a great deal from spending time on this website, if of course you use it properly (same is true of any intellectual website). Watching sports gives the entertainment aspect, but you don’t come out any wiser.

    Evidently one of the great strengths of Unz is the free speech environment that allows people to advocate for shooting illegal migrants without getting the least amount of backlash. Almost impossible anywhere else. One of the downsides is that it attracts a lot of nutters. On the other hand some reasonably sane and intelligent people are also attracted by the freedom given here. I should point out that Unz review isn’t completely “free” to any intellectual debate. There are certain topics or positions that will immediately attract scorn and derision from the majority of commentors; one of which is pro-migration attitudes; the other (though not pertinent to this blog) is philo-Semitic or philo-Zionist viewpoints. Inevitably an intellectual gathering place will attract like-minded people who will proceed to set-up their own “zone of comfort” where they refuse viewpoints which run counter to their cherished beliefs. Unz review is no exception. On the other hand, TUR allows a great deal of diverse opinions to be aired on certain topics like the Russia-Ukraine conflict; and this is where its unique strengths start to shine.

    I think for me and most commentors here the main attraction is the commenting system and users, as demonstrated by the fact that we comment here without needing a columnist or blogger to lead the discussion.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @Yahya


    the other (though not pertinent to this blog) is philo-Semitic or philo-Zionist viewpoints
     
    There have been several Jewish commenters on the site over the years, also some pretty pro-Israel gentiles. For a site that features so much antisemitic content, the commentariat is suprisingly non-uniform in this regard.
    As for "pro-migration attitudes", sure (though there have been commenters with such views). But since those are utterly dominant in media and politics throughout the West, they're hardly needed for balance.
    , @AnonfromTN
    @Yahya

    I agree with most of your points, except about entertainment value. I find watching sports incredibly boring. Maybe because there is nothing in it to engage my brain (little gray cells, as Poirot used to say).


    philo-Semitic
     
    Some commenters here express views that are ridiculously skewed to pro-Israel. E. g., demonizing Iranian regime like the dumbest Israeli propagandists. But overall, reading comments here is indeed educational. Even though some commenters are almost 100% predictable, sometimes they post something interesting outside of the area of their mania. That’s why I do not ban anyone: humans are quite interesting, particularly when they say and do unexpected things.

    Replies: @A123

    , @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Yahya


    Watching sports gives the entertainment aspect, but you don’t come out any wiser.
     
    Between the public contest and the obsessive scrutiny there are important true facts that are revealed in the world of sports news available in no other media. For the broader public the most accurate information covered almost nowhere else for Corona virus 2020-2021 was on MMA announcer Joe Rogan and NFL pundit Pat McAfee's podcasts. For many millions of people these were the only places they got even a hint the official story was the official cover story.

    Replies: @Barbarossa

  578. @KidDynamite
    @Yahya


    Of course given the pathetic state for the German military (by some measures behind Egypt’s and Turkey’s), you are also in no position to make such threats anyway.
     
    Going back to my point about never losing a martial edge. High-falutin’ poetry and music will not keep people from assaulting your borders, only the explicit or implicit threat that - you send any young armed men here, we will send them back in plastic bags. It’s what those illiterate goat-herders did in Afghanistan until we finally got the message and tired of it and left.

    As it is, I see places like Egypt concentrate their Olympic medal efforts in things like wrestling, weightlifting and martial arts...I’m seeing Morocco produce very solid kick boxers...leave badminton and ping pong for the nerds.

    Replies: @Yahya

    So are you going to return permanently under your old moniker, or is this temporary?

    How long have you been lurking here?

    Peace.

  579. German_reader says:
    @Yahya
    @AnonfromTN


    It’s certainly a more entertaining activity, but hardly more productive.

     

    It's more productive in that you learn a great deal from spending time on this website, if of course you use it properly (same is true of any intellectual website). Watching sports gives the entertainment aspect, but you don't come out any wiser.

    Evidently one of the great strengths of Unz is the free speech environment that allows people to advocate for shooting illegal migrants without getting the least amount of backlash. Almost impossible anywhere else. One of the downsides is that it attracts a lot of nutters. On the other hand some reasonably sane and intelligent people are also attracted by the freedom given here. I should point out that Unz review isn't completely "free" to any intellectual debate. There are certain topics or positions that will immediately attract scorn and derision from the majority of commentors; one of which is pro-migration attitudes; the other (though not pertinent to this blog) is philo-Semitic or philo-Zionist viewpoints. Inevitably an intellectual gathering place will attract like-minded people who will proceed to set-up their own "zone of comfort" where they refuse viewpoints which run counter to their cherished beliefs. Unz review is no exception. On the other hand, TUR allows a great deal of diverse opinions to be aired on certain topics like the Russia-Ukraine conflict; and this is where its unique strengths start to shine.

    I think for me and most commentors here the main attraction is the commenting system and users, as demonstrated by the fact that we comment here without needing a columnist or blogger to lead the discussion.

    Replies: @German_reader, @AnonfromTN, @Emil Nikola Richard

    the other (though not pertinent to this blog) is philo-Semitic or philo-Zionist viewpoints

    There have been several Jewish commenters on the site over the years, also some pretty pro-Israel gentiles. For a site that features so much antisemitic content, the commentariat is suprisingly non-uniform in this regard.
    As for “pro-migration attitudes”, sure (though there have been commenters with such views). But since those are utterly dominant in media and politics throughout the West, they’re hardly needed for balance.

  580. @showmethereal
    @Yahya

    You skip the FACTS. Soviets installed Kim. US and Soviets divided Korea. China has NEVER controlled the Kim’s. It fought in the war when the US got to the Yalu River. It was US arrogance that caused China to flood into Korea. Those are facts. China does not tell Kim how to run NK. In fact most of the consumer goods NK get is smuggled in by those who work in China. Most dissidents who escape North Korea to get to the South do so via China. They don’t cross the DMZ. All governments involved know this. So stop making up stuff. China “saved” North Vietnam too for the same reason it saved North Korea. It didn’t want the US at its border. Only difference is the North Vietnamese were able to flood the South while the Chinese soldiers stayed in North Vietnam. Vietnam on its own chose to reform its economy - like China did. So if you blame China for North Korea then you should give China credit for the next Asian economic miracle - which is Vietnam. But your bias is there. Or maybe you genuinely don’t know the history…. I can’t say

    Replies: @Yahya

    You are a CCP shill. No point in “debating” with you.

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @Yahya

    Typical of people who can’t defend their points to use (insert whoever) “shill” accusations. I stated facts while you repeated the western narrative. Seems you expect China to let North Korea economically collapse. North Korea is more educated and has a larger population than Cuba. Has Cuba collapsed? Whose “fault” is that????

    I will leave you with two more points. The current Kim had his brother assassinated at that airport in Malaysia. Do you know why? His brother was living for years under protection in China. Kim feared China and South Korea were plotting together to have him be the new leader. So once he left China - he had him killed. And you are going to sit here and claim China is able to control North Korea? It’s absolutely nonsense western narrative.


    And for the record - when the Korean War happened China had no nukes. It went toe to toe with the US only a few years after the US dropped atomic bombs on Japan. Having enemies at the gate is no light thing. That is why China understands why Russia is standing up against NATO expansion. When China helped North Vietnam it had nukes (which it developed because the U.S. threatened it during the Korean War). If you claim China controls North Korea then they could have given Vietnam nukes and done the same thing you claim it did with Korea. But no China didn’t control Vietnam either… so they ended up fighting a few years later because China was mad Vietnam invaded Cambodia. Facts…. No shilling.

    If I was a shill I would claim China is going to win the 2030 World Cup. But I have sense. Unlike the guy who interjected before when I said East Asian do not have the genetics to dominate in football physically. He called me names like you. But he ran away now that Japan lost to tiny Costa Rica and South Korea lost to Ghana (oh the horror for racial superiority proponents)

    Replies: @Yahya

  581. Why is SJW Muslim Globalism so deviant? This is core Bacha Bāzī messaging: (1)

    After being caught inserting subliminal messages inciting pedophilia and child pornography into their advertisements, luxury fashion brand Balenciaga blames the producers and sues them for $25 million.

    On Friday, the luxury brand sued the production company North Six, Inc. and the set designer Nicholas Des Jardins, for using a legal document from a Supreme Court ruling on child porn laws as a prop.

    How can we permanently expel George IslamoSoros and his Jihadist NGO’s from Judeo-Christian lands?
    ___

    How do we know Balenciaga and Muslims are linked? Follow the vile anti-Semitism: (2) (3)

    Balenciaga-related posts from her Instagram page after the brand came under fire for its latest campaign.

    Hadid posted pictures from the new campaign on her feed, which were reportedly deleted on Wednesday. The new campaign was created to display the brand’s Objects line and featured a number of children holding plush toys, bizarrely dressed in bondage. Shortly after the campaign was released, users on Twitter noticed that one image appeared to include a poorly hidden court document about ‘virtual child porn,’ causing people to question the brand’s ethics and intentions

    Bella Hadid accused of sharing anti-Semitic rhetoric over Israeli-Palestinian clash

    “There is NO place for this!!! Especially in 2021!!!! it has always been #freepalestine. ALWAYS. I have a lot to say about this but for now, please read and educate yourself. This is not about religion. This is not about spewing hate on one or the other. This is about Israeli colonization, ethnic cleansing, military occupation and apartheid over the Palestinian people that has been going on for YEARS,” she wrote in the deleted post.

    Many Instagram users pointed out the various inaccuracies in Hadid’s post, including perpetuating anti-Semitic tropes.

    Why are Muhammad’s followers so evil? Apartheid, genocide, and paedophilia. All in one religion.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2022/11/balenciaga-damage-control-sues-producer-25-million-child-bdsm-themed-ads-approved/

    (2) https://hypebae.com/2022/11/bella-hadid-balenciaga-campaign-instagram-posts-details

    (3) https://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/bella-hadid-anti-semitic-rhetoric

  582. @Yahya
    @AnonfromTN


    It’s certainly a more entertaining activity, but hardly more productive.

     

    It's more productive in that you learn a great deal from spending time on this website, if of course you use it properly (same is true of any intellectual website). Watching sports gives the entertainment aspect, but you don't come out any wiser.

    Evidently one of the great strengths of Unz is the free speech environment that allows people to advocate for shooting illegal migrants without getting the least amount of backlash. Almost impossible anywhere else. One of the downsides is that it attracts a lot of nutters. On the other hand some reasonably sane and intelligent people are also attracted by the freedom given here. I should point out that Unz review isn't completely "free" to any intellectual debate. There are certain topics or positions that will immediately attract scorn and derision from the majority of commentors; one of which is pro-migration attitudes; the other (though not pertinent to this blog) is philo-Semitic or philo-Zionist viewpoints. Inevitably an intellectual gathering place will attract like-minded people who will proceed to set-up their own "zone of comfort" where they refuse viewpoints which run counter to their cherished beliefs. Unz review is no exception. On the other hand, TUR allows a great deal of diverse opinions to be aired on certain topics like the Russia-Ukraine conflict; and this is where its unique strengths start to shine.

    I think for me and most commentors here the main attraction is the commenting system and users, as demonstrated by the fact that we comment here without needing a columnist or blogger to lead the discussion.

    Replies: @German_reader, @AnonfromTN, @Emil Nikola Richard

    I agree with most of your points, except about entertainment value. I find watching sports incredibly boring. Maybe because there is nothing in it to engage my brain (little gray cells, as Poirot used to say).

    philo-Semitic

    Some commenters here express views that are ridiculously skewed to pro-Israel. E. g., demonizing Iranian regime like the dumbest Israeli propagandists. But overall, reading comments here is indeed educational. Even though some commenters are almost 100% predictable, sometimes they post something interesting outside of the area of their mania. That’s why I do not ban anyone: humans are quite interesting, particularly when they say and do unexpected things.

    • Agree: Barbarossa
    • LOL: A123
    • Replies: @A123
    @AnonfromTN

    The depraved bloodlust of sociopath Khamenei has killed hundreds. (1)



    Iranian security forces have killed at least 326 people since nationwide protests erupted two months ago, the Norway-based Iran Human Rights NGO (IHRNGO) group has claimed.

    That figure includes 43 children and 25 women, the group said in an update to its death toll on Saturday – saying that its published number represented an “absolute minimum.”

     

    Even if you do not believe CNN's total count. Every objective source shows that sociopath Khamenei is making the situation worse. For example: (2)


    Supreme Leader Ali Khamenei publicly rejected the possibility of compromise or reform to placate the ongoing protests on November 26. Khamenei reiterated his hard line on the protests and his accusation that foreign actors incited the unrest. He ended his speech with a Quranic verse that social media users interpreted as further affirmation that he will not make concessions.[1] Khamenei made these remarks in a meeting with Basij members and lauded their role in protest suppression.
    ...
    Many regime officials support Khamenei’s uncompromising stance toward the protests, on the other hand. IRGC Deputy Commander Brigadier General Ali Fadavi expressed implicit support for the regime using more brutality in the protest crackdown on November 21.[6] Some hardline media outlets have similarly called for security forces to use less restraint against protesters.[7] This rhetoric indicates that at least some regime circles prefer more repression rather than limited reform.

     

    Why do you hate Jesus and God so much that you embrace this bloodshed targeting children? Wordlessly accepting Khamenei's mass murder of innocent Iranian civilians is demonic behaviour.


    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.cnn.com/2022/11/12/middleeast/iran-protests-death-toll-intl-hnk/index.html

    (2) https://www.understandingwar.org/backgrounder/iran-crisis-update-november-26
  583. @AnonfromTN
    @songbird


    Trudeau is a tranny.
     
    Whether true or not, that’s irrelevant. What relevant is that he is a pathetic nonentity subservient to the empire.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @songbird, @Mr. Hack

    I assume that you pay income, property and other types of taxes to the US government? By doing so, you are also serving the interests of “the empire”. You do have choices here, you may quit paying taxes and take a principled position showing that you don’t go along with the policies and foreign entanglements of the empire. Or better yet, you can just pick up your bags and move to somewhere like Moscow and stand with your own people.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Mr. Hack

    I do not recall asking for an advice.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

  584. What old moniker? I’ve done some comments here and there anonymously since 2020 but this forum forced me to choose a name. Do you know why that is?

    I guess you could say I have been lurking around this site since late 2020.

    Peace to you also.

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @KidDynamite

    Your writing style bares a strange resemblance to this commentor:

    https://www.unz.com/comments/all/?commenterfilter=Talha


    but this forum forced me to choose a name. Do you know why that is?
     
    I thin Ron Unz has banned anons from commenting on this blog.

    Replies: @songbird

  585. @showmethereal
    @Mr. Hack

    What is naive? Since you think you know so much explain…. Most the Ukrainian sources I see on the internet are junk.
    And what are questioning about the difference of western Ukraine? I’m pretty sure by now you have heard of groups like the Right Sector - let alone the Azov. I only became interested in Ukraine in 2014. 1) I knew it was going to turn into a disaster when I saw Nuland and gang playing puppet master 2) I wondered what type of psychopaths would attack gov buildings or would chase people into a building and set it on fire as happened in Odessa.

    And I experientially only know 1 Ukrainian. Nice woman. Except she is very arrogant toward Russians. Never made sense to me - especially since she lives in what you would call a third world country and says she preferred it to conditions in her native Ukraine - and this was before the conflagrations

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    Most the Ukrainian sources I see on the internet are junk.

    Which ones might those be? I want to make sure that I avoid reading them.

    And what are questioning about the difference of western Ukraine? I’m pretty sure by now you have heard of groups like the Right Sector – let alone the Azov.

    You’re the one that first made the insinuation that “It’s just sad to me that western Ukraine would turn on their Slavic brethren like that.” So you chose to pinpoint Western Ukraine as somehow being the disloyal Slavic brethren, turning on Russia, when, as we all know that it was first Russia that decided to forgo peaceful means with Ukraine and invaded to “chase Nazis”and other such nonsense, killing tens of thousands of Ukrainian civilians in the process.

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @Mr. Hack

    So you are completely ignoring the fact that ethnic Russians and those with Russian sympathies in eastern Ukraine were under literal bombardment since the 2014 coup?? Come on. Are you also claiming the psychopaths who set those people on fire in Odessa back then were “misunderstood” nationalists?? Or are you claiming all the videos were Russian propaganda??

    Replies: @Beckow, @Philip Owen

  586. @KidDynamite
    What old moniker? I’ve done some comments here and there anonymously since 2020 but this forum forced me to choose a name. Do you know why that is?

    I guess you could say I have been lurking around this site since late 2020.

    Peace to you also.

    Replies: @Yahya

    Your writing style bares a strange resemblance to this commentor:

    https://www.unz.com/comments/all/?commenterfilter=Talha

    but this forum forced me to choose a name. Do you know why that is?

    I thin Ron Unz has banned anons from commenting on this blog.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Yahya

    Believe banning anons was an old rule of AK.

    Sensible, as even creating the lowest energy barrier removes some chaff and some level of insanity.

    Replies: @KidDynamite

  587. @AnonfromTN
    @Yahya

    I agree with most of your points, except about entertainment value. I find watching sports incredibly boring. Maybe because there is nothing in it to engage my brain (little gray cells, as Poirot used to say).


    philo-Semitic
     
    Some commenters here express views that are ridiculously skewed to pro-Israel. E. g., demonizing Iranian regime like the dumbest Israeli propagandists. But overall, reading comments here is indeed educational. Even though some commenters are almost 100% predictable, sometimes they post something interesting outside of the area of their mania. That’s why I do not ban anyone: humans are quite interesting, particularly when they say and do unexpected things.

    Replies: @A123

    The depraved bloodlust of sociopath Khamenei has killed hundreds. (1)

    Iranian security forces have killed at least 326 people since nationwide protests erupted two months ago, the Norway-based Iran Human Rights NGO (IHRNGO) group has claimed.

    That figure includes 43 children and 25 women, the group said in an update to its death toll on Saturday – saying that its published number represented an “absolute minimum.”

    Even if you do not believe CNN’s total count. Every objective source shows that sociopath Khamenei is making the situation worse. For example: (2)

    Supreme Leader Ali Khamenei publicly rejected the possibility of compromise or reform to placate the ongoing protests on November 26. Khamenei reiterated his hard line on the protests and his accusation that foreign actors incited the unrest. He ended his speech with a Quranic verse that social media users interpreted as further affirmation that he will not make concessions.[1] Khamenei made these remarks in a meeting with Basij members and lauded their role in protest suppression.

    Many regime officials support Khamenei’s uncompromising stance toward the protests, on the other hand. IRGC Deputy Commander Brigadier General Ali Fadavi expressed implicit support for the regime using more brutality in the protest crackdown on November 21.[6] Some hardline media outlets have similarly called for security forces to use less restraint against protesters.[7] This rhetoric indicates that at least some regime circles prefer more repression rather than limited reform.

    Why do you hate Jesus and God so much that you embrace this bloodshed targeting children? Wordlessly accepting Khamenei’s mass murder of innocent Iranian civilians is demonic behaviour.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.cnn.com/2022/11/12/middleeast/iran-protests-death-toll-intl-hnk/index.html

    (2) https://www.understandingwar.org/backgrounder/iran-crisis-update-november-26

  588. @Yahya
    @AnonfromTN


    It’s certainly a more entertaining activity, but hardly more productive.

     

    It's more productive in that you learn a great deal from spending time on this website, if of course you use it properly (same is true of any intellectual website). Watching sports gives the entertainment aspect, but you don't come out any wiser.

    Evidently one of the great strengths of Unz is the free speech environment that allows people to advocate for shooting illegal migrants without getting the least amount of backlash. Almost impossible anywhere else. One of the downsides is that it attracts a lot of nutters. On the other hand some reasonably sane and intelligent people are also attracted by the freedom given here. I should point out that Unz review isn't completely "free" to any intellectual debate. There are certain topics or positions that will immediately attract scorn and derision from the majority of commentors; one of which is pro-migration attitudes; the other (though not pertinent to this blog) is philo-Semitic or philo-Zionist viewpoints. Inevitably an intellectual gathering place will attract like-minded people who will proceed to set-up their own "zone of comfort" where they refuse viewpoints which run counter to their cherished beliefs. Unz review is no exception. On the other hand, TUR allows a great deal of diverse opinions to be aired on certain topics like the Russia-Ukraine conflict; and this is where its unique strengths start to shine.

    I think for me and most commentors here the main attraction is the commenting system and users, as demonstrated by the fact that we comment here without needing a columnist or blogger to lead the discussion.

    Replies: @German_reader, @AnonfromTN, @Emil Nikola Richard

    Watching sports gives the entertainment aspect, but you don’t come out any wiser.

    Between the public contest and the obsessive scrutiny there are important true facts that are revealed in the world of sports news available in no other media. For the broader public the most accurate information covered almost nowhere else for Corona virus 2020-2021 was on MMA announcer Joe Rogan and NFL pundit Pat McAfee’s podcasts. For many millions of people these were the only places they got even a hint the official story was the official cover story.

    • Replies: @Barbarossa
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    I dunno man, that seems like a real stretch. Rogan talks about everything under the sun on his program , it's not like he was sneaking it the 'Vid realism in between announcing the punches, so the sports connection is extremely tangential at best.
    You may as well say that sports watching is a important way for people to get exposure to the principles of physics. I guess it sort of rhymes, but I don't think it makes much sense.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

  589. I just clicked on that link and man, what a nerdy lady! Over twelve thousand comments!!! Almost two million words. Talk about having too much time on your hands – damn, write a book or something!

    I thought you were going to say I was that other lady who used to do psycho analysis on everyone. Trilexa I think her name was.

    You got the wrong number kid – I’m a guy who once in awhile likes trolling nerds on this site…everyone developed hobbies during covid. My best exchange was with that jung-Freud guy lay year until he started blocking my comments. I guess he figured out it was the same guy even though I was switching email addresses. I guess that’s probably why this forum has these rules – to make sure guys like me don’t go too crazy.

    • LOL: Barbarossa
    • Replies: @Yahya
    @KidDynamite

    Well i've changed my mind, you're definitely not Talha, for he was neither disingenuous nor a troll.

    Now i'm thinking you are just another weird schizo who pops in here from time to time.

  590. @silviosilver
    @Sher Singh


    I care about White Christian survival due to concubines.
     
    If you keep carrying on like that, you're going to larp your way to an early grave, son.

    A belated reply to your post, because your nonsense ticks me off, but I was just watching the Canada v Croatia match, and goddam, the number of nigs on that team, it reminded me of my "silver rule" [silviosilver, geddit?]: if someone is a nighater, or gives me reliable indications that he may become a nighater, I shall do my best to mend fences, because this world of ours will require all the nighaters it can get its hands on if we are to survive the coming deluge. (We can kill each other later.)

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @Wokechoke

    Oh Canada, why did they do it? I was astonished by the large numbers too.

  591. @Yahya
    @KidDynamite

    Your writing style bares a strange resemblance to this commentor:

    https://www.unz.com/comments/all/?commenterfilter=Talha


    but this forum forced me to choose a name. Do you know why that is?
     
    I thin Ron Unz has banned anons from commenting on this blog.

    Replies: @songbird

    Believe banning anons was an old rule of AK.

    Sensible, as even creating the lowest energy barrier removes some chaff and some level of insanity.

    • Replies: @KidDynamite
    @songbird

    Yes, alas - removing anonymity definitely reduces investment/return ratio for trolling enthusiasts.

    Replies: @songbird

  592. @songbird
    @Yahya

    Believe banning anons was an old rule of AK.

    Sensible, as even creating the lowest energy barrier removes some chaff and some level of insanity.

    Replies: @KidDynamite

    Yes, alas – removing anonymity definitely reduces investment/return ratio for trolling enthusiasts.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @KidDynamite

    Handles definitely reduce the number of trolls, but, for connoisseurs, I think they elevate the quality of trolling.

  593. @KidDynamite
    @songbird

    Yes, alas - removing anonymity definitely reduces investment/return ratio for trolling enthusiasts.

    Replies: @songbird

    Handles definitely reduce the number of trolls, but, for connoisseurs, I think they elevate the quality of trolling.

  594. @KidDynamite
    I just clicked on that link and man, what a nerdy lady! Over twelve thousand comments!!! Almost two million words. Talk about having too much time on your hands - damn, write a book or something!

    I thought you were going to say I was that other lady who used to do psycho analysis on everyone. Trilexa I think her name was.

    You got the wrong number kid - I’m a guy who once in awhile likes trolling nerds on this site...everyone developed hobbies during covid. My best exchange was with that jung-Freud guy lay year until he started blocking my comments. I guess he figured out it was the same guy even though I was switching email addresses. I guess that’s probably why this forum has these rules - to make sure guys like me don’t go too crazy.

    Replies: @Yahya

    Well i’ve changed my mind, you’re definitely not Talha, for he was neither disingenuous nor a troll.

    Now i’m thinking you are just another weird schizo who pops in here from time to time.

  595. That’s a good point actually, but I haven’t invested enough time nor do I plan to, in refining my skills to be at an elite level. My trolling will likely age like crusty bread rather than fine wine.

    • Replies: @Barbarossa
    @KidDynamite

    Well, you have to to respect an honest troll...
    It's refreshing really.

    Replies: @KidDynamite

  596. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Yahya


    Watching sports gives the entertainment aspect, but you don’t come out any wiser.
     
    Between the public contest and the obsessive scrutiny there are important true facts that are revealed in the world of sports news available in no other media. For the broader public the most accurate information covered almost nowhere else for Corona virus 2020-2021 was on MMA announcer Joe Rogan and NFL pundit Pat McAfee's podcasts. For many millions of people these were the only places they got even a hint the official story was the official cover story.

    Replies: @Barbarossa

    I dunno man, that seems like a real stretch. Rogan talks about everything under the sun on his program , it’s not like he was sneaking it the ‘Vid realism in between announcing the punches, so the sports connection is extremely tangential at best.
    You may as well say that sports watching is a important way for people to get exposure to the principles of physics. I guess it sort of rhymes, but I don’t think it makes much sense.

    • Agree: KidDynamite, AnonfromTN
    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Barbarossa

    Joe Rogan is a buffoon but his program deserves attention.

    1. he has 11 million subscribers and he talks about illegal drugs, identity politics, nuclear war and peace with people never permitted on other main media. Like Alex Jones example number one. Measure by (free speech times free reach product) and he might be number one. If not he is close.

    2. the claim he says whatever he wants to and talks to whoever he wants to is false. We will hear Kanye West talking about Jews on there at some point. This is because West is a retard and his hate speech is safe hate speech. There ain't no way we will hear Farakhan dealing the facts about Goldman Sacks of Jew cash coming from trading African slaves and then multiplied by dealing smack and crack to liberated African slave descendants.

    3. he had those gas bags Neil Tyson and Eric Weinstein on his show covering your principles of physics for you.

    The sports connection is this: Joe Rogan audience at the beginning were all MMA fans. He sucks at comedy but he knows fighting.

    Replies: @Barbarossa

  597. @KidDynamite
    That’s a good point actually, but I haven’t invested enough time nor do I plan to, in refining my skills to be at an elite level. My trolling will likely age like crusty bread rather than fine wine.

    Replies: @Barbarossa

    Well, you have to to respect an honest troll…
    It’s refreshing really.

    • Agree: songbird
    • Replies: @KidDynamite
    @Barbarossa

    I’ll take a bow to that. I will say though, while I do enjoy trolling nerds, what I wrote here was based on life experience of many decades. There will be people that want your stuff or to hurt people you love - you need to be prepared to defend yourself in that situation. That applies on a national level. I think it’s deplorable that we have so many fat people around here - especially men, I tend to give women a pass. One of my MMA coaches is in his sixties and can whup guys half his age readily. On a national level, be prepared to make the other side pay dearly for every inch they want so they think twice. And those things that encourage martial and useful athletic qualities in the general population are good ideas. Soccer may not be super useful, but it tends to keep men lean and have serious stamina and endurance.

    Anyway, I think I will slink back into the anonymous shadows to pounce upon the unsuspecting. Picking a name is a bit disconcerting for my kind. Perhaps you will come across me on another forum and wonder, could this have been the amazing KidDynamite, the bane of Internet nerds?

    I which case I leave you to ponder...ask not for whom the bell trolls, for it trolls for thee.

    Replies: @Barbarossa

  598. @Mr. Hack
    @AnonfromTN

    I assume that you pay income, property and other types of taxes to the US government? By doing so, you are also serving the interests of "the empire". You do have choices here, you may quit paying taxes and take a principled position showing that you don't go along with the policies and foreign entanglements of the empire. Or better yet, you can just pick up your bags and move to somewhere like Moscow and stand with your own people.

    https://s3.amazonaws.com/lowres.cartoonstock.com/politics-vladimir_putin-fifth_column-russia_politics-fifth_columnists-pied_piper-atan4949_low.jpg

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    I do not recall asking for an advice.

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @AnonfromTN

    Don't worry, I wont be sending you a bill at the end of the month...it was just some inspired rhetoric that occured to me after reading your previous blurb. You must be getting close to retirement age, still thinking about Singapore?

  599. @Barbarossa
    @KidDynamite

    Well, you have to to respect an honest troll...
    It's refreshing really.

    Replies: @KidDynamite

    I’ll take a bow to that. I will say though, while I do enjoy trolling nerds, what I wrote here was based on life experience of many decades. There will be people that want your stuff or to hurt people you love – you need to be prepared to defend yourself in that situation. That applies on a national level. I think it’s deplorable that we have so many fat people around here – especially men, I tend to give women a pass. One of my MMA coaches is in his sixties and can whup guys half his age readily. On a national level, be prepared to make the other side pay dearly for every inch they want so they think twice. And those things that encourage martial and useful athletic qualities in the general population are good ideas. Soccer may not be super useful, but it tends to keep men lean and have serious stamina and endurance.

    Anyway, I think I will slink back into the anonymous shadows to pounce upon the unsuspecting. Picking a name is a bit disconcerting for my kind. Perhaps you will come across me on another forum and wonder, could this have been the amazing KidDynamite, the bane of Internet nerds?

    I which case I leave you to ponder…ask not for whom the bell trolls, for it trolls for thee.

    • LOL: German_reader
    • Replies: @Barbarossa
    @KidDynamite


    One of my MMA coaches is in his sixties and can whup guys half his age readily
     
    Personally I'm not that much into playing sports (though I'm not at all opposed) since my typical workday if like a combination of parkour and weight lifting. However I know working guys exactly like this (and I aspire to be one myself). I know guys in their 60's that can work most 20 or 30 year olds under the table.

    I was looking at some old yearbooks from the late 40's and early 50's belonging to my grandparents at Thanksgiving and noted the conspicuous absence of overweight people, either children or adults. I think the national lack of fitness and strength is an extremely sad state. I feel that people should have more pride in their bodies' physical capabilities at the least. It's strange that we have a dichotomy of extreme schlubbiness coexisting with the insane perfection standards of the Instagram aesthetic.

    I'd much rather see a bunch of normal, average, but self respectingly presentable people than the collection of extreme slobs and narcissists we seem to have now. The former seems to indicate a healthy psychological state while the latter screams dysfunction.

    But at any rate, I think we'd all be happy to have more of your input if you decide to jump back in in the future. You seem a most convivial troll.

    Replies: @KidDynamite

  600. @KidDynamite
    @Barbarossa

    I’ll take a bow to that. I will say though, while I do enjoy trolling nerds, what I wrote here was based on life experience of many decades. There will be people that want your stuff or to hurt people you love - you need to be prepared to defend yourself in that situation. That applies on a national level. I think it’s deplorable that we have so many fat people around here - especially men, I tend to give women a pass. One of my MMA coaches is in his sixties and can whup guys half his age readily. On a national level, be prepared to make the other side pay dearly for every inch they want so they think twice. And those things that encourage martial and useful athletic qualities in the general population are good ideas. Soccer may not be super useful, but it tends to keep men lean and have serious stamina and endurance.

    Anyway, I think I will slink back into the anonymous shadows to pounce upon the unsuspecting. Picking a name is a bit disconcerting for my kind. Perhaps you will come across me on another forum and wonder, could this have been the amazing KidDynamite, the bane of Internet nerds?

    I which case I leave you to ponder...ask not for whom the bell trolls, for it trolls for thee.

    Replies: @Barbarossa

    One of my MMA coaches is in his sixties and can whup guys half his age readily

    Personally I’m not that much into playing sports (though I’m not at all opposed) since my typical workday if like a combination of parkour and weight lifting. However I know working guys exactly like this (and I aspire to be one myself). I know guys in their 60’s that can work most 20 or 30 year olds under the table.

    I was looking at some old yearbooks from the late 40’s and early 50’s belonging to my grandparents at Thanksgiving and noted the conspicuous absence of overweight people, either children or adults. I think the national lack of fitness and strength is an extremely sad state. I feel that people should have more pride in their bodies’ physical capabilities at the least. It’s strange that we have a dichotomy of extreme schlubbiness coexisting with the insane perfection standards of the Instagram aesthetic.

    I’d much rather see a bunch of normal, average, but self respectingly presentable people than the collection of extreme slobs and narcissists we seem to have now. The former seems to indicate a healthy psychological state while the latter screams dysfunction.

    But at any rate, I think we’d all be happy to have more of your input if you decide to jump back in in the future. You seem a most convivial troll.

    • Replies: @KidDynamite
    @Barbarossa

    Well now I really need to go underground. I’ve been called honest and convivial. I’ll probably be canceled among my peeps and be evicted from under the bridge...no, this won’t do at all.

  601. @Beckow
    @German_reader


    ...the boundaries are that badly defined today
     
    Less than in the past, but the western, eastern and northern (Kaliningrad) borders are not fully settled - it is imaginable that it would change, esp. the cursed idea if Intermarium. Many Poles otherwise normal talk about their Intermarium dreams, usually when inebriated :)...

    Poles are European, maybe too much so... they consciously play up bad Euro habits like fake superiority, greed, mindless aggression. There is something atavistic about it, quite underdeveloped.

    Arestovych is a homo from a secret service and theatre background, bought and sold many times. In times of extreme strife weird characters making no sense pop up. Kiev is full of them, e.g. sweatpants Zelko. Historically the weirdos have no staying power, street clowns to distract. When things settle down they will be gone. If things settle down...

    Replies: @AP

    Arestovych is a homo

    He’s been married twice and has three children. You?

    • Replies: @songbird
    @AP


    He’s been married twice and has three children.
     
    Those are Eulenburg numbers, if he were in the same birth cohort.

    (But seriously, I have no idea who you are talking about.)
  602. @German_reader
    @Beckow


    It is about the lands, the incredible arable topsoils with plenty of water, it has always been about that, for at least 300-400 hundred years.
     
    You could claim the same about Russia, they've grabbed some pretty valuable agricultural land in Eastern Ukraine after all. And I'm not convinced such motivations play that much of a role in NATO countries.
    Regarding Poland, I wonder if they'll ever get fed up with Ukraine. The recent missile incident with Zelensky's blatant attempt at manipulation (in Germany noticed even by a mainstream conservative newspaper like Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung btw) should have been a bright red warning sign for Poland that the Ukrainians may have goals that aren't in Poland's interests at all (and possibly use distinctly underhanded methods in pursuit of those goals). But I suppose Poles are too invested in the project and too big romantics to entertain such cynical thoughts. A pity.

    Replies: @A123, @Beckow, @AP

    Regarding Poland, I wonder if they’ll ever get fed up with Ukraine.

    Russian loss is critical for Poland, so not in the context of this war.

    The recent missile incident with Zelensky’s blatant attempt at manipulation

    A Pole told me that the Russians have been deliberately sending their missiles in such as way that they would draw Ukrainian AA missiles into Poland, that they had been doing that before and that this is the first time it worked. I didn’t pursue the discussion and don’t know where he had heard that.

    Ukrainians may have goals that aren’t in Poland’s interests at al

    Survival of the Ukrainian state and its separation from the Russian world are very much in Poland’s interests.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @AP


    Survival of the Ukrainian state
     
    Sure, it's Poland's interest (and that of other EU countries as well) that Ukraine doesn't become a Russian satellite state, with Russian troops or security services being stationed close to the Polish border. However, there's also another, possibly quite existential interest for Poland: not to become a direct participant, and theatre, in this war. And Zelensky's government has shown again and again that they very much would like to draw NATO countries into becoming direct participants in their war, without regard for the consequences (and as I mentioned in my previous comment, with the missile incident it was so blatant and egregious that even mainstream media in Western countries noticed).
    One has to realize what Zelensky and co. actually did here: A Ukrainian missile lands in Poland, killing two Poles, and the Ukrainians must have known pretty much immediately that it was their own missile. Instead of apologizing, saying "We'll do our best to avoid such incidents in the future" they then lie (yes, lie) about it and try to spin it to their advantage by once again calling for NATO entering the war through enforcement of a no-fly-zone (not just asking for more anti-air-defense systems, as would have been reasonable). And that's the most charitable interpretation of this incident.

    A Pole told me
     
    I'm sure there are Poles who believe such things, but it still doesn't make any sense.

    Orban is willing to play that role
     
    And you base that on what? Do you seriously believe Hungary has any territorial designs on Ukraine that would cause them to take part in Ukraine's dismemberment? I've seen nothing in Orban's public statements that would indicate something like this (unless you're referring to the ridiculous scarf he was wearing recently).

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @AP

  603. @Mikel
    @LatW


    Israel. Not Finland, not Switzerland. Israel.
     
    No. Switzerland is a far superior solution. It hasn't had a war in several centuries. Its combination of a credible military deterrence (which Ukraine now also has) and good relations with everybody spared them from being invaded even by the Nazis. Crucially, it is also a confederation. Every little canton belongs to the federation on a voluntary basis and has ample autonomy, including its own constitution, police and courts.

    Speaking of Nazis, if Ukraine tries to go for a Versailles humiliation, understandable as the desire might now be, it is not difficult to predict that it will sooner or later get a III Reich on its frontier. Even AK is now deriding Putin and the "Kremlins" in every second tweet. Large swaths of United Russia voters must be ready to support a hardliner challenge to the current order. It's time for statesmanship in order to avert a worse Russian threat for everybody in the future.

    Replies: @German_reader, @LatW, @AP

    No. Switzerland is a far superior solution.

    Federation in Ukraine would not have resembled Switzerland but rather 18th century Poland. “Autonomous” eastern parts would be under de facto control of Russia, and therefore any Ukrainian policies would be vetoed by Russia. The state would be weak, dexentralized, paralyzed. It’s why Minsk deal was pushed by Russia. You think Russia had Ukraine’s best interests in mind when doing so?

    Russia invaded and partitioned Poland when Poland tried to reform its system in order to eliminate that state of affairs. It was aided by Poland’s western neighbors. Russia would like the same – Orban is willing to play that role, but fortunately for Ukraine Poland is not.

    Speaking of Nazis, if Ukraine tries to go for a Versailles humiliation, understandable as the desire might now be, it is not difficult to predict that it will sooner or later get a III Reich on its frontier

    Are Russians as competent as the Germans were?

    It’s time for statesmanship in order to avert a worse Russian threat for everybody in the future.

    Allowing Russia to keep any territory seized in 2022 and for it not to pay for the damage it caused would reward its illegal and bloody aggression.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @AP


    Allowing Russia to keep any territory seized in 2022 and for it not to pay for the damage it caused would reward its illegal and bloody aggression.
     
    The question is if there could be a deal that would allow Ukraine to achieve part of its objectives and at least a chance of a lasting peace agreement. Let's suppose Russia would agree to hand back occupied Zaporizhzhia (as I understand it a territory that is quite clearly Ukrainian in sentiment) in exchange for keeping some Donbass parts (or optimally, letting their future be decided by internationally supervised referenda) and Ukrainian recognition of Crimea as Russian. Of course such a deal may be just fantasy anyway and Russia might never agree to it in any case. But shouldn't one at least explore the possibility of such an agreement? It doesn't have to mean foregoing military options, many wars have featured continued fighting and parallel negotiations.
    As for Russia paying reparations, that seems like a very unrealistic goal.

    Replies: @A123, @AP, @AnonfromTN

    , @Mikel
    @AP


    Are Russians as competent as the Germans were?
     
    No. But in the end they defeated the very competent Germans nonetheless. Dismiss the people who put the first man in orbit and built the Tsar Bomba at your own peril.

    Replies: @AP

  604. German_reader says:
    @AP
    @German_reader


    Regarding Poland, I wonder if they’ll ever get fed up with Ukraine.
     
    Russian loss is critical for Poland, so not in the context of this war.

    The recent missile incident with Zelensky’s blatant attempt at manipulation
     
    A Pole told me that the Russians have been deliberately sending their missiles in such as way that they would draw Ukrainian AA missiles into Poland, that they had been doing that before and that this is the first time it worked. I didn't pursue the discussion and don't know where he had heard that.

    Ukrainians may have goals that aren’t in Poland’s interests at al
     
    Survival of the Ukrainian state and its separation from the Russian world are very much in Poland's interests.

    Replies: @German_reader

    Survival of the Ukrainian state

    Sure, it’s Poland’s interest (and that of other EU countries as well) that Ukraine doesn’t become a Russian satellite state, with Russian troops or security services being stationed close to the Polish border. However, there’s also another, possibly quite existential interest for Poland: not to become a direct participant, and theatre, in this war. And Zelensky’s government has shown again and again that they very much would like to draw NATO countries into becoming direct participants in their war, without regard for the consequences (and as I mentioned in my previous comment, with the missile incident it was so blatant and egregious that even mainstream media in Western countries noticed).
    One has to realize what Zelensky and co. actually did here: A Ukrainian missile lands in Poland, killing two Poles, and the Ukrainians must have known pretty much immediately that it was their own missile. Instead of apologizing, saying “We’ll do our best to avoid such incidents in the future” they then lie (yes, lie) about it and try to spin it to their advantage by once again calling for NATO entering the war through enforcement of a no-fly-zone (not just asking for more anti-air-defense systems, as would have been reasonable). And that’s the most charitable interpretation of this incident.

    A Pole told me

    I’m sure there are Poles who believe such things, but it still doesn’t make any sense.

    Orban is willing to play that role

    And you base that on what? Do you seriously believe Hungary has any territorial designs on Ukraine that would cause them to take part in Ukraine’s dismemberment? I’ve seen nothing in Orban’s public statements that would indicate something like this (unless you’re referring to the ridiculous scarf he was wearing recently).

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @German_reader

    Ukraine and Hungary have been tussling over perceived Hungarian rights in Zakarpattya for many years now. To wear such a "ridiculous scarf" at such a time as now, is the height of insensitive hubris.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    , @AP
    @German_reader


    Sure, it’s Poland’s interest (and that of other EU countries as well) that Ukraine doesn’t become a Russian satellite state, with Russian troops or security services being stationed close to the Polish border. However, there’s also another, possibly quite existential interest for Poland: not to become a direct participant, and theatre, in this war
     
    Correct. It is in Poland’s best interest for Russia to fail to conquer Ukraine, and it is in Poland’s best interest not to be a direct participant. It would get tricky if direct participation were to become necessary in order to prevent a Russian conquest of Ukraine, however. This has not been the case, fortunately. But Poland is rightly doing all it can to enable Ukraine to fight on its own.

    A Pole told me

    I’m sure there are Poles who believe such things, but it still doesn’t make any sense
     
    Why do you think it wouldn’t make sense for Russia to want a Ukrainian missile to hit Polish territory? And since it does, to deliberately make this more likely by firing close to Polish territory?

    “Orban is willing to play that role”

    And you base that on what? Do you seriously believe Hungary has any territorial designs on Ukraine that would cause them to take part in Ukraine’s dismemberment
     
    If given the chance, Orban would absolutely take a chunk of Ukraine populated by ethnic Hungarians. His government has given passports to ethnic Hungarians in Ukraine against the wishes of Ukraine (same thing that Russia did for people in Donbas) and it is no coincidence that his is the most Russia-friendly country in Europe regarding Ukraine, including criticising the provision of weapons for Ukraine to defend itself. Of course, little Hungary on its own can’t do anything, particularly since Ukraine has not collapsed. But I have no doubt that if Russian soldiers made it to the Carpathians, Hungary would try to secure the other side of those mountains. The scarf scandal is just a slip-up.

    Here is a Hungarian politician tweeting about wanting a common border with Poland again:



    https://twitter.com/cyberspec1/status/1591565297647235072?s=46&t=8vJ3fXvCYXQIjck4dVFPRg

    Replies: @German_reader

  605. @Barbarossa
    @KidDynamite


    One of my MMA coaches is in his sixties and can whup guys half his age readily
     
    Personally I'm not that much into playing sports (though I'm not at all opposed) since my typical workday if like a combination of parkour and weight lifting. However I know working guys exactly like this (and I aspire to be one myself). I know guys in their 60's that can work most 20 or 30 year olds under the table.

    I was looking at some old yearbooks from the late 40's and early 50's belonging to my grandparents at Thanksgiving and noted the conspicuous absence of overweight people, either children or adults. I think the national lack of fitness and strength is an extremely sad state. I feel that people should have more pride in their bodies' physical capabilities at the least. It's strange that we have a dichotomy of extreme schlubbiness coexisting with the insane perfection standards of the Instagram aesthetic.

    I'd much rather see a bunch of normal, average, but self respectingly presentable people than the collection of extreme slobs and narcissists we seem to have now. The former seems to indicate a healthy psychological state while the latter screams dysfunction.

    But at any rate, I think we'd all be happy to have more of your input if you decide to jump back in in the future. You seem a most convivial troll.

    Replies: @KidDynamite

    Well now I really need to go underground. I’ve been called honest and convivial. I’ll probably be canceled among my peeps and be evicted from under the bridge…no, this won’t do at all.

    • LOL: Barbarossa, songbird
  606. German_reader says:
    @AP
    @Mikel


    No. Switzerland is a far superior solution.
     
    Federation in Ukraine would not have resembled Switzerland but rather 18th century Poland. "Autonomous" eastern parts would be under de facto control of Russia, and therefore any Ukrainian policies would be vetoed by Russia. The state would be weak, dexentralized, paralyzed. It's why Minsk deal was pushed by Russia. You think Russia had Ukraine's best interests in mind when doing so?

    Russia invaded and partitioned Poland when Poland tried to reform its system in order to eliminate that state of affairs. It was aided by Poland's western neighbors. Russia would like the same - Orban is willing to play that role, but fortunately for Ukraine Poland is not.

    Speaking of Nazis, if Ukraine tries to go for a Versailles humiliation, understandable as the desire might now be, it is not difficult to predict that it will sooner or later get a III Reich on its frontier
     
    Are Russians as competent as the Germans were?

    It’s time for statesmanship in order to avert a worse Russian threat for everybody in the future.
     
    Allowing Russia to keep any territory seized in 2022 and for it not to pay for the damage it caused would reward its illegal and bloody aggression.

    Replies: @German_reader, @Mikel

    Allowing Russia to keep any territory seized in 2022 and for it not to pay for the damage it caused would reward its illegal and bloody aggression.

    The question is if there could be a deal that would allow Ukraine to achieve part of its objectives and at least a chance of a lasting peace agreement. Let’s suppose Russia would agree to hand back occupied Zaporizhzhia (as I understand it a territory that is quite clearly Ukrainian in sentiment) in exchange for keeping some Donbass parts (or optimally, letting their future be decided by internationally supervised referenda) and Ukrainian recognition of Crimea as Russian. Of course such a deal may be just fantasy anyway and Russia might never agree to it in any case. But shouldn’t one at least explore the possibility of such an agreement? It doesn’t have to mean foregoing military options, many wars have featured continued fighting and parallel negotiations.
    As for Russia paying reparations, that seems like a very unrealistic goal.

    • Replies: @A123
    @German_reader


    But shouldn’t one at least explore the possibility of such an agreement? It doesn’t have to mean foregoing military options, many wars have featured continued fighting and parallel negotiations.
     
    Zelensky's refusal to have any sort of communication is one of the reasons to believe he is insincere. If his team receives an offer that is good for Ukrainians & bad for Zelensky, it could create a schism within his government. By not talking, he avoids this risk.

    Let’s suppose Russia would agree to hand back occupied Zaporizhzhia (as I understand it a territory that is quite clearly Ukrainian in sentiment) in exchange for keeping some Donbass parts ... and Ukrainian recognition of Crimea as Russian.
     
    Another viable solution would be something near the current lines. It secures fresh water and electricity to Crimea that was ruthlessly cut off to inflict collective punishment on Russian civilians. However, Putin would have to swallow a bitter pill in reversing some of the more Northern claims.

    There are many options that could be put on the table if the are two sides willing to negotiate in good faith.

    letting their future be decided by internationally supervised referenda
    ...
    As for Russia paying reparations, that seems like a very unrealistic goal.
     
    Parts of Kosovo voted to join Serbia. The international community repudiated referenda as a concept, forcing Serbs to stay part of Kosovo. Certainly, it can be placed on the negotiation table. However, what Russia legitimately perceives as inherently unreliable "international referenda" are as unrealistic as reparations.
    ____

    Until there is a serious effort at negotiations, it is hard to tell what is possible.

    PEACE 😇
    , @AP
    @German_reader


    “Allowing Russia to keep any territory seized in 2022 and for it not to pay for the damage it caused would reward its illegal and bloody aggression.”

    The question is if there could be a deal that would allow Ukraine to achieve part of its objectives and at least a chance of a lasting peace agreement
     
    My point is that if Russia ends the war with more than it had when it started and Ukraine with less, then Russia will have been rewarded for its aggression. Even if the result is a “Pyrrhic” victory.

    So Ukraine (a country hostile to Russia) getting its infrastructure destroyed without compensation from Russia (i.e., having the West pay to rebuild) would be a reward for Russia. Additional territory would be a reward for Russia.

    This does not mean that Russia should get partitioned, or occupied, or forced to pay reparations that exceed paying for the material damage it caused, or “given” a civil war, or whatever. But to be clear - any additional territory beyond what Russia controlled in February this year and any destruction that Russia gets away with not paying for is a reward for Russia’s invasion of another country. Reversal of those gains should be a minimal requirement for peace.

    I agree that plebiscites in the pre-February Russian-controlled territories run and observed by neutral countries would be a just way of permanently resolving these issues and allowing an off ramp for normalisation and elimination of sanctions. But if Ukraine can get more on the battlefield, then additional losses for Russia within Ukraine would not be unreasonable. Germany’s territorial losses to Czechoslovakia and Poland were a precedent. Invasions can have consequences.

    As for Russia paying reparations, that seems like a very unrealistic goal
     
    It can just be taken out of the seized reserves and assets. There have been precedents for that IIRC.

    Replies: @A123, @Beckow

    , @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader


    as I understand it a territory that is quite clearly Ukrainian in sentiment
     
    Now I know where this and many of your previous statements come from. Tägliche Nachrichten shows that in terms of lying Deutsche Welle beats even CNN (not a mean feat). My condolences.

    Replies: @Beckow, @German_reader

  607. @songbird
    Some pretty insane numbers coming out of Ireland: (from beginning of Oct)

    -207,843 PPS numbers (similar to social security number) issued so far this year
    -only about 22.8% of those for births in Ireland (and one can wonder what percentage of these are actually Irish births)


    https://www.irishpatriots.com/new_pps_numbers_issued_shows_rising_scale_of_mass_immigration_to_ireland
    https://youtu.be/4qRpvKbKFIo

    Replies: @Coconuts

    I also watched Keith’s video last night.

    It looks like they are trying to play accelerated catch up with some of the other North-West Euro countries in terms of demographic change. Hate speech laws only appeared in the UK about 50 years after migration started for example, and it took a while for them to really come into effect. They do seem to be a powerful and effective tool for controlling discussion of the topic though.

    [MORE]

    Is this the influence of NGOs and corporate interests from Europe and other parts of the Anglo world? It’s hard to understand what advantage Ireland gains from encouraging unfiltered immigration.

    Some interesting data points on what is going on in the UK at present:

    https://unherd.com/thepost/report-critical-race-theory-is-endemic-in-british-schools/

    https://www.spiked-online.com/2022/11/22/critical-race-theory-is-being-taught-as-fact/

    In the 2nd link there is a reference to the apparently quite widespread belief that the UK was a country founded on racism. The Museum of London apparently now has a display suggesting that a typical inhabitant of Roman London was a Sub-Saharan woman with mixed race children.

    This guy is one of the best mainstream or centre-left commentators on the issue, he is not as pessimistic:

    https://unherd.com/thepost/migration-numbers-are-not-as-bad-as-they-look/

    Things Ireland may have to look forward to in the future.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Coconuts

    I suspect that it is a problem of scale. Ireland is a very small country. So, that makes it easier to buy people. And easier to shift the political debate. There are really only like what, four cities? Most towns are essentially small villages. So small numbers can straight away weaponize liberals. Plus, due to scale, indigenous cultural production is pretty low. Culture is mostly a kind of fusion between the UK and America. IMO, the Balts are totally screwed.

    BTW, I'm skeptical about this idea that student visas can be entirely discounted as being part of some invasion. Yes, not everyone stays or wants to stay, but the reality that I've observed directly is that a large number see it as their ticket in, and there is a kind of wink-wink relationship with the regime. "Look, some degree mill here gave them a paper certificate, so that means that they are the professionals we need!" I've known plenty that have used it as their ticket in. Some that were the anchor babies who were claiming their rights. Many very odious people were born as the result of student visas. It is hardly a neutral endeavor to expose intelligent young people to large numbers of foreigners, or to become dependent upon them for teaching assistants, etc. Foreign students help prop up the tertiary education industry, something that is obviously too big for our own good.

    Replies: @Coconuts

  608. @silviosilver
    @showmethereal


    When did I claim China was an innocent angel?
     
    I didn't say you claimed it. I brought it up as a way to demonstrate my evenhandedness on the issue of illegal infiltration. (A gesture of congeniality you've evidently chosen to throw back in my face. Noted.)

    Shoot all you want and show the world how bloodthirsty you are.
     
    The "world" (ie those parts of it keenest to export their useless riffraff) might howl in impotent rage, but would it do? It protests but ultimately does nothing when NATO forces launch military operations - which, unlike defending yourself, actually can be described as "bloodthirsty" - so my guess is nothing would happen. I'm willing to try and find out anyway.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @showmethereal

    If China was the one responsible for the disruption in Myanmar and was flooded with migrants then I would say it’s China’s fault and China has to deal with it. But that’s not the case.

    And you claim I was anti white. Where did I blame all whites???? I don’t believe Serbians should have to suffer consequences of NATO actions. I didn’t think Finland should either – but since Finland wants to join NATO then I wouldn’t feel sorry for them if they have a migrant crisis. Same goes for the issues that come up regarding past imperialism and relationships with former colonies. If they weren’t a colonizer I don’t think a white country should have to suffer. Which was how this argument started. Why should Russia take in African migrants. France won the World Cup with descendants and immigrants from former colonies. Russia has not won a World Cup and Russia did not have them. See people aren’t stupid. Africans have said it themselves regarding both Russia and China. Why do you think in the recent riots in Haiti they were marching with Russian flags asking Russia for help to keep out “international UN troops” like happened last time (which was a U.S. and French operation in disguise).

    As to the consequences of what would happen to your suggestion …. Well personally I think it might ignite the jihadists again to attack western countries some more. But It will certainly cause Global South countries to further vote against western countries in the UN. If they think it’s “bad” the global south won’t economically sanction Russia right now – expect it to get “worse”.

    Make no mistake – I am against illegal migration. But I understand cause and effect. I also understand the God given principle that governs all of creation which is – sowing and reaping.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @showmethereal


    Make no mistake – I am against illegal migration. But I understand cause and effect. I also understand the God given principle that governs all of creation which is – sowing and reaping.
     
    You are against illegal infiltration, but also against taking action to prevent it. And if it were a simple case of cause and effect, it would occur naturally, without you having to campaign for it. (And which case your comments on it would amount to no more than taunts of the "suck shit" variety, which in fact is precisely what they are even in the absence of that causal mechanism.)

    Drop the sanctimony, please. You are no good at it. You have the requisite duplicity, but you completely lack the charm, which is the other essential ingredient. Thus your attempts to assume the moral high ground come off as nothing more than you hurling your Chinese butthurt against the world. From the standpoint of personal wellbeing, seeking professional help for your emotional difficulties would be the wiser course of action, but it is your life, your choice.

    Oh, and you are also a muslim, obviously on George Islamo-Soros's payroll.

    : p

    Replies: @Barbarossa, @showmethereal

    , @Coconuts
    @showmethereal


    Make no mistake – I am against illegal migration. But I understand cause and effect. I also understand the God given principle that governs all of creation which is – sowing and reaping.
     
    I think it's interesting to think about what error or mistake God might be exacting justice on these countries for...

    A dominant political belief in say France or Britain is that in an ideal world an individual's hereditary national or ethnic identity should not shape and determine their lives in either positive or negative ways. People holding this view are rather against hereditary influences and inherited differences in wealth, power etc. between nations.

    (This may not be the actual cause of their immigration policies, just on the surface a lot of people ostensibly hold these views.)

    This is one reason they promote high levels of migration; it will break down distinctions between nations and make populations more equal.

    But superficially God's judgement on this seems to be 'if you believe in these egalitarian fictions your population will go extinct, or at least reduced to a remanent, and all the territory and resources will pass into the hands of people and other nations in perpetuity'.

    God's justice seems kind of based if they are going to be punished for believing in that error.

    Replies: @A123, @showmethereal

  609. @German_reader
    @AP


    Allowing Russia to keep any territory seized in 2022 and for it not to pay for the damage it caused would reward its illegal and bloody aggression.
     
    The question is if there could be a deal that would allow Ukraine to achieve part of its objectives and at least a chance of a lasting peace agreement. Let's suppose Russia would agree to hand back occupied Zaporizhzhia (as I understand it a territory that is quite clearly Ukrainian in sentiment) in exchange for keeping some Donbass parts (or optimally, letting their future be decided by internationally supervised referenda) and Ukrainian recognition of Crimea as Russian. Of course such a deal may be just fantasy anyway and Russia might never agree to it in any case. But shouldn't one at least explore the possibility of such an agreement? It doesn't have to mean foregoing military options, many wars have featured continued fighting and parallel negotiations.
    As for Russia paying reparations, that seems like a very unrealistic goal.

    Replies: @A123, @AP, @AnonfromTN

    But shouldn’t one at least explore the possibility of such an agreement? It doesn’t have to mean foregoing military options, many wars have featured continued fighting and parallel negotiations.

    Zelensky’s refusal to have any sort of communication is one of the reasons to believe he is insincere. If his team receives an offer that is good for Ukrainians & bad for Zelensky, it could create a schism within his government. By not talking, he avoids this risk.

    Let’s suppose Russia would agree to hand back occupied Zaporizhzhia (as I understand it a territory that is quite clearly Ukrainian in sentiment) in exchange for keeping some Donbass parts … and Ukrainian recognition of Crimea as Russian.

    Another viable solution would be something near the current lines. It secures fresh water and electricity to Crimea that was ruthlessly cut off to inflict collective punishment on Russian civilians. However, Putin would have to swallow a bitter pill in reversing some of the more Northern claims.

    There are many options that could be put on the table if the are two sides willing to negotiate in good faith.

    letting their future be decided by internationally supervised referenda

    As for Russia paying reparations, that seems like a very unrealistic goal.

    Parts of Kosovo voted to join Serbia. The international community repudiated referenda as a concept, forcing Serbs to stay part of Kosovo. Certainly, it can be placed on the negotiation table. However, what Russia legitimately perceives as inherently unreliable “international referenda” are as unrealistic as reparations.
    ____

    Until there is a serious effort at negotiations, it is hard to tell what is possible.

    PEACE 😇

  610. @Sher Singh
    https://www.reuters.com/world/americas/canada-launches-new-indo-pacific-strategy-focus-disruptive-china-2022-11-27/

    https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/canada-china-trudeau-xi-taiwan-1.6664854

    Focus on cybersecurity - means they'll continue to poke India who's buttmad at Sikhs.
    More people turn out for Sikh referendums than local elections lol.

    https://twitter.com/porusofpanjab/status/1589181214778621958?s=20

    Hindus leak fluid even when they're 80-90% it's weird..



    https://twitter.com/porusofpanjab/status/1595466125474926592

    https://twitter.com/porusofpanjab/status/1595471402353975296

    lol

    https://twitter.com/porusofpanjab/status/1591658813878587392?s=20

    Hindus crying after 2 Jatts storm 100s of them.

    Replies: @showmethereal

    What is the condition now? Do Sikhs want their own state. Is there potential for another “war”?

    Also how did so many get to Toronto? Is it for religious reasons they left India or just economic? I see loads of them when I go to Toronto. Especially in the Brampton area – there is a huge temple on a main road.

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @showmethereal

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1040104857660555284/1046905075940991006/image.png

    Replies: @showmethereal

  611. @AnonfromTN
    @Mr. Hack

    I do not recall asking for an advice.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    Don’t worry, I wont be sending you a bill at the end of the month…it was just some inspired rhetoric that occured to me after reading your previous blurb. You must be getting close to retirement age, still thinking about Singapore?

  612. @showmethereal
    @silviosilver

    If China was the one responsible for the disruption in Myanmar and was flooded with migrants then I would say it’s China’s fault and China has to deal with it. But that’s not the case.

    And you claim I was anti white. Where did I blame all whites???? I don’t believe Serbians should have to suffer consequences of NATO actions. I didn’t think Finland should either - but since Finland wants to join NATO then I wouldn’t feel sorry for them if they have a migrant crisis. Same goes for the issues that come up regarding past imperialism and relationships with former colonies. If they weren’t a colonizer I don’t think a white country should have to suffer. Which was how this argument started. Why should Russia take in African migrants. France won the World Cup with descendants and immigrants from former colonies. Russia has not won a World Cup and Russia did not have them. See people aren’t stupid. Africans have said it themselves regarding both Russia and China. Why do you think in the recent riots in Haiti they were marching with Russian flags asking Russia for help to keep out “international UN troops” like happened last time (which was a U.S. and French operation in disguise).

    As to the consequences of what would happen to your suggestion …. Well personally I think it might ignite the jihadists again to attack western countries some more. But It will certainly cause Global South countries to further vote against western countries in the UN. If they think it’s “bad” the global south won’t economically sanction Russia right now - expect it to get “worse”.

    Make no mistake - I am against illegal migration. But I understand cause and effect. I also understand the God given principle that governs all of creation which is - sowing and reaping.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @Coconuts

    Make no mistake – I am against illegal migration. But I understand cause and effect. I also understand the God given principle that governs all of creation which is – sowing and reaping.

    You are against illegal infiltration, but also against taking action to prevent it. And if it were a simple case of cause and effect, it would occur naturally, without you having to campaign for it. (And which case your comments on it would amount to no more than taunts of the “suck shit” variety, which in fact is precisely what they are even in the absence of that causal mechanism.)

    Drop the sanctimony, please. You are no good at it. You have the requisite duplicity, but you completely lack the charm, which is the other essential ingredient. Thus your attempts to assume the moral high ground come off as nothing more than you hurling your Chinese butthurt against the world. From the standpoint of personal wellbeing, seeking professional help for your emotional difficulties would be the wiser course of action, but it is your life, your choice.

    Oh, and you are also a muslim, obviously on George Islamo-Soros’s payroll.

    : p

    • LOL: Sher Singh
    • Replies: @Barbarossa
    @silviosilver


    Oh, and you are also a muslim, obviously on George Islamo-Soros’s payroll
     
    A123 is going to sue for infringement of intellectual property!

    On second thought, I think that would only apply if you had called him a George Islamo-Homo-Soros Muslim.

    Dang, maybe I'm confused on that since IslamoHomoSoros sounds like a dinosaur's name. I can see the memes already...

    Replies: @A123, @silviosilver

    , @showmethereal
    @silviosilver

    I get it — you don’t understand spiritual concepts. No problem. Stew in your frustrations then.

    But I notice a pattern with your types. You love to ascribe labels to anyone you can’t defeat in debate. I won’t even respond in kind… it’s a complete waste of time and energy. I wonder if attempting insult makes people like yourself feel good. It only makes you look intellectually small. But hey I guess that’s why you like your echo chambers

  613. @German_reader
    @AP


    Survival of the Ukrainian state
     
    Sure, it's Poland's interest (and that of other EU countries as well) that Ukraine doesn't become a Russian satellite state, with Russian troops or security services being stationed close to the Polish border. However, there's also another, possibly quite existential interest for Poland: not to become a direct participant, and theatre, in this war. And Zelensky's government has shown again and again that they very much would like to draw NATO countries into becoming direct participants in their war, without regard for the consequences (and as I mentioned in my previous comment, with the missile incident it was so blatant and egregious that even mainstream media in Western countries noticed).
    One has to realize what Zelensky and co. actually did here: A Ukrainian missile lands in Poland, killing two Poles, and the Ukrainians must have known pretty much immediately that it was their own missile. Instead of apologizing, saying "We'll do our best to avoid such incidents in the future" they then lie (yes, lie) about it and try to spin it to their advantage by once again calling for NATO entering the war through enforcement of a no-fly-zone (not just asking for more anti-air-defense systems, as would have been reasonable). And that's the most charitable interpretation of this incident.

    A Pole told me
     
    I'm sure there are Poles who believe such things, but it still doesn't make any sense.

    Orban is willing to play that role
     
    And you base that on what? Do you seriously believe Hungary has any territorial designs on Ukraine that would cause them to take part in Ukraine's dismemberment? I've seen nothing in Orban's public statements that would indicate something like this (unless you're referring to the ridiculous scarf he was wearing recently).

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @AP

    Ukraine and Hungary have been tussling over perceived Hungarian rights in Zakarpattya for many years now. To wear such a “ridiculous scarf” at such a time as now, is the height of insensitive hubris.

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @Mr. Hack

    https://communistcrimes.org/sites/default/files/inline-images/file-20220302-13-6lqr2j.jpg
    Ukrainians are surrounded by a Bolshevik (to the north, man with hat and red star), a Russian White Army soldier (to the east, with Russian eagle flag and a short whip), and to the west a Polish soldier, a Hungarian (in pink uniform) and two Romanian soldiers. Wikimedia Commons.

    Ukrainian sensitivity to such childish pranks as Orban's appearance at a football match wearing a scarve depicting pre-Trianon borders needs to be viewed in relation to their history. Romania also has voiced its insensitivity to this display: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-63724710

    https://unherd.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/11/3.jpg

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @KidDynamite

  614. @Coconuts
    @songbird

    I also watched Keith's video last night.

    It looks like they are trying to play accelerated catch up with some of the other North-West Euro countries in terms of demographic change. Hate speech laws only appeared in the UK about 50 years after migration started for example, and it took a while for them to really come into effect. They do seem to be a powerful and effective tool for controlling discussion of the topic though.

    Is this the influence of NGOs and corporate interests from Europe and other parts of the Anglo world? It's hard to understand what advantage Ireland gains from encouraging unfiltered immigration.

    Some interesting data points on what is going on in the UK at present:

    https://unherd.com/thepost/report-critical-race-theory-is-endemic-in-british-schools/

    https://www.spiked-online.com/2022/11/22/critical-race-theory-is-being-taught-as-fact/

    In the 2nd link there is a reference to the apparently quite widespread belief that the UK was a country founded on racism. The Museum of London apparently now has a display suggesting that a typical inhabitant of Roman London was a Sub-Saharan woman with mixed race children.

    This guy is one of the best mainstream or centre-left commentators on the issue, he is not as pessimistic:

    https://unherd.com/thepost/migration-numbers-are-not-as-bad-as-they-look/

    Things Ireland may have to look forward to in the future.

    Replies: @songbird

    I suspect that it is a problem of scale. Ireland is a very small country. So, that makes it easier to buy people. And easier to shift the political debate. There are really only like what, four cities? Most towns are essentially small villages. So small numbers can straight away weaponize liberals. Plus, due to scale, indigenous cultural production is pretty low. Culture is mostly a kind of fusion between the UK and America. IMO, the Balts are totally screwed.

    BTW, I’m skeptical about this idea that student visas can be entirely discounted as being part of some invasion. Yes, not everyone stays or wants to stay, but the reality that I’ve observed directly is that a large number see it as their ticket in, and there is a kind of wink-wink relationship with the regime. “Look, some degree mill here gave them a paper certificate, so that means that they are the professionals we need!” I’ve known plenty that have used it as their ticket in. Some that were the anchor babies who were claiming their rights. Many very odious people were born as the result of student visas. It is hardly a neutral endeavor to expose intelligent young people to large numbers of foreigners, or to become dependent upon them for teaching assistants, etc. Foreign students help prop up the tertiary education industry, something that is obviously too big for our own good.

    • Replies: @Coconuts
    @songbird


    I suspect that it is a problem of scale. Ireland is a very small country. So, that makes it easier to buy people. And easier to shift the political debate. There are really only like what, four cities? Most towns are essentially small villages. So small numbers can straight away weaponize liberals. Plus, due to scale, indigenous cultural production is pretty low. Culture is mostly a kind of fusion between the UK and America. IMO, the Balts are totally screwed.
     
    I didn’t think of the scale issue, but it would be a decent explanation of why it is moving much more quickly, and it is easier to generate the weight of opinion/influence needed to push this sort of change through. I did get the impression Irish culture retained strong British and US cultural influences, maybe Catholicism mitigated it to some extent, but this is now receding as well or supportive of the same policies.

    The Baltic states may have a certain level of protection due to the migrations they already experienced in the Soviet era, and the losses of population during WW2. I don’t think there are any Western countries with this sort of legacy to strengthen awareness of national identity, OTOH they are small.


    It is hardly a neutral endeavor to expose intelligent young people to large numbers of foreigners, or to become dependent upon them for teaching assistants, etc. Foreign students help prop up the tertiary education industry, something that is obviously too big for our own good.
     
    That’s true, the UK has already managed to grow a pretty oversize university sector that is increasingly eager to recruit foreign students. Funding for British students has also been progressively cut so they have to take out large loans as in the US, at the same time the career prospects for graduates are no longer as good due to sheer numbers being produced. Imo some of the explanation for the prominence of weird academic identity politics in wider society is coming from this student issue.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @songbird

  615. @German_reader
    @AP


    Allowing Russia to keep any territory seized in 2022 and for it not to pay for the damage it caused would reward its illegal and bloody aggression.
     
    The question is if there could be a deal that would allow Ukraine to achieve part of its objectives and at least a chance of a lasting peace agreement. Let's suppose Russia would agree to hand back occupied Zaporizhzhia (as I understand it a territory that is quite clearly Ukrainian in sentiment) in exchange for keeping some Donbass parts (or optimally, letting their future be decided by internationally supervised referenda) and Ukrainian recognition of Crimea as Russian. Of course such a deal may be just fantasy anyway and Russia might never agree to it in any case. But shouldn't one at least explore the possibility of such an agreement? It doesn't have to mean foregoing military options, many wars have featured continued fighting and parallel negotiations.
    As for Russia paying reparations, that seems like a very unrealistic goal.

    Replies: @A123, @AP, @AnonfromTN

    “Allowing Russia to keep any territory seized in 2022 and for it not to pay for the damage it caused would reward its illegal and bloody aggression.”

    The question is if there could be a deal that would allow Ukraine to achieve part of its objectives and at least a chance of a lasting peace agreement

    My point is that if Russia ends the war with more than it had when it started and Ukraine with less, then Russia will have been rewarded for its aggression. Even if the result is a “Pyrrhic” victory.

    So Ukraine (a country hostile to Russia) getting its infrastructure destroyed without compensation from Russia (i.e., having the West pay to rebuild) would be a reward for Russia. Additional territory would be a reward for Russia.

    This does not mean that Russia should get partitioned, or occupied, or forced to pay reparations that exceed paying for the material damage it caused, or “given” a civil war, or whatever. But to be clear – any additional territory beyond what Russia controlled in February this year and any destruction that Russia gets away with not paying for is a reward for Russia’s invasion of another country. Reversal of those gains should be a minimal requirement for peace.

    I agree that plebiscites in the pre-February Russian-controlled territories run and observed by neutral countries would be a just way of permanently resolving these issues and allowing an off ramp for normalisation and elimination of sanctions. But if Ukraine can get more on the battlefield, then additional losses for Russia within Ukraine would not be unreasonable. Germany’s territorial losses to Czechoslovakia and Poland were a precedent. Invasions can have consequences.

    As for Russia paying reparations, that seems like a very unrealistic goal

    It can just be taken out of the seized reserves and assets. There have been precedents for that IIRC.

    • Replies: @A123
    @AP


    My point is that if Russia ends the war with more than it had when it started and Ukraine with less, then Russia will have been rewarded for its aggression. Even if the result is a “Pyrrhic” victory.
     
    Your proposed approach for Ukie-stan sounds much like the Pali tradition of insincere "negotiations". That strategy has failed for 70+ years. Is that really the fate you want for the region? Generations of turmoil?
    ___

    Why should Putin not set conditions based on an equally logical argument dating back to events in 2014 (and earlier).

    The Kiev regime brutally killed in Donbass and elsewhere. They also engaged in collective punishment targeting Russian citizens in Crimea. Clearly Ukraine must not be rewarded for its aggression by keeping everything it had after 8 years of misbehavior. Even if the result is a "Pyrrhic” victory for Kiev.
    ____

    In the real world, a deal means that neither side will get everything they want.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @AP

    , @Beckow
    @AP


    ...Reversal of those gains should be a minimal requirement for peace.
     
    Kiev is not in a position to reverse it militarily, e.g. Mariupol, Azov coast...if you want peace Kiev will have to negotiate. It is heading to either a prolonged bloody stalemate or a new Russian attack with Kiev collapsing out of cumulative destruction.

    You can't dictate to the other side if you are losing on the ground. You live in a temporary bubble of 'success' without understanding that strategically nothing has changed: Russia is still much stronger. Plebiscites are a non-starter, the two sides don't trust each other and there are no neutral observers. Who would vote and who would count? It is a few years late for that.


    ...taken out of the seized reserves and assets
     
    Another fantasy. The Western assets in Russia - they have also been frozen - exceed Russia's 'financial deposits' in the West. It is $300 trillion against $500+ trillion in Western assets in Russia. Western assets are real: oil, gas, minerals, factories... vs. electronic 'money' and bonds. Exxon, Total, BP... would have to be compensated first - they lost huge wealth with potential to grow.

    A story in finance is that Russia intentionally left some reserves in the West to goad the eager Westerners into freezing it. That allowed Russia to reciprocate and freeze more valuable Western investments in Russia. Given Putin's legalism Russia wanted an excuse. Not sure it is true, but that's the way it has played out. You are suggesting that Kiev in effect be compensated from BP, Exxon, Japanese... and their lost Russian assets. Do you think they will agree? (Maybe...it is all about geo-politics now, business be damned.)

    It is a loss-loss and it undermines international finance, back to Middle Ages...do you think money people like going back to Middle Ages so you can forbid Russian language in Donbas schools and have Nato prance around Black Sea steppes?

    Replies: @AP, @showmethereal

  616. @Mr. Hack
    @German_reader

    Ukraine and Hungary have been tussling over perceived Hungarian rights in Zakarpattya for many years now. To wear such a "ridiculous scarf" at such a time as now, is the height of insensitive hubris.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    Ukrainians are surrounded by a Bolshevik (to the north, man with hat and red star), a Russian White Army soldier (to the east, with Russian eagle flag and a short whip), and to the west a Polish soldier, a Hungarian (in pink uniform) and two Romanian soldiers. Wikimedia Commons.

    Ukrainian sensitivity to such childish pranks as Orban’s appearance at a football match wearing a scarve depicting pre-Trianon borders needs to be viewed in relation to their history. Romania also has voiced its insensitivity to this display: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-63724710

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Mr. Hack


    appearance at a football match
     
    It's a football match for crying out loud. Complaining about this is fake and gay.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    , @KidDynamite
    @Mr. Hack

    What’s everyone mad at? He looks like one of the many fat grandpas during my work’s annual ugly winter sweater contest.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

  617. @Barbarossa
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    I dunno man, that seems like a real stretch. Rogan talks about everything under the sun on his program , it's not like he was sneaking it the 'Vid realism in between announcing the punches, so the sports connection is extremely tangential at best.
    You may as well say that sports watching is a important way for people to get exposure to the principles of physics. I guess it sort of rhymes, but I don't think it makes much sense.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    Joe Rogan is a buffoon but his program deserves attention.

    1. he has 11 million subscribers and he talks about illegal drugs, identity politics, nuclear war and peace with people never permitted on other main media. Like Alex Jones example number one. Measure by (free speech times free reach product) and he might be number one. If not he is close.

    2. the claim he says whatever he wants to and talks to whoever he wants to is false. We will hear Kanye West talking about Jews on there at some point. This is because West is a retard and his hate speech is safe hate speech. There ain’t no way we will hear Farakhan dealing the facts about Goldman Sacks of Jew cash coming from trading African slaves and then multiplied by dealing smack and crack to liberated African slave descendants.

    3. he had those gas bags Neil Tyson and Eric Weinstein on his show covering your principles of physics for you.

    The sports connection is this: Joe Rogan audience at the beginning were all MMA fans. He sucks at comedy but he knows fighting.

    • Replies: @Barbarossa
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    I basically fully agree with your take on Rogan. I wish him all the best for the unorthodox takes he is willing to entertain on his show.


    Joe Rogan audience at the beginning were all MMA fans.
     
    Sure, but still the sports connection is tangential and not really directly correlated to his free speech aspect. Rogan also hosted Fear Factor and so by the logic of your initial statement you could assert that reality TV shows have an important truth telling aspect because Rogan said sensible things about Covid or other un-PC matters.

    To whit; correlation does not imply causation.

    It's not a big point at all, I just didn't think your comment made much sense. Happens to the best of us!
  618. @Mr. Hack
    @Mr. Hack

    https://communistcrimes.org/sites/default/files/inline-images/file-20220302-13-6lqr2j.jpg
    Ukrainians are surrounded by a Bolshevik (to the north, man with hat and red star), a Russian White Army soldier (to the east, with Russian eagle flag and a short whip), and to the west a Polish soldier, a Hungarian (in pink uniform) and two Romanian soldiers. Wikimedia Commons.

    Ukrainian sensitivity to such childish pranks as Orban's appearance at a football match wearing a scarve depicting pre-Trianon borders needs to be viewed in relation to their history. Romania also has voiced its insensitivity to this display: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-63724710

    https://unherd.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/11/3.jpg

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @KidDynamite

    appearance at a football match

    It’s a football match for crying out loud. Complaining about this is fake and gay.

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    So if Zelensky showed up at "it's onl a football match" wearing SS regalia would it be Okay? I trust not, so why the double standard?

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

  619. Is there some way that they could pretend to give all these Moroccans in Belgium free tickets and Moroccan jerseys to the next world cup, but really deport them to Morocco?

  620. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Mr. Hack


    appearance at a football match
     
    It's a football match for crying out loud. Complaining about this is fake and gay.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    So if Zelensky showed up at “it’s onl a football match” wearing SS regalia would it be Okay? I trust not, so why the double standard?

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Mr. Hack

    Sure. Why not?

    What adult free man with 3/4 of a brain is afraid of a swastika? Can you name one?

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

  621. @showmethereal
    @silviosilver

    If China was the one responsible for the disruption in Myanmar and was flooded with migrants then I would say it’s China’s fault and China has to deal with it. But that’s not the case.

    And you claim I was anti white. Where did I blame all whites???? I don’t believe Serbians should have to suffer consequences of NATO actions. I didn’t think Finland should either - but since Finland wants to join NATO then I wouldn’t feel sorry for them if they have a migrant crisis. Same goes for the issues that come up regarding past imperialism and relationships with former colonies. If they weren’t a colonizer I don’t think a white country should have to suffer. Which was how this argument started. Why should Russia take in African migrants. France won the World Cup with descendants and immigrants from former colonies. Russia has not won a World Cup and Russia did not have them. See people aren’t stupid. Africans have said it themselves regarding both Russia and China. Why do you think in the recent riots in Haiti they were marching with Russian flags asking Russia for help to keep out “international UN troops” like happened last time (which was a U.S. and French operation in disguise).

    As to the consequences of what would happen to your suggestion …. Well personally I think it might ignite the jihadists again to attack western countries some more. But It will certainly cause Global South countries to further vote against western countries in the UN. If they think it’s “bad” the global south won’t economically sanction Russia right now - expect it to get “worse”.

    Make no mistake - I am against illegal migration. But I understand cause and effect. I also understand the God given principle that governs all of creation which is - sowing and reaping.

    Replies: @silviosilver, @Coconuts

    Make no mistake – I am against illegal migration. But I understand cause and effect. I also understand the God given principle that governs all of creation which is – sowing and reaping.

    I think it’s interesting to think about what error or mistake God might be exacting justice on these countries for…

    A dominant political belief in say France or Britain is that in an ideal world an individual’s hereditary national or ethnic identity should not shape and determine their lives in either positive or negative ways. People holding this view are rather against hereditary influences and inherited differences in wealth, power etc. between nations.

    (This may not be the actual cause of their immigration policies, just on the surface a lot of people ostensibly hold these views.)

    This is one reason they promote high levels of migration; it will break down distinctions between nations and make populations more equal.

    But superficially God’s judgement on this seems to be ‘if you believe in these egalitarian fictions your population will go extinct, or at least reduced to a remanent, and all the territory and resources will pass into the hands of people and other nations in perpetuity’.

    God’s justice seems kind of based if they are going to be punished for believing in that error.

    • Replies: @A123
    @Coconuts


    A dominant political belief in say France or Britain is that in an ideal world an individual’s hereditary national or ethnic identity should not shape and determine their lives in either positive or negative ways. People holding this view are rather against hereditary influences and inherited differences in wealth, power etc. between nations.
     
    Many of these traditions came from a time when travel was vastly more difficult. France did an excellent job making migrants French, regardless of their ethnicity, when they arrived in limited numbers from nearby lands or as pre assimilated successes from French colonies.

    The modern era failure is driven by a combination of both volume and quality.

    The number of people who can travel is much higher. Trying to make it to an island in an inexpensive rubber boat is a very new concept. Such boats did not 100 years ago. And, even if one made it to an island like Corsica, there would be no further transport to the mainland.

    Accepting Europeans and only a few hand picked from far away locations meant that France was dealing with individuals with high assimilation potential. Literacy was limited and 500 words of pidgin French would achieve lower class functionality. The barrier was higher in the middle and upper class, but still surmountable. Reading and writing passable French was an achievable aspiration.

    The modern era brings an over abundance of these with poor prospects for assimilation. It broke the model. The idea of "no-go" zones should be unthinkable. Indeed God may be levying a punishment. The first step towards redemption is sending those incapable of Judeo-Christian belief back to where they came. They can never be properly French.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @Coconuts

    , @showmethereal
    @Coconuts

    I am separating the process of legal migration- which any country can make laws however they want (a country is free to allow little to no legal migration) vs having to deal with human waves of displaced people because of destabilization.

    For instance there are those who complain about foreign students or visas given to foreign workers. I make no judgments on those who want to close down those visas. Whether it benefits their society or not is a different issue. Complete different issues. I saw on the news many Americans dismayed by the increasing waves of Venezuelan people after the US has tried to crush the society and government. They want them to revolt. But they rather migrate rather than start a civil war - especially since many know the US is the one who strangled their country in the first place. Same with all the refugees from Afghanistan and Iraq and Syria and those flooding through a decimated Libya. On and on and on….

    Those are caused by decisions made by higher ups to cause destruction and they are reaping the fruits of what they did. If democracy works as people claim then they should be voted out. But most people have zero clue as to the roots of the problem.

  622. @AP
    @Mikel


    No. Switzerland is a far superior solution.
     
    Federation in Ukraine would not have resembled Switzerland but rather 18th century Poland. "Autonomous" eastern parts would be under de facto control of Russia, and therefore any Ukrainian policies would be vetoed by Russia. The state would be weak, dexentralized, paralyzed. It's why Minsk deal was pushed by Russia. You think Russia had Ukraine's best interests in mind when doing so?

    Russia invaded and partitioned Poland when Poland tried to reform its system in order to eliminate that state of affairs. It was aided by Poland's western neighbors. Russia would like the same - Orban is willing to play that role, but fortunately for Ukraine Poland is not.

    Speaking of Nazis, if Ukraine tries to go for a Versailles humiliation, understandable as the desire might now be, it is not difficult to predict that it will sooner or later get a III Reich on its frontier
     
    Are Russians as competent as the Germans were?

    It’s time for statesmanship in order to avert a worse Russian threat for everybody in the future.
     
    Allowing Russia to keep any territory seized in 2022 and for it not to pay for the damage it caused would reward its illegal and bloody aggression.

    Replies: @German_reader, @Mikel

    Are Russians as competent as the Germans were?

    No. But in the end they defeated the very competent Germans nonetheless. Dismiss the people who put the first man in orbit and built the Tsar Bomba at your own peril.

    • Agree: showmethereal
    • Replies: @AP
    @Mikel

    The Russians didn’t defeat the Germans. The USSR did. So Russians plus 90% of Ukrainians plus Central Asians.

    Russia is not the USSR. It is not the Russian Empire. It is just - Russia. A country that was defeated by a motivated and unified Poland (lavishly supported by the West - sound familiar?) in 1921. A country that regularly lost wars to Poland-Lithuania until the latter splintered in a civil war.

    Replies: @Mikel

  623. @AP
    @German_reader


    “Allowing Russia to keep any territory seized in 2022 and for it not to pay for the damage it caused would reward its illegal and bloody aggression.”

    The question is if there could be a deal that would allow Ukraine to achieve part of its objectives and at least a chance of a lasting peace agreement
     
    My point is that if Russia ends the war with more than it had when it started and Ukraine with less, then Russia will have been rewarded for its aggression. Even if the result is a “Pyrrhic” victory.

    So Ukraine (a country hostile to Russia) getting its infrastructure destroyed without compensation from Russia (i.e., having the West pay to rebuild) would be a reward for Russia. Additional territory would be a reward for Russia.

    This does not mean that Russia should get partitioned, or occupied, or forced to pay reparations that exceed paying for the material damage it caused, or “given” a civil war, or whatever. But to be clear - any additional territory beyond what Russia controlled in February this year and any destruction that Russia gets away with not paying for is a reward for Russia’s invasion of another country. Reversal of those gains should be a minimal requirement for peace.

    I agree that plebiscites in the pre-February Russian-controlled territories run and observed by neutral countries would be a just way of permanently resolving these issues and allowing an off ramp for normalisation and elimination of sanctions. But if Ukraine can get more on the battlefield, then additional losses for Russia within Ukraine would not be unreasonable. Germany’s territorial losses to Czechoslovakia and Poland were a precedent. Invasions can have consequences.

    As for Russia paying reparations, that seems like a very unrealistic goal
     
    It can just be taken out of the seized reserves and assets. There have been precedents for that IIRC.

    Replies: @A123, @Beckow

    My point is that if Russia ends the war with more than it had when it started and Ukraine with less, then Russia will have been rewarded for its aggression. Even if the result is a “Pyrrhic” victory.

    Your proposed approach for Ukie-stan sounds much like the Pali tradition of insincere “negotiations”. That strategy has failed for 70+ years. Is that really the fate you want for the region? Generations of turmoil?
    ___

    Why should Putin not set conditions based on an equally logical argument dating back to events in 2014 (and earlier).

    The Kiev regime brutally killed in Donbass and elsewhere. They also engaged in collective punishment targeting Russian citizens in Crimea. Clearly Ukraine must not be rewarded for its aggression by keeping everything it had after 8 years of misbehavior. Even if the result is a “Pyrrhic” victory for Kiev.
    ____

    In the real world, a deal means that neither side will get everything they want.

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @AP
    @A123

    Are you working on your pro-Islamic pivot?



    https://twitter.com/orthodoxnews2/status/1596636272273272832?s=46&t=Frs0oajOL0JbWNdgQmOXAQ

  624. @Mr. Hack
    @Mr. Hack

    https://communistcrimes.org/sites/default/files/inline-images/file-20220302-13-6lqr2j.jpg
    Ukrainians are surrounded by a Bolshevik (to the north, man with hat and red star), a Russian White Army soldier (to the east, with Russian eagle flag and a short whip), and to the west a Polish soldier, a Hungarian (in pink uniform) and two Romanian soldiers. Wikimedia Commons.

    Ukrainian sensitivity to such childish pranks as Orban's appearance at a football match wearing a scarve depicting pre-Trianon borders needs to be viewed in relation to their history. Romania also has voiced its insensitivity to this display: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-63724710

    https://unherd.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/11/3.jpg

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @KidDynamite

    What’s everyone mad at? He looks like one of the many fat grandpas during my work’s annual ugly winter sweater contest.

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @KidDynamite

    Years of sucking up to Putler hasn't helped his image any:

    https://images.cartoonstock.com/lowres/orban-victor_orban-ukraine_crisis-russian_military_invasion-russian_military_aggression-tank-CS566243_low.jpg

    Replies: @Barbarossa

  625. @Mr. Hack
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    So if Zelensky showed up at "it's onl a football match" wearing SS regalia would it be Okay? I trust not, so why the double standard?

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    Sure. Why not?

    What adult free man with 3/4 of a brain is afraid of a swastika? Can you name one?

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    That's an easy one. Hasn't Putler stated that one of his main reasons for invading Ukraine is to rid the country of Nazis? He seems to see them everywhere within Ukraine, hospitals, apartment buildings, churches. The guy is a lunatic when it comes to seeing Nazis everywhere!

    https://mediacloud.theweek.com/image/private/s--kxqXotLd--/f_auto,t_single-media-image-desktop@1/v1608148723/59347_cartoon_main.jpg

    Replies: @Beckow

  626. @Coconuts
    @showmethereal


    Make no mistake – I am against illegal migration. But I understand cause and effect. I also understand the God given principle that governs all of creation which is – sowing and reaping.
     
    I think it's interesting to think about what error or mistake God might be exacting justice on these countries for...

    A dominant political belief in say France or Britain is that in an ideal world an individual's hereditary national or ethnic identity should not shape and determine their lives in either positive or negative ways. People holding this view are rather against hereditary influences and inherited differences in wealth, power etc. between nations.

