文章总体来说：讨人喜欢。

最后，必须认真对待恐怖分子从墨西哥越境进入美国的威胁，但我们必须再次清醒地考虑为什么他们可能会试图伤害我们。至少从 1990 年起，我们就一直在向中东投掷炸弹。

1.你们向柬埔寨和塞尔维亚投下了大量炸弹；为什么没有柬埔寨或塞尔维亚恐怖分子？
2. 曾有美国公民犯下恐怖主义：气象员，他们“没有受到压迫，也没有贫穷，或者类似的事情。 ”（https://status451.com/2017/01/20/days-of-rage/）。这意味着什么？这是为什么？
3.除了轰炸之外，你们还监禁、折磨和精神控制了无数无辜的穆斯林（http://www.thedailybell.com/exclusive-interviews/anthony-wile-lost-in-a-yemen-jail-a-db-staffer-speaks-about-his-long-strange-trip-and-the-secret-gulag-america-has-built-in-the-middle-east-and-africa/），并且武装了从阿富汗到利比亚和叙利亚的激进伊斯兰主义者。伊斯兰恐怖分子的制造远比单纯的爆炸更加有力、复杂和直接。

总的来说，文章的思路是准确的。

PS“伊斯兰教是和平/善良”与“伊斯兰教是邪恶”看起来像是经典的“分而治之”。

You make some excellent points Dr. Paul. Of course Trump has already promised his supporters a wall. But maybe it’s not too late. Have you contacted President Trump?

The welfare magnet.

Great definition. However, I wish he’d have elaborated a bit the removal itself.

I suppose with Cambodia and Serbia, it’s generally in the past now, whereas our interventions in the Middle East are ongoing. However, I do sometimes think that, if Kosovo were a Christian region under our protection and Serbia were Muslim, we would probably have Serbian terror groups attacking us until we ended recognition of Kosovar independence and withdrew our participation in their defense. So I agree that there is something especially incendiary about Islam, such that attacks on Muslim honor or dignity are more likely to result in violent blowback than attacks on other groups. On the other hand, maybe if we tried not attacking them at all we would see less violent blowback. There seems to have been a lot less Islamic terror in the mid 20th century, when our main ideological foe was communism and we allied with devout Muslims against their left-wing enemies (e.g. in Indonesia).

我们还必须考虑沙特和瓦哈比的角色。因为我们保护沙特人，所以他们还有很多钱可以用来向穆斯林世界传播他们的极端伊斯兰教形式；他们在境外或明或暗地宣扬激进主义，包括恐怖主义，目的是将原教旨主义能量引向本国腐败政权。人们想知道如果没有他们的恶意影响，穆斯林世界将会有多么不同。

Like everything Ron Paul writes it goes off into libertarian la-la land. Most illegals don’t come here for welfare – although they do game the system if they can. The real solution is decidedly non-libertarian – take their jobs away. Fine and jail the employers. I would also sentence the illegals to a period of hard labor (purely for punishment) as a reasonable deterrent to coming back after deportation.

So you basically want to give illegals jobs that are not even in demand in the labor market, so add no value, and which furthermore impose costs on natives to guard and feed them while they carry out their meaningless tasks? The 1930s are calling, my friend.

First, the wall will not work. Texas already started building a border fence about ten years ago. It divided people from their own property across the border, it deprived people of their land….

Dear God. Anything that might cause a slight impact or inconvenience to commerce is cause for a libertarian jihad. The people who are allegedly being deprived of their land can ask Trump to install one of his “big beautiful doors” so they won’t be deprived of their property.

As it is, the current fencing is little more than glorified chicken wire in some places that drug cartels and “coyotes” easily cut. The fencing in other areas is not difficult to breach for anyone really determined to make it over. A high concrete barrier wall is in order. Somehow the wall the Israelis built is working just fine, so the “walls never work” crowd should take note.

其次，墙会很贵。该墙估计耗资 12 至 15 亿美元。你可以打赌它会不止于此。特朗普总统声称，如果墨西哥政府不付款，他将对墨西哥进口产品征收20%的关税。谁将缴纳这笔税款？

你可以对汇款征收 25% 的税，这将带来大约 5 亿美元的收益，而这不会转嫁给美国消费者。通过振兴制造业和能源部门来扩大所得税基础将解决剩下的问题。

And we do need to end our pointless Middle East wars, but Muslim hatred for us will not dissipate within 24hrs of doing so, so some type of impenetrable border barrier is required. I’ve never seen so much spilled ink and drama queenery over a border wall in my life, not necessarily from Ron Paul, but in general.