    (This may not be the actual cause of their immigration policies, just on the surface a lot of people ostensibly hold these views.)

    This is one reason they promote high levels of migration; it will break down distinctions between nations and make populations more equal.

    But superficially God's judgement on this seems to be 'if you believe in these egalitarian fictions your population will go extinct, or at least reduced to a remanent, and all the territory and resources will pass into the hands of people and other nations in perpetuity'.

    God's justice seems kind of based if they are going to be punished for believing in that error.

    Replies: @A123, @showmethereal

    A dominant political belief in say France or Britain is that in an ideal world an individual’s hereditary national or ethnic identity should not shape and determine their lives in either positive or negative ways. People holding this view are rather against hereditary influences and inherited differences in wealth, power etc. between nations.

    Many of these traditions came from a time when travel was vastly more difficult. France did an excellent job making migrants French, regardless of their ethnicity, when they arrived in limited numbers from nearby lands or as pre assimilated successes from French colonies.

    The modern era failure is driven by a combination of both volume and quality.

    The number of people who can travel is much higher. Trying to make it to an island in an inexpensive rubber boat is a very new concept. Such boats did not 100 years ago. And, even if one made it to an island like Corsica, there would be no further transport to the mainland.

    Accepting Europeans and only a few hand picked from far away locations meant that France was dealing with individuals with high assimilation potential. Literacy was limited and 500 words of pidgin French would achieve lower class functionality. The barrier was higher in the middle and upper class, but still surmountable. Reading and writing passable French was an achievable aspiration.

    The modern era brings an over abundance of these with poor prospects for assimilation. It broke the model. The idea of “no-go” zones should be unthinkable. Indeed God may be levying a punishment. The first step towards redemption is sending those incapable of Judeo-Christian belief back to where they came. They can never be properly French.

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @Coconuts
    @A123


    Many of these traditions came from a time when travel was vastly more difficult. France did an excellent job making migrants French, regardless of their ethnicity, when they arrived in limited numbers from nearby lands or as pre assimilated successes from French colonies.
     
    This is true. I think there are a couple of additional points as well.

    The first is the declining fertility and white populations in France and the UK, when these ideas became current, I don't think this issue was understood. Afaik people tended to assume the white population levels would stay fairly constant.

    The other is that some of the momentum behind these ideas comes from business interests that prioritise expanding their labour pool and access to markets, regardless of larger impacts (egalitarianism is not a motivating force). But policies like Brexit or restricting immigration would get in the way of this, so they weigh in against them by promoting things like CRT training among their work forces.

    Replies: @A123

  627. @German_reader
    @AP


    Allowing Russia to keep any territory seized in 2022 and for it not to pay for the damage it caused would reward its illegal and bloody aggression.
     
    The question is if there could be a deal that would allow Ukraine to achieve part of its objectives and at least a chance of a lasting peace agreement. Let's suppose Russia would agree to hand back occupied Zaporizhzhia (as I understand it a territory that is quite clearly Ukrainian in sentiment) in exchange for keeping some Donbass parts (or optimally, letting their future be decided by internationally supervised referenda) and Ukrainian recognition of Crimea as Russian. Of course such a deal may be just fantasy anyway and Russia might never agree to it in any case. But shouldn't one at least explore the possibility of such an agreement? It doesn't have to mean foregoing military options, many wars have featured continued fighting and parallel negotiations.
    As for Russia paying reparations, that seems like a very unrealistic goal.

    Replies: @A123, @AP, @AnonfromTN

    as I understand it a territory that is quite clearly Ukrainian in sentiment

    Now I know where this and many of your previous statements come from. Tägliche Nachrichten shows that in terms of lying Deutsche Welle beats even CNN (not a mean feat). My condolences.

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @AnonfromTN

    DW is pathetic, a combination of Western guidance and German defeatist servility. They overdo even CNN.

    But why would we expect more from a defeated country? Anglos took the Russian victory over Germany in WW2 and imposed their own rule over Germans. Russians stayed in East Germany for 45 years (actually Poles took and cleansed most of East Germany). Anglos are in Germany for 75 years and it looks like it will be in perpetuity, they are even bringing new people to make it feel more like home.

    , @German_reader
    @AnonfromTN

    I don't watch Deutsche Welle, or any other German mainstream media.
    Do you have evidence that Zaporizhzhia is clearly pro-Russian? Or do I just have to take your word for it, or believe in that ridiculous pseudo-referendum?

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @LondonBob

  628. @AP
    @German_reader


    “Allowing Russia to keep any territory seized in 2022 and for it not to pay for the damage it caused would reward its illegal and bloody aggression.”

    The question is if there could be a deal that would allow Ukraine to achieve part of its objectives and at least a chance of a lasting peace agreement
     
    My point is that if Russia ends the war with more than it had when it started and Ukraine with less, then Russia will have been rewarded for its aggression. Even if the result is a “Pyrrhic” victory.

    So Ukraine (a country hostile to Russia) getting its infrastructure destroyed without compensation from Russia (i.e., having the West pay to rebuild) would be a reward for Russia. Additional territory would be a reward for Russia.

    This does not mean that Russia should get partitioned, or occupied, or forced to pay reparations that exceed paying for the material damage it caused, or “given” a civil war, or whatever. But to be clear - any additional territory beyond what Russia controlled in February this year and any destruction that Russia gets away with not paying for is a reward for Russia’s invasion of another country. Reversal of those gains should be a minimal requirement for peace.

    I agree that plebiscites in the pre-February Russian-controlled territories run and observed by neutral countries would be a just way of permanently resolving these issues and allowing an off ramp for normalisation and elimination of sanctions. But if Ukraine can get more on the battlefield, then additional losses for Russia within Ukraine would not be unreasonable. Germany’s territorial losses to Czechoslovakia and Poland were a precedent. Invasions can have consequences.

    As for Russia paying reparations, that seems like a very unrealistic goal
     
    It can just be taken out of the seized reserves and assets. There have been precedents for that IIRC.

    Replies: @A123, @Beckow

    …Reversal of those gains should be a minimal requirement for peace.

    Kiev is not in a position to reverse it militarily, e.g. Mariupol, Azov coast…if you want peace Kiev will have to negotiate. It is heading to either a prolonged bloody stalemate or a new Russian attack with Kiev collapsing out of cumulative destruction.

    You can’t dictate to the other side if you are losing on the ground. You live in a temporary bubble of ‘success‘ without understanding that strategically nothing has changed: Russia is still much stronger. Plebiscites are a non-starter, the two sides don’t trust each other and there are no neutral observers. Who would vote and who would count? It is a few years late for that.

    …taken out of the seized reserves and assets

    Another fantasy. The Western assets in Russia – they have also been frozen – exceed Russia’s ‘financial deposits‘ in the West. It is $300 trillion against $500+ trillion in Western assets in Russia. Western assets are real: oil, gas, minerals, factories… vs. electronic ‘money’ and bonds. Exxon, Total, BP… would have to be compensated first – they lost huge wealth with potential to grow.

    A story in finance is that Russia intentionally left some reserves in the West to goad the eager Westerners into freezing it. That allowed Russia to reciprocate and freeze more valuable Western investments in Russia. Given Putin’s legalism Russia wanted an excuse. Not sure it is true, but that’s the way it has played out. You are suggesting that Kiev in effect be compensated from BP, Exxon, Japanese… and their lost Russian assets. Do you think they will agree? (Maybe…it is all about geo-politics now, business be damned.)

    It is a loss-loss and it undermines international finance, back to Middle Ages…do you think money people like going back to Middle Ages so you can forbid Russian language in Donbas schools and have Nato prance around Black Sea steppes?

    • Replies: @AP
    @Beckow


    Kiev is not in a position to reverse it militarily, e.g. Mariupol, Azov coast
     
    Too early to tell. Remember that you insisted Ukraine would fall in days. How did that work out?

    It is heading to either a prolonged bloody stalemate or a new Russian attack with Kiev collapsing out of cumulative destruction.
     
    Our former host who is smarter, more honest, and better informed than you are predicts 70% stalemate roughly along current lines, 30% Ukrainian victory (retaking land bridge, going into northern Crimea). He has a history of overestimating Russia, moreover.

    Plebiscites are a non-starter, the two sides don’t trust each other and there are no neutral observers.
     
    I was discussing how an eventual peace might look (i.e., if both sides are exhausted after a long time of stalemate).

    Another fantasy. The Western assets in Russia – they have also been frozen – exceed Russia’s ‘financial deposits‘ in the West. It is $300 trillion against $500+ trillion in Western assets in Russia.
     
    It is billions, not trillions.

    And you are lying again.

    The frozen Russian government central bank reserves amount to $300 billion.

    Russia/Russians have an additional $1 trillion parked in the West, that are not Russian government reserves. If you want to compare assets by private Western companies in Russia versus assets of Russia in the West and play this game, Russia loses also. It can take the West's $500 billion in Russia and lose $1.3 trillion in the West.

    Do you really "think" that the West sent more money into Russia than vice versa? Lol.
    , @showmethereal
    @Beckow

    Western governments know that if you met it out - western assets in Russia are more valuable than the seized Russian reserves in the west. But of course the easily fooled sheep don’t get it. And yeah it absolutely was a master play because it will give a basis.. “you took our stuff so we take yours”.

  629. @silviosilver
    @showmethereal


    Make no mistake – I am against illegal migration. But I understand cause and effect. I also understand the God given principle that governs all of creation which is – sowing and reaping.
     
    You are against illegal infiltration, but also against taking action to prevent it. And if it were a simple case of cause and effect, it would occur naturally, without you having to campaign for it. (And which case your comments on it would amount to no more than taunts of the "suck shit" variety, which in fact is precisely what they are even in the absence of that causal mechanism.)

    Drop the sanctimony, please. You are no good at it. You have the requisite duplicity, but you completely lack the charm, which is the other essential ingredient. Thus your attempts to assume the moral high ground come off as nothing more than you hurling your Chinese butthurt against the world. From the standpoint of personal wellbeing, seeking professional help for your emotional difficulties would be the wiser course of action, but it is your life, your choice.

    Oh, and you are also a muslim, obviously on George Islamo-Soros's payroll.

    : p

    Replies: @Barbarossa, @showmethereal

    Oh, and you are also a muslim, obviously on George Islamo-Soros’s payroll

    A123 is going to sue for infringement of intellectual property!

    On second thought, I think that would only apply if you had called him a George Islamo-Homo-Soros Muslim.

    Dang, maybe I’m confused on that since IslamoHomoSoros sounds like a dinosaur’s name. I can see the memes already…

    • Replies: @A123
    @Barbarossa


    IslamoHomoSoros sounds like a dinosaur’s name. I can see the memes already…
     
    ROTFL

    Is Silvio going for IslamoGloboHomoEuroSoros?

    Congratulations..... That is so tangled, I will not go that far.....

    It would be the most confused dino of all time. Cause of extinction = Shunned by all cis-dinosaurs, was unable to reproduce.

    #LetsGoBrandon 😇

    Replies: @Barbarossa

    , @silviosilver
    @Barbarossa


    A123 is going to sue for infringement of intellectual property!
     
    Cripes, I had not thought of that. Reading your post, I feared I may be forced to swallow my pride and pour on all the charm I can muster. ("Heeyy, A123, buddy, pal, chum!! How goes it, my fellow judeo-christian? We are a couple of battle-hardened keyboard warriors, are we not? Here's to old times!") Say what you will about him, but I have come to respect his ability to snare the unwary with his eccentricities, only to lay the smack down over pesky, overlooked details. It appears my concerns were unwarranted, as he is in a kindly mood. I shall consider it a lesson learned, however.
  630. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Mr. Hack

    Sure. Why not?

    What adult free man with 3/4 of a brain is afraid of a swastika? Can you name one?

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    That’s an easy one. Hasn’t Putler stated that one of his main reasons for invading Ukraine is to rid the country of Nazis? He seems to see them everywhere within Ukraine, hospitals, apartment buildings, churches. The guy is a lunatic when it comes to seeing Nazis everywhere!

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @Mr. Hack

    Oh my god, this is sad...what are you like 90-95 IQ? How did you even find Unz?

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

  631. @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader


    as I understand it a territory that is quite clearly Ukrainian in sentiment
     
    Now I know where this and many of your previous statements come from. Tägliche Nachrichten shows that in terms of lying Deutsche Welle beats even CNN (not a mean feat). My condolences.

    Replies: @Beckow, @German_reader

    DW is pathetic, a combination of Western guidance and German defeatist servility. They overdo even CNN.

    But why would we expect more from a defeated country? Anglos took the Russian victory over Germany in WW2 and imposed their own rule over Germans. Russians stayed in East Germany for 45 years (actually Poles took and cleansed most of East Germany). Anglos are in Germany for 75 years and it looks like it will be in perpetuity, they are even bringing new people to make it feel more like home.

  632. @Mr. Hack
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    That's an easy one. Hasn't Putler stated that one of his main reasons for invading Ukraine is to rid the country of Nazis? He seems to see them everywhere within Ukraine, hospitals, apartment buildings, churches. The guy is a lunatic when it comes to seeing Nazis everywhere!

    https://mediacloud.theweek.com/image/private/s--kxqXotLd--/f_auto,t_single-media-image-desktop@1/v1608148723/59347_cartoon_main.jpg

    Replies: @Beckow

    Oh my god, this is sad…what are you like 90-95 IQ? How did you even find Unz?

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @Beckow

    Why, do you feel that Putler somehow hasn't used the Nazi boogeyman as one of his primary reasons for starting this war (er, "military operation" for dimwits like you). :-)

    Replies: @Beckow

  633. @KidDynamite
    @Mr. Hack

    What’s everyone mad at? He looks like one of the many fat grandpas during my work’s annual ugly winter sweater contest.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    Years of sucking up to Putler hasn’t helped his image any:

    • Replies: @Barbarossa
    @Mr. Hack

    What is up with the deep and wide genre of "HomoPutin" jokes and memes? It doesn't really make any sense and is equally strange for being generally made by people that are on #TeamHomoLeftists.

    They just seem unfunny and deeply unimaginative. I'm sure that if one wanted to portray Trump or Orban as being in Putin's pocket they could figure out some more clever way to do it, but the HomoPutin take is just lazy.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Mr. Hack

  634. @Beckow
    @Mr. Hack

    Oh my god, this is sad...what are you like 90-95 IQ? How did you even find Unz?

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    Why, do you feel that Putler somehow hasn’t used the Nazi boogeyman as one of his primary reasons for starting this war (er, “military operation” for dimwits like you). 🙂

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @Mr. Hack

    In a war everybody uses what they can. Russian rhetoric about 'Nazis in Ukraine' is overstated, but it is based on more reality than you admit and compared to West-Ukie demonization of everything Russian ("Mongol hordes!") it is mild. Your 'cartoon' was retarded, think about it before you descend into primitivism.

    And I have always called it a war...it is a war.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

  635. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Barbarossa

    Joe Rogan is a buffoon but his program deserves attention.

    1. he has 11 million subscribers and he talks about illegal drugs, identity politics, nuclear war and peace with people never permitted on other main media. Like Alex Jones example number one. Measure by (free speech times free reach product) and he might be number one. If not he is close.

    2. the claim he says whatever he wants to and talks to whoever he wants to is false. We will hear Kanye West talking about Jews on there at some point. This is because West is a retard and his hate speech is safe hate speech. There ain't no way we will hear Farakhan dealing the facts about Goldman Sacks of Jew cash coming from trading African slaves and then multiplied by dealing smack and crack to liberated African slave descendants.

    3. he had those gas bags Neil Tyson and Eric Weinstein on his show covering your principles of physics for you.

    The sports connection is this: Joe Rogan audience at the beginning were all MMA fans. He sucks at comedy but he knows fighting.

    Replies: @Barbarossa

    I basically fully agree with your take on Rogan. I wish him all the best for the unorthodox takes he is willing to entertain on his show.

    Joe Rogan audience at the beginning were all MMA fans.

    Sure, but still the sports connection is tangential and not really directly correlated to his free speech aspect. Rogan also hosted Fear Factor and so by the logic of your initial statement you could assert that reality TV shows have an important truth telling aspect because Rogan said sensible things about Covid or other un-PC matters.

    To whit; correlation does not imply causation.

    It’s not a big point at all, I just didn’t think your comment made much sense. Happens to the best of us!

  636. @German_reader
    @AP


    Survival of the Ukrainian state
     
    Sure, it's Poland's interest (and that of other EU countries as well) that Ukraine doesn't become a Russian satellite state, with Russian troops or security services being stationed close to the Polish border. However, there's also another, possibly quite existential interest for Poland: not to become a direct participant, and theatre, in this war. And Zelensky's government has shown again and again that they very much would like to draw NATO countries into becoming direct participants in their war, without regard for the consequences (and as I mentioned in my previous comment, with the missile incident it was so blatant and egregious that even mainstream media in Western countries noticed).
    One has to realize what Zelensky and co. actually did here: A Ukrainian missile lands in Poland, killing two Poles, and the Ukrainians must have known pretty much immediately that it was their own missile. Instead of apologizing, saying "We'll do our best to avoid such incidents in the future" they then lie (yes, lie) about it and try to spin it to their advantage by once again calling for NATO entering the war through enforcement of a no-fly-zone (not just asking for more anti-air-defense systems, as would have been reasonable). And that's the most charitable interpretation of this incident.

    A Pole told me
     
    I'm sure there are Poles who believe such things, but it still doesn't make any sense.

    Orban is willing to play that role
     
    And you base that on what? Do you seriously believe Hungary has any territorial designs on Ukraine that would cause them to take part in Ukraine's dismemberment? I've seen nothing in Orban's public statements that would indicate something like this (unless you're referring to the ridiculous scarf he was wearing recently).

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @AP

    Sure, it’s Poland’s interest (and that of other EU countries as well) that Ukraine doesn’t become a Russian satellite state, with Russian troops or security services being stationed close to the Polish border. However, there’s also another, possibly quite existential interest for Poland: not to become a direct participant, and theatre, in this war

    Correct. It is in Poland’s best interest for Russia to fail to conquer Ukraine, and it is in Poland’s best interest not to be a direct participant. It would get tricky if direct participation were to become necessary in order to prevent a Russian conquest of Ukraine, however. This has not been the case, fortunately. But Poland is rightly doing all it can to enable Ukraine to fight on its own.

    A Pole told me

    I’m sure there are Poles who believe such things, but it still doesn’t make any sense

    Why do you think it wouldn’t make sense for Russia to want a Ukrainian missile to hit Polish territory? And since it does, to deliberately make this more likely by firing close to Polish territory?

    “Orban is willing to play that role”

    And you base that on what? Do you seriously believe Hungary has any territorial designs on Ukraine that would cause them to take part in Ukraine’s dismemberment

    If given the chance, Orban would absolutely take a chunk of Ukraine populated by ethnic Hungarians. His government has given passports to ethnic Hungarians in Ukraine against the wishes of Ukraine (same thing that Russia did for people in Donbas) and it is no coincidence that his is the most Russia-friendly country in Europe regarding Ukraine, including criticising the provision of weapons for Ukraine to defend itself. Of course, little Hungary on its own can’t do anything, particularly since Ukraine has not collapsed. But I have no doubt that if Russian soldiers made it to the Carpathians, Hungary would try to secure the other side of those mountains. The scarf scandal is just a slip-up.

    Here is a Hungarian politician tweeting about wanting a common border with Poland again:

    [MORE]

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @AP


    Why do you think it wouldn’t make sense for Russia to want a Ukrainian missile to hit Polish territory?
     
    What would Russia gain from it? As the missile incident showed, people are likely to blame Russia in any case, so this would make it only more likely that more advanced weapons systems will be sent to Ukraine.

    But I have no doubt that if Russian soldiers made it to the Carpathians, Hungary would try to secure the other side of those mountains.
     
    imo that's paranoid, I think Orban is too realistic for that.
    Too bad reiner tor isn't here anymore, he could add a lot to this discussion.
  637. @Mr. Hack
    @KidDynamite

    Years of sucking up to Putler hasn't helped his image any:

    https://images.cartoonstock.com/lowres/orban-victor_orban-ukraine_crisis-russian_military_invasion-russian_military_aggression-tank-CS566243_low.jpg

    Replies: @Barbarossa

    What is up with the deep and wide genre of “HomoPutin” jokes and memes? It doesn’t really make any sense and is equally strange for being generally made by people that are on #TeamHomoLeftists.

    They just seem unfunny and deeply unimaginative. I’m sure that if one wanted to portray Trump or Orban as being in Putin’s pocket they could figure out some more clever way to do it, but the HomoPutin take is just lazy.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Barbarossa


    What is up with the deep and wide genre of “HomoPutin” jokes and memes?
     

    They just seem unfunny and deeply unimaginative.
     
    The funny thing is that the same people claim that Putin has a younger lover and even children with that lover and that he is a homo. The people pushing this BS are too dumb to even see the contradiction between these fairy tales. Tells you all you need to know about them.
    , @Mr. Hack
    @Barbarossa

    It may be a bit of laziness on my part, but I feel that political cartoons encapsulate a lot of easily digestible information that can make incredibly poignant points. These cartoons can be incredibly clever and deserve reposting, IMHO, and this blog is after all one that covers much of world politics. Hopefully, one poor cartoon doesn't detract from the many other brilliant ones that I've posted here. If you don't like a particular cartoon, by all means feel free to express an opinion that challenges the inherent message of the cartoon. At the very least, I will hopefully have spurred on some interesting commentary regarding it. Is it my fault that the "TeamHomoLeftists" are very good at creating clever political cartoons? Nobody is stopping "TeamHomoRightists" from doing the same? Two time Pulitzer prize winner Michael Ramirez has this to say about his craft:


    “I am a big believer in editorial cartooning as serious journalism,” Ramirez said. “Editorial cartooning must be more than humorous anecdotes about current events. It should be the catalyst for thought.

     

    One of my favorite right leaning cartoonists is A.F. Branco, whose hard-hitting humor makes liberal politician cringe in fear. Here's one that celebrates the Thanksgiving season, that you're bound to like:

    https://cdn.creators.com/1054/337896/337896_image.jpg
  638. @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader


    as I understand it a territory that is quite clearly Ukrainian in sentiment
     
    Now I know where this and many of your previous statements come from. Tägliche Nachrichten shows that in terms of lying Deutsche Welle beats even CNN (not a mean feat). My condolences.

    Replies: @Beckow, @German_reader

    I don’t watch Deutsche Welle, or any other German mainstream media.
    Do you have evidence that Zaporizhzhia is clearly pro-Russian? Or do I just have to take your word for it, or believe in that ridiculous pseudo-referendum?

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader


    I don’t watch Deutsche Welle, or any other German mainstream media.
     
    That’s wise.

    Do you have evidence that Zaporizhzhia is clearly pro-Russian?
     
    As I don’t trust propaganda from either side and don’t personally know people living in that area (in contrast to Donbass), I have no opinion one way or another. I know that Ukie propaganda is 99+% lies, whereas Russian propaganda is maybe 50% lies and omissions. But, scientifically speaking, this knowledge does not have predictive value. It only shows how much each side needs to lie to push its narrative.

    Replies: @German_reader

    , @LondonBob
    @German_reader

    Melitopol is pro Russian. Even Reuters admitted as much a few months ago.



    https://twitter.com/johnnyjmils/status/1595745426287874056?s=20&t=vEnUq7bJw1SIIj0AAwa5ww

    Replies: @AP

  639. @Mikel
    @AP


    Are Russians as competent as the Germans were?
     
    No. But in the end they defeated the very competent Germans nonetheless. Dismiss the people who put the first man in orbit and built the Tsar Bomba at your own peril.

    Replies: @AP

    The Russians didn’t defeat the Germans. The USSR did. So Russians plus 90% of Ukrainians plus Central Asians.

    Russia is not the USSR. It is not the Russian Empire. It is just – Russia. A country that was defeated by a motivated and unified Poland (lavishly supported by the West – sound familiar?) in 1921. A country that regularly lost wars to Poland-Lithuania until the latter splintered in a civil war.

    • Agree: Sher Singh
    • LOL: Mikhail
    • Replies: @Mikel
    @AP


    The Russians didn’t defeat the Germans. The USSR did. So Russians plus 90% of Ukrainians plus Central Asians.
     
    Would the Russians have been unable to put a man in orbit and build the Tsar Bomba without the help of Ukrainians and Central Asians?

    Replies: @AP

  640. German_reader says:
    @AP
    @German_reader


    Sure, it’s Poland’s interest (and that of other EU countries as well) that Ukraine doesn’t become a Russian satellite state, with Russian troops or security services being stationed close to the Polish border. However, there’s also another, possibly quite existential interest for Poland: not to become a direct participant, and theatre, in this war
     
    Correct. It is in Poland’s best interest for Russia to fail to conquer Ukraine, and it is in Poland’s best interest not to be a direct participant. It would get tricky if direct participation were to become necessary in order to prevent a Russian conquest of Ukraine, however. This has not been the case, fortunately. But Poland is rightly doing all it can to enable Ukraine to fight on its own.

    A Pole told me

    I’m sure there are Poles who believe such things, but it still doesn’t make any sense
     
    Why do you think it wouldn’t make sense for Russia to want a Ukrainian missile to hit Polish territory? And since it does, to deliberately make this more likely by firing close to Polish territory?

    “Orban is willing to play that role”

    And you base that on what? Do you seriously believe Hungary has any territorial designs on Ukraine that would cause them to take part in Ukraine’s dismemberment
     
    If given the chance, Orban would absolutely take a chunk of Ukraine populated by ethnic Hungarians. His government has given passports to ethnic Hungarians in Ukraine against the wishes of Ukraine (same thing that Russia did for people in Donbas) and it is no coincidence that his is the most Russia-friendly country in Europe regarding Ukraine, including criticising the provision of weapons for Ukraine to defend itself. Of course, little Hungary on its own can’t do anything, particularly since Ukraine has not collapsed. But I have no doubt that if Russian soldiers made it to the Carpathians, Hungary would try to secure the other side of those mountains. The scarf scandal is just a slip-up.

    Here is a Hungarian politician tweeting about wanting a common border with Poland again:



    https://twitter.com/cyberspec1/status/1591565297647235072?s=46&t=8vJ3fXvCYXQIjck4dVFPRg

    Replies: @German_reader

    Why do you think it wouldn’t make sense for Russia to want a Ukrainian missile to hit Polish territory?

    What would Russia gain from it? As the missile incident showed, people are likely to blame Russia in any case, so this would make it only more likely that more advanced weapons systems will be sent to Ukraine.

    But I have no doubt that if Russian soldiers made it to the Carpathians, Hungary would try to secure the other side of those mountains.

    imo that’s paranoid, I think Orban is too realistic for that.
    Too bad reiner tor isn’t here anymore, he could add a lot to this discussion.

  641. @German_reader
    @AnonfromTN

    I don't watch Deutsche Welle, or any other German mainstream media.
    Do you have evidence that Zaporizhzhia is clearly pro-Russian? Or do I just have to take your word for it, or believe in that ridiculous pseudo-referendum?

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @LondonBob

    I don’t watch Deutsche Welle, or any other German mainstream media.

    That’s wise.

    Do you have evidence that Zaporizhzhia is clearly pro-Russian?

    As I don’t trust propaganda from either side and don’t personally know people living in that area (in contrast to Donbass), I have no opinion one way or another. I know that Ukie propaganda is 99+% lies, whereas Russian propaganda is maybe 50% lies and omissions. But, scientifically speaking, this knowledge does not have predictive value. It only shows how much each side needs to lie to push its narrative.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @AnonfromTN


    As I don’t trust propaganda from either side and don’t personally know people living in that area (in contrast to Donbass), I have no opinion one way or another.
     
    Why the hell then do you automatically dismiss the idea that most (though perhaps not all) people in Zaporizhzhia don't want to be part of Russia? iirc even Karlin once essentially admitted as much (though of course he hoped for "re-educating" the people there).
    I freely admit that I'm not familiar with all the ethnographic realities on the ground, as you write it's very difficult to form a clear impression from Western media which are certainly pushing a selective agenda. But that doesn't mean the opposite of their claims is true in all cases.

    Replies: @A123, @Beckow

  642. German_reader says:
    @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader


    I don’t watch Deutsche Welle, or any other German mainstream media.
     
    That’s wise.

    Do you have evidence that Zaporizhzhia is clearly pro-Russian?
     
    As I don’t trust propaganda from either side and don’t personally know people living in that area (in contrast to Donbass), I have no opinion one way or another. I know that Ukie propaganda is 99+% lies, whereas Russian propaganda is maybe 50% lies and omissions. But, scientifically speaking, this knowledge does not have predictive value. It only shows how much each side needs to lie to push its narrative.

    Replies: @German_reader

    As I don’t trust propaganda from either side and don’t personally know people living in that area (in contrast to Donbass), I have no opinion one way or another.

    Why the hell then do you automatically dismiss the idea that most (though perhaps not all) people in Zaporizhzhia don’t want to be part of Russia? iirc even Karlin once essentially admitted as much (though of course he hoped for “re-educating” the people there).
    I freely admit that I’m not familiar with all the ethnographic realities on the ground, as you write it’s very difficult to form a clear impression from Western media which are certainly pushing a selective agenda. But that doesn’t mean the opposite of their claims is true in all cases.

    • Replies: @A123
    @German_reader

    Why do both sides believe that Zaporizhzhia Oblast and Kherson Oblast are uniform?

    It is not hard to consider solutions that divides Kherson Oblast using the Dnieper. A division of Zaporizhzhia Oblast does not have such an obvious geographic feature, but a North/South split is quite plausible.

    If people know what the final lines will be, then moving to "their" side is practical for a portion of the population.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @LondonBob

    , @Beckow
    @German_reader

    You can't determine people's preferences in time of war. Most want peace and to survive. They change their minds and most will go with the winner. If being annexed by Poland, Belarus, Hungary or Turkey would bring immediate peace you could probably find a majority supporting it.

    Replies: @sudden death

  643. @Barbarossa
    @Mr. Hack

    What is up with the deep and wide genre of "HomoPutin" jokes and memes? It doesn't really make any sense and is equally strange for being generally made by people that are on #TeamHomoLeftists.

    They just seem unfunny and deeply unimaginative. I'm sure that if one wanted to portray Trump or Orban as being in Putin's pocket they could figure out some more clever way to do it, but the HomoPutin take is just lazy.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Mr. Hack

    What is up with the deep and wide genre of “HomoPutin” jokes and memes?

    They just seem unfunny and deeply unimaginative.

    The funny thing is that the same people claim that Putin has a younger lover and even children with that lover and that he is a homo. The people pushing this BS are too dumb to even see the contradiction between these fairy tales. Tells you all you need to know about them.

  644. @Mr. Hack
    @Beckow

    Why, do you feel that Putler somehow hasn't used the Nazi boogeyman as one of his primary reasons for starting this war (er, "military operation" for dimwits like you). :-)

    Replies: @Beckow

    In a war everybody uses what they can. Russian rhetoric about ‘Nazis in Ukraine‘ is overstated, but it is based on more reality than you admit and compared to West-Ukie demonization of everything Russian (“Mongol hordes!“) it is mild. Your ‘cartoon‘ was retarded, think about it before you descend into primitivism.

    And I have always called it a war…it is a war.

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @Beckow


    And I have always called it a war…it is a war.
     
    You could be thrown in the slammer for many years for stating something like this within Russia. Seriously. :-(

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  645. @German_reader
    @AnonfromTN


    As I don’t trust propaganda from either side and don’t personally know people living in that area (in contrast to Donbass), I have no opinion one way or another.
     
    Why the hell then do you automatically dismiss the idea that most (though perhaps not all) people in Zaporizhzhia don't want to be part of Russia? iirc even Karlin once essentially admitted as much (though of course he hoped for "re-educating" the people there).
    I freely admit that I'm not familiar with all the ethnographic realities on the ground, as you write it's very difficult to form a clear impression from Western media which are certainly pushing a selective agenda. But that doesn't mean the opposite of their claims is true in all cases.

    Replies: @A123, @Beckow

    Why do both sides believe that Zaporizhzhia Oblast and Kherson Oblast are uniform?

    It is not hard to consider solutions that divides Kherson Oblast using the Dnieper. A division of Zaporizhzhia Oblast does not have such an obvious geographic feature, but a North/South split is quite plausible.

    If people know what the final lines will be, then moving to “their” side is practical for a portion of the population.

    PEACE 😇

    • Disagree: German_reader
    • Replies: @LondonBob
    @A123

    Partition is sensible, there will inevitably be some people moving from one to the other, in the Reuters piece on Melitopol there was a woman who moved from Western Ukraine to liberated Melitopol. Homogenous ethno-states work best.

  646. @A123
    @AP


    My point is that if Russia ends the war with more than it had when it started and Ukraine with less, then Russia will have been rewarded for its aggression. Even if the result is a “Pyrrhic” victory.
     
    Your proposed approach for Ukie-stan sounds much like the Pali tradition of insincere "negotiations". That strategy has failed for 70+ years. Is that really the fate you want for the region? Generations of turmoil?
    ___

    Why should Putin not set conditions based on an equally logical argument dating back to events in 2014 (and earlier).

    The Kiev regime brutally killed in Donbass and elsewhere. They also engaged in collective punishment targeting Russian citizens in Crimea. Clearly Ukraine must not be rewarded for its aggression by keeping everything it had after 8 years of misbehavior. Even if the result is a "Pyrrhic” victory for Kiev.
    ____

    In the real world, a deal means that neither side will get everything they want.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @AP

    Are you working on your pro-Islamic pivot?

    [MORE]

    • LOL: A123
  647. @German_reader
    @AnonfromTN


    As I don’t trust propaganda from either side and don’t personally know people living in that area (in contrast to Donbass), I have no opinion one way or another.
     
    Why the hell then do you automatically dismiss the idea that most (though perhaps not all) people in Zaporizhzhia don't want to be part of Russia? iirc even Karlin once essentially admitted as much (though of course he hoped for "re-educating" the people there).
    I freely admit that I'm not familiar with all the ethnographic realities on the ground, as you write it's very difficult to form a clear impression from Western media which are certainly pushing a selective agenda. But that doesn't mean the opposite of their claims is true in all cases.

    Replies: @A123, @Beckow

    You can’t determine people’s preferences in time of war. Most want peace and to survive. They change their minds and most will go with the winner. If being annexed by Poland, Belarus, Hungary or Turkey would bring immediate peace you could probably find a majority supporting it.

    • Replies: @sudden death
    @Beckow

    Unless you're a Jew in EE during WWII, the worst immediate possible option for simple more or less apolitical civilians during wars is protracted battles all over the same places, when everything turns into rubble. So far by this criteria pro-RF is overall worse choise in UA, even when considering those quickly captured places at the end of February, but since then they're not able to capture almost anything without destroying it first.

  648. @Barbarossa
    @silviosilver


    Oh, and you are also a muslim, obviously on George Islamo-Soros’s payroll
     
    A123 is going to sue for infringement of intellectual property!

    On second thought, I think that would only apply if you had called him a George Islamo-Homo-Soros Muslim.

    Dang, maybe I'm confused on that since IslamoHomoSoros sounds like a dinosaur's name. I can see the memes already...

    Replies: @A123, @silviosilver

    IslamoHomoSoros sounds like a dinosaur’s name. I can see the memes already…

    ROTFL

    Is Silvio going for IslamoGloboHomoEuroSoros?

    Congratulations….. That is so tangled, I will not go that far…..

    It would be the most confused dino of all time. Cause of extinction = Shunned by all cis-dinosaurs, was unable to reproduce.

    #LetsGoBrandon 😇

    • Replies: @Barbarossa
    @A123

    You do have to wonder what happened to those poor dinosaurs? Are we sure it was an ice age or giant meteor?
    If a T-Rex is dug up with a name-tag stating it's pronouns we'll know for sure.

    Replies: @A123

  649. @Barbarossa
    @Mr. Hack

    What is up with the deep and wide genre of "HomoPutin" jokes and memes? It doesn't really make any sense and is equally strange for being generally made by people that are on #TeamHomoLeftists.

    They just seem unfunny and deeply unimaginative. I'm sure that if one wanted to portray Trump or Orban as being in Putin's pocket they could figure out some more clever way to do it, but the HomoPutin take is just lazy.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Mr. Hack

    It may be a bit of laziness on my part, but I feel that political cartoons encapsulate a lot of easily digestible information that can make incredibly poignant points. These cartoons can be incredibly clever and deserve reposting, IMHO, and this blog is after all one that covers much of world politics. Hopefully, one poor cartoon doesn’t detract from the many other brilliant ones that I’ve posted here. If you don’t like a particular cartoon, by all means feel free to express an opinion that challenges the inherent message of the cartoon. At the very least, I will hopefully have spurred on some interesting commentary regarding it. Is it my fault that the “TeamHomoLeftists” are very good at creating clever political cartoons? Nobody is stopping “TeamHomoRightists” from doing the same? Two time Pulitzer prize winner Michael Ramirez has this to say about his craft:

    “I am a big believer in editorial cartooning as serious journalism,” Ramirez said. “Editorial cartooning must be more than humorous anecdotes about current events. It should be the catalyst for thought.

    One of my favorite right leaning cartoonists is A.F. Branco, whose hard-hitting humor makes liberal politician cringe in fear. Here’s one that celebrates the Thanksgiving season, that you’re bound to like:

  650. @Beckow
    @Mr. Hack

    In a war everybody uses what they can. Russian rhetoric about 'Nazis in Ukraine' is overstated, but it is based on more reality than you admit and compared to West-Ukie demonization of everything Russian ("Mongol hordes!") it is mild. Your 'cartoon' was retarded, think about it before you descend into primitivism.

    And I have always called it a war...it is a war.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    And I have always called it a war…it is a war.

    You could be thrown in the slammer for many years for stating something like this within Russia. Seriously. 🙁

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Mr. Hack


    You could be thrown in the slammer for many years for stating something like this within Russia. Seriously
     
    Says a person who last time was in Russia - never.

    Replies: @Mikhail, @Mr. Hack

  651. @Mr. Hack
    @Beckow


    And I have always called it a war…it is a war.
     
    You could be thrown in the slammer for many years for stating something like this within Russia. Seriously. :-(

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    You could be thrown in the slammer for many years for stating something like this within Russia. Seriously

    Says a person who last time was in Russia – never.

    • Replies: @Mikhail
    @AnonfromTN

    As you know, in Kiev regime controlled Ukraine, one can be jailed, beaten or killed for any perceived expression of pro-Russian sentiment, contrasted from how Nazis and neo-Nazis have greater freedom there.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    , @Mr. Hack
    @AnonfromTN

    I've been to Moscow only once in my lifetime, during a stopover to Ukraine. It's changed a lot over the years, and I've always wanted to visit it again for a longer stay. Not anymore. I can figure out what's going on within Russia without having to travel and be there:


    Russia’s national parliament, the Duma, passed a new law Friday that will make it a criminal act to call the war in Ukraine a war...The new legislation envisions penalties of up to 15 years in prison for the distribution of “false news” about military operations in Ukraine, which the Russian military invaded Feb. 24. “False news” is described as anything not officially approved by Moscow...Russia’s media regulator Roskomnadzor has issued strict guidelines over coverage of Ukraine and the Russian military, ordering media across the country to only publish information provided by official sources. It is forbidden, for example, to describe the attacks on Ukraine as an “invasion” or a “war”; instead, they must be called a “special military operation.”
     
    https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/politics-news/russia-censorship-law-duma-ukraine-dozhd-1235104216/

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  652. …could be thrown in the slammer in Russia

    I doubt that, it is another myth. I know enough Russian and on their TV people call it a ‘war’ all the time and discuss it openly. You believe in a very distorted, heavily propagandized version of Russia fed to you for decades by the US propaganda. They have huge problems, but the caricatures in your mind are silly. Actually quite stupid.

  653. @Barbarossa
    @silviosilver


    Oh, and you are also a muslim, obviously on George Islamo-Soros’s payroll
     
    A123 is going to sue for infringement of intellectual property!

    On second thought, I think that would only apply if you had called him a George Islamo-Homo-Soros Muslim.

    Dang, maybe I'm confused on that since IslamoHomoSoros sounds like a dinosaur's name. I can see the memes already...

    Replies: @A123, @silviosilver

    A123 is going to sue for infringement of intellectual property!

    Cripes, I had not thought of that. Reading your post, I feared I may be forced to swallow my pride and pour on all the charm I can muster. (“Heeyy, A123, buddy, pal, chum!! How goes it, my fellow judeo-christian? We are a couple of battle-hardened keyboard warriors, are we not? Here’s to old times!”) Say what you will about him, but I have come to respect his ability to snare the unwary with his eccentricities, only to lay the smack down over pesky, overlooked details. It appears my concerns were unwarranted, as he is in a kindly mood. I shall consider it a lesson learned, however.

    • LOL: A123, songbird, Barbarossa
  654. German_reader says:

    I just watched an interview with colonel Markus Reisner from the Austrian army about the situation in Ukraine. Pretty bleak assessment by him (for Ukraine), he’s essentially saying that on current trends Russia is winning the war of attrition. Stocks of arms in Europe are already largely depleted, there would have to be an urgent re-armament programme to send more in a race against time, but there’s political paralysis and no clear idea how to proceed (no determined attempt at a diplomatic solution, but also no coordinated effort for long-term arms supplies to Ukraine, maybe the worst of all worlds).
    Whatever one thinks about the war and its course, it’s certainly once again shown the weakness and incompetence of European political leaders.

  655. @A123
    @Matra


    Leaving aside the crass politicization of sports which has put me off all of them there’s the problem of changing broadcast rights requiring either a cable/satellite TV package or different paid apps for each league.
     
    You can enjoy 100% of U.S. IMSA competition for free with no package -- Those in countries with no broadcast deal can find a live feed.

    https://www.imsa.com/tvlive/

    In the U.S., Canada, and other countries with live deals the replays are available here (usually only 3 days after the event):

    https://www.youtube.com/c/imsaofficial/videos

    Watching sports is something we can all do a lot less of, sticking to more productive activities like arguing on Unz.
     
    Watching the Rolex 24 Hours of Daytona can be done in parallel with posting on Unz. Its a twofer.

    Right now I am catching up on some European racing that I missed some months ago:

    https://www.youtube.com/user/gt1world

    PEACE 😇

     
    https://cdn.lsr-freun.de/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/magz225-768x266.jpg

    Replies: @showmethereal

    24 hour Nurburgring is the most exciting – lol. LeMans had been neutered in the name of environmentalism and cutting costs. But Le Mans used to be in the top 2 also

    • Replies: @A123
    @showmethereal


    24 hour Nurburgring is the most exciting – lol.
     
    Also available as a full replay.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Areco0Nw2Mo

    LeMans had been neutered in the name of environmentalism and cutting costs. But Le Mans used to be in the top 2 also
     
    The full Le Mans circuit does not get much use, so cost/safety is a business necessity. The new change to HyperCar is largely driven by the need to slow the top class by 15-20 mph. There is simply not enough money to bring all 8+ miles of track up to standards with the speeds prototypes can achieve.

    The most powerful cars allowed at the full Nordschleife in large competitions (such as the 24 hr) are GT3. You might find some historics that could be faster, but owners do not want to risk destroying them.

    Spa went too far with asphalt run off and put some gravel traps back in.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @showmethereal

  656. @AnonfromTN
    @Mr. Hack


    You could be thrown in the slammer for many years for stating something like this within Russia. Seriously
     
    Says a person who last time was in Russia - never.

    Replies: @Mikhail, @Mr. Hack

    As you know, in Kiev regime controlled Ukraine, one can be jailed, beaten or killed for any perceived expression of pro-Russian sentiment, contrasted from how Nazis and neo-Nazis have greater freedom there.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Mikhail


    in Kiev regime controlled Ukraine, one can be jailed, beaten or killed for any perceived expression of pro-Russian sentiment
     
    Current Kiev regime is brutally oppressive. At the level of Haiti under Duvalier. But its puppeteers studiously avoid seeing obvious things. Especially things that contradict their narrative.

    Replies: @AP

  657. @LatW
    @showmethereal

    I understand what you mean about 3rd parties, it's a problematic issue (even if inevitable in many cases). In that regard, I understand very well where Hu Xijin from Global Times is coming from (he is just being protective of his nation). Remember that other nations feel that way, too. It's partly the fault of E.Europeans that they did not provide enough information to China. Even if you are going to stay on Russia's side, you would still have better information.

    Replies: @showmethereal

    Well I can respect your comment then…. But please clarify the “better information” from Eastern Europe would be (I assume the context you mean is Ukraine/Russia)?

    • Replies: @LatW
    @showmethereal


    But please clarify the “better information” from Eastern Europe would be (I assume the context you mean is Ukraine/Russia)?
     
    Without generalizing and just purely based on Global Times, it is obvious there are some informational gaps there and a lot of sweeping statements. It's understandable because most Chinese probably don't have time or interest to delve into it but when you have such a broad sweeping approach you risk running into surprises later (or simply not have accurate information).


    For example, I saw you mentioning Lviv. It has turned into an idiotic meme that even intelligent people seem to parrot (surprisingly, even after 8 years of war with plenty of information available) because it is convenient. It has very little to do with reality on the ground. The ease with which you threw that out made me think of how I would not want to voice similarly stereotypical (and wrong) statements about your country or culture. But as I said, the onus is on the Ukrainians (and their friends) to inform the Chinese about this.

    Replies: @showmethereal

  658. @AnonfromTN
    @Mr. Hack


    You could be thrown in the slammer for many years for stating something like this within Russia. Seriously
     
    Says a person who last time was in Russia - never.

    Replies: @Mikhail, @Mr. Hack

    I’ve been to Moscow only once in my lifetime, during a stopover to Ukraine. It’s changed a lot over the years, and I’ve always wanted to visit it again for a longer stay. Not anymore. I can figure out what’s going on within Russia without having to travel and be there:

    Russia’s national parliament, the Duma, passed a new law Friday that will make it a criminal act to call the war in Ukraine a war…The new legislation envisions penalties of up to 15 years in prison for the distribution of “false news” about military operations in Ukraine, which the Russian military invaded Feb. 24. “False news” is described as anything not officially approved by Moscow…Russia’s media regulator Roskomnadzor has issued strict guidelines over coverage of Ukraine and the Russian military, ordering media across the country to only publish information provided by official sources. It is forbidden, for example, to describe the attacks on Ukraine as an “invasion” or a “war”; instead, they must be called a “special military operation.”

    https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/politics-news/russia-censorship-law-duma-ukraine-dozhd-1235104216/

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Mr. Hack


    I’ve been to Moscow only once in my lifetime, during a stopover to Ukraine
     
    Seeing an airport tells you a lot about the country. LOL.

    I can figure out what’s going on within Russia without having to travel and be there:
     
    Sure. Hollywood reporter is a very reliable source. About as truthful as Hollywood movies.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

  659. @Mikhail
    @AnonfromTN

    As you know, in Kiev regime controlled Ukraine, one can be jailed, beaten or killed for any perceived expression of pro-Russian sentiment, contrasted from how Nazis and neo-Nazis have greater freedom there.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    in Kiev regime controlled Ukraine, one can be jailed, beaten or killed for any perceived expression of pro-Russian sentiment

    Current Kiev regime is brutally oppressive. At the level of Haiti under Duvalier. But its puppeteers studiously avoid seeing obvious things. Especially things that contradict their narrative.

    • Replies: @AP
    @AnonfromTN

    This nonsense is the mirror image of nonsense written about Russia.

  660. @Beckow
    @German_reader

    You can't determine people's preferences in time of war. Most want peace and to survive. They change their minds and most will go with the winner. If being annexed by Poland, Belarus, Hungary or Turkey would bring immediate peace you could probably find a majority supporting it.

    Replies: @sudden death

    Unless you’re a Jew in EE during WWII, the worst immediate possible option for simple more or less apolitical civilians during wars is protracted battles all over the same places, when everything turns into rubble. So far by this criteria pro-RF is overall worse choise in UA, even when considering those quickly captured places at the end of February, but since then they’re not able to capture almost anything without destroying it first.

  661. @Yahya
    @showmethereal

    You are a CCP shill. No point in "debating" with you.

    Replies: @showmethereal

    Typical of people who can’t defend their points to use (insert whoever) “shill” accusations. I stated facts while you repeated the western narrative. Seems you expect China to let North Korea economically collapse. North Korea is more educated and has a larger population than Cuba. Has Cuba collapsed? Whose “fault” is that????

    I will leave you with two more points. The current Kim had his brother assassinated at that airport in Malaysia. Do you know why? His brother was living for years under protection in China. Kim feared China and South Korea were plotting together to have him be the new leader. So once he left China – he had him killed. And you are going to sit here and claim China is able to control North Korea? It’s absolutely nonsense western narrative.

    And for the record – when the Korean War happened China had no nukes. It went toe to toe with the US only a few years after the US dropped atomic bombs on Japan. Having enemies at the gate is no light thing. That is why China understands why Russia is standing up against NATO expansion. When China helped North Vietnam it had nukes (which it developed because the U.S. threatened it during the Korean War). If you claim China controls North Korea then they could have given Vietnam nukes and done the same thing you claim it did with Korea. But no China didn’t control Vietnam either… so they ended up fighting a few years later because China was mad Vietnam invaded Cambodia. Facts…. No shilling.

    If I was a shill I would claim China is going to win the 2030 World Cup. But I have sense. Unlike the guy who interjected before when I said East Asian do not have the genetics to dominate in football physically. He called me names like you. But he ran away now that Japan lost to tiny Costa Rica and South Korea lost to Ghana (oh the horror for racial superiority proponents)

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @showmethereal


    If I was a shill I would claim China is going to win the 2030 World Cup. But I have sense. Unlike the guy who interjected before when I said East Asian do not have the genetics to dominate in football physically. He called me names like you.
     
    You’re right; I should not have called you a shill. But you do seem to have an emotional attachement towards China. That’s ok, everyone has their biases, but it would be preferable if you were to reveal your nationality (are you Chinese?) so that we are aware of potential national/ethnic bias. For me I have nothing against China per we, am even inclined to favor it as I admire its history and culture a great deal. I do hold a prejudice against the Chinese Communist Party though; so that may shape my thinking on the matter. My beef with the CCP is their oppression of Muslims in Xinjiang. I have read though Vogel’s biography of Deng Xiaoping and have come to admire him personally for his strategic and pragmatic thinking, stoic demeanor, sense of duty and willingness to change his mind when the circumstances call for it.

    Anyway, back to the topic of North Korea. I think you are setting up strawmen and misquoting me on the issue, so I will restate my position. I wasn’t saying China “controls” the Kim regime, I was saying they aided in their survival and have been propping them up, which I think is objectively true. It’s well-known among diplomatic circles that China covertly refuses to implement full and effective sanctions against North Korea for fear of a state collapse in that country and a reunification of a Korean Peninsula under an American-allied regime. My opinion is that China should let the North Korean regime collapse; it would lift the decades long suffering ordinary North Koreans have had to endure.

    I agree that China doesn’t control the Kim regime to the extent that some Western pundits seem to think. I’ll even add that in the past, the North Korean regime has previously approached the US and offered an alliance in an effort to reduce reliance on China and counter their hegemonic ambitions. So evidently North Korea and China are not as chummy as usually thought of in the West. But this doesn’t negate the key fact that China is the only major player on the scene that wishes to maintain the status quo rather than let the NK regime implode; and that despite the ostensible signing of UN agreements, they have maintained trade volumes at a level sufficient to ensure the survival of the Kim regime (only briefly dropping it a few years ago during a diplomatic spat between Xi and Kim).

    Replies: @showmethereal, @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

  662. @A123
    @Barbarossa


    IslamoHomoSoros sounds like a dinosaur’s name. I can see the memes already…
     
    ROTFL

    Is Silvio going for IslamoGloboHomoEuroSoros?

    Congratulations..... That is so tangled, I will not go that far.....

    It would be the most confused dino of all time. Cause of extinction = Shunned by all cis-dinosaurs, was unable to reproduce.

    #LetsGoBrandon 😇

    Replies: @Barbarossa

    You do have to wonder what happened to those poor dinosaurs? Are we sure it was an ice age or giant meteor?
    If a T-Rex is dug up with a name-tag stating it’s pronouns we’ll know for sure.

    • Replies: @A123
    @Barbarossa


    If a T-Rex is dug up with a name-tag stating it’s pronouns we’ll know for sure.
     
    So, the tranny-soros is they/them?

    PEACE 😇
  663. @showmethereal
    @A123

    24 hour Nurburgring is the most exciting - lol. LeMans had been neutered in the name of environmentalism and cutting costs. But Le Mans used to be in the top 2 also

    Replies: @A123

    24 hour Nurburgring is the most exciting – lol.

    Also available as a full replay.

    LeMans had been neutered in the name of environmentalism and cutting costs. But Le Mans used to be in the top 2 also

    The full Le Mans circuit does not get much use, so cost/safety is a business necessity. The new change to HyperCar is largely driven by the need to slow the top class by 15-20 mph. There is simply not enough money to bring all 8+ miles of track up to standards with the speeds prototypes can achieve.

    The most powerful cars allowed at the full Nordschleife in large competitions (such as the 24 hr) are GT3. You might find some historics that could be faster, but owners do not want to risk destroying them.

    Spa went too far with asphalt run off and put some gravel traps back in.

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @A123

    Yeah I like Spa too…. But not as much as the other two. But are you sure it was cost if the track? In fact the prototype manufacturers- Toyota - Audi - Porsche - Peugeot were spending big money until Le Mans neutered them. My guess is they could have found a way. But yeah Le Man is going to allow GT 3 in the same way other races do. So we might see some of the same competitors at the Nurburgring and Le Mans (if that story was correct).

  664. @Barbarossa
    @A123

    You do have to wonder what happened to those poor dinosaurs? Are we sure it was an ice age or giant meteor?
    If a T-Rex is dug up with a name-tag stating it's pronouns we'll know for sure.

    Replies: @A123

    If a T-Rex is dug up with a name-tag stating it’s pronouns we’ll know for sure.

    So, the tranny-soros is they/them?

    PEACE 😇

  665. @Mr. Hack
    @AnonfromTN

    I've been to Moscow only once in my lifetime, during a stopover to Ukraine. It's changed a lot over the years, and I've always wanted to visit it again for a longer stay. Not anymore. I can figure out what's going on within Russia without having to travel and be there:


    Russia’s national parliament, the Duma, passed a new law Friday that will make it a criminal act to call the war in Ukraine a war...The new legislation envisions penalties of up to 15 years in prison for the distribution of “false news” about military operations in Ukraine, which the Russian military invaded Feb. 24. “False news” is described as anything not officially approved by Moscow...Russia’s media regulator Roskomnadzor has issued strict guidelines over coverage of Ukraine and the Russian military, ordering media across the country to only publish information provided by official sources. It is forbidden, for example, to describe the attacks on Ukraine as an “invasion” or a “war”; instead, they must be called a “special military operation.”
     
    https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/politics-news/russia-censorship-law-duma-ukraine-dozhd-1235104216/

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    I’ve been to Moscow only once in my lifetime, during a stopover to Ukraine

    Seeing an airport tells you a lot about the country. LOL.

    I can figure out what’s going on within Russia without having to travel and be there:

    Sure. Hollywood reporter is a very reliable source. About as truthful as Hollywood movies.

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @AnonfromTN

    So, you're disputing that censorship has occurred in Russia due to the promulgation of the Russian 2022 Censorship laws (The Russian 2022 Laws Establishing War Censorship and Prohibiting Anti-War Statements and Calls for Sanction)? Go ahead, inform us on the heels of your recent trip there, how open and free the press is in Russia today? And while you're at it, please do explain why so many Russian reporters, journalists AND TV hosts have decided to leave Russia at this juncture?

    BTW, I did manage to take part in a tour of the Kremlin - does that count at all? I don't think that I saw you there anywhere, always on the lookout for kremlin stooges. :-)

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Beckow

  666. @AnonfromTN
    @Mr. Hack


    I’ve been to Moscow only once in my lifetime, during a stopover to Ukraine
     
    Seeing an airport tells you a lot about the country. LOL.

    I can figure out what’s going on within Russia without having to travel and be there:
     
    Sure. Hollywood reporter is a very reliable source. About as truthful as Hollywood movies.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    So, you’re disputing that censorship has occurred in Russia due to the promulgation of the Russian 2022 Censorship laws (The Russian 2022 Laws Establishing War Censorship and Prohibiting Anti-War Statements and Calls for Sanction)? Go ahead, inform us on the heels of your recent trip there, how open and free the press is in Russia today? And while you’re at it, please do explain why so many Russian reporters, journalists AND TV hosts have decided to leave Russia at this juncture?

    BTW, I did manage to take part in a tour of the Kremlin – does that count at all? I don’t think that I saw you there anywhere, always on the lookout for kremlin stooges. 🙂

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Mr. Hack

    I must congratulate the US propaganda on remarkably successful brainwashing of at least some people. To the point that they don’t see even glaring contradictions. You just stated that, according to some Hollywood rag, you can be jailed in Russia for using the term “war”. Within minutes you claim that there is a law that uses this (prohibited, according to your source) term twice in its name. What gives?

    As to the recent law, it prohibits spreading the info that can be used by the enemy: troop and hardware locations and other military-related things.


    how open and free the press is in Russia today
     
    I do not watch TV or read newspapers in any country. The people I talked to in Russia were never afraid to say anything, be their positions pro- or anti-government. When my mother was alive, I saw snippets of Russian TV that she watched (gave her TV set away to a charity later). I can compare those to snippets of the US TV I saw at that time (can’t avoid it at the airports and in hotel lobbies). Russian TV was immeasurably more pluralistic in terms of the views aired than the US TV. Heck, even Soviet TV was more pluralistic than the US TV today.

    please do explain why so many Russian reporters, journalists AND TV hosts have decided to leave Russia at this juncture?
     
    Again, you don’t even see a glaring contradiction. You just claimed that there is total censorship in Russia. Now you are saying that lots of reporters, journalists and TV hosts in Russia held anti-government positions yet were allowed to be reporters, journalists and TV hosts. Which is true, then?

    In fact, a small percentage of the total left. Being a biologist, I prefer biological explanations. Here is one. At least 5% of your weight is shit. When it leaves your body, this cannot be considered a loss even by your worst enemies.

    Replies: @Beckow, @Mr. Hack

    , @Beckow
    @Mr. Hack

    Hollywood Reporter described the law in an evasive, lying way: they took pieces that may (or not) be in the law and elaborated with very loaded words. That's how you do propaganda for stupid people.

    They mix up different things, some are criminal, e.g. falsely disclosing military situation that impacts morale - and many Euro countries have the same or more drastic laws, US manages it with tight media control.

    Describing the war as war is not a crime and nobody will be prosecuted for it - unless it is added to other things that the Hollywood Reporter chooses to omit. All laws have pompous statements that are not enforceable and not meant to be enforced. But you are free to believe whatever they feed you.

    You are embarrassing yourself with gullible repetition of obvious propaganda.

    Replies: @showmethereal

  667. @Mr. Hack
    @AnonfromTN

    So, you're disputing that censorship has occurred in Russia due to the promulgation of the Russian 2022 Censorship laws (The Russian 2022 Laws Establishing War Censorship and Prohibiting Anti-War Statements and Calls for Sanction)? Go ahead, inform us on the heels of your recent trip there, how open and free the press is in Russia today? And while you're at it, please do explain why so many Russian reporters, journalists AND TV hosts have decided to leave Russia at this juncture?

    BTW, I did manage to take part in a tour of the Kremlin - does that count at all? I don't think that I saw you there anywhere, always on the lookout for kremlin stooges. :-)

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Beckow

    I must congratulate the US propaganda on remarkably successful brainwashing of at least some people. To the point that they don’t see even glaring contradictions. You just stated that, according to some Hollywood rag, you can be jailed in Russia for using the term “war”. Within minutes you claim that there is a law that uses this (prohibited, according to your source) term twice in its name. What gives?

    As to the recent law, it prohibits spreading the info that can be used by the enemy: troop and hardware locations and other military-related things.

    how open and free the press is in Russia today

    I do not watch TV or read newspapers in any country. The people I talked to in Russia were never afraid to say anything, be their positions pro- or anti-government. When my mother was alive, I saw snippets of Russian TV that she watched (gave her TV set away to a charity later). I can compare those to snippets of the US TV I saw at that time (can’t avoid it at the airports and in hotel lobbies). Russian TV was immeasurably more pluralistic in terms of the views aired than the US TV. Heck, even Soviet TV was more pluralistic than the US TV today.

    please do explain why so many Russian reporters, journalists AND TV hosts have decided to leave Russia at this juncture?

    Again, you don’t even see a glaring contradiction. You just claimed that there is total censorship in Russia. Now you are saying that lots of reporters, journalists and TV hosts in Russia held anti-government positions yet were allowed to be reporters, journalists and TV hosts. Which is true, then?

    In fact, a small percentage of the total left. Being a biologist, I prefer biological explanations. Here is one. At least 5% of your weight is shit. When it leaves your body, this cannot be considered a loss even by your worst enemies.

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @AnonfromTN

    It is hopeless. The thickness of layered propaganda that people like Mr.Hacks (and AP) absorbed is impossible to get through. They lack critical thinking so even obvious oxymorons are accepted as holy truth - the propaganda is too deep.

    When you tell them that many current discussions in the West are about as free as in later day Soviet times, they respond with "how about Gulag?" or with North Korea - the idiocy so profound that there is no cure.

    The basic principle about lies is that it takes two sides for a lie to exist: the liar and the willing audience. Mr.Hacks prefers to be lied to.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @AnonfromTN, @AP

    , @Mr. Hack
    @AnonfromTN


    You just stated that, according to some Hollywood rag, you can be jailed in Russia for using the term “war”. Within minutes you claim that there is a law that uses this (prohibited, according to your source) term twice in its name. What gives?
     
    You have a point here. I thought of this myself while reading the description. Perhaps, this is the best way to transcribe the name of the law from Russian to English?

    I do not watch TV or read newspapers in any country. The people I talked to in Russia were never afraid to say anything, be their positions pro- or anti-government.

     

    If this is so, then you're not qualified to make any pronouncements regarding "freedom of the press" issues. What personal friends or acquaintances utter to you in privacy has no bearing on this issue.

    At least 5% of your weight is shit. When it leaves your body, this cannot be considered a loss even by your worst enemies.
     
    And in your case, when just the opposite is true (I'll let you do the math and the proportions) what do your own enemies say? :-)

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  668. @Mr. Hack
    @AnonfromTN

    So, you're disputing that censorship has occurred in Russia due to the promulgation of the Russian 2022 Censorship laws (The Russian 2022 Laws Establishing War Censorship and Prohibiting Anti-War Statements and Calls for Sanction)? Go ahead, inform us on the heels of your recent trip there, how open and free the press is in Russia today? And while you're at it, please do explain why so many Russian reporters, journalists AND TV hosts have decided to leave Russia at this juncture?

    BTW, I did manage to take part in a tour of the Kremlin - does that count at all? I don't think that I saw you there anywhere, always on the lookout for kremlin stooges. :-)

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Beckow

    Hollywood Reporter described the law in an evasive, lying way: they took pieces that may (or not) be in the law and elaborated with very loaded words. That’s how you do propaganda for stupid people.

    They mix up different things, some are criminal, e.g. falsely disclosing military situation that impacts morale – and many Euro countries have the same or more drastic laws, US manages it with tight media control.

    Describing the war as war is not a crime and nobody will be prosecuted for it – unless it is added to other things that the Hollywood Reporter chooses to omit. All laws have pompous statements that are not enforceable and not meant to be enforced. But you are free to believe whatever they feed you.

    You are embarrassing yourself with gullible repetition of obvious propaganda.

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @Beckow

    Give credit where credit is due. Western psyops have spent billions studying human thought and behavior to propagandize the masses to great effect. One of the greatest tricks is the lie that they consume “free and fair” media

  669. @AnonfromTN
    @Mr. Hack

    I must congratulate the US propaganda on remarkably successful brainwashing of at least some people. To the point that they don’t see even glaring contradictions. You just stated that, according to some Hollywood rag, you can be jailed in Russia for using the term “war”. Within minutes you claim that there is a law that uses this (prohibited, according to your source) term twice in its name. What gives?

    As to the recent law, it prohibits spreading the info that can be used by the enemy: troop and hardware locations and other military-related things.


    how open and free the press is in Russia today
     
    I do not watch TV or read newspapers in any country. The people I talked to in Russia were never afraid to say anything, be their positions pro- or anti-government. When my mother was alive, I saw snippets of Russian TV that she watched (gave her TV set away to a charity later). I can compare those to snippets of the US TV I saw at that time (can’t avoid it at the airports and in hotel lobbies). Russian TV was immeasurably more pluralistic in terms of the views aired than the US TV. Heck, even Soviet TV was more pluralistic than the US TV today.

    please do explain why so many Russian reporters, journalists AND TV hosts have decided to leave Russia at this juncture?
     
    Again, you don’t even see a glaring contradiction. You just claimed that there is total censorship in Russia. Now you are saying that lots of reporters, journalists and TV hosts in Russia held anti-government positions yet were allowed to be reporters, journalists and TV hosts. Which is true, then?

    In fact, a small percentage of the total left. Being a biologist, I prefer biological explanations. Here is one. At least 5% of your weight is shit. When it leaves your body, this cannot be considered a loss even by your worst enemies.

    Replies: @Beckow, @Mr. Hack

    It is hopeless. The thickness of layered propaganda that people like Mr.Hacks (and AP) absorbed is impossible to get through. They lack critical thinking so even obvious oxymorons are accepted as holy truth – the propaganda is too deep.

    When you tell them that many current discussions in the West are about as free as in later day Soviet times, they respond with “how about Gulag?” or with North Korea – the idiocy so profound that there is no cure.

    The basic principle about lies is that it takes two sides for a lie to exist: the liar and the willing audience. Mr.Hacks prefers to be lied to.

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @Beckow


    The basic principle about lies is that it takes two sides for a lie to work: the liar and the willing audience.
     
    Kind of like the way that you and the good professor work together? :-)

    Replies: @AP

    , @AnonfromTN
    @Beckow


    It is hopeless
     
    I know. Nobody is as blind as someone who refuses to see. I am writing this for the people who think, not for the brain-dead consumers of propaganda.

    Replies: @A123

    , @AP
    @Beckow


    The thickness of layered propaganda that people like Mr.Hacks (and AP) absorbed is impossible to get through.
     
    This is you:

    https://i.imgur.com/IubQ1Rx.png
  670. @AnonfromTN
    @Mr. Hack

    I must congratulate the US propaganda on remarkably successful brainwashing of at least some people. To the point that they don’t see even glaring contradictions. You just stated that, according to some Hollywood rag, you can be jailed in Russia for using the term “war”. Within minutes you claim that there is a law that uses this (prohibited, according to your source) term twice in its name. What gives?

    As to the recent law, it prohibits spreading the info that can be used by the enemy: troop and hardware locations and other military-related things.


    how open and free the press is in Russia today
     
    I do not watch TV or read newspapers in any country. The people I talked to in Russia were never afraid to say anything, be their positions pro- or anti-government. When my mother was alive, I saw snippets of Russian TV that she watched (gave her TV set away to a charity later). I can compare those to snippets of the US TV I saw at that time (can’t avoid it at the airports and in hotel lobbies). Russian TV was immeasurably more pluralistic in terms of the views aired than the US TV. Heck, even Soviet TV was more pluralistic than the US TV today.

    please do explain why so many Russian reporters, journalists AND TV hosts have decided to leave Russia at this juncture?
     
    Again, you don’t even see a glaring contradiction. You just claimed that there is total censorship in Russia. Now you are saying that lots of reporters, journalists and TV hosts in Russia held anti-government positions yet were allowed to be reporters, journalists and TV hosts. Which is true, then?

    In fact, a small percentage of the total left. Being a biologist, I prefer biological explanations. Here is one. At least 5% of your weight is shit. When it leaves your body, this cannot be considered a loss even by your worst enemies.

    Replies: @Beckow, @Mr. Hack

    You just stated that, according to some Hollywood rag, you can be jailed in Russia for using the term “war”. Within minutes you claim that there is a law that uses this (prohibited, according to your source) term twice in its name. What gives?

    You have a point here. I thought of this myself while reading the description. Perhaps, this is the best way to transcribe the name of the law from Russian to English?

    I do not watch TV or read newspapers in any country. The people I talked to in Russia were never afraid to say anything, be their positions pro- or anti-government.

    If this is so, then you’re not qualified to make any pronouncements regarding “freedom of the press” issues. What personal friends or acquaintances utter to you in privacy has no bearing on this issue.

    At least 5% of your weight is shit. When it leaves your body, this cannot be considered a loss even by your worst enemies.

    And in your case, when just the opposite is true (I’ll let you do the math and the proportions) what do your own enemies say? 🙂

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Mr. Hack


    If this is so, then you’re not qualified to make any pronouncements regarding “freedom of the press” issues.
     
    In case you missed that, we live in the 21st century. I don’t need to read actual papers to know what’s in them. I can scan websites of “free press” to find out what’s there. Compared to NYT, WaPo, the Guardian, Daily Mail, and a lot of others, Soviet papers in the 1980s were paragons of truthfulness. Welcome to “1984” (or “Brave New World”, if you prefer). Behave yourself, Big Brother is watching you.
  671. @Beckow
    @AnonfromTN

    It is hopeless. The thickness of layered propaganda that people like Mr.Hacks (and AP) absorbed is impossible to get through. They lack critical thinking so even obvious oxymorons are accepted as holy truth - the propaganda is too deep.

    When you tell them that many current discussions in the West are about as free as in later day Soviet times, they respond with "how about Gulag?" or with North Korea - the idiocy so profound that there is no cure.

    The basic principle about lies is that it takes two sides for a lie to exist: the liar and the willing audience. Mr.Hacks prefers to be lied to.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @AnonfromTN, @AP

    The basic principle about lies is that it takes two sides for a lie to work: the liar and the willing audience.

    Kind of like the way that you and the good professor work together? 🙂

    • Replies: @AP
    @Mr. Hack

    Beckow is certainly an expert on lies and lying.

  672. @A123
    @Coconuts


    A dominant political belief in say France or Britain is that in an ideal world an individual’s hereditary national or ethnic identity should not shape and determine their lives in either positive or negative ways. People holding this view are rather against hereditary influences and inherited differences in wealth, power etc. between nations.
     
    Many of these traditions came from a time when travel was vastly more difficult. France did an excellent job making migrants French, regardless of their ethnicity, when they arrived in limited numbers from nearby lands or as pre assimilated successes from French colonies.

    The modern era failure is driven by a combination of both volume and quality.

    The number of people who can travel is much higher. Trying to make it to an island in an inexpensive rubber boat is a very new concept. Such boats did not 100 years ago. And, even if one made it to an island like Corsica, there would be no further transport to the mainland.

    Accepting Europeans and only a few hand picked from far away locations meant that France was dealing with individuals with high assimilation potential. Literacy was limited and 500 words of pidgin French would achieve lower class functionality. The barrier was higher in the middle and upper class, but still surmountable. Reading and writing passable French was an achievable aspiration.

    The modern era brings an over abundance of these with poor prospects for assimilation. It broke the model. The idea of "no-go" zones should be unthinkable. Indeed God may be levying a punishment. The first step towards redemption is sending those incapable of Judeo-Christian belief back to where they came. They can never be properly French.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @Coconuts

    Many of these traditions came from a time when travel was vastly more difficult. France did an excellent job making migrants French, regardless of their ethnicity, when they arrived in limited numbers from nearby lands or as pre assimilated successes from French colonies.

    This is true. I think there are a couple of additional points as well.

    The first is the declining fertility and white populations in France and the UK, when these ideas became current, I don’t think this issue was understood. Afaik people tended to assume the white population levels would stay fairly constant.

    The other is that some of the momentum behind these ideas comes from business interests that prioritise expanding their labour pool and access to markets, regardless of larger impacts (egalitarianism is not a motivating force). But policies like Brexit or restricting immigration would get in the way of this, so they weigh in against them by promoting things like CRT training among their work forces.

    • Replies: @A123
    @Coconuts


    The first is the declining fertility and white populations in France and the UK, when these ideas became current,
     
    White is (at best) only an indirect indicator for France. Many Persian and some Arab origin migrants are pigment equivalent to southern & periphery Europeans. Judeo-Christian is much more precise describing the issue. As a short hand, simply Christian is viable as Jews are a tiny population in France.
    __

    Declining Christian fertility & populations in France are a *result* of failed migration policy. Drivers for family formation and then children are:

    • Immediate financial means
    • Future career security
    • Belief that your children will have opportunities

    Low wage Great Replacement invasion by Jihadist anti-Christians (of all pigments), simultaneously devastated all three key drivers. Any attempt to fix the problem cannot be successful unless it is anchored in religion.
    ___

    Is there a separate, much less pressing, problem with Christian migration? Admittedly, Yes. Intra-EU Christian migration damages both "donor" and "recipient" European nations. In a perfect world, both issues could be tackled simultaneously. However, the EU is FAR from perfect.

    Ending the Muslim invasion is priority #1. It is an immediate and existential threat to Christendom .

    Muslims must be an OUTFLOW, decreasing demographic for Europe. Once that is locked in, more subtle issues surrounding intra-EU Christian migration can be addressed.

    PEACE 😇

  673. @AnonfromTN
    @Mikhail


    in Kiev regime controlled Ukraine, one can be jailed, beaten or killed for any perceived expression of pro-Russian sentiment
     
    Current Kiev regime is brutally oppressive. At the level of Haiti under Duvalier. But its puppeteers studiously avoid seeing obvious things. Especially things that contradict their narrative.

    Replies: @AP

    This nonsense is the mirror image of nonsense written about Russia.

  674. @Mr. Hack
    @Beckow


    The basic principle about lies is that it takes two sides for a lie to work: the liar and the willing audience.
     
    Kind of like the way that you and the good professor work together? :-)

    Replies: @AP

    Beckow is certainly an expert on lies and lying.

    • Agree: Mr. Hack
  675. @AP
    @Beckow


    Arestovych is a homo
     
    He's been married twice and has three children. You?

    Replies: @songbird

    He’s been married twice and has three children.

    Those are Eulenburg numbers, if he were in the same birth cohort.

    (But seriously, I have no idea who you are talking about.)

  676. @AP
    @Mikel

    The Russians didn’t defeat the Germans. The USSR did. So Russians plus 90% of Ukrainians plus Central Asians.

    Russia is not the USSR. It is not the Russian Empire. It is just - Russia. A country that was defeated by a motivated and unified Poland (lavishly supported by the West - sound familiar?) in 1921. A country that regularly lost wars to Poland-Lithuania until the latter splintered in a civil war.

    Replies: @Mikel

    The Russians didn’t defeat the Germans. The USSR did. So Russians plus 90% of Ukrainians plus Central Asians.

    Would the Russians have been unable to put a man in orbit and build the Tsar Bomba without the help of Ukrainians and Central Asians?

    • Replies: @AP
    @Mikel


    Would the Russians have been unable to put a man in orbit and build the Tsar Bomba without the help of Ukrainians and Central Asians?
     
    Well, the most important member of the Soviet space program was a Ukrainian guy born in Zhytomir (he was half-Ukrainian but his father left when he was three years old and he was raised by his Ukrainian mother and her family):

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sergei_Korolev



    Sergei Pavlovich Korolev[a] (Russian: Сергей Павлович Королёв, romanized: Sergey Pavlovich Korolyov, lit. 'sʲɪrˈɡʲej ˈpavləvʲɪtɕ kərɐˈlʲɵf'; Ukrainian: Сергій Павлович Корольов, romanized: Serhiy Pavlovych Korol'ov, lit. 'sɛrˈɦij ˈpavlovɪtʃ koroˈlʲou̯') 12 January 1907 [O.S. 30 December 1906] – 14 January 1966) was a lead Soviet rocket engineer and spacecraft designer during the Space Race between the United States and the Soviet Union in the 1950s and 1960s. He is regarded by many as the father of practical astronautics.[3][4] He was involved in the development of the R-7 Rocket, Sputnik 1, launching Laika, Sputnik 3, the first human-made object to make contact with another celestial body, Belka and Strelka, the first human being, Yuri Gagarin, into space, Voskhod 1, and the first person, Alexei Leonov, to conduct a spacewalk.[
  677. @showmethereal
    @Sher Singh

    What is the condition now? Do Sikhs want their own state. Is there potential for another “war”?

    Also how did so many get to Toronto? Is it for religious reasons they left India or just economic? I see loads of them when I go to Toronto. Especially in the Brampton area - there is a huge temple on a main road.

    Replies: @Sher Singh

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @Sher Singh

    What does that have to do with Sikhs in India and the Toronto area?

  678. @Mr. Hack
    @showmethereal


    Most the Ukrainian sources I see on the internet are junk.
     
    Which ones might those be? I want to make sure that I avoid reading them.

    And what are questioning about the difference of western Ukraine? I’m pretty sure by now you have heard of groups like the Right Sector – let alone the Azov.
     
    You're the one that first made the insinuation that "It’s just sad to me that western Ukraine would turn on their Slavic brethren like that." So you chose to pinpoint Western Ukraine as somehow being the disloyal Slavic brethren, turning on Russia, when, as we all know that it was first Russia that decided to forgo peaceful means with Ukraine and invaded to "chase Nazis"and other such nonsense, killing tens of thousands of Ukrainian civilians in the process.

    Replies: @showmethereal

    So you are completely ignoring the fact that ethnic Russians and those with Russian sympathies in eastern Ukraine were under literal bombardment since the 2014 coup?? Come on. Are you also claiming the psychopaths who set those people on fire in Odessa back then were “misunderstood” nationalists?? Or are you claiming all the videos were Russian propaganda??

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @showmethereal


    ...ignoring the fact that ethnic Russians and those with Russian sympathies in eastern Ukraine were under literal bombardment since the 2014 coup
     
    It is worse, Mr.Hack heartily approved of the bombing and killing. The idiotic point of view that says that a large ethnic group can be destroyed or expelled because they are "Russian" (the horror!) is the mainstream Kiev-West viewpoint. They dance around it, lie, talk about other things - aggression! - all in order not to face the obvious: what the post-Maidan Kiev did to its own Russian population was a crime by any objective standard.

    Their big fear is that once Kiev loses the war it will be discussed openly and they will look like who they are: genocidal maniacs who intentionally provoked a bloody war that they will end up losing. No wonder they worship Bandera (and probably Nazis in private).

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @showmethereal

    , @Philip Owen
    @showmethereal

    They were under bombardment in 2014 and 2015 during the Russian invasion. After that about a dozen people a year stepped on their own mines. You are locked into a propaganda narrative.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @showmethereal

  679. @silviosilver
    @Dmitry


    Just look at your own experiences.
     
    Of course I consulted my own experiences (who else's would I?), but perhaps I erred in extrapolating too far from them. You and I may just be very different people. But probably more similar than you think, since I also strongly feel that western liberal societies are the best that have ever existed and nothing else really comes close. I just wish it could all take place in a racially and culturally reasonable context - a thought you're apparently completely unwilling to entertain. (The world's big enough for all of us, so why not?)

    To address your point again, there are places we go to get away from people and places we go in order to be around them. Some places lend themselves to both purpose, like the beach. If you feel like being alone, an empty beach can be perfect. If you want to have some fun in the sun, a crowded beach can be just the ticket. Other places, it strikes me as bizarre that a group of friends would prefer to be there alone. "We went to the nightclub bro and we were the only ones there, it was so cool!!" I can't imagine anyone ever saying that. To me, some of the examples you use fall into (or closer to) this category.

    Alone in a museum? Not sure about that. I wouldn't want it so packed I had to wait forever to see any of the exhibits, but it would definitely feel 'warmer' if there were other people there besides my own group. (Unless we were kids and the objective was to run wild, lol.) Generally, I think the rule is if a place is obviously built to hold a large number of people but there are only a few there, it feels kinda sad. Individual mileage would vary quite considerably here.

    Most couples are not in love at lot of the time
     
    Yeah I know, that's why I specified a couple in love, hoping to imply that they are feeling pretty in love in that moment. Anyway, I'll stop nitpicking you if you stop nitpicking me. I'm starting to feel like AP responding to every little detail lol.

    Replies: @Dmitry

    bizarre that a group of friends would prefer to be there alone. “We went to the nightclub

    Maybe not if you go to the nightclub to meet women, but if you are with friends or colleagues, even then it is often more pleasant when it is mostly empty except your group. This is also the theme for “VIP” spaces in that industry.

    By the way, think about the experiences which are expensive. Why do wealthy people buy a yacht, instead of going with the Carnival Cruises?

    Yacht goes to the same places as Carnival Cruises, with less luxury, less options for food, less entertainment. Carnival Cruise ship has 50 difference restaurants, but it is full of other people. Yacht is less luxurious than any cruise ship, but it is without the other people.

    Yacht is a private space, which can go to an empty beach, which only has family and staff. Billionaire’s yatcht carries the comfortable level of a middle class suburban house to non-human natural spaces.

    It combines the comfortable world of civilization, with the empty world of our ancestors. For most of our history, except a very recent time, our world population was some thousands and our society was around 100 people. The problem in our ancestor’s time was the difficulty of nature, as Marx has written.

    But when the difficulty of nature is resolved (e.g. billionaire’s yacht), then of course the soul feels more comfortable to go to the empty spaces, than in the Carnival Cruise. It is without this recent, unnatural experience of large numbers of people.

    Most of our ancestors have never experienced a large number of people before around 80 generations in the past. But in tens of thousands of generations our ancestors were living with mostly empty and depopulated planet, seeing less people in all life, than modern people see every day.

    it would definitely feel ‘warmer’ if there were other people there besides my own group. (Unless we were kids and the objective was to run wild,

    I’ve been often in the museums when they are empty or almost empty. It’s definitely better if it is a museum with interesting objects, as you are alone with the objects, like they were in your house.

    If it was a bad museum, then you might not want it to be empty, but I’m not sure you enjoy it even with people, unless you are visiting an interesting country. It’s true when you are in vacation, even just people watching can become interesting.

    why I specified a couple in love, hoping to imply that they are feeling pretty in love in that moment

    Sure, but even a couple not in love, will be feeling a better mood in empty Venice, than Venice full of tourists.

    I’m not talking about “abandoned” in the sense that it is like post-apocalypse. Or “vacation to Vorkuta”. But I mean, when it is the same as normal civilization, but without all the people. This is just luxury.

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Dmitry


    This is also the theme for “VIP” spaces in that industry.
     
    The cachet of the VIP section results from its exclusivity, not its seclusion. If it were completely secluded it might still retain some of that cachet (as onlookers enviously wonder what lies behind that door and what it takes to get in), but it wouldn't be as fun, because occupants would not be able to bask in the envious gaze of those unable to gain access. So the VIP, even if more sparsely populated, indirectly relies on the presence of other people, and would lose its cachet almost completely if there were more people inside the VIP section than outside of it.

    By the way, think about the experiences which are expensive. Why do wealthy people buy a yacht, instead of going with the Carnival Cruises?
     
    I think I already covered this in my earlier reply: "there are places we go to get away from people and places we go in order to be around them." For those with the means to afford either, a yacht would fall into the former category, a cruise ship the latter.

    But when the difficulty of nature is resolved (e.g. billionaire’s yacht), then of course the soul feels more comfortable to go to the empty spaces, than in the Carnival Cruise.
     
    How can you possibly make such a blanket statement? Surely you've read enough by now to be aware of individual differences in personality traits, probably the most basic of which - and the most immediately comprehensible to us - is introversion vs extroversion. Surely it shouldn't be too hard to imagine that some people might find the presence of other people more comforting to the soul than are empty places, at least some of the time.

    Sure, but even a couple not in love, will be feeling a better mood in empty Venice, than Venice full of tourists.
     
    I have forgotten what we were even talking about and, not to be rude, but I can't really be bothered going back to check. This statement, however, is so obvious I have a hard time believing I said anything that would suggest I believed otherwise. And if something I said did suggest I believed otherwise, I here and now, before gods and men, formally proclaim that I don't. :)

    Replies: @Dmitry

  680. @songbird
    @Coconuts

    I suspect that it is a problem of scale. Ireland is a very small country. So, that makes it easier to buy people. And easier to shift the political debate. There are really only like what, four cities? Most towns are essentially small villages. So small numbers can straight away weaponize liberals. Plus, due to scale, indigenous cultural production is pretty low. Culture is mostly a kind of fusion between the UK and America. IMO, the Balts are totally screwed.

    BTW, I'm skeptical about this idea that student visas can be entirely discounted as being part of some invasion. Yes, not everyone stays or wants to stay, but the reality that I've observed directly is that a large number see it as their ticket in, and there is a kind of wink-wink relationship with the regime. "Look, some degree mill here gave them a paper certificate, so that means that they are the professionals we need!" I've known plenty that have used it as their ticket in. Some that were the anchor babies who were claiming their rights. Many very odious people were born as the result of student visas. It is hardly a neutral endeavor to expose intelligent young people to large numbers of foreigners, or to become dependent upon them for teaching assistants, etc. Foreign students help prop up the tertiary education industry, something that is obviously too big for our own good.

    Replies: @Coconuts

    I suspect that it is a problem of scale. Ireland is a very small country. So, that makes it easier to buy people. And easier to shift the political debate. There are really only like what, four cities? Most towns are essentially small villages. So small numbers can straight away weaponize liberals. Plus, due to scale, indigenous cultural production is pretty low. Culture is mostly a kind of fusion between the UK and America. IMO, the Balts are totally screwed.

    I didn’t think of the scale issue, but it would be a decent explanation of why it is moving much more quickly, and it is easier to generate the weight of opinion/influence needed to push this sort of change through. I did get the impression Irish culture retained strong British and US cultural influences, maybe Catholicism mitigated it to some extent, but this is now receding as well or supportive of the same policies.

    The Baltic states may have a certain level of protection due to the migrations they already experienced in the Soviet era, and the losses of population during WW2. I don’t think there are any Western countries with this sort of legacy to strengthen awareness of national identity, OTOH they are small.

    [MORE]

    It is hardly a neutral endeavor to expose intelligent young people to large numbers of foreigners, or to become dependent upon them for teaching assistants, etc. Foreign students help prop up the tertiary education industry, something that is obviously too big for our own good.

    That’s true, the UK has already managed to grow a pretty oversize university sector that is increasingly eager to recruit foreign students. Funding for British students has also been progressively cut so they have to take out large loans as in the US, at the same time the career prospects for graduates are no longer as good due to sheer numbers being produced. Imo some of the explanation for the prominence of weird academic identity politics in wider society is coming from this student issue.

    • Thanks: songbird
    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Coconuts


    The Baltic states may have a certain level of protection due to the migrations they already experienced in the Soviet era, and the losses of population during WW2.
     
    The Baltic statelets lost a lot more population since 1991 than in WWII. Serves them right, if you ask me.
    , @songbird
    @Coconuts

    The Balts certainly seem to have a surplus of ethnocentrism (at least as judged by Western Euro standards), but I would argue perhaps that it is negative, in the sense that it is directed against their historical antagonists, which are not likely to be their future antagonists based on fundamental changes like NATO and nuclear weapons, but which simultaneously might serve to blind them to their future antagonists, who cannot be effectively countered by those things, but rather who might be somewhat enabled by them.

    It is just incident, but witness LatW's evident hostility to AfD and Sudden Death's evident hostility to Le Pen.

    It is said that ethnogenesis is the result of facing the aggression or threats of an outside group. But what if it is not omnidirectional? But unidirectional? Affording a defensive response against only one group?

    Perhaps, like an antibody against one variant of a virus, which, in becoming fixated, impedes the effective response against another variant. Or, maybe, that is not a good analogy...

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @LatW, @Coconuts, @sudden death

  681. @Mr. Hack
    @AnonfromTN


    You just stated that, according to some Hollywood rag, you can be jailed in Russia for using the term “war”. Within minutes you claim that there is a law that uses this (prohibited, according to your source) term twice in its name. What gives?
     
    You have a point here. I thought of this myself while reading the description. Perhaps, this is the best way to transcribe the name of the law from Russian to English?

    I do not watch TV or read newspapers in any country. The people I talked to in Russia were never afraid to say anything, be their positions pro- or anti-government.

     

    If this is so, then you're not qualified to make any pronouncements regarding "freedom of the press" issues. What personal friends or acquaintances utter to you in privacy has no bearing on this issue.

    At least 5% of your weight is shit. When it leaves your body, this cannot be considered a loss even by your worst enemies.
     
    And in your case, when just the opposite is true (I'll let you do the math and the proportions) what do your own enemies say? :-)

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    If this is so, then you’re not qualified to make any pronouncements regarding “freedom of the press” issues.

    In case you missed that, we live in the 21st century. I don’t need to read actual papers to know what’s in them. I can scan websites of “free press” to find out what’s there. Compared to NYT, WaPo, the Guardian, Daily Mail, and a lot of others, Soviet papers in the 1980s were paragons of truthfulness. Welcome to “1984” (or “Brave New World”, if you prefer). Behave yourself, Big Brother is watching you.

    • Agree: Mikhail
    • LOL: Mr. Hack
  682. @Coconuts
    @songbird


    I suspect that it is a problem of scale. Ireland is a very small country. So, that makes it easier to buy people. And easier to shift the political debate. There are really only like what, four cities? Most towns are essentially small villages. So small numbers can straight away weaponize liberals. Plus, due to scale, indigenous cultural production is pretty low. Culture is mostly a kind of fusion between the UK and America. IMO, the Balts are totally screwed.
     
    I didn’t think of the scale issue, but it would be a decent explanation of why it is moving much more quickly, and it is easier to generate the weight of opinion/influence needed to push this sort of change through. I did get the impression Irish culture retained strong British and US cultural influences, maybe Catholicism mitigated it to some extent, but this is now receding as well or supportive of the same policies.

    The Baltic states may have a certain level of protection due to the migrations they already experienced in the Soviet era, and the losses of population during WW2. I don’t think there are any Western countries with this sort of legacy to strengthen awareness of national identity, OTOH they are small.


    It is hardly a neutral endeavor to expose intelligent young people to large numbers of foreigners, or to become dependent upon them for teaching assistants, etc. Foreign students help prop up the tertiary education industry, something that is obviously too big for our own good.
     
    That’s true, the UK has already managed to grow a pretty oversize university sector that is increasingly eager to recruit foreign students. Funding for British students has also been progressively cut so they have to take out large loans as in the US, at the same time the career prospects for graduates are no longer as good due to sheer numbers being produced. Imo some of the explanation for the prominence of weird academic identity politics in wider society is coming from this student issue.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @songbird

    The Baltic states may have a certain level of protection due to the migrations they already experienced in the Soviet era, and the losses of population during WW2.

    The Baltic statelets lost a lot more population since 1991 than in WWII. Serves them right, if you ask me.

  683. @Coconuts
    @A123


    Many of these traditions came from a time when travel was vastly more difficult. France did an excellent job making migrants French, regardless of their ethnicity, when they arrived in limited numbers from nearby lands or as pre assimilated successes from French colonies.
     
    This is true. I think there are a couple of additional points as well.

    The first is the declining fertility and white populations in France and the UK, when these ideas became current, I don't think this issue was understood. Afaik people tended to assume the white population levels would stay fairly constant.

    The other is that some of the momentum behind these ideas comes from business interests that prioritise expanding their labour pool and access to markets, regardless of larger impacts (egalitarianism is not a motivating force). But policies like Brexit or restricting immigration would get in the way of this, so they weigh in against them by promoting things like CRT training among their work forces.

    Replies: @A123

    The first is the declining fertility and white populations in France and the UK, when these ideas became current,

    White is (at best) only an indirect indicator for France. Many Persian and some Arab origin migrants are pigment equivalent to southern & periphery Europeans. Judeo-Christian is much more precise describing the issue. As a short hand, simply Christian is viable as Jews are a tiny population in France.
    __

    Declining Christian fertility & populations in France are a *result* of failed migration policy. Drivers for family formation and then children are:

    • Immediate financial means
    • Future career security
    • Belief that your children will have opportunities

    Low wage Great Replacement invasion by Jihadist anti-Christians (of all pigments), simultaneously devastated all three key drivers. Any attempt to fix the problem cannot be successful unless it is anchored in religion.
    ___

    Is there a separate, much less pressing, problem with Christian migration? Admittedly, Yes. Intra-EU Christian migration damages both “donor” and “recipient” European nations. In a perfect world, both issues could be tackled simultaneously. However, the EU is FAR from perfect.

    Ending the Muslim invasion is priority #1. It is an immediate and existential threat to Christendom .

    Muslims must be an OUTFLOW, decreasing demographic for Europe. Once that is locked in, more subtle issues surrounding intra-EU Christian migration can be addressed.

    PEACE 😇

  684. @Beckow
    @AnonfromTN

    It is hopeless. The thickness of layered propaganda that people like Mr.Hacks (and AP) absorbed is impossible to get through. They lack critical thinking so even obvious oxymorons are accepted as holy truth - the propaganda is too deep.

    When you tell them that many current discussions in the West are about as free as in later day Soviet times, they respond with "how about Gulag?" or with North Korea - the idiocy so profound that there is no cure.

    The basic principle about lies is that it takes two sides for a lie to exist: the liar and the willing audience. Mr.Hacks prefers to be lied to.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @AnonfromTN, @AP

    It is hopeless

    I know. Nobody is as blind as someone who refuses to see. I am writing this for the people who think, not for the brain-dead consumers of propaganda.

    • Replies: @A123
    @AnonfromTN


    Nobody is as blind as someone who refuses to see. I am writing this for the people who think, not for the brain-dead consumers of propaganda.
     
    This is good logic.

    Why do I keep responding to the mental vacuum, #NeverTrump, low-IQ Yahoo named Mikel? There is no hope of fixing such a Sheeple.

    It is to help those who might otherwise be lead astray by his non-stop, conformist, SJW bleating and lying. The world does not need any more DNC acolytes.

    PEACE 😇

     
    https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEjzqLq4zupLGNJ2AiPn-Ha0BY0clStWMnvN3JE120WZzmFACODQ0Oqxdcf-XPb8BROF2sSTZFabb949sr3t2l0N7Zd8YljmoWraUAsR1wMZ6ytpMWQObV9igbN6mRkHxqI9pkTwipMWUdmdUME3x8hepppFDdqydgIEhTxFZC_5_hsxmmpiG18NmVsh/s960/265643028_10159730656222427_8281106370592307126_n.jpg

    Replies: @Mikel

  685. @showmethereal
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    You would see the comment clearly they said it to you if you weren’t rabid in your anti China nonsense.
    Mock at history all you want - history is going back to what it has normally been in Asia for much of history. You can’t hide under the US skirt forever. Just pray for yourself that man mg don’t want to settle any blood debt. (But you probably aren’t even Japanese but an American who got obsessed with Japan from watching anime).
    Pride always comes before a fall. You will look at smart as you did when Costa Rica just beat Japan at the World Cup. What’s that you were saying about idiots and not knowing sports???

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    I left the conversation because I don’t think you can actually read and write Chinese.

    If you are actually literate you should be able to easily identify the source and meaning of this passage–

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    Is that the excuse you are using? I’ve seen Thai before. I remember it from childhood. Take your ball and go home. I made sure to teach my children differently. In any event This is a public English language platform. This is not a private conversation so I won’t indulge in folly nor deviate from the matter at hand.

    Costa Rica 1 - Japan 0
    Ghana 3 - South Korea 2

    That’s for everyone to read. What it means is your argument that Japanese are superior to Chinese is falling on its shaky legs. You must be very embarrassed that Japan lost to a team that has blacks and South Korea lost to one that is basically all black. Please don’t commit seppuku. Unz is fairly anonymous - so you don’t have to worry about your honor

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

  686. @showmethereal
    @Mr. Hack

    So you are completely ignoring the fact that ethnic Russians and those with Russian sympathies in eastern Ukraine were under literal bombardment since the 2014 coup?? Come on. Are you also claiming the psychopaths who set those people on fire in Odessa back then were “misunderstood” nationalists?? Or are you claiming all the videos were Russian propaganda??

    Replies: @Beckow, @Philip Owen

    …ignoring the fact that ethnic Russians and those with Russian sympathies in eastern Ukraine were under literal bombardment since the 2014 coup

    It is worse, Mr.Hack heartily approved of the bombing and killing. The idiotic point of view that says that a large ethnic group can be destroyed or expelled because they are “Russian” (the horror!) is the mainstream Kiev-West viewpoint. They dance around it, lie, talk about other things – aggression! – all in order not to face the obvious: what the post-Maidan Kiev did to its own Russian population was a crime by any objective standard.

    Their big fear is that once Kiev loses the war it will be discussed openly and they will look like who they are: genocidal maniacs who intentionally provoked a bloody war that they will end up losing. No wonder they worship Bandera (and probably Nazis in private).

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @Beckow


    Mr.Hack heartily approved of the bombing and killing. The idiotic point of view that says that a large ethnic group can be destroyed or expelled because they are “Russian” (the horror!) is the mainstream Kiev-West viewpoint.
     
    You're not only full of BS, but as AP has pointed out on many occasions here, you often lie as well. Show me where I said anything at all like what you're trying to spread about me here?

    Replies: @Beckow

    , @showmethereal
    @Beckow

    You are correct. Though much of the world outside the 1 billion in the “west” are openly discussing and aware of it. As I said - me personally I never paid attention to Ukraine until the Nuland coup. The only thing I knew up to that point was that I liked Ukrainian boxers. After that I paid attention intently. That’s why I have little patience for the western propaganda surrounding the situation

    Replies: @LatW

  687. @AnonfromTN
    @Beckow


    It is hopeless
     
    I know. Nobody is as blind as someone who refuses to see. I am writing this for the people who think, not for the brain-dead consumers of propaganda.

    Replies: @A123

    Nobody is as blind as someone who refuses to see. I am writing this for the people who think, not for the brain-dead consumers of propaganda.

    This is good logic.

    Why do I keep responding to the mental vacuum, #NeverTrump, low-IQ Yahoo named Mikel? There is no hope of fixing such a Sheeple.

    It is to help those who might otherwise be lead astray by his non-stop, conformist, SJW bleating and lying. The world does not need any more DNC acolytes.

    PEACE 😇

     

    • Replies: @Mikel
    @A123


    the mental vacuum, #NeverTrump, low-IQ Yahoo named Mikel
     
    To think that I have been using the word Trumpist out of courtesy... But well, I guess everyone here understood that I really meant to say the much more common word that rhymes with mustard. Everyone except for you, that is :-)

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @A123

  688. @Coconuts
    @Sher Singh


    Why does a Slav care for Turks or Anglos?
    If it’s just crass consumerism & a respect for modern amenities – that’s a dead end.
     
    From my irl experience of Belarusians, apart from the ties to local Slavic culture and Russia or Poland, plenty of the more educated ones seem to be 'Northern Euro' orientated, looking to Scandanavia, Netherlands, Switzerland, WASPs in the US for political and cultural inspiration, Germany for technology.

    I found this noticeable because the educated liberal people in the UK had a different orientation, similar to what SilvioSliver was talking about in Australia, where they value a mixture of aborigine, Native American and tribal cultures generally, blacks etc.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @Dmitry

    looking to Scandanavia, Netherlands

    It’s not specific for Belarus. Everyone outside Europe, is looking (with dreams) to Western Europe. Western Europe is the center for our cargo-cult.

    I guess a lot is in relation to consumer products. My parents always wanted every consumer product “made in Germany”, whether car or washing machine. It’s like having a German automobile, means you now have been able to give your family the quality of life of Germany.

    In Russia, if you rent an apartment which is slightly clean or modern, you can advertise saying it has “Scandinavian style” and add to the price. “Scandinavian style” doesn’t just mean you go to IKEA, but maybe it is the perfect euphemism to describe middle class, clean apartment where “real white people” (i.e. Western Europeans) can live.

    I believe there is the same cargo-cult in Latin America, in the Middle East. In India, it’s infamous, that the driver of the taxis will start to talk about their admiration for Nazi Germany.

    educated liberal people in the UK had a different orientation,

    Educated people in the UK are probably the world’s most elite nationality, with space a little below for France, Germany, Netherlands etc. They have been the creators of the modern world for more than a couple centuries. If you are cargo-cult for everyone, then who will be cargo cult for you?

    This probably part of the fashion for “primitivism” in the latter 19th century. There is also the dream of the “secret knowledge” of ancient peoples, which is especially in relation for India, which is not exactly “primitivism” (as the ancient Indians were the most advanced in certain topics in their time). Many of the English creators of topics like computer science were obsessed with ancient India.

    I think North-West European countries like UK also cargo-cults in the epicurean topics (e.g. food) for the Latin cultures like France, which is correct as the countries with Mediterranean have always better food, and have continued more traditional culture in those areas like food and the traditional industry.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Dmitry


    I think North-West European countries like UK also cargo-cults in the epicurean topics (e.g. food) for the Latin cultures like France, which is correct as the countries with Mediterranean have always better food
     
    I have heard a theory that it was the American boomers, who, as part of their subversive counter-culture, promoted the idea that Italian food was the best food, in clear contravention with the old opinion of prevailing establishment, which was that French food was the best.

    Personally, I think it is a really crazy theory, and would say rather that Italian food was promoted because of Italian immigration and perhaps because it was cheap.

    Replies: @Dmitry

  689. @A123
    @AnonfromTN


    Nobody is as blind as someone who refuses to see. I am writing this for the people who think, not for the brain-dead consumers of propaganda.
     
    This is good logic.

    Why do I keep responding to the mental vacuum, #NeverTrump, low-IQ Yahoo named Mikel? There is no hope of fixing such a Sheeple.

    It is to help those who might otherwise be lead astray by his non-stop, conformist, SJW bleating and lying. The world does not need any more DNC acolytes.

    PEACE 😇

     
    https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEjzqLq4zupLGNJ2AiPn-Ha0BY0clStWMnvN3JE120WZzmFACODQ0Oqxdcf-XPb8BROF2sSTZFabb949sr3t2l0N7Zd8YljmoWraUAsR1wMZ6ytpMWQObV9igbN6mRkHxqI9pkTwipMWUdmdUME3x8hepppFDdqydgIEhTxFZC_5_hsxmmpiG18NmVsh/s960/265643028_10159730656222427_8281106370592307126_n.jpg

    Replies: @Mikel

    the mental vacuum, #NeverTrump, low-IQ Yahoo named Mikel

    To think that I have been using the word Trumpist out of courtesy… But well, I guess everyone here understood that I really meant to say the much more common word that rhymes with mustard. Everyone except for you, that is 🙂

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Mikel

    Calling each other names is unseemly. Don’t stoop to the level of official propaganda. It targets intellectually impaired.

    , @A123
    @Mikel


    To think that I have been using the word Trumpist out of courtesy…
     
    The pejorative "Trumpist" has no courteous application. It is exclusively deployed by low-IQ Yahoos, who do not understand that MAGA is larger than Trump.

    everyone here understood that I really meant to say the much more common word that rhymes with mustard
     


    I appreciate the compliment. There may be hope for you after all.

    Lustered - definition of lustered by The Free Dictionary

    lus•ter 1. n.

    1. the state or quality of shining by reflecting light: the luster of satin.
    2. a substance, as a coating or polish, used to impart sheen or gloss.
    3. radiant or luminous brightness; brilliance.
    4. radiance of beauty, excellence, distinction, or glory: achievements
    that add luster to one's name.
     
    Your courtesy is appreciated. Excellence and Glory. I like those.

    #LetsGoBrandon 😇
  690. @silviosilver
    @showmethereal


    Make no mistake – I am against illegal migration. But I understand cause and effect. I also understand the God given principle that governs all of creation which is – sowing and reaping.
     
    You are against illegal infiltration, but also against taking action to prevent it. And if it were a simple case of cause and effect, it would occur naturally, without you having to campaign for it. (And which case your comments on it would amount to no more than taunts of the "suck shit" variety, which in fact is precisely what they are even in the absence of that causal mechanism.)

    Drop the sanctimony, please. You are no good at it. You have the requisite duplicity, but you completely lack the charm, which is the other essential ingredient. Thus your attempts to assume the moral high ground come off as nothing more than you hurling your Chinese butthurt against the world. From the standpoint of personal wellbeing, seeking professional help for your emotional difficulties would be the wiser course of action, but it is your life, your choice.

    Oh, and you are also a muslim, obviously on George Islamo-Soros's payroll.

    : p

    Replies: @Barbarossa, @showmethereal

    I get it — you don’t understand spiritual concepts. No problem. Stew in your frustrations then.

    But I notice a pattern with your types. You love to ascribe labels to anyone you can’t defeat in debate. I won’t even respond in kind… it’s a complete waste of time and energy. I wonder if attempting insult makes people like yourself feel good. It only makes you look intellectually small. But hey I guess that’s why you like your echo chambers

  691. @Mikel
    @AP


    The Russians didn’t defeat the Germans. The USSR did. So Russians plus 90% of Ukrainians plus Central Asians.
     
    Would the Russians have been unable to put a man in orbit and build the Tsar Bomba without the help of Ukrainians and Central Asians?

    Replies: @AP

    Would the Russians have been unable to put a man in orbit and build the Tsar Bomba without the help of Ukrainians and Central Asians?

    Well, the most important member of the Soviet space program was a Ukrainian guy born in Zhytomir (he was half-Ukrainian but his father left when he was three years old and he was raised by his Ukrainian mother and her family):

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sergei_Korolev

    [MORE]

    Sergei Pavlovich Korolev[a] (Russian: Сергей Павлович Королёв, romanized: Sergey Pavlovich Korolyov, lit. ’sʲɪrˈɡʲej ˈpavləvʲɪtɕ kərɐˈlʲɵf’; Ukrainian: Сергій Павлович Корольов, romanized: Serhiy Pavlovych Korol’ov, lit. ’sɛrˈɦij ˈpavlovɪtʃ koroˈlʲou̯’) 12 January 1907 [O.S. 30 December 1906] – 14 January 1966) was a lead Soviet rocket engineer and spacecraft designer during the Space Race between the United States and the Soviet Union in the 1950s and 1960s. He is regarded by many as the father of practical astronautics.[3][4] He was involved in the development of the R-7 Rocket, Sputnik 1, launching Laika, Sputnik 3, the first human-made object to make contact with another celestial body, Belka and Strelka, the first human being, Yuri Gagarin, into space, Voskhod 1, and the first person, Alexei Leonov, to conduct a spacewalk.[

  692. @Beckow
    @AnonfromTN

    It is hopeless. The thickness of layered propaganda that people like Mr.Hacks (and AP) absorbed is impossible to get through. They lack critical thinking so even obvious oxymorons are accepted as holy truth - the propaganda is too deep.

    When you tell them that many current discussions in the West are about as free as in later day Soviet times, they respond with "how about Gulag?" or with North Korea - the idiocy so profound that there is no cure.

    The basic principle about lies is that it takes two sides for a lie to exist: the liar and the willing audience. Mr.Hacks prefers to be lied to.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @AnonfromTN, @AP

    The thickness of layered propaganda that people like Mr.Hacks (and AP) absorbed is impossible to get through.

    This is you:

    • Agree: Mr. Hack
    • LOL: sudden death
  693. @Mikel
    @A123


    the mental vacuum, #NeverTrump, low-IQ Yahoo named Mikel
     
    To think that I have been using the word Trumpist out of courtesy... But well, I guess everyone here understood that I really meant to say the much more common word that rhymes with mustard. Everyone except for you, that is :-)

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @A123

    Calling each other names is unseemly. Don’t stoop to the level of official propaganda. It targets intellectually impaired.

  694. @Beckow
    @AP


    ...Reversal of those gains should be a minimal requirement for peace.
     
    Kiev is not in a position to reverse it militarily, e.g. Mariupol, Azov coast...if you want peace Kiev will have to negotiate. It is heading to either a prolonged bloody stalemate or a new Russian attack with Kiev collapsing out of cumulative destruction.

    You can't dictate to the other side if you are losing on the ground. You live in a temporary bubble of 'success' without understanding that strategically nothing has changed: Russia is still much stronger. Plebiscites are a non-starter, the two sides don't trust each other and there are no neutral observers. Who would vote and who would count? It is a few years late for that.


    ...taken out of the seized reserves and assets
     
    Another fantasy. The Western assets in Russia - they have also been frozen - exceed Russia's 'financial deposits' in the West. It is $300 trillion against $500+ trillion in Western assets in Russia. Western assets are real: oil, gas, minerals, factories... vs. electronic 'money' and bonds. Exxon, Total, BP... would have to be compensated first - they lost huge wealth with potential to grow.

    A story in finance is that Russia intentionally left some reserves in the West to goad the eager Westerners into freezing it. That allowed Russia to reciprocate and freeze more valuable Western investments in Russia. Given Putin's legalism Russia wanted an excuse. Not sure it is true, but that's the way it has played out. You are suggesting that Kiev in effect be compensated from BP, Exxon, Japanese... and their lost Russian assets. Do you think they will agree? (Maybe...it is all about geo-politics now, business be damned.)

    It is a loss-loss and it undermines international finance, back to Middle Ages...do you think money people like going back to Middle Ages so you can forbid Russian language in Donbas schools and have Nato prance around Black Sea steppes?

    Replies: @AP, @showmethereal

    Kiev is not in a position to reverse it militarily, e.g. Mariupol, Azov coast

    Too early to tell. Remember that you insisted Ukraine would fall in days. How did that work out?

    It is heading to either a prolonged bloody stalemate or a new Russian attack with Kiev collapsing out of cumulative destruction.

    Our former host who is smarter, more honest, and better informed than you are predicts 70% stalemate roughly along current lines, 30% Ukrainian victory (retaking land bridge, going into northern Crimea). He has a history of overestimating Russia, moreover.

    Plebiscites are a non-starter, the two sides don’t trust each other and there are no neutral observers.

    I was discussing how an eventual peace might look (i.e., if both sides are exhausted after a long time of stalemate).

    Another fantasy. The Western assets in Russia – they have also been frozen – exceed Russia’s ‘financial deposits‘ in the West. It is $300 trillion against $500+ trillion in Western assets in Russia.

    It is billions, not trillions.

    And you are lying again.

    The frozen Russian government central bank reserves amount to $300 billion.

    Russia/Russians have an additional $1 trillion parked in the West, that are not Russian government reserves. If you want to compare assets by private Western companies in Russia versus assets of Russia in the West and play this game, Russia loses also. It can take the West’s $500 billion in Russia and lose $1.3 trillion in the West.

    Do you really “think” that the West sent more money into Russia than vice versa? Lol.

  695. @Dmitry
    @Coconuts


    looking to Scandanavia, Netherlands
     
    It's not specific for Belarus. Everyone outside Europe, is looking (with dreams) to Western Europe. Western Europe is the center for our cargo-cult.

    I guess a lot is in relation to consumer products. My parents always wanted every consumer product "made in Germany", whether car or washing machine. It's like having a German automobile, means you now have been able to give your family the quality of life of Germany.

    In Russia, if you rent an apartment which is slightly clean or modern, you can advertise saying it has "Scandinavian style" and add to the price. "Scandinavian style" doesn't just mean you go to IKEA, but maybe it is the perfect euphemism to describe middle class, clean apartment where "real white people" (i.e. Western Europeans) can live.

    I believe there is the same cargo-cult in Latin America, in the Middle East. In India, it's infamous, that the driver of the taxis will start to talk about their admiration for Nazi Germany.


    educated liberal people in the UK had a different orientation,
     
    Educated people in the UK are probably the world's most elite nationality, with space a little below for France, Germany, Netherlands etc. They have been the creators of the modern world for more than a couple centuries. If you are cargo-cult for everyone, then who will be cargo cult for you?

    This probably part of the fashion for "primitivism" in the latter 19th century. There is also the dream of the "secret knowledge" of ancient peoples, which is especially in relation for India, which is not exactly "primitivism" (as the ancient Indians were the most advanced in certain topics in their time). Many of the English creators of topics like computer science were obsessed with ancient India.

    I think North-West European countries like UK also cargo-cults in the epicurean topics (e.g. food) for the Latin cultures like France, which is correct as the countries with Mediterranean have always better food, and have continued more traditional culture in those areas like food and the traditional industry.

    Replies: @songbird

    I think North-West European countries like UK also cargo-cults in the epicurean topics (e.g. food) for the Latin cultures like France, which is correct as the countries with Mediterranean have always better food

    I have heard a theory that it was the American boomers, who, as part of their subversive counter-culture, promoted the idea that Italian food was the best food, in clear contravention with the old opinion of prevailing establishment, which was that French food was the best.

    Personally, I think it is a really crazy theory, and would say rather that Italian food was promoted because of Italian immigration and perhaps because it was cheap.

    • Replies: @Dmitry
    @songbird

    Although the famous high cuisine (kind of "rich people's food") in France was introduced by an Italian - Catherine de Medici


    Italian food was promoted because of Italian immigration
     
    It seems like many Italian immigrants that go to the food industry, invented new recipes when they are in America, than wanted to continue the traditional Italian kitchen (it would have been more of the peasants' food).

    For example, this recipe of beef in Chicago. Surely, not many people in Italy were eating large parts of beef before the economic miracle there (1960s). That would be very expensive for Italians. Old Italian food is based in more cheap ingredients.

    It likely more of the local Chicago culture, which was famous for meat industry since the 19th century, than people carrying Italian recipes from home.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nojaKlA7MoU

    Replies: @songbird, @AnonfromTN

  696. @Mikel
    @A123


    the mental vacuum, #NeverTrump, low-IQ Yahoo named Mikel
     
    To think that I have been using the word Trumpist out of courtesy... But well, I guess everyone here understood that I really meant to say the much more common word that rhymes with mustard. Everyone except for you, that is :-)

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @A123

    To think that I have been using the word Trumpist out of courtesy…

    The pejorative “Trumpist” has no courteous application. It is exclusively deployed by low-IQ Yahoos, who do not understand that MAGA is larger than Trump.

    everyone here understood that I really meant to say the much more common word that rhymes with mustard

    I appreciate the compliment. There may be hope for you after all.

    Lustered – definition of lustered by The Free Dictionary

    lus•ter 1. n.

    1. the state or quality of shining by reflecting light: the luster of satin.
    2. a substance, as a coating or polish, used to impart sheen or gloss.
    3. radiant or luminous brightness; brilliance.
    4. radiance of beauty, excellence, distinction, or glory: achievements
    that add luster to one’s name.

    Your courtesy is appreciated. Excellence and Glory. I like those.

    #LetsGoBrandon 😇

  697. @LatW
    @Mikel


    Do you think that if Ukraine takes back Crimea the Russians will never come back again? The contrary looks much more likely.
     
    Please, see my post above. They always come back. It's been that way since the 5th century or so. Only one solution - Israel. Not Finland, not Switzerland. Israel.

    Short of marching to Moscow and dismembering the Russian state, I don’t know how Ukrainians can prevent their children from having to fight Russia in the future.
     
    As I said above, the Russians themselves have to march to Moscow. Ukraine will stop on its borders, then pass the baton on to the Russians. If they have enough strength (which I highly doubt).

    Alternatively, they can enjoy a "beautiful" life under Prigozhin's sledgehammer. (Look that up).

    Ukraine deserves to be independent from Moscow, now more than ever.
     
    That's not how this works. One doesn't "deserve" something out of the blue. One has to fight for it. As the Ukrainian people have done for hundreds of years now.

    When Musk proposed this he was met with abuse in Kiev though.
     
    It is way too late for those solutions now. Such a plan will also be rejected by the Russian side long term (although they are desperate for an agreement so that they can at least keep the current gains). No, it's too late. It is in the hands of the Ukrainian military now.

    Replies: @Yahya, @Mikel, @Dmitry

    Only one solution – Israel

    For internal security policy, Israel is not exactly a successful example. They are killed every week in different terrorist attacks. There are politicians in Israel’s parliament, who receive over $100,000 salary from taxpayers, who are supporting Hamas. There are female conscripts, working in prisons, who were raped by Palestinian security prisoners, sacrificed by their officers. There are religious cult groups who go to live in territory which could never be legally part of Israel.

    There is an example of the dystopian aspects of European internal law applied to unfinished civil war in the Middle East since 1948, which has fuel of nationalism and Middle East’s very strong religions. There are more than 50 years without two-state solution, but even with two-state solution the civil war will continue within Israel.

    This is surely a dystopia.

    If you ignore the civil war, Israel has a mix of the 19th century European political software, which also has predictable positive results like in colonial states of Australia or New Zealand.

    There is English law, proportional representation, free-speech, private property, decentralized/uncensored media. There is some successful anti-corruption policies. There is investment in science* and quite bit of the artistic and academic production for the size of country. There is consumer protection, unionization and worker protection (although not in all industries e.g. construction industry is less like in a developed country).

    Israel is also a population of mostly third world multiracial immigrants (the majority of the Jewish population) who they can assimilate to create a new nationality in a couple generations. But then this “melting pot” is going to a society divided by religion instead. As the “melting pot” of Brazil, is not ending another type of division (in Brazil, class divisions instead of religious divisions).


    *From the view of postsoviet countries, there should be a desire to copy the higher investment in R&D , which China could be attaining. But also places like Germany or Sweden have much higher investment for R&D.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Dmitry


    investment in R&D
     
    Investment in R&D is only part of the story. The most important thing is productivity of these investments. Some of the most obvious examples.

    US. Twenty years ago 75-80% of NIH dollars went to productive labs. Today this fraction is much smaller, as a significant portion of the money goes to dead-end labs in the name of “diversity”. Accordingly, labs that could have produced high quality science are not getting these funds. Pure waste.

    RF. Members of the Academy of Sciences are being paid fairly high wages. In most cases these people have already forgotten what they are supposed to be studying (assuming they ever knew). Again, pure waste.

    Replies: @Dmitry

    , @LatW
    @Dmitry


    For internal security policy, Israel is not exactly a successful example.
     
    But they are. I've had a chance to observe close up the security protocol that the Israelis carry out in a formal, but relatively simple and non-threatening environment. It was very thorough (many times more thorough than other states). So this is an approach that can be applied to all sorts of areas in life (in EE, we wouldn't need to do that in every sphere of life, but it is something to think about).

    But, of course, I didn't mean it as a literal comparison, I meant the defense policies. I would say the attitude exemplified by Golda Meir would be something worth studying.. And, as I mentioned, a lot of the Israeli problems wouldn't exist in Ukraine's case. It was not meant to be taken literally but as a spiritual and defense model. Most importantly, Israel's enemies do not just want to occupy or limit Israel. They want Israel not to exist.

    Replies: @A123, @Dmitry

  698. @Coconuts
    @songbird


    I suspect that it is a problem of scale. Ireland is a very small country. So, that makes it easier to buy people. And easier to shift the political debate. There are really only like what, four cities? Most towns are essentially small villages. So small numbers can straight away weaponize liberals. Plus, due to scale, indigenous cultural production is pretty low. Culture is mostly a kind of fusion between the UK and America. IMO, the Balts are totally screwed.
     
    I didn’t think of the scale issue, but it would be a decent explanation of why it is moving much more quickly, and it is easier to generate the weight of opinion/influence needed to push this sort of change through. I did get the impression Irish culture retained strong British and US cultural influences, maybe Catholicism mitigated it to some extent, but this is now receding as well or supportive of the same policies.

    The Baltic states may have a certain level of protection due to the migrations they already experienced in the Soviet era, and the losses of population during WW2. I don’t think there are any Western countries with this sort of legacy to strengthen awareness of national identity, OTOH they are small.


    It is hardly a neutral endeavor to expose intelligent young people to large numbers of foreigners, or to become dependent upon them for teaching assistants, etc. Foreign students help prop up the tertiary education industry, something that is obviously too big for our own good.
     
    That’s true, the UK has already managed to grow a pretty oversize university sector that is increasingly eager to recruit foreign students. Funding for British students has also been progressively cut so they have to take out large loans as in the US, at the same time the career prospects for graduates are no longer as good due to sheer numbers being produced. Imo some of the explanation for the prominence of weird academic identity politics in wider society is coming from this student issue.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @songbird

    The Balts certainly seem to have a surplus of ethnocentrism (at least as judged by Western Euro standards), but I would argue perhaps that it is negative, in the sense that it is directed against their historical antagonists, which are not likely to be their future antagonists based on fundamental changes like NATO and nuclear weapons, but which simultaneously might serve to blind them to their future antagonists, who cannot be effectively countered by those things, but rather who might be somewhat enabled by them.

    It is just incident, but witness LatW’s evident hostility to AfD and Sudden Death’s evident hostility to Le Pen.

    It is said that ethnogenesis is the result of facing the aggression or threats of an outside group. But what if it is not omnidirectional? But unidirectional? Affording a defensive response against only one group?

    Perhaps, like an antibody against one variant of a virus, which, in becoming fixated, impedes the effective response against another variant. Or, maybe, that is not a good analogy…

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @songbird


    Affording a defensive response against only one group?
     
    The more enthusiastically they fight windmills, the sooner they disappear. Survival of the fittest, pure and simple.
    , @LatW
    @songbird


    The Balts certainly seem to have a surplus of ethnocentrism (at least as judged by Western Euro standards), but I would argue perhaps that it is negative, in the sense that it is directed against their historical antagonists
     
    It's not just negative, there is a positive side, too (mostly internally facing). It is not typically defined by "antagonists". It's just there, as in the concept of Dasein. And, btw, a certain response to "antagonists", as you call them, is healthy. The kind of "antagonists" that you have in mind that are negative also occasionally try to make moves and sometimes receive a response. But there are fewer of those than from the East (for now).

    It is just incident, but witness LatW’s evident hostility to AfD and Sudden Death’s evident hostility to Le Pen.
     
    Please, do not extrapolate my posts on all the Baltic people, this is not a forum for mainstream politics or majority ideas. Most Baltic people are democratic and support non-contraversial politics, and do not care much about AfD (even if most of them view non-European immigration negatively, even peaceful and diligent Asians, while accepted, are not considered a "norm".. btw, most nationalists view AfD quite positively and the Estonian nationalists even met with Le Pen in person and she was greeted by them quite warmly). Under normal circumstances, I'd be amicable towards AfD and would support them wholeheartedly (and, if I were German, would also support them or a similar party financially, even if AfD is a mild party by my standards), just not when their voters lecture to Eastern Europeans about things they have never experienced themselves. I think AfD should focus internally, on problems that have direct relevance to the negative side of the non-Euro immigration. If the AfD doesn't want to support Ukraine, then this is totally their right and actually in line with their politics. I respect that, but that means they have no say over how Ukraine develops and what Ukraine does. Which is fair, imo.

    The unwritten agreement with Western Europe is that we are amicable and wish well to each other, only in that case we allow the West to have access to our internal policies (or domestic markets). If they side with our enemy (or get paid by him), that ends. I'm speaking generally, not accusing AfD of anything, of course. Not that they should listen even, it's their country (and, afaik, the AfD are actually eurosceptic so these views are irrelevant - I'm assuming, if AfD were in power, with large masses supporting them, there would be no EU at least in its current form and Eastern policy would hopefully be a minor part of their agenda).

    Replies: @Yevardian, @German_reader, @songbird

    , @Coconuts
    @songbird


    The Balts certainly seem to have a surplus of ethnocentrism (at least as judged by Western Euro standards), but I would argue perhaps that it is negative, in the sense that it is directed against their historical antagonists, which are not likely to be their future antagonists based on fundamental changes like NATO and nuclear weapons, but which simultaneously might serve to blind them to their future antagonists, who cannot be effectively countered by those things, but rather who might be somewhat enabled by them.
     
    There is the angle that the Baltic nations have had much more exposure to the authoritarian side of progressivism in their recent history, and much of this is also applicable to the ways mass-immigration from outside Europe is promoted and normalised in a society, at least when the left-wing are doing it. I can't speak any Baltic languages but from some of the academics I have heard discussing the Soviet era in English, they are similar to the level of the Poles in their analysis, which is deeper than what you usually encounter in mainstream in the West.

    It means I don't think their progressives will find as easy to gain cultural hegemony as ours have, I think LatW has mentioned this in the past as well.

    Replies: @songbird

    , @sudden death
    @songbird

    NATO and nuclear weapons are worthless without political will to act in case of crisis and politicians, taking money from RF, like LePen (promising to get out of NATO military structure) are doing everything to weaken both political will and military capabilities. In theory, somebody might be just idealist isolationist without any foreign influence, but the end result will be also destruction of that political will.

    RF will certainly cross any NATO boundaries if they will calculate that there is no political will to stand against and react:

    https://twitter.com/RadioJustBack/status/1502769211969622017?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1502769211969622017%7Ctwgr%5E7d8d68f0858648bcc4010bdf8e44c3526a627042%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.reddit.com%2Fr%2FUkraineWarVideoReport%2Fsearch%2F%3Fq%3Dkorotchenkosort%3Drelevancet%3Dall

    Replies: @sudden death, @songbird

  699. @Dmitry
    @LatW


    Only one solution – Israel
     
    For internal security policy, Israel is not exactly a successful example. They are killed every week in different terrorist attacks. There are politicians in Israel's parliament, who receive over $100,000 salary from taxpayers, who are supporting Hamas. There are female conscripts, working in prisons, who were raped by Palestinian security prisoners, sacrificed by their officers. There are religious cult groups who go to live in territory which could never be legally part of Israel.

    There is an example of the dystopian aspects of European internal law applied to unfinished civil war in the Middle East since 1948, which has fuel of nationalism and Middle East's very strong religions. There are more than 50 years without two-state solution, but even with two-state solution the civil war will continue within Israel.

    This is surely a dystopia.

    If you ignore the civil war, Israel has a mix of the 19th century European political software, which also has predictable positive results like in colonial states of Australia or New Zealand.

    There is English law, proportional representation, free-speech, private property, decentralized/uncensored media. There is some successful anti-corruption policies. There is investment in science* and quite bit of the artistic and academic production for the size of country. There is consumer protection, unionization and worker protection (although not in all industries e.g. construction industry is less like in a developed country).

    Israel is also a population of mostly third world multiracial immigrants (the majority of the Jewish population) who they can assimilate to create a new nationality in a couple generations. But then this "melting pot" is going to a society divided by religion instead. As the "melting pot" of Brazil, is not ending another type of division (in Brazil, class divisions instead of religious divisions).


    -
    *From the view of postsoviet countries, there should be a desire to copy the higher investment in R&D , which China could be attaining. But also places like Germany or Sweden have much higher investment for R&D.

    https://i.imgur.com/u4d5Nv9.jpg

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @LatW

    investment in R&D

    Investment in R&D is only part of the story. The most important thing is productivity of these investments. Some of the most obvious examples.

    US. Twenty years ago 75-80% of NIH dollars went to productive labs. Today this fraction is much smaller, as a significant portion of the money goes to dead-end labs in the name of “diversity”. Accordingly, labs that could have produced high quality science are not getting these funds. Pure waste.

    RF. Members of the Academy of Sciences are being paid fairly high wages. In most cases these people have already forgotten what they are supposed to be studying (assuming they ever knew). Again, pure waste.

    • Replies: @Dmitry
    @AnonfromTN

    Something about the R&D in America, the total R&D fund as proportion of GDP was increasing fast since 2018, but the federal R&D fund as proportion of GDP has been decreasing since 1965.

    So, in addition to discussion of productivity in their expenditure, groups like NIH might not have such good long term increases in their budget.

    https://i.imgur.com/N48sG4J.jpg

    It was still time of Kennedy (1963-64), when there was the highest federal funding available as proportion of GDP.

    Before 2018, in the Obama years, the federal funding for R&D was also decreasing according to this article. "in 2018 and 2019, the results of lengthy congressional debates on federal spending resulted in substantial increases overall in the agency budgets to conduct R&D."

    https://ncses.nsf.gov/pubs/nsf22330

    Economy was also growing slow in many years of Obama, so the decrease in the federal funding for R&D would be also as absolute decrease (not only as proportion of GDP).

  700. @songbird
    @Coconuts

    The Balts certainly seem to have a surplus of ethnocentrism (at least as judged by Western Euro standards), but I would argue perhaps that it is negative, in the sense that it is directed against their historical antagonists, which are not likely to be their future antagonists based on fundamental changes like NATO and nuclear weapons, but which simultaneously might serve to blind them to their future antagonists, who cannot be effectively countered by those things, but rather who might be somewhat enabled by them.

    It is just incident, but witness LatW's evident hostility to AfD and Sudden Death's evident hostility to Le Pen.

    It is said that ethnogenesis is the result of facing the aggression or threats of an outside group. But what if it is not omnidirectional? But unidirectional? Affording a defensive response against only one group?

    Perhaps, like an antibody against one variant of a virus, which, in becoming fixated, impedes the effective response against another variant. Or, maybe, that is not a good analogy...

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @LatW, @Coconuts, @sudden death

    Affording a defensive response against only one group?

    The more enthusiastically they fight windmills, the sooner they disappear. Survival of the fittest, pure and simple.

  701. @songbird
    @Dmitry


    I think North-West European countries like UK also cargo-cults in the epicurean topics (e.g. food) for the Latin cultures like France, which is correct as the countries with Mediterranean have always better food
     
    I have heard a theory that it was the American boomers, who, as part of their subversive counter-culture, promoted the idea that Italian food was the best food, in clear contravention with the old opinion of prevailing establishment, which was that French food was the best.

    Personally, I think it is a really crazy theory, and would say rather that Italian food was promoted because of Italian immigration and perhaps because it was cheap.

    Replies: @Dmitry

    Although the famous high cuisine (kind of “rich people’s food”) in France was introduced by an Italian – Catherine de Medici

    Italian food was promoted because of Italian immigration

    It seems like many Italian immigrants that go to the food industry, invented new recipes when they are in America, than wanted to continue the traditional Italian kitchen (it would have been more of the peasants’ food).

    [MORE]

    For example, this recipe of beef in Chicago. Surely, not many people in Italy were eating large parts of beef before the economic miracle there (1960s). That would be very expensive for Italians. Old Italian food is based in more cheap ingredients.

    It likely more of the local Chicago culture, which was famous for meat industry since the 19th century, than people carrying Italian recipes from home.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Dmitry


    It likely is more of reflection of local Chicago life
     
    When the Irish came, they adopted corned beef and cabbage. The corned beef was supposedly a substitute for mutton, which they could not find when they arrived, but it may be considered somewhat doubtful, as the common peasant probably only ate meat once or twice a year, if he were lucky.

    I think the corned beef reflects that they arrived when refrigerated freight cars weren't a thing. Some say they adopted it from Jews, but, IMO, that is very dubious.

    With regard to Italians: when they came, refrigerated freight cars were a thing, so though there are many Italians in Chicago, I would guess the food might not be so heavily influenced by the particular location, and one would witness the same thing at the same time in other Italian destinations, like Boston, or the NYC area.

    It is interesting how America has modified the ethnic food of so many arrivals to be more meat intensive. I remember being a kid, and having a hard time believing that Chinese actually ate with chopsticks - I suppose that it was because my thinking was so meat-influenced.
    , @AnonfromTN
    @Dmitry


    wanted to continue the traditional Italian kitchen (it would have been more of the peasants’ food).
     
    My Sicilian grad student told me that the greatest compliment for an Italian chef is “you cook like my grandmother”.
  702. Nina 🐙 Byzantina
    @NinaByzantina
    Taras Shevchenko is considered one of the founders of modern Ukrainian language. Yet what they won’t tell you is that he admired Russian military leaders and engraved an entire series (here, Suvorov and Potemkin, a founder of Novorossia). Today his admirers remove their statues.

    [MORE]

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @Mikhail

    Making busts of anybody is not necessarily "admiration", but more like just fulfilling a business contract. You pay me, and I paint your picture, carve your bust etc, This is another one of your baseless tries at eternal Ukrainian/Russian brotherliness. I prefer a good old fashioned "Averkoism". Time to bring those back, they always added a certain panache to your writing style! :-)

  703. @AnonfromTN
    @Dmitry


    investment in R&D
     
    Investment in R&D is only part of the story. The most important thing is productivity of these investments. Some of the most obvious examples.

    US. Twenty years ago 75-80% of NIH dollars went to productive labs. Today this fraction is much smaller, as a significant portion of the money goes to dead-end labs in the name of “diversity”. Accordingly, labs that could have produced high quality science are not getting these funds. Pure waste.

    RF. Members of the Academy of Sciences are being paid fairly high wages. In most cases these people have already forgotten what they are supposed to be studying (assuming they ever knew). Again, pure waste.

    Replies: @Dmitry

    Something about the R&D in America, the total R&D fund as proportion of GDP was increasing fast since 2018, but the federal R&D fund as proportion of GDP has been decreasing since 1965.

    So, in addition to discussion of productivity in their expenditure, groups like NIH might not have such good long term increases in their budget.

    It was still time of Kennedy (1963-64), when there was the highest federal funding available as proportion of GDP.

    Before 2018, in the Obama years, the federal funding for R&D was also decreasing according to this article. “in 2018 and 2019, the results of lengthy congressional debates on federal spending resulted in substantial increases overall in the agency budgets to conduct R&D.”

    https://ncses.nsf.gov/pubs/nsf22330

    Economy was also growing slow in many years of Obama, so the decrease in the federal funding for R&D would be also as absolute decrease (not only as proportion of GDP).

  704. @Dmitry
    @songbird

    Although the famous high cuisine (kind of "rich people's food") in France was introduced by an Italian - Catherine de Medici


    Italian food was promoted because of Italian immigration
     
    It seems like many Italian immigrants that go to the food industry, invented new recipes when they are in America, than wanted to continue the traditional Italian kitchen (it would have been more of the peasants' food).

    For example, this recipe of beef in Chicago. Surely, not many people in Italy were eating large parts of beef before the economic miracle there (1960s). That would be very expensive for Italians. Old Italian food is based in more cheap ingredients.

    It likely more of the local Chicago culture, which was famous for meat industry since the 19th century, than people carrying Italian recipes from home.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nojaKlA7MoU

    Replies: @songbird, @AnonfromTN

    It likely is more of reflection of local Chicago life

    When the Irish came, they adopted corned beef and cabbage. The corned beef was supposedly a substitute for mutton, which they could not find when they arrived, but it may be considered somewhat doubtful, as the common peasant probably only ate meat once or twice a year, if he were lucky.

    I think the corned beef reflects that they arrived when refrigerated freight cars weren’t a thing. Some say they adopted it from Jews, but, IMO, that is very dubious.

    With regard to Italians: when they came, refrigerated freight cars were a thing, so though there are many Italians in Chicago, I would guess the food might not be so heavily influenced by the particular location, and one would witness the same thing at the same time in other Italian destinations, like Boston, or the NYC area.

    It is interesting how America has modified the ethnic food of so many arrivals to be more meat intensive. I remember being a kid, and having a hard time believing that Chinese actually ate with chopsticks – I suppose that it was because my thinking was so meat-influenced.

  705. That wacko überfreak that Biden hired for the energy department recently stole a women’s purse, at an airport.

    [MORE]

    • LOL: German_reader
    • Replies: @A123
    @songbird

    It was not merely a purse. It was checked luggage taken from airport baggage claim. Between bag and contents something like $3,000 of value. The wacko had not even checked a bag, so it is not an "accident". It is all on video tape.

    ... up to five years in prison and $10,000 fine for allegedly taking another person's luggage ...

    It is so egregious, it is hard to see going for anything other than the maximum. Anything less would be a PR fiasco.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @songbird

    , @S
    @songbird


    That wacko überfreak that Biden hired for the energy department recently stole a women’s purse, at an airport.
     
    He looks like one of the Talosians in the very first (albeit ultimately aborted) episode of Star Trek. :-)


    https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-5v8yY4EC1KA/Uv6W4CtBV1I/AAAAAAAAAlc/6MD8sl5GUek/s1600/cage-talosian-718794.jpg


    From the same intended original pilot episode of Star Trek filmed almost exactly 58 years ago in late 1964, it's interesting to see just how healthy people looked then..


    https://alchetron.com/cdn/the-cage-star-trek-the-original-series-bfefbf1b-65d6-4bf7-a7cb-3e86c4749b6-resize-750.jpeg

    Replies: @Yevardian

  706. @silviosilver
    @Barbarossa


    Voting in local elections is usually far more effective than any national races.
     
    Assuming "local" means municipal rather than state, describe some of its successes.

    Replies: @Barbarossa, @Barbarossa

    Out of curiosity, I described some examples of the relative importance of local governments in my other reply. Any feedback on that?

    • Replies: @silviosilver
    @Barbarossa

    Yes, sorry, I wasn't asking frivolously, I was genuinely curious. Just quickly, I am a former libertarian. One of the attractions of libertarianism was the "permission" it gave me to ignore society and its happenings and focus solely on what is of direct interest to me personally. One lingering consequence of that is that I am still very uninvolved in society, and I have little idea of how much of it works in a political context (in the real world, at the personal level). I have often heard claims of "local politics is where it's at," but I have been skeptical because I have been unable to imagine what that would involve (in such a way that it'd benefit my political values and objectives).

    So okay, what you mentioned has helped paint a picture for me. It even seems a little obvious after you described it, and I feel like that's something I should have thought of - but I hadn't. How much of it, though, is a result of local voting - of getting the right party into power - and how much of it is a result of non-political community ties? I think this is an important distinction, because if it's more the result of people belonging to an established community in which "everyone thinks the same", then local elections seem to have less to do with it. If this is the case, then in a larger municipality, one which lacks the tight-knit community ties, in which people emphatically do not think the same way, I doubt it would be able to emulate your town's experience, since even winning the election and getting "your people" into positions of authority would still leave them facing heightened scrutiny and they would be warier of bending the rules to favor their own people. Or maybe they would, if they had a sizeable enough political majority. I'm not sure. Still, I do very much have the impression that what you described is to a good degree more the result of homogeneity rather than political power per se.

    Replies: @Barbarossa

  707. @Yahya
    @Yevardian


    Incidentally I know this from my mother’s side, my father can’t stand any of this stuff, which goes for almost anything except Western Classical Music really. I tried introducing him to Jazz when I was first getting into the genre. Although he didn’t actually hate it, after the novelty wore off he quickly lost interest.
     
    Your father and I are kindred souls; I couldn't listen to any of the stuff you posted. I was actually impressed by the beginning instrumentation of the first Erkin Koray tune; until he started singing in that psychedelic style which I can't stand. I told the Dragon Man before that my musical tastes tends towards the orderly and mundane; never got into jazz, electronic, hip-hop, dance, rock or psychedelic music. My reaction to jazz was pretty much identical to your father's. Perhaps you can recommend the Arabic pieces I posted above, I think he might like some of them.

    From Turkey I am a fan of their classical tradition. I wrote a lengthy post on it to Bashibuzuk here: https://www.unz.com/akarlin/open-thread-198/#comment-5581415

    It's fairly similar to Arabic music, as it is based on the Maqam/Makam/Mugham system utilized by the Arab world, Turkey, and Azerbaijan; though surprisingly it took me a while to get accustomed to it. I cannot comment on the popularity or lack thereof of Anatolian Rock in the Arab world; since i've never listened to any till today, though I was vaguely familiar with the genre. All I know is that i've never heard a Turkish tune being played on TV, radio or in outdoor settings; though Turkish TV shows are ubiquitous on MBC (a pan-Arab TV network watched all over the Arab World). My friends mostly listen to the basest forms of Western music, stuff that make my ears bleed.

    Iran - zero. The cultural separation between Iran and the Arab world is several times greater than with Turkey, perhaps owing to the residual Ottoman influence of the latter. I do not have experiences like you of watching The Lizard or listening to Banan with family; I had to explore Iranian cinema and music by myself. I largely agree with your take on the division between the Semitic and Turco-Persian worlds. I've seen several Israeli renditions of classical Arabic songs, unsurprisingly from the Mizrahim of that country. Though Arabic cultures popularity with Mizrahi seems strange considering the hatred they have for us. I should point out though that some Turks like listening to Arabic music as well; I see them in the comment sections of many Arabic songs. And occasionally I come across Turkish renditions of Arabic songs, such as this tasteful adaptation of Lena Chamamyan's Baali Maak by Selva Erdener:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R18262T-REA&ab_channel=SelvaErdener

    Regarding Turkey and Iran's influence; obviously both of them try to gain favor with the prestige Arab world in their quest to lead the Islamic Ummah. Iran has been more successful, even though it faces a steeper battle given its cultural distance and more importantly, Shia disposition, which puts it at odds with Sunni Arabs in the region. Turkey should have done better considering many Arab elites in places like Egypt and Algeria have recent Turkish ancestry. But Erdogan really played his cards wrong, supporting the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt, opposing Assad in Syria, and picking fights with the Gulf Arab monarchies. Virtually the only "nation" he has any influence over is tiny Qatar. Iran has done well given the poor cards they were dealt, but they too are treated with suspicion and hostility by most of the Arab World, as I demonstrated in my reply to you some months ago.


    I remember going through a phase of listening to Serbian ‘turbofolk, some extremely ‘powerful’ lyrics and musicvideos, though my impression was that only Roki Vulavic had genuine talent as singer.

     

    Lol, these videos seem like self-parodies.

    I'm a huge fan of Balkan folk music. This piece of Bulgarian polyphonic music is exquisite:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UsDtmdWFBxU&ab_channel=CosmicVoicesfromBulgaria

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @Barbarossa

    I’ve been going through your music suggestions from throughout the thread and have been enjoying everything quite a bit, so thanks for sharing those. I have a pretty broad appreciation for any high quality music regardless of extraction, but I tend to not listen to it for a extended periods of time. I’ll be likely to binge on a bunch or your suggestions and connected music for a week or so and perhaps not return to anything like it for many months. I’m not sure why that is, but I suppose that even if I have a great deal of appreciation for something it still doesn’t feel like my “thing”.

    Even if I don’t stick with it I’m enjoying it quite a bit and find it quite obvious that you have discriminating taste.

    At the Melkite church that we often go to their are quite a number of Lebanese and one man in particular who sings in Arabic. It’s quite incredible. In general I find the Middle Eastern music/ singing to be incredibly emotive and rich. It just feels ancient.

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @Barbarossa


    At the Melkite church that we often go to
     
    Yes I remember you mentioning being part of the Melkite Byzantine Catholic Church. I am intrigued though as to how you came about joining this esoteric sect; and why you choose it over more traditionally Irish or American churches?

    quite a number of Lebanese
     
    Lebanese Christians, whether Maronite, Melkite or Orthodox, are something of a Gold Standard among Arabs in that they are a handsome, intelligent people. I'd rank them among the smartest ethnicities worldwide, perhaps only behind the Ashkenazim (who are of course unbeatable on the IQ front). Their success in commercial endeavors across the globe are of course well-known; amazing how many billionaires are of Lebanese descent considering their numerical diminutiveness: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Lebanese_by_net_worth

    But lesser known is the contributions they've made to Arabic culture.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mikhail_Naimy

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elias_Khoury

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amin_Maalouf

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ameen_Rihani

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Butrus_al-Bustani

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nadine_Labaki

    Their peculiarity is hard to explain given they don't look all that different from their Muslim neighbors, and seem to be derived mostly from the same genetic stew as Lebanese Muslims. My working theory is that a combination of Phoenician and Jizya-based selective forces, Jesuit educational influences, and a simple lack of Islamic inhibitiveness is what separates them from the rest. Copts and Assyrians share two of these factors, but they lack the millennia-long child sacrifice practices of Phoenicians, so ultimately aren't as smart or beautiful as the Lebanese.

    I should point that Sunni Lebanese are just as "elite" as Christians in Lebanon; your Hariri's and Mikati's would likely be offended at the notion that they are lesser than Maronites or Melkites. But imo the Sunnis aren't nearly as culturally productive as their Christian counterparts. Lebanese Shiites are mostly simple peasants from the countryside, their contributions seem to be limited to Hezbollah, i'm unaware of any major cultural figure other than Hanan Al-Shaykh.

    If Lebanon had been 90%+ Christian it would probably look something more like France or Spain. On the other hand, it would also be more degenerate and at risk of ethno-racial demolition. Already many Lebanese Christian urban youth are SWPL-lite morons; aping the West in the worst possible ways.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9sroVPh389Q&ab_channel=HibaTawajiVEVO

    So perhaps it is for the better that traditionally-minded Muslims overtook them demographically at this critical juncture.


    It just feels ancient.
     
    Yes but you have to remember that Middle Eastern music was heavily influenced by Western music in the modern period; so is not as ancient or pure as you'd expect. There's this excellent Iranian website which gets into the history of how Iranian music was altered by the Westernizing reforms of Reza Shah Pahlavi during the 20th century: https://saednews.com/en/category/music

    One prominent modification was the addition of Western instruments such as the violin, cello and the piano; and the expansion of the traditional Iranian ensemble into a Western-style orchestra. A further modification was the harmonization of the melody, which began when composers Ali-Naqi Vaziri and Ruhollah Khaleqi investigated the possibility of harmonizing Persian scales while preserving their basic character. Though the use of microtones, the frequent absence of a clear tonic and dominant, and the distinctly modal character of many melodies presented challenges to harmonization; Persian tasnifs now played on Iranian airwaves utilize rudimentary four-part harmony and simple counterpoint.

    You can see the influence of all of the above in the music of Gholam-Hossein Banan:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4PL607ZiiO8&ab_channel=Gholam-HosseinBanan-Topic


    In general I find the Middle Eastern music/ singing to be incredibly emotive and rich.

     

    Thanks, let me know which pieces you liked the most so I can tailor my recommendations. For now I'll attach Near Eastern Christian music since you expressed a liking for the Lebanese Melkite melodies you heard in church.

    1) Wa Habibi

    A famous Good Friday hymn sung by legendary Lebanese singer Fairouz.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qSThyqD3rZ8&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=159&ab_channel=Saintelieantelias

    Many excellent renditions on Youtube:

    Ghada Shbeir (Lebanese Christian): (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NB4_GJqLgLM&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=135&ab_channel=GhadaShbeir)

    Souad Hashem (Lebanese Christian): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mYUUzcB2tOw&t=167s&ab_channel=ArmandoD

    Carla Cahmoun (Lebanese Christian): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NckMXOlYf34&ab_channel=CarlaChamoun

    Rania Ateek (Palestinian Christian): (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Udqr79TuBvo&ab_channel=RaniaAteek)

    Xaris Alexiou (Greek Christian): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JgelvUS9lyg&ab_channel=SocratesDigitalCreations1

    2) Abun Dbashmayo

    A Syriac Lord's Prayer, roughly translated as "Our Father In Heaven", performed by the St. Ephrem Patriarchal Choir of Damascus in Jesus' native tongue. The instrumentation is based on the Maqam Nahawand mode. This one is my personal favorite:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zvbqUY3I5WA&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=195&ab_channel=St.EphremPatriarchalChoir

    Sarah Ego (Assyrian): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_AdPiRWIam0&t=66s&ab_channel=WalterBreitenmoser

    St. Mark's Covenant Jerusalem (Palestinian): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Bo3keay8fw&ab_channel=AnaGodwith

    3) Agni Parthene

    Famous Greek/Byzantine chant, here performed in Arabic by Ribale Wehbé:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bqhen0OfB3E&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=63&ab_channel=RibaleWehb%C3%A9-%D8%B1%D9%8A%D8%A8%D8%A7%D9%84%D9%88%D9%87%D8%A8%D9%87

    Too many renditions to list, practically every country with a Greek Orthodox presence has done a rendition. This one by Serbian vocalist Divna Ljubojevic is my favorite:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RcjwuIx5-nI&ab_channel=Divna%26Mel%CF%8Cdi

    4) Hymn Of The Light

    The hymn was composed by Saint Ephrem of Syria, Doctor of the Church from 306-373 AD, and one of the most notable hymnographers of Eastern Christianity. He was born in the Roman province of Mesopotamia, in a city which had a complex ethnic composition, consisting of Assyrians, Arabs, Greeks, Jews, Parthians, Romans, and Iranians. He is considered a patron of the Syriac people in the Greater Syrian Christian tradition.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0A1NVTLirM&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=185&t=156s&ab_channel=MUSINGS153

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

  708. @showmethereal
    @Mr. Hack

    So you are completely ignoring the fact that ethnic Russians and those with Russian sympathies in eastern Ukraine were under literal bombardment since the 2014 coup?? Come on. Are you also claiming the psychopaths who set those people on fire in Odessa back then were “misunderstood” nationalists?? Or are you claiming all the videos were Russian propaganda??

    Replies: @Beckow, @Philip Owen

    They were under bombardment in 2014 and 2015 during the Russian invasion. After that about a dozen people a year stepped on their own mines. You are locked into a propaganda narrative.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Philip Owen

    Then how come NATO weapons wielded by Ukies daily kill civilians now in Donetsk, Gorlovka, Makeevka, and other DPR and LPR cities? Ukies killed about half a dozen children in Donetsk agglomeration in recent weeks. Not to mention that several times in the last two months Ukies used HIMARS rockets to scatter anti-infantry mines in residential areas of DPR towns. These mines killed a few and wounded scores, including children (they look like toys). Are all those dead propaganda? Tell it to mothers of murdered children and come back to report the results.

    Replies: @keypusher

    , @showmethereal
    @Philip Owen

    Civilian areas of Donbass are still being attacked to this day. No military value. But of course you ignore that and yet accuse others of propaganda. That is plain silly. Stop watching CNN and Fox and BBC and DW.

  709. @songbird
    That wacko überfreak that Biden hired for the energy department recently stole a women's purse, at an airport.

    https://twitter.com/MrAndyNgo/status/1597360606533029888?s=20&t=jv1bgXnyf_wCrhPMsmKNNA

    Replies: @A123, @S

    It was not merely a purse. It was checked luggage taken from airport baggage claim. Between bag and contents something like $3,000 of value. The wacko had not even checked a bag, so it is not an “accident”. It is all on video tape.

    … up to five years in prison and $10,000 fine for allegedly taking another person’s luggage …

    It is so egregious, it is hard to see going for anything other than the maximum. Anything less would be a PR fiasco.

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @songbird
    @A123

    Yes, guess it was a "roller bag' - something more like a suitcase than a handbag. Upon reading more about the story, I am weirdly disappointed that it was not stolen during the Thanksgiving rush, which I think would add an extra tragi-comic element to it.


    It is so egregious, it is hard to see going for anything other than the maximum.
     
    One would have to be remarkably deranged to steal something in such an environment with multiple cameras and likely angles.

    I don't see the maximum happening, at all. Progressive elites downplay the significance of normal people having their cars stolen, and that area has got to be super progressive. Wouldn't be surprised if they plea bargain it for some community service, where the freak can work for some evil NGO.

    Replies: @German_reader

  710. @Dmitry
    @songbird

    Although the famous high cuisine (kind of "rich people's food") in France was introduced by an Italian - Catherine de Medici


    Italian food was promoted because of Italian immigration
     
    It seems like many Italian immigrants that go to the food industry, invented new recipes when they are in America, than wanted to continue the traditional Italian kitchen (it would have been more of the peasants' food).

    For example, this recipe of beef in Chicago. Surely, not many people in Italy were eating large parts of beef before the economic miracle there (1960s). That would be very expensive for Italians. Old Italian food is based in more cheap ingredients.

    It likely more of the local Chicago culture, which was famous for meat industry since the 19th century, than people carrying Italian recipes from home.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nojaKlA7MoU

    Replies: @songbird, @AnonfromTN

    wanted to continue the traditional Italian kitchen (it would have been more of the peasants’ food).

    My Sicilian grad student told me that the greatest compliment for an Italian chef is “you cook like my grandmother”.

  711. @A123
    @songbird

    It was not merely a purse. It was checked luggage taken from airport baggage claim. Between bag and contents something like $3,000 of value. The wacko had not even checked a bag, so it is not an "accident". It is all on video tape.

    ... up to five years in prison and $10,000 fine for allegedly taking another person's luggage ...

    It is so egregious, it is hard to see going for anything other than the maximum. Anything less would be a PR fiasco.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @songbird

    Yes, guess it was a “roller bag’ – something more like a suitcase than a handbag. Upon reading more about the story, I am weirdly disappointed that it was not stolen during the Thanksgiving rush, which I think would add an extra tragi-comic element to it.

    It is so egregious, it is hard to see going for anything other than the maximum.

    One would have to be remarkably deranged to steal something in such an environment with multiple cameras and likely angles.

    I don’t see the maximum happening, at all. Progressive elites downplay the significance of normal people having their cars stolen, and that area has got to be super progressive. Wouldn’t be surprised if they plea bargain it for some community service, where the freak can work for some evil NGO.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @songbird


    One would have to be remarkably deranged to steal something in such an environment with multiple cameras and likely angles.
     
    He probably stole it so he could get the woman' underwear or other personal items for some fetish of his.
    Just shows again that a lot of those trannies are potentially dangerous perverts.
  712. @Dmitry
    @silviosilver


    bizarre that a group of friends would prefer to be there alone. “We went to the nightclub
     
    Maybe not if you go to the nightclub to meet women, but if you are with friends or colleagues, even then it is often more pleasant when it is mostly empty except your group. This is also the theme for "VIP" spaces in that industry.

    By the way, think about the experiences which are expensive. Why do wealthy people buy a yacht, instead of going with the Carnival Cruises?

    Yacht goes to the same places as Carnival Cruises, with less luxury, less options for food, less entertainment. Carnival Cruise ship has 50 difference restaurants, but it is full of other people. Yacht is less luxurious than any cruise ship, but it is without the other people.

    Yacht is a private space, which can go to an empty beach, which only has family and staff. Billionaire's yatcht carries the comfortable level of a middle class suburban house to non-human natural spaces.

    It combines the comfortable world of civilization, with the empty world of our ancestors. For most of our history, except a very recent time, our world population was some thousands and our society was around 100 people. The problem in our ancestor's time was the difficulty of nature, as Marx has written.

    But when the difficulty of nature is resolved (e.g. billionaire's yacht), then of course the soul feels more comfortable to go to the empty spaces, than in the Carnival Cruise. It is without this recent, unnatural experience of large numbers of people.

    Most of our ancestors have never experienced a large number of people before around 80 generations in the past. But in tens of thousands of generations our ancestors were living with mostly empty and depopulated planet, seeing less people in all life, than modern people see every day.


    it would definitely feel ‘warmer’ if there were other people there besides my own group. (Unless we were kids and the objective was to run wild,
     
    I've been often in the museums when they are empty or almost empty. It's definitely better if it is a museum with interesting objects, as you are alone with the objects, like they were in your house.

    If it was a bad museum, then you might not want it to be empty, but I'm not sure you enjoy it even with people, unless you are visiting an interesting country. It's true when you are in vacation, even just people watching can become interesting.


    why I specified a couple in love, hoping to imply that they are feeling pretty in love in that moment
     
    Sure, but even a couple not in love, will be feeling a better mood in empty Venice, than Venice full of tourists.

    I'm not talking about "abandoned" in the sense that it is like post-apocalypse. Or "vacation to Vorkuta". But I mean, when it is the same as normal civilization, but without all the people. This is just luxury.

    Replies: @silviosilver

    This is also the theme for “VIP” spaces in that industry.

    The cachet of the VIP section results from its exclusivity, not its seclusion. If it were completely secluded it might still retain some of that cachet (as onlookers enviously wonder what lies behind that door and what it takes to get in), but it wouldn’t be as fun, because occupants would not be able to bask in the envious gaze of those unable to gain access. So the VIP, even if more sparsely populated, indirectly relies on the presence of other people, and would lose its cachet almost completely if there were more people inside the VIP section than outside of it.

    By the way, think about the experiences which are expensive. Why do wealthy people buy a yacht, instead of going with the Carnival Cruises?

    I think I already covered this in my earlier reply: “there are places we go to get away from people and places we go in order to be around them.” For those with the means to afford either, a yacht would fall into the former category, a cruise ship the latter.

    But when the difficulty of nature is resolved (e.g. billionaire’s yacht), then of course the soul feels more comfortable to go to the empty spaces, than in the Carnival Cruise.

    How can you possibly make such a blanket statement? Surely you’ve read enough by now to be aware of individual differences in personality traits, probably the most basic of which – and the most immediately comprehensible to us – is introversion vs extroversion. Surely it shouldn’t be too hard to imagine that some people might find the presence of other people more comforting to the soul than are empty places, at least some of the time.

    Sure, but even a couple not in love, will be feeling a better mood in empty Venice, than Venice full of tourists.

    I have forgotten what we were even talking about and, not to be rude, but I can’t really be bothered going back to check. This statement, however, is so obvious I have a hard time believing I said anything that would suggest I believed otherwise. And if something I said did suggest I believed otherwise, I here and now, before gods and men, formally proclaim that I don’t. 🙂

    • Replies: @Dmitry
    @silviosilver

    I would not expect it is so related to being extrovert or introvert. Extroverts would not dream to emigrate to Japan so they can "enjoy" the overcrowding of the people in Tokyo.

    Or the extroverts would not dislike the most of the world's luxury spaces (mansions, palaces, yachts, private beaches), which as necessary condition for being luxury, because they are empty of people.


    some people might find the presence of other people
     
    Sure, just because the crowds are unnatural for us (until the very recent history), but you can still enjoy it sometimes. You know people like crowding in football games with tens of thousands of fans and hooligans.

    But our vast populations are not a natural situation, not only in a mild way, but by many orders of magnitude.

    We can often see how peoples' brains are confused by applying something which is relevant for our ancestors when world population was a million of times smaller than today. For example, the celebrity culture, where we automatically view in the reflex part of our brain, famous celebrities like they are friends or neighbors.

    Replies: @songbird

  713. @Philip Owen
    @showmethereal

    They were under bombardment in 2014 and 2015 during the Russian invasion. After that about a dozen people a year stepped on their own mines. You are locked into a propaganda narrative.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @showmethereal

    Then how come NATO weapons wielded by Ukies daily kill civilians now in Donetsk, Gorlovka, Makeevka, and other DPR and LPR cities? Ukies killed about half a dozen children in Donetsk agglomeration in recent weeks. Not to mention that several times in the last two months Ukies used HIMARS rockets to scatter anti-infantry mines in residential areas of DPR towns. These mines killed a few and wounded scores, including children (they look like toys). Are all those dead propaganda? Tell it to mothers of murdered children and come back to report the results.

    • Replies: @keypusher
    @AnonfromTN

    No one was dying from shelling between 2015 and Putin's invasion on February 24, 2022. Since then thousands of civilians have died.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  714. @Barbarossa
    @silviosilver

    Out of curiosity, I described some examples of the relative importance of local governments in my other reply. Any feedback on that?

    Replies: @silviosilver

    Yes, sorry, I wasn’t asking frivolously, I was genuinely curious. Just quickly, I am a former libertarian. One of the attractions of libertarianism was the “permission” it gave me to ignore society and its happenings and focus solely on what is of direct interest to me personally. One lingering consequence of that is that I am still very uninvolved in society, and I have little idea of how much of it works in a political context (in the real world, at the personal level). I have often heard claims of “local politics is where it’s at,” but I have been skeptical because I have been unable to imagine what that would involve (in such a way that it’d benefit my political values and objectives).

    So okay, what you mentioned has helped paint a picture for me. It even seems a little obvious after you described it, and I feel like that’s something I should have thought of – but I hadn’t. How much of it, though, is a result of local voting – of getting the right party into power – and how much of it is a result of non-political community ties? I think this is an important distinction, because if it’s more the result of people belonging to an established community in which “everyone thinks the same”, then local elections seem to have less to do with it. If this is the case, then in a larger municipality, one which lacks the tight-knit community ties, in which people emphatically do not think the same way, I doubt it would be able to emulate your town’s experience, since even winning the election and getting “your people” into positions of authority would still leave them facing heightened scrutiny and they would be warier of bending the rules to favor their own people. Or maybe they would, if they had a sizeable enough political majority. I’m not sure. Still, I do very much have the impression that what you described is to a good degree more the result of homogeneity rather than political power per se.

    • Replies: @Barbarossa
    @silviosilver


    I am a former libertarian.
     
    I can commiserate since I found libertarianism to be somewhat attractive in my late teens and early 20's. It seems to be a good thing to grow out of, since it's a neat and tidy ideology that doesn't really reflect much about how the world really works.

    As far as my examples I think it is a combination of non-political community ties and voting, though I would generally weight the former higher. It also entails proper scale for communities. If the municipality is too big then you will lose the direct human connection which makes accommodation more likely.

    At least this is the case in an situation where atomized individual predominates. I'm pretty sure that Sher Singh or my local Amish sawyer can somewhat count on a measure of beneficent treatment from others in their wider in-group, regardless of personal connection. You and me are just individuals though and so we become faceless statistics in a larger setting, and only by finding a small enough receptive community, with at least limited shared values, can we regain a reasonable measure of mutual accommodation.

    But voting is important too, since in the case of a county Sheriff or health department, they probably won't know you personally but they will know the general state of the county. A Sheriff may know that if he sends his men out to aggressively enforce some new gun law out of Albany, he's likely to end up with a shootout, so he may publicly call the law boneheaded and choose to turn a blind eye unless someone is so boneheaded or dangerous that his hand is forced.

    So you have to vote those guys in, vote the guys in that will do the appointing, or run yourself/ encourage other reasonable folks to run. Either way it takes more than just passive community involvement or the whole thing will get overrun by busybodies.

    You absolutely have to have the amenable human capital to make a community run but you also have to be able to deploy it in enough concentration to make a difference.

    Replies: @A123

  715. @Yahya
    @silviosilver


    The thing is, they seem to me to be so closely associated with that culture (or with a particular people/nation) that it creates a barrier for me to completely enjoy it.
     
    I can see where you're coming from with the "cultural barrier" thing. Though I ultimately I don’t agree; for me the barrier is no impediment to enjoying an artistic piece of music. In fact, I find that the intellectual component of "high-art" music makes it easier for me to identify with the piece, because I feel like it is operating on the same wavelength, as opposed to some pop tune designed to appeal to the lowest common denominator. The composer of a classical piece is targeting a tiny subset of the population, whereas a pop musician is aiming too broadly for it to "speak to me", if you get what I mean. Also, a classical piece isn't really designed to get you to identify with it or "join in" the same way a pop song would.

    As you can probably tell, I listen to a lot of folk music from around the world. Folk music is nothing if not ethnically particular, but it doesn't stop me from enjoying it. Now, I do acknowledge that getting into Arabic folk music is a lot easier, and elicits a greater emotional reaction, than listening to foreign folk music. But i've also enjoyed listening to non-Arabic folk music, even from cultures that are immensely distant from my own. Japanese people are as alien to me as they come; yet I have been moved greatly by this tune:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JGbsvxMLkgg&ab_channel=bahpaw

    It's one of my favorite songs of all-time and the first I learned to play on the piano.


    But western culture has been promoting itself as universal culture for so long now, that Wagner becomes accessible in a way he previously wasn’t.
     
    Yes I've heard of the refrain before that Western music is "universal" and belongs to everyone etc. including oddly by Edward Said. I have to disagree completely with that notion; to me it is clear that that genre was developed in a very peculiar place and context which makes it uniquely Western. I also disagree, and to some extent am annoyed, with the premise that Western music is "universal" while everyone else's is just "ethnic" music or lumped into a generic and overly broad "world music" category. Why should East Asian music, which utilizes 5-tone pentatonic scales and simple time divisions, be put in the same category as Middle Eastern music, which uses 7-tone scales and a wide variety of modes and complex time divisions? The two are clearly as different to each other as Western music is to them.

    Much as I enjoy Beethoven or Mozart or Rachmaninov or Szymanowski etc. they aren't really universal musicians, but were forged out of a specific milieu in Europe. Had they born in Indonesia or Egypt or Peru, they would not have composed the music they did. Now it's true that some people from non-Western countries have taken to composing European classical music. But they remain obscure to the vast majority of people in their home countries, practically no-one listens to them (except me!). I don't think European classical music has reached enough of an audience in non-Western nations to truly be classified as universal.


    My question is: is that an Arabic style you recognize, and if so, what is it and what is its origin?
     
    I immediately recognized the outfits and the people - they are Upper Egyptian ("Saidi") peasants. The people who have been tilling the fertile plains of Egypt since the dawn of civilization. They have a unique culture which is quite separate from the urbanized townfolk; which you can immediately tell by their peculiar manner of dress. The music they were playing was Saidi Egyptian folklore. I'm not surprised it fuses well with gypsy music; the clue is in the name.

    I couldn’t really get into them, tbh. Some of them took like three minutes for the vocals to begin. I just don’t have that kind of patience, lol.
     
    Well this whole thread on music just reinforced my notions that musical tastes are too different; it's impossible to guess which songs will resonate with another person. I don't think any of us liked each other's recommendations. My response to the Colombian playlist was roughly similar to yours; the rhythms are neat, nice to listen to, but ultimately I probably won't be going back to listen to them frequently. Perhaps if I force myself I could get into Colombian music the same way I did Indian or Turkish or Japanese music.

    But dammit, I would've been content had you liked at least one of the songs I recommended. But now I'm compelled to give some more suggestions. This time I will try to tailor it to your tastes, given the new information you've presented to me.

    1) Ehzar and Ya Ossas

    Starting off on the pop side, my favorite all-time singer Julia Boutros, whom I hesitated to mention again in my previous comment for fear of beating on a dead horse. But I love her music (at least some of it), have to put in a word. She has two types of songs: 1) nationalistic/patriotic Lebanese or pan-Arab songs and 2) romantic love songs. The former is what I listen to; can't stand the romantic mumbo-jumbo (true of any singer really). But I suppose the "particularism" of her nationalistic songs will put you off, so I'm going to attach two songs of hers, one from each category.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0aGjeb5GpHM&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=22&ab_channel=JuliaBoutros

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xcJqArTAFjE&ab_channel=WATARY

    You'll probably be able to guess which one is which just by quickly listening to the instrumentals.

    2) Ya Zahratan Fi Khayali

    This one is an "Arab tango" originally composed by Syrian Druze émigré Farid Al-Atrash in the 20th century; but performed here by an Armenian singer born in Lebanon:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0kh9xmnxk-E&ab_channel=AzizAllaf

    I like the instrumentation of this rendition much better than the original. There are a surprisingly large number of excellent renditions of this famous song, some of which include:

    Mirna Kassis (Assyrian): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o5R0yIczEBc&ab_channel=MirnaKassis

    Faia Younan (Assyrian): (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WV0IOOinRXk&ab_channel=rihabchahba)

    Aseel Massoud (Syrian): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LqlRNnW2GTs&ab_channel=ATHRODEELAhmad%26Aseel

    Serouj Kradjian (Armenian): (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FfZAYGYKpj8)

    Valdimir Troshin (Russian): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44pqhknYvMI&ab_channel=FaridHQ%D9%81%D8%B1%D9%8A%D8%AF

    3) Ya Rayah

    Over to the Maghreb, a jovial tune by the excellent El Gusto Orchestra; this one I'm sure you will like. Hard not to feel upbeat after listening to this track.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r84MWStOChE&ab_channel=bristol324

    This music belongs to the category of Algerian Chaabi music. The orchestra is comprised of veteran Algerian Muslim and Jewish musicians who were reunited after 50 years of separation owing to the creation of Israel and subsequent flight of Algeria's Jewish population. The creation of the orchestra has led to a rediscovery of their music, a mix of Andalusian and Berber sounds and religious chants which incorporates strong, guttural singing with an accompanying piano, flute, strings and percussion. The resulting sound is remarkably textured and harmonious. The NYT wrote an article on this orchestra here if you're interested: https://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/13/arts/music/algerian-chaabi-musicians-reunite-in-the-band-el-gusto.html

    4) Mabrouk

    Another pop tune, this time by Yemeni singer Balqees:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aa28dxptaR4&ab_channel=Rotana

    Here i'm hoping the percussion will appeal to you as it is roughly similar to Saidi Egyptian folklore. Balqees' music is a cut below Julia's in terms of both the quality of instrumentation and vocal ability. This is evident in their live concerts; the Lebanese singer sounds much better whereas the Yemeni singer requires the aid of a studio sound engineering. Both though are vastly superior to 99% of pop artists around the globe.

    Replies: @silviosilver

    The music they were playing was Saidi Egyptian folklore. I’m not surprised it fuses well with gypsy music; the clue is in the name.

    Have you heard of the “Egyptians” ethnic group in the balkans? I am pretty sure they are just gypsies, but they claim descent from Egyptians (a local variation on the we wuz kangz theme).

    But dammit, I would’ve been content had you liked at least one of the songs I recommended. But now I’m compelled to give some more suggestions.

    I am very moody when it comes to what music and what movies I enjoy. For weeks, sometimes months, at a time I will get into a certain kind of music or certain genre of film and listen/watch almost exclusively that, and then abruptly tire of it and move onto something else, but I always find myself circling back around eventually. I really wouldn’t do justice to your selections to listen to them now, as I’m just not in that kind of mood. Sorry.

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @silviosilver


    Have you heard of the “Egyptians” ethnic group in the balkans?

     

    I've come across them before.

    I'm sure you're also aware of the reverse; Muhammad Ali Pasha was of course an eminent Egypto-Balkanoid.

    I bet you've never heard of these guys though: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magyarab_people

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J-er3THRd8Q&ab_channel=Masaman

    Replies: @Yevardian

  716. Aaron Maté
    @aaronjmate
    ·
    8h
    Western audiences never hear about Ukrainians like Sergei Sivokho, a Zelensky confidante. Sivokho, with Zelensky’s backing, unveiled a peace initiative in 2020. He was attacked by Azov members, who scared Zelensky as well: Sivokho was promptly dismissed.

    [MORE]

  717. @Mikhail

    Nina 🐙 Byzantina
    @NinaByzantina
    Taras Shevchenko is considered one of the founders of modern Ukrainian language. Yet what they won’t tell you is that he admired Russian military leaders and engraved an entire series (here, Suvorov and Potemkin, a founder of Novorossia). Today his admirers remove their statues.
     


    https://twitter.com/NinaByzantina/status/1595973498521808896?cxt=HHwWgMCjpZ3chKYsAAAA

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    Making busts of anybody is not necessarily “admiration”, but more like just fulfilling a business contract. You pay me, and I paint your picture, carve your bust etc, This is another one of your baseless tries at eternal Ukrainian/Russian brotherliness. I prefer a good old fashioned “Averkoism”. Time to bring those back, they always added a certain panache to your writing style! 🙂

  718. @Beckow
    @showmethereal


    ...ignoring the fact that ethnic Russians and those with Russian sympathies in eastern Ukraine were under literal bombardment since the 2014 coup
     
    It is worse, Mr.Hack heartily approved of the bombing and killing. The idiotic point of view that says that a large ethnic group can be destroyed or expelled because they are "Russian" (the horror!) is the mainstream Kiev-West viewpoint. They dance around it, lie, talk about other things - aggression! - all in order not to face the obvious: what the post-Maidan Kiev did to its own Russian population was a crime by any objective standard.

    Their big fear is that once Kiev loses the war it will be discussed openly and they will look like who they are: genocidal maniacs who intentionally provoked a bloody war that they will end up losing. No wonder they worship Bandera (and probably Nazis in private).

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @showmethereal

    Mr.Hack heartily approved of the bombing and killing. The idiotic point of view that says that a large ethnic group can be destroyed or expelled because they are “Russian” (the horror!) is the mainstream Kiev-West viewpoint.

    You’re not only full of BS, but as AP has pointed out on many occasions here, you often lie as well. Show me where I said anything at all like what you’re trying to spread about me here?

    • Replies: @Beckow
    @Mr. Hack

    If you write about a topic and avoid mentioning the bombing of Donbas Russian civilians and the murders in Odessa, but instead ritually repeat Ukie talking points, one can assume that you approved of the bombing. It would be like talking about WW2 without ever mentioning Pearl Harbour or Barbarossa.

    Your one-sidedness speaks for you. Do you denounce what Kiev did after Maidan? You have an opportunity to clarify.

  719. @showmethereal
    @LatW

    Well I can respect your comment then…. But please clarify the “better information” from Eastern Europe would be (I assume the context you mean is Ukraine/Russia)?

    Replies: @LatW

    But please clarify the “better information” from Eastern Europe would be (I assume the context you mean is Ukraine/Russia)?

    Without generalizing and just purely based on Global Times, it is obvious there are some informational gaps there and a lot of sweeping statements. It’s understandable because most Chinese probably don’t have time or interest to delve into it but when you have such a broad sweeping approach you risk running into surprises later (or simply not have accurate information).

    [MORE]

    For example, I saw you mentioning Lviv. It has turned into an idiotic meme that even intelligent people seem to parrot (surprisingly, even after 8 years of war with plenty of information available) because it is convenient. It has very little to do with reality on the ground. The ease with which you threw that out made me think of how I would not want to voice similarly stereotypical (and wrong) statements about your country or culture. But as I said, the onus is on the Ukrainians (and their friends) to inform the Chinese about this.

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @LatW

    Where did you see me mention Lviv??? And you seem to be talking in circles with nothing specific. And you keep bringing up Global Times editorials. That is going in circles. China is not even pro Russian and anti Ukraine. China is not stupid. China is well aware of the 2014 coup. China was heavily invested in developing Ukraine - so to claim they are pro Russia is nonsense. But China knows the same foreign government who stepped in and forced Ukraine to cancel the sale of Motor Sich to a Chinese entity is the same government who wants to use Ukraine as a proxy to fight Russia. China is also well aware of US psyops to compare Ukraine to Taiwan and has repeatedly said openly that is a nonsense comparison. So what is China not getting??? Didn’t you hear?? The US says China hacks every computer system in the world (sarcasm)…. So what is it missing?

    Replies: @LatW

  720. @Dmitry
    @LatW


    Only one solution – Israel
     
    For internal security policy, Israel is not exactly a successful example. They are killed every week in different terrorist attacks. There are politicians in Israel's parliament, who receive over $100,000 salary from taxpayers, who are supporting Hamas. There are female conscripts, working in prisons, who were raped by Palestinian security prisoners, sacrificed by their officers. There are religious cult groups who go to live in territory which could never be legally part of Israel.

    There is an example of the dystopian aspects of European internal law applied to unfinished civil war in the Middle East since 1948, which has fuel of nationalism and Middle East's very strong religions. There are more than 50 years without two-state solution, but even with two-state solution the civil war will continue within Israel.

    This is surely a dystopia.

    If you ignore the civil war, Israel has a mix of the 19th century European political software, which also has predictable positive results like in colonial states of Australia or New Zealand.

    There is English law, proportional representation, free-speech, private property, decentralized/uncensored media. There is some successful anti-corruption policies. There is investment in science* and quite bit of the artistic and academic production for the size of country. There is consumer protection, unionization and worker protection (although not in all industries e.g. construction industry is less like in a developed country).

    Israel is also a population of mostly third world multiracial immigrants (the majority of the Jewish population) who they can assimilate to create a new nationality in a couple generations. But then this "melting pot" is going to a society divided by religion instead. As the "melting pot" of Brazil, is not ending another type of division (in Brazil, class divisions instead of religious divisions).


    -
    *From the view of postsoviet countries, there should be a desire to copy the higher investment in R&D , which China could be attaining. But also places like Germany or Sweden have much higher investment for R&D.

    https://i.imgur.com/u4d5Nv9.jpg

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @LatW

    For internal security policy, Israel is not exactly a successful example.

    But they are. I’ve had a chance to observe close up the security protocol that the Israelis carry out in a formal, but relatively simple and non-threatening environment. It was very thorough (many times more thorough than other states). So this is an approach that can be applied to all sorts of areas in life (in EE, we wouldn’t need to do that in every sphere of life, but it is something to think about).

    But, of course, I didn’t mean it as a literal comparison, I meant the defense policies. I would say the attitude exemplified by Golda Meir would be something worth studying.. And, as I mentioned, a lot of the Israeli problems wouldn’t exist in Ukraine’s case. It was not meant to be taken literally but as a spiritual and defense model. Most importantly, Israel’s enemies do not just want to occupy or limit Israel. They want Israel not to exist.

    • Troll: Yahya, Yevardian
    • Replies: @A123
    @LatW


    Most importantly, Israel’s enemies do not just want to occupy or limit Israel. They want Israel not to exist.
     
    Jewish Palestine is difficult to use as a model case because of your exact point.

    Millions of indigenous Palestinian Jews will die if Israel falls. Due to a number of international failures the actual border (e.g. Jordan River Line), was not properly formalized. The resulting Muslim Occupied Judea & Samaria [MOJS] is an inherently defective construct. The presence of Abbas in the 18th year of his 4 year term is also an absurd situation.

    The need for strong security in Jewish Palestine is driven by multiple, unique circumstances.
    ___

    The dispute between two Orthodox Christian countries does not have similar genocidal consequences.

    How many times have regional borders of various nation states in the region changed over the last 500 years? Ukraine is currently huge in land area, but this is not the only border the nation has ever had.

    More applicable cases for Ukrainian aspirations are Austria, Poland, and Hungary. Those nations once had much more expansive borders. As those grand constructs went away, they became smaller but more cohesive nations.
    ___

    Russia will carry significant costs integrating whatever they obtain in a war ending partition. A peace deal is not a "green light" to future conflict. If anything, it is just the opposite. Putin will have to divert funds from other initiatives to reconstruction. A fair deal saps the resources that could drive additional conflicts.

    PEACE 😇

    , @Dmitry
    @LatW


    security protocol that the Israelis
     
    You can develop effective tactics, as compensation for having not very good strategy. But how long can you compensate for strategic failure with tactical success? You know you have to walk in the metal detector and scan your bags, not just in the airport, not just in the train stations, but when you go to many large shops.

    all sorts of areas in life (in EE, we wouldn’t need to do that in every sphere of lif
     
    I think many things in Israel are not bad examples to follow - the English legal system (which is above the Ottoman legal foundation), proportional representation voting, free/uncensored media, private property rights, public health system, investment in science. Until the 1990s the economy was financially unstable. But after the early 2000s, the authorities have followed relatively responsible fiscal policy, with increasing tax revenue.

    After the 2010s, Israel also begins significant investment in public transport, which is a good sign of not following the American automobile-only development model that has been less criticized in the late 20th century. (https://en.globes.co.il/en/article-can-israel-pivot-from-cars-to-public-transport-1001387134)

    But the positive things from Israel, are usually the things which are not related to the war and conflict, it all requires you to not think too much about that (where the running to bomb shelters will seem only like strategic failure).

  721. @songbird
    @Coconuts

    The Balts certainly seem to have a surplus of ethnocentrism (at least as judged by Western Euro standards), but I would argue perhaps that it is negative, in the sense that it is directed against their historical antagonists, which are not likely to be their future antagonists based on fundamental changes like NATO and nuclear weapons, but which simultaneously might serve to blind them to their future antagonists, who cannot be effectively countered by those things, but rather who might be somewhat enabled by them.

    It is just incident, but witness LatW's evident hostility to AfD and Sudden Death's evident hostility to Le Pen.

    It is said that ethnogenesis is the result of facing the aggression or threats of an outside group. But what if it is not omnidirectional? But unidirectional? Affording a defensive response against only one group?

    Perhaps, like an antibody against one variant of a virus, which, in becoming fixated, impedes the effective response against another variant. Or, maybe, that is not a good analogy...

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @LatW, @Coconuts, @sudden death

    The Balts certainly seem to have a surplus of ethnocentrism (at least as judged by Western Euro standards), but I would argue perhaps that it is negative, in the sense that it is directed against their historical antagonists

    It’s not just negative, there is a positive side, too (mostly internally facing). It is not typically defined by “antagonists”. It’s just there, as in the concept of Dasein. And, btw, a certain response to “antagonists”, as you call them, is healthy. The kind of “antagonists” that you have in mind that are negative also occasionally try to make moves and sometimes receive a response. But there are fewer of those than from the East (for now).

    [MORE]

    It is just incident, but witness LatW’s evident hostility to AfD and Sudden Death’s evident hostility to Le Pen.