I would sterilize every illegal alien caught, including their children and grandchildren.

That would give them a big incentive to stay away.

Ron’s solution wouldn’t eliminate illegal immigration entirely, but it would eliminate most of the societal cost without the high cost of the wall. (I’m not entirely against the wall, BTW but he makes some good arguments against it.) Another suggestion Ron has often made is to repeal birthright citizenship. If the children of illegals are not citizens, there’d be no incentive for pregnant women to sneak across to have their anchor babies.

The cost of the wall is infinitesimally small compared to the costs of the illegals themselves. The biggest costs are not welfare but the cost of schooling, unpaid medical costs, incarceration, the cost to victims of crime, and the loss of tax revenue due to the lowering of wages for citizens working in heavily immigrant areas.

The people who cry about the wages the illegals lose to Social Security when they use a stolen SS number don’t count the loss of FICA taxes when employers pay their people far less because they use illegal labor. That chicken processing factory that was raided had to raise their employee’s pay by 2 dollars and hour to keep the place staffed. It was in the deep south so the average wage in the place probably went from 8 to 10 dollars an hour a 25% increase. Multiply that by 4000 employees and the 6.15% that both the employee and the employer pay and start to consider how much those wonderful illegals are costing the system.

No, I want to punish them so that the next time they think about sneaking in they can remember the pain they endured and the years it took them in Mexico to finally regain their health. Then they will think better of coming back.

The alternative is to feed them to the sharks while divers in shark cages pay to watch the great whites devour them.

>Multiply that by 4000 employees and the 6.15% that both the employee and the employer pay and start to consider how much those wonderful illegals are costing the system.

Peanuts compared to the employers who pay in cash.
In that case the U.S. government gets zilch. Nada.
We, the legal U.S. taxpayers get to pick up the tab.
The illegals get pure, “uncut” wages, however small.
Walk into any grocery store in a predominantly Spanish speaking neighborhood in SoCal and watch the $100 bills come out at the cash register. *May* have come from a check cashing place, but certainly did not come from an ATM.
Dishonest employers who hire them get: a) ultra-cheap labor, and b) no payroll taxes to pay.
Same thing can and does happen to U.S. citizens who run afoul of these dirtbag “businessmen,” who are really just criminals. Good Republicans, most likely. Bush the Younger’s “base.”

Time to go after the dirtbag employers who violate U.S. tax law, and leave their employee victims alone, whether legal or not, in my opinion.

Of course, the employees are violating the law also, by not reporting cash wages, but they are small fish who generally get coerced into accepting less than the market rate for legit pay w/ deductions, because “hey, I’m paying you cash.” Been there, seen that. Have been forced to accept it, on occasion, and I am native born of European heritage.

Gov’t should go after the big fish, the employers.

Tax evasion was how they nailed Al Capone, among others.

Sorry, Dr. Paul, there is no “welfare magnet.”
What a load of bunk.
Mexicans come here looking for work because they cannot make a decent living in their own country. I would, too, if I were in their shoes.
They can’t make a living in their own country because the Mexican economy is AFU

看这里：
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mexican_peso_crisis

See Atlas Shrugged for elaboration.

I’m pretty sure Ron would include taxpayer-funded schools, hospitals, jails etc in the “welfare” provided to illegal immigrants. Welfare is more than just direct cash transfers.

Libertarians care about commerce because commerce is what generates wealth. Even if you believe in the welfare state and wealth redistribution, you have to generate the wealth first, so anti-commerce policies are going to undermine your goals in the long run.

It’s time to call them something other than the ‘left’.

为什么罗恩·保罗声称使用征用权“行不通”？这是宪法里写的。真的，确实如此！而且你并没有“被剥夺”，因为你得到了“公正的补偿”。

有时我想知道这个自封的立宪主义者是否真的阅读了这份文件。

最后， 恐怖分子的威胁 必须认真对待从墨西哥越境进入美国的行为，但我们必须再次清醒地考虑为什么他们可能会试图伤害我们。至少从 1990 年起，我们就一直在向中东投掷炸弹。

1.你们向柬埔寨和塞尔维亚投下了大量炸弹；为什么没有柬埔寨或塞尔维亚恐怖分子？

1.他明确表示 威胁 must be taken seriously. Yours is a straw man argument. Actual Mexican terrorists, by any rational definition, are probably as rare as the Cambodian and Serbian ones you’re asking about.