    Please, do not extrapolate my posts on all the Baltic people, this is not a forum for mainstream politics or majority ideas. Most Baltic people are democratic and support non-contraversial politics, and do not care much about AfD (even if most of them view non-European immigration negatively, even peaceful and diligent Asians, while accepted, are not considered a “norm”.. btw, most nationalists view AfD quite positively and the Estonian nationalists even met with Le Pen in person and she was greeted by them quite warmly). Under normal circumstances, I’d be amicable towards AfD and would support them wholeheartedly (and, if I were German, would also support them or a similar party financially, even if AfD is a mild party by my standards), just not when their voters lecture to Eastern Europeans about things they have never experienced themselves. I think AfD should focus internally, on problems that have direct relevance to the negative side of the non-Euro immigration. If the AfD doesn’t want to support Ukraine, then this is totally their right and actually in line with their politics. I respect that, but that means they have no say over how Ukraine develops and what Ukraine does. Which is fair, imo.

    The unwritten agreement with Western Europe is that we are amicable and wish well to each other, only in that case we allow the West to have access to our internal policies (or domestic markets). If they side with our enemy (or get paid by him), that ends. I’m speaking generally, not accusing AfD of anything, of course. Not that they should listen even, it’s their country (and, afaik, the AfD are actually eurosceptic so these views are irrelevant – I’m assuming, if AfD were in power, with large masses supporting them, there would be no EU at least in its current form and Eastern policy would hopefully be a minor part of their agenda).

    • Replies: @Yevardian
    @LatW


    Under normal circumstances, I’d be amicable towards AfD and would support them wholeheartedly (and, if I were German, would also support them or a similar party financially, even if AfD is a mild party by my standards), just not when their voters lecture to Eastern Europeans about things they have never experienced themselves. I think AfD should focus internally, on problems that have direct relevance to the negative side of the non-Euro immigration.
     
    Of course, unlike Eastern Euros, Germany really shouldn't lecture others on the perils of a war with Russia, foreign occupation or living under a Communist Regime, things which they have had no experience of themselves.
    , @German_reader
    @LatW


    just not when their voters lecture to Eastern Europeans about things they have never experienced themselves.
     
    Once again: You aren't Ukrainian, your country hasn't been attacked, your country isn't at war (at least not more than the rest of NATO is), and unless Putin or some replacement decides to go for total war with NATO, the Baltic states won't be invaded. The latter risk is not totally non-existent, but still quite small and manageable. It's also something a lot of Germans have experienced. The town I grew up in was near the border with the DDR, the Soviets were literally a few kilometres away (and while I didn't consciously experience the threat, it was still recent enough that in 1990 my father could play some sick joke on me saying "War has started, the Russians are coming"). This was the reality for 40 years, yet most people in West Germany and Western Europe still didn't engage in such unhinged hysterics as you Balts regularly do. There are legitimate concerns about the defense of Eastern NATO members, but when I read your comments, and those of virtually all Baltic politicians, it sounds as if you'd actually like to join in the current war in Ukraine.
    As for AfD, I will freely admit that some of their politicians are rather too pro-Russian and have stupid ideas about some wonderful German-Russian friendship. However, the reality simply is that the total break with Russia that has occurred is economically disastrous for Germany and has led to a serious threat of de-industrialization, so saying "AfD should focus on internal matters" won't do either. An opposition party (which for the foreseeable future is completely frozen out of power anyway) can't avoid these issues totally.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @AP, @Dmitry

    , @songbird
    @LatW


    it’s not just negative, there is a positive side, too (mostly internally facing)
     
    I'm oversimplifying a lot, in trying to make my analogy. I don't think it would be true to say that Irish nationalism was wholly a negative feeling against the English, or English nationalism wholly a negative feeling against the French or Germans, etc. But I do suspect that these negative feelings may have been like rutted wagon tracks, and have impeded a quick readjustment to the threat of mass migration. That the old antagonisms in Western Europe in current times have all the significance of sports rivalries, channeling and subverting the healthy instinct for tribe into outlets acceptable to the regime.

    even if AfD is a mild party by my standards
     
    I don't like their blank-slatist rhetoric myself, but isn't it essentially German law? With the state repression against them, they need to try to accommodate themselves to the system, to appear on any ballot. As I've long said, I suspect that there is no political solution for Germany. That in the distant future, parts of it may end up being annexed, by Poland or Denmark (as improbable as that seems now), with the native Germans welcoming it.

    just not when their voters lecture to Eastern Europeans about things they have never experienced themselves.
     
    I haven't followed the rhetoric too closely, but I suspect that much of it might be a clutzy attempt to verbalize national interests, rather than a desire to lecture.

    If they side with our enemy (or get paid by him), that ends.
     
    historically, neutral countries usually carry out trade, when not impeded by military barriers. This is not tantamount to wanting to sell arms to them, or join their army. It is mostly about serving national interests. (not that I would categorize Western Europe as neutral now). I don't think it is right to categorize it as perfidy. EEs are certainly not ordering their behavior for the maximum benefit of Western Euros - it is more like they want them to adopt their foreign policy, regardless of costs incurred.

    Trade embargoes strike me as an idea that springs from American hegemony. To illustrate the point, we have Zeihan comically saying that the Russians blew up their own pipeline, that the Swedes have the proof, and that America has no choice but to enforce international property norms, and embargo any European country doing business with Russia, whether Europeans want them to or not.

    The kind of “antagonists” that you have in mind that are negative also occasionally try to make moves and sometimes receive a response.
     
    IMO, Russian will never cross NATO's borders.

    Perhaps, you see the potential of some future alliance with Ukraine - something to counter the poz, and see Russia as impeding that, by weakening Ukraine territorially? Of course, I have said that Ukraine appears very pozzed to me now given its per capita, but the future is hard to predict.

    Replies: @LatW

  722. @silviosilver
    @Yahya


    The music they were playing was Saidi Egyptian folklore. I’m not surprised it fuses well with gypsy music; the clue is in the name.
     
    Have you heard of the "Egyptians" ethnic group in the balkans? I am pretty sure they are just gypsies, but they claim descent from Egyptians (a local variation on the we wuz kangz theme).

    But dammit, I would’ve been content had you liked at least one of the songs I recommended. But now I’m compelled to give some more suggestions.
     
    I am very moody when it comes to what music and what movies I enjoy. For weeks, sometimes months, at a time I will get into a certain kind of music or certain genre of film and listen/watch almost exclusively that, and then abruptly tire of it and move onto something else, but I always find myself circling back around eventually. I really wouldn't do justice to your selections to listen to them now, as I'm just not in that kind of mood. Sorry.

    Replies: @Yahya

    Have you heard of the “Egyptians” ethnic group in the balkans?

    I’ve come across them before.

    I’m sure you’re also aware of the reverse; Muhammad Ali Pasha was of course an eminent Egypto-Balkanoid.

    I bet you’ve never heard of these guys though: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magyarab_people

    • Replies: @Yevardian
    @Yahya

    Albanians were disproportionately represented in other areas of the Ottoman Empire too.
    On Egypt, it always struck me that I can't think of a single native Egyptian actually ruling the country from the end of the Pharaohs until Nasser.
    Perhaps I'm missing something, but the Tulunids were Turks, the Fatimids were Berber, Saladin and the Ayyubids were Kurds, Mamluks were mostly Circassian, was there really no indigenous ruler on the Nile for over 2000 years? That history must pose challenges for a suitably patriotic school curriculum.
    Obviously Armenia spent its own millennia facing foreign domination, but there were frequent revolts and periods of local rule as well. It seems the pre-Arab Egyptian culture was assimilated much more quickly than places like Syria, perhaps because Egypt's geography lends itself to total centralised control like nearly no other place. The Islamisation of Egypt is something I'll have to read about sometime.

    Replies: @Yahya

  723. @LatW
    @songbird


    The Balts certainly seem to have a surplus of ethnocentrism (at least as judged by Western Euro standards), but I would argue perhaps that it is negative, in the sense that it is directed against their historical antagonists
     
    It's not just negative, there is a positive side, too (mostly internally facing). It is not typically defined by "antagonists". It's just there, as in the concept of Dasein. And, btw, a certain response to "antagonists", as you call them, is healthy. The kind of "antagonists" that you have in mind that are negative also occasionally try to make moves and sometimes receive a response. But there are fewer of those than from the East (for now).

    It is just incident, but witness LatW’s evident hostility to AfD and Sudden Death’s evident hostility to Le Pen.
     
    Please, do not extrapolate my posts on all the Baltic people, this is not a forum for mainstream politics or majority ideas. Most Baltic people are democratic and support non-contraversial politics, and do not care much about AfD (even if most of them view non-European immigration negatively, even peaceful and diligent Asians, while accepted, are not considered a "norm".. btw, most nationalists view AfD quite positively and the Estonian nationalists even met with Le Pen in person and she was greeted by them quite warmly). Under normal circumstances, I'd be amicable towards AfD and would support them wholeheartedly (and, if I were German, would also support them or a similar party financially, even if AfD is a mild party by my standards), just not when their voters lecture to Eastern Europeans about things they have never experienced themselves. I think AfD should focus internally, on problems that have direct relevance to the negative side of the non-Euro immigration. If the AfD doesn't want to support Ukraine, then this is totally their right and actually in line with their politics. I respect that, but that means they have no say over how Ukraine develops and what Ukraine does. Which is fair, imo.

    The unwritten agreement with Western Europe is that we are amicable and wish well to each other, only in that case we allow the West to have access to our internal policies (or domestic markets). If they side with our enemy (or get paid by him), that ends. I'm speaking generally, not accusing AfD of anything, of course. Not that they should listen even, it's their country (and, afaik, the AfD are actually eurosceptic so these views are irrelevant - I'm assuming, if AfD were in power, with large masses supporting them, there would be no EU at least in its current form and Eastern policy would hopefully be a minor part of their agenda).

    Replies: @Yevardian, @German_reader, @songbird

    Under normal circumstances, I’d be amicable towards AfD and would support them wholeheartedly (and, if I were German, would also support them or a similar party financially, even if AfD is a mild party by my standards), just not when their voters lecture to Eastern Europeans about things they have never experienced themselves. I think AfD should focus internally, on problems that have direct relevance to the negative side of the non-Euro immigration.

    Of course, unlike Eastern Euros, Germany really shouldn’t lecture others on the perils of a war with Russia, foreign occupation or living under a Communist Regime, things which they have had no experience of themselves.

    • LOL: Sher Singh
  724. @German_reader
    @AnonfromTN

    I don't watch Deutsche Welle, or any other German mainstream media.
    Do you have evidence that Zaporizhzhia is clearly pro-Russian? Or do I just have to take your word for it, or believe in that ridiculous pseudo-referendum?

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @LondonBob

    Melitopol is pro Russian. Even Reuters admitted as much a few months ago.

    [MORE]

    • Replies: @AP
    @LondonBob

    You can even find a pro-Russian in Lviv or Warsaw. So?

    Zaporizhia is more pro-Russian than Kherson but less pro-Russian than Donbas. It consistently has been more pro-Ukrainian than pro-Russian (unlike Donbas).

    Here are results for the pro-Russian party in the 2019 parliamentary election (be aware that this support does not equal desire to be annexed by Russia, some party leaders such as Dobkin from Kharkiv are fighting against Russia). In most of Zaporizhia oblast it was 20% to 30%, in one district it was 30% to 40%. In contrast the party got over 50% in much of Donbas.

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/56/%D0%95%D0%BB%D0%B5%D0%BA%D1%82%D0%BE%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%BB%D1%8C%D0%BD%D0%B0_%D0%BF%D1%96%D0%B4%D1%82%D1%80%D0%B8%D0%BC%D0%BA%D0%B0_%D0%BF%D0%B0%D1%80%D1%82%D1%96%D1%97_%D0%9E%D0%9F%D0%97%D0%96_%D0%BD%D0%B0_%D0%9F%D0%B0%D1%80%D0%BB%D0%B0%D0%BC%D0%B5%D0%BD%D1%82%D1%81%D1%8C%D0%BA%D0%B8%D1%85_%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B1%D0%BE%D1%80%D0%B0%D1%85_%D0%B2_%D0%A3%D0%BA%D1%80%D0%B0%D1%97%D0%BD%D1%96_2019_%D1%80%D0%BE%D0%BA%D1%83.svg

  725. @Yahya
    @silviosilver


    Have you heard of the “Egyptians” ethnic group in the balkans?

     

    I've come across them before.

    I'm sure you're also aware of the reverse; Muhammad Ali Pasha was of course an eminent Egypto-Balkanoid.

    I bet you've never heard of these guys though: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magyarab_people

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J-er3THRd8Q&ab_channel=Masaman

    Replies: @Yevardian

    Albanians were disproportionately represented in other areas of the Ottoman Empire too.
    On Egypt, it always struck me that I can’t think of a single native Egyptian actually ruling the country from the end of the Pharaohs until Nasser.
    Perhaps I’m missing something, but the Tulunids were Turks, the Fatimids were Berber, Saladin and the Ayyubids were Kurds, Mamluks were mostly Circassian, was there really no indigenous ruler on the Nile for over 2000 years? That history must pose challenges for a suitably patriotic school curriculum.
    Obviously Armenia spent its own millennia facing foreign domination, but there were frequent revolts and periods of local rule as well. It seems the pre-Arab Egyptian culture was assimilated much more quickly than places like Syria, perhaps because Egypt’s geography lends itself to total centralised control like nearly no other place. The Islamisation of Egypt is something I’ll have to read about sometime.

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @Yevardian


    On Egypt, it always struck me that I can’t think of a single native Egyptian actually ruling the country from the end of the Pharaohs until Nasser.
     
    Yes well Egypt’s fecklessness in the face of foreign occupiers is legendary; perhaps only rivaled by India. Apart from some failed rebellions here and there; Egyptians pretty much acquiesced to rule by non-natives for almost 2,300 years until Nasser’s overthrow of King Farouk. Most nations can’t even trace their history back 2,300 years.

    OTOH, Iran was likewise ruled by non-natives for a long period of time, maybe 1,200-1,300 years. The Pahlavi ruling dynasty of the 20th century was the first Persian ruling house of all Iran since the fall of the Sassanids in 650. So Egypt is not unique in the Islamic world. This has to do with Islam's peculiar ability to put religious identity ahead of ethnic identity, which i'll get to below.


    That history must pose challenges for a suitably patriotic school curriculum.
     
    Not really; most Egyptians tend to take a philosophical approach to these things. I remember being taught about Muhammad Ali Pasha’s reign in school in a very positive sense, also some lesser known Mamluk rulers like Baybars (Turkic Sultan who defeated Crusaders at famous battle of Ain Jalut), Qaitbay (Circassian Sultan who built spectacular architectural monuments across major cities of the Middle East), and Shajar al-Durr (slave girl of possible Bedouin, Circassian, Greek, Armenian or Turkic origin who rose to the throne of Egypt).

    Saladin is of course considered a national hero; his citadel sitting atop a hill overlooking the Old Cairo. There's also a mosque built by and named after Muhammad Ali within the confines of the citadel.


    https://www.cgarchitect.com/rails/active_storage/representations/proxy/eyJfcmFpbHMiOnsibWVzc2FnZSI6IkJBaHBBbkY3IiwiZXhwIjpudWxsLCJwdXIiOiJibG9iX2lkIn19--0a95fe9e0d491d3a0a201c5565ccdca40fba7b43/eyJfcmFpbHMiOnsibWVzc2FnZSI6IkJBaDdCem9VY21WemFYcGxYM1J2WDJ4cGJXbDBXd2RwQWxZRk1Eb0tjMkYyWlhKN0Jqb01jWFZoYkdsMGVXbGsiLCJleHAiOm51bGwsInB1ciI6InZhcmlhdGlvbiJ9fQ==--a140f81341e053a34b77dbf5e04e777cacb11aff/9dd882a7.jpg


    All of the above were viewed positively in my textbooks. The reason for this is simple. They were Muslims, which to many Egyptians takes precedence over their ethnic origins. I remember talking to my friend one time and he was saying "how the British colonial rule set Egypt back etc." and I responded by saying the Turks ruled Egypt for longer before the British did, he replied "yeah but these people are Arabs", by which he meant they were Muslims so it's fine. Not all Egyptians take this approach of course; some Arab nationalists believe the Turks are to blame for our decline. But the general view in Egypt is that non-ethnic Egyptian rulers were "our own" in a meaningful manner as long as they are Muslims. Copts may take a different view though.

    There's one exception to the Muslim rule, which is Cleopatra. Her name is plastered across several streets, buildings, hospitals, restaurants, corporations etc. all over Egypt. She is far and away the most celebrated Egyptian ruler over here. Probably not many Egyptians are even aware of her Greek/Macedonian background; she's viewed as "our own" queen. And I don't see why not really, she may have been Greek but Egypt gave her her name; somehow I doubt she would have achieved the everlasting fame she did had she stayed in Greece.

    Re, Muhammad Ali Pasha: he was definitely a capable, imaginative ruler and did much to industrialize Egypt and bring her back to prominence after a long period of obscurity under Ottoman rule. Still, his ambition got the better of him and he overshot by attempting to march on Constantinople. Perhaps it was a good decision at the time, for it is likely he would have succeeded had the British not intervened. Still, definitely not a good idea to take on the big dogs in such a manner. His taxation and conscription policies in Syria also backfired spectacularly. Personally I agree with George Antonious when he wrote that Muhammad Ali's son Ibrahim Pasha was the better of the two. The former seemed to be driven solely by personal ambition, while the latter had a genuine respect for Arabs and regarded himself as one, as was noted by French envoys to Egypt.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @Yevardian

  726. @AnonfromTN
    @showmethereal


    I saw where people in Kherson region were glad at the integration of the healthcare system to Russian standards….
     
    As far as I know (from relatives living in Ukraine), Ukrainian healthcare is now below the level of poor African countries. I have no personal experience with current RF healthcare system. A few years ago during her visit there my wife broke her hand. They set it for free at the local emergency room. When upon return she saw an American doctor, he said that everything was done right, there is nothing else that needs to be done. Considering how much they would charge for that in the US, her good quality free treatment was remarkable.

    I saw many young people in the Donbass region saying it would make it was for them to go to university in Russia. But of course I would assume Russia would want them to return to help develop the region. Correct?
     
    My knowledge in this area is spotty. I know that some years ago Donbass switched to Russian handbooks in schools and colleges and Russia recognized LPR and DPR school and college diplomas (could not do that when they used pathetic Ukrainian handbooks). Young people could go to Russian colleges after school even back then, but there might have been bureaucratic issues. In Russian colleges there are two tracks: tuition is free for those who get good scores on entrance exams, whereas those with poorer (but not failing) scores could get in for a fee (it is still peanuts compared to outrageous tuition costs in the US).

    I know that in the RF the mobilization of college students was prohibited, whereas LPR and DPR mobilized college students. Recently Putin issued a decree that college students in LPR and DPR should be demobilized and return to their studies.

    I think the RF government will provide some incentives for college graduates to return to LPR and DPR (as well as incentives for specialists from other Russian regions to go there), but I don’t think this will be mandatory. After all, now that these are Russian regions, local people have the same rights as all Russian citizens: they are free to go anywhere.

    Replies: @showmethereal, @LondonBob

    Rostov and Sochi are the fastest growing Russian cities, the infrastructure in Novorossiya will need upgrading, but I have no doubt these areas will attract the people who make these areas thrive.

  727. @A123
    @German_reader

    Why do both sides believe that Zaporizhzhia Oblast and Kherson Oblast are uniform?

    It is not hard to consider solutions that divides Kherson Oblast using the Dnieper. A division of Zaporizhzhia Oblast does not have such an obvious geographic feature, but a North/South split is quite plausible.

    If people know what the final lines will be, then moving to "their" side is practical for a portion of the population.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @LondonBob

    Partition is sensible, there will inevitably be some people moving from one to the other, in the Reuters piece on Melitopol there was a woman who moved from Western Ukraine to liberated Melitopol. Homogenous ethno-states work best.

    • Thanks: A123
  728. German_reader says:
    @LatW
    @songbird


    The Balts certainly seem to have a surplus of ethnocentrism (at least as judged by Western Euro standards), but I would argue perhaps that it is negative, in the sense that it is directed against their historical antagonists
     
    It's not just negative, there is a positive side, too (mostly internally facing). It is not typically defined by "antagonists". It's just there, as in the concept of Dasein. And, btw, a certain response to "antagonists", as you call them, is healthy. The kind of "antagonists" that you have in mind that are negative also occasionally try to make moves and sometimes receive a response. But there are fewer of those than from the East (for now).

    It is just incident, but witness LatW’s evident hostility to AfD and Sudden Death’s evident hostility to Le Pen.
     
    Please, do not extrapolate my posts on all the Baltic people, this is not a forum for mainstream politics or majority ideas. Most Baltic people are democratic and support non-contraversial politics, and do not care much about AfD (even if most of them view non-European immigration negatively, even peaceful and diligent Asians, while accepted, are not considered a "norm".. btw, most nationalists view AfD quite positively and the Estonian nationalists even met with Le Pen in person and she was greeted by them quite warmly). Under normal circumstances, I'd be amicable towards AfD and would support them wholeheartedly (and, if I were German, would also support them or a similar party financially, even if AfD is a mild party by my standards), just not when their voters lecture to Eastern Europeans about things they have never experienced themselves. I think AfD should focus internally, on problems that have direct relevance to the negative side of the non-Euro immigration. If the AfD doesn't want to support Ukraine, then this is totally their right and actually in line with their politics. I respect that, but that means they have no say over how Ukraine develops and what Ukraine does. Which is fair, imo.

    The unwritten agreement with Western Europe is that we are amicable and wish well to each other, only in that case we allow the West to have access to our internal policies (or domestic markets). If they side with our enemy (or get paid by him), that ends. I'm speaking generally, not accusing AfD of anything, of course. Not that they should listen even, it's their country (and, afaik, the AfD are actually eurosceptic so these views are irrelevant - I'm assuming, if AfD were in power, with large masses supporting them, there would be no EU at least in its current form and Eastern policy would hopefully be a minor part of their agenda).

    Replies: @Yevardian, @German_reader, @songbird

    just not when their voters lecture to Eastern Europeans about things they have never experienced themselves.

    Once again: You aren’t Ukrainian, your country hasn’t been attacked, your country isn’t at war (at least not more than the rest of NATO is), and unless Putin or some replacement decides to go for total war with NATO, the Baltic states won’t be invaded. The latter risk is not totally non-existent, but still quite small and manageable. It’s also something a lot of Germans have experienced. The town I grew up in was near the border with the DDR, the Soviets were literally a few kilometres away (and while I didn’t consciously experience the threat, it was still recent enough that in 1990 my father could play some sick joke on me saying “War has started, the Russians are coming”). This was the reality for 40 years, yet most people in West Germany and Western Europe still didn’t engage in such unhinged hysterics as you Balts regularly do. There are legitimate concerns about the defense of Eastern NATO members, but when I read your comments, and those of virtually all Baltic politicians, it sounds as if you’d actually like to join in the current war in Ukraine.
    As for AfD, I will freely admit that some of their politicians are rather too pro-Russian and have stupid ideas about some wonderful German-Russian friendship. However, the reality simply is that the total break with Russia that has occurred is economically disastrous for Germany and has led to a serious threat of de-industrialization, so saying “AfD should focus on internal matters” won’t do either. An opposition party (which for the foreseeable future is completely frozen out of power anyway) can’t avoid these issues totally.

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @German_reader

    LatW is entitled to voice any opinion that he feels is necessary to make. I consider him to be one of the better commentators here at this blog, being able to hold his own in conversations with any of the better commentators at this blog, including yourself, Bashibusuk, AP etc. He has a wide breadth of knowledge and offers interesting opinions on a wide range of topics.

    He really does know an awful lot about Ukraine, its history, culture etc. When I first started to correspond with him here, I actually thought that he was Ukrainian, or at least that he lives (or has lived) in Ukraine. A Balt's opinion is every bit as valid as a Germans, IMHO.

    Replies: @German_reader, @Yahya, @Wokechoke

    , @AP
    @German_reader


    The town I grew up in was near the border with the DDR, the Soviets were literally a few kilometres away (and while I didn’t consciously experience the threat, it was still recent enough that in 1990 my father could play some sick joke on me saying “War has started, the Russians are coming”). This was the reality for 40 years, yet most people in West Germany and Western Europe still didn’t engage in such unhinged hysterics as you Balts regularly do
     
    The Balts experienced mass deportation, mass murder, and mass importation of colonists. As a West German, your experience of the Soviet nightmare is a tiny fraction of that of a Balt. An East Prussian or Danziger could relate, but those guys had voted for Nazis en masse so there is some reason for their tragedy a they might be understandably quiet about it, whereas Balts are just victims (certainly for Lithuanians and Estonians, the issue of the Latvian Red Right Rifles is a bit more complicated).

    when I read your comments, and those of virtually all Baltic politicians, it sounds as if you’d actually like to join in the current war in Ukraine
     
    A weak Russia means safety for the Baltic republics. It may be exaggeration to say Ukraine is keeping “all of Europe” safe but it’s is certainly keeping Eastern and Northern Europe safe. There is a reason why Poles, Balts, Finns and Swedes are Ukraine’s strongest supporters in Europe. All these countries are close to Russia.

    Replies: @German_reader

    , @Dmitry
    @German_reader


    people in West Germany and Western Europe still didn’t engage in such unhinged hysterics as you Balts
     
    It is not really similar, as Germany is not part of the Russian Empire/Soviet Union.

    Baltic countries. These are recent and important parts of the Russian Empire/Soviet Union. They should be (from the recent history view) part of Russia, if the power has not collapsed.

    Not in their culture or their right for self-determination, but their recent political situation - they are rebel provinces, that have been successful rebels for a very recent time (30 years is little time in world history).

    Germany has a different history, not as part of Russia, or even the independence foreign occupation. Its national project was the effective unification of those different states which has been confederated part of Holy Roman Empire.

    But Latvia, Estonia, Lithuania, they are rebelling against their master successfully and it's not surprising the national fear, or the main national project is to fight against, a scenario where they will return to their old master.

    Maybe in their national unconscious they dream they are wives of a Sultan, who have escaped from the palace. This escape is the national attainment of recent times. So of course, the fear is to be captured again by their husband and return to their old life.

    @MrHack


    LatW is entitled to voice any.. He really does know an awful lot about Ukraine, its history,
     
    Well they are not a foreigner for this war. They are one of the few people here who is a former compatriot of both Putin and Zelensky, born in the USSR. Excluding the political views, they are also a rusofil, that has more rosy view of all the postsoviet world than most sensible people.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

  729. German_reader says:
    @songbird
    @A123

    Yes, guess it was a "roller bag' - something more like a suitcase than a handbag. Upon reading more about the story, I am weirdly disappointed that it was not stolen during the Thanksgiving rush, which I think would add an extra tragi-comic element to it.


    It is so egregious, it is hard to see going for anything other than the maximum.
     
    One would have to be remarkably deranged to steal something in such an environment with multiple cameras and likely angles.

    I don't see the maximum happening, at all. Progressive elites downplay the significance of normal people having their cars stolen, and that area has got to be super progressive. Wouldn't be surprised if they plea bargain it for some community service, where the freak can work for some evil NGO.

    Replies: @German_reader

    One would have to be remarkably deranged to steal something in such an environment with multiple cameras and likely angles.

    He probably stole it so he could get the woman’ underwear or other personal items for some fetish of his.
    Just shows again that a lot of those trannies are potentially dangerous perverts.

    • Agree: songbird
  730. @songbird
    @Coconuts

    The Balts certainly seem to have a surplus of ethnocentrism (at least as judged by Western Euro standards), but I would argue perhaps that it is negative, in the sense that it is directed against their historical antagonists, which are not likely to be their future antagonists based on fundamental changes like NATO and nuclear weapons, but which simultaneously might serve to blind them to their future antagonists, who cannot be effectively countered by those things, but rather who might be somewhat enabled by them.

    It is just incident, but witness LatW's evident hostility to AfD and Sudden Death's evident hostility to Le Pen.

    It is said that ethnogenesis is the result of facing the aggression or threats of an outside group. But what if it is not omnidirectional? But unidirectional? Affording a defensive response against only one group?

    Perhaps, like an antibody against one variant of a virus, which, in becoming fixated, impedes the effective response against another variant. Or, maybe, that is not a good analogy...

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @LatW, @Coconuts, @sudden death

    The Balts certainly seem to have a surplus of ethnocentrism (at least as judged by Western Euro standards), but I would argue perhaps that it is negative, in the sense that it is directed against their historical antagonists, which are not likely to be their future antagonists based on fundamental changes like NATO and nuclear weapons, but which simultaneously might serve to blind them to their future antagonists, who cannot be effectively countered by those things, but rather who might be somewhat enabled by them.

    There is the angle that the Baltic nations have had much more exposure to the authoritarian side of progressivism in their recent history, and much of this is also applicable to the ways mass-immigration from outside Europe is promoted and normalised in a society, at least when the left-wing are doing it. I can’t speak any Baltic languages but from some of the academics I have heard discussing the Soviet era in English, they are similar to the level of the Poles in their analysis, which is deeper than what you usually encounter in mainstream in the West.

    It means I don’t think their progressives will find as easy to gain cultural hegemony as ours have, I think LatW has mentioned this in the past as well.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Coconuts

    I hope it is so, but I'm not sure how effective or permanent such things are, the the face of rising GDP. We are already over 30 years out from the fall of communism in Eastern Europe. Surely there may be some generational memory that weakens.

    It seems like Germans (or what passes for them) are no longer hypervigilant about saving and inflation. Meanwhile, there is something comical in the meaning of corrupt parties in Ireland: Fianna Fáil (soldiers of destiny), Sinn Féin (we ourselves).

    IMO, Eastern Europe's best chances are in simply observing the decline.

    Replies: @Coconuts

  731. @Coconuts
    @showmethereal


    Make no mistake – I am against illegal migration. But I understand cause and effect. I also understand the God given principle that governs all of creation which is – sowing and reaping.
     
    I think it's interesting to think about what error or mistake God might be exacting justice on these countries for...

    A dominant political belief in say France or Britain is that in an ideal world an individual's hereditary national or ethnic identity should not shape and determine their lives in either positive or negative ways. People holding this view are rather against hereditary influences and inherited differences in wealth, power etc. between nations.

    (This may not be the actual cause of their immigration policies, just on the surface a lot of people ostensibly hold these views.)

    This is one reason they promote high levels of migration; it will break down distinctions between nations and make populations more equal.

    But superficially God's judgement on this seems to be 'if you believe in these egalitarian fictions your population will go extinct, or at least reduced to a remanent, and all the territory and resources will pass into the hands of people and other nations in perpetuity'.

    God's justice seems kind of based if they are going to be punished for believing in that error.

    Replies: @A123, @showmethereal

    I am separating the process of legal migration- which any country can make laws however they want (a country is free to allow little to no legal migration) vs having to deal with human waves of displaced people because of destabilization.

    For instance there are those who complain about foreign students or visas given to foreign workers. I make no judgments on those who want to close down those visas. Whether it benefits their society or not is a different issue. Complete different issues. I saw on the news many Americans dismayed by the increasing waves of Venezuelan people after the US has tried to crush the society and government. They want them to revolt. But they rather migrate rather than start a civil war – especially since many know the US is the one who strangled their country in the first place. Same with all the refugees from Afghanistan and Iraq and Syria and those flooding through a decimated Libya. On and on and on….

    Those are caused by decisions made by higher ups to cause destruction and they are reaping the fruits of what they did. If democracy works as people claim then they should be voted out. But most people have zero clue as to the roots of the problem.

  732. @Beckow
    @AP


    ...Reversal of those gains should be a minimal requirement for peace.
     
    Kiev is not in a position to reverse it militarily, e.g. Mariupol, Azov coast...if you want peace Kiev will have to negotiate. It is heading to either a prolonged bloody stalemate or a new Russian attack with Kiev collapsing out of cumulative destruction.

    You can't dictate to the other side if you are losing on the ground. You live in a temporary bubble of 'success' without understanding that strategically nothing has changed: Russia is still much stronger. Plebiscites are a non-starter, the two sides don't trust each other and there are no neutral observers. Who would vote and who would count? It is a few years late for that.


    ...taken out of the seized reserves and assets
     
    Another fantasy. The Western assets in Russia - they have also been frozen - exceed Russia's 'financial deposits' in the West. It is $300 trillion against $500+ trillion in Western assets in Russia. Western assets are real: oil, gas, minerals, factories... vs. electronic 'money' and bonds. Exxon, Total, BP... would have to be compensated first - they lost huge wealth with potential to grow.

    A story in finance is that Russia intentionally left some reserves in the West to goad the eager Westerners into freezing it. That allowed Russia to reciprocate and freeze more valuable Western investments in Russia. Given Putin's legalism Russia wanted an excuse. Not sure it is true, but that's the way it has played out. You are suggesting that Kiev in effect be compensated from BP, Exxon, Japanese... and their lost Russian assets. Do you think they will agree? (Maybe...it is all about geo-politics now, business be damned.)

    It is a loss-loss and it undermines international finance, back to Middle Ages...do you think money people like going back to Middle Ages so you can forbid Russian language in Donbas schools and have Nato prance around Black Sea steppes?

    Replies: @AP, @showmethereal

    Western governments know that if you met it out – western assets in Russia are more valuable than the seized Russian reserves in the west. But of course the easily fooled sheep don’t get it. And yeah it absolutely was a master play because it will give a basis.. “you took our stuff so we take yours”.

  733. @Barbarossa
    @Yahya

    I've been going through your music suggestions from throughout the thread and have been enjoying everything quite a bit, so thanks for sharing those. I have a pretty broad appreciation for any high quality music regardless of extraction, but I tend to not listen to it for a extended periods of time. I'll be likely to binge on a bunch or your suggestions and connected music for a week or so and perhaps not return to anything like it for many months. I'm not sure why that is, but I suppose that even if I have a great deal of appreciation for something it still doesn't feel like my "thing".

    Even if I don't stick with it I'm enjoying it quite a bit and find it quite obvious that you have discriminating taste.

    At the Melkite church that we often go to their are quite a number of Lebanese and one man in particular who sings in Arabic. It's quite incredible. In general I find the Middle Eastern music/ singing to be incredibly emotive and rich. It just feels ancient.

    Replies: @Yahya

    At the Melkite church that we often go to

    Yes I remember you mentioning being part of the Melkite Byzantine Catholic Church. I am intrigued though as to how you came about joining this esoteric sect; and why you choose it over more traditionally Irish or American churches?

    quite a number of Lebanese

    Lebanese Christians, whether Maronite, Melkite or Orthodox, are something of a Gold Standard among Arabs in that they are a handsome, intelligent people. I’d rank them among the smartest ethnicities worldwide, perhaps only behind the Ashkenazim (who are of course unbeatable on the IQ front). Their success in commercial endeavors across the globe are of course well-known; amazing how many billionaires are of Lebanese descent considering their numerical diminutiveness: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Lebanese_by_net_worth

    But lesser known is the contributions they’ve made to Arabic culture.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mikhail_Naimy

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elias_Khoury

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amin_Maalouf

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ameen_Rihani

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Butrus_al-Bustani

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nadine_Labaki

    Their peculiarity is hard to explain given they don’t look all that different from their Muslim neighbors, and seem to be derived mostly from the same genetic stew as Lebanese Muslims. My working theory is that a combination of Phoenician and Jizya-based selective forces, Jesuit educational influences, and a simple lack of Islamic inhibitiveness is what separates them from the rest. Copts and Assyrians share two of these factors, but they lack the millennia-long child sacrifice practices of Phoenicians, so ultimately aren’t as smart or beautiful as the Lebanese.

    I should point that Sunni Lebanese are just as “elite” as Christians in Lebanon; your Hariri’s and Mikati’s would likely be offended at the notion that they are lesser than Maronites or Melkites. But imo the Sunnis aren’t nearly as culturally productive as their Christian counterparts. Lebanese Shiites are mostly simple peasants from the countryside, their contributions seem to be limited to Hezbollah, i’m unaware of any major cultural figure other than Hanan Al-Shaykh.

    If Lebanon had been 90%+ Christian it would probably look something more like France or Spain. On the other hand, it would also be more degenerate and at risk of ethno-racial demolition. Already many Lebanese Christian urban youth are SWPL-lite morons; aping the West in the worst possible ways.

    So perhaps it is for the better that traditionally-minded Muslims overtook them demographically at this critical juncture.

    It just feels ancient.

    Yes but you have to remember that Middle Eastern music was heavily influenced by Western music in the modern period; so is not as ancient or pure as you’d expect. There’s this excellent Iranian website which gets into the history of how Iranian music was altered by the Westernizing reforms of Reza Shah Pahlavi during the 20th century: https://saednews.com/en/category/music

    One prominent modification was the addition of Western instruments such as the violin, cello and the piano; and the expansion of the traditional Iranian ensemble into a Western-style orchestra. A further modification was the harmonization of the melody, which began when composers Ali-Naqi Vaziri and Ruhollah Khaleqi investigated the possibility of harmonizing Persian scales while preserving their basic character. Though the use of microtones, the frequent absence of a clear tonic and dominant, and the distinctly modal character of many melodies presented challenges to harmonization; Persian tasnifs now played on Iranian airwaves utilize rudimentary four-part harmony and simple counterpoint.

    You can see the influence of all of the above in the music of Gholam-Hossein Banan:

    In general I find the Middle Eastern music/ singing to be incredibly emotive and rich.

    Thanks, let me know which pieces you liked the most so I can tailor my recommendations. For now I’ll attach Near Eastern Christian music since you expressed a liking for the Lebanese Melkite melodies you heard in church.

    [MORE]

    1) Wa Habibi

    A famous Good Friday hymn sung by legendary Lebanese singer Fairouz.

    Many excellent renditions on Youtube:

    Ghada Shbeir (Lebanese Christian): (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NB4_GJqLgLM&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=135&ab_channel=GhadaShbeir)

    Souad Hashem (Lebanese Christian):

    Carla Cahmoun (Lebanese Christian):

    Rania Ateek (Palestinian Christian): (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Udqr79TuBvo&ab_channel=RaniaAteek)

    Xaris Alexiou (Greek Christian):

    2) Abun Dbashmayo

    A Syriac Lord’s Prayer, roughly translated as “Our Father In Heaven”, performed by the St. Ephrem Patriarchal Choir of Damascus in Jesus’ native tongue. The instrumentation is based on the Maqam Nahawand mode. This one is my personal favorite:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zvbqUY3I5WA&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=195&ab_channel=St.EphremPatriarchalChoir

    Sarah Ego (Assyrian):

    St. Mark’s Covenant Jerusalem (Palestinian):

    3) Agni Parthene

    Famous Greek/Byzantine chant, here performed in Arabic by Ribale Wehbé:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bqhen0OfB3E&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=63&ab_channel=RibaleWehb%C3%A9-%D8%B1%D9%8A%D8%A8%D8%A7%D9%84%D9%88%D9%87%D8%A8%D9%87

    Too many renditions to list, practically every country with a Greek Orthodox presence has done a rendition. This one by Serbian vocalist Divna Ljubojevic is my favorite:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RcjwuIx5-nI&ab_channel=Divna%26Mel%CF%8Cdi

    4) Hymn Of The Light

    The hymn was composed by Saint Ephrem of Syria, Doctor of the Church from 306-373 AD, and one of the most notable hymnographers of Eastern Christianity. He was born in the Roman province of Mesopotamia, in a city which had a complex ethnic composition, consisting of Assyrians, Arabs, Greeks, Jews, Parthians, Romans, and Iranians. He is considered a patron of the Syriac people in the Greater Syrian Christian tradition.

    • Thanks: Mr. Hack
    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @Yahya


    Copts and Assyrians share two of these factors, but they lack the millennia-long child sacrifice practices of Phoenicians, so ultimately aren’t as smart or beautiful as the Lebanese.
     
    Could you further explain how "millenia-long child sacrifices" practiced by the Phoenicians could possibly have a positive influence on the Lebanese acquiring a "Gold Standard" among Arabs?

    I lived in the same neighborhood that included Lebanese Christians in Minneapolis and regret not having delved more deeply into their unique culture, aside from frequenting their local bars, restaurants and delis. While they were building their large and beautiful Marionite church in Mpls, they were allowed to hold services within the equally beautiful Ukrainian Catholic Church in the same neighborhood, just down the street:

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/65/St._Maron%27s_Minneapolis_2.jpg/800px-St._Maron%27s_Minneapolis_2.jpg?20100510160701

    https://i.ibb.co/DYKQNkM/front3-1.jpg
  734. @LatW
    @Dmitry


    For internal security policy, Israel is not exactly a successful example.
     
    But they are. I've had a chance to observe close up the security protocol that the Israelis carry out in a formal, but relatively simple and non-threatening environment. It was very thorough (many times more thorough than other states). So this is an approach that can be applied to all sorts of areas in life (in EE, we wouldn't need to do that in every sphere of life, but it is something to think about).

    But, of course, I didn't mean it as a literal comparison, I meant the defense policies. I would say the attitude exemplified by Golda Meir would be something worth studying.. And, as I mentioned, a lot of the Israeli problems wouldn't exist in Ukraine's case. It was not meant to be taken literally but as a spiritual and defense model. Most importantly, Israel's enemies do not just want to occupy or limit Israel. They want Israel not to exist.

    Replies: @A123, @Dmitry

    Most importantly, Israel’s enemies do not just want to occupy or limit Israel. They want Israel not to exist.

    Jewish Palestine is difficult to use as a model case because of your exact point.

    Millions of indigenous Palestinian Jews will die if Israel falls. Due to a number of international failures the actual border (e.g. Jordan River Line), was not properly formalized. The resulting Muslim Occupied Judea & Samaria [MOJS] is an inherently defective construct. The presence of Abbas in the 18th year of his 4 year term is also an absurd situation.

    The need for strong security in Jewish Palestine is driven by multiple, unique circumstances.
    ___

    The dispute between two Orthodox Christian countries does not have similar genocidal consequences.

    How many times have regional borders of various nation states in the region changed over the last 500 years? Ukraine is currently huge in land area, but this is not the only border the nation has ever had.

    More applicable cases for Ukrainian aspirations are Austria, Poland, and Hungary. Those nations once had much more expansive borders. As those grand constructs went away, they became smaller but more cohesive nations.
    ___

    Russia will carry significant costs integrating whatever they obtain in a war ending partition. A peace deal is not a “green light” to future conflict. If anything, it is just the opposite. Putin will have to divert funds from other initiatives to reconstruction. A fair deal saps the resources that could drive additional conflicts.

    PEACE 😇

  735. @German_reader
    @LatW


    just not when their voters lecture to Eastern Europeans about things they have never experienced themselves.
     
    Once again: You aren't Ukrainian, your country hasn't been attacked, your country isn't at war (at least not more than the rest of NATO is), and unless Putin or some replacement decides to go for total war with NATO, the Baltic states won't be invaded. The latter risk is not totally non-existent, but still quite small and manageable. It's also something a lot of Germans have experienced. The town I grew up in was near the border with the DDR, the Soviets were literally a few kilometres away (and while I didn't consciously experience the threat, it was still recent enough that in 1990 my father could play some sick joke on me saying "War has started, the Russians are coming"). This was the reality for 40 years, yet most people in West Germany and Western Europe still didn't engage in such unhinged hysterics as you Balts regularly do. There are legitimate concerns about the defense of Eastern NATO members, but when I read your comments, and those of virtually all Baltic politicians, it sounds as if you'd actually like to join in the current war in Ukraine.
    As for AfD, I will freely admit that some of their politicians are rather too pro-Russian and have stupid ideas about some wonderful German-Russian friendship. However, the reality simply is that the total break with Russia that has occurred is economically disastrous for Germany and has led to a serious threat of de-industrialization, so saying "AfD should focus on internal matters" won't do either. An opposition party (which for the foreseeable future is completely frozen out of power anyway) can't avoid these issues totally.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @AP, @Dmitry

    LatW is entitled to voice any opinion that he feels is necessary to make. I consider him to be one of the better commentators here at this blog, being able to hold his own in conversations with any of the better commentators at this blog, including yourself, Bashibusuk, AP etc. He has a wide breadth of knowledge and offers interesting opinions on a wide range of topics.

    He really does know an awful lot about Ukraine, its history, culture etc. When I first started to correspond with him here, I actually thought that he was Ukrainian, or at least that he lives (or has lived) in Ukraine. A Balt’s opinion is every bit as valid as a Germans, IMHO.

    • LOL: Mikhail
    • Replies: @German_reader
    @Mr. Hack


    LatW is entitled to voice any opinion that he feels is necessary to make.
     
    She's a woman (formerly commenting as LatvianWoman)...how can you not know this after several years?
    Of course you like her comments (which sometimes are interesting, I will admit that), because she tells you what you want to hear, that everything will turn out fine for Ukraine, that Russia will be defeated militarily and lose even Crimea without resorting to nuclear weapons, that the biggest danger is a ceasefire cheating Ukraine of its supposedly inevitable victory. It's understandable on a psychological level. Whether any of it is likely to happen, that's another question.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @Barbarossa

    , @Yahya
    @Mr. Hack


    He has a wide breadth of knowledge and offers interesting opinions on a wide range of topics.
     
    I agree that LatW is an intelligent and knowledgeable commentor.

    I'm just irritated at her positive references to Israel's vile "defense" policies. I used to give her (and you) the benefit of the doubt, thinking that she's a typically gullible Westerner/European who's been brainwashed by Zionist propaganda to think Israel is some heroic David fighting against the Arab Goliath. But her last comment on the topic clearly displayed she has some, even first-hand, knowledge of Israeli state policy, yet she wholly endorses their behavior, thinks its just wonderful, something to be emulated. Lol.

    Putting aside the multitude of dirty tactics the Israeli state employs to further its foreign policy ends (you can look up the Deir Yassin massacre, the Qibya massacre, the USS Liberty incident, and Irgun and Lehi terrorism against the British, to name a few); the one that made me lose most of the sympathy I had for Israel was the 1954 Lavon affair, in which a group of Egyptian Jews were recruited by Israel to carry out bombings of British and American buildings in Egypt, in an effort to pin the blame on Egypt and induce Britain and America to go to war with the country. This is the affair as described by Israeli/Zionist scholar Benny Morris in Righteous Victims:


    At the beginning of July 1954, Unit 131, a psychological warfare department of IDF Intelligence, launched a long-dormant Egyptian-Jewish network on a bombing campaign in the streets of Cairo and Alexandria, targeting American and British cultural centers and other sensitive Western sites. Unfortunately for the Israelis, one of the saboteurs was caught on July 23, as a bomb he was carrying in his pocket began to emit smoke. Under torture he revealed names and addresses, and within forty-eight hours the whole network was in Egyptian hands. Israel dissociated itself from the affair, but nobody believed it. One of the captured saboteurs was tortured to death, and an Israeli agent, picked up along with the network, committed suicide. In January 1955 most of the network were given stiff prison sentences, two were acquitted, and two were sentenced to death—and almost immediately executed, contrary to assurances which Western intermediaries felt they had been given by Nasser that no capital sentences would be carried out..
     
    To make matters worse, the Israeli government lied about its involvement in the affair until 2005, when they admitted to carrying out, and get this, even awarded the perpetrators of the bombings with certificates of appreciation, delivered to them straight from the Israeli president's hands.

    And LatW thinks this is all just very praiseworthy. Because nothing is more admirable than bombing your allies, some of whom have been extraordinarily generous with you in the past, aiding you diplomatically and supplying you with critical weaponry. And of course there's nothing wrong with attempting to destabilize a large country like Egypt in service of Israel's "security", because as LatW's hero Golda Meir would say “There is no Zionism except the rescue of Jews.” With this sort of amoral thinking, it doesn't surprise me at all that Ukraine shelled Polish citizens a few weeks ago. It's especially grating when LatW preens and lectures, making explicit moral arguments in Ukraine's defense, then turns around and endorses Israel's villainous policies as something to emulate.

    @German_Reader


    She’s a woman (formerly commenting as LatvianWoman)…how can you not know this after several years?

     

    Lol, I had not previously been aware of LatW being a female. This explains a lot. I used to think her ramblings on the "beautiful and masculine" Chechens were him being a closeted gay. But this makes more sense.

    Replies: @German_reader, @LatW, @Mr. Hack

    , @Wokechoke
    @Mr. Hack

    It’s a woman.

  736. German_reader says:
    @Mr. Hack
    @German_reader

    LatW is entitled to voice any opinion that he feels is necessary to make. I consider him to be one of the better commentators here at this blog, being able to hold his own in conversations with any of the better commentators at this blog, including yourself, Bashibusuk, AP etc. He has a wide breadth of knowledge and offers interesting opinions on a wide range of topics.

    He really does know an awful lot about Ukraine, its history, culture etc. When I first started to correspond with him here, I actually thought that he was Ukrainian, or at least that he lives (or has lived) in Ukraine. A Balt's opinion is every bit as valid as a Germans, IMHO.

    Replies: @German_reader, @Yahya, @Wokechoke

    LatW is entitled to voice any opinion that he feels is necessary to make.

    She’s a woman (formerly commenting as LatvianWoman)…how can you not know this after several years?
    Of course you like her comments (which sometimes are interesting, I will admit that), because she tells you what you want to hear, that everything will turn out fine for Ukraine, that Russia will be defeated militarily and lose even Crimea without resorting to nuclear weapons, that the biggest danger is a ceasefire cheating Ukraine of its supposedly inevitable victory. It’s understandable on a psychological level. Whether any of it is likely to happen, that’s another question.

    • Agree: Mikhail
    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @German_reader


    She’s a woman (formerly commenting as LatvianWoman)…how can you not know this after several years?
     
    I obviously missed her coming out party? :-) There was nothing that I could detect in her writing that indicated that she was a woman.

    Of course you like her comments (which sometimes are interesting, I will admit that), because she tells you what you want to hear,...It’s understandable on a psychological level. Whether any of it is likely to happen, that’s another question.
     
    See? Even you don't know how it's all going to turn out. LatW's opinions are as worthy of a nickel, as are anybody else's contributing at this blog, in actuality worth at least a dime compared to many displayed here.

    Replies: @German_reader

    , @Barbarossa
    @German_reader

    I actually didn't pick up on the fact that LatW is a woman either.

    Although your revelation did make me realize something interesting. I realized that my mind automatically has assigned indistinct likenesses to almost all of the commenters around here based on their "voice", mannerisms etc. It's not conscious, it's rather how one generally forms pictures of radio announcers. However, I realized that I didn't have an image formed for LatW, but now that I know that she is a woman, my mind supplies one. It's as if my brain didn't have the necessary information to make the image. Perhaps since I assumed that LatW was a man, but something in the typing "voice" was not quite male enough? Beats me, but I thought it was rather interesting.

    Replies: @Yahya

  737. @Yahya
    @Barbarossa


    At the Melkite church that we often go to
     
    Yes I remember you mentioning being part of the Melkite Byzantine Catholic Church. I am intrigued though as to how you came about joining this esoteric sect; and why you choose it over more traditionally Irish or American churches?

    quite a number of Lebanese
     
    Lebanese Christians, whether Maronite, Melkite or Orthodox, are something of a Gold Standard among Arabs in that they are a handsome, intelligent people. I'd rank them among the smartest ethnicities worldwide, perhaps only behind the Ashkenazim (who are of course unbeatable on the IQ front). Their success in commercial endeavors across the globe are of course well-known; amazing how many billionaires are of Lebanese descent considering their numerical diminutiveness: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Lebanese_by_net_worth

    But lesser known is the contributions they've made to Arabic culture.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mikhail_Naimy

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elias_Khoury

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amin_Maalouf

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ameen_Rihani

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Butrus_al-Bustani

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nadine_Labaki

    Their peculiarity is hard to explain given they don't look all that different from their Muslim neighbors, and seem to be derived mostly from the same genetic stew as Lebanese Muslims. My working theory is that a combination of Phoenician and Jizya-based selective forces, Jesuit educational influences, and a simple lack of Islamic inhibitiveness is what separates them from the rest. Copts and Assyrians share two of these factors, but they lack the millennia-long child sacrifice practices of Phoenicians, so ultimately aren't as smart or beautiful as the Lebanese.

    I should point that Sunni Lebanese are just as "elite" as Christians in Lebanon; your Hariri's and Mikati's would likely be offended at the notion that they are lesser than Maronites or Melkites. But imo the Sunnis aren't nearly as culturally productive as their Christian counterparts. Lebanese Shiites are mostly simple peasants from the countryside, their contributions seem to be limited to Hezbollah, i'm unaware of any major cultural figure other than Hanan Al-Shaykh.

    If Lebanon had been 90%+ Christian it would probably look something more like France or Spain. On the other hand, it would also be more degenerate and at risk of ethno-racial demolition. Already many Lebanese Christian urban youth are SWPL-lite morons; aping the West in the worst possible ways.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9sroVPh389Q&ab_channel=HibaTawajiVEVO

    So perhaps it is for the better that traditionally-minded Muslims overtook them demographically at this critical juncture.


    It just feels ancient.
     
    Yes but you have to remember that Middle Eastern music was heavily influenced by Western music in the modern period; so is not as ancient or pure as you'd expect. There's this excellent Iranian website which gets into the history of how Iranian music was altered by the Westernizing reforms of Reza Shah Pahlavi during the 20th century: https://saednews.com/en/category/music

    One prominent modification was the addition of Western instruments such as the violin, cello and the piano; and the expansion of the traditional Iranian ensemble into a Western-style orchestra. A further modification was the harmonization of the melody, which began when composers Ali-Naqi Vaziri and Ruhollah Khaleqi investigated the possibility of harmonizing Persian scales while preserving their basic character. Though the use of microtones, the frequent absence of a clear tonic and dominant, and the distinctly modal character of many melodies presented challenges to harmonization; Persian tasnifs now played on Iranian airwaves utilize rudimentary four-part harmony and simple counterpoint.

    You can see the influence of all of the above in the music of Gholam-Hossein Banan:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4PL607ZiiO8&ab_channel=Gholam-HosseinBanan-Topic


    In general I find the Middle Eastern music/ singing to be incredibly emotive and rich.

     

    Thanks, let me know which pieces you liked the most so I can tailor my recommendations. For now I'll attach Near Eastern Christian music since you expressed a liking for the Lebanese Melkite melodies you heard in church.

    1) Wa Habibi

    A famous Good Friday hymn sung by legendary Lebanese singer Fairouz.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qSThyqD3rZ8&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=159&ab_channel=Saintelieantelias

    Many excellent renditions on Youtube:

    Ghada Shbeir (Lebanese Christian): (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NB4_GJqLgLM&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=135&ab_channel=GhadaShbeir)

    Souad Hashem (Lebanese Christian): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mYUUzcB2tOw&t=167s&ab_channel=ArmandoD

    Carla Cahmoun (Lebanese Christian): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NckMXOlYf34&ab_channel=CarlaChamoun

    Rania Ateek (Palestinian Christian): (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Udqr79TuBvo&ab_channel=RaniaAteek)

    Xaris Alexiou (Greek Christian): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JgelvUS9lyg&ab_channel=SocratesDigitalCreations1

    2) Abun Dbashmayo

    A Syriac Lord's Prayer, roughly translated as "Our Father In Heaven", performed by the St. Ephrem Patriarchal Choir of Damascus in Jesus' native tongue. The instrumentation is based on the Maqam Nahawand mode. This one is my personal favorite:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zvbqUY3I5WA&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=195&ab_channel=St.EphremPatriarchalChoir

    Sarah Ego (Assyrian): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_AdPiRWIam0&t=66s&ab_channel=WalterBreitenmoser

    St. Mark's Covenant Jerusalem (Palestinian): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Bo3keay8fw&ab_channel=AnaGodwith

    3) Agni Parthene

    Famous Greek/Byzantine chant, here performed in Arabic by Ribale Wehbé:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bqhen0OfB3E&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=63&ab_channel=RibaleWehb%C3%A9-%D8%B1%D9%8A%D8%A8%D8%A7%D9%84%D9%88%D9%87%D8%A8%D9%87

    Too many renditions to list, practically every country with a Greek Orthodox presence has done a rendition. This one by Serbian vocalist Divna Ljubojevic is my favorite:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RcjwuIx5-nI&ab_channel=Divna%26Mel%CF%8Cdi

    4) Hymn Of The Light

    The hymn was composed by Saint Ephrem of Syria, Doctor of the Church from 306-373 AD, and one of the most notable hymnographers of Eastern Christianity. He was born in the Roman province of Mesopotamia, in a city which had a complex ethnic composition, consisting of Assyrians, Arabs, Greeks, Jews, Parthians, Romans, and Iranians. He is considered a patron of the Syriac people in the Greater Syrian Christian tradition.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0A1NVTLirM&list=PLk4jQWJwkElTO7fwOk8m_Ibn-gQ_leGiZ&index=185&t=156s&ab_channel=MUSINGS153

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    Copts and Assyrians share two of these factors, but they lack the millennia-long child sacrifice practices of Phoenicians, so ultimately aren’t as smart or beautiful as the Lebanese.

    Could you further explain how “millenia-long child sacrifices” practiced by the Phoenicians could possibly have a positive influence on the Lebanese acquiring a “Gold Standard” among Arabs?

    I lived in the same neighborhood that included Lebanese Christians in Minneapolis and regret not having delved more deeply into their unique culture, aside from frequenting their local bars, restaurants and delis. While they were building their large and beautiful Marionite church in Mpls, they were allowed to hold services within the equally beautiful Ukrainian Catholic Church in the same neighborhood, just down the street:

  738. @German_reader
    @Mr. Hack


    LatW is entitled to voice any opinion that he feels is necessary to make.
     
    She's a woman (formerly commenting as LatvianWoman)...how can you not know this after several years?
    Of course you like her comments (which sometimes are interesting, I will admit that), because she tells you what you want to hear, that everything will turn out fine for Ukraine, that Russia will be defeated militarily and lose even Crimea without resorting to nuclear weapons, that the biggest danger is a ceasefire cheating Ukraine of its supposedly inevitable victory. It's understandable on a psychological level. Whether any of it is likely to happen, that's another question.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @Barbarossa

    She’s a woman (formerly commenting as LatvianWoman)…how can you not know this after several years?

    I obviously missed her coming out party? 🙂 There was nothing that I could detect in her writing that indicated that she was a woman.

    Of course you like her comments (which sometimes are interesting, I will admit that), because she tells you what you want to hear,…It’s understandable on a psychological level. Whether any of it is likely to happen, that’s another question.

    See? Even you don’t know how it’s all going to turn out. LatW’s opinions are as worthy of a nickel, as are anybody else’s contributing at this blog, in actuality worth at least a dime compared to many displayed here.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @Mr. Hack


    Even you don’t know how it’s all going to turn out.
     
    Of course, none of us knows, and the choices involved (on which none of us commenting here have any influence) are very hard. All I'm saying is that I think categorically excluding negotiations to end the war (which would presumably have to include some concessions by Ukraine) might be a terrible mistake. And I can't have much sympathy for Poles and Balts who spout all those hardline opinions without ever entertaining the slightest doubt. They behave as if they have some special knowledge and are under imminent threat or already at war themselves, but none of that is true.
  739. German_reader says:
    @Mr. Hack
    @German_reader


    She’s a woman (formerly commenting as LatvianWoman)…how can you not know this after several years?
     
    I obviously missed her coming out party? :-) There was nothing that I could detect in her writing that indicated that she was a woman.

    Of course you like her comments (which sometimes are interesting, I will admit that), because she tells you what you want to hear,...It’s understandable on a psychological level. Whether any of it is likely to happen, that’s another question.
     
    See? Even you don't know how it's all going to turn out. LatW's opinions are as worthy of a nickel, as are anybody else's contributing at this blog, in actuality worth at least a dime compared to many displayed here.

    Replies: @German_reader

    Even you don’t know how it’s all going to turn out.

    Of course, none of us knows, and the choices involved (on which none of us commenting here have any influence) are very hard. All I’m saying is that I think categorically excluding negotiations to end the war (which would presumably have to include some concessions by Ukraine) might be a terrible mistake. And I can’t have much sympathy for Poles and Balts who spout all those hardline opinions without ever entertaining the slightest doubt. They behave as if they have some special knowledge and are under imminent threat or already at war themselves, but none of that is true.

  740. @German_reader
    @LatW


    just not when their voters lecture to Eastern Europeans about things they have never experienced themselves.
     
    Once again: You aren't Ukrainian, your country hasn't been attacked, your country isn't at war (at least not more than the rest of NATO is), and unless Putin or some replacement decides to go for total war with NATO, the Baltic states won't be invaded. The latter risk is not totally non-existent, but still quite small and manageable. It's also something a lot of Germans have experienced. The town I grew up in was near the border with the DDR, the Soviets were literally a few kilometres away (and while I didn't consciously experience the threat, it was still recent enough that in 1990 my father could play some sick joke on me saying "War has started, the Russians are coming"). This was the reality for 40 years, yet most people in West Germany and Western Europe still didn't engage in such unhinged hysterics as you Balts regularly do. There are legitimate concerns about the defense of Eastern NATO members, but when I read your comments, and those of virtually all Baltic politicians, it sounds as if you'd actually like to join in the current war in Ukraine.
    As for AfD, I will freely admit that some of their politicians are rather too pro-Russian and have stupid ideas about some wonderful German-Russian friendship. However, the reality simply is that the total break with Russia that has occurred is economically disastrous for Germany and has led to a serious threat of de-industrialization, so saying "AfD should focus on internal matters" won't do either. An opposition party (which for the foreseeable future is completely frozen out of power anyway) can't avoid these issues totally.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @AP, @Dmitry

    The town I grew up in was near the border with the DDR, the Soviets were literally a few kilometres away (and while I didn’t consciously experience the threat, it was still recent enough that in 1990 my father could play some sick joke on me saying “War has started, the Russians are coming”). This was the reality for 40 years, yet most people in West Germany and Western Europe still didn’t engage in such unhinged hysterics as you Balts regularly do

    The Balts experienced mass deportation, mass murder, and mass importation of colonists. As a West German, your experience of the Soviet nightmare is a tiny fraction of that of a Balt. An East Prussian or Danziger could relate, but those guys had voted for Nazis en masse so there is some reason for their tragedy a they might be understandably quiet about it, whereas Balts are just victims (certainly for Lithuanians and Estonians, the issue of the Latvian Red Right Rifles is a bit more complicated).

    when I read your comments, and those of virtually all Baltic politicians, it sounds as if you’d actually like to join in the current war in Ukraine

    A weak Russia means safety for the Baltic republics. It may be exaggeration to say Ukraine is keeping “all of Europe” safe but it’s is certainly keeping Eastern and Northern Europe safe. There is a reason why Poles, Balts, Finns and Swedes are Ukraine’s strongest supporters in Europe. All these countries are close to Russia.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @AP


    whereas Balts are just victims
     
    No, they aren't. You mentioned Red Riflemen yourself. Latvians supposedly also had the highest per capita rate of Holocaust perpetrators. My own grandfather (who may or may not have participated in crimes himself, I can't know for sure) saw Latvian auxiliaries beating up Jews in Minsk. Of course that wouldn't have happened without the prior Soviet crimes in 1940/41 and without the German occupation, and I once even used to have some sympathy for Balts because of their historical experiences. I don't anymore given their unhinged behaviour during the current crisis. And what happened in 1941 and 1944 is only of limited relevance today anyway, unless one approaches international politics as a form of collective trauma therapy, like a lot of Balts and Poles seem to do.

    A weak Russia means safety for the Baltic republics.
     
    Safety for the Baltic republics lies in the NATO forces stationed there, even if they're merely tripwire forces, they'd almost certainly ensure a strong reaction in case of a Russian invasion (and I haven't yet seen a plausible scenario why Russia would want to invade the Baltic states anyway). I know you always feel compelled to be in "professional Ukrainian" mode (as utu aptly put it before his disappearance), but Ukraine is fighting for herself, for nobody else, and claims to the contrary are just exercises in public relations.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @AnonfromTN, @AP

  741. @LondonBob
    @German_reader

    Melitopol is pro Russian. Even Reuters admitted as much a few months ago.



    https://twitter.com/johnnyjmils/status/1595745426287874056?s=20&t=vEnUq7bJw1SIIj0AAwa5ww

    Replies: @AP

    You can even find a pro-Russian in Lviv or Warsaw. So?

    Zaporizhia is more pro-Russian than Kherson but less pro-Russian than Donbas. It consistently has been more pro-Ukrainian than pro-Russian (unlike Donbas).

    Here are results for the pro-Russian party in the 2019 parliamentary election (be aware that this support does not equal desire to be annexed by Russia, some party leaders such as Dobkin from Kharkiv are fighting against Russia). In most of Zaporizhia oblast it was 20% to 30%, in one district it was 30% to 40%. In contrast the party got over 50% in much of Donbas.

  742. German_reader says:
    @AP
    @German_reader


    The town I grew up in was near the border with the DDR, the Soviets were literally a few kilometres away (and while I didn’t consciously experience the threat, it was still recent enough that in 1990 my father could play some sick joke on me saying “War has started, the Russians are coming”). This was the reality for 40 years, yet most people in West Germany and Western Europe still didn’t engage in such unhinged hysterics as you Balts regularly do
     
    The Balts experienced mass deportation, mass murder, and mass importation of colonists. As a West German, your experience of the Soviet nightmare is a tiny fraction of that of a Balt. An East Prussian or Danziger could relate, but those guys had voted for Nazis en masse so there is some reason for their tragedy a they might be understandably quiet about it, whereas Balts are just victims (certainly for Lithuanians and Estonians, the issue of the Latvian Red Right Rifles is a bit more complicated).

    when I read your comments, and those of virtually all Baltic politicians, it sounds as if you’d actually like to join in the current war in Ukraine
     
    A weak Russia means safety for the Baltic republics. It may be exaggeration to say Ukraine is keeping “all of Europe” safe but it’s is certainly keeping Eastern and Northern Europe safe. There is a reason why Poles, Balts, Finns and Swedes are Ukraine’s strongest supporters in Europe. All these countries are close to Russia.

    Replies: @German_reader

    whereas Balts are just victims

    No, they aren’t. You mentioned Red Riflemen yourself. Latvians supposedly also had the highest per capita rate of Holocaust perpetrators. My own grandfather (who may or may not have participated in crimes himself, I can’t know for sure) saw Latvian auxiliaries beating up Jews in Minsk. Of course that wouldn’t have happened without the prior Soviet crimes in 1940/41 and without the German occupation, and I once even used to have some sympathy for Balts because of their historical experiences. I don’t anymore given their unhinged behaviour during the current crisis. And what happened in 1941 and 1944 is only of limited relevance today anyway, unless one approaches international politics as a form of collective trauma therapy, like a lot of Balts and Poles seem to do.

    A weak Russia means safety for the Baltic republics.

    Safety for the Baltic republics lies in the NATO forces stationed there, even if they’re merely tripwire forces, they’d almost certainly ensure a strong reaction in case of a Russian invasion (and I haven’t yet seen a plausible scenario why Russia would want to invade the Baltic states anyway). I know you always feel compelled to be in “professional Ukrainian” mode (as utu aptly put it before his disappearance), but Ukraine is fighting for herself, for nobody else, and claims to the contrary are just exercises in public relations.

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @German_reader


    I don’t anymore given their unhinged behaviour during the current crisis.
     
    Did you ever consider the possibility that maybe the Jews deserved it?

    Ha ha just kidding. It is erroneous and illogical and stupid to inflict a material penalty on a class of people. It's not just if you care about justice and you definitely should. It creates enemies unnecessarily which is not pragmatic taken to 11 even if you are Satanic and insensitive to the Platonic good of justice.

    Jews, Latvians, Germans. Russians, Ukrainians. When it comes to dealing punishments the presumption of innocence is as close to a tautology (P>.99999999999999999999) as we have got.

    Replies: @LatW

    , @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader


    Safety for the Baltic republics lies in the NATO forces stationed there
     
    The only thing that would make Baltic republics safe is decent behavior. Yet their “leaders” assiduously destroy their safety by stupid militant statements. As to NATO, did you actually read Article 5? It says that if one of the NATO countries experiences aggression from the outside, all other NATO members have to assist it, and each member has a right to decide how exactly. So, if a member decides to send the victim of aggression pampers, this member thereby fulfils its obligations under Article 5.

    In NATO, only the US military has capabilities to do something consequential. In a private discussion a former NATO military analyst told me that if push comes to shove, the US would not risk endangering its own cities for the sake of responding to an attack on any European target, not only Vilnius or Warsaw, but even Berlin, Paris, or London. Indeed, the US has a long history of double-crossing its allies, Kurds being the latest example.

    Replies: @LondonBob, @sudden death, @A123, @Mikhail

    , @AP
    @German_reader


    whereas Balts are just victims

    No, they aren’t.
     

    Yes they are. Their countries were forcibly annexed by the Soviets, they were murdered and deported in large numbers, and were being replaced by Russian and Russian-speaking colonists.

    You mentioned Red Riflemen yourself.
     
    Latvians were not 100% innocent, unlike Lithuanians and Estonians. Although this case is more ambiguous than that of the Germans from the lost territories. Latvians supported the Bolsheviks because they wanted to be independent, Germans in East Prussia and Danzig supported the Nazis in part because they wanted to rule eastern Europeans and take their land (this was a major part of the Nazi program).

    Latvians supposedly also had the highest per capita rate of Holocaust perpetrators
     
    Probably revenge for the Bolshevik nightmare, as you implied.

    I once even used to have some sympathy for Balts because of their historical experiences. I don’t anymore given their unhinged behaviour during the current crisis
     
    Strong support for the victim of murderous Russian aggression is "unhinged?"

    Safety for the Baltic republics lies in the NATO forces stationed there, even if they’re merely tripwire forces, they’d almost certainly ensure a strong reaction in case of a Russian invasion (and I haven’t yet seen a plausible scenario why Russia would want to invade the Baltic states anyway).
     
    Someone else had posted Russian threats. Baltic republics are inconvenient due to Kaliningrad. And two of them have large Russian populations.

    Ukraine is fighting for herself, for nobody else
     
    By fighting for herself, Ukraine fights for Russia's other neighbors.

    Replies: @Mikel, @German_reader

  743. @Mr. Hack
    @Beckow


    Mr.Hack heartily approved of the bombing and killing. The idiotic point of view that says that a large ethnic group can be destroyed or expelled because they are “Russian” (the horror!) is the mainstream Kiev-West viewpoint.
     
    You're not only full of BS, but as AP has pointed out on many occasions here, you often lie as well. Show me where I said anything at all like what you're trying to spread about me here?

    Replies: @Beckow

    If you write about a topic and avoid mentioning the bombing of Donbas Russian civilians and the murders in Odessa, but instead ritually repeat Ukie talking points, one can assume that you approved of the bombing. It would be like talking about WW2 without ever mentioning Pearl Harbour or Barbarossa.

    Your one-sidedness speaks for you. Do you denounce what Kiev did after Maidan? You have an opportunity to clarify.

  744. @LatW
    @songbird


    The Balts certainly seem to have a surplus of ethnocentrism (at least as judged by Western Euro standards), but I would argue perhaps that it is negative, in the sense that it is directed against their historical antagonists
     
    It's not just negative, there is a positive side, too (mostly internally facing). It is not typically defined by "antagonists". It's just there, as in the concept of Dasein. And, btw, a certain response to "antagonists", as you call them, is healthy. The kind of "antagonists" that you have in mind that are negative also occasionally try to make moves and sometimes receive a response. But there are fewer of those than from the East (for now).

    It is just incident, but witness LatW’s evident hostility to AfD and Sudden Death’s evident hostility to Le Pen.
     
    Please, do not extrapolate my posts on all the Baltic people, this is not a forum for mainstream politics or majority ideas. Most Baltic people are democratic and support non-contraversial politics, and do not care much about AfD (even if most of them view non-European immigration negatively, even peaceful and diligent Asians, while accepted, are not considered a "norm".. btw, most nationalists view AfD quite positively and the Estonian nationalists even met with Le Pen in person and she was greeted by them quite warmly). Under normal circumstances, I'd be amicable towards AfD and would support them wholeheartedly (and, if I were German, would also support them or a similar party financially, even if AfD is a mild party by my standards), just not when their voters lecture to Eastern Europeans about things they have never experienced themselves. I think AfD should focus internally, on problems that have direct relevance to the negative side of the non-Euro immigration. If the AfD doesn't want to support Ukraine, then this is totally their right and actually in line with their politics. I respect that, but that means they have no say over how Ukraine develops and what Ukraine does. Which is fair, imo.

    The unwritten agreement with Western Europe is that we are amicable and wish well to each other, only in that case we allow the West to have access to our internal policies (or domestic markets). If they side with our enemy (or get paid by him), that ends. I'm speaking generally, not accusing AfD of anything, of course. Not that they should listen even, it's their country (and, afaik, the AfD are actually eurosceptic so these views are irrelevant - I'm assuming, if AfD were in power, with large masses supporting them, there would be no EU at least in its current form and Eastern policy would hopefully be a minor part of their agenda).

    Replies: @Yevardian, @German_reader, @songbird

    it’s not just negative, there is a positive side, too (mostly internally facing)

    I’m oversimplifying a lot, in trying to make my analogy.

    [MORE]
    I don’t think it would be true to say that Irish nationalism was wholly a negative feeling against the English, or English nationalism wholly a negative feeling against the French or Germans, etc. But I do suspect that these negative feelings may have been like rutted wagon tracks, and have impeded a quick readjustment to the threat of mass migration. That the old antagonisms in Western Europe in current times have all the significance of sports rivalries, channeling and subverting the healthy instinct for tribe into outlets acceptable to the regime.

    even if AfD is a mild party by my standards

    I don’t like their blank-slatist rhetoric myself, but isn’t it essentially German law? With the state repression against them, they need to try to accommodate themselves to the system, to appear on any ballot. As I’ve long said, I suspect that there is no political solution for Germany. That in the distant future, parts of it may end up being annexed, by Poland or Denmark (as improbable as that seems now), with the native Germans welcoming it.

    just not when their voters lecture to Eastern Europeans about things they have never experienced themselves.

    I haven’t followed the rhetoric too closely, but I suspect that much of it might be a clutzy attempt to verbalize national interests, rather than a desire to lecture.

    If they side with our enemy (or get paid by him), that ends.

    historically, neutral countries usually carry out trade, when not impeded by military barriers. This is not tantamount to wanting to sell arms to them, or join their army. It is mostly about serving national interests. (not that I would categorize Western Europe as neutral now). I don’t think it is right to categorize it as perfidy. EEs are certainly not ordering their behavior for the maximum benefit of Western Euros – it is more like they want them to adopt their foreign policy, regardless of costs incurred.

    Trade embargoes strike me as an idea that springs from American hegemony. To illustrate the point, we have Zeihan comically saying that the Russians blew up their own pipeline, that the Swedes have the proof, and that America has no choice but to enforce international property norms, and embargo any European country doing business with Russia, whether Europeans want them to or not.

    The kind of “antagonists” that you have in mind that are negative also occasionally try to make moves and sometimes receive a response.

    IMO, Russian will never cross NATO’s borders.

    Perhaps, you see the potential of some future alliance with Ukraine – something to counter the poz, and see Russia as impeding that, by weakening Ukraine territorially? Of course, I have said that Ukraine appears very pozzed to me now given its per capita, but the future is hard to predict.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @songbird


    I don’t think it would be true to say that Irish nationalism was wholly a negative feeling against the English
     
    Not at all, wouldn't you say nationalism exists on its own? I thought we were talking about ethnocentrism, not nationalism, those are slightly different things. Every nation is a priori ethnocentric, right? Nationalism is more of a political manifestation. But there might be something to it, this is the case with freedom, when you know you can lose it, you value it more? This is an undervalued aspect in the conversation about Ukraine as well. They talk a lot about territory and language rights (although those are connected to freedom) but not about how Ukrainians simply do not want to live under someone tyrannical, especially under a tyrannical outsider.

    But I do suspect that these negative feelings may have been like rutted wagon tracks, and have impeded a quick readjustment to the threat of mass migration.
     
    Maybe, or maybe the immigration into Ireland wasn't perceived as a negative in the beginning (by your average citizen)? I'm not familiar with the original profile of the migrants, weren't most of them peaceful and employed? I mean, most people will not object to an Indian female nurse that speaks your language, right? Of course, it's far from great how things have turned out overall. I haven't been to Ireland in a while, so don't know how things look on the ground.

    Also, one thing you might want to keep in mind is that not all whites act the same among other whites. In Western Europe or the US you don't notice this, but historically some Russians have sometimes had a certain type of demeanor or behaviors that really make them stand out (for example, they are louder than others, their women use more makeup and are more sexualized, etc) - this is not necessarily liked by everyone, regardless of them being a "former occupier". Obviously, this depends on the person, but this is a common stereotype. Or at least used to be, that is changing too.

    I don’t like their blank-slatist rhetoric myself, but isn’t it essentially German law?
     
    Tbh, these types of nationalist parties may simply not be able to reach above a certain level of electoral support. And in a democratic environment, one has to respect that one's compatriots, the majority of them anyway, may not want to vote for these parties (e.g., accept far right ideas or even basic conservatism). Haven't you ever felt that it would seem arrogant to tell others how they should be politically? The problem is when their complacent politics start affecting everyone.

    I haven’t followed the rhetoric too closely, but I suspect that much of it might be a clutzy attempt to verbalize national interests, rather than a desire to lecture.
     
    No, it's at a systemic level where they think they know better, that they are better and that everyone should accept their political ideas (including social experiments). It even gets to absurd things like we see above, where a German will insinuate that Latvians are worse Nazis than the Germans themselves (very convenient), etc, etc. I'm not saying it's every Westerner, definitely not most, but enough of them. It's been that way for decades now (and obviously it will be related to poz as well, since they will promote poz very happily and with great enthusiasm and will always find local allies).

    historically, neutral countries usually carry out trade, when not impeded by military barriers. This is not tantamount to wanting to sell arms to them, or join their army. It is mostly about serving national interests.
     
    The problem is that it's not just trade. Neutral country with plenty of self-defense doing just trade would be great. But there are few such countries overall, maybe not that realistic these days.

    IMO, Russian will never cross NATO’s borders.

     

    They have in some ways (airspace, spying, expecting the EU institutions to observe their ethnic rights while they don't observe minority rights at home). But that's not what I meant, what I meant was that those antagonists from the woke side, that you had in mind, I'm assuming, that they, too, sometimes act out and in some cases are met with resistance (maybe not enough). You sounded like you were saying that because of the Russian antagonists, the Baltic states or Ukraine are not aware of the poz. This is not the case. I don't think one should choose between the two, they can both be banished. But, of course, the people will decide how it plays out, if the people are meek or find benefits in the poz (which many do, objectively, quite a few people get financial benefit or emotional gratification out of it so they won't consider it an "antagonist" at all but something that adds to their life), then it will come through. Maybe not to the extent as in the West, but that's little solace.

    you see the potential of some future alliance with Ukraine – something to counter the poz, and see Russia as impeding that, by weakening Ukraine territorially?
     
    Very much so. Russia practically destroyed Eastern Ukraine which would've been the biggest anti-poz bastion, for purely selfish reasons and out of jealousy. But in general, it is not Ukraine's job to "counter the poz", Ukraine's job is to preserve themselves first and foremost.

    I have said that Ukraine appears very pozzed to me now given its per capita
     
    They may be low GDP per capita but they are high IQ and quite exposed to Europe. And they don't have the type of traditionalist rules as in some non-white countries. But I don't know why you consider them more pozzed, the Ukrainians I notice are not pozzed at all, not sure they will prevail, of course, they could get pushed aside in the future.

    Replies: @German_reader, @songbird

  745. @Coconuts
    @songbird


    The Balts certainly seem to have a surplus of ethnocentrism (at least as judged by Western Euro standards), but I would argue perhaps that it is negative, in the sense that it is directed against their historical antagonists, which are not likely to be their future antagonists based on fundamental changes like NATO and nuclear weapons, but which simultaneously might serve to blind them to their future antagonists, who cannot be effectively countered by those things, but rather who might be somewhat enabled by them.
     
    There is the angle that the Baltic nations have had much more exposure to the authoritarian side of progressivism in their recent history, and much of this is also applicable to the ways mass-immigration from outside Europe is promoted and normalised in a society, at least when the left-wing are doing it. I can't speak any Baltic languages but from some of the academics I have heard discussing the Soviet era in English, they are similar to the level of the Poles in their analysis, which is deeper than what you usually encounter in mainstream in the West.

    It means I don't think their progressives will find as easy to gain cultural hegemony as ours have, I think LatW has mentioned this in the past as well.

    Replies: @songbird

    I hope it is so, but I’m not sure how effective or permanent such things are, the the face of rising GDP. We are already over 30 years out from the fall of communism in Eastern Europe. Surely there may be some generational memory that weakens.

    It seems like Germans (or what passes for them) are no longer hypervigilant about saving and inflation. Meanwhile, there is something comical in the meaning of corrupt parties in Ireland: Fianna Fáil (soldiers of destiny), Sinn Féin (we ourselves).

    IMO, Eastern Europe’s best chances are in simply observing the decline.

    • Replies: @Coconuts
    @songbird


    I hope it is so, but I’m not sure how effective or permanent such things are, the face of rising GDP. We are already over 30 years out from the fall of communism in Eastern Europe. Surely there may be some generational memory that weakens.
     
    At the moment intuitively I’d say you are right; it looks like these economic and standard of living factors are most important. The resistance to it may be stronger, through knowing some of how progressives are likely to play things in advance, even if it remains a minority.

    IMO, Eastern Europe’s best chances are in simply observing the decline.
     
    It’s similar to the conclusion I've reached about Western Europe, any change will only come through experience of the decline.

    Generally, it seems probable that when the demographic change becomes even more visible it will be hard for them to avoid the emergence of different forms of white identity politics.

    I was going to write this in a reply to one of Dmitry’s earlier messages, but I think the more different ethnic groups you come into contact with or observe on a daily basis and the more numerous they are, can’t help but make you more conscious of the existence and characteristics of your own group. Similar to what happens after you have been living abroad for a long time and return home, only without having to go anywhere.

    Given the numbers and the speed of change I doubt integration into the pre-mass migration culture is going to be realistic, you can already see this model being rejected now and tendencies moving in the other direction. The economic prospects are also not looking that great. It doesn’t appear to be the case that mass-immigration will make the UK or France wealthier, more powerful, a better country than ever before, which afaik are still part of the arguments used for greater diversity.


    Meanwhile, there is something comical in the meaning of corrupt parties in Ireland: Fianna Fáil (soldiers of destiny), Sinn Féin (we ourselves).
     
    These names are starting to look like hostages-to-fortune now. I wonder if in 20/30 years they will be retired? There is this issue with belief in Progress and where it is supposed to be taking us at the moment. Progress may now mean becoming more Islamic, as one challenging example.
  746. @songbird
    @Coconuts

    The Balts certainly seem to have a surplus of ethnocentrism (at least as judged by Western Euro standards), but I would argue perhaps that it is negative, in the sense that it is directed against their historical antagonists, which are not likely to be their future antagonists based on fundamental changes like NATO and nuclear weapons, but which simultaneously might serve to blind them to their future antagonists, who cannot be effectively countered by those things, but rather who might be somewhat enabled by them.

    It is just incident, but witness LatW's evident hostility to AfD and Sudden Death's evident hostility to Le Pen.

    It is said that ethnogenesis is the result of facing the aggression or threats of an outside group. But what if it is not omnidirectional? But unidirectional? Affording a defensive response against only one group?

    Perhaps, like an antibody against one variant of a virus, which, in becoming fixated, impedes the effective response against another variant. Or, maybe, that is not a good analogy...

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @LatW, @Coconuts, @sudden death

    NATO and nuclear weapons are worthless without political will to act in case of crisis and politicians, taking money from RF, like LePen (promising to get out of NATO military structure) are doing everything to weaken both political will and military capabilities. In theory, somebody might be just idealist isolationist without any foreign influence, but the end result will be also destruction of that political will.

    RF will certainly cross any NATO boundaries if they will calculate that there is no political will to stand against and react:

    • Replies: @sudden death
    @sudden death

    btw, this RF state TV show was done in December 2021 and they did fig leaf spoken disclaimer about it being just theoretical script as RF has no such intentions, but at the time they were speaking absolutely the same about UA too, despite preparing for real invasion meanwhile.

    , @songbird
    @sudden death

    As far as that TV clip goes, I think there is a certain bizarre, impotent saber-rattling happening on Russian TV. I recall that clip of the dubious super-weapon torpedo being used to radioactive tsunami Britain and Ireland - But I am still waiting for them to push the button.

  747. @Mr. Hack
    @German_reader

    LatW is entitled to voice any opinion that he feels is necessary to make. I consider him to be one of the better commentators here at this blog, being able to hold his own in conversations with any of the better commentators at this blog, including yourself, Bashibusuk, AP etc. He has a wide breadth of knowledge and offers interesting opinions on a wide range of topics.

    He really does know an awful lot about Ukraine, its history, culture etc. When I first started to correspond with him here, I actually thought that he was Ukrainian, or at least that he lives (or has lived) in Ukraine. A Balt's opinion is every bit as valid as a Germans, IMHO.

    Replies: @German_reader, @Yahya, @Wokechoke

    He has a wide breadth of knowledge and offers interesting opinions on a wide range of topics.

    I agree that LatW is an intelligent and knowledgeable commentor.

    I’m just irritated at her positive references to Israel’s vile “defense” policies. I used to give her (and you) the benefit of the doubt, thinking that she’s a typically gullible Westerner/European who’s been brainwashed by Zionist propaganda to think Israel is some heroic David fighting against the Arab Goliath. But her last comment on the topic clearly displayed she has some, even first-hand, knowledge of Israeli state policy, yet she wholly endorses their behavior, thinks its just wonderful, something to be emulated. Lol.

    Putting aside the multitude of dirty tactics the Israeli state employs to further its foreign policy ends (you can look up the Deir Yassin massacre, the Qibya massacre, the USS Liberty incident, and Irgun and Lehi terrorism against the British, to name a few); the one that made me lose most of the sympathy I had for Israel was the 1954 Lavon affair, in which a group of Egyptian Jews were recruited by Israel to carry out bombings of British and American buildings in Egypt, in an effort to pin the blame on Egypt and induce Britain and America to go to war with the country. This is the affair as described by Israeli/Zionist scholar Benny Morris in Righteous Victims:

    At the beginning of July 1954, Unit 131, a psychological warfare department of IDF Intelligence, launched a long-dormant Egyptian-Jewish network on a bombing campaign in the streets of Cairo and Alexandria, targeting American and British cultural centers and other sensitive Western sites. Unfortunately for the Israelis, one of the saboteurs was caught on July 23, as a bomb he was carrying in his pocket began to emit smoke. Under torture he revealed names and addresses, and within forty-eight hours the whole network was in Egyptian hands. Israel dissociated itself from the affair, but nobody believed it. One of the captured saboteurs was tortured to death, and an Israeli agent, picked up along with the network, committed suicide. In January 1955 most of the network were given stiff prison sentences, two were acquitted, and two were sentenced to death—and almost immediately executed, contrary to assurances which Western intermediaries felt they had been given by Nasser that no capital sentences would be carried out..

    To make matters worse, the Israeli government lied about its involvement in the affair until 2005, when they admitted to carrying out, and get this, even awarded the perpetrators of the bombings with certificates of appreciation, delivered to them straight from the Israeli president’s hands.

    And LatW thinks this is all just very praiseworthy. Because nothing is more admirable than bombing your allies, some of whom have been extraordinarily generous with you in the past, aiding you diplomatically and supplying you with critical weaponry. And of course there’s nothing wrong with attempting to destabilize a large country like Egypt in service of Israel’s “security”, because as LatW’s hero Golda Meir would say “There is no Zionism except the rescue of Jews.” With this sort of amoral thinking, it doesn’t surprise me at all that Ukraine shelled Polish citizens a few weeks ago. It’s especially grating when LatW preens and lectures, making explicit moral arguments in Ukraine’s defense, then turns around and endorses Israel’s villainous policies as something to emulate.

    @German_Reader

    She’s a woman (formerly commenting as LatvianWoman)…how can you not know this after several years?

    Lol, I had not previously been aware of LatW being a female. This explains a lot. I used to think her ramblings on the “beautiful and masculine” Chechens were him being a closeted gay. But this makes more sense.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @Yahya


    Because nothing is more admirable than bombing your allies, some of whom have been extraordinarily generous with you in the past, aiding you diplomatically and supplying you with critical weaponry.
     
    There were those revelations a few years ago that apparently Israeli security services created a totally fictitious terror group in Lebanon in the early 1980s that killed a non-trivial number of civilians in car bombings. Even better, it looks like they tried to assassinate the US ambassador (Jewish himself).
    I suppose it makes a certain sense when you regard Israel as an integral part of its region (not like other states in the neighbourhood haven't employed ruthless methods themselves). But definitely at odds with how quite a few Westerners view the country.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @A123

    , @LatW
    @Yahya


    even first-hand, knowledge of Israeli state policy, yet she wholly endorses their behavior, thinks its just wonderful, something to be emulated.
     
    Let me explain. It wasn't meant literally, that everything should be done the way Israel does (so do not take it as literally). I used this example of a simple security procedure to illustrate the care with which Israel approaches her citizens and her statehood. It doesn't mean I support everything they do from the moral pov, obviously Ukraine would have her own style and the Ukrainian moral code and customs would be in place.


    I heard somewhere that at one point there used to be roughly the same number of Ukrainians as Russians (or at least their proportions were closer in size). They also lived in a larger territory than now, they have been assimilated by Russians in very large numbers, often willingly. Somehow I doubt this would've happened if someone like Golda Meir had been in charge of them. If I'm not mistaken, she used to say things like "Do not assume that your enemy will not attack you. Just be prepared when they do". That's all, really. I'm not insisting that historically Ukrainians had the means to be that way, but maybe they will in the future? Or at least, if they had acted that way before the invasion, they may have been able to avert some damage. I'm not saying this to put down their efforts, obviously, their efforts are immense, it's just that there is some discussion among the patriots about why the Russians were able to move in so quickly.

    And LatW thinks this is all just very praiseworthy
     
    No. What I had in mind was something else. More like.. last week during the Russian air raids on Zaporizhya, a maternity hospital was crushed and a newborn who was only 2 days old was killed (he already had a name, little Seryozha). The Ukrainian troops immediately identified where the fire came from and immediately fired back destroying those who had murdered this child. This is what I had in mind.

    “beautiful and masculine” Chechens
     
    Haha. I wouldn't go there (although some Kists are attractive). They sported a good look before the invasion (with black uniforms). But of course Kadyrovites are poseurs who don't really observe the traditional Chechen culture, afaik, and, of course, they shouldn't be in Ukraine in the first place.
    , @Mr. Hack
    @Yahya

    I rarely if ever comment about Israeli/Moslem relations in the Middle East simply because I really do not know enough about these affairs to make any real informed opinions. I used to know a bit about Ottoman affairs, but that's about as far as it went with me. Perhaps, once I retire and have more time for reading, I'll delve more deeply into this history. LatW apparently has a deeper understanding of these affairs, so you'll need to address your concerns to her. I was, however, more interested in your knowledge of Lebanese ethno-genesis, and was waiting to hear back from you from a comment that I made above directly addresed to your attention about some things that you had written above, that didn't quite make sense to me:



    Copts and Assyrians share two of these factors, but they lack the millennia-long child sacrifice practices of Phoenicians, so ultimately aren’t as smart or beautiful as the Lebanese.
     
    Could you further explain how “millenia-long child sacrifices” practiced by the Phoenicians could possibly have a positive influence on the Lebanese acquiring a “Gold Standard” among Arabs?
     

    Replies: @Yahya

  748. German_reader says:
    @Yahya
    @Mr. Hack


    He has a wide breadth of knowledge and offers interesting opinions on a wide range of topics.
     
    I agree that LatW is an intelligent and knowledgeable commentor.

    I'm just irritated at her positive references to Israel's vile "defense" policies. I used to give her (and you) the benefit of the doubt, thinking that she's a typically gullible Westerner/European who's been brainwashed by Zionist propaganda to think Israel is some heroic David fighting against the Arab Goliath. But her last comment on the topic clearly displayed she has some, even first-hand, knowledge of Israeli state policy, yet she wholly endorses their behavior, thinks its just wonderful, something to be emulated. Lol.

    Putting aside the multitude of dirty tactics the Israeli state employs to further its foreign policy ends (you can look up the Deir Yassin massacre, the Qibya massacre, the USS Liberty incident, and Irgun and Lehi terrorism against the British, to name a few); the one that made me lose most of the sympathy I had for Israel was the 1954 Lavon affair, in which a group of Egyptian Jews were recruited by Israel to carry out bombings of British and American buildings in Egypt, in an effort to pin the blame on Egypt and induce Britain and America to go to war with the country. This is the affair as described by Israeli/Zionist scholar Benny Morris in Righteous Victims:


    At the beginning of July 1954, Unit 131, a psychological warfare department of IDF Intelligence, launched a long-dormant Egyptian-Jewish network on a bombing campaign in the streets of Cairo and Alexandria, targeting American and British cultural centers and other sensitive Western sites. Unfortunately for the Israelis, one of the saboteurs was caught on July 23, as a bomb he was carrying in his pocket began to emit smoke. Under torture he revealed names and addresses, and within forty-eight hours the whole network was in Egyptian hands. Israel dissociated itself from the affair, but nobody believed it. One of the captured saboteurs was tortured to death, and an Israeli agent, picked up along with the network, committed suicide. In January 1955 most of the network were given stiff prison sentences, two were acquitted, and two were sentenced to death—and almost immediately executed, contrary to assurances which Western intermediaries felt they had been given by Nasser that no capital sentences would be carried out..
     
    To make matters worse, the Israeli government lied about its involvement in the affair until 2005, when they admitted to carrying out, and get this, even awarded the perpetrators of the bombings with certificates of appreciation, delivered to them straight from the Israeli president's hands.

    And LatW thinks this is all just very praiseworthy. Because nothing is more admirable than bombing your allies, some of whom have been extraordinarily generous with you in the past, aiding you diplomatically and supplying you with critical weaponry. And of course there's nothing wrong with attempting to destabilize a large country like Egypt in service of Israel's "security", because as LatW's hero Golda Meir would say “There is no Zionism except the rescue of Jews.” With this sort of amoral thinking, it doesn't surprise me at all that Ukraine shelled Polish citizens a few weeks ago. It's especially grating when LatW preens and lectures, making explicit moral arguments in Ukraine's defense, then turns around and endorses Israel's villainous policies as something to emulate.

    @German_Reader


    She’s a woman (formerly commenting as LatvianWoman)…how can you not know this after several years?

     

    Lol, I had not previously been aware of LatW being a female. This explains a lot. I used to think her ramblings on the "beautiful and masculine" Chechens were him being a closeted gay. But this makes more sense.

    Replies: @German_reader, @LatW, @Mr. Hack

    Because nothing is more admirable than bombing your allies, some of whom have been extraordinarily generous with you in the past, aiding you diplomatically and supplying you with critical weaponry.

    There were those revelations a few years ago that apparently Israeli security services created a totally fictitious terror group in Lebanon in the early 1980s that killed a non-trivial number of civilians in car bombings. Even better, it looks like they tried to assassinate the US ambassador (Jewish himself).
    I suppose it makes a certain sense when you regard Israel as an integral part of its region (not like other states in the neighbourhood haven’t employed ruthless methods themselves). But definitely at odds with how quite a few Westerners view the country.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader


    But definitely at odds with how quite a few Westerners view the country.
     
    Israel is an openly apartheid state (although Western MSM studiously avoid calling it that). Israel officially (in writing) proclaimed itself to be a Jewish state, which infringes on the rights of all its non-Jewish citizens, even non-religious Jews. In Israel you cannot legally marry without a ceremony in Jewish Temple. I know that from non-religious Jews who worked in my lab. To marry legally, they go to Cyprus, get married there, and then come back to Israel: Israel recognizes foreign marriage certificates. Israeli Arab citizens have reduced rights by an Israeli “law” (Nazi Germany and apartheid South Africa had “laws” that would be crimes in any remotely civilized country). Another glaring example: Israel has a law that land and other real estate can be sold buy an Arab to a Jew, but no real estate owned by any Jew can be sold to an Arab. You cannot be more apartheid than that.

    Replies: @A123

    , @A123
    @German_reader

    Of course a standard Taqiyya deception tactic is falsely blaming things done by Muslims against their fellow Muslims on Israel.

    For example, is now 100% proven that Muslims killed Shireen Abu Akleh. Technical analysis of physical evidence unequivocally proves that there were no IDF troops in a position to be the source of the bullet.

    If that is not bad enough, Muslims openly abuse others Muslims: (1)


    Palestinians: The House Demolitions and Land-Grabs No One Talks About

    • The raid on the village came after the Hamas-controlled Land Authority in the Gaza Strip ruled that the residents must be evacuated because they had built their homes on "state-owned" lands.

    • Sources in the Gaza Strip said that there are 28 more villages slated for demolition by Hamas on the pretext that they were illegally built on public lands.

    • "The Hamas security forces prevented the ambulances from entering the village.... That's why we had to take the injured to hospital in our cars." — Yahya Abu Thariyeh, a resident of Umm al-Nasr, independentarabia.com, June 11, 2022
     


    While the international community and media continue to condemn Israel day in and day out about a host of grievances, including the demolition of houses built without proper permits, no one seems to be interested in the ongoing human rights violations against Palestinians by the Palestinian Islamist group Hamas.

    The United Nations and many foreign journalists are so obsessed with Israel that they have paid no attention to the latest crime committed by Hamas against residents of the Bedouin village of Umm al-Nasr in the northern Gaza Strip. The village was established nearly 80 years ago, long before Hamas was founded in 1988.
     

    Why does the Islamophile, Fake Stream Media not give this headline coverage.

    Could it be that today's media is anti-Semitic? Say it ain't so!

    The manufactured fiction that Muslim colonists in Judea & Samaria are victims rather than aggressors is slipping badly. Consider it a side benefit of the Abraham Accords.

    PEACE 😇
    ___________

    (1) https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/18613/palestinians-house-demolitions

  749. @A123
    @showmethereal


    24 hour Nurburgring is the most exciting – lol.
     
    Also available as a full replay.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Areco0Nw2Mo

    LeMans had been neutered in the name of environmentalism and cutting costs. But Le Mans used to be in the top 2 also
     
    The full Le Mans circuit does not get much use, so cost/safety is a business necessity. The new change to HyperCar is largely driven by the need to slow the top class by 15-20 mph. There is simply not enough money to bring all 8+ miles of track up to standards with the speeds prototypes can achieve.

    The most powerful cars allowed at the full Nordschleife in large competitions (such as the 24 hr) are GT3. You might find some historics that could be faster, but owners do not want to risk destroying them.

    Spa went too far with asphalt run off and put some gravel traps back in.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @showmethereal

    Yeah I like Spa too…. But not as much as the other two. But are you sure it was cost if the track? In fact the prototype manufacturers- Toyota – Audi – Porsche – Peugeot were spending big money until Le Mans neutered them. My guess is they could have found a way. But yeah Le Man is going to allow GT 3 in the same way other races do. So we might see some of the same competitors at the Nurburgring and Le Mans (if that story was correct).

  750. @Beckow
    @Mr. Hack

    Hollywood Reporter described the law in an evasive, lying way: they took pieces that may (or not) be in the law and elaborated with very loaded words. That's how you do propaganda for stupid people.

    They mix up different things, some are criminal, e.g. falsely disclosing military situation that impacts morale - and many Euro countries have the same or more drastic laws, US manages it with tight media control.

    Describing the war as war is not a crime and nobody will be prosecuted for it - unless it is added to other things that the Hollywood Reporter chooses to omit. All laws have pompous statements that are not enforceable and not meant to be enforced. But you are free to believe whatever they feed you.

    You are embarrassing yourself with gullible repetition of obvious propaganda.

    Replies: @showmethereal

    Give credit where credit is due. Western psyops have spent billions studying human thought and behavior to propagandize the masses to great effect. One of the greatest tricks is the lie that they consume “free and fair” media

  751. @German_reader
    @Yahya


    Because nothing is more admirable than bombing your allies, some of whom have been extraordinarily generous with you in the past, aiding you diplomatically and supplying you with critical weaponry.
     
    There were those revelations a few years ago that apparently Israeli security services created a totally fictitious terror group in Lebanon in the early 1980s that killed a non-trivial number of civilians in car bombings. Even better, it looks like they tried to assassinate the US ambassador (Jewish himself).
    I suppose it makes a certain sense when you regard Israel as an integral part of its region (not like other states in the neighbourhood haven't employed ruthless methods themselves). But definitely at odds with how quite a few Westerners view the country.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @A123

    But definitely at odds with how quite a few Westerners view the country.

    Israel is an openly apartheid state (although Western MSM studiously avoid calling it that). Israel officially (in writing) proclaimed itself to be a Jewish state, which infringes on the rights of all its non-Jewish citizens, even non-religious Jews. In Israel you cannot legally marry without a ceremony in Jewish Temple. I know that from non-religious Jews who worked in my lab. To marry legally, they go to Cyprus, get married there, and then come back to Israel: Israel recognizes foreign marriage certificates. Israeli Arab citizens have reduced rights by an Israeli “law” (Nazi Germany and apartheid South Africa had “laws” that would be crimes in any remotely civilized country). Another glaring example: Israel has a law that land and other real estate can be sold buy an Arab to a Jew, but no real estate owned by any Jew can be sold to an Arab. You cannot be more apartheid than that.

    • Replies: @A123
    @AnonfromTN


    Israel is an openly apartheid state (although Western MSM studiously avoid calling it that).
     
    Huh? Let me Fix That For You

    The Muslim Authority in the West Bank is openly apartheid state (although Western MSM studiously avoid calling it that).

     
    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ExGm-KeWUAAAHvZ.jpg
     

    Mecca & Medina are the most Apartheid cities on the planet.

    In the interest of religious parity, let us apply the same standard to the Christian & Jewish Holy Cites (Jerusalem & Bethlehem). Some how fairness is off the table. And Muslims are always the privileged. Why is that?

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  752. @German_reader
    @AP


    whereas Balts are just victims
     
    No, they aren't. You mentioned Red Riflemen yourself. Latvians supposedly also had the highest per capita rate of Holocaust perpetrators. My own grandfather (who may or may not have participated in crimes himself, I can't know for sure) saw Latvian auxiliaries beating up Jews in Minsk. Of course that wouldn't have happened without the prior Soviet crimes in 1940/41 and without the German occupation, and I once even used to have some sympathy for Balts because of their historical experiences. I don't anymore given their unhinged behaviour during the current crisis. And what happened in 1941 and 1944 is only of limited relevance today anyway, unless one approaches international politics as a form of collective trauma therapy, like a lot of Balts and Poles seem to do.

    A weak Russia means safety for the Baltic republics.
     
    Safety for the Baltic republics lies in the NATO forces stationed there, even if they're merely tripwire forces, they'd almost certainly ensure a strong reaction in case of a Russian invasion (and I haven't yet seen a plausible scenario why Russia would want to invade the Baltic states anyway). I know you always feel compelled to be in "professional Ukrainian" mode (as utu aptly put it before his disappearance), but Ukraine is fighting for herself, for nobody else, and claims to the contrary are just exercises in public relations.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @AnonfromTN, @AP

    I don’t anymore given their unhinged behaviour during the current crisis.

    Did you ever consider the possibility that maybe the Jews deserved it?

    Ha ha just kidding. It is erroneous and illogical and stupid to inflict a material penalty on a class of people. It’s not just if you care about justice and you definitely should. It creates enemies unnecessarily which is not pragmatic taken to 11 even if you are Satanic and insensitive to the Platonic good of justice.

    Jews, Latvians, Germans. Russians, Ukrainians. When it comes to dealing punishments the presumption of innocence is as close to a tautology (P>.99999999999999999999) as we have got.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @Emil Nikola Richard

    It is very convenient for some Germans to talk that way about Eastern Europeans. They created a hell, together with their Soviet friends, in which people turned on their neighbors, and now they can point fingers.

  753. @Sher Singh
    @showmethereal

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1040104857660555284/1046905075940991006/image.png

    Replies: @showmethereal

    What does that have to do with Sikhs in India and the Toronto area?

  754. @sudden death
    @songbird

    NATO and nuclear weapons are worthless without political will to act in case of crisis and politicians, taking money from RF, like LePen (promising to get out of NATO military structure) are doing everything to weaken both political will and military capabilities. In theory, somebody might be just idealist isolationist without any foreign influence, but the end result will be also destruction of that political will.

    RF will certainly cross any NATO boundaries if they will calculate that there is no political will to stand against and react:

    https://twitter.com/RadioJustBack/status/1502769211969622017?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1502769211969622017%7Ctwgr%5E7d8d68f0858648bcc4010bdf8e44c3526a627042%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.reddit.com%2Fr%2FUkraineWarVideoReport%2Fsearch%2F%3Fq%3Dkorotchenkosort%3Drelevancet%3Dall

    Replies: @sudden death, @songbird

    btw, this RF state TV show was done in December 2021 and they did fig leaf spoken disclaimer about it being just theoretical script as RF has no such intentions, but at the time they were speaking absolutely the same about UA too, despite preparing for real invasion meanwhile.

  755. @German_reader
    @Yahya


    Because nothing is more admirable than bombing your allies, some of whom have been extraordinarily generous with you in the past, aiding you diplomatically and supplying you with critical weaponry.
     
    There were those revelations a few years ago that apparently Israeli security services created a totally fictitious terror group in Lebanon in the early 1980s that killed a non-trivial number of civilians in car bombings. Even better, it looks like they tried to assassinate the US ambassador (Jewish himself).
    I suppose it makes a certain sense when you regard Israel as an integral part of its region (not like other states in the neighbourhood haven't employed ruthless methods themselves). But definitely at odds with how quite a few Westerners view the country.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @A123

    Of course a standard Taqiyya deception tactic is falsely blaming things done by Muslims against their fellow Muslims on Israel.

    For example, is now 100% proven that Muslims killed Shireen Abu Akleh. Technical analysis of physical evidence unequivocally proves that there were no IDF troops in a position to be the source of the bullet.

    If that is not bad enough, Muslims openly abuse others Muslims: (1)

    Palestinians: The House Demolitions and Land-Grabs No One Talks About

    • The raid on the village came after the Hamas-controlled Land Authority in the Gaza Strip ruled that the residents must be evacuated because they had built their homes on “state-owned” lands.

    • Sources in the Gaza Strip said that there are 28 more villages slated for demolition by Hamas on the pretext that they were illegally built on public lands.

    • “The Hamas security forces prevented the ambulances from entering the village…. That’s why we had to take the injured to hospital in our cars.” — Yahya Abu Thariyeh, a resident of Umm al-Nasr, independentarabia.com, June 11, 2022

    While the international community and media continue to condemn Israel day in and day out about a host of grievances, including the demolition of houses built without proper permits, no one seems to be interested in the ongoing human rights violations against Palestinians by the Palestinian Islamist group Hamas.

    The United Nations and many foreign journalists are so obsessed with Israel that they have paid no attention to the latest crime committed by Hamas against residents of the Bedouin village of Umm al-Nasr in the northern Gaza Strip. The village was established nearly 80 years ago, long before Hamas was founded in 1988.

    Why does the Islamophile, Fake Stream Media not give this headline coverage.

    Could it be that today’s media is anti-Semitic? Say it ain’t so!

    The manufactured fiction that Muslim colonists in Judea & Samaria are victims rather than aggressors is slipping badly. Consider it a side benefit of the Abraham Accords.

    PEACE 😇
    ___________

    (1) https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/18613/palestinians-house-demolitions

  756. @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader


    But definitely at odds with how quite a few Westerners view the country.
     
    Israel is an openly apartheid state (although Western MSM studiously avoid calling it that). Israel officially (in writing) proclaimed itself to be a Jewish state, which infringes on the rights of all its non-Jewish citizens, even non-religious Jews. In Israel you cannot legally marry without a ceremony in Jewish Temple. I know that from non-religious Jews who worked in my lab. To marry legally, they go to Cyprus, get married there, and then come back to Israel: Israel recognizes foreign marriage certificates. Israeli Arab citizens have reduced rights by an Israeli “law” (Nazi Germany and apartheid South Africa had “laws” that would be crimes in any remotely civilized country). Another glaring example: Israel has a law that land and other real estate can be sold buy an Arab to a Jew, but no real estate owned by any Jew can be sold to an Arab. You cannot be more apartheid than that.

    Replies: @A123

    Israel is an openly apartheid state (although Western MSM studiously avoid calling it that).

    Huh? Let me Fix That For You

    The Muslim Authority in the West Bank is openly apartheid state (although Western MSM studiously avoid calling it that).

      

    Mecca & Medina are the most Apartheid cities on the planet.

    In the interest of religious parity, let us apply the same standard to the Christian & Jewish Holy Cites (Jerusalem & Bethlehem). Some how fairness is off the table. And Muslims are always the privileged. Why is that?

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @A123

    I’ve noticed that you did not deny that openly discriminatory “laws” are in effect in Israel. I guess this can be counted as progress.

    As to Muslims, it is a fact that >90% of terrorists in the world are Islamic terrorists (Israeli and Ukie terrorists are vying for the second place now that Tamil terrorists are out of the picture). It is also a fact that quite a few Islamic terrorist organizations were enabled, financed, trained, and armed by the US and Israel.

    From my perspective, every terrorist deserves capital punishment. Organizers, enablers, funders, and functionaries of any terrorist organization deserve life in prison or worse. But the police and legal system have a right to persecute criminals only if they are not criminals themselves. Skirmishes between criminal gangs cannot count as law enforcement.

    Replies: @LondonBob, @A123

  757. @songbird
    @LatW


    it’s not just negative, there is a positive side, too (mostly internally facing)
     
    I'm oversimplifying a lot, in trying to make my analogy. I don't think it would be true to say that Irish nationalism was wholly a negative feeling against the English, or English nationalism wholly a negative feeling against the French or Germans, etc. But I do suspect that these negative feelings may have been like rutted wagon tracks, and have impeded a quick readjustment to the threat of mass migration. That the old antagonisms in Western Europe in current times have all the significance of sports rivalries, channeling and subverting the healthy instinct for tribe into outlets acceptable to the regime.

    even if AfD is a mild party by my standards
     
    I don't like their blank-slatist rhetoric myself, but isn't it essentially German law? With the state repression against them, they need to try to accommodate themselves to the system, to appear on any ballot. As I've long said, I suspect that there is no political solution for Germany. That in the distant future, parts of it may end up being annexed, by Poland or Denmark (as improbable as that seems now), with the native Germans welcoming it.

    just not when their voters lecture to Eastern Europeans about things they have never experienced themselves.
     
    I haven't followed the rhetoric too closely, but I suspect that much of it might be a clutzy attempt to verbalize national interests, rather than a desire to lecture.

    If they side with our enemy (or get paid by him), that ends.
     
    historically, neutral countries usually carry out trade, when not impeded by military barriers. This is not tantamount to wanting to sell arms to them, or join their army. It is mostly about serving national interests. (not that I would categorize Western Europe as neutral now). I don't think it is right to categorize it as perfidy. EEs are certainly not ordering their behavior for the maximum benefit of Western Euros - it is more like they want them to adopt their foreign policy, regardless of costs incurred.

    Trade embargoes strike me as an idea that springs from American hegemony. To illustrate the point, we have Zeihan comically saying that the Russians blew up their own pipeline, that the Swedes have the proof, and that America has no choice but to enforce international property norms, and embargo any European country doing business with Russia, whether Europeans want them to or not.

    The kind of “antagonists” that you have in mind that are negative also occasionally try to make moves and sometimes receive a response.
     
    IMO, Russian will never cross NATO's borders.

    Perhaps, you see the potential of some future alliance with Ukraine - something to counter the poz, and see Russia as impeding that, by weakening Ukraine territorially? Of course, I have said that Ukraine appears very pozzed to me now given its per capita, but the future is hard to predict.

    Replies: @LatW

    I don’t think it would be true to say that Irish nationalism was wholly a negative feeling against the English

    Not at all, wouldn’t you say nationalism exists on its own? I thought we were talking about ethnocentrism, not nationalism, those are slightly different things. Every nation is a priori ethnocentric, right? Nationalism is more of a political manifestation. But there might be something to it, this is the case with freedom, when you know you can lose it, you value it more? This is an undervalued aspect in the conversation about Ukraine as well. They talk a lot about territory and language rights (although those are connected to freedom) but not about how Ukrainians simply do not want to live under someone tyrannical, especially under a tyrannical outsider.

    [MORE]

    But I do suspect that these negative feelings may have been like rutted wagon tracks, and have impeded a quick readjustment to the threat of mass migration.

    Maybe, or maybe the immigration into Ireland wasn’t perceived as a negative in the beginning (by your average citizen)? I’m not familiar with the original profile of the migrants, weren’t most of them peaceful and employed? I mean, most people will not object to an Indian female nurse that speaks your language, right? Of course, it’s far from great how things have turned out overall. I haven’t been to Ireland in a while, so don’t know how things look on the ground.

    Also, one thing you might want to keep in mind is that not all whites act the same among other whites. In Western Europe or the US you don’t notice this, but historically some Russians have sometimes had a certain type of demeanor or behaviors that really make them stand out (for example, they are louder than others, their women use more makeup and are more sexualized, etc) – this is not necessarily liked by everyone, regardless of them being a “former occupier”. Obviously, this depends on the person, but this is a common stereotype. Or at least used to be, that is changing too.

    I don’t like their blank-slatist rhetoric myself, but isn’t it essentially German law?

    Tbh, these types of nationalist parties may simply not be able to reach above a certain level of electoral support. And in a democratic environment, one has to respect that one’s compatriots, the majority of them anyway, may not want to vote for these parties (e.g., accept far right ideas or even basic conservatism). Haven’t you ever felt that it would seem arrogant to tell others how they should be politically? The problem is when their complacent politics start affecting everyone.

    I haven’t followed the rhetoric too closely, but I suspect that much of it might be a clutzy attempt to verbalize national interests, rather than a desire to lecture.

    No, it’s at a systemic level where they think they know better, that they are better and that everyone should accept their political ideas (including social experiments). It even gets to absurd things like we see above, where a German will insinuate that Latvians are worse Nazis than the Germans themselves (very convenient), etc, etc. I’m not saying it’s every Westerner, definitely not most, but enough of them. It’s been that way for decades now (and obviously it will be related to poz as well, since they will promote poz very happily and with great enthusiasm and will always find local allies).

    historically, neutral countries usually carry out trade, when not impeded by military barriers. This is not tantamount to wanting to sell arms to them, or join their army. It is mostly about serving national interests.

    The problem is that it’s not just trade. Neutral country with plenty of self-defense doing just trade would be great. But there are few such countries overall, maybe not that realistic these days.

    IMO, Russian will never cross NATO’s borders.

    They have in some ways (airspace, spying, expecting the EU institutions to observe their ethnic rights while they don’t observe minority rights at home). But that’s not what I meant, what I meant was that those antagonists from the woke side, that you had in mind, I’m assuming, that they, too, sometimes act out and in some cases are met with resistance (maybe not enough). You sounded like you were saying that because of the Russian antagonists, the Baltic states or Ukraine are not aware of the poz. This is not the case. I don’t think one should choose between the two, they can both be banished. But, of course, the people will decide how it plays out, if the people are meek or find benefits in the poz (which many do, objectively, quite a few people get financial benefit or emotional gratification out of it so they won’t consider it an “antagonist” at all but something that adds to their life), then it will come through. Maybe not to the extent as in the West, but that’s little solace.

    you see the potential of some future alliance with Ukraine – something to counter the poz, and see Russia as impeding that, by weakening Ukraine territorially?

    Very much so. Russia practically destroyed Eastern Ukraine which would’ve been the biggest anti-poz bastion, for purely selfish reasons and out of jealousy. But in general, it is not Ukraine’s job to “counter the poz”, Ukraine’s job is to preserve themselves first and foremost.

    I have said that Ukraine appears very pozzed to me now given its per capita

    They may be low GDP per capita but they are high IQ and quite exposed to Europe. And they don’t have the type of traditionalist rules as in some non-white countries. But I don’t know why you consider them more pozzed, the Ukrainians I notice are not pozzed at all, not sure they will prevail, of course, they could get pushed aside in the future.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @LatW


    It even gets to absurd things like we see above, where a German will insinuate that Latvians are worse Nazis than the Germans themselves (very convenient)
     
    I insinuated nothing of the sort, and normally I wouldn't bring it up (as I said I can't know for sure after all what my own relatives did or didn't do, and in any case it's of course true that ultimate responsibility lies with Germany). But when someone like AP comes up with such moralistic pseudo-arguments, I'm still going to make the obvious counter-point.
    And it would be a dumb argument even if all Balts had been completely innocent angels 80 years (!) ago. Victimhood doesn't give people a kind of special wisdom that should be beyond criticism, it can just as well lead to a distorted perception.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    , @songbird
    @LatW


    Maybe, or maybe the immigration into Ireland wasn’t perceived as a negative in the beginning (by your average citizen)? I’m not familiar with the original profile of the migrants, weren’t most of them peaceful and employed?
     
    I believe the originals were primarily heavily-pregnant Nigerians, exploiting a loophole in the peace process (frankly, I suspect it was there by the design of globalists, but perhaps not) to drop anchor babies. Sometimes, they gave birth on the plane. At one, point, I think most of the babies being born at the Rotunda Hospital in Dublin were Nigerians, or at least foreigners. People were very alarmed by this, naturally. And they actually had a ballot to repeal birthright citzenship that won in a landslide - in one of the rare votes in Europe where some proxy of immigration was ever put before the people.

    If you took a vote of the natives, I am quite sure they would vote against mass migration. There are surveys that say so, but they will never get the vote. Especially now that hate speech laws have been instituted.

    wouldn’t you say nationalism exists on its own? I thought we were talking about ethnocentrism, not nationalism, those are slightly different things. Every nation is a priori ethnocentric, right?
     
    I'm just speaking kind of loosely, simplifying terms, to try to get my analogy across. I think there were ancient ideas of ethnos, complete with some level of ethnocentrism.

    The exact definition of nationalism, IMO, depends on how romantic or mechanistic a view of it one wants to take. The romantic view is that it is something with old or even ancient underpinnings. The mechanistic view is that it is something modern, perhaps, requiring certain technologies to encourage a high threshold of cooperation.

    My personal bias is for the romantic view.

    But for my analogy, I am considering something more like a modern or legacy culture, which names the outgroup. I suspect this sort of legacy culture, as it has developed, might be a handicap, in modern times. In some, it spawns silly antagonistic feelings (it is actually amusing how often this can be seen with brands of beer), while others may dismiss all calls to ethnocentrism based on how silly some of these old antagonisms seem.

    Tbh, these types of nationalist parties may simply not be able to reach above a certain level of electoral support. And in a democratic environment, one has to respect that one’s compatriots, the majority of them anyway, may not want to vote for these parties
     
    Yes, this is shortfall of democracy. Most like to vote for legacy parties. I don't think people are very capable of re-adjusting, after they reach a certain age. And many are simply programmed by the regime to support it, and to not support the thing the regime opposes.

    But I don’t know why you consider them more pozzed, the Ukrainians I notice are not pozzed at all
     
    There was that story I linked to twice about a hockey player doing some taunt with a banana to an American-born black player, in the Donbass no less, and it seems like they really threw the book at him. Didn't they also fly a giant rainbow flag in Kiev? And Ze was in that skit where he was naked with a black man in a supermarket. And there appeared to be very large numbers of foreign students, before the war, which I would argue is partly a scheme by the regime in Western Europe to launder them, by giving them credentials.

    I wouldn't say these things are necessarily reflective on the general pop, but the elites definitely seem in the pozzed camp, or at least appear to be signaling allegiance to it. (just like in many other countries)
  758. @German_reader
    @AP


    whereas Balts are just victims
     
    No, they aren't. You mentioned Red Riflemen yourself. Latvians supposedly also had the highest per capita rate of Holocaust perpetrators. My own grandfather (who may or may not have participated in crimes himself, I can't know for sure) saw Latvian auxiliaries beating up Jews in Minsk. Of course that wouldn't have happened without the prior Soviet crimes in 1940/41 and without the German occupation, and I once even used to have some sympathy for Balts because of their historical experiences. I don't anymore given their unhinged behaviour during the current crisis. And what happened in 1941 and 1944 is only of limited relevance today anyway, unless one approaches international politics as a form of collective trauma therapy, like a lot of Balts and Poles seem to do.

    A weak Russia means safety for the Baltic republics.
     
    Safety for the Baltic republics lies in the NATO forces stationed there, even if they're merely tripwire forces, they'd almost certainly ensure a strong reaction in case of a Russian invasion (and I haven't yet seen a plausible scenario why Russia would want to invade the Baltic states anyway). I know you always feel compelled to be in "professional Ukrainian" mode (as utu aptly put it before his disappearance), but Ukraine is fighting for herself, for nobody else, and claims to the contrary are just exercises in public relations.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @AnonfromTN, @AP

    Safety for the Baltic republics lies in the NATO forces stationed there

    The only thing that would make Baltic republics safe is decent behavior. Yet their “leaders” assiduously destroy their safety by stupid militant statements. As to NATO, did you actually read Article 5? It says that if one of the NATO countries experiences aggression from the outside, all other NATO members have to assist it, and each member has a right to decide how exactly. So, if a member decides to send the victim of aggression pampers, this member thereby fulfils its obligations under Article 5.

    In NATO, only the US military has capabilities to do something consequential. In a private discussion a former NATO military analyst told me that if push comes to shove, the US would not risk endangering its own cities for the sake of responding to an attack on any European target, not only Vilnius or Warsaw, but even Berlin, Paris, or London. Indeed, the US has a long history of double-crossing its allies, Kurds being the latest example.

    • Replies: @LondonBob
    @AnonfromTN

    The Soviet Union voluntarily withdrew from the Baltic states.

    Anyway what is the point of talking about these countries as if they are independent, they are really just city states, entirely run by the US, they will adopt whatever policy the State Department tells them to.

    , @sudden death
    @AnonfromTN


    The only thing that would make Baltic republics safe is decent behavior. Yet their “leaders” assiduously destroy their safety by stupid militant statements.
     
    This is also typical, but usefully illuminating example of currently dominant mentality, both Sovok and imperial/national, i.e. just "speaking" about/for them is enough of a cause to invade.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @LatW

    , @A123
    @AnonfromTN


    In a private discussion a former NATO military analyst told me that if push comes to shove, the US would not risk endangering its own cities
     
    By "former" you mean "no actual knowledge" of current policy or standing orders. How completely NOT convincing.

    It is remarkably convenient that you have a single, anonymous source for this tidbit. Do you work for CNN?


    the US has a long history of double-crossing its allies, Kurds being the latest example
     
    What is the name of the Senate ratified treaty obliging Not-The-President Biden to go to war for the Kurds? No treaty. No betrayal. So you prefer the full NeoConDemocrat solution.

    How many troops would you put into Syria to protect the Kurds?

    As I have pointed out many, many, many, many times. Trump functionally ended U.S. involvement in Syria when he took American troops out of the kill sack between Turkish and Syrian lines.

    The Kurds had plenty of warning that the tiny remaining intelligence (and probably special ops) units left in the Syrian wilderness were unable to provide substantial boots on the ground. The Kurds will get some pretty good intel though.

    PEACE 😇

    , @Mikhail
    @AnonfromTN

    Latest petty Baltic stupidity -

    https://www.insidethegames.biz/articles/1131010/lithuania-figure-skating-russia

  759. @Emil Nikola Richard
    @German_reader


    I don’t anymore given their unhinged behaviour during the current crisis.
     
    Did you ever consider the possibility that maybe the Jews deserved it?

    Ha ha just kidding. It is erroneous and illogical and stupid to inflict a material penalty on a class of people. It's not just if you care about justice and you definitely should. It creates enemies unnecessarily which is not pragmatic taken to 11 even if you are Satanic and insensitive to the Platonic good of justice.

    Jews, Latvians, Germans. Russians, Ukrainians. When it comes to dealing punishments the presumption of innocence is as close to a tautology (P>.99999999999999999999) as we have got.

    Replies: @LatW

    It is very convenient for some Germans to talk that way about Eastern Europeans. They created a hell, together with their Soviet friends, in which people turned on their neighbors, and now they can point fingers.

  760. @A123
    @AnonfromTN


    Israel is an openly apartheid state (although Western MSM studiously avoid calling it that).
     
    Huh? Let me Fix That For You

    The Muslim Authority in the West Bank is openly apartheid state (although Western MSM studiously avoid calling it that).

     
    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ExGm-KeWUAAAHvZ.jpg
     

    Mecca & Medina are the most Apartheid cities on the planet.

    In the interest of religious parity, let us apply the same standard to the Christian & Jewish Holy Cites (Jerusalem & Bethlehem). Some how fairness is off the table. And Muslims are always the privileged. Why is that?

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    I’ve noticed that you did not deny that openly discriminatory “laws” are in effect in Israel. I guess this can be counted as progress.

    As to Muslims, it is a fact that >90% of terrorists in the world are Islamic terrorists (Israeli and Ukie terrorists are vying for the second place now that Tamil terrorists are out of the picture). It is also a fact that quite a few Islamic terrorist organizations were enabled, financed, trained, and armed by the US and Israel.

    From my perspective, every terrorist deserves capital punishment. Organizers, enablers, funders, and functionaries of any terrorist organization deserve life in prison or worse. But the police and legal system have a right to persecute criminals only if they are not criminals themselves. Skirmishes between criminal gangs cannot count as law enforcement.

    • Replies: @LondonBob
    @AnonfromTN

    Jews deserve their own state, it is the other stuff I object to, if they were more pragmatic they would have done a deal.

    , @A123
    @AnonfromTN


    I’ve noticed that you did not deny that openly discriminatory “laws” are in effect in Israel. I guess this can be counted as progress.

     

    ROTFLMAO

    It was so obviously ludicrous, I though that you were going for humor. Islam kills to prevent land transfers. Muslim Israelis can readily buy land from Jews in most of Israel.

    All foreigners have great difficulty buying land, especially residential, in Jewish Palestine. That is not Apartheid. That is preventing land speculation. My understanding is that Ukraine has pretty similar laws, as do many other countries.

    quite a few Islamic terrorist organizations were enabled, financed, trained, and armed by the US and Israel.
     
    20/20 hindsight applies in many places, such as the Mujahideen in Afghanistan.

    The most recent screw up was the U.S. giving money to Turkey to train "Syrian Moderates". That backfired badly.

     

    London Bob,

    Jews deserve their own state, it is the other stuff I object to, if they were more pragmatic they would have done a deal.
     
    It Takes Two to Tango

    If Islam had been more pragmatic this would have been over decades ago. Every pragmatic deal made be the Israelis has been repudiated. Or, other forces have intervened. Iranian Hamas and Palestinian Iranian Jihad [PIJ]. Have only made the situation worse.

    At this point, there us only one path forward.

    ========================================
        Muslim Colonies are the Problem!
           Muslim Decolonization is the Answer!
    ========================================


    Muslims could have had a better deal back in the 80's. Their unilateral violence has made anything vaguely resembling a two state simulation permanently unobtainable. Actions have consequences.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  761. @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader


    Safety for the Baltic republics lies in the NATO forces stationed there
     
    The only thing that would make Baltic republics safe is decent behavior. Yet their “leaders” assiduously destroy their safety by stupid militant statements. As to NATO, did you actually read Article 5? It says that if one of the NATO countries experiences aggression from the outside, all other NATO members have to assist it, and each member has a right to decide how exactly. So, if a member decides to send the victim of aggression pampers, this member thereby fulfils its obligations under Article 5.

    In NATO, only the US military has capabilities to do something consequential. In a private discussion a former NATO military analyst told me that if push comes to shove, the US would not risk endangering its own cities for the sake of responding to an attack on any European target, not only Vilnius or Warsaw, but even Berlin, Paris, or London. Indeed, the US has a long history of double-crossing its allies, Kurds being the latest example.

    Replies: @LondonBob, @sudden death, @A123, @Mikhail

    The Soviet Union voluntarily withdrew from the Baltic states.

    Anyway what is the point of talking about these countries as if they are independent, they are really just city states, entirely run by the US, they will adopt whatever policy the State Department tells them to.

  762. @AnonfromTN
    @A123

    I’ve noticed that you did not deny that openly discriminatory “laws” are in effect in Israel. I guess this can be counted as progress.

    As to Muslims, it is a fact that >90% of terrorists in the world are Islamic terrorists (Israeli and Ukie terrorists are vying for the second place now that Tamil terrorists are out of the picture). It is also a fact that quite a few Islamic terrorist organizations were enabled, financed, trained, and armed by the US and Israel.

    From my perspective, every terrorist deserves capital punishment. Organizers, enablers, funders, and functionaries of any terrorist organization deserve life in prison or worse. But the police and legal system have a right to persecute criminals only if they are not criminals themselves. Skirmishes between criminal gangs cannot count as law enforcement.

    Replies: @LondonBob, @A123

    Jews deserve their own state, it is the other stuff I object to, if they were more pragmatic they would have done a deal.

  763. @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader


    Safety for the Baltic republics lies in the NATO forces stationed there
     
    The only thing that would make Baltic republics safe is decent behavior. Yet their “leaders” assiduously destroy their safety by stupid militant statements. As to NATO, did you actually read Article 5? It says that if one of the NATO countries experiences aggression from the outside, all other NATO members have to assist it, and each member has a right to decide how exactly. So, if a member decides to send the victim of aggression pampers, this member thereby fulfils its obligations under Article 5.

    In NATO, only the US military has capabilities to do something consequential. In a private discussion a former NATO military analyst told me that if push comes to shove, the US would not risk endangering its own cities for the sake of responding to an attack on any European target, not only Vilnius or Warsaw, but even Berlin, Paris, or London. Indeed, the US has a long history of double-crossing its allies, Kurds being the latest example.

    Replies: @LondonBob, @sudden death, @A123, @Mikhail

    The only thing that would make Baltic republics safe is decent behavior. Yet their “leaders” assiduously destroy their safety by stupid militant statements.

    This is also typical, but usefully illuminating example of currently dominant mentality, both Sovok and imperial/national, i.e. just “speaking” about/for them is enough of a cause to invade.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @sudden death


    just “speaking”
     
    They don’t just speak. Baltics actively supply weapons and ammo to the Kiev regime. Baltics banned RF citizens, including Schengen visa holders, from entering. They do other things, but I guess these two examples will suffice.
    , @LatW
    @sudden death

    You could literally just lay there, doing nothing, saying nothing, and they would still invade if it were feasible for them.

  764. @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader


    Safety for the Baltic republics lies in the NATO forces stationed there
     
    The only thing that would make Baltic republics safe is decent behavior. Yet their “leaders” assiduously destroy their safety by stupid militant statements. As to NATO, did you actually read Article 5? It says that if one of the NATO countries experiences aggression from the outside, all other NATO members have to assist it, and each member has a right to decide how exactly. So, if a member decides to send the victim of aggression pampers, this member thereby fulfils its obligations under Article 5.

    In NATO, only the US military has capabilities to do something consequential. In a private discussion a former NATO military analyst told me that if push comes to shove, the US would not risk endangering its own cities for the sake of responding to an attack on any European target, not only Vilnius or Warsaw, but even Berlin, Paris, or London. Indeed, the US has a long history of double-crossing its allies, Kurds being the latest example.

    Replies: @LondonBob, @sudden death, @A123, @Mikhail

    In a private discussion a former NATO military analyst told me that if push comes to shove, the US would not risk endangering its own cities

    By “former” you mean “no actual knowledge” of current policy or standing orders. How completely NOT convincing.

    It is remarkably convenient that you have a single, anonymous source for this tidbit. Do you work for CNN?

    the US has a long history of double-crossing its allies, Kurds being the latest example

    What is the name of the Senate ratified treaty obliging Not-The-President Biden to go to war for the Kurds? No treaty. No betrayal. So you prefer the full NeoConDemocrat solution.

    How many troops would you put into Syria to protect the Kurds?

    As I have pointed out many, many, many, many times. Trump functionally ended U.S. involvement in Syria when he took American troops out of the kill sack between Turkish and Syrian lines.

    The Kurds had plenty of warning that the tiny remaining intelligence (and probably special ops) units left in the Syrian wilderness were unable to provide substantial boots on the ground. The Kurds will get some pretty good intel though.

    PEACE 😇

  765. @Yahya
    @Mr. Hack


    He has a wide breadth of knowledge and offers interesting opinions on a wide range of topics.
     
    I agree that LatW is an intelligent and knowledgeable commentor.

    I'm just irritated at her positive references to Israel's vile "defense" policies. I used to give her (and you) the benefit of the doubt, thinking that she's a typically gullible Westerner/European who's been brainwashed by Zionist propaganda to think Israel is some heroic David fighting against the Arab Goliath. But her last comment on the topic clearly displayed she has some, even first-hand, knowledge of Israeli state policy, yet she wholly endorses their behavior, thinks its just wonderful, something to be emulated. Lol.

    Putting aside the multitude of dirty tactics the Israeli state employs to further its foreign policy ends (you can look up the Deir Yassin massacre, the Qibya massacre, the USS Liberty incident, and Irgun and Lehi terrorism against the British, to name a few); the one that made me lose most of the sympathy I had for Israel was the 1954 Lavon affair, in which a group of Egyptian Jews were recruited by Israel to carry out bombings of British and American buildings in Egypt, in an effort to pin the blame on Egypt and induce Britain and America to go to war with the country. This is the affair as described by Israeli/Zionist scholar Benny Morris in Righteous Victims:


    At the beginning of July 1954, Unit 131, a psychological warfare department of IDF Intelligence, launched a long-dormant Egyptian-Jewish network on a bombing campaign in the streets of Cairo and Alexandria, targeting American and British cultural centers and other sensitive Western sites. Unfortunately for the Israelis, one of the saboteurs was caught on July 23, as a bomb he was carrying in his pocket began to emit smoke. Under torture he revealed names and addresses, and within forty-eight hours the whole network was in Egyptian hands. Israel dissociated itself from the affair, but nobody believed it. One of the captured saboteurs was tortured to death, and an Israeli agent, picked up along with the network, committed suicide. In January 1955 most of the network were given stiff prison sentences, two were acquitted, and two were sentenced to death—and almost immediately executed, contrary to assurances which Western intermediaries felt they had been given by Nasser that no capital sentences would be carried out..
     
    To make matters worse, the Israeli government lied about its involvement in the affair until 2005, when they admitted to carrying out, and get this, even awarded the perpetrators of the bombings with certificates of appreciation, delivered to them straight from the Israeli president's hands.

    And LatW thinks this is all just very praiseworthy. Because nothing is more admirable than bombing your allies, some of whom have been extraordinarily generous with you in the past, aiding you diplomatically and supplying you with critical weaponry. And of course there's nothing wrong with attempting to destabilize a large country like Egypt in service of Israel's "security", because as LatW's hero Golda Meir would say “There is no Zionism except the rescue of Jews.” With this sort of amoral thinking, it doesn't surprise me at all that Ukraine shelled Polish citizens a few weeks ago. It's especially grating when LatW preens and lectures, making explicit moral arguments in Ukraine's defense, then turns around and endorses Israel's villainous policies as something to emulate.

    @German_Reader


    She’s a woman (formerly commenting as LatvianWoman)…how can you not know this after several years?

     

    Lol, I had not previously been aware of LatW being a female. This explains a lot. I used to think her ramblings on the "beautiful and masculine" Chechens were him being a closeted gay. But this makes more sense.

    Replies: @German_reader, @LatW, @Mr. Hack

    even first-hand, knowledge of Israeli state policy, yet she wholly endorses their behavior, thinks its just wonderful, something to be emulated.

    Let me explain. It wasn’t meant literally, that everything should be done the way Israel does (so do not take it as literally). I used this example of a simple security procedure to illustrate the care with which Israel approaches her citizens and her statehood. It doesn’t mean I support everything they do from the moral pov, obviously Ukraine would have her own style and the Ukrainian moral code and customs would be in place.

    [MORE]

    I heard somewhere that at one point there used to be roughly the same number of Ukrainians as Russians (or at least their proportions were closer in size). They also lived in a larger territory than now, they have been assimilated by Russians in very large numbers, often willingly. Somehow I doubt this would’ve happened if someone like Golda Meir had been in charge of them. If I’m not mistaken, she used to say things like “Do not assume that your enemy will not attack you. Just be prepared when they do”. That’s all, really. I’m not insisting that historically Ukrainians had the means to be that way, but maybe they will in the future? Or at least, if they had acted that way before the invasion, they may have been able to avert some damage. I’m not saying this to put down their efforts, obviously, their efforts are immense, it’s just that there is some discussion among the patriots about why the Russians were able to move in so quickly.

    And LatW thinks this is all just very praiseworthy

    No. What I had in mind was something else. More like.. last week during the Russian air raids on Zaporizhya, a maternity hospital was crushed and a newborn who was only 2 days old was killed (he already had a name, little Seryozha). The Ukrainian troops immediately identified where the fire came from and immediately fired back destroying those who had murdered this child. This is what I had in mind.

    “beautiful and masculine” Chechens

    Haha. I wouldn’t go there (although some Kists are attractive). They sported a good look before the invasion (with black uniforms). But of course Kadyrovites are poseurs who don’t really observe the traditional Chechen culture, afaik, and, of course, they shouldn’t be in Ukraine in the first place.

  766. @AnonfromTN
    @A123

    I’ve noticed that you did not deny that openly discriminatory “laws” are in effect in Israel. I guess this can be counted as progress.

    As to Muslims, it is a fact that >90% of terrorists in the world are Islamic terrorists (Israeli and Ukie terrorists are vying for the second place now that Tamil terrorists are out of the picture). It is also a fact that quite a few Islamic terrorist organizations were enabled, financed, trained, and armed by the US and Israel.

    From my perspective, every terrorist deserves capital punishment. Organizers, enablers, funders, and functionaries of any terrorist organization deserve life in prison or worse. But the police and legal system have a right to persecute criminals only if they are not criminals themselves. Skirmishes between criminal gangs cannot count as law enforcement.

    Replies: @LondonBob, @A123

    I’ve noticed that you did not deny that openly discriminatory “laws” are in effect in Israel. I guess this can be counted as progress.

    ROTFLMAO

    It was so obviously ludicrous, I though that you were going for humor. Islam kills to prevent land transfers. Muslim Israelis can readily buy land from Jews in most of Israel.

    All foreigners have great difficulty buying land, especially residential, in Jewish Palestine. That is not Apartheid. That is preventing land speculation. My understanding is that Ukraine has pretty similar laws, as do many other countries.

    quite a few Islamic terrorist organizations were enabled, financed, trained, and armed by the US and Israel.

    20/20 hindsight applies in many places, such as the Mujahideen in Afghanistan.

    The most recent screw up was the U.S. giving money to Turkey to train “Syrian Moderates”. That backfired badly.

    London Bob,

    Jews deserve their own state, it is the other stuff I object to, if they were more pragmatic they would have done a deal.

    It Takes Two to Tango

    If Islam had been more pragmatic this would have been over decades ago. Every pragmatic deal made be the Israelis has been repudiated. Or, other forces have intervened. Iranian Hamas and Palestinian Iranian Jihad [PIJ]. Have only made the situation worse.

    At this point, there us only one path forward.

    ========================================
        Muslim Colonies are the Problem!
           Muslim Decolonization is the Answer!
    ========================================

    Muslims could have had a better deal back in the 80’s. Their unilateral violence has made anything vaguely resembling a two state simulation permanently unobtainable. Actions have consequences.

    PEACE 😇

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @A123


    Muslim Israelis can readily buy land from Jews in most of Israel.
     
    Now, this is simply not true.

    Replies: @A123

  767. German_reader says:
    @LatW
    @songbird


    I don’t think it would be true to say that Irish nationalism was wholly a negative feeling against the English
     
    Not at all, wouldn't you say nationalism exists on its own? I thought we were talking about ethnocentrism, not nationalism, those are slightly different things. Every nation is a priori ethnocentric, right? Nationalism is more of a political manifestation. But there might be something to it, this is the case with freedom, when you know you can lose it, you value it more? This is an undervalued aspect in the conversation about Ukraine as well. They talk a lot about territory and language rights (although those are connected to freedom) but not about how Ukrainians simply do not want to live under someone tyrannical, especially under a tyrannical outsider.

    But I do suspect that these negative feelings may have been like rutted wagon tracks, and have impeded a quick readjustment to the threat of mass migration.
     
    Maybe, or maybe the immigration into Ireland wasn't perceived as a negative in the beginning (by your average citizen)? I'm not familiar with the original profile of the migrants, weren't most of them peaceful and employed? I mean, most people will not object to an Indian female nurse that speaks your language, right? Of course, it's far from great how things have turned out overall. I haven't been to Ireland in a while, so don't know how things look on the ground.

    Also, one thing you might want to keep in mind is that not all whites act the same among other whites. In Western Europe or the US you don't notice this, but historically some Russians have sometimes had a certain type of demeanor or behaviors that really make them stand out (for example, they are louder than others, their women use more makeup and are more sexualized, etc) - this is not necessarily liked by everyone, regardless of them being a "former occupier". Obviously, this depends on the person, but this is a common stereotype. Or at least used to be, that is changing too.

    I don’t like their blank-slatist rhetoric myself, but isn’t it essentially German law?
     
    Tbh, these types of nationalist parties may simply not be able to reach above a certain level of electoral support. And in a democratic environment, one has to respect that one's compatriots, the majority of them anyway, may not want to vote for these parties (e.g., accept far right ideas or even basic conservatism). Haven't you ever felt that it would seem arrogant to tell others how they should be politically? The problem is when their complacent politics start affecting everyone.

    I haven’t followed the rhetoric too closely, but I suspect that much of it might be a clutzy attempt to verbalize national interests, rather than a desire to lecture.
     
    No, it's at a systemic level where they think they know better, that they are better and that everyone should accept their political ideas (including social experiments). It even gets to absurd things like we see above, where a German will insinuate that Latvians are worse Nazis than the Germans themselves (very convenient), etc, etc. I'm not saying it's every Westerner, definitely not most, but enough of them. It's been that way for decades now (and obviously it will be related to poz as well, since they will promote poz very happily and with great enthusiasm and will always find local allies).

    historically, neutral countries usually carry out trade, when not impeded by military barriers. This is not tantamount to wanting to sell arms to them, or join their army. It is mostly about serving national interests.
     
    The problem is that it's not just trade. Neutral country with plenty of self-defense doing just trade would be great. But there are few such countries overall, maybe not that realistic these days.

    IMO, Russian will never cross NATO’s borders.

     

    They have in some ways (airspace, spying, expecting the EU institutions to observe their ethnic rights while they don't observe minority rights at home). But that's not what I meant, what I meant was that those antagonists from the woke side, that you had in mind, I'm assuming, that they, too, sometimes act out and in some cases are met with resistance (maybe not enough). You sounded like you were saying that because of the Russian antagonists, the Baltic states or Ukraine are not aware of the poz. This is not the case. I don't think one should choose between the two, they can both be banished. But, of course, the people will decide how it plays out, if the people are meek or find benefits in the poz (which many do, objectively, quite a few people get financial benefit or emotional gratification out of it so they won't consider it an "antagonist" at all but something that adds to their life), then it will come through. Maybe not to the extent as in the West, but that's little solace.

    you see the potential of some future alliance with Ukraine – something to counter the poz, and see Russia as impeding that, by weakening Ukraine territorially?
     
    Very much so. Russia practically destroyed Eastern Ukraine which would've been the biggest anti-poz bastion, for purely selfish reasons and out of jealousy. But in general, it is not Ukraine's job to "counter the poz", Ukraine's job is to preserve themselves first and foremost.

    I have said that Ukraine appears very pozzed to me now given its per capita
     
    They may be low GDP per capita but they are high IQ and quite exposed to Europe. And they don't have the type of traditionalist rules as in some non-white countries. But I don't know why you consider them more pozzed, the Ukrainians I notice are not pozzed at all, not sure they will prevail, of course, they could get pushed aside in the future.

    Replies: @German_reader, @songbird

    It even gets to absurd things like we see above, where a German will insinuate that Latvians are worse Nazis than the Germans themselves (very convenient)

    I insinuated nothing of the sort, and normally I wouldn’t bring it up (as I said I can’t know for sure after all what my own relatives did or didn’t do, and in any case it’s of course true that ultimate responsibility lies with Germany). But when someone like AP comes up with such moralistic pseudo-arguments, I’m still going to make the obvious counter-point.
    And it would be a dumb argument even if all Balts had been completely innocent angels 80 years (!) ago. Victimhood doesn’t give people a kind of special wisdom that should be beyond criticism, it can just as well lead to a distorted perception.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader


    even if all Balts had been completely innocent angels 80 years
     
    There were two Latvian Waffen SS divisions (15th and 19th Waffen Grenadier division of the SS), and one Estonian Waffen SS division (20th Waffen Grenadier division of the SS). For the sake of fairness, it should be noted that there were no Lithuanian Waffen SS divisions, even though the population of Lithuania is greater than that of Latvia and Estonia combined.

    Replies: @German_reader

  768. @sudden death
    @AnonfromTN


    The only thing that would make Baltic republics safe is decent behavior. Yet their “leaders” assiduously destroy their safety by stupid militant statements.
     
    This is also typical, but usefully illuminating example of currently dominant mentality, both Sovok and imperial/national, i.e. just "speaking" about/for them is enough of a cause to invade.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @LatW

    just “speaking”

    They don’t just speak. Baltics actively supply weapons and ammo to the Kiev regime. Baltics banned RF citizens, including Schengen visa holders, from entering. They do other things, but I guess these two examples will suffice.

  769. @Yahya
    @Mr. Hack


    He has a wide breadth of knowledge and offers interesting opinions on a wide range of topics.
     
    I agree that LatW is an intelligent and knowledgeable commentor.

    I'm just irritated at her positive references to Israel's vile "defense" policies. I used to give her (and you) the benefit of the doubt, thinking that she's a typically gullible Westerner/European who's been brainwashed by Zionist propaganda to think Israel is some heroic David fighting against the Arab Goliath. But her last comment on the topic clearly displayed she has some, even first-hand, knowledge of Israeli state policy, yet she wholly endorses their behavior, thinks its just wonderful, something to be emulated. Lol.

    Putting aside the multitude of dirty tactics the Israeli state employs to further its foreign policy ends (you can look up the Deir Yassin massacre, the Qibya massacre, the USS Liberty incident, and Irgun and Lehi terrorism against the British, to name a few); the one that made me lose most of the sympathy I had for Israel was the 1954 Lavon affair, in which a group of Egyptian Jews were recruited by Israel to carry out bombings of British and American buildings in Egypt, in an effort to pin the blame on Egypt and induce Britain and America to go to war with the country. This is the affair as described by Israeli/Zionist scholar Benny Morris in Righteous Victims:


    At the beginning of July 1954, Unit 131, a psychological warfare department of IDF Intelligence, launched a long-dormant Egyptian-Jewish network on a bombing campaign in the streets of Cairo and Alexandria, targeting American and British cultural centers and other sensitive Western sites. Unfortunately for the Israelis, one of the saboteurs was caught on July 23, as a bomb he was carrying in his pocket began to emit smoke. Under torture he revealed names and addresses, and within forty-eight hours the whole network was in Egyptian hands. Israel dissociated itself from the affair, but nobody believed it. One of the captured saboteurs was tortured to death, and an Israeli agent, picked up along with the network, committed suicide. In January 1955 most of the network were given stiff prison sentences, two were acquitted, and two were sentenced to death—and almost immediately executed, contrary to assurances which Western intermediaries felt they had been given by Nasser that no capital sentences would be carried out..
     
    To make matters worse, the Israeli government lied about its involvement in the affair until 2005, when they admitted to carrying out, and get this, even awarded the perpetrators of the bombings with certificates of appreciation, delivered to them straight from the Israeli president's hands.

    And LatW thinks this is all just very praiseworthy. Because nothing is more admirable than bombing your allies, some of whom have been extraordinarily generous with you in the past, aiding you diplomatically and supplying you with critical weaponry. And of course there's nothing wrong with attempting to destabilize a large country like Egypt in service of Israel's "security", because as LatW's hero Golda Meir would say “There is no Zionism except the rescue of Jews.” With this sort of amoral thinking, it doesn't surprise me at all that Ukraine shelled Polish citizens a few weeks ago. It's especially grating when LatW preens and lectures, making explicit moral arguments in Ukraine's defense, then turns around and endorses Israel's villainous policies as something to emulate.

    @German_Reader


    She’s a woman (formerly commenting as LatvianWoman)…how can you not know this after several years?

     

    Lol, I had not previously been aware of LatW being a female. This explains a lot. I used to think her ramblings on the "beautiful and masculine" Chechens were him being a closeted gay. But this makes more sense.

    Replies: @German_reader, @LatW, @Mr. Hack

    I rarely if ever comment about Israeli/Moslem relations in the Middle East simply because I really do not know enough about these affairs to make any real informed opinions. I used to know a bit about Ottoman affairs, but that’s about as far as it went with me. Perhaps, once I retire and have more time for reading, I’ll delve more deeply into this history. LatW apparently has a deeper understanding of these affairs, so you’ll need to address your concerns to her. I was, however, more interested in your knowledge of Lebanese ethno-genesis, and was waiting to hear back from you from a comment that I made above directly addresed to your attention about some things that you had written above, that didn’t quite make sense to me:

    Copts and Assyrians share two of these factors, but they lack the millennia-long child sacrifice practices of Phoenicians, so ultimately aren’t as smart or beautiful as the Lebanese.

    Could you further explain how “millenia-long child sacrifices” practiced by the Phoenicians could possibly have a positive influence on the Lebanese acquiring a “Gold Standard” among Arabs?

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @Mr. Hack

    The Phoenicians were accused by Hebrew and Greek sources of child sacrificing rituals. According to them, in the ceremony known as mulk, a child was placed on the arms of a bronze statue and dropped into a brazier below. Researchers have discovered roughly 9 Tophets across the Mediterranean where some speculate the practices occurred. A Tophet is a cemetery containing the cremated remains of infants and young children in clay jars. Presumably the Phoenicians would have chosen their least favored child for sacrifice, and that could have selected for intelligence and beauty, hence my speculation on its eugenic impact on the Lebanese. Though I’ll admit I may have been a bit hasty in my conclusion (which is why I called my statements mere working theories, not final judgements). Plutarch also mentioned that rich families would buy children from poor families to send to the sacrifice.

    Nonetheless, the claims that Phoenicians practiced child sacrifice is controversial as both the Hebrew and Greek sources were xenophobic and furthermore, there are no Phoenician texts preserved that describe this religious practice. Hence, it is difficult to judge these rituals from a Phoenician viewpoint. Some opposing scholars contend that Tophets were burial sites for infants who had died a natural death and that in antiquity infant mortality had been uniformly high across every society so nothing was out of the ordinary.

    Replies: @Yevardian

  770. @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @showmethereal

    I left the conversation because I don't think you can actually read and write Chinese.

    If you are actually literate you should be able to easily identify the source and meaning of this passage--

    https://i.postimg.cc/DybxsJXy/ea852f1db8fdd385.jpg

    Replies: @showmethereal

    Is that the excuse you are using? I’ve seen Thai before. I remember it from childhood. Take your ball and go home. I made sure to teach my children differently. In any event This is a public English language platform. This is not a private conversation so I won’t indulge in folly nor deviate from the matter at hand.

    Costa Rica 1 – Japan 0
    Ghana 3 – South Korea 2

    That’s for everyone to read. What it means is your argument that Japanese are superior to Chinese is falling on its shaky legs. You must be very embarrassed that Japan lost to a team that has blacks and South Korea lost to one that is basically all black. Please don’t commit seppuku. Unz is fairly anonymous – so you don’t have to worry about your honor

    • Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @showmethereal

    You can't read Chinese can you?

    A literate Chinese and Japanese would recognize that this is a quatrain by Tang poet Du Mu 杜牧 (AD 803—852) commenting on the Battle of Red Cliff (AD 208). It was quoted in Romance of Three Kingdoms (14th CE).

    折戟沉沙鐵未銷,自將磨洗認前朝。

    東風不與周郎便,銅雀春深鎖二喬。

    There's a translation here, https://28utscprojects.wordpress.com/2010/11/28/290/
    I'll also give my own in English and German,

    Red Cliff
    Broken halberds buried deep in the sand, have yet rust are their spearheads,
    Alas I wash them up and recognise they are from an ancient dynasty,
    Had the eastern wind not blown in our boy Zhou's favour,
    Tower of Bronze Peacocks would have forever held captive the hot Qiao sisters.

    Rote Klippe
    Zerbrochene Hellebarden tief im Sand vergraben, auch rostig sind ihre Speerspitzen,
    Ach! wasche sie ab und erkenne, dass sie aus einer alten Dynastie stammen,
    Hätte der Ostwind nicht zu Gunsten von junge Zhou treffen,
    Bronzepfauenturm hätte die geilen Qiao Schwestern für immer gefangen gehalten.

    The story is that Cao Cao before the battle boasted about taking Zhou Yu's wife Little Qiao and her equally stunning sister as concubines. But Zhou Yu defeated Cao's numerically vast superior navy with a brilliant fire attack assisted by easterlies.

    Replies: @showmethereal

  771. @Beckow
    @showmethereal


    ...ignoring the fact that ethnic Russians and those with Russian sympathies in eastern Ukraine were under literal bombardment since the 2014 coup
     
    It is worse, Mr.Hack heartily approved of the bombing and killing. The idiotic point of view that says that a large ethnic group can be destroyed or expelled because they are "Russian" (the horror!) is the mainstream Kiev-West viewpoint. They dance around it, lie, talk about other things - aggression! - all in order not to face the obvious: what the post-Maidan Kiev did to its own Russian population was a crime by any objective standard.

    Their big fear is that once Kiev loses the war it will be discussed openly and they will look like who they are: genocidal maniacs who intentionally provoked a bloody war that they will end up losing. No wonder they worship Bandera (and probably Nazis in private).

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @showmethereal

    You are correct. Though much of the world outside the 1 billion in the “west” are openly discussing and aware of it. As I said – me personally I never paid attention to Ukraine until the Nuland coup. The only thing I knew up to that point was that I liked Ukrainian boxers. After that I paid attention intently. That’s why I have little patience for the western propaganda surrounding the situation

    • Replies: @LatW
    @showmethereal


    The only thing I knew up to that point was that I liked Ukrainian boxers.
     
    Did you know that Usyk is now wearing a uniform and is on the front lines apparently? That's so messed up. :(

    Are you following the protests in China? Based on some footage, there are way more protesters than the police can control, it seems quite serious. This could totally affect their economy.

    Replies: @showmethereal

  772. @German_reader
    @LatW


    It even gets to absurd things like we see above, where a German will insinuate that Latvians are worse Nazis than the Germans themselves (very convenient)
     
    I insinuated nothing of the sort, and normally I wouldn't bring it up (as I said I can't know for sure after all what my own relatives did or didn't do, and in any case it's of course true that ultimate responsibility lies with Germany). But when someone like AP comes up with such moralistic pseudo-arguments, I'm still going to make the obvious counter-point.
    And it would be a dumb argument even if all Balts had been completely innocent angels 80 years (!) ago. Victimhood doesn't give people a kind of special wisdom that should be beyond criticism, it can just as well lead to a distorted perception.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    even if all Balts had been completely innocent angels 80 years

    There were two Latvian Waffen SS divisions (15th and 19th Waffen Grenadier division of the SS), and one Estonian Waffen SS division (20th Waffen Grenadier division of the SS). For the sake of fairness, it should be noted that there were no Lithuanian Waffen SS divisions, even though the population of Lithuania is greater than that of Latvia and Estonia combined.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @AnonfromTN


    There were two Latvian Waffen SS divisions
     
    Those were mostly conscripts and iirc during their existence were mostly limited to regular warfare, so probably not many war crimes committed by them. Some of their members had been in police and auxiliary formations before though which did commit a lot of crimes, up to mass killings.
    Anyway, I have little desire to discuss the issue, one of the most annoying habits of Eastern Europeans is their tendency to view everything through the lens of the 1940s ("Holodomor!" "Nazis!" "Banderites!" and so on). That both Russians and their regional enemies do this, is just another sign that in the end you're all from the same world, a world any sane Western European would want to have as little to do with as possible.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Mikel, @AnonfromTN

  773. German_reader says:
    @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader


    even if all Balts had been completely innocent angels 80 years
     
    There were two Latvian Waffen SS divisions (15th and 19th Waffen Grenadier division of the SS), and one Estonian Waffen SS division (20th Waffen Grenadier division of the SS). For the sake of fairness, it should be noted that there were no Lithuanian Waffen SS divisions, even though the population of Lithuania is greater than that of Latvia and Estonia combined.

    Replies: @German_reader

    There were two Latvian Waffen SS divisions

    Those were mostly conscripts and iirc during their existence were mostly limited to regular warfare, so probably not many war crimes committed by them. Some of their members had been in police and auxiliary formations before though which did commit a lot of crimes, up to mass killings.
    Anyway, I have little desire to discuss the issue, one of the most annoying habits of Eastern Europeans is their tendency to view everything through the lens of the 1940s (“Holodomor!” “Nazis!” “Banderites!” and so on). That both Russians and their regional enemies do this, is just another sign that in the end you’re all from the same world, a world any sane Western European would want to have as little to do with as possible.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader


    a world any sane Western European would want to have as little to do with as possible.
     
    Thanks to the European efforts, this feeling is now mutual. Let’s see who is going to suffer more. The wait won’t be long.

    Replies: @German_reader

    , @Mikel
    @German_reader


    one of the most annoying habits of Eastern Europeans is their tendency to view everything through the lens of the 1940s (“Holodomor!” “Nazis!” “Banderites!” and so on). That both Russians and their regional enemies do this, is just another sign that in the end you’re all from the same world, a world any sane Western European would want to have as little to do with as possible.
     
    Quite true.

    In fact, I do have some understanding for Eastern Europeans. In post-war Western Europe people were much freer to discuss things, mend relations and build mutually beneficial relationships whereas Eastern Europeans lived in the Soviet freezer for decades, forced to disguise their animosities and subject to the rule of Moscow to a much greater degree than Western Europe was subject to their big US ally.

    From this perspective, it is natural that their worldview is still not exactly like the Western one. I think that this also happened to Eastern Germans to some extent. In the late 90s I was driving through Germany on my way to Poland and I stopped at a highway rest area in Eastern Germany, where the attendant asked me to pay for the entrance. I didn't have Marks on me, only some Dutch Guilders, but he readily accepted them as "gutes Geld". We chatted for a few seconds but it was enough for him to start complaining about the Easterners (Kameraden, as he called them) that tried to pay with their "worthless" money. It was just a brief encounter but I got the distinct impression that things were different in Eastern and Western Germany at the time. I couldn't imagine a Western German deriding foreigners like that in a brief encounter with an unknown passer by.

    The problem, however, is that Eastern Europeans beyond the Oder seem to have dragged their old animosities much longer. They haven't been able to mend their disputes and they could actually lead us to a senseless nuclear confrontation. To be fair, it's not only EEs though. There's plenty of Russophobe nutters in the West too. This wouldn't have escalated so badly if we hadn't found it our duty to take sides in their quarrels and especially support the Maidan revolution.
    , @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader


    most annoying habits of Eastern Europeans is their tendency to view everything through the lens of the 1940s
     
    Unfortunately, this is not just ancient history, but recurring pattern of behavior that is reproduced right now. Lithuania supplied no Waffen SS divisions in the 1940s. The same Lithuania gave citizenship to all its residents. Latvia and Estonia supplied Waffen SS divisions in the 1940s. Latvia and Estonia did not give their residents that were Russians citizenship, introducing a category of non-citizens, unheard of in any country pretending to be civilized. Naturally, the EU pretended that it does not see anything untoward in it, even though this contradicts officially proclaimed EU policy regarding national minorities.

    Back in the USSR I thought that Balts are civilized. I was wrong. People with nationalist feelings appropriate for a caveman cannot be considered civilized.
  774. @sudden death
    @AnonfromTN


    The only thing that would make Baltic republics safe is decent behavior. Yet their “leaders” assiduously destroy their safety by stupid militant statements.
     
    This is also typical, but usefully illuminating example of currently dominant mentality, both Sovok and imperial/national, i.e. just "speaking" about/for them is enough of a cause to invade.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @LatW

    You could literally just lay there, doing nothing, saying nothing, and they would still invade if it were feasible for them.

  775. @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader


    Safety for the Baltic republics lies in the NATO forces stationed there
     
    The only thing that would make Baltic republics safe is decent behavior. Yet their “leaders” assiduously destroy their safety by stupid militant statements. As to NATO, did you actually read Article 5? It says that if one of the NATO countries experiences aggression from the outside, all other NATO members have to assist it, and each member has a right to decide how exactly. So, if a member decides to send the victim of aggression pampers, this member thereby fulfils its obligations under Article 5.

    In NATO, only the US military has capabilities to do something consequential. In a private discussion a former NATO military analyst told me that if push comes to shove, the US would not risk endangering its own cities for the sake of responding to an attack on any European target, not only Vilnius or Warsaw, but even Berlin, Paris, or London. Indeed, the US has a long history of double-crossing its allies, Kurds being the latest example.

    Replies: @LondonBob, @sudden death, @A123, @Mikhail

  776. @showmethereal
    @Beckow

    You are correct. Though much of the world outside the 1 billion in the “west” are openly discussing and aware of it. As I said - me personally I never paid attention to Ukraine until the Nuland coup. The only thing I knew up to that point was that I liked Ukrainian boxers. After that I paid attention intently. That’s why I have little patience for the western propaganda surrounding the situation

    Replies: @LatW

    The only thing I knew up to that point was that I liked Ukrainian boxers.

    Did you know that Usyk is now wearing a uniform and is on the front lines apparently? That’s so messed up. 🙁

    Are you following the protests in China? Based on some footage, there are way more protesters than the police can control, it seems quite serious. This could totally affect their economy.

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @LatW

    Indeed I do know. I know lomochecnko did too - but he went back to boxing. But the irony is sitting and listening to the State Department under Nuland playing kingmaker and discussing what they wanted to do with the Klitschko brother who got into politics made me pay attention more keenly. That was smart of them to use him as a puppet since he was western friendly from his boxing. The whole thing is a joke because people in the west didn’t like him much before because he was an Eastern European. They wanted soooo bad for an American to beat either brother. I personally wanted to see the one who lost to Anthony Joshua beat him and retire gracefully. Westerners were sooo happy a Brit won over him. It’s sooooo hysterical to me to see how Ukrainian boxers are treated now by the west as opposed to even a decade ago. Now they save the scorn for just the Russian boxers.

    Protests? Protests happen in China all the time. People have those lies about Tinanmen in their head to think Chinese are afraid of their government (which makes no sense since China’s history is full of rebellions). I mean even in that instance people forget the protesters were allowed to be out there for 6 whole weeks. Police and soldiers were unarmed and sat out there and sang songs. The leaders were able to face the CPC leaders and ask questions and it was recorded. But the western lies would have you believe the people got outside asking for democracy and a couple of days later got mowed down by machine guns and tanks. Complete folly and people believe it.

    In any event - China made clear that they will sacrifice economic growth to protect lives. Personally I think they can ease up since Omicron is weaker. But another irony is that people are not forced to be vaccinated in China. Only about 60% of the elderly chose to get vaccinated. Yet the west claims there is no freedom in China and also claiming “communist China” doesn’t care about life. Completely backwards. In any event so protests will continue. And since China doesn’t have a lot of violent crime you will indeed see people outnumbering the police. If there were real riots like in the west tha ts when the Peoples Militia would come out. They are the largest militia in the world and would relieve the police. Police in China are not like western police for the most part. Another misconception. And again protests in China are common. This won’t be a repeat of 1989…. The government has much tools at keeping track of foreign agents…. There will be no stockpiling of Molotov cocktails and firearms like in 1989. No groups will be allowed to squat in public for 6 days let alone 6 weeks. All this is good for is press.

  777. @Mr. Hack
    @Yahya

    I rarely if ever comment about Israeli/Moslem relations in the Middle East simply because I really do not know enough about these affairs to make any real informed opinions. I used to know a bit about Ottoman affairs, but that's about as far as it went with me. Perhaps, once I retire and have more time for reading, I'll delve more deeply into this history. LatW apparently has a deeper understanding of these affairs, so you'll need to address your concerns to her. I was, however, more interested in your knowledge of Lebanese ethno-genesis, and was waiting to hear back from you from a comment that I made above directly addresed to your attention about some things that you had written above, that didn't quite make sense to me:



    Copts and Assyrians share two of these factors, but they lack the millennia-long child sacrifice practices of Phoenicians, so ultimately aren’t as smart or beautiful as the Lebanese.
     
    Could you further explain how “millenia-long child sacrifices” practiced by the Phoenicians could possibly have a positive influence on the Lebanese acquiring a “Gold Standard” among Arabs?
     

    Replies: @Yahya

    The Phoenicians were accused by Hebrew and Greek sources of child sacrificing rituals. According to them, in the ceremony known as mulk, a child was placed on the arms of a bronze statue and dropped into a brazier below. Researchers have discovered roughly 9 Tophets across the Mediterranean where some speculate the practices occurred. A Tophet is a cemetery containing the cremated remains of infants and young children in clay jars. Presumably the Phoenicians would have chosen their least favored child for sacrifice, and that could have selected for intelligence and beauty, hence my speculation on its eugenic impact on the Lebanese. Though I’ll admit I may have been a bit hasty in my conclusion (which is why I called my statements mere working theories, not final judgements). Plutarch also mentioned that rich families would buy children from poor families to send to the sacrifice.

    Nonetheless, the claims that Phoenicians practiced child sacrifice is controversial as both the Hebrew and Greek sources were xenophobic and furthermore, there are no Phoenician texts preserved that describe this religious practice. Hence, it is difficult to judge these rituals from a Phoenician viewpoint. Some opposing scholars contend that Tophets were burial sites for infants who had died a natural death and that in antiquity infant mortality had been uniformly high across every society so nothing was out of the ordinary.

    • Replies: @Yevardian
    @Yahya


    The Phoenicians were accused by Hebrew and Greek sources of child sacrificing rituals. According to them, in the ceremony known as mulk, a child was placed on the arms of a bronze statue and dropped into a brazier below. Researchers have discovered roughly 9 Tophets across the Mediterranean where some speculate the practices occurred. A Tophet is a cemetery containing the cremated remains of infants and young children in clay jars. Presumably the Phoenicians would have chosen their least favored child for sacrifice, and that could have selected for intelligence and beauty, hence my speculation on its eugenic impact on the Lebanese. Though I’ll admit I may have been a bit hasty in my conclusion (which is why I called my statements mere working theories, not final judgements). Plutarch also mentioned that rich families would buy children from poor families to send to the sacrifice.
     
    Pretty bizzare conjecture to take from this any long term eugenic effects vis-a-vis Lebanese attractiveness or intelligence.
    Anyway I certainly wouldn't dismiss 'accusations' of Phoenician child sacrifice as propaganda, the Hebrew Bible (obviously a complex and problematic historical source, but again the sole literary source we have for the time) hints that the practice was common and normalised enough throughout the whole region that the Israelites engaged in it themselves when pressed.
    There's the tale of the Hebrew chieftain Jephthah who felt compelled to sacrifice his own daughter after his victory against another local Semitic tribe (Ammonites, Edomites, anyway wasn't Philistines iirc), and of course there's the Abraham and Isaac story everyone knows.

    Nonetheless, the claims that Phoenicians practiced child sacrifice is controversial as both the Hebrew and Greek sources were xenophobic and furthermore, there are no Phoenician texts preserved that describe this religious practice.
     
    The Phoenicians and Hebrews (and Moabites, see the Mesha Stele) spoke virtually the same language, so at least on this local matter they should be afforded some weight, particularly as the gruesome ritual is on record as being 'mistakenly' practiced amongst themselves.
    The lack of Phoenician texts on the matter scarcely means anything, because hardly any non-transactional records from their culture survive whatsoever.

    Some opposing scholars contend that Tophets were burial sites for infants who had died a natural death and that in antiquity infant mortality had been uniformly high across every society so nothing was out of the ordinary.
     
    That apologetic viewpoint has become very hard to maintain in light of recent evidence showing crushed infant bones and the like. It does appear to be unquestionably a widespread Semitic Cult practice at this point, although at least unlike in the Americas, whether adolescent-to-adult human sacrifice was engaged in remains an open question. Livy mentions the Romans resorting to ritual murder of infants during the Punic Wars also, hardly something he would make up. The Celts (and Germanic peoples iirc?) of antiquity are described as practicing human sacrifice too, although only of their enemies, PoW's and the like.

    I don't know of the Egyptians ever engaging in the ritual sacrifice of infants, but again I'm extremely vague on any Egyptian history before the Persian conquest. Maybe G_R could comment, though I think it's outside his usual reading area as well.

    Replies: @songbird

  778. @Philip Owen
    @showmethereal

    They were under bombardment in 2014 and 2015 during the Russian invasion. After that about a dozen people a year stepped on their own mines. You are locked into a propaganda narrative.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @showmethereal

    Civilian areas of Donbass are still being attacked to this day. No military value. But of course you ignore that and yet accuse others of propaganda. That is plain silly. Stop watching CNN and Fox and BBC and DW.

  779. @LatW
    @showmethereal


    But please clarify the “better information” from Eastern Europe would be (I assume the context you mean is Ukraine/Russia)?
     
    Without generalizing and just purely based on Global Times, it is obvious there are some informational gaps there and a lot of sweeping statements. It's understandable because most Chinese probably don't have time or interest to delve into it but when you have such a broad sweeping approach you risk running into surprises later (or simply not have accurate information).


    For example, I saw you mentioning Lviv. It has turned into an idiotic meme that even intelligent people seem to parrot (surprisingly, even after 8 years of war with plenty of information available) because it is convenient. It has very little to do with reality on the ground. The ease with which you threw that out made me think of how I would not want to voice similarly stereotypical (and wrong) statements about your country or culture. But as I said, the onus is on the Ukrainians (and their friends) to inform the Chinese about this.

    Replies: @showmethereal

    Where did you see me mention Lviv??? And you seem to be talking in circles with nothing specific. And you keep bringing up Global Times editorials. That is going in circles. China is not even pro Russian and anti Ukraine. China is not stupid. China is well aware of the 2014 coup. China was heavily invested in developing Ukraine – so to claim they are pro Russia is nonsense. But China knows the same foreign government who stepped in and forced Ukraine to cancel the sale of Motor Sich to a Chinese entity is the same government who wants to use Ukraine as a proxy to fight Russia. China is also well aware of US psyops to compare Ukraine to Taiwan and has repeatedly said openly that is a nonsense comparison. So what is China not getting??? Didn’t you hear?? The US says China hacks every computer system in the world (sarcasm)…. So what is it missing?

    • Replies: @LatW
    @showmethereal


    Where did you see me mention Lviv?
     
    You mentioned something about "Western Ukrainians betraying their brothers". And then Hu said that "4 provinces joined Russia". So by this logic, it sounds like those from Lviv are trying to take over some of the eastern areas that are trying to leave. But this is entirely skewed because there is an occupation, and the whole of Ukraine, including many folks from the East, are fighting against it. That's what I mean by informational gaps.


    China was heavily invested in developing Ukraine – so to claim they are pro Russia is nonsense.
     
    Well, China was trying to have everything - have a strategic relationship with Russia, promote anti-Westernism and a schism between US and Europe, but also have access to large areas of Eastern Europe. Under peaceful conditions this seems possible and was intended intelligently (since such a large war was not expected).

    There is some info that China might be supplying Russia in the war. This is speculation but there is some info that planes are flying without transponders between China and Russia and may be carrying some war supplies, not weapons but possibly winter gear (for the "second best army on the planet").


    But China knows the same foreign government who stepped in and forced Ukraine to cancel the sale of Motor Sich to a Chinese entity
     
    Companies such as Motor Sich should be in Ukrainian hands. I know this may not be as simple due to financial reasons, but this should be the aim. Foreigners may own shares, but not in full.

    China is also well aware of US psyops to compare Ukraine to Taiwan
     
    These are not always accurate comparisons. Yes, there is an element of a proxy war in Ukraine, but Ukraine is essentially fighting an anti-colonial war of independence.

    Replies: @showmethereal

  780. @A123
    @AnonfromTN


    I’ve noticed that you did not deny that openly discriminatory “laws” are in effect in Israel. I guess this can be counted as progress.

     

    ROTFLMAO

    It was so obviously ludicrous, I though that you were going for humor. Islam kills to prevent land transfers. Muslim Israelis can readily buy land from Jews in most of Israel.

    All foreigners have great difficulty buying land, especially residential, in Jewish Palestine. That is not Apartheid. That is preventing land speculation. My understanding is that Ukraine has pretty similar laws, as do many other countries.

    quite a few Islamic terrorist organizations were enabled, financed, trained, and armed by the US and Israel.
     
    20/20 hindsight applies in many places, such as the Mujahideen in Afghanistan.

    The most recent screw up was the U.S. giving money to Turkey to train "Syrian Moderates". That backfired badly.

     

    London Bob,

    Jews deserve their own state, it is the other stuff I object to, if they were more pragmatic they would have done a deal.
     
    It Takes Two to Tango

    If Islam had been more pragmatic this would have been over decades ago. Every pragmatic deal made be the Israelis has been repudiated. Or, other forces have intervened. Iranian Hamas and Palestinian Iranian Jihad [PIJ]. Have only made the situation worse.

    At this point, there us only one path forward.

    ========================================
        Muslim Colonies are the Problem!
           Muslim Decolonization is the Answer!
    ========================================


    Muslims could have had a better deal back in the 80's. Their unilateral violence has made anything vaguely resembling a two state simulation permanently unobtainable. Actions have consequences.

    PEACE 😇

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    Muslim Israelis can readily buy land from Jews in most of Israel.

    Now, this is simply not true.

    • Replies: @A123
    @AnonfromTN



    Muslim Israelis can readily buy land from Jews in most of Israel.

     

    Now, this is simply not true.
     
    Yes. It is 100% true.

    Muslims have intentionally deceived you according to the Pillar of Deception "Taqiyya".

    Private land may be sold to Israeli Arab Muslims.

    The layers of disinformation are two fold:

    -1- All foreigners, regardless of religion, have purchase restrictions.
    -2- Large tracts of state land can never be sold. They can only be leased, usually for 49 years.

    Both #1 and #2 hamper all religions Jews, Muslims, and Druze equally. Taqiyya deceivers knowingly misrepresent this as a land sale restriction based on religion. It is not.

    You should consider your sources more carefully.
    ___

    The reverse is not true. Abbas, leader of the Muslim Authority, openly calls for life sentences as a penalty for land transfer to Jews: (1)


    Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas has toughened the penalty for citizens selling property to Israelis.

    According to the official Palestinian Wafa news agency, Abbas on Monday imposed a sentence of hard labor for life on “anyone diverting, renting or selling land to an enemy state or one of its subjects.”

    Jordan’s penal code number 16 article 114, applicable in the Palestinian territories, previously subscribed “temporary hard labor” to perpetrators of the crime.
     


    the PLO’s Revolutionary Penal Code (1979) applies the death penalty both to traitors and to those accused of “transferring positions to the enemy.” Since the late 1990s, Palestinian courts have been dealing out death sentences to convicted land dealers, though Abbas has not authorized the implementation of executions since his election in 2004.
     
    The only Apartheid religion in Palestine - Islam.

    This is an objectively true fact.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.timesofisrael.com/abbas-toughens-law-against-palestinians-selling-land-to-jews/

    Replies: @Dmitry

  781. Jai Bodh Avatar

    Dhan Dhan Guru Nanak Guru Gobind Singh Ji

    Comment 786 too

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ

  782. @showmethereal
    @Yahya

    Typical of people who can’t defend their points to use (insert whoever) “shill” accusations. I stated facts while you repeated the western narrative. Seems you expect China to let North Korea economically collapse. North Korea is more educated and has a larger population than Cuba. Has Cuba collapsed? Whose “fault” is that????

    I will leave you with two more points. The current Kim had his brother assassinated at that airport in Malaysia. Do you know why? His brother was living for years under protection in China. Kim feared China and South Korea were plotting together to have him be the new leader. So once he left China - he had him killed. And you are going to sit here and claim China is able to control North Korea? It’s absolutely nonsense western narrative.


    And for the record - when the Korean War happened China had no nukes. It went toe to toe with the US only a few years after the US dropped atomic bombs on Japan. Having enemies at the gate is no light thing. That is why China understands why Russia is standing up against NATO expansion. When China helped North Vietnam it had nukes (which it developed because the U.S. threatened it during the Korean War). If you claim China controls North Korea then they could have given Vietnam nukes and done the same thing you claim it did with Korea. But no China didn’t control Vietnam either… so they ended up fighting a few years later because China was mad Vietnam invaded Cambodia. Facts…. No shilling.

    If I was a shill I would claim China is going to win the 2030 World Cup. But I have sense. Unlike the guy who interjected before when I said East Asian do not have the genetics to dominate in football physically. He called me names like you. But he ran away now that Japan lost to tiny Costa Rica and South Korea lost to Ghana (oh the horror for racial superiority proponents)

    Replies: @Yahya

    If I was a shill I would claim China is going to win the 2030 World Cup. But I have sense. Unlike the guy who interjected before when I said East Asian do not have the genetics to dominate in football physically. He called me names like you.

    You’re right; I should not have called you a shill. But you do seem to have an emotional attachement towards China. That’s ok, everyone has their biases, but it would be preferable if you were to reveal your nationality (are you Chinese?) so that we are aware of potential national/ethnic bias. For me I have nothing against China per we, am even inclined to favor it as I admire its history and culture a great deal. I do hold a prejudice against the Chinese Communist Party though; so that may shape my thinking on the matter. My beef with the CCP is their oppression of Muslims in Xinjiang. I have read though Vogel’s biography of Deng Xiaoping and have come to admire him personally for his strategic and pragmatic thinking, stoic demeanor, sense of duty and willingness to change his mind when the circumstances call for it.

    Anyway, back to the topic of North Korea. I think you are setting up strawmen and misquoting me on the issue, so I will restate my position. I wasn’t saying China “controls” the Kim regime, I was saying they aided in their survival and have been propping them up, which I think is objectively true. It’s well-known among diplomatic circles that China covertly refuses to implement full and effective sanctions against North Korea for fear of a state collapse in that country and a reunification of a Korean Peninsula under an American-allied regime. My opinion is that China should let the North Korean regime collapse; it would lift the decades long suffering ordinary North Koreans have had to endure.

    I agree that China doesn’t control the Kim regime to the extent that some Western pundits seem to think. I’ll even add that in the past, the North Korean regime has previously approached the US and offered an alliance in an effort to reduce reliance on China and counter their hegemonic ambitions. So evidently North Korea and China are not as chummy as usually thought of in the West. But this doesn’t negate the key fact that China is the only major player on the scene that wishes to maintain the status quo rather than let the NK regime implode; and that despite the ostensible signing of UN agreements, they have maintained trade volumes at a level sufficient to ensure the survival of the Kim regime (only briefly dropping it a few years ago during a diplomatic spat between Xi and Kim).