2. This is an excellent article but even at that, the terrorist meme is largely BS I think. The real terrorists are the money bags that fan the flames of terrorism for their own benefit. RP is spot on about the bombs Obomba’s dropped. That clown is/was world terrorist #1.

罗恩

We need the Wall and much more. Otherwise, we never know who is in the country since we cannot control who or how many walk across the Rio Grande River, crawl through a hole in the fence in San Diego, or overstay their tourist visas. At present, once across the border and they are home free.

Nice try by trying to target incentives, but it is simply not true that the 混血 和 campesinos from places as wide-ranging as Peru, Bolivia, Guatemala, El Salvador, Mexico, MENA, and subSaharan Africa are pouring in for welfare. They come primarily for personal and familial safety, jobs, schooling, and in general a better life than living in the shitholes back home … and, yes, most non-European countries in the world are shitholes. Indeed, we know illegals who have been in the country for more than ten years who have never taken a dime of welfare. They don’t want the risk. There is security in the anonymity of hiding in the “black” immigrant economy where the government doesn’t know who you are, where you live, or what you do for a living.

We need the Wall followed by internal identity cards/passports on the model of those already in place in European countries for internal security and immigration control. Otherwise, we’ll be overwhelmed with people from a wide-range of countries continuing to “flash mob” the border … with the risk that the mobs of immigrants will transplant into the United States the same social orders and problems of Mexico, El Salvador, MENA, subSaharan Africa, etc., that they were fleeing from.

What! That’s already happened?

Those who call for a reduction of welfare payments are correct. However most seem to miss the fact that big business loves welfare payments to individuals, as well as to themselves, for a couple of basic reasons.

1. Those individuals who receive the payments probably 花 the bulk of it immediately.

2. Also, some big businesses probably benefit from welfare subsidized workers. For them, what’s not to like? Here’s one example.

Report: Walmart Workers Cost Taxpayers $6.2 Billion In Public Assistance

http://www.forbes.com/sites/clareoconnor/2014/04/15/report-walmart-workers-cost-taxpayers-6-2-billion-in-public-assistance/#40acb8197cd8

As long as there are big businesses that obtain a net benefit from welfare payments to the proles, there will continue to be welfare payments to the proles, and no wall (or anything else) will stop that. Ever.

I wouldn’t be surprised if the construction companies doing the wall building hired illegals to build the damned thing!

Yeah, yeah, I know, you want to punish people for earning an honest buck. It’s the American Way!

至少几千年来，墙壁一直被证明是一个笑话。

Trump’s wall may be built but the welfare payments and immigration, both legal and illegal, will continue. Here’s one reason why.:

While the U.S. government doesn’t break out food-stamp spending at individual retailers, it does report spending by retail segment. And last year, the category Walmart is in — Super Stores — accounted for 47 percent of the dollars spent with food stamps, even though such companies represent only about 7 percent of the number of stores that accept SNAP payments.

https://www.bloomberg.com/gadfly/articles/2016-05-25/walmart-food-stamp-business-an-edge-on-amazon

The ruling classes probably don’t give a damn about welfare recipients OR small businesses, so I don’t expect anything to change in any substantial way any time soon.

华尔街以奴隶修建的围墙命名。那里一定有一条消息。

non-citizens working in the US without authorization is not honest.

你是对的！ 这堵墙需要有人看守，任何试图越过它的东西都应该被射杀，即使它只是一只野兔。 反激励！

沃尔斯为以色列和匈牙利工作。 他们也会在这里工作。

Turning off the welfare magnet would help, but food stamps aren’t the main reason illegal immigrants come here. They come for the high quality public schools, medical care, law and order, quality infrastructure, etc. Should we end public education etc, and simultaneously legalize heroin? Only a libertarian, drunk on theory and impervious to real world experience, would be foolish enough to say yes.