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @Yahya

    Ahhh the Uighurs. If China is treating all the Uighurs bad - then please explain why every single majority Muslim nation on earth - except Turkiye - has great relations with China? Literally all of them have written to the UN Human Rights Council stating they have sent delegations there and think Xinjiang is great. I can tell you why Turkiye is the only one. Because Turkey uses tens of thousands of them to fight jihad for them against Assad in Syria (non Chinese source below). And what of all the terrorist attacks in China? Many Han were killed... But guess who most of the injured and killed were? Moderate Uighurs who refused the overtures of the jihadis. Do you want to see videos of Uighur Muslim clerics being hacked to death in the streets by the extremist Uighurs??? And why is it not spoken in western sources - the other main reason basically all Muslim nations have good relations with China. It's because they know the LARGEST Muslim group in China is not the Uighurs but the Hui people. Hui don't have jihadi separatists who blow up markets and police stations and drive suicide vehicles into Tiananmen square and invade trade stations and hack people to death or start riots and burn stores and murder innocents in the streets. Hui Muslims didn't have any of that - so they never faced such restrictions that the Uighurs did/do. You can go visit Xinjiang (unless you work for western media or intelligence services)... Go visit a mosque and ask. Or go ask the moderate Uighurs who refused the hardliners brand of Islam.

    https://www.al-monitor.com/originals/2017/08/turkey-is-ankara-abandoning-uighurs-for-china.html

    China is not the cause of the Kim family still being in power. US weapons and troops in South Korea is. The Korean civil war was not anyone else's business. To for a minute think that China would allow the main country whose openly stated role is to bring China to heel to have a presence near its border only exists in fantasy land. No nation on the planet would do it. Trading with North Korea so it doesn't starve to death is something both China and Russia do as neighbors and makes perfect sense. Had US troops left in the past 20 years chances are the two Koreas would have had some from of reunification by now. I mean there were even plans drawn up to connect the two Koreas and China and Russia all together with a high speed passenger and freight rail line. Do you know what South Korea's "sunshine policy" was in the past 20 years - until recently??? It was about building the blocks to reunification. Same as what was happening between Mainland China and Taiwan up until 2016. What is the common denominator in both??? US interference and threats causing tension and ruptures in warming ties.

    , @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @Yahya

    I stand by the insults that I gave him. It makes perfect sense for CCP shills to belittle East Asian athletics because they want Chinese men to play pansy sports like ping pong instead of more physical sports. It would be a nightmare for CCP to have Chinese guys be like Fedor Emelianenko and Klitschkos.

    For example I stated the top Chinese sprinters are at the near level as American and Europeans,

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/why-are-there-few-black-third-basemen-and-soccer-goalies/#comment-5676413

    But PRC is reasonable in wanting a buffer state in NK. Japan tried to invade China through Korea in 16th CE. Koreans themselves have a long history of disunity totally unrelated to China,

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_invasions_of_Korea_(1592–1598)
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_Kingdoms_of_Korea

    Apart of Uighurs China has many other Muslim minorities, Hui, Kazakhs, Uzbeks, Tatars, and none are persecuted.

  783. @German_reader
    @AnonfromTN


    There were two Latvian Waffen SS divisions
     
    Those were mostly conscripts and iirc during their existence were mostly limited to regular warfare, so probably not many war crimes committed by them. Some of their members had been in police and auxiliary formations before though which did commit a lot of crimes, up to mass killings.
    Anyway, I have little desire to discuss the issue, one of the most annoying habits of Eastern Europeans is their tendency to view everything through the lens of the 1940s ("Holodomor!" "Nazis!" "Banderites!" and so on). That both Russians and their regional enemies do this, is just another sign that in the end you're all from the same world, a world any sane Western European would want to have as little to do with as possible.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Mikel, @AnonfromTN

    a world any sane Western European would want to have as little to do with as possible.

    Thanks to the European efforts, this feeling is now mutual. Let’s see who is going to suffer more. The wait won’t be long.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @AnonfromTN

    That's a theme you keep returning to, like a broken record. Sure, Europe's future is likely to be utterly bleak, I have no illusions about that. Seems very doubtful to me though that Russia's will be great either. Being junior partner to China is probably all the country can aspire to. And apart from that, relations with such wonderful partners as the Islamic republic or the occasional military junta in Africa.
    I'm not happy about that development, in fact I find it deeply depressing, all the hopes of better relations between Russia and Europe that emerged after the Cold War ruined. Your apportionment of the blame is very one-sided though. EU has made a lot of mistakes (and continues to make them, like the EU parliament now seriously concerning itself with the urgent issue of Holodomor, absurd). But if Russia hadn't resorted to military force (was there really no other way?), things would never have gotten this far. Sure, you can always argue that EU was hypocritical and didn't do enough to condemn Ukrainian actions in Donbass. Still, what Russia's been doing since February wasn't necessary and has only made things worse.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  784. @AnonfromTN
    @A123


    Muslim Israelis can readily buy land from Jews in most of Israel.
     
    Now, this is simply not true.

    Replies: @A123

    Muslim Israelis can readily buy land from Jews in most of Israel.

    Now, this is simply not true.

    Yes. It is 100% true.

    Muslims have intentionally deceived you according to the Pillar of Deception “Taqiyya”.

    Private land may be sold to Israeli Arab Muslims.

    The layers of disinformation are two fold:

    -1- All foreigners, regardless of religion, have purchase restrictions.
    -2- Large tracts of state land can never be sold. They can only be leased, usually for 49 years.

    Both #1 and #2 hamper all religions Jews, Muslims, and Druze equally. Taqiyya deceivers knowingly misrepresent this as a land sale restriction based on religion. It is not.

    You should consider your sources more carefully.
    ___

    The reverse is not true. Abbas, leader of the Muslim Authority, openly calls for life sentences as a penalty for land transfer to Jews: (1)

    Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas has toughened the penalty for citizens selling property to Israelis.

    According to the official Palestinian Wafa news agency, Abbas on Monday imposed a sentence of hard labor for life on “anyone diverting, renting or selling land to an enemy state or one of its subjects.”

    Jordan’s penal code number 16 article 114, applicable in the Palestinian territories, previously subscribed “temporary hard labor” to perpetrators of the crime.

    the PLO’s Revolutionary Penal Code (1979) applies the death penalty both to traitors and to those accused of “transferring positions to the enemy.” Since the late 1990s, Palestinian courts have been dealing out death sentences to convicted land dealers, though Abbas has not authorized the implementation of executions since his election in 2004.

    The only Apartheid religion in Palestine – Islam.

    This is an objectively true fact.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.timesofisrael.com/abbas-toughens-law-against-palestinians-selling-land-to-jews/

    • Replies: @Dmitry
    @A123

    There isn't purchase restriction for foreigners to buy real estate in Israel. But for the non-residents, they added a sale tax which is very high for the transaction, unless you live in the apartment for an extended time (which is not possible for most non-citizens).

    Wealthy foreigners like to buy property in Israel. You can see after the peace deal of recent years Israel with UAE, Bahrain, wealthy people in the Gulf were buying property in Israel. Probably after some years, the increase in the price of the property would be greater than any tax you pay.


    Peace Deals in Place, Wealthy Gulf Arabs Are Boosting Israel’s Super-Prime Real Estate Market

    Buyers from Gulf countries have helped drive prices for Tel Aviv villas, mansions, and penthouses well above the $10 million mark, according to Mansion Global. And the resulting activity, though economically beneficial, will only put additional pressure on middle-class locals hoping to afford family homes.

     
    https://www.architecturaldigest.com/story/tel-aviv-real-estate

    I guess AnonTN idea is about the protests against selling property to Arabs in Afula or against selling to Jews in Yafo.

    The Mayor of Afula can go to the demonstration against selling in Afula to Arab families. There is an article about this theme. https://www.al-monitor.com/originals/2019/07/israel-arabs-benjamin-netanyahu-discrimination-afula-citizen.html

    Analogy for Jewish discrimination against Arab residents in Afula seems like the 1930s Detroit discrimination against African-Americans. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Housing_segregation_in_the_United_States It's a combination of local authorities with the local residents.

    Analogy for Yafo is a bit parallel than Fort Greene or Bedford–Stuyvesant, although the violence in Yafo also had the religious war component in 2021 when it was connected with the conflict with the Temple Mount complex in Jerusalem.

    Replies: @A123

  785. German_reader says:
    @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader


    a world any sane Western European would want to have as little to do with as possible.
     
    Thanks to the European efforts, this feeling is now mutual. Let’s see who is going to suffer more. The wait won’t be long.

    Replies: @German_reader

    That’s a theme you keep returning to, like a broken record. Sure, Europe’s future is likely to be utterly bleak, I have no illusions about that. Seems very doubtful to me though that Russia’s will be great either. Being junior partner to China is probably all the country can aspire to. And apart from that, relations with such wonderful partners as the Islamic republic or the occasional military junta in Africa.
    I’m not happy about that development, in fact I find it deeply depressing, all the hopes of better relations between Russia and Europe that emerged after the Cold War ruined. Your apportionment of the blame is very one-sided though. EU has made a lot of mistakes (and continues to make them, like the EU parliament now seriously concerning itself with the urgent issue of Holodomor, absurd). But if Russia hadn’t resorted to military force (was there really no other way?), things would never have gotten this far. Sure, you can always argue that EU was hypocritical and didn’t do enough to condemn Ukrainian actions in Donbass. Still, what Russia’s been doing since February wasn’t necessary and has only made things worse.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @German_reader


    Still, what Russia’s been doing since February wasn’t necessary and has only made things worse.
     
    Western Europe cooperated with the empire in creating the Banderite-dominated Ukraine the RF is fighting now. Maidan of 2014 saw not only Nuland’s cookies (her “fuck the EU” turned out to be prophetic). Merkel and various leaders of European countries and of the EU itself were on the Maidan, openly demonstrating their support. Europeans signed the agreements between Yanuk and demonstrators (both of these sides were scum IMO) and next day applauded when the other side broke these agreements and deposed an elected president. France and Germany were guarantors of Minsk agreements and never did anything in many years to make Kiev regime implement those agreements, or at least to stop Ukie butchery in Donbass.

    One of the commenters above talked about sowing and reaping. Europe is reaping what it sowed.

  786. @showmethereal
    @LatW

    Where did you see me mention Lviv??? And you seem to be talking in circles with nothing specific. And you keep bringing up Global Times editorials. That is going in circles. China is not even pro Russian and anti Ukraine. China is not stupid. China is well aware of the 2014 coup. China was heavily invested in developing Ukraine - so to claim they are pro Russia is nonsense. But China knows the same foreign government who stepped in and forced Ukraine to cancel the sale of Motor Sich to a Chinese entity is the same government who wants to use Ukraine as a proxy to fight Russia. China is also well aware of US psyops to compare Ukraine to Taiwan and has repeatedly said openly that is a nonsense comparison. So what is China not getting??? Didn’t you hear?? The US says China hacks every computer system in the world (sarcasm)…. So what is it missing?

    Replies: @LatW

    Where did you see me mention Lviv?

    You mentioned something about “Western Ukrainians betraying their brothers”. And then Hu said that “4 provinces joined Russia”. So by this logic, it sounds like those from Lviv are trying to take over some of the eastern areas that are trying to leave. But this is entirely skewed because there is an occupation, and the whole of Ukraine, including many folks from the East, are fighting against it. That’s what I mean by informational gaps.

    [MORE]

    China was heavily invested in developing Ukraine – so to claim they are pro Russia is nonsense.

    Well, China was trying to have everything – have a strategic relationship with Russia, promote anti-Westernism and a schism between US and Europe, but also have access to large areas of Eastern Europe. Under peaceful conditions this seems possible and was intended intelligently (since such a large war was not expected).

    There is some info that China might be supplying Russia in the war. This is speculation but there is some info that planes are flying without transponders between China and Russia and may be carrying some war supplies, not weapons but possibly winter gear (for the “second best army on the planet”).

    But China knows the same foreign government who stepped in and forced Ukraine to cancel the sale of Motor Sich to a Chinese entity

    Companies such as Motor Sich should be in Ukrainian hands. I know this may not be as simple due to financial reasons, but this should be the aim. Foreigners may own shares, but not in full.

    China is also well aware of US psyops to compare Ukraine to Taiwan

    These are not always accurate comparisons. Yes, there is an element of a proxy war in Ukraine, but Ukraine is essentially fighting an anti-colonial war of independence.

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @LatW

    So China wanting to have good relations with Ukraine and China is a bad thing??? Where is the logic in that? Only countries that seek to divide and rule think there should be “blocs” (gangs) among countries. China promotes anti western ideology? Ummm no China was all too happy to do business with the west. But if saying the west doesn’t have the right to dictate to the rest of the globe - then yeah I guess you can call it that.

    And who are you to say if Motor Sich should be sold? Fact is Ukraine was ready and willing until the US ordered them not to. So much for sovereignty and freedom. It’s a joke.

  787. @AnonfromTN
    @Philip Owen

    Then how come NATO weapons wielded by Ukies daily kill civilians now in Donetsk, Gorlovka, Makeevka, and other DPR and LPR cities? Ukies killed about half a dozen children in Donetsk agglomeration in recent weeks. Not to mention that several times in the last two months Ukies used HIMARS rockets to scatter anti-infantry mines in residential areas of DPR towns. These mines killed a few and wounded scores, including children (they look like toys). Are all those dead propaganda? Tell it to mothers of murdered children and come back to report the results.

    Replies: @keypusher

    No one was dying from shelling between 2015 and Putin’s invasion on February 24, 2022. Since then thousands of civilians have died.

    • Troll: Mikel, showmethereal
    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @keypusher


    No one was dying from shelling between 2015 and Putin’s invasion on February 24, 2022.
     
    That’s a blatant lie. Numerous Donbass civilians were murdered by Ukie shelling after 2015. I cannot find all exact data in English, but here are some:
    https://www.crisisgroup.org/content/conflict-ukraines-donbas-visual-explainer
  788. @LatW
    @showmethereal


    The only thing I knew up to that point was that I liked Ukrainian boxers.
     
    Did you know that Usyk is now wearing a uniform and is on the front lines apparently? That's so messed up. :(

    Are you following the protests in China? Based on some footage, there are way more protesters than the police can control, it seems quite serious. This could totally affect their economy.

    Replies: @showmethereal

    Indeed I do know. I know lomochecnko did too – but he went back to boxing. But the irony is sitting and listening to the State Department under Nuland playing kingmaker and discussing what they wanted to do with the Klitschko brother who got into politics made me pay attention more keenly. That was smart of them to use him as a puppet since he was western friendly from his boxing. The whole thing is a joke because people in the west didn’t like him much before because he was an Eastern European. They wanted soooo bad for an American to beat either brother. I personally wanted to see the one who lost to Anthony Joshua beat him and retire gracefully. Westerners were sooo happy a Brit won over him. It’s sooooo hysterical to me to see how Ukrainian boxers are treated now by the west as opposed to even a decade ago. Now they save the scorn for just the Russian boxers.

    Protests? Protests happen in China all the time. People have those lies about Tinanmen in their head to think Chinese are afraid of their government (which makes no sense since China’s history is full of rebellions). I mean even in that instance people forget the protesters were allowed to be out there for 6 whole weeks. Police and soldiers were unarmed and sat out there and sang songs. The leaders were able to face the CPC leaders and ask questions and it was recorded. But the western lies would have you believe the people got outside asking for democracy and a couple of days later got mowed down by machine guns and tanks. Complete folly and people believe it.

    In any event – China made clear that they will sacrifice economic growth to protect lives. Personally I think they can ease up since Omicron is weaker. But another irony is that people are not forced to be vaccinated in China. Only about 60% of the elderly chose to get vaccinated. Yet the west claims there is no freedom in China and also claiming “communist China” doesn’t care about life. Completely backwards. In any event so protests will continue. And since China doesn’t have a lot of violent crime you will indeed see people outnumbering the police. If there were real riots like in the west tha ts when the Peoples Militia would come out. They are the largest militia in the world and would relieve the police. Police in China are not like western police for the most part. Another misconception. And again protests in China are common. This won’t be a repeat of 1989…. The government has much tools at keeping track of foreign agents…. There will be no stockpiling of Molotov cocktails and firearms like in 1989. No groups will be allowed to squat in public for 6 days let alone 6 weeks. All this is good for is press.

  789. @German_reader
    @AnonfromTN

    That's a theme you keep returning to, like a broken record. Sure, Europe's future is likely to be utterly bleak, I have no illusions about that. Seems very doubtful to me though that Russia's will be great either. Being junior partner to China is probably all the country can aspire to. And apart from that, relations with such wonderful partners as the Islamic republic or the occasional military junta in Africa.
    I'm not happy about that development, in fact I find it deeply depressing, all the hopes of better relations between Russia and Europe that emerged after the Cold War ruined. Your apportionment of the blame is very one-sided though. EU has made a lot of mistakes (and continues to make them, like the EU parliament now seriously concerning itself with the urgent issue of Holodomor, absurd). But if Russia hadn't resorted to military force (was there really no other way?), things would never have gotten this far. Sure, you can always argue that EU was hypocritical and didn't do enough to condemn Ukrainian actions in Donbass. Still, what Russia's been doing since February wasn't necessary and has only made things worse.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    Still, what Russia’s been doing since February wasn’t necessary and has only made things worse.

    Western Europe cooperated with the empire in creating the Banderite-dominated Ukraine the RF is fighting now. Maidan of 2014 saw not only Nuland’s cookies (her “fuck the EU” turned out to be prophetic). Merkel and various leaders of European countries and of the EU itself were on the Maidan, openly demonstrating their support. Europeans signed the agreements between Yanuk and demonstrators (both of these sides were scum IMO) and next day applauded when the other side broke these agreements and deposed an elected president. France and Germany were guarantors of Minsk agreements and never did anything in many years to make Kiev regime implement those agreements, or at least to stop Ukie butchery in Donbass.

    One of the commenters above talked about sowing and reaping. Europe is reaping what it sowed.

  790. @keypusher
    @AnonfromTN

    No one was dying from shelling between 2015 and Putin's invasion on February 24, 2022. Since then thousands of civilians have died.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    No one was dying from shelling between 2015 and Putin’s invasion on February 24, 2022.

    That’s a blatant lie. Numerous Donbass civilians were murdered by Ukie shelling after 2015. I cannot find all exact data in English, but here are some:
    https://www.crisisgroup.org/content/conflict-ukraines-donbas-visual-explainer

  791. The DNC Globalists are now on record against workers: (1)

    Unions Furious As Biden, Pelosi Push Bill To Avert Rail Strike

    Under pressure from President Biden, Speaker Pelosi said that House lawmakers will take up legislation on Wednesday to stop a nationwide strike by railroad workers by imposing a proposed contract that members at four railroad unions had rejected, saying Congress needs to intervene to prevent devastating job losses.

    “I don’t like going against the ability of unions to strike, but weighing the equities, we must avoid a strike. Jobs will be lost, even union jobs will be lost, water will not be safe, product will not be going to market,” she said.

    There is unusually high activity at MAGA campaign headquarters in Mar-a-Lago.

    Several channels with a good record of prognostication suggest that Trump will soon be making an announcement endorsing contract terms more favourable to Union workers. This is obviously not a done deal until we a hear it. However, 66%+ likely at this point. Keep your ears open.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.zerohedge.com/political/unions-furious-biden-pelosi-push-bill-avert-rail-strike

    • Replies: @A123
    @A123


    Several channels with a good record of prognostication suggest that Trump will soon be making an announcement endorsing contract terms more favourable to Union workers. This is obviously not a done deal until we a hear it. However, 66%+ likely at this point. Keep your ears open.
     
    So much for prognostication.

    The Bill passed the House (1). It is too late for Trump to advocate better conditions for workers. I do not know the reason for the balk. Anything that might backfire, causing coal & oil trains to stop, might have been seen as too risky with the cold season coming.

    MAGA showed at least a little pro-worker backbone opposing this gift to MegaCorporations, but I had hoped for more.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11486839/House-PASSES-bill-stop-rail-strike-December-9-Biden-asked-Congress-step-in.html

     
    https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2022/11/30/18/65098837-11486839-image-a-1_1669832089119.jpg
  792. @LatW
    @songbird


    I don’t think it would be true to say that Irish nationalism was wholly a negative feeling against the English
     
    Not at all, wouldn't you say nationalism exists on its own? I thought we were talking about ethnocentrism, not nationalism, those are slightly different things. Every nation is a priori ethnocentric, right? Nationalism is more of a political manifestation. But there might be something to it, this is the case with freedom, when you know you can lose it, you value it more? This is an undervalued aspect in the conversation about Ukraine as well. They talk a lot about territory and language rights (although those are connected to freedom) but not about how Ukrainians simply do not want to live under someone tyrannical, especially under a tyrannical outsider.

    But I do suspect that these negative feelings may have been like rutted wagon tracks, and have impeded a quick readjustment to the threat of mass migration.
     
    Maybe, or maybe the immigration into Ireland wasn't perceived as a negative in the beginning (by your average citizen)? I'm not familiar with the original profile of the migrants, weren't most of them peaceful and employed? I mean, most people will not object to an Indian female nurse that speaks your language, right? Of course, it's far from great how things have turned out overall. I haven't been to Ireland in a while, so don't know how things look on the ground.

    Also, one thing you might want to keep in mind is that not all whites act the same among other whites. In Western Europe or the US you don't notice this, but historically some Russians have sometimes had a certain type of demeanor or behaviors that really make them stand out (for example, they are louder than others, their women use more makeup and are more sexualized, etc) - this is not necessarily liked by everyone, regardless of them being a "former occupier". Obviously, this depends on the person, but this is a common stereotype. Or at least used to be, that is changing too.

    I don’t like their blank-slatist rhetoric myself, but isn’t it essentially German law?
     
    Tbh, these types of nationalist parties may simply not be able to reach above a certain level of electoral support. And in a democratic environment, one has to respect that one's compatriots, the majority of them anyway, may not want to vote for these parties (e.g., accept far right ideas or even basic conservatism). Haven't you ever felt that it would seem arrogant to tell others how they should be politically? The problem is when their complacent politics start affecting everyone.

    I haven’t followed the rhetoric too closely, but I suspect that much of it might be a clutzy attempt to verbalize national interests, rather than a desire to lecture.
     
    No, it's at a systemic level where they think they know better, that they are better and that everyone should accept their political ideas (including social experiments). It even gets to absurd things like we see above, where a German will insinuate that Latvians are worse Nazis than the Germans themselves (very convenient), etc, etc. I'm not saying it's every Westerner, definitely not most, but enough of them. It's been that way for decades now (and obviously it will be related to poz as well, since they will promote poz very happily and with great enthusiasm and will always find local allies).

    historically, neutral countries usually carry out trade, when not impeded by military barriers. This is not tantamount to wanting to sell arms to them, or join their army. It is mostly about serving national interests.
     
    The problem is that it's not just trade. Neutral country with plenty of self-defense doing just trade would be great. But there are few such countries overall, maybe not that realistic these days.

    IMO, Russian will never cross NATO’s borders.

     

    They have in some ways (airspace, spying, expecting the EU institutions to observe their ethnic rights while they don't observe minority rights at home). But that's not what I meant, what I meant was that those antagonists from the woke side, that you had in mind, I'm assuming, that they, too, sometimes act out and in some cases are met with resistance (maybe not enough). You sounded like you were saying that because of the Russian antagonists, the Baltic states or Ukraine are not aware of the poz. This is not the case. I don't think one should choose between the two, they can both be banished. But, of course, the people will decide how it plays out, if the people are meek or find benefits in the poz (which many do, objectively, quite a few people get financial benefit or emotional gratification out of it so they won't consider it an "antagonist" at all but something that adds to their life), then it will come through. Maybe not to the extent as in the West, but that's little solace.

    you see the potential of some future alliance with Ukraine – something to counter the poz, and see Russia as impeding that, by weakening Ukraine territorially?
     
    Very much so. Russia practically destroyed Eastern Ukraine which would've been the biggest anti-poz bastion, for purely selfish reasons and out of jealousy. But in general, it is not Ukraine's job to "counter the poz", Ukraine's job is to preserve themselves first and foremost.

    I have said that Ukraine appears very pozzed to me now given its per capita
     
    They may be low GDP per capita but they are high IQ and quite exposed to Europe. And they don't have the type of traditionalist rules as in some non-white countries. But I don't know why you consider them more pozzed, the Ukrainians I notice are not pozzed at all, not sure they will prevail, of course, they could get pushed aside in the future.

    Replies: @German_reader, @songbird

    Maybe, or maybe the immigration into Ireland wasn’t perceived as a negative in the beginning (by your average citizen)? I’m not familiar with the original profile of the migrants, weren’t most of them peaceful and employed?

    I believe the originals were primarily heavily-pregnant Nigerians, exploiting a loophole in the peace process

    [MORE]
    (frankly, I suspect it was there by the design of globalists, but perhaps not) to drop anchor babies. Sometimes, they gave birth on the plane. At one, point, I think most of the babies being born at the Rotunda Hospital in Dublin were Nigerians, or at least foreigners. People were very alarmed by this, naturally. And they actually had a ballot to repeal birthright citzenship that won in a landslide – in one of the rare votes in Europe where some proxy of immigration was ever put before the people.

    If you took a vote of the natives, I am quite sure they would vote against mass migration. There are surveys that say so, but they will never get the vote. Especially now that hate speech laws have been instituted.

    wouldn’t you say nationalism exists on its own? I thought we were talking about ethnocentrism, not nationalism, those are slightly different things. Every nation is a priori ethnocentric, right?

    I’m just speaking kind of loosely, simplifying terms, to try to get my analogy across. I think there were ancient ideas of ethnos, complete with some level of ethnocentrism.

    The exact definition of nationalism, IMO, depends on how romantic or mechanistic a view of it one wants to take. The romantic view is that it is something with old or even ancient underpinnings. The mechanistic view is that it is something modern, perhaps, requiring certain technologies to encourage a high threshold of cooperation.

    My personal bias is for the romantic view.

    But for my analogy, I am considering something more like a modern or legacy culture, which names the outgroup. I suspect this sort of legacy culture, as it has developed, might be a handicap, in modern times. In some, it spawns silly antagonistic feelings (it is actually amusing how often this can be seen with brands of beer), while others may dismiss all calls to ethnocentrism based on how silly some of these old antagonisms seem.

    Tbh, these types of nationalist parties may simply not be able to reach above a certain level of electoral support. And in a democratic environment, one has to respect that one’s compatriots, the majority of them anyway, may not want to vote for these parties

    Yes, this is shortfall of democracy. Most like to vote for legacy parties. I don’t think people are very capable of re-adjusting, after they reach a certain age. And many are simply programmed by the regime to support it, and to not support the thing the regime opposes.

    But I don’t know why you consider them more pozzed, the Ukrainians I notice are not pozzed at all

    There was that story I linked to twice about a hockey player doing some taunt with a banana to an American-born black player, in the Donbass no less, and it seems like they really threw the book at him. Didn’t they also fly a giant rainbow flag in Kiev? And Ze was in that skit where he was naked with a black man in a supermarket. And there appeared to be very large numbers of foreign students, before the war, which I would argue is partly a scheme by the regime in Western Europe to launder them, by giving them credentials.

    I wouldn’t say these things are necessarily reflective on the general pop, but the elites definitely seem in the pozzed camp, or at least appear to be signaling allegiance to it. (just like in many other countries)

  793. @sudden death
    @songbird

    NATO and nuclear weapons are worthless without political will to act in case of crisis and politicians, taking money from RF, like LePen (promising to get out of NATO military structure) are doing everything to weaken both political will and military capabilities. In theory, somebody might be just idealist isolationist without any foreign influence, but the end result will be also destruction of that political will.

    RF will certainly cross any NATO boundaries if they will calculate that there is no political will to stand against and react:

    https://twitter.com/RadioJustBack/status/1502769211969622017?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1502769211969622017%7Ctwgr%5E7d8d68f0858648bcc4010bdf8e44c3526a627042%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.reddit.com%2Fr%2FUkraineWarVideoReport%2Fsearch%2F%3Fq%3Dkorotchenkosort%3Drelevancet%3Dall

    Replies: @sudden death, @songbird

    As far as that TV clip goes, I think there is a certain bizarre, impotent saber-rattling happening on Russian TV. I recall that clip of the dubious super-weapon torpedo being used to radioactive tsunami Britain and Ireland – But I am still waiting for them to push the button.

  794. @German_reader
    @AP


    whereas Balts are just victims
     
    No, they aren't. You mentioned Red Riflemen yourself. Latvians supposedly also had the highest per capita rate of Holocaust perpetrators. My own grandfather (who may or may not have participated in crimes himself, I can't know for sure) saw Latvian auxiliaries beating up Jews in Minsk. Of course that wouldn't have happened without the prior Soviet crimes in 1940/41 and without the German occupation, and I once even used to have some sympathy for Balts because of their historical experiences. I don't anymore given their unhinged behaviour during the current crisis. And what happened in 1941 and 1944 is only of limited relevance today anyway, unless one approaches international politics as a form of collective trauma therapy, like a lot of Balts and Poles seem to do.

    A weak Russia means safety for the Baltic republics.
     
    Safety for the Baltic republics lies in the NATO forces stationed there, even if they're merely tripwire forces, they'd almost certainly ensure a strong reaction in case of a Russian invasion (and I haven't yet seen a plausible scenario why Russia would want to invade the Baltic states anyway). I know you always feel compelled to be in "professional Ukrainian" mode (as utu aptly put it before his disappearance), but Ukraine is fighting for herself, for nobody else, and claims to the contrary are just exercises in public relations.

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard, @AnonfromTN, @AP

    whereas Balts are just victims

    No, they aren’t.

    Yes they are. Their countries were forcibly annexed by the Soviets, they were murdered and deported in large numbers, and were being replaced by Russian and Russian-speaking colonists.

    You mentioned Red Riflemen yourself.

    Latvians were not 100% innocent, unlike Lithuanians and Estonians. Although this case is more ambiguous than that of the Germans from the lost territories. Latvians supported the Bolsheviks because they wanted to be independent, Germans in East Prussia and Danzig supported the Nazis in part because they wanted to rule eastern Europeans and take their land (this was a major part of the Nazi program).

    Latvians supposedly also had the highest per capita rate of Holocaust perpetrators

    Probably revenge for the Bolshevik nightmare, as you implied.

    I once even used to have some sympathy for Balts because of their historical experiences. I don’t anymore given their unhinged behaviour during the current crisis

    Strong support for the victim of murderous Russian aggression is “unhinged?”

    Safety for the Baltic republics lies in the NATO forces stationed there, even if they’re merely tripwire forces, they’d almost certainly ensure a strong reaction in case of a Russian invasion (and I haven’t yet seen a plausible scenario why Russia would want to invade the Baltic states anyway).

    Someone else had posted Russian threats. Baltic republics are inconvenient due to Kaliningrad. And two of them have large Russian populations.

    Ukraine is fighting for herself, for nobody else

    By fighting for herself, Ukraine fights for Russia’s other neighbors.

    • LOL: Mikhail
    • Replies: @Mikel
    @AP



    Latvians supposedly also had the highest per capita rate of Holocaust perpetrators

    Probably revenge for the Bolshevik nightmare, as you implied.
     
    How could random Jewish people, including women, children and civilians from outside the USSR be regarded by Latvians or Ukrainians as responsible for Bolshevik crimes? There must have been some other reasons behind those genocidal impulses. Nobody with a functioning brain thinks that killing a Jewish infant from Poland or Hungary is revenging any crime committed by people in a different country.

    Replies: @AP, @Wokechoke

    , @German_reader
    @AP


    Strong support for the victim of murderous Russian aggression is “unhinged?”
     
    The Balts don't matter much in material terms. Their "support" consists in verbal extremism that has a good chance of getting us all killed if it becomes policy. An example: Latvia's minister of defense just demanded that Ukraine be given the "right" to attack RF territory (meaning, presumably, pre-2014 RF territory) to stop the missile strikes against Ukraine. Of course Ukraine already has that "right" in the abstract, so what he really means is that Ukraine should be given the means (long-range missiles) and the intelligence support by NATO to do so. And if NATO directly aided in attacking Russia proper, then we would indeed be getting inexorably closer towards nuclear armaggeddon.

    Replies: @LatW

  795. @German_reader
    @AnonfromTN


    There were two Latvian Waffen SS divisions
     
    Those were mostly conscripts and iirc during their existence were mostly limited to regular warfare, so probably not many war crimes committed by them. Some of their members had been in police and auxiliary formations before though which did commit a lot of crimes, up to mass killings.
    Anyway, I have little desire to discuss the issue, one of the most annoying habits of Eastern Europeans is their tendency to view everything through the lens of the 1940s ("Holodomor!" "Nazis!" "Banderites!" and so on). That both Russians and their regional enemies do this, is just another sign that in the end you're all from the same world, a world any sane Western European would want to have as little to do with as possible.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Mikel, @AnonfromTN

    one of the most annoying habits of Eastern Europeans is their tendency to view everything through the lens of the 1940s (“Holodomor!” “Nazis!” “Banderites!” and so on). That both Russians and their regional enemies do this, is just another sign that in the end you’re all from the same world, a world any sane Western European would want to have as little to do with as possible.

    Quite true.

    In fact, I do have some understanding for Eastern Europeans. In post-war Western Europe people were much freer to discuss things, mend relations and build mutually beneficial relationships whereas Eastern Europeans lived in the Soviet freezer for decades, forced to disguise their animosities and subject to the rule of Moscow to a much greater degree than Western Europe was subject to their big US ally.

    From this perspective, it is natural that their worldview is still not exactly like the Western one. I think that this also happened to Eastern Germans to some extent. In the late 90s I was driving through Germany on my way to Poland and I stopped at a highway rest area in Eastern Germany, where the attendant asked me to pay for the entrance. I didn’t have Marks on me, only some Dutch Guilders, but he readily accepted them as “gutes Geld”. We chatted for a few seconds but it was enough for him to start complaining about the Easterners (Kameraden, as he called them) that tried to pay with their “worthless” money. It was just a brief encounter but I got the distinct impression that things were different in Eastern and Western Germany at the time. I couldn’t imagine a Western German deriding foreigners like that in a brief encounter with an unknown passer by.

    The problem, however, is that Eastern Europeans beyond the Oder seem to have dragged their old animosities much longer. They haven’t been able to mend their disputes and they could actually lead us to a senseless nuclear confrontation. To be fair, it’s not only EEs though. There’s plenty of Russophobe nutters in the West too. This wouldn’t have escalated so badly if we hadn’t found it our duty to take sides in their quarrels and especially support the Maidan revolution.

  796. @showmethereal
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    Is that the excuse you are using? I’ve seen Thai before. I remember it from childhood. Take your ball and go home. I made sure to teach my children differently. In any event This is a public English language platform. This is not a private conversation so I won’t indulge in folly nor deviate from the matter at hand.

    Costa Rica 1 - Japan 0
    Ghana 3 - South Korea 2

    That’s for everyone to read. What it means is your argument that Japanese are superior to Chinese is falling on its shaky legs. You must be very embarrassed that Japan lost to a team that has blacks and South Korea lost to one that is basically all black. Please don’t commit seppuku. Unz is fairly anonymous - so you don’t have to worry about your honor

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    You can’t read Chinese can you?

    A literate Chinese and Japanese would recognize that this is a quatrain by Tang poet Du Mu 杜牧 (AD 803—852) commenting on the Battle of Red Cliff (AD 208). It was quoted in Romance of Three Kingdoms (14th CE).

    折戟沉沙鐵未銷,自將磨洗認前朝。

    東風不與周郎便,銅雀春深鎖二喬。

    There’s a translation here, https://28utscprojects.wordpress.com/2010/11/28/290/
    I’ll also give my own in English and German,

    Red Cliff
    Broken halberds buried deep in the sand, have yet rust are their spearheads,
    Alas I wash them up and recognise they are from an ancient dynasty,
    Had the eastern wind not blown in our boy Zhou’s favour,
    Tower of Bronze Peacocks would have forever held captive the hot Qiao sisters.

    Rote Klippe
    Zerbrochene Hellebarden tief im Sand vergraben, auch rostig sind ihre Speerspitzen,
    Ach! wasche sie ab und erkenne, dass sie aus einer alten Dynastie stammen,
    Hätte der Ostwind nicht zu Gunsten von junge Zhou treffen,
    Bronzepfauenturm hätte die geilen Qiao Schwestern für immer gefangen gehalten.

    The story is that Cao Cao before the battle boasted about taking Zhou Yu’s wife Little Qiao and her equally stunning sister as concubines. But Zhou Yu defeated Cao’s numerically vast superior navy with a brilliant fire attack assisted by easterlies.

    • Replies: @showmethereal
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    You don’t realize you are a troll do you? That has absolutely NOTHING to do with the forum nor the topic being argued (which was sports). That officially makes you a troll. Cao Cao is a favorite historical figure. But only trolls would try to insert that into this discourse. You were better off seething over the World Cup loss quietly

  797. @German_reader
    @Mr. Hack


    LatW is entitled to voice any opinion that he feels is necessary to make.
     
    She's a woman (formerly commenting as LatvianWoman)...how can you not know this after several years?
    Of course you like her comments (which sometimes are interesting, I will admit that), because she tells you what you want to hear, that everything will turn out fine for Ukraine, that Russia will be defeated militarily and lose even Crimea without resorting to nuclear weapons, that the biggest danger is a ceasefire cheating Ukraine of its supposedly inevitable victory. It's understandable on a psychological level. Whether any of it is likely to happen, that's another question.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @Barbarossa

    I actually didn’t pick up on the fact that LatW is a woman either.

    Although your revelation did make me realize something interesting. I realized that my mind automatically has assigned indistinct likenesses to almost all of the commenters around here based on their “voice”, mannerisms etc. It’s not conscious, it’s rather how one generally forms pictures of radio announcers. However, I realized that I didn’t have an image formed for LatW, but now that I know that she is a woman, my mind supplies one. It’s as if my brain didn’t have the necessary information to make the image. Perhaps since I assumed that LatW was a man, but something in the typing “voice” was not quite male enough? Beats me, but I thought it was rather interesting.

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @Barbarossa


    I actually didn’t pick up on the fact that LatW is a woman either.
     
    This revelation that LatW is a woman has been pretty disconcerting. Over the past year, I had cemented an image in my mind of a 40-ish year old Latvian closeted homosexual male. I think her interests in military affairs, fat-right political orientation, and as you say subconscious application of sameness to commenters, is what made me automatically assume LatW is a male rather than female.

    I’m trying to hark back to any comment that may have indicated she was female. Can’t think of one where someone else referred to her as a “she”, or if she directly reveled her gender. But maybe I haven’t been reading the comments carefully. I don’t fault her if she has deliberately been concealing her gender. I think the commenters here tend to get aggressive with females, some out of misogyny, others because they sense feminine passivity and feebleness. There was another poor female commenter called “Rosie” (I think gone now) who was constantly belittled and domineered by the male commenters on this site. OTOH, the Laxa character could hold her own against others here, although it’s unclear what sort of human being she/he/it was.

    I’m now starting to wonder who else here might be a closeted female. Sher Singh? A123? Songbird?

    KidDynamite mistakingly referred to Talha as a “lady” the other day. Not sure if he (or would that be a she?) was trolling, but I’ve seen others mistake Talha for a woman before, probably because of the “a” at the end of his name. Incidentally my own name likewise ends with an “a”, though no-one has mistaken me for a female. Wonder why that is?

    Replies: @Yevardian, @Barbarossa, @songbird

  798. @AP
    @German_reader


    whereas Balts are just victims

    No, they aren’t.
     

    Yes they are. Their countries were forcibly annexed by the Soviets, they were murdered and deported in large numbers, and were being replaced by Russian and Russian-speaking colonists.

    You mentioned Red Riflemen yourself.
     
    Latvians were not 100% innocent, unlike Lithuanians and Estonians. Although this case is more ambiguous than that of the Germans from the lost territories. Latvians supported the Bolsheviks because they wanted to be independent, Germans in East Prussia and Danzig supported the Nazis in part because they wanted to rule eastern Europeans and take their land (this was a major part of the Nazi program).

    Latvians supposedly also had the highest per capita rate of Holocaust perpetrators
     
    Probably revenge for the Bolshevik nightmare, as you implied.

    I once even used to have some sympathy for Balts because of their historical experiences. I don’t anymore given their unhinged behaviour during the current crisis
     
    Strong support for the victim of murderous Russian aggression is "unhinged?"

    Safety for the Baltic republics lies in the NATO forces stationed there, even if they’re merely tripwire forces, they’d almost certainly ensure a strong reaction in case of a Russian invasion (and I haven’t yet seen a plausible scenario why Russia would want to invade the Baltic states anyway).
     
    Someone else had posted Russian threats. Baltic republics are inconvenient due to Kaliningrad. And two of them have large Russian populations.

    Ukraine is fighting for herself, for nobody else
     
    By fighting for herself, Ukraine fights for Russia's other neighbors.

    Replies: @Mikel, @German_reader

    Latvians supposedly also had the highest per capita rate of Holocaust perpetrators

    Probably revenge for the Bolshevik nightmare, as you implied.

    How could random Jewish people, including women, children and civilians from outside the USSR be regarded by Latvians or Ukrainians as responsible for Bolshevik crimes? There must have been some other reasons behind those genocidal impulses. Nobody with a functioning brain thinks that killing a Jewish infant from Poland or Hungary is revenging any crime committed by people in a different country.

    • Replies: @AP
    @Mikel


    How could random Jewish people, including women, children and civilians from outside the USSR be regarded by Latvians or Ukrainians as responsible for Bolshevik crimes?
     
    The mentality for many of those people was something like blind rage or cold hateful vengeance. Someone whose family were slaughtered would in turn slaughter the family of those linked to their killers. Or in a more benign version, be indifferent to the murder of people like those who had murdered their loved ones. Obviously I do not agree with this approach and view it as a case of evil begetting evil, and imagine (and hope) that if I had been tested as those people were I would not have been capable of such crimes.

    BTW, we have sort of an example here - our AnoninTN, whose relatives suffered from bombing in Luhansk, and is indifferent and makes excuses for a much worse and larger scale bombing of people he links to the bombers of Luhansk.

    Nobody with a functioning brain thinks that killing a Jewish infant from Poland or Hungary is revenging any crime committed by people in a different country.
     
    Well, infants die in the Russian bombing, yet Russians angry about Donbas justify or dismiss such deaths as Kiev getting a taste of its own medicine, or something like that.

    Replies: @Mikel, @AnonfromTN

    , @Wokechoke
    @Mikel

    The Baltic Area was lousy with Jews before ww2.

  799. @silviosilver
    @Barbarossa

    Yes, sorry, I wasn't asking frivolously, I was genuinely curious. Just quickly, I am a former libertarian. One of the attractions of libertarianism was the "permission" it gave me to ignore society and its happenings and focus solely on what is of direct interest to me personally. One lingering consequence of that is that I am still very uninvolved in society, and I have little idea of how much of it works in a political context (in the real world, at the personal level). I have often heard claims of "local politics is where it's at," but I have been skeptical because I have been unable to imagine what that would involve (in such a way that it'd benefit my political values and objectives).

    So okay, what you mentioned has helped paint a picture for me. It even seems a little obvious after you described it, and I feel like that's something I should have thought of - but I hadn't. How much of it, though, is a result of local voting - of getting the right party into power - and how much of it is a result of non-political community ties? I think this is an important distinction, because if it's more the result of people belonging to an established community in which "everyone thinks the same", then local elections seem to have less to do with it. If this is the case, then in a larger municipality, one which lacks the tight-knit community ties, in which people emphatically do not think the same way, I doubt it would be able to emulate your town's experience, since even winning the election and getting "your people" into positions of authority would still leave them facing heightened scrutiny and they would be warier of bending the rules to favor their own people. Or maybe they would, if they had a sizeable enough political majority. I'm not sure. Still, I do very much have the impression that what you described is to a good degree more the result of homogeneity rather than political power per se.

    Replies: @Barbarossa

    I am a former libertarian.

    I can commiserate since I found libertarianism to be somewhat attractive in my late teens and early 20’s. It seems to be a good thing to grow out of, since it’s a neat and tidy ideology that doesn’t really reflect much about how the world really works.

    As far as my examples I think it is a combination of non-political community ties and voting, though I would generally weight the former higher. It also entails proper scale for communities. If the municipality is too big then you will lose the direct human connection which makes accommodation more likely.

    At least this is the case in an situation where atomized individual predominates. I’m pretty sure that Sher Singh or my local Amish sawyer can somewhat count on a measure of beneficent treatment from others in their wider in-group, regardless of personal connection. You and me are just individuals though and so we become faceless statistics in a larger setting, and only by finding a small enough receptive community, with at least limited shared values, can we regain a reasonable measure of mutual accommodation.

    But voting is important too, since in the case of a county Sheriff or health department, they probably won’t know you personally but they will know the general state of the county. A Sheriff may know that if he sends his men out to aggressively enforce some new gun law out of Albany, he’s likely to end up with a shootout, so he may publicly call the law boneheaded and choose to turn a blind eye unless someone is so boneheaded or dangerous that his hand is forced.

    So you have to vote those guys in, vote the guys in that will do the appointing, or run yourself/ encourage other reasonable folks to run. Either way it takes more than just passive community involvement or the whole thing will get overrun by busybodies.

    You absolutely have to have the amenable human capital to make a community run but you also have to be able to deploy it in enough concentration to make a difference.

    • Replies: @A123
    @Barbarossa



    I am a former libertarian
     
    I can commiserate since I found libertarianism to be somewhat attractive in my late teens and early 20’s. It seems to be a good thing to grow out of, since it’s a neat and tidy ideology that doesn’t really reflect much about how the world really works
     
    I have also been there. If everyone is a Libertarian, then Libertarianism makes sense. As soon as there are followers of other concepts. Hyper individualistic, pure Libertarians are easy fodder.

    Robust groups of Judeo-Christians create a collective fire team with reliability driven by faith.

     
    https://memegenerator.net/img/instances/62015710.jpg
     

    Can you get four secular Libertarians in a fox hole? Possibly? How does unit cohesion work?

    A Godless society is inevitably a failed civilization.

    PEACE 😇
  800. @Mikel
    @AP



    Latvians supposedly also had the highest per capita rate of Holocaust perpetrators

    Probably revenge for the Bolshevik nightmare, as you implied.
     
    How could random Jewish people, including women, children and civilians from outside the USSR be regarded by Latvians or Ukrainians as responsible for Bolshevik crimes? There must have been some other reasons behind those genocidal impulses. Nobody with a functioning brain thinks that killing a Jewish infant from Poland or Hungary is revenging any crime committed by people in a different country.

    Replies: @AP, @Wokechoke

    How could random Jewish people, including women, children and civilians from outside the USSR be regarded by Latvians or Ukrainians as responsible for Bolshevik crimes?

    The mentality for many of those people was something like blind rage or cold hateful vengeance. Someone whose family were slaughtered would in turn slaughter the family of those linked to their killers. Or in a more benign version, be indifferent to the murder of people like those who had murdered their loved ones. Obviously I do not agree with this approach and view it as a case of evil begetting evil, and imagine (and hope) that if I had been tested as those people were I would not have been capable of such crimes.

    BTW, we have sort of an example here – our AnoninTN, whose relatives suffered from bombing in Luhansk, and is indifferent and makes excuses for a much worse and larger scale bombing of people he links to the bombers of Luhansk.

    Nobody with a functioning brain thinks that killing a Jewish infant from Poland or Hungary is revenging any crime committed by people in a different country.

    Well, infants die in the Russian bombing, yet Russians angry about Donbas justify or dismiss such deaths as Kiev getting a taste of its own medicine, or something like that.

    • Replies: @Mikel
    @AP


    infants die in the Russian bombing
     
    Not in the same targeted and deliberate way as during the massacres of Jews during WW2.

    I'm just trying to understand those events and revenge for Bolshevik crimes doesn't look too convincing. I doubt that most Holocaust collaborators had victims of those crimes in their immediate families, just like few German perpetrators had such close personal reasons to do what they did.

    If I saw people of a certain race disproportionately represented among the criminals victimizing members of my community (for example Black Americans or Mexican Hispanics) and I felt desires of revenge, I don't think killing Nigerian or Ecuatorian infants would provide me any relief.

    Perhaps they bought the Nazis' ideology of inferior races that needed to be exterminated or perhaps they didn't care that much for ideologies but wanted to make thrmselves useful to their German allies leaving moral constraints aside. Both alternatives look more likely to me.

    Let's hope this war stops soon and we don't reach those levels of depravation.

    Replies: @Coconuts, @AP

    , @AnonfromTN
    @AP


    BTW, we have sort of an example here – our AnoninTN, whose relatives suffered from bombing in Luhansk, and is indifferent and makes excuses for a much worse and larger scale bombing of people he links to the bombers of Luhansk.
     
    Information tidbit. The residents of Ukraine protested against a lot of things: high prices of electricity, natural gas, increase in payments for their apartments, even against high customs duties levied on used cars they brought from Europe.

    How many times did they protest against heinous crimes committed by their government ostensibly in their name in Donbass for eight years? Exactly zero.

    How many times did they protest against cutting off water and electricity supply to presumably their compatriots in Crimea? Exactly zero.

    Any more questions?

    Replies: @AP

  801. @Barbarossa
    @silviosilver


    I am a former libertarian.
     
    I can commiserate since I found libertarianism to be somewhat attractive in my late teens and early 20's. It seems to be a good thing to grow out of, since it's a neat and tidy ideology that doesn't really reflect much about how the world really works.

    As far as my examples I think it is a combination of non-political community ties and voting, though I would generally weight the former higher. It also entails proper scale for communities. If the municipality is too big then you will lose the direct human connection which makes accommodation more likely.

    At least this is the case in an situation where atomized individual predominates. I'm pretty sure that Sher Singh or my local Amish sawyer can somewhat count on a measure of beneficent treatment from others in their wider in-group, regardless of personal connection. You and me are just individuals though and so we become faceless statistics in a larger setting, and only by finding a small enough receptive community, with at least limited shared values, can we regain a reasonable measure of mutual accommodation.

    But voting is important too, since in the case of a county Sheriff or health department, they probably won't know you personally but they will know the general state of the county. A Sheriff may know that if he sends his men out to aggressively enforce some new gun law out of Albany, he's likely to end up with a shootout, so he may publicly call the law boneheaded and choose to turn a blind eye unless someone is so boneheaded or dangerous that his hand is forced.

    So you have to vote those guys in, vote the guys in that will do the appointing, or run yourself/ encourage other reasonable folks to run. Either way it takes more than just passive community involvement or the whole thing will get overrun by busybodies.

    You absolutely have to have the amenable human capital to make a community run but you also have to be able to deploy it in enough concentration to make a difference.

    Replies: @A123

    I am a former libertarian

    I can commiserate since I found libertarianism to be somewhat attractive in my late teens and early 20’s. It seems to be a good thing to grow out of, since it’s a neat and tidy ideology that doesn’t really reflect much about how the world really works

    I have also been there. If everyone is a Libertarian, then Libertarianism makes sense. As soon as there are followers of other concepts. Hyper individualistic, pure Libertarians are easy fodder.

    Robust groups of Judeo-Christians create a collective fire team with reliability driven by faith.

     

     

    Can you get four secular Libertarians in a fox hole? Possibly? How does unit cohesion work?

    A Godless society is inevitably a failed civilization.

    PEACE 😇

  802. @Barbarossa
    @German_reader

    I actually didn't pick up on the fact that LatW is a woman either.

    Although your revelation did make me realize something interesting. I realized that my mind automatically has assigned indistinct likenesses to almost all of the commenters around here based on their "voice", mannerisms etc. It's not conscious, it's rather how one generally forms pictures of radio announcers. However, I realized that I didn't have an image formed for LatW, but now that I know that she is a woman, my mind supplies one. It's as if my brain didn't have the necessary information to make the image. Perhaps since I assumed that LatW was a man, but something in the typing "voice" was not quite male enough? Beats me, but I thought it was rather interesting.

    Replies: @Yahya

    I actually didn’t pick up on the fact that LatW is a woman either.

    This revelation that LatW is a woman has been pretty disconcerting. Over the past year, I had cemented an image in my mind of a 40-ish year old Latvian closeted homosexual male. I think her interests in military affairs, fat-right political orientation, and as you say subconscious application of sameness to commenters, is what made me automatically assume LatW is a male rather than female.

    I’m trying to hark back to any comment that may have indicated she was female. Can’t think of one where someone else referred to her as a “she”, or if she directly reveled her gender. But maybe I haven’t been reading the comments carefully. I don’t fault her if she has deliberately been concealing her gender. I think the commenters here tend to get aggressive with females, some out of misogyny, others because they sense feminine passivity and feebleness. There was another poor female commenter called “Rosie” (I think gone now) who was constantly belittled and domineered by the male commenters on this site. OTOH, the Laxa character could hold her own against others here, although it’s unclear what sort of human being she/he/it was.

    I’m now starting to wonder who else here might be a closeted female. Sher Singh? A123? Songbird?

    KidDynamite mistakingly referred to Talha as a “lady” the other day. Not sure if he (or would that be a she?) was trolling, but I’ve seen others mistake Talha for a woman before, probably because of the “a” at the end of his name. Incidentally my own name likewise ends with an “a”, though no-one has mistaken me for a female. Wonder why that is?

    • Replies: @Yevardian
    @Yahya

    I was a little surprised when G_R mentioned it, but it immediately made perfect sense given past posting history, where I'd previously just assumed it was a male poster who heavily inclined to the emotional, personal and anecdotal. Recently LatW was starting to remind me of that constantly sockpuppeting 'Laxa' commenter, but now its obvious why.


    Sher Singh? A123? Songbird?
     
    Respectively: A romantically frustrated male Pajeet emigrant clinging to his solice that Sikhs are the original Aryans, a Russian disinformation bot almost certainly of male coding origin, and a garden-variety HBD rightoid, I doubt there will be any surprises there.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Sher Singh

    , @Barbarossa
    @Yahya


    automatically assume LatW is a male rather than female
     
    On UNZ it's an assumption which will be pretty safe on average, LOL. The revelation hasn't shaken me up, partly though since I really haven't had that much direct conversation with LatW as she sticks heavily to Balt/Balkan/Russia topics in which I don't have a horse. The right wing orientation doesn't surprise me since it often seems from my experience that when women are right wing (or left wing) they are often more uncompromisingly so than many men. I suppose that the heavy recruitment of women by the Left has probably been quite effective for the energy expended. That should probably serve as some sort of lesson to the right.

    “Rosie” (I think gone now) who was constantly belittled and domineered by the male commenters
     
    I always found that behavior stupid, obnoxious, and counterproductive (see reason above). I prefer to just deal with the substance of what is being said. I never even found Triteleia Laxa that terminally annoying. Amusingly, I once read my wife one of Laxa's comments in which she was psychoanalyzing somebody, and before I even got through the comment my wife's reaction was, "Is she always this obnoxious? Wow!". That cracked me up!

    I'll get back to your other comment more in depth later, but thanks for that. My wife and I gave them all a listen. I definitely prefer the chant and more traditional instrumentation to the more Westernized works. Too much Western instrumentation makes it sound a bit neither here nor there to me. It's okay, but it doesn't grab me as much. I really liked some of the Persian and Turkish traditional music that you posted in previous comments. And any kind of chant is generally fine with me, be it Buddhist, Gregorian, Orthodox, or really any other kind. The purity of only the human voice and limited tonal range seem very transcendent to me.

    Out of curiousity, you seem to have a fairly deep and technical knowledge of music, do you play an instrument or are you just an avid listener?

    Replies: @Yahya

    , @songbird
    @Yahya


    Sher Singh?
     
    In Sikh tradition, "Singh" is the surname which all Sikh males are required to take. But, in emigrating to Canada, I suppose it could be that the females of the line took up the name. And the references to female sex slaves might indicate a lesbian. And the boots and benchpressing a butch.
  803. @Yahya
    @Mr. Hack

    The Phoenicians were accused by Hebrew and Greek sources of child sacrificing rituals. According to them, in the ceremony known as mulk, a child was placed on the arms of a bronze statue and dropped into a brazier below. Researchers have discovered roughly 9 Tophets across the Mediterranean where some speculate the practices occurred. A Tophet is a cemetery containing the cremated remains of infants and young children in clay jars. Presumably the Phoenicians would have chosen their least favored child for sacrifice, and that could have selected for intelligence and beauty, hence my speculation on its eugenic impact on the Lebanese. Though I’ll admit I may have been a bit hasty in my conclusion (which is why I called my statements mere working theories, not final judgements). Plutarch also mentioned that rich families would buy children from poor families to send to the sacrifice.

    Nonetheless, the claims that Phoenicians practiced child sacrifice is controversial as both the Hebrew and Greek sources were xenophobic and furthermore, there are no Phoenician texts preserved that describe this religious practice. Hence, it is difficult to judge these rituals from a Phoenician viewpoint. Some opposing scholars contend that Tophets were burial sites for infants who had died a natural death and that in antiquity infant mortality had been uniformly high across every society so nothing was out of the ordinary.

    Replies: @Yevardian

    The Phoenicians were accused by Hebrew and Greek sources of child sacrificing rituals. According to them, in the ceremony known as mulk, a child was placed on the arms of a bronze statue and dropped into a brazier below. Researchers have discovered roughly 9 Tophets across the Mediterranean where some speculate the practices occurred. A Tophet is a cemetery containing the cremated remains of infants and young children in clay jars. Presumably the Phoenicians would have chosen their least favored child for sacrifice, and that could have selected for intelligence and beauty, hence my speculation on its eugenic impact on the Lebanese. Though I’ll admit I may have been a bit hasty in my conclusion (which is why I called my statements mere working theories, not final judgements). Plutarch also mentioned that rich families would buy children from poor families to send to the sacrifice.

    Pretty bizzare conjecture to take from this any long term eugenic effects vis-a-vis Lebanese attractiveness or intelligence.
    Anyway I certainly wouldn’t dismiss ‘accusations’ of Phoenician child sacrifice as propaganda, the Hebrew Bible (obviously a complex and problematic historical source, but again the sole literary source we have for the time) hints that the practice was common and normalised enough throughout the whole region that the Israelites engaged in it themselves when pressed.
    There’s the tale of the Hebrew chieftain Jephthah who felt compelled to sacrifice his own daughter after his victory against another local Semitic tribe (Ammonites, Edomites, anyway wasn’t Philistines iirc), and of course there’s the Abraham and Isaac story everyone knows.

    Nonetheless, the claims that Phoenicians practiced child sacrifice is controversial as both the Hebrew and Greek sources were xenophobic and furthermore, there are no Phoenician texts preserved that describe this religious practice.

    The Phoenicians and Hebrews (and Moabites, see the Mesha Stele) spoke virtually the same language, so at least on this local matter they should be afforded some weight, particularly as the gruesome ritual is on record as being ‘mistakenly’ practiced amongst themselves.
    The lack of Phoenician texts on the matter scarcely means anything, because hardly any non-transactional records from their culture survive whatsoever.

    Some opposing scholars contend that Tophets were burial sites for infants who had died a natural death and that in antiquity infant mortality had been uniformly high across every society so nothing was out of the ordinary.

    That apologetic viewpoint has become very hard to maintain in light of recent evidence showing crushed infant bones and the like. It does appear to be unquestionably a widespread Semitic Cult practice at this point, although at least unlike in the Americas, whether adolescent-to-adult human sacrifice was engaged in remains an open question. Livy mentions the Romans resorting to ritual murder of infants during the Punic Wars also, hardly something he would make up. The Celts (and Germanic peoples iirc?) of antiquity are described as practicing human sacrifice too, although only of their enemies, PoW’s and the like.

    I don’t know of the Egyptians ever engaging in the ritual sacrifice of infants, but again I’m extremely vague on any Egyptian history before the Persian conquest. Maybe G_R could comment, though I think it’s outside his usual reading area as well.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Yevardian


    I don’t know of the Egyptians ever engaging in the ritual sacrifice of infants
     
    Evidence for retainer sacrifice is limited to the First Dynasty, and Egypt was a fairly centralized state. I find it dubious that they banned it, but killed children.

    and a garden-variety HBD rightoid
     
    Garden variety?! Come on, man!

    Have you ever considered that the black midget child star from the eighties (I need to specify which one) Emmanuel Lewis might be some sort of throwback to the pygmy peoples that were overrun by the Bantus, during their expansion? That if he is not wholly Mbenga in his traits, at least he might owe his height to them?

    Evidence is that he has no obvious health problems associated with dwarfism, unlike Gary Coleman, the other midget child actor and sitcom star of '80s American television, who sadly is already dead.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emmanuel_Lewis

  804. @Yahya
    @showmethereal


    If I was a shill I would claim China is going to win the 2030 World Cup. But I have sense. Unlike the guy who interjected before when I said East Asian do not have the genetics to dominate in football physically. He called me names like you.
     
    You’re right; I should not have called you a shill. But you do seem to have an emotional attachement towards China. That’s ok, everyone has their biases, but it would be preferable if you were to reveal your nationality (are you Chinese?) so that we are aware of potential national/ethnic bias. For me I have nothing against China per we, am even inclined to favor it as I admire its history and culture a great deal. I do hold a prejudice against the Chinese Communist Party though; so that may shape my thinking on the matter. My beef with the CCP is their oppression of Muslims in Xinjiang. I have read though Vogel’s biography of Deng Xiaoping and have come to admire him personally for his strategic and pragmatic thinking, stoic demeanor, sense of duty and willingness to change his mind when the circumstances call for it.

    Anyway, back to the topic of North Korea. I think you are setting up strawmen and misquoting me on the issue, so I will restate my position. I wasn’t saying China “controls” the Kim regime, I was saying they aided in their survival and have been propping them up, which I think is objectively true. It’s well-known among diplomatic circles that China covertly refuses to implement full and effective sanctions against North Korea for fear of a state collapse in that country and a reunification of a Korean Peninsula under an American-allied regime. My opinion is that China should let the North Korean regime collapse; it would lift the decades long suffering ordinary North Koreans have had to endure.

    I agree that China doesn’t control the Kim regime to the extent that some Western pundits seem to think. I’ll even add that in the past, the North Korean regime has previously approached the US and offered an alliance in an effort to reduce reliance on China and counter their hegemonic ambitions. So evidently North Korea and China are not as chummy as usually thought of in the West. But this doesn’t negate the key fact that China is the only major player on the scene that wishes to maintain the status quo rather than let the NK regime implode; and that despite the ostensible signing of UN agreements, they have maintained trade volumes at a level sufficient to ensure the survival of the Kim regime (only briefly dropping it a few years ago during a diplomatic spat between Xi and Kim).

    Replies: @showmethereal, @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    Ahhh the Uighurs. If China is treating all the Uighurs bad – then please explain why every single majority Muslim nation on earth – except Turkiye – has great relations with China? Literally all of them have written to the UN Human Rights Council stating they have sent delegations there and think Xinjiang is great. I can tell you why Turkiye is the only one. Because Turkey uses tens of thousands of them to fight jihad for them against Assad in Syria (non Chinese source below). And what of all the terrorist attacks in China? Many Han were killed… But guess who most of the injured and killed were? Moderate Uighurs who refused the overtures of the jihadis. Do you want to see videos of Uighur Muslim clerics being hacked to death in the streets by the extremist Uighurs??? And why is it not spoken in western sources – the other main reason basically all Muslim nations have good relations with China. It’s because they know the LARGEST Muslim group in China is not the Uighurs but the Hui people. Hui don’t have jihadi separatists who blow up markets and police stations and drive suicide vehicles into Tiananmen square and invade trade stations and hack people to death or start riots and burn stores and murder innocents in the streets. Hui Muslims didn’t have any of that – so they never faced such restrictions that the Uighurs did/do. You can go visit Xinjiang (unless you work for western media or intelligence services)… Go visit a mosque and ask. Or go ask the moderate Uighurs who refused the hardliners brand of Islam.

    https://www.al-monitor.com/originals/2017/08/turkey-is-ankara-abandoning-uighurs-for-china.html

    China is not the cause of the Kim family still being in power. US weapons and troops in South Korea is. The Korean civil war was not anyone else’s business. To for a minute think that China would allow the main country whose openly stated role is to bring China to heel to have a presence near its border only exists in fantasy land. No nation on the planet would do it. Trading with North Korea so it doesn’t starve to death is something both China and Russia do as neighbors and makes perfect sense. Had US troops left in the past 20 years chances are the two Koreas would have had some from of reunification by now. I mean there were even plans drawn up to connect the two Koreas and China and Russia all together with a high speed passenger and freight rail line. Do you know what South Korea’s “sunshine policy” was in the past 20 years – until recently??? It was about building the blocks to reunification. Same as what was happening between Mainland China and Taiwan up until 2016. What is the common denominator in both??? US interference and threats causing tension and ruptures in warming ties.

  805. @Yahya
    @Barbarossa


    I actually didn’t pick up on the fact that LatW is a woman either.
     
    This revelation that LatW is a woman has been pretty disconcerting. Over the past year, I had cemented an image in my mind of a 40-ish year old Latvian closeted homosexual male. I think her interests in military affairs, fat-right political orientation, and as you say subconscious application of sameness to commenters, is what made me automatically assume LatW is a male rather than female.

    I’m trying to hark back to any comment that may have indicated she was female. Can’t think of one where someone else referred to her as a “she”, or if she directly reveled her gender. But maybe I haven’t been reading the comments carefully. I don’t fault her if she has deliberately been concealing her gender. I think the commenters here tend to get aggressive with females, some out of misogyny, others because they sense feminine passivity and feebleness. There was another poor female commenter called “Rosie” (I think gone now) who was constantly belittled and domineered by the male commenters on this site. OTOH, the Laxa character could hold her own against others here, although it’s unclear what sort of human being she/he/it was.

    I’m now starting to wonder who else here might be a closeted female. Sher Singh? A123? Songbird?

    KidDynamite mistakingly referred to Talha as a “lady” the other day. Not sure if he (or would that be a she?) was trolling, but I’ve seen others mistake Talha for a woman before, probably because of the “a” at the end of his name. Incidentally my own name likewise ends with an “a”, though no-one has mistaken me for a female. Wonder why that is?

    Replies: @Yevardian, @Barbarossa, @songbird

    I was a little surprised when G_R mentioned it, but it immediately made perfect sense given past posting history, where I’d previously just assumed it was a male poster who heavily inclined to the emotional, personal and anecdotal. Recently LatW was starting to remind me of that constantly sockpuppeting ‘Laxa’ commenter, but now its obvious why.

    Sher Singh? A123? Songbird?

    Respectively: A romantically frustrated male Pajeet emigrant clinging to his solice that Sikhs are the original Aryans, a Russian disinformation bot almost certainly of male coding origin, and a garden-variety HBD rightoid, I doubt there will be any surprises there.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @Yevardian


    a Russian disinformation bot almost certainly of male coding origin
     
    Commenting record of A123 contradicts this conclusion. It contains repetitive boring diatribes against Iranian leadership, as well as Muslims in general. It contains vehement defense, often using even blatant lies, of indefensible Israeli policies. It contains repeated denunciation of Europe and Dems (IMO, these are well deserved) and glorification of the US (IMO, this is not). It contains MAGA pipedream that would have been realistic maybe 25 years ago but is unachievable today. It contains uncritical admiration for Trump, who promised a lot of reasonable things and did diddly-squat. In addition, A123 usually responds to comments mentioning his/her statements within minutes.

    All of this is inconsistent with him/her being a Russian troll. It is consistent with a retired Republican supporter of either gender with lots of time on his/her hands, who gobbled up most of the US propaganda uncritically. Even his/her diatribes against Kiev regime are easily explained by the fact that Biden, his son, and many high-ranking Dems got kickbacks from Ukraine and all these personages were and are using this corrupt location to launder money.

    That’s my take on A123. Generally agree with you about Sher Singh and songbird.
    , @Sher Singh
    @Yevardian

    We take solace in nothing but the Guru's feet and Weapons.

    https://twitter.com/Kharagket/status/1105167528882589698?s=20

    Don't really even comment here unless I'm mentioned anymore..
    Eastern Christians & Meds are just grist caught between Global Diversity & the Western elite.

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ

  806. @Yahya
    @Barbarossa


    I actually didn’t pick up on the fact that LatW is a woman either.
     
    This revelation that LatW is a woman has been pretty disconcerting. Over the past year, I had cemented an image in my mind of a 40-ish year old Latvian closeted homosexual male. I think her interests in military affairs, fat-right political orientation, and as you say subconscious application of sameness to commenters, is what made me automatically assume LatW is a male rather than female.

    I’m trying to hark back to any comment that may have indicated she was female. Can’t think of one where someone else referred to her as a “she”, or if she directly reveled her gender. But maybe I haven’t been reading the comments carefully. I don’t fault her if she has deliberately been concealing her gender. I think the commenters here tend to get aggressive with females, some out of misogyny, others because they sense feminine passivity and feebleness. There was another poor female commenter called “Rosie” (I think gone now) who was constantly belittled and domineered by the male commenters on this site. OTOH, the Laxa character could hold her own against others here, although it’s unclear what sort of human being she/he/it was.

    I’m now starting to wonder who else here might be a closeted female. Sher Singh? A123? Songbird?

    KidDynamite mistakingly referred to Talha as a “lady” the other day. Not sure if he (or would that be a she?) was trolling, but I’ve seen others mistake Talha for a woman before, probably because of the “a” at the end of his name. Incidentally my own name likewise ends with an “a”, though no-one has mistaken me for a female. Wonder why that is?

    Replies: @Yevardian, @Barbarossa, @songbird

    automatically assume LatW is a male rather than female

    On UNZ it’s an assumption which will be pretty safe on average, LOL. The revelation hasn’t shaken me up, partly though since I really haven’t had that much direct conversation with LatW as she sticks heavily to Balt/Balkan/Russia topics in which I don’t have a horse. The right wing orientation doesn’t surprise me since it often seems from my experience that when women are right wing (or left wing) they are often more uncompromisingly so than many men. I suppose that the heavy recruitment of women by the Left has probably been quite effective for the energy expended. That should probably serve as some sort of lesson to the right.

    “Rosie” (I think gone now) who was constantly belittled and domineered by the male commenters

    I always found that behavior stupid, obnoxious, and counterproductive (see reason above). I prefer to just deal with the substance of what is being said. I never even found Triteleia Laxa that terminally annoying. Amusingly, I once read my wife one of Laxa’s comments in which she was psychoanalyzing somebody, and before I even got through the comment my wife’s reaction was, “Is she always this obnoxious? Wow!”. That cracked me up!

    I’ll get back to your other comment more in depth later, but thanks for that. My wife and I gave them all a listen. I definitely prefer the chant and more traditional instrumentation to the more Westernized works. Too much Western instrumentation makes it sound a bit neither here nor there to me. It’s okay, but it doesn’t grab me as much. I really liked some of the Persian and Turkish traditional music that you posted in previous comments. And any kind of chant is generally fine with me, be it Buddhist, Gregorian, Orthodox, or really any other kind. The purity of only the human voice and limited tonal range seem very transcendent to me.

    Out of curiousity, you seem to have a fairly deep and technical knowledge of music, do you play an instrument or are you just an avid listener?

    • Replies: @Yahya
    @Barbarossa


    Out of curiousity, you seem to have a fairly deep and technical knowledge of music, do you play an instrument or are you just an avid listener?
     
    I play the piano.

    My knowledge of music isn’t as deep as you think though. I posses no formal degree of music training, so my knowledge is mostly limited to what I can gather from the internet. I’m trying to work my way through some music theory textbooks by Rimsky-Korsakov, Tchaikovsky and Hector Berlioz, though the dryness of the subject is proving to be a formidable impediment. I’ve read a few books on Arabic music so my knowledge there is more sophisticated, but for everything else I’m relying on internet sources like the Iranian website I mentioned.

    Too much Western instrumentation makes it sound a bit neither here nor there to me. It’s okay, but it doesn’t grab me as much.
     
    Good point. There’s this Turkish pianist called Fazil Say who’s very talented and even gifted in playing the piano, but whenever I listen to his compositions it always strikes me as a bit off. Western classical music just ain’t part of the Turkish tradition; and typically that’s why I think these non-Western composers almost always fall flat on their face, no matter how good they were. Again, with the possible exceptions of Armenians and Azeris.

    I don’t mind the incorporation of some Western elements into Middle Eastern music, but definitely one needs to take care not to overdo it; the music should stay Middle Eastern in character.

    really liked some of the Persian and Turkish traditional music that you posted in previous comments.
     
    I was going to post some more recommendations, but probably I’m overdoing at this point, so will stop here. Perhaps some other time.

    Replies: @orchardist

  807. @AP
    @Mikel


    How could random Jewish people, including women, children and civilians from outside the USSR be regarded by Latvians or Ukrainians as responsible for Bolshevik crimes?
     
    The mentality for many of those people was something like blind rage or cold hateful vengeance. Someone whose family were slaughtered would in turn slaughter the family of those linked to their killers. Or in a more benign version, be indifferent to the murder of people like those who had murdered their loved ones. Obviously I do not agree with this approach and view it as a case of evil begetting evil, and imagine (and hope) that if I had been tested as those people were I would not have been capable of such crimes.

    BTW, we have sort of an example here - our AnoninTN, whose relatives suffered from bombing in Luhansk, and is indifferent and makes excuses for a much worse and larger scale bombing of people he links to the bombers of Luhansk.

    Nobody with a functioning brain thinks that killing a Jewish infant from Poland or Hungary is revenging any crime committed by people in a different country.
     
    Well, infants die in the Russian bombing, yet Russians angry about Donbas justify or dismiss such deaths as Kiev getting a taste of its own medicine, or something like that.

    Replies: @Mikel, @AnonfromTN

    infants die in the Russian bombing

    Not in the same targeted and deliberate way as during the massacres of Jews during WW2.

    I’m just trying to understand those events and revenge for Bolshevik crimes doesn’t look too convincing. I doubt that most Holocaust collaborators had victims of those crimes in their immediate families, just like few German perpetrators had such close personal reasons to do what they did.

    If I saw people of a certain race disproportionately represented among the criminals victimizing members of my community (for example Black Americans or Mexican Hispanics) and I felt desires of revenge, I don’t think killing Nigerian or Ecuatorian infants would provide me any relief.

    Perhaps they bought the Nazis’ ideology of inferior races that needed to be exterminated or perhaps they didn’t care that much for ideologies but wanted to make thrmselves useful to their German allies leaving moral constraints aside. Both alternatives look more likely to me.

    Let’s hope this war stops soon and we don’t reach those levels of depravation.

    • Replies: @Coconuts
    @Mikel


    Perhaps they bought the Nazis’ ideology of inferior races that needed to be exterminated or perhaps they didn’t care that much for ideologies but wanted to make thrmselves useful to their German allies leaving moral constraints aside. Both alternatives look more likely to me.
     
    I found Timothy Snyder's arguments in his book Bloodlands, that the mass revolutionary violence of the 1917-33 period in Ukraine helped produce a certain number of willing auxiliaries for the Nazis, pretty plausible.

    Both Nazism and the Soviet ideology in its revolutionary period seem to have had some similar features, the idea that history is determined by certain forms of struggle (racial/class), collective identities are more fundamental and relevant than individual ones, 'bourgeois' legal norms and customs must be suspended during the period of struggle, view that impersonal scientific laws determine collective behaviour, an elite must take the lead politically in the struggle etc. There was a fair bit written about this after WW2 in the 50s and 60s.

    Replies: @Mikel

    , @AP
    @Mikel


    “infants die in the Russian bombing”

    Not in the same targeted and deliberate way as during the massacres of Jews during WW2.
     

    Correct. And likewise, the Donbassers did not experience a fraction of the misery that the Balts were subjected to. So they don’t mind or justify the bombing of Kyiv but wouldn't (I hope) justify more brutal, personal acts.

    I need not have just mentioned AnoninTN. How many Brits, whose country had been subjected to German bombing of London and other cities, objected to the terror firebombing of Dresden and other German cities in which tens of thousands of civilians including children were incinerated alive?


    I’m just trying to understand those events and revenge for Bolshevik crimes doesn’t look too convincing. I doubt that most Holocaust collaborators had victims of those crimes in their immediate families, just like few German perpetrators had such close personal reasons to do what they did
     
    Here is how the Balts differed from the Germans. Given the sheer scale of Soviet atrocities it is likely that the Balt war criminals did experience deadly persecution among close family, friends, or neighbours. Whereas for Germans it was a matter of more abstract principles.

    So equalising the two is just wrong.


    If I saw people of a certain race disproportionately represented among the criminals victimizing members of my community
     
    It was more than merely overrepresentation among the Soviet administration. The other issue is that the local Jewish population, for very understandable reasons (obviously for Jews Stalin was a much lesser evil than Hitler), tended to support and favor the Bolsheviks. The locals noticed that as the Bolsheviks were killing and deporting their people.

    and I felt desires of revenge, I don’t think killing Nigerian or Ecuatorian infants would provide me any relief.
     
    Correct. As Coconuts pointed out, another factor is that people back then did think in more collectivistic terms than they do now. They may have viewed these victims as potential killers or (in the case of children) as future killers.

    perhaps they didn’t care that much for ideologies but wanted to make thrmselves useful to their German allies leaving moral constraints aside
     
    This was probably an additional factor. But I think most would not had done this unless the previous factors applied. Would those Latvians had agreed to commit atrocities against French, Poles, or others who were not associated with Soviet crimes against their people?

    So, I think that all of the main factors are covered here: rage and desire for revenge by victims; more collectivistic view of groups of people; and opportunism and encouragement by Nazi authorities, at the expense of people viewed as deadly or potentially deadly enemies.

    Replies: @Mikel

  808. @Mr. Hack
    @German_reader

    LatW is entitled to voice any opinion that he feels is necessary to make. I consider him to be one of the better commentators here at this blog, being able to hold his own in conversations with any of the better commentators at this blog, including yourself, Bashibusuk, AP etc. He has a wide breadth of knowledge and offers interesting opinions on a wide range of topics.

    He really does know an awful lot about Ukraine, its history, culture etc. When I first started to correspond with him here, I actually thought that he was Ukrainian, or at least that he lives (or has lived) in Ukraine. A Balt's opinion is every bit as valid as a Germans, IMHO.

    Replies: @German_reader, @Yahya, @Wokechoke

    It’s a woman.

  809. @Yahya
    @Barbarossa


    I actually didn’t pick up on the fact that LatW is a woman either.
     
    This revelation that LatW is a woman has been pretty disconcerting. Over the past year, I had cemented an image in my mind of a 40-ish year old Latvian closeted homosexual male. I think her interests in military affairs, fat-right political orientation, and as you say subconscious application of sameness to commenters, is what made me automatically assume LatW is a male rather than female.

    I’m trying to hark back to any comment that may have indicated she was female. Can’t think of one where someone else referred to her as a “she”, or if she directly reveled her gender. But maybe I haven’t been reading the comments carefully. I don’t fault her if she has deliberately been concealing her gender. I think the commenters here tend to get aggressive with females, some out of misogyny, others because they sense feminine passivity and feebleness. There was another poor female commenter called “Rosie” (I think gone now) who was constantly belittled and domineered by the male commenters on this site. OTOH, the Laxa character could hold her own against others here, although it’s unclear what sort of human being she/he/it was.

    I’m now starting to wonder who else here might be a closeted female. Sher Singh? A123? Songbird?

    KidDynamite mistakingly referred to Talha as a “lady” the other day. Not sure if he (or would that be a she?) was trolling, but I’ve seen others mistake Talha for a woman before, probably because of the “a” at the end of his name. Incidentally my own name likewise ends with an “a”, though no-one has mistaken me for a female. Wonder why that is?

    Replies: @Yevardian, @Barbarossa, @songbird

    Sher Singh?

    In Sikh tradition, “Singh” is the surname which all Sikh males are required to take. But, in emigrating to Canada, I suppose it could be that the females of the line took up the name. And the references to female sex slaves might indicate a lesbian. And the boots and benchpressing a butch.

  810. @LatW
    @German_reader


    a ceasefire wouldn’t make any sense if Russia just uses it to regroup and then attack again
     
    Right, that's exactly what Russia would do - regroup and then try to attack again (even though the shitheads don't even have enough winter uniforms, something they should've thought about back in August). But for some reason the likes of yourself just keep screeching for this ceasefire - so you know full well what would happen and you still insist on it. Wow, that's transparent.

    and I’m not convinced either by your claims “But Ukrainians think the same”…maybe in Lviv or among those living abroad, might be different in the regions where the fighting actually takes place

     

    It's been what - 8 years of war now? - and you still come out with deeply uninformed statements like that? Don't embarrass yourself - you're not in the loop. Do me a favor before you text me again - open any Ukrainian channel and listen to it for a few hours. I have no time for someone who is that uninformed, it's just not serious.

    all of Europe is making immensely painful economic sacrifices because of the war
     
    Do not fucking blame the Ukrainians for this. The Ukrainians didn't attack anybody. The economic hardships are only partially due to the war. The inflation was going to come either way - it started way BEFORE the war. The inflation is the result of the "quantitative easing" that was performed by the Federal Reserve and the European Central Bank. For years. This is your own doing! Own it.

    Replies: @German_reader, @Wokechoke

    Harpie person.

  811. https://thenewkremlinstooge.wordpress.com/2022/11/03/this-years-recipient-of-the-double-headed-eagle-prize-for-being-the-antithesis-of-the-degenerate-and-hypocritical-west/comment-page-4/#comment-82365

    Just have to post his comment in MoA, November 28:

    From a Russian guy in Kiev:

    I’ve walked around Kiev during weekend. The biggest impression is the old houses on the Windy Mountains, if you lived in Kiev you know what I’m talking about. The old people in the yards cook food on bricks. It is tough to see. I suppose they should have gas, but well… Children in front of our eyes warmed instand noodles to eat in an aluminum bowl. Young people have completely switched to food delivery, not sure how they cook it but they do deliver pizza, though you have to wait for 3 hours.

    Supermarkets are kind of random. In the same district (Obolon) you go to Fora – there seems to be everything and not many people, but in a Silpo in 300 meters and there are no products.

    The main problem now in Kiev is that there is no work in the commercial sector and there will not be. Everything is closed, but young rich boys are not leaving yet, because there appeared a whole industry of plundering Western funds. Some associations of volunteers, assistants of some battalions, etc. By the way, it’s hard to believe, but warehouses of the former MaryKey, Avon, Procter & Gamble, Caterpillar, etc. are now rented by some humanitarian aid funds. Ridiculously huge amounts of money involved there.

    Do you know what infuriates ordinary Kievans most of all? These people in camouflage, half with weapons. There are hundreds of thousands of them in Kiev. The front is 700 km away, yet in every second car in Kiev there is a redneck with a machine gun. Not a single plant is working in the country, everything has gone down. But these 130-kilogram carcasses with huge bellies in camouflage and with weapons are everywhere.

    Our impression: the country is dead, this is some kind of militaristic agony. Abyss ahead.

    https://t.me/denatofication/4351

    Take: most of the economy in Kiev is composed of schemes to plunder western aid fund (big business) and large amounts mercenaries cowarding from the front line, rather collecting their average pay by hanging out in the city.

    Posted by: unimperator | Nov 28 2022 22:22 utc | 112

    The “Russian guy” writes word-perfect English.

    https://thenewkremlinstooge.wordpress.com/2022/11/03/this-years-recipient-of-the-double-headed-eagle-prize-for-being-the-antithesis-of-the-degenerate-and-hypocritical-west/comment-page-4/#comment-82377

    Investigators also uncovered multiple cases of sexual abuse and violence. Cases include allegations that Ukrainian prisoners of war were tortured and castrated, along with claims of children being sexually abused and women raped.”

    Investigators from where? ‘Uncovered’ how? By writing down and recording accounts from the Ukrainians? Did everybody not learn from the example of their Human Rights Ombudsman, whose lurid tales of gang rape and pedophilia were so over the top that she was fired because none of them could be substantiated? Ukraine’s best chance to keep hoovering up loose money from the ‘international community’ is to inspire pity, now that victory is about as likely as a Buddhist Pope. The claim that Russian wives are giving their husbands the green light to rape Ukrainian women is an obvious ploy to discredit and foment hate against the entire Russian population, not just soldiers, and the supposed abuse of children and infants is a reliable tearjerker that has westerners grabbing for their wallets no matter how many times it is employed. It’d be nice if one day westerners learned how cynically and ceaselessly they were milked, but they probably never will, and will be tagging their social-media messages with little blue-and-yellow flags ’til the judgment trump.

    That hypocritical bigot Thomas Bach is appropriately answered in the comments section below this article –

    https://www.rt.com/sport/567366-ioc-bach-russia-sanctions/

  812. @A123
    @AnonfromTN



    Muslim Israelis can readily buy land from Jews in most of Israel.

     

    Now, this is simply not true.
     
    Yes. It is 100% true.

    Muslims have intentionally deceived you according to the Pillar of Deception "Taqiyya".

    Private land may be sold to Israeli Arab Muslims.

    The layers of disinformation are two fold:

    -1- All foreigners, regardless of religion, have purchase restrictions.
    -2- Large tracts of state land can never be sold. They can only be leased, usually for 49 years.

    Both #1 and #2 hamper all religions Jews, Muslims, and Druze equally. Taqiyya deceivers knowingly misrepresent this as a land sale restriction based on religion. It is not.

    You should consider your sources more carefully.
    ___

    The reverse is not true. Abbas, leader of the Muslim Authority, openly calls for life sentences as a penalty for land transfer to Jews: (1)


    Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas has toughened the penalty for citizens selling property to Israelis.

    According to the official Palestinian Wafa news agency, Abbas on Monday imposed a sentence of hard labor for life on “anyone diverting, renting or selling land to an enemy state or one of its subjects.”

    Jordan’s penal code number 16 article 114, applicable in the Palestinian territories, previously subscribed “temporary hard labor” to perpetrators of the crime.
     


    the PLO’s Revolutionary Penal Code (1979) applies the death penalty both to traitors and to those accused of “transferring positions to the enemy.” Since the late 1990s, Palestinian courts have been dealing out death sentences to convicted land dealers, though Abbas has not authorized the implementation of executions since his election in 2004.
     
    The only Apartheid religion in Palestine - Islam.

    This is an objectively true fact.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.timesofisrael.com/abbas-toughens-law-against-palestinians-selling-land-to-jews/

    Replies: @Dmitry

    There isn’t purchase restriction for foreigners to buy real estate in Israel. But for the non-residents, they added a sale tax which is very high for the transaction, unless you live in the apartment for an extended time (which is not possible for most non-citizens).

    Wealthy foreigners like to buy property in Israel. You can see after the peace deal of recent years Israel with UAE, Bahrain, wealthy people in the Gulf were buying property in Israel. Probably after some years, the increase in the price of the property would be greater than any tax you pay.

    Peace Deals in Place, Wealthy Gulf Arabs Are Boosting Israel’s Super-Prime Real Estate Market

    Buyers from Gulf countries have helped drive prices for Tel Aviv villas, mansions, and penthouses well above the $10 million mark, according to Mansion Global. And the resulting activity, though economically beneficial, will only put additional pressure on middle-class locals hoping to afford family homes.

    https://www.architecturaldigest.com/story/tel-aviv-real-estate

    I guess AnonTN idea is about the protests against selling property to Arabs in Afula or against selling to Jews in Yafo.

    The Mayor of Afula can go to the demonstration against selling in Afula to Arab families. There is an article about this theme. https://www.al-monitor.com/originals/2019/07/israel-arabs-benjamin-netanyahu-discrimination-afula-citizen.html

    Analogy for Jewish discrimination against Arab residents in Afula seems like the 1930s Detroit discrimination against African-Americans. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Housing_segregation_in_the_United_States It’s a combination of local authorities with the local residents.

    Analogy for Yafo is a bit parallel than Fort Greene or Bedford–Stuyvesant, although the violence in Yafo also had the religious war component in 2021 when it was connected with the conflict with the Temple Mount complex in Jerusalem.

    • Thanks: A123
    • Replies: @A123
    @Dmitry


    I guess AnonTN idea is about the protests against selling property to Arabs in Afula or against selling to Jews in Yafo.

    The Mayor of Afula can go to the demonstration against selling in Afula to Arab families
     

    In many ways, the Afula Park story was much more secular than religious.

    Residential property values are driven by amenities. When the park was swarmed with non-locals, everyone who actually lived there took a financial hit. Similarly, when a family with one or two children leaves and a family with four or more children moves in, that impacts schools and other facilities.
    ___

    The Jaffa situation is more complicated. It has an unusually high religious mix dating back for decades. As tensions have risen over the years, there really is no good place to build barriers or otherwise achieve separation. Neither side will accept being forced out. Thus, the locals watch every transaction closely for anything that may disadvantage their side.

    Jaffa is a favorable location for gentrification. Huge amounts could be made by flipping a building and remodelling it for upper middle class buyers.

    There is also a small, often over looked, Christian population around the local Church of St. Peter.

    https://www.custodia.org/en/sanctuaries/jaffa

    PEACE 😇

  813. @Yahya
    @showmethereal


    If I was a shill I would claim China is going to win the 2030 World Cup. But I have sense. Unlike the guy who interjected before when I said East Asian do not have the genetics to dominate in football physically. He called me names like you.
     
    You’re right; I should not have called you a shill. But you do seem to have an emotional attachement towards China. That’s ok, everyone has their biases, but it would be preferable if you were to reveal your nationality (are you Chinese?) so that we are aware of potential national/ethnic bias. For me I have nothing against China per we, am even inclined to favor it as I admire its history and culture a great deal. I do hold a prejudice against the Chinese Communist Party though; so that may shape my thinking on the matter. My beef with the CCP is their oppression of Muslims in Xinjiang. I have read though Vogel’s biography of Deng Xiaoping and have come to admire him personally for his strategic and pragmatic thinking, stoic demeanor, sense of duty and willingness to change his mind when the circumstances call for it.

    Anyway, back to the topic of North Korea. I think you are setting up strawmen and misquoting me on the issue, so I will restate my position. I wasn’t saying China “controls” the Kim regime, I was saying they aided in their survival and have been propping them up, which I think is objectively true. It’s well-known among diplomatic circles that China covertly refuses to implement full and effective sanctions against North Korea for fear of a state collapse in that country and a reunification of a Korean Peninsula under an American-allied regime. My opinion is that China should let the North Korean regime collapse; it would lift the decades long suffering ordinary North Koreans have had to endure.

    I agree that China doesn’t control the Kim regime to the extent that some Western pundits seem to think. I’ll even add that in the past, the North Korean regime has previously approached the US and offered an alliance in an effort to reduce reliance on China and counter their hegemonic ambitions. So evidently North Korea and China are not as chummy as usually thought of in the West. But this doesn’t negate the key fact that China is the only major player on the scene that wishes to maintain the status quo rather than let the NK regime implode; and that despite the ostensible signing of UN agreements, they have maintained trade volumes at a level sufficient to ensure the survival of the Kim regime (only briefly dropping it a few years ago during a diplomatic spat between Xi and Kim).

    Replies: @showmethereal, @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    I stand by the insults that I gave him. It makes perfect sense for CCP shills to belittle East Asian athletics because they want Chinese men to play pansy sports like ping pong instead of more physical sports. It would be a nightmare for CCP to have Chinese guys be like Fedor Emelianenko and Klitschkos.

    For example I stated the top Chinese sprinters are at the near level as American and Europeans,

    https://www.unz.com/isteve/why-are-there-few-black-third-basemen-and-soccer-goalies/#comment-5676413

    But PRC is reasonable in wanting a buffer state in NK. Japan tried to invade China through Korea in 16th CE. Koreans themselves have a long history of disunity totally unrelated to China,

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_invasions_of_Korea_(1592–1598)
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_Kingdoms_of_Korea

    Apart of Uighurs China has many other Muslim minorities, Hui, Kazakhs, Uzbeks, Tatars, and none are persecuted.

  814. @Mikel
    @AP



    Latvians supposedly also had the highest per capita rate of Holocaust perpetrators

    Probably revenge for the Bolshevik nightmare, as you implied.
     
    How could random Jewish people, including women, children and civilians from outside the USSR be regarded by Latvians or Ukrainians as responsible for Bolshevik crimes? There must have been some other reasons behind those genocidal impulses. Nobody with a functioning brain thinks that killing a Jewish infant from Poland or Hungary is revenging any crime committed by people in a different country.

    Replies: @AP, @Wokechoke

    The Baltic Area was lousy with Jews before ww2.

  815. @Yevardian
    @Yahya


    The Phoenicians were accused by Hebrew and Greek sources of child sacrificing rituals. According to them, in the ceremony known as mulk, a child was placed on the arms of a bronze statue and dropped into a brazier below. Researchers have discovered roughly 9 Tophets across the Mediterranean where some speculate the practices occurred. A Tophet is a cemetery containing the cremated remains of infants and young children in clay jars. Presumably the Phoenicians would have chosen their least favored child for sacrifice, and that could have selected for intelligence and beauty, hence my speculation on its eugenic impact on the Lebanese. Though I’ll admit I may have been a bit hasty in my conclusion (which is why I called my statements mere working theories, not final judgements). Plutarch also mentioned that rich families would buy children from poor families to send to the sacrifice.
     
    Pretty bizzare conjecture to take from this any long term eugenic effects vis-a-vis Lebanese attractiveness or intelligence.
    Anyway I certainly wouldn't dismiss 'accusations' of Phoenician child sacrifice as propaganda, the Hebrew Bible (obviously a complex and problematic historical source, but again the sole literary source we have for the time) hints that the practice was common and normalised enough throughout the whole region that the Israelites engaged in it themselves when pressed.
    There's the tale of the Hebrew chieftain Jephthah who felt compelled to sacrifice his own daughter after his victory against another local Semitic tribe (Ammonites, Edomites, anyway wasn't Philistines iirc), and of course there's the Abraham and Isaac story everyone knows.

    Nonetheless, the claims that Phoenicians practiced child sacrifice is controversial as both the Hebrew and Greek sources were xenophobic and furthermore, there are no Phoenician texts preserved that describe this religious practice.
     
    The Phoenicians and Hebrews (and Moabites, see the Mesha Stele) spoke virtually the same language, so at least on this local matter they should be afforded some weight, particularly as the gruesome ritual is on record as being 'mistakenly' practiced amongst themselves.
    The lack of Phoenician texts on the matter scarcely means anything, because hardly any non-transactional records from their culture survive whatsoever.

    Some opposing scholars contend that Tophets were burial sites for infants who had died a natural death and that in antiquity infant mortality had been uniformly high across every society so nothing was out of the ordinary.
     
    That apologetic viewpoint has become very hard to maintain in light of recent evidence showing crushed infant bones and the like. It does appear to be unquestionably a widespread Semitic Cult practice at this point, although at least unlike in the Americas, whether adolescent-to-adult human sacrifice was engaged in remains an open question. Livy mentions the Romans resorting to ritual murder of infants during the Punic Wars also, hardly something he would make up. The Celts (and Germanic peoples iirc?) of antiquity are described as practicing human sacrifice too, although only of their enemies, PoW's and the like.

    I don't know of the Egyptians ever engaging in the ritual sacrifice of infants, but again I'm extremely vague on any Egyptian history before the Persian conquest. Maybe G_R could comment, though I think it's outside his usual reading area as well.

    Replies: @songbird

    I don’t know of the Egyptians ever engaging in the ritual sacrifice of infants

    Evidence for retainer sacrifice is limited to the First Dynasty, and Egypt was a fairly centralized state. I find it dubious that they banned it, but killed children.

    and a garden-variety HBD rightoid

    Garden variety?! Come on, man!

    Have you ever considered that the black midget child star from the eighties (I need to specify which one) Emmanuel Lewis might be some sort of throwback to the pygmy peoples that were overrun by the Bantus, during their expansion? That if he is not wholly Mbenga in his traits, at least he might owe his height to them?

    Evidence is that he has no obvious health problems associated with dwarfism, unlike Gary Coleman, the other midget child actor and sitcom star of ’80s American television, who sadly is already dead.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emmanuel_Lewis

  816. @silviosilver
    @Dmitry


    This is also the theme for “VIP” spaces in that industry.
     
    The cachet of the VIP section results from its exclusivity, not its seclusion. If it were completely secluded it might still retain some of that cachet (as onlookers enviously wonder what lies behind that door and what it takes to get in), but it wouldn't be as fun, because occupants would not be able to bask in the envious gaze of those unable to gain access. So the VIP, even if more sparsely populated, indirectly relies on the presence of other people, and would lose its cachet almost completely if there were more people inside the VIP section than outside of it.

    By the way, think about the experiences which are expensive. Why do wealthy people buy a yacht, instead of going with the Carnival Cruises?
     
    I think I already covered this in my earlier reply: "there are places we go to get away from people and places we go in order to be around them." For those with the means to afford either, a yacht would fall into the former category, a cruise ship the latter.

    But when the difficulty of nature is resolved (e.g. billionaire’s yacht), then of course the soul feels more comfortable to go to the empty spaces, than in the Carnival Cruise.
     
    How can you possibly make such a blanket statement? Surely you've read enough by now to be aware of individual differences in personality traits, probably the most basic of which - and the most immediately comprehensible to us - is introversion vs extroversion. Surely it shouldn't be too hard to imagine that some people might find the presence of other people more comforting to the soul than are empty places, at least some of the time.

    Sure, but even a couple not in love, will be feeling a better mood in empty Venice, than Venice full of tourists.
     
    I have forgotten what we were even talking about and, not to be rude, but I can't really be bothered going back to check. This statement, however, is so obvious I have a hard time believing I said anything that would suggest I believed otherwise. And if something I said did suggest I believed otherwise, I here and now, before gods and men, formally proclaim that I don't. :)

    Replies: @Dmitry

    I would not expect it is so related to being extrovert or introvert. Extroverts would not dream to emigrate to Japan so they can “enjoy” the overcrowding of the people in Tokyo.

    Or the extroverts would not dislike the most of the world’s luxury spaces (mansions, palaces, yachts, private beaches), which as necessary condition for being luxury, because they are empty of people.

    some people might find the presence of other people

    Sure, just because the crowds are unnatural for us (until the very recent history), but you can still enjoy it sometimes. You know people like crowding in football games with tens of thousands of fans and hooligans.

    But our vast populations are not a natural situation, not only in a mild way, but by many orders of magnitude.

    We can often see how peoples’ brains are confused by applying something which is relevant for our ancestors when world population was a million of times smaller than today. For example, the celebrity culture, where we automatically view in the reflex part of our brain, famous celebrities like they are friends or neighbors.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Dmitry

    It is an interesting phenomenon that in Chinese cities, it seems that one can often find people sleeping in the nosiest circumstances. On benches, among the tread of jostling crowds, with jackhammers in the distance.

    I have often wondered whether this has something to do with scale in finding rare individuals among a moving backdrop, or if it is a result of culture, or if it might even be explained by some adaptation which came from a long and ancient process of urbanization.

    But I don't seem to notice it among Chinese born overseas, and perhaps all those ancient cities were just fertility sinks.

    Replies: @Yevardian

  817. @Dmitry
    @silviosilver

    I would not expect it is so related to being extrovert or introvert. Extroverts would not dream to emigrate to Japan so they can "enjoy" the overcrowding of the people in Tokyo.

    Or the extroverts would not dislike the most of the world's luxury spaces (mansions, palaces, yachts, private beaches), which as necessary condition for being luxury, because they are empty of people.


    some people might find the presence of other people
     
    Sure, just because the crowds are unnatural for us (until the very recent history), but you can still enjoy it sometimes. You know people like crowding in football games with tens of thousands of fans and hooligans.

    But our vast populations are not a natural situation, not only in a mild way, but by many orders of magnitude.

    We can often see how peoples' brains are confused by applying something which is relevant for our ancestors when world population was a million of times smaller than today. For example, the celebrity culture, where we automatically view in the reflex part of our brain, famous celebrities like they are friends or neighbors.

    Replies: @songbird

    It is an interesting phenomenon that in Chinese cities, it seems that one can often find people sleeping in the nosiest circumstances. On benches, among the tread of jostling crowds, with jackhammers in the distance.

    I have often wondered whether this has something to do with scale in finding rare individuals among a moving backdrop, or if it is a result of culture, or if it might even be explained by some adaptation which came from a long and ancient process of urbanization.

    But I don’t seem to notice it among Chinese born overseas, and perhaps all those ancient cities were just fertility sinks.

    • Replies: @Yevardian
    @songbird


    But I don’t seem to notice it among Chinese born overseas, and perhaps all those ancient cities were just fertility sinks.
     
    I thought it would have been well known at least here that the death-rate of cities everywhere far exceeded their birthrates until the 19th Century. It was only constant migration from the countryside that they could even maintain a steady population.

    Replies: @songbird, @Emil Nikola Richard

  818. @LatW
    @Dmitry


    For internal security policy, Israel is not exactly a successful example.
     
    But they are. I've had a chance to observe close up the security protocol that the Israelis carry out in a formal, but relatively simple and non-threatening environment. It was very thorough (many times more thorough than other states). So this is an approach that can be applied to all sorts of areas in life (in EE, we wouldn't need to do that in every sphere of life, but it is something to think about).

    But, of course, I didn't mean it as a literal comparison, I meant the defense policies. I would say the attitude exemplified by Golda Meir would be something worth studying.. And, as I mentioned, a lot of the Israeli problems wouldn't exist in Ukraine's case. It was not meant to be taken literally but as a spiritual and defense model. Most importantly, Israel's enemies do not just want to occupy or limit Israel. They want Israel not to exist.

    Replies: @A123, @Dmitry

    security protocol that the Israelis

    You can develop effective tactics, as compensation for having not very good strategy. But how long can you compensate for strategic failure with tactical success? You know you have to walk in the metal detector and scan your bags, not just in the airport, not just in the train stations, but when you go to many large shops.

    all sorts of areas in life (in EE, we wouldn’t need to do that in every sphere of lif

    I think many things in Israel are not bad examples to follow – the English legal system (which is above the Ottoman legal foundation), proportional representation voting, free/uncensored media, private property rights, public health system, investment in science. Until the 1990s the economy was financially unstable. But after the early 2000s, the authorities have followed relatively responsible fiscal policy, with increasing tax revenue.

    After the 2010s, Israel also begins significant investment in public transport, which is a good sign of not following the American automobile-only development model that has been less criticized in the late 20th century. (https://en.globes.co.il/en/article-can-israel-pivot-from-cars-to-public-transport-1001387134)

    But the positive things from Israel, are usually the things which are not related to the war and conflict, it all requires you to not think too much about that (where the running to bomb shelters will seem only like strategic failure).

  819. @songbird
    @Dmitry

    It is an interesting phenomenon that in Chinese cities, it seems that one can often find people sleeping in the nosiest circumstances. On benches, among the tread of jostling crowds, with jackhammers in the distance.

    I have often wondered whether this has something to do with scale in finding rare individuals among a moving backdrop, or if it is a result of culture, or if it might even be explained by some adaptation which came from a long and ancient process of urbanization.

    But I don't seem to notice it among Chinese born overseas, and perhaps all those ancient cities were just fertility sinks.

    Replies: @Yevardian

    But I don’t seem to notice it among Chinese born overseas, and perhaps all those ancient cities were just fertility sinks.

    I thought it would have been well known at least here that the death-rate of cities everywhere far exceeded their birthrates until the 19th Century. It was only constant migration from the countryside that they could even maintain a steady population.

    • Replies: @songbird
    @Yevardian

    It's quite easy to understand that ancient Chinese cities did not grow forever in scope. And it is quite probable that ancient Chinese cities were dens of disease, with overall higher rates of mortality.

    However, it involves too many assumptions to assume that they were blackholes. That everyone who went into them had lower fertility than everyone outside them, and that there is no chance that they affected modern DNA.

    I don't want to give out too much personal info, but I can say that I descend from people that lived in very densely populated areas, but who had very large families.

    Moreover, it is well known that sedentism influenced human DNA and biology, though there is a great deal of evidence that it caused disease. Sometimes, quite horrible diseases, like falciparum.

    It is also well-known that urbanization has influenced the DNA of wild animals living in urban environments.

    , @Emil Nikola Richard
    @Yevardian


    I thought it would have been well known at least here that the death-rate of cities everywhere far exceeded their birthrates until the 19th Century.
     
    You might be able to get your meme re tweeted ninety million times if you plot (deaths-births) v. population and year for London, Peking, Bombay, Lagos, and Rio. Use color and whatnot to get your 4 variables smashed into two dimensions.

    There are millions of idiots with smart phones out there to serve info tidbits to. You'll only make a fraction of a cent off each one but it is practically zero work!!!

    They used to teach Dickens in schools to 13 and 14 year olds and everybody knew what a cesspit 1850 London was. Now people learn about 1850 London by seeing live action role playing and television action role playing and nobody has a clue that it smelled like a sewer.
  820. @Mikel
    @AP


    infants die in the Russian bombing
     
    Not in the same targeted and deliberate way as during the massacres of Jews during WW2.

    I'm just trying to understand those events and revenge for Bolshevik crimes doesn't look too convincing. I doubt that most Holocaust collaborators had victims of those crimes in their immediate families, just like few German perpetrators had such close personal reasons to do what they did.

    If I saw people of a certain race disproportionately represented among the criminals victimizing members of my community (for example Black Americans or Mexican Hispanics) and I felt desires of revenge, I don't think killing Nigerian or Ecuatorian infants would provide me any relief.

    Perhaps they bought the Nazis' ideology of inferior races that needed to be exterminated or perhaps they didn't care that much for ideologies but wanted to make thrmselves useful to their German allies leaving moral constraints aside. Both alternatives look more likely to me.

    Let's hope this war stops soon and we don't reach those levels of depravation.

    Replies: @Coconuts, @AP

    Perhaps they bought the Nazis’ ideology of inferior races that needed to be exterminated or perhaps they didn’t care that much for ideologies but wanted to make thrmselves useful to their German allies leaving moral constraints aside. Both alternatives look more likely to me.

    I found Timothy Snyder’s arguments in his book Bloodlands, that the mass revolutionary violence of the 1917-33 period in Ukraine helped produce a certain number of willing auxiliaries for the Nazis, pretty plausible.

    Both Nazism and the Soviet ideology in its revolutionary period seem to have had some similar features, the idea that history is determined by certain forms of struggle (racial/class), collective identities are more fundamental and relevant than individual ones, ‘bourgeois’ legal norms and customs must be suspended during the period of struggle, view that impersonal scientific laws determine collective behaviour, an elite must take the lead politically in the struggle etc. There was a fair bit written about this after WW2 in the 50s and 60s.

    • Agree: AP
    • Replies: @Mikel
    @Coconuts

    Those authors may be right but I don't see an obvious connection between the rise of two ideologies that promote collective punishments and the revenge aspect that AP (and GR) argued for.

    If you are persecuted by people of an ideology that believes in violence against a class of citizens you don't take revenge against those ideologues by adhering to a very different ideology that promotes violence against a totally different type of innocent people. Many people suffered Bolshevik and Communist oppression around the world but that turned very few of them into Nazis, even in the 30s-40s. The Spanish legionaries that joined Barbarosa were surely motivated by the Communist atrocities in the Spanish Civil War but they didn't volunteer to kill Jewish civilians, only to continue fighting the Reds. And did the Latvians really experience a disproportionate amount of atrocities in the early USSR?

    Replies: @German_reader, @Coconuts

  821. @songbird
    @Coconuts

    I hope it is so, but I'm not sure how effective or permanent such things are, the the face of rising GDP. We are already over 30 years out from the fall of communism in Eastern Europe. Surely there may be some generational memory that weakens.

    It seems like Germans (or what passes for them) are no longer hypervigilant about saving and inflation. Meanwhile, there is something comical in the meaning of corrupt parties in Ireland: Fianna Fáil (soldiers of destiny), Sinn Féin (we ourselves).

    IMO, Eastern Europe's best chances are in simply observing the decline.

    Replies: @Coconuts

    I hope it is so, but I’m not sure how effective or permanent such things are, the face of rising GDP. We are already over 30 years out from the fall of communism in Eastern Europe. Surely there may be some generational memory that weakens.

    At the moment intuitively I’d say you are right; it looks like these economic and standard of living factors are most important. The resistance to it may be stronger, through knowing some of how progressives are likely to play things in advance, even if it remains a minority.

    IMO, Eastern Europe’s best chances are in simply observing the decline.

    It’s similar to the conclusion I’ve reached about Western Europe, any change will only come through experience of the decline.

    Generally, it seems probable that when the demographic change becomes even more visible it will be hard for them to avoid the emergence of different forms of white identity politics.

    I was going to write this in a reply to one of Dmitry’s earlier messages, but I think the more different ethnic groups you come into contact with or observe on a daily basis and the more numerous they are, can’t help but make you more conscious of the existence and characteristics of your own group. Similar to what happens after you have been living abroad for a long time and return home, only without having to go anywhere.

    [MORE]

    Given the numbers and the speed of change I doubt integration into the pre-mass migration culture is going to be realistic, you can already see this model being rejected now and tendencies moving in the other direction. The economic prospects are also not looking that great. It doesn’t appear to be the case that mass-immigration will make the UK or France wealthier, more powerful, a better country than ever before, which afaik are still part of the arguments used for greater diversity.

    Meanwhile, there is something comical in the meaning of corrupt parties in Ireland: Fianna Fáil (soldiers of destiny), Sinn Féin (we ourselves).

    These names are starting to look like hostages-to-fortune now. I wonder if in 20/30 years they will be retired? There is this issue with belief in Progress and where it is supposed to be taking us at the moment. Progress may now mean becoming more Islamic, as one challenging example.

    • Thanks: songbird
  822. @Dmitry
    @A123

    There isn't purchase restriction for foreigners to buy real estate in Israel. But for the non-residents, they added a sale tax which is very high for the transaction, unless you live in the apartment for an extended time (which is not possible for most non-citizens).

    Wealthy foreigners like to buy property in Israel. You can see after the peace deal of recent years Israel with UAE, Bahrain, wealthy people in the Gulf were buying property in Israel. Probably after some years, the increase in the price of the property would be greater than any tax you pay.


    Peace Deals in Place, Wealthy Gulf Arabs Are Boosting Israel’s Super-Prime Real Estate Market

    Buyers from Gulf countries have helped drive prices for Tel Aviv villas, mansions, and penthouses well above the $10 million mark, according to Mansion Global. And the resulting activity, though economically beneficial, will only put additional pressure on middle-class locals hoping to afford family homes.

     
    https://www.architecturaldigest.com/story/tel-aviv-real-estate

    I guess AnonTN idea is about the protests against selling property to Arabs in Afula or against selling to Jews in Yafo.

    The Mayor of Afula can go to the demonstration against selling in Afula to Arab families. There is an article about this theme. https://www.al-monitor.com/originals/2019/07/israel-arabs-benjamin-netanyahu-discrimination-afula-citizen.html

    Analogy for Jewish discrimination against Arab residents in Afula seems like the 1930s Detroit discrimination against African-Americans. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Housing_segregation_in_the_United_States It's a combination of local authorities with the local residents.

    Analogy for Yafo is a bit parallel than Fort Greene or Bedford–Stuyvesant, although the violence in Yafo also had the religious war component in 2021 when it was connected with the conflict with the Temple Mount complex in Jerusalem.

    Replies: @A123

    I guess AnonTN idea is about the protests against selling property to Arabs in Afula or against selling to Jews in Yafo.

    The Mayor of Afula can go to the demonstration against selling in Afula to Arab families

    In many ways, the Afula Park story was much more secular than religious.

    Residential property values are driven by amenities. When the park was swarmed with non-locals, everyone who actually lived there took a financial hit. Similarly, when a family with one or two children leaves and a family with four or more children moves in, that impacts schools and other facilities.
    ___

    The Jaffa situation is more complicated. It has an unusually high religious mix dating back for decades. As tensions have risen over the years, there really is no good place to build barriers or otherwise achieve separation. Neither side will accept being forced out. Thus, the locals watch every transaction closely for anything that may disadvantage their side.

    Jaffa is a favorable location for gentrification. Huge amounts could be made by flipping a building and remodelling it for upper middle class buyers.

    There is also a small, often over looked, Christian population around the local Church of St. Peter.

    https://www.custodia.org/en/sanctuaries/jaffa

    PEACE 😇

  823. @Yevardian
    @songbird


    But I don’t seem to notice it among Chinese born overseas, and perhaps all those ancient cities were just fertility sinks.
     
    I thought it would have been well known at least here that the death-rate of cities everywhere far exceeded their birthrates until the 19th Century. It was only constant migration from the countryside that they could even maintain a steady population.

    Replies: @songbird, @Emil Nikola Richard

    It’s quite easy to understand that ancient Chinese cities did not grow forever in scope. And it is quite probable that ancient Chinese cities were dens of disease, with overall higher rates of mortality.

    However, it involves too many assumptions to assume that they were blackholes. That everyone who went into them had lower fertility than everyone outside them, and that there is no chance that they affected modern DNA.

    I don’t want to give out too much personal info, but I can say that I descend from people that lived in very densely populated areas, but who had very large families.

    Moreover, it is well known that sedentism influenced human DNA and biology, though there is a great deal of evidence that it caused disease. Sometimes, quite horrible diseases, like falciparum.

    It is also well-known that urbanization has influenced the DNA of wild animals living in urban environments.

  824. @Yevardian
    @songbird


    But I don’t seem to notice it among Chinese born overseas, and perhaps all those ancient cities were just fertility sinks.
     
    I thought it would have been well known at least here that the death-rate of cities everywhere far exceeded their birthrates until the 19th Century. It was only constant migration from the countryside that they could even maintain a steady population.

    Replies: @songbird, @Emil Nikola Richard

    I thought it would have been well known at least here that the death-rate of cities everywhere far exceeded their birthrates until the 19th Century.

    You might be able to get your meme re tweeted ninety million times if you plot (deaths-births) v. population and year for London, Peking, Bombay, Lagos, and Rio. Use color and whatnot to get your 4 variables smashed into two dimensions.

    There are millions of idiots with smart phones out there to serve info tidbits to. You’ll only make a fraction of a cent off each one but it is practically zero work!!!

    They used to teach Dickens in schools to 13 and 14 year olds and everybody knew what a cesspit 1850 London was. Now people learn about 1850 London by seeing live action role playing and television action role playing and nobody has a clue that it smelled like a sewer.

  825. North Rhine-Westphalia, the German state with the biggest population and economy, has just declared a financial emergency, due to the energy crisis.

  826. @Mikel
    @AP


    infants die in the Russian bombing
     
    Not in the same targeted and deliberate way as during the massacres of Jews during WW2.

    I'm just trying to understand those events and revenge for Bolshevik crimes doesn't look too convincing. I doubt that most Holocaust collaborators had victims of those crimes in their immediate families, just like few German perpetrators had such close personal reasons to do what they did.

    If I saw people of a certain race disproportionately represented among the criminals victimizing members of my community (for example Black Americans or Mexican Hispanics) and I felt desires of revenge, I don't think killing Nigerian or Ecuatorian infants would provide me any relief.

    Perhaps they bought the Nazis' ideology of inferior races that needed to be exterminated or perhaps they didn't care that much for ideologies but wanted to make thrmselves useful to their German allies leaving moral constraints aside. Both alternatives look more likely to me.

    Let's hope this war stops soon and we don't reach those levels of depravation.

    Replies: @Coconuts, @AP

    “infants die in the Russian bombing”

    Not in the same targeted and deliberate way as during the massacres of Jews during WW2.

    Correct. And likewise, the Donbassers did not experience a fraction of the misery that the Balts were subjected to. So they don’t mind or justify the bombing of Kyiv but wouldn’t (I hope) justify more brutal, personal acts.

    I need not have just mentioned AnoninTN. How many Brits, whose country had been subjected to German bombing of London and other cities, objected to the terror firebombing of Dresden and other German cities in which tens of thousands of civilians including children were incinerated alive?

    I’m just trying to understand those events and revenge for Bolshevik crimes doesn’t look too convincing. I doubt that most Holocaust collaborators had victims of those crimes in their immediate families, just like few German perpetrators had such close personal reasons to do what they did

    Here is how the Balts differed from the Germans. Given the sheer scale of Soviet atrocities it is likely that the Balt war criminals did experience deadly persecution among close family, friends, or neighbours. Whereas for Germans it was a matter of more abstract principles.

    So equalising the two is just wrong.

    If I saw people of a certain race disproportionately represented among the criminals victimizing members of my community

    It was more than merely overrepresentation among the Soviet administration. The other issue is that the local Jewish population, for very understandable reasons (obviously for Jews Stalin was a much lesser evil than Hitler), tended to support and favor the Bolsheviks. The locals noticed that as the Bolsheviks were killing and deporting their people.

    and I felt desires of revenge, I don’t think killing Nigerian or Ecuatorian infants would provide me any relief.

    Correct. As Coconuts pointed out, another factor is that people back then did think in more collectivistic terms than they do now. They may have viewed these victims as potential killers or (in the case of children) as future killers.

    perhaps they didn’t care that much for ideologies but wanted to make thrmselves useful to their German allies leaving moral constraints aside

    This was probably an additional factor. But I think most would not had done this unless the previous factors applied. Would those Latvians had agreed to commit atrocities against French, Poles, or others who were not associated with Soviet crimes against their people?

    So, I think that all of the main factors are covered here: rage and desire for revenge by victims; more collectivistic view of groups of people; and opportunism and encouragement by Nazi authorities, at the expense of people viewed as deadly or potentially deadly enemies.

    • Replies: @Mikel
    @AP


    Would those Latvians had agreed to commit atrocities against French, Poles, or others who were not associated with Soviet crimes against their people?
     
    Is that not exactly what happened? I'm not very sure about Latvians but many Ukrainians (Trawniki men) definitely took part in crimes against people from all around Europe that the Nazis gathered in Polish concentration camps. A good amount of the victims were not even Jews.

    Replies: @AP

  827. Within the past 24 –

  828. @German_reader
    @AnonfromTN


    There were two Latvian Waffen SS divisions
     
    Those were mostly conscripts and iirc during their existence were mostly limited to regular warfare, so probably not many war crimes committed by them. Some of their members had been in police and auxiliary formations before though which did commit a lot of crimes, up to mass killings.
    Anyway, I have little desire to discuss the issue, one of the most annoying habits of Eastern Europeans is their tendency to view everything through the lens of the 1940s ("Holodomor!" "Nazis!" "Banderites!" and so on). That both Russians and their regional enemies do this, is just another sign that in the end you're all from the same world, a world any sane Western European would want to have as little to do with as possible.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Mikel, @AnonfromTN

    most annoying habits of Eastern Europeans is their tendency to view everything through the lens of the 1940s

    Unfortunately, this is not just ancient history, but recurring pattern of behavior that is reproduced right now. Lithuania supplied no Waffen SS divisions in the 1940s. The same Lithuania gave citizenship to all its residents. Latvia and Estonia supplied Waffen SS divisions in the 1940s. Latvia and Estonia did not give their residents that were Russians citizenship, introducing a category of non-citizens, unheard of in any country pretending to be civilized. Naturally, the EU pretended that it does not see anything untoward in it, even though this contradicts officially proclaimed EU policy regarding national minorities.

    Back in the USSR I thought that Balts are civilized. I was wrong. People with nationalist feelings appropriate for a caveman cannot be considered civilized.

  829. @AP
    @Mikel


    How could random Jewish people, including women, children and civilians from outside the USSR be regarded by Latvians or Ukrainians as responsible for Bolshevik crimes?
     
    The mentality for many of those people was something like blind rage or cold hateful vengeance. Someone whose family were slaughtered would in turn slaughter the family of those linked to their killers. Or in a more benign version, be indifferent to the murder of people like those who had murdered their loved ones. Obviously I do not agree with this approach and view it as a case of evil begetting evil, and imagine (and hope) that if I had been tested as those people were I would not have been capable of such crimes.

    BTW, we have sort of an example here - our AnoninTN, whose relatives suffered from bombing in Luhansk, and is indifferent and makes excuses for a much worse and larger scale bombing of people he links to the bombers of Luhansk.

    Nobody with a functioning brain thinks that killing a Jewish infant from Poland or Hungary is revenging any crime committed by people in a different country.
     
    Well, infants die in the Russian bombing, yet Russians angry about Donbas justify or dismiss such deaths as Kiev getting a taste of its own medicine, or something like that.

    Replies: @Mikel, @AnonfromTN

    BTW, we have sort of an example here – our AnoninTN, whose relatives suffered from bombing in Luhansk, and is indifferent and makes excuses for a much worse and larger scale bombing of people he links to the bombers of Luhansk.

    Information tidbit. The residents of Ukraine protested against a lot of things: high prices of electricity, natural gas, increase in payments for their apartments, even against high customs duties levied on used cars they brought from Europe.

    How many times did they protest against heinous crimes committed by their government ostensibly in their name in Donbass for eight years? Exactly zero.

    How many times did they protest against cutting off water and electricity supply to presumably their compatriots in Crimea? Exactly zero.

    Any more questions?

    • Replies: @AP
    @AnonfromTN


    Information tidbit. The residents of Ukraine protested against a lot of things: high prices of electricity, natural gas, increase in payments for their apartments, even against high customs duties levied on used cars they brought from Europe.

    How many times did they protest against heinous crimes committed by their government ostensibly in their name in Donbass for eight years? Exactly zero
     
    Thanks for proving my point. For you, it is acceptable to bomb Kiev and kill it’s people (including children) because people in Kiev didn’t protest against bombing Donbas. For many Latvians during World War II it was acceptable to kill Jews, because many of them supported the Soviet government. You are on the same spectrum as those guys, just (I hope) at different points.

    Of course, the reason that Donbas bombed was because Russia had sent fighters and weapons into Donbas, recognised Ukrainian territory, and the state was defending its territory. No different from Russia defending its territory in Chechnya or Syria against foreign ISIS fighters sponsored by the Saudis or Turks - except Kiev was far more careful with civilians than were Putin or Assad. You like to forget that part.

    How many times did they protest against cutting off water and electricity supply to presumably their compatriots in Crimea
     
    Why should they be obligated to supply their own water and electricity to a hostile state that grabbed its territory? Should Russia be obligated to send electricity or water from Russia to Ukraine?

    A stupid comparison some pro-Russians make is when they claim that Ukraine choosing not to export its own water or electricity to another county is somehow the same as bombing another country’s power plants or water treatment facilities.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

  830. @Yevardian
    @Yahya

    I was a little surprised when G_R mentioned it, but it immediately made perfect sense given past posting history, where I'd previously just assumed it was a male poster who heavily inclined to the emotional, personal and anecdotal. Recently LatW was starting to remind me of that constantly sockpuppeting 'Laxa' commenter, but now its obvious why.


    Sher Singh? A123? Songbird?
     
    Respectively: A romantically frustrated male Pajeet emigrant clinging to his solice that Sikhs are the original Aryans, a Russian disinformation bot almost certainly of male coding origin, and a garden-variety HBD rightoid, I doubt there will be any surprises there.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Sher Singh

    a Russian disinformation bot almost certainly of male coding origin

    Commenting record of A123 contradicts this conclusion. It contains repetitive boring diatribes against Iranian leadership, as well as Muslims in general. It contains vehement defense, often using even blatant lies, of indefensible Israeli policies. It contains repeated denunciation of Europe and Dems (IMO, these are well deserved) and glorification of the US (IMO, this is not). It contains MAGA pipedream that would have been realistic maybe 25 years ago but is unachievable today. It contains uncritical admiration for Trump, who promised a lot of reasonable things and did diddly-squat. In addition, A123 usually responds to comments mentioning his/her statements within minutes.

    All of this is inconsistent with him/her being a Russian troll. It is consistent with a retired Republican supporter of either gender with lots of time on his/her hands, who gobbled up most of the US propaganda uncritically. Even his/her diatribes against Kiev regime are easily explained by the fact that Biden, his son, and many high-ranking Dems got kickbacks from Ukraine and all these personages were and are using this corrupt location to launder money.

    That’s my take on A123. Generally agree with you about Sher Singh and songbird.

  831. @AnonfromTN
    @AP


    BTW, we have sort of an example here – our AnoninTN, whose relatives suffered from bombing in Luhansk, and is indifferent and makes excuses for a much worse and larger scale bombing of people he links to the bombers of Luhansk.
     
    Information tidbit. The residents of Ukraine protested against a lot of things: high prices of electricity, natural gas, increase in payments for their apartments, even against high customs duties levied on used cars they brought from Europe.

    How many times did they protest against heinous crimes committed by their government ostensibly in their name in Donbass for eight years? Exactly zero.

    How many times did they protest against cutting off water and electricity supply to presumably their compatriots in Crimea? Exactly zero.

    Any more questions?

    Replies: @AP

    Information tidbit. The residents of Ukraine protested against a lot of things: high prices of electricity, natural gas, increase in payments for their apartments, even against high customs duties levied on used cars they brought from Europe.

    How many times did they protest against heinous crimes committed by their government ostensibly in their name in Donbass for eight years? Exactly zero

    Thanks for proving my point. For you, it is acceptable to bomb Kiev and kill it’s people (including children) because people in Kiev didn’t protest against bombing Donbas. For many Latvians during World War II it was acceptable to kill Jews, because many of them supported the Soviet government. You are on the same spectrum as those guys, just (I hope) at different points.

    Of course, the reason that Donbas bombed was because Russia had sent fighters and weapons into Donbas, recognised Ukrainian territory, and the state was defending its territory. No different from Russia defending its territory in Chechnya or Syria against foreign ISIS fighters sponsored by the Saudis or Turks – except Kiev was far more careful with civilians than were Putin or Assad. You like to forget that part.

    How many times did they protest against cutting off water and electricity supply to presumably their compatriots in Crimea

    Why should they be obligated to supply their own water and electricity to a hostile state that grabbed its territory? Should Russia be obligated to send electricity or water from Russia to Ukraine?

    A stupid comparison some pro-Russians make is when they claim that Ukraine choosing not to export its own water or electricity to another county is somehow the same as bombing another country’s power plants or water treatment facilities.

    • Replies: @AnonfromTN
    @AP


    For you, it is acceptable to bomb Kiev and kill it’s people (including children) because people in Kiev didn’t protest against bombing Donbas.
     
    It’s mostly a bunch of lies used by Ukie puppets to beg for more financial aid that they can steal. Interestingly, some US media said that Russian weapons are sub-par because they kill too few Ukrainian civilians. Typical sour grapes.

    FYI, Russia targets military installations, including the locations where Ukrainian troops are billeted, as well as power stations and industry installations producing and/or repairing weapons/ammo. In case you conveniently forgot, similar targets, plus residential areas and bridges, were bombed by NATO in Serbia. Even Chinese embassy in Belgrade was bombed.

    Now, a simple question: how many civilians were killed in Kiev by Russian rockets, and how many by malfunctioning/mistargeted Ukrainian anti-missile rockets, like those two unfortunate Poles recently?

    Replies: @AP, @Mr. Hack

  832. @LatW
    @showmethereal


    Where did you see me mention Lviv?
     
    You mentioned something about "Western Ukrainians betraying their brothers". And then Hu said that "4 provinces joined Russia". So by this logic, it sounds like those from Lviv are trying to take over some of the eastern areas that are trying to leave. But this is entirely skewed because there is an occupation, and the whole of Ukraine, including many folks from the East, are fighting against it. That's what I mean by informational gaps.


    China was heavily invested in developing Ukraine – so to claim they are pro Russia is nonsense.
     
    Well, China was trying to have everything - have a strategic relationship with Russia, promote anti-Westernism and a schism between US and Europe, but also have access to large areas of Eastern Europe. Under peaceful conditions this seems possible and was intended intelligently (since such a large war was not expected).

    There is some info that China might be supplying Russia in the war. This is speculation but there is some info that planes are flying without transponders between China and Russia and may be carrying some war supplies, not weapons but possibly winter gear (for the "second best army on the planet").


    But China knows the same foreign government who stepped in and forced Ukraine to cancel the sale of Motor Sich to a Chinese entity
     
    Companies such as Motor Sich should be in Ukrainian hands. I know this may not be as simple due to financial reasons, but this should be the aim. Foreigners may own shares, but not in full.

    China is also well aware of US psyops to compare Ukraine to Taiwan
     
    These are not always accurate comparisons. Yes, there is an element of a proxy war in Ukraine, but Ukraine is essentially fighting an anti-colonial war of independence.

    Replies: @showmethereal

    So China wanting to have good relations with Ukraine and China is a bad thing??? Where is the logic in that? Only countries that seek to divide and rule think there should be “blocs” (gangs) among countries. China promotes anti western ideology? Ummm no China was all too happy to do business with the west. But if saying the west doesn’t have the right to dictate to the rest of the globe – then yeah I guess you can call it that.

    And who are you to say if Motor Sich should be sold? Fact is Ukraine was ready and willing until the US ordered them not to. So much for sovereignty and freedom. It’s a joke.

  833. @AP
    @AnonfromTN


    Information tidbit. The residents of Ukraine protested against a lot of things: high prices of electricity, natural gas, increase in payments for their apartments, even against high customs duties levied on used cars they brought from Europe.

    How many times did they protest against heinous crimes committed by their government ostensibly in their name in Donbass for eight years? Exactly zero
     
    Thanks for proving my point. For you, it is acceptable to bomb Kiev and kill it’s people (including children) because people in Kiev didn’t protest against bombing Donbas. For many Latvians during World War II it was acceptable to kill Jews, because many of them supported the Soviet government. You are on the same spectrum as those guys, just (I hope) at different points.

    Of course, the reason that Donbas bombed was because Russia had sent fighters and weapons into Donbas, recognised Ukrainian territory, and the state was defending its territory. No different from Russia defending its territory in Chechnya or Syria against foreign ISIS fighters sponsored by the Saudis or Turks - except Kiev was far more careful with civilians than were Putin or Assad. You like to forget that part.

    How many times did they protest against cutting off water and electricity supply to presumably their compatriots in Crimea
     
    Why should they be obligated to supply their own water and electricity to a hostile state that grabbed its territory? Should Russia be obligated to send electricity or water from Russia to Ukraine?

    A stupid comparison some pro-Russians make is when they claim that Ukraine choosing not to export its own water or electricity to another county is somehow the same as bombing another country’s power plants or water treatment facilities.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN

    For you, it is acceptable to bomb Kiev and kill it’s people (including children) because people in Kiev didn’t protest against bombing Donbas.

    It’s mostly a bunch of lies used by Ukie puppets to beg for more financial aid that they can steal. Interestingly, some US media said that Russian weapons are sub-par because they kill too few Ukrainian civilians. Typical sour grapes.

    FYI, Russia targets military installations, including the locations where Ukrainian troops are billeted, as well as power stations and industry installations producing and/or repairing weapons/ammo. In case you conveniently forgot, similar targets, plus residential areas and bridges, were bombed by NATO in Serbia. Even Chinese embassy in Belgrade was bombed.

    Now, a simple question: how many civilians were killed in Kiev by Russian rockets, and how many by malfunctioning/mistargeted Ukrainian anti-missile rockets, like those two unfortunate Poles recently?

    • Agree: Mikhail
    • Replies: @AP
    @AnonfromTN


    FYI, Russia targets military installations, including the locations where Ukrainian troops are billeted, as well as power stations and industry installations producing and/or repairing weapons/ammo. In case you conveniently forgot, similar targets, plus residential areas and bridges, were bombed by NATO in Serbia. Even Chinese embassy in Belgrade was bombed.
     
    According to the UN about 7,000 civilians have been conformed killed as a result of the Russian invasion, but UN states that the real number is far higher.

    Yugoslavia claims that 1,200-2,000 civilians were killed by NATO.

    So the Russia State has killed several times more Ukrainians than NATO killed Serbs.

    But I guess you made some progress by comparing Russia to NATO.

    Now, a simple question: how many civilians were killed in Kiev by Russian rockets, and how many by malfunctioning/mistargeted Ukrainian anti-missile rockets
     
    This makes no difference in terms of culpability. If someone breaks into your house, shoots at you, you shoot back and mistakenly kill one of your family, it is the fault of the person that broke in that your loved one is dead, and not your fault.

    As I said, and as you insist on proving, you are of the same kind as those Latvians who didn't mind killing Jews because Jews had killed Latvians. Likewise, you don't mind bombing of Ukrainians because Ukrainians have bombed Donbassers.

    Replies: @Mikhail, @AnonfromTN

    , @Mr. Hack
    @AnonfromTN


    For you, it is acceptable to bomb Kiev and kill it’s people (including children) because people in Kiev didn’t protest against bombing Donbas.

    It’s mostly a bunch of lies used by Ukie puppets to beg for more financial aid that they can steal.
     
    Really? Where did "Ukie puppets" use the idea that because they didn't protest the bombing of Donbas, they were entitled to financial aid (so "that "they can steal" it)? Your personal fantasies are interfering with your abilities to counter AP's claim, or is it just your inability to properly express yourself?
  834. @Barbarossa
    @Yahya


    automatically assume LatW is a male rather than female
     
    On UNZ it's an assumption which will be pretty safe on average, LOL. The revelation hasn't shaken me up, partly though since I really haven't had that much direct conversation with LatW as she sticks heavily to Balt/Balkan/Russia topics in which I don't have a horse. The right wing orientation doesn't surprise me since it often seems from my experience that when women are right wing (or left wing) they are often more uncompromisingly so than many men. I suppose that the heavy recruitment of women by the Left has probably been quite effective for the energy expended. That should probably serve as some sort of lesson to the right.

    “Rosie” (I think gone now) who was constantly belittled and domineered by the male commenters
     
    I always found that behavior stupid, obnoxious, and counterproductive (see reason above). I prefer to just deal with the substance of what is being said. I never even found Triteleia Laxa that terminally annoying. Amusingly, I once read my wife one of Laxa's comments in which she was psychoanalyzing somebody, and before I even got through the comment my wife's reaction was, "Is she always this obnoxious? Wow!". That cracked me up!

    I'll get back to your other comment more in depth later, but thanks for that. My wife and I gave them all a listen. I definitely prefer the chant and more traditional instrumentation to the more Westernized works. Too much Western instrumentation makes it sound a bit neither here nor there to me. It's okay, but it doesn't grab me as much. I really liked some of the Persian and Turkish traditional music that you posted in previous comments. And any kind of chant is generally fine with me, be it Buddhist, Gregorian, Orthodox, or really any other kind. The purity of only the human voice and limited tonal range seem very transcendent to me.

    Out of curiousity, you seem to have a fairly deep and technical knowledge of music, do you play an instrument or are you just an avid listener?

    Replies: @Yahya

    Out of curiousity, you seem to have a fairly deep and technical knowledge of music, do you play an instrument or are you just an avid listener?

    I play the piano.

    My knowledge of music isn’t as deep as you think though. I posses no formal degree of music training, so my knowledge is mostly limited to what I can gather from the internet. I’m trying to work my way through some music theory textbooks by Rimsky-Korsakov, Tchaikovsky and Hector Berlioz, though the dryness of the subject is proving to be a formidable impediment. I’ve read a few books on Arabic music so my knowledge there is more sophisticated, but for everything else I’m relying on internet sources like the Iranian website I mentioned.

    Too much Western instrumentation makes it sound a bit neither here nor there to me. It’s okay, but it doesn’t grab me as much.

    Good point. There’s this Turkish pianist called Fazil Say who’s very talented and even gifted in playing the piano, but whenever I listen to his compositions it always strikes me as a bit off. Western classical music just ain’t part of the Turkish tradition; and typically that’s why I think these non-Western composers almost always fall flat on their face, no matter how good they were. Again, with the possible exceptions of Armenians and Azeris.

    I don’t mind the incorporation of some Western elements into Middle Eastern music, but definitely one needs to take care not to overdo it; the music should stay Middle Eastern in character.

    really liked some of the Persian and Turkish traditional music that you posted in previous comments.

    I was going to post some more recommendations, but probably I’m overdoing at this point, so will stop here. Perhaps some other time.

    • Replies: @orchardist
    @Yahya

    On the Sensation of Tone by Helmholtz is the bible.

    Replies: @Che Guava

  835. @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @showmethereal

    You can't read Chinese can you?

    A literate Chinese and Japanese would recognize that this is a quatrain by Tang poet Du Mu 杜牧 (AD 803—852) commenting on the Battle of Red Cliff (AD 208). It was quoted in Romance of Three Kingdoms (14th CE).

    折戟沉沙鐵未銷,自將磨洗認前朝。

    東風不與周郎便,銅雀春深鎖二喬。

    There's a translation here, https://28utscprojects.wordpress.com/2010/11/28/290/
    I'll also give my own in English and German,

    Red Cliff
    Broken halberds buried deep in the sand, have yet rust are their spearheads,
    Alas I wash them up and recognise they are from an ancient dynasty,
    Had the eastern wind not blown in our boy Zhou's favour,
    Tower of Bronze Peacocks would have forever held captive the hot Qiao sisters.

    Rote Klippe
    Zerbrochene Hellebarden tief im Sand vergraben, auch rostig sind ihre Speerspitzen,
    Ach! wasche sie ab und erkenne, dass sie aus einer alten Dynastie stammen,
    Hätte der Ostwind nicht zu Gunsten von junge Zhou treffen,
    Bronzepfauenturm hätte die geilen Qiao Schwestern für immer gefangen gehalten.

    The story is that Cao Cao before the battle boasted about taking Zhou Yu's wife Little Qiao and her equally stunning sister as concubines. But Zhou Yu defeated Cao's numerically vast superior navy with a brilliant fire attack assisted by easterlies.

    Replies: @showmethereal

    You don’t realize you are a troll do you? That has absolutely NOTHING to do with the forum nor the topic being argued (which was sports). That officially makes you a troll. Cao Cao is a favorite historical figure. But only trolls would try to insert that into this discourse. You were better off seething over the World Cup loss quietly

  836. @LatW
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms


    There was an Estonian with freakish athleticism but never made it,

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margus_Hunt
     

    Yea, he was in the NFL. He is 6'8, 277lbs. He started out as a discus thrower (he did well in the junior championships).

    Big and fast white guys are actually not that rare
     
    You're right, not that rare. There are some in ice hockey who are around 190cms and fast.

    Replies: @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    The biggest ever MMA fighter was actually a Korean, Hong-man Choi, 7’2, 351lbs. But he was lazy and thought can just overpower people.

    Here he is against a normal size Slav who’s infinitely more skilled, Fedor, who got him easily with a 十字固め jūji-gatame “cross arm bar”, judo technique.

    [MORE]

    • Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard
    @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms

    That is a great fight.

  837. @Yevardian
    @Yahya

    Albanians were disproportionately represented in other areas of the Ottoman Empire too.
    On Egypt, it always struck me that I can't think of a single native Egyptian actually ruling the country from the end of the Pharaohs until Nasser.
    Perhaps I'm missing something, but the Tulunids were Turks, the Fatimids were Berber, Saladin and the Ayyubids were Kurds, Mamluks were mostly Circassian, was there really no indigenous ruler on the Nile for over 2000 years? That history must pose challenges for a suitably patriotic school curriculum.
    Obviously Armenia spent its own millennia facing foreign domination, but there were frequent revolts and periods of local rule as well. It seems the pre-Arab Egyptian culture was assimilated much more quickly than places like Syria, perhaps because Egypt's geography lends itself to total centralised control like nearly no other place. The Islamisation of Egypt is something I'll have to read about sometime.

    Replies: @Yahya

    On Egypt, it always struck me that I can’t think of a single native Egyptian actually ruling the country from the end of the Pharaohs until Nasser.

    Yes well Egypt’s fecklessness in the face of foreign occupiers is legendary; perhaps only rivaled by India. Apart from some failed rebellions here and there; Egyptians pretty much acquiesced to rule by non-natives for almost 2,300 years until Nasser’s overthrow of King Farouk. Most nations can’t even trace their history back 2,300 years.

    OTOH, Iran was likewise ruled by non-natives for a long period of time, maybe 1,200-1,300 years. The Pahlavi ruling dynasty of the 20th century was the first Persian ruling house of all Iran since the fall of the Sassanids in 650. So Egypt is not unique in the Islamic world. This has to do with Islam’s peculiar ability to put religious identity ahead of ethnic identity, which i’ll get to below.

    That history must pose challenges for a suitably patriotic school curriculum.

    Not really; most Egyptians tend to take a philosophical approach to these things. I remember being taught about Muhammad Ali Pasha’s reign in school in a very positive sense, also some lesser known Mamluk rulers like Baybars (Turkic Sultan who defeated Crusaders at famous battle of Ain Jalut), Qaitbay (Circassian Sultan who built spectacular architectural monuments across major cities of the Middle East), and Shajar al-Durr (slave girl of possible Bedouin, Circassian, Greek, Armenian or Turkic origin who rose to the throne of Egypt).

    Saladin is of course considered a national hero; his citadel sitting atop a hill overlooking the Old Cairo. There’s also a mosque built by and named after Muhammad Ali within the confines of the citadel.

    All of the above were viewed positively in my textbooks. The reason for this is simple. They were Muslims, which to many Egyptians takes precedence over their ethnic origins. I remember talking to my friend one time and he was saying “how the British colonial rule set Egypt back etc.” and I responded by saying the Turks ruled Egypt for longer before the British did, he replied “yeah but these people are Arabs”, by which he meant they were Muslims so it’s fine. Not all Egyptians take this approach of course; some Arab nationalists believe the Turks are to blame for our decline. But the general view in Egypt is that non-ethnic Egyptian rulers were “our own” in a meaningful manner as long as they are Muslims. Copts may take a different view though.

    There’s one exception to the Muslim rule, which is Cleopatra. Her name is plastered across several streets, buildings, hospitals, restaurants, corporations etc. all over Egypt. She is far and away the most celebrated Egyptian ruler over here. Probably not many Egyptians are even aware of her Greek/Macedonian background; she’s viewed as “our own” queen. And I don’t see why not really, she may have been Greek but Egypt gave her her name; somehow I doubt she would have achieved the everlasting fame she did had she stayed in Greece.

    Re, Muhammad Ali Pasha: he was definitely a capable, imaginative ruler and did much to industrialize Egypt and bring her back to prominence after a long period of obscurity under Ottoman rule. Still, his ambition got the better of him and he overshot by attempting to march on Constantinople. Perhaps it was a good decision at the time, for it is likely he would have succeeded had the British not intervened. Still, definitely not a good idea to take on the big dogs in such a manner. His taxation and conscription policies in Syria also backfired spectacularly. Personally I agree with George Antonious when he wrote that Muhammad Ali’s son Ibrahim Pasha was the better of the two. The former seemed to be driven solely by personal ambition, while the latter had a genuine respect for Arabs and regarded himself as one, as was noted by French envoys to Egypt.

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @Yahya

    https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/791104449971224606/1047591567243886592/Baagi_Hind.png

    , @Yevardian
    @Yahya


    OTOH, Iran was likewise ruled by non-natives for a long period of time, maybe 1,200-1,300 years. The Pahlavi ruling dynasty of the 20th century was the first Persian ruling house of all Iran since the fall of the Sassanids in 650.
     
    There a few mistakes here, I'll try being brief. Edit: Just noticed you mentioned 'all Iran', which might render my point moot. Although the independent Persian Buyids and Samanids definitely ruled territories the same size or larger as the Iran's contemporary borders.

    Right after the Arab-Islamic conquest/internal overthrow of the Sasanid Empire numerous local Zoroastrian dynasties declared independence around Mazandaran (the Caspian litoral) which continued to fight the Ummayads for over a century. E.g. the Bavandis, Dabuyidis, Paduspandis, etc.
    The area later became a haven for both Shiism and various Islamic heresies of all kinds, though the rest of Iran was Sunni until the Safavids forcibly converted the country in the 1500s.

    Local Muslim dynasties of Persian origin appear from the 9th Century, though earlier ones like the Tahirids and Saffarids never declared outright independence, the (Shia) Buyids actually conquered Baghdad and allowed the nominal Abbasid 'Caliph' to continue as a puppet, the first of many.
    At the same time there were the Samanids in Khorasan, which although outside Iran-proper today, was the cultural heartland of Persian culture during this period. Ferdowsi and Avicenna lived under the Samanids, who were by origin Zoroastrian 'converts' to Islam, though its obvious they were simply nobles that wanted to retain their privileges.

    But yeah, after the 'Iranian Intermezzo' as this period is called, its mostly dynasties of Turkic origin, just as the Arab world was also being politically taken over by Turks. Still, after the Safavids there were the eastern-Iranian Zands, although they were a brief & unsuccessful dynasty.
    Finally, the parvenue founder of the Pahlavis, Reza Shah, was half-Georgian.


    I remember talking to my friend one time and he was saying “how the British colonial rule set Egypt back etc.” and I responded by saying the Turks ruled Egypt for longer before the British did, he replied “yeah but these people are Arabs”, by which he meant they were Muslims so it’s fine.
     
    Lol. Islam really is a genius psychological tool for enforcing Arab supremacism, if nothing else. You know Ahmadinejad got in serious trouble from the Mullahs a while ago, for espousing the views of clerics that were denounced as heretical, because they were far more Persian nationalist than 'Islamic'?
  838. @China Japan and Korea Bromance of Three Kingdoms
    @LatW

    The biggest ever MMA fighter was actually a Korean, Hong-man Choi, 7'2, 351lbs. But he was lazy and thought can just overpower people.

    Here he is against a normal size Slav who's infinitely more skilled, Fedor, who got him easily with a 十字固め jūji-gatame "cross arm bar", judo technique.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CbIRj2DDK1A

    Replies: @Emil Nikola Richard

    That is a great fight.

  839. @Yahya
    @Barbarossa


    Out of curiousity, you seem to have a fairly deep and technical knowledge of music, do you play an instrument or are you just an avid listener?
     
    I play the piano.

    My knowledge of music isn’t as deep as you think though. I posses no formal degree of music training, so my knowledge is mostly limited to what I can gather from the internet. I’m trying to work my way through some music theory textbooks by Rimsky-Korsakov, Tchaikovsky and Hector Berlioz, though the dryness of the subject is proving to be a formidable impediment. I’ve read a few books on Arabic music so my knowledge there is more sophisticated, but for everything else I’m relying on internet sources like the Iranian website I mentioned.

    Too much Western instrumentation makes it sound a bit neither here nor there to me. It’s okay, but it doesn’t grab me as much.
     
    Good point. There’s this Turkish pianist called Fazil Say who’s very talented and even gifted in playing the piano, but whenever I listen to his compositions it always strikes me as a bit off. Western classical music just ain’t part of the Turkish tradition; and typically that’s why I think these non-Western composers almost always fall flat on their face, no matter how good they were. Again, with the possible exceptions of Armenians and Azeris.

    I don’t mind the incorporation of some Western elements into Middle Eastern music, but definitely one needs to take care not to overdo it; the music should stay Middle Eastern in character.

    really liked some of the Persian and Turkish traditional music that you posted in previous comments.
     
    I was going to post some more recommendations, but probably I’m overdoing at this point, so will stop here. Perhaps some other time.

    Replies: @orchardist

    On the Sensation of Tone by Helmholtz is the bible.

    • Thanks: Yahya
    • Replies: @Che Guava
    @orchardist

    You are generally verbose, dividing no. of words by no. of comments.

    However, thank you very much for reminding me of that book Sensations of Tone by Helmholtz, I had it but lost it. Likely stolen. Kleptomaniac bibliophile acquaintance of the time most likely reason.

    Had only read about a third, it is very dense, but brilliant. To continue, inter-library loans or download. Finding another copy to buy, except from Amazon, which I strictly boycott, seems unlikely.

  840. Funny 2 see refugees from the USSR call me an emigrant.

    With a lower body count too..

    The most popular politician among women in Canada,
    is a Sikh.

  841. @silviosilver
    @Thulean Friend


    I mean Partisan Red Belgrade was already pretty damn impressive by the late 1970s. In 1991, they won against Marseilles (which was a fantastic team back then).
     
    Not sure if that's supposed to be a joke, but Partizan and Red Star Belgrade are two different teams.

    I saw that game. Marseilles dominated but couldn't score. I think their best chance was when former Red Star player ("traitor") Dragan Stojkovic - now manager of the Serbian national team - came on as a substitute late in the game. That game was one of the most elated victory feelings I've ever experienced. The other was when Partizan won the Euro League basketball final against Badalona the following year, with a 3-pointer at the buzzer.

    Funny, I can remember a ton of individual games and some of their details from the 90s, but draw a complete blank on anything in the last fifteen years. Well, part of the reason is I hardly care about the results anymore, whereas I used to be a passionate little sporstball fan.


    One wonders how things might have panned out if the disaster of the 1990s didn’t unfold. Maybe the Balkan superstar period was always fated to begin and it just skipped a decade due to the wars.
     
    Hey? In the 90s, Serbia won the Eurobasket tournament in 1995 and 1997 and the FIBA world championship in 1998. And a still intact Yugolsavia won the world championship in 1990 and the Euro championship in 1991. At the club level, in addition to the aforementioned Partizan victory, Jugoplastika Split won it in 1989, 1990, and 1991.

    Replies: @Thulean Friend

    Funny, I can remember a ton of individual games and some of their details from the 90s, but draw a complete blank on anything in the last fifteen years. Well, part of the reason is I hardly care about the results anymore, whereas I used to be a passionate little sporstball fan

    Though I did not personally grow up with the game in the late 1980s and early 1990s, my dad did. He also spent a lot of time watching games all over Europe with his friends in his youth. So through him I got to learn of now long-lost names like Batistuta and can recall a time when Parma was actually a serious team. He has a similar attitude to yours.

    Teams weren’t all bought up by some rich oil sheikh. The owners were genuine fans in a manner which is rare today. The Agnelli family’s relationship with Juventus was perhaps iconic, but not unique. It nearly is now.

    The player squads were more local, so they actually cared for the clubs to a greater extent. Or if not local, at least from the same nation. This made Champions League games more exciting. Watching old recordings of Man Utd’s 1999 Champions League win is still something I remember fondly from my childhood and their Bayern Munich opponents was almost an entirely German team. Most non-English players were either from the British Isles or Scandinavians.

    Additionally, and perhaps this is subjective, but my sense is that there were greater personalities. Who is the Eric Cantona of today? I can’t think of anyone. Messi is a crybaby and Ronaldo seems like an idiot. Lewandowski is probably a perfectly polite guy but also feels boring and empty.

    Everything wasn’t hyper-optimised in terms of diet or fitness. There were more things left to chance, both on the pitch and off it. Referees had greater tolerance for fights. Players could occasionally get away with going to the pub before a game. They were famous, but not mega-celebrities in the way that they are today.

    In short, the game didn’t feel as mercenary as it does today. At least that’s the impression I got growing up with old recorded games. I later read a lot about this period and it was probably the golden mean between some amount of necessary globalisation with the right amount of local flavour.

    • Thanks: Sher Singh, Barbarossa
    • Replies: @songbird
    @Thulean Friend


    Ronaldo seems like an idiot.
     
    I am not disagreeing. Don't really follow soccer at all, to know the case, but I did think it was pretty cool when he removed the two coke bottles in front of him at a press conference, and said "Drink water."
  842. Panth always ready for War.

    @barbarossa The Quom exists for Shahadat.

    The impotent rage against Sikhs isn’t any dif from Algerians in France or Turks in Ger.
    Everyone knows who has the watch and who the time||

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ

    ਕਾਲਉਪਾਸਕਛਤ੍ਰਿਯਧਰਮਾਰਣਕਟਿਕਸਿਪ੍ਰਧਾਨਅਏ॥

    Worshipers of Death and followers of the Kshatriya way, wearing a waistband they are supreme in battle.

  843. @Thulean Friend
    @silviosilver


    Funny, I can remember a ton of individual games and some of their details from the 90s, but draw a complete blank on anything in the last fifteen years. Well, part of the reason is I hardly care about the results anymore, whereas I used to be a passionate little sporstball fan
     
    Though I did not personally grow up with the game in the late 1980s and early 1990s, my dad did. He also spent a lot of time watching games all over Europe with his friends in his youth. So through him I got to learn of now long-lost names like Batistuta and can recall a time when Parma was actually a serious team. He has a similar attitude to yours.

    Teams weren't all bought up by some rich oil sheikh. The owners were genuine fans in a manner which is rare today. The Agnelli family's relationship with Juventus was perhaps iconic, but not unique. It nearly is now.

    The player squads were more local, so they actually cared for the clubs to a greater extent. Or if not local, at least from the same nation. This made Champions League games more exciting. Watching old recordings of Man Utd's 1999 Champions League win is still something I remember fondly from my childhood and their Bayern Munich opponents was almost an entirely German team. Most non-English players were either from the British Isles or Scandinavians.

    Additionally, and perhaps this is subjective, but my sense is that there were greater personalities. Who is the Eric Cantona of today? I can't think of anyone. Messi is a crybaby and Ronaldo seems like an idiot. Lewandowski is probably a perfectly polite guy but also feels boring and empty.

    Everything wasn't hyper-optimised in terms of diet or fitness. There were more things left to chance, both on the pitch and off it. Referees had greater tolerance for fights. Players could occasionally get away with going to the pub before a game. They were famous, but not mega-celebrities in the way that they are today.

    In short, the game didn't feel as mercenary as it does today. At least that's the impression I got growing up with old recorded games. I later read a lot about this period and it was probably the golden mean between some amount of necessary globalisation with the right amount of local flavour.

    Replies: @songbird

    Ronaldo seems like an idiot.

    I am not disagreeing. Don’t really follow soccer at all, to know the case, but I did think it was pretty cool when he removed the two coke bottles in front of him at a press conference, and said “Drink water.”

    • Agree: Thulean Friend
  844. @Matra
    @Thulean Friend

    Spain also won two European championships in 2008 & 2012 - they also won one in the 60s. In the same period they were the top European country in basketball, which is big outside of Northern Europe, and probably the dominant country in motorsports, tennis, and a couple of other widely played international sports. I remember at the time David Goldman aka Spengler, who was bitter at Spain over their Israel policy, mocked them as an unambitious loser country pointing to their lack of accomplishment in sports as an example. Being a typical American rube his evidence of Spanish lack of sporting prowess was their poor performances at the Olympics (which few care about) and was completely ignorant of the country's towering position in world sport at the time.

    Replies: @Thulean Friend

    Spain also won two European championships in 2008 & 2012

    Yeah, the Spanish team from 2008-2012 basically crushed everything but their trophy count outside of this golden four year period is meager indeed. I do hope they do well in this tournament. Of all the teams playing, I enjoy watching them the most.

    There were some here who questioned the utility of even watching sports. My answer is simple. Never in a million years could I play as beautifully as the Spanish team when they are in form no matter how hard I try. I’ve heard people really into tennis say the same thing when Federer was at his best. It transcends sports, it almost becomes meditative watching a true master at his craft.

    I remember at the time David Goldman aka Spengler, who was bitter at Spain over their Israel policy

    I still come across quite a few snide remarks against the Irish by various Jewish twitter types. It took me some time to figure it out before it became clear that it’s for Ireland’s historically pro-Palestine stance.

  845. @Yevardian
    @Yahya

    I was a little surprised when G_R mentioned it, but it immediately made perfect sense given past posting history, where I'd previously just assumed it was a male poster who heavily inclined to the emotional, personal and anecdotal. Recently LatW was starting to remind me of that constantly sockpuppeting 'Laxa' commenter, but now its obvious why.


    Sher Singh? A123? Songbird?
     
    Respectively: A romantically frustrated male Pajeet emigrant clinging to his solice that Sikhs are the original Aryans, a Russian disinformation bot almost certainly of male coding origin, and a garden-variety HBD rightoid, I doubt there will be any surprises there.

    Replies: @AnonfromTN, @Sher Singh

    We take solace in nothing but the Guru’s feet and Weapons.

    Don’t really even comment here unless I’m mentioned anymore..
    Eastern Christians & Meds are just grist caught between Global Diversity & the Western elite.

    ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ

  846. @Yahya
    @Thulean Friend

    I thought I spotted some familiar facial features on that Belgian foreign minister, and sure enough she’s from an Algerian background.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hadja_Lahbib

    Incidentally some of the Turkish-origin players were also protesting Qatar’s LGBT arm-band decision along with their German teammates. A sign of assimilation perhaps.

    Are MENA people in Europe generally becoming more socially liberal, or are these unrepresentative samples?

    Interesting that an Algerian-Belgian minister is attempting to impose European values on an Arab nation. The beginnings of a new era.

    Replies: @Matra, @Thulean Friend

    Are MENA people in Europe generally becoming more socially liberal, or are these unrepresentative samples?

    Can only speak for Sweden and I would say generally yes, there is significant liberalisation but it also depends widely. The moslem community is exceptionally diverse both in terms of ethnicity (and thus cultural practices) as well as how long they’ve been here.

    One puzzle has been Sweden’s very slow crawl upwards in terms of our moslem population in official surveys. Immigration has been very rapid, yet the percentage has moved up far more slowly over the last twenty years. This has led to accusations from the far-right that our demographers are “covering up our replacement”.

    But there’s a more simple way to square this circle; we now have many more “cultural moslems”. By some estimates, as many as 14% of the population could be classified as moslems by including this more liberal definition. The way people are asked in some of these surveys can be quite strict (wrt to regular observances, mosque attendance etc) so that’s why this number is closer to 8-9% in surveys. A significant percentage are basically liberal secularists who conveniently become moslem during ramadam (or even just during Eid).

    Anecdotally, it does gel with my personal experience. I saw lots of assimiliated moslem girls at my university. Befriended some and many had Swedish boyfriends. Though I still noticed a greater cultural aversion to casual sex, which is postive in my book. Swedish culture is a bit degenerative at times. As an aside, a Pakistani family moved in across the building from me. We met them at the bus-stop a few days ago, and didn’t know they lived close to us before they told us their adress (very direct and un-Swedish!). The woman wore a hijab but her teenage daughter dressed completely Swedish. (And I’m not one who cares much about hijabs anyway. Niqab/Burka is a different story).

    Still, there’s a bit of a backlash due to perceived excessive assimilation. A controversy which is brewing around so-called “virginity operations” where young girls who have lost their virginity will try to “restore” their hymen so as to raise their status in the marriage market. The current government is moving to criminalise these operations, but some leftist activists are saying that if it is forced underground then these girls will still attempt it but at considerably greater physical risk to themselves and their health. It’s a tough issue, IMO. I agree in principle with our government but the leftists do have a point.

    It’s a bit like the issue of “woman going home alone at 3 AM dressed in a miniskirt gets raped”. Of course, any decent moral stance wouldn’t blame the woman. Yet, pragmatically we must accept that the world isn’t perfect and she should’ve exercised better personal judgement. How to pull that off without sounding like an apologist for rapists isn’t easy. Similar balance here.

    • Replies: @Sher Singh
    @Thulean Friend

    Hope it turns into a cultural sovereignty issue & White Swedes mind their own business.


    Interesting that an Algerian-Belgian minister is attempting to impose European values on an Arab nation. The beginnings of a new era.
     
    Selection pressures go against more liberal politicians among POC.
    Racism hardens identity, and encourages cultural signaling toward the homeland.

    2nd or 3rd gen youth are often less liberal than elites back home.
    W Europe is just 10-15 years behind North America in demographics/identity issues.

    Wait and see.
    ---

    Do you think London has a British culture with its street gangs & reggae?
    What about the Banileus & their gangster rap?

    That's the future.
    Religious leaders will just learn to organize that mob the way early Christians did.

    , @silviosilver
    @Thulean Friend

    It is a question of cultural identity as much as a question of religion. Even when they secularize, they retain considerable anti-western/anti-white hostility. (The Moroccan rioters recently in the news were probably not religious fanatics.) How much is "considerable"? I don't know. Less than what the far right claims, but more than the rosy outlook of secularization theorists like yourself.

    , @Wrights
    @Thulean Friend


    [Muslim] Immigration has been very rapid, yet the percentage has moved up far more slowly over the last twenty years. This has led to accusations from the far-right that our demographers are “covering up our replacement”.

    But there’s a more simple way to square this circle. By some estimates, as many as 14% of the population could be classified as moslems by including this more liberal definition.
     
    Imagine being such a moron that you are unable to see that the best way to find out how many Muslims a country has with the help of a survey is simply asking "what is your religion", counting how many tick "Islam" and creating a percentage from this data... and also being genuinely shocked when non-retards (far-right) can see through this transparent sleight of hand from the surveyors to keep those Muslim totals down ie changing the definition of Muslim.

    But there’s a more simple way to square this circle (...) The way people are asked in some of these surveys can be quite strict (wrt to regular observances, mosque attendance etc) so that’s why this number is closer to 8-9%...

     

    And then coming up with the above embarrassingly moronic rationalisation.

    "Yeah Abdul/Muslimah you might be thinking that you are Muslim but listen, you barely go to the Mosque and drink wine from time to time so... we are not going to include you both in the Muslim population of Sweden"

    Not to talk about being such a muppet that you use "far-right" and "Latinx" unironically. What a lolcow.
  847. @A123
    The DNC Globalists are now on record against workers: (1)

    Unions Furious As Biden, Pelosi Push Bill To Avert Rail Strike

    Under pressure from President Biden, Speaker Pelosi said that House lawmakers will take up legislation on Wednesday to stop a nationwide strike by railroad workers by imposing a proposed contract that members at four railroad unions had rejected, saying Congress needs to intervene to prevent devastating job losses.


    “I don’t like going against the ability of unions to strike, but weighing the equities, we must avoid a strike. Jobs will be lost, even union jobs will be lost, water will not be safe, product will not be going to market,” she said.
     

     
    There is unusually high activity at MAGA campaign headquarters in Mar-a-Lago.

    Several channels with a good record of prognostication suggest that Trump will soon be making an announcement endorsing contract terms more favourable to Union workers. This is obviously not a done deal until we a hear it. However, 66%+ likely at this point. Keep your ears open.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.zerohedge.com/political/unions-furious-biden-pelosi-push-bill-avert-rail-strike

    Replies: @A123

    Several channels with a good record of prognostication suggest that Trump will soon be making an announcement endorsing contract terms more favourable to Union workers. This is obviously not a done deal until we a hear it. However, 66%+ likely at this point. Keep your ears open.

    So much for prognostication.

    The Bill passed the House (1). It is too late for Trump to advocate better conditions for workers. I do not know the reason for the balk. Anything that might backfire, causing coal & oil trains to stop, might have been seen as too risky with the cold season coming.

    MAGA showed at least a little pro-worker backbone opposing this gift to MegaCorporations, but I had hoped for more.

    PEACE 😇
    __________

    (1) https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11486839/House-PASSES-bill-stop-rail-strike-December-9-Biden-asked-Congress-step-in.html

     

  848. @Yahya
    @Yevardian


    On Egypt, it always struck me that I can’t think of a single native Egyptian actually ruling the country from the end of the Pharaohs until Nasser.
     
    Yes well Egypt’s fecklessness in the face of foreign occupiers is legendary; perhaps only rivaled by India. Apart from some failed rebellions here and there; Egyptians pretty much acquiesced to rule by non-natives for almost 2,300 years until Nasser’s overthrow of King Farouk. Most nations can’t even trace their history back 2,300 years.

    OTOH, Iran was likewise ruled by non-natives for a long period of time, maybe 1,200-1,300 years. The Pahlavi ruling dynasty of the 20th century was the first Persian ruling house of all Iran since the fall of the Sassanids in 650. So Egypt is not unique in the Islamic world. This has to do with Islam's peculiar ability to put religious identity ahead of ethnic identity, which i'll get to below.


    That history must pose challenges for a suitably patriotic school curriculum.
     
    Not really; most Egyptians tend to take a philosophical approach to these things. I remember being taught about Muhammad Ali Pasha’s reign in school in a very positive sense, also some lesser known Mamluk rulers like Baybars (Turkic Sultan who defeated Crusaders at famous battle of Ain Jalut), Qaitbay (Circassian Sultan who built spectacular architectural monuments across major cities of the Middle East), and Shajar al-Durr (slave girl of possible Bedouin, Circassian, Greek, Armenian or Turkic origin who rose to the throne of Egypt).

    Saladin is of course considered a national hero; his citadel sitting atop a hill overlooking the Old Cairo. There's also a mosque built by and named after Muhammad Ali within the confines of the citadel.


    https://www.cgarchitect.com/rails/active_storage/representations/proxy/eyJfcmFpbHMiOnsibWVzc2FnZSI6IkJBaHBBbkY3IiwiZXhwIjpudWxsLCJwdXIiOiJibG9iX2lkIn19--0a95fe9e0d491d3a0a201c5565ccdca40fba7b43/eyJfcmFpbHMiOnsibWVzc2FnZSI6IkJBaDdCem9VY21WemFYcGxYM1J2WDJ4cGJXbDBXd2RwQWxZRk1Eb0tjMkYyWlhKN0Jqb01jWFZoYkdsMGVXbGsiLCJleHAiOm51bGwsInB1ciI6InZhcmlhdGlvbiJ9fQ==--a140f81341e053a34b77dbf5e04e777cacb11aff/9dd882a7.jpg


    All of the above were viewed positively in my textbooks. The reason for this is simple. They were Muslims, which to many Egyptians takes precedence over their ethnic origins. I remember talking to my friend one time and he was saying "how the British colonial rule set Egypt back etc." and I responded by saying the Turks ruled Egypt for longer before the British did, he replied "yeah but these people are Arabs", by which he meant they were Muslims so it's fine. Not all Egyptians take this approach of course; some Arab nationalists believe the Turks are to blame for our decline. But the general view in Egypt is that non-ethnic Egyptian rulers were "our own" in a meaningful manner as long as they are Muslims. Copts may take a different view though.

    There's one exception to the Muslim rule, which is Cleopatra. Her name is plastered across several streets, buildings, hospitals, restaurants, corporations etc. all over Egypt. She is far and away the most celebrated Egyptian ruler over here. Probably not many Egyptians are even aware of her Greek/Macedonian background; she's viewed as "our own" queen. And I don't see why not really, she may have been Greek but Egypt gave her her name; somehow I doubt she would have achieved the everlasting fame she did had she stayed in Greece.

    Re, Muhammad Ali Pasha: he was definitely a capable, imaginative ruler and did much to industrialize Egypt and bring her back to prominence after a long period of obscurity under Ottoman rule. Still, his ambition got the better of him and he overshot by attempting to march on Constantinople. Perhaps it was a good decision at the time, for it is likely he would have succeeded had the British not intervened. Still, definitely not a good idea to take on the big dogs in such a manner. His taxation and conscription policies in Syria also backfired spectacularly. Personally I agree with George Antonious when he wrote that Muhammad Ali's son Ibrahim Pasha was the better of the two. The former seemed to be driven solely by personal ambition, while the latter had a genuine respect for Arabs and regarded himself as one, as was noted by French envoys to Egypt.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @Yevardian

  849. Sher Singh says:
    @Thulean Friend
    @Yahya


    Are MENA people in Europe generally becoming more socially liberal, or are these unrepresentative samples?
     
    Can only speak for Sweden and I would say generally yes, there is significant liberalisation but it also depends widely. The moslem community is exceptionally diverse both in terms of ethnicity (and thus cultural practices) as well as how long they've been here.

    One puzzle has been Sweden's very slow crawl upwards in terms of our moslem population in official surveys. Immigration has been very rapid, yet the percentage has moved up far more slowly over the last twenty years. This has led to accusations from the far-right that our demographers are "covering up our replacement".

    But there's a more simple way to square this circle; we now have many more "cultural moslems". By some estimates, as many as 14% of the population could be classified as moslems by including this more liberal definition. The way people are asked in some of these surveys can be quite strict (wrt to regular observances, mosque attendance etc) so that's why this number is closer to 8-9% in surveys. A significant percentage are basically liberal secularists who conveniently become moslem during ramadam (or even just during Eid).

    Anecdotally, it does gel with my personal experience. I saw lots of assimiliated moslem girls at my university. Befriended some and many had Swedish boyfriends. Though I still noticed a greater cultural aversion to casual sex, which is postive in my book. Swedish culture is a bit degenerative at times. As an aside, a Pakistani family moved in across the building from me. We met them at the bus-stop a few days ago, and didn't know they lived close to us before they told us their adress (very direct and un-Swedish!). The woman wore a hijab but her teenage daughter dressed completely Swedish. (And I'm not one who cares much about hijabs anyway. Niqab/Burka is a different story).

    Still, there's a bit of a backlash due to perceived excessive assimilation. A controversy which is brewing around so-called "virginity operations" where young girls who have lost their virginity will try to "restore" their hymen so as to raise their status in the marriage market. The current government is moving to criminalise these operations, but some leftist activists are saying that if it is forced underground then these girls will still attempt it but at considerably greater physical risk to themselves and their health. It's a tough issue, IMO. I agree in principle with our government but the leftists do have a point.

    It's a bit like the issue of "woman going home alone at 3 AM dressed in a miniskirt gets raped". Of course, any decent moral stance wouldn't blame the woman. Yet, pragmatically we must accept that the world isn't perfect and she should've exercised better personal judgement. How to pull that off without sounding like an apologist for rapists isn't easy. Similar balance here.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @silviosilver, @Wrights

    Hope it turns into a cultural sovereignty issue & White Swedes mind their own business.

    Interesting that an Algerian-Belgian minister is attempting to impose European values on an Arab nation. The beginnings of a new era.

    Selection pressures go against more liberal politicians among POC.
    Racism hardens identity, and encourages cultural signaling toward the homeland.

    2nd or 3rd gen youth are often less liberal than elites back home.
    W Europe is just 10-15 years behind North America in demographics/identity issues.

    Wait and see.

    Do you think London has a British culture with its street gangs & reggae?
    What about the Banileus & their gangster rap?

    That’s the future.
    Religious leaders will just learn to organize that mob the way early Christians did.

  850. @Thulean Friend
    @Yahya


    Are MENA people in Europe generally becoming more socially liberal, or are these unrepresentative samples?
     
    Can only speak for Sweden and I would say generally yes, there is significant liberalisation but it also depends widely. The moslem community is exceptionally diverse both in terms of ethnicity (and thus cultural practices) as well as how long they've been here.

    One puzzle has been Sweden's very slow crawl upwards in terms of our moslem population in official surveys. Immigration has been very rapid, yet the percentage has moved up far more slowly over the last twenty years. This has led to accusations from the far-right that our demographers are "covering up our replacement".

    But there's a more simple way to square this circle; we now have many more "cultural moslems". By some estimates, as many as 14% of the population could be classified as moslems by including this more liberal definition. The way people are asked in some of these surveys can be quite strict (wrt to regular observances, mosque attendance etc) so that's why this number is closer to 8-9% in surveys. A significant percentage are basically liberal secularists who conveniently become moslem during ramadam (or even just during Eid).

    Anecdotally, it does gel with my personal experience. I saw lots of assimiliated moslem girls at my university. Befriended some and many had Swedish boyfriends. Though I still noticed a greater cultural aversion to casual sex, which is postive in my book. Swedish culture is a bit degenerative at times. As an aside, a Pakistani family moved in across the building from me. We met them at the bus-stop a few days ago, and didn't know they lived close to us before they told us their adress (very direct and un-Swedish!). The woman wore a hijab but her teenage daughter dressed completely Swedish. (And I'm not one who cares much about hijabs anyway. Niqab/Burka is a different story).

    Still, there's a bit of a backlash due to perceived excessive assimilation. A controversy which is brewing around so-called "virginity operations" where young girls who have lost their virginity will try to "restore" their hymen so as to raise their status in the marriage market. The current government is moving to criminalise these operations, but some leftist activists are saying that if it is forced underground then these girls will still attempt it but at considerably greater physical risk to themselves and their health. It's a tough issue, IMO. I agree in principle with our government but the leftists do have a point.

    It's a bit like the issue of "woman going home alone at 3 AM dressed in a miniskirt gets raped". Of course, any decent moral stance wouldn't blame the woman. Yet, pragmatically we must accept that the world isn't perfect and she should've exercised better personal judgement. How to pull that off without sounding like an apologist for rapists isn't easy. Similar balance here.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @silviosilver, @Wrights

    It is a question of cultural identity as much as a question of religion. Even when they secularize, they retain considerable anti-western/anti-white hostility. (The Moroccan rioters recently in the news were probably not religious fanatics.) How much is “considerable”? I don’t know. Less than what the far right claims, but more than the rosy outlook of secularization theorists like yourself.

    • Agree: Sher Singh
  851. @Coconuts
    @Mikel


    Perhaps they bought the Nazis’ ideology of inferior races that needed to be exterminated or perhaps they didn’t care that much for ideologies but wanted to make thrmselves useful to their German allies leaving moral constraints aside. Both alternatives look more likely to me.
     
    I found Timothy Snyder's arguments in his book Bloodlands, that the mass revolutionary violence of the 1917-33 period in Ukraine helped produce a certain number of willing auxiliaries for the Nazis, pretty plausible.

    Both Nazism and the Soviet ideology in its revolutionary period seem to have had some similar features, the idea that history is determined by certain forms of struggle (racial/class), collective identities are more fundamental and relevant than individual ones, 'bourgeois' legal norms and customs must be suspended during the period of struggle, view that impersonal scientific laws determine collective behaviour, an elite must take the lead politically in the struggle etc. There was a fair bit written about this after WW2 in the 50s and 60s.

    Replies: @Mikel

    Those authors may be right but I don’t see an obvious connection between the rise of two ideologies that promote collective punishments and the revenge aspect that AP (and GR) argued for.

    If you are persecuted by people of an ideology that believes in violence against a class of citizens you don’t take revenge against those ideologues by adhering to a very different ideology that promotes violence against a totally different type of innocent people. Many people suffered Bolshevik and Communist oppression around the world but that turned very few of them into Nazis, even in the 30s-40s. The Spanish legionaries that joined Barbarosa were surely motivated by the Communist atrocities in the Spanish Civil War but they didn’t volunteer to kill Jewish civilians, only to continue fighting the Reds. And did the Latvians really experience a disproportionate amount of atrocities in the early USSR?

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @Mikel


    And did the Latvians really experience a disproportionate amount of atrocities in the early USSR?
     
    The key aspect is what happened in 1940/41, with mass deportations to the Gulag just before the German invasion (and btw, it's actually true that the Soviets were disproportionately favoured by the Jewish and Russian minorities, only the top levels of the Communist Party in Latvia during the occupation of 1940/41 were ethnically Latvian, it looked very different lower down. The Soviets also made a big show of standing against antisemitism). And when the Soviets retreated, the NKVD shot batches of prisoners (or killed them with grenades etc.) they couldn't take with them. This then featured prominently in German propaganda aimed at Baltic policemen, ex-military types etc., some of whom then took part in mass killings in Latvia and in the parts of the occupied Soviet Union like Belarus.
    Anyway, unlike what I'm (predictably enough) accused of my point wasn't to exculpate Germans or collectively condemn Latvians. It's much simpler: It's pretty braindead to use events of the 1940s to claim some special moral authority or special wisdom about what should be done in 2022. All the more so when your "nothing but victims and heroes" story about your own nation leaves out some well-known facts. Of course this applies even more to Ukrainians with their bizarro cult of Bandera and various terroristic mass murderers who butchered Poles in the tens of thousands, on their own initiative, without much German prodding.

    Replies: @German_reader

    , @Coconuts
    @Mikel


    If you are persecuted by people of an ideology that believes in violence against a class of citizens you don’t take revenge against those ideologues by adhering to a very different ideology that promotes violence against a totally different type of innocent people.
     
    I think the argument Snyder was making was somewhat different, because iirc the emphasis was on the way the various forms of mass terror in Ukraine in the 1917-33 period, and in 1937-38, created a psychological climate favourable to the use of violence against civilians on a mass and fairly indiscriminate scale by security forces.

    Nazi antisemitism emphasised the collective guilt of Jews for Bolshevism and the idea that 'it was in their blood', so they couldn't necessarily help supporting revolution, terrorism and all kinds of anti-Aryan activities, here you can see a mixture of emotional appeals to feelings of revenge and a more impersonal idea of curing society of an infection at the same time. Leninism had something similar, where the destruction of groups like Kulaks was just an example of material historical laws playing themselves out for the improvement of humanity.

    Afaik the Baltic case is related but different in that the Soviet terror activities were more concentrated in the 1939-41 period, but the Nazis used the same sort of antisemitic propaganda there, and the idea of revenge against the Bolsheviks on the part of Baltic nationalists might have been a more direct factor. Probably there was also the issue of partisan activity, as the Germans tended to believe Jewish civilians were a big support base for Red Army partisans.

    There is a good book about one of the German Order Police units involved in 'Jewish actions' called Ordinary Men by Christopher Browning. I don't know if anything similar has been done for any Baltic Auxiliary police units, but some of the explanations are probably applicable for both.

    Replies: @German_reader, @LatW

  852. @AP
    @Mikel


    “infants die in the Russian bombing”

    Not in the same targeted and deliberate way as during the massacres of Jews during WW2.
     

    Correct. And likewise, the Donbassers did not experience a fraction of the misery that the Balts were subjected to. So they don’t mind or justify the bombing of Kyiv but wouldn't (I hope) justify more brutal, personal acts.

    I need not have just mentioned AnoninTN. How many Brits, whose country had been subjected to German bombing of London and other cities, objected to the terror firebombing of Dresden and other German cities in which tens of thousands of civilians including children were incinerated alive?


    I’m just trying to understand those events and revenge for Bolshevik crimes doesn’t look too convincing. I doubt that most Holocaust collaborators had victims of those crimes in their immediate families, just like few German perpetrators had such close personal reasons to do what they did
     
    Here is how the Balts differed from the Germans. Given the sheer scale of Soviet atrocities it is likely that the Balt war criminals did experience deadly persecution among close family, friends, or neighbours. Whereas for Germans it was a matter of more abstract principles.

    So equalising the two is just wrong.


    If I saw people of a certain race disproportionately represented among the criminals victimizing members of my community
     
    It was more than merely overrepresentation among the Soviet administration. The other issue is that the local Jewish population, for very understandable reasons (obviously for Jews Stalin was a much lesser evil than Hitler), tended to support and favor the Bolsheviks. The locals noticed that as the Bolsheviks were killing and deporting their people.

    and I felt desires of revenge, I don’t think killing Nigerian or Ecuatorian infants would provide me any relief.
     
    Correct. As Coconuts pointed out, another factor is that people back then did think in more collectivistic terms than they do now. They may have viewed these victims as potential killers or (in the case of children) as future killers.

    perhaps they didn’t care that much for ideologies but wanted to make thrmselves useful to their German allies leaving moral constraints aside
     
    This was probably an additional factor. But I think most would not had done this unless the previous factors applied. Would those Latvians had agreed to commit atrocities against French, Poles, or others who were not associated with Soviet crimes against their people?

    So, I think that all of the main factors are covered here: rage and desire for revenge by victims; more collectivistic view of groups of people; and opportunism and encouragement by Nazi authorities, at the expense of people viewed as deadly or potentially deadly enemies.

    Replies: @Mikel

    Would those Latvians had agreed to commit atrocities against French, Poles, or others who were not associated with Soviet crimes against their people?

    Is that not exactly what happened? I’m not very sure about Latvians but many Ukrainians (Trawniki men) definitely took part in crimes against people from all around Europe that the Nazis gathered in Polish concentration camps. A good amount of the victims were not even Jews.

    • Replies: @AP
    @Mikel


    many Ukrainians (Trawniki men) definitely took part in crimes against people from all around Europe that the Nazis gathered in Polish concentration camps. A good amount of the victims were not even Jews.
     
    The Ukrainians in the German concentration camps located in Poland were not really volunteers. They were mostly Soviet POWs who were given the option of dying of starvation or exposure in the POW camps (not certain, but death rate was very high for Soviet POWs) or saving themselves by working in the concentration camps. Most of the victims were Jews. These guards had, as children, survived the 1930s forced starvation implemented by largely Russians and Jews and this may have explained their callousness or indifference towards Jewish victims in their "work."
  853. @Mikel
    @AP


    Would those Latvians had agreed to commit atrocities against French, Poles, or others who were not associated with Soviet crimes against their people?
     
    Is that not exactly what happened? I'm not very sure about Latvians but many Ukrainians (Trawniki men) definitely took part in crimes against people from all around Europe that the Nazis gathered in Polish concentration camps. A good amount of the victims were not even Jews.