德国公司为沙特哈里发国建造的 600 多英里高科技边境墙是一堵“himdinger”——它非常有效，以至于没有一个移民（沙特及其酋长国对移民零容忍，奴隶劳工除外）通过。 /超过它。

也许穆蒂可以让她的公司为美国工作！

墙壁是一个“笑话”？以色列安全围栏结束了起义。我敢打赌你的电脑就在四堵用锁锁住的墙内。

First, the wall will not work. Texas already started building a border fence about ten years ago. It divided people from their own property across the border, it deprived people of their land through the use of eminent domain, and in the end the problem of drug and human smuggling was not solved.

Of course a border wall across a single state won’t work. It is better than a border wall across no states, though. I don’t care about dividing property owners from their property across the border, whatever the Hell that means. I don’t care about the people paid fair and square for their land through eminent domain, either; libertarians should have won that battle elsewhere, it’s too late to fight it now (and libertarians are too treacherous to be trusted to have genuine motives for doing so).

Did the drug and human smuggling carry on 超过 (or under) the Texas border wall? If so, it wasn’t much of a wall.

Israel’s walls seem to be working well.

Second, the wall will be expensive.

Whatever the cost, it will be a drop in the bucket; libertarians should have won that battle elsewhere, it’s too late to fight it now (and libertarians are too treacherous to be trusted to have genuine motives for doing so).

Taxpayers will have the option of avoiding products from Mexico for the duration of any tax.

The solution to really addressing the problem of illegal immigration, drug smuggling, and the threat of cross-border terrorism is clear: remove the welfare magnet that attracts so many to cross the border illegally, stop the 25 year US war in the Middle East, and end the drug war that incentivizes smugglers to cross the border.

That’s great Ron. Great soapbox speech. Let me know how that turns out for you guys.

I see where you forgot to mention E-Verify, and cracking down hard on employers of criminal aliens. Because libertarians are squishes (at best) on immigration. In your hearts, you love the idea of open borders.

Rest was TL;DR, libertarians are boring.

联邦所得税也在宪法（第 16 修正案）中，但 RP 一直强烈谴责它和修正案。 我认为他的立场是，至少联邦政府应该将其活动限制在宪法规定的范围内，但即使在宪法规定的范围内，政府也可以做很多恶作剧。

征用权的问题在于，除非交易是自愿的，否则“公正补偿”是没有意义的。 价值是主观的，至少根据 RP 所支持的奥地利经济学理论，因此无法确定某些财产的价值，除非所有者可以在不受胁迫的情况下以他可以同意的价格自由出售给政府。

公共教育不是很烂吗？ 国家主义者一直把公共教育作为政府干预成功的例子，我不知道他们在说什么。 海洛因过去也是合法的，这没什么大不了的。

保护边境当然属于“宪法规定的活动”。征用权被写入 原版的 权利法案，因为国家是土地的主权者，而不是个人。如果您对此不确定，请了解为什么该州禁止将土地从印第安人直接转让给白人，并确保土地转让首先通过州土地办公室进行处理。

至于无政府主义的伎俩，让我们看看最有影响力的创始人之一对无政府主义的看法：

“对由他们自己选择的人制定的法律的自愿支持，使有能力自治的思想特别与众不同。相反的精神就是无政府状态，它必然会产生专制主义。” ——托马斯·杰斐逊致费城公民，1809 年

另一篇关于财产理论和征用权的文章，与米斯恩没什么关系：

“私有财产是社会的生物，并受到社会的召唤，无论何时其需要需要它，即使是最后一分钱，其对公共紧急情况的贡献者不应被视为对公众的利益，赋予贡献者荣誉和权力的区别，但作为先前收到的义务的返还，或作为正义债务的支付。” -本杰明·富兰克林

如果在奥地利狂热中有人称我为“国家主义者”，我会同意并放大；我就是其中一个“最珍贵”的例子。

“小土地所有者是 最珍贵 国家的一部分。” ——托马斯·杰斐逊，写给詹姆斯·麦迪逊的信，1785 年

关于土地价值，业主之间存在大量自愿的房地产交易，县房地产官员对此很清楚，以建立《权利法案》中规定的“公正补偿”。

You have to understand that “anarchy” has a wide range of meanings. Most self-described anarchists are still of the left-wing variety and typically deny private property rights, seeing private property as a creature of a coercive state. The realization that private property rights are in fact incompatible with a coercive state and existed before the state is relatively new in political thought.