    Replies: @AP

    many Ukrainians (Trawniki men) definitely took part in crimes against people from all around Europe that the Nazis gathered in Polish concentration camps. A good amount of the victims were not even Jews.

    The Ukrainians in the German concentration camps located in Poland were not really volunteers. They were mostly Soviet POWs who were given the option of dying of starvation or exposure in the POW camps (not certain, but death rate was very high for Soviet POWs) or saving themselves by working in the concentration camps. Most of the victims were Jews. These guards had, as children, survived the 1930s forced starvation implemented by largely Russians and Jews and this may have explained their callousness or indifference towards Jewish victims in their “work.”

  854. @AnonfromTN
    @AP


    For you, it is acceptable to bomb Kiev and kill it’s people (including children) because people in Kiev didn’t protest against bombing Donbas.
     
    It’s mostly a bunch of lies used by Ukie puppets to beg for more financial aid that they can steal. Interestingly, some US media said that Russian weapons are sub-par because they kill too few Ukrainian civilians. Typical sour grapes.

    FYI, Russia targets military installations, including the locations where Ukrainian troops are billeted, as well as power stations and industry installations producing and/or repairing weapons/ammo. In case you conveniently forgot, similar targets, plus residential areas and bridges, were bombed by NATO in Serbia. Even Chinese embassy in Belgrade was bombed.

    Now, a simple question: how many civilians were killed in Kiev by Russian rockets, and how many by malfunctioning/mistargeted Ukrainian anti-missile rockets, like those two unfortunate Poles recently?

    Replies: @AP, @Mr. Hack

    FYI, Russia targets military installations, including the locations where Ukrainian troops are billeted, as well as power stations and industry installations producing and/or repairing weapons/ammo. In case you conveniently forgot, similar targets, plus residential areas and bridges, were bombed by NATO in Serbia. Even Chinese embassy in Belgrade was bombed.

    According to the UN about 7,000 civilians have been conformed killed as a result of the Russian invasion, but UN states that the real number is far higher.

    Yugoslavia claims that 1,200-2,000 civilians were killed by NATO.

    So the Russia State has killed several times more Ukrainians than NATO killed Serbs.

    But I guess you made some progress by comparing Russia to NATO.

    Now, a simple question: how many civilians were killed in Kiev by Russian rockets, and how many by malfunctioning/mistargeted Ukrainian anti-missile rockets

    This makes no difference in terms of culpability. If someone breaks into your house, shoots at you, you shoot back and mistakenly kill one of your family, it is the fault of the person that broke in that your loved one is dead, and not your fault.

    As I said, and as you insist on proving, you are of the same kind as those Latvians who didn’t mind killing Jews because Jews had killed Latvians. Likewise, you don’t mind bombing of Ukrainians because Ukrainians have bombed Donbassers.

    • Replies: @Mikhail
    @AP

    False equivalency as Yugo in 1999 didn't use civilians/civilian infrastructure as human shields like the corrupt, undemocratic and neo-Nazi influenced Kiev regime, which has blood on its hands before and after 2/24/22.

    Overall, the JNA in 1999 behaved better than the Kiev regime Interior Ministry affiliated militias and a portion of the AFU.

    , @AnonfromTN
    @AP

    Another day in Donetsk, the city that never submitted to Banderites. Today Ukie shells hit a kindergarten, a hotel, and some residential buildings. Luckily, today in Donetsk no civilians were killed. Some sources claim that Ukies are low on artillery ammo. Yet that does not prevent them from targeting things that have no military value.

    The list of war crimes of post-coup Kiev regime keeps growing ever since it started aggression against Donbass in 2014. The scum should remember that there is no statute of limitations on prosecution for war crimes.

    Replies: @AP

  855. @Yahya
    @Yevardian


    On Egypt, it always struck me that I can’t think of a single native Egyptian actually ruling the country from the end of the Pharaohs until Nasser.
     
    Yes well Egypt’s fecklessness in the face of foreign occupiers is legendary; perhaps only rivaled by India. Apart from some failed rebellions here and there; Egyptians pretty much acquiesced to rule by non-natives for almost 2,300 years until Nasser’s overthrow of King Farouk. Most nations can’t even trace their history back 2,300 years.

    OTOH, Iran was likewise ruled by non-natives for a long period of time, maybe 1,200-1,300 years. The Pahlavi ruling dynasty of the 20th century was the first Persian ruling house of all Iran since the fall of the Sassanids in 650. So Egypt is not unique in the Islamic world. This has to do with Islam's peculiar ability to put religious identity ahead of ethnic identity, which i'll get to below.


    That history must pose challenges for a suitably patriotic school curriculum.
     
    Not really; most Egyptians tend to take a philosophical approach to these things. I remember being taught about Muhammad Ali Pasha’s reign in school in a very positive sense, also some lesser known Mamluk rulers like Baybars (Turkic Sultan who defeated Crusaders at famous battle of Ain Jalut), Qaitbay (Circassian Sultan who built spectacular architectural monuments across major cities of the Middle East), and Shajar al-Durr (slave girl of possible Bedouin, Circassian, Greek, Armenian or Turkic origin who rose to the throne of Egypt).

    Saladin is of course considered a national hero; his citadel sitting atop a hill overlooking the Old Cairo. There's also a mosque built by and named after Muhammad Ali within the confines of the citadel.


    https://www.cgarchitect.com/rails/active_storage/representations/proxy/eyJfcmFpbHMiOnsibWVzc2FnZSI6IkJBaHBBbkY3IiwiZXhwIjpudWxsLCJwdXIiOiJibG9iX2lkIn19--0a95fe9e0d491d3a0a201c5565ccdca40fba7b43/eyJfcmFpbHMiOnsibWVzc2FnZSI6IkJBaDdCem9VY21WemFYcGxYM1J2WDJ4cGJXbDBXd2RwQWxZRk1Eb0tjMkYyWlhKN0Jqb01jWFZoYkdsMGVXbGsiLCJleHAiOm51bGwsInB1ciI6InZhcmlhdGlvbiJ9fQ==--a140f81341e053a34b77dbf5e04e777cacb11aff/9dd882a7.jpg


    All of the above were viewed positively in my textbooks. The reason for this is simple. They were Muslims, which to many Egyptians takes precedence over their ethnic origins. I remember talking to my friend one time and he was saying "how the British colonial rule set Egypt back etc." and I responded by saying the Turks ruled Egypt for longer before the British did, he replied "yeah but these people are Arabs", by which he meant they were Muslims so it's fine. Not all Egyptians take this approach of course; some Arab nationalists believe the Turks are to blame for our decline. But the general view in Egypt is that non-ethnic Egyptian rulers were "our own" in a meaningful manner as long as they are Muslims. Copts may take a different view though.

    There's one exception to the Muslim rule, which is Cleopatra. Her name is plastered across several streets, buildings, hospitals, restaurants, corporations etc. all over Egypt. She is far and away the most celebrated Egyptian ruler over here. Probably not many Egyptians are even aware of her Greek/Macedonian background; she's viewed as "our own" queen. And I don't see why not really, she may have been Greek but Egypt gave her her name; somehow I doubt she would have achieved the everlasting fame she did had she stayed in Greece.

    Re, Muhammad Ali Pasha: he was definitely a capable, imaginative ruler and did much to industrialize Egypt and bring her back to prominence after a long period of obscurity under Ottoman rule. Still, his ambition got the better of him and he overshot by attempting to march on Constantinople. Perhaps it was a good decision at the time, for it is likely he would have succeeded had the British not intervened. Still, definitely not a good idea to take on the big dogs in such a manner. His taxation and conscription policies in Syria also backfired spectacularly. Personally I agree with George Antonious when he wrote that Muhammad Ali's son Ibrahim Pasha was the better of the two. The former seemed to be driven solely by personal ambition, while the latter had a genuine respect for Arabs and regarded himself as one, as was noted by French envoys to Egypt.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @Yevardian

    OTOH, Iran was likewise ruled by non-natives for a long period of time, maybe 1,200-1,300 years. The Pahlavi ruling dynasty of the 20th century was the first Persian ruling house of all Iran since the fall of the Sassanids in 650.

    There a few mistakes here, I’ll try being brief. Edit: Just noticed you mentioned ‘all Iran’, which might render my point moot. Although the independent Persian Buyids and Samanids definitely ruled territories the same size or larger as the Iran’s contemporary borders.

    Right after the Arab-Islamic conquest/internal overthrow of the Sasanid Empire numerous local Zoroastrian dynasties declared independence around Mazandaran (the Caspian litoral) which continued to fight the Ummayads for over a century. E.g. the Bavandis, Dabuyidis, Paduspandis, etc.
    The area later became a haven for both Shiism and various Islamic heresies of all kinds, though the rest of Iran was Sunni until the Safavids forcibly converted the country in the 1500s.

    Local Muslim dynasties of Persian origin appear from the 9th Century, though earlier ones like the Tahirids and Saffarids never declared outright independence, the (Shia) Buyids actually conquered Baghdad and allowed the nominal Abbasid ‘Caliph’ to continue as a puppet, the first of many.
    At the same time there were the Samanids in Khorasan, which although outside Iran-proper today, was the cultural heartland of Persian culture during this period. Ferdowsi and Avicenna lived under the Samanids, who were by origin Zoroastrian ‘converts’ to Islam, though its obvious they were simply nobles that wanted to retain their privileges.

    But yeah, after the ‘Iranian Intermezzo’ as this period is called, its mostly dynasties of Turkic origin, just as the Arab world was also being politically taken over by Turks. Still, after the Safavids there were the eastern-Iranian Zands, although they were a brief & unsuccessful dynasty.
    Finally, the parvenue founder of the Pahlavis, Reza Shah, was half-Georgian.

    I remember talking to my friend one time and he was saying “how the British colonial rule set Egypt back etc.” and I responded by saying the Turks ruled Egypt for longer before the British did, he replied “yeah but these people are Arabs”, by which he meant they were Muslims so it’s fine.

    Lol. Islam really is a genius psychological tool for enforcing Arab supremacism, if nothing else. You know Ahmadinejad got in serious trouble from the Mullahs a while ago, for espousing the views of clerics that were denounced as heretical, because they were far more Persian nationalist than ‘Islamic’?

  856. @songbird
    That wacko überfreak that Biden hired for the energy department recently stole a women's purse, at an airport.

    https://twitter.com/MrAndyNgo/status/1597360606533029888?s=20&t=jv1bgXnyf_wCrhPMsmKNNA

    Replies: @A123, @S

    That wacko überfreak that Biden hired for the energy department recently stole a women’s purse, at an airport.

    He looks like one of the Talosians in the very first (albeit ultimately aborted) episode of Star Trek. 🙂

    From the same intended original pilot episode of Star Trek filmed almost exactly 58 years ago in late 1964, it’s interesting to see just how healthy people looked then..

    • LOL: songbird
    • Replies: @Yevardian
    @S


    From the same intended original pilot episode of Star Trek filmed almost exactly 58 years ago in late 1964, it’s interesting to see just how healthy people looked then..
     
    They're actors...

    Replies: @songbird, @S

  857. @S
    @songbird


    That wacko überfreak that Biden hired for the energy department recently stole a women’s purse, at an airport.
     
    He looks like one of the Talosians in the very first (albeit ultimately aborted) episode of Star Trek. :-)


    https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-5v8yY4EC1KA/Uv6W4CtBV1I/AAAAAAAAAlc/6MD8sl5GUek/s1600/cage-talosian-718794.jpg


    From the same intended original pilot episode of Star Trek filmed almost exactly 58 years ago in late 1964, it's interesting to see just how healthy people looked then..


    https://alchetron.com/cdn/the-cage-star-trek-the-original-series-bfefbf1b-65d6-4bf7-a7cb-3e86c4749b6-resize-750.jpeg

    Replies: @Yevardian

    From the same intended original pilot episode of Star Trek filmed almost exactly 58 years ago in late 1964, it’s interesting to see just how healthy people looked then..

    They’re actors…

    • Troll: S
    • Replies: @songbird
    @Yevardian

    To a certain extent, I think the aesthetic of the show resembled the aesthetic of the intended audience. If not perfectly, then impressionistically.

    Star Trek TOS was designed for a general audience of the '60s. The general population at that time was younger, higher T, bolder, and more dynamic. This might in someway be reflected in the strong male characters, the miniskirts and skimpy costumes for females, and the snappy dialogue.

    The series failed for a general audience, but became a cult hit in syndication, for a geekier audience. This may have been the first diminution in aesthetic, affecting later shows.

    The next show, Star Trek TNG came out in the '80s. Arguably, it was intended for this narrower, geekier audience. Perhaps, built to take advantage of nostalgia, so that makes the audience older, as well as the average age of Americans was older. They had less T, were less assertive, and I think you can start to see this creep into the show a bit. The captain is older. Only one character wore a miniskirt and not for long. Another female character though not ugly was given a masculine haircut and masculine characteristics. A guy in the background in a few episodes wore a dress. They had an episode with a sort of tranny alien.

    Now they have multiple Star Trek shows running. (Haven't seen them, but I know of them) One of them stars the same captain from TNG, now an octogenarian. Another crew member was a bombshell on a Trek show from the '90s. She looks good for her age, but is old. The women are on the whole, dumpier and frumpier. There are gay and tranny characters on one show. Stacey Abrams was the global president on another.

    IMO, in some way, this reflects the changes to the general population.

    , @S
    @Yevardian



    From the same intended original pilot episode of Star Trek filmed almost exactly 58 years ago in late 1964, it’s interesting to see just how healthy people looked then..
     
    They’re actors…
     
    Ummm, yes...state the obvious. What's your point?

    What I said still stands.

    As actors, aka people, they look healthier than today's actors, aka people.

    Feel better now?
  858. @AP
    @AnonfromTN


    FYI, Russia targets military installations, including the locations where Ukrainian troops are billeted, as well as power stations and industry installations producing and/or repairing weapons/ammo. In case you conveniently forgot, similar targets, plus residential areas and bridges, were bombed by NATO in Serbia. Even Chinese embassy in Belgrade was bombed.
     
    According to the UN about 7,000 civilians have been conformed killed as a result of the Russian invasion, but UN states that the real number is far higher.

    Yugoslavia claims that 1,200-2,000 civilians were killed by NATO.

    So the Russia State has killed several times more Ukrainians than NATO killed Serbs.

    But I guess you made some progress by comparing Russia to NATO.

    Now, a simple question: how many civilians were killed in Kiev by Russian rockets, and how many by malfunctioning/mistargeted Ukrainian anti-missile rockets
     
    This makes no difference in terms of culpability. If someone breaks into your house, shoots at you, you shoot back and mistakenly kill one of your family, it is the fault of the person that broke in that your loved one is dead, and not your fault.

    As I said, and as you insist on proving, you are of the same kind as those Latvians who didn't mind killing Jews because Jews had killed Latvians. Likewise, you don't mind bombing of Ukrainians because Ukrainians have bombed Donbassers.

    Replies: @Mikhail, @AnonfromTN

    False equivalency as Yugo in 1999 didn’t use civilians/civilian infrastructure as human shields like the corrupt, undemocratic and neo-Nazi influenced Kiev regime, which has blood on its hands before and after 2/24/22.

    Overall, the JNA in 1999 behaved better than the Kiev regime Interior Ministry affiliated militias and a portion of the AFU.

  859. @AnonfromTN
    @AP


    For you, it is acceptable to bomb Kiev and kill it’s people (including children) because people in Kiev didn’t protest against bombing Donbas.
     
    It’s mostly a bunch of lies used by Ukie puppets to beg for more financial aid that they can steal. Interestingly, some US media said that Russian weapons are sub-par because they kill too few Ukrainian civilians. Typical sour grapes.

    FYI, Russia targets military installations, including the locations where Ukrainian troops are billeted, as well as power stations and industry installations producing and/or repairing weapons/ammo. In case you conveniently forgot, similar targets, plus residential areas and bridges, were bombed by NATO in Serbia. Even Chinese embassy in Belgrade was bombed.

    Now, a simple question: how many civilians were killed in Kiev by Russian rockets, and how many by malfunctioning/mistargeted Ukrainian anti-missile rockets, like those two unfortunate Poles recently?

    Replies: @AP, @Mr. Hack

    For you, it is acceptable to bomb Kiev and kill it’s people (including children) because people in Kiev didn’t protest against bombing Donbas.

    It’s mostly a bunch of lies used by Ukie puppets to beg for more financial aid that they can steal.

    Really? Where did “Ukie puppets” use the idea that because they didn’t protest the bombing of Donbas, they were entitled to financial aid (so “that “they can steal” it)? Your personal fantasies are interfering with your abilities to counter AP’s claim, or is it just your inability to properly express yourself?

  860. @Yevardian
    @S


    From the same intended original pilot episode of Star Trek filmed almost exactly 58 years ago in late 1964, it’s interesting to see just how healthy people looked then..
     
    They're actors...

    Replies: @songbird, @S

    To a certain extent, I think the aesthetic of the show resembled the aesthetic of the intended audience. If not perfectly, then impressionistically.

    Star Trek TOS was designed for a general audience of the ’60s. The general population at that time was younger, higher T, bolder, and more dynamic. This might in someway be reflected in the strong male characters, the miniskirts and skimpy costumes for females, and the snappy dialogue.

    The series failed for a general audience, but became a cult hit in syndication, for a geekier audience. This may have been the first diminution in aesthetic, affecting later shows.

    [MORE]

    The next show, Star Trek TNG came out in the ’80s. Arguably, it was intended for this narrower, geekier audience. Perhaps, built to take advantage of nostalgia, so that makes the audience older, as well as the average age of Americans was older. They had less T, were less assertive, and I think you can start to see this creep into the show a bit. The captain is older. Only one character wore a miniskirt and not for long. Another female character though not ugly was given a masculine haircut and masculine characteristics. A guy in the background in a few episodes wore a dress. They had an episode with a sort of tranny alien.

    Now they have multiple Star Trek shows running. (Haven’t seen them, but I know of them) One of them stars the same captain from TNG, now an octogenarian. Another crew member was a bombshell on a Trek show from the ’90s. She looks good for her age, but is old. The women are on the whole, dumpier and frumpier. There are gay and tranny characters on one show. Stacey Abrams was the global president on another.

    IMO, in some way, this reflects the changes to the general population.

    • Thanks: S
  861. @AP
    @AnonfromTN


    FYI, Russia targets military installations, including the locations where Ukrainian troops are billeted, as well as power stations and industry installations producing and/or repairing weapons/ammo. In case you conveniently forgot, similar targets, plus residential areas and bridges, were bombed by NATO in Serbia. Even Chinese embassy in Belgrade was bombed.
     
    According to the UN about 7,000 civilians have been conformed killed as a result of the Russian invasion, but UN states that the real number is far higher.

    Yugoslavia claims that 1,200-2,000 civilians were killed by NATO.

    So the Russia State has killed several times more Ukrainians than NATO killed Serbs.

    But I guess you made some progress by comparing Russia to NATO.

    Now, a simple question: how many civilians were killed in Kiev by Russian rockets, and how many by malfunctioning/mistargeted Ukrainian anti-missile rockets
     
    This makes no difference in terms of culpability. If someone breaks into your house, shoots at you, you shoot back and mistakenly kill one of your family, it is the fault of the person that broke in that your loved one is dead, and not your fault.

    As I said, and as you insist on proving, you are of the same kind as those Latvians who didn't mind killing Jews because Jews had killed Latvians. Likewise, you don't mind bombing of Ukrainians because Ukrainians have bombed Donbassers.

    Replies: @Mikhail, @AnonfromTN

    Another day in Donetsk, the city that never submitted to Banderites. Today Ukie shells hit a kindergarten, a hotel, and some residential buildings. Luckily, today in Donetsk no civilians were killed. Some sources claim that Ukies are low on artillery ammo. Yet that does not prevent them from targeting things that have no military value.

    The list of war crimes of post-coup Kiev regime keeps growing ever since it started aggression against Donbass in 2014. The scum should remember that there is no statute of limitations on prosecution for war crimes.

    • Replies: @AP
    @AnonfromTN

    And no doubt you use this as an excuse to justify your side killing civilians in non-Russian ruled Ukraine.

  862. @AnonfromTN
    @AP

    Another day in Donetsk, the city that never submitted to Banderites. Today Ukie shells hit a kindergarten, a hotel, and some residential buildings. Luckily, today in Donetsk no civilians were killed. Some sources claim that Ukies are low on artillery ammo. Yet that does not prevent them from targeting things that have no military value.

    The list of war crimes of post-coup Kiev regime keeps growing ever since it started aggression against Donbass in 2014. The scum should remember that there is no statute of limitations on prosecution for war crimes.

    Replies: @AP

    And no doubt you use this as an excuse to justify your side killing civilians in non-Russian ruled Ukraine.

  863. @Yevardian
    @S


    From the same intended original pilot episode of Star Trek filmed almost exactly 58 years ago in late 1964, it’s interesting to see just how healthy people looked then..
     
    They're actors...

    Replies: @songbird, @S

    From the same intended original pilot episode of Star Trek filmed almost exactly 58 years ago in late 1964, it’s interesting to see just how healthy people looked then..

    They’re actors…

    Ummm, yes…state the obvious. What’s your point?

    What I said still stands.

    As actors, aka people, they look healthier than today’s actors, aka people.

    Feel better now?

  864. Hey, you want to point at 60s Star Trek casting as evidence of the greatness of the ancients, that’s your choice, sir.

  865. @Thulean Friend
    @Yahya


    Are MENA people in Europe generally becoming more socially liberal, or are these unrepresentative samples?
     
    Can only speak for Sweden and I would say generally yes, there is significant liberalisation but it also depends widely. The moslem community is exceptionally diverse both in terms of ethnicity (and thus cultural practices) as well as how long they've been here.

    One puzzle has been Sweden's very slow crawl upwards in terms of our moslem population in official surveys. Immigration has been very rapid, yet the percentage has moved up far more slowly over the last twenty years. This has led to accusations from the far-right that our demographers are "covering up our replacement".

    But there's a more simple way to square this circle; we now have many more "cultural moslems". By some estimates, as many as 14% of the population could be classified as moslems by including this more liberal definition. The way people are asked in some of these surveys can be quite strict (wrt to regular observances, mosque attendance etc) so that's why this number is closer to 8-9% in surveys. A significant percentage are basically liberal secularists who conveniently become moslem during ramadam (or even just during Eid).

    Anecdotally, it does gel with my personal experience. I saw lots of assimiliated moslem girls at my university. Befriended some and many had Swedish boyfriends. Though I still noticed a greater cultural aversion to casual sex, which is postive in my book. Swedish culture is a bit degenerative at times. As an aside, a Pakistani family moved in across the building from me. We met them at the bus-stop a few days ago, and didn't know they lived close to us before they told us their adress (very direct and un-Swedish!). The woman wore a hijab but her teenage daughter dressed completely Swedish. (And I'm not one who cares much about hijabs anyway. Niqab/Burka is a different story).

    Still, there's a bit of a backlash due to perceived excessive assimilation. A controversy which is brewing around so-called "virginity operations" where young girls who have lost their virginity will try to "restore" their hymen so as to raise their status in the marriage market. The current government is moving to criminalise these operations, but some leftist activists are saying that if it is forced underground then these girls will still attempt it but at considerably greater physical risk to themselves and their health. It's a tough issue, IMO. I agree in principle with our government but the leftists do have a point.

    It's a bit like the issue of "woman going home alone at 3 AM dressed in a miniskirt gets raped". Of course, any decent moral stance wouldn't blame the woman. Yet, pragmatically we must accept that the world isn't perfect and she should've exercised better personal judgement. How to pull that off without sounding like an apologist for rapists isn't easy. Similar balance here.

    Replies: @Sher Singh, @silviosilver, @Wrights

    [Muslim] Immigration has been very rapid, yet the percentage has moved up far more slowly over the last twenty years. This has led to accusations from the far-right that our demographers are “covering up our replacement”.

    But there’s a more simple way to square this circle. By some estimates, as many as 14% of the population could be classified as moslems by including this more liberal definition.

    Imagine being such a moron that you are unable to see that the best way to find out how many Muslims a country has with the help of a survey is simply asking “what is your religion”, counting how many tick “Islam” and creating a percentage from this data… and also being genuinely shocked when non-retards (far-right) can see through this transparent sleight of hand from the surveyors to keep those Muslim totals down ie changing the definition of Muslim.

    But there’s a more simple way to square this circle (…) The way people are asked in some of these surveys can be quite strict (wrt to regular observances, mosque attendance etc) so that’s why this number is closer to 8-9%…

    And then coming up with the above embarrassingly moronic rationalisation.

    “Yeah Abdul/Muslimah you might be thinking that you are Muslim but listen, you barely go to the Mosque and drink wine from time to time so… we are not going to include you both in the Muslim population of Sweden”

    Not to talk about being such a muppet that you use “far-right” and “Latinx” unironically. What a lolcow.

  866. German_reader says:
    @Mikel
    @Coconuts

    Those authors may be right but I don't see an obvious connection between the rise of two ideologies that promote collective punishments and the revenge aspect that AP (and GR) argued for.

    If you are persecuted by people of an ideology that believes in violence against a class of citizens you don't take revenge against those ideologues by adhering to a very different ideology that promotes violence against a totally different type of innocent people. Many people suffered Bolshevik and Communist oppression around the world but that turned very few of them into Nazis, even in the 30s-40s. The Spanish legionaries that joined Barbarosa were surely motivated by the Communist atrocities in the Spanish Civil War but they didn't volunteer to kill Jewish civilians, only to continue fighting the Reds. And did the Latvians really experience a disproportionate amount of atrocities in the early USSR?

    Replies: @German_reader, @Coconuts

    And did the Latvians really experience a disproportionate amount of atrocities in the early USSR?

    The key aspect is what happened in 1940/41, with mass deportations to the Gulag just before the German invasion (and btw, it’s actually true that the Soviets were disproportionately favoured by the Jewish and Russian minorities, only the top levels of the Communist Party in Latvia during the occupation of 1940/41 were ethnically Latvian, it looked very different lower down. The Soviets also made a big show of standing against antisemitism). And when the Soviets retreated, the NKVD shot batches of prisoners (or killed them with grenades etc.) they couldn’t take with them. This then featured prominently in German propaganda aimed at Baltic policemen, ex-military types etc., some of whom then took part in mass killings in Latvia and in the parts of the occupied Soviet Union like Belarus.
    Anyway, unlike what I’m (predictably enough) accused of my point wasn’t to exculpate Germans or collectively condemn Latvians. It’s much simpler: It’s pretty braindead to use events of the 1940s to claim some special moral authority or special wisdom about what should be done in 2022. All the more so when your “nothing but victims and heroes” story about your own nation leaves out some well-known facts. Of course this applies even more to Ukrainians with their bizarro cult of Bandera and various terroristic mass murderers who butchered Poles in the tens of thousands, on their own initiative, without much German prodding.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @German_reader

    Btw, since AP always tells me that Melnyk was an efficient diplomat with his insolent behaviour (it "worked" in Germany after all), his recent appointment to deputy foreign minister wasn't exactly popular with Poles:
    https://notesfrompoland.com/2022/11/23/anger-in-warsaw-over-ukraine-appointing-minister-who-denied-wartime-massacre-of-poles/

    Replies: @AP

  867. @German_reader
    @Mikel


    And did the Latvians really experience a disproportionate amount of atrocities in the early USSR?
     
    The key aspect is what happened in 1940/41, with mass deportations to the Gulag just before the German invasion (and btw, it's actually true that the Soviets were disproportionately favoured by the Jewish and Russian minorities, only the top levels of the Communist Party in Latvia during the occupation of 1940/41 were ethnically Latvian, it looked very different lower down. The Soviets also made a big show of standing against antisemitism). And when the Soviets retreated, the NKVD shot batches of prisoners (or killed them with grenades etc.) they couldn't take with them. This then featured prominently in German propaganda aimed at Baltic policemen, ex-military types etc., some of whom then took part in mass killings in Latvia and in the parts of the occupied Soviet Union like Belarus.
    Anyway, unlike what I'm (predictably enough) accused of my point wasn't to exculpate Germans or collectively condemn Latvians. It's much simpler: It's pretty braindead to use events of the 1940s to claim some special moral authority or special wisdom about what should be done in 2022. All the more so when your "nothing but victims and heroes" story about your own nation leaves out some well-known facts. Of course this applies even more to Ukrainians with their bizarro cult of Bandera and various terroristic mass murderers who butchered Poles in the tens of thousands, on their own initiative, without much German prodding.

    Replies: @German_reader

    Btw, since AP always tells me that Melnyk was an efficient diplomat with his insolent behaviour (it “worked” in Germany after all), his recent appointment to deputy foreign minister wasn’t exactly popular with Poles:
    https://notesfrompoland.com/2022/11/23/anger-in-warsaw-over-ukraine-appointing-minister-who-denied-wartime-massacre-of-poles/

    • Replies: @AP
    @German_reader

    I agree with you on this. He should have been limited to work with Germany, where he was effective. This was a bad move.

  868. German_reader says:
    @AP
    @German_reader


    whereas Balts are just victims

    No, they aren’t.
     

    Yes they are. Their countries were forcibly annexed by the Soviets, they were murdered and deported in large numbers, and were being replaced by Russian and Russian-speaking colonists.

    You mentioned Red Riflemen yourself.
     
    Latvians were not 100% innocent, unlike Lithuanians and Estonians. Although this case is more ambiguous than that of the Germans from the lost territories. Latvians supported the Bolsheviks because they wanted to be independent, Germans in East Prussia and Danzig supported the Nazis in part because they wanted to rule eastern Europeans and take their land (this was a major part of the Nazi program).

    Latvians supposedly also had the highest per capita rate of Holocaust perpetrators
     
    Probably revenge for the Bolshevik nightmare, as you implied.

    I once even used to have some sympathy for Balts because of their historical experiences. I don’t anymore given their unhinged behaviour during the current crisis
     
    Strong support for the victim of murderous Russian aggression is "unhinged?"

    Safety for the Baltic republics lies in the NATO forces stationed there, even if they’re merely tripwire forces, they’d almost certainly ensure a strong reaction in case of a Russian invasion (and I haven’t yet seen a plausible scenario why Russia would want to invade the Baltic states anyway).
     
    Someone else had posted Russian threats. Baltic republics are inconvenient due to Kaliningrad. And two of them have large Russian populations.

    Ukraine is fighting for herself, for nobody else
     
    By fighting for herself, Ukraine fights for Russia's other neighbors.

    Replies: @Mikel, @German_reader

    Strong support for the victim of murderous Russian aggression is “unhinged?”

    The Balts don’t matter much in material terms. Their “support” consists in verbal extremism that has a good chance of getting us all killed if it becomes policy. An example: Latvia’s minister of defense just demanded that Ukraine be given the “right” to attack RF territory (meaning, presumably, pre-2014 RF territory) to stop the missile strikes against Ukraine. Of course Ukraine already has that “right” in the abstract, so what he really means is that Ukraine should be given the means (long-range missiles) and the intelligence support by NATO to do so. And if NATO directly aided in attacking Russia proper, then we would indeed be getting inexorably closer towards nuclear armaggeddon.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @German_reader


    The Balts don’t matter much in material terms.
     
    This is for Ukrainians on the ground to judge and they will disagree with you (the Balts have sent hundreds of millions worth of items, cash, drones, etc, over 100K refugees settled). The Balts provided assistance at a crucial moment when others weren't providing it. This will be analyzed at some point but the initial events around Kyiv proved quite important (and that's when the Balts provided Javelin, etc, together with the British & Polish, of course).

    As to the events of WW2, the head of the NKVD in Latvia was a Jew named Semyon Shustin - so a Russian Jew, from Russia, was brought in to torture and slaughter Latvians. This happened in 1940 so before the German occupation. Before the war, the Jewish situation in the Baltics was not that bad (there were, of course, those Jews who were harmful Commies, but there were a ton of great, talented Jews that contributed greatly in various non-contraversial professions who perished and it was a big loss) . The Latvians had to push out the Commies by force in 1920.

    German propaganda aimed at Baltic policemen, ex-military types etc., some of whom then took part in mass killings in Latvia
     
    You leave out in what capacity. Most of the actual shooting was done by the German nationals from the SD. There were trials on members of Arajs Kommando in the West and the truth is that results are rather scarce. I'm not trying to deny anything, of course they were there (although it hasn't been all that easy to ID them all or even most, very few names available, tbh) and probably doing some of the shooting in some cases (and that they were involved on the logistical side is bad enough especially in the far out and smaller towns), but it's just that there is a lot of speculation but not much in terms of real evidence (even the historian who has over the years been quoted the most on these matters, Andrew Ezergailis, just recently admitted that a lot of this cannot be proven which is quite scandalous, imo). We seem to forget a lot here that there were first and foremost actual German nationals - on all levels - who organized and carried this out. And the German occupation was severe. The mobilization into the Legion was illegal by international law (only some of it was voluntary participation and that, too, should be totally understandable given the circumstances).

    Let me just say for those here who claim to be supporting Russian Whites (I'm thinking of AP mainly) but shy away from the German units in WW2 - an interesting fact is that those Latvian officers who led the Legion in the 1940s had previously served in the Russian Imperial Army (and had fought in WW1 for Russia, and had fought on the side of the Whites during the Civil War, and had been awarded the crosses of St George). So be careful who you chastise.

    Not to get into the topic of WW1 & Soviet communism (including the riflemen), but suffice it to say that the Soviets were founded already around the time of the Revolution of 1905 (or were in the process of being created, of course, they were not as prominent as in 1917 and were often exiled).

    Lenin, Stalin & Trotsky were active already then (these are all well known facts - there were countless red organizations that were supported by the Russian masses and even the growing middle class wasn't always happy with the Tsar). The Russian anarchists were active in the late 19th century. All of these processes started way before the Latvian Riflemen. Finns assassinated their Russian governor as a response to heavy Russification (and were deemed a national hero in Finland) and there were plenty of other attacks on the Tsar's officials. Of course, even during the times of the 1905 revolution, areas such as Poland, Baltics, Finland were restless, it is obvious that the more European parts were not ok with how things were... but also the whole of the Empire.

    Georgy Gapon who led the procession in 1905 during what turned into the Bloody Sunday and who fraternized with socialists, was in fact Ukrainian. We can find a lot of lesser known facts here as well that will show "culpability" of many ethnicities (if one is inclined to approach things in such a manner). Anyway, for those who feel like judging certain historic characters, you might want to keep things in the context.

    Replies: @German_reader

  869. @Mikel
    @Coconuts

    Those authors may be right but I don't see an obvious connection between the rise of two ideologies that promote collective punishments and the revenge aspect that AP (and GR) argued for.

    If you are persecuted by people of an ideology that believes in violence against a class of citizens you don't take revenge against those ideologues by adhering to a very different ideology that promotes violence against a totally different type of innocent people. Many people suffered Bolshevik and Communist oppression around the world but that turned very few of them into Nazis, even in the 30s-40s. The Spanish legionaries that joined Barbarosa were surely motivated by the Communist atrocities in the Spanish Civil War but they didn't volunteer to kill Jewish civilians, only to continue fighting the Reds. And did the Latvians really experience a disproportionate amount of atrocities in the early USSR?

    Replies: @German_reader, @Coconuts

    If you are persecuted by people of an ideology that believes in violence against a class of citizens you don’t take revenge against those ideologues by adhering to a very different ideology that promotes violence against a totally different type of innocent people.

    I think the argument Snyder was making was somewhat different, because iirc the emphasis was on the way the various forms of mass terror in Ukraine in the 1917-33 period, and in 1937-38, created a psychological climate favourable to the use of violence against civilians on a mass and fairly indiscriminate scale by security forces.

    Nazi antisemitism emphasised the collective guilt of Jews for Bolshevism and the idea that ‘it was in their blood’, so they couldn’t necessarily help supporting revolution, terrorism and all kinds of anti-Aryan activities, here you can see a mixture of emotional appeals to feelings of revenge and a more impersonal idea of curing society of an infection at the same time. Leninism had something similar, where the destruction of groups like Kulaks was just an example of material historical laws playing themselves out for the improvement of humanity.

    Afaik the Baltic case is related but different in that the Soviet terror activities were more concentrated in the 1939-41 period, but the Nazis used the same sort of antisemitic propaganda there, and the idea of revenge against the Bolsheviks on the part of Baltic nationalists might have been a more direct factor. Probably there was also the issue of partisan activity, as the Germans tended to believe Jewish civilians were a big support base for Red Army partisans.

    [MORE]

    There is a good book about one of the German Order Police units involved in ‘Jewish actions’ called Ordinary Men by Christopher Browning. I don’t know if anything similar has been done for any Baltic Auxiliary police units, but some of the explanations are probably applicable for both.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @Coconuts


    and in 1937-38, created a psychological climate favourable to the use of violence against civilians on a mass and fairly indiscriminate scale by security forces.
     
    Question though is how to explain people like Roman Shukhevych (read this about him just yesterday: https://brill.com/view/journals/fasc/5/1/article-p26_3.xml?language=en , which I suppose is accurate enough at least on the key aspects). He was to some extent mentored in mass violence by the Germans, since he took part in anti-partisan warfare in Belarus in 1942, and presumably then transferred those "skills" to the massacres of Poles in 1943. But on the other hand, he had already been a terrorist in interwar Poland, well before any of that. So the Tim Snyder thesis that it's all just due to the pernicious influence of Soviets and German Nazis (which imo in its popular form has a contemporary political agenda linked to Intermarium ideas, since it makes the peoples of the region merely the victims of outside forces who set them against each other) breaks down somewhat in cases like this.

    Replies: @AP

    , @LatW
    @Coconuts


    I don’t know if anything similar has been done for any Baltic Auxiliary police units
     
    There is a book by Richard Plavnieks "Nazi Collaborators on Trial during the Cold War". But it is flawed. The motivations behind these events was partly opportunism and partly anti-Communist ideology. Resistance to the Soviet invasion was shown in other ways too, not just by collaboration with the Germans.
  870. German_reader says:
    @Coconuts
    @Mikel


    If you are persecuted by people of an ideology that believes in violence against a class of citizens you don’t take revenge against those ideologues by adhering to a very different ideology that promotes violence against a totally different type of innocent people.
     
    I think the argument Snyder was making was somewhat different, because iirc the emphasis was on the way the various forms of mass terror in Ukraine in the 1917-33 period, and in 1937-38, created a psychological climate favourable to the use of violence against civilians on a mass and fairly indiscriminate scale by security forces.

    Nazi antisemitism emphasised the collective guilt of Jews for Bolshevism and the idea that 'it was in their blood', so they couldn't necessarily help supporting revolution, terrorism and all kinds of anti-Aryan activities, here you can see a mixture of emotional appeals to feelings of revenge and a more impersonal idea of curing society of an infection at the same time. Leninism had something similar, where the destruction of groups like Kulaks was just an example of material historical laws playing themselves out for the improvement of humanity.

    Afaik the Baltic case is related but different in that the Soviet terror activities were more concentrated in the 1939-41 period, but the Nazis used the same sort of antisemitic propaganda there, and the idea of revenge against the Bolsheviks on the part of Baltic nationalists might have been a more direct factor. Probably there was also the issue of partisan activity, as the Germans tended to believe Jewish civilians were a big support base for Red Army partisans.

    There is a good book about one of the German Order Police units involved in 'Jewish actions' called Ordinary Men by Christopher Browning. I don't know if anything similar has been done for any Baltic Auxiliary police units, but some of the explanations are probably applicable for both.

    Replies: @German_reader, @LatW

    and in 1937-38, created a psychological climate favourable to the use of violence against civilians on a mass and fairly indiscriminate scale by security forces.

    Question though is how to explain people like Roman Shukhevych (read this about him just yesterday: https://brill.com/view/journals/fasc/5/1/article-p26_3.xml?language=en , which I suppose is accurate enough at least on the key aspects). He was to some extent mentored in mass violence by the Germans, since he took part in anti-partisan warfare in Belarus in 1942, and presumably then transferred those “skills” to the massacres of Poles in 1943. But on the other hand, he had already been a terrorist in interwar Poland, well before any of that. So the Tim Snyder thesis that it’s all just due to the pernicious influence of Soviets and German Nazis (which imo in its popular form has a contemporary political agenda linked to Intermarium ideas, since it makes the peoples of the region merely the victims of outside forces who set them against each other) breaks down somewhat in cases like this.

    • Replies: @AP
    @German_reader


    But on the other hand, he [Shukhevych] had already been a terrorist in interwar Poland, well before any of that.
     
    There is a difference between terrorism and mass murder.

    The 1930s OUN was like the IRA. It was not a genocidal organization.

    Replies: @German_reader

  871. To test the Snyder hypothesis perhaps you would need to study the local personnel of the Schuma battalions and SD units to try to find out who they were and what regional backgrounds they came from, if possible. The kind of explanations put forward in ‘Ordinary Men’ about why German police reservists came to participate in those actions may turn out to be more valid than the Snyder ones, though there is some overlap between the two.

    But it strikes me the Snyder explanations may ultimately go back to 1914-18, because this informed how the Russian Civil War would be fought and what kind of ideologies would come to the forefront, and the whole Central-Eastern European region was involved in or impacted by WW1.

    A reason it seems to have limited relevance to anything going on today is that few members of any of these nations were ever members of the security units involved in these activities, and they were mostly controlled by authoritarian political elites. The general lesson I remember taking away from reading ‘Bloodlands’ was the benefit of having a politically active and responsible citizenry with moderate levels of property ownership. I read it in about 2014…

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @Coconuts


    I read it in about 2014…
     
    So did I. I didn't like it already at the time, its cloying sentimentality got on my nerves. "I want to focus on the victims"...I suppose that's in line with the general spirit of the age, but if you're writing about mass killing you must at least make an effort to show what motivated the perpetrators, and Snyder's book wasn't illuminating in this regard at all.
    It got bad reviews by some German historians btw, partly because of some claims about Nazi Germany which were seen as dubious or exaggerated (the entire "Hunger plan" business), but even more so because of how it treated Soviet crimes like the famines in Ukraine. I guess critics from Central Eastern Europe would allege that's the spirit of "Molotov-Ribbentropp 2.0" in action.
  872. German_reader says:
    @Coconuts
    To test the Snyder hypothesis perhaps you would need to study the local personnel of the Schuma battalions and SD units to try to find out who they were and what regional backgrounds they came from, if possible. The kind of explanations put forward in 'Ordinary Men' about why German police reservists came to participate in those actions may turn out to be more valid than the Snyder ones, though there is some overlap between the two.

    But it strikes me the Snyder explanations may ultimately go back to 1914-18, because this informed how the Russian Civil War would be fought and what kind of ideologies would come to the forefront, and the whole Central-Eastern European region was involved in or impacted by WW1.

    A reason it seems to have limited relevance to anything going on today is that few members of any of these nations were ever members of the security units involved in these activities, and they were mostly controlled by authoritarian political elites. The general lesson I remember taking away from reading 'Bloodlands' was the benefit of having a politically active and responsible citizenry with moderate levels of property ownership. I read it in about 2014...

    Replies: @German_reader

    I read it in about 2014…

    So did I. I didn’t like it already at the time, its cloying sentimentality got on my nerves. “I want to focus on the victims”…I suppose that’s in line with the general spirit of the age, but if you’re writing about mass killing you must at least make an effort to show what motivated the perpetrators, and Snyder’s book wasn’t illuminating in this regard at all.
    It got bad reviews by some German historians btw, partly because of some claims about Nazi Germany which were seen as dubious or exaggerated (the entire “Hunger plan” business), but even more so because of how it treated Soviet crimes like the famines in Ukraine. I guess critics from Central Eastern Europe would allege that’s the spirit of “Molotov-Ribbentropp 2.0” in action.

  873. @German_reader
    @AP


    Strong support for the victim of murderous Russian aggression is “unhinged?”
     
    The Balts don't matter much in material terms. Their "support" consists in verbal extremism that has a good chance of getting us all killed if it becomes policy. An example: Latvia's minister of defense just demanded that Ukraine be given the "right" to attack RF territory (meaning, presumably, pre-2014 RF territory) to stop the missile strikes against Ukraine. Of course Ukraine already has that "right" in the abstract, so what he really means is that Ukraine should be given the means (long-range missiles) and the intelligence support by NATO to do so. And if NATO directly aided in attacking Russia proper, then we would indeed be getting inexorably closer towards nuclear armaggeddon.

    Replies: @LatW

    The Balts don’t matter much in material terms.

    This is for Ukrainians on the ground to judge and they will disagree with you (the Balts have sent hundreds of millions worth of items, cash, drones, etc, over 100K refugees settled). The Balts provided assistance at a crucial moment when others weren’t providing it. This will be analyzed at some point but the initial events around Kyiv proved quite important (and that’s when the Balts provided Javelin, etc, together with the British & Polish, of course).

    [MORE]

    As to the events of WW2, the head of the NKVD in Latvia was a Jew named Semyon Shustin – so a Russian Jew, from Russia, was brought in to torture and slaughter Latvians. This happened in 1940 so before the German occupation. Before the war, the Jewish situation in the Baltics was not that bad (there were, of course, those Jews who were harmful Commies, but there were a ton of great, talented Jews that contributed greatly in various non-contraversial professions who perished and it was a big loss) . The Latvians had to push out the Commies by force in 1920.

    German propaganda aimed at Baltic policemen, ex-military types etc., some of whom then took part in mass killings in Latvia

    You leave out in what capacity. Most of the actual shooting was done by the German nationals from the SD. There were trials on members of Arajs Kommando in the West and the truth is that results are rather scarce. I’m not trying to deny anything, of course they were there (although it hasn’t been all that easy to ID them all or even most, very few names available, tbh) and probably doing some of the shooting in some cases (and that they were involved on the logistical side is bad enough especially in the far out and smaller towns), but it’s just that there is a lot of speculation but not much in terms of real evidence (even the historian who has over the years been quoted the most on these matters, Andrew Ezergailis, just recently admitted that a lot of this cannot be proven which is quite scandalous, imo). We seem to forget a lot here that there were first and foremost actual German nationals – on all levels – who organized and carried this out. And the German occupation was severe. The mobilization into the Legion was illegal by international law (only some of it was voluntary participation and that, too, should be totally understandable given the circumstances).

    Let me just say for those here who claim to be supporting Russian Whites (I’m thinking of AP mainly) but shy away from the German units in WW2 – an interesting fact is that those Latvian officers who led the Legion in the 1940s had previously served in the Russian Imperial Army (and had fought in WW1 for Russia, and had fought on the side of the Whites during the Civil War, and had been awarded the crosses of St George). So be careful who you chastise.

    Not to get into the topic of WW1 & Soviet communism (including the riflemen), but suffice it to say that the Soviets were founded already around the time of the Revolution of 1905 (or were in the process of being created, of course, they were not as prominent as in 1917 and were often exiled).

    Lenin, Stalin & Trotsky were active already then (these are all well known facts – there were countless red organizations that were supported by the Russian masses and even the growing middle class wasn’t always happy with the Tsar). The Russian anarchists were active in the late 19th century. All of these processes started way before the Latvian Riflemen. Finns assassinated their Russian governor as a response to heavy Russification (and were deemed a national hero in Finland) and there were plenty of other attacks on the Tsar’s officials. Of course, even during the times of the 1905 revolution, areas such as Poland, Baltics, Finland were restless, it is obvious that the more European parts were not ok with how things were… but also the whole of the Empire.

    Georgy Gapon who led the procession in 1905 during what turned into the Bloody Sunday and who fraternized with socialists, was in fact Ukrainian. We can find a lot of lesser known facts here as well that will show “culpability” of many ethnicities (if one is inclined to approach things in such a manner). Anyway, for those who feel like judging certain historic characters, you might want to keep things in the context.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @LatW


    Most of the actual shooting was done by the German nationals from the SD. There were trials on members of Arajs Kommando in the West and the truth is that results are rather scarce.
     
    That's just tosh, of course Latvians in those police and auxiliary formations took part in mass killings themselves. You may say they were acting only in a subordinate role, and if they hadn't done it, the Germans would have found someone else, but totally denying it is pretty ridiculous.
    I'm not endorsing the extreme claims by Russians and others who are saying that Latvia before WW2 had already been "fascist", that Latvians deserved the deportations etc., not at all. But nor do I think Westerners are obliged to uncritically accept a whitewashed view of history where even the members of Arajs Kommando weren't really that bad after all, just because that is apparently convenient now for geopolitical reasons.

    Replies: @LatW, @Wokechoke

  874. @Coconuts
    @Mikel


    If you are persecuted by people of an ideology that believes in violence against a class of citizens you don’t take revenge against those ideologues by adhering to a very different ideology that promotes violence against a totally different type of innocent people.
     
    I think the argument Snyder was making was somewhat different, because iirc the emphasis was on the way the various forms of mass terror in Ukraine in the 1917-33 period, and in 1937-38, created a psychological climate favourable to the use of violence against civilians on a mass and fairly indiscriminate scale by security forces.

    Nazi antisemitism emphasised the collective guilt of Jews for Bolshevism and the idea that 'it was in their blood', so they couldn't necessarily help supporting revolution, terrorism and all kinds of anti-Aryan activities, here you can see a mixture of emotional appeals to feelings of revenge and a more impersonal idea of curing society of an infection at the same time. Leninism had something similar, where the destruction of groups like Kulaks was just an example of material historical laws playing themselves out for the improvement of humanity.

    Afaik the Baltic case is related but different in that the Soviet terror activities were more concentrated in the 1939-41 period, but the Nazis used the same sort of antisemitic propaganda there, and the idea of revenge against the Bolsheviks on the part of Baltic nationalists might have been a more direct factor. Probably there was also the issue of partisan activity, as the Germans tended to believe Jewish civilians were a big support base for Red Army partisans.

    There is a good book about one of the German Order Police units involved in 'Jewish actions' called Ordinary Men by Christopher Browning. I don't know if anything similar has been done for any Baltic Auxiliary police units, but some of the explanations are probably applicable for both.

    Replies: @German_reader, @LatW

    I don’t know if anything similar has been done for any Baltic Auxiliary police units

    There is a book by Richard Plavnieks “Nazi Collaborators on Trial during the Cold War”. But it is flawed. The motivations behind these events was partly opportunism and partly anti-Communist ideology. Resistance to the Soviet invasion was shown in other ways too, not just by collaboration with the Germans.

  875. German_reader says:
    @LatW
    @German_reader


    The Balts don’t matter much in material terms.
     
    This is for Ukrainians on the ground to judge and they will disagree with you (the Balts have sent hundreds of millions worth of items, cash, drones, etc, over 100K refugees settled). The Balts provided assistance at a crucial moment when others weren't providing it. This will be analyzed at some point but the initial events around Kyiv proved quite important (and that's when the Balts provided Javelin, etc, together with the British & Polish, of course).

    As to the events of WW2, the head of the NKVD in Latvia was a Jew named Semyon Shustin - so a Russian Jew, from Russia, was brought in to torture and slaughter Latvians. This happened in 1940 so before the German occupation. Before the war, the Jewish situation in the Baltics was not that bad (there were, of course, those Jews who were harmful Commies, but there were a ton of great, talented Jews that contributed greatly in various non-contraversial professions who perished and it was a big loss) . The Latvians had to push out the Commies by force in 1920.

    German propaganda aimed at Baltic policemen, ex-military types etc., some of whom then took part in mass killings in Latvia
     
    You leave out in what capacity. Most of the actual shooting was done by the German nationals from the SD. There were trials on members of Arajs Kommando in the West and the truth is that results are rather scarce. I'm not trying to deny anything, of course they were there (although it hasn't been all that easy to ID them all or even most, very few names available, tbh) and probably doing some of the shooting in some cases (and that they were involved on the logistical side is bad enough especially in the far out and smaller towns), but it's just that there is a lot of speculation but not much in terms of real evidence (even the historian who has over the years been quoted the most on these matters, Andrew Ezergailis, just recently admitted that a lot of this cannot be proven which is quite scandalous, imo). We seem to forget a lot here that there were first and foremost actual German nationals - on all levels - who organized and carried this out. And the German occupation was severe. The mobilization into the Legion was illegal by international law (only some of it was voluntary participation and that, too, should be totally understandable given the circumstances).

    Let me just say for those here who claim to be supporting Russian Whites (I'm thinking of AP mainly) but shy away from the German units in WW2 - an interesting fact is that those Latvian officers who led the Legion in the 1940s had previously served in the Russian Imperial Army (and had fought in WW1 for Russia, and had fought on the side of the Whites during the Civil War, and had been awarded the crosses of St George). So be careful who you chastise.

    Not to get into the topic of WW1 & Soviet communism (including the riflemen), but suffice it to say that the Soviets were founded already around the time of the Revolution of 1905 (or were in the process of being created, of course, they were not as prominent as in 1917 and were often exiled).

    Lenin, Stalin & Trotsky were active already then (these are all well known facts - there were countless red organizations that were supported by the Russian masses and even the growing middle class wasn't always happy with the Tsar). The Russian anarchists were active in the late 19th century. All of these processes started way before the Latvian Riflemen. Finns assassinated their Russian governor as a response to heavy Russification (and were deemed a national hero in Finland) and there were plenty of other attacks on the Tsar's officials. Of course, even during the times of the 1905 revolution, areas such as Poland, Baltics, Finland were restless, it is obvious that the more European parts were not ok with how things were... but also the whole of the Empire.

    Georgy Gapon who led the procession in 1905 during what turned into the Bloody Sunday and who fraternized with socialists, was in fact Ukrainian. We can find a lot of lesser known facts here as well that will show "culpability" of many ethnicities (if one is inclined to approach things in such a manner). Anyway, for those who feel like judging certain historic characters, you might want to keep things in the context.

    Replies: @German_reader

    Most of the actual shooting was done by the German nationals from the SD. There were trials on members of Arajs Kommando in the West and the truth is that results are rather scarce.

    That’s just tosh, of course Latvians in those police and auxiliary formations took part in mass killings themselves. You may say they were acting only in a subordinate role, and if they hadn’t done it, the Germans would have found someone else, but totally denying it is pretty ridiculous.
    I’m not endorsing the extreme claims by Russians and others who are saying that Latvia before WW2 had already been “fascist”, that Latvians deserved the deportations etc., not at all. But nor do I think Westerners are obliged to uncritically accept a whitewashed view of history where even the members of Arajs Kommando weren’t really that bad after all, just because that is apparently convenient now for geopolitical reasons.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @German_reader


    Latvians in those police and auxiliary formations took part in mass killings themselves
     
    In some cases, yes, but a lot of the systematic shooting was done by German nationals from Germany who were in the SD. I would say that it is much worse to walk into a country and start murdering that country's citizens (or worse - use a country or a whole region to commit one's dirty deeds instead of doing it in one's own home), than, let's say, someone shooting the Communists who had murdered their sibling (after ripping out their finger nails) a year prior.

    The Germans entered into a society that had already been heavily traumatized from the initial Soviet occupation (which cleared out a lot of people and institutions that could've potentially resisted the Nazis - the result of which would have most likely been that the Nazis would simply murder those people anyway, like they did with the intelligentsia and the clergy in Lithuania).

    The whole "Holocaust without Germans" myth needs to die already. We don't have to talk about these things at all, but since you bring up things like this:

    Latvians supposedly also had the highest per capita rate of Holocaust perpetrators
     
    Do you have anything to substantiate this claim (besides the 1960s Soviet fantasies, or Western sources that rely on these fantasies)? How can this even be calculated when there are no exact numbers (such as the exact number of perpetrators, the number of Jews who were evacuated (or the number of Jews persecuted by the Soviets a year prior)? Yet they are quick to throw out phrases such as these, including on the political arena.

    Arajs Kommando weren’t really that bad after all
     
    They were bad, but the majority of their duties consisted of escorting and guarding (Wachsdienst). Only a part of them were involved in the actual shooting. In the biggest campaigns organized by Jeckeln, it was German nationals who did the shooting.

    When I said "evidence is scarce", I had the trial of Arajs' in mind in West Germany where the prosecution relied solely on witness statements - there were no tangible documents (granted, documentation was most likely destroyed, but this is still worth noting). I'm not saying there is no guilt, just that there are also a lot of questions. Definitely a lot of fluff of political kind added to the trial.

    just because that is apparently convenient now for geopolitical reasons.
     
    What are you saying, that establishment Americans (and other Westerners) who are the biggest accusers of the Balts when it comes to the Holocaust, will now all of a sudden stop? There are financial, career and reputation related incentives for them. But you might be guessing right that they may not be able to repeat this with Ukrainians at this point (although some of them will probably try).

    Replies: @German_reader

    , @Wokechoke
    @German_reader

    These minnow countries are getting tiresome. Alex Boris Johnson really dropped the UK in the shot here.

  876. @orchardist
    @Yahya

    On the Sensation of Tone by Helmholtz is the bible.

    Replies: @Che Guava

    You are generally verbose, dividing no. of words by no. of comments.

    However, thank you very much for reminding me of that book Sensations of Tone by Helmholtz, I had it but lost it. Likely stolen. Kleptomaniac bibliophile acquaintance of the time most likely reason.

    Had only read about a third, it is very dense, but brilliant. To continue, inter-library loans or download. Finding another copy to buy, except from Amazon, which I strictly boycott, seems unlikely.

    • Troll: Yahya
  877. @German_reader
    @German_reader

    Btw, since AP always tells me that Melnyk was an efficient diplomat with his insolent behaviour (it "worked" in Germany after all), his recent appointment to deputy foreign minister wasn't exactly popular with Poles:
    https://notesfrompoland.com/2022/11/23/anger-in-warsaw-over-ukraine-appointing-minister-who-denied-wartime-massacre-of-poles/

    Replies: @AP

    I agree with you on this. He should have been limited to work with Germany, where he was effective. This was a bad move.

  878. @German_reader
    @Coconuts


    and in 1937-38, created a psychological climate favourable to the use of violence against civilians on a mass and fairly indiscriminate scale by security forces.
     
    Question though is how to explain people like Roman Shukhevych (read this about him just yesterday: https://brill.com/view/journals/fasc/5/1/article-p26_3.xml?language=en , which I suppose is accurate enough at least on the key aspects). He was to some extent mentored in mass violence by the Germans, since he took part in anti-partisan warfare in Belarus in 1942, and presumably then transferred those "skills" to the massacres of Poles in 1943. But on the other hand, he had already been a terrorist in interwar Poland, well before any of that. So the Tim Snyder thesis that it's all just due to the pernicious influence of Soviets and German Nazis (which imo in its popular form has a contemporary political agenda linked to Intermarium ideas, since it makes the peoples of the region merely the victims of outside forces who set them against each other) breaks down somewhat in cases like this.

    Replies: @AP

    But on the other hand, he [Shukhevych] had already been a terrorist in interwar Poland, well before any of that.

    There is a difference between terrorism and mass murder.

    The 1930s OUN was like the IRA. It was not a genocidal organization.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @AP


    It was not a genocidal organization.
     
    You could say the same about the SS in the 1920s and even the 1930s. Can you really say that it wasn't just a matter of available means and opportunities? It's not like Shukhevych could have killed Poles en masse during the interwar era. But when he could, he did.

    Replies: @AP

  879. German_reader says:
    @AP
    @German_reader


    But on the other hand, he [Shukhevych] had already been a terrorist in interwar Poland, well before any of that.
     
    There is a difference between terrorism and mass murder.

    The 1930s OUN was like the IRA. It was not a genocidal organization.

    Replies: @German_reader

    It was not a genocidal organization.

    You could say the same about the SS in the 1920s and even the 1930s. Can you really say that it wasn’t just a matter of available means and opportunities? It’s not like Shukhevych could have killed Poles en masse during the interwar era. But when he could, he did.

    • Agree: Mikhail
    • Replies: @AP
    @German_reader


    "It was not a genocidal organization."

    You could say the same about the SS in the 1920s and even the 1930s. Can you really say that it wasn’t just a matter of available means and opportunities?
     
    Without the example and experience thanks to both Soviets and especially Nazis (both practical and moral), I doubt that mass extermination was inevitable. This might have been unthinkable, out of the box thinking for people who hadn't become habituated to mass killings and hardened by having experienced mass killings of one's own people. There's a big difference between targeted killings of various officials and policemen, and slaughter of tens of thousands of people including entire families.

    I'm not saying it would have been impossible but it would have been unlikely, and certainly not inevitable.

    Do you think that if the IRA had total power over northern Ireland it would have slaughtered 10,000s of Protestants, women and children included? Probably not. Ireland was hadn't been occupied by Nazis and Soviets.

    Replies: @German_reader

  880. @German_reader
    @AP


    It was not a genocidal organization.
     
    You could say the same about the SS in the 1920s and even the 1930s. Can you really say that it wasn't just a matter of available means and opportunities? It's not like Shukhevych could have killed Poles en masse during the interwar era. But when he could, he did.

    Replies: @AP

    “It was not a genocidal organization.”

    You could say the same about the SS in the 1920s and even the 1930s. Can you really say that it wasn’t just a matter of available means and opportunities?

    Without the example and experience thanks to both Soviets and especially Nazis (both practical and moral), I doubt that mass extermination was inevitable. This might have been unthinkable, out of the box thinking for people who hadn’t become habituated to mass killings and hardened by having experienced mass killings of one’s own people. There’s a big difference between targeted killings of various officials and policemen, and slaughter of tens of thousands of people including entire families.

    I’m not saying it would have been impossible but it would have been unlikely, and certainly not inevitable.

    Do you think that if the IRA had total power over northern Ireland it would have slaughtered 10,000s of Protestants, women and children included? Probably not. Ireland was hadn’t been occupied by Nazis and Soviets.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @AP


    Do you think that if the IRA had total power over northern Ireland it would have slaughtered 10,000s of Protestants, women and children included?
     
    Who knows? And regarding Ukraine, I don't see how people like Bandera or Shukhevych could ever have achieved their stated goals without drastic violence against Poles collectively.
    But to some extent it's of course speculative and I probably shouldn't have entered into this historical discussion, not like it's going to lead anywhere. As I indicated above, I think it would be better, if Eastern Europeans tried to move on from those historical issues, difficult as that may be.

    Replies: @LatW, @AP

  881. German_reader says:
    @AP
    @German_reader


    "It was not a genocidal organization."

    You could say the same about the SS in the 1920s and even the 1930s. Can you really say that it wasn’t just a matter of available means and opportunities?
     
    Without the example and experience thanks to both Soviets and especially Nazis (both practical and moral), I doubt that mass extermination was inevitable. This might have been unthinkable, out of the box thinking for people who hadn't become habituated to mass killings and hardened by having experienced mass killings of one's own people. There's a big difference between targeted killings of various officials and policemen, and slaughter of tens of thousands of people including entire families.

    I'm not saying it would have been impossible but it would have been unlikely, and certainly not inevitable.

    Do you think that if the IRA had total power over northern Ireland it would have slaughtered 10,000s of Protestants, women and children included? Probably not. Ireland was hadn't been occupied by Nazis and Soviets.

    Replies: @German_reader

    Do you think that if the IRA had total power over northern Ireland it would have slaughtered 10,000s of Protestants, women and children included?

    Who knows? And regarding Ukraine, I don’t see how people like Bandera or Shukhevych could ever have achieved their stated goals without drastic violence against Poles collectively.
    But to some extent it’s of course speculative and I probably shouldn’t have entered into this historical discussion, not like it’s going to lead anywhere. As I indicated above, I think it would be better, if Eastern Europeans tried to move on from those historical issues, difficult as that may be.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @German_reader


    I think it would be better, if Eastern Europeans tried to move on from those historical issues, difficult as that may be.
     
    When all the little lies perish, then. And when Western Euros in concert with the Russians quit promoting things such as the "Holocaust without Germans" and similar myths, including all the ridiculous nonsense in the Soviet arsenal that is still floating around (including on these pages).
    , @AP
    @German_reader


    Who knows? And regarding Ukraine, I don’t see how people like Bandera or Shukhevych could ever have achieved their stated goals without drastic violence against Poles collectively.
     
    Given the pre-Soviet and pre-Nazi context, it probably would have been treating Poles as second class citizens, arrests, censorship, and occasional scattered deadly police brutality as Ukrainians had been subjected to in 1920s and 1930s. Rather than unthinkable slaughter of entire families.
  882. @German_reader
    @LatW


    Most of the actual shooting was done by the German nationals from the SD. There were trials on members of Arajs Kommando in the West and the truth is that results are rather scarce.
     
    That's just tosh, of course Latvians in those police and auxiliary formations took part in mass killings themselves. You may say they were acting only in a subordinate role, and if they hadn't done it, the Germans would have found someone else, but totally denying it is pretty ridiculous.
    I'm not endorsing the extreme claims by Russians and others who are saying that Latvia before WW2 had already been "fascist", that Latvians deserved the deportations etc., not at all. But nor do I think Westerners are obliged to uncritically accept a whitewashed view of history where even the members of Arajs Kommando weren't really that bad after all, just because that is apparently convenient now for geopolitical reasons.

    Replies: @LatW, @Wokechoke

    Latvians in those police and auxiliary formations took part in mass killings themselves

    In some cases, yes, but a lot of the systematic shooting was done by German nationals from Germany who were in the SD. I would say that it is much worse to walk into a country and start murdering that country’s citizens (or worse – use a country or a whole region to commit one’s dirty deeds instead of doing it in one’s own home), than, let’s say, someone shooting the Communists who had murdered their sibling (after ripping out their finger nails) a year prior.

    The Germans entered into a society that had already been heavily traumatized from the initial Soviet occupation (which cleared out a lot of people and institutions that could’ve potentially resisted the Nazis – the result of which would have most likely been that the Nazis would simply murder those people anyway, like they did with the intelligentsia and the clergy in Lithuania).

    The whole “Holocaust without Germans” myth needs to die already. We don’t have to talk about these things at all, but since you bring up things like this:

    [MORE]

    Latvians supposedly also had the highest per capita rate of Holocaust perpetrators

    Do you have anything to substantiate this claim (besides the 1960s Soviet fantasies, or Western sources that rely on these fantasies)? How can this even be calculated when there are no exact numbers (such as the exact number of perpetrators, the number of Jews who were evacuated (or the number of Jews persecuted by the Soviets a year prior)? Yet they are quick to throw out phrases such as these, including on the political arena.

    Arajs Kommando weren’t really that bad after all

    They were bad, but the majority of their duties consisted of escorting and guarding (Wachsdienst). Only a part of them were involved in the actual shooting. In the biggest campaigns organized by Jeckeln, it was German nationals who did the shooting.

    When I said “evidence is scarce”, I had the trial of Arajs’ in mind in West Germany where the prosecution relied solely on witness statements – there were no tangible documents (granted, documentation was most likely destroyed, but this is still worth noting). I’m not saying there is no guilt, just that there are also a lot of questions. Definitely a lot of fluff of political kind added to the trial.

    just because that is apparently convenient now for geopolitical reasons.

    What are you saying, that establishment Americans (and other Westerners) who are the biggest accusers of the Balts when it comes to the Holocaust, will now all of a sudden stop? There are financial, career and reputation related incentives for them. But you might be guessing right that they may not be able to repeat this with Ukrainians at this point (although some of them will probably try).

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @LatW


    Do you have anything to substantiate this claim
     
    No, and if you go back to read my original comment, I added supposedly before it. It's just a claim I remember having been made by Holocaust scholars (or "scholars", depending on one's pov). It may well be bs, and taken by itself it's not very meaningful anyway.
    I agree with you insofar as of course there would have been no "Holocaust without Germans" in Latvia. I have never claimed that Latvia was "fascist" before the German occupation, I know the 1930s dictatorship was a fairly moderate one with no violence against the national minorities. The violence that did happen in the early 1940s would have been unthinkable without the crimes committed by the Soviets during their occupation, and then the various perverse incentives during the German occupation. No disagreement from me in that regard.
    Where I disagree is your claims that Latvians (some Latvians, that is), like those in Arajs Kommando, didn't personally take part in acts of mass murder, and not just in a support role, but as actual killers. Frankly, denial of that strikes me as pretty silly revisionism. But I don't think further discussion of that will lead anywhere, and since the whole discussion has been rather unedifying, I'd rather end it.

    Replies: @LatW

  883. @German_reader
    @AP


    Do you think that if the IRA had total power over northern Ireland it would have slaughtered 10,000s of Protestants, women and children included?
     
    Who knows? And regarding Ukraine, I don't see how people like Bandera or Shukhevych could ever have achieved their stated goals without drastic violence against Poles collectively.
    But to some extent it's of course speculative and I probably shouldn't have entered into this historical discussion, not like it's going to lead anywhere. As I indicated above, I think it would be better, if Eastern Europeans tried to move on from those historical issues, difficult as that may be.

    Replies: @LatW, @AP

    I think it would be better, if Eastern Europeans tried to move on from those historical issues, difficult as that may be.

    When all the little lies perish, then. And when Western Euros in concert with the Russians quit promoting things such as the “Holocaust without Germans” and similar myths, including all the ridiculous nonsense in the Soviet arsenal that is still floating around (including on these pages).

  884. German_reader says:
    @LatW
    @German_reader


    Latvians in those police and auxiliary formations took part in mass killings themselves
     
    In some cases, yes, but a lot of the systematic shooting was done by German nationals from Germany who were in the SD. I would say that it is much worse to walk into a country and start murdering that country's citizens (or worse - use a country or a whole region to commit one's dirty deeds instead of doing it in one's own home), than, let's say, someone shooting the Communists who had murdered their sibling (after ripping out their finger nails) a year prior.

    The Germans entered into a society that had already been heavily traumatized from the initial Soviet occupation (which cleared out a lot of people and institutions that could've potentially resisted the Nazis - the result of which would have most likely been that the Nazis would simply murder those people anyway, like they did with the intelligentsia and the clergy in Lithuania).

    The whole "Holocaust without Germans" myth needs to die already. We don't have to talk about these things at all, but since you bring up things like this:

    Latvians supposedly also had the highest per capita rate of Holocaust perpetrators
     
    Do you have anything to substantiate this claim (besides the 1960s Soviet fantasies, or Western sources that rely on these fantasies)? How can this even be calculated when there are no exact numbers (such as the exact number of perpetrators, the number of Jews who were evacuated (or the number of Jews persecuted by the Soviets a year prior)? Yet they are quick to throw out phrases such as these, including on the political arena.

    Arajs Kommando weren’t really that bad after all
     
    They were bad, but the majority of their duties consisted of escorting and guarding (Wachsdienst). Only a part of them were involved in the actual shooting. In the biggest campaigns organized by Jeckeln, it was German nationals who did the shooting.

    When I said "evidence is scarce", I had the trial of Arajs' in mind in West Germany where the prosecution relied solely on witness statements - there were no tangible documents (granted, documentation was most likely destroyed, but this is still worth noting). I'm not saying there is no guilt, just that there are also a lot of questions. Definitely a lot of fluff of political kind added to the trial.

    just because that is apparently convenient now for geopolitical reasons.
     
    What are you saying, that establishment Americans (and other Westerners) who are the biggest accusers of the Balts when it comes to the Holocaust, will now all of a sudden stop? There are financial, career and reputation related incentives for them. But you might be guessing right that they may not be able to repeat this with Ukrainians at this point (although some of them will probably try).

    Replies: @German_reader

    Do you have anything to substantiate this claim

    No, and if you go back to read my original comment, I added supposedly before it. It’s just a claim I remember having been made by Holocaust scholars (or “scholars”, depending on one’s pov). It may well be bs, and taken by itself it’s not very meaningful anyway.
    I agree with you insofar as of course there would have been no “Holocaust without Germans” in Latvia. I have never claimed that Latvia was “fascist” before the German occupation, I know the 1930s dictatorship was a fairly moderate one with no violence against the national minorities. The violence that did happen in the early 1940s would have been unthinkable without the crimes committed by the Soviets during their occupation, and then the various perverse incentives during the German occupation. No disagreement from me in that regard.
    Where I disagree is your claims that Latvians (some Latvians, that is), like those in Arajs Kommando, didn’t personally take part in acts of mass murder, and not just in a support role, but as actual killers. Frankly, denial of that strikes me as pretty silly revisionism. But I don’t think further discussion of that will lead anywhere, and since the whole discussion has been rather unedifying, I’d rather end it.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @German_reader


    I added supposedly before it. It’s just a claim I remember having been made by Holocaust scholars (or “scholars”, depending on one’s pov). It may well be bs, and taken by itself it’s not very meaningful anyway.
     
    I know where this comes from (most likely from the speed of killings that was higher than in other places, but it lacks other important data that I already mentioned above). The problem with this is that not only it can't be proven, but it affects Baltic children - when our children will go to university somewhere in the world or visit some other international venues, or even have foreign guests over, they will have people throw unsubstantiated claims like that at them and put them in an unfair position. This is why I will always fight against this.

    I know the 1930s dictatorship was a fairly moderate one with no violence against the national minorities.
     
    Not only that, but Ulmanis accepted Jews when many other countries denied shelter to Jews.

    Where I disagree is your claims that Latvians (some Latvians, that is), like those in Arajs Kommando, didn’t personally take part in acts of mass murder
     
    Of course, they did take part in various capacities, the problem is the data - the data is not always easy to pin down as accurate. Besides, a lot of them, probably most, were already tried by the Soviets. I bet there were crazy instances when a young guy who was just guarding in the forest was given 25 years in Siberia. Because it's just what the Soviets did.

    But I don’t think further discussion of that will lead anywhere
     
    I agree, it's a stupid discussion. The unwritten rule we used to have with German right wingers was very simple - you don't trash us, we don't trash you. Went without saying and worked fantastically well.

    Replies: @German_reader

  885. @German_reader
    @LatW


    Do you have anything to substantiate this claim
     
    No, and if you go back to read my original comment, I added supposedly before it. It's just a claim I remember having been made by Holocaust scholars (or "scholars", depending on one's pov). It may well be bs, and taken by itself it's not very meaningful anyway.
    I agree with you insofar as of course there would have been no "Holocaust without Germans" in Latvia. I have never claimed that Latvia was "fascist" before the German occupation, I know the 1930s dictatorship was a fairly moderate one with no violence against the national minorities. The violence that did happen in the early 1940s would have been unthinkable without the crimes committed by the Soviets during their occupation, and then the various perverse incentives during the German occupation. No disagreement from me in that regard.
    Where I disagree is your claims that Latvians (some Latvians, that is), like those in Arajs Kommando, didn't personally take part in acts of mass murder, and not just in a support role, but as actual killers. Frankly, denial of that strikes me as pretty silly revisionism. But I don't think further discussion of that will lead anywhere, and since the whole discussion has been rather unedifying, I'd rather end it.

    Replies: @LatW

    I added supposedly before it. It’s just a claim I remember having been made by Holocaust scholars (or “scholars”, depending on one’s pov). It may well be bs, and taken by itself it’s not very meaningful anyway.

    I know where this comes from (most likely from the speed of killings that was higher than in other places, but it lacks other important data that I already mentioned above). The problem with this is that not only it can’t be proven, but it affects Baltic children – when our children will go to university somewhere in the world or visit some other international venues, or even have foreign guests over, they will have people throw unsubstantiated claims like that at them and put them in an unfair position. This is why I will always fight against this.

    I know the 1930s dictatorship was a fairly moderate one with no violence against the national minorities.

    Not only that, but Ulmanis accepted Jews when many other countries denied shelter to Jews.

    Where I disagree is your claims that Latvians (some Latvians, that is), like those in Arajs Kommando, didn’t personally take part in acts of mass murder

    Of course, they did take part in various capacities, the problem is the data – the data is not always easy to pin down as accurate. Besides, a lot of them, probably most, were already tried by the Soviets. I bet there were crazy instances when a young guy who was just guarding in the forest was given 25 years in Siberia. Because it’s just what the Soviets did.

    But I don’t think further discussion of that will lead anywhere

    I agree, it’s a stupid discussion. The unwritten rule we used to have with German right wingers was very simple – you don’t trash us, we don’t trash you. Went without saying and worked fantastically well.

    • Replies: @German_reader
    @LatW


    I bet there were crazy instances when a young guy who was just guarding in the forest was given 25 years in Siberia. Because it’s just what the Soviets did.
     
    Sure, that certainly happened, Soviet trials weren't held according to rule of law principles after all, but were show trials or pursued political objectives. One certainly can't take all the confessions and testimonies in them at face value, guilty defendants mixed in with innocent, truth with falsehood, and not always easy to distinguish. You don't need to tell me that, I'm well aware, also that Russia uses these historical issues for very dubious purposes. I just think that revisionism can also go too far though.

    The unwritten rule we used to have with German right wingers was very simple – you don’t trash us, we don’t trash you. Went without saying and worked fantastically well.
     
    It's because of the war in Ukraine. I get that our perspectives on some matters may be irreconcilable (different experiences and all that), and some German right-wingers are certainly too pro-Russian in a rather repellent way, giving no thought at all to the suffering of Ukrainian civilians and soldiers. But I still find some of the accusations commonly made rather unfair. The questions raised by this war and how to deal with it are very hard, the dangers possibly existential, so imo the correct reaction is far from obvious.

    Replies: @LatW

  886. German_reader says:
    @LatW
    @German_reader


    I added supposedly before it. It’s just a claim I remember having been made by Holocaust scholars (or “scholars”, depending on one’s pov). It may well be bs, and taken by itself it’s not very meaningful anyway.
     
    I know where this comes from (most likely from the speed of killings that was higher than in other places, but it lacks other important data that I already mentioned above). The problem with this is that not only it can't be proven, but it affects Baltic children - when our children will go to university somewhere in the world or visit some other international venues, or even have foreign guests over, they will have people throw unsubstantiated claims like that at them and put them in an unfair position. This is why I will always fight against this.

    I know the 1930s dictatorship was a fairly moderate one with no violence against the national minorities.
     
    Not only that, but Ulmanis accepted Jews when many other countries denied shelter to Jews.

    Where I disagree is your claims that Latvians (some Latvians, that is), like those in Arajs Kommando, didn’t personally take part in acts of mass murder
     
    Of course, they did take part in various capacities, the problem is the data - the data is not always easy to pin down as accurate. Besides, a lot of them, probably most, were already tried by the Soviets. I bet there were crazy instances when a young guy who was just guarding in the forest was given 25 years in Siberia. Because it's just what the Soviets did.

    But I don’t think further discussion of that will lead anywhere
     
    I agree, it's a stupid discussion. The unwritten rule we used to have with German right wingers was very simple - you don't trash us, we don't trash you. Went without saying and worked fantastically well.

    Replies: @German_reader

    I bet there were crazy instances when a young guy who was just guarding in the forest was given 25 years in Siberia. Because it’s just what the Soviets did.

    Sure, that certainly happened, Soviet trials weren’t held according to rule of law principles after all, but were show trials or pursued political objectives. One certainly can’t take all the confessions and testimonies in them at face value, guilty defendants mixed in with innocent, truth with falsehood, and not always easy to distinguish. You don’t need to tell me that, I’m well aware, also that Russia uses these historical issues for very dubious purposes. I just think that revisionism can also go too far though.

    The unwritten rule we used to have with German right wingers was very simple – you don’t trash us, we don’t trash you. Went without saying and worked fantastically well.

    It’s because of the war in Ukraine. I get that our perspectives on some matters may be irreconcilable (different experiences and all that), and some German right-wingers are certainly too pro-Russian in a rather repellent way, giving no thought at all to the suffering of Ukrainian civilians and soldiers. But I still find some of the accusations commonly made rather unfair. The questions raised by this war and how to deal with it are very hard, the dangers possibly existential, so imo the correct reaction is far from obvious.

    • Replies: @LatW
    @German_reader


    I just think that revisionism can also go too far though.
     
    Of course, one has to be extremely careful with these matters. On both sides. The side that keeps throwing out these unsubstantiated claims is doing it too liberally, most often for political reasons, and is not being called out. There are insane cases where groups of American congressmen can be told that "jews were burned alive in this synagogue" and then a few years later, some respectable historian comes out and says there is "no proof there were people inside there". Yet that congressman leaves thinking there were some real savages living here. Then they multiply this meme unto other societies. Show a Netflix documentary with footage from Lviv while they talk about Latvia (and vice versa). Same footage all the time. This has real repercussions on people's lives, and it will be perpetuated onto the future. Besides there are a lot of questions that are simply not answered. Obviously, I'm not a historian, but some things are just so obvious, such as what happened with the bodies, if they were burned, in those numbers it would be visible, I've been to the Rumbula site, there is just no way that 25 000 bodies can be buried there, it is a relatively small site with lots of pine trees that must have been there 80 years ago. And none of this takes away from the fact that there was a holocaust and it was massive. It's just the lightness with which these inaccuracies are thrown around (and for political purposes) that bugs me.

    Anyway, I'm sure you know all this.

    The questions raised by this war and how to deal with it are very hard, the dangers possibly existential, so imo the correct reaction is far from obvious.
     
    Right. I didn't mean it with regards to Ukraine, but with regards to WW2. The Ukraine issue is a whole new range of problems (although there is a bit of an overlap re: WW2).
  887. @German_reader
    @AP


    Do you think that if the IRA had total power over northern Ireland it would have slaughtered 10,000s of Protestants, women and children included?
     
    Who knows? And regarding Ukraine, I don't see how people like Bandera or Shukhevych could ever have achieved their stated goals without drastic violence against Poles collectively.
    But to some extent it's of course speculative and I probably shouldn't have entered into this historical discussion, not like it's going to lead anywhere. As I indicated above, I think it would be better, if Eastern Europeans tried to move on from those historical issues, difficult as that may be.

    Replies: @LatW, @AP

    Who knows? And regarding Ukraine, I don’t see how people like Bandera or Shukhevych could ever have achieved their stated goals without drastic violence against Poles collectively.

    Given the pre-Soviet and pre-Nazi context, it probably would have been treating Poles as second class citizens, arrests, censorship, and occasional scattered deadly police brutality as Ukrainians had been subjected to in 1920s and 1930s. Rather than unthinkable slaughter of entire families.

  888. @German_reader
    @LatW


    I bet there were crazy instances when a young guy who was just guarding in the forest was given 25 years in Siberia. Because it’s just what the Soviets did.
     
    Sure, that certainly happened, Soviet trials weren't held according to rule of law principles after all, but were show trials or pursued political objectives. One certainly can't take all the confessions and testimonies in them at face value, guilty defendants mixed in with innocent, truth with falsehood, and not always easy to distinguish. You don't need to tell me that, I'm well aware, also that Russia uses these historical issues for very dubious purposes. I just think that revisionism can also go too far though.

    The unwritten rule we used to have with German right wingers was very simple – you don’t trash us, we don’t trash you. Went without saying and worked fantastically well.
     
    It's because of the war in Ukraine. I get that our perspectives on some matters may be irreconcilable (different experiences and all that), and some German right-wingers are certainly too pro-Russian in a rather repellent way, giving no thought at all to the suffering of Ukrainian civilians and soldiers. But I still find some of the accusations commonly made rather unfair. The questions raised by this war and how to deal with it are very hard, the dangers possibly existential, so imo the correct reaction is far from obvious.

    Replies: @LatW

    I just think that revisionism can also go too far though.

    Of course, one has to be extremely careful with these matters. On both sides. The side that keeps throwing out these unsubstantiated claims is doing it too liberally, most often for political reasons, and is not being called out. There are insane cases where groups of American congressmen can be told that “jews were burned alive in this synagogue” and then a few years later, some respectable historian comes out and says there is “no proof there were people inside there”. Yet that congressman leaves thinking there were some real savages living here. Then they multiply this meme unto other societies. Show a Netflix documentary with footage from Lviv while they talk about Latvia (and vice versa). Same footage all the time. This has real repercussions on people’s lives, and it will be perpetuated onto the future. Besides there are a lot of questions that are simply not answered. Obviously, I’m not a historian, but some things are just so obvious, such as what happened with the bodies, if they were burned, in those numbers it would be visible, I’ve been to the Rumbula site, there is just no way that 25 000 bodies can be buried there, it is a relatively small site with lots of pine trees that must have been there 80 years ago. And none of this takes away from the fact that there was a holocaust and it was massive. It’s just the lightness with which these inaccuracies are thrown around (and for political purposes) that bugs me.

    Anyway, I’m sure you know all this.

    The questions raised by this war and how to deal with it are very hard, the dangers possibly existential, so imo the correct reaction is far from obvious.

    Right. I didn’t mean it with regards to Ukraine, but with regards to WW2. The Ukraine issue is a whole new range of problems (although there is a bit of an overlap re: WW2).

  889. @German_reader
    @LatW


    just not when their voters lecture to Eastern Europeans about things they have never experienced themselves.
     
    Once again: You aren't Ukrainian, your country hasn't been attacked, your country isn't at war (at least not more than the rest of NATO is), and unless Putin or some replacement decides to go for total war with NATO, the Baltic states won't be invaded. The latter risk is not totally non-existent, but still quite small and manageable. It's also something a lot of Germans have experienced. The town I grew up in was near the border with the DDR, the Soviets were literally a few kilometres away (and while I didn't consciously experience the threat, it was still recent enough that in 1990 my father could play some sick joke on me saying "War has started, the Russians are coming"). This was the reality for 40 years, yet most people in West Germany and Western Europe still didn't engage in such unhinged hysterics as you Balts regularly do. There are legitimate concerns about the defense of Eastern NATO members, but when I read your comments, and those of virtually all Baltic politicians, it sounds as if you'd actually like to join in the current war in Ukraine.
    As for AfD, I will freely admit that some of their politicians are rather too pro-Russian and have stupid ideas about some wonderful German-Russian friendship. However, the reality simply is that the total break with Russia that has occurred is economically disastrous for Germany and has led to a serious threat of de-industrialization, so saying "AfD should focus on internal matters" won't do either. An opposition party (which for the foreseeable future is completely frozen out of power anyway) can't avoid these issues totally.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack, @AP, @Dmitry

    people in West Germany and Western Europe still didn’t engage in such unhinged hysterics as you Balts

    It is not really similar, as Germany is not part of the Russian Empire/Soviet Union.

    Baltic countries. These are recent and important parts of the Russian Empire/Soviet Union. They should be (from the recent history view) part of Russia, if the power has not collapsed.

    Not in their culture or their right for self-determination, but their recent political situation – they are rebel provinces, that have been successful rebels for a very recent time (30 years is little time in world history).

    Germany has a different history, not as part of Russia, or even the independence foreign occupation. Its national project was the effective unification of those different states which has been confederated part of Holy Roman Empire.

    But Latvia, Estonia, Lithuania, they are rebelling against their master successfully and it’s not surprising the national fear, or the main national project is to fight against, a scenario where they will return to their old master.

    Maybe in their national unconscious they dream they are wives of a Sultan, who have escaped from the palace. This escape is the national attainment of recent times. So of course, the fear is to be captured again by their husband and return to their old life.

    @MrHack

    LatW is entitled to voice any.. He really does know an awful lot about Ukraine, its history,

    Well they are not a foreigner for this war. They are one of the few people here who is a former compatriot of both Putin and Zelensky, born in the USSR. Excluding the political views, they are also a rusofil, that has more rosy view of all the postsoviet world than most sensible people.

    • Replies: @Mr. Hack
    @Dmitry


    Well they are not a foreigner for this war. They are one of the few people here who is a former compatriot of both Putin and Zelensky, born in the USSR. Excluding the political views, they are also a rusofil, that has more rosy view of all the postsoviet world than most sensible people.
     
    Who are "they"?

    Must be that day of the month when alcohol is to be consumed? A rather poorly written couple of sentences that are hard to understand?........
  890. @Dmitry
    @German_reader


    people in West Germany and Western Europe still didn’t engage in such unhinged hysterics as you Balts
     
    It is not really similar, as Germany is not part of the Russian Empire/Soviet Union.

    Baltic countries. These are recent and important parts of the Russian Empire/Soviet Union. They should be (from the recent history view) part of Russia, if the power has not collapsed.

    Not in their culture or their right for self-determination, but their recent political situation - they are rebel provinces, that have been successful rebels for a very recent time (30 years is little time in world history).

    Germany has a different history, not as part of Russia, or even the independence foreign occupation. Its national project was the effective unification of those different states which has been confederated part of Holy Roman Empire.

    But Latvia, Estonia, Lithuania, they are rebelling against their master successfully and it's not surprising the national fear, or the main national project is to fight against, a scenario where they will return to their old master.

    Maybe in their national unconscious they dream they are wives of a Sultan, who have escaped from the palace. This escape is the national attainment of recent times. So of course, the fear is to be captured again by their husband and return to their old life.

    @MrHack


    LatW is entitled to voice any.. He really does know an awful lot about Ukraine, its history,
     
    Well they are not a foreigner for this war. They are one of the few people here who is a former compatriot of both Putin and Zelensky, born in the USSR. Excluding the political views, they are also a rusofil, that has more rosy view of all the postsoviet world than most sensible people.

    Replies: @Mr. Hack

    Well they are not a foreigner for this war. They are one of the few people here who is a former compatriot of both Putin and Zelensky, born in the USSR. Excluding the political views, they are also a rusofil, that has more rosy view of all the postsoviet world than most sensible people.

    Who are “they”?

    Must be that day of the month when alcohol is to be consumed? A rather poorly written couple of sentences that are hard to understand?……..

    • LOL: Yahya
  891. @German_reader
    @LatW


    Most of the actual shooting was done by the German nationals from the SD. There were trials on members of Arajs Kommando in the West and the truth is that results are rather scarce.
     
    That's just tosh, of course Latvians in those police and auxiliary formations took part in mass killings themselves. You may say they were acting only in a subordinate role, and if they hadn't done it, the Germans would have found someone else, but totally denying it is pretty ridiculous.
    I'm not endorsing the extreme claims by Russians and others who are saying that Latvia before WW2 had already been "fascist", that Latvians deserved the deportations etc., not at all. But nor do I think Westerners are obliged to uncritically accept a whitewashed view of history where even the members of Arajs Kommando weren't really that bad after all, just because that is apparently convenient now for geopolitical reasons.

    Replies: @LatW, @Wokechoke

    These minnow countries are getting tiresome. Alex Boris Johnson really dropped the UK in the shot here.

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