In any case, RP is not an anarchist; I’m just explaining to you why he might have a problem with eminent domain, the income tax and other things that are strictly speaking constitutional but which violate property rights. One thing to note about the original formulation of eminent domain is that it treated only the compulsory purchase of land by the government for government purposes; it was not intended to allow the government to forcibly purchase private land to give to another private owner, but that is how it is being used nowadays.

Your argument that the State is sovereign over the land because historically it has prohibited direct land transfers is descriptively accurate, but I’m interested in sovereignty as a normative concept. I know that the State prohibits a lot of things; the issue is whether it has a 右 to do so. The quotes from the founders clearly presuppose some sort of social contract theory. That’s fine if you accept the theory, but I don’t. I’m not sure if Ron Paul does and I’m not sure how much he’s thought deeply about these foundational issues; in general I think he’s been content to allow that the government has a right to exist but only within limits prescribed by the constitution.

最初拥有监管移民权力的是各州，而不是国会，这就是为什么美国宪法只规定了监管入籍的权力。移民管制的联邦化是 19 世纪末的发展。

墙壁是一个“笑话”？以色列安全围栏结束了起义。我敢打赌你的电脑就在四堵用锁锁住的墙内。

The walls that we’re talking about here are a joke and that includes the Israeli monstrosity. How sick does one have to be to build, maintain and staff something like that?

It’d be interesting to read how you came to the conclusion that it ended the intifada.

As far as my house is concerned, it doesn’t have any type of wall that we’re addressing here. I’ve never had a yard so much as a fence either, and the few my neighbors have are essentially decorative.

The house came with locks but we almost never use them and if someone wanted to get in, the locks (and doors) are truly a joke security wise. The walls wouldn’t be much of a barrier to someone eager to enter either, even in the absence of windows.

至于你对杰斐逊和无政府状态的评论，他一定是失败了。

以下是他对此主题的一些评论。

“Societies exist under three forms, sufficiently distinguishable: 1) without government, as among our Indians… It is a problem, not clear in my mind, that the first condition is not the best.

托马斯·杰斐逊，给詹姆斯·麦迪逊的信，巴黎，30 年 1787 月 XNUMX 日

“…crimes are very rare among [the Indians]: insomuch that were it made a question, whether no law, as among the [Indian] Americans, or too much law, as among the civilized Europeans, submits man to the greatest evil, one who has seen both conditions of existence would pronounce it to be the last: and that the sheep are happier of themselves, than under care of the wolves. It will be said, that great societies cannot exist without government. [the Indians] therefore break them into small ones.”

托马斯·杰斐逊 (Thomas Jefferson)，“弗吉尼亚州注释”，查询 XI，1787 年

Ya ya, I know what happened to the Indians, so save it. And consider how much yer walls’d stop some SWAT team. Ever heard of the Waco massacre?

There are only two feasible crossing points between the Dominican Republic and Haiti, because illegal immigrants need access to roads and transportation. Buses leave Djabon in the Dominican Republic frequently bound for Santiago, but there are numerous spot checks of the passengers in buses and other vehicles by immigration officials along the way, so it is very difficult to travel anywhere in the Dominican Republic even if you can cross the border illegally.

In fact it is quite easy to cross over the border from Haiti illegally and I have done it myself on a day when the border was closed due to a trade spat involving chickens and eggs, as I recall. There are people running an organized business who provide motorcycle transportation on both side of the border and assistance to safely for the river. So you are OK if you cross the border illegally, so long as you have a visa or US passport, but you will not be able to travel far if you are undocumented.

I wonder if large relatively unpopulated segments of the US border might not be better protected by security on the roads within 50 miles approaching the border on the US side, particularly stopping passenger vans with blacked out windows. Planes or helicopters like those used for monitoring speeding vehicles would also surely be useful for monitoring movements on dirt roads or private lands close to the border.

This could be a hell of a lot cheaper than building and maintaining a wall. Of course where the border divides cities, then there must be a need for a Berlin Wall type of setup to keep the two populations apart.

Another more Trumpian solution would be to build walls or barbed wire fences around the large orange plantations and produce farms here in Florida and have immigration officials conduct passport and visa checks at the gates